# Cichlid swimming vertically



## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

My Jack dempsey has been just swimming in one spot for several days now with his mouth right at the substrate, and his caudal fin up in the air. He is breathing kinda heavier than normal as well.
He is some where's around 8 years old(give or take), and resides in a 125 gallon tank with just a small school of giant danios. No physical signs of stress or illness.

Does this sound strangely abnormal? is his old age catching up to him?


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## jreich (Feb 11, 2009)

i have a neon that does the same exact thing but he has been doing that for about 6+ months now.


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## roadmaster (Nov 5, 2009)

Have you tried water change? Perhaps changing his diet might help.
Gill flukes or other parasite(s) may also be something to consider.


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## jreich (Feb 11, 2009)

sorry to threadjack, but i do 50% wc weekly, and i dont see any visable parasites. How about you green?


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

What are all the tank water & temperature parameters?

Is he eating?

Could you get a pic of him?


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## jreich (Feb 11, 2009)

again sorry to thread jack, but he looks totally healty, eats normally, temp is usually 79 or so. he can swim normally when it wants to but is usually just chillin vertically. almost looks like it has swim blatter problems but i dont think it does. i think its just a weird fish that likes to hang out like that.


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

pH-7.4
KH-6
GH-18......
Temp-75
Nitrite-0
Ammonia-0
Nitrate 5-10ppm

The tank has been running for all most 2 years now.
I rarely change the water in this tank due to its size. I would If I had the hot water to, along with the rest of my tanks on Sundays. I should stop being so lazy on the other 6 days out of the weak and just do it at LEAST once a month :/.
I do not mind going out and getting some other foods he may enjoy, but he is kinda picky.(tried veggies, not his cup of tea) 
I have not seen him eat in maybe 2-3 days, but its been about a week since he started acting this way.
He had a rough upbringing so to speak. (lived in a 30g, full grown, and was either fed goldfish, or cooked and uncooked meat form time to time. He also had a few oscars that the original owner tried to house with him, that was a no go, he killed the oscars so he could live basically. Not enough space and O2 for them all)
I know this may sound terrible to some, but to be completely honest, I am kinda waiting for the ole clunker to pass on so I can cut down on my electricity bill, and so I can re-seam the tank. The corners are looking kind of shady. I am not going to just up and kill him or anything, I want him to live out his life happily. Than I will redo the tank seams.

Here is Jack a few months ago.


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

and here he is now, sorry for the weak pic.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

It may just be the pic, but it looks like there's a "dent" in his head, above and back a bit from his eye (first picture)?

What does he eat?


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

spirulina discs, cichlid sticks, large cichlid pellets. He does not care for any veggies i try to feed him. He does love meat though, every once and a while ill give him a small piece of sandwich meat, like ham or turkey. He fricken loves it...
And he does not eat fish anymore. He lost his taste for then after he ate one of my giant danios.

For as long as I can remember hes all ways had a dent kinda thing going on, nothing very unnatural looking. At one point I thought he was getting hole in head, but it appeared to have went away.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Well, I do think something is wrong, but in the absence of any more symptoms so far, I lean towards thinking it's something internal.

He's old, so things like kidney failure, renal failure, artery/heart disease, etc are all definite possibilities.

You could always try a med or some salt, but it's such a crapshoot that I personally wouldn't try a commercial med... though salt or epsom salt are not likely to do any harm. Epsom salt could help rule out that he's constipated?


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## Swan900 (Apr 27, 2010)

Ive seen these same symptoms on an older cardinal tetra. I remember the owner stating it was diagnosed as an internal problem as Laura said above. Could it be a swimbladder related problem here?

Swan


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

Thanks for the help and ideas folks, I just added a little aquarium salt, and will be doing a partial water change tomorrow.


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

He has now went from vertical, to being practically upside down. Poor guy..... I wonder if I should euthanize him to make his death quick and with the least amount of pain as possible. I have never put down a fish of this size, only fish up to 2 inches in length. (submerging in ice water technique) Do you think this would be the best way for him? Or should I just let him die naturally? 
Seems kinda cruel to let him suffer slowly upside down, but its gonna be hard to euthanize this inhabitant. He has all ways been the most personable fish I have owned. Would reach out of the water to grab food from my hand, loves attention, walk by the tank and he would follow you, stare into the tank, and he'd get right up in you face and stare back.
Poor Jack, at least he was able to live out the rest of his adult life comfortably in a 125 gallon tank, than compared to the first half of his life in a 30 gallon.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

IDK a great way to euthanize a fish this size without asking a vet for access or recommendation for an anaesthetic. Clove oil can work well for small fish, but IDK that it would be easy to get a sufficient dosage with a fish this size?

When I'm cleaning big fish for eating (I happen to love saltwater fishing), a quick boning knife to the brain is what I usually do. That's not something everyone is up for though, and you do need to know how to hold them, where to hit them, and be able to follow through quickly. IDK myself if I'd be able to do it on a fish that was a pet, rather than one I'd just caught for the purpose of eating...

If neither of those seem viable options, only thing else I know would be to let nature take its course. That may be the best option, especially if he doesn't seem to be in physical pain?


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## Chunkanese (Feb 2, 2011)

i agree with lauraleel, let nature take its course, and who knows it may just correct itself, cichlids are ridiculously strong, i have a cichlid doing the same thing right now, i will let you know how it goes.


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

Small update on Jack's condition....
I come home from work this morning, he is no longer upside down, and is swimming somewhat normally. He even went after some food I dropped in for him. Maybe later today I will try and feed him some de-skinned peas if he is able to eat again. I though I recall reading somewhere that they are good for fish...


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## Swan900 (Apr 27, 2010)

Good to hear he's showing some good signs. Thank god you waited a little before euthanising him. Hope he stars eating well and returning to health!

Swan


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## Green024 (Sep 19, 2009)

Don't thank god, thank my laziness and my possible determination that he may have survived this ordeal


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## Swan900 (Apr 27, 2010)

Green024 said:


> Don't thank god, thank my laziness and my possible determination that he may have survived this ordeal


Hahaha, in that case well done for being lazy.

Swan


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Peas are the Exlax of the fish world. If a fish is constipated, the full bowels can push up against the swim bladder, causing it to malfunction.

Epsom salt is another laxative that also can bring down other types of swelling, as it's diuretic.

I'd honestly try some aquarium salt (sea salt, pickling salt, etc) at this point- just to hopefully reduce the risk of infection or in case it was an infection that was the underlying cause of his issues?

I'm glad he seems to have taken a turn for the better!


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## Swan900 (Apr 27, 2010)

Hows the fish doing now? Still all ok?

Swan


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