# 100 gal planted tank journal (56k?)



## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

What better way to spend my tax refund than setting up a big tank? 

$300 tank
$300 stand+top
$100 filter
$100 lights
$100 plants
$70 heater (cable)
$30 substrate
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... there it goes...

The spot for it was 71" (really!). So no way to get a standard 72" tank in there :evil: That left me with the next smaller size: 60x24x18.
Next decision was to buy a custom stand or diy. After calculating back and forth I diy'd, not because I would save any money, but after looking at the stands at the fish store I lost some confidence and did it myself.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Ordered some plants to give the tank a good head start. This one looks funny... supposed to be a Wisteria, but I guess it got mixed up with something else.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Just planted... still no real concept on how it should look like. In a few weeks the plants will need to be re-arranged.


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## GulfCoastAquarian (Jul 30, 2002)

I like what you've got so far. Very natural, river bottom looking aquascape. It screams of Discus. What sort of fish are you planning?


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## digger (Feb 18, 2003)

The mirror background makes the tank look huge.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Discus... is a dream fish for me, maybe one day. My water is fairly hard, and I don't want to mess too much with chemistry (RO).
Once the tank is a little more stable, I would like some pearl gouramies, other dwarf gouramies, some dwarf cichlids, nothing fancy or complicated.
Right now the tank houses one ghost shrimp (just shed its skin last night) and a Flying Fox (nervous little guy). I will probably add some oto's to help cleaning up the brown algae.


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## 2la (Aug 18, 2002)

Your wisteria is fine; that's the appearance of the emersed growth. It will change once you get it acclimated to submersed life.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Ooops... thanks 2la, I guess that is why they call it _difformis_.
Hopefully with the little light it will change to the fern shaped leaves. And the label says -- "true aquatic" they should add: field grown.
:icon_mrgr


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Time for an update... 

First, there were brown algae. For about two weeks they covered gravel, glass, and most of the plants. Then they all disappeared.

Now I am enjoying a different sight... green algae, and green water. The blue in the pic below is not there really... just increased the contrast a little to make the plants more visible in my pea soup. Just as the brownies, I hope this is part of the tank getting stable, so I am waiting with patience. I don't believe in fighting them with diatom and algae ex and whatnot, I think they will commit suicide by eating up their specific nutrient combination.

Most plants have grown satisfactory. Limnophila and Myriophyllum (center, hardly visible) have shown a tremendous growth. Had to cut the Wisteria into pieces, it is starting to lose its emerse leaf shape. Ceradopteris, Diandra & Rotala grow nicely. Crypts and Swords are growing okay, one sword (ruffled? bleheri?) new leaves are very yellow. I am adding iron and also recently a fertilizer tab to that sword and to the red rubin.

As expected, the Glosso does not like the low-light situation (about 150W for 100gal). Bolbitis and Java fern are not growing at all.

I added two Oto's to the Flying Fox and Ghost Shrimp. Looks like they enjoy their new home, swimming around like little sharks. Next week I will get two more of them.

Once this stabilizes a little more, I want to add Pearl Gouramies, and some Nannostomus (pencil fishes).


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## digger (Feb 18, 2003)

Yep, looks just like my new 10 gallon. Full of pea soup.


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## fishpoop (Feb 27, 2003)

I'm sorry about your green water 
I love that photo of your gost shrimp
you are a skilled photographer 
I want a camera that will take shots like that!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Thanks fishpoop, I am sure the green water will clear up itself in a week or so, after that the tank will be immune...
Taking photos is one of my many hobbies, all I can say is it's not the camera that takes shots, but the person behind it :wink: but a good optics definitely help. I switched from SLR to digital cameras a year ago, and I absolutely love the ability to take 50 shots of the same subject and then pick out the two that came out nicely.

Last night I bought an African Butterfly Fish, I always thought they are amazing fellows. It ate already 2 big flies today, and I added a few bite-sized mosquito fishes to play with :lol: However, I hope it knows that my Oto's are not for lunch, and the shrimp neither...


