# Do platy fish have any special requirements? mine keep dying for some reason.



## miogpsrocks (Sep 3, 2015)

Do Platy fish have any special requirement ? 

I had every single Platy fish die in my tank and I had quite a few of them, day after day, more and more platy fish die, everyday for the last week I always find a dead Platy.

I try to do a water change and just taking some water out of the tank causes more to die. Not even refilling the tank with water, just taking some of the water out and there are more dead platy fish. 

I have notice there are fish in my tank with ICH and I'm not sure if that would have killed them that quickly or not. Ammonia may have been a little high but never reach .2PPM or above. 

Seacham just gave me an " alert" but never raised to the "alarm or toxic" levels. I had eco complete which had a lot of trace elements into the water, Temp maybe around 75, the PH may have been a little high due to the eco complete. 

Are platy just really fragile fish or more prone to stress than other fish? All my platys have died and I'm currently running 2 UV sterilizer lights and have done 20 gallon water changes(in 75 tank) for like 3 days in a row. 

I wish I knew what I was doing wrong so I could correct it. 

Thanks.


----------



## NotCousteau (Sep 25, 2014)

What is your tank size, filtration and sticking levels? Nitrites and nitrate levels?

Platies aren't difficult fish. The ich will definitely weaken their defenses to any other "normal" stressors, though.

They're dying right after you siphon out water? Dying before you get the new water in? I'm not sure why that would happen.

How long has the tank been up? Ammonia should read zero. Ammonia will harm fish.

Good luck.


----------



## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

20 gallon water change in a 75 gallon tank is not much. Keep on doing this daily until the ammonia reads 0 and the Ich is gone. Use a dechlor that locks up ammonia (Prime is one). Concentrate on vacuuming the floor of the tank to remove Ich that has fallen to the floor to breed. 
Make sure the new water is the same GH, KH, TDS as the water in the tank. (Though this small a water change it is OK if the values are a little bit off). 

Ich can hide in the gills, and this could be killing the fish. UV us a good way to treat if you are sure all the water is going through the UV. Are they the right UV for parasites? If the tank is densely planted then it is highly likely that there are calm areas where Ich is breeding, and some of these babies can infest the fish before the water passes through the UV. UV is most effective in an almost empty tank. 

Platys are hardy fish in general. They will handle a wide range of water parameters. Optimum is somewhat harder, cool water. 
They are fine with salt, if you decide to use this as a treatment for Ich. 
Are these fairly new fish? Could they have been sick from the store?


----------



## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

Ideal for a platy is actually estuarine conditions, with that said their environment changes drastically and rapidly, they're among the most hardy fish in the hobby, I keep mine with a puffer in partial marine water, it's also heated to 84 during the photoperiod and the water drops to around 78 overnight more if it is cooler in the house. 

The reason I bring all this up is that ich is your likely culprit, raise the temp to 85 or 86 slowly and treat for ich, you don't have to add salt and I wouldn't if you have plants or fish without good osmoregulation

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk


----------



## Daisy Mae (Jun 21, 2015)

Is the tank cycled? How much fish do you have in there? 
I'm just wondering why there's ammonia maybe any or combo of below--

1. The tank is not cycled which stresses and kills already sick fish, or 

2. The dying fish are causing ammonia spikes due to decomposition --> which then causes a vicious cycle of killing more stressed fish which then decompose etc. 

3. There's lots of material that decompose (plant material, excess food etc) which the BB can't keep up with for some reason (new tank, lots of new livestock all at once etc). 

Platies are easy fish to keep, so the culprit is something else.


----------



## GallonsOfFun (Nov 11, 2015)

If there's no visible signs of ich then the most likely cause is the ammonia. pH fluctuations, hidden ich, etc. all basically go out the window in things you need to be concerned about when your ammonia is at 2ppm. If it's that high then your tank is likely not cycled (unless something drastic happened, like decomposing fish as another user suggested). First and foremost you need to get the ammonia levels down.


----------



## miogpsrocks (Sep 3, 2015)

NotCousteau said:


> What is your tank size, filtration and sticking levels? Nitrites and nitrate levels?
> 
> Platies aren't difficult fish. The ich will definitely weaken their defenses to any other "normal" stressors, though.
> 
> ...


Tank is pretty new, only setup for a little over a week however I had 24/7 ammonia monitoring badge and a lot of established biomedia taken from another 55 gallon tank with a lot of fish in it. 

On the seachem chart, its at the alert level. It has never reached alarm or toxic. 

It goes:
1. Safe(below .02
2. Alert(about .05) 
3. Alarm(about 0.2 mg/L)
4. Toxic (about 0.5 mg/L) 

Seachem. Ammonia Alert

Thank size is 75 gallons
Hydrolift sponge filter rated for 125 gallon tank, taken from an established 55 gallon which has been setup for months. This was the main filter for that tank. 
Canister filter like 265 gallons per hour with 1/3 filled with biomax fluval ceramic rings
Various aquarium sponges also taken from the 55 gallon tank. 

