# 10gal Betta Albimarginata: rescue male 10/27



## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Okay since I'm breeding a rare fish I thought I'd start a little thread for them. I bought a pair of wild caught betta albimarginata (White Seam Fighters). Within two week they bred, and now they have had their babies and bred again! 

Here's daddy holding the eggs (you can only see the eggs when he yawns at the moment). 











Here is a baby on the first day out of the mouth. He spat out an unknown number but sadly they were sooo small that were able to get out of the breeder, I ended up saving seven of them.











Here is one of the little guys a week or so later. I have set them up in a ten gallon grow out with tons of frogbit, hornwort, riccia, and terra cotta pots. This time around I am going to put daddy in the tank when he is a few days from spitting them out (last time the tank wasn't cycled yet).

Look at that belly! Feeding them crushd snails, cycopseze, and newly hatched brine shirmp (live). Feeding parents live blackworms.










I'll post a pic of the whole tank later.


Other babies: I just had about twenty baby Crystal Red Shirmp hatch, and a dozen or so cherry reds. My CDP have yet to breed that I've noticed. Sigh.


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## Ugly Genius (Sep 27, 2003)

That's a really cool-looking betta. Do you have another photo of it that shows the whole fish?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks! Here's the whole fish


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here is the female. She turns really dark with white vertical stripes when she's in the....uh...'mood'.


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## cintamas (Feb 17, 2009)

This species of betta is so fun! The males are just gems, especially if there's a female in sight. Congrats on the 2 spawns! There are a lot of folks out there who try really hard to get these fish to breed and here you've gone and done it after two weeks of bringing them home! I'm impressed. I can't find any locally for less than $100/pair. Worth it? Maybe. Especially after watching your success with them. 

I hope you keep us posted on the growth of these little guys.


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## CAM6467 (Feb 11, 2009)

Thanks for starting this thread! Your babies are growing very well, and I'm sure that they will be very beautiful!! Congrats on the success of your bettas.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thank you both! I bought my pair for 80$ and so far it's been worth it, I just love them. Although I was a little upset when they bred a second time...the male had only been eatting for four days! I'm going to have to separate them for a little while to give him a break after this!

I'm hoping to be able to help add to the captive bred population so that people don't have to rely on wild caughts.


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## Jack Gilvey (Jun 16, 2008)

Wow...that's a stunning fish I'd never heard of. Much prettier and more interesting than the Betta Walmartus.  What'd you have to do to your water for them, if anything?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

They don't need anything special done with their water!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

The babies look like real fish now. I think this may be a little boy.


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## Jack Gilvey (Jun 16, 2008)

Awesome.


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

Wow that looks really cool! What's their adult size?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

The parents are a little over two inches. They are an awesome fish, I just love them! They are rarely found captive bred in the US and I'm working to change this. 

If I can prove to my husband that these guys can bring me some income I think I can talk him into letting me set up a few more tanks devoted to breeding.


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## CAM6467 (Feb 11, 2009)

That's awesome! Are you going to buy more wild caught parent fish to avoid inbreeding?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I've got another friend in the area that is captive breeding, not intentionally, his just bred and he didn't do anything about it so he has some fry. So I'm going to get some of those for genetic diversity. As time goes on I'll inject new blood.


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## CAM6467 (Feb 11, 2009)

Very nice! It sounds like you're going to do very well with this project. Who knows...maybe I'll be knocking on your door for some breeding advice once I graduate from my 10 gallon to that 75 planted of my dreams!!


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## connordude27 (Jun 14, 2008)

wow this is awesome do you plan to sell these ones? or breed them with your friend batch of fry?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I'm going to start selling once I get a nice established breeding population going. So hopefully in about six months I'll be ready to start selling some!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here is daddy with a mouthful of babies. They have hatched now and so he'll spit them out in a day or two.










After this Daddy gets a break till he fattens up!


