# Which t5 fixture with good reflectors?



## Undertow (Dec 21, 2012)

The best bang for the buck I think is the oddyssea T5ho fixtures. I have 2 of them and they seem to have really good reflectors. They also have a really nice price


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

I have a relatively inexpensive hydroponic unit over my 75 (48" 4 bulb). It has a wide body and great reflectors. Was like 120 bucks and came with some bulbs. 

Mine is a sage colored version of this one Grow Crew HO T5 4?, 4 Bulb Fixture w/ Bulbs - WHITE Seems they only have white one atm.

Here's a review - Grow Crew T5 HO 4 feet 4 bulb review


Amazon also has quite a few brands. I like this one - Amazon.com: MILLIARD 2-FT/4-Bulb T5 Grow Light System: Patio, Lawn & Garden , but it only has one switch. So that's something to think about 


Anyway, Ive been very happy with mine for about 15 months now.


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

Undertow said:


> The best bang for the buck I think is the oddyssea T5ho fixtures. I have 2 of them and they seem to have really good reflectors. They also have a really nice price


Thanks, gonna check into this. Too bad Amazon doesn't have them, I'd overnight it haha.



burr740 said:


> I have a relatively inexpensive hydroponic unit over my 75 (48" 4 bulb). It has a wide body and great reflectors. Was like 120 bucks and came with some bulbs.
> 
> Mine is a sage colored version of this one Grow Crew HO T5 4?, 4 Bulb Fixture w/ Bulbs - WHITE Seems they only have white one atm.
> 
> ...


Nice, I was wondering about the lights like these. I will look into them also. I see two switches, but one plug. Any way to run them on a controller to have 2 lights and 4 lights? I guess though over my tank suspended I could run all 4 bulbs and just raise it to control the intensity so it wouldn't matter all that much. Does that sound right?


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## BigJay180 (Jul 20, 2014)

Lookup Catalina, I went with one of those. I have two 3X39 watt fixtures over a 180 gallon tank with good reflectors.

Catalina Aquarium - Catalina Aquarium

The Odyssea are OK for the money. They do the job but the reflectors aren't very good, and the bulbs they come with are garbage. Replace the bulbs at least if you go that way.


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

BigJay180 said:


> Lookup Catalina, I went with one of those. I have two 3X39 watt fixtures over a 180 gallon tank with good reflectors.Aquarium - Catalina Aquarium
> 
> The Odyssea are OK for the money. They do the job but the reflectors aren't very good, and the bulbs they come with are garbage. Replace the bulbs at least if you go that way.


Are they still making fixtures? I emailed them I'd say 5 months ago and they told me (after like 2 weeks waiting) that they weren't making them anymore. I originally wanted to go with them and a 3 bulb would be perfect.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

bsantucci said:


> Nice, I was wondering about the lights like these. I will look into them also. I see two switches, but one plug. Any way to run them on a controller to have 2 lights and 4 lights? I guess though over my tank suspended I could run all 4 bulbs and just raise it to control the intensity so it wouldn't matter all that much. Does that sound right?


Two switches, two ballasts, one plug. So to run it on a timer it's all 4 or nothing. That's what I do, although been meaning to wire another plug into it to be able to run a 2-4-2 schedule. Just havent got around to it


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

burr740 said:


> Two switches, two ballasts, one plug. So to run it on a timer it's all 4 or nothing. That's what I do, although been meaning to wire another plug into it to be able to run a 2-4-2 schedule. Just havent got around to it


Thanks again. I'm gonna have to keep looking for the perfect fixture. Don't have time to tinker anymore since the baby came. Maybe i'll just stick it out with the BML's for a bit more.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

bsantucci said:


> Thanks again. I'm gonna have to keep looking for the perfect fixture. Don't have time to tinker anymore since the baby came. Maybe i'll just stick it out with the BML's for a bit more.


What height above the water do you have it at? width of tank?
As to t5.. just buy 3:
Amazon.com : Sunblaster 904298 NanoTech T5 High Output Fixture Reflector Combo, 4-Feet : Plant Growing Lamps : Patio, Lawn & Garden


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

jeffkrol said:


> What height above the water do you have it at? width of tank?
> As to t5.. just buy 3:
> Amazon.com : Sunblaster 904298 NanoTech T5 High Output Fixture Reflector Combo, 4-Feet : Plant Growing Lamps : Patio, Lawn & Garden


Those look promising. I'll look into them more thanks! 

