# Confused with LED options (180 Gallon tank)



## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

72" plus length right?

Have you considered DIY?
A "primer" but note this is probably "the most" expensive way to DIY
Reason being is that 1) 2) and 3) can be met 4) as well but it is a bit more difficult for most unless just putting it in a hood.

There are "off brands" that meet most of the criteria i.e cost and control.
Efficiency is another story.. Average LEd's are no more efficient than average t5/8's

current state of the art are more efficient.
good thing about LEd is due to the spacial pattern of the beam you can use less watts so even the lower efficiency ones are more efficient in that regard..

How they are driven (constant current vs constant voltage) also adds or subtracts efficiency..
Point is they all have some efficiency but TCO (total cost of ownership) would be such that recoup of your initial purchase by efficiency is a very long period.

but that brings us to point 3) Ther is nothing easier to automate w/ dimming, spectrum changes ect. than LED really. 

As to control, the Apex blows point 3) out of the water.
There are creative options (people her have built full controllers using Aduino and asst. boards or these:
Ferduino Aquarium Controller 
https://aquarium-led-controller.com/product/bluefish-led-controller/


to be honest the best bet to match a price point is going off brand w/ a built in controller
Reefbreeders and DSunY both produce fully controllable lights (intensity and spectrum) cheaper than the Cadillac ones.
Of course secondary automation (dosers ect) come into play here

Options are slowly expanding while pricing is slowly coming down..

A 72" Quad Beamswork and 2 on/off timers would be under $300. finding the 6500k version of said light is a bit harder


> 12960 Lumens
> Super energy efficient 3 watt high output LEDs
> 76x 10,000K LED
> 20x Actinic 460nm LED
> Use 288 watts


3 A169 Kessils w/out a controller is $717
Add a Bluefish for $200

Ther are some choices that go beyond your 4 a bit, including look via "colors" and color temp..and things like how automated?
rampup/ramp down.. ect

Anyways just "stuff" to contemplate..

Even DIY involves trade offs and compromises.. Point is what areas are acceptable for this.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

This tank is 72"x24"x24" roughly, correct? 24" and high light will start to be a demanding setup, but not impossible.

Here is an interesting image:










Link to original post: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/1...-greenelement-other-cheap-chinese-arrays.html

With that in mind, I'd say go with some 72" beamswork fixtures. The one in the photo is linked here:

EVO 72 LED Reef Bright (try to find 6500k versions)

Two of those would give you pretty uniform coverage from front to back and run you in the $300 range. I recently purchased one of these and am pretty pleased with it thus far. 

Your next step up is running 4 36" Ray2 LEDs. At $135 ea, you'll be right at $500. I believe you will be lower in the par range, but still in medium light.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

Freemananana said:


> This tank is 72"x24"x24" roughly, correct?


topdogsellers has some quad snakeyes 

*SnakeEyes Quad 72" Timer (Ready) 6500K 3W LED Aquarium Light Freshwater Plant ...*



$233.95


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

I disagree with that because the snake eye offers increased par at depth at the cost of beam angle. Now that you have a smaller beam angle, you would definitely need at least two, maybe 3, to evenly light a 2' wide tank. At least, that is what I have read and seen stated. The snake eye is an interesting light though. It may be worth more consideration than what I am giving it. Feel free to correct me.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

Freemananana said:


> I disagree with that because the snake eye offers increased par at depth at the cost of beam angle. Now that you have a smaller beam angle, you would definitely need at least two, maybe 3, to evenly light a 2' wide tank. At least, that is what I have read and seen stated. The snake eye is an interesting light though. It may be worth more consideration than what I am giving it. Feel free to correct me.


snake eyes quad is 4 rows.. and yes slightly different beam angle then the normal quad but the fixture is 9" wide.. you have an internal spead of at least 7" I still would rate them at 90 degrees though
12 plus 7 is 19" spread at 3" above the water line..
Bringing it up an inch or 2 should cover all the tank. And 3" may be a bit low of an estimate..

BUT the main point was where to find 72" FW beamsworks..
Aquatraders rarely has them topdog has asst. flavors usually..


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

That's interesting. It has been awhile since I looked at those in particular. If he can handle the par, go for it! I've been wrong before, seems to be the case now too.


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## kevin007 (Aug 15, 2007)

I have been doing more research since the last time I posted. Is beamswork really the best choice? I have been looking at Satellite Plus Pro and the new Fluval ones too. Yes I am aware that I will need to get 2 fixtures (at least) but I would rather buy from a well known brand than a Amazon/China brand.

Is there a problem with this thinking? Do the beamswork work equally as good?


