# Looking for some ideas / inspiration



## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Hi everyone,

I am turning to TPT for some inspiration / ideas for my next scape / layout. 

Little history (this will help explain what I am looking for). Started my 75g low tech, all easy growing stem plants, a dwarf sag carpet. a bit of random hardscape but no plan in mind. moved things around a lot and it did well. looked alright but nothing impressive.

slowly transitioned over my first year to more interesting plants, obviously these became more demanding and as such i up'd the ferts and lowered the lighting and added co2. this stage i was still trying to get the growth i wanted but wasn't planning my scape at all. still a chaotic mess.

finally got sick of trimming and such and went with a full crypt tank with moss carpet (my latest, till i torn it all down today). it was a success in terms of awesome plant growth imo, but the scape lacked in a lot of ways. I realized that i wanted more of an impressive hardscape while still keeping things low tech low maint. I want the water to be as high quality as possible for my fish as well. I am focusing more of fish and hardscape but with some plants in the mix.

Which is why I am seeking some advice now. I can't seem to find existing scapes that I like that resemble what I am looking for. I want it to look natural. I am going to be housing only 1 species of fish (most likely angels but I may change my mind. But it won't be small schooling fish but rather some medium or large ones.

I want to have lots of driftwood but that doesn't take away too much swimming space but can break up sight lines and such. Rock is key too, again nothing to overpowering. I don't know what kind of wood or rock is best but I would rather it not have to be attached to slate because I want to easily move it around if possible.

I don't want to have a deep layer of substrate, I want to be able to stay clean and anaerobic free. so I will be using a thin layer of PFS.

As for plants I want to stick with hardy low tech ferns and alike. anubias for sure. narrow leaf java fern or similar, and bolbitis. maybe a big amazon sword (maybe..). I have a small buce brownie blue that will be in there too. since I want this to look natural, I want to stick with only a few species of plants. ideally ferns because i won't have deep substrate.

Lighting will be my 48" finnex planted plus. I will raise it up as high as I need. I will be dosing very rarely and no excel or co2. I don't want lots of plants. I would prefer lots of hardscape and a bit of plants in the right spots to highly focal points.

Creating a sense of depth has always been a huge problem in all my attempts. I fail at it all the time. I would really like to achieve this in my new layout. 

I hope my rambling is making some sense and has painted a picture of what I am looking for. Any help / suggestions would be a huge help, I really want to do this right! Type of wood to use? rocks? layout advice? other potential plant choices? fish suggestions? pictures or links to similar ideas would be great too.

money is not an issue, the tank is a new rimless 75g and its a blank canvas right now.

I have been doing planted tanks for 2 years and I can grow nice lush plants but have never been able to achieve a great scape. I want to change that  

Thanks


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## klibs (May 1, 2014)

my scapes suck too lol. I suggest to keep looking at examples of tanks similar to what you want to achieve. Planning is key... Good hardscape is paramount for that kind of setup but you will also need to have an idea of what plants you want and where you want them which it seems you have a good handle on. I am personally terrible at doing all that so I kind of just 'wing it' and use plants to get the best results I can.

Good luck


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Well that's part of the problem. I can't find tanks that really capture what I want to do.

I guess the closest thing is a biotope.

As for plants I am pretty set with bolbitis, anubias nana and petitie, needle leaf fern. 

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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

philipraposo1982 said:


> Well that's part of the problem. I can't find tanks that really capture what I want to do.
> 
> I guess the closest thing is a biotope.
> 
> ...


For fauna could take a look at geophagus species they're lots of fun. There's a couple sub species that grow to the same length or a little bigger than angels, cupid cichlids are another great choice

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Wow stunning fish! Plant eater or no?

