# Dwarf puffer progress thread



## Robin Conor Sallade (Jan 26, 2017)

Ill preface this with I don't own a puffer but do know a bit about them thanks to my girlfriend. Pea Puffers, while capable of inflation as long as you are patient and take your time acclimating them and just try to minimize time out of water, also since it sounds like they are being shipped remember that breather bags aren't the best floaters so maybe get a cup or smaller bowl and dump them into that then drip acclimate (maybe add a lil Prime to it as well) then fishnet right into tank after acclimated. If netting makes you nervous I have heard of waterfalling (pouring out as much water as possible before dumping them right into the tanks, but the key here is to dilute the shipment water), but i am skeptical of possible infection vs stress level.


----------



## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

My puffer experience: bought 3 for a well planted 12g long. When they arrived I used a cup to scoop them from bag to tank. Reason: I'd read they may puff up if taken out of water and might not unpuff. I wasn't going to risk it so I always cup (use net to lead them into cup when moving from tank).

I had deaths but not from parasites (I'd recommend a good parasite med like paragaurd from seachem to treat when they arrive). Long story short my male puffer (other 2 where females) sucked at hunting.. even though there was a TON of live snails and black worms in the tank he was always the last to catch any. Even though the tank was big enough for 3 (3gs per a fish recommended) he saw the 2 girls as a threat to getting food and chased them to death/caused them to jump to their deaths (had lid they jumped through small gaps for filtration). He was still a juvie so it wasn't a breeding thing.

After that tried adding another female to the tank but he chased her to jump and turn into a dried up fishy on the desk.

pH 7.5, temp 74-76F

Added some otos in the tank which he ignored.. then some cherry shrimp thrown in as food but he would not eat so they exploded in population from 5-7 to 100-200-the shrimpltes would swim by his mouth and adults land no his head.. he didn't care 0.0 such a weirdo (note this is not common behavior: most puffers will eat shrimp- I've seen a youtube vid of a few taking apart an amano shrimp so even big ones aren't safe). When he finally passed away no new puffer was ever added to tank because it would demolish the shrimp population.

Puffer refused frozen foods only took live (buy from msjinkxd she says she gets them to accept frozen food before selling). I bought live black worms from here:
Live Black Worms - Welcome to Eastern Aquatics!
Note they do come with some harmless leeches-not the kind that harm fish/people (small translucent little things) you can get rid of with a little work -they'll stick to sides of container so when washing worms just move worms to new container and rinse out old one to get rid of leeches.. 
I live close by so its cheap for me. If you are on the west side of the states there are several black worm culture sites that will mail them. Get over night shipping, it cost more but they can die if you try priority mail. 1 culture can last you the life of the puffer if properly cared for (I'd get a 1/2 pound and had tons to feed all my other fish)
I just kept my worms in large steralite tubs in basement (cool) with sponge filter and brown paper bags as food. But if family/spouse/roommates don't mind them in the fridge that method works too. If you get blackworms don't neglect water changes-if they die off (from poor water quality/too many packed into too small a space-hence why i used large bins) the smell is *sooooo foul*! It makes the idea of changing bed pans at an old folks home a better prospect than having to clean out the dead worm container.
Use Seachem Prime to bind ammonia in worm culture water.


----------



## Harbinger (Apr 30, 2017)

I'm on my second try at pea puffers. I started with 5 a few months ago in a newer 20g planted with a false back. One never ate and wasted away, three died in the overflow  Even with a foam guard covering the overflow they'd get stuck in the suction. So don't have a filter with a strong suction and put a sponge guard on any intakes. Mine wouldn't eat any dead foods. Not frozen brine shrimp, mysis, bloodworms, or any flake or pellet food either. I kept mine fed with mosquito larvae and daphnia from the fishless pond out back. They loved going after those things. Now I have grindal worm cultures going which they eat, and am starting to culture daphnia. I took down the 20g and have a 20L in dry start, and have the one remaining puffer with three new puffers and 7 glowlight tetras in quarantine. Started PraziPro treatment and will do ParaGuard too before moving them to the 20L.

