# Photo Journal: "True Colors" 75g Mbuna Planted Tank (56k = death)



## PeteyPob (Apr 26, 2004)

LOL, great show!
Love the tank!


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## esarkipato (Jul 19, 2005)

very, very nice. Just got myself a 75g and this looks like a great idea. Kudos.  I especially love how it looks like you did all this in one night  Seems like a lot even for a 6-day creation story!


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## Finch_man (Mar 21, 2006)

Looks great!! Can't wait to see the java fern to grow out!!


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## Kelley (Nov 2, 2006)

Oh, I love this tank! Thank you for making me laugh.  It was even worth the dial-up wait. 

I'm a poor grad student on a budget, too, so I'll be keeping my eye on this one. 

Good luck with your new tank!


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## hooha (Mar 14, 2004)

lol

I'm entertained, and subscribed.

I'd like to see how it grows out, keep us updated. I have a 45 gallon Mbuna that I'd like to rescape over the summer....gives me ideas.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

wow you must have ALOT of time on your hands to do some much photo animation and narration....lol. It looks very good though...


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## mrbelvedere (Nov 15, 2005)

Easily the best journal I've seen on here. Tank looks magnificent, and in the DIY spirit. Congratulations.


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## Blackthumbwoes (Feb 27, 2007)

Thanks for the humorous post and the passing on the great idea for rain gutter caves...i've been having weight issues in my tanks and never thought about that before.

keep up the great work and i hope they dont gopher everything outa wack in there.

jason


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

That was freaking awesome!!! banging tank.

Btw. how did you mount the background? is it freestanding?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Thanks all, for your comments/compliments/et cetera...



RachPreach said:


> wow you must have ALOT of time on your hands to do some much photo animation and narration....lol. It looks very good though...


It is spring break, so yes, I do have a lot time. and so must you for reading. :tongue:



gmccreedy said:


> how did you mount the background? is it freestanding?


It is semi-freestanding. I used lots of silicone and lava rocks between the gutterings (there are four total) to make it rigid. The limestone rocks in the left/center/right keep it propped up. I didn't want to have to drill the top and hang it like the original (besides, it wouldn't be practical on the right due to my 'stepped' design).


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

do you think about using suction cups or magnets at all?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

no. would probably work, but I don't need 'em.


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## fresh_lynny (Mar 9, 2006)

Very entertaining journal...
Cute...nice job on the tank. Looks beautiful~


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

macclellan said:


> no. would probably work, but I don't need 'em.


right on. gonna give this a whirl. Will get some beer and let you know how it works out.


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## jt20194 (Oct 16, 2006)

And Joel said let there be fun and there was!!! Great job

JT


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

This arrived in the mail today and had me laughing out loud:


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Well, a fairly major update....Plants are all growing nicely....I moved some stuff around and got some nice crypts in trades (thanks guys!). I'll post details later on the plants, but the major new news is FISH!!!! 

Through aquabid I got 17 p. demasoni (paid for [email protected]$3 each, quite a deal in my book!) and 3 more yellow labs....here are some pics of the process and result. Sorry for the crappy snapshots I was in a hurry.

Live Fish!!! My mailman was kind enough to deliver this direct to the door first thing this morning instead of delivering to office in afternoon:










It's ALIIIIVE!!!


























Mrs. Acei says: WhoTF are you?!?!















Full Shot:













Another one: 













Closeup:













Another one:


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## esarkipato (Jul 19, 2005)

Lovin' it....except for....DUDE is that a bubble ladder I see? What happened to your nice looking glass diffuser?

The fish and plants look extremely healthy and full of color


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## Architect1 (Feb 19, 2006)

I love the blue sea of fish. my god there beautiful Its nice to see you bought them out side of a fish store. ewww lfs fish dirty. Nice show by the way.


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## unirdna (Jan 22, 2004)

Very original idea for the backdrop. I love seeing folks pave new roads. The cichlids have to love that thing.

I have a feeling this is going to grow into a good one....... biatches! :hihi:

**subscribed**


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

esarkipato said:


> What happened to your nice looking glass diffuser?


cheap @$$ chinese knock-off ADA diffusor + Mbuna Headbutting = broken cheap @$$ chinese knock-off ADA diffusor

just kidding...this next one is really true:
cheap @$$ chinese knock-off ADA diffusor + All thumbed fish caretaker with IQ lower than room temperature (a.k.a. ME) = broken cheap @$$ chinese knock-off ADA diffusor
So now we got PLASTIC, it is even child-safe. I put it in my mouth and tried to swollow to no avail.