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

Wow! Those are really beautiful and interesting fish! I'm so glad they are breeding well, and it's really great that you are trying to help establish / enlarge the captive bred population, i think that's a really important thing to do in this hobby! If I ever have space for the tanks, I'd love to try and do that with my CPDs. 

Those babies are so cute too! Congratulations on the little ones doing well and good luck with this next spawn! Can't wait to see more pictures!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

thanks Karackle! I'm having a lot of fun with this! I've been trying to breed my CPDs as well, but so far no luck with those guys. giggle. I also think that breeding rare fish is important to keep the wild populations safe.


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

yeah, i'd love to have a go at breeding the CPDs, right now i'm having fun with guppy - endler hybridizing because I only have room for 1 10g fry tank and I think i'd need a few more spawning / rearing tanks for pretty much any other fish, I have CPDs now so maybe when I move i'll forgo the guppy project and try my hand at CPDs if I have space for a few more 10g (they're so cheap and easy to set up as rearing tanks, the only issue I have truly is space right now, i live in a small apartment and have 3 display tanks as it is + the guppy endler tank :tongue

But yes, captive bred populations are definitely important so as to keep nice healthy wild populations in tact!


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## suebe333 (Feb 17, 2009)

Very nice ,, love all the pics


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

The Daddy had his babies today!! Here's an out of focus picture of one of the new ones. I've counted ten of them so far, but they are hard to find in all the hornwort!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here's a pic of the whole tank. It's choked with hornwort. Daddy is in the breeder box cause Momma is all ready to 'go' again and I don't think he can take it! So I'm going to let him fatten up.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I thought daddy was done, but he spit out over twenty more while in the breeder. Where was he hiding so many little fish! There must be over forty of them in all.


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## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Poor guy. What interesting fishes though


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

They are a lot of fun!


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

hah that tank looks like so much fun. makes me want to start breeding some fish. maybe ill start with guppies 

cute bettas, so unique.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Wow, that is stunning coloration, I don't think I've seen this species before. Be sure to let me know when you decide to "add to the captive bred population", I'd be glad to buy a pair or two off you and keep the ball rolling.  Would probably keep adding wilds back into the strain.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I will let you know! I'm going to try and bring other captives back into my blood lines. I'm speaking with someone who has a set of fry.

Thanks!


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## chris1993 (Mar 6, 2009)

nice job , so thats 40 fry , 20 pairs , $100 a pair , if my calculations are correct thats $2000


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I plan to sell them at more around 40-50 a pair. But yeah, if I can find homes for them all it's good business! I'm hoping to do well on AB since there are no American breeders of these guys on there.


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

Wow look at all those babies! How DID they all fit in his mouth?! That's so wonderful that the breeding pair is doing so well!  woohoo! :bounce:


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## FrostyNYC (Nov 5, 2007)

Wow congratulations on breeding such a rare species.


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## connordude27 (Jun 14, 2008)

wow the fry looks very cool could you try and get a close up?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I love breeding a rare fish! giggle

I'll try to get a close up...they are hard to get a shot of!


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## kyle3 (May 26, 2005)

awesome!


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

You have the coolest tanks.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Went to feed this morning and found that my female was in breeding colours again! I had added the male back yesterday cause he was all fat again. The female almost looks like the male when she's courting him, just less red.

Here's the female before breeding colours:










Here she is with her breeding colours:











Here you can see the male's head, he looks worried. Giggle. Too much fish sex.


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

hahaha wow! It sounds like you couldn't have asked for a better pair to get a captive breeding population under way! WAHOO!


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## lookin_around (Dec 18, 2005)

Awesome job Phoenix! I've never seen this species before this thread. Is it just because of their rarity that they are so expensive?

Sounds like the female is a Faaa-reak!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

She is a freak. Giggle. And yup, their rarity and the fact that they are almost all wild caught make them so exspensive.

They won't be rare in the pet trade for long if my momma fish as anything to say about it!


