# freph's Mini M



## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

So, I finally decided to spoil myself a bit and get a Mini M setup with all the bells and whistles (well, mostly). I've got some pretty sweet manten stone and am currently just waiting on a few more items that were on backorder etc. to get to the good stuff. Here's a teaser shot, though.


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## mcqueenesq (Aug 29, 2011)

Very nice!


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

How do you like the AQUASKY?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> How do you like the AQUASKY?


I haven't had a chance to see its effect on plants yet or the illumination of the tank when filled/planted/scaped, but I like it as far as first impressions go. It's bright without being too bright and is very aesthetically pleasing. The light concentrates itself pretty well also. My only real quirk about the unit is the orientation of the transformer that plugs into a power outlet. It's kinda like this and the way my timer/power strip is oriented I can only use my solenoid adapter and it (I have need for another timed outlet for the lighting on the 10g and don't really want to buy another timer for the strip) at the same time (2 out of 4 sockets). I really wish they made transformers more compact or at least oriented more conveniently. Otherwise, I'm quite pleased with the fixture at current. Very reasonable for the price as far as quality and tank pairing is concerned.

By the way, all of the additive boxes (Green Bacter, ECA, Green Gain, Phyton Git) smell like hickory smoke bbq sauce to me. Dollface wasn't kidding. Hickory smoke and...radiation. Mmm-mmm good!


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Looks great so far. In every picture a member has posted of the AQUASKY, the color looks so perfect. It's a shame I really don't like the actual design. Is it possible to take the legs off? I assume not, at least if you don't break them off but I would serious love to retrofit this light into a Solar fixture, not that I have an ADA tank yet anyway lol.


Look forward to your work.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

talontsiawd said:


> Looks great so far. In every picture a member has posted of the AQUASKY, the color looks so perfect. It's a shame I really don't like the actual design. Is it possible to take the legs off? I assume not, at least if you don't break them off but I would serious love to retrofit this light into a Solar fixture, not that I have an ADA tank yet anyway lol.
> 
> 
> Look forward to your work.


The heatsink is detachable but none of the acrylic parts are. I'm sure you could retrofit the heatsink into the Solar housing.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

freph said:


> The heatsink is detachable but none of the acrylic parts are. I'm sure you could retrofit the heatsink into the Solar housing.


Great to know. That light just became way more appealing to me...not that I can afford it right now.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Getting impatient so decided to fill it with water and give the Eheim 2211 a spin. Flow is a lot better than I expected. Having a smaller outflow than intake has an impressive effect.

Tank will probably be planted and filled next week since I'm waiting for aquariumplants to get some E. tenellus in stock then I'll do the plant order.

*Plant plans*:
_Eleocharis acicularis
Glossostigma elatinoides
Echinodorus tenellus
Riccia fluitans
DHG Belem_

*Fauna plans*:
_Boraras urophthalmoides
Otocinclus sp.
Caridinia japonica_


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Looks great, even with the Eheim inlet. The light looks more appealing with water in it, even just water, it somehow doesn't seem as "bulky". Sorry, not trying to hate on the light, I just love the previous ADA lights and don't really get the changes.

Why glosso? I love the plant but in a tank this nice, I just feel you could do something more "exotic", plus I don't like the scale for small tanks. It's actually my go to for non CO2 injected tanks as it still works pretty easily, just doesn't spread well compared to with CO2 and higher light.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It is a nice setup but I find the green distracting so far but it may just be there are no plants so my eye goes right to the Eheim inlet, I'm painting some black today to hide them a little, there's no way I could keep clear pipes clean.

The plant list looks good to me, some tall hair grass for hiegt in one corner might look nice, I just saw this at club meeting last week and it looked nice, UG is another one that looks nice and maintenance free, good luck.

That light is awesome and even at a low angle doesn't bother you to look at it so it wust just disappear from above.

By the way, all of the additive boxes (Green Bacter, ECA, Green Gain, Phyton Git) smell like hickory smoke bbq sauce to me. Dollface wasn't kidding. Hickory smoke and...radiation. Mmm-mmm good! 

I'm want to try all the additives so badly but the cost is hard to get past, now that I know it can be sprinkled on my ribs I might go for it.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

talontsiawd said:


> Looks great, even with the Eheim inlet. The light looks more appealing with water in it, even just water, it somehow doesn't seem as "bulky". Sorry, not trying to hate on the light, I just love the previous ADA lights and don't really get the changes.
> 
> Why glosso? I love the plant but in a tank this nice, I just feel you could do something more "exotic", plus I don't like the scale for small tanks. It's actually my go to for non CO2 injected tanks as it still works pretty easily, just doesn't spread well compared to with CO2 and higher light.


Glosso stays smaller under high light and if it's well trimmed....but I could always do _Elatine hydropiper_...I just really don't like the price point it's at right now. Thanks for the compliments on the tank. I didn't see an issue with the previous lighting system either, but I'm certainly not opposed to this new fixture (plus it's a bit cheaper).



150EH said:


> It is a nice setup but I find the green distracting so far but it may just be there are no plants so my eye goes right to the Eheim inlet, I'm painting some black today to hide them a little, there's no way I could keep clear pipes clean.
> 
> The plant list looks good to me, some tall hair grass for hiegt in one corner might look nice, I just saw this at club meeting last week and it looked nice, UG is another one that looks nice and maintenance free, good luck.
> 
> ...


The green tubing and inflow are being replaced with the Mini V-1 and clear tubing set. The pipe is on backorder and the tubing (along with my substrate additive pack, which is why it's got just water in it and not a rockscape) hasn't been shipped yet. Getting a spring washer for the pipe cleanliness as well. For how long they last, the additives are pretty cost efficient for the nano tank. I'm sure they'd make some pretty B.A. ribs to boot! :hihi: The ferts are as well....it's like 4 cents a day on a tank this size.


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## antbug (May 28, 2010)

freph said:


> I haven't had a chance to see its effect on plants yet or the illumination of the tank when filled/planted/scaped, but I like it as far as first impressions go. It's bright without being too bright and is very aesthetically pleasing. The light concentrates itself pretty well also. My only real quirk about the unit is the orientation of the transformer that plugs into a power outlet. It's kinda like this and the way my timer/power strip is oriented I can only use my solenoid adapter and it (I have need for another timed outlet for the lighting on the 10g and don't really want to buy another timer for the strip) at the same time (2 out of 4 sockets). I really wish they made transformers more compact or at least oriented more conveniently. Otherwise, I'm quite pleased with the fixture at current. Very reasonable for the price as far as quality and tank pairing is concerned.
> 
> By the way, all of the additive boxes (Green Bacter, ECA, Green Gain, Phyton Git) smell like hickory smoke bbq sauce to me. Dollface wasn't kidding. Hickory smoke and...radiation. Mmm-mmm good!


Have you tried anything like this?

http://uneasysilence.com/2007/08/maximize-your-power/

You can get them at walmart for a dollar or two. 

Can't want to see that light in action.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

antbug said:


> Have you tried anything like this?
> 
> http://uneasysilence.com/2007/08/maximize-your-power/
> 
> ...


I was just going to use a couple of spare single->double extension cords but that looks like a much better option...thanks for the link! I'll definitely pick up a couple next time I'm in town. I currently only have the light on for aesthetic viewing pleasure (risk of algae and such) so there's no rush. The light is...very nice in water. I love the shimmer effect.


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## antbug (May 28, 2010)

I use them on both of my tanks and in my office.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Actually, forget the trip to Walmart...just snagged a 5 pack of them with my Discover Rewards Points ($1:$1 on Amazon). I wish I would've invented these things...holy cow. So simple yet so ingenious!

As far as foreground/carpet plants are concerned, I can either do HC, Glosso, or Elatine hydropiper. Keep in mind that it'll be intermingled with Riccia and DHG Belem.


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

I'm waiting on inlet too


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## FisheriesOmen (Jan 14, 2012)

I don't know why but whenever I see something Like "ADA" "Mini-(random letter)" or "Fluval" I always tend to faze over it. Trying to force myself to click on these cause the tanks always look super nice.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

FisheriesOmen said:


> I don't know why but whenever I see something Like "ADA" "Mini-(random letter)" or "Fluval" I always tend to faze over it. Trying to force myself to click on these cause the tanks always look super nice.


Some of the best tanks on here have that type of title composition. Every journal on here is worth a click imo.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Well, I was hoping to at least get the rock scape done (substrate additives were to arrive Friday) but chances of that are iffy. UPS decided it'd be a great idea to put my package on the wrong delivery truck. Looks like someone at the shipping center didn't have their coffee this morning. :icon_roll

2 hours later update: It's not out for delivery in the right place. Someone must have had their coffee.


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

where is the pic of new stuff u got


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hasn't arrived yet. I'll take pics when it gets here.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

So, Frank decided to massively spoil me on this one. I bought most of his old tools since he wanted to get 20th Anniversary products and I got a great deal on them. Pro Scissors Short Curved and Straight, Pincettes S and M, AP Glass + what food he had left in it (AP-1 Gold) and his Maintenance Stand. The tool quality is absolutely amazing compared to what I'm used to. Definitely worth the extra buck. Also got substrate additives (Penac P&W are what's in the bag). The Mini V-1 came in today also, as did the substrate additives, a bottle of AP-1 Gold fish food, and Spring Washer S. I'll get the rock scape done tomorrow morning and post pictures. In the mean time, sexy ADA pictures. Side note: Photobucket is excruciatingly slow today for me.


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## radioman (Oct 29, 2007)

That stand is sexy! What are the brown granules in the glass jar?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

They are AP-1 Gold fish food. 

Power Sand is laid, will finish the additives off then add AS Powder type and try to get the rocks going. The AQUASKY makes for a wonderful light at the back of the tank during setup.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

That looks like a lot of fun and I'm sure all the ADA stuff is top quality and now you have the authority to comment on the products because you've used them. I would love to do the same thing, lately some of the contest tanks have inspired me to try and get more out of my next build and this thread is definitely helping.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

150EH said:


> That looks like a lot of fun and I'm sure all the ADA stuff is top quality and now you have the authority to comment on the products because you've used them. I would love to do the same thing, lately some of the contest tanks have inspired me to try and get more out of my next build and this thread is definitely helping.


It'll be a while before I can definitely comment on the quality of the stuff. My espei rasboras took right to the AP-1 Gold, though. Time will tell. I'm glad you find this thread inspirational!

Placement of the main stone, not quite 100% on it. I think it may be alright though. Thoughts? I'm not worried about the substrate being even right now, I'll get to that in a bit. I've still got plenty of AS to sculpt with.


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

I suggest put one stone at left also put two more small one at right side. make it looks like they are break from the big one.


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

hmm since the center one is to big might also push the aqua soile back a little make more slope


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Working on the slope but I think I've pretty much settled on something. I did like the idea of stones breaking off from the main one and that's kinda what I went for....I think it has a very mountainous look to it.


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

since the tank is small, you don't want to many big stones. just one big and few small. try to take the one at left back out and move the small one on the left close toe the big one a little and see


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

you want to save the corver and side for the plants


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

True, but I also don't want to use an even number of stones and 3 seems like too few. I'll sleep on it and check back in the morning.


