# Melt or deficiency?



## Surf (Jun 13, 2017)

Sachem trace has no macro nutrients. The root tabs might or might not (depends on the brand). But root tabs will mainly fertilizer the substrate. Not the water column. Sachem trace also doesn't have iron. I think most of your problems are due to the fertilizer. 

I think in addition to trace you need Iron and all the macro nutrients. You can also get Sachem equilibrium. It will supply half the macros (calcium, magnesium, and sulfur). Increase your water hardness by 2 degrees. nitrogen and phosphorous and potassium are probably also needed.You can purchase these in liquid form (Sachem dose sell them). But others also sell them in dry or liquid form.


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## mgeorges (Feb 1, 2017)

What size is your tank? Another problem you might be facing is excessive light. How many bulbs is that T8, because that tank looks BRIGHT! More light = higher demand for nutrients and CO2, and you'll also start to see algae very badly if you're not dialed in and well balanced. I didn't see anything about injected co2, so I'm guessing you're not doing that. Are you dosing Excel or another glut source?


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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

mgeorges said:


> What size is your tank? Another problem you might be facing is excessive light. How many bulbs is that T8, because that tank looks BRIGHT! More light = higher demand for nutrients and CO2, and you'll also start to see algae very badly if you're not dialed in and well balanced. I didn't see anything about injected co2, so I'm guessing you're not doing that. Are you dosing Excel or another glut source?


Its a 55 gallon. There are two bulbs, one on each side of the tank. I was actually worried about not having enough light! 
I am not injecting CO2 and it's not something I want to get into at this time, probably eventually down the road, but not yet haha. 
I was worried if I started dosing macros and micros that I'd have an excess of nutrients and grow algae, is that not the case? The only thing I'm doing currently is Trace, although I'm looking into dry ferts as we speak. 

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## mgeorges (Feb 1, 2017)

That doesn't sound too bad, your tank just looks really bright. You'll need to dose macros, just at a much lower amount than someone running a high tech tank. Dying plants and an imbalance will cause algae, not ferts. The macros you'll want, you can get from either greenleafaquariums.com or nilocg.com, whichever is cheaper. I've gotten to the point where I like GLA's fert jars because some of my bags are starting to fall apart. You'll need KNO3, KH2PO4 and K2SO4. I would also pickup a jug of Excel or Metricide. Metricide is much more concentrated than Excel, FYI. It will provide a carbon source for the plants. 

Do you know your GH/KH? If you're using tap water, you should probably be fine with trace and those three macros.


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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

mgeorges said:


> That doesn't sound too bad, your tank just looks really bright. You'll need to dose macros, just at a much lower amount than someone running a high tech tank. Dying plants and an imbalance will cause algae, not ferts. The macros you'll want, you can get from either greenleafaquariums.com or nilocg.com, whichever is cheaper. I've gotten to the point where I like GLA's fert jars because some of my bags are starting to fall apart. You'll need KNO3, KH2PO4 and K2SO4. I would also pickup a jug of Excel or Metricide. Metricide is much more concentrated than Excel, FYI. It will provide a carbon source for the plants.
> 
> Do you know your GH/KH? If you're using tap water, you should probably be fine with trace and those three macros.


Thank you for the help!!
I think the pictures look so bright because of my phone, Pixel 2 does amazing things with it's camera haha[emoji106][emoji108]
I think I'll go with NilocG, shipping is cheaper. Ill order a bottle of Excel now too. 
Do you think about half dose would be good? 

I just tested my GH/KH for the first time today and if I'm reading it correctly I have soft water. GH/KH index on the paper the test kit came with said 71.6

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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

fall.freeman91 said:


> Thank you for the help!!
> I think the pictures look so bright because of my phone, Pixel 2 does amazing things with it's camera haha[emoji106][emoji108]
> I think I'll go with NilocG, shipping is cheaper. Ill order a bottle of Excel now too.
> Do you think about half dose would be good?
> ...


Should I also buy Magnesium or stick to NPK for now? 

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## mgeorges (Feb 1, 2017)

If you have really soft water, a water softener or want to use RO(DI), then you may want to invest in CaSO4 and MgSO4. If your hardness is about 72ppm though, then you're around a GH of 4.3 degrees, which isn't bad. Should be more than enough Mg and Ca in your tap for a low tech tank. Up to you if you want to spend a few extra bucks on them to have around, just in case. But note as you add CaSO4 and MgSO4, you need a Ca:Mg ratio of 3:1 which you can calculate on rotalabutterfly.com. Note that the ratio isn't based on weight, but rather ppm's. So if you're adding 15 ppm Ca, you'll want 5 ppm Mg. You'll also be raising your GH, so you gotta watch that. Big GH swings are not liked by some fish. Again, I think you'll probably be fine without those two, but up to you. Is your water city or well?

As far as what to dose, I'll let someone with low tech experience chime in on what they dose.


