# Am I growing BBA correctly?



## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Yes, you did good in growing BBA!

When it turns white like that it is dead, and many fish will then eat the dead algae, cleaning it up completely. But, the plant leaves will be badly scarred by the BBA and will likely die. So, you almost always have to prune off badly infested leaves.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Looks dead to me, this suggest strongly that BBA is CO2 related, but there are cases where the results are not as dramatic also. Still, I cannot induce BBA any other way than via CO2 manipulation, and that is the key to causes, germinating the BBA.

My hgas tank has run out and I've taken my sweet time getting it replaced, without BBA attacking also. Other tanks had issues prior, and that just pushing past the point, then the BBA came.

But there's some amount of time between the tipping point, and other factors that make tipping that point harder.

Still, the root issue still seesm to be mostly CO2.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Yes I believe it is a CO2 issue. I had to push the CO2 past the fishes limits. I could see them getting stressed at the last 15 - 30 min of the lighting period and as soon as the lights went out I would plug in a pump and bubble wand to circulate the water and out gas the the CO2. I didnt use excel here because basically it it doesnt work for me, I tried it in another tank and all it did was turn the BBA red and within a month it was back again. 

Hoppy - I dont see any fish eating the dead algae hopefully this will change because that was a nice needle leaf that I have and would hate to lose it. Maybe I will not feed them for a while and see what happens.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

SAE's will gnaw it better than any other critter.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## Spachi (Oct 27, 2008)

plantbrain said:


> SAE's will gnaw it better than any other critter.
> 
> Regards,
> Tom Barr


even the living bba? i've heard mixed things about sae's.


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## TheRac25 (Nov 5, 2008)

mine loves bba but absolutly will not toutch anything above about the mid point of the tank... and that anubias is far from dead


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

I added 2 SAE's in and I dont really see a significant decrease in the BBA. The BBA is still white though, but its not falling off or anything. I haven't fed the fish anything over the weekend to see if they would go for the BBA and they didn't. Oh and yes they are true SAE, they have the black line going from the tip of the mouth to the tip of their back fin.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

Have you thought about putting a couple of your platties in there temporarily to pick off the algae?


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## rountreesj (Jun 12, 2007)

a gallon of liquid nitrogen would do the trick...lol

no seriously...i suggest removing manually what you can...i got some needle leaf i an send you to replace it...


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

sewingalot said:


> Have you thought about putting a couple of your platties in there temporarily to pick off the algae?


OH NO!!!!!!! Last thing they need is more room to procreate. I put 2 in there today I got 60 next month, They wont get me like that again. LOL



rountreesj said:


> a gallon of liquid nitrogen would do the trick...lol
> 
> no seriously...i suggest removing manually what you can...i got some needle leaf i an send you to replace it...


Haha, Thats a tedious task. Its a lot of tiny clumps of BBA. I was really hoping the fish would do something. But if not I will have to manually pick it off. I will probably wait until this weekend and see what comes of it. 

Keep me in mind once you are done with your scape, I may take you up on that offer. Mines isnt dead yet, its still some green under dat der BBA.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

rekles75 said:


> OH NO!!!!!!! Last thing they need is more room to procreate. I put 2 in there today I got 60 next month, They wont get me like that again. LOL


Muahahaha!


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## susankat (Oct 14, 2007)

Put in 2 males, and if they procreate, make some money off them


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## brion0 (Sep 28, 2008)

It really doesn't look healthy, given enough time it should fade.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

susankat said:


> Put in 2 males, and if they procreate, make some money off them


Thats Funny, LOL



brion0 said:


> It really doesn't look healthy, given enough time it should fade.


Thats really what I am hoping for. I know its not spreading my other plants are super healthy. I may try taking a knife and gently scaping the leaves to see if it will just fall off easily. I just dont want to pick one clump at a time. That would take a while, and a toll on my back.


