# Stocking a 75G with Angel Fish



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

So I got my wife to agree to letting me buy a 75G tank if she can get Angel fish. I have nothing against Angel fish and it seemed like a small price to pay. :hihi:

I currently have neon tetras, cherry barbs, green corys and otos in my 30G. They will all be rehomed to the 75G. Will I have any issue with these and the Angels? I was planning on picking up the smallest Angels I could find (quarter sized) so they grow up in the tank and it will be moderately planted (a little denser than my current tank). 

I also wanted to up the number of cherry barbs and maybe get some more corys. I'm just not sure what the limit is on a 75G for small schooling fish and I've never housed something like an Angel that needs a decent amount of space. 

So what is a good number of Angels for a 75G if I want to keep some small schooling fish? Also, can I put rainbow sharks in a 75G? I've heard they are pretty peaceful. I saw them at the LFS and they look beautiful.


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## lksdrinker (Feb 12, 2014)

The neons _could_ become snacks for the angels. But if you get juvenile angels and they grow up in a tank with the neons they may never look at them as food. Just be aware of the possibility!

I think you'll be okay with everything else you mentioned. 

If you were just stocking the neons you could probably do 50+ in that 75 gallon tank. Probably wouldn't want that many if you've got other fish in there with them though. 

Once the angels reach maturity I'd say you probably wouldnt want more than 4 or maybe 5 along with a school of maybe 12-15 neons, maybe 8-10 cherry barbs and a few corys as well as a few otos. That would probably leave you towards the high end of stocking (at least at a quick uneducated guess).


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

I think the barbs will nip the fins of nickel sized Angelfish.
Maybe not so much if Angelfish are larger.
Seven adult Angelfish could work ,but may need to be able to re-home a few if pair forms and decides to become aggressive as they often due when in spawning mode and or protecting egg's,fry.
Have a sister who has nine adult Angelfish in 75 gal and expressed wonderment that her shrimp population is dwindling. (she don't take advice very well)


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## Midnighttide102 (Oct 2, 2014)

No prob with cherry barbs there not nippers like some other barbs I keep them myself with angels and have never had a prob along with 3 Otto and 6 neons 5 cherry barbs 4 cayman island Lima and 2 angelfish 1 honey gourami in 30 gallon planted tank I've never had an issue , now as far as you putting in a few angelfish the problem is going to come down the road when they reach breeding age and pair up angelfish become pretty aggressive when breeding so keep that in mind


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

I was thinking a pair or two of angels since they become territorial during spawning. I'd almost prefer a group of 3 males if I could find them, but I read that sexing angels is hard without them mating. 

I only wanted a handful of angels, not a primarily angel fish centered tank. I do like the small schools of fish more than centerpiece fish, but my wife has a lot of say-so. 

I'm rehoming my shrimp population because I doubt they would enjoy living in a 75G with larger fish.


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## Beefy (Mar 6, 2015)

I have no experience with angels, but have been reading a lot about them a lot in planning a new tank. Opinions vary but the general consensus is to pick up a good number of juveniles, maybe 5-7. Then when (if!) you get two of them pair off for their very first breeding, immediately get rid of the others. Alternative would be to buy a proven-breeding pair right off the bat. Safe, but a bit boring to my tastes.

You could try and keep two breeding pairs in a 75, but most don't recommend it. A 6' long tank would be more appropriate for two pairs.


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## RugburnTanks (Mar 31, 2015)

Neons and angels are fine as long as you don't have baby neons and you get juvenile angelfish. I've kept them in the past fine.


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

I decreased my holding of angels from 7 to 4 recently. Now I have two pairs that spawn. One pair is very territorial. They will go after the other two angels, otos, corries even snails...
Two of the 3 angels I sold were big males. Their height was like half the height of my 75 gal tanks. From my point of view, 7 angels in a 75 gallons was too much.


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## bklyndrvr (May 24, 2008)

I had a 75 gallon with 4 angels that a friend gave me. I bought about 15 rummy nose tetras to go with them and they looked great. The rummy would school together very well and zip back and forth. Eventually two Angel's paired up and took over 1/2 the tank during breeding time. Otherwise I had no issues.


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## Bushkill (Feb 15, 2012)

Freemananana said:


> I was thinking a pair or two of angels since they become territorial during spawning. I'd almost prefer a group of 3 males if I could find them, but I read that sexing angels is hard without them mating.
> 
> I only wanted a handful of angels, not a primarily angel fish centered tank. I do like the small schools of fish more than centerpiece fish, but my wife has a lot of say-so.
> 
> I'm rehoming my shrimp population because I doubt they would enjoy living in a 75G with larger fish.


