# 75 Gallon tank - adventures in budget aquascaping **8/31/14**



## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Nice plan. I look forward to watching it come together. Dont be shy with the updates once you get started!


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Thanks  Things are moving slowly. 

I have all the rocks I want and I have some time tomorrow to put them together. I am having a little trouble finding a good piece of wood though. I was a little surprised when I moved to Rhode Island that there is a distinct lack of driftwood here. As a result, I have been scouring the woods to find some stumps that I can use. Atleast my dogs are happy with all the walks through the woods. 

I am still a little trigger shy on the LED's...The beamworks evo looks like a decent fixture, I think I just need a few beers to get me clicking!

I have my DIY 20 gallon sump in the works. I have been apoxying some plexiglass to make different chambers. I think I may go a little crazy with my sump design. I have been toying with the idea of an algae scrubber. I have used them in salt water set-ups and I am curious if they would work in freshwater. 

I have been working on a big plant order from aquabid...tons of plants, lots of stems, crypts, foreground and midground plants. I need to wait on the light before I order though. 

So that is that, I will post some rockwork pics as soon as it is done. Hopefully I will have some wood this weekend!


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Here is my design for the 20 gallon sump.










I had an old eheim canister filter that didn't work anymore, so I am going to use those media chambers (4 of them) filled with filter media (ceramic beads, balls etc). The water will drain right into the top of the chamber and pass through the bottom where it will go through the baffles stuffed with foam. I am going to use pot scrubbers as well. 

I am building an enclosure out of eggcrate for the middle region, and I will wrap it in cotton batting to use as a sort of refugium. 

The water will then pass through more scrubbies and through a bio wheel. Finally the water will pass through a large amount of batting as the final polish before it is pumped back to the tank. 

I will also attach my cerges reactor to the outlet.

It should be fun to put together! I will post pictures when it is done.


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## Ltraine (Apr 30, 2014)

This sounds awesome! keep posting, i've been looking into starting my first 75 gal apisto tank myself and i'm looking for some inspiration from those who are more experienced in this stuff. cant wait to see how this turns out.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Thanks, will do. I am excited for this build! 

I finished the sump yesterday, I just need to get the filter media. I think I will take a trip to the dollar store for pot scrubbers and sponges. I really want to get the plumbing done so I can get some water flowing in this bad boy. 

I went for a long hike yesterday, looking for the perfect piece of wood, but I came back empty handed. It looks like I may need to frankenstump something together.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Made some good progress today, woohoo! 

Sump is done

Pic without filter media:

















dollar store media :bounce:









Pic with filter media:









Added sponges and ceramic beads to the old canister cartridges









I think I am going to load the refugium area with moss. 

Plumbing is done









Straight shot into the sump from the overflow.
I split the return line so that I would have to outputs into the tank. 
Right now they are just feeding back into the sump, until I get my hardscape sorted out. I got the wrong size connectors for the cerges reactor so that will have to wait. 

Substrate is done

Tossed in some mineralized dirt and covered it with sand. 










Still need to set-up the hardscape, toying with a few ideas for the rock pile but I haven't loved anything yet. I Need some wood!

Light is ordered

I got the quad LED fixture from aquastyles. I plan on having it about 30" above the substrate, so we will see how it goes! Once that gets here I can order some plants. 

I am getting excited!


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## Ltraine (Apr 30, 2014)

are you going to set up multiple territories for the cichlids? everyone keeps telling me that i have to make sure to do that but i'm honestly not sure how/what they mean exactly.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Yes I hope to. Basically it means they should have their own little areas/caves with limited line of site between them. Whether it is hardscape or plants that separate them doesn't really matter.

I hope that the big rock pile will be able to have a couple pairs while the wood and smaller pile will make for a few more pairs.


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## Ltraine (Apr 30, 2014)

awesome thanks for the clarification. i was thinking it had to be a larger area for each territory. love the refugium tank btw, wish i had the resources to build one myself


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Looking great man! Very interesting read too..


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Unfortunately I had to tweak my vision for the tank considerably. I just couldn't find the wood I wanted, and I refuse to pay for driftwood! I still had a ton of cool rock from my last tank, so I thought I would just try to do a cool rockscape.

My inspiration for the rockscape were the Flatirons in Colorado:









And the needles mountains in South Dakota:









This is what I ended up with, it is probably 95% done. 









