# 230G Rimless Starphire AquaForest (56K!)



## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

Dream tank! Looking forward to seeing this develop.

No clue on the solenoid, but you're going to need a pressure-rated pump not a flow-pump (the Snapper is max 11' of head) to run that massive filtration system. Take a look at the Reeflo Marlin. 

Who's building the tank BTW?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks... yeah I was afraid the pump can't handle the system. I am hoping I don't have to go to pressure rated pump (ie energy hog). I've already purchased the pump, so I guess I'll test it out first.

Concepttanks.com is the tank builder, they have good price and very on time, I thought I could prepare before the tank arrive, but look like the tank will be in the garage for a couple weeks. I'll give another update when I receive the tank.


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## intermediate_noob (Jan 23, 2007)

You have obviously done your research, but can all the Pentair modules be installed horizontal like that? I thought for some reason that some of them, specifically the mechanical modules had to be installed vertically?

No criticism, just a question really. Great tank, great threat, subscribed!


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

I thought you were storing spent fuel rods at first...


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## AaronT (Apr 11, 2004)

It looks like a good setup so far. I think you could do without the chemical filtration though. The UV should keep the water plenty clear for you.


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## nellis (Oct 27, 2005)

khoile said:


> Thanks... yeah I was afraid the pump can't handle the system. I am hoping I don't have to go to pressure rated pump (ie energy hog). I've already purchased the pump, so I guess I'll test it out first.


Good luck. I just caved in and bought a pressure rated Blue-Line for the reef I'm building. With that many canisters and turns I have a feeling you just may... but keep your fingers crossed.


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

> With that many canisters and turns I have a feeling you just may


I agree with Nellis here, if I were you I would return that pump and get a pressure rated pump. With that many modules the Snapper pump is not going to work well....thats if it even starts pumping anthing at all :icon_frow 

If it were my setup I would be looking at the Wahoo/Marlin, Panworld 200/250 PS or Iwaki 70/100RLT.


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## frozenbarb (Dec 16, 2006)

762 watts of light  is that too much maybe?


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## MOsborne05 (Jan 7, 2007)

Wow, looks like you are going all out! I can't wait to see it when you finally get it up and running. Altums would look great if you can find them, although I'm partial to discus in big tanks


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for all the comments,

I really hope the pump works . If not maybe I just get another snapper to power half of the loop? It's too late to return the pump now, I bought it months ago. I got almost all the hardware piling up here in my room waiting for the tank and the stand (to be built).

As for if the Pentairs work horizontally, I believe they will, I haven't seen any document that suggest other wise, it would be suck if it didn't as I really like the current setup now. I can change the filter pretty easily since everything is accessible from the front, can you say 60 second filter change . I'm even thinking about getting another chem module for the top loop, since look like I'll be permanently gluing all these together, rather overdo it than to find out it needed in the future.

One thing I need to add the the plumbing diagram is the ferts, I totally forgot about that.

Anyway, here's an update with the beast in its natural habitat.










I'll try to find pics of my 75G tank, I've never run into serious algae problem before, so I'm pretty scare now, with highlight, etc... I think I maybe getting into alot of trouble here .


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## sick lid (Jan 13, 2008)

That thread title practically screamed out from across the room. Subscribed.
How thick is the glass, and how much $$ for the tank?


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

A good point was brought up regarding the mechanical and chemical modules being horizontal, won't that make it tedious to change the media without removing the entire module?


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## Plantshrink (Mar 19, 2008)

awesome. I am following along.


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## moogoo (Dec 7, 2007)

Pretty awesome tank setup. I wish I had the time, money and space for such a thing, but unfortunately I don't. 

Just a note, I would be concerned bout putting your tank so close to the fireplace, but if you don't use it, shouldn't be an issue. Doesn't seem like you would need to with your location anyway. 

Keep us updated!


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## gsd78 (Jan 13, 2004)

This is gonna be a great setup! Subscribed.

Only thing I would advise against is glueing the Pentair modules together. I bought my Pantairs used and already glued together and really wish they weren't. I'd put unions between them all if it were my setup. Would make it much easier to pull one for maintenance or change the placement/order of them if needed.

As others have said I'm also worried about the pump. Going through that many modules and having that many returns in the tank you'll likely get almost no flow. Even with a pressure rated pump I'd think you'd need extra powerheads in the tank for proper water circulation.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Raul-7 said:


> A good point was brought up regarding the mechanical and chemical modules being horizontal, won't that make it tedious to change the media without removing the entire module?


Nope, I don't need to remove the modules. The module has a cap at the end and all I need to do is unscrew it, then replace the pleat with an extra one. I plan to either put all these modules on a platform that can slide outward ~6 inch, so I can put a bucket under to catch any water. Or I could tilt them up slightly ~5 - 10 degree, to minimize drip.

The glass thickness is 3/4" (19mm) all around. Cost... let just say it took 2 years of saving. I started out only want to upgrade to 90G, then to 120G, then to 180G, and finally ended up with 230G.


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## dekstr (Oct 23, 2007)

This is going to be a sick set-up! 230g alone makes me drool.

Then you add "rimless"?

AND THEN STARPHIRE GLASSS?

Wow that would be one of my dream tanks for sure.

I'm looking forward to updates and how you're going to set up this baby.


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## phanizzle (Jun 28, 2007)

looking forward for some pictures!


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I'd go with 2 in line systems and use the Ocean clear filters, they have plenty of options and are easier to service.

For heat:

You could do the fireplug, but I do not think they make them any more.
Hydor in line if you run a split and ran a smaller Tee of the line and used 2x300W would do the job.

Or, use the in line modules above.

I think you will be happier with the bio/chem and mechical of the Ocean Clear though.

Run two different lines in parallel.
Each running about 800-1000gph.

So use 4 OC modules and a heater set up.
One set of 2 will run the CO2 and the other the heat.
2 pumps etc.
Venturi CO2 loops.
You can also add the pressure gauges on the Oc filters.

Sumps are nice for many reasons at this size also.
Heater, CO2, surface skimming, but you have the skimmer column or the box in the tank. But if it's a box, you can easily remove it for a photo.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

Khoile - WOW! I think that is brilliant! Great diagrams too!

This is definitely an improvement on what I'm doing, but I'd like to offer a few possible improvements before you build this puppy.

1) Move your drain solenoid to a spot downstream of you mech filters. That way you have no change of them getting gummed up with crap from the tank.

2) I LOVE the parallel flows, but I'd move one UV and one heater to each of the twp parallels. That way you can take one of the two paths down and still have heat and UV covered. That will, of course, mean a new bypass on the lower path.

3) Move your temp and ph probes before the two paths diverge, i.e, before the "T" to the mechs. That way if either path is taken out, you do not lose those two VERY critical functions. And obviously you can't move them to your retun manifold because your temp and pH won't reflect what's in the tank.

4) To Tom's point, you might consider replacing those horizontal Mechs and Chem with something that is not going to pour water everywhere when you open them up. The heaters and UV are not as important, as opening them is not too often. But the mechs and chem will have to be opened with some frequency, and it's gonna be a pita. IMO leave them where they are in the loop, just use vertical rather than horizontal canisters.​

Other than that this looks GREAT!

IMO having a single pump is fine. Just make sure of two things...

1) You have plenty of unions on the mount so you can swap it out fast and easy if needed.

2) Use AT LEAST 1" diameter hose/PVC, if not 1 1/4" so you can maintain decent flow rates. You can go to Reef Central and use their flow calculator and see that you are not going to get squat for flow (even with that pump) if you choke it down to 3/4" tubing.​

Good luck! This looks awesome!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Tom:

Thanks for the advice, I know I'll be happier with the OC, but I wanted to stay with one brand this time, so that it look consistent. That and I thought it would be easier to change to Pentair filter vs the OC. With the pentair, I just slide out the filter, put a bucket underneath, remove the cap and replace the filter.

Steve:


> 1) Move your drain solenoid to a spot downstream of you mech filters. That way you have no change of them getting gummed up with crap from the tank.


I wanted to have as much flow as I can, because I plan to water my garden (using the spinning sprinker thing). But having the solenoid fail due to gunk is worst. I'll make the modification.



> 2) I LOVE the parallel flows, but I'd move one UV and one heater to each of the twp parallels. That way you can take one of the two paths down and still have heat and UV covered. That will, of course, mean a new bypass on the lower path.


The reason I have them the way they are because I thought for UV to be most effective, contact time is the key. By having the UV in series I double the contact time. Heaters is probaly the same? I can heat the water more effectively if the heaters module are in series.



> 3) Move your temp and ph probes before the two paths diverge, i.e, before the "T" to the mechs. That way if either path is taken out, you do not lose those two VERY critical functions. And obviously you can't move them to your retun manifold because your temp and pH won't reflect what's in the tank.


I just afraid a plant piece or something can catch on the probe and cause it to give a false reading. Can any plant make it through the propeller in one piece?



> 4) To Tom's point, you might consider replacing those horizontal Mechs and Chem with something that is not going to pour water everywhere when you open them up. The heaters and UV are not as important, as opening them is not too often. But the mechs and chem will have to be opened with some frequency, and it's gonna be a pita. IMO leave them where they are in the loop, just use vertical rather than horizontal canisters.


As mentioned previously, I'll have these modules on a slideable platform, that way I could move them out (6" or so) and change the filter without wetting the stand. 

I guess the issue is I'm not sure how easy it is to change the filter media on the OC. My stand is pretty short, I just afraid I don't have enough vertical space.

Thanks again for all the input.
Khoi.


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## intermediate_noob (Jan 23, 2007)

Khoi, I do not mean to belabor the point more, but from what I read in the little research I did about the mechanical Pentair modules was that they required changing a lot, especially if there was a lot of mechanical filtration. Now these were cichlid tanks which get quite messy, but still.

I know someone mentioned it, but you might want to also take a look at Reefs.org's pump selection guide and their head loss calculator. This will give you a good idea of what you will be losing as you pass the water through all those modules. If you have not heard this enough, I would go for two pumps, just in case. 

I think all this advice is being thrown at you because we are all SO jealous. For your stand, is it built already, or are you going to build it yourself? Thanks again for putting up with us and sharing this!


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## TheCryptKeeper (Mar 9, 2008)

wow.. that is crazy nice! I can't wait to see real pics. take lots!


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

I love this journal, it is really an amazing idea!!!!!!!!!!


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## crabcake (Dec 19, 2007)

what did you draw that with?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

intermediate_noob:
No problem, I welcome all comments. Actually you guy are so helpful I've redesigned the plumbing to a better version. Yup I will plumb with an additional pump in mind, so if needed, I can just hook one up, no need to replumb. I've read some thread on the cichlid forum, and realized that the pentair mech modules require more frequent media change than OC, so my solution to the problem? add more problem! So I originally plan only 1 mech, now I have 2 :icon_eek: I'll give pentair a chance, if they don't work well I'll just replace the mech/bio-chem block with OC units.

