# Alternanthera reineckii 'cardinalis'



## ADJAquariums

Anyone have good info on this plant? i saw it at petsmart yesterday and though... Man i cant pass this up, so i got it, i thought the reds and pinks looked very nice.


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## chevyguy8893

I couldn't find much information on it when I bought it, but it is a good plant from my experience. In my case it is not a fast grower and seems to be more bushy, but that could be an error on my end since I am still learning. The only substrate nutrients it gets is from seachem root tabs and basic liquid ferts (Leaf Zone and Comprehensive). Mine started out pretty small and took over an end of the tank in a couple months. It seems to be responding better with CO2 injection now. 

I had to thin a lot of it out because it got covered in BBA, but it is not lost. I found this plant actually grows pretty well emersed too, so anything covered in BBA gets to grow out and the algae dies . I attached an older picture before the algae (ignore the sad looking red ludwigia that brought the algae with it). I hope this helps a little with my lack of specific details.


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## P015

Hey chevyguy, I've had my plant for 2 weeks now and it doesn't seem to be doing much at all in terms of growth. Some of the leaves are also melting and curling..did your leaves melt initially? (I dose excel everyday) A lot of rooting is also growing from the stem itself.

Just curious if your initial leaves melted away/fell off initially and then it grew newer better leaves.

BTW i have medium LED lighting and also aquasoil.


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## chevyguy8893

P015 said:


> Hey chevyguy, I've had my plant for 2 weeks now and it doesn't seem to be doing much at all in terms of growth. Some of the leaves are also melting and curling..did your leaves melt initially? (I dose excel everyday) A lot of rooting is also growing from the stem itself.
> 
> Just curious if your initial leaves melted away/fell off initially and then it grew newer better leaves.
> 
> BTW i have medium LED lighting and also aquasoil.


Mine didn't have much in the form of new growth in the first couple weeks, except for roots shooting out from the stems. I did not encounter any melting or leaf curling though. This may be, and I could be wrong, due to the possibility that it was grown emersed in the agar gel it is adapting. The only loss of leaves they had was the low, small leaves that were shaded from the light. I would think that enough nutrients would come from the aquasoil for it, but I am unsure of the light requirements for it. Before the CO2 system it was growing fine on a double dose of API CO2 booster. 

If it helps at all mine are grown under a 48W T5HO aquatic life dual fixture with cheap 5000K and 6700K bulbs. So, I think that is moderate by some and high light by Hoppy's chart over a 20 gallon. Sorry I can't be of more help here.


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## ADJAquariums

I think this plant is a really cool little plant, hopefully it doesnt grow too tall and grows more bushy, id love to have a lower growing plant


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## P015

chevyguy8893 said:


> Mine didn't have much in the form of new growth in the first couple weeks, except for roots shooting out from the stems. I did not encounter any melting or leaf curling though. This may be, and I could be wrong, due to the possibility that it was grown emersed in the agar gel it is adapting. The only loss of leaves they had was the low, small leaves that were shaded from the light. I would think that enough nutrients would come from the aquasoil for it, but I am unsure of the light requirements for it. Before the CO2 system it was growing fine on a double dose of API CO2 booster.
> 
> If it helps at all mine are grown under a 48W T5HO aquatic life dual fixture with cheap 5000K and 6700K bulbs. So, I think that is moderate by some and high light by Hoppy's chart over a 20 gallon. Sorry I can't be of more help here.


No, you were pretty helpful! I'll just continue with what I'm doing and see what happens in a few weeks lol. Hopefully, I can get it to grow. 
To ADJ, the plant is beautiful so it is definitely worth a try. I also read somewhere trimming the tops will help it branch out more and become more bushy. Also did either of you buy any of the other plants in the agar packets? I bought needle leaf ludwigia and it has been taking off, next time I want to buy the micro sword.


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## chevyguy8893

P015 said:


> No, you were pretty helpful! I'll just continue with what I'm doing and see what happens in a few weeks lol. Hopefully, I can get it to grow.
> To ADJ, the plant is beautiful so it is definitely worth a try. I also read somewhere trimming the tops will help it branch out more and become more bushy. Also did either of you buy any of the other plants in the agar packets? I bought needle leaf ludwigia and it has been taking off, next time I want to buy the micro sword.


Well I am glad I could help. I hope it turns around for you since it is a nice looking plant. 

As for other plants in the gel, I have the cryptocoryne wendtii "green" growing well in my 10 gallon betta tank and also growing strong emersed. I also bought the dwarf hairgrass that is doing well in a dry start tank. Took a while to find a pack that wasn't mush though. I was thinking of buying the needle leaf ludwigia, so it is good to know it grows really well too. I am curious about the micro sword and how it does too.


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## xxUnRaTeDxxRkOxx

http://www.fishchannel.com/fish-species/plant-profiles/alternanthera-reineckii-2.aspx

I have bought a couple packages of that plant, kinda seem to die off a bit, but location in my tank will mean life or death of any plant lol. I've also got the Bacopa that grew like no tomorrow, I've got some of the Wendtii green that's doing amazing, and I got a bit of the dwarf hairgrass which didn't do so good.

But I plan to carpet my sera 60 nanocube with the wendtii green, and add some spots of dwarf sag to it.


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## AquaLady86

Im wondering the same thing. How do I care for it and how to I plant it? Mine are babies not even an inch long yet.


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## ADJAquariums

When did this come back up? It likes a nutrient rich substrate and a good deal of light, I have mine in direct sunlight for up to 6 hours a day, so I can't really give a good idea as to light requirements


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## snausage

Lol, I picked up a pack of these growing agar the last time I went to petsmart. 

Mine are all doing quite well and I think every individual stem is still alive and kicking. 