Any suggestions, critiques would be appreciated! I think the large rocks are staying put but I may add a few more spires on the right and tweak some of the smaller rocks here and there. There certainly are a ton of caves! 

I plan on leaving the tops of the spires unplanted, but I want to put anubias around the base along with fissidens. I left a lot of room in the back and sides for stems which will allow for some strategic accents. I will do blyxa and staurogen repens in the foreground. 

My light is arriving friday, at which point I will put in a plant order somewhere!


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## lksdrinker (Feb 12, 2014)

I'm digging it! Looks like this will be a great setup.

The sump design looks pretty simple but has lots of potential. Seems like you're not using that first chamber to its max potential though. If I'm looking at that correct it seems like you have the water entering into the media chambers out of your canister filter without any sort of mechanical filtration in front of that? You'll probably want to have some sort of sponge or batting in place before the media chambers. I'm also not seeing the purpose of the batting around the refugium area? And I'm not sure if that biowheel is really going to do anything beneficial for you. 

The hardscape really does capture the look of your inspiration; but I have to admit I would rather see what you first described with the driftwood and various caves.

Cant wait to see the finished product!


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

lksdrinker said:


> I'm digging it! Looks like this will be a great setup.


Thanks! Looking forward to getting it planted!



lksdrinker said:


> The sump design looks pretty simple but has lots of potential. Seems like you're not using that first chamber to its max potential though. If I'm looking at that correct it seems like you have the water entering into the media chambers out of your canister filter without any sort of mechanical filtration in front of that? You'll probably want to have some sort of sponge or batting in place before the media chambers.


I didn't show it, but the top two chambers have sponge filters in them for the mechanical filtration. Followed by the two chambers with ceramic rings. I also have a large amount of batting between the biowheel and the return pump which should be my final polish. I think I may add some more batting though because it is having trouble getting out the dust from the sand. 



lksdrinker said:


> I'm also not seeing the purpose of the batting around the refugium area? And I'm not sure if that biowheel is really going to do anything beneficial for you.


I was toying with the idea of keeping shrimp in the refugium full time, so the batting in that area was going to be to keep them contained. I have since changed my mind on that though and I may change that area. The biowheel was really just for fun, I don't expect it to have any real filtration purposes. What it has done though is allowed me to visualize the flow rate, which is kinda cool. 



lksdrinker said:


> The hardscape really does capture the look of your inspiration; but I have to admit I would rather see what you first described with the driftwood and various caves.
> 
> Cant wait to see the finished product!


Thanks, yeah, I am a little bummed that I couldn't find the wood that I wanted. Perhaps I should have been more patient but I just REALLY wanted to get this tank up and running. This is the first time I haven't had a 'natural' tank. Seeing as this is more of a landscape type design, I have also been thinking about scraping the black paint off the back of the tank and going lighter.


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## HybridHerp (May 24, 2012)

Regardless, this tank is going to look AWESOME.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

^ thanks! Hopefully it comes together!

So I finalized the hardscape, removed the black painted background and built a backlit background set-up. I was getting tired of the dark backgrounds and wanted a nice light background that was variable. So I got some frosted window film and blue cellophane to create a backlit background. 

Here are some before and after pics.

Black painted background









Black background removed









I set-up a T8 fixture to light the bottom









No background with the backlight









Added the frosted window film and blue cellophane over the light









I am really happy with the changes, I like that the center brace shadow isn't as prevalent in the pics and I like how the ripples show up on the background. I can't wait to get some green and reds in there from the plants! My light should be arriving tomorrow, so I am pretty excited!

The backlight is just a single t8 flora bulb (pinkish hue), so I think I may either replace the bulb with a bluer one or try to get a brighter fixture in there. I will play around with it tomorrow.


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

That looks really cool with the backlighting. The hard scape looks really nice also. 

What kind of Apistos do you plan to add? If you haven't decided yet you should look into Apisto panduro or Apisto nijsseni, both are very cool looking apistos but not the easiest to find. I will be watching this thread and look forward to see what you do with the planting.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Thanks! 

I have had an agassizii double red trio before and I really enjoyed them, so much so that I was thinking of doing them again. The Borelli Blue look really cool though as well so I was thinking about them. 

The Panduro are quite nice, kind of like a chubby agassizii, it looks like there are some available on aquabid. There are not many optiions around here for apistos, so I will probably have to order off of aquabids.


