# Is this Algae? Help!



## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I bought some plants and this algae is now taking over my aquarium.
It is so upsetting.
Can you tell from the picture what it is?
Is it hair algae?
What are my option?
Am I screwed? 
In the picture it is covering my Christmas Moss growing on a rock.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

It's definitely a filamentous algae, most likely hair or fuzz. Even if it was brought in on plants it shouldn't take over your tank like that. Something is off in your parameters or husbandry.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Asteroid said:


> ....Something is off in your parameters or husbandry.


Maybe, I am new to planted tanks. Trying to figure it out.
It is not every where, but in this spot it did take over!


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

I recommend reason the second half of this post before you'll get much help:









Tips for New & Returning Members Before Posting


TL;DR: This is a long one. It's about thinking before posting. Most won't read it because social media has killed their attention span. If you've read this far? Woohoo! Just be kind to others and use your brain. And read the rest of this because some of y'all really need a reminder or two. Be as...




www.plantedtank.net


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> Maybe, I am new to planted tanks. Trying to figure it out.
> It is not every where, but in this spot it did take over!


I'm not saying there wasn't any algae on it, but it wouldn't go viral like that if something wasn't off in your setup. I'll make the assumption it didn't look that way when you bought it. Posting some specs about your setup will help, but generally algae like that takes off when there is too much organics in the water for your setup. The variables are light and plant mass/uptake.


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## deemw (10 mo ago)

What lights do you have and how long are they on for?
I get that in ponds outside that are in direct sunlight for most of the day.

Sent from my SM-A315F using Tapatalk


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

deemw said:


> What lights do you have and how long are they on for?
> I get that in ponds outside that are in direct sunlight for most of the day.


Not too much light. (I don't think)
I have a 48" LED Shop light I got from Walmart (3200 Lumen)
And two 10 watt full spectrum LED light bulbs. I am planning of adding two more of the 10 watt bulbs today.
They are on a timer for 6 hours per day.
1.5 hours in the morning to wake the fish up so I can feed them before work. (5:00am to 6:30am)
4.5 hours in the evening (from 4:30pm to 9:00pm)
I also have CO2 going in while the lights are on.
This evening I am going to go start picking and pulling out all the hair algae I can.
It came up in a week! 
BTW, it is a 75g tank


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

Right out of the gate, that split lighting period isn’t good for your plants, especially since you’re injecting CO2. CO2 alone isn’t enough; you need to have adequate and STABLE CO2 concentration during your photoperiod. Other than that, please provide the following info:



How big is your aquarium?
How long has it been running?
Can you give a full-tank photo?
How often do you change your water?
How much water do you change?
Are you using tap or RO water?
(these questions help us determine the level of husbandry you do)

Ammonia:
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
Phosphate:
GH:
KH:
How are you dosing Macro / Micro nutrients?:
(these questions give us an idea of what your water parameters look like)

pH of fully degassed water(48 hours):
pH when lights turn on:
pH at the end of the photo period:
(these questions help us figure out if your CO2 is properly dialed in)


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I will work on getting all the info. I can gather most of it this evening...


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> I will work on getting all the info. I can gather most of it this evening...


That would be good. There are certain variables that work together. Algae could be the result of changing one thing, but there are other variables that work against you in the algae battle. The two most notable are light and organics. The organic load in the tank is what triggers algae since it releases toxins in the water. 

To eliminate or lower these toxins we do water changes or increase plant uptake by adding more plants and/or getting the ones you have t grow faster and that leads to looking at co2/fert levels, etc. See what I mean. Nothing happens in a vacuum. It's all connected.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

Asteroid said:


> That would be good. There are certain variables that work together. Algae could be the result of changing one thing, but there are other variables that work against you in the algae battle. The two most notable are light and organics. The organic load in the tank is what triggers algae since it releases toxins in the water.
> 
> To eliminate or lower these toxins we do water changes or increase plant uptake by adding more plants and/or getting the ones you have t grow faster and that leads to looking at co2/fert levels, etc. See what I mean. Nothing happens in a vacuum. It's all connected.


Exactly. This is why I asked for as much info as I did... If OP's tank is heavily planted and low on NO3, but high in PO4, then you could actually have a nutrient deficiency causing your algae. It's really hard to diagnose without getting a full picture.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

There we two changes over the last 5 days. Not sure if they contributed to the rapid growth.
1. I was out of town, so I was not dosing it daily with CO2 boost.
I got back yesterday, but did not dose with CO2 boost yet, but I did think about it, I will this evening

2. I turned off my powerhead (528-Gph Wave Maker Pump.) I had it set to come on to circulate the water when the lights and CO2 were on. I turned it off, because I planted a bunch of hair grass, Monte Carlo and micro swords. I wanted them to have time to take root.

I dose with Leaf Zone twice a week, per directions
Last water change was two weeks ago 75%, I change between 2 and 4 weeks. When I can get to it. Normally 2 to 3 weeks and I change 75%
I use Tap water and condition for 70 gallons.

EDIT: I will schedule a water change this evening, because I have been adding plants steadily...


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Everyone is already helping but I'll just say I've found that this type of algae loves to take over patches of moss. I have absolutely ZERO algae anywhere in my aquarium but when I had a tiny patch of weeping moss that was struggling to take off, finally I pulled it out and found it absolutely throttled by the hair algae. They hadn't spread anywhere else, just in that teeny tiny patch of moss.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

LidijaPN said:


> Everyone is already helping but I'll just say I've found that this type of algae loves to take over patches of moss. I have absolutely ZERO algae anywhere in my aquarium but when I had a tiny patch of weeping moss that was struggling to take off, finally I pulled it out and found it absolutely throttled by the hair algae. They hadn't spread anywhere else, just in that teeny tiny patch of moss.


You know, I can see a small piece of the hair algae here and there, but now that you mention it, 95% of it is on the Christmas Moss. I have two other rocks I covered with Christmas Moss, but it has not taken over there (YET.) I am going to try to remove all the hair algae I can this evening, I just hate to have my arm in the tank too much, but it is necessary this time.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

johnnymax said:


> You know, I can see a small piece of the hair algae here and there, but now that you mention it, 95% of it is on the Christmas Moss. I have two other rocks I covered with Christmas Moss, but it has not taken over there (YET.) I am going to try to remove all the hair algae I can this evening, I just hate to have my arm in the tank too much, but it is necessary this time.


Yeah yeah they really adore the moss. If you can get those rocks out you can gently pick the hair algae out of the moss. I did it with my weeping moss though it ended up dying on me all the same. It's a PITA but you can definitely get a lot off physically without harming the moss, if you have some patience. If you get the rocks out, you can maybe also spot treat with Excel while they're out of the tank? Others can advise on details because I haven't ever used any treatment on algae.... but it would be better than treating your whole tank I think.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

LidijaPN said:


> ...you can maybe also spot treat with Excel while they're out of the tank?


I do not have excel, would CO2 boost help?
I guess I need to order some.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

I’m not sure, there might be other treatments... wiser minds will advise! Physical removal will definitely help, whatever else you do. As well as making sure everything else is dialed in (co2, light, organics)


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

LidijaPN said:


> I’m not sure, there might be other treatments... wiser minds will advise! Physical removal will definitely help, whatever else you do. As well as making sure everything else is dialed in (co2, light, organics)


I guess I need a definition of organics. Is that fertilizer?


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## puopg (Sep 16, 2012)

Simply put, organics in this context will be more like decaying plant matter and fish waste. It CAN be fertilizer but when you think about farming, organic fertilizers are just stuff that needs microbes to help break down into useable nutrients for plants. Compare that to inorganic fertilizers, which are basically just a load of immediately useable nutrients. 

If you are dosing things like KNO3, or liquid ferts sold by companies, im pretty sure these are inorganic sources of nutrients.

Excel spot dosing on moss may result in some die off. They should recover, but as they die off, they release organics. And that can in turn feed more algae.

Like your plan to remove it, manual removal is the best course of action if you can since it breaks that cycle. It's the most annoying, time consuming task, but it really is one of the best ways. For things that easily come off, do it.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> ...please provide the following info:
> (these questions help us figure out if your CO2 is properly dialed in)


How big is your aquarium? *75G*
How long has it been running? *15+ month, but it had all plastic plants. I decided about 6 weeks ago to put live plants in. I have been introducing plant for about 4 weeks. I did not know I was venturing into a DEEP rabbit hole with no end! *
Can you give a full-tank photo? *See Below







*
How often do you change your water? *Every 2 to 3 weeks*
How much water do you change? *50% to 75%*
Are you using tap or RO water? *Tap and add conditioner for 70 g*

Ammonia: *0.25 ppm*
Nitrite: *0.00 ppm*
Nitrate: *5.00 ppm*
Phosphate: _(cannot check)_
GH:_ (cannot check)_
KH:_ (cannot check)_
How are you dosing Macro / Micro nutrient? *I am just using Leaf Zone and CO2 Boost as directed*

pH of fully degassed water(48 hours): _(eventually)_
pH when lights turn on: *7.6*
pH at the end of the photo period: _(will try tomorrow. I need to adjust the light timer to have the lights on without being split)_


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> How big is your aquarium? *75G*
> How long has it been running? *15+ month, but it had all plastic plants. I decided about 6 weeks ago to put live plants in. I have been introducing plant for about 4 weeks. I did not know I was venturing into a DEEP rabbit hole with no end! *
> Can you give a full-tank photo? *See Below
> 
> ...


I'm going to go out on a limb here...

I think something is off on your Nitrate test.