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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2016)

Ivanacara adoketa's!
think you could keep a nice group with 2males 3/4 females in your tank.. 
they'd leave angels alone as well, just make sure there's some holes for them to hide in, although they don't do so much. 

first thing that came to my mind with your description is a biotope as well actually. blackwater to be specific.. 
the roots would make it hard to make it look big unless you can find some really nice really small ones.. 

if the back of the tank is dark and with low light it's not to hard to create a sense of depth with one really big piece of driftwood sticking out of the darkness in the back. Saw a really nice display tank done like this last month had like 30 blackhead angels in there. looked impressive!


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

So I spent the night reading about geos and I am really digging these fish. I called around and I can get some geophagus tapajos aka orange or red heads.

I am still unsure how many I will get. Maybe 7? 

Gotta start sourcing materials for hardscape. I should be able to get the new geos on Saturday. Maybe a bit of hardscape before then too.

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Is there any rocks that someone can suggest that will work for a biotope type of thing but won't change / harden my water. Ideally I want to use a single type of rock. Has to look natural. Thinking of use some manzanita wood.

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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

philipraposo1982 said:


> Wow stunning fish! Plant eater or no?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900W8 using Tapatalk


Geophagus rummage through the sand but do not eat healthy plants, since you don't really intend on root feeders this won't be a problem =)

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philipraposo1982 said:


> So I spent the night reading about geos and I am really digging these fish. I called around and I can get some geophagus tapajos aka orange or red heads.
> 
> I am still unsure how many I will get. Maybe 7?
> 
> ...


Tapajos a really the way to go, I have 6 right now and love them, perfect little fish, and so so active. As for rocks I find simple river stone works for me in a biotope.

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Aren't river rocks a mix of different type of rocks (minerals)? Wouldn't those effect the ph and hardness?

What's size tank do you have the 6 in? Talking to a guy yesterday about his and he has 12 plus other fish in a 125 (4 foot tank).


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## WaterLife (Jul 1, 2015)

Remember Geos are Earth Eaters (they pick up mouthfulls of substrate and sift through it), so keep that in mind with your planting ideas as they can/will uproot any plants that aren't well rooted.

As too how many you can keep in a 75, it depends on the species, which would determine their temperament and how large they get.

*Some* large Geos can actually be housed with small 2" fish. But do your research on which species tend to work out best if you attempt that. If you succeed though it does look very cool to have little fish with much larger fish coexist peacefully. Chances of success are better if you can get the Geos when they are young and have them grow up with the other small fish. Keeping the fish well fed helps too 

You can keep a mixed species tank of Geos, but again do your homework to find out which are more likely to be compatible.
I saw on your other thread regarding sex ratio, I would say 1M/1F would be the most, but more females than males would be the more preferred ratio. Especially if you are doing all the same species Geo and breeding takes place, things can get hectic and so definitely more females would be preferred.

Try asking on MonsterFishKeepers forum or a Cichlid forum and you should get more experienced input.

Couple threads from a quick search
How many Geophagus in a 75? - Tropical Fish Forums at the Age of Aquariums
Geophagus Red Head Tapajos - 57662


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

I am getting tapajos. How many of those could I keep?

No plants will be in substrate (pfs), all will be ferns and anubias and bolbitis, attaching to driftwood and rocks. Maybe some buce too. I won't be keeping anything else with them just geos by themselves.

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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

philipraposo1982 said:


> I am getting tapajos. How many of those could I keep?
> 
> No plants will be in substrate (pfs), all will be ferns and anubias and bolbitis, attaching to driftwood and rocks. Maybe some buce too. I won't be keeping anything else with them just geos by themselves.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900W8 using Tapatalk


A good size group if you only include a dither that is local to them like lemon tetras, there are a few small pike cichlids in the Rio tapajos as well. I'd go with a group of 6-8 to start, they will breed if you give them good water, not saying you have to change it a lot just nice and stable 6.0-7.0 pH and some tanins if you don't mind them. They also like leaf litter while young. 