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## thor79 (Apr 15, 2014)

In regards to the back lighting...you might try some LED lighting fixtures (I'm talking something like this: https://www.adafruit.com/search?q=led+strip not the kind you put over your tank), they will take up considerably less room behind the tank. You can rig up some small reflectors to reflect it back towards the tank. That T8 hangs a lot back there.

Looking good though. Love that you're using the Needles as inspiration.


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

Very cool layout, really like the last photo! Are you still planing to add any plants?


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Got my LED's today woohoo! They look great, there are two banks which operate independently and for each bank you can have half on or all on. So there is some decent variability there. I am quite pleased! They are very bright which diminishes the effect of the backlight though.



thor79 said:


> In regards to the back lighting...you might try some LED lighting fixtures (I'm talking something like this: https://www.adafruit.com/search?q=led+strip not the kind you put over your tank), they will take up considerably less room behind the tank. You can rig up some small reflectors to reflect it back towards the tank. That T8 hangs a lot back there.
> Looking good though. Love that you're using the Needles as inspiration.


I think I will eventually switch to something like that, especially since the LED's on top of the tank are washing out the T8. I don't really have any space constraints since this tank is essentially in the middle of my basement so I am not too worried about space issues. But I like the idea of being able to switch the colors. Going from a blue to an orange/red would be pretty sweet. 

I also ordered a stronger pump (700 gph) from aquatraders that arrived with the light. 35$ and this thing is a beast! It really improved the flow through the sump and in my tank.

I got my CO2 set-up, the solenoid on my milwaukee regulator crapped out on me though. It failed in the closed position, so I just jammed it in to allow CO2 to pass through. I will just run it as is for now. I don't plan on getting fish for awhile so I am not too worried about it.

So, it looks like I am ready for some plants!!



AquaAurora said:


> Very cool layout, really like the last photo! Are you still planing to add any plants?


Thanks! I am definitely going to plant heavily. 

I am thinking I want to do dwarf hairgrass transitioning to blyxa on the left, I want s. repens in the front and possibly some downoi. And then maybe 3-4 different stem plants for the back and the right. Not sure what yet, but I want some nice color variation back there. 

I was just at petsmart today, checking out their plant selection and they had the dwarf hairgrass, the downoi and S. Repens. I may try a few of the packages out and see how they look. I am itching to get some plants in this tank now that it is all set-up. 

Stay tuned!


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

Lucky you my Petsmart has crap for plant selection (as well as Petco) so have to get my plants online.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Looking good! I like those rocks.


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## mistuhmarc (Oct 1, 2013)

Have to say, I'm really liking that rock formation and background. Works very well together.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

^^ Thanks!



AquaAurora said:


> Lucky you my Petsmart has crap for plant selection (as well as Petco) so have to get my plants online.


It really is hit or miss with the chain stores, some have great aquatic sections while others you wouldn't want to go near with a 10 foot pole. The ones near me are somewhere in between. I am just curious about the gel packet plants, think I may get some today. 

I am also going to get a big plant order from aquabid.

So, here is my beautiful powerpoint schematic for the plant lay-out. Atleast this is what I have in mind, whether or not it can be executed remains to be seen!










I want the left to be kind of like increasing taller grass, and the stems in the back to follow the slope of the flat-iron rocks. I want some color in the stems to kind of mimic a sunset. And I would like to have the big spire as a main focal point. 

Any comments/critiques would be welcome about the plant choices and the layout. I am not very knowledgeable about plants so I am not sure if the stems I chose will achieve what I want.


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## Grah the great (Jul 3, 2013)

Out of curiosity, but how are you going to solve the apisto's preference for soft, acidic water? Are you just going to stick to species that do well in alkaline water?


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

I hadn't really thought much about it much since this is a little farther down the road. But my water is pretty soft to begin with and I am using quartz sand and dosing CO2 which should keep the pH on the lower side. The rocks are silicates so they won't leach much into the water and I will probably also use RODI water for water changes. I can also put wood in the refugium to drop the pH if it gets too high. In addition, the Borelli, Agassizi and Cacatouides are pretty forgiving so I am not too concerned.

I won't be getting fish for awhile though so I will be able to check the parameters to make sure the set-up works for the fish I want to get. I will monitor the pH and TDS as I go.