You have a lot of life in that tank, Green Dust Algae on the glass and ornaments, and haven't changed your water in a couple of weeks. Your plants aren't growing robustly enough to consume the amount of Nitrate your fish are adding. If I were you, I would take a sample of water to your LFS and have them test your water for Nitrates and Phosphates (they'll probably do it for free).

When @Asteroid mentioned tank "husbandry", he (she?) means maintenance. *All* of the very successful, algae free tanks are going to have the exact same thing in common; they're all meticulously maintained. This means weekly water changes, weekly scrubbing of glass, hardscape, filter pipes and hoses, weekly trimming of dead and dying leaves, weekly gravel-vac, monthly (or better) filter cleaning, etc etc etc. This isn't to make the tank look pretty all the time, but it keeps your organics down.

By the way, when talking about "organics", that usually refers to the stuff in your water that hasn't turned to ammonia yet, but will. This means fish poop, mulm build up in the substrate, dead and dying leaves, excess fish food, the random tetra that died in the corner and you didn't see it, etc etc.

So if I'm you and looking for a plan of action, I would do the following, in this order:

- Bring a sample of water to the fish store and get it tested for nitrates and phosphates

- set aside some time and do a good, deep clean. This means all of the areas that you can reach get cleaned. Get all of the algae off of your surfaces. Gravel-vac the substrate, getting underneath the ornaments, and focusing on the corners and under the filter inlet.

- Do a deep clean in your filter. leave all of the media, but replace any sponges or floss that is caked with "gunk"

- get rid of that split photo period and do some research on dialing in your CO2.

- pull out the infected moss and either pick it clean or dispose of it.

- research and implement an actual fertilizer regiment. Leaf Zone only provides Potassium and Iron, when your plants need a lot more than that to survive. Fertilizing is a whole topic of its own that I'm not going to dive into here, but rest assured, it's important. I'll use one really quick example: Think of fertilizers, lighting, and CO2 as parts of your car. You need all of the parts of your car to be present and in working order for the car to operate properly. Missing a key component of your car means the car might go forward, but it will never run properly, and will be dangerous. Same goes for your tank. Just picking something out of a hat here, but let's say that your water has zero magnesium in it. Magnesium is a core component of chlorophyll, an without it, every plant you put in will have stunted growth, and eventually die.

- fill your tank with fast growing, hardy species of plants. These can be removed and replaced, 1 at a time, with plants you like and will grow with your lighting. The idea is to keep the tank full of fast growing plants that will out-compete your algae.

I hate to be "That Guy", but these beautiful tanks don't run on autopilot. they're a lot of work with an amazing reward. You're going to have to put in the effort to reap that reward.


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## DangerFish (11 mo ago)

You are already in safe hands with Jellopuddinpop. But just to point out specifically, doing a very large waterchange of 50-75% and only every 2-3 weeks is definely a red flag for me, especially in a planted and highly stocked tank. Little and often is much better and you will get less fluctuations in tank parameters. For example I do 10-20% every two days at the moment. and 25%+ on the weekend. with Monthly canister cleans. I would also point out my bi-daily water changes incoporate a sand vac (surface spot clean level only) and also spot glass cleans.

Hope this helps


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I may have found "ANOTHER" problem that caused the explosion of algae growth!
When I went to adjust the light timer and discovered someone pushed the tabs down (Most likely my 6 year old Grand-Monster)
So, instead of 6 hours of light per day, it was getting 24 hours!!! Uhhhhh.... 
I did not notice, because I thought I had it programmed to be on when I tend to it.
Note to self.... Hide the timer from view in the cabinet!
The Grand-Monsters were coming over and feeding the fish while we were out of town.
I need to explain the timer to Emmett...

I am ordering some Easy-Green by Aquarium Co-op (unless someone throws up flags)
Also ordering test kits for Phosphate, GH & KH.
Anything else I need off-hand?
*I had no idea what I was getting into switching to planted tank!
But, I am going to figure it out, even though I may be sacrificing the lives of many plants in the process!*


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> How long has it been running? 15+ month, but it *had all plastic plants**.* I decided about 6 weeks ago to put live plants in. I have been introducing plant for about 4 weeks. I did not know I was venturing into a DEEP rabbit hole with no end!


Welcome to the real world, Neo.

Yeah it can be quite the rabbit hole, but it really isn't that complicated and you don't have to possess a deep science background/understanding to make it work. @jellopuddinpop gave you a pretty detailed explanation of what needs to happen. 

I guess people's definition of algae differs but you have algae all over your tank it's not isolated to the moss. The moss can act as in incubator of sorts as a ton of organics can get caught up in it as opposed to an upright stem plant.

In the very least there are three basic things plants need. Light, Ferts and Co2. So you need to know what levels you have. At present, I don't think you know any of these. Do some research on your light and try to determine how strong it is. From the pics, it looks bright for what your growing, but could just be the pic. Ferts, for hi-tech you need a complete fertilizer not one that only provides a few as mentioned by @jellopuddinpop

Co2, as discussed you need to measure your degassed to gassed PH drop. Should be around 1.0 lower by the time the lights are on or running for a few hours. Also your in-tank diffuser is too small for a 75G, You should get one around 2" diameter. You can also you use an in-line one or a reactor, but they all work, don't let anyone tell you, you need a reactor for that size tank, you don't.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> I may have found "ANOTHER" problem that caused the explosion of algae growth!
> When I went to adjust the light timer and discovered someone pushed the tabs down (Most likely my 6 year old Grand-Monster)
> So, instead of 6 hours of light per day, it was getting 24 hours!!! Uhhhhh....
> I did not notice, because I thought I had it programmed to be on when I tend to it.
> ...


Well, that'll do it! 24h of light plus overfeeding will get you some algae, my friend.

I would still proceed with the steps I outlined above. You can get away with Easy Green.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

jellopuddinpop said:


> Well, that'll do it! 24h of light plus overfeeding will get you some algae, my friend.


You forgot this little nugget as well.

"The Grand-Monsters were coming over and feeding the fish while we were out of town"

If I had to make algae, I would have my grand monsters feed the fish and leave the light on 24 hrs.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Asteroid said:


> You forgot this little nugget as well.
> "The Grand-Monsters were coming over and feeding the fish while we were out of town"
> If I had to make algae, I would have my grand monsters feed the fish and leave the light on 24 hrs.


Yea, I discovered the 24 hour light issue right before I went to bed last night.
I was resetting it as per recommendations.
I was surprised to find it was still on...
Now after just one week, my tank is a wreck! Not that is was right prior, but it was a lot better.
I am having the water tested at lunch, then I will formulate a plan of recovery and maintenance based on what was recommended here.
Thanks! 😎


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> Yea, I discovered the 24 hour light issue right before I went to bed last night.
> I was resetting it as per recommendations.
> I was surprised to find it was still on...


Yep, although I don't know if that's the only issue (looks like the algae has been there a long time) you do need to measure the things discussed. As I mentioned in my post #25, you need a bigger co2 diffuser. The one you have is for a nano.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

I’m pretty confident you can turn this around because you seem to be approaching the whole thing with enthusiasm. Things don’t work until they start working. 

You have good guidance for next steps... I also use Nilocg Thrive and have found it a pretty great all-in-one that feeds a wide selection of easy plants well even when underdosed (I have been underdosing by accident). If you’ve already ordered the Easy Green I think it’s fine too.

Definitely no 24h lights!! Haha there was another thread where we had already concluded that ‘when things seem off, interrogate the children’. They have a way of messing with things without realizing they’re messing with them. Also I have never seen a child NOT overfeed a tank.

Looking forward to seeing future updates and you winning your battle!! Oh also physically scrubbing the glass and stuff inside the tank with clean new kitchen scrubbies and then doing a water change is also a great way to put a dent in the algae.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

For GDA, I'm a huge fan of Mr. Clean Magic Erasers. They're incredible at cleaning anything that isn't abrasive and are completely inert.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Not to make the rabbit hole any more complicated, but for a 75G you should really consider dry ferts. One order will last forever. Anything liquid your paying a ridiculous amount of money for what's mostly water. You don't have to be a chemist to use these. This will work for most setups.









Estimative Index (EI) Aquarium Nutrients Package - Bags


Shop Estimative Index (EI) Aquarium Nutrients Package (Bags) for your planted aquarium. Complete aquarium fertilizer package. Brand: Green Leaf Aquariums (GLA). Orders ship fast worldwide and get free shipping on orders $125.




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I'm certainly not, I was a communications major in college, can't you tell?


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

Asteroid said:


> Not to make the rabbit hole any more complicated, but for a 75G you should really consider dry ferts. One order will last forever. Anything liquid your paying a ridiculous amount of money for what's mostly water. You don't have to be a chemist to use these. This will work for most setups.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is what I didn't want to get into earlier, but fertilization is a very deep, very broad subject with a lot of differing opinions. I completely agree with @Asteroid that dry ferts are a blessing, but using _something_ (an all-in-one) now while you sort everything out is worth it. I would focus on husbandry, CO2, lighting, and plant selection first, and worry about dry fertilizers second.

Don't get me wrong, I would absolutely be moving to dry fertilizers eventually; I'm just trying to prevent information overload.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

jellopuddinpop said:


> This is what I didn't want to get into earlier, but fertilization is a very deep, very broad subject with a lot of differing opinions. I completely agree with @Asteroid that dry ferts are a blessing, but using _something_ (an all-in-one) now while you sort everything out is worth it. I would focus on husbandry, CO2, lighting, and plant selection first, and worry about dry fertilizers second.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I would absolutely be moving to dry fertilizers eventually; I'm just trying to prevent information overload.



