# ADA Aquariums worth the premium price?



## cmf0106

As a newcomer to planted aquariums, I am looking for a tank that will last me in the long run and provide great clarity. As a newcomer would I even notice the difference between ADA and a petstore brand? I am willing to purchase ADA if the premium is worth it.


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## DJ-Graham

The Ada is rimless and most pet store tanks are thinner glass and require a rim top and bottom


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## cmf0106

removed


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## sammyman

cmf0106 said:


> Thanks for replying. I understand ADA is rimless, with no top, but what do you mean by store tanks require a rim top and bottom? Wouldn't it be possible to just leave the store tank rimless?


The rim top and bottom hold the tank together. This isn't required with an ADA tank. ADA is considered the best by most, but there are other cheaper alternatives such as Mr. Aqua, GLA, etc.


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## Francis Xavier

While there are reports of success with people taking rims off of standard pet shop tanks, they aren't guaranteed or designed for that, so it's very possible for them to come apart and leak.

The ADA tanks are worth every bit the premium - they have super clear glass that is absolutely stunning in person. Another difference, aside from the no rim portion (which is pretty cool, helps make the tank look bigger than it actually is), is that the silicon work on the sides is nearly invisible - so you don't see all the silicon on the side like you do with a normal tank.

If you're looking for something for a display tank, there's nothing that can beat the ADA tank.


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## Lycosa

Everyone has their own opinion on this. Do I personally think that an ADA aquarium is worth the cost because of the low-iron glass and because it is rimless? No. I would buy one because of those _features_, but not because I thought that for the long term it's craftsmanship will be far superior to a regular store bought tank. I also don't really believe that the cost is justified. But.. whether it is justified or not, the tanks are beautiful. Further, they are built by the company founded by 'the man' of planted tanks...Takashi Amano. 

If you are looking for a rimless tank.. well, that can be bought from another tank maker that will rival an ADA tank in quality and craftsmanship..and cost less. Check out the tanks from GLA (Their banner is likely at the top of this page). There are also other manufacturers of rimless tanks if you do some research. If you want those features, then it'll be worth the research. If you just want a tank that isn't going to leak and hold up in the long term, just about any manufacturer will do. All the main manufacturers use a standard 3.8 safety rating in choosing the glass thickness for their tanks. All this means is that given the tanks rated volume, with standard glass, it will not deflect beyond an acceptable limit when full (actually it will not deflect with a lot more weight in the tank. The safety rating ensures some redundancy). Most manufacturers add an additional band at the top and bottom to further reduce glass deflection, but either way, it is designed safe.

So what it really comes down to is aesthetics. If you are willing to pay for the aesthetics that an ADA or rimless tank offers, then go with that. Otherwise, you should be able to buy a Marineland, Oceanic, or similar name-brand manufacturer's tank without worry about craftsmanship.

Hope this helps


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## cmf0106

Thanks for the in depth reply lycosa!

How do GLA aquariums rank with ADA?


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## Francis Xavier

The glass on the GLA tanks aren't the same grade as the ADA - so essentially, the current GLA tanks have a green tint to them where as the ADA ones are completely clear.


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## cmf0106

Francis Xavier said:


> The glass on the GLA tanks aren't the same grade as the ADA - so essentially, the current GLA tanks have a green tint to them where as the ADA ones are completely clear.


How noticeable/intense would you say the green tint is? A 17 gallon tank from ADA is 120$ vs 80$ from GLA.


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## Francis Xavier

It's pretty noticeable, especially if you ever see the two side by side - I've seen the older model ADA tanks that use the same glass as the current GLA ones and the green was always pretty apparent compared to the clarity of the low-iron grade glass (current ADA standard). 

When you look at pictures you can tell by looking at the side edges of the glass where the panes meet at the corners - 'high clarity' glass will be completely clear there, where as normal glass will be green. Basically the current GLA tank is about = to the Do!Aqua tank from ADA.


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## Lycosa

The difference is low-iron glass vs regular glass. The green tint isn't even visible until you get to a pretty thick piece of glass. While I agree that low-iron glass is very nice, smaller volume tanks will see very little difference. The difference in clarity in a smaller tank is comparable to acrylic and regular glass for those without much experience in looking through different glass types. The thicker the glass, the bigger the difference between low-iron glass and regular glass. Not that much difference between glass that is between 1/8" - 1/4" thick.

(Edit: If you are pleased with the clarity of glass of virtually all aquariums you find at your local pet store, then you will be pleased with GLA's rimless tanks. If you notice, and are bothered by the tint of regular glass, then a tank with low-iron glass would be more suitable for you. Besides ADA, glasscages.com sells rimless tanks and I'm pretty sure you can order one with low-iron glass as well.)


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## Mr. Fisher

I've owned several ADA tanks (2- MiniS, 1 MiniL, A Do!Aqua Cube).
ADA quality is second to none, so if you want ultra-clean lines and to really showcase your scape, ADA (or even Do!Aqua) is the way to go.

This being said, I have many ADA components on my main show tank (TruVu acrylic). I have an ADA diffuser, Cabochon ruby, etc.

My reason for going acrylic:

I feel that acrylic tanks are much lighter and much stronger than glass tanks.

With acrylic tanks, there are no silicone seams, and you don't have to worry about durability/chipping, etc.

Scratching acrylic is harder than some make it out to be.

Is ADA worth the price, yes, if you want quality. I've seen beautifuly scaped ADA tanks here in SF and online. 

Did I buy one for my own larger show tank? No. Acrylic is almost as clear as ADA glass, but it insulates better.


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## Mr. Fisher

Lycosa said:


> The difference is low-iron glass vs regular glass. The green tint isn't even visible until you get to a pretty thick piece of glass. While I agree that low-iron glass is very nice, smaller volume tanks will see very little difference. The difference in clarity in a smaller tank is comparable to acrylic and regular glass for those without much experience in looking through different glass types. The thicker the glass, the bigger the difference between low-iron glass and regular glass. Not that much difference between glass that is between 1/8" - 1/4" thick.


 
I'd have to disagree with this. I've seen plenty of smaller ADA tanks and their lower-end brand Do!Aqua, and there is even a visible difference here. Pet-store brand glass tanks are messy (especially with the silicone) and the quality leaves something to be desired.


The issue isn't just the quality of the glass, it's the craftsmanship. Although I haven't seen a Mr. Aqua tank, I doubt that this is the same quality as an ADA tank.


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## Francis Xavier

You can also always talk to Jeff at ADG (adgshop.com), not a bad idea if you're new to the hobby with questions about the ADA stuff. He's also got an account here, jsenske for pm's.


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## Jason Baliban

Worth every penny....the tanks and aquasoil, that is

jB


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## Lycosa

Mr. Fisher said:


> I'd have to disagree with this. I've seen plenty of smaller ADA tanks and their lower-end brand Do!Aqua, and there is even a visible difference here. Pet-store brand glass tanks are messy (especially with the silicone) and the quality leaves something to be desired.
> 
> 
> The issue isn't just the quality of the glass, it's the craftsmanship. Although I haven't seen a Mr. Aqua tank, I doubt that this is the same quality as an ADA tank.


