# how to balance with assassin snail populations



## Blacktetra (Mar 19, 2015)

So I just got some ramshorn from a friend.
They warned me that they breed like CRAZY. Well I've had 4 of them for 24 hours and I already have two patches of maybe 20 eggs each on the glass. So once I have 50 or so in a 40 gallon, if I add 5 assassin snails will the two populations even each other out somewhat?

In short, which is wiser/better:
a) Manual collection of excess ramshorn and destroying them or...
b) Assassin snail population that keeps them under control without completely killing them off 100%?

I've heard ramshorn are pretty good snails for some people and wanted to try them out, but I can't have things look this over crowded:

http://i.imgur.com/6FEaIPK.jpg


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## rragan (Jun 2, 2015)

I have 2 assasins and 2 yoyo loaches in a 55 gallon. they control the pond snail population. and I see eggs all the time. Ide guess maybe 30 pond snails all the time.

I think the yoyo loaches do most of the work.


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## loach guy (Jun 2, 2014)

rragan said:


> I have 2 assasins and 2 yoyo loaches in a 55 gallon. they control the pond snail population. and I see eggs all the time. Ide guess maybe 30 pond snails all the time.
> 
> I think the yoyo loaches do most of the work.


Yoyo's are the A-10's of freshwater aquariums (I love 'em!). I would consider them more of a snail eradicator than I would a snail population manager. You should read up on them as they should be kept in groups of 5 or more. Also you can forget about keeping shrimp with these guys. They will be the first to go.

I have never kept assassins, but my pond snail population is getting out of hand so I am thinking about adding them. Since I have amano shrimp in the tank, yoyo's are out of the picture.


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## Blacktetra (Mar 19, 2015)

It seems like the only way to have two competing populations without one wiping out the other is to have a large tank with lots of hiding places.

If you have a very densely planted tank with lots of bladder or ramshorn, and throw in a breeding population of assassins, the assassins will grow in population until they struggle to find food, and so long as you don't over feed the fish (and thus provide alternate food for the assassins) some will die off, giving the few remaining bladder snails a chance to hide, reproduce, and grow back, once they are in a larger number, the assassins will begin to grow in number too, back and forth. But I doubt this is easy to do without a rather large tank to provide enough room and hiding places to help ensure one doesn't wipe out the other.

I've considered loaches, but I think they'll likely remove ALL my snails, rather than just some, unless I have a section of tank that the snails can access, that the loaches can't.


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## Tihsho (Oct 10, 2007)

If you want to make it easy just let the population of ramshorn's grow and place a slice of zuchinni in and pull out the ramshorn's that are on it regularly and relocate them. This will remove a good chunk of them without having a predator for them in the tank.


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## Blacktetra (Mar 19, 2015)

Tihsho said:


> If you want to make it easy just let the population of ramshorn's grow and place a slice of zuchinni in and pull out the ramshorn's that are on it regularly and relocate them. This will remove a good chunk of them without having a predator for them in the tank.


While I like this approach, it really means that I myself have to be the predator, and while I don't mind this so much, it's just one more thing to do for tank maintenance.


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## Markp80nj (Mar 1, 2014)

My ramshorn population was out of control, so I got, I think it was, 15 assassins for my 60 gallon. 
Ramshorns are completely wiped out, and assassins have doubled in number. 
I do make sure I leave some extra food for them though, because I think they are very pretty, and don't want them dying off. 
I didn't want to wipe out my ramshorns though, so don't put too many assassins in there, and maybe you'll be alright. 

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## bereninga (Mar 18, 2006)

So what do you do w/ the assassins snails after control is achieved?


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## Blacktetra (Mar 19, 2015)

if the populations have enough room and are each big enough, in theory they should manage each other. However, most people get assassin snails to kill off all other snails in the tank, and once they do, people either feed them to keep them, or dispose of them.


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## Tihsho (Oct 10, 2007)

Blacktetra said:


> While I like this approach, it really means that I myself have to be the predator, and while I don't mind this so much, it's just one more thing to do for tank maintenance.


Depending on how you feed or how much organic material they have to eat, this could be a monthly to weekly thing. I do get it's a pain, but it's not like you can train Assassin snails to only eat a few. They don't know about your requirements and that there is a limit, haha.



bereninga said:


> So what do you do w/ the assassins snails after control is achieved?


This is a question I've had for years. I wanted to get Assassin's before but was worried about how to feed them post them clearing a tank.


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## Vidikron (May 21, 2015)

Blacktetra said:


> if the populations have enough room and are each big enough, in theory they should manage each other. However, most people get assassin snails to kill off all other snails in the tank, and once they do, people either feed them to keep them, or dispose of them.


I read somewhere that you should add 1 assassin per 10 gallons to get rid of pest snails and that is what I did for my pond snail problem. I added 5 Assassins to a 46bf tank that had hundreds of pond snails and they obliterated them. After about a month I could only see a few snails in the mornings. A few weeks later nothing. I would still see a few small ones inside the filter for a couple of months after that, but this last filter clean I only saw one in there. 

I think striking a balance is going to be hard unless your tank is huge. But if you want to try and find that balance I'd suggest staying below the 1 Assassin per 10 gallons guide that I followed. Because at that level I can tell you from personal experience they will likely wipe out the other snails.


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## Markp80nj (Mar 1, 2014)

bereninga said:


> So what do you do w/ the assassins snails after control is achieved?


Mine seem to enjoy the same pellets as my cories, so I throw in a little extra for them. 

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## walklong (Aug 31, 2013)

+1 on catfish pellets for feeding assassin snails, they will work on algae as well, as I understand, if hunting other snails isn't very productive. You can always post a wtb/raok for the surplus ramshorn if you need to harvest - puffer and loach keepers looking for food respond. 

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## wlevine09 (Apr 7, 2014)

In my experience, the assassins (assuming you have a male and female) will reproduce like crazy (albeit slowly) and will eventually take over the nuisance snails. Not really a bad thing as you can always sell the extras on here for a few bucks.


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## schnebbles (Jan 10, 2015)

Glad I read this. I had some loaches caught at the pet store I work at then put them back because I thought about my cherry shrimp. Decided to do more research before getting a loach. I have mts getting out of control. I know I over feed. I feed my amanos and all the bottom feeders. 

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## mootay (Feb 16, 2015)

Unfortunately, I don't believe there is a straight forward way to balance ramshorns and assassins withouta lot of human intervention. Your best bet is to keep the assassins separate for a while. You can then attempt to sex them by poking each snail to see if a cloud of milt emerges. Supposedly males do this with some regularity. If you can isolate a group of males, then you can control assassin snail breeding. At that point introduce males slowly to the primary tank, very very slowly. Two factors will then control your ramhorn population; number of assassin snails and available food.


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## Jeff B (Oct 16, 2010)

mootay said:


> You can then attempt to sex them by poking each snail to see if a cloud of milt emerges. Supposedly males do this with some regularity.


Don't feel too bad about poking them. They loooove it.


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