For pump headloss, I did use the calculator for both Sequence Snapper and Dart when I was researching pumps, here are my result:

Snapper:









Dart:









As you can see the dart has only a bit higher flow than the snapper, since I was targeting 5x tank volume (~1000gph) I thought the snapper with its lower wattage is a better buy. If I needed more flow I am better served buying 2x snapper rather than 1 dart. Atleast that was the plan.

I will be (well my dad will) building the stand. It's not built yet. You can see my plan in the diy thread here:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/diy/62140-please-review-my-stand-design.html

crabcake:
I did the drawing with Google Sketchup


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

The Oc filters are a snap to change, simply unscrew the top and no water spills.
You take out a 40 sq Ft 25 micron cartiage(this is more than enough for virtually any application), bleach for a day or so, rinse, dechlor and return(I'd suggest getting 2 sets of media, makes changing them easier).

OC's are easier than the plan you have.
The Volume of media for the bio and chem modules is pretty good also.

If OC or the Rainbow stuff does not do it for you, check out Aquaticeco.
They have larger systems with much better flow and pipe sizing.

As those pumps get larger, so does the sound/noise.

While some things might look neat, when you have to service them, you start dreading it.

Then you stop cleaning them etc.

Same deal with a Water change, make the set up easy for you to service.
Turn a valve to drain and back wash, turn another to refill and or backwash with clean tap.

I cannot drill through the wall or floor where I'm at.
So I use a little Giant sub pump to drain and fill by simply placing it in the tank to drain or in the bathroom to fill. Takes 7 minutes to drain and 8 to fill a 180 to 80% water change.

Imagine this with a bucket.

Some folks still think buckets are their only alternative and that hoses are not made longer than 20 ft:icon_roll 

There are many options with filters when you start getting to these tank sizes. So the trade offs are very worth while over time.

You do not need to use hobby level equipment either.
You might be more familiar etc, but the end result is really the goal.

So learn now rather than the harder lesson later.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Tom,

Could you give me a link to Aquaticeco filter that have larger pipe size? I couldn't find any on their website, Aquaticeco.com.

I already bought all the pentair modules, so I guess I'll try them out first, but I'm convinced that OC is better now. I just have to make sure I design the plumbing so that I could swap in the OC if needed.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Flash back!*

Here's some pictures of my 75G.. this is the best that it got to, all downhill after that, mainly due to 2 moves (all within a year), now it's just a java fern factory, not even a good one. I still do water changes frequently, so the fish stay happy.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

khoile said:


> The reason I have them the way they are because I thought for UV to be most effective, contact time is the key. By having the UV in series I double the contact time. Heaters is probaly the same? I can heat the water more effectively if the heaters module are in series.


Not true. At least I don't think so. Assuming the dwell time is the same in two different water paths, having either heat or UV in series on a single path should have just the same effect as it being spread across two paths. But the assumes the same flow rate (dwell time) on both paths. And by spreading and given function across two paths, you reduce the negative impact of losing one path. 




khoile said:


> I just afraid a plant piece or something can catch on the probe and cause it to give a false reading. Can any plant make it through the propeller in one piece?


 No. But the little chunks can gum up a solenoid. And you and best plan on some sort of pre-filter before it gets to your pump. It would really be a drag to have a Sequence turn into toast because you let a piece of cabbage get sucked into the outflow!




plantbrain said:


> If OC or the Rainbow stuff does not do it for you, check out Aquaticeco.
> They have larger systems with much better flow and pipe sizing.


Tom's talking about Aquaticecosystems.com. Great people! Anyone planning a tank your size should not do it without first spending an hour or three going over every page of their catalogue. They will have stuff that you never thought of, and upon seeing it, will wonder how you could have ever lived with out it. For myself, that includes cable harnesses, tubing connectors, and hard to find PVC pieces. And not to be discounted... they sell primo teflon tape.




khoile said:


> Yup I will plumb with an additional pump in mind, so if needed, I can just hook one up, no need to re-plumb.


Having two pumps now, I'm absolutely convinced that one pump, pushing parallel paths is better. Isn't Tom's like that?

Anyway, I can't do that now because my tubing/pipe diameter is too small. Hoover dam could not push water any faster through my 3/4" pipe than it's moving now. But you are using nice fat pipes! One pump should do. Plumbing so you can easily add a 2nd if required is ideal!


Keep up the good work!


PS - good decision to be ready to use OC's vs. the Pentairs.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

i like the plans, did you use sketch-up? must have taken forever, subscried


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## intermediate_noob (Jan 23, 2007)

khoile said:


> Tom,
> 
> I already bought all the pentair modules, so I guess I'll try them out first, but I'm convinced that OC is better now. I just have to make sure I design the plumbing so that I could swap in the OC if needed.


I will tell you from personal experience that replacing plumbing _after_ the tank goes in is the biggest pain in the butt I have had with any tank. I rushed and had to replace a sump (had to rehouse all fish and plants) because I did not test enough and now having to replace two pumps because they were "what I had". With that stand you are planning it will also be incredibly difficult to get in and out of if you need to replace all that stuff. 

That is just my two cents on the subject. I know you have bought your stuff and want to use it, and I have never used it so take it for what its worth. I just hate it when people have to relive the nightmares I have had to go through.

This is a great thread and you are getting some awesome advice. Heck Mr. Barr himself stopped by!

Lastly. which mechanical modules did you get? I was at the Pentair site and they said the single modules are only good up to a 150 gallon tank or something. 

Also, the AquaticEco site is horrid now, just had to mention that. Cannot find anything unless you know what you are searching for.


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## fishscale (May 29, 2007)

How dare you post this, you should be banned. Making me all jealous, terrible.


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## duzzy (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi there, 

this is shaping into one hell of a cracking tank, will definitely keep this thread on the watching list. All the best with it. Also what is starphire glass?

Regards Darren


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

intermediate_noob said:


> Also, the AquaticEco site is horrid now, just had to mention that. Cannot find anything unless you know what you are searching for.


That is absolutely true. But their catalog weights a couple of pounds and is very well organized. It is spectacular. Which is why I mentioned it.

Everyone that has a planted tank should go onto their website to request the catalog.

Oh yeah, their prices tend to be high. But they are also the only place you will find a lot of really cool things. For example the really big filters Tom was referring to.

Sorry for the hijack khoile - but you do need to get your hands on that catalog before you finish this wonderful tank.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

intermediate_noob said:


> With that stand you are planning it will also be incredibly difficult to get in and out of if you need to replace all that stuff.


As it is, yes. But if khoile puts a few more ball valves into his design, and puts a union in front of, and behind, every component it won't be nearly so hard.

khoile - if you do that, the unions I mean. Be sure that you always put every union pointing in the same direction with respect to water flow. For instance installing them all so that water flows in the little side and out the large side. That way when you replace a component, you install 1/2 a union (the little piece) on the inflow side of the component and the other 1/2 of that same union (the big piece) on the outflow side. If everything in the stand that way, switching components will be a simple matter of shutting off some ball valves (maybe a pump) and unscrewing the old component and screwing in the new.


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## intermediate_noob (Jan 23, 2007)

scolley said:


> Everyone that has a planted tank should go onto their website to request the catalog.


Thanks for the idea, I appreciate it.
Edit 1:
FYI, you can download the whole catalog. All 128 megabytes of it.

http://www.aquaticeco.com/images/static/catalog-pdfs/AES-2008-hi-res.pdf

Edit 2:

And OMG it is SEARCHABLE!!! Will Wonders never cease! (I think I need to get out more!)


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks everyone, really helpful tips.

Ok I'll call them and get the catalog. I agreed, their website is almost useless, it like it's design to work if you have the catalog in hand and know exactly what part number you want, or else it's manually clicking through thousand of products.

intermediate_noob:
I bought the pentair double modules. They are rated for 200 gallon tank, whatever that mean . I got two mechanical, hopefully that will allow me to run 2 weeks without media change. I know I know, OC will run for a month, probaly more.

Steve:
Thanks for the plumbing tip, I need as much tip as I can because this is my first plumbing project.


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

duzzy said:


> Hi there,
> 
> this is shaping into one hell of a cracking tank, will definitely keep this thread on the watching list. All the best with it. *Also what is starphire glass?*
> 
> Regards Darren


Starphire is a brand of low-iron glass (glass without the green tinge).


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Got Tank!*

Ok here she is:















































Now I got lots of work to do .

Khoi


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

WOW! WOW! WOW! WOW!

That is SWEET! You've got my dream tank! You are going to have SO much fun! roud:


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

Wow!
What a really nice tank!


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## SeaSerpant (Feb 20, 2008)

Can't wait to see it up with some water in it.


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## giga (Dec 7, 2007)

Nice, some day I will own a 300 gallon tank much like your 230G i'm a little jealous


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## nellis (Oct 27, 2005)

How much does that thing weigh??? You're gonna have a hernia getting it on to the stand.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for all the complements.

nellis, fedex list the freight as 750lbs. By my estimation it's ~500lbs.

So my schedule will be, 

this week - buy wood for stand
next week - build stand
+2 weeks - do plumbing
+3 weeks - put tank on stand, finish plumbing
+4 weeks - Initial planting

Hope I can meet my personal deadline of fully planted tank by September.


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## ringram (Jan 19, 2005)

Looks like a good plan.
Just remember that with most projects (IME) you can double or triple the time you _think_ it'll take and that will be the _actual_ time.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

x3 is usually about right, IME...


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## Steve Z (Jul 5, 2007)

I'm trying to put my model from the google sketchUp system on here ,but can't figure out how 
can you tell me since you know how to


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## ColeMan (Mar 9, 2008)

ringram said:


> Looks like a good plan.
> Just remember that with most projects (IME) you can double or triple the time you _think_ it'll take and that will be the _actual_ time.


I'd have to agree with you here! I've been working on a tank roughly one-third this size for the last 8 weeks and i don't even have substrate! Granted I may be a bit slow, but, ya know...things come up! This is a helluva thread, though, can't wait to see some more progress.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Yeah look like 2x is right, cause I got the wood, but thing comes up and I have to travel for work this weekend... oh well...


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## Digital (Apr 4, 2008)

Holy cow man, you've got a real nice setup starting there! I'd like to own a great sized planted aquarium one day! 

GO GET'M!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Pentair Experiment!*

Hi all,

I did an experiment this weekend. The goal is to figure out if the Pentair modules can be hook together using only Megaloc thread compound.

