# Need advice on CRS baby survival - 100 gal tank.



## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

Hi everyone, after finally successfully keeping and getting my crystals to survive and get to the point of mating and being berried after many fails I've arrived at a new challenge which I'm trying to solve.

I have many berried females in this 100gal tank and I'm sure at least 3-4 have released their babies already.
So far I've only seen 1 at a time every other day and only when the females have just released their eggs.
It seems that the babies I've seen are the ones that were just released and they just die off after day 1 of birth.

Tank parameters:

Temperature: 74-78... (Main worry that this is the cause) I turn a fan on to lower the temperature when it gets above 75.
Temperature fluctuates from 75-78 everyday...

gH: 4-5
kH: 0-1
TDS: 145

Tank is running (3) eheim 2215 classic canister filters.
Can over-filtration be the problem?; preventing growth of abundant micro organism/food that baby shrimps eat.

I feed the adults 1 flake of shirakura everyday and dose Shirakura Micro-organism 1 small spoon a day.
Should I dose more powdered Shirakura Micro-organism baby food?

I check and look for baby shrimps everyday and so far I have not seen one in 3 days.

I know since the tank is so big and baby shrimps are so small they can be hiding but after I've seen at least 3-4 females give birth already I would think I can at least see 2-3 baby shrimps grazing around normally...

Any help and advice would be MUCH appreciated!


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## Tabberwok (Jan 31, 2013)

I doubt temperature is the problem, as my CRS breed prolifically at 78-80. My best guess is that they are hiding


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## mordalphus (Jun 23, 2010)

They are probably in there. One good tip to increase survival rate is adding an airstone. Also do water changes very slowly. 
Feed microorganism every 2-3 days, doesn't need to be every day.


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## inthepacific (Oct 21, 2012)

the baby shrimp dont usually eat that sort of food until they're a few months old. they usually just eat from the moss and hide. and because you're tank is so big, yea, it's gonna be tough finding the babies. they're probably just hiding.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

I forgot to add that I have 2 sponge filters running on the left and right side of the tank for aeration and a little extra filtering.

I do 15-20% water changes every two weeks and normally just top of with RO water every other day.
When I top off or do water changes I use airline tubing to refill the water =D

Thanks for the comments about them hiding guys it puts me a little more at ease.
Hopefully they'll grow up and turn up soon.

Someone from another forum advised me to get a thermostat and run it with the fan to keep the temperature more constant so I don't manually need to turn the fan on and off.
I think I'm going to try it out.


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## CookieM (Feb 7, 2012)

Nice tank it's a jungle in there.


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## shrimpzoo (Sep 27, 2011)

JYY626 said:


> I forgot to add that I have 2 sponge filters running on the left and right side of the tank for aeration and a little extra filtering.
> 
> I do 15-20% water changes every two weeks and normally just top of with RO water every other day.
> When I top off or do water changes I use airline tubing to refill the water =D
> ...


Assuming you have prefilters on the inputs of your EHEIM filters so shrimplets are protected. I would highly suggest you to just stop doing water changes lol.

The tank is a 100 gallons. And you have shrimp. The water changes aren't required. Just top off any evaporated water using RO.

When you maintain a constant stability in your tank, breeding will also be constant. I don't think you need to tweak your temperatures if you have berried shrimp. But best of luck. IMO, I think they are just hiding really well in your giant awesomely lush green planted tank.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

shrimpzoo said:


> Assuming you have prefilters on the inputs of your EHEIM filters so shrimplets are protected. I would highly suggest you to just stop doing water changes lol.
> 
> The tank is a 100 gallons. And you have shrimp. The water changes aren't required. Just top off any evaporated water using RO.
> 
> When you maintain a constant stability in your tank, breeding will also be constant. I don't think you need to tweak your temperatures if you have berried shrimp. But best of luck. IMO, I think they are just hiding really well in your giant awesomely lush green planted tank.


Yes, I do use SS mesh pre-filters for all the instake of the canister filters.

I use to do 15% water changes once a week but with the tank being 100 gallons going back and forth to the RO water store was a hassle.
Also someone else have also told me that it wasn't necessary for me to do frequent water changes in my large tank with a lot of filtration and just top off with RO.

When I stopped water changes weekly they started breeding...
I guess its because the parameters are more constant without water changes because no matter how hard I try to remineralize the RO water it will never be that exact.

I now do one water change every 2-3 weeks and remineralize with the water change.

