# Warning about excel and cory cat



## Cardinal Tetra (Feb 26, 2006)

I should say that you overdosed by 10x...I think a lot of people say to overdose 3x or something like that.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Recommended dosing is around 1mL per 10g. Overdosing, for algae control purposes, is recommended at 2-3mL per 10g for a 10-14 day period (or 3-4.5mL for a 15g tank). So, yeah, 15mL for 15g is quite dangerous.


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## flip9 (Jun 16, 2011)

Weird, my flourish excel says 1 capful (5ml) for every 10 gallons. Do they change the concentration depending on the size bottle you buy?


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## Cardinal Tetra (Feb 26, 2006)

flip9 said:


> Weird, my flourish excel says 1 capful (5ml) for every 10 gallons. Do they change the concentration depending on the size bottle you buy?


I believe they say one cap thread or something like that per 10 gallons (5 of them per cap). I don't have a bottle on hand... I think it's 5ml for the initial dose per 10 gallons.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Initial use, after a 40+% water change, is 1 capful (5mL) per 10g, but the daily dose is 1 capful (5mL) per 50g, which is 1mL per 10g.

If you interpret the initial dose as the "shock" dose, 15mL per 15g is double the shock dose.


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## flip9 (Jun 16, 2011)

Roughly how long does an initial dose last in a 25g tank with small-medium density of plants?


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## gagaliya (Aug 19, 2006)

Cardinal Tetra said:


> I should say that you overdosed by 10x...I think a lot of people say to overdose 3x or something like that.


hmm...for my 15 gallon that has no excel at all what is the recommended dosage/schedule to achieve the 3x amount?

Initial dosage is stated at 5ml per 10 gallon. I dosed 15ml, is that incorrect? 

Ongoing maintenance (if no water change) is indicated at 1ml per 10 gallon, so I should dose 3ml daily then? 

Can someone confirm what the initial dosage should be for a tank that never had excel previously. 

Thanks


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## Epitaph (Nov 28, 2007)

I don't believe Corydoras are particularly susceptible to excel. Over gassing CO2 or over dosing excel are both dangerous to all fauna. There are many cases on the web about fauna killed due to over dosage of excel, not just cories.

I disagree slightly with what the Seachem Rep. said about Corydoras paleatus being less efficient in low oxygen environments than the other fish. Corydoras spp. gulps at the water surface as an adaptation against low oxygen levels in murky waters. Although Corydoras paleatus originates from rivers and lakes, this adaptation is embedded to the genes of all Corydoras spp.. 

When oxygen levels are low, you can spot cories dashing to the water surface constantly for air. They will not lie sideways, upside-down, right-side up, etc waiting for themselves to suffocate. It is not just cories, but other fish go up to the surface and gasp for air as well when oxygen is insufficient.

I've experienced bristlenose plecos acting in the same manner when over gassed with CO2. They enter a paralyzed state and drop sideways, upside-down, and motionless but exposure to oxygen quickly revives them. Whether it's because catfish are scaleless or some other reason, I don't know.

I do agree that the cory died from low oxygen by entering a paralyzed state and unable to gulp air from the surface, but not because Corydoras paleatus are inferior at coping with low oxygen levels.

You dose 5 mL excel as the initial dosage when you do a major water change OR never dosed excel previously before. Then dose 1 mL excel per 10 gallons daily or every other day. Multiply by 2-3 as over dosage ratio.


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## GeToChKn (Apr 15, 2011)

Ya, 15ml in 15g is way over the overdose rate. If your battling algae, just use it as a normal dose, cut back on feeding, cut back on the lights and be patient. It can take a few months for a new tank to find its equilibrium and get everything settled in. I have algae right now, I'm treating with 1ml on a 20gal, so 1/2 dose of Excel every few days to help the plants and to keep my shrimp safe as well. I have pond snails, right now all over my glass but they're mowing through all the algae on the glass, so they can stay. As there is less algae eventually the pond snail population will die down, the algae will clear up, the plants will grow more and live will balance out. Unless you want to go super light, full co2, super plant setup, it takes time but dosing almost 10x the regular amount isn't going to help.


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## gagaliya (Aug 19, 2006)

This is rather interesting. So I have cut back and being dosing 3ML daily since my first post in this thread.

Seems had absolutely zero effect on the staghorn and bba, was about to write this off as a fail. Then all of sudden when I woke up today and the lights came on, EVERYTHING in the tank is RED. All the algae on the driftwood, in my DHG, on the wall/glass. Everything is red!

Does that mean they are dieing?


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## dmxsoulja3 (Dec 22, 2010)

yeah that means it worked, now if you want it to clean up either direct your flow or add a powerhead, I always add extra flow once it turns red to whisk it away, as a side note leaving the extra flow in keeps algae away, was easy for me to figure out that even though I am over filtering the size of my tank means I cant keep flow in different areas as constant and got algae. Power head solved alot of issues for me.


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## flip9 (Jun 16, 2011)

Yeap, red means its dying. It will eventually fall off.


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## gagaliya (Aug 19, 2006)

Had to show you guys this picture of my fish tank, crazy!!


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## art_t (Jun 8, 2008)

About 2 months ago I was pouring flourish excel into the cap over my tank and my daughter accidently ran by and hit my elbow. Well, a bunch of excel flew out of the bottle and poured directly into the tank. At the time I had 2 plecos and 2 angelfish in the tank. The angelfish started gasping like crazy right away. I bailed about 30% of the water out as fast as I could and I replaced it as fast as I could with fresh water (just to dilute it somewhat). Then I immediately did another 50% water change just to dilute it even more. I didn't even siphon it because that would have taken too long, I just bailed like a bat out of hell. After the 2nd larger water change they weren't gasping anymore and they have been fine since. I was a wreck though!


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## MissCoryCat (Jul 5, 2011)

At least you realized you overdosed in time in order to perform a water change in an attempt to fix things. Hope they are doing better!


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## MelissaP (Mar 31, 2013)

*Your post saved my Corys!*

Wow, am I ever grateful for the wonder of the Internet today! I recently started dosing my 6 gallon planted tank with Flourish Excel...not overdosing, just dosing. I used the recommended dosing on the bottle for a greater than 40% water change as I was changing the water today. About fifteen minutes after completing the water change, my two albino cory cats were as you said, sideways on the substrate. A panicked google search put your post first. I did as you did and changed the water again and they're back to their perky explorative selves! Phew! I know your posts fairly old so I hope you see this reply. A big thanks and another warning regarding Excel and cory cats. Incidentally, they've been just fine this week with the small maintenance dose. I will avoid the larger dose for water changes in the future for sure. Thanks again!


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