I was surprised the beneficial bacteria did not do a better job considering how much stuff I took from an established tank. 

Currently the ammonia is Safe(below .02 on the badge however all the platy are already dead. The nitrites are a lot higher, I used an API test and it shows purple. From the Color chart, I honestly can't tell the difference between .50PPM and 5PPM. They all took to be the same shade of purple. 

They are dying just by just siphon out water before new water is even placed in the tank. 

So how long does Ich normally take to kill a fish or is it more likely the chemcials? I am not sure what level of nitrites is toxic to fish. 

Thanks.


----------



## GallonsOfFun (Nov 11, 2015)

My bad, I misread it before and I thought you said 2ppm and not .2ppm!


----------



## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

This is an ich problem, though nitrates in high enough levels can be harmful

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk


----------



## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

Nitrite affects the blood and makes the blood less efficient at carrying oxygen. Depending on the age and species NO2 can affect the fish at levels as low as .25ppm, but most aquarium fish can tolerate that amount for a short time. Fry are more sensitive, so if you are raising fry keep the level undetectable. 
General instructions for aquariums:
Do enough water changes (frequency and volume) to keep the NO2 under 1 ppm.
Use a dechlor that can minimize the toxicity such as Prime. 
Add 1 teaspoon of salt per 20 gallons of water. This will reduce the amount of NO2 that crosses the gills This is a low level of salt, well tolerated by even the most salt-sensitive fish and plants. To get this effect from other sources it is the chloride that does the job. You will have to research the dose of something like Calcium Chloride. 
When you do water changes add just enough salt to treat the new water. Example: if you do a 20 gallon water change add 1 teaspoon of salt to the new water. 

For more details about NO2 toxicity you can look up Methemoglobinemia and Brown Blood Disease. It affects many animals, not just fish, and can be a serious problem for humans, too. 

If you need to treat for Ich you can use a higher level of salt, and this will protect against a certain amount of NO2, but keep up the water changes. You need to keep the NO2 level under 1 ppm.


----------



## miogpsrocks (Sep 3, 2015)

Diana said:


> 20 gallon water change in a 75 gallon tank is not much. Keep on doing this daily until the ammonia reads 0 and the Ich is gone. Use a dechlor that locks up ammonia (Prime is one). Concentrate on vacuuming the floor of the tank to remove Ich that has fallen to the floor to breed.
> Make sure the new water is the same GH, KH, TDS as the water in the tank. (Though this small a water change it is OK if the values are a little bit off).
> 
> Ich can hide in the gills, and this could be killing the fish. UV us a good way to treat if you are sure all the water is going through the UV. Are they the right UV for parasites? If the tank is densely planted then it is highly likely that there are calm areas where Ich is breeding, and some of these babies can infest the fish before the water passes through the UV. UV is most effective in an almost empty tank.
> ...


Yes, they could be sick from the store. 

One of the store tanks it filled with ich and I recently found out they share a filter. Which means that whatever disease one tank has will spread to the other tanks. I am hoping to get my sunsun canister filter working again to provide a 3rd UV source. Currently I have 2 stand alone sunsun UV sterilizers working on opposite ends of the tank. Last night I changed out 40 gallons.

I also had a very aggressive bunch of Buenos Aires Tetras originally that were harassing all the fish in the tank before I returned them. 

I can't wait until the Kordon Ich attack medicine arrives in the mail, I ordered it over the weekend and hopefully it will be here in a few days. 

Thanks.

Bump:


shrimpNewbie said:


> Ideal for a platy is actually estuarine conditions, with that said their environment changes drastically and rapidly, they're among the most hardy fish in the hobby, I keep mine with a puffer in partial marine water, it's also heated to 84 during the photoperiod and the water drops to around 78 overnight more if it is cooler in the house.
> 
> The reason I bring all this up is that ich is your likely culprit, raise the temp to 85 or 86 slowly and treat for ich, you don't have to add salt and I wouldn't if you have plants or fish without good osmoregulation
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk


I am also thinking ich combined with stress however does Ich usually work that quickly? 

My fish were mostly in the dark and lots of them died. I finally got my LED light delivered and when I turned on that bright light, I could see all the ich on almost all the fish! 

I guess by the time you see the ich, it means it has been on the fish for a while huh? 

Thanks.


----------



## GallonsOfFun (Nov 11, 2015)

Remember to raise the temperature to 86F (if possible) as this prevents ich from reproducing.


----------



## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

Ich lands on the fish as a single cell. 
In warm water it burrows in, begins feeding, and grows large enough to see in just a couple of days. It can take a week or longer to see Ich in a pond fish, at cooler temperatures. 
They grow for several days to a week at tropical temperatures, then fall off the fish, and land on the substrate, plant leaves, rocks and pretty much everywhere. They divide into many babies over a period of a day or so. 
This whole cycle can happen as fast as 1 week in warm water, or longer than a month in colder water (such as a pond). 