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

After 7 days of pea soup the tank has cleared up, as expected, all by itself. Slowly raising the water level to the full 23".
Still haven't done major landscaping, still trying out which plants behave how in this setup. Most plants grow nicely, with exceptions of R. wallichii and Glosso, probably because the light levels are not sufficient, or water too hard, or something else or a combination :mrgreen: Marcels Riccia is greening up too :up: 

Inhabitants are now
1 Ghost Shrimp
1 Flying Fox
2 Oto's
1 African Butterfly Fish
1 pair Pearl Gouramies

I would like to get some dwarf cichlids, but I haven't seen any in the LFS around here. My wife wants something colorful, something that swims from one side to the other and then back... I like Neon Tetras, but the water temperature has been 86 recently (outside ~100, no air condition  )


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## Pooky125 (Jul 30, 2002)

Amazing, can't wait to see it when it's done! Wish I could help you on the dwarf cichlids, I can get quite a variety around here, but wouldn't feel safe shipping them to you, or I would. I personally, have some lovely agasizzii, blue rams, kribs, and winkelfleck. Can also get ahold of caucatoides (sp?), and several of the other lesser known species. There's an amazing breeder who sells that the fish auctions. Huge variety, and they go for good prices. Anyways.. Tank looks awesome, don't know how you can get it to fill in so quickly, or afford to do something like that.. Not to mention the patience.. No wonder I stick with little tanks.. Sheesh. Looks great, can't wait to see it when its done!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Pooky, thank you for your kind comments... It is interesting to compare the pic when it was planted first (and only half full water) to the most recent one, what a change in a little over 3 weeks...
Having fairly hard water I think some of the dwarf cichlids are out of reach for me... Perhaps a pair of Kribs should fit in well. Need to do some more reading. Still learning so much, especially here on this forum.


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## Pooky125 (Jul 30, 2002)

I have hard water, and don't seem to have any problems.. Cept none of them feel like getting in the mood, and giving me some fry!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

It only took 4 weeks to convert an empty glass container into a lush Planted Tank. As it is loosing it's "new" status, this thread is coming to an end as well. I hope these latest photos will be an inspiration for some thinking about setting up a large planted tank without spending a xxxxload of money for the latest in power compact lighting, pressurized CO2 and Flourite. 

The tank is not nearly "finished", but it is more joy than work now. The latest changes... I threw out most of the Limnophilas, they were growing too much and too leggy, as well as the wallichii, which definitely needs more light. Except for iron, I am not adding any fertilizer (and I am not planning to... unless I want to get into the plant selling business). 10% weekly water changes keep them growing slowly.

In the left back corner, there is the Red Rubin, steadily growing new leaves, surrounded by Cabombas, which happen to be among my favorite plants (that I have not much luck with). In front of them Diandra, which I love because of it's nice slow bushy growth and the ease that it can be cut in half and just replanted. In the front corner a Crypt lutea, with new brownish leaves and older green ones. To the right, in the background one of my other favorites, Watersprite (Ceradopteris), just reaching the surface. The older leaves grow little plantlets which I let float on the surface, the roots add to the "Jungle" look. Melon Swords add some color in the foreground, behind them a larger Amazon Sword which seems to miss some nutrients, showing in the yellowish leaves. A dark red N. lotus is the color king in front...

In the center of the tank, my favorite background plant: brown myriophyllum. I will move all of them into the right corner, where they can hide the filter pipes, and to avoid optically cutting the tank into two halves. In their place C. balansae will have some room to stretch out.

Actually in the pictures there is a little piece of the center section missing, which features some bushy Ludwigia. The right part is taken over by lilies in the middle ground, and the front corner is reserved for crypts (that are not too impressive yet).

As more plants reach the surface and floaters take over, I might add another ballast and OD my T8's to bring sufficient light to the lower levels.

I ordered a bunch of plants from AquariumGarden, but it will get crowded... I am still looking for some floaters like Salvinia, Pistia and anything interesting... if someone has a nice selection and can donate a few please PM me  

Regarding fish... My butterfly girl is pretty bored, so if I find a nice male I might add that excitement to her life. The pearl gouramies might go into the bubble nest business one day, and I will wonder what to do with hundreds of tiny gouramies. Still looking at LFS's for some dwarf cichlids. Except for flies and earwigs for the butterfly fish, I don't feed anything. I tried flakes and mosquito larvae, but only the Flying Fox eats them, who is supposed to munch algae anyway. The gouramies seem to be vegetarians who clean out Riccia and algae.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Just thought I would update this...










Finally I have almost all of the fishies I wanted. A pair of African Butterflies is waiting for flies. A pair of Pearl Gouramies is nibbling on the algae. Four Oto's are cleaning up. Some Ghost Shrimps are looking for food, jumping nervously when one of the three Yoyo Loaches comes too close. Two tiny Rams self-confidently show their colors.










This beautiful display of Lotus was only short-lived, now most leaves reach the surface.

