# BGA problem!



## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

OK I have a 100 gallon tank, Im going to start co2 soon, I have a powerhead sponge filter to move the water, and Ive been dosing KNO3 at 1/2 teaspoon every other day since tuesday. Im having problems with BGA growing. It seems like the growth has slowed since adding a powerhead and KNO3 but it is still growing. What else can I do to get rid of this gross stuff??


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

How much light do you have? Reducing the light should slow down the blue green algae considerably, especially when you have no CO2.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

umm I have four 32 watt t8 bulbs...I'll try to reduce the light until co2


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Are you dosing phosphate too? If you don't the plants will not be able to use the nitrate and traces. You need about 1/4 tsp of KH2PO4 about once or twice a week, given the light you have.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

Ok what is a good amount of KH03, Phosphate, Potassium, and CSM+B to dose in the 100 gallon tank until I get co2? Plus how many days a week for each?

Is the lighting I have not going to be enough for when I get co2? I was thinking about overdriving them 2x to get more wattage.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

Hoppy where'd ya go?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

You have 128 watts of lighting, with poor reflectors, over 100 gallons of water. That is about 1 watt per gallon or less of AHS type lights and reflectors. You have a low light aquarium. CO2 will help the plants, but with that light you wont get the rapid growth of both plants and algae that high light tanks get. This may well be good!

I would try fertilizing at: 1/8 tsp KH2PO4, once a week, 1 tsp of KNO3 once a week, 1/4 tsp of CSM+B once a week. This could be split into twice a week at half the doses. I would try adding a plant or plants like Hygrophila Difformis or Ludwigia Repens in quantity and let them grow for a couple of months to cycle the tank thoroughly, then switch to the low light plants I really wanted, like crypts, Java ferns, etc.

I suggest when you get the CO2, thoroughly clean up the tank, getting rid of algae infested leaves, cleaning the glass good, cleaning the top of the substrate, and considering that a new start for the tank.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

Well I have very good reflectors like the ones from AH supply behind my lights and I have an electrician that can overdrive the bulbs to get about 2 watts per gallon. I have lots of plants in there already..Some are fast growing while some are not. Dont think I can fit any more plants in there right now....

I cut down the lights for now until I get co2 because the stupid BGA wont quit growing...Why wont it stop? Will co2 inhibit it from growing?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Blue green algae seems to start in response to low nitrates and high light intensity. Or, that's how I remember from what I have been reading here and elsewhere. I also recall that it is hard to get rid of. Some folks use antibiotics on it, since it isn't a real algae, but a form of bacteria. Maybe someone with more experience with it will add some comments.

With good reflectors you have 1.3 or so watts per gallon, so overdriving them to get 2 watts per gallon is probably a good idea. I haven't tried that, but those who do say it is a good idea. For a tank as large as yours you probably could do well with less than 2 watts per gallon, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to get the CO2 running well, then get your electrician to do his thing.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

ok...So when I add co2 will that help with my BBA too? I have alot of that on my slow growing plants. Im thinking I might take those plants out and do a bleach dip on them to get rid of it after I get the co2 started...What do you think?


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

Who should I talk to about getting rid of BGA with antibiotics?


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

Hoppy said "I would try fertilizing at: 1/8 tsp KH2PO4, once a week, 1 tsp of KNO3 once a week, 1/4 tsp of CSM+B once a week. This could be split into twice a week at half the doses"

So this is a good amount for now until I get co2??


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

We seem to be carrying on a private conversation here!

CO2 does indeed inhibit BBA from forming. When you get BBA you can almost be sure you are too low in CO2. But, once you have BBA, unless it is a very small amount, adding more CO2 doesn't usually kill it. So, yes, I like to use a 1 in 20 bleach solution to kill the BBA on hardy plants and on hardscape and hardware when I try to restart the tank with more CO2.

Those fertilizer numbers are what I would use with or without CO2, and I would change 50% of the water once a week to make sure I wasn't building up too much in the water.

