# A Twist on Mr. Aqua 12 Long



## Down_Shift (Sep 20, 2008)

Saw the thread and thought awesome another 12g. I really want one. They look great. Then I saw you filtration and was surprised! Thumbs up for taking it another level. Can't wait to see how you build it.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Tiny update. All the parts are now ordered except the baffles for the sump (will try and do that today). Pump will be in tomorrow. Tank and filter media will be here Friday. Everything else should be in next week. I'm hoping to start on the stand and filter this weekend and will post updates.

Some pictures:

LED. Built very well. Not sold yet on LED lighting but I'm giving it a try.

















My 10 gallon sump. Thanks to Petco's $1/gallon sale it was only $10 instead of $12. What a deal!


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

That's going to be a nicely filtered tank with such a big filter area (10 gallon) to cram full of differnt medias!


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Some minor updates..

I have the Eco Complete cycling in an extra 10 gallon tank I have. I put in some filter media from another tank so I'm hoping the bacteria will grow fast.

Got the cut glass for the sump baffles as well as the external overflow box. 

The tank and filtration media comes in tonight! YEAH!

Installed the baffles and filtration holders in the sump.









I also picked up all (or at least most) of the PVC I'll need for the project.









I also picked up all the wood for the stand. I'm hoping to get most of the build done this weekend (pics to come).

I found some zebra rock at the lfs that I think I may use. I also have some gray slate I may try and use too. I'm still not sure what I'm going to do for a hardscape.

The hard part is going to be waiting for the glass cutting hole saw. I cheapened out and bought one from China (saved $10). Unfortunately it'll probably be another week or two before it comes in. I guess that just means more time to plan out the hardscape.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Medium size update (I guess)...

The tank came in. Marine Depot did a great job packing it up.









I also built the stand. I used mostly 3/4 furniture grade wood. I did cheat a bit and used 2x3's as the base and tank support. The tank fits between two windows down to a 1/16th of an inch. It's like the tank was built exactly for this spot.



























Lastly, I set up the sump and it's almost done cycling thanks to some media from my 190 gallon.









In case you're wondering, the gravel is not staying in the sump. It's just in there to help build additional bacterial. Basically 99% of the filtration is being cycled and should be done by the time the tank is ready (I'm really hoping next week but probably the week after).

Now I just have to decide whether to paint or stain the stand and wait for the hole saw to come in. I think it's in customs right now so who knows how long it will take 


Any recommendations on plants for the tank? I'm planning on doing primarily shrimp. I might try adding in some neons and maybe an otto or two. Any suggestions?


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## fishlip (Jan 2, 2014)

This is going to be a crazy setup!


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

fishlip said:


> This is going to be a crazy setup!


I hope so! I always go over the top and my wife is telling me I'm outdoing myself by putting a sump on a 12 gallon. It's just more fun


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Lots of progress.

I got the stand stained. Now I need to apply a few coats of polyurethane and I'll post some pictures.

CO2 tank and regulator is assembled (pictures to come).

I drilled the back of the tank with 2 drains and 2 returns. I also siliconed the overflow box to the back of the tank.

Back of tank drilled (4 holes):










Drains drilled:










Nice clean holes:










Overflow box siliconed and taped:










Back side of the tank:










Another view:










My silicone job is one of the best I've done but still very amateurish. I don't think I'd build my own tank but for an external overflow that will never be seen I'm very happy.

I will be installing a coast-to-coast overflow using 1/4" black acrylic. The water will overflow the acrylic and drain through the 2 rear holes. It will enter the external overflow and drain out of 1 primary and 1 emergency drain. Water will drain to the sump and return through the two overflows at eat end of the tank. With the 320gph pump I have I should have plenty of circulation.


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## parrottbay (May 14, 2012)

That is insane but I definitely dig it! Very awesome, who isn't subscribed? I am....


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## helgi125 (Jan 16, 2014)

I am literally hovering over the "order" button on a 12g long...

That sump is sick and superb glass work, cant wait to see how this one turns out.

Subbed.


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## cfosgate (Jan 17, 2014)

WOW! What a setup. I never thought about having a sump on a tank that small. You've opened my eyes.


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## Mike00726 (May 23, 2011)

Sick. Can't wait to see it up and running.