The BMLs are hung about ten inches above the tank. So 25 inches above the substrate. Tank is 18 inches wide. 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

jeffkrol said:


> What height above the water do you have it at? width of tank?
> As to t5.. just buy 3:
> Amazon.com : Sunblaster 904298 NanoTech T5 High Output Fixture Reflector Combo, 4-Feet : Plant Growing Lamps : Patio, Lawn & Garden


Ive almost bought some of these a couple different times. The thing that stands out to me is how shallow the reflector seems to be. By that I mean it doesnt look like it comes down as far as the bulb does. That is going to create an awful lot of spillage into the room.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

burr740 said:


> Ive almost bought some of these a couple different times. The thing that stands out to me is how shallow the reflector seems to be. By that I mean it doesnt look like it comes down as far as the bulb does. That is going to create an awful lot of spillage into the room.


you be the judge..
https://youtu.be/2J6eRC7ZZpw
https://youtu.be/PgLxMfUx8Ow
Those nano particle parabolic are pretty efficient..


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

jeffkrol said:


> you be the judge..
> https://youtu.be/2J6eRC7ZZpw
> https://youtu.be/PgLxMfUx8Ow
> Those nano particle parabolic are pretty efficient..


Right. This is exactly what Im talking about. I know those nano reflectors are supposed to be highly.....reflective. But it barely comes down to the bulb's halfway point.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

but if you think about it it would be pointless, and wasteful to allow a spread of more than 120 degrees or so.. Much like most LED's..
They do advertise them as "wide coverage".. 
Allowing light to go out at 180 degrees, or only a little less, sure wouldn't help you sell "efficiency"... 

I guess they are just close to the surface type lighting.. 

I'd have to see one in person. Couldn't find a real good image of the spread ..


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

jeffkrol said:


> but if you think about it it would be pointless, and wasteful to allow a spread of more than 120 degrees or so.. Much like most LED's..
> They do advertise them as "wide coverage"..
> Allowing light to go out at 180 degrees, or only a little less, sure wouldn't help you sell "efficiency"...
> 
> ...


Im not sure you understand my point. When the reflector is deep enough so that the bulbs are even with, or slightly above the bottom of the reflector, then there is very little light spillage out into the room. It also makes it pleasant to look at from eye level, or a foot or two below eye level - like for example sitting on the couch.

Im too lazy to go turn mine on and take a picture, but here's one of Tom's old 120. This is what a deep reflector looks like when viewed from such a level. 










Now take another look at the reflector on the Sunblasster. Notice how far the actual bulb sticks out below it? Imagine trying to view a tank with those on it. You'd be staring at the bottom half of a bare bulb.


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

burr740 said:


> Im not sure you understand my point. When the reflector is deep enough so that the bulbs are even with, or slightly above the bottom of the reflector, then there is very little light spillage out into the room. It also makes it pleasant to look at from eye level, or a foot or two below eye level - like for example sitting on the couch.
> 
> Im too lazy to go turn mine on and take a picture, but here's one of Tom's old 120. This is what a deep reflector looks like when viewed from such a level.
> 
> ...


Probably how I feel viewing my tank my with my BMLs ten inches above. It's not a lot of fun. That's another reason I'm looking into t5s. I'm going to reach out to catalina again and hope they are making lights again. If not, an ATI sunfire may be the best option for me. Bit overkill but I do love the sunrise sunset ability I have with these multi channel leds and to have that with t5s would be nice. 

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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

burr740 said:


> Im not sure you understand my point. When the reflector is deep enough so that the bulbs are even with, or slightly above the bottom of the reflector, then there is very little light spillage out into the room.


i have been partially agreeing w/ you all along. 
but if you look at the wall in thatphoto above you will see a lot of light is spilling into the room.. It is only a matter of where you are viewing it..
From the camera point of view, dropping a few inches down may change your opinion.

I'm not sure any reflectors are designed to be, say, true spot lights..

http://www.lightingassociates.org/i...Qs_Reflector_Design__Why_is_it_important_.pdf
nice ray tracing here..

Guess I've never really mentioned that no matter the light in most cases (some well designed spot PAR lamps ect) you will usually need an ancillary skirt..

Really would like to se a ray trace of the sunblaster..
They sort of cheat here..


