# Dirted tanks- clear as mud!



## Italionstallion888 (Jun 29, 2013)

I sifted my miracle grow for the wood bits. I put a 1/2 inch of it in the tank (started with a pile in the center) poured a layer of sand around the edges of the tank and spread the dirt even. Added another inch of sand on top to cap. 

Algae issue will be driven by your light selection. I went low/med light. 

I stuffed the tank from the start. Had some die back but I did semi aggressive trims and it all came back. 

After a few failed attempts, I learned to be gentle with the substrate. I dare not bump the tank, and I poke some holes before I uproot/replant. If the tank can balance out, water changes I've found really disrupt the tank. I do 1 monthly small change to pick up mulm, and top off the rest of the time. The tank just grows now.


----------



## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

You learn to drive by driving not by reading . Throw an inch of dirt in the tank. Add an inch of play sand that you rinsed before. Plant heavily. Then see what grows. Once the tank stabilizes, add the fauna. Your corries will be happy. Mine are and so are the angels and the critters.

Dirt tanks are meant to be watched evolve. The evolve slowly but steadily. its rewarding.


----------



## CannaBrain (Oct 3, 2008)

1. IMHO, I think mgop is... I don't know how to say... cheap. A more expensive, cheap alternative to actually taking the time to batch up your own mts. I have bought bags for a $1 in the past. It's cheap and GREAT but takes a little more time and effort. I believe in the MTS method, I don't believe in the mgop concept. I've set up several tanks now using mts and have had nothing but GREAT results. I think if you go w/ mgop, you should go thru the mineralizing process still, but hey, that's just my opinion. 

2. The only plants I have lost in a dirt tank are ones that were not previously established and that had a stressful shipment. I expect these would have had issues in established tanks in their condition as well. Of the plants that failed, most from the same shipment did not. Plants I've pulled from other tanks that have been grown in my chemistry have only ever taken off once transferred into my mts tanks.

3. Meh, personal preference mostly. White or light color sand will look dirtier by contrast and will also reflect more light... technically more prone to algae growth. Haven't used white sand in a long time, but w/ natural buff colored sand, haven't noticed more or less issues than w/ black sand tanks. 

4. Not familiar w/ this. Obviously heavy root feeders will make the most use of a nutrient rich substrate. Examples are plants that "run" or "creep" like crypts, grasses and other carpeters, swords and the like. But in my experience, once my stem plants hit the payload thru their cap, they take off.

I've capped w/ sand as well as gravels like flora-max. Only difference I find is that it's MUCH easier to plant into sand.


----------



## Raymond S. (Dec 29, 2012)

"but after weeks of researching dirted tanks I finally feel confused enough to post for the first time."
Sound strangely familiar...LOL...
I did "Tom's Hardware" a site for computers and great for info for those interested in building their own. Then I found an actual "IT" forum for computer geeks.
I could only understand about every third word in each sentence...LOL...
But you may find something in this which could help at times.
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=27118
MGOCPM...Miracle Grow Organic Choice Potting Mix
Has sterilized chicken droppings as a nutrient source. Use "as is" except that you might sift it for larger pieces of wood which likely may float up.
Any "Organic" soil will work. Mineralized top soil being the best. Occasionally sold on here from various members...check the "For Sale" section. Unless of course you want to make your own. Sound like you already have a list for it.
An inch is what I've read about how much/w 1.5-2" of cap.
Probably can use less of the bottom layer in smaller tanks.
If you keep moving the plants to a minimum and pull them out very slowly you will
minimize the mess. But I don't have a dirted tank so this is what I've read on here.
98% of all plants get nutrients from both top and roots. Those not in the sub like Anubias are the exceptions. Supplying ferts in the water gives plants the benefit of
getting the nutrients from both available sources and IMO reduces the use from the sub thus extending it's life.


----------



## Monster Fish (Mar 15, 2011)

Krisnbaum said:


> Hello! I have been lurking around these forums for years but after weeks of researching dirted tanks I finally feel confused enough to post for the first time. :help:
> 
> With Petco's $1/gallon sale going on, I finally decided to replace my old, leaky 29 gallon with a new tank. I was so excited, until I started agonizing over substrate choice. I got this silly idea in my head that I wanted to try out this "dirted tank" thing and see what all the fuss is about. It seems the more I read the more confused I get. Lately, I have been reading some pretty scary horror stories, so I was hoping those with more experience could help clarify a few things or point me in the direction of any resources that you found helpful.
> 
> ...


1: I've used both but Mineralized topsoil >>> MGOCPM. The effort to make a batch is worth it. No need to worry about your substrate being unstable for a few months because of decaying organic matter. You can use dolomite, potash, and clay with bagged organic soils no problem though.

2. Do regular water changes and monitor your parameters for the first few months. Fast growing stem plants will be needed along with floaters. As the substrate continues to settle down, start adding more slower growers like crypts and other heavy rooting plants.

3. Pool filter sand is fine to use as a cap. If you plan on rescaping, slowly pull up any plants, especially those with large root systems. You can also use a sharp knife to cut back any excess roots in the substrate. You should then do a water change after any uprooting.

4. Epiphytes like java ferns and mosses will need water column dosing if kept in a dirted tank, especially with fast growing weeds in the tank. Otherwise, most plants will do great with dirt.


