# my gifted 35 gallon glass tank - on a budget! 1/18 update! corydoras sterbai :D



## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Hi guys! I am back after a long hiatus on this board. You can see in my signature my two previous tanks, both were small nano tanks. This is my first go at a medium sized tank 

I am living in Berlin, Germany. I've been here a little while now and a friend of mine gave me her 35 gallon tank and some accessories for free today! I finished up scrubbing it down the best I could with what was at hand. It is glass and she didn't really keep it super clean so there is some grime that I do not have the patience for. But I think it is good enough as it is, it was all free after all. 


Anyway, I want to do a heavily planted setup with nothing too fancy, no co2, no high tech lighting, etc etc...

I am thinking about doing a soil substrate and then covering it mostly with sand and leafs. I am thinking about doing some fresh water angels in this tank... not sure yet if that is a good idea, it seems like 30 gallons is the minimum for angels. Well I exceed that by a little bit, but I am curious if you guys think I could have a group of angels in this tank. It is not very tall, but still 35 gallons. 

So yeah, I think mostly a planted tank with a school of one species of fish (maybe angels?) and then some sakura shrimps and that is it. Big point being simplicity. Maybe angels are too temperamental? Any advice appreciated! 


Also I need to do some research about lighting... I have a hood for this tank that I can use these fluro lights with, but I am not sure I want to use that bulky setup.

I might just go for a diy LED setup, maybe with a strip with blue/red led's for night time lighting... my old 5g nano had a built in blue lighting and I really liked that for night time. I just don't know if you should select specific plant growing spectrum lighting for daytime setup or if you can just take off the shelf stuff at say like the hardware store. I mean I want to probably take easy low-medium light plants anyway so maybe it is pretty simple.


I stop ranting now, here are some pictures of what I have:

ps. the white dresser thing is what I plan to use as my tank stand, it seems sturdy enough  - oh and the tank has a sort of built in corner for filtration... but the wall is filter media, so it is porous and this pump she gave me is a bit strange.. the output I would just stick through the media wall... doesnt seem very strong, but maybe it is good enough... but I do not have filtration media really, just that foam wall... no carbon or whatever, though perhaps I could pile on some into this corner, I dunno - I need to do some research on that.

Thanks for stopping by and hopefully by the end of next week I can get it planted and filled  - gotta get the cycle going.


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## theatermusic87 (Jun 22, 2014)

The filter is called a hamburg matten filter, it's a mostly european thing though they are slowly catching on here as well.. A quick google search can clue you in on the details, but basically they offer high bio filtration (like any other sponge filter), and pretty good mech filtration (in my experience) , and they have extremely long maintenance intervals on the order of clean it once a year or longer.

They're great for hiding equipment behind, are shrimp/fry proof, and they do well with high or low outputs from a pump (5-15x turn over in volume is usually fine)



Also i wouldn't recommend putting angels and shrimp together, the angels will eat the shrimp.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks for your reply! yeah, I googled it and yeah I guess it is a pretty good setup huh, anyway thanks for the info/advice



So I finally got the tank planted and filled today  I am really happy with the piece of driftwood I found in the little local aquarium store down the street... they also have a nice selection of plants and I ended up buying a lot... I still am thinking about some foreground short plants, or maybe some sort of stones/gravel to break up the uniformity of the sand that covers the soil... but I dunno, I might just get some leafs and litter them on the sand.

So the light setup works for now, but I would prefer an led solution, this bulky fluro setup isn't so great, but for now it works. I wonder what a good idea for me will be, all the plants I have chosen are low to medium light, I need an LED setup with blue/red night light setting  

Also, I will get a test kit here soon and take some readings, but lucky for me the built in filter is pretty well broken in so maybe I have low enough readings within a couple weeks.

You guys have to help me figure out what to stock this tank with... I cannot decide 

Anyway, here are the pictures, I stop rambling now! (sorry but it is still a bit murky, but you can see the general scape).


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

new pix! I did some really minor adjustments with the sand and then added 2 new plants, I took pix of them, the first 2, one is planted into the sand next to the small piece of wood with the anubias, not sure what it is called  then the other new one is next to the ludwiga and is tall and green, also don't know what it is called :x

Anyway, the tank got murky a little from my meddling... I think the soil I used isnt so great, it is quite dusty and seems a bit like powdery clay  not sure if that is bad, but yeah maybe not so great... I hope my api test kit comes in soon so I can see what the levels are at and when I can get some fish in the tank


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## rick dale (Feb 26, 2014)

*new tank*

Nice tank. I like it.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thanks! 

I might have to make a custom stand though... I am having more doubts about my dresser being able to hold like ~330 lbs


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

looks good i dig the biotope look


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## serenityfate (Jan 29, 2014)

Loving the wood piece!!


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## theatermusic87 (Jun 22, 2014)

Looks pretty fantastic to me!


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## SpankyMR2 (Nov 11, 2010)

Looks great!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thanks for the comments guys 

as for stocking I am not quite sure yet... advice welcome 

~8 danios (zebras?)

1 or 2 pearl gourami

1 oto & some other sucker?

assassin snails (damn pond snails need hunted)

amanos?

a group of 6 tetras or cpd?

^ is that over stocked if I would go for another group of fish like tetras or cpds?

^another question is shrimp, could amano's survive with such tank mates?


another idea is tiger barbs instead of danios, but I guess they would bully a gourami or 2 from what I hear


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

got a package of indian almond leafs in today... still waiting on the test kit and flourish


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## reefcorgi (Mar 2, 2014)

great setup


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

so I added a new plant, I am not sure what it is called... haha actually I don't know what most my plants are called except I have 3 varities of anubias and 2 ferns (maybe they are the same?) some java moss a type of ludwiga and some other plant that grows like ludwiga  embarrassing on this forum, I know...

I hope the new plant, that I took a photo of under this text holds up, so far after a week no plants have melted much at all and overall seem happy.

I can't wait for my master test kit to come in the mail then I get some readings, I hope the already well worn in filter gives me some good water readings 

I am leaning towards a group of danios (leopard or zebra) maybe a tetra group (not sure what type) then some bottom dwellers, I'd like a group of cory cats but I am afraid they will dig too much into the sand and cause the dusty soil to be mixed in the water... maybe just a couple otos.

Then the question is gourami's - I want a pearl gourami, do you think I could put a pearl gourami in the tank? Is it best to put a pair in or is a single ok? Do you think a pearl gourami would eat large amano shrimps?

photos:


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## NotCousteau (Sep 25, 2014)

That's a really good-looking tank there!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Hey guys, so I have been noticing some browning on the plants, well and even on the filter outlet, it is a sort of algae? Anyway, the perfect picture is of the edge of the java fern, you can also see it on the anubia on the edges of the leafs.

