# Shrimp Frustration. Consistent death every few days.



## Aquatic Athlete (Oct 7, 2017)

Every few days i come home to a single dead shrimp. never multiple deaths on the same day.

29 gallon.
45g HOB filter with sponge over intake.
30" Finnex Planted 24/7 SE on max for 14 hour photo period
Moderate- heavily planted. Plants are growing well.
over the last 2-3 weeks, absolutely no ammonia, nitrites or nitrate issues.

You can see various microorganisms in the water. Cyclops and who knows what else can be occasionally seen flittering around the tank.
Original inhabitants: 
7 Orange Neocaridina shrimp.
6 Otocinclus cats

About a week goes by, no shrimp deaths. 

1 shrimp died.

About 5 days later, another death. 

About a week goes by, and no deaths and no intolerable water chem changes. 

A few days later, i buy 2 more orange neos. 1 male, 1 berried female. I slow drip acclimate them over 2 hours. They area both eating and active.

Another week goes by and i find 1 dead, looks like he crawled into a crevice and got stuck.. or went there to die... couldn't get him, he was in a tiny tunnel he found that went way down into the substrate. I buried him there, its under some plants so i'm sure it'll be used.. (can one shrimp decomposing under the soil be dangerous in such a high water volume with no negative test readings?) One of the original...

2 days later, ( this morning. I get up, count the shrimp. I see all 6 of them, including the berried shrimp, everyone is fine. They are grazing. its been a few days since feeding, i feed the entire tank, 2 Hikari crab cuisine pellets. ) I leave for 5 hours and fine 1 dead. 

What the heck is happening? Why not a mass die off? why 1 every now and then. All deaths have been from the original 7 which were a semi-painted grade of orange, bought from petco as "Orange Bee " shrimp. Website said Neocaridina and so did the online community.

My water quality as of last night:

Ammonia 0ppm
Nitrites: 0ppm
Nitrates: 0ppm
Water temp 77F
dKH 5
dGH 5
PH 6.9-7.0

No co2 dosing 

Any suggestions?
Its starting to become very frustrating. Everytime they begin to seem fine, i find another death. 

What is normal healthy shrimp behavior?


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## aubie98 (Apr 22, 2017)

so, out of the original 7 shrimp, 4 died? I experienced a similar mortality rate with the blue velvet and cherry shrimp I bought from Aquatic Arts, 4/7 dead blue velvet shrimp and 5/7 cherry shrimp in little over 1.5 to 2 weeks.

Was advised on this board that it's probably due to using a vendor that sales imported adult shrimp which are stressed from shipping and less able to adapt to the new tank parameters.

After the initial mortality, the shrimp that did survive are still with me ~2 months later. Also, one of the surviving blue velvet shrimp was a berried female that subsequently gave birth (hatched?) to ~10-12 shrimplets. 1 or 2 may have died, but the vast majority have survived. And actually all three of the original shrimp (all female) are berried again, expecting (fingers crossed) new shrimplets in about 1.5 weeks.

So, the shrimp that do survive from your original group should do well as they will have adjusted to your parameters. And if your berried female produces shrimplets, they should do great as they will have been born in the parameters.

A lot of people here advised that it's better to get shrimp from domestic vendors that don't import (Han Aquatics, Aquarium Creation, etc.). And I don't know if it's helped, but I started using Shrimp King BioTase to help boost the shrimp's immune system and build up biofilm for the shrimp to eat.


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## MuricaMike (Apr 11, 2017)

Man, you're having a heck of a time with these shrimp. The only thing I can think of at this point is lowering the temperature to around 72. 77 is on the higher side of their comfort zone. They seem to tolerate lower temps better than higher. Other than that, I'm stumped.


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## Vinster8108 (Sep 1, 2016)

Can you confirm they are dead shrimp? I only ask because nothing seems to jump out as an issue to me. What you're finding could be molts. Throw some zucchini in there and count how many come out to eat.

Things to try: lower temp, raise Gh to 7-8?


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## Aquatic Athlete (Oct 7, 2017)

Vinster8108 said:


> Can you confirm they are dead shrimp? I only ask because nothing seems to jump out as an issue to me. What you're finding could be molts. Throw some zucchini in there and count how many come out to eat.
> 
> Things to try: lower temp, raise Gh to 7-8?


Sadly, they're certainly dead shrimp. Lighter orange/pinkish color that shrimp turn when they die. Obvious leakage of deteriorating body when you move them. They're definitely not the crystal clear, skeletal molts.

