# CO2 Diffuser Setup



## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

8-10 BPS? Bubbles per second?


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## Geobelle (Feb 28, 2004)

I am not using any glass diffuser, instead a glass reactor being attached to a power head. And maintaining 2 bps of CO2 since my reactor dissolves CO2 with water efficiently.


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## Bugman (Jan 7, 2008)

I use a DIY inline reactor on the outflow of my cannister. The flow of the cannister pushes the Co2 thru the tank but I also use a Koralia on the opposite end of the tank to increase the flow. 

When you say you don't have a Co2 test it sounds like you don't have a drop checker? For a small amount you can get one and I definitely reccomend it. You can get one from Orlando at http://www.greenleafaquariums.com/co2-drop-checkers/gleaf-drop-checker.html
for 19.99 and it includes the 4dkh. Small investment of the peace that your Co2 is at the right level.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

I have my diffusers about halfway between top and bottom
of tank, usually a tad closer to the top.
I have better response from the plants, and I can make fish 
choke much faster than placing it at sub-level.

I also have good results with it placed under my out-pipe
between tank top and bottom.

If you are using pipes instead of spray bar then try it with
diffuser under outflow with pipe directing flow out and not down.

Get the water going in a circular motion, around the tank.
This is how I use them.

I don't get good results with diffuser placed low.

This is a good subject that needs more attention,
I am glad you brought it up.
Does this have to do with your setaceum thread?
that could be why that plant isn't working well.


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

Thanks for the reply Craig.
Yes, my question directly relates to the E. setaceum thread.
I will try the locations you suggested.

Sorry I didn't mention that I have dual CO2 counters and outlets on my regulator. I'm using one for the diffuser and the other one is injected directly into the powerhead which feeds my UV. So in a way I'm also using my UV as a CO2 reactor.


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## tazcrash69 (Sep 27, 2005)

Wö£fëñxXx said:


> I have my diffusers about halfway between top and bottom
> of tank, usually a tad closer to the top.
> I have better response from the plants, and I can make fish
> choke much faster than placing it at sub-level.


Not to Hijack, but......
Craig, thanks, I never have second guessed the placement of my diffusers close to the bottom. Do you have an ideas as to why this could be? I've always thought that close to the bottom is better so it has more travel time before hitting the surface.


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

tazcrash69 said:


> Not to Hijack, but......
> Craig, thanks, I never have second guessed the placement of my diffusers close to the bottom. Do you have an ideas as to why this could be? I've always thought that close to the bottom is better so it has more travel time before hitting the surface.


My thought is exactly.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Round Head said:


> Thanks for the reply Craig.
> Yes, my question directly relates to the E. setaceum thread.
> I will try the locations you suggested.
> 
> Sorry I didn't mention that I have dual CO2 counters and outlets on my regulator. I'm using one for the diffuser and the other one is injected directly into the powerhead which feeds my UV. So in a way I'm also using my UV as a CO2 reactor.


Your welcome  it is a good subject...
Have you considered a second diffuser, that would be better
than a power head, the FX5 isn't strong enough to push a UV 
on a 70g? :icon_eek: 
I never had any luck with using a power head for anything other than
flow, in my experience they make for poor to a disadvantage for
C02.



tazcrash69 said:


> Not to Hijack, but......
> Craig, thanks, I never have second guessed the placement of my diffusers close to the bottom. Do you have an ideas as to why this could be? I've always thought that close to the bottom is better so it has more travel time before hitting the surface.


Hey Taz,
Have you ever had any poor plant or algae issues? if so you 
should second guess it, C02 can be trixy.
As I said placing the diffuser on sub yields the least favorable 
result in terms of plant health. I think logic tells us the longer or 
farther down the diffuser is the better the rate, that does not
seem to be true for me.
Placing it midways seems to work better, I don't have any means
of testing this other than me seeing how my plants respond,
and that is enough for me to know there is a difference.
It is as though it makes the water richer in carbon, it works,
Amano does it, thats what you see in nearly every one of his 
tanks.

http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery02/23.jpg

http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery02/25.jpg

It appears he has at least two in this one, under the pipes
on far left.
http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery02/1.jpg

http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery02/20.jpg

With my diffuser placed under the outflow, I get many
extra fines that get sucked into the pipe and shot
across the tank.


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## EdTheEdge (Jan 25, 2007)

Intresting thread.... I think I'll change the placement of my diffusor tonight.


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

i just don't see how moving the diffuser up the water column would increase plant growth. I imagine Amano moves the diffuser up so that 

1)it's not distracting to the scape
2)is not taking up real estate where there would be plants growing
3)allows light to reach the plants underneath it
4) is easy to swap out an old dirty one for a new one without disturbing the scape.

moving the diffuser up would automatically decrease contact time, and increase the relative size of a rising co2 bubble at corresponding points in the water column... thus reducing its susceptibility to water currents which in turn would reduce dissolution.