'nuff said?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

oh, did everyone see the 'water dish' I left in the tank? That is in case the fish get thirsty when I'm at school/work. :icon_roll 

No, seriously, I left it in last night after waterchange by accident.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Architect1 said:


> Its nice to see you bought them out side of a fish store. ewww lfs fish dirty.


They sell p. demasoni at the LFS. They are $19.95 a piece! That is $339.15 + tax in fish! :eek5: I already spent all my money on my crack habit, so $19.95 was just too much.. I only paid $45 for all!!!


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## JustOneMore21 (May 23, 2006)

Your tank looks awesome! I tried some plants in my Malawi tank and they just kinda died (lighting sucks)....so just gonna stick with rock and keep the planted tanks seperate. :wink: 

Loved the show too....very entertaining...:hihi:


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## jpfelix (Oct 10, 2006)

beautiful! 

glad i could help fund your habit! esp. when the results are so outstanding!


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## andbigdaddy2 (Oct 3, 2006)

Hey macclellan where did you purch your fish and how tall is you tank?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Thanks for comments peoplez....



jpfelix said:


> glad i could help fund your habit! esp. when the results are so outstanding!


LOL how you said "habit" and not "hobby"! <insert drug-dealer/user analogy here>



andbigdaddy2 said:


> Hey macclellan where did you purch your fish and how tall is you tank?


Got the p. demasonis from omacichlid on aquabid.com. the zebra, albino greysheki, acei, labs, and bulldog pleco's were acquired locally.


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## yoko (Mar 16, 2007)

OMG HOTT!!!!!!!1:hihi:


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## confuted (Jan 31, 2007)

What a fun journal. Keep it up.


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## vollphann (Jun 3, 2005)

Hey! I've seen those crypts somewhere before! Looks great Joel! Glad to contribute(in a very tiny way) to such a beautiful tank, glad I got to see the process.I attached the Xmas and Peacock mosses last night. I'll post pics of it here tonight(well, not here in your thread, but n a new thread). Cheers!


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## guitardude9187 (Aug 22, 2006)

demonsoni's are one of the coolest I've ever owned, congrats on such an awesome purchase. keep us up to date on the computability on such a big number of them.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

guitardude9187 said:


> demonsoni's are one of the coolest I've ever owned, congrats on such an awesome purchase. keep us up to date on the computability on such a big number of them.


Thanks. Actually, the more the merrier with demasoni. Quoting from species profile at cichlid-forum.com": "First and foremost, a minimum of twelve should be kept in any size tank to help disperse aggression. This not only keeps a single male from being dominant over all others, it helps females and sub-dominant males from being chased to exhaustion (and death) by getting "lost in the crowd". A small group of 5 or 6 simply will not work, as the dominant male will systematically kill off each tank mate until only he remains." source: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/p_demasoni.php


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## elpezpr (Nov 12, 2006)

How did you fit the 75g in a Yaris?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

elpezpr said:


> How did you fit the 75g in a Yaris?


KY Jelly and some manhandling?

Actually, the Yaris has a foldable rear seat, so I just pushed up the front passenger seat and folded the rear seat and it fit perfect. even measured the car before I went to the store being the nerd that I am.


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## JenThePlantGeek (Mar 27, 2006)

This is a great journal! Have you seen many fish pairing up and using the caves? I can't wait to see the pictures when those caves start pouring out fry!


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## SilverSurfer (Mar 1, 2007)

Just awesome!

This i found very odd when i came across a picture of riccia and a demasoni directly above it. Now i've used to feed cabomba to my labs would make their colorations just superb.

Notice any plant nipping at all with the mbuna?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

JenThePlantGeek said:


> This is a great journal! Have you seen many fish pairing up and using the caves? I can't wait to see the pictures when those caves start pouring out fry!


Jenny, no, nothing yet. It was just 1x pseud. acei, 1x metriaclima zebra, 1x metriaclima greysheki and 2x lab. caeruleus until last night, so there was only 50% chance of having the right sexes of the right species (not sure they are mature yet either). Now with 5x labs and 17x pseud. demasoni, it is much more likely that there will some 'action.' They are probably still a bit stressed from shipment and aren't ready for a ride on the love machine. It will be cool when the caves pour out fry. 

It is like an apartment complex...albino greysheki is top dog in the 'suite' (top left). the orange zebra has center left, the yellow labs have the bottom right caves. the acei is an open water mbuna. the demasonis are actually staking out territories in the plants! the biggest most colorful male (whom I so originally call "#1") has claimed the top half of one of the apon. boivinianus leaves! Boy will he get pissed when I trim that one.



SilverSurfer said:


> Just awesome!
> Notice any plant nipping at all with the mbuna?