Any ideas as to what that is? Prevention? I think maybe I could have too much light?

Any ideas would be appreciated!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

so I did a 50% water change today and a little cleaning... and also ordered some goodies:










^ The beamworks led light... the one sized for my 1 meter long tank 

then I also got a circulation pump:










I am thinking about getting a bamboo shrimp or two so I wanted to grab that also I think some more flow would be better

I am also trying to source some floaters locally, this one I think I can find: Limnobium-laevigatum they call it froschbiss here.

Anyway, hopefully my test kit comes by monday and I can get some numbers


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## Johann (Nov 16, 2009)

Cool tank!

Will be very interesting to see how the Beamswork LED goes!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks!

I think it should be fine, at least I hope so! I am a little worried the color might not be warm looking enough, I dunno we will see... I am not trying to grow a carpet of anything needy, no co2 etc etc etc so I think it should be ok. Just a cheaper led light and some flourish 


I did a lot of research on pearl gouramis but I guess my tank is just too small for them, I prefer to keep fish as natural as possible and it sounds like they need a minimum of 2 females and a male - I think my tank is too small (1m long).

So I am leaning towards now:

7-9 bleeding heart tetras

8-10 leopard or zebra danios

3 otos

a few amano shrimps (I assume they have no danger from danios/tetras  )

and try out a bamboo shrimp eventually and if it goes well maybe go for 2 of them.


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## BoxxerBoyDrew (Oct 16, 2005)

The Brown dusting you are seeing are diatom algae. They usually come in the beginning of a tank and IIRC they feed on silicates in the water. I know Otto cats and most snails will take care of it, as well as circulation will help it from settling on as many places. But it is a very common thing in the beginning! Pretty easy to get rid of as algae go. 

I really like your layout too! I can't wait to see it fill in.

Your fish list seem like a very nice group of fish as well! I really like Pearl Gouramis, but every time I have a tank for them to go in the local supply is either to small or to big/to old, so I never get to put any in my tanks! SUX!!! I haven't had any since I was in high school. But I think you are correct in your thinking, in the long run your tank would get a bit cramped with a proper group of Pearls! Unless you just had them and some bottom dwellers and a basic clean up crew, but that might make for a slow moving tank! With the Bleeding Hearts you will get some pretty good size as well as color, and the danios will give you plenty of movement, the ottos and amanos will do a good job on cleanup, though you might need a few more of each in the beginning.

As for the Bamboo shrimp I really, really like them, but even though one of the worst fish stores in a 100 mile area of me can keep them alive for months on end, maybe even years, I can never seen to keep them alive for more than a week!!! I have NO CLUE AS TO WHY EITHER??? I have tried them in my 55g planted, a 20g that was fully cycled but had no fish in it for over 3 weeks prior to the bamboo shrimp, and was 100% R/O D/I water where I added the minerals to be perfect for them, and had a Poly Pad running in the filter to make sure there were no heavy metals, meds, or anything else in the water and it showed there was nothing but normal organics. That was the time they lasted a week to maybe 10 days!

Heck I have had better luck with Ghost shrimp!!! LOL So Good luck with the Bamboos if you try them! 

I want to hear a report on the LED fixture in about 6 months to see how you are still liking it, as I have a 40B I am thinking of going LED. So I am subscribed to your thread as well as a few others who are using LEDs and are about the same width as my 40B to see how they are liking their lights! So I would be Grateful for any info you could give me now and in the future!

Well Keep up the great work, and good luck with it!
Take Care,
Drew


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Hey! Yeah, I realized that after doing some research... diatom... yeah youre right should be really easy to sort out.

Thanks for the compliments! The tank is kind of a biotope, not really a representation of any certain area - basically I just want the tank to look and feel really natural, a little piece of a calm stream somewhere in the tropics 

Yeah, pearls seem like really cool fish but I think I wouldn't just want 1 - sounds like they are much better in groups and much happier. 

Yeah, I dunno, maybe I get more otos or some other bottom dweller, I dunno. I wanted some cories but I think they might dig into the sand too much and my soil is really dusty so I dont want that. 

Bamboo are really interesting yeah, well that sucks - but maybe where you were getting them had taken such bad care of them that they were almost dead anyway? From what I hear they are generally easy to care for it is just that you need to make sure there is enough small particle food for them to filter from with a nice current somewhere they can access. 

Yeah, this cheap end beamworks light should be good enough for the plants I am keeping! Though I am concerned that the light will be too bright white for my taste, I feel like warm light looks much more natural so I really hope the white led's arent too "lab room" like....... we will see. At the very least the blue night light option is pretty sweet IMO. Plus this tank is in my bedroom so I like the blue night light idea 

thanks for the nice message


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

So I got my beamworks LED light and little circulation pump in the mail today 

My first impressions of the beamworks led light is like most everyone else, well made for the price - generally a good value. One thing I would say is I wish they made the switch integrated into the cable so you could just reach for the cable and switch it there... if you have a cover on the tank you have to open that to switch it. Anyway, shortly I get it on a timer.

The little circulation pump does the trick, I didnt want too much flow so I think I got the right one 

I also grabbed some frogbit from someone local, I am not sure I like how long the roots are in my tank, I feel like my tank is too short for this floater. Either way worth a try - I think I leave them in the tank for the time being but later probably will get rid of them.

I am still waiting on my damn API test kit... it ships from England to here in Germany so it is taking too long, I should have just bought the German brand test kit - then I would have had it here last week  

Finally I think I am going to make a simple DIY stand for this tank, nothing fancy at all, I am gonna basically just make this stand:










Here are the pictures! (the color is definitely less yellow/warm than my old worn out flouros but yeah it is fine I will get used to it, reminds me a lot of the way my old stock fluval specV looked like except quite brighter).



























^ I need some otos and amanos stat!


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## theatermusic87 (Jun 22, 2014)

Frogbit roots get longer if the amount of nutrients in the water are low, and get shorter if you have more, dont fret thelong roots just yet, get the tank settled and stocked then make up your mind


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Ah, I didn't know that. Yeah I was suprised how long these roots were, some where like 7 inches long and I heard that they get to about 3-4 inches long. Anyway, they are fine in the tank for now and yeah later I will decide about them, maybe I will just keep a few of them anchored into the wall of the hamburg filter then throw the rest out. But no rush for now.

I am still waiting on my damn test kit 

I might just go ahead and put some otos and amanos in the tank within a week, I am fairly sure that should be ok... the algae needs a cleanup crew


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

So I put in the algae control force in the tank today  (after a 30% water change)

-4 Amanos (2 a quite large, 1 is medium, and 1 is really small)

-5 Otos

-1 zebra nerite snail

(also planted one new plant next to the large anubias on the right side of the tank)



Here are the pictures:














































Still not sure what I will end up stocking the tank with, probably a group of zebra/leopard danios and a larger tetra... not sure what yet


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## Mitashade (Jan 8, 2015)

Wait a couple days, those guys will have that tank spotless. 