Yep, agree


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Yap yap. Dry ferts are great but you have to work out the ratios and measurements and mixing and dosages and it’s really not simple for a newbie. People tell you ‘just go to Rotala Butterfly!!’ But it took me like ten visits to Rotala Butterfly and two separate fert question threads to even understand what I was looking at.... 

Then you ask people what recipe to use and everyone is like ‘well everyone has their own preference, depends what you want to support’ and I’m like ‘is there a general ‘prevents plants from dying’ type formula??’ 

For a newbie the all in one is worth its weight in gold.


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## MoreliaViridis (May 19, 2021)

Quick word of advice:






























Don't be this guy.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

LidijaPN said:


> For a newbie the all in one is worth its weight in gold.


Your past the newbie post count. Your officially a Planted Tank Guru. Stop paying for water.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Asteroid said:


> Your past the newbie post count. Your officially a Planted Tank Guru. Stop paying for water.


I actually got someone on the forum to mix my gH+ and I’ll see if they can mix the fert for me too... that way I get to not weigh out my own 0.0006mg of boron or whatever but also get to not pay for water 😂

But since I had the weird Thrive underdosing issue my original bottle that I bought on the first day is still kinda full hahah. I got time


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

I tend to get algae breakouts if I don't do weekly maintenance. I can go 2 weeks max. I shoot for between a 33 and 50 percent change each week. I recently found out I've had high phosphates in my tap so I'm trying to figure out how to adapt to that better.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

evil8 said:


> I tend to get algae breakouts if I don't do weekly maintenance. I can go 2 weeks max. I shoot for between a 33 and 50 percent change each week. I recently found out I've had high phosphates in my tap so I'm trying to figure out how to adapt to that better.


Hmm.. we have high phosphate out of the tap and the lfs dude made me buy phosguard sheets... and they gave my plants deficiencies so fast. Got rid of them and all is good. I ignore the phosphate, there’s no algae for now...


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I had the nitrate tested. *Nitrate = 20 ppm

Here is what I am planning for my 75g tank based on feedback here.*
1. Remove rocks with Christmas moss. Put in tub with reduce light and dose with liquid carbon.
2. Scrub and clean all Glass & hardscape.
3. Syphon vacuum 70% water change after the big tank scrubbing.
4. Get stats on CO2 levels, so I can adjust CO2. (Degassed, at light on and light off)
5. Buy kits to measure Phosphate, KH & GH. _I already have the others._
6. Dose with NiloCG, Thrive (for now.)
_I want to learn the fertilizers, so I can add what is needed for each deficiencies at the time._
7. New water change schedule: Tue, Friday 15% & Sun 25%.
8. Use syphon vacuum for all water changes.
9. Algae scrub before Sunday vacuum & water change.
10. Upgrade CO2 system.
Not sure if I hit everything, but I need to figure out my lighting somehow. More reading...


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

I like it =)

When it comes to the CO2, the reason we’re asking about your pH is that your pH readings have an inverse relationship to your CO2 levels. As you inject CO2, your pH will start to drop. Starting with fully de-gassed tank water, a pH drop of 1 full point equals 30ppm of CO2. Add this to a reasonable amount of surface agitation, and your livestock will be completely fine. Your goal is to have your CO2 kick on an hour or more before your lights, build to roughly 30ppm, and hold there throughout the photoperiod.

This is accomplished by tuning both your injection rate and surface agitation. As your surface agitation increases, it becomes increasingly difficult for your water to hold more CO2. The idea is to make it so your CO2 rises, and caps at the ppm determined by your injection rate and your surface agitation. You can read all about this relationship in the following article:

Surface agitation & gaseous exchange in CO2 injected tanks

If you do this properly, and chart your ph, you should see a curve that is inverse of the CO2 levels in the tank. I chart my pH, and this is what mine looks like from just before my photoperiod to just after. Keep in mind that this is the pH, but the inverse of this is the CO2 concentration. Notice how the pH sort of plateaus once it hits the bottom of this curve. If I had zero gaseous exchange, this curve would kill my fish by 2 hours in. You'll also notice that I shoot for much more than a 1 point drop in pH. This comes from years of experience, and is in no way necessary (it's actually dangerous to your fish if you're not very careful). You don't need to actually chart it like I do, but determining your pH of fully degassed water, pH at the start of your photoperiod, and pH at the end will give you a pretty good idea of what's going on.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> I had the nitrate tested. *Nitrate = 20 ppm
> 
> Here is what I am planning for my 75g tank based on feedback here.*
> 1. Remove rocks with Christmas moss. Put in tub with reduce light and dose with liquid carbon.
> ...


If your not dosing nitrates from ferts, 20ppm is way too high. You want it to come from the fertilizer. When you have it in the tank naturally it means there are a good amount of organics decomposing, which in turn release ammonia before it becomes the nitrate. It's the ammonia and other toxins that are the primary reason for algae. So the nitrates is the result to not enough WCs, not enough healthy growing plants, livestock/feeding.


Things I would change from your list:

1. Throw the moss out, you have bigger fish to fry. Not worth the time. 
7. Do between 50%-70% weekly water change. In hi-tech with standard dosing for good light/co2 this is what the dosing guidelines are usually based on and is what pretty much most of the experienced people do, including myself. Doesn't mean you can't do less, but start there. 
8. When you vacuum don't disturb the substrate. When you do your releasing toxins into the water which will cause algae. Just gently put the vacuum near the substrate and the lighter waste should be suctioned out. 
10. On the co2, I don't know what you have, but if your system is working properly all you need is a bigger diffuser. Two-inch if using in-tank one.


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

LidijaPN said:


> Hmm.. we have high phosphate out of the tap and the lfs dude made me buy phosguard sheets... and they gave my plants deficiencies so fast. Got rid of them and all is good. I ignore the phosphate, there’s no algae for now...


Yeah... so far things are okay. It's mostly about keeping to the routine and not skipping maintenance or changing things that don't need to be changed.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Asteroid said:


> 1. Throw the moss out, you have bigger fish to fry. Not worth the time.
> 7. Do between 50%-70% weekly water change. In hi-tech with standard dosing for good light/co2 this is what the dosing guidelines are usually based on and is what pretty much most of the experienced people do, including myself. Doesn't mean you can't do less, but start there.
> 8. When you vacuum don't disturb the substrate. When you do your releasing toxins into the water which will cause algae. Just gently put the vacuum near the substrate and the lighter waste should be suctioned out.
> 10. On the co2, I don't know what you have, but if your system is working properly all you need is a bigger diffuser. Two-inch if using in-tank one.


I really want the Christmas moss. It is still too early to give up.
I may eventually go to weekly water changes, but for now I will try three days a week. It adds up to 55%
I was wondering about not vacuuming the substrate, because I have newly planted foreground plants.
As far as the CO2, I am going to try something different. I plan to release the CO2 directly into the wave maker with a sponge filter over it.
If it works I may post it in a new thread. This is not my idea, I read it somewhere and the idea has been rolling around in my head for a while.
I will stick with the small diffuser for now, because when I turn the wave maker on (notice it is right over it) I get great CO2 into solution.
I had to slow the bubbles down when I put it in there.
Thanks everyone. I have a new direction and feel a little more confident... 😎


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> I really want the Christmas moss. It is still too early to give up.
> I may eventually go to weekly water changes, but for now I will try three days a week. It adds up to 55%
> I was wondering about not vacuuming the substrate, because I have newly planted foreground plants.
> As far as the CO2, I am going to try something different. I plan to release the CO2 directly into the wave maker with a sponge filter over it.
> ...


Actually removing 25% of the water twice a week is completely different than removing 50% weekly. And most fert dosing calculators are based on removing 50% weekly, but I'm not interested at this point explaining why. Your getting good co2 dissolution without any measurement. Interesting.

I think I'm done. Good luck!


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Asteroid said:


> Actually removing 25% of the water twice a week is completely different than removing 50% weekly. And most fert dosing calculators are based on removing 50% weekly, but I'm not interested at this point explaining why. Your getting good co2 dissolution without any measurement. Interesting.
> 
> I think I'm done. Good luck!


I was going by the glass with the liquid in it. When the liquid turned yellow I slowed the bubbles down and it was on the opposite side of the tank.
Not interesting really


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> I was going by the glass with the liquid in it. When the liquid turned yellow I slowed the bubbles down and it was on the opposite side of the tank.
> Not interesting really


A drop checker is about 2 hours behind the actual tank, as it takes time for the gas to expel into the airspace, then into the checker fluid. When you see the color in your drop checker, you're seeing the tank conditions as they were 2 hours ago. It's better than nothing, but not the same as testing the pH. The drop checker in your photo is a deep forest green by the way. Maybe that was right at the beginning of your photo period, but seeing how the lights were on for 24 hours a day and you didn't notice, I don't think that's the case.

The person that recommended you change a little water every other day is more than likely coming from the saltwater world, where this is a common way to keep nitrate / phosphates pegged at zero, and stability is much, much more important. This is not "the planted tank" way of doing things. You'll also notice that he created his account a little over a month ago. Meanwhile, @Asteroid and I have been here for a combined 9 years, and have over 4400 posts between us. I'm not saying the other guy is wrong in his way of doing it, but it's certainly not in line with common practices. I'm following his journal, and will be interested to see how his tank progresses. He has a beautiful tank, but only time will tell if the plants will do well. 

I'll also do the math for you to see how much water you're actually changing with your method...

Tuesday: Change 15% of the tank water. Result = 85% old, 15% new
Friday: Change out 15% of the tank water. Of this water, 15% is new water, 85% is old. Result = 72.25% old, 27.75% new
Sunday: Change out 25% of the tank water. Of this water, 27.75% is new water, 72.25% is old. Result = 55.05% old, 45.95% new.