I can appreciate the differences in an ADA tank and a regular store bought aquarium. The messy wide silicone has much to do with redundancy for what is anticipated as an aquarium that may be roughly handled or maintained poorly. The calculation for glass thickness is overrated for the volume as well. Then there is the bands on the top and bottom which further serve as a safety factor.. which really has a lot to do with both the stability of the seams and the deflection of the glass.. but for safety, not because the smaller volume tanks can not withstand the pressure exerted on the glass/silicone seams. When we start to get to larger volume tanks, like 55g long, the mid brace really provides that additional safety for glass deflection, but.. I've seen that removed as well on tanks (over 75g) that were level and and put on suitable stands and the tank held fine.

While ADA are stunning tanks, my argument is only that while the craftsmanship of ADA tanks are suited to the niche crowd who can appreciate the exceptional display they offer, the regular pet store silicone mess looking tank has it's own benefit in craftsmanship in that it has far more redundancy built in for the average homeowner that may apply much more stress to the tank than it should have. The question is, could an ADA tank survive the same abuse? (I can't answer that since I try and not abuse my tanks ) My impression from the OP was that he was looking for a tank that will last, and I find no reason to buy an ADA tank for that regard over a standard aquarium. If the aesthetics are worth the purchase price to the OP, then he will find himself with a beautiful tank. If he is more interested in a tank that will simply 'last', then I find no reason to buy the more expensive ADA tank over a standard aquarium.


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## Mr. Fisher

Lycosa-

Well articulated. 

The main tank at Aqua Forest Aquarium, I think, is original (2004-5). They've rescaped it several times over the past few years with no problem.

I think both tanks will last...Don't think I haven't thought about the durability of ADA tanks...:icon_bigg I actually broke one. Set it down while empty and it slipped and fell. Luckily it was a Mini S.

ADA tanks are easy to chip unlike acrylic or glass tanks with a plastic external frame.

I chose an acrylic tank due to durability and ease.

After saying all of this, I haven't heard of a single ADA tank failure. People have broken, chipped, and scratched tanks, but non of them have failed.

I agree that the person to talk to about ADA tanks and durability is either Jeff at ADG or George/Steve Lo at AFA. 

They have to deal with warranty issues and would know more about the topic than the average consumer. Be interesting to see what Jeff says.

ADA is prob the upper 1% of aquariums as far as price...TruVu is another expensive company for acrylic tanks.


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## jsenske

In going on 5 years of North American ADA distribution, I have had 1 (one) warranty claim. I originally though there were 2, and some of you may have seen koop's thread about a Mini M that "leaked". Well he called me today actually and even though I had already shipped him a replacement tank, he discovered (after a full rescape in the "new" tank- poor guy!) that the tank was in fact fine and had *no leak*. He was a little embarrassed. I told him not to worry about it and keep the replacement tank as shipping it back, etc. would just be a hassle. 

Anyway, I have a 120-H (120 x 45 X 45cm) in my own living room on 50 year old, fully restored hardwood floors and while some bowing is evident (this is the "old style ADA tank made in Germany by the way, the new ones have thicker and 100% clear glass) it is nowhere near any level of concern. I've had that tank 4 years now. I think another component of ADA switching to the slightly thicker glass was to assuage these concerns and build an added layer of durability balanced by the move as well to full production of 100% clear glass. 

There are some new companies making ADA-style rimless tanks (ADA was the first ever company to produce this style of tank, all others are derivative in some sense). They have a long track record or extremely low warranty claims. Most other competitors are so new in the market that they have no real warranty track record as of yet. I'm confident they will be fine and are well made, but their ultimate long-term performance remains unknown as, stated before, they have only been around a few months. ADA tanks have been in the international market well over 10 years. 

I can show you a pic of even small (MINI S) ADA tank side by side with a Mini S DoAqua. The tinting is as evident there as on any larger tank, but clearly exaggerated-looking, the bigger the actual tank and panel of glass.

This is not a rip on any other manufacturer, just a statement of facts about the ADA product referenced and discussed in this thread.


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## cmf0106

Thanks for the replies everyone. To continue on my original post another quality I would like is aquarium clarity. Although it seems like the majority of you here favor ADA vs GLA, I would still like additional comments on this specific quality of the two. Some are stating GLA has a noticeable green tint, vs the less iron ADA.

Thanks!


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## Mr. Fisher

Clarity:

ADA > GLA


Quality:

ADA > GLA

These are both IMO, only.


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## plantbrain

Jason Baliban said:


> Worth every penny....the tanks and aquasoil, that is
> 
> jB


+1

If you need something beyond the 120cm range, then a custom made Lemar, or other high grade vendors might be cost/quality comparable(or ADA just might not make the tank the size/shape you want), but anything in the 120cm range or smaller, I think it's worth every penny. Same with the Aqua soil.

You should get 10+ years out of any of these two products.
Which is the same for the standard aquariums.

I've looked at a number of different custom tank makers, and in the 120 cm range or smaller, which is about 80% of the market........ADA as far as rimless and good grades go, are extremely tough to beat.
I would not even waste the time. 

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## CL

Mr. Fisher said:


> Clarity:
> 
> ADA > ADG
> 
> 
> Quality:
> 
> ADA > ADG
> 
> what specifics do ya want to know?


You mean GLA, not ADA?
I own three different brands of rimless glass tanks.
Personally I love my GLA tank, however, as has been stated many many times before, there is a green tint to the glass, and there is _slightly_ more silicone in the seams, where in ADA you can't even notice it (on my two nano-ish tanks at least) Personally, the reason I buy either brand- ADA and GLA, is because the tanks are rimless. If I wanted the tank to be even more luxurious, I would go with ADA because of the clearer glass and smaller silicone seams. However, I do believe that GLA with be upgrading their tanks to models with clearer glass.

GLA:








ADA:








ADA vs. Aqueon/ All Glass:


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## plantbrain

cmf0106 said:


> Thanks for the replies everyone. To continue on my original post another quality I would like is aquarium clarity. Although it seems like the majority of you here favor ADA vs GLA, I would still like additional comments on this specific quality of the two. Some are stating GLA has a noticeable green tint, vs the less iron ADA.
> 
> Thanks!


I have not seen a GLA tank, but I can attest to the ADA tanks, I think anyone that's had one, seen a few in person, would argue they are worth the $. 

I think initially folks are put off by the cost $$, but if you add up where folks blow lots of $, they really are not.



















Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## Filete

Planted tanks are all about beauty and esthetics, and the easiest part to control is the tank itself, everything else you put on it will be alive (even rocks and substrate) and will be challenging to control. get the ADA if you can make the effort

and then you will want an upgrade to ELOS...


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## Mr. Fisher

CL said:


> You mean GLA, not ADA?
> I own three different brands of rimless glass tanks.
> Personally I love my GLA tank, however, as has been stated many many times before, there is a green tint to the glass, and there is _slightly_ more silicone in the seams, where in ADA you can't even notice it (on my two nano-ish tanks at least) Personally, the reason I buy either brand- ADA and GLA, is because the tanks are rimless. If I wanted the tank to be even more luxurious, I would go with ADA because of the clearer glass and smaller silicone seams. However, I do believe that GLA with be upgrading their tanks to models with clearer glass.


CL,

Yeah, you're right...I meant GLA. SOrry Jeff. I'm going to correct it in my original post...:icon_mrgr


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## TLE041

Isn't it a general consensus that GLA tanks are simply rebranded Mr. Aqua?


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## CL

TLE041 said:


> Isn't it a general consensus that GLA tanks are simply rebranded Mr. Aqua?


No, Mr. Aqua tanks are yet another Azoo rip-off of another company's product.


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## VincentK

I would say get a cheaper rimless if it's one of your first.