Are you planning to go with a foreground/carpet plant?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Yeah I hope so  I am gonna reduce my photo period too, I think I had the light on way too long for a few days there. 

As far as a carpeting plant, no I do not really have a plan to try that. I kind of like the balance right now, I want enough sand surface area to keep the biotope look.

I have this plant (dont know what it is called lol):

http://s21.postimg.org/osshh3p9j/IMG_1996.jpg

It seems to stay low but isn't as pretty as a true "carpet" plant but it seems to have pretty good new growth and should spread out a little bit. But really I think I am done planting the tank with anything new now. 

So far growth seems fine, just need to get the diatom in check.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ the diatom on the large anubias turned into poop 









^ i dont know what that plant is but it is definitely the only plant that looks like it isnt doing well, yeah the diatom is a bit excessive at the moment in the tank but that plant is melting some and yellowing pretty bad. I thought I could keep it but I guess it struggles/dies (only beamworks led & flourish).









^backside of the tank is kinda dirty huh...









^ diatom task force leader


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## sperzerker (Mar 19, 2015)

Looking good so far dude! Those amanos and otos are killin' it!


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## Mitashade (Jan 8, 2015)

Yeah looking great. Your tank isn't really that dirty/full of algae, it all looks pretty normal for a newish setup. Well done! 

I think that plant you said isn't doing too well is Hygrophila. I have some in my tank too, and so far it hasn't done much (looks kinda crumpled like yours), but my tanks conditions can hardly get much better, so I think it's just settling in (only added it just over a week ago). Maybe yours is too?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thanks for the comments guys! 

I googled Hygrophila and i think that is the plant just behind this one I meant, the one that is yellowish I have doesnt seem to grow in height, it spreads out laterally...


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

Very clean, great work. Have you added any fish yet?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks! Yeah, so far its just the 5 otos and 4 amanos (and a lot of pond snails and my one zebra snail... gonna get a couple assassins soon).

I still cannot decide on the stocking... I think a tetra group and danio group... I also am thinking about a pair of Peacock Gudgeons, but I heard they have a hard time feeding among more active fish like tetras and danios - anyone with input on that would be appreciated.

Anyway, I finally got my testkit today (german company so maybe the measurements are strange?).

All the numbers are fine, though I am not surprised 


*KH:* (dKH - d=deutsch/german) *11* (which is on the high range, the generic recommendations on this kit say 12/13 is the max for freshwater.

*PH: 7,5* or *8 *(was really close, couldnt tell which really)

*Ammonium*: less than *0.05* (mg per liter)

*Nitrit*: between *0.01 - 0.025* (mg per liter)

*Nitrat*: between* 0.5 and 1* (mg per liter)

So everything seems pretty good at the moment.  The otos really are getting more and more active, at night when I put the blue leds on they get a little crazy active for a little while. The amanos have all molted once (well the smallest I am not quite sure) but they looks like they are doing well.

And wow the zebra snail poops a lot hahaha, but therefore is the tank almost 100% diatom free!


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

That's awesome, I need to get some Amanos and Ottos too! I gassed the last 2 I got when I put them in my 10 gallon. I hear they are more sensitive than most.

Tetras would look awesome in your tank. It's pretty boring of me, but neons and cardinals are still my favorite. They just have such cool coloring and highlight. Some rasboras might look real nice too. Good luck on the German science project, that stuff is so complicated I am still intimidated to look too far into mine outside of the drop checker..


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## sahajaydip (Sep 25, 2014)

Beautiful tank.Drift is awesome.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks, yeah that piece is really quite good! I was at my LFS and all the pieces for sale were really not nice at all haha, one of the employees noticed I really liked the tank with the Humphead Glassfishes, they had my dw piece in that tank so he offered to sell it to me but for a pretty penny, it was 25 euros if I remember correctly. But I think it is really perfect for my tank size and biotope look. I attached the anubias and java fern to the piece, it didn't come with them 


I found a craigslist aquarium the other day and tomorrow I pay 70 euros for a nice eheim external filter and heater as well as the tank and stand... the stand is really all I want:










The stand seems pretty well made but mayyyybe I reinforce it a little bit but either way I want to have it placed in front of my sofa, also my ikea dresser is probably not so great as a tank stand in the long run. But anyway, then I just try to resell the tank and accessories here to someone else... but I think 70 euros isnt bad really, especially if i can sell the filter and tank for I dunno 20-40 euros (I think I will keep the new heater because the one my friend gave me is pretty old and doesnt seem to work so well).

Anyway, I hope the tank move goes well, we only have to move it like 10 feet.... but I do not want to have too much weight in the tank obviously, so I think I need to drain like 90% of the water at least... I dunno how much weight the glass can take unsupported......... hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 

I have German damage insurance, at the very least 

If all goes well, after we get the tank on the new proper stand I will refill it and then perhaps take a walk to my LFS and get the first group of schooling fish in the tank


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## sperzerker (Mar 19, 2015)

Even if you only want the stand now, you might want the tank/filter later on! That tank you got in the deal would make a great quarantine/hospital tank.

You have me thinking that I need a proper stand as well, so I'm looking on CL for a replacement for what I have. It's a solid wood piece (pine with oak veneers) but at the same time it would probably be a good idea to buy/build a purpose-built stand in the long run.


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## breakg (Oct 4, 2013)

Looking nice, any one notice his branches looks like a ballet dancer?


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## RWaters (Nov 12, 2003)

breakg said:


> Looking nice, any one notice his branches looks like a ballet dancer?


Ha ha. Now I can't un-see it!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

I guess I have to call it the ballet dancer tank now


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Well one of my roommates finally showed up today haha and we moved the tank to the new (used off ebay "kleinanzeige" here in Berlin) - I think I got a good deal! Paid 70 euros for the stand and other tank and nice eheim filter and some other things - I hope to get 30-40 euros from the rest of the stuff I have. 









^ view from the door to my bedroom (the wood structure in the right side of the frame are two of the legs of my raised bed, which is about 6 ft raised, the ceiling is like 12 feet high, old building)









^ to move it I took out like 90% of the water so its still a bit cloudy









^view from the couch

Nice to have all that work finished  Now on monday I go to my LFS and buy the first group of fish (besides the algae crew of amanos and otos).......... not 100% sure which yet


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

ran to the LFS today and got a pair of peacock gobies and a group of ten tetras... I actually forget exactly which one this is haha, had red eyes but I dont know is it really the "red eye tetra" ?


