# First impressions on Kessil Amazon Sun



## Daximus

Looks like a neat product. Seems misleading to label A150w all over it...I suppose that's their model number, but it would seem to me they are trying to make it appear as a 150 watt item. Maybe I'm reading into it a bit too much, lol. 

In your opinion, will the light spread out enough to properly cover the tank floor? At what height above the tank does this occur?


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## propsi

Daximus said:


> In your opinion, will the light spread out enough to properly cover the tank floor? At what height above the tank does this occur?


At 24" height light spread is 6'. It is a punctual light source however and light levels drop off considerably at the outer edges. That's the nature of the beast. I unfortunately do not have any light intensity readings to give. I'm just going on my visual impressions.


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## Daximus

propsi said:


> At 24" height light spread is 6'. It is a punctual light source however and light levels drop off considerably at the outer edges. That's the nature of the beast. I unfortunately do not have any light intensity readings to give. I'm just going on my visual impressions.


Cool, I'm just curious. Never seen anything like it. Is this like a complete florescent replacement or more of an accent light? I can see some really neat "sunlight" effects being possible. Pretty cool looking.


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## propsi

Daximus said:


> Cool, I'm just curious. Never seen anything like it. Is this like a complete florescent replacement or more of an accent light? I can see some really neat "sunlight" effects being possible. Pretty cool looking.


It is marketed as a "replacement" (your word). Reefers have been fooling around with it for a while and it is their general opinion that it does the job (for them...). They report lots of shimmer effects.


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## Daximus

propsi said:


> It is marketed as a "replacement" (your word). Reefers have been fooling around with it for a while and it is their general opinion that it does the job (for them...). They report lots of shimmer effects.


Sweet. Well if the reefers are happy with the light output then logically I'd have to guess it will work for us...perhaps even overkill. 

I played around with some homemade spotlights...some really natural looking shimmer/sunlight effects can be achieved. I can't wait to see what you end up doing with them.


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## propsi

Daximus said:


> I played around with some homemade spotlights...some really natural looking shimmer/sunlight effects can be achieved. I can't wait to see what you end up doing with them.


I'm impatient to see the results also. That will take a while unfortunately. I'm still setting up my system and I have some contracts coming up and no spare time.


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## IWANNAGOFAST

We have these at my store, I can try to get par readings this weekend


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## propsi

IWANNAGOFAST said:


> We have these at my store, I can try to get par readings this weekend


That would be great! If you can, take some readings off center to see how much the light falls off. My initial impression is that light diminishes considerably 15" from the center line.


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## samamorgan

I haven't checked into the kessil fixture much, but i assume it uses some sort of reflector or lens. From what i have observed, most LED emmiters with no reflector drop off PAR values by about 50% in a pattern that looks like an equilateral triangle. So at 6" down from the light, 6" offset, PAR would be cut in half of what it is directly under at any given distance. Keep in mind this is just a pattern i have observed when looking at bunches of PAR readings on various fixtures, one of these days i'll get my own meter and to a bunch of experiments.


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## propsi

I've unearthed a long forgotten light meter and took light readings on both Kessils. Readings are in footcandles: best I can do at this point. Since I will be lighting a 120p, I suspended both lamps 16" apart and 24" high as a starting point. Interesting to see that the light readings were a bit higher in between both lamps than directly under. It suggests that I could separate the lamps to attain better distribution. Take note however that I "guestimate" error to be around 10%, if not more. Obviously a PAR meter will give the real story here, but the readings suggest nonetheless a significant drop off at the outer perimeter of the light field. 



samamorgan said:


> I haven't checked into the kessil fixture much, but i assume it uses some sort of reflector or lens.


Yes there is a small lens.


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## samamorgan

Your mesaurements would suggest a 50% light cutoff at the 60 degree mark, mind doing the same measurements at 12 inches below the lights to confirm? Would give us a good idea of coverage pattern, even better once we get PAR results.


