# Metricide 14 to replace the Excel dosing



## barbarossa4122

I am planning on ordering Metricide 14 to replace the Excel dosing. Right now I dose 10ml/day of Excell in my 55g. How much 100% Metracid do I need to dose to match the Excel dosing. Also do you know if it's safe to overdose Metricid a little? Thank you.


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## StillLearning

barbarossa4122 said:


> Hi over_stocked,
> 
> I am planning on ordering Metricide 14 to replace the Excel dosing. Right now I dose 10ml/day of Excell in my 55g. How much 100% Metracid do I need to dose to match the Excel dosing. Also do you know if it's safe to overdose Metricid a little? Thank you.



10ml/day?



> On initial use or after a major (> 40%) water change, use 1 capful (5 mL) for every 40 L (10 gallons*). *Thereafter use 1 capful for every 200 L (50 gallons*) daily or every other day.* Dosing may be slowly increased in high-growth aquariums. For smaller dosing please note that each cap thread is approximately 1 mL.


I use 5ml/day on my 55 gallon. I really dont think you wanna use 10ml/day when using Metricide 14 cause its a little stronger.


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## Gatekeeper

Bump to top.


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## StillLearning

Thanks Gate 

Also for anyone else reading the thread there is some good info here as well.


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## fibertech

I dose 7ml daily - full strength in my 55


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## dj2005

Just a heads up for those who are interested in purchasing Metricide 14: Dealmed.com seems to have lowered their price by $2, making the total $22.14 ($17.15 for one gallon and $4.99 for standard shipping). Not sure how often the price fluctuates on this product, but I haven't seen it lower than this over the past few weeks.


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## barbarossa4122

I paid $ 18.95 + $ 9.95 shipping on March 11th. Still way better than buying Excel. Just checked their website , darn I did not know about the $ 4.99 standard shipping.:icon_cry: Next time I'll be more careful. 

Thanks for the heads up dj2005.


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## OverStocked

Yup, I pointed out the cheaper shipping last time. Gotta check that drop down!


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## Burks

Pretty much, if I figured this correctly, you can just multiply whatever dose you'd normally use for Excel by 0.6 and get your Metricide-14 dose? Seeing as Metricide-14 is 60% stronger mL per mL. 1.5% for Excel, versus 2.5% for Metricide (1.5/2.5=0.6). Or at least get you pretty close to whatever you want to dose. I don't feel like making my own Excel, would rather just dose it straight.

Just ordered myself some. Ran out of Excel yesterday.


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## born2lovefish

I ordered a gallon last night from dealmed.com for $22.14 shipped.


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## barbarossa4122

I am good for 378 days of dosing:icon_bigg


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## OverStocked

barbarossa4122 said:


> I am good for 378 days of dosing:icon_bigg


Pretty great, huh!


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## aquyenl

could this essentially replace CO2 for a tank? I have a 46 gallon and was planning to use diy co2...but this stuff would be a lot cheaper and less hassle than co2.


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## mistergreen

Just a little warning guys, Metricide is a toxic chemical. Take care when handling them. Don't breath it, touch it and obviously, don't swallow any.

And chemically it's not exactly the same as excel. Excel is derived from Glutaraldehyde which makes it a bit less toxic to plants and animals.


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## jargonchipmunk

Metricide is a Gluteraldehyde derivative as well. 2.6% I believe (which is the reason it's "stronger" than Excel) If anything buy this and don't mess with trying to dilute your own Gluteraldehyde. THAT is some nasty stuff lol.

(although mistergreen is right in warning about this stuff as well, it's also fairly hazardous)


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## sewingalot

I actually wrote Seachem about the topic. Yes, they have a vested interest, but I think they have valid points:



> We consulted with our chemist in regard to your email and
> this was his response:
> 
> "First, I should tell you that Flourish Excel is not a 1.7
> per cent glutaraldehyde solution.
> 
> Second, the "-cide" portion of the name "Metracide"
> indicates it kills living organisms. That is why Metracide
> is sold in the first place. If it were sold as an additive
> for aquariums, I'm sure that the strength would be
> adjusted to achieve the desired goal of enhancing plant
> growth. As it is, it has the strength to kill microbes.
> This means that it should be diluted, and carefully.
> (Glutaraldehyde does real damage to the eyes, so I would
> wear safety goggles.)
> 
> Remember that glutaraldehyde is a reducing agent. The
> activator that comes with Metracide sounds like an agent
> to increase the reducing ability of the glutaraldehyde. I
> would most certainly avoid that. But it makes me wonder if
> there is something other than water in the inactive
> ingredients list, perhaps a buffer to help the activator
> work better.
> 
> As a general rule, it is a good idea to wear gloves, and
> to make sure that glutaraldehyde doesn't come in contact
> with skin. Some chemicals are sensitizers, meaning that
> repeated exposure to the chemical can cause a person to
> break out in a rash, or worse. Glutaraldehyde is such a
> chemical. I copied this from the OSHA (Department of
> Labor) website:
> 
> "Long-term (chronic) effects: Glutaraldehyde is a
> sensitizer. This means some workers will become very
> sensitive to glutaraldehyde and have strong reactions if
> they are exposed to even small amounts. Workers may get
> sudden asthma attacks with difficult breathing, wheezing,
> coughing, and tightness in the chest. Prolonged exposure
> can cause a skin allergy and chronic eczema, and
> afterwards, exposure to small amounts produces severe
> itching and skin rashes. It has been implicated as a
> possible cause of occupational asthma."
> 
> The stronger the solution of glutaraldehyde, the greater
> the chance of acquiring a chemical sensitivity. For the
> record, somewhere in my 35 years of working in the
> chemical industry I picked up a sensitivity to
> glutaraldehyde. I also use Flourish Excel in both my
> planted tanks, with no adverse reaction.
> 
> To play it safe, I would recommend continuing to use
> Flourish Excel, and not substituting something that was
> designed to do something other than deliver organic carbon
> to plants. Of course, I work for Seachem, so you would
> expect me to say that. But we develop our products with
> the hobbyist, and not the hospital, in mind. Flourish
> Excel is safe when used according to directions. It does
> not have to be diluted. You don't have to worry about
> developing chemical sensitivities. We do recommend that
> you keep it out of your eyes, a good recommendation for
> all our products."
> 
> I hope this information was helpful and please let us know
> if you have any additional questions. Have a wonderful
> day!
> 
> Seachem Support 100215


