# Buce Mountains/Valley of Parva (Spec V)



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

I just set up a new Spec V, stock everything. My plan is to plaster the "mountains" with mini Buce varieties and cover the ground with Cryptocorne parva (with Salvinia minima floating). For now, it's pretty rough looking, since it's so sparsely (and recently) planted, but more Buce are on the way from Han Aquatics, who is having a killer pre-Black Friday sale on Buce (still looking for a good, inexpensive source for C. parva). It will house a betta of my wife's choosing.

Comments and suggestions welcome.

Specs:
Seachem Onyx Sand base, ADA Malaya Aqua Soil
Cobalt Aquatics 50W heater
Flourish Excel, 2mL 2x/day
Current USA Satellite Freshwater LED+

Updated plant list: 
HC
Bucephalandra
Alternanthera reineckii "mini"
Hygrophila 'araguaia'
Duckweed


----------



## jo.jacques (Dec 2, 2013)

Hey, great looking tank! Can't wait to see how the plants hold up with the Stock light of the Spec V. I have the same tank and I am considering switching the light for a Finnex since the stock light is so weak.

Keep us posted!


----------



## WaterLife (Jul 1, 2015)

You sure you want to do a parva valley/carpet?
They get taller than you might want, reaching further up the mountains. (especially in low light? -floaters-)

I'm no aquascaper, but I think the valley between the mountains could be implemented better somehow to make it more "dramatic" (eye catching, focal point)

Maybe like more sense of depth by tappering the valley, wider up front to a more narrower appearing valley at the back. Or angle the substrate, or different depths of substrate front to back down the valley? Like I said, I am no aquascaper so I am bad at explaining it and not sure myself on how to go about implementing it. Just a suggestions. Still looks nice. Although the right mountain, I like how it has a curved face toward the valley and I like how the substrate sort of reflects that curve with it curved/sloped appearance against that "mountain"


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

WaterLife said:


> You sure you want to do a parva valley/carpet?
> They get taller than you might want, reaching further up the mountains. (especially in low light? -floaters-)
> 
> I'm no aquascaper, but I think the valley between the mountains could be implemented better somehow to make it more "dramatic" (eye catching, focal point)
> ...


Thanks for the thoughts! You're right that the parva is taller than I'd like for scale purposes. I would love to do a lower/carpet-like plant for the valley, but I don't know that it's feasible with such low light and no CO2 (I could add Excel). I don't think I'll let the floaters stay over the valley, though -- they seem to stay on the left, and I'll scoop them out when they creep out over that.

As for changing the valley, I will give some thought to tapering it as you described... I'll need to find some smaller seiryu stone to work in for that purpose.

Bump:


jo.jacques said:


> Hey, great looking tank! Can't wait to see how the plants hold up with the Stock light of the Spec V. I have the same tank and I am considering switching the light for a Finnex since the stock light is so weak.
> 
> Keep us posted!


Will do. I think the Buce will be fine; a little worried about the parva, so we'll see.


----------



## leemacnyc (Dec 28, 2005)

love the hardscape!


----------



## bereninga (Mar 18, 2006)

I like the angles of the rocks on the left, but the ones on the right might need work. If it's covered completely w/ buces, that would look like a good focal point.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

bereninga said:


> I like the angles of the rocks on the left, but the ones on the right might need work. If it's covered completely w/ buces, that would look like a good focal point.


The angles of the left and right are closer to aligned in person (you can't tell from the picture that the left and right formations are both pointed forward at the same angle), but you're right, I think I'm going to tilt the main rock on the right a smidge to the left and forward by adding a little more substrate under it.

Bump: Any recommendations for a background color? Also, what kind of material does everyone use for backgrounds? My other tank has a spraypainted back, but I don't want to paint this one. Is there a non-glossy material that works well and sticks to the back?


----------



## WaterLife (Jul 1, 2015)

I am thinking a black background would work best. Or if you wanted a less "dark vibe" approach, maybe a white background like you see in those fancy aquascape photos, but not so sure it would look so great without the lighting effects (sun shine, blue sky, clouds) they use.

