# Rockwood's 75g - Updated 4/25/12



## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

*Progression Shots*

























*Previous shots when the tank looked good: *















*

Current Equipment*
75g All-Glass Aquarium with glass canopies
Black All-glass stand
2x Hydor 200w ETH Heater
2x Ehiem 2215 w/ 2217 impellers
120 lbs. Eco-Complete Black
GLA Ultimate Regulator w/ NV-55 and bubble checker
GLA drop checker
Cerge's style CO2 Reactor
Catalina Aquarium T5HO 4x54w Solar fixture (all 6700k)
Coralife 9v TurboTwist UV

*Current Fauna*
3 Boesemani Rainbows (2 male/1 Female)
1 Yellow Rainbow (Male)
2 Turquoise Rainbows (1 Male/1 Female)
2 New Guinea Rainbows (1 Male/1Female)
1 Rubberlip (L187b) Pleco
8 Julii Corydoras 
3 Clown Loaches
10+ Rummynose Tetras

*Current Flora*
Amazon Sword
Amazon Sword Compact
Crypt Walkeri
Crypt Wenditii
Sunset Hygro
Hygro Corymbosa (Compacta)
Red Tiger Lotus


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Everyone who's been following my thread lately knows the trouble I'd been having. 

After personal issues caused me to move away from my parents house and leave the tank behind. During that time the tank more or less crashed. The fish survived (I still don't know how) and not much else did. I know when I went to break it down, I had a layer of decaying/dead leaves and fish poop sitting on the surface of the substrate. I was actually clogging my python over and over trying to clean the muck off. 

Ever since I set the tank back up its been a battle with algae and just general crap all over the place. I've done everything I could to get it back in order and nothing was working. I upped CO2, raised my lights (which I never needed to do before), added flow, etc. and none of it made a difference. Then I had a light bulb turn on upstairs. I never rinsed the substrate out. I was in such a rush to get everything back together that I never even thought of rinsing the substrate and what kind of filth was in there. 

Well yesterday I decided enough is enough. I'm tired of having a crappy looking tank. I broke down and pulled all of it out and rinsed it. The funk that was coming out was ridiculous. The water that was rinsing through it basically looked like mud. I'm fairly positive parts of it were going anaerobic. Its no wonder I couldn't keep crap off my plants. I also had this cool stump sitting around that I had been toying with putting in the tank. I went ahead and pulled the trigger on it. I'm still having to hold it down to keep it in place (using extra ehiem tubing I had laying around haha) while it soaks. I've also brought back some of the slate rocks that some of you might remember. 

I was really, REALLY wanting to do a manzy scape and had been eying a couple pieces from Mr. Barr, but it doesn't make sense to drop $150-$200 on some wood right now. Plus when I do that I really want to go the AS route. Plus EVERYONE is doing a manzy scape. I wanted to do something a little different. 

So here it is...... hopefully everyone likes


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Good looking restart.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Thanks. I need to get a new camera because phones just don't cut it. It looks a LOT better in person. 

I couldn't believe how quickly the water cleared up and how nice it looks. I had forgotten what a tank is supposed to look like lol. If Justin will ever get me my root tabs (I ordered 2 complete+ packs 2 Fridays ago) I can get the amazons and vals kicking back up again. I've got 3 amazons in there behind the stump but I'm going to kick all but which ever one is doing the best out in short order. I want it to get big like my last one and kind of anchor the scape/help soften the vertical look of the trunk.

I've got some plans still yet to execute. Equipment wise I need to get a Koralia (not sure on size yet.) I want to add in one of those Current USA Subcurrent filters to break the surface and allow me to add things like Purigen, peat, or w/e I decide necessary. Much like Craigthor does. I want to change 2 of the 6700k bulbs out with a plant grow (4000k I think?) and a 10,000k bulb. I'm going to build custom spray bars that bring both the 2215 outflows into one and then Y back out across the top. It will help keep the CO2 even across the tank without needing to go dual valves and build another reactor. I also need a new bulb for the UV. 

As far as plants, I want to add some of that sexy Red Ludwiga Tom has as well as get a bunch of his Staurygone stems. I'm thinking some Rotala colorata and Ludwiga Glandulosa. I really want a lot of color variance. I'm going to look into a grass type forground also like DHG, micro sword, etc. Something a little different than the Staurygone foreground everyone seems to be doing now. 

I kinda want to go against what's popular right now.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Just ordered 3 portions of DHG from PhishingforFish from the SnS. 

Now, does DHG do well with EI dosing or should I hit the substrate up with tabs around it?


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## Kathyy (Feb 22, 2010)

Glad things are looking up for you.

My DHG is in 1" of 10 year old dirty Schultz's Aquatic Soil topped with 2" of clean pea gravel and only dosed with EI and doing fine.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Awesome I'm glad EI will take care of it. 

The Rootmedic tabs shipped yesterday so I'll probably still stick a few in sporadically where I plant it just for good measure.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Rootmedic caps showed up Saturday. Got them put in today. The amazon swords are already bubbling. Meanwhile the Sunset Hygro is looking great. Tops are pinking up. Despite being on 4 bulbs the tank seems to have algae under control, which is very exciting!

The Blyxa was all floating around the top of the tank when I got home, and looks like its been munched on. I think my tigers got hungry and ate it/pulled it up. Had to replant and feed them well lol. 

DHG and some Rotala Colorata ship out on Tuesday.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm beginning to get fairly frustrated that I don't have a decent camera to get good pictures anymore (I ganked mom's from her when I was getting my original shots.)

Of those of you actually reading/lurking this thread, what camera would you suggest. I don't want anything crazy like an SLR or w/e; something decent and cheap (like $150ish?)


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I think I have my Blyxa in finally where it will stay. It kept coming up out of the substrate. Hopefully I don't have this problem with the DHG when it gets here. 

The DHG and the R. Colorata shipped today so hopefully they'll be here around Thursday.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

DHG and Colorata came in today. I've got the R. Colorata in and I'm working on the DHG. Sheesh I didn't realize how tough this stuff would be to plant....

I'll try to get pictures after I plant it and do a water change.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Updated pictures after Colorata and DHG planting. My tank looks like it has hair plugs, heh. I'm thinking the Vals on the left are going to get replaced... maybe with some L. Glandulosa or L. Aromatica. Not sure yet. 

I had a scare today also. My lights didn't come on this morning on time. My timer is running behind which leads me to believe I need to replace the batteries in it. However, the CO2 came on just fine. Interestingly enough, the fish are fine, and weren't showing any signs of issues. I have a feeling its because I'm running an airstone right now. I might have to make this a permanent fixture as my CO2 can go WAY up in relation to the amount of surface agitation the small bubbles are causing. If it keeps the fish healthy while smacking around the algae I'm good with it. 

Current full tank shot: 









Right Side









Left Side


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## beastoise (Apr 17, 2011)

Lol, I'm having the exact same problem with my blyxa. When it came in the mail, it was already looking ragged, now my darn tigers won't leave it planted. Which is weird cause I've never seen them mess with any other plants. Looks like you're off to a good start, I'll have to keep an eye on it.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I think I finally have it pushed down in there far enough they'll leave it alone. Two pieces came up to day but the majority is staying down, and I'm noticing the pieces that came up are sporting some new roots so it is recovering. 

I'm getting a pretty nice baby bubble storm tonight in appreciation of the increased CO2 I'm assuming. It's nothing like what used to happen in this tank but it's an improvement. 

Things are looking up


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm insanely frustrated right now. I'm at the point now where I'm seriously considering tossing it all out the window and tearing the tank down. 

When the lights turned on today I noticed that the swords aren't doing spectacular like I thought they would, the algae problem growing on the leaves is still persisting. I've spent $20 on 40 pieces of Blyxa and the only thing remaining from that is maybe 15 or so nubs. The leaves aren't healthy, mainly because they keep getting pulled out by the Tiger Barbs. The $20 worth of DHG that I just purchased also is looking fairly sickly. It looked green and healthy when it arrived, but now its down to looking like the rest of the tank. Has the weird brown sh*t growing amongst it already and just looks bad. That doesn't include the $20 of Staurygone Repens that I put in and it just melted to nothing.

The only thing I'm managing to grow are things like Hygro, especially the Sunset Hygro which is considered an invasive species. So it will grow anywhere. 

I'm beginning to think the first time I set this up and had success it was a fluke. I couldn't really do anything wrong. Sh*t just grew and it was awesome. 

After the tank crash nothing works. I've raised the lights higher than they ever were, cranked the CO2 to the point where I need an airstone in the tank to keep the fish from floating, pulled all the substrate out and cleaned it, added a second 2215, started dosing Excel, and guess what nothing changed!!! 

The only difference from the first go around at this point was a UV and everyone says they don't really do anything in planted tanks.

At this point it will serve me better in the garbage and I'll have a lower water bill. I'll also not be spending money to kill plants.


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## plecostomouse (Jun 9, 2011)

hi, im no expert by far, but maybe because you have kranked up light and co2 the plants have very high demands for macro and micro nutrients, in low light setups you dont need to dose these as the plants have very low demands.
if you turned down your lights the growth would be slower but the plants may be able to remain healthier.

also what temp do you have your tank set too?
this has an affect on plant procceses like photosynthesis, so if you kept your temp down plant requirements may not be as high.

hope this helps


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I have root tabs and I also dose EI every day. I'm not seeing signs that they aren't getting enough, I've seen those before (yellowing leaves, holes in the leaves, etc.)

Tank temp is 78-79.


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## plecostomouse (Jun 9, 2011)

then i have no idea whats wrong


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Maybe you need to build a little nitrifying bacteria and to let the tank settle in a little, I've never tried Blyxa but it's a cool looking plant and I see complaints of poor roots, floating out of the substrate, and high nutrient requirements so don't get to down on that one as I've decided not to try it unless AS is the sub.

The Excel should help and I do the same dosing 20 ml daily to boost my growth and keep algae at bay, after a couple of weeks the plants will start growing and eating up all the nutrients that are currently feeding algae. You started on 10-6 so it's been 2 weeks for the bulk of the plants but only a couple of days for the DHG so the hardest part can this period of waiting before any growth starts, but I think it will turn the corner soon.

The flat stones you have in the tank are perfect for Riccia, Fissidens, or Peacock Moss, so that would be a cool addition, floating Riccia pods are also cool (some hate Riccia) and shrimp love to hang in them.

Soon the R. colorata will start growing like a weed too.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

So I'm hoping these come out well. I wanted to get some pictures of the various unwanted growth I'm seeing (algae.) I did my water change and then set out to get some shots. *I'm REALLY hoping you guys can help me out with some answers so I can have a nice lush tank like I used to have*. I'm at my wits end here.