What size take do you have for them? What filter are you using? Snails might not be enough to feed them. Pea puffers don't have strong enough jaws, I tossed in a 1/8th inch pond snail and they couldn't get through the shell, they ate out what they could reach through the opening. Take a look at culturing daphnia, that might be the more nutritious and easiest live food to culture.

~~John


----------



## puser1 (Aug 13, 2017)

Robin Conor Sallade said:


> Ill preface this with I don't own a puffer but do know a bit about them thanks to my girlfriend. Pea Puffers, while capable of inflation as long as you are patient and take your time acclimating them and just try to minimize time out of water, also since it sounds like they are being shipped remember that breather bags aren't the best floaters so maybe get a cup or smaller bowl and dump them into that then drip acclimate (maybe add a lil Prime to it as well) then fishnet right into tank after acclimated. If netting makes you nervous I have heard of waterfalling (pouring out as much water as possible before dumping them right into the tanks, but the key here is to dilute the shipment water), but i am skeptical of possible infection vs stress level.


GF counts.  I just wanted to make sure it's sound advice irl and not something they read online. Thanks!

Bump:


AquaAurora said:


> My puffer experience: bought 3 for a well planted 12g long. When they arrived I used a cup to scoop them from bag to tank. Reason: I'd read they may puff up if taken out of water and might not unpuff. I wasn't going to risk it so I always cup (use net to lead them into cup when moving from tank).
> 
> I had deaths but not from parasites (I'd recommend a good parasite med like paragaurd from seachem to treat when they arrive). Long story short my male puffer (other 2 where females) sucked at hunting.. even though there was a TON of live snails and black worms in the tank he was always the last to catch any. Even though the tank was big enough for 3 (3gs per a fish recommended) he saw the 2 girls as a threat to getting food and chased them to death/caused them to jump to their deaths (had lid they jumped through small gaps for filtration). He was still a juvie so it wasn't a breeding thing.
> 
> ...


Thanks for replying.

I hope all three get along. It was sold as a set of 3. 
I've been thinking of lowering temp, I'll try to keep it at ~76*
Not a fan of otos which I feel like I'm in the minority on that, haha. What I really want are female bettas. Not that I'm going to try that any time soon if at all.

Any chance you've got some trial size blackworms you're willing to sell? :smile2: The problem is I don't want to buy 1lb in case they don't eat it and it's so pricey. I just want a little bit to try.



Harbinger said:


> I'm on my second try at pea puffers. I started with 5 a few months ago in a newer 20g planted with a false back. One never ate and wasted away, three died in the overflow  Even with a foam guard covering the overflow they'd get stuck in the suction. So don't have a filter with a strong suction and put a sponge guard on any intakes. Mine wouldn't eat any dead foods. Not frozen brine shrimp, mysis, bloodworms, or any flake or pellet food either. I kept mine fed with mosquito larvae and daphnia from the fishless pond out back. They loved going after those things. Now I have grindal worm cultures going which they eat, and am starting to culture daphnia. I took down the 20g and have a 20L in dry start, and have the one remaining puffer with three new puffers and 7 glowlight tetras in quarantine. Started PraziPro treatment and will do ParaGuard too before moving them to the 20L.
> 
> What size take do you have for them? What filter are you using? Snails might not be enough to feed them. Pea puffers don't have strong enough jaws, I tossed in a 1/8th inch pond snail and they couldn't get through the shell, they ate out what they could reach through the opening. Take a look at culturing daphnia, that might be the more nutritious and easiest live food to culture.
> 
> ~~John


Man, you've got some picky dp. I'm hoping mine would be chill. Was it lfs or online orders? Hope all goes well with yours.

I have a 55g and I'm using Tetra Whisper 40I. You don't think the intake and outflow is too strong for it is it? I know the filter is underrated for the tank but I'm also waiting on two duel sponge filter to put in it. 

The main one that I was originally was going to use was brand new but wasn't working and then I broke the outflow piece trying to fix it. It's a Marineland HOT 250 Magnum. I haven't tried calling to see if I can get a replacement because I bought it like 3 years ago but never used it.

