# So, what's the deal with the lily pipes?



## jread (Jan 2, 2004)

Why does everyone go ape**** over these? Is it because they're clear or is there more to it?


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

i've been on a recent kick to remove as much crap from the tank as possible. I recently removed eheim inflow and outflow pipes from my 5.5gallon and replaced them with ada pipes. the difference is huge. I don't see the pipes now... before they were very prominent and detracted from the aquascape.


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## fishscale (May 29, 2007)

That's the main reason. I mean there's also the "vortex", which can sort of be achieved by angling your pipe anyway. Mainly, though, because they are clear.


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## smoq (Feb 19, 2008)

Can I buy any other lilly pipes except ADA ones?


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## dougiefresh (Sep 5, 2006)

Check Green Leaf Aquariums the sponsor. And ebay has some listed. Just know your tubing size when you order. Some inflow and outflow are different of eheims.


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## jread (Jan 2, 2004)

Ok, so it _is_ just an aesthetic thing. Thanks for clearing that up for me


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Also fishman9809 sells acrylic ones for cheap. I like them since I'd give glass ones like a week, tops, in my house. :icon_roll


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Yup for looks as I don't want to see them in my tank 

Craig


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

jread said:


> Why does everyone go ape**** over these? Is it because they're clear or is there more to it?



Which do you prefer... 

exhibit A













Or exhibit B


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I have to say A


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## imeridian (Jan 19, 2007)

That's a great set of photos, really illustrates how much an impact there is on focal point.


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## rich815 (May 21, 2008)

B, of course. Until the GSA, GDA, BBA and other assorted algaes and bacterias start their thing. 

Even when the rest of my tank is looking almost algae-free there always seems to be a little GSA or a tad of BBA here and there on older leaves, in the corner somewhere, etc. But it's hardly visible so it's no biggie. 

My pipes get it too, but with my opaque gray Eheim fittings it's not so evident so I only really have to remove and clean them every few months or so (let alone the pipe brush internal cleaning). With those clear ones I'd probably have to clean them every few weeks! 

Sure the clear look MUCH better when new and clean, but.....


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## imeridian (Jan 19, 2007)

rich815 said:


> Sure the clear look MUCH better when new and clean, but.....


Indeed, they look so very awful when they're dirty. Add in the risk of breakage while cleaning to the extreme cost of the glass and I too opt for more practical opaque plastic.


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

That picture comparison is a little skewed. There is practically nothing else in the tank but the pipes. In a fully planted tank the difference is greatly minimized.

Lily pipes certainly aren't _amazing_. I tried them but their cons outweighed the pros in my experience. I have 2 sets up for sale! 

*The good*
They are invisible when clean!

*The bad*
They are ugly when dirty.
They are a pain to clean.
They don't allow the aquarist many options in directing the water flow.
They are fragile.
Open top tanks evaporate fast, requiring regular topping off or adjustement of the pipes to keep the vortex going.

It wasn't worth the extra work for me. A black background and black plastic pipes disappear just as well, and without all the extra work and limitations. And if you aspire to be a master aquascaper they just pull the equipment for beauty shots anyways.


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

rich815 said:


> B, of course. Until the GSA, GDA, BBA and other assorted algaes and bacterias start their thing.
> 
> Even when the rest of my tank is looking almost algae-free there always seems to be a little GSA or a tad of BBA here and there on older leaves, in the corner somewhere, etc. But it's hardly visible so it's no biggie.
> 
> ...


dirty pipes still don't look like unnatural bulky plastic in your tank. cleaning the pipes is easy. I'm cleaning a set right now. won't need to touch them again for a few months



imeridian said:


> Indeed, they look so very awful when they're dirty. Add in the risk of breakage while cleaning to the extreme cost of the glass and I too opt for more practical opaque plastic.


lily pipes are less fragile than glass diffusers. handle with care and you have no worries. all of my tanks except one use lily pipes. I've broken zero to date



prototyp3 said:


> That picture comparison is a little skewed. There is practically nothing else in the tank but the pipes. In a fully planted tank the difference is greatly minimized.
> 
> Lily pipes certainly aren't _amazing_. I tried them but their cons outweighed the pros in my experience. I have 2 sets up for sale!
> 
> ...


