# Seachem Equilibrium or Micro Ferts



## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

Seachem Equilibrium is a good GH booster, mostly containing Ca, Mg, some K and Iron. That's about it. You still need to dose your micros.


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

As said before u will need both. Micro mixes include a few other neccessary elements. Also without c02 injection ur c02 level cannot be 13ppm. The highest water equilizes at is around 3ppm unless being fed by and underwater source such as an active volcano. Kh ph charts are only good as a reference and are not accurate at all. Too many variables affect kh, and ph.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

HD Blazingwolf said:


> Also without c02 injection ur c02 level cannot be 13ppm. The highest water equilizes at is around 3ppm unless being fed by and underwater source such as an active volcano. Kh ph charts are only good as a reference and are not accurate at all.


I apologize. What should I get that is accurate then?


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

90g dosing Excel as the sole carbon source??? The tank is too large to dose excel economically? I am not sure if there are ways to measure your carbon level if your carbon source is in the liquid form...


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## CrazyMidwesterner (Oct 19, 2006)

Not true. Use cidex and you can buy excel for cheaper then pressurized for at least 8 years or so.

Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

CrazyMidwesterner said:


> Not true. Use cidex and you can buy excel for cheaper then pressurized for at least 8 years or so.
> 
> Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk



But how do you measure your CO2 level at all then....


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

its very hard to accurately measure c02.. you can calibrate a specific amount of water to 4 dkh and injec a specific amount of c02 in over time and calculate the change.. that is almost as accurate as u can get before getting into digital equipment which i have and promise u is very expensive and practically not worth it.


drop checkers are about 3 hours behind and better than the ph/kh scale but rely on ur eye for measurement. i usually just note the change of my ph from c02 off to c02 on.. 1 ph drop is around 30 ppm. anything .2 over that almost doubles. i drop 1.8 on the ph scale. but i also produce enough oxygen to keep fishies alive.

excel is an excuse for carbon. plants can strip it from the glut but it does not increase ur overall ppm of c02


once again. measuring is almost pointless. the best measuring tool is how your plants and fish respond.. if u have low algae growth and good plant growth and fish are health.. stick with it. there will almost always be algae i a healthy system.. that is why trimming, of old leaves is beneficial as they are the ones that usually grow the algae.. its kinad like getting old. u get sick more often as u get old.

its also helpful to have a cleanup cew but they wont solve the problem. just help control it

i hope this helps


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## CrazyMidwesterner (Oct 19, 2006)

tetra73 said:


> But how do you measure your CO2 level at all then....


You don't measure the CO2 persay but the advantage is you know the exact amount of material you are putting in the tank. For example I dose 20 ML a day. I can easily adjust and add say 15 or 25 and monitor results. You don't have to worry about "well I am at 3 BPS but how much is getting disolved?"

While the cost argument doesn't work in my estimation in all honesty I am switching to pressurized CO2 in the next few weeks. Having to dose excel daily in the morning is getting to be a bit of a pain and excel does limit you a little bit on plant choices. Some plants respond well while others don't.

I plan on setting my dry ferts on auto doser's and once I tune in the CO2 I can hopefully refill the doses once a week during water change and enjoy.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

tetra73 said:


> 90g dosing Excel as the sole carbon source??? The tank is too large to dose excel economically?


Unfortunately it's all I can do right now. It's better than not putting anything in there at all. I mean a 500mL bottle will last up to 3 months. That's with doing a water change every other week and adding 40mL then and 5mL/day after that. For right now I can afford to pay $15 every 2.5-3 months and like I said, it's better than not putting anything in. Eventually I will be going pressurized but just don't have the funds.



HD Blazingwolf said:


> its very hard to accurately measure c02.. you can calibrate a specific amount of water to 4 dkh and injec a specific amount of c02 in over time and calculate the change.. that is almost as accurate as u can get before getting into digital equipment which i have and promise u is very expensive and practically not worth it.
> 
> 
> drop checkers are about 3 hours behind and better than the ph/kh scale but rely on ur eye for measurement. i usually just note the change of my ph from c02 off to c02 on.. 1 ph drop is around 30 ppm. anything .2 over that almost doubles. i drop 1.8 on the ph scale. but i also produce enough oxygen to keep fishies alive.
> ...


Thanks for the info BlazingWolf! It is much appreciated! The plants are definitley growing that's for sure! When I was experimenting without adding the Excel they grew extremely slow. I can now see a daily difference with my stem plants alone. Also, my Java Fern has began to show better growth as well! The algea that I had when I bought the tank was BBA, as I'm sure you may have seen my other post asking about the algae that I have. It is well under control after a week with adding 4 SAE's, 5 Whisker Shrimp, and spot treating with Excel.



Back to my main question, the difference between adding Seachem Equilibrium or Micro Ferts. According to the post by Tom Barr linked in my main post, he added Seachem Equilibrium isntead of Micro Ferts. I was just curious as to what would benefit me the most.