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## PRESTON4479 (Mar 22, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> Looks dead to me, this suggest strongly that BBA is CO2 related, but there are cases where the results are not as dramatic also.


This is what I don't understand. I have pushed my co2 to the limits of gassing my fish and I still develop BBA?




plantbrain said:


> Still, the root issue still seesm to be mostly CO2.


So is it anyway possible that something else may be causing it to grow?

I have cleaned it up mostly by using peroxide to kill it and also turned up the co2. I know the co2 has to be good because the fish are very inactive and the drop checker is always on the yellow side. Also plants are pearling daily. At this point the growth seems to have slowed considerably but it is still growing very slowly.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Well I thought the Increased CO2 was beating the BBA back, but it seems to be getting green again. I initially didn't want to use excel because it is only a temporary cure and I want to rid my tank of it. Is there any cases of BBA adjusting to the CO2 increase and gaining hold again? The BBA was definately white and I thought that meant dead, but it is definately getting green again. 

Some Specs.....

Pressurized CO2 #10 tank split 3 ways 
EI dosing 
temp at 78^
7 hour lighting period 3 32 watt t-8 with a 2 32 watt t-8's for a 3 hour burst


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## PRESTON4479 (Mar 22, 2007)

rekles75 said:


> Well I thought the Increased CO2 was beating the BBA back, but it seems to be getting green again. I initially didn't want to use excel because it is only a temporary cure and I want to rid my tank of it. Is there any cases of BBA adjusting to the CO2 increase and gaining hold again? The BBA was definately white and I thought that meant dead, but it is definately getting green again.
> 
> Some Specs.....
> 
> ...


Is this over your 55g? If it is I would try moving to an 8 hour photo period and eliminating the burst.
I've never heard of BBA adjsuting to a co2 gain. When it turns that color in my tank it dies and does not recover.

Also I like to use peroxide to kill it and then clean it up after I make adjustments. This makes for kind of a fresh start and I can see if it begins to come back.

Mine has seemed to slow drastically since adjusting my photo period and light level.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Thanks *Preston4479*

When you say 8 hr without the burst do you mean all the lights or just the initial lights. I dont think some of the plants I have will grow without at least 5 of the 7 lights I have in the canopy. I am also thinking I may have to change from a ceramic disk difusser to an inline CO2 reactor. I know I am getting CO2 through out the tank but I may need the reactor to better disolve the CO2. 

I have never used the H2O2 method, I have seen it mentioned though. I will have to do a search to find out more about it. Or if you have a particular method or a good link maybe you could post it here.


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## brion0 (Sep 28, 2008)

You might think about a bleach dip, it looks like its only afecting your fern an anubias. Excel is a temporary cure, an so is a bleach dip. But Excel will take many spot treatments an a beach dip will get it in one, at a lot less money. Your slow growing plants are being over run, so you might do some heavy trimming. By getting rid of leaves that are afected most, it will slow the spread. An encourage the plant to grow a little faster. I found the recomended 20:1 mix hard on plants an 30:1 or 40:1 still kills the algae, an is easyer on the plants. Good luck.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Thanks *Brion0*

Bleach dip was what I was thinking of doing this weekend, Because excel didnt work for me in another tank. Initiatally I really didnt want to go for Bleach, excel, or H2O2. I wanted to remedy the problem. But for know I will settle for the quick fix.


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## PRESTON4479 (Mar 22, 2007)

rekles75 said:


> Thanks *Preston4479*
> 
> When you say 8 hr without the burst do you mean all the lights or just the initial lights. I dont think some of the plants I have will grow without at least 5 of the 7 lights I have in the canopy. I am also thinking I may have to change from a ceramic disk difusser to an inline CO2 reactor. I know I am getting CO2 through out the tank but I may need the reactor to better disolve the CO2.


Try increasing to an 8 hour photo period and a 1 hour burst. What kind of plants are you keeping?

