# CO2 Diffuser?



## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

I just purchased an Aquatek regulator, and from what I understand all I need now is co2 tubing and a diffuser, but what is a good diffuser (for a 55 gallon tank) that isn't bank breaking but is eye appealing? Or at least not an eye sore. Working good would also be a bonus lol



Thanks in advance!




--Miles


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## Higher Thinking (Mar 16, 2011)

Do you have a canister filter? You can always just thread the CO2 tube into the filter intake.


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

Yeah I have a fluval 305 but I've read that putting co2 into fluvals makes the impeller lock up or something like that. I was looking at glass diffusers but I feel like I'd break them


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## Justintoxicated (Oct 18, 2006)

Miles said:


> Yeah I have a fluval 305 but I've read that putting co2 into fluvals makes the impeller lock up or something like that. I was looking at glass diffusers but I feel like I'd break them


I just got a cheap glass one off ebay and put it under my fluvals output. That  way the bubbles travel up then across the tank. With a tank your size, maybe a reactor would work better though.


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## cawolf86 (Dec 31, 2010)

With that long of a tank you could split your CO2 output with a T valve and buy 2 cheapo glass diffusers off the 'bay. Then put them deep down on opposite sides of the tank.

Edit. You would need to add a second needle valve. My original reply was poor - apologies.


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## samamorgan (Dec 31, 2011)

Just splitting it with a T valve will very likely result in one useless diffuser. I recommend getting an inline atomizer from eBay and putting it on your filter output as close to the canister as you can. Most efficient method short of using a reactor, and less complex for a beginner. Also won't reduce flow.


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## Mk4Gti (Dec 16, 2010)

I have a fluval FX5, it has the function that shuts the filter down and releases trapped gasses. Since i added C02 it shuts down like every 12 hours and you hear the excess gas hiss out.


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## Schneeball (Dec 28, 2011)

Mk4Gti said:


> I have a fluval FX5, it has the function that shuts the filter down and releases trapped gasses. Since i added C02 it shuts down like every 12 hours and you hear the excess gas hiss out.


Are you using polishing pads? Try taking them out if so, I have a diffuser under my FX5 intake and it works great. I have a feeling fine media pads make it harder for fine air bubbles to make it through the media, just a guess.


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## sketch804 (Mar 2, 2011)

i would still go make a reactor for a tank that large, they work great and you get even CO2 distrubution throughout the whole tank provided you have good flow all over the tank. A inline atomizer is another great idea! And if you do anything like these the hoses you wanna switch to are 5/8" and can be bought at most any hardware store. Glass diffusers are okay, but i dont think they will work that great for a tank that long. But to each is own..good luck!


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## KrazyFish (Dec 23, 2010)

Make a reactor! You will not regret it. You can buy if you like but the cheapest way is to make a rex grigg type reactor.

Trust me on this - the inline atomizers work well but they leave your water looking like 7-up, tons of "carbonation" bubbles. Plus reactors will save you CO2 over time as less is able to be off gassed.

Go with a reactor!!!!


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## AndreyT (Apr 28, 2011)

KrazyFish said:


> Trust me on this - the inline atomizers work well but they leave your water looking like 7-up, tons of "carbonation" bubbles. Plus reactors will save you CO2 over time as less is able to be off gassed.


Are you sure you understand what an _inline_ diffuser is? 

Firstly, it is simply not possible to have water with ordinary soda-style carbonation bubbles in the tank, regardless of what kind of diffuser is used. When people talk about "7 UP", they refer to the stream of rising bubbles created by an in-tank diffuser. 

Secondly, a properly installed _inline_ diffuser will have no bubbles at all and no wasted gas (besides the normal surface loss).


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## inkslinger (Dec 28, 2003)

I had good luck with a AM1000 co2 reactor and a mag 5 pump when I had a 55g tank.


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## KrazyFish (Dec 23, 2010)

AndreyT said:


> Are you sure you understand what an _inline_ diffuser is?
> 
> Firstly, it is simply not possible to have water with carbonation bubbles in the tank, regardless of what kind of diffuser is used. When people talk about "7 UP", they refer to the stream of rising bubbles created by an in-tank diffuser.
> 
> Secondly, a properly installed _inline_ diffuser will have no bubbles at all and no wasted gas (besides the normal surface loss).