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## MARIMOBALL

Im interested in these lights. I have an ADA 120P with two 150 watt metal halides with 8000K bulbs and have never seen any LED come close to what these put out. I can borrow a par meter to check my setting.


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## propsi

MARIMOBALL said:


> Im interested in these lights. I have an ADA 120P with two 150 watt metal halides with 8000K bulbs and have never seen any LED come close to what these put out. I can borrow a par meter to check my setting.


It would be an interesting comparison.


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## IWANNAGOFAST

forgot to bring the par meter, but, here's a video I shot today while at the shop

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OakPhTON6PY


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## propsi

IWANNAGOFAST said:


> forgot to bring the par meter, but, here's a video I shot today while at the shop


Thanks for that! Looks like a healthy tank. Is it 18" or 24" tall? I'm debating whether the lights would be powerful enough to light a deep tank. If you do have the occasion to get PAR readings that would be really great !


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## IWANNAGOFAST

The tank is 21" tall, it's an oceanic 57gal, so 36x18x21


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## pwolfe

Mind posting some pics of the tank? full tank shots, close-ups, the works!


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## Gookis

IWANNAGOFAST said:


> here's a video I shot today while at the shop
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OakPhTON6PY



Hehe, I just bought the Do!Aqua on the wall in the video! Dig those lights.

Matt


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## pwolfe

bump for pics/par


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## propsi

I'm waiting for my PAR sensor to come in. Around 2 weeks I'm told. I'll gladly post numbers when it comes in.


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## Qwedfg

I would say with 99 percent confidence that this will effectively light a 24 inch planted tank if these have similar specs to the reef version. I have seen very nice SPS tanks lit by Kessils before and they require alot more light.


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## propsi

Qwedfg said:


> I would say with 99 percent confidence that this will effectively light a 24 inch planted tank if these have similar specs to the reef version. I have seen very nice SPS tanks lit by Kessils before and they require alot more light.


...which was the logic behind my purchase


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## god91234

i am very interested in these lights... subscribed!


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## m00se

IWANNAGOFAST said:


> forgot to bring the par meter, but, here's a video I shot today while at the shop
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OakPhTON6PY



Are you Neptune Aquatics?

0_o


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## Lurch98

Very interested in this testing, I've been considering getting 2 or 3 of these lights depending on coverage as well. 

I apologize if this is a dumb question, but does anyone know if these lights are dimmable and can be connected to a controller for sunrise/sunset simulation?I was going to email Kessil and ask them, if someone hasn't already. I couldn't find any reference on their documentation.


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## pwolfe

the reef centric lights are not dimmable. I think the same applies here.


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## zergling

m00se said:


> Are you Neptune Aquatics?
> 
> 0_o


He works there during the weekends I believe....


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## audioaficionado

*Fwiw*

A150W Amazon Sun, A Review by Albany Aquarium

Looks like there's hot spots the way they have them set up.


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## propsi

The Amason suns are not dimmable unfortunately.


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## propsi

audioaficionado said:


> A150W Amazon Sun, A Review by Albany Aquarium


Forgive me but i don't think that's a review, it's a promo. I think we will be doing the review if you know what I mean


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## houseofcards

If that's a review it's quite lame.


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## propsi

> If that's a review it's quite lame.


Do you mean Albany's ?  I would agree, it doesn't contain very much info. Frustrating. 
I hope to come up with some PAR numbers as soon as I receive my bloody sensor. It's taking forever.


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## audioaficionado

It's fine if you turn off the sound. It's obvious that those lights had hot spots in the center the way the store had them set up. The tank didn't look too bad considering that it wasn't rectangular.

BTW, how much longer before you get your PAR sensor for this review?


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## propsi

I think hot spots are par for the course in this case (no pun intended). These are after all punctual light sources. I believe however that it's possible to mitigate that effect by proper lamp placement when using more than one, based on my measurements.


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## houseofcards

propsi said:


> Do you mean Albany's ?  I would agree, it doesn't contain very much info. Frustrating.
> I hope to come up with some PAR numbers as soon as I receive my bloody sensor. It's taking forever.


