# My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs! and a Tardis..



## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

This is my first attempt with discus, had them for about 4 months now the tank i have had has been running as a community tank for about 9 months or so 

managed to get the discus for a very good price as the previous owner was shutting the tank down :icon_bigg

so here are the dimensions of the tank



Here is the tank back when it was just a community tank




THE FISH

*Discus *

5 discus about 3-4" 

2 blue turquoise discus 

1 yellow discus

2 orange discus















*Tank mates

*7 or 8 Rummy Nose Tetras 

5 red eyed Tetras

a few harlequin Tetras

5 penguin Tetras

1 guppy! remains of community tank

2 plecs (not for long as I will be re-homing)

6/7 Corydoras - not sure of the types but I think Bronze and a nice spotty one

2 Nerite Snail

1 Elephant nose snail

a load of Malaysian Trumpet Snails

a bunch of Ramshorn snails

*Plants

*Java Fern

not really sure what plants I have I'm sure someone can help me ID them I think they are Amazon Swords and another Sword?

*Equipment+ maintenance + Decor 

*Water produced by my 50gph R/O filter 
100 Litre waterbutt 

Tank as above ...

100watt heater
1000lph all pond sollutions external filter with spray bar and skimmer

GLO twin t5 unit with 2x25 watt bulbs 8 hours + JBL ferrapol 5ml per week/water change

medium sized LED strip colour changing with remote (normally on green/blue)

tetra airpump

Black sand (can't remember the brand but was a 25kg sack)

2 large Redmoor Roots

2 PVC Tube/Caves

digital Temp

TDS Meter from Ebay 

PH meter from Ebay - needs new battery and calibrating though 

JBL Combiset test kit


I do a 10% water change once a week sometimes 2 times if needed

after some reading on here I was fed up with using a small pump to fill the tank slowly after changes so I got a 3 way flow valve and put in on the intake of the filter tube and when i do a change i just flick the valve to the 25 litre container thats filled from the water butt and it fills my tank nice and slow through the spray bar




*The Start

*When I first got this tank it had guppies neons tetras etc the usual community tank

adopted a Beta that someone was getting rid of and never really had much of a plan for the tank kept swapping the types of fish I would keep and it was never too stable

Heard of the Discus tank being shutdown and had seen them in the house before and always liked them so was offered them really cheap 

along with the 5 discus I was also given a load of plants the rummy noses the red eyed tetras the cories and also a peacock eel...(lasted about 3 months until my holiday..)

started by doing a large water change in my tank with RO from a garden centre not too far from me with an aquatic section with the aim to slowly acclimatise my current fish to the softer water.

picked up the fish and drip acclimatised them in cool-boxes for around 1/2 hours plonked them in and all good!

a bit shy to star with spent a lot of time hiding but eventually came out 



Started to feed on Blood worm (defrosted in tank water) 

discus mix (frozen again defrosted in tank water)

frozen brine shrimp defrosted 

flake 

NT Labs tropical pellets

Tetra Prima 

I was worried about over feeding them and water quality so I began to feed them every 2 days usually 

got some freeze dried Tubiflex worms which proved to be very popular!





*The water

*Got really fed up with driving out to get RO water once a week

I was taking 2 25 litre containers and this only cost me £4 but it was hassle

so got hold of a cheap RO unit on ebay for around £40 and a TDS Pen for around £8 

RO tends to come out with a TDS of around 004ppm and a PH of 6.5 which is good seeing as i live in an area that has tap water like liquid rock... not great for discus!

I remineralize with a mineral powder ( can't remember brand) in the 100 litre water but and aim for a TDS of around 150 

since starting this I must have forgotten the TDS aimed for as it was around 250 on my last test so I have since started to work it down again



*MY FIRST DISCUS DEATH!!

*all was good I don't think I had so much as a tetra die in the last 4 months until last month I went on holiday for 2 weeks!

left my mum a pill box with 2 weeks of food all set out... Since starting I have learned that Discus require little and often so while I was away 1 small meal per day seemed a good idea seeing as I would not be able to have a water change.

while I was away 1 of the blue turquoise discus died! 

tested the water and all was good so unsure of cause of death I would imagine it to be water condition though or an illness that went unnoticed while away

*The replacement!

*Whilst at a garden centre I realised they did discus 

I was looking to get a pigeon blood discus 

they had 1 pigeon blood left 3-4" £37 not a bad price! it had quite bad peppering though :icon_neut

and they had another blue turquoise 3-4" £37 also although the quality of this was far better then its replacement a much nicer colour and a red streak on the fins 

I went for the Blue turquoise and glad i made the choice it is a very nice fish although even 3 weeks later its still very shy





*after a lot more reading!

*So I did what I thought was a lot of reading before taking these discus on but I have learned lots more since getting them

I am now feeding them every day and some days a small meal of pellets in the morning or prima or flake and I have picked up some hikari discus food they like too 

then when im home from work they have 2 bloodworm cubes and 1 brine shrimp cube or 1 discus cube defrosted in tank water 

I have now changed the plants to an easy to grow kind and with the new 25 watt bulb and 7ml of ferrapol per week seem to be doing really good and i have been able to take a cutting of the Java fern and create a new plant!
a first for me with plants - even if its not a big accomplishment! 

*The Tank now

*




not as much peppering on this one



my latest test (before the water change and last change was 1 week ago)



*Future

*I still have some tanks in the garage so I would like to get them to breed but I don't know if male / female (help appreciated!) 

I will keep a spreadsheet of params and update my chart

keep up with photos and updates on here

when possible upgrade to a much larger tank ( this currently is in my bedroom)


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## NeonFlux (Apr 10, 2008)

Awesome, nice pics! And cool pick ups.


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## second (Jan 31, 2005)

beautiful fish!


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## Sajacobs (Aug 24, 2012)

Your fish are beautiful. 

You probably know this....you might want to remove the cups your plants are in. Their roots will soon out grow the cups.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Sajacobs said:


> Your fish are beautiful.
> 
> You probably know this....you might want to remove the cups your plants are in. Their roots will soon out grow the cups.


Thank you I didn't know to remove them actually I thought the roots just grow through cos they are pretty rooted now 

The only issue I have is my sand is quite shallow so I don't know if they would be held down enough 

How would I hold the plants down once the cups are off


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## Sajacobs (Aug 24, 2012)

Snip the plastic basket with scissors and gently pull off the basket. Some roots will break off but as long as the majority of the roots are ok the plant will be fine. Some stores sell plant anchors. You'll need to add more substrate to cover the roots plus root tabs to nourish the plant. Sand has no nutrients to provide to your plants. 

Keep posting pics as your tank matures.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Sajacobs said:


> Snip the plastic basket with scissors and gently pull off the basket. Some roots will break off but as long as the majority of the roots are ok the plant will be fine. Some stores sell plant anchors. You'll need to add more substrate to cover the roots plus root tabs to nourish the plant. Sand has no nutrients to provide to your plants.
> 
> Keep posting pics as your tank matures.


Thanks I have some plastic root anchor clips but they don't seem to hold much down as they weigh nothing 

Okay root tabs it is then.. Now do I put one under each plant? 

Do I still continue to use liquid ferts too? Would you recommend anything other than ferripol 

The tank is not heavily planted and will not be as I need the room for swimming space 

Looks like I should get a couple of small bags of black sand and then just place ontop.. Should be able to drop it in by hand without causing too much of a cloud... I hope 

Will remove the plants and replant on the weekend so more photos to come!


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Here is a video of the DIY system I use to change water







and a video of the fish feeding taken about a month ago


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## exv152 (Jun 8, 2009)

Very nice setup. Most discus keepers grow their juveniles out in grow-out tanks with bare bottoms, and 50% daily water changes, just to get them big enough before adding them to a tank with substrate. I suggest keeping the temperature at a minimum of 82ºF to keep them healthy, and add a uv sterilizer to kill any pathogens or other things that can lead to illness. Keep the updates coming.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

exv152 said:


> Very nice setup. Most discus keepers grow their juveniles out in grow-out tanks with bare bottoms, and 50% daily water changes, just to get them big enough before adding them to a tank with substrate. I suggest keeping the temperature at a minimum of 82ºF to keep them healthy, and add a uv sterilizer to kill any pathogens or other things that can lead to illness. Keep the updates coming.