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## Centromochlus

VincentK said:


> I would say get a cheaper rimless if it's one of your first.


Agreed. It's quite ambitious of you to get a rimless tank as your first one, so i'd at least get one that isn't too pricey if i were you.

Personally, i think ADA tanks are very sleek-looking aquariums. However, I would never get one over 18 gallons (60-P). After that, they get ridiculously expensive IMO. For the price of a 120-P (65 gallons/$599.00), you can get everything needed for a really nice regular setup.

Will ADA tanks hold up better then other glass tanks? PROBABLY not. But i have never owned one, so i can't say.
But the quality of the silicone work is amazing. And the glass is very clear.


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## Francis Xavier

There's zero point in investing in something that will inevitably be replaced. If you want all of the traits that are suited to an ADA tank, buy the ADA tank. Why buy a 'cheaper' rimless tank just so down the road you can replace it with what you really want? 

All of the money I've wasted on this hobby has been from that mentality - when I stopped thinking like that, I stopped wasting money. There just isn't any point to buying a tank that isn't premium quality if your intention is for it to be a main display tank and for it to just have the intention of being replaced later. Why pay the extra money? I know from personal experience that you waste the most money when you buy cheap when what you really want is the good stuff. It always breaks or becomes baggage or is just plain tacky and needs replacing.

The tanks -really- aren't that expensive. In fact, they're still the area where you are going to end up spending the least amount of money overall. It's pretty amazing that they're priced where they are, considering that not just a few years ago the price of the tanks using the low-iron glass was roughly double the amount. 

There's nothing ambitious about getting a rimless tank - it's not like having a rimless tank suddenly makes things more challenging to do or adds extra worry to the situation. All a tank is is a canvas - and personally, i'd rather not have my display cluttered by ugly rims and glass that isn't completely clear.

Plus, if you ever decide you want to get out of the hobby, the ADA tanks tend to have a much higher resale value than other tanks. Everytime I've seen one posted in the swap-n-shop for near retail value they're gone almost as quickly as they're posted. Where as a standard 10 or 20 gallon can barely even be given away.

I might be in the minority here, but anyone who prizes clean design and aesthetics has no need to look any further. There just simply is no comparison right now.



> Will ADA tanks hold up better then other glass tanks? PROBABLY not. But i have never owned one, so i can't say.


So don't say.


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## koop

Francis Xavier said:


> You can also always talk to Jeff at ADG (adgshop.com), not a bad idea if you're new to the hobby with questions about the ADA stuff. He's also got an account here, jsenske for pm's.


2nd that. Jeff at adgshop.com is first class.


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## dj2005

Francis Xavier said:


> There's zero point in investing in something that will inevitably be replaced. If you want all of the traits that are suited to an ADA tank, buy the ADA tank. Why buy a 'cheaper' rimless tank just so down the road you can replace it with what you really want?
> 
> All of the money I've wasted on this hobby has been from that mentality - when I stopped thinking like that, I stopped wasting money.


Agreed.


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## cmf0106

I made a similar topic on another forum, and one of the more seasoned members had some concerning words of caution for ADA aquariums. *Specifically the 60P+ ADA seals break after 2 to 3 years.*



Anonymous said:


> Do!Aqua and ADA make great stuff that is level and flush, very clear but way overpriced in my opinion. In this instance you get what you pay for if what you're paying for is the prestige of this brand and they have the very real issues: It is known that their seals, for the 60P and above, will separate after a 2-3 years. I find this totally unacceptable. And their liberal use of Engrish also turns me off as well as other pseudoscientific garbage they tend to throw in their other offerings.


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## jsenske

That, my friend, is simply BS. I have a 60-P set up continuously for 5 years now. It is the most popular model in ADA's production (worldwide) and has been for years. That is a goofy, ill-founded, and downright irresponsible statement to make, and I resent it wholeheartedly. It is a false statement, period.

And I am not "anonymous" or hiding behind some forum name. I stake my name, my career as a professional aquarist, and my company's reputation when I say that statement about ADA seals failing after 2-3 years is patently BS. You don't have to like the stuff, and are welcome to opinions, but that is a statement bordering on slander and I find it pathetic that someone calling themselves "Anonymous" is taken as factual, merely because they could post it on a forum. Ridiculous.


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## cmf0106

jsenske said:


> That, my friend, is simply BS. I have a 60-P set up continuously for 5 years now. It is the most popular model in ADA's production (worldwide) and has been for years. That is a goofy, ill-founded, and downright irresponsible statement to make, and I resent it wholeheartedly. It is a false statement, period.


I think he was referring to ones larger than 60P, but yes it did sound a bit off.


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## jsenske

It's way off. I personally have in my care two 120-P (four years now), four 90-P (3 + years), a 120-H (my own personal tank at home for 4 years), a 180-P in the ADG Gallery (3 years), two 90-H (over 2 years, easily). All are rock solid and narry a single issue, ever. Never had but one come back for warranty after 5 years of selling hundreds all over the US. Mr. "Anonymous" (what a weak yet fitting name), is the usual contemptuous soul who simply doesn't like ADA products and resents their popularity. The reference to ADA using "Engrish" is just plain offensive.


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## Francis Xavier

As far as I know, even above the 60-P mark it's complete myth that borders on libel. When there's only been one real warranty claim of a tank with a problem in all the years of ADA operations in the US, it's pretty safe to say that people saying that are just perpetuating a myth.

Clearly from the way that guy was talking about ADA he/she just has a hatred for the company for the sake of hating it.


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## Jason Baliban

I rocked a 120H for 2 years and now a 75p....ZERO problems!!

The tanks are gorgeous, made perfect, and worth EVERY penny you spend for them.

In the extremely RARE case that there is a problem (that should be IF), Jeff has made it perfectly clear that he takes care of his customers. 

Trust me, you buy an ADA tank you are going to be happy for years, until you want a bigger one anyway

And just for the purpose of credibility, i am no ADA team member or anything. I have stated plenty of "less than favorable" opinions on some of ADA's products (sorry Jeff ), but NONE when it comes to their tanks!

Buy with confidence!!

jB


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## jsenske

Ok, well after seeing the whole post in context, I might be being a little sensitive about that person's overall attitude, but the fact remains that statement is wholly false and anyone that buys into it is severely misguided or just doesn't like ADA products and clings to anything they can find to reinforce that dislike. Weird. 

It should be noted the comment was made over on a forum hosted by a company producing products that compete with (and copy, oddly enough) ADA. Shocking.


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## CL

cmf0106 said:


> I think he was referring to ones larger than 60P, but yes it did sound a bit off.





Anonymous said:


> It is known that their seals, for the 60P and above, will separate after a 2-3 years.


Personally I think that a lot of the "brand hatred" towards ADA is just something that will always be there. IMO, it's like paying $800 for a purebred dog, vs. $10 for your neighbor's unofficial dachshund pups. If the dog isn't worth $800 to you, then don't buy it.


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## Lycosa

When I first read this thread, and responded to it, I was afraid of what sort of attitudes this would bring out of the plantedtank woodwork. I hope this doesn't become one of those debates where... if you don't like ADA tanks, then you obviously do not have the discerning eye and appreciation for such a fine piece of work.

They are fish tanks after all. They hold water, and if they can do that without leaking, then I think it's a good tank.