So far my experience is this. I have a 20g that is med/high light and was growing gangbusters. I pulled the plants and floated them in my 55g (now gone) with the mbunas, basically no light and no ferts for about two weeks while I got the 75g ready. Oh yeah, follow that with 4 days in buckets in a closet. :iamwithst So, those plants were really hurting, obviously. 

The e. tennellus completely melted, maybe the hardness(?). 
Wisteria and other hygros and najas looked pissed for the negligence, and the mbunas picked at the weak spots but is now growing faster than toe fungus.
Oh, but Rotalas (wallachi, rotundfolia and macandra 'green') = salad bar.
I don't care about the stem plants though, they are temporary.

the acei poked a few holes in the Red Tiger Lily at first, but all new growth is nipless.
Same with anubias. I got a s#!t-ton of HUGE anubias for 75% off at walmart, with a decent amount of BBA for free  They were nipping at that, but the bleach dip killed it off and all new growth is healthy.
No problems at all with Crypts, Java Fern (all varieties), and apons. 
oh, and [email protected]'apons prefer soft water'! I am rocking it at 20gH and the apon grows like 6" a day with new leaves all the time....

Basically, it seems that if plants are algae free and the mbuna are well fed, no problems. your mileage may vary. 

I was saving up for a Plant Defense System: Cameras to track fish movement triggering small electrical impulses for Behavioral Modification Negative Reinforcement Therapy against plant eating ...Doesn't look like I'll need it, which is great so I can feed my crack habit instead.


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## guitardude9187 (Aug 22, 2006)

macclellan said:


> Thanks. Actually, the more the merrier with demasoni. Quoting from species profile at cichlid-forum.com": "First and foremost, a minimum of twelve should be kept in any size tank to help disperse aggression. This not only keeps a single male from being dominant over all others, it helps females and sub-dominant males from being chased to exhaustion (and death) by getting "lost in the crowd". A small group of 5 or 6 simply will not work, as the dominant male will systematically kill off each tank mate until only he remains." source: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/p_demasoni.php




yea I know about that and have experienced it, it's true in some ways but false in many. The sub dominant one's are always going to be hiding and very unhappy, pale colors, and stressed. witch will lead to the dominant one always getting the food and the less dominant not getting enough. I've kept demasoni's and yellow labs ( juvies) together in a 30 and one demasoni was the only one that was left. The demasoni has also stood up to my albino snow white, witch was more then three times it's size and known to be one of the more aggressive cichlids. The albino snow white was also was the king of the tank, so it just shows you how aggressive they can be.

But in your case, you have a 75 gal, witch is a lot of space, should be fine for them considering if you have a lot of hiding places and is sparsely spread out.

http://www.gcca.net/fom/Pseudotropheus_demasoni.htm
http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_demasoni.php
http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/fish/demasoni.php


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

We'll just have to wait and see what happens then...it is 75g with lots of hides, so hopefully I'll be ok. I had a similar problem as you. the greysheki just about killed the orange zebra in a 20g, but now they leave each other alone completely.

I hear you about the aggression of demasonis though! The smallest gal/guy (fry?) is about 1/2"-3/4" and successfully chased away the 4" albino greysheki, the so-called 'tank leader.'


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## guitardude9187 (Aug 22, 2006)

definitely, Great looking tank roud:


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## A Hill (Jul 25, 2005)

fresh_lynny said:


> Very entertaining journal...


I'll have to second that! Probably one of the most entertaining one's I've seen (stealthy ninja's where good though)

Keep it coming. Oh, and how long was it before there was light? This is a very discussed question:hihi: Was it a 24hr day 48hr day? Or 120m hr day?

-Andrew


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Here is my 75G I had going awhile ago. A 75G is plenty of room for these fish, they will all be out and active. No worries. Please be sure to feed your Demasoni a vegetable diet only, as they are very much susceptible to bloat.

Very nice tank BTW.


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## Zulu (Aug 18, 2005)

macclellan said:


> *Stage 9: "Just add Water"*
> 
> Fill er up, and it didn't even fall through the floor. Isn't it beautiful?



Ahaha, this alone makes you awesome.


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## esarkipato (Jul 19, 2005)

Overfloater said:


> Here is my 75G I had going awhile ago. A 75G is plenty of room for these fish, they will all be out and active. No worries. Please be sure to feed your Demasoni a vegetable diet only, as they are very much susceptible to bloat.
> 
> Very nice tank BTW.


DIY concrete caves? nice! Those don't look like your typical styrofoam caves....

Sorry a little OT.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

esarkipato said:


> DIY concrete caves? nice! Those don't look like your typical styrofoam caves....
> 
> Sorry a little OT.


Nah, they are feather rock that I worked. Total weight of all that rockwork underwater was about 20 pounds.