Sorry, yes the Albany review. Also that might be a good sales tool for growth as what a LFS would call good growth, but the look of those plants would hardly be a good sales promo here.


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## propsi

audioaficionado said:


> BTW, how much longer before you get your PAR sensor for this review?


Between my work commitments and final delivery of the sensor, 2 weeks I would say. I work in the film business. It's miminum 13 hours a day on set for me, which basically doesn't give me a life .


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## audioaficionado

How much longer are you guys gonna keep beating on Albany Aquarium? 

I started with crappy little plants from my LFS, but after a few months they got healthy and grew in anyway. Albany Aquarium seems to have a good selection compared to my local LFS in Southern Oregon.

Luckily that issue is now a non factor with this forum, other aquatic forums and online dealers. Same for equipment and supplies.



propsi said:


> Between my work commitments and final delivery of the sensor, 2 weeks I would say. I work in the film business. It's miminum 13 hours a day on set for me, which basically doesn't give me a life .


Great! I'm looking forward to seeing your results and observations.


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## houseofcards

audioaficionado said:


> How much longer are you guys gonna keep beating on Albany Aquarium?
> 
> I started with crappy little plants from my LFS, but after a few months they got healthy and grew in anyway. Albany Aquarium seems to have a good selection compared to my local LFS in Southern Oregon.
> 
> Luckily that issue is now a non factor with this forum, other aquatic forums and online dealers. Same for equipment and supplies.
> 
> Great! I'm looking forward to seeing your results and observations.


No one's picking on Albany, so please don't start. Just putting things in perspective. That is NOT a review and thread goers shouldn't perceive it as so and the plants from a LFS standpoint are actually pretty good, but not from an advanced hobbyist standpoint.


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## vincenz

propsi said:


> I think hot spots are par for the course in this case (no pun intended). These are after all punctual light sources. I believe however that it's possible to mitigate that effect by proper lamp placement when using more than one, based on my measurements.


Yeh, the spread doesn't look that great according to the Albany Aquarium video. Using more than 1 of these would get expensive very quickly


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## propsi

audioaficionado said:


> How much longer are you guys gonna keep beating on Albany Aquarium?


Sorry people. I didn't mean to start anything about Albany Aquarium. I was just reacting to the word "review" and things seemed to grow from there. Kessil is allowed after all to promo their product as they see fit, and I have nothing to say about Albany Aquarium. Never been there. Power to them in fact. 



vincenz said:


> Yeh, the spread doesn't look that great according to the Albany Aquarium video. Using more than 1 of these would get expensive very quickly


The spread for one is actually quite good, but there is a prominent hotspot. That effect is mitigated in the overlapping light when using 2 or more. And yes, they are expensive when using multiples. What sold me was the discreet size of the lamp. I was looking for a lamp that would not overtake the look of the tank (as is often the case IMO).


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## vincenz

Any updates on this? I'm considering hanging 1 over a 36x36x14 tank for low light.


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## IWANNAGOFAST

Tested the PAR yesterday, it's a very very very heavily planted tank so I couldn't get a very good reading but right at the water surface, about 8 inches from the light, right in the center, it has a PAR of about 300umols. About a foot away from the center, but still at the surface, it dropped to about 40umol. 

at about 15inches below the surface, so about 23 inches total from the light, and about 10 inches away from the center, the PAR is about 50. which is good.

So this is a light that needs to be hung up pretty high off the tank to avoid the intense spot lighting, so I would think about a foot would be good.

We're setting up 3 18x18x18 cubes, 2 planted and 1 reef. the 2 planted will use the amazon sun and one will be an iwagumi scape so i'll be able to get better par readings


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## vincenz

Awesome, thanks for the info. I might just go for it


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## propsi

Finally got my Apogee sensor. Hooked it up to a multimeter and got the following readings. Measurements were taken on a tabletop arrangement, at various heights, not submerged. I took several readings using two kessils spaced 20" apart at 18", 24", and 30" height and one series using a single lamp at 30" height. One could expect a slight improvement in performance underwater if Hoppy's assertions are correct__ he says that intensity can increase up to 10% underwater because of internal reflections. All of this means that with 2 lamps one could attain a medium amount of light at a height of 24" to 30" off the substrate, which is great for such small lamps. Take note that I would guess a 10% margin of error in my readings.