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

well.. many of the micro ferts can be obtained by seachem equilibrium but not all. and u probably wont or dont need to dose it every day.
equilibrium cannot add. boron. zinc, or copper


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

HD Blazingwolf said:


> well.. many of the micro ferts can be obtained by seachem equilibrium but not all. and u probably wont or dont need to dose it every day.
> equilibrium cannot add. boron. zinc, or copper


 
The recommended amount was actually 1 Teaspoon every week plus what I have at the top of the post of dosings. So I was looking to get that from one of my LFS's as they stock that regualarly as I can never find Micro ferts in my LFS and would hate to order some dry ferts for just the Micros as I am not in need of the Macros for quite some time.

Are you saying I wouldn't need to dose the Equilibrium daily or the Excel?


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Seachem Flourish is a micro source. You can use it alone, or in conjunction with Equilibrium to cover micros. And for a 90g, I would definitely suggest a gallon of Metricide or Cidex instead of Excel. It'll be a whole lot cheaper.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

kevmo911 said:


> Seachem Flourish is a micro source. You can use it alone, or in conjunction with Equilibrium to cover micros. And for a 90g, I would definitely suggest a gallon of Metricide or Cidex instead of Excel. It'll be a whole lot cheaper.


Flourish is the Micros? I for some reason thought they were Macros.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Here's the breakdown from Seachem website:

Total Nitrogen 
0.07%
Available Phosphate ( P2O5) 
0.01%
Soluble Potash 
0.37%
Calcium (Ca) 
0.14%
Magnesium (Mg) 
0.11%
Sulfur (S) 
0.2773%
Boron (B) 
0.009%
Chlorine (Cl) 
1.15%
Cobalt (Co) 
0.0004%
Copper (Cu) 
0.0001%
Iron (Fe) 
0.32%
Manganese (Mn) 
0.0118%
Molybdenum (Mo) 
0.0009%
Sodium (Na) 
0.13%
Zinc (Zn) 
0.0007%


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

well u can breakdown the 1 teaspoon dose of GH booster to a daily dose if u want. it does provide iron. and could save u frm needing to dose extra iron potentially that way??

excel should be a daily dose and after u go pressurized c02. u will need to continue dosing it for a few weeks until thingsadjust to the new carbon source.
flourish comprehensive is a trace mix that also provides a small quantity of macros. i use it in my shrimp dirt tank to dose water column occaisionally but it does work for ur means


also. something to consider is. once u dose micro's or trace elements given how ur tank is going now. u will probabaly see algae growth as they are the limiting nutrients right now..

the trace elements will not be the cause. u will notice a good change in plant growth and until everything comes to balance. algae will be present. be prepared to do frequent water changes and plant trimmings to control algae growth


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Thanks for the info everyone! I just got home from work and noticed that the one stem plant that I have been watching is really taking off. The new leaves started this week at about 1/2" and are now around 2-2.5" long. I noticed a huge difference in plant growth just from last night to today after cutting my lights back an extra hour. I will pick up some Equilibrium today and see if they got any Micro ferts in to get me by until I order my next order of dry ferts. Micros and Trace are the same type of ferts correct? I may also add a little bit of Seachem Comprehensive as I have that already to see how the plant growth goes.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

So here's another question, what are the fertilizers that you want to focus on the most out of everything for a healthy planted tank?


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

I just tested my water as well and here are my results after adding 1/2 teaspoon KN03 and 1/8 teaspoon KH2P04 on Sunday along with daily dosing of 5mL of Excel:

pH: 7.4
Nitrate: <5ppm
Ammonia: <.25ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
GH: 16 drops = off my chart
KH: 6 drops = 107.4ppm

To me this seems a little off of what it should be correct?


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

well it looks like ur plants are consuming the nitrates. i'd shoot for 7-10 ppm personally

there should be no ammonia.. bacteria is probably affected by excel or not enough o2.. find some way to increase aeration at night. either by surface agitation or airstone. gh and kh are fine if u have hard tap water
i'd reccommend doing weekly water channges though personally. its good for the tank


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

The ammonia that shows up is due to extra chloramine that has been added to the tap water from the good ol' water company. From what I've read online that when this is increased that it will show up as ammonia and the best way to monitor the high ammonia is to watch the nitrates and nitrites. If they are low then it's fine.

As far as my GH and KH, will the Seachem Equilibrium help or will it make it worse? As in, should I even buy it? I was hoping to get away with doing water changes every other week as I'm about to have surgery on my arm and will be out of commission for 3 2-3 months. That's why I was looking into doing the fertilizing as mentioned in the post by Tom Barr. Still think I'd be able to get away with every other week or will this directly affect the fish/plants?


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

what happens is a build up of organics. u can go longer. but reducing photoperiod and fertilizers will help as they decrease the plants usage of these organics. also as part of the cycle of ur tank. kh gets used up over time. once its gone. tank has a huge ph crash. every two weeks will be fine though. if u find kh is going down. u can always add baking soda. aka sodium bicarbonate. it will increase KH and help buffer the tank. it is temporary. it wont stay there forever.

even with high GH equilibirum is probably still beneficial. untill u know what makes ur water so hard. u don't know what ur adding. it could be all calcium. it could be all potassium though not likely in either case. equilibrium increase calcium, magnesium, manganese, potassium and iron( though iron is very temporary)


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

I'm still new to all of this and learning everything. Just so I'm understanding this correctly. The build up of organics is due to excess nutrients from fertilizers? Which is a good thing right? As you want to have a buildup of fertilizer in the water column to ensure the plants have enough, and sometimes more than enough, in order to grow properly correct?