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## dlanderson (Mar 29, 2009)

Those look like lemon tetras. In that size of a group they should be ok at shoaling.


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

Those tetras are really cool looking I don't think I've seen them before.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

yeah, theyve gotta be lemon tetras, thanks for the specific ID...

the peacock gobies are also really cool, they are super calm and hangout naturally on the bottom.

I think I want to add one more group to the tank and perhaps a bamboo shrimp or 1 or 2 dwarf crays...

Thus far it is:

11 Lemon Tetras (I asked for 10 but apparently he gave me 11)
2 Peacock Gobies
5 Otos
4 Amanos
1 Zebra Nerite

I think I will put in either a group of neon or cardinal tetras or a group of zebra or leopard danios....... cannot decide :X


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)




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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

creeping up on the lemon tetras at night  theyre too fast and are easily spooked still


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ What do you think that white spot is on the oto near his fin? He is the only fish in the tank with some sort of blemish, his behavior is fine tho, I just wonder if that is some sort of infection? Any ideas?


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## jimbo662 (Aug 4, 2013)

andrewss said:


>


What are these two?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Peacock Gudgeons (they are also called the Peacock Goby but they are not really a goby apparently).

http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/tateurndina-ocellicauda/


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## TDashJ (Nov 6, 2014)

nice setup! I would put some moss on some of those branches, that would be sweet!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks! yeah that is a good idea.

***so a little update:

Well today I ended up getting a group of ten (which actually ended up as 11 lol) neon tetras for 10 euros then he gave me 4 RCS for 1 euro... my LFS here in Berlin is really nice 

I also grabbed a few interesting looking floaters, we shall see if they multiply!

Here are some more photos:


















^there goes the grumpy father back into his lair... I am convinced that the female laid eggs in there - the last few days he banished her from the tube and stays in there almost 100% of the time, only really comes out to harass the otos when they hangout near the entrance - or in this case the poor new neons when they swam to that area learned that they have a grumpy new neighbor... but he isn't so vicious - mostly seems like an actor 




























of course the neons are quite shy but they seem to be doing well - their colors are basically how they were in the store, didn't take too long for them to bounce back. They shoal nicely, I am interested if they quarrel within the group like the lemon tetras do - the lemons seem to be a bit bossy with each other.

No photos of the new RCS as they are hiding themselves quite well. The peacock gludgeons might try to eat them, I am not really sure - definitely the babies if they have them, but I saw the female peacock investigating one of the new RCS and she didnt eat him so that is a nice start.


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## theatermusic87 (Jun 22, 2014)

I like the end on shot of the tank alot. Also if you post some pics of the floaters we might be able to id them for you


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Sooooooo I faltered and accidentally ended up coming home from the LFS with a great pair of Apistogrammas:

http://aquaworld.netfirms.com/Cichlidae/Apistogramma/Apistogramma_viejita.htm 

I am 99% sure they are the Apistogramma-Viejita not really sure which of the subvariants they are yet. At the store they were much more vivid than they are at home here, although it seems like they change their coloring quite rapidly. Anyway I am hoping they get colored up soon I hope they didnt get shocked. I bought them on Wed, yesterday they didnt really seem to eat - well besides filtering some of the sand and eating a few snail babies, today they finally went for some of the frozen food.

So far it seems ok with them in the tank... I am adding much more indian almond leaves to give them extra hiding places, I add a couple every couple days. Anyway they dont bother anyone in the tank and seem pretty comfortable, the only problem is their colors are still quite faded. Also the peacock male really annoys them when they ever get close to the nest tube. 

Well here are some new pictures of the tank, I added a pic of the new floaters for ID oh and I added some assassin snails and a new dark colored crypt near the main DW piece.


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## skoram (Aug 9, 2012)

based on the 2 photos it looks like you have Apistogramma macmasteri - which is very closely related to viejita and very often confused for them. True viejita was just recently reintroduced in small quantities to the hobby after about a 25 year hiatus so you would have had to pay big bucks for them - they sell for over $350 a pair where I'm at. If you want a definitive ID I recommend posting some photos over at apistogramma.com

P.S. the tank looks awesome


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks for your input! Yeah I heard the two are often confused, you are probably correct  yeah... they were only 8 euros a piece here in Berlin so probably... I will look into IDing them after they get more comfortable in the tank and show their true colors


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## skoram (Aug 9, 2012)

if those are true viejita and you paid only 8 EUR a piece for them you won the fish lottery :wink: I saw a guy offering 500 EUR for a healthy pair a few months ago. :tongue:


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## theatermusic87 (Jun 22, 2014)

Floater look like water lettuce and the smaller darker green leafed one looks like its frogbit


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks for the input 

here are couple more pix of the Apistogrammas, they are seemingly comfortable in the tank, they are eating now and exploring a lot, I am still amazed by how quickly they change colors, earlier I thought it was just shock but now I realize they are kind of like chameleons, it seems they change the vividness of their colors depending on where in the tank they are (dark or light for example) and also depending on what they are communicating between each other (at least I assume from what I observe in their behavior). Very cool fish


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## The Dude (Feb 8, 2011)

I was worried about where this would go when you were talking about a group of angels in the beggining, but man its turned out GREAT! I love apistos and I want some very badly. I'm going to do three pairs of various species in my 180 gallon tank. Very cool and I'm sure active tank. Well done


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

hey well thanks! Yeah, I am really happy with the apistos, I think they are quite interesting fish  I am wonder though if I ought to give my peacock gludgeons away to someone local though... if both of them spawn at the same time at some point I think they will become quite hostile to each other... the tetras and otos though are no problemo... but basically I would say I like the apistos better than the peacocks. Though I witnessed the male peacock earlier corral the female into the nest tube and I wish I got it on camera haha it was quite the frantic show nothing like I have seen other male fish do.


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## Julie7778 (Apr 21, 2015)

Wow! I joined this forum just to keep updated with your tank xD so awesome, I love it!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Well wow I feel honored  thanks for the compliment and hope you stick around on the forum! Do you have your own tank or dream of doing one soon?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

So, yet again I accidentally came back from my LFS with something more than I should have 

They just got two nice healthy lookin CPOs in so I decided I would give them a new home. I took a pair and they seem to be doing well right now in the tank, they are eating these little crab loops that I bought for them and are not hiding all the time - theyre quite active. I kept 1 CPO in my old fluval edge and always really liked CPOs.

Anyway, the tank is now totally stocked - I will not be coming back from the LFS with anything new for the tank! 


As for the tank, I started about 6 days ago with the European equivalent of Excel. So the tank gets dosed 1x daily with "excel" and gets about 2.5/3ml of Flourish every week. Also I trimmed a little off the large anubias in the far right corner and other minor trimming. I added a little anubias in front of the DW as well. I have been adding many catappa leaves... I think there are about 12 leaves in the tank at the moment.

