# JG's 40G breeder (Retired 5.8.10)



## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

So I posted this morning with no intention of doing anything today... well it was just too nice out. Its still 64F and its almost 6:30 in the evening. Gotta love the southern weather. After riding with a buddy to pick out some bat houses I started having a few and decided to go ahead and have at cleaning up the tank. 
It didn't take too much to whip it into shape and I managed to test fill it for a while... don't worry its level and all four sides are touching all the way. 
Gonna bleach it out a few more times to kill anything that could have been present and rinse it like a madman. The paint ended up being latex and most of it peeled right off. It took a little more detail work to get the over-spray off of the plastic rim. There is only one >tiny< spot that I couldn't manage to get off of the front glass... it looks like a spot of rust or something.










I had a random 1.25 inch PVC cap laying around that I just barely managed to get on the bulkhead enough to test using some teflon tape. The threading is obviously different. I'd love to hear any thoughts about plumbing either the intake or return there or should I just skip it and plug it... the way I figure it the tank is drilled already why not use that to my advantage?

I also snagged a stand today made for up to 80 gallon tanks (50x20x30). Might set that up tomorrow depending on how lazy I want to be.  

Cheers


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Wow! Looks like it cleaned up great!


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## rwong2k (Dec 24, 2004)

wow, what a big difference after cleaning it up !


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks guys. I'm quite happy also with how well it cleaned up... I'm sure the wife will be too.


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## Cwhite (Dec 16, 2007)

MrJG said:


> So I posted this morning with no intention of doing anything today... well it was just too nice out. Its still 64F and its almost 6:30 in the evening. Gotta love the southern weather.


Very funny..just had to rub it in didn't you...


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

lol! Sorry bout that Cwhite, the weather makes up for itself in the summer time when its 90F and 85% humidity. 

Since this got brought back up I have a little dilemma... I should probably post this in the equipment section to have a better chance for suggestions.

The hole in the tank is 2 inches. The bulkhead that is there already is 1 1/4 inches inner diameter. I'm struggling with the idea of capping it off or feeding the intake side of the filter from there.

I was looking at some of DiabloCanine's excellent threads last night where he's drilled and fitted the intake and return to ports. Looks like almost all of his hardware came from marinedepot.com.... which I glared at for waay too long last night.

To do the intake idea I need 4 parts since I have to step down the sizing.

1" double threaded bulkhead made to fit a 1 3/4" hole
Threaded overflow strainer 1"

Of course with the 1" coming out I need to step that down to 3/4 to match the 5/8 tubing from the XP2 as closely as possible.
Bushing Fitting - 1 inch MPT x 3/4 inch FPT
Then the 3/4 barbed elbow for the intake hose.
Insert Elbow Fitting - 3/4 inch MPT x 3/4 inch Insert

I *think* I got that right. Everything hinges on whether or not the 1" bulkhead thats made to fit in a 1 3/4" hole will fit in the 2" hole and make the seal. 1/4 inch is quite a difference but I know the flange portion of the bulkhead is quite a bit larger than the inner diameter. To get anything larger diameter wise it jumps to a schedule 80 fitting which is a good bit more bulky. This is where I could could use some experienced advice. Will this work?

Looking at all the cool plumbing on peoples threads make me itch to try this. Along with indiboi's nice and simple semi-auto water change hookups I'm also considering trying to duplicate Diablocanine's heater/co2 manifold for the output side.

Looks like my simple idea for a new tank setup is starting to morph a bit...


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## AaronT (Apr 11, 2004)

I think you might be better off using the bulkhead spot as the return as you were originally planning. If you have the intake strainer that high in the tank you'll likely get a large buildup of detritis on the bottom of the tank. You could use that modular loc line stuff to make a return. 

Also, why not go with the XP3 instead of the XP2 and powerhead combo? I have an XP3 on my 90-P, which is roughly the same dimensions and it's plenty of flow by itself and cuts down on equipment in the tank.

You'll definitely want to upgrade the lights to at least 2 x 39 watt T5HO as well, even for the lower light setup you want. 

Congrats on the find. I've been scouring for a deal like this in my area for a little while now.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

AaronT: thanks for the advice. I've now had multiple folks recommend going with the larger canister so I'll certainly be on the lookout for deals on the xp3. 

As far as the lighting goes... like I said above the original idea is morphing a bit.  Thinking of using a 2x54w T5HO in addition to the 48W and doing pressurized co2 now. 

I'm not in a huge hurry to get running so I want to take my time and do everything nice and neat the first time. I'm concentrating on figuring out the plumbing first. 

Even using the port as a return I still have the same question regarding the bulkhead fitting in the hole and maintaining a seal. I know the bulkhead is only a $7 part but if I'm going to do this I'd like to order everything at once to save a bit on the shipping.


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## AaronT (Apr 11, 2004)

A decent LFS should have all of the bulkhead fittings. It's nice to get those in person to see how it all fits together. Take it from someone who tried to order all the plumbing supplies they needed online and came up short by one part. Doh!

The 2 x 54 watt fixture is too long for a 40 breeder. Why not just use the 2 x 39 watt, which is closest to 36" long?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Current USA Nova Extreme 36" 2x54W T-5 is what I was looking at... didn't realize that its not the HO model. The 2x54W HO is indeed 48 inches long. Thanks for the heads up. doh! Combo-ing up the 48W I have with the 2x39W will give me right around 3 wpg of HO goodness. I'm sure that would be fine given the depth of the tank. 

Is it just me or did the prices jump an amazing amount on these nova extreme fixtures recently? Actually nevermind that... went back to the original place I got my 2x24w extreme and the prices are in line. Just seems odd that one major online retailer has the same fixture for $110 more than another!! Yikes. 

I'll check with the local place on the plumbing supplies... good grief they price most stuff like it was made of love and pure gold though. Can't hurt to give them a try, it is a fairly nice store.

btw yes work is slow today.


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## cleekdafish (Jun 13, 2007)

problem with nova extreme fixtures..they have noisy fans.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Gotcha. I think the lower wattage fixtures are not fan cooled so I should be able to avoid the noise issue.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

No snazzy pics yet but parts are starting to flow in...

Got the stand put together and the tank sitting on top. Need to add some shelf liner under the tank and level everything up.

Order from Marine Depot came in with all of the parts to plumb the filter return to the new 1" bulkhead and use a loc-line sprayer. 
Got a decent priced brand new XP3 filter from Ganjero here on the Swap & Shop.
A hydor ETH 201 and coralife digital timer is in the way from eBayland. 
Tonight I managed to snag a 36" Current Orbit 2x96W PC fixture on eBay for $110 shipped!!! Its used but thats quite alright, I'll have to buy at least one new dual daylight bulb for it. Might even have to buy two but I couldn't pass up the deal. If it was someone on here that I snaked in the last 30 seconds of the auction... sorry 'bout that but all is fair in eBaying. :O I know it seems like a lot of light but I plan on staggering the banks, I learned my lesson last time and decided to get as much wattage as I could up front this time.

I'm thinking of trying to keep things simple and forgo hard plumbing too much to start. I'll go with a traditional glass diffuser for now as opposed to doing a reactor. I like seeing the bubbles. 

So I still need the CO2 equipment and a few timers which I'm searching about trying to find decent (dirt cheap) deals on. I've been in no major hurry on this tank and I've gotten some great prices on most stuff so far so I'm going to try to stay patient and wait for the right price. 

I'll be waiting until I have all of the hardware before I make my order from ADG for soil/rocks... then driftwood. I'm still going over layout ideas in my head, no sketches or anything but I have a decent handle on how I want to get started. 

Hang in there...

Edit: Oh and Aaron I know Charleston is a good ways from Maryland but I know at least one guy drove a u-haul truck down from VA to get quite a number of tanks from the same guy. He's got several storage buildings full of tanks that he bought on auction from stores if you get a group together. I can hook you up with his info if interested. He had 35-50 Gallon breeders, 15-55 G, 11-55G- drilled with overflows and others the last time I saw. Asking close to $1 Gallon on most everything.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*decided to not be lazy*

I was checking my email this morning when I turned to the tank and pieces all stacked up lying in wait for me to not be lazy... Maybe if I get everything else ready I'll make myself finish buying the pieces needed to get this puppy running.  

Everything needed to make the tank function is here already...









So I got busy placing some shelf liner I had lying around underneath and making sure everything was square. Then I did the plumbing followed by the electrical stuff. Its nothing fancy compared to some. Just tried to make everything clean and accessible. Thinking about adding in some quick disconnects in a few places before it really gets going.

Here is a snap of the back. Made sure to have a couple of drip loops and I could probably shorten the intake tubing a bit but I want to test the flow before I cut any more tubing.









A quick shot of the power center, all timers are programmed and running now for a test. The light is a 2x96W PC.
Front bank will run from 1-9 pm daily.
Back bank will run from 5-8 pm daily.
LEDs will run at lights out.
CO2 will come on at ~12:30 pm and shut down at ~8 pm.









Close up of the return, hope it works out ok. depending on flow I might get a "Y" and add another head. 









And lastly a fts of where the tank will rest. I'm still trying to figure out what to do about a background... the wood panelling just doesn't do it for looking "natural" haha. It should be fairly apparent also that nothing is leveled yet. My house was built in 1901 so most things around here are less than square. Heh. 









