# sn8k's 90 gal Journal (56k) Updated 01/28/05 pg17



## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

My goodness........... "Algea Grower" just isn't working for you! That is one amazing setup you got there. I had trouble breathing when I saw it...

--cich


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## FiberCon (May 22, 2004)

Very nice setup there sn8k... Very nice plumbing job! 

Digital timers. Eheim pumps and filter. Lighted cabinet. Shelving. I'm jelous.


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## trenac (Feb 15, 2004)

Wow...You thought of everthing. Can't wait to see it planted & with Discus. Keep us updated.


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## SNPiccolo5 (Oct 6, 2002)

Holy crap.....:icon_eek: ! That's a really nice setup you have... It's all your people's fault that I want another tank- if I didn't see stuff like this then I'd be happy- yeah right!:wink: 

Seriously now- I'm interested in seeing how your discus will do. I really like those fish but don't have the capacity (skill-wise, money-wise, etc...) to take care of fish like those. I do, however, enjoy my angelfish.

Good luck and hopefully you'll get it filled soon!

-Tim


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

That tank looks like it has a high center of gravity, I would be afraid of it tipping over


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

Urkevitz said:


> That tank looks like it has a high center of gravity, I would be afraid of it tipping over


 Crossed fingers for earth-quakes I guess! hehehe...

You know what comes to mind the 2nd time viewing the pics? I got a FULL tour of the Vancouver Aquarium once, and saw all their behind-the-scenes operations. Your setup actually brought back those memories! roud:

--cich


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for all the nice compliments guys. I've had a while to think of how I wanted it to be - and believe it or not most everything I did was taken from bits and pieces of people who post here, and a few other ideas I gathered off the internet for the last 2 months. Having done tanks on and off over the last 20 years gave me a little incite on what was needed - but forums like this one are an invaluable resource - so a huge thanks to all that post here and share their experience and expertise. roud: 

I can only hope that over the course of time I can repay the group by becoming a valued contributor. This hobby is one of the most fulfilling ones I've ever been involved with - and I can say that even though it's been awhile since I had my last tank... finding this forum and reading all of the great things people do here, it's like coming home. 

Glad to be back :icon_bigg

I'll certainly be keeping things updated as thje 'big day' approaches. 

SNPiccolo5 - Angels are a big favorite of my better half... and although I do have my heart set on a 1/2 dozen adult Red Turks, things somehow have a way of changing. The wife unit is always #1 - and if she pushes the issue at all... it's going to be very hard to say no. Keeping her happy, keeps me happy... and that is as it should be. :wink:


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Looks like a great prep job. I like the steps you've taken to make it right. Keep us posted!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Update 07/13/04

First and formost... it appears that the Merlin fluidized bed filter has a crack in one of the fiting - so I spent half the day tracking the problem down and cleaning up the mess (hella water everywhere). Looks like I'll be sending back the unit for a new one - but in the meantime I just bypassed thet filter in order to get the system running.

The RO Unit is now fully functional (with the addition of a flush valve) and had produced enought water over the last day and 1/2 to fill up the tank. The first pic is the top of the holding tank, with the shutoff valve and the intake tube. The fill tube proved to be a real pita to keep primied so more then likely I'll be relocateing the pump inside the barrel to keep pump priming a bit easier (to be done at a later time). The controller on the wall is for the titanium heater... right now it,s set at 80 degrees F.

I did place a piece of 1/2" PVC pipe to keep the splatter of the water into the barrel at a minimum... this will also be replaced with something more user firendly. I see a trip to Lowes hardware in my near future  . 










The second pic is of the inside of the barrel. I siliconed a sch 80 3" flange that supports a 3 foot section of 3" sch 80 pipe that I attached all of the hardware (titanium heater & Eheim 1046 pump for circulation) to make it easy to remove the pipe/hardware for maintainence. I did cut a series oif 3/8" holes all over the pipe so that water will circulate inside the pipe... this made it easier for the intake tube to be located (soon to house the Ehem 1250 so that pump primimng will not be an issue). I attached everything with wire ties, even the plastic box to hold the pump (best invention known to man :wink: 










The next 4 pics shows the tank fully filled with 160 lbs of EcoComplete, the driftwood that I got from aquariumdriftwood.com - who I might add did an almost perfect job getting me what I was looking for, and last but not least - my old Model D1 Diatom Filter to help clear the water fast. I'll probably add one more bag of EcoComplete on the left side of the tank to get a litter better terrace effect.





































With my work week rather condensed, I probable wont to must except remove the Diatom filter, clean the canister sponges, and then install the CO2 reactor & tank _if_ it gets here next week... give me some time to figure out the controller and do a little more reading and what not. Anyway, the project is coming along nicely (however that leaking Merlin was a huge pain).

And finally, a pic of the tank without the diatom filter running.











Till nest time - happy fishes to all roud:


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## jbarone (May 31, 2004)

Wow! Nice Setup.

You know---I know this place is called "plantedtank.com", but I really like the look of your tank without anything in it.
I'm sure that with all that expensive equipment you'll want to get something more fulfilling out of it, but I get a supremely natural feel from the way it is now. Maybe a
little hairgrass and some java moss would green it out a little, but it still looks great.

It reminds me of something I'd see in the colder parts of Europe.


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## rumples riot (May 29, 2003)

Nice Sn8k, looks like it is going to be a success, Great equipment and set up of plumbing. Look forward to seeing the tank with plants growing and discus in it.

Paul


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Dang I love the wood !

The equiptment and thought that went into this tank is very intriguing...I will be watching this tanks progress closely. 
Im with your "better halfs" fish choice... Angels are a great choice with those tank dimensions since they love to swim up and down all day as opposed to being more "cautious" swimmers as the discus can be. But discus would not hurt you either... LOL 

Great start here... 

also, how about some insight about your planting ideas ? roud:


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## ColinAnderson (Jun 25, 2004)

Good grief. I want to learn how to create plumbing like that. W.O.W. That's looking great.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

ColinAnderson - There's really not too much inolved in the plumbing besides a lot of 1/2 inch schedule 40 pipe, a lot of different fittings (Orchard Supply hardware has it all), and a good ratchet pipe cutter. Th biggest problem was fitting and refitting the pipe to make sure it fit as it should. I actually injured my hands from all of the twisting & pipe fitting - it took 2 weeks before my right hand was feeling normal again.

Buck - As I'm sure you are aware, the plant selection has to be of a very hardy variety that can stand the heat. Echinodorus tenellus to provide a nice carpet, some willow moss for the driftwood, anabias nana, anabias barteri, microsorium, Java fern for some texture, Vallisneria americana gigantea & balansae for the background. I really don't know if everything listed will thrive in the tank, but I'm more then willing to test out a few vairities that are not listed above. Light in the tank is at 2.8 watts per gallon right now - but hopefully I can add some more after enought shading & hiding places are made for my low light discus friends. The big piece of driftwood on the left will be heavily planted on top to provide a nice shaddow area underneath. The big plan if for red turks... but I may go towards heckles is I can find the right stock.

rumples riot - if I can come close to what you have done, I will consider the entire project a huge success. I am always amazed at what you have been able to achieve. roud:


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

It looks like you are getting good light intensity at the bottom of the tank.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

With water, substrate, driftwood in the tank - I decided it was time to check the water parameters.
pH: 6.6
GH: 40 ppm
KH: 30 ppm
CA: <20 mg/l
NH3: 0
NO2: 0
NO3: 0
PO4: 5

Raising the KH is as easy as adding sodium bicarbonate in the right amounts... but what has me really troubled was the PO4 readings that topped the scale. Just as a test, I went ahead and tested the water in my holding tank - and it showed zero PO4. So either something in the tank or something I am adding to the water is causing the PO4 imballance. The only things I'm adding to the water is Kent RO Right & Seachem Dicus Buffer. I'm kinda at a loss on why this is occuring... but in the meantime I'm going to add a PO4 sponge to the canister filter - and then do some more testing with 5 gallon buckets of the RO water and see if either the RO Right or the Discus Buffer is causing the PO4 spike. I don't think it is the driftwood or the EcoComplete - do you?

On a happier note - the tank has it's first fish (to cycle the bio filter).... 4 Congo Tetras. Ravenous little buggers and seems to be happy in their new home. Planting starts next week :icon_bigg


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## convicted_convict (Jun 30, 2003)

I would suspect that it could be possibly the buffer. Some contain phosphates in them.
The tank looks great by the way. I cannot wait to see the fish and plants.


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## gnatster (Mar 12, 2004)

Seachem says that Discus Buffer is phosphate based.

From their FAQ. Bold is mine.

What is the difference between Neutral Regulator™, Discus Buffer™, Alkaline Buffer™, and Acid Buffer™?

A: Neutral Regulator™and* Discus Buffer™ are phosphate based* buffers providing a very strong and stable buffering system. Alkaline Buffer™and Acid Buffer™are non-phosphate buffers, which although less stable than a phosphate buffer, are ideal for the planted aquarium where high phosphate levels would lead to an algae problem.

RO Right is phosphate free.

-*-*-*-*
gnatster


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks guys - the Discus Buffer if going into the trashcan as soon as I'm done here. Then it's time to do a 1/3 water change... removing the remainder with the phosphate sponge & a few more water changes later in the week.

Thanks


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

That's an awesome setup man  Did you mention where you get the driftwood?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

ninoboy said:


> That's an awesome setup man  Did you mention where you get the driftwood?


I got the driftwood from www.aquariumdriftwood.com - since she takes special orders I went ahead and emailed her along with an attached 3-view drawing I did. 








. 

Even though she wasn't able to locate the long branches I was looking for, I think I can work around that :wink: . Took 2 weeks to fill the order - but the wait as well worth it roud:


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

Ahh, thanks for the detail. I ordered from her before. I'll send her an e-mail to locate what I need.


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## macbrush (Jun 2, 2004)

Is it just me? I couldn't see any pic on the whole thread.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

I saw all the pics. That tank is like WOW. My heart skipped a beat when i saw the tank w/out the diatom filter. Boy was that subtrate expensive! lol I can't wait untill the planting starts. BTW your not planning on adding a few corys to the tank are you?


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

I'm diggin this tank. I don't care for the long/thin look of a 55g, but this tall/thin tank is working. Stacking the two pieces of wood added the illusion of depth. I think this tank is beggin for collection of top-water schoolers. 

Great work snake (very impressive plumbing/tech)! I really look forward to seeing how this one grows out.


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## macbrush (Jun 2, 2004)

sn8k, sorry for the OT, but I wonder whether your server's banned all hong kong ips? I could ping, but couldn't access port 80 from both home and office. After reading all those comments, I just can't wait to see your tank.


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## Brennor (Mar 8, 2004)

macbrush said:


> sn8k, sorry for the OT, but I wonder whether your server's banned all hong kong ips? I could ping, but couldn't access port 80 from both home and office. After reading all those comments, I just can't wait to see your tank.



Yeah I have the same problem in the UK. I was able to see them a week or so ago


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

macbrush said:


> sn8k, sorry for the OT, but I wonder whether your server's banned all hong kong ips? I could ping, but couldn't access port 80 from both home and office. After reading all those comments, I just can't wait to see your tank.


My humble appolgies sir. I had forgotten that I did have a friend set up a firewall on my new server that prevents certain regions (the ones known for some quite prolithic hacking activities) from accessing it. Having been hacked before and having to spend a solid 2 weeks of work to repair the damage done to the server has me a little paranoid - I hope you can understand why I now use some measure of protection on a server that I house about 18 sites on.

Edit: I redid the posts to use the image hosting feature feature on this site. Not a bad service for the price and that way - from now on so that everyone can see the pictures. roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> BTW your not planning on adding a few corys to the tank are you?


I would think that the temperature of the water might be a litttle high for those (85 to 86 degrees) but I haven't throughly researched that yet. I would love to have a dozen or so... but I'm leaning more towards a using cherry shrimp and maybe a few amanos right now.

Do you think Cory's would do well at a high tank temp? Most everything I've seen so far lists the ideal temp range for these little beauties at 75 to 79 degrees. My main goal is to provide an opitimum enviorment, which I'm sure is the goal for most fish keepers.

Thanks in advance for any advice roud:


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

I keep them at 82F along with my discus. Not sure aboiut 86F though.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

*I seem to be winning the phosphate war!!!* :icon_bigg 

Been a little over a week since my last update - but after three 50% water changes and 2 treatments with Kent's phosphate sponge I've gotten the PO4 level down to 2.5ppm (from a high of 5+). I plan on doing 3 or 4 more 50% water changes over the next 5 days to get this under control before I add any plants to the tank (fighting one battle at a time seems to be the wisest course of action).

I do have a little algae, but I kinda like the visual effect it has at it's current level... so I'm good with what I have at the moment. I have a feeling once the plants are introduced to the tank they will out compete the algae for nutrients for the most part, with the shrimp taking care of the remainder to keep it under control. 



















I FINALLY got my new custom hood... but the bad part is it came with a gloss black finish (my stand is simi-gloss). I guess I'll be painting it again in the near future. I think IIRC that they sell a gloss flattener/reducer at the local paint store, so I'll try that before I wet sand the entire hood and respray a coat of semi-gloss. The easy way out sometimes works well - we'll have to wait and see.

Anyway, here's a pic, but have removed the canopy from the tank at the moment until I win the PO4 war, do another round with the diatom filter, and then get most of the plants in the tank. It's a pita to have to work around.










And finally, a pic of the 4 happy fishies (Congo Tetras) I'm using to cycle the tank. I used a product recommended by the LFS called "Stress Zyme" that seems to have worked out well during the last 2 weeks. Right now I'm showing only a trace amount (if any) NH3, no nitrites and very little nitrate. On this front, everything is going along quite well. :icon_bigg I'm still going to wait for 6 weeks before adding any other fish, and as always, keep my home journal up=to-date with all of the tank parameter (testing every 3 days right now... hoping to tailor that back to once per week after the tank has matured).










That's about all for now. And as always, thanks on advance for any comments or suggestions. roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

ninoboy said:


> I keep them at 82F along with my discus. Not sure aboiut 86F though.


I've heard that 82 degrees is very doable for the Discus... but right on the lower boundry as far as ideal temps for those type of fish. Do you have any problems or issues arrising from temp variences? My tank temp varies from 85.2 at the low end to 86.3 on the high end for some reason.... but then again, I'm probably being a little over cautious.


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Congo Tetra's to "cycle" with ? I paid 7$ a piece for my 5 congo's...I sure wouldnt call them "cycling fish... LOL 

That algae is gonna take off on you if you dont get some plants in there soon... unless of course you are not lighting this tank yet. There is no need to "cycle" a tank if you load it up with plants from the beginning...there is no buildup's of nitrite/nitrate what so ever and it keeps even tap water traces in check. 
I haven't cycled a tank in years... :wink:

Cant wait to see this tank planted .