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

Phoenix-cry said:


> They won't be rare in the pet trade for long if my momma fish as anything to say about it!


Hahaha i think that is true! Your freaky-deaky momma fish is definitely ready to get a captive breeding population up and running NOW! :hihi:


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here's a baby update!

Here's the second batch:










And here's how big the first batch is!


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

They're so frickin' cute!!! heeheehee :biggrin:


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Awesome! :thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Pheonix looks like you are surely on your way! Your little guys are doing you proud! Glad your making them take a little time out!


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## connordude27 (Jun 14, 2008)

wow those look awesome


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks! My poor male needs to get fattened up! He's actually looking really good right now.

I love their big eyeballs!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

So I've had a touch of trouble with my babies. The hornwort is so thick that I was having trouble knowing how many fish I had. So I removed it and scooped out all the fish.

I have five big beautiful betta that are just hitting an inch. 

Sadly I have three tiny, very thin betta as well. As well as about thirty missing betta. 

Look at the size difference, these guys were born around the same time. 

The trouble is the ten gallon heavy compition for food and a harder search so only the really strong survived and grew. So I have the tree tiny ones in an ICU tub and they will get the best of the best food in hopes of getting them caught up.

Next time daddy spits out some babies I'm going to place them in a small tank till they are large enough for the grow out.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Wow, what a difference. :icon_eek:


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Amazing what food (or lack there of) can do. Although you know there was plenty in the tank for everyone!


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## connordude27 (Jun 14, 2008)

wow those look awesome! what food do you feed?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks!

I've been feeding newly hatched live brine shrimp, cyplopeze, and crushed snails.


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Hope all works out for the little runts. What a difference. I would not have thought that it would have been this way. Keep us posted on their progress.


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## kyle3 (May 26, 2005)

well done!

cheers-K


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

The runts are doing well in the tiny tank with fresh hatched brinies. I'm also getting some microworms in the mail soon and I'm going to start raising my own.


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## H82LOS3 (Mar 5, 2009)

Beautiful bettas, i've never seen anything like that!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I've found another local breeder with a set of Betta Al and so now I've got a pool of three separate gene pools to get my breeding program going. So I've re set up where my tanks are. I bought a 75 gallon stand, and put both my 10 gallons on it.

I spruced up the grow out tank a bit and now that the babies are big enough not to get eatten I've moved the adult pair in there as well since the little fish in the ten gallon planted were starting to annoy them. Hopefully this will give them the quiet they want to breed again (female is fat with eggs).

I also set up a one gallon 'starter' tank, so when this next batch is born they'll go in the one gallon till they are big enough to fend for themselves in the ten. 

If I can make some money breeding these guys I'll buy them a 55 to grow out and breed in.



Here is a baby:











Here's the new set up:


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## Outlawboss (Dec 30, 2008)

Awesome tanks. I've really enjoyed watching these little guys grow up and your progress with successfully breeding them.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks! Pleased to see yer enjoying!


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## equi_design (May 6, 2009)

As a Betta nut (or maybe a geek- heck, whatever  ) I'm SO happy to see your success and progress. I'd love to get a project like this going when things get settled in our new house. You get the fun of keeping fish, and helping out the wild population in a responsible manner.

 Good work!


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## demosthenes (Aug 23, 2008)

great job phoenix! good luck with all of the babies. can we see an FTS soon? hows the tank itself been coming?


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Awesome, get it going! 

Nice scape on the right


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks everyone! 

Demo: there should have been a FTS one page back!

The tank on the Right is my 'fun' tank, the one I'm putting the effort into aquascaping rather than breeding.

I am SO excited about truly getting a captive bred population going and I'm so pleased that I found two other people who want to do the same so we can keep our genetics nice and fresh without taking more out of the wild! Won't be long before I have F2 generation captive breds!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Oh and I just started raising microworms, waltorworms, and bananaworms for my next batch of betta to munch on!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I actually caught my betta spawning this morning! Here you can see the female spitting out the eggs so the male will put them in his mouth.