45.95% =/= 55%

On top of that, your fertilizers are designed to do a 50% change weekly, with the resulting long term accumulation hitting the target levels for your plants. Changing less water 3 times weekly will completely mess that accumulation formula up, and defeat the purpose of using a known method of fertilization. If you want to do it your way by all means go for it, but there is a reason we gave you the advice that we did; it works.

The reason @Asteroid gave you crap is:

A.) you came to us with incomplete and inaccurate information
B.) once we got the information we were looking for, we determined there is a lot more going on than just some hair algae in some moss
C.) we gave advice, but you're only going to take some of it, and then do your own thing on the rest
D.) Hair Algae, Green Fuzz Algae, Green Dust Algae, and Green Beard algae (I've spotted all of them in this tank) are all caused, in part, by low or fluctuating CO2. You're confident that your CO2 is adequate.
...
...
H.) You'll be back here in a month, ready to pull your hair out and tear down the tank as it continues to spiral.

We see the same thing happen over and over again, with newcomers to the hobby trying to break from traditional practices because they want to do things their own way. Some folks are planted tank wizards who experiment to try to invent a better mousetrap. Most people should probably start with tried and true methods, then once things are booming, try new things. You (and me, and most on this website) are in that latter group.

Again, you're free to do as you like with no ill-will. I would encourage you to keep this thread alive with any and all actions you take, along with the results. I wish you the best =)


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

I think this is a difficult dynamic, OP. You're new to planted tanks and want help with your algae. There are lots of people on here that have put in a lot of time figuring out how to be successful, and they can tell you how to do it to. All you have to do is... do everything they say. But that's not really a great way to grow in a hobby. New folks want to try things and learn on their own, even though more experienced hands can look at that and say, "tried that, won't work". I would encourage you to go off and figure it out. That's how it will really stick, and it will be more rewarding too. It should take approximately two years, if my experience is any guide, lol.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

I am all for following tried and true practices but

a) when you’re new sometimes it’s hard to tell best practice from a confident person’s opinion- i.e. we don’t know enough to easily determine who to trust, and we get a ton of experienced but conflicting info thrown at us (because everyone has their own twist to things as they get good)

b) not everything might align with everyone’s goals.... like if OP values the moss, there are definitely ways to save that moss, or at least try. Saying ‘chuck it’ may be practical, but not in line with his priorities. Like I get a ton of advice to ‘just add CO2’, and I get why that would be good, but I also know why I won’t do it. Someone might find me dumb for that, and that’s ok.... but we all have our own priorities. And sometimes you gotta learn on your own experience (even if it ends up biting you in the butt)

And yes I’m learning a ton from messing around with my dinky tank even though every experienced tanker here would laugh at it.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

EmotionalFescue said:


> It should take approximately two years, if my experience is any guide, lol.


And even here, most thing that you try will not work, and you'll go back to researching and end up right back here. In my experience, starting from a place of success allows you the freedom and excitement to try new ideas. You can change something up, watch for the resulting changes in your tank, and go back to the way you were doing it before if it doesn't work. When your tank is already struggling, tossing random, unproven things at it hoping for success is doomed to fail.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

I don’t know, I’m doing a bunch of things in my tank that a portion of very successful, very experienced people with beautiful tanks would say are ‘doomed to fail’. Like grow riccia in a low tech tank. (After I was told it was doomed to fail lol). And even if things fail, we regroup, ok, come back here, realize you guys were right all along.... that’s learning too?

I feel like too often here people want to give you a checklist of ‘success points’ to implement but you don’t understand the points and you’re doing it mechanically and it doesn’t feel like a hobby..... it’s exactly what @EmotionalFescue said. I could probably be ‘successful’ in lots of hobbies by essentially copy-pasting the methodology of someone vastly better than me... but I’ll learn more from my own blunders? If that makes sense?


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

LidijaPN said:


> And yes I’m learning a ton from messing around with my dinky tank even though every experienced tanker here would laugh at it.


I don't think that's true. I hope it's not true because that would mean we're all a holes lol. You have an algae free planted tank. I think anyone with experience would respect that.

I think your experience is informative though. You started with a low energy tank and you read a lot. That's a great way to break into this hobby.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Thanks @jellopuddinpop for your comments. Am I in the wrong thread. Is the title not

*Is this Algae? Help!*

I thought that's what OP was doing, trying it on his own and the result is the result. There's no reason to reinvent the wheel and discount the experience, that @jellopuddinpop and myself have. The moss thing is no big deal, but to discount larger water changes which is the foundation of most hi-tech tanks and are done for the reasons pointed out by @jellopuddinpop makes no sense. Especially with a tank that has every algae known to mankind. '

The member who told the OP to do smaller frequent water changes because he's doing it, doesn't even have a hi-tech tank. Is not using co2. In low-tech it's not uncommon to do smaller water changes, because your not dosing as much and relying on the tanks organics. What does that have to do with hi-tech which is what the OP has. That's the negative part of the forum, it's like a wild west show and anyone can say anything and it's the OPs responsibility to decide what to listen to.


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

I feel you, @johnnymax . I too am just switching from plastic to real plants, and boy it’s like kicking a hornet nest, or rather a fish tank.
Keep going, don’t give up, remember that these guys are trying to help you, even if it feels like they are just pounding you down.
Best of luck,


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

EmotionalFescue said:


> I don't think that's true. I hope it's not true because that would mean we're all a holes lol. You have an algae free planted tank. I think anyone with experience would respect that.
> 
> I think your experience is informative though. You started with a low energy tank and you read a lot. That's a great way to break into this hobby.


I think people often get advised to jump into CO2 before they’re ready, honestly. Which is why so many have algae death spirals etc. Everything happens too fast and you don’t know enough to course correct. People are trying their best to help you (as I fully feel @Asteroid and @jellopuddinpop are absolutely doing, don’t get me wrong guys, I hugely value your advice), but you just feel confused and overwhelmed. I remember when people were sending me to RotalaButterfly and I kept going there and just not even knowing what I was looking at......

I feel like starting with low tech is playing on easy mode....

I honestly think it’s ok to start with implementing whatever changes sound logical, if those don’t work out, reevaluate....

Better light period, physical cleaning, whatever water changes will help to a point... then OP can see where he is and maybe get a new layer of advice... that way he builds his knowledge base with understanding. In the end it’s not necessarily about having the perfect tank... for me it’s all about those little moments of ‘aha! So that’s what I’ve messed up! Oh, well....’


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Asteroid said:


> Thanks @jellopuddinpop for your comments. Am I in the wrong thread. Is the title not
> 
> *Is this Algae? Help!*
> 
> I thought that's what OP was doing, trying it on his own and the result is the result. There's no reason to reinvent the wheel and discount the experience, that @jellopuddinpop and myself have. The moss thing is no big deal, but to discount larger water changes which is the foundation of most hi-tech tanks and are done for the reasons pointed out by @jellopuddinpop makes no sense. Especially with a tank that has every algae known to mankind. '


I'm honestly not sure what you're so bothered over. Seems to me like OP is trying and flailing, as one does at this stage. It doesn't read to me like anyone is discounting anything. OP is still trying to find up from down, left from right.

My advice is to him: starting a thread and asking for help with your algae may just not be the best approach _in my opinion_.

If it were me, I would go off and read read read planted tank threads and give yourself time to osmose the information that will lead to success. 

Take a voyage of careful study and self discovery.

Or not! But it may turn out like... this.



LidijaPN said:


> I think people often get advised to jump into CO2 before they’re ready, honestly. Which is why so many have algae death spirals etc.


I would say people often jump into high light before they're ready. I think CO2 would only make your tank better and I wish you would do it lol.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I think some of the problem is, I am having conflicting information, i.e. changing water every other day. I have always changed water every two weeks and changed 75% or more
Someone says that is a problem, so I say ok, I will change less more often.
Then someone says I need to change every week and change more. Which makes since to me originally.
I AM NOT wanting to do my own thing. I am wanting to do everything the way it is recommended.
Well, maybe, I won't by a larger CO2 diffuser just yet, as I am able to to get sufficient CO2 in solution when used with the wave maker.
When the drop checker turned yellow (almost clear) that was over two weeks ago, when I added the wave maker over it.
I did not know about monitoring CO2 by the pH. For now I will use the drop checker, until I know the CO2 levels degassed, etc.
As far as who to listen to, I wish some members had a GURU status symbol or something, because everyone posts like they are a GURU, well, not me.
So please don't be upset with me. I am earnestly seeking good advice from y'all who know what I hope to one day know as well.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

EmotionalFescue said:


> I'm honestly not sure what you're so bothered over. Seems to me like OP is trying and flailing, as one does at this stage. It doesn't read to me like anyone is discounting anything. OP is still trying to find up from down, left from right.


This is the second time you've implied something that isn't true. I'm simply stating that I was done with the thread. I would just rather spend time "teaching" someone who will listen. I think that is my right. Stop stirring the pot. If you want to do that, please go somewhere else.


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

johnnymax said:


> I think some of the problem is, I am having conflicting information, i.e. changing water every other day. I have always changed water every two weeks and changed 75% or more
> Someone says that is a problem, so I say ok, I will change less more often.
> Then someone says I need to change every week and change more. Which makes since to me originally.
> I AM NOT wanting to do my own thing. I am wanting to do everything the way it is recommended.
> ...


The thing is, there is no single right way. All of them are right. You need to chose your own. I’m saying this from a position of a noobie newer than you. Find the one that works for you.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

EmotionalFescue said:


> I would say people often jump into high light before they're ready. I think CO2 would only make your tank better and I wish you would do it lol.


yess! High ferts and high light to make quick growth and then the wrong thing grows!! Ha!

