# How many blocks of frozen food would you feed this many fish and inverts each day?



## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

I think I may be underfeeding my fish. I recently noticed some of my torpedo barbs trying to eat algae from the tank walls and my blue german ram was trying to eat riccia.

I generally feed them frozen food, and while I'd like to include other foods, for now, I'd like to get some idea of how many blocks of frozen food you think would be the right amount for all of my fish.

The frozen food is something like Hikari bloodworms, krill, brine shrimp and brine shrimp with spirulina. They're all the same size blocks. I usually thaw them out in a little container with water, and then dump it all in pretty fast in an area in which the current will scatter it all over the tank.

The fish and inverts I have are:

5 Pelvicachromis (Kribs)
10 Torpedo Barbs (all are 1.5"-2.5" in size)
1 Blue German Ram
20 Cardinal Tetras (med to large/jumbo)
~12 male guppies (around half are adult and half are juveniles)
1 L204 Flash Pleco (wood eater, mature size)
~ 40 Amano Shrimp (most 2", but males are smaller)

That comes to a total of 89 mouths to feed! And while some are light feeders, such as the cardinals, some are heavy feeders, like the guppies. I dump the food in all at once specifically so there will be so much food that the blue german ram and kribs can be certain to get some since they aren't as aggressive at chasing down a piece of food. They tend to like to look at it first, and then spend time "chewing" it while the barbs and guppies seem to inhale the food in a split second.

I was feeding them 2 frozen blocks, but that was gone so fast, I increased it to three. But I don't always feed daily. Sometimes it's every other day. I'm not going to pretend to be an angel at feeding.

If I were to get really good at feeding them every day, how many blocks of food should I offer? Keep in mind that the amanos are aggressive shrimp and will grab a bloodworm or shrimp to feast on. So that's 40 or more eaten right there.

I'm also interested in what other foods would be good to use? They love the frozen foods, of course, but sometimes I'd like to just open a container and toss in some food. Any suggestions on which food would be a good compliment for the frozen food?

Thanks to all, in advance! :smile:


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

That's not enough food, but jeez, how can you afford using frozen blocks for that many fish?!? I have a friend that spends more on frozen food for his (marine) sharks than he spends on food for himself.

IMHO, the blocks are a bad deal. Much better buying the "zip locked" kind and cutting to size yourself. That is, if you are hell bent on using frozen food exclusively.

I'd simply feed high quality flake for most of the inhabitants and then squirt some frozen food down to the lower levels or drop in a few HBH Super Soft Pellets for the rams and kribs - I can't say enough about this food (available at petsmart) for fish that typically won't eat flake. My Bolivian Rams *love* these little nuggets, and they won't touch flake food, NLS Cichlid pellets, etc. it is the only non-frozen or non-freeze-dried food that they will eat:


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

I don't want to feed frozen food exclusively! That's why I'm asking questions.

I first need to get some idea of how much to feed this many fish, and the blocks are a measured amount of food that I think most anyone can relate to. So if people say 3 blocks a day or 6 blocks a day, I'd get a better feel for how much I should be feeding.

I can then use that as a help to feeding other, non frozen, foods.

It's just that there is so much concern about over feeding that I'm beginning to realize that I'm taking it too far and am under feeding my fish!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

The problem is that you can't extrapolate from frozen to other foods. Frozen, especially the cubes, are almost all water. You'd feed far less, volume wise, of freeze dried or flake/pellet etc. Maybe I'm nuts, but the standard "feed as much as the fish will consume in 2 minutes" is what you should be feeding them - it works just fine for most of the world. I'd guess that something like 1/4-1/2tsp of flake in your case. 

Is it really so complicated...feeding fish?


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

I have 3 fish in my turtle tank that I only feed about once a week. Most fish don't need nearly as much food as we feed them.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I feed a different food every day, but I make sure I feed sinking wafers at least 3x week. I drop about 6 in my 90gal about an hour before lights out just to make sure that all the bottom- and nocturnal-feeders get to eat.

I really like the frozen cubes, personally - they're easy to measure and I'm not worried about water with Hikari brand. There's some but not enough to make me feel like I'm getting gypped. I get San Francisco brand pretty regularly too when I can't get Hikari, and they're OK.

Omega One is my staple flake. I feed that probably every other day.

I also fast my fish at least one day a week.

If I tried to make sure absolutely every single fish in my tank was full every single day I'd overfeed for sure. Instead, I target my foods to different species each day to make sure every fish does get full at least 1 to 2 times a week.

In a big community tank, sometimes making sure everyone gets fed does take some planning.


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

macclellan, it's certainly not complicated. I simply wanted to receive feedback from others here. That's why we're here, isn't it?

