# Help with my first nano (56k, I feel your pain)



## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm working on a 10 gallon also but that's mentioned in it's own thread. This is for my even smaller tank.










This is what I have so far. I plan to dose excel or maybe inject pressurized Co2. I'm thinking about maybe 7-15 watts of true CF light in a mounted pendant hanging over it or an Azoo glaxy light suspended above. Dwarf hairgrass in the back and HC in the front. Prolly a submersed filter hidden somewhere like the back left corner and covered by the hairgrass. Maybe some kind of moss tied to the branches at the top.

I've never done a nano tank before. Any advice on plants or the proper wattage or a supersmall submersed filter?

I want all the equipment to be hidden and to really give it the appearance of being a full sized tank. I think the dwarf hairgrass in the back and the HC carpet in the front could really give the effect, especially if I used a very fine textured moss of some kind on the branches.

ANy advice would be appreciated.


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## turtlehead (May 31, 2005)

Nice wood work some rocks and it will be complete, how big is that tank and where'd you get it?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Thanks.

12x7x7. I haven't tested/calculated for gallon volume yet.

Someone bought it in California and mailed it to me. I'm guessing maybe AquaForest had them but I'm not sure. I should email them and ask if that's where it came from. I just know it was bought at a LFS in Cali.

I just ordered an Azoo Galaxy PC clipon light, 13w and a spare bulb just in case. With shipping it was only like $28. I'll paint the housing black.

I found a small 2.5lb Aluminum Co2 cylinder on Ebay that I might order. It's only 10 inches tall. I know where I can get a miniature glass Co2 diffuser.

I'm seriously considering making a little ADA style stand for it, maybe a foot tall, to house the Co2 if I use it and just to look darn cool! Would cost next to nothing to make.

Still not sure about the filter.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

And here's another slightly larger tank I'm working on. The two are kinda coming along together so some of what works for one may work for the other.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Just took some measurements:

2.3 gal empty

roughly 2.0 gal with substrate.

I ordered a Galaxy 13w clipon PC light.

4.3 wpg would be low light
6.4 medium
8.6 high.

Based on this calculator 

So my 6.5wpg should be about right for dosing Excel.


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## lamthuyduong (Aug 1, 2004)

I have a 2.5g tank with 23 watts of compact fluorescen over it. I don't know if 13w is enough to grow hairgrass and hc.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I guess I'll find out. If it isn't enough I can order another galaxy and then I'll have almost exactly the same amount of light as you.

What plants are you growing in yours and what kind of lights are you using?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

And here is a 1.3 gallon.

I found some wood chips in my moms garden and thought I'd give em a try. I think I'll move the ones on the left half a little closer to the front.

My main concern is giving it a sense of perspective. What do you think? With a field of HC, would it's size fool you?


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## juanBeegas (May 9, 2005)

With a field of HC and small fishes like Boraras... I think It'd fool anyone. Have you thought of swapping out the wood chips for slate chips instead? Or if you have a nice piece of branchy dirftwood that you could use instead...


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## Pseud (Oct 2, 2005)

This looks like a fun project. Looking forward to the progress.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

juanBeegas said:


> Have you thought of swapping out the wood chips for slate chips instead?


The urge hit me about 45 minutes before I posted the pic. In that time, I grabbed the tank out of storage, emptied what was left in the bottom of one of my Aquasoil bags into it, threw on a coat and walked out in the yard and found the wood chips.

I imagine they'll give me heck trying to keep them down. I wanted to see if I could get the look in something this small. I'd love to use rocks instead. There's a place or two I know of where I could try to find some. I'd definitely have to smash them up and hope I get some lucky fragments. Still, it would look better and be much easier to work with.

To give you some idea of how available stuff is around here, I'd have to order the cherries, the hairgrass and HC, the Rasboras, had to order the tanks and branchy driftwood, the lights, the filters, the substrates...the hardest part is definitely getting my hands on the stuff and all the shipping costs are making it more expensive than it should have to be. So far, the wood chips will be the only thing that doesn't come through the mail.



Pseud said:


> This looks like a fun project.


I've been very excited over these three tanks. Something about their size makes them seem less daunting and it's actually easier for me to decide on the layouts. I'm having a lot of fun with them. I'm still not sure what kind of hardscape I want to do in the 10 gallon. It's narrow and long so I definitely need to draw the eye across it rather than into it.


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## turtlehead (May 31, 2005)

Does the person that sent you that small tank want to send another tank out? I live in southern california. And where did youget those branches?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm trying to find out if the LFS still sells them. Waiting for a reply.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Albany Aquarium has 1 of this style tank left. It is the 10 gallon. I have a picture of mine in the other thread that I linked to earlier. It is $50 and I did not think to ask if they ship or not.

AFAIK, there are no plans to restock these models. God only knows why. I still want to hunt down the manufacturing source.


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## lamthuyduong (Aug 1, 2004)

I java moss, glosso and riccia. Currently, the plants are not doing very good. without co2, it is growing at a very slow rate and it looks very unhealthy.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

It sounds like you have plenty of light. Are you dosing any ferts or Excel for carbon? I would not think light would be your problem.