Also, noooo!! Neverrr!! You’ll never take me aliiiiive!!! 😂


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Asteroid said:


> This is the second time you've implied something that isn't true. I'm simply stating that I was done with the thread. I would just rather spend time "teaching" someone who will listen. I think that is my right. Stop stirring the pot. If you want to do that, please go somewhere else.


I don't know what to tell ya - I'm not trying to stir the pot. I'll do my best to not engage with you if that's what you're looking for, but I will feel free to offer my advice if I think it's welcome. And I'll piss off if I think it's not.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

EmotionalFescue said:


> I don't know what to tell ya - I'm not trying to stir the pot. I'll do my best to not engage with you if that's what you're looking for, but I will feel free to offer my advice if I think it's welcome. And I'll piss off if I think it's not.


Telling me I'm so bothered about something is not offering advise. You need to stop now.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

johnnymax said:


> I think some of the problem is, I am having conflicting information, i.e. changing water every other day. I have always changed water every two weeks and changed 75% or more
> Someone says that is a problem, so I say ok, I will change less more often.
> Then someone says I need to change every week and change more. Which makes since to me originally.
> I AM NOT wanting to do my own thing. I am wanting to do everything the way it is recommended.
> ...


I honestly think you’re doing well!! It’s just a disorientating stage. You will work it all out. Start with 50% change once a week and see how it works. If something seems off, we can readjust. But that ratio works for a LOT of people. 

It’s hard when we know little and everyone sounds like they all know EVERYTHING but they’re all saying different things. After a while you realize almost all of them meant well and were giving good info, just approaching things from various angles. 

You can definitely do this! One step at a time.


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

Yes. That is a perfect suggestion. Start where you can.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> I think some of the problem is, I am having conflicting information, i.e. changing water every other day. I have always changed water every two weeks and changed 75% or more
> Someone says that is a problem, so I say ok, I will change less more often.
> Then someone says I need to change every week and change more. Which makes since to me originally.
> I AM NOT wanting to do my own thing. I am wanting to do everything the way it is recommended.
> ...


There was a guy that was as close to being a Guru as you could get, but he's no longer allowed to post here. It's a damned shame too, because his tank is stunning, he was super active, and he always jumped in to help everyone, from beginner to advanced.

Now the folks who are out of the beginner phase, but not quite a guru, have nowhere to turn on this forum. Our whole purpose here is to help newer people without having anyone to turn to ourselves.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

LidijaPN said:


> ...And yes I’m learning a ton from messing around with my dinky tank even though every experienced tanker here would laugh at it.


I have always had "dirty tanks" so this is all new, but I am all in. It is making me abandon everything I have ever done. 
As far as trying to inject CO2 into my wave maker, that will be once I have everything stabilized. I mean if I ever get everything stabilized.
Right now, I am getting CO2 into solution.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Take whatever steps you can from everything previously discussed and report back with findings!! ⭐

I mean it’s just plants in water. What’s the worst that can happen? 😅


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Good luck, OP - you'll get there!


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

jellopuddinpop said:


> There was a guy that was as close to being a Guru as you could get, but he's no longer allowed to post here. It's a damned shame too, because his tank is stunning, he was super active, and he always jumped in to help everyone, from beginner to advanced.
> 
> Now the folks who are out of the beginner phase, but not quite a guru, have nowhere to turn on this forum. Our whole purpose here is to help newer people without having anyone to turn to ourselves.


You do a great job. We are thankful for what you guys do. As far we are concerned you are the masters.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

johnnymax said:


> As far as who to listen to, I wish some members had a GURU status symbol or something, because everyone posts like they are a GURU, well, not me.


All you have to do is click on their username and see what they've done. Most who are experienced have journals. I actually have links right in my signature on the bottom and you could see the type of tank I have. If your running a hi-tech co2 tank, then makes sense to get advise from someone doing that to. If someone isn't running co2 how would they be able to help you.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Asteroid said:


> All you have to do is click on their username and see what they've done. Most who are experienced have journals. I actually have links right in my signature on the bottom and you could see the type of tank I have. If your running a hi-tech co2 tank, then makes sense to get advise from someone doing that to. If someone isn't running co2 how would they be able to help you.


For sure, best advice I got given here is ‘listen to people who are doing what you want to do’


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

@LidijaPN 

Much easier on mobile to @mention someone as opposed to quoting.

The reason most of the veterans recommend CO2 is that it's really the control factor in the aquarium. As someone else mentioned, too many newcomers jump into high lighting, which is more like a gas pedal. If you start with a low light, low tech tank, then CO2 isn't needed (though it wouldn't hurt!). The reason it's given so often as advice is that as long as it's stable and doesn't kill your fish, it can't possible hurt things. It can only make things better.

I'm always trying to turn things into a metaphor, and in this case, CO2 is like the steering wheel on a car, where light is the gas pedal. Sure, you can punch it down a windy road without a steering wheel, but you're gonna crash. Drive nice and slow in a parking lot, and your steering wheel won't hurt you.

Using that same analogy, most people need to stick to 40-60 PAR and learn to drive before jumping on the Autobahn and flooring it at 200, and that's with a steering wheel.


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## puopg (Sep 16, 2012)

Haha on the topic of guru vs non guru, I think its more about experience within some desired goal range. Some are great at keeping shrimp, some at growing difficult plants, and some are great at doing low tech.

In my planted tank journey, I still consider myself a beginner - intermediate. I may be able to offer advice to those who keep medium tech tanks, but I have never had a non-co2 low tech tank for longer than say a few months. So I could never claim to be a guru for low tech since I cannot prove that I have had success with that goal in mind. Each goal is different. 

That said, there is a lot of overlap between goals, its not like you can grow plants in a complete blackout and no light. Take a step back, deep breath, and take your time processing all the information you are receiving. It's totally overwhelming at first, I can say that from experience. But eventually, things start to click. 

Patience is one of the key things to learn in this hobby. Trust that you will get there, and find people that share your goals. Best of luck to ya!


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

jellopuddinpop said:


> @LidijaPN
> 
> Much easier on mobile to @mention someone as opposed to quoting.
> 
> ...


I do get that... and totally agree, with you and @EmotionalFescue, that light is the first trigger usually. People want best of everything while not understanding things can be too good for your own good, hahah. My terrible light is probably actively saving my butt.

But I do also feel, from a recent newb perspective, that there’s maybe a touch too much accent on ‘dialing in that pH point drop’, at the expense of other things that could help and be easier for the person to implement at their given place on the learning curve... people do run tanks with no CO2, people run tanks with homemade CO2, with ‘just a little CO2’, and all these things work, in different ways, for different things... one can adjust the light (which OP is actively doing), one can adjust feeding, clean more, control organics.... add plants... add different types of plants.... 

From what I’m seeing in the thread, OP totally wants to follow advice. I think it will work out for him even if he doesn’t follow it all at once?


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## puopg (Sep 16, 2012)

LidijaPN said:


> But I do also feel, from a recent newb perspective, that there’s maybe a touch too much accent on ‘dialing in that pH point drop’, at the expense of other things that could help and be easier for the person to implement at their given place on the learning curve... people do run tanks with no CO2, people run tanks with homemade CO2, with ‘just a little CO2’, and all these things work, in different ways, for different things... one can adjust the light (which OP is actively doing), one can adjust feeding, clean more, control organics.... add plants... add different types of plants....


I think it's just that CO2 is the hardest thing to get a grasp on in this hobby, leading to the emphasis on it. And most people rely on visual indicators such as bubble count and drop checker color. Both are arguably unreliable methods of gauging CO2. They just have a lot more error like from user vision and how big is a bubble?

It's like if you are baking cupcakes, when the recipe calls for 1 cup of sugar, and you pack the crap outta it, vs going by weight and then wondering why your cakes are so sweet and how this recipe sucks. Volume has more user error, weight is consistent and repeatable. So the pH point drop is a more reliable unit of measurement vs my "drop checker is green".

But even with all the emphasis on that point drop, I still see more often mentions of drop checkers and bubble counters. Doesn't mean they aren't useful, I can visually see a drop checker is blue way faster than getting out a pH probe and plunging it in. But I don't go and recommend these other indicators, or even DIY CO2 due to the factors of user error and repeatability. I would rather share a process that can be more easily replicated for anyone else. This may be a reason for that accent you mention.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Well, for the record, it has been a process to get here.
I started low light and no CO2.
My plants were all melting away and I saw almost no new growth. (I hit the forum reading, including the web and kindle books.)
I started using Leaf Zone and CO2 Boost, because I happened to have it in a box already.
Then I saw a sign here and there of growth, but on the type of plants they say anyone can grow.
So I decided to add CO2, (I had the tank and regulator from owning a brewery.)
I saw some growth! 
Then I added two small full spectrum bulbs.
The plants started to grow, new growth. Not a lot, but noticeable.
Then I leave on a trip and come back and I find hair algae here and there, especially on the moss.
So I made a post here asking what it was and if there was any advice.
Then information poured from the screen in thru my eyeballs and overloaded all the circuits in my brain! 
And, in the process I spent 100 bucks ordering stuff recommended (that is why a new CO2 diffuser is not on the list right now)
Oh, since I decided to just put plants in my aquarium I have spent 100's 
Wife is on my a..... (butt)
But I am determined not to fail, at least not this time. There is too much information out there. Right?
I honestly though that after a couple of months of reading and researching I could do it!
So, I pulled out the plastic plants and planted live plants.
That was a great, happy and glorious day! I was so proud! 
Then it was like throwing water on the wicked witch of the west in the Wizard of Oz. I'm Melting!!!!
Oh, By the way. Thank you everyone for all your help! And I do mean everyone!


