# Safe T Sorb = Algae?



## Fishly (Jan 8, 2010)

I've been having a horrible time with algae in my 5.5g and it's been getting worse since I switched to Safe T Sorb. I've been maintaining the tank (50% WC every week, daily excel, full EI added after water changes), but the algae has just kept growing. I also had issues with this algae with my previous substrate (black sand with root tabs), but it seems to have gotten worse.

Right after replacing substrate (~ July 7th):









August 9th (after fish removal and first H2O2 treatment):









































First I thought my dosing was off, so I remixed all my solutions (20ppm potassium nitrate, 2 ppm monopotassium phosphate, 1ppm CSM+B) and made sure I dosed after every water change. Then I thought my filter was going through a mini cycle and leaving ammonia in the water, so I moved all my fish to QT. The algae kept growing.

With the fish out of the picture, I diluted H2O2 and squirted it on the plants, then double dosed excel. Waited a few days, no improvement, so I squirted the H2O2 on undiluted. Even where there was very intense bubbling, the algae remained. 

In an act of desperation I did a four day blackout. Last night, when I took off the cover, I found this (Note: I trimmed the red ludwigia and DHG before the blackout):










































The algae had actually grown in the dark. I assumed that was impossible, but there you go.

I decided to tear down the tank. I started taking out plants and manually scrubbing algae off each leaf with a sponge (fun!). The weird thing was that several of my anubias petites were rotting. They looked normal when in the tank, but practically disintigrated when I tried to pull them out. Almost all of them had some rotten spots and grey roots. At first I thought they had the anubias rotting disease, but then I noticed my stauro also had atrophied roots and the buried stems were grey and rotting. Same with my crypts. I haven't finished taking out the stems, but several of them have failed to root. The only plants that weren't affected were the Rotala sp. 'Green', Ludwigia sp. 'Red', and my Parviflorus sword. In my 16" tank it managed to grow 18" pearly white roots.

Mind you, it has been only six weeks since I switched to STS. Everything was cleaned up before the switch - I trimmed roots and leaves and threw out anything that didn't look healthy. I gave the plants the best start I could. 

The only explanation I can come up with is the Safe-T-Sorb has been causing this. I'm thinking it could be a combination of several factors:
1. The STS is very fine. I sifted it through window screen to keep the smallest particles. It could be smothering the roots somehow. But that doesn't explain why some of the stems and sword were able to grow roots.

2: STS is known for drawing some nutrients out of the water. The lack of water flow in the deeper sections might have caused the STS to starve the plant roots. Maybe even somehow sucking nutrients out of the plants. That would explain why the rooted plants were having such a hard time compared to the stems. And possibly why the sword sent roots out so far - it was seeking out nutrients. Maybe it was healthier because it was absorbing nutrients from the rotting roots of the other plants.


If the substrate's the problem, I have a few options. But I need to act quickly since the plants are already weak from the four day blackout and the stress of being uprooted.

1. Use the same substrate, but double or triple the EI dosing and hope the plants can get some before the STS does.

2. Use the same substrate, but add root tabs, continue normal EI.

3. Switch to a coarser grade of STS and add extra EI and/or root tabs.

4. Switch to a completely different substrate (most likely pool filter sand) with root tabs.


The plants are currently sitting in a bucket of water. Before I change the substrate, can anyone think of anything else that might be causing this algae besides the STS?


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## thedood (May 30, 2015)

I dont think the substrate is the issue as many people have used sts with no problems. You have an imbalance and I suspect it is to much ferts vs co2 and light. Do you use co2? My suggestion is, assuming no co2, root tabs by the root feeders and cut the dosing altogether for now. What light do you have?

Bump: I might also add to start using glut or excel, again assuming no co2.


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## JJ09 (Sep 11, 2014)

I have STS in both my tanks, and not this problem. You say you sifted and kept the finer particles? My guess is they are breaking down quickly, and there's dust from it settling on everything- which could block light and degrade plant health = algae. When I put STS in the tank I sifted out the dust and small bits and kept only the bigger particles, about half the original volume. When pieces come out of the tank now (vacuum hose) they often are soft enough to crumble between my fingers.


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

First instinct says you have way too little water flow in the tank


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

My thought's are lighting might be too much for maybe 12 inches above the substrate in 5.5 gal tank with nearly three inches of substrate (speculating from photo)
We do not know how long the light period was,what light fixture is being used,or what the PAR is at the depth from the light to the substrate.
The Safe -T_Sorb does not provide nutrient's initially, unless you soak it in nutrient rich water, so plant's were relying on reported Full EI Dosing which is suggested for CO2 injection.Not as much needed otherwise.
Excel was added daily as directed? and this can provide a form of carbon for the plant's = good, but not as effective as injection (It is said) for the plant's must first take in the liquid Excel before they can process it into useable form of carbon as I understand/read.
Plant's were then hit with double excel dose for how many day's?
Then subjected to Peroxide once diluted,and then double dose.
Then blackout with filter media removed but good circulation? 
Has been quite a hard time for the plant's all the while being subjected to unstable ,newly established tank.(Or maybe bacteria that took a hit wit H2O2)
Good new's is..by now the Safety-sorb has accumulated a fair amount of nutrient's via the water column and full EI dosing .(soaked a lot up)
Is a small 5.5 gal tank and can simply remove the plant's and start again while maybe looking at the light first to see if maybe it is just too much too long?
I see nearly two inches of substrate above the black trim along the bottom of the tank, with another inch of depth behind the trim along the bottom.
Could be the light is stronger than you need at this actual depth and shading the light or raising it certainly will not hurt. 
Would continue with EXCEL and dose maybe one third of Estimative index rather than Full EI. 
Good circulation,leave filter alone for a while if the media was not removed during Peroxide treatment.
Keep light period to six hour's total for first couple month's.
change water weekly.
My two cent's from what was posted here.
Had no inclination to look and see if another thread regarding this post exist's.