Here's a few of the DHG and what is attacking it: 


























And nearby on the rocks I'm seeing what I believe are diatoms. I'm HOPING that is coming out because its pulling silicates out of the rocks. They've been in the water before and didn't do that for long. I would have thought that would have been all over since they've cycled through it before but I guess not. 










Here are some of the crypt leaves with junk on them. Some of it looks like dead brown algae, some of it doesn't. The interesting thing is most of it can be wiped off but it comes right back.


























Here's the tiny lotus I kept, and you can see fairly well the stuff just sitting on the leaves. Its not attached, just resting on them. If I stir the water around it, it will come off... mostly.










The good ole growth on the wood









And a shot of what is attacking my swords (amazons and compact) and my compact hygro. 










*So I have a couple questions.*

1. Can anyone help identify what is attacking these plants and help me get rid of it? 
2. After the water change, interestingly enough my plants when bubblestorm ballistic. I turned the second bank of bulbs on to get more light for the pictures and WOW what a response. Is it entirely possible that I'm dosing with EI and it's not enough, leading to the algae winning? What could be in the water causing this response that the plants aren't getting long term? 
3. Can I save the DHG, or is it a lost cause in waiting? 

*Like I said earlier, I know people look a the thread, but I'm really hoping to get a conversation going so I can get this back in order. *

I took a video that I'm trying to upload, and as soon as I get it done I'll post it. However right now I'm uploading at the speed of smell.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It looks like you had a little diatom outbreak and the other looks like BBA starting, when rescape and move the substrate around you can stir up silicates that have settled in the substrate and cause a diatom outbreak but this will pass and higher light can help if they can be lowered closer to the tank. There is also the possibility your bulbs are past their prime and it's time to replace them, it's big bucks but every year is best, Antbug said his par reading was 20 with old bulbs and went upto 50 with the new.

For the BBA I would dose excel 1ml per 3 gallons or more for 15 to 20 days, some have said they dosed as high as 1ml per gallon but I have found the leaves tend to fall off some plants more rapidly than others, I just did 15 days dosing excel then a 10 day break and now I'm dosing Excel again but at half the rate or 1ml to every 6 gallons.

If you can I would pull that piece of wood out and scrub it with stiff brush then wipe it down with a little Excel or a Chlorox (10 to 1) mix, rinse it good a couple and put it back. I'd do the same with any plastic in the tank, BBA loves to stick to filter intakes/outlets and this can help it spread because it's right in the flow.

DHG will do that, it turns brown here and there while it's growing roots then it will start to put out new growth, you can always mow it to stimulate growth.

The Excel will help your growth too. I just did all this to my tank and it's paying off, it looks cleaner than it has in a while. I would also keep wiping it of with your fingers if you can make it a daily routine until the problem is solved.


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## Kathyy (Feb 22, 2010)

It has been only 2 weeks and you tossed the mulm in the gravel out when you re set the tank, healthy mulm is good stuff if yucky looking. My mulm smelled like fresh soil, if yours smelled like rotten eggs then you were right to rinse it out! The leaves present when you planted are going to get algae and look horrible as they are replaced by healthy new growth. Your hairgrass looks a whole lot better than mine did. Mine completely turned brown before I started seeing new shoots. Only remembering that it always does that it kept me from ripping it up and buying new plants.

Are you running all the lights? Might reduce the lighting period and shade the tank or use fewer bulbs right now. My plants perked up when I shaded the tank. Once things looked better I removed the shade for a couple hours a day and at the moment no shade at all and I have removed most of the floating plants as well. Have that screen ready for use still!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

150EH - Thanks for your help. I've been wondering about my bulbs as well. I've been wanting to replace them with Geismanns (sp?) but you're right, its big money. I've been focusing on building a rifle up until this point and since that's done maybe I can get them here soon. I want to do a 10k, 2x 6700k, and a 4000k. I haven't been running all 4 all the time lately. I've been trying the "noon burst" that people talk about. That's when I got my epic bubble storm yesterday, when I flipped on the extra bank. 

I'm going to try just doing the "filters off spray with excel" thing on the wood, as I don't want to remove it if I can avoid it. The substrate is built up around it like I wanted and if I pull it... well that's all over.

I'll pick up on my Excel dosing and see where that gets me too. I'm hoping the DHG will survive as it makes a really cool looking carpet, and it was SO healthy when I got it here. I'm considering trimming it down about half way to maybe stir it into action. I just don't want to do anything that will cause me to lose it, because well... that would just suck.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Kathyy - I had no idea that DHG routinely goes brown before coming back to life. I'll give it more time and hope that it gets straightened out. Would you suggest a trim might help or hurt it? 

As far as the lights, like I told 150EH, I have them cut back to 1 bank right now. I turn the second bank on once a day for about 2-3 hours and cut them again. The photo period is back down to 8 hours (I was trying to push it to 10). I know things seem to be growing like the Hygro. The rotala is already taking off too which is interesting although I'm getting completely different shaped growth than what I received in the mail. It's weird.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I re-homed the 8 Tiger Barbs into my roommates 65g downstairs. I was tired of them causing havoc, pulling plants up, and just generally taking up bio load space. They actually seem VERY happy down there in his tank and a couple of his small clown loaches are trying to school with them  I guess they think they look alike. 

I'm going to replace them with some additional rummynose tetras (I lost a several when the whole tank cycle/algae fest was going on) to get a school of around 25 or so. Then I'd like to add 3-4 rainbows of some type of rareish variety. Any suggestions? 

I'm also going to try and find another pitbull pleco or two and throw them in there, to give my current one some friends  Speedie wouldn't come up off his . 


As far as the plants, things seem to be getting better. I'm pretty sure the DHG has started growing, so I trimmed it down about an inch to hopefully promote spreading. The rotala is growing, but is only green and also leaves are shaped very differently from what arrived. I'm confused by it but maybe after it matures the colorata part will come back lol. The sunset is starting to pick up its pink hue again, and the swords are starting to get some real healthy looking leaves again. 

I'm not sure any of the Blyxa will survive ( should have pulled the Tigers sooner) but if not I'll just find more and bring it in. This time it won't get eaten.


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Good to hear things are coming around. Sounds like your colorata was grown emersed or at a different temperature or with a different lighting level. Give it time I suspect the color will come out as it grows taller. Watch your nitrate and phosphate levels. Don't let your nitrate get above 20 or your reds will turn green or even stop growing if the level is high enough. Phosphates should be around 1.5 to 2.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I need to get all new testing kits here in the next couple of weeks. For now I'm happy that everything is growing and it LOOKS like the new leaves are managing to stay algae free. If I can get the carpet growing in and the amazon getting bigger, I'll be much happier. 

Once that starts happening I'll begin looking into additional stems and start grouping things up a little better. I'll thin out the sunset and colorata some, bring in more variety, and probably replace the val area with additional stems there.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> I need to get all new testing kits here in the next couple of weeks. For now I'm happy that everything is growing and it LOOKS like the new leaves are managing to stay algae free. If I can get the carpet growing in and the amazon getting bigger, I'll be much happier.
> 
> Once that starts happening I'll begin looking into additional stems and start grouping things up a little better. I'll thin out the sunset and colorata some, bring in more variety, and probably replace the val area with additional stems there.


I am not really that experienced, but may I suggest maybe more stems now? Maybe it will help bring everything into balance a little better. Either way. The tank looks good.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Ha, Cable the only problem with that is I don't know what I want  You're probably right though, it would help bring a lot of additional growth into the tank.

I mean really that's what happened last time the tank did so well. It basically went from a few swords fresh out of the store (still with their round leaves) to "HOLY CRAP PLANTS EVERYWHERE". 

I used to have a stem or two of Ludwiga Glandulosa and I think I'd like to try that again. I'd love to have some of that red ludwiga Tom has too. Maybe some L. Aromatica? I'm not sure, I really need to do some stem research. My stem variety knowledge is really limited. Of course I guess I could always look at Craigthor's tank since he has *all* of them. Opinions on what would be nice are welcome by the way 



SIDE NOTE: I have noticed the rotala leaves are losing the stubby roundness and taking the shape they had when the stems arrived. I'm assuming I was correct in the stems needed to mature in their new home a little. Hopefully color happens soon!.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Ha, Cable the only problem with that is I don't know what I want  You're probably right though, it would help bring a lot of additional growth into the tank.
> 
> I mean really that's what happened last time the tank did so well. It basically went from a few swords fresh out of the store (still with their round leaves) to "HOLY CRAP PLANTS EVERYWHERE".
> 
> ...


I would say to just get some of whatever is at the LFS for now to balance it out, then replace them as you find some. Some Hygro difformis would be nice, but I have a soft spot for that plant and don't know why.roud:

I will try to get an idea for some better ones for you.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

The LFS here is incredibly too high priced and has next to ZERO variety. The plants look like crap to boot. The store I get my fish from in Nashville (1.5 hrs away) is better as far as quality, but not in variety. 

My only real supply of stems is the SnS here. I've looked at a couple packages and will probably post a WTB thread after my rent/utilities/car payment is paid.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> The LFS here is incredibly too high priced and has next to ZERO variety. The plants look like crap to boot. The store I get my fish from in Nashville (1.5 hrs away) is better as far as quality, but not in variety.
> 
> My only real supply of stems is the SnS here. I've looked at a couple packages and will probably post a WTB thread after my rent/utilities/car payment is paid.


Got ya. If anything, PM wkndracer, he may be able to send you a bunch when he trims. He did that for me. It is where most of my plants came from, and they are doing great. I only paid $18 for a huge bag of stuff from him. Might be worth a shot to get things started, then you can trade them or sell them for the plants you want.:icon_smil


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Anyone have some ideas on stems to throw in to this thing that are a little different/colorful? 

Also need tips on where I can get 3-4 semi-rare type Rainbows.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Quick photo update


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Looks good man.roud:


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

It's looking _better_. 

The left side is obviously weak. Cable, you're right. I need to order some stems and load that side up as well. The center is going to look barren for a little while until that sword grows up into its big boy shoes. 

Obviously the right side needs trimming, but I'm more or less letting it grow unabated until everything evens out. I'm still getting a lot of brown on the DHG but Kathyy said her's turned almost completely brown and it looks good now, so I'm hoping that holds true here too. Time will tell. 

I'm following 150EH's advice with the Excel dosing. It seems to be working for the powerhead and filter pieces, but the wood on the right is still holding steady. I don't mind it as long as it behaves and stays on the wood. I'll probably eventually moss/anubia that area and I'll clean it all off then. 

Also, I'm not sure if that stump is going to sink or not. I might have to so some messing with it (like gluing some rocks on it, etc.) to make it stay.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> It's looking _better_.
> 
> The left side is obviously weak. Cable, you're right. I need to order some stems and load that side up as well. The center is going to look barren for a little while until that sword grows up into its big boy shoes.
> 
> ...


