# LED light that can grow "Red" plants really well



## Noahma (Oct 18, 2009)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> Ok I am looking for suggestions and supporting pictures that shows that an LED light can grow red plants in a Dutch tank. I am planning a 40B and I would prefer to do LED over T5HO but I need examples of successful LED's that have grown red plants and not just had then survive but *thrive*.
> 
> Please include the following
> 
> ...


The BML (build my LED) fixtures will do this very well. I have a 40b with several species of red plant and all are doing very well. You can check my tank out in my sig below. I will also try to get a good picture here after the water has cleared from my water change. 

The light is a build my led dutch spectrum MC (multi channel) I run it with their controller which allows sunrise and sunset, along with lightning and cloud cover.


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

One of my concerns with a BML and a 40 breeder is... will I need more than 1 fixture. I would prefer to only have on as they are $275 a pop. How many do you have on your 40B?


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## Noahma (Oct 18, 2009)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> One of my concerns with a BML and a 40 breeder is... will I need more than 1 fixture. I would prefer to only have on as they are $275 a pop. How many do you have on your 40B?


I am running one fixture. The light drop off at the top of the tank took some getting used to, but coverage at the bottom of the tank is great. I have the 90* optics. A second one might be nice in the future, but I don't see it as necessary. The light is powerful. I have mine set to run at 85% power during the lighting cycle, and the plants are still doing very well.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

Noahma said:


> I am running one fixture. The light drop off at the top of the tank took some getting used to, but coverage at the bottom of the tank is great. I have the 90* optics. A second one might be nice in the future, but I don't see it as necessary. The light is powerful. I have mine set to run at 85% power during the lighting cycle, and the plants are still doing very well.


You could raise it 3-9" to take care of that problem..


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## Noahma (Oct 18, 2009)

jeffkrol said:


> You could raise it 3-9" to take care of that problem..








Nah, would rather have the light on the tank, my last lighting setup was hung lights, I got tired of the look. I don't mind the light drop off at the top of the tank, nothing to see there anyway. And I can change the intensity of the lights on the fly with the solunar


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## seandelevan (Sep 24, 2006)

I was about to pull the trigger on switching T5HO to LED on my 40. But somewhere on this site someone (can't remember who) had 4!!!!!! Finnex fugeray LEDs on their 40 and their red plants still went green. He/she went back to their T5HO. I've heard BML grows reds but with that price tag im a little gun shy and skeptical. I will go ballistic if I paid that much money for a light that turned my reds green.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

seandelevan said:


> I was about to pull the trigger on switching T5HO to LED on my 40. But somewhere on this site someone (can't remember who) had 4!!!!!! Finnex fugeray LEDs on their 40 and their red plants still went green. He/she went back to their T5HO. I've heard BML grows reds but with that price tag im a little gun shy and skeptical. I will go ballistic if I paid that much money for a light that turned my reds green.


Just 1 practical experience and one FYI re: light
Sonychemp had really good success w/ a Fluval aquatic plant light
on a 20 high.
An expensive but well balanced spectrum LED:








http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?278881-Red-plants-and-LED-s/page

Background info.. 
http://www.sunlitest.com/showroom/index.php?main_page=page&id=63

More red, more blue, more intensity, CO2, nitrogen, iron, genetics ect..all play a part.

A good video:
http://youtu.be/y4WNMBKKVjU

Summary: High light, low nitrogen, high iron, high CO2, broad spectrum.. and naturally red plants..


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## tigertim (Jan 11, 2015)

i also use the Fluval overhanging luminiere Led.....getting very good results all round....got 6 inches of growth on Rotala Macrandra in 2 months....underrated light imho


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## seandelevan (Sep 24, 2006)

jeffkrol said:


> A good video:
> http://youtu.be/y4WNMBKKVjU
> 
> Summary: High light, low nitrogen, high iron, high CO2, broad spectrum.. and naturally red plants..


Interesting. At the end he pretty much scoffs at LED's for red plants. Says T5ho are the way to go.


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## FatherLandDescendant (Jul 24, 2014)

The Current Sat+Pro should be able to grow anything if the manufacture can be believed. I've yet to try red plants as I'm waiting for warmer weather before I order some. But the 36" fixture on a 40b gives great coverage front to back even at the top of the tank. Run it full spectrum and grow all the algae you want


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## TroyVSC (Oct 22, 2012)

The finnex planted+ has red less specifically for growing plants. They seem to get good reviews.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

seandelevan said:


> Interesting. At the end he pretty much scoffs at LED's for red plants. Says T5ho are the way to go.


Yes that was his second error..  He uses 2000k 6000k and 10000k bulbs.. yet thinks LED's are all "one color".. 
apparently so our florescents since he needs 3 "colors".... 