Finally, I am quite concerned the bioload is too high for this tank... I think it is definitely pushing it, so I have been doing 8% water changes everyday when I dose excel. I wonder if that is too much though... that means within a week I am exchanging around 50-70% of the water (sometimes I take a little more or a little less, not so precise).

I took a lot of grime/waste/etc out of the sand yesterday and want to stop with the small WCs until Tuesday then do a full water test and see where the levels go (hopefully they stay low).

Here are some pictures I did some FTS and then a photo shoot with the CPOs and the male Apisto... I have to say that he (and all the other fish) are looking better and better after this week I started doing some live foods, they got some color enhancing crustaceans some blood worms and some mosquito larve. I also received some color enhancing flake/dried/commercial food today 

Anyyyyway THE PIX:

















































































^ he is lookin good huh


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Well I am sad to say it but the CPOs gotta go! I came back after being gone 2 days (my roommate fed the tank for me) and 4 of my neon tetras have tail fin damage, nothing too bad but you can see they were attacked, then the 4th one actually lost the entire tail find up to the red stripe... he still ate today but I think he might die, not sure how robust they can be - I will get pictures of them tomorrow. Also the male peacock gudgeon obviously fought with one of the CPOs because he was hurt a little bit - but that isn't surprising given the territorial thing. But I guess at night when the neons hangout at the bottom of the tank the CPOs ambush them - during the day with lights on the CPOs could never get them. Also one of the otos was hiding today and sure enough when I found him he had a little bit of tail fin damage.

Anyway I feel silly for the CPO purchase, however I had kept them before with guppies and never had a problem - I am quite surprised the neons got attacked from them - maybe my male CPO is just a psycho. Anyway I listed to sell the CPOs and actually also the peacocks because the male is kind of annoying with territory himself - not to mention the bottom end of the tank is already kind of crowded with the apisto pair. So hopefully someone takes them off my hands, otherwise I will try to give them back to my LFS.

Sucks  and sucks that I feel embarrassed to have created this situation to begin with!


Finally... I have really just assumed the culprit are the CPOs but I havent seen the aggression really with my own eyes. The smaller one is a bit more adventurous and seems to take aggressive posture to most things that are nearby - otherwise maybe it was the fish nipping among themselves? The male peacock can get quite aggressive when fish get close to his nest. I dunno - but most likely it is the smaller CPO (or both of them).


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## zeldar (Jun 24, 2009)

I really don't think the CPO's are the culprit. 35 gallons is a lot of space for the fish to get away. I have 12 or so CPD in a tank with 2 CPO and haven't seen any fin damage. The fish would have to just lay there as the CPO grabbed it and held it to their little mouth. Also, I don't think the CPO would go after just the tail on each fish, it would just start gnawing on it anyway it could get ahold of... It sounds like its a territorial thing between the fish. But then again, maybe it is some crazy CPO that I've never seen!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Yeah I mean generally I agree I don't think the culprit is one or both of the CPOs... but the coincidence is kind of strong... however another thing is that the tank wasn't fed for nearly 24hrs from Sat night to Sun night... they are used to getting 2 feedings a day so maybe they were maybe hungry and attacked each other? Otherwise the male peacock has been out of his nest a lot in the last day so maybe he attacked some neons? The peacock could be the problem... it is true that all the damage on the neons and one oto is on the tail... like nipping, I suppose a CPO attack wouldnt have such a pattern. 

I maybe get rid of the peacocks (locally or try to return them to my LFS) and see what happens then consider the CPOs as well.


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## zeldar (Jun 24, 2009)

I don't have any experience with peacocks or apistos but that is the direction I would lean. It could be they were hungry although most people only feed their fish once a day or even every other day and don't experience cannibalism! 

Do you think it might be tail rot disease?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Yeah, I am going to keep a close eye on things in the next few days! I don't think it is tail rot disease. Anyway yeah I keep observing things and then make a decision - I probably will just get rid of the peacocks anyway - the male was at the least quite aggressive during his nesting period. As for the CPOs maybe they can stay. Also I have found a lot of info on neons being aggressive among themselves - however they hadnt been for a few weeks and I have 11 in there so tons of serious nipping is rare for them but not impossible then again.


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## Phyzix (Mar 20, 2015)

Just read through the whole thread it's really coming along nicely. I'm thinking similar stocking on my next tank, maybe Mr Aqua 22 gallon long. I like the look of your wood a lot more than mine, maybe time to mix it up...


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## zeldar (Jun 24, 2009)

Any more deaths or fins getting nipped?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Thanks Phyzix! Yeah, I like the way it has turned out but I made a few mistakes with stocking. 

Anyway well luckily not zeldar - however the one neon with the badly nipped tail doesnt seem to happy but he has still eaten so that is good - the one oto with a little bit of nipping is still seemingly a bit shy. Besides that everything seems fine.

However I still have found someone local here on the local Berlin & local area forum to take my 2 Peacocks... sad to see them go but they just don't fit with the Apistos and seemingly also the CPOs stress them out a little - it is best to find them a new home. The lady coming today to take them keeps these little guys already so I am sure they go to a good home and probably less stressful tank environment 

After theyre gone I will continue to keep an eye on the fin nipping situation and see what happens, maybe the neons had some infighting.


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## kimchilee (Mar 2, 2015)

how many almond leave you have in the tank? i used to have a 10g betta tank, i only put one in the tank, and the tank water turned yellow after couple hours...


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

I am maintaining about 10-15 leaves in at any given time... I do not mind the yellowing of the water 



Anyway, I gave away my peacocks to a member of the local fish club - she already has a number of them but this pair I gave her will go alone in a 10 gallon tank and she hopes they will breed for her. 

Anyway, I will keep the CPOs - I really think it is unlikely they are the cause of the fin damage problem... I continue to observe the neons and notice they are chasing and nipping at each other a lot more than they used to (as a matter of a fact I dont even remember seeing them do that). But honestly it doesnt look sooooo bad, I mean the lemon tetras "play fight" since I got them and seem more active etc but they never show any battle wounds... but these neons really are hurting each other. Today I have seen that yet another one has had its entire tail fin eaten away to the body... so it doesnt seem to be getting better quickly.

I keep the water REALLY clean and have 11 of them and have fed them flake, frozen, and various live foods. The tank is pretty well planted and is 3 feet long - everything seems to be pointing to a good environment for neons... no other fish really pay any attention to them either nor have effectively claimed an area of the tank for themselves (except for the male peacock during breeding but hes gone now). 

I hope they stop being so nippy to each other... I wonder if more neons would help or just make things worse? Otherwise I have no idea what to do about them. Maybe they will grow out of it, like it has to do with a breeding cycle? I dunno!