i hate planning a scape with hiding pipes in mind. You don't have to w/ glass. dirty pipes still look a lot less bulky and unnatural than plastic pipes do. cleaning them is not hard at all.

leave extra length on your tubing on initial set up.
use sharp scissors to cut below the lily pipe connection.
use a razor and slice vertically down the tubing that is still connected to the lily pipe.
plop in original plastic pipes into tubing to stretch tubing in advance of lily pipe insertion and to keep filtration going.
place lily pipes (i typically include my glass diffusers as well) into bleach solution ( I have a bucket marked BLEACH for cleaning glass only)
let soak overnight
rinse pipes and run a pipe brush through them
add to clean water and dechlor for a few hours
insert back into tubing at your leisure

i really don't care about the vortex. the main drawback for me is creating the ideal water flow. I prefer spray bars... not many feasible options for glass spraybars.

i've been on a mission to pull everything out the tank that I can. Airstones, heaters, co2 diffusers, and plastic pipes. Even dirty... lily pipes are way more aesthetic than plastic.


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

MedRed, you're certainly more dedicated to your aquarium hobby than I. Any maintenance I can cut out will get the axe.

I also find the dirty pipes to be really fugly. I'd rather see opaque plastic than gunked up glassware. But to each their own preferences. They do look nice when properly kept.


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## jinx© (Oct 17, 2007)

I have to agree with quite few points prototyp3 made, especially cleaning and flow direction control.

I just go stealth with a painted black background and satin black fusion sprayed pipes. They're pretty much invisible from across the room and not really eye drawing when close.

I have to admit, for a nano tank I'd consider using the glass pipes though.


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## klumsyninja (Apr 16, 2008)

Does the 'Vortex' clean the skim off the top of the tank?


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## dougiefresh (Sep 5, 2006)

With ADA type looks, details and aesthetics are everything, hence the lily pipes. A lot of maintenance to achieve a lot of these beautiful tanks. Aquascaping is definitely an interactive sport. 

What about sometimes directly squirting a little excel into the intake, would it help keep them cleaner?


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

Or exhibit B










over one month later










So over a month since the lily pipes were placed in this tank and they are still clean . the brown in the slits is AS debris.


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

They better be clean, there's only like 3 plants and no animals in there to foul your tank up. Get that baby stocked for a down and dirty test!


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## helgymatt (Dec 7, 2007)

prototyp3 said:


> That picture comparison is a little skewed. There is practically nothing else in the tank but the pipes. In a fully planted tank the difference is greatly minimized.
> 
> Lily pipes certainly aren't _amazing_. I tried them but their cons outweighed the pros in my experience. I have 2 sets up for sale!
> 
> ...


Not for sale anymore I'm going to give them (yours) a shot because I'm trying out an Iwagumi style tank. I think in that type of tank, glass pipes can make a larger difference than in a planted tank with tall background plants to disguise the plastic pipes. 

I figure, with all the other things I have to do in this hobby like clean the tank glass, prune the plants, clean the filters, tediously plant HC:icon_eek:, etc.,....whats so hard about cleaning glass pipes? 

The $100+ cost for pipes was astounding to me and I just couldn't justify the cost until I found the knock-offs (Powermen brand) which are sold for $50 bucks a set. That I can afford.

You are right that the black pipes blend in better with a black background, but when you don't have a background, I think black (or ehim green, etc) pipes are distracting. For some reason I have grown to hate black backgrounds so now both of my tanks are open to the white wall behind. I splash some uplighting up behind the tank and I like that effect a lot more. Things just look brighter and cleaner than the black. I will say that a darker, more subtle background is great for a lot of tank styles though. If I decide to go with black backgrounds again, I will be painting it on, and not using the black plastic and scotch tape:icon_cool


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## dthb4438 (Nov 12, 2007)

Aren't the acrylic ones just a little stronger than the glass? I seem to have a problem with the glass breaking and slicing my hands. I opt for the lily pipes. Tired of looking at the green Eheim ones. Do they make spray bars that are acrylic? I am interested in those.


