# First Planted Tank. Step by step?



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Hey everyone:icon_roll
Well I'm looking to start my first planted tank! I have a 20g(I think its 20..) long tank. I haven't used it for years and I want to start a fish tank again. I decided to really put some effort(but not a lot money) into this and decided to make it planted. I did some researching all day but I haven't found any real solid step by step directions.

So far I learned..

I would need:
tank:icon_roll - 20g long
substrate - Eco-complete?
heater - was thinking a 50 watt Submersible Heater? (where in the tank do I put this?)
light - I don't have a cover for my tank. Is there a specific kind I should look for to fit a light for the plants? I hear I would need 3watts p/g
filter - ? No clue (suggestions?) 
Plants - ??still researching
DIY co2 - sugar + yeast = happy plants?
(BTW I would like to keep total price range around 150$, possible?)

This is what confuses me.....When I get everything I need, what steps should I take? Would 24 hrs of water/equipment running be enough to start planting? When do I put in the substrate? the co2? the light? Are there products I need to buy to put in the water? How long after planting can I put in fish? (BTW I really want a tiny needle nose gar, can I have that in this tank?)
Also I never found any information on how to plant the plants. If I want to cover some of the floor with moss, how would I go about putting it on the substrate? Etc Etc.

Thanks for reading. Answers and more info would be appreciated.:redface:


----------



## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Welcome to TPT!

www.aquariaplants.com is a good place that explains quite a bit of the questions you asked. Lots of resources there.

But here's also a few of my suggestions.

First of all, keep it simple and start off with a "low tech" tank. Low lighting (1.5 to 2 watts per gallon of either compact flourescent or T8 lighting), CO2 is optional. DIY CO2 can work out pretty well on a low light small tank like a 20gal, but you should be able to grow low light plants just fine without any extra CO2.

For a filter, I'd recommend either a canister (a Rena XP1 or an Eheim 2213 would be my personal choices) or an HOB (hang on back/power filter) if you want to go the more economical route. IMO AquaClear and Penguin are the HOBs I like best.

Heater - if you go with a canister filter, then go with an in-line Hydor heater. One less piece of equipment to have to try an hide inside the tank. If you get a heater, go with a submersible heater and figure out a way to hide it in your aquascape (behind rocks or driftwood tends to work well).

Eco Complete will work just great. Dump it in, fill up the tank halfway, pack the tank full of low-light plants, fill up the tank, and go.

There's a great sticky with a list of low-light plants you could try at the top of the Low Tech forum.

Moss is easy to tie onto rocks or driftwood to start with. From there, it can grow out to cover the entire floor of the tank if that's what you like. If you go this route, I'd recommend getting lots of shrimp since IME they're great at keeping moss clean and free of debris.

IDK of any species of gar that would be appropriate for a tank your size. (there may be, but IDK of one? Most species I'm familiar with get at least a foot in length...) There are some Killies that would work though, if you want a slender, colorful topwater fish. Or if you want a predator, there are some "pike" tetras that might work.


----------



## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

is there a how-to on a newbie set-up somewhere in here? if not, there should be. i was thinking it would have answered a lot of questions...(it would be a long article though..)

welcome! you found a great forum. many of these folks are very informed on how to get you going in the right direction. i haven't asked anything yet that someone didn't know about.

i have found that the more useful info you can get them the better. 

there are basically two types of planted tanks, high tech (meaning high levels of light, and pressurized co2) way more costly to start up. and low tech, (lower light levels, lower growth rates, and generally easier to take care of). it sound like low tech is right up your alley(cost wise).

if you have a 20 long, i would suggest a coralife 30" freshwater t5no strip light. great for low tech. a 100w heater. and a aquaclear filter. i have eco-complete in my tank and i think it's great. but there are many options out there. you can even make your own.

there is a great list of low light plants at top of the low tech page as well. good luck!

EDIT_ ohp's! she beat me to it! lol


----------



## Sarge (Sep 29, 2008)

Substrate: 
Expensive or cheap, up to you, I'm using top soil underneath playground sand, total cost together 6.00 (Lowes)

Heater:
I'm not using one at the moment, I have some huge rocks, the lights I'm using heat them well, and temps flux from 74 at night, to 78 at day. Other than that I have a Rena heater, it's a cheapo one, but it does the job, place it where it can evenly distribute heat to the water, above the substrate.

Lights:
This I've found are the most expensive, I had a shop light set up, but it wasn't doing as good a job as my new T5HO by Hagen, I use 3 T5 @ 24wpg (72 total), look around for an in-depth lighting article here this place is full of knowledge.

Filtration:
I've heard 3x over to 8x over, gph. I've seen filterless tanks, but they use powerheads to well circulate the water. I use the Eheim 2217 on my 20 gal. and it's been wonderful.

CO2:

I use 2 DIY bottles on my 20gT, ceramic diffusers. Saving up for the pressurized system.

