# HQI MH bulb for reds and blues?



## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

The bulbs that I got with my MH lights are about at end of life, and I've finding very little information about the spectrum of available MH HQI lamps for any bulbs less than 12000K. Seems this is a big deal for reef keepers, but I'm not finding much info on 10000K and lower bulbs.

My tank has fish that are both red and and blue. And I'm interested in bulbs that will help those colors "pop" visually. I'm not so worried about the plants. For anything available between 4000 and 10000K, I'm sure they'll adapt.

Please note, I'm not asking what color temp should I get to get these two colors to be emphasized. I'm asking about specific HQI MH bulbs.

Thanks in advance.


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

What wattage is your MH setup, scolley?

The ADA 8800K bulb pops these two colors quite nicely. There are also the Astralux 8000K bulbs but I feel they're a bit closer to 10KK than the ADA bulbs. Definitely not 10KK...they're not that white, but a tad bit whiter than the ADA bulb. I might have an extra Astralux bulb or two that I fired up to test whether they worked if you're interested. 

Other than two two bulbs, I haven't had any luck in sourcing a MH bulb with good coloration for a FWP tank. The only setup I've seen with good growth and color had both MHs and T5s. The MH was 10KK while the T5s employed a mix of the pink-ish Grow bulbs and the Giesemann midday bulbs.


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

AquaMedic 10K renders FW colors very nicely IME...


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

I'm sorry, I should have specified... these MH HQIs are 150 watt. 

epicfish - According to ADA documentation their HQI's peak in red and green. You're sure they make blue pop? My fish are seriously red and blue, and I want both colors to jump out.

Presently I've got whatever the 10000Ks are that come with AquaMedic fixtures - Aqualine Buschke I believe - and they make blues look great, but really don't make the plants look very good. So I'm sure the ADA's would be a nice change, IF they highlighted blues too.

And I may PM you about those Astralux. Thanks.


roybot73 - Thanks. I agree. I'm posting a new pic tonight in my Son of Kahuna thread where you can see how the AM's make my fish look. But I'm not happy with how they light the plants. But you can be the judge...


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

bump


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## Martin (Jan 15, 2005)

Hi Steve.
Well, you linked to this thread, so I'll post here.

Personally I've had excellent success with a 5200K bulb. that's 600K below the sun.

Osram HQI-TS 150W/D UVS RX7S-24 FS1
Osram 150W HQI-TS Double Ended Quartz Metal Halide Clear

# D Daylight 150 Watt, RX7s-24 Cap
# Excellent colour rendering 91%.
# 150W HQITS Powerstar
# CCT 5200K

Main characteristics 
Average luminance 1500 cd/cm² 
Base RX7s-24 
Colour of the product clear 
Colour rendering group 1B 
Colour rendering index (Ra) Min. 80 Max. 89 
Colour temperature in Kelvin 5200 K 
Colour temperature in Kelvin (HQI CCG) 5200 K 
Diameter in mm 23 mm 
Distance a / LCL in mm 66 mm 
ILCOS MD/UB-150/52/1B-H-RX7s24-23/132/P45 
Import tag (derivation) Import article 
Lamp current in Amps 1.8 A 
Lamp wattage in Watts 150 W 
Luminous Efficacy in lm/W 80 lm/W 
Luminous output in lumen 12000 lm 
Main frequency in Hz 50 Hz 
Max. Length in mm 132 mm 
Operating position p 45 
PFC capacitor at 50 Hz µF 20 µF 
Rated wattage in Watts 150 W 
SEG-Nr. 8333222 
System power consumption in Watts 170 W 

A quick search for a shop came up with this:
http://www.bltdirect.com/product.php?pid=10132

I just had a rather hard time finding an actual spectral chart but lo and behold...

I can only recommend this bulb. Nice CRI, Nice Kelvin, Nice price.. though it is an english shop.. I'm sure there are US dealers! 

hope you can use this info.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I'm a big HQI and MH user for decdes now...........I think epicfish is right, you need a combo color, the HQI give some nice reflectance, real sunlight like sheen, but they seem to wash color out, too bright perhaps for our eyes, so the T5's and/or some PC's might be the best solution.

I get a slightly nicer sheen with MH's, some plants do better than others, some do worse with PC's etc.

Overall, the T5's seem the best IME for this goal.

Spread and color are better, but that shimmer is missing

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Martin - thanks for the reccomendation. I spent a while looking for that bulb in the states, and could not find it. But when I checked out that spectum graph, I can see that's not what I'm looking for anyway...

I'm specifically looking for a 150w HQI lamp with peaks in red and blue.

Problem is, as your difficulty in locating the spectrum info for your bulb indicates... it is often stupidly difficult to locate spectral data for a given bulb. I'm baffled as to why vendors would not make that information easily available.


Tom - Thanks for the suggestion. And I'm sure combo's are the way to go. But I've only got 2 150w fixtures over this tank, and a combo is not possible without changing fixtures. And I've already sunk enough money into converting these from the crap/noisy magnetic stock ballasts to nice quiet electronic ones, that I'm not changing fixtures.

And I've had a nice T5 - but deliberately gave that up. Even if I have to put up with colors being washed out, to me (it's clearly a personal preference) I'm happy to put up with it. As you know from having them... colors wash out in photos, but the "shimmer" that you get in person from MH lamps is just spectacular to behold. So, for now, I'm gonna stick with the HQI's.

Now if I could just find an nice red and blue peaking bulb...