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

so i am buying either one of these driftwood boxes from a website i found.
http://fineaquatics.com/images/ap2 contents.jpg
http://fineaquatics.com/images/ap2 xl contents.jpg

i purchased my 7 geophagus tapajos today and acclimated them (drip). They are doing amazing! active, exploring the sand, no shy or scared. They are young (didn't want to spend $450 on bigger ones) only about 2-2.5 inches, but look very healthy.

I have no idea what rock i am going to use, hoping to get some suggestions. I am kinda going for a biotope-ish look but no darkwater and will use anubias, bolbitis, and needle leaf fern. Like i mention before I want a natural look.

I can't seem to find any good pictures of tanks that i like.. need to keep searching through pictures i guess.


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

here are some pics i found.











what kind of rocks could i use that a larger, roundish like in these pics? would they effect my water parameters?


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## Immortal1 (Feb 18, 2015)

Looks like you have found some VERY cool pics. FWIW, and this is just my opinion, the 3rd pic from the top is visually a KILLER! I could spend all nite looking at that.
The 6th pic looks cool but I think you would loose the appearance of your fish in the background.
The 7th pic has beautiful fish, but it just seems to be too many fish.
The 9th and 10 - Wow. Don't know how to do that look, but if I could I would.


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

I wondering what kind of rock is being used in these scapes. Are they safe for aquarium use? 

I want to go with more nuetral color rocks as I am using pool filter sand as substrate. So beige or off whites, tans, light grey rocks would be ideal.

It's really the last piece to my puzzle. I don't want it to raise my ph have metals. But I know very little about rocks.

Alot of people use river rock. But it seems river rock is all a mix mash of different stuff, so how is it safe?

I really like 3 too. I will be using all of these and taking some ideas front each to create my own scape


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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

philipraposo1982 said:


> I wondering what kind of rock is being used in these scapes. Are they safe for aquarium use?
> 
> I want to go with more nuetral color rocks as I am using pool filter sand as substrate. So beige or off whites, tans, light grey rocks would be ideal.
> 
> ...


Most of those are typical river rock easy to test for safety but if you change your water with r/o you shouldn't have issues, I have mine in sub 6 pH most of the time 90/10 ro to tap

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Any idea what kind of rocks these are? Vinegar doesn't seem to make the rock fizz.

There is clear shimmer parts to it. When wet you can see some dark in it too.

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Here is a pic of them today. After only a day of acclimation they are all eating and super chill. They are not scared of my hands in the tank or my right in front of them starring 

I bought 60lbs of rocks (granite roundish stones) in all sizes from the biggest (what you see in the pictures) to as small as .5 inch pebbles and everything in between.

I placed the largest ones in the tank to get a feel of how they look. 

I have a box of manzanita dw coming in. Untill then I will keep buying plants (anubias nana, needle leaf fern, and more bolbitis). The amazon sword and buce in the photo are being sold, just there temporally. The little twigs in there will probably go too as I don't want non manzanita in there 
























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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

Very nice juvies =)

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Thanks 

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## touch of sky (Nov 1, 2011)

I just started reading this thread today, and was going to suggest granite stones. I use them in my tanks, and pick them from the fields on my property. A homesteader in the 1800's built a stone fence with round stones, so I have thousands of them to choose from. Another thing I use in my tanks are dead apple tree branches. Once they are dry, the bark comes off easily and they last well in the tank and have nice shapes. I have many wild apple trees on my property, as well, so a good source of these.


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## pipelayer (Sep 24, 2013)

Tank looks pretty good so far and I'm sure will look even better with the extra wood and plants. 

Here is my 120 gal. biotope from a couple years ago as another reference. Not quite as nice as some of the pictures you posted but you get the idea.


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

so i picked up a big clump of narrow leaf and needle leaf java fern. paid more than i should of but oh well 

I also sorted through my bag of rocks and added some more to the tank. I would like some opinions as to which ones I should keep. also, how many of the larger ones vs smaller ones.

I wanted to see them in the tank for a few days to see color and shape and hope that i would find ones i like this way.

Placement of stuff is not how it will be, its just scattered for now for the purpose of visualizing. I also have a 5lb pail full of smaller rocks that I will add at the end once the wood and main rocks are in place as well as the plants.