Example:
You looked at the fish in the store and saw no Ich, so you brought the fish home.
You added the water from the bag to your tank. In that water are some Ich babies, and on the new fish are also Ich that just landed on the fish before you bought them. Ich can live in the gills where you cannot see it. These may be more advanced than the babies that just landed on the fish. 

It can easily take 24-48 hours for you to see Ich on the new fish, and another day or so for Ich to grow large enough on your original fish (infected by the Ich babies in the bag of water from the store). 
This is why it is very important to use a quarantine tank for new fish. By the time you see the Ich, even just a day or two after purchase, your whole tank is infested. 

In a week or less (depending on temperature) many of the original Ich organisms that got on the fish in the store are falling off and reproducing. The ones that may have been in the gills could be older, and are ready to fall off your new fish right away. So, in just a few days to a week, the tank may have a very large Ich population, many fish infested, and the white spots will be showing up in just a few days. 

If the fish can handle the higher temperature then 86+ degrees will indeed stop an infestation. Water holds less oxygen when it is warmer. Add aeration by adding a bubbler, power head or altering the aim of the filter outlet to move water so there is more ripples at the surface. You could lower the water level if you have a HOB filter so the water falls a bit farther into the tank. 

Other treatments are based on targeting the babies- Ich burrowed in on the fish are not susceptible to medication. You need to keep the medication in the water long enough to kill the babies from at least 2 full cycles just to make sure you have killed them even if their timing is different.


----------



## WaterLife (Jul 1, 2015)

Great info already.

Just wanted to mention about the higher temperatures. Remember that thermometers and even heaters are not all that accurate. So if you set the heater to 86*F (temp at which ich stops reproducing), the heater and/or the thermometer may be inaccurate and you could actually be at 84*F or so, in which case you would be speeding the life cycle, and reproduction rate of the ich which would further and faster infect the fish (could also read higher at 88*F or so I suppose). Just wanted to point that out. But speeding the ich life cycle up can be helpful in shortening treatment times since the ich will reach it's vulnerable life stage faster and be killed off sooner, BUT that is only if you are actually in the process of treating it, which right now you aren't doing since you aren't dosing meds or salt.

Not to mention the higher temps (and with it, potentially less dissolved oxygen if extra aeration is not provided), further stress fish.
It is said that temps 90*F and higher kill ich, which may be true, but from my personal experience with heat and treating ich is that the fish are pretty stressed out (more so from the heat, than the ich infestation), more disstressed than I feel comfortable seeing/putting my fish through. And I personally haven't had the success with heat + salt method, but that's just me, as plenty of others have had it work out great. Some have even had success with the 90*F+ temps to kill off ich without fish dying. Just sharing. 

Monitor the fish with whatever treatment you go with. If you are going to be using Kordon Ich Attack, which is what I now use, raising the temp isn't really necessary. But if you do want to raise the temp to have quicken treatment, I personally wouldn't recommend raising the temp until at least the second day of dosing, just to give the med some time to get to work before speeding up the ich cycle.

And remember to continue treatment (regardless of treatment method -heat, salt, meds, etc.) for at least 3-4 extra days *after* there are no visible ich spots/cysts.


----------



## miogpsrocks (Sep 3, 2015)

WaterLife said:


> Great info already.
> 
> Just wanted to mention about the higher temperatures. Remember that thermometers and even heaters are not all that accurate. So if you set the heater to 86*F (temp at which ich stops reproducing), the heater and/or the thermometer may be inaccurate and you could actually be at 84*F or so, in which case you would be speeding the life cycle, and reproduction rate of the ich which would further and faster infect the fish (could also read higher at 88*F or so I suppose). Just wanted to point that out. But speeding the ich life cycle up can be helpful in shortening treatment times since the ich will reach it's vulnerable life stage faster and be killed off sooner, BUT that is only if you are actually in the process of treating it, which right now you aren't doing since you aren't dosing meds or salt.
> 
> ...


I would love to start treating my fish if Petco would every ship me my order. 

I am not normally one to pay for overnight shipping or anything since their distribution center is in George and I'm in Florida right next to them. However, I think I ordered it on a Friday or saturaday and today is Wednesday and it still have not even shipped out yet! 

I guess I am spoiled with amazon usually shipping the same day that I order. 

I have been relying on 2 UV sterilizers and turning the light off and aggressive water changes so far until the medicine arrives. It look like the visible ich on the fish has decreased maybe 80% surprisingly because I did not think the UV sterolizer worked on ich. It also could be just the life cycle speeding up since I had raised the temperature to around 78-80. 

I have neon tetra which I have heard do not like high temperature or salt. So I am trying to rely on that medicine. The more Petco delays my order, the more dead fish I am going to have to return to them. I wish they would hurry up and ship my order.


----------