I've red a couple of threads and pages about high water temperatures being a cause of baby shrimp death and that's why I was concerned.
Is it just a myth?

Thanks for the information and complement =D


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## Asphalt Art (Apr 18, 2013)

Usually you won't see them for a week. I could easily "lose" 20-30 little ones in a 10G tank until they are big enough to be easier to see.

Unless you see dead shrimplettes, there are no dead shrimplettes.


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## mordalphus (Jun 23, 2010)

And yes, high temps are not good. 

Before I got AC for my shrimp room, I plugged my fan into the same timer as my Lights.


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## randyl (Feb 1, 2012)

If you can, keep temp at 75F (24C), at least no higher than 77F(25C). Higher than 77 for a long time is not good for them. And I also agree less WC is good as long as you don't have nitrate issue.

For baby CRS shrimps, what I've observed,
- There is usually a 7 to 10 days of "free-trial period". They will disappear after this period if they don't like the environment.
- You might spot them in the first day right after birth, then they will go hide for a few days. Normally they will come out after a week.
- The new born babies (first few days) moving around the tank is a good sign, I find them would survive better. If they stay motionless most of the time, average result is not as good.
- I have tried a few baby food, from my experience, shrimpton is by far the best one. The tank I use this sees much better survival and growth rate. Disclaimer: Only a few months of experience, I'm still trying to get more evidence.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

randyl said:


> If you can, keep temp at 75F (24C), at least no higher than 77F(25C). Higher than 77 for a long time is not good for them. And I also agree less WC is good as long as you don't have nitrate issue.
> 
> For baby CRS shrimps, what I've observed,
> - There is usually a 7 to 10 days of "free-trial period". They will disappear after this period if they don't like the environment.
> ...


Yeah, my newborns just stay motionless and don't move around much...
Don't know whats causing it, I'm guessing its the temperature so I'm going to add a thermostat and plug my fan into it.

Thanks for the info!


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## inthepacific (Oct 21, 2012)

is this tank only for shrimp? or did you have fish in it before


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

inthepacific said:


> is this tank only for shrimp? or did you have fish in it before


Shrimp only.

I use to have ottos in there but removed them because I was worried they would bother the shrimp lol


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## Bluek24a4 (Mar 16, 2010)

That's a great tank.

What's your ph?

Ottos wont bother shrimp.

I do water changes once a month on a 5.5G plant/shrimp tank. On a 100G shrimp/planted tank like yours I would probably do them even less.

Also, I have a hard time finding shrimp in small tanks, in a large tank its got to be impossible.

That being said, I don't like my shrimp tanks at 75 degrees. 78 would freak me out. I try to maintain them at 72 or lower.


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## sayurasem (Jun 17, 2011)

Is that aquasoil in your tank? That must cost a fortune!

Anywhoo, the babies are definately hiding. I don't even see the babies in my ten gallon because they are hiding in the moss and fissidens. Usually it takes me a good 1-2 months until the babies grew up a little and join the feeding frenzy. Before that time I think shrimp babies doesn't like the chaos when feeding time.
This got me thinking why powdered food is the best kind of shrimp baby food because the powder will distributed throughout the tank so the babies doesn't have to "look" for the food.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

sayurasem said:


> Is that aquasoil in your tank? That must cost a fortune!
> 
> Anywhoo, the babies are definately hiding. I don't even see the babies in my ten gallon because they are hiding in the moss and fissidens. Usually it takes me a good 1-2 months until the babies grew up a little and join the feeding frenzy. Before that time I think shrimp babies doesn't like the chaos when feeding time.
> This got me thinking why powdered food is the best kind of shrimp baby food because the powder will distributed throughout the tank so the babies doesn't have to "look" for the food.


Yep I used 2 bags of amazonia 9L and 1 large bag of fluval shrimp substrate.
It took me a while to find the tank I wanted on craigslist but I saved a lot of money.
I think for the tank + stand + a canister filter + a lot of other stuff I only paid $200.
So from saving money on the tank I was able to spend more on other stuff like decent lights and good aquasoil.


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## MsNemoShrimp (Apr 25, 2011)

You got a 100 gallon tank + 3 Eheim 2215 + a lot of other stuff for only $200? WOW! Normally those 3 Eheims will already put you at $200. Good job! 