If you have a bunch of stems on the other side ready to be trimmed, do so, and add the trimmed ones to the side with the sword. That will work temporarily. And I would look at some Hygros. Specifically in the red dept. Take a look at Bahugo's thread. He has some really nice red stems that would look good in here.

Excel is amazing. As far as the algae on the wood, I wouldn't worry too much. If you add some stems it may get rid of that due to taking up all the nutrients on it.

And to keep the wood down, you could always attach a piece of slate to it and bury the slate. If you are going to do that though, you want to do it soon as when your plants get going, you won't want to mess with the substrate on that kind of level.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Limno Wavy for the left side back corner...


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I ordered a stem package from Crispin last night. It had a couple things in it I knew I wanted and a lot that I have no clue about so I figured it would be a good deal for an experiment. I bought it with the idea to get the stems in and play with them some to help diversify what things look like in various combination (leaf shape, color, etc.)

Here's what I'm getting: 

Syngonanthus sp 'Belem'
Acmella repens
Ludwigia inclinata var verticillata 'Pantanal'
Ludwigia inclinata var verticillata 'Cuba'
Ludwigia sp 'Red'
Pogostemon yatabeanus
Limnophila sp 'Wavy'
Limnophila sp 'Mini'
Bacopa sp 'Salzmannii'/Araguaia
Hygrophila sp 'Tiger'
Staurogyne sp 'Bihar'
Eichornia diversifolia
Rotala sp 'Vietnam'
Rotala macranda (Red, Slender and Pointed Leaf)
Rotala macranda sp 'Green'
Rotala sp 'Singapore'
Rotala wallichii
Ammania bonsai or True Rotala indica
Pogostemon punctata 'Blume'

Once that gets here I'm going to hack back the Sunset Hygro and pull some of it and the Colorata. I'll group everything up a little better (sort of dutch style I guess. I'm going to pull a bunch of the Vals and Hygro Compact too so I can make room for the new stems. 

Now some of the only things I need to get are probably some more Blyxa (since the stuff I had just isn't going to make it) and I really want some Ludwiga Glandulosa. Other than that I'll just have a grow operation on my hands.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm looking at moving away from spray bars and going to more of just a fan outflow or locline. While doing so, I want to pick up a Koralia.

*My question now is how big? Recommendations? *I just want one that will keep a solid current yet not uproot plants or keep them all leaning like they were in a hurricane.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Look what just arrived!


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

I love packages of the green variety.:biggrin:


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## ptr (Sep 23, 2011)

Fantastic ! Can't wait to see them in the tank !


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Whew... all planted and water change complete. Pictures are uploading. I saved a few of the stems of colorata and sunset hygro but most of it had to go. I was running out of room!

BTW If you want a nice plant package, talk to Crispin in the power sellers spot. Everything looked great and he labeled everything amazingly. Even though I don't remember exactly what is what :/


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I haven't color corrected/sharpened etc these so bear with me but you can at least see the layout for now. I'm sure it will change several times (about like Craig has changed his) over the next however long. I think the Amazon is already on the chopping block, as its going to be WAY too big for this amount of stems. 

*FTS*









*Left close-up*









*Center close-up*









*Right close-up* (rainbows playing in the stream from the powerhead









*Hairgrass* It's showing signs of growth. Its not putting out runners yet but I'm holding out hope. I think it just needs to get its roots good and set and I'll start seeing them in a couple weeks. 









I'll get some better shots of things sometime early next week after some of the plants settle in and straighten out. I know everything is pearling already after the water change so that's a plus.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm not gonna lie... I'm sitting here looking at the tank and I'm wanting a bigger one. I don't think this amazon is going to be able to stay in this size tank.

And I'm watching my Rubberlip run along the glass and do some cleaning, and he's making me want more of them. Speedie needs to sell me his . I love that guy. He makes me smile every time he comes out of hiding.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

FTS after the night, some of the color is coming back after shipping and stems are straightening out.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

And apparently the rainbows wanted to model for you guys.


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Tank looks great, excellent selection of plants, good mix of leaf types and colors. Livestock looks great, too. It will take a little while for the sword to overtake the tank, but you are right that it will get huge.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

2in10 said:


> Tank looks great, excellent selection of plants, good mix of leaf types and colors. Livestock looks great, too. It will take a little while for the sword to overtake the tank, but you are right that it will get huge.


Thanks, really it was Crispin that selected the plants haha. I don't want to take credit for that as I'm still very much learning what is what. 

And yeah, that's why I'm thinking about pulling the sword now. If I wait the roots will pretty much cause me to need to replant the entire tank. Plus I could move one of the stems in there and let it get nice and bushy to fill in behind the stump. 

Right now Ludwigia inclinata var verticillata 'Cuba' is on the other side. I'm thinking about moving it to the "sword side" so it will be able to grow up and be seen a little more. I'm not sure what I'd stick in the spot where it is now (kinda behind the back left of the stump.)

I'm also considering moving the Syngonanthus sp 'Belem' or the Pogostemon yatabeanus back there. I'm leaning toward the Pogostemon for that spot though. I could leave the Ludwigia inclinata var verticillata 'Pantanal' where it's at now. With the Syngonanthus or L. Cuba I get similar leaf shape/texture and they will probably muddy in together. 


I'm sure this thing will go through what Craig's tank has been doing with constant shifting as it grows in and I see what's going on. There are probably be a few things pulled out too so I can focus on breaking up color/texture. It will be easier to get nice contrasts going on when there are wider differences between the various species than having some of all shapes/sizes.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Made the mistake of going to the LFS yesterday and ended up picking up 2 Marci Rainbows. They're young so they don't have a ton of color yet but I think they'll be awesome as they mature. They're quite different from what I had so I couldn't resist. 

They also had a sale on Rummynoses so I picked up another dozen of those to replace the ones I lost (which was most of the last batch.) I think the water parameters were off and the new rummies weren't able to handle it last time. Now I'm positive my water and all is much, much better so hopefully I'll be able to keep 90% of these. Right now its a nice little school. 

Plant wise everything is growing, some faster than others but that's ok. I'm falling in love with the Pogostemon quickly. The DHG is growing decently too so I'm continuing to increase hope for a nice lush grassy foreground.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

ACK! So I need some advice here. I think my tank could be going through a mini cycle some how and I don't know what I did. 

I did my routine maintenance last night. I pulled the filters out, changed the fine floss and put them back together. Then I finally got a new UV bulb and I put that in. Then I did my water change and now this morning the water is cloudy like crazy. 

What did I do? Is it the UV maybe? I ran tests and I'm not seeing ammonia (MAYBE a _slight_ green so 0.1 at the worst.) Has anyone else gotten cloudiness after installing/repairing a UV?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Ok, I have what I think is probably a really big problem. I have what looks to be mold/mildew/fungus growing underneath my substrate. When I was under the tank yesterday I noticed 2-3" diameter white spots at the bottom glass. 

*I'm pretty worried about it, and I REALLY need some advice as to what might be going on. Is this substrate just trash and I need to get new or what?*

I know some of you are happy just viewing, but I need someone to help with some answers this time.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm worried as hell.... I just put all these plants in and don't want them dead from the root up. If I have to act I need to do it now but I honestly don't have a clue what to do about it.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> I'm worried as hell.... I just put all these plants in and don't want them dead from the root up. If I have to act I need to do it now but I honestly don't have a clue what to do about it.


Not sure myself. I have all my tanks on something that does not allow me to see under them, so I wouldn't know if they had that or not. Did you post a thread in the general area?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Doing it now...


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Doing it now...


You might also try posting something on APC as well.


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## smiller8 (Feb 14, 2010)

Can you post a picture of the mold/fungi?

Is it on the substrate or the wood? You may have a slime mold of some sort, but a picture would be extremely helpful.

Best,

Steve Miller


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

It's _under_ the substrate. Like between the bottom glass and substrate layer. I'll post pictures in a few.


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## smiller8 (Feb 14, 2010)

Yes post a pic when you get a chance.

You can see under your substrate? Or the mold is starting to go up the front/back/sides of the glass?

If it is the water mold I'm am imagining in my mind you may not have much to worry about, just scrap it off. Or you can try malachite green, but not if you have snails or shrimp, that will most likely kill them. 

Best to get a pic up though before you go too crazy with medication or before I shrug it off like it's no big deal!

Best,

Steve Miller


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I can see the bottom piece of glass by sticking my head into my stand and looking up. I actually was looking under the tank to see how the root systems of some of the plants were doing (namely the crypts) and that's when I noticed it. 

Here are pictures as best I can get them considering I have only an iphone and require flash to get it to show up.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I use the JBJ circulation pumps from Marine Depot, they have a wide gentle flow and at the time the price was right for 2 x 500 gph pumps with a wave maker and the worked nicely in my tank which is 48" long. I now have made some custom plumbing with a vertical spray bar and it has enough flow without the other pumps added, I took a bold step and tried Amano's method of the flow coming from the front right corner over all the low foreground plants first the rebounds off the other end of the tank back to the right rear corner where the filter intake is positioned, of course he does it with lily pipes. But it works good and the black vertical spray bar is no more ugly that a power head but you can remove the power head anytime. It looks like you could try this without buying anything but some flat black Krylon paint to help them disappear but this is certainly not going to meet the look of everyone's style.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

They are planaria if I remember correctly. After looking I don't think they are but if you post the photo in the invert section some one can help you.

Yeah don't add any meds to your tank it may be something easy to fix.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

150EH said:


> They are planaria if I remember correctly. After looking I don't think they are but if you post the photo in the invert section some one can help you.
> 
> Yeah don't add any meds to your tank it may be something easy to fix.


The white string things are the roots of some of the crypts, not worms. My concern is the white mold spots.


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## smiller8 (Feb 14, 2010)

The first picture looks like it's different from the second picture. This may just be because you had to use your iPhone. I am not sure what it is to be honest, but if you plants and fish seem fine, I wouldn't do anything rash or worry too much. I think this may go away. Maybe try a larger water change and monitor if it gets larger or stays the same.

