# Dreaming about my first tank: large, planted, Discus fish | updated pics as of 6/28



## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Once upon a time...

On a cold day in February, I was browsing on craigslist.com, looking for houseplants. So I started clicking here and there, and eventually came across a 125g fish tank. Nothing but the stand, glass lids and ****ty lighting fixtures came with it.

Let me tell you right now that planted aquariums with fish in them are addictive. I had space for the 5 ft monster tank in the living room, so I convinced my roommates that everything is going to work out well and we picked up the tank. Nevertheless, the guy who was selling it lived quite far and we managed to bring everything home in one piece in a pickup's trunk. I've never seen so many people staring at our load on the highway because we stuffed a bunch of old pillows on the bottom and in-between, so the glass and wooden stand won't break.

The tank got into the living room, I ordered the equipment and started setting up everything. I was very confused! The more people I spoke to (LFS staff, Petco, Petland, etc.) the more blurry the picture about my tank became. Nevertheless, these people's opinions weren't consistent at all. I almost gave up on it... In a desperate search for live plants, someone on craigslist told me about plantedtank.net and since then I didn't listen to my LFS guy anymore.

Looking back, what was I thinking with that white and black substrate?!? And rocks?? Some of them are ok, but these don't even match! This cannot work.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Anyhow, I filled up the tank and started cycling it. I added 10 small Zebra Danios the next day. The water was a bit cloudy and the lights I've ordered didn't arrive yet, so I had to stick with the old ones. The fish were lost in that large tank, too bad I forgot to take a pic while I had them.

After about a week my roommate convinced me to add some Angels, too. We picked those up, introduced 6 into the tank but soon after the Danios started picking on them, so the next day I took them back to the LFS.

Although very shy at the beginning (they didn't like the decorations either...), the Angels became more and more lively as days passed. Without knowing how many times they should be fed, I threw in food about 3-5 times a day. Every day. I had the water tested at the LFS, where the guy told me that I was making McDonald's fish out of poor angels. So I had to slow down and cut back feeding to once a day.


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

Welcome to the site! Nothing like starting BIG! Actually easier than small too.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

I heard about a Cichlid Swap Meet, held in Arlington Heights, IL, today (Sunday) and I wanted to check it out. They said that I might find some good deals on plants and driftwood. By the way, that would be my next step: throwing out most of the rocks and filling up the bottom with plants and driftwood.

We arrived to the meet around 10:15 am and started looking for plants right away. I ended bringing home 3 Angels as well, frozen blood worms, brine shrimp eggs and a bunch of plants (I don't even remember their names) for $71. I feel like I made a good deal today, especially if I compare prices with the fish stores' around.

Planting has to wait till tomorrow or Tuesday. The only thing I couldn't find was driftwood. I mean they had driftwood, I just didn't like it that much. About a week ago I picked up some wood from the nearby Kankakee river. The small pieces were boiled and still soaking. The large pieces have been soaked in hot water for a day but I don't have that large of a container or bucket to soak it in. And I like taking showers, so the wood is currently sitting in the garage instead of the bath tub.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

wkndracer said:


> Welcome to the site! Nothing like starting BIG! Actually easier than small too.


Thank you! It might be easier but this is my very first tank ever. Thus I can't compare it with anything and the only 3 words that come to my mind are IT IS HARD. Oh, and one more thing: do not ever believe anyone who is telling you that setting up an aquarium is going to be easy both for you and your pocket. 'Cause it won't. But it's nothing like the feeling of satisfaction and happiness that you eventually succeeded!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

So I have 5 + 3 Angels in the tank right now. I was looking for tetras too today but couldn't find any since it was a cichlid swap. Dah! I found a vendor though who is a Discus breeder. He brought along this showpiece quality magnificent female Discus, obviously she wasn't for sale, and we agreed to keep in touch via email. I think he'll be my juvenile Discus supplier: prices are great and he looks like the kind of person who takes care of his fish. There was a bag with 6-7 juvis that were supposed to be picked up by someone who decided not to show up. I was very close to buy that bag. Can you see what addiction does to me?!?

Anyhow, my water conditions are not the best yet, the tank has only been cycling for 19 days and the nitrate test turned out very purple. I decided to wait another month (there's a convention coming up on Memorial Day) and I'll meet the seller then.

Till then I have lots of things to do: get rid of those ugly rocks, add driftwood and plants, perform another 50% water change. Water changes are fun. I did 1 so far, it took me half of a day. Remember it's a 125g.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Oh, I forgot to mention that the day my nitrate test came back purple, the LFS guy recommended me to buy Stress Zyme (I might not spell it correctly), liquid bacteria that will boost the size of colonies in the filters. I have to use it every other day for a week. 

I might have forgotten the type of equipment that I have in the tank right now. So I'll write a short list:

- Eheim 2217 canister and Emperor 400 power filters
- 2 Jager Ebo 250w/each heaters
- 2 power heads
- 5 ft power compact lighting fixture, that hasn't arrived yet, with 4x65w bulbs
- black plants substrate, white sand


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## Centromochlus (May 19, 2008)

Love the angels! :thumbsup:

I actually kinda like your current scape, it's different but unique. Would look even better though with driftwood and plants!

Nice start, and good luck!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

AzFishKid said:


> Love the angels! :thumbsup:
> 
> I actually kinda like your current scape, it's different but unique. Would look even better though with driftwood and plants!
> 
> Nice start, and good luck!


Thanks! I think the look could be described as sort of 'avant-garde': it's not your average but you shouldn't question it  I've seen all these other aquariums on the forum and I'm not sure how to place driftwood and plants into my tank to make it look good. In your opinion, should I keep the black-and-white substrate, or should I throw half of it out? No worries, I have plenty of extra left in the garage to fill in the empty space. By the way, if anyone is interested in substrate, I'm ready to trade whatever I have left.


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## Kayen (Oct 14, 2007)

gabriella said:


> Oh, I forgot to mention that the day my nitrate test came back purple, the LFS guy recommended me to buy Stress Zyme (I might not spell it correctly), liquid bacteria that will boost the size of colonies in the filters. I have to use it every other day for a week.
> 
> I might have forgotten the type of equipment that I have in the tank right now. So I'll write a short list:
> 
> ...


Yuu don't need Stress Zyme.
Plants carry lots of the good stuff to get started.
So just get lots of plants, and um wait awhile before you get more fish.
Anyways for a first timer you got yourself a nice start.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Kayen said:


> Yuu don't need Stress Zyme.
> Plants carry lots of the good stuff to get started.
> So just get lots of plants, and um wait awhile before you get more fish.
> Anyways for a first timer you got yourself a nice start.


I wish I knew it, I already used the Stress Zyme yesterday. Though I bought the largest bottle, it has pretty much 3 dosages, but I'll put it away I guess. As for the plants, how do you measure their quantity? I mean how much is a lot and what's a bare minimum there? What I've got today seems a lot to me considering that they will grow eventually and start spreading. Note: I don't have CO2 yet but it's part of the plan to get it.