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## NanoDave (Feb 25, 2013)

Great job. Really took the 12 Long to the next level. You should join the 12 long club (check my signature for the link)


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## AnotherHobby (Mar 5, 2012)

This is fascinating, and it looks like you are off to one hell of a start! I'll be following for sure.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks for the feedback. I finished staining the stand tonight. I'm planning on plumbing it tomorrow night and adding water. If all works out I'll try and add fish on Tuesday as the filter media in the sump is already cycled thanks to fishless cycling.

Any recommendations on shrimp-friendly fish? I was thinking like 20x neons, 3x corries, and 1-2x ottos. I know they'll eat fry and eggs but I'm planning on trying to do some selective mating and hatching in a breeder. I'd definitely appreciate feedback as I'm a complete noob on shrimp.


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## AnotherHobby (Mar 5, 2012)

I have neons, panda corys, and CPDs. I love them all. The cory's live at the bottom, the neons a little above them, and the CPDs a little above them. I don't have any otto's, but I think they'd fit in well.

One things I'd suggest is to swap out a few neons for corys. They like to be in bigger numbers, and I'd recommend at least 6. Neons seem to be the same, preferring at least 6 total. I had a few corys die and their behavior changes when they get below those numbers. They hide more and play less, and are clearly less happy. Especially if they are that out numbered. You will enjoy them more (and they will be happier) if you have a few more of them. I can't speak to the ottos since I don't have them.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

AnotherHobby said:


> I have neons, panda corys, and CPDs. I love them all. The cory's live at the bottom, the neons a little above them, and the CPDs a little above them. I don't have any otto's, but I think they'd fit in well.
> 
> One things I'd suggest is to swap out a few neons for corys. They like to be in bigger numbers, and I'd recommend at least 6. Neons seem to be the same, preferring at least 6 total. I had a few corys die and their behavior changes when they get below those numbers. They hide more and play less, and are clearly less happy. Especially if they are that out numbered. You will enjoy them more (and they will be happier) if you have a few more of them. I can't speak to the ottos since I don't have them.


Do you have any shrimp with them? Any issues? Do any fry make it?


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## NanoDave (Feb 25, 2013)

Otto's will actually school and hang out together if kept in groups. Though I don't think it's necessary I feel it could help to do more. I would personally do 6 or so corys like Another Hobby suggested. 5 or so ottos and 15 or so neons/cardinal tetra w/e you prefer. You won't really need more than 15 tetras in the 12 long as it's only 9" height and with substrate makes it like 6-7" so 15 cardinals will look great and not be too crowded. As for ottos, personally they are the best clean up crew and you'll be thanking them with higher numbers as your tank will look a lot nicer with that much less algae.


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## NanoDave (Feb 25, 2013)

I have RCS in my 12 long and the I haven't seen the cardinals eat any yet but then again I've only had the shrimp for a few weeks and the first batch just dropped. I do have a very thick carpet of glosso and I can see newborns hiding under the carpet on the edges of the tank so I think that helps a lot. I would imagine some will def get eaten though. I have around 30 RCS and a half dozen are berried so I don't doubt I'll have hundreds in a few months.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

NanoDave said:


> Otto's will actually school and hang out together if kept in groups. Though I don't think it's necessary I feel it could help to do more. I would personally do 6 or so corys like Another Hobby suggested. 5 or so ottos and 15 or so neons/cardinal tetra w/e you prefer. You won't really need more than 15 tetras in the 12 long as it's only 9" height and with substrate makes it like 6-7" so 15 cardinals will look great and not be too crowded. As for ottos, personally they are the best clean up crew and you'll be thanking them with higher numbers as your tank will look a lot nicer with that much less algae.


I didn't know that ottos will schoool. I have 11 ottos in my 190 and I've never seen them school. I know different fish act differently. I usually go with neons over cardinals just for the price. I can get neons for $1 any day but cardinals are hard to find and if you do find them they are $5 each. I definitely like cardinals better but can't justify the money for the minor differences.


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## AnotherHobby (Mar 5, 2012)

rdmustang1 said:


> Do you have any shrimp with them? Any issues? Do any fry make it?


I keep RCS and Amanos in there. I've never seen any of my fish even nip at a shrimp, but if a fry will fit in a fish's mouth, and it's swimming out in the open, consider it a snack. I'm can guarantee some fry have been eaten.


