# Help me combat major hair algae problem



## joejvj (Jul 17, 2020)

I'm running out of things to try to reduce a bad hair algae bloom in my aquarium.

The tank is a 12 gallon long AquaMaxx rimless aquarium. It has been setup for 6 months. Substrate is Carib Sea ECO complete. Filter is an Eheim Classic 250. I have a CO2 tank and controller which keeps the pH at 6.5 and the CO2 level at 27 mg/l day and night. The lighting is a Nicrew Classic 36 inch fixture with 18 Watts (LED). The light is on for 7 hours a day. Plants are easy to grow low maintenance types (see pics). Livestock is a dozen White Clouds, 2 oto's, and a bunch of cherry shrimps.

When the hair algae first started to appear, I measured my nutrient levels and found I had zero nitrates and .01 mg/l phosphates. Thinking that was the issue I dosed macro elements (using Seachem liquid Nitrogen/Phosphate/Potassium). Also dosed some Seachem Flourish at label directions. My readings were then:

Nitrates: 8.0 mg/l
Phosphates: 0.5 mg/l
Potassium: 20 mg/l

A few days after dosing, my hair algae went crazy. I kept reading that nutrients don't affect algae, but in my case this does not seem to be true. I keep removing the hair algae every day or two but I can't keep up with it.

I would appreciate anyone that can recommend something else I can try. I've spent a lot of money on this tank and it's a shame that it looks so bad. Pleaee help me out if you can.


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## chrisg (Mar 28, 2020)

I was fighting hair algae in a new 5 gallon setup about a month ago and tried Deanna's recommendation of dosing high levels of excel from this thread (https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/23-algae/1234042-hair-algae-consuming-moss-hc-advice.html) which worked great. I started with an 8 ml dose, then did a 50% water change a week later and dosed 12 ml. It took a few days after the second dose for it to all die off but it worked and hasn't come back yet.

On livestock, I had a few Neos in the tank (rescued from another, I didn't really want to stock it yet) and they all did fine at the higher doses. Since it worked so well I decided to dose my 20g tank after a water change and started with a 20ml initial dose - the otos and betta didn't seem to mind, but my glowlight tetras panicked and swam at the glass looking for an escape. I did another 25% water change and it helped calm them down, about an hour later they were back to being spaced out and de-stressed. It also killed off my anacharis so I'm wondering if your Christmas moss might have problems too, but it did kill the hair algae in that tank with just a single dose. The root of it may be an imbalance in light/co2/nutrients and you might try raising your light or lowering the photo period too, but I'm too green still to really speak to that.


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## Jabolko (Jul 18, 2016)

Damn, had exact problem like you. Everything was fine than boom. Hair algae. 
Guy in local fish store suggested blackout for two days but in my case didnt helped. You can try with two days blackout and then clean as much as you can with tweezers. If plants are in good conditions they will survive without any problems.


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## joejvj (Jul 17, 2020)

Thanks for your help. I think I will try the Excel one a week high dosing and maybe cut back on lighting hours at the same time.


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## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

Try Phosban for hair algae. Place it in you canister filter and hair algae will go a way in short order. I have had this issue when I first started doing planted tanks. I come from 35 years in saltwater. 
In seawater you need a low phosphate level. What I found that the fish food was raising my phosphate. Doing testing I found it high so that due to the Lower flow in planted tanks it would allow hair algae to grow. 
Tried the water change lowering light level and time. 
Once the phosban when into the filter it change the hair algae problem in a week.


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## joejvj (Jul 17, 2020)

I too have kept saltwater and reef tanks for going on 30 years and have learned all the ropes. This is the second planted tank I've tried and I'm failing miserably at it.

I'm going to try the Excel once a week mega-dose as highlighted by Deanna in the link above starting this week.

I do have some Phosban laying around and maybe I'll try that too. Thanks for the tips.