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## OverStocked

Of course this is there answer. Yet still they won't actually identify what is in Flourish Excel. For the record, the MSDS safety precautions for each are identical and continuing to pretend that it is somehow safer because it comes in a pretty(expensive) bottle is silly. 

At one point Excel was simply labeled as Glutaraldehyde on the MSDS. Now they have essentially made up a name for it(that at one point they claimed to be patenting, but apparently have no grounds to patent it on). 

The use of Metricide 14 in a responsible manor is safe. NO more or less dangerous than Excel. If you don't believe me, just look at the MSDS provided by seachem. 


> SECTION VIII: CONTROL MEASURES
> Respiratory Protection NA
> Ventilation Local Exhaust, Mechanical Ventilation
> Protective Gloves Recommended
> *Eye Protection Required*
> Other Protective Clothing or Equipment NA
> Work/Hygienic Practices Good house keeping practices


http://www.seachem.com/support/MSDS/FlourishExcel.doc.pdf


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## OverStocked

mistergreen said:


> Just a little warning guys, Metricide is a toxic chemical. Take care when handling them. Don't breath it, touch it and obviously, don't swallow any.
> 
> And chemically it's not exactly the same as excel. Excel is derived from Glutaraldehyde which makes it a bit less toxic to plants and animals.


There is no proof that Excel is somehow safer than Metricide. Please read the MSDS for each product. What leads anyone to believe that it is safer when the MSDS indicates that both are of the same risk is mind boggling to me. 

Further, this "glutaraldehyde" derivative is an unknown compound. Seachem said years ago that they would elaborate after getting it patented, but was unable to secure a patent. This leads me to believe that it is nothing more than a diluted version of Glutaraldehyde, just like Metricide. 

Metricide is NOT pure Glutaraldehyde. It is diluted and continuing to perpetuate that it is somehow some nasty chemical and Excel is like bottled water is both irresponsible and false.


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## mistergreen

over_stocked said:


> There is no proof that Excel is somehow safer than Metricide.


Yeah, I know. That's why I said 'a bit safer'.. But there are no studies on it.. Honestly, I've stopped using excel.



> Further, this "glutaraldehyde" derivative is an unknown compound. Seachem said years ago that they would elaborate after getting it patented, but was unable to secure a patent. This leads me to believe that it is nothing more than a diluted version of Glutaraldehyde, just like Metricide.


Actually it is known, I saw the name of it but it's so long, I've forgotten it.. Something like iso.....glutataldehyde.... But as you said, it's still under the patent procedure so they can't release their method for making this compound.



> Metricide is NOT pure Glutaraldehyde. It is diluted and continuing to perpetuate that it is somehow some nasty chemical and Excel is like bottled water is both irresponsible and false.


It's not pure glutaradehyde but it doesn't mean it's safe. There are scientific papers on the negative effects of it in the environment, water notably.


Either way, use excel or metricide at your discretion.


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## OverStocked

mistergreen said:


> Yeah, I know. That's why I said 'a bit safer'.. But there are no studies on it.. Honestly, I've stopped using excel.
> 
> 
> Actually it is known, I saw the name of it but it's so long, I've forgotten it.. Something like iso.....glutataldehyde.... But as you said, it's still under the patent procedure so they can't release their method for making this compound.


Aqueous solution of polycycloglutaracetal
This is a proprietary name from Seachem. You will find no other reference to it from any other source. Seachem will not say what it is. It just so happens that the MSDS for it is identical to other diluted Glutataldehyde products. Actually, Seachems is often worded STRONGER than others. 

There is no patent. There is no patent procedure. Seachem freely admits they do not have a patent. They formerly said they were in the process of patenting it, they no longer do. This was around 2001. 


> It's not pure glutaradehyde but it doesn't mean it's safe. There are scientific papers on the negative effects of it in the environment, water notably.


 Used properly it is safe. The MSDS for these both prove that. Used irresponsibly without proper personal protection, it is dangerous after long term usage. Saying something is not safe in a blanket statement like this is very misleading. 

How about this statement... Potassium Nitrate is not safe. No qualifiers. Nothing. 

There are scientific studies on Pure Glutaradehyde, yes. 


> Either way, use excel or metricide at your discretion.