When you say that baking soda will increase my KH, is that meaning that the number of drops it requires in the tester for it to change colors or it will take more? What is the preferred ppm for KH?

What worries me is the GH is off the chart that I have. Again, is that a good thing or bad? I'm new to the whole testing of GH and KH and am still trying to learn what is considered "normal".

What can I do to determine what is the exact cause of my hard water?


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

well organics include more things than just fertilizers. they are more considered "salts"
organics are things that form from breakdown of fish poop, decaying leaves, decaying food. etc

plants will use some of this to an extent. that's why water changes are key to a healthy tank

baking soda added to ur tank water will increase its KH

some say the ideal target is 3-6 dGH and dKH u can grow most plants in just about any condition though.. don't stress over it right now.. its not that important unless u want to get into special fish or shrimp. and rare exotic plants.... most of all things iwll grow fine in what u have

u can have ur water analyzed.. or check ur local tap water repor. it may break down everything that's in it for u


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Sweet! Thanks again!


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Does anyone actually use Seachem Equilibrium?


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

ME  in my ten gallon.. but for my 29g i use GH booser from GLA basically same product. seachems hardens into rocks a lot. while gh booster from gla does not and the GH booster was cheaper


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

JEden8 said:


> Does anyone actually use Seachem Equilibrium?



I do.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

So do you two run Equilibrium in conjunction with Plantex CSM+B frets or just the Equilibrium?


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

both.. when i do my 50% wc on my ten i drop 1/8 tsp in and then two days later i drop one dose of csm+b in which lasts more than all week in my low tech 10

lemme get csm's breakdown of nutrients 

CSM+B Plantex 1 lb, a micro nutrient mix, 
See mixing and dosing instructions in the FAQ's.



Guaranteed Analysis:

Total magnesium - water soluble chelated magnesium 1.5%

Copper - chelated 0.1%

Iron - chelated 7.0%

Manganese - chelated 2.0%

Molybdenum 0.06%

Zinc - chelated 0.40%

Boron 0.8%

EDTA - minimum content 55%

there ya have it.. compare to equilibrium which is a hardness booster. which supplies many of those nutrients. some of which will all be used depending on the growth rates of ur plants. iron precipates out of water anyways. which is why most people dose more than once a week with it


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Nice. So since I need to re-stock on all of my dry frets from GLA anyway, would you recommend getting their GH booster or Equilibrium?


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

I prefer their gh booster over seachems.. they breakdown much the same but the gh booster is cheaper and is much easier to dose. it doesn't cake up in the bag and turn ino big chunks of hard rock


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Sweet. That answers that! GLA here I come! Glad I haven't ordered yet. Is there anything else I would need/want?

I currently have their KN03, KH2P04, & (K2S04 (don't dose this anymore))

Looking to get:
Plantex CSM+B
GH Booster
Their fertilizer dispensers (are they any good?)


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

i dispense with dry teaspoons... pickup a good set from amazon for a few bux


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

That's how I'm currently doing it. I wanted to mix my own solutions and use some pump bottles like pfertz does.


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

JEden8 said:


> So do you two run Equilibrium in conjunction with Plantex CSM+B frets or just the Equilibrium?



Use both but only dose Plantex csm+b daily. Equilibrium for the WC only. That's roughly 2x a week since I do 2 50% WC a week. My tank is way overstocked with fish and plants. Doing 2 50% WC a week is the only way to combat BBA.


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

tetra73 said:


> Use both but only dose Plantex csm+b daily. Equilibrium for the WC only. That's roughly 2x a week since I do 2 50% WC a week. My tank is way overstocked with fish and plants. Doing 2 50% WC a week is the only way to combat BBA.


 
OR can u turn down ur lights just a tad?? that would make a huge difference


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

HD Blazingwolf said:


> OR can u turn down ur lights just a tad?? that would make a huge difference



Not good.  My plants are so dense that I could barely have enough light reaching to the lower leaves. 

Here is shot of my tank couple of weeks ago.









Actually, I am not getting enough light to the front and I even need to add a homedepot spot light near the front. I have trimmed the front left a bit last week. That only opens up the middle part.


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## HD Blazingwolf (May 12, 2011)

hmm.. the best way to even the light spread is to raise lights. i find it works great to getting light to the botom. u lose total light but gain even spread.. even through dense foliage


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## tetra73 (Aug 2, 2011)

HD Blazingwolf said:


> hmm.. the best way to even the light spread is to raise lights. i find it works great to getting light to the botom. u lose total light but gain even spread.. even through dense foliage



Hmm..I see if can raise another inch. Right now, I think the surface light is still too strong and my hygro seems to be growing too fast at the top...


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