I will try this 2.5 with 13w PC lighting, 1.5x manufacturer's recommended dosage of Excel and 1/2 the normal dosage of EI since that seems to be where Tom has suggested I start from. If I test and my nutrients are building up I may back down to 1/4 EI dosing, just speculation until I get some plants in there and see what happens. Only experience I've had has been with 55 gallon hi-tech.

If things don't move along, I may try upping the light. Honestly, for some reason, I seem to be totally oblivious to how much light a smaller tank needs. I never thought I'd go smaller than 55 gallons again so I haven't been paying attention.

I tried breaking up some rocks I had but they fracture into thin sheets so it isn't working. I boiled the wood chips and after a while finally got them to sink. I replanted them and filled the tank with water to keep them from drying out. I'll drain the water back down for planting when I get the plants. I think the wood chips will work, at least until I come across something better.


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## turtlehead (May 31, 2005)

Alright, thanks for asking for me. Where did you get the branches?


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## Zen (Oct 17, 2005)

It really sucks you have to order things and wait, wait, wait.
Where I live you can get almost anything you want, but the prices are really high.


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## Pseud (Oct 2, 2005)

RA, I have a LOT of slate left over. I can send you some slate pieces if you wanna try them. Just let me know what kinda size and shapes you're looking for and I'll see what I can find...


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Pseud, I'm trying to think of ways to use your slate. If I can come up with something I like you'll be the first person I ask.


Other than HC and Dwarf Hairgrass trimmed even shorter, what other plants fit the scale of a tank in the 1-3 gallon department?

Are there any mosses that grow tight to wood, like how terrestrial moss looks?

I have plenty of riccia but it's too long and branchy. I need something soft that grows in little clumps.

Does such a thing exist?

Maybe algae is what I'm really asking for? :icon_conf


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## juanBeegas (May 9, 2005)

There is a form of moss... I don't know the latin name for it, but it's called mini moss here. It looks exactly like christmas moss, only, roughly, half the size. 
I think you have your substrate a little too flat... Maybe if you sloped it off to the sides and create a little "valley" in between? You could fill up the valley with the HC and have the HG growing on the 2 "hills"... I hope you can get an idea of what I'm trying to describe...


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Hey! I had to use a 1.5 inch wide paintbrush to get my gravel like that!  

I know what you mean and I agree. The soil needs to be higher where the wood juts out because there would be other hard stuff under the soil in those areas to raise it up, like with mountains. I plan to dust some soil around them before planting. It doesn't take much to make those little wood chips fall and I don't want to have to worry about the force of sloshing water. :icon_redf

I'm gonna look into this mini moss also. Until I see how the HC grows I can't be certain for what kind of scale I'm gonna shoot for.

Right now I'm thinking add a little rolling nature to the substrate, plant the HC everywhere, then put a few sprigs of HG around the edges of the wood where they meet the substrate and a few little patches dotted along the back glass, then trim the HG to about .5 inches along the smaller wood and 1 inch max near the larger wood chips and then the back a little taller than the rest. I really want the wood chips to look about 8-16 inches tall when everything is trimmed right.

Of course, I've never worked with wood, or stone, or HC, or HG, or Aquasoil before so these are probably typical best-laid plans  

I'd love to use rocks in another one to make a mountain range from a far distance. I'd have to use algae to give them green patches of foliage.

I'd love to see something like this in an 18 inch x 12 inch x 9 inch tank.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I've put up a black background and set the 13w galaxy light up over the 1.3. It's about 5.5-6.0 inches above the water. The wood has a much nicer brown color under this 7000k light, not at all like the orange hue it had under that other light I held over it for the above pic. I did a Ro water change and added 1/4tsp Equilibrium and a 1ml Excel. I added maybe 1/16 tsp of baking soda. Then I planted a few small cuttings of Pearl Weed to see if anything will grow in here before ordering a lot of HC and sending it to it's doom.

From now on I'll be dosing Excel at a rate of .2ml a day...somehow. At that rate, this 250ml bottle should last me about 3.5 years :icon_roll 

So now I just need to dose ferts. I want to try EI @ 25% normal dosage.

So how do I add:

.0023 tsp of Potassium Nitrate
5.682x10(-4) tsp of Mono Potassium Phosphate
.0455 ml of micronutrient solution

Does anyone make 1/500th teaspoons?  Looks like I'll have to mix solutions.

How do you guys dose your carbon enriched nanos?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

ok, I'm shooting for 25% normal EI dosage with my light and 1.5-2x normal dosage of excel for carbon.

Normal EI ranges are about 15ppm No3 and 1-3ppm PO4.

So I'm aiming for 3.75ppm NO3 and about 1 ppm PO4.

I want everything to mix into 500ml of RO H20 and dose at 5ml dosages because that's how I mix and dose my micros in my 55gal and that will keep everything consistent and easy to remember. It also allows me to use test kit vials for easy dosage since their fill line is 5ml.

Here's my math (based on this) ...

.5 tsp KNO3 added to 500ml RO water dosed in 1.2 gal of RO water will mean that every 1ml of solution will add 0.76ppm NO3 to my water, thus 5ml will dose 3.8ppm Nitrate.