Thank you still a work in progress and still learning 

Yeah they are kept at 28ºc At the moment

I had looked into a uv and still may get one 

Might order some purigen as a next step for the filter


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

your yellow discus looks really skinny and malnourished you should up the water changes and feedings


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

du3ce said:


> your yellow discus looks really skinny and malnourished you should up the water changes and feedings


Yeah I agree that's the best route 

I have read discus are prone to digestion problems and bloat from over feeding in your experience what do you think?


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## Discusdude7 (Sep 14, 2013)

Tank looks good. Hate to poop ur party but some of the fish are stunted. . .did you buy these from an LFS?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Discusdude7 said:


> Tank looks good. Hate to poop ur party but some of the fish are stunted. . .did you buy these from an LFS?


Thank you 1 the most recent one the blue turquoise one is from my lfs so should be alright 

The rest I got off someone I know shutting the tank down all can from an lfs originally

In fairness it sounds like my fault for not feeding enough.. Was worries about over feeding but it was the opposite 

Time to up the feeds and increase the wc


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

jameshill247 said:


> Yeah I agree that's the best route
> 
> I have read discus are prone to digestion problems and bloat from over feeding in your experience what do you think?


theyre prone to be bloated from flakes and pellets not frozen or freeze dried food


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

du3ce said:


> theyre prone to be bloated from flakes and pellets not frozen or freeze dried food


Ohhhhhh so a small amount of pellet and flake in morning then a couple of cubes of freezedried worms stuck to the glass at lunch time then 3 frozen cubes when I'm home would be alright then?


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## Discusdude7 (Sep 14, 2013)

jameshill247 said:


> Thank you 1 the most recent one the blue turquoise one is from my lfs so should be alright
> 
> The rest I got off someone I know shutting the tank down all can from an lfs originally
> 
> ...


Even If you up feeds and increase WC these fish won't grow much more than a few inches, if ur lucky. If you want fish u can be proud of buy from Hans, Kenny, Chicagodiscus etc.
Hans: http://discusfishstore.com/
Kenny: http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showt...2013-Forrest-shipment-Special-Hai-Khoon-stock
Chicago discus (Josie):http://chicagodiscus.com/

Remember that the bigger fish you get the easier it is on you in the long run. U will be impressed by the quality of fish from these people. My avatar fish was a fish from Hans.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Discusdude7 said:


> Even If you up feeds and increase WC these fish won't grow much more than a few inches, if ur lucky. If you want fish u can be proud of buy from Hans, Kenny, Chicagodiscus etc.
> Hans: http://discusfishstore.com/
> Kenny: http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showt...2013-Forrest-shipment-Special-Hai-Khoon-stock
> Chicago discus (Josie):http://chicagodiscus.com/
> ...


Yeah figured it might be too late 

Well I'm in the uk so would need a uk supplier but I'm gonna stick with the ones I have they are my first try so I have a lot to learn still

Hopefully they will improve a little but if not I'm fine with it


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## Discusdude7 (Sep 14, 2013)

jameshill247 said:


> Yeah figured it might be too late
> 
> Well I'm in the uk so would need a uk supplier but I'm gonna stick with the ones I have they are my first try so I have a lot to learn still
> 
> Hopefully they will improve a little but if not I'm fine with it


Good luck.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Discusdude7 said:


> Good luck.


Thanks I will keep the updates going


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## CheyLillymama22 (Jun 9, 2013)

I think your fish are really pretty.
I don't know much about discus, but I love their colors


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

CheyLillymama22 said:


> I think your fish are really pretty.
> I don't know much about discus, but I love their colors


Thanks  

Hopefully I can get them to improve 

I would as an end goal breed them once I have got a good understanding of them


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Update.....

Was away all last week when I started the journal 

Back today and going to start the increased feeding and more water changes

Took the plants out of the pot and replanted 

Had to put in 12kg of sand to allow me to plant them properly 










Found a baby plant that fell out of the bunch from the pot (the big main plant) 












Hoping it grows 

Took some more of the fish so I can get a before and after and hopefully see some improvement in 4 weeks time 



















Really shows the fact the yellow one Is very stunted its a very different shape 










Not so keen on the peppering but have always been that way... Don't think it ever leaves 










Not so peppered this one 










The other blue turquoise was hiding which is a shame seeing as it's the better coloured one 

Took the 2 plecs to the lfs as I don't want to keep them with my discus 

Did some reworking got rid of the left side drift wood 

Took the PVC tubes out no longer needed 

Did a large water change 

Also got one of those seachem ammonia alerts into the tank but forgot to take a photo have to see how well it works 

Still waiting on the tubifex and then will order some blackworms too

Will be getting a feeding cone soon in an attempt to keep the worms in one place


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Forgot to add a video taken today after the rework 

http://youtu.be/wd0K-pUxMMY


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## steakman (Feb 3, 2012)

Dark substrate will cause more peppering.

Your discus might have been stunted before you got them, so very much not a whole lot you could do.

Watch out for overfeeding problem.

If a discus goes hiding, it's either:

- Being picked on by a dominant fish

- Being sick

Either way, you should pay a closer look.

Nice tank and set up.

SM


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

steakman said:


> Dark substrate will cause more peppering.
> 
> Your discus might have been stunted before you got them, so very much not a whole lot you could do.
> 
> ...


Thanks 

Yeah the dark substrate can't be changed and the background is dark and also part of the tank 

But I will have to live with the peppering 

Yeah I'm keeping an eye on it I think it's because it's the newest of the bunch all the others were bought at the same time apart from that one 

He comes out when I'm away from the tank but hides when I come near the eventually comes out again 

The others were like that when I first got them now they rush to the front when I come near


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## parrottbay (May 14, 2012)

Where did you get the splitter? I really like that idea! Could you PM me about it please!?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

parrottbay said:


> Where did you get the splitter? I really like that idea! Could you PM me about it please!?


eBay I will see if I can find you the link and will pm you


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

jameshill247 said:


> eBay I will see if I can find you the link and will pm you


Can u send me that link also? Thanks

samsung galaxy s3


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

du3ce said:


> Can u send me that link also? Thanks
> 
> samsung galaxy s3


Would posting it on the journal be allowed?

I will pm you also

Depends on the size of your tube but I just searched eBay for 3 way flow valve


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

Ebay or craigslist isnt allowed but ill search for it thanks

samsung galaxy s3


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

du3ce said:


> Ebay or craigslist isnt allowed but ill search for it thanks
> 
> samsung galaxy s3


Sent you the link if you look for something like that for your pipe size cos I just picked the first one that looked similar as I can't remember my size and I guess your size may differ


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks I have the same canister filter as you

samsung galaxy s3


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

du3ce said:


> Thanks I have the same canister filter as you
> 
> samsung galaxy s3


I can try and find the item I bought on my purchases if you need the tube size but I believe it's listed on the filter spec


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Here's the seachem ammonia alert

Good for one year 

And easy to read 










And a new video of them feeding

The newest discus ( 3/4 weeks since adding) still doesn't come out much.. Do you think having 5 discus is the reason and maybe I should go to 6 and get rid of some of the tetras as they can spook discus?

All the others aren't bothered by the faster fish

I haven't really seen any aggressiveness towards it from the other discus but it seems scared when I come near the tank


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Once again forgot to post the link for the video

http://youtu.be/c1QSyUwn8GU

Looks like a film on top of the water? Could be the light though..


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Spent today trying to make a condensation lid!

Got some polycarbonate twin wall and cut it down to size.... Easier said then done with a now front 










Cut a piece I can slide across the feeding holes 










Superglued a couple of pieces together to make a block then glued the block in place to hold the lid in the tank and it all fits 

It does annoy me already that I have to take it out to access the tank and also I can't have the water level as high as I wanted which means I can see a crack of light in the corner which is bugging me... I can see me throwing this lid out already!

Also I have some algae issues... 










Any idea how I can get rid of this..