Well they do make a reversible black/blue background, purposely made for aquarium that is waterproof and can stick to the aquarium, but the ones I've seen are glossy. If you meant a DIY one, I am not sure what material to get and where. I am interested in hearing if there is a cheaper DIY alternative. Maybe you could still get a cheap "purpose made" aquarium background (are they plastic/vinyl?) and spray paint that instead? (not sure how well it would stick onto the tank painting though, taping it might leave air pockets)


As for the rocks leaning, I think what is meant is that it appears the majority of the rocks (rocks as a whole, not just the points/peaks) are leaning toward the back left corner, where as the rock on the right seems to be standing straight up-ish. Usually aquascapers like to have all the rocks leaning toward the same direction/corner.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

WaterLife said:


> As for the rocks leaning, I think what is meant is that it appears the majority of the rocks (rocks as a whole, not just the points/peaks) are leaning toward the back left corner, where as the rock on the right seems to be standing straight up-ish. Usually aquascapers like to have all the rocks leaning toward the same direction/corner.


Ah, I see what you mean. I kind of like the concave look that creates, though; I'll play with it a little, but I may stick with it and see how it looks as things start growing. Still going to work on the valley some though.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

Quick update: The Buces have been doing fine, so I added lots more mini Buces last night (thanks Han Aquatics). I may get one last batch once I see what does well and looks good after a few weeks. (Right now I really like the 'Super mini Brownie' variety.)

About half the C. parva has melted pretty thoroughly -- I'll give it a couple more weeks to see if it recovers. If not, I may upgrade to a Current Satellite Freshwater LED+ and switch to a smaller carpeting plant like Marsilea crenata. That should carpet alright at 30-40 PAR with Excel, right?

Given the crypt melt, no pics today. I'll check back in soon.


----------



## bereninga (Mar 18, 2006)

All of the crypts melted completely? I wouldn't switch the light just yet until they bounce back. I wanna see more buces eye candy. heheh


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

bereninga said:


> All of the crypts melted completely? I wouldn't switch the light just yet until they bounce back. I wanna see more buces eye candy. heheh


Not all -- I'd say about 2/3 of the 15 parva nodes melted, while 1/3 seem to be doing fine. I'm wondering whether it has something to do with the Osmocote+ caps I buried under them (I don't think I overdid them, but perhaps some are too close to too much). In any event, I plan to wait a couple weeks to see what they do before any light changes.

Buce eye candy coming soon -- just waiting a bit for them to acclimate post-shipping. They really are cool little plants!


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

The C. parva is not improving, and the nodes that hadn't melted are starting to flag. I'm going to save what I can and stick it in my other tank. Then I'm going to upgrade the lighting to the Current Satellite Freshwater LED+ and plant HC next week. Stay tuned.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

And the Excel-only HC experiment begins... I added a blue aquarium background (it's not as dark as I'd hoped but it'll do for now), swapped out half of the onyx sand for Malaya Aquasoil, and planted some tissue-cultured HC. I left a couple of areas open in the "mountains" where I might try a little bit of AR mini. I'm still deciding what, if anything, to do in the two back corners. Maybe more HC, or possibly Ludwigia sp. red "super mini". Worried about messing up the scale of the aquascape with stems that are too tall though, so I might just add more HC.



I'm going to start with 2 4-hour photoperiods (9:30 - 1:30 and 5:30 to 9:30) with 3mL Excel added each time. Haven't decided whether to add ferts to the water column -- is that necessary/helpful for the HC?


----------



## bereninga (Mar 18, 2006)

Did you bury the right rock more this time? It looks a lot better now. I think the blue doesn't look bad. I like the HC choice you went with.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

bereninga said:


> Did you bury the right rock more this time? It looks a lot better now. I think the blue doesn't look bad. I like the HC choice you went with.



Yep, the right rock got buried a little more as a side effect of adding the new substrate.

I might change the blue to black, but probably not... It's one of those sticky backgrounds, so I think I'd have my work cut out for me. 

Fingers crossed that the HC lives/grows.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

This one is still a work in progress. The HC is starting to spread, albeit slowly. I added some tissue-cultured AR mini on the mountains, which is also starting to take root. The betta is in -- his name is Sir Elliot Puff. He started out pretty much pure white, but now has a good bit of blue-green coloring. We also have three nerite snails, which are big fans of uprooting HC (but my wife likes them, so...). 

Latest photos:


----------



## bereninga (Mar 18, 2006)

Those buces are looking real nice! Once this tank matures and fills out, it's going to look even better. Nice work!


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

Getting there... 

These nerite snails are a pain -- they keep knocking off a handful of the Buces. 

The HC has really kicked into gear the last month. I'm hoping the front corners will grow in in another month or two. 