.125 (1/8) tsp K2PO4 added to 500ml RO water dosed in 1.2 gal of RO water will mean that every 1ml solution will add .18ppm PO4 to my water, thus 5ml will dose .9ppm Phosphate.

Sound about right? Please check my math if you will.

Still need to figure out my micros.


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## Tino (Jan 9, 2005)

random_alias said:


> I did a Ro water change and added 1/4tsp Equilibrium and a 1ml Excel. I added maybe 1/16 tsp of baking soda.


 Honestly, you're set. Aquasoil will take care of the rest. Forget about Macros.
This is way more simple than you are imagening.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Two quick snaps, obviously not meant for showing off. Tanks aren't finished with planting or scaping at all and the water in the larger is still cloudy. Just got my Azoo Palm filters in the mail today and finished setting them up. These pics are just to show how their filters and (painted) lights look and to give good size comparisons. Purely equipment/ Painting the reflectors white seems to have really helped even out the color of the lighting.

THe pics still came out blue but that's my photo skills, not the lights.


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## turtlehead (May 31, 2005)

Hey what light is that and where did you get it? How many watts?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

It's a modified Azoo Galaxy light. The housing and the light it gives off looks very different from the way it does out of the box.

The housing was hot pink and transparent so light spilled out the top. The reflector has holes punched in it so light escapes and hits the semitransparent housing, making it look like little dots of light, very annoying. The reflector is unpolished and total crap. I painted it with a flat white paint. When you do those things, the light turns into something very nice and classy. 

13w. They say 7200k but the color is very very unpredictable between the three I have. Painting the reflectors seemed to help even out the colors some.

I got them for half price from http://www.aquariumconnection.com/

But I do not recommend the lights very highly if you are going to use them as stock. I wasn't impressed. But the housing and the arm mounting made them worth the effort because I really wanted this style.

P.S. My photos were taken low because I don't have a tripod. I sat the camera on a small box. Under normal viewing conditions, you can't see the light bulb at all, only the black top of the lights.

Oh, and if you're gonna order more than one of these lights, I would recommend going ahead and order a spare bulb. It'll give you better odds of being able to get the light temps to match.


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## fhqwhgads (Jan 18, 2005)

i think i found a moss that you might be interested in on aquabid, i thought it looked a lot like terrestrial moss
http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?liveplants&1132146770


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Since you and juanBeegas have recommended the mini moss, I just won that auction. Thanks for the heads up. When I get it I'll grow it out and then we'll see how well it works in a nano. 

Thanks.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

These little filters are _really_ vibrating. Usually I can put foam underneath a HOTB filter to dampen the vibration or remove the cover or both but these little guys are shaking my desk!! I mean, resting my forearms and elbows on the desk to type I can really feel the vibration. 

Returning them. So, now I'm back to square one on filtration. What's the deal with Azoo? Do they _have_ a QC dept? I don't really need filtration anyway since these are gonna be plants and shrimp. I just need SILENT water movement.

Anyone know of any really really small, dead silent water pumps that throw out maybe 8-15gph and don't shake the tank?

What about other methods? I have really small air pumps that came with old betta tanks. I may just use one to blow up a few bubbles to turn the water surface and call it a day.

Man, I'm not having much luck with equipment for these little tanks. I guess companies figure smaller equipment, cheaper construction.


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## Tino (Jan 9, 2005)

There's another option for you:http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/product.xml?product_id=29281;category_id=1721

Maybe we have actual users here who could chime in with feedback.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

All these people that keep writing "Silent Operation" in filter descriptions should be shot! Why can't they just be honest. "You can't hear it unless you are 1.5 ft away." "You can hear it across the room at night but it's not bad if the TV is on or you sleep with a fan." "If you put your arms on the table, it will massage your upper body." These are descriptions I'd like to start seeing.

Thanks. That little filter looks like a good option. Yeah, anyone willing to chime in here is great. My only requirement is that it be silent. I'm gonna search for reviews of this thing. We gotta find some high quality nano equipment that doesn't interfere with the small tanks.


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## mickey85 (Nov 6, 2005)

random_alias said:


> These little filters are _really_ vibrating. Usually I can put foam underneath a HOTB filter to dampen the vibration or remove the cover or both but these little guys are shaking my desk!! I mean, resting my forearms and elbows on the desk to type I can really feel the vibration.
> 
> Returning them. So, now I'm back to square one on filtration. What's the deal with Azoo? Do they _have_ a QC dept? I don't really need filtration anyway since these are gonna be plants and shrimp. I just need SILENT water movement.
> 
> ...


Do you just want an internal pump, or an actual HOB filter? If you want a pump, look for a Rio 180. Good pumps, and they come with attachments to reduce the flow (it's only 70 GPH as is) and direct the flow to any part of the tank.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Actually, I _hate_ HOB filters but in the case of a 1.3 gallon tank I didn't think a mini submersible would fit well. A small, weak, silent water pump sounds like my best option.

The Rio Mini 180 is 120 gph.

