# Do i have enough light to grow my plants?



## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

I tried asking this in the light section but no'one bothered to reply.. I would really like to know if i got enough light in my tank. I did tons of research but there seems to be no real answer.. I got a juwel trigon 190 with 3 10000k led sera x-change tubes

Plants have been installed today, just adding some moss to the wood when these plants have settled in(if they do)

I alqo have a diy co2 system running


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

I can tell you those lights are too 'blue' for planted tanks, generally speaking. 6500K is usually the go-to light temperature. Also, you really didn't tell us much about the lights themselves. Wattage and links would help. Supply this information and you'll get some better help:

1. Tank height and other dimensions
2. Light information (wattage, length, etc)
3. Plant list
4. BPS on DIY CO2

Unless there is documented information on your lights in term of PAR, it will be a rough guess. Even with par information, a bow front tank is tough to evenly light.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

The statistics of each bulb is are the following:
length: 520 mm
Lumen: 649 lm
volts: 20 V
watts: 12 W
(intensity is on 10k for all 3 bulbs)
link of tubes:
https://www.sera.de/en/products/category/led-x-change-tubes-5957.html

https://www.sera.de/en/products/in_...ubes-5957/product/sera-led-cool-daylight.html

tank sizes : http://www.juwel-aquarium.de/out/pictures/generated/srcms/1/618_342_80/16300.jpg

i kinda wanna be able to grow pretty much whatever plant i want in it ... now i got:
-micranthemum micranthemoides
-microsorium pteropus trident
-alternanthera reineckii

The BPS on my DIY system, i don't have a regulator so its rather irregular... and i use slightly larger tubing so the bubbles are larger aswel then normal airline, so its hard to say...


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## Raymond S. (Dec 29, 2012)

Yea...what he said...LOL...
According to the site you have two bulbs on there if they are the ones which came/w it ?
So you added one ?
The blue spectrum is used by plants, but the red is the one used for growing.
Those 10,000K LED replacement bulbs are usually considered for marine application.
Doesn't hurt to use one for the brightness of it as that blue spectrum is used as well
but you would want the 6500K to be the primary type because the 10,000K has very
little in it if any. I would consider using one(only) of the Zoo Med "Flora sun" in the T5HO in there.
Aquarium Lighting HO T5 Fluorescent Bulbs: Zoo Med Flora Sun Maximum Plant Growth T5 HO Lamps
Two tubes would possibly be less light than your tank might handle(if it were regular T5HO bulbs) but three may be over the top for only DIY CO2.
So I'd watch it for signs of algae and use lower hrs in the beginning of the plants getting started. 8 hrs tops.
Have pity...hard to answer if you don't know much about a particular type of light.
Light section questions will get ample answers on known lights in known tank types.
So my reply is semi-educated guessing mixed/w generally accepted facts about those
parts of this which are known factors like how far the light is from the sub.
So my admitted guessing says your over rather than under, but in a not so good of spectrum. Tweeking it spectrum wise and watching for any algae will likely make it 
work for you. If you can't locate a 6500K led replacement for one of the 10,000K led's
then my personal choice for the third bulb would be an Aquatic life Natural 6000K T5HO.
Just looked at your light bulb. The second one on that list would be better for two of the bulbs.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

It is really difficult to give you an answer, at least for me. I would start with some 5000-6500K bulbs. I had good growth with 5000K bulbs in the past. After that, just start experimenting with your window of light. It will grow some things for sure. But some plants require much more stable CO2 than a DIY kit will put out. The DIY CO2 also makes it harder to balance light.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

Thanks for all the replies, the plants are currently pearling like crazy, so i guess the ones u got are okay with ot for now? I will save up for a new bulb and a propper co2 system


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## DeeFromBrooklyn (Jun 18, 2012)

You'll have to plan your plant choices and placement based on how strong your fixture is. Of course you'll have dead spots due to the tank shape and choice of decoration. My tank has an open top so i get better light penetration

Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk


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## goatnad (Aug 13, 2015)

I recommend checking out a 20w or 30w outdoor led floodlight. I use one for my 55g corner bow front and I have no dead spots. Almost the same dimensions as yours. Very well lit and growing plants well. Also only cost me $25.