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## parthapratim22 (Dec 22, 2011)

are you sleeping??? But I have something to say....

You main rock is very strong, it can be an awesome tank, with some serious addition!!!


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## Ozydego (Aug 29, 2011)

Also, I would hesitate to place stones to get a final position before you move some more of that AS away from the front, thats a lot of black space at the front glass. It can be manicured at the end, but its tough to get placement right, then move a bunch of soil around. I REALLY like that main stone though, using the thought of pick a stone that looks to big to fit and it will be perfect, I think you accomplished that. +1 on the stones seeming to break off the main stone, a steep slope would help with that look as well. Keep going, looks like it could reach that epic status.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Ozydego said:


> Also, I would hesitate to place stones to get a final position before you move some more of that AS away from the front, thats a lot of black space at the front glass. It can be manicured at the end, but its tough to get placement right, then move a bunch of soil around. I REALLY like that main stone though, using the thought of pick a stone that looks to big to fit and it will be perfect, I think you accomplished that. +1 on the stones seeming to break off the main stone, a steep slope would help with that look as well. Keep going, looks like it could reach that epic status.


Yeah....I really like the main stone and I intentionally started with more AS than I planned to keep just so I could scoop and manipulate it better. I got tired and called it a night. :icon_mrgr

parthapratim22,
I like the layout you proposed. I feel it has a better flow than what I've got right now. The left side just looks...crowded at current. Thanks!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Who knew playing with rocks would be this hard. The bottom right stone is just really oddly shaped...but the top has a great hue and features to it. It's a bit annoying to soften the edges to make it look right but I think I did an alright job. Moved the stones around on the left to give it a more open look as opposed to cluttered. Four stones apparently signifies death, so I'm rather reluctant to remove that top left stone but I think the scape benefits moreso from not having it...


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Got tired of working with the rocks and had a nice talk with Frank about them (this doesn't mean that everyone else's input was null and void; every input was valuable to me and I tried them all) and ended up deciding on a single stone scape. The main rock is large enough to support itself and for an aquarium this size, it works well as a single scaping feature. It was also quite convenient as I had forgotten to put Clear Super in on top of the Bacter 100 :icon_redf. I want this to be as much about the plants as I do the rock. Glosso and DHG Belem foreground, Riccia and H. tenellum placed randomly around the aquarium (DHG will also be placed randomly to accent the Riccia and blend the scape together) and E. acicularis with H. tenellum will create a lovely natural background (plus the roots will hold the slope well). The plant order has been placed and should be here sometime mid/late next week, maybe sooner depending on how their shipping is working this week since I'm not 100% on how it'll be. I wish you guys could see the purplish hues this rock has....it's really something else and my iPhone (even after several attempts of focusing different object to correct the color balance) can't do them justice.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Lower the substrate a little, while you can. I wish I could now...


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Lower the substrate a little, while you can. I wish I could now...


How much lower and why? What happened in your tank that made the substrate depth a bad thing? Actual substrate height in the front is 1.5" and height in the back is 4" for reference.


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## Ozydego (Aug 29, 2011)

That's the Amano's measurements for soil right? The front looks great now, it's gonna be a great layout!


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## Kratos (Apr 25, 2008)

This is going to be a dang fine setup!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Ozydego said:


> That's the Amano's measurements for soil right? The front looks great now, it's gonna be a great layout!


It was actually just what looked good to me at the time, but I did notice that it was almost spot on for what's in the Book of ADA. Nifty. Thank you!



Kratos said:


> This is going to be a dang fine setup!


Thanks! I certainly hope I can make it something great.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> How much lower and why? What happened in your tank that made the substrate depth a bad thing? Actual substrate height in the front is 1.5" and height in the back is 4" for reference.


Maybe it's just me, but I personally like about 1" in the front on my nanos, as it seems to throw off the scale sometimes if it is too high. To each his own, I suppose. :icon_smil


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Maybe it's just me, but I personally like about 1" in the front on my nanos, as it seems to throw off the scale sometimes if it is too high. To each his own, I suppose. :icon_smil


Makes sense. The only problem with that is that the stone needs adequate slope in the front to maintain softened edges and it's height presence, otherwise I probably would've gone at least 1/4" lower. I think it should be fine, though. The true test will be perspective after the plants grow in.


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## mcqueenesq (Aug 29, 2011)

I agree with Kiran. I wish mine were lower too. Space is so limited; it just seems like a waste to use so much for foreground plant roots. It turns into this annoying 2" horizontal brown stripe across the bottom of your otherwise beautiful layout. I wonder if Amano factored in the constant battle with evaporation? That's 1/2" of viewing pleasure lost on any given day in my house.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

mcqueenesq said:


> I agree with Kiran. I wish mine were lower too. Space is so limited; it just seems like a waste to use so much for foreground plant roots. It turns into this annoying 2" horizontal brown stripe across the bottom of your otherwise beautiful layout. I wonder if Amano factored in the constant battle with evaporation? That's 1/2" of viewing pleasure lost on any given day in my house.


1.5" honestly isn't that much...I don't see it as a distraction at all.  Evaporation shouldn't be too horrible. If it gets out of hand I've got a glass top (which will likely be used the first few weeks anyway to prevent any jumpers). Push come to shove it's just topping it off with RO water.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Tank is planted. I'll post a picture of it when it clears up but everything went alright....for the most part. I underestimated the power of the 2211 filter and ended up getting my substrate line annihilated and a valley on the opposite side of the outflow. It's turned down to about 50% now to keep that from happening and still blowing CO2 around just fine.

Side note: For nanos, or any tank that's honestly in the 20-40g range...one pot of any carpeting/background plant is fine. I've got extra pots of E. acicularis and glosso that I can't do anything with.


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

cant wait to see the pic! I ruined my substrate line too, but it was when I was planting the glosso and trying to replant all the ones that floated to the top. lol


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

It's that, and the penac in the substrate making the soil "fluffy" from the oxygen bubbles. It's definitely got more volume in the front. It's funny, because I can hit the board that the tank is on with my palm and bubbles come up from the soil. Here's how the tank looks right now. There's not much surface agitation right now because the filter is throttled down. I'll drain it down a bit tonight to get some more oxygenation going and then finish draining it when I get out of class. Pro Razor Mini is definitely a great buy. I'm in love with hoe functional it is. One of my pet peeves about manual scraping of the glass is it tends to upset the substrate a bit too much from hand movement...it's almost non existent with this lovely little tool. Comes with 2 razors so you won't have to buy for a while.

Plants all came in very well except the riccia. The description on the website was extremely misleading. What was supposed to be a tennis ball sized portion of riccia was about the size of a 3-high stack of single saltine crackers and absolutely infested with duckweed/wateremal (I couldn't distinguish) and the quality was pretty rough. Nothing like Frank's picture of his lovely fluffy green mass. I only had enough for 4 small stones (which, is fine) after separating the riccia out. Hopefully it'll grow in well. I've still got a pot of E. acicularis and glosso floating in my 20 right now....not sure what I'll do with them since the 20 and 10 are loaded down as well. 1 pot of glosso is enough to fully plant a 20L if you separate them right, maybe even a 40B.

Here's the tank. The manten shows these amazing purple hues once wet...it's really spectacular. The tank is a bit cloudy, but oh well. It'll be better tomorrow. Not rinsing NA Carbon = black water of death while priming the filter. Luckily I caught it all in a pitcher until it ran clean. Penac bubbles are awesome. So are the little lazer beam spotlights from the AQUASKY. :hihi:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

I like it, but personally I would have used more than one stone. But it looks great!

What are your plans for stocking?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Same fish I just posted about in your journal.  The stone thing was a result of wanting more plants vs stone accents. I think it'll look wonderful once it fills.

Stocking list:
Amanos and Otos @ 2 weeks
_Bororas urophthalmoides _ @ 1 month


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Great start!

On your next water change, double up on your glosso from that other pot, trust me on that one!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> Great start!
> 
> On your next water change, double up on your glosso from that other pot, trust me on that one!


Will do. I'll just plant them as single sections to cover more ground.

Edit: decided to just go ahead and do it. Added 19 more glosso plantlets in less planted areas. It definitely looks fuller. First trim for glosso should be in about a week or so I believe.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

*Day 2*

50% water change, 4 drops of Green Bacter. Additional Glosso was planted last night. No brown stuff to trim at the moment, so that's good. The black bits on my diffuser are actually some carbon residue that got in there from a little mishap. It's not affecting the diffuser so I'm not worried about it right now. A little bleach will fix that come maintenance time. Water finally cleared up a bit!


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Awesome going Freph!

When you get ready for needing glassware cleaning - get with me. I've got a Clean Bottle and Superge with your name on it. I'm not sure what is in Superge exactly, but it cleans + polishes the glassware within about 10-15 minutes of being used (so you can do it in the middle of your water changes).


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Is there any particular reason why your lily pipes are so low? I keep mine fairly high so that I get better surface movement.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

The flow is cut 50% and there's still a very slight ripple. They create a nice ripple at full flow even being at that height. The only time I agitate the surface more is at night by lowering the water level a bit.


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

good job


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

This is great! Looking really good so far. Looking forward to following its progression.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> Awesome going Freph!
> 
> When you get ready for needing glassware cleaning - get with me. I've got a Clean Bottle and Superge with your name on it. I'm not sure what is in Superge exactly, but it cleans + polishes the glassware within about 10-15 minutes of being used (so you can do it in the middle of your water changes).


Awesome. I'll definitely get up with you on that one. Thanks!



catfishbi said:


> good job


Thanks!



frrok said:


> This is great! Looking really good so far. Looking forward to following its progression.


Thanks! I'm looking forward to it as well as your Mini M. :thumbsup:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> The flow is cut 50% and there's still a very slight ripple. They create a nice ripple at full flow even being at that height. The only time I agitate the surface more is at night by lowering the water level a bit.


I see. That makes sense. Great job, can't wait to see the Glosso fill in.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Can't wait to see it either. All of it is staying down except for one piece I had to replant when I got home. The 2211 really puts out! I'm very impressed.


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## radioman (Oct 29, 2007)

That purple hue is sweet. I like the singe rock too.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

radioman said:


> That purple hue is sweet. I like the singe rock too.


Thank you! I agree. Once it got wet the purple hues started to show. It's a gorgeous rock. The fractures in it are very nice as well.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

*Day 3*

50% water change, 3 drops Green Bacter, 1 squirt Brighty K.

Nothing out of the ordinary on this one. There's actually already a little bit of noticeable growth. Pretty impressive. Trimmed a few browning bits of hairgrass.


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## CryptKeeper54 (Apr 14, 2012)

Great start. Looks good. I wish I could see that stone in person. I'm sure pics don't do it justice. Any chance of you posting a HD youtube video when filled in?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

CryptKeeper54 said:


> Great start. Looks good. I wish I could see that stone in person. I'm sure pics don't do it justice. Any chance of you posting a HD youtube video when filled in?