Your post was helpful as I never considered how much water there was in frozen foods, and the idea of putting 1/2 tsp flakes is way more than I ever imagined. I'm used to small tanks, not large ones. I can easily tell you how much First Bites to give 9 microrasporas, for example.

The 2 minute idea.... does it include the time in which the fish are looking all over the tank for food on the bottom? The fish tend to eat the food up almost instantly, but a lot also drops down and gets stuck on the plants and all. The fish then search for it and clean it up. I drop all the fish food in at once, intending for it to scatter so the less aggressive feeders can get some food while the more aggressive feeders are running around like crazy, trying to eat it all.

And then there's the amanos. If they can, they'll grab whatever food they can and run off with it. With close to 40 amanos in the tank, that's a lot of food they take.

I'm basically trying to get some idea of what amount of food is considered reasonable for this many fish and inverts, and I didn't think it harmed anything to ask what others think. I realize quite a few of my questions are very basic, but I'd rather ask so I can learn than to be too afraid my question will be deemed too simple.


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## DiscusIt'sWhats4DinneR (Apr 25, 2008)

omega one "super color" is a really good one. it will color up your fish really nicely.


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

Laura Lee, that's very helpful. But I'm curious; when you put the sinking wafers in, do the fish fight over them? My first problem with sinking wafers is that the amanos grab them. I can't put 40+ wafers in! So I have to break them up really small. But then I never know which fish eat them because all my fish love them!

I did discover today that there is a food the amanos like that the fish don't seem to like. I have some of that HBH soft food that macclellan posted, but the kind I have is spirulina, not the overall basic.

I put them in the tank, and the fish tried to eat them, but for the most part, spit them out and did not try them again. However, the shrimp grabbed one right away! So maybe I can first feed the shrimp some of the spirulina and once most of them have grabbed a pellet, then I can add some sinking wafers. Hopefully, the shrimp will be too preoccupied with their spirulina to take all the wafers before the fish can get them?


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

That's two recommendations for Omega One. I get some and try it. Thanks!


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## KurtG (Dec 10, 2007)

Vicki-
fyi- The problems you are having with your fish [other post], I went through after feeding frozen hikari bloodworms. I don't feed frozen anymore. Never did determine the cause of the problems other than it was frozen food related.


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## Coltonorr (Mar 12, 2008)

Complexity,
you could try feeding a little less 2-3x a day or every other day. that way all the fish get 2-3 opportunities a the food.
are some of your fish thin? have you lost any? if not I wouldn't worry too much...if they are all living and healthy keep doing what your doing.


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## fishbguy1 (Feb 29, 2008)

I feed all my tropicals and carnivorous cichlids (apistos and N. multifasciatus):

tetra color food
frozen bloodworms
live blackworms
Live seamonkeys (  Brineshrimps)
bottom feeder tablets

I feed my herbivorous fish (african cichlids and plecos)

Omega one super veggie (YAY omega one!!)
Tetra color
Algae tablets
Bottom feeder tablets
Romaine lettuce
Zuchinni
Cucumber
live blackworms (RARELY!)

They get fed the flakes every day. The carnivores get their worms/seamonkeys every other day. Either live, or frozen, but not both.

Herbivores get their fresh veggies every 3 days or so. I just grab whatever is closest out of the fridge..haha They get worms once a month or 2.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Complexity said:


> Laura Lee, that's very helpful. But I'm curious; when you put the sinking wafers in, do the fish fight over them? My first problem with sinking wafers is that the amanos grab them. I can't put 40+ wafers in! So I have to break them up really small. But then I never know which fish eat them because all my fish love them!
> 
> I did discover today that there is a food the amanos like that the fish don't seem to like. I have some of that HBH soft food that macclellan posted, but the kind I have is spirulina, not the overall basic.
> 
> I put them in the tank, and the fish tried to eat them, but for the most part, spit them out and did not try them again. However, the shrimp grabbed one right away! So maybe I can first feed the shrimp some of the spirulina and once most of them have grabbed a pellet, then I can add some sinking wafers. Hopefully, the shrimp will be too preoccupied with their spirulina to take all the wafers before the fish can get them?


Yep, my Amanos will snag a few. I actually have an open area of just gravel in my tank where I start feeding the fish, and the Amanos don't like this open area and generally leave anything that falls there alone. I usually throw a few over near my driftwood for the Amanos, as well. Feeding in different areas of the tank at the same time tends to work well. When I feed flakes, I put them in my filter output so they get blown all over. The Amanos tend to stick to picking the flakes out of my sponge prefilters when I do that, which works for me. :thumbsup: No wasted food! LOL

KurgG- I've fed frozen Hikari bloodworms for I've no idea how many years (5-10?) and never had any issues... What did your fish have that you think was linked to frozen foods?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Complexity, of course it is fine to discuss. You missed my wink, I was razzing you a bit 'tis all. 



lauraleellbp said:


> I really like the frozen cubes, personally - they're easy to measure and I'm not worried about water with Hikari brand. There's some but not enough to make me feel like I'm getting gypped.


