# Walstad Tank issues



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

I also tend toward Walstad tanks. Here are some of the plants that do well for me:

Anubias nana
Heteranthera zosterifolia
Bacopa caroliniana
Vallisneria asiatica
Crotocoryne (pretty much any)
Ludwigia repens (red)
Vesicularia dubyana (Christmas moss)

I hope that helps!

Also, does the tank get any sunlight at all? With no light, even low light plants will need a little something. Even a cheapie LED in the 5000K to 7000K temperature range will make a huge difference.

Regarding your Blyxa - it tends to be the case in Walstad tanks that some plants just simply die away and others do really well. If you have one completely melting down, I would pull it and try something else in its place.

Also, if you haven't read the book, I can recommend Diana Walstad's "The Ecology of the Planted Aquarium". It's not an easy breezy read, but it is full of useful information. Hardback is expensive, though - better to try to find the eBook.


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

Desk lamp over tank with led spotlight and some red root floaters would be my suggestion.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

Shrubbery said:


> I also tend toward Walstad tanks. Here are some of the plants that do well for me:
> 
> Anubias nana
> Heteranthera zosterifolia
> ...


The tanks in a garage, there is a light, I'll probably pull out the plants then. I have read Diana's book, it's excellent. Is there any desk lamp that you recommend? Also, all the plants above are basically strong light and medium light, what kind of lamp will I need? Is the anyway to get some kind of light that's timed?

Bump:


DaveKS said:


> Desk lamp over tank with led spotlight and some red root floaters would be my suggestion.


What do you mean by red root floaters?


----------



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

Sappire said:


> The tanks in a garage, there is a light, I'll probably pull out the plants then. I have read Diana's book, it's excellent. Is there any desk lamp that you recommend? Also, all the plants above are basically strong light and medium light, what kind of lamp will I need? Is the anyway to get some kind of light that's timed?


I have them all in fairly dimly lit tanks and they are doing fine, likely in large part from the nutrients from the soil. 

I can't think of a light with a built-in timer, but if you have a receptacle for power, just a standard plug-in timer from your local hardware store will do the trick just fine (that's what I use on all of my tanks). As a rule of thumb, you want about 2-3 watts per gallon of compact fluorescent light, or about half that in LED - that is enough to support any of the plants I mentioned. If you just do crypts and Anubias and maybe Java fern and/or moss, you could probably halve that again. Following Diana's 5-4-5 siesta pattern (5 hours on, 4 off, 5 on) has worked well for me. 

How big is the tank? That will help inform what lighting options would make sense. Chances are pretty good that a compact fluorescent or LED from your local hardware store will do just fine. If it's a particularly large tank, you might need multiples, or a bigger fixture. You don't need much - and if your tank gets periodic sunlight (even indirect) from the open garage door, so much the better!


----------



## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Diana now has an updated LED lighting section in her book. The updated pages are available for free on her website. https://dianawalstad.com/aquariums/

She lists some lighting pattern information and some information on what led light strength she uses.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

Shrubbery said:


> I have them all in fairly dimly lit tanks and they are doing fine, likely in large part from the nutrients from the soil.
> 
> I can't think of a light with a built-in timer, but if you have a receptacle for power, just a standard plug-in timer from your local hardware store will do the trick just fine (that's what I use on all of my tanks). As a rule of thumb, you want about 2-3 watts per gallon of compact fluorescent light, or about half that in LED - that is enough to support any of the plants I mentioned. If you just do crypts and Anubias and maybe Java fern and/or moss, you could probably halve that again. Following Diana's 5-4-5 siesta pattern (5 hours on, 4 off, 5 on) has worked well for me.
> 
> How big is the tank? That will help inform what lighting options would make sense. Chances are pretty good that a compact fluorescent or LED from your local hardware store will do just fine. If it's a particularly large tank, you might need multiples, or a bigger fixture. You don't need much - and if your tank gets periodic sunlight (even indirect) from the open garage door, so much the better!