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## Seattle_Aquarist (Jun 15, 2008)

Hi Fishly,

I can assure you that it is not the Safe-T-Sorb substrate that is causing the issues, most likely excessive fertilizer and light (photoperiod too long)

Here is a 10 gallon approximatly 8 weeks after being set up, no CO2 (but dose DIY Excel), EI fertilizers, 2X10 watt CFL 6500K lamps


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## houseofcards (Mar 21, 2009)

Fishly said:


> I also had issues with this algae with my previous substrate (black sand with root tabs), but it seems to have gotten worse...


OP states this in his first post, plus I don't believe there is co2 injection so yeah the lights would be even more suspect IMO.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Fishly said:


> full EI added after water changes
> ...
> so I remixed all my solutions (20ppm potassium nitrate, 2 ppm monopotassium phosphate, 1ppm CSM+B)


This a whopping amount, several times more than an EI dose..unless you are going for the full weekly totals in one whack.

Why so much, especially not running co2?


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## Fishly (Jan 8, 2010)

The light is a 16" Stingray. It's 1.5" above the waterline. The substrate is 2" deep on average. The distance from the light to the substrate is about 10". It's hard to find data on the 16" model, but it should be about 35 PAR at the substrate, increasing to 50 PAR at the halfway point. I noticed when I started the blackout that the photoperiod has been way too long - 10 hours. I'm reducing it to six or seven. 

Excel has been dosed daily, except during the four-day blackout. 

Since this tank was overstocked with guppies, I didn't dose nitrate. I dosed monopotassium phosphate, potassium sulphate, and a pinch of a mix of CSM+B and iron. I have an API test kit, but when I tested, I couldn't get any readings on ammonia, nitrite, or nitrate. I don't know if my test kit is broken or if I did the tests wrong. My ammonia test is definitely broken (bottle dropper is deformed). But it made me wonder if the tank wasn't getting enough macros, so I went full EI just to cover the bases.

I always add the ferts after water changes, usually once per week. I know I've done a few extra water changes, some larger than 50%, but I can't remember them all. But I always dose my ferts after a water change; it's part of my routine.

I've had a lot of problems maintaining flow in this tank. I tried to create a spraybar for my powerhead to make the flow more even, but it ended up reducing the flow so much as to be useless.

So, in hindsight, I don't think it was the STS. That's a relief; I like it. The most likely reasons for the algae bloom:
1: Too much light in the top half of the tank.
2: Too long photoperiod.
3: Lack of water flow.
4: Imbalanced ferts in the first month.
5: Lack of root ferts for root feeders.
6: Too much fiddling in too little time.

A rough timeline:

*First week of July:* Changed substrate from black sand with root tabs to rinsed fine STS.
*First week of August:* Tested ammonia, nitrite, nitrate - all zero. Remixed ferts.
*Second week of August:* Moved fish and filter to QT. Tried to make a spraybar for my powerhead (reduced flow instead of improving it). Squirted diluted H2O2 directly on plants, did 50% water change, added double dose of excel. Waited three days. Squirted undiluted H2O2 on plants, no excel or water change.
*Third week of August:* Moved powerhead to QT, left filter media in QT. Empty filter moved to tank. Blackout for 4 days.
*Yesterday (beginning of fourth week of August):* Ended blackout, began tank teardown.


*Plan of Attack:*
Remove as much algae as possible.
Add root tabs to substrate.
Reduce photoperiod to 6-7 hours.
Put tape over some of the LEDs to diffuse light.
Continue EI dosing once per week, do water change once per week.
Keep flow as high as possible.
Wait at least one week before putting fish back in tank.

Sound good to you guys?


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

You arent dosing EI. You are dosing roughly what EI calls for over the course of a week...all at once. This is a big part of your problem if I had to guess.

Full EI is meant for higher light tanks filed with demanding plantsrunning CO2. 

3x per week::

KNO3 - 7.5 ppm
KH2PO4 - 1.3 ppm
^ provides around 5 ppm K, more is optional

Csmb dosed at .5 ppm Fe

Also important to note that even Tom Barr says he has no idea where the .5 csmb 3x week came from. Which is what most calculators call for. 


You have a small tank with no CO2 and mostly non demanding plants. It doesnt need full EI, and certainly not dosed all at one time.

Your tank is middle of the road (at best) between "high tech" and "low tech". You should adjust your dosing accordingly.

I would do something like

4-5 ppm KNO3
.5 ppm KH2PO4
.1 csmb

2X per week. 

Macros after water change, micros the next day. Skip a day or two and repeat. Next water change start over again.

Or if you prefer to dose macros and micros on the same day that is OK, as long as they arent mixed in the same bottle. In this case you would dose once after a water change, and again 2-3 days later.

Those amounts arent carved in stone, just a ballpark suggestion, which imo should be more than enough to sustain your tank. Plenty in fact.


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## JJ09 (Sep 11, 2014)

Fishly said:


> *Plan of Attack:*
> Remove as much algae as possible.
> Add root tabs to substrate.
> Reduce photoperiod to 6-7 hours.
> ...


Yes- for the few things I feel I can speak on. I have the same LED on a 10gal tank- 10" from substrate and I had to cut the light w/plastic and tape over the LEDs, reduce the photoperiod to 6 hours and I only dose 1/3 EI, once a week. I don't use Excel so if you are using that, not sure if you can get away w/more light and more ferts. I finally got this one tank balanced and am not touching it. Changing things too quickly always got me into a mess w/my tanks. Then I never know what went wrong... 

Hope it improves for you.


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