# Aquarium timer using Irrigation computer



## Fish'InMN (Apr 23, 2006)

Prices vary considerably.. Cheapest I saw was a 4 zone 'interior mount' for $26 which isn't bad. Putting the money into figuring out the control structure, modifying a power strip or adding sockets, etc.. Still fairly bulky, but it could work. Its got a nice interface too, 

I am tinkering with a PIC 'system' to control my lights, heater, and fans, as well as monitor temperature (and use temp to regulate heater/fan on/off) and maybe pH. Will have a USB port so I can hook it up to my laptop to update the program, but no other controls except reset and power switches. Nothing new though, I know its been done before. Still waiting for my samples though... 


Marty


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Heh. Just spent $35 on this thing.

Couple of interesting points:

* Independent program for each valve
* Watering Duration: from 1 minute to 11 hours and 59 minutes in 1 minute increments
* Four start times per day on weekly schedule
* Automatic short detector isolates the faulty valve and continues the irrigation cycle
* Start time stacking prevents hydraulic overload
* Water budget from 95% to +95% in 5% increments
* Three modes: automatic, semi-automatic and manual
* * Can operate two valves at the same time*
* Waiting mode for third and fourth valves
* Manual irrigation cycle via the controller
* Battery backup retain program memory during a power outage

So I was wrong about not being able to run two things at the same time. And one minute to 12 hours in one minute steps for six different stations is pretty darn flexible.

Oh yeah, and since this is an irrigation timer, turning the water change solenoid on and off shouldn't be much of an issue either. :biggrin:


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## imeridian (Jan 19, 2007)

Ohh, the ability to do two zones at once is really good. That single zone issue really put me off the idea.


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## Fish'InMN (Apr 23, 2006)

Output: 24 V*AC* 0.83 mA, interesting. Wish I wasn't so busy right now.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Hehe, I am busy too, but this is fascinating. It's like six digital timers in one box, with a huge array of options to fine-tune and adjust.

Looking for some inexpensive 24V relays right now... any idea? Combining this with relays adds another interesting tad, you can easily use one timer/zone to alternate things. Like mainlight/moonlight, or CO2/airpump etc.

How's that for a schedule?


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

How is this? Picture looks like crap, but its got a 120 VAC rating for the relay.

http://www.electronicpartsforless.c...ed.aspx?sfid=100806&i=52296458&mpid=36&dfid=1


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## kornphlake (Dec 4, 2007)

www.digikey.com has every relay known to man, if there's a cheap one out there they'd have it. I'm not seeing anything even close to the 0.83mA current though, are you sure that's correct?


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## swylie (May 10, 2007)

Thats probably a typo. Right below it it says "# Outputs: 24 VAC, 0.27A # Maximum output: 0.83A," which makes a lot more sense. That's 6.5 and 20 watts, for what it's worth.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Thanks for the links... I must be spoiled, looking for something like this (price and feature-wise) but 24V instead of 110V.

The current is just the max that the transformer can deliver (to actuate the solenoids). For relays, much less is needed. Less is better, since it will use up less electricity.


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## LS6 Tommy (May 13, 2006)

indiboi said:


> Ohh, the ability to do two zones at once is really good. That single zone issue really put me off the idea.


If you use good old "ice cube" relays, you can run up to 3 things off of each of the 6 outputs, depending on how many sets of contacts the relay has!! 6 if you use triple pole, dual throw relays and run half of the items in the "on" cycle and half in the "off" cycle.

I think I smell a control upgrade coming...roud: 

Tommy


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## swylie (May 10, 2007)

LS6 Tommy said:


> If you use good old "ice cube" relays, you can run up to 3 things off of each of the 6 outputs, depending on how many sets of contacts the relay has!! 6 if you use triple pole, dual throw relays and run half of the items in the "on" cycle and half in the "off" cycle.
> 
> I think I smell a control upgrade coming...roud:
> 
> Tommy


Yeah, but you can't control those things _independently_, can you?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

swylie said:


> Yeah, but you can't control those things _independently_, can you?





Wasserpest said:


> Heh. Just spent $35 on this thing.
> 
> Couple of interesting points:
> 
> * Independent program for each valve


That's one weird/good thing about this particular timer that you can control the zones independently, rather than a one after another deal like other timers. 

I really need to dig up a 9V battery and start to play around with it. But as far as I understand, you can set them up however you want it, as long there are no more than two overlapping at the same time.

The instructions are not really thorough so I just have to play around with it.


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## stagius (Nov 26, 2007)

how you are gonna hook up the electric wire to these irrigation timer. 