The tank is 13 gallons. Problem is it gets extremely cold, I have a heater that's turned all the way up to max, and it's still not heating the tank to 26 C, it doesn't go above 24, so the garage door is going to be blocked off in exchange for skylights. The LED light should be coming down from the top into the tank, right? Also I had a lid, will that affect the lighting from the top? 

So how many watts for a 13 gallon?

I have a 55 gallon, but this 13 gallon is first being used as a test to see if the Walstad method will work for me.

How did you do the plug-in timer?

Sorry for the many questions.


----------



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

Sappire said:


> The tank is 13 gallons. Problem is it gets extremely cold, I have a heater that's turned all the way up to max, and it's still not heating the tank to 26 C, it doesn't go above 24, so the garage door is going to be blocked off in exchange for skylights. The LED light should be coming down from the top into the tank, right? Also I had a lid, will that affect the lighting from the top?
> 
> So how many watts for a 13 gallon?
> 
> ...


Ideally the light should come from above (it's certainly the easiest way to make sure the whole tank gets some light), because you want to maximize how many plants receive the light and not create too much distance between the plants and the light. 

Two of my tanks have very weak lights but get some indirect sunlight for a couple of hours a day - the plants love that.

For 13 gallons, with some indirect light from the skylights, you could probably get away with a 9-12W LED. You could go as high as probably 18W without it becoming too much light.

For the plug-in timer, I just ran the cord from my light to one of those timers with the push-pins that you use to set what hours the light is on for, and I set it for 8am-1pm and 5pm to 10pm. It's off the rest of the time.


----------



## Amp2020 (Mar 8, 2013)

Blyxa japonica never does well in my tank unless I have strong lights and CO2. Might be able to save it if you plant it in a jar and set it on a window sill with direct sunlight. Letting the leaves barely touch air allows it to get plenty of CO2.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

Shrubbery said:


> Ideally the light should come from above (it's certainly the easiest way to make sure the whole tank gets some light), because you want to maximize how many plants receive the light and not create too much distance between the plants and the light.
> 
> Two of my tanks have very weak lights but get some indirect sunlight for a couple of hours a day - the plants love that.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much for your help! I really appreciate it!

Unfortunately I can't put the tank under the skylights because it will be in the way of everything, so I'm going to have to get a 18W light, if I'm correct? Or is that too high? 

So I can just go to a place like Bunnings Warehouse to get the timer then. Cool.

Also, if the light comes down from the top, I have a lid that's ontop of the tank, and it obviously gets misty and water is on it, does that affect the light? Thanks.

Bump:


Amp2020 said:


> Blyxa japonica never does well in my tank unless I have strong lights and CO2. Might be able to save it if you plant it in a jar and set it on a window sill with direct sunlight. Letting the leaves barely touch air allows it to get plenty of CO2.


I might try that, I don't know if they've survived though, they aren't completely brown.


----------



## Frank158 (Oct 1, 2013)

Hi



> I have a 55 gallon, but this 13 gallon is first being used as a test to see if the Walstad method will work for me.



The Walstad method will work if it is set up correctly. You need to set your tank up correctly with an appropriate light over top of your aquarium. 




> Also, if the light comes down from the top, I have a lid that's ontop of the tank, and it obviously gets misty and water is on it, does that affect the light? Thanks.


Yes it will. There is nothing you can do about the mistyness but you should keep the glass lid as clean as you can.

Here is a list of low light plants. One thing to note that the Walstad Method supplies nutrients with dirt via the roots of the plants. Plants like Anubia, Java Fern and Moss plants do not get their nutrients this way. Anubias/Ferns have a rhizome that *should not be* buried into the substrate. This will kill the plant.

Here is the list of plants:

https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/100-low-tech-forum/56042-excellent-list-low-light-plants.html

Hope this helps.

Cheers


----------



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

Sappire said:


> Thank you so much for your help! I really appreciate it!
> 
> Unfortunately I can't put the tank under the skylights because it will be in the way of everything, so I'm going to have to get a 18W light, if I'm correct? Or is that too high?
> 
> ...


