# Fluval Ebi! Updates 6/26



## fusiongt (Nov 7, 2011)

Are you injecting co2? I think it's difficult to carpet the tank without it.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

fusiongt said:


> Are you injecting co2? I think it's difficult to carpet the tank without it.


Nope, I really don't want to use co2, I've heard of people having luck with HC using excel so that's what I'm going to do, but if it doesn't work out I'll just swap it for something easier.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

fusiongt said:


> Are you injecting co2? I think it's difficult to carpet the tank without it.


Excel should work better than CO2 in such a small tank. Excel provides organic carbon which is exactly what CO2 will provide.

Hm... but even if the plants grow out won't the middle of your tank still be bare? Hope the anubias you're getting is nice and tall then


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Excel should work better than CO2 in such a small tank. Excel provides organic carbon which is exactly what CO2 will provide.
> 
> Hm... but even if the plants grow out won't the middle of your tank still be bare? Hope the anubias you're getting is nice and tall then


Kewl, so my carpet idea might work after all!

Hoping to fill the middle area with some medium sized plants, not sure what species (open for suggestions :icon_mrgr), but ones that will make the transition from short to tall plants less drastic.


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## damenblankenship (Nov 11, 2010)

I've grown HC using excel. it should work fine. IMO C02 in small tanks is a bit of a pain anyway. good luck!


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

dragonsong93 said:


> Planned inhabitants are lots of CRS and some CBS mixed in. Is it safe to ship these guys to PA in December? No pet stores around here have them so I have to order online.


Yes it is safe to have them shipped as long as the person you're buying them from knows what they are doing. Make sure they insulate the box and provide a 72 hour heat pack. Make sure to ask questions from the seller, if they aren't answering them I would suggest switching to someone on here.

Excel will work much better on the HC if you inject it directly into the substrate instead of dumping it into the water column. I recently ordered a 9" needle and syringe combo to do the trick. I'll be uploading some photos tomorrow if you'd like to see what they look like!



dragonsong93 said:


> Hoping to fill the middle area with some medium sized plants, not sure what species (open for suggestions ), but ones that will make the transition from short to tall plants less drastic.


When the DW is done soaking you should lay that out first. Generally it will provide a good transition from your carpet plant to taller plants (unless you just stick the DW straight into the tank vertically haha). But if you can arrange the DW first it might be easier to help you with plant ideas. I would recommend not making a trip to the LFS for plants until you plan the scape with the DW. But you seem to be a little sick of DW


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Yes it is safe to have them shipped as long as the person you're buying them from knows what they are doing. Make sure they insulate the box and provide a 72 hour heat pack. Make sure to ask questions from the seller, if they aren't answering them I would suggest switching to someone on here.
> 
> Excel will work much better on the HC if you inject it directly into the substrate instead of dumping it into the water column. I recently ordered a 9" needle and syringe combo to do the trick. I'll be uploading some photos tomorrow if you'd like to see what they look like!
> 
> When the DW is done soaking you should lay that out first. Generally it will provide a good transition from your carpet plant to taller plants (unless you just stick the DW straight into the tank vertically haha). But if you can arrange the DW first it might be easier to help you with plant ideas. I would recommend not making a trip to the LFS for plants until you plan the scape with the DW. But you seem to be a little sick of DW


K, will CRS be ok with the excel? Should I turn down the dosage to like 1/2 or so? 

Yea the driftwood's been soaking for about a week and none of the pieces are sinking yet! And they're pretty small too!


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## MsNemoShrimp (Apr 25, 2011)

In the last picture, are those mini marimo balls? They look so cute! :biggrin:


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

NeoShrimp said:


> In the last picture, are those mini marimo balls? They look so cute! :biggrin:


Yup! There's four of them and none are bigger than 1/2"


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

dragonsong93 said:


> K, will CRS be ok with the excel? Should I turn down the dosage to like 1/2 or so?
> 
> Yea the driftwood's been soaking for about a week and none of the pieces are sinking yet! And they're pretty small too!


The moss balls are very cute :]!

CRS definitely be ok with excel. Just avoid overdosing and dumping the fertilizer on top of the shrimp! If you do inject straight into the soil you'll have no problems!

Pictures of the DW ?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> The moss balls are very cute :]!
> 
> CRS definitely be ok with excel. Just avoid overdosing and dumping the fertilizer on top of the shrimp! If you do inject straight into the soil you'll have no problems!
> 
> Pictures of the DW ?


Came up with a possible planting arrangement, maybe saggitaria chilensis in the very back, or anacharis, with dwarf saggitaria around the corners before the rocks. The anubias I ordered is a dwarf so I might stick that on the driftwood or in between the rocks. Kinda want a bit of red color but don't know where or which plant to get, also would be nice to have some small more textured leaves to mix things up a bit. 

And pix of the driftwood:
























My favorite one: 









And a fts, because the frogbit has really taken off and is sending roots everywhere. There's also a heater in there now and a couple random plant bulbs.


