# Newbie needing substrate advice!



## Quagulator (May 4, 2015)

matt769 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I am hoping to create a planted tank with my new 84" x 24" x 24" tank!
> 
> ...


See bold. Successful planted tank with plain, inert gravel / sand are all over this forum. Cheap, easy to maintain, easy to clean, lasts the life of the tank, no mess when moving plants and comes in many colours at a very affordable price. Save money on the substrate to spend on lighting / CO2 / fertilizers and plants!


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## matt769 (Jan 7, 2020)

Quagulator said:


> See bold. Successful planted tank with plain, inert gravel / sand are all over this forum. Cheap, easy to maintain, easy to clean, lasts the life of the tank, no mess when moving plants and comes in many colours at a very affordable price. Save money on the substrate to spend on lighting / CO2 / fertilizers and plants!


That's brilliant! Exactly what I wanted to hear so thank you 

I think the specialist soil may be good in smaller tanks but as mines rather large its just not economic! I did get rather worried when I started costing it up..

Haha, I plan to have a slightly open area as I would like 2 smaller variety pleco's so I'll see if they tear up the plants! I'm planing on placing rocks around the plants so that there's a reduced possibility of it happening.

Would you say sand or gravel is better in terms of not causing any issues as ive heard that you can get build up of things under sand - I'd have a community tank including burrowers and snails.

What thickness to you have your gravel/sand at or would recommend?

Last question! Haha - what would you recommend as fertiliser/dosing for the plants when using gravel/sand?

The tank will have a black vinyl applied background so my plan is to have a darker coloured substrate to match this and create a modern looking tank 

I will have a look into those suggestions you've made now, would you recommend any particular suppliers at all?

Many thanks


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

I second Quagulator regarding staying clear of eco-complete or flourite. They are inert and add no nutrients to the party and are expensive in large quantities.

You can definitely just go with sand (pool filter sander is probably the cheapest and most uniform variety available in the USA, no idea about the UK but would be surprised if its much different). Another option is to buy a bag or two of aquasoil. I know George Farmer and MD Fishtanks (youtubers) are in the UK and both are sponsored by Tropica which has their own brand of substrate (thus I know its relatively easy to get in the UK) and you could certainly buy a bag or two of their substrate. This is no where near enough to cover your tank but you wouldn't need to. Instead just put some down in the area you know will be planted then cap it with sand. An inch of aquasoil followed by an inch or sand would do fine. Elsewhere 3 inches or less of sand is a good way to go. Burrowing fish will mix the substrates up over time, so it might be a good idea to add a few handfuls of darker colored aquarium gravel on the surface of the sand so the aquasoil won't stand out as much as it gets brought to the surface.

Most sands you will find will be lighter colored. So you will want to keep that in mind.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

If your new to this, my advise for a deep tank (24") that's going to be partially planted with rock/wood is go with easy slow growing, low light plants and use a dark substrate. Although pool filter sand is great, it will discolor and get littered with waste and will need to be maintenanced on a regular basis. Use mostly ferns, anubias, crypts and other slower growing plants that are attached to hardscape and can be higher up in the water column. Reaching down tow feet for frequent trimming/maintenance can get old, fast. 

Deep tanks require a lot of light to reach the bottom. So if the tank isn't heavily planted this can easily cause algae issues. That's why low-light plants are key. 

One final thing, I would learn about co2 and use it. It makes growing everything easier. Even in low light plants grow better and their uptake of nutrients is increased which makes algae related issues less likely.


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## zwalter08 (Feb 12, 2019)

I have a 20 gallon long planted. I needed to go cheap so i went with potting soil capped with sand. I have no complaints except in the beginning mine clouded the water for a while but i did like 50% water change ever other day and within a few weeks it was crystal clear. Otherwise my plants are triple the size and i dont run CO2. The only thing is the soil has to be organic i believe. do some research before getting the soil because certain ones can effect the water parameters. But this is a super cheap alternative and i personally love the look of sand.


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## kgbudge (Feb 8, 2019)

My 55 gallon planted and 5 gallon betta tank both use water filter sand as substrate. I've enriched it somewhat with laterite but mostly because I have a very old box around that needs using up. The only complaint I have is that the sand is slightly coarser than optimum.


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## Quagulator (May 4, 2015)

matt769 said:


> What thickness to you have your gravel/sand at or would recommend?
> 
> Last question! Haha - what would you recommend as fertiliser/dosing for the plants when using gravel/sand?
> 
> ...


I would not go less than 1.5" in the front, then up to 3" - 4" in the back. 

I would recommend either an all-in-one fertilizer such as Thrive, or dry ferts and follow PPS-Pro or a modified EI light. 

Check out this website to determine how much of what to dose:

https://rotalabutterfly.com/nutrient-calculator.php

For black / dark substrate, google the UK equivalent of black diamond blasting sand. It's coal slag used for sand blasting things, find a supplier and check the SDS sheets to see if they are similar. In Canada where I'm at, K @ E industrial sand is essentially the exact same as black diamond blasting stand our American friends use, so I use the K @ E stuff. 