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

I'm going to give my BML's a chance mounted on the rim and lower the intensity. Since I have two of them, I really shouldn't need to worry about spread on the tank even top mounted as long as I position them well.

At least I think so.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

bsantucci said:


> I'm going to give my BML's a chance mounted on the rim and lower the intensity. Since I have two of them, I really shouldn't need to worry about spread on the tank even top mounted as long as I position them well.
> 
> At least I think so.


sounds like a plan..


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

I'm stubborn if nothing else.. 
more light spill than I'd care for but.. not too bad ..

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/12-tank-journals/163954-mahkos-ohko-stone-journal-7.html


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

I'm tempted to try 2 of them connected though. Even if I needed 3, it's $144. Debatable though for that price when I could get a fixture like Burr mentioned for around the same.

Still going to give the BML's a shot tank mounted and reduced intensity. They really do produce nice light.

I've been playing with the channel controls lately and doing higher white and red lighting and lower blue/green. Produces a very nice color. I'm just not sure how it's affecting actual PAR values though on the tank.
@jeffkrol, since you are the resident LED guru it seems, do you think reduced blue/green channel will lower intensity much? I think most comes from the white and red?


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## thegirlundertherainbow (Aug 12, 2004)

bsantucci said:


> Thanks, gonna check into this. Too bad Amazon doesn't have them, I'd overnight it haha.


Amazon had them a few months ago as I got one.. maybe they'll get them again


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

bsantucci said:


> I've been playing with the channel controls lately and doing higher white and red lighting and lower blue/green. Produces a very nice color. I'm just not sure how it's affecting actual PAR values though on the tank.
> @*jeffkrol*, since you are the resident LED guru it seems, do you think reduced blue/green channel will lower intensity much? I think most comes from the white and red?


PAR is defined by the vis. spectrum from 400-700nm.. Changing "color" (assuming quantum output is equal) doesn't change "recorded PAR" or shouldn't (sensor inaccuracies ignored) . Now "effective" spectrum (PUR) is another story..and unfortunately is not only species specific but also really not measured w/ any common instruments..

bottom line, shifting tone while maintaining intensity is a "wash"...for the most part.

PS Really don't consider myself a guru, just wasted a lot of time the past few years in brushing up on my Botany..
And I do profess a love of solid state lighting..

Decreasing light always decreases PAR, regardless of color.. just some are a wee bit more than others..

and I love charts..


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

jeffkrol said:


> PAR is defined by the vis. spectrum from 400-700nm.. Changing "color" (assuming quantum output is equal) doesn't change "recorded PAR" or shouldn't (sensor inaccuracies ignored) . Now "effective" spectrum (PUR) is another story..and unfortunately is not only species specific but also really not measured w/ any common instruments..
> 
> bottom line, shifting tone while maintaining intensity is a "wash"...for the most part.
> 
> ...


Thanks Jeff!

So changing the "color" is actually a change in intensity with these lights. You can only increase or decrease the Red, White, or Blue/Green channels. That is how you effectively change the color on these devices.

So I'm assuming decreasing the blue/green channel is going to decrease PAR to an extent, just not sure how much. I will just go with it for a bit and see how the plants react. I'm less scientific and more into real response. Granted, I get things to an extent, but once math comes into play and numbers are thrown around my brain hurts


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

bsantucci said:


> Thanks Jeff!
> 
> So changing the "color" is actually a change in intensity with these lights. You can only increase or decrease the Red, White, or Blue/Green channels. That is how you effectively change the color on these devices.
> 
> So I'm assuming decreasing the blue/green channel is going to decrease PAR to an extent, just not sure how much. I will just go with it for a bit and see how the plants react. I'm less scientific and more into real response. Granted, I get things to an extent, but once math comes into play and numbers are thrown around my brain hurts


Consider all diodes on = 100% PAR..
IF the dimming is linear say you shut one channel off (assume 2) you would have 50% less PAR..

IF you had 3 channels and shut one completely off (other 2 on full) PAR wil decrease by 1/3 (33%)

If you have 3 channels and cut one down 50% you lose 16.6%

Dimming one channel of 3 25% or less (8% or less) really affects PAR very little. 
Visually is another story.. human eye sensitivity and all that..