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## airangel (Jan 12, 2010)

Watching with interest to see how you end up decorating, I'm looking for new ideas, lol. My Flora came a few days ago and I just finished adding silicone to the backing and plastic back pieces. My plants have been shipped. I should be using this time to soak the 2 bags of stratum and driftwood. Is that one of those 10w preset heaters you're using? I'm debating what to do in mine, have a 10w Marina I just picked up but reveiws are horrid on those presets...such decisions. Will keep checking back to see your progress.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

airangel said:


> Watching with interest to see how you end up decorating, I'm looking for new ideas, lol. My Flora came a few days ago and I just finished adding silicone to the backing and plastic back pieces. My plants have been shipped. I should be using this time to soak the 2 bags of stratum and driftwood. Is that one of those 10w preset heaters you're using? I'm debating what to do in mine, have a 10w Marina I just picked up but reveiws are horrid on those presets...such decisions. Will keep checking back to see your progress.


Yea the stratum's really dusty, I didn't know and just gave it a quick wash.....3 water changes later I could finally see the back of the tank. 

The heater's been relatively good, and the tank has been at a stable 77F, although it did take a while to actually heat up. It was in a tiny bowl before (maybe 3g?) that I used to store some extra plants.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Those DW pieces look really great! Will you be removing some of the rocks when you add the DW though? And the frogbit really takes off well, very nice long roots. Makes me really consider getting some.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Those DW pieces look really great! Will you be removing some of the rocks when you add the DW though? And the frogbit really takes off well, very nice long roots. Makes me really consider getting some.


That's funny because I was hoping the roots wouldn't be this long! But I suppose it'll be better for the shrimp, more room to hide & climb. 

BTW! This tank might actually temporarily house some orange eye blue tigers which I might be getting if I'm lucky, fingers & toes both crossed! Super excited!! 

Some work done today, added one of the pieces of stubborn driftwood, it's only staying in place because of the rock and the filter holding it down. The other more round piece I think I'm going to put on the right, it looks really nice by those two rocks. Speaking of rocks, I think I'm going to remove the one on the left and replace it with some kind of medium sized plant, it's going to look a bit too cluttered when everything's in place. Also seeded the tank with the filter from my 55g to get it cycled.

Ordered some saggitaria and that's going to arrive Friday at the latest.
Tank today, with the driftwood.

















Ps- let me just say I HATE that filter. It works fine, but it's just filling up that whole corner and....ick. Anyone know any suggestions for a less intrusive filter?


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Your parameters have to be really stable for OEBT's. But I assume you know what you're doing since you wanted CRS and CBS ! But that's great! I'm still to scared to attempt anything expensive as I don't have buffering soil or RO water. That limits me to neos... lol! Trying some regular tigers at the moment as well. If those work out I might try a few green caridina as well.

The only time I would trim the frogbit roots are if they start rooting into the soil . Other besides that its great for sucking up those extra nitrites in the entire water column! I'm definitely getting a few haha. You convinced me with another photo. I have a question though, do they multiply fast? Am I going to have my entire top of the tank covered?

To be honest, that driftwood does a great job of hiding your filter haha. I didn't notice it until you pointed it out. If you're pleased with the filtering job its doing maybe you can hide it with taller plants and some moss tied on the driftwood? I use internal filters myself since they seem to work fine for me.

Sounds good for taking out one of the rocks for a DW though. Or you're not gonna have much planting room along the bottom of your tank. Looking forwards to updates! And maybe those OEBT!


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## airangel (Jan 12, 2010)

New to the forum and haven't gotten my Flora set up yet (still playing with silicone) but you can swap out to a sponge filter, esp if going with shrimp, tons of different sized/shaped ones and totally low maint as well. Just a thought.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Your parameters have to be really stable for OEBT's. But I assume you know what you're doing since you wanted CRS and CBS ! But that's great! I'm still to scared to attempt anything expensive as I don't have buffering soil or RO water. That limits me to neos... lol! Trying some regular tigers at the moment as well. If those work out I might try a few green caridina as well.
> 
> The only time I would trim the frogbit roots are if they start rooting into the soil . Other besides that its great for sucking up those extra nitrites in the entire water column! I'm definitely getting a few haha. You convinced me with another photo. I have a question though, do they multiply fast? Am I going to have my entire top of the tank covered?
> 
> ...


The frogbit is probably the fastest growing plant I have right now, the roots are going about 1/2" to 1" a day or more, it's definitely noticeable. If there's too many you can always just toss the extras or keep them in a random bowl of water (like me lol)

I'll see what the filter looks like once I get the saggitaria in there (3 large plants just shipped today) it works good I just don't like how it's taking up the corner space *is used to big tanks with larger spaces*


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Yea I understand the feeling since I'm running internal filters myself. I like how it lets me put the tanks right up against the walls in my room. Can't do that with a HOB filter. How's the intake on that filter? As airangel said you will have to cover up the opening with some sponge or stocking to stop baby shrimps from getting sucked in.

Good news on the frogbit. How do you stop it from covering the entire top though? Or does the roots mostly grow longer and it doesn't really multiply?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Yea I understand the feeling since I'm running internal filters myself. I like how it lets me put the tanks right up against the walls in my room. Can't do that with a HOB filter. How's the intake on that filter? As airangel said you will have to cover up the opening with some sponge or stocking to stop baby shrimps from getting sucked in.
> 
> Good news on the frogbit. How do you stop it from covering the entire top though? Or does the roots mostly grow longer and it doesn't really multiply?