Right now I am working on a cheap second tank, lots of experimenting, with sandy beach and kitty litter and a very interesting filtration, journal to follow...


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## jart (Jan 17, 2003)

wasserpest you said the green water in your tank cleared up "by itself". is that the case, or did you help it along with some large water changes?

regards,

jart


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

The only thing I did was to NOT change any water for 7 or 8 days. Otherwise, no changes (in lighting, CO2, etc). I think in this way most green water in newly setup tanks can be taken care of, and large water changes to clear or thin the algae are nonsense, since they propagate much faster than you can change water.

I forgot to add... my noble intention of not adding any fertilizers lead to a major plant meltdown. Now I am adding K2SO4, Flourish, and as before Flourish Iron. Just ordered a Red Sea testkit for NO3, the one from AP gives me only zero readings, be it in the tank, tap water, or water where I dosed KNO3.

Doing 15% water changes every week. Little light, little CO2, and little fertilizing all gives me a slow plant growth and a stable tank.


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## KyleT (Jul 22, 2002)

Just to let everyone know Wasserpest's tank has been added to the gallery on the main site! 

Check it out: Click Me

Kyle


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## jart (Jan 17, 2003)

ah so you finally got around to buying the nitrate test kit  

i have never had a green water outbreak in any of the tanks i have set up in the past. i would have assumed that large water changes would dilute any nutrients that the algae feed on. surely the few fish you had at the time would have produced little in the way of waste products in such a big tank. and from my understanding, most of the ammonia would have been rapidly chewed up by your plants. so, i find this approach curious (ie no large water changes). if you have anything more to add to this discussion i would be most interested.

learning mode on,

jart


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

jart said:


> ah so you finally got around to buying the nitrate test kit


As I mentioned, I have the AP test kit for a while, and just ordered the Red Sea kit, hoping it might be "better".



jart said:


> i have never had a green water outbreak in any of the tanks i have set up in the past. i would have assumed that large water changes would dilute any nutrients that the algae feed on. surely the few fish you had at the time would have produced little in the way of waste products in such a big tank. and from my understanding, most of the ammonia would have been rapidly chewed up by your plants. so, i find this approach curious (ie no large water changes). if you have anything more to add to this discussion i would be most interested.


You must be lucky... Most tanks I set up went through an initial green water outbreak. See there are many different approaches and solutions in this hobby. I shouldn't have said that water changes are nonsense, I only choose a different approach and it works for me, just as water changes, diatom filters, UV lamps and a bag of water flea might all clear things up.
Not sure if it is the ammonia or waste that causes the green water in the first place... as you say, in a large tank with almost no fish there probably isn't much of either present, and the water quality is very close to the tap water that has been used to fill the tank. I think it is the iniatial instability that provides for a very special condition that leads to a green water outbreak. Now I am reasoning that the thicker the soup, the more organisms using up whatever nutrients they prefer, and soon it all collapses, leading to a greater stability that prevents future outbreaks.
Just sharing observations... not claiming it will ever work for anyone else :mrgreen:


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## m.lemay (Jul 28, 2002)

> I think it is the iniatial instability that provides for a very special condition that leads to a green water outbreak. Now I am reasoning that the thicker the soup, the more organisms using up whatever nutrients they prefer, and soon it all collapses, leading to a greater stability that prevents future outbreaks.
> Just sharing observations... not claiming it will ever work for anyone else


I couldn't agree with you more!!! And add that water changes are also diluting the organisms which would otherwise consume the excess nutrients in the water column.  It really is all about stability and balance. We try to be Mother Nature and Mother Nature laughs when we try to mess with the eco-system. 8) 

Marcel


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## Guttboy (Jul 19, 2003)

Marcel,

So are you saying that you should just let the tank go with the hazy water...and hopefully it will settle out?

Mike


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## jart (Jan 17, 2003)

very interesting.

how i'm reading this is that, presented with a green water outbreak in a new tank, you simply wait for the critters to eat themselves out of house and home (let them exhaust their food supply, whatever it might be). and a water change would simply dilute the # of organisms, merely prolonging the resolution of the problem. 

thanks for following up on this, lads. i'll know what to do if this happens in the future.


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## m.lemay (Jul 28, 2002)

Guttboy said:


> Marcel,
> 
> So are you saying that you should just let the tank go with the hazy water...and hopefully it will settle out?
> 
> Mike


Thats exactly what I'm saying. Just make sure the filter is running, but don't change the filter media. Clean the filter only if flow thru the filter is compromised otherwise leave it alone. Rinse media with cold water and reuse. roud: 

Jart: In 90% of cases this will work with the exception of excess nitrates and or phosphates in the tank. And even in a lot of those cases the situation will clear up given time and patience to the organisms. Algae is mother natures way of bringing things into balance.