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## aquatic-store.com (May 24, 2003)

Looking good, I love the dark look!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Buck said:


> Congo Tetra's to "cycle" with ? I paid 7$ a piece for my 5 congo's...I sure wouldnt call them "cycling fish... LOL
> 
> That algae is gonna take off on you if you dont get some plants in there soon... unless of course you are not lighting this tank yet. There is no need to "cycle" a tank if you load it up with plants from the beginning...there is no buildup's of nitrite/nitrate what so ever and it keeps even tap water traces in check.
> I haven't cycled a tank in years... :wink:
> ...


Well, I have to admit the congos were an "impulse buy" - they were just so darn healthy looking (and cute  ). I don't regret it though - even with that "sticker shock" at the register (I didn't bother to check the price on the tank at the LFS that said $10.99 each). I think the look on my face would have said it all  lol

The tank is at 1.2w/gal presently - thanks for the tip on getting the plants in asap. I will be getting the CO2 bottle on Monday from the local welding supply store and have that system installed by the afternoon (already have the regulator, bubble counter, check valve, reactor & pH controller). I'll be ordering the first bunch of plants tomorrow morning now that you've mentioned it. Next update should be early next week, with some plants in the tank (for a change) if all goes well. roud:


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

The Congo's are definately eye catchers and ravenous feeders as well ! I do love mine , they add were a nice addition to the tank.

When you order your plants dont be shy with 1 bunch of this and 1 bunch of that... and dont forget, Root Feeders cannot be counted as helpful in the cycling process. 
Any of the faster growing stem plants are great as well as the mosses and ferns that draw nutrients directly from the water column are good for a new tank also.

Look at it this way, once the tank is established a bit you can always sell or trade these plants that dont quite fit in anymore. :wink:


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## Rosko_22 (May 19, 2004)

Tank's looking like it's off to a great start. roud: 

You're right about those congos, super healthy looking. Really attractive fish. :icon_bigg I've often admired them at my lfs, never noticed the price tag before though, pretty steep as far as tetras go. Hopefully they'll make it through the cycling process for you, it'd be a shame to lose them. :icon_frow


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

sn8k said:


> Do you have any problems or issues arrising from temp variences? My tank temp varies from 85.2 at the low end to 86.3 on the high end for some reason.... but then again, I'm probably being a little over cautious.


Actually, my discus tanks temp. fluctuated worse before I switch all the heaters to Win Bro. Pro heat Titaniums. Before it was between 80-84 but all the discus were fine.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for all the comments & suggestions guys... believe me when I say I will take them all into serious consideration, and in all liklihood impliment as many as possible. I do have to say that all of this is great fun and I'm really enjoying the experience of sharing, learning, and interacting on this forum. I still have a long way to go, but it's certainly a fun ride getting there - mainly due to the help I am getting here, even if it's just reading through the posts or looking at the pics. 
Thanks again roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Buck said:


> When you order your plants dont be shy with 1 bunch of this and 1 bunch of that... and dont forget, Root Feeders cannot be counted as helpful in the cycling process. Any of the faster growing stem plants are great as well as the mosses and ferns that draw nutrients directly from the water column are good for a new tank also.


I went with the following on the first plant order... I wanted to give myself enough time to get them all planted in one afternoon/evening.

For the driftwood:
5	Java Moss (Vesicularia Dubyana)
clump approx size of baseball)
5	Java Fern (Microsorium pteropus)
(large size 5"-7",3-4 stems each)

For the "lawn"
5	Sword, Narrow Leaf Chain (Echinodorus tennelus)
(medium size 5-8 cm.) 10 plants per order

For the "shrubbery"
4	Green Temple (Hygrophilia corymbosa)
(LARGE size 9"-10", 6-8 stems)
2	Sag, Subulata (narrow leaf)(Sagittaria subulata)
10 plants per order
2	Nana (Anubias barteri v.‘Nana’)
(medium size 4"-5")
2	Congensis (Anubias ‘Congensis’)
(medium size 4"-6")

For the background:
4	Vals, Corkscrew (Vallisneria americana)
10 plants per order

I just hope I didn't bite off more then I can chew  . Once I get these in I can see what I'll need to do next to add texture, depth & a little variety. 

Ending today on a happy note - after 2 more 50% water changes over the last 2 days I've gotten the phosphate levels at slightly less then 1mg/liter... so I figure I won the PO4 war. One or 2 more 50% water changes will bring it down to where I think it should be. Wining a war like this is always gratifying - woot roud: . One of the best side effects of all these water changes is that the water is now crystal clear. I don't think another round with the diatom filter will be neccessary.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

To make a long story short... I got the order but my FedEx man decided it was more convieneient to ring the bell and leave after waiting 30 seconds then to actually allow me to get me clothes on and answer the door. So, I got the plants the next day via USPS priority. Overall, I was fairly happywith the shipment, but I was hoping that the Vallisneria americana would have beeen a little taller.

So being that the shipment arrived a day late, I was able to get the day off from work and spend the evening planting the tank (I had a few issues come up that afternoon that prevented me from doing otherwise). I think the planting came out nice.

A few notes here......
1) The larger piece of driftwood I just didn't have time to complete. I guess I'll have to oder some more java moss and some more java ferns to complete that. Afterqwards I'll have a better idea of how to handle the shaddow are underneath. Probably some more Anubias barteri v.‘Nana’ would work, butI'm still debating that issue.
2) The Vallisneria americana should reach a heigth of over 30" - but as you can see that will take a long time. I might be getting something to fill in the large plank area until then.

Anyway - here's the pics.





































As always, any comments or suggestions are most apprichated. roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Looks great. I like how you have chosen only five or six diferent species of plants. I'm a fan of larger groupings of fewer plants. Right now my 40G has only seven. Keep up the good work.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Looks great. I like how you have chosen only five or six diferent species of plants. I'm a fan of larger groupings of fewer plants. Right now my 40G has only seven. Keep up the good work.


Thanks bro - not too many plants can stand the heat for a Discus tank so I need to be selective. I've since lowered the temp to 82 degrees for some corrys I added yesterday. Plants are looking a little transparent now and as many people out there, is now suffering from the "new tank syndrome" with a lot of SGA and BA. As recomended in other posts here, I'm just going to be patience, clean up what I can on a regular basis, maybe get a few SAE & Amanos to help the problem... and in a few months when the tank matures it should all be good  . Rome wasn't built in a day, and a nice planted tank just takes time. :wink:


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

sn8k said:


> As always, any comments or suggestions are most apprichated. roud:


Here's a comment for you... You're doing SO awesome with this tank!!! Thankyou so much for showing us the pics 

--cich


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## ColinAnderson (Jun 25, 2004)

Yes yes, very nice. Wow. I love the arrangement of your plants. When they fill in it will look spectacular.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

cich said:


> Here's a comment for you... You're doing SO awesome with this tank!!! Thankyou so much for showing us the pics
> 
> --cich


Thanks cich, but I am having my share of getting back on top of the learning curve... see this post and you'll know what I mean :icon_frow


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

I'm sure you'll get ontop of it. I'm having some terrible deficiencies in my tank because I haven't been well enough to do much work on it lately 

--cich


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

cich said:


> I'm sure you'll get ontop of it. I'm having some terrible deficiencies in my tank because I haven't been well enough to do much work on it lately
> 
> --cich


I certainly hope you get to feeling better soon cich  (and your tank too) . I feel ya, my right hand still gives me fits after a long days work even 6 weeks after I first injured it. 

Actually the tank is doing OK - going to go ahead and get some water sprite ordered soon, some more fast growing stem plants, and should be getting my order of 20 Amanos tomorrow. All the fish look healthy, it's just going to take a bit of patience and time to get things settled.

Pretty happy with the results so far... it's just no where near where I want it to be. I WILL get on top of it eventually


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## cich (Aug 5, 2003)

That's a great attitude to have, Sn8k 
Thankyou so much for your best wishes for me too 

--cich


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

I know how you feel Sn8k. When I setup my tank I had horrible bacterial blooms, the tank took about 2 months to get balanced.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Urkevitz said:


> I know how you feel Sn8k. When I setup my tank I had horrible bacterial blooms, the tank took about 2 months to get balanced.


Yes - but I have to say you now have one of the most beautiful tanks on the forum roud: . 

But anytime I feel a little down about the progress of my tank, I just take a little cruise in my namesake - and everything is happy once again 

_BAD SN8K_









or I'll take a little jaunt in _the Savage_


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Nice. I'm a huge fan of fox bodies and use to own a few. What do you have done to the black GT?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Nice. I'm a huge fan of fox bodies and use to own a few. What do you have done to the black GT?


hehehe - another Fox Body fan roud: 

Well, here's the mod list.....

*Built 306 (302 bored .060 over)
(about 1500 miles on the new motor)
*Edelbrock RPM Performer upper and lower (upper polished)
*FRP heads aluminum X302, cleaned up (stage 1 port job)
*Custom ground cam, about 288 duration .544/.555" lift
*1.7 rockers
*Crower Sportsman rods
*Wiseco forged 10.5:1 comp pistons
*Scat lighten forged crank
*Canton Stud Girdle
*Canton 7qt Oil pan
*Canton Windage Tray
*MSD 6 AL box 
*MSD 2 Step box
*BBK cold air fender induction (chrome)
*75mm Granatelli mass air
*24# injectors
*70mm BBK throttle body w/EGR Plate (polished)
*FRP Ford Racing valve covers (polished)
*Victor water pump (polished)
*PA-Performance 130 Amp 3-G Alternator (chrome)
*Be Cool Aluminum radiator w/2 elec fans
*March underdrive pulleys
*BBK Shorty chrome headers
*BBK h-pipe w/cats
*2-Chamber American Thunder FlowMasters
*World Class Tranny
*B&M Ripper short throw shifter
*FRP 4.10 gears
*Tokico 5 weay adjustable shocks/struts
*H&R Sport Springs
*Autometer Pro-Shift
*Autometer Pro-Lite (oil/water temp)
*RCI 5 Point Safety Harness
*Autometer gauge cage (3) 2 5/8 phantom guages
*White face gauge cluster
*17" Cobra R (chrome)
*Nitto Extremes (245x45x17 front)(275x40x17 rear)
*93 Cobra Rear Bumper
*93 Cobra Rear Spoiler
*Cervins Cobra R Hood w/hood latches
*and LOTS of Zaino 

I also have a complete black interior from a 93 GT that I'm curently steam cleaning & preping for restoration (an ongoing project). The engine is prepped for Nitrous... I have a Taylor N2O controller and will probably run a 2 stage shot - looking for low 11's. And no - it's not smog legal :tongue: 

Here's the latest pic I have of her - with the new hood. You'll see I don't have the locking hood latches installed here (but you can see the holes for them).










Now I bet you are saying... _I shouldn't have asked_ LOL
Sorry for the long non-fiishie post, but my cars are my first passion. I just decided not to constantly dump all my extra money into cars and figured that the aquarium would be a nice diversion. It has proven to be a good decision roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Nah I'm always interested in these cars roud: 

What does the car run now? 10.5:1... are you sure the nitrous is a good idea? 

:wink: 


How about posting some shots of the motor?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Nah I'm always interested in these cars roud:
> 
> What does the car run now? 10.5:1... are you sure the nitrous is a good idea?
> 
> ...


The car runs mid to high 12's on drag radials right now... rear end & tranny need to be redone before I can run slicks.

The high compression IS good for running N2O. It's not good for a blower. With all forged internals & the other engine work done, the car should easily handle a 150 shot.

Engine pic? Not a problem


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

Haha :hihi: Now I understand why your tank's set up is like that (high tech). I have a feeling that you have more satisfaction setting up the tank's hardwares than planting it roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Interesting. I was going to ask why not just go with a blower with such a stout engine... but nitrous will work better with your compression. You're right going with forged pistons instead of the hypereutectics. It's a beautiful car but I prefer the clean lines of an LX. I've always wanted a black notchback with welds  After I finish school I want to build a Factory Five kit car. 

Is the IAC polished also? That's a pretty clean engine. How do you like the Ripper? I've heard the Pro 5.0 was the best but I've never used either. Do you have any kind of subframes installed? 

It's hard to find people that realize the true potential these cars possess. Most that own them don't know anything about the powertrain, etc... it's mostly people wanting to look good. For me they are a passion.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Interesting. I was going to ask why not just go with a blower with such a stout engine... but nitrous will work better with your compression. You're right going with forged pistons instead of the hypereutectics. It's a beautiful car but I prefer the clean lines of an LX. I've always wanted a black notchback with welds  After I finish school I want to build a Factory Five kit car.
> 
> Is the IAC polished also? That's a pretty clean engine. How do you like the Ripper? I've heard the Pro 5.0 was the best but I've never used either. Do you have any kind of subframes installed?
> 
> It's hard to find people that realize the true potential these cars possess. Most that own them don't know anything about the powertrain, etc... it's mostly people wanting to look good. For me they are a passion.


Yeah, the Notch will be lighter and better for the track - and their lines are cleaner. I just couldn't pass up the great deal I got on this car... kid that just sunk 13.5K into the engine, then got one too many tickets and his parents were adament he sell the car (in 1 week no less). So me dancing away with the car for 5K was a stroke of luck. Do't know what you are refering to when you ask about the IAC, but thanks for the props on the clean engine. 

I don't like the ripper that much - so I have a Steeda tri-ax sitting in the garage for when the time is right for replacing it. The car needs a LOT of suspension work... no subframes, welded torque boxes, nothin. That money went for the new fish tank LOL

Yeah, I like my fox a lot roud: . Any more questions should go to PMs though, so we can keep the thread on topic. I'm sure we could go on to 5 pages just talking about cars


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

ninoboy said:


> Haha :hihi: Now I understand why your tank's set up is like that (high tech). I have a feeling that you have more satisfaction setting up the tank's hardwares than planting it roud:


Setting the tank up was a lot of fun - but that doesn't mean much unless the results back it up. I do like the aquascaping part of the tank just as much. It's ALL fun


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Hey I've read where corys like temps in the Low 70's not the low 80's so thats why I was just asking. But I think that captive breed and captive raised corys are more hardy and most likely can stand the 80 temps. Just be careful. Nice tank btw, and how did you spread out that java moss on that wood like that? very inspiring!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> Hey I've read where corys like temps in the Low 70's not the low 80's so thats why I was just asking. But I think that captive breed and captive raised corys are more hardy and most likely can stand the 80 temps. Just be careful. Nice tank btw, and how did you spread out that java moss on that wood like that? very inspiring!


The corys seem to be doing well with no ill effects because of the hight temps. 82 degrees is as high as I will go with these in tank... but they are a very welcome addition.