Also, it is under the substrate, so I wouldn't go digging at it or anything. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Oh, sorry I totally read it wrong and saw it wrong, I see now its the underside of the tank. I could just be sediment from the substrate and I don't think mold will grow without any light so you would need to have a light constantly on under the tank. My stand is very similar and my flourite gets dead areas where there are no plant roots etc. and it's never been a problem but it's exactly why the UGF was a good idea and I will still use them in shrimp tanks were clean water is essential.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

This substrate just hasn't been the same since the period where it was heavily neglected and all but crashed. I'm _really_ considering throwing the Eco in the garbage and going to AS. I just have to find the money to do so. However with Christmas coming, I'll probably have to hold off.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I would try putting both you intakes right next to each other in the back corner of the tank, then if you Eheim stuff is old you can just remove the little 90 degree bend and place both spraybars right next to each other in the front corner of the tank as a temporary experiment. If you find it works well then you can make everything custom to hide it or at least lesson the look with flat black paint, custom plumbing, depending on how far you want to take it. If you ever need help on pipe/tubing sizing, etc. just send me a pm and I will be glad to help if I can, good luck.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> This substrate just hasn't been the same since the period where it was heavily neglected and all but crashed. I'm _really_ considering throwing the Eco in the garbage and going to AS. I just have to find the money to do so. However with Christmas coming, I'll probably have to hold off.


Why not give dirt a shot?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

150EH - Thanks man. I've got extra Eheim tubing laying around. I'm going to have to cut one piece longer but I'm probably going to move everything around this weekend. 

Cable - Everyone has such amazing success with AS I've just been focusing on that. I really don't know much about dirt pros/cons. I know someone was saying something about the organic potting soil having an issue with burping badness into the water etc. The pro's of AS just seem so incredible that I'm thinking its worth the cash.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> 150EH - Thanks man. I've got extra Eheim tubing laying around. I'm going to have to cut one piece longer but I'm probably going to move everything around this weekend.
> 
> Cable - Everyone has such amazing success with AS I've just been focusing on that. I really don't know much about dirt pros/cons. I know someone was saying something about the organic potting soil having an issue with burping badness into the water etc. The pro's of AS just seem so incredible that I'm thinking its worth the cash.


I am not going to argue on the greatness of AS. I have not used it yet myself, but I have some that I plan on using very soon. I have seen amazing growth and reviews on it, so I am not going to say it is not worth every penny. I was just thinking if you want something a little cheaper, dirt is the way to go. I currently have 2 full on dirt tanks, and 2 dirt-ish tanks. The dirt-ish tanks use planters pots with dirt and gravel to grow plant in. As far as it burping out badness, it will spike in nitrates, nitrites, and ammonia in the beginning, but so will AS from what I have seen. If you soak the organic stuff and set it up right, you should not have to worry about anything worse than that coming from it. If you can spare the money for the AS though, go for it, if you don't want to drop all that much money on it, 20 bucks would dirt and cap your entire tank.roud:


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## green_valley (Sep 14, 2011)

You got some nice looking plants.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

green_valley - Thanks. They're not so hot in person right now. I'm still getting a lot of brown algae and crud on them, and I just can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. 

Cable - I'm going to investigate the dirt idea a little more. I'm still leaning towards AS due to how it changes water parameters and how successful pretty much EVERY plant is in it, plus its a one step deal (no root tabs etc needed.) How successful have your tanks been with the dirt? I'm assuming you drop the dirt in and then cap with something like Tahitian moon sand? Do you need to layer anything else under it? 

I'm thinking I might give myself a birthday present in Jan (after xmas gifts are paid for.) I'm looking at some wood from Tom, and then the switch to AS New Amazonia (6-7 9L bags. *ouch*) I'll probably also scoop up package of his smaller pieces too, to help do a fairly serious wood scape. If the pieces I'm eyeballing right now sell I'll end up seeing if he can help me get something close as Jan is a ways off and his stuff is selling like crazy right now. 

Here's the piece I'm looking at:


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Cable - I'm going to investigate the dirt idea a little more. I'm still leaning towards AS due to how it changes water parameters and how successful pretty much EVERY plant is in it, plus its a one step deal (no root tabs etc needed.) How successful have your tanks been with the dirt? I'm assuming you drop the dirt in and then cap with something like Tahitian moon sand? Do you need to layer anything else under it?


My tanks with dirt are going crazy. And I don't have to use fert tabs. I use fert tabs in the tank with EcoComplete. I do use CO2 and water column ferts on my dirt tanks. Some plants you just can't get around that with. Mostly it for the plants that are on DW. I use a mix of things to cap with. Sometimes I use regular gravel, and other times I use sand. I have black reef sand (not live) and regular leveling sand from a home improvement store. I prefer the marine sand as the size is a little more uniform and it does not blow around as much. I don't layer anything under it unless I am putting it in a planter pot in which case I just use gravel under the dirt. So far all my dirt tanks are doing amazing. I am very happy with how well they do, and you can still do a high tech setup with the dirt as well. If you need any more info, feel free to ask. You can also ask wkndracer as he is pretty much the dirt guru, and if you like, the thread in my sig is a combo of all my individual threads. The first post has links to the individual ones if you want to see any of the pots or the way I set up the dirt tanks.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I lost my Yellow Rainbow today....


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> I lost my Yellow Rainbow today....


Sorry to hear that man.:icon_frow


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

*Major Update*

Ok, I have a major update. 

First new full tank shot: 
(looking better but still not good yet)









Here are additional pictures so you can see the algae/plant health issue I'm working on. Below I describe what I'm doing to turn this tank from "Eh OK" to "Great". I'm all ears on other suggestions as well. I know there are a lot of people here with more experience than I have so I'd love it if you shared that knowledge here. 


























































*The Problems*
1. I'm still combating the brown algae issue, and fighting BBA. 
2. I had just loads of build up of plant matter/junk under plants in certain corners and a build up around the DHG.
3. If I removed the air stone the fish would have serious problems breathing, quickly so it was out of balance severely. 

*** Yes these solutions are out of order ***
*Attempted solution to problem #2*
I decided the flow pattern from the filters wasn't getting the job done. After suggestions from 150EH I decided to move everything around and do the more "Amano" style of filtration where the output is at the front of the tank on one side and the intake is in the back on the same side. There are a lot of people running their tanks with this method and getting great results so I wanted to try it and see if it would help eliminate dead spots. 

I replaced several lengths of hosing (some were FILTHY and some were to short to do what I needed.) I also pulled the CO2 reactor out of the cabinet and gave it a thorough cleaning. It was disgusting. I didn't realize it because its dark under the tank, but there was a big build up of what looked to be diatoms inside the reactor. I had to take an old toothbrush and scrub the insides to get it off. I serviced one of the filters also and it was a good thing because it had to be working overtime to keep decent flow going through it. The eheim mech (little tubes) were full of crap. 

I've also ordered two new "U" shaped outputs with adjustable flow direction on them, a Koralia Evo 750 and a Current USA Subcurrent internal overflow style filter. Combining these into the new flow pattern should help keep everything moving nicely. 

*Attempted solution to #3*
About a week ago, I decided I wanted to pull the air stone. It was unsightly and the tube was gathering BBA on it. When I pulled it, I had to crank my CO2 way down to keep the fish from gasping. I had it entirely too high. Now that I've turned it down, things seem to be just fine, and I'm using way less CO2 which is great. I've had to put the air stone back in temporarily though. Due to the new flow scheme I have reduced my surface agitation down immensely and I was having an issue keeping the fish happy and the CO2 steady. Once I get the Koralia, new outputs, and subcurrent filter in I should have enough agitation to remove the air stone for good. 

*Attempted solution to #1*
I've replaced my light bulbs and reworked my lighting period. It's 8 hours with 2 6500k 54w T5HO running and mid-cycle, for 3 hours, an additional 4000k and 10000k turn on (vs 7 hours of 6700k 4x54w).

After reading the "ADA/ADG Gallery journal", I came to the conclusion that I think I've been fertilizing way to much. Between realizing the CO2 was double what I needed it to be, and trying everything else in the book that's the only thing I can imagine. When Francis mentioned the GDA showing up meaning the tank was out of balance and in turn reducing his ferts I realized that could be the issue here. I've reduced dosing to: 

Day 1 - 3/8tsp KH2PO4 - 1/8tsp K2SO4
Day 2 - 3/8tsp CSM+B - 1/8tsp Iron Chelate
Day 3 - repeat day 1
Day 4 - repeat day 2
Day 5 - repeat day 1
Day 6 - nothing
Day 7 - 1/4tsp KH2PO4 - 1/8tsp K2SO4 - 1/4 CSM+B (After 60-75% water change)

The dosing scheme is coming from Francis saying "always dose potassium" and wanting to keep micros in the tank as it helps keep plants growing well. 

The massive water changes are being done after reading Francis' advice in his thread. He mentions when things are that out of balance big water changes help. I've noticed this to be true as I've seen a subtle improvement after doing two 75% water changes this week. I've also brought it down that far to do direct excel dosing to the wood I have remaining in the tank to kill the BBA infesting it. It's working like a charm. All the BBA is red or purple and falling off. 

*Questions*
So now my questions are this. Now that I seem to have a grip on what the root issues are, and I'm taking steps to fix them... how do I handle the plants? I have several (like the Ludwiga Cuba, Red Ludwiga, Syngonanthus sp 'Belem', Acmella repens, Eichornia diversifolia) that have a LOT of lower leaves I should probably trim off. Is that the recommended course of action? It will leave the lower stem very barren, but would remove the damaged portion. I just don't want trimming these leaves off to kill the plant. 

Are there any other recommendations out there for changes I should make to see continued improvements?


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

The brown algae (brown fuzzy stuff on your leaves) is a form of diatom algae, add about 10 Amano Shrimp to your tank and this will eliminate that. You don't want that lingering in the tank, because it's an easy algae to remove with shrimp, but if you don't remove it, then worse algae can grow on it. 

I would remove the filtration hoses / pipes (the eheim, in take and out put, the air stone and airline tubing) and I would soak them in bleach - they look like they're pretty infested with BBA and at this point that would be the easiest solution. Bleach is very water soluble so you can wash with a bleach solution to remove the algae (i'd use an algae pad to help in this task) then rinse with water until you can't really smell the bleach and you're good to go (dechlorinater will also remove bleach). I'd get into the habit of doing this once every two weeks or so (not the full on bleaching, but removing the pieces and cleaning with an algae pad in the sink), since filtration pipes are like leaves that don't grow - they're just another surface for algae to grow on. 

That you have diatoms in your tank tells me that something screwy went on with the biological filtration - this typically only occurs at the start of new tanks, when the bio media isn't fully established (or in the case of the 60-P, after a decent portion of the bio filter was replaced with new media). It's super easy to remove with a small piece of airline tubing used to drain the tank (use it like a normal drain hose and create 'suction,' to remove tuft like algae's like that or debris between plant build ups).

For the stems - if the leaves on the bottom are rotty, what I would do is cut the stem then replant the tops and remove the bases, you have to do this periodically with stems as the bases become weaker every time they are trimmed (and they have to be trimmed to get bushy instead of leggy!), so this would be a good time to do that. Just remove as much surface with algae on it as possible.