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Dude, this journal rocks. But I think you need a Crinum calemestratum in there! ha ha


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## travis (Nov 17, 2004)

Great work man! I just found this thread and am very impressed with what you've done. Are there any updates?


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## esarkipato (Jul 19, 2005)

Yes, yes. More updates please. I have been thinking more and more about the lava rock wall/caves. It's ohhh so tempting. I'm curious about how much the fish use these caves, and if they actually become home to some. Also, do you have a dark background behind the tank?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Sorry guys and gals for the lack of updates, busy here with end of semester duties. Tank needs some upkeep. 

All is well in Mbuna land. Here is a quick pic, sorry for the poor quality.

Comments, criticisms, oral farting appreciated.

"Fight Club"


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## yoink (Apr 21, 2005)

Nice tank. I love seeing planted african cichlid tanks.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Nice tank overfloater.


Update. 
Added an Eheim 2227 filter ($50 bucks! woot!). Got to find a way to hide that plumbing.
Added 8 juvenile Xystichromis phytophagus (Christmas Fulu) for some nice red/yellow (thanks ophelia!). No longer a "Mbuna Tank" technically, as this species is from Lake Victoria (and endangered due to habitat loss!!!!)
Added an Anubias hastafolia.











Here is a juvie male starting to show colors:











Here is the father of the juvies I got:











Here is a closeup of some 'action':


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

And no, that demasoni in the center of the first pic isn't dead and floating around, he looks poised to charge at the closest conspecific. They never tire of doing this, mean lil' buggers.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Thanks Mac. I enjoyed my tank for the short time I had it setup. 

Your tank looks great. I have tried several plants with my fish and the only ones they really ate were Vals. Chewed them right down to nubs within days of planting. I added tons of Vals hoping to minimize any damage but they were all over them. 

Keep us posted!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Major update coming later today.

Current state of the tank:










When seeing this, my first thought was "I'd be jealous if all these anubias weren't already mine." Does that make me a bad person? :flick:


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

Previous pictures look great! Must be the perspective or it must be me, but the tank looks more like a 55...

EDIT: It only seems to look like one in the starting pictures, ignore me. :redface:


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

The Grotto background takes up 4 inches of depth. This makes it closer to a 55g in front of the caves. It isn't just you.


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## zergling (May 16, 2007)

love the pic with the fish talk!! 

I wonder what my fish thinks whenever I trim or add plants?

"WTF are those long metal things?!"
"OMG illegal logging!!!"
"HUH? That tree became two?!"
"FOOOOOODDDDDDDD!!!!!"

:fish1:


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

this is exciting...can't wait to see whats coming.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Goodbye Mr. DIY Hood. You were hot stuff. Too hot for my fish. A DIY fan might have fixed you, but you still lit up the room better than the aquarium. Nothing a bit of cold, hard cash can't fix. $100 coralife fixture from Drs.F/S.
Recouped some bills by selling the shoplights for 20quid. Nothing can replace the blood and sweat. Priceless.

RIP:


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

So no canopy over the Coralife fixture?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Roger that Captain. She's just sitting there topless!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

*'The' Update*

Here is the update. Same design, better execution.

I pulled the soilmaster. It is too light... cichlids blow it around stirring up gunk. Replaced with two bags of Tahitian Moon sand. Now no poo will settle in substrate to be stirred up and the kiddies can play in the sand.

I plan on putting in some Under Gravel Jets, but I need to wait a few days to see where the poo accumulates to know where to locate the jets.

Removed all crypts (I figured they won't do too hot in the inert sand). I also pulled the Lotus, as I felt it detracted from the fish. Now I'm sticking with just anubias, java fern, and a lone crinium Calamistratum. All green/black except the fish. This is a fish tank with plants, not a planted tank.

Pulled the CO2, that is for my new 30g high light, coming soon to a forum near you.

I did a better job of hiding the hardware than before. I had to disguise that gawd awful GREEN eheim tubing.

To the lamer who rated this thread a 1: you can kiss my Wrasse: :fish: 
Fess up and show me your better Planted African Rift Cichlid tank or crawl in a hole and die.

Here are the current specs...

Tank: AGA 75g
Light: Coralife 48" 130w 6700k
Substrate: Tahitian Moon Sand
Filtration: Filstar XP3 and Ehiem 2227
Heater: 200w stealth
Airpump: Aquaculture x2
Background: DIY Cave Grotto
Hardscape: Limestone

Plants:
Anubias barteri 'nana'
Anubias barteri 'coffefolia'
Anubias hostifolia
Anubias lancelot
Crinium Calamistratum
Microsorum pteropus
Microsorum pteropus 'Narrow Leaf'
Microsorum pteropus ' Needle Leaf'

Animals:
2x Metraclima estherae
1x Metraclima gresheki (albino)
1x Pseudotropheus acei
13x Pseudotropheus demasoni (RIP to the 3 that died of bloat a few weeks after I got them. I read that this was normal and was due to shipping and adjusting. All is good with the rest. Several have been holding, but I think they are still too young).
8x Labidochromis caeralus
6x Xystichromis phytophagus
yeppers, that is 31 cichlids by my count.

