# very best substrate



## gonefishy1981 (Jul 31, 2006)

what is the best substrate known to the planted tank, and i dont care how much it cost


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## DiabloCanine (Aug 26, 2005)

gonefishy1981 said:


> what is the best substrate known to the planted tank, and i dont care how much it cost


Okay, I'll start the war....Onyx sand......Eco complete.....soilmaster.....pick one....DC


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## tazcrash69 (Sep 27, 2005)

DiabloCanine said:


> Okay, I'll start the war....Onyx sand......Eco complete.....soilmaster.....pick one....DC



:icon_twis Return Fire:

I like my Flourite, but hear some really great things about the ADA stuff.

FWIW "Best" is in the eye of the beholder.


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## Bert H (Dec 15, 2003)

> and i dont care how much it cost


 That might be the key statement....ADA stuff, from what I hear. Personally, I use Eco and Flourite and am happy with it.


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## JenThePlantGeek (Mar 27, 2006)

I've heard of some pretty rockin' root growth using plain old garden soil, but you have to be careful with it.

I personally have used Soilmaster Pro Select Charcoal, Turface, Flourite, ecoComplete, and fine flint gravel + laterite. So far I think the Soilmaster Pro Select Charcoal is my favorite, with Flourite as a close second.


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## Marilyn1998 (Mar 8, 2006)

I have Soil Master Select Red and I love it!!! I think second best I would go with Eco Complete. (and the Soil Master only cost $10 to do a 90 gallon tank)


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## MiSo (Oct 26, 2005)

i use eco and love it, but i would love to try the ada stuff.


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

ADA is bar none the best stuff.


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## Brilliant (Apr 11, 2006)

ianiwane said:


> ADA is bar none the best stuff.



Would choose eco only because I havent tried the stuff above.

And would most likely vote ADA because of initial grief caused b eco.

However, ADA seems to be some sort of mystery product like the soilmaster select.


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## trustbran (Jun 27, 2006)

I would have to say its gotta be ADA Aqua Soil hands down! and for those of you who don't believe this, go grab a bag for yourself and try it and you will be amazed at the plant growth you will witness...............


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## Brilliant (Apr 11, 2006)

trustbran said:


> I would have to say its gotta be ADA Aqua Soil hands down! and for those of you who don't believe this, go grab a bag for yourself and try it and you will be amazed at the plant growth you will witness...............


Where? Am I able to pickup locally?


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## trustbran (Jun 27, 2006)

I think you could try giving Jeff a call at ADG...I usually pick mine up at Aqua Forest in SF, CA............


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## mrbelvedere (Nov 15, 2005)

I really wish people would quit asking this question.


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## BlueRam (Sep 21, 2004)

Best is so subjective.

If you like black, try (decreasing cost) ADA, Eco, onyx, and SM select.

If you like red, try _(edit:ADA)_ fluorite, SM Select

If you like sand, try ADA product, Laplace luster, quartz sand, "play sand"

And there are may other thinks people have tried including kitty litter and making layers etc...

If cost is no object, I would like to use gold nuggets. I will personally test the viability of gold as a substrate if the members would be kind enough to send an appropriate volume.:thumbsup:




gonefishy1981 said:


> what is the best substrate known to the planted tank, and i dont care how much it cost


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## JenThePlantGeek (Mar 27, 2006)

> I really wish people would quit asking this question.


Do you mean "which is the best substrate?" or "where do I get ADA products locally?". You don't HAVE to read threads with the 'same old topic' if you don't want to. There's nothing wrong with asking questions, please don't make the newbs feel bad for asking. If you don't feel like repeating yourself, just let someone else answer.


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## gonefishy1981 (Jul 31, 2006)

thank you jen


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

I agree and disagree. One should first use the search feature and if they do not find what they are looking for then post the question. After all that is why there is a search feature. There have been numerous threads along this line so i do get were mrbelvedere is comming from. But at the same time if someones asks then we should give them a good answer.