Still learning the names of plants, so here's what I know for sure I have in the bucket (please don't ask me to be more specific ):

- 3 moss balls
- 4 swords
- 2 Anubias (2 stems each)
- 1 Ludwigia (3-4 stems)
- 1 onion plant
- 2 tall, pretty plants, 2-3 stems each
- 6"x3" Java fern mat

That's what I'll start out with. Thanks for the advice!


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

Hello!
You said water changes are fun??? Well with a planted discus tank be prepared to do at least 3 large ones a week. I made the commitment to have a 180gal hi-tech discus tank and it is a PITA!:eek5: On Sunday I do a 90% WC. On wed. I do a 60% WC and another one on friday. Discus need the best water conditions you can give them. I would also advise against getting juvies in a planted tank as they need even better water quality and even more WC's for them to grow properly and not be stunted etc. I spend around 25+ hours a week in cleaning etc. 

I like where your head is at though, If you are prepared for the commitment dive in. I absolutely love looking at my tank and it is worth every penny I have spent. I would suggest if you havnt to read and read and read about discus and diseases, water parameters needed, plants that can handle 82-86 degree water and suitable tank mates. Also I would test your water for GH,PH,KH. I use 50/50 RO and tap/well water because my water is not how I want my discus to live.

I dont know if you have been to simply discus forums but I highly recommend it if you havnt.http://forum.simplydiscus.com/

I would also like to recommend Cory at Baylees fishees for plants. He is an excellent guy and you get more than what you pay for. And the quality is outstanding. http://www.bayleesfishees.com/store/

Good luck and never let this hobby discourage you!!


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

Angels like clean water but Discus keeping is tough. Lotta work. Bigger is easier to balance but nobody ever said cheap.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

I have a 265 gallon Discus tank. I do a 30% water change every two or three weeks, and I have no water quality issues. Just plant dense and keep an eye out for strange behavior. Check out your tap water parameters and see if they meet discus requirements, I cut mine with one third RO water to keep my hardness reasonable. 

The tank stays at 86° so you need to choose plants that can survive at that temp, do some research and you will be fine.


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## rich815 (May 21, 2008)

Do discus jump? I've got an open-top 75 gal and I'm thinking of removing my 3-4 rainbows and getting 2-3 discus in there instead but I like it being rimless and topless. I do have the occasional suicide jump from penguin tetras, danios and rasboras but have learned now not to get notorious jumpers. Are discus generall ok in a topless tank?

(sorry for the hijack, but it's related, no?)


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## Tamelesstgr (Jan 11, 2008)

Gabriella,

Nice Tank! I wish I had the room for a tank that big. Maybe if I end up getting a bigger house this year like I plan on. Sounds like you are well on your way, just be glad you started with a big tank. I went from 6 gallon to 10 gallon to 20 gallon, always wanting that larger tank.

The swap meet is a great place to pick up a lot of good stuff and great prices. I picked up some plants and a few cory's too.

Good luck, I'll be waiting for updates.

Ken


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

rich815: Yes discus will jump. They are a skittish fish at times. I have heard them bang into my glass tops, which I hate having to have! Most are under the impression discus do better in groups of 5-6.

Bowles42: A 30% WC every 2-3 weeks? Are your fish stunted at all? Or are they adults? If everything is fine you are lucky? :thumbsup:


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> Hello!
> You said water changes are fun??? Well with a planted discus tank be prepared to do at least 3 large ones a week. I made the commitment to have a 180gal hi-tech discus tank and it is a PITA!:eek5: On Sunday I do a 90% WC. On wed. I do a 60% WC and another one on friday. Discus need the best water conditions you can give them. I would also advise against getting juvies in a planted tank as they need even better water quality and even more WC's for them to grow properly and not be stunted etc. I spend around 25+ hours a week in cleaning etc.
> 
> I like where your head is at though, If you are prepared for the commitment dive in. I absolutely love looking at my tank and it is worth every penny I have spent. I would suggest if you havnt to read and read and read about discus and diseases, water parameters needed, plants that can handle 82-86 degree water and suitable tank mates. Also I would test your water for GH,PH,KH. I use 50/50 RO and tap/well water because my water is not how I want my discus to live.
> ...


Oh, sorry, you must have missed my sarcastic little smirk on my face when I said that  What I meant was that I did my first (50%) water change and yes, it's definitely a PITA! It took half day to clean the tank and clean up my mass but I could tell that the Angels loved the water afterwards.

Thanks for the discus forum's link, I'll definitely check it out. As for the Cory fish, I have so many plans in my head right now that I must take it slow... It's on my list as well as CO2, testing kit (my LFS is testing the water right now free of charge), etc. I'm looking for driftwood through a forum member, it looks like I'll be buying more plants today or tomorrow, my lights have been shipped but don't want to arrive for some reason, a small Angel is picking on one of the big ones (till his butt is getting kicked one of these days by the big guy ), trying to put the existing plants into the tank so they won't die on me, I have to chop up the one-pound frozen blood worms that I got yesterday into 'daily packs' and refreeze, ... and I definitely need to make a TODO list with stuff ordered by their importance! Once you have a tank, there goes your personal life  Nah, just joking of course.

As you can see, though I'm new to this hobby, I'm trying to be better at it. I'm glad that everybody is encouraging me to learn about Discus before I actually get them. Good news, I spoke with the breeder who pretty much warned me about all the things that everyone here has stated. I didn't say it's going to be easy, in fact I do admit that it's very hard to get started, especially because there's no bulletproof recipe to a tank. Try-errors are the best we all can do, except perhaps listening to those who went trough similar difficulties or had the same problems with their tanks. And let's admit it, even a pro used to be a noobie some time ago. There's this line in the Ratatouille: Everybody can cook! Not everybody will become a great chef but a great chef may come from anywhere. So let's cook!... I mean, let's do-whatever-planted-tank-with-discus-keepers-do


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## jjp2 (May 24, 2008)

If you are growing out juvi discus, and you want show quality discus, you will be doing 50% every other day as you will be feeding them heavy 3 or more times a day.

If you would be happy with just nice discus, then you can get by with one 50% water change a week and feeding them 2 times a day.

You will need to keep your tank between 82-84 degrees. You will have a lot of evaporation. Evaporation should be replaced with 100% RO water.

Your regular water change should be 50% or more RO water. If you tap water is very hard, you'll want 100% and then add some Gh booster to it.

Start thinking about how to make the water changes easy before getting your discus. if you don't, you'll be unhappy or you'll have unhappy fish as you won't do enough.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

wkndracer said:


> Angels like clean water but Discus keeping is tough. Lotta work. Bigger is easier to balance but nobody ever said cheap.


