# Unirdna's 46g Bowfront - Terminated - 03/2004 - 03/2007



## chinaboy1021 (May 30, 2003)

awesome looking tank. i love the stone wall.


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

*Drooling* I love the equipment  A very nice setup you have there, particulary the inline heater. Is that a DIY CO2 reactor? I'm guessing so, because although it looks very professional, it doesn't look too mass-produced, if you know what I mean...

--cich


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## Tonyd (Jan 22, 2004)

Looking good, can't wait to see it with the plants. 

Tony


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## wellbiz (Aug 6, 2003)

:shock: :shock: :shock: Nice...


Jason


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## plantastic28 (Dec 22, 2003)

cich,

He says the co2 reactor is made from left over stuff in his discription.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Here are a few lovelies I picked up a few hours ago. Nothing is planted yet because I'm still waiting on my driftwood. I figure there is no harm letting the plants get a jump start before I'm ready to start painting. They have already started bubbling. I don't know if this is O2 created via photosynthesis, or if it's just coming out of solution.....but it's very nice-looking, either way. Question for you plant gurus: my dwarf hairgrass came with some kind of moss lining the top of the plastic pot. It's bubbling like crazy (see photo). Any idea what this is? Any ideas how to make use of it? Any reasons why I shouldn't? 

Nitrates and Phosphates are both @ zero. From most of the posts I've read, it is my understanding that you want to start out with stem plants to absorb N and P. Are these nutrients eventually going to show up (for some reason I can't figure out), or does that fact that I used 100% reconstituted RO water make my situation different from the norm?

Not so sure about all the plants....definitely gonna screw up spelling. Feel free to jump in, if I messed up too bad 

1. Ambulia
2. Ludwegia sp?
3. baby tears (latin?)
4. Cambomba sp?
5. Wisteria sp?
6. Dwarf hairgrass (latin?)
7. Jungle vals (latin?)

Other recommendations? I still have a few ducats left in the coffers.

Ted


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

Just curious how many inches did the 3 bags of Eco-Complete you?


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## trenac (Feb 15, 2004)

very nice setup.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Raul-7 said:


> Just curious how many inches did the 3 bags of Eco-Complete you?


I'm @ ~ 2.5 inches. I'm thinking of adding one more bag. What's $20 more, once I'm at this stage of the game ?

....and thanks for the compliments on the tank/gear....but the real test is whether or not I can _make_ it 'work' :twisted: ...hehe

Ted


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Looks like you are off to a great start!  Nice plant selection, should be able to fill some space quickly, before algae becomes a problem.
Not sure what the green stuff is, but my guess is that the Hairgrass was grown emers and some terrestric moss has grown on the pot. Time will tell, maybe you found the perfect Nano-Moss? 8)


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## Mike (Mar 8, 2004)

Nice tank and equipment. I'm looking forward to getting an Ehiem canister someday :up:


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## corigan (Feb 22, 2004)

Very Nice, I can't wait to see it when it's filled in. Great Arrangement.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

A couple new additions to the tank . Also, the ambulia has shown significant growth in just one day :? . Is this normal (see photo  )?


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

plantastic28 said:


> cich,
> 
> He says the co2 reactor is made from left over stuff in his discription.


*HUGE blush* I guess I should read before I start shooting off my mouth...

--cich


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## Thooshe (Dec 11, 2003)

Looking good Ted. I have gotten my 46 set up now same amount of lighting but I used Flourate instead. 

How do you like the Ecco? I am looking at going with a 2215 classic as soon as I get the cash because my 46 blew a hole in my wallet too.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Hi Thooshe,

I'm feelin ya, man. Took me 2 months to get all the knickknacks together ($$$). The eco-complete is fantastic (so far). The size and density is perfect. Easy to push in fragile stems, but it still holds them very well. Also, there is absolutely no dust to worry about. The tanks had a whiteish haze for an hour or so, but it quickly turned clear. 

I was torn between the 2215 (classic) and the 2235 (ECCO). Wound up getting the ECCO because the price was very right. I think that the pump rates are similar, but the 2215 has a bit more media area. The current the 2235 has created seems about perfect. I had to cut down the spray bar to make it fit on the side of the tank. Since I cut off 2-3 spray holes, I widened the remaining holes with my dremel (just to make sure I wasn't restricting flow). I aim the spraybar down and towards the glass (for now). The creates a gentle current that sweeps the bottom of the tank.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

unirdna said:


> Also, the ambulia has shown significant growth in just one day :? . Is this normal (see photo  )?


Yep, that's normal. Ambulia is among the fastest growing stem plants. With lots of light and CO2, it will require pruning twice a week or more often. Unless you're okay with it floating along the surface.

It's an ideal plant for a new tank, since it eats up so many nutrients, overwhelming any algae in the process  

I have started to plant it in little pots, because I got tired of pulling the roots out of the substrate each week (clouding the water). Now I just pull them out of the pot, cut them in half, and stick them back in.


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## trenac (Feb 15, 2004)

Amano shrimp...Love them...Great fun to watch.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Got it all planted!

Also added a small chunk of microsword and some sag.

In addition to the 2 amanos, I now have 2 SAE's and 4 ottos. After watching my amanos crawl all over the driftwood, I'm now sure that I am going to go 'shrimp crazy' with this tank. I love em! I especially want a couple of those big suckers, with the 'feather' claws. But to keep those would mean that I probably shouldn't ever get a UV sterilizer, since they eat drifting algae. I think I'd be willing to sacrifice a bit of clarity to be able to keep a couple of those .


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## corigan (Feb 22, 2004)

Looks good, can't wait to see it grow in.

Matt


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

So, it's about 10 days now since the first plants went in the tank. And a few days since I've arranged the tank. Nitrates and phosphates have been at 0 ppm since the start. In the last few days I noticed that growth was slowing and a bit of hair algae and bga was starting to grow on the hairgrass. So I've started dosing ferts. Just nitrate and flourish (so far). I added enough KNO3 to bring the tank to 5ppm. I'm scared to add phosphate  , but will bring the tank up a couple tenths ppm in the coming days (so long as the nitrate dosing goes ok). I also plan to dose K for the first time this weekend when I do a water change.

Here's a shot taken right after adding NO3 for the first time. I'm thoroughly documenting this, so you'll all be up to speed if my tank 'explodes'. 

Ted


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## rumples riot (May 29, 2003)

Looking good and nice design, will look great once it grows in.

Paul


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Finally added some fish that weren't required to do any cleaning. I love the way these guys school. They don't look frightened, just 'clicky'. Like freshman walking to a house party during the first month of college . This brings my current fish count to:

2 SAE's
4 Ottos
4 Amanos
8 Rasboras


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

- Updated photo of whole tank. 

A little bit of haze in the water column and some staghorn on the hairgrass, but things seem to be balancing out. You can see an Apotomogeton crispus leaf sprouting from near the small piece of wood. That bulb has been buried in my girlfriends 15 gal (presumably dead) for 3 years. It only took 6 hours to 'wake up'. Overall, The tank is taking on a softer look. I like the shadowing created by a bit of the ambulia resting on top.....still, I have to trim it twice a week.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

...and a view from the couch. (I thought I would post a 'day' photo, to give a better idea of how _I_ see the tank). Please ignore the pH probe  . - And note the addition of an _A. crispus_ leaf overnight!  The more I look at that plant, the more I love it.


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## pixelcrayon (Mar 24, 2004)

im just started my first planted tank. still in the planning/scaping stage. hope mine turns out as good as yours. nice job!!


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## corigan (Feb 22, 2004)

Loving the layout uni, keep us updated with pics. I love the contrast between the left side and the right side.

Matt


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Sorry to post a new photo so soon, but I needed a way to show Tonyd how my tank is looking. I'm attempting to acquire some of his clippings and need to show him what I have to offer (trade).

But now that you're here....might as well take a look .

Please excuse the wicked glare on the tank. Our living room has skylights and three walls of windows. It is all but impossible to get a clean shot during the day.


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

Awesome, I really like it! Is that H.micranthemoides, I like the foreground effect.


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## Tonyd (Jan 22, 2004)

LOL, looks great! I really like your vals, hopefully mine will look as nice soon. Hmm, the only thing I think you are missing is a little Red Temple. :wink: :lol: 

Tony


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## rumples riot (May 29, 2003)

Looking very nice, you should be proud of this one.

BTW, it must be the Eheim that you have on your tank that is giving that superb water quality.  Come join the Eheim pimp thread.

Paul


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## Somarg (Apr 24, 2003)

How is tha inline heater working out for you? I've been considering it.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Raul-7,
Yep it's H. micranthemoides (aka baby tears). The more I look at that stuff, the more I like it. It beams under my CF lights, and does not allow hair algae to grow on it like my hairgrass. It has filled in its own section and is expanding towards my hairgrass section. I think I'm just going to let it go and fill in my entire foreground. Whenever it shoots a stem towards the sky, I just gently push it into the thicket.

Somarg,
I've been happier with this inline heater than any other I've ever used. It keeps temps right on. I've tested the temp with a digital thermometer and it has only varied by .1 deg F. Also, you gotta appreciate removing a big chunk of glass/titanium from the tank. Only caveat is that it only accepts a 5/8" hose. Since I have an Eheim ECCO (1/2"), I had to make the adjustment.

To all readers,
I've recently gotten a PM re: the contraption I was using to fill the tank (first series of photos). I thought I would share my response, in case anyone else was interested.

_"Hey _____,

I got the idea from Rex Grigg's webpage http://rexgrigg.com/aa.htm#hw. In the hardware section, you'll find this sentence, "Here is a picture of a little project I built...".

I pieced mine together at home depot (PVC dept). I used my little dremmel tool to do the cutting, but almost any saw would probably work just as well (if not better). I have a ball valve ($2) at the end of mine, to prevent the water from siponing back out while I run to the basement to get more RO water. There is a 1/2" hose barb just below the ball-valve allowing me to run tubing from the pvc thingy to a pump. I use a maxijet powerhead 1000 to pump the water, from the bucket, back into the tank. Without this little contraption, I would uproot and blow my plants all over. Additionally, I have designed the thing to accept multiple intake/output heads to fit all of my tanks. I just drill the holes to the level of water I want to remove. I then attach a 20 foot, 1/2" piece of vinyl tubing to the hose barb, and run the hose out the nearest window. My lawn loves it, and it cuts my 'bucket running' in 1/2." 

Total cost was around $10. 

Regards, 
Ted"_

Finally, thanks for the compliments. I've heard many a horror story about 'first tanks', and I feel fortunate that mine hasn't had that chapter. Of course, without online resources like this one, I most certainly _would_ have had such problems (and would never have been invited to join the 'Eheim Pimp Club" ).


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## Fat Guy (Nov 19, 2003)

I like your tank very much. Letting the Hemianthus Mircanthemoides grow in big on the front right adds a very nice dimensinon to your tank.

BTW. H. Micranthemoides is NOT baby tears. It is Pearl Grass. Just thought you'd like to know. In any case, I don't think that you should let it overtake the foreground where the hairgrass is. I like the transition that there is between the two. 

Looks so much better now that it looks more mulitdimensional. Great work. Very clean looking and refreshing. The nice part about those bow front tanks is that you have more room to manipulate in the foreground. You can put more into it with all the space.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks for the correction, FatGuy. I've just been repeating what my LFS called it . Since when has a LFS ever been wrong ?

I'll consider your words re: not letting the pearlgrass take over the tank. I just wish my hairgrass would get on the horse :twisted: .


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## ///ACS330Ci (Jan 25, 2004)

Looks really, really good! Progressing nicely roud:


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## geodiscus (Feb 7, 2004)

great setup...How do you like your eccho? I was thinking about getting that one.


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## corigan (Feb 22, 2004)

Flotsam & Jetsam, I love it! Nice Amano's they look really healthy, I wish I could find some that size, I wouldn't have to worry about them getting eaten like my last few. If you don't mind me asking did you get those locally or somewhere online?

Matt


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

A few exciting improvements I'd like to share.

1. My hairgrass is shaking off the remaining cells of the staghorn algae minion that attacked my tank two weeks ago. New growth is sprouting, and I like it!

2. My javafern, which has been draggin its heals since I set up the tank, has finally decided to join the party. New leaves are uncurling, and the rhizome is traveling south.

3. Hardware improvement. I was frustrated with the air that would accumulate in my CO2 reactor, so I installed a gas-release valve from some of the parts in my 'black hole' aquarium box. What makes this DIY unique is that I install it 'on the fly'. Very exciting :twisted: .


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Also, 

It's now been 4 weeks since plants hit the water. I've attached a couple photos to put things in perspective. Never expected this level of success. Very rewarding, indeed. I'm now setting my attention on renovating my other two tanks (30g; 15g). 

What an addiction!


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## R2thaSAR (Feb 22, 2004)

what substrate are u using?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Matt,

I get em locally. I'm lucky enough to have an LFS that actually specializes in planted tanks (and the usual inhabitants of such tanks). Amanos are always healthy and big (over 1 in). I usually pick out the two biggest in the tank, each time I visit.

R2,
Using 100% eco-complete. My LFS only had 3 bags, so I bought him out. I wanted 4 bags, but was too impatient to wait another 2-4 weeks for it to arrive though his shop. Three bags equals around 2.5 inches. Since I only have a couple rooting plants, I think I'll be o.k. for now.


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

Very-very nice  and the plants look very healthy too. And no hair algae like mine :? .


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## Sedghammer (Jan 5, 2004)

Verrry nice. What do you fertilize with and how much/often?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Sedghammer said:


> Verrry nice. What do you fertilize with and how much/often?


Nutrient dosing (skip to the last paragraph for summary):

I bought Potassium Sulfate, Potassium Nitrate, Monopotassium Phosphate, and Magnesium Sulfate from gregwatson.com (A+ service, BTW). I'm currently only using the Nitrate. I dosed 15ppm K and .5ppm PO4 about two weeks ago, and was quickly smacked by an algae bloom. Were those nutrients the cause? Beats me. Could have had everything, part, or nothing to do with it. But I'm a little shy with the syringe now.

Since I have a pretty good fish load (and a very unreliable PO4 test kit), I don't think I'm going to dose Phosphate again, unless my plants show that they need it. And after reading the horror stories about overdosing K, I'll let my KNO3 do the dosing (again, unless my plants say otherwise). And as for the Mg?.....well, it turns out the my RO right has lots of that in it anyway, so once again.....not unless it's needed.

In short, I check my NO3 about twice a week. When PPM starts getting close to 0, I give the tank a 5ppm dose (with 1/2 cap of flourish). I've been working with the philosophy that less is more. Plants seem to be doing fine, so far.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

A few more photos, for fun. 

1. Sag running down the side of the tank. Exactly how I wanted it  

2. My biggest snail (almost one inch). Please I.D. this bugger for me.

3. One of my new Rams. I bought 5; all are very small (< 1")

Fish count:

4 SAE's
4 Ottos
5 Blue Rams
8 Harlequin Rasboras
6 Espi's Rasboras
8 Cardinal Tetras
6 Amano Shrimp


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

It looks like a common pond snail to me. I like the algae growing on him, it reminds me of a Ramshorn I had awhile ago.


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## corigan (Feb 22, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> It looks like a common pond snail to me. I like the algae growing on him, it reminds me of a Ramshorn I had awhile ago.


Agreed, common pond snail. Awesome looking ram, and the sag is running quite nicely.. 

Matt


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Here's a shot after my major clipping has grown in for a week. Cut down the ambulia on the left (big time). The ambulia on the right, I tore out and replaced it with some hygro(?) that Tonyd sent me. The ludwegia is taking on a very red tone, now that it is getting close to the light. 

You can see a clump of hairgrass gone in the front left (traded to Tonyd). It's growing back in quickly, but for the time, has become the favorite hiding spot for one of my rams. There are also a couple red plants in the back that Tony traded me (the guy really set me up). One is red temple, and I don't know what the other is. Both are simply in temporary spots, until I get some nice new growth, and decide where I will want them permanently. Suggestions welcome.


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## secretagent (Mar 13, 2004)

DUDE thats sweet! Im soo awwwed at it!!!


Messyroadkil


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## rumples riot (May 29, 2003)

Looking nice

Paul


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## geodiscus (Feb 7, 2004)

Nice growth in a relative short time span.....Hows the amanos doing?Have you noticed how algae effiecient they are?


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## Tonyd (Jan 22, 2004)

Looks good, that is really growing in fast. The hairgrass looks great.

Tony


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## Hop (Mar 27, 2004)

Thats looking great. I was going to take a nice relaxing saturday, but after seeing the progress on your tank.... I got work to do


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

geodiscus said:


> Nice growth in a relative short time span.....Hows the amanos doing?Have you noticed how algae effiecient they are?


All my original amanos are alive and well. I add a smidge of Kent iodine to the tank each month (1 time so far), but I don't have any evidence that they wouldn't be ok without it. I find a couple moltings a week in the tank, so they are definitely growing/eating. I really don't know how efficient they are at eating algae because they've been in the tank since the beginning (so I have no comparison). But their guts are always green, and they molt a lot, so I assume they are chowing on the stuff.

...and, as usual, thanks for the kind words guys. It seems that my tank has better progress when I keep my grubby mits off it for a while :wink: , and just let it grow. You really need to NOT mess with hairgrass if you want it to do well. Replanting will set it back a LOT. 

Unfortunately, the red temple is starting to look pretty shabby; but the other red plant is doing well (albeit, new leaves are green).


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## SCMurphy (Oct 21, 2003)

Amano's are great at cleaning out dead hairgrass too. I had some hairgrass that I trimmed down to encourage spreading and after it did a lot of the original plant died back. I watched the amano's go in there and clean out the old plant matter. They even sifted the 'bare' sand at the front of the tank and cleaned up the detritus that had gathered there.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Kind of in a 'transitional phase' right now. Removed most of the wisteria from the right side of the tank. The old growth was looking shabby. Also ripped out a big chunk of pearlgrass up front. I'm trying to get rid of the "this side, that side" look by angling the contact between the hairgrass and the pearlgrass. Besides, I like hairgrass more .

I'm happy that the Red Temple has recovered and is now starting to grow. Hey Tony, what is that plant you traded me - on the left (looks like ludwigia with small leaves).?

My rams have bred a couple times now, and both times the eggs have hatched, but the babies soon vanished. So when they lay again, I plan to let them take care of them for the first two days, then remove them. I'll put em in a breeder net with some javamoss.


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## Tonyd (Jan 22, 2004)

I thought it was ludwigia. Tank looks great.

Tony


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## secretagent (Mar 13, 2004)

WHat was the specs again? I really Like how the plant in the back drifts Forward!!! VERY COOL! Also I like the ram, Im not that fimillier with them. How big do they get? How big of a tank do they need? are they agressive?


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## pixelcrayon (Mar 24, 2004)

looks great!!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I added two of these last week, but hadn't seen them until today. This one found the spraybar, and seems very content to stay there. They are very pretty and entertaining.


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## peejlitos (Mar 19, 2004)

unirdna said:


> I added two of these last week, but hadn't seen them until today. This one found the spraybar, and seems very content to stay there. They are very pretty and entertaining.


hi...just reading ur post and wanna know....how are those wood shrimp...do they get big and do they get along with ur fish and other shrimps...??cool tank..


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Hello peejlitos,
They do get pretty big, as far as shrimp go. My two are medium sized, a little over 2 inches. But I've seen them at the pet store over 3 inches. They get along with my fish and amanos just fine. They don't swim around as much as my amanos, but when they do, it's quite an event. They close up their feather-legs, point them forward, and let er rip. Everyone gets out of the way .