I meant mostly water in the sense that living things are mostly water, not that the worms are in a block of water. 

Compare $:weight of frozen food (>70% water being conservative) vs. freeze dried (For example, Hikari Tubifex worms are 6% max moisture) food that you reconstitute yourself, or flake. It's a no-brainer which is more cost-effective. Frozen foods are like Liquid Fertilizers - really expensive for mostly water.

I use frozen only as a treat due the cost but largely stick to dried foods, just like ferts.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I feed some dried foods, but I actually have had more issues with them than with frozen. Constipation not all that uncommon  I guess you could soak dried foods in water to rehydrate them first, but that's too much work for me LOL 

I also tend to think that you lose some nutrients when foods are dried, some electrolytes, some compounds/amino acids/etc will break down... might not be a big deal, but still something to consider.


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

macclellan said:


> Complexity, of course it is fine to discuss. You missed my wink, I was razzing you a bit 'tis all.


I'm sorry. Obviously, I missed the wink. I'm not all here right now after finding my torpedo barb with dropsy. My stomach is in knots.

But let's keep this thread about food only. I appreciate everyone's input. I haven't even made it to page 2 yet, and already I'm getting lots of excellent information and ideas!


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## Feral (Feb 26, 2008)

I also use Omega Flakes and my fish love them.

Their favorite food however is the MicroCrabs. They are slow sinking and its like a frenzy when I throw it in.












I tend to be lax in feeding also, but in the wild fish never know when the next meal will be so I think feeding different amounts and types of food daily keep the fish very happy.

If you prefer frozen. There are tons of different recipes. You use unflavored gelatin mixed with different ingredients (shrimp, fish, clams, etc. - all blended of course). I've heard of some people breaking up human vitamins and putting them in these concoctions. Then freeze and you can make your own perfect sized portions.


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## vance71975 (Jun 4, 2008)

I favor the Ocean Nutrition products, i feed them to my FW fish all the time. What i do is get a big container, and i mix One of Each type Of the Ocean Nutrition Flake in the big container. they have like 4 or 5 different foods, Some are more "Meat Based" and Some are more "Veggie Or Algae" Based. Mixing all of them together really creates a Nice balanced diet. I also like *Whole Freeze Dried Cyclop-eeze Or **Cyclop-eeze 100% Wafer* Made byArgent. Below are links to some brands i like!

Links:

http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_AquariumPage~PageAlias~fish_food_ocean_nutrition_dry_flakes.html

http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_AquariumPage~PageAlias~fish_food_argent_cyclop-eeze.html

http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_searc...t=&vendorcode=DC&vendorname=Dainichi&parsed=1


My Homemade Fish Food recipe.


In Blender mix the following:

1 Can Peas (drained)
1 can Clams (NOT DRAINED unless it has salt added then drain and rinse)
1 can Crab meat (NOT DRAINED unless it has salt added then drain and rinse)
1 can Carrots (Drained)
1 can Small Shrimp(NOT DRAINED unless it has salt added then drain and rinse)
1 Can Flake Fish food(your choice on brand)
1 can freeze dried blood worms.
1/4 Bottle Selacon
1/4 Bottle Kent Extreme Garlic
You can add Liquid Baby Vitamins if you like.

2 Packages Knox Gelatin

Run all above EXCEPT Gelatin through blender till smooth.

Make Knox on Stove As package directs but instead of water use Clam Juice (most grocery stores or Super Wal marts carry it) Add contents of blender to the Knox and mix well . Pour out in Shallow pans (you want it about a inch deep) Cool in fridge till the Gelatin sets then cut into cubes and toss in baggies and freeze. You are free to add too or take away from the above that's just the batch i made and the fish went nuts over it! If its too runny add more fish food slowly till you get a paste that will pour.


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

Got to the store and was able to find the Omega One. I got the Super Color flakes and granules along with the kind made for cichlids.

I also ran across a food I had never seen before made by Seachem. It's called NutriDiet Naturals. There are different kinds available so I decided to try the shrimp. I got it only to add some variety to what I feed.

I also found some food I had previous bought that's supposed to be a natural food that "helps boost immune system to repel internal & external parasites". It's called Spectrum Thera+A by New Life. I have no idea if it works. I couldn't find it anywhere, and then discovered I had put it in the freezer to keep it fresh!

This gives me some alternatives to feed my fish other than just frozen foods and Tetra flakes.

Thanks for everyone's help! :smile:


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