Anyhow this is my experience. Since I stopped doing weekly water changes, I got lots of berried moms and I actually see babies now. Newborns, literally 1-3 days won't move much. They will move of course but literally inches. When I feed Bebi ALL my shrimps go nuts, even the babies. My tank right now is filled with PRL and Hybrids, babies all over the place. I actually never though I could accomplish this, but I did and I am definitely enjoying every moment of this success of mines. Good luck with yours! :hihi:

* Keep temp 76 or less
* Little to no water changes at all
* Don't just "add" things, even plants. If the tank is doing good, stop adding things, it could only do harm.
* Make sure you have baby food, that increases survivability by a ton in my experience


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

MsNemoShrimp said:


> You got a 100 gallon tank + 3 Eheim 2215 + a lot of other stuff for only $200? WOW! Normally those 3 Eheims will already put you at $200. Good job!
> 
> Anyhow this is my experience. Since I stopped doing weekly water changes, I got lots of berried moms and I actually see babies now. Newborns, literally 1-3 days won't move much. They will move of course but literally inches. When I feed Bebi ALL my shrimps go nuts, even the babies. My tank right now is filled with PRL and Hybrids, babies all over the place. I actually never though I could accomplish this, but I did and I am definitely enjoying every moment of this success of mines. Good luck with yours! :hihi:
> 
> ...


I actually just got 1 canister filter that came with the tank.

I feed the Shirakura baby food which (Bebi) food are you talking about?
I think I'll give it a go.

Thank you for your advice.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

Keep the ideas coming guys, I really appreciate it!

I see at least 7-8 berried females and it frustrates me knowing that the babies might not survive after coming so far...

Here are more pics of the tank; please tell me if you can find anything that doesn't look right.














































I just removed 1 canister because I was worried that it had too much filtration and also the water current from the outflow might tire the shrimps out.
I had all three outflows pointed downwards to the substrate, and about 1 month ago I turned all the outflows towards the water surface and the shrimps finally began to mate and get berried.

I now leave the fan on 24/7 and it doesn't get above 75

I also forgot to mention that this tank is in my side garage; so it gets hot + I don't know if there are any pollutants that emits from the cars that would get into the tanks.


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## binbin9 (Jan 31, 2012)

sweet looking tank. These photos probably dont do it any justice. The scape looks great now you just cant touch or move anything. The slightest stirring of your substrate will cause ammonia spikes that can wipe out the more sensitive shrimps.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

binbin9 said:


> sweet looking tank. These photos probably dont do it any justice. The scape looks great now you just cant touch or move anything. The slightest stirring of your substrate will cause ammonia spikes that can wipe out the more sensitive shrimps.


I have Malaysian trumpet snails in the tank... will them moving around in the substrate cause ammonia spikes? 
I've tested the water and everything is where it should be...


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## MsNemoShrimp (Apr 25, 2011)

The Shirakura baby food should work as great!


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## binbin9 (Jan 31, 2012)

good question probably not enough to do anything serious 



> I have Malaysian trumpet snails in the tank... will them moving around in the substrate cause ammonia spikes?


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## sayurasem (Jun 17, 2011)

Dude that tank is shrimp heaven! Though try not to fluctuate the temperature during the day, though 100 gallon of water should be pretty easy to maintain its temperature stability.

Btw do I see a heater in that tank? It gets pretty hot during the summer lol.



Btw join SCAPE club! You are only 5 miles away from the best lfs in SGV area! Check out A+ Tropical Fish store if you have the time


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

sayurasem said:


> Dude that tank is shrimp heaven! Though try not to fluctuate the temperature during the day, though 100 gallon of water should be pretty easy to maintain its temperature stability.
> 
> Btw do I see a heater in that tank? It gets pretty hot during the summer lol.
> 
> ...


The heater is set at 72, it never comes on in the summer.
I should just unplug it heh

I am also on SCAPE forum and posted same thread on there haha, trying to maximize replies.


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## peachii (Jun 1, 2013)

I see one big, huge glaring problem.

This tank is in your garage and not my living room 

Looks absolutely great. Give it time and patience and you will have more shrimp than you know what to do with.

As for your garage, look into putting some potted plants like Pothos near the tank 


> Golden pothos (Scindapsus aures)
> Another powerful plant for tackling formaldehyde, this fast-growing vine will create a cascade of green from a hanging basket. Consider it for your garage since car exhaust is filled with formaldehyde. (Bonus: Golden pothos, also know as devil’s ivy, stays green even when kept in the dark.)