Happy to help!

The "ideal" range would be somewhere 13W and 18W. If you go a little lower, you might have slower growth. A little higher, and you might need to be a bit more vigilant about algae. If you can find something in between, that's about ideal, in my experience (basically a number of Watts equal to about 1 to 1.5 times the gallon capacity of the tank.

The water buildup on the lid will affect the light a little, as someone said earlier, but I wouldn't stress out too much about that. Give the lid a clean once in a while and make sure there's no algae building up on it, and you'll be just fine.

The nice thing about the Walstad method is that the light isn't as much of an exact science as it is in a typical high tech setup. 

Good luck with it - I find these setups very rewarding and really low-maintenance. In the early days, keep an eye on algae and remove what you can (reduce the lighting period a little if it seems to be getting out of hand), and enjoy the tank!


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

Shrubbery said:


> Happy to help!
> 
> The "ideal" range would be somewhere 13W and 18W. If you go a little lower, you might have slower growth. A little higher, and you might need to be a bit more vigilant about algae. If you can find something in between, that's about ideal, in my experience (basically a number of Watts equal to about 1 to 1.5 times the gallon capacity of the tank.
> 
> ...


Hi! Thanks, I got some of the plants you recommended. I have ONE more question though, I'm afraid that the plants might die because the roots haven;t been planted properly, I'm trying not to stress too much, I tried my best, got them right into the bottom, and tried to pull the large tweezers out without letting too much sand get into the soil. I have attached a photo of my tank that I just set up with your advice. Some of the roots from the plants are sticking out from the sand, is that okay? It's really hard to get all the roots into the soil, I kind of freak out because a lot of dirt comes out when I pull the tweezers out, now I'm afraid I've ruined it. 

https://imgur.com/tKG26Ph


----------



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

Sappire said:


> Hi! Thanks, I got some of the plants you recommended. I have ONE more question though, I'm afraid that the plants might die because the roots haven;t been planted properly, I'm trying not to stress too much, I tried my best, got them right into the bottom, and tried to pull the large tweezers out without letting too much sand get into the soil. I have attached a photo of my tank that I just set up with your advice. Some of the roots from the plants are sticking out from the sand, is that okay? It's really hard to get all the roots into the soil, I kind of freak out because a lot of dirt comes out when I pull the tweezers out, now I'm afraid I've ruined it.
> 
> https://imgur.com/tKG26Ph


I think you're in great shape!

Don't worry too much about a few of the roots poking out (I get that sometimes, too).Those particular roots may or may not die off, but new ones will take their place under the sand/soil.

If it is really bothering you, you can take something like a chopstick (or press your tweezers closed and use the tip) and just push it gently under the sand. I wouldn't worry about trying to get it all the way to the bottom at all. You've got some good rooting plants there that will create their own root systems soon enough!

Next up: the waiting game while everything settles in!

As Diana said in her book, don't be too concerned if one of the plants doesn't do so well - you can always replace it later. Look at the health of the whole tank as a guideline (if none of the plants are doing well, something's wrong). But, it certainly looks to me like you're off to a great start. Enjoy it!


----------



## Desert Pupfish (May 6, 2019)

If you're lucky enough to be starting out with plants that have extensive roots, it can be tricky to get them all covered by the substrate. I you have some leftover sand, just put that on top of any exposed roots. But as @Shrubbery says, I wouldn't sweat it if some are uncovered....


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

Shrubbery said:


> I think you're in great shape!
> 
> Don't worry too much about a few of the roots poking out (I get that sometimes, too).Those particular roots may or may not die off, but new ones will take their place under the sand/soil.
> 
> ...


Thanks!

The plants seem to be doing alright, would it be alright to add my snail back into the tank as well as some glass shrimp? 
Also, I don't know if this is just me worrying or not but the plants have a bit of brown near the bottom, the light hits most of the plants but doesn't cover the leaves that are in the shade, is that ok?