The next step is I would treat this like a brand new aquarium - I would do a water change every single day for the first week, of at least 50%, and I would only be dosing potassium (though that's in aqua soil, eco-complete is a little different, so traces are fine I think, unless you have a lot of root tab fertilizers). 

Then I'd do a water change every other day after that for the second week, then every third day for the third week, then once a week after that.

It'll be hell week for you, but as you do water changes, remove more bba or other problematic pieces as you can, and add Amano shrimp to the picture, then trim off the dead growth and replant the stem tops and you should have almost a 180 degree turn around on this tank. 

Using Bacter 100 would also be very beneficial to increasing the beneficial bacteria base (under substrate additives at adgshop.com) and Green Bacter for feeding the bacteria.

It may actually also be in your best interest to remove pieces of the hardscape and dip them in a bleach solution too to kill off the BBA, then thoroughly rinse and put back in. 

The good news is once you get the aquarium balanced and good then you'll be smooth sailing and won't have to put in that huge effort daily to correct it.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Thanks for the advice Francis. 

With the Amanos: Will my clown loaches do OK with them or are they going to destroy them at night? I added 20+ shrimp last week (random cross bred shrimp... nothing fancy) and after the second night they were gone. I'd love to add shrimp but if they're just going to be really expensive loach food that's not very appealing. 

I'll do the bleach dip when my other gear comes in as I'll already be turning the filters off to switch the outtakes. I've been trying to avoid pulling the wood out considering its sunk down in the substrate well, but I'm afraid it might be the only course of action. The BBA is spreading to the stones below and I'm going to have to pull those up too. I've noticed that pieces of Eco-Complete (mostly the larger pieces) will begin growing a tuft of BBA in the foreground semi-often. I try to just pull them out when I see them, but is there any other way to stop this? 

I'll start the water change regime on Monday and update with progress here. While doing the daily/semi daily water change, how would you handle dosing ferts? My first guess would be nothing the first week, potassium the second week, and then potassium + traces the third week. Then on the forth begin introducing K2SO4 and maybe nitrates if it looks necessary. Sound like a good plan?

As for the plants, some of them will have to be done carefully. I'll try to cut the bases off what I can. Other items I'll just have to remove leaves that are infested until I get a little more vertical growth so I can cut the base then.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

After you finish your water change, add the ferts in as per norm with the reduced fert scheme: potassium at least. Try to do the water change during the morning / early am (basically as close to when lights turn on as possible). I don't have proof this helps, but it seems like it just works better to do water changes at the beginning of a photoperiod.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

I'd probably remove the clown loaches - they shouldn't bother Amanos, but not being able to use Amano shrimp in a planted tank is a really, really big weakness. It's not easy keeping a 100% clean tank without Amano's as back up. Because we have no Amano shrimp in the 60-P, it forces me to be 1000% more vigilant in spotting algae problems ahead of time.

But anyway, with the water changing: water change, ferts, water change ferts, etc.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm ordering 12 Amanos and 4 Ottos from msjinkzd as soon as the amanos she got in today are ready to sell.

I'm also starting the water change cycle today. I'll be posting pictures over the next 3 weeks to document how things are progressing for others who might be watching this journal and having these issues as well.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

So Week #1 is underway (water change every day.)

Here's how the tank started the day:









Did a major trim to remove the algae ridden leaves/stem bottoms and replanted. That's also why there's so much garbage floating around.









Water level dropped: 









And back full: 









I'm hoping my new outflows, koralia and overflow filter are coming in tomorrow so I can change all that out/do bleach dip/clean wood as I set up the new stuff.


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## frenchymasters (Nov 28, 2011)

are those kamaka and bosemoni rainbows? what is the other one? looks red


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

There are Bosemani (2m/1f), Marci (2x), Turquoise (Lake Kutubu 1m/1f) and Irian Jaya (1m/1f) Rainbows in there. The red one is the Irian Jaya male. 

I'm not sure what the 2 Marci's are yet (male or female.) I'm leaning towards female from the shape of the head.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Those hacked plants are a scary sight man. I hope it all works out for you.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Oh I'm not worried about them coming back. I'm just hoping they'll come back without the algae. Most of the stems I cut just below a node with roots growing. Then I'd trim up the leaves at least 2 nodes high and plant deeply. 

I'm really thinking the water change cycle will allow them to set roots and get situated before I start trying to extend the fert pattern back out. Between that and the Amanos/Ottos I'm ordering I should be good.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm not sure the DHG is going to make it though. It's looking pretty haggard. I'm going to attempt to trim the pieces that are a lost cause tomorrow and hope the rest survives. I REALLY want to see a nice lush carpet of this stuff in here at some point, but I don't know that it will happen.

For whatever reason, foregrounds elude me. Even when the tank was running nicely last year I had trouble getting the Stauygone to spread.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

I really hope the plants give you no problems on the comeback. Good luck to you in the war you have waged against algae.:icon_smil


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Its a heck of a war.

Today I get to pick through Eco-Complete and pull pieces with BBA tufts on it. Then I get to trim individual pieces of DHG with BBA/crap on it. 

I keep telling myself patience is a virtue....


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Its a heck of a war.
> 
> Today I get to pick through Eco-Complete and pull pieces with BBA tufts on it. Then I get to trim individual pieces of DHG with BBA/crap on it.
> 
> I keep telling myself patience is a virtue....


Good luck man. I hope you win.

That sounds like a dull day. Add some good music, and you should be able to do that for hours.:icon_smil

Lol, one that many aquarists lack. Myself included.:hihi:


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

My gear from Marine Depot just showed up. My fish are swimming around in the new flow like the turtles from Finding Nemo.

I had extra Ehiem Bio balls so I threw those in the subcurrent instead of going with the stuff they sent with it. Extra bio ftw. I'm going to have to play with positioning on this Koralia to find the best spot. I want it kind of blowing around down low to keep the funk from settling on the bottom but I also want it to disturb the surface a LOT so I can pull the air hose out. 

Hopefully I can get it all settled out today.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Water change #2 of week 1 done. 










Trimmed up the DHG as promised. I tried not to cut the taller pieces if I didn't have to. Hopefully this will help keep it healthy. There are a lot of nice bright green healthy pieces now. The new Koralia is blowing right over top of them so that _should_ keep the funk from gathering in that area anymore. 










I set the subcurrent up to split the flow along the back wall and then blow up at the surface to help keep the oxygen exchange at a maximum. That was the main reason I bought this piece. 










If I manage to save one thing in the tank then the rest will be easy. I'm not sure what plant this is, but it was absolutely BEAUTIFUL when it came in from Crispin. I'm hoping I can get that top to grow long enough so I can cut and replant. I had 4-5 really healthy pieces and now this lone sprig is all I have left due to melting and being attacked.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

If you want to save that stem, cut the healthy part (still green) and replant that into the substrate, the bottom looks a bit rotty.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Just finished water change #3. There was almost nothing sitting on the substrate to suck up today. I don't know if its the new powerhead/internal filter keeping junk suspended or if its due to the water changes. Either way its nice. 

And my dosing for today was (also did this yesterday): 

1/4 tsp Mono Potassium Phosphate
1/4 tsp Potassium Sulfate
1/8 tsp CSM+B

I'm not seeing a whole lot of build up of the brown funk on the leaves any more either. I'm getting a little slight bit of growth from a few stems but I think most of them are resetting after the major trim fest. 

There are a few more I'm keeping an eye on that I might have to trim off before its all said and done.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Glad to hear you are making some headway man. Keep it up. Hope it continues to go well for you.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Not sure if I'm crazy or what, but the DHG looks A LOT greener right now. Maybe I can grow a foreground after all.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Not sure if I'm crazy or what, but the DHG looks A LOT greener right now. Maybe I can grow a foreground after all.


Do you have a before and after pic by any chance?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I can throw up a picture tomorrow when the lights kick on no problem.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> I can throw up a picture tomorrow when the lights kick on no problem.


Works for me.roud:


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Doing water change 4. I might have spoke too soon. It seems like I'm still getting a lot of that brown fluffy/stringy algae building up over night. It's no where what it used to be but it's still occurring. It falls right off when I move the plant around but they all more or less have it on them. 

Francis, if you're still watching this thread: do you have any idea why or what I can do? I'm trying to order some amanos from Rachael but they're in QT for her right now. Is that the only solution to this problem?

Cable, your pic is coming once its refilled.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Amano's will devour that brown-fluff algae. In the mean time, just keep manually removing as much as you can.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Doing water change 4. I might have spoke too soon. It seems like I'm still getting a lot of that brown fluffy/stringy algae building up over night. It's no where what it used to be but it's still occurring. It falls right off when I move the plant around but they all more or less have it on them.
> 
> Francis, if you're still watching this thread: do you have any idea why or what I can do? I'm trying to order some amanos from Rachael but they're in QT for her right now. Is that the only solution to this problem?
> 
> Cable, your pic is coming once its refilled.


Waiting patiently.roud:


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Ok, water change 4 done. Today the only thing I dosed was 3/8 tsp Mono Potassium Phosphate. I'm eliminating the CSM+B to see if that helps the brown fuzz calm down anymore. Though its no where near as bad as it used to be. 

First the FTS after today's water change. 









Cable, I can't find a good before picture, other than yesterdays. I'm not sure how much difference you can tell in the pictures, but in person the bottoms of the DHG are a nicer more vibrant lime green than they were yesterday morning. It's still getting attacked by the fuzz pretty hard, but I'm trying to remove it as best I can. 

BEFORE (yesterday)









AFTER









Oh, and to put things in perspective this is what I started with after the tank crashed and I moved it last time: 









Now I don't feel so bad.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

It does look better. A little more green at the base like you said. You may be hitting a turning point with the DHG.

The whole tank looks way better.roud:


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

cableguy69846 said:


> It does look better. A little more green at the base like you said. You may be hitting a turning point with the DHG.


Boy I hope. I'd love to have me a grassy little field across the front of this thing.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Boy I hope. I'd love to have me a grassy little field across the front of this thing.


I think you will be all right with it. As long as you keep up with everything you are doing.roud:


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

You may not notice, since you see the tank everyday and deal with it directly (hazard of care taking) but the tank's condition has improved by leaps and bounds, your dog is much healthier than it was and is growing and you are on a regime that will even out soon. Next week I would do a water change every other day.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I hope so that's the case. I know my plants are pearling right now so I must be doing something right.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Water change #5 was done earlier today. I dosed 3/8tsp Mono Potassium Phosphate and 1/8 CSM+B. I didn't see any improvement yesterday between using micros and not using micros so I'd rather have _some_ in there than not.

I tested some water parameters and I have a couple questions: 

GH = 6
KH = 5
PH = 7.4-7.6
NO3 = >5ppm

1. My PH has notoriously been high since this tank was put together and that spans 3 different addresses across the state. What is happening? Plants tend to like slightly acidic water correct? What can I do to help coax this down? Should I bother with it?

