# My 31g Frameless HC Aquascape *Update July 17,2007 Tek installed, total teardown*



## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Hey all, this is my first attempt at an Iwagumi-ish styled tank. Thanks to a member on a local forum, he brought in a whole bunch of ADA goods. I picked up 1 bag of powersand and 2 bags of Aquasoil Amazonia. I layed out the Powersand then topped it with Aquasoil and began to do the scape. I know the powersand is kind of thin, but I had to stay within my budget. 

The weapons I chose are:
31g Frameless Hagen
36'' Coralife Dual CF 2X96 watts
Stand I bought off someone on Craigslist and painted black
Eheim 2026 Professionel II
Hydor 201 Inline Heater
APC SurgeArrest Powerbar



A final pic after I layed out the HC, Rotala Sp Green, and Blyxa. 


Tell me what you guys think. Thanks


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

Any rocks? To be iwagumi you need rocks. Iwagumi has to do with a 3 rock grouping.


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## ringram (Jan 19, 2005)

Looks great!I can't quite tell what you used to make the hill on the left. Is that some sort of molded plastic piece? The blyxa will soon cover the Co2 diffuser. That's a good thing though.
Lots of light though. Almost 6wpg. That HC should spread in no time.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Yeh, I planned to get some rocks, but its kind of hard to find rocks that look similar to Seiryu rocks, atleast in Canada. Thats what im trying to look for. Are there any other ones that would fit nicely? That hill was just formed with the aquasoil, no means of reinforcement.


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## Blacksunshine (Oct 11, 2006)

off to a good start. will look good as it matures and once you track down some rocks. 
If you ahve any places that sell bonsai trees or supplies you might be able to get ahold of some nice rocks.


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## Subotaj (Oct 16, 2006)

It will be a beautiful one!


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## Nightshop (May 12, 2006)

192 watts is a lot over a 31 gallon, how many hours do you plan on keeping it on during the day?


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## Finch_man (Mar 21, 2006)

I have heard that if you have to much lighting on the HC, the HC won't spread out as much and grow more compact.


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## sNApple (Nov 6, 2005)

i once heard that eco complete wont even grow hc


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

you can grow hc in eco it just won't grow as fast as in AS. I've done it before.


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## bigstick120 (May 23, 2005)

sNApple said:


> i once heard that eco complete wont even grow hc


Very False! Take a look at my 29 journal, what you heard was someone looking for an excuse!:icon_wink


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

This is gonna be an awesome one, i'm subscribing.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Well for some reason the tank turned pretty murky and the HC started melting. I did the weekly 50% water change and it cleared it up, slowly everyday it gets better. I have the lighting on from 3-11. The HC was thinned out a bit due to some of it simply floating up but the ones that are well planted are doing better after the murky fiasco. Im adding in some shrimps slowly to see how things are going. Big Als Boxing Day Sale at 2$ CDN for an Amano, yes I know sNApple not as good as your deal:icon_bigg . I seem to have a battle with that stringy riccia weed that intertwines with everything, any tips?


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Kicker said:


> Well for some reason the tank turned pretty murky and the HC started melting. I did the weekly 50% water change and it cleared it up, slowly everyday it gets better. I have the lighting on from 3-11. The HC was thinned out a bit due to some of it simply floating up but the ones that are well planted are doing better after the murky fiasco. Im adding in some shrimps slowly to see how things are going. Big Als Boxing Day Sale at 2$ CDN for an Amano, yes I know sNApple not as good as your deal:icon_bigg . I seem to have a battle with that stringy riccia weed that intertwines with everything, any tips?


you mean the Utriculara <bladderwort>? I hate that crap. It hijacked in some plants I bought on here and has been a pain ever since. I use long teezers and slowly pull them out every time I see them. One day I may get rid of it, but I doubt it.


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

BTW I grow HC in eco, so that is bs..... looking forward to seeing this fill in~


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## ringram (Jan 19, 2005)

I have HC in fluorite with 5.5wpg right now and its not growing much at all. It's basically just collecting debris and some detritus algae.