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## essabee (Oct 7, 2006)

azazan said:


> The statistics of each bulb is are the following:
> length: 520 mm
> Lumen: 649 lm
> volts: 20 V
> ...


Don't let them discourage you. You can have a great tank with DIY CO2 and your light set-up. Just a little tweaking here and there. 

The overall K of your lights is at present 10,000 - to get this down all you need to do is change one of them for the "sera LED X-Change Tube plantcolor sunrise " with matching watts & volts. This will strengthen the weak red-end spectrum of the lights you have. I have experimented with mix of bulbs having different K colours and posted about it in this forum. If you are interest I can give you the reference to browse.

You are using DIY CO2 - continue to do so as long as you feel convenient with it. They will tell you that the CO2 supplied by it is inconsistent but will not tell you how to make it consistent and comparable with pressurised systems. Use a 3 bottle system instead of a single bottle. I you are at present using a 1.5 liter bottle use 3X 0.500 liter bottles. Refresh one bottle each week by turn. You could upgrade that DIY system to store the night production of CO2 also. I have done that too and posted here - in fact my DIY system was at one period of time keeping 4 tanks (with cumulative 1700 liters of water) above 20 ppm CO2.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

essabee said:


> Don't let them discourage you. You can have a great tank with DIY CO2 and your light set-up. Just a little tweaking here and there.
> 
> The overall K of your lights is at present 10,000 - to get this down all you need to do is change one of them for the "sera LED X-Change Tube plantcolor sunrise " with matching watts & volts. This will strengthen the weak red-end spectrum of the lights you have. I have experimented with mix of bulbs having different K colours and posted about it in this forum. If you are interest I can give you the reference to browse.
> 
> You are using DIY CO2 - continue to do so as long as you feel convenient with it. They will tell you that the CO2 supplied by it is inconsistent but will not tell you how to make it consistent and comparable with pressurised systems. Use a 3 bottle system instead of a single bottle. I you are at present using a 1.5 liter bottle use 3X 0.500 liter bottles. Refresh one bottle each week by turn. You could upgrade that DIY system to store the night production of CO2 also. I have done that too and posted here - in fact my DIY system was at one period of time keeping 4 tanks (with cumulative 1700 liters of water) above 20 ppm CO2.


thank you! I would love to see both your article on the lights and on the DIY system please!


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## keymastr (May 25, 2015)

Just for reference I run 2 2 liter bottles on a 20 gallon changing one bottle each week. I would run 4 bottles on a larger tank changing 2 per week.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

my DIY is a single 5 liter bottle. I will get more bottles but its all on my aquarium hood atm(because i havent found a decent check valve)

as far as my lights go, the system allows me to just add as many lights as i want and i guess i can fit a few more under that good, so i'll just customize the hood a bit more and add another 6.5k light(or 3) ..

Gotta figure out how to propperly stop the CO2 from entering my system at night now.. quite unsure of that..


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## essabee (Oct 7, 2006)

*1*


> my DIY is a single 5 liter bottle. I will get more bottles but its all on my aquarium hood atm(because i havent found a decent check valve


You could keep your DIY under the aquarium and still not need a check valve - all you need is to keep the drop-checker on the aquarium hood, and this will stop any tank water from going down to the DIY unit under the tank. You will need 3 bottles of either 2L or 1.5L capacity.

*2*


> as far as my lights go, the system allows me to just add as many lights as i want and i guess i can fit a few more under that good, so i'll just customize the hood a bit more and add another 6.5k light(or 3)


10000K is a lopsided spectrum for plant growth - the red to yellow part is very faint - green to violet very strong. The sunrise fixture is 2450 K is another lopsided spectrum which virtually just the reverse of the 10000K - In equal strength the (1 X 10000 + 1 X 2450) the effective K would be in the range of 6000K - 7000K depending upon the exact colour bars of the spectrums.

*3*


> Gotta figure out how to propperly stop the CO2 from entering my system at night now.. quite unsure of that..