If you own an ADA tank, it isn't comparable to owning a Porsche and the rest of the people driving an '83 Chevette. This happens to be one of the few hobbies that money has little to do with how beautiful a tank turns out. It's more about knowledge and dedication than dollars and cents.

I've had both over the years. I had a smaller ADA tank back in 2006 and while it was a nice tank, it was just a tank. You can grow algae as good in an ADA tank as any other, and you can make a beautiful aquascape in one just as in any other. 

ADA tanks are nice tanks. What makes them a beautiful tank is the hard work and diligence of the aquarist that transforms the box o' water into something else. Aquariums do not win aquascape competitions, aquarists do. 

Further, while I do like ADA aquariums, I've been on forums like this one long enough to know that the unofficial 'ADA fanclub' can often times be more offensive than someone who posts a negative comment.. which, maybe, possibly, has something to do with receiving seemingly unwarranted negative comments. Food for thought I suppose.


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## jsenske

Lycosa-- all I am doing is shooting down a blatantly false statement made about the product. I agree with you wholeheartedly, and don't want to be that guy, the ADA sycophant. But dude-- I can not just let damaging myths be spread unchecked. I never smack talk or spread BS myths about other brands. No reason to. Someone ALWAYS has to jump in an ADA-related question with some unsubstantiated garbage myth. I sat back and let it spread unanswered for long enough. No one in the "fan club" is at all "offended" when the posts, comments, and opinions are kept within the realm of the factual.
I have never made and will never make any sort of "elitist, ADA is the Porsche and you guys all drive crappy Corvettes" comments. I don't think that way, never have and never will. Not sure if you are referring to me in your comments, but all I have ever done is tried to do is help hobbyists- something do for people who call and consult with me for free everyday.

Your points are nice, but no one is saying an ADA tank makes you some hero. They are answering the OPs inquiry about (in their opinion, because that's what he is asking for), if ADA tanks are worth the premium price. That's it. That's all I see.


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## EKLiu

I have both ADA and GLA tanks. The silicone work is actually better on the GLA tanks. Unfortunately, my 2 GLA tanks are not built perfectly square (very minor issue though), and the glass is quite a bit greener than the ADA. ADA is the tank to get if money is not an issue. A Mr. Aqua or GLA tank is not a bad choice either though.


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## Minsc

It is good to hear that so few warranty claims have been made on the ADA tanks.
I had also heard that the larger one were likely to leak from the seams after a couple years.

Personally, I don't notice things like the clarity of the glass or the silicone work when I look at a tank, and a glass lid that keeps jumping fish in and evaporation down has much higher value than a rimless look. So, no, I don't think ADA tanks are worth the higher cost, but these are obviously matters of taste. 

It would make me ever so happy if a US manufacturer would start making Euro braced tanks though.


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## Lycosa

jsenske said:


> Lycosa-- all I am doing is shooting down a blatantly false statement made about the product. I agree with you wholeheartedly, and don't want to be that guy, the ADA sycophant. But dude-- I can not just let damaging myths be spread unchecked. I never smack talk or spread BS myths about other brands. No reason to. Someone ALWAYS has to jump in an ADA-related question with some unsubstantiated garbage myth. I sat back and let it spread unanswered for long enough. No one in the "fan club" is at all "offended" when the posts, comments, and opinions are kept within the realm of the factual.


jsenkse, I honestly wasn't referring to you. I understand, especially from your position being involved with their product, that it is important that you dispel any myth being perpetuated about the product. 

I suppose you know what I'm talking about. People tend to really 'throw down' when someone says they don't like ADA tanks. I've seen some posts in the past that really were quite offensive to people that did not own ADA tanks. I've also read posts where people said that they didn't like ADA tanks only to be offended by the people who do. Not to be one-sided of course.. I've seen a lot of posts that had negative things to say about ADA tanks that weren't true as well.

I really do like ADA tanks, and I'm a huge fan of Amano's work (who isn't ). My only..and I mean only criticism of ADA tanks is that the cost of them are prohibitive to a lot of folks out there. It seems a lot of people out there are trying to grow plants in a cheap 10 gallon asking on this forum if a regular lightbulb is going to work because they really want to get into the hobby, but see the price tags on some of the equipment and feel like it is an impossible task when it is not. I would rather encourage people to get the most out of the hobby with the money they _do_ have, and remind them that a spectacular looking tank is not dependent on the tank they own, or the money they have spent on their equipment, but the time learning and attention to their captive charges that ultimately make the biggest difference... all else is just luxury.


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## CL

IMO, the reason that most people think you need to have an ADA tank to have a nice looking tank is because so many of the very nice scapes are inside ADA tanks. I think that this has to do with the experience level of the aquarist. The more experienced aquarist tends (now, I have seen some extraordinary scapes in AGA tanks, and some crappy ones in ADA tanks) to place a higher value on aquascaping, and is willing to spend more money on the appearance of his/ her tank, and will buy the higher end equipment, such as ADA tanks. Because these more experienced scapers have these ADA tanks, people get the false illusion that an ADA tank means a better scape (when really, more or less, it is the other way around).

Also, if we were to somehow artificially lower the price of ADA tanks, ADA would have to use lower quality products to make these tanks, which I am sure that they are not willing to do (who wants to make products less attractive than they were making previously, anyway?), and thus, the price stays where it is.


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## Centromochlus

Francis Xavier said:


> So don't say.


Sheesh...


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## plantbrain

I think given the price, they(ADA) are not that far off from anyone else. I cannot get custom local work cheaper than anything under a 180cm range with the same quality and grade. 

If you do not care about going rimless, you do not care about other details, heck, a bucket might do. There's going to be trade offs.

I like a nice look to the home, to the cabinet, to the outside of the aquarium, it's placement in the home. I've had rimless and open top tanks for 20 years. I like them for many reasons. I've taken all the short cuts and also blown wads of $ on the pricy stuff.

Not everyone goes out and buys a Canon D1 camera right off the bat as newbie photographer.........same thing here. Maybe you can justify a Sigma off brand lens vs the top of the line Canon lens. Or a cheaper model to suit your needs. If you are into the hobby, then you will likely have nice stuff if you can afford it.

I saw this knee jerk reaction back when Dupla came to town in the 1980's, again with 2000$ set ups, 500$ heater cables, 500 $ CO2 systems, 250$ CO2 reactors etc. I see very similar comments. I was a newbie and a Dupla convert at the time. 

But........I learned more and more. I no longer took everything on faith. I tested and questioned the products. I did the same to ADA. I like ADA much more these days than Dupla of past, but both where high priced items with support books, a whole line of plant specific products. 

Some things really helped and some did not. This is going to be true with any high line product line. Cameras, aquarium plants, Reefs, kite surfing.......you name it.

I have to agree with Jeff here about the comments about the ADA tanks, they are really well made and precise. They have no issues. I know plenty in our very large SF group and LA groups that can attest to this, as well as a 2 clients, and my own home. I have them 1st thing when you walk into my own home. I have other tanks that where cheaper as well, these will be sold when I move and upgraded to ADA, or custom made. They will all have ADA aqua soil.

Pretty ringing endorsement I'd say about ADA's tanks. 

Regards, 
Tom Barr


----------



## plantbrain

cmf0106 said:


> I made a similar topic on another forum, and one of the more seasoned members had some concerning words of caution for ADA aquariums. *Specifically the 60P+ ADA seals break after 2 to 3 years.*


Then I'd suggest not going to that forum :wink:
Ignorance is not justification. They hang themselves.