Done:
drop checker - trade w/rizoybot thanks dude. 
nice glass diffuser - rhinox 2000 on the way thanks tainted glory
CO2 tubing - ordered from rex
fertz - ordered from rex
thermometer - done
new bulb to replace actinic - ordered 
ADA dirt - 36 liters ordered today from adgshop
ADA sand - small bag of bright sand from adgshop
stone - cmlaracy chucked me a few rocks in the mail thanks dude 

Need:
CO2 tank! -
air pump of some sort for night use... i like aeration
install a GFCI outlet behind the tank
a freakin' python

Need to make a trip to the hardware store and see if I can find some kind of flexible plastic that I can cut/bend and silicone to the bottom to section the tank into "trays". Anybody have something specific that they can recommend?

...till next time


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

You know, I was just looking at this thread last night and wondering when you'd get it rockin'!

Looks like quite the setup you've got there.

GET SOME PLANTS IN IT!!!



I've got a drop checker for you. Typical ADA knockoff -- I think you've got the same one in yer 20.. Maybe some trade-type-action?

---->


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Sure thing man. Let me know when you are ready.


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

I'm VERY anxious to see this thing really up and running. It's gonna look great, I'm expecting a lot from you!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Haha. Thanks man. Its going to be a bit yet before I'm close to putting plants in considering my brain hasn't really finalized what kind of layout is going to happen. I have several ideas though... maybe something will hit me once all the layout stuff gets here, maybe not. I guess it depends on how the rocks crumble under the hammer. We'll see what happens. I've only done a few tanks so far and I learn something new every time. 

I do know that the 2.5g is getting a rescape before I start on this one, nothing crazy but I'm growing tired of the look. I have a trip to NY in early June and I don't anticipate filling the tank before then but then again I have the strange ability to get motivated at odd times. If it hits me I'll just roll with it.


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

MrJG said:


> Haha. Thanks man. Its going to be a bit yet before I'm close to putting plants in considering my brain hasn't really finalized what kind of layout is going to happen. I have several ideas though... maybe something will hit me once all the layout stuff gets here, maybe not. I guess it depends on how the rocks crumble under the hammer. We'll see what happens. I've only done a few tanks so far and I learn something new every time.
> 
> I do know that the 2.5g is getting a rescape before I start on this one, nothing crazy but I'm growing tired of the look. I have a trip to NY in early June and I don't anticipate filling the tank before then but then again I have the strange ability to get motivated at odd times. If it hits me I'll just roll with it.


Well you should certainly be careful that your hammer doesn't crumble under the rocks! They are seriously the most dense rocks I've ever held. You'll see what I mean when they arrive. I shipped them out today by the way, you should get them by wednesday or thursday. Good luck, and BE CAREFUL. I don't want you gettin hurt bro, they are some tough rocks! :thumbsup:


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

updates? how'd you make out with breaking those rocks?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

rocks - 0
4lb hammer - for great justice

Heh needless to say the zebra stone didn't fare well against my "Thor hammer". Its in much smaller to tiny pieces. I ended up re-scaping my 2.5g with the white bits that were left over... still waiting for the dust to settle a bit more before I can show pics. I made quite the mess and smashed much Aquasoil in the process. To those who plant hairgrass in anything bigger than this, my condolences to your back. 

As far as the 40 goes I'm in a holding pattern. Everything is here except the rhinox 2000 and I still haven't sourced a CO2 tank or a place to get it filled. 
I really can't decide on a direction for the tank. Due to my significant other switching jobs I'm having to divert hobby money for other fun things (sorry gotta go camping and see some shows). I'm not sure if there is even wood in the picture at this point. I've toyed with the idea of a dutch style layout... a farm tank... a non-nature aquarium park kind of layout with terraces... hell if my water wasn't so soft I'd probably consider a planted african tank. 

Who knows how it will end up. It'll hit me sooner or later. If I wasn't hung up on if I should use wood or not I'd probably have my hardscape done already. I'm one of those kind of folks that really just needs everything in front of me when I have that eureka moment and make up my mind. At least I know what kind of plants I want in it. 

I'd say at this point chances of this thing having water in it before mid-june is slim. Summer is my busiest time at work (rollouts) and I have a trip in early June. At best I'm hoping I can have ALL of the parts here and have the hardscape settled before then.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Oh well. I guess I have some wood on the way now hopefully. BCNF just posted a package that caught my eye... guess I better sell a few patches of HC to make up for it. :icon_eek:


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

update?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

no update. I have wood soaking in a 5g bucket.  

I gotta level this thing soon though before I start any hardscape. Its pretty jacked up and I'm not sure how to level the stand the way its built. Looks like if I just shim the front up that a good portion of the load bearing lower support will be lost.


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

How off-level is it?

The tank looks really well cleaned up! Are you able to access your heater from the inside of the stand?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Its off enough that you can tell by looking at it. 

On the external heater yes. Everything is just Velcro-ed to the back to make it clean. I just have to reach by the filter and unzip it. I put it back there because after you set the temp it really needs to be out of the way so it doesn't get bumped accidentally.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*Explosions in the sky*

mmm memorial day weekend. Time off... time to relax... right? Time to thank all of our active troops and veterans for having the honor and heart to serve our country no matter what the call. 

Only one of the 96W bulbs on. :icon_eek: 









Nothing more relaxing that working on a new tank.  Swapped the tank and piano positions in the room and leveled it up. I finally picked up a python today. I did a "dry" test which is more of a wet test in this situation. 
Telflon tapped up all the external bulkhead fittings and secured everything up good. Pulled the filer media/baskets and now its filled with the filter running testing water movement and fittings. I'm going to let it run for a few hours until I'm satisfied that everything is set then drain and dry everything out really well. The XP3 output through the sweeper fitting looks to be doing a great job moving the bubbles around the tank. 

The last major piece (10lb CO2 tank) should be here next week. Then I'll be on hiatus from doing anything with the tank until I get back from a trip mid-June. I can't fill it now and then leave... that and I need a freakin' TON of plant mass to suss out. 

Maybe if I'm motivated the rest of the long weekend I'll get down to business with this... looks like a tiny hardscape for a 40 breeder :icon_twis :


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Slowly but surely, eh?

This is gonna be sweet dude!


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

dont worry, once you get plants in there and fish and stuff, it wont look bright. youll probably be itching to get more light to get those red plants that final deep crimsom shade.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Heh yea slowly, sorry about all the buildup. I'm still trying to stick to my plan of funding everything for this tank from money I would otherwise be spending on cigarettes even though I've cheated once or twice. 
It just so happens that now that I have everything I have other things that are pushing the planting fun back. 

@[email protected]: the fixture is a 2x96W


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

Don't smoke 
Looks great so far! Are you going to really need all 192 watts?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Of course not  1 bulb is for a "noon burst" for 1-2 hours.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

thats some nice lighting, but later on when the tank is stable, you could increase the noontime light exposure. i have an insanely long noon burst in my 20L, but i do have an acrylic cover so that filters some of it out.
cant wait to see it nice and stocked.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*wip hardscape*

I could never decide if I wanted to go with a "nature aquarium" layout or try a dutch style so I kinda opted for both. Left side will be an attempt at packing contrasting plants together in this style and the right side I wanted to look like a mangrove at the edge of the water. Hopefully when it all works out they will work together. 

I wasn't feeling totally creative today but I reluctantly started work after coming back from doing some trap shooting. 

getting the sand and aquasoil in:









Soil in I started doing border and rock work:









I started with what I thought was a fairly large mound on the right to simulate the mangrove... I think it could really be a bit higher.



a little closer:


I still have a bag and a half of AS if I decide to rip it all up and make the mound bigger... either way I plan on adding a good bit more to the top/back of the mound. I figured I'd wait until I finalized the scape by siliconing the wood to the rocks. Thats what's good about taking it slow. I now have 2-3 weeks to walk by this thing every day and do little tweaks to the wood. 
Might scoop a little soil out to create a small valley between the right and left sides and more clearly define the slope around the rockwork...
and not to worry there will be a background on there by the time planting comes around. 

Thoughts/criticisms?


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

looks incredible, I wish I could have done something nice like that.


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## Digital (Apr 4, 2008)

Looks great so far. You must have to clean that tank VERY carefully when doing gravel vacs!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks guys. 

As far as gravel vacs go they will not happen very often. The rocks/wood will be siliconed together in their final positions so it should be a bit easier to plant/clean between them.


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

This is the slickest 40B I have ever seen. Very nice


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## crudnugget (Feb 5, 2008)

The way you have that set up with the wood touching the soil makes it look like a spider!

I just got a 40BR in trade, thinking of taking my 55 down and moving it into the 40. What are your thoughts about the footprint of your tank vs something narrower?


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

crudnugget said:


> The way you have that set up with the wood touching the soil makes it look like a spider!
> 
> I just got a 40BR in trade, thinking of taking my 55 down and moving it into the 40. What are your thoughts about the footprint of your tank vs something narrower?


I also like the way the wood comes down and touches the sand.

I have both 40 breeders and a 50 gal (same as 55 but shorter). I was getting frustrated scaping the 50 gal because of how narrow it was. I absolutely love the 40 breeder footprint. I really don't miss the extra length because I have more room front to back which enables me to get more hardscape in them.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks guys. So you think the hardscape looks alright as it sits? 

I think I'm going to scoop a bit of soil out of the left side this evening to see if it makes a bigger impact without the straight line going across and build up a nice slope leading up to the formation. I'll post some comparison pics unless I just decide that I like it better. 

crudnugget: I can't really comment too much on the narrower tanks. Since this and my 20 long were both purchased as planted tanks first I went with the most available depth and more shallow tank for lighting purposes. In my reading I found that both were highly sought after for doing planted layouts so I went with the flow. The 18 inches is deeep though, its going to take a lot of plant mass to start up and I can't wait.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

i like the driftwood arrangement, but maybe adding 1 or two branches going nearly straight up may make it a bit better (dont move the current ones though, unless you dont have any more).


