# Dirt tank and what to add???



## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Not sure if this is the right soil but I just picked up a bag of Mircale Grow Organic Garden Soil with peak moss and manure. It seems that many are using the Potting Mix instead of the Garden Soil. I screened the dirt out of large chunks of woods. Is this the "right" dirt to use? I haven't added water yet because I am waiting on some laterite to arrive and to mix them in with the dirt. Do I need to add anything else with the dirt? I have a full bottle of Osomocote. Should I even add some with the dirt? Before I will cap the dirt with some fine gravels, I should mix the dirt with some water until I get mud, maybe need to do this for couple of days?

Thanks....


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## Tabberwok (Jan 31, 2013)

in one of my nanos I used that kind of dirt (MG organic garden soil) but didn't mix any fertilizer into it at all. I did wet the dirt before capping though, but only enough to moisten it and make it firmer and easier to cap. It worked for me and I'm getting good growth and not having any problems with livestock


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Tabberwok said:


> in one of my nanos I used that kind of dirt (MG organic garden soil) but didn't mix any fertilizer into it at all. I did wet the dirt before capping though, but only enough to moisten it and make it firmer and easier to cap. It worked for me and I'm getting good growth and not having any problems with livestock



Thanks. Hmm...I think I have my answer. The manure may not be desirable but I don't expect to put any fish in there for a while. So, I am going to stick with this soil. And it was only $7 for a 40lb dirt. I believe the potting mix (no manure in it?) is $13 at Homedepot. Yeah, I am presoaking the dirt right now. Couldn't drain all the water and I am sure a lot of the water would either evaporate or get soaked up by the soil in couple of days. I think I am going to mix the laterite and that's about it.


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## wrm130 (Jan 16, 2013)

I use this dirt in all my tanks. 10 of them Everything from shrimp to apistos and plecos, which all breed like crazy!No problems. I also use ridiculous amounts of light with no algae issues either. Fluorite, clay or other ferts I haven't played around with at all and the tanks looks and grows great.

Add your dirt, wet it pretty thoroughly, cap it and fill the tank GENTLY ie: use a small airline to siphon in water. Try to plant the tank heavily immediately. The dirt will cycle the tank for you. There you go, done


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

wrm130 said:


> I use this dirt in all my tanks. 10 of them Everything from shrimp to apistos and plecos, which all breed like crazy!No problems. I also use ridiculous amounts of light with no algae issues either. Fluorite, clay or other ferts I haven't played around with at all and the tanks looks and grows great.
> 
> Add your dirt, wet it pretty thoroughly, cap it and fill the tank GENTLY ie: use a small airline to siphon in water. Try to plant the tank heavily immediately. The dirt will cycle the tank for you. There you go, done


That's good to know. I thought the manure could cause problems....


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## wrm130 (Jan 16, 2013)

%@^%@ I"M SOOOOO SORRY!!!!!

I misread!!!!!! I use the organic potting soil!!!!!!!!
I hope its not too late!!!!


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## Django (Jun 13, 2012)

tetra73 said:


> That's good to know. I thought the manure could cause problems....


I wish I could tell you all the why's about why manure is bad in a fishtank, but I'm a noob really in this area. I think manure will produce ammonia as it is broken down, and it smells anyway.

I would reemphasize planting a great deal of fast growing stem plants right away. Over 50% of the surface area of the substrate. They will take up Ammonia and Nitrate and maybe Nitrate from your water and start the momentum of the processes just starting. I really think it's worth the investment, even if you don't want them all forever.


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## Django (Jun 13, 2012)

wrm130 said:


> %@^%@ I"M SOOOOO SORRY!!!!!
> 
> I misread!!!!!! I use the organic potting soil!!!!!!!!
> I hope its not too late!!!!


I'm wid you, bud!


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

wrm130 said:


> %@^%@ I"M SOOOOO SORRY!!!!!
> 
> I misread!!!!!! I use the organic potting soil!!!!!!!!
> I hope its not too late!!!!



Too late for what???  Is ok. I will stick with this soil. Not sure how much manure is left because I think I screened them out already. I am just seeing some small branches and peat moss. The bigger stuff is not there or maybe only a little. I have no intentions to add fish for at least a month.


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Django said:


> I wish I could tell you all the why's about why manure is bad in a fishtank, but I'm a noob really in this area. I think manure will produce ammonia as it is broken down, and it smells anyway.
> 
> I would reemphasize planting a great deal of fast growing stem plants right away. Over 50% of the surface area of the substrate. They will take up Ammonia and Nitrate and maybe Nitrate from your water and start the momentum of the processes just starting. I really think it's worth the investment, even if you don't want them all forever.



I will see how it goes. I don't believe I have much manure left after screening the bigger chucks out. I am not smelling anything right now. It may take a bit longer to become safe for fish but that's ok. I have no plans to add fish any time soon. As for algae issue, this is a low light tank. I may not going to add plants that soon, at least waiting for the water to clear up a bit first. I am planning to use some of my bio media from my other tanks to start the cycle quicker.


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## wrm130 (Jan 16, 2013)

If you are using the manure soil, I'd suggest planting the tank as heavily as you possibly can...to avoid algae.

The rest sounds good
Be interesting to see how it turns out.


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## Jnad (Aug 17, 2012)

Hello!