The Java moss was just wrapped around the logs then secured with some dark brown cotton thread. Easy stuff - got the idea from posts here in this forum. roud:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

very nice! I've got a huge peice of wood in my 55 gallon that I want to cover with java moss. Getting a 1/4lb of the moss. I hope it is enough to get a start on it lol. Anyways nice tank, when is the Discus comming?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> very nice! I've got a huge peice of wood in my 55 gallon that I want to cover with java moss. Getting a 1/4lb of the moss. I hope it is enough to get a start on it lol. Anyways nice tank, when is the Discus comming?


Good luck with your project - should be an easy thng to do and I feel it adds a more natual look to the wood.

Discus will be coming in October. I want to get the tank well established with plants and water quality nailed down before I add them. Since they are so easily stressed, I don't want to have to do any digging around in the tank for a month or so after they are introduced. Just changing 50% of the water twice weekly & cleaning the glass is about as much disturbance I want going on while the Discus get used to their new home.

Thanks for the props on the tank roud:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

very cool! Thats a very very smart choice of you to wait. I love seeing a person wait untill they know they can keep the fish without any problems such as hurried water quality and stuff. Your tank is and will be even more stunning once the discus come, any thought of breeding these beautiful buggers?


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

I saw some red pigeon blood discus this weekend. Man, I wish I had the space (and a strong enough floor) to support a big show tank.

So. Very. Jealous.


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## badmatt (Nov 19, 2003)

amanda discus only require the space of 10 gallons per adult discus you could stick a pair of nice pigeonin your 20 or 29 gallon


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

There was a nice juvenile wild colored discus at petsmart today, I don't think it will die of old age.


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

badmatt said:


> ...you could stick a pair of nice pigeon in your 20 or 29 gallon


To get the full effect of the beauty of these fish, I'd really want a large enough tank for several of them, with plenty of swimming space for them. In a 29g, they'd pretty much just be sitting there. :icon_conf


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## badmatt (Nov 19, 2003)

discus arnt a swimming fish they arnt as active as other fish i have 2 in a 25 gallon and ones 8"s and the other 5"

and discus wont be as active as you think they are they are a very mellow fish that sit there maybe move 2 feet and sit there for 8 hours.


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## I'm new at this (Dec 10, 2003)

you just proved her point, they would school in a shoal of 6-8 which in turn would need a larger aquarium... :icon_frow


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Today I went out to Albany Aquarium to get some more plants in order to not only make the tank look better - but to also add a lot of fast growing stem plants to outcompete the algae for nutients. Got a boat-load of water sprite (Ceratopteris Thalictroides _thanks for the correction Bob_), 10 very impressive examples Crinum thaianum, and a few bunches of Lilaeopsis sp. Mauritius to add a little varience in heigth & texture to the Echinodorus tenellus that seems to be doing well in the tank. They say a picture is worth a thousand words - so I'll let the pics do the talking. Needless to say, I'm very happy with the new additions :icon_bigg 



















Here's a nice pic of my Congo Tetras...
They seem to enjoy schooling much more then before.


















And my favorite pic roud: 









Thanks for looking - and as always, any comments or suggestions are most welcomed. 

BTW: pufferfreak - I have no plans to breed the Discus. I'll leave that up to the pros that have the available resources to do that correctly. 3 adult Red Turks of 5" and two of about 3 1/2" will do me just fine :wink:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Watersprite is not H. Difformis. It is Ceratopteris Thalictroides. Just to help you out a bit :wink: The tank looks good but a few comments. You may find the crinums grow far too large to be usefull, as I did. I think you should try laying the large uncovered wood horizontally. It looks odd to me standing up....


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

Hmmm. I really like the wood standing up like that.

The tank's looking great sn8k. I agree with Overfloater about the crinums possibly getting too big for you though. Don't get me wrong -- they look great right now, but I think they're going to take over quickly.


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## jbarone (May 31, 2004)

I think everything looks great!
Since your journal started I've been extremely interested in how everything progressed. Near as I can tell, you're doing a bang up job. Congratulations!

Your plant selections fit really well, In my opinion. The Crinums will provide some shade cover for your congos, but not enough to kill out the plants below. They look really natural in there.

The only thing I'd change would be the java moss. Perhaps you could spread it all out over the driftwood, or remove some of it from that section? It looks a little too thick, and kind of throws off the focus from everything else.

Once again, though, great job.

Looking forward to your next update,

JBarone


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for the replys  - they are all very useful, especially in planning for the future development of the tank. On the crinums, some of those in the tank now are over 5' long.... and I could see that this may pose a problem in the future. I did leave all of the 40 Vallisneria americana in place, and will be removing most of the crinums as they get well established. I'm also hopeing that Albany Aq will be able to supply me with some nice balansae soon. In brief - the crinums will beome disposable over time. 

The java moss was intentionally put on way too thick as I expectected a lot of the 'leaves' would wither & die, which I was not too far off the mark on that one as about 1/3 of the 'leaves' are brown. Next weeek I plan on doing some major pruning there.

The Tall vertical piece of driftwood is the last aquascape project in itself... as it will also be covered in java moss, and have a few dozen Java ferns attached to the branches. The idea here is to provide a hidden area for the Discus in that corner of the tank, should they feel too exposed... and to also cast a shaddow on the front-bottom of the tank. This will be the Discus feeding area (which may need constant attention to remove the detrus) and provide a nice contrast to the area immediatly behind it... similar to the pic below taken from Amano's Nature Aquarium World - book 1. I liked that effect and in my tank, it will supply a need... so I thought I would try to make something similar.










I will also be adding a black background to that side of the tank to further provide the Discus with an area that is somewhat isolated and more private. I'm sure you all know these guys can be very shy... but from what I gather as long as you can provide them with a 'shelter', they will be less stressed and with that, heathtier happier fishies that don't mind venturing out into the more viewable areas of the tank.

Again, thanks for the comments and suggestions - keep 'em coming roud:


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## g8wayg8r (Dec 24, 2003)

Love the ferns and the HUGE tank. How do your attach your ferns? Iv'e been using rubberbands. Although they work they look pretty bad at time so I may make the move to black or dark brown thread.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

g8wayg8r said:


> Love the ferns and the HUGE tank. How do your attach your ferns? Iv'e been using rubberbands. Although they work they look pretty bad at time so I may make the move to black or dark brown thread.


Staples also work very well.


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

I've heard of people using crazy glue to attach ferns.


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

Sn8k,
It's one of the prettiest all green plants tank I've seen lately roud: Keep it that way. Discus will sure stand out in that tank.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

I love the tank now!! I love the wood standing up, once the chain swords get in front of it, it will look cool. Can't wait to see the discus!


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## amanda huggenkiss (Mar 3, 2004)

ninoboy said:


> Discus will sure stand out in that tank.


Good point. I can't wait to see the discus in there. roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

g8wayg8r said:


> How do your attach your ferns?


I use black wire ties (wire tie wraps), available at your local hardware store. I try yo use the smallest ones that will fit around the branch. With the moss on the logs & it being in the shaddows created by the java fern, they are barely noticable. It's actually very easy to do this even with the tank full of water and the driftwood already in place. :wink:


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## badmatt (Nov 19, 2003)

any new pics dood?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

badmatt said:


> any new pics dood?


Tank looks pretty much the same as my last update - no new additions or very much growth since the last time - so no new pics yet. That may change in a few days (my wife has hinted at a little bit of a spending spree for my upcoming birthday present - but she's not letting me know any particulars).

Actually I had a bit of a major problem with the tank I had to deal with a few days ago... 

I decided to try to remove most of the brown diatom algae that was in the tank - it had basically taken a good foothold on the java moss and was scattered throughout the tank - so it was due for a little TLC. I decided it would be best to just remove all the java moss and toss it in the trash (will replace after the tank gets a little more settled). I also removed the driftwood, gave it a good cleaning, and vacumed the bottom - trying to remove as much of the algae as possible. It was all good up to this point... then it went all bad in a BIG hurry with the next step.

Diatom filter - I guess I should have made sure I had set it up correctly before sucking up the diatomaceous earth on the intake side :icon_redf . To make a long story short - about 1/2 of the fine white diatomaceous earth found it's way into the tank. Talk about a cloudy tank - it was horrifically bad. You could barely even see inside the tank. After a lot of work that evening, it got back to being about where it was a few hours later. I did a 50% water change and since the diatom filter looked as though as it was now working as it should, I just left it running for about 3 hours to clean up the mess - and it did do a good job fixing the problem. I still have another cleaning job to do to get *all* that white crap out of the tank and off the plants (I'd say I got 95% of it already - so it's not a huge problem at this point in time). That will be tomorrow's project :wink: 

Reguardless - I'll certainly post pics as soon as I get the next new additions added.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

cool, cant wait!


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## Fat Guy (Nov 19, 2003)

Wicked setup.

Looking forward to seeing it all fill out. :fish: :icon_bigg


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## badmatt (Nov 19, 2003)

we need pics >_<


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## mad about fish (Nov 17, 2003)

love this set up been following the thread.

dont worry about the vals it will pick up if you want it to grow faster put some sort of root fertiliser underneath and it generally causes a huge growth spurt


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## badmatt (Nov 19, 2003)

Piiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiics >_<

#_#


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

New pics will be coming soon  - I'll post some in a few days.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Can't wait!!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Guess it's time to catch everyone up on my progress(?) since my last update. Having some luck, but having my fair share of problems too.

Brown diatom algae problem hasn't dissappeared, but has gotten better over the last 2 weeks. The amanos seem to be keeping the large piece of driftwood clean & the left side of the tank - but really haven't made a dent on the algae issues on the right side of the tank (they always hang out on the left side of the tank for some reason). Now I'm also dealing with some thread/fuzz algae issues too. Looks like it's time to get a dozen otos and a bristlenose pleco... hopefully that will help until the tank gets settled.

The pics below were taken this evening, following my bi-weekly 50% water change and the weekly removal of all that's bad (the dreaded algae crap :icon_roll ). I guess I shouldn't feel too bad - I haven't lost a fish yet :wink: (knock on wood) and that's the most important thing to me. Still, waiting for the tank to settle is a pain - looking forward to the day that algae control is no longer needed and I can start dosing & using fertilizers roud: 


















































































The Echinodorus tennelus is probagating well - lots of runners 









That's about it... haven't added anything new since the last update - just a little growth in the plants & a bit of rearranging things. Hopefully next week I'll be able to get to the store and get some new goodies... been fighting off the flu for the last 5 days and didn't feel up to doing anything until this afternoon.


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Looking great. Looks like a nice place for those Congos! 

I'm wondering how it'd look in there with a different shade of green or maybe even a reddish plant?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

John P. said:


> Looking great. Looks like a nice place for those Congos!


Thanks bro roud: - the Congos really seem to like it... they have been in the tank for a long time now. They know me and always rush to the front of the tank when I put my hand up close to the glass (that's how I got the group photo).



> I'm wondering how it'd look in there with a different shade of green or maybe even a reddish plant?


I'll be looking into the different shades of green - actually the pics are a little over saturated and the green plants looks more varied then the pics show. However, since all you can see is mainly 3 different kinds of plants - I agree with you, I need to mix it up more. I'm only running 2.9 watts per gallon and probably would need a little more lighting for any red plants. But I'll talk with the guy at the LFS and see if there is anything he has that would work.


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## bigpow (May 24, 2004)

My goodness Dude...
I'm speechless!

I'm sooo jealous! :drool:


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## shawmutt (Aug 10, 2004)

Wow. I just spent a while catching up on the post.

Wow.


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

If I were a fish, that's where I'd want to live. It looks gorgeous, and your congos have inspired me to look into adding a school to my own tank. 
(Great pictures too, by the way. Great clarity and color).


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

wonder woman said:


> If I were a fish, that's where I'd want to live. It looks gorgeous, and your congos have inspired me to look into adding a school to my own tank.
> (Great pictures too, by the way. Great clarity and color).


Thanks for the compliment :icon_bigg 

On the congos - I should tell you first if you have any fish smaller then 1 1/2" you might want to think twice before ading these. It may be because they have been in my tank since day 1 - but they do seem to be rather aggressive. They leave my corries alone just fine, but I've already lost about 10 amanos to them (they do seem no longer interested in them now however). I'll be adding some ottos soon - I'll let you know how it goes.

I've been taking pics for awhile now - spot metering on the lighter areas of the tank and recomposing for the final pic makes a world of difference roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

sn8k said:


> I've been taking pics for awhile now - spot metering on the lighter areas of the tank and recomposing for the final pic makes a world of difference roud:


Oh, that must be what I'm doing wrong - spot metering :icon_bigg .

I'm going to look in to that, snake.

And what a tank you've got there. IMO, yours is _by far_ the most entertaining photo journal.

Some red temple would look great in that tank.


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

I think...I HOPE...my fish will all be okay if I add congos. I've got a couple of otos that are about 1 1/2", and a few "teenage" platies that are about 1", but they're all too big to fit in my angels' mouths, and they get left alone. So hopefully, I'll be okay. Hope they get along with angels.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Yes I love your tank!! Very inspiring! But there is one thing I miss about it, that wood with all the java moss on it!!!


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

Light must be reaching the bottom pretty well to grow such a nice carpet of E. Tenellus so quickly. Some Brazilian Pennwort might look nice behind the smaller pieces of driftwood.


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

The tank looks great!! Especially those Congo Tetras!! I used to have 6 myself...until I realized they were all wild caught and had all sorts of parasites and worms that I just couldn't get rid of!! I really like the green to black contrast with the entire tank!!


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## trenac (Feb 15, 2004)

What a awesome tank...The water is so clear and the plants so green. The layout looks great.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Sorry I didn't get back to everyone's comments last week. I had a very tight work schedule that made it tuff to do anything but read the posts here for the last week. 

unirdna - Yes, spot metering (or center weighted metering) works well for me bcause of the big open spaces in the tank that are black tries to overexpose (and wash out) the green. With a tank like your's that is so heavily planted, I don't know if that would help you. I've looked at your pics and they seem perfect - I don't know if spot metering would help you, but center wieghted metering may be a different matter. BTW: That red temple would be a great addition... hsould be able to get some later this month  

wonder woman - congos should do well with angels. I picked up another one this weekeend (it was all alone in a tank full of angels) so I knda felt sorry for him and brought him home to be with more of his kind. He seems to be well adjusted  . I am getting ready to put 9 otos in the tank in a few, some of them are 1" to 1 1/4" - so I'll let you know if they fair well with the congos.

pufferfreak - I'm still having too many issues with the brown & hair/fuzz algae to put any moss on the driftwood right now. Hopefully the 2 plecos & 9 otos will take care of this... and I should be done with that new tank syndrome next month so the algae issues should be going away soon. I do intend on doing the java moss again when the time is right  .