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## lopez_316us (Jan 25, 2008)

Hey MrJG Where did you get the wood? I'm looking for something like that but in my local fish store don't have branches.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

lopez: Search for a thread in the swap & shop started by Badcopnofishtank titled manzanita i think. This is one of his "nano" packages


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Little help... or I might drive the wife crazy. She keeps walking by the tank saying "Leave it alone, it looks fine". Hehe. 

Original try:


a little closer:


New and improved swivel armed battle grip?:

a little closer...


I'm really not asking about wood/rock positioning but rather to leave the original full front to back slope or go with the valley between. I promise not to ask for help with anything else. :icon_twis


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

add a little rocks on the other side? Looks amazing!!!!! I like how the wood lunges toward you.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

i think the hills are too symetrical, just smooth out the one on the left a LITTLE bit, so its flatter. dont worry about what your wife says, work on your tank as much as you like, just dont forget there will be plants going in there (i have seen people forget that they will have plants in there and complain about it being "empty" and adding more and more rocks and wood until they go to plant and there is no room to stick in anything).


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

I like the layout, but the _only_ critique I have is that everything seems too equally divided... If you take a kind of squinty look at it, or take off your glasses if your vision is as bad as mine it looks like it's split 50/50, right down the middle. You might be able to offset this with plant groupings though.

But it's yr tank bro, and I can't wait to see how you plant it! I think it's gonna be super sweet! 

40 breeders and 20L's almost seem to made for planting, don't they?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks guys. Yea no more rocks or wood left so thats really not an option. lol. 

Now that I look at it I can see the split right down the middle. Honestly now that I'm looking at both side by side I think I like the original better. Its certainly going to give me a better chance to blend the dutch side in with the hardscape on the right without having to contend with what to do plant wise in the "valley". 

I know in the end I have to live with it.  But I have to get a new set of eyes on it that have seen as many tanks as this forum has. 

Man... I love the depth. The left side has so much planting area its insane. I may go broke getting it packed to start.


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

i just thought of it, if you cut of 1/3 of the tank on the left, it would look great, not that it doesnt now, coat it with moss, and wammo, instant cha-ching from shrimp breedng. Tho this would look great with so GBR in it


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

if the gbr you mean are german blue rams as i think they are, they dont mix well with moss. moss doesnt like too high temps.


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## lopez_316us (Jan 25, 2008)

Thanks for the Info!!! Also, Your tank is looking really good!!!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*wet season*

Its been a long time coming. 

Taking a break... I figure another hour and I'll be done for the night with the main planting... two more boxes of plants coming tomorrow/saturday for the finishing touches. In roybot73 style I'll post a teaser shot for now.


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

YEEEAAAHHH!

Been wondering about this, it has indeed been a long time coming! Looking forward to seeing it all!


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## AaronT (Apr 11, 2004)

Hey! I recognize that plant. 

It's looking pretty good so far. I can't wait to see it all filled in.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Hehe. Yea it may end up not staying depending on how things fill out... Its by far the largest leaved plant in the tank and it might throw off the scale. 
I'll have some naked space around the middle/front for a while as I've still yet to find a few centerpiece plants I've been looking for. 

Don't you hate how it takes a day or two for new plants to perk up? Its almost like flying.  Maybe it'll look good enough early next week for the first fts... right now its pretty fugly heh.


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## ikuzo (Jul 11, 2006)

i'm glad you keep the last hardscape pic.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*Initial planting photos*

The plants are starting to perk up a bit now for the most part so I figured some beginning shots are in order. I did my 4th 50% water change today since Thursday night to try to keep the ammonia in check. Stems are loving it... Lobelia/Downoi not so much. Hopefully I can get them through the soil cycle without burning them too bad. 

Not much time for image editing this evening. I just resized and only color corrected the fts with a color curve layer. 

Plants on the "Dutch" side of the tank will no doubt be swapped around a bit once things settle in more and I learn where the fastest growth should go etc. The Rotala Mac 'green' is just kinda jammed in there at the moment until then. 
Postitions of the upward facing wood might get moved around a bit as well as I'm not 100% satisfied there yet. The "mangrove" effect wood is all siliconed to the rock work. 

Specs for those who don't want to dredge through the whole thread:

40 gallon Breeder 36*18*17
Rena XP3 w/ return plumbed into a 1 inch bulkhead
Hydor 300W inline heater
2x96W Current Orbit Power Compact (1-10K dual, 1 split 10K-6.7K): 1 96W from 2pm-9pm with both bulbs on from 4pm-7pm
Pressurized CO2 diffused w/ rhinox 5k
Aquasoil Amazonia/ ADA bright sand
Zebra stone/ Manzanita
only dosing traces at the moment, will kick in NPK later EI style
background: rockin' the wood paneling muahahaha

Flora -
Narrow and Needle leaf Java Fern
Anubias 'Coffefolia'
Anubias Nana 'petite'
Low gro Hygro
Sunset Hygro
Rotalas:
'wallichi'
'colorata'
'rotundifolia'
'green'
'pusilla'
'verticillaris'
'macrandra red'
'macrandra green'
Pogostemon Helferi 'downoi'
Lobelia Cardinalis 'Small Form'

Special thanks to AaronT, gw11ucb, Overfloater, Jazzlvr, plantbrain, and Texgal for providing quality starting plants and working with me to help stage the larger orders to get everything here at the same time. Cheers folks.

Photos are basically snapshots with only one 96W bulb on.

Manditory fts:






































...now daily water changes until the soil settles in. Should give me plenty of time to eyeball where I want to move things around to get the best color/leave contrast.


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## CobraGuppy (Sep 23, 2007)

It's awesome!

I really like the right side of your tank and how the dw is kinda of interrupting the flow of java fern


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## AaronT (Apr 11, 2004)

It's looking good.  I'm glad to see you got a nice start on the plant mass in there.


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

Thats pretty cool bro. The left side is a real nice Dutch scape, and the right looks like it could be cut right out of an Amano nature scape! Chocolate and vanilla, the best of both worlds in one tank lol. Very creative, very nice. Here is a picture explaining what I'm trying to say:










LOLOLOL


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## Chrisinator (Jun 5, 2008)

That looks so awesome!


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

i like it a lot. looks great already and has even more potential. it looks nice with the mixture of dutch and nature, but i think you need to get some kind of way to blend them together. like use a row of plants that is uniform in the dutch side but slowly becomes more disorganized as it becomes part of the midground in the other. a common foreground would/will also help. right now its nice, but kinda like two different tanks next to each other. if you could blend them together, you get some kind of mega-tank.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks for the replies guys. It definitely has to mature a bit before I start moving things... its only 6 days old. :O


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

I love it, the color contrast you display is very nice.


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## fishboy87 (Feb 19, 2008)

My suggestion would be to slightly mix the sand and gravel very slightly where they hit each other and remove the wall so it looks slightly more natural. Then to blend it together, I'd place some of that foreground plant in the front left to the right side in front of the rocks near the driftwood and then take some of that java fern and put it on the left side among those plants . That is just my opinion. BTW-That is the best tank that I've ever seen that is only 6 days old  NICE JOB


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

lookin great  what do you plan on putting in there?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Not 100% sure on stocking yet... but I have someone lined up to get wc german blue rams from hopefully. Undecided on if I want to add female or not. Probably a large amount of something that will form a nice tight school with the cichlids around. Can you tell I'm pretty open at the moment?


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

Hey, thats exactly what I'm going to be doing for my stock! A school of Cardinals and a School of Rummy's with a pair of German Blue Rams. I've had it planned for a while now but I have no idea where to get the Rams... Idk if my LFS has one, but I'll check and hope for the best. I have perfect extremely soft water (0 GH and 3 KH), and it's pretty acidic with CO2 pumpin' through it. The amano scape that I've been trying to replicate also has them. I think they'll look great in your scape!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Nice! I'm considering an apisto 'orange flash' also for more color. The wife wanted this tank to have lots of brightly colored fish so I'm trying to fit the bill without having to put glow light neon danios in there! lol! 

I'm about the same on the water KH~1 and Gh~0 at best. I've been adding a little epsom salt and calcium to bring the GH up slightly. 

Now I gotta go search for the thing I read once about plants pearling at lights out. I seem to recall having something to do with low dissolved oxygen which I wouldn't doubt. I'm seeing very little pearling during lighting but I see the plants all closed up now with beads of goodness everywhere. 

Little fungus on the wood at the moment and the Lobelia is getting pretty jacked by the ammonia, I may have to pull it back to the 20 long so it can recover until this tank is stable.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Looking great, Great assortment of plants


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

To raise my GH and supply my plants with all those micros (Mg, Ca, Co, ectect), I just dose a bit extra Green Brighty Step 1. Works like a CHARM. I had Rotala mac Green which would twist and curl with low GH. I dosed extra Brighty step 1 and the twisting and curling immediately stopped and straight, healthy growth resulted. It also has a medium to small amount of Iron which is always beneficial. You should try it if you're looking for something a little less crude than Epsom salt, something that also has a lot of other beneficial nutrients. I love the results it gives me, great stuff. Step 1 that is... Step 2 has a lot more iron and a little bit less GH nutrients. Step 3 has potassium and the same stuff as step 2... Go for step 1


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

just a tip about buying rams:

many come from asian fish farms, DONT GET THOSE. they are fed hormones to grow faster, but they also age faster. i had a female ram die of old age after 3 monthes. and a male in the same tank was there MUCH longer. i dont know about any places in SC; but CmLaracy, youre in NJ, DONT buy your ram(s) at Absolutely Fish. they are a great store, not their fault, but whoever they buy from feeds hormones to the rams (all their other fish i had so far were great, but the female ram that lasted me 3 monthes, that was from there).