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## Phyzix (Mar 20, 2015)

I notice my cardinal tetras and harlequin rasboras nip their own kind all the time, but I never see any damage from it so it's probably an outside party. Good to know the problems you came across because it saves me 

I have seen the CPOs in person and they rock, but I would be worried about my shrimp babies. Although it might be good population control. If only a ram wouldn't wipe them all out!


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## Sky817 (Feb 25, 2015)

nice piece of driftwood


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## Nazdaq (Mar 25, 2015)

i like the driftwood, really spooky but nice looking


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Yeah... but I have been keeping a close eye on the tank lately and it just doesnt make sense - I have a hard time believing the CPOs are quick enough to attack them plus the point of the damage always being on the tail fin seems too clean of work for a clumsy CPO "attack" haha... I dunno enough about tetra behavior to really be confident about understanding this 


thanks for the compliments guys - yeah I got lucky with a cool piece of driftwood at my LFS... it was in one of their display tanks and they sold it to me


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

Tank is looking great man.. What a piece of driftwood. Thats a 1 in a million piece.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks! Yeah it is pretty unique... it was in one of the display tanks at my LFS, the guy working there noticed I was scrutinizing the pieces of dry DW they had there and said I could buy any of the wood in the display tanks - so naturally I took it haha, it costed 25 or 30 euros (cant remember exactly) and came with no plants attached, I tied on the anubias and java fern. 

As for the tank, everything is going well... the neons seem to be calming down some and growing back their fins slowly. The peacocks being gone is generally better, the male was a little stressful to have around, during breeding quite aggressive and even then he was hard to keep fed IMO... I had to basically hand feed him, he wouldnt feed with the others like the female would. 

Everything is testing perfectly except nitrates - they are also not bad, I mean I change almost about 40-50% worth of the water weekly but yeah they are testing at 5-10ppm so quite low but still a value. Ammonia and nitrites stay at 0 with my maintenance. 

I am not gonna lie the idea of a small pleco (clown or something that stays no bigger than 4-6") or a pair of pearl gouramis is really itching at me.. I have a problem haha! But yeah I dunno probably not the best idea, well the "small" pleco is probably doable more than a pair of pearls....


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

I recently added a star bristlenose and he works wonders on the glass algae in my 90. I need to get him a mate soon! Keep up the good work.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks!

So I am proud of myself, I went to the LFS and didnt come back with anything but plants! I was tempted to take a couple dwarf gouramis but I didnt 

Anyway I did come back with a few plants... my lowtech tank was taking too long to fill in so I helped it out 

Anyway I got some:

Hygrophila corymbosa 'Siamensis' that I planted near the small piece of DW with anubias growing out of it.

Echinodorus ozelot (a sword) that I planted near the large anubias in the right corner of the tank.. I cleared out some of the java moss that would have blocked a lot of light from it.

Then I got more of the tall grass to complete the "back wall" I like the look now - looks more mature 

Here are some pix... the tank is still a bit cloudy but you can see what I did:































































^he is starting to get quite photogenic


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

I have no idea where they get that kind of wood over there, but it instantly gives a very European feel to the tank. I'm reminded of the setups I see on the Dutch forums. Lovely set up! How's that Hamburg filter working for you?


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## jimbo662 (Aug 4, 2013)

Wow, that's a gorgeous fish. what is it?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Thanks Phil, yeah I don't know either  Yeah the hamburg matten filter seems pretty great, really easy and pretty discreet and so far has been testing quite well and the water stays nice and clean for a while considering my stocking level. 

Thanks Jimbo, it was sold to me as apistogramma viejita but many think it is a apistogramma macmasteri ... quite possibly a cross too... from googling pictures I feel like mine look actually more like the viejita but they are considered rare and expensive and I didnt pay but 9 euros a piece for mine so probably not an imported real viejita but anyway the male is actually really quite well colored - he and the female change their coloration constantly (she more than him) sometimes when he trys to flash for her his colors fade out or adjust quite rapidly - interesting fish


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## Nazdaq (Mar 25, 2015)

I know the temptation of not leaving the lfs empty handed all too well  Beautiful tank and fish mate!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Thanks! Yeah, it is hard huh... I really want one more thing in the tank haha now that the peacocks are gone.

But yeah maybe a pair of dwarf gouramis... the guy at my lfs was trying to assure me theirs arent so sickly as the asian imported ones - he claimed they were european bred, dunno if that is credible or not but yeah I hear dwarf gouramis are quite plagued with health issues.

I also really want a group of hatchets haha but I really think I would be pushing the stocking but then again they would be out of the way of the other fish but yeah the bioload is already probably a bit high... I am pretty sure if I didnt change the water as much as I do already it could start testing bad. Decisions decisions


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Some pictures of it just after a feeding, the water is nice and clear now but the glass needs a cleaning 









^apparently the new grass wall is a hit with one of the RCS - they are rarely seen on this side of the tank. I think there is 3 or 4 of them still in the tank... usually they hangout around the filter/java moss. 


















^I think this is a great view of the tank, sitting on the couch on the lounge part the view down the long side of the tank is great


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

I'm falling in love with this tank!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks Phil! I'm glad that you enjoy it  - I will do a video introduction of the tank sometime in the next few days 

Anyway here are some late night shots of the tank... the tank never sleeps (well it sort of does  )









^this CPO thinks he is actually good at hunting haha









^ the male noticed the camera 









^ she is always hanging out in this corner of the tank at night and her sometimes annoying mate is usually on the other side of the tank


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Oh I finally got a pic of the new guy...... I might have been tempted earlier today at my LFS...









^ whoever can actually see him and give an ID gets the prize 









^ fairly obvious here..


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## kylehca (Oct 15, 2011)

Wow, love the look of your tank!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks a lot 










^I think it is maybe a she but yeah, maybe I try to keep another with her, im not sure yet...


















^ a shot of my favorite invert  CPOs are really fun to keep


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## Phyzix (Mar 20, 2015)

Nice gourami! Those get pretty large eh? I just posted a quick iphone video of mine spitting on my thread since you mentioned it. It's tough to get the shot and not risk the phone LOL.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks, the pearls get up to 5-6 inches (I think females stay a little bit smaller, I am not yet sure what sex mine is) and live upwards of 8 years


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

The gourami is pretty. I'd venture to say it is too big for your tank though. Plans when it gets big?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks, yeah the tank is about 160L/35 gallons so it is too small for the perfect minimum for pearls which would be 2 females and 1 male - some say they find good pairs in which the male isnt harassing the female too much and 2 would work more or less in a 35g but it is a little risky, otherwise pearls can be kept alone but yeah not 100% ideal - I am not sure yet if I try to pair my pearl up - not even sure about whether or not you can sex them this young (my lfs only had juvies) so I was afraid to take 2 males - that would be a disaster probably!