Urkevitz - thanks for the idea on the Brazilian Pennywort. That would look great and I'll certainly do that when the budget allows.

And a special thanks to everyone for the compliments/tips. They all help and are most welcome. roud:


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## PuffedUp (Sep 9, 2004)

Wow! roud: Maybe one day I will have a tank like that. Nice job!


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Good! I'm glad to hear your doing the java moss again! I was so attached to it haha. Hope all your Otos live


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

So far the otos are doing great... even the small ones. The big male congos took a nip at a few of them when they were first placed in the tank - but so for no predation has occured. And considering that between the 9 otos and the 2 plecos they have removed more then 50% of the brown and the hair/fuzz algae, I'd say it's been a really great success. 

Tank looks better then it ever has before - I'm stoked (woot!!!!) :icon_mrgr :bounce:


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## FMZ (Jul 13, 2004)

what type of camera are you using??

Can you give me a breakdown on your lightining??

I have 220W PC plus 40W normal flour. bulb and can't seem to grow glosso or any red plant. Got CO2 pressuriezed


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

FMZ said:


> what type of camera are you using??
> 
> Can you give me a breakdown on your lightining??
> 
> I have 220W PC plus 40W normal flour. bulb and can't seem to grow glosso or any red plant. Got CO2 pressuriezed


The camera I am using is a somewhat dated Sony Mavica CD1000. It is ony rated at 2 megapixels, but has great optics and also allows one to set apature priority, shutter priority, as well as spot and matrix metering. Any good digital that allows you to select a varied amout of options will do you just fine. I have been taking photos for many years, and have been published a few times in various mags, so knowing how to use what you have to its maximum potential is the best recipe for a great photo... towards that end, the BIG three key words in this equation are practice, practice, and practice!! :icon_bigg 

My lighting is an off-the-shelf CoralLife Compact floresent fixture - 4x65watts yielding a total of 260 watts - at 6500k. I also run a UV sterilizer to maintain water clarity. Even though my tank is 90 gallons - the 160 lbs of ecocomplete & driftwood makes the tank have an 80 gallon capacity... which would equate to a realistic figure of 3.25 watts/gallon. I think that some of the easier red plants (like the Red Temple) will grow fine under these conditions... however IMHO I think that anyone who really wants to grow stunning red plants would be best serverd with Metal Hylide fixtures or VHO floresent fixtures. Even then, it's more then just lighting that makes for stunning red plants, dosing micros and macros in the correct amounts are just as important. Please take all this with a grain of salt - there are far more qualified individuals here to speak about lighting then I am... unirdna, Urkevitz, and more would be much more qualified then I to speak about optimising lighting requirements. HTH


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

PuffedUp said:


> Wow! roud: Maybe one day I will have a tank like that. Nice job!


Thank you very much for the kind words - most apprichiated :icon_bigg 

I'm sure that you'll have a tank that is even better then mine in time - it just takes time, patience, and a willingness to learn. You're already on the right track - this forum is an invaluable resourse for anyone who is motivated enough to take it to the next level. roud:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Also red plants take up ALOT of iron I believe. Can't wait for a update Sn8k. I'm glad to hear that the ottos and placos did the job you was looking for. They will finish it off within this week I bet!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Just a small update.... I went to Albany Aquarium and picked up 12 new amanos, one oto, and a few new plants - which I added this evening. Tank inhabitants now include:

24 - Amano Shrimp
10 - Otos
2 - Plecos
3 - Golden Zebra Botias
2 - Kuli loaches
1 - Julie Corry
5 - Panda Corries
8 - Congo Tetras

I had a long talk with the wife unit today... as I said awhile back, her favorite fish are angles and it wouldn't take too much perswadiing on her part to influence me to get angles instead of Discus if that would make her happy and a little more interested in the tank. I did have my heart set on getting about 5 adult wilds (the brown/dark red ones with 7 bands), but I also realize it could very well be until income tax time before I could come up with the $800 needed for this purchase. To make a long story short, I think within the next few weeks I'll be trying to get some medium size angles for the tank. This should peak her involvement, which is always a huge plus i my book. :icon_bigg 

Later - should we decide to get the Discus, we can always get another tank & stand to transfer the angles into. Sounds like a double win for Markers roud: 

Anywayz - here's a pic of the tank with the new plants........









click here for a 1024x768 image.

Thanks for visiting my album, and as always - any advise and/or constructive critism is most welcomed roud:


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## sanj (Jan 11, 2004)

Arent you the sweet fella thinking abouy your wife. Good on ya 

I have a 380 litre S American/African set up. I have 6 congos, 15 Rummy noses (the best shoaling fish I have kept yet), 10 Cardinals and currntly 8 Angels.

Five of the Angels are Peruvuan wild stock (Scalare). Just a suggestion, these guys (original wild type colouration) are the best IMO much more stunning then the cultivated varieties. If you get the chance consider it they would really look amazing in your tank.

The other Angels are two black and one half black for contrast to the main stock.

Ofc everyone has different ideas.

Good luck with it.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Ohhhhh - I like the wild angles the best :icon_bigg 

I saw a group of 7 adult wilds over at Albany (they were foir thier show tank and not for sale.... believe me, I ask numerous times if they were wanting to sell them  .

Sounds like you have quite a tank yourself roud: . So I take it you don't have any problems wih the Cardinals & the congos getting along with each other? I'm afraid to get any smaller fishes then the congos because mibe are such aggressive eaters and don't have a problem with nipping at fish smaller then they are. I've thought a few times reciently that I might have to get rid of the congos, but they have been in the tank since almost day one, so it's kinda like their tank. I don't think I have the heart to take them out.

Thanks for the imput and helpful suggestion.... I may be on a quest for Scalares sooner then you think :wink:


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Sn8k-
Beware of combining angels with shrimp. I have 4 juvenile angels (their bodies are about the size of Kennedy 50 cent pieces, not including fins), and this weekend, I introduced 7 ghost shrimp about 1" long. They very quickly all became snacks.  

If your shrimp are larger than 1", they may be fine, but expect some picking and nipping. the three ghost shrimp i have in my other tank with platies and cories are doing fine.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

wonder woman said:


> Sn8k-
> Beware of combining angels with shrimp. I have 4 juvenile angels (their bodies are about the size of Kennedy 50 cent pieces, not including fins), and this weekend, I introduced 7 ghost shrimp about 1" long. They very quickly all became snacks.
> 
> If your shrimp are larger than 1", they may be fine, but expect some picking and nipping. the three ghost shrimp i have in my other tank with platies and cories are doing fine.


Oh well, it would have been nice... but I think I can also be just as happy with a larger school of Congos, or something similar that would not think the amanos are just a snack for them. Thanks a bunch for the warning, I'll take your advise oin that one foir sure roud:

EDIT: No, my wife now is set on getting angles (bless her heart, she's now actually taking a very active roll in what the remainder of the tank will be stocked with). Looks like I'll be taking the smaller amanos back to the LFS. Most of them are about 1 1/4" - so with any luck they'll be OK.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

sn8k do I have the fish for you........Get 2 females and 1 male of........A. Cacatuoides


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> sn8k do I have the fish for you........Get 2 females and 1 male of........A. Cacatuoides


Beautiful!!!!!!! roud: :icon_bigg roud:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Oh and the plus thing, they wont attack your shrimp!!!


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

About the shrimp, you COULD try it anyway. At my lfs, the ghost shrimp were 10 for $1, so I figured, why not? (How was I to know they'd get snacked on?). So far, of the 7 I put in the planted tank, I've found 4-5 dead (mostly pieces). I did spot one (smart) live one yesterday, hiding. If you bought lots of shrimp, there's always the chance a few might outsmart the angels and survive. I do highly recommend angels. I have 4 who are the most graceful fish I've seen. They seem to float through the water more than swim. But they are most definitely HUNTERS. You won't keep many fry if they're born in that tank. 

Sn8k- due to your inspiration, I just picked up 3 congos from my lfs. I know eventually I'll build a school of 6 or 8, but the three are a test-run. At $8 each, I don't want to invest $50-60 if they don't "take" well to my little eco-system. They are absolutely gorgeous in the tank- albeit a bit twitchy and high-strung (something that has always bothered me about tetras in general). But a wonderful addition. Thanks for providing such wonderful inspiration.


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## oldfarmhouse (May 18, 2004)

puffer freak. Whats the name of those fish in lay talk??


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## ThatNewGuy (Sep 8, 2004)

I have to say Snake that you have a really beautiful tank and I thank you for sharing with us "Algaa Growers" and newbs


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## FMZ (Jul 13, 2004)

Hey sn8k, i just noticed one thing that your water is filled all the way up to the top or atleast where the top frame is. Is there any drawbacks to it?? I always leave 2-3 inches below the top frame of the aquarium.


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

um why and the world would you do that


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## catwoman (Aug 30, 2004)

oldfarmhouse said:


> puffer freak. Whats the name of those fish in lay talk??


Dwarf cockatoo cichlid


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

wonder woman - on the angles, well... here are the first 5 :icon_bigg 
(you'll only see 4 in the pics - the other new arrival was in the back resting behind the plants)









(I have a feeling wonder woman will want to see a big one of the pic above!!!





































So far so good - the angles are leaving all the amanos and smaller fish alone. We opted for the plain jane variety due to their easy availability.. the Scalares would have been nice - but I compromised since the wife thought these were adorable. The congos were a bit startled and tweaking - but I think after a day or two they'll settle down after they see that the angles pose no threat to them. Until this occurs, I won't be adding any more angles - but I do have plans for adding at least another dozen (hopefully in 2 weeks when payday hits). Just like I had planned with the Discus, I'll only have one type in the tank.

Very happy to hear you got a few congos yourself... they are cute little buggers :icon_bigg . I can only wish that you have just as much success with them as I have thus far - best of luck with the newbies roud: 

FMZ - I haven't had any problems at all filling the tank to the top... to be honest, I don't know why I do it... just for looks I suppose. I do have to drain the tank 6 inches when I have to do any work inside the tank - but that only usually occurs dring water changes.

Thanks for the compliments on the tank everyone... I'm having a great time with it so far. Now that my wife in getting involved with the fishies... we've already started planning our next tank. Next year we'll go ahead and transfer the angles to the new tank and putting the Discus in the 90 gallon. :icon_bigg 

Thanks again for visiting my album, and as always - any advise and/or constructive criticism is most welcomed roud:


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## sanj (Jan 11, 2004)

Hi again,

those angels look great (a bit like mine lol). Most Angelfish in the hobby are Scalares, but have been captive bred into various colour forms and fin shapes.

The other two more rare species: are the really Impressive Altums that are pretty fussy about water quality like Discus and the Leopoldi which isnt see that much in the hobby.

Regarding my cardinals they have dropped in number considerably, not sure whats going on found one or two dead, but I suspect the angels although they are either small or medium sized.

Definatley all or most the same colour looks better.


Btw the mad plant at the bottom, is it Echinodorus Tennelus the Dwarf chain sword?

I think I need some


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

I think your wife will appreciate some red in the tank.  :tongue: Try some alternanthera reineckii, it's easy to grow and readily available.

The angels of course look great.

This tank is coming along superbly.


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## Inzeos (Sep 10, 2004)

Very nice tank! A lot of inpsiration and ideas to apply to my next tank project, which is on the planning block right now.

Leif


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

sanj said:


> Btw the mad plant at the bottom, is it Echinodorus Tennelus the Dwarf chain sword?


Yes it is - the tennelus seems to love the ecocomplete and is growing like a bad weed. Deffinatly one of the better growers in my tank.



Overfloater said:


> I think your wife will appreciate some red in the tank.


Working on that one bro. I'm going to have to remove the piece of driftwood that is laying flat on the bottom of the tank (not visable in the pics above, but you can see it on the first page of this thread) to gain the valuable realestate needed for more plants. I'll add the alternanthera reineckii to the list of plants to buy next - great looking plant... thanks for the suggestion. roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

sn8k said:


> I'll add the alternanthera reineckii to the list of plants to buy next - great looking plant... thanks for the suggestion. roud:


No problem. I will have some stems I could send you soon for shipping. I give you priority because of the fox body. :icon_mrgr Then again it's not like this plant is hard to aquire hehe...


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> No problem. I will have some stems I could send you soon for shipping. I give you priority because of the fox body. :icon_mrgr Then again it's not like this plant is hard to aquire hehe...


Sweet :icon_bigg 

Let me know when the time comes... that way I can send you some $$ to cover shipping and stuff. 

Thanks roud:


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## mpb (Jun 6, 2004)

sn8k said:


> wonder woman - on the angles, well... here are the first I do have plans for adding at least another dozen (hopefully in 2 weeks when payday hits).


IMO that is too many angels for 90 g tank. I would keep at most 10.

Not to mention that if only two pair up then they will become very aggressive.
On my 50g tank I have a pair the does not allow any other angel in the tank.

You have an impressive tank!


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Sn8k-
Those angels were definitely the perfect addition to your tank. They compliment the plants and congos well. However, I would agree with mpb- angels will pair off as they mature, and male angels will get pretty territorial towards eachother. I would think 4-6 in a 90g would be a good number. In my 100g, I currently have 4- I had 6, but two didn't make it :icon_sad: . 
And, if you kept the # of angels down, there'd be more room for another kind of fish- say cories...(my favorite).

It's tanks like yours that give me something to aspire to (in all seriousness). Keep it up!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Back in the day when I had my fish room going (10 tanks of various size) we had a dedicated 35 gallon for angles.... can't remember off hand but I think we had like 15/16 fish in the tank. they all seemed to get along fine until one day - there were two fish on one side of the tank and all the rest were being "corralled" on the other side. A brief look see was all it took to find out the reason, two had paired off and laid eggs. Talk about aggressive behaviour :icon_eek: - we rearranged things so that the mated pair stayed in the 35 gallon, and transfered the remainder to another tank. Too bad the eggs were never fertilized, but it was an interesting experience.. and a good lesson.

On the males being territorial, yes - and if it gets ugly there is always the LFS that I have around the corner that will be happy to take them off my hands for store credit. So I understand the risks of having a large group of angles. IME, as long as they don't pair off and mate, it's all good. If they do, then it's time to get the eggs out of the tank before your little angles make mince meat out of the other tank inhabitants.

Still, even after having said all that, mabey a few less would make it a lot easier in the long run... so I'll keep it at a max of 10. Sounds like a good round number. 

BTW wonder woman - I do have 6 corries in the tank... they just stay hidden among the vegitation for the most part - except for the Julie - she's the adventrous one 

Thanks for the advise, and and the kind words. roud:


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Sn8k-
You seem well educated/ prepared, 10 sounds like a nice number, as long as there aren't many other fish that the congos and cories (and shrimp) in the tank. 
Mine haven't paired off yet, but, being juveniles, I have already caught a couple of them (assumedly males) squaring off (well, they actually looked like they were kissing, but not in a nice way :wink: ).