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

A few new developments.

First, the rams are breeding again. I don't know how all those eggs come out of the little females :? . I'm going to let the parents guard/fan the eggs for two days, and then I will put them in a fry net with some java moss.

Second, I have added a discus to the tank (which brings me to the end of my fish additions). I have always wanted a discus, but never had the water parameters to keep one (thank you RO unit). He's turquois - classic - my favorite. The LFS gave me a great deal on him because he was being harrassed by two other discus in the display tank (which had paired off). He figured that they would eventually kill this guy, so he sold him to me. He's been in the tank for a few days now, and is doing quite well. He ate bloodworms right away.

Third, my Apodomogeton crispus has sent a flower to the surface. Well, it's a bud right now. It looks like a small, green pinecone. I can't wait to see what it does. I'll post photos if it blooms/opens.


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## nornicle (Dec 29, 2003)

fantastic work!! I really like how the tank is looking! i hope the grass doesn't over grow..

its looking very jungly !!


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## pixelcrayon (Mar 24, 2004)

your tank looks very healthy. so lush. and the discus looks amazing in youre tank set up. but i think its calling for some more discus now!! great job!!


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## katymay (Feb 2, 2004)

wow. what a gorgeous tank! I don't know if you're looking for aquascaping suggestions, but if you are I would say that perhaps you may want to add some medium sized plants to make a smoother transition from short to long. Regardless, it's gorgeous.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

katymay said:


> I would say that perhaps you may want to add some medium sized plants to make a smoother transition from short to long.


I agree, Katymay. I used to have the ludwegia as the middle ground plant, with ambulia and cabomba in the back. In time the ludwegia reached the top, and I realized that I like it much more as a background plant than the ambulia. I removed all the ambulia and most of the cabomba and have 'pushed' the ludwegia to the back of the tank. And now I'm on the lookout for new middle ground plants. I originally planned on using the red temple and that thin-leaved ludwegia (on the right side of the tank), but now I've changed my mind, since I don't think red-on-red is the look I want. Better to leave that red temple where it is. When it grows up, its contrast should look very nice among the vals and java fern.

So, I guess what I am saying :roll: :lol: is, "give me some suggestions". Middle-ground plants? Are there any that won't grow 20 inches?


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Nice job. I can't believe how quickly your environment ramped up. Really amazing. 

I noticed you have both Harlequins and Cardinals, and that both appear to school independently of the other. Is that the case most often?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

John P. said:


> I noticed you have both Harlequins and Cardinals, and that both appear to school independently of the other. Is that the case most often?


In my tank, this is the case. I think that they stick to their own because they are very different fish (different Families for starters). In a small bare tank (LFS), they seem to have similar behaviors, but give them a planted tank and their true personalities come out. Among other difference, the rasboras prefer wide open water, where the cardinals hug some veg almost always. The two schools will occasionally cross over one another, yet the two fishes don't even seem to acknowledge each other. This isn't to say that harlequins or cardinals won't school with other fish. Actually, I removed other Rasbora (espeis) and Tetra (neons) species from the tank because they 'loosely' schooled together. I prefer all or nothing.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

What's nicer than going on vacation? Coming home and seeing your tank has grown like a weed! Nitrate was down to zilch.

Tank specs have changed a bit since I started the tank; here are some updates.

Temp: 81F
pH: 6.6-6.8
KH: 3 dh
GH: 3 dh
Nitrates: 5-10ppm (add KNO3 2X a week)
Potassium: Only source added is with KNO3
Phosphates: Don't test / Don't add
Traces: Cap of Flourish once a week
Fish: 8 Harlequins, 8 Cardinals, 8 Amanos, 4 Rams, 4 Ottos, 1 Discus, 1 Wood shrimp


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## chrisl (May 6, 2004)

That's very nice Unirdma! Amazing still growth on the floor despite the large top canopy coverage! 

btw, how do you keep that mound of substrate in place in the front right? I like that effect alot...brings you more into the scene imo.

Chris


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

chrisl said:


> btw, how do you keep that mound of substrate in place in the front right? I like that effect alot...brings you more into the scene imo.
> Chris


That isn't a mound of gravel, it's a heavily-shadowed area. That pearlgrass is a heck of a light-stopper. I'm currently cutting the grass back. It used to be pressed up against the glass on more than 1/2 the tank. The work-in-progress involves removing 2 inches of the pearl grass and allowing the hairgrass to make its way into that area. This should create a nicer effect, seen in the middle portion of the tank.

Here's a photo I took at the same time as the first, except I used the flash. The flash bleeds out the colors and leaves a glare spot, but you can get a better view of the dark spots.


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Your tank looks sweet UniDude...
I feel like I been fragged.... 









roud:


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## Stranger (Dec 2, 2003)

There is no doubt that's a beautiful tank. Great job!

Is there a reason for the lone discus? I hate to see them by themselves like that.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Stranger said:


> Is there a reason for the lone discus? I hate to see them by themselves like that.


Yeah, there's a reason. Because of my fish load, I would not be comfortable having more than two discus. And all attempts to find this one a friend have failed. He's a real butthead. But he was here first, so I can't kick him out. He seems quite content being single.


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## chrisl (May 6, 2004)

I see it now...that is ALOT of pearlgrass! And i agree w/ you, the hairgrass in front of the pg will look better.

I have an onion plant w/ similar leafs to the val. there. I was thinking of cutting them even w/ top of water to incr. light...not sure it'll look right though.


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

Your tank looks amazing. I'd love to have such a lush lawn as that. How did you start it off? (all the earlier pics are gone :icon_frow ). 

I just picked up a few bundles of hairgrass for my new 20g, and I'm wondering whether I should plant it in a few clumps and let it spread out, or try to spread it out as much as I can.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Ted... it's unbelievable to see the transformation from your 30 gal java ferned wood beginnings to this beauty. 

You have great talent roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Wasserpest said:


> Ted... it's unbelievable to see the transformation from your 30 gal java ferned wood beginnings to this beauty.
> 
> You have great talent roud:


Thanks Wasser. But the talent is all over this forum. I just did what I was told . Still, I appreciate the compliment.



amanda said:


> Your tank looks amazing. I'd love to have such a lush lawn as that. How did you start it off? (all the earlier pics are gone :icon_frow ).


I found the old photos in my internet temp files. Here ya go.


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

Wow. It's amazing how much growth you've had in such a short time. You're obviously doing something right! Thanks for digging those pics out for me.

Love that pearlgrass. Do you mind if I just copy what you've done? :tongue:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Absolutely not . It's the greatest form of flattery.


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## colleen (Jun 6, 2004)

Thanks so much for posting the older photos. I have been reading other journals and wondering about how fast to expect things to move along, but without the older photos all I get to see are the later or last shots. 

Let me officially say WOW. Great job. 

Are your growth rates AVERAGE? It seems to have come about in an astonishingly short period of time. For me that is,sitting in front of the comp not doing the work of water changes or grooming etc :wink: But for you it is obviously a labor of love.

thanks again


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Hello Colleen,

I wouldn't say that my growth rates are average because I don't have average tank specs. Lighting is on the high end (~200 watts) and the tank is supplemented with pressurized CO2. This did create a 'labor of love' for the first month, as I had a heluva time with staghorn algae. Also, those stems (cabomba/ambulia) that were originally in the back-right had to go. I did not have the patience to deal with their growth rates.

Now the tank is pretty low maintanence. I give it a trim every couple of weeks, dose NO3 once a week, and do a 20% water change every weekend. Not much more work than my non-planted tanks.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Updated Photo*

Looks to be time for a trimming  , but I just don't have the heart to take an axe to it yet. The tank is looking downright 'dark' (despite 4.2 wpg) because of all the light being absorbed in top layers. I thought the hairgrass might start to suffer, but it is doing anything but.... In fact, that stuff creeps into even the darkest spots of the tank (in the back, under the vals).

Anyway...here's the updated photo. I think my little discus may have even grown a bit since the last photo.


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

Beautiful, Unirdna. I think yours is my favourite tank here!


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## Hop (Mar 27, 2004)

Personally I like it the way that it is, however, I don't think that a selective trim would hurt the appearance though!


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

That looks fantastic...can you submit for any contests? You really should!! roud:


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

Hey... this tank is BEAUTIFUL! It's up there in the top 20, maybe even top 10 on my list of "seen." Keep up the good work, and keep posting 

--cich


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Looks superb. Great work.

Where did you obtain the hairgrass? Online? Locally?

I love how the Cardinals and the Harlequins stay in their own schools. Having the predator discuss in there probably helps!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

John P. said:


> Where did you obtain the hairgrass? Online? Locally?
> 
> I love how the Cardinals and the Harlequins stay in their own schools. Having the predator discuss in there probably helps!


I bought the hairgrass locally. It cost $4 a pot - I bought 2 pots. I think it was grown emersed because it had a non-aquatic moss growing on it and all of the original grass died off after a month. This created a hoooorrible mess when the staghorn algae targeted the dying grass. But - when the dust cleared all was well.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

....and here's a photo of the 'dark days' of the tank .


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

Eeeewww. You're not kidding the hairgrass was a mess!

Hey, you gonna enter the new AGA contest?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I've been thinkin about it. I just saw the new post by tsunami in the general section. I've only been at this 'planted tank' stuff for a few months. Seems a bit ambitious to try to run with the big boys so soon . Still, for only 5 bones, might as well put my name in the hat...:hihi: .


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

Heh. That's funny. In _my_ mind, you _are_ one of the big boys. roud:


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

unirdna said:


> ....and here's a photo of the 'dark days' of the tank .


Dayum, that IS ugly! Glad it's past!


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## Geo (May 30, 2003)

What LFS do you use, Uni? I'm also in Madison and I tend to hover around Aquatic Specialties over on University Ave.

Always looking for other good LFSs in the area


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Geo said:


> What LFS do you use, Uni? I'm also in Madison and I tend to hover around Aquatic Specialties over on University Ave.
> 
> Always looking for other good LFSs in the area


Hi Geo,

I spend most of my time at Aquatic Specialties too. All the fish (and shrimp) you see in my tank came from that store; as well as the pearlgrass and sag. A few of the other plants (including the hairgrass) came from one of the many 'superstores' in the area. Petworld....Petsmart....Smartworld....etc....etc.... The redtemple and hygro came from "Tonyd", a member on the forum.

edit: I take that back. My 8 cardinals came from that 'mom-n-pop' store on Sherman Drive. Noah Ark, is it called??? Aquatic Spec wants too much ($4) for cardinals. That other store sells em for $2. They have other cool stuff too (like Altum angels), but do not specialize in planted tanks. It's a miracle we even have one 'planted' store in the area with our 20-30 dH, 8.5-9.5 pH tap water. No coincidence that there are so many African Cichlids for sale in the area.


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## tommyboy22481 (Mar 24, 2004)

Tank looks great, I'll have to check out the store on Sherman drive, I thought I had found all the stores in Madison. What do you do with your water, use it as is or soften it with R/O?

If we find a couple more people in Madison we might have enough for a club or something. MadPlanters maybe? I know, I'll start a thread after the Eheim pimps, Hydor 'hos, and the Fluval Hoes.  (Jeesh, this is starting to sound like gangs of plantedtank.)


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*new angles*

I was browsing through other photo threads and saw that some folks post multiple angle-shots. Realizing how much better this allowed me to appreciate their work, I thought I would follow suit.

So, I gave the tank a much-needed pruning (it's first in more than a month :icon_roll ), and took a few shots right before the lights went out. The bowfrontedness warps things a bit, but I think that these shots will help to remove the two-dimensionalism of the tank. 

As always, comments/suggestions are appreciated :icon_bigg .


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## Geo (May 30, 2003)

I am so glad you posted this because I totally forgot I asked you before about the other places in Madison!!! 

The tank looks BEAUTIFUL, I love it. Bowfronts definatly warp things a bit, and it seems one either loves it or hates it. I've noticed it's really hard to get a 3d picture of my 7 gallon as well, perhaps this is due to the bow.

Noah's Ark is a great place, (I used to live in Cherokee on the North side of town, now I live a block from the Zoo) and the guy who owns it is real nice. I should go check them out some more, perhaps they might have some more of the harder-to-find gourami species I am looking to complete my 7 gallon with.

I also have a RO system installed in my house, (tastes so much better than our faucet water ... ) so I use that for aquariums as well. However it limits me to small water changes (3 gallon tank) so that's why all my tanks are nano as of now. I use RO right to harden up the water a bit, and right now I like how things are with a KH of 5 and hardness ... somewhere near there as well. Great for the plants 

I've always wanted to do a cichlid tank before ... mb I should get that together!

MadPlanters, eh? I'm in.


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## corigan (Feb 22, 2004)

Beautiful as always Uni. I always like how healthy all your plants look.  Thanks for the multi-angle shots, that last one shows a happy ram peaking out of the background.

Matt


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*ch ch ch ch changes*

So we all must do it at some point in time....this was my first. Things were getting waaayy too dark, and I could take it no longer. Yesterday, I broke out the chainsaw and went to work. 

1. Removed almost all of the leafy red stuff (too lazy to learn the name) on the far left.

2. Moved the red temple from center-tank to the far left.

3. Hacked the bajeezuz out of the hygro.

4. Removed the wisteria

5. Trimmed back the Red Ludwigia (on the right).

My initial response was, "what have I done?". But, from similar posts on the forum (specifically momo's journal), I expected this. It's been 24 hours, and I think I'm happy with my decision. 

I can see my fish again!!!

ps. I'm considering removing all the vals and sag.....any comments?


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Looks great! I think it would work if you were to remove the sag and vals. If you do that I would move the alteranthera to the left edge next to the java fern.

Send me some of that hairgrass. :icon_bigg


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## Rosko_22 (May 19, 2004)

First off, great looking tank! roud: Plants look fantastic, especially love the rams too.



> ps. I'm considering removing all the vals and sag.....any comments?


Are you thinking of leaving the left side bare? (other than the temple) Or replacing the vals and sag with something else?

I think it would be hard to make that tank look "bad" regardless of what you do to it. I think it would look cool with the left bare, fish would probably like all that swimming space too.


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## chrisl (May 6, 2004)

I like it too, but i too perhaps would just use the val as a single plant and perhaps put something green and more bushlike on the left to give the A. Rein a background too...

Still learning myself though lol
Chris


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Well, it's that time of the month again -- photo time, that is.

If you think it looks overgrown now, you should have seen it last week. Pruned er down and got 30 bucks store credit for all the plants. I used to be impatient for plants to grow; now I wish they would slow down a bit .

I'm lucky to have a local store that will give me something for my clippings. It beats throwing them in the backyard. They are especially fond of pearl grass clumps. Seems that this stuff doesn't ship too well, so they can only get it from local chumps like me. I used some credit last week and picked up 8 feather-fin rainbows (http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/...in Rainbow&productvariantid=1832&TopCatId=886)
to round off the top water in my tank. They are a pretty durable fish for as delicate as they look. They have a cousin in Wisconsin lakes/rivers called the Brook Silverside, and they are the woosiest fish on earth. 

Blah blah blah - here's the tank.


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

Wonderful!

Is that Aponogeton crispus in the midground? It looks really great there. If only it would stay that small! :icon_frow 

I like the vals, but I think eventually replacing them with some Cypreus helferi would be neat. C. helferi has become my favorite "grassy" plant as of late!

Mike


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Awesome tank bro - very well done roud:


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

One of my favorites around here. Such a nice job!

Are the Cardinals still in there?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks for the comments and suggestions. Cyperus helferi is a great looking grassy plants. I definitely will look into this stuff. It's finer than the clunky vals, and seems like it would 'soften' the tank. Any ideas where I can order some, Mike? And yeah, that's a crispus front and center. But it hasn't grown out of control or shot up any 'stemmy' leaves in the 6 months it's been in there. Hope my luck holds .

John, the cardinals are still in there, alright. They had just been fed, and like to retreat back into the vals after Thanksgiving feast. They're front and center all day long, and are just about full-grown now.

Fish inhabitants:
8 Cardinals
8 Rasbora Heteros
8 Feather-fin Rainbows
4 Otos
10-20 Amano Shrimp
4 Blue Rams (2 breeding pair)
1 Discus


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## randomrambler (Jun 24, 2004)

wow that is a cool looking discus! can we get a side pic? your fish look really healthy and happy. good job!


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

I would like to see a full shot of the tank. Nice close up pictures


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Random,
Here's a shot for ya. I don't think my discus is anything special. Just a run-o-the-mill turquoise, I believe. He does change color a lot though. Depends on whether or not the rams are pissing him off.

Puffer,
If you click on the "46" of my signature, there is a link to a full tank shot. Or did you mean, the tank, stand, room surrounding, etc.? If that's the case, I'd be better off waiting until tomorrow (daylight) to take a photo.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I got sick of the reds, and wanted to open things up a bit, and give my fern a little room to stretch out. Took out the scissors and started cutting...and cutting....I couldn't stop!! Might have taken a bit too much off the top :icon_roll, oh well, it grows back (and I got $30 store credit for the clippings at the LFS - they pay nicely for pearlgrass). 

....I do like the all green thing. Nice change of pace - inspired by Snake's Journal .


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

I like it without the reds as well Uni... the hairgrass is as beautiful as ever! I have 2 questions... Is that Discus what they call a 'Candy Apple' ? and How in the world did you stunt the growth of the Apono ? I love those plants but they always grew to fast and tall for me...do you just cut leaves when they get too tall ?

Lookin great bro... roud:


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## Kimbo (Oct 30, 2004)

looks excellent!!!!! jeez i need more tanks


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## fishlady (Jan 12, 2004)

Very nice, beautiful. And I love the discus....I have a question. I emailed a breeder of discus in Florida inquiring about Co2 (I do NOT inject it) and it was recommended I do NOT use it with discus. Do you know why or see a problem with it?? Thanks...again, nice job! roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Buck,
Mike (Momotaro) has been saying the same thing, that I should expect that apon to grow out of control...but it just isn't. I planted it right in the middle of the hairgrass, and I think that is the cause of it's stunted growth. That hairgrass is now so thick that I can not plant anywhere on the left side of the tank (without ripping a chunk out). When the apon tries to add girth, it is stopped by this wall of grass....just a guess :icon_conf . Or maybe it is root related. I don't give it any gravel ferts, and maybe the hairgrass is sponging away too much of the good stuff. Whatever the reason, I can tell you that I have never pruned the leaves in any way. 

Glad you like the all green look, too. I was so busy trying to make my tank "AGA" style that I never bothered to ask myself what I liked best - and that is the "wild" look. AGA's are beautiful and very artistic, but I'm a biologist and freediver, and I simply want a 'slice' of a lake bottom to look at . BTW, I thank you for your advice re: the 'drain' flowering can have on apons (posted months ago, on a thread I can not remember). I was enjoying all the flowers, while at the same time lamenting about the condition of the leaves. I now pluck off the flower stem as soon as it reaches the surface.

* oh yeah, the discus variety... I have no idea what he is. He is called "inexpensive discus" . He came in with a LFS shipment of turquoise and snakeskins, and was kicking the crap out of everyone in his tank. In Madison, we NEED to use RO water if we intend to keep discus, and the LFS did not want to set up a whole other tank for one fish, so they sold him to me for $20. Couldn't pass it up. Since then, I have been trying to find out what kind he his, but never see a match on any online shops. Thanks for the guess; I'll run a search on this Candyapple variety you speak of.