Marcel


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## slyargent (Sep 8, 2003)

How true! I had green water a few weeks ago, and I did 20% water changes everyday. They just stayed there for 3 weeks. I got feed up, and did the blackout, after 4 days, they are all gone and so is the unexpected demise of the BGA.

Anyway, NICE TANK! I do a low cost tank myself, and I use sunlight to supplement my tank. I still have to observe though. But I have wisterias, gymnocoronis, and vals at the back of my tank,and as they grow, they should filter out most of the sunlight, and grow even bigger.

Really nice tank. Btw, I read that the bigger the tank, the less light you need, is this true? I have a 75 gallon, and have 160watts of power(Ok, I know watts aren't as good in measuring, but I use full spectrums, and a cool white).


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

slyargent said:


> Btw, I read that the bigger the tank, the less light you need, is this true? I have a 75 gallon, and have 160watts of power(Ok, I know watts aren't as good in measuring, but I use full spectrums, and a cool white).


The 2.5-3 WPG recommendation applies to "medium sized" tanks, whatever that is. It is not linear, for smaller tanks it can be increased, for larger tanks decreased. IMO reflectors are a big part of this, and if you have none, or perfectly shaped highly reflective aluminum beauties makes a huge difference, and invalidates the formula.

The more light you have, the more (difficult) plants you can grow, and the faster they will grow. On the other hand, if you can live without some of the extremely demanding plants, and don't need to measure weekly growth of so-and-so many inches per week, a lower wattage with good reflectors still let's you create a nice planted tank. Plus, you don't need to add as many fertilizers, CO2, and don't need to worry that much about overheating and that huge energy bill :lol:


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## Guttboy (Jul 19, 2003)

Running some coaggulant in the tank (accuclear type stuff). Makes tank a bit more cloudy but clears it up nicely after that.....will see if I can get this to eliminate some of the haze....some others have said this treatment works...just gets the bulk out.

Mike


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

Slyargent,

As long as your bulbs are strong enough to get sufficient light to the substrate and provide good coverage to the aquarium 160watts sounds perfect. Regular fluorescent, T12 or T8, bulbs aren't strong enough to get enough light to the substrate in a 75. You would need Power Compact or stronger bulbs for that. 

There's no need for 3-4w/g in an aquarium for the exact reasons Wasserpest mentioned. I'm able to grow very nice Glossostigma elatinoides in my tank with two year and a half old PC bulbs totalling a hair over 2.0w/g. Sure, I don't get insanely fast growth, but neither do I want to always be trimming it back to keep it from overgrowing the aquarium. I feel that with proper nutrition and CO2 supplimentation I could grow anything in this tank with no problems. 

Best,
Phil


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Phil Edwards said:


> As long as your bulbs are strong enough to get sufficient light to the substrate and provide good coverage to the aquarium 160watts sounds perfect. Regular fluorescent, T12 or T8, bulbs aren't strong enough to get enough light to the substrate in a 75. You would need Power Compact or stronger bulbs for that.


Just for my curiosity... Wouldn't 5x 32W T8's give you the same amount of light as 3x 55W PC, assuming similar quality reflectors? PC's appear to be brighter, but they are also -- of course -- more compact and shorter than a 48" T8's. I admit, getting 5 bulbs to fit over a tank might be a little difficult though. On the other hand, if DIY is your thing, overdriving T8's is fairly easy too.

I don't want to start a big PC vs T8 or T12 debate, but your statement discourages the use of any T8/T12, while I think they are the most economical, efficient (lumens/watt), and even way of lighting a tank today.

Maybe because I am dirt cheap, T8's (with good reflectors) would be my first choice of lighting any 48" tank. On the other hand, if someone would pay all my expenses I would first look into PC fixtures :wink:


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

Wouldn't 5x 32W T8's give you the same amount of light as 3x 55W PC, assuming similar quality reflectors? 

Assuming similar quality reflectors a Power Compact bulb is going to be able to push light deeper into the water column than a Normal Output Fluorescent. Overdriving NOs will provide more light per bulb, but the nature of NO bulbs itself restricts the intensity and the overall "driving power" of the light it puts out. 