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## nickcamp12345 (May 2, 2009)

that picture of the beta spitting out the eggs is amazing. good luck with the whole population thing.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

They grow up so fast! Today I look in and two of my babies have gained their red colour and they were displaying at one another. It is hard to see the colour of the forground one cause he had just decided to back off and go dull. Boys will be Boys!!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

The new babies hatched in Dad's mouth this morning, now I just have to wait for him to spit them out! Giggle.


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## ch3fb0yrdee (Oct 2, 2008)

THat babies are so cute. The male and females can be kept together in one tank without and issues? Are these the more passive bettas? Really cool stuff.

When you have enough to sell, Id love to buy a pair from you. They are just wonderful!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

These betta actually do best in schools! How cool is that? You can even keep more than one male together, they will flare, but they don't fight. 

I'll be letting everyone know when they are ready for sale (it's going to be a few months).

I have just fallen in love with these fish. I'm working with a few other breeders to get more genetic diversity so when the time comes I should be able to get you an unrelated pair.


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

cool little bettas. I had a blast breeding regular betta splendens. This seems pretty fun.

take advantage of the warmer temps. You can harvest mosquito larvae and think about raising daphnia as an alternative to brine shrimps.

b. macrostoma looks pretty cool too. I'd give that a go one day.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I've been raising microworms, waltorworms, and bananaworms for this round of babies, but mosquitos and daphnia are a great idea too!! Hugs.

I have a friend that breeds macs, they are AWESOME!


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

Phoenix-cry said:


> I've been raising microworms, waltorworms, and bananaworms


why the 3 different worms btw?
Aren't they the pretty much the same size?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

They have different protein values, and slightly diffrent cycle rates. Although the main reason is that on e-bay the guy was selling them as a three pack and I wanted to see who was the easisest to care for. For the record the Bananaworms are by far the easiest to care for. But yeah, they are pretty much the same.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here's one of the babies that I found in my other tank (the babies were so small when they were born in the clear breeder box that some of them escaped, I am impressed that two surrvived on their own with so many carnivors). 

So here's a new pic!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I woke up today to 16 new baby Betta Albimarginata! Squeee!!!

They are soooo tiny! Right now they are in a TRE (target rich enviroment), a bowl full of microworms. They'll spend the next three hours here and then they'll be moved to the baby tank to grow up till they are ready for the grow out tank.











I placed the male back in the freedom of the whole tank...and the female went RIGHT for him and went all breeding colours and fanning out and 'give me some!'. So I saved him and placed him in my planted tank. After three weeks of not eating he is not ready to be bred again. He needs to be fattened up! I have heard of female albi breeding their men to death and I don't want that to happen!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Hey, John of Aqualand. If yer reading this you can e-mail me at [email protected] for any info on these guys! Thanks sooooo much for the original pair, they are the best!


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

those are some nice betta. congrats on the fry.


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## DarrylR (Oct 9, 2007)

Just started reading this thread, great looking fish and good job on breeding them! I should find a pair for my spare 29 gallon .


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Well DarrylR if you can wait a month or so these guys will be up for sale at far lower than you could get them at a LFS or on Aquabid and you'll know for a fact that yer getting a CB fish!  

Although if you are looking to breed yourself you'll have to wait a bit longer cause I'm going to be trading genes with some other breeders so I can supply non related pairs. 

HUGS! 

Mako: thanks!!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

First dominate male showed his colours today! I can't get a good shot of him, but he's developed the white seams to his fins. Squeee!

I've been told that I need to separate the males in over to truly sex them cause one will always be the dominate and most colourful.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I got a new tattoo today! Since it is fish related I thought I would post it here.


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

hey! pretty good tat.. Props to the artist.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

The first batch of babies got big enough to eat live blackworms and they exsploded in size!!! they are almost real fish now!