Check out astro - turf infill sands, they are inert (the ones I've seen anyway) and can come in various colours.


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## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

To me sand should be kept to no more than 3” thick, also grain size of 1-3mm is best. Avoid cheap sands that look like one on right here, to fine, makes it hard for most plant root to penetrate and doesn’t allow adequate circulation into substrate layer, the size on left is proper grain/pore size. 










If you go for black diamond blast sand (coal slag) go for medium 12/40 grit, not the fine.

Good resource for how’s and whys of of substrate, in fact his whole website is a wealth of fact based information you should read start to finish.

https://www.advancedplantedtank.com/defining-good-substrate.html


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## Quagulator (May 4, 2015)

matt769 said:


> This is what I’ve managed to find so far:
> [Ebay Link Removed]


Do you have a "tractor supply" or "TSC" style store where you are located? 

Some hardware stores can carry coal slag as well, try looking up coal slag abrasives around you. 

Again, check the SDS sheet compared to Black Diamond Blasting Sand to make sure they are close, do a bucket test if you buy some on TDS / pH / kH / gH just to confirm it's not adding anything dramatically.


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## matt769 (Jan 7, 2020)

I’ve had a look but we don’t really have that equivalent in the uk unfortunately and haven’t been able to find anywhere to source it from


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## JJJessee (Jan 8, 2020)

matt769 said:


> This is what I’ve managed to find so far:
> [Ebay Link Removed]
> 
> Not too bad for £32.99 for 30kg delivered and it’s 1-3mm if this isn’t too fine
> ...





I would try a farm supply store.

In the states, Tractor Supply Co, a sort of 'big box' agriculture store seems to stock it.

In the old days, I remember using a "Gran-i-Grit" used in chicken feed -also sold at the feed store. Our local was a salt and pepper white crushed granite, dusty but cheap. Still available it seems.


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## OldOne14 (Jan 13, 2020)

*I have 6ftx2ftx2ft 180 gal build in the works.*

I've been following this thread with great interest. You all are a wealth of information. I'm going with 12/40 black sand. I'm lucky and have a Tractor Supply down the road with it in stock. My question is before I put the sand in is there any ferts I should first. Like Crushed coral for calcium or clay etc...


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## Quagulator (May 4, 2015)

OldOne14 said:


> I've been following this thread with great interest. You all are a wealth of information. I'm going with 12/40 black sand. I'm lucky and have a Tractor Supply down the road with it in stock. My question is before I put the sand in is there any ferts I should first. Like Crushed coral for calcium or clay etc...


You don't need any, but you can lay half a handful of Osmocote+ fertilizer down before adding sand, again, not needed. 

Go easy on the osmocote+ if you use it... a little goes a long way and you can always add more later. 

My vote would be just go with 100% sand and not add anything to it, keep things simple and clean.


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## OldOne14 (Jan 13, 2020)

Sounds good. I love simple and easy.


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## Desert Pupfish (May 6, 2019)

For anyone starting a new planted tank, I highly recommend checking out Dennis Wong's website, and especially his section on substrates: https://www.advancedplantedtank.com/substrates-overview.html

As you'll see from his excellently written article, and the myriad posts on this site, whether or not to use dirt is a hotly debated topic. As a newbie who started my first dirted tank about 7 months ago, I can attest that dirt is less predictable than an inert substrate, and the first month or so was a bit of a rollercoaster given the unpredictable nutrient leaching. But I've found, as have many others, that plants thrive in dirt, and IMHO gives a heads up to planted tank newbies to grow plants well. So much so that I'm starting up a second larger tank with dirt as well.

Lots to learn, and if you ask here you'll get lots of opinions. The challenge (and fun part) will be deciding what will work best for you in your situation. There's no right or wrong answer here (but plenty of advice!)

Good luck!


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## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

matt769 said:


> This is what I’ve managed to find so far:
> [Ebay Link Removed]
> 
> Not too bad for £32.99 for 30kg delivered and it’s 1-3mm if this isn’t too fine
> ...


That’s looks like this floracor black so probably a tumbled volcanic type substrate. Size seems right and that’s way cheaper than floracor.

Activ·Flora? Planted Aquarium Substrate by World Wide Imports Ent., Inc.


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## matt769 (Jan 7, 2020)

I'm going to order this today as its alot cheaper than anything else I can find

Gona go for around 100kg or abit less of substrate


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## rajdude (Apr 13, 2020)

*thank you!*

a bunch of thanks for this thread. I read up on all the posts PLUS the excellent website of 2 hour aquarist (?)
Very good information.


I think after reading this all, I will just go with Black Diamond from the local Tractor Supply store. Cant be beat for just 10 bucks, right? :grin2:


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