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## sNApple (Nov 6, 2005)

sNApple said:


> i once heard that eco complete wont even grow hc


INTERNET JOKE


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

bigstick120 said:


> Very False! Take a look at my 29 journal, what you heard was someone looking for an excuse!:icon_wink


Haha, well said.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## sNApple (Nov 6, 2005)

Kicker said:


> Well for some reason the tank turned pretty murky and the HC started melting. I did the weekly 50% water change and it cleared it up, slowly everyday it gets better. I have the lighting on from 3-11. The HC was thinned out a bit due to some of it simply floating up but the ones that are well planted are doing better after the murky fiasco. Im adding in some shrimps slowly to see how things are going. Big Als Boxing Day Sale at 2$ CDN for an Amano, yes I know sNApple not as good as your deal:icon_bigg . I seem to have a battle with that stringy riccia weed that intertwines with everything, any tips?


hey kicker you still gotta update with pics, even when things go bad... thats what make good journals


and LOL ^^ at people taking what i said seriously.


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## mr.sandman (Nov 7, 2006)

Any updates??


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

I'll try and get them done tonight.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

OK here are some updates:
I cant get the HC to grow nuts, im bubbling Co2 at like 2 bps and its getting shot throughout the tank I can see the bubbles everywhere. Im dosing 1/4 tsp KNO3, 1/16 tsp of KH2PO4, and 5 ml trace via the EI method every other day etc. The HC doesnt seem to be taking off in some cases melting also. Sorry about the low water level tommorow is the day for water changes so today is at its worst. Here are the pics:


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

HC looks to be growing to me, but slow.


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## bigstick120 (May 23, 2005)

HC seems to take a little while to get settled in before it takes off, just keep at it and it will get going for you


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## D.gilly (Sep 25, 2005)

where the heck did you find HC in canada! ive been trying for so long after an aquaspot fiasco i realized its next to impossible to get here. if you dont mind me asking when your HC fills in would you mind selling me some ?


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## trfjason (Aug 10, 2006)

D.gilly said:


> where the heck did you find HC in canada! ive been trying for so long after an aquaspot fiasco i realized its next to impossible to get here. if you dont mind me asking when your HC fills in would you mind selling me some ?


I got my HC from Big Al's Oakville. I have seen them in Big Al's Mississauga too!

Check out my 31G: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/photo-album/38683-trfs-31-gallon-planted-updated-01-a.html


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

I found a seller from a local forum here in BC. I grew the little patch in a 10g left floating for a few months and just before I planted this 31g I had the top of a 10g full of HC.


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## D.gilly (Sep 25, 2005)

I hear many good things about big als oakville mabey one day ill go there when they have some hc. thanks for the help.


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## trfjason (Aug 10, 2006)

D.gilly said:


> I hear many good things about big als oakville mabey one day ill go there when they have some hc. thanks for the help.


Not a problem!

Big Al's Oakville has the widest selection of plants. It's worth a drive to visit that shop.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Well I had a green water outbreak, not too pleasant. I did water changes 4 times this week and another tommorow. After looking at last weeks pics the HC and Rotala went pretty good Id say. My Rhinox 5000 came in, I wasnt to happy about the packaging, it was a styofoam box with the rhinox jingling inside wrapped in bubble wrap. Pretty unacceptable, I mean you couldve used paper or something. None the less it still funstions way better then my old Boyu.


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## thatguy (Oct 11, 2005)

Your HC will take off, just wait. For whatever reason, it likes to wait a bit then growth is fast.


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

Time to grab a diatom filter or a UV sterilizer.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Im just trying to do water changes everyday and I reduced one of my lights from 2 to 1X96 watts. Im not dosing any ferts right now except Flourish every other day. I think my GW started from the ferts ( I dosed EI). Im just letting the Aqua soil feed the plants till everything evens out. I dont know if Id want to spend the money on a diatom or UV filter i'd only use a couple of times.


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

Cutting it down from 2 bulbs to 1 bulb isn't gonna get rid of GW. Any spores of algae will just keep replicating and growing even with minimal light.

Your best bet would be to do a blackout, get a diatom filter, or UV sterilizer.

Did you stir up the substrate recently? Major re-planting?


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

I havent done any major replanting or substrate movement since i started her up. Ive heard once you really aggrevate the AS it will leech nutrients into the water causing the GW right?


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

yeah it could. Get a UV and be done with it. 3 days and crystal clear. IMO if I was doing a minimalist scape <with not a lot of fast growes in it> I would have a UV running 24/7. Pristine water is one of the most important parts to thos types of scapes. There is no hardscape and the growth itself is the "show" so water clarity is key. Buck up and put one inline....


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## sNApple (Nov 6, 2005)

UV sterilizer girl friend yea yeah


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## eklikewhoa (Aug 29, 2006)

What photo period are you running on your tank?