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

@[email protected]: This is the main reason I found someone who can get wild caught rams. No hormones or any other additives. Other than that I'm sure in the larger cities there are always folks in your local clubs that have breeding programs or know someone you can get quality tank raised fish from.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

good, then they will also have better colors, and fish like rams that generally stay in their territory dont find aquarium life too different. i just suggest you acclimate especially slowly (like slower then you would even for other rams). but i have to say im impressed you found such a person, i never did, but i never really looked.


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## mysticalnet (Dec 2, 2007)

I like your plant positioning, very nice, great job!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks for the comments everyone. Its time for a wee update. 

I really should have waited until my work schedule slacked off a little after summer to start the tank. I'm not finding much time to re-arrange plant groups between that and weekend trips (it is summer after all). 

All is going well for the most part. I'm not at all satisfied with the left side and really need to dive in there soon and re-do it to better define the groupings. It all looks a bit mashed together now. I think I may have packed in just a bit too many plants as well. 
Had a little wood fungus which is almost gone. I have a little GSA on the glass which is no biggie at this point, a little algae sprouting up on the tips of the fern but thats to be expected until things start to stabilize. I just started dosing NPK today, been adding a little iron and flourish since the start though. Still have the CO2 cranked and doing major 50-60% WC every 2-3 days. Haven't tested anything yet, might this weekend if I manage a few minutes of time indoors.

Looks like even with running both 96W bulbs that I still do not quite have enough intensity to get the 'colorata' really red like it came to me from overfloater... I think he had them under MH, gotta go back and check that thread. The downoi is suffering quite badly and melting down. I'm just cleaning what I can and hoping it bounces back, never had any do this. The lobelia that I managed to get out is recovering/re-growing in my other tank. I'll try it again once I know the tank is ammonia free. I got a little coffefolia thrown in with one of my orders and its thrown a nice new leaf since the tank started and it looks 100% better than the old ones, hope that trend continues. Looks like I'm stuck with the plants in my tanks until later this summer as its gotten too hot to ship lately. 

Here it is after the second hack trim... I guess I should look into making a background too. If you've followed the thread you know I tend to take things slow lol. Cheers folks.


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Quite a bit of growth! It looks like two very distinctly different tanks from left to right! The needle (narrow?) Java fern looks great -- it's huge!! Hopefully your Downoi pulls through, it'll be nice to a see a field of it eventually.

What color temp bulbs are you using?

Looking good bro!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks dude! I'm still working toward figuring out a way to break up the 50/50 look... I think once I double up the wallichi the transition will look a little better. Its mostly narrow leaf but I have 2 nice batches of needle on the far right and front left of the bunch. As it grows out I'm going to thin the narrow leaf out until I can remove it all, I just think the needle looks better and grows much cleaner. 

I think the bulb that came with the fixture is a dual 10k (used) and I added a split 10k-6.5k to it.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*ch-ch-ch-changes*










Yea I still haven't managed a background... 

So I've made multiple mistakes:
packed the plants in waaay too close together
didn't pick plants that worked together for the effect I was looking for
let the waterchanges slack off on a new aquasoil tank for several days at a time
constantly adjusted CO2 trying to find the sweet spot
lowered lighting period to attempt to lighten algae taking hold
dosed inconsistently

Haha. Oh well gotta learn somehow. 

needless to say that most of the stems have suffered terminal fates. The tupperware dish is the nicest tops that I'm going to loosely replant, the 5 gallon bucket are the plants I'm tossing. All the downoi is toast, I saved 3 stems that I *might* be able to get new growth on. 

I'm taking a break at the moment but I'm wiping the slate clean on the left side and restarting. I'll plant stems in very loose packs this time. I think I overestimated the intensity of the lighting thinking that with the 196W on for 6-7 hours while the AS leeched that it would be enough. It wasn't. I've never seen so many plants go downhill and melt so fast. 
I also think that I need to add a powerhead to help the flow out a bit. I'm moving the CO2 diffuser out to the front of the tank also.

it's quite alright though. I had a little battle with the 20 when I started it so I really didn't think this would be any different.


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Hey, I recognize that drop checker:hihi:

Kind of a bummer that you have to start over, but now you'll get to plant it _exactly_ how you want... Still going all stemmy on the left?

Right side still looks sweet!


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## crudnugget (Feb 5, 2008)

Any updates on your tank? This is one of the only 40 breeder threads on the forum, and I need you to give me ideas for mine so I can eventually make my own thread!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Not too great of an update unfortunately... as in no pictures.
I basically started over on the left and with the heat wave lately I've been reluctant to have any plants shipped. I transfered some limno 'mini', 'aromatica' and some Rotala 'colorata' from my 20 to try to help bring things around. 

Things are growing and my last test had the ammonia at .25 so its almost ready for fish I think. I hope its finally reaching a point that I can start beating back the algae growth. I've been siphoning out hair algae from the substrate at water changes and its much slower to re-appear now. I could really use lots more hearty stems but until its cooler here I'm going to try to hang in there with what I have. Nothing looks exceptionally healthy to me right now so I have to chalk this up to a fairly rough start with the aquasoil along with my other mistakes. I really should have waited a few more months to start the tank. After working 10H days I really lacked the motivation to be as aggressive as needed with the waterchanges etc. even with a python. 

I'm going to order some amanos soon to start helping with the cleanup and I have someone holding a nice Apisto 'orange flash' trio for me that I need to go pick up when the ammonia hits 0.


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## JustOneMore21 (May 23, 2006)

I can't wait to see what you do with the tank.  The wood and Java ferns on the right look really nice. I'm interested to see how you incorporate that into the left side with the replant.

I have a heavily planted 40 breeder but I've slacked off on maintenance lately, so mine isn't looking to hot.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

So updating both tank threads in one day.


I'm still working on balancing my dosing as well as finding the best place to get the best CO2 diffusion and tank flow. Had a nice outbreak of Hair, Green spot, diatoms and a few tufts of BBA lately. Most of it is Nitrate imbalance I'm sure coupled with where I had the second powerhead and diffuser positioned. I also had (removed entirely) a hydor aerator running at night that would turn off at lights on, I think it was counteracting the CO2 coming on 2 hours before lighting which probably explains the little bit of BBA. I tested everything at the end of a few weeks of full blown EI dosing and my kit read ~60ppm nitrates. So I decided unfortunately to lay off on the nitrate dosing until the levels dropped a bit... apparently I was low on phosphates or potassium and everything got a little jacked up. That and my nitrate kit is not calibrated either so it could be off. 
I'm back to full on dosing unless I see a reason to stop. Topped everything and replanted the left side yesterday again and I was astounded how much plant mass I pulled out of the tank.

I've pulled and replanted tops in this tank at least 3-4 times since the last pics. Lots of the Rotala sp. suffered terminal fates from the aquasoil settling in as well as being stunted by my lack of early dosing. Now I'm down to only a few fairly common species until I get a really good handle on the tank, then I'll start switching back out to more difficult/rarer stuff. Its tough to kill $$$ worth of plants. :-/

Without more typing about my struggles, here are some current pics:
Sorry for the bubbles. I should have turned off the CO2!
Pardon the remnants of multiple types of algae... 

Right now the stems list is rather modest until things level out:
Rotala 'colorata'
limnophila 'mini' 
limnophila 'aromatica' 
Some kind of big Hygro sp.
few stems of Hygro 'sunset' 

Same as the other tank I'm not really worried about completing the scape goal at the moment. I'm concentrating on healthy growth and lowering algae levels. 


Full tank


Arty 3/4 shot hehe


The tank now has some residents:

10 rummynose tetras
pair of Blue Rams
2 hitchhiker headlight/tailight tetras

Hopefully I can get my hands on some cardinals soon although I know they are technically out of season right now. A lot of places around here will not stock them and will only sell them directly out of the shipping container with no guarantee. 

Male GBR









Female GBR









Best pic of the Rummy Nose I've ever taken lol










Cheers,
James


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

A small text update on the tank since last time...

Added 6 Otocinclus in and they have ravaged the left over hair algae... still working on eradicating BGA. It looks like this is primarily a flow issue as the only place it is growing is at the front of the tank right below where the bulkhead outputs. The flow has to go over/through the fern so maybe its not getting to substrate level.

In my last tank maintenance cycle I finally caught on to what probably has been my main issue with the hair algae and I feel like such an idiot that I didn't catch it sooner. I removed the light cover to clean the reflectors/bulbs. I noticed that the 1x96 that I have been running as the primary (7 hours) is actually the one that I bought used with the fixture... manufacture date on said bulb - 2003! So no doubt the bulb is shot and needs to be replaced. I moved the bulb that I purchased new when I started the tank to use as the primary and just decided to not use any burst (2x96w) until I can get a replacement in. Plants aren't pearling now but growth is much more healthy and this combined with the Otocinclus has the hair algae on the run. I'm hoping that the next week or two is when the tank will make the turn toward more stability. I still have some existing BBA tufts but nothing new has popped up, those will be treated with excel at my next maintenance. 