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## Grah the great (Jul 3, 2013)

Oh, good...from my research, apistos are often found in areas with deep layers of dead leaves, so adding some leaves would both be natural and help with the water parameters.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

woohoo, just got my first plants in the tank (rotala rotundifolia) and they were pearling great after a couple hours. Very happy to see the lights and CO2 doing their thing. I am very excited to get this bad boy planted.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Starting to get more plants:

Picked up these guys from Petsmart, I was curious and wanted to give them a try. They look pretty decent, small, but in good shape. Hopefully they will transition well to my tank.










I also got a ton of Blyxa, thanks mosART!

So I have some of the foreground (E. Parvula, Downoi, alt reineki cardinalis) still want some S. Repens but I think it will be done after that. The blyxa is the midground. And I still need a big stem order to fill out the back. 

I have been playing with the back lighting a bit, trying to get a something I like. I moved the T8 fixture to the top and put some LEDS on the bottom. I also have a small bulb to simulate a setting sun. The top lighting is a little too bright, I find it distracting at the moment so I will have to raise it a little higher so that the actual bulb is hidden above the tank. Other than that I am pretty happy with it. I have been thinking of getting another light for the lower left hand side to simulate sun rise. I would have the two yellow lights on timers to bookend my light cycle. Kinda pointless, but fun  










I am finding it really difficult to photograph the tank, the lighting is really weird with the variable background so the pictures aren't really doing it justice I find.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

D'OH...just checked the tank and the CO2 tank is totally drained. Methinks I have a leak in my set-up!

I have a cheapo milwaukee regulator, after checking it I think the bubble counter was the culprit. I have used my budget for the month so I am going to have to wait to get a new one. I will have to jury rig something until then. 

I managed to take the regulator, solenoid, needle valve and bubble counter apart. I am going to clean all the seals and just attach the needle valve directly to the regulator. I will make a make shift bubble counter as well. Hopefully that will work until I can get a replacement.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

I just took a bunch of pics of the tank and thought I would share. Some good results and some not so good.

Overall, the plants I got from Petsmart are growing fairly well and appear to have transitioned from emmersed to immersed growth. They are showing good compact growth, so I am happy. I am getting brown filamentous algae and cyanobacteria but I am not terribly concerned, I think it is just new tank syndrome, getting used to the silica sand etc...

Here are a couple comparison pics:

5/17/14









5/23/14









You can see the hairgrass is thickening up, as is the downoi and A.Reineckii. The rotala is showing some nice compact growth as well. 

Here are some pics of the hairgrass:

5/17/14









5/23/14









































There is quite a bit of new growth (the brighter green stalks) and overall it looks like the plugs I planted are spreading out. So I am happy about that. You can see some of the brown algae in some spots. 


The Downoi is really growing well and filling in nicely. Here are some comparison pics:

5/17/14









5/23/14

































The heads are getting bigger and there are alot of new shoots coming out, so that is good. Some brown algae on these as well. 

Here are some pics of the A. Reineckii:

5/17/14









5/23/14

























And finally, the R. Rotundifolia are the only stems I have at the moment. The old growth is looking pretty ratty but the new growth is nice and compact, with short internodal distance. This makes me happy and I look forward to getting the rest of the stems ordered. 


















I am still getting my CO2 dialed in and the appropriate timing for the lights, but I am happy to see that the lights are giving decent growth so far. I have a bit of green spot algae on the rocks, but nothing on the plants. Hopefully I will get the tank balanced soon though...I may get some otos to help with the brown algae.

Thanks for looking!


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Great update. Man that hardscape really came together, looks fantastic! I think you'd enjoy some Ottos. Mine are great plant cleaners.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

thanks, I am really looking forward to getting the plants growing in to complete the scape!

These are the stems that I am going to order I think:

Rotala wallichii
Nesea pedicellata ‘golden’
Rotala Nanjenshan
Ludwigia repens
Hemianthus micranthemoides
Alternanthera reineckii
Potamogeton gayi

I have been holding off on adding fish because wanted to dose CO2 really heavily to get the plants going strong right off the bat.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Finally ordered the rest of my stems, they should be here in a couple days. 

I took a few pics of the tank this morning. I am still getting really good growth from all the plants.



















I should be able to start propagating the downoi soon. I am going to have a ton of this plant, what a great deal from petsmart. 










The AR is growing really well as well. It is getting bushier with each day so it seems to like the conditions. 










