# On the fence... Dirting a Tank



## Ethan2213 (Feb 29, 2016)

I am really on the fence about dirting my 38 gallon. I want to try and see what happens but i've heard of some problems with algae and other issues. I have a single florescent light that has grown crypts, vals, and swords pretty great over the last year with only some root tabs. 

If I dirt my tank....
Ill keep my light
I recently bought a few stocks of dwarf sag, pieces of frog bit, and another larger sword.

I currently have a medium and small size sword plants in there and some vals starting to grow. I also have probably 13-17 bunches of Crypts Wentii. I also run a siesta light schedule. 5-3-5. Water conditions have always been great. I'm using a hang on filter and a heater.


So my overall question is do I have enough plants to dirt my tank and not have algae problems? Its hard to see the plants in this picture but where the blur is there are a lot of Crypts there.

Thanks!! Any feedback is appreciated. Even the smallest reply!


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## geisterwald (Jul 18, 2016)

You're planning on just tearing everything down and putting in new substrate, replanting, putting livestock back? Sounds like too much of a pain to bother with. A compromise might be to freeze some dirt in an ice cube tray and stuff the blocks under the substrate like glorified root tabs. I just recently started my first dirted tank with organic garden soil, it's only been up and running for a couple weeks but no problems yet, aside from a little water staining because of unstoppable wood chips. Generally I think if you maintain the tank there aren't more problems than with any other kind of substrate.


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

Dirted tanks are maybe not for those who uproot or move plant's about frequently, and with crypt's in particular,the less moving about the better.
Will never see the result's of dirt if one does not try.
Were it me (and it ain't), I would give it a go with some plain top soil as bottom layer about two inches deep that I sifted to remove all the wood chips and or large clump's.
On top of this I might sprinkle some osmocote + (walmart) about a half cup for 38 gal.
Then I would cap the dirt with two inches of fine gravel, or sand, or black diamond blasting media.(rinsed in old pillow case)
Place the plant's in the tank ,and fill the tank with dechlorinated water slowly with plate or bowl on the sand, to allow water to hit the plate or bowl rather than the sand.
After the tank had settled for an hour or two, I would turn on the filter's and heater .
Would not immediately turn the heater on after filling the tank till it had set in the newly filled tank for at least a half hour to prevent thermal shock and damaged heater.(been there)
If you get all the stuff together, and rinse the sand or gravel, plant the tank,wait to turn on the filter's and heater,then fishes could be placed in the tank so long as they are not too many.
Would monitor the water once each day and be prepared to change out 50% should ammonia level's rise above .25 
Assuming the filter did not lose too much bacteria during the switching of substrate's you may not se any real ammonia spike but it does not hurt to check daily.
Would not go crazy with lighting for the first month or six week's and run lighting for 6 hour's a day total.
Can alway's increase the number of hour's after the plant's get a good start.
Hope some of this help's you or other's.


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## Ethan2213 (Feb 29, 2016)

Thank you! I think ill try and see what happens. I dont have award winning fish in this tank and I have like one of each kind of fish since slowly over the years a few have died. Thanks for your input!


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## ichy (Apr 6, 2015)

In my last tank I put in a thin layer of "pure" worm castings. It flattened and compacted and made a nice neat layer under BDBS.
Once the roots hit that layer they grew like gang busters. Plants will never grow better than in a properly dirted tank, but it has its pros and cons depending on how you maintain your tanks. I feel the pros outweigh the cons and with worm castings it is not messy at all.


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## Scratch (Aug 12, 2016)

Thanks very much for your post and suggestion about Osmocote +, Roadmaster.
Looked it up on Amazon and found that some people freeze this stuff as ice cubes and place them into the substrate as needed. Genius.
Best of luck with your tank, Ethan.


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## ThinkTank (May 24, 2011)

I just redid a tank and used plastic desk organizer trays. Filled 2/3s with dirt, capped with sand and then i was able to wiggle it into the existing sand in the tank and cover with more substrate. 

Im hoping this will let me move things around without the mess. I used a few 2"x2" and 2"x6" trays.