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## Warlock (Feb 28, 2012)

contact Simon discus.. uk discus.. 

http://www.aquarist-classifieds.co.uk/php/detail62_136616.php

https://www.facebook.com/groups/justdiscusukbred/

when you need better fish.. that yellow looks sick.. if you see any of these fish foreheads start to look "THINNER".. or pinched.. they are sick.. so keep eye out on them.. mixing fish together with out qt can cause other problems.. but whats done is done.. 

just keep up with water changes daily.. to give change to recover from previous care.. super clean water does amazing things to ill discus.. 

good luck


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Warlock said:


> contact Simon discus.. uk discus..
> 
> http://www.aquarist-classifieds.co.uk/php/detail62_136616.php
> 
> ...


Thanks I will take a look at the links 

Oh really they yellow one eats the same as usual and has always looked the same

Could it be the stunting that's made it look that way 

QT would be ideal but I don't have the space to set up any other tanks at the moment


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## gt turbo (Sep 13, 2012)

Look on here for a user by the name of DiscusPaul. He has a great write up on the care of discus, which I believe has been stickied in the Fish section here on TPT. PM him for some great advice on your tank and fish.

Btw, you have a fantastic tank, I believe your discus were stunted before you bought them. Kuddos to you for giving them a good home and doing your best to make and keep them healthy.

Good luck with your tank.


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

jameshill247 said:


> Spent today trying to make a condensation lid!
> 
> Got some polycarbonate twin wall and cut it down to size.... Easier said then done with a now front
> 
> ...


Looks like bba, don't let it get a hold! You can spot treat it with excel and or H2o2.
Lower your lighting period could help, what's it at now?


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## discuspaul (Jul 27, 2010)

gt turbo said:


> Look on here for a user by the name of DiscusPaul. He has a great write up on the care of discus, which I believe has been stickied in the Fish section here on TPT. PM him for some great advice on your tank and fish.
> 
> Btw, you have a fantastic tank, I believe your discus were stunted before you bought them. Kuddos to you for giving them a good home and doing your best to make and keep them healthy.
> 
> Good luck with your tank.


Many thanks for the plug, gt.

Yes, my guide is located inside the first & only sticky in the Fish section. click on that sticky for 3 articles & FAQ.

And to James Hill, yes, I would be very happy to answer any questions you may have on discus - don't hesitate to PM me if I can be of any help.

BTW, you can also view my guide on the BIDKA forum, (British & International Discus-Keepers Association) in their "Library" section.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

gt turbo said:


> Look on here for a user by the name of DiscusPaul. He has a great write up on the care of discus, which I believe has been stickied in the Fish section here on TPT. PM him for some great advice on your tank and fish.
> 
> Btw, you have a fantastic tank, I believe your discus were stunted before you bought them. Kuddos to you for giving them a good home and doing your best to make and keep them healthy.
> 
> Good luck with your tank.


Thank you is appreciate the point in the right direction 

Thanks they may well have been as they were a few months old already but at least I have learned for future care now 




mott said:


> Looks like bba, don't let it get a hold! You can spot treat it with excel and or H2o2.
> Lower your lighting period could help, what's it at now?


I have never been able to beat this... This is the first time I have really tried to keep the plants in check. Normally just throw out and replace when they get too bad! 

Actually tried to get plants that might survive better and they seem to be doing okay this time but the algae is always my problem

The lights are on from about 10:30 till 7:30 at night ( timer) if I turn the time it will make my feeding window even smaller which is already a problem due to work 

I have just started to use easy-life profito which is supposed to be an all round fert 15ml last Saturday after wc and will be using 15ml per week from now on.... Could it be the tank settling to that? 




discuspaul said:


> Many thanks for the plug, gt.
> 
> Yes, my guide is located inside the first & only sticky in the Fish section. click on that sticky for 3 articles & FAQ.
> 
> ...


Thanks I have looked through and found it very useful so far

Appreciated again thanks 

I have created an account on BIDKA but not yet had much of a look around so I will look into that too


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## jeepguy (Jul 24, 2013)

Beware, my ammonia alert sticker never worked for me from the get go and I lost a couple cardinals because of it. My fault for not testing to confirm it worked, but with expensive fish like that I wouldn't want to risk it.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jeepguy said:


> Beware, my ammonia alert sticker never worked for me from the get go and I lost a couple cardinals because of it. My fault for not testing to confirm it worked, but with expensive fish like that I wouldn't want to risk it.


Thanks for the heads up I will keep an eye on it and test with the kit as well for a while


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## gt turbo (Sep 13, 2012)

Hi James as it relates to your lighting period, it could be shortened during the day with the use of a "siesta" period. This is where you shut off the lights for a predetermined period of time, I personally use 2 hrs. The premise for this is that, during a normal day plants would be given chances to rest from photosynthesis due to cloud cover, shadows from foliage, etc., so by instituting this siesta period you give the plants a little rest period. It is also noted that during this time CO2 levels in the tank will rise, as it isn't being used and in fact may be added from the plants themselves, and when the lights are turned back on there will be an abundance of CO2 for the plants to use. I'm not sure how marginal of an increase that is.

Now this method takes care of your feeding dilemma as the siesta can be instituted while you aren't at home.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

gt turbo said:


> Hi James as it relates to your lighting period, it could be shortened during the day with the use of a "siesta" period. This is where you shut off the lights for a predetermined period of time, I personally use 2 hrs. The premise for this is that, during a normal day plants would be given chances to rest from photosynthesis due to cloud cover, shadows from foliage, etc., so by instituting this siesta period you give the plants a little rest period. It is also noted that during this time CO2 levels in the tank will rise, as it isn't being used and in fact may be added from the plants themselves, and when the lights are turned back on there will be an abundance of CO2 for the plants to use. I'm not sure how marginal of an increase that is.
> 
> Now this method takes care of your feeding dilemma as the siesta can be instituted while you aren't at home.


That's a good idea actually I think I will take a couple of hours off during the day and see if that helps 

I don't think the led strip I use would cause any issues with algae right? It's a colour changing one? 

I could put the tank on at 7 then so I can feed early before work then turn lights off at like 12 but leave LEDs on? Then back on at 2 again then I could possibly look at time off in the evening so I can feed later when I'm back and the lights wouldn't have been on the whole time?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!*

And on the subject of the plants...

Just got home and have seen some new growth on the plant (ID anyone I think it's a sword) but it's a funny colour 










I have been cutting those off when the shoot this colour... Will they change into green? Or do I need some root tabs?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Did the water change yesterday 

Got some API root tabs and put 3 in my tank one under each go the large plants 

Made a massive error! Forgot to turn the Heater back on!! 

Got home today and water was 21!! Normally 28/29 

Turned it back on now and my water change is being heated by a heater now to bring it up to a little higher so hopefully will be okay...


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

your plant looks like an ozelot sword to me. I have three, they are beautiful, and grow really bushy as opposed to tall under high lighting in my experiences. They are heavy root feeders, be prepared with some root tabs. O+ preferably. Don't cut them, that is how they are supposed to be.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> your plant looks like an ozelot sword to me. I have three, they are beautiful, and grow really bushy as opposed to tall under high lighting in my experiences. They are heavy root feeders, be prepared with some root tabs. O+ preferably. Don't cut them, that is how they are supposed to be.


Ah thanks 

Yeah I have been reading about that but isn't it something you get from garden centres it's not aquatic specific is it?

I have noticed growth in one day since the API tabs 

Oh really will the colour change as they get bigger?


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

ozelot sword plant is a true aquatic plant. google them, they are beautiful. they get bigger and the leaves will all be the speckled look to them.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> ozelot sword plant is a true aquatic plant. google them, they are beautiful. they get bigger and the leaves will all be the speckled look to them.