2. I'm not sure if the Nitrate bottle is correctly calibrated or not. I might go buy another one as I don't remember ever getting a proper reading even when I was dosing nitrates.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Oh, and I ordered a 6x4 patch of DHG last night too


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Oh, and I ordered a 6x4 patch of DHG last night too


Nice one.

As for the PH, mine is right about in that range too and my plants don't seem to care. As long as the fish are ok with it, I wouldn't mess with it. But if you must lower it, look into running peat in the filter or something like that. I don't have any more info on it, but I am pretty sure I read that that will lower your PH.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Water change #6 down. Dosed 3/8tsp mono potassium phosphate. 

So from experience let me tell you. I know I've learned one thing that is fact in keeping a planted aquarium. Do your maintenance or you WILL regret it. I love the challenge this thing is bringing, trying to get it turned around. But if I have to do another round of daily water changes on a 75g aquarium again, I might just call it quits.

10 Amanos have been ordered and the 6x4 patch of DHG will get shipped out on Monday. I'm excited. The Amanos are going to have a TON of stuff to eat so hopefully they'll be ultra happy in their new home. Shrimp are fun to watch and I'm actually really excited to be getting them.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I hope I'm not speaking too soon, but I think I've turned the corner on this tank. I got a LOT of new growth last night and there are a couple plants that were really struggling who show the most improved signs since the lights went off. 

What I didn't mention yesterday was I cleaned out both filters, switched out the outtakes from the spray bars to more "lily pipe" style and cleaned, bleached the intakes thoroughly. I don't know if that made the improvement or not but something did. 

I'm pretty excited right now. And with the Amanos coming from MGamer later this week and the DHG coming from Nilcog, I'm pumped to see how things work out through this week.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> I hope I'm not speaking too soon, but I think I've turned the corner on this tank. I got a LOT of new growth last night and there are a couple plants that were really struggling who show the most improved signs since the lights went off.
> 
> What I didn't mention yesterday was I cleaned out both filters, switched out the outtakes from the spray bars to more "lily pipe" style and cleaned, bleached the intakes thoroughly. I don't know if that made the improvement or not but something did.
> 
> I'm pretty excited right now. And with the Amanos coming from MGamer later this week and the DHG coming from Nilcog, I'm pumped to see how things work out through this week.


Glad to hear it man. roud:

I just got some DHG from nilocg as well. It came in quick and looked great. You will be happy with what you get from him.:icon_mrgr


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Was yours emmersed also? How did it handle the transition?


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Was yours emmersed also? How did it handle the transition?


Yep. It is handling it fine so far. I didn't use a whole lot of it in a tank, cuz I was doing a 2 gallon, but it is good so far.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Moving on to every other day water changes. 

On water change day (today) I'll be dosing: 

3/8tsp Mono Potassium Phosphate
1/8tsp Iron Chelate
1/8tsp Plantex CSM+B
1/8tsp Potassium Sulfate

On the off days I'll only be dosing the mono potassium phosphate.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Sweet. I just checked tracking and both the DHG and the Amanos left Nashville headed this way earlier tonight. They should both get here tomorrow when the mail lady rolls through.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

New FTS










The DHG and Amanos came in today. The Amanos have dispersed and I haven't seen them again. Hopefully they're in there cleaning away. I ended up leaving the clown loaches in the tank vs pulling them. I actually had them out and in the bucket but felt bad that they were getting kicked out. Plus when moving the log/rocks around I actually found several shrimp that had been put in there earlier who have apparently been just fine. I'm assuming more are out running around too and I just don't ever see them? 

Either way, if I don't see the amanos doing their thing throughout the rest of the week I'm going to assume the worst and start setting plans forth to move the loaches. It will make me sad but I guess it will have to happen. 

I haven't shown off my new outflows yet either so here they are: 

















I've also noticed since I hadn't been dosing KNO3 that my pinks/reds were getting stronger. The sunset hygro is looking amazing. I tried to get a good shot of it but with an iPhone its tough.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

The tank is looking MUCH better. That sunset hygro is amazing. I have some too, and I love the color on it. It looks great emergent as well.


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## .Mko. (Sep 23, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Water change #6 down. Dosed 3/8tsp mono potassium phosphate.
> 
> So from experience let me tell you. I know I've learned one thing that is fact in keeping a planted aquarium. Do your maintenance or you WILL regret it. I love the challenge this thing is bringing, trying to get it turned around. But if I have to do another round of daily water changes on a 75g aquarium again, I might just call it quits.
> 
> 10 Amanos have been ordered and the 6x4 patch of DHG will get shipped out on Monday. I'm excited. The Amanos are going to have a TON of stuff to eat so hopefully they'll be ultra happy in their new home. Shrimp are fun to watch and I'm actually really excited to be getting them.


This. oh i know this. currently int he same battle as you dooing daily 70% water changes and my tank is only 15 gallons.. I can only imagine.. hang in there man tanks starting to come around =).. are you planning to up the amano count in your tank btw? the more the better I have 14 in my 15 gallon tank and it seems to be working


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

.Mko. said:


> This. oh i know this. currently int he same battle as you dooing daily 70% water changes and my tank is only 15 gallons.. I can only imagine.. hang in there man tanks starting to come around =).. are you planning to up the amano count in your tank btw? the more the better I have 14 in my 15 gallon tank and it seems to be working


Most likely. I'm mainly curious to see how the clown loaches act first. I'd rather know if I can keep them before I go dropping 50 or so shrimp in the tank.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

cableguy69846 said:


> The tank is looking MUCH better. That sunset hygro is amazing. I have some too, and I love the color on it. It looks great emergent as well.


Thanks  I'm worried though as the algae has been kicking back up now that I've not been doing daily water changes (I'm at semi-daily now) and I'm worried it's just going to get worse. I raised my lights another 1-2 inches today but I'm not so sure its light or CO2.....


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Thanks  I'm worried though as the algae has been kicking back up now that I've not been doing daily water changes (I'm at semi-daily now) and I'm worried it's just going to get worse. I raised my lights another 1-2 inches today but I'm not so sure its light or CO2.....


Hmmm, not really sure. I am terrible with that stuff.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Yeah, I don't know either. Its mostly the brown furry stuff. If I can get it under control and figure out why its growing so easily I'll have no problem with anything else. 

BBA is retreating.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

Brown furry stuff is diatoms. Amano's will devour.


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## Dollface (Sep 30, 2008)

I see your haiku is as bad as ever.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

That wasn't haiku. This is a terrible Haiku:

neglect everywhere,
causing brown bombs, brown bombs
woe to be the diatoms.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I haven't even seen the Amanos since I put them in there. After I dropped them in yesterday they just dispersed back into the plants and haven't been seen again. 

So I don't know if they're running around eating anything or not.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Unfortunately I think I'm going to have to move the Clown Loaches to a new home. I think they've gone after the amanos during the night. I know there are a few shrimp living under the wood right now but they aren't doing anything but hiding. My roommate has his 65g downstairs and I should be able to put them in there. I have a feeling I'm going to end up buying his tank from him when we move anyways. 

Francis, do you think cutting off some of the light will help with the fuzzy brown algae problem for now? I'm currently running 2x t5ho for 2 hours, then 4x t5ho for 6 hours, then 2x t5ho again for the last two ours (as suggested in your thread.)

I'm going to have to order some more amanos. I'm probably going to to go with like 25 this time around. I have a lot of this crap growing. 

I wish I knew where I could get some like my LFS has. They've got a display tank with 3" shrimp in there! The loaches wouldn't bother those big boys.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Amano shrimp are in and roaming around. The rainbows did their normal thing where they run up and touch everything moving, but they didn't try to eat them. I swear they act like toddlers. 

I have pictures and I'll post them later. 

One question: Do they normally gather at the top of the tank? There are some down on the bottom eating and wandering, but a lot of them have perched on something higher up near the waterline (plants, outflows, magfloat silicone seams). Normal behavior?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Well, I'm not sure how this is going to go.... I thought it was the clown loaches going after the shrimp so they got moved out. Then today I saw the Irian Rainbow eat one.... or attempt to. He actually had to spit half of it out because he couldn't swallow it. 

The Amanos are staying up in the top of the plants near the waterline hiding. I'm pretty sure most of them are safe as they're on the larger size, but there are a few who are probably going to get eaten. However, it remains that since they're scared, and are getting nipped at some (even the larger ones) they aren't doing their job. 

I'm beginning to think this tank is lost in its current state..... I'm really considering a tear down and rebuild. 150EH and his new manzy is really making me want to do it too. Plus I want to try AS. Although I'm also considering dirt since people like Cable are having such success and capping it with a nice caribsea sand.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Well, I'm not sure how this is going to go.... I thought it was the clown loaches going after the shrimp so they got moved out. Then today I saw the Irian Rainbow eat one.... or attempt to. He actually had to spit half of it out because he couldn't swallow it.
> 
> The Amanos are staying up in the top of the plants near the waterline hiding. I'm pretty sure most of them are safe as they're on the larger size, but there are a few who are probably going to get eaten. However, it remains that since they're scared, and are getting nipped at some (even the larger ones) they aren't doing their job.
> 
> I'm beginning to think this tank is lost in its current state..... I'm really considering a tear down and rebuild. 150EH and his new manzy is really making me want to do it too. Plus I want to try AS. Although I'm also considering dirt since people like Cable are having such success and capping it with a nice caribsea sand.


It would be a lot of work for a redo, but it may be worth it. Just make sure to get everything in balance from the get go. And no slacking.:hihi: Lol. Cuz I have any room to talk, didn't do anything today except for acclimate my fish.

I am currently running a tank with used AS capped with sand now. The 20 gallon has had a transformation. It is growing plants just as well though. So, either way you go, you should be good.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Are you having any issues with the dirt tank? What would you recommend? New AS or dirt with like the caribsea peace river sand?


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Are you having any issues with the dirt tank? What would you recommend? New AS or dirt with like the caribsea peace river sand?


It is really too early to tell how the AS will do. I think it will perform well though. I know the dirt was rockin the plants and still is. I wouldn't mind using new AS, but I heard it gets really dusty. And I find the sand will blow around a bit in high flow. Maybe the sand you said a little less, and sometimes will get sucked up during water changes. But it looks good. In the darker color anyway. Keeping the lighter colors clean would be a pain.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

OH NOES!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

And dirt is in:


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Holy crap!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Haha, it will be ok. I finished up the conversion/rebuild about 3am last night. When the lights kick on here in a few hours I'll put up some pictures. I weeded out some species, cut down a lot of junk in there and opened up the spacing between plants/groups. I'm going to attempt to keep this very well groomed. 

