# Ludwigia melt?



## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

Check your Gh. 

Mine started doing the same thing because it was Ca deficient. Even though the Gh was 4.

Lissette


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

my Gh is about 15 last time i checked :/


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

Whoa. That's high. 

Although, I hear tell that sometimes water from the tap, may contain more magnesium than calcium, or vice versa, to make up the hardness.

Some people experiment by adding a little Ca or Mg (depending on which nutrient you believe your plants need) to the water despite the fact that the hardness is high to see if there's any difference.

Lissette


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

ya its pretty high . I live in Texas and we are right on top of an aquifer that is made of limestone. I've never dosed Mg in my tank or extra Ca but if i were to where would i be able to get some? I remember reading about Seachem Equilibrium, is that a good source? thanks


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

I'm sorry that I didn't answer sooner. Been pretty busy.

Yes, Seachem Equilibrium will raise your Gh. The bottle will tell you what to dose.

I'm not saying that it's your answer. However, depending on plant mass, light setup (and many other things), at least in my setup, I have to dose Seachem to get at least 11 to 12 d Gh. Otherwise, the plants start melting. I still can't believe that it takes that much for them to do well.

Like I said, it all depends on your setup. Remember, watch your plants. They tell you when they need something. If it turns out that it's not a Ca/Mg deficiency, at least you can cross both of those off your list, and try something else.

HTH

Lissette


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

It could be a lighting problem. 1.5 wpg is pretty low. Ludwigias love light, when they are shaded they melt away. Im going to bet its the lighting.


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

the ludwigias are growing fine in 1.5wpg... they are growing pretty good actually but in my 20g with 2.5wpg (after i updated its a little over 3wpg i think) it isn't doing that well so i doubt its lighting. If i go to petsmart of my lfs any time soon i'll pick up a jar of equilibrium. Is equilibrium good for shrimp and snails?? thanks


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

MS- i probably read through your post too fast to catch the details. Are the ludwigias the only plants showing this problem?

If its not the light they maybe its the water like you mentioned. I'd look into that as well.


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

ya its only the ludwigias, the only big difference i see is the 40g goes through the salt water softener and the 20g i get the water from the hose outside that isn't treated by the water softener. And in SA, Tx that is a big jump cuase we are on a limestone aquifer. I think i really should try out the equilibrium or an alternative. I have a few questions to make sure i am not thinking the wrong way

1. Hardness is determined by the Mg and Ca in the water right?

2. Limestone is all Ca right? (at least most of it)

so if a big portion of the hardnes is coming from Ca then i'm missing a lot of Mg right? 

3. Where can i get Mg from? is epson salt a good source? any other choices? i know equilibrium is

thanks


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## Oqsy (Jul 3, 2004)

if you really are missing Mg, then by adding equilibrium it might be nearly impossible to get the right balance. equilibrium contains more calcium than magnesium, so adding it, while increasing Mg, will also increase Ca, propetuating the gap between Mg and Ca target levels... I honestly don't know the ratio off the top of my head, but I'm sure a search here would yield great advice for ideal Ca:Mg ratios for planted tanks.

Oqsy


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

Okay, here goes:

1. Yes
2. No, from what I've read, limestone contains Ca and Mg.
3. No. Testing is the only way to find out what the plants are in need of. Your tank water might be more deficient in Mg than Ca. Like I said, it all depends on your setup and what your plants are consuming the most.

Your 40 gal. has 1.5 wpg. The demand for nutrients in that tank is virtually nil because it is a low light tank. Not even Co2 is needed (but never a bad idea). 

Your 20 gal. has 2.5 wpg (medium lighting). This planted tank will consume nutrients at a much faster level with Co2. Your light is higher, so adding Co2 will greatly benefit your plants. At 2.5 wpg, I'd definitely go for Co2, and you must also dose accordingly. Try diy Co2 for now and see what happens.

Who knows, it might be the answer that you are looking for.

Lissette :wink:


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

Oqsy,

Equillibrium has 23% Potassium, 8% Calcium, 2.-% Magnesium.

I'm having trouble reaching the Ca level needed for my plants because of this. Which is why I dose heavily. At the same time, I'm over dosing on K and other traces.

I have to find some other source of Ca for the plants.

Lissette


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

the 20g is more then 3wpg now and has about 30ppm co2 which allows me to do EI and its always been kept close to 30ppm with DIY Co2 already


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

oh and any other alternatives to Mg?? thx


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

Ah, so Co2 and light shouldn't be a problem at all then. I didn't see this in your post.

Unfortunately, I don't know another source for Mg. Maybe someone else can chime in.

Lissette


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## matthewburk (Sep 22, 2005)

You can get magnesium from greg watson I believe. BTW my tap is 30GH and I am growing L. repens fine after a few snafus. I was potassium defecient and all the growth came in all curled up. It only occured in my high light tank though, due to the more rapid growth the potassium becuase a real issue.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

epsom salt is the best source for mg. You can buy it walmart or any store that sells health products.


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

Lissette said:


> Ah, so Co2 and light shouldn't be a problem at all then. I didn't see this in your post.
> 
> Unfortunately, I don't know another source for Mg. Maybe someone else can chime in.
> 
> Lissette


I didn't mention co2 anywhere but i also didn't mention not having co2 

I'll try the epsom salt next time i go to the store or maybe look for some at home. Any ideas on a good measurement to start off at with a 20g? thanks


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## Bert H (Dec 15, 2003)

If you're on top of a limestone aquifer, as I am in Florida with well water, you have mostly all calcium. Add Mg to your water! Buy some Epsom salts from the store or get some from Greg Watson. For a long time I couldn't grow L. repens to save my life. Then I started to add Mg and they started to grow for me. It also makes a difference in trying to grow A. reinickii without stunting, curling leaves. As a refernce point, I add 1 tsp twice a week to my 50 gal. BTW, my gh is 11, mostly from Ca.


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

MercuryShrimp,

I'd go with Bert's advice. Try the Epsom salt first and see what happens. I add 2 tsps of Epsom salt in my 29 gal. (after weekly 50% w/c), and wow, what a difference it makes.

Hopefully, you'll see some positive results too.

Lissette :smile:


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

ok thanks for the help guys if i dont have any i'll pick it up soon becuase BSS is sending me some A. reinickii which should get here by tommorow. I also have some stunting in my rotala rotundifolia, is that from the same thing? thanks


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## Lissette (Apr 2, 2005)

No Problem.

Yes, it's affecting your Rotala too.

In my tank the Rotala Indica, Didiplis Diandra, and the L. Repens would do that if the Ca isn't high enough. Eventually, they'll either turn brown and melt, or they'll show an unnatural color (especially the Rotala).

Lissette


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

was gonna go to the grocery store right after driving school but turns out my mom had an old carton about 1/6 full of epson salt and that is enough to last me like half a year dosing 1/4tsp a week  I just dosed 1/4tsp a minute ago just to get through the week until Friday my WC day and just dose 1tsp after that cause it looks like serious stunting  hopefuly i can save the last baby stem of ludwigia and rotala or i'll have to get it off someone again. Anyways, thanks for the help guys, i'll let you know if anything goes wrong and progress


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