I will be picking up a huge portion of bolbitis and a few anubias petite and nana on saturday morning. No idea on when I will get the wood though :-/

anyhow, any suggestions would be great! I am really hoping to visually creat a fair bit of depth in this layout upon completion. Also keep in mind I don't want to cover up too much sand as the fish are earth eaters and sift constantly. From the photos i feel like its way to much rock.

I am thinking of keeping maybe 3 of the big ones and 5-7 medium, then add small and tiny rocks at the end. suggestions? remember i will not have plant in the substrate but rather tucked in places and attached to wood.

here are the pictures:


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## Riceman (Nov 17, 2014)

"and went with a full crypt tank"

That's funny I ended up doing the same thing,I've had a forest of crypts now for about
4 years.Every 4 or 5 months I trim by reaching in grabbing a few handfulls and throwing them 
outside.:smile2:


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Hey riceman,

Decided to do something different with the hobby for a bit. Focusing more on the fish and hardscape. Obviously will still have some plants but only low tech ferns and very few species. I feel I will get enjoyment this way, and that's what it is all about 

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## Aquarium_Alex (Jul 28, 2014)

I like the tank how it is a lot!

If you were wondering about the 3rd pic from the top those are mexican beach pebbles. Go to your local landscaping supply store/rock distributor and they should have them. This is one of my favorite aquascapes that utilizes them:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/c3/22/f5/c322f52ecc5d314d8debc1d5c2bf9cc5.jpg

(by Annika Reinke)

I created a tank similar to the one above. 

As far as advice about arranging the rocks goes, I'd say try to make them in more "associated" piles. It's kind of hard to explain, but I find that if you have a bunch of smallish rocks dotting the tank like on the left side they stick out too much. Try moving all but one or two closer to the larger rocks, leaving only a few on their own, for contrast.

You definitely have to experiment a lot to get it right.


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

So my box of manzanita wood deal fell through 

But.. I found some nice piece of spider wood that I think will be really neat.

Here is some initial thoughts for layouts of the wood. I would love any feedback or help.













































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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

A few more ideas.












































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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

philipraposo1982 said:


> So my box of manzanita wood deal fell through
> 
> But.. I found some nice piece of spider wood that I think will be really neat.
> 
> ...


Second to last pic is gold, with river stones around the base and a little sand would be awesome!

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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2016)

agreed, like the second one all the way from the top as well. 
is it being planted? sorry I know i've read your whole thread at one point but can't remember.


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Not really planting in the substrate. The three species of plants are anubias nana, bolbitis, and needle leaf fern.

My thoughts are to have plants in-between rocks and tied or glued to wood.

Because this tank is dedicated to geophagus tapajos, aka eartheaters, they will sift the sand too much and uproot plants.

I also want the fish to be more of my focus and keep the tank low tech. I don't want to be tinkering so much, more viewing time and focus on quality water.

I want the plants to create darker areas and cover for my fish.

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

A few more, I am done for today 
















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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

philipraposo1982 said:


> A few more, I am done for today
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Second one =)

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

You seem to like the ones that have the wood all in one group with a curve to it 


For now I just have the wood in the tank with rocks all on it. Gotta get the wood water logged so it might take a bit before final scaping happens.

Dipped a bunch of loose plants in there for now too. Picking up the rest of the plants tomorrow morning.









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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Just stuffed the plants in for now. Once the wood sinks on its own I will be able to scape the tank. 

Bought another 7 geos. I got some bigger fish.

All the plants are here now, so just waiting for the wood to waterlog. Still don't know what layout I am going with though.

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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

https://youtu.be/1BfHqoWsREw

Quick video of the new tapajos

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## Julia Adkins (Aug 19, 2010)

One of the ways to have geophagus is to attach your plants to pieces of wood with zip ties, garden tape or ? so the plants are not in the substrate to be undermined and dug up.