The Working Class:
5x Olive Nerite Snails
1x CAE

I wasn't dosing ferts there for a few months at the end of the semester and got some BBA when I pulled the CO2. That has cleared up and am now on a 'low maintenance', albiet regular and lean dosing regimen. Currently dosing:
35mL Excel 1x, 1/8 tsp M.P.Phosphate and 1/2 tsp P. Nitrate weekly at waterchange then another 1/8 tsp M.P.Phosphate 3 days later.

Overview:









Another:









Left:









Right:









Here are two pics of the disguised hardware:
Rena Filstar XP3 (blue intake disguised with Marineland prefilter)









Rest of the hardware (Ehiem, Heater, Airstones)










Here is a little before and after action:





















Betowess said:


> Dude, this journal rocks.


Thanks!



Betowess said:


> Dude, this journal rocks. But I think you need a Crinum calemestratum in there! ha ha


Done! :flick:


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

That heater is a Visi-Therm Deluxe, not a Visi-Therm Stealth, or so your picture shows.


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## fish_lover0591 (Nov 11, 2006)

Awesome tank and journal  If you don't like the look of your green eheim tubing paint it black with krylon fusion paint i believe its waterproof once it dries. btw what is your tap water and tank ph? I was thinking of keeping cichlids but my ph is low and i don't really want to have to add things to make my water hard.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

tropicalfish said:


> That heater is a Visi-Therm Deluxe, not a Visi-Therm Stealth, or so your picture shows.


Thanks. (stands up). I stand corrected. However, it is pretty stealth hidden back behind there, ain't it? :flick: Does that make it an Invisi-Therm Stealth Deluxe? 


Jen has just informed me that the Crimum is _Crinum thaianum_ instead of a _Crinum calamistratum_. Calimistratum is the crinkly leaved one that I almost assassinated Betowess for, but then my conscience kicked in. This is the more vanilla version. If anyone has a kinky-crinkly that they want to send me, I promise immortality via giving mad public props right here! PM me!

(thx Jen!)

regards,
Joel


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

fish_lover0591 said:


> Awesome tank and journal  If you don't like the look of your green eheim tubing paint it black with krylon fusion paint i believe its waterproof once it dries. btw what is your tap water and tank ph? I was thinking of keeping cichlids but my ph is low and i don't really want to have to add things to make my water hard.


Thanks, I thought about Kryloning it, but I think it will chip because that piece moves around a bit (the wet/dry action gives it a 'wave maker' pulse sorta movement). Maybe I will and see what happens. Then I'll have you to blame if the road turns south.

Tap water is like gh 6 and ph 7...real ordinary.

Tank water is kh16 gh20 and ph8. It is easy and cheap to make the water hard. Epsom Salts (gh) and Baking Soda (kh and ph). real fast to do at waterchange and a box lasts forever.


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## fish_lover0591 (Nov 11, 2006)

heres a thread http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/26949-painting-durso-return-pipes.html about someone who used it on their return pipes  I may consider starting a cichlid tank if its not too much work.


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## RachPreach (Jan 16, 2006)

i always thought those kind of cichlids would eat plants. Ive always wanted to keep them. they are gorgeous.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

just pick your cichlids well and the plants well and all is fine. (feeding them well also will keep them distracted from eating them...but uprooting is a hole other story as i am sure my fellow cichlid brethren will tell you)

tank looks banging...

Good luck with the sand mac...


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

RachPreach said:


> i always thought those kind of cichlids would eat plants. Ive always wanted to keep them.


they do eat plants. lots of them, both quantity and variety. gmecreedy is right. pick your plants and pick your cichlids. Notice that I basically only have anubias and java fern and 1 crinum. they slam on pretty much any stem plant, floating plant, etc etc. And yep, feed em lots. But that means big filters etc. etc. not for the faint of heart.



RachPreach said:


> they are gorgeous.


yep, they are. :biggrin:


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## python (Mar 21, 2007)

Great tank, great post. It almost seems like you had TOO much fun with this one. :fish: :fish: roud: :fish: :fish:


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## craig83 (Jan 24, 2007)

Firstly i'd like to take a moment to appreciate the fine choice of filtration
Wicked journel and LOVIN the tank dude, nice work!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Python: Thanks! Funny you should say that. Growing up, my Uncle had a boat called Too Much Fun (followed by Too Much Fun Too) where I learned to waterski (read: free high velocity lake-water enemas). I could think of a worse modus operandi.