 
I am absoluetly familiar with an inline diffuser Sir. Are you? I have used both and I speak from experience. Unless you are hooking up your Inline diffuser prior to your filter (which is not the recommended way to do it) you will indeed get the 7up look I refer to and it will be even worse than a typical glass diffuser because it will be spewed through out the water column.

Get your facts straight and post what you know.


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

So basically my best choices are a reactor or an inline atomizer? 

like this? [Ebay Link Removed]

What exactly do you do with an inline atomizer? 

And as far as reactor's go, do they have to be inside the tank? I saw a DIY one that just had a water pump attached to a gravel vacuum and it looked absolutely hideous...


Thanks for all the help!


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

Oops, didn't know you couldn't post ebay links, but there was only one thing that popped up when I searched for an inline atomizer on ebay


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## Joefish4jc (Mar 18, 2010)

What I did for mine for a long time was using a hydor in-tank filter that had an inlet tube for O2 diffusion and I just plugged it directly into that but it always filled the tank with a mist...

Finally I did a DIY project to make it part of my filter out put.
I should post a journal or pic. It cost about $30 for parts from lowe's.
Google: "DIY inline CO2 reactor" for an example of what im talking about.


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## KrazyFish (Dec 23, 2010)

Reactor systems are external so you can keep them hidden from site. They can either be hooked up to a canister filter much the same way an inline atomizer works or they can be hooked up to a seperate pump. Water & CO2 flows into the top portion of the reactor chamber the water then falls down wards towards the exit of the chamber. The downward current of the water and the natural tendency for the CO2 gas to rise up through the water creates the turbulence needed to diffuse the Co2 into the water. This means all the diffusion is done within the chamber not in side your tank like an atomizer.
An atomizer hooks into your canister return hose and releases tiny bubbles (just like the glass ones do) into the return water current which then blows the bubbles into your tank creating the 7-up look.

Atomizers work well but I personally hated the bubbles floating around in the water so I switched to a reactor and have been very happy ever since.


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## KrazyFish (Dec 23, 2010)

One other thing to keep in mind with an atomizer is that you must have a working pressure of 30psi minimum for them to work. They do not work with DIY co2.


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## sketch804 (Mar 2, 2011)

Look up Rexx or Cerges reactor if you want to mess with a reactor. both are EZ to build and don't cost much at all! I would highly recommend them! love mine and only had it a few weeks! 
But I am with other dude, I have known a couple people that have used inline atomizer's and they do produce a lot of bubbles floating around your tank, but not all do, it all depends on how much CO2 your running and how fast it dissolves into the water.


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## Higher Thinking (Mar 16, 2011)

Miles said:


> Yeah I have a fluval 305 but I've read that putting co2 into fluvals makes the impeller lock up or something like that. I was looking at glass diffusers but I feel like I'd break them


Yea I have heard the same statement, the only thing is that no one actually verifies what they are talking about. Nor do they think about it logically. People say that running CO2 directly into the inlet can cause acid erosion of the impeller.....um, yea right. 

The CO2 is reducing your waters pH regardless of where you diffuse it. That water is then pushing through the filter. Obviously filters can handle low pH as people often push theirs' down quite low with CO2. I run four tanks on pressurized CO2 and three of them have the gas line running directly into filter. Obviously it will be dependent on filter type, quality, and flow rate, but fr the most part you are not going to get any better dissolving rates between using a reactor and just using the filter. One of the tanks I run CO2 into the filter is on a 55. 

Using a reactor or anything else does not get you "even distribution throughout the whole tank" as some have state. It is not the reactor that gets you the good flow, but the filter that prvides the water movement. Thus you will have the same distribution just inserting the line into the filter....probably better as you don't have anything inhibiting flow like a reactor or inline diffuser.


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## hbosman (Oct 5, 2006)

For those not wanting to build a Reactor. I've used a Mix Max Reactor for several weeks after having used inline diffusers, PVC Reactors and Cerge Reactors. The advantages of the Mix Max Reactor are cost, nothing to build and no mist in tank. Disadvantages, It might reduce filter flow (not that I notice anyway) and having to invert it after filter cleaning to remove air pocket.

http://www.amazon.com/Gulfstream-Tr...JEGC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1332957971&sr=8-1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxRvdHAglyk


There is another disadvantage, some people have reported dripping from hose connections. I did notice this but fixed it by rubbing vasoline between hose connections and adapters. I also used metal hose clamps.