Maybe I should introduce you to my LFS guy. He said I could do the whole thing for about half of whatever I already spent on things. Obviously he either doesn't have a tank or never set up a large tank before. Anyhow, I'm aware that Discus are pretty hard to keep happy but I'll definitely try. And cry later...



Bowles42 said:


> I have a 265 gallon Discus tank.  I do a 30% water change every two or three weeks, and I have no water quality issues. Just plant dense and keep an eye out for strange behavior. Check out your tap water parameters and see if they meet discus requirements, I cut mine with one third RO water to keep my hardness reasonable.
> 
> The tank stays at 86° so you need to choose plants that can survive at that temp, do some research and you will be fine.


Wow, I thought I had a monster tank, but yours sounds amazing. How many Discus do you have in it? I'm trying to raise the water temperature about 1-2 degrees per week, so I won't hot shower the Angels in it. As for the plants, you're right, I need to read more about them before my next purchase. The LFS recommended mixing the tap water with RO water, but after a while I simply quit listening to them anymore. I might consider it though once I'll have everything ready for the fish. So much left to do 




Tamelesstgr said:


> Gabriella,
> 
> Nice Tank! I wish I had the room for a tank that big. Maybe if I end up getting a bigger house this year like I plan on. Sounds like you are well on your way, just be glad you started with a big tank. I went from 6 gallon to 10 gallon to 20 gallon, always wanting that larger tank.
> 
> ...


Thanks, Ken! If everything goes according to your plans, I'm sure you'll be able to fit a large tank in a house. Even if you have to toss it under your bed  As for me, if you check out the very first pictures, you might notice that the pictures (paintings) on the wall aren't positioned well. That's because I had a wine rack there that I moved across the room to make space for the tank. Some things were rearranged and yes, I do wish I had a bigger living room. But then again, I'd probably be wanting a larger tank. Endless story that is.

Anyhow, the swat was a great opportunity to learn that such meets even exist. Thanks, Ken, for telling me about it and in fact inviting me to this great forum!!!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> rich815: Yes discus will jump. They are a skittish fish at times. I have heard them bang into my glass tops, which I hate having to have! Most are under the impression discus do better in groups of 5-6.
> 
> Bowles42: A 30% WC every 2-3 weeks? Are your fish stunted at all? Or are they adults? If everything is fine you are lucky? :thumbsup:


I agree, I was told at least 1 WC per week, or daily small WC. How do you do that? Do you have some sort of special filters, magical plants, or is it simply a self cleaning aquarium? If so, please let us know where you got it from


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

jjp2 said:


> If you are growing out juvi discus, and you want show quality discus, you will be doing 50% every other day as you will be feeding them heavy 3 or more times a day.
> 
> If you would be happy with just nice discus, then you can get by with one 50% water change a week and feeding them 2 times a day.
> 
> ...


Thanks, John, I got your point. I'd like to raise my Discus to their fullest potential, I can't stand those sad looking fish that they sell at my LFS with their long rather than round bodies or concave foreheads. I don't want my fish to end up being a piece of furniture in the house that I can replace any time and people would compliment on them without really knowing how they're supposed to look like. I put that down on my list too: RO water. 

Water changes aren't very easy right now because I have to run the water hose along the house. There're not many options left since taking out water by the bucket simply cannot work at 125g. I'm sure once I figure it out, water changes won't cause a headache.

What's a Gh booster? Sorry, still learning the terminology.


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

This is what I do to make WC's a little easier.

I have a separate pump for my UV sterilizer and my Co2 reactor. They both run together on there own loop. I put a shut of valve right before a T fitting right before my pump. So I shut the shut off valve(water from tank) before the T fitting and put my hose onto the t fitting and pump the fresh aged water from my water storage device(rubbermaid garbage cans) into the tank. Remember to make sure the water is as close to the same temp as the tank. All of the garbage cans are on little dollies I picked up from a hardware store so I can roll them through the house from the where the RO unit is located. Did that make sense?. I think I confused myself.


You can also just use a submersible pump in a container. Please keep in mind if you go the discus route to age your water and make sure its the same temp as the tank water. Aged water is simply aerated water that has had 24hrs or so to get oxygenated, get to temp and let the bad stuff gas out. i.e. chlorine and what ever else is in there. If you are using city water it is important to age the water and use a good water conditioner like seachems Prime.

Heres a link to a pretty good deal on a Co2 system. I bought mine from them.http://www.aquabuys.com/miva/mercha...2_set_dlx_06&Category_Code=i2&Product_Count=1

As difficult as a planted tank can be I opted to buy the kit rather than DIY one together. Sometimes a little money can save you a little in the end.

That link is to Cory at Baylees Fishees. He sells plants, he is the only guy I use because he is cheap, honest, and sells quality plants.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> This is what I do to make WC's a little easier.
> 
> I have a separate pump for my UV sterilizer and my Co2 reactor. They both run together on there own loop. I put a shut of valve right before a T fitting right before my pump. So I shut the shut off valve(water from tank) before the T fitting and put my hose onto the t fitting and pump the fresh aged water from my water storage device(rubbermaid garbage cans) into the tank. Remember to make sure the water is as close to the same temp as the tank. All of the garbage cans are on little dollies I picked up from a hardware store so I can roll them through the house from the where the RO unit is located. Did that make sense?. I think I confused myself.
> 
> ...


Ok, I see now, I misunderstood you. I thought you were suggesting possible tank mates with Discus (cory is a type of fish, right?), but it's not a cory. It's Cory! @ BayleesFishes.com! A poor guy that I kept confusing with a fish. I apologize for that.

You might have confused yourself, but I certainly understood what you meant. I'll tell you how we do water changes. We = Me. Me = Me last Tuesday. So you take the water hose, one end in the tank, the other in the backyard somewhere (depending on the size of the hose). And then just let it go. The water flows by itself, it's physics. It's a bit slow this way but it doesn't freak the fish out. I refilled the tank with regular tap water, from the sink, approximately same temperature. The reason: I have neither RO water maker nor storage device yet. Working on both though.

As for the equipment and everything else, I know it would've been easier if I got the whole package as they sell it everywhere but the problem was that I knew little or nothing about aquariums. The more I read about them the more I wanted a planted tank. The more pictures I saw the more I wanted to keep Discus. The more pictures I was sent (like this one) the more I had wished my tank look similar to those. You see, it all started with an innocent mouse click on a tiny ad that I became interested in this hobby. If I had to start it all over again, I'd be doing things differently, no doubt about it.

Thanks for the great tips on WC. May we see some pictures of your 180g please? I'm actually quite curious how you manage to change the water so frequently and what your scape and fish look like.


