# Black Diamond Sand - ENDING ALL SPECULATIONS!



## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

Ok, so I bit the bullet and went to the Tractor Supply store around my area and luckily they had one bag open and I was able to feel and touch it. Immediately I knew that the substrate was good to go! I was so confident then I loaded up my car with 5 bags and I even went as far as grabbing a small pile and rubbing it more than gently on my palms for a good 10 seconds or so and it felt great! LOL, more like a massage so this substrate is NOT going to cut your hands or cause any major scratches as some claims unless you are very careless and have it stuck under your magnet cleaner. But having even gravel would do the same thing. The total came out to $30 something dollars for 250lbs of sand which should cover 3" for a six foot tank.

So all in all - the substrate is between sand and gravel, not too rough as gravel and not too soft as sand. I got the 20/40 grit which is the box checked in the middle.

Now its time to rinse and start up my tank! Its gona be a busy day!

KUDOS to *TACTUSMORTUS* for the recommendation! Hopefully the plants will thrive!


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

Questions: 

1.) How do you rinse this stuff? do you just put it in?
2.) I've considered using this diamond sand as the border of the tank, and perhaps get flourite sand for the middle. So its all 3" of flourite in certain parts of the tank, and the rest are just fillers. What's your thought on that?
3.) Can we put clay into the diamond sand to help with nutrients instead of flourite root tabs? How much and how far apart? what kind of clay?
4.) I have a sump tank beneath, I thought perhaps the 30 gallons could be substrated with the flourite sand and possibly the nutrients would be then the dosing for the water column for the display tank above?

What's everyone's thought on this?


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

Where in new york are you? I'm looking for some too. How far from city? You should try using miracle grow potting mix underneath it. Just a thought. Plenty of nutrients


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

Too much hassle


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## tuffgong (Apr 13, 2010)

You don't need to rinse the Black Diamond. I've set up several tanks w/out rinsing and they were all fairly clear from the very first fill up. Just fill the tank very very slowly and use a plate to disperse the water entering the tank.


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## xxbenjamminxx (Aug 8, 2011)

I just put in a bucket and kept rinsing it with the hose while stirring with my hand and dumping off the excess water. At first you will notice a little film of oily looking stuff on top but it will go away and poses no harm to fish or plants. 

I use homemade osmocote root tabs in my tanks with it and spaced them about 3-4 inches apart throughout the substrate. I dont see how clay would do anything to harm the substrate and should only improve its iron content. 

I'm not sure about the whole sump thing since I have never had one. Im glad another person is chiming in on how its not gonna cut your hands all up and all that. About the scratches in glass ANY substrate will do that, but with a little common sense on the part of the person cleaning you wont have any troubles.


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

JonAseed said:


> Ok, so I bit the bullet and went to the Tractor Supply store around my area and luckily they had one bag open and I was able to feel and touch it. Immediately I knew that the substrate was good to go! I was so confident then I loaded up my car with 5 bags and I even went as far as grabbing a small pile and rubbing it more than gently on my palms for a good 10 seconds or so and it felt great! LOL, more like a massage so this substrate is NOT going to cut your hands or cause any major scratches as some claims unless you are very careless and have it stuck under your magnet cleaner. But having even gravel would do the same thing. The total came out to $30 something dollars for 250lbs of sand which should cover 3" for a six foot tank.
> 
> So all in all - the substrate is between sand and gravel, not too rough as gravel and not too soft as sand. I got the 20/40 grit which is the box checked in the middle.
> 
> ...


Glad you pulled the trigger! Wish my Tractor Supply would stock the bigger stuff they always have the small stuff only in stock.


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## mach_six (Sep 12, 2005)

Can you tell us which particular grade you got, Black Diamond makes 5 grades. I would think it's the "Wicked Sister" 20-40 or "Little Furry" 30-60 which are labled as finer grades.

Oops, I see you said 20-40.


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

JonAseed said:


> Questions:
> 
> 1.) How do you rinse this stuff? do you just put it in?
> 2.) I've considered using this diamond sand as the border of the tank, and perhaps get flourite sand for the middle. So its all 3" of flourite in certain parts of the tank, and the rest are just fillers. What's your thought on that?
> ...


I did no rinsing I just filled up the tank. Like others said you are going to have a little oil film at the top it goes away as soon as you get a filter running. The size you got is to big to be sucked into the filter so no worries. 