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

Tank has grown in beautifully and your choice of adding angels was superb. Can't beat the looks of them in a planted tank (or any tank for that matter). 

Good thing that you decided not to add another dozen to the mix. As time goes by, they're gonna eventually pair off and start to mate (this is just a matter of time, since in such a tank, the conditions are favorable for them to do so). Although it is possible to have more than one pair of angels in the tank, it will be very chaotic (had two pairs which split the tank in half and patrolled their mutual border viciously).


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

Those angels must love that tall tank, it is amazing how far your tank has come in such a short time.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for all the help and nice comments everyone. I may have been doing this off-and-on for a long time, but there are still things I need to learn. 

The five new angles are doing great (one developed a fungus infection, so I'm treating with Maroxy and it's going away very quickly. Must have been injured during netting at the LFS.) and adapting to their new surroundings. Congos seem at ease again, and the amanos & smaller fish just swim around - the angles seem to be living at peace with them so far (knock on wood). I'll be keeping a very close eye on the angles - we should get a new tank setup soon just i case... besides, I need a place to put all of the clipping from the water sprite. Those plants are growing by leaps and bounds... and would be a nice starter to setting up a second tank.

Speaking of a new tank, I think this one will be a little lower tech afair. Just no way I can afford a setup like on the 90 gallon twice in such a short time. No clue right now about how big it will be - I just may buy a stand so that I can have two separate tanks sitting next to each other (on the same stand). I'm getting to the point where it would be great to have an isolation tank for treating fish that are sick or newly aquired fish - as well as a tank for growing out plants for the 90 & if the need arrises, a breeding tank. We will see... one thing is certain though - this hobby is very addicting & pleasurable. Haven't had this much fun with aquariums since I started doing this many moons ago :icon_bigg


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Well - looks like it's time for the first trim. Here's a series of pics of the tank as she hs progressed over the last couple of months (total 7 weeks growth on plants).










As can be seen, the groth rate is really taking off. Figuring that this tank is 30" tall - in 5 1/2 weeks the water sprite has grown an average of 4 1/2" per week!!! I never imagined fast growing stem plants would grow that fast!!! So this weekend, it will be time for a haircut, some old plants thrown away, and the first major rescape. Albany Aquarium is supposed to get huge shipment of new plants within the next day or two - so I'm going to be there with my wallet in hand. I'll take some pics after it's all done and hopefully by Tuesday of next week - we'll have a better aquascape in place (looking at a two day overhaul).

I'm planning on trimming the water sprite down 10" on the left side of the tank, removing most of it on the right side, and replaceing that with more mid-heigth plants to allow for a bit more swimming room for my wet pets. I don't know what I'm going to get until after I leave Albany on Monday - but with any luck they'll have exactly what I need to give the tank a bit more textured & structured look to it. I love the jungle look... but it's time for a more eye appealing setup. 

See you all in a few days with my first major update roud:


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## trenac (Feb 15, 2004)

Wow! What a difference 7 weeks makes, can't even see the driftwood. Can't wait to see the pics after the redo.


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Sn8k-
All I can say is "wow!". I also love the jungle look that is most recent, but, as I'm also finding out, I know that the angels and congos require lots of open swimming room. 
My 3 congos are doing fine (I have to admit :icon_redf I did not quarantine them first, but they never went through any adjustment phase or anything.) I did lose one the day after I bought him, but he was replaced for free by the lfs. In a few weeks, I will add another 3-4 of them. I must have two males and one female, because two of them are constantly sparring with eachother, but to no harm. The most dominant one also likes to bully my platies (which I'm surprised by), so i hope you're not planning on adding any of those. I think they would look silly in your very sophisticated tank anyways.
Keep up the gorgeous work!


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## oldfarmhouse (May 18, 2004)

Great looking tank Sn8k. Super photos also. I come to find out Water sprite grows too fast for my liking and looses its beauty when it has a trunk for a root system.All of a sudden its overwhelming but it sure cycles the tank quick. can't wait to see it when you replant. You have a green thumb bro! and love the Angels.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for all the kind comments everyone. roud: 

Well, I had a little bit of a meltdown today with the tank. A little background - I've been having some minor issues with hair algae growing on the plants at the top of the tank. No biggie - the algae eaters have been taking care of it for the most part.. the rest I remove with a sponge and a little rubbing. Anywayz, I noticed that the algae was getting thicker then normal, so I decided it was time to remove the offending crap. Uh ohh - the hair algae issue turned into a nightmare - in less then 1 weeks time the hair algae had turned into the scurge of freshwater planted tanks... 
*the dreaded brush algae* :eek5: .

OK - fast action was now required to remove as much of this stuff as possible... and there was no cutting corners here. As much as I hated to do it, just about everything had the top 10" lopped off of it. On other effected areas, I just prunned to remove the contaminated leaves. This got rid of about 98% of the brush algae - and tommorrow I think it's time to invest in some SAEs to keep the remainder in check.

Actually, if there ever was a time for this to happen today was about as good as it gets as tomorrow I'm going to go to the plant store and get some new additions. However, it was a hard thing to cut off the tops of ALL the crinums knowing that they are now going to have to be replaced. It was a sad thing to do, but neccessary. Hopefully tomorrow will bring better news from the sn8k pit... I remain hopeful that maybe it all will turn out well.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

wonder woman said:


> My 3 congos are doing fine (I have to admit :icon_redf I did not quarantine them first, but they never went through any adjustment phase or anything.) I did lose one the day after I bought him, but he was replaced for free by the lfs. In a few weeks, I will add another 3-4 of them. I must have two males and one female, because two of them are constantly sparring with eachother, but to no harm. The most dominant one also likes to bully my platies (which I'm surprised by), so i hope you're not planning on adding any of those. I think they would look silly in your very sophisticated tank anyways.
> Keep up the gorgeous work!


Naw, they wouldn't look silly at all. It's about what you enjoy keeping and what makes your tank a happy one. Whether it's a bala shark or a guppy, a discus or a platty, they are are cool in their own right and fun to keep. Some of the most enjoyable tanks can also contain the simpliest fish to keep. I like them all :icon_bigg .

My male congos often "spar" with each other... and as you well know it's more of a dance to see who looks bigger/better then anything of hostile intent. I am surprised that your congo is bullying your platties. With any luck it's just a thing he will outgrow as time passes. I don't like seeing that kinda stuff going on in the tank, as I'm sure you don't. Somehow everything ballances out after awhile, and that's when it's great to just sit and watch our wet pets do thier thing. It's a great hobby roud:


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Sn8k-
Sorry to hear about your algae issues. The kind you have (forgot-brush? beard??) is REALLY annoying and hard to miss. But, to make you feel better, it DOES go away eventually. It's a new-tank thing. My 100g has been running since April, and I had a huge algae problem, to where I' like you, drastically trimmed and removed some plants. But it disappeared in 1-2 months tops. Ever since then, I have had NO algae problems at all. But, then, I don't have pressurized co2, and I only have 2.6 wpg, which might be partly why. Have faith, do your water changes, keep your algae eaters happy, and it will go away.
I'm happy that, although two of my congos do spar, no one ever gets hurt, and it just seems to be a territorial thing. The dominant one is the one who also chases the platies. But, again, there's no blood drawn. But the poor things do get occasionally stressed by this and hide in a corner with their fins clamped. Don't know what to do about that.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Yeah - I'm hoping it will go away, patience is a virtue  . Since the tank is 2 months old now, I figured it would have all gone by now (most of it has) and I have confidence that this latest scurge will also go away sometime in the near future. In the meantime, I've decided to go ahead and wait until the brush algae goes away before I add any new plants... so my plans for a new aquascape are on hold until then. It just seems the prudent thing to do at this juncture.



wonder woman said:


> I'm happy that, although two of my congos do spar, no one ever gets hurt, and it just seems to be a territorial thing. The dominant one is the one who also chases the platies. But, again, there's no blood drawn. But the poor things do get occasionally stressed by this and hide in a corner with their fins clamped. Don't know what to do about that.


Well, if it does persist then I'd say your only real option is to take the offending congo back to the LFS for credit or a new one. Sometimes we get a tank ruffian, and in the interest of keeping a happy tank, have to get rid of him for the sake of the other tank inhabitants. It's something I don't like doing, but not doing anything IMO is far worse... the lesser of two evils as some call it.

Anyway, maybe the slack time in getting this tank to settle can be used to good benifit to plan the new scape a little better. There is always something that needs to be done, and having the time to do it right the first time is just going to make it all the better. roud:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Wow that looks great man! I like it how it is, just wish you could see the wood more. maybe thats in the rescaping plans? If so, sounds good to me! Pimpin job dude


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

I love the look of the tank in the 9/13 photo... crisp, clean and some real nice lines in there ! The water sprite will take over a tank in no-time I see you are finding out though huh Mark ... :icon_frow 

Nice looking plant , too bad we cant figure out a way to tame it ! LOL


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## DaAverageJoe (Sep 7, 2004)

Nice tank, looks totally different than the first layout... for the good


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Agreed Buck - I do like the water sprite, but it is growing like a bad weed. I think regular pruning (weekly) is about the only way to keep it in check. In fact, I had to do another prune on it yesterday. :tongue: 

On the tank - I'm still having issues with the brush algae and bought 5 SAEs yesterday to help... so I'm still just pruning to get as much of that stuff out of the tank as possible. I was going to get about 10 of the SAEs, but I forgot my debit card when I went to the store, so I could only spend what cash I had in my wallet :icon_frow . Got the diatom filter running now, so the water looks crystal slear... I'll take that off later tonight and post a pic :icon_bigg .

I was having some really tuff times getting more angles for the tank (healthy specimens are tuff to come by), so I broke down & bought some wilds from a dealer on the east coast. I should be getting some Altums on Tuesday next week to get the number up to 10 for the tank (actually ordered 7, figuring that not all with make the trip).

Anywayz - I'm still holding off purchasing any more plants until the brush algae issues are gone. With any luck - it'll be history in a week or two. Thanks for all the compliments on the tank guys - much apprichiated roud:


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Speaking of plants that grow like weeds, the balansae's are on their way Mark, you should be gettin them Friday or Sat. 


> I should be getting some Altums on Tuesday next week


 The Altums should look sweet in that tank, I hope they all arrive safely. If the balansae's were for this tank then they will fit together nice with the Angels... they go together like peanut butter and jelly... LOL

And dont worry yourself to death over that algae, keep the water fresh and the plants fed and the algae will take care of itself :wink:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks Buck - and I'll just not fret over the algae... it's a passing thing I know. Very much looking forward to the weekend - and thanks again bro roud: 

OK - I promised pics so here they are... not much new, just a little cropping of the tops here and there.



















BTW: My esteemed boss at work notified my yesterday that I have been assigned overtime on Tuesday next week (so very nice of them to allow me a huge 5 days notice  ) - so it looks like I'm going to have to postpone the delivery of the Altums until the following week. Hopefully I can get back in touch with the guy. I explained the situation to my boss, and he seemed unconcerned about the fact that if I can't, $250 worth of fish will die on my doorstep. Yes, I'm more then a little upset about this - and will only serve to force me to start playing hard ball from here on out... and I play to win.


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## pphx459 (Jun 25, 2004)

Awesome tank! I read this thread awhile back, weren't you thinking of putting in discus? You probably posted the answer, but i'm kinda lazy to read through the whole thing again..


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

his wife wanted angels.... so he let her and his discus coem later on from what i know


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

fishyboy said:


> his wife wanted angels.... so he let her and his discus come later on from what i know


Yeap - that's the ticket. :icon_bigg 

To be totally precise, the discus I want (dark red/brown wilds) are not going to be available for quite some time - so instead of waiting, I thought it would be a good idea to get some angles since the wife likes 'em so much (and I have to admit, I like them too). Besides, it gives me a reason to get another tank more sutable for aquascaping (20+ deep and 24" tall) for the angles & congo tetras when the time comes. My existing tank really isn't suited very well for aquascaping due to it's narrowness (only 14"). For me, it's a win, win senario. roud:


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

when you do get another tank is the deeper one front to back goign to be discus and plants or angels and plants since you know you can't have a non-planted tank now


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Sn8k-
Once again, I'm jealous- gorgeous tank! And as for the fish delivery- is your work too far from home to make a quick trip to take care of them, then go back? Or, do you have any friends nearby who are fellow hobbyists or just very careful and caring people? Maybe you can bribe them with clippings or something?


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

so when are you supposted to get your Altums? BTW love the tank still!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

fishyboy said:


> when you do get another tank is the deeper one front to back goign to be discus and plants or angels and plants since you know you can't have a non-planted tank now


The 90 Gallon will be for the discus - they are fairly "slow movers" and the depth should not effect their mobility. The Angles & Congos need a lot of swimming room, and will handle lower temps & brighter lights - so they will do best in the other tank (it should measure 48" long, 24 " deep & 24" tall... I think that actually works out to a 120 gallon). Looks like I'll need a bit more flow from my RO unit to make that happen.

wonder woman - I have to be bruttally honest - I don't trust anyone one to take care of the tank. It's got far too many variables & gadgets to allow a novice to take care of - and the wife uinit has a nasty perpensity to use tap water saying "a little clorine can't hurt the fish. I just smile and nod  . She's a good kid, but not to technical savy. I did talk to my boss who was extremely uncooproative in allowing mw to do what was needed. I really can't blame him - can't shoot the messanger as they say. Being an air traffic controller, it's not like I can hold the flights on the ground until I get back. :wink: . We do have an extreme staffing shortage and a lot of programs that need to be done, and training to do. It's not that I like the situation - it just is what it is. 

pufferfreak - I was able to delay the delivery of the 7 Altums until next week - so it's all good. roud:

On a much sadder note - one of my big angles had a heat attack yesterday and I lost him (at least, that's all I can figure since he just went bonkers and was zipping around the tank at light speed - and then became motionless and passed away). It was very sad. :icon_cry: 

On the happy side - I was FINALLY able to find some new congos - so I added 2 pairs (2 males & 2 females) to the tank. They are enjoying life - just as the new 9 SAE's. I also recieved some nice Ballenese from Buck that I added to the tank yeasterday. A huge thanks to Buck roud: 

OK - time for some new pics........




