Dominante male on top:











New babies are growing fast too! Doing much better in the small grow out, no deaths.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here are my babies, all in a row!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Okay, so I had to move my male back into the grow out tank cause I was having some balance issues with my planted tank (ammonia spike). Since it has only been a week since he last had babies I wanted him to take more of a break. So I put the female in the breeder net so the male could have the run of the tank for a change.

Over the night the female fought her way up and out of the breeder net and...well...she got to him. Sigh.

So now he has so many eggs in his moth he can barely close his mouth.


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## kyle3 (May 26, 2005)

what a crazy challenge keeping those two apart! it might be time for a third 10g! you have to go to such lengths just to keep him from starving poor little guy . . .

good luck and keep up the great work!

cheers-K


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Honestly I couldn't believe it! The breeder net is like 1/8 of an inch away from the glass top. Sigh. Luckily he had a full week of munching down live blackworms so he had fattened up a lot. 

Babies for sale soon!


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## VisionQuest28 (Apr 18, 2007)

Very cool! I have been wanting to work with some type(s) of wild bettas for awhile now. Its going to have to stay on the back burner though, everything is in limbo for me right now. Living situation, car, job...EVERYTHING. The one tank i have set up doesnt even live with me right now! lol But ive got several empty tanks, and several ideas of what i want to do with them. Long story short...some day im gonna want some of your bettas! Keep up the great work


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Whenever you are ready I'm sure I'll have some babies for ya! Giggle. Actually as of right now I've already sold my larger babies so it will be a few months before I've got older ones to sell.


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## DarrylR (Oct 9, 2007)

Ahhhh i want a pair! I need to start selling packages to build up a reserve in my paypal -__-.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Sell away! Giggle. Don't worry, at the rate they are breeding I'll have fish enough for everyone!


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## DarrylR (Oct 9, 2007)

Phoenix would you take any trades? Sorry for clogging your thread with questions :S.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I take trades if ya got somthing that perks me interests!


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## ddtran46 (Jul 8, 2008)

NIce!! How much will you be selling each fish for? I wouldn't mind getting myself a pair. lol


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Okay, I'm going to put up my pricing now so that I can remember it and keep it the same for everyone:

I sell full adult sexed pairs for 45$.

Single adult female for 25.

Single adult male for 30 (so just buy the pair...giggle).

Sub-adult unsexed single for 20$

With discounts on schools of 4 or more. 4 unsexed for 75, 6 unsexed for 100.



At your LFS adult pairs will run 80-120$. I have seen some wild caught on Aquabid for 25$ a pair, but you have to ship them in from Thailand.

I offer overnight shipping for 30$ in the US with a full DOA return. Or priority 2 day for 15 with no DOA return. I ship in breather bags with bag buddies, and either cold or hot packs.

Right now I have two sub-adults that are about two weeks away from showing if they are potiental males. 

Other than that I just have a mass of fry, they will be sub-adult in a month to two months and adult in three to four months. I haven't thought about selling fry cause I fear they won't do well in shipping.


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## Ebichua (May 13, 2008)

I got my Betta Albimarginata from Phoenix-Cry today. They're quite shy and like to hide in my plants, so it was very difficult to snap pictures of them when I put them into the tank. Some were curious enough to approach the red light when I tried to snap a shot, others were too shy. I saw the beautiful male but as I tried to snap a pic, the red light scared it away. It's a young male, just starting to show the white color and red fins. I really wish I got a closer look and a picture of it. It hid between rotala greens so you could only see only a fraction of its body, broken up. But in any case, these fish are fantastic. Furthermore, Phoenix-Cry is a FANTASTIC breeder and person to get them from. She went the extra mile and more for these fish and to get them to me. For anyone who is interested in these fish, get it from her. Trust me, you won't be disappointed. I sure as hell am not  

Picture time! I'll post pictures of the males that show color when they come out and stop being so shy ;-)


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I'm so glad they got there safe! But WOW they are pale!! Poor little guys. They will lose that shyness in time, at least they were never shy in the grow out tank, I was always snapping shots of them. giggle. 