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## NanoDave (Feb 25, 2013)

$5 a cardinal! A LFS by me has them at $2.5 and neons at $1.5. If you buy 8 you get 2 free so I never blink an eye at getting cardinals. Sorry to hear there so expensive by you. As for ottos schooling it really depends on the tank. I've noticed in my very heavily planted tanks they often will group on one plant or in a diamond shape formation on the glass sometimes. They don't school in one of my larger tanks thats not planted as much so maybe that has something to do with it. I would think it would be the other way around and they would school with less cover, who knows.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

NanoDave said:


> $5 a cardinal! A LFS by me has them at $2.5 and neons at $1.5. If you buy 8 you get 2 free so I never blink an eye at getting cardinals. Sorry to hear there so expensive by you. As for ottos schooling it really depends on the tank. I've noticed in my very heavily planted tanks they often will group on one plant or in a diamond shape formation on the glass sometimes. They don't school in one of my larger tanks thats not planted as much so maybe that has something to do with it. I would think it would be the other way around and they would school with less cover, who knows.


Yea, some fish prices are way out of wack lately. I've been searching for a large school of panda corries but everyone wants $12 and up. I used to get them for $2.99. I found one for $5 and jumped on it but now I feel bad because he's all by himself. There are ~15 other corries in the tank but no other pandas. He schools a little with the melini corries but is by himself more often than the other corries.


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## Down_Shift (Sep 20, 2008)

I have 7 oto and they school in my 18g. They love to hang out as a group on the hard scape. I usually keep count this way. 

3 dwarf cories as well they swim as a school very enjoyable to watch. 

When will this tank be up? Can't wait to see the complete set up


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Ok, tank is up and running. It's cycled and ready to go.

Some pics:

Tank and stand. Hardscape hasn't been decided yet. Plants are in bad shape and need some TLC. The back is a coast-to-coast external, micro overflow made using a black piece of acrylic. You can also see a return on each end.










Filtration and CO2:










External overflow:










All plumbing in the back:


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## Ach1Ll3sH33L (Mar 1, 2012)

looks good, not sure i would leave the stand pipes so high up, very little room for water fluctuation if the drain gets slightly blocked.


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## gnauhandy (May 6, 2009)

Hey can you post a picture of the water intake into the overflow box? Great set up btw. Does the cholla wood promote shrimp breeding and how are you getting them to sink? 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

gnauhandy said:


> Hey can you post a picture of the water intake into the overflow box? Great set up btw. Does the cholla wood promote shrimp breeding and how are you getting them to sink?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


The water overflows the black acrylic which is 1/8" shorter than the tank. It then enters the overflow box via 2 holes in the back of the tank. I used the 30mm drill bit that I used for the returns and the drains.

You can see the holes in the pic here:









If I had to do it over I would put the holes lower. I drilled higher up because the clamps I used to hold the template in place for the drill wouldn't go any lower. With the holes being that high up it will gurgle a bit if the water level in the overflow isn't towards the top.

I just put the cholla wood in the tank. Two pieces sank after one day. Two more sank after another day. One more is still floating. If it doesn't sink by tomorrow I'll weigh it down with a rock. I'm told shrimp like to eat it and fry like to hide inside. There is no fauna in the tank yet. I'm hoping to add some tomorrow.


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## dasob85 (Feb 4, 2012)

very nice. I always wanted to something like this with my 12g. I even bought a 20H and glass to make baffles but in the end didn't. spent the effort on a bigger tank with bigger sump instead. Love to see other people as crazy as myself succeed


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

dasob85 said:


> very nice. I always wanted to something like this with my 12g. I even bought a 20H and glass to make baffles but in the end didn't. spent the effort on a bigger tank with bigger sump instead. Love to see other people as crazy as myself succeed


Still too early to claim success 

Actually I just added some livestock.

15x Neon Tetras
5x Ottos
10x Ghost Shrimp

Gonna see how it goes for a while and then I may add some RCS and more..


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## shambhalove. (Jan 22, 2013)

Man this is awesome. I really want to get into the sump side of this hobby but i was worried about the diy stuff on a large scale. Now that i see this ill have to practice on some small tanks first!!


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

So, my neons didn't seem to be crazy about the new tank. They stayed in a very tight group at the bottom of the tank.