EDIT: You know, I told the good people here about a huge plant shipment that was going to arrive at Albany Aquarium 2 weeks ago. Some one went there that weekend and purchased $2500 worth of the stuff, that basically wipped them out. So I guess it ws a good things that I decided to wait a few weeks before I went to get any more plants - still.... I don't think I'll be advertising that fact here any longer. It's one think for someone to take a little advantage of a situation - it's an entirely different affair for someone to be so self centered that they take everything, and leave the scraps for the other peeps here. So from now on - if anyone wants to know when plant shipmets are arriving at Albany- just PM me. I go there every week or two so i know what's going on as far as shipments and when they are due to arrive.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

wow man very nice. I usted to have 2 angels like the ones you have, very lovely guys. Good thing you could get the altums delayed. When you setting up the 120 for the angels? I want to see a Photo Journal! haha Love the congos! Oh btw, hurry up and get that java moss wood stick back in there dangit lol


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> wow man very nice. I usted to have 2 angels like the ones you have, very lovely guys. Good thing you could get the altums delayed. When you setting up the 120 for the angels? I want to see a Photo Journal! haha Love the congos! Oh btw, hurry up and get that java moss wood stick back in there dangit lol


I always get a huge refund from Uncle Sam at tax time - so that's when the new tank will be setup. I've also discovered that Java Moss does NOT like high temps above 80 degrees (it just dies and looks like poopoie after a shoert time). So you won't see and Java moss util the new tank is established and running. 

Thnaks for the props on the tank bro roud:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Dangit! Oh well at least you will have it lol. Idk why i'm so obsessed with it but I am. I'm waitng on my huge peice of wood to get covered with java moss, that will take years! Oh well. I love the tank now! Any aquascaping ideas do you have for the 120? I could think of some...lol


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> Any aquascaping ideas do you have for the 120? I could think of some...lol


I'm planning on keeping this one simple - petrified wood & tons of hairgrass.... amano style


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## Dwarfpufferfish (May 29, 2004)

Cant wait to see those fish in your gorgeous tank!


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

Oh man! THAT WAS MY IDEA! Looks like I didnt have to help you out lol. OH also have giant hairgrass in the backs and on the sides, maybe a clumb of it in the left corner. That would good


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

pufferfreak said:


> Oh man! THAT WAS MY IDEA! Looks like I didnt have to help you out lol. OH also have giant hairgrass in the backs and on the sides, maybe a clumb of it in the left corner. That would good


You got it bro roud: 

The real trick for a tank like that is for all the plumbing to be invisable - so I'll be having the bottom of the tank predrilled for intake & outflow, along with an inline Hydor filter & externam CO2 reactor. I might just spring for an All Glass Aquarium Megaflow along with a black vinyl background - making the overflow system all but invisable. 

And yes, I have to admit, I have been keeping up on your thread about your nano tank :icon_bigg


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Dwarfpufferfish said:


> Cant wait to see those fish in your gorgeous tank!


Thank you very much for the compliment buddy roud: 

I can't wait either :wink:


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

My tank really? Wow! Very nice very nice. My tank is comming along slowly. The dwarf hairgrass is sprouting up new growth but the old growth that came with the plants are kinda dead. I think alot of my cherry shirmp are dying, because I can only see about 3 or 4 at a time, I should have 10. I lost one of my pregant females, maybe I can find her later tonight. I'll update mine soon. Anyways haveing your tank predrilled would be very nice! I tried to have all of my equipment hidin, and I have it all except the Outflow of my XP3. All of it is hidin behind a huge peice of wood. lol Anyways cant wait untill you get the angel tank up and goin!


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## nornicle (Dec 29, 2003)

fantastic... your tank looks beautiful, I am also considering just keeping congos only, they school beautifully.

roud:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

SN8K.. where are you? And how is that Alternanthera I sent you?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> SN8K.. where are you? And how is that Alternanthera I sent you?


I am still here :icon_bigg - just been very busy trying to deal with a little financial BS created when my bank sold my mortgage to another lender... the paperwork got all screwed up and I wound up having to make 2 house payments last month. Wife unit also REALLY messed up her back and has been bed ridden for the last few days - so I just haven't had much free time lately.

Anywayz - the Alternanthera arrived in good shape and although shedding a few leaves over the last week, looks like it will be a very nice addition to the tank once it takes hold and starts growing well. I put it in an unrestricted light area so it should get lots of happy light and do fantastic. Thanks again roud: I don't know if it's location now will be it's final - but I fell it was best for it to get good lighting and start getting a good root structure. Later as the tank develops (and I add a tad bit more lighting) it will probably be relocated in a area that gives the aquascape a nicer & more porportioned focal point.

Right now I gust got back from Albany Aquarium with some new plants (trying to replace a lot of the water sprite right now) and am preparing to get on my weekly maintanence of pruning, getting to floaters off the top, changining the water, scraping the glass, ect. - so I should have a new pic uploaded later this evening.

BTW: My new Altums have been shipped and I'll be picking them up tomorrow morning. Just got off the phone with Al - and the seven 3" fish are deffinately going to complete the stocking of the 90 gal tank. We talked at length about what to feed them, how often, and all about 'em basically. What really surprised me is that these buggers will get 8" to 9" large in a couple of years, so next year's new tank is gonna have to be a big one indeed. :eek5: 

OK - off to do some planting and fun stuff. And again, thanks ever so much for the Alternanthera :icon_bigg


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

very nice, I want to see the angels when they come in, you HAVE TO SHOW US! haha


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

I am glad you are happy with the Alternanthera Mark. It did have a habit of dropping leaves whenever I took it out for pruning. I think it's just a fairly brittle plant. It willl no doubt spring back though. I hope it adds that needed splash of color to your aquascape. 

Best wishes to your wife for a speedy recovery.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Well, here's the new pics... just some minor aquascaping (and again, a special thanks to BOTH overfloater & Buck for the new plants) roud: 




























I'll post comprehensive picture log of the new Altums when they arrive tomorrow. :icon_mrgr


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## chinaboy1021 (May 30, 2003)

sooo pretty


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Best wishes to your wife for a speedy recovery.


Thanks Bob - unfortunately it looks like we'll be making a trip to the emergency room later today. The problem only seems to be getting worse, so hopefully a visit to the professionals (and a little pain medication) will go a long way. Poor thing is in a bad way for sure... hurtin for certin :icon_sad:


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Wow, did you trim the alternanthera or is your tank really that tall?


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## Hop (Mar 27, 2004)

You know I sat here for quite some time and tried to reflect on what it is that makes this tank so appealing. After some thought I think I figured out what pulls me into your tank. First is the healthy colors, second would be the natural layout and third would be the slightly abnormal height associated with the run of the mill planted tanks. I’ve got to tell you that your tank has great appeal as I feel that the natural, unscaped look really works here. Thanks for posting and keeping us updated!!!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Wow, did you trim the alternanthera or is your tank really that tall?


LOL - no trimming at all, that be my 30" tall tank Bob :icon_bigg . It's kind of an unknown on new plants bought/recieved unseen because of the size of the tank and the rather healthy growth of the Echinodorus tennelus (pygmy chain swordplants) which are 5" to 6" tall on average. However, I have little doubt that the alternanthera will start growing out well and to a suitable heigth. Actually, the more I look at it's location in the tank then more I'm liking it. At this juncture, I don't plan on relocating them anythime in the near future.

Hop - thanks for the compliments bro roud: . I really wanted a taller then normal tank that would fit in the 48" area in the dinning room that I had to work with. It has proven to be quite the challenge (you should see me trying to stretch my arm to the bottom of the tank to add plants that I can't use the planting tongs on - I have to drain 6" of water and stick my head & shoulder inside to reach the bottom. LOL ). My wife thinks I'm a bit "over my head" so to speak :wink: . This kinda adds to the problem of not being able to locate stuff exactly where I'd like it to be sometimes, it's a hit and miss affair - but I get close most of the time. 

BTW: I picked up the Altums 30 minutes ago - all 7 arrived heathy and fat - no really visable signs of stress (save one, with clamped tail fins). I'll post pics later - right now I just have about 20 minutes before I start adding tank water to the bags. The wife unit doesn't really want to go to the hospital until later anyway (wanting to get some more sleep) so it's all working out fine so far for me today. Gonna be a busy one though, that's for sure.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

I'm sorry about your Wife! I love the tank! The alternanthera looks great! Cant wait to see the altums


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## trenac (Feb 15, 2004)

Your tank is amazing, just when you think it can't look any better it dose roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

The big Altum shipment came today - and I can finally say that the tank is now fully stocked :icon_bigg (woot!!). As I said in a previous post, I thought it would be fun to capture all the trials and tribulations on my digital - so here goes.

The box as it arrived at the house after a quick trip to the local FedEx pickup facility this 
morning. Even though it was a rainy day outside, the arrival brought a lot of sunshine 
into my day. 








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Opening the box, you soon see the normal stuff - a big styrophome box stuffed with 
the fish and newspapers.








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, after we got all the paper out there sat a huge plastic bag of fish (the first of 4) 
and a heat pack.








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Taking off the first big bag, there was another one containing 7 individually, double-bagged 
fish transportation devices (LOL).








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

OK, the fish were almost ready - so it was time to take off the canopy, turn on the lights, 
and get cracking.








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

OK the next step was the obvious one... taking out the individual bags and placing them 
in the tank to get the temp settled (45 minutes) before adding 1/4 cup of tank water 
to the bags slowly at 15 minute intervals.








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

The blue water in the bags kinda confused me - but after a little thinking it was obvious 
that it would have been much easier for the supplier to see if there were any leaks in the 
bags. The fish certainly didn't seem to ming the food coloring used.
*EDIT:*_ I found out that the blue color was an additive used to sedate fish for shipping_








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Overall pic of the tank with the new bags-o-fish.








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Our smalled domestic Angle we've named "little one" took an immediate interest in the new 
arrivals. She hovered around the bags for almost the entire time before the new arrivals 
were released.








-----------------------------------------------------------------------

After about 2 1/2 hours, it was time to start adding 1/2 cups of tank water to the bags in 
15 minute intervals to speed things along. These next two pics just prior to releasing the 
Altums.
















-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Awe - Altums in the tank... 4 hours after the process began. I must admit - I like them 
quite a lot. Much different then the domestics. The stripes and the general color of the 
Altums are more brown - and the Altums do not have a red eye like the domestics. 
You can easily tell the differences in the fin patterns in the remaining pics.





















































-----------------------------------------------------------------------

OK - all went well so far today, but as I was warned (and anticipated), the existing domestic angles were acting rather aggressivly towards the Altums. Now that it has been a few hours - all seems to have settled down to a somwhat more normal occational "sparring". Most of this will subside over the next few days, but they are Angles and will act the way nature intended them to behave... I will just have to keep a close eye out on the tank to insure the tank remains happy for all residents.

Well, it's time to take care of all the fur people and the wife unit... so till next update: Thanks for visiting my journal.... and as always, any comments or helpful suggestions are most welcomed and apprichiated. roud:


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## Jumbotummy (Feb 12, 2004)

WOAAAAA.....
Those are some nice looking altums!! roud:


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

The blue water is probably b/c of Methylene blue or some other additive--not just food coloring.

Beautiful Altums!


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## pphx459 (Jun 25, 2004)

Great looking fish, I love it~


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## FrozenAssassin (Jan 29, 2004)

LIKE OMG! HOW MAD LOOKING IS THAT TANK. INSPIRATIONAL!!! roud: roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

John P. said:


> The blue water is probably b/c of Methylene blue or some other additive--not just food coloring.
> 
> Beautiful Altums!


Thanks John - and you were spot on about the blue color of the water. It's something called bag buddies & used when shipping fish to kinda sedate them.


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

sn8k said:


> Thanks John - and you were spot on about the blue color of the water. It's something called bag buddies & used when shipping fish to kinda sedate them.


No problemo ... this one looks like he's well sedated: :icon_bigg


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

John P. said:


> No problemo ... this one looks like he's well sedated: :icon_bigg


Well, sometimes I like to have a "bag buddy" myself LOL . In my case, that would be a cold brew. :wink:


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## amber2461 (Sep 26, 2004)

Awesome tank and of course, fishes too. roud:


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## derekkim (Apr 26, 2004)

Wow.. btw, i love the colour of the blue water


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

wow very nice dude, love the Altums, I've always wanted some


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## Vinlo (Mar 29, 2003)

Wow thos are some nice fish. Every time I see someone with some Altums in a good looking tank, I always kick myself in the rear for not going the Altum route. Ahwell.. next tank. 

Looking good Mark.


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## m3th0d (Jun 27, 2004)

Man, this is seriously one of my favorite threads... so many great pictures! And your tank is looking really nice.

Where'd you get those Altums btw?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for all the compliments guys :icon_bigg 

m3th0d - I got the Altums from Al Sabetta... he's a supplier of wilds & posts over at SimplyDiscus.com as brewmaster15. Very nice guy roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

It's been a week since I introduced the 7 new Altums to the tank, and I must say it's been a lot of worrying wether or not the new fish would work out well. My first concern with them is that the bigger Scalares seemed to be picking on them a lot - that all went away within a few days and they are now getting along quite well together. In fact, the Altums are not shy at all and come out to the front of the tank quite often... even schooling sometimes with the Scalares which does make me very happy indeed. :icon_bigg 

My second concern was that the new arrivals were simply not eating. They seem to be eating better now since I started feeding them the Ocean Nutrition Formula 1 flake food, but they are still not eating as much as the other fish in the tank. I am holding out hope that by next week they'll be as ravenous as the others in the tank... and I'll have to make a determination then if I need to start using frozen foods (something I'm not really thrilled about due to the much higher bioload caused by feeding that type of foods). 

Other then that, everything is working out well in the tank for the most part. I'm still removing brush algae weekly - and have pretty much come to the conclution that I'm going to have to start really watching the water parameters closer and dosing the correct amount of macros & micros. Believe it or not I've yet to begin any dosing regiment - just adding K2SO4 & KNO3 weekly, and some florish iron occationally. So I'll be ordering the full monty from Greg Watson later this week and start dosing as I should have been for awhile. My lazyness in not dosing PO4 has probably been my downfall - and I really have no good excuse for not doing it. Hopefully when I get on my new work schedule next year I'll have the time needed to work on this - but until then I'm just going to have to find the time to do it.

OK then - I really can't post an update without any new pics, so here they are roud: 

Altums









Front tank pic









Corner view









As always, any comments or suggestions are most apprichiated... 
& thanks for visiting my journal. roud:


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## Edouard (Apr 30, 2004)

Wow!
As always the tank is beautiful!
The altums are just wonderfull. They look much better than the scalares in my opinion.

Don't you fear you will have to many fishes when the scalares and the altums grow to their maximum size?
I'm impressed by your ability to plant this very narrow tank roud: 

Keep us informed :wink:


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## sanj (Jan 11, 2004)

Hi Sn8K,

I cant help thinking that we have similarish set up...ok dimensions are different and I dont have Altums.

But I have a jungle and Congos and Wild Scalares.

Do you have soft water where you are? Mine is moderately hard although co2 injections brings Ph down a little. I guess no good for Altums. 