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

I know what you mean..1 click and all of the sudden you are broke!! I have always had a tank of some kind. I took a break for a while and got my daughter a 14 gallon community for her room and that was it. Soon after I had a 11o and now the 180. I hope when I get a new house soon I can get a 300. 
Anyway here it is. I just rescaped and trimmed last night. Actually I removed everything from the tank and just re did it all. I have a problem with leaving it alone. There is to many possibilities. But anyways this is how it is right after I got it all back together. It looks a bit dim due to all the lights not being on. It took from 10pm till 6am to get it back together. Thats not counting the clean up time of my kitchen, living room and bathroom.scrubbed new rocks in the bath tub then used our canning pot to boil them. But that does include the many interruptions from my fiance telling me to be quit!roud:


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## timme278 (Jan 1, 2009)

wow

what a transformation!!!

looks amazing.... get those discus in and youll have your hands in their changing it every 2-3 mins lol


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

I've had my discus since I got them as juveniles in December of '06. I have 6 full grown super red turquoise and one blue diamond high fin and one peach white. All are full grown and healthy, the only one I would consider a little stunted is the blue diamond high fin. Also consider I have a low bio load. 

Not sure if it's luck or science, just keep your parameters in check. 

Full disclosure: I started with 11 discus and lost three to internal parasites a year ago or so.

Ryan


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> I know what you mean..1 click and all of the sudden you are broke!! I have always had a tank of some kind. I took a break for a while and got my daughter a 14 gallon community for her room and that was it. Soon after I had a 11o and now the 180. I hope when I get a new house soon I can get a 300.
> Anyway here it is. I just rescaped and trimmed last night. Actually I removed everything from the tank and just re did it all. I have a problem with leaving it alone. There is to many possibilities. But anyways this is how it is right after I got it all back together. It looks a bit dim due to all the lights not being on. It took from 10pm till 6am to get it back together. Thats not counting the clean up time of my kitchen, living room and bathroom.scrubbed new rocks in the bath tub then used our canning pot to boil them. But that does include the many interruptions from my fiance telling me to be quit!roud:


cyberhog05, you're tank is beautiful! I really like all the details in it and you did a great job with plants. By the way, no matter how enthusiastic my fiance was, if he worked 8 hours, all night, on this, I'd be angry too 

I thought you had Discus in it since you knew so much about them, plus water changes. I might be blind or the tank too big but I can't see any of them in there.

Last night I finally managed to place all the plants in the tank. It's a temporary setup, just to keep them alive while I figure out how I'd like the scape organized. I'm ashamed to post any pics, so I'll wait till I achieve "the look" and then post some. Some of the plants that I got might end up being sold or given to someone else since they don't really fit in the image. 

While arranging the plants, all the Angels were swimming by my hands. Some of them even let me to touch their fins which surprised me a lot. Right after finishing up I gave them frozen worms and they seemed to enjoy "discovering" the plants. Today I've noticed that none of them were hiding behind rocks anymore and they kept following me every time I passed in front of the aquarium. They cannot possibly be hungry. I'd feed them more often but the LFS guy told me not to unless I wanted overfed fish. I still smuggle small portions of food into the tank every now and then; I can't help it, they constantly stare at me with those big eyes 

Back to you, cyberhog05, I hope you'll be able to set up that 300g. I couldn't find your journal about this tank, do you have one? I'd be curious to see the transformation. Nice job!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

timme278 said:


> wow
> 
> what a transformation!!!
> 
> looks amazing.... get those discus in and youll have your hands in their changing it every 2-3 mins lol


I wish that tank belonged to me, but it's actually cyberhog05's and the picture was posted on my request. My tank doesn't look that good (yet!) but I'm trying and will hopefully get there very soon.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Bowles42 said:


> I've had my discus since I got them as juveniles in December of '06. I have 6 full grown super red turquoise and one blue diamond high fin and one peach white. All are full grown and healthy, the only one I would consider a little stunted is the blue diamond high fin. Also consider I have a low bio load.
> 
> Not sure if it's luck or science, just keep your parameters in check.
> 
> ...


Hello Ryan,

I've looked at your 265g tank with all the Discus in it. I believe this is the simplest yet most stunning Discus setup that I've seen so far. Simple in terms of having a few plants, not a huge variety or densely planted, and a couple of large pieces of driftwood. Stunning because of the view you managed to achieve by using a few tools. The tank looks spacious, and your fish even match the curtains  I'm sorry, I know that wasn't the point but the tank turned out great! Sorry to hear that some of your fish passed away. It's good the parasites didn't get to everyone in there. Good luck with your current stock, VIVE LA Discus!


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

@ gabriella The picture in my profile is ages old lol. Thanks for the compliments though. I've got a thread in this section somewhere that I update occasionally, I'll try to post some updated pictures so you can see what it looks like now. I've learned a lot since I got started, mostly from the folks on the planted tank.

Planning on a minor (major?) rescape maybe this weekend too!

Ryan


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

They are in there but after 8 hours of mayhem they were hiding behind driftwood Here is a link to TFH forums where I have pictures of each phase different scape. I am new to discus and plants. Been at it for about 4 months...http://forums.tfhmagazine.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=25613

Hey bowels I too would like to see some pix. post that link!:thumbsup:


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Bowles42 said:


> @ gabriella The picture in my profile is ages old lol. Thanks for the compliments though. I've got a thread in this section somewhere that I update occasionally, I'll try to post some updated pictures so you can see what it looks like now. I've learned a lot since I got started, mostly from the folks on the planted tank.
> 
> Planning on a minor (major?) rescape maybe this weekend too!
> 
> Ryan


Hi Ryan,

Old or up-to-date, that picture still looks great. I figured it out right away though since you had more fish in it than you described in your post but other than fish I would have expected the tank to look the same. If you changed it around, rescaped it or it simply changed over the time, please don't hesitate to post that link.

I don't know about you guys, but every picture I see on this forum is unique therefore a great source of inspiration.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> They are in there but after 8 hours of mayhem they were hiding behind driftwood Here is a link to TFH forums where I have pictures of each phase different scape. I am new to discus and plants. Been at it for about 4 months...http://forums.tfhmagazine.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=25613
> 
> Hey bowels I too would like to see some pix. post that link!:thumbsup:


LOL, if they had spoken, the fish would have told you to be quiet, too. After 8 hours no wonder they were hiding. The pictures look amazing, I really like your fish, the multitude of colors that blends nicely with the environment. Though 4 months into Discus doesn't seem that awfully long time, I have to admit you're doing a pretty good job. I would have never guessed that you just started a little while ago. What kind of lights do you have? It looks very similar to what I've ordered.


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

Im running T5HO geismann aqua floras and some T5HO 67k life glo bulbs. Then I have 4 10k t8s.

I read a ton and educate myself the best I can. We will see what time tells me!!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Should I feed my Angels baby brine shrimp?*

cyberhog05, what do you feed your fish with? Probably beef heart is a regular entree, but what else?

I bought brine shrimp eggs because I read that they are full of protein and nutrients that would help baby fish grow. I'm not sure about their age hence the question: should I feed my Angel fish with hatched brine shrimps? Or does that menu apply for kids 12 and under only? You know what I mean...