Here's the setup:


















I'm not sure the result is good or bad news . Up to ~15psi, no leak, but they burst apart at ~25psi.



















Here to see at what psi they burst, I reconfigure the clamp to only clamp onto one of the module instead of both.










Here's the video showing no leak at ~15psi. You have to use a flash player to view these video, I use vlc player.
http://www.teamvn.com-a.googlepages.com/DSCF1248.flv

and here's the video showing they burst apart at ~25psi, I know you can't see too well from the video, but trust me, it's ~25psi. You can still see the needle moving up slowly.
http://www.teamvn.com-a.googlepages.com/DSCF1250.flv

Is 15psi good enough that's the question. My estimate is the system is only going to be ~10psi. I'm sure there are other things to consider, but this is what I got so far...

Comments?

Khoi.


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## gsd78 (Jan 13, 2004)

I know I said it before in your other thread, but I'll again advise against what your testing. Thread lock compound is intended to be used to seal threaded connections and NOT slip fit connections like your attempting. Slip fit connections must be glued. Also, were you measuring it up to 15psi with the filters clamped together? Were you planning on clamping them together in your stand?

I'd use unions between all the modules if I were you. Using thread compound on slip fittings is just asking for major leaks in my opinion.


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## intermediate_noob (Jan 23, 2007)

I would second the idea of using unions and PVC, not the thread compound. Think about that mess under your stand. If you glue them and then use unions, you will still be able to remove them. I do not know if you have seen them before, but this is what they look like. (crappy picture that is not mine, but you can see how it works to allow you to unscrew one side and have it separate)


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

I agree union is the correct way to go, but what if I build a jig to ensure the modules stay put? My only problem with union is that they take up too much space.

Still a worth while expreriment I thought... even though it too risky to use.


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## Jace (Feb 20, 2008)

Updates?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Sorry... not much so far, still building the stand. You guy were right... it take 3x longer than plan . Stand pics to come this weekend. Hopefully.


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## giga (Dec 7, 2007)

I know how that goes. When I built mine(signature) it took a lot longer then I thought.


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## dr.tran (Oct 8, 2007)

updates?


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## DiscusIt'sWhats4DinneR (Apr 25, 2008)

how are you planning to get it onto the stand; help from 3 friends? or do you have a more creative method


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

this tank looks awesome
where are the updates?


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## metageologist (Jan 10, 2008)

can't wait to see this please post updates


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

metageologist said:


> can't wait to see this please post updates


x2:thumbsup:


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Sorry I've been working overtime these past weeks. However, I finally finished the stand frame this weekend, and only need to do the skinning.

This one took me and my dad 4 weekends to complete.

Enjoy the pics:

Here's the model of the stand:










And here is the finished product:


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

wow stand looks GREAT and very sturdy, you have a great dad to help you out like that


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## ValorG (Dec 27, 2003)

yah, very sturdy looking, looks like more back breaking lifting is needed to move this monster. >_<


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

looks amazing
i can't wait for the tank to go on it


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

Nice house, I mean stand...lol. Man is that thing solid.

I am guessing.... about 200 lbs?

Hope you got some really strong reinforced flooring for that stand and tank.


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## Wingsdlc (Dec 9, 2005)

Very nice stand. I am quite interested in seeing how you skin it. I built a stand a week or so ago and opted not to skin it as I wasn't sure how.


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

This is what popped into my head as soon as I saw your stand...










And that's a _good_ thing! Nice work!!!


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

Looks like someone's been spending a lot of time on Reef Central. That's got the smell of a reefer's build!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Yeah I did spent quite a bit of time at RC . As for skinning it, I plan to use plywood, but I got to go to Home Depot to see what they offer first, so far don't have a clue how it's going to turn out. Although I like "old wood" stain.

I'm ordering some plumbing now and hope to get watter running next month .


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Stand is 90% done - Staining next*

Finally done skinning the stand. I'm having it stain next week.

Hope you like it.




























I'm really hoping to fill the tank 2 weeks from now :icon_roll .


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## BiscuitSlayer (Apr 1, 2005)

khoile -

Stand looks good man! Please correct me if I am wrong, but that looks like 1/2 oak ply for the skin and the trim looks like 1" X 3" (3/4" by 2 3/4" actual).

Kind of hard to get the scale since the stand is so big. Are you going to wire it up with GFCIs or anything? That is one deep stand (front to back)


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Hey Biscuit, 

The skin is 3/4" plywood, and you are right, the trim is 3/4 x 2 3/4. I plan to wire it up with GFCIs, got to go back and check your thread for tips .


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

Stand looks great! What are you planning on using to light this monster?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

I got a "mint" current outer orbit 3x 150W HQI and 8x 39W T5 on ebay . . I just fired it up for couple minutes to test and It's been taking up my office room space ever since. I may replace the bulb with ADA ($$$), but for now the stock one will do.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

That sounds like a good light choice IMO. Any chance you can fire up only a single bank of T5's, like four? If so, that's got to be the perfect light.

And I LOVE the stand! While I know the doors will swing pretty wide, you are REALLY going to appreciate the ability to get your whole head shoulders and arms into the stand when you need to. And you will. Good design decision. :icon_wink 

That tank is SO awesome, I'm really anxious to see this up and running. But don't hurry on the part of people like me. This is a big and expensive undertaking. Keep proceeding as you are... planning and taking the time needed to do it right.

But HURRY! :biggrin:


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Steve,

The light as is cannot control the T5 independently. I plan to make modifications so that I could do just that, controlling both the T5s and individual MH so I can stagger start/stop them.

Finally the stand is stained and lacquered.

Here are the pics:










Here's one with the tank...









Next up, electrical then plumbing.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

§ drool §


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

amazing, I can't wait


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## CobraGuppy (Sep 23, 2007)

That is Awesome!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Light mounted / Stand in place*

Quick update!

I've finally rewired the light, now all the MH ballasts are external and can be control independently. The T5s are rewired so that I can control the front and back bank, also independently. The OEM fans are very noisy, so I replaced those with 12V PC quite fans.

Before light mods:









After...









Light and stand.









Bracing for the top shelve... peace of mind!









Enjoy!
Khoi


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

You are out of your mind dude.

I can't wait to see this thing functioing!!!


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

Subscribed!


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

First off, This is an awefully big build up (no pun intended)... no pressure or anything.

Second, that is some serious anchoring for that light fixture.


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## aquanut415 (Jan 21, 2006)

wow.. an awful lot of work, and planning well documented there. definitely looking forward to seeing more progress.


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## rich815 (May 21, 2008)

What will this baby weigh full? Something like 2500 lbs+??


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## NstyN8 (May 9, 2008)

Very Impressive! Did you acquire that from a tanning salon?


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

now thats what I wanna see


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## rekles75 (Feb 25, 2008)

Got me drooling. I am SUBSCRIBED.


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## nellis (Oct 27, 2005)

Nicely done sir, but you forgot to add moonlights while you were in there.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for all the complements.



NstyN8 said:


> Very Impressive! Did you acquire that from a tanning salon?


Which one? the shelve? That one is a DIY.



nellis said:


> Nicely done sir, but you forgot to add moonlights while you were in there.


I do have moonlights, it's part of the fixture, 9 blue and 9 white .



rich815 said:


> What will this baby weigh full? Something like 2500 lbs+??


Yeah at 8 lbs per gallon, it's 1800 for the water, 500 for the tank, 300 for the stand. The grand total is ~2600 lbs.


Just the plumbing left....chunk ka chunk ka chunk ka chunk ka.. choo choo


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

AWSUM

I love it


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## nanojimbo (Jul 2, 2008)

subscribed  good luck with the plumbing - looks too much for my brain to handle haha


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

Hows this tank coming along?


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## blazeyreef (Mar 17, 2008)

can not wait to see this thing started!


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## ZID ZULANDER (Apr 15, 2008)

What manufacture built the tank for you? Does it have a glass section around the top for a brace?


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## Badcopnofishtank (Jan 20, 2004)

I think he specified it was rimless...with starfire front and sides. Did you ever find a pump, cause I have a mint Panworld 250 sitting around. I was going to use it on my 190, but it was bit too powerful. 

Anxious to see the hardscape on this one.


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## ZID ZULANDER (Apr 15, 2008)

I am not sure if you are responding to my post or not but being rimless and with starfire front and sides doesnt say who put the tank together. A company like Lee Mar or Advance Aqua Tanks or Oceanic would be what I was looking for. Any of those companies would be the people that built the tank. Also it could still be rimless ( lack of molding ) but still have a bracing around the top on the inside.




Badcopnofishtank said:


> I think he specified it was rimless...with starfire front and sides.
> 
> Anxious to see the hardscape on this one.


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## Badcopnofishtank (Jan 20, 2004)

I am curious to find out who built the monster as well, I think your referring to eurobracing?


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## ZID ZULANDER (Apr 15, 2008)

Badcopnofishtank said:


> I am curious to find out who built the monster as well, I think your referring to eurobracing?


 
Yes that is what I am talking about but most people on this site wouldnt know what that was.


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## Stevo (Aug 22, 2007)

ZID ZULANDER said:


> Yes that is what I am talking about but most people on this site wouldnt know what that was.


If you have a read through the whole thread you will find pictures of the tank that clearly show that it is rimless, as described. i.e. no bracing (unlike eurobracing). There's even a link in the first post, if that helps..


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## KC21386 (Feb 15, 2008)

The builder was mentioned earlier in the thread as well.

Looking forward to an update too! September is coming fast!


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## ZID ZULANDER (Apr 15, 2008)

KC21386 said:


> The builder was mentioned earlier in the thread as well.
> 
> Looking forward to an update too! September is coming fast!


 
Yes I see it now it was such a small plug that I missed it. Also the pictures in the thread are not really clear and there never was mention of bracing but you can not tell from the pictures.


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## jackh (Jul 2, 2008)

oh my god. subscribed.

will 2600 lbs in that one spot not crack the floor or do something to the foundation in the house? jw cuz my cousins putting a 5x8 ft tank in his wall and they had to reinforce the foundation when building the house.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Hi, http://www.concepttanks.com/ is the tank builder. Although I don't recommend them, if you want the details pm me.

I'm still working on setting up the plumbing... I hope to get the tank on the stand next week.



jackh said:


> oh my god. subscribed.
> 
> will 2600 lbs in that one spot not crack the floor or do something to the foundation in the house? jw cuz my cousins putting a 5x8 ft tank in his wall and they had to reinforce the foundation when building the house.


Hehe I'm kinda nervous about this, but a quick calculation shows that I have 200lb per square foot weight distribution (3000lb / (6ftx2.5ft)). I weight almost as much and if I stand on my toe, the floor didn't collapse so I guess it's good.


