# Rotala Indica how do I get it pink



## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

What lighting are you guys using to get rotala indica to turn pink. Mine turned green so I added 40 watts of light right above it to my tank to give me 3.25 wpg. Now the plant is just growing horizontally and staying green.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

What is your NO3 level?

Low nitrates and good iron/micro supply is what makes pink plants even pinker.


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## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

Nitrates 5-10 ppm. I added 2.5 ml Flourish 2 days ago, 4 ml Iron 1 day ago, and all I got was hair algae.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

I changed the title of this thread.

Rotala indica "Pink" implies that there is another variety of Rotala indica. I am pretty sure there is not.

The plant you have Anthony is Rotala rotundifolia. According to Kasslemann, Rotala indica really isn't very common in the hobby at all.

Mike


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## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

It was red to pink when I got it. What wattage gets it that color? Why would growth go horizontal?


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Anthony, that is another stem plant that seems to respond to elevated iron levels for coloring. Personally I think that this plant grows with a nicer look in lower lighting from my experience. 
As far as the sideways growth... dont ask me why but it seems that some stems do this to propagate itself. I have maybe 8-10 stems of it and 2 out of the bunch are growing sideways and putting out new stems from just about each set of leaves, where as the stems growing upwards are not. 
Also the sideways stems are throwing out roots like crazy from the entire stem, the others are not. 
Same light, different growth habits in the stems so I dont think it is the light causing it.
Are you seeing lots of new shoots growing from your stems ?


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Momotaro said:


> I changed the title of this thread.
> 
> Rotala indica "Pink" implies that there is another variety of Rotala indica. I am pretty sure there is not.
> 
> ...


Sure there is  I have two varieties of rotala rotundifolia in my tank side by side, they are distinctly different. The one Anthony mentioned(I think) is normally green, with pink tips depending on nutrient, this one is by far the most common in the US. The other one is kind of the opposite, the old growth turns orange/red while the new growth might be green depending on nutrient. It is the latter that might be the one that Ammano uses a lot in his picture book, where it can be very red. I bought this from a very good LFS, it is very red in his tank. I am not trying to manupilate nutrient levels, just keep everything high, so it is not as red in my tanks.

Another difference that I see is, the more common rotundifolia likes to grow 3-4 leaves per whorl for the most part, the redder one often has only 2 leaves per whorl, but I have some stems with 3 leaves per whorl as well. This can be variable depending on conditions.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

> Sure there is


Prove it.  

I am really tired of hobbyists creating different varieties of plants themselves by just adding a set of quotation marks and a color. That is not how science works. We need to be far more responsible than that. Those who are serious about the culture and propagation of aquatic plants should really know better.

Please provide a link or some real, scientific reference.

Mike


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## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

Iron just seemed to help algae. It is, however, growing new stems from the plants that are growing horizontally just like Buck had mentioned.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

I don't think dosing iron alone created your algae problem. 

How soon after your lighting upgrade did the algae appear? Did you adjust your CO2 and other nutrient dosing to compliment your lighting upgrade? Upgrading your lighting also requires a rethinking of your nutrient fertilization. The added light boosts your plants requirements for NO3, PO4, CO2 and micros. Take a look at what you were dosing and try and figure out what you need to dose since you've increased your lighting.

Mike


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## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

Yes, DIY Co 2 (2, 1 gallon jugs) is at 25 ppm right after lights out. Nitrates 7.5 ppm. Also dosing potassium nitrate(Grant's Stump Remover), Flourish Potassium, Flourish, Marc Weiss' Natural Aquarium Vital. My phospahtes are kinda low at only 0.5 ppm.


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## jwholmes (Feb 27, 2004)

I have 260 watts over my 75g and my Rotala Indica stays green until it nears the top of the tank. Then the tops turn gold and if I leave it they turn pinkish-red. Once they have the color I like, I pull them, cut off the top and replant. The color fades out a bit but as it grows near the light it colors up again. Just cutting off the tops usually gives me thin, weak stems after a while but replanting the tops keeps them thick and healthy looking.


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Momotaro said:


> Prove it.
> 
> I am really tired of hobbyists creating different varieties of plants themselves by just adding a set of quotation marks and a color. That is not how science works. We need to be far more responsible than that. Those who are serious about the culture and propagation of aquatic plants should really know better.
> 
> ...


I was not saying there is a plant with the proper name r. rotundifolia 'pink', not at all. :tongue: I was just saying there ARE more than one variety/cultivar of r. rotundifolia. At least there is one r. rotundifoia 'colorata', according to Carlos(tsunami) in the LAST post here 
I believe I have this one because I saw it just as red as in Ammano's pics in the store. It is currently not as red in my tank, but at any given moment, the two plants are DIFFERENT. I have had both for more than 6 months, so any initial difference due to different conditions would be long erased. I can show you some pic later with the two side by side, but there are some pics in the link above, still not as red as it can be. On another note, I also have Rotala rotundifolia 'green'(AKA, rotala sp. 'green'), which is used a lot by ammano as well, but is either one the proper name? I don't know, few know I guess.