----------



## Desert Pupfish (May 6, 2019)

Diana recommends snails. Malaysian trumpet snails will aerate the substrate, but if overfed with excess food or algae can explode in numbers. Nerites don't breed in freshwater, so are easier to control if you don't wanna be bothered with removing excess snails. Not that they really bother anything or add a lot to the bioload.

Are glass shrimp like ghost shrimp? I've got some--they're cheap and also do a good job cleaning up algae & excess food, as well as dead plant leaves. Ghost shrimp can breed in the tank--providing free live food for your fish.


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

It’s perfectly fine to trim back roots to 1.5-2” before planting. Most plants actually like to have roots trimmed before planting.

Looking at your picture your water wisteria (hygrophila difformis) was grown out of water and will take a few weeks to transform into submerged growth. You also need to spread them out so that there is at least 1.5-2” between each stem so it does not overshade it’s own lower leaves. It will also be a much wider plant once it goes to its submerged growth. This will be what each stem looks like after it transitions and you’ll need to go to about 2-3” or more spacing on each stem then.










All your plants really should have been broken apart and spread out more. The plants will do better and also fill in the aquarium more.


----------



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

Desert Pupfish said:


> Diana recommends snails. Malaysian trumpet snails will aerate the substrate, but if overfed with excess food or algae can explode in numbers. Nerites don't breed in freshwater, so are easier to control if you don't wanna be bothered with removing excess snails. Not that they really bother anything or add a lot to the bioload.
> 
> Are glass shrimp like ghost shrimp? I've got some--they're cheap and also do a good job cleaning up algae & excess food, as well as dead plant leaves. Ghost shrimp can breed in the tank--providing free live food for your fish.


I have become a big fan of snails, too. They aren't aesthetically great, but they are workhorses in the tank.

For shrimp, you have to be a bit more careful because they can be very sensitive to ammonia and nitrite. If you're testing and the numbers look good (zeroes for each of them), you should be fine to add a few shrimp. Do test first, your soil is constantly decomposing things and can create ammonia, even without adding anything to the tank. The plants will take a lot (maybe all) of it up, but you want to keep an eye out in case things are out of balance.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

DaveKS said:


> It’s perfectly fine to trim back roots to 1.5-2” before planting. Most plants actually like to have roots trimmed before planting.
> 
> Looking at your picture your water wisteria (hygrophila diffomis) was grown out of water and will take a few weeks to transform into submerged growth. You also need to spread them out so that there is at least 1.5-2” between each stem so it does not overshade it’s own lower leaves. It will also be a much wider plant once it goes to its submerged growth. This will be what each stem looks like after it transitions and you’ll need to go to about 2-3” or more spacing on each stem then.
> 
> ...


Oh crap, what do I do? should I take them out and replant them?

Bump:


Shrubbery said:


> I have become a big fan of snails, too. They aren't aesthetically great, but they are workhorses in the tank.
> 
> For shrimp, you have to be a bit more careful because they can be very sensitive to ammonia and nitrite. If you're testing and the numbers look good (zeroes for each of them), you should be fine to add a few shrimp. Do test first, your soil is constantly decomposing things and can create ammonia, even without adding anything to the tank. The plants will take a lot (maybe all) of it up, but you want to keep an eye out in case things are out of balance.


What would you do? Would you take the plants out and spread them out like what Dave said? Will this impact my plants? If I do replant them, will it be okay. I'm just worried that the dirt will get too much sand in it and stop the plants from growing.

Augh, I'm such a worry wort.


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

You seem to be under impression that Walstad type tanks require no maintenance/pruning/replanting. They are very fast growing when going good and you will be constantly pruning and replanting something. The dirt, you go as slow as possible when pulling plants so as not to pull any excess to surface, don’t worry about a little sand getting down into soil, it won’t hurt anything and you can always add a little more to top as needed. If you don’t want to replant a lot you should have went with crown plants like swords and crypt that stay in substrate and you just prune off old leaves from outer layer of crown.