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## yevgenb

Hmm... Doesn't look like we can cover 60p with only one and get 50 mmol on the surface, or I'm wrong?


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## propsi

If you mean on the substrate, no, I don't think so.


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## prototyp3

Seems like a fail for anything other than a small cube. Given the form factor, not too surprising.


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## vincenz

propsi said:


> Finally got my Apogee sensor. Hooked it up to a multimeter and got the following readings. Measurements were taken on a tabletop arrangement, at various heights, not submerged. I took several readings using two kessils spaced 20" apart at 18", 24", and 30" height and one series using a single lamp at 30" height. One could expect a slight improvement in performance underwater if Hoppy's assertions are correct__ he says that intensity can increase up to 10% underwater because of internal reflections. All of this means that with 2 lamps one could attain a medium amount of light at a height of 24" to 30" off the substrate, which is great for such small lamps. Take note that I would guess a 10% margin of error in my readings.


This is excellent, thanks. It's good news for people with smaller tanks that want to do an open-top aquarium without a bulkier fluorescent fixture on top. As I expected, a single one at 30" off the substrate is perfect for low-tech setups with no CO2. That's what I've had mine running at for about a week now over a 20g. Also have to note that because it was designed as a concentrated point-source light, at 30" off the substrate, there's not much spillover compared to a fluorescent strip or metal halide. 

I have to say though, that I agree with you about the fan noise on the unit. It's not a big deal if you're used to desktop computer fans because that's what it sounds like. Not a deal-breaker, but something to consider if you're picky about an absolutely no-noise aquarium.


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## yevgenb

Hmm... Considering the price of kessils looks like a fail for anything bigger than nano


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## propsi

I realize I should have posted PAR numbers for a single lamp first. Here are some readings for heights of 18", 21", 24". At 21" height you can have medium light levels in most of the tank. The earlier 30" height readings for a single lamp might have been misleading given the fall off. 
Anyhow, it doesn't feel like a fail to me. Depending on your plants (obviously) a 60p would receive sufficient light IMO.


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## propsi

> Hmm... Doesn't look like we can cover 60p with only one and get 50 mmol on the surface, or I'm wrong?


I should correct my earlier response based on my measurements: 
Depending on the height of the lamp you can get within striking distance of 50 it seems.


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## jeremyTR

Nice lights but DAMN those are pricey.


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## jingleberry

Too expensive for me, but they sure look sexy.


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## samamorgan

From those PAR readings i would say you can light the same space at 50% the cost with LEDs using other solutions. Don't know why Kessil thinks these are worth $250. Mind if i add this information to the compendium?


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## propsi

Please be my guest.


> From those PAR readings i would say you can light the same space at 50% the cost with LEDs using other solutions.


Undoubtedly, but would that solution be a punctual light source of comparable size ?


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## audioaficionado

PAR30/PAR38 (not photosynthetically active radiation) LED Edison based bulbs might do the trick for less than half the $$$. The PAR30 is rather compact.


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## samamorgan

propsi said:


> Undoubtedly, but would that solution be a punctual light source of comparable size ?


Like audio said PAR LED bulbs would be just as good, then you can put it in any kind of pendant you want. On top of that some PAR LED bulbs are dimmable, too.

The ones I had in mind wouldn't be pentands though, but equally attractive clip on or hang above styles. Most of the commercial LED stuff out there is fairly attractive looking. I'm a big fan of everything ecoxotic myself because of their modular approach to everything. You never know when you might want more or less light.

Oh, and thanks a bunch for the permission. I'll get it up on the sticky as soon as i get done writing this java program for CS class. Busy homework weekend....yay.