Essentially I'm trying this out for now to see if

A) I was right about the substrate being a large part of the issue. 
B) Try out some ideas before I do the whole shebang (like buying wood from tom, bringing in seiryu stone, etc)

To be honest, during the summer after I move this tank has a much lower tech purpose in store for it so I didn't want to drop the $200 on AS. The 75g is going to get turned into the jungle/fern/crypt/sword/val tank with the rainbows in it. Then I have plans to get a shrimp only 60-P where I can grow the more demanding plants and I'll do the AS in that tank. 

I also have plans to buy my roommates 65g with all the trimmings ($350ish) when we move (he swears up and down he's not going to move it so it's getting sold) and that will most likely be a fish centered tank, very lightly planted. I'm thinking discus or nice angels since it has the height for them to be comfortable.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Haha, it will be ok. I finished up the conversion/rebuild about 3am last night. When the lights kick on here in a few hours I'll put up some pictures. I weeded out some species, cut down a lot of junk in there and opened up the spacing between plants/groups. I'm going to attempt to keep this very well groomed.
> 
> Essentially I'm trying this out for now to see if
> 
> ...


The fiancee would kill me if I ever stayed up that late messing with tanks. Lol. That is good that you are starting from scratch. It will probably be easier to get algae in check if it pops up. And dirt tanks are great for experimentation too. If you mess up the sub though, that is a pain to clean up.

Not bad to start smaller with the AS. The only reason I have any at all is cuz I got it used and free. I don't think I would drop that kind of money on dirt. Unless I went all hi tech and had some hundred dollar bills lying around. You will not regret the dirt decision. What kind of dirt did you use?

Nice pickup on the 65 gallon. I vote for angel fish.:icon_smil


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Excuse the buckets and other paraphernalia, it was late and I'm busy working at the moment so I can't clean up. 

*Plan going forward*
I've got it pretty thick in a few places to get slope, so to combat gas build up as the dirt breaks down I'm going to use a metal skewer to poke down deep into the substrate and hopefully let out air pockets during water changes. I'll be doing the daily water change routine again, though since everything is pretty clean now, it will be less of a hassle. 

I'm keeping the lights at 2x54w with no burst for now. CO2 adjustment is going to be priority #1 so I can get it high and stable throughout the day. I've always had an issue with excess CO2 later in the day and I'm going to try and find that sweet spot where it doesn't happen. 

Keeping that in mind ferts are going to be limited to K for the first week, then I'll do K and CSM+B for the second week (every other day water changes.) Considering the color that I get when I keep NO3 down, there's a very good chance it will be limited even once I'm to the weekly water changes. 

*Fauna Update:* 
I found out when breaking the tank down there are quite a few shrimp in the tank still. I thought the rainbows had eaten them all, but to my surprise I pulled at least 20-30 out. They're back in there running around, but they do a good job of hiding. My rainbows still pick at them occasionally (mainly the male Irian) so I'm guessing they're fearing for their lives.

I also added two VERY young LFBNPs and an Otto. There are a few Nerites running around (well slimming around) in there too.

Cable - I used MG Organic Potting Mix. I pretty much used it as is, only pulling out a few bigger wood chips. That whole "starting from scratch" thing is what pretty much made me pull the trigger. I know I can stay on top of better and adjust faster when its not tank wide. 

And yeah, AS will be overkill for the final plans for this tank. The jungle plants in my experience, really aren't overly picky about their substrates as long as the roots have room to grow, and you throw tabs under them. If this goes well This tank will most likely always be a dirt tank from here forward (though the cap will probably change as jungle looks better with dark substrate.)

And yes, I'm thinking Angels as well. I saw someone saying something about blue angels the other day on a thread here and that has my curiousity. Plus I really don't want to deal with an RO unit and finding plants that will work with 84 degree water.


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

This looks like a fantastic start! I hope it all fills in nice. I love the rainbows. I am surprised the missed some shrimp  If you get the Pinoy blue angels they wont miss any....trust me  Fantastic job on the rescape!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Thank you Chad. It's still a bit cloudy today, but it's to be expected I suppose with sand. Hopefully it will all settle out as I do the water changes. And yes Pinoy Blue... that was what I heard mentioned. Sounds interesting .

I've noticed today as I watch the tank, that the colors on the fish have changed. They're all a little lighter. The female Irian is a bright yellow gold, and my female bosemani's colors are much more subtle than normal and the two turquoise are very blue. 

Also, I think the LFBNPs are going to be gorgeous. They are technically my girlfriends so thats fitting. (she ninja reads this thread, I'm going to get brownie points for that one  )


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

rockwood said:


> Cable - I used MG Organic Potting Mix. I pretty much used it as is, only pulling out a few bigger wood chips. That whole "starting from scratch" thing is what pretty much made me pull the trigger. I know I can stay on top of better and adjust faster when its not tank wide.


I used that too for one of my tanks. I sifted mine though, which was probably not necessary. The bigger pieces will break down and release CO2 in the tank, so you may have some issues dialing yours in, but I don't see them to be huge issues. Sometimes starting over, while more initial work, is easier than fixing it.



rockwood said:


> And yeah, AS will be overkill for the final plans for this tank. The jungle plants in my experience, really aren't overly picky about their substrates as long as the roots have room to grow, and you throw tabs under them. If this goes well This tank will most likely always be a dirt tank from here forward (though the cap will probably change as jungle looks better with dark substrate.)


I agree with the AS. I think it is overkill for anything but the most hi tech setup. And you are right. The stems and even crypts, will be very happy with the dirt. As for dark substrate, I love it. I am not a huge fan of the light colored stuff, although in the right application, it does look good.



rockwood said:


> And yes, I'm thinking Angels as well. I saw someone saying something about blue angels the other day on a thread here and that has my curiousity. Plus I really don't want to deal with an RO unit and finding plants that will work with 84 degree water.


Blue angels? I don't blame you on the discus. If I was retired and had nothing better to do than be in a tank every day, I would think about them, but not when I have a life. Lol. You will not regret that choice. Also with angels, they like it planted up. You can do another dirt tank, and just do plants that will not need CO2 or high light, and still have a jungle for them.

The tank looks great too man. I look forward to seeing it mature and grow now.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Better pictures after the day 2 water change. The water isn't so cloudy....










And I'm seeing the shrimp start to move around and do their thing. They aren't completely comfortable, and they have reasons. There are quite a few in there still, so I'm thinking the rainbows might be laying off a little. I think what has helped is the shrimp aren't so jumpy and swimming around all over the place. For what ever reason my rainbows have a tendency to go after anything floating around but will leave stuff on the bottom alone most of the time. I also noticed today while doing the water change that one had.... molted I guess? That means growth right?

Here's a shot of one of the amanos. It's the best I can do with an iPhone.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Looks good man.:biggrin:


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## Chaos_Being (May 18, 2010)

Hmm, a rainbow tank I hadn't posted on before? Those are some great, healthy looking fish  Good luck on the rescape, it's already looking good and I've seen a lot of good results with dirt tanks. I still want to try one some day.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I haven't posted in here in quite a while. 

I had a major blow up with the tank. Apparently mounding potting mix in any shape or fashion is a huge problem. I started having problems with gassing and I noticed the bottoms of some of my plants were rotting out. I bumped my driftwood ever so slightly (it was stuck down in the dirt) and broke loose a torrent of dirt and gas that basically turned my water black. It literally looked like an under water volcano erupting with an ash cloud engulfing the tank. 

I lost all my shrimp and a few fish. 

I scooped out all of the substrate again, and went to straight sand. Since then the tank has been limping along. I've been covered up with work so I haven't been dosing diligently and I ended up having a BGA outbreak. It's fun stuff. 

I'm working on getting that fixed now and I'm essentially letting it limp along while I get ready for an overhaul. 

I'm in the process of making my first overhaul purchase. I'm grabbing one of Craigthor's 2262 filters to replace both of my 2215s. I'm going to rework the plumbing to simplify everything down. I'll be removing the cerge style reactor and going to one or two inline Atomic diffuser(s) from GLA. The heaters and UV are going to get put on a PVC built apparatus where the 2262 will push water through all three evenly at the same time which should help keep flow restriction to a minimum and keep the heaters from having to work extra hard. I'm considering running the heaters inline with each other however and allowing one to heat a little and the next to finish it off. Not sure how I want that to work. 

The next purchase is going to be about 10 bags of AS New Amazonia. I'm also looking for driftwood I love. I'm probably going to get Tom Barr to help me out there.

This is going to happen over the next 6 months or so. I'm not in a huge hurry considering I have a move coming up this year sometime once the girlfriend finds a job in TN.

Anyways, figured I'd update those that might have wondered what happened.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

That sucks, but I guess that's just goes with the dirt substrate, did you get soil with cow poo without knowing? Also it's a good thing because after you get the AS and new filter installed things should be much easier. That's a powerful filter at 900 plus gph, I would split the outlet into 2 ot 3 legs then put them back together so only a single spray bar etc. is in the tank, if you use flexable pvc there are a lot of options for wye's or manifolds.

Keep us up to date on your progress.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Yeah, it was the right kind of dirt but Craig pointed out my mistake. I had the part about sand on top of the dirt being no more than 1" but missed the part about the dirt ITSELF being no more than 1" as well. I had it mounded up 6-7" in some spots. 

As far as the AS, I'm still trying to decide to get it. I'm looking at 8 bags of normal type and probably 2 bags of powder for the foreground. Although I'm really liking some of the decorative sand (Xingu and Nile) they have available too so I could use that for foreground instead. Regardless 8 bags @ $28/ea = $224 + shipping. I'm looking at around $300. Ouch. Plus I have to have the money available when one of the two places in the US that carry it get some in. 

As far as the filter I'm planning on bringing it out and into PVC where it will split into the 2 heaters, and UV all arranged in parallel. I'm also removing the Cerge's style reactor and going to an inline diffuser like the Atomic that GLA has. Then it will all join back together and head back into the aquarium exiting a 1" outflow similar to a lily pipe.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Why are you using so much AS, it's for the 75 gallon right?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Yeah EH, the plan right now is for the 75. I think I'm eventually going to move to a 125 but I'm not sure when. 

What do you think I'd need for it? I figured 6" deep across the whole tank allows me to put some serious slope in it. Is that too much you think?


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I think 3 inches is good for the most part but you could add more in the back if you are trying to make a slope, I always worry about deep substrate and getting dead spots.

If you use a piece of driftwood with a root type structure or rocks you can also save on using too much substrate and do a faux type slope raising the grade dramatically behind a root or rock.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm thinking I want a severe root type system with something that looks like an actual tree in it. I have an idea I want to execute but it's going to require a fantastic substrate (aquasoil & power sand.)