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## Aryanasdad (Jul 27, 2020)

What I did with the algae issue in my 29 gallon tank was double dose excel following format on the bottle. so instead of the loading dose after WC being 5 ML per 10 gallon, I did 10 (actually closer to 15) and used it to spot treat with pumps off for about 10 minutes. Then daily I did about 6 ML mixing with about 6 ML of water to give a little more volume and spot treat with that as well. Also, you may want to take a long look at your light cycle because 7 hours may even be too much


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## Econde (Oct 13, 2015)

I was having similar problems, but not as severe. Someone here, one of the plant veterans mentioned that upping the Phosphates to above 5 ppm should help with hair algae.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

Econde said:


> I was having similar problems, but not as severe. Someone here, one of the plant veterans mentioned that upping the Phosphates to above 5 ppm should help with hair algae.


Yep, bottoming out on Phosphates can bring on hair algae quick.

And never use a phosphate remover in a planted tank. Plants need phosphate and it is a key to good health.


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## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

I tested and found the level of phosphate. An haven’t had hair algae for two years in this aquarium. No plant issues. Phosphate in food is the major cause of hair algae. This is long been known in the saltwater hobby. 
Keep the level low and I never have the problems. In fact Phosban works better in freshwater than in saltwater. Due to interference of the elements in salt.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

The plants still need phosphate, so if it's not in the water column OP has to have phosphate source in substrate.


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## Deanna (Feb 15, 2017)

The PO4 need in planted tanks is definitely something that needs to be maintained, generally in the 1-5ppm area (sometimes we go higher). However, in non-planted tanks, and I assume sw tanks for the same reason, the objective is to always strive for zero phosphates and zero nitrates to inhibit algae as much as possible and this is the opposite of planted tanks. Without plants we have no means to inhibit algae easily, so we try to starve it, which can often work when you keep light reasonable and use various media to pull the organics out. However, with planted tanks, we want to encourage healthy growth, as the plants will then inhibit algae growth. I should add that snails work in both situations, although I do not know if they do in sw.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

EdWiser said:


> I tested and found the level of phosphate. An haven’t had hair algae for two years in this aquarium. No plant issues. Phosphate in food is the major cause of hair algae. This is long been known in the saltwater hobby.
> Keep the level low and I never have the problems. In fact Phosban works better in freshwater than in saltwater. Due to interference of the elements in salt.


I am glad to hear you have not had hair algae issues for a long time. Most tanks don't, unless something is seriously off. But I doubt using Phosban has anything to do with it.

Phosphate causing algae is like an old wives tale that has been debunked over and over again. Not really even debatable at this point. I am in contact with loads of the most successful folks in the hobby, and not a single one would ever use a product to remove PO4. In fact, most dose levels that might make your head spin.

But like I said, if you found a system that works for you, the more power to you. But to suggest that folks limit PO4 to combat hair algae is counter intuitive. It is well known that PO4 bottoming out can cause hair and all kinds of other algae. Weak starving plants are a magnet for it.

Any pics of the tank? Would be curious to see what types of plants and tank you are talking about.


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## Karley (Jun 16, 2020)

I'll share my experience with hair algae, for what it's worth. 

I have a low tech, heavily stocked planted tank: no fertilizers, no CO2, Eco-Complete substrate. I have some driftwood attached with a suction cup up at the top of the tank (this entire tank is set up to please Princess, my male dwarf gourami). This driftwood gets covered in algae, which I don't mind. The fish spend a lot of time foraging in it, and I like how it looks moving in the current. I prune it when I do my water changes. BUT the hair algae started spreading to my plants and really going nuts, so I cut down my lighting by about 25%. Its growth has slowed significantly, especially on the plants. Also, I swear some of the other plants are growing faster with the reduced lighting. 

My take away - it seems that light supply, and also maybe height/distance, are the driving factors in my tank. Good luck!


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

Karley said:


> so I cut down my lighting by about 25%. Its growth has slowed significantly, especially on the plants. Also, I swear some of the other plants are growing faster with the reduced lighting.
> 
> My take away - it seems that light supply, and also maybe height/distance, are the driving factors in my tank. Good luck!