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

Now I got both diffusers going at mid level.
One on the far right under the filtration outlet and the other is on the far left under the UV outlet. I hope this is my issue.


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

Look here..http://www.aquascapingworld.com/forum/equipment/737-video-diffuser-placement.html


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

MedRed said:


> i just don't see how moving the diffuser up the water column would increase plant growth. I imagine Amano moves the diffuser up so that
> 
> 1)it's not distracting to the scape
> 2)is not taking up real estate where there would be plants growing
> ...


I agree with you 100% and I think Craig also mentioned it above.
I've tried and failed but I'm open to new ideas. I'll post new results.

Thanks


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## bigstick120 (May 23, 2005)

Im not seeing how raising the diffuser up would help. Unless you are having better flow around the diffuser. The flow down near the substrate could be less. That I could see as being a reason.

I run mine under the spray bar on one tank. And in the corner with the outlet pointing at it in another tank. Both are a few inches from the substrate.


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

I just run mine through my cannister. Never had any luck with glass diffusers and diy co2.


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## Tim S (Mar 18, 2007)

I'm actually running into a bit of trouble with my CO2 as well. I've been using a AC30 powerhead to distribute my CO2, but now that I've bumped the lighting its not enough. My Drop checker takes hours after lights on to turn green and I dont get any pearling until 2 hours before lights out. I also have a xp3 and the small pump from my Redsea reactor for water movement. I'm debating between 2 diffusers or a mazzie injector. This method I'm using now really isnt working.


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

This level of pearling occurs with the diffuser placed on the very bottom underneath the the spraybar. The co2 wasn't on in this video (ph controller) but it rises up and gets pushed to the front of the tank and down just like how you can see the smaller oxygen bubbles being blown forward. The co2 bubbles are a lot finer (i use rhinox diffusers) and so they get pushed a lot further and then down the front of the glass. 

http://www.me.com/gallery/#100001/MVI_0689


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## Erirku (May 9, 2007)

IMHO, I think if the diffusor is in the current of the outflows current, the co2 bubbles will always recirculate in the tank. I have seen this with my setup, as the I continually see the co2 bubbles going in circles before it reaches the surfaces, which in return lets the co2 gases dissolve longer in the water column. I have great pearling in my tank. Which I am always glad to see.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Set it where ever _you_ can get the best diffusion,
whether it be in the middle, top, bottom, or anywhere
in between.
You should be able to get good diffusion with a single
diffuser for a 70g, depending on the disk size you have,
you would need an ADA50 or Rhino 5000.
With less light, less is required so you could get away
with a smaller disk. so use two smaller disks if you have
too. Type of outlet and direction of flow help in the 
tweaking process of C02 diffusion, a power head
being the least favored.

Whatever it takes to get the C02 where it needs to be to grow
that plant you want to grow.

Depending on how much light I want to burn on my 120P
I use two diffusers when I need too.

I have read several places where Amano says where to place
the disk for optimal diffusion. "The Style of ADA" for one, page
103.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

If you are setting the diffuser on the sub to get "maximum"
dissolution, then you're not adding enough C02 already..
or your disk is to small :help: :hihi: 

Midways should be perfect and give you room to use all the actual
real estate...

hehe


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

Thanks for all of your help Craig.
I set both diffusers like you recommended and starting to see good results.
All this time I thought it was fertilization and never even considered CO2 as an issue. I have both Rhinox 5000 and 3000 and just purchased a few more 3000. Seems like the 5000 does not utilize it's entire diffusing surface area. 
Now I got to give E. setaceum another shot.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

How is this working out for you Round Head?

This is a side shot of my 120P, I have been able
to grow anything in this tank, I use:

Sunlight Supply Tek T5 6/54w
-100% RO/DI, TDS I keep 200 or less.
-10# C02 tank w/dual needle valves and dual diffusers.
-ADA Super Jet 1200 Filter with glass pipes, inflow and
outflow on the right hand side creating a flow that goes
around the tank-across the front, down the side to back
across the back and returns to front.
I have floaters/Aldrovanda vesiculosa to be precise so I am
constantly seeing this circular motion.

Using two diffusers, I use probably 10 to 20bps, no way to
actually count, but I use a lot of C02.

Very minimal surface agitation during photo period of 8hrs,
after lights out, the tank gets a constant aeration by raising
my out pipe to break the surface until the next day.

This tank gets dosed daily.

3/8Tsp KN03-daily
1/8Tsp KH2P04-daily
1Tsp GH Booster once a week
15 to 20 ml trace daily-Plantex or Floursh Comprehensive or
Tropica.
3ml Fe. daily.
This tank is a machine, it is constantly changing on almost a
weekly basis, when I have the time to work on it. 

The filter gets cleaned about once a month, I use either RO
or tank water to rinse the media without damaging the bacteria.