It would be shot from my iPhone 4/new iPad, but I'm sure I could arrange something. :icon_cool


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

Greetings. Great sсape! Why you do not add Green gain? In the first week is necessary. Bryghty K can be added from the second week. Pay great attention to the amount of CO2. Overdose may end in failure, as here.
_P.S._ My Mini M


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> Greetings. Great sсape! Why you do not add Green gain? In the first week is necessary. Bryghty K can be added from the second week. Pay great attention to the amount of CO2. Overdose may end in failure, as here.
> _P.S._ My Mini M



Thanks! I don't use Green Gain right now because it's really only necessary after trimming. That, and I don't have any right now. I'll be here Tuesday. CO2 is in good condition and I lower the water level for extra aeration via the outflow for 14 hours.


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

freph said:


> it's really only necessary after trimming.


Not only after trimming. Green gain is the anti-stress. Trimming is stress. Replanting is also a lot of stress. Green gain helps plants adapt to new conditions. Also, it contains trace elements and is highly concentrated fertilizer. If you have problems with the growth of plants you must to use it too.
It's all written in the instructions to the Green gain. Good luck!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> Not only after trimming. Green gain is the anti-stress. Trimming is stress. Replanting is also a lot of stress. Green gain helps plants adapt to new conditions. Also, it contains trace elements and is highly concentrated fertilizer. If you have problems with the growth of plants you must to use it too.
> It's all written in the instructions to the Green gain. Good luck!


Makes sense. The instructions on the ADA website read "when subjected to stress". Trimming and replanting are both equally stressful. I'll try it out when it gets here.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

*Day 4*

50% water change, 5 drops Green Bacter, 1 squirt Brighty K. Glosso is going nuts. Other than that, nothing really new to report. Smooth sailing!


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## Ozydego (Aug 29, 2011)

Do you think the riccia is going to survive? I remember you said it was in bad shape when you got it...


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Ozydego said:


> Do you think the riccia is going to survive? I remember you said it was in bad shape when you got it...


It should be fine. Almost all of it is pearling and growing a bit.


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

freph said:


> 5 drops Green Bacter


Can question? Why so much? Why did you decide not to follow the instructions ADA? In the *Mini M* about 15-18 liters of water. According to the instructions needed to make a drop for every 10 liters of water. It turns out that two drops is the maximum dosage, if you follow the instructions. Why did you decide to increase the dose of Green bacter? I do not want to teach you, I'm just wondering why you do that?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> Can question? Why so much? Why did you decide not to follow the instructions ADA? In the *Mini M* about 15-18 liters of water. According to the instructions needed to make a drop for every 10 liters of water. It turns out that two drops is the maximum dosage, if you follow the instructions. Why did you decide to increase the dose of Green bacter? I do not want to teach you, I'm just wondering why you do that?


Not entirely sure really. I wanted to follow Frank's journal closely but I'll dial it down a bit. A bit extra can't really hurt, though.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

You can't overdose Green Bacter - so if you do the recommended dosage + more it works well, or just the recommended dosage. Only harm is not doing enough.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> You can't overdose Green Bacter - so if you do the recommended dosage + more it works well, or just the recommended dosage. Only harm is not doing enough.


That's what I thought. Water is crystal clear at least. I assume the bacteria are growing well as well.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Sexy diffuser. I want one :biggrin:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Sexy diffuser. I want one :biggrin:


It's very nice. I messed up a bit when I initially filled the tank and got a little bit of carbon residue on it that stained it pretty good....a little bleach and just running it seems to be working on it though. I love it. The height issue I previously commented on in Frank's journal makes a lot more sense when you actually have it in the tank. The Mini P-1 does an excellent job of blowing it around even at 50% flow.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

How much does it cost? What is the model name?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> How much does it cost? What is the model name?


Massive price hike it seems....it was $90 when I got mine.

http://www.adgshop.com/Pollen_Glass_Mini_p/102-1012.htm


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Gah! Maybe I'll find a way RO trade for a used one. I will _never_ pay that much for a single diffuser. And I appreciate ADA quality, I do. But I can't swallow that price.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Yeah, it's a bit much at current. I wonder why the price went up so much....hmm. At any rate, finding a used one seems to be your best bet if it's out of budget. Best of luck on that one.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Yeah actually that $35 Do!Aqua diffuser looks nice.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

It does, actually. Same styling at least. Why not just spend the extra $4 for a larger diffusing surface?  Though, I'm guessing the 10D is for the Mini S and 15D is for the Mini M...but who knows. It could be for some of the cubes.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Yeah. If someone makes an offer, I'll jump. I put a trade offer in my sales thread.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Good luck!

Also, I'd just like to note that glosso grows ridiculously fast. Not sure if it's the AQUASKY or what...but these plants are going absolutely nuts.


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

Im using the 10d on my tank and I really like it, definitely worth 35 bucks.

My glosso is starting to send out runners, but I know glosso is a fast grower in general. I do think the aquasky helps


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Who knows. Have you trimmed it yet or just letting it do its thing?


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

mluk27 said:


> Im using the 10d on my tank and I really like it, definitely worth 35 bucks.


Sweet! Shipping is quite high though. Okay, back to Freph now :icon_lol:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

:hihi: No worries. I'm surprised at the resilience of riccia. Almost every single piece is pearling now....quite impressive considering it wasn't in the best shape when I got it. Still, there will be trimming and re-tieing in the future.


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

ITs only a matter of time. It should be a week or so tops


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hopefully. I trimmed the glosso down a bit. I've got quite a few runners coming up! Thin and small too. Looks like this carpet won't take long to establish. Even the Belem grass is sending off runners.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

*Day 5*

Trimmed the glosso a bit to eliminate some vertical growth and encourage new spread. 50% water change, 3 drops Green Bacter, 1 squirt Brighty K. As you can see by the bubbles, the riccia is doing quite well. It shouldnt' be long before it's able to be trimmed and re-tied.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

I think that this is gonna fill in very quickly. However, I would say that the tank needs more color. Think Rotala colorata. But that's just my take


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hopefully it does fill in quickly. The tenellus will grow differently once it gets established and starts sending off submersed growth, which gets a bit of red color to it. What you're seeing right now is emersed growth and the same goes for the acicularis and glosso. It'll all be trimmed to the bone in a few weeks once it's well established to eliminate any of the old growth. As for color, the fish are gonna do that for me.  However, the R. colorata does look amazing. I'll definitely consider it if I feel I'm lacking color.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Okay, I now need to know where I can purchase some Bororas urophthalmoides. Like, *now.* :biggrin:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Rachel sells em! I've been talking with her about fish orders for this tank for a while now.


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

Wet spot has them too


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## Tcal01 (Apr 23, 2012)

wow that riccia is really doing some serious pearling


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

It certainly is. It's getting better by the day.  Speaking of which...


*Day 6*

Same old, same old. 50% water change, 3 drops Green Bacter, 1 squirt Brighty K. Tomorrow will be the 1 week mark. I'll start incorporating Green Brighty Step 1 into the dosing regimen. Everything is growing quite nicely. Glosso needs to hurry up and fill the right side though so I can go ahead and crank my filter outflow all the way up.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

*Day 7*

Day 7 marks the end of daily water changes. Awesome. It also marks the start of adding Green Brighty Step 1 to my dosing regimen. Currently dosing 1 squirt each of Brighty K and Green Brighty Step 1 daily and 2 drops of Green Bacter at water changes (every other day now). I'll trim the hairgrass down to the stubs when I do my next water change. All of the bunches are already sending off runners so that lets me know that the roots are growing in just fine and it's time to get rid of old, emersed growth. The tenellus may be a while. It's still quite green...but eventually will be trimmed down as well. Riccia is doing awesome and so is the glosso. I should have a decent carpet going by the end of the month. The belem is also hanging in there. Doing decently given that it had a rough time in my 20L. That tank is getting completely cleaned tomorrow since it has a lot of issues that need to be addressed. Still 0 algae that I know of in the Mini M.


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## Overgrowth (Feb 19, 2012)

At first I was like, "What's that white plant that looks like Riccia?" and then I was like, "Oh." Very nice!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Overgrowth said:


> At first I was like, "What's that white plant that looks like Riccia?" and then I was like, "Oh." Very nice!


Right? Riccia pearls like crazy all the time. It's quite the plant. I'll be trimming and re-tieing the stones once it gets tall enough since the layer tied to the stone is kinda mushy. I've already trimmed a few specs of BBA off of old pieces of Belem grass and airline tubing siphoned some hair algae off of one of the riccia stones, but other than that everything else is pretty good to go. I trimmed the E. acicularis down to nubs today and pruned a few E. tenellus leaves. Lots of new growth from both plants, especially the E. acicularis. I've got a few 2" or so long roots along the back and right side panes....just goes to show that plants really are incredible organisms.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

*Day 16*

Figured you guys might like an update. Tank has been moseying along. Grass and E. tenellus is doing very well. Glosso is spreading pretty well. There's a bit of nuisance algae but nothing that's out of hand or too bothersome...otos and amanos will very easily take care of it. I'll be adding otos and amanos on Wednesday. The week afterwards, Bororas urophthalmoides will be going in. Can't wait. 

Current dosing:
1 squirt of Brighty K and Green Brighty Step 1 daily
1 squirt of Green Brighty Special Lights every other day and at water changes
3 drops Green Bacter, 2 drops Green Gain at water changes


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Glosso is doing pretty shoddy....not sure what to do with it. Seems like every bit of slightly old growth gets brown algae on it and needs to be cut away. Roots are healthy, though. Am I approaching this correctly with trims or should I just let it grow and do whatever for a while?

Amanos and Otos will be here Wednesday. Hopefully they'll help out.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Let it grow for another 10 days or so, once the roots are nice and established trim it down to the base!


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

The brown algae is totally normal, don't worry. Amano's and o-cats will eat a lot of that.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Good to know. Thanks Frank.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Oh, by the way I was just in Charlotte this past weekend! The locals thought I was nuts when I complimented the weather as being nice. Compared to Houston it feels like Seattle weather! 

Though I know what they're talking about, since I used to live in Raleigh.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

NC weather in general is pretty whacky. I can't stand it unless its late fall-early spring. Too hot.  Did you have a chance to stop by Fintastic?


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

I did not - it was a pretty full schedule. Though they are a store I'd like to open ADA to.


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

Man your riccia looks so much better than mine. lol Im kind of afraid that mine is dead on the bottom haha.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

I'd gladly trade you my Riccia for your glosso....mine is driving me nuts. I'm honestly about to lower the substrate line and replant it. It seems too high....should've listened to everyone in the first place. Project either tonight or tomorrow night for sure.


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

Yea.. I just trimmed the glosso when it got to high in some areas and replanted those trimmings. You just need more mass ahah


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Yeah, I agree entirely. I had to trim it down to the bone yesterday because it was butting me so much. Everything I trimmed has sent off new growth, though. Leaves and all type new growth. Makes me not want to touch my substrate now....bah. Maybe I'll just vacuum the front line a bit. :hihi:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Well, that was a quick little project. Nice and clean substrate line lowered ever so slightly and I have a much better idea of where my glosso and belem grass will be moving. Removed about 2 cups of aquasoil. Next picture won't be for a while. The tank looks very much out of its prime.


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

A lot of CO2 can trigger leaf elongation in Glosso


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> A lot of CO2 can trigger leaf elongation in Glosso


Thin, narrow, longer leaves as opposed to the short and broad ones?