Overall her/his behavior seems pretty good at the moment, nobody harasses the pearl and the pearl doesnt harass anyone else and is eating (only frozen so far, no flake) and explores the tank in a way I would say looks normal, she/he isnt hiding away or constantly/manically moving across the glass.... so for now hopefully all is ok.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Hi guys! I ended up finally making a little video of my tank today. I also ended up putting the gopro actually in the tank for some feeding footage  now I am thinking I really want to get a set of macro lenses for my gopro so I can get some upclose and personal images of the fish (the standard gopro doesnt focus so close).

Anyway, hope you enjoy it! (you can view it on 1080p too!)

https://youtu.be/5iw9_EcKYN4


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## Kindafishy (Jan 14, 2015)

Funny, once you put the camera in the corner, how the tetras are all like "Hey, what's that thing?" and the Apisto's pretty much just show up for food. 

Nice video.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^thanks! yeah the camera action caused a little stress haha... if I could get a macro lense on the gopro I want to sink some food right in front of it for some fun shots... as it is standard the gopro doesnt focus close enough but the video was still cool and turned out well / interesting 


Also I wanted to note that I am thinking I really need a cover for my tank due to humidity... but I dunno I can cover above or under my light, if I cover above it then humidity around it is high and it will get wet, I would assume that wouldnt be a big problem but eventually maybe it could be an issue... or I just get some sort of transparent material to put under the light, between the light and the water... anyone have any advice? what would be a cheap solution? material ideas? I don't want to diffuse my already low light


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Did a glass cleaning and minor trimming, pretty happy with the growth in my lowtech tank... though the limitations are clear with my light, the ludwigia is getting out competed for light and has lost most all of the low leaves, I have tried to trim around that area to get more light penetration but yeah oh well. I hope the amazonia gets enough light too, trying to clear some space for it.



























^they sorta match huh









^getting a breathe


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Your location is listed as Ohio but you say you are in Germany. 

Very interesting tank!!

Are you dosing ferts. Looks like plants, vals and anubias, need calcium sulfate. If you were in the states I would suggest an all in 1 fert by select aquatics. Contents is Calcium sulfate, Iron sulfate, Mag. s., Mang s, Molybden, Biotin. Look for dry ferts. They last a lot longer than the liquid fert that the LFS sell.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Yeah, I always forget to change my location, I used to live in Ohio but I have been living in Germany since August. 

Thanks!

I am dosing seachem flourish and flourish excel (well its actually the european market equivalent of excel). I dunno if I will really invest in anything more, haha I dunno maybe I should, but generally the plants seem happy but yeah I should probably do more for them


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

Wow tank is looking excellent man. I love that shot of the ram and the red lobster too. I just added 2 pearl gourmis too!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thanks man! I agree, I think it looks great too, for a lowtech tank without a proper carpet I think it looks great  my carpet is just tons of indian almond leaves  haha but I kinda like that biotope look the sand and leaves facilitate 

Yeah Pearls are really cool, I am always debating if I should risk trying to put another in the tank, but I am afraid they might get territorial with one another - and also I cannot find anything locally here in Berlin that doesnt just stock super young pearls so it is impossible to know the sex, if I end up with 2 males in this tank it would be a disaster probably... anyway the behavior of my solo (male, female?) young pearl has gotten really good, it doesnt shy away from any of the other fish and seems quite comfortable - eats like a pig if I let it and explores the tank calmly 

I just dunno if when it is full grown 4-6 inches if the tank will look too small for it, we will see.


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## Nazdaq (Mar 25, 2015)

Haha that invert is really awesome too, where did you get it?


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

CPOs are fairly common, many fish stores carry them regularly, they are pretty easy to keep  I really like them


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

here is a little update, things are going well with the tank, the pearl is growing up strong and wow the floaters I have are exploding!


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## LRJ (Jul 31, 2014)

Love this tank. Well done.


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

Very nice looking tank. Whats the floating plant in the 3rd photo? Its leaf shape is so odd


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ thanks for the nice comments guys! 

the floating plant, I honestly have no idea what it is! it is getting MASSIVE and sprouting clones all over the place, I probably will have to remove the big one soon, but now it is getting crazy and I have a good supply of clones to grow out - probably just stick to a cycle like that.

EDIT: You mean in the thirrrrrd picture, yeah well can anyone ID the huge floaters I have in the 2nd picture?

Anyway, yeah in the 3rd picture its the same story, I do not know  though those arent doing so hot compared to the large floaters, some of those odd shaped smaller ones melted away but some small clusters seem to be doing ok.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

lost a CPO today  noticed last night that he didnt seem so active, and then found him this afternoon dead  the other one seems fine, I dunno if it was a problem of nutrition or something else, he had a bad molt recently and was missing a leg but that isnt sooooo bad but maybe an indication... though I guess CPOs dont live all that long generally and I think this pair was at my LFS for quite some time already.

I think I will try to get a couple more and/or look into more feeding options (they seemed half interested in the "crab" food I got for them, other wise I always feed algae wafers and other wafers for cories).

I also did a thorough cleaning of the filter chamber today and changed water, everyone seems happy in the tank


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

hey everyone, I have yet another photo update 

I have been trimming minimally and have let the ludwigia take over some, but sort of like the overgrown look 

Considering no co2 and not much fert things are going pretty well


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## du3ce (Jan 26, 2013)

love the tank looks very natural


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thank you! yeah I like the biotope/natural look! I think the constant supply of indian almond leaves helps in that respect, I have no carpet so at least leaf litter in the sand gives a nice biotope feel. I usually have 10 or so in the tank at all times


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## sahajaydip (Sep 25, 2014)

Nice tank.IAL is good .I have used that.Its good for fish too.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Hi guys! I havent posted an update in so long!

The tank is doing well. I finally found a male pearl gourami a couple weeks back so now my female pearl has a friend. They are together a lot and actually the female has calmed down with him, she used to be a bit of a chaser during feedings but now is seemingly much more calm. He is a bit small though, so needs to grow up some for his big lady friend haha. 

The Apistos are doing well, last week the female seemed ready to breed, her behavior and colors got really crazy and she started dancing and flaring for the male like he always did for her! But I have seen no laid eggs.

Finally my two CPOs eventually died out but a few days ago I got 6 new ones (3m 3f) from a store here in Berlin that only sells inverts and plants! Their CPOs look all amazing, most all of them seem fairly small and young, their colors are amazing vivid and behavior is really good! I also got a crab/shrimp food for them there that they actually seem to like (the last one I had they didnt like) - also a big plus is the fish dont try to eat it like they do most sunken foods.