That's not to say OD NO fluorescents aren't a viable option in a tank up to 12" deep for high light plants or up to 18" deep for moderate light plants. For all practical purposes NO Fluorescent light doesn't reach farther than 18" and the use of PC, VHO, or Halide lighting is necessary for any but the most low light plants. 

Hope this helps,
Phil


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## slyargent (Sep 8, 2003)

Ok, so I have about 3 inches of substrate, and use NO bulbs, and the tank is about 16 inches deep. Is it fine?

I just got all my plants last week, and I'm kinda new to the planted part of the hobby. Im a cheapskate, too, and uses $5-$10 full spectrum bubls. Although I do have a $20 coralife triphospor(My LFS i should get the expensive ones :x) . Anyway, My anacharis is doing really well, its deep green now, and it is more compact(it used to be leggy and the "nodes" are separated at about half an inch, but now, I cannot see it at all) than what it used to be. So am I doing fine?

Next time, I will probably replace my bulbs with ge chromas, ultralumes and a cool white(again).


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

I don't know, are you doing ok?  If things are working the way you want them to, like Wasserpest's awesome foliage, why change things? 

Just because someone flaps his or her mouth/fingers doesn't mean it has to be that way. I've had people telling me that glosso won't grow well under less than 2.5w/g and that PC bulbs as old as mine are don't work well.


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## slyargent (Sep 8, 2003)

Yes all are doing well, and today, I'm just trying DIY co2 out. Hope it works.

The anacharis is unusally branching out though, it made about 1-3 branches per stem.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

I agree with what Phil says in his last post... I am using NO T8's for a 23" tall tank, which shouldn't work, and indeed, there are plants I can not grow this way, and others that hardly show any growth, but there are still many left to create an excellent aquascape.
Can't grow Glosso with 1.6W/gal? Well it doesn't break any speed records, and looks a little pale, but if you'd wanted to...


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## slyargent (Sep 8, 2003)

I really like your tank, wasserpest. I really like that banana plant like plant in the middle. Great job!

I'm growing some dwarf hairgrass(and they are growing!) which is supposed to be high maintennace, needs bright light. maybe because it recieves bright(direct) light in the morning and my tank isnt too deep. Anyway, I personally like bar foreground, or a few plants here and there, and let the midground plants cover the bottom of the background.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Thanks for the compliments slyargent. Banana-plant like... do you mean the tenellus in the foreground? I am still changing things around. Some plants, especially the Red Rubin and Tropica Swords have grown a lot of much bigger and healthier leaves in the last weeks, I think due to the KNO3 addition. Yes I like to see some uncovered gravel too. Still looking for some very-low-light plants that grow underneath the plants in the background. Experimenting with Ludwigia, and hoping to get some Java moss one day.
Now that most plants (Nymphaea too :evil reach the surface, and some of it is covered by floating Riccia and Ceradopteris, the light availability on the bottom is much worse than in the beginning.
So once in a while I think about adding another ballast to overdrive my bulbs... but not yet.


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## slyargent (Sep 8, 2003)

Why don't you try some low light crypts? I esp like the crypt wendetii "Tropica", nice leaf shape, and it stays bronze. You can put it under the tenellus, near thew wisteria. Or you can use that wisteria as a foreground plant, just prune it more?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

You are right, crypts are great plants for this. I have a "Lutea" in the front left corner, which has grown a lot since I took that last image. There are some wendtii's hidden underneath that Wisteria in the right corner, I need to do something there to get them out into view. I heard they don't appreciate getting moved around once they are established.
Wisteria as foreground plant? I will give that a try!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

After a long time looking at tiny little microorganisms (still not sure what they are... copepods? ciliates? paramecium?) clouding my water I finally got a Magnum H.O.T. filter. The Micron filter did do nothing. Went and bought a bag of diatomaceous earth and ... bingo! The clearest water since I filled the tank! Inexpensive, portable, and a emergency filter in case my primary filter cracks up... I love it.
Since some of my swords have grown to monsters -- the little red ruby in the left corner has taken over 25% of the 100 gal tank -- I am in the process of reducing the initial variety of plants. Makes it a little more relaxing to look at. Will post a new pic soon...
:mrgreen:


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## aquaverde (Apr 15, 2003)

I've got a tank full of crypts that I treat like my wife treats the living room furniture. I moved a C. spiralis with about 20 leaves and a root ball that I could see on the bottom of 4-1/2" of substrate and never lost a leaf. That stuff is just a weed. Also moved a stand of C. wendtii red twice in two weeks with the same result. These are well-established plants, some of the wendtii went into a different tank with different hardness parameters, different lighting, still no melt. What kills me is, I put different-looking plants in my crypt tank and they all end up sort of looking like one another in leaf shape and color tone after a while. Moved some wendtii from this tank to a little high light 10 and they all went from a deep dark green to solid bronze with no green.