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## styxx

MARIMOBALL said:


> Im interested in these lights. I have an ADA 120P with two 150 watt metal halides with 8000K bulbs and have never seen any LED come close to what these put out. I can borrow a par meter to check my setting.


Oh Marimoball, you haven't checked out the AquaIllumination Sol yet have you, lol!! Those are the Lambourghinis of LED fixtures.


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## prototyp3

styxx said:


> Oh Marimoball, you haven't checked out the AquaIllumination Sol yet have you, lol!! Those are the Lambourghinis of LED fixtures.


I'd actually call the Aqua Illumination offerings the Ford of LEDs. They get the job done, but they aren't top of the line in terms of features or quality.


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## pwolfe

I'd love to see AI release a freshwater version, just sayin


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## MARIMOBALL

After seeing the Kessils Par , I guess Ill be keeping my 2 150 Watt Metal halides. I know 300 watts over 65 gallons sound a little crazy, but I can grow anything. Even a reef set up. If Kessil would drop their price by 20-30%. Then three kessils would be fine on one of my 120Ps. Aquaillumination only offers a 12000K-14000K of white light. Who wants to spend $800 on a light that will washout the colors of your plants.The aquaillumination light and the ecoxotic LED are ugly in my eyes. Kesill's design Is way nicer and cleaner looking. I even like the green band going around the rim. If anyone selling their used ones LMK, This way I can get three and finally rid myself of the Metal halides.


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## audioaficionado

Maybe they think reefers are all rich?


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## hidefguy

Hi Propsi,

Any updates on this setup? i'm really interested on getting a LED setup, thinking about these or possibly a pair of par38 bulbs. thanks.


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## propsi

> Any updates on this setup? i'm really interested on getting a LED setup, thinking about these or possibly a pair of par38 bulbs. thanks.


Please see posts #45 & #51


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## Husker13

audioaficionado said:


> PAR30/PAR38 (not photosynthetically active radiation) LED Edison based bulbs might do the trick for less than half the $$$. The PAR30 is rather compact.



What PAR30/PAR38 bulbs would you recommend?


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## audioaficionado

I don't have any first hand knowledge of any particular brands, but if you do a search in this forum, some people have already posted specific PAR30/PAR38 bulbs they've gotten and used as well as source and data links.


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## carpalstunna

rapidled has some nice looking ones

http://www.rapidled.com/7-led-par38-bulb-all-white-leds/


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## samamorgan

Finally got around to updating the compendium and added your data. Thanks propsi!


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## dknydiep1

carpalstunna said:


> rapidled has some nice looking ones
> 
> http://www.rapidled.com/7-led-par38-bulb-all-white-leds/


I have one over my 10g and I'm not too impressed. The corners are dark due to the spotlight. I test the par readings a while back but I don't remember the numbers. I just know that I wasn't too impressed.


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## zimbo

So I recently got a couple Kessils. I do have a friend who could get them at wholesale for me, and that's honestly the only reason i got them, $260 a piece otherwise is just ridiculous.

I don't have pics to post as of yet, figure I'd give the tank a bit. I'm honestly not into all of the measurements that you guys do. I'm a med student, and busy as heck, i just need lights that won't cost me an arm and a leg in electricity and bulbs. 

My first impression is that for those of you who are considering them, go and find someone who has them and have a look before you break your bank account. I have mine over a 90 gallon rainbow fish tank. I did see them before i got them and had some concerns about how dim they were in appearance, and now that i have them, they are not as bright as they could be for display purposes. Could they replace a 150 MH in terms of growth...we'll see, but overall from an aesthetic perspective, not so much. 

I find that the colors are not fantastic, I'll likely have to supplement the light over the long run. Shimmer effect is great, almost too much. 

Again, in looking at this thread there's lots of number crunching. I look at its from an aesthetic perspective, and I'm probably more into how they light up fish too than a lot of folks here who are probably more focused on plant growth. Just find someone who has them if possible is all I can say for now. We'll see how things look in a month.


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## AlanLe

So I guess bottom line is these Kessils are a "no go" then. However I still like the design. I don't know if spotlight would work or not. There are some designs look exactly like Kessil. They can be hung from the ceiling or attached to a gooseneck.