Ohh no i meant the fertilizer osmote + or what ever it is lol? Oscmote? Is that what you meant by O+ 

Yeah I like the speckled leaves on the plant the big ones are plain green though? Is it because it's now established that they are becoming speckled on the new leaves i thought they were dying or something


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

im not sure why the bigger ones aren't speckled. it might be that your plant was grown under a different lighting than you have them now and so the speckled part is only coming out now. About the osmocote + tabs, you will have to find someone on here with them for sell because they don't sell them anymore at lowes or wherever, what you will get is the pelletized fertilizer put into little individual pill packs. they are wayyy better than the api root tabs. but honesltly I have a sword plant that is like 10 years old that has gotten nothing but api root tabs its whole life and is probably the biggest oldest sword plant I have.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> im not sure why the bigger ones aren't speckled. it might be that your plant was grown under a different lighting than you have them now and so the speckled part is only coming out now. About the osmocote + tabs, you will have to find someone on here with them for sell because they don't sell them anymore at lowes or wherever, what you will get is the pelletized fertilizer put into little individual pill packs. they are wayyy better than the api root tabs. but honesltly I have a sword plant that is like 10 years old that has gotten nothing but api root tabs its whole life and is probably the biggest oldest sword plant I have.


Ah right so may be tricky to find someone in the uk that can ship 

In a 50gal do you think 3 tabs would be enough and do I add 3 more in 4 weeks? 

I am dosing liquid fertiliser too but then with the water changes... Doesn't that just take them back out? 

Here's the adult leaves 










REALLY bad algae not sure how I'm gonna get rid of that

And the new growth 










Definitely grown a fair amount in the last day or so 

So the rest periods are now set throughout the day... Got some tabs... 15ml easylife pro fito per week 

What next


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

A couple of weeks on and some improvements 


And more algae! 

So I have upped the feeding to 4 feeds a day 

1 frozen beef heart 9am 

1 frozen brine shrimp 12 

1 frozen beefheart 3pm

1 frozen bloodworm or brine shrimp or beefheart 5pm 

They also get a small FD tubifex if they are pestering between feeds 

Do you think that's enough? Was thinking of doing 2 cubes at 5? 

Here's some photos I think they have got a lot broader and the colours are looking better on them especially the fuller red one 



















Yellow is thicker but no growth I think it may be too stunted but it doesn't look as skinny and sick now 























































Lots of algae!! So picked up some easycarbo and started to spot treat 4ml per day 

Had a disaster forgot to turn the heater back on after water change and came home to 22 degree tank! 

Also found this 100wAtt heater isn't enough to heat to 30 when it's colder in the home so picked up a 300watt and the water is more stable temp now 

Here's a video of the tank after 2 weeks

The smaller shoot I planted is doing well not sure if I need to pop a tab under it as there's not one that close to it

http://youtu.be/GPttjc-jh-g


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

Your discus are looking better, I watched the youtube it does them better justice. The yellow one still has a ways to go, and to be honest it may never look healthy and full but it does look better, everyone seems to have better and brighter coloring and eyes. About your algae on the swords...you might be leaving the lights on too long, also are you dosing with any co2, dosing with API co2 or seachem's excel will help with algae. Or adding an ottocinclus/a nerite snail/ some amano shrimp could help also. Usually has something to do with lighting though


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> Your discus are looking better, I watched the youtube it does them better justice. The yellow one still has a ways to go, and to be honest it may never look healthy and full but it does look better, everyone seems to have better and brighter coloring and eyes. About your algae on the swords...you might be leaving the lights on too long, also are you dosing with any co2, dosing with API co2 or seachem's excel will help with algae. Or adding an ottocinclus/a nerite snail/ some amano shrimp could help also. Usually has something to do with lighting though


Thanks, I think there's an improvement 

As with the algae easylife easycarbo is pretty similar to excel its liquid carbon in fact it's more concentrated then excel 

Only had 1 dose so far so hoping with spot treatment to see an improvement soon

There are a few nerites and ramshorns in there so they should be doing their job but it's not really working


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

After about 4 or 5 days of treating 4ml per day

It's working! 

But it Looks like the leaves are burning? 

Started a new thread in the fertilisers section but here's some photos 



















This one shows how well it's working if it wasn't for the burns the leave looks a lot cleaner especially the one on the left










One long line of burn! Makes me think it is the easycarbo actually burning it 










Not yet spot treated 

I am thinking if taking them out and putting 5ml into a atomiser like the perfume sprayers you can get samples of (empty plastic ones on eBay for about £1) 

Then spraying the lot leaving 30 mins then replant? 

5ml will give me approx 60sprays so should have a good chance of getting a good covering 

Any thoughts?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Also can anyone ID the algae? 

Can't decide if it's bba or thread

I have read that just OD'ing with easycarbo will help does that mean like double the dose each day?


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

jameshill247 said:


> Also can anyone ID the algae?
> 
> Can't decide if it's bba or thread
> 
> I have read that just OD'ing with easycarbo will help does that mean like double the dose each day?


Looks like bba to me...


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

mott said:


> Looks like bba to me...


Just went back through my thread and saw you had said that before lol 

Have you seen damage like that on leaves before? 

If this was your plants would you pull them out and spray/paint them? 

And I have now noticed some patches of green slime on the 3d background! Can't win with algae at the moment! 

I really want to add some more plants but there's no point till I can actually maintain what I have


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Just found this in my tank!!

Thought it was a bit of silicone from the hood 

Looks like a leech or something?


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## kwheeler91 (May 26, 2009)

Loks like a Leech... not all leeches are parasites though. Some eat detritus. Its kind of hard to tell but yours doesn't seem to have teeth and one that size would have to be feeding so if there isn't any blood in it when you cut it open its probably the latter.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

kwheeler91 said:


> Loks like a Leech... not all leeches are parasites though. Some eat detritus. Its kind of hard to tell but yours doesn't seem to have teeth and one that size would have to be feeding so if there isn't any blood in it when you cut it open its probably the latter.


Didn't really get a chance to cut it open cos I threw it out 

But I did look after and the tissue it's on was brown/orange so.... Could be blood might not have been 

Haven't found any more at the moment though 

Really hoping there aren't loads in there

Guess I will soon find out when I find one stuck to my arm after a water change


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

jameshill247 said:


> Just went back through my thread and saw you had said that before lol
> 
> Have you seen damage like that on leaves before?
> 
> ...


Bba is a tough Algea to fight once it sets in. I would try lowering your lighting period and spot treating as much as possible.
H202, excel etc...

Be careful with your discus, you don't want to od on excel and kill them.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

mott said:


> Bba is a tough Algea to fight once it sets in. I would try lowering your lighting period and spot treating as much as possible.
> H202, excel etc...
> 
> Be careful with your discus, you don't want to od on excel and kill them.


Yeah it's hard to get rid of

Spot treating with easycarbo which is similar to excel seems to be working 

Had to cut off the leaves that had burned a hole in from spot treating... Which was quite a few

The plants have lots of patches of clear leaf now though and seems to be just the tips and edges with algae which also seems to be going 

Popped some more root tabs in yesterday and my easylife profita and have been sticking to 4ml easy carbo per day and looks like I'm winning


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Decided to make my own discus food today 

Got the beef heart from the butchers only cost £4 and was huge! 










Had to trim all the fat off and figure out what parts were good and not good 










Quite a lot of meat after 

Ingredients

950g beef heart after trimming (blitzed in blender 

360g cooked fresh prawns (blitzed to a pulp in the blender) 


112g spinach after steaming and squeezing (would have liked more but that was a whole bag)

140g carrot cooked then grated

4 cloves of garlic.... A little too much I think... Stinks! 

5 gelatine sheets in 250ml of water only used about 200ml in the end

1 capful from the shaker of paprika 

A handful of tetra prima 

Larger handful or 2 of JBL Flake 

Few shakes of NT labs tropical granules

Small handful of hikari discus bio gold 





























All blended in the blended then added gelatine 










Placed into freezer trays and into the fridge to set before freezing 

After a few hours I tried a chunk and it was too loose so decided to go straight to freezing 










Then cut one of the ice cube trays up into feeding size chunks and into a takeaway tub to prevent freezer burn 

I will do the rest when the rest are frozen tomorrow 

Looks like I have about 6 containers worth and only cost £10 soo much cheaper and took about an hour and a half most of which was the the trimming of the heart 

Also got some new plants and moved the tank about but this post is long enough as it is!

Will post update on the tomorrow 

Here's a video of my fish feeding

Seems to break up well... A little too messy for my liking tbh but the tetras and Corydoras mop up well 


http://youtu.be/XCYMIF7NEdo


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

No more leaches found since the first one so maybe I got lucky! 