Unfortunately though in taking so long to get things worked out I might have to ride the plants that are in there through the winter period as opposed to switching them out with other species like I want to. Tis' alright though that should give me time to think about things. I have a few sprigs of some less common surprise stuff on the way to try out. Hopefully I can manage to propagate some of those sp. in the coming months and come out with something unique for the next big update.

cheers,
James


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## Captain Hooked (Oct 13, 2008)

Hi James,

I just read this entire thread for the first time. First off, you have talent. That "spider" is just the sickest looking thing- I love it! Some of your pics of it look like a killer giant ant coming to drink at the watering hole. Dig it! :thumbsup:

Sorry to see it all crashed, cause it was looking so nice. 

I'm a planted newbie- just farming some plants right now and learning to keep things in check. I'm getting some amazing growth on all my stuff....learning, learning. I have three 20L that are acting as plant farms until i get the nerve to actually aquascape with the training wheels off. I say all this because right now, you can do what I'm doing which is to experiment with the plants you _have_ to better prepare you for the plants you'll _get_...next time. 

Since I have qualified myself as a newbie, take what I'm about to suggest with an ocean of salt (if you wish). Your new set up needs some balance (left/right) just like your old setup did. You need to ying yang that sucker. I think a common foreground plant would go a long ways. I'd also strongly consider arranging a driftwood grouping similar to what you did on the right side, only much smaller and not quite all the way to the _left_ end. since your breeder tank is deep- play off that by putting the second driftwood arrangement further into the midground. Having the larger driftwood arrangement closer to the eye than the smaller one gives the impression of it being miles away. This helps pull you into the tank (so to speak). Another disconnect seems to be the dark green of your java- nothing is quite that green on the left side. In fact, most of your left side plants are pales and reds. This is creating some of the L/R contrast. You need a dark green broadleaf plant tucked in the left side. if you did all these things...to my mind's eye...it would absolutely look killer, and suck you into the scape.

I know you're waiting for more plants and such, so not much you can do right now except grow on. Anyways, thanks for sharing your journey. It's been a pleasurable read! I gotta make a spider like that......


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

CH: Thanks for the comments bro they are much appreciated. 

No problem with the suggestions. I also still consider myself new to the whole deal too, I only started with my first low light tank back in '06. There is always something to learn with this stuff which is keeping it interesting for me.

This is my first try at a larger tank with high light and pressurized CO2, only having the 20L setup before this. I'm still struggling with the dimensions and depth a bit being used to trimming plants in the much shorter 20. 

A few things I've learned so far... some I already knew:
Initial setup with aquasoil can be a bear, both times I've struggled for the first few months but the end results are entirely worth the trouble.

Go easy on the lights/period. I knew going with a 2x96W fixture that it is quite a bit of light for the tank but I wanted the option of bursting a few hours a day to maximize growth and get a little pearling going. Now its looking as good as it ever has with only 1 bulb going.

Dialing in pressurized CO2 was a bit difficult and I think I may have tinkered with the rates and diffuser positioning just a bit too much in the early stages which explains the BBA. 

I should have put quick connects on all of the filter tubes. As of right now if I want to break those down to clean the tubing I have to drain the tank down and then remove the output from the bulkhead which for me is quite scary. I can always see me wrenching on it and then cracking the tank. :eek5:

On the scape suggestions. I agree with just about everything. Being so new at this you really only get to learn what works by trying and this is really only my 2-3rd real attempt at doing something cohesive.
Hardscape wise I think the way the "spider" mound on the right was positioned wasn't quite right from the start, it really needs to be moved out a little from the back wall and right side to leave a little room back there. I also hate that most of the rock work gets lost in plant growth almost immediately. I agree that a smaller outcropping on the left would go a long way to bringing the whole thing together but... that goes against the twisted plan of a dutch-nature mashup. Obviously its nowhere near that yet. 

As far as the plant contrasts... your comments are spot on. I never really intended for most of these sp. to end up in there except a little of the 'colorara' and a few stems of 'macrandra green'. It has been more of using what I had available to get the tank worked out. Due to other circumstances I had to reign in a little of my hobby spending cash lately. I do have something that could be a possible foreground candidate on the way. I guess we'll see. I really wanted to have 5-8 nice Eriocaulon 'cinerum' in that spot as well.

Originally I had intended to use mostly less common Rotala sp. in the tank but I succeeded in wiping most of those out early. If this tank follows the timeline of others that I've set up it's usually a 10-12 month struggle until things settle in and I can start growing whatever soft-water plants I want in there... then hopefully I can start shaping it into something a bit better.


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

Any updates to this?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks for asking ZTM! 
No pic updates at the moment. I literally just did a huge trim/prune and I have some new plant sp. arriving monday or tuesday. So maybe next weekend I can get some new pics up.

The tank is stable now (knocks on wood). Any hair algae that was trying to keep up has been toast for quite a week. BGA is toast as well. I only have a few left over tufts of BBA on a stick of wood and that got treated today with my maintenance... seems like every time I do it I manage to forget one. Bottom line: the tank is coming around now for sure. I love aquasoil but I hate the starting struggles. 

I have several new plants in the tank now and with some more on the way I should have a good stock to whip this thing into shape over the winter months. I'm starting to slowly remove the species I never intended to keep in this tank and replace them with others. The wife doesn't like the 'colorata' at all so a good chunk of it came out today to make room for monday.

Look for a nice set of RAOKs from me in the SnS in a bit.


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## SeaSerpant (Feb 20, 2008)

Very nice. And i'm think ZTM is right. We need some updates for this tank.

Keep up the good work

SeaSerpant


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

That's a fantastic shot of the rummynose. I really like the way the right side has grown in. I think you need some thing on the left side (darker green plant) to help bring the two sides together. I look forward to your next update.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*work in progress*

As promised I snapped a few pics today for a quick update. I definitely agree with everyone that there needs to be something dark green on the left but I'm at a loss as to what is going to match the ferns color other than more fern. Any ideas?

Its looking like a collectoritis patient right now but I'm testing a few things and giving myself a few different sp. to play with over the winter. I'm hoping I can mix and match stuff that I have to come up with something that stands out a bit more. 

Whats in there now?

Plants:
Narrow leav Java fern
Anubias Nana
Echinodorus tenellus 'pink' and 'angustifolia'
"Low gro" Hygro
ammania sp bonsai
Purple bamboo
Lamiaceae sp.
Polygonum 'Kawagoneum'
Cardamine Lyrata
Lagarosiphon Madagascariensis
Cryptocoryne wendtii 'Green Gecko'
Cryptocoryne x willisii 'lucens'
Cryptocoryne wendtii 'Red'
Limnophila aromatica
Limnophila sp. 'Mini'
Elatine triandra
Anubias barteri 'Coffeefolia'
Anubias barteri 'Petite'
Lindernia 'variegated'
Rotala 'colorata' - this is definitely going away
Glossostigma elatinoides
Staurogyne sp.

Fish:
German blue ram pair
10 Rummynose tetras
3 Golden pristella tetras
3 Headlight Tailight tetras
5 Otocinclus
Amano shrimp

One thing is for sure. I'm getting much better CO2 diffusion just by moving the glass piece right under my intake. I get micro bubbles all over the tank now to the point where I need to turn off the CO2 for pictures. 

Pardon the pictures. I'm working with a new camera that I can manually adjust the white balance on as well as the aperture now. I need more practice.

fts #1:


fts #2:



Some detail shots of the new plants.

Ammania sp. Bonsai, Lindernia 'variegated', and Lamiaceae sp.:









Lindernia 'variegated' closer:









Polygonum 'Kawagoneum':









And finally a GBR glamour shot... gotta practice with this camera more. I think its better than the old one. They just bred this past week and his color has faded a bit since they ate the eggs. :O









Thanks for looking. Feedback/criticism is great and much appreciated.


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## SeaSerpant (Feb 20, 2008)

It looks great right now. All i would do is wait for it to grow, propogate it, plant it and just let everything fill in. I'm thinking that, that would make it look great because it seems a bit sparce because everything isn't close knit together.

Looking good so far.
SeaSerpant


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks for the reply. Thats pretty much the plan right now for the winter.:thumbsup: Propagate what I have to work with and remove the sp. that end up not fitting in. I did do a major trim/replant last week so things aren't quite as thick as they were.


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## queensalmon (Oct 15, 2008)

This thread is a great teaching tool for those of us that are considering to set up a simular tank. I'll keep checking in just to learn more and enjoy your skills.

Queensalmon


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

Isn't that Ammania a beautiful plant? Too bad it's in my 10 gal which doesn't have much room for it to grow vertically


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Yes I really like it a lot. I just got these from kotoeloncat as well as the purple bamboo and polygonum, super healthy plants and well packed shipping. Much recommended. I also have to say that the Lamiaceae sp. came from Tex Gal, I highly recommend her for quality plants as well. 

I definitely need to move things around once they get established a little more. The Ammania barely stands out in front of the Rotala and everything just kind of meshes together right now especially in pictures. That said its a work in progress... plenty of cold days ahead to get things in the right place.  

Thanks for the replies and queensalmon thats good to hear. I'm learning as I go myself so if the journal helps others along that is just icing on the cake.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*Just add water!*

Its been bothering me for a while and I really wanted to give this tank more life... 
So its done... at least until the ground cover arrives today. I've spent a long time trying very hard to find eleocharis sp. 'japan' to use to no avail. I decided to go with another new emerging hairgrass sp. eleocharis sp. 'belem', it seems to have the same traits in curling back down to the substrate instead of growing straight up... at least in pictures. 