I have five Angels in my aquarium 47x20x28 (H). Do you think I could keep more without any problems? Others are 7 congos, 4 rummy (want to increase a bit) 3 cardinals ( again increase, but not sure about angels picking the moff) 3x SAE, 3x Zebra loaches and an ancistrus.

I did have more cardinals and rummy ,but they died off had whitespot. Als on ot sure if Angels being naughty although the remainder have been fine for a couple of months.

Sorry for ramble, excellent tank btw.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

sn8k said:


> I'll have to make a determination then if I need to start using frozen foods (something I'm not really thrilled about due to the much higher bioload caused by feeding that type of foods).
> 
> and have pretty much come to the conclution that I'm going to have to start really watching the water parameters closer and dosing the correct amount of macros & micros. Believe it or not I've yet to begin any dosing regiment - just adding K2SO4 & KNO3 weekly, and some florish iron occationally.
> 
> My lazyness in not dosing PO4 has probably been my downfall



Snake,

For what it's worth, I've been feeding frozen foods exclusively since I set up my 46g in March, 2004. I bought NO3, K, P, and Mg from Greg as well, and after a little trial and error....only use the NO3 and K now. My tank gets enough Mg from using Kent RO right, and the P comes from the frozen foods. Mind you, my P still stays below the 'recommended' levels, so it isn't as if the food is loaded with it - just enough, it seems. I buy those pre-cubed packets of bloodworms and brineshrimp; giving the tank 2 cubes of worms and one of shrimp each day. This is a lot, I know, but even with all this load in the tank, I still have to dose NO3 weekly. 

....It goes without saying that water changes are a must, but that should be done with any tank.

Grrrrrreat looking Altums, btw. I almost bought a pair of them when I first set up...but went with discus instead (for my centerpiece fish) because I was afraid that angels would eat my feather-fin rainbows.

Really enjoy the thread roud:


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

Awesome pictures and a great journal (it's residing on my desktop right now  ).

It'll serve as an inspiration as I'm in the process of setting up a 90 gallons to house some altums as well (just four of them  ). Those altums of yours look very nice. The four that I have are just a tad larger than yours, as from looking at the finnage. If you like them now, just wait a bit longer, when those fins become more elongated.


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## Buck (Oct 13, 2002)

Beautiful Altums... ! roud: 

Once you get your dosing routine down you will be able sit back and enjoy the tank... dont let that algae get away from you now, youve worked to hard !


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks to everyone for the compliments on the tank :icon_bigg !! 

I really have been enjoying myself with the new tank, even though it has been a lot of work. Right now I've been in a little slump as far as free time (worked overtime today and have more coming down the pike), the wife unit getting laid up with her back problems, and a little screwup with my mortage lenders (had to double pay last months house payment when the bank sold the note to a different lender)... so I've been a bit behind the power curve. things are getting back to normal now with the wife & the cash flow issues - but overtime is going to be kicking my butt for the next 12 months. Anywayz.....

Buck - no way am I gonna let this algae stuff get any more then a slight foothold. I still remove most all the brush algae I see every week - and hopefully the dosing regime will eliminate it all together. A long time ago, I lost a nice planted tank to this stuff - never again.... whatever it takes. roud: 

unirdna - interesting notes you have on your tank and the feeding/dosing requirements. I think I may try frozen bloodworms after all - but not as an everyday food. Maybe every other day or every third day to ease into the additional bioload/work involved with it.

sanj - Yes, I do have _very_ soft water. I use an RO/DI water and add Kent RO Right. After about 2 days in the holding tank - the pH settles at 6.5, same as my tank water. Using a pH controller and pressurized CO2 makes the job of keeping things stabilized easy. You said you have 5 angles in you tank currently, and were wondering if your tank could support more. That's going to depend on their size I'm afraid... more on this in the next paragraph. As far as them getting along and not being naughty - well, that is going to depend too - but from what I've gathered on reccomendations here... about 10 regular sized angles are about as many as you should have in a 90 gallon. You should also know that if a pair mates and lays eggs - then you better think about getting the eggs out of the tank asap as angles defend their brood with unrelenting vigor. 

Edouard - In about 1 year I will have to thin out the number of angles in the tank. 11 adults in a 90 gallon is just too many - and in 2 years when the Altums reach maturity, they should be 8" to 9" (maybe larger) so the math there just doesn't add up to a happy tank. I should be able to get away with 5 or 6... but any more then that would be too many large fish for a 90 gallon. I'm hoping to get another larger tank setup sometime in the future... and will more then likly move the angles & congos into that one. However plans sometime change and I may just have to sell/trade some of the angles I have when the time comes. 

Thanks again for all the suggestions/comments guys roud:


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

*Brush algae melting away!!!* roud: 
I guess it's about time - and I'm very happy that my intuition told me it was time to start dosing - because I think this was the real ticket for the brush algae issues I was having. 

Just a quickie update - but last week I replaced 2 of my 6700K CF bulbs with the 9325K CF fixtures as well as finally dosing the tank for the proper amounts of NO3 (10ppm) & PO4 (1ppm). You could see the results overnight as there was a noticable difference in the algae (for the better :icon_bigg ). I would have started dosing earlier, but I was afraid I would have been jumping the gun - dosing too soon and not allowing the tank to settle... which could have caused a lot more algae issues then I already had at this juncture. Reguardless - the dosing worked out very well for me at this stage of the tank - and the replacement of 2 of the CF bulbs was icing on the cake. Plants are gowing like mad now, pearling like the dickens and making a lot of good O2 for the fishies.

So enough of the chatter - here are the results.........





































I have noticed that the pinkish hue the new 9325K bulbs have do have a tendency to wash out the saturation of the green colors in the plants, but IMHO it certainly looks more "natural" then before and I couldn't be happier. 

I don't have any plans in the immediate future other then to just keep on top of the dosing and water parameters. No rescaping for the next few weeks (well, maybe a few new plants, but nothing major). I'm just glad to have gotten rid of that algae scurge - and hopefully for good this time.

As always, any comments or suggestions are most apprichiated... 
& thanks for visiting my journal. roud:


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Lookin' great Mark. I wish I had gone with that temperature bulb instead of the 6500 (6700?) ones that I bought. Looks like that's what I'll do in another 4-5 months or so.

I, too, just started dosing. I had forgotten what growth & pearling looked like! Are you using Greg Watson dry ferts, or another? I bought Seachem macros & Flourish . . .next time it'll be Watson.


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

i have the same light .. the 6,700's are just to green by themself. So i threw in 2 9325K's i had from my aga light strip. It's a little nicer, still not as nice as just the 9325K's but nicer...


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Thanks for the nice comments on the tank John roud: 

I actually got 4 of the 9325 bulbs, but found that the color of the bulbs washed out the greens far too much for my viewing pleasure (I really liked the super saturated green color the plants used to have) - so I decided to mix them 50/50 with the 6700K. Now I have my replacements bulbs for next year :icon_bigg . I am also planning on upping the light in the tank sometime next year - raising it to approx 3.5 to 4 watts per gallon so I can grow some red plants... but I haven't decided which way to go as far as K ratings on the additional lights I will add. We'll have to wait and see.

I started using the Fleet enema along with a supply of potassium sulfate & potassium nitrate, and florish iron (I already had these for the day when I decided to start dosing) - but I just recieved my first order from Greg Watson yesterday, so I'll be using his CSM+B Plantex starting tomorrow.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Looking good Mark. Doesn't look like the alternanthera is growing much though. Is it jsut me?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Overfloater said:


> Looking good Mark. Doesn't look like the alternanthera is growing much though. Is it jsut me?


No, sadly it just seems to be barely holding it's own... it needs more light, or more nutrients, both of which will be coming sooner rather then later I hope. I remain optimistic that she'll make it through


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## [PlantMan] (Nov 8, 2004)

Very impressive setup! Good job! roud: 

BTW, what kind of piping(?) is that? And what are the advantages of those over ordinary flexible tubing?


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## teddo10 (Nov 9, 2004)

He Mark, great looking setup.
The CF you mentioned are Compact Fluorescent tubes are they? Are they the same as T5 fluorescent tubes? (Here in Europe T5 are finding there way into the Aquarium hobby, already used in seawater a lot)
I'm changing from high pressusure mercury lamps to T5 80 W bulbs (1x 4000K, 1x 6500K).
(400 gallon planted tank)
Ed


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## travis (Nov 17, 2004)

sn8k - I'm new to Planted Tank and just spent an incredibly enjoyable hour reading your journal. You are a man after my own heart when it comes to high-tech setups. I thought I was doing well with mine until I saw the fantastic job you've done with yours. I have now revised my ideas of what the cabinet of my tank should look like  

As to your bulbs washing out the greens, I've never used the 9325Ks before, they don't come in 96w CF. I run a 50/50 mix of 6700K/10000K and love it. I actually used to have 25% of the lighting as Actinic 03 (fantastic for bringing out certain colors) but switched them out to increase my total usable wattage.

I hope your wife is now doing much better. I've never kept one before. Do they require a lot of maintenance? :tongue: 

Well, thanks for the inspiring journal, it's already given me some very interesting ides! 

teddo - I believe that CF bulbs are the same diameter as T5 bulbs, they are just bent back on themselves in a 'U' shape so they inevitably get more strike-back than a T5 setup of similar wattage. I would love to use T5s if they were more affordable over here in the States.


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

travis said:


> I hope your wife is now doing much better. I've never kept one before. Do they require a lot of maintenance? :tongue:


You have no idea ... :wink: 

You're right ... this is a great project by Mark. Kudos to him!


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

sn8k said:


> No, sadly it just seems to be barely holding it's own... it needs more light, or more nutrients, both of which will be coming sooner rather then later I hope. I remain optimistic that she'll make it through


Alternanthera is not picky. Just make sure it doesn't run out of NO3.


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

Mark, the tank looks great! Yeah, I just got rid of my fuzz algae about a month ago!! Those altums are looking great!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Sorry guys - I took a few days away from the fish hobby to do that car hobby thing. Almost bought a new car, but decided against it after looking at the bottom line (6 years of monthly payments isn't exactly what I call fun anyway). Must be that holiday spirit thing, I was just itching to buy me something new... glad to see that temporary insanity has gone away. :icon_conf 

Thanks to everyone for the props on the tank - everything is still growing like a bad weed since I started dosing... with the algae is diminishing daily. I think I've finally hit the "sweet spot" on the aquarium. So much happier to be able to look at the tank and see healthy growth and hungry fishies - tranquility at it's best.

--------------------------
[PlantMan] - the piping I used was schedule40 PVC. It's main advantage is keeping everything orderly below decks. It really has no beneficial advantages over regular tubing, in fact, with all the 90 degree bends it actually is inferior to the regular tubing as it does restrict flow. Still, I think the reduced flow is worth the price of dangling hoses I don't think I'll ever have a tank again that isn't plumed with the PVC - it just makes everything look slick.

--------------------------
teddo10 - Yes, the CF I mentioned are Compact Fluorescent tubes. Travis gave you an excellent explanation on what they are... and just like him, wished they were a bit less expensive. That tank of yours is a real monster - super size me :biggrin: . Sure wish I had the room for something like that. I remember seeing the pics of it in this forum... it's stunning!!! I'm sure the new lighting will do a great job at growing those beautiful swords of yours.

--------------------------
travis - We must share that kindred spirit of high tech, don't we. All those gadgets and stuff kinda makes things more "exotic" - but we both know you don't need all that to get great results. It just makes things a little more easy, and a little more precise. That's what I call fun!! Glad to see that my journal has given you a few inspirations... it's a rewarding feeling seeing that others are getting some good use out of my escapades. 

I honestly don't know why they don't make the 9325k bulbs for 96watt applications... I know you would really love 'em. Your setup is almost identical though (mixing the 6700k with the 10000k) and I have a feeling they yield similar color rendition to mine. Here's hoping the 96 watters become available for you. 

And a huge thanks for mentioning the wife unit and your best wishes. She has been doing quite well for the last month or so - stuff like that makes you really aware of what things in life are the most important.

--------------------------
Overfloater - it's just so sad bro... everything else is taking off like gangbusters. I just feel terrible that I can't seem to get the Alternanthera to do well. As painful as it sounds, it looks like it's days in the tank are numbered. I wish I had better news for you buddy - we'll give it a couple of more weeks though - hopefully it will take off like the rest of the tank.

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Georgiadawgger - Fuzz algae gone is all good roud: - glad to hear it. Yeah, I absolutely love those Altums... so regal and proper looking. I'm very tickled that they are doing so well in the tank now that they seem to have settled in. I have one that is starting to take a dominate posture with the other Altums, so the pecking order is being established as it is in nature. God, I love this stuff. :icon_bigg 

--------------------------

Again, thanks to everyone for visiting my journal - I'll post some new pics in a couple of days (it's a jungle again). :icon_mrgr


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## ninoboy (Jan 26, 2004)

I haven't followed your journal for quite a while. WOW. what a progress roud: 



> Eheim 2028 Pro II - 8w AquaUV Sterilizer - 48" Aqualight 2-65W 6700K & 2-55W 9325K - (4) 3/4Watt Aqualight Lunar Blue-Moon-Glow LEDs - 160lbs EcoComplete substrate - Dupla Therm 500 substrate heater w/Temp Control - Hydor ETH300 inline heater - pressurized Co2 w/pH controller - Reactor 1000 CO2 - & lots of other misc. crap


There is nothing else you can add to that awesome list. When I set up a new tank, I always use whatever spares I have in my garage. Sometimes I wish I had nothing and start everything fresh like yours.


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

Things seem to be settling down for you personally, which is good to hear. Thanks for the update on the tank. I'm still using it as a wallpaper on my desktop at home and it serves as an inspiration while I'm planning out the 90G. I just planted 6 bunches of Lilaeopsis late last night (started on the under the stand work, and eventually got into planting at 1:30 in the morning). I'm gonna readjust my altums after things become more finalized (didn't want them in there while I was fiddling around, even though the tank has a school of P. denisonii in there).

Can't wait to see how the tank has grown in and the evolution of it.

BTW, I know what you're talking about spending during this time of the year. I just ordered some new 96W (one of them blew out on me after the clip in the middle melted, b/c I thought I could get away with it w/out the fan on :icon_redf ). Ordered the same bulbs which are currently in there: (2) 6700k and (2) 10000k from hellolights. Then spent some more dough on a new camera. Talk about breaking the bank before the season really gets into the swing of things.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Here's some pics of the tank as of 11/24/04

You can easily tell that it is desperate need of a good prune, especially the top floaters. Last week, there was only 7 individual big leaves on the top... this week there are easily 3 times that number - and it's certainly making it hard for the light to penetrate and the plants below are starting to show it. Tomorrow I'll have to do a pretty hefty prune before I go to work... so with that said........ 

*Welcome to the jungle* :icon_bigg


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

very nice looking, love the look still


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

Gotta love that jungle-like look. Very lush and entrancing.  