I wouldn't go with only clay however I have considered going with a member on here in the swap and shop who sells a mineralized top soil refill type thing. Where he has filled gel capsules with dolomite, muriate of potash, and clay. I figured that would work just as well as flourite root tabs however would likely last longer and would still not look terrible if it mixed over time. However flourite root tabs are still ideal if money wasn't a concern. Because as I mentioned they blend in perfectly. Make sure you get the 40 pack though and it should be enough for your entire tank. I found them online for under $20 at the link below.

http://www.dtpetsupplies.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=9292

As for your sump I would think that once the flourite sucks in the nutrients it is not going to release the nutrients back into the water column. If you are running a sump though you could go with a kents aquadoser then you just put your micro and macro solutions in those and dose accordingly. There is a sticky in the equipment section of the forum about autodosing ferts. Check it out it is a wealth of info on the subject.


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## Optix (May 31, 2011)

JonAseed said:


> Ok, so I bit the bullet and went to the Tractor Supply store around my area and luckily they had one bag open and I was able to feel and touch it. Immediately I knew that the substrate was good to go! I was so confident then I loaded up my car with 5 bags and I even went as far as grabbing a small pile and rubbing it more than gently on my palms for a good 10 seconds or so and it felt great! LOL, more like a massage *so this substrate is NOT going to cut your hands or cause any major scratches as some claims unless you are very careless and have it stuck under your magnet cleaner.* But having even gravel would do the same thing. The total came out to $30 something dollars for 250lbs of sand which should cover 3" for a six foot tank.
> 
> So all in all - the substrate is between sand and gravel, not too rough as gravel and not too soft as sand. I got the 20/40 grit which is the box checked in the middle.
> 
> ...


well see


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

Optix said:


> well see


About? When I fill the tank?


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

Hah, another person who has no experience with it chiming in. This happens all the time JonAseed.


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## Optix (May 31, 2011)

TactusMortus said:


> Hah, another person who has no experience with it chiming in. This happens all the time JonAseed.


umm...no dumb dumb
he had another thread asking the exact same thing before...I told him there that I have it in my tank and have scratched my glass with it before

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/s...ing-black-diamond-sand-setup.html#post1572108




JonAseed said:


> About? When I fill the tank?


if you scratch your glass while filling/scaping


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## tuffgong (Apr 13, 2010)

There's no way you can scratch your glass from filling. If some how you end up scraping the glass with the sand and some pressure then of course it will scratch. It is sand after all.....


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

So I went ahead and filled the glass cup 1/4 filled with the diamond black sand and 1/4 with water. Then started to stir really hard and I can hear the sand grinding against the glass for about 20 seconds. Results? Barely any scratches...

So that makes me wonder what grit did you get and if your tank was made of acrylic or glass?


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

TactusMortus said:


> I did no rinsing I just filled up the tank. Like others said you are going to have a little oil film at the top it goes away as soon as you get a filter running. The size you got is to big to be sucked into the filter so no worries.
> 
> I wouldn't go with only clay however I have considered going with a member on here in the swap and shop who sells a mineralized top soil refill type thing. Where he has filled gel capsules with dolomite, muriate of potash, and clay. I figured that would work just as well as flourite root tabs however would likely last longer and would still not look terrible if it mixed over time. However flourite root tabs are still ideal if money wasn't a concern. Because as I mentioned they blend in perfectly. Make sure you get the 40 pack though and it should be enough for your entire tank. I found them online for under $20 at the link below.
> 
> ...


When I filled my cup up with the sand, I noticed there were little grits floating and the water looked a bit dull. But the bag says "Washed Product"....so should I still rinse?


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

I never did rinse but you could.


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

Optix said:


> umm...no dumb dumb
> he had another thread asking the exact same thing before...I told him there that I have it in my tank and have scratched my glass with it before
> 
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/s...ing-black-diamond-sand-setup.html#post1572108
> ...


I think by your name calling I can assume you are not mature enough to have an intelligent conversation. Many have used the diamond blasting sand. I have never had an issue with scratching glass. Like others have said if you get it between your glass and magnetic glass cleaner. You will have a problem. However the same can be said about commercial substrates such as flourite sand. Hell if you got aquasoil in between your magnetic cleaner and the glass I would think it would scuff it up. 

However the stuff I use is heavy it will not float. I run a 1050 gph powerhead over it about 6-8 inches above the surface and it doesn't move much at all just all the garbage that has settled on it.


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

Anyone know anything about clay and sand combo? I tried googling and searching, but not much luck.


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

What are you looking to find out about it?


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

how to fertize the sand with it. IF that is even possible


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## DerekFF (May 24, 2011)

It doesnt really fert the sand...you just get a nice mix of sub thats easy for roots to move through with clay pieces in it as a bonus! And magnets=scratches no matter what.....its inevitable


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## xxbenjamminxx (Aug 8, 2011)

I just use Osmocote "Ice cubes" that I quickly place in the sand about 3 inches or so apart.