So here we go... I've never been a fan of letting tanks get to the jungle stage as I seem to prefer the more trimmed ornamental look like Oliver Knott's scapes. This has been bugging me for the last few weeks:









Time to get to work. I carefully unplanted/trimmed the plant species that I planned on keeping and placed them in holding dishes. Once those were out I did a hack trim on the rest lopping off the best tops of all remaining species for a lucky club member's christmas present. I slowly worked my way through all the stems saving the hardscaped area for last. Its still hard to tell that theres much there in this pic halfway through the teardown.:









Then I placed all hardscape items in a nice concentrated bath of Excel + potassium pomegranate to wipe out any lingering algae. Removed the CO2 diffuser to a bleach bath. Removed the XP3 intake to paint it black with Krylon Fusion. Removed the sand and added ~4 liters of new aquasoil.
With the tank empty, fish residing in a heated/airstoned 5 gallon bucket, and plants prunned/trimmed and ready to be re-planted it was time to get busy trying to work out a scape. 









A few of my main thoughts on the new scape were this:
Concentrate on not immediately loosing the hardscape to overgrown plants
Try to create a focal point this time using the "golden ratio"
Thin the plant species down to those that are less "unruly" 
Do a little better with using plant groupings with contrasting colors/leaf shapes and leave myself room to top/replant to create thicker groupings over the winter. 

I think the first time I jammed everything over into the corner with the intake and this time I wanted to create a bigger raised planting area but still use the ferns as the centerpiece. I wish I had a little more zebra stone to work with but I think I stretched what I had out pretty well. I think the way its set now with the plans for the groundcover I'll be able to actually tell that there are rocks in there for a while.  










Yes I'm a tease. A better final pic will come later today when the lights flip on. I can still see a light tinge of haze in the tank looking through it lengthwise but it should be ok. 

p.s. Seriously if you don't have python replacement parts order some now or at least have a spare. I was in the initial stages of the new scape with ferns/anubias/etc already tied down that I was spritzing with a water bottle. Got ready to fill a bit to add some stems... python broke. @#$&**@ I have to drive 40 minutes one way to the closest petsmart. Our LPS doesn't stock python stuff... walmart? day before Christmas Eve? Sure! No pythons.  But they did have a Tom's water changer which I readily scooped up for emergency use. Lesson learned. I'll be ordering a full array of python replacement parts this week.


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

i was so ready to see a scape and then it ended :angryfire

hurry up with the lights! through the dust, it looked pretty awesome :icon_wink


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Super sweet! I like where it's headed, and I've gotta say-- I'm glad you decided to get rid of the sand

I hear what you're saying about the Python parts -- the shutoff valve on mine broke a few weeks ago as soon as the tank was done filling. I had to run 12 feet to the bathroom with water spraying all over the place, and when I finally reached the bathroom, I slipped on the wet tile floor and pulled a muscle. Luckily the wifey wasn't around to see it happen, all she saw was a sparkling clean bathroom:hihi:


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## ragin_cajun (Dec 22, 2008)

What is a "drip loop"?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

where are you getting your Eleocharis 'Belem'? I bought from 2 different people and they have grown different in their tanks.

One was grown under 65 watts of CF and Aquasoil and it grew more straight and less bent but was slightly taller.

Then I got some that looks like E. Japan that is bent over.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ragin_cajun said:


> What is a "drip loop"?


http://freshaquarium.about.com/od/equipmentquestions/f/driploop.htm


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Chris: Sorry 'bout the tease bro. I honestly thought I'd have time to get a few startup pics before I had to head out for a Christmas thing. I'll get something up tonight I promise... 5 minutes after I posted USPS showed up with the 'belem' and I got busy separating/planting it and it took a while because there was a lot to go in. 

Rob: Most def. on the sand. Never again will I use it like that. The only way I'll use it again is maybe an island type of scape where I can completely box in the substrate somehow. 

Craig:I got mine from Boun, as per usual fantastic plants and really awesome portion for the price he charged. It doesn't look totally bent down to the substrate like 'japan' does but its definitely not as tall as the regular hairgrass either. 

Completed pics in a while hopefully. :biggrin:


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

haha no problem  i'm looking forward to seeing it


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*Merry Christmas!*

Alright so I woke the fish up after lights out and snapped a few pics. Been helping the wife put together her new ballin' Ferret Nation 142 cage that I got her.  

Hope everyone is having a great holiday so far. 

These are pretty much snapshots... I think I got them all in 5 minutes haha. Still a tiny bit hazy but its to be expected, I did just completely rip the thing up. 

Please let me know your thoughts especially on the 3 little rocks on the right. I had them left over after I was somewhat satisfied with the other rock work and I just threw them in there so I wouldn't forget I had them. 

FTS:









Standing:









Right 3/4:









Left 3/4:









View from the right side that we see when we walk through the hallway:









Closeup of the eleocharis 'belem' for Craigthor:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Thanks for the pics. Yeah my other portion came from boun as well. I got from both him and aaront the same day. hope it will start to curl with an abundance of light. got good portions form both guys though. yours does look to have more curl than mine did aswell.

Can't wait for this to fill in now....

Craig


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

That's going to be one sweet aquarium when it's all grown in. I like the changes.

Regards,
Phil


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks Phil I appreciate the kind comments. 

I think I'm going to move the leftover rocks around today, then its time to wait a few weeks and double those stands of plants and watch the foreground grow in... hopefully.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

I am really digging the new scape, The possibilities of a 40 gal. I really like the the way the DW rolls down the front of the hill. I hope the slope stays thru the water changes.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks Rekles! I too hope the slope will hang in there. It seems to be fairly sturdy at the moment although during the fill I started to see some cascading soil and almost lost it. Haha. My only concern is that the majority of the newly added aquasoil is providing the foundation and I know how it likes to compact slightly over time. 

I added an additional 2x24W T5HO fixture over the front today as a kick in the pants for the ground cover.


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

nice scape MrJG!! wont the ferrets try and drink out of your tank? lol


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

its looking nice  is that all eleocharis belem? its gonna look sweet!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

thanks fishman and chris! The ferret is still small ~3 months old but we do not plan on letting her roam the house unattended.  I can definitely see one fishing around the rim of the tank. lol.
Chris its all 'belem'... speaking of which I just remembered that I need to leave feedback for the S&S. Here's to hoping I can get it to grow in nice and thick.


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## brt_p (Nov 16, 2008)

it's a very nice cabinet, looks nice and simple..and of course, nice layout too..


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

Woah it looks nice! What's the plant in the back right corner?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks brt and ZTM! That plant in the back right corner is Polygonum 'Kawagoneum'. I got it from kotoeloncat and I recommend the seller highly for quality plants.

I visited a few club members today and added a male purple moscow guppy for the wife and 3 male "N" class red stripe endlers that are descendants of Ryzilla's that he gave as an RAOK here. Hopefully they like the tank... if not I'll move them to the smaller hex.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Well the endlers bit it. not sure what happened to them but I suspect a mass rummynose tetra beatdown or possibly the GBR. Never found the bodies... so tiny, the shrimp probably cleaned them up. 
"Prince" the purple moscow guppy will be moving to the 10g hex. He's just not up to the work the current in this tank requires. When I unplug the filter he cruises around with no problems. 

When taking pics of the 20 a while ago I walked by to find that it must be close to spawning time so I tried to snag a good pic of "Julia" the male GBR... and his mate "Lyle" the female (she has a little crooked mouth ala Lyle Lovette). I thought I got lots of good pictures but only ended up with one of a good display.










As far as the tank, its still cranking along. I'm already seeing new runners of the eleocharis so it'll be time for a progress pic next weekend. The rest of the stem plants will probably need a trim/replant before then as well.


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

looks great, I also like the way the DW follows the slope. That fern in the middle is huge!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks cah925! Oddly enough that is about 1/4 of the fern mass that was in there prior to the re-scape. When I was starting the redo I added it all back... then after starring at it for a while decided that it was just too much. The rest of it went to a gent in our club for the fry tanks in his supa-mega fish room.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Took a quick pic to document growth of the foreground today. Everything is moving along fine. 

Still getting a little BBA popping up in the front left corner. I hope to remedy this by adding a splitter to the bulkhead with a 6 inch bendable extension to get some flow over that way and closer to substrate level. If that doesn't do the trick I'll be looking into finding the right sized pump to move to a needle wheel system for CO2 delivery. 
There was a little GSA buildup on the front glass from running the additional fixture. Nothing major and it took 3 weeks to build up to the point where I noticed it. 

Since the last pics:
Moved the rocks over to bolster the mound a little, I still wish I had more. 
Added a few stems of Ludwigia 'pantanal' on the left beside the fern. Already had to top/replant once. Its going to be time to trim the Lindernia and Polygonum this week. 

FTS:
 

Close-up of 'pantanal':


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

dang thats growin fast


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

That fern is amazing!


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

You still have BBA with all that CO2?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Yep. Crazy huh? Its not much but I still get little tufts forming on the substrate there. The CO2 gets sucked up by the intake at the back of the tank there and then spit out by the output on the right top of the tank. I'm guessing that spot is just not getting enough flow from the output since its so far away and low...


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## Agent Zero (Dec 24, 2008)

WOW lots of changes, your tank looks great.


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

i love 40 breeders!. they look great!
btw, do you find the co2 gets dispersed better with the diffuser next to the outflow of the filter or the inflow?


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## chonhzilla (Apr 22, 2008)

looks cool


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

MrJG said:


> Still getting a little BBA popping up in the front left corner. I.