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

You're very welcome. I another few weeks, I'll be re-introducing my tank to the planted world. If you really want to see how far down the rabbit hole you can fall, don't miss it =)

I haven't posted my tank in a long time because I was stuck in a pattern of poor growth, and the real solution was going to take some serious time and energy. I've completed 90% of the journey, and have the week of 4/11 off of work to really polish it up. I'll have a huge update on my tank by the end of that week. I can't wait =)


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

You have great vibes, @johnnymax !! You’ll make this work! It can’t all be taken in in a night, that’s for sure!


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

pH at lights out: *pH = 6.5*
CO2 valve is shut off.
Thursday evening I can check pH degassed


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

What was the pH when the lights came on?


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> What was the pH when the lights came on?


pH was 7.6 at lights on


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> pH was 7.6 at lights on


Ok, see, that's a problem. It counts like you're getting enough CO2 into your tank, but it's happening by the end of the day. You need that CO2 in the water at the beginning of the photoperiod, and it needs to stay there throughout the day. Are you turning your CO2 on an hour or two before your lights?


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> ...Are you turning your CO2 on an hour or two before your lights?


I noticed on your graph that you have the CO2 being injected before the lights are on.
That is new to me. After seeing your graph I had already planned to buy a second timer for the CO2 solenoid.
Payday today, so I will pick one up.
I will be turning the CO2 back on Thursday evening after measuring the degassed pH.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

I personally recommend these timers as opposed to analog ones. It's much easier to program, and would be grandchild proof =)

BN-LINK WiFi Heavy Duty Smart Plug Outlet, No Hub Required with Timer Function, White, Compatible with Alexa and Google Assistant, 2.4 Ghz Network Only (2 Pack) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CVPKD8Z/ref=cm_sw_r_apan_i_PXBAZ0BNWCPSDDJZ29QC?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> I personally recommend these timers as opposed to analog ones. It's much easier to program, and would be grandchild proof =)


Well, I actually have 4 smart plugs (somewhere) I had them so I could tell Alexa to turn on & off aquarium lights and wave makers.
They have timer capabilities also. I never used that function.
When we moved out to our property 2 years ago, I never set them back up.
I wonder where they are???
Thanks for jogging my memory.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> Well, I actually have 4 smart plugs (somewhere) I had them so I could tell Alexa to turn on & off aquarium lights and wave makers.
> They have timer capabilities also. I never used that function.
> When we moved out to our property 2 years ago, I never set them back up.
> I wonder where they are???
> Thanks for jogging my memory.


I don't have any of the home automation stuff set up myself, and don't have Alexa or Google home. I can picture it now... Grandkids see you do it once, and then every time they come over, "Alexa! Turn on the fishtank!"


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> I don't have any of the home automation stuff set up myself, and don't have Alexa or Google home. I can picture it now... Grandkids see you do it once, and then every time they come over, "Alexa! Turn on the fishtank!"


I think I will pick up the cheap analog timer at lunch for now, LOL


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## Bandit1200 (Dec 11, 2010)

There's nothing I can add that hasn't been said already. I can vouch for how awesome the smart plugs are for setting everything up on timers and even manual over rides. I have one that has filters/pumps/heater/co2 all on one circuit. I don't have a scheduled timer for that one, it's "always on" except for water changes and feeding time. I have it set to a countdown to automatically turn itself back on so I don't forget (again) to turn it back on. I have no need/desire for "alexa" to control my house, but having the option to do so from my phone is pretty handy. Good Luck!


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## Profector (Oct 7, 2010)

just wanted to add my two cents. I’m sure you’re getting a lot of good advice here. my advice is to confirm what you read here. While most of the advice is technically correct, there are multiple means to the same end.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> I bought some plants and this algae is now taking over my aquarium.
> It is so upsetting.
> Can you tell from the picture what it is?
> Is it hair algae?
> ...


I have had this issue and it seems there are some common elements to it; at least in my case.
1. It happens in tanks that have plenty light
2. It used to happen in tanks, which had been fertilized a bit on the heavy side
3. It has typically been localized and growing in “clouds”, sort of like a blob, which engulfs things around it: other plants, decor, whatever is stationary
Remedies that had worked for me, all done simultaneously :
As per 1: reduction of light in either intensity, or duration, or both
As per 2: reducing ferts, especially phosphorus
As per 3: mannual removal of the “blobs”. 
the latter can be risky, if plants had been incorporated into the blob. Unless done with utmost care and with spreading the blob apart and away from plants, pulling in it typically pulled plants with it.
In tanks, where I had no fish, shrimp, or snails I would take a small syringe, fill it up with peroxide, turn off the air/filter (anything that moves water) and squirt the affected areas under water with the peroxide. In small doses but every 10 seconds, or so. The fine fibers in algae hate that, foam up, and react with peroxide then die off. This works especially in tanks with larger volume of water: 20 gal and up. The peroxide disperses and even a few milliliters are insignificant to overall tank volume. 
If fauna co-inhabit the tank, that technique is a bit trickier. In my case I have found that shrimp are the least affected by peroxide. in some cases some of the plants in the tank would suffer from peroxide, but shrimp would not. Of course the effect is delayed, as nothing drops dead on the spot. Almost nothing. It takes time for the algae to show disintegration. Snails can be affected, if they spend too long in higher concentration of peroxide, but who seems to be least tolerant to it are fish. One of the tanks I treated had guppies in it. You put your hand in the tank, guppies are immediately there. One day a male guppy swam into a cloud of peroxide and ended up dying within the next 30 min. Not a pretty sight; it seems their gills burn up, severe swelling takes place, and they drop. 
Some of the plants seems to be sensitive to peroxide as well: I had Elodea and Vallisneria turn white and disintegrate within hours after treatment. That is a reaction very similar those two can have to Seachem Excel. Other plants seem to have been more resistant to this treatment.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I had already moved the 3 rock I glued the moss on, into a pan of water and dosed with peroxide. But I will still have a problem in the tank. I am contemplating H2O2 in the tank. We shall see...


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

That works, but be careful how You go about doing that. I actually timed what it takes to kill a different type of algae in pure peroxide bath. It takes a full minute to do so. I would not go over 45 seconds with the moss in straight store-grade (3%) peroxide. This algae is fine-fibers, so it does not take much. I have killed Java moss in 3 minute baths as experiment. Not sure what is the minimum time do get there; had not have algae in moss, but once and in that case I had enough moss on hand to just discard/replace.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

*Took Extreme Measures!*
1. I soaked the rocks covered with Christmas moss with H2O2 in a pan (2.5 ml per gallon)
2. I dosed the whole tank with H2O2 (1.5 ml per gallon)
3. I removed most of the plants and trimmed off melted/algae covered leaves (it was most of the leaves)
4. Scrubbed glass and ornaments.
5. Siphon vacuumed the bottom
6. Did an 80% water change
7. Replanted trimmed plants before adding water back
8. Dosed with Thrive (Came in today)
9. I spread Osmocote granules (sparsely) around the plants that need fertilizer and pressed them into the substrate
10. Turned CO2 back on (on timer to come on 2 hours before lights)
11. I moved lights around on the top to concentrate light on plants that need more light and away from ones that need less (Java fern)

*Water tested post water change so I can monitor the change over the week:*
Ammonia = 0.00 ppm
Nitrite = 0.00 ppm
Nitrate = 5.00 ppm
pH degassed = 7.6
pH at lights on = 7.6
pH at lights off = 6.5
Still waiting on new test kits to come in for phosphate, GH & KH.

*New Planned Maintenance Schedule:*
Every Sunday evening:
Test water
Trim and tend to plants
Clean glass and ornaments
Vacuum Siphon bottom
70% water change
Dose with Thrive

Thank you for all the guidance.
This site (members) have helped me so much more than all the reading of books and articles I have done.
But the books and articles are what gave me the courage to go planted tank.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> View attachment 1040115
> 
> *Took Extreme Measures!*
> 1. I soaked the rocks covered with Christmas moss with H2O2 in a pan (2.5 ml per gallon)
> ...


Lots done! Nice tank! People tell me, that osmocote needs to be buried deep in the substrate, or algal bloom is eminent.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

Yeah, that Osmosote needs to be waaaay in the substrate, or its going to spike your nutrients crazy high.


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## MoreliaViridis (May 19, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> 9. I spread Osmocote granules (sparsely) around the plants that need fertilizer and pressed them into the substrate


Ideally you would do this before WC. But don't matter much.
O+ will leech NH4+, even when planted if substrate is inert. (No CEC).
So your filter better be on point and you should use O+ sparingly. Few balls are enough for a bunch of plants.



johnnymax said:


> *Water tested post water change so I can monitor the change over the week:*
> Ammonia = 0.00 ppm
> Nitrite = 0.00 ppm
> Nitrate = 5.00 ppm
> ...


GH and KH is helpful but not hugely necessary.
I have a feeling that your KH is on the higher side..
Phosphate isn't going to be helpful much but who knows...your tap might be heavy on PO4.

Gotta work on that pre-light CO2.
You want CO2 to reach equilibrium (input amount=degassing amount) before light to turn on.
It might take few hours if your dissolving method is not suitable for your size tank.



johnnymax said:


> *New Planned Maintenance Schedule:*
> Every Sunday evening:
> Test water
> Trim and tend to plants
> ...


Testing water is fine, but the best way to figure out how plants are doing is looking at plants themselves.
Doesn't matter what is in the tank. Only matters whether plants have enough.
I usually measure pH, KH, GH at the setup and thats about it.
You should test tap water too. Its as important as tank water.