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## fshfanatic (Apr 20, 2006)

So, what is the best substrate?


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## JenThePlantGeek (Mar 27, 2006)

I personally liked BlueRam's answer best: 



> Best is so subjective.
> 
> If you like black, try (decreasing cost) ADA, Eco, onyx, and SM select.
> 
> ...


Haha, here we go repeating ourselves again. Oh well....


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

You are also forgeting the ADA comes in Malaysia and Africana which are both brownish red. Also ADA aquasoil does not really cost any more than eco, onyx, or flourite. Each ADA bag may cost more, however the ADA bags are a lot bigger than the eco, onyx or flourite bags.


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## BlueRam (Sep 21, 2004)

ianiwane said:


> You are also forgetting the ADA comes in Malaysia and Africana which are both brownish red. Also ADA aquasoil does not really cost any more than eco, onyx, or flourite. Each ADA bag may cost more, however the ADA bags are a lot bigger than the eco, onyx or flourite bags.


With a heavy item like substrate, the cost to deliver may exceed the cost of the product. (Thinking one bag of soilmaster (~$15) shipped ($$)). As always, the cost goes down for multiple bags etc. You are right in that the bags are of different size. However a big tank with any of the name brand products is going to be expensive.

The benefit of an expensive substrate varies with the tank set up and dosing scheme. That is that no one product will make a perfect planted tank experience of an algae free, vibrant, aquascaped masterpiece.


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## JenThePlantGeek (Mar 27, 2006)

A good substrate WILL make your life easier though. Plain gravel, kitty litter or soil can cause trouble for newbies, where as Flourite or others are much easier and tend to _help_ facilitate "a perfect planted tank experience of an algae free, vibrant, aquascaped masterpiece", in addition to good husbandry of course.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I've tried every substrate listed here and few that have not been.

Overall, for the hobbyists, ADA Aqua soil is the best stuff I've used.

It's easy to use first off. Cost about the same, on average as Flourite, it's cheaper than EC, now some clown will come in and say they found free shipping for EC and they got it for 12.99 a bag etc, you might get lucky on cost, but on average, the cost are similar.
But the plants will do better with the ADA AS.

ADA As works very well with EI dosing.
When you have non limiting conditions in the water column, then you can compare the differences done via the substrate without water column interactions.



Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## fshfanatic (Apr 20, 2006)

So where can I get ADA AS locally?


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## trustbran (Jun 27, 2006)

JenThePlantGeek said:


> Do you mean "which is the best substrate?" or "where do I get ADA products locally?". You don't HAVE to read threads with the 'same old topic' if you don't want to. There's nothing wrong with asking questions, please don't make the newbs feel bad for asking. If you don't feel like repeating yourself, just let someone else answer.


Now thats a good thought......:thumbsup:


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

If you notice I was not comparing it to soilmaster.



BlueRam said:


> With a heavy item like substrate, the cost to deliver may exceed the cost of the product. (Thinking one bag of soilmaster (~$15) shipped ($$)). As always, the cost goes down for multiple bags etc. You are right in that the bags are of different size. However a big tank with any of the name brand products is going to be expensive.
> 
> The benefit of an expensive substrate varies with the tank set up and dosing scheme. That is that no one product will make a perfect planted tank experience of an algae free, vibrant, aquascaped masterpiece.


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## xcooperx (Jun 21, 2006)

Flourite is still the best!!!


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## Brilliant (Apr 11, 2006)

fshfanatic said:


> So where can I get ADA AS locally?


Thats a better thought :thumbsup:

You can contact Jeff at ADG...

My eco was at the lfs.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

http://www.adgshop.com/

I think he will have more ADA AS in around the 15th of Aug.
That should tell you and give an indication of how good it is.
He sells out fast.

If you are lazy or simply do not want to bother with the KNO3 stuff, KH2PO4 etc, you might want to consider the power sand as well.



Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## Boost (Aug 15, 2006)

hi gents, I'm from sydney australia and am contemplating on setting up a planted aquarium. Ive had a look at prices per bag of eco complete and its like $55 - $60 AUD per bag. Is this the average price for these substrate? If so are there anyone brand that is cheaper? I'm asking because the tank I want to setup is going to 4" - 5" long and at $55 a bag for 9.2Kg its going to take well over 4 bags to cover the bottom of the tank.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

fshfanatic said:


> So where can I get ADA AS locally?


If you are in Arizona probably no where- Currently i think only 2 vendors have them in the US. One in SF, California and the other in TX.

ADA soil would be my vote. All my tanks now have ADA soil.

As weird as it sounds, I think AS is a whole new ball game. There are lots of ways to use it and I think having a little experience under your belt will keep you out of trouble. If you think you can use the ph/kh co2 table with this stuff then good luck. It likes to drop your kh. You can be at 6dkh at a water change day and then 1dkh at the end of the week. It'll drive you crazy if you like to test the water.


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## chiahead (Dec 5, 2005)

Locally???? Aquatouch at 32nd street and Cactus. Ask for Scott.

And BTW Marc, some local fish stores are starting to carry ADA aquasoil as an alternative to the other substrates. Not very many but a select few across the country.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

chiahead said:


> Locally???? Aquatouch at 32nd street and Cactus. Ask for Scott.
> 
> And BTW Marc, some local fish stores are starting to carry ADA aquasoil as an alternative to the other substrates. Not very many but a select few across the country.


I was not aware- thats awsome because ADA AS is really good stuff.


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## duck (Apr 22, 2004)

I use and like Eco-Complete and very happy with it,And it's cheaper over here than ADA

Off topic.
Boost,Yes that is about as low as you will get for any specialized substrate,Freight is the big part of the price.
And 4"=inch's 4'= foot



Boost said:


> hi gents, I'm from sydney australia and am contemplating on setting up a planted aquarium. Ive had a look at prices per bag of eco complete and its like $55 - $60 AUD per bag. Is this the average price for these substrate? If so are there anyone brand that is cheaper? I'm asking because the tank I want to setup is going to 4" - 5" long and at $55 a bag for 9.2Kg its going to take well over 4 bags to cover the bottom of the tank.


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## landlord (Apr 2, 2006)

Shultz has always worked for me, i dont have one complaint about the stuff. cheap. (although isnt it the same stuff as soil master?)


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

But the question is what is best. The OP did not care about the cost. Also here eco-complete costs about the as ADA aquasoil.


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## chiahead (Dec 5, 2005)

duck said:


> I use and like Eco-Complete and very happy with it,And it's cheaper over here than ADA



You do realize that 1 bag of AS is almost the same volume as 2 bags of Eco right? That makes the price about the same, and AS is sooooo much better. No competition at all in my book.


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## LGHT (Aug 21, 2006)

Anyone know where to get this ADA stuff. I want to pickup about 5-6 bags for half of a 180, but didn't know if they sell it locally or if you have to pay shipping on their site. I'm live the LA area by Beverly Hills and would like to try some out in a new tank.


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## LGHT (Aug 21, 2006)

I put in a post on there site and somoene named Jeff said they don't have local shops in the LA/OC area. Hopefully that will change soon with a few phone calls to a buddy that owns a shop. 

Looks like for now i'll have to bite the bullet and just pay for the shipping.


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## chiahead (Dec 5, 2005)

LIGHT they have some at Aqua Forest but its in Frisco area. Other than that, just order it from http://www.adgshop.com/


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## Dwayne (Nov 2, 2004)

Duck,

You can get ADA Aqua Soil for A$62 for a 9 litre bag (I assume 9l = 9kg) at APW. It is only $6 more than the Eco Complete and by all accounts is a better substrate.

Dave.


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## ianiwane (Sep 7, 2004)

one 9L is is 9 liters. It is about 20 pounds, it is way more in volume than one bag of eco.


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