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## thefishguy

i have two kessils on my 65g and i love the color and shimmer...very natural. however the brightness seems lacking cause it doesnt spread too well. I would need 4 to get the lighting i want. but i use two and a couple of t5ho to fill the gaps


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## TallDragon

The new A160WE is coming soon according to Kessil site. It will be controllable intensity with knob or 0-10V with Apex or 'hopefully' the Current USA single ramp timer. They have a 90 degree adapter, which should also help position it higher above tank.


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## Turningdoc

So. No one wants to pay $100 more for the A360, but wants to slam Kessil for their 150 not being strong enough? Also A360wE is controller-ready. Having done both reef and planted, I can say I feel $$ on lighting system usually key in success. Sure you can do it yourself. After time, $ in parts shipping, and ghetto-looking results waiting to set your house on fire, you probably should have left it to the lighting engineers. They really do know what they're doing and are worth the cost. (no I don't work for them)


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## jeffkrol

Turningdoc said:


> So. No one wants to pay $100 more for the A360, but wants to slam Kessil for their 150 not being strong enough? Also A360wE is controller-ready. Having done both reef and planted, I can say I feel $$ on lighting system usually key in success. Sure you can do it yourself. After time, $ in parts shipping, and ghetto-looking results waiting to set your house on fire, you probably should have left it to the lighting engineers. They really do know what they're doing and are worth the cost. (no I don't work for them)


As someone who likes the "idea" of a Kessil there are a few gotchas involved w/ the high end model for "planted" tanks..
1) Not enough of a color range:
*



Tune the spectrum and intensity for a personalized look. Kessil Logic™ maintains consistent output across the spectrum. 6,000-9,000K.

Click to expand...

*2) Poor choice of dimming protocols..(arguable)
*



Compatible with 0~10V external controllers.

Click to expand...

*3) price differential between "hort lighing" and "aquarium lighting" which points to blatant gouging since both have the exact same basic tech..


> h150 $106
> a150 $225


4) a single unit is only good for a squareish tank, meaning most would need 2 and that leads to #3 being even more problematic.


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## Turningdoc

http://www.kessil.com/aquarium/Freshwater_A360.php

A360WE

1. Covers 2'x2'
2. Controllable and serial likable to 0-10v
3. Adjustable intensity AND spectrum between 6000-9000K
4. Price is $300+ given retailer, but this is in line with the rest of high-end LED market. Features above require tech that is not cheap!

Point being a light totally adjustable, custom capable, cheap, running cool, and with coverage for any tank does not exist, will never exist, and if did exist could never keep a company in business.


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## jeffkrol

Turningdoc said:


> Point being a light totally adjustable, custom capable, cheap, running cool, and with coverage for any tank does not exist, will never exist, and if did exist could never keep a company in business.


Actually "we" are getting closer.. 
It is not hard to build an LED w/ a range in spectrum from say 2000k to 15000K.........
http://www.bigalspets.com/aquatic-p...son+Shopping&gclid=CNqCuLLTmsECFWqCMgodciUAZw

Per "surface area" half the cost of 2 Kessils.
Granted $340 is not exactly "cheap".. but compared to the "bad old days" of LEd's it is a steal..


> Aquatic Plant LED Lighting System - 48" to 60"
> 
> Number of 1 watt White LEDs - 46
> Number of 3 watt RGB LEDs - 8
> PAR/LUX at 12" - 172/10530
> PAR/LUX at 24" - 83/4810
> Lumens - 4480











http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2108862&highlight=ah+supply


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## Turningdoc

Not controllable, not linkable, not intensity adjustable, and good luck w corporate support. Just sayin.
Will give you cheaper though.😏


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## jeffkrol

Turningdoc said:


> Not controllable, not linkable, not intensity adjustable, and good luck w corporate support. Just sayin.
> Will give you cheaper though.��


and for over $600 you can't even get a decent sunset.. 