Fishlady,
I've never come across any info saying that you should not use CO2. I have come across many many sites, however, saying that "for best results" discus should always be kept in a bare-bottom tank, get water changes every day, be displayed as boring as possible , etc etc. So, it seems reasonable that CO2 would not be used, IF you were following the other guidelines. *Incidently, I also break another of the "Discus" rules. I only keep one. But that is not because I am cruel - He is. I've offered him company on several occasions. He is not a very nice host.

Ted


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

unirdna said:


> ....I do like the all green thing. Nice change of pace - inspired by Snake's Journal .


That is probably the highest compliment anyone has ever said/done - I'm speachless. :icon_mrgr 

Your execution of the theme makes mine pale in comparision Ted - love the look you created. roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Yeah, except now you have red in your tank Mark. You're a defector! :tongue:


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## enchanted (Sep 23, 2004)

Very well done. You know, a lot of people say Discus should be kept in a bare bottom tank. I can't state off facts yet, because I haven't had any, but I just don't agree with that personally. They don't live barebottom in the wild so why do we need to keep them barebottom is my perspective. 

Some great shots you have here.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Mark, 

You are too modest . You're tank has come the furthest in the shortest amount of time than any other journals....even Momos :icon_eek: :hihi: 


Bob,

My reds will eventually grow back, too. I just hacked em down to the nub. I don't fully remove any stems anymore because the hairgrass would quickly take up the real estate, and then it'd be a royal PIA to plant new ones . I'll post another shot in a week or two....you'll see.

Nice site, BTW. I am hugely digging the "plant island" aquarium. roud: 

Ted


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Yeah, except now you have red in your tank Mark. You're a defector! :tongue:


Ah..... sorry to say this, but the red plant is melting away :icon_cry: . I'm afraid I don't have enought lighting to keep red plants looking vibrant & healthy right now - but I do have plans on changing that. :wink: 



unirdna said:


> You're tank has come the furthest in the shortest amount of time than any other journals....


I was just lucky enough to have a LFS that carries some good plant specimens... but I do very much apprichiate the compliment. roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*10 days of growth*

Look back to the previous page to see what 10 days of uncheck hygro growth looks like . Ridiculously fast plant. Also am getting a bit of bg algae on the lower-left glass. Now, through March, the sun hits that corner of the tank for 4+ hours each day. Ludwegia and Red Temple are starting to peak out again. 

Needs pruning :icon_roll ...


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Looking good Ted. That hygro is a fast grower. You should replace it with something more manageable like stargrass.... :wink: 

I haven't touched my site in months. But thanks for the compliment


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

I actually dig that overgrown look. Just need to do some pruning so that the fish can swim to the other side, instead of being trapped on the left side. :bounce:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Reconstruction / Relocation*

First off, my discus has left; he is now in a 100 gal tank with 4 other of his kind. I'm sure he will be happier in his new home. I just hope he behaves himself  . The rams are already much more relaxed without having to worry about being tormented every time they come out from their hiding spots.

Second, I am thinking (....just thinking) about getting a pair of altums. I'm not really keen on the whole caught-from-the-wild-so-you-need-to-first-get-rid-of-their-parasites 'thing', but they sure are purdy . Whether I get them or not, I've decided that the tank needs more open space. The pearlgrass heap had to be cut back, and hairgrass planted in its place. Got 12 bones at the LFS for the pearlgrass roud: . It's been a while since I watched hairgrass overtake a section of gravel. I love it!

Before (but after a huge clipping last week) cutting the pearlgrass:










...and after the destruction. We all love this image :icon_roll .










...and finally, a couple hours later. Eventually, I think I'll get rid of all red in the tank. Amano is a very influential guy.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Fish Load*

Two batches of angel fry, and $400 store credit later, my tank is suffering. Not health, but asthetics. The plants are great....but the dreaded staghorn has returned. Surprisingly, the nitrates are held in check - but the phosphates... :icon_roll . The rest of this second batch of angels (there are about 80 in the tank, yet) will be gone in week or so. I can't get them to the pet store fast enough - they sell so quickly. The owner refers to my deliveries as "bags of gold".

Since the angel parents got ich (currently under treatment - stable, but not out of the woods yet) thanks to my stupidity, the tank will get a much needed recovery period. Water changes and time will shake off the staghorn. 

I'll also need to give that java fern a hacking. The older leaves are starting to show their age. Buck (and other java gurus), if you got your ears on, could you tell me how you go about this. Do you trim the stalk, or can you simply trim the leaves - will new leaves grow from the same old stalk?


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Wow, sounds like you've had a lot to contend with. I hope you get it all back to 100% soon.


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

You really are sitting on a pot of gold with those angels! How are the rams doing? The tank looks good too! roud: 

As far as the Java fern, I just clip my leaves since my rhizomes are so stuck to my driftwood so well. New leaves will pop out of the rhizome.


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

Great tank, it's good to hear the Discus finally has some playmates. Wow you made $400 on 80 Angel fry?! I think I better start going into the breeding business...:wink:


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Wow, that's a lot of angels. The tank looks nice as well. Good luck on selling all the fry, it was well worth the spawning and time for an extra $400 to replace the equipment that you bought.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

I'm a little saddened by the disappearence of the micranthemoides-- but good luck with all the projects! Keep us updated.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks for the comments, folks.

Raul,

I not making THAT kind of profit . I made $500-600 store credit on 300+ angel fry (two spawns). With that credit, I'm setting up a 30 gal planted in my bedroom. This tank will be exclusively for raising angels (with a small cleaner crew). Journal will be coming soon. 

Thanks Mup,

Once I'm done acquiring toys, the store has agreed to give me cash (albeit, less per fish than store credit). I get to feel good about selling them as well. The LFS sells all the angels out of their 150g planted display tank. Maybe they don't all make it to the nicest homes, but while they are waiting, they live in luxury.

GreenMF,

The pearl grass is not all gone, just cut waaaay back. Even now, as I type, it is gathering it's minions and will once again rise to power . 

Ted


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

lol-- evil, evil little plant-- so pretty though. :wink:


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## Momotaro (Feb 21, 2003)

> I'm a little saddened by the disappearence of the micranthemoides





> evil little plant


It is! Tough little plant to control sometimes. It looks so beautiful but gets out of hand in the blink of an eye!

You cut it back hard Uni, or do you trim and replant?

Mike


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

It grows very slowly in my hard water. I liked the fast growth I used to have in softer water. Now it takes months to form anything resembling a hedge.

Tank looks great BTW.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

I've got soft water-- pearlweed . . . is a weed . . . It has covered the surface and swamped underwater of a 1.5g tank with only 7watts of pc lighting and no co2. In my 10g, I have to trim . . . too often . . .


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Momotaro said:


> You cut it back hard Uni, or do you trim and replant?
> Mike


Nope, just hack er down - always comes back. I have nothing against the replant method. If you like to keep your tank photogenic, it's the way to go. But I prefer to leave the roots intact and just start over. I also have an LFS that give me solid store credit for pearlweed (I guess it's hard to ship), so I give the good, top stuff.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Day or Night*

Now that I have my stove installed, you can't tear me away from this room.

During the day, the sun beams through the overhead skylights and eventually makes its way to the left half of the tank. It literally explodes with bubbles .

But at night....oh soo relaxing.

Which do you prefer?

Ted


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

Sweet, I like's them both 
I have my tank in my pc room along with my fireplace, I live in this room...
So I know how you feel Ted roud:


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## Hop (Mar 27, 2004)

Wow, great room. I think night... It pulls you into the two most important and relaxing things, fireplace and planted tank. Tank looks fantastic as well!


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## SueNH (Feb 25, 2004)

I used to have the same stove. You aren't afraid it will heat the tank up too much? That stove used to knock me right out of the room at times.

My tank and computer and woodstove are in the same room. Tried to convince my husband to turn the stove so i could see the fire from my little tank corner but I got the blank stare of total disbelief so left it alone for now.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

I think I like it better at night...

Great tank!roud:


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

i like tanks better at night... less light interfering with the tank. Also, plants seem greener when its dark :tongue:


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

I like the daytime photo, how long does the sun hit the tank for? the natural sunlight looks good.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

Nice!! What's the green stem plant on right? Some sort of egeria sp.?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

greenmiddlefinger said:


> Nice!! What's the green stem plant on right? Some sort of egeria sp.?


I dont know what the heck that stuff is. It just showed up a few months ago - I never bought it. It looked pretty cool, so I let it go... and now I l-o-v-e- it. Creates some canopy, but still allows enough light to get to the hairgrass below it. This results in my hairgrass growing at two different heights - giving the tank more dimension. The grass actually grows along the entire front of the tank, but that out-of-control :icon_roll java casts a shadow. 

Anyone have a guess at what that plant is? Looks a bit like elodea, but has better color and roots and leaves .


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## observant_imp (Jun 30, 2004)

It looks kinda like egeria najans.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

No idea what kind of plant it is.. but it does look nice. roud:


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## FMZ (Jul 13, 2004)

Very nice looking tank, what kind of hair grass is it in the front?? It has taken over the whole tank


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

FMZ said:


> Very nice looking tank, what kind of hair grass is it in the front?? It has taken over the whole tank


I don't know the exact Latin name - but it looked like this when I bought it, and it was purchased at Petco. It was obviously grown emersed because it has terrestrial moss growing on it, and it underwent a huge die-off in the first few weeks.

And you are right, it is taking over the tank. You see that Apon (crinkle-leafed plant on the left side)? It is suppose to take over a tank. And look how the vals fell off over the months. I did not make those changes - the hairgrass made them. Strange that a carpet plant can smother canopy plants - usually the other way around, right?


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Looks like Eleocharis Acicularis to me ... "Dwarf Hairgrass."


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

Its looking great. I liked the middle pic the best though. I think the anacharis is a bit spaced out...maybe bunching it up closer?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Georgiadawgger said:


> Its looking great. I liked the middle pic the best though. I think the anacharis is a bit spaced out...maybe bunching it up closer?


 :icon_bigg I completely understand what you're saying, and here's where we reach an impass. It's a question of what you want out of your aquascape... I like it wild - the wilder the better. I even like the look of old, dying leaves :icon_redf . The middle photo was taken a few months into my "plant" days. I was never happy with it no matter how much I pruned and replanted. Then, I went on a 3-week vacation. When I got back my tank was an overgrown disaster....and I loved it  . Since then, I've approached aquascaping from a different (lazy hehe) perspective.

Glad you enjoyed the photo, though .


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## Wö£fëñxXx (Dec 2, 2003)

I like the wild look also, my problem is I can't keep my stinking hands out of the tank long enough to let that happen though.... :icon_roll


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

Wö£fëñxXx said:


> I like the wild look also, my problem is I can't keep my stinking hands out of the tank long enough to let that happen though.... :icon_roll


My problem too  Applying for jobs and more jobs split with working on getting my dissertation chapters published gives me plenty of time to get wrinkled fingers...


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

I like the updated shot much more, and applaud the choice to break up the uniformity in the composition. Mixing the stem plants on the right definitely lends a more natural-esque appearence, and allows the plants to balance and contrast each other with better flow that would be disrupted by "bunching" them. The nice dip of the hair grass is cool too.

While the "wild" look is definitely nicer (in my book) I still cannot agree with randomly floating micranthemum stems, and leaving the ratty brown java leaves alone. :hihi: 

lol, then again, lazy . . .


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

How about some updates Ted?


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

i second that.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Oh, Okay then *

Here's a whole tanks shot. The right side was getting too dark, so I hacked out a bunch and planted it in the tank at work. I am always amazed at how skewed my interpretation of a head-on photo can be, so I took a few more photos to help give a more complete perspective.










One thing that is hard to grasp is the size of that Java fern. It is a monster, and effective divides the tank in two. Here are right and left side photos.

(right)









(left)









...and remember when I said that pearl grass would make a comeback? Well, it's on the move up front...










....and even sneaking around the back, left side; making its way into the java










The vals, seemingly stalled over the past few months have made a curious move - out into the hairgrass.









And try this one on for size ... Around the right corner, microsword shows up. Nice, and I like it - but, I never planted microsword in this tank. Additionally, I haven't added any new plants in 6+ months.










Finally, I have replaced the male ram with a new one. This guy was always my favorite, but, unfortunately became the omega odd-man-out when the two females originally paired up. So, he's been in a 15 gal by himself for over a year. With the pair failing to produce any viable fry in their last 3 attempts, I decided to let this "banished" male have a go. He's actually larger and more colorful than the other males; I can't figure out why he got his butt beat. Check out the length on that 4th dorsal ray .


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

damn! you need to give that beast a working. roud: I think If you moved the javas to the right a bit more, it would balance out the tank a bit better. I love the hairgrass; I hope mine becomes as nice as yours; I bought it the same way you did, from petsmart.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

After a full year of NEVER trimming the java fern, it finally got its first haircut. Those giant vals may need some discipline soon, as well. They are really taking the battle to my hairgrass. And check out those three rasboras on the left - synchonized swimming.










Something for the takers at aquabid


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Very nice!

lol @ the rasboras..


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

uni, i see in your past pictures that your java ferns were browning a bit... how often and how severely does that happen to you? Is it a disease that can be spread, or does it just happen to certain leaves and not to others... Ive had it for about a week, and it's only gotten worse... Im wondering if i should trim it as well. Its been 6 months.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks said:


> uni, i see in your past pictures that your java ferns were browning a bit... how often and how severely does that happen to you? Is it a disease that can be spread, or does it just happen to certain leaves and not to others...


Old leaves just go brown...it is the way of the fern. This usually accompanies a whole lot of propagates budding off them. For most, this marks the time for pruning. Leave them, and they will eventually fall off :icon_redf .


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

well; its not only happening to the old ones, but its happening to young ones which still have translucent greenish tops and are still growing :icon_conf 
it's also happening to the babies still on adults.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

Hey Unirda- what plant is this in your picture? On the right side


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Marc,

If you're talking about the stuff in the corner, that's just good old hygro. It takes on a bit different shape/color when you continually beat it down . I hack off the vertical stuff, but let the running stems move about. This might give it the illusion of a midground plant.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Getting to be harvest time again...*

Almost time to pluck the java plantlets and yank out the pearlgrass. I'm really enjoying the tank these days because it is waay low maintanence. The hairgrass keeps most of the stem plants and vals in check. I attempted to remove some of the grass and realized that my gravel is no longer...er....gravel. It is now sod; completely surrounded and held by hairgrass roots. I could lift all the grass and 60 pounds of eco complete out of that tank in one huge carpet.

I have taken a liking to placing a stem or two of pearlgrass into the left side of the java fern and watching it grow out. Then, once it's grown to huge proportions, I rip it out and aquabid the whole wad. It grows many times faster under that intense lighting, and really does a number on nutrients. 

I've taken a couple photos using different shutter speeds. It's impossible to capture the tank as it really is, so this is the best I can do. Imagine the best of each photo .

Shutter 1/30









Shutter 1/15









Shutter 1/8 (yellows the photo a bit)









And here's one last image. Ever have trouble deciding on your foreground species. Well, neglect your pruning like I do, and you can have multiple :icon_roll. (ignore the bloodworms, rams must be saving those for later)


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Great updates Ted, i'll be interested in some java ferns if you don't aquabid it!


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

I actually like the current foreground...it has a real natural look to it. Maybe pluck out the H. micranthemoides stray stems? Very nice!


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

Georgiadawgger said:


> I actually like the current foreground...it has a real natural look to it. Maybe pluck out the H. micranthemoides stray stems? Very nice!


I agree- the mixed foreground gives it a natural feel.


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## cprroy73 (Nov 10, 2004)

Great tank I have never seen a java mass quite that big. Your hairgrass looks great.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Looks good! :icon_bigg 
I too like the foreground roud: 
The java blob needs a good hacking I think...


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

I would leave the java fern mass there.. It makes the tank.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Not much to tell other than I am currently in the process of experimenting/comparing Flourish (Gluconated) Iron vs. Kent EDTA iron. I'll have results within a week, and will post in the water param section. Preliminary results are intriguing, unfortunately there will be too many variables to truly narrow down which is better. Nevertheless, the results will be useful (especially for me).

Tank:

Vals creep there way around to the right side.
Microsword is doing well growing in the hairgrass.
Pearlgrass set up a new camp on the left side (probably a settled clipping)
Potomegeton sp. has risen from the "dead" and is back on the wagon

All-in-all, the juggernaut known as hairgrass is starting to give way to other tenacious species.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Woah :icon_eek: 
That java fern is taking over.. if it gets left it is going to engulf the whole tank.. :eek5: 
The vals are starting to get a good foot hold too.. they might kill off your hair grass.. how ironic :hihi:

And btw Ted, my ecco is being loud again :icon_roll


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

The big ol java fern mass is giving the front left of the tank a sort of eerie look...kind of like something was "cut" out of the picture since it shades the front so much (from the picture). Kind of neat. Maybe trim it down a bit? :tongue:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*What a difference!*

My PC lights are still the original ones that came with my fixture, way back when I started this journal in March, 2004. That's almost 18 months. The other day, I [finally] noticed that they were losing their punch. Just for kicks, I sought out the EXACT same bulbs (JBJ 6500K) to compare the old and the new.

These two photos were taken a week apart, but all the camera specs were identical (including the time of day/night).

Take a look. And while you're looking, check out all those bubbles in the 2nd pic . I love it!

Old bulbs










New bulbs


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

I use the same bulbs as you do, and it makes a big difference when replacing the existing bulb. Tank looks great, and thats a lot of pearling. Thats a monster java fern you have there.


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## dss2004 (Apr 1, 2005)

WOW!! I love your tank. I think it is one of the most natural looking tanks I have seen. That java fern you have going there is unreal!!! 

On the changing of bulbs. How often should a PC bulb be changed?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

dss2004 said:


> On the changing of bulbs. How often should a PC bulb be changed?


Most of what I read suggests changing them every 12-16 months. The plants in my tank were doing okay with the yellowing bulbs, but the change has obviously made them much more active. I forgot to mention, the old bulbs were very brittle and one cracked upon removing it. Luckily, I had the good sense (lucky) to have removed the hood from the top of the aquarium before swapping them out. I don't know how that bulb dust would treat a tank, and I don't want to be the one to find out.

Thanks for the nice words, as well. I'm a big fan of the natural look, myself. Easier on the pruning snips too .

Ted


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

unirdna said:


> Most of what I read suggests changing them every 12-16 months. The plants in my tank were doing okay with the yellowing bulbs, but the change has obviously made them much more active. I forgot to mention, the old bulbs were very brittle and one cracked upon removing it. Luckily, I had the good sense (lucky) to have removed the hood from the top of the aquarium before swapping them out. I don't know how that bulb dust would treat a tank, and I don't want to be the one to find out.
> 
> Thanks for the nice words, as well. I'm a big fan of the natural look, myself. Easier on the pruning snips too .
> 
> Ted



The interesting thing is I think I started a poll about a year ago asking when people swapped their bulbs out and the majority of the responders said they would run the bulbs until they ran out. I noticed a difference in light intensity, growth (pearling), etc when I swapped mine out, but oh well. :icon_conf Unfortunately I can't afford to get any new bulbs in the immediate future so maybe I should start a piggy bank. :tongue: 

As far as bulb dust...fluorescent bulbs are nasty!! Mercury is in them. Be sure you wrap them up and try to take them to the appropriate place for disposal (NOT IN YOUR TRASH CAN)...its considered hazardous (universal) waste and CAN'T go in a landfill per RCRA and NEPA. Check your county website for a place to take them, or take them to work with you and your office or company building maintenance person can store it and dispose of it for you (he/she probably has boxes of old bulbs somewhere in a haz. waste storage place).