Dont be afraid of the manure, i used soil containing 30% cow manure in these two tanks in this tread:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=266170&highlight=

Jnad


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Here is an update. I flooded the tank this past Sat. I have been doing 80% WC with aged, treated water (10 hours+) daily until this morning. I am getting 95% water clarity here. I did add 2 big tsps of purigen though. I am also using a sizable, established bio medias from my other tank. Phosphate level is around 3ppm. Don't have a nitrate kit. GH is around 5 degree. KH is about 2 degree. Currently, just planted 10 stems of Blyxa Japonica. No, they aren't pearling yet.  I have been poking the substrate with a pair of scissors and didn't see any big bubbles coming up. No strange smell coming from the water either. I do kind of worry that the substrate by the middle of the tank is a bit too thin. Maybe less than 1 inch of dirt. I am planning to carpet the area and not intending to plant any big root feeders in the middle though.

Here is the tank. Yeah, this is an old 20g Long tank. There are some carbonated stain I couldn't get rid of yet....










I am using a 48" shop light from Lowes and 2 6500k t8 bulbs. They are only 3" above the water. Just waiting for the weather to get cooler to order some Marselia minuta for the tank carpet...


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## wrm130 (Jan 16, 2013)

Tank is looking great! Super clear! Purigen is some GOOD stuff! I'd suggest more plants though, asap

You probably won't see gas pockets in the substrate for another week or so. If it concerns you MTS snails work well...and a friend of mine has had very good success using undergravel heating to promote flow in deeper substrate areas.

ps. the only plant that pearls in my dirted tanks is baby tears.


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

wrm130 said:


> Tank is looking great! Super clear! Purigen is some GOOD stuff! I'd suggest more plants though, asap
> 
> You probably won't see gas pockets in the substrate for another week or so. If it concerns you MTS snails work well...and a friend of mine has had very good success using undergravel heating to promote flow in deeper substrate areas.
> 
> ps. the only plant that pearls in my dirted tanks is baby tears.



Thanks. Still deciding which plants to use for carpeting. I have a lot of chainwords from my other tank. However, I want something different. Unfortunately, I can't get them locally. Decisions...decisions, decisions...


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## wrm130 (Jan 16, 2013)

Additional info: Your nitrates will probably stay low or non-existent. In my 16g I had 23 neons, 2 bushynose and 5 juvenile apisto cacatuoides and 100+ shrimp. The tank only ever tested 5ppm nitrate. Yes they're low bioload fish but still.


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

wrm130 said:


> Additional info: Your nitrates will probably stay low or non-existent. In my 16g I had 23 neons, 2 bushynose and 5 juvenile apisto cacatuoides and 100+ shrimp. The tank only ever tested 5ppm nitrate. Yes they're low bioload fish but still.



Just tested my nitrates and it turns out I have ZERO. Is kind of odd for a dirt tank though. Is possible my daily water change 80% for the past 3 days reduced my nitrate to very little. My Blyxa Japonica have been in the tank for total of 2 days and been dosing excel. I believe I have high light right now. That effectively gives me zero nitrates. Anyway, I just dosed some KNO3 (about 7ppm) and K. Phosphate level has been stable, about 3ppm. I didn't bother to test ammonia because it should be zero since I am using a sizable established bio media from my other tank. So, why are people having problems with their dirt tank having excessive organic contents in the water?


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## wrm130 (Jan 16, 2013)

Lol I don't know why people are having problems with organics in the water...There are lots of people who say this and that about dirted tanks(mostly negative)...and most likely never having tried one. Kudos to you for giving it a go! With your dosing skills and knowledge I'm sure it'll be amazing!

Expect a little algae (most likely brown) in the coming weeks. And don't be scared to do huge water changes. The dirt will hold you cycle.


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## VJM (Feb 9, 2013)

I think some folks try to use a cap that is either too thin and breaks open, or had too large a grain size. 

When the cap breaks, I suppose it could cause a spike but I have never experienced one. Even in my first tank, where the cap was waaaay thin and I rescaped all the time.


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

wrm130 said:


> Lol I don't know why people are having problems with organics in the water...There are lots of people who say this and that about dirted tanks(mostly negative)...and most likely never having tried one. Kudos to you for giving it a go! With your dosing skills and knowledge I'm sure it'll be amazing!
> 
> Expect a little algae (most likely brown) in the coming weeks. And don't be scared to do huge water changes. The dirt will hold you cycle.



I decided to carpet my tank with my chainswords. Is free. They have been conditioned to thrive in my water and current water temperature (84 to 86 degree). It would be interesting to see how well they grow with dirt. I also replanted my ludwigia ovalis from my high tech tank to this one since they aren't so good looking because my Black Neon tetra have been eating the leaves. I salvaged whatever I could and to plant them in the corners. Looks like this low tech tank would have medium high to high lighting. The first sign of algae I would have to raise the light a bit.


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Here is my low tech 20g, dosing with excel and EI dosing once per week. All of these plants are from my high tech tank, except the Japonica Blyxa. Everything is growing nicely and the tank has been up for a bit over 1 week.


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

dirt works (so we don't have too :smile
off to a great looking start


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

wkndracer said:


> dirt works (so we don't have too :smile
> off to a great looking start



Occasionally, I see bubbles coming up though. I am not smelling anything and so I don't even bother to poke the substrate.... I am amazed the tank water got clear up within 3 days. With my high tech dirt tank, it has been up for 4 days and the water is still a bit cloudy.


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

Unless you see mounding where things were flat before I don't see the gas as any concern. Even then just free the gas releasing it and move on to other things. 
Even if you poke the sub and it does have odor it passes 99.999% without issue. Having a bunch of soggy dirt here it's never caused any critter problems. Even had a pocket of anaerobics large enough to turn reopen roots black and rot the stems, angelfish spawned the same week. Tannins are my pet peeve but they pass over time. 
Knowledge debunks most of these concerns when you understand what's going on.


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