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Is it the case that a blue and red peaking bulb will make blue and red fish's color pop more than a more even spectrum bulb, or a differently peaking bulb than red and blue? I don't know much about the science of light. Please enlighten me (sorry, I just _had_ to say it!).

I like the look of 10kk personally, but never worried about the bulbs' color spectrum with respect to the colors of my fish...


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

macclellan said:


> Is it the case that a blue and red peaking bulb will make blue and red fish's color pop more than a more even spectrum bulb...


Exactly. In fact, many of my fish look so blue now because the 10,000K has a pretty big blue peak. Though they are generally referred to as "white", 10,000Ks tend toward "bluish white". Makes red look like crap. Which applies to both my fish, and some of my plants.

Something that would accent reds would be really nice.


PS - Not sure there is such a thing as "even spectrum" anyway. They all have peaks. Many bulbs are described as "full spectrum", which is fair. But those full spectrums have peaks too.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

scolley said:


> PS - Not sure there is such a thing as "even spectrum" anyway.


Right. But there is such a thing as more even.


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

scolley said:


> ... I'm specifically looking for a 150w HQI lamp with peaks in red and blue. ...


How about this one from: http://www.giesemann.de/76,2,,.html
*MEGACHROME tropic* – particularly suitable for fresh-water aquariums thanks to the stable spectrum with high red and low blue peaks.

This lamp will offer the correct balance of light to ensure that the growth of your plants remain lush and healthy and due to the special spectrum you will get very little nuisance algae growth.

The bulb is the best choice to meet your freshwater aquarium requirements.

colour temperature: 5600 Kelvin

available in 70 and 150 Watt double ended


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Left C - Thanks for the suggestion. And thanks for taking the time to post that spectrum chart! That's what always tells the tale, but is so often missing.

It looks like a very interesting bulb. The claim of reducing algae by reducing the blue spectrum is interesting. Certainly worth a bit of research. But I've got to admit, it's hard to believe. If that were true, I suspect the plant community would have picked up on that by technique now, and everyone would be using them.

That said, except for the diminished blues, this is an example of an "even" lamp that macclellan was referring to.

Problem is, half my fish are blue. Very blue. And I want a bulb that will emphasize them. And a bulb that will also emphasize my red fish and plants. With this bulb my blue fish would probably look a bit dull. I'm looking for just the opposite.

Yet, that said... if I can't find a bulb with the red and blue peaks I'm looking for, maybe a a better balanced bulb is a good alternative - one that will at least provide light in the colors the fish are, without washing that out with a blast with some other color.


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

scolley said:


> Left C - Thanks for the suggestion. And thanks for taking the time to post that spectrum chart! That's what always tells the tale, but is so often missing.


You are very welcome.



scolley said:


> ... It looks like a very interesting bulb. The claim of reducing algae by reducing the blue spectrum is interesting. Certainly worth a bit of research. But I've got to admit, it's hard to believe. If that were true, I suspect the plant community would have picked up on that by technique now, and everyone would be using them. ...


This is what I have found out about a "special spectrum that will get very little nuisance algae growth." I have a GE 9325K 55w PC over a 15g tall in a 24" Aqualight fixture with Coralife's flip-up legs. It has pressurized CO2.

This bulb is rather red as we know and I don't get any algae in that particular aquarium. I can skip dosing, skip water changes, dose ammonium and urea via Schultz 19-31-17 Orchid Food at ~ 4 grams 2X weekly of that product. I don't get any algae. I was going to post a thread about why I am not getting any algae and my plants are going great. Maybe it is the color spectrum??? I don't really know. I haven't read anyone else's posts about finding this out about the 9325K bulb. 
*
9325K Color Spectrum*


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## OliverN (Sep 25, 2006)

Where do you find the bulbs in the US?


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Which bulbs?


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

scolley said:


> ... That said, except for the diminished blues, this is an example of an "even" lamp that macclellan was referring to.
> 
> Problem is, half my fish are blue. Very blue. And I want a bulb that will emphasize them. And a bulb that will also emphasize my red fish and plants. With this bulb my blue fish would probably look a bit dull. I'm looking for just the opposite....


I just thought of something, but I don't know if it will work or not. 

The MEGACHROME tropic HQI has more red than blue light in its color spectrum. In water, the more energy blue color penetrates much deeper than the less energy red color. Maybe when you put the MEGACHROME tropic bulb over an aquarium; bottom line ... you may end up with brightly colored blue fish as well brightly colored red fish or even a more evened colored spectrum in the water.

This is just a guess though. Have you contacted Giesemann or some of the distributors of Giesemann bulbs?


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Hi scolley

Did you find a HQI MH bulb for reds and blues?

Left C


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Left C - thanks for the help. But nope. I've not found what I'm looking for. May not exist in a single bulb.

The GE 9325K you mentioned earlier is a pretty popular bulb. Maybe there is something to the lack of blue. They aren't available in HQI, so it does not help me. And I've had them before, and while lots of people love them, I thought the color they cast was butt ugly. Might be good for plants, and bad for algae, but I'm in this game to create something the looks nice, and IMO the GE 9325K's clobber any chance of that. But that is a very personal, and subjective, position. They may be the bee's knees for many other people.

Interesting point about the greater penetration of blue light, even though it does not show a spectral peak. I'd love to know if that were true. It so, it could provide what I'm looking for - decent coloration of both my blue and red fish.

Anyone know?

Thanks.


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

18,000k bulbs have high spikes of blue and red(not so much green/yellow). i know you were looking for a lower K but that violet color might be what you are after.


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