These crypts are fun! But you just never know what they'll do. I'd like to try some of the wendtii Tropica. I'd like to try just about anything that starts "Cryptocoryne"  

I'll be quiet now :roll: 

James


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

aquaverde said:


> What kills me is, I put different-looking plants in my crypt tank and they all end up sort of looking like one another in leaf shape and color tone after a while. Moved some wendtii from this tank to a little high light 10 and they all went from a deep dark green to solid bronze with no green.


I know exactly what you mean! This happens to me with swords too... four very different swords look very similar in one tank, but two of the same species in different tanks appear totally different.


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## GulfCoastAquarian (Jul 30, 2002)

Wasserpest said:


> aquaverde said:
> 
> 
> > What kills me is, I put different-looking plants in my crypt tank and they all end up sort of looking like one another in leaf shape and color tone after a while. Moved some wendtii from this tank to a little high light 10 and they all went from a deep dark green to solid bronze with no green.
> ...


Me too! What I suspect is that, instead of these plants being different species, they are simply a different variety that grew in an environment that caused it to appear that way. When placed in the same tank - they all end up looking the same! I've seen this with Crypts and Swords a LOT.


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## 2la (Aug 18, 2002)

Nah, they're all different species. Remember that these are mainly terrestrial or bog plants, and in those forms they are easily differentiated by the flowers they produce. Certain aquatic conditions promote similar growth habits in different species (of the same genus), and so they appear similar when grown underwater in our tanks. C. wendtii and C. lutea are very difficult to distinguished after a while when placed in the same tanks.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Time for a new photo!










No revolutionary change, but slowly the variety of plants is getting reduced. Plant-wise the biggest change are those huge swords... it's amazing when you plant them, you never think of how large they become one day :roll: I will continue to remove plants... but it is soooo hard!

I am fairly happy with the left third... the huge red rubin in the corner, Ludwigia below, C. lutea in the front corner, and the melon sword in the foreground. The right side hasn't fully developed yet.

Cleaning the water with diatom earth once in a while, which both plants (pearling) and fishies (dancing) enjoy very much. Got rid of the little micro-orgs that were clouding the water.

Still all the same fishies, only change is that I added a male Ram to the two females. All three of them show colors that I have never seen before... especially the females seem to glow, almost.


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## m.lemay (Jul 28, 2002)

My rams began to show better colors too ,after about a week, once they got adjusted to thier new home. How are the rams doing in the tank with all the other inhabitants? 
If the rams start to get territorial , It's probably because they laid some eggs somewhere in the tank.

Marcel


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

I love it! That overgrown look suits the tank well and the natural gravel only enhances the feel.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Marcel said:


> How are the rams doing in the tank with all the other inhabitants?


They all get along great. Since adding the male ram the females fight much more, no suprise... he is quite a nice looking guy :shock: 
They haven't laid eggs, but they seem to be evaluating and cleaning surfaces, but then get distracted with each other.
Looks quite funny when one of the huge Pearl Gouramies gets "attacked" by one of the tiny females, they are like -- what's that thing doing on my side??
I think one possible problem with Rams could be if you keep them together with Tetras, Barbs and other quick and fast feeders they might get shorted on their food supply. Those 3 Yoyos are all over the place when it is feeding time, showing no respect, nibbling on everything and ticking off their tank mates. I need to make sure the Rams get something to eat before the Yoyos finish up everything. I am curious to see if the Rams will be able to fend off Yoyos when they have some eggs to protect.


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## aquaverde (Apr 15, 2003)

2la said:


> C. wendtii and C. lutea are very difficult to distinguished after a while when placed in the same tanks.


Precisely the two species I was observing.

James


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## aquaverde (Apr 15, 2003)

Wasser, I know how hard it is to remove plants, but I have to say the look in this tank has improved because of it. I think the swords and crypts look great with the hardscape. Great job!

James


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Both because the album I linked to disappeared, and because the last photo I posted was awful awful, I would like to attach the latest...


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## GDominy (Jul 30, 2002)

Thats really coming along! Nice work!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

It is definitely amazing to post and get an answer about 40 seconds later!
:mrgreen:


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## GDominy (Jul 30, 2002)

What can I say.... I have a desk job


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## aquaverde (Apr 15, 2003)

I wish I could get that dark green in my crypts like you have on the left side. One of the things I really like is the gravel color and rock work in this tank. It's getting harder to see because you're getting more and more growth, but I think it looks great.