I googled daphnia. That looks scary. I'm skirmish. Haha. I can barely handle snails. They're interesting to look at but I have to put disposable gloves on to grab them. :icon_mrgr


----------



## gtu2004 (Feb 17, 2010)

Harbinger said:


> I'm on my second try at pea puffers. I started with 5 a few months ago in a newer 20g planted with a false back. One never ate and wasted away, three died in the overflow  Even with a foam guard covering the overflow they'd get stuck in the suction. So don't have a filter with a strong suction and put a sponge guard on any intakes. Mine wouldn't eat any dead foods. Not frozen brine shrimp, mysis, bloodworms, or any flake or pellet food either. I kept mine fed with mosquito larvae and daphnia from the fishless pond out back. They loved going after those things. Now I have grindal worm cultures going which they eat, and am starting to culture daphnia. I took down the 20g and have a 20L in dry start, and have the one remaining puffer with three new puffers and 7 glowlight tetras in quarantine. Started PraziPro treatment and will do ParaGuard too before moving them to the 20L.
> 
> What size take do you have for them? What filter are you using? Snails might not be enough to feed them. * Pea puffers don't have strong enough jaws, I tossed in a 1/8th inch pond snail and they couldn't get through the shell, they ate out what they could reach through the opening*. Take a look at culturing daphnia, that might be the more nutritious and easiest live food to culture.
> 
> ~~John


Dwarf puffers do not crush or eat snail shells. They simply suck them out.


Dwarf puffers are one of my all time faves. Very tricky to feed as all of those I've had never ate foods that didn't move. They might eat grindal worms but that's only before they got a taste of live blackworms. All of mine ate blackworms, some ate snails more than others. Despite all that, they really are a great pet.


----------



## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

puser1 said:


> GF counts.  I just wanted to make sure it's sound advice irl and not something they read online. Thanks!
> 
> Bump:
> 
> ...


No sorry I got rid of my culture a year ago after the puffer passed. Since all my other fish accept dried/frozen foods.
Try making a WTB thread here:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/156-wtb-raok/
strong emphasis on using a cool pack and insulation foam-they like cold water (can live in your fridge).

I had a betta sorority that worked well, unfortunately like most it had to be taken down/girls separated due to deaths in the group-they fight over new ranking when this happens and it just got too ugly.
If you do one: *densely *planted/decorated tank (I've used live plants and silk plants) you should not be able to see the opposite glass wall (view from front-cannot see back glass, view from side-cannot see other side's glass) line of sight break up is important.
*QT* them at least a month. I kept mine in lidded cups (1 per) placed in a shallow filled 10g so I could put a heater in. Water change every day. Girls could see eachother but couldn't attach. Shuffled cups around so everyone saw everyone else. 
check out beffafish.com too


----------



## gtu2004 (Feb 17, 2010)

AquaAurora said:


> No sorry I got rid of my culture a year ago after the puffer passed. Since all my other fish accept dried/frozen foods.
> Try making a WTB thread here:
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/156-wtb-raok/
> *strong emphasis on using a cool pack and insulation foam-they like cold water (can live in your fridge).*
> ...


This would be advisable for shipping. I've had dwarf puffers in two stints, and kept blackworms in the fridge the first time. However now I keep them in a shallow plastic soup bowl (the kind they give you at chinese takeouts for a small soup) with an bubbler, some Flourite, Java moss, and whatever dead plant clippings from my tank at room temperature. I feed them flakes sometimes. This seems to be a decent enough set up. $1 of blackworms from an LFS can last me a few months as they seem to reproduce via fragmentation.


----------



## TheMakani (May 31, 2017)

puser1 said:


> Starting with what I do once they arrive! I read that they can't inhale air when puffed. True? So is it okay to net them or or would they puff up? Do I have to scoop them up with water when I transport them out of the bag?
> 
> I'm afraid of them dying since I've seen a lot of post of them dying within the week because they're prone to parasite but I've read other people saying the same thing when asked about dp so I don't how much of it is recycled material vs actual death. When you got yours, did any die? How many? Did you replace them and how many died from the second batch?
> 
> ...