I already have a makeshift filter sock/cover which I'm going to put on....whenever I feel like fishing it out of that corner. I think the frogbit does multiply.....a lot, I'm going to have to scoop some out soon and just leave the little ones. 
Last week:








THIS WEEK:









GOOD NEWS & bad news, I'm probably not getting the OEBT's because I was outbid, but I did order some CBS and they're going to be here by the end of the week, and my anubias arrived! Also, I broke down and put the driftwood in the tank, using a HIDEOUS contraption made out of two rocks and string. Yea. It's pretty ugly lol....I hope it sinks soon. The smallest piece still in the bucket did today so the others should follow. Once it's off you can see how pretty it is, can't wait till there's some little shrimps scattering all over....
















HC is growing a little bit


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Holy crap that frogbit multiplied like crazy haha... I might have to make a little pen with straws to keep it in place or something. I wouldn't want it covering the light for the other plants.

Too bad about the OEBT. You can always try your hand at them later on! Or you can wait for tigers cause one of mine is berried !

Did you boil the DW? I find that if I boil it, it sinks much faster. If you get some moss and cover the rocks and part of the DW you could potentially keep that as a permanent scape. It looks pretty mountain-like in that corner there!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

I need to thin down on the frogbit soon lol, I'm keeping it in for water quality's sake until I get more plants for the rest of the tank. I was looking into tigers...which means another tank....and another shelf....and less space for me xD 

Today my saggitaria arrived in town and is sitting in the post office till delivery tomorrow (was just stalking tracking numbers)...and MY SHRIMP ARE ON THE WAY! Should have 5 or 6 lil CBS in the tank by this weekend. Part of me wants to just have a swarm of crystal black shrimp but I think I'll end up adding some red into the mix because they're so pretty.

I think I'm going to replace the filter with a sponge filter because it'd be just way easier for me to clean and has a lot more surface area than this filter. But with any luck it should start looking a bit prettier with a background of taller plants and some shrimp


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

If you do decide to set up another tank make sure to start a journal for it! You could always just make lots of tibees ! AND MY TIGERS ARE BERRIED!!!! Two of them are so far. Hoping those breed out!! Snapped a few pics in my journal haha.

At least that isn't as nerve wracking as having the shrimp shipment sitting in the warehouse. Then I'd be tempted to drive and pick those up lol. But congrats on the shrimps arriving soon! After they arrive you'd wanna keep the tank renovations to a minimum if you want lots of breeding. When you start getting babies you can renovate all you want afterwards!

The filter change is really up to you. My shrimp tanks work fine with a HOB. But then again I'm not willing the shell out more money for sponge filters. You could actually keep both the sponge and internal filter inside your tanks and have two sources of beneficial bacteria for when you have to clean one out. But it's all up to you :]!!


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## MsNemoShrimp (Apr 25, 2011)

dragonsong93 said:


> Yup! There's four of them and none are bigger than 1/2"


Wow. How did you get them that way. I have a huge Marimo ball mat, so should I pinch some off and roll it into a ball or something? : )


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

The shrimp have left Cali! I hope they get here ok, we just had a flash snow storm last night, the trees were really pretty this morning.



diwu13 said:


> If you do decide to set up another tank make sure to start a journal for it! You could always just make lots of tibees ! AND MY TIGERS ARE BERRIED!!!! Two of them are so far. Hoping those breed out!! Snapped a few pics in my journal haha.
> 
> At least that isn't as nerve wracking as having the shrimp shipment sitting in the warehouse. Then I'd be tempted to drive and pick those up lol. But congrats on the shrimps arriving soon! After they arrive you'd wanna keep the tank renovations to a minimum if you want lots of breeding. When you start getting babies you can renovate all you want afterwards!
> 
> The filter change is really up to you. My shrimp tanks work fine with a HOB. But then again I'm not willing the shell out more money for sponge filters. You could actually keep both the sponge and internal filter inside your tanks and have two sources of beneficial bacteria for when you have to clean one out. But it's all up to you :]!!


Congrats on the berries!! Renovations are done for a while now, saggitaria came and I'll snap a few pictures after the water clears. I have room for maybe one plant, I'm thinking of just adding some java moss to the driftwood and then everything's got to grow in.



NeoShrimp said:


> Wow. How did you get them that way. I have a huge Marimo ball mat, so should I pinch some off and roll it into a ball or something? : )


Yea basically that's what you do!

I bought 3 small ones but one was kinda lop-sided so I broke it and half and rolled it into two balls to make the really tiny ones.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Shrimp arrived today!! All five alive & well, better pix soon when I get back home. 
iPods have issues with tiny shrimp pictures....


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Whoa wait. Better pictures when you're home? Where is that breeder box then? :O? Did you have the shrimp mailed to your office?

And very true on iPhone having problems with baby shrimps. Might I recommend http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...ils?ie=UTF8&me=&qid=1323479735&sr=8-3&seller= ! That's what I use haha


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Whoa wait. Better pictures when you're home? Where is that breeder box then? :O? Did you have the shrimp mailed to your office?
> 
> And very true on iPhone having problems with baby shrimps. Might I recommend http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...ils?ie=UTF8&me=&qid=1323479735&sr=8-3&seller= ! That's what I use haha


Box is on the ebi and I transferred them into the tank before going to a friend's house. Will be back tomorrow and then I'll take pictures with my better cam


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## MitchellLawson (Nov 8, 2011)

Really like how the tanks turning out, were did you get the frogbit?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

MitchellLawson said:


> Really like how the tanks turning out, were did you get the frogbit?


eBay


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Back home and as promised, pictures of the shrimp! Now all I have to go is get some red ones, and wait for it all to grow in...









