# Is this normal when cycling a tank with fish food?



## annyann (Aug 31, 2013)

I set my tank up a couple weeks ago and added a large pinch of fish food, I have tested the water three times in the last week or so and I find no ammonia or nitrite. I dont have a nitrate test. Anyway two days ago I got my new lights in place on the tank (two CFL's 23 Watt 6500K)and added a good amount of live plants. Then I filled a nylon media bag with about 1-1/2 TBS of fish food. The next day my tank was really cloudy and it still is. There is a whitish slimy film all over the bag of food and on the driftwood in the tank. Is this a normal thing to occur during cycling? I dont really know what to expect, I've never done a fishless cycle before and could not find the right kind of ammonia to use. So I had to use the fish food and I put it in the nylon bag to cut done on the mess.. 
At first I thought the cloudiness could be an algae bloom from the new lights, or maybe a bacteria bloom from the cycle starting? But I don't know and the slimy white fungusy looking stuff has me worried something is going wrong.
Any help will sure be appreciated!


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## Bluebugs (May 1, 2013)

You may be looking at 2 separate things. The bacterial bloom from the cycling, and the fungus growing on drift wood. 

Just speculation, of course. We would need a pic to really determine. 

I cycled a tank with fish food, get ready for a nematode bloom too.


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## danielt (Dec 19, 2012)

Unless you want algae for some critters to feed on, it's best to leave the light off until the tank is cycled. Plants won't do much for the bacteria that needs to grow. They help by feeding off nitrates once the tank is established. Putting plants from the start will prolong the time needed if ammonia is not enough to go around.

Plants feed on ammonia if they have it available, if not then nitrates. It might explain why your ammonia is 0 right now.


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## THE V (Nov 17, 2011)

Fungal and bacterial bloom after adding in plants is very normal. When you added in the plants you also added in large amounts of other organisms. In a healthy tank there are all sorts of organisms floating around. 

The object of cycling a tank is too allow time for the nitrogen converter/absorbing organisms to become established. Whether its from the plants or the bacteria doing the job doesn't really matter. Having a nitrogen source but no detectable ammonia or nitrite indicates its ready for some fish. 

Personally I'd start slow and no more than double the bioload once a week.


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## urbach (Apr 16, 2009)

White slimy film on driftwood during setup is normal. It will go away in few weeks time. To get Ammonia, throw in some market prawns. Will shell peel off. That will be Ammonia in few day time. What filter are you using.? Canister? Canister with the right biomedia will speed up your cycle. Expect to wait for 3 till 4 week for fully cycle. 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


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## houseofcards (Mar 21, 2009)

The white slim is normal as mentioned. Are there plants in the tank?


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## annyann (Aug 31, 2013)

Thanks everyone for answering. Im feeling better about this being a normal thing that happens during cycling. I took some pics to give you a better idea of what it looks like. Also the tank is not as cloudy as it was, but the white fungusy looking stuff is getting worse. I also just tested the water and it has no ammonia or nitrites. I cant figure out why it wont start the cycle? Is it possible that there was enough bacteria on the live plants to convert to nitrate already? I wish I had a nitrate test, but I dont. 
Also I have another question, when i'm sure the cycle is over I will do a large water change, maybe 90%. Will it hurt my new bacteria if I use water that's colder than the tank water is or is bacteria not as sensitive as fish about water temperature change?


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## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

The white stuff is fungus that grows on stuff that was once living. Like driftwood and fish food. 
I would remove as much as you can without fighting too hard. It is not really all that bad, but it can get to be a large volume. 

I do not think you have enough plants to safely add fish. 
Using the fish food is OK. Protein breaks down to ammonia. 
Keep on testing ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. 
If the ammonia or nitrite go over 5 ppm remove the fish food for a day or two and do a partial water change. 

It is OK to do a large water change with water that is different. The bacteria do not care. 
Temperature, chemistry... not a problem. 

The bacteria grow best in hard alkaline water. But once the colony has grown to a good size and the cycle is complete you can do a water change with soft acidic water, if that is what your fish like. The bacteria will slow down, but that is OK.