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## AKnickolai (Nov 30, 2012)

I just left home for a few weeks for work, so I can't post any pics for a while. But, I just built a DIY LED light for my 80G (48x20x20) tank using bridgelux vero 18 COBs (3 5600k and 3 2700k). It's mounted about a foot off the tank and using no optics I can get well over 100 PAR to my substrate with very even light distribution. Cost to build the light was $375 including $45 to upgrade the crappy fans that ship with the Makers Heat Sink to Noctua fans (high quality and quiet) and the meanwell power supply. I already had my own DIY controller based on an AVR.

I wanted a medium light tank, so I'm only pushing about 0.5A through each COB and I might tone that down a bit. I seriously think I could have gotten away with a total of 4 COBs, especially since my goal was medium light. Visually, the light looks amazing and the build is very simple as the LED chip count is low, but you do need one driver per chip. If you want, I can post more details on the build, but you'll have to wait for pics. I plan on doing a write up in the DIY section when I get time.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

kevin007 said:


> I have been doing more research since the last time I posted. Is beamswork really the best choice? I have been looking at Satellite Plus Pro and the new Fluval ones too. Yes I am aware that I will need to get 2 fixtures (at least) but I would rather buy from a well known brand than a Amazon/China brand.
> 
> Is there a problem with this thinking? Do the beamswork work equally as good?


your comparing apples to oranges.. The Sat plus pro is a full function light. The Beamswork is an, out of the box, static array.. 
as to manuf.. almost all are made in China w/ the exception of buildmyled and "maybe" others..


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## kevin007 (Aug 15, 2007)

I absolutely do not trust my DIY skills whatsoever. If I can purchase a unit that someone built, I would be willing to do so.

I am not sure what the difference between a static array and a full function light. Like I said, I am highly confused with these new LED options.

The 72" snake eye seems to be the best bang for the buck thus far. But there are so little information on them or user reviews out there. I do like the pricing...alot..

But nonetheless. I appreciate all the response.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

kevin007 said:


> I am not sure what the difference between a static array and a full function light. Like I said, I am highly confused with these new LED options.


The snakeyes, at best has a digital on/off timer.. no intnsity adjustments, no slowly ramp up th lighting function, no color mixing..
Static..
The Current plus pro you can adjust the colr, ramp up down the light, set max intensity ect..
Dynamic..not even including things like lightning or clouds..

Snakeyes is equiv to a fluorescent, non-dimmable tube light in function.


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## bsherwood (Nov 22, 2007)

Finnex is my new LED friend. There may be better, there maybe a DIY thing out there...but for me? out of the box, on top of the tank and go!
RayII! I have 6 of them now........


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## AWolf (Jun 13, 2014)

I bought some 12watt LED Spot lights, E27 fixture, so they fit just fine in a clip on desk lamp. They are red and blue spectrum only. Then I added cheap white LED strip lights to drown out the purpleish glow on the tank. Each spot light cost about 30 dollars. TaoTronics 12watt. They are so high in lumens, that you will need to shade your tank top, or place them a few feet from the top of the tank. Then set your cheap white LED's directly over the tank. Total cost for 55 gallon: approx. 75 dollars. If I had the money, I still wouldn't spend so much on LED's. The cost will continue to come down, and these 30 dollar bulbs do the job just fine. I am still trying to tweak the hight over my tanks. Over 4000 lumens/PAR at just 2 feet!!!! (Air specs, I don't know how much it is lowered going through water).

P.S. I think the LED fixture industry is so extremely overpriced because they know people think LED's are fancy. The technology is not so new any more.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

AWolf said:


> P.S. I think the LED fixture industry is so extremely overpriced because they know people think LED's are fancy. The technology is not so new any more.



There is that but most of the overprice comes in 2 things 1)niche products w/ a SMALL customer base and 2)automation/programming, though cheap as a DIY, NOT normally something one wants to tackle.

you can buy 50 Bridgelux 3w white "eggs" for $15 inc. shipping, yet a Cree/Phillips will cost you $3 per piece. 
but the Bridgelux will run 50L/w while the Cree/Phillips will be 100 Lumens plus.

as they say.. parts is parts.. 

those spots at $30 aren't "really" inexpensive either..  and w/ the power supplies and drivers above the heat "usually" not destined for a long life..
not much different that those compact flour. "twists" that are "supposed" top last 3-4 plus years..

we are consumers so by definition we are guinea pigs and cash cows... 

http://www.ledsmagazine.com/article...-21-contributes-to-the-solution-magazine.html


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Finnex is a step up from Beamswork. The Ray 2 would be a good choice. You'd need 4 of the 36" models... wait a minute....