Rio Mini 50 is 66 gph before attachments. 2.2" x 1.4" x 1.8". Same size as the 180 according to what I've read . Adjustable valve for flow rates.

Sounding pretty good if it's quiet. I could reduce the flow and then aim it to bounce off a wall or two and probably not have rip current probs. I've heard of reliability probs with Rios but in this application I don't think it would really matter. How quiet are Rio pumps?


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## mickey85 (Nov 6, 2005)

I lied, I was talking about the Via Aqua 180.

http://www.graystonecreations.com/images/va180.jpg

I have this in a 2G hex, and it's silent, but it does take up quite a bit of room, and I am planning on using a Red Sea HOB after Thanksgiving. But I really like this one - I have one in a couple salty nano tanks, as well las the hex and they work well.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

ok. I just ordered 2 ViaAqua 40 pumps. 

2 watts
1.8"x1.75"x1.25"
40gph max flow. Flow is adjustable.

Here's a good chart for comparing the models.

They sound small enough to me. Hopefully they are silent. Getting these weaker ones, I will hopefully avoid having to do a lot of restricting, which I know can cause noise in pumps.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

Ah, this brings back memories for me-- I don't know what the manufacturer for these all glass tanks are, but I have used many of these in the past. Almost all the LFs in Hawai'i carry this type. The manufacturer is almost certainly not ADA.

From my experience, 13 watts isn't enough to get "high" lighting for these tanks. Under 13 watts marsilea was very happy for me, but glosso would not stand a chance-- let alone HC. I had good experience with 19 watts with moss foreground. For some reason I didn't use creaping plants in that tank. Another time I used 30+ watts and got the glosso to be really happy-- unfotunately the moss died. :icon_redf 

26 watts worked well for me all-around. The glosso didn't grow as fast, but everything else did quite well. I don't think HC will do well in anything under 20 watts-- which still probably isn't enough by itself.

Well, the lighting really depends. Amano's 1g from his book has 20+ watts of light. But I've also seen attractive tanks with only 7-9 watts, but those never involved creeping foreground plants other than marsilea.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

What kind of light were you using?

That sounds pretty crazy. I'm not saying you aren't right but 26w over 1g sounds pretty crazy. I mean, how do you physically get 2x13w over a 1g tank without having half the light spill out over the sides because the bulbs are pretty much bigger than the tank itself. I have to aim the end of my 1x13w down a little to get the light from the end of bulb into to tank without bleeding out the side. Seems like 1x13w centered over the tank would be just as effective as 2x13w with half the light overshooting the edges.

I guess I'll see. There's HC in the 1g now.


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

Nice tanks RA- Ive got 2 tanks similar to yours, they are 1/2 gal and got them from Tom Barr. Great Journal so far- my tanks are just sitting right now, your pictures are giving me ideas on how to do mine. Keep up the work!


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Water has cleared. Still waiting on plants. Thrown in some floaters in the meantime. I'd say it's 15% planted at this point. Had HUGE ammonia levels when I finally got around to testing. Forgot/neglected to seed the substrate and filter. Added some media from my established tank and the NH4 is disappearing. 

There's 26w over this and I still can't photograph the subtleties from the lighting. Asked for a tripod for Xmas. Maybe then I can sit and fiddle with the camera settings/ambient lighting without having to worry about the camera itself.










So far I'm thinking Dwarf HG, HC and mini moss.

Rubberbands from braces are making an effective shrimp protector on this HOB until the mini pumps come in later this week to replace them.

Considering pressurized Co2.


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## eds (Feb 12, 2003)

Too little too late, but I have no complaints about my Red Sea deco nano.
Looks nearly identical to your Azoo, down to the white and black foam pads. I've tossed some eheim "cocoa puffs" in there as well.

I have it on my 3g in my office, and sitting at my desk approx 8' away I can't hear anything. 

Just closed my door and sat next to it - with my ear about 1' away or less, I can hear a slight hum/buzz. But sitting back in the chair so that I am 3' or more away - general casual viewing distance - can't hear a thing. Of course, I work in downtown Chicago, so there is some ambient noise from traffic outside (30 floors down) the HVAC system, other people in the office, my computer's fan, etc.

Than enough detail for you?


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## jgc (Jul 6, 2005)

pretty sure azoo makes that red sea hob.

I have a hagen mini pump in a 10 gallon. It made a ton of noise when it first started, but think it has become much more quite since - bubbles make it loud. It has adjustable flow rate - wide open it is too much for flow for the 10 gallon - going to make a spraybar for it eventually, and a mattenfilter. It is not a show tank


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

ok. The ViaAqua Aqua Pump VA-40 came in today. With the "gate" completely open it should put out 40gph. I have the gate almost closed and it gives good flow without stirring up the substrate or blowing over my precariously balanced "Drift Twigs". It's nice to know it has good enough flow to scale up to larger tanks. I've removed the noisy HOBs and am gonna try just using these pumps for circulation and see how the the biological stuff handles itself. I do water changes.

A lot quieter, cleaner looking and more versatile. Hoping it's also functional.