Eventually someone will add their two cents worth about using antibiotics on BGA, or you can use the search function and probably find discussions about it.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

thanks hoppy for your knowledge and help! If I have any more questions you know Ill ask..lol


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## sandiegoryu (Feb 15, 2006)

Im telling you first that I'm only a kid. 

Ok. I have used Marycyn, not Marycyn 2 for killing BGA. I know that I should've used ferts to control and what nots first. I'm sorry I didn't. And I can't blame my youth for this.

Ok. But I don't think you should use antibiotics for your problem, because it is a 100 gallon tank. You would need lots of antibiotics. The antibiotic btw is erythromicyn. What I did for me was to add 500mg per 10 gallons on the first day. Then I added 250mg per 10 gallons every 24 hours. I continued dosing 250mg until maybe the 5th day (I don't remember), then I gave up. On the many articles about using BGA I saw that on about the 2nd day you should see the BGA crawling upwards on the glass, and making bubbles as if it was pearling. Then it would turn brownish around the 4th-5th day. I saw no sign of this except one patch going up the glass and one patch bubbling. So i just stopped dosing, and about 4 days later I went to Japan for about 2 weeks. Then I came home to see no BGA at all! I thought maybe the antibiotics helped to weaken the algae, and my low biomass (I didn't feed my fish except once during the week where i had my neighbour fed them, in which i had a portion in a ziplock bag) had killed the BGA. I had nothing but white clouds. And i thought the no trace of dead BGA was due to the small snails i had.

O yah and before this medication, I did a 3 day blackout. I was going to do a 4 day blackout, but I got impatient and took it off on the 3rd night, thinking that the nighttime would count enough to be the 4th day. (That didn't make sense :-D.) The way to do a black out is to do a big water change before the night, and to dose something I don't remember sorry. You can search and there would be an answer. Then you do another water change after the black out, to get all the dead BGA. In this black out, you should tape your aquarium with a blanket or something to trap out ALL light. and they seem serious about this being ALL. No spots of light AT ALL. No dimness either. Just BLACK. No peaking either. Which means no feeding the fish. They said that a 4 day blackout would not harm your plants, and many report plants seem to be much more healthier after the black out. But I have also heard other reports saying that their plants died except for one stem. So there are some mixed results, probably due to how horrible their case of BGA was.

Wow I babbled a lot. Sorry to make you read so much. And I hope I was of help and didn't make any grammatical errors which made it more confusing for you to read. :-D


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

wow your really educated on this! I would like to see some pictures of your tank and see what 14 year olds can do! So basically the best option is a black out? I thought getting water movement and getting the nitrate level up would eliminate it? I dont guess its that simple???


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## sandiegoryu (Feb 15, 2006)

Well I guess if you have a nice balanced tank, then water circulation and dosing may help for minor BGA problems. I guess it depends on how bad your problem is. I hope somebody more knowledgeable will be able to help you.


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## Aquaseafoam (Apr 6, 2006)

Another way to kill the BGA is with hydrogen peroxide. This is what I did, and I had a horrible outbreak of it. It worked in killing all the BGA at the time, but I never added any nitrates (reccommended to combat BGA) and now a few months later it is coming back slowly. I spot treat these places with hydrogen peroxide and am planning to order some KNO3.
Here is something I put together about it.
https://district.bluegrass.kctcs.edu/khostetler0002/bga.htm


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

oh wow my BGA isnt that bad. I just have a couple of spots on my gravel. Could I use hydrogen peroxide to spot treat the areas on the gravel? What do i do just fill up a syringe and squirt it onto the places in the tank? Im not planning on taking all my plants out becuase it isnt that bad...


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## Aquaseafoam (Apr 6, 2006)

Yes, fill a syringe (or turkey baster) and spray it directly onto the BGA.
I need to update that page- Do NOT dip plants in pure hydrogen peroxide... most of my plants I that I dipped ended up dying.
If I had known how well the peroxide would work I would have left everything in the tank.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Aquaseafoam said:


> Another way to kill the BGA is with hydrogen peroxide.  This is what I did, and I had a horrible outbreak of it. It worked in killing all the BGA at the time, but I never added any nitrates (reccommended to combat BGA) and now a few months later it is coming back slowly. I spot treat these places with hydrogen peroxide and am planning to order some KNO3.
> Here is something I put together about it.
> https://district.bluegrass.kctcs.edu/khostetler0002/bga.htm


Well, you have no plants in the treated tank................