So yeah the tank is quite lively! But yeah hope you like the pix (the plants have filled in some, slowly but surely, I have no co2 so nothing happens too fast  )


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## Daisy Mae (Jun 21, 2015)

Very nice tank, to me it's got good 'flow' from left to right.


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## Julie7778 (Apr 21, 2015)

Always loved this tank. Looks great, hope you update some more.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thanks for the positive comments  and yes I will try to update a little more regularly


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## rhor (Aug 27, 2014)

I really like the sand you chose! Ive got white river sand, and it seems sort of unatural. Whats it called, or where did you get it? Also those apistos are beautiful!


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

rhor said:


> I really like the sand you chose! Ive got white river sand, and it seems sort of unatural. Whats it called, or where did you get it? Also those apistos are beautiful!


Looks like the river sand I get from local landscaping co.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

rhor said:


> I really like the sand you chose! Ive got white river sand, and it seems sort of unatural. Whats it called, or where did you get it? Also those apistos are beautiful!


It was just some sort of sand I found at my local fish store here in Berlin (I am not currently living in Ohio). 

Thanks! I really love the apistos! They are such great fish


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

hey guys! A little video update for you! Sorry but my digital camera is quite old and the quality isnt exactly great - but you can get a good impression of the tank anyway! The music is well, I dunno the best "ambient" things I could find on the standard youtube video maker - its not really an annoying song at all but yeah just wanted to cover the sounds I made in the apartment creeping around the tank! Hope you like the way it is looking 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0P8S1yPqgU


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## Daisy Mae (Jun 21, 2015)

It's looking really good. Man, that Java Fern is just lush!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ Thanks! Yeah it is getting pretty big, compared to how it looked when I first put it in the tank its kinda a monster now


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## nsellers (Sep 3, 2015)

What is the plant on the right side of this picture? I have an empty space that this sort of plant would be perfect in. I'm assuming its some sort of anubius but idk, i'm not a plant expert. Please help with the id


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

^ honestly I am also not sure, it is an anubias but granted a rather large growing one... I just found it at my LFS - it doesnt seem to like to stretch too tall though which is nice. I have trimmed a lot of new growth from it as well but yeah... dunno exactly which anubias it is


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Hey guys, a little update... I was gone for a few days last week and my timer was messing up so I had my roommates manually do the light well I think they were giving it too much light and the algae got a bit out of control so I did a fairly heavy trim and now have the tank to a less over grown look - I think it is lookin pretty good a little bit more neat. Anyway, things are going well with the tank - I have counted 4 very tiny RCS babies grazing on the java moss so that is cool  besides that nothing much to report 



























^ he is slowly catching up in size to his wife


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## tahuboy (Oct 8, 2013)

@andrewss Fantastic tank! I just finished reading the whole thread and am lovin' it. Giving me an itch to start another tank! 
Gourami's are my fave fish and i have kept a platinum gourami (3") in a heavily stocked 20 gallon with no issue's. As long as you see your pair not stressing about space you should be fine as they grow larger.
Respect, keep the good stuff coming!


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## ipkiss (Aug 9, 2011)

Very nice and calming! Good job! This thing shows up way bigger than 35 gallons in pics and videos.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

thanks for the positive comments guys 

yeah the gourami pair seem quite content so far... hopefully they stay this way! The female actually calmed down ever since I put the male in there with her!


Yeah, I sort of agree - the tank does seem bigger but it is!


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## cosmic_shaman (Oct 2, 2015)

I'm blown away by this tank! It looks fantastic. Love the lush plants and vivid friends you have living there 
I look forward to more updates when you have the time!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

hey guys! a little update here, not much to report. Well my pump needed reviving this week and is set to max flow but barely has any power, but at least it is pumping some! I am looking for a replacement for cheap. Also the CPOs are dying out a little bit. I have 3 of the 6 left. I honestly think it is due to aggression. I am not totally sure though. But now I have seen that they are little fighters (only among themselves). They fight each other occasionally pretty hefty. The last female (I assume) has been walking around now with 1 claw and only a couple feet, she went into the filter chamber when she was berried but then emerged after a week with now berries.. dunno what happened there but she seems to be a fighter, I believe she lost some limbs during an encounter with an aggressive male. Their mating ritual is quite brutal, she seemed healthy but then after I saw her pinned down by a male for quite sometime she appeared to be injured. Anyway, despite all the hiding places in this tank I feel like CPOs are little fighters. Though I am no expert 

The 2 assumed males seem still very healthy though... they might be little evil guys hahaha - the strong survive?

Anyway, the apistos are doing well - you would think they'd have mated already but no eggs or fry! They dance and display for each other almost all day now haha. The female has really become a part of the display now. Their displays have definitely evolved over time  The pearl gouramis are doing pretty well... the female just this week started to get a little nippy with the male, I think she wants to claim the entire left side of the tank for herself. Though she isn't always being so aggressive, doesnt seem to be an issue really. She is just moody I guess lol! But their challenging stance is interesting... they really square off face to face and charge forwards and backwards... so far the male ends up submitting after the standoff. 

I think I lost one neon a couple weeks ago. Down to 10 now. And I think I lost another Oto - unless it is hiding very well. 

Enjoy the pictures:



























^ you can see he has grown up a lot since the last update, his long fins are really coming in now




































^ just to show you how damn large that java fern has gotten!


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Hey guys/gals... long time no update! 

Well some things have changed. Over Christmas I lost my male Apisto because my pump broke and my friend taking care for the fishes swapping that out accidentally broke the heater in the process... they had a somewhat cold tank for a couple days until I got home. Otherwise I lost 2 neons as well.

So right now the stocking is:

A pair of pearl gouramis
1 female apisto
11 lemon tetras
8 neon tetras
2 otos
2 CPOs
Some CRS and amano shrimps

AND as of today... I got 6 Cory sterbai... couldn't help it! I really liked them when I saw them. 

I hope they don't get toooo big, hopefully more like 2" than the possible 2.5" they can get. 

Anyway, tank is prettttty stocked, I am not sure what to do with my year old apisto female, she seems pretty ok now that the male is gone but it is kinda sad now that she lacks the male. I am trying to find someone local to take her off my hands. Hopefully that works out.

Also the pearls are breeding like crazy, he is building bubble nests quite frequently now. I have seen plenty of fry a few times but they don't last long, although a few weeks ago a couple got actually decently sized but then disappeared (no surprise there). 

Here are some new pictures!

















































































^funny little hiding spot there huh hahaha


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## Mikeygmzmg (Mar 19, 2015)

Tank looks awesome Andrews! Post another update soon man. 

Also check out my new scape, I gave the 2nd mountain scape a lot more rocks this time. 

Peace


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