I just think it is silly for people to keep arguing that Excel is somehow safer than products like Metricide. The risk of Reactive Asthma from the use of Metricide is DIRECTLY linked to the aerosolized long term usage of Metricide. Not pouring it once daily or every couple of days. I have used this chemical in a responsible manor for 7 years with no adverse reactions. Use anything in a manor other than directed and it can be dangerous.


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## fibertech

I am sticking with Metricide. Been using it for months with no problem.


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## CRS Fan

Metricide 14 is safe for planted tank and even some shrimp species at half the dose of Seachem Excel. Make sure you DO NOT ADD THE ACTIVATOR from Metricide 14. It works very well as a carbon source in lieu of injected CO2. A very good friend of mine has been using this on her 256 gallon planted tank with excellent results. Please note that lower order plants are susceptible to Metricide/Excel. This would include Riccia, Mini Pelia, Vals, Stonewort (Nitella flexilis) to name a few. I pick mine up at a medical supply store here in Canada for $22 Canadian (now equal to US funds )!

Best Regards,

Stuart


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## barbarossa4122

> "First, I should tell you that Flourish Excel is not a 1.7
> per cent glutaraldehyde solution.


 I heard to versions, 1.7 or 1.5. Does anyone knows for sure? Btw, I am using Metricide and I don't blame Seachem for sticking with their product which is good but, pricey.


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## OverStocked

barbarossa4122 said:


> I heard to versions, 1.7 or 1.5. Does anyone knows for sure? Btw, I am using Metricide and I don't blame Seachem for sticking with their product which is good but, pricey.


Not that I am aware. Seachem won't even admit what is in their product, so it is hard to say. I am tempted to send it to a mass spec lab, as I already have products going for testing.


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## barbarossa4122

> I can't recall the thread, but if you do some hunting you'll find a guy who had Excel put through analysis at a lab and they came out with 1.5% glutaraldehyde. Cidex is 3.4%
> 
> http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/7153-flourish-Excel-Alternatives?highlight=metricide


So, it's 1.5 if this is accurate.


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## herns

dj2005 said:


> Just a heads up for those who are interested in purchasing Metricide 14: Dealmed.com seems to have lowered their price by $2, making the total $22.14 ($17.15 for one gallon and $4.99 for standard shipping). Not sure how often the price fluctuates on this product, but I haven't seen it lower than this over the past few weeks.


I just placed an order of Metricide 14 from Dealmed.com. $22.14 shipped. 

Its a lot of savings since a 2L Excel is $30.89 + $7.45 shipping from Big Als.:bounce:


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## Luichenwai

Will using this be safe in my ADA Mini M Shrimp tank? Red Cherry Shrimps....


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## CRS Fan

I know absolutely Cherry Shrimp, Blue Pearls, Amanos, and Mountain Fan Shrimp are not affected by this product even in Flourish Excel overdose amounts. Use half as much of Metricide 14 to compensate for the stronger solution.

Best Regards,

Stuart


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## born2lovefish

herns said:


> I just placed an order of Metricide 14 from Dealmed.com. $22.14 shipped.
> 
> Its a lot of savings since a 2L Excel is $30.89 + $7.45 shipping from Big Als.:bounce:


I did the same about a month back.


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## herns

dj2005 said:


> Just a heads up for those who are interested in purchasing Metricide 14: Dealmed.com seems to have lowered their price by $2, making the total $22.14 ($17.15 for one gallon and $4.99 for standard shipping). Not sure how often the price fluctuates on this product, but I haven't seen it lower than this over the past few weeks.


I placed second order of Metricide 14 & Dealmed increased shipping cost from $4.99 to $7.99. The price is still on sale for $17.14.


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## The_Finglonger

So for a gallon of metricide 14, I would need to dilute it with half a gallon of distilled water to get the ratio needed?


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## Scuba Steve

You could do the math up front and then dose at full strength. Saves you the hassle of finding mixing containers and the mixing. BTW, the ratio appears to be 1.5% (Excel) versus 2.6% (Metricide). (The ratio issue has been explored here.) I've seen folks either dose Metricide at 50% or 60% of the Excel dose and not report issues. I just started dosing to fight some BBA and am using 50% of what I would have used with Excel.


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## The_Finglonger

thanks!


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## OverStocked

Excel IS 1.5% Glut: http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/c...opic&t=2917&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=30


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## Sharkbait-ooHAHA

I saw the syringe method of getting the metricide out of the jug. Are there other ways so as not to spill it everywhere?


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## mrchach

well im gonna assume they are all chemicals... and potassium which im sure we have bags of dry ferts with potassium in it... if its pure it is highly highly explosive... so chemicals are nothing to play with period, always wear protection if your dealing with anything, and read MSDS sheets! 

Whats interesting is that it was stated as a chemical used to kill things...
While its a good source of carbon im not sure that "cides" are good things to be dosing pets and much cared for plants... while it is cheaper than co2 systems and much more easily regulated than diy systems, it is still a "poison" of types and should be treated as such... I wonder if maybe thats why shooting it directly onto algae helps kill it, i was assuming that the carbon factor simply stunted the algae somehow... now im thinking your spraying the algae with a herbicide and before it has time to dilude (10ml into 55 gal is a hell of a dilution for something thats already diluded to 1.7/100th).