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

I'm seeing alot of pearlings now.
My setup is almost exacty like your except my diffusers and inflow/outflow are on the rear end of the tank; one diffuser on the far left and another directly under the outflow. The outflow shoots directly to the left but I think that I will adjust the flow direction since the taller background plants get sweep to the left too much. Are you aiming your outflow at about a 45 degree angle toward the left front so that it actually hits directly mid-front of the tank and gets ricochet to the left side? Also looks like you are pumping alot of CO2. I will also bump mine up as well.
I can see your E. setaceum are sitting real low and they are looking very happy. I'll be damn!!!


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## ccLansman (Jan 30, 2007)

I run a homemade inline diffuser(plans off barrreport) I modded it a bit to save on flow rate, the barbs are straight out the top and bottom instead of bent off the side, seems to allow full flow out of my eheim 2026. It is inline on the outflow from the filter. I made a custom spray bar out of sprinkler drip line tubing and have it attached to the back wall of the tank. Solenoid turns the co2 an hour before lights on at 3-4bps and the drop checker is green by lights on. All plants are pearling by midday. The spray bar off the back creates a nice mixing from front to back. I put some gh booster in and was amazed at how well the spray bar circulated the stuff, so that must mean good co2/nutrient circulation.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Round Head said:


> Are you aiming your outflow at about a 45 degree angle toward the left front so that it actually hits directly mid-front of the tank and gets ricochet to the left side?
> I can see your E. setaceum are sitting real low and they are looking very happy. I'll be damn!!!


No, no 45 degree angle's  mounted on front right
shooting to the left side straight across the front.

setacheum has always been one of my favorite all
time plants, it is similar to raising a wife and three
daughters, can be very demanding at times...


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

Craig... your garden looks wonderful. maybe it's time to get an inline diffuser or reactor.


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

Wö£fëñxXx said:


> No, no 45 degree angle's  mounted on front right
> shooting to the left side straight across the front.
> 
> setacheum has always been one of my favorite all
> ...


Great idea having the outflow up front Craig. That way you don't sweep away the taller background plants. Duh!!!


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Thanks Red, no scape at all, just growing plants and constantly
moving things around. the plants do look good however.
I would like to tinker with an inline diffuser to see what
I could get out of it.
I'm not to crazy about reactors, they are just so ghetto.
I have and have made many.

Whichever you choose, just make sure you are pumping enough
gas to satisfy the plants. 
I will choke a fish for a plant any day, screw the fish... :hihi: 
I am not a cruel individual, plants do come first though.

Yeah Round Head.... DuH! 
Keep updating us...


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

lol... i'm a fish man before a plant man... but i do love "natural" environments. I just ordered a cal aqua inline diffuser. I'll let you know how it goes.


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## bigstick120 (May 23, 2005)

Craig! A 120p as a farm tank! Scape that sucker!!!!! Get a 33 long to farm out plants!


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

lol @ bigstick... I already have plans for a 120p and it's not as a garden... lol. I don't care what you do with your tank Craig... just send us a little love in the SnS.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

bigstick120 said:


> Craig! A 120p as a farm tank! Scape that sucker!!!!! Get a 33 long to farm out plants!


Hehe, I concur Jeff and have always wanted too, to a degree,
but "farming" is what has paid for that tank and filter and pipes,
diffusers etc...
My two youngest daughters 18 & 19 just started college, I may
have to sell the entire setup to stay away from the poor house :hihi: 

Today is the start of a lovely 4 day weekend for me, so I am
going to be working on that very idea you mention.
Thanks


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

Craig,
Please explain for me a few things about TDS.
Before I did my weekly 50%-60% water change, the tank reads 391ppm.
After the water change with 100% RO/DI, it reads 191ppm.
And 3 days later the TDS reading is up to 232ppm.
I understand that if I do another big water change, the TDS will be down to half, (trivial). But what is the major cause for the increase in hardness, fish food, fish poop, decay plants, or ferts/CSM? And I'm sure rinsing out the filter will also lower the TDS reading.


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

Everything affects TDS. If you add hardness to you water that will cause a big change for that dose. From there on the big hitters are the ferts, especially K2SO4 which causes a larger ppm change of them all.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Everything you dose affects TDS, but don't get to hung up
on TDS alone. Focus on growing plants well.
People who have algae issues usually spend their time
studying algae, wanting to know why why why, it is
because they haven't studied how to grow plants well
yet.

I just checked my TDS for the first time in a week or so,
because I don't have to test it much, I can just look at the
tank and see what is happening, by the way the plants look.

My TDS was 184 for what that's worth, water change Sunday
so everything is copacetic.

Do two or three or as few or as many water changes you need
to get the TDS lower.
My RO water is 0 TDS, when I do a water change my tank is
somewhere in the neighborhood of 70 to 90 TDS. 
Everytime you dose test the TDS before and after, this will give
you an idea of what is happening.


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## Round Head (May 23, 2008)

Thanks a bunch guys.
I'm such a moron. I bought my RO/DI filters from A.W.I. and it came with a digital TDS meter. It's been nearly 2 years and I just recently took it out of the package and start using it. Weird thing is I don't have any problems with major algae, just the green crud on the glass that's all.


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