Thanks for posting the pictures!! Hugs!

PS- the 'tattered' fin look is just the pale colours right? No one left here with tattered fins, so if it happened in transport I'll have to perhaps change to just one fish per bag instead of two.


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## VisionQuest28 (Apr 18, 2007)

Phoenix-cry said:


> Whenever you are ready I'm sure I'll have some babies for ya! Giggle. Actually as of right now I've already sold my larger babies so it will be a few months before I've got older ones to sell.


A few months sounds perfect, although maybe if you decide you can ship some of the smaller ones, i might be able to jump on that sooner. Just keep us udpated!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I have no problems shipping small guys, I just can't give you any guesses as to their sex. I've got two right now that are around an inch, that's about as small as I'd feel comfy shipping. One of them was showing some red today...but sometimes the females do that as well just to throw me off the scent! Giggle. 

I'll also have breather bags and bag buddies in a few days so the priority shipping will be safer. 

I'll just keep a running tab on who I have for sale. 

Right now: two sub-adults 1 inch.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I added some black sand (I had white) to my grow out/breeder tank and my female got so colourful she almost looks male! The male got more red as well...but he's hiding at the moment.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here's my male. He ended up eating the most recent batch of eggs and sadly I think it's cause I was fishing around in there for like ten minutes trying to get the sub adults out. Those guys are fast! Oh well, the female is getting fat again already and this will give the male a little more time to gain some weight anyway.

Here's a recent shot of the male, I've decided to name in Kimoto the female is Savak (everyone on the Betta forum names their fish, it's not something I've ever thought to do before).


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## Ebichua (May 13, 2008)

Phoenix, the fins really are tattered in person. But nothing more than minor damages. Fins heal fast, thankfully.  Hope that helps!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Eek! That's no good! Hmmmm...I put that hornwort in there to give them something to feel secure around, but I guess it gave them some fin damage. Heal up quick little ones!


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## connordude27 (Jun 14, 2008)

how many of these little fish will fit in a 10g?


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## VisionQuest28 (Apr 18, 2007)

wow, their color really changed alot with the black sand! I wonder if they will continue to color up more in the coming days/weeks. Man, im so tempted by these little beauties! Trying so hard to be responsible and put this off for a little bit....must....fight...it.... lol


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

A pair or two males and female would be perfectly happy in a ten gallon. You might have to seperate out the male every so often cause the females will breed the men to death, which is why I don't suggest two females and a male.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Well you'll have to put it off a little longer anyway cause I've only got the two sub adults at the moment! Giggle.

Yeah, they are more comfortable with the dark background to blend in with, it's true with most fish.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

A local fish owner who has a pair of Albi has 10 fry he is going to give me cause he's not interested in breeding! I'm so excited, I'm picking them up tomorrow. Now I can start breeding unrelated pairs together!


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

cool.. I was wondering about the genetic diversity of your Albis.

You're going to be a rich woman if you keep this up. You're going to have to take over the basement & garage


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

So far I have only been breeding the two original wild caught pair, so it hasn't been a problem, and even a few generations of inbreeding in fish is not a big deal. But now I'll have three gene pools (another breeder on line is going to be swaping some pairs with me).

The *real* problem is now each adult pair needs it's own tank and each batch of fry need their own tanks as well so that I know who is who and who is breeding with who!!!


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

There's a woman by me that breeds fancy b. splendens. I think she took over a warehouse to breed and run her business.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Oh dear...my husband is balking at the thought of two more tanks as it is!!