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## helgymatt (Dec 7, 2007)

The think the acrylic may be stronger in some ways, but in other ways I don't. For example I saw the vids of where fishman was droping pieces of acrylic pipe on the ground and rolling it under its shoe. Nice to see you can drop it, but you will see he didn't drop an "actual" pipe. It would be very easy to break the tube once bent into shape, because that point where you heat and bend is much weaker than virgin pipe. I broke my 1/2" set getting them out of the box. It is also easy to break glass ones, especially against another hard surface like other glass or stone. So it is my opinion that both are fragile in different ways


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## helgymatt (Dec 7, 2007)

I think it would really have to mess up to have the glass break and slice your hand. Like use a pliers to hold the glass in one hand and push the tubing on with your other hand...don't try this at home!!! 

When gripping the glass pipe in one hand and pushing/sliding the hose on with the other hand I find it would be really hard to break the glass. Heating the tubing will help a lot! Boil a bit of water and dip the tubing in there for a bit.


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## EdTheEdge (Jan 25, 2007)

jread said:


> Why does everyone go ape**** over these? Is it because they're clear or is there more to it?


They're over priced overrated hard to clean easily breakable get dirty fast hard to attach nausiatingly praised overly oogled pieces of glass.

Other than that they're sweet!


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## fshfanatic (Apr 20, 2006)

jread said:


> Why does everyone go ape**** over these? Is it because they're clear or is there more to it?


I couldnt care less. personally I think they look like crap after awhile once they get gunked up, they tend to break when you clean them. No thanks.


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## helgymatt (Dec 7, 2007)

Here's a nice way to look at it. Some people like a "cleaner" look to things. Matter of personal taste. Some people like to keep their Jaguars waxed and shinny while others keep their Pontiac full of bird crap and road salt i.e. ME Funny though, that I have more care about my planted tank than my Pontiac.


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

helgymatt said:


> Not for sale anymore I'm going to give them (yours) a shot because I'm trying out an Iwagumi style tank. I think in that type of tank, glass pipes can make a larger difference than in a planted tank with tall background plants to disguise the plastic pipes.
> 
> I figure, with all the other things I have to do in this hobby like clean the tank glass, prune the plants, clean the filters, tediously plant HC:icon_eek:, etc.,....whats so hard about cleaning glass pipes?
> 
> ...


I'm with you on the black background thing. I started with it but now I prefer the white background, especially for iwagumi. And I agree that's where glass pipes also have their value. But with any type of tall background plant I'd just hide the ugly equipment behind it to keep from becoming an eyesore.

The glass pipes are surprisingly strong and took every bump without breaking. I thought for sure I'd break them, I've broken enough glass diffusers... 

Having done the black background and equipment thing to the glassware thing, I can safely say my next tank will have a sump. Perfect place to hide the equipment with no over-the-edge plumbing, and a constant water level in the display tank. Talk about perfect!


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## ddtran46 (Jul 8, 2008)

helgymatt said:


> Not for sale anymore I'm going to give them (yours) a shot because I'm trying out an Iwagumi style tank. I think in that type of tank, glass pipes can make a larger difference than in a planted tank with tall background plants to disguise the plastic pipes.
> 
> I figure, with all the other things I have to do in this hobby like clean the tank glass, prune the plants, clean the filters, tediously plant HC:icon_eek:, etc.,....whats so hard about cleaning glass pipes?
> 
> ...


Where did you find the powermen lily pipes? I tired looking but no luck.


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

prototyp3 said:


> They better be clean, there's only like 3 plants and no animals in there to foul your tank up. Get that baby stocked for a down and dirty test!


this tank was set up before... dumped everything out and added fresh aquasoil and plants from an existing tank. That means existing algae spores, high light, and an overabundance of nutrients. This is typically the stage where algae goes nuts.


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

EdTheEdge said:


> They're over priced overrated hard to clean easily breakable get dirty fast hard to attach nausiatingly praised overly oogled pieces of glass.
> 
> Other than that they're sweet!


overpriced yes... hard to clean no, easily breakable no, dirty fast no, hard to attach no. 

the pic above is a pic of lily pipes over a month old in a tank's most algae intense stage of cycling... and they are clean. I've not broken a single pipe and i have lily pipes on 5 tanks. My glass diffusers get gunked up with algae 4x as fast as the glass pipes do. 

I posted instructions above on an regimen for painlessly cleaning pipes.