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## scolley (Apr 4, 2004)

khoile - I gotta tell you, IMO that "shelf", or "hoodless hood", or whatever you want to call that braced piece of _stand-matching, light hanging shelf _is a stroke of genius! Did you think that up? I've never seen that before, and by-gosh, if anyone has respect for GOOD new ideas, it's me! That is awesome!

Looking at it I see a few major advantages...


Most Important - you can run your power cords vertically, minimizing the impact they have if you pull them back to a wall behind the tank (as I have :icon_frow ). This minimization is both visual (all wires - structural and electronic - running the same direction) and practical (pulling electirical wires from hanging lights to any direction other than the physical hanging point) because it allows the light to hang as desired, without being pulled in other directions by the electrical cords

Least Important - you have a convenient platform from which you could mount other lights (like moon lights or similare LEDs) without having to mess with your major light source.

Median Importance - you visually emphasize the openness of your tank with the horizontal platform, without actually interferring with the true openess of your tank.


Now MUCH of what I have just said can be repeated for bars, or bracing - as with ADA - for lights. But IMO your solution is MUCH more elegant.

It does have some seeming drawbacks...


It will be most effective if you have a high ceiling. That's clearly not a problem for you.

That height (whatever is is) needs to be high enough to minimize the visual impact of the bracing above the shelf. Again, not a problem you seem to have.

All I can say, is that I see my next project in the works. And it is building a shelf *just like yours*! Good job! roud:

Thanks for the inspiration. We are even now. :icon_wink


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for the complement, believe it or not, it was my idea all along . Although I didn't think that deep into it like you described. 

If you look back at the plan you'll see it here:









It's great that you want to build the same, a warning on mounting it though, make sure you mount the board to some bottom brackets first, install the top brackets and remove the bottom one. I didn't do that, and was using many chairs/tables stack on top of each other to hold the board, it was scary.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

khoile said:


> It's great that you want to build the same, a warning on mounting it though, make sure you mount the board to some bottom brackets first, install the top brackets and remove the bottom one. I didn't do that, and was using many chairs/tables stack on top of each other to hold the board, it was scary.


You lost me here. Do you mean like temporarily brace it while you install the permanent brackets? For a few bucks, you could have just built a rigged up 2x4 brace system underneath, built to the desired height of the shelf and layed the shelf on it while you installed the brackets.

Or you can get a few buddies on ladders and tell them to hold it (bribe them with beer or something, this is what I do when I need to something crazy like that)

But as Steve expanded on, this really is a great idea if it can match the decor and style of the room.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Glenn, your ideas would work too. At the time when I install it, it was just me and my dad. And we didn't have any frame pre-built for this (we underestimated the task, as always). So we ended up stacking my daughter table (short one), one the ladder, then add a chair (up side down) on top of the table, then the board goes on top of the chair legs. Not a good idea at all, we almost drop the board, glad that's over , but now I know better.


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## st3v3 (Apr 14, 2008)

khoile said:


> Thanks for all the complements.
> 
> nellis, fedex list the freight as 750lbs. By my estimation it's ~500lbs.
> 
> ...


I'm dying to see this thing put together. It's been a long time coming.


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

looks great


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Not really a major update, but I'm kinda on track to move the tank in this weekend. I've finally finalized my return plumbing setup:

This setup allows me to put two pressure gauges, one before and one after the venturi, so I can dial in that 30% pressure (optimize setting?) differential. 


















And finally installed the door, I wish they were taller, but... oh well.









And the "missile silo" aka pentair heaters/uv setup.









Lastly, top to bottom, all cords from the light fixture are hidden now, need to do the same for the controller.









One thing I learn about PVC fittings, you'll always be missing that one part!

Enjoy,


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

The Charts below is not taking into account the 1" PVC you have here and there, accessories like a Mazzei which requires a fair amount of pressure, the micron filter that goes down to *5µ*, the other Pentair modules that will put a load on the pump, the fancy PVC fittings....etc. You are seriously underpowered for your setup and you will have water quality issues eventually.

I suggest you upgrade that Sequence Reeflo pump or pumps to ones that will be able to better handle your loop and it's accessories. I suggest again that you go with a bigger pump such as a *'minimum'* Hammerhead and even then if this were my tank, I would use a dedicated pump for my Mazzei *if* I went with this lower head pump. In actuality I would use a Dolphin Aqua Sea 3600SP or similar if I was going with a tank this with size and accessory level.

Even if you are considering using 2 pumps you are choosing one of the lowest head pumps on the market. Why spend all this money on good stuff and then slack off majorly on the heartbeat of the system?

Everything looks great otherwise and I especially like the gauges before and after the Mazzei! While I'm in tune with my Mazzei and it's capabilities, I think I'll do this as well so that I can visually relate to what PSI what pressure works best for the Co2 level I would like in my tank...excellent Idea! BTW there is no ideal pressure, you will have to adjust according to your tank needs.

mrkookm









khoile said:


> intermediate_noob:
> No problem, I welcome all comments. Actually you guy are so helpful I've redesigned the plumbing to a better version. Yup I will plumb with an additional pump in mind, so if needed, I can just hook one up, no need to replumb. I've read some thread on the cichlid forum, and realized that the pentair mech modules require more frequent media change than OC, so my solution to the problem? add more problem! So I originally plan only 1 mech, now I have 2 :icon_eek: I'll give pentair a chance, if they don't work well I'll just replace the mech/bio-chem block with OC units.
> 
> For pump headloss, I did use the calculator for both Sequence Snapper and Dart when I was researching pumps, here are my result:
> ...


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for the advice, I choose the Snapper for two reasons:

1. Low energy usage, when I started the system I try to target minimum usage while getting adequate flow rate.

2. Lack of experience, so I relied on calculator.

I do plan to upgrade the pump, I just don't' know to what. The link to the dolphin you sent me look good except it consume 700+ watt to run. How about barracuda or goby?

Thanks again for the advice. I really needed them since this is my first system where I use external dedicated pump, and the pentair modules.

*Edit*
I could also use needle wheel pump instead of mazzei, I just need to undo the mazzei setup and plumb-in the pump. This maybe the route I will take since I have to bite fingernails to ditch out more $$ for another system pump.


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

I'm not familiar with this method but I've read it works well providing the correct size needle wheel is used. An underpowered Mazzei is useless at that gallonage and with the new pumps it will not have the head to generate good sized mist, dissolve efficiently and especially so with all those Pentairs. 

You no longer have a 75 gal where tiny canisters will cut it, you chose to go to the big league so we gotta think big all over  Ultra quiet, low energy, low head is not gonna kick it with 240gal tank with 6 ~7 Pentair Modules  Thats not factoring a whole lot more restrictions that I saw in your diagram.

I think the needle wheel is a smarter approach IMO but it should be used with the new pumps listed *NOT *with the Reeflo. Do you remember the issues crazy loach had with his setup 240gal? He also went the lowhead, quiet and low energy route but he had multiple issues and he had nowhere near the same resistance as you :eek5:


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Yeah, I checked his thread again and he ended up with the Dart, I got confuse between crazy loach and gsd, and ended up thinking gsd using dart, and he's pumping from bottom floor up, but now that I double checked, gsd is using barracuda. Geez... . Well, what ever the decision is, I'm going to wait to see how the little pump that couldn't performs.


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## gsd78 (Jan 13, 2004)

Khoile: For what its worth...I am running a Barracuda as my return pump with only the Mazzei on it (with a bypass loop like you have). I decided to add a second pump (Panworld 100px-x) to power my Pentair Lifegard modules and I only filter the water in my sump with them. The flow I get out of the Panworld and 4 Pentair modules is fairly low, but fits my needs as I am relying on the Barracuda to provide flow in the tank. The Barracuda does provide plenty of flow even pumping from the basement up to the first floor. I even have it valved down quite a bit because I am limited by the flow rates of my overflow and durso standpipes.


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

gsd78 said:


> I decided to add a second pump (Panworld 100px-x) to power my Pentair Lifegard modules and I only filter the water in my sump with them.


Note his Panworld is rated at 790gph @ *21ft* and the Barracuda is *19ft* Using the Panworld to power the 3~4 Pentair modules made all the difference for gsd78 because if he tried to use his Barracuda then he would have run into problems with the resistance of the Pentairs.

BTW to get better performance from the Mazzei direct all the flow you do not want towards the Mazzei instead of using the ball valve to reduce overall flow. This will make you Co2 performance better.



gsd78 said:


> The Barracuda does provide plenty of flow even pumping from the basement up to the first floor. I even have it valved down quite a bit because I am limited by the flow rates of my overflow and durso standpipes.


I have no doubts the Barracuda's ability to overwhelm the tank when pumping water from the basement to your tank using 1½in PVC. At only 10~15ft the pump is pushing around 3000~2100GPH but this would have been a very different situation if you tried using it to power the 4 Pentairs that has 1in plumbing and then trying to get the Mazzei pressure it needs to sing  

Good choice on using a higher head pump for the modules and higher flow pump with descent head for main tank. 

My suggestion to khoile to go with a hammehead head is because he has *6 or 7* modules + Mazzei + plus other cool restrictive suff inline :eek5: very different from you lower resistance setup gsd78


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

gsd, thanks for the helpful information.

mrkookm, I also have 1.5" PVC. Every time there's a 1" I use a wye split from 1x 1.5" to 2x 1", so in reality I never reduce the pipe size to 1", I just split 1x 1.5" to 2x 1". Would that change your perspective? 

Also, the Panworld pump listed by gsd is a 1000ish gph at 0 feet pump with 13feet max. You mentioned a much higher number? did I miss anything?


Thanks for the comments.
Khoi


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## mrkookm (Apr 4, 2007)

gsd, thanks for the helpful information.


> mrkookm, I also have 1.5" PVC. Every time there's a 1" I use a wye split from 1x 1.5" to 2x 1", so in reality I never reduce the pipe size to 1", I just split 1x 1.5" to 2x 1". Would that change your perspective?





> Also, the Panworld pump listed by gsd is a 1000ish gph at 0 feet pump with 13feet max. You mentioned a much higher number? did I miss anything?


I missed the double XX so my miscalc there. Even still, he is using 4 modules @ 60% loss and if he was to add 1 more his flow would be dead. How many modules do you have?

Like you've said.... try it and then change it if needed.


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## TANKd (Jul 28, 2008)

Nice Setup! Keep up the good work!I wanna see some updates with fauna and plants. Nice Job! roud:


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## fish_fasinated (Mar 30, 2006)

deffidently subscribed. simply amazing.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Finally brought in the tank.

It takes some work but I rented the Genie lift material lifter and bought two glass suction cups.

Anyway here are the pics:


















Also I've replaced the reeflo snapper (12' max head) pump with Uno Marlin (37' max head).