I have the coralife 2x96w fixture over my 30g as well and just wanted to hear how you are running yours. I have mine set for 1x96 for 7-8hrs and 2x96w for 3hrs in the middle of my photo period. I also didn't dose any ferts for the first week with just daily water changes. 

I think your HC is growing fine! I have mine and after the first week it's finally spreading horizontally.

Nice looking tank!


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## apistaeasy (Nov 5, 2005)

I'm sure many of the things I did in this post will also apply to GW.

Good luck, and I look forward to updates.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

In order to rid yourself of GW you have two options. Wait it out. It will disappear on it's own in 4-6 weeks. Or buy a UV sterilizer and see water so clear it's like it's not even there. Blackouts do not kill algae, they kill your plants and shift your algae problem to another species. Water changes will not rid you of GW, they will make the problem worse.

I have done both. I run a UV sterilizer inline with my canister and results could not be better. 

In summary: Eliminate fertilizing, reduce lighting to 7-8 hours per day, do only one WC per week at 30-40% volume. Wait.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

New Updates:
No time to find a way to mount the Tek. Coralife will be up for sale soon hopefully. Green water is still a pain, tommorow I'll follow up on a friends advice on removing it with particle clumper and alot of mechanical filtration. The HC hasnt been touched and has grown alot by comparing the pics but the Rotala has been trimmed twice now and the blyxa was thinned slightly. Theres like 4 Amanos and like 6-10 cherries in there cleaning and adding some colour and movement to the tank. I had the Co2 diffuser right in the middle of the front side of the glass cause the newly mounted spraybar created this downward water movement that hit the glass and went down, so the Co2 was constantly being pushed down. It created a great diffusion affect but as you can see the left side of the HC hasnt grown very much so I moved it over. Im dosing only calcium and magnesium after my weekl w/c. And trace every other day. No other ferts as they are what seemed to have caused this.


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## aquarium boy (Jul 28, 2004)

looks nice. i agree with the rest of everyone else a uv pump is litteraly a must for any planted tank. not only does it get rid of alot of bad things it makes your water turn into air...


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## eklikewhoa (Aug 29, 2006)

The Hc is growing really nicely!


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## EdTheEdge (Jan 25, 2007)

Just a thought...

I had a green water experience once (knock on wood) a long long time ago when I was first attemping planted aquaria. I only had guppies in the tank so I did two or three COMPLETE water changes (one right after the other) only leaving enough water for the fish to barely swin upright. I also did a thorough filter cleaning before and after the water change. After that I blacked out the tank for a day and the green water just went away. Luckily guppies are pretty hardy and I didn't loose a single one. 

I know this type of attack will be frowned upon but it worked for me. As always YMMV.


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Here are some new pics, I finally got my GW to disappear. I have plenty of baby shrimps in there and alot are prego. 








Sorry for the blurry pic


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

Very nice HC lawn.


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## intermision (Nov 7, 2005)

Looks great, but I think it needs some sort of hardscape.


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

sweet! lovin it!


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Looks like HC for sale! roud:


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## Yoshi (Apr 5, 2007)

The HC lawn looks amazing, any updates?


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

When you folks use ADA soil, you need to do 2-3x a week 50% water changes, just like ADA suggest, for the first 4-6 weeks and then taper off.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## paradise (Dec 11, 2003)

Tom's right, people dont do the right thing with Aquasoil. I was told by several people "in the know" to follow a doubling schedule for Aquasoil. Once you setup the tank and fill it, you do WC after 1 day, then 2 days, then 4 days, then weekly after that. Should have no problems. Also this tank was started with minimal amount of plants that soak in excess nutrients. When I start an Aquasoil tank, I just throw a ton of stems into it for the initial setup and then remove 'em after 2 weeks, once the tank starts running smoothly and the rest of the plants take hold.


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## eklikewhoa (Aug 29, 2006)

When I set up a tank with AS I do daily water changes.


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## sNApple (Nov 6, 2005)

this tanks like 4 months old now guys....

looks good jordan!


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

plantbrain said:


> When you folks use ADA soil, you need to do 2-3x a week 50% water changes, just like ADA suggest, for the first 4-6 weeks and then taper off.
> 
> Regards,
> Tom Barr


If someone is spending the change and effort to buy AS, I think they would probably take the time to read the instructions. :icon_roll


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## FelixAvery (Jan 11, 2007)

give us an update please?
got any hardscape yet?