If you do not know, then you do not know and cannot say.
This does not some folks however.

I suppose I and others are lucky, we can see plenty of ADA tanks in person year after year, or own them. 

Regards, 
Tom Barr


----------



## Dr. Acula

The answer to this question is really up to the individual. They are amazing tanks, nobody can argue that. They are also relatively expensive, nobody can argue that. If you really want what they offer, than go for it. It all depends on your situation. It is a luxury item, after all, and value is subjective.


----------



## MARIMOBALL

I have had my ADA 120P up and running for three years with no problems on the seams. I use 300watts of MH lighting and have low PH of 6.5. Having a rimless tank exposed to these conditions and still holding up is a good buy to IMHO. I am currently considering tearing down all my smaller ADA tanks and purchasing another 120P. This way I can have two tanks to focus on insted of many small ones. Mr.Aqua and GLA are also rimless tanks, but if anyone wants a really nice tank displayed in your living room where guest and yourself will see it then buy ADA. Yes they are expensive but the are worth the price. If GLA and Mr. Aqua offer a high clarity rimless tank with clean silicone joints and a warranty like ADA. Than chances are GLA and Mr. Aqua ( which I think are the same manufacturer) would have to raise their price bringing there tanks to near ADA prices. Please lets not argue about rimless vs. regular tanks. I think the initial question was is ADA worth the price. Then I say yes. No other aquarium company other than ELOS can measure up to the quality. For a first tank I say go for the best that you can get initially so you wont have to spend again. I think by now ADA has proven themselves over the last five years.


----------



## Francis Xavier

AzFishKid said:


> Sheesh...


I wasn't trying to be rude or insulting towards you, and I totally respect having a preference towards one kind of tank or another. The only thing I'm trying to convey is that it's one thing to have an opinion, but entirely another to make guesses about a product that can be damaging. When you don't have facts or experience to back it, all it does is support myths - albeit by being totally accidental.

Let's face it - at the end of the day, we're just all here to spread the hobby and we're passionate about specific segments of the hobby, even within the planted tank niche. None of us want to see confusing information spread. ADA, GLA, Mr. Aqua, Aqueon, Perfecto, whatever; it's just about spreading and encouraging more people to share in our passion to make badass aquascapes, grow awesome plants, make a biotope from a specific part of the Amazon, or what not.


----------



## boink

I have 2 ADA 120P tanks and their build quality (silicone work, beveled edge, glass corners meeting at a precise 90 degree angle, flush in all three directions) is second to none. I do not include ELOS because I am not a fan of black seams for freshwater (saltwater is a maybe).

For a premium price, you get a premium product. Sure you can spend less on other rimless tanks and not get the cleanest (some are clean, but not the cleanest) work. If you have the money and want a beautiful product with outstanding build quality, buy ADA.

And yes, Jeff/ADG takes care of his customers.


----------



## plantbrain

I think everyone that bought an ADA tank has been pleased and feels the $ warrants the price.

This thread shows it, those who do not have the tanks, or have tried them.........you can no say. So I question their intent when they try to do so:icon_idea I have been critical of some products ADA markets, no one can accuse me of being an ADA fan boy. However, the tanks are top notch. No one that has owned one has suggested otherwise in this thread.

I welcome other makers to offer better pricing with similar quality, but I have not seen some of these brands, so I cannot say:icon_idea Since shipping is involved, ADA is available locally for me, the cost is not better either nor breakage risk. Any returns are simpler to deal with as well.

Not everyone is in this group though, but ADA is much more widely available these days. I've had the cheaper nano curved glass Hong Kong tanks and few other cheapo rimless tanks. I really like the ADA over those.

I found the trade off made a difference at about 15 gal and up ranges to about 120cm for ADA. At 180 cm and over, I found I could have a high grade tank custom made to specs. Still, at least ADA offers a nice 180cm and nice smaller nano's and some nice dimensions. I can be cheap and DIY as much as anyone, but I can also see the usefulness of a commercial high grade brand.

regards, 
Tom Barr


----------



## cmf0106

jsenske said:


> It's way off. I personally have in my care two 120-P (four years now), four 90-P (3 + years), a 120-H (my own personal tank at home for 4 years), a 180-P in the ADG Gallery (3 years), two 90-H (over 2 years, easily). All are rock solid and narry a single issue, ever. Never had but one come back for warranty after 5 years of selling hundreds all over the US. Mr. "Anonymous" (what a weak yet fitting name), is the usual contemptuous soul who simply doesn't like ADA products and resents their popularity. The reference to ADA using "Engrish" is just plain offensive.


Thought this would be of interest to you and others. Here he is reaffirming what he previously stated, and offering addition insight. Have you guys heard of this happening past the warranty, perhaps thats why there are no warranty exchanges if this happens after it expires. 



 anonymous said:


> Basically yes. *It starts out innocently enough as air bubbles forming in the seals and they eventually separate, but they always start doing it after the warranty expires.*



Here is the original post by this user in case someone may have missed it. 


Anonymous said:


> Do!Aqua and ADA make great stuff that is level and flush, very clear but way overpriced in my opinion. In this instance you get what you pay for if what you're paying for is the prestige of this brand and they have the very real issues: It is known that their seals, for the 60P and above, will separate after a 2-3 years. I find this totally unacceptable. And their liberal use of Engrish also turns me off as well as other pseudoscientific garbage they tend to throw in their other offerings.


----------



## Quesenek

IMO if I were to setup a smaller tank as a display I would go ADA. There is no faults with them and anyone who says there is I believe are lying.
That said I will never own an ADA tank because my next setup will be a 240+ gallon with starphire glass discus tank and if they ever did make an aquarium that big I would be afraid of it busting without the plastic braces.

In short buy ADA if you are serious about the hobby.


----------



## MuddyWishkah

Can someone explain why ADA tanks (and their competitors) ONLY come in certain dimensions?

Is it because Amano-sensei deems these to be the "most-pleasing" proportions, in his opinion?

I would love to have a rimless tank, but unless I contact "the company which *must not* be named", I'm stuck with the same models/sizes......


----------



## Francis Xavier

cmf0106 said:


> Thought this would be of interest to you and others. Here he is reaffirming what he previously stated, and offering addition insight. Have you guys heard of this happening past the warranty, perhaps thats why there are no warranty exchanges if this happens after it expires.


The standard warranty is 3 years. Jeff cited multiple examples of large tanks he's had for more than that standard warranty period with no problems. From what I know, it's not just that there has only been one real claim in 5 years, it's that that one claim was the first time anything was ever even called in for concern, past warranty or not. When ADA switched manufacturers they even bumped up the width of the glass panes for improved performance.

This link, I think, will show you what I mean; it addressed the issue before.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/109621-gla-vs-ada-vs-mr-aqua-2.html#post1082716

It just seems like that guy is saying it for the sake of saying it. There hasn't been a single citation of proof to back up his claim.


----------



## cmf0106

Thanks Frances.


----------



## CL

MuddyWishkah said:


> Can someone explain why ADA tanks (and their competitors) ONLY come in certain dimensions?
> 
> Is it because Amano-sensei deems these to be the "most-pleasing" proportions, in his opinion?
> 
> I would love to have a rimless tank, but unless I contact "the company which *must not* be named", I'm stuck with the same models/sizes......