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

Good stuff guys, so I ended up grabbing 3 bags of Flourite yesterday and will be putting them pockets in the sand. I already know the layout I want, so there will be pockets in the sand where it's 100% of flourite sand and all 3" of it. The black diamond will serve as a filler and very thin layer, perhaps .3 inches as topping of black diamond on flourite.

So how soon can I put my plants in this? I already have established media so the cycle can get started.

Also, I want to place the dwarf grass on the front to cover about 2 feet length and 1 feet wide. Could I mix flourite with black sand (75/25 ratio), or pocket out 100% flourite or flourish tab for this? 

How does those flourish tabs work? I purchased 40 seachem flourish root tabs. If it were to be an area with lots of plants like the dwarf grass, do I put the flourish tabs every 2 square inch?

Clay - how big and how many clay piece should I put in the sand?


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## nilocg (Jul 12, 2010)

JonAseed said:


> Good stuff guys, so I ended up grabbing 3 bags of Flourite yesterday and will be putting them pockets in the sand. I already know the layout I want, so there will be pockets in the sand where it's 100% of flourite sand and all 3" of it. The black diamond will serve as a filler and very thin layer, perhaps .3 inches as topping of black diamond on flourite.
> 
> So how soon can I put my plants in this? I already have established media so the cycle can get started.
> 
> ...


You can plant right away, if you are going to use root tabs you really don't have to worry about the flourite. It really won't help you grow the plants any better than the blasting grit. you will still want to place the fert tabs in the areas with the flourite.

As for the fert tabs, place them under each large plant and the space them out every 5-6" under the hair grass. 

I'm not sure how you are going to use the clay, but If they are in capsules I would think spacing them out like the fert tabs would work well.


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

nilocg said:


> You can plant right away, if you are going to use root tabs you really don't have to worry about the flourite. It really won't help you grow the plants any better than the blasting grit. you will still want to place the fert tabs in the areas with the flourite.
> 
> As for the fert tabs, place them under each large plant and the space them out every 5-6" under the hair grass.
> 
> I'm not sure how you are going to use the clay, but If they are in capsules I would think spacing them out like the fert tabs would work well.



Awesome! 

So if the flourite isnt any better than blasting grit? I figure it would be easier to plant in certain areas of the tank that is lacking Flourish root tabs. My impression of Flourite sand is that its alternative to Dirt. I don't have to dose or anything, just plant and you're good to go. Am I wrong?


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

anyone?


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

Flourite is just inert sand same as blasting sand. It will intake nutrients however which blasting sand will not. You have to use root tabs regardless of which you choose. With 40 flourish root tabs you will have plenty for your tank that there will not be any dead spots. I used 30 on my entire 120 gallon tank.


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## mach_six (Sep 12, 2005)

If you look at the composition on Seachem's site the flourite does contain higher traces of certain elements depending on which bag you got. Isn't that enough to make flourite the better choice than inert sand and gravel?


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## TactusMortus (Jun 28, 2011)

mach_six said:


> If you look at the composition on Seachem's site the flourite does contain higher traces of certain elements depending on which bag you got. Isn't that enough to make flourite the better choice than inert sand and gravel?


Because of the price no I would wager just about anything that if you put two potted plants in individual pots one with blasting sand and root tabs the other one with flourite and root tabs. That you would have nearly identical growth rates.


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

awesome! So I finally filled up the tank last night and the sparkle in the sand was not as visible anymore. I guess this is normal.

I need ideas on how to make my tank look better.


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

mach_six said:


> If you look at the composition on Seachem's site the flourite does contain higher traces of certain elements depending on which bag you got. Isn't that enough to make flourite the better choice than inert sand and gravel?


It might say that... but my tests(lab) have said otherwise. They aren't available nutrients, anyways. 

It has a decent cec, and that is what makes it better than sand. Ordinary soil is better than it.


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

OverStocked said:


> It might say that... but my tests(lab) have said otherwise. They aren't available nutrients, anyways.
> 
> It has a decent cec, and that is what makes it better than sand. Ordinary soil is better than it.


 
Whats your take on putting clay in the Black Diamond grit? Will it give it any nutrient value?


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

A light dusting on the glass won't hurt. However most clay is basically just a high cec substrate too, so it needs to have nutrients added to it, as well.


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## JonAseed (Oct 19, 2011)

OverStocked said:


> A light dusting on the glass won't hurt. However most clay is basically just a high cec substrate too, so it needs to have nutrients added to it, as well.


 
Sorry? Well I read somewhere people use it when adding soil. So I figure it could have th same affect for sand?


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## tuffgong (Apr 13, 2010)

In all of my sand only tanks I use Root Medic root capsules for my substrate ferts. I can usually get at least 6 months out of them. You can add stuff like clay and other ferts initially, but I think it will all eventually leach out over time and will need to be replenished anyway. I like to keep it simple so that it's easy to maintain.


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