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## fhqwhgads (Jan 18, 2005)

where did you get those branches that are sprouting leaves haha i thought it was driftwood, is that safe for fish and shrimp


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

AFAIK that _is_ driftwood. I pinched off some ends from some Wandering Jew (a houseplant). You can start the cuttings off in water and then move the plant to soil. They do pretty well in aquariums with their stems just under the water. 

Someone sent the wood to me. No idea where they get it.


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## bpm2000 (Feb 16, 2005)

Very curious to see how HC does under 13w in tank of that size.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Hi. Which tank are you referring to? There's 13w over my 1.3 but there's 2x13w over this 2.5 now. 2 tanks, 3 galaxy lights is the current situation. The above photos were taken with the room lights still on and the camera brightness was low. It's brighter than the photo makes it look. Visually, I'd say it's about perfect. Things are well lit without looking washed out and the wood is able to cast a few shadows directly beneath.

Also, currently no filters. Each tank has a small water pump for circulation. Both use Aquasoil. 

Beginning to get my nutrient dosages in order (having to mix very diluted solutions to properly dose).

So far, the greatest challenge has been doing any kind of work in the tank without disturbing the hardscape. I'm getting very good with tweezers. Tweezers holding cotton balls is my current method of glass cleaning and making small adjustments to the aquasoil.

I figure if the HC doesn't do well then I may try mini moss as a carpet.


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## bpm2000 (Feb 16, 2005)

Oh I see. Is HC going in both tanks?


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## trckrunrmike (Jul 20, 2005)

This tank is very cheap and mass produced in HK. I was going to bring one to the US but I was afraid it'll break on the plane ride.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Well, I'd love to see someone sell them here, cheap or not.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

bpm2000 said:


> Oh I see. Is HC going in both tanks?


That's the plan. I've ordered a 5lb Co2 cylinder and Azoo regulator and a 6 port splitter with 2 needles and 4 plugs. I'm gonna try injecting both tanks. Right now, the HC is just "sitting there" and not doing much one way or the other.

There's a wonderful green algae growing on the wood and substrate that looks like a very fine low growing moss. Pretty cool as long as the shrimp keep it in check. This look is actually exactly what I had envisioned so I'm hoping I can keep the algae. :icon_roll The mini moss still hasn't gotten here. 

Still have high ammonia in the tank. Put one of the filters back on to get some bacteria cycling.


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## BigB (Oct 14, 2005)

cool sounds liek urs is goin nicely, I got my shrimps in my and had an algae outbreak sigh. hahaha all part of the fun keep it up roud:


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I've cleaned out some of the repetitive pics to help the thread load faster. I still can't get my photo exposures right though. They're either too dark or too bright. Must be the lighting. 

Looking over the photos it's nice to see how the tank has become more and more natural looking. I cringe at how sharp, arachnid and posed the original hardscape looked. All that's really happened since then is I've accidentally knocked stuff over while fiddling inside the tank and things literally "fell" into place.



BigB said:


> cool sounds liek urs is goin nicely, I got my shrimps in my and had an algae outbreak sigh. hahaha all part of the fun keep it up


Yeah, these nanos are a blast. I've been neglecting my 55g the last couple of weeks. What can I say, this 2.5 is way more fun!

Seems like nanos are catching on and becoming more popular.


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## BigB (Oct 14, 2005)

i think they are getting more popular because they are cheaper and easily to maintain. When you get an algae outbreak its a little easier to deal with then in a larger tank. Also the cost of plants and the amount of time spent aquascaping is liek 90% less roud:


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## Marc (Oct 13, 2004)

RA- would you be able to tell me where you got you ViaAqua pump from? Does it have to be submerged in water? I'm looking for a pump that will allow me to pipe and in and out hose.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Greystone Creations. http://www.graystonecreations.com/acc.htm

This pump must be submerged. It uses a grate as the intake and cannot accept a hose for water feed. 

Further up the thread I posted a link to a chart with info on the various models.


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## MercuryShrimp (Sep 10, 2005)

awesome tank random alias roud: love the driftwood and the substrate


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## melbourne (Sep 20, 2004)

I love your tank. Its looking very nice. What are the dimensions on that tank? I'm having a hard time locating something similar online. I found this tank but haven't found a dealer that is carrying it yet.

http://www.jbjlighting.com/sys_pico.html

Also is there an online vendor in the US that carries the ADA Aquasoil? I really like the way it looks compared to Eco-complete.

I also did a bit of experimenting tonight with lighting solutions for small tanks, I found that a few Nano-reefer's were using the Corallife Mini Aqualight as a pendant and also fitting in 2x13w PC versus the 2x9w that it comes with. I had to give it a try. I was able to fire up the 7000k 13w Aqualux bulbs that my Galaxy's came with, they flicker for a few seconds before firing up. I was not able to fire the $8 Home Depot 13w bulbs they just flicked for a few minutes before I turned the unit off. So that may be an alternative to the Galaxy's if you want a pendant instead.

I like how your tank has depth, which gives the appearance of a much larger tank. The driftwood arrangement is also very nice. Very inspiring.

-Mike


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I've tried getting these tanks available in the US. So far, all I've been able to get are people saying they can buy them in other parts of the world, like Singapore. I asked if someone would buy the tanks and ship them here but they said the cost of shipping would make the final price unreasonable. So, at the moment, I don't think I could buy one in the US without paying someone to fly to Singapore and back.