Good point.

It's all about balance. And that balance is in relation to the particular plants in the tank and their needs.

Another example that comes to mind would be CO2. Take a well running high tech high light tank and turn of the gas, and hair and all other kinds of algae can come up quick. Sometimes folks chase dosing, when light or CO2 could be the culprit.


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## Aryanasdad (Jul 27, 2020)

Greggz said:


> Good point.
> 
> It's all about balance. And that balance is in relation to the particular plants in the tank and their needs.
> 
> Another example that comes to mind would be CO2. Take a well running high tech high light tank and turn of the gas, and hair and all other kinds of algae can come up quick. Sometimes folks chase dosing, when light or CO2 could be the culprit.


I completely agree. I'm running quite a bit of light on my tank. When I moved, my co2 wasn't up quite as high as it was prior to the move but light was the same and so was the dosing. I did start having a little bit of BBA and GSA pop up. As soon as I turned my Co2 back up, it started to go away. I do dose excel as well simply because I always have and I don't want to change anything because it's working. I guess I'm afraid of throwing that balance off.


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## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

Shot from this morning. 











Here is hair algae 










Gregg what I did was remove the phosban not change any other routine in the aquarium. An the hair algae came back. This tank mostly has rotala plants. 
and Christmas moss. In my new 120p I will be doing ICP testing on dosing methods. This is to actually nail down the take up on plants nutrients and 
Elements. I have been using ICP testing since it came out and follow DUTCH synthetic reefing guidelines. So I am looking this all from a testing of method not a this is what others due. 
I always like to get down to reasons why not just this is what is done. 
Lots of learning to be done which I enjoy having kept aquariums for 57 years now is my interest in the aquarium hobby.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

EdWiser said:


> Gregg what I did was remove the phosban not change any other routine in the aquarium. An the hair algae came back. This tank mostly has rotala plants.
> and Christmas moss. In my new 120p I will be doing ICP testing on dosing methods. This is to actually nail down the take up on plants nutrients and
> Elements. I have been using ICP testing since it came out and follow DUTCH synthetic reefing guidelines. So I am looking this all from a testing of method not a this is what others due.
> I always like to get down to reasons why not just this is what is done.
> Lots of learning to be done which I enjoy having kept aquariums for 57 years now is my interest in the aquarium hobby.


Ed thanks for sharing. That is interesting.

I have to say I have never once seen a correlation with removing PO4 and defeating hair algae. In fact I have seen a lack of PO4 bring on hair algae many times. But I don't discount what you have observed. 

Planted tanks can be mysterious things, and I have seen many things that seem to be outliers to most others experience. Each tank is a unique eco system, which makes it difficult to pinpoint cause and effect.

I once tested the upper limits of PO4 in my tank. At the peak I was dosing 15 ppm PO4 weekly. No hair algae, and no increase in any other algae either. Some sensitive plants did stunt, but nothing else really changed. Not that is proves anything, but I do know many of the best tanks I follow dose somewhere between 3 and 8 ppm PO4 weekly, and hair algae has never been an issue.

Out of curiosity, what was the PO4 reading in the tank before Phosban and after? Have you ever tried to duplicate it? If you remove Phosban now will it come back. It just seems strange, especially in that it is hair algae, which is not real common in my experience. 

Anyway, very interesting stuff, and look forward to seeing what you come up with regarding plant uptake.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Not doubting your observation after using Phosban, but what else does Phosban remove?


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## joejvj (Jul 17, 2020)

FYI Phosban is 100% iron oxide hydroxide (Ferric Oxide). Its been used for decades in water treatment plants to remove phosphates. It may leach small amounts of iron into the aquarium, but in a ferric form which is not readily soluble at the pH we keep in aquariums.