Side view:








The shrimp! The nicest looking one is staying in the back so all I have is a few blurry pictures, but his white & black look painted on, it's so awesome.
























Staredown...
















































My favorite, but shy, shrimp:








Find the hidden shrimp
















Two mysterious plants I got from buying other plants, I think I'll keep them. I'm pretty sure the floating one is fairy moss.

















Finally it looks acceptable! :icon_bigg


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Went into the room this morning to find some frogbit over the side of the tank and some water so I think my cat was either drinking water (REALLY MESSY, she scoops up water in her paw then laps it up that way...kinda odd lol) or she forgot there's no lid and accidentally fell in. Either way, everyone is still ok and the plants are undamaged.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Hm... I'd keep your cat out of the room with the fish tank to be honest. You wouldn't wanna risk having a shrimp on the frogbit, getting scared, and jumping out of the tank. Also, I've read many horror stories where everything in the tank would die if the cat had a lot of kitty litter stuffs on its hand.

Hope the shrimp enjoy their new home ! More pictures when they color up some!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Spent a long time stalking the shrimp around the tank with my camera, and finally got some ok pictures of the really dark ones.
















And the one who has thus claimed that driftwood as HERS. 
























You can see two of them in this pic:








Really likes being on the saggitarus
















One last pic of the plants for good measure 









I think they're coloring up quite well considering this is their...third day in the tank. I'm also pretty sure I have three females and two males, only time will tell though!

CRS on the way soon! S & SS grades 



diwu13 said:


> Hm... I'd keep your cat out of the room with the fish tank to be honest. You wouldn't wanna risk having a shrimp on the frogbit, getting scared, and jumping out of the tank. Also, I've read many horror stories where everything in the tank would die if the cat had a lot of kitty litter stuffs on its hand.
> 
> Hope the shrimp enjoy their new home ! More pictures when they color up some!


Yea, I don't normally have them in there but one is going to the vet and I can't give him food for 24 hours prior to the surgery (neeuuuutering :icon_eek and if I did that with the other two I would be followed by two furiously mewing cats until they are fed.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Great looking pictures. Glad they're adjusting to the tank well. When are the CRS coming? And yea, it's MUCH harder to tell which tigers I have are male/female. I still am only sure I have 2 females, and at least one male that knocked them up haha. No idea what the others are. Just happy they're all alive and well!

Also, what are the parameters of your tank? Will you be doing water changes with RO water?

And poor cat... neutering :X!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Thanks! The place I got them from ships on Mondays so either this week or next.

On the tank right now the temp. is 74F, ph is 6.5, and gh is 5. Water comes out of the tap really soft like that so I don't think I'd need RO water. Been using the shrimp water conditioner as well as the minerals that came with the ebi setup


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Hm... hope they come next week or they'll get stuck in the Christmas delivery rush.
Everything seems good with your parameters. What's your kH? That'll be pretty important to keep low for CBS and CRS. (You should update the first post with flora, fauna, and equipment if you have time!) I think tap would degrade your fluvial stratum pretty quickly?


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

I started reading this the other day but had to deal with the girlfriend wanting to go out and do something fun, before I had a chance to comment. This is a really good scape for round rocks, I normally don't see a scape done well with them. I really like what you did. Kind of "calming" for lack of a better word.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

First post has been updated :icon_cool



diwu13 said:


> Hm... hope they come next week or they'll get stuck in the Christmas delivery rush.
> Everything seems good with your parameters. What's your kH? That'll be pretty important to keep low for CBS and CRS. (You should update the first post with flora, fauna, and equipment if you have time!) I think tap would degrade your fluvial stratum pretty quickly?


I think they'll be here tomorrow! Checked the tracking number and they're in the state :biggrin: With any luck 12 new shrimp will be joining the herd!!

Haven't a clue about the stratum though, but this weekend I'm off to the store to buy a kh test kit, and some excel, maybe some java moss...there's a big space under the filter that gets barely any light and I want to put some kind of plant back there.



talontsiawd said:


> I started reading this the other day but had to deal with the girlfriend wanting to go out and do something fun, before I had a chance to comment. This is a really good scape for round rocks, I normally don't see a scape done well with them. I really like what you did. Kind of "calming" for lack of a better word.


Hehe thanks!! They're really the only rocks I have for my tanks, I *always* collect them when near streams, rivers, and lakes so I've got quite the stockpile lol


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

NICE! Beat out the christmas rush for shipping. Not sure if you have one already but I would get a TDS meter online if you start to notice breeding issues. No real need to get it early if it seems everything is alright.

Just be a bit careful with excel. I've never had problems with it and shrimp, but many people have had shrimp die due to excel usage. However, I dose my excel straight into my flourite, which absorbs it right away. Other people just dump excel into the tank so that might be where the issue comes from. If you need I can recommend you to a guy that sells 9 inch needles + syringes so you can dose excel straight into your substrate as well.

Moss would be a good choice for places where there's low light. Just make sure to secure it so it doesn't clog the filter intake!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

And I was right!! The crystal reds came today and I have to say, wow! Their color is already good I can't wait till they get settled into the tank. And as for how they breed in my water, we'll see soon...the biggest has a saddle!!








The most high-grade one of the batch, the white is like paint and they aren't even colored up yet!

































And an update on the CBS, this is one of the most black ones, three have a slight reddish tint, and two are like this.