my dwarf puffer has never puffed up, i transport him with a net. moved him between tanks a few times and the net seems to be fine, but different thing might stress different fish.
i dont have any info about parasites/ dying when you get them as i got my dwarf puffer from a friend not a store.
temp ranges from 70-80 degrees, no heater just a warm house in a tropical climate
ph is currently at 7.0 (busted out the API test kit just for you)
he's feeding on snails full time now that I've got a snail tank running, but i was originally feeding him live brine shrimp and frozen blood worms. since switching to snails, i don't know for sure how much/often he eats. i just take snails out of the snail tank whenever it gets crowded and add a bunch to my main tank, but have never seen the main tank run out of snails

dwarf puffers are a super cute and fun fish. back when i used to hand feed him blood worms he would follow my hand as i moved it outside the glass, but since I've switched to snails he doesnt seem as interested in me. I'm assuming its because i no longer equate to food for him. my puffer is super mellow, just cruises around and minds his own business. I've never seen him harass other fish or shrimp, but of course i can't watch them 24/7


----------



## Stacy1 (Dec 15, 2016)

I have three dp that I've had for a couple of years now. Started with four, but one died last year. No idea why. I have had them in two different tanks and completely redone the tank they are in now a few months ago changing everything from the substrate to the plants. I move them with a regular fish net and have never had one puff up. Mine eat mainly ramshorns and pond snails along with grindal worms. All of which I raise just to keel my puffers happy. They live in a 30gal low light moderately planted tank. Mine have been very low maintenance and a joy to watch. Anytime I walk into their room they immediately come to the front of the glass and watch me until I'm gone.


----------



## puser1 (Aug 13, 2017)

AquaAurora said:


> No sorry I got rid of my culture a year ago after the puffer passed. Since all my other fish accept dried/frozen foods.
> Try making a WTB thread here:
> http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/156-wtb-raok/
> strong emphasis on using a cool pack and insulation foam-they like cold water (can live in your fridge).
> ...


Yeah, it's going to be awhile for my tank to become heavily planted for me to consider any other fish with the dp. Thanks for your guide, I will definitely try if I get them in the future.

Bump:


TheMakani said:


> my dwarf puffer has never puffed up, i transport him with a net. moved him between tanks a few times and the net seems to be fine, but different thing might stress different fish.
> i dont have any info about parasites/ dying when you get them as i got my dwarf puffer from a friend not a store.
> temp ranges from 70-80 degrees, no heater just a warm house in a tropical climate
> ph is currently at 7.0 (busted out the API test kit just for you)
> ...


Ok, that's why I asked for advice from actual owners to see what they use and making sure what I read online is backed up. I just bought a big net for them today. I e-mailed when my dp would arrive because I was expecting them by now and they haven't even shipped it yet! They will tomorrow for Monday delivery.
Now I know they can go as low as 7.0, thanks for testing for me 0

Dp sounds so great, that's why I picked them through my search for what kind of fish to buy.


----------



## requiem (Oct 25, 2008)

I have 3 dwarf puffers in a fluval chi (6.6g) with otos. They are such interesting fish! The tank is on my computer desk. When i'm sitting there I really feel like they are staring at me! They look so cute and curious. BUT drop a snail in there, they examine it for a minute... then tear it to pieces! Cute, smart and vicious. An odd combo 

Mine accept frozen bloodworms just fine. Freeze dried bloodworms or frozen brine shrimp as second choice. But of course they love snails. They *are* very agressive feeders, one of mine is always bullied so I feed him separately with a pipette or long thongs. Just keep an eye out for inwardly curved bellies, which means they need food. They'll keep eating until their bellies are ridiculously swollen so keep an eye out during feeding.


----------



## puser1 (Aug 13, 2017)

This is day two of having four of my dwarf puffer(seller gave one extra) and I love them!

I thought they were dead out the box because none of them were moving at all at the bottom of the bag. I was taking pictures of them to get another batched sent or a refund when I saw one of them moved a tail ever so slightly. Then I thought, maybe they'll live! Their "cheek" were red and they weren't swimming but once in awhile I see an eye move or are slight body movement but no swiming so I rush to dump them in a bucket and added a bit of prime to neutralize the ammonia and nitrite buildup. Then I started a drip acclimation. They started moving around ever so slowly which I was relieved and happy that they're not motionless and lifeless anymore and once in awhile they'd do a quick swim to the side of the bucket like it's safe to move so I'm going to do it real quick, hit the side of the bucket and sit still! It was adorable seeing them bolting randomly and then stop. Maybe they were playing Simon Says with each other.