Still deciding what to do in the back corners... anything tall enough to see over the rocks may throw off the scale, but I hate to leave them bare. Ideas welcome.


----------



## gmdiaz (Feb 3, 2016)

I really enjoy seeing Spec V builds!!

Wow, love your hardscape! Will be watching your progress!


----------



## jrh (Sep 9, 2007)

Wow, this is beautiful.


----------



## overgrown (Dec 30, 2015)

Beautiful Spec V! I love the buce over the hardscape.


----------



## agfish12 (Dec 2, 2015)

What kind of rock it that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

agfish12 said:


> What kind of rock it that?


Seiryu stone from mrbluepanda (I think) on this site.


----------



## agfish12 (Dec 2, 2015)

end3r.P said:


> Seiryu stone from mrbluepanda (I think) on this site.



Looks awesome. I have this tank as well and was hesitant to keep the stock light on it. Do you have the heater located in same compartment as the return pump?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

*Buce Mountains*



agfish12 said:


> Looks awesome. I have this tank as well and was hesitant to keep the stock light on it. Do you have the heater located in same compartment as the return pump?


Yes, the heater is in the return pump space. It's a 25W, and it can't quite keep the temp at 80 (for the betta) even with a couple holes poked in the return line, so I'm swapping it out for a 50W to see if it helps.

I swapped out the stock light after the crypt parva died under it. The Current Satellite LED+ is working great. Dealing with a little bit of hair algae at the moment, but it's growing HC without pressurized CO2 (Excel only), which is pretty awesome. I do 2 four-hour photoperiods.

Bump:


overgrown said:


> Beautiful Spec V! I love the buce over the hardscape.


Thanks! I got them from Han Aquatics during a big sale -- all mini varieties. I wish the nerites would stop knocking them down. Most are attached strongly enough now, but there are about 3 that I have to re-glue on a weekly basis.


----------



## agfish12 (Dec 2, 2015)

Awesome. I have a nano reef tank so I'm still hesitant to dive too deep into a nano planted tank. I'm gonna follow this thread closely since you are doing basically what I had in mind for it. Let you work out the kinks hehe 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Julie7778 (Apr 21, 2015)

Are you just using the stock light and Exel to grow the HC? Sorry if I missed something! Looks great though, beautiful betta as well!


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

Julie7778 said:


> Are you just using the stock light and Exel to grow the HC? Sorry if I missed something! Looks great though, beautiful betta as well!



Current USA Satellite LED+ and Excel.


----------



## Aslmx (Jan 28, 2016)

How many lbs of rock is that? I have a spec v I'm going to build but I can't judge how much rock I need. Yours is perfect to me. Great balance


----------



## csong30 (Jan 24, 2016)

This is really awesome! I'm trying to grow some s repens with just excel. Do you dose 3ml everyday? Would that be enough for my 10g tank?


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

csong30 said:


> This is really awesome! I'm trying to grow some s repens with just excel. Do you dose 3ml everyday? Would that be enough for my 10g tank?


I dose about 2-3 mL twice a day, usually a little before my lights turn on each time (2 4-hour photoperiods). Your results may vary with S. repens, but assuming you don't have any Excel-sensitive species, a capful a day (5mL) is probably fine (maybe even overkill... I use a lot for my HC knowing that it doesn't compete well for carbon).

Bump:


Aslmx said:


> How many lbs of rock is that? I have a spec v I'm going to build but I can't judge how much rock I need. Yours is perfect to me. Great balance


Not much... I don't recall the exact amount, but I believe it was in the range of 14 pounds or so. You can't tell, but both of the large visible rocks are actually sitting on uglier rocks from the lot I bought so they sit higher in the tank.


----------



## csong30 (Jan 24, 2016)

end3r.P said:


> I dose about 2-3 mL twice a day, usually a little before my lights turn on each time (2 4-hour photoperiods). Your results may vary with S. repens, but assuming you don't have any Excel-sensitive species, a capful a day (5mL) is probably fine (maybe even overkill... I use a lot for my HC knowing that it doesn't compete well for carbon).


Well I don't think I have high lighting. Probably more low to medium. I have a beamswork 0.5w led 10000k spectrum at 1500 lumen. I do 2 5 hour photoperiods a day. 