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## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

I was at 10ppm and got it down to 1ppm. 
I spent most of the past 30 years working with SPS corals. Which are a 1000 times more sensitive than plants. 
We have worked to stop doing water changes at all on coral tanks. To reach a stability of water parameters. So the whole let’s do 100 percent and 50 precent water changes to me is crazy. 
This is the old the solution to pollution is dilution answer. 
I know ICP testing is not a big thing in planted tanks. But you can do tests of the water before an after dosing an see how much the plants actually up take. 
The two photos above show a before and after phosban. 
Phosban Is a Synthetic ferric oxide hydroxide granules with an extremely high capacity for adsorbing phosphate from saltwater and freshwater. Also adsorbs silicate, and does not release adsorbed substances.
One could use straight ferric oxide which is iron pellets. 
Another way is to use a algae scrubber. 
Which creates am the perfect environment for algae to grow. 
All algae’s come about due to an access of nutrients in the aquarium that the algae needs to grow.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

EdWiser said:


> All algae’s come about due to an access of nutrients in the aquarium that the algae needs to grow.


I would agree algae comes about from excess nutrients, more specifically from the ammonia and other toxins that come from organic waste. If algae came about from excessive NPK, then every EI type dosed tank would have algae. I know my tanks typically keep in excess of 40 ppm of NO3, been as high as 80-100ppm and 3-4 PO4 and I don't have any fast growing stems in the tank, nor did I ever go through an algae phase, not even diatoms. 

What all these EI type tanks have in common is excess ferts, so that simply can't be the answer. What they don't have in common is the uptake necessary to "immediately" process the ammonia.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

EdWiser said:


> I was at 10ppm and got it down to 1ppm.
> I spent most of the past 30 years working with SPS corals. Which are a 1000 times more sensitive than plants.
> We have worked to stop doing water changes at all on coral tanks. To reach a stability of water parameters. So the whole let’s do 100 percent and 50 precent water changes to me is crazy.
> This is the old the solution to pollution is dilution answer.
> ...


If your PO4 was at 10 ppm without dosing any PO4, then IMO you could really use more water changes. 

Water changes are not beneficial because they dilute the fertilization, they are helpful because they removed dissolved organics from the system. An uber clean tank with low dissolved organics is easily the best defense against algae.

And there is a world of difference in a tank that generates 10 ppm PO4 from fish waste/food to a tank that is uber clean and is dosed to 10 ppm PO4. 

Like @Asteroid said above, your statement that all algae come about from a excess in nutrients is simply not true. I can point you to some of the best tanks in the world that dose in "excess" but are algae free. 

In fact, I would argue that too little nutrients is far worse than too many. Weak starving plants are an easy target and a magnet for algae.

In the end, think providing plants all they need to have healthy steady growth, not defeating algae. IME, starving algae never works, and only makes things worse.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Greggz said:


> If your PO4 was at 10 ppm without dosing any PO4, then IMO you could really use more water changes.
> 
> Water changes are not beneficial because they dilute the fertilization, they are helpful because they *removed dissolved organics *from the system. An uber clean tank with low dissolved organics is easily the best defense against algae.


That's a good point about the 10 ppm of PO4 without dosing. Excessive waste from fish food etc. BTW from the Phosban description:

"Largest adsorption capacity of any phosphate filtering media. Ferric oxide hydroxide-based granules also* adsorb organics and other pollutants.* Use just like activated carbon; filter bag included. 

So it appears that it also removes organics as well, which is interesting, but I still wouldn't recommend for planted aquaria since you need some PO4, which your @EdWiser getting from the ADA AS.


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## Deanna (Feb 15, 2017)

EdWiser said:


> In my new 120p I will be doing ICP testing on dosing methods. This is to actually nail down the take up on plants nutrients and Elements. I have been using ICP testing since it came out and follow DUTCH synthetic reefing guidelines. So I am looking this all from a testing of method not a this is what others due.