Freemananana said:


> Your next step up is running 4 36" Ray2 LEDs. At $135 ea, you'll be right at $500. I believe you will be lower in the par range, but still in medium light.


I had actually suggested this as an option already since you showed interest in your original post.

As for the SAT+ PRO, you are diving into deep water. They are amazing lights and fully adjustable. But you are looking at 4x $250 ($1000) for enough lights to stretch 6' and 2' wide. 

Beamswork: $300
Finnex: $500
Current: $1000
BML: $1000+

Identify your price range and decide.


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## AWolf (Jun 13, 2014)

All true and good. The problem I face when it comes to these LED aquarium fixtures is the failure rate. Reading the reviews online make me think that they aren't holding together. Sure, you can pay big bucks for them, get that guarantee, and hope that you can ship them back and have them returned fixed. Down time. I like the idea of a quick twist off, and a CFL twist on, and I am good to go until I get another LED spot light. My 125watt/2700k CFL's cost more than this particular LED spot strangely enough. But the LED spot is so much cooler, just warm to the touch. At night the purple glow of just the LED spot is really cozy. :}


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## kevin007 (Aug 15, 2007)

Freemananana said:


> Finnex is a step up from Beamswork. The Ray 2 would be a good choice. You'd need 4 of the 36" models... wait a minute....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Realistically I am willing to spend up to 1000.

My total budget for the tank is 7-8k CAD.

I would like to have "high" output so I can grow any type of plants I want to without being limited by my lighting.

Why is the Finnex a "Step" up" Is it the PAR output or the adjustability?

Also, is there a reason why I cannot use regular timers like I do for my fluorescent lights on LEDs? There are also stuff like light dimmers sold at ikea. Can't I use those with the LEDS?


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## captexas (Aug 24, 2015)

I just ordered some Finnex lights for my 240g tank I'm setting up. I went with a mix of the Fugeray Planted+ and Ray 2's. If you make a decision to go Finnex, note there are places online cheaper than Amazon and still have free shipping. Place I was looking at was cheaper and had a 10% off halloween sale, so even better deal. Amazon would have cost me a couple hundred more.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

kevin007 said:


> Also, is there a reason why I cannot use regular timers like I do for my fluorescent lights on LEDs? There are also stuff like light dimmers sold at ikea. Can't I use those with the LEDS?


on/off timers are fine.. 
dimmers need special LED bulbs w/ compatible drivers inside.. And you need the correct dimmer type...

just for fun and ideas..

http://www.ferduino.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=57


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## kevin007 (Aug 15, 2007)

captexas said:


> I just ordered some Finnex lights for my 240g tank I'm setting up. I went with a mix of the Fugeray Planted+ and Ray 2's. If you make a decision to go Finnex, note there are places online cheaper than Amazon and still have free shipping. Place I was looking at was cheaper and had a 10% off halloween sale, so even better deal. Amazon would have cost me a couple hundred more.


If you don't mind me asking, what was the exact combination that you bought?

Are you planning on keeping plants that require, low, medium, or high light?


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

kevin007 said:


> Realistically I am willing to spend up to 1000.
> 
> My total budget for the tank is 7-8k CAD.
> 
> ...


Step up is highly opinionated. Finnex is a 'trusted' brand while beamsworks is 'chinese'. I trust spiral CFL bulbs and beamswork myself. My experience with popular light brands has been less than ideal. 

You can use regular timers. LEDs just have dimmable capabilities so specific timers can set up sunrise/sunset looks and adjust colors to a specific spectrum. 

I would venture to say the Chinese fixtures offer just as much par as any other fixture. It depends on the model you get. There are plenty of par recordings for every fixture I can think of at variable depths and distances from center. You can pretty easily decide which fixture works best for you by looking at charts side by side.


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## captexas (Aug 24, 2015)

kevin007 said:


> If you don't mind me asking, what was the exact combination that you bought?
> 
> Are you planning on keeping plants that require, low, medium, or high light?


Plan is to keep low to medium light plants. Due to cost and the way I have my canopy set up, I'm running one row side to side across the back and one row across the middle of the Fugeray Planted+ lights. Then I'll have two 30" Ray 2's across the front of the tank for a little stronger light for the shorter plants. I plan to have them on timers with offset on/off times so to ramp up/down the amount of light during the day. I debated for a long time on the combination to use. I have a thread in this lighting forum probably on the next page or two where another member here posted pictures of their 240g tank with a combination of the same lights. Check the pics out, they helped me get an idea of how they looked as well as his opinion on them.


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