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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

mgeorges said:


> If you have really soft water, a water softener or want to use RO(DI), then you may want to invest in CaSO4 and MgSO4. If your hardness is about 72ppm though, then you're around a GH of 4.3 degrees, which isn't bad. Should be more than enough Mg and Ca in your tap for a low tech tank. Up to you if you want to spend a few extra bucks on them to have around, just in case. But note as you add CaSO4 and MgSO4, you need a Ca:Mg ratio of 3:1 which you can calculate on rotalabutterfly.com. Note that the ratio isn't based on weight, but rather ppm's. So if you're adding 15 ppm Ca, you'll want 5 ppm Mg. You'll also be raising your GH, so you gotta watch that. Big GH swings are not liked by some fish. Again, I think you'll probably be fine without those two, but up to you. Is your water city or well?
> 
> As far as what to dose, I'll let someone with low tech experience chime in on what they dose.


Ok, I'll wait on the Magnesium then! Thanks  

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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

Sorry, just saw that you also asked about my water. We have city water

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## Orichid123 (Feb 25, 2018)

the swords are heavy iron feeders so tabs and a liquid iron will do as for the others were they sold as potted if so then they were grown emersed and now are under water so they need to change their leaves from emersed to submerged they will defoliate and regrow new leafs the fern are very slow growers so be pait. try api co2 booster for your carbon it is a liquid and works well


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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

Orichid123 said:


> the swords are heavy iron feeders so tabs and a liquid iron will do as for the others were they sold as potted if so then they were grown emersed and now are under water so they need to change their leaves from emersed to submerged they will defoliate and regrow new leafs the fern are very slow growers so be pait. try api co2 booster for your carbon it is a liquid and works well


Thanks! I bought them off eBay, so I'm assuming they were once in someone else's tank, but I'm really not sure. 
I think at least the wisteria was emersed though, based on the shape of it's leaves, it's so different from submerged pics I've seen of wisteria. 

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## sfsamm (Apr 3, 2017)

Low tech here.
The swords definitely appear to me to be transitioning from emersed to submerged. The more rounded leaves with fairly rounded tips that are melting off are giving way to those new nicely sword shaped leaves that you can see starting. Trim off the worst, trying to leave the best 3-4 only is what I do then whack them out one at a time as the new submerged growth unfurls.
Stems I'll avoid comment as after a move to different water I have my own set of struggles with them and they are completely unrelated to what you have so I don't want to misspeak off what I'm working out now.
As for the spots on the Java ferns, whether or not it applies specifically to your situation this is what I've found. The spots occur when A) they are throwing runners which will start showing little roots off the leaves and eventually new growth (usually brown spots though) or B) they apparently get too much light. When mine do that moving them to a shaded area or a lower light tank stops that spot nonsense. But I've been told at least a half a dozen times that light isn't my problem... They also don't seem to like moving to new parameters much and nearly always seem to do that at first even if the tank is otherwise perfect, at least to me. Java fern and I have a relationship that walks a fine line between the trashcan and success, so take this with a grain of salt. Shady spot or wait and see both are cheap and easy and my personal experience is nothing else works lol.  

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## fall.freeman91 (Feb 27, 2018)

sfsamm said:


> Low tech here.
> The swords definitely appear to me to be transitioning from emersed to submerged. The more rounded leaves with fairly rounded tips that are melting off are giving way to those new nicely sword shaped leaves that you can see starting. Trim off the worst, trying to leave the best 3-4 only is what I do then whack them out one at a time as the new submerged growth unfurls.
> Stems I'll avoid comment as after a move to different water I have my own set of struggles with them and they are completely unrelated to what you have so I don't want to misspeak off what I'm working out now.
> As for the spots on the Java ferns, whether or not it applies specifically to your situation this is what I've found. The spots occur when A) they are throwing runners which will start showing little roots off the leaves and eventually new growth (usually brown spots though) or B) they apparently get too much light. When mine do that moving them to a shaded area or a lower light tank stops that spot nonsense. But I've been told at least a half a dozen times that light isn't my problem... They also don't seem to like moving to new parameters much and nearly always seem to do that at first even if the tank is otherwise perfect, at least to me. Java fern and I have a relationship that walks a fine line between the trashcan and success, so take this with a grain of salt. Shady spot or wait and see both are cheap and easy and my personal experience is nothing else works lol.
> ...


Thanks so much for the reply. That's all really helpful! I'm seeing 3 new leaves on each of my swords so that's excting! 
I'll give the shade thing a try with the ferns. Hopefully my relationship with them isn't as complicated as yours, haha!! 
I hope you get your problem with stems sorted out easily [emoji106][emoji4]

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## sfsamm (Apr 3, 2017)

fall.freeman91 said:


> I hope you get your problem with stems sorted out easily [emoji106][emoji4]


Lol I'll take the stems issue as I always wanted crypts and couldn't get those right before so I am still plenty entertained with those... For now [emoji6]


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