I found this website where this guy is hatching brine shrimp eggs using a square dish rather than a cone-shaped device. He says that hatching requires warm salty water and air pump, so far similar to a cone, but he leaves the eggs alone for a day. The next day (about 22024 hours later) most of the eggs will be hatched, depending on the hatching rate, and then he places a lamp to one corner of the dish with a very bright bulb in it. In about 5 to 10 minutes the shrimp will swim, crawl, walk, hop into the lit corner and they can be sniffed up with a syringe and fed to the fish. He doesn't rinse his shrimp at all but says that no egg shells will be present in the syringe either.

So what do you guys say? Should I feed some shrimp to my Angels or should I toss the eggs into the garbage and write it off as bad purchase?


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

I feed beef heart in the morning and throughout the day I will feed one or more of the following. frozen blood worms, live black worms, mysis shrimp, mosquito larvae, frozen brine shrimp with spirulina, and I going to get them started on Ocean nutrition prime reef flakes. Variety is the spice of life!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> I feed beef heart in the morning and throughout the day I will feed one or more of the following. frozen blood worms, live black worms, mysis shrimp, mosquito larvae, frozen brine shrimp with spirulina, and I going to get them started on Ocean nutrition prime reef flakes. Variety is the spice of life!


A-ha! Frozen brine shrimp versus live ones. So you wouldn't recommend me feeding them live baby brine shrimp, right? Live black warms sound delicious , but how do get them? Do you buy them or DIY? Also, I haven't even thought about mosquito larvae but reef flakes??

_________________________________
DISCUS FOOD LIST

[x] Frozen beef heart is good for them.
[x] Get frozen blood worms.
[ ] Buy mysis and frozen brine shrimp.
[ ] Mosquito larvae is a must.
[ ] Don't forget about live black worms either.
[ ] Get used to the idea of reef flakes and buy some.
________________________________

Thank you very much for that piece of information. Though Discus aren't here yet, I like to make plans in advance.

Am I bothering you with all these silly questions? I'm sure I must be stepping on someone's nerves by now. 'Oh, no! Not her again! I thought I've explained everything already!'


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

Dont let the name reef flakes fool ya. It is just a very good mix of proteins, fats etc. I did some research on Simply Discus forums and Ocean Nutrition flakes sound like they are very good foods. The Ocean Nutrition Discus flakes are excellent as well. I have also recently came across this vendor. His flake food seems to be nearly as good as the Ocean Nutrition line and WAYYYY cheaper. I just ordered some his flake and some pellets for my fiances Oscars. I got roughly 3lbs of foods for 30 bucks shipped.http://www.angelsplus.com/index.htm 
Another popular way to feed would be making your own food mixes here is an example of one of the members from Simplys recipe. http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=69130


As far as live brine shrimp I am under the impression that most use it for fry. But with discus comes the inevitable spawning. I have a pair in my tank that lays eggs regularly but wont take care of them once they hatch. So I to bought brine shrimp eggs for when I do decide to remove the pair I am closer to being ready to feed the fry. So keep those eggs!

You can get California black worms on aquabid or here is another good source
http://aquaticfoods.com/worms.html

Enjoy the reading!:thumbsup:


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Here's the link to my journal. Haven't updated since January though, might get to an update next week.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals-photo-album/65610-265g-discus-new-pics-1-25-a.html


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## timme278 (Jan 1, 2009)

gabriella said:


> I wish that tank belonged to me, but it's actually cyberhog05's and the picture was posted on my request. My tank doesn't look that good (yet!) but I'm trying and will hopefully get there very soon.


opps. i realy should read the info instead of just looking at pics


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

timme278 said:


> opps. i realy should read the info instead of just looking at pics


I'm glad to promote other user's aquariums, too, which might be an inspiration for all of us. In fact, I usually do the same thing like you do. I check out a journal because of the pictures mainly. I know I should stop doing it and read through the valuable info but that's just plain boredom, isn't it? 'Let me see your results, your tank and tools that you begun with, and I'll decide for myself if I can do it, too', right? Actually, I just finished reading a book about graphic user interfaces (GUI if you wish) that states that users don't read instructions and they hardly read anything at all. It doesn't mean that we are morons, in contrary, we know what we are looking for and tend to screen through a bunch of other info as fast as we can. Before and after pictures are the best! Just like reading a book about nutrition plans and weight loss and you see all these people, before and after, whatever they do in between and their results.

Best of all is the fact that you can achieve the 'after' look in whichever tank, and the piece of information is free.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Bowles42 said:


> Here's the link to my journal. Haven't updated since January though, might get to an update next week.
> 
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals-photo-album/65610-265g-discus-new-pics-1-25-a.html


Hey, do you want to plant and arrange my tank, too? 'Cause yours looks awesome! What a transformation compared with that old picture from your profile.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Thanks for the compliment. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I guess. I'm not very happy with the way the tank is looking right now, but it is such a chore to rescape a tank that size. I might get into it this weekend or next. 

It's also a challenge to find plants that will thrive in the same environment as discus. I recently pulled the flame moss and rotala indica, I had them both in there for a couple months and they were struggling. Crypts seem to do fine though, mine are monsters.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*About the lights*

UPS delivered the lights on Thursday. I opened the package in the evening and noticed that the fixture was missing a small piece of plastic, on the left side, right by the switches. I assembled it though, just to give the bulbs a try and I like the lights very much. First thing, I called the manufacturer who promised to send me a replacement since that plastic part pops out and can be easily changed.

The lights do make a difference! All the plants that I got from the swap meet are in the tank, mainly to survive till I get the driftwood and then I can arrange them as I wish. 

I did a water change today and accidentally poured some between the glass and background paper; that's what the large white spot on the left is. It'll be gone by tomorrow, no big deal.

And finally, I had to take a pic of the non-planted tank related item too, which happens to be in there. I got it from my friends and they insisted that it's an absolute must! Now here's a message for everyone out there, below and above the Stratosphere, if you currently don't have a half-blinded, pirate-looking, greenish skeleton that sails an invisible boat (I haven't introduced him to Mr AirPump yet), you better hurry and get one. In case you haven't heard about it yet, THIS is the new trend and absolute must in a plated tank


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Am I ready for Tetras?*

Water has been tested one week ago and it's due again tomorrow. Depending on the nitrite level, I might get a dozen of Cardinal or Neon Tetras. I like the Black Tetras, too. Basically, you can't show me a fish that I wouldn't like. If it was ugly, I would feel sorry for it but still like it 

Anyhow, I'm full of "hopes" now: I hope the water will be okay, I hope I can put more fish into the tank, I hope they'll all survive, I hope I'll get the driftwood soon, I hope I can start arranging both wood and plants to look their best. And I hope I'll find more eggs than my friends will. Happy Easter everyone! :bounce:


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## Tamelesstgr (Jan 11, 2008)

Maybe a "Pirates of the Caribbean" theme tank is in order? Looking good, what kind of driftwood did you pick up? I'm guilty of the never saw a plant I didn't like, I'm much more picky about my fish.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Tamelesstgr said:


> Maybe a "Pirates of the Caribbean" theme tank is in order? Looking good, what kind of driftwood did you pick up? I'm guilty of the never saw a plant I didn't like, I'm much more picky about my fish.