Haha. No, it's because custom sizes would cost more, take longer to manufacture, etc. Plus they offer as lot more sizes than what's on the afa or adg site. If you were to contactJeff, you could get one of the other sizes. It just makes more business sense to stock the common sizes and keep the oddballs for special order. Nothing to do with "Amano sensei". AGA doesn't make custome tanks either to my knowlege


----------



## plantbrain

Francis Xavier said:


> It just seems like that guy is saying it for the sake of saying it. There hasn't been a single citation of proof to back up his claim.


+1

Talk is cheap, the actual evidence is not.


Regards, 
Tom Barr


----------



## ukamikazu

*I know this seems strange, but*

Post 2 of 5. Just need to increase the minimum number before I can chime in with a response because it has links in it.


----------



## ukamikazu

Lycosa said:


> jsenkse, I honestly wasn't referring to you. I understand, especially from your position being involved with their product, that it is important that you dispel any myth being perpetuated about the product.
> 
> I suppose you know what I'm talking about. People tend to really 'throw down' when someone says they don't like ADA tanks. I've seen some posts in the past that really were quite offensive to people that did not own ADA tanks. I've also read posts where people said that they didn't like ADA tanks only to be offended by the people who do. Not to be one-sided of course.. I've seen a lot of posts that had negative things to say about ADA tanks that weren't true as well.
> 
> I really do like ADA tanks, and I'm a huge fan of Amano's work (who isn't ). My only..and I mean only criticism of ADA tanks is that the cost of them are prohibitive to a lot of folks out there. It seems a lot of people out there are trying to grow plants in a cheap 10 gallon asking on this forum if a regular lightbulb is going to work because they really want to get into the hobby, but see the price tags on some of the equipment and feel like it is an impossible task when it is not. I would rather encourage people to get the most out of the hobby with the money they _do_ have, and remind them that a spectacular looking tank is not dependent on the tank they own, or the money they have spent on their equipment, but the time learning and attention to their captive charges that ultimately make the biggest difference... all else is just luxury.



Random pull quote to get post 3 of 5 down, again, terribly sorry and excuse me. Just have to flitter around for a few seconds so the forum software doesn't think I'm a bot.


----------



## ukamikazu

plantbrain said:


> +1
> 
> Talk is cheap, the actual evidence is not.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Tom Barr


Have to do this trick again, again pardon the mess and thank you Tom for letting me do what I just did to Lycosa.


----------



## ukamikazu

Last one I promise and then content will follow because I know everybody is chomping at the bit for this one.


----------



## ukamikazu

*I hate to stir the pot, but...*

I was the one who made the comments in the other forum. I am certainly not anonymous. cmf0106 was just trying to do me a kindness, while I appreciate it, I will stand on my own.

Yes, I said that. I see there have been many passions inflamed by this. For that I apologize.

What I can't apologize for are my opinions. There are more than one post or incident about defects that one can easily google for from this very place. A warranty service department somewhere in Japan or the USA has probably had a few come through every once in a while, still it happens, happened and it has affected my choices. Comments & experiences do exist,good, bad and ugly, ultimately we like what we like and dislike what we dislike. For your perusal, here are but two very tiny examples: 

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/general-planted-tank-discussion/81842-my-tank-about-leak.html"

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/81103-ada-leak.html"

Is any line free of defects? Absolutely not! Think of your favorite car, computer, fertilizer maker, etc, there are issues but you overlook them (Don't get me started about the superiority of Hondas over other vehicles, to draw out a previously stated analogy).

Does everyone prefer there own brand? Certainly.

Is it worth getting worked up because of one person who was asked his opinion? Not at all. Do I dislike Amano? No, I adore him. I just think a lot of his stuff needs some work, and it is improving but not to the point where I am comfortable. Personally, I've never been loyal to one brand or another. News of failures in this, that or the other are something to take to heart when making an expensive purchase. Bad news travels fast and far these days. I am also free to take a whole and enjoy the good bits and leave the bad. Can't take too many chances for x amount of money. We all have our demand curves and risk tolerances. 

This is how I feel. I can't retract that nor make an apology for it. The information I have available to me is an infinitesimally small representative sample, agreed, but enough to turn me off for the moment. Who knows, in 5, 10 years I may have a complete change of heart. 

But I will not recant. I can't do that. A record exists now and that must stand.

Before you all reply and castigate me, and I know you all will, do me the favor of reading this first please, sleep on it then tell me what you think:

http://youarenotsosmart.com/2010/05/19/fanboyism-and-brand-loyalty/

...and no, I'm not immune from it either.

I am ready to accept my fate. Do and say what you will. I will not resist but nor will I take back what I've said. Thank you and good day to you all.

And remember, you are having a "Two Minutes' Hate" and an argument/debate on the Internet. Over an opinion. That originated outside this forum. Just saying...


----------



## ukamikazu

*Almost forgot....*

....My opinions are solely my own and in no way reflect on or have any connection whatsoever to or with GLA or Orlando Morales.

I am not an employee of GLA, disrtibutor, marketer or privy to Orlando Morales' thoughts, records, etc but a mere acquaintance and an uncompensated volunteer on his official website and forum.


----------



## Jason Baliban

Love the link!! HAHAHHA You hit a place in my heart with the Mac thing. The only thing that makes a mac bad is its users (fanboys)!!

I think its great that you wrote your point of view here. These links are important and certainly part of the story. I think this type of thing is going to be a concern for all rimless tanks.....no matter the manufacturer. What is important is that people understand these tanks need to be put on very flat surfaces and a garden matte is essential!!!

All that being said, jeff has stated his commitment to take care of his customers, site unseen.

jB


----------



## ukamikazu

Jason, your tweeks to PPS Pro is what really got me started in a serious way. It's regrettable we had to meet this way, and I don't mean this ironically, but I am a fanboy of yours and I just want to say thank you for your work and the inspiration. My apologies for gushing.

As for Jeff, yes he is a superior human being when it comes to his service, kindness and dedication to his customers. All entrepreneurs could learn quite a few lessons from him. In fact, I really like ADA Aqua Soils especially for the fishless cycle which is more humane. It grows awesome plants. But again, that is one of those parts of the whole where I take away what I like and leave the rest.

Mix and match, story of my life.


----------



## Jason Baliban

ukamikazu said:


> Mix and match, story of my life.


Nothing wrong with that!! Thanks for the kudos

I think the major thing that ADA runs into is the price. This is not the place for me to talk about what I agree with and what I dont in regards to their pricing strategy. I think its safe to say the price is high because of the name and thats what amano wants to charge.

Do i think there is a huge difference between GLA and ADA tanks? Without having owned a GLA i would say, probly not. Back to our mac comparison. You pay a premium for mac because thats what they want to charge and thats what people will pay to have ADA or an apple on their product. What we all should expect is service that matches the price because the product itself is not much different than something that is reasonably priced for the same types of parts. (get over it mac people, its a PC with an aluminum case, you are paying for the name and service)

I feel that when it comes to ADA, they rest on their name. What allows them to exist in the market here is Senske's devotion to helping his customers. I cant say for sure, but i bet he goes above and beyond what ADA expects of him to satisfy his customers.

jB


----------



## cmf0106

ukamikazu said:


> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/general-planted-tank-discussion/81842-my-tank-about-leak.html"
> 
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/81103-ada-leak.html"


Sobering threads thanks.


----------



## MrJG

Not trying to put my 2 cent in as I don't even have a rimless tank let alone an ADA tank but that first thread is NOT about an ADA tank for the sake of clarity.


----------



## ukamikazu

Good to know and it feeds back into Jason's point, very good. Excellent observation!