You can use copper as well and permangnate and a dozen other general biocides that are fish safe in that case.

A blackout takes 3 days and is as immediate as any method suggested, Drugs, Peroxide etc, but unlike the other methods, you can quickly see if you solved the long term issue, low NO3/need to clean the filter/vac the gravel etc.

Cost:
Free, need to go get anything other than something like KNO3 which you need if you don't have it: none.

100% effective *if you add the KNO3 and keep doing so from then on*.
Unlike your method or anyone's, this *helps the plants grow better*.

No other method ever suggested that idea for some reason..........maybe it's because they enjoy killing algae as hobby rather than growing plants?:biggrin: 

Focus on the plants, then you don't have algal issues.

Regards,
Tom Barr


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## channafreak (Jun 14, 2004)

I guess Ill chime in for the blackout method as well. I put lots of elbow grease into manually removing the cyanobacteria when I saw it but always ended up getting a bloom within a few days. I fed the fish, manually removed every scrap I could find, did a 1/3 waterchange, then draped 2 king sized comforters over the tank for 4 days. It has been 6 months now and I havent seen a bloom come back. Even though I sorted out my dosing pretty well, it seemed like I needed that blackout to completely nuke it. Im always too worried about messing up my nitrofying bacteria when using chemicals so I never even considered the erythromycin.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

Ok so I dont really want to do a blackout because I am setting up co2 in a day or two so explain to me thoroughly what my other options are?


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

You can get a antibiotic (Maracyn) from the LFS or order it. It will kill the BGA which is actually a cyanobacteria, not a true algae. You'll still have to remove all the dead yukky BGA manually. And the antibiotic will nuke your nitrifiying bacteria in the filter and gravel for the most part so you'll have to re-cycle the tank. But that shouldn't be hard since you have a boatload of healthy plants. Here is a link for the Maracyn, which is basically erythromycin. Not real cheap to dose for a big tank and I'm not sure of the dosing having never had a bad case of BGA. A search on the forum should be easy to find out the correct dosing, however. Some folks swear by this cure, as BGA can come back pretty easy... I have heard. The Maracyn shouldn't hurt the fish if dosed correctly, but I'm not sure about shrimp and inverts. You could search the forum for BGA or Marcyn and get all your questions answered.http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=4838&N=2004+113021

Or you could try the steady NO3 dosing like Tom said, just keep dosing in appropriate levels of NO3 and it should go away. BGA starts with a nitrate shortage.


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## JeremyChase (May 23, 2006)

plantbrain said:


> 100% effective *if you add the KNO3 and keep doing so from then on*.
> Unlike your method or anyone's, this *helps the plants grow better*.
> 
> Regards,
> Tom Barr


I am 3 weeks into my first planted tank, and am also experiencing (What I believe) BGA.

Right now I'm only doing Yeast CO2 in my 10 gallon. I'm planning on a blackout as I'm going to be away anyway this weekend. Where can I get KNO3 locally? Does a place like Home Depot, etc, carry the goods?

-Jer


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## jgc (Jul 6, 2005)

Boiling.

My method of killing it last night was quick and simple. Pulled out the lone fish in the tank, threw away the plants, scrubed the tank, and boiled the substrait. Might slow it down for a bit...

It was a nano tank, and I have vertually unlimited plants available for it from my high tech tank. As such, I replanted and really did not worry about cycling it. I might try a blackout if it continues - but really need to up the circulation to keep it at bay first.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

> Boiling.
> 
> My method of killing it last night was quick and simple. Pulled out the lone fish in the tank, threw away the plants, scrubed the tank, and boiled the substrait. Might slow it down for a bit...
> 
> It was a nano tank, and I have vertually unlimited plants available for it from my high tech tank. As such, I replanted and really did not worry about cycling it. I might try a blackout if it continues - but really need to up the circulation to keep it at bay first.