I’m going to guess from this picture that we’re dealing with a 20gal tank.









You really don’t have enough light, especially those little plants down at bottom left, their just going to slowly die away from lack of light. This light would be good choice, it should give you about 40-50par at substrate and give you more even coverage across tank. Not that expensive.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F7391M...pY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZkb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU&th=1

If your going to continue with the home brew lighting you will need another light like the one on there now at other end of tank. At least two 14w led spotlight bulbs. You seem to also be under impression that a Walstad tank requires no light but there is minimum you have to have and your no where near that.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

DaveKS said:


> You seem to be under impression that Walstad type tanks require no maintenance/pruning/replanting. They are very fast growing when going good and you will be constantly pruning and replanting something. The dirt, you go as slow as possible when pulling plants so as not to pull any excess to surface, don’t worry about a little sand getting down into soil, it won’t hurt anything and you can always add a little more to top as needed. If you don’t want to replant a lot you should have went with crown plants like swords and crypt that stay in substrate and you just prune off old leaves from outer layer of crown.
> 
> I’m going to guess from this picture that we’re dealing with a 20gal tank.
> 
> ...


Not in the beginning, over time the water changes wouldn't be needed is what I'm gathering.

So would a tank setup like this be what I need to do?










I'm going by the research I've done. It has been said to plant a mixture of the plants that I've planted, even Diana said that she plants a whole bunch of plants and sees which ones will make it or not.

So I should replant the plants slowly?


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

Pic not showing. Needs to be on a secure server or link addresses is incomplete. 

But yes, when you get time spread plants out a bit. Those water wisteria should be spread to cover that whole back corner. Get 2nd light so sword is not completely shaded out. That Val right in center is completely shading out whole left of tank and plants there.


----------



## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Plants will spread if there is space to do so. With your plants bunched up like that most (any not on the edges) won't have room to spread. By separating them out you are allowing them room to self propagate. If you are unsure how to do this look at videos from George farmer on YouTube. When he sets up a new tank he goes through how to prepare plants. He published one a month or so ago about resetting his fluval flex tank that was geared towards beginners. That was a low tech tank which is different than a walstad but his planting methods are universal.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

DaveKS said:


> Pic not showing. Needs to be on a secure server or link addresses is incomplete.
> 
> But yes, when you get time spread plants out a bit. Those water wisteria should be spread to cover that whole back corner. Get 2nd light so sword is not completely shaded out. That Val right in center is completely shading out whole left of tank and plants there.


It's 13 gallons by the way. I think the reason the sword is getting shaded out is because of the position of the water wisteria at the time. 

Here's the link https://imgur.com/a/TFdJQZV

Bump:


minorhero said:


> Plants will spread if there is space to do so. With your plants bunched up like that most (any not on the edges) won't have room to spread. By separating them out you are allowing them room to self propagate. If you are unsure how to do this look at videos from George farmer on YouTube. When he sets up a new tank he goes through how to prepare plants. He published one a month or so ago about resetting his fluval flex tank that was geared towards beginners. That was a low tech tank which is different than a walstad but his planting methods are universal.


Can you link the video? Thanks


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

Not even sure that’s a Walstad tank but it’s getting full sunshine through window. 

Here’s my 7gal, not a Walstad but I haven’t changed water since early May. Just have to throw away handfuls of plants every week. Just top off with distilled water and dose ferts at 1/3 strength. A $29US led light and a aquaclear 20 filter, Betta and 11 mini tetra.


----------



## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Sappire said:


> Can you link the video? Thanks








Edit: not quite as good as I remember for plants so here is a better one:


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

DaveKS said:


> Not even sure that’s a Walstad tank but it’s getting full sunshine through window.
> 
> Here’s my 7gal, not a Walstad but I haven’t changed water since early May. Just have to throw away handfuls of plants every week. Just top off with distilled water and dose ferts at 1/3 strength. A $29US led light and a aquaclear 20 filter, Betta and 11 mini tetra.