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## The_Finglonger

I use a turkey baster to get mines out of my metricide mix.



Sharkbait-ooHAHA said:


> I saw the syringe method of getting the metricide out of the jug. Are there other ways so as not to spill it everywhere?


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## tuffgong

I pour my Metricide into an old Excel bottle that's re-labeled as Metricide 14.


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## ridethespiral

tuffgong said:


> I pour my Metricide into an old Excel bottle that's re-labeled as Metricide 14.


My excel bottle is almost empty and I was thinking of ordering a jug and doing this exact same thing 
It has the child proof cap which I can barely get off at times :angryfire


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## fresh.salty

Someone help me please. I barely made it through algebra in high school in 1973. lol

Anyway, I have an empty 2L bottle of Excel. How much Metricide do I need in the bottle to come up with something about the same strength.

Been using it in my 90g for clean up but also in my 3g. I'd prefer not using it full strength since the 3g dosage is already real small.


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## [email protected]

fresh.salty said:


> Someone help me please. I barely made it through algebra in high school in 1973. lol
> Anyway, I have an empty 2L bottle of Excel. How much Metricide do I need in the bottle to come up with something about the same strength.
> Been using it in my 90g for clean up but also in my 3g. I'd prefer not using it full strength since the 3g dosage is already real small.


We can't help you as we don't know the strength of YOUR bottle of Metricide. It varies. 
People can't even agree on the percentage of Gluteraldyhde in Excel. Apparently it varied over time and Seachem changed their MSDS sheet a year or so back so it doesn't list it anymore.

Give us the strength of the Metricide you have and someone will give you an amount of water to add to X amount of Metricide to reach a specific concentration equivalent.


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## fresh.salty

Had to wait until this morning, MY bottle of Metricide is at my shop and says 2.6%.


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## fresh.salty

fresh.salty said:


> Had to wait until this morning, MY bottle of Metricide is at my shop and says 2.6%.


And I'd like to make 2L of "Excel strength" to dose.


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## snafuspyramid

I dose a 10% solution of gluteraldehyde supplied by a native plant breeder in the Northern Territory (Aus).

So far so good.

But the water has gone cloudy recently. Mmm.


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## staticfritz

any reason not to use metricide 28 vs 14?


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## bsmith

snafuspyramid said:


> I dose a 10% solution of gluteraldehyde supplied by a native plant breeder in the Northern Territory (Aus).
> 
> So far so good.
> 
> But the water has gone cloudy recently. Mmm.


I would venture that you dosed a bit too much and killed off some of your good bacteria creating a mini cycle. This will happen if excel is too heavily overdosed and with metricide this can happen even easier.


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## hoffmanjj19

I'm surprised this thread stalled out. Seemed like a very interesting conversation.


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## OverStocked

hoffmanjj19 said:


> I'm surprised this thread stalled out. Seemed like a very interesting conversation.


I guess I'm not sure what else you want from the conversation.... There are a few other more detailed topics on this. If you look for some posts by me on glut you'll see some of it.


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## deanwaters

I've got a question. Maybe I'm confused but did I read that some people continue dosing CO2 while using metricide? I assume that is overkill and not necessary but I wanted to be sure. I'm thinking about tossing my sugar/yeast combo and just buying metricide. Do I understand correctly that 1 gallon of this stuff could last as long as a whole year with a 55gallon tank? I'd love to hear from someone who uses Metricide with a 55g and how much of the Metricide 14 formula should be used daily and how/where to dose it. Into the filter intake? into the ground? Anywhere in the water? Sorry for all the questions.


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## herns

edit.


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## herns

barbarossa4122 said:


> I paid $ 18.95 + $ 9.95 shipping on March 11th. Still way better than buying Excel. Just checked their website , darn I did not know about the $ 4.99 standard shipping.:icon_cry: Next time I'll be more careful.
> 
> Thanks for the heads up dj2005.



After more than 2 years, price had gone up! $21 + $6 shipping on Eaby

I found one cheaper but it wouldnt provide shipping estimate.

http://www.coneinstruments.com/cart.asp


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## Aben314

Is metricide still worth it if I'm only using it on a 10 gallon tank?

500ml of Excel is only ~$10 with amazon prime. It's much safer and easier to dose, right?


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## herns

Aben314 said:


> Is metricide still worth it if I'm only using it on a 10 gallon tank?
> 
> 500ml of Excel is only ~$10 with amazon prime. It's much safer and easier to dose, right?



Your $10, 500ml Excel probably would last for a month or two. A gallon of metricide 14 is about $23-$25 shipped and would last for about a year. its more stronger than Excel so if you dilute it with I think distilled water you are looking for 2 gal Excel strength metricide 14.


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## Aben314

A month or two?

I was under the impression that with 500ml and only adding the recommended dosage of 1ml for 10 gallons every other day I'd be set for quite a while.


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## jahmic

herns said:


> Your $10, 500ml Excel probably would last for a month or two. A gallon of metricide 14 is about $23-$25 shipped and would last for about a year. its more stronger than Excel so if you dilute it with I think distilled water you are looking for 2 gal Excel strength metricide 14.


?

In a 10 gallon tank...even with doubling the recommended amount and dosing daily, you would be dosing 2ml per day. That 500ml bottle would last well over a month or two...closer to 7 or 8 months.