Crystal reds are going in the tank as soon as they finish eating, they were HUNGRY!!


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

You fed them in the separate breeder box?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> You fed them in the separate breeder box?


Well...yea. Like 2 little pellets. Took them all of 10 minutes to finish them off

They're in the tank now scattered over all the plants and exploooring!


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Don't feed them tomorrow! Let them munch on all the goodies in the tank for a while and get to know the place :]


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Bit of an update, everyone has been doing good and I think growing, I definitely noticed that some of the CBS are getting bigger.

Some FTS'

















And the inhabitants:

































































This is my favorite little CRS:









And is anyone in need of any frogbit? I've got 3 separate containers of it besides the glob in the ebi. It's multiplying like crazy! This picture was taken before I removed around half


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

I was just going to say how much your frogbit is covering everything on the top of your tank lol. Your CRS/CBS are coloring up nicely. Should have some berries soon :]! How much are you looking to sell that frogbit for?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Trimmed a bunch of the longest roots today on the frogbit, looks a lot less crazy. Should take a picture before they take over again ! The shrimp are also coloring up and the CBS are nearly glowing, guess they like the tank - I have high hopes for the two tiniest reds because they are showing awesome color at such a small size.



diwu13 said:


> I was just going to say how much your frogbit is covering everything on the top of your tank lol. Your CRS/CBS are coloring up nicely. Should have some berries soon :]! How much are you looking to sell that frogbit for?


Probably just pay shipping, I'll trade for some java moss though :biggrin: I'll warn you though I've NEVER shipped anything living before so I have no idea how it would turn out. Going to look up shipping envelope/box sizes or something soon.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

How'd you get all the roots out after you snipped them? Or did you hover your hand nearby and pick them out one by one?

I should have java moss ready to go soon as well, started up a moss jar to grow out the moss. If you wanna check it out it's in my journal if you'd like to look. We would probably both ship to each other using small flat rate boxes for $5.20 each. Shipping plants, at least cheaper ones like frogbit/moss, is very easy. All you have to do is:
1) wrap the frogbit in some damp paper towel
2) place the package in a ziplock bag
3) close it tightly, leave a little bit of air in. not too much for the bag to pop easily
4) pad with some newspaper
5) shove into the small flat rate box and you're good to go


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Updaaates!! 

FTS'









Mr. Pickles approves of his minions:









And onto the shrimp pictures:

































































...I post entirely too many pictures :O


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## DesmondTheMoonBear (Dec 19, 2011)

Love the tank. Love the shrimp even more! I've only ever had RCS, for about half a year, they did great until I introduced a bunch of wild plants which apparently had dragonfly eggs laid in them. After a two week vacation and some neglection I came to the horror of some very fat nymphs and a couple dying RCS. 

What's the secret to CBS/CRS? I really want to order a dozen and just try some out, I'm getting my EBI very soon, but they cost a pretty penny and losing them would be pretty bad.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

DesmondTheMoonBear said:


> Love the tank. Love the shrimp even more! I've only ever had RCS, for about half a year, they did great until I introduced a bunch of wild plants which apparently had dragonfly eggs laid in them. After a two week vacation and some neglection I came to the horror of some very fat nymphs and a couple dying RCS.
> 
> What's the secret to CBS/CRS? I really want to order a dozen and just try some out, I'm getting my EBI very soon, but they cost a pretty penny and losing them would be pretty bad.


Wow.. that sucks about the dragonflies hatching on you :O! "Wait.. those don't look like the RCS..." would be my first reaction :[.

Main different to CRS/CBS is that they require soft acidic water, whereas RCS can handle pretty much anything. You'll often need buffering soil to lower the pH, and RO water to keep the water soft. Rare cases where they can do fine without one of the two if you have good tap water.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

So... how do you trim the frogbit roots? One hand on the roots, one hand on scissors? And catch any that you snip? Am I getting some frogbit with such long roots ?!

But omg... you aren't afraid Mr. Pickles will like flip out and touch the tank or something? Was the cover on the tank?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

DesmondTheMoonBear said:


> Love the tank. Love the shrimp even more! I've only ever had RCS, for about half a year, they did great until I introduced a bunch of wild plants which apparently had dragonfly eggs laid in them. After a two week vacation and some neglection I came to the horror of some very fat nymphs and a couple dying RCS.
> 
> What's the secret to CBS/CRS? I really want to order a dozen and just try some out, I'm getting my EBI very soon, but they cost a pretty penny and losing them would be pretty bad.


Thanks!!! I think you should try to get some CRS, there are some good deals too for the lower grades...as for secret, I really haven't *done* anything (my water just seems to be good for them), just loaded the tank with plants to help filter the water, and just treated the tank with a little bit of that mineral stuff they give you with the ebi every water change (which is about 10% every week) 

And I've NEVER kept any kind of freshwater shrimp before, just did a ton of research before getting these guys.



diwu13 said:


> So... how do you trim the frogbit roots? One hand on the roots, one hand on scissors? And catch any that you snip? Am I getting some frogbit with such long roots ?!
> 
> But omg... you aren't afraid Mr. Pickles will like flip out and touch the tank or something? Was the cover on the tank?


I just kinda pick up the frogbit out of the water and pull off the offending roots, and toss them out. That way they're not randomly floating all over the water and I don't have to chase them around the tank :hihi: On the plants, dunno if the roots will make shipping but I'll try to pack them carefully (when I got mine, you can see in the first few pix, they were really short) but grow out in only a few days if the water conditions are ok. Saying that because I noticed they grow reeeeeally long in my ebi, but any other tank I have them in not so much...I don't think they like high water currents.