Craig83: What was my fine choice of filtration? The 2227? Only thing is the slight 'thunk' noise when the float device pops up engaging the wet-cycle, kind of loud. It is a biological filtration monster, however, so I deal with it.


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

Swwet tank.
I sometimes wish i kept my mbunas.
but i went ot the tanganyikan side, and kept haps and peackocks.
[will never look back!(wait, i just did....)]

BTW: is that the tank my Nymphaea is coming from? just wondering.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Thx dufus. I'd love to do a 20g of Tang shelldwellers with very fine white and black sand and hard-as-nails water. Only problem is that it is currently a shrimp tank...

Yes, that lotus was in there for a long time, but has spent the last five weeks or so in a smaller tank (20T w/36w AHS, flourite, and 'normal' water parameters) awaiting me to get free enough to get this sale all ready.


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## travis (Nov 17, 2004)

Very nice work man! The plants and fish are all in top shape 

I keep a planted ARLC tank and have noticed that we seem to keep almost the same species of mbuna: Ps. acei, Ps. demasoni, L. caeruleus, etc. I suspect that these are some of the most plant-friendly mbuna, all being of the dwarf-mbuna variety.

Keep up the great posts!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Thanks Travis.

You are definitely right on the L. caeruleus and Ps. demasoni... I can wholeheartedly recommend them for planted tanks. They are also some of the most beautiful. The Xystichromis phytophagus don't touch the plants either and the males are just stunning.

I wouldn't consider Ps. acei to be a dwarf (6"+), and I think she munches on new anubias leaves.
I also keep Metraclima estherae (Red Zebras) and a 'lone wolf' Metraclima gesheki (Albino Red Top), and I'm beginning to think that thiis was a mistake for fish and plants. They get 6"+ and are very aggressive.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

have to agree Mac, I had five Red Zebras, 3 Orange, 1 Blue and One OB. I got rid of the three red and things have calmed down a bit. For the albino red top's, I have two and they seem to be active, but i wouldn't say agressive. however, i have gotten rid of the really "aggressive" mbuna, so that may lend to the red tops "calming down" a bit. 

If you want really tame mbuna's, without having to really search, Taiwan reef's are really cool and very calm, as well as baenschi and borleyi. these are pretty common to most LFS and can be kept. the baenschi and borleyi are carnivores so you can get away with some more delicate plants than anubia's, ferns and vals too. 

but they will still uproot if they can...just cause thats how they roll roud:.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

I have two beautiful Red Zebras, I just got a _slightly_ smaller male two days ago for them to 'play' with. He's beaten up real bad.  I don't think he'll make it to nightfall without intervention on my part, but I don't know if the stress of moving him to a hospital tank will only hasten death.

You are right, gmccreedy, the gresheki male is actually pretty tame, despite being the boss of the tank. He mostly just protects his territory and gets his shag on with the zebras, but doesn't actively attack anybody else.

None of the fish you mentioned are Mbunas...baenschis is a peacock and borleyis and Taiwan Reef are haps..they are all peaceful and carnivores (and beautiful), but ultimately a bad combination of diet and temperament with Mbunas, which are vegetarians and aggressive. I'd do yellow labs with those species, but not any of the other species I have. I may do a hap/peacock tank someday, they are more conducive to plants., but I'm sticking with the bruisers for now, and no new species, plant or animal. Perhaps one more acei and another male zebra if this guy doesn't hold on.

I'm just living with the anubias nipping for now. I trim of the leaves they nibble at, but this only happens to about 50% of new leaves, so there is still plenty of new growth surviving.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

He he...i just realized that i wrote that. OMG i am losing it today. Mbuna's...no...you are correct sir! 

thats what happens when you start typing something then stop halfway through and start up again without proof reading.

Sorry for the mis info.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

No problem. 

They are all beautiful species, that is for sure. I'd do Taiwan Reefs with German Reds and Yellow Labs with maybe some Synodontis cats if I went that route.


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

Yellow labs are probly the calmest of the mbuna, i have one female with haps, peackocks, and tangs.

Mac...the best addition to an african rift cichlid tank............Synodontis.

they will stand up to the fish, are beutiful, and are very entertaining.

i have a Syno. eupterous and a hybrid, the hybrid is HUGE.

but they really are fun to watch, the hybrid swims upside down at feeding time and "Powergrazes" the surface.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Yeah, I have been planning to get one or three for awhile. I want the Synodontis njassae because it is from Lake Malawi, but I've never seen it available locally. I'd settle for a Tang one like Synodontis multipunctatus or the petricola, but I've never seen them for less than $15. I've never spent more than $7.99 on a fish, so call me a cheap arse.


