# Do I really need a bubble counter?



## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

If you have a good 2 stage regulator and a decent metering valve, and take some time.. a bubble counter is unnecessary.. Now good check valves on the other hand.........


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## 691175002 (Apr 28, 2009)

Blowing through a check valve is not a requirement. Line pressure in a low pressure CO2 setup is generally at least 10PSI.

For reference, a party balloon is at about 0.5PSI.

Even if it was impossible for a human to blow through the check valve, it would be unlikely to pose any problem for CO2.


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## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

In short, use the first one in-line.

Do you need a bubble counter? Not really, but it can be a useful tool, depending on your set up and if you are just starting out with co2.

It's primary use is to see at a glance if co2 is actually coming out of the needle valve without going through the hassle of sticking the co2 line into water (or your mouth or nose ).

It could be useful to check if your rate is changing over time (floating needle valve, debris, WP changing).

On the minus side, the JBJ style is a PITA - leaking, check valve breaking, plastic cracking, extra connectiins).

They can also give you a false sense if security: the rate is the same but your fish is dead (surface agitation, temperature, plant mass change).

They are also a poor tool for setting your rate: co2 concentrations depend on many other factors, like WP, and the number of bubbles per minute is a meaningless number outside of your tank. In larger tanks you do not have bubbles, you have a stream.

Don't worry about not being able to blow through your check valve - that usually requires more pressure then human lungs can generate.

A mixed blessing. A specialized tool for specific tasks, in knowledgeable hands.

v3


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## jakeowen (Apr 12, 2014)

Thanks guys, I am going to use the glass set up. I guess I am going to be busy tonight. 

I have been wanting to put co2 on my tank for years. I am very excited about this. I'll report back and let you know how it goes.


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## gus6464 (Dec 19, 2011)

Also if you are looking for inline check valves you can't beat mcmaster-carr. They are very cheap and very high quality. Much better than the aquarium marketed ones that you find on [Ebay Link Removed]


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## evaninspace (Feb 19, 2014)

I just set up my first pressurized system 2-3 months ago. I'm running a single stage into a cerges reactor, a quality needle valve and a drop checker. My drop checker is a cheap one off ebay with a diy solution that took no time at all to make. 

I just started out with the valve tightened up and gradually loosened it. I can hear CO2 enter the reactor if I listen closely. I also get random bubbles popping out of the filter into the aquarium. At that point I know at the very least the co2 is flowing into the tank. 

I've slowly upped the flow of CO2 and the drop checker is a nice color. I didn't need to count the bubbles.

There is a flip size to that logic though...a bubble counter could let you know if you are not diffusing the co2 well enough. My cerges is really good at dissolving the co2 so I have no sign of co2 entering my tank save random bubbles that make it through the reactor. If you are tweaking your diffusal methods then a bubble counter could let you know (combined with a drop checker) how well you are accomplishing this.


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## jakeowen (Apr 12, 2014)

Hey again,
I have a couple of questions, with the glass bubble counter I am using, I am not sure of the proper direction of flow. there is an insert inside of it, is that end the intake or output? I hope I am explaining this clearly enough.

Also what is to keep the water from spilling out of it?

Do I need to locate the check valve below it - between the counter and the regulator?

Thanks for all your help so far.

Bump:


gus6464 said:


> Also if you are looking for inline check valves you can't beat mcmaster-carr. They are very cheap and very high quality. Much better than the aquarium marketed ones that you find on [Ebay Link Removed]


is this the one?

http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-check-valves/=t00ajz


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## gus6464 (Dec 19, 2011)

jakeowen said:


> Hey again,
> I have a couple of questions, with the glass bubble counter I am using, I am not sure of the proper direction of flow. there is an insert inside of it, is that end the intake or output? I hope I am explaining this clearly enough.
> 
> Also what is to keep the water from spilling out of it?
> ...


http://www.mcmaster.com/#7757k41/=t014w2


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

I believe that little red thing in the glass is actually a really simple check valve. It should go before the bubble counter. Just looking online, I am thinking that the direction and setup should be if you flipped you picture upside down, the top being the inlet, for the check valve, then bottom being the outlet, seems like everything would be in the right order.

That said, I have no idea if that check valve is reliable so if you add another one, you could just ditch the glass one. 


One other thing, though the brass one is designed to be mounted on the regulator, you could make it inline as well. I have thought about doing it with mine, mounting it with some brackets to the inside of my stand so I can see it better. You need a 1/8NPT fitting (I believe) with the correct nipple size, easy to find. Just saying, it doesn't have to go on the regulator, though many don't like that style of bubble counter. Mine has worked fine but I didn't get mine off eBay so it may or may not be the same as the ones people don't like, same design for sure.


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