If you take a look at the 2nd and 3rd picture, there are two pieces of wood floating, which I picked up at Kankakee. I wasn't really satisfied with the other pieces I got, so I PMed Badcopnofishtank and asked for help. He promised to put a package together and get back to me as soon as it's ready. Now I'm waiting for reply.

The problem is that those 2 pieces have been floating in the tank for more than 2 weeks now, without sinking. I've boiled one of them and soaked the other one for a day without luck. Maybe it'd just be a matter of time, but Badcopnofishtank's packages look very attractive. And I think your driftwood comes from the same supplier, doesn't it? 

By the way, you were right about the plants: some will end up being sold and others will be bought instead. I'd like a different setup now than the one I had in mind when I bought these plants.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*About the lights, again*

Well, I've received the replacement for the broken plastic part on the fixture yesterday (extremely fast shipping by the way) and changed it. Everything is okay with the part. Meanwhile I've noticed that both the Anubias and Swords started to grow baby leaves. That means they like it in the tank, right?

By the way, I'm making a traditional fish soup today. No, not out of the Angels in case you were wondering. It's my father's not-so-secret recipe. You have to cook parts of the fish with onions in the pressure cooker for a long, long, looooong time and that makes the whole house stink. That's why I make this soup 3 times a year only...


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## Tamelesstgr (Jan 11, 2008)

My driftwood came from Jake (badcopnofishtank) It took maybe a week for mine to sink. Some woods may take a long long time to become waterlogged and sink. Make sure you soak the manzanita for at least a week in like a bucket or tub if you have one large enough. Then boil it. I am having some fungus come back every few weeks, I have had to take the pieces out and re scrub them. I added a pleco and he seems to like eating it though.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Tamelesstgr said:


> My driftwood came from Jake (badcopnofishtank) It took maybe a week for mine to sink. Some woods may take a long long time to become waterlogged and sink. Make sure you soak the manzanita for at least a week in like a bucket or tub if you have one large enough. Then boil it. I am having some fungus come back every few weeks, I have had to take the pieces out and re scrub them. I added a pleco and he seems to like eating it though.


I've been to the LFS today and had my water tested. Unfortunately the nitrite was very "purple" again, which meant that I couldn't bring home any fish. All I have in the tank are 8 Angels and the water didn't seem to improve since I last tested (one week ago).

I was a bit disappointed because I've seen these beautiful tetras and plecos that I decided to add to the tank long time ago. On the way home I picked up a magnetic glass cleaner and scared the heck out of the Angels. I started noticing some brown algae growing on the glass but not anymore  Unfortunately, the algae wouldn't spread on the glass only but gravel, rocks and some of the plants, too. I really have to get some algae eaters in there but I'm afraid of doing more harm than good to the water itself.

This is so confusing :help: the LFS lady told me that my 40% water change was too much and I pretty much threw out most of the good bacteria. I don't understand this. I was told to change the water weekly at the beginning, and she told me herself that 40 to 50% is a good amount. What am I doing wrong?

Clearly I'm not ready for more fish but what should I do about the algae? I'd really like to add some cleaning fish to the tank since the Angels seem to be little piggies and waste a lot of food that sinks to the bottom.


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## cyberhog05 (Jan 5, 2009)

the brown algae are diatoms. It will go away after your tank gets more established. Here is a link that explains cycling your tank.

http://www.rexgrigg.com/cycle.htm


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

cyberhog05 said:


> the brown algae are diatoms. It will go away after your tank gets more established. Here is a link that explains cycling your tank.
> 
> http://www.rexgrigg.com/cycle.htm


Thanks for the article, I read it, it's interesting to find out that a medium to heavily planted tank with a large load of fish might cycle a tank faster. Strangely, the article doesn't mention any water changes. I guess I'll wait another week and test the water again.


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## Tamelesstgr (Jan 11, 2008)

The bacteria is mostly building up in the filter. You need to do water changes to bring the bad levels in the water down, that is the only way really. Unless you want to stick a whole mess of fast growing plants in there to use up the nitrites.

Brown Diatom algae is common and will clear up, and it's easy to clean too. When I started my 20 I didn't have any b/c I used water and filter media from my other tank. No water spikes or algae after a month. That's a benefit of using an existing tank to start a new one.

Don't worry, I learned all this for the first time two years ago. I wouldn't add anymore fish.

What type of filter are you using again?


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Tamelesstgr said:


> The bacteria is mostly building up in the filter. You need to do water changes to bring the bad levels in the water down, that is the only way really. Unless you want to stick a whole mess of fast growing plants in there to use up the nitrites.
> 
> Brown Diatom algae is common and will clear up, and it's easy to clean too. When I started my 20 I didn't have any b/c I used water and filter media from my other tank. No water spikes or algae after a month. That's a benefit of using an existing tank to start a new one.
> 
> ...


There's an Eheim 2217 canister and an Emperor 400 power filter in the tank. What worries me about the algae most is that it started to grow everywhere since I put up the new lights. From the glass it's easy to wipe it off but I shouldn't clean the gravel this week (LFS lady told me not to) and the white sand is completely covered with brown stuff.

Tonight I have spotted an intruder in the tank. On one of the floating pieces of driftwood, more specifically. It's a tiny trumpet snail that I have no idea how it got into the aquarium. I've noticed it while feeding the fish (thank god they were busy eating and didn't bother the little fella). I don't know how it got in there but it's more than welcome to stay


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

gabriella said:


> There's an Eheim 2217 canister and an Emperor 400 power filter in the tank. What worries me about the algae most is that it started to grow everywhere since I put up the new lights. From the glass it's easy to wipe it off but I shouldn't clean the gravel this week (LFS lady told me not to) and the white sand is completely covered with brown stuff.
> 
> Tonight I have spotted an intruder in the tank. On one of the floating pieces of driftwood, more specifically. It's a tiny trumpet snail that I have no idea how it got into the aquarium. I've noticed it while feeding the fish (thank god they were busy eating and didn't bother the little fella). I don't know how it got in there but it's more than welcome to stay


The brown algae is just diatoms. It should go away soon. It's just starting out. You don't need to worry about the mts. They're tough lil' buggers!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

clwatkins10 said:


> The brown algae is just diatoms. It should go away soon. It's just starting out. You don't need to worry about the mts. They're tough lil' buggers!


Actually I'm very happy that this tiny snail made it into the tank, but I'd be curious to find out how he did it though. The only thing I've changed within the last week was the diet, added dried brine shrimp and some other kind of shrimp, that the Angels keep playing with. I'm planning to get him buddies to help cleaning up that algae, plus they look cool in a tank.