Today I woke up and they seem much more comfortable in the tank! They are staying in 2-3 groups but they are swimming around and are much more spaced out than before.

Also, my ottos are definitely schooling (as you guys said). I never knew they were a schooling fish but all 5 are almost always very close together. It's actually pretty cool. They definitely aren't schooling in my 190 tho 

Updates on livestock:

15x Neons
5x Ottos
5x Nerite Snails
24x Ghost Shrimp

On the way:
6x Sterbai Cories
10x Fire Red Shrimp


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Updated pic:










Video of fish/shrimp/snails:
http://youtu.be/8mbXF-TBskk


I'm still totally undecided on hardscape. I can't decide between dead coral (what's in there now), driftwood or rock. Nothing is popping out at me like it normally does.

Anyways.. Shrimp love the flame moss. The CRS are almost always under it. The fire reds come and go. I know ghost shrimp are big hits with shrimp people but I love them. They have so much personality.


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## gnauhandy (May 6, 2009)

Hey, what are your water parameters? I'd think that CRS are the most sensitive fauna you have in there. Why not put both driftwood on one side and put rocks on the other? 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

gnauhandy said:


> Hey, what are your water parameters? I'd think that CRS are the most sensitive fauna you have in there. Why not put both driftwood on one side and put rocks on the other?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Currently parameters are at:

pH: 7.4
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 0
Nitrates: 10
KH: 12
GH: 3

I know KH is way too high for the CRS but they came from a breeder who runs at 7-8. They have been in a couple weeks and are doing ok. I have a RO/DI filter on the way that I'll probably use for all new water.


Anyone ever have nerite snails crawl out of the tank? I have one that crawls out every night and falls 3 feet to the floor. He sits there until morning when I find him and put him back. He's done it about 5 or 6 times and seems to be ok. It's annoying and I'm afraid he'll die if I'm not here to put him back in the water.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

I finally made a decision on hardscape. I can always change it later on. I went with some wood and rock that I had laying around. 










What do you think?


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Some action shots:

Fire red hanging out on a java fern:










CRS on some rotala that's still in shock:










Fire red doesn't mind the neons:










Ghost shrimp giving the panda cory a back rub:










These shrimp don't care about gravity:










A few of the CRS like to hang out on top of the return:


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

So I got the CGA 320 stem from ua hua. I couldn't get it to stop leaking no matter how tight I made it so I used tape on the threads. How bad is that? I was very careful to skip the first thread and keep any tape away from the edge.

Anyway, I got it hooked up to a paintball tank to test the regulator. It seems to hold the pressure.










I still don't have the needle valve that probably won't work so I can't test that. I'm going to try and wire up the solenoid tonight and start on the post body.

Any other tests I should perform?


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

I found out the hard way that ghost shrimp become killers when they get larger. I saw multiple ghost shrimp grabbing fish, rolling them over, hold them down and try to eat them. I couldn't believe my eyes but I found some others complaining of the same thing.

These were very large ghost shrimp but they were vicious. I took out all the ghost shrimp and put them in my 190. I hope they didn't eat my RCS or CRS. I have so many hiding places in there now that I can't count my shrimp any more. Usually only 4-5 are out at a time.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Well, the day after I removed the ghost shrimp all my other shrimp decided they don't want to hide any more. They don't mind the fish but apparently didn't like the ghost shrimp. I'm very surprised but happy.

Also, I got in a shipment of 20+ PFR that I bought on eBay. They were advertised as a mixture of sizes but red in color. I received 12 absolutely clear newly born babies. Seller isn't being responsive and I guess this is a lesson not to buy shrimp on eBay.


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## GBRguy (Oct 1, 2013)

That sucks about the shrimp. hopefully they color up more as they grow


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## AGUILAR3 (Jun 22, 2013)

rdmustang1 said:


> Also, I got in a shipment of 20+ PFR that I bought on eBay. They were advertised as a mixture of sizes but red in color. I received 12 absolutely clear newly born babies. Seller isn't being responsive and I guess this is a lesson not to buy shrimp on eBay.


File a paypal complaint. I would.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

AGUILAR3 said:


> File a paypal complaint. I would.