Nutrients:

Seachem has a good line up (Flourish), dry ferts are available online as well. There are well put together articles on this around. NPK, CSM+B, Fe...

ehh I probably still have you in the same spot you're in... brb


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Thanks for all the help so far  Been trying at several different places, but this is the only real active and helpful place so far.

OK..
So I'd love to have one of those canister filters, but its too expensive for me right now. I'll grab a Aquaclear filter. I'll look at the list at plants to determine what I will start with. I guess my real problem would be getting a cover and light, I'll go look into that.

Also with the needle nose gar. I'm going to buy one starting at about 4inches and if it grows too fast and too big I'll just give it back to the shop. How many shrimp are appropriate? Also, I hear a lot about having an oto fish, I hate how they look, do I have to have some?

Ok, so far this is what I've thought w/ the help so far.
tank - 20g long (Have)
substrate - Eco-complete (20$)
heater - 100 watt Submersible Heater (10-20$)
light - ? 
filter - AquaClear (30$)
Plants - ?still researching
co2 - DIY

TYTY:thumbsup:


----------



## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

You'll definitely need a lid if you're getting a "needle nosed gar" (which I'm guessing is a halfbeak??) They'll eat anything small enough to fit in their mouths, and they've got big mouths. So that leaves shrimp and Otos out of the question, anyways. Actually, I think they do best in speceis tanks. A tight-fitting tank lid will be a must, since they're jumpers.


----------



## SearunSimpson (Jun 5, 2007)

If you google practicalfishkeepingmagazine or whatever, it should show you a link to the Practical Fish Keeping Magazine website. There are quite a few step-by-steps on there. That site, along with this site are my two favourite sites.


----------



## lovelandbmxrider (Dec 6, 2008)

this is a good cheap solution to your filter problem http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/group/23234/product.web 
its cheap effective and about right size for your tank im looking at getting one for my 10


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Thanks guys!
And thank you lovelandbmxrider, Looks like thats perfect for me! I'll most likely order it today 

tank - 20g long (Have)
substrate - Eco-complete (20$)
heater - 100 watt Submersible Heater (10-20$)
light - Maybe a Coralife F/W Aqualight double strip 30'' - (35$)
filter - Rapids canister filter - (30$)
Plants - Aquabotanic's Hard to Kill Package (What do you guys think?) + some other plants I may want to buy. (50+$)
co2 - DIY (10+$)

165$ :redface: No room for failure!!!!!!!!!! going to do more research.

Btw can someone list what I'm missing. Do I have to have test kits?


----------



## priv_sim (Dec 6, 2008)

If you are going for high-tech you will have to fertilize your plants. Because they will use nutrients much more and much faster and after a while they will stop growing, algae will attack.
So I suggest you to choose dosing method (EI, pmdd ...) and prepare.


----------



## Mori (Jul 23, 2003)

I think I'd want the test kit. I guess you don't have any fish on your last tally, so it's less important (I feel bad killing fish, less bad killing plants :icon_roll), but still...it's good to have. 

To save a few $$, you can get the strip tests. Everyone says they're garbage, and they really aren't great, but they do give you a general idea of what's going on in the tank. They're fairly cheap and definitely better than nothing.


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Hmm I think It will be a low tech tank. Do those still use fertilizers? So far I went and bought/ordered...

20LBS eco-complete - 25$ <-lfs 
Light/Heater/Net - 65$ online
Filter Canister - 38$ online

When those arrive I'll purchase the plants. 50$+
Already went over my estimated price :icon_cry:

Do I need something to make bubbles?

Thanks for the testing help :thumbsup: So.. what kind do I exactly need :icon_eek:


----------



## lovelandbmxrider (Dec 6, 2008)

you would still use ferts mine is low tech (for now)and i use them getting ready to make big dry purchase, you can spend around 20dollars you wont need it for the first few weeks atleast i didn't use them for the first three weeks 
(i might be crucified for saying this) but...... as far as a heater you can get it from walmart they work good enought

what light fixture ard you looking at?

no air pump just good circulation and co2


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

ok, guess I wont buy any ferts till I need it then. Do I need to put anything into the water when I first till up my tank?

as for light, i purchased a Coralife F/W T-5 Aqualight Double Strip Light-30"


----------



## Naja002 (Oct 12, 2005)

That Tom's Rapids canister is not going to be sufficient for your 20L. I doubt it will work well on LLBMXR's 10g.....


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Naja002 said:


> That Tom's Rapids canister is not going to be sufficient for your 20L. I doubt it will work well on LLBMXR's 10g.....


:icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: :icon_cry: 

I already ordered it..... Can you go into detail why it wont work?