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

Higher Thinking said:


> Yea I have heard the same statement, the only thing is that no one actually verifies what they are talking about. Nor do they think about it logically. People say that running CO2 directly into the inlet can cause acid erosion of the impeller.....um, yea right.
> 
> The CO2 is reducing your waters pH regardless of where you diffuse it. That water is then pushing through the filter. Obviously filters can handle low pH as people often push theirs' down quite low with CO2. I run four tanks on pressurized CO2 and three of them have the gas line running directly into filter. Obviously it will be dependent on filter type, quality, and flow rate, but fr the most part you are not going to get any better dissolving rates between using a reactor and just using the filter. One of the tanks I run CO2 into the filter is on a 55.
> 
> Using a reactor or anything else does not get you "even distribution throughout the whole tank" as some have state. It is not the reactor that gets you the good flow, but the filter that prvides the water movement. Thus you will have the same distribution just inserting the line into the filter....probably better as you don't have anything inhibiting flow like a reactor or inline diffuser.


I completely agree. I use a Rena Filstar XP2 and simply bubble the CO2 into the filter inlet tubing (I drilled a hole below the surface in the intake tube).

This works just fine. Indeed, the Rena canister has an internal flow exactly like a reactor. The water flows from the top of the canister, down to the bottom, up through the filter baskets, and final, reaching the impeller, is sent back to the tank through a spray bar that evenly distributes the water throughout the tank (which means that CO2 is not reaching the impeller, but is completely dissolved before hand).

I could put a reactor before or after the Rena canister filter, but it would be of no additional value (in fact it might actually release some bubbles into the tank where the canister would not). It would be a useless component, the only purpose of which would be to take up space.

I think the bottom line is -- feed the CO2 into the intake of your canister filter. If this doesn't work (your canister filter does not have a flow similar to a reactor), then use a reactor. Don't just add hardware to the system for the sake of adding hardware. 

Simplify, simplify, simplify.


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## hbosman (Oct 5, 2006)

I have a Rena XP2 as well. Feeding CO2 into the intake did work for me but, every now and then, the CO2 would build up and expel out of the output in a cloud of bubbles. I stopped doing that because it just seemed a little wasteful. I am currently trying the $15.00 Mix Max Reactor on the output. It is extra equipment but no mist to look at and I can reduce the Regulator working pressure which makes CO2 leaks less likely. 40 PSI caused leaking for me with the Cheapo bubble counters I use.


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

hbosman said:


> I have a Rena XP2 as well. Feeding CO2 into the intake did work for me but, every now and then, the CO2 would build up and expel out of the output in a cloud of bubbles. I stopped doing that because it just seemed a little wasteful. I am currently trying the $15.00 Mix Max Reactor on the output. It is extra equipment but no mist to look at and I can reduce the Regulator working pressure which makes CO2 leaks less likely. 40 PSI caused leaking for me with the Cheapo bubble counters I use.


Why did you need 40 psi?


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## hbosman (Oct 5, 2006)

galabar said:


> Why did you need 40 psi?


Oh, that was when I was using an inline diffuser. I probably used 10 or 15 PSI when I bubbled into the input of the filter.


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

hbosman said:


> Oh, that was when I was using an inline diffuser. I probably used 10 or 15 PSI when I bubbled into the input of the filter.


Ah, Ok. That makes sense. Bubbling into the input of the canister should require the same pressure as a reactor (near "0" -- really, just slightly above atmospheric, whick would show as 0 on a pressure gauge if it were attached in line to the CO2 tubing).

How much CO2 were you trying to push through the XP2? Was this without the diffuser or with? I've got a pretty low bubble count so there may be a limit as to how much diffusion you can get. Note that not all bubbles are created equal (I think) and your bubble count at 40 psi cracking pressure is not the same as your bubble count at "0" psi cracking pressure.


