# Red Cherry Shrimp failing to molt after a month?



## KWaters (May 1, 2017)

I think temp-wise you may be running a bit hot. Your GH is fine, but RCS do best in slightly lower temps. They seem to like temps around 72F the best, but can do fine in 68F-75F. When the temperature is too warm, the shrimp grows too quickly for the shell, and they can't molt properly.

Lower the temps a little bit and try feeding them some leafy greens like spinach and kale, which have important nutrients for molting. Don't worry that your shrimp won't eat the protein you're putting in - a little protein is okay, but a lot causes problems.

This would be my first guess, you could try measuring the TDS but I'm not sure that has anything to do with molting problems.


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## Zoidburg (Mar 8, 2016)

*So I recently added 20 cherry shrimp to my 10G low tech planted tank, and I've noticed that every month or so, a couple of my cherry shrimp will die from a failed molt.*

How recent is "recent".

*pH : 7.3
KH : 2.5 dKH
GH: 10 dGH
Temperature : 76-78F depending on night/day*

I would recommend lowering the temp down to 68-72° F instead. If you have a heater, take it out. If you aren't using a heater, try a clip on fan attached to the brim of the tank and blowing across the top of the water. This will help cool the tank down, but will also cause faster evaporation.


*I've ruled out copper poisoning, as I have kept 3 amano shrimp and a nerite in the same water for 5 years (they're in an "overflow" tank I have hooked up), and they seem fine. I don't think it's a calcium deficiency either, as my amanos have never had a problem molting, and my cherries seem able to molt most of the time.*

I don't know about nerites, but that's not really a good comparison... amanos can be extremely hardy! Cherry shrimp live for 1-2 years, amanos can live for 5-10+ years... amanos have the potential to be more forgiving of water parameters than cherry shrimp. They do, after all, live 3-6 weeks in the ocean, then have to climb home, swimming up-stream, or climbing over rocks and such.



*1. GH too high/low. I've read many conflicting opinions about this...would like a second (or third or etc.) opinion. LFS staff say they use tap water for their RCS tank, and their cherries are breeding fine.*

You'll have to define "tap" here... what are the parameters that the LFS keep their shrimp in?

Many shrimp (with the exception of amanos and ghosts) kept in my tap water, without anything added to it, would eventually die! And all because I have soft tap water... My sister on the other hand? It's the complete opposite! She has hard tap water!


*2. TDS too high / TDS mismatch from tap water. I don't have a TDS meter, but my tank water and tap water have essentially identical GH/KH/pH from testing. There is a slight ammonia reading from my tap water (< 0.5 ppm?), but I think that may be due to the water conditioner interacting with chloramine..I might switch to a vitamin C based dechlorinator (provided it doesn't change the pH too much).* 

Without correct tests, it may be hard to say if that's actually ammonia or something else. Do you do the test before or after adding a water conditioner?


*3. Nutrient deficiency. As I mentioned before, my shrimp seem to ignore most of the dry/live food I feed my fish (unfortunately I now have a lot of snails to clean up the uneaten food lol), instead preferring to graze on my crypt leaves. Since I don't really control the nutrients in the biofilm, maybe they are having problems molting because they are missing vital nutrients from only eating the biofilm? I've heard that iodine may be the culprit here, but I've also heard to never use iodized salt in an aquarium. Would dosing iodine hurt my fish?*

I'd recommend to just avoid iodine... I highly doubt it's the answer...

Although it is quite possible that their diet is off for whatever reason, and that could be killing them.


*4. Some sort of bacterial infection or planaria...? I've seen this on a couple of the threads here, but my cherries don't seem to turn cloudy (other than the white ring) and I've never seen any planaria (I'm sure my scarlet badis would eat any he saw anyways). I would like to avoid antibiotics as much as possible so that I don't end up with a mini cycle, but would treating with antibiotics also negatively affect the biofilm growth in my tank?* 

Planaria is a worm, which would be treated with a dewormer of some sort or another... aka Fenbendendazole, No Planaria or Planaria Zero.

Treating for a bacterial infection could probably harm the biofilm, since it is, after all, bacteria that's growing.