Enjoy.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

the host is having problem their http server has been on/off intermittently.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

wow, this is gonna be awesome


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

What's the gizmo attached to the wall on the right?

And what's next? It's awesome finally seeing that monster on the stand!!! :thumbsup:


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

It's the AquaController, it controls the automatic water change, lightning and dosing.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

NICE!
great big tank, great clear glass, great stand (well once it gets some doors), the setup is bound to be good.

your using an AC for a freshwater tank? i have an ACjr on my reef and it has plenty of functions, for a freshwater tank with just WC, dosing, top-off, and lighting, what do you need the advanced (and expensive) one? the ACs work great though, unless you have too much electric noise, but most people dont need to worry too much about that.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

I aggree Marko, however there is one key limitation to the jr (besides the web based functionality), it limits the user to 40 lines of code (which really sucks IMO). I have struggled many times with my controller because of it and if I did it again, I would have bought the AC III.


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## PlantN0ob (May 18, 2008)

Solid build, cant even imagine how it would look once filled/planted and all.


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Very Nice! :thumbsup: This is an interesting discussion/thread for those contemplating the big leagues. Good luck with the pump decisions too. 

PS. I would replace those blue moonlights to all white. Just my opinion.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for all the complements.

For those who are interested, I selected AC3 mainly due to it's ability to control 20 devices and http access. Because I wanted to control each of my MH indendently (I have 3 MHs) and also my T5s (front and back). Just for the light I have used already one DC8. 3 for MH, 2 for T5, 1 for Fan, and 2 for moonlights (I may join both, but for now 2). Then there's the macro and micro dosing (2x outlets), water change (2x, one for drain and one for fill). Heaters (2x), UV (1x), CO2 (1x), that's another 8, not including pump since pump run 24/7, I'll just hook a switch to the pump so I can power it off manually for filter change. If you are in the market for a controller I think you should also look at Reefkeeper elite, I don't think it is as flexible as the AC series due to lack of a programming feature, but it is very expandable. Right now the only thing against it is lack of http access, although they have a web module planned, don't count on it being release anytime soon though.

Betowess I don't know how the moonlights look yet, but I see that you prefer white, I'm not sure if they sell an all white module though.

I'm charging ahead to fill this tank even though I haven't setup the CO2/dosing/water change because my daughter B day is next Saturday.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

for a moonlight, will you use an incandescent bulb, or some LEDs?
i think a few LEDs would be best (10-20) with a combo of blue and white LEDs. but that would be a pain to connect and change. but scattered around the hood would look nice IMO then 1 incandescent bulb, it would also let you control the color more. 

filling it up actually isnt such a bad idea, why not let the bacteria build up while you are adding the final automated features.


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

Yeah, IMO blue LEDs tend to look a bit alien, whereas all white LEDs look exactly like moonlight and facilitate viewing the nocturnal habits. Some really do like the blue, just not me. 

This is a really nice sized setup, perfect for aquascaping. Going to be sweet!


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

What did you end up choosing for substrate?


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## Saraja87 (Jul 18, 2007)

There is actually an excellent moonlight company on ebay, this is their store:
http://stores.ebay.com/DiGiKits-com-Electronic-Components

Their prices are really reasonable and if you send them a message they are really great at accommodating special orders. Just give them your tank size, depth, measurements and tell them you want white LEDS and they'll design a great moon lighting system for you.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

The fixture have 12 white and 12 blue moon lights built-in. I can alternate from white to blue or change them to all white or all blue If I wanted.

lauraleellbp, I haven't decided yet, it's either going to be Aquasoil or SMS. The thing is I'm not sure how long I will live here, so another move will be in the near future, I am not sure if Aquasoil is a good idea since removing them would smash them into mud, if anyone have any experience taking aquasoil in/out please let me know. Oh and the cost too, Aquasoil would cost almost $500 shipped vs $50 bucks for SMS .


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## ChineseSnooker (May 20, 2008)

wow. thats gunna be a B**** to move.. but i vote for aqua soil.. I've moved allota stuff in/outta my tank and it doesn't crumble that easily..


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

If you're going to move soon I'd probably just go with SMS to start off, personally.

After the move I'd take a good hard look at Mineralized Soil though- I've seen some pretty amazing results from that process, and it's very cheap, just a little labor-intensive right at first. There's a thread going now in the Substrate forum if you're interested.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

The Mineralized Soil seem to be a very effective idea. I may try it. But for a 230G, how much soil do I need? This is a good thing, as an effective DIY soil at a much cheaper than ADA price is what the hobby need right now.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

khoile said:


> The Mineralized Soil seem to be a very effective idea. I may try it. But for a 230G, how much soil do I need? This is a good thing, as an effective DIY soil at a much cheaper than ADA price is what the hobby need right now.


I agree, I'm really excited to give it a try soon.  Ingg and/or AaronT would probably be able to answer your question regarding how much of all the materials you'd need- they've set up pretty big tanks using this method.


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## SeattlesDarko (Nov 27, 2008)

*Wow*

I'm going to be old and gray before I'm ever able to have a tank that beautiful and HUGE! But I'm so anxious to see all that you do with this! It's just amazing!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Sorry for the lack of updates, I have to move to another location unexpectedly and in the process of doing that. The tank will not be up until couple months later. I have other issues right now with the tank weight . My new location is raised floor and I'm working on reinforcing it to support 3000lbs.


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

aw man that sucks, but good luck, keep us posted on the progress


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## Architect1 (Feb 19, 2006)

there a lot of wood there more thing i think was needed. but non the less looks good to bad its taking for ever.


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## metageologist (Jan 10, 2008)

how is the tank progressing


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## fastfreddie (Sep 10, 2008)

any news?


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## timme278 (Jan 1, 2009)

fastfreddie said:


> any news?


wow, this thread is old, i was like :eek5: its realy that old lol

updateeeee


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

khoile said:


> It's the AquaController, it controls the automatic water change, lightning and dosing.


Oh, that is a fun tank to move:icon_evil
Get 2 more suction disc and some piano moving carts, straps etc.

I am moving my 180 this month.
Ain't looking forward to it.

Those pumps are going to suck a lot of energy and make a lot of noise.
2-3 Large Ehiems will produce 80-120 watts. No mazzei, but you can use needle wheel and use less energy.
An Iwaki 40 is enough filtration if you add more current with a pair of canister filters like Nu Clear or OC.
This is about the same as the 2-3 ehiems as far as energy(Ehiems are easier to clean IMO/IME), but the big factor is much less noise. 

Mazzei's are great, but reduce water flow and are dependent on pressure, which over time changes as filters clog.
If you have power/flow to burn, that's fine.

You likely are not going to use those MH's a lot also.
I stopped using mine entirely on all my tanks, just the T5 or PC's.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## c_sking (Aug 4, 2008)

I would love to see this tank up and running----HINT !!!!!!!!!!!!! Heck I would like to see it with water moving around.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

yeah, I was just thinking of this tank yesterday when building a stand


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## FSM (Jan 13, 2009)

look at his profile

Last Activity: 01-31-2009 05:29 PM


I hate when stuff like this happens.


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## FastTimes (Oct 16, 2008)

maybe he changed his mind on a planted tank and went with african cichlids.


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## gogreen (Sep 18, 2008)

FastTimes said:


> maybe he changed his mind on a planted tank and went with african cichlids.


GOSH i hope not


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## jmhart (Mar 14, 2008)

I appreciate the time put into this tank. Planning started on or before 4/2008. Sure, the OP had an unexpected move, but even before that he still spent 6-7 months.

That's dedication. I think a lot of people would have rushed and done a crappy job just to get it up.

I should be putting together a 120 in the next few months, so this gives me a lot of ideas.


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## c_sking (Aug 4, 2008)

jmhart said:


> That's dedication. I think a lot of people would have rushed and done a crappy job just to get it up.
> 
> 
> 
> > Good point I would have :tongue: I hope he still owns it. Would love to see it floating plants. The fact he has been absent for so long and not remarked on this makes me think the worst. He had to get rid of it, but I am a glass is never half full kind of guy. All those years of drinking I guess:icon_twis


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## outcast (Jul 4, 2007)

damn, i was hoping to see some finished pictures of this puppy, hopefully the original poster will come back and keep us posted


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Hey guy I'm back. The last 6 months I spent remodeling our new house. The sad news is the tank is in the garage now, I can't get the tank inside the new smaller house . So it will be setup in the garage. 

I have to thanks plantedtank.net for automatically charging my credit card and trigger my return .


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## c_sking (Aug 4, 2008)

khoile said:


> Hey guy I'm back. The last 6 months I spent doing some time remodeling our new house. The sad news is the tank is in the garage now, I can't get the tank inside the new smaller house . So it will be setup in the garage.
> 
> I have to thanks plantedtank.net for automatically charging my credit card and trigger my return .


Well congrats on the new house, you mean you bought a house, did remodeling and did not focus it around the tank???? WTH ????. Just kidding glad some kid isnt pouring pounds of gravel in it for his red ear slider even though that could make a great home for one or 20.
Best of luck and we are still waiting on PICs of it up and running!!!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Yeah, if I have my way, I would extend the living room just for the fish tank. But I don't have my way, so.. it's going into the garage. The immediate problem I trying to solve is the garage floor is uneven. My plan is to buy 4x of these Wedge-Style Leveling Mounts:

http://www.mcmaster.com/#6012k41/=3g249u


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## gogreen (Sep 18, 2008)

oh that sucks man but congrats on the house remodeling  if you want you can set that tank up in my house  HA HA


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## SamH (Jul 17, 2009)

Nice, I'm super jealous. Can't wait to see how this one turns out.

BTW, you're awesome at SketchUp. Are you an architect?


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

Do what the reefers do, make half your garage into a fishroom and make the tank in-wall.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

khoile said:


> Hey guy I'm back. The last 6 months I spent remodeling our new house. The sad news is the tank is in the garage now, I can't get the tank inside the new smaller house . So it will be setup in the garage.


Very cool! I can't wait to see it all come together, finally, even if it is in the garage.


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## chris.rivera3 (Apr 15, 2008)

any updates???


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Ditto on that one^


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## xmas_one (Feb 5, 2010)

Me three, I just stumbled onto this tread, that thing looks awesome. I dig the shelf light hanger idea he had going on when it was in the house too.


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## chris.rivera3 (Apr 15, 2008)

xmas_one said:


> Me three, I just stumbled onto this tread, that thing looks awesome. I dig the shelf light hanger idea he had going on when it was in the house too.


Hey Dan! if I get that Mr. Aqua tank then i was thinking about the shelf for the lighting as well


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## nemosreef (Oct 19, 2007)

Nice setup. Looking forward to seeing planted.