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## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

Subscribed... great thread, and I really like the look you're going for. I was actually paging through the forum looking for inspiration for a possible rescape of my 38-gallon tank (which is a pain to scape since it's narrow but somewhat tall), because I want to create more open space than I have currently. I'm going to start looking for similar hardscape, i.e., small "boulders" and a few pieces of spiderwood. I have a bunch of bucephalandra, anubias, and java fern growing in my current setup that would look really good, and I'll probably keep my Rotala and Cryptocoryne spiralis in the corners/background).


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

So the wood is mostly waterlogged minus the one piece on the left (almost there).

I decided on a layout of wood that I liked, and tied on all the needle leaf fern. The anubias and bolbitis have been placed but not tied it. I may move some plants around as time goes on.

As for my rocks, I am having a hard time placing them within this scape. I am hoping for some advice. 

Thinking of using large rocks up front and smaller ones in the back. Still trying to create more depth in the tank.

Here is a picture
















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## Jeroen (Jan 12, 2016)

philipraposo1982 said:


> As for my rocks, I am having a hard time placing them within this scape. I am hoping for some advice.
> 
> Thinking of using large rocks up front and smaller ones in the back. Still trying to create more depth in the tank.


Looking sharp! Have a picture of the rocks in question? 

In general you would have to place small ones in the front and large ones in the back to create depth.


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

Here is my first attempt with some rocks. I will leave it for a few days before deciding what to change if anything.


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## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

This is a cool look. The white rocks are a unique touch. They do blend in with the substrate a bit much for my taste, but maybe that's the look you're going for. 

One idea would be to bunch the rocks a bit tighter against the wood, making it look more like the wood is wrapped around or through the rocks. This would increase the contrast and help them not blend into the substrate so much. I'd also use more rocks if you have them. On the other hand, if the wood is serving as caves/hiding spots for the fish, I get not wanting to remove that element by pushing the rocks up against the wood. At the least, I might try to move the rocks to more random placements -- especially on the right, they look a little like they've been placed in a circle.

Regardless, I love the open sand look, and those geos have to be very happy with that setup. I've had issues keeping my whitish sand looking clean and free of algae -- how does yours look so good? Low lighting? Cleaning?


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## philipraposo1982 (Mar 6, 2014)

end3r.P said:


> This is a cool look. The white rocks are a unique touch. They do blend in with the substrate a bit much for my taste, but maybe that's the look you're going for.
> 
> One idea would be to bunch the rocks a bit tighter against the wood, making it look more like the wood is wrapped around or through the rocks. This would increase the contrast and help them not blend into the substrate so much. I'd also use more rocks if you have them. On the other hand, if the wood is serving as caves/hiding spots for the fish, I get not wanting to remove that element by pushing the rocks up against the wood. At the least, I might try to move the rocks to more random placements -- especially on the right, they look a little like they've been placed in a circle.
> 
> Regardless, I love the open sand look, and those geos have to be very happy with that setup. I've had issues keeping my whitish sand looking clean and free of algae -- how does yours look so good? Low lighting? Cleaning?


I was trying to find rock that would blend in well with the sand, maybe a did a bit too good of a job 

Because of my tapajos I wanted to provide different cave type areas which is why I didn't want to pack it with too many rocks around the wood. Also, because they sift through the sand alot I didn't want too many rocks getting in the way of that.

I realize the right side is poorly done, I will be adjusting them, just giving my fish a break from me messing with their home. I agree with it looking too round, I will probably only use 3 rocks on that area. 

As far as keeping the sand clean I don't do anything special. I never vacuum the sand or anything. I make sure to feed my fish appropriately and I have lots of snails. So maybe that helps. Also do large weekly water changes and run the lighting low as I don't have any algae. Low lights and lots of plant mass has always been my key to success with my tank. 

The fish sifting the the sand is going to make a huge impact. As they get older and bigger I suspect it will only get cleaner and cleaner.

Thanks for the feedback too.


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