Let's get the bad air out and settle in.


----------



## F22

wow, this was the most heated thread i've seen in a long time....
fun read though


----------



## ukamikazu

F22 said:


> wow, this was the most heated thread i've seen in a long time....
> fun read though


Well, like the BBC I do my best to educate, entertain and inform, though not necessarily in that order and occasionally one of those terms is exclusive to the set, but I am human and one does the best one can. Of course none of this could have been possible without the help of my fellow Planted Tank denizens and especial thanks to cmf0106 for without whom none of this would have been possible :tongue:.


----------



## ramawo

Interesting thread !



> 可以您生活的时候趣时间。


Is it Chinese? And what you want to say?


----------



## ukamikazu

ramawo said:


> Interesting thread !
> 
> 
> Is it Chinese? And what you want to say?


It's the closest one can come to a misappropriated Chinese saying, that was never uttered by anyone in China. In Mandarin, it comes out slightly mangled as "It can make for an interesting life time" but in Han, which I'm a lot better at, it is much closer to, "May you live in interesting times."


----------



## ramawo

I see....
Since my English is poor, I try my best. someone correct me if I am wrong !



> "It can make for an interesting life time"


它能史您生活投其所好



> "May you live in interesting times."


把興趣融入生活當中

This is a little off topic.... lol


----------



## Francis Xavier

As was said - that first thread is NOT an ADA tank, NOT about an ADA tank, or anything of the sort. The second thread was the only real incident reported of an ADA tank leaking in North America, -and- was fully covered, including expense to ADG. *Does one leak in thousands constitute a chronic problem with every tank 60-cm and above leaking?* Not even close. This whole 'ADA tanks leak horribly' myth has gotten so out of control and out of proportion that it -literally- can be classified as libel. Giving an opinion is great, fine; cool: if you don't like the brand, you don't like the brand. However, stating that the tanks fall apart after 2-3 years is not an opinion nor can it be protected as an opinion. It's just false.

An opinion: I don't like Susan Celebrity, I just don't like the size of her hips.

Another opinion: I think the Widget 873 model is the cleanest design on the market for portable devices. It just has class and is super sleek.

Not an opinion: I think Susan Celebrity is having an affair with 35 men. Just my opinion though. She looks like the type that'd be having an affair with 35 men. Maybe 36.

Not an opinion: The Widget 873 model portable device can be used as alternative fuel to get to the moon. I think it can also cure cancer.

Again, it's just been the one example of a single tank in a single incident leaking in the ENTIRE North American market and a few examples from overseas that some were said to be nearly a decade old (with nothing but unconfirmed reports of how they were placed, whether or not they were level and what not), and then -one- guy just saying that 'believe me, it's a problem over here!" It's kind of funny how the 'reported break-down' period of the tanks went from 5-7 years...to 4-5....to 2-3....what's next? If you buy an ADA tank it'll break in 3 months? When does the absurdity stop? Maybe we can draw the line at the tank just comes to you broken. Or how about Amano just sells nothing but shards of glass wrapped up in cardboard.

If you don't like the line, fine, not a single person is hating anyone else for simply not preferring an ADA tank. What people -are- calling out is false statement and myth.


----------



## ukamikazu

ramawo said:


> I see....
> Since my English is poor, I try my best. someone correct me if I am wrong !
> 
> 
> 
> 它能史您生活投其所好
> 
> 
> 
> 把興趣融入生活當中
> 
> This is a little off topic.... lol


Very good! And thank you. I should perhaps update my signature.


----------



## cmf0106

Francis Xavier said:


> If you don't like the line, fine, not a single person is hating anyone else for simply not preferring an ADA tank. What people -are- calling out is false statement and myth.



The second thread (linked below) has more than one account of a faulty ADA tank, and numerous ones spotted in Japan. Not trying to disturb the hornets nest anymore, just pointing it out. 

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/81103-ada-leak.html


----------



## Francis Xavier

Francis Xavier said:


> and a few examples from overseas that some were said to be nearly a decade old (with nothing but unconfirmed reports of how they were placed, whether or not they were level and what not) and then -one- guy just saying 'believe me, it's a problem over here!"


Also notice that every single one of these cited examples was from tanks made from the old manufacturer. New tanks have thicker and clearer glass for pretty much the same price.

Put it this way: the whole myth was started by people super-imposing their 'opinion' on areas that they have no, zero, nada, zip expertise in. Then supported by people citing those 'opinions' and taking them as fact.

Notice that also, the only person staking their reputation on the issue (jsenske), supporting that there aren't any big and widespread problems with these tanks is the person with the most to lose when it comes to reputation. That's an example I can follow. Heck, for what it's worth I'll stake my credibility on there being no chronic problem with the tanks falling apart. I'll even bet a ride to Houston to see them in person.

Is anyone else willing to stake their credibility to support their 'claim'?


----------



## CL

Francis Xavier said:


> Notice that also, the only person staking their reputation on the issue (jsenske), supporting that there aren't any big and widespread problems with these tanks is the person with the most to lose when it comes to reputation.


That's a very good point, and personally I think that the argument should have ended there.
That's what I call faith in a product.


----------



## houseofcards

ukamikazu,

Do you or have you owned an ADA tank?


----------



## Lycosa

**Wall of Text Warning**

While I wholeheartedly believe that everyone who has had experience with jsenske will confirm that he is very honest and stands by the product he sells, I would caution only that most people do not look to the salesman for reviews. I think it is wise to do your own research on a product. 

Further, if there are 1 - 15 leaks on ADA aquariums, that is also a quantity of 'perhaps' acceptable issues if you measure it against the units sold. In other words, if it turns out that 99.9999% of a manufacturer's product is satisfactory for the life of the product, then that's a good track record if it is 1 or 1000 defects. I doubt very much that any aquarium manufacturer has a perfect track record. They also have no idea of how their product is used once it leaves the shelf. How many failures are due to accidental abuse? How many are due to improper leveling of the tank? (Which is critical on rimless tanks since there is no rim to stabilize the seams). 

There are a ton of variables at work here. What is known, is that I can personally show that ADA tanks use a higher than needed glass thickness. They could have used thinner glass and been within the tolerable limit of glass deflection without breaking. Of course, the closer they get to that tolerance limit, the less outside stress it will take to break the tank. However, they are far above what is required. The only other factor to consider here is the silicone. I can not comment on the quality of the silicone because I do not know much about it. I can say that my ADA tank did not leak and the silicone work was done well. That's all there is to it. Glass and silicone and prepping the glass to make sure the silicone sticks. What else is there?

The question comes in that 'if' there is indeed a risk of a leak for any manufacturer, then is that chance acceptable given the cost? It's an individual choice.. but it should be a choice weighed on facts. Everyone has their own opinion, but let's not confuse the two. When I owned an ADA tank, I did not find it so much better than a standard, or homebuilt aquarium. A lot of my _opinion_ stems from the fact that I like DIY items whenever I can, and that I'm sort of personally against flowing with the mainstream on things. I enjoy what I affectionately call 'Frankentank'... just an aquarium that is full of strange DIY ideas that I test and upgrade whenever possible. It is part of the hobby that I find most fun. That has nothing to do with the quality of ADA aquariums, just my own silly personality.