It's in process. The only thing he had to say was that I didn't send a picture within an hour of receiving the shrimp. I seriously could not see shrimp in the bag and thought it was an empty bag. It wasn't until I dumped them into a specimen container and turned on a flashlight that I could see them. I really should have taken a picture.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

AGUILAR3 said:


> File a paypal complaint. I would.


I struck a deal with the seller. He refunded me $30 so I ended up basically paying $18 for 12 baby shrimp. I didn't want to send them back because it would be a pain to pack them up and they are so small I'm guessing some would die. 

I'm setting up a 2 gallon I have to raise them as I'm afraid my other shrimp or fish may eat them. Hopefully it will cycle fast thanks to a sponge filter I pulled out of my 190.


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## AGUILAR3 (Jun 22, 2013)

I doubt he would want you to ship them back. He probably has hundreds and hundreds. Did you try buying from one of our members first?


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## sevenportsOFFICE (Aug 5, 2013)

Very nice job on the overflow for a 12 gallon long. So the black acrylic background acts as a surface skimmer? Any issues with shrimp going over yet ? Or is it even wide enough?


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

AGUILAR3 said:


> I doubt he would want you to ship them back. He probably has hundreds and hundreds. Did you try buying from one of our members first?


I haven't seen PFR shrimp sold here and most of the prices for other shrimp on here are much higher than available elsewhere. I did buy some from shrimpusadotcom on aquabid and his came in nice. I was trying to get some more but apparently went the wrong way.




SevenportsJohn said:


> Very nice job on the overflow for a 12 gallon long. So the black acrylic background acts as a surface skimmer? Any issues with shrimp going over yet ? Or is it even wide enough?


Yes, I had a few shrimp end up in the external overflow and in the sump so I put some black foam filter between the acrylic and the glass. It helps quite a bit. I'd like to replace it with something like a stainless mesh but not sure how.


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## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

Whoa @ tank and work <speechless with awe).

v3


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

OVT said:


> Whoa @ tank and work <speechless with awe).
> 
> v3


Thanks!

I put my new regulator on the paintball tank. I had to use the 6w solenoid since I don't have the right power adapter for my new 0.5w solenoid. The 6w is running hot but working.


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## pianofish (Jan 31, 2010)

Good night man, that is quite the regulator for a paint ball tank lol. I completely agree with your methodology though. Its better to save up and get the best of what you want later, than to cheap out and buy meh stuff now. Tank looks incredible my friend. And I applaud you on the plumbing job. My only question is why didn't you put a small like .5" internal box to get some skimming for the tank? Skimming is one of the major benefits of having an overflow setup in my opinion. What size plumbing did you end up using on the pipes?
Great job man,
Joshua


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

pianofish said:


> Good night man, that is quite the regulator for a paint ball tank lol. I completely agree with your methodology though. Its better to save up and get the best of what you want later, than to cheap out and buy meh stuff now. Tank looks incredible my friend. And I applaud you on the plumbing job. My only question is why didn't you put a small like .5" internal box to get some skimming for the tank? Skimming is one of the major benefits of having an overflow setup in my opinion. What size plumbing did you end up using on the pipes?
> Great job man,
> Joshua


I have a coast-to-coast overflow in the form of a 1/4" acrylic sheet. It skims water from the entire back of the tank very well. The reason I went with the C2C was because I wanted the back of the tank black and I couldn't figure a way to do so with a smaller overflow box. I actually box a mini overflow box but ended up selling it. I couldn't paint the back of the tank because I had to silicone the external overflow to the tank and everything I read said not to silicone over paint. I didn't want the overflow, plumbing, or the holes in the back showing. I think the C2C is overkill but it looks very nice (imo) and works great. The only thing I'd change is making the acrylic sheet a little smaller. The water level is very high in the tank and I have to shut the pump off to put my hand in the water to fix anything. I'm toying with the idea of removing the sheet and cutting it down but that would be a very large ordeal. I can keep the bacteria in the filter alive easily but would have to move the fish and shrimp somewhere. The new silicone would have to cure for 1-2 days before adding anything back in.

Plumbing is 1/2". I wanted to go as small as possible with a good amount of slack. I did use 3/4" true union ball valves and 3/4" unions because they are rated for sch 80 which means the ID is much smaller. The ball valve is about 1/2 closed so the system can handle a lot more than is going down. Even if the pipe was to become partially clogged I'm comfortable with the pipe sizes.