I just gonna look up these term, and it mainly used to control water feeding in the crop. Basically, i still dont have a clear idea on how it works ? Maybe a little bit visual picture will help me.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Basically, the irrigation controller has a number of contacts that switch 24VAC. Normally, you would connect solenoid valves (sprinkler valves) to them. But, you could also connect say a 24VAC relay to them which in turn switches an electrical outlet which could be connected to your lights or dosing pumps.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

Did you choose your relays yet WP? I am curious to see what the total cost of this will be.


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## nycsicktank (Sep 15, 2007)

theres something like this in sw equipment =)


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## swylie (May 10, 2007)

Wasserpest said:


> That's one weird/good thing about this particular timer that you can control the zones independently, rather than a one after another deal like other timers.


Yeah, I saw where you mentioned that, and that's cool. It would still be nice if you could control each zone _completely _ independently, but I guess that's not really necessary. However, I was referring to the relays that someone mentioned that had three channels or something. Of course they all switch together, so it doesn't do anything for you except increase the current handling capacity of your relay, so far as I can tell. Still six channels, not eighteen...


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## LS6 Tommy (May 13, 2006)

Hey! Where did my post go?! It just disappeared! I posted an explanation of how you could use one output to control a relay, which would energize however many adjustable time delay relays to stage multiple items off of each output. I also explained the basic programming I would use to control my lunar lights, 3 stages of main lighting, the CO2 solenoid, Reactor pump & an air pump. I could do all that with the 4 zone unit. 

I'm not going to sit here & rethink the timer schedule again. 

Tommy


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

gmccreedy said:


> Did you choose your relays yet WP? I am curious to see what the total cost of this will be.


No, I am searching. Got some excellent 110V relays for $0.75/ea (see link earlier) and I was hoping to find something similar for 24V.

So, the total cost would be

$35 for the irrigation timer
$5 for relays
$5 for power strip

$45 for basically 6 semi-independent advanced timers in a compact package. Not too bad.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

LS6 Tommy said:


> Hey! Where did my post go?! It just disappeared! I posted an explanation of how you could use one output to control a relay, which would energize however many adjustable time delay relays to stage multiple items off of each output. I also explained the basic programming I would use to control my lunar lights, 3 stages of main lighting, the CO2 solenoid, Reactor pump & an air pump. I could do all that with the 4 zone unit.
> 
> I'm not going to sit here & rethink the timer schedule again.
> 
> Tommy


Hmmm... lost in electron land.

This sounds workable, but then you'd have to add delay timers, which adds to the total cost and complexity I guess. I prefer to spend a bit more for a 6 zone timer upfront, and the flexibility to time minutes up to 12 hours is pretty good.


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## LS6 Tommy (May 13, 2006)

Wasserpest said:


> Hmmm... lost in electron land.
> 
> This sounds workable, but then you'd have to add delay timers, which adds to the total cost and complexity I guess. I prefer to spend a bit more for a 6 zone timer upfront, and the flexibility to time minutes up to 12 hours is pretty good.


I agree on the 6 zone, but you can still only have 2 zones energized at the same time. The beuaty of using TDR's is you can stage multiplethings off of 1 or 2 zones. A TDR costs about $8.00 for me.

Tommy


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

LS6 Tommy said:


> A TDR costs about $8.00 for me.
> Tommy


Just for you, or anyone? Got a link or source?

I am asking because I built some delay timers with relays, but buying the circuit board, relay, and plugs added up to a bit more.


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## LS6 Tommy (May 13, 2006)

LS6 Tommy said:


> I agree on the 6 zone, but you can still only have 2 zones energized at the same time. The beuaty of using TDR's is you can stage multiplethings off of 1 or 2 zones. A TDR costs about $8.00 for me.
> 
> Tommy





Wasserpest said:


> Just for you, or anyone? Got a link or source?
> 
> I am asking because I built some delay timers with relays, but buying the circuit board, relay, and plugs added up to a bit more.



Sorry, bad typo! It should read $28.00. At least that's what i used to get them for. Here's an example (even though it's not who we used to get them from):

http://www.wolfautomation.com/Product.aspx?ProductID=22575

Tommy


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## kornphlake (Dec 4, 2007)

It's no dollar relay, but it's probably the best you'll find assuming whatever you are powering doesn't draw more than 3A
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=PB139-ND

There are a couple others, this one is a little less and will handle [email protected], way overkill but it'll save you a couple bucks per relay
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=Z843-ND

[email protected]
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=Z184-ND


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## dekstr (Oct 23, 2007)

This sounds interesting. I don't understand most of it, but when you guys have it figured out, make sure to write out a irrigation set-up for dummies article!

In the mean time I'll keep reading and scratching my head.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

kornphlake said:


> It's no dollar relay, but it's probably the best you'll find assuming whatever you are powering doesn't draw more than 3A
> http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=PB139-ND
> 
> There are a couple others, this one is a little less and will handle [email protected], way overkill but it'll save you a couple bucks per relay
> ...