Don't use ICP ...yet. They are not able to accurately read the levels that we maintain micros, and you certainly don't need such analysis for macros. The reported values will, essentially, be guesses. They are working on this capability and expect to have it in the future, hopefully sometime this year. You may want to contact them about it (they are very responsive), as any interest on a potential customers' part may encourage them to look at our market.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

Asteroid said:


> So it appears that it also removes organics as well, which is interesting, but I still wouldn't recommend for planted aquaria since you need some PO4, which your @EdWiser getting from the ADA AS.


That is interesting. 

Removing organics having an effect on algae would make more sense the removal of PO4. 

IMO, more frequent water changes, regular gravel vacs, and good filter maintenance far outweigh the benefits of charcoal, Purigen, or something like Phosban.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Greggz said:


> That is interesting.
> 
> Removing organics having an effect on algae would make more sense the removal of PO4.
> 
> IMO, more frequent water changes, regular gravel vacs, and good filter maintenance far outweigh the benefits of charcoal, Purigen, or something like Phosban.


I agree, I do use purigen or more preferably Carbon because my tanks aren't stem heavy and much of the real estate is hardscape which doesn't help with uptake so in the initial period I feel these organic removal products can only help. Another tool in the toolbox against algae. 

The best for organic removal for me is plants (continuous) and then water change/vac (once a week usually) The filter is at the end because when the filter takes in waste it's still part of the system. Plenty of tanks have huge filters, no plants and with good light they grow algae quite well. A theory can be told that your better off having waste not be collected by the filter, as one gravel vacs more frequently then they clean their filter. :surprise:


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## gjcarew (Dec 26, 2018)

Asteroid said:


> Phosban description:
> 
> "Largest adsorption capacity of any phosphate filtering media. Ferric oxide hydroxide-based granules also* adsorb organics and other pollutants.* Use just like activated carbon; filter bag included.


I love the fascinating little tidbits you glean from conversations like this! Who knew that phosban also adsorbs organics.

I get the impression that you can really get away with minimal phosphorous in an aquarium. There was someone on here that couldn't detect phosophorous in a sample of Easy Green but that seems to work just fine for most people. I only add 2.8 ppm per week, and definitely don't overfeed, and I only occasionally get GSA and never get green hair algae.

I've had severe hair algae outbreaks in the past. The nuclear option is the "one-two punch" method, but the real root cause for me has always been tank cleanliness i.e. excess "organics". In one case it was due to using a lot of organic/non-mineralized dirt in the substrate (I used a bunch of worm castings) that was dragged up every time I uprooted plants. In another case it was a bunch of gaps in rocks that detritus was building up in.


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## joejvj (Jul 17, 2020)

Just wondering, if dissolved organics is the string algae culprit, has anyone here used activated carbon with success to combat it?


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## Deanna (Feb 15, 2017)

gjcarew said:


> I love the fascinating little tidbits you glean from conversations like this! Who knew that phosban also adsorbs organics.


We have to be a little careful about this. If you read further on the Phosban site, they are specific about it removing only water-staining organic compounds. These are things such as tannins. It does not remove the nitrogenous organics and there are many other waste aspects beyond nitrogen and phosphorus. As @Asteroid mentioned, Purigen and AC will also remove the same organics that Phosban does, other than PO4. Seachem also has products that do what Phosban does.


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## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

When reading about the over dosing of fert’s then doing massive water changes. While in May work it is not a user friendly was of maintaining an aquarium. The “average “ hobbyist doesn’t have the time to do massive water changes 3 times a week. They have a family jobs and lives. 
Now I can do this easily as I have a completely automated system to do this. I built it for my Saltwater system. 
My friend D2mini who post’s to his build thread here does this. I can do this easy by either scheduling the removal of so much water per hour or by just pressing one button on my touch screen control of my tank an remove water while watching the tank. 
I try to think about how to better manage this balance for the average hobbyist. 
As far as plants taking up phosphate. 
Have we looked into what plants take up what fert’s. This would allow people to realize that the may want to add certain plants to a tank to “balance” and therefore help with issues like hair algae.