Got some new plants yesterday 

Not sure what they are though I think they are ludwigia of some sort 

I used to just plant the bunch they come in but this time I separated the stems and planted them properly.. Looks better I think 










Discus wouldn't get out the way! 

Also picked up some anubias of some sort as well put one on a rock and the other one that a shoot fell off of on the driftwood 

Trimmed the driftwood yesterday to a smaller but to make room for more plants.. It see getting in the way 



















Another bunch of ludwigia 

And the discus seem to be really getting thicker now 










The red one looks a lot thicker 










And a lot redder! 










This was the shy one that now is the first one to food and pushed everyone out the way 










Looking pretty fat 










The tank looks a little bare as all the plants are low at the moment

Trimmed off the leaves I burned from the big centre sword and the new leaves don't appear to have algae or not like the other leaves anyway 

Hopefully with the ferts going in and the root tabs being used it will fill out quickly


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Big update! The discus have laid eggs!

So I have a pair in the tank after all 








[/URL]

Got a poor video taken with the phone held the wrong way

http://youtu.be/U8GmGGfMoss

The eggs were eaten as they are in the community tank the but both parents stayed in the corner guarding them. I think it might have been them that are them 

I would have like to set a breeding tank up for them as I have a couple of tanks spare sat around that used to be a shrimp tank and an hex tall too the 2ft bow front shrimp tank would be better suited though 

Unfortunately I don't have anywhere to set them up at the moment but at least I have a pair for when I can 

Still battling the algae and I have green slime algae too now  

Bought some more plants today to try and up the amount of plants to help and when they are all in I will put some more photos up 

http://youtu.be/DTrIPaPkrJs 

Side view


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

So still battling with the algae had to throw out a couple of the amazon swords they looked Ropey and had been cut back so much they just weren't really growing... Are the slow growers? 

Picked up some new plants today to try and combat the algae they are supposed to grow fast in warmer water so should do well 

I have had them before I always known them as pond weed but don't know the name? 










Covered the egg area with plants for next time they lay them might give more chance of not getting eaten 










Turns out this one is a female










Colours looking better now 










Full tank shot needs to grow out now


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

I am so proud of you! your fish (other than the yellow) look so much better and fatter, they look healthy now. Congrats on figuring out how to make your own food, that is awesome! Your tank is really coming a long.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> I am so proud of you! your fish (other than the yellow) look so much better and fatter, they look healthy now. Congrats on figuring out how to make your own food, that is awesome! Your tank is really coming a long.


Thank you very much! 

The yellow one just won't grow it does tend to get left out but I make sure it always feeds 

Lots of reading up on here and this thread has helped me lots especially all the advice


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Discus laid eggs again today in the same spot 

As I can't have a breeding tank of their own due to no space to put one... Even though I have 2 spare tanks  

I have divided the tank 

It looks terrible but I might try and come up with a better way 

So I picked up an undergravel filter plate really cheap as the tubes were missing 

Cut it to size



Cable tidied to make the correct size for the tank 

Put some holes in for flow with a corn on the cob holder 

Had to put more in after with a bigger needle and in the end I just cut slits with scissors 



It wedges in and doesn't need suckers or weighing down 






Flow is okay but a little slow 



The new eggs 

Also got some floating plants 

Had to get them ID'd at the plants section cos the lfs didn't know 

Seems to be frogbit?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs!*

Just after writing this....

More eggs have been laid in the same spot! 

Hoping it's just a top up and not two females...


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

GOOD JOB!! Dividing the tank is a good idea, now have you really thought about whether you want baby discus or not. good lord you have no idea how much work is involved with bringing up a batch of discus. you are going to go ahead and get your spare tanks ready if you have babies. maybe think of joining SimplyDiscus.com forum if you haven't already and read up. 

also the floating water plant is DWL (dwarf water lettuce) it is good for soaking up nitrates, but will shade out everything if left to overtake tank as it will since it is a very fast growing plant. Keep Up the good work!!


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs!*



jmf3460 said:


> GOOD JOB!! Dividing the tank is a good idea, now have you really thought about whether you want baby discus or not. good lord you have no idea how much work is involved with bringing up a batch of discus. you are going to go ahead and get your spare tanks ready if you have babies. maybe think of joining SimplyDiscus.com forum if you haven't already and read up.
> 
> 
> 
> also the floating water plant is DWL (dwarf water lettuce) it is good for soaking up nitrates, but will shade out everything if left to overtake tank as it will since it is a very fast growing plant. Keep Up the good work!!



Thanks, yeah ideally I would have both my spare tanks running but don't have anywhere to set them Up at the moment 

When it gets warmer I could maybe set them up in the garage but It was tricky enough getting the go ahead switching from the shrimp tank to this tank I have set up lol especially seeing as this tank is upstairs in my room... 

I think I'm gonna make a better divider using mesh of sorts I don't think the flow is really good enough now

And I'm a member at simply discus they are very knowledgable and have learned a lot but I tend to use the forum a lot more


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

so you are planning on them hatching and staying on that side of the divider until spring/summer??


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> so you are planning on them hatching and staying on that side of the divider until spring/summer??



Well... Not sure what's going to happen yet 1 of 2 things 

1 hatch them and try to get them to a size that's big enough to release the divider and then I guess only the strongest ones would make it to a larger size again without getting eaten 

Or I can see if I get any wrigglers then beg for a place to set my other tanks up! And if not then at least I know I have a pair and in spring I can work on having them in their very own breeding tank 

At the moment just really testing things and seeing if they are capable of breeding


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## j03yYunG (Mar 26, 2013)

congrats on the eggs. I'm still waiting for mines to pair off. :/


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

j03yYunG said:


> congrats on the eggs. I'm still waiting for mines to pair off. :/



Thanks! 

It will happen soon enough I didn't expect it to happen at all 

I was focusing on getting them to a good size and giving them good food and it just happened


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs!*

Day 2/3 of the eggs! 

2 for the new set laid yesterday 

3 for the set the day before 

The new eggs seem to be going dark now but the first set seem to be staying lighter if not white



 

White eggs aren't fertilized from I understand but the dark are so hopefully it is a pair in the tank

The divider has to go it's not letting enough flow through the right side has dropped half a degree and there isn't much movement 

I will be ordering some fly screen today hoping that will workl


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

You know how your yellow guy looks? I would suspect that if you try and grow any survivors out on the tiny side of the divider then release them into the whole tank once they get an inch or two, that this is what your offspring will turn out looking like, severely stunted and malnourished/unhealthy looking. Not to be the bearer of bad news, but sometimes it is better for the eggs to be removed to avoid extreme disfiguration due to inadequate grow out conditions.


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## Mark Allred (May 3, 2013)

James,
I applaud you! I did what you are doing,14 or so years ago! I bought a dozen baby Discus from Samson Chung, a renowned breeder from SF, Cal., and set up a 130 gallon planted CO2 injected, aquarium. I grew these fish out with my own frozen beefheart recipe. Three years? I won awards ( and prizes) in international photo contests. I won six Bing Seto Cobalt Red Discus with my Beefheart recipe, and pics of my big, fat Discus! 







[/URL][/IMG]

Sounds great, huh? However, I was doing 50% water changes every 2 or 3 days, and gravel vacuuming, glass cleaning, due to the fouling from the beefheart. About 90 minutes labor. I ended up with 3 large tanks of Discus! After about 4 or 5 years, I BURNT OUT! Backed off on the WCs, and maintenance, tried feeding the Discus flake food. (I had won a 6 gallon bucket of the stuff in one of the photo contests).  Flake food diet will end up giving them Hole in the Head Disease. If frequent water changes are not kept up, their health will go south pretty quickly. Sold or gave away all of my aquariums, and fish. I had been keeping fish since 1969! Two years ago, my son asked me if I would like my 65 High back... now I am back in Cichlid/Planted tank Hell! Now I am doing Angelfish, Apistos, Rams, etc (3 tanks). I am doing CO2 again, wet/dry sump filtration. In a year I have NEVER vacuumed gravel, I set the tanks up for continuous water changes. I have NO algae, wipe the glass down once a week or so, swap out a filter pad about every 10 days. Very little maintenance! My 125 now...