The shrimp are faaaarrr too boring to attract his attention :biggrin:, most he's ever done was sniff the water. No cover but there's no kitties going into that room without my supervision now that he's had his -ahem- _appointment_ and noone has to be separated anymore.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Oh god. The neutering :O!

And sounds fine about the roots. Hope they get super long and stringy on me too haha. Funny how you just yank those and not cut them . Guess that doesn't damage the plants any.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

AAAAA MY CRS IS BERRIED! FINALLY!! I am so excited there are no words-
















My minions are multiplying :hihi:


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

LONG TIME NO SEE!!! Where have you been :O? That crazy of a new year ?

And congrats on the berries! How about a new FTS to see how the plants have grown?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> LONG TIME NO SEE!!! Where have you been :O? That crazy of a new year ?
> 
> And congrats on the berries! How about a new FTS to see how the plants have grown?


Yep haha! Too busy... xD

I freaked out when I saw the berries, I'd been guessing for a while now that she'd have some soon and today...well.:biggrin:

Two really quick pix for the day, more to follow tomorrow. Pardon the mess, was supposed to do a water change + maintenance today but the berries stopped that lol

The Sagittaria is sending out lots of runners apparently, two little plants have popped up between the driftwood this week, and it looks like there's more starting toward the back of the tank! HC started growing reaaaaaaaaaaally slow but I think once the frogbit is cleared out it should pick up again - the top is almost completely covered! Again!


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Nice, I do notice lots of new growth compared with your other FTS from the past!

I have tons of frogbit and another type of floater called Hygroryza Aristata. A lot of it was cold damaged (soaked in cold water for too long) and I'm losing a ton of leaves/roots. Hopefully the stems make it and they recover or I'll be sad. About 85-90% of the top of my tank is covered now! Good thing is that it blocks out a lot of the light, which is good for me!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Yea there's definitely been tons of plant growth, and there's now a second berried shrimp!! Two batches of eggs so far and I think one more is on the way soon! The two have been hiding in the driftwood since then and haven't been bothered by the other shrimp.

Got a bunch of updated pix and a better FTS:
New berries!








Repost of the first berries:









The other shrimp of the tank

























It's quickly becoming a forest in the back of the tank!

















...and frogbit is amazing for shrimpkeeping, it keeps the water nice and they like scurrying all over the roots

























The whole tank:









And yesterday when I was doing plant stuff, one of the shrimp landed on my hand and started cleaning me, haha it was so cute xD


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Wow those are HUGE clutches of eggs as well! At least everything came along very nicely while you were playing Skyrim haha. Maybe go play a different game (like the Zelda game for Wii) and then when you return the babies will be everywhere 



> And yesterday when I was doing plant stuff, one of the shrimp landed on my hand and started cleaning me, haha it was so cute xD


Did you stay still and let it eat your skin for a while ?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Wow those are HUGE clutches of eggs as well! At least everything came along very nicely while you were playing Skyrim haha. Maybe go play a different game (like the Zelda game for Wii) and then when you return the babies will be everywhere
> 
> 
> Did you stay still and let it eat your skin for a while ?


LOL yea :hihi: 

I've been debating on setting up the little breeder box and separating one of the females before she has her eggs and just putting my 2 male CBS in there but I don't know if that would stress them too much. I think I'll have a max of 4 berried shrimp soon though! 

Yep that shrimp sat on my hand for like 2 minutes before he swam off !


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

It generally doesn't make a huge different with CRS/CBS breeding among each other. But if you wanted to make sure you'd have to keep a saddled female in there for a while. But you'd only need one male with her in the breeder box.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Just thought I'd update that there's now *three* berried females!! There's going to be shrimplets EVERYWHERE.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Haha, saturate that ebi in one go . Congrats! Hope they all carry through for you!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Got pictures of all the berried females! When should I expect shrimplets running everywhere?


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Should take ~30 days for the shrimplets to be born! That's a really full load on the mom too !


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Awesome! On a side note I just picked up vase from walmart... not quite a gallon but about 0.7g, might make it into a shrimp bowl and by then I'll have some extra shrimp to stock it with  I have the tiniest little piece of driftwood for it as well.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Hm... not sure if the CRS/CBS will like such a small volume of water. 0.7g is really small ._.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

There's only going to be a few, mostly for keeping the plants clean - it does have a nice area though. ACTUALLY....my guess wasn't right xD just measured and found out its actually 1.7 gallons, waaaay more than it looks! I fail at estimations.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

1.7g will be pretty good as long as you keep the heat consistent


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Update! Added three sparkling gouramis, the plants are growing like crazy and all three shrimp still have their berries.

A Snail has appeared.








Fish!
















Shrimp time
























It's really starting to be like a forest







/
And I have tons of frogbit if anyone wants to trade









FTS!


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## Snowflake311 (Apr 20, 2011)

Love the tank I just ordered an ebi for my bee shrimp I am excited. 

Congrats on the eggs but don't expect many to survie with those tiny hunters in the tank. I tried to keep a pair of sparkling gouramis with cherry shrimp it did not work. I never saw babie. I did see the gouramis nip at adults and hunt in the HC. Mine pestered the shrimp so much that I never saw them come out of hiding. A while after I took the gouramis out I started finding Babies and my shrimp were out in the open swimming much more.

