# Planted Tank - No CO2



## jcali10

New member here with a question or two. The more I read, the more I am confused. 

I have a 20G tall, fish only tank, that I've had for about a year now. I want to convert to a planted tank. I don't want to deal with CO2 yet. 
What substrate do I want? Sand, Eco-Complete, or plain gravel? 

Lighting, I was thinking about a 55 watt CF from AH Supply. 

I have 12 harlequin rasboras and 3 peppered corys. 

Is it a good idea to run an air stone in the evenings when the lights are out in a planted tank? Since plants generate oxygen in the daytime and consume it at night. 

Can I successfully grow healthy plants without CO2? Your thoughts and inputs are welcome.

Thanks, 
jcali10


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## pittiepride

You can easily grow nice plants with moderate light and no co2. For instance I grow easy low light plants live java fern, giant hygro and wisteria in my 30g with only 40 w flourescent light and light doses of liquid fertilizers.The substrate is less than ideal but it anchors the plants fine. 
An air stone is not needed.

kara


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## CampCreekTexas

I'm a newbie to planted tanks, too, and at first was confused as well. So I started small and slow in a ten gallon tank set in a window giving dappled sunlight and planted some easy to grow plants in it ~ java ferns, mosses, hygros (hygrophilia species), hydrocotyle and pellia. It's linked in my sig (10g shrimp tank) if you want to take a look at it. I don't have any CO2 in it, no filter, and don't use any ferts either. Not yet. I did recently add a 15 watt light above it. I think starting small and slow has helped me not be nervous about this ~ if the whole thing crashes irreperably, I'm not out much and it'll be relatively easy to chunk everything in the tank and start over. I think your 20gallon will allow you that same feeling.

For substrate, I used Soilmaster Select charcoal colored from Lesco. I'm very happy with it so far. It's ridiculously cheap ($17 for a 50lb. bag) and doesn't have many if any extra nutrients which, when you're new and learning, is a good thing IMHO ~ no big algae blooms, swings in PH, ammonia spikes, etc., that would be big problems for a newbie to deal with. I've read about others having those problems and more with other substrates such as EcoComplete, and I didn't want the frustration while I'm learning. I want to learn how to grow the plants first, THEN learn to deal with problems like that. 

I have collected other things that others use as I learn about them from reading the forums ~ dry ferts, some EcoComplete (I think ~ might be another brand ~ it was a partial bag I found for sale in the Swap&Shop forum), Excel, plant fertilizer tablets for use in the substrate next to root feeders, etc. I'll be using those things to experiment with in a couple other tanks I've set up, again all ten gallon tanks. 

I've also started out small with compact spiral flourescent bulbs, the screw-in kind. I wanted to start with them since I can control the wattage above my tanks easier ~ with four receptacles in each lighting setup and both 15watt and 30 watt bulbs on hand, I can change the bulbs out, unscrew some, add more, and generally play around with the amount of light as I see what each light level does. Right now I have just some of those cone-shaped "shop light" reflectors that clip onto things hanging over my tanks. Soon I'll have wooden hoods my stepson is making for me that will fit the tops of the ten gallon tanks. They'll each have four receptacles in them and I'll paint them bright white inside to reflect the light down into the tank better.

About CO2 ~ From what I understand, the more light you have over the tank, the more you'll need CO2. Just how much light is enough to need CO2 I don't know. I also have read that you can use Flourish Excel as a CO2 substitute, atleast with some plants and up to a certain light level. You're at 2.5 watts per gallon, so I'd think you can still get away with using Excel only. I'm not positive, so you might want to do some more reading/research on that.

I'll start using DIY CO2 (soda bottles with yeast mixture ~ LOTS more info on that in the DIY section) when I get the light hoods installed. Right now, things are okay without it ~ I'm getting an algae bloom in one of my tanks and that's probably due to the high amount of light (60 watts) without CO2 plus it being a new tank. I now have some Excel on hand, so will start using that and dosing (fertilizing) using the EI method I think. And if I don't learn enough doing that to fix it, I'll change out the bulbs to only have 30 watts over that tank and try that for a while. Eventually I'll add the DIY CO2, but I want to watch what goes on in there first so I can learn. Hopefully I'll learn enough that in a few months or a year or so, I can add pressurized CO2 (by then I should be able to afford it ).