[/URL][/IMG] Maybe Discus would be easier would be easier in heavily planted tanks like I am doing now? I don't know. Sorry for the rambling... it just sounds like you are working your butt off on this. Don't get discouraged! You are getting some great advice from forum members. Try to keep the fun in it, trt to keep it simple, and don't do what I did.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> You know how your yellow guy looks? I would suspect that if you try and grow any survivors out on the tiny side of the divider then release them into the whole tank once they get an inch or two, that this is what your offspring will turn out looking like, severely stunted and malnourished/unhealthy looking. Not to be the bearer of bad news, but sometimes it is better for the eggs to be removed to avoid extreme disfiguration due to inadequate grow out conditions.



Took your advice and removed the divider  

The eggs went fuzzy anyway so I'm just gonna focus on what I have now for the moment and when I have the facility to set the breeders up again I will do  

I'm happy enough that they have grown so much from when they were stunted and are able to breed 

It's a real shame that the yellow one won't grow anymore I don't want to get rid of it though 

Every now and then I think about getting rid of the tetras in there and just keeping the corrys and discus 

I would like to replace all the tetras with some neons but then I think I would get bored of it 

I would like to add another discus cos I have 5 and would like 6 maybe a yellow one so I have a pair of each but with the tetras the tanks probably at its limit if not already over stocked


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Mark Allred said:


> James,
> 
> I applaud you! I did what you are doing,14 or so years ago! I bought a dozen baby Discus from Samson Chung, a renowned breeder from SF, Cal., and set up a 130 gallon planted CO2 injected, aquarium. I grew these fish out with my own frozen beefheart recipe. Three years? I won awards ( and prizes) in international photo contests. I won six Bing Seto Cobalt Red Discus with my Beefheart recipe, and pics of my big, fat Discus!
> 
> ...



Wow! That's a tank! 

Those discus look very nice it's no surprise you won awards!

I'm trying to enjoy it as much as possible and I'm pleased with the results that feeding my home made beefheart has brought 

Give discus a go again! 

I'm really struggling with alage at the moment and it's off putting that each day it seems to get worse! 

The one that's bad at the moment is the green slime algae... I don't like using chemicals to get rid of but I think I might have to get some of the stuff to get rid of green slime algae 

I think I would like to set up a breeding tank in the future and Maybe just have 1 batch at a time 

Not really interested in making profit as that's not possible on a small scale but more so about raising a batch and having none stunted this time  

I know what your saying about the labour it's tricky to find time to do enough as it is 

I like the sound of the constant W/C I would like to do something in the future but at the moment it's not possible with it being in my room as I can't do any of the plumbing 

Thanks for the advice 

Is there a journal for your tank?


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## Mark Allred (May 3, 2013)

Thanks!
Your beefheart recipe looks similar to my old recipe (mine actually had a little Hershey's Cocoa added :smile: ).
Beefheart is a lot of work to clean/prep! No room for Discus, I currently am focused on Angelfish, great personalities. 
Good luck on the algae, haven't dealt with Cyanobacteria in years. A good cleaning, or cleanings is how I got rid of it. 
I had a bunch of Black Brush Algae on some Myriophyllum in the 125 a while back, 
I pulled the plant out of the tank, and misted it with Glutaraldehyde. After about 2 minutes I put it back in. 
The next day the algae had turned red, the day after that it had totally disappeared! It never came back. 
I haven't done any journals yet, I would like to!


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs!*



Mark Allred said:


> Thanks!
> Your beefheart recipe looks similar to my old recipe (mine actually had a little Hershey's Cocoa added :smile: ).
> Beefheart is a lot of work to clean/prep! No room for Discus, I currently am focused on Angelfish, great personalities.
> Good luck on the algae, haven't dealt with Cyanobacteria in years. A good cleaning, or cleanings is how I got rid of it.
> ...



Yeah it was definitely the cleaning and cutting of the beefheart that took the time... Gets tedious very fast!

The Green slime has really taken hold now... I thought it was bits of spinach on the bottom at first but it's not  

To top it off the newer plants I have (pond weed looking one) doesn't seem to be doing well... It's meant to be an easy plant! The only plant that's doing well at all is my anubias 
The new plants seem to be shedding the fine leaves and they are making a real mess! I'm hoping it's just establishing...

Not sure why the plants are doing so bad.. In my old shrimp tank the plants did sooo much better and I didn't even fert at all.. And no algae at all 



When it was a shrimp tank 



Then it became a Kribensis tank..


This tank was so simple to maintain... And always looked spotless

But then.... It was like 4 times smaller and full of shrimp... And i didn't get to keep discus in it 

Angel fish are good and can be a good challenge to breed also 

You should start a journal it's good to be able to look back at changes and problems compared to now


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs!*

Big clean up today! 

Filter sponges cleaned filter and all the mess poured out and refilled with some 'clean' tank water 

50% water change and while the water was low brushed some easycarbo on the the 3D background 

Scraped away as much green slime as possible and vacuumed up all the teeny tiny leaves that the plants so nicely spread round my tank.... :|



Before full tank 



See that plants just don't seem to be growing!!

[/URL

Green everywhere!!

[URL=http://s226.photobucket.com/user/jameshill_247/media/Discus%20Tank/E8D6F808-83D3-4FBC-866F-0C7D3A880DC5.jpg.html]




The picture of pure evil! 



And after a lot of cleaning and scrubbing and pulling out plants that are doing bad 



The floaters are doing well... At least that's one thing! 

I think I'm gonna have to get a group of ottos and a Siamese fighter very soon!


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## Mark Allred (May 3, 2013)

Hi James,
Is that BBA on your background? Nasty!
The BGA sucks too.
My experience with planted aquariums, is plant heavy or go home.
This was my 65 about 20 months ago. Lots of algae problems, BBA, GSA, and Brown algae (diatoms), and the plants didn't do well either. The substrate probably didn't help much also.







[/URL][/IMG]

The same tank as we speak... Everything is thriving.







[/URL][/IMG]

The 125 just now, sorry for the crappy pics, and lights are in "sunset mode".








[/URL][/IMG]

The 29 gallon just now, no CO2. Growing Glosso pretty well!







[/URL][/IMG]

Using Eco Complete substrate in all these tanks,
LED lighting in all these tanks,
Doing PPS dry ferts in all tanks, dosing twice a week.
Pressurized CO2 in the 125 and 65, Gluteraldehyde in the 29.
Basically NO algae in the 125 and 29. Wipe the glass every week or two.
Green spot algae on the glass in the 65, not bad, I scrape the glass every two weeks or so. My lighting is most likely the problem here, 6 15 watt LEDs on 12 hours daily ( This tank is bright!)


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Mark Allred said:


> Hi James,
> 
> Is that BBA on your background? Nasty!
> 
> ...



Somehow I missed this post! Stupid phone not giving me notifications! 

Wow what a transformation...

Looks amazing  

It's good to see a tank looking so nice without co2 

I was just looking at my tank and how bad the plants are doing...








I was considering getting one of those packs on flebay you know the 100 discus plants or 50 or how ever many you need with 1 stem being a plant 

I have bought these before just not the discus ones and usually get a nice mix but as per usual I can't ever get plants to grow! 

I'm thinking to just pack the tank with as many plants as I can!

But I don't see how they will do any better...

I can't see what I'm doing wrong... I'm now dosing ferts and liquid carbon and root tabs (not for a while with the tabs tbh) but still nothing is doing well... Even plants that I'm told are easy to grow 

So you use Eco complete? I think If I was to redo I would think into the substrate more cos I just have sand....


I know it's very hard to diagnose but looking at my journal.... What am I missing lol why won't my plants grow!?! 