Thanks for sharing Dave, I just took everyones advice, and I split up the plants and added a bit more sand to top the soil. I've taken a picture of the moved plants, does it look better? I tried my best to move the roots all the way down. 

https://imgur.com/a/Y7plMyq


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

What is short little plant? Hard to tell in photo.


----------



## Sappire (Aug 8, 2019)

DaveKS said:


> What is short little plant? Hard to tell in photo.


I don't remember their name, but if you look at the previous reply before I moved the plants, you'll see them more clearly, I think their names started with a R. I buried them into the soil properly this time, before they weren't actually in.


----------



## Diana Walstad (Aug 17, 2019)

*Reduced price for Ecology of the Planted Aquarium*



Shrubbery said:


> Also, if you haven't read the book, I can recommend Diana Walstad's "The Ecology of the Planted Aquarium". It's not an easy breezy read, but it is full of useful information. Hardback is expensive, though - better to try to find the eBook.


Thanks very much for compliments about my book. Being somewhat perturbed by the high price charged by Internet retailers, I've now had my distributor lower the price for direct sales to hobbyists. I am now offering the hardback of ‘Ecology of the Planted Aquarium’ for only $24.50: Ecology of the Planted Aquarium

In addition, I am selling a combo package of the aquarium book plus my family history book directly off my books' website: https://dianawalstad.com/ Cost of the two books--both autographed and with free shipping within the U.S.--is only $29.95. Finally, website contains free articles on guppy breeding, aquatic plants and fish diseases.


----------



## Blue Ridge Reef (Feb 10, 2008)

Holy catfish, honored to have you here!


----------



## Shrubbery (Jul 1, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> Shrubbery said:
> 
> 
> > Also, if you haven't read the book, I can recommend Diana Walstad's "The Ecology of the Planted Aquarium". It's not an easy breezy read, but it is full of useful information. Hardback is expensive, though - better to try to find the eBook.
> ...


Thank you so much for posting here, and for letting us know about the new pricing and distribution model.

I am currently working through my third reading of your book, and I continue to develop better and better insights as to what is happening in my aquariums. Thank you for sharing your research and experience with the hobby!

For me, it has been a game-changer.


----------



## Desert Pupfish (May 6, 2019)

I just wanna know why Diana Walstad--THE Diana Walstad--is listed as a "newbie" on here???


----------



## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> Thanks very much for compliments about my book. Being somewhat perturbed by the high price charged by Internet retailers, I've now had my distributor lower the price for direct sales to hobbyists. I am now offering the hardback of ‘Ecology of the Planted Aquarium’ for only $24.50: Ecology of the Planted Aquarium
> 
> In addition, I am selling a combo package of the aquarium book plus my family history book directly off my books' website: https://dianawalstad.com/ Cost of the two books--both autographed and with free shipping within the U.S.--is only $29.95. Finally, website contains free articles on guppy breeding, aquatic plants and fish diseases.


A celebrity in our midst! Quick everyone clean up.

Just took advantage of your combo book offer a couple of weeks ago and finished reading Ecology of the Planted Aquarium last night. Really excited to setup my own "Walstad Tank" in the month or so when I get my vessel in. Thank you for writing such an excellent resource. Few people have grown the hobby like you have.


----------



## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

Desert Pupfish said:


> I just wanna know why Diana Walstad--THE Diana Walstad--is listed as a "newbie" on here???


Well technically she only has 1 post and just joined. >


----------



## Diana Walstad (Aug 17, 2019)

Shrubbery said:


> Thank you so much for posting here, and for letting us know about the new pricing and distribution model.
> 
> I am currently working through my third reading of your book, and I continue to develop better and better insights as to what is happening in my aquariums. Thank you for sharing your research and experience with the hobby!
> 
> For me, it has been a game-changer.


Thanks for your enthusiasm! I hadn't seen this forum before--don't get around much--but I see constructive, knowledgeable group giving decent advice. I plan to return!


----------