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

I have to agree wholeheartedly with Shalu here on the different varieties... proper names of course are up in the air but I I have personally seen and grown both varieties Mike. They are different and were in the same tank with same light and nutrients. One very red and then a different batch purchased at a different time that would not get the same coloration or growth patterns in the leafs.. 
Which is which I couldnt tell you but I will and have to agree that there are "varieties"... now I just call them all pretty! 
Great plants...whatever you call them. 
Someone straighten this out please.... roud:


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

> is either one the proper name? I don't know, few know I guess.


That is part of the argument I am trying to make. We really shouldn't suppose a name. By doing that, at times we (ourselves here on the board) are creating varieties on our own. 

Because a certain specimen of a certain plant appears redder than another specimen of that particular plant doesn't mean that plant should be labeled Xxxx xxxx "Red" by us. Who are we to just create varieties of plants. I argued this point in another post a while back when the individual had labeled a plant on their own and actually created their own Genus. 

There are people who actually study and achieve PhD. degrees in the science of plants. Botanists! We should look for new plants. We should strive for newer cultivars. We should be observant! We should leave the actual naming of plants to the people who know best. The botanists!

I am not disputing the fact that you folks have some really interesting specimens of R. rotundifolia. I am disputing calling a plant Rotala indica "Pink" when no such cultivar exists in any scientific literature. 

Mike


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Shalu did not call it Rotala pink... he said there are other varieties and I believe that. The original poster Anthony called it "pink" (unintentionally I imagine) but Shalu only pointed out the belief of the different varieties.

The leaf patterns mentioned alone that I have seen make me wonder what the proper ID is on them... 
Any Rotala experts out there ? Any Botanists ? Maybe you could hash it out at the next meeting you go to and get some opinions... roud:


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## bharada (Mar 5, 2004)

I've had rotundifolia given to me by a friend, and also bought what was sold as indica. The rotundifoia I got was very pale pink/orange and the indica was nearly blood red (looked like R magenta). However, after several weeks in my tank it all looked the same. Now it all grows with green lower stems that get pink/orange tips as it nears the surface (under hight light).

I can't attribute the pink/orange coloration to low NO3 since I typically have 10-20ppm of NO3 along with 1.5-2ppm of PO4. And i don't dose Fe except for what's in TMG (20ml 3x week in my 125g tank).


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

I don't really disagree with above statements by Mike. But your original statement makes it sound like, there is one and only cultivar/variant of r. rotundifolia(implying they will all look the same under the same conditions), which is not true. From a practical view point, without a real proper name, how would you expect people to ask questions on a specific cultivar, like, "How do I get my supposed-to-be-red-leaved-rotala-rotundifolia to look red?" :icon_bigg

Bill, I know you got your supposed-to-be-red one from FloridaDriftwood. I got the red one from Ocean aquarium. It was and is different from the regular rotundifolia.


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## Aftica (Nov 26, 2003)

I think there is 2.. but not really the same variation etc... I went to Tropica's website and looked at the stuff below... the picture looks like they are similar - and the color is explained in the text etc...

Rotala sp. ''Green'' and Rotala rotundifolia

*As per Tropica's website... regarding Rotala rotundifolia*

The Latin name means ''the plant with the round leaves''. But this only applies to the marsh variety, which has circular leaves. In aquariums Rotala rotundifolia has long, thin leaves. Unlike other Rotala species it is relatively undemanding, although it needs good light to produce red leaves. It forms side shoots willingly, becoming compact and bushy. This also means that it is hard for light to reach the lower leaves, so the plant should be pruned frequently. Also known as Rotala indica.


*As per Tropica's website... regarding Rotala sp. ''Green''*

Growth and appearance similar to Rotala rotundifolia, but leaves are lighter green even when light is relatively good.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

The original title of the thread was "Rotala indica "Pink"". Rotala indica and Rotala rotundifolia are two different plants.

If we take a moment to reexamine my first post:


> Rotala indica "Pink" implies that there is another variety of Rotala indica. I am pretty sure there is not.
> 
> The plant you have Anthony is Rotala rotundifolia. According to Kasslemann, Rotala indica really isn't very common in the hobby at all.


My comments were initially about Rotala indica a plant of which there is only one known cultivar, that being Rotala indica. I have never seen Rotala indica, never mind Rotala indica "Pink". 

I told Anthony the plant he had was Rotala rotundifolia. I probably should have told him the plant he had was more than likely Rotala rotundifolia, since I haven't actually seen the plant he actually has.

However, I am not sure where I argued there was a single form of Rotala rotundifolia? I have you guys coming at me from all sides about Rotala rotunidfolia pointing out to me me the different varieties you have growing and have read about and I have never disputed that fact! There are two varieties in my oriental aquarium book! _Where did you guys come up with my arguing a single variety of rotala rotundifolia?_ :icon_conf 

I only disputed the creations of plant names. I am glad Shalu has seen my point on that subject! roud: 



> From a practical view point, without a real proper name, how would you expect people to ask questions on a specific cultivar, like, "How do I get my supposed-to-be-red-leaved-rotala-rotundifolia to look red?


From a practical standpoint, I would expect someone to ask "How do I get my Rotala rotundifolia/Rotala indica (if they actually have that plant) redder?"