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## kman (Dec 11, 2013)

Fascinating. So if I'm understanding correctly, after you drilled the holes in the back of the tank, you simply put in a 1/4" sheet of black acrylic that runs the full width of the back of the tank? (is that what you mean by "coast to coast" or is that some sort of brand name?) Then water overflows over the top of it into a ~1/4" space between the acrylic and the back glass panel, and from there into the overflow box that you custom siliconed in place? (and then down to the sump, of course)


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

kman said:


> Fascinating. So if I'm understanding correctly, after you drilled the holes in the back of the tank, you simply put in a 1/4" sheet of black acrylic that runs the full width of the back of the tank? (is that what you mean by "coast to coast" or is that some sort of brand name?) Then water overflows over the top of it into a ~1/4" space between the acrylic and the back glass panel, and from there into the overflow box that you custom siliconed in place? (and then down to the sump, of course)


Yes, that's right. Coast to coast is a method, not a brand. It allows for the skimming of water across the entire tank. The space behind the acrylic is closer to 1/2". It gives me good filtration and looks great too.


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## kman (Dec 11, 2013)

rdmustang1 said:


> Yes, that's right. Coast to coast is a method, not a brand. It allows for the skimming of water across the entire tank. The space behind the acrylic is closer to 1/2". It gives me good filtration and looks great too.


It does indeed. 

So you give up approx 3/4" of tank depth. Is there water intake other than whatever pours over the top of the backplate? And I guess the height of the backplate determines the water level in the tank. If it goes to low to pour over the top, how does water get into the outflows down to the sump?

I need to do some searching on this method, it looks slick.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

kman said:


> It does indeed.
> 
> So you give up approx 3/4" of tank depth. Is there water intake other than whatever pours over the top of the backplate? And I guess the height of the backplate determines the water level in the tank. If it goes to low to pour over the top, how does water get into the outflows down to the sump?
> 
> I need to do some searching on this method, it looks slick.


Yes, there is a sacrifice in space but even in this small of a tank it's not really noticeable. The height of the acrylic determines the constant height of water level. If no water is pumped in then no water pumps out once the water level lowers to the height of the acrylic. To me, this is another benefit. The sump allows for evaporation yet the display tank still looks pristine. The downside is that if enough water evaporates the pump will run dry and may burn up and eventually the bacteria bed will die. Of course this is true with any filter. I do water changes every week. In a week about 2 gallons of water evaporates. My setup will allow for about 4 gallons of evaporation before the pump starts drawing in air. It could probably go another gallon before failing to return water. That means that I can go 2.5 weeks between water changes if I want.



Another update. Some new pics:

Tank pic:










My nerites love coming out of the water. A few times I've seen them on the outside of the glass and a handful of times I've found them on the floor. Here is one on the driftwood outside the tank:


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

The tank came out just like I wanted; however, the water level being that high was nothing but problems. Fish liked to jump out. Snails climbed out and fish and shrimp loved to go into the overflow box and sometimes into the sump. I couldn't put foam over the overflow because it would cause the water to overflow the sides of the aquarium. Any time plants grew to the surface and made contact with the legs of the lights the water would flow out onto the floor.

So..... I took the tank apart and cut the overflow panel down about 1/2". I moved the fish into the return section of the sump and the shrimp into the pre-filter section of the sump. I drained the aquarium, took out the substrate and pulled out the acrylic sheet.

Here's a picture without the overflow.










Then I cut it and re-silicone'd the acrylic. I also cut and stuck Poret foam behind the overflow panel to act as a pre-filter. Now the water level is down about 1/2" from the top of the tank. No jumping fish. Nobody in the sump. Everything seems to be working much nicer (knock on wood).

Here is a pic after being put back together. I mostly threw everything back in place because this project took much longer than I was hoping.










I'm also in the process of redoing the doors. The wood on the previous doors was too ugly and the wife wasn't happy.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

I forgot to mention. I was pleasantly surprised when I took all the fauna out of the tank. While the tank was up I could only find maybe 5-6 CRS and 8-10 RCS in the tank. They are so good at hiding.