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## timr (Mar 23, 2005)

Tank looks great, i'm always amazed when i change bulbs, just because the yellowing is so slow and you'll never notice if it's not next to new bulbs. 

On the natural look topic...Doesn't your java fern get full of waste? you wouldn't even be able to see my fern next to yours but mine was loaded after about a month and i noticed some leaves looked diseased.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Video*



timr said:


> Doesn't your java fern get full of waste? you wouldn't even be able to see my fern next to yours but mine was loaded after about a month and i noticed some leaves looked diseased.


Not sure what you mean by "waste". If you mean "collect organic mulm on the leaves", the answer is no (in part because I have 20+ amano shrimp picking away). And about the "diseased" look you mentioned. I'm guessing you are describing the blackening of leaves, and yes, this does happen from time to time. Usually when I neglect ferts for a while.

______________________________________________________


Okay, I just had to show this to you guys. Here's a link (right click "save target/link as") to a 1 minute video of my plants breathing. Even the video doesn't fully capture the amount of bubbles in the tank, but it gives a much better representation than a photo. Maybe some of you have seen this kind of activity, but, it's new to me. It feels like I just set the tank up for the first time.

The area in the video is shown in this photo


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## limey (May 10, 2005)

wow, thats a lot of pearling there. I havent seen crazy pearling like that in my tank in a long time. My bulbs are a little over a year old though. I should probably replace them soon.
nice rams by the way.


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Nice video, those rams are amazing.


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## timr (Mar 23, 2005)

unirdna said:


> Not sure what you mean by "waste". If you mean "collect organic mulm on the leaves", the answer is no (in part because I have 20+ amano shrimp picking away). And about the "diseased" look you mentioned. I'm guessing you are describing the blackening of leaves, and yes, this does happen from time to time. Usually when I neglect ferts for a while.


No, not on the leaves, down in the roots and rhizome. 

I've had pearling like that but it has been a while for me too, but i like it better without all the bubble obscuring my view.


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Hey Ted that video is awesome and the plants look beautiful...love the backdrop of Vals. Is that Apono crispus on the left fairly new or are you trimming long leaves ?? I like how its staying short !! 

Very kool tank its turned into... roud:


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## AlphaExPlus (Jun 19, 2005)

That video was great. It was kinda like a matrix of bubbles, heh. How'd you feel when you saw that? Haha . . I would love to see more!


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Woah, huge difference with the new bulbs
That pearling is amazing!roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Buck said:


> Is that Apono crispus on the left fairly new or are you trimming long leaves ?? I like how its staying short !!


Buck, it took your post for me to FINALLY realize the mistake I've been making for nearly a year. This plant is Aponogeton cripus, NOT Potamogeton crispus (curly-leafed pondweed). The two look similar, but appear to be different species. 

Now that I've cleared that up...

No, I've never touched the thing. It stays low, and goes though its phases without having to remove it from the tank or put it in the fridge. It sends up flowers (that make seeds) all the time. I have no idea if they will grow, but I'd be happy to send you some next time I "let" the plant keep a flower (I always snap off the flowering stems because they seem to exhaust the plant and impede leaf growth)

Here's a photo-history of that Apon...

Day 1, bulb planted (after spending 3 years buried in the gravel of an unused aqarium - tough little buggers)










1 month










4 months










8 months










12 months










15 months










18 months


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

I like the evolution of your tank, but I like 4 month old picture.


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

The "evolution" of that java fern monster is great!! Kind of reminds me of "Cartman" on Weightgainer 4000!! Swallowing up nitrates like its going out of style!! :tongue: 

That video is pretty neat. How did you post that? I have some random vids of my tank but those Rams are great! Fiesty male you got there--almost like he's protecting the female!!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Georgiadawgger said:


> That video is pretty neat. How did you post that? I have some random vids of my tank but those Rams are great! Fiesty male you got there--almost like he's protecting the female!!


The vid was captured with my digital camera (olympus c-5050) @ 15fps. I converted it to .wmv format using Windows Movie Maker (bundled with XP). I hosted it at my work site. The rams were gearing up to lay eggs again; that's why the male was so interested in the female. They get downright nasty where there are fry swimming around. But it's all over in a couple days (when all the fry get eaten).




Jdinh04 said:


> I like the evolution of your tank, but I like 4 month old picture.


Many like the "old" look of my tank to the "new" look. I admit that the manicured garden look has its merits... It's just not what I enjoy looking at. Plus, that old tank was a bear to prune. The newer, wilder tank is much easier on the scissors.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Took a solid look at the bottom of my tank today and noticed that the hairgrass was starting to die off in many areas because of the java's shading. Decided to stop tip-toeing and went to work on that beast.

Removed it...









Took it to the deck

Here's the front









And the back









I removed (what I thought) to be about 50-60% of the plant.









...and stuck it back in the tank. All-in-all, maybe 1/2 hour. I expected much worse. The tank is looking a bit frazzled now, but should grow back in soon.

Before:









After:









Ted


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## Safado (Jul 10, 2005)

From your 10/30/2004 post


unirdna said:


> I got sick of the reds, and wanted to open things up a bit, and *give my fern a little room to stretch out. * Took out the scissors and started cutting...and cutting....I couldn't stop!! Might have taken a bit too much off the top :icon_roll, oh well, it grows back (and I got $30 store credit for the clippings at the LFS - they pay nicely for pearlgrass).
> 
> ....I do like the all green thing. Nice change of pace - inspired by Snake's Journal .



How long did it take the fern to stretch out? I didn't notice any major clippings in between then and now. Was this a full year's growth? How did you "remove" the pieces? Did you just break off pieces of the roots? It looks like more than a 1/2 hour undertaking. The tank still looks great!


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Much better depth! Nice work.


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Wow! I agree that it looks so much better now that the ferns are trimmed, I bet those left overs are hitting over to aquabid?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Safado said:


> How long did it take the fern to stretch out? I didn't notice any major clippings in between then and now. Was this a full year's growth? How did you "remove" the pieces? Did you just break off pieces of the roots? It looks like more than a 1/2 hour undertaking. The tank still looks great!


Correct. With the exception of plucking plantlets (100's of them) off leaves, and the occasional pruning of dead leaves, there was no hard-core pruning. To prune it, I simply ripped off the lower, loose sections of the plant. In some cases, the rhizome needed to be snapped; in others it had already detached.

Thanks guys. I like it better, too. I look forward to my hairgrass carpet returning.


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## SueNH (Feb 25, 2004)

Looking at this I just got brave and pulled my java monster. Mine was the narrow leaf. It sort of swallowed one side of the tank. Swallowed the windelov and regular java. I've got a clump in a bucket now the size of a basketball with still plenty in the tank. Going to peer through the leaves and see if I can find the other javas.


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## timr (Mar 23, 2005)

John P. said:


> Much better depth! Nice work.


i agree, but it still looks as big, it really just looks like you moved it back in the tank. don't get me wrong it looks great, but it's still a monster!


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## frmrreefr (Jan 5, 2005)

Absofrickinlutly awesome thread! Seeing this tank progress over the months has been a treat! 

BTW, how did you make out with the Kent vs. Flourish experiment? Would like to know what you have to say about the 2 diff. types of iron....

GREAT JOB! Keep it up! And I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one with a mutated fern!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

frmrreefr said:


> BTW, how did you make out with the Kent vs. Flourish experiment? Would like to know what you have to say about the 2 diff. types of iron....


You can read all about that short experiment right here http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=20415

I swear that Java is much smaller (and thinner). There is all kinds of light reaching the substrate now. Yep, I said substrate, because the shade from that thing killed off all the hairgrass in its shadow. You can't see it in the photos, but there is a large open area in the middle of the tank now.


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## frmrreefr (Jan 5, 2005)

Dude, it's hairgrass! It'll come back before you know it! I've got a giant hairgrass problem now. It wants to become the dominant plant in the tank and is becoming a little annoying....want some?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Reduction*

I wanted to try a new look. As usual, it starts with one or two plants being removed, and before you know it, you are completely out of control. With the exception of a few stragglers to the left, all vals have been ripped out of this tank. Same goes for the hygro. The entire right side is now open field. I had forgotten how clear the water was :icon_roll . 

Thoughts and opinions appreciated.

Ted

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2005-09-15.jpg









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2005-09-15leftview.jpg









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2005-09-15rightview.jpg


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## bharada (Mar 5, 2004)

Ted, first of all, thank you for speaking to us from the future. Can you tell me if the 49ers beat the Eagels? :icon_lol:

Seriously though, I wish I could get hairgrass to take off for me like that. Mine just straggles along. Now the Java Fern I can relate to. I've already given away one that was the size of a basketball with another ready to be picked out of 125.  It's definitley an improvement without all the Vals in there.

So is this where the Endlers are going to be residing?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

bharada said:


> Ted, first of all, thank you for speaking to us from the future. Can you tell me if the 49ers beat the Eagels? :icon_lol:


ROFLMAO - whoops (but, now I'm going to leave it or our posts won't make any sense to someone who finds the thread a week from now :hihi: )

The endlers are in the 30g with my shrimp. I tore that tank a new one today as well. I'll have an update shortly.

- go niners (one more win and they tie last years record roud: )


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Removal of the Java Fern*

Yep, the landmark of my tank has worn out its welcome. Inspired by others on the forum, I have cut my lifeline and went for it. The java and the wood it was attached to has been removed. It will be going to aquabid as soon as I am SURE I like the tank without it.









Large View 









Larger View 

I also took this opportunity to add a bag of eco complete. When I set the tank up, the LFS only had 3 bags. I wanted 4, but would have had to wait 5-6 weeks to get the 4th bag (you wouldn't have had the patience either ). So, I set the tank up with a "thin" substrate, and have been wrestling with it ever since. 

Here's a couple views of the tank now.









Larger View 









Larger View 

Here's the java's replacement....a little anubias . I plan to slope the left side aquascape to the anubias, and leave the grass to the front and right side alone.









Larger View 

Momotaro traded me a few stems of Blyxa Japonica about a month ago. All stems immediately melted down to stubs (or died completely). I have a few stems on the comeback, and I am hopeful that I will be able to grow this plant, as I would like it to have a strong presence in the "grass field".









Larger View 

That's it. Bold move for a conservative guy like me. Tell me what you think, please.....be honest roud:


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

You have some guts to take a major step on your tank, I still have the java ferns that you gave me a while ago. Keep it up, would like to see that back fill in =)


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

AAAArrrrghhhh... I miss the ferns !!! 
*I love ferns , I love ferns , I love ferns .* 

Trim them way back and work with them ...you will rue the day you sold them. Sorry, you said be honest. :tongue: :icon_bigg 

I love ferns , I love ferns , I love ferns .
I love ferns , I love ferns , I love ferns .
I love ferns , I love ferns , I love ferns .

The hairgrass is beautiful as ever BTW... you and marcel are grass masters ! roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

I have plenty of blyxa but could use some of that hairgrass you have  Any chance you'd rip me up a small section? 

I think it looks good now that you've opened it up. However I think you will have to work on a hardscape now or the tank will seem flat. Just my opinion


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

LOL - I appreciate the candor.

Buck, I think I needed to hear this, but, mind you, the java needs to be demoted. I'm working on using a smaller piece of driftwood, and see if I can't get a bit of it back into the tank. I'm still planning on getting rid of the large mass. I may just pick a few pieces off it before I part ways.

Bob,
Agreed that the tank is in danger of looking "flat". You can't see it yet, but there is a lot of topographic relief withing that EC open area. Hopefully, growth will reflect that. I do plan on adding one more piece of wood too....but I'll need to make a trip to the LFS first. Be happy to work out a trade with you in a bit. When I suddenly increase light to the grass, it frequently undergoes a brief period of adaptation; where old growth dies off and new growth takes its place. You can see this occuring in the front of the tank. Once the grass starts to get some momentum, I'll drop you a PM.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

I think it's great you're starting a new! You've tried the ferns, now you can try who knows what!! (the choices are endless!!!)


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## timr (Mar 23, 2005)

I like it too. I think it's great that you are going to try something new. Maybe even just some moss growing some branchy wood. I dunno, you'll figure it out.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Out with the old....*

Well, the Java is as good as gone...

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?liveplantsr&1132024800

I have another one growing in my 30g, so I won't be without a fern if I go into withdrawl .

I added a new plant today; one that I hope will play a larger role in the aquascape once I get some more growth.









Large View 

The plant is Hydrotriche hottoniiflora. To me, it looks like an underwater pine tree. The look is unique and I love it.









Large View


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

That plant looks like a great choice to go with the hairgrass ! It blends in beautifully... I hope it does well for you. roud:

Your photos are always so nice.


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

Very nice...the open look is pretty sweet! Hydrotriche hottoniiflora...never seen it before and Buck's right, it blends very well with the hairgrass...looking really close at the stem and the petioles it looks similar to Pogostemon but with needle leaves (like the pine tree you mentioned). Get em growing to share  

That anubias looks so lonely


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## Fish (Sep 16, 2005)

*unirdna*

I look through all the pages from the beginning and all I can say Wow! That's the best tank I've ever seen. It's sad that the java fern has to go away :icon_frow I think it looks really good in the tank. 

I have some really dumb questions about the hairgrass :icon_redf . Is its body round like the human hair or flat like a grass? How do you feel how you touch the hairgrass in the tank? Is it as soft and flexible like a human hair or stiff? Round body is a lot stiffer than the flat one I guess. Would you mind taking a real close up picture of a hairgrass? Sorry to ask all the dumb question :icon_redf .


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

I'm with you on moving forward. I really like the new look and that plant I've never heard of. Cool  re: java, I once yanked out a java and traded it to the LFS, but kept some babies. Now I'm on my third or fourth generation as they are so easy to grow. I think change is good sometimes. Fun to try some new plants. Your tank looks great with the extra elbow room. The hair grass looks terrific! 

I'm yanking my mongo java, rotalla indica, and sunset hygro as soon as my new plants (cryps, L aromatica, maybe some E. stellata narrow, and ludwegias) show up... IF, they show up alive. :icon_roll. But I may wait till they grow in, and not do it all at once. And maybe get a backboard like you have to hide the emptiness. Your tank's looking great and very nice pictures!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*The good, the bad, and the algae.*

It's been a couple weeks since I've waged war on the hair algae in this tank. Having read much about controlling hair algae, I've decided to use the "feed the tank" method. CO2 has been increased to 60ppm. NO3 to 15ppm. PO4 to 3ppm. Micros I'm holding off, completely. 

The good thing about the algae is that very little of it is fixed to plant tissues. Only dead stalks of hairgrass serve as an attachment surface. The bulk of the algae grows in clumps; which is easily removed. In total, I've pulled about a baseball-sized clump from the tank. I've been saving it in a container so I'll know how much it was when this is all over.

The good news: The plants are healthy and growing.










Grass is growing in. I'm going to love this carpet when its completed. Hairgrass, microsword, and [hopefully] blyxa japonica. (and currently, riccia  as well - hitchhiker. You can see it below the anubias). I'm a big fan of the 'wild' look, and single-plant carpets don't do it for me.










Finally, I'm "building" a cardinal tetra school. I traded my rasboras for 6 more cardinals. The pet shop guy was amazed as the size of the rasboras; he decided to keep them in his display tank. Cardinal school currently at 13 - plan to get it to 50.

...oh yeah, and that's a java fern back in the tank. I missed it .


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## Goldfishcrazy11 (Nov 20, 2005)

*Beautiful, Just Beautiful!*

 
Man you're good at planting tanks... I remember viewing your pictures of your angelfish a while back when I wasn't a member... You have a nack for growing plants and angelfish!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Anubias Flowering*

So here I am....3 hours away from leaving for vacation with the Mrs., and what do I see - A little anubias bud. From what I've read on this forum (using the search function ), anubias flowering is quick and erratic. I have a feeling it'll all be over by the time I get back . Oh well, such is the sacrifices we must make.

Oh yeah, I've also toned the tank down to one 96w bulb instead of two - putting me a 2wpg instead of 4wpg. I've run 192w on the tank since I set it up almost two years ago, but for the first time, it just doesn't look right with both lights blazing. Too intense, and algae growth has all-but stopped since I made the change. I was worried that my ground plants would suffer, but the grasses are still creeping along nicely. Also, the tank looks much nicer with the lower light - more green and less white.


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## fluff34567 (Nov 15, 2005)

all of my dwarf anubias flowered, the bud didnt last too long as the fish ate it


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Wow, didn't know time flies by so fast. Its been 2 months since that anubias been in your tank, but it only felt like 2 weeks!


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Ted - it seems like the one time I had an anubia flower, it lasted in my tank a couple weeks. I think it only died after I accidentally snipped part of it. Hopefully, you'll still be able to enjoy it when you get back. Let us know how it does...and I hope you had a great trip!!


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## cookfromscratch (Aug 10, 2005)

That is beautiful! My experience with anubias flowering was like BSS. It lasted a long, long time. I hope you get to see it and that you have a great vaca!


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## endparenthesis (Jul 13, 2004)

My anubias' absolutely will not stop flowering... it's crazy. It's nice to know there's at least one thing I'm doing right.

I suspect maybe it has something to do with how the plant was grown... if it was used to being emmersed for a long time, once it becomes submersed it may still flower as it used to for a while. But that's just a guess.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

endparenthesis said:


> My anubias' absolutely will not stop flowering... it's crazy. It's nice to know there's at least one thing I'm doing right.
> 
> I suspect maybe it has something to do with how the plant was grown... if it was used to being emmersed for a long time, once it becomes submersed it may still flower as it used to for a while. But that's just a guess.


Ive heard that Anubias send out flowers when a change environment occurs.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks much for your responses. It was a nice return for me .

And your experience seems spot on with what is occuring. That little flower is taking its time. During my 8 day absence, the little bud has fattened up, and the stem has only grown an inch or two. 

I assume this flower is heading for the surface. Anubias doesn't have an underwater flower, right? An underwater flower would make no sense.

The low lighting (I've changed from 192w to 96w) seems to give me a bit more freedom to leave the house. In the past, running 192w, after a week of "neglect", nutrients would be depleted, the tank overgrown, and some plants starting to suffer. Everything looked ship-shape when I returned today. A bit of pruning, and here's what you have.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Anubias do flower underwater. I have one right now that has been opened up for about 9 days. :thumbsup:


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

As always Ted, the tank is looking good.
That apon is getting bigger.. 
I dont see any rams in the latest pics, where are they?
Come to think of it, I dont see them in the previous updates either..


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Lorenceo said:


> As always Ted, the tank is looking good.
> That apon is getting bigger..
> I dont see any rams in the latest pics, where are they?
> Come to think of it, I dont see them in the previous updates either..



Good observations, Lorenceo. The apon has me perplexed as well. Just when I was starting to think I did NOT actually have an Apon crispus, it starts to take off. In the 2 years I've had it, it always stayed low (albeit healthy). I have two ideas: 
1. That big ol' java fern I used to have in the tank was competing with the apon. 
2. That apon prefers less intense lighting (2wpg as opposed to 4wpg). 

I'm leaning toward #2 (but it could just as easily be neither). Comments and experience would be appreciated.

