# Eco Complete now has a new formulation - contains sand, rinsing required!



## Tino (Jan 9, 2005)

Well, I guess too bad for them. There's more good stuff becoming readily available nowadays (ADA soils, Elos etc).


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## John S (Feb 27, 2004)

ya i got the old stuff and i really like it but if they did change it at what they charge for a bag then sounds like they wont be selling alot of the new stuff as soon as the word gets out that it anit the same anymore


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## duck (Apr 22, 2004)

I got a few bag's of the new Eco and i didn't rinse it,It took a whole 10-20 minutes to settle down, even when i move plants around it didn't cloud up much,Again this time it took only a couple of minute's to settle.
I'm for the new Eco, no boulder's,


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## Hypancistrus (Oct 28, 2004)

ADA Aquasoil really isn't a replacement for Eco because it has a dramatic impact on KH and GH, lowering it quite a bit. It makes it less than ideal if you have very soft water or RO water (like me, it messes with my reconstitution calculations and stability). Eco Complete did actually raise GH and sometimes KH for a while, but it always stabilized after some water changes. It was great... dump the bag in, fill your tank, water stays crystal clear. If you had digging fish, no matter how much they dug in it, it wouldn't cloud the water.

Duck, the bags of Eco Complete I have left over are from 2002, there are no "boulders" in them. The old stuff kicked up NO clouding, and took ZERO time to settle.

If I had known Carib-Sea would be doing this a couple of years ago (how could you guess a company would degrade their product), I would have bought a whole skid (like 100 or more bags) of it and opened an eBay store for "original formula Eco Complete" now. 

Seachem is talking about making a black substrate in the near future.. now would be a great opportunity for them.

This sucks.


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## yoink (Apr 21, 2005)

I recently got a bag of corrupt eco replaced and love the stuff they sent me instead. The old stuff had massive pieces in it. The new stuff does have some sand particles, but I think it looks better and is easier to plant in. I would love to see some black flourite though.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

ADA aqua soil kicks it's butt though...........
and it'll never scratch anything if your tank, it cost less to fill a tank with also and is already a nice even size, it needs no rising at all nor are we paying for shipping of water and bags waiting to leak all over the place.
Soil Master pro league charcoal needs rinsed, it not quite as dark, but for all practical purposes, at 5x less the cost of EC, I see little difference.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## krazykidd86 (Jul 27, 2005)

I just looked at some bags that they just sent me (two weeks ago). It looks good. Perfect size grains, not much sand compared to other bags I purchased which were sandy. The new bags still say no rinsing required, packed in amazon liquid, etc.

Interesting though roud:

the KK


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## esarkipato (Jul 19, 2005)

Good find, Hypancistrus. I've never personally owned ECO, but what with the bad batch and now this I'm pretty sure I never will. I remember the day when I held it up on a petestal at the LFS "ooooh my precious expensive substrate I will save for you" haha not any more! That's just bad business, not informing of a change in composition!


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

plantbrain said:


> ADA aqua soil kicks it's butt though...........
> and it'll never scratch anything if your tank, it cost less to fill a tank with also and is already a nice even size, it needs no rising at all nor are we paying for shipping of water and bags waiting to leak all over the place.
> Soil Master pro league charcoal needs rinsed, it not quite as dark, but for all practical purposes, at 5x less the cost of EC, I see little difference.
> 
> ...


Hypancistrus reports this stuff lowers the KH and GH. Is that accurate and what is the cost and size or weight of the ADA aqua soil? TIA bob


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## cbennett (Oct 20, 2005)

According to the SFBAAPS guys, the Aquasoil goes for ~$36 for the 9 liter bag at Aquaforest. One 9 liter bag = two flourite bags. I've the AS at Aquaforest in their tanks, and it's GORGEOUS!


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## krazykidd86 (Jul 27, 2005)

Definately lowers KH by about 2-3 degrees and pH by 0.7. I haven't tested for GH though.

Hope that helps! roud:

the KK


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## Hypancistrus (Oct 28, 2004)

Betowess said:


> Hypancistrus reports this stuff lowers the KH and GH. Is that accurate and what is the cost and size or weight of the ADA aqua soil? TIA bob


http://shop.aquariumdesigngroup.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=1_17&products_id=31




> *AQUA SOIL SERIES*
> A high pH level (alkaline) of the substrate causes difficulties for aquatic plants in consuming nutrients. The Aqua Soil Series decreases the hardness of the water and lowers the PH level to the degree at which most aquatic plants can consume nutrients and comfortably grow. Aqua Soil granules maintain their shape and density for long periods underwater securing good circulation of water and oxygen through the substrate. With Aqua Soil, growing difficult plants such as Tonina sp. becomes easier, and it is ideal for fishes demanding soft water.
> 
> *SPECIAL FEATURES :*
> ...


Amano himself also said in his demo for the 2002 AGA Convention (it's on the DVD) that the substrate would greatly lower GH and KH. It gives me the impression that it's really designed for use with moderately hard to hard tap water.

I would personally prefer an inert substrate, or at least one that becomes inert after a couple months at the most (like original Eco Complete).

I wonder what is in the ADA substrate to make it lower the GH and KH. Seeing how water stays crystal clear after filling with it, it leads me to believe it must have _some_ kind of treatment done to it. Which leads me to think it might have something deliberately added to it to lower GH, KH, and pH, such as the addition of humic and/or tannic acid to it.


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## FISA (Dec 3, 2004)

Hmm...thats interesting...

I would be interested in trying the new Eco Complete out as well....
I love the old Eco Complete...
too bad they didnt announce the change in composition...


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## Betowess (Dec 9, 2004)

I imagine it will flatten out to inert given some time. I think the KH/GH could easily be modified by we who are blessed with soft water by upping the amount of Mg, Cal. chloride, and baking soda that we add to our change water. $36 per bag is not too unreasonable, I suppose.


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## jake (Feb 20, 2004)

I asked them if they changed the formulation of Eco Complete and this was the reply:



> Eco-Complete is being made on the same screens as always. The raw material itself can have some variation in the percentage of what size material is retained on each screen. It effects the final product a little but not much. But Eco-Complete is the same as it has always been, it performs very well. We do appreciate your feedback.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


CaribSea, Inc.


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## sparrow (Feb 27, 2006)

*Not New*

I just today (3-10-2006) received a shipment (9 bags) of Eco-Complete directly from CaribSea. The product I received does not appear to be a "new formulation". It is all of approximately the same size (no 2 layer sizes). Additionally, the directions still say that it does not need to be rinsed, and that it should be added directly to the tank. From all the information I have been able to ascertain, the Eco-Complete that I received is the same product that CaribSea has been providing for some time.

I wonder if there may have been some sort of mixup, and that the person that received a "layered formula" might have gotten the wrong product. The response from CaribSea posted above, along with what I received directly from them, makes me think that may be the case.


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