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## houseofcards (Mar 21, 2009)

danielt said:


> *Unless you want algae for some critters to feed on, it's best to leave the light off until the tank is cycled. Plants won't do much for the bacteria that needs to grow.* They help by feeding off nitrates once the tank is established. Putting plants from the start will prolong the time needed if ammonia is not enough to go around.
> 
> Plants feed on ammonia if they have it available, if not then nitrates. It might explain why your ammonia is 0 right now.


Seriously, do you realize your on a planted tank forum.


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## annyann (Aug 31, 2013)

Diana said:


> The white stuff is fungus that grows on stuff that was once living. Like driftwood and fish food.
> I would remove as much as you can without fighting too hard. It is not really all that bad, but it can get to be a large volume.
> 
> I do not think you have enough plants to safely add fish.
> ...


Thanks so much for answering. You're a big help thats for sure. The cloudiness is gone this morning, but the fungus is still the same. It's a big relief to know I can do a large water change and clean it all up without harming the bacteria im colonizing in the tank. I tested again and there is still no ammonia or nitrites showing up. Im beginning to wonder if my test kit is any good. Its a master liquid test kit for ponds, but its about 8 years old. I still have some left over ammonia that I couldn't use in the tank because it foamed when shaken. I think im going to mix in some of that with water in a cup and see if my test kit will pick up that..


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## annyann (Aug 31, 2013)

I tested my tank again this morning and still no ammonia detected by my test, but the nitrite was at .25 I still have the large amount of fish food floating in the tank in a nylon bag. The bag is still covered in fungus, the fungus has stuck all over the glass, its on the driftwood, its floating freely in the water and sticking to my live plants kinda like a dust storm. It doesn't appear to being doing any harm to the plants, it just looks bad. And the tank smells bad when I lift the lid..What should I do? Should I keep the food in the tank until the nitrite drops to 0 then clean everything up and do a 90% water change? Does the smell and fungus still sound normal? How will I keep the fungus from coming back after the cycle? I know i'm asking a lot of questions, but a stinky fungus filled tank is not inviting to put fish in...


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## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

8 year old test kit is probably too old. Did you test it with the ammonia you have?

That big a bag of fish food would produce enough ammonia to test positive. 

Remove as much of the fungus as you can reasonably do. Do not take everything out and scrub it, though. The beneficial bacteria are probably getting attached to things like the driftwood. 

The bad smell... can you describe it? Does it smell like cat pee? That is ammonia. 

Once the tank is cycled you will be adding fish. Many Loricariads will eat that fungus. So plan on a few Otos, a Bristlenose, or whatever Pleco relative fits in the tank. Small ones are just fine. No need to take up a lot of the bioload with a common Pleco! 

Places to look for ammonia:
Dollar tree and similar stores. 
Ace hardware.
Other hardware stores.
Bottom shelf of the grocery store (where they keep the cheapest stuff). 

Alternatives to ammonia: I think the fish food is working, but your test kit is not. However, something that is higher in protein like a prawn from the grocery store might work, too. 
Garden fertilizer Sulfate of Ammonia would probably work, too. Hmm... maybe I should go try this!


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## danielt (Dec 19, 2012)

Hard to believe there no ammonia reading with a bag of fish food floating in there. Try fresh tests. Watch for the expiration date, you never know for how long they are gathering dust on the shelf.

If the water smells bad, it's full of ammonia that reached a point it gasses out or the fish bag is low on oxygen and hydrogen sulfide (smells like rotten eggs) formed in there.

@houseofcards

I'm fully aware this is a planted tank forum. The topic is not about plants. It's about fishless cycling. That's what I'm rumbling about 

For starters, it's best that the bacteria does not have to compete with anything else for ammonia. The statement plants prefer ammonia first, then nitrates is taken from Diana Walstad's book. Unless you want to test the water daily for ammonia, I think it's best to have only one consumer, bacteria. If they have too little, they starve, if they have too much they slow down.

If you start putting in plants, bacteria will have competition, since you're not testing in realtime, you don't have a good idea if there is enough ammonia to go around for everybody. I wouldn't float a bag of fish food as I wouldn't put plants earlier than the second or third week. If I want a cycle as fast as possible.