If it continues with the larger growth, it will have to go, or at least be relocated.

I haven't had any rams for months. Again, two reasons:

1. Every time they would spawn, they became nasty, terrorizing all other fishes in the tank.

2. Since I introduced cherry shrimp to the tank, I didn't want a "hunting" fish to eat the shrimplets. The only fish I have in the tank now are 8 featherfin (aka threadfin) rainbows and 13 cardinal tetras. I plan to grow my school of cardinals to 50 or so using store credit from trading angelfish. I've was forturnate to find a LFS that gets their cardinals from a breeder. They are always colorful, with no disease. It pays to ask questions.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

I think its number 2, you've had 4wpg over it since it was added, when you started using less light, its had to grow bigger to get the light it was used to before. Thats just me thinking, although it is nearly half past 4 (am) :icon_redf 
Going back through the pictures, I see the rams have been gone for a while. Silly me :icon_redf 
I love rams. My male died recently, and the female doesn't look too good now hes gone.. I need to get a replacement, but her partner of about a year is gone, and it will be hard to find a male of similar age for her. Of course, assuming she accepts it..
I'm rambling.. Think I'll go to bed.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Open*

The Anubias flower opened today. Thought some of you might like a look.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Aquascaping - this is new.*

It been tough, but I've stayed the course. Reductionism - that's what I want. Lots of open space, with a prominent collection using the golden ratio tank placement.

What?!? Yep, I've been bitten by the aquascaping bug. A precarious path to walk. But, I've become "bored" just growing weeds. I really want an experssion. But, the path is fraught with danger.

OK, enough drama . I'm making my first 'real' attempt at aquatic art. Step one: reduce my 4-5 species of fish to a single school of cardinal tetras. On a side note, once all other species of fish (even small, peaceful fish like featherfin rainbows) were removed the cardinals came out and schooled. Most say you need a large predator to make cardinals school. Having ONLY cardinals seems to be a second way to make this happen.

Step two: remove the pearlgrass and giant val that has been in the tank for nearly two years.

I really want an open grass field. It may look decent right now, but it is nowhere near where I want it. The front grass is still the most mature, as it was my foreground. And I need the back grass to be highest to give the effect I'm looking for. The substrate is tapered to about an inch higher to the back. I really hope this happens .

Since the cutting (yesterday), the tank has taken on a cloudy look. I don't know what cause this specifically, but I hope it's not a bad omen. This aquascape relies on crystal clear water; there is a lot of open space. Without good clarity, I won't get the contrast that I want.

January 8th (two days ago)









Remove giant val and a little pearlgrass









January 10th (after I sacked the tank)









Lots of growth needed









And that hazey water...:icon_roll


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## Sudi (Jun 28, 2005)

Wow,
Nice setup, and the plants are growing like crazy, I see...
Well, good luck, I'm starting my tank now, so I'm sure I'll use some of the things that you wrote about. Like nutrients 

Great Job roud:

matt


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Ted, are you feeling alright?:icon_eek: 
A quote from earlier in the thread:


unirdna said:


> Glad you like the all green look, too. I was so busy trying to make my tank "AGA" style that I never bothered to ask myself what I liked best - and that is the "wild" look. AGA's are beautiful and very artistic, but I'm a biologist and freediver, and I simply want a 'slice' of a lake bottom to look at .


Have you been looking at the ADA gallery pictures again?:hihi:

Kidding aside, it looks nice. Although I liked the pearlgrass. Wish I could get it here 
As to the cardinals and schooling, it might just be that their cover has been removed, so they stick together to feel safe. Assuming this is the case, when plants get dense again, they will go back into hiding. That is just me speculating though.
The water cloudyness might be that you removed a significant chunk of plant mass, causing a bacterial bloom and thus your cloudy water. Leave it a while, it should clear up on its own.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Lorenceo said:


> Ted, are you feeling alright?:icon_eek:
> A quote from earlier in the thread:
> 
> Have you been looking at the ADA gallery pictures again?:hihi:


You have a keen eye, Lorenceo. Ever thought about getting into law?

Truth is, I went back to the lakes to get inspiration for my tanks. And, wouldn't you know it, Amano is on to somthing... No, I don't agree with all things amano now, but I used to think his naturalscapes didn't fully represent the true diversity of nature. Turns out, the photos I captured last fall shows a lake bottom that is anything but diverse. One species almost always dominates. Nature is diverse, but in large clumps . This is when I started to rethink my ideas of what it means to have a natrual aquarium.

Here are a couple photos of inspiration. I captured them freediving (no tanks) . I find freediving more peaceful (than scuba), and so do the fish .


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## Perfectblue (Jan 11, 2006)

Your tank is really beautiful.


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## [RK] (Aug 11, 2005)

How do you hold your breath for so long? :S


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

[RK] said:


> How do you hold your breath for so long? :S


Training. Practice. Familiarity.

Here's some info from the folks in your neck of the woods.
http://www.freedive.com.au/


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*The straw that broke the camel's back...*

...CRACK!!!

The hairgrass.......

I'll be on this project ALL day :icon_roll . Update this evening...


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

Ohh I want that hairgrass! lol..What do you plan on doing with it may I ask?


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

Thats a lot of grass wow, so far on all the drawf hairgass I've gotten from online plant sellers has spread a little and then all died, then it seems everyone else's thrives and turns into that.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Ugh....still going.

I've been picking through the hairgrass; trying to save some of the really nice stuff, but it is a real pain. I'm only about 1/2 done. The hairgrass needed to come up. It was growing on top of itself and became unsightly in the front of the aquarium. 

I need to rescape this thing. When I'm done, there will be pound of hairgrass "scraps" to go around. No guarantees on the quality though. There is a lot of moss and algae in this mass as well. We'll just have to see....


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

Sounds good to me..Goodluck getting it all out mate..


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

Ok this sounds a lot like my situation. Whenever i have hairgrass in my tank(which has moss) I get the type of algae that begins with a C (I can't spell and I have to get going so i can't look it up). Honestly it seems like whenever the moss hits the substrate level+ has the slightiest bit of hair algae then you'kk get that algae in the grass badly. Is this the same as you? Only things I've found that helps is excel or hydrogen peroxide. That algae is the stuff that looks like dark dark hair algae, and when you pull it up you pull up a lot of your substrate.


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## bharada (Mar 5, 2004)

fishyboy said:


> Ok this sounds a lot like my situation. Whenever i have hairgrass in my tank(which has moss) I get the type of algae that begins with a C (I can't spell and I have to get going so i can't look it up). Honestly it seems like whenever the moss hits the substrate level+ has the slightiest bit of hair algae then you'kk get that algae in the grass badly. Is this the same as you? Only things I've found that helps is excel or hydrogen peroxide. That algae is the stuff that looks like dark dark hair algae, and when you pull it up you pull up a lot of your substrate.


I think you're referring to Cladophora. That's my personal arch enemy. Lot's of hand removal and a few (or lots of) female Amano shrimp seem to be the only thing that works at eliminating it in my tanks.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

bharada said:


> I think you're referring to Cladophora. That's my personal arch enemy. Lot's of hand removal and a few (or lots of) female Amano shrimp seem to be the only thing that works at eliminating it in my tanks.


That's the stuff - CLADOPHORA. I've read it's such a royal PIA because it's requirements are similar to plants. It has faded back considerably in this tank, but it will forever be in there now. This is why I'm considering trying a new carpet plants. I know that the hairgrass is still in the tank (even though I've removed the entire carpet), and that it will pop back up. But, I'm thinking of replanting none of it. Rather, I would use all this microsword instead. I separated it from the hairgrass. It was all in my tank. Since it has a waxy surface, that damn algae can't get a hold on it. If it did grow among the microsword (and I think it will not), it would easily slip away.

edit: And I've noticed the same re: Female Amano shrimp, Bill. They are tinted green (because their guts are full of algae), while the males are clear.


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

So you're saying mircoswords may be better off?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

fishyboy said:


> So you're saying mircoswords may be better off?



Thanks for the question. I'm going crazy planting that microsword :icon_eek: 

I'm saying that because the microsword's surface doesn't lend itself for algae attachment, it will stay cleaner than hairgrass. Hairgrass has a coarse feel to it, and "thread" algae varieties seem to prefer fixing itself to rough surfaces. Microsword feels like a bunch of tiny amazon sword plants. Because of this, I don't think the microsword will "hold" any of that darn cladophora that keeps popping up in my tank. On the other hand, bga loves smooth surfaces, so I'll hope that doesn't pop out (especially since my tank is a bit shocked right now).

edit: HOWEVER, microsword grows very slowly when compared to Eleocharis sp. This will require patience. We'll see how it goes. I'm keeping some of the best hairgrass handy incase it doesn't work out. Regardless, that mat had to come up.


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## bharada (Mar 5, 2004)

I've found that Cladophora will only attach to hard surfaces (wood, rocks, gravel). I've yet to find it attaching itself to any king of plants—although it does a bang up job getting entangled in fine/small leaf plants (HC, hairgrass, Riccia, moss, etc...)


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

bharada said:


> I've found that Cladophora will only attach to hard surfaces (wood, rocks, gravel). I've yet to find it attaching itself to any king of plants—although it does a bang up job getting entangled in fine/small leaf plants (HC, hairgrass, Riccia, moss, etc...)


Thanks for helping me clarify, Bill. The cladophora attaches to the dead pieces of hairgrass that naturally occur among the live pieces. It only takes about 5% of the hairgrass to be brown for an all-out algae infestation. Live, healthy hairgrass seems to keep the algae off. However, hairgrass naturally goes though a life cycle. It dies and is replace constantly. IME, microsword doesn't do this, so there will be no brown, dead leaves to facilitate algae attachment.

...all speculation at this stage. Time will tell. Anyone out there with a thick mat of microsword?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

bharada said:


> I've found that Cladophora will only attach to hard surfaces (wood, rocks, gravel). I've yet to find it attaching itself to any king of plants—although it does a bang up job getting entangled in fine/small leaf plants (HC, hairgrass, Riccia, moss, etc...)


Thanks for helping me clarify, Bill. The cladophora attaches to the dead pieces of hairgrass that naturally occur among the live pieces. It only takes about 5% of the hairgrass to be brown for an all-out algae infestation. Live, healthy hairgrass seems to keep the algae off. However, hairgrass naturally goes though a life cycle. It dies and is replace constantly. IME, microsword doesn't do this, so there will be no brown, dead leaves to facilitate algae attachment.

...all speculation at this stage. Time will tell. Anyone out there with a thick mat of microsword?

---------------------------------------

Planted tank's quick reply is acting up again. Need to "go advanced" to get the job done.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

And you ended up with 2 posts:tongue:
When do we get to see pics of the tank? It must look way different with all those plants gone!
My msn is open if you dont want to show pics of it to the world just yet..:icon_wink 
I get cladophora on my gravel - evil stuff. But it doesnt seem to grow on the plants or wood (the BBA has claimed the wood:icon_roll), Just the gravel. Easy to remove, but annoying because you have to take the affacted gravel with it.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

If I'm not mistaken, Cladophora is the one that some like to cultivate into mats, right?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Ugh! I am not kidding, I just finished the tank and snapped this photo. About 10 minutes before lights-out. Oh, I was screwing around on the internet and cooking dinner and such....but still, that is the longest amount of time I have ever spent on this (or any) tank. Probably 5 hours of solid work. 

...but enough of my appeal for pity :icon_roll 

Here's what I did:
- removed entire mat of hairgrass (over and under substrate)
- gravel vac'd 10 gallons of water from the tank to remove surface loam layer
- sorted out the entire "mat" by species
- Microsword
- Jave Moss
- Riccia
- Hairgrass
- Blyxa japonica (what's left of it)
- rescaped the gravel
- clipped every microsword strand into individual plants
- planted all the microsword
- planted the stems and anubias
- cleaned the canister filter (pads only)

I'm still debating what I'm going to do with the Hydrotriche and Riccia. 

Here it is. By no means a finished aquascape. Just an idea in progress. I intend to grow the middle island to at least 50% larger, and might introduce riccia to the foreground.

Now I wait.....and hope algae stays away .

Before (Jan 10th):










After (Jan 16th):


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Wow. Looks awesome. :thumbsup: 
Those words probably dont seem adequate after all the time and effort you have spent on the tank today, But I mean it. It looks nice. 
Add some cool looking rocks and it could pass for an Amano tank. roud:
The microsword is a nice change to the hairgrass, Even though hairgrass is still my foreground plant of choice. (untill I can get my hands on some HC)

If the Blxya Japonica survives, you could get some of those awesome looking masses of it going amoungst the micro sword. Now that would look cool.
You have inspired me to get off my lazy butt and attempt to tame the jungle I have in my 40g.

Great work Uni, I look forward to watching it progress.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Lorenceo said:


> If the Blxya Japonica survives, you could get some of those awesome looking masses of it going amoungst the micro sword. Now that would look cool.


That would be great. Momotaro and BSS make growing that plant look like child's play. But, my chances seem about as good as a one-legged man in an a$$-kicking contest.

I'm pleased that you like the new look. The hairgrass was starting to wear me out. I may use it yet for an "accent" plant, but not as the dominator anymore. Now that the "mop" is out of the tank, I see a lot more depth. It had become unmanageable (a warning from Marcel about a year ago that I should have listened to more clearly). It was growing on top of itself, smothering the bottom plants and not allowing the top plants to root into the substrate. The result, a toupee resting on $125 of substrate.

Still, a lot of work ahead of me. Work I don't mind, so long as it doesn't involve battling the green monster. (knock knock).


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## bharada (Mar 5, 2004)

That's a lot of microswords you have there! 

I'll be feeling your pain in a week or so, when I'll be setting up a new 120g tank with a microsword foreground. So when you clipped the individual plantlets, did you remove the excess runner portions? I start doing it that way when I'm replanting Marselia, but toward the end I always get lazy and just leave them on.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Naw Bill, I left most of the runner portion on the plant.

2 reasons:

1. A guess. The runners may store nutrients and food that the plant may be able to use to start growing.

2. Practical. If the bunch that I bury into the substrate has a bunch of runner-section "T's" on the bottom, they hold better. Without those small portions of runners, the bunch lifts back out of the substrate very easily (causing accute insanity).

Good luck with a 120g, my friend !


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

unirdna said:


> Momotaro and BSS make growing that plant (Blyxa) look like child's play.


Ah, if we could all just be happy with what grows best in our own tanks. Blyxa is one I just threw in 5 small tops and BOOM! Blyxa, a'plenty! If yours dies out and/or you want to try some new stock, LMK and I'll ROAK you some !

Neat new look...I think I'll be going the driftwood route soon. If I could just follow your lead and thin out the number of species, I might be maturing in this hobby!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I know it's a bit early for an update, and I don't plan to show a full tank shot, as the microsword has just started to get going, but the fact that I have NO algae growing in a tank with limited plant mass and direct sunlight makes me want to share :redface: . 

I might be tempting fate by posting a few pics....but, you can't live in fear of superstition . 

Here's a shot of the tank opposite the sunlight side. You can see the light shining through the leaves, and around the front. Every winter, the sun "dips" lower in the south sky, the tank gets 4+ hours of direct sunlight. When you look at the photo, keep in mind that the "shaded" areas of the photo are still under 192w of PC lighting. Sunlight is intense!










I've also started to cultivate a chunk of "rogue" riccia that hitchhiked into the tank a few months ago. I'm not exactly sure what I'm going to do with it yet. I think I'll be able to use it without weights because this stuff does NOT float in my tank. Pearling is almost nil, yet it's growing quite well.










Finally, I managed to [painstakingly] sort through some of the hairgrass patch that was removed last week. I intend to offer it up to my local club because I owe much to them for the inspiration and materials of my new aquascape. Whatever is left, I will offer up to folks on this forum.

What's left of the mass (not enough patience to sort through it :icon_roll )










What I salvaged (12 inches long, 7 inches high, 1 inch deep with grass)


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## jimmydrsv (Apr 8, 2005)

I was wondering which type of hairgrass this is to get this tall. Mine is the shorter variety which hasn't grown much taller than 1-2 inches.


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

The hairgrass doesn't look that tall in your tank, but when I look at it now it "IS" tall.

I prefer the shorter species.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Check out the Iron Experiment I did on this tank.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Two week photo. Starting to think about scaping ideas now that things are settling in. Eventually, I'll have to remove some microsword to make room for other plants. I separated the riccia and placed it among the microsword. I have never seen this done, so I just had to try.

The tank is on hour 9.5 of 10. The Hydrotriche hottoniifloras has closed up for the night.










The orange dot is the result of the photographer failing to shut off the dining room light.


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## awrieger (May 12, 2005)

I kinda liked it with the hairgrass, but hey, you know me and hairgrass! I'm looking forward to seeing how this progresses. The central feature is looking really good now. 

So that algae is called Cladophora? Ha, I finally have a name for my nemesis! I did the same as you and just ripped up all the hairgrass in my 4' long. But I'm going to try the Hydrogen Peroxide treatment in the 4x2x2 to see if that eradicates it.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

4 weeks since I chopped up my tank. What's more fun than seeing things grow  ?

Newly set up:









Two weeks:









Four weeks:









I'll link the rest of these photos in order to keep the post somewhat tidy.

School of cardinals (currently at 28)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/cardinalschool1.jpg

Lilaeopsis running
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/microswordrunning.jpg

Trying out a bit of pennywort for contrast
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/pennywort1.jpg

Hydrotriche. It branched out when I let it grow to the surface; Then I clip off the top and replanted it. I think this will make it look full.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/Hydrotrichehottoniiflora.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/Hydrotrichehottoniiflorabudding.jpg


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Looking nice Ted, the anubias nana is starting to take off. Are you going to grow a huge anubias nana statue like you did with the java fern?


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## awrieger (May 12, 2005)

Hey, that's filled in really well in just four weeks. Nice!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Sunlight*

It's tough to get a good sunlight photo without a ton of glare. But, I wanted to show you all this, and it's the best I could do. I played with the shutter speed until I could effectively show how intense sunlight is. For reference, the "shaded" (right side) portion of the tank is under 192w of CF lighting. Because of this intense 2-3 hours of sunlight, I've reduced the overall photoperiod to 10 hours.

So its:
1 hour @ 96w
2.5 hours @ 192w
2.5 hours @ 192w + sunlight
4 hours @ 96w









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/sun1.jpg









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/sun2.jpg









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2005-02-25.jpg


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Hey Ted - that 'feature' plant is H. augustifola (or is is angustifolia...per the Tropica site ), isn't it? Mine recently started to grow nicely, and I really like the look you've achieved. How do you keep the stalks from shooting up? You likely don't, but I'm guessing you just pinch/snip off the stalks such that the bottom just keeps getting bushier and thicker? Please enlighten me :thumbsup: !

I don't really have enough room in my tank for that basketball sized bunch you have there. But, maybe I could start making room.

Good stuff!
Brian


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## medicineman (Sep 28, 2005)

Ted,

Sunlight is sure good stuff for your tank  especially if you have the control over it. Regulating sunlight gives me great improvement in algae control.

I also have sun beams at my 260 tank for 4-5 hours, but I regulate is to just 2-3 hours mainly to prevent excessive heating of the tank. I also block any undirect sunlight off those periods. Sure I got some algae, but not much and they are still under control (credits to algae eaters). Anyway it is still quite a new setup so to speak. 