I keep seeing one or another at random times having their body vertically straight up with their big eyes looking at me and I thought oh no, they're dead, they didn't survive but then they wink or move their eyes so it looks like they're winking and then swim away and my heart melt! But I freak out every time they do it to me until they give me a sign that they're alive and then I melt again at the fact that they're noticing me and watching me. Fish that are aware of their surroundings and looking up right at me! What a great feeling! I felt like a proud parent that just adopted these little bugger. I drop some frozen blood worms and they all started attacking it. Again adorable watching them eat in a pounce way. Also I thought, that was easy as I was worried it'll be hard to get them to eat based on what I read.

I then transferred them with water into the 55 gallon because I didn't have time to net them. I was on my lunch break! It was only about 25 minutes of drip acclimating them and so the last 3 hour at work was brutal wondering if any would die. They're all great and no more red on their cheeks when I came home from work.

So I thought I got lucky with them about not being picky eater. Boy was I wrong. I guess they were starving from the two day in the dark through the mail or that they saw the snails in the tank and so they are not readily eating blood worms like when they were in the bucket during the drip acclimation. Some would come up to it while it's floating down, stare at it and swim away. Others would eat it and spit it out. I've been feeding them through a pipette and they are more reluctant to grab it from the pipette then when it's free floating in the water. Some would still spit it out or change their mind and swim away. But still, it's a pain getting them to eat every time yet a wonderful feeling when they do eat.

Long progress update post but I am just so pumped still to finally have these pea size puffer. Just watching their eye movement, body movement and everything about them is so interesting. Especially when they're in scavenging and hunting mode. I love watching their fluttering fins. It's like wings of a golden snitch. It's fluttering so fast that you don't notice unless you focus on it. It doesn't seem like they're swimming but a mixture of gliding/floating/flying.

My choice of fish to keep was spot on. Totally my type of fish.

edit: ps: probably a lot of run on sentence and sloppiness story telling but idc. Just wanted to pour it all out there


----------



## puser1 (Aug 13, 2017)

Do dwarf puffer know when to stop eating? I accidentally hatched too many brine shrimp and while taking the hatchery out, I forgot to plug the hole so a lot got dump into the tank.

Needless to say all four of my puffer belly if very fat and plump from eating them and yet they're still eating and I'm worried they're eating themselves to death.

Will they eventually stop when they're full?! I feel like they should have stopped an hour ago.


----------



## puser1 (Aug 13, 2017)

RIP one of the puffer. : ( It was suck to the side of the filter all puffed up. I've shut the filter down. I feel so sad for believing in them that they won't get themselves sucked in.

I've got two duel sponge filters coming in the mail soon. Do you think that's enough or should I buy another filter?


----------



## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

puser1 said:


> Do dwarf puffer know when to stop eating? I accidentally hatched too many brine shrimp and while taking the hatchery out, I forgot to plug the hole so a lot got dump into the tank.
> 
> Needless to say all four of my puffer belly if very fat and plump from eating them and yet they're still eating and I'm worried they're eating themselves to death.
> 
> Will they eventually stop when they're full?! I feel like they should have stopped an hour ago.


No they will eat until they die, they will constantly beg you for food once they learn you=food, even if they're so stuffed they could explode.



puser1 said:


> RIP one of the puffer. : ( It was suck to the side of the filter all puffed up. I've shut the filter down. I feel so sad for believing in them that they won't get themselves sucked in.
> 
> I've got two duel sponge filters coming in the mail soon. Do you think that's enough or should I buy another filter?


Sorry about your loss. I didn't have an issue with my puffer and filter but I have a much weaker fitler-eheim 2211 on a 12g long. You can use foam over the intake to protect the fish (also helps keep snails from getting into the filter).


----------



## requiem (Oct 25, 2008)

I second what aquaaurora said - mine could eat until they explose! Greedy little guys.


----------