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## helgymatt (Dec 7, 2007)

Ebay - check the buyer International Fish Street
http://cgi.ebay.com/Inflow-Outflow-...ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

Also here...aquahk8
http://cgi.ebay.com.my/Aquarium-Inf...Pipe-17mm_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQitemZ180295750320


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## Minsc (Jul 9, 2006)

Having tried to make these things, I'm not convinced they are overpriced either.
I briefly worked on a set with an experienced glass artist, and it was a massive pain in the rear. They require a lot more time and effort than I assumed.


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## KC21386 (Feb 15, 2008)

Not to hijack this wonderful thread, but can anyone list some tank-safe spray paints? I'd like to paint my new eheim hardward flat black to match my background. Thanks.


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## Riiz (Apr 30, 2008)

Krylon Fusion Black is the only paint I've used inside the aquarium. There might be others, but I've never heard of them.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

I'm not knocking lily pipes, it's cool if that's your thing. But just because you don't use them doesn't mean your tank must have 'green monsters' in your tank prominently displayed. There are many ways to achieve a clean look.

Exhibit C:









Please pardon the light coming in from the blinds. 
Everything is in the back right corner. All is black or dark grey. Pretty inconspicuous if you ask me. In tank I have: Rena XP3 intake and outlet tubes, co2 line and internal reactor, heater, airline, airstone, and drop checker. I need to hit the XP3 output with some Krylon fusion...it's a dark grey, not black. The bright blue intake has already been painted. The drop checker is quite visible, but that's sorta the point.


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

Here are my evedince pics. Used with a Kodak P&S with no editing whatsoever.

Before I even had some Manzanita attempting to hide it.









Now the ZEN look. :icon_cool

















I think thats kind of a skewed pic. You have a highlight tank with background light. So the camera under exposes the pic. It also looks like it has been "cleaned up" ir darkened in certian areas with some form of editing software. Im sure to the naked eye the pipes are much more noticable.




macclellan said:


> I'm not knocking lily pipes, it's cool if that's your thing. But just because you don't use them doesn't mean your tank must have 'green monsters' in your tank prominently displayed. There are many ways to achieve a clean look.
> 
> Exhibit C:
> 
> ...


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

bsmith782 said:


> I think thats kind of a skewed pic. You have a highlight tank with background light. So the camera under exposes the pic. It also looks like it has been "cleaned up" ir darkened in certian areas with some form of editing software. Im sure to the naked eye the pipes are much more noticable.


Regarding my tank, the grey pipe is somewhat noticeable, the other one barely, and you can see any of the other gear at all. I rubber stamped some floating 'micro' tennellus in photoshop that accumulated there - I hardly ever see it since the tank is low, but it looked unsightly in the picture. The image is otherwise unedited. I can get a better pic once nighttime rolls around here.

With regards to your tank, I'd actually argue that since everything is clear and you have no background, the black suction cups in your pic stand out far more than anything in my tank. Can you do away with them, or substitute clear ones? That would help a lot.

Anyways, the more important point is, using a background, one can make things pretty inconspicuous. You could have done that with your tank too. Lilly pipes are another way. I also like the idea of drilling tanks on the bottom and keeping everything inline. Different strokes for different folks...more than one way to skin a cat.


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

ddtran46 said:


> Where did you find the powermen lily pipes? I tired looking but no luck.


Did You find the links?

If you didn't, here they are.
*closed by Kyle:* http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-shop/78242-fs-filter-equip.html
*open thread:* http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-shop/70351-custom-made-inflow-outflow-pipes-made.html


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

I need some 1/2" suction cup clip things. They only sell the small ones at LFS's around me and all of those are in a pack with other stuff.



macclellan said:


> Regarding my tank, the grey pipe is somewhat noticeable, the other one barely, and you can see any of the other gear at all. I rubber stamped some floating 'micro' tennellus in photoshop that accumulated there - I hardly ever see it since the tank is low, but it looked unsightly in the picture. The image is otherwise unedited. I can get a better pic once nighttime rolls around here.
> 
> With regards to your tank, I'd actually argue that since everything is clear and you have no background, the black suction cups in your pic stand out far more than anything in my tank. Can you do away with them, or substitute clear ones? That would help a lot.
> 
> Anyways, the more important point is, using a background, one can make things pretty inconspicuous. You could have done that with your tank too. Lilly pipes are another way. I also like the idea of drilling tanks on the bottom and keeping everything inline. Different strokes for different folks...more than one way to skin a cat.


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