# Is Excel the miracle cure for BBA?



## Stone454 (Jun 1, 2013)

I had a BBA nightmare, I had to do the one-two punch to get rid of it, that was over a month ago all I have been doing differently is feeding my fish sparingly and dosing excel daily and it has not shown it's ugly face in my tank.


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## MiSo (Oct 26, 2005)

lots of ppl have success with overdosing excel. it works if your plants are not sensitive to excel. my tank full of fissens wouldn't like it so much.


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## jfynyson (Apr 15, 2013)

The one two punch (H2O2 & Excel) does work for BBA but you're treating the symptom not the root cause. You'll see where many do this and it comes back or you could keep treating it w/ Excel after water changes and it keeps it at bay. I'm far too busy these days to not add the Excel personally. I have not even had to simply scrape my glass in over 2 months (only need weekly water changes) in a high light high tech take. Not sure what your ferts dosing vs light vs CO2 consistency was in the past but most will conclude root cause of BBA is related directly to inconsistent CO2 delivery.


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## acitydweller (Dec 28, 2011)

BBA is often a combination of spores introduced to the tank and it benefiting from a surplus of nutrients in the water column, often exacerbated in higher flow areas. I just attempted to dose some excel on a plant with BBA as a second test. i attempted this a month ago and showed no sign of the BBA retreating. Looking to use higher % glut next.

The only way i have managed to scare the bajeebis out of BBA is a 1 second bleach dip and obviously that is not possible in tank and high destructive for plants.


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## jfynyson (Apr 15, 2013)

acitydweller said:


> BBA is often a combination of spores introduced to the tank and it benefiting from a surplus of nutrients in the water column, often exacerbated in higher flow areas. I just attempted to dose some excel on a plant with BBA as a second test. i attempted this a month ago and showed no sign of the BBA retreating. Looking to use higher % glut next.
> 
> The only way i have managed to scare the bajeebis out of BBA is a 1 second bleach dip and obviously that is not possible in tank and high destructive for plants.


Note that I have access to 50% glut and have found that dilutions of 5% and even 3% spot treatments for GSA & green beard /fuzz worked but it also burnt anubias (I didn't have any BBA during this test). It did kill off the algae though...but at the cost of the leaf. 

I've found H2O2 dips for 3-5min (fully submerged in a bowl of 3% H2O2) or even using a syringe on the leaf of anubias when plant is above the water level during a water change killed BBA. I also observed H2O2 spot treatments under water just before a water change to kill BBA off anubias. After about 15-30sec you'll see / hear fizzing action (oxidizing the algae & bacteria). After about 3 days the BBA would change color (typically turns white / grey using H2O2) then it dies off. You need zero current if spot treating under water though (of course) and allow a 15min dwell (IME).


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

jfynyson said:


> The one two punch (H2O2 & Excel) does work for BBA but you're treating the symptom not the root cause. You'll see where many do this and it comes back or you could keep treating it w/ Excel after water changes and it keeps it at bay. I'm far too busy these days to not add the Excel personally. I have not even had to simply scrape my glass in over 2 months (only need weekly water changes) in a high light high tech take. Not sure what your ferts dosing vs light vs CO2 consistency was in the past but most will conclude root cause of BBA is related directly to inconsistent CO2 delivery.


+one.:thumbsup:


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## jfynyson (Apr 15, 2013)

Sorry forgot to mention...I've not observed the 3% H2O2 to damage any plants or roots but I read that Excel is hard on vals and Egeria densa and someone reported losing Riccia, Najas and Hemianthus glomeratus (aka Hemianthus Micranthemoides (erroneous), Micranthemum glomeratum, Baby tears) using H2O2 while they were just fine with Excel.


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## Aqualady (Jan 14, 2013)

jfynyson said:


> Note that I have access to 50% glut and have found that dilutions of 5% and even 3% spot treatments for GSA & green beard /fuzz worked but it also burnt anubias (I didn't have any BBA during this test). It did kill off the algae though...but at the cost of the leaf.
> 
> I've found H2O2 dips for 3-5min (fully submerged in a bowl of 3% H2O2) or even using a syringe on the leaf of anubias when plant is above the water level during a water change killed BBA. I also observed H2O2 spot treatments under water just before a water change to kill BBA off anubias. After about 15-30sec you'll see / hear fizzing action (oxidizing the algae & bacteria). After about 3 days the BBA would change color (typically turns white / grey using H2O2) then it dies off. You need zero current if spot treating under water though (of course) and allow a 15min dwell (IME).


Hi, do you know if the peroxide treatment is safe for RCS?


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## jfynyson (Apr 15, 2013)

Aqualady said:


> Hi, do you know if the peroxide treatment is safe for RCS?


Sorry but I do not recall & I do not have shrimp. However, read this thread and you'll find your answer I'm sure...

One -Two punch
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=203684


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## Aqualady (Jan 14, 2013)

jfynyson said:


> Sorry but I do not recall & I do not have shrimp. However, read this thread and you'll find your answer I'm sure...
> 
> One -Two punch
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=203684


Ha! Great, it was the first thing in red bold letters...thanks....


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## BruceF (Aug 5, 2011)

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=423737&highlight=bba


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## acitydweller (Dec 28, 2011)

h2o2 is not recommended for inverts. best to remove if you are using it in higher dosages, particularly the one two punch.


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## rezco (Jan 25, 2012)

jfynyson said:


> The one two punch (H2O2 & Excel) does work for BBA but you're treating the symptom not the root cause.



Agreed. I have had BBA problems in my CO2 fed tank too. The underlying cause is nutirent imbalance (in my case phosphate over 2ppm).

I had guppies that kept multiplying to a point where there were too many fish and the addition of an automated feeder made the problem worse.

In my experience - keep a high plant to fish ratio, back off the photoperiod if there is BBA growth under the lamps, maintain CO2, and frequent water changes.


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## dzega (Apr 22, 2013)

Aqualady said:


> Hi, do you know if the peroxide treatment is safe for RCS?


h2o2 is not safe for any living organism, all depends on dosages.
ive treated few tanks with it while RCS and amanos were there without issues.

on the other hand ive lost a few when i overdosed and did not change water after treatment


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## dzega (Apr 22, 2013)

a bit of an offtopic.
ive seen a gorgeous tank filled with BBA and hardscape only. a piece of an art truly


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## Barbels (Aug 3, 2004)

dzega said:


> a bit of an offtopic.
> ive seen a gorgeous tank filled with BBA and hardscape only. a piece of an art truly


:icon_eek: EEEEeeewww.


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## tweakz20 (Oct 30, 2013)

acitydweller said:


> h2o2 is not recommended for inverts. best to remove if you are using it in higher dosages, particularly the one two punch.


Overdosing excel is also bad for inverts. If it's high enough, it's bad for fish and plants too. Excel kills algae because it contains an active ingredient of Glutaraldehyde. 

"Glutaraldehyde is an antimicrobial, bactericide, fungicide, and virucide, commonly used to sterilize medical instruments. It is also used as an embalming fluid, as an ingredient in Anti-Freeze, an antibacterial agent in cooling towers, a leather tanning agent, a biocide in water treatment, a sanitary solution for portable toilets, and is used to sterilize ballast tanks in ships moving from one water source to another (to kill off pathogens and critters that may be transferred in the tanks from one water way to another)."
http://www.oscarfish.com/article-home/equipment/114-buyer-beaware-seachem-excel.html

Inverts can die even from a standard dose if there's not enough plants to uptake the compounds. Excel is not an algae fix, it manages the problem, but the root cause of the algae needs to be fixed. Alternatively, use some algae eater and avoid chemical treatments.


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