You have quite an interesting lighting schedule. Great control and it simulates natural daylight also :thumbsup:


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## awrieger (May 12, 2005)

Are those pearling tufts Riccia? It creates quite a natural looking (aqua)landscape, just like a genuine moor or field where you get low-profile bushes growing amongst the grass. 

So the Micro Swords are simply acting as an anchor for it, like the way Cladophora anchors itself in Hairgrass? I think you've invented a very effective technique there, nicely done!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

BSS said:


> Hey Ted - that 'feature' plant is H. augustifola (or is is angustifolia...per the Tropica site ), isn't it? Mine recently started to grow nicely, and I really like the look you've achieved. How do you keep the stalks from shooting up? You likely don't, but I'm guessing you just pinch/snip off the stalks such that the bottom just keeps getting bushier and thicker? Please enlighten me :thumbsup: !
> 
> I don't really have enough room in my tank for that basketball sized bunch you have there. But, maybe I could start making room.
> 
> Brian


Brian, You're right, it aNgusifolia. Autonomic typing responses are difficult to overcome . I trim one stem, the middle one (mother stem). The lateral branches I haven't trimmed yet. Of course, I'll have to periodically 'restart' the process, but the plant grows slowly compared to other hygry sp., and by my estimates, I'll only have to do this 3 or so times a year (if I chose to keep this look). There are C. balansae behind that 'bush' that are finally starting to look nice, and I'm eager to show them off. 

You won't have to have a basketball-size wad like that to get the 'bush' effect. The chunk on the left is that size, but there is also a smaller chunk to the back right (behind the anubias). If you look closely, you may be able to get a sense of it's dimensions. If not, I can post a more specific photo.

For what it's worth, a buddy of mine has this same plant in his tank, but can NOT achieve this look because his lighting isn't as intense as mine. Lower leaves die off, and lateral stems don't shoot out. 



awrieger said:


> Are those pearling tufts Riccia? It creates quite a natural looking (aqua)landscape, just like a genuine moor or field where you get low-profile bushes growing amongst the grass.
> 
> So the Micro Swords are simply acting as an anchor for it, like the way Cladophora anchors itself in Hairgrass? I think you've invented a very effective technique there, nicely done!


Yep, that's riccia. It's finally starting to pop out. About a month ago, I shoved small pieces of it down into the microsword. It grew within the stems, and is now completely held in place by its own growth. I'm actually quite proud of my idea :icon_redf . I'm sure it's been done before, but I never saw it. Thing is, once you remove a clump, you can't put it back (I suppose you could trim it though). I look forward to growing in a genuine aquascape of the stuff. For now, I am just experimenting. 

All that riccia in my tank was grown from one tiny hitchhiker sprig that I got from Momotaro about 3-4 months ago . And, to think he appologized for it :hihi:.


Thanks for all the kind words, everyone. Trying new stuff is fun roud:.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Ted, I've been waiting until I got a nice, unencumbered chunk of time to read this thread in detail. And I'm glad I did - Wow, what an adventure! It's exciting to see such successful evolution and change in a tank. Your early photos were... well... let's just say good for perspective in seeing just how very far you have taken this.:icon_wink 

And maybe I missed the post where you explained it, but the solitary discus disappeared somewhere along the way. Bummer. I want discus too, sorry to see that go.

And the Java fern.. good riddance. Veni, Vidi, Vici! I came, I saw, I conquered! And so did you buddy with Java ferns! Glad you realized that and moved on to your "reductionist" phase... an aesthetic I have _deep, deep_ appreciation for. It's much easier to say a lot with a lot, than it is to say a lot with a little.

IMO this is just an indication of your continued maturation in this arena, and I anxiously await more news of progress.

Again, sorry to have been absent from this thread for so long.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Fighting Monsteritus*

...Monsteritus - the compulsive behavior I continue to exhibit causing me to grow huge spheres of one kind of plant. It was the Java Fern a few months back, and I was doing the same thing with the Hygrophila angustifolia.

Self-intervention: I trimmed the darn thing and intend to continue to do so until my affliction is under control .

The trimming definitely adds more depth to the aquascape, me thinks.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-03-13.jpg

They Hydrocotyle continues to shoot up a stem every 7-10 days. Definitely not a fast grower. Then again, there could be many stems that didn't make it past the riccia mat. 









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/hydrocotyle.jpg

The microsword has shown that it will not take getting covered in riccia without a fight. 









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/microswordriccia.jpg

And that C. balansae is finally seen. Eventually, I hope for this plant to play the largest role in the aquascape.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/C.jpg


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Looking really good Ted, I love how the micrograss filled in so quickly. It seems that you've been on a roll with growing these plants, the last time I ever saw you with a bad case of algae was with that 30g which now seems to be doing really good.

Keep it up, you've been through alot and I bet seeing your tank improve makes it worthwhile.


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Wow, the riccia and microsword in rolling tufts with that centerpiece H. angustifolia. YEAH!!! And the C balansae will be a sweet elegant rise in there some day. Fun to watch this progression for sure. Do you even have to scrape the glass? Wonderful thread.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Betowess said:


> Do you even have to scrape the glass?


hehe. Yeah, about once every two weeks the green "dust" shows up. I take a plastic Kent scraper, and the deed is done in a minute or two. It comes off quite easily. The most recent set of photos were taken at about day 4 after the last scraping. Honestly, I do NO algae removal in this tank other than the scraping (and, I suppose you can't really call that "removal"  ). The only plant that lends itself to algae growth is the older growth on the Hydrotriche hottoniiflora, and even that is miniscule. Or maybe, its miniscule because the shrimp are constantly all over that small oasis of algae .

I'm glad you like the look of the grass and riccia. But, my photos always disappoint me. They make it look like I have some sort of infestation in my grass  . I think the tank looks so much better in person, so I'm frustrated that I can't properly capture that scene in a photo.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

unirdna said:


> my photos always disappoint me. They make it look like I have some sort of infestation in my grass  . I think the tank looks so much better in person, so I'm frustrated that I can't properly capture that scene in a photo.


Wow! Well I'm sorry we can't get a better look. Because in the photos the tank looks great! Really nice composition. Your compulsion is a good thing at this point IMO. Just make sure you continue to restrain yourself enough to keep all that beautiful open space - it's the balance between mass and void that does it for me. And the contrast and compliment of the various shapes and growth orientations.

The health is obvious, but it is the composition that really knocks me out! Great job Ted!:thumbsup: Beautiful tank.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

unirdna said:


> My photos always disappoint me. I think the tank looks so much better in person, so I'm frustrated that I can't properly capture that scene in a photo.


This photo offers a bit more perspective of what the tank "really" looks like, but it's still not quite there. I'm starting to think that photography skills are more important that aquascaping skills :icon_neut .









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/sunlightmar14.jpg


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

unirdna said:


> T I'm starting to think that photography skills are more important that aquascaping skills :icon_neut .


You have no idea the truth you speak.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

unirdna said:


> This photo offers a bit more perspective of what the tank "really" looks like, but it's still not quite there. I'm starting to think that photography skills are more important that aquascaping skills :icon_neut .


It's not just photography IMO. It's overall composition too.

That tank would look much less dramatic without that deep black background. So it is lots of important factors... aquascaping design, photograpy, and how you frame it. All together it makes for the great visual drama. And in your case, it's all coming together right now.:thumbsup:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Run Run Riccia*

So this was going to happen sooner or later .

What I didn't expect was how big these things would be when they finally broke free . I was pleasantly surprised to see that the grass under the riccia was green and healthy.

Well, put another small piece or riccia in the grass, and wait another couple of months. 









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/ricciabreaksfree.jpg









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/ricciafloat.jpg


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## bastalker (Dec 8, 2004)

scolley said:


> It's not just photography IMO. It's overall composition too.
> 
> That tank would look much less dramatic without that deep black background. So it is lots of important factors... aquascaping design, photograpy, and how you frame it. All together it makes for the great visual drama. And in your case, it's all coming together right now.:thumbsup:


Looks like it has already came together!!

Awsome tank!! Kudos Ted!!roud:


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

The microsword riccia combo is amazing Ted. Really, really incredible. And I agree it's even more awesome that the microswords are doing well under the riccia.

This has got to be one of the most impressive examples of microsword growth I've ever seen. Too often people give up on it because it dies on them (being terrestrial form in the LFs). So, people instead obsess over the all the fancy foreground plants like HC and elatine and wonderful plants like this get so easily forgotten.

Kudos my friend-- I am always fond of the good use of more "classic plants" (me saying this in the midst of a bacopa-obsessed-phase).


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

greenmiddlefinger said:


> I agree it's even more awesome that the microswords are doing well under the riccia... Too often people give up on it because it dies on them (being terrestrial form in the LFs).


You aren't kidding, Steven. I was one of those "quitters" two years ago. I planted the microsword along with the hairgrass. The microsword died off and was smothered by the hairgrass, but I just left it. Six months later, it pops up, and slowly begins to creep around the tank. After I ripped all the hairgrass out - a few months ago - and planted the (2 years of microsword), I finally gave the microsword a chance to run without competing with hairgrass.

This is the reason the growth in my tank was so fast - it was already submersed growth, acclimated to my tank, with "seasoned" substrate. This would never happen to someone who set up a new tank, and bought 20 pots of microsword from the LFS. And this is why MY microsword is "gold" compared to what you would buy from an online store .

I think that the plants under the riccia do OK because the entire mat of grass is connected by runners. I think that they "share the wealth", and the plants under high light aid those under low light. And the denser the system, the faster it grows. Vals and sag do the same thing. If a new plant is attached to a runner, it will grow fast and furious, even under low light (because it is nursed by parent plants).


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Sunlight Video*

I captured this today and thought I might share it with you guys. It's interesting for two reasons:

1. The plants go nuts when the sun hits them.
2. If you focus your eye on the TV in the "back" of the reflection, it can give the illusion that there is no tank at all, but rather that the room is underwater. See if you can see what I "see" .

Click to open in mediaplayer. (I think Firefox doesn't work; you'll need to open the link with dusty ol' IE ).

https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/bier/Aquarium.wmv?uniq=-ckc0s5


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Nice video Ted! I can definately feel that i'm underwater as well, do your plants always pearl up like that? or is it just after water changes that you seem to take these incredible videos of the plants bursting out bubbles everywhere?

The quality of your plants seems to be super healthy and looks great, i'll be tearing down my 20g this friday, so most likely I will send you some HC and Eustralis stellata the same day.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

seriously, I understand how hydroponics is useful for the nurseries for mass production, but what's the point if most of it is going to die? Silly really. My personal opinion is that they should limit the practice to plants that transition between forms easily; mosses, HC, and some bacopas come to mind. Eusteralis? No. Microswords? No. Ludwigia? Maybe . . . no. lol


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Getting there....*

Everything is turning up roses with this tank lately, so me thinks I should take advantage and start moving on the aquascape. Because, I do plan to enter the AGA competition this year. Mostly because I'd like to know what the judges don't like about it :hihi:, but also because I want to know how it feels to sit at the grown-up table . So, I'm experimenting little by little.

This is a recent addition. Anubias barterii (var. coffeefolia). I got it from a recent plant swap. I'm giving it a try for shape contrast. Please tell me what you think.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/AnubiasCofifolia.jpg









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/AnubiasCofifolia1.jpg

And the hydrocotyle seems to have finally achieved some momentum. I call this photo "the rise of the lily pads"  - kind of "war of the worlds".









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/riseofthelilypads.jpg

Whole tank shot: I've removed the Hydrotriche (moved it to another tank to see how I like the tank without). I've also cut down the Hydrophila to open up the java fern and C. Balansae. John and I are doing a swap right now, and I look forward to seeing how E. stellata looks in the tank. Still don't know if I'm going to use the plant as a centerpiece or plant it where the hydrotriche was (to the right). Opinions? John?









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-03-26.jpg

High Resolution: https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/bier/AGA 2006-03-26 012.jpg?uniq=-ckag56


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Great additions Ted, it doesn't hurt to try new things out especially how good your plants are growing right now. I like it how you are wanting to try out new plants and what not to improve your scape.

Ted, I am up to about 7-8 stems of eustralis stellata at the moment, although the mother stem has shot out about 3-4 new stems so hopefully they'll grow bigger by the end of this week when I take the tank down.

Looking at what your 46g have progressed so far, in my opinion I would have the eustralis stellata on the far right, it looks a little bit empty over there so a good bounce of colors should look great. Then maybe once you start getting the stems growing you can merge them to the center and see how that looks. Mess around with it and i'm sure you will come up to something that you'll like.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Awesome video! :thumbsup: 
It seems like you are looking through the tank and seeing the other side of the room.
That new anubias is a nice addition. Definatley a keeper.
Only thing I'm not too keen on is the blob of pearling ricca at the front, looks wierd IMO.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Lorenceo said:


> Only thing I'm not too keen on is the blob of pearling ricca at the front, looks wierd IMO.


Interesting. I hadn't considered changing this....but, what about removing that riccia and replacing it with one or two dark crypts (wendtii possibly)? That might look sharp!


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

unirdna said:


> Interesting. I hadn't considered changing this....but, what about removing that riccia and replacing it with one or two dark crypts (wendtii possibly)? That might look sharp!


Ted, I think the point may be that you want to remove _anything_ from the front obscures the view of the plants in the middle back and mid-ground. That would certainly be my recommendation.

I think you have the makings of a really great aquascape now. And great movie BTW!:thumbsup: I'm hesitant to post my thoughts on how to improve your scape, vs. pm'ing, given that I have no track record in this space. But in the interest in open exchange, here goes:

1) Give in to a nice center balanced design - you are already 1/2 way there. To that end...
2) Open up the front, don't let anything obscure the mass in the middle.
3) Either change the camera angle (shoot from higher up) of try to create a the visual impression that your foreground is either fairly level, or slightly rising as it moves from the front to the back.
3) Keep the C. balanese sparse! Not too many more leaves. And keep them in the center as it is now.
4) But let the rest of that center mass fill in.
5) Encourage that hydrocotyle off to the left. But keep it under control, and not too close to center mass either. It should be on the high side, offset by...
6) Something low off near the right side. Maybe the riccia, maybe something else.
7) Also on that hydrocotyle, keep the leaves in odd numbers - 3 or 5 is probably best, all at staggered heights. Most of the leaves I would keep low, and 1 or 2 on the high side.​
In conclusion... finish what you have started. It's a great thing you have now. Don't let "collectoritis" get in the way of a potentially great AGA entry - if that is your priority. You have the beginnings of a great center-weighted aquascape now - go with it!


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## tom855 (Jan 31, 2006)

Ted,

Absolutely awesome setup. I'm really impressed with the idea of putting in less species instead of more. You deserve a lot of credit.

My big question is where do you hide your in-tank plumbing? I have a 46 Bow as well and always fight with that. The 12" front to back doesn't allow for a back to front spraybar, so it's either across the back or vertical. 

Where do you hide it all?

Tom


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Steve,
You are too modest. Excellent excellent observations and ideas!! This is what I need - fresh eyes. Thanks.

Tom,
The hiding of equipment is something of an obsession for me . 

Brawn:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/checkvalve.jpg

Beauty:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/lilyblack.jpg

You can read more about that glass plumbing here


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Jdinh04 said:


> ...in my opinion I would have the eustralis stellata on the far right, it looks a little bit empty over there....


And, scolley recommends going with the center island approach. Personally, before reading these two, I was thinking the E. stellatus should go on the left so you can have a sloped design.

So, there you have it! We have concensus...NOT! Then again, I, like scolley, won't claim I'm an expert 'scaper...yet.

In any case, the health continues to look great. I, too, would try to keep species limited, though the texture/color of the stellatus *might* be nice, if it doesn't become too dominant/distracting.

Keep at it and keep us posted!
Brian.


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## tom855 (Jan 31, 2006)

Oh great - custom glass, invisible pipes.......................

The great money sucking sound continues................. :icon_conf

It sure does give it a great look though, thanks!


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

An opinion on stellatas: I would plant them between the two hygro groups behine the microsorum (if there's room). That spot is a bit unsettling in its emptiness right now, and the stellatas would be a welcome balance of texture.

An opinion on the right side: It's not too empty, looks good. If you wanted to do anything to it, maybe just buy more anubias to plant on the right side of the "island."

It was really annoying when those two stems were sticking out randomly from the right side-- the tank looks infinitely better just by moving them outta there.

I got mixed feelings about the riccia blob -- I'd like to see it when it's not pearling THAT much. If it's possible to catch a photo then I'd do it. The glare is what's distracting about it, not really the mass of the plant I think.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

greenmiddlefinger said:


> I would plant them between the two hygro groups behine the microsorum (if there's room). That spot is a bit unsettling in its emptiness right now, and the stellatas would be a welcome balance of texture.
> 
> An opinion on the right side: It's not too empty, looks good. If you wanted to do anything to it, maybe just buy more anubias to plant on the right side of the "island."
> 
> It was really annoying when those two stems were sticking out randomly from the right side-- the tank looks infinitely better just by moving them outta there.


Everything you just said is what I've been thinking, as well . In fact, Steve and I have been PMing about the exact things you just mentioned. I'm glad to hear that you think Stellata would do well in the center - this is what I was planning to do, but having never seen stellata in real-life, I wasn't sure what I was getting myself into. I think the tank needs a focal point, and that plant was the one I was going to try.

Agreed that the tank looks better without the hydrotriche stems.

Hopefully that anubias will grow an inch or so into the right side. That's the way it's headed, and it really has some momentum right now.





tom855 said:


> Oh great - custom glass, invisible pipes.......................
> 
> The great money sucking sound continues................. :icon_conf
> 
> It sure does give it a great look though, thanks!


I subscribe to the idea that in life, you pick your passion and open your wallet . Thanks for the compliment, Tom.


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

unirdna said:


> I'm glad to hear that you think Stellata would do well in the center - this is what I was planning to do, but having never seen stellata in real-life, I wasn't sure what I was getting myself into. I think the tank needs a focal point, and that plant was the one I was going to try.


I like stellatus. It's got an interesting texture and can have nice colors, under certain circumstances as well.

Just something to consider, it seems like some stellatus grows straight up and some grows on an angle. Most of mine grows at about a 50-60 degree angle. Not sure if it is dictated by stock or not. However, is you do want to try some of the angling stock, LMK and I can send you a few stems.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Making way for a new plant*

I received my 1/2 of the trade with John today . Eustralis stellata. The plant has me perplexed. When I do a google image search, it turns up a whole lot of photos.........that all look very different. Does this plant morphologically vary, or are the photos/plants mislabeled/misidentified?

I cleared a space on the left side of the centerpiece by removing 3 of the large Hygrophila angustifolia stems. What's left is an open space, surrounded by smaller H.a. stems - and this was where the first of my three stems of stellata was planted.

The stems aren't puny, they are 5-6 inches and robust. They arrived in fairly good health. They just look small because the growth in my tank is very tall. The microsword/riccia mat is 6-8 inches high. A few microsword leaves (popping through the riccia) are 10+ inches long. This will have to be controlled eventually (eg. soon ).

Here's the three little buggers in their new nest.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-04-03006stellata2.jpg

In case you couldn't make them out, here's a closer look.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-04-03001Stellata1.jpg

The whole tank has undergone a few other changes. Many balls of riccia are gone to various homes, including the one that was up front. And for the moment, I've removed the Anubias coffeefolia. It may return. I just didn't want to have it in the way while I finnagle with planting and pruning stellata.