You need a air-pillow, a T-joint, and a tap - to devise a storage for the CO2 generated at night. You will also need a pin-valve for regulating the flow-rate of the CO2.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

essabee said:


> *1*
> You could keep your DIY under the aquarium and still not need a check valve - all you need is to keep the drop-checker on the aquarium hood, and this will stop any tank water from going down to the DIY unit under the tank. You will need 3 bottles of either 2L or 1.5L capacity.


Why are 3 smaller bottles better then one big bottle?



> *1*
> 10000K is a lopsided spectrum for plant growth - the red to yellow part is very faint - green to violet very strong. The sunrise fixture is 2450 K is another lopsided spectrum which virtually just the reverse of the 10000K - In equal strength the (1 X 10000 + 1 X 2450) the effective K would be in the range of 6000K - 7000K depending upon the exact colour bars of the spectrums.



So basically i should get the 2.450 Kelvin sera LED X-Change Tube plantcolor sunrise and that would be beneficial over the of the 6-8k ones in combination with my current 10k ones?


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

azazan said:


> my DIY is a single 5 liter bottle. I will get more bottles but its all on my aquarium hood atm(because i havent found a decent check valve)
> 
> as far as my lights go, the system allows me to just add as many lights as i want and i guess i can fit a few more under that good, so i'll just customize the hood a bit more and add another 6.5k light(or 3) ..
> 
> Gotta figure out how to propperly stop the CO2 from entering my system at night now.. quite unsure of that..


10,000K will grow plants just fine, it just doesnt bring out the best color in planted tanks to the naked eye. But that's not to say 6500K doesnt grow things a little better.

Check out the DIY link in my sig for some of the co2 issues you are having. 



azazan said:


> Why are 3 smaller bottles better then one big bottle?


Because it's difficult to maintain a consistent rate of production using only one bottle. Having multiple bottles on staggered start change times makes it much easier. 

The hardest thing about DIY is staying consistent. Up and down levels from one day to the next will cause algae issues every time.

You definitely need to incorporate a gas separator/bubble counter bottle so you can keep a close eye on the bubble rates.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

burr740 said:


> 10,000K will grow plants just fine, it just doesnt bring out the best color in planted tanks to the naked eye. But that's not to say 6500K doesnt grow things a little better.
> 
> Check out the DIY link in my sig for some of the co2 issues you are having.
> 
> ...


Will check it out, thank you!


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## essabee (Oct 7, 2006)

burr740 said:


> Check out the DIY link in my sig for some of the co2 issues you are having.


Hi Burr
Check this out and mark the dates. It was always there to do for those who dared. http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/20-diy/53172-co2-madhatters-diy.html


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

essabee said:


> Hi Burr
> Check this out and mark the dates. It was always there to do for those who dared. http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/20-diy/53172-co2-madhatters-diy.html


Bravo sir. That brick solution is pretty amazing. I think Wasser mentions that set-up in my thread but Ive never seen it before.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

Quick update. Havent been able to go to the store yet to upgrade co2 or lighting, but my plants have grown quite a bit in a few days, especially the carpet plants, i hope they'll cover the ground my the end of the month... The red plants cant really keep up though and i am afraid they will be suffocated by the carpet...


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## essabee (Oct 7, 2006)

Trim the tops of the baby tears and plant them for spreading the carpet. Keep them trimmed for more thick bushy effect.

Try adding a few easy stem plants behind the rocks - some how looks empty.

The red temple (alternanthera reineckii) would need some extra iron in the soil. Do find some iron root tablets for it.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

Thank you! The empty look is probably because of the reflection, makes the tank look deeper then it is.. There is almost no room behond the rocks, No gravel available at all. 

I will try some iron, inadded quite a bit liquid iron on the startup less then a week ago Though.

Replanting the baby tears, doesnt it matter they dont have roots yet?


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## essabee (Oct 7, 2006)

Roots are not needed - they mostly anchor the plant.

If you slip the stem behind the rock and pour a spoonful of sand - you can have a stem plant there. Choose a tall stem plant with a different leaf style.


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## azazan (Aug 17, 2014)

Any suggestions for what kind of stem plant?


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## essabee (Oct 7, 2006)

Cabomba caroliniana, Ludwigia ovalis, Proserpinaca palustris to start with. They all have types of leaves dissimilar to the plants you already have and each of them will grow tall enough to remove that emptiness.


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