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

Exactly


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Any idea as to what a good bps rate would be for this tank, or do I just need to adjust it and wait for new growth to appear and judge it from there?


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## Ozydego (Aug 29, 2011)

eventually you would use the growth to fine tune it, but in the beginning I use a drop checker so I can see at what color the plants start to do well and algae goes away...


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Plants are growing fine for now...no real need to use a drop checker for approximation. That, and I get tired of the only drop checker I own floating up every couple of days.  More important things to purchase right now. I generally just go by the flow of bubbles coming from the diffuser. I'll get a bubble counter next ADA shipment for sure. :hihi:


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## Ozydego (Aug 29, 2011)

I use the bubble mist as well, but like last night I was raising the level and at one point I noticed one fish at the surface, I checked the color of the DC and then lowered the mist slightly. I then use the color to monitor periodically


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

2-3 bps will be good for now.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Awesome; that's what I've been running it at since the start of week 3. Thanks Frank!


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

It's been 3 weeks? Time flies when you're having fun, it seems!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Doesn't feel like it's been that much, honestly. I'll be entering the fourth week soon but I'm skeptical of how well this tank will do once I swap the carbon for bio rio...it's in a bit of a weak state right now and diatoms wouldn't be good at all. :icon_neut

The girlfriend got me an ADA bubble counter for my upcoming birthday (12th) and I decided to spoil myself a bit and buy a Vuppa. Once the Mini gets to the point where I can crank up the filter outflow, I'll have the Vuppa preventing surface scum and giving a bit more gentle flow as opposed to the concentrated flow from the mini outflow. It's quite strong even at half open.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> Doesn't feel like it's been that much, honestly. I'll be entering the fourth week soon but I'm skeptical of how well this tank will do once I swap the carbon for bio rio...it's in a bit of a weak state right now and diatoms wouldn't be good at all. :icon_neut
> 
> The girlfriend got me an ADA bubble counter for my upcoming birthday (12th) and I decided to spoil myself a bit and buy a Vuppa. Once the Mini gets to the point where I can crank up the filter outflow, I'll have the Vuppa preventing surface scum and giving a bit more gentle flow as opposed to the concentrated flow from the mini outflow. It's quite strong even at half open.


Don't get discouraged. Remember that tanks as small as ours are incredibly unstable, regardless of how "stable" we think we are (stability is relative)... So much can go bad so fast. But the good news is, the same goes vice versa!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Don't get discouraged. Remember that tanks as small as ours are incredibly unstable, regardless of how "stable" we think we are (stability is relative)... So much can go bad so fast. But the good news is, the same goes vice versa!


Yeah....I think it's just because it was in so much of a transition phase that I'm having issues with it. I'm wanting things to grow in more before I add amanos again as well since I'll have to reduce the CO2 for a good while. I'll probably add at least an oto or two when I get my Vuppa in.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Vuppa is here. It's a pretty sweet little device. I love it. My only issue with it is that mine was a tad bit noisy before I left for work. I'm not sure if it's got a natural hum or what now, but that's all that I can hear (and I have to practically put my ear up to it to hear it). As you can see from pictures, it works pretty well.  I'm happy to have it. Hopefully the tank will grow in soon enough and I can get this show on the road. I'm done with resets for now.

Next Thursday I'll be swapping the carbon out for bio rio and praying that diatoms don't annihilate my tank.  Hopefully the amanos and otos will be able to handle it. Oh yeah, did I mention how much I love the Vuppa? Man, this thing is _nice_.





































Nice and clean!










...and not so clean. Yum algae. I'll take a toothbrush to it next water change.


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## menoseloso (Dec 2, 2006)

shrimp buffet lol


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Pretty much. Amanos are gonna be fat when they get done. :hihi:


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## mluk27 (Jan 22, 2012)

Nice Vuppa, I just wish it wasnt so bulky lol


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

It's honestly not that bulky, at least in my opinion. It'd barely be noticeable in a larger tank. I definitely want one for my next build...probably a 60-P/F. It works very nicely.  Only problem is that my glosso hasn't covered my foreground enough yet and the Vuppa makes a little clearing in the front left corner. Not enough to uproot, but moves about 1/8" of substrate...and I can't turn down or redirect the flow.


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## CryptKeeper54 (Apr 14, 2012)

Nice vuppa. My first time seeing it. Going to research it right now. Seems like a cool nano filter to have.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

It's essentially just that. However, you really don't want to use it as a mechanical filter. The chamber is pretty large and you fill it with bio cube. It's a power head at the bottom of a column that doubles as bio filtration and a surface skimmer. Darn sexy too. :hihi:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

It's been six days! What's changed?!


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

So you run the Vuppa in conjunction with a Canister filter? Or did the Vuppa replace it?

Nice setup btw, I hope they make the AQUASKY for larger tanks soon.:hihi:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Moved the Vuppa to my 20L. It's a bit too much flow for the mini right now. Works like a charm on my 20, though.




Geniusdudekiran said:


> It's been six days! What's changed?!


Some algae on my foreground soil that pearls, a bit of plant growth and a lot of algae. I'll be going back to 2-3x weekly water changes until that issue gets fixed.


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## bluestems (Feb 7, 2012)

Nice tank! I really like the aquasky and would love to do one for my tank, but it's not the right size. Do the legs/brackets come off so a suspension setup could be rigged?


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

The Aquasky light is separate from the mounting brackets, so you could suspend it off something else, yes. The 30cm and 36cm versions are the same light, with different sized mounting.


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## bluestems (Feb 7, 2012)

Thanks Frank... that's good to know! Do you think the light would adequately light a 50cm wide aquarium?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

I think he mentioned using 2 for a 60P (60cm), so I you could probably do that.

Personal shoutout: Frank's riccia is the best around...even better than buying from a professional retailer. It got fine here from Texas to North Carolina during the summer via USPS Priority shipping, so it's pretty resilient stuff. I see why the dog ate it now. :hihi:

Also, another side note: If you don't feel like buying Riccia Line (or run out like I did and need a quick solution), you can go to the fishing section of store with a sports/outdoors/whatever section and pick up some 4lb test green fishing line. I got 220 yards of the stuff for like $5. Same waterproof tying line, just different color. Granted, you won't be seeing the line anyway if your tank is growing well.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Did I miss something, or did you lose some Glosso plant mass?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Did I miss something, or did you lose some Glosso plant mass?


Remember when you mentioned you were going to redo your Mini S and I said I was going to redo mine too? :wink:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> Remember when you mentioned you were going to redo your Mini S and I said I was going to redo mine too? :wink:


Oh, right. I've been crazy busy setting up my site, working on my trees etc., not to make excuses. But I my defense, this is a Mini M, not an S! :tongue:

Why don't you add more though? Can't get it locally, or don't want to have to pay to have it shipped?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Both. I'm just waiting for it to grow in right now...it's spreading fine.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Tank is whacky out of balance right now. Starting tomorrow I'll probably just be dosing lightly since there's quite a bit of algae....No BBA, though.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> Both. I'm just waiting for it to grow in right now...it's spreading fine.


Some people like to just sit back and watch the world -- whoops, their tanks -- grow. :hihi:



freph said:


> Tank is whacky out of balance right now. Starting tomorrow I'll probably just be dosing lightly since there's quite a bit of algae....No BBA, though.


It's great to have a (relatively) stable nano tank. It takes time, and a lot of it. But I can go a week without any ferts or a week with extra ferts with minimal symptoms. I don't do that often, maybe once every couple months by accident, but it's great. 

Nanos ftw!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Some people like to just sit back and watch the world -- whoops, their tanks -- grow. :hihi:
> 
> It's great to have a (relatively) stable nano tank. It takes time, and a lot of it. But I can go a week without any ferts or a week with extra ferts with minimal symptoms. I don't do that often, maybe once every couple months by accident, but it's great.
> 
> Nanos ftw!


I do enjoy watching it grow...it's nice to see nature take its course. I think most of the instability is being caused by lack of plant mass, though. I can't turn my filter outflow all the way up until the glosso grows in otherwise it blasts my soil like crazy. Blah.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Hey man, I just got some tissue cultured glosso and a few other plants. Let me know if you want it to fill out the tank.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey man, I just got some tissue cultured glosso and a few other plants. Let me know if you want it to fill out the tank.


You have a pm, good sir.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Got my hands on some H. tenellum 'micro'....I'm a happy camper. Replacing the old H. tenellum with the micro variety. Some of the stuff shipped in already read and very small...I love it!


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

Maybe I missed it, but what is your CO2 setup that you are using?


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

It's been 2 weeks and 1 day since we've seen the tank! 

That's a long time on the scale of a nano tank!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> It's been 2 weeks and 1 day since we've seen the tank!
> 
> That's a long time on the scale of a nano tank!


Not when you've changed the media to bio rio and have cloudy water. :redface:


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

You may have switched over a little soon if you're getting some cloudiness - and too soon by I mean that you had to replant most everything.

Don't worry, you'll get through it and come out the other end making some kickass scapes.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> You may have switched over a little soon if you're getting some cloudiness - and too soon by I mean that you had to replant most everything.
> 
> Don't worry, you'll get through it and come out the other end making some kickass scapes.


The cloudiness isn't really bothering me. It happens. I'm adding green bacter daily to help speed along the new media seeding. The amanos and otos I added are doing fine and my plants are spotless. The glosso (finally, now that it's not covered in algae!) and hairgrass are really taking off.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

This is great news Freph! You're turning the corner!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> This is great news Freph! You're turning the corner!


Hopefully I can keep it that way, too. :redface: The riccia is starting to stand up quite well. Some of the whitening is going away (probably has to do with the fact that I added about 1/16tsp of micros mix the day you mentioned it vs the Green Brighty) but some of it was just like that from what you sent. Cuts more towards the bottom, I'm guessing. They're growing well now though. No amano deaths either! This is a first. The new H. tenellum 'micro' is taking off as well. I've got a couple of new red leaves already. :icon_smil Did a 50% WC today. Nothing to trim, no algae to scrape...just cloudy water to replace with clean water and ADA goodies to dose.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Mini is improving quite a bit. Algae is down to a minimum which I very much approve of. Quite the sight for sore eyes. All my amanos and otos survived just fine too. Say what? My amanos normally die/jump in 2-3 days....I approve. Frank, I think you'll approve of the riccia comeback. Thanks for the advice on the micros.

P.S. That diffuser is getting cleaned as soon as I finish posting this and in my other journal. :biggrin:


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

im looking forward to seeing it once it fills in. particularly the glosso. its a high maintenance plant, but it can look really majestic.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

@[email protected] said:


> im looking forward to seeing it once it fills in. particularly the glosso. its a high maintenance plant, but it can look really majestic.


I'm fine with high maintenance. There will definitely be a lot of effort put into this tank to keep it pristine.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Holy otos! How many are there, five?


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

looks great freph!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Holy otos! How many are there, five?


I believe so. It was only going to be 4, but Rachel sent me an extra.  They're happy anyway. Social creatures and stuff. There's 11 amanos in there too. :hihi: Needless to say, my algae woes are gone.



orchidman said:


> looks great freph!


Thanks!


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## DanW11 (Apr 3, 2012)

Looking great, that riccia is pearling up a storm! Looks like the glosso is sending out runners too, I'll bet carpeting is just around the corner.