JGC.... I have said before...my BGA isnt that bad at all...only a few places...Im not looking for something that extreme..Plus it is a 100 gallon tank so obviously that isnt very "quick and simple".


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## endparenthesis (Jul 13, 2004)

Marycyn kills BGA good. It also kills your biological filter good.


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## Ryzilla (Oct 29, 2005)

RachPreach said:


> JGC.... I have said before...my BGA isnt that bad at all...only a few places...Im not looking for something that extreme..Plus it is a 100 gallon tank so obviously that isnt very "quick and simple".


BGA always starts small. The best method that I have used twice is the blackout method. I am now on my third blackout. I do 4 days since 3 was not enough for the BGA in my nano. 4 days, little stress, no chemicals, and BGA is gone. Go for it


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## JeremyChase (May 23, 2006)

Ryzilla said:


> BGA always starts small. The best method that I have used twice is the blackout method. I am now on my third blackout. I do 4 days since 3 was not enough for the BGA in my nano. 4 days, little stress, no chemicals, and BGA is gone. Go for it


When it is "gone" does anything remain? Does something eat the "dead" BGA?

Jer


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

JeremyChase said:


> I am 3 weeks into my first planted tank, and am also experiencing (What I believe) BGA.
> 
> Right now I'm only doing Yeast CO2 in my 10 gallon. I'm planning on a blackout as I'm going to be away anyway this weekend. Where can I get KNO3 locally? Does a place like Home Depot, etc, carry the goods?
> 
> -Jer


Your hardware store probably carries Greenlight Stump Remover, which is KNO3. Some other brands are the same, but not all, so I have heard.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

> BGA always starts small. The best method that I have used twice is the blackout method. I am now on my third blackout. I do 4 days since 3 was not enough for the BGA in my nano. 4 days, little stress, no chemicals, and BGA is gone. Go for it


Its been small for a while....ive been cleaning it out every other day to keep it from spreading....I think Im going to try to spot treat the small areas with hydrogen peroxide...


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## jgc (Jul 6, 2005)

My post was somewhat in gest. Starting the tank over and boiling the substrait was pretty much "nuke it from outerspace, just to be sure". I was getting very frustrated with it.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

ok i got my co2 set up and there seems to be alot of tiny tiny little bubbles coming out of the spraybar...I have a reactor from rex grigg. Is this normal to have tiny little bubbles like this? They are circulating around everywhere in my tank! Help!


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

ok well i tried the hydrogen peroxide spot treatment and it worked! its been gone for about 3 days so far! thanks yall!


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## JeremyChase (May 23, 2006)

RachPreach said:


> ok well i tried the hydrogen peroxide spot treatment and it worked! its been gone for about 3 days so far! thanks yall!


How is it now? Is the BGA retreating or advancing?


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

> How is it now? Is the BGA retreating or advancing?


nope its still long gone!


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## JeremyChase (May 23, 2006)

RachPreach said:


> nope its still long gone!


Good for you.. I literally just covered my tank; blackout time.


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## eds (Feb 12, 2003)

I'm removing the paper from my 55 tonite after 4 days blackout.
A couple of courses with maracyn didn't do the trick.
I'm eager to see my plants and angels again.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

You folks can kill BGA and few different ways, 3 day blackout is plenty.

But...........and I think I need to say this is the largest font there:
*BGA will come back if you do not address the plant growth, you need to add KNO3 and keep it at a good level from here on after killing the BGA.*

You will have issues with BGA and other algae till you start addressing that issue.

A little BGA along the gravel line on the frotn panel is fine, clean it off and do a water change once a week etc and it should never be an issue.

Basically if you focus on what the plants need to grow well, you will have far fewer issues with algae and focus on plant pruning, growth, aquascaping etc etc........

Remember? That hobby you started out doing rather than algae killing method Hobby?

Many times a good cleaning, water change alone gets rid of most algae, you do not need to resort to H2O2, drugs, blackouts, UV at all.