Bump:


aubie98 said:


> so, out of the original 7 shrimp, 4 died? I experienced a similar mortality rate with the blue velvet and cherry shrimp I bought from Aquatic Arts, 4/7 dead blue velvet shrimp and 5/7 cherry shrimp in little over 1.5 to 2 weeks.
> 
> Was advised on this board that it's probably due to using a vendor that sales imported adult shrimp which are stressed from shipping and less able to adapt to the new tank parameters.
> 
> ...



I was shocked to see the painted quality and honestly didnt realize what i had bought at the time. Sadly the berried female is just a super low grade orange, from my second purchase. But.. If thats how its gotta be, its how its gotta be. I really wanted young from the painted oranges, but at this rate, its doubtful.




MuricaMike said:


> Man, you're having a heck of a time with these shrimp. The only thing I can think of at this point is lowering the temperature to around 72. 77 is on the higher side of their comfort zone. They seem to tolerate lower temps better than higher. Other than that, I'm stumped.


Thats what i'm thinking of doing. dropping the temp. 



Vinster8108 said:


> Can you confirm they are dead shrimp? I only ask because nothing seems to jump out as an issue to me. What you're finding could be molts. Throw some zucchini in there and count how many come out to eat.
> 
> Things to try: lower temp, raise Gh to 7-8?


Gh will be my next next move.


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## ILikeRice (Jul 9, 2017)

Uhh, is that tank cycled? Doesn't seem like it to me..How do you do water changes? I do mines 20-30% a time and leave newly prepped water sitting for atleast 7days. Another thing Incorporated is having the prepped water and tank water to similar parameters including temp...it helps for adaptation and less stress for the shrimp.Also how is the water agitation and O2 supply? Do you dose anything?

BTW, when adding new shrimp be sure to quarantine them for a week or 2 as a precaution. Bee shrimps prefer pH around 5.5 btw..


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## Betta132 (Nov 29, 2012)

0 nitrates is definitely possible with low stock and plenty of plants, but, just to be safe, is there any way your test kit is expired? Water quality is unlikely to be the issue given that you aren't losing them all at once, though. 
Is there any way they could have some sort of parasite? Does anything about the bodies not look right?


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## Zoidburg (Mar 8, 2016)

Vinster8108 said:


> Can you confirm they are dead shrimp? I only ask because nothing seems to jump out as an issue to me. What you're finding could be molts. Throw some zucchini in there and count how many come out to eat.
> 
> Things to try: lower temp, raise Gh to 7-8?


Ditto this.




ILikeRice said:


> BTW, when adding new shrimp be sure to quarantine them for a week or 2 as a precaution. Bee shrimps prefer pH around 5.5 btw..


They aren't bee shrimp, even though they are being sold as bee shrimp... they are just orange neos.


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## Aquatic Athlete (Oct 7, 2017)

ILikeRice said:


> Uhh, is that tank cycled? Doesn't seem like it to me..How do you do water changes? I do mines 20-30% a time and leave newly prepped water sitting for atleast 7days. Another thing Incorporated is having the prepped water and tank water to similar parameters including temp...it helps for adaptation and less stress for the shrimp.Also how is the water agitation and O2 supply? Do you dose anything?
> 
> BTW, when adding new shrimp be sure to quarantine them for a week or 2 as a precaution. Bee shrimps prefer pH around 5.5 btw..


Haha, Yes the tank is most certainly well cycled. 
Water changes are made to the same water quality and temp.

They're Neo shrimp. Sold as Bees incorrectly.



Betta132 said:


> 0 nitrates is definitely possible with low stock and plenty of plants, but, just to be safe, is there any way your test kit is expired? Water quality is unlikely to be the issue given that you aren't losing them all at once, though.
> Is there any way they could have some sort of parasite? Does anything about the bodies not look right?


API Master kit with a 2022 expiration date. 
Thats the puzzling part. If it was water, i should have woken up to a mass die off. 

Bodies look fine. I've googled all sorts of shrimp parasites. No odd colored veins or fungus throughout the body or swimmerettes. Its quite frustrating. Its gotten to the point where the first thing i do when getting home is to stare at the tank looking for corpses.



Zoidburg said:


> Ditto this.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



@Zoidburg excellent. Whats the best way to bring GH up? I've got decent ability to find products to help. First thing that came to my mind was AquaVitro's GH product. Only because i have the KH as well.

Bump: Note. Just to be sure that the motionless figure of my shrimp, laying on it's side, no leg movement, faded eyes and whatnot... was or wasn't dead, i left him/her there for another hour+ and there was zero movement, zero change in shape or figure. I am however suspecting a molting issue. While i do occasionally see the crystal clear ghostly shells of shrimp molts, i've noticed a light colored band mid shrimp, which i assume is the split in the molt, revealing the new shell.. 