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

i bought my hybrid for 4.99.
my eupterous was 16.00!!!

luckily, if i want anything rare from africa, i live close to daves cichlids.

he ships also, he's an awesome guy.

http://www.davesfish.com/


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Thanks, but in all cases, shipping costs more than I am willing to pay for a fish, not to mention the price of the fish, so that is a non-starter.

I might just drop $15 and get one with the money from all those plants I just offed in SnS.


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## guitardude9187 (Aug 22, 2006)

tank is looking real nice! good work


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Everybody knows Mbuna are bruisers, but I never thought they'd take down a coyote...Eat that you schooling-fish sissies.

Toughest Planted Tank eva? yiiaa











3 yellow labs and 2 demasonis holding right now. Been too busy to see if they're spitting or if the fry are getting eaten or what. Can't wait till the fulu's get a lil bigger and start shagging. LFS pays $15ea. for fry(!).


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

yep, they're actually what caused the extinction of the dinosaurs, then god decided to contain them into a few lakes, 

if the fry are getting eaten, you'll still see some in a few weeks, they're smarter than you think.


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## Haeun (Mar 9, 2007)

Wow, that skull looks pretty cool, actually. Heh, is that a real skull by any chance? Or a plastic one?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

It is a real skull (coyote), but I had to pull it - got nasty. Now it is on my wall keeping the evil spirits at bay. I might pick up a kitschy plastic buffalo skull instead to keep some sillyness in this world. 

Baby demasonis are growing quickly. You are right dufus, they are smarter than I think. There are at least three surviving in the rocks and eating god knows what.

Bad knews: Had to pull the background. 8hours of my life down the drain. Fatal error: Fusion spraypaint holds up fine underwater, but not with the weight of lava rock siliconed to it - chunks started falling off and I decided to scrap the project. Also, it made the tank a PITA to clean. Lastly, the tank has a much simpler aesthetic to it now, more like I had originally envisioned. I threw in more limestone and pulled all the java fern, leaving only the crinum apon and three anubias species. I'll put the narrow leaf java in the back corners when I get around to it.

Here is a crappy and quick snapshot:


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

doesn't limestone raise your pH, like A LOT. But then again, thats how those darn Mbunas like it I suspect.


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## JustOneMore21 (May 23, 2006)

Yep, limestone will raise the hardness and pH, but Mbunas like hard water and a high pH. 


Any new pics of the tank macclellan?


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

The limestone doesn't raise the kh/gh/ph much actually. There is also crushed coral in one of the canisters and I add poor man's rift lake buffer (epsom salt and baking soda). pH is around 8 and kH around 20. So yeah, hard as nails, but the limestone alone and it is barely over 7.

I just moved and have been busy with school. I'll have some new pics hopefully sometime soon. Tank is going strong, there are several baby p. demasoni growing up and 'the boss' aka "Cracka" is looking wonderful - he is an albino metraclima gresheki. I just got him a girl to play with.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Bwahahahaaa, most entertaining journal yet :icon_mrgr 

The tank looks great, I love the new limestone.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Here are some new pics. Haven't updated in forever.


Female Demasoni









Newborn Demasoni









Yellow Lab









Albino greysheki male









Male Zebra, watching out from his territory









Female Zebra










---

Unrelated photo from a different tank, but pretty fish (butterfly cichlid from africa, aka dwarf jewel):


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## JustOneMore21 (May 23, 2006)

Great pics! That baby Dem is so cute!


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## guitarsrmine (Mar 15, 2007)

I dont care much for your Biblical refrences-YOU didnt create anything-GOD created it all, so how about giving credit where credit is due-He is the Creator of all the earth!!


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Never thought I'd see the day that religious trolls would slither into a planted tank forum. :icon_conf

Try to remember what forum this is, and that the members are from all over the world, from different walks of life. We're here to discuss planted aquariums, not sling religious theory around and force feed ideals.



> I dont care much for your Biblical references


Then don't make them. You can't separate Joel's humor from serious statements, make an attempt to loosen up and try to enjoy the thread for it's purpose.

Like they say, if you don't like the show, change the channel. Free speech, respect one's rights, yada yada yada and so on. No suppression please.


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## topfrog007 (Dec 30, 2007)

guitarsrmine said:


> I dont care much for your Biblical refrences-YOU didnt create anything-GOD created it all, so how about giving credit where credit is due-He is the Creator of all the earth!!


I hope your joking.

The OP created the scape in the tank, spent his time on it, and none of it would have been possible without him.