Congrats on battling through the algae woes. Those amanos are pretty awesome eh? Just absolute clean-up masters.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

DanW11 said:


> Looking great, that riccia is pearling up a storm! Looks like the glosso is sending out runners too, I'll bet carpeting is just around the corner.
> 
> Congrats on battling through the algae woes. Those amanos are pretty awesome eh? Just absolute clean-up masters.


Glosso is spreading like crazy and the riccia is just amazing in its own right. Everything is doing very well now. Can't wait for the glosso to spread into the front right corner...means I can turn the outflow from the 2211 all the way up. 

I did break my Pollen Glass Mini, though. RIP money. :/


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

freph said:


> Glosso is spreading like crazy and the riccia is just amazing in its own right. Everything is doing very well now. Can't wait for the glosso to spread into the front right corner...means I can turn the outflow from the 2211 all the way up.
> 
> I did break my Pollen Glass Mini, though. RIP money. :/


Love this tank. Good work so far! 

That's what worries me about glassware. They seem very fragile and its tough spending all that money for it to break very easily. I broke a diffusor and wasn't even in the tank yet. Well I fixed it with a little bit of silicone. It may not be pretty but it works. If your in a pinch you can do that until you get a new one.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Hey! Send me the broken pieces! Lol


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> Love this tank. Good work so far!
> 
> That's what worries me about glassware. They seem very fragile and its tough spending all that money for it to break very easily. I broke a diffusor and wasn't even in the tank yet. Well I fixed it with a little bit of silicone. It may not be pretty but it works. If your in a pinch you can do that until you get a new one.


No need to, I've always got spare up aqua ones laying around. 



Geniusdudekiran said:


> Hey! Send me the broken pieces! Lol


If you really want me to, I can lol.

I'll do an update today. For now...breakfast, class and a haircut.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

How old are you? Have fun at class


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

orchidman said:


> How old are you? Have fun at class


21 good sir. College senior majoring in computer science and minoring in math.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

As promised, an update. Had the replacement ADA diffuser shipped out today, should be here Monday or so. $139.95 later...  Oh well, such is life and the current state of the USD vs JPY. Trimmed the hairgrass down since it was getting unruly. Other than that, everything is on autopilot. Fish next Thursday!

Post WC









About an hour post WC - pearling riccia!









Cool overhead shot. Healthy stuff.









Amano army, assemble!


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## moosenart (Feb 18, 2012)

Looking good!!


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

freph said:


> 21 good sir. College senior majoring in computer science and minoring in math.


awesome! not sure why anyone would want to minor or major in math! blech


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

moosenart said:


> Looking good!!


Thank ya!



orchidman said:


> awesome! not sure why anyone would want to minor or major in math! blech


It's one extra course from computer science, so why not, eh?


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

freph said:


> Thank ya!
> 
> 
> 
> It's one extra course from computer science, so why not, eh?


guess that makes sense, lol! but i wouldnt wanna do that! haha horticulture FTW!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

orchidman said:


> guess that makes sense, lol! but i wouldnt wanna do that! haha horticulture FTW!


I really enjoyed horticulture in high school. I can't say I'd like to pursue a career in it, though.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

freph said:


> I really enjoyed horticulture in high school. I can't say I'd like to pursue a career in it, though.


im in highschool, but i definitely want to major in hort. I really like it and im interested in it because of all my orchids


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

orchidman said:


> im in highschool, but i definitely want to major in hort. I really like it and im interested in it because of all my orchids


It's an interesting and broad field, that's for sure. Tons of different things you can specialize in.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

freph said:


> It's an interesting and broad field, that's for sure. Tons of different things you can specialize in.


yeah! there are all kinds of different openings! my dream is to open a world class orchid nursery and be able to breed phalaenopsis and other genera. be like the next Krull-Smith Orchids!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

orchidman said:


> yeah! there are all kinds of different openings! my dream is to open a world class orchid nursery and be able to breed phalaenopsis and other genera. be like the next Krull-Smith Orchids!


Sounds like an excellent idea. Always go with what you're passionate about. 

So, this may make some of you cringe, but I made a temporary ADA nano diffuser....Frankenstein-style. Yep. Basically, broke the stem off with a pair of pliers (the glass was wrapped in a sock, no safety worries) and put some tubing on it. Fairly simple rig. Behold! (Frank, please don't kill me for this)




















H. tenellum 'micro' is doing well!


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

lol the diffuser is like you cant tell anything happened! you should sell it to me for an exorbitantly low price roud:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

orchidman said:


> lol the diffuser is like you cant tell anything happened! you should sell it to me for an exorbitantly low price roud:


Kiran is first in line if he wants it, I know he's been wanting one for ages and he commented about it first. If he doesn't want it, you can have it (for a small fee, of course).


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

i wasnt aware he wanted one. if he doesnt want it (who am i kidding?) im your man


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

*freph*, Judging by the pictures running the diffuser, you have a strong overdose of CO2. I told you at the beginning of your journey to be careful here. I am more than confident that because of this, you have a problem with an aquarium. I'm sorry that you did not take my words too seriously then. Maybe now listen ... Good luck.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> *freph*, Judging by the pictures running the diffuser, you have a strong overdose of CO2. I told you at the beginning of your journey to be careful here. I am more than confident that because of this, you have a problem with an aquarium. I'm sorry that you did not take my words too seriously then. Maybe now listen ... Good luck.


I don't really see how there's an overdose of CO2. Everything is growing fine and algae is at a minimum. The diffuser is only running at 1.5-2bps (all ADA equipment) anyway.


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

freph said:


> Sounds like an excellent idea. Always go with what you're passionate about.
> 
> So, this may make some of you cringe, but I made a temporary ADA nano diffuser....Frankenstein-style. Yep. Basically, broke the stem off with a pair of pliers (the glass was wrapped in a sock, no safety worries) and put some tubing on it. Fairly simple rig. Behold! (Frank, please don't kill me for this)
> 
> ...


Sweet fix! Looks fine to me. That diffuser looks like it works well. The rhinox one I have isn't the best. Some of the bubbles are big. But it works for now... 

Regarding the Co2 comment. All you have is shrimp in this tank, correct? And they are amanos which are pretty hardy. If I were you I'd crank it even more! Lol. I'm running mine at about 1bps. But it's because I have sakura shrimp and I'm trying to raise it slowly and get them used to the co2. If I could, I'd go as high as possible. You can never od on co2. And how can you tell from a picture the amount of co2 your running?? What? Lol!!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> Sweet fix! Looks fine to me. That diffuser looks like it works well. The rhinox one I have isn't the best. Some of the bubbles are big. But it works for now...
> 
> Regarding the Co2 comment. All you have is shrimp in this tank, correct? And they are amanos which are pretty hardy. If I were you I'd crank it even more! Lol. I'm running mine at about 1bps. But it's because I have sakura shrimp and I'm trying to raise it slowly and get them used to the co2. If I could, I'd go as high as possible. You can never od on co2. And how can you tell from a picture the amount of co2 your running?? What? Lol!!


Thanks! Yeah, my up aqua one puts out slightly larger bubbles....but this ADA one, oh man. About as good as you can get from just a glass/ceramic before going atomic style diffuser. I'm impressed.

Maybe it just looked like a lot of CO2 from the amount of small bubbles, but who knows. You technically "can" od on CO2 to the point that it kills the livestock, but there's no surface film and plants are producing plenty of oxygen (look at the riccia, lol) so I'm not too concerned. I've got otos and amanos in there but haven't had any deaths. Just random amanos jumping up and hitting the glass top for whatever reason. Other than that, they're fine and dandy. Fish will be in Thursday.  Still waiting for glosso and grass to fill in so I can crank up the darn filter outflow. The 2211 puts out!


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

I was thinking atomic also but I don't like the black suction cups...lol. But as far as diffusion goes. I think it's the best you can get besides ADA.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Lol, love the diffuser! Name me a price! :hihi:

Tank looks awesome. When're you getting fish?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> I was thinking atomic also but I don't like the black suction cups...lol. But as far as diffusion goes. I think it's the best you can get besides ADA.


Functionally speaking, atomics should be better because of the finer mist. ADA wins aesthetically for me, though. Plus they make micro bubbles fine on their own.



Geniusdudekiran said:


> Lol, love the diffuser! Name me a price! :hihi:
> 
> Tank looks awesome. When're you getting fish?


Fish Thursday.  PM me about the diffuser, we can work something out.


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

CO2 intensity is very well seen in the photo of the diffuser, and do not have to be a child prodigy, which would see the difference with this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?annota...=iv&src_vid=VVR5bfYuffM&v=g63Z6DpNF6s#t=2m49s

Plants began to grow and algae are gone, that's good. But it's been two months after setup! With proper care the plants grow rapidly from the beginning, and algae almost none at the start and very quickly they disappear completely from view.

Now if everything is good, it does not mean it will last forever. I had the same problem with the growth of plants, as you do. Information about an overdose of CO2 in the Internet very little, and the problem with aquariums, many because of this. 1,5-2 bps is a lot, especially after the setup aquarium. 3 bps need for 60 cm. aquarium. In your case, one bps is the maximum dose. After setup need less. In addition to the harmful effects of CO2 on microorganisms, you greatly lower the pH level and the plants also suffer because of this.
Otherwise, how do you explain such a poor condition your plants for two months, if you do everything correctly and use only original products ADA? Do not look into the causes of problems, you will soon get them again.

It looked like my tank after setup,









and to look like in two months









From the beginning, had no problems with algae or the growth of plants.
Doing all the instructions ADA. Added the original fertilizer according to instructions, in the recommended dose (1 ml for each fertilizer). And I am fully confident that if I added CO2 in the quantities that you make, I would have the same problems with the aquarium as you.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Gorgeous tank. Honestly, I think my bigges downfalls were not starting with enough plant mass and then replanting the tank. However, I'll take your advice and drop the CO2 down a bit. I wonder if ADA's diffusers and bubble counter work with each other through different back pressures on the counter from different ceramic disks type and the bps stepping is the same for all tanks?


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

The recommendations of the ADA clearly states that for aquariums 36 cm need to file one bubble per second. You have diffuser and bubble counter from ADA, Why do you doubt, and why invent your dosage?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> The recommendations of the ADA clearly states that for aquariums 36 cm need to file one bubble per second. You have diffuser and bubble counter from ADA, Why do you doubt, and why invent your dosage?


Hm, I guess in the book they didn't really clarify that their 4-week plan is for 60cm tanks (1, 2, 3 bps as you move to week 4). I'll have to read the book over when I get home.

Edit: In the video, looks like they're running about .5bps....interesting.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

BPM is outdated/proven to be an invalid form of CO2 measurement. I'd say you're just fine. Use a drop checker if you're not sure. That's the only real way available to hobbyists.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> BPM is outdated/proven to be an invalid form of CO2 measurement. I'd say you're just fine. Use a drop checker if you're not sure. That's the only real way available to hobbyists.


I'll just adjust based on reactions in the tank. Drop checkers are nice and all, but I feel it'd just be too bulky in the tank. Minimalistic is what I want for this tank now that I've removed the Vuppa.