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

jeffkrol said:


> Consider all diodes on = 100% PAR..
> IF the dimming is linear say you shut one channel off (assume 2) you would have 50% less PAR..
> 
> IF you had 3 channels and shut one completely off (other 2 on full) PAR wil decrease by 1/3 (33%)
> ...


Very good, that makes sense and that's good to hear. 

Basically like you said, I'm running channel 1 and 2 at 75% and 3 at 55%. So there isn't much difference, just enough like you said to warm it up to my eyes.

Thanks for the explanations!


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

I have a 4 bulb Catalina on my 75g. I'm now going to replace them with a similar model to Burr740. The reason being is that the spread is terrible. All 4 bulbs are pretty much side by side. Maybe a half inch to an inch apart. Granted each bulb is separated by a reflector, but the fixture is only maybe 1/3 of the width of my tank. This all adds up to a lot of light being forced into the center. The fixture does light up the whole tank, but its definitely less in the front and back than it should be, and accounts for the fixture getting hotter than it should. With out forking over $400 plus dollars on an ATI unit, I think the best replication of these lights are hydroponic T5HO fixtures. 

Catalilna had great customer service, and the light was nice, and for a $130 with bulbs you cant go wrong. At least I thought until I seen some of the hydro setups for around the same price. 

IMHO if your going to go T5HO stay away from lights designed for aquariums. They're going to charge you more for less. All of the brands like Aquatic Life, Coralife, etc etc are overpriced, and they are not as good. Some are pretty much junk IMHO. Minus Aquatic Life of course, but when you consider the price difference to a Hydro unit they don't even compare. 

There are a few concerns for me in regards to going with a Hydroponic T5HO light though. For starters there seems to be a lot of generic brands, and its hard to tell which ones are tried and true, and last but not least most of them are built to grow terrestrial plants in a commercial environment so they are not very aesthetically pleasing. It can be hard to find a fixture that looks good or doesn't look like it belongs in a shop.

Here are a few I'm thinking of going with:











If anyone has any experience with either of these lights plz let me know.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Thing about the hydrofarm is it only has one switch. You may think that you'll always want to run 4 or nothing, but the ability to do 2 at a time comes in very handy.

The Badboy looks wickedly awesome, but same issue I believe only one switch?


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

burr740 said:


> Thing about the hydrofarm is it only has one switch. You may think that you'll always want to run 4 or nothing, but the ability to do 2 at a time comes in very handy.
> 
> The Badboy looks wickedly awesome, but same issue I believe only one switch?


Yeah I was thinking the same thing. One of my favorite things about my Catalina is that it has 3 plugs/switches.


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

BayazGouramiz said:


> I have a 4 bulb Catalina on my 75g. I'm now going to replace them with a similar model to Burr740. The reason being is that the spread is terrible. All 4 bulbs are pretty much side by side. Maybe a half inch to an inch apart. Granted each bulb is separated by a reflector, but the fixture is only maybe 1/3 of the width of my tank. This all adds up to a lot of light being forced into the center. The fixture does light up the whole tank, but its definitely less in the front and back than it should be, and accounts for the fixture getting hotter than it should. With out forking over $400 plus dollars on an ATI unit, I think the best replication of these lights are hydroponic T5HO fixtures.
> 
> Catalilna had great customer service, and the light was nice, and for a $130 with bulbs you cant go wrong. At least I thought until I seen some of the hydro setups for around the same price.
> 
> ...


Thanks for all this info. Catalina was definitely one I was interested in, but they aren't making lights anymore.

I decided to try a new LED light, Aquatic Life's Halo Freshwater. It's arriving tomorrow. Going to try running a single light with the 110 degree lense and see if that gives me the coverage I need. If not, I'll grab a second. Really like what I am seeing and hearing about this light. We'll see if it lives up to the hype.


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

bsantucci said:


> Thanks for all this info. Catalina was definitely one I was interested in, but they aren't making lights anymore.
> 
> I decided to try a new LED light, Aquatic Life's Halo Freshwater. It's arriving tomorrow. Going to try running a single light with the 110 degree lense and see if that gives me the coverage I need. If not, I'll grab a second. Really like what I am seeing and hearing about this light. We'll see if it lives up to the hype.


Yeah its to bad they dont make fixtures anymore... I think the one I got was one of the last ones. They were selling them all for super cheap and it seemed like they were going out of business. 