The Pantanals were telling you Co2 was no good too  

The top 2in of the plant looks good, but can be better. Clearly you realized Co2 was not up to spped and worked on Co2 to get those leaves sticking out without much curl at the tips. You are not far off either just needs a little more tweaking or maybe cosistency now  

BTW your's is one of the best ones I've seen floating around here so good job ! It's *not a difficult plant* it just like it's Co2 and most who have tried & failed have difficulties with adding Co2 optimally to their system...so naturally to them it's difficult  

Remember no curl whatsover means you have a healthy growing Pantanal accept nothing less and you will do well overall. 



Close-up of 'pantanal':


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks for chiming in mrkookm. The tops definitely look good but further on down the good non-curling growth tapers off. :-/ Once I correct the CO2 issue will those leaves that are already curling perk back up? 

I definitely at minimum need to work on CO2 delivery I believe. I'm going to add the splitter to the output this week to try to get a little better distribution with flow. If that doesn't help out then I'll try bumping the CO2 up a bit when I can watch the fish. For some reason after re-doing my drop checker after a few days the solution ends up looking really clear and hard to read, using 4dkh. So I'm really going by plant growth and the fish at this point. No bubble counter installed. If THAT doesn't work I think I'm going to ditch what I have now and go with a needle wheel. 

Other than that I'm fairly pleased with the tanks progression so far. One thing that I keep thinking about is ditching the PC lighting and going with a Tek T5HO (if I can find a good deal) to get better coverage and get a little better coloration lower down on the stems. Seems like I could do better with a wider fixture rather than the thin 2x96W... or at least rig something up to raise the existing fixture a bit. 18 inches of tank depth is hard to cover.


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

> Once I correct the CO2 issue will those leaves that are already curling perk back up?


Once the leaves looks as if someone squished it between their fingers to create what appears to be a broken line where the leaf bends they are too far gone for a come back. Plant will need to topped.


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## skratikans (May 23, 2008)

wow, I like the new layout! How do you diffuse your Co2 evenly throughout your tank?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks! Good question... wish I knew the answer because I suspect that this is what is causing the few small issues with the tank at the moment.:thumbsup:


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## rwong2k (Dec 24, 2004)

wow looking great, love the progess, i've got a 40 breeder myself and just tore the scape down and starting it again, thanks for the ideas =)


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

I snapped a quick during the dawn/dusk lighting that runs prior to and a little after the main lights turn on. 









Tank is doing fairly well and its pretty stable. The foreground is coming along well. Its going to take more work to get those front corners blanketed though. I'm hoping that in the next 3-4 weeks it will be fairly solid. 

I had just done a fairly major trim and topped/replanted a bunch of stuff including Ammania Bonsai, Purple bamboo, Poly sao paulo and porto velho on the left. Hacked half of the lindernia and poly kawagoneum on the right... so this is a more a pic to show the lighting and progress on the lawn.

Ended up removing the Ludwigia 'pantanal' since its growth rate was mega fast it usually required more frequent trimming than everything else.


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

You have Purple Bamboo too?

And btw I LOVE that needle leaf java fern...it makes such a nice focal point:thumbsup:


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

Tank looks fantastic. I love the dawn/dusk lighting.


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## luckydud13 (Jun 21, 2008)

Great job MrJG, just great.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Awesome tank! I want one!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks guys. It seems to be coming along, I'm definitely liking the new layout much more than the old. Just needs some tweaks here and there. 

I finally started trimming/replanting the staurogyne sp. like Garuf described. I started to see some deterioration on some of the lower leaves so I reluctantly lopped the top portions off and replanted. Seriously though I think I've seen anubias grow faster than this stuff.  

I'll probably wait to do full lighting shots when it grows back in a bit unless someone wants a few now.

Oh and thanks for the rating... not sure its worthy just yet but I'm learning.


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## CAM6467 (Feb 11, 2009)

Great tank! I'm trying to get my hands on a few GBR's for my 10. I love yours, they are beautifully colored. Nice re-scape too! Keep those pics coming.


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## Wingsdlc (Dec 9, 2005)

MRJG - your tank is looking pretty nice! I like the rock work quite a bit. If you have a chance I wouldn't mind seeing a fully lite shot or two.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks! I'll try to snag a few once the CO2 clicks off. Keep in mind I just hacked the fool out of it on friday though. 


Off to knock that rating down... no disrespect to whoever did it but this tank needs a lot of work to get a rating like that.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

wings... better late than never. Gotta love the BGA in the lower right corner $#%^!. 










Edited to say: Fear my gnarly silicone.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Man I just love this tank. I hear so much good things about 40 gal breeders. Its great to see a really nice one.


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## Wingsdlc (Dec 9, 2005)

once your stems grow back and you get them to thicken up a bit your tank is going to look quite sweet. I really like your hard scape. I have completely lost the large rocks in my tank.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Wingsdlc: Thanks man, its much appreciated. That was one of the main reasons for the re-scape to get those rocks out in the open, expensive little buggers. 

Thats the plan right now. I think I have everything plant wise that I'd like to keep in the tank now so its a matter of keeping things stable and tweaking things to get this little bit of BGA that keeps popping back up to go away. I've already increased my nitrate dosing a bit to make up for it but I guess I haven't been aggressive enough with removing whats there already.

I have some plans to adjust the plant groupings a bit. Bringing all the polygonum sp. (sao paulo, porto velho, kawagoneum) to the right of the fern in the back as I split more stems. Probably removing that hygro sp. there entirely as the leaves get too large and shade things there. Once I can get that done I'm thinking of keeping the Linerndia sp. (variegated, india) in front of those to hide the lower portions of the polys behind. 
Hopefully by the time I get that accomplished I'll have started splitting Ammania 'sulawesi' (aka Rotala 'sunset) stems to keep with the ammania 'bonsai' in the back left. 
That and just being patient while the foreground grows in more... going to have to do some funky light adjustments to get those front corners though I think. 

Steady as she goes.


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## skratikans (May 23, 2008)

I like this new rescaped look, especially since you have a nice amount of openness in the front..


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## mizu-chan (May 13, 2008)

Simply inspiring!


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## chris.rivera3 (Apr 15, 2008)

looks amazing! i want to upgrade my 20L to a much larger tank now :icon_frow ...im jealous


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks everyone for the kind comments. The tank is still plugging along while I patiently wait for the ground cover to fill in completely...


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Wow, it looks AWESOME!


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Wow! Looks great dude! A nice coating o' pearls on everything, it seems. That 'belem' is a really great ground cover, and yours seems to be liking what you're doing for it. Do you find you have to trim your needle leaf Java much? Mine fills space at a seemingly unstoppable rate

Keep up the good work!


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Thanks CL/RoyB! 

Yea the the fern is pretty out of control right now. Fairly soon I'm going to be taking it out and hacking at least half the mound off. The few spots closest to the rocks where the 'belem' hasn't filled in gets a good bit of shading from the fern so I think thats going to be mandatory to get that to fill in.


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

Wow is that a DHG carpet?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

ZTM: Its similar. Eleocharis sp 'belem' instead of growing straight up it curls back down toward the substrate.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Not much to update... just prepped the tank for going away on vacation. Gave everything a good trim and pulled 3/4 of the fern mass out. Hopefully the next couple of weeks while I'm gone the carpet will like the added light and fill in more.... patience waning. 

This is mainly a giant plug for fishneedit.com for those who pop in to check out the thread. 
I purchased a 150W MH back in late Jan from them for this tank. I haven't installed it yet but I've been using it to do a little emersed experiment (Polygonum, Lamiaceae sp.).
After using the light for a few weeks I started to have an issue getting the bulb to fire. I would need to manually flip the power on the ballast a few times to get it going (this is one of the new electronic ballasts). I sent off a quick email to them to see what could be done... 5 minutes later I got a call from them. Very awesome customer service to say the least. They are sending a new ballast and bulb for me to troubleshoot with, as well they are including return postage for the bad parts which hopefully will be one of the two. Also if neither of these work (which is doubtful) they have offered either a refund or replacement on the whole shebang. So in short if you are on the fence about fishneedit.com or leery about the pricing for their lighting have no worries. The customer service is the best I've ever encountered.


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## rountreesj (Jun 12, 2007)

good to hear about fishneedit...i'm bout to take the plunge on 2 of the 70 watt metal halide fixtures...


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

Judging from your comment on my page, you tore this sucker down correct? That's a shame if you did . You got some talent man. Better than mine.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Nah man its still up, just semi neglected on most occasions other than dosing/waterchanges. I plan on doing a good maintenance routine on it tonight to clear some of the jungle out for a club meet. I'll try to snap a few pics of its current state over the weekend if I get a chance. I am growing a bit tired of the layout though so it'll be time to restart pretty soon. Just wish I had access to better hardscape materials without blindly ordering stuff online. 

I do have some awesome BBA covering the manzanita and I've managed to keep it pretty contained there. I like it! There are a few spots of fissidens growing on the branches that pop right out of the BBA! Haha. I think I'm demented or something. :icon_twis


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

It was worse than I thought, I'm tired but I have lots of plants to spread around. Its amazing how many offshoots stems throw out at the top of the water as they start overtaking a tank.


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Whoa. I threw a pile about that big on my compost pile when I started to rework the 60-P.

Amazing how big these "slow growers" can get :hihi:


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

I was snapping some quick pics of the 2.5G so I figured I'd pop the lights on for a few quickies to update this thread as well. 