Screen size enlarge: 
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/screensize2006-04-03011wholetankhig.jpg
High Resolution:
https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/bier/2006-04-03 011 whole tank high res.jpg?uniq=-cjdrm2

Please share your thoughts re: the changes made, or how you predict these changes will affect the [growing] aquascape. Thanks.


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

I swear that e. stellata can get lost in there, I can barely see it haha. In a few weeks it should be visible, hopefully everything goes well for you. I have your riccia sitting in a jar right now, i'm not sure what I have planned for it. I wanted to set it in the tank, but i'm afraid all those bits and pieces are going to fly everywhere, so i'm planning to get some riccia stones for it. The micrograss you sent me is doing fine, it'll be about a couple weeks before I can see them growing anyways. Thanks again, and be sure to keep us updated with that stellata!


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## matrixxr4wd (Mar 19, 2006)

Your tank is beautiful! I get so jealous when I see you guys with lush growth and crystal clear water... I'm just finally getting plants to grow... and just finally encountering the dreaded GW... :icon_cry: 

Thank you unirdna for posting such great pics of your tank!


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

BSS said:


> Just something to consider, it seems like some stellatus grows straight up and some grows on an angle. Most of mine grows at about a 50-60 degree angle.


Earth to Brian! Earth to Brian! Come in please!

Wow, major brain fart on this one! It's not stellatus that grows on an angle, it's L. aromatica. What was I thinking?!?

Ted - you'll soon have PM :icon_redf ! 

I gotta slow down....life just has me spinning these days! Ugh!


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## medicineman (Sep 28, 2005)

Ah... a new fellow stellata keeper. 

Do keep the plant updated as I'm curious on how it grows and turns out to be. It is quite a difficult plant to make colourful, yet alone to keep it growing and alive. I found by this short experience that high light and very soft water to help it grow and turn colour.

I also keep stellata (2 weeks) in my new scape tank. It is turning from its green origin to a bit orange hue right now. Please help yourself in my 260 section for my stellata.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

medicineman said:


> Ah... a new fellow stellata keeper.


I think not :hihi:. It turns out that Brian and John both mistakingly (and independently) sent me Limnophila aromatica. I thought something looked "off" about John's stellata. So, it turns out I will be giving THAT plant a spin as my centerpiece :hihi:. In my experience, these kinds of "mixups" usually turn out to be just the ticket. In a while, I'll have this L. aromatica growing well. Then, I'll get some stellata, hate the look, and go back to L. aromatica.

Check it out, John. http://images.google.com/images?q=Limnophila+aromatica&hl=en&btnG=Search+Images

Now if you'll excuse me, with coincidences like this floating around my chi, I think I'll step out for a lottery ticket.


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## medicineman (Sep 28, 2005)

Ah... that is why it looks so green (and small).

No problem, that will make you a new fellow L aromatica keeper... (what a luck  )
as I also have new L aromatica in my new setup (also around 2 weeks old) which is surviving after fish attack to the new leaves. Now it is turning colour slowly from the green top to a bit yellowish hue. Lots of aromatica, turning almost twice the original size. Anyway please do update how it turns out... I love to watch plants evolve into beautiful form. (I will update my aromatica now).


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Even MORE coincidences....*

So Brian, looking at your tank, is this the plant you sent me? Because, if it is, then actually you sent me the plant I wanted (which means that I was the first person - in the chain - to mistake aromatica for stellata) .


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

unirdna said:


> So Brian, looking at your tank, is this the plant you sent me?


Why, yes Ted, it is! Actually, I think those are pretty much the majority of the stems I sent you. If you look below the circle and off to the left, you'll see a stem that is about 1/3 the height and is less 'dense'. That is one of my 2-3 remaining stems of stellatus. For whatever reason, I've had much better luck with the aromatica.

I agree with you, you seem to have ended up with aromatica for a reason! Glad I could do my part :icon_roll !


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Weird ... are you sure its Limnophila aromatica? I recieved the plant known as Eustralis stellata from Jason Baliban back when he was selling it. Give it a few days, it may look iffy right now but it'll grow great and looks a lot better if you add some iron and get the colors to show.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Jdinh04 said:


> Weird ... are you sure its Limnophila aromatica?


Nope, only pretty sure. I'll do as you suggest, let it grow, and time will tell. Stay tuned .


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

I had quite a bit of trouble distinquishing L. aromatica from P. stellatus when I first got it. Here's some observations from my limited, questionable :redface: stock. The aromatica leaves seem to have more pronounced ridges, while the stellatus leaf ridges are more subtle. It looks like the aromatica tends to have 6-8 leaves per whorl (I think that's the right term!), meaning at each location in the stem that they grow out. The aromatica internodes seem to be a bit closer than the stellatus. So, overall, the aromatica seems to have a more dense appearance.

YMMV, but that's how I'm readin' 'em!
Brian.


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## medicineman (Sep 28, 2005)

If you have the guts, crush em. As the name suggest, L aromatica has a distinct smell to it (sometimes you can even smell it well enough without the need of crushing it). In fact it is also used as a herb due to the aroma. While so far I did not smell anything similar from P stellata.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

I hope the coffeefolia makes a return soon-- it looked really good


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*A Serious Choppin'*

It takes me 2 years to grow a few tufts of microsword, and within 3 months I have it piling on top of itself. :icon_roll 

The riccia got out of hand, as well. Detaching and floating to the surface. The tank was weeks away from smothering itself, and IME, this can create conditions for algae. 

So, had to hack it back. And when I go in, I make it count . The microsword ground was great; I loved it for a couple months. But, lately it has grown so tall in the front of the aquarium that my aquascape was losing dimension. I opted to remove about 80% of the riccia and MS. In doing so, I discovered that I had a few nice pieces of Blyxa japonica; so I brought them to the front. I hope to propagate this plant, and eventually replace all the microsword. B. japonica would be much easier to maintain, me thinks. Maybe not. Fun to try new stuff regardless. Momotaro traded me the japonica many months ago. It took forever just to recover from the trip. It really does not seem to handle shipping very well.

I'm babbling.....here are some photos.

Before (April 10)








http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-04-10sized.jpg

After (April 13)








http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-04-13sized.jpg

The new "scape" is a bit chaotic. Lots of stuff. I'll see how things grow in, and decide where to take this in the next month or so.


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## rrguymon (Jul 10, 2005)

That looks great. I like what you did with it. You had a real jungle of MS.

I also like your cardinals. I have half a dozen neons. I think I will add half a dozen cardinals with them.

Rick.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Looks much better! That microsword was definatley getting out of hand.
If the Blxya takes off it is going to look great.
I see some rams have returned. Good move, I love those fish.roud:
Nice "moss" you have growing on the substrate there too. :hihi:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Lorenceo said:


> Nice "moss" you have growing on the substrate there too. :hihi:


Riccia pieces and a smidge of BGA (caused by the "dead space" against the front of the tank, created by the thick microsword). The ramshorn snails appeared to like it, so I left them the snack. For whatever reason, once the dead space is removed, it dies off - and I like to watch it die :icon_twis .


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Hey Ted - what's all that dark stuff in the front of your....oh....wait...nevermind. It's substrate :icon_lol: ! Not sure I remember seeing that in your tank before...LOL.

Gotta love that blyxa. Looks like yours is starting to get pretty happy in there. So, now where does the tank go.....


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## awrieger (May 12, 2005)

Nice trim job!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*GW - hehehe*

It is the responsibility of a good journal-keeper to record all events, right ? Well, it seems I may have asked a bit too much of my plants. Three days after the big trim (aka uprooting), I have green water sneaking in. My nutrients are well in check, and the plants are doing great. I have a UVS inline, but I hope not to have to turn it on. Two years ago, that baby would be blasting at the first sight of GW. Now days, my curiosity gets the better of my anal retention.

Blyxa owners (I'm taking to you, Brian and John ), what does it mean when the leaves start growing in with a reddish hue? Is this because it's getting more light now? The plants are growing well, but you can definitely tell that the new leaves are a different color.

Here's a shot of the GW. It's not that bad yet, so I had to overexpose the photo a bit, so you could see it better.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/greenwater.jpg

And here's a side view. I didn't have to overexpose this shot because it was taken closer, and viewed through 3X more water.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/greenwaterside.jpg


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Your a brave man Ted! Everychange you do, the outcome is great! I can't wait to see how this turns out.

If your blyxa is changing color (leaves), I assume it must be getting enough iron along with brightlight making it turn that color. IMO I just hate the plain ol' green blyxa, after I decided to add iron it changed my mind of the plant 

Hope everything works well for you and better get that GW cleared up, I hate to see that beauty tank turn into a disaster!


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## Rupey (Nov 16, 2002)

Tank is looking good Ted! Are you going to fill in the rest of the foreground with blyxa? If you want some more let me know I have a ton! Or maybe try a little smaller plant in front of the blyxa like some downoi? Good luck with the green water!!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Hey Jon,

Long time, no see. Thanks for the Blyxa offer. I was sitting here, proud that I finally got this plant to grow, and now I find out that everyone is growing this weed like crazy :hihi:. How humbling. Mine is showing signs of serious growth right now, so for my own satisfaction, I'd like to see if I can grow my own lawn of the stuff. If not, I'll swallow my pride and come begging at your doorstep .

Are you alluding that you have downoi?!? If you are, you once again have my full attention re: some kind of trade .

Speaking of trades, that stock of cherry shrimp you gave me have turned out to be top notch. The color on some of the veteran females is nuts!









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/cherrysized.jpg


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## Rupey (Nov 16, 2002)

Glad to see the shrimp are doing well for you. As for the downoi, yah I have a few lol Last time I counted it was around 85 but probably more by now If you want some just let me know and I can cut some sideshoots off for you. I will be in Madison next week to pick up my boat launch pass so i could bring them along if you want.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Back on Track*

I now have an appreciation for folks trying to kill greenwater. Thing is, there is NO nutrient regime you can implement to get rid of the stuff. Once it starts, the only way to get your tank back is to forcefully kill the stuff. The data is clear. Nutrients (NH4, NO2, NO3, PO4, and FE) were the same before and after I rescaped the tank. Kicking up the substrate MUST have released some unknown component that triggered the greenwater.

The scientist in me stopped me from fighting the GW, at first. I wanted to see how the plants and fish responded. I got my answer :icon_roll . My Crypt balansae completely melted away, and my cardinal tetras were losing their color and apetite. Thus marked the end of the observing....

In my case, I have the luxury of having a UVS inline. I plugged it in, and 72 hours later, the water was crystal clear again. Some buddies give me crap for spending the money on a UVS, rather than simply blacking out the tank for 3 days. The reason I prefer UV is because the plants do not suffer, as they can during a blackout period.

As expected, the UVS did precipitate all of the iron from my tank, as it has always done in the past. I have since unplugged the UVS, and dosed Iron back up to the level I like it. The GW has not returned....that stuff sure is mysterious.

The Blyxa is growing in nicely and the L. aromatica is on the move as well. Next update should reflect some great growth, and a new aquascape.


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## jade_dragon71 (Dec 2, 2005)

Wow, your tank sure recovered nicely. I'm impressed at what a UVS can do....the more I think about it, the more I want one! (No GW here, but just almost a constant slight haze since setting up my tank a month ago)

If I could get blyxa to do something besides melt, I'd be proud of myself! I think I might try it one more time, but not just yet.


BTW, I love how you aquascape...always so serene and harmonious.


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## matrixxr4wd (Mar 19, 2006)

unirdna said:


> I now have an appreciation for folks trying to kill greenwater. Thing is, there is NO nutrient regime you can implement to get rid of the stuff. Once it starts, the only way to get your tank back is to forcefully kill the stuff. The data is clear. Nutrients (NH4, NO2, NO3, PO4, and FE) were the same before and after I rescaped the tank. Kicking up the substrate MUST have released some unknown component that triggered the greenwater.
> 
> The scientist in me stopped me from fighting the GW, at first. I wanted to see how the plants and fish responded. I got my answer :icon_roll . My Crypt balansae completely melted away, and my cardinal tetras were losing their color and apetite. Thus marked the end of the observing....
> 
> ...


Your tank still looks great, even after the battle!

I too just recently battled GW in my 90 gallon. I tried all the DIY stuff like blackouts, willow branches, etc... nothing worked. I even bought this PhosBan stuff that cost me like 30 bucks, and the LFS guy swore it would clear it up. Nope. I got a UVS and did 40-50% water changes and in 3 days, it was sparkling again.


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## rrguymon (Jul 10, 2005)

Your tank looks great as it always does.

I had green water once too. The UV did the trick. A lot people say you do not need a UV and seem to have an a strong unreasonable bias against using one. IME a UV is quick and effective at removing the GW. A very useful tool.

I see your Blyxa is getting some copper color to it. Mine is too. I wonder why that is? It seems like the ones that get the most light have the copper tones in my tank.


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

rrguymon said:


> It seems like the ones that get the most light have the copper tones in my tank.


Bingo. :smile:


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Looks great Ted.

Yeah, I changed my light some weeks back to 4x54 watts of GE starcoats and AquaMedic 10000k T5s. I had pulled out two dimmer Aquamedic Plantas. My Blyxa aubertii, which is just a larger version of Japonica turned a screaming rust yellow with a bit of salmon and zero green color. I read on JPANs thread how his Blyxa that was shaded was nice and green, but those under full light would curl leaves and have the tendency to grow shorter and turn toward the warm colors. I kind of like the mixed green and yellow with pink salmon on Blyxa so I put one AM Planta back in and shortened the photoperiod as I didn't think the sunburned look was too healthy. 
So the long and short is maybe keep it toward a mix of green and yellow/pinks for best health of a Bylxa?

Also, did you yank the C.balansae? I don't see it in the pic.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*New Scape - Here comes the Limnophila!*

Well, in spite of all my greenwater shenanigans, my tank has held up. I'm in another reductionist phase, having removed almost all the Riccia and H. angustifolia (much to the pleasure of the endlers in my 30g - click on signature for photo). The 6 stems of Limnophila that John and Brian sent me have shifted into high gear, and I have given it some space to grow. I really really like the look of this plant, and can't wait until it approaches the light and [hopefully] takes on its characteristic red tones.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/limnophilagrowing.jpg

The Blyxa also continues to do well, and I have recently divided it up to cover more foreground. The Limnophila in this photo is closing up, as the photo was taken only 1/2 hour before lights out.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-05-01sizedjpg.jpg


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Man, Ted - that tank is just cranking out new growth. Most excellent! My L. aromatica (and P. stellatus, too) have recently starting coloring up a bit since I've gotten my N levels under control. I can actually see some on the underside of the top row or two of leaves of the tallest stem near the middle of your cluster. The stock in my tank has never gotten heavily colored, but many of the leaves start getting that purplish hue on the undersides. Then again, you'll probably be able to get the color to really 'pop', and that'll just create another challenge for me :icon_mrgr !

Get ready to start offering up some Blxya!
Brian.


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## Livebearer101 (Feb 7, 2006)

Your tank and aquascape still just looks awesome. The plant growth is superb. Something to be proud of no matter what problems it faces. Well done.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

BSS said:


> ...since I've gotten my N levels under control.


Brian,
What's the 411 on the N levels? Is limiting N suppose to pull out the reds and purples? If so, have you seen this work?


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

unirdna said:


> What's the 411 on the N levels? Is limiting N suppose to pull out the reds and purples? If so, have you seen this work?


I've read many that state that keeping N levels at 10 or below should help pull out the colors in the plants. The one time I really tried it a while back (when my tank was full of DW "acids"), it led to a serious algae outbreak. Not sure if it was due to N bottoming out, or just the fragile state of my tank balance.

However, before my recent tank cleaning about 8 days ago (where the previous 2-3 WCs had been missed), I found that my NO3 was off my LaMotte scale (so >44 ppm). After two sizable WCs, it was still at ~15. So, I haven't added NO3 since then. Now, I'm starting to get some decent coloring back in the new growth of my L. aromatica and P. stellatus. If the trend continues, I'll definitely be posting an update soon.

Oh, and I clearly need to relook at my EI approach. As I'm likely an overfeeder, I'm thinking of following something you mentioned in some thread and only dosing macros once a week. So, far I'm pretty happy with dosing micros everyother day.


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Looking good Ted, the growth of the plants in this tank has been outstanding. It seems like you are really good at growing plants and that you are always giving each plant a try and striving in your tank. 

I was able to get the plant to color up a bit by reducing my kno3 dosing and as well as dosed 5ml of flourish iron. If you have a good fish load, i'm sure that they will help you out with nitrates as well, so give it a shot at decreasing your dosing of kno3, and maybe dose a bit of iron in there.

Keep it up, I miss the microsword lawn, but the blyxa will also be just as good.

jD


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## bigstick120 (May 23, 2005)

Ted, I keep N around 10-20 and PO4 around 1-2 in my 29 and it brings out the red/purple of that plant very well, I know its time to dose based on that plant. I dose about 1ml/gallon of Iron and Flourish as well. Look at my sig 29 gallon for some photos of that plant


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks for the words, fellas!

And thank you for pointing me to your thread, bigstick. Great photos roud: !! It's been a couple months...maybe time for an update ?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Nearing the Peak...*

Tank is creeping closer and closer to its pinnacle. I'm posting photos more frequently lately in hope of getting some opinions on when the tank looks it's best (peak condition). If you look at the previous page, you'll see that my limnophila has made a serious move towards the red in the last week. And that blyxa keeps crankin' <fingers crossed>

Quick-n-dirty shots of my 46g (point-n-shoot w/o tripod)









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-05-08acoupleweeksaway.jpg

Limnophila aromatica









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/limnophilaspreadingout.jpg

Jon (Rupey) stopped by the other day. What a guy! He gave me a bunch of the nicest downoi you've ever seen. It's currently planted in a little field in the back, out of sight. It will be a part of my next aquascape. I plan to bring downoi to the front, blyxa will go where the lileaopsis currently is, and lileaopsis will go to the hounds .









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/downoi-Pogostemonhelferiback.jpg


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

woof woof :tongue:


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

The aromatica is looking nice, Ted. For some reason, that 'hole' right in front of the aromatica is looking for "something". Perhaps if one of the blyxa gets a bit taller, you might move it into that spot. It just seems like there is too big of a 'jump' from the blyxa to the aromatica at the moment.

FWIW,
Brian.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I think you are spot-on, Brian. I'm going to work on that. Thanks!

Things that might look OK in "real life" can appear out of sorts in a photo. That's why I appreciate ALL feedback roud:.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Nailed the AGA photo set!

Special thanks to Rupey, Jdinh, BSS, Momotaro, and Madison Aquarium Gardeners Club. Without plant trades with these folks, this aquascape would have never been possible. And thanks to those who have offered opinions and guidance over the last few months, and for the duration of this thread.

This isn't the end of the thread; just one chapter. I look forward to submitting this tank to the AGA 2006 contest. I want to leave some element of suspense, so I won't post all the photos. But, I won't leave you completely hanging either. Here's a low-res teaser . Look for my tank in this year's contest roud:

Again, thanks everyone!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

These days, I seem to be treating this less like an aquarium, and more like a dry-erase board. But, I'm learning while I go.

No more greenwater. Following advice and wisdom of forum members, I was able to completely avoid a GW outbreak, despite rocking my tank. In the past, I got GW from simply removing one crypt. It's been two days since completely overhauling my tank, and GW is not coming.

What I did differently:

1. More gentle when removing deep-rooted plants. Were talking very very very gentle. Pull a little, wiggle, pull , wiggle.....keep going. And when the plant was out of the substrate, I removed it slowly.