It was too bad because my sparkling gouramis did really well they bred for me and I had free swimming fry. But they just could not leave the shrimp alone so I had to pick save the shrimp. 

Hope your little guy is better then mine. It looks like a male in both photos.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Yeah I was gonna ask why you put in those fish cause your little shrimpies will die


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

They've been really good with the shrimp though O.O 
No nipping they just kinda stay around the surface and eat the tiny baby snails that were invading for a while. If they have issues I have another tank they can move to.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Yea.. see the fact that they eat baby snails means they will also eat baby shrimp :\


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## Snowflake311 (Apr 20, 2011)

Yeah mine were good for 3 weeks then they turned on my shrimp. They were mean but they were also spawning so they were extra mean. I just remember then hunting down tiny ones. Mmmm shrimp.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Well my worrying over the shrimplets made me move the little guys, all three fish are now out of the ebi. Sad though  Really wanted at least some kind of fish in there. Been thinking of other options, I dunno if endler's are aggressive or shrimp-safe and they seem to be the only other tiny fish.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Well since you have more expensive shrimp and your population isn't that large I wouldn't really keep any fish in there. Once you have a nice population going you can add some fish back in!

The only 100% shrimp safe fish are ottos. But those don't really swim in like open space which is probably what you are looking for


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

I'd just like to announce that there are now four berried shrimp  and some of the eggs are changing color a little, maybe I'll see eyes next lol


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Congrats ! Good luck and glad you removed those fishies


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

ANNNoooother update! There's a 5th berried shrimp and....

I have....

*Orange-eye Blue tigers coming in the mail!!!* OMG I am so exciteeddddd!!! They're not going in the Ebi but still...this needed to be announced


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Congrats! Where are those OEBT going? New journal for it?


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## Snowflake311 (Apr 20, 2011)

There are fish that are safer. But my sparkling gouramis were far from shrimp safe. Your shrimp will be better off with out them. 

I think Pygmy cory cats can be shrimp safe. Along with otos. In a larger tank with lots of plants and hide out I find my galaxy danios good mates for shrimp they might eat a few slow ones but they don't hunt them down. I still find babies with these fish in the tank. 

Pygmy cory cats could be fun to try once your shrimp babies get a little bigger.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Congrats! Where are those OEBT going? New journal for it?


Probably a 2.5g I'm making specifically for them, then a 12g long if I manage to find one for a decent price. Def gonna post a journal for that tank 



Snowflake311 said:


> There are fish that are safer. But my sparkling gouramis were far from shrimp safe. Your shrimp will be better off with out them.
> 
> I think Pygmy cory cats can be shrimp safe. Along with otos. In a larger tank with lots of plants and hide out I find my galaxy danios good mates for shrimp they might eat a few slow ones but they don't hunt them down. I still find babies with these fish in the tank.
> 
> Pygmy cory cats could be fun to try once your shrimp babies get a little bigger.


I've seen the pygmy cories and they're cute  Might look into some when my crs population gets going.

-------------

OK! The OEBTs ARRIVED! And I nearly had a heart attack when I saw the packaging! Only a relatively thin layer of newspaper was separating these little guys from the elements, I'm so freakin' glad the winters been mild here :icon_eek:

And they are also microscopic. Thought I was buying shrimp not shrimpLETs but with ebay you never actually know what you just bought till it arrives on your doorstep...
I don't regret getting them tho :icon_cool
































There's shrimp in those pictures. I swear. :hihi:

Updates on the crystal herd:

































And this is the corner all the berried shrimp go in to talk about their lives lol


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

How many OEBT did you get? Why not order from this forum ?

Seems the females feel most safe in that corner haha.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> How many OEBT did you get? Why not order from this forum ?
> 
> Seems the females feel most safe in that corner haha.


7, maybe more. 

Because I don't have a paypal and found a good deal :icon_eek:


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Ah right. I remember you telling me that now haha.

I couldn't really see the shrimps at all in the pictures haha :X


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Updated fts! I finally removed the one rock from the driftwood because it doesn't float anymore, the other piece however....









And some better pictures of the tiny OEBTs, this hobby is definitely testing my camera's macro to the limit LOL. Right now they're living in the breeder box on the ebi because it has the most stable parameters of all my tanks, and I found a molt yesterday so they are already eating & growing
You can see the lil orange eyes in this one
















One of the tiniest ones
























The tiger nursery, I'm going to need to put a sock or something over the intake so no CRS shrimplets get sucked into the box. They should be born any day now too. And if you look reaaaally close you can see a lil shrimplet on the anubias leaf! The lid is only off for picture purposes 
















And this one discovered the crushed pond snail


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Is the breeder box getting enough filtration? How are you promoting circulation into that tank?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Is the breeder box getting enough filtration? How are you promoting circulation into that tank?


Powerful air pump, lots of plants, and I siphon it (very carefully:icon_eek when doing water changes on the ebi. :icon_mrgr


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Did you block out the outflow from the breeder box with sponge or something?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Did you block out the outflow from the breeder box with sponge or something?


Of course :icon_eek: can't have microscopic OEBTs all over the tank!


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Doesn't it outflow back into the tank from the hanger arm?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Yea there's a little grate over it that you can't really see in the pix. 