----------



## Naja002 (Oct 12, 2005)

It's simply no where near powerful enough....It has a flow rate of 80gph--that's a maximum flow rate. After you put media in it--it's going to drop to 30-50gph. You may be able to get by with it and a small powerhead. Really depends somewhat on what type of scape you are going to try to do. But the TRC alone just isn't going to do it....:thumbsup:


----------



## mpodolan (Mar 27, 2007)

Where did you order it from? You can probably call them and cancel or change the order. I've done this when ordering from Big Al's before. They were very helpful and reasonable when I dealt with them


----------



## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

you are going to need more than 20lbs of eco complete. more like 40lbs. that will get you a better depth to work with. (unless you plan on mixing it with something else).


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

OK guys, I e-mail'd them to see If I could cancel the order. So should I just get a HOB aquaclear filter? Suggestions on what type I should get? Thinking of just going to a pet store and grabbing a hagen aquaclear filter. 10-30gallon would suffice?

I guess I'll go buy some more substrate later


----------



## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

Aquaclear 30 is what i'd get for a 20L.

edit - maybe the 50. it's only 6 bucks more and you could turn it down. the more the turn over the better.


----------



## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

oldpunk78 said:


> Aquaclear 30 is what i'd get for a 20L.
> 
> edit - maybe the 50. it's only 6 bucks more and you could turn it down. the more the turn over the better.


+1 :thumbsup:

I'd call them instead of relying on email. Guess you may need to wait till tomorrow morning at this hour though?


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Yea, I e-mailed their sales. I'll call them if it isn't canceled by tomorrow. I'll head to the store and get an aquaclear when I can.


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

okay, so today I'll have:
Tank (20long)
Substrate
Heater
Filter
Lights
(Maybe rocks from the lfs?)
(Getting plants/DIY Co2 next week)

Can I start filling my tank up now? Here's where I need some step to step directions. I'm thinking I need to put in the substrate, sub heater, and filter into the tank. Then to fill it with water. Do I need to buy anything to add into the water? Might order the plants today, but probably wont receive until next week because of the weekend. I don't have any test kits yet... do I really need them? If I do I would probably have to settle for those cheap strip ones. No ferts yet..still unclear about that whole thing.


----------



## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Yes, you want to use a good dechlor/water conditioner before adding water to the tank, to remove any chlorine/chloramine products that will kill livestock and also detoxify heavy metals.

My personal choice is Seachem's Prime.

By "sub heater" did you get a substrate heater? Is it too late to return it? Substrate heaters won't work to heat your tank, and it is very debatable whether it really does anything for the plants, too.

IMO spending $25 for a master freshwater test kit is a really good investment. I personally wouldn't waste money on the strips. If you can't afford a test kit you'll need to plan lots of trips to your LFS to make sure your water is safe before you start stocking the tank with fish/livestock. You can plant just as soon as all the equipment is set up.


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Alright, I'll drop by the LFS and see if they have any of those products. And by sub heater I meant submersible heater - sorry!

--
OK so I went to the lfs and they grabbed me a Ph/Nitrite/Ammonia kit. Do I need something for Nitrate?
Also got the seachem prime, 2 drops per gallon? so I need 40 drops for my 20long? Do I put this in after I fill the tank up? or do I mix it with a bucket of water or something and dump that in my tank? What about after I remove water to plant? Do I have to add it again?


----------



## Sarge (Sep 29, 2008)

they probably gave you the tetra test kit lol...

Look for the API test kit, it has everything (pH,KH,GH,NH3/NH4, NO2,NO3) for 5 dollars cheaper than the tetra kit. You can find this thru online means or at PetsMart.

Someones probably going to shoot me, but I just refill the tank, pull out the necessary mL of dechlorinator and pour it in the tank near the power head & outflow of my filter so it disperses quickly. I haven't noticed any negative affects on my fish yet.

Nobody has mentioned a Python have they? It's a siphoning tool, fill the tank and drain the tank with it, to hell with buckets.


----------



## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

You should definitely treat the water before adding it to the tank. I put the Prime in the bottom of the empty bucket and then fill the bucket; IME it's a good way to make sure it gets well mixed into the water. 

Yes, you need to treat new water each and every time before adding it into the tank. _*Tap water that has not been conditioned most of the time is toxic to livestock.*_

If you're using a Pyton or similar device, then after you remove the water, you're supposed to add enough Prime to the tank to treat the entire volume of water in the tank (not just the amount you're about to add back in) before adding in the new water.

Otherwise you're taking a big risk that your fish will end up exposed and possibly dying from the chlorine/chloramines before the water conditioner kicks in. Sarge, IMO you're playing "russian roulette" with your fish. There's no reason not to reverse your process and just add the water conditioner first instead of after adding in the new water.

It's going to be a few dollars more expensive in the long run buying the test kits one at a time but that's the only difference. I'd recommend that you add a nitrate and kH/gH test kit to your collection. You can go ahead and start cycling the tank without these, though.


----------



## joshh (Dec 9, 2008)

Hmm well the boxes do say "API", I guess they didn't grab the nitrate box? I'll go check later for that and the kH/gH.
Thanks for the help again


----------