Will help keep your air quality around the tank clean and clear with minimal effort from you and if you hang them in a cascading fashion on either side of the tank (not on or in it) then it will just enhance the look of you setup. Pothos can be hung from the side of the tank and cascade over the side and grow beautifully but since this is a shrimp tank, I'm not sure I recommend it - although if you did that, it would literally suck all ammonia from the water. Just an idea.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

peachii said:


> I see one big, huge glaring problem.
> 
> This tank is in your garage and not my living room
> 
> ...


Haha that beginning of the comment scared me a bit, I thought there was really something major wrong with the tank.

Awesome, awesome suggestion about the Pothos plant!

I will definitely get some to hang on top of the tank!
I think it'll really enhance the look of the garage.
I will post some photos when I set it up.

The plants should also make the air in the garage better for me when I workout in it.
It's kind of a garage/gym/fish room haha
I'm going to get a good amount 

Thank you for sharing your knowledge!
I appreciate it very much.


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## mythin (Jun 26, 2009)

MsNemoShrimp said:


> The Shirakura baby food should work as great!


This is what I use, Shirakura Chi Ebi, for the past 3-4 years or so and i swear by it. I get something like 80-90% shrimplet survival rate, and I feed just a little bit daily.


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

peachii said:


> I see one big, huge glaring problem.
> 
> This tank is in your garage and not my living room
> 
> ...


Added a large shelf on top of the tank and now I can FINALLY hang my lights from it instead of using 2by4s to prop them up!
I have Always wanted to add a shelf and hang my lights from it but just forgot about it until you brought up the Pothos idea.

Bought 2 big baskets of Pothos!
They look awesome in the side garage; made the room more inviting and natural.
Really enhances the whole setup like you said.
Thank you for the suggestion.
Since two cars are parked in the same garage connected to my side garage/gym/fish room the plants will absorb some bad air and produce oxygen; it's going to help a bit when I workout in the room.

Can't wait until they grow down and cover the front of the tank, than it'll look like plants are growing out of the tank heh.

CRS Baby update:
Still don't see many babies, but I did see 1 baby that was definitely not a day old, so I guess that means a few of them are surviving...

I also moved a pregnant female into a satellite breeder box to see if the babies will survive in the box.
If the babies survive than there might be something in the main tank that is eating the baby shrimp.
If the babies don't survive in the box than there is something wrong with my water...
Don't know which outcome to look forward to...


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## JYY626 (May 14, 2009)

I've finally been seeing more and more baby shrimps lately and they all seen to be more than a couple of days old.

Thanks to all that commented and gave their input on the tank and thank you for your suggestions on helping me fix the problem.

It was probably just paranoia on my part thinking that the babies aren't surviving and maybe some of them did not at first but with a little bit more care I think they are finally doing OK.

Raised the TDS to 160 from 150 and the adults white colors have become more solid.
Lowered the temperature at a somewhat stable 75-77.


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## somewhatshocked (Aug 8, 2011)

That's great news! Thanks for sharing an update.

On an aside: love your giant tank and love how tiny those breeder boxes look hanging on the front.


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## jimmytruong87 (Oct 16, 2012)

Sweet shrimp tank. I think you need keep temperature around 24'C in summer . I saw many breeders use aquarium chiller


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## peachii (Jun 1, 2013)

Looks absolutely amazing, after they grow out it will be breathtaking!! Glad the suggestion hit you the right way. 





JYY626 said:


> Added a large shelf on top of the tank and now I can FINALLY hang my lights from it instead of using 2by4s to prop them up!
> I have Always wanted to add a shelf and hang my lights from it but just forgot about it until you brought up the Pothos idea.
> 
> Bought 2 big baskets of Pothos!
> ...


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## colorfan (Nov 12, 2013)

That is a beautiful set up. Would love to turn my garage into a shrimp room.


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## oblongshrimp (Jul 26, 2006)

Bebi is a product by Borneowild that is similar to the Shirakura baby or Mosura Bioplus.



JYY626 said:


> I actually just got 1 canister filter that came with the tank.
> 
> I feed the Shirakura baby food which (Bebi) food are you talking about?
> I think I'll give it a go.
> ...


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## Thatshrimpguy (Aug 16, 2013)

It's a jungle in there, I think you should give it a month or two after you see berried females finish their pregnancy and see if you can see some smaller shrimps before you panic... No way can you spot all the babies in a great planted taNk like that! They may just be hiding


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