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## Tamelesstgr (Jan 11, 2008)

He's a stow-a-way from the plants you bought at the swap meet most likely. I see a few every time I get new plants. Personally I do not like snails.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Tamelesstgr said:


> He's a stow-a-way from the plants you bought at the swap meet most likely. I see a few every time I get new plants. Personally I do not like snails.


Yes, I agree, I don't like them either although the garlic butter sauce with parsley and black pepper sounds good (French escargot) 

But seriously, I'm okay with snails, they are harmless creatures and some of them very beautiful in my opinion.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Disaster*

Algae, algae, algae. Didn't change the water today, fed the Angels once with very small amount of blood worms and pellets and cleaned the glass with that floating magnetic algae scraper. The water itself is very clean though but this brown stuff is everywhere. I detected the second snail last night and just ordered a load of MTS from Sharon, a forum member.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Mts*

MTS has arrived today and after a quick rinse I added them to the tank. I hope they have a big appetite and will clean up the diatoms.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Test Kit*

Got a freshwater test kit today and gave it a try. Colors on the picture are a bit different than in reality. Anyhow, I did 5 tests: pH, higher pH (because the regular pH was off the chart), ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. The ammonia and nitrite levels are 0 (light yellow, light blue), the nitrate is closer to 5 than 10 on the scale (light orange), and the pH almost hit 8 (red). I haven't got the driftwood yet; once that's in the tank, I figure the pH will be much lower.

To sum it up, I'm pretty satisfied with today's results! It means that the aquarium is almost fully cycled (I'll consider it cycled once the diatoms are gone). I also wanted to do a major water change and scrubbing off that awfully lot of brown algae today but one thing led to another and didn't have time to do it. Perhaps tomorrow.

While in the store, I picked up 3 kinds of foods for the Angels. Not knowing (obviously) anything about the right ingredients that should make up a balanced diet, I found myself reading all kinds of labels, and I thought, hmm... 5% dried shrimp must be a good amount. They have these color enhancer flakes everywhere now: 'Buy the new color enhancer flakes that will enhance the colors of your fish that you've been feeding with different brand of color enhancers...'. Honestly, to me the Angels are the ultimate test, if they eat it before it sinks to the bottom, that's the one!

I must have been staring at the Phantom catfish and different Tetras for quite a while (sigh!) because two staff members asked me if I needed anything. But I didn't buy any fish. Yet


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## Tamelesstgr (Jan 11, 2008)

Glad to hear the tank is coming along!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Today I added 6 Neon Tetras and 3 Swordtails (1 male, 2 females) after I changed the water and did a big cleaning. Scrubbing off the brown algae wasn't fun at all especially from the plants. I also got a gravel vacuum and cleaned the filters, too.

At the LFS they have live blood worms. I bought a 'shot' of them. Since I fed the fish in the morning, I gave them just a sample of the worms and they started fighting over them.

I've also noticed that the Angels started following the new fish. Not so much the Neons, because they schooled up and moved around with confidence, but the Swordtails. No attacks yet but I'll definitely keep an eye on the two most aggressive Angels, nicknamed Superman (because of its size) and El Gordo (fat) by my friends. By the way, Superman is a girl, so it should be changed to Wonderwoman, or something...


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Tamelesstgr said:


> Glad to hear the tank is coming along!


Thanks, I'm happy too. The driftwood is on its way, good news. Meanwhile I found a used RO unit on sale. Either that or CO2. But I'd rather say both, one step at a time.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*He's the man! I mean, he's the breeder!*

Couple of days ago I spoke with the Discus breeder, who invited me to check his hatchery / show room out. We couldn't set up an appointment yet because of our availability. If everything goes right I might end up with Discus in the tank in 2-3 weeks. The only thing that is stopping me right now is the pH level. It's really high but hope the driftwood will naturally and instantly lower it.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*More fish*

Yesterday I got more fish :hihi:

I doubled the number of neons, 12, plus 3 phantom and 3 head and tail light tetras. Everybody is doing fine, eating well. Though small fish, I was expecting the water to be messed up. I tested it tonight, both ammonia and nitrite were 0, nitrate was between 0 and 5. All good news.

Current fish stock:

8 Angels
12 Neon T.
3 Phantom T.
3 Red and tail Light T.
3 Red Swordtails


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*1 red swordtail - RIP*

A few days ago one of the swordtails died  I couldn't tell what had caused its death; I tested the water but ammonia, nitrite and nitrate were all 0; every fish ate the same food. This fish looked very healthy, no other pal was chasing or disturbing it. It's a complete mystery how it died.

Anyhow, the others are doing fine and I'm seeing some real algae (not diatoms) has started to develop. Some of it is on the plants, forming thin hair-like strings, but the glass turns green, too, every 2 to 3 days. Is there any way I could get rid of those without killing the plants or fish?


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

It's been a while since my last posting, but I've been busy these weeks. It certainly doesn't mean that I neglected my fish tank and its inhabitants. Long story short: I got the driftwood, soaked it, placed it in the tank and rearranged the plants a bit. I don't really like how I positioned the wood that's why I won't post any pictures but redo the whole thing next week.

All the fish are healthy and growing! I got rid of a couple of plants that I could tell they didn't really like this environment. Every time I changed the water, I would trim their dead parts, so eventually there was almost nothing to be trimmed... Anyhow, I kept the ones that are doing well, the Anubias and Java Fern (which has lots of baby leaves).

About the snails. It was a very good decision to introduce MTS into the tank. I have minimal algae buildup, which is constantly being eaten. All plants look very clean. Favorite scene: after the gravel is being vacuumed and the water changed (I usually do 50-60% weekly for now), most of the snails start climbing up the sides of the tank. There's so many of them as they race to the top and then fall back down to the bottom. I've also noticed how these little snails pick up the leftover food on the bottom that my piggy fish wouldn't eat.

I also got rid of the rocks, for now at least. I still would like to put the lace and white rocks back into the tank but haven't quite figured out how. 

Once I'm ready, I'll upload some pics to see what others have to say about it.


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

I just read through your entire thread and I must say you sound like I did when I jumped into this planted tank thing lol! One little click of the mouse and it was over. I actually used to keep fish when I was younger but I digress, it seems you have been pretty lucky 
with fish loss compared to being a newbie fish keeper. Do your self a big favor, invest in a quarantine/hospital tank, there is nothing worse than introducing a sick fish into a tank like you have there. I once lost a whole stocked tank due to neon tetra disease and it's no fun.
I'm surprised no one suggested Ammano shrimp for the cleanup crew, these shrimp are awesome, they like to eat algae and look really cool to boot. 
Your tank is looking real nice and I love the stand! 
Good luck with everything!!! just remember impulse buy's are usually a bad thing with this hobby take your time and research.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

mott said:


> I just read through your entire thread and I must say you sound like I did when I jumped into this planted tank thing lol! One little click of the mouse and it was over. I actually used to keep fish when I was younger but I digress, it seems you have been pretty lucky
> with fish loss compared to being a newbie fish keeper. Do your self a big favor, invest in a quarantine/hospital tank, there is nothing worse than introducing a sick fish into a tank like you have there. I once lost a whole stocked tank due to neon tetra disease and it's no fun.
> I'm surprised no one suggested Ammano shrimp for the cleanup crew, these shrimp are awesome, they like to eat algae and look really cool to boot.
> Your tank is looking real nice and I love the stand!
> Good luck with everything!!! just remember impulse buy's are usually a bad thing with this hobby take your time and research.