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## Ozydego (Aug 29, 2011)

I think you are absolutely correct about watching how things react. I am sure the current "master" will tell you that watching the plants response is a much better idea then using the "invented" BPS that is stated somewhere. For Bozhkov, one BPS worked, no need to change it, for ANY other tank it may be different. That number is a baseline and you adjust based on the individual aquarium. The placement of the diffuser and diffusion rate change the BPS needed to keep the plants liking it best. My advice, dont follow anyones advice, only take it into consideration. You know what is working for your tank, don't doubt it. Do what you are doing and keep that riccia looking AWESOME!


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

i agree, bps is how much CO2 goes into the tank, not necessarily how much the tank retains, or is useable.
the changes in plants and fauna are the best things for gauging if you need more, less, or got it right.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Yeah. Results-driven tanking, ftw!

Can't wait to receive the diffuser, btw! roud:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Ozydego said:


> I think you are absolutely correct about watching how things react. I am sure the current "master" will tell you that watching the plants response is a much better idea then using the "invented" BPS that is stated somewhere. For Bozhkov, one BPS worked, no need to change it, for ANY other tank it may be different. That number is a baseline and you adjust based on the individual aquarium. The placement of the diffuser and diffusion rate change the BPS needed to keep the plants liking it best. My advice, dont follow anyones advice, only take it into consideration. You know what is working for your tank, don't doubt it. Do what you are doing and keep that riccia looking AWESOME!


Riccia looks awesome regardless.  Stuff pearls like crazy for me and all stones have an inch thick worth of growth on them since I redid the stones. Insane. I believe I may have had just a tad too much CO2 in the system since the plants are just as vibrant at 1bps as they were with 1.5-2, so.



@[email protected] said:


> i agree, bps is how much CO2 goes into the tank, not necessarily how much the tank retains, or is useable.
> the changes in plants and fauna are the best things for gauging if you need more, less, or got it right.


Agreed. Every tank will have different needs and the only way to figure that out is to be scientific about it.



Geniusdudekiran said:


> Yeah. Results-driven tanking, ftw!
> 
> Can't wait to receive the diffuser, btw! roud:


Can't wait for you to get it! I know you've been wanting an ADA diffuser for ages. Unfortunately, this is the best I can do for you.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> Can't wait for you to get it! I know you've been wanting an ADA diffuser for ages. Unfortunately, this is the best I can do for you.


Don't worry man, it's now a "one of a kind!" No one else has an ADA diffuser cracked exactly that way now! :tongue: lol


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Don't worry man, it's now a "one of a kind!" No one else has an ADA diffuser cracked exactly that way now! :tongue: lol


This it true. :hihi: I hope you enjoy it. It'll be coming with the original box, btw. PM/iMessage me your shipping info as well unless you've already sent it to me somehow and I just missed it.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> This it true. :hihi: I hope you enjoy it. It'll be coming with the original box, btw. PM/iMessage me your shipping info as well unless you've already sent it to me somehow and I just missed it.


Oooh, sweet! Thanks for the reminder.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Fish? Fish. 25 or so Bororas urophthalmoides. Loving them very much right now. Great little fish and so small! They'll only get a tad bit bigger too, which is awesome.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Beautiful!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Beautiful!


Thanks! It's just.....not where I want it right now. I need everything to grow in more and be healthier. The tank just doesn't have that sparkle right now.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> Thanks! It's just.....not where I want it right now. I need everything to grow in more and be healthier. The tank just doesn't have that sparkle right now.


I think you need some color variation. All you've got is one monotonous green (photos can lie, though, so I don't know...), and even the rock is green :confused1:. 

Add something red (or a different shade of green)!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> I think you need some color variation. All you've got is one monotonous green (photos can lie, though, so I don't know...), and even the rock is green :confused1:.
> 
> Add something red (or a different shade of green)!


The H. tenellum 'micro' in the back is red, it's just not grown enough yet. Check a few posts back at the top views of it. That, and the fish need to grow a little bit more so their colors become more noticeable. If there's any issues with reds, I've got just the things for the tank. 

Side note: substrate level is bugging me again.....must.....resist..... :redface::fish:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Hey wait a second, if I recall, I told you to change the substrate level months back, before you had filled it... :hihi: roud:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Hey wait a second, if I recall, I told you to change the substrate level months back, before you had filled it... :hihi: roud:


Yeah yeah. Coming back to bite me now. Project WK will change that, however....:wink:roud::bounce:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

freph said:


> Yeah yeah. Coming back to bite me now. Project WK will change that, however....:wink:roud::bounce:


Lol. Ability to admit is an admirable trait.

Indeed, it will!  :thumbsup: roud:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Lol. Ability to admit is an admirable trait.
> 
> Indeed, it will!  :thumbsup: roud:


Luckily I still have about half of a 9L bag of powder soil and won't need a ton for the rescape. Thinking maybe 1" in the front and 2-2.5" in the back. WK glosso patties will just be pushed down into the soil anyways and stems the same. Gotta keep a low depth and my sanity this time around. November can't come fast enough!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

So....I really let this tank get out of hand. Algae infestation from another planet. I got the hair algae under control and the GSA on the glosso.....but my riccia turned to mush. Might've been the large amounts of Excel that were being poured in to kill the hair algae (which worked amazingly, mind you). Oh well. Took 2 stones out and did a massive trim that consisted of 2 water changes with a general mow-down and some fine pruning. I'll post the aftermath tomorrow night after the tank has a recovery day. It needs a break too, ya know. :fish:


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

Why is all that bad? Maybe it's a curse? 
All much simpler. Night aeration and moderate amounts of CO2 during the day. Decide with CO2, set the Drop Checker.
Judging by the presence of the hair algae and the GSA have begun to deficiency of macro. Check the parameters of the water and if the tests shows zeros, go to Special lights (in exchange Step)


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> Why is all that bad? Maybe it's a curse?
> All much simpler. Night aeration and moderate amounts of CO2 during the day. Decide with CO2, set the Drop Checker.
> Judging by the presence of the hair algae and the GSA have begun to deficiency of macro. Check the parameters of the water and if the tests shows zeros, go to Special lights (in exchange Step)


Shouldn't have been a macro deficiency...I've been dosing the recommended amount of Brighty K, Green Brighty Step 1 and Green Brighty Special Lights for a good while now. The spirogyra was probably just due to inadequate CO2 distribution since my flow was turned down quite a bit while the right side grew in (otherwise the filter outflow would blow the substrate out if I turned it up more). It's fine now, though. 99% of the algae is gone. A major issue was probably the underlying riccia melting away as well....but I'm not entirely sure. I'll re-tie the stones I removed with good riccia from the 20L and also the other two stones if those don't recover.

Night time aeration...again, an issue of flow control. That side was not grown in so I couldn't really do it. Now that things are back in good condition, I'll start doing it again. CO2 was dropped down after the trim a tad since there's not as much plant mass right now. Green Gain and Phyton Git added to help plants grow back in and keep the algae at bay.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Alright, it's official. Redoing the tank on Sunday (assuming everything comes in on Saturday). I want a much cleaner execution this time around. Tank inhabitants will be hanging out in my 20g in the meantime. Instead of using two smaller riccia stones, I'll just use one large one in the setup so I can make the carpet as neat as possible (that and I've got this great 3.5" x 2" piece of slate that's perfect for a large riccia mass).

The back/midback sections will consist of E. acicularis and H. tenellum 'micro' for height and a lovely color deviation. The foreground will contain that one large riccia mass and glosso. I'm planning to pick up some E. parvula from PetsMart (their little gel packs are great for quick plug and play - cheap for what you get, too since there's no overnight shipping fees!) and do a little bit of planning. Since the rock has such a nice size to it, I'm going to plant bunches of E. parvula at the base of the rock so they'll hide the base of it and smooth its blending into the scape as a whole. I think this will be much better than my idea of just letting glosso and Belem grass go rampant.

To those of you that mentioned lower substrate depth from the get-go, consider this your personal victory. The substrate line is being dropped about an inch as well. I believe this will solve the issue of the filter outflow kicking up soil at the beginning of the setup so I can optimize the flow and CO2 distribution from the start and prevent excess algae or other issues. Daily water changes for the first couple of weeks (or more, as I deem necessary) will ensure more balance for the system.

The tank will receive a thorough cleaning via bleach being run through the filtration system (all canister media removed, of course) for a few hours and then rinsed well and dechlorinated for an hour before I begin the actual setup. The rock will be cleaned separately to avoid bleaching of its lovely tones (H2O2 and a toothbrush).


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

Good luck. Are you keeping the same
Hard scape?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> Good luck. Are you keeping the same
> Hard scape?


Same rock, yeah.


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## Bozhkov (Dec 15, 2011)

Hi! Filter is crucial to set up your aquarium. If you first start the nitrogen cycle, and then plant the plants, you will have no problems (if you strictly follow the instructions ADA). 
The best way to use a filter from another tank. Since you washed filter (I would not have done), the easiest and most reliable way is to pour the substrate with additives, to set up the stones and the filter. Do not plant the plants and do not substitute water. Just wait until the water disappears ammonium.
Then drain all water to plant the plants and to enjoy the aquarium without the algae.
About aeration you know. Symptoms of overdose of CO2 will be elongated leaves of the glosso.
--
_P.S. Sorry for my English. Blame It on Google translator :icon_mrgr_


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Bozhkov said:


> Hi! Filter is crucial to set up your aquarium. If you first start the nitrogen cycle, and then plant the plants, you will have no problems (if you strictly follow the instructions ADA).
> The best way to use a filter from another tank. Since you washed filter (I would not have done), the easiest and most reliable way is to pour the substrate with additives, to set up the stones and the filter. Do not plant the plants and do not substitute water. Just wait until the water disappears ammonium.
> Then drain all water to plant the plants and to enjoy the aquarium without the algae.
> About aeration you know. Symptoms of overdose of CO2 will be elongated leaves of the glosso.
> ...



The bio rio in the filter is already loaded with good bacteria. I'm not cleaning that, just the tubing and glassware. I've seen the benefit of having a good base of bacteria before using aquasoil when I redid my 20. Very stable and no algae issues.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Reset more likely to be Thursday. Poor Frank came down with the West Nile Virus this week and was unable to ship my stuff out. Soon, though.

Edit: Friday is the day.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

I can't believe I haven't posted any pictures of this tank since the reset. It looks a lot better to say the least, but the substrate is still bothering me. That, and I'm redoing the tank with HC and a different hairgrass pattern. Anyone wanna buy some glosso/belem grass mix?  Full carpet worth.

My everyday view:


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

wow, i really love it. mixed carpets are the isht... good job. glosso/hairgrass combo looks good. taking notes for sure


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## QQQUUUUAADDD (Feb 26, 2012)

The otos look quite cute.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

Quite a stunning carpet!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> wow, i really love it. mixed carpets are the isht... good job. glosso/hairgrass combo looks good. taking notes for sure


They're nice, but this one just isn't to my liking. The next one will have some interesting features and not be so...messy. Plus, the riccia stone will be quite large and it'll be the only one in the tank. The riccia in the 20g is in the perfect state to trim and make a new stone with... 