Actually the best scenario would be a sorority tank. All females.

It's been said here already. You can start with a bunch, but you may up with two if a pair forms. A 75G is a bit on the small side for two pair to live side by side but it can happen. I have three in the 180G. 

There are no hard and fast rules, but the mating process is temporary and all goes back to normal after a little less than a week and the eggs are consumed. You could also end up with a VERY good parenting pair and it could go longer and with more aggression.

In the end, you just need to have a back up plan if the aggression becomes too intense. Just don't overreact to pushing and shoving. If it gets to the point where a fish is no longer able to get a share of the food, you need to step in. Just don't try to overfeed to compensate.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Well my wife said one pair is all she wanted, so that solves that. I'll pick up two and go for that. 

As for tank mates, I was checking out the stock at the LFS. They had blue rams, gouramis (many types) and rainbow sharks. Would those work with a pair of angels? Those are just the fish that caught my eye.


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## Bushkill (Feb 15, 2012)

Picking up two won't guarantee you a pair. Unless they are really large and older, you can tell a male easier but as juveniles or even sub-adults it's pure guesswork. Two large males stand a 50-50 chance of co-habitating peacefully as adults. Chances are a little better with two females.
Those fish should work fine, but some gouramis can get a little pushy. I haven't owned one in decades, so hopefully someone else will chime in on that one.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Searching online brings up a million similar threads but with differences in ideas that change the while concept. I could also go by what my LFS says or Petsmart, but those seem to be bad ideas from what I've gathered. So I made a thread to get store input since every tank has differences that effect stocking. 

But I'll keep searching. Rams, angels and gouramis seem to coexist fine from what I've read this far.


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

Freemananana said:


> Searching online brings up a million similar threads but with differences in ideas that change the while concept. I could also go by what my LFS says or Petsmart, but those seem to be bad ideas from what I've gathered. So I made a thread to get store input since every tank has differences that effect stocking.
> 
> But I'll keep searching. Rams, angels and gouramis seem to coexist fine from what I've read this far.


 
I might select the Pearl gourami for they are not as prone to Iridovirus that Colisa Ialia (sp) and variant's thereof are prone to.
No need to invite possible disease to otherwise healthy stock.
Diamond tetras,Lemon tetra's, bleeding heart tetra's are a few that are fairly common and are a bit too large for even adult angelfish to readily consider snacks like some of the smaller tetra's.
Can google,bing,"Dwarf gourami disease" for more info on the iridovirus that many of the imported varieties are blessed with.

Bump:


Midnighttide102 said:


> No prob with cherry barbs there not nippers like some other barbs I keep them myself with angels and have never had a prob along with 3 Otto and 6 neons 5 cherry barbs 4 cayman island Lima and 2 angelfish 1 honey gourami in 30 gallon planted tank I've never had an issue , now as far as you putting in a few angelfish the problem is going to come down the road when they reach breeding age and pair up angelfish become pretty aggressive when breeding so keep that in mind


 I kept the cherry barbs with long finned albino bristlenose that I care
for .
they were alright for a couple week's and began nipping the long fins of both the adult bristlenose and babies as well anytime the bristlenose were caught on the glass above the substrate.
Mileage might vary for other's who had better luck, but I did not much care for their behavior and it was no easy task to catch them from large heavily planted tank.

Bump:


Bushkill said:


> Actually the best scenario would be a sorority tank. All females.
> 
> It's been said here already. You can start with a bunch, but you may up with two if a pair forms. A 75G is a bit on the small side for two pair to live side by side but it can happen. I have three in the 180G.
> 
> ...


 
Good advice.:hihi:


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

Fishbarrie said:


> I can not believe these responses. You should look at a minimum of one pair per 75 gal. 100gal preferably. (are you tring to crreate a fish pound!) These fish need plants, wood and rock to survive naturally in your tank.
> 
> i am sorry but if you need to ask these very basic questions on fish habitation ..... then maybe do your homework and start slowly and work your way up. I have been an aquariumist for over 30 years and have always followed experienced researched advice vs chat line, blog garbage, etc. etc..
> Do your research and you will be rewarded with a healthy aquatic environment!!