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## styxx (Jul 2, 2003)

Plantbrain, that's correct, the first month is hell but it gets *dramatically* better after that to perfect clarity and outrageous plant growth...


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## jebarj90 (Mar 11, 2007)

Hey, What kind of plants are those in the back left and the back right corner???


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

yeah i want to know that too!


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## ringram (Jan 19, 2005)

Looking good!
As for the wc's with aquasoil -- I agree. I was doing wc's every 2-3 days for the first month or so, then every 3-4 days for the next month or so. I'm still doing wc's every 3-4 days (3 months into it now) as I'm just anal about pristine water quality and build-up of nutrients.


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## Roc (Mar 16, 2007)

ringram said:


> Looking good!
> As for the wc's with aquasoil -- I agree. I was doing wc's every 2-3 days for the first month or so, then every 3-4 days for the next month or so. I'm still doing wc's every 3-4 days (3 months into it now) as I'm just anal about pristine water quality and build-up of nutrients.


Thinks about my poor fish only getting 20% WC 1 time per week..............:fish:


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## terri (Mar 25, 2007)

Hi Kicker,
Very nice tanks. Can you tell me where I can get nice plants ? I live in Victoria and I cannot get many plants on the Island.
I am looking for HC and Glosso. Wonder whether I can courier some plants to the Island. Is Rotala SP Green a ground cover?


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## SuRje1976 (Feb 2, 2006)

jebarj90 said:


> Hey, What kind of plants are those in the back left and the back right corner???


Back left is Blyxa japonica - back right is Rotala sp. Kicker - please correct me if I'm wrong!


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Yepp you're correct Surje. Well major replant was done yesterday, water is still a bit cloudy. I went to the local landscape shop and found some Lace rock i think it is. I soaked it for a month in a bucket then boiled the crap out of em for like 30 mins. L Aromatica was trimmed with the tips being replanted. The Blyxa was identical to sNApples so I tore that out and planted small plantlets, the rest is going to King Ed. The Downoi is coming back to life but my HC seems to be lacking something. Its not as dense as before im going to see what happens if I stop dosing my KNO3 and KH2PO4 and just dose Flourish every other day along with some excel. Im still dosing the Mg and Ca on w/c days which is every week 50%.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

Try holding off on the CA and MG...I had the same problem and it seemed to do the trick.


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## mrbelvedere (Nov 15, 2005)

I'd move the back right rock up about an inch and a half. Then I'd plant more L. aromatica in the group, it would look nicer in a bigger group.


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## ikuzo (Jul 11, 2006)

what is that plant at the bottom right?


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## apistaeasy (Nov 5, 2005)

ikuzo said:


> what is that plant at the bottom right?



Pogostemon helferi, aka Downoi


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## styxx (Jul 2, 2003)

Kicker, how in the hell do you get your HC so dark green. Mine is really coming along splendidly but it's not as dark. (Not to threadjack but I though ou might want to see what I'm talking about. http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/photo-album/44809-my-ada-60p-warning-56k-updated.html) 
Are you dosing Iron regularly and if so what concentration do you like to keep it at or do you attribute that depth of that green to something else other than Fe? Just curious. Oh, btw- are those shrimp adults in the3rd pic on your 3-25-07 post? Thanks!


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

I installed the Tek, its ghetto rigged on styrofoam. Its got 2 10k and 2 Giesemann 6000k Middays. It looks so much better than the Coralife in terms of brightness and colour. Im a noob at cameras so it may look a bit green or murky. The waters still murky from the substrate plowing. I tore out the HC and the other plants. Dont mind the white rocks, its the powersand that was brought up with the rest of the other plants. I know it looks gross, i'll take it out later. Hopefully this time the HC doesnt lift out like when I had my Coralife.


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## Kelley (Nov 2, 2006)

What is in the little breeder box?


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## Kicker (Jul 17, 2006)

Just some random plants I wanted to keep for a bit like some glosso and Subwassertang.


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## Nightshop (May 12, 2006)

I hope this new scape grows in successfully and beautifully just like the previous.

Good luck!


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## Zer (May 23, 2007)

wow, you really had a nice scape, and it looks like you have the makings for another one. best of luck with the tek!


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## Yoshi (Apr 5, 2007)

Looking forward to see new developments, this tank was one of my favorites!


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