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

Would an inline atomizer even work with a fluval? I have a fluval 305 and the hose is all ridgey and uneven and not smooth like other brands


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## sketch804 (Mar 2, 2011)

you gota get some 5/8" hoses if you wanna do anything inline like atomizer or reactor..i recommend the braided ones so they wont bend and cut flow off..just use screw clamps on all connections to prevent leaks or the hose coming off..i did the same a few weeks ago, only took a min to switch them out..


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

Actually Nevermind, I think running it into my fluval should work because the flow of water also goes from top to bottom to top, so that should work great!


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## Daximus (Oct 19, 2011)

I run a single, basic ceramic diffuser underneath the intake of my filter and it seems to be working well on my 90. I could see issues just pumping regular bubbles into it, but after the diffuser the bubbles are pretty small and seem to mostly dissolve in the tubing and filter itself. Once in a while it burps a little, but never air locks on me.


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

That sounds even better, making the bubbles tiny before you run them through the filter, I think I'll do that


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

Miles said:


> That sounds even better, making the bubbles tiny before you run them through the filter, I think I'll do that


It seems like it could help and it should allow you to diffuse more CO2 than just bubbling in. However, there are a few drawbacks:

1. Extra hardware needed.
2. Higher working pressure needed in the CO2 line.
3. Possibly more maintenance (but an inline diffuser, not being hit by your lights, should require much less maintenance).

I like to start off as simple as possible. To me, that is bubbling CO2 into the filter intake. If that doesn't work, I think the in-line diffuser on the intake hose sounds like a good idea. If that doesn't work, I would go with a reactor.

I wouldn't use a diffuser in-tank or on the output of the canister because the bubbles in the tank would drive me nuts.


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

How high of a working pressure is needed? I have an aquatek regulator that is preset at 30 psi, that high enough?


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

Miles said:


> How high of a working pressure is needed? I have an aquatek regulator that is preset at 30 psi, that high enough?


For just bubbling the CO2 into the intake tubing (or using a reactor), you don't need a working pressure much about "0." For a diffuser, you might need up to 45 psi (or much lower) depending on the diffuser.


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## Miles (Sep 9, 2011)

Ended up buying a little glass diffuser, broke it within 30 seconds of putting it in my tank lol only make that mistake once I hope...


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## samamorgan (Dec 31, 2011)

KrazyFish said:


> I am absoluetly familiar with an inline diffuser Sir. Are you? I have used both and I speak from experience. Unless you are hooking up your Inline diffuser prior to your filter (which is not the recommended way to do it) you will indeed get the 7up look I refer to and it will be even worse than a typical glass diffuser because it will be spewed through out the water column.
> 
> Get your facts straight and post what you know.


Obviously you aren't that familiar with inline diffusers since you think because you used one once and it made your tank look like 7-up that it's this way with everyone. I currently run one and have no bubbles in the tank besides the end of light cycle oxygen pearling. The diffuser is inline in the output about 2 inches from the canister filter. I'm running ~1bps at 45psi. Drop checker on the yellow side of green in a rimless 20 long all day. Filter used is an Eheim 2232. That is not to say it isn't possible for me to get the 7-up look in my tank, but i would have to be over-injecting.

I guess what i'm saying is that when these are properly applied, the 7-up thing is a complete myth.



AndreyT said:


> Are you sure you understand what an _inline_ diffuser is?
> 
> Firstly, it is simply not possible to have water with ordinary soda-style carbonation bubbles in the tank, regardless of what kind of diffuser is used. When people talk about "7 UP", they refer to the stream of rising bubbles created by an in-tank diffuser.
> 
> Secondly, a properly installed _inline_ diffuser will have no bubbles at all and no wasted gas (besides the normal surface loss).


Actually we are carbonating our aquarium water when we inject co2. This is represented by the chemical equation h2o + co2 --> h2co3 (carbonic acid). Exactly the same process used to carbonate beverages. The difference is we don't do it at pressure, so you don't see visible co2 bubbles effervesce like in soda. But the tiny bubbles rising out of an improperly used inline diffuser do make the tank water look exactly like this.