 I might would agree with you that one pair would be best if breeding the fish were my aim. But as most of the angelfish offered are quite small, and juveniles,it is near impossible to get a mated pair without placing several juveniles in the tank and letting a pair form "naturally".
Is the way with most cichlids in my experience.
As is also the way with many of the cichlids,,larger number's help to spread out the aggression as the fish grow and become sexually mature.
Much easier to realize a pair in this way.
Many are those who keep several adult fish together in tanks of 55 gal or larger(better) such as Discus, and Angelfish.(many other's as well).
If they are all raised together as juvies,,the fishes work out the pecking order at fairly young age and if one is lucky,, this order is maintained with exception of the pair(s) that may indeed form to produce fry.
Then as mentioned..one may have to move the breeding pair to their own tank which could be as small as 29 gal.
In truth,there ain't much that is natural about a glass box of water where there are no tides,rain's,current's,to carry away organic waste and where it is upon us, to remove the unwanted waste via water changes.
Plant's would help with both water quality,and as source of comfort for the fishes.
Something as simple as fast growing water sprite planted in substrate, or left to float on the surface could do well in such a tank and some anubia attached to some wood (maybe several) could also do well.
these are just a couple of the easier plant's that can do well with low to moderate light and not much in the way of care.
As for rock's..all they need is substrate.
Some of the afore mentioned may be of some interest/help to the OP rather than attacking an earnest effort at researching what may or may not work for their goals by gathering opinions from what they might hope are those with some measure of experiences.
Measured opinion's are a good thing I think.
In any event.. I might be a bit turned off by those with such an approach as your's.

You are most assuredly not the only one here with 20 +year's of experiences to share.


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## Midnighttide102 (Oct 2, 2014)

I've keep cherry barbs for years and never once have had a issue with them but fish will be fish they all have there own personality so you never know , stay away from the 3 spot gourami they are pretty aggressive as far as gouramis go the pearls you spoke of are much more peaceful 
Now as far as this Fishbarrie guy WOW need I say more ? Were all here because we love the hobby and share exsperaence not BASH anyone act RUDE and criticize enough said before I stoop to your level sir : )


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## somewhatshocked (Aug 8, 2011)

Fishbarrie said:


> The number of posts and reply's does not make you a viable expert


Nor does being a hobbyist for 30 years.

Here's the deal, folks: Don't insult other members. Period. Even if you think they deserve it.

This is a forum filled with kids, here with parental permission, and each of you is expected to maintain a certain level of respect when interacting here. Always remember that this is a plant forum - not life or death. There's never a need to get nasty.

I won't clean this thread up again.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Thanks for the replies. 

I've used forums for quite awhile and I've come to expect 'debates' amongst enthusiasts. 

As for saying I shouldn't keep fish because I don't know the answers, that's crazy talk. That's why I'm seeking answers before purchasing fish. I am new to the hobby and I've had success with my current 30 gallon tank. I have no experience with larger fish so that's why I've come here. 

Could I keep a single Angelfish? I've read varying opinions on them wanting a mate, but I don't really want to stock 5-6 of them and then keep just one pair after they do decide on mates. I also don't really want to purchase a pair of them because they would most likely be large enough to dominate all other tank mates. 

Rams seem to be much of the same, but I've read many success stories on pairs coexisting in much smaller tanks (20-30G) with similarly sized, peaceful, tank mates. 

Lastly, the gouramis. I've seen some labeled 'gouramis' and not dwarf gouramis. Both are quite beautiful. My local fish store has blue, flame red, dwarfs, pearls, honeys, sunset honeys and kissing gouramis. I'd like to find the most peaceful and add some to this potential community tank.

I have neons (sorry if they end up fish food), cherry barbs, corys and otos in my tank now. Aside from the neons, they should coexist peacefully. The neons will probably end up food. Some of them are adult size and will probably survive. I may actually just rehome them.


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

Yes you can keep just one Angelfish.
Many are those who attempt to attach humanistic qualities to fishes (ie) I think he/she is lonely.
Perhaps bigger question.. Will the wife be receptive to the lone Angelfish??
My money say's No ,and one day you will come home and there will be two or more.
"But the one we have looked so lonely"


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

She said she was okay with just one. She is quite accepting of stuff like this. Her favorite fish right now are my otos, she has named them all and can tell them apart. I just asked her what her favorite fish was, and aside from a yellow tang, she said angelfish. So I proposed that I would house angelfish if I could get a larger tank. That's what started the whole thing. If I can only house one, I'm sure she will understand. It will be _*her*_ fish. She will probably name it and claim it as her own.