----------



## Krisnbaum (Jul 22, 2015)

Thank you! Thank you! I felt like MTS was the way to go but needed someone to confirm it. I appreciate your help!

I am assuming I dont need more than one bag for a 29 gal. does anyone have a suggestion of how much I top soil I should start out with? If I make too much, can I store the rest to use in another tank down the road? or will it "go bad" if not used right away?


----------



## HDBenson (Jan 26, 2015)

No, your batch will not go bad if you prepare too much. I have a batch that's a few months old waiting for two tanks. I just wet this batch every few weeks with WC water and keep turning it until it gets mostly dry and water again, basically to keep the bacteria alive.


----------



## Monster Fish (Mar 15, 2011)

Start with two bags for a 29. You might lose a bit of volume after you sift the soil, depending on how much junk is in it. I started with about 120lbs of topsoil and ended up with 7 gallons worth of usable MTS after sifting out all the rocks and pieces of bark.


----------



## Krisnbaum (Jul 22, 2015)

I want to thank you guys, again, for your help. I have one more question. I have been soaking and drying my top soil all week. It is hot and Dry in CO, so the soil actually dries out in like 6-8 hours. Do I need to soak it a full 24 hours or can I soak it over night and then dry it again, the next day? 

I purchased just the cheapest top soil from Home depot. it is mostly sand, a random stick, here and there, and I am assuming some peat? (it is a lighter/fluffier, blacker substance that easily get poured out with the water). Is it OK that a lot of that has gotten poured out? I wasnt sure if I was supposed to try and save it, or not, and it is hard to remove the water without this stuff going with it.

Thanks guys!


----------



## bpb (Mar 8, 2011)

The miracle grow becomes mineralized over time in the tank as it decays. Sure this takes a few months, but i think too often people want immediate results. I'be actually done two batches of MTS and am currently on my first miracle gro tank. It's true. The first few months the substrate is incredibly unstable and gasses off a ton. I have had some algae. Some medium and difficult to keep plants have NOT done well right off the bat, but about 3-4 months in now and they're really starting to come around. I did add calcium, magnesium, and potassium to the soil as well before capping. No clay as I dose plenty of iron. Either way patience is an virtue and the more you invest the better your results will be. By invest I mean in learning and research, AND invest money in quality equipment (co2, lights, water, ferts). 

Hindsight, if I did it all over again for a 4th time (all attempts have been on the same 75 gallon tank, I don't do multi tank syndrome) I would just buy Ada aqua soil and be done with it. It's expensive but the track record speaks for itself 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Wilderman204 (Mar 5, 2015)

Try using worm castings instead of MIracle grow organic choice. It is almost already in a "mineralized"state, and I've seen better plant growth compared to MG. find "worm gold plus" if you can, it's the best bagged worm poop.
Just add a sprinkle of sul-po-mag and dolomite on the bottom, cover with 1"of worm castings mixed with red clay, cap with 1" of sand. If you are adding fish they will provide phosphates when the worm castings run out. Otherwise add some soft rock phosphate before the castings too.

Also if you can find it, add some Azomite, or "glacial rock dust"to your dirt. Both are powdered rock products containing 70+ trace minerals. I see WAY better plant growth with this in my dirt, but it's not necessary.
You can still grow great plants with just capped MG or casting.Adding the other things will prevent you running into the common defficencies in about a year. And dolomite will help prevent the dirt or castings from acidifying the water as they break down. And if you do use MG screen it. It's hard to pull out plants when their roots are wrapped up in chunks of wood under the cap.


----------



## Thibault02 (Apr 12, 2017)

Hi! 

So I tried a dirted tank for the first time. I feel I had did my research and knew what I was doing, however, the outcome is not what I expected. I put the Miracle Grow in first and then capped it with black sand. It was fine and the water was clear UNTIL I added my filter. I let my filter run over night thinking the water would eventually clear...well it has been almost two weeks now and the water is still the brownish dirt color and does not seem like it is going to clear any time soon. Can someone please help and explain to me why this is? I want to start adding plants and fish but I want the water clear first. Any pointers will help. Thank you!


----------



## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

Thibault02 said:


> Hi!
> 
> So I tried a dirted tank for the first time. I feel I had did my research and knew what I was doing, however, the outcome is not what I expected. I put the Miracle Grow in first and then capped it with black sand. It was fine and the water was clear UNTIL I added my filter. I let my filter run over night thinking the water would eventually clear...well it has been almost two weeks now and the water is still the brownish dirt color and does not seem like it is going to clear any time soon. Can someone please help and explain to me why this is? I want to start adding plants and fish but I want the water clear first. Any pointers will help. Thank you!


What kind of media in your filter. To remove the brown color you'll need carbon or purigen.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


----------



## bigbadjon (Aug 6, 2015)

How deep did you make the cap? You will likely have to pull it and start over if you disrupted it.


----------



## MtAnimals (May 17, 2015)

I've done 2 small tanks with miracle gro,just put it in straight out of the bag,and capped it with blasting sand the same depth.I've been very pleased with the results.I'm not running any co2,and everything I've planted in it is thriving.

I had a couple of plants that survived,but just sorta stayed the same size,an amazon sword and a blyxa,I had them both in ECO with root caps,but when I put them in the MGO tanks,they went nuts,doubled and tripled in size in a month's time.

Time will tell how it works out long term,I've only had these set up a month or two.


----------