If you have BGA and do not want it coming back, no matter how you plan on killing/getting rid of it, *plan on adding KNO3*.

This also applies to marine tanks.
Now tell the other folks when they come and ask for help, give them a long term solution, not the quick fix and then leave them hanging.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## eds (Feb 12, 2003)

plantbrain said:


> A little BGA along the gravel line on the frotn panel is fine, clean it off and do a water change once a week etc and it should never be an issue.
> 
> If you have BGA and do not want it coming back, no matter how you plan on killing/getting rid of it, *plan on adding KNO3*.


Funny, but I always kinda assumed most of the folks here added KNO3 regularly - as I do. 

Every time I have had "a little BGA along the gravel line" it seemed to get worse, spreading to a couple of my plants more than others. Never seems to stay at that low level, despite weekly (or more often) cleaning and watehr changes.


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

I would forego putting your bacteria colony and fish through the stress of high dose antibiotics, and just do a 3 day blackout. I just did it, and it is g-o-n-e gone. Since you don't have CO2 yet it can't hurt. Do a 50% change clean substrate, filter, tubes, does KNO3, then wrap black garbage bags covering the entire tank, and your pipes, etc. leave it alone for 3 days, fish don't need to eat that bad, and NO PEAKING. After 3 days, do a cleaaning, 50% change and add KNO3 then do your thing. Hook up your CO2, dose ferts correctly, and you won't have an issue.


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## captured!byrobots (Jan 8, 2006)

I was having crazy bad BGA problems when I first started out.
I removed it, but it came back, of course....

What I did?
So I got the diy co2 going, and packed the tank with plants,
and raised the light up away from the tank a bit,
shortened the photoperiod.
Since my
tank was overstocked at the time, the nitrate was high, 
and low and behold, end of BGA! Less light, co2, more nitrate...
I was adding nitrate by having an overstocked tank....

I don't suggest you overstock, but it did work for me(at the time)
Now I have KN03, so I can dose instead of overstocking.

Sometimes you have to try a lot of things to 
figure out the right answer for your tank....

LOVE JBOT


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

eds said:


> Funny, but I always kinda assumed most of the folks here added KNO3 regularly - as I do.
> 
> Every time I have had "a little BGA along the gravel line" it seemed to get worse, spreading to a couple of my plants more than others. Never seems to stay at that low level, despite weekly (or more often) cleaning and watehr changes.


No, many are irregular with their dosing, they negelect their tanks for a little while.

It's not that folks negelect their tanks over the long term..............it's the peroidic negelect.

We all know we can pus things for a few days without dealing with a problem, how far can you push things before it's now a big job?

If you have done the hobby long enough, you know this.
And you know the same old thing it'll take to fix the problem.........

KNO3 alone is not the end all here, but it's a huge part it and should be as well as the other things involved in plant health as part of solution.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

In all fairness to ed, I have that sheen at my gravel line too, and it was there that it leeched out to my plants and became a problem. I dose dry ferts, EI, so heavily, and I do it with out fail!!! I always have that sheen. yes, it was after test kit telling me my NO3 was way high that I skipped 2 days , and it leeched out to plants. But before that occured, I had that sheen that is unmistakeable dosing EI everyday. The side that is the worst is facing the window. I do think that despite NO3 level, this has a distinct effect on cyano formatiion along the gravle line, where there is NO water movement. I liken it to herpes. Someone may have herpes lying dormant in their bodies and never know it, but if they become immunocompromised somehow, by a cold or the flu, wham fever blister or outbreak. So by the nature of the tank and where it is placed, you may have this "herpes" then by slacking one week, like I did because I listened to a sucky test kit, my herpes had a chance to spread in my compromised tank. Sorry, it is the clinician in me, but it makes sense, no?


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I agree with your observations along the gravel line and alos, and very importantly, the side closest to the window(why migh that be?).

The regions where flow is greatly reduce, also have micro sites where the NO3 is low, other critters etc cannot disturb it.

Simply sloping the gravel below this lip/taping the gravel line will kill off the remaining BGA there forever.