This is the current state of the tank... little messy and not fully recovered from the major hack last week.
It hasn't changed much. The eleocharis 'belem' carpet got pulled and sold a while back and I only kept a little. I've been mainly focusing on learning how to keep and propagate this staurogyne sp. on the right side. Eventually after I hack it up for another project I intend on filling out the rest of the front of the tank with it before this gets torn down for a new scape. This stuff is terribly slow growing though. 

Pardon the random sprigs of Bacopa 'japan' in the front. I just rescued them from the blyxa monster in my 20 and they needed a recovery area.  



















And a close-up of the Staurogyne (tropica #049G). Pardon the lower leaf degradation... some of those have been there for 4-5 months and show the results of my lazy tank maintenance. This stuff clusters like Downoi and stays this size. Really neat.


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## RipariumGuy (Aug 6, 2009)

That looks AMAZING! Great work!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That's really nice. The depth of this tank makes such a nice effect. That _Staurogyne_ is a cool little plant.


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## Dan the Man (Sep 8, 2009)

Man, I was following along in your journal and got to your jump from March 2009 to like January of 2010. Is that correct? Anyway, I've been saving my spending money since september 2009 and I have purchased a nova extreme 4 x 39 watt T5HO, a Marineland pinpoint PH controller, a dual stage victor reg, an aqua-medic reactor1000 and another $600 dollars in cash for this project. My goal is to place in the top three of AGA's aquascape contest. I still have many things to buy and your thread has been extremely helpful. My question is, since I currently have a 30g breeder (36''Lx12''wx16 1/2"h) how much of an upgrade is a 40g breeder? Is it worth taking some of that cash and buying a 40g? Thanks for your help and I hope you won't quit scaping your tank.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Dan: Yea there was a pretty sizable gap there where I didn't update. 

Pretty lofty goal there! I'm still practicing for a while yet. 

Personally the difference for me between a 30 and a 40 breeder is huge. That extra 4" of height really opens things up. I bought 2 30 breeders a while back for an idea then I just couldn't come to terms with the shallow depth. I guess it all depends on your plans for the scape. If you are doing tons of stems there is going to be lots of trimming/re-planting to keep everything in check with the 30. Once you get a good solid 4-5 inches of substrate toward the back of that puppy there isn't much room for stems to grow out. If you were thinking more like an iwagumi layout the 30 dimensions would probably do much better than the 40. 

I'll definitely not be quitting on this stuff. So much to learn and try. This one will be getting another scape sooner or later. Just working on growing some things out. Too bad I can't find good stone around here. :-/


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## Dan the Man (Sep 8, 2009)

Hey JG, I accidentally misinformed you about my tank. It's a standard 30g; it's dimensions are 36" x 12" x 16 3/4" . I't actually taller than a 40g breeder. I've been talkin to a couple of guys in the "plantgeek" forum and they all recommend going with the 40g breeder over my standard 30. 

Yeah, it is a pretty lofty goal and I'm going to need all the help I can get. I've been saving up for almost a year now in order to not cut any corners and as I slowly make progress on my supplies I've been pouring over the different forums on plantgeek mostly and this one as well. 

I hope you update with some more pics. One other thing. I noticed that the room the tank is in is carpeted. Have there been any issues with that? Are you able to do maintenance and water changes without spilling much on it?

Thanks man and good luck on finding some stone. I'm thinking of either biting the bullet and buying some from ADA or maybe going to a local rock/landscaper and seeing if he's got any inert stones. I like the more blond stones over the dark or zebra ones.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Ahh yea. In that case the 40 breeder is a much better option for scaping. 

I'll be taking some new images pretty soon as well as some HD video of the tank after it grows back in a little more.

The room where I have this tank and all the others listed in my sig is a spare bedroom that we use for a ferret playroom/tank room. The carpet in there is pretty much toast already so we don't really worry about it too much. I have a 50ft python that I use for water changes so no problems with water getting on the floor unless I'm filling a tank while working on another and forget (I do maintenance for all tanks at the same time). Lets just say I don't rock the ipod + ear buds anymore while doing so. It helps when you can hear the water gushing over the top.  

On the stone I've pretty much exhausted all the local landscape suppliers for decent stuff. I'm now looking for small bonsai shops etc.


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## VadimShevchuk (Sep 19, 2009)

Nice 40B and and 20l. REad both of your journals but it took me 2 hrs =/. Now i have to go and read your 29 gallon journal. =D


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## skratikans (May 23, 2008)

do you order some of your plants from tropica?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

If only I could... I'm sure most of us in the states dream of making an order from Tropica (Denmark) or Rayon Vert (Japan). Honestly I'm not really sure what it would entail to buy plants from these distributors and then legally get them through customs into the U.S. 

Pretty much everything I've ever had in all my tanks have been purchased from others in the swap & shop here or through trades with folks on this board as well as aquatic plant central.


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## JennaH (Sep 28, 2009)

i saw some Staurogyne at a lfs not too far from here but it was still growing out and not for sale yet . im tempted to try some, it has a great look


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Haven't updated in a bit and walked by it this evening and it was asking for a pic...










Finally starting to move the carpet around. Its going to take a while to get everything to bush up since this stuff is slower to grow. Just patiently snipping and moving tips until it fills in. 
Everything else in the tank got hacked on saturday. The middle fern is the "small" piece I kept. 

Should be able to sit back for a while and watch things grow back in.


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## oneduduboy (Feb 23, 2010)

I wanted to ask you a few questions because I'm also starting a 40g breeder tank. How many bags of ADA AS2 did you use? Also wanted to know where you got the rocks for your tank. TIA


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

oneduduboy: If I recall correctly I used 3 9 liter bags of Amazonia I normal. Since our water here is so soft I've never experienced any of the issues that ADA brought version II out for. 

The stone is Zebra stone that I bought from someone here on the boards. I think they either got if from Aqua Forest Aquarium or Aquarium Design Group. I smashed up the pieces and removed most of the white veining thats usually present and this is what was left.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

*final update?*

I'm letting this thing grow more than I normally would. This scapes days are numbered. Not sure how soon but its coming. I got a lot of nice stone from boink in the swap&shop thats just begging me to get into this tank. 

The staurogyne foreground is coming along well. I could have packed more into the bare spots when I trimmed today but decided it was time to let some go. 

Large images ahoy!




























A shot down the length which I'm not sure if I've ever done. The straight on shot never conveys the depth of this tank and thats purely a shortfall of the scape.









And a close-up of one of my favorite fishes in there Golden Pristella tetras. My wife found three of these and loved them, I was meh on them. Once they got home and into the tank they colored up quite nice. Wish I could find some more.


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

I'm liking how it's coming along bro. 

Is that BBA you're letting grow on your branches? 

Also, what's your lighting as far as bulb temp/type and wattage? Reason I ask is I'm growing Staurogyne sp. as well in my tank but it grows nothing like your stuff.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

I absolutely love that foreground. If you ever need to sell any of it when Tom Barr isn't, I _may_ be interested. I have one stem currently and it looks pretty cool.
Love that fern, too.
Just noticed that you are indeed selling some right now. haha


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Yep. Its BBA goodness. I especially like how the tufts of fissidens grow out of it. As long as It stays on the wood I'm cool with it, it shows of the inconsistent CO2 well. 

The lighting is 2x96 watt PC using dual daylight 6.5k + 10k bulbs. I've been wondering that as well. Tom has some in one of his tanks that looks just like mine... then the same stuff in the larger tank just looks flatter. As if the leaf tips don't extend upward on the edge. He mentioned the lighting was the determining factor for him as those that look like mine were shaded.

CL: yea theres some fs now. Wish I could offer it at the prices Tom is selling them for. Truth is its a slow grower and my stand is nowhere near the size he's rolling with. If its not worth $3 a stem to folks its completely worth it for me to put it back in the tank and fill in a few spots.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

As of saturday this scape has been retired so its time to say farewell. It was a fun one and I learned quite a bit with this being the largest tank I've attempted. Hope everyone enjoyed the journey. Be on the lookout, a fresh thread will be started for the new layout. 

Humble beginnings:









Final scape image:









Full circle to a new beginning:


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

JG!!! That was an awesome tank dude. RIP 

I'm positive you'll come back with another SICK scape. I'll keep an eye out for your journal. 

What's your plan?


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Its up and running other than some tweaking. 

Lots of seiryu stone. I tried not to worry myself too much with placement or rules. Just went for depth and a bit of balance across the whole tank. Since I'm still a newb at scaping every time I do a restart its a lot of trial and error until it feels right. I think the actual scape took me 2 hours. 

Took me 14.5 hours to tear down and build back up. I hope I can make all that effort worth it. 

Might be picture worthy today. After the reset got the standard bacterial bloom but it was nearing its final phases yesterday evening. If the water is clear I might post up today... took a sick day from work.


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## Laotin (Mar 11, 2010)

looks great!


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## Dan the Man (Sep 8, 2009)

Its up and running other than some tweaking.

Lots of seiryu stone. I tried not to worry myself too much with placement or rules. Just went for depth and a bit of balance across the whole tank. Since I'm still a newb at scaping every time I do a restart its a lot of trial and error until it feels right. I think the actual scape took me 2 hours.



> Took me 14.5 hours to tear down and build back up. I hope I can make all that effort worth it.
> 
> Might be picture worthy today. After the reset got the standard bacterial bloom but it was nearing its final phases yesterday evening. If the water is clear I might post up today... took a sick day from work.


Hey man, what's going on??? Any update on your new 40's scape? Your journal's the one to blame for getting me sucked into all of this!


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