Yea LED's bite..


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

jeffkrol said:


> Yes that was his second error..  He uses 2000k 6000k and 10000k bulbs.. yet thinks LED's are all "one color"..
> apparently so our florescents since he needs 3 "colors"....
> 
> 
> ...


Ok Jeffkrol are you being serious or sarcastic. Do you think BML or the Sat Planted Plus Pro would do a good job?

Or do LED's really suck for this application and T5 is the best way to go if I wanted to grow red plants


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

seandelevan said:


> I was about to pull the trigger on switching T5HO to LED on my 40. But somewhere on this site someone (can't remember who) had 4!!!!!! Finnex fugeray LEDs on their 40 and their red plants still went green. He/she went back to their T5HO. I've heard BML grows reds but with that price tag im a little gun shy and skeptical. I will go ballistic if I paid that much money for a light that turned my reds green.


The guys name was Ebi

Here is his tank Journal

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=522545

And yes he did end up going to T5HO but I also believe that the LED spread he had was not appropriate. Yes he had high light but he also had a wide spectrum of lights across the 4 fixtures and maybe his problem is that he didn't have enough of what he needed to sustain the Red.


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## Xiaozhuang (Feb 15, 2012)

BMLs with red/Blue LEDs do make the reds pop....


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> Ok Jeffkrol are you being serious or sarcastic. Do you think BML or the Sat Planted Plus Pro would do a good job?
> 
> Or do LED's really suck for this application and T5 is the best way to go if I wanted to grow red plants


Yes I was being sarcastic. I believe "red" is more complicated than people like to think it is.
I see some having absolutely no problem w/ reds and LED's
That said, I also suspect the fact that LED's, having zero UV may also play a minor factor. That "sunscreen effect".
No proof of this though.

It is much more important to me to have control of color and intensity in an easy to deal with fashion (multicolored, programmable fixtures) 

so I have a bias.. 
The 6500k "thing" has somewhat hindered the reputation of LED's..


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## Seattle_Aquarist (Jun 15, 2008)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> Ok I am looking for suggestions and supporting pictures that shows that an LED light can grow red plants in a Dutch tank. I am planning a 40B and I would prefer to do LED over T5HO but I need examples of successful LED's that have grown red plants and not just had then survive but *thrive*.
> 
> Please include the following
> 
> ...


Hi MEandYouPhoto,

I did a DIY LED retrofit using an AH Supply kit.

AH Supply 26 watt; 6400K; 21.5" LED Lamp
Standard 20H (24" long) tank


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

jeffkrol said:


> MEandYouPhoto said:
> 
> 
> > Ok Jeffkrol are you being serious or sarcastic. Do you think BML or the Sat Planted Plus Pro would do a good job?
> ...



So what lights do you use?


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

Seattle_Aquarist said:


> MEandYouPhoto said:
> 
> 
> > Ok I am looking for suggestions and supporting pictures that shows that an LED light can grow red plants in a Dutch tank. I am planning a 40B and I would prefer to do LED over T5HO but I need examples of successful LED's that have grown red plants and not just had then survive but *thrive*.
> ...



I would love to do something like that but my DIY skills are limited to say the least.


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## kman (Dec 11, 2013)

AnotherHobby seems to grow red plants nicely with the Ecoxotic E-Series lights. His 60P tank is shallower than a 40b, though.


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

kman said:


> AnotherHobby seems to grow red plants nicely with the Ecoxotic E-Series lights. His 60P tank is shallower than a 40b, though.



What a great example! Thanks Kman. 

I will make sure and send AnotherHobby a PM if I have any questions regarding his LED's performance


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## kman (Dec 11, 2013)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> What a great example! Thanks Kman.
> 
> I will make sure and send AnotherHobby a PM if I have any questions regarding his LED's performance


He's been off the board, mostly, for a few months (pursuing "other hobbies" LOL), but someone in the E-Series club can likely answer your questions.

Or I could, at least as they relate to the 60P. Again, bear in mind a deeper tank will have a different experience, but there's a lot of adjustment possible with regards to putting the light directly on the rim vs. raising it, etc.

Here's a bad picture of mine. I have both the E-Series and a Current Sat+. Red plants don't seem to be a problem. Mine aren't as red as AH's, but I'm using root tabs in Activ-Flora and AH was using ADA AquaSoil.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> So what lights do you use?


I build my own..


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## ahem (Dec 27, 2014)

I've got a Finnex planted plus on my 20G long, my reds are ok, very deep at the top of the plant but then they green out lower. Stunned at some of the tanks posted on here. I love red plants and need to figure out how to get those with just Excel and no CO2. I add Seachem micros and iron religiously. But clearly I am missing some crucial piece of the puzzle.