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## KrazyFish (Dec 23, 2010)

samamorgan said:


> Obviously you aren't that familiar with inline diffusers since you think because you used one once and it made your tank look like 7-up that it's this way with everyone. I currently run one and have no bubbles in the tank besides the end of light cycle oxygen pearling. The diffuser is inline in the output about 2 inches from the canister filter. I'm running ~1bps at 45psi. Drop checker on the yellow side of green in a rimless 20 long all day. Filter used is an Eheim 2232. That is not to say it isn't possible for me to get the 7-up look in my tank, but i would have to be over-injecting.
> 
> I guess what i'm saying is that when these are properly applied, the 7-up thing is a complete myth.
> 
> ...


 
I suppose you are right. My experience using the atomizer was on a large tank which required far more CO2 than 1BPS to get to adequate levels - more like +/- 8, so the "7-Up" look was definitely a problem for me. Since I switched to the reactor I have been pleased however because I never see a single bubble escape my spray bar unless the co2 is jacked way too high. That other guy/girl just got my back up a little with the arrogant response.


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## brains613 (Aug 18, 2010)

galabar said:


> .... *I use a Rena Filstar XP2 and simply bubble the CO2 into the filter inlet tubing (I drilled a hole below the surface in the intake tube).*
> 
> This works just fine...


 *Emphasis mine.*

I'm trying to figure out a better way to get CO2 into my tank without adding any hardware. (I hate the look of the glass diffuser in my tank.) I have a Rena XP4, and your statement intrigues me. Can you explain this a bit further?


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## exv152 (Jun 8, 2009)

Someone else, earlier in this thread, mentioned what I would recommend which is adding the atomizer to the OUTput of your canister as opposed to input. And closer to the canister itself to give the bubbles more of a chance to disolve in the water. The other huge bonus to this approach is you don't ruin the internal components of the canister ie; impeller etc. CO2 can degrade plastic parts over time. Check out this photo...

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/general-planted-tank-discussion/151438-co2-diffusor-problems-help-please-inline.html


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

brains613 said:


> *Emphasis mine.*
> 
> I'm trying to figure out a better way to get CO2 into my tank without adding any hardware. (I hate the look of the glass diffuser in my tank.) I have a Rena XP4, and your statement intrigues me. Can you explain this a bit further?


I just drilled a small hole into one of the sections of the intake tube below the water line. I then inserted the end of the CO2 tubing into it. I have a bubble counter near my regulator, so I can see how much CO2 is being injected (the Rena tubing sections are solid plastic, so you would not be able to count the bubbles).

My first approach was to have the CO2 tubing below the strainer of the intake tube. However, I think my current setup looks cleaner. Also, you usuall don't need all the input tube sections that are provided with the filter, so you can drill a hole in one of them and not feel too guilty. 

p.s. Here is a picture of the intake sections. I just drilled the second one from the top so that the CO2 tubing would always be underwater, even when doing a water change:


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

exv152 said:


> Someone else, earlier in this thread, mentioned what I would recommend which is adding the atomizer to the OUTput of your canister as opposed to input. And closer to the canister itself to give the bubbles more of a chance to disolve in the water. The other huge bonus to this approach is you don't ruin the internal components of the canister ie; impeller etc. CO2 can degrade plastic parts over time. Check out this photo...
> 
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/general-planted-tank-discussion/151438-co2-diffusor-problems-help-please-inline.html


That link doesn't have anything to do with CO2 degrading parts. What it, or did you just mean to show an inline diffuser setup?


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## galabar (Oct 19, 2011)

Here is a related thread:

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/110470-co2-into-canister-yes-another-canister.html


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## brains613 (Aug 18, 2010)

I get it now. I was picturing somewhere OUTSIDE the tank, which is why I couldn't visualize it properly. I just may give it a shot, even though I'm still using paintball CO2. (Would have to get a bubble counter) The other link you posted about using a reducing tee is intriguing as well. Appreciate the explanation and the links. Hopefully it wasn't too much of a thread derailment.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Get the Ista Mix Max Large for like $15 and you will be happy with it.


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## Aquaticfan (Oct 30, 2011)

My vote for a Reactor.. I prefer the easy to build Cerges. Cant go wrong. Tank wont look like 7 up. 100% dissolve. Like all of mine. You can make one in about 15 minutes or less once you have the parts.


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