2. Gravel vac / water change. When all plants were removed, I vaccummed up all the floating mulm on top of the substrate. I also vaccuumed the top inch of substrate. 25% water change total. I used a flow regulator on my vaccuum to adjust the siphon to the perfect speed so that it did not suck up my small-size Eco Complete.

3. Measure twice, cut once. I did not go through the ritual of planting and replanting. I mapped out the tank, and planted it one time. Everything is not exactly where I want it right now, but that's alright. A little bit of "leave it alone" time will do the tank good right now.

Changes in the tank flora / aquascape

All microsword gone!
Blyxa spread out (new ground cover - controllable - no runners)
Downoi brought forward.
Java/Anubias log spilt up - 1/2 removed.
Hydrocotyle grouped tighter - 1/2 removed.

All plants were donated to my Local Aquarium Club. We have had a swell of new members in the recent months and I like to give them something more during the plant-swap than the usual bucket of Vals and Hygrophila.


All plants removed

Temporary plant storage

Previous aquascape

New aquascape (clear water - no GW - no UVS needed)


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## Rupey (Nov 16, 2002)

Looks good as usual Ted :thumbsup: Replacing the "not so micro" micro sword will clean up the look quite a bit. Nice work!


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

I'm lovin' it.
Stupid Mc Donalds ads..
Looks good man, I look forward to seeing what happens when it grows in. roud:


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

But, isn't it exciting to keep hitting that reset switch . Definitely makes for a creative afternoon and, if approached properly, can be quite relaxing.

Keep the creativity flowing. You'll eventually settle in on one you really enjoy...at least for a few months  .

Good stuff, Ted!


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Gorgeous!!


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

Very nice job indeed!! The downoi seems to fit right in with the foreground!


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Georgiadawgger said:


> The downoi seems to fit right in with the foreground!


Man, you got that right! When I looked at the photo, I seem to recall sensing a different texture in there, but I never did spot that it was from a different plant. Way cool!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Close Call! Two week vacation almost spelled disaster for the tank.

Despite properly planning a fert dosing, upon my return, my plants were
stunted. No oxygen bubbles, white leaves, thread algae, trouble. Ferts
(N,P,Fe) were right in line, so there must have been some other limiting
factor (I suspect K, but have NO way to prove this because...). I did a
50% water change (15g RO; 5g Tap-water), and dosed K(K2SO4)up to 25ppm. Tank immediately launched into heavy bubbles. 

The algae has lightly grown on every plant in the tank. You may be able to see it on the hydrocotyle. Plants seem happy again. Now to see if the algae dies off. 

Ted









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-06-06Whole.jpg

PS. If you are interested in what freediving in the Cayman Islands
(where I took my vacation) might look like, follow one of these links to
one of my dive videos. Unfortunately, the video will not likely work if you are usinga Mac. PM me if you have a question or comment about this off-topic interest, as I don't want to turn my photo album into a diving discussion .

High Resolution (640x480 TV Quality - maybe better) - 46.4 mb
https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/bier/Little Cayman - Action High Res.wmv?uniq=-xkd0yb

Low Resolution (320x240 Streaming Video Quality) - 8.3 mb
https://mywebspace.wisc.edu/bier/Little Cayman - Action Low Res.wmv?uniq=-xkd0xz


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Welcome back Ted! Do you do supplemental K dosing every week at water change? And you skipped a week, or two? If so I'd bet your are onto your problem, and that might indicate you want to add some K2SO4 in that daily dose. Which might also imply cutting back, as appropriate that supplemental weekly supplemental dosing.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*Summer = Algae*

I can't say why, but every summer in my home yields a bit of algae in my tank. Dosing is the same, plants still flourish, but I get a bit of thread and spot every summer.... Anyone else experience this phenomenom? 

Anyway, tank still looks pretty good. I wanted to share yet another "ground cover" plant that has reached for the sky - the Blyxa japonica. This is now #3. Dwarf hairgrass and microsword have both reached over 10 inches. Some parts of the blyxa has matched that height.









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-06-29005sized.jpg


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Uri looks great! So green. My blyxa takes on a straw/slightly pinkish color. i think they aren't big fans of so much light!


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## Rupey (Nov 16, 2002)

Looking good Ted! When I read this "I wanted to share yet another "ground cover" plant that has reached for the sky " I expected to see the downoi I gave you touching the surface! lol I have had blyxa get that tall myself. It seems to happen when it gets real full and then it starts growing up. Have your rams been breeding at all?


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## bigstick120 (May 23, 2005)

My blyxa does the same as well, it seems to start to float up as it get large as well. As far as the summer algae, being that your tanks sits by the window may have something to do with it, the summer sun comes in differently and for longer hours of the day


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*One Month of Growth*

I've received a few flattering emails asking me to update. Summer is a busy time for most of us, so photojournals and tank duties frequently are neglected :icon_redf . Luckily, despite neglect, I've avoided major crashes. The tank is growing very quickly these days, despite using "slower growing" species. However, the water loses very little nutrients. I need only dose 5ppm NO3 and .5ppm PO4 every couple weeks to maintain the target range. True that I feed my fish well, but the load is small compared to plants. Judging by the extensive root growth (as well as the overall growth) on the blyxa and even the limnophila, I believe that my 2.5 year old substrate is their primary source of food. I haven't dosed iron in months either. There is a bit of thread algae in the tank, but it is not growing on any plant surfaces so I don't mind it. It comes and goes in small quantities (it is at a low point in both photos). I don't remove it because the fish like to pick at it, and I think they may even eat some of it - handy when I take long vacations.

Here is a photo comparison of 28 days of growth. I appologize for the glare on the photos. My lighting regime needed to be shifted to an earlier time, since the morning sun pounds on the tank at 7AM - thus, lights out by 5PM and no chance for a night photo. Yeah, I could just turn the lights on for a few minutes at night to snap a shot, but we all know what that looks like - fish are pale and frightened and the plants are folded up :icon_roll .

July 14, 2006








http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/2006-07-14sized.jpg

August 12, 2006








http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/20060812sized.jpg


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Hey Ted! Tank looks great! It's a different look - not manicured now, but oh so lush!

You have clearly gotten your tank to that wonderful/terrible stage. Wonderful because it's healthy as can be, fully mature and balanced, and everything just wants to grow, grow, grow. And it's terrible because everything does indeed grow, grow, grow. And of course you get to spend your free time giving it a trim, trim, trim. :icon_wink 

Looks great pal!


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

It's looking good Ted!
A bit overgrown, but that just means there's more to look at, right? 
For once the java fern looks swamped.


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

Wow it has grown alot huh. I like the trimmed look like you had before, but thats just me.


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## Brilliant (Apr 11, 2006)

Hey your tank looks really lush!
What happened to the other pics? I love seeing the progression photos 
I like the downoi I am looking for some now.

I was thinking the amount of sunlight in that room has something to do with your summertime grief.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I think you are right on the mark re: that sunlight. 

Every summer the tank has gone through an evil phase. During the winter months, I have toyed with every variable imaginable, and the tank held without any problems. Next summer I plan to cover the tank with a blanket before I go to bed. Sorry I couldn't provide any progression photos. It was only a 28 day period , and I don't have the same level of obsession as I did 3 years ago.

I like the thin look better too. But, to keep it, I'd have to get into my tank every other week. Summer is too darn busy for that. I'd rather be spending my time at the lake than in my tank .

Thanks, everyone, for your comments.


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

Lol true, I have a huge pond two houses down. Its so relaxing and has bass in it. I fish there for fun.


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## Brilliant (Apr 11, 2006)

unirdna said:


> I think you are right on the mark re: that sunlight.
> 
> Sorry I couldn't provide any progression photos. It was only a 28 day period , and I don't have the same level of obsession as I did 3 years ago.
> 
> Thanks, everyone, for your comments.


I meant it seems that some of the pics were removed. I like seeing the original pics.

I was going to setup a reeftank in my sun room. But that isnt likely now. SO much for dreams. Thats why I had the sunlight thing on the brain.


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Ted - I really like the way you create a plant focal island and then let a lush green sea grow in all around it. I've always liked that look...though I haven't stolen it...yet!

It's also interesting to hear that you don't seem to need a lot of nutrients...though clearly the plant growth is top notch. Though my growth rate doesn't quite compare, I've always noticed a similar trend in my 46g, that being that I just don't seem to need as much nutrients as other. Think it could have anything to do with the structure of the 46g bowfront :icon_eek: . I can't think of any other similarities? (And for those of you that took those last two sentences seriously...lighten up :thumbsup: !)


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## the_noobinator (Jun 10, 2006)

i love banana plants!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*You've all inspired me...*

....to get my butt in gear, and do some hacking.

Hacked it down good. Limnophila has been relocated to a different aquarium, where it will grow more slowly (hopefully). 









http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/20060821sized.jpg

Before photo (so you don't have to flip back a page - a PIA )








http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v340/unirdna/20060812sized.jpg


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

What kind of pennywort are you growing?? I think I have the same plant, it is shooting leaves to the surface of my 75gallon.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

It's "marsh pennywort". Better known as Hydrocotyle verticillata. And it grows to the surface in my tank....much to the contrary of tropica's description. http://www.tropica.dk/productcard_1.asp?id=039 . I love the stuff - great contrast.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I've changed the tank from a centerpiece to a horseshoe layout. I brought back the Limnophila aromatica - placed in the right corner. I missed the color. The Hydrocotyle (lily pad stuff) has moved to another tank, as I was growing tired of the "running". This tank is now very very low maintenance - Blyxa, anubias, java fern, and Limnophila. All grow slowly, require little dosing (thanks to the fish load), and stay where you put them. 

I also added a pair of kribensis, and a few more cardinal tetras. I think this may be my favorite aquascape yet.

Thanks for looking.


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

wow, looks great.

love the color, and the blyxa looks great going all around the tank like that.

good to see its low maintenance!


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## bastalker (Dec 8, 2004)

Lookin sweet as usual Ted!! If ya ever wanna thin some of that blyxa out, I would be honored to take some off yer hands!!:wink: :biggrin:


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Love the look!


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Hey Ted - Good lookin' entry for AGA! Great job IMO. 

Congratulations on a fine entry! roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Not a lot has changed since the last photo; this update is strictly for me - I like to keep the journal active. Tank looks full now. Probably at its peak.


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Ted, the tank is looking nice. Very green, it would look even better if you were able to get some more color out of that Limnophilia aromatica? or Pogostemon stellatus. Anyhow, I can't believe its over a year since you had that Anubias barteri var. 'nana'. Will you be thinning it out to sell or are you going to just keep on growing it? anyways, the growth looks great. Keep it up!


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Ted..you tank rocks as usual. It is lush and pretty. Maybe pull back a little on the NO3 and see how much reds you can get out of that Limnophila...looking good!


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

unirdna said:


> Tank looks full now. Probably at its peak.


VERY dramatic Ted.

I'm partial to the monochromatic look. A garish collage of colors... anyone can do that. What you've achieved with this black/green juxtaposition is beautiful IMO. And not necessarily easy. Great job.

PS - I really like the balance too.


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Yeah, Very nice Ted! I wish I could train myself to chuck the stems. Every time I do, someone shows a sweet new variety, like Hygrophila balsamica - (thank-you Miss F. Newbie) which I just have grow for a while.At least Limnophila aromatica grows slow enough that one can handle it. I really like the java as a center piece too.


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## AlGee (Sep 7, 2006)

did you throw out your pennywort?  :icon_excl


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## ianmoede (Oct 1, 2004)

Beautiful job, only criticism is (and i constantly have the problem myself with "dwarf, yeah right" sag) is that things look crowded when they grow up against the glass of the tank. In your case it looks like blyxa on the bottom left edge.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Thanks for the comments, folks!

*John and Newb*, Nitrate starving has never worked for me when it comes to reddening up the stems. They get red as they reach the light and that is the only sure thing (for my tank). I've had many trimming episodes of that anubias. I'm never sold any; always having given them away to my local plant club. They are hands down, one the best aquarium plants available. I've had one sit in a bucket in my basement for 2 months - I forgot about it - and it didn't show one sign of stress. Plopped it in a tank and it started sending out new leaves in a few days. 

*Steve*, thanks for the compliments and analysis. In truth, it is the works of Seneske that inspire this tank. Slow growers - few species. I like the look more and more every time I walk past it . I recently got my hands on a couple stems of P. stellata. They are tangled and full of white roots; a real eyesore - right up front :hihi:. Just an experiment. I've always wanted to see if my tank will grow the plant.

*Betowess*, please see comments to Steve re: stems :hihi:. No one is as disciplined as he/she thinks . 

*AlGee*, are you a spokesman for the Hydrocotyl Society ? I swear I didn't hurt the plant. The wort was moved to my 30g tank. It's spreading everywhere, and continues to grow tall despite being under a canopy of water lettuce and sword leaves.

*ianmoede*, I agree completely with your comments roud:. No doubt, I would lose points for the plants growing against the glass if the photo was entered in a contest.


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## BSS (Sep 24, 2004)

Nice updates, Ted! Reminds me that I need to go take a shot of my tank as well. Great growth...as always!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*A new beginning....*

The tank has been completely broken down. I removed and washed the gravel (in aquarium water, of course), and took a razor blade to every inch of glass.

The new tank will be a low[er] light, moss, brachy, river bottom. The only plants from the old aquascape that will be used in the new are the anubias nana. I purchased a bunch of manzanita, and it's soaking in a trashcan as I type. The amount of tannins that have already leached out is amazing - looks like iced tea. 

Keep an eye on the swap n shop for the removed plants. Some are spoken for, but there will be much available. Certainly some Blyxa, and likely the java ferns as well. John, I know you have spoken for some anubias, and I'll drop you a PM when the new scape is done. I'm sure there will be some left over, but for now, I'm going to hang on to all of it because you never know which piece will look good in which place.

So that's it: Branches, moss, crypts, anubias, and maybe a few sprigs of pygmy chain sword running on the bottom. The only fish in the tank will be my school of cardinals. Rupey and I have compiled our funds and order some crystal red shrimps. If they work out, there will be some of those in there, as well.

More photos and updates coming in the next few weeks. I'm considering starting a new thread. What do most folks do when they wipe the slate? Thoughts? Should I just keep piling on this one?

The "removed":









Manzanita order:









Manzanita color - Dry:









Manzanita color - Wet:









Manzanita Soaking:









Manzanita Sunk (used a diving belt with 6 lbs):









Current state of the tank 









A Closer view:


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## TheOtherGeoff (Feb 11, 2003)

thats alot of anubus. do you have any plans to replant any of the stems you removed?


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Umm no TOG he said he is moving toward moss/anubias and branches the stems will go on sale  wooohooo


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## TheOtherGeoff (Feb 11, 2003)

fresh_lynny said:


> Umm no TOG he said he is moving toward moss/anubias and branches the stems will go on sale  wooohooo


oh yeah. there it is. haha. thats what i get for not reading it all.


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Only Ted would use a divers belt to weight down his Manzanita. The rest of us guys have to use rocks! Its such a nice thread, maybe keep it going so newbies will see it. Then again, new tank look. New thread. Either way I suppose.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

I vote for the new thread


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## aquanut415 (Jan 21, 2006)

unirdna said:


> More photos and updates coming in the next few weeks. I'm considering starting a new thread. What do most folks do when they wipe the slate? Thoughts? Should I just keep piling on this one?


keep piling them on here... starting a new thread can look like a desperate attempt to make people look at something we have all already seen!

but please do keep us posted on the tank....


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

but if it is completely new, then it isn't something we've already seen...


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## aquanut415 (Jan 21, 2006)

hey lynn, i do agree with you. if you have a new setup, and want to start a new thread, please by all means do so, or even if its just a new layout in an old tank... who really cares what everyone else thinks? just be prepared to hear others opinions if you should choose to play the look at my thread game (sorta tiresome, sorta pathetic IMO)... 

just seems to me that one of the nicest things about photo journals is to be able to see what has gone on in the history of the tank, the best looks and the worst.... not just the best moment of the tanks life.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

Though, some tanks have no bad points in their life to show. :icon_smil And some tanks are built with the skill to have moments worthy of exultation.

This has been one of the journals I've followed with admiration ever since joining PT more than 2 years ago! I remember admiring it at the very start of my aquascaping, and can't wait to see the newer incarnation that follows. Much worth honoring with a new thread IMO.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I appreciate the input, everyone. It was Scolley's "redo" that made me think I may need a new thread. But, I now realize his situation was different, as he was fed up with an algae battle and consequently had to wipe his entire tank off the face of TPT . I haven't actually ripped the entire tank down and sanitized it. It was doing fine, and I simply wanted a change. And it isn't officially "completely new". I think this consitutes sticking with the same thread. Regardless, I really appreciate the kinds words, especially those of Steven Chong, offering justification for the creation of a new thread.

'Nuf said on that subject . Back to the tank.

I was stunned to discover that after only 24 hours, many of the manzanita pieces are already negatively buoyant. Everything I've read said this would take weeks. So, as soon as I start to see the tannin leaching slowing down, it'll be game on. I have placed a couple submerged powerheads in the tank to hopefully speed up this process - I think the water flow may also reduce the "slimes" and "molds" that sometimes grow on soaking manzanita. I have no blind to compare it to, so that is just a hunch .


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

I found my manzanita to be similar in behavior. A few pieces sank in a couple of days while the majority took about two weeks. I didn't have any problems with mold or fungi though and the water was stagnant except for a complete change every few days.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

*The End...*

After some thought, I have decided to shut down this aquarium. I will be selling off the tank, stand, light, and substrate. 

But......I'll be keeping the hardware because - da da da da - I'm getting a 90cm ADA tank! In the next couple weeks, I'll be ordering the goods and building a stand. I've emailed Jeff Senske a few questions, and as soon as he gets back to me, the money hits the table. Keep your eyes on the photo forum. The new tank _will_ be getting a new thread .

It's been 3 years. Thanks to all who offered input and praise.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Wooo Hooo! That's great Ted. :bounce: 

I don't mean about the loss of the bowfront... it's been a beautiful tank, and a great learning tool for you too. But I'm excited about the new tank. You've earned it!

Yahoo!

That's gonna look great. And I, for one, can't wait to see the good things you are going to do with it! roud:


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## TheOtherGeoff (Feb 11, 2003)

wonderful tank. i cant wait to see what you are able to do with a 90.


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

sweet~~~ I bet it will be a doosy~


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Will be sad to see this tank go.. Looking forward to seeing the new one!


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## organic sideburns (Dec 22, 2005)

I never thought I would see this thread end. lol.

Cant wait for your new set up.


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## styxx (Jul 2, 2003)

unirda,
Believe me it is well worth the investment. The construction quality is, simply amazing. They know what they're doing...you literally can hardly see any silicone at all. Period. Its almost like the glass panels are just touching each other...I got mine from aquaforestaquarium.com and they know how to SHIP these bad boys, I think I could have jumped on top of the box and not even slightly chipped it!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

styxx1 said:


> ...they know how to SHIP these bad boys, I think I could have jumped on top of the box and not even slightly chipped it!


That is what I would expect for nearly 200 bones :icon_eek: I suppose you can't really cut any corners when shipping one of these from Japan, though. If you tried to simply wrap it up in cardboard, the cardboard would be the only thing that arrives at your door. Still, I don't know if I'll be able to bring myself to throw the box in the trash. I might have to build a coffee table out it.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

Man, I'm jealous . . . :hihi: :icon_lol:


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