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## Tha Wolf (May 7, 2019)

https://greenaqua.hu/en/alga-tajekoztato

I went here to help me with hair algae on my 75 gallon. All I did was become more consistent with my Co2. I have a set schedule since i'm working from home now and it's gone from a mess to only spot algae. I do recommend trimming the length of it or rubbing the areas gently to try and get it off there.

One person said to put a bunch of Excel in there, this is a great idea if you don't inject Co2. 

I really can't wait to see what this looks like when you are done. I liked the layout a lot.


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## joejvj (Jul 17, 2020)

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and experiences. Based on your inputs, here is what I'm doing and will post new pics as I make progress:

I did the Excel megadose on Monday @ 1ml/gallon. It's Friday today and while I don't see much improvement in the hair algae yet, the plants and livestock do not seem to be affected at all. Even my Christmas Tree Moss is unaffected. I was really scared dumping 10x the recommended dosage of Excel in my tank. Anyways, I will follow the increase dose instructions and move to 1.5ml/gallon next week.

I also added Phosban and Activated Carbon to my canister filter. If the problem is dissolved organics, this will attack it on that front.

Finally, I'm trying something that is off the wall. In my reef tanks I have used a product called "Vibrant Aquarium Cleaner" which has worked wonders. It even eliminated Green Bubble Macro algae and Bryopsis in saltwater that is near impossible to control. The product is some type of bacteria blend rather than an algaecide. I've done the 1st dose of this according to label directions and will see what happens.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Tha Wolf said:


> https://greenaqua.hu/en/alga-tajekoztato


This is a good article on algae. I think there's some confusion in this thread on what causes algae to appear in the first place and how to get rid of it once it's there. 

Key point in the Green Aqua article:

"OK, so what causes algae to appear? In short: the presence of light and ammonia. The more light we have (and modern, high-tech aquariums have a lot of light), the less ammonia is needed to trigger algae-bloom. This is why beginning aquascapers see more algae after setting up their aquariums than traditional, low-tech hobbyists.

Problem is that ammonia can not be just "eliminated" - unless you make bigger, daily water changes in your aquarium - but that will also be a symptom cure. Our goal is to find out what causes the ammonia levels to spike in our water - and this is where things start to get more complicated. Ammonia appears as a result of decomposing organic elements in your water. This can be of multiple sources: dirty or inefficient filter, fish that died and remained undiscovered, decomposing plant leaves, accumulated mulm, etc."

Pretty much my belief. If you go on to read it, hadn't read it before and it's exactly what I think is true, The ammonia starts before you even "see" the algae and once it's algae it can feed off regular plant nutrients, but it starts with ammonia feeding spores. Also you can't really starve algae by reducing dosing, you need to out compete it. So if using something like Phosban make sure you have p04 in your substrate.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

gjcarew said:


> I get the impression that you can really get away with minimal phosphorous in an aquarium. There was someone on here that couldn't detect phosophorous in a sample of Easy Green but that seems to work just fine for most people.


It depends on the individual tank. 

Low light low tech tanks full of slow growing plants (most people?) can probably get by with PO4 that is generated from the tank.

Stop dosing PO4 into my high light tank full of flowery stems and you should expect a crash. 

Also has much to do with the variety of stems. Rotala's & Ammannia's (lythraceae) and the like can get by with very little water column ferts as long as there is a nutrient rich substrate. And even then, some Rotala's like Macranda's prefer more EI level ferts. 

So you really need to look at each tank in it's entirety, because there are a huge variety of tank eco systems out there.


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## ryubui (Jul 14, 2014)

I have a fully planted tank, dosing EI and havent done a water change in 2 months (shame on me). CO2 + high lighting and only algae i get is diatoms (probably due to not enough phosphates) Plants and fish are thriving.

My other little guy is getting 0 ferts, 0 co2, but high lighting, Hair algae everywhere...i can vouch phosphate isnt the cause xD


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