I'll try and attach a photo. If so, raising the GH should help and dropping the temp as well, correct?


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## Zoidburg (Mar 8, 2016)

Yes, if there are failed molts, then lowering temp and raising GH *should* help. If you continue having problems weeks afterwards, then you also need to look at diet.


There are several products you can use to raise GH. You can go with shrimp products geared towards shrimp, or you can attempt using products just meant to raise GH. Since your KH is as high as it is, you only need something to raise GH. There are several great shrimp GH remineralizers out there, but some people have sworn by something as simple as Equilibrium. Some of the liquid shrimp products may have lower TDS than some of the conventional products. All in all, it's up to you.


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## Aquatic Athlete (Oct 7, 2017)

Zoidburg said:


> Yes, if there are failed molts, then lowering temp and raising GH *should* help. If you continue having problems weeks afterwards, then you also need to look at diet.
> 
> 
> There are several products you can use to raise GH. You can go with shrimp products geared towards shrimp, or you can attempt using products just meant to raise GH. Since your KH is as high as it is, you only need something to raise GH. There are several great shrimp GH remineralizers out there, but some people have sworn by something as simple as Equilibrium. Some of the liquid shrimp products may have lower TDS than some of the conventional products. All in all, it's up to you.


Excellent. I will invest in fixing the GH.
I am also doing a dose of FenBendazol to kill off the Hydra in my tank. Water is slowly being decreased in temp.


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## d33pVI (Oct 28, 2015)

I had the same issue when I first got cherry shrimp. LFS suggested some remineralizer product. Don't know if that helped or not, but eventually the population stabilized and grew. I think the older shrimp were dying, but the young and newly hatched shrimp started doing fine. I don't use the remineralizer anymore and I now have more shrimp than I can count.


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## clownplanted (Mar 3, 2017)

d33pVI said:


> I had the same issue when I first got cherry shrimp. LFS suggested some remineralizer product. Don't know if that helped or not, but eventually the population stabilized and grew. I think the older shrimp were dying, but the young and newly hatched shrimp started doing fine. I don't use the remineralizer anymore and I now have more shrimp than I can count.


Classic case that has been proven time and time again that the older ones just have a much harder time to adjust and many times just fail to do so.


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## houseofcards (Mar 21, 2009)

Shrimp still freak me out. I used to breed cherries in pretty soft water (KH=2, GH=4) without issue they were everywhere. I did't have any for a few years and bought some probably 6 months ago or something. I transferred two of them into my little nano that has 7 Ember Tetras in it. they were in there for a few months no problem. 

The other day I saw them climbing all over the moss covered stones they looked perfectly fine. I added a little flourish comp to the tank like I've been doing and glued a small piece of Buce to one of the rocks. I looked at the tank an hour later, both shrimp were dead. The tetras were all fine.

I'm thinking it was the glued Buce that killed them. I had been dosing the Flourish without issue for a few months unless I accidently overdosed.


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## ILikeRice (Jul 9, 2017)

Any update for us OP ^


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## clownplanted (Mar 3, 2017)

houseofcards said:


> Shrimp still freak me out. I used to breed cherries in pretty soft water (KH=2, GH=4) without issue they were everywhere. I did't have any for a few years and bought some probably 6 months ago or something. I transferred two of them into my little nano that has 7 Ember Tetras in it. they were in there for a few months no problem.
> 
> The other day I saw them climbing all over the moss covered stones they looked perfectly fine. I added a little flourish comp to the tank like I've been doing and glued a small piece of Buce to one of the rocks. I looked at the tank an hour later, both shrimp were dead. The tetras were all fine.
> 
> I'm thinking it was the glued Buce that killed them. I had been dosing the Flourish without issue for a few months unless I accidently overdosed.


Very interesting. What kind of glue did you use? Was it dried before adding? Wonder if they foraged on it and somehow got a few pieces.


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## houseofcards (Mar 21, 2009)

clownplanted said:


> Very interesting. What kind of glue did you use? Was it dried before adding? Wonder if they foraged on it and somehow got a few pieces.


That was my thought as well. I use the Loctite Gel. The rocks were already intergrated into the hardscape so I was able to lower the water below the area on the rock that I wanted to attach the plant (which I did several times before in the same setup with the shrimp.) I then waited a while and filled it back up. Whatever killed them it was fast and it got both of them.


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