There are minor algae issues between water changes, but there's really only a few crucial notes to keep in mind:

1) Consistent CO2 supply and adjustment based on plant need is very important. Too much and your livestock will suffer, too little and your plants will suffer and algae will take hold. Neither is fun...let the tank tell you what it needs.

2) Maintenance when necessary is important as well, especially when it comes to algae. The best plan is just to knock it out as soon as you see it. You can flip back through the pages of this journal and see how easily and quickly the spirogyra took over. It could have easily been prevented if I had jumped on it from the start. Very dumb mistake that I paid for and learned from. Don't be afraid to take some filter tubing (sometimes airline tubing just doesn't provide strong enough suction) and do some spot maintenance on the tank. Believe it or not, that entire back and right side section of hairgrass had algae on it before I did a water change today. All I did was incorporate that into my draining time. That, and I "vacuumed" the glosso/grass/riccia carpet.

Maintenance also includes keeping your filter clean and functioning at its best. Decaying organic matter in your mechanical filtration system can lead to excess organics that you don't want.

3) Dose ferts! I had an issue with iron deficiency a little while back and I solved it by supplementing ECA until the tank got back into the swing of things. I see quite often that people have issues with algae in their tanks and they don't dose at all. High light, CO2, all the bells and whistles...but no ferts. Things like that elude me.

4) Do water changes. I can't tell you how many times I've solved problems in this tank by doing quick water changes.

5) Trim your plants. Trimming encourages spreading of carpet plants and promotes denser, healthier growth.



QQQUUUUAADDD said:


> The otos look quite cute.


Thank you! They certainly are adorable. 



Hayden said:


> Quite a stunning carpet!


Thanks! I definitely put a good bit of effort into it. Your tank will have one soon enough when you get it started. HC is a weed! Keep it happy and it'll grow very well for you.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

> Thanks! I definitely put a good bit of effort into it. Your tank will have one soon enough when you get it started. HC is a weed! Keep it happy and it'll grow very well for you.


I'm looking forward to the replant, it will really clean up the appearance of your tank- We can be HC buddies.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> I'm looking forward to the replant, it will really clean up the appearance of your tank- We can be HC buddies.


Sure can! HC is a very fun plant. I'm glad I've got a little bit of experience with it.


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## somewhatshocked (Aug 8, 2011)

Love how the Otos look like giants compared to the Boraras.

Love that rock, as well.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

somewhatshocked said:


> Love how the Otos look like giants compared to the Boraras.
> 
> Love that rock, as well.


Yeah, the urophthalmoides are really small. Perfect fish for a nano tank honestly. I love the rock as well. It has great features and tones to it.


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

freph said:


> They're nice, but this one just isn't to my liking. The next one will have some interesting features and not be so...messy. Plus, the riccia stone will be quite large and it'll be the only one in the tank. The riccia in the 20g is in the perfect state to trim and make a new stone with...
> 
> There are minor algae issues between water changes, but there's really only a few crucial notes to keep in mind:
> 
> ...


I really need to heed some of this advice for my next re-scape. I'm still kind of stuck in the lo-tech mindset where I thought that few water changes were better than frequent ones. And my tank is a bit dirty, could explain a lot of things. But it's tough to turn things around now. Just going to keep trying to battle the algae and hopefully it plateaus. 

This really helps!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> I really need to heed some of this advice for my next re-scape. I'm still kind of stuck in the lo-tech mindset where I thought that few water changes were better than frequent ones. And my tank is a bit dirty, could explain a lot of things. But it's tough to turn things around now. Just going to keep trying to battle the algae and hopefully it plateaus.
> 
> This really helps!


I'm glad you found that post helpful. Your Mini M looks pretty good from your recent FTS. I'm surprised you're having issues with it as good as it looks (minus your post about the ludwigia, lack of ferts would explain the melt). That rotala looks great though and the nice thing about it is that it'll grow in pretty much any conditions (of course slower in some). I'll put up a picture of the stems in my 20L when I get home today....should give you an idea of how fast the stems grow in that tank. It's ridiculous. Definitely get some micros and macros in the Mini M though, I'm sure you'll be amazed with the results.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Dude, finally! I love it!

I don't know how you feel about this, but you can get that carpet down nice and low I'd you mow it, now that it's so thick. I love that mixed carpet.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Dude, finally! I love it!
> 
> I don't know how you feel about this, but you can get that carpet down nice and low I'd you mow it, now that it's so thick. I love that mixed carpet.


Sold the carpet off and redid it today. Substrate line and execution will be much better this time. It was a nice tank but it would always bug me when I looked at it. Stupid substrate line. >:|


Without further adieu, I present the new scape. It's not much to look at right now, but it'll grow in. I'm actually debating ordering another pot of HC from Frank....probably gonna happen. Fancy tissue cultured stuff is amazing. Very easy to plant and very healthy. Love it. Bleached the living crap out of everything today (filter with bleach plan, removed media of course) so that's why the tank actually looks clean. My lungs, throat and sinuses hate me but whatever. It was worth it. :hihi:






























Also, pictures of the teardown.

Yum.










And....the results!


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## Neatfish (Jun 22, 2012)

Dig it can't wait to see when it grows in.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Neatfish said:


> Dig it can't wait to see when it grows in.


I can't wait for it to do so. Sent Frank a message for 2 more pots of HC. Definitely don't want to wait as long as I did last time for enough plant mass to crank the filter up to max without worrying about it blowing stuff away.

Edit:
1:14am
I must say, this tank is ridiculously crystal clear to have just been redone. Filter bacteria...what magical critters you are. 100% bio rio is good stuff.


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

Any updates?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Green_Flash said:


> Any updates?


Yeah, sure. Here ya go. Not much to report honestly. Just a little bit of growth here and there. Waiting for the HC to grow a bit longer so I can cut and replant more stems for faster coverage. Planted a few 1/8" pieces today and some that were horizontal stems with just a root. Not that fun, but they're in there! New pictures courtesy of Razr Maxx HD. Still getting used to the camera options, but it shoots very well.


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

Oh it looks good , you still trying ricca?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Green_Flash said:


> Oh it looks good , you still trying ricca?


Yeah, but just one big stone this time. I want a section of riccia not interspersed ricca. Easier to maintain too, I think.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

I like the replant! I think yours will fill in much faster than mine. I still don't have roots. 
See you at the finish line!  Haha seriously though, your tank looks very beautiful, and also very professional!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> I like the replant! I think yours will fill in much faster than mine. I still don't have roots.
> See you at the finish line!  Haha seriously though, your tank looks very beautiful, and also very professional!


I'm surprised yours haven't rooted yet....mine settled in pretty quickly (well, the bunches that survived anyway). Trim your HC and replant stems in bunches once it gets a little bit taller in growth. It'll spread much faster that way. Dunno about professional, but I do appreciate the compliments.  Current goal: get the right side filled in more (I pulled the H. tenellum last night, wasn't doing well and it's in a bad spot) so I can actually crank the filter output up. This little half flow crap isn't cutting it. It's starting to cause some slight algae issues.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

There's some green algae coating the soil in the front....not sure what's causing it. I'm honestly a bit confused. Maybe lack of flow at the soil level (which I can't really do anything about right now because the right side would get owned)....bleh.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

That's odd about the algae..
Did you say your HC was TC? I'm still not getting root growth. 
How did you plant it? I think my issue may be that I used the dead parts as "roots"- maybe if I just cut the dead junk off and plant individual stems it'll take off.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Yep, the HC was TC. I planted it in bunches. They were all nice and green when I planted them. Honestly could have split them up more (and I'm doing so as they grow), but all of them are growing very well and have root growth.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

What I got was a big ball of nice green HC, but all the middle stuff was dead, and there weren't any roots.. 
Do you think I should rip it all up, cut off the buried dead stuff, and replant individual stems?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> What I got was a big ball of nice green HC, but all the middle stuff was dead, and there weren't any roots..
> Do you think I should rip it all up, cut off the buried dead stuff, and replant individual stems?


Removing the dead stuff is always what you want to do. You really only want healthy stems in the tank. Anything else is just detrimental to the tank.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

Ok I guess I'll do that.. :/
Thanks for the help Freph!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> Ok I guess I'll do that.. :/
> Thanks for the help Freph!


I personally pulled a few healthy looking plugs last night....rotted plant matter all the way down from where I planted. Planting in bunches like that = not good. TC needs to be split more when planted. I'll be planting the whole tank Thursday except for the new stuff I've already split, lol. You're not alone.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

We seem to be doing everything at the same time! Well good luck!


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## mltreat (Aug 18, 2012)

The tank looks great! Is the ricca difficult to grow/keep from floating all over the tank? I have read of people using mesh, but I can't see if you used mesh or something else. How are you keeping it there? 

The glassware looks awesome! I really like the scape too!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> We seem to be doing everything at the same time! Well good luck!


It happens.  It just means we're both dedicated to working hard to make sure our tanks do their best.



mltreat said:


> The tank looks great! Is the ricca difficult to grow/keep from floating all over the tank? I have read of people using mesh, but I can't see if you used mesh or something else. How are you keeping it there?
> 
> The glassware looks awesome! I really like the scape too!


I tied it down to a large piece of slate with 4lb test monofilament fishing line. It's the same thickness as the Riccia Line sold by ADA and serves the same purpose. I just ran it around the rock one way, tied it and then made a cross pattern the other way and tied it again. It works quite well. My 20 on the other hand has issues with it. I blame my amanos and being lazy with cleaning up trimmings. :hihi:


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## mltreat (Aug 18, 2012)

Thanks for the inside scoop. I used some string to secure my java moss on my rocks, so I will try the fishing line when I pick up some ricca for my tank.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

mltreat said:


> Thanks for the inside scoop. I used some string to secure my java moss on my rocks, so I will try the fishing line when I pick up some ricca for my tank.


You can tie moss to porous rocks or wood with cotton thread and it'll attach itself. No need for fishing line unless it's a smooth rock.

Edit:
Also, probably going to start doing daily water changes in this tank until it gets into good shape. Maybe a month or so of that. Good oxygenation = good bacterial growth. Good algae prevention technique while plants are growing also. It's probably honestly the reason I have algae. Not a huge plant density + only doing twice weekly water changes on fresh amazonia is asking for trouble even with a cycled filter (flow reduced, though).


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Hang in there man, you'll get over the hump and be making badass layouts before you know it.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> Hang in there man, you'll get over the hump and be making badass layouts before you know it.


Hopefully. The bad thing is I know what I did wrong...not enough plant mass from the start. The TC stuff was nice but most of it just died off for some reason. I'm not really sure what went wrong there. That, and I can't turn up my outflow or it'll blow the substrate around! Very frustrating and I don't really have a solution to it. I look at your initial setup you based your journal around and just sit there in utter confusion thinking "well, he has all the plant mass there....but there are still gaps by the panes of glass that would be hit by full flow and be blown away....what's his secret?!?!?". It's just frustrating. Push come to shove I'll just let the hairgrass take over and make it a simple grass and rock tank, lol. Win/win either way I guess.


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## bitFUUL (May 14, 2010)

freph said:


> ...not enough plant mass from the start.


Same reason my 11.4g failed the first time around. I drained/reset/restarted and had a much better success second time around, but with much more plants. 
Good luck!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

bitFUUL said:


> Same reason my 11.4g failed the first time around. I drained/reset/restarted and had a much better success second time around, but with much more plants.
> Good luck!


