# potassium permanganate dips not working for me



## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

I decided to try a potassium potassium permanganate dip on some new plants I got. One batch had bladder snails, and another had (probably more than one type of) hair/filament algae.

I did quite a bit of research, and generally found that a 10-20 min dip was suggested. As for the solution strength, usually the suggestion was to make it a "dark pink" or 10ppm. Since "dark pink" is a bit vague to me, I went with 10ppm.

I made a solution of 2g/l concentrate, and add 5ml of that to each liter of water in the container used for the drip. This should result in a 10ppm solution. I've looked at some pictures of what a 10ppm solution should look like, including the following, and that seems close to what I have.

http://www.caruscorporation.com/resources/content/7/5/images/remediation6.png

First I tried this on a plant full of bladder snails. I removed all the visible snails first, inspected for egg sacks (saw none), dipped for 15 minutes, put it in quarantine for two weeks, dipped 15 min again, then added to my tank. 10 days later I see a small bladder snail cruising around. Suspecting that maybe he managed to avoid the dips (ie. was stuck to my hand or some other piece of equipment), I pulled him out and put him in another 15min dip. No affect. He's still doing great (which is bad). I haven't done further testing yet to see what it will take to kill him. I'll give him a few more days to regain strength first.

A few days before discovering the bladder snail in my tank, I acquired a different set of plants with the hair/filament algae. I also dipped them for 15min and put in a quarantine tank. After seeing the dip failed to kill the snail, I double checked the plants and they were still full of the algae. I had to get a magnifying glass to see most if it, but it was there. Looked very green and healthy under a microscope.

So, I consider a 15min dipped in 10ppm potassium permanganate to be next to useless for killing snails and algae. I'm looking for suggestions on how much I should up the concentration and/or the length of time to be certain all algae and snails are killed, and any risk to plants by doing this.

Also, please limit this discussion to potassium permanganate. I know there are other options (bleach, alum, just live with 'em, etc.). I just want a better understanding of how to use potassium permanganate and what it's risks and limits might be.

Thanks


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

I turn the water near black-dark purple with the PP for dips. I usually dip for algae and parasites, I don't mind the 'pest' snails like bladder, pond, and ramshorn. I keep them in all my planted tanks to clean diatoms (brown algae), uneaten fish food, and dead plant matter. They don't explode in pollution unless there is an over abundance of food for them. Many of my fish eat the snails so they turn into snacks.


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

AquaAurora said:


> I turn the water near black-dark purple with the PP for dips. I usually dip for algae and parasites, I don't mind the 'pest' snails like bladder, pond, and ramshorn. I keep them in all my planted tanks to clean diatoms (brown algae), uneaten fish food, and dead plant matter. They don't explode in pollution unless there is an over abundance of food for them. Many of my fish eat the snails so they turn into snacks.


How long can you dip for? Does it kill the snails?

BTW, I decided to do a 30 minute sterilization of the quarantine tank by using enough PP to make it dark purple. I had some nerites in there, so I pulled them first. I missed one. He seems to be doing fine. Makes me think PP isn't much good for killing snails, but then he does have a trap door he can pull shut. Most pest snails don't.


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## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

When you started with 10ppm, and left it for 30min, did it stay pink? Or did it turn murky or brown? 
If it turned brown, then there was a high content of organic matter, and some of the potency may have been used up in burning off the organic matter, not enough left to attack the algae for long enough. 
I would sure think that a rinse and re-dip should have resolved this, if it happened at all. 

Next test: can you make a stronger solution (purple) and trim just a stem with just a few leaves with algae to test? 
Hoping the algae will die, and the leaves be OK.


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## flight50 (Apr 17, 2012)

10-15 mins is what you want. Much longer and you risk losing the plant. The PM dip does not kill eggs. Its only for live organics. Dark purple is the solution you want. It can also be reused only if storeed in an air tight opaque container. I have keep mine for several months now and its still purple. I dipped from an online vendor but i still ended up with pond snail. Glad I actually got them though. Much more tolerable than rams horn imo as the do a managable job on maintenance.


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

Diana said:


> When you started with 10ppm, and left it for 30min, did it stay pink? Or did it turn murky or brown?
> If it turned brown, then there was a high content of organic matter, and some of the potency may have been used up in burning off the organic matter, not enough left to attack the algae for long enough.
> I would sure think that a rinse and re-dip should have resolved this, if it happened at all.
> 
> ...


It stayed pink. I pulled the plants clean of all the hair/filament algae after PP failed. I'll try a stronger solution on a bit of the algae I saved, but only after I get a chance to grow it out a bit. I'll also retest with the snail once I'm sure he has recovered.

Bump:


flight50 said:


> 10-15 mins is what you want. Much longer and you risk losing the plant. The PM dip does not kill eggs. Its only for live organics. Dark purple is the solution you want. It can also be reused only if storeed in an air tight opaque container. I have keep mine for several months now and its still purple. I dipped from an online vendor but i still ended up with pond snail. Glad I actually got them though. Much more tolerable than rams horn imo as the do a managable job on maintenance.


Yes, I figured it wasn't killing eggs, which is why I inspected for eggs, and also re-dipped after 2 weeks.

I think you are right about dark purple, and I'm guessing that's a lot more than 10ppm. Probably more like 40-50 ppm. BTW, when I gave my quarantine tank a bath in a very dark purple solution, I decided to toss the plants in too for about 15 minutes. I didn't want to take any chance with this algae, and if I lost the plants, oh well, I could live with that. A day later and they seem none the worse for it.


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## Tessa (Dec 8, 2015)

I did a bleach dip (1/20 solution) for two java ferns covered in hair algae. 1 minute dip, then 1 hour in a bucket of heavily Primed water. Killed all the algae and snails and so far it looks like the plants are fine. I would only use bleach on tougher plants though, like java ferns and anubias.


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

Tessa said:


> I did a bleach dip (1/20 solution) for two java ferns covered in hair algae. 1 minute dip, then 1 hour in a bucket of heavily Primed water. Killed all the algae and snails and so far it looks like the plants are fine. I would only use bleach on tougher plants though, like java ferns and anubias.


The sensitivity many plants, especially stems, have to bleach dips, and how easy it is kill the plant, is the main reason I decided to try PP. However, it might very well be that a PP dip is really no different than bleach in its ability to kill the bad guys and to kill the plant, but just takes a lot longer to do both. I don't know at this point.

If I have to dip for 30 min in PP to kill a certain algae, but the plant dies in 15 min, well that doesn't do me any good, and is no different than the algae needing a 2 min bleach dip to kill, but the plant dying after 1 min.


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## Tessa (Dec 8, 2015)

Yeah, I was really worried the bleach would hurt the plants too, but since they were really covered with hair algae I thought - why not just try. So I made the solution, dipped the plants (probably for less than a minute) and now, a week later, everything seems okay. I hope it stays that way...


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## TINNGG (Mar 9, 2005)

Someone on another forum suggested a flubendazole treatment. They put the plants in the solution for a couple of days.


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