The dry ferts you do... I have seen some starter kits for dry ferts (think there was a thread recently) but my lfs said for my tank and without co2 I wouldn't necessarily benefit anymore then I do from the ferts I'm already using... How do you find using them
On your non co2 tank


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## Mark Allred (May 3, 2013)

Hi James,

I have read your whole journal but my memory is not that great, so excuse the questions I ask. :icon_wink 
What is the liquid carbon you are using?
Some of your simpler plants i.e. Anacharis/Elodea HATE Gluteraldehyde/Excel/Liquid Carbon and will die.
What is the plant in your third picture?
IMO sand is a horrible substrate for plants, most have no nutrients, and it is hard to keep the plants rooted.
Eco Complete, is I believe, volcanic rock, and is loaded with minerals.
Plants stay rooted pretty well, due to the jagged edges, and varying sizes of the substrate.
What are you using for lighting?
As for ferts, a lot of people at your local LFS, have no idea what they are talking about! 
They hear something, and like a parrot.... 
This is the fert package I am using: http://greenleafaquariums.com/aquarium-fertilizers-supplements/pps-pro-fertilizer-package.html
Will probably last me a few years, and comes with a couple of handy dosing bottles!
Picked up an electronic gram scale from Sears online for $8.00 US, free shipping! and I was in there!
My dry ferts are working great on my non CO2 29 gallon tank, but I also dose gluteraldehyde daily!
Definitely, IMO, you need a decent substrate.
And yeah, you need to plant heavier.


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## chrispowell (Jan 23, 2013)

Dont want to spoil your party but I think you have two females there. Often If discus lay eggs on the glass more then once there is a good chance they are both female..

You also said you had two batches in the same night? I think they are both female.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Mark Allred said:


> Hi James,
> 
> I have read your whole journal but my memory is not that great, so excuse the questions I ask. :icon_wink
> What is the liquid carbon you are using?
> ...


im using EASYCARBO liquid carbon

profita fert both made by easylife

ummm the third plant... no idea lol im not great at remembering... i know it sends roots down and it was red at the tops... before i got hold of it!

ah... so that explains why they are falling apart... 

lighting... this is where i lack the knowledge lol... i know that its 2x T5 bulbs one is slightly longer than the other... the second bulb i got i did actually research before buying and the wattage is adequate but i dont know if its too much.. i cant turn one off though as its just the single switch... i really do need to do some more research into this though..

my current schedule is... lights on for 30 mins (timer) at 7:15-7:45 so i can check the tank before work and dose my easycarbo then lights go off till 1 then they are back on till 7:30 then off and my night lights come on..(they are a small led strip on all day so the fish arent in complete darkness during the break.

the pack i saw... i cant remember who it was from but they are uk based i think... comes in packs with a measuring spoon and you just follow the directions give it a shake up in the bottle and sorte... micros macros and trace??? i have no idea what im on about really....

i would like to have a substrate that helps with plants but i dont really want to start it all again... plus would i need to let it cycle? does eco-complete leach ammonia?

would placing some crushed lava rock in my substrate help? would it absorb nutrients and help keep them in the sand? 

so... next steps then.... rip out my plants... get some decent root tabs and actually put enough in...

purchase the 100 discus plants (about £20... looks a good deal)

scrub the tank free of algae 

get the starter kit sorted for dry ferts....confused how this works with lots of water changes for a discus tank...

plant the tank right out...

own the best tank in the world :red_mouth:red_mouth:red_mouth





chrispowell said:


> Dont want to spoil your party but I think you have two females there. Often If discus lay eggs on the glass more then once there is a good chance they are both female..
> 
> You also said you had two batches in the same night? I think they are both female.


 
yeah... the thought had crossed my mind... it seems to be the same one that was laying but i dont think discus will lay multiple batches so that makes me think the same..

and the fact that the eggs got all fungsy... so not fertile also seems to point that way... 

can discus cross breed... blue turqs and melons for example?


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## chrispowell (Jan 23, 2013)

Yes their Strain wont make a difference


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

chrispowell said:


> Yes their Strain wont make a difference



Ah right... Hmm out of 5 I must have a male and a female... Unless im very unlucky


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

The discus have laid more eggs on the glass this time! But I'm not thinking anything of it until I can prove they are a pair and not two females... If it happens it happens

At the moment I would like the tank to be capable of growing plants! 

So with that in mind 

I asked about substrates at my lfs and they recommended stratum and their display tank is doing very well without co2 and actually no ferts 

But the cost will be quite high even with a good deal 

Akadama is very cheap here in the uk and was very popular which shrimpers but as a planted tank substrate how does it compare? 

Some reading up through previous threads a lot of people praise is ability to absorb but say it lacks the nutrients to begin with. 

I can't get red line but I found regular didn't break down too much in the year I had the shrimp tank running 

Has anyone used it and how did you find it?

I would need to be able to add it to the tank as is so would have to siphon out the sand and then drop in the substrate so it's important it won't leach 

I'm expecting a ph kh drop so would probably soak the Akadama in a bucket for a couple of weeks and do wc every couple of days


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

so akadama has been ordered and should be coming today

plans are now to actually take the fish out and plants

bin the plants that are fuzzy gonna keep the anubias though cos thats the only thing doing well....

scrub the 3d background drift wood 

gonna get the sand out and make sure the tank is as clean as i can get it without taking it outside and spraying it

anyone put anything under the akadama? i read about peat moss but then i also read it doesnt do very much? others have said squeeze out the filter onto the akadama then put another layer on top?

my plan really was just to lay the akadama out then put the root tabs in 

now this is where i need some opinions...

knowing how bad the algae is at the moment should i 

A) empty clean akadama fill fish in lights off 4 days turn lights on and plant 

or 

B) empty clean akadama fill plants in fish in lights on


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

So the plants....

From plants alive 

They sell discus collections based on a size that I'm assuming is the tank but working on one plant is one stem i think these sort of sizes but tell me what you think 

A) 48" discus collection Includes:

5 x Aponogetum Crispus,
10 x Echinodorus Tennellusor 
10 x Sagittaria Pusilus
5 x Cabomba Furcata,
5 x Vallinseria Spirallis,
5 x Vallisneria Torta,
5 x Hygrophilia Polysperma,
5 x Cryptocoryne Wendtii,
5 x Rotalla Macrandra,
5 x Sagittaria Subulata,
5 x Ceratopteris Thalicroides, 
10 x Ludwigia Mullertii,
5 x Rotalla Rotundifolia,
5 x Myriophylum Procerpinoides,
2 x Nymphae Stellata,
5 x Microsorium Pteropos.

£21.95

B) 60" discus collection Includes: 

5 x Aponogetum Crispus,
10 x Echinodorus Tennellus or 10 x Sagittaria Pusilus
10 x Cabomba Furcata, 
10 x Vallinseria Spirallis, 
10 x Vallisneria Torta, 
10 x Hygrophilia Polysperma,
5 x Cryptocoryne Wendtii, 
10 x Rotalla Macrandra, 
10 x Sagittaria Subulata,
10 x Ceratopteris Thalicroides, 
10 x Ludwigia Mullertii, 
10 x Rotalla Rotundifolia, 
10 x Myriophylum Procerpinoides,
2 x Nymphae Stellata or 2 x Nymphea Maculata
5 x Microsorium Pteropos,
5 x Cryptocoryne Ciliata,
5 x Cryptocoryne Beckettii.

£27.95 

I don't want to over do it but I want it to look quite well planted 

I have no idea what the plants are but they are chosen to suite a discus tank

Anything there that screams out I'm wasting my money or is it a good pick for my tank


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## andyl9063 (Oct 22, 2010)

as a fellow discus guy. I don't think you should have raise your discus in that tank.
Should have done bare bottom, along with clear background and bottom. Your setup will affect their color and they might not reach their full potential. I raise my discus from quarter size to 5-6 inches before I put them in my display tank.

Of course, this is just my opinion and some of those look to be stunted because of big eyes already. You should get your planted tank stabilize and setup before introducing these guys to get the full potential.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

andyl9063 said:


> as a fellow discus guy. I don't think you should have raise your discus in that tank.
> Should have done bare bottom, along with clear background and bottom. Your setup will affect their color and they might not reach their full potential. I raise my discus from quarter size to 5-6 inches before I put them in my display tank.
> 
> Of course, this is just my opinion and some of those look to be stunted because of big eyes already. You should get your planted tank stabilize and setup before introducing these guys to get the full potential.