I would love some of the plant that was and is different than the "regular" rotundifolia for myself!

Mike


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

OK, did not pay attention to the part you were stressing "indica" and "rotundifolia". My bad. But honestly, are you expecting people to use "rotundifolia" only? I think you are fighting a losing battle, because these two words have been used way too interchangebly in this hobby, even Amano the Meister himself. And people buy it from the store/online labelled as indica.

So Mike, would it be more agreeable to you if the original poster used 
"rotala rotundifolia 'pink'"? :icon_bigg 


Momotaro said:


> From a practical standpoint, I would expect someone to ask "How do I get my Rotala rotundifolia/Rotala indica (if they actually have that plant) redder?"
> 
> Mike


There lies the problem. In this incarnation of the question, there is no differentiation which cultivar we are talking about, there is NO hope of getting the more common rotundifolia to be as blood red as the "red" cultivar CAN be no matter how hard you try, I bet $1 on that. I am just using this as an example, the original poster talked about pink :icon_bigg not exactly sure which one he was referring to either.


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## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

Sorry to have started all this. I was just wondering how to give it more of the pink to red look? It has 3 leaves per whorl. Bottom half is red, but the tops have grown green.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

> So Mike, would it be more agreeable to you if the original poster used
> "rotala rotundifolia 'pink'"?


Nope. :hihi: Still "creating" a variant. 

There are still only two known varieties on the books. 

I had Rotala rotundifolia and the color of the plant depended on the conditions in the aquarium. High nitrates = less color, lower nitrates = more color. The plant's color changed with the water parameters. I'll see if I can scare up some photos!

Anthony, you didn't create any problems. I enjoy talking about plants, as does Shalu!

Mike


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Momotaro said:


> I had Rotala rotundifolia and the color of the plant depended on the conditions in the aquarium. High nitrates = less color, lower nitrates = more color. The plant's color changed with the water parameters.
> 
> Mike


That's given for many plants, including this one, or two  My point was, I always have them side by side(like 1 inch apart :icon_bigg ), sure, their color would both change depending on what and how much I dump into the tank, but at ANY GIVEN MOMENT, they are always different, never the same. Sounds like Buck had the same experience.

Nope, Anthony, you did not create any problems. It just gave us some excuse to dribble about plants :tongue: .


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

Could you have both R. routundifolia and R. indica?

Mike


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Momotaro said:


> Could you have both R. routundifolia and R. indica?
> 
> Mike


I have no idea. Tom Barr claims that he has the TRUE indica, so maybe one of these days I am going to haggle him to give me a few stems.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

Do it! Then you can compare and we will all know for sure!

Mike


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Momotaro said:


> Do it! Then you can compare and we will all know for sure!
> 
> Mike


Alrighty, Sir Mike. I am going to put a request to him before the next club plant swap, which will be a month or two away. wait, is it on the fed/CA obnoxious weed list? If so, I don't think he is going to do it, because his day job is "Weed police" for the state of california :icon_bigg


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## Opiesilver (Nov 3, 2003)

Here are the recognized varities that I know of;

Rotala indica
Rotala macranda
Rotala macranda var. Green
Rotala macranda var. Green Narrow
Rotala macranda var. Narrow Leaf
Rotala macranda var. Small Leaf
Rotala macranda var. Verigated
Rotala najean
Rotala najean var. Pearl
Rotala rotundifolia var. Green
Rotala wallichii
Rotala wallichii var. Long Leaf

RH at AquaBotanic may know of a few that I don't. He works with a few different nurseries that I do.


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Opiesilver, we are not talking about different species of rotala. :icon_bigg Mainly rotundifolia.
Rotala indica from aquariumplants.com is actually the most common form of Rotala rotundifolia in the US. I know, I got it from you guys.


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## Opiesilver (Nov 3, 2003)

Yeah, I know. I just thought I would throw that out there to show everyone just how confusing this could get. Many of those forms of Rotala look almost exactly alike and leave a lot of room for the type of debate that is happening now.


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

I have not personally seen Rotala macranda var. Small Leaf. can you describe to me what it looks like compared to regular macrandra? Or link to a nice picture of it growing in a tank? Just curious.


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

Keeping nitrates low and having good iron and macros will help with the pink color. Does increased phosphates also help? I just picked up some rotala from petsmart and I want to keep it a nice pink color.


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## GulfCoastAquarian (Jul 30, 2002)

Anthony said:


> Sorry to have started all this. I was just wondering how to give it more of the pink to red look? It has 3 leaves per whorl. Bottom half is red, but the tops have grown green.


Don't sweat it man, haha. Planted nuts like us can get just a little obsessive at times. 
My rotala looks the best when it grows too tall and hits the surface, inches away from the lights. Then I cut the top 6"-8" of the stem and replant it and I get this amazing pink bush of rotala. If your plants aren't that tall yet, try tying a bunch together with some plant weights and propping the weight on some driftwood or another plant to let the tops of the stems sit near the light for a few days. They'll turn, trust me!


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## Anthony (Jan 11, 2005)

Yep, they have finally reached the surface and are now turning pink.


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