Those P. scalares have definitely put on some size, but the altums are growing in very nicely also.


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Nice jungle! and you wonder why the Alternanthera does not grow? :tongue: Looks like you spent as much as I did on high tech gadgets :icon_bigg


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

Awesome growth, that jungle style suits this tank well especially with the Altums in there. Try cutting down the floating leaves, maybe that will shed some light on the Alternanthera.


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## Hop (Mar 27, 2004)

Still quite striking! The jungle appearence brings out a natural look. Great work!


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Yo snake,

How those Altums doing?


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## Ahkuma (Dec 5, 2004)

I just read this whole thread from the beginning. It was an hour and a half of bliss. 

You can sure take some great pictures with that old 2 megapixel camera. 

It almost seems unfair to the regular angels to be in the same tank with the Altums. It's hard to compete with the beauty of an Altum.

Are you still going to get that 90 gallon?

I would like to see some pics of the clean up crew as well.


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

how about some updates sn8k??  
it would be great to see how your amazing tank has progressed.. roud:


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## Jdinh04 (Mar 15, 2004)

Same here, would like to see updates. I am very addicted to your tank!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Updates.... well - not too much good news to report. 2 of the Altums past away (1 yesterday, and the other last week) :icon_frow - they just stopped eating for some reason and there wasn't too much I could do for them other then to offer food. All the other fish in the tank seem to be doing great... healthy appities and all, so I'm at a distinct loss to determine why the 2 stopped eating.  

Other then that - the tank is looking very much the same as it did in the last pics. It is certainly in need of a few new plants, and could use some more lighting so that I can grow some of the other more light demanding ones - but that's going to have to wait until next month when 'disposable income' is more plentiful (Christmas tapped me out :tongue: ).

I'll take a few pics tomorrow evening and post up roud:


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## sanj (Jan 11, 2004)

Hunger strike gone wrong?

I like your tank Sn8k...reminds me a bit off mine . I havent managed to post pics on here yet, my camera is useless , my dad made some short vids, not sure if i can upload onto here.

I am removing my angels to a 240 litre and replacing with discus (if the delivery man ever finds the time to deliver) lol.

Thought about adding Altums with discus, then thought parasites...then thought poorly discus


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Did you treat the Altums for internal parasites when you first received them?

Sorry to hear about that.


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

Yup, make sure that you deworm them. I did that when I first got the altums and haven't lost one yet. Just added another couple and I'm pretty sure they came in with worms. They're eating, but not as much and the other four have lost a bit of their appetite. Time to deworm them all together...


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Ibn-
I know it's pretty common practice to de-worm cats, but fish? Is it really so common (at least in angels)? Or only in wild-caught ones? Is that something I should consider as a preventative after I purchase angels?


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## GDominy (Jul 30, 2002)

Camalanus worms are quite common with garage bred angels out here... not sure how it is everywhere.. but out here I have to de-worm fish about twice a year.. Usually wild caught fish (rams, loaches, etc) kept in infected tanks with distributors.. or Angels....


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Yep, angels and discus often need deworming. I never paid much attention to the poor appetite of my angelfish until I dewormed my discus. The angel just got a free ride, and bamm, its appetite shot way up.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

this is the first time ive heard about deworming. How does one do this? and what symptoms do fish show?


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Marc said:


> this is the first time ive heard about deworming. How does one do this? and what symptoms do fish show?


Poor appetite, often spit out food, fish look thin. Some worms(Camalanus) might hang from anus(might be swollen). I use Levamisole for Camalanus, praziquantel for tapeworm, piperazine is another general dewormer. There are a few others.


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Wow! Good to know. No symptoms with my angels right now- they feed like piranhas- but at least I'll know what's wrong with them if they STOP eating.
But now that I think about it, I do have 1 angel that, although he eats really well, does occasionally have a tiny, thin, short red strand (only about 1/16-1/8" long, looks like a tiny red thread) that hangs out his anus. I had always assumed that that was either the begining or ending of a poop string, but is that something I should be worried about? Other than that, he's fine, although obviously not the most dominant of my 4 angels. He's not paired up, whereas my other 3 angels have bred a few times, so he occasionally gets picked on, especially by the biggest one. Should I worry?

Thanks guys!


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

nope, thats neon orange poo. :tongue: kinda wierd right?


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

I don't think it's poo- poo is usually lumpy and brown (sorry for the visual, everyone!). This looks more like a very short, very fine red thread. But it doesn't move or wiggle. It just sticks out about 1/16" from the fish's anus.
Does anyone have, or can they direct me to, pictures of fish infected with these worms?


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## Ibn (Nov 19, 2003)

I think that both Sha and Gareth covered it pretty well already. roud: 

Worms aren't usually commonly found in tank bred/captive raised fish, but it's pretty common in wild caught fish. Altums are rarely bred in captivity and even when they are, very few are sold. The ones which are out on the market are more than likely to be wild caught. Always deworm any fish from the wild (hopefully before they're introduced into the tank w/other fish), just in case.


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## observant_imp (Jun 30, 2004)

The red threads from the vent do sound like camallanus worms. IME they are really tough to get rid of--you'll have to get the fish to eat the medicine (guess who's fond of fussy eaters :icon_frow ).


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Yikes! But this angel eats without any problems. And I've seen it before, but have never had problems with these guys. It seems to appear only occasionally.


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

observant_imp said:


> The red threads from the vent do sound like camallanus worms. IME they are really tough to get rid of--you'll have to get the fish to eat the medicine (guess who's fond of fussy eaters :icon_frow ).


Yes, that's camallanus. In my experience, fish infected with this particular pest can have normal appetite. Levamisole is pretty effective for me. I do it the second time after couple of weeks to get the unhatched eggs missed by the fist time. No need to use in food, 24 hours bath is enough. Fish reaction is mild(slight reduction in appetite) to no reaction under normal dose (2ppm). I overdosed grossly(>5x) once, fish quit eating for a week.


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## pufferfreak (Oct 19, 2003)

them angels are so beautiful! got any updates?


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

uhh... the bright orange things always fall off the angel, and often get squished against things, so i thought it was poo........


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## observant_imp (Jun 30, 2004)

shalu--where do you get your hands on Levamisole? I gave up on trying to treat camallanus a decade ago--I could never find anything that actually worked.


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

observant_imp said:


> shalu--where do you get your hands on Levamisole? I gave up on trying to treat camallanus a decade ago--I could never find anything that actually worked.


I got levamisole from a pigeon supplies place


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## observant_imp (Jun 30, 2004)

thanks--I get really upset at myself anytime I bring home something that has them. Now I'll be able to fix them. roud:


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

wonder woman said:


> Does anyone have, or can they direct me to, pictures of fish infected with these worms?



















More: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=7352&highlight=parasite+anus


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Oh, crap.
That's it. Now I'm bummed. I've only got the one angel exhibiting that right now, so what should I do, take him out and treat him seperately? He's been in my 100g almost since I set it up. I have had a few fish infected with it over that timespan, but I don't think I still have any of them. They died. :icon_frow 
Maybe this afternoon, I'll post a question about steps in treating it over in Fish or something, so I don't continue to hijack Sn8k's thread. 
Thanks for all you help, everyone! At least now I know what it is!


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Don't worry about the hyjacking Wonder Woman - it's all good roud: . We all are learning something and that is why we are here to begin with.

On that note - I never dewormed my Altums - so that's something worth investigating. I haven't noticed any abnormal "short red worm thingie" hanging from the anus... but I really haven't been looking so I'll check tomorrow and report back. 

Now it's time for the pics :icon_bigg 




























Altums & Congo Tetras









Scalars - the one on the left is the dominate male "Butch" - he has paired with the Scalar just below him and he makes sure they are the only angles on the left side of the tank. The Scalar on the right is the another male (almost identical in size to Butch) who we named "Max" - those two are constantly 'sparring'. They don't ever hurt each other, but their display is quite a sight to see.









Tank issues: I let the Water Sprite grow a little "too big" and it cut off much of the light to the Echinodorus tennelus, which caused them to grow much bigger then they should be. I will eventually need to replace them, but not after getting some new plants to replace the water sprite. I still have a slight problem with light getting to the front of the tank - so I plan on getting another fixture (2-55Watt 9325k bulbs) for that purpose. Other then that, the tank is doing quite well. I can stare at it for hours - it's deffinately my best effort to date. roud: 

Thanks for visiting my journal - and as always, a special thanks to everyone for the compliments/tips. They all help and are always welcomed. :icon_bigg


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Always look forward to updates on this thread. Nice work! I was thinking you had been blasted by algae or something.


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## wonder woman (Oct 30, 2003)

Mark-
As always, your tank is gorgeous. Yours is an example of a tank done right the FIRST time, unlike the tanks of some of us, who are on a huge learning curve. I really love the wild jungle look. Although Amano's stuff is also great, I'm not as crazy about "manicured" greenery.
The angels and congos must have thought they died and went to heaven! 
I hope you love your school of congos as much as I love mine- I don't believe there's a prettier fish out there, and then, put them in a group with a few females!
Please keep a vigilant eye out for camallanus worms- I just discovered one of my (store-bought) angels has it, so I have to treat my whole 100g tank. You don't want to lose any more of the little guys.
Keep up the beatiful work!


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## Georgiadawgger (Apr 23, 2004)

Those Altums are looking really good! Do they have enough room to swim?


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

John - I know I've been absent from the forums since November... I've just been kept really busy with work and have had an unusually high amount of web design and graphic projects along with a new server and message board upgrades. Keeping up with everything just got to be too much, so I've had to keep my forum activity down lately. Most of the projects are tapering off now - so I'll be visiting here again more often.

Wonder Woman - thanks for the compliments girl :icon_bigg . I'd like to think the fish are happy campers in the aquatic world I created for them - they certainly do like feeding time and seem to enjoy themselves. Yes, I do love the congos... they have calmed down a lot since the day I got them - maybe that has to do with the fact that the angles are getting bigger and establishing themselves. I don't know really, but they do school better then most and aren't too shy. They're just a great breed to have in the tankl and really compliment the angles. Over the next few months I think I will actually start to try to gradually add a little bit of structure to the tank. Not really going for that manicured look - but more diversity in plants and a bit of aquascaping should make the jungle a little more civilized. :icon_wink 

I looked closely at all the angles today - no camallanus worms were evident. But I do think I should watch them more closely for evidence of worms in general. The Altums do tend to spit out their food on occation, and they just don't look as fat as the Scalars do - so I'll be reading up on the worm issues and taking appropriate action.

Georgiadawgger - I really am trying to keep the plants trimmed a bit more then I have in the past to make sure there is more swimming room now that the fish are growing bigger. May not seem that way though - the plants just grow so fast it's hard to keep on top of that all of the time. It's not something I'm going to loose any sleep over - healthy growing plants are a good thing :icon_mrgr


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## ghostcarp (Feb 10, 2005)

cool tank, 5 star


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Well - my Scalars laid eggs the other day... I didn't really see the spawn nor did I realize what had happened. I came home from work and noticed something strange - the angles grouped together is a non-typlical location of the tank. After a brief look see - it was evident that "Butch" had *all* of the other Angles hunkering down in attempt to get away from his wrath (he is and has been a very aggressive male lately - now I know why). 

Now for the sad news.... I had to remove the eggs from the tank due to Butch's aggressiveness torward his fellow tank mates - and didn't have a separate tank for raising the eggs... so I had to destroy them. The good thing that came from this is that knowing this will happen again in the near future - I am already looking at another tank setup and what's needed to raise the little angles. I still feel very bad about having to do what was needed - but that's also tempered with the knowledge that it was for the best in this case. 

This happened last Friday... and everything is back to normal now. I will certainly be much better prepared next go around roud:


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

sn8k said:


> I still feel very bad about having to do what was needed - but that's also tempered with the knowledge that it was for the best in this case.


Don't sweat it, Mark. Even when you get your fry tank set up, you'll still only be able to raise a fraction of the eggs those angels will lay. It takes at least a couple months for eggs to go from mom-n-pop to fish store, and the parents (if well fed, which applies to yours by the looks of things) can spawn once every two weeks or so. 

Better to remove the eggs than to allow all that agression. There was never any emotional scarring in my tanks .....unless you count my wife; she couldn't bear it :hihi:
Ted


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

How about some updates mark?roud:


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## Barbels (Aug 3, 2004)

Mark,
Very impressive. Nice, nice, nice.
I like the looks of your timers, are they good uns? If so, would you please tell me where you got them?
Thank U.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

I got the timers from a friend who no longer needed them - but you can buy similar units at Orchard Suppy Hardware, Home Depot, Lowes, ect. They are just digital timers - looking for them at the hardware store should yield good results. They work well - sometimes I have to reset them on occation, but it beats the crap out of having to do it all manually all of the time... and the other mechanical one's "ticking" all the time drive me crazy. :icon_frow 


> How about some updates mark?


Well - there in lies a problem. I had been fighting some disease/parasite that infected my tank for the last month or so. Sadly, it claimed over 50% of my angles (I only have 4 left) - and the medication/constant water changes/lack of fertilizing for fear this was an issue with the disease... was not kind to my plants... lost all of the water sprite. On a happy note the problem seems to be gone now and the tank (and the inhabitants) are recovering well. I think I traced the problem down to something that was in the holding tank - my bad for not cleaning that out regularly. I really feel bad that it was probably an error on my part that probably caused all of this, but we live and learn I guess. That's a mistake I'll never make again. roud: 

I'll post some "post screw up" pics tomorrow.


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Pics of the tank today. Not much to llook at really, but we'll be doing something about that soon enough roud:


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

i see only two altums... The rest are hiding, right? You better not have sold any roud:


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## Lorenceo (Jan 29, 2004)

Sorry about the altums Mark
Oh well, at least you still have 4 left right?
Look at it this way, you get to have the fun of setting another tank up 

EDIT: I'm getting red X's on the above pics now..


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## sn8k (May 24, 2004)

Only 2 altums & 2 scalars made it (for the total of 4) :icon_sad: 
The altums were more suseptable to the problem I had.

Fixed the pic links  . You're right though, replanting the tank should prove to be fun.


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## Nekentros (Jun 11, 2005)

Awsome tank!

Could you post your routine for maintaining this tank; IE:


Fertilizers - which Macros/Micros / brands / quantities / how often

Water changes - how much / how often

UV sterilizor / Atomizer use - how often / duration

Lighting duration

Filter cleaning - how often if any

What water readings you shoot for


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## randomrambler (Jun 24, 2004)

Nice tank  I just read through this whole thread and enjoyed every part of it. One question though if you don't mind me asking. What is that plant that seems like a lilypad? Just a regular lilypad you can buy from a garden supply store or something else? Once again, congrats on making this such a great tank!


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