Having said that, I do not find it _unreasonable_ that people have had problems with rimless tanks simply because they are rimless and it takes a fair bit of extra caution when placing the tank.. especially on bigger volumes. Remember that while there are some variations in glass from manufacturer to manufacturer, the basic tensile/compressive strengths are considered the same if it is done by industry standard and reinforced by quality control. The only thing we have left to consider on a rimless tank is the silicone. Given the glass thickness is adequate to support the pressure exerted on the tank, the silicone is the key to keeping it all together. Personally, I use epoxy on homebuilt rimless tanks and silicone to make them waterproof. Even then, there are considerations since if the epoxy isn't even, you can have areas that shrink more than others causing extreme pressure on the glass.

Anyone who is a fan of Amano's work will argue that it is hard to imagine a person so dedicated to this hobby would sell an inferior product. I would agree. Not only does he sell the product, but he personally uses the product he sells. That is evidence of faith. Lastly, if anyone chooses to not buy an ADA product because of of the lack of faith in craftsmanship, then what tank _is_ suitable? About the only rimless tank that will be more secure is an acrylic one since it can be basically 'welded' together. If you want a rimless glass tank, then I believe you should take into consideration that the very design has issues that had to be overcome in order to make a marketable product. Several manufacturers have done this with the new higher strength silicone, but it seems quite logical that a rimless tank will not be able to be subjected to the same stress that a rimmed tank can without failing. If all the criteria are met that ensure the longevity of a rimless tank, then I find no reason to avoid one... and if the specifications of an ADA rimless tank are worthy of the price to you, then make the purchase in good faith that their products aren't inferior; Instead, ADA tanks are setting standards for other manufacturers to follow regarding glass clarity and silicone work. This thread is proof of that.


----------



## plantbrain

I'd stake my rep on it and I have zero to gain by doing so.
No one can accuse me of being not in the know about the tanks either, I have them, I know and regularly visit many folks that have them as well.
I do not sell ADA, the product line speaks for itself with each individual product. 

I see no issues.
I figure over a dozen tanks constitutes some stats that are worthy.
I'd suppose we have over 100 tanks floating around here in the club in SF, no one had any issues.

Some rubbish in Japan or "some where else" is all fine but in the USA and with the folks who have purchased the ADA tanks, there's no evidence to support this manure spewer.

Jeff might sell ADA tanks, so do others, but he's not going to lie outright about it concerning any issues, so do not even suggest such *personal* drivel.

You hang/hung yourself when you go there and I'll be glad to put that noose around your neck if the mods and admin does not get there first. 
Stick to the facts that can be verified and what we do know.


Regards, 
Tom Barr


----------



## Francis Xavier

plantbrain said:


> I'd stake my rep on it and I have zero to gain by doing so.
> No one can accuse me of being not in the know about the tanks either, I have them, I know and regularly visit many folks that have them as well.
> I do not sell ADA, the product line speaks for itself with each individual product.
> 
> I see no issues.
> I figure over a dozen tanks constitutes some stats that are worthy.
> I'd suppose we have over 100 tanks floating around here in the club in SF, no one had any issues.
> 
> Some rubbish in Japan or "some where else" is all fine but in the USA and with the folks who have purchased the ADA tanks, there's no evidence to support this manure spewer.
> 
> Jeff might sell ADA tanks, so do others, but he's not going to lie outright about it concerning any issues, so do not even suggest such personal drivel.
> 
> You hang/hung yourself when you go there and I'll be glad to put that noose around your neck if the mods and admin does not get there first.
> Stick to the facts that can be verified and what we do know.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Tom Barr


+1

This is the kind of support that'll drown out and put an end to errant myths.



Lycosa said:


> That is evidence of faith. Lastly, if anyone chooses to not buy an ADA product because of of the lack of faith in craftsmanship, then what tank is suitable?


Truer words, truer words.


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## Mr. Fisher

I've owned 3 ADA tanks and a mini-solar s. All three have done very well. Consistantly excellent workmanship. 

I own an ADA diffuser, Cabochon ruby, aquasoil, powersand, and a few other trinkets.

Everything works the way it's suppose to.

I know several people in the club that Tom is talking about who have ADA tanks. No issues/failure there. I can vouch for that.

There are prob. 100+ ADA tanks owned by members on that site, and I've never heard of a failure.

The reason why I asked Jeff to chime in on this topic is because he's an honest guy. I get that vibe and I live half way across the country. I've done business with him, and he is straightforward. He's also the most credible person on here when it comes to ADA.

ADA's reputation is known and accepted everywhere.


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## Mr. Fisher

ukamikazu said:


> Well, like the BBC I do my best to educate, entertain and inform, though not necessarily in that order and occasionally one of those terms is exclusive to the set, but I am human and one does the best one can. Of course none of this could have been possible without the help of my fellow Planted Tank denizens and especial thanks to cmf0106 for without whom none of this would have been possible :tongue:.


 

brand loyalty or is this a case of sheer product superiority?

Toyota is a company that rested on its reputation and got away with nearly murder.

ADA makes hand made glass tanks with five sides and silicone.

Car manufacturers, PC, and Apple users buy products that are mass produced on an assembly line. They have multiple systems that work as an integrative whole. Chances are a car will malfunction (according to probability) more frequently than a fish tank. This is especially true when ADA has some of the highest standard of quality control.

your argument is that everything fails .01% of the time. This happens in nature, too...t's called "an act of God" by insurance companies.

The linked TPT threads relating to leaky ADA tanks does not prove that there are defects in those particular tanks. If you look, the people who posted their problems have had their tanks shipped to them. Anything could have happened to them during shipment. They also placed them on DIY stands. These are two factors that could cause failure.

I don't care whether you buy or don't buy ADA. Chances are no one can change your mind once it's set.

All I'm saying is that you shouldn't believe everything you read on the internet.

be critical


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## familyman03

While I do not own one myself the view i see in the new low iron glass truely surpasses any thing of old.


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## Qwedfg

ADA makes very nice stuff but they arent the only company that does! Just like apple ADA was smart in that they didn't just make good stuff they also marketed it perfectly. I own some ADA stuff and have no complaints about any of it but there are other tank makers that do just as nice of a job....you just won't have the ADA badge in the corner.

I have a CADlights zen series tank and the glass/craftsmanship is impeccable..plus its manufactured in the US. I can see the allure of having an all ADA setup but some of the prices they charge for things like lights that aren't cutting edge or canister filters seems a little crazy but to each their own.


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## Shoumin

Well I have been in the hobby about a year, and just truly in love with planted tanks , though I live in a very small condo in seattle downtown, all my tanks are in a shelve, upgraded that shelve into a extra heavy duty industrial shelve where each shelve can hold 1000lbs, 4 of tanks are normal tank and it really doesn't look good at al to my eyes since I go AquariumZen.com
Well the shelve is 84x48x18! 
Here's my struggle I know I can't really enjoy what ADA tank truly is having it placed in a shelve! Cause a 65 gallon tank is $800! 
Now I'm worried that if something happen my wooden floor will cost me a fortune and definitely with divorce!
So looking into acrylic tank, want to place 3 level of aquarium! Two 17g ada wouldn't be an issue, but wanting a bigger tank is a nightmare! 
Most of the online custom aquarium maker don't offer free shipping and AquaMaxx's 48.2 gallon would do but the tank is $349 website says shipping is free but handling and packing cost $150! That's without tax! 
Also the shelve is 48x18 and Ada is same size ! What if the sides of the metals pushes the tank! So the best would be to order custom made! And I'm just struggling and wandering around everywhere! 
Multiple tank syndrome!


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