Thanks, but nah... not even close to the best I will find. This is a bit closer.


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## kornphlake (Dec 4, 2007)

Wasserpest said:


> Thanks, but nah... not even close to the best I will find. This is a bit closer.


Or you can use that. I never think to look on ebay for stuff like that, usually for items under about $10 you don't save much after paying the inflated shipping and handling fees.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

gmccreedy said:


> Did you choose your relays yet WP? I am curious to see what the total cost of this will be.





kornphlake said:


> Or you can use that. I never think to look on ebay for stuff like that, usually for items under about $10 you don't save much after paying the inflated shipping and handling fees.


Just went ahead and bought six

POTTER & BRUMFIELD KHAU-17A11-24 RELAY 14 BLADE 24VAC

via fleabay. They were $2.75 ea and with (very reasonable) shipping the total came out to $20 flat, or $3.33/relay.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

Did you just solder to the pins of these relays to make the connections or did you buy some type of base unit to plug the relays into? I am a bit lost with this electrical stuff here, but this is totally intriguing to say the least.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

I just placed the order, so I don't have them yet. Plus not much time at the moment. But I will just solder them most likely, like I did with the delay timer relays.

They are too big to fit inside a power strip, so I need to find some neat way to assemble and combine the relays and power strip and controller. Maybe some board (piece of wood) that can be hung on the wall or inside the stand. With all those cables going to one place it will be difficult to make it look neat.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

What about something like this WP to hide all the stuff inside and mount the controller on the front.

http://www.radioshack.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=2032276&cp=2032058.2032230

You may need to still mount the power strip outside. Not sure how big it is, but you can certainly hide the relays at least.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Hehe, that's the thing... besides the controller and the power strip you don't have much, just 4 little relays maybe, so that box would probably be overkill. I think mounting all those things onto a board will work, the ugly part will be all the power cables plugging into the power strip.

I will post pictures when there is some progress...


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

There has been progress. An hour or two of soldering didn't sound really enjoyable, so the stuff has been sitting under my desk for - ooops - two months. Last night I finally found some time and dedication and soldered it all together. I will post pictures and stuff after making sure it works as expected, but so far, so good. Maybe I start another thread to get rid of all the startup fluff.


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## Augus (Apr 7, 2008)

Great news WP, can't wait to see the whole setup and pics.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

how much did you end up spending?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

$35 for the irrigation controller.
$3.33 for each relay --> total of $13. (there might be cheaper options)
$.70 for each outlet --> total of $2.

Not counting wires and screws which can be salvaged from other things, it adds up to ~$50. A bit more expensive than a similar solution combining mechanical and electronic timers, but much more convenient and compact.

I still need to make it look nice with a front plate, and box it all in, but I might be able to finish it Sunday and will post some pictures next week.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Just in case you wondered where the pictures are... had a little setback. Two of the four relays that I used in the setup are no good. One is shorted (which the timer accurately reported!) and the other one is open. Should have taken a minute and tested them when I got them. So now I have to rip that thing apart and replace the two relays...

Other than that, I love the features and easy programming of the irrigation controller.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

I thought there was six relays? I must be confused.

So are you just modifying a standard power strip and bypassing the hot legs to each outlet with the relay? Or are you using standard household outlets?

I am curious how this thing will look when done.


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## colinthebassist (Nov 30, 2007)

Here is what I'll be using to control my tank. 64 Outputs and 32 Inputs may seem like to many, but thats not what I say.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

gmccreedy said:


> I thought there was six relays? I must be confused.
> 
> So are you just modifying a standard power strip and bypassing the hot legs to each outlet with the relay? Or are you using standard household outlets?
> 
> I am curious how this thing will look when done.


I bought 6 relays, but just want to use 4 with this little setup. Keep in mind two things: 1) the relays will switch two ways (DT - double throw) so one relay can toggle two outlets, and 2) even though there are 6 zones, I want to use one or two directly (without relay) with water change solenoids. So I figure 4 zones with relays to switch 6 outlets, one for water change, and one spare for some other future use.

I will draw something up to make it easier understandable.

I gave up on modifying the standard power strip, using regular double outlets now.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

What happened with this little contraption?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

*Here is the link to the final project: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/diy/66050-wasser-controller.html*

It is one of the few DIY projects that worked out perfectly. Not sure for how long the little relays hold up, but so far, not a single problem at all.

Thanks to the battery backup it is holding time extremely well, not affected by power outages.

Thanks for asking... very recommended if you don't mind soldering a few wires. I had a few PM's asking for specifics... don't be shy and post your solution if you built one.


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