I've gotten my best growth in dirted tanks.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I continue to recommend that the dirt used under our substrate should be dirt, and not something purchased in a big, colorful plastic bag. That bagged stuff is not dirt. It is ground up bark, including lots of floating bits, possibly some manure of indeterminate age, and, often some fertilizer designed for terrestrial plants. It will leach ammonia for quite awhile after it is under water. The original recommended use of dirt was for real dirt, dug up from the ground (from areas where there was no risk of industrial or other oily contaminants in the soil). That dirt was then "mineralized", which means it was treated so as to convert the organic nitrogen to inorganic nitrogen, so little or no ammonia would be there to leach out. That is a well proven, trouble-free way to use dirt, and get all of the benefits from it. Dirt is so rich in nutrients you don't need a 2 inch layer of it. Use about one inch and top it with about 2 inches of inert substrate, like pool filter sand, grit blasting media, etc. and it is a very good substrate, that will give you very few problems.


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## Ethan2213 (Feb 29, 2016)

So i dirted my established tank everything looks good. Would you say 50% water changes for about a week?


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> I continue to recommend that the dirt used under our substrate should be dirt, and not something purchased in a big, colorful plastic bag. That bagged stuff is not dirt. It is ground up bark, including lots of floating bits, possibly some manure of indeterminate age, and, often some fertilizer designed for terrestrial plants. It will leach ammonia for quite awhile after it is under water. The original recommended use of dirt was for real dirt, dug up from the ground (from areas where there was no risk of industrial or other oily contaminants in the soil). That dirt was then "mineralized", which means it was treated so as to convert the organic nitrogen to inorganic nitrogen, so little or no ammonia would be there to leach out. That is a well proven, trouble-free way to use dirt, and get all of the benefits from it. Dirt is so rich in nutrients you don't need a 2 inch layer of it. Use about one inch and top it with about 2 inches of inert substrate, like pool filter sand, grit blasting media, etc. and it is a very good substrate, that will give you very few problems.


 
I agree with much of this^:wink2:
Is why I suggest plain top soil or mineralized, if you care to go to the trouble.(I never have).
Have also used the miracle grow organic choice without issues with fishes but as mentioned..it will release ammonia, so monitoring the water daily with fishes present is a good idea or..you can wait a month before adding the fishes if maybe daily or every two day's water changes do not suit you.
Lot's and lot's of plant's also are a benefit and suggested by most for they readily take up ammonia as food for growth which lessen's the chance of toxic ammonia level's considerably.
As for depth ,,I like sword plant's for my tank's are a bit larger,and they help fill in area's nicely, and the root system on these plant's are extensive as well as large crypt's.
I get better result's with deeper substrate and it seem's to provide nutrient's for a bit longer than shallower depth's of the dirt.
I can also move plant's closer to the low to moderate light I employ by making the total depth of substrate deeper which moves them closer to the light (foreground plant's if used).



Ethan2213 said:


> So i dirted my established tank everything looks good. Would you say 50% water changes for about a week?


 Test kit for ammonia will tell you when water change is needed with fishes present.
Lot's of plant's,and one might not see level's of ammonia which would require water change at all.
Too much light for too long,and ammonia at elevated level's will encourage algae if plant's are few so as mentioned,it is wise to plant heavily and keep an eye on the ammonia level's with or without plant's.
Reducing light intensity and duration for first few week's is also a good idea and practiced by many regardless of type of tank they are running low tech ,high tech,dirted or otherwise.
ADA substrates also leach a fair amount of ammonia also so frequent water changes are suggested for them as well.
Dirt is just cheaper for me ,and provides the result's I desire.
After a year,,the dirt need's replaced for it often times becomes depleted of nutrient's but I seldom see or hear of any tank's that are left to run this long before they are taken down down to create a new aquascape anyway.
With deeper dirt, and some clay and or root tab's mixed with it ,one can get a little more mileage, maybe two year's.
A little fertilizer added to the water once a week for low tech can also help extend the time before considering replacing the dirt IME.
I like playing in the dirt, been doin it since I was a young boy in short pant's.:grin2:


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