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## A Hill (Jul 25, 2005)

guitarsrmine said:


> I dont care much for your Biblical refrences-YOU didnt create anything-GOD created it all, so how about giving credit where credit is due-He is the Creator of all the earth!!


And he also created sin and cars? And all that other good stuff...

If you can't distinguish between a funny guy and a satanist, well go out and see the world! I'm confirmed don't worry he hasn't poisoned me yet:icon_lol: !

I didn't know the thread had been updated since my last post.. Stupid me! That tanks looked great! What happened to all them blue fishies :icon_lol: Did you sell them off or something?

I've been thinking of tanks to make a list of to try and make, and this just made my list:hihi: Bright fish, nice healthy plants whats better? Well shrimp and moss, DUH!

Don't let this or that stop you from being yourself dude! I want some pix!

-Andrew


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## JenThePlantGeek (Mar 27, 2006)

For fear of being offensive to our wide variety of patrons, we've made religious, political, and non-PG statements off limits for signatures (and in some cases, for posts, when it gets out of hand). We're not quite to that point yet, but let's keep it that way and lay off the religion. There's a time and a place for everything. I personally have strong religious and political views, and a pretty non-PG sense of humor - but you're never going to see that here!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

*guitarsrmine* - I don't have much to say _here_ about your comment except that you're entitled to your opinion, and I defend your right to express it if it is done respectfully. Hopefully, something's being offensive to someone isn't enough for it to be censored, for if it were, there'd be precious little we could talk about. That said, this really isn't the venue for religious discussions (try here if discussing origins is your thing). I don't come here to pt.net to discuss this. I do that enough at my day job. 

*A.Hill* - I can only hope that I'm the funny guy and not the satanist! :help: 
Don't worry - the demasonis are in there. Several died to bloat (probably subdominant males) awhile back, but the population has been steady at 9 individuals (two nice males) for at least six months now, and there are 3 medium-sized juvies and God knows how many fry (Oh wait, can I say that without offending anyone?).


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## RyanG (Jan 25, 2008)

I was always deathly afraid of chilids and plants together Mac, I keep anubias coffeeola, barteri, and nana with a microsword street in my 29 gal rainbow tank. Do you have any tips or pointers? religion rocks...


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## guitarsrmine (Mar 15, 2007)

*Re:*

To macclellan;


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## guitarsrmine (Mar 15, 2007)

I didnt mean to imply anything toward you;you have your beliefs, as I do mine. I didnt realize I would raise such a ruckus for expressing my opinion. Your tank looks great- I appreciate the hard work=as we all do when we bust our butts to make something nice. I take pride in my tanks, as I'm sure all the members here do. Again, I wasn't trying to offend or imply. Continued fishkeeping success to0 you and all the members here!!


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## fshfanatic (Apr 20, 2006)

It takes a big man to admit his mistakes.. Kudos.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

Banging fish as usual Mac!! Always a fun journal to pop in and take a look at.

Keep up the goods!


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Mac,

If you have the inclination, you can make some nice rockwork out of feather rock. I made a nice layout (with plants), and the total weight of the rocks underwater was negligable. I can post a picture if you'd like.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

*OVerfloater *- You already did.  Thanks though.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

macclellan said:


> *OVerfloater *- You already did.  Thanks though.


Forgive me. Senility has set in.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

*Parting is Such Sweet Sorrow*

This tank is coming down soon, so I thought I'd post a parting post to conclude this journal. This tank has been plantless for the last few months....

What I learned: Demasonis and Labs are great with anubias/java fern/many other plants. Zebras, Greyshekis, and Aceis eat a lot of plants (no surprise there) but also damage anubias/java ferns. They don't eat them outright, but they 'taste' them with their algae scraping teeth - since they are such slow growers, it's a process of gradual decline even while new growth occurs.










Coming soon: 75g Planted anyone? mwahaha :fish:


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

Thats a cool lookin hang out for those sweet fish. Nice rock scape, and the darkness of it all really makes the fish pop. Black background, dark substrate, gray rocks... then orange and yellow and blue fish. Way to really make them shine. Great use of contrast. For a non-planted, I love it.


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## eyebeatbadgers (Aug 6, 2007)

I just spent the past five minutes laughing at your "filter pimping" picture.

Looking forward to the next version of the tank.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Thanks Laracy!

Badgers, they're not my glasses, I swear (really, they aren't!)!
But seriously, do I get a purple heart from the Filstar Club for that demeaning pose? :fish1:


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## eyebeatbadgers (Aug 6, 2007)

I'd hope so.


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## kyle3 (May 26, 2005)

LOVED the thread! thanks!

cheers-K


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