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## FDNY911 (Dec 6, 2009)

Any updates on this tank? Maybe TPT.com should bill him one more time to get his attention because this thread is due for an update lol. Really looking forward to seeing this tank.


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## zenche (Feb 9, 2011)

no joke. just saw this thanks to the bump. what an insanely badass project.


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## FDNY911 (Dec 6, 2009)

Z tell me about it, I'm subscribing to a thread thats been dead for like a year lol just in hopes he comes back!


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## zenche (Feb 9, 2011)

lol, same here!


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

Just read all 12 pages. Very impressive l must say, l was looking forward to the finished tank by the time l got to page 11 or 12 but l guess patience is a virtue...


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## CrudeR (Mar 25, 2009)

Wow very nice setup you had started here, planed out very well. Read all 12 pages as well and got to the last page and was bummed that you didn't get a chance to finish it up. Any updates? Sold the tank? Still in the garage? Do we still have hope of seeing this beast up in action?


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## Kaie (Feb 23, 2011)

wow.... what an ending =[


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## urples (Nov 15, 2010)

Kaie said:


> wow.... what an ending =[



took the words right out of me, hahahaha


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## Xalyx (Sep 26, 2010)

You guys should just give up on this. He said he was setting it up in his garage in Sept 09, it's 18 months later.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Should never give up! more coming...


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

khoile said:


> Should never give up! more coming...


w00t!!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Hi everyone..

Sorry for not updating this thread... long story, moved to new house. New house is smaller than the old one, and desperately needed some construction so spend a year doing that. Then because newer house is raised floor, it needed to be reinforced, so spend some months doing that. Now it's reinforced but wife still isn't comfortable putting such a big tank in the house. So after down time because of all the set back and big project push at work, I got back to setting it up over the memorial day weekend.

As always it will be slow.. so forgive me. I got most of the plumbing done as you can see below:

Here's the tank in it future home:









The pump, all the pipe will be connected once the tank move back a little:









CO2 injection, via venturi port, dual pressure gauges so I know the flow rate by calculating it from the delta pressure:









Water return distribution:









Water flow control panel:









The filtration system, all pvc cemented together:









Tank with bulk heads installed and tested (no leak :bounce:









Thanks for being patience with me everyone. I'll try to update this often now.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

wow! thats alot of little pvc pieces.this looks like it will be an awesome tank! cant wait to see it progress.


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## WeedCali (Jun 21, 2010)

WOW! nice to see this up and running again!


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## zenche (Feb 9, 2011)

how much does this bad boy weigh when it's full?


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

Holy plumbing!

How easy will it be to service the filtration units once in the stand? Pretty tall looking. 
I assume there will be enough shutoffs and unions other than seen? 
Is there a water changer integrated into this? 
How about a way to drain the filtration unit completely for servicing? 
I don't see any shutoffs for the mazzei bypass. What if you need to service this?
What is after the check valve on the return line? Are those injection ports for dosing, etc?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Gatekeeper said:


> Holy plumbing!
> 
> How easy will it be to service the filtration units once in the stand? Pretty tall looking.
> I assume there will be enough shutoffs and unions other than seen?
> ...


One of the nice turn out for placing the tank in the garage is I don't have to put the filtration system inside the cabinet. So I decided to put it behind the tank, this way it's easier for me to maintain. Before I have a rail system so I could slide the filter out and put a bucket underneath to do maintenance, to slide the filter out require complicated plumbing, so I drop that when we decided to put the tank in the garage.

Water change is integrated, it's just not hook up yet so it's not obvious. I have already purchased (and is using) GE Merlin, and will be using that as an RO source for the tank. The mazzei is hooked up to the system using union so I could remove it for service, if that's what you're referring to.

You are right, those 4 ports after the check valve are dosing ports.

Mazzei bypass is the large 1 1/2" valve, I assume water will take the path of least resistance so no need to put a valve before the mazzei, I could just cap off the inlet port.



zenche said:


> how much does this bad boy weigh when it's full?


Dry Tank Weight: ~500 lbs
Stand Weight: ~200 lbs?
Water Weight: 8lb * 230 gallon = 1840 lbs
Total: ~2500 lbs.

That's why I reinforced the floor inside the house...

One question to you guy.. it's been so long I forgot.. what do I need to dose? I know iron is one of them.. I have 4 ports, one if for the heater probe, one is for iron. I guess macro mixed and micro mixed will use the other two.
Do you guy usually mix macro and micro together? Sorry been so long I don't remember some of the decisions I made 3 years ago.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Khoile first of all what great tank and I could never match your patients, I would have had a new wife by now with all the time, money, and thought put into this setup, but good for you. As with anyone who has looked at this thread I hope you get it set up and let us peek into your world from time to time, I also hope that you garage turns out to have cable tv, a pool table, poker table, etc., good luck with your tank. I have a 150 not nearly as nice but it sets on concrete in a room that was originally a "Florida Room" but I would be affraid to put it in the living area of the house and I am not quite sure how much weight the wooden floor joists would carry, so maybe this was a good thing it's in your garage now. Can you imagine all that water on carpet or hardwood, I just finished reading a thread on the tank "Scolley" built, it was beautiful but the unthinkable happened.


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## msawdey (Apr 6, 2009)

Wow Kholie. This is unbelievable and an amazing build. I cant imagine moving that sucker. I have a 50 show that im getting ready to move and absolutely dreading it. 

I am right down the 5 from you in SD. If you get a chance check out our two big LFS, Pet Kingdom and Aquatic Warehouse. Both are great LFS. I know OC has a few really great stores (a a few really bad stores) but if your planning on Discus or Angels, Pet kingdom i the place to be. Both also have a great selection of plants. If you need any starter plants i have sunset hygro that gross like a damn weed but is absolutely gorgeous with green and orange and pink at the tips of the leaves. Let me know. I usually have to clip once a week


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## Badcopnofishtank (Jan 20, 2004)

I didn't like my mazzei injection as much as the reactors. The mazzei made the water look foggy due to so much co2 being injected too closely to the tank outlet.


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## Jeffww (Aug 6, 2010)

khoile said:


> One of the nice turn out for placing the tank in the garage is I don't have to put the filtration system inside the cabinet. So I decided to put it behind the tank, this way it's easier for me to maintain. Before I have a rail system so I could slide the filter out and put a bucket underneath to do maintenance, to slide the filter out require complicated plumbing, so I drop that when we decided to put the tank in the garage.
> 
> Water change is integrated, it's just not hook up yet so it's not obvious. I have already purchased (and is using) GE Merlin, and will be using that as an RO source for the tank. The mazzei is hooked up to the system using union so I could remove it for service, if that's what you're referring to.
> 
> ...


You need a macro and micro solution. How often are you planning on doing water changes? EI is an option but expect to be dosing aroudn 120ml of Macro and ~30ml of micros daily. Big tanks aren't the best thing to go high tech on, really. EI takes big water chagnes and unless you're willing to part with ~ 100 gallons of water weekly EI isn't going to be your best option. 


You need: 

phosphate (in the form of kh2po4 ) 
potassium and magnesium and calcium (you can use a RO GH booster for this) 
Nitrates from kno3 

Micros: 
I suggest miller's microplex, csm is a tad incomplete


Iron I use 11% ferrous gluconate.
So basically a gallon a month of fertilizers.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Badcopnofishtank said:


> I didn't like my mazzei injection as much as the reactors. The mazzei made the water look foggy due to so much co2 being injected too closely to the tank outlet.


You reminded me of the fogging issue with mazzei, I guess we'll see.. if I can't stand the fog, I'll replace the mazzei loop with a reactor.



Jeffww said:


> You need a macro and micro solution. How often are you planning on doing water changes? EI is an option but expect to be dosing aroudn 120ml of Macro and ~30ml of micros daily. Big tanks aren't the best thing to go high tech on, really. EI takes big water chagnes and unless you're willing to part with ~ 100 gallons of water weekly EI isn't going to be your best option.
> 
> 
> You need:
> ...


Thanks for the rough estimate, this is going to help my decision on buying the dosing pumps. I don't want EI if I don't have to, although I do plan to do maybe 10 gallon water change daily, depend on the on the fish I guess. I am considering altum angels, but those are hard to find.



msawdey said:


> Wow Kholie. This is unbelievable and an amazing build. I cant imagine moving that sucker. I have a 50 show that im getting ready to move and absolutely dreading it.
> 
> I am right down the 5 from you in SD. If you get a chance check out our two big LFS, Pet Kingdom and Aquatic Warehouse. Both are great LFS. I know OC has a few really great stores (a a few really bad stores) but if your planning on Discus or Angels, Pet kingdom i the place to be. Both also have a great selection of plants. If you need any starter plants i have sunset hygro that gross like a damn weed but is absolutely gorgeous with green and orange and pink at the tips of the leaves. Let me know. I usually have to clip once a week


Thanks for the plant offer and LFS suggestion, OC is kinda far from San Diego, but I do go there occasionally (got SD Zoo membership). I may drop by the LFS stores you suggested the next time I'm in the area.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Finally!!!!*

Hi all...

Finally!! full tank.. no leak. I would call the test 80% successful though because of some unexpected bubble on the top rim.. but for now I'm happy.




























Enjoy...


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## sidefunk (Apr 22, 2010)

wow that tank is amazing. dream tank


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## aelysa (Oct 20, 2006)

You should come to the SCAPE meeting this month to pick up some plants


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Water! Wow! I'm so excited to finally see water in this beast!


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## MARIMOBALL (Mar 18, 2007)

aelysa said:


> You should come to the SCAPE meeting this month to pick up some plants


X2
Im so looking forward to this build.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks guys...

It's been a long time coming.. although not without trouble. When the tank is full, there are 3 air pockets that appear at the top-front-left corner of the tank. Because of this I drained the tank to half and will conduct longer test later. I hope this is a non issue because or else it would really sucks. I guess the moral of the story for anyone buying large rimless tank is you really don't want to go cheap on the tank. I went cheap and now paying the price...uncertainty.

In any case, I also finish most of the filtration hook up:










Messed up pvc gluing one of the end connector... didn't know it's pretty hard to connect, ended connecting only 25% of the connector. I hope it's ok, you can see on the right side:









Emergency pump installed and is ready to drain the tank at moment notice 











aelysa said:


> You should come to the SCAPE meeting this month to pick up some plants


Just signed up for SCAPE. Will see if there a local meeting sometime next month. Hopefully the tank is ready for plants by then.
Thanks for the info.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

*Houston - We have closed loop!*

Finally, closed the loop! :bounce:

Some leak at the threaded joints that will need to be fix, but overall a pretty good day.