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## Midnighttide102 (Oct 2, 2014)

Keeping a single angelfish is not a good idea I've keep and breed angels for over 10 years you want to at least keep 2 min to be happy in a tank as far as gouramis pearls or any of the dwarf's are the most peaceful shoot a note to Bushkill he is also a angelfish breeder for many years and knows his stuff on them as well , you won't have a prob with 2 angelfish unless they pair and lay eggs and even at that all you have to do is pull the eggs and they go right back to normal just being angelfish the odds of getting a breeding pair only starting with 2 are very unlikely


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

I talked it over with my wife, basically just read this thread. She said angelfish are jerks (PG version) and she doesn't care if we get them or not. Despite this, I'm sort of attached to them. Maybe I'll avoid them in this community tank. I've heard great stories about them and they are eye catching fish.


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## Midnighttide102 (Oct 2, 2014)

There is honestly no reason to be afraid to keep angelfish there honestly night the demons people think at times for the most part they are very peaceful majestic fish with interactive traits which makes them fun to keep and enjoy when I had my fish room 50 tanks 95 % were my angels I was breeding and raising they deff have there own personality's don't cut yourself short and give 2 a try you might just be surprised how much you & your wife end up enjoying them


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

Freemananana said:


> I talked it over with my wife, basically just read this thread. She said angelfish are jerks (PG version) and she doesn't care if we get them or not. Despite this, I'm sort of attached to them. Maybe I'll avoid them in this community tank. I've heard great stories about them and they are eye catching fish.


If she ever has the chance to see angels moving around eggs from leaf to leaf and bringing back home those babies that try to run away she will change her mind.  And not to mention how much time they spend aerating the eggs with their fins.


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## Beefy (Mar 6, 2015)

Freemananana said:


> She said angelfish are jerks (PG version) and she doesn't care if we get them or not.


They are a cichlid...... and like all cichlids there is the potential for them to be jerks, but that is what gives them their unique personality and makes the tank interesting. A school of cardinal tetras is very pretty, but it has zero personality.

Seriously, you should look into starting with a group of juveniles, hope you get a breeding pair, then off-load the rest to a good home. Fill the rest of the tank with a couple of decent schools of mid-dwelling dither fish, some corydoras and a cleanup crew (ottos?) and you are all set.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

That is pretty much my plan at this point. I'll probably look for a pair of angels, a school of cherry barbs and my current school of neons, my school of corys and the school of otos I already have. 

I may look to rehome the neons in favor of something else.


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## TINNGG (Mar 9, 2005)

I have a 75, and it's occupied by two breeding pairs. This was not my intent; I just wanted something that was out in the open (the lone Bolivian ram hid all the time, and the bristle nose...) The pet store had just gotten in a shipment, and I came home with two overloaded shipping bags of 3 adult angels each. This was...a little over a month ago. Two were for my daughter's tank, thank God. Shortly after they settled in - like within 5 days - two of them started pairing off.

My tank is now sporting two homemade dividers - to give each pair space, and to provide a sanctuary for the diamond tetras I also brought home...and the poor Bolivian ram. At least he's out in the open now. Still...it's interesting.

And I referred to them among friends as fallen angels.

Previous experience was 3 Peruvians who each had his (I assume they were all male) corner and spent much of the day near the middle of the tank, doing the piscine equivalent of trash talking each other.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

I definitely don't want multiple breeding pairs. Just one pair would really be nice as 'centerpiece' fish. I don't even care if they breed. I just want them to be decent community fish, which I think will happen if they grow up in the tank and I luck out on the temperament.


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## TINNGG (Mar 9, 2005)

I've never had issues with them temperament wise if they were introduced as juveniles. This is the first time I've ever bought a group of adults. The LFS owner was bemused by their size - they were listed as medium on the stock sheet. Dunno if there was a mixup at the distributor or what. The irony is that I was looking for youngsters and she supposedly had gotten some in but couldn't locate the bag.

I don't have the fry in the tank itself - have them in a marina breeding box. Mom and dad get very agitated whenever I go to feed the young. I suspect they'd care for them themselves but there are too many tank mates for that to happen.


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## Vancat2 (Jun 23, 2010)

Angelfish are so beautiful, and a mystery to me. I kept 7 wild altums for a few years and they were the greatest, most interesting fish ever- very healthy and active, with great personalities. A few years after they were gone, I got 2 smaller koi angels at an LFS, as I missed having angels. They were wimpy, boring fish and died one at a time.


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