When you do gravel vaccum be careful to not expose O+.
I like to get turkey baster and gently disturbing 1~2cm on surface substrate while sucking out water.
But thats just me using aquasoil.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

I'm really hoping you get to read this before tomorrow...

If you were getting a 1 point drop by the end of your photo period (when your CO2 came on at the same time as your lights), you may want to dial that back a bit and observe. You're going to be running an extra 2 hours of CO2, and if your gaseous exchange isn't high enough, you may end up gassing your fish. 

I would highly recommend turning it down for the first day that you have it coming on earlier. You can always turn it up a touch every day, but you don't want to overshoot your mark and kill any fauna.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I always wondered how you could add fertilizer every week and it not get too concentrated in part. That is why you need a huge water change every week. You are removing any parts of the fertilizer not being used up.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> I always wondered how you could add fertilizer every week and it not get too concentrated in part. That is why you need a huge water change every week. You are removing any parts of the fertilizer not being used up.


Yupp, you got it!


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Phosphate test kit came in.
*Phosphate = 2.0 ppm*


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> Phosphate test kit came in.
> *Phosphate = 2.0 ppm*


2ppm is actually pretty good.

At this point, I think you're on the right track. I personally would ahead avoided the osmocote, but that ship has sailed.

Stick with the water changes and cleanliness, dose Thrive as directed, dial in that CO2, and stuff the tank with fast growing plants, and I think you'll be just fine.


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## MoreliaViridis (May 19, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> I always wondered how you could add fertilizer every week and it not get too concentrated in part. That is why you need a huge water change every week. You are removing any parts of the fertilizer not being used up.


Mostly correct.
However WC does not remove all leftover ferts.

Let's say we have a bare tank with no plants.
And we add 10 nutrient at the start of the week.
And we do 50% WC at the end of the week.

Week 1: 10 - 5
Week 2: 15 - 7.5
Week 3: 17.5 - 8.75
Week 4: 18.75 - 9.375
.......
Week ∞: 20 - 10
Simple infinite series that converges to 20.

As you can see, as long as you are doing WC nutrients stop concentrating infinitely, even if you don't remove everything in the tank.

Nutrient concentrations never exceed:
(Weekly dose)×1/(WC%). (If you do WC once per week.)

So for above example:
10×1/(1/2)=10×2=20

If WC% was 80% then:
10×1/(4/5)=10×5/4=12.5
Notice concentration is lower due to more WC%.

Even if you do 1% WC it will eventually converge.
However the concentration will be 100 times of weekly dose so not practical.
Minimum for me is 30%.



WC is also extremely important for reducing organics. Organic matter, dissolved or undissolved, is most impactful for algae control. So good to do high WC.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> I always wondered how you could add fertilizer every week and it not get too concentrated in part. That is why you need a huge water change every week. You are removing any parts of the fertilizer not being used up.


There is something to be said about huge weekly water changes, which may be something to ponder. Ideally one would strive for a balanced parameter list in a tank. That is what happens in nature, for most part. Some things swing, but most stay the same. Surface runoff influx here and there? Sure. Happens. But not every week and not likely a huge of an influx, where over 50% of things might change. 
One can get the parameters back with careful measurements/replacements, sure. Minerals, concentration, etc. But for each10 things measured/balanced there may be 50 others, that are not. Just train of thought that might make sense.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

Fake_Buce777 said:


> There is something to be said about huge weekly water changes, which may be something to ponder. Ideally one would strive for a balanced parameter list in a tank. That is what happens in nature, for most part. Some things swing, but most stay the same. Surface runoff influx here and there? Sure. Happens. But not every week and not likely a huge of an influx, where over 50% of things might change.
> One can get the parameters back with careful measurements/replacements, sure. Minerals, concentration, etc. But for each10 things measured/balanced there may be 50 others, that are not. Just train of thought that might make sense.


The difficulty of keeping everything stable, while also keeping everything very clean, is exactly why a lot of people end up in the EI dosing or ADA dosing camps.

In EI dosing, your goal is the make sure all required nutrients are at a non-limiting amount, then keep a very clean tank to avoid stressing yoir biofilter and getting algae outbreaks.

The ADA system relies on keeping the water column very lean to prevent algae, while feeding the plants via an active substrate. This is very close to what happens in natural environments.

Keep in mind that most natural systems recieve a nearly endless supply of fresh, "water change" water through currents. The water turns over faster than we could ever reproduce in our systems. The exceptions that don't have a constant stream of water, are swampy bog ponds that are full of every time of algae imaginable. This is obviously not what we're going for.

When you take all of this together, you're led to the ADA system or EI system. 

(Note before anyone brings it up, there's the Walstad system as well, but that also relies on an active substrate and very, very easy growing plants.)


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Quick update on the Chrisymas moss covered rocks. They have been back in the tank for 4 days. I put them in a pan and treated with H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) 2 ml per gallon. Left them in the pan over night. Here is a picture. I know some suggested it may be easier to just get rid of it, but I would not have learned anything that way. It's not over of course. It could come right back, but my tank was not set up right at all when it got covered in algae. I hope I can do better now. You can still see some of it. It is turning pale yellow. It was the most expensive plant individually.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Actually I suggested you get rid of the moss only after I saw a FTS of your tank and there was algae everywhere. The sides were so crusted in algae you couldn't even tell it was glass. So yeah there where bigger things to worry about then a patch of algae-invested moss. 

In reality, you have placed dying moss back in your tank that will simply be a magnet for more algae instead of replacing it with a healthy thin layer of moss that will grow in quickly. But I'm happy you learned something.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Yea, it was a mess. But I hope the moss is not going to die. I saw growth the last two days. I wanted to see growth before I posted. Because of this thread everything I did with a tank was thrown out the window, LOL
Still trying to figure it out...


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

What @Asteroid is saying goes back to what we were talking about with "organics". Dead or dying plant matter releases ammonia, which helps fuel algae. The dying moss on that rock is just going to continue to grow algae unless you get all of the dying stuff off of it.

If it's really well attached to the rock, you could try trimming it way down, just leaving the bits that are stuck to the rock. That little bit stuck to the rock can still grow back, literally just as well as a fully covered rock. The difference, is now you don't have all of that decaying plant mass to act as an algae catalyst. This might be a compromise between "keep it" and "chuck it".


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> What @Asteroid is saying...


I will check the ammonia this evening.
One of the advantages of having an aquarium that has been a messy wreck for so long is the fact that I now have a formidable army that converts ammonia quickly.
Worse case, I have to do a water change or two until it is gone.
Also to be noted my shrimp have been munching on the dead algae.
I will keep you posted on the moss. Normally in situations where I am learning I end up being wrong.
But I did not want to just give up on the moss and trash it, because it was only in my tank for a week or so.
If the hair algae comes right back, I may have to trash it.
You have to remember I found out the light had been switched on to 24 hours, which I did not realize until after I started this post.
That is when I had the algae take over.
The tank is on 6 hours of light now.
I may be wrong, but the Christmas moss seems to be doing good. It was pearling when I got home yesterday and that was after only 3 hours of light.
I think the moss is doing well, even though I treated it with H2O2.
If I can't save the moss I will admit that I was wrong...


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> I will check the ammonia this evening.
> One of the advantages of having an aquarium that has been a messy wreck for so long is the fact that I now have a formidable army that converts ammonia quickly.
> ...snip...


You're not going to see an ammonia reading. A combination of your biological filter and your algae will consume it all . Your formidable army is, in part, the algae that has been growing on your plants!!

This is the reason we see algae growth directly on plant matter; it's consuming the ammonia as it's being produced. As an anecdote, if you had 10 species of plant in your algae-free aquarium doing amazing and 1 doing poorly, you would see that 1 plant start growing hair algae, green spot algae, staghorn algae, and black beard algae. This is because the most prominent and direct source of ammonia in the tank.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> You're not going to see an ammonia reading. A combination of your biological filter and your algae will consume it all . Your formidable army is, in part, the algae that has been growing on your plants!!
> ............


Yep, I probabily really downsized my army!


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Quick Update on the moss. I must admit, I am surprised at how fast the moss has recovered. I am still watching for signs of the algae infestation coming back.
I think the advice here turned my tank around. (Edit: I know it did!)
There is a new scary looking algae that showed up.
I have discovered it on two leaves. I spot treated it with H2O2.
It is already not as black as it was.









Here is the black scary algae!
This is a day after I sprayed it with H2O2. It is starting to lighten up.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

Glad to see it slowly working out. It is a cool experiment and certainly a great learning exercise.


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

johnnymax said:


> Quick Update on the moss. I must admit, I am surprised at how fast the moss has recovered. I am still watching for signs of the algae infestation coming back.
> I think the advice here turned my tank around. (Edit: I know it did!)
> There is a new scary looking algae that showed up.
> I have discovered it on two leaves. I spot treated it with H2O2.
> ...


Wow. You’ve got more endurance and determination than I could ever have. Luck has really been against you. Looks like things might be recovering. I hope they do,
Best of luck,


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I have to look on the bright side. Persevering through these plant trials will help me make it through the next plant trial. I know I have learned a lot and I am sure there are things I learned that I just have not realized yet. So far I am extremely happy as I still have some green plants 🌿 in my tank. Quite a few sacrificed their lives to further my path from ignorance to enlightenment.
On a side not, I really want one of those lights oneone mentioned on one of the post I read here somewhere. It is a light that you can program through a blue tooth app. Percent of different lights, set brightness, moon light fade in and out. As I recall I searched for it at the time. It is a thing to wish for one day. I wish I had written down the name...