I'm not sure how much rock I'll need. I might plan for 4 inches and go with that. If I have extra that's fine as I want to start a couple super high light shrimp tanks later this year anyways, probably a 60F and a mini M. So I can just use the extra there.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

That's what it looks like right now. Just coasting. The sand was getting cyano really bad so I covered it with stone. That seems to have helped so I THINK my light was too high for sand considering it was so light colored. 

There's one spot with cyano coming back in the gravel right there in front of the log but it's been maintaining its size. I have a feeling it's due to lack of flow in that particular region.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Hacked it back and spread the stems out. Now waiting for it to grow in again. Sorry about the hazy pictures. I don't have a good camera, just my iPhone.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Glad to see it is still kicking man. Keep it up. If you ever want a couple more plants, let me know. I have a couple of stems and some crypts in my emersed boxes that I could part with.:icon_smil


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

So, I'm working on a deal for some 2 year old Amazonia. Will it still be effective after being used for 2 years? I've seen people say theirs is running for 4+ years and still growing things well, but I want to make sure before I make the final call. 

I'll probably talk to Justin @ Rootmedic and have him help me out with some additional "juice" to throw in under the AS for the extra boost, and I'm also going to continue dosing EI. 

My next scape is going to involve DHG, some stauro and some of the more needy stems if possible. If you've been following this thread you know I've had issues with DHG in the past and the only thing I've seen grow it consistently well is AS. 

I just want to make sure I'm not going to get this and it be a waste. Thoughts?


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I have never used it in my tanks but most of my fellow GWAPA member do use it and as I understand 2 years is when you will need to start dosing the water column depending on your plants, if I was going to do a total rebuild with a new substrate I would buy it new, good luck.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I can't get new. Anywhere. And ADG refuses to answer an email, twitter, or otherwise so I don't know when the next container is coming in with fresh. I don't know why they have those channels of communication if they're not going to use them. 

I'm going to be doing EI dosing anyways.

However, the general consensus seems to be that it won't do me any good to buy this used......


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Well, I got the Ehiem 2262 from Craig last week, and finally got it set up last night. The amount of flow this thing puts out is insane. I was able to remove the Koralia completely. I'm curious to see how much this will help my CO2 diffusion as well. 

I also picked up the used AS. It cost me like 65 bucks for about 2x 5 gallon buckets full. That's pretty cheap, and it still looks good. I'm holding off on adding that until I can get some new wood from Tom and some rock and figure out how the move is going to shake out. I'm hoping the fembot (girlfriend) will land a job at the job fair this weekend and we can start planning. I'll probably grab additional Aqua Soil in May when the ADG container arrives to supplement the used stuff. Or maybe I'll put the used stuff in the 65g tank and put all new in the 75 

I've decided that that Rainbows are going to get moved over to the 65 gallon once we move and that's going to be a lower tech fern/crypt set up with some cool wood to utilize the height. 

This tank (75g) will keep the rummies, probably have another 20-25 added and also add a school of Rasboras. I'm REALLY hoping we move into a house so I can sneak in an RO/DI set up so I can go soft water and keep all the cool kid plants.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So did it fit in the stand?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Barely. 

Hey, how did your Cerge's reactors work? The new filter is pushing so hard through the reactor its actually blowing bubbles through up into the tank. It's pretty inefficient and I'm going to have to figure something out. 

Any ideas? I love the increased flow and the bio capacity is INSANE.


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

rockwood said:


> Barely.
> 
> Hey, how did your Cerge's reactors work? The new filter is pushing so hard through the reactor its actually blowing bubbles through up into the tank. It's pretty inefficient and I'm going to have to figure something out.
> 
> Any ideas? I love the increased flow and the bio capacity is INSANE.


80 to 100 gph seems to be the max that can be run through the Cerge reactor. I use a Fluval 105 to power my reactor.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Well sh*t..... the whole point of this is to simplify things. I don't want to run another filter. Grrrr.


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

rockwood said:


> Well sh*t..... the whole point of this is to simplify things. I don't want to run another filter. Grrrr.


Never fails, I run 2 Koralia 425s, the Fluval 105 and a Fluval 106 on my tank.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

What would other options be? I've seen the Atomic Diffusers but at the rate this water is moving through the lines I'm assuming I'll get the same situation (a lot of bubbles rolling out of the outtake.)


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

rockwood said:


> What would other options be? I've seen the Atomic Diffusers but at the rate this water is moving through the lines I'm assuming I'll get the same situation (a lot of bubbles rolling out of the outtake.)


I think you could split the line and use a ball valve to control the flow to the reactor.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Yeah, once the tank gets moved I'm actually going to plumb everything together using PVC and have it all nicely laid out. Until then I guess I'll just make it work.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

The EXT5000 works great on classic canisters like the 2215 and 2217 so look for a cheap pump in the 160 to 260 gph range for a Cerges reactor to work properly but with a high flow canister you'll need so much pressure to get the CO2 into the reactor that it will displace the water and then start blowing out of the outlet into the tank. 2 in 10 also has a go method of doing it and with that canister you could even split into 3 or 4 tubes and have them come back together and then go into the tanks, each could control something like a heater, reactor, UV, etc., this site has a lot of options and you may want to go with flex pvc, look here.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I still have my 2215 canisters sitting over in the bathroom. I could throw a bunch of floss and some Purigen in it to use as a water polisher, and hook it to the reactor for now I suppose. I just wanted to avoid using 2 filters but I suppose that's not going to happen until I'm able to set up the whole thing using PVC.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Big update and story time! YAAAAAYYYY!!!

Hokay, so....










For about a year I had been wanting to upgrade my filtration for flow reasons and well, I just like having a beast mode filter. Since I started keeping a tank I've been running Ehiem classics. I had looked around at several options including other filters from Ehiem and the Fluval FX5. I had seen the 2262 and it was nice (the capacity looked insane) but really didn't want to throw that much cash down for something new right now, and since I didn't really like the other options... I ended up leaving it alone and just making due with my pair of 2215s. The flow rate sucked, so I had a Koralia running too. 

Then I saw Craigthor switching to the 220 and a sump. I knew he had two of the 2262s on his 150. He gave me a heck of a deal and I finally pulled the trigger. I knew he took great care of his stuff and he gave me a good deal including a bunch of new substrat pro (I forget how much, I think like 12 liters of media.)

I got it a few weeks ago once he was finally able to get the sump running on the 220 and break down the 150. He would have sent it earlier but was having issues figuring out how to get the massive inflow QD off the bulkhead without dumping 150g of water into his floor. I had seen pictures of it.... but it doesn't do it justice. That's my 75g tank you see in the background... not like a 29 or anything. I think Eheim had an engineer literally say "hey lets make a filter out of this 5 gallon bucket", and the 2262 is what they produced. 

Here's the inflow QD it comes with. Works with a 1" ID hose.










Anyways, so several of you have seen me complaining about wanting AS but didn't want to pay for it and even if I did you can't find it. Well I found a deal on here in the SnS for a bunch of used that was going ultra cheap. It had been used 2 years but I figured it would be worth the $65 I paid for it. It got me enough to fill about 1 3/4 5g buckets.

Well I was stoked I had all this new stuff, but was holding off on breaking down everything and putting all the new gear in/on. My girlfriend is currently looking for a job in the Nashville area (shes a PE teacher graduating with her masters in May) and is trying to move down from KY this summer. When that happens I'm going to have to break down all my sh*t and move it to Nashville as well. So I didn't want to do all this, and then have to tear it all apart right as I started to get everything settled. 

Well, that lasted about 2 weeks. She's been having trouble finding a job, so I figured why not? Because 2 things are going to happen as soon as I switched everything out. 

1) I was going to be happier with my tank and be able to get rid of the haggardness within it. 

2) As soon as I did it she'd get a job. Because that's how my life works lol. 

And here's the result: 



















I had some Rootmedic complete+ capsules sitting here and I used those to help supplement the AS since it was used. I pulled the capsules apart and sprinkled the little balls onto the bare glass, then piled the AS on top of that. 

I thinned out a bunch of stuff I didn't like. And I've also lost a lot of species. Some are on their last leg and I'm trying to resuscitate them to health, but we'll see. I really liked the sunset hygro but I don't know if it's going to recover or not.

I grabbed some Limno Aromatica, Rotala Colorata and Ludwiga Cuba that showed up today. The cuba is FANTASTIC looking. The Limno didn't make the trip well but the last time I ordered some that happened as well but it recovered just fine. The colorata is also fantastic looking and I hope I can keep it that way. 

Oh also, I had mentioned the 2262 was blowing the CO2 right through my Cerges reactor. I ended up getting one of my 2215's back in the fray and switched the reactor and put one of the hydors back on that circuit. I'm using the 2215 mostly as a simple mech filter and pump. All the bio is being handled by the 2262. I need to get some fine floss and purigen to put in the 2215 so it can be more of a polisher. 


I'm going to lean on you guys to help me get this thing back up to par.


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## vincenz (Jan 29, 2012)

That eheim is an absolute monster! Beautiful rainbows, how old are they?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Some are 2-3 and a few I've had under a year.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Quick video of the tank today after the weekly water change: 

http://youtu.be/fchKEVDV2pM


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

The tank is really looking up


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## majerah1 (Nov 6, 2010)

Wow I had no idea the trials you have been through with this tank!It looks fantastic though and I think you have learned alot!

Ill be following along!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Looking good, bet you didn't know what you were in for with that 2262.  Based on pics online it looks so innocent. LOL


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Craigthor said:


> Looking good, bet you didn't know what you were in for with that 2262.  Based on pics online it looks so innocent. LOL


It was so worth the expense though. It does nothing but flow water through bio. No heating, CO2 or anything. The only thing I want to change is the inflow. I need to build one out of PVC or something that holds closer to the tank.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

2in10 said:


> The tank is really looking up





majerah1 said:


> Wow I had no idea the trials you have been through with this tank!It looks fantastic though and I think you have learned alot!
> 
> Ill be following along!


Thanks guys.


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## majerah1 (Nov 6, 2010)

Oh yeah that filter is a monster!Hows the flow on that thing?bet my bettas would really hate me.


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## Quesenek (Sep 26, 2008)

Too late but with the reactor you can put filter floss around the bottom of the output (ringed around the pipe in the middle) that way the bubbles get caught and wont get through. Worked wonders for me and it had limited to no impact on the filter flow you just clean the filter floss along with the filter.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> It was so worth the expense though. It does nothing but flow water through bio. No heating, CO2 or anything. The only thing I want to change is the inflow. I need to build one out of PVC or something that holds closer to the tank.


You should build one out of 1" PVC an paint it with Krylon Fusion paint or even build it out of clear PVC.


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