For a small volume tank you aren't really going to need such a large bottle of metricide, IMO. Although it makes sense when your are dosing, for example, almost 10ml a day or so in a 75 gal tank, I'd just save the storage space and buy a bottle of excel for the convenience.


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## jahmic

Aben314 said:


> A month or two?
> 
> I was under the impression that with 500ml and only adding the recommended dosage of 1ml for 10 gallons every other day I'd be set for quite a while.


Lol...I type too slow on my phone. You are definitely correct. I've had a 500ml bottle for well over a year as I dose weekly, at the most.


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## m8e

5ml of excel in 200L(≈1ml per 10.5 gallon) adds the same amount of carbon as 0.825ppm of CO2. Does this tiny and temporary increase in carbon really make a noticable difference?


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## herns

Aben314 said:


> A month or two?
> 
> I was under the impression that with 500ml and only adding the recommended dosage of 1ml for 10 gallons every other day I'd be set for quite a while.


Yeah youre right. I apologize.

I calculate base on my heavy dosing. I always love to overdozed . Like 30ml -40ml on my 20g every other day. so 500ml will only last a month to me.

Here's a poll of Metricide 14 vs Seachem's Excel

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...ions/75088-metricide-14-vs-seachem-excel.html


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## ProndFarms

Has anyone found any good deals on Metricide 14 lately? Cheapest I can find now is $25.08 before shipping


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## hbosman

ProndFarms said:


> Has anyone found any good deals on Metricide 14 lately? Cheapest I can find now is $25.08 before shipping


Check amazon.com. You can buy it by the quart if you dont need a gallon.

http://www.amazon.com/Glutaraldehyd...ution-quart/dp/B0030UDNZQ/ref=pd_rhf_se_p_t_2


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## JoraaÑ

ProndFarms said:


> Has anyone found any good deals on Metricide 14 lately? Cheapest I can find now is $25.08 before shipping


Ebay has some its 28 tho' same stuff...1gal/25$ shipped.


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## jbrady33

Gallon is 26 & change shipped on amazon


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## ipkiss

Man, that stuff is going up like gas. I had to shell out 27 and change today.


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## ipkiss

hbosman said:


> Check amazon.com. You can buy it by the quart if you dont need a gallon.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Glutaraldehyd...ution-quart/dp/B0030UDNZQ/ref=pd_rhf_se_p_t_2


I thought about the quart but at $16 shipped, that's ALMOST the price of a bottle of excel! But yea, it is hard to get rid of a gallon if your tank is small so I had to split it with a buddy.


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## sowNreap

I just calculated this out using Metricide 14 (2.6%) ... someone please check my math ... if I use 10ml/day of Excel .. the equivalent I'd use of Metricide 14 @ 2.6% would be about 6ml/day. 

There's 3785 ml in a gallon. So 3785 ml ÷ 6ml = 630 days ÷ 365 days = 1.7 yrs. So a 1 gallon jug would last me about 1-3/4 yr and only cost $24.04 shipped! (ebay item #230818682873 ) That's a *huge *savings over Excel!!! If I did my math right. LOL

I had to Google the shelf life of Metricide just to make sure it wouldn't expire before I used it all. That didn't help much so I emailed the seller to ask what the expiration date is. I wouldn't have thought of that if I hadn't noticed a couple listings that gave an expiration date .. one for Metricide 14 with expiration of 8/13 .. that one would expire before I could use it all. Mostly I don't want to buy one that's already expired .. you just never know when you buy from that site.


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## Seattle_Aquarist

Hi sowNreap,

Your math is good; 5.8ml is closer but 6.0 is close enough...enjoy the savings and don't add the activator.

I purchase 50% Biological Grade Glutaraldehyde and store it in the downstairs refrigerator; it substantially improves the shelf life.


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## jbrady33

DON'T GET THE 28! Its not the same stuff, has soap/detergent added (surficants, that how it goes from 14 day to 28)


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## sowNreap

During my Google search I think I read that the biological grade and EC grade (I think that's what it was called) require refrigeration. Think I'll just stick with the 2.6% for now. Who knows ... I may end up going the pressurized co2 route by this time next year. LOL 

I saw that the 28 has surfactants but also saw a lot of people that are using it seemingly without problems.?? But rather than take chances just figured I'd use the 15. It's still a huge savings over Excel.

And definitely will NOT use the activator.

Thanks all.


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## sowNreap

For anyone interested in purchasing the Metricide 14 at $24.04 shipped check out e b a y seller supermedicalsupply or search item #230818682873. I received a reply that the expiration would be a well over 1yr if not 2 yrs .. they have too many in their warehouses to know the exact date. I ordered it Monday afternoon and received it today .. and that's with free shipping! The expiration date on the bottle I received is 8/2014 so no worries there.


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## herns

ProndFarms said:


> Has anyone found any good deals on Metricide 14 lately? Cheapest I can find now is $25.08 before shipping



I just bought 1 gal at Amazon $27 shipped. The best deal so far.

Dealmed was previously the cheapest and on e--bay but they had gone up to $30-$38.


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## Tetranerd

*Metricide 14*

I bought a gallon of Metricide 14 today from Ebay for $29 with free shipping. I'm happy with the price - that gives me almost 2 years of doses for my 90 gal aquarium if I dose straight (2.6%) at 0.5 ml per gallon. That beats paying almost that much for 500 ml of Excel.