> *maintains consistent output across the spectrum. 6,000-9,000K.
> *


Or you could get 4 of these.. 
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=28127


> 5 colors of 120-degree dispersion, 0.5W LEDs ensure a full spectrum of light needed by all your aquarium inhabitants
> * Features 3-channel timer, sunrise & sunset functions, daytime effects, and moonlight effects
> 
> Take your aquarium lighting to the next level with EDGE LED Fixtures from Aquatic Life. These easy-to-use fixtures for saltwater or freshwater use offer a host of features that simplify your life and streamline your aquarium lighting. Choose from 3 sleek sizes, each measuring only 1/2" high and 4" wide. EDGE LED Fixtures from Aquatic Life, ideal for both the novice and expert aquarist, enhance life inside your aquarium while being virtually invisible over your setup. Outstanding features include:
> 
> State-of-the-art LED technology covers the entire expanse of the fixture and focuses maximum light output inside the aquarium with no heating of the aquatic environment.
> 5 colors of 120-degree dispersion, 0.5W LEDs ensure a full spectrum of light needed by all your saltwater or freshwater aquarium inhabitants.
> 3-channel timer allows simple, completely independent control of the EDGE fixtures' bright white, mixed color, and moonlight LEDs, creating lighting that replicates underwater daytime sunlight, sunrise/sunset effects, and the shimmering blue glow of moonlight.
> Sunrise & sunset functions let you easily program the LEDs to slowly turn on or off in 10-minute increments over a 2-hour time period, thereby creating a variety of different sunrise and sunset effects.


As I said.. they all have "warts".. esp. when they think they know what "we" want.. 
Really Wi-fi???????


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## Bob1

I just bought two 360 we's for my 125 long. And although I have them running I can't comment on plant growth as I haven't planted the tank yet. I would be happy to answer any questions other may have regarding these lights. I took a calculated risk in ordering them as I didn't know how they would work out. So far I could not be any happier.

Bob


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## Turningdoc

What are your feelings on them being "spotty" and the adjustability?

Companies must have decided the want into freshwater market. Radion just brought out these:
$299

http://ecotechmarine.com/products/radion/radion-xr15-freshwater

Maybe true innovation is coming for less soon from the whole industry


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## BigL_RIP

Bob,

Would a single 360we suffice for a 90P (36 x 18 x 18)?


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## Bob1

BigL_RIP said:


> Bob,
> 
> Would a single 360we suffice for a 90P (36 x 18 x 18)?


I would say yes for me it would.......although it would depend upon what you wanted to grow in the tank and how you would want it lit. 

What I love about the kessils is the fact that there _*are*_ shadows in the tank. It looks real rather than just everything being lit with the same brightness. This is just really subjective I know. But it's what I like.This I think comes from two factors: one the single source or focal point of light(spot light), and second, lighting a rectangular area with a round pattern of light. 
I don't care about high par numbers. I had high par led fixtures before, and was glad once they broke down because high par *is* high maintenance. What I love about these fixtures is that I will have I'm guessing medium to medium high light levels with only two small fixtures. I love the open top look of the tank, and it makes planting and maintenance a breeze. 

I will post pictures of the set up if someone wants. I know they are not the light for everyone but I'm happy with them.

Bob


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## BigL_RIP

I'd appreciate pics. I use a point source system now, two of the below, and am considering a change:

http://greenleafaquariums.com/led-aquarium-lights.html


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## Turningdoc

Anyone using Kessil 360we with reefkeeper or apex controllers?


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## Bob1

Ok here we go. The video quality isn't the best, and the water is tannin stained right now, but it should give people a good idea on spread which is what I wanted to know. I will post more video when I get it planted because there is only black flourite and driftwood to base coloration on, which admittedly isn't much. The aquarium is in a really tight space right now. It's in the basement hallway leading into the rec room. My two channel tube amp system occupies the prime real estate right now. The aquarium is viewed from beneath the stairs and from about 3 feet away. Not ideal I know but, it is what it is. I call it private viewing for one.