BGA needs light, in the tank, there's little issue, but in these protected spots, the BGA can get a foothold.

Tom Barr


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

plantbrain said:


> I agree with your observations along the gravel line and alos, and very importantly, the side closest to the window(why migh that be?).
> 
> The regions where flow is greatly reduce, also have micro sites where the NO3 is low, other critters etc cannot disturb it.
> 
> ...


agreed 100%. The side by the window is like that for obvious reasons...<photosynthesis> Basically, now I know where that problem area is, i just make a point to disturb it regularly. I don't see the need to tape it as it distracts, but If it is disturbed to allow NO3 to get there and to allow flow, I think that would nip the problem in the bud


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## lifetapestry (Jan 12, 2006)

fresh_newby said:


> Basically, now I know where that problem area is, i just make a point to disturb it regularly. I don't see the need to tape it as it distracts, but If it is disturbed to allow NO3 to get there and to allow flow, I think that would nip the problem in the bud


A shoal of corries and some bottom-feeding food tossed there (frozen works well for this) will do this nicely for you. Plus, corries (my favorites are albinos, and we have quite a variety in our tank) are enormously entertaining and social little fish.

Karla


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

I know I have an albino corry and he is great! he is constantly moving. Hes name is Pete!


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## lifetapestry (Jan 12, 2006)

Rach,

Get another albino cory and watch how happy your Pete will be-- they literally dance around the tank together and are so much fun to watch. Ours also constantly lay eggs, which are greedily eaten by the other tank inhabitants (as well as themselves, unfortunately).

Karla


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

lifetapestry said:


> A shoal of corries and some bottom-feeding food tossed there (frozen works well for this) will do this nicely for you. Plus, corries (my favorites are albinos, and we have quite a variety in our tank) are enormously entertaining and social little fish.
> 
> Karla


we have 9 corys already and 2 plecos...


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

well im so nervous about getting any other fish because I feel like I already have too many fish for a 100 gallon....see my stock list?? below?


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## lifetapestry (Jan 12, 2006)

fresh_newby said:


> we have 9 corys already and 2 plecos...


Apologies for the recc, then. It does boggle my mind a bit to imagine a tank with corries with any part of the substrate substantially undisturbed. Obviously my tireless little bottom-stirrers are not as representative of the corydoras pool as I imagined. This typically happens when I try to generalize my own experience to the rest of the world. You'd think I'd learn occasionally from this, but . . . . 

Karla


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## lifetapestry (Jan 12, 2006)

RachPreach said:


> well im so nervous about getting any other fish because I feel like I already have too many fish for a 100 gallon....see my stock list?? below?


I think you only have too many fish if you have problems with ammonia/nitrites, which indicates that the tank can't hold that bioload. It does seem like you have a lot of fish, but you also have a big tank.

Corries are a schooling fish, and I would think that whatever small bioload that another would add to your tank would be more than offset by how happy your lone guy would be with a pal.

Karla


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

I dont have problems with ammonia and nitrites. I have really good filtration and I do a 50% wc every week so I think Im ok.


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

lifetapestry said:


> Apologies for the recc, then. It does boggle my mind a bit to imagine a tank with corries with any part of the substrate substantially undisturbed. Obviously my tireless little bottom-stirrers are not as representative of the corydoras pool as I imagined. This typically happens when I try to generalize my own experience to the rest of the world. You'd think I'd learn occasionally from this, but . . . .
> 
> Karla


No Karla, 
Your reccomendation was a good one. My cories are too all over the map. There is nothing undisturbed on the surface. The problem seems to be about a half an inch below the surface, against the glass, and extends about an inch further towards the bottom. 

Hey Tom, what about inserting like Jobes plant spikes way down into those problem areas into the substrate to allow nitrates to penetrate deep into the substrate. Would that work you think?


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

That would be the last thing I'd do.
Just clean it good, vac etc, tape, slope the gravel up so the gravel is below the lip so no light gets there.

It's sometimes annoying but of little threat if things are mild.


Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

............Thanks!


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