I'm not agreeing with any other method of cycling a tank. You can fast cycle a tank in many ways. But it's not stable. The bacteria needs to be in an equilibrium. The ammonia ones in the right ratio to produce enough nitrites and so on. This is not something that can be done by snapping fingers at organisms that multiply in 24-32 hours.

In my opinion, cycling a tank is not the same as having bacteria in it. It needs to have some sort of stability with regards to the nitrogen cycle. That means no spurious spikes of ammonia or nitrites.


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## rininger85 (Jun 30, 2013)

I only read the first half of the posts, but IME the white fungus stuff you are talking about is 1) bacteria growing on the food, and 2) normal growth on driftwood after its been submerged, it goes away on its own, or if its still there when you add fish they'll probably eat it...

cloudiness in the tank is also a good sign of bacteria bloom to get to large enough population to handle the ammonia/nitrite in the tank.


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## annyann (Aug 31, 2013)

Diana said:


> 8 year old test kit is probably too old. Did you test it with the ammonia you have?
> 
> That big a bag of fish food would produce enough ammonia to test positive.
> 
> ...


Thanks for replying to my thread again, I did test my test kit with a drip or two of ammonia in 1/2 gallons of water and it read it as having .50 of ammonia, so the test kit is working. Nitrite is still at .25 and my PH is holding steady at 7.5
The smell in the tank doesn't smell like cat pee or ammonia.... It's hard to describe....My best guess is it smells like old pond water and week old garbage... I think what i'm smelling is the rotting fish food in the bag at the top of the water..
I dont know why the ammonia hasn't showed up in the tank, my plants are growing and putting down roots. Maybe they brought with them enough bacteria to convert the waste to ammonia?? Or maybe they used some of the ammonia as nutrients. 
With only .25 of nitrite in my tank Im wondering if that will be enough to keep me from having mini cycles when I do add my fish?


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## rininger85 (Jun 30, 2013)

the plants are eating the ammonia, as well as the bacteria population is working on it as well. You don't get nitrites without first having ammonia, so its there, just the plants and bacteria are converting/eating it fast enough to keep up with the amount the decaying food is creating... 

You'll be OK! Like I've already said, wait til both are showing 0's, give it an extra week to be safe and then you'll be good. 

If the plants / bacteria are keeping up with the amount of ammonia produced by a big bag of fish food decaying, they'll be able to keep up with a much smaller amount that you feed your fish daily (even if you are adding several you should be OK, because you remove a big amount of decaying food and put back just a little amount for the fish to eat/poop).


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## annyann (Aug 31, 2013)

rininger85 said:


> the plants are eating the ammonia, as well as the bacteria population is working on it as well. You don't get nitrites without first having ammonia, so its there, just the plants and bacteria are converting/eating it fast enough to keep up with the amount the decaying food is creating...
> 
> You'll be OK! Like I've already said, wait til both are showing 0's, give it an extra week to be safe and then you'll be good.
> 
> If the plants / bacteria are keeping up with the amount of ammonia produced by a big bag of fish food decaying, they'll be able to keep up with a much smaller amount that you feed your fish daily (even if you are adding several you should be OK, because you remove a big amount of decaying food and put back just a little amount for the fish to eat/poop).


Thanks rininger85, I know you're right lol. I guess everything is going as it should be. I will probably test again tomorrow to make sure the nitrite is holding steady and then wait a few days or a week till I test again.


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## Diana (Jan 14, 2010)

> If the plants / bacteria are keeping up with the amount of ammonia produced by a big bag of fish food decaying, they'll be able to keep up with a much smaller amount that you feed your fish daily (even if you are adding several you should be OK, because you remove a big amount of decaying food and put back just a little amount for the fish to eat/poop).


Exactly right! Fish food is the source of ammonia after the tank is cycled. So, cycling with fish food, using more than what you will feed the fish is a good way to do this.


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## Positron (Jul 22, 2013)

That fungus will grow on anything decaying until other more beneficial things start growing.


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