When I took everything out of the tank I found maybe 10 CRS and 15 RCS. I was careful to keep all rocks and wood in water because I know shrimp like to hide. Shrimp apparently really like the driftwood because I kept finding shrimp in the bucket that had the drift wood soaking. In the end I had a total of 24 CRS and 20 RCS. Originally I put 25 CRS and 33 RCS in. I'm guessing the aggressive ghost shrimp I had in there before ate some of the smaller RCS. I can't imagine it was the water since I only lost 1 CRS.

I also bought 40 more RCS from barakainus on here (super good pricing). He sent mostly juveniles and I might have to cull out some of them but it looks like a lot of them will be nicely colored.


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## jcgilmore2 (Jul 10, 2013)

Nice tank, great build. Always wanted a 12g long theyre just always sold out when I decide Im gonna go for it. Do you not lose a bunch of co2 gas through aeration in the sump? Ive had people I know run into issues with that. I may have missed it you've already discussed it.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

jcgilmore2 said:


> Nice tank, great build. Always wanted a 12g long theyre just always sold out when I decide Im gonna go for it. Do you not lose a bunch of co2 gas through aeration in the sump? Ive had people I know run into issues with that. I may have missed it you've already discussed it.


There is almost 0 surface agitation in the sump. In fact there is usually a skim on the surface of the water. I think most of the CO2 loss is from the external overflow. I'm not sure how to reduce any loss.


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## Higher Thinking (Mar 16, 2011)

What if you used stainless mesh on the backside of the tank, inside the overflow box? You could use super glue to stick the mesh on the overflow holes. That way you don't have to worry about sponges getting clogged and overflowing your system.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Higher Thinking said:


> What if you used stainless mesh on the backside of the tank, inside the overflow box? You could use super glue to stick the mesh on the overflow holes. That way you don't have to worry about sponges getting clogged and overflowing your system.


I actually bought mesh for that purpose but couldn't think of a safe way to attach it. Would super glue hold it in place? Is it fish safe?

I'm not too concerned with it clogging. 3 feet of overflow at a low flow rate means very little water is going over the edge at any one point. My main concern is that with the foam the skimming has been drastically reduced. The water is building over the foam and it's draining fine but no skimming. It's great for shrimp as they actually like to sit on the foam as the water flows over them but I'm afraid I'll get surface scum and eventually reduced O2.


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## lamiskool (Jul 1, 2011)

super glue is fish safe, I use it all the time to attach moss to my dw or rocks


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## Zoidborg (Jan 29, 2014)

I love your tank! Ill be following your progress.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

The neons and rummy nose just wouldn't stop jumping out of the tank so I thought I'd trying something different. I moved the remaining neons and rummies to the 190 and put in 12x CPD. I'll get some pics uploaded soon (hopefully). So far I'm happy. They are much smaller so I'll eventually put another dozen or two in.

I did have a couple shrimp death yesterday. Water looks great except GH is back down to 0. I did my weekly water change and am adding some GH booster tonight to help them out. I'm hoping that's it.


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## rdmustang1 (Oct 20, 2013)

Not much of an update. I moved a couple plants around. Took some out. Added more.

Shrimp seem to be happy.


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## nomad1721 (Jan 3, 2011)

Your build is inspiring. Absolutely amazing in every way! Looking forward to seeing the updates with the CPD's as I'm planning on stocking my new 9g with them.


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## H2Ogal (Apr 27, 2010)

rdmustang1 said:


> Anyone ever have nerite snails crawl out of the tank? I have one that crawls out every night and falls 3 feet to the floor. He sits there until morning when I find him and put him back. He's done it about 5 or 6 times and seems to be ok. It's annoying and I'm afraid he'll die if I'm not here to put him back in the water.


In the wild some species of nerites migrate between water sources — going freshwater to brackish, I think — for mating, etc. Sounds like your guy has the roaming gene. 



rdmustang1 said:


> I found out the hard way that ghost shrimp become killers when they get larger. I saw multiple ghost shrimp grabbing fish, rolling them over, hold them down and try to eat them. I couldn't believe my eyes but I found some others complaining of the same thing.
> 
> These were very large ghost shrimp but they were vicious. I took out all the ghost shrimp and put them in my 190. I hope they didn't eat my RCS or CRS. I have so many hiding places in there now that I can't count my shrimp any more. Usually only 4-5 are out at a time.


Various types of shrimp get sold as ghosts, and not all are peaceful. The ones to avoid are young Macrobrachium. It seems the clue to look for is large claws, often with red on them.


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