Thanks for reading the whole thing through! There'll be new pics next week once I finish arranging the driftwood and rocks in the tank. When one of the Swordtails died I got a little scared too because it was nothing wrong with it, ate well the previous day, was moving around a lot, etc. Not like one of the first Angels that looked sick as soon as I put it into the tank. Luckily no other fish has died since, and it's been well over a month now. The quarantine tank is a very good idea, and I'm on it, trust me, it's just so many other things going on right now that I can't keep up with everything. This doesn't mean that I don't take care of my fish or tank, in the opposite, I tend to overfeed poor Angels. I can't help it, they keep following me! Even with their eyes 

Anyhow, the bad news is that I still don't have the CO2 equipment and RO unit. Plus the quarantine tank. Good news: I didn't introduce any other fish since the last one passed away, but I was just wondering how long do fish live? I mean, I got the Swordtails and Tetras from LFS but I don't know for how long they've been there. These are all adults but I can't tell their age. Is it possible that they may die simply because nothing and no one lives forever? How can you tell if a fish is old? Should I look for wrinkles?

And yes, I too like the stand. I know I'm going to sound like one of those fashionistas with a designer dog in their purse, but I think the stand's color compliments the living room furniture and decor, and the aquarium itself looks great, better than an expensive piece of art, though the expensive part is disputable.

As for the shrimp, I read somewhere that they will be eaten by Angels and Discus once these fish get big enough. True, that's what they told me about the Neon Tetras at the LFS, too, but I still went ahead and bought a dozen of them. Not one had been chased or eaten since. So I don't know what to say about shrimp. I never had any before, and the snails are doing a pretty good job right now. Do you have any Ammano shrimp in your tank?

Perhaps it's beginner's luck that 'only' 2 fish died so far but I definitely wouldn't want to experiment with Discus. That's why I'm still waiting for the water conditions to be excellent (lower pH) and to read as much as I can about Discus before getting them.


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

I have Ammano shrimp but no Angels so I couldn't tell you if they do eat them.

Once you get your Co2 going, that should bring your Ph down. Good luck with the Discus, I know they are tough to keep from what I read.

What are your parameters like now? Do you really need Ro?


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

mott said:


> I have Ammano shrimp but no Angels so I couldn't tell you if they do eat them.
> 
> Once you get your Co2 going, that should bring your Ph down. Good luck with the Discus, I know they are tough to keep from what I read.
> 
> What are your parameters like now? Do you really need Ro?


I know that Angels would eat anything that fits in their mouth. I've seen one biting on a snail once but it spit it out, probably wasn't very tasty. They do 'attack' the live blood worms though, so I wouldn't be surprised if they did the same with shrimp.

I tested the water in the morning, the pH is between 7.2 and 7.4, my tap water pH is 7.4. The ammonia, nitrite, nitrate are all zeros and 50% water change is due tomorrow. I didn't have time to fix the driftwood yet, hence no pics, but perhaps tomorrow.

The CO2 has many purposes: it should deal with that little amount of algae that I currently have and boost plant growth. The lights are pretty good, at least that's what I've been told, when everything is on there's 2 x 55w + 2 x 65w = 240w for 125g, which is a shy 2 WPG.

I had (and still have) way too many trumpet snails and gave away some on Monday to a guy who has Discus but he told me that he doesn't bother either putting RO water in the tank or having CO2 equipment. His Discus still survive, they eat well (beef heart) but every now and then they get sick and the medication wipes all the snails out (therefore he needed new ones). Well, I could go his way, I mean throwing Discus in there is a no-brainer. He says he has had Discus for 6 years and usually 3-4 survived in every new batch of 10. Now that number is very low for me.

I'll have those pictures in a day or two.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*As of June 28th*

Today is 'water change' day. Hooray! As you can see, all MTS survived and they keep multiplying like crazy. Every now and then a giant one shows up... The fish were pretty shy today. Anyhow, this is the new scape. Opinions, criticism is more than welcome.


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## Bmac (May 24, 2009)

New scape looks very good! I like it!


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## Axelrodi202 (Jul 29, 2008)

That is some nice driftwood! But I think you should attach some moss to it.


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Thank you!*



Bmac said:


> New scape looks very good! I like it!





Axelrodi202 said:


> That is some nice driftwood! But I think you should attach some moss to it.


Thanks! Though I spent quite some time figuring out how the driftwood should be placed, I think it worth it. When I received the wood I built a very nice "tree" in the middle of the living room carpet. Then I soaked the branches but, once in the tank, I couldn't make it stay and look exactly the way it previously did on the carpet. Moss is a very good idea, and I changed my mind about the rocks. I don't think I'll put any of them back into the tank, or at least not for now.

Since I added more black gravel and did a 100% water change, the water was very cloudy for one day. I took the fish out and kept them in a bucket till I was done. When they got their home back, I bet they thought it was a different tank or something. They kept swimming back and forth for hours or rather exploring every inch of it.

Discus are almost here. Working on it...


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

*Baby on board!*

:fish:Something incredible happened last night.

As I mentioned before, there are way too many MT snails in the tank. I shipped 40 of them to Texas on Monday, and amazingly they all survived the long trip in spite of the triple digit temperature. Last night I turned off the lights a little earlier than usual because I wanted to check how many is that "many" exactly, and the perfect way to catch a glimpse of all existing snails in the tank is by suddenly turning the lights on in the middle of the night.

As I was checking the snails out (and telling myself that I need to get rid of more), I've noticed a tiny (about half inch) red baby Swordstail. She (I decided it was a girl) wasn't moving until I started waving at my roommates, and then hid between the Java Fern leaves.

I haven't yet seen her today, but I really hope that none of the Angels will develop a taste for her. Next time I'll have my camera ready, perhaps I'll be able to snap a shot.

Such wonderful, wonderful news! I mean everybody knows that most fish will have babies at some point, but it's really incredible when it does happen.


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

The DW looks awesome! Congrats on the fry, it's always exciting when fish breed in the home!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

Ta-da!


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## gabriella (Mar 25, 2009)

mott said:


> The DW looks awesome! Congrats on the fry, it's always exciting when fish breed in the home!


Yes, it is exciting. I took a picture of her last night; I wish there were more. Happy 4th of July!


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