Dimensions of the 1.3g are 9x6x6.5 (lxwxh), the 2.5g is 12x7x7.5, the 10g is 23.5x8.5x12.

I got my aquasoil from Aqua Forest. Nice guys. Very helpful, very informative, communicative, fair, you get the idea. I've never felt the need to look for other sources of ADA products. Expecting some Ohko stone from them any day now, too. I'll email you a .pdf on ADA substrates if you want to know your choices.

I prefer pendants but the nature of these small tanks has them moving around or sitting on desks, etc. I haven't found a permanent home for them yet. Looking to make a table to line them all up on kinda like you've done. Once I do, I may use pendants. I do plan to use a pendant on the 10g once it's setup. The clipons are a nice compromise when a pendant just can't be used.

I'd like to know more about your nano reef. I'll email you.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

hey random_alias, I haven't been checking back with this thread-- sorry!

Lesse, about the light . . . I tried DIY set ups with 19w spirals, and 13 w pc's. the 19w's in particular are easy to aim over a small tank, though of course the efficiency isn't as good with the shape, it still ends up being a lot brighter than simple 13w. Well, your tank and best of luck man.

Hmmm . . . my opinion is the mid ground doesn't have enough height. At this rate, you might end up with the "field in front of a wall of stem plants" that seems to be the downfall of many an otherwise well-planned scape. I'd try to build more strength and thickness into the mid ground. BTW-- is there enough room for stems in the back? This seems like one of those lay outs that needs stem plants.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm hoping the foreground and hairgrass can be dithered together, but that may be wishful thinking. I don't think there's enough room for stems. I have to use extreme measures just to be able to clean the glass because the wood is so close to the glass in some places. 

I'd rather clean the glass in my 55 than this 2.5 anyday.

I'm going to let it grow in like I have it and then see if the midground needs something to fuse the scape together. I hate to fiddle with adding something to it now and end up having to pick HC and HG out of it later. 

I really don't know what I could use anyway. All that wood is very delicately placed and bumping one piece always disturbs at least 2 others.

I had forseen the midground as an issue though. I got some mini moss to soften up the edges here and there but I really can't "see" where to put it until the foreground fills in. 

I have a feeling you're right though and that I'll end up needing a third species.


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## melbourne (Sep 20, 2004)

Something I use on my nano-reef tanks. Its a nano magnet cleaner using rare earth magnets. Works great.

-Mike

http://www.nimblenano.com/


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

wow. 

That's
so...


perfect.



Do you use the regular or the super? 

Do they scratch the glass at ALL? If I mess these tanks up I can't get new ones without flying from NC to Singapore and back.


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## melbourne (Sep 20, 2004)

Hi,

I use the regular. I've had no issue with scratching glass, however if you have sand or a rock stuck on the cleaning side it could scratch your glass but its unlikely unless your tank is made of starphire or low iron glass. Really good magnet cleaner for nano's.

-Mike


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Sweet. This thing may deserve it's own post so people can find it when searching. I'm gonna order one.


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## turtlehead (May 31, 2005)

Is there something like that in size but cheaper?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm not aware of there being anything else like that in size, period!


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

So, let's say you have a HOB filter that's vibrating your tank and your lights and your desk and everything else, turning it's surroundings into a noise amplifier. I've tried different ideas on how to cut down on the vibration transfer from the filter to the tank. 

So far, the best method is to take a length of airline tubing and slice it down the middle on one side. Then, push it over the lip of the tank. Sit the filter on it. Cut another length of tubing but do not slice it open. Place this round tubing between the bottom of the filter and the tank. Now your entire HOB filter is floating on rubber/silicone dampeners. Seems to work pretty well.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Out of desperation, I dropped a few mats of mini moss in and a couple rocks to hold them down. Quick, easy and I like the look. I need to build height, etc..but this is by far the best direction I've been able to take this 1.3g. All the other plants I tried looked too big. 

Floating riccia for a sense of size.


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## A Hill (Jul 25, 2005)

great little journal i really like how that scape looks with the sticks VERY natural looking and the scape with the mini moss loook awwsome i think i wouldnt toutch it idk if id go shrimp only in that tank because u might want something in the higher shtrata of water what about some endlers? just a suggestion 

great job so far!

Fish Newb

(i also just made a good sized order from Dr fosters and smith.... and i SAVED about .... 50 60 bucks because they had sales and the heater alone saved me $30 since they sell them for so low and its free shipping for orders over $60 so there is ur shipping rate gone =-o im waiting for it shoud get here by newyears so ill let u know how they shipped if u ever are interested in buying from them..)


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I've planted it a little more since the last picture but it was still planted sparsely. It's grown in a little since then. I trimmed all the hairgrass down to try to encourage it to fill in. It used to be 1-1.5 inches taller.










Things still don't look healthy to me. This is my first non Co2, Excel tank. Is this growth normal looking? You can compare the dates of the picks in the other posts. I may put the pressurized Co2 on it for a few weeks and see if anything spectacular happens.