Thanks for the advice 

Ideally they would have been raised in a bare bottom tank but as I only have the space for the one tank at the moment and I like to look at my tank this was not possible 

They are definitely stunted you are right but they have came a long way from the skinny stunted sick looking fish that I started with 

In the future I would like to have some breeding tanks and the display tank for the adults but not possible right now 

I don't think they will grow anymore then they have but I know what I need to do in the future to get the best results 

Right now I'm looking for a balance of fish and plants


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## andyl9063 (Oct 22, 2010)

I think you can still achieve a great looking tank when the plants filled in.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Hopefully 

The fish have came a long way 

I'm gonna add some more ottos once the tanks all sorted and I have a voucher that I can use to get another discus but I would have to get rid of some of the tetras really to do so


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

*My First Discus Tank Lots of photos!... Now with eggs!*

***RESCAPE!!!***  

Ordered 28 litres of Akadama described as the hard variety and I can say it's tougher than the stuff I used in my shrimp tank

Spent a good hour trying to clean it... But gave up with that idea in the end 

Drained out most of the water into as many containers as I had including 2 insulated coolboxes to keep the fish in while I worked 

Caught all the fish and got the lid on them hoping to keep the heat in 

Scooped out as many snails as I could into a glass 

Scraped all the sand out and then got to cleaning!

Scrubbing the top half of the 3D background with neat easycarbo while the water was low a couple of weeks ago has pretty much got rid of it on the top half so took to the whole background with neat easycarbo and left it soaking while I cleaned all the glass

In went the Akadama... What a mess! 

Tried to make it a lot taller at the back in particular the right side and sloped forward not sure if it's too high...
Can it be too high? 

About 10-12cm I would have thought in the back corner... Actually I need to measure it 

Placed the anubias the only plants that I'm keeping from the old scape...
Apart from the floating

Filled it back up with some of the water I took out and about 50% fresh RO water 

Had to wait a little while to heat the tank... Fish back in....

And the results! 



I realise now that the slope is hard to see from this angle but if anything I think it's too sloped! But I guess with plants it will look like it should 



Ordered the 48" discus plant collection and should be here in a few days/ 1 week 

The bba is losing grip already after 24 hours and looks like it's going the way to top half did  

Light period for 1 week 3 hours a day to try and kill off any other algae... Have seen a spot of green slime that has appeared so tomorrow that will be picked off... Hoping the blackout will help with that 

And the new additions... 3 ottos... (All they had) buying another 5/6 when they get more in 

And one of my Xmas presents...






The tardis!!

Updates to follow when the plants come!


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Plants arrived today 

[/URL

Placed them out how I wanted them and labeled them from the print out that came with it.... had to use google images cos I had no idea!

[URL=http://s226.photobucket.com/user/jameshill_247/media/Discus%20Tank/B48F2787-5507-4825-AC93-B2E9C0808932.jpg.html]
I'm not good at placing plants I can never get it looking nice but it's growing on me as I get used to it 



Left side and the tardis aka Otto house 



Other side 




Full tank 





The discus today


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## Jack Gilvey (Jun 16, 2008)

Very nice, love the tardis! Showed my 7-year-old and she's insisting we get one.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Jack Gilvey said:


> Very nice, love the tardis! Showed my 7-year-old and she's insisting we get one.



Thanks very much

I was thinking of growing some moss around it to make it look abandoned but I don't think moss would cope well in high temp anyway 

You can get daleks as well but I think that would just make the tank look tacky 

On a side note.... Disaster! Left the heater off... Again! I need to set an alarm or something or get one of those thermometers with the alarm built in 

The plants.... Are not looking good but that's expected while they acclimatise....right?


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Update...

Plants are growing now and the lily bulbs that you can't see in the first photos.... Now are coming through!



Tiny bit of green slime algae again on the background but scrubbed it off 

Photoperiod has been increased to 6 hours a day

One of the plants at the back almost overnight shot a flower up to the surface and it's bloomed



Sticking to 4ml easycarbo a day 
And 4ml of profito a day Monday to Friday then a break on the weekends


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

The lily bulbs are really growing well now, I like them they look quite bushy which is good as I had a lot of space to fill at the front. 



They don't look like I thought they would 

Picked up a new discus today...
Pigeon blood blue turquoise



Was feeding well at the shop and isn't hiding away 

I think it looks a Lot more interesting than the others


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Plants are really starting to fill out now... A massive improvement from my other attempts! 

The new discus is doing well and no algae still... Not even on the glass! 





The lily bulbs have really done well and I think I like them best. They are a mixture of red and green

And I now have 5 or 6 Lily's at the surface 





The anubias is also doing well it did start to kinda look like It was drying up?? It obviously wasn't but it started getting yellow holes in it? But now looks better  



The plant at the back flowered like this in the end it burned on the light so I cut it back 



The new fish again 

I was looking at an EI starter kit online to replace the profito I have been using daily but I don't use co2 so don't know if I will benefit more from EI but with half a sake or stick to what I'm doing... 

At the moment though it's working so I should probably keep it as it is


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## jmf3460 (Aug 21, 2013)

I have been following you since starting this thread, I must say it has come a long way, tank looks good and clean and the discus look much healthier. little yellow guy even starting to look better. your new discus is beautiful!


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

jmf3460 said:


> I have been following you since starting this thread, I must say it has come a long way, tank looks good and clean and the discus look much healthier. little yellow guy even starting to look better. your new discus is beautiful!



Thanks! I think the yellow one looks better too 

Still don't think it's gonna grow much more but it's an improvement 

Thanks I really like the new one


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## Rbp917 (Dec 9, 2012)

The yellow one is most likely done growing, it will be fine, don't worry about it. You can tell how they were raised by the ratio of their eye size to their body size. They are very demanding while growing, plenty of small meals and constant water changes. This is why so many discus folks like bare bottoms and single species tanks. Trying to accommodate discus and plants is very challenging, but when it us done right it is amazing.

Sometimes I avoid the discus tanks at my LFS, they all look stunted and have a dark appearance with clamped fins. But they can be magnificent with the correct conditions.

I'm trying to decide if former discus keepers or former reef keepers take longer to recover?


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## The Trigger (May 9, 2012)

Wow beautiful discus! They look very healthy


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## ctaylor3737 (Nov 14, 2013)

What are you feedin them? I seen you try a few different things, I have 15 discus. So I am interested lol. Ill have to post some of my fish! I think I have a couple on my pages but not my recent ones. They look good, you stumbled upon discus like I did a few years ago. They will get very large just have to give them care when they are young. Then you breed them with good lines and sell them to people in your area. Stores that have Discus normally do not have an idea what to feed them. Not all are bad but a few are.


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## jameshill247 (Apr 2, 2012)

Rbp917 said:


> The yellow one is most likely done growing, it will be fine, don't worry about it. You can tell how they were raised by the ratio of their eye size to their body size. They are very demanding while growing, plenty of small meals and constant water changes. This is why so many discus folks like bare bottoms and single species tanks. Trying to accommodate discus and plants is very challenging, but when it us done right it is amazing.
> 
> Sometimes I avoid the discus tanks at my LFS, they all look stunted and have a dark appearance with clamped fins. But they can be magnificent with the correct conditions.
> 
> I'm trying to decide if former discus keepers or former reef keepers take longer to recover?



Yeah just trying to get a balance I'm happy with 

Reading up on here has helped though 



The Trigger said:


> Wow beautiful discus! They look very healthy



Thanks  they are getting there!



ctaylor3737 said:


> What are you feedin them? I seen you try a few different things, I have 15 discus. So I am interested lol. Ill have to post some of my fish! I think I have a couple on my pages but not my recent ones. They look good, you stumbled upon discus like I did a few years ago. They will get very large just have to give them care when they are young. Then you breed them with good lines and sell them to people in your area. Stores that have Discus normally do not have an idea what to feed them. Not all are bad but a few are.



Been feeding them the discus beefheart mix I made a few pages back and seems to be doing well.
Cheap too! 

Yeah pop a link on here and I will take a look 

I did see they were feeding the discus more than the other fish so I think they are getting a good feed at my lfs but they are quite specialist for most lfs


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