Here's a pictorial description of the loop:

Overall system from the front, water is drawn in to the pump (Reeflo Marlin) on the left, and goes to the back to the filtration system, then comes back in on the right:









Water goes to the 2x Pentair mech module, T out for water change (not yet plumbed):









Once goes through the Pentair mech and chem modules, join back the water and continue to 3x Pentair heater modules, and 2x 25W UV modules. UV modules flow rate is control by the ball valve placed before the inlet:









Finally before going back into the stand, water is route through a 6 ports 1.5" PVC pipe. This is where the PH probe, RO water inlet will be connected:









Going back into the stand going through the mazzie venturi -> check valve -> dosing ports -> distributor -> 6x valve -> back to tank:









One of my favorite view.. top down angle:









Next step, hang the light...

Thanks for viewing.. I'll keep you guy up-to-date.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Jan 27, 2006)

Wow...an epic thread. How did I miss this? I thought my 100 gallon cube was long -11 months now and still waiting for a custom canopy.


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## billb (May 29, 2009)

khoile said:


> One of my favorite view.. top down angle:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I love this shot! This was one of my favorite threads, The tank and it's dimension are great. Will you be using a controller (ex Apex by Neptune systems)?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

billb said:


> I love this shot! This was one of my favorite threads, The tank and it's dimension are great. Will you be using a controller (ex Apex by Neptune systems)?


Yes I will use Neptune AC3. When I bought it 3 years ago it was top of the line.. now I see that they come out with Apex. I don't plan to upgrade to Apex though.. too much money with basically the same functions I believe.


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## karatekid14 (Jan 16, 2011)

Updates?


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## TwoStrokeKing (Mar 24, 2011)

All those pipes would confuse me. haha nice work


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## Wwh2694 (Dec 14, 2010)

Wow nice... I hate to clean that tank.


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## gitusukka (Dec 31, 2007)

All that plumbing reminds me of a swimming pool


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Sorry for lack of updates.. I've been battling what essentially is my lack of experience. I threaded all the pvc together all the way in.. and now all the threaded connections crack... . I've been researching on how to fix them ever since.. and now just started to apply the fix. I'm using JB Cold Weld, and I have high hope that it will fix it.. so far it seem so, can't really test until I fix all the cracks.

I realized now that all I have to do is apply teflon, hand tighten until stop, then use a wrench for another 1/4 to 1/2 turn.


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## TwoStrokeKing (Mar 24, 2011)

Dude JB weld fixes everything have no worries! I Love that stuff!


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## Chevelle (Jun 19, 2011)

That aquarium is a monster. 


Im sure it weighs a couple hundred pounds


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## Dr. Acula (Oct 14, 2009)

Chevelle said:


> That aquarium is a monster.
> 
> 
> Im sure it weighs a couple hundred pounds


Ha, that thing's more like a couple thousand.

Awesome, though, man. I can't wait to see things progress once you get to start scaping that beast of a tank.


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## Ahura-sama (Dec 7, 2009)

230 x 8.5 = 1955 lb + the tank ~100 lb so ~2055 or a sliver over 1 ton.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Ahura-sama said:


> 230 x 8.5 = 1955 lb + the tank ~100 lb so ~2055 or a sliver over 1 ton.


I bet that tank weighs over 300lbs. My 150tall is about 250 empty.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

khoile said:


> Sorry for lack of updates.. I've been battling what essentially is my lack of experience. I threaded all the pvc together all the way in.. and now all the threaded connections crack... . I've been researching on how to fix them ever since.. and now just started to apply the fix. I'm using JB Cold Weld, and I have high hope that it will fix it.. so far it seem so, can't really test until I fix all the cracks.
> 
> I realized now that all I have to do is apply teflon, hand tighten until stop, then use a wrench for another 1/4 to 1/2 turn.


Yep, you have to be careful no to over tighten pvc threaded conections, they also use a lot of teflon tape and a 8 count around the corse threads is needed from my experience. Pipe dope may do better on threaded pvc joints to prevent leaks and over tightening, I would check at your local plumbing supply with an experienced counter person. Teflon is great on the metal fine thread of plumbing fixtures around the house but those coarse threads can be a real pain, good luck and I hope you don't have to break it down too many times but it is definately worth it to get it done right.

Awsome tank BTW


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## Chevelle (Jun 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> I bet that tank weighs over 300lbs. My 150tall is about 250 empty.
> 
> Craig



Does your 150 have the glass thickness this 230 has?


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## Booger (May 17, 2004)

khoile said:


> Sorry for lack of updates.. I've been battling what essentially is my lack of experience. I threaded all the pvc together all the way in.. and now all the threaded connections crack... . I've been researching on how to fix them ever since.. and now just started to apply the fix. I'm using JB Cold Weld, and I have high hope that it will fix it.. so far it seem so, can't really test until I fix all the cracks.
> 
> I realized now that all I have to do is apply teflon, hand tighten until stop, then use a wrench for another 1/4 to 1/2 turn.




Can you comment any further on this? I have always tightened my threaded connections to.. very tight. I figured at such low PSI, it was more important to make them watertight than resistant to pressure. Now I'm rethinking.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Booger said:


> Can you comment any further on this? I have always tightened my threaded connections to.. very tight. I figured at such low PSI, it was more important to make them watertight than resistant to pressure. Now I'm rethinking.


What I found out (the hard way) was there is a high chance of PVC thread crack (the female part) if you tighten it all the way in, depend on the pieces that you have and the manufacturer. I undo my entire filter system just recently to repair this problem and found out that most of the thread PVC connection have crack in them  :angryfire.

I'm now fixing them one at a time, I'll post some pictures later today to show you what I mean.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Chevelle said:


> Does your 150 have the glass thickness this 230 has?


Glass is 5/8" thick. It is needed as the tank is 30" tall.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

My 150 is a 1/2 thick at 30 inches tall, but it has a top rim that's 1.5 inches tall with a center brace. The female pvc joints are almost like pipe thread and if you bottom them out it will crack, I try to get one really tight using pipe dope and leave 3 threads showing. Most of the times this works good but every once in a while you'll get one that's no where near tight at this point, so you either have to tighten a little more a go with it or buy extras and switch them out if this happens.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

khoile said:


> What I found out (the hard way) was there is a high chance of PVC thread crack (the female part) if you tighten it all the way in, depend on the pieces that you have and the manufacturer. I undo my entire filter system just recently to repair this problem and found out that most of the thread PVC connection have crack in them  :angryfire.
> 
> I'm now fixing them one at a time, I'll post some pictures later today to show you what I mean.


I've learned this the hard way myself when I was installing spas for a contractor many moons ago. Teflon tape is what keeps it from leaking, not brute force thread tightening.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

audioaficionado said:


> I've learned this the hard way myself when I was installing spas for a contractor many moons ago. Teflon tape is what keeps it from leaking, not brute force thread tightening.


He he that make both of us.

Small update, I fixed all the cracks using JB Cold Weld, great stuff!
Also hanged the light. I'm almost ready. Still small leak here and there, but no cracks.. just need more teflon tape.

Got some pictures, but also upgrading to i7 2600k right now so no software to upload the pics yet. Trying to overclock it to 4600.. what a time consuming process... 

Sorry went off on a tangent there...


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## Chaos_Being (May 18, 2010)

Ahh that is going to be a nice tank. Good luck on the overclock too, its nice to see another OC'er here. I'm planning on getting some new watercooling equipment so I can finally overclock the i7 950 I got around christmas. It's been running stock, with the stock cooler...it feels criminal, lol :hihi:


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Chaos_Being said:


> Ahh that is going to be a nice tank. Good luck on the overclock too, its nice to see another OC'er here. I'm planning on getting some new watercooling equipment so I can finally overclock the i7 950 I got around christmas. It's been running stock, with the stock cooler...it feels criminal, lol :hihi:


Should I use my OCF avatar over here? I've got so much $$$ in my aquarium that I could have already built a Sandybridge rig and OCed the heck out of it LOL.


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## Chaos_Being (May 18, 2010)

Hah! The building of my aquarium last year is probably why I'm not re-watercooled now :hihi: I'm on OCF too, although I haven't been active for a while. Same user name.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Finally got some real updates!

I hanged the light, re-installed the plumbing, been running the pump for 24 hours now, so far no leak. However the tank build quality is horrible!! I'm so worry this thing could bust anytime, crossing my fingers I'll get about 4-5 years of service from this tank, giving me enough time to save up for its replacement.

Here are some pictures of the JB cold welded parts:





























One of the coolest thing I added, an in-line flow meter. It's currently showing 10gpm per channel, so that's 20gpm for the entire loop making its 1200gph, right where I wanted it:










A full tank shot with the light shown, I will lower it once I finish the aquascape:










And finally I made a you tube walk around video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwYx-SnAhcY

As for the OC, I finally got my i7 to run at 4600 at 1.385v, I haven't tried to lower it below that, however I did get it to run at 4400 at 1.300, so I'm running at that.

Thanks for looking.. updates will be slow now as I'm slowly completing the plumbing, hooking up the automatic water change and run some electrical wire for the lights.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

cant wait to see it filled!


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

orchidman said:


> cant wait to see it filled!


It's filled already . See the video.


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## Ben. (Mar 29, 2011)

That looks amazing! I'm crossing my fingers for your tank!


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

This is going to be beautiful. Dang, its already beautiful and it isnt even scaped yet


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Good for you, I though this tank would never get filled and it so nice. It's still a shame it's in the garage and not on the other side of that wall and you could leave all the filters and thar noisy pump in the garage.

I hope you get some plants and fish soon and can't wait to see an update, good luck.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Hey guys,

I got some more updates.. Finally now deciding which substrate to get. It's been so long, look like ADA Aquasoil is still the #1 choice? I was thinking a long time ago to go cheap and get SMS, but look like that product is no longer available. Buying AqualSoil would cost me $500, ouch. Would aquariumplants.com substrates be OK? or should I just bite the bullet and get Aquasoil?

Here is the tank now, waiting for the driftwood to sink.





































And here's my mickey mouse temp probe holder, I use a hard plastic tube and filled it with silicone so that it can be held by the compression valve.









And here's the plumbing for water drainage, the garden solenoid is controlled by AC3, and when open the water will get pumped out to the lawn.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Before buying those I would look around for Turface Pro League Grey, it's identical to SMS Charcoal. I think John Deere sells it. The only downside to that type of substrate is how light it is and it does not stick together. If you want something that holds together better for big slopes or high current then you want something like AS or Eco-complete. I actually mix SMS with Eco to save money while taking advantage of the superior CEC of SMS. You could even use dirt.


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## TankZen (Jan 31, 2011)

WOW....THIS IS CRRRRAAZZY!! Can't wait to see this one come together!