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## OhioTank (Mar 11, 2015)

I have a 75G and I have had no problem growing red plants, I use 2 lights on the tank. 1 48" Planted+ and 1 Mainland Plant LED 48-60. Im in the medium light range with Pres. CO2 and PPS-Pro. I currently have no reason to add FE as all the reds are doing extremely well. The fine planted+ series are very reasonable even if you wanted to run 2 of them to get higher PAR


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

Xiaozhuang said:


> BMLs with red/Blue LEDs do make the reds pop....



Xiaozhuang, First let me say, my wife and I sorted through hundreds of profile pictures on here and picked tanks we liked the look of. Two of your tanks were in the top 5! 

The BML are my top choice and I am glad to see you have had such suceess with them. How many do you have on your tanks? (number of lights, size of lights, size of tanks) Thanks!


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

jeffkrol said:


> I build my own..


Jeffkrol do you have a build thread for your lights?


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> Jeffkrol do you have a build thread for your lights?


no it is a fairly simplistic build..


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## Xiaozhuang (Feb 15, 2012)

> Xiaozhuang, First let me say, my wife and I sorted through hundreds of profile pictures on here and picked tanks we liked the look of. Two of your tanks were in the top 5!
> 
> The BML are my top choice and I am glad to see you have had such suceess with them. How many do you have on your tanks? (number of lights, size of lights, size of tanks) Thanks!


Thanks ! The pics are taken only with the Dutch on, though I run the tank with both a dutch and the 10k... Coloration wise, the 10k kinda gives a very bluish tint, the dutch gives better colors


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## Kntry (Dec 26, 2013)

Where do you get Iron for the tanks?


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## ahem (Dec 27, 2014)

Kntry said:


> Where do you get Iron for the tanks?


I use Seachem Iron. Your LFS probably has it. I think Seachem Flourish has some iron in it to along with all the other traces. I use extra iron for my red plants. Hopefully that isn't voodoo science.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

ahem said:


> I use Seachem Iron. Your LFS probably has it. I think Seachem Flourish has some iron in it to along with all the other traces. I use extra iron for my red plants. Hopefully that isn't voodoo science.


Iron inhibits the breakdown of the red pigments.. but you need those pigments first.. 

see pg 140
https://books.google.com/books?id=Q...on inhibits breakdown of anthocyanins&f=false


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## seandelevan (Sep 24, 2006)




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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

I agree, the Dutch BML is the best for red plants.


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## adamfish (Feb 3, 2015)

^^^^what a deal! The 36" fixture like that is $379 at my lfs. I laughed and walked away.


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

CO2 is primary need for red plants irrespective of lighting.IMHO
Then one can decide what bulbs will make the plant's look more red than another.


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

seandelevan said:


>


Yea I have that same deal at my nearby Petco. But I did some research on that light and it really is only effective for "low light" plants


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> Yea I have that same deal at my nearby Petco. But I did some research on that light and it really is only effective for "low light" plants


W/ CO2 injection it can hold it's own in shallower tanks.. (under 14" guessitmate)
due to the LED composition is will score a bit low on a Apogee 
PAR meter..IF that is what was used..

anyway only known PAR chart..'








http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=312713&page=6
2 of them over fairly normal tank depths (<20") would be at least medium light..


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

Raul-7 said:


> I agree, the Dutch BML is the best for red plants.


That's likely what I will be getting

Bump:


jeffkrol said:


> W/ CO2 injection it can hold it's own in shallower tanks.. (under 14" guessitmate)
> due to the LED composition is will score a bit low on a Apogee
> PAR meter..IF that is what was used..
> 
> ...


Even as the half off price two of them would be price equivalent to 1 BML.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

MEandYouPhoto said:


> That's likely what I will be getting
> 
> Bump:
> 
> Even as the half off price two of them would be price equivalent to 1 BML.


Yes the 3w emitters compared to these smd types is night and day.


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## MEandYouPhoto (Jul 1, 2014)

Xiaozhuang said:


> Thanks ! The pics are taken only with the Dutch on, though I run the tank with both a dutch and the 10k... Coloration wise, the 10k kinda gives a very bluish tint, the dutch gives better colors


So on the tank you pictured. You have both the 10k and the Dutch?

What size is the tank?


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## csynic (Jun 19, 2015)

hey do you have a link to the BML dutch LED that you used for the shot? can't seem to find it on the interwebs - thanks!

Bump: oh wait sorry for the double post, I found it. realized BML = buildmyled lol. what kind of CFL bulb do you use?


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