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## Tetranerd

[QUOTE/] at 0.5 ml per gallon [/QUOTE]
That's supposed to be per 10 gal - 


Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2


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## sowNreap

I guess neither of you saw my post right above your where you could get a gallon of Metracide 14 for $24 shipped .. that price has now dropped to $23.80. I realize the price difference isn't much but every dollar adds up. 

For anyone else interested in buying some ... as noted in my previous post, on ebay search for item # 230818682873 or seller "supermedicalsupply" . They shipped same day I ordered and I received it the next day and this was free shipping .. of course YMMV although they have warehouses scattered throughout the country.


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## Tetranerd

Nope - bought before reading this. Will keep it in mind for next time, tho, if it's still there a year or so down the road! 

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2


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## sowNreap

Tetranerd said:


> Nope - bought before reading this. Will keep it in mind for next time, tho, if it's still there a year or so down the road!
> 
> Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2


Yeah ... that's me too. I had to Google Metricide shelf life or expiration date to make sure it would stay good until I used it all. The bottle I got has expiration date of 8/2014 .. should be gone by then.


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## herns

sowNreap said:


> Yeah ... that's me too. I had to Google Metricide shelf life or expiration date to make sure it would stay good until I used it all. The bottle I got has expiration date of 8/2014 .. should be gone by then.


I know Excel can has no expiration date. 

Can an expired Metricide still be used?


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## jbrady33

I'm thinking that the exp date on Metricide is for medical use - after that date they wouldn't guarantee it's sterilization properties. 

I would still use it, but others will disagree.

I've actually kicked WAY back on my usage - down to a half dose once a week. Just an experiment to see if some of the plants I've had trouble with will grow. (Swords and stuff. Don't have any true jungle vals left, but some smaller val-like 'grasses' seem to be perking up with less) If I ever boost the lights I might have to kick it up again.

PS: I've been using Metricide in one tank and 'real' excel in the small tank - both seem to respond the same.


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## herns

jbrady33 said:


> PS: I've been using Metricide in one tank and 'real' excel in the small tank - both seem to respond the same.


Metricide is amazing. I had recently a bad hair algae growing in my moss wall and and it just hard to remove. The moss comes along when I tried to pull them out. I dose as much as 30ml everyday on my 20 and they are slowly vanishing.

I just bought another gal. last night on eebay for a great deal $20 shipped. Check out "other site" thread for the item no.



Sent from HTC One device using Tapatalk2


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## shift

IS there any negative effects of dosing a medium light low tech tank? 

Is it shrimp safe? I don't think i would dose daily.. but probably at water changes.


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## Darkblade48

shift said:


> IS there any negative effects of dosing a medium light low tech tank?


As with many other things, if overdosed, it can be harmful.



shift said:


> Is it shrimp safe? I don't think i would dose daily.. but probably at water changes.


Yes. I have used diluted glutaraldehyde (which is what Metricide 14 is) with no problems in a shrimp aquarium.


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## shift

Thanks Darkblade48, How many ml would you recommend dosing for a 84G tank? From what i read its a bit stronger then excel.. so i'm thinking about a half dosage when going of the excel specs.


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## m3177o

Is it shrimp safe? Yes, but don't over dose. I've made this mistake twice. And twice it wiped out my Oebt colony. Just watch it when you're dosing. It's fine.


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## shift

How much do you consider to much?


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## Darkblade48

shift said:


> Thanks Darkblade48, How many ml would you recommend dosing for a 84G tank? From what i read its a bit stronger then excel.. so i'm thinking about a half dosage when going of the excel specs.


There is a dosing calculator that you can find quite easily online.

You can also use the formula m1v1 = m2v2 (the calculator uses the same formula) to determine how much you need to dose.

m1 = concentration of first chemical
v1 = volume of first chemical
m2 = concentration of second chemical
v2 = volume of second chemical

With the concentrations of Excel and Metricide 14 being known (as well as the normal dosing rates for Excel), solving the volume of Metricide 14 to dose becomes a routine algebraic exercise.


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## Aquarist_Fist

So, here is a question, and I apologize if this has been asked and answered a million times already: If it is now known what Excel is (glutaraldehyde) and if Seachem has no patent on it, how come we are not seeing a) an explosion of glutaraldehyde products in the aquarium market (after all, there must be a dozen different dechlorinators that do all the same thing), and b) why is the price of Excel not going down?


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## shift

Because people keep buying it.... and are afraid to use a 'chemical disinfectant' in their fish tank


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## herns

:icon_conf


Aquarist_Fist said:


> why is the price of Excel not going down?


There are still lots of people who doesnt know about Metricide 14. Even some people in forums wanted to stick w/ Excel.


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## jbrady33

And there are others, API has "Co2 Booster", not 100% sue but I think it is gut also


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## Aquarist_Fist

I see. I understand Excel still sells well. I am just surprised the market isn't being totally flooded with similar products, given what a moneymaker Excel must be for Seachem.


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## newbieplanter

*Metricide 14 Dosing*

I wanna use metricide 14 undiluted n flourish in my 5gal custom tank I have flame moss pennywort, 3 swords (small ones), 2 jungle vals, 4 stems of myro matt, for fish I have 2 Cory cats, 10 rili n 5 red shrimp, an a bunch of guppies. Question is how much metricide to use every other day? I never used flourish excel so I don't know how excel to dose unless its the same instructions on both flourish and flourish excel?