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Aquariumplants' substrate is good I have been using it for over 3 years and it does not break down. It does have a tendancy to make your pH crash and use up your KH rapidly. I mean within a few hours when first used. You will want to get your water parameters stable before adding plants or they will melt.


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## VadimShevchuk (Sep 19, 2009)

I read the whole journal today! Sucks that you keep running into problems =/ Did you decide if you want high light or low light tank? With your light fixture i am assuming that its high light lol


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

WWWHHHOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't believe my eyes, come on just a little more.

I'm so glad to see this most beautiful tank and set up get up and running, can't wait to see more.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks for the kind words... I can't believe the tank is at a stage where I can put substrate in either .

I found this report from Tom, and it look like using Aquasoil for large tank could be asking for trouble, with cloudy water, and the fact that I can't walk on the soil in case I needed to is a downer also.

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/2955-I-hate-ADA-aqua-soil?

What do you guy think? that post was made in 2007, has anything changed since?

*Edit*
Look like there's a New Amazonia Normal Aquasoil, anyone know if it addresses the issues described in Tom's post?
I went ahead and ordered a 3L bag, give a try first before spending the $$ for the 15 bags my tank needed.


Thanks.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Tom recently posted that the new AS is very similar to the AS-I, not like AS-II's turning to mud problems. However wasn't AS-I the one he complained of in 2k7?

ADA AQua soil "new"
The thread you also posted in.

I got a small sample of Eco Complete with some plants a while back and this stuff is hard as gravel and I doubt it would turn to mud or get cloudy past the initial rinsing when it was new. You'd have to add substrate ferts if you wanted to root feed, but that would be easy when you first set up the tank and subsequent root tab usage.


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## BoxxerBoyDrew (Oct 16, 2005)

FREAKIN' AWESOME Khoile!!!

Man I love the tank!!! I am soooo sorry about the problems with the quality of the construction though!!!! HUGE DOWNER!!! I think You did the right thing putting it in the Garage though! I had a trash can I used to fill with R/O water bust in the living room before spilling close to 30g of water on the carpet!!! You talk about destructive, it completely soaked the living room, dining room , and hallway carpet. The living room and dinning room were together and was 25' wide and 34' long with the hallway being 40" wide and 10' long. The carpet was so soaked when Ya stopped in one spot and were barefoot the water would completely cover your feet!!!

So from experience a little water goes A LONG LONG WAY!!!

Anyway your setup is VERY WELL planned and constructed, even with the pvc snafu! It should be a thing of perfection once you get it planted and stocked!!! I can't wait to see it! O am really intrigued by the automation you have Incorporated into this, and will be watching to see how it all works!

Keep up the AWESOME WORK and Posts!!!
Drew


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I have used Flourite always and it works good and lasts forever but it's not the best looking substrate. If I were to set up a new tank with plants that were demanding I would either try ADA AS or MTS, and althought the MTS is a pain in butt DIY project, you can cap it with what ever you like.

If you click the GWAPA link below and go to "Articles" theres a good step by step for the MTS, hey it's been a couple of years in the making, whats one more!!!

I wouldn't be affraid to try the ADA AS it's just the money thing for me, but the worst I've heard is a little Ammonia spike and you have yo be carefull not to disturb it but almost anything will grow in it and grow well.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

jaidexl said:


> Before buying those I would look around for Turface Pro League Grey, it's identical to SMS Charcoal.





150EH said:


> I have used Flourite always and it works good and lasts forever but it's not the best looking substrate. If I were to set up a new tank with plants that were demanding I would either try ADA AS or MTS, and althought the MTS is a pain in butt DIY project, you can cap it with what ever you like.
> 
> If you click the GWAPA link below and go to "Articles" theres a good step by step for the MTS, hey it's been a couple of years in the making, whats one more!!!
> 
> I wouldn't be affraid to try the ADA AS it's just the money thing for me, but the worst I've heard is a little Ammonia spike and you have yo be carefull not to disturb it but almost anything will grow in it and grow well.


I kinda decided already to go with AS since I always wanted to try it, and if I don't go with AS I'll keep on questioning myself how would the tank be with AS. I'll looked in MTS/Turface Pro League Grey as my next substrate couple years down the line when I am ready to experiment again. Right now I am desperate to see some greenery in my tank .

I didn't look into Flourite because mainly it cost almost the same as AS, and what I read thus far, it require quite a bit of washing before it can be use. That and it still needed to be tab fertilize vs AS has some built-in ferts.

I also didn't want Eco-Complete for the same reason that it cost almost the same as AS, and I have used it before, and now wanted to try something else.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

I would go with AS then, but if you want to mix in some cheap stuff to save the number of AS bags you have to buy and ship, it shouldn't hurt anything, I think you'd get enough nutrients from half the AS it takes to a actually fill that monster to 3". Black Colorquartz T grade is another nice looking sub, you get it from the places that sell industrial use sand for blasting, pool plaster and concrete mixing etc. It's a heavier grit sand, jet black and holds a slope well. A 50lb bag is about 20 bucks I think.


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## BradH (May 15, 2008)

Subscribing!


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## Gold Finger (Oct 13, 2011)

I am literally drooling. enjoy!


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

A month and a half later update? :biggrin:


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## stretnik (Feb 20, 2010)

Hi. That looks like a great set-up. Can I ask you what software you are using to Draw? Kev.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of updates. But I've been busy on the tank. So far I've finished the automatic water change system. Pumping old tank water out the the front lawn. Replacing the water with RO water, the waste RO water is stored, then pump to the back yard, so zero water waste. I'll post some pictures soon.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

I used Google sketchup: http://sketchup.google.com/download/




stretnik said:


> Hi. That looks like a great set-up. Can I ask you what software you are using to Draw? Kev.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

khoile said:


> Hey guys, sorry for the lack of updates. But I've been busy on the tank. So far I've finished the automatic water change system. Pumping old tank water out the the front lawn. Replacing the water with RO water, the waste RO water is stored, then pump to the back yard, so zero water waste. I'll post some pictures soon.


Even small plumbing jobs can be a PITA and take up a lot of time with filters and other equipment is off while your connecting it all, not to mention the countless trips to the hardware store for the one piece you forgot, then if your old like me you end up with duplicates glued up that are now trash, so I feel your pain on the plumbing.

Never the less, PICS, PICS, PICS :bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce:


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

It'll be a while now until I get plants in.. I'm broke atm and waiting for my allowance to catch up before I can order the substrate and plants...

Here are the pics 

Over view:









Here's the RO unit and waste water storage tank, I have a sump pump in there and it get turn on once water level reaches a certain level. If something goes wrong and the pump didn't turn on, then it will over flow out to the side of the house.


















Here, a long 3/4" pipe taking the waste water to the garden in the back:









Micro sprinkler water the garden, pennyworth in this case:









Tank water going out to the front lawn through vent opening:









Also using micro sprinkler for the front flower pots:









Thanks for looking guys.


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## BradH (May 15, 2008)

Very cool idea!


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, I know the feeling. I gotta beg borrow and steal to get my stuff but slowly it comes together. That's $300 in PVC.


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## eaf (Sep 4, 2010)

So, this tank has never been fully set up since 2008? Or did I miss pictures with fish and plants?


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## nikonD70s (Apr 6, 2008)

eaf said:


> So, this tank has never been fully set up since 2008? Or did I miss pictures with fish and plants?


yes, now u gotta wait another 3 years to see it with fish and plants


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

He's not kidding when he says he has to save up for the plants. To do a large tank like this will cost a small fortune to fully plant it even if he get's 'em fairly cheap. AS new will eat up a lot of bux to say the least.

The cost to set up my tank wasn't so much the tank or stand, but all the extras like lights, filtration, flora, fauna, etc. The filtration plumbing on this build was complex and substantial.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

I remember this thread from the setup and then it not being setup. Glad to see you have it going again. I really look forward to seeing this thing up.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Happy New Year guys...!!!

I finally got fish in the tank.. I'm sorry I've moved to the "dark side" I am keeping arowana and parrot cichlids (they were given to me, and so I venture into keeping large fish). I will be adding plants and maintain a low light tank for now.. eventually I'll replace the parrots with discus.. anyway here's what the tank look right now.



















Maybe slightly drop-eye? I don't know.. just got him/her for about a week.









A very cool view.. the arowana stays mostly at the surface,and some time let me touch it!









My water condition:









Got to mix the waste water with RO to get the right PH and also I read some where that pure RO is no good for fish









Added another pre-filter filled with carbon cartridge to make sure I remove the chlorine









The automation works wonderfully.. I recycled 100% of the water by watering the plants in the front and back yard.

That's it for now.. it'll be a while until I add some plants.. I'll post some more then.

Happy New Year!


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I've never kept arrowana, but aren't they notorious jumpers?


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

lauraleellbp said:


> I've never kept arrowana, but aren't they notorious jumpers?


They are.. I cover the tank when I'm not around. The cool thing is I'm going to feed it from above the surface and see it jump for food.. haven't done it yet.. but after the fish recover from the transport stress I plan to give it a try.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Here's a photo of the tank with the cover on:


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

The glass looks super clear and I'm glad to see you have got something in it so you can enjoy it after all this time, keep us posted.

Btw some floaters might help the fish feel more comfortable and a bag of Frogbit is cheap, sucks up waste nutrients, and helps keep jumpers in, just a thought.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

150EH said:


> The glass looks super clear and I'm glad to see you have got something in it so you can enjoy it after all this time, keep us posted.
> 
> Btw some floaters might help the fish feel more comfortable and a bag of Frogbit is cheap, sucks up waste nutrients, and helps keep jumpers in, just a thought.


That's a great idea.. I'll see if my LFS has them.. didn't really know the name for them until now. I like to see the tank w/o the cover but always a bit nervous.. I keep a large net around all the time to scoop the arowana up just in case he jump.


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## Capsaicin_MFK (Nov 15, 2009)

Jeez...that filtration system makes my single FX5 look like a chump. Awesome tank!


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I know a bunch of people sell them on the SnS and if you find a seller in CA you won't need to worry about the weather. I would keep the top on anyway, the guy looks big enough to knock the top off iff it wanted to.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

your arrowana is soo cool!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Very nice fish. Can't wait to see it planted and what not.


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## zenche (Feb 9, 2011)

yea, nice to see this tank is back alive! love that glass man...it's a beautiful tank.


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## khoile (Jan 27, 2005)

Thanks everyone for the nice complements.. I'm going to get some plants soon, probably in a week or two. I plan to just go for low lights plant.. Anubias and java fern in the front and center, with some swords in the background. The swords I'll keep them in pots. I hope the parrots will leave these plants alone.


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## bugmenot (Oct 28, 2005)

Is it fully planted and stocked now?


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