That is a weird looking light, looks like its really good though. Let us know how it works out, I plan on switching to LED's on my low tech tank soon. 

Burr you are lucky you got a black unit.... all they have are white ones now! Its so hard to find a dual switch 4x4 fixture let alone one that isnt white... I may waitfor my tax return and get a good ATI unit. Prolly need new bulbs to cuz my bulbs are always so hot 

oh yeah Santucci do you still have some Brevipes? cuz if so I'd like to buy some from you, that plant was so lame for me, but I moved a stem that almost died and it got all robust and super cool looking. It actually became one of my favorite plants. The pinna was cool too, but it to has perished due to a month long compete neglect of the tank... finally got ferts dialed in an everything is looking better than ever. I dont like Pinna though cuz its so hard to find a good place for it. Burr has found a great place for his though. I love buying [censored][censored][censored][censored] for my tank :nerd:


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

BayazGouramiz said:


> Yeah its to bad they dont make fixtures anymore... I think the one I got was one of the last ones. They were selling them all for super cheap and it seemed like they were going out of business.
> 
> That is a weird looking light, looks like its really good though. Let us know how it works out, I plan on switching to LED's on my low tech tank soon.
> 
> ...


Hah wish I had it still, but I sold it all and moved into another direction with my tank. It is an awesome plant when growing well. I'm honing in ferts in my tank now, specifically micro's, so I may try it again in the future. It stunted a lot with me, but so do a lot of my plants, I think as a result of micro's.

I'll update back here when I get the new LED going tomorrow night.....can't wait.

Agree it's bulky, but function over form for me. 2 BMLs over my tank with a hanging fixture isn't exactly not bulky either


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Interested to hear what you think of that Halo...


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

I went with one of these lil crappers( 



 ) I'll let you know how it works out.


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## SwampGremlin (Dec 5, 2014)

Enviro gro T5 fixture is working well for me and the price is very reasonable.


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## birdermom (Jun 10, 2013)

Enviro grow.....does this "spill" light into the room when hung?


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

BayazGouramiz said:


> I went with one of these lil crappers( Amazon.com : ViaVolt T5 HO Fluorescent Fixture, 4' - 4 Lamp : Plant Growing Light Bulbs : Patio, Lawn & Garden ) I'll let you know how it works out.


The light is here and I finally have it up... The reflectors are tweaked a bit towards the sides, and they don't sit flush. Other than that they seem okay so far. Went from a spread of 7.25 inches to 13.5, what a huge difference. Fingers are crossed that the bulbs are still good.


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

BayazGouramiz said:


> The light is here and I finally have it up... The reflectors are tweaked a bit towards the sides, and they don't sit flush. Other than that they seem okay so far. Went from a spread of 7.25 inches to 13.5, what a huge difference. Fingers are crossed that the bulbs are still good.


Can you take a photo? Curious how it looks. 

I've been running my Halos for a week and absolutely love them. 

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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

bsantucci said:


> Can you take a photo? Curious how it looks.
> 
> I've been running my Halos for a week and absolutely love them.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


Yeah for sure. Tomorrow after work when the lights are on, I will take a pic.


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

bsantucci said:


> Can you take a photo? Curious how it looks.
> 
> I've been running my Halos for a week and absolutely love them.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


Here are a few pics:







[/ATTACH][/ATTACH]

The pics kind of suck I know. Phone camera is all that I have atm.

Lets see some pics of your new lights.


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## bsantucci (Sep 30, 2013)

BayazGouramiz said:


> Here are a few pics:
> 
> View attachment 576409
> [/ATTACH][/ATTACH]
> ...


Nice looks great. I'll have to consider that if and when I get a bigger house for a bigger tank haha. 

Here's my new lights. 



















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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

Nice tank man, it looks great. I really like the lights to btw. Some day I will have a rimless, so jealous


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## Emmanuel (Nov 7, 2013)

Why is it that for all those grow lights, I don't see ballast in the fixtures? Just bulbs and plugs. T5 doesn't require ballast to function?


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## Emmanuel (Nov 7, 2013)

For example.. 









Can any engineer enlighten me why I don't see any ballast?

Thank you.


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## BayazGouramiz (May 13, 2015)

Emmanuel said:


> For example..
> 
> View attachment 576585
> 
> ...


The T5HO's have them they are just out of sight behind the reflector. Not sure about LED's


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