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## shift

Times the excel amount by about 0.6. And it should give you the approximate doseage


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## sowNreap

Price is down for Metricide 14 via e b a y .. $20.99 with free shipping. Search item # 350766996161 . The seller doesn't have the best rating but I'm going to chance it .. can always use buyer protection or PayPal dispute if any problems. Cheapest I've seen lately.


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## Hilde

Calculator for solution here.

I don't have ml measuring cup, just a baby syringe. So I did a 6:1 with Cidex 28 which is 2.5% glut. Then dosing 6ml daily in 29G.


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## Hilde

newbieplanter said:


> I wanna use metricide 14 undiluted n flourish in my 5gal custom tank I have flame moss pennywort, 2 jungle vals, 2 Cory cats, 10 rili n 5 red shrimp.


All of the above are very sensitive to glut in metricide and excel.


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## chunkychun

sowNreap said:


> Price is down for Metricide 14 via e b a y .. $20.99 with free shipping. Search item # 350766996161 . The seller doesn't have the best rating but I'm going to chance it .. can always use buyer protection or PayPal dispute if any problems. Cheapest I've seen lately.


as long as you are okay with OMNICIDE b/c that is what you will get from this dealer. Also very poor service and lied to me about shipping date. eventually i just got my money back from [Ebay Link Removed]

i rec look elsewhere


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## sowNreap

chunkychun said:


> as long as you are okay with OMNICIDE b/c that is what you will get from this dealer. Also very poor service and lied to me about shipping date. eventually i just got my money back from [Ebay Link Removed]
> 
> i rec look elsewhere


What is wrong with Omnicide?? That is what I received (and what the title says it might be). Contains the same amount of glutaraldehyde = 2.6% .. with activator in separate bottle (which I threw away), just like the Metricide I had before. Just want to know before I use it. 

I didn't have any problems with my order. Ordered over weekend, shipped on Monday & received Thursday. Very well packaged.

EDIT: I don't see a problem with using Omnicide the MSDS reads *exactly* the same as for Metricide ... only difference is the manufacturer. Here's the MSDS for Omnicide: http://www.kellysolutions.com/erene...1-25B_Omnicide_14_N_S_8_4_2005_6_31_39_PM.pdf

Here's the MSDS for Metricide: https://www.vaxserve.com/image.cfm?doc_id=10066&image_type=msds_sheet

So if anyone knows why I can't/shouldn't use Omnicide, please speak up.


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## MB2

Just bought a gallon of metricide 14. The instruction said to mix in the activator before use and do not use beyond 14 days! For our planted tank purposes, do you mix in the activator? And don't use after 14 days?


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## Seattle_Aquarist

Hi MB2,

Do not use the activator.

Store in a cool dark location and it will last a year or more.


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## tetra73

Does anyone know if anything harmful about metricide 14 over excel? Or they have the same effects when overdosing too much?


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## MB2

Seattle_Aquarist said:


> Hi MB2,
> 
> Do not use the activator.
> 
> Store in a cool dark location and it will last a year or more.


Ok, thank you Roy.


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## Darkblade48

tetra73 said:


> Does anyone know if anything harmful about metricide 14 over excel? Or they have the same effects when overdosing too much?


They have the same active ingredient; overdosing both will cause problems amongst livestock.


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## jeepguy

I actually bought my metricide from this seller. Didn't have any problems and shipment was relatively quick.


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## Mizuhuman

Darkblade48 said:


> They have the same active ingredient; overdosing both will cause problems amongst livestock.


Do you know what kind of problems? I didn't know overdosing cause problems because I have read that some people overdose without any apparent problems.


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## lipadj46

Mizuhuman said:


> Do you know what kind of problems? I didn't know overdosing cause problems because I have read that some people overdose without any apparent problems.


It is used to sterilize medical equipment that cannot be put in an oven. They use it to clean the colonoscopy scopes at the GI center my wife worked at. It will kill fish quite easily if overdosed and the fish are not used to it

sent from an undisclosed location using morse code


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## bigstick120

I bought from that seller on ebay, advertised metricide, I got omnicide. It isnt the same omnicide has a rust inhibitor added that metricide doesnt. Omnicide also smells like mint. I had been adding a little extra, not over dosing but about 8ml a day in my 58 as my CO2 was running low and my bubble count wasnt as high. Lights came on and I see a ton of snails and shrimp at the top and several dead shrimp.

My point is there is for sure something else in it, Ive used merticide and only had it kill and stress when I really overdosed. Use omnicide only at regular levels.


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## khanzer22

Just saw this thread and would like to share the Glut product I recently purchased from e-b-a-y... If you can get a hold of Pro-Advantage by NDC product (they have 14 and 28 days as well), that's the same as Metrex Metricide... I checked and confirmed with Metrex that they private labeled this for them and MSDS-wise, they're identical (like xerox copy)... The best part, I only paid ~$20 shipped for a gallon...

Here's what it looks like for reference (the pic shows the 28 day product)


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## hedge_fund

Just purchased this...you can checkout with PayPal which was a huge plus.

http://www.dealmed.com/Shop-by-Brand/Metrex/101405#.UrmNppX8vFs


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## jacko5

Thought i would bump this up.
Has anyone found Metricide 14 anywhere in the UK ?
Thanks.