Again, my goal right now isn't to have a show tank ~ it's to learn. So I don't know how much what I've written here helps you, but hopefully it has atleast a little bit.


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## skabooya

Totally possible and you do not need an airstone. Of course your success will depend on the plants you choose. I have a 20gal high with plain black inert gravel which is the wrong size (slightly too big by a few mm) and only have 15watts of light over the entire tank. I dont have CO2 and I havent used liquid ferts for 3 years now. Insead my tank was overstocked with guppies and my plants went wild! I started with 3 java fern and 1 giant hygro plant and a teeny weeny little single strand of java moss that came attached to one of my ferns. I recently re-did my setup by ripping out lots and lots of ferns, moss and hygro and giving away bags and bags of ziplock bags full of plants. I replaced my guppies with 8 harlequins and 4 peppered corys (gonna get more harlequins). And only because my fish load has gone down dramatically do i see my plants suffering. So, when my lfs can get liquid ferts in (after the floods recede (cant spell) i will pick some up and get my plants nice and green again.


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## jcali10

*re: Planted Tank No CO2*

Thanks everyone for the feedback. I have typical beginner setups, fish only tank lighting right now. I haven't had much luck yet with plants. 

My 50 gallon has one flourescent bulb, which I did get some growth from a java fern, but my gold barbs ate it down to a nub. Thinking about moving them to another tank; I picked up a 30G breeder tank at a yard sale for $5.

I bought some hornworts last weekend and they just seem to be disintegrating in my 20 and my 50. I even put some Kent's Pro-Plant in both tanks. I thought they would thrive and soak up nutrients in the tanks. 

I am still want to do a non CO2 planted tank. I just bought a couple of books on plants and planted aquariums from amazon which I have not read through yet. 


Thanks again to everyone here.


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## cornhusker

*planted tank-no co2*

Campcreektexas,your advice is very well taken.it will make it easier for many newbies,thank you. regards,cornhusker


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## Kolkri

Why do people keep suggesting java ferns as easy to grow. Mine look just awfull and dont grow.


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## kimo

Java ferns are slow growers... should be tied to driftwood or rocks instead of planting roots (keep rhizome above gravel) in gravel for best growth. Sometimes too much light will slow them down or cover them in algae... they will grow in almost total darkness. Ferts are really not needed unless its for other type plants in the tank.


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## CampCreekTexas

You're welcome, JCali and Cornhusker (thanks for the compliments too, CH ).


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## Cheesehead Cory

That's the first time I've seen a recommendation to stay away from the fertile substrates. Hmmmm, maybe that's why I'm fighting green water after upgrading my lighting. :redface: 

Flourite + 55w AH Supply kit, no CO2 or additional ferts, in a 33 gal. tank.


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## CampCreekTexas

If you meant my advice, that's just the way I figured I'd do it since I'm a newbie and think that the KISS way of learning is best.


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## jcali10

*Lots of good advise*

I was feeling kind of alone in this thing (trying to start a small planted tank). Good to hear from all of you. 

I've been searching the web for a new light and think I found what I want here at http://www.marineandreef.com/shoppro/power_novaXtremeFresh.htm

It's a T5 fixture, very reasonably priced. :thumbsup: 

Now, I just have to decide on a substrate. I found a Lescos; I heard that Soil Master Select stuff was good and cheap. But the Lescos here only has the red SMS. I would have really prefered the charcoal, but they are not going to be ordering the charcoal. I can't just order one bag. They buy pallets at a time and it seems the stuff is primarily used on baseball diamonds and red is the in color now. 

So I am leaning towards eco complete again but its rather expensive and costs add up. I have to be a little conservative. I'm cheap really. 

One last thought. :icon_ques I bought some hornwort about two weeks ago and thought it would be a piece of cake growing them. They mostly disintegrated, not much left. I dipped them in a solution of water and bleach, 50:1 ratio (a really weak solution) to kill any snails etc before introducing them into my fish tank. Do you think that might have caused the hornworts to self destruct?


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