I also threw 2 stems in a low light emersed setup and they seem to be growing very quickly.


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## dtejeda.arias

I have some of those. Very very slow growers! I use them as a foreground plant. My leaves are not that red though


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## OVT

Some pictures would be great. Thanks!

via Droid DNA Tapatalk 2


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## chevyguy8893

Seeing that this thread came up again, I figured I'd give an update to how I have done with this plant. Growing it out emersed gave me much faster growth and healthier stems that could be easily transitioned to submerged growth. I think my lack of knowledge and keeping the stems bunched together in my old post kept the smaller leaf growth, but I can't prove it.

I kept them in a closed up sterilite tub in pots of MGOCPM, old EI dosed tank water changed once a month, 2 T12 (one full spectrum, and one unknown plant grow bulb) directly above the container on a 14 hour photoperiod, water kept at 80F (cold basement), and an airstone for water movement. I am not very good about opening up the container, and never had to mist because the humidity seemed very high (never tested it). I have never had any flowering under these conditions, but they all grew very well to me.

Even for the time I had it under a 4 T5HO Catalina fixture on my 29 gallon, with CO2 that was not limiting, it still grew fairly slow. Compared to the other alternanthera reineckii species I have, the 'cardinalis' was the fastest grower for some reason. The growth also seems to be healthier looking with higher nitrates for whatever reason that may be. 

Emersed growth (old pictures)


















Old picture of the submerged growth before I gave it away.


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## OVT

Thanks a lot for the pictures.
To me, this looks like a 'regular' Alternanthera reineckii (Copperleaf).
So, I am still trying to find out where and how 'cardinalis' comes into play :iamwithst


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## chevyguy8893

OVT said:


> Thanks a lot for the pictures.
> To me, this looks like a 'regular' Alternanthera reineckii (Copperleaf).
> So, I am still trying to find out where and how 'cardinalis' comes into play :iamwithst


I was starting to think the same thing after getting what was sold as Alternanthera reineckii once it grew out more of the submerged growth. Maybe it is just another way to sell it easier under a different name, it wouldn't be the first time. I may add one of the emersed stems back to the tank to grow out next to the other alternanthera and compare the growth.


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## Zorfox

OVT said:


> So, I am still trying to find out where and how 'cardinalis' comes into play


Unfortunately, there seems to be little reputable explanation for this. I can only assume that Alternathera reineckii or a variety of this species was incorrectly named Telanthera 'cardinalis'.

Tropicos lists Alternanthera and Telanthera as a separate genus while others list them as synonyms. It's quite confusing when even botanical taxonomy seems conflicting. Tropicos lists Alternanthera reineckii as being a species of the Alternathera genus. Then of course we have the varieties such as rosefolia. Clearly the plants listed as Telanthera 'cardinalis' are not of another genus hence my argument for an improper naming technique.

All this suggest that Telanthera 'cardinalis' is indeed A. reineckii. However, the question is, what variety is it. Other than random posts in forums saying T. Cardinalis is the same as A. R. roseafilia are the same, I don't know. I would like to get to the bottom of it lol

The taxonomy as listed by Tropicos

*Telanthera Taxonomy*
class: Equisetopsida C. Agardh 
subclass: Magnoliidae Novák ex Takht. 
superorder: Caryophyllanae Takht. 
order: !Caryophyllales Juss. ex Bercht. & J. Presl 
family: Amaranthaceae Juss.
genus: _Telanthera_ R. Br. 
　
*Alternathera Reineckii Taxonomy*
class: Equisetopsida C. Agardh 
subclass: Magnoliidae Novák ex Takht. 
superorder: Caryophyllanae Takht. 
order: !Caryophyllales Juss. ex Bercht. & J. Presl 
family: Amaranthaceae Juss. 
genus: _Alternanthera_ Forssk. 
species: _Alternanthera reineckii_ Briq.


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## kingjombeejoe

I have the same plant from petsmart and also 2 other very similar plants that were sold to me as Alternathera reineckii 'ROSAEFOLIA', Alternathera reineckii 'LILACINA'. These plants all grow very similar and I don't know which of those other 2 are which. I do notice the "CARDINALIS" has a more deeper red color than the others and grows short and bushy. Of the other 2, one grows tall and thin and has a more lighter red, almost pink-purple color to it. The other one has a yellowish color on the top and pink undersides and also grows short and bushy. Sorry to ramble. I just assumed when I got them the "CARDINALIS" was for the dark almost cardinal red color it has, as opposed to the yellow and pinkish-purple of the other 2


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## Zorfox

I've seen many posts from hobbyist that describe cardinalis differently from roseafolia. The common theme seems the color is more red for 'Cardinalis' while 'roseafolia' has a muted copper tone but more maroon than 'copper leaf'. It's hard to say since environment plays a huge role in coloration. It seems to me at least 'cardinalis' may be a different var. from 'roseafolia'. I would venture to guess that telanthera 'cardinalis' should aptly be called alternanthera reineckii 'cardinalis' but who knows lol


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## danellis1229

nothing like bringing a post back to life 

does this spread then grows high i bought 2 packages tissue cultured have it in a co2 tank for 2 months looks like a great carpet but only about 3 inches high was hoping for a background plant


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## twkoch

Mine grows nice and tall, as well as pretty quickly. I had organic dirt as substrate, dual t5ho lights, and pressurized co2 in this setup. Did not dose any ferts.


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## aclaar877

Wow, that looks great. I've been trying to grow the same thing from Petsmart for a few months, and mine is only a few inches tall too. It's not in the best shape, but getting bigger leaves now. I have CO2 mist blowing right on it. I'd kill to grow them like twkoch...


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