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

hey, $$$ talks


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

So a local I met on a fish forum wanted to get out of his betta albimarginata (he breeds some amazing betta splendids, and about 30 tanks of random other fish). He had them in a 2 gallon, the adults had died, and he was just going to put them out in his pond for mosquito control. Ack! So he gave me a batch of sub adults! I'm so excited! I'm going to pick out the best of the best to reenter into my breeding program and offer the rest for sale. 

I'm not sure their quality yet, but first glance at them stressed out says they are beauties! 

I have them in a 2 gallon jar at the moment. I didn't want to add them right to my ten gallon with my champion breeding pair in cause there are any disease issues.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

My hope...that when they colour up they don't prove to actually be betta chanoides! The only cosmetic difference is the chanoides don't have black on their dorsal fin, but chanoides and albi will not interbreed.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Want to get into breeding wild type betta? I've got a once in a life time chance fer ya!

Betta Channoides.

Go here for more details: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-shop/89860-colony-betta-channoides.html#post871946


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

Phoenix,

Thanks for sending me this way. I gotta hand it to you for producing so many babies with that couple. Nice work. Now I just need to get my breeder tank set up so I can get some from you. That last pic of your male is beautiful!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks! I've had good luck with these guys, but I'm going to be retiring them soon. So I'll be keeping this last batch of babies and exchanging pairs with another Albi breeder. I'll soon have three breeding pairs so I can keep up with demand.

Here's an update of the last batch! All eyeballs!


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

SO cute! Sounds like you're in business. Here's to your success!:thumbsup:


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## Kolkri (Dec 9, 2006)

So cute. Can't wait to see more.


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## Shadow (Sep 19, 2006)

Hey another Minnesotan 
Do you keep the fry in with the parents, or are they removed?


"If I can make some money breeding these guys I'll buy them a 55 to grow out and breed in."
I happen to have a all glass 55g oak tank with stand and glass top sitting in the basement waiting for a new home.


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## Germitune (Oct 24, 2009)

I've really enjoyed this thread! Any updates? Been awhile.

I have two of these bettas and I was hoping they were a pair but as they've grown I reallize they are both males... so I've been looking for some females.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Sorry it's been so long! 

These guys are doing great! I've got nine sub-adult/aduts and 18 babies at the moment and demand is way above supply for me. So I'm moving them into a 45 long and a 30 reg and a 10, and the fry in a picotope. 

You MUST remove the young from the parents, the parents will eat the babies! 

I'll have pics up soon. Sorry to be away for so long.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Here's a pic of my first batch of I said these were F1, but what I meant was F2! 










Sorry I haven't been around. Got busy this summer!


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## FrostyNYC (Nov 5, 2007)

Phoenix-cry, I just want to give credit where it's due. Great thread. 

How large are the F1 fry at this point? Has growth been fast/slow? What are you feeding them?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Thanks! I'm pleased you are enjoying!!

F1 fry are now about 1/4 to 1/2 inch, and I've had another F1 batch that are a little under 1/4. Betta Albi are slow growing for Betta, mature size is reached in 5-6 months. I feed a combination of microw/walter/bananaworms, live baby brine shrimp, micro waffers by Hikira, frozen daphina, frozen cyclopseze, and the adults also get live blackworms.


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## Germitune (Oct 24, 2009)

Thanks for the update! I'm happy to see you're doing so well with them. My 2 are actually near my office desk so I'm falling in love with this species.

I just discovered that the C.A.R.E.S Preservation Program has these listed on their site as "At risk in nature". This makes me want to breed my guys even more. I figure the more of us that are breeding them in captivity the less pressure they will have in nature. Not to mention I'm feeling a little guilty since I know mine were wild caught.

Please keep us informed on your progress... I'm really enjoying this thread.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Yes, these guys do need lots of captive breeding to keep the natural population healthy! 

These are wonderful fish!