James


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## Scorpion (Oct 10, 2003)

Holly cow! How long have you had this tank?


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## chinaboy1021 (May 30, 2003)

looks amazing.


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## GulfCoastAquarian (Jul 30, 2002)

Looking great! That tank must have an amazing presence in the room it is in.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Thanks for the comments... I have this tank now for almost 6 months (see page 1 of this journal :wink: )
The Crypt lutea in the left corner is really dark green... not sure if this is because of the variety, or the combination of light/substrate/fertilizer (or lack thereof).


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Time for a quick photo...

The tank is almost 1 year old, still low tech, low light, low CO2, but lots of enjoyment.


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## GDominy (Jul 30, 2002)

Thats looking great... I'm envious


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## wellbiz (Aug 6, 2003)

Nice color... :shock: :shock:


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## pixelcrayon (Mar 24, 2004)

that looks AMAZING... it looks like someone painted it!!


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

Awesome tank. I love the Red Melon, and the brilliant colors of all the other plants. Are you sure it's still low-tech?! :wink:


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Low Nitrates! To get those plants red. Maybe it is not really low tech, more like medium tech. I am trying to find a good compromise between low tech and high tech. Whatever that means.

In reality the tank looks a little more yellow/green, but my cameras white-point fixes that, gently.

Thanks for your kind comments!


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## wellbiz (Aug 6, 2003)

Wasser,

What kind of sword it the in the very front almost at the glass offset from center by a few inches...... 


Jason


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## pixelcrayon (Mar 24, 2004)

what levels do you keep your nitrates at?? potassium? phosphate? can you share your dosing schedule with us??


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

That's the Red Melon sword, E. barthii.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5406


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

pixelcrayon said:


> what levels do you keep your nitrates at?? potassium? phosphate? can you share your dosing schedule with us??


Definitely.

Every Sunday I do a ~30% water change. After fill-up, I dose

1/2 tsp NO3
3/4 tsp K
0.3 ppm PO4
1 ml Flourish
2 ml Flourish Iron

This brings NO3 to 5-7.5 ppm, and PO4 to 0.3-0.4 ppm.

At midweek, I test NO3 (which is zero, almost always), and PO4 (which sometimes is down, sometimes is still sufficient) and dose N and P accordingly.

I severely underdose this tank... but keep in mind that the light levels are not that great, and DIY CO2 doesn't get the levels to some "optimum".


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## GDominy (Jul 30, 2002)

If you upped your nitrate just a bit you might notice a dramatic imporvement in the size and shape of the leaves on your crypt. Now dont get me wrong, its still a stunning looking plant.. but with a bit more nitrate theleaves get nice and fat with a much more pronounced crinkle.


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## wellbiz (Aug 6, 2003)

Wasserpest said:


> That's the Red Melon sword, E. barthii.
> 
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5406


Ok, thanks... That goes on the wish list for my next purchase..... :lol: 

Jason


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## pixelcrayon (Mar 24, 2004)

thanks wasser. i currently have my nitates at 0-2.5pm. im really worried about over dosing. will i have a problem if i get my levels to 5-7.5ppm? i currently have pressurized CO2 (21ppm) and 4.6wpg. my plants are growing but i noticed today that my red ludwigia isnt as red as it use to be before i started dosing NO3. just wondering cause you stated that youre NO3 levels are "low?" i also thought PO4 levels should be .1ppm. 

sorry to cluter your album with questions i should be posting on the general boards, but your tank is awesome and id like to dublicate your success as much as possible in my tank.


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## pedietz (Dec 18, 2003)

Wasserpest, what do you do to the sword leaves when they hit the water line ??


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

GDominy said:


> If you upped your nitrate just a bit you might notice a dramatic imporvement in the size and shape of the leaves on your crypt. Now dont get me wrong, its still a stunning looking plant.. but with a bit more nitrate theleaves get nice and fat with a much more pronounced crinkle.


You are right, it would improve the crypt, and perhaps a few other plants as well. I am not sure if I want the additional growth in the swords and stemplants though. I throw out lots of plants every week already, more nutrients = more work.