My stock is Oto affinis Honey gourami pygmy cory and emerald rasboras. Would that be overkill for the fish? I just don't want my stock to die, but I do want my bladder snails to die. They are annoying keep coming back no matter how much I remove them.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

csong30 said:


> Well I don't think I have high lighting. Probably more low to medium. I have a beamswork 0.5w led 10000k spectrum at 1500 lumen. I do 2 5 hour photoperiods a day.
> 
> 
> 
> My stock is Oto affinis Honey gourami pygmy cory and emerald rasboras. Would that be overkill for the fish? I just don't want my stock to die, but I do want my bladder snails to die. They are annoying keep coming back no matter how much I remove them.



Excel shouldn't affect your fish or snails.


----------



## csong30 (Jan 24, 2016)

end3r.P said:


> Excel shouldn't affect your fish or snails.


Okay thanks, I just have pest snails that I'm trying to get rid of. They came out of nowhere again after killed them all. 

Anyways, I'll start dosing a little more daily and see how my plants do during the week. Thanks.


----------



## anfield (Dec 1, 2013)

How is the HC doing with excel? Nice tank, will be interesting to see once the buces have filled in


----------



## manfjourde (Feb 2, 2016)

Any updates on the HC growth or updates in general?


----------



## Mewski (Mar 6, 2016)

I really love your tank! So great to see how it's coming along. I'm also considering the same light, specifically because I want to grow bluish, purplish and reddish Buces and stuff like this. Very exciting that the HC is taking off as well, it's really filling out your valley.

Question, when you have to reglue to the rocks, does the glue kind of pile up or can you pick it off? Is it super glue?

Looking forward to more progress updates!


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

manfjourde said:


> Any updates on the HC growth or updates in general?


The HC is still looking great -- the corners are almost filled in. I added tissue-cultured Hygrophila 'araguaia' to the back corners, and it's looking pretty cool. I will update with photos soon, after I do my weekly water change and cleaning.

Bump:


Mewski said:


> I really love your tank! So great to see how it's coming along. I'm also considering the same light, specifically because I want to grow bluish, purplish and reddish Buces and stuff like this. Very exciting that the HC is taking off as well, it's really filling out your valley.
> 
> Question, when you have to reglue to the rocks, does the glue kind of pile up or can you pick it off? Is it super glue?
> 
> Looking forward to more progress updates!


The light seems to be a great choice for this setup. There is a little hair algae I have to pick out of the tank every so often, but there's no algae on the glass (though the nerites help with that), and everything is growing well. I definitely get that purplish growth from the Buces.

I pick off the excess super glue when plants come off -- it usually sticks to the plants, not the rocks. I expect you'd have less issues if you went ahead and glued the plants to the hardscape before flooding the tank (or before putting them in the tank). I did all of mine when the tank was flooded, and it's harder to get it to stick permanently. Most by this point are stable and sticking on their own, though.

Bump:


anfield said:


> How is the HC doing with excel? Nice tank, will be interesting to see once the buces have filled in


The HC is doing awesome. Frankly, given all I'd read about HC being particularly difficult without pressurized CO2, I'm surprised with how well it's doing. (Though Tom Barr said it'd be fine.) Pics soon.


----------



## ArchimedesTheDog (Apr 9, 2012)

Jiminy crickets, what a great tank.


----------



## Seetide (Feb 25, 2016)

Tank is looking great, nice job!


----------



## TaylorTurner (Mar 15, 2016)

This is a really nice looking tank! Thank you for sharing.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

All is well with this tank. I added some tissue-cultured Hygrophila 'araguaia' in the back. The HC carpet is pretty much complete, except for the front left corner. In thinking there's just not enough light there with the big rock over it, so I might plant something small there, or even just get a few mini moss balls for that corner. 

The latest photos:


----------



## sevendust111 (Jul 15, 2014)

Wait.....your dosing about 5ml of Excel a day in a 5 gallon tank? Wow thats a lot. Can't knock it though, that is the best looking non c02 hc I have ever seen.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

sevendust111 said:


> Wait.....your dosing about 5ml of Excel a day in a 5 gallon tank? Wow thats a lot. Can't knock it though, that is the best looking non c02 hc I have ever seen.




Yes. It's probably overkill, but everything seems happy, and there's very little algae (though the nerites may have something to do with that). I could probably dial it back a smidge, but an extra 2-3mls per day doesn't change my expenses much, and I hate to mess up a good thing.