Also, is your co2 on a timer? If so when does it come on? Before lights, after lights etc.

I'm just thinking of reducing the light to give yourself a fighting chance against it. Meanwhile continue to look at co2/circulation. Make sure its right. Consistency is everything and has made a big difference in my tank. 



rekles75 said:


> I have never used the H2O2 method, I have seen it mentioned though. I will have to do a search to find out more about it. Or if you have a particular method or a good link maybe you could post it here.


I don't remember the exact ratio but I safely use 100ml to 140ml in my 55g. I use a plastic syringe with a piece of air tubing(for accuracy) on the end of it
and slowly squirt it on to the BBA. The BBA will start bubbling almost immediately. Be sure to turn off all filters and any powerheads that will circulate water before you do this. I let it sit for like 20 minutes then do a water change. 

Be aware that some plants do not take well to this(naja's roraima) but in my experience most are fine.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Yes the CO2 is on 30min before lights and cuts off when last lights cut off. Everything is on timers. The plants in question are mainly Eleocharis sp."Belem" and Rotala Verticullaris(sp?) I have already stopped using 2 of the 7 t-8's in the canopy. That and the increase in CO2 was what I believe was the main cause of the BBA turning white at first. 

I will try the H2O2 as I dont want to remove the needle leaf because it may cause the rock wall to fall. Its difficult to put back together in the water. Thanks.


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## brion0 (Sep 28, 2008)

I was going to say cut your light to a minimum, maybe just 3 bulbs. A plastic syringe with a piece of air tubing, thats a good idea.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

brion0 said:


> I was going to say cut your light to a minimum, maybe just 3 bulbs. A plastic syringe with a piece of air tubing, thats a good idea.


 
I would but I am not truely sold that it is a just lighting problem. I think it may be CO2 dispersion. Maybe the Difusser is not dispersing the CO2 enough. I will get the parts together to build a reactor and try that. 

I have a syringe w/ air tubing that I have used for excel OD'ing, so no problem there.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

It is more likely a co2 problem. Lowering the lights will fix it temporarily, but until you get the co2 flowing properly, it'll keep coming back. That's what I have learned here.


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## brion0 (Sep 28, 2008)

rekles75 said:


> I would but I am not truely sold that it is a just lighting problem. I think it may be CO2 dispersion. Maybe the Difusser is not dispersing the CO2 enough. I will get the parts together to build a reactor and try that.
> 
> I have a syringe w/ air tubing that I have used for excel OD'ing, so no problem there.





sewingalot said:


> It is more likely a co2 problem. Lowering the lights will fix it temporarily, but until you get the co2 flowing properly, it'll keep coming back. That's what I have learned here.


Yes, you guys are likely right. How are you getting your CO2 in now? Are you going to make a reactor that goes in the tank?


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Right now CO2 is going thru a ceramic diffuser placed under the XP3 intake and dispersed back thru the XP3 output in the middle of the tank. I will make a DIY inline reactor outlined by Rex Grigg.


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## PRESTON4479 (Mar 22, 2007)

rekles75 said:


> Yes the CO2 is on 30min before lights and cuts off when last lights cut off. Everything is on timers.


Are you using a drop checker. You want to be sure that co2 is optimum before bringing your lights on. Right now my co2 is set to come on several hours before lights on. This is something I'm still experimenting with myself. I agree with the others in that it is a co2 problem. I just think its going to take adjusting both lighting and co2 to find the balance and keep BBA away.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Yes I use a Drop Checker, but I dont rely on it too much. Besides I wake at noon -1p. everything is on by then except the 2-4p burst. 

I agree that it is a both the lighting and the CO2, I have to find the _*sweet spot*_ between the two. I must have did something right in the beginning when I upped the CO2 but it was not enough and I have to try something else.


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

I also noticed today that I am getting a film of GDA on the glass. This tak was set up at the end of January, and I already had a case of GDA that I let cycle its life span and now its back.


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