*I do a 20% water change weekly using cold tap water that I've let sit for an hr or so to equilibrate temperature.* 
Do you test the temperature of the water to match it to the tank?

Do you just pour the water back in or drip it back in via an air-line tube?




I don't see anything that *really* sticks out, but I must wonder, if you've had them for at least 4 months, has there been any breeding? Any offspring?

The best way to get shrimp acclimated to your water parameters is to have them breeding in your tank, and the offspring will be better acclimated to the water parameters than their parents. Now, since you have your shrimp with fish, if they are breeding, it's quite possible that the fish are eating the offspring, thus the shrimp aren't really acclimating to the water parameters because they don't have a self-sustaining colony going.



My recommendation would be to set up a separate tank to raise shrimp in and once you've got a healthy colony going, you can start moving the extras into the community tank.


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## Antichton (May 17, 2017)

Thanks for the replies guys!

Seems like temperature may be a big factor. Unfortunately, I just live in a warm area so my room temperature is never below 75 or so. I'll see if I can find a fan to cool the tank.

To answer Zoidburg's questions:
1. Recent is 4 months ish. 
2. LFS has pretty hard tap water, pH/KH/GH similar to my house (at least from the parameters they had written down). Their cherries don't seem to be dying, so they must be doing something right!
3. I tested after adding dechlorinator - I'll test again before I do a WC.
4. Temperature of the water is within 2F of tank water when I pour it (using a ghetto thermometer). I just kinda pour it in since the chemistry is very similar. Maybe I should drip it in? A bit worried that my plants would dry out at the top after 30mins or so tho...
5. I've seen my females berried before, but haven't found any shrimplets. Predation may be an issue here. I don't have space for another tank, but would amano shrimp eat cherry shrimplets? I can move the cherries to my overflow tank (has 3 amanos and a nerite).


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## Zoidburg (Mar 8, 2016)

Some people have all the luck and don't do squat!


Without knowing the TDS of the tank vs the tap water, it could potentially be harmful to pour the water back in. That is, assuming it's related water parameters rather than diet. The tap should, in theory, have lower TDS than the tank, so when you do water changes, even if the ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, GH and KH are all the same, the TDS could be an issue. I doubt this would be that big of a deal, to be honest. (thinking back on some people having all the luck...)

Could you possibly share what the water parameters are of the LFS? Or possibly just ask for a water sample to test yourself?


The amanos may or may not go after the cherries... I'm not making any guarantees! A lot of people keep amanos with cherries and other shrimp, no problems! And then there are amanos that will hunt down and eat other shrimp and fish...

I keep amanos and cherries together and, knock on wood, I haven't seen the amanos go after the cherries (let alone the loaches).


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## Antichton (May 17, 2017)

Yo, just a quick update.

So, I went to the LFS, and the parameters they supplied for tapwater are: pH 7.2, KH 30ppm, GH 200ppm. I also installed a fan so my tank stays around 75F now (would probably need ac to get it lower).

I moved a few of the remaining cherries that I have to the overflow tank, and found a couple of shrimplets yesterday! They were really tiny; I wouldn't be surprised if my badis ate all of the shrimplets in the community tank (he does constantly pick at the substrate). The shrimplets are currently in a breeder net with some pellia and a couple of CPD fry that aren't big enough to eat them (yet). Hopefully there will be more to come! Thanks for the help guys!


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## awesometim1 (Oct 31, 2013)

GH is way too high. They can have trouble molting. Try lowering it with RO water or use some gh lowering substance 


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## Zoidburg (Mar 8, 2016)

If the LFS keeps and breeds them in 11 GH (i.e. doesn't purchase them from somewhere else), then 10 GH is perfectly fine.


Might need to try and drip the water back in. I have heard of people putting paper towels on the top of the water, although I've never tried that method myself... Also seen some people use plastic wrap on the top to keep plants moist. Would suggest trying to figure out a way to drip the water back into the aquarium in a way that it's safe for shrimp and plants.



Next question is diet? You did mention that they pretty much ignore the food, but what are you feeding?


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