# GSA, help me diagnose the issue and fix it.



## tbarabash (May 18, 2011)

You tried everything else I would have suggested :\ I'd say it's a good try. 40B is what, 16 inches tall? Par must be pretty high with 3 bulb HO. I have 4 geissman bulb over my 36 bowfront but it's 21" tall and only have GSA problems on crypts/anubias


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

Yes 16" tall, but also 18" across. I tried to take advantage of that by separating my fixtures such that they share as little area as possible, so no more than 2 bulbs illuminate any particular area. The lights are also lifted off the tank a bit by the variable height mounting clamps that come with Glo fixtures, probably 4-6" or so.

It must be pretty severe to have as intense of a GSA issue as I'm having on stems.


----------



## ryc120 (Jan 17, 2012)

How long are you leaving your lights on for? Try lowering the duration


----------



## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Have you tried adding any MgSo4? I would guess yours is GDA unless you get big circles of it on your glass, then its GSA. Epsom salts should help.


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

I do occasionally have green spots, but they are not particularly plentiful and sporadic. I have moderately hard water here so I would think that there would be a decent supply of non-calcium minerals in it. I will, however, pick up some MgSO4 asap and see if that has an impact. Thank you very much for the idea.


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

Also to answer Ryc120's questions, my lights are currently on for about 7 hours. I already reduced them from 10 hours without significant result.


----------



## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

What other plants do you have in here? The two you have shown are slow growers and dont suck up a ton of ferts like EI dosing is giving them. Do you have some fast growing/nutrient export plants in here too?


----------



## ryc120 (Jan 17, 2012)

I have pretty much the same set up as you except I have a 29gal. Just started to get an outbreak of GSA on my Amazon swords and back glass. My lights were on for 11 hours. Reducing mine to 8 hours a day starting today.
Also going to try starting CO2 1 hour before lights go on and turning it off 1 hour before lights go out.


----------



## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

This looks painfully like a CO2 issue.


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

chad320 said:


> What other plants do you have in here? The two you have shown are slow growers and dont suck up a ton of ferts like EI dosing is giving them. Do you have some fast growing/nutrient export plants in here too?


I have a pretty respectable bunch of wisteria going to one side. Other plants in the tank are glosso, Rotala Macranda, Limnophila Aromatica, Stargrass, Sagittaria Platyphyla and Subulata (with the later being new to the tank), Rotala Wallichi (which has almost entirely been choked off at this point but isn't yet melting). All are suffering from the algae to one degree or another. The wisteria appears to be the least affected, but that's not surprising. 



ryc120 said:


> I have pretty much the same set up as you except I have a 29gal. Just started to get an outbreak of GSA on my Amazon swords and back glass. My lights were on for 11 hours. Reducing mine to 8 hours a day starting today.
> Also going to try starting CO2 1 hour before lights go on and turning it off 1 hour before lights go out.


CO2 comes on an hour and a half before lights do.



plantbrain said:


> This looks painfully like a CO2 issue.


Yea, it really does. My drop checker is almost always yellow/lime green. Also judging from my fish's activity levels, my CO2 is pretty high as well. KH/pH relationship also pegs me pretty high, whatever that's worth... Oddly enough though, it almost never goes back to blue by morning. I'm considering going from GLA's atomizer to a inline reactor of some sort so that I can get a little more assurance of complete efficiency.


----------



## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Here is what I would do. Do a 2 50% WC within 3 days to completely reset your tank. Than, dose your fert keeping your nitrate around 15 ppm, potassium 10ppm, and phosphate around 5ppm to 10ppm. Right now, your phosphate level is too high and it is upsetting your tank balance. 3 T5HO lights are a bit too much. Try maybe using 2 lights. As for the CO2, makes sure it is yellow. Not lime green but yellow. My CO2 is light yellow by 1pm, CO2 is on at 9am. It remains yellow until 5pm and it is off. Fish is fine throughout the whole day.


----------



## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I think adding 15ppm a week would be considered pretty high. Do you have any evidence and a specific ppm for PO4 that will induce the the result from the OP?

Drop checkers frankly stink.............and they really take awhile to respond........and people place way too much reliance in their measure.

My tanks run at 70ppm, then another 45-55ppm, another 50ppm.
I have good current and good filtration, no surface scum, good O2, surface movement.

It's not JUST adding more and more CO2 till you gas your fish, there are a no# of significant factors, but lousy measurement and assumptions of those measurements, this prevents good stable CO2.

I have high ferts and only have this issue once the CO2 runs out/issues with CO2.

GSA is PO4(too low) and/or CO2(too low).

There might be other possible causes, but these two are very suggestive or poor CO2, PO4 dosing is EASY to rule out....CO2.....not so easy.......


----------



## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Although I agree with Toms statement, I am left wondering why you would go to great lengths to have a pressurized system and be tight on the substrate. This is basically an inert substrate and even with root tabs you are constantly tipping the scales. I would look to your base layer before relating it to Co2. The same is true for EI dosing. It works good as a starting point but back off it to tie it into your lights and Co2.


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

I wouldn't have thought that substrate fertilizer would have had a profound impact on algae. But to answer your question, it was a combination of finances, availability, and bad advice. I've been considering scooping it and putting MTS under it, but I was dubious whether it would warrant the effort.


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

I changed 75% of the water (50% + %50). I did some trimming on the plants to remove the heavily affected portions of the plants, and then redosed to about 15 ppm nitrate and 3-4 ppm phosphate, then added MgSO4. Lights have been reduced to just the 2 bulb Hagen Glo fixture. I upped my CO2 a little bit, but I didn't want to turn it up too much without me being able to be present of observe the tank (I'm not home for the first hour or so of my photoperiod), so I'm going to delay my photoperiod until I get home from work so that I can crank the CO2 but also be diligent about fish safety levels. Will report back when I have better results.

On a related note, will switching to a inline reactor (rex grigg or similar) help with low CO2 problems over my current GLA atomizer?


----------



## BioHouse (Jan 30, 2010)

don't do some trimming. do heavy trim. trim at the very bottom of the stem. let new plants grow


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

I probably reduced the biomass of my plants by 50% or so, maybe more. Perhaps 'some' wasn't the best term to use.


----------



## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Sounds like youve really got it together. Wait a couple weeks and see what happens. PM me if you still have some problems.


----------



## Aqua_chem (Jul 23, 2011)

Ok, we'll see if this pans out. I'll update when I can see results on way or another.


----------