Noticed something cool today, same shrimp, December '11 to Feb '12
















White faded a little right after the berries but now it's back to looking painted on. Both my favorite crs ended up being female and now have berries!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

*Shrimplets!!*

Came home to find these little guys everywhere. All over the tank. There are so manyyy and this is only the first round! Still 4 more berried shrimp! :icon_eek:

It was sooo hard to get decent pictures...








































Mom-shrimp on the left, shrimplet on the far right frogbit root 
















This one's only got a teeny spot of color on it's face
















Blending in with the frogbit









And two of the known males

















Can't wait till the others hatch!! There's already 15-20 new babies in the tank!


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Aw... so cute! Congrats on your first babies!


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Aw... so cute! Congrats on your first babies!


Thanks 

I think there are more today...counted a few brown/grey ones so I could have some new CBS wandering around the tank! I have so many plans for tanks now, I have an 20g on a shelf in the same room and....it needs to be filled :biggrin:


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

So the tank is now littered with little grey, maroon, and red shrimplets...still 2 berried shrimp that should be having babies soon. Also bought them some new food, "Ebita Breed CRS Food". They swarmed it :icon_mrgr
















































Lil shrimplets


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## Cynth (Sep 11, 2010)

Congrats! It is always exciting to find new babies.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Dang! Those shrimpies colored up super nicely! I remember when you first got them they were splotchy clear! Now look at those !


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## Thark (Feb 19, 2012)

I like your tank. Congrats on the little shrimp, they look very exciting.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Thanks everyone!!

There's some sad news today though, checked on the tank to find this one breathing heavily, then dead 15 minutes later. None of the other shrimp are distressed and everything's fine, but I did a 10% waterchange just to be safe. 

One of the nicest looking ones I had, but also the oldest, so maybe that was the cause 
RIP


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Aw.. why did you take a picture of it dead  It even was a no-hino CRS. But if it was the only one I think you should be fine.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Aw.. why did you take a picture of it dead  It even was a no-hino CRS. But if it was the only one I think you should be fine.


Making sure nothing looked 'unusual' about it...but it's not all white inside like if it was a disease or anything. I'm hoping that he's got some shrimplets somewhere in the tank :icon_conf


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

So I've been thinking of replacing the filter, to give me some more planting space in the back, what's the best nano canister filter guys??

Also had another litter of shrimplets appear yesterday and a new berried shrimp today! The previous ones are getting big and their white looks awesome, I can see them across the room from the tank! The OEBT's are also getting their blues in so I'll have to update on everyone soon with some pix.


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Picture Updates! I don't even know how many shrimp there are anymore, I see new little shrimplets everyday...there could be 15 or 20 more... :icon_mrgr
Here's what the tank currently looks like, took the HC out of the right corner and replaced it with a riccia-covered rock but not much else has changed.

















































Berries & shrimplets :icon_cool
















In the veeery center there's a lil black shrimplet








2 little ones








One of the biggest ones


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Those are some very healthy looking shrimp. The bright white on them looks great.

I just set up and EBI and must say that I'm already a fan. You have me wanting to put in some parva.

Have you given a canister filter more thought?


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Hyzer said:


> Those are some very healthy looking shrimp. The bright white on them looks great.
> 
> I just set up and EBI and must say that I'm already a fan. You have me wanting to put in some parva.
> 
> Have you given a canister filter more thought?


Thanks!

As for the canister, I'm looking at either a Finnex PX 360 or a Mini-Rapids right now. Dunno which one is better though.


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## DesmondTheMoonBear (Dec 19, 2011)

Oh wow, nice. Wish I had a CRS/CBS shrimplet invasion instead of a RCS one, lol. Excited to see how my 6 CRS/CBS do though...I'm not expecting a lot though with my rock water.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Wish I had a shrimplet invasion... looking great though Stacy


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

Been away from the forums a while, but the shrimp are still breeding and growing like crazy! I actually have plans for a *55g* tank. ALSO I will be thinning off some CBS and maybe a few CRS shrimplets soon and I'm willing to trade some of them for low to medium light plants so if anyone's interested pm me.

Major update pix
There's a bit of an aponogeton takeover going on right now, lol








Frogbit, salvinia, riccia mat, and pothos plants









And the shrimp, I seriously have to get a pic of feeding time soon because they all just come out of I don't even know where...but it's an epic swarm! Maybe tomorrow.

























































Super tiny newborn shrimplet!









And my HUGE _*ugly*_ CRS that I've had since the first batch, she still has pretty babies though! Just never got the color back from being shipped I guess.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Welcome back haha! Your tank really got overgrown ! What kinda low light plants are you looking for? I got some anubias, round pella, and some random stems lying around! I'd be interested in a trade :3


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## dragonsong93 (Nov 25, 2011)

diwu13 said:


> Welcome back haha! Your tank really got overgrown ! What kinda low light plants are you looking for? I got some anubias, round pella, and some random stems lying around! I'd be interested in a trade :3


Yea! I'm in the process of renovating it a little each day because of shrimp swarms lol, the whole left corner is rotala now :biggrin:

Pretty much anything, my plant collection is pretty small (and a 55g can fit a lot of plants!)..plus I gotta go to the post office tomorrow and see what size box I'll need for shipping shrimps.


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## diwu13 (Sep 20, 2011)

Want me to take a picture of the plants and you can decide if you want to trade?

I think a small priority box is pretty popular. the 6x6x7 one.


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