I'll have my new set up on Monday night. I'll post pics of it.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I kept saying F1, I meant F2! These are the babies of my first babies.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

My Betta Nano system is no longer so nano. I just set up a 45 gallon and 30 gallon dual tank set up to start seriously breeding these guys. So now I've got betta fry in a 3 gal, best breeding pair in a ten, and in a few weeks when these tanks are cycled I'll be putting my secondary breeders in the 30 and my grow outs on in the 45! I will be a betta factory! Giggle. I LOVE these fish!

I will be adding more hiding, and a sponge over the filter intake in case I don't catch a holding male in time to place him in the net breeder.


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## Germitune (Oct 24, 2009)

Cool and grats on the expansion! I really look forward to seeing how things progress!


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Such a wonderful process. These are really neat fish!


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## ravenmyth (Dec 22, 2008)

Agree, very exciting long term story. You should be proud of your success.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Squeee! thank you all. I'm very proud of my little babies. I've got five gene lines now (I bought some F1 babies off a guy who has several lines). I hope to one day be up to my eyeballs in this fish!


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

pump them out so we can buy some off you in the spring!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Yes! That is the plan!


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

VERY cool setup! You'll be running a baby makin' factory in no time!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

So I just happened to be near my LFS and thought I'd drop in. They've had a pair of wild caught Betta Albimarginata that I've had my eye on for a month, but I couldn't bring myself to pay 80 bucks for this pair (they weren't the greatest). When I went in today the rotting corpse of the female was on the bottom of the 2 gallon tank they were in (she must have been dead at least three days) and the male was next. He is painfully thin (they were trying to feed just flake).

So although I shouldn't have I paid 30 bucks to take the male. I hope some live blackworms and some time in a good sized tank (the ten gallon) will whip him back into shape and I can add a touch more wild genes to my stock.

I think he was way too expensive for a dying fish (talked down from 40), but I couldn't just leave him there to die. I love these guys too much.


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Way to go!:thumbsup: :bounce: I'm glad you got him. If anyone can save him, it's you!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Hug!!!!!


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

phoenix,

How long from when the eggs hatch to the point the male spits out the babies? I'm asking because I'm at the point where I can see the babies wiggling through his gills. Any advice from the master?


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

If you see wriggling when it first starts you've got two to three days till he spits them out. The moment I spot eyeballs I move my male into a breeder net (not a box, the slots in the boxes are too big and the babies slip out). Once they are spat out the male will only remember them for a day or so...and then they will become lunch. So if you want high yield you need to keep babies and parents apart.

I had one male spit out too early and all the babies had egg yolk sacs (it was his second batch) so I placed them in a cup of water with java moss and they just laid in the moss, three days later they were free swimming! 

If you catch them mating or you notice that one day he eats and the next day he doesn't, mark that date on the calandar since that they tend to hold for 12-15 days (although I had one dad hold on for 22 days) and that way you don't have worry about spotting wriggling you can just place them in the breeder net on the 11th day.

Good luck, got any pics?


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

Thank you. That was very informative. They've been wiggling for 2 days now so I'll keep my eyes peeled for the babies. As for pics, here they are. Beleive it or not, these are your fish. Ebichua let me borrow them for breeding . 

male with eggs in his mouth









both together


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Squeee!!!! I'm so proud!!!

They look great!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I've started a new thread for breeding Albi here: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/fish/95608-phoenixs-betta-albimarginata.html#post931422


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## Germitune (Oct 24, 2009)

Big applause for saving the male!


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

He's doing great!! Eatting like a pig and even challanging my top male!


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

My male finally released 2 babies, more like they forced their way out after 8 days of hatching inside his mouth. I'll try to take some pics later tonight.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Glad to hear ya got some babies!


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## Fatality (Oct 21, 2009)

Very beautiful fish! When you start selling please let me know I want some!


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## koop (Sep 18, 2009)

Phoenix- Where in MN are you? I would be interested in a pair in a few months.


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

I'm in St. Paul. You can find me on the Minnesota Fishkeeper Forum.


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