The R. Rotundifolia is showing still showing nice compact growth, it is growing side-ways in the tank as opposed to up which suggests to me that it is very happy with the amount of light it is receiving. Still waiting for it to turn reddish though. 











Overall, the tank is starting to balance out. The cyanobacteria has passed so I am happy about that. I seem to be getting some green thread algae though. It is only appearing on the glass and rocks, not on the plants at all. This suggests that the plants are really healthy but that I have too much nutrients (does this make sense?).

Once my stems get here, I am going to hack away at the R. Rotundifolia to get a more compact healthier bunch. I may also remove one of the flat-iron rocks on the right side to open up the scape a bit more. While I like the scape, I am finding it to be a little too cramped.


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## Tyrone (Nov 22, 2013)

Magnifico!

Just throw in an algae control patrol, consisting of Amanos, SAE's, Oto's and Nerites once the tank is fully cycled and they'll keep it in check!

I was thinking about some Cory's, but not sure about that, they might uproot some plants.


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## jhays79 (Mar 28, 2012)

what kind of pump are you using for the sump?


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Yeah a nice clean up crew will be ordered once the tank is ready for them, in the mean time, I am going to try to get it balanced!

jhays79, I am using the Odyssea WP700 pump  and I am quite happy with it for the price. I was using a RIO 400 GPH pump, but the turnover rate was not quite what I wanted, so I went for the cheapskate route!


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## maddmaxx (Aug 11, 2013)

tharsis said:


> Yeah a nice clean up crew will be ordered once the tank is ready for them, in the mean time, I am going to try to get it balanced!
> 
> jhays79, I am using the Odyssea WP700 pump  and I am quite happy with it for the price. I was using a RIO 400 GPH pump, but the turnover rate was not quite what I wanted, so I went for the cheapskate route!


Do you have any more pics of the sump setup?


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

soooo...I was trying to get the right hand side of the mountain tweeked a bit while having a couple beers last night. One thing led to another and the entire right hand side got rescaped.

I was unhappy with the density of rock so now it is much more open and waiting to accept a bunch of stems. 

Here are some pics!



















I like the open space more on the right hand side and I kinda like the path even though it is a bit of cliche with aquascapes. I split and spread out the downoi and AR, I am very impressed with the rate of growth so far. I can't decide if I like it with the sunset light or not. 

I hacked up the R. Rotundifolia and sandwhiched it between the downoi, the AR and the rock wall. I hope to get it REALLY bushy and use it as a mid ground plant....we will see how it goes/grows. 




















I am realizing that I have WAY too much downoi so I planted some nice crowns on the open space to the right and letting them grow out for now. I will probably sell them to buy something else for there. I am not sure what I want to put there yet though. Maybe some more grass...or another foregorund plant...not sure yet. It will probably turn into a field of S. Repens since I can start the front out short and increase the height to grade into the stems in the back. 










The left hand side is pretty much unchanged.










I plan on strategically planting stems to fill in the gaps in the rock spires. I am also going to attach HM and anubias in the cracks between the spires to fill them in.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Got some S. Repens from petsmart and some A. Reinecki (thanks BetaBerry!). I planted the S. Repens on the right along with the AR. Not too happy with the AR where it is; there is just too much pink over there, so I will probably move it once it adjusts to my tank. It is interesting though to compare the colors of the two AR varieties. I definitely have to much Downoi so I will be harvesting the crop soon. 





































I am happy to see the rotundifolia coloring up so close to the substrate, that tells me I have more than enough light. The DHG is spreading really fast and it is staying low to the substrate as well which is nice so that also suggests high light at the substrate. 

My big order of stems will be shipped on Tuesday so I will leave things as is until they arrive and then I will rearrange and have a more permanent layout.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Coming along nicely. Bet the stems really set it off. The pink on the right side may not look too much once you get those in.


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## CluelessAquarist (Apr 5, 2014)

This tank really looks great already. I think you did a good job making a hardscape that isn't tired out from being done so many times. Can't wait to see more


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

thanks, yeah I am really looking forward to getting my stems in. 

My CO2 tank ran out again yesterday (took about 2 weeks!), I think my make shift set-up has a big leak. I have been running the CO2 really high because I have no fish in the tank, but that seems way too fast. So, I ordered a milwaukee regulator, should get here in a couple days. The low budget solution. I am going to set-up my drop checker,really dial in the CO2 and add saran wrap to the sump to minimize degassing.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

I