I guess it's progressed well for non Co2 and pitifully planted but I want LUSH!


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## Perfectblue (Jan 11, 2006)

Looks good.


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## mrbelvedere (Nov 15, 2005)

I love nanos. May start my own someday. Fantastic looking tank, BTW. I am legitimately impressed. :thumbsup:


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## Stan the Man (Dec 12, 2005)

Damn, that is a fine looking tank! Love the arrangement of the driftwood... haven't been able to find nice little pieces like that yet! Also like how you have the tank open... has the potential for emersed plant growth? Look forward to see more pics as things progress.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Thanks guys. 

I've never stuck with a scape before. Actually, I never did a scape before. In the past I've always collected, grown out, gotten rid of, replaced with something different, etc. Just patches of plants here and there and always changing, getting pulled up.

One good thing about a nano is that you can't fall victim to collectoritis as easily, or have a "stem of the month" mentality.

Seems like it took the HC FOREVER to start growing runners. I guess I should have planted it in clumps rather strands, but I don't have that kind of dough 

It sounds like the growth is good. Seems to me like other ppls' nanos grew in faster. Maybe they just waited to take decent pictures 

I don't understand the dwarf hairgrass. It will grow a runner from the back of the tank, down under the big wood, out the other side and up comes green blades of grass...but it won't send another clump up right beside itself. :icon_roll

If I didn't know better I would say that every runner of hairgrass in the tank heads for the center of the HC foreground.


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## fhqwhgads (Jan 18, 2005)

you should get some moss and make a tree out of that driftwood


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## kzr750r1 (Jun 8, 2004)

random_alias said:


> Things still don't look healthy to me. This is my first non Co2, Excel tank. Is this growth normal looking? You can compare the dates of the picks in the other posts. I may put the pressurized Co2 on it for a few weeks and see if anything spectacular happens.
> 
> I guess it's progressed well for non Co2 and pitifully planted but I want LUSH!


Give it time. Non Co2 tanks are slowwwwwww. In nanos (my opinion) youll be tearing it up every week if plants took over too quickly.

I've been acclimating some of my stems to my excel 10 g from the 55 co2 tank. They take on a whole new growth rate.

Another example is the java fern that was in the 10g. It was always a steady slow grower with double dose excel each day. Then moved it to the 55g. It's quickly growing these days and looks awsome. Almost night and day difference.


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## ChrisCummins (Jan 22, 2006)

Excuse my stupidity, but what does HC stand for?

Great tank BTW 

Thanks,
Chris


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Does anyone have any recommendations on a background plant that will work well in this setup? It needs to be small and very easily manageable. I'm considering planting something in a very very small pot, like a medicine cup, so I can easily pull it out and replant the top. Any advice would be appreciated.


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## ChrisCummins (Jan 22, 2006)

I think a black background would look great on the back there.


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## Stan the Man (Dec 12, 2005)

Love the tank! I'm partial to Blyxa, so I'd recommend it as a possible background plant in a small tank. It'd also be a lot lower maintenance than stem plants, since essentially no trimming required. Just pluck out the extra plantlets.

It'd also look neat if you put some moss, or perhaps marimo algae balls (cut into quarters and tied on) onto the driftwood.

Great tank. Look forward to updates.


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## mrbelvedere (Nov 15, 2005)

ChrisCummins said:


> Excuse my stupidity, but what does HC stand for?
> 
> Great tank BTW
> 
> ...


Hemianthus callitrichoides

A small carpet plant. I like it.


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## Stan the Man (Dec 12, 2005)

Are you running that tank with just Excel, or do you have DIY CO2 as well?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Just Excel. :thumbsup: 

I happen to have some blyxa.

A black background does look good on it. However, I won't be displaying it until I get rid of all the little limpets I have :redface: 

I need to find some extrememly tiny moss. I thought I had some small enough but it turns out it gets way too big.


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## Steven_Chong (Sep 14, 2004)

How's this for an idea:

Instead of planting something in the background, when you have enough HC, dig out some and tie it to the wood. HC supposedly is able to grow as an epiphyte like ferns, and this would be an interesting thing to try.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Now that would be cool.

I'm testing it on a piece of wood. I'll post how it turns out. Prolly give it a week or two.

I've given it a little more thought and decided there's really nowhere for me to plant stems. 

#1 they'll destroy the sense of depth.
#2 they'll cut out the light in the back half of the tank.

The whole tank is only about 6 inches deep.

However, this is a desktop nano. I could use a shallow tray and plant some terrestrial plants directly behind the tank. Hmm.....


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## turtlehead (May 31, 2005)

You seem to be missing a mid ground, grow the hair grass a little higher in the back and add a tint of red and greens. Rotala sps. would be a goo selection.


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## fishfry (May 9, 2004)

If you can get your hands on some of what people are calling Rotala sp. "mini" it has extrememly small leaves and is a cute little plant, that might work. I think Rotala pusilla has small leaves too.