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## jbrady33

jacko5 said:


> Thought i would bump this up.
> Has anyone found Metricide 14 anywhere in the UK ?
> Thanks.


It looks pricey, but Amazon UK has both Cidex in quarts and Metricide in gallons. See if you have a hospital supply company anywhere near you (or on-line with in-country shipping)


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## jacko5

Thanks for the info.
I have found Metricide 28 from a tattoo place in the UK for £12 a quart.
I guess this is not good to me ?


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## jbrady33

jacko5 said:


> Thanks for the info.
> I have found Metricide 28 from a tattoo place in the UK for £12 a quart.
> I guess this is not good to me ?


No, the 28 has soaps (surfactants) added to make it last longer as a disinfectant - great for the tattoo guy, not so good for your tank. The 14 has no soap added, and if you find some DON'T use the little bottle of "activator" tha t comes with it - you just want the main bottle.


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## jacko5

Thanks for the info, cheers :icon_smil


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## sowNreap

Pro-Advantage by NCD (formerly called Omnicide) is same as Metricide just different name .. maybe search for either of those names. It could even be called something different in UK. 

But as mentioned don't get the 28 day of it either .. same exact thing as Metricide 28, it has surfactants & rust inhibitor.


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## jacko5

Thanks.
Also for android phone users who want to calculate Glutaraldehyde mixing, look at this great app,

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=appinventor.ai_fwmilmo.Glutaraldehyde_Calculator


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## jacko5

Bump.
Still looking for a UK supplier.
Also looking for glutaraldehyde 50% at a good price in the UK.
Found some on ebay but £26 1 liter delivered is expensive, and Amazon 5 liter £45 also expensive.
UK peeps on here let me know if you find a cheaper option for glutaraldehyde 50% , thanks.


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## Seattle_Aquarist

jacko5 said:


> Bump.
> Still looking for a UK supplier.
> Also looking for glutaraldehyde 50% at a good price in the UK.
> Found some on ebay but £26 1 liter delivered is expensive, and Amazon 5 liter £45 also expensive.
> UK peeps on here let me know if you find a cheaper option for glutaraldehyde 50% , thanks.


Hi jacko5,

Actually £26 for 1 liter of 50% concentration glutaraldehyde delivered is a very good price. 1 liter of 50% will make 33 liters of 1.5% (Excel strength) mixture. It stores in the refrigerator for over a year without losing potency.


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## jacko5

Seattle_Aquarist said:


> Hi jacko5,
> 
> Actually £26 for 1 liter of 50% concentration glutaraldehyde delivered is a very good price. 1 liter of 50% will make 33 liters of 1.5% (Excel strength) mixture. It stores in the refrigerator for over a year without losing potency.


Thanks for that.
When you say it stores for 1 year, do you mean the glutaraldehyde 50% after its first opened ?
Or the batch you make up from the glutaraldehyde 50% ?
I think a 1 liter bottle of glutaraldehyde 50% will last me 2 years, so it may only last 1 year when opened.
Really no use in buying the 5 liters.


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## Seattle_Aquarist

Hi Jacko5,

I purchase 50% concentration glutaradehyde in one liter bottles and mix my own 1.5% concentration; and I have done so for several years. My current bottle of concentrate, which I store in our downstairs refrigerator (proper marked at "Poison"), is almost empty and it is just a potent as it was when I purchased it in November, 2012. When I make up the 1.5% concentration I try to use it up in a couple of months and I store it in a dark cabinet at room temperature.


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## jacko5

Seattle_Aquarist said:


> Hi Jacko5,
> 
> I purchase 50% concentration glutaradehyde in one liter bottles and mix my own 1.5% concentration; and I have done so for several years. My current bottle of concentrate, which I store in our downstairs refrigerator (proper marked at "Poison"), is almost empty and it is just a potent as it was when I purchased it in November, 2012. When I make up the 1.5% concentration I try to use it up in a couple of months and I store it in a dark cabinet at room temperature.


Thanks a lot for that.
I will get 1 liter then.
Hope it lasts me 2 years and be Ok in that time.
I want to use it as i have just got LED lighting and am getting a lot of hair algae, i have adjusted the lighting now, turned the power down.
I am hoping this will help to keep the algae in check as well as feeding my plants.


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## jacko5

Ok guys, i have just made my first batch of glut.
1.5%.
For my first dose do i put 20ml in like i will every day ( i should do 17.5ml really but i have upped the dose a bit ) or do i put in 80ml ( i should do 87.5ml but i have lowered it a bit as i do not do a 50% water change ) like i will do on a water change ?
Thanks.


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## TekWarren

I don't dilute metricide at all or do the "pre-charge" after a water change. I've just started out with a small amount and worked my way up slowly based on the plant response.


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## jacko5

TekWarren said:


> I don't dilute metricide at all or do the "pre-charge" after a water change. I've just started out with a small amount and worked my way up slowly based on the plant response.


Thanks.
Its Glutaraldehyde 50% i have made into Glutaraldehyde 1.5%, by mixing it with distilled water.
I think i will start with 20ml and take it from there.
Also i have read certain plants do not like Glutaraldehyde, i have a feeling my Giant Vallis may get killed.
Has anyone had this problem ?


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