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

There are a lot of lights like that. Your best is a separate post in the lighting section. They're going to be most interested in the size of your tank (in dimensions, not gallons), rimmed vs rimless, the kinds of plants you want to keep, CO2 vs no CO2, and budget.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> I have to look on the bright side. Persevering through these plant trials will help me make it through the next plant trial. I know I have learned a lot and I am sure there are things I learned that I just have not realized yet. So far I am extremely happy as I still have some green plants 🌿 in my tank. Quite a few sacrificed their lives to further my path from ignorance to enlightenment.
> On a side not, I really want one of those lights oneone mentioned on one of the post I read here somewhere. It is a light that you can program through a blue tooth app. Percent of different lights, set brightness, moon light fade in and out. As I recall I searched for it at the time. It is a thing to wish for one day. I wish I had written down the name...


Fluval makes those, but it is not the only one. So does Finnex.


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## BigMamaCleo (Jul 26, 2020)

johnnymax said:


> On a side not, I really want one of those lights oneone mentioned on one of the post I read here somewhere. It is a light that you can program through a blue tooth app. Percent of different lights, set brightness, moon light fade in and out. As I recall I searched for it at the time. It is a thing to wish for one day. I wish I had written down the name...


As @Fake_Buce777 said, Fluval makes the light you mentioned. Super easy to work, works like a charm, not cheap, but not too expensive, either, lots of control with options. HOWEVER, no matter how much blue or red you turn up on it, the overall look leans toward the yellow spectrum. It's not bad, and the plants like that spectrum, but side-by-side another tank, one can tell the difference. Just fyi... I'm glad to hear about Finnex. I'll definitely have to check that one out.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

BigMamaCleo said:


> As @Fake_Buce777 said, Fluval makes the light you mentioned. Super easy to work, works like a charm, not cheap, but not too expensive, either, lots of control with options. HOWEVER, no matter how much blue or red you turn up on it, the overall look leans toward the yellow spectrum. It's not bad, and the plants like that spectrum, but side-by-side another tank, one can tell the difference. Just fyi... I'm glad to hear about Finnex. I'll definitely have to check that one out.


I have three finnex lights in three different tanks and am quite happy with them.


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## BigMamaCleo (Jul 26, 2020)

Fake_Buce777 said:


> I have three finnex lights in three different tanks and am quite happy with them.


THANKS!


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

BigMamaCleo said:


> THANKS!


My pleasure


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I am STUNED! The algae that was everywhere in my tank is gone. My tank is starting to look pristine! Y'all kept insisting that I had algae problems because my tank was not balanced. To be honest I thought it was a load of bs, but out of respect (and desperation) I tried to employment all the recommendations. Now I read other things and made a few mistakes, but I am watching my tank showing signs it is beginning to flourish.
I want to specifically thank these two
@Fake_Buce777
@jellopuddinpop
I now hold your opinions in high regard!
I thank everyone who helped also, but these two took time to write volumes to help me on this thread.
I learned so much. I am indebted to you both...


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

Glad it all worked out.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

You're very welcome.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

Death_by_Dinosaurs said:


> Glad it all worked out.


Thank You. I much appreciate Your kind words. Looking forwards to photo updates 😉


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

Fake_Buce777 said:


> Thank You. I much appreciate Your kind words. Looking forwards to photo updates 😉


Uh, did you quote the wrong person?


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Death_by_Dinosaurs said:


> Uh, did you quote the wrong person?


LOL and thanks too @Death_by_Dinosaurs

Here is an update picture. I just got in from camping. All the way home, I was anxious to see my Planted Tank. Hoping it is still doing well.
Here is the picture. I am pleased.
And, relieved!









Oh, I pulled back a little on CO2 concentration. I am not pushing for optimal/extreme growth, but measured growth. It seems a little easier to maintain balance. We shall see, the high tech life of my tank is still young. Medium/measured growth I feel will require trimming less often. My goal is just to have healthy plants and an aquarium that is not over run with algae. I am looking for a balence between high and low tech, but on the high tech side predominantly.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Now that you have seen first hand how the different aspects affect each other, you can play with pulling the levers of ‘light’, ‘ferts’, and ‘co2’ (gently!) to achieve the balance you want ⭐


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## Jekk (Jan 11, 2022)

It’s looking beautiful! The learning curve to conrolling algae really is so satisfying. Well done to you.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

Awesome. Enjoy and fine-tune. The longer it goes the easier it gets.



Death_by_Dinosaurs said:


> Uh, did you quote the wrong person?


Haha. Who am I to say no to credit, when it knocks on my door?


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Thought I would post an update. I am about to start trimming plants, but I want to clean and set up a few small tanks to plant them in first. Low tech.
Below is an overall pic and one of the Christmas Moss covered rock. The moss finally rocovered
So far implementing what was recomended here is working .
It ain't broke, so not making any changes.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> Thought I would post an update. I am about to start trimming plants, but I want to clean and set up a few small tanks to plant them in first. Low tech.
> Below is an overall pic and one of the Christmas Moss covered rock. The moss finally rocovered
> So far implementing what was recomended here is working .
> It ain't broke, so not making any changes.
> ...


Looks nice!!


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

Wow! Went back. This was the same tank just 6 1/2 weeks ago!


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> Wow! Went back. This was the same tank just 6 1/2 weeks ago!
> View attachment 1042549


It has come a long way. You had good ppl help out on that. I find the aquarium community to be very giving.


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## Death_by_Dinosaurs (11 mo ago)

Amazing. Nice job! What started as mass confusion has turned into something awesome!


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

Death_by_Dinosaurs said:


> Amazing. Nice job! What started as mass confusion has turned into something awesome!


Well put


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

How are thing's looking? Keeping Algae at bay?


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

jellopuddinpop said:


> How are thing's looking? Keeping Algae at bay?


Well actually everything is good. I am behind on trimming my plants. I have so many plants I need to trim and I don't want to just trash them. I set up 4 small dirted tanks and they are cycling now. I plan to take different plants and concentrate different plants in different tanks. I will decide which ones, in which tank when I have them laid out.
Thanks for asking. 😎



jellopuddinpop said:


> o
> How are thing's looking? Keeping Algae at bay?


I just snapped a picture of the tank. It is really getting over grown.


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## LidijaPN (12 mo ago)

Love it! It’s grown out so beautifully! ⭐


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

johnnymax said:


> I just snapped a picture of the tank. It is really getting over grown.
> 
> View attachment 1043664


Awesome! That's really great to see =)


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## Eric Tran (Jul 7, 2016)

Always great to see a hobbiest learn and fix their tank balance problems instead of giving up on the whole tank. Goes to show no matter how bad it looks, you just have to take the steps to get the tank in balance. Well done sir. 👏


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> Well actually everything is good. I am behind on trimming my plants. I have so many plants I need to trim and I don't want to just trash them. I set up 4 small dirted tanks and they are cycling now. I plan to take different plants and concentrate different plants in different tanks. I will decide which ones, in which tank when I have them laid out.
> Thanks for asking. 😎
> 
> 
> ...


Does not look overgrown to me, ut this co es from a guy, who favors the jungle look. You do have to prune fairly regularly to avoid a mess. I think the right side in the back is the area You may want to watch out for, as this particular plant can take over within days. But I feel You already have figured that one out. Otherwise the tank looks very nice.


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## johnnymax (May 15, 2009)

I have not posted an update in 6 1/2 months. The aquarium has basically been on its own, other that feeding the fish. I have not injected CO2 or added fertilizer in 5 months. I only do water changes after 6 to 8 weeks when the water level has dropped 3”.

The plants are doing well. The main problem is the surface was covered with floating plants reducing the light. I have a light on 8 hours a day on a timer. The low light has caused the plants to get a little tall and thin. I removed most floating plants and a trimmed a bunch of plants this week and finally did a water change. The tank has an UGF and that is it. I did count the fish and noticed I lost one skirted tetra sometime over the last 6 months. I need to rescape the tank, or at least clip and plant. I noticed I had about 8 different pups here and there hanging onto plants. Most were Amazon Swords. I need to attach them somewhere I guess. I have just been watching the aquarium evolve over the summer. It is in the living room right under the TV, so I look at it all the time. I had such a problem getting the tank right in the beginning, but I think after it is really established it can fend for itself, so to speak. The lazily enjoy approach may not work for some, but it does for me.

The top picture I took this week, the second I took about 3 weeks ago before I cleaned the surface plants away. I was surprised to find I have a large colony of glass shrimp. Some are almost 2" long.


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## Fake_Buce777 (May 21, 2021)

johnnymax said:


> I have not posted an update in 6 1/2 months. The aquarium has basically been on its own, other that feeding the fish. I have not injected CO2 or added fertilizer in 5 months. I only do water changes after 6 to 8 weeks when the water level has dropped 3”.
> 
> The plants are doing well. The main problem is the surface was covered with floating plants reducing the light. I have a light on 8 hours a day on a timer. The low light has caused the plants to get a little tall and thin. I removed most floating plants and a trimmed a bunch of plants this week and finally did a water change. The tank has an UGF and that is it. I did count the fish and noticed I lost one skirted tetra sometime over the last 6 months. I need to rescape the tank, or at least clip and plant. I noticed I had about 8 different pups here and there hanging onto plants. Most were Amazon Swords. I need to attach them somewhere I guess. I have just been watching the aquarium evolve over the summer. It is in the living room right under the TV, so I look at it all the time. I had such a problem getting the tank right in the beginning, but I think after it is really established it can fend for itself, so to speak. The lazily enjoy approach may not work for some, but it does for me.
> 
> ...


Looks good! It has this more “established” look to it and everything looks pretty healthy in it. Glad to see it like that. I was getting curious about it, especially that there were challenges on the front end, but that is when most take place.


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