Also, I have two photoperiods spread sort of far apart: 9:30am to 1:30pm, and 5:30pm to 9:30pm. Since I do the first Excel dose early morning (7 or so), it may well dissipate before the end of the second photoperiod (IIRC, Seachem has said it has about a 12-hour lifespan). Two 2.5ml doses at 7am and around 6pm ensures that it's always available when the lights are on.

Edit: I'm wrong about the 12-hour window. Seachem's website says 24. So, yeah, I may go to 1x/day and see whether I notice any difference.


----------



## ArchimedesTheDog (Apr 9, 2012)

end3r.P said:


> Yes. It's probably overkill, but everything seems happy, and there's very little algae (though the nerites may have something to do with that). I could probably dial it back a smidge, but an extra 2-3mls per day doesn't change my expenses much, and I hate to mess up a good thing.
> 
> Also, I have two photoperiods spread sort of far apart: 9:30am to 1:30pm, and 5:30pm to 9:30pm. Since I do the first Excel dose early morning (7 or so), it may well dissipate before the end of the second photoperiod (IIRC, Seachem has said it has about a 12-hour lifespan). Two 2.5ml doses at 7am and around 6pm ensures that it's always available when the lights are on.


Wow, I've always understood that it's bad for the fish to overdose Excel! I'm too much of a nervous nelly to go all out like that, but I divide my photo period also... Hrm. Ever done that with shrimp?


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

ArchimedesTheDog said:


> Wow, I've always understood that it's bad for the fish to overdose Excel! I'm too much of a nervous nelly to go all out like that, but I divide my photo period also... Hrm. Ever done that with shrimp?



No problems here... I wouldn't dump it on top of a fish or anything, but it's supposed to be safe for fish. And Seachem suggests a "loading" dose that's about the same dose as I use each time, so I think it's fine. I'm sure others will chime in if they've confirmed or suspected any issues with fish/shrimp and Excel.

I also use a good bit of Excel in a tank of mine that has Amano shrimp. They seem fine too.


----------



## sevendust111 (Jul 15, 2014)

Do you only have the betta and inverts in the tank?

I think your success with hc and your approach to excel is worth a thread unto itself. You are getting one of the hardest aquariums plants to grow well and carpet in a non c02 tank. I see some pearling in the tank. And your doing with little algae. This photoperiod/excel setup is worth further investigation and experimentation imo. Maybe one of the gurus could set something up. I would love to have an hc carpet without c02.


----------



## end3r.P (Aug 31, 2015)

sevendust111 said:


> Do you only have the betta and inverts in the tank?
> 
> I think your success with hc and your approach to excel is worth a thread unto itself. You are getting one of the hardest aquariums plants to grow well and carpet in a non c02 tank. I see some pearling in the tank. And your doing with little algae. This photoperiod/excel setup is worth further investigation and experimentation imo. Maybe one of the gurus could set something up. I would love to have an hc carpet without c02.


Yes, just the betta and three nerite snails.

To be fair, that photo was taken after a water change, so I'm pretty sure it's not pearling. But thanks for the kind words; I've been pleasantly surprised myself. A couple of thoughts on what worked: 

First, part of it, I think, is that people always hear that HC is hard, so they don't try it in low-tech setups. But Tom Barr has said for some time (I think) that the main issue with HC is that it doesn't compete well for carbon. So in this tank, I started off with only HC, Bucephalandra, and floaters (I don't think the floaters compete with HC at all (they get plenty of CO2 from the air), and the Buces are very slow-growing, so they probably aren't taking all the carbon either), and dosed Excel generously. I eventually added AR mini and Hygrophila 'araguaia', but only after the HC seemed to be established and spreading. I'm not certain this gradual planting was a big factor, but it fits with Tom's theory.

Second, this took some patience. The tissue-cultured HC died off some at first, and then began to look better and eventually spread over a few months' time. It may be that folks who try HC without CO2 just don't wait long enough to see results.

Third, my substrate is a base of Seachem Onyx Sand "capped" with ADA Aquasoil Malaya Powder. The powder is a nice substrate; easier for HC to root in, and lots of nutrients. (No idea if the Onyx Sand adds anything to the mix; it was just was I used before I decided to try HC, and it helps elevate the hardscape without using 2x as much Aquasoil.)

Finally, it's highly unlikely this would have worked without any added carbon source. Folks going truly low-tech are going to have trouble getting HC to do anything... At least dosing Excel/metricide is a must.


----------