The painful part is just knowing that I ruined it from the start. Bah. I'll be doing stupid amounts of daily work on this tank now until I'm pleased with it....at least on the algae scraping front. I turned up the outflow some today and just dealt with the substrate being moved. I can always move it back later.

First step: Move outflow and diffuser. Place some blank stones for flow disruption at soil level. Master plan now in effect.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

Sorry to hear its going so difficult! Are you officially ditching HC? That would be a shame.I hope it pulls through man, good luck.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> Sorry to hear its going so difficult! Are you officially ditching HC? That would be a shame.I hope it pulls through man, good luck.


If it doesn't grow into the quality and area I want it to then probably, but as of now I pulled the HC portions in the back parts of the tank so the grass can take over back there and do its thing. I did replant those portions in the front of the tank, though. I'll start selectively pulling E. parvula runners if they become a problem for the HC to grow in, but I doubt they will given how HC spreads. I want it to have a "wild" look to it. HC and grass intermingled is awesome. I won't be bothering with riccia in this installation. The pearling picked up tremendously as soon as I moved the outflow and diffuser, which is awesome because it's exactly what I want to target for growth right now. Outflow at back left and diffuser at back right....outflow hits the diffuser and starts the CO2 flow directly downward and along the right and front sides....exactly where I want the densest growth right now so I can turn the filter up ASAP. I've isolated the soil disruption to the back right corner (under the diffuser) which only has E. acicularis runners in it, so they're fine and it doesn't annihilate my HC plantings. Put my top back on the tank too. Not sure why, just felt like it. Evaporation has been a bit much lately now that the humidity has dropped and my ceiling fan is turned up.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

You might hate me for this Freph,

But I saw the new Super Jet ES-300 and the way they designed the lily pipe for it is absolutely spectacular - it maintains a higher flow rate than the eheim 2211, but then disperses the flow in a manner that doesn't disrupt the soil at all. I saw them using it on both a Mini S and a Mini M. 

Keep tinkering with it man - I promise you'll get to the skill level you want to achieve with persistence. Remember that the way you feel while maintaining your aquariums will effect the results you get - so practice clearing your mind and be relaxed when you do tasks on the aquarium, your work will reflect it.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Francis Xavier said:


> You might hate me for this Freph,
> 
> But I saw the new Super Jet ES-300 and the way they designed the lily pipe for it is absolutely spectacular - it maintains a higher flow rate than the eheim 2211, but then disperses the flow in a manner that doesn't disrupt the soil at all. I saw them using it on both a Mini S and a Mini M.
> 
> Keep tinkering with it man - I promise you'll get to the skill level you want to achieve with persistence. Remember that the way you feel while maintaining your aquariums will effect the results you get - so practice clearing your mind and be relaxed when you do tasks on the aquarium, your work will reflect it.


You know you're required to get me a lily pipe now, don't you? :icon_neut

Google-fu reveals that it's the Lily Pipe Spin. Got any documents on it?


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

How's this tank going freph? I haven't heard from you in quite awhile.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> How's this tank going freph? I haven't heard from you in quite awhile.


It's going decently. I'll upload a picture if I have time when I get home today. It's post trim, mind you. Stupid tank gets full of detritus for whatever reason even though there's only like 7 things living in it.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Here ya go. Not much to look at and I need to clean the pipes. I'll get to it.


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## shrimpnmoss (Apr 8, 2011)

Your lawn looks super! Nice and even trim. I used to have that ADA nano diffuser. It's really nice....and fragile...I broke mine...so sad...

I can't wait to play with my Mini M. Frank shipped it on Monday so I'm digging through all the Mini M journals to see what others are doing to theirs.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

shrimpnmoss said:


> Your lawn looks super! Nice and even trim. I used to have that ADA nano diffuser. It's really nice....and fragile...I broke mine...so sad...
> 
> I can't wait to play with my Mini M. Frank shipped it on Monday so I'm digging through all the Mini M journals to see what others are doing to theirs.


Lawn is nice and all but it gets unruly after a week and a half or so. I have to mow it to the ground like that to keep the algae down. It's a bit of an annoyance honestly. I wish I did a plain HC carpet. Mixed carpets are nice and all, but not for me. I've played with them enough between this and my 20L. :hihi:

Glad you're getting a Mini M of your own, though! Hopefully you'll enjoy it and turn it into your own little work of art. I have to agree with you on the diffuser as well. It's VERY fragile. Beautiful, but fragile.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

That's looking great! It looks really clean actually. nice and simple. I love the color the rotala adds. Also, I love the natural, mixed carpet feel.
Have you ever tried Algaefix? I found it to be a wonderful product to get algae under control. For my tank, I was having problems with recurring algae, and within a few days Algaefix really cleared it all up. it made a world of difference.
It would probably also be cool if you added some fish! Great looking tank freph.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> That's looking great! It looks really clean actually. nice and simple. I love the color the rotala adds. Also, I love the natural, mixed carpet feel.
> Have you ever tried Algaefix? I found it to be a wonderful product to get algae under control. For my tank, I was having problems with recurring algae, and within a few days Algaefix really cleared it all up. it made a world of difference.
> It would probably also be cool if you added some fish! Great looking tank freph.


Don't feel like throwing chemicals in there. 90% of it comes out with water changes (2x weekly, vacuum hairgrass etc while doing so) and the rest is munched on by amanos/otos. It's not a real problem...I just need some actual stock in the tank lol. Tight on funds right now so I can't really afford it. I'll get up with Rachel for some amanos and some chili rasboras or maculatus. Either/or. The point of the rotala was to add some more color contrast to the tank and also to fill that corner better. They were just planted a few days ago so the new growth is promising. Green, but they'll turn red the taller they grow. Needs about 2-3 prunings to get it to where I want it as far as density. The rotala bush in the 20 is a monster to say the least....and even then it pales in comparison to my d. diandra bush. :icon_twis


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

Awesome! Looking forward to stocking and new growth!


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Dude, the tank is looking _killer_. How about an update? Absolutely love it.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Haven't updated this thread in ages. Whoopsies. :redface:

Took the huge rock out and just went 100% plants. Back left corner hasn't filled yet but it's already got plenty of runners in it. Rotala bush is almost where I want it to be in terms of shape and density. Ignore the clothespin. It's only there until the corner grows in.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

I like the direction you went with this. What plant is going in the back left corner? Your HC is nicer than mine. :tongue:


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> I like the direction you went with this. What plant is going in the back left corner? Your HC is nicer than mine. :tongue:


Just going to let it fill in with hairgrass and HC. Whatever sp grows into it first gets it. I'm not picky at this point.

And hardly! Your HC was glorious.


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## Hayden (Feb 21, 2012)

Sounds good! Was? it's still chugging along, but still not full! :redface: Oh well


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Hayden said:


> Sounds good! Was? it's still chugging along, but still not full! :redface: Oh well


Teardown imminent, unfortunately.  Poor tank. I'll be sad to see it go. It's quite wonderful. Surprised it's not full yet though.


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## bitFUUL (May 14, 2010)

very nice setup, makes me want to crash mine!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

bitFUUL said:


> very nice setup, makes me want to crash mine!


Been there, done that. That's actually how that tank got to where it is today. It's had a rough and rocky ride but I learned a great deal from it.


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

I like it, when the rotala grows in some more it will look even nicer. :thumbsup:


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## Patson (Mar 4, 2013)

Wow the HC carpet :drool:


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## MrAlmostWrong (Jul 16, 2012)

Your persistence through all of this is truly inspiring. Great to see you are able to get to a place with this tank that makes you happy. Almost time for me to start my first lawn.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Green_Flash said:


> I like it, when the rotala grows in some more it will look even nicer. :thumbsup:


Indeed. I'm toying with iron dosing and the height of the rotala to control the amount of red I get out of it. It doesn't show well in the pictures, but it's an almost bronze color right now. It's quite nice.



Patson said:


> Wow the HC carpet :drool:


That carpet has given me more headaches than I care to say. I've finally learned how to trim it right, though. Trimming and good CO2 are things that HC definitely requires and they must be done right. 



MrAlmostWrong said:


> Your persistence through all of this is truly inspiring. Great to see you are able to get to a place with this tank that makes you happy. Almost time for me to start my first lawn.


Thank you! I'm so very glad that the tank has come to this stage as well. I almost considered tearing it down completely at one point due to frustration. Just goes to show that a little bit of hard work and perseverance can pay off very well. Make sure you get enough to start your first lawn when you do. Densely planting with carpet plants from the get-go is a great way to give yourself a head start and to avoid problems.


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## frrok (May 22, 2011)

practice makes perfect... sometimes its worth just getting rid of the distractions and judt focus on growing the plants better. I wish I can do that. but I always want something thats aesthetically pleasing to me. even if I get frustrated trying to get it right...


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## Jdiesels (Mar 20, 2013)

All of these scapes have made me a better human being, thank you...


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

frrok said:


> practice makes perfect... sometimes its worth just getting rid of the distractions and just focus on growing the plants better. I wish I can do that. but I always want something that's aesthetically pleasing to me. even if I get frustrated trying to get it right...


Aesthetics and healthy planted tanks go hand-in-hand. The rock was just an algae magnet and far too disproportionate for this poor tank in my case. You should have seen the crater that it made from removing it! Ridiculously huge. I had to add a good amount of powder type soil back to the tank to level it out. Good thing about the plant mass and well-established biofilter in that tank is that I didn't have to keep the fish and shrimp out while waiting for the ammonia to leach out of the soil. It handled itself. Only real issue was a little bit of GDA on the glass and that's easy peasy.

Just try to look at the long term in making a scape. If it doesn't look right in your mind then it it's probably not going to look right in the end result either. Also realize that a freshly planted tank is going to have some dings in it. I've been working with the HC/E. parvula carpet for months. I've been working with the E. acicularis for just as long. The rotala has been worked on in the past couple of month as well. All that's been done to it is about 15 stems or so at the initial planting and the rest was trimming and letting rogue stems grow horizontal to the substrate. This is a very quick and easy way to make rotala bushy or to propagate new plants.



Jdiesels said:


> All of these scapes have made me a better human being, thank you...


Thank you for the comment! I'm glad they have inspired you.


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## tetra10 (Aug 5, 2012)

whats the name of your main stem plant in the middle?


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

tetra10 said:


> whats the name of your main stem plant in the middle?


It's Rotala rotundifolia.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

A little bit of an update I suppose. I mowed the carpet down in a thread a little while ago detailing how to trim and what you should expect it to look like afterwards. You can see here that it's already grown back in and starting to thicken again. Also, I present...

Freph's Rotala Bush o' Doom. It'll be getting trimmed up here shortly.


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

looks great, very natural.


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

Nice thicket!


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

any updates?


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Great to see you've turned the corner, Freph!


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Couesfanatic said:


> any updates?


Just some algae on the glass. My CO2 ran out. Oops. 

HC, hairgrass and rotala as healthy as ever.


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## FlyingHellFish (Nov 5, 2011)

For the Rotala, when you trim the plant, do you replant the tops? I'm trying to get a ball-shape for my Rotala, but it just spits out new stems.


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