Pixelcrayon said:


> thanks wasser. i currently have my nitates at 0-2.5pm. im really worried about over dosing. will i have a problem if i get my levels to 5-7.5ppm? i currently have pressurized CO2 (21ppm) and 4.6wpg. my plants are growing but i noticed today that my red ludwigia isnt as red as it use to be before i started dosing NO3. just wondering cause you stated that youre NO3 levels are "low?" i also thought PO4 levels should be .1ppm.


The usual recommendation here is NO3 10 ppm and PO4 1 ppm. Since my tank is low/medium light, I dose only to ~ 5/0.5 ppm. 0.1 ppm PO4 is really low, and might become the limiting factor for plant growth. For a high light tank like yours you should keep the levels up higher. If they bottom out for extended times plants will starve and algae could take over.



pedietz said:


> Wasserpest, what do you do to the sword leaves when they hit the water line ??


I enjoy them. Fishies enjoy them too, they feel more secure if the water surface is a little bit covered. When the plants get too big, I remove entire leaves starting with the oldest (from outside).


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Wasserpest-
Gorgeous tank!
I just stumbled on this thread, but will start to follow it closely, because I just set up the same size tank (100g) about a month ago, going with the same low/ med. tech principles. My setup differs in that I do not have undergravel heating, I'm using two hob filters, and I have a little more light (260 watts c.f.'s). 
Can I ask what exactly your set-up is for your DIY co2 system? I'm currently running 2 1-gal. jugs, one with a diffusion bell about the size of a coffee cup, and one out of a powerhead. But I've got a powered reactor on order, which will enable me to get rid of one of the other methods. 
I also use 2 Emperor hob filters, which I know aren't great for a co2, so I'm going to be ordering a nice canister filter shortly.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Forget the undergravel heater, doesn't make a difference. I am not using it 8 months of the year anyway.

I am using two 3 liter soda bottles, connected to an inline reactor, which is connected to one of my canisters. For trial purposes, I have a third bottle connected to a powerhead reactor, but it is just too hard to hide in the tank, so I am going to loose it.

With 260W light and good reflectors, I would suggest to get pressurized CO2.


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

I'm planning on pressurized co2 in the future, but I want to invest in a good canister filter (Eheim) first. I do have a powered reactor on its way, in the meantime. 
It seems like you're getting excellent results the low tech way. Keep it up!


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## Scorpion (Oct 10, 2003)

Show off!
I like it.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Tank under the moonlit sky... not pretty, but interesting :icon_bigg 










Camera set to 15sec, lens wide open, ASA400. Streetlights remain visible as a reflection in the center, and a reflection of the closed shutters. They would not close further, and to me, the room was absolutely dark. The LCD display of the camera seemed like a high wattage beam in the darkness.


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## randomrambler (Jun 24, 2004)

:icon_eek: wow... looks like something out of a fairytale! i love it!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Rescaping can be fun... not...

The barthii just grew and grew and grew and the day came when it started looking not-right, pressed against the glass. Those suckers have an enormous root ball size.

Carefully pulled out roots one-by-one, but couldn't avoid to pull some heater cables out as well, and of course a big loamy mess in the water column.










Planted the barthii in the background, stuffed heater cables back into the gravel, whipped out the diatom filter, and a few hours later everything looked much better than before.

Note my 4 Festivums... oh well, that is another thread, uh, story.


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## Brennor (Mar 8, 2004)

WOW, I dont know how I missed this thread, that is a truely great tank.

I love the night shot too, looks very creapy


Dave


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Thanks Brennor... I am contemplating if I should re-attach all the old pics again, some were pretty interesting. But then, this journal is pretty much done.


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## aquanut415 (Jan 21, 2006)

hey wasserpest, how do you like the heater cables? are you able to maintain the water in the tank at the temp you want without using any other additional heating devices?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

One day they stopped working, and when I rescaped the tank, they ended up where they should have been all along... the trashcan.

While they were working, they did a good job heating the tank evenly. They burned up to 300 Watts iirc, so basically like a regular 300W heater, spaced out through the substrate. I had them connected to a temperature controller and a dimmer, which allowed me to dial down the wattage. There is a little lag in heating the tank water, could be an issue if you try to counter cold water water changes.

I wouldn't use them in a planted tank again...


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## aquanut415 (Jan 21, 2006)

bummer... ive been looking into getting some cause i sorta dislike the inline heaters (i worry about leaks, and when the filter clogs they work poorly). also i like the idea of having the heater conveniently snugged underneath the substrate. thanks!


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## ikuzo (Jul 11, 2006)

umm the moonlights. looks like aliens searchlight. interesting and different indeed. oh and wow what a huge root system.


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