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## azn_fishy55 (Dec 17, 2005)

Your tank would look good with some HC and moss as well as Anubias Nana Petite on the wood.Looks great even though not fully planted yet.^_^


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## tiagodovale (Feb 2, 2006)

What about some anubias in the wood? Like _Anubia barteri_ nana "Petite"? This one is quite small: it's leaf size is just around 1 inch... And it's not demaning CO2-wize.


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## csf (Jul 10, 2003)

I just got Amano's 2nd book - the one focusing on small to medium tanks. One of the recent AGA issues has a tank similar to yours (with the small wood making a "V" shape). 

I might try something in just the middle (between the "V"). A reddish stem or a reddish plant could really look great. Barclay longfolia red, maybe? I don't know how big they get in comparison to your set-up. I've got a tiger lotus that's staying small (leaves under 1") in a nano (unheated, but w/ DIY CO2, excel, lots of ferts, onyx sand, occasionally filtered and 13W CF).

Anubias nana (at least mine), tends to have, at most, 1" leaves. Anubias nana "petitie" (at least mine) has leaves that are about 1/3rd to 1/4th that size - about 1/4".


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## Kenny_123 (May 31, 2005)

La^m Thu`y Duong? It sounds like a Vietnamese name. It's hard to find an Asian female who is really into... planted tank. Do you have any picture of your tank? I would love to see it.

Here's mine:








Sorry I don't pic of the whole tank
I am working on the substrate!!


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

It's been a while but I have been listening to you guys. As the HC has grown I've been able to remove a little and begin adding it to the wood. It seems to grow well like this. It's patchy now but I will fill it in as my HC crop allows. 

I have 2 anubas nana petite plants. One is on the right and the other is floating right now.

I tried moss but it gets way too big. I'm actually considering using HC as a moss wood accent substitute from now on, even in larger tanks. That was a great recommendation. Thanks!.

I finally scored some Rotala sp. mini!! It looks awesome. I have it recovering from shipping in another tank and I'll try adding it to this nano once it's ready. It should make for a good background/accent plant for the back. That and the constant addition of HC to the wood and I think the tank will mature well. The anubas nana petite I think will add a little green contrast to the foreground once I find a place for it.

The dwarf hairgrass is slowly getting taller, although I think it's max height will be maybe 1 inch taller than it is now.

My only worry for now is when to trim the HC. I don't want the bottom to die and cause problems. What are the warning signs of when to trim?

The weekly water change/cleaning was actually supposed to happen earlier today but I never got around to it so this is the aquarium at pretty much it's least flattering moment.

Still dosing EI on a standard daily schedule at 50% and adding Excel daily at 2x. Still running a nano HOB and the 2 13w galaxy lights...and taking crappy photos that look like they came from a cell phone.


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## Stan the Man (Dec 12, 2005)

Love your tank! The HC foreground looks fantastic (I'm still waiting for it to completely grow in my nano foreground...). How did you get the HC to stick to your driftwood? I like the look of the hairgrass in the background. As for your photos, I think that they look fine.

I like the look of the ADA substrate. Unfortunately, here in Canada, we don't have access to any of the ADA stuff. :icon_sad:

Have you thought about adding a small school of fish in there (cardinal tetras, white cloud minnows)?


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

I tied HC onto the wood with black polyester thread.

Yes, I've thought about fish...and shrimp.  In the past, I've added fuana and flora together and it caused me grief. My new policy is not to add any fish until the scape is complete. That way I can keep things under control, rearrange, do fast water changes with cold water, blast Co2 if need be, etc without worrying about killing anything.

Also, I don't know what type of fish will fit the tank until it's finished, and I currently have no idea what it's supposed to look like when it's finished


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## Winzzy (Jan 15, 2006)

Endler's Livebearer's would fit the tank nicely or a pair of gudgeons maybe... There is always the old nano standby Mr. Beta

Cherry shrimp would be very very cool as well.


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## John P. (Apr 10, 2004)

Nice! I had luck with HC attaching to rock in one of my past scapes. It looks great draped over hardscape.

As far as fish, I think your best bet would be one of the dwarf rasboras (maculatas, perhaps) so they scale to the tank properly. That, or maybe an Oscar.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

The HC is slowly being added to the wood and growing.










and here's the 10g right after a 3 day blackout and trimming of the leggy growth that ensued. Notice the hopeful addition of willow branches 










and a 1.3g just getting started with various stuff floating in temporary storage


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

And a not-so-nano but why not show them all.

here's a 55g. just java ferns for now, tossed in with lead weights. Waiting on the rest of the wood to soak in the tub. Once I place all the wood I'll decide on a foreground and supporting plants.










They're all obviously works in progress. I would estimate each one is around 50% complete.

Funny how my small ones look big and my big ones look small


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## juanBeegas (May 9, 2005)

Some mini pellia attached to the wood would give it a nice contrast and a small school of Boraras Brigittae?


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## Stan the Man (Dec 12, 2005)

Love your tanks! Simple yet beautiful aquascapes. It'll be interesting to see how the HC grows on the wood. I really like the 'Amano'-type rocks in your 1.5g tank.


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## random_alias (Jun 28, 2005)

Hey, those aren't 'Amano'-type rocks! Those are genuine Aqua Design Amano Ohko stones! I knew I should have left the price tag on them.


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