First part of the video is with the lights set to the lowest intensity at about 9000k, then it is set to 9000k at the highest intensity. Then the light set to only to one side to illustrate the spread for one light in half the tank. Then set to high at 6500 K.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zq6TNcNSZUE&feature=youtu.be


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## Turningdoc

Thank you Bob1. Looks like a good start. Seems like 6500 to 9000 range gives decent options. Can't wait to see with plants.


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## BigL_RIP

Ditto, thanks Bob. Deciding if one would be sufficient here. Looking forward to seeing more.


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## Turningdoc

Bob1. Are you using Kessil gooseneck mounts over the tank. Also, how far above the water do you have them?


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## Bob1

Turningdoc said:


> Bob1. Are you using Kessil gooseneck mounts over the tank. Also, how far above the water do you have them?



Hello Doc,

14" from the top surface of the water level, and 19" from the top of substrate to the top of the water level. So total distance from substrate to the light is 33" Kessil recommends 12"-24". 

Yes I do have the Kessil goose necks. And this is really in my mind, the best and easiest way to mount them. I spent a great deal of time trying to figure out a way of suspending them above the tank, and came up with some great ideas. Unfortunately none of them would have looked as clean, unobtrusive or have been any cheaper than the goose necks themselves. No need to re invent the wheel....... I also am using the 90 degree adapters for no other reason than to justify buying them. If I did not use them, I could get the lights closer to the tank. Once its planted time will tell. All in all still no nagging regrets.

Bob


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## Raul-7

Soon they'll release the A160WE Tuna Sun: http://reefbuilders.com/2014/08/25/...reased-brightness-controls-popular-spotlight/


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## MrRealty

Would the Kessil A150W Sun be overkill on a 17.5" cube?


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## treyLcham

propsi said:


> I took the plunge. Ordered 2 Kessil A150 Amazon Suns. They came in today.
> 
> I'm not really into product porn but I thought I would share my first impressions and some photos nonetheless.
> 
> There's good and bad.
> 
> The good: very compact and seemingly powerful light. It's my impression__as of yet unverified__that 2 units will be able to light my 120p if hung within 24" of the substrate. My hope is that I will have anywhere between 30 and 80 par with the lamp at 20"-24" over the substrate. Pure conjecture on my part. Unfortunately I have no par meter yet, so no readings to give. The color is slightly blue-ish but does not seem to discolor plants in any unpleasant way . The lamp housing stays warm but never hot. Power consumption: 34watts per lamp. By all appearances this is the same base unit as the rest of the series. Reefers seem to be happy with the product.
> 
> The bad: and IMO Kessil drops the ball on this one. Hanging the lamp is something of an afterthought here. A collection of gold hooks, screws and brackets are included in the kit. The assumption here is that there is a canopy over the tank and if not, you're on your own. You can always hang the lamps from the ceiling with some kind wire arrangement, or even by it's electrical wire (no mention in the documentation if that's ok however). But the problem then becomes the length of electrical cord (6ft): way too short to run up to the ceiling and down a wall . Which means you're in DIY territory and possibly voiding the warranty depending on your solution. In my case, I'll buy an extension plugged in as an intermediary between the jacks and hang the unit from the ceiling.
> 
> You can always shell out extra bucks for their gooseneck if that arrangement suits your needs. In that case I just find it a pity that Kessil hasn't made any arrangements to hide their 1/4" cable.
> 
> The small cooling fan inside the lamp emits a steady whine that may disturb some. IMO Kessil could have spent more effort baffling the unit to limit the sound. Not quite a deal breaker but will take some getting used to.
> 
> Documentation is sparse to say the least. No PAR, no spectrography and precious little on how to hang the unit. It's as if Kessil won't stand behind their product and doesn't want to discuss consumers no 1 question: will the lamp do the job it's designed to and if so, to what extent (low, medium or high light ?). Is there a hot spot ? etc..
> Too bad.
> 
> The final test will come when I put the light use. I'm still assembling my setup so no news for a bit.


any updates or videos on how the tank looks?


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