# why are the leaves curling up and growing deformed leaves?



## tropicana (Dec 15, 2008)

could the cause be over fertilizing? or underfertilizing? anyone know? leaves are kinda turning brownish/reddish or something but i think thats normal i geuss.. plant is i think the regular hygro


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Sounds like to much light.

Need more info:

How much light and how close to water is it?
Tank size?
C02 injection?
Nutrients dosed?

etc.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

tropicana said:


> could the cause be over fertilizing? or underfertilizing? anyone know? leaves are kinda turning brownish/reddish or something but i think thats normal i geuss.. plant is i think the regular hygro


This is most commonly caused by the most limiting nutrient in aquatic systems: CO2.

Not "nutrients", there is not direct relationship with overfertilizing any nutrient we commonly add and deform growth in any species(well, out of say 300-400 species tried, not found one yet over a pretty wide range).

You can get stunted tips from running out or too low on some nutrients.
But given that Carbon is 40-45% of the plant's biomass and how it makes new tissue, you will see dramatic affects if it's in short supply.

NO3, Fe, PO4 etc, do not change fast, CO2 does, particularly with higher light intensities.

Always start with hoiw much light you have, then go to CO2, then nutrients.
You can rule out nutrients easy: do a large water change and dose. That's simple. Lights, well, you never mentioned anything there.

Then if you have a decent amount on the lower side of light, then you will only need to work with CO2.

Hygro is a very weedy plant and adding CO2 speeds up growth dramatically(20X vs non CO2 tanks with the exact same nutrients in both treatments). CO2 is also the hardest thing to measure well in planted tanks and causes the most issues.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## DarioDario (Nov 8, 2008)

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquarium-pictures/browseimages.php?c=12&userid=&t=


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## tropicana (Dec 15, 2008)

hmm kind of looks like this one http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquarium-pictures/showimage.php?i=2759&original=1&c=12
but with yellowish leaves..

this is a 25gal tall with 2x24w t5ho hagen lighting system... not on brackets, i need more light to grow my carpet of glosso..

i am dosing EI, diy co2, two 2litre bottles, 3 smaller bottles 500ml.. tryna get most co2 into this tank as possible... do you guys think i need pressurized co2?


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## JDowns (Mar 6, 2008)

DarioDario said:


> http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquarium-pictures/browseimages.php?c=12&userid=&t=


I'm not sure how much faith I would put into that. 

What type of sampling was done to determine the defeciency? At what levels are those nutrients deficient and how were the levels detected?

For those charts they gather their "knowledge", are those based on aquatic or terrestrial plant studies?.


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## DarioDario (Nov 8, 2008)

JDowns said:


> I'm not sure how much faith I would put into that.
> 
> What type of sampling was done to determine the defeciency? At what levels are those nutrients deficient and how were the levels detected?
> 
> For those charts they gather their "knowledge", are those based on aquatic or terrestrial plant studies?.



its merely a place to start because I challenge you to find a website that has pics of deficiency's with description


but I suppose if you have the free time to run such test I await your results


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## JDowns (Mar 6, 2008)

DarioDario said:


> its merely a place to start because I challenge you to find a website that has pics of deficiency's with description
> 
> 
> but I suppose if you have the free time to run such test I await your results


You miss the point.

How were the deficiencies isolated in those photos? Tissue sampling? Controlled water parameters? Where's the photos of the starting healthy specimen. Was light and CO2 measured? Just simple questions. 

What happens if you crank down CO2 to sub optimal levels with high light. Can you replicate some of those deficiencies with poor CO2?

Can some nutrients mask distress of another nutrient.

So is your starting point a good starting point. Will the hobbyiest now chase a deficiency from a false standing, to never reach his endpoint.


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## tropicana (Dec 15, 2008)

ok guys little update, i noticed its only the top of the plants that are turnin yellowish and deformed leaves.. the lower partsof the plants are fine..

now what i think the problem could be, over fertilizing? i did overfertilize the other day but could over fertilizing do this?

co2 has been changed not to long ago but it was changed right away so maybe it could be that? but co2 levels should be fine now.. so shouldnt the plant be fine or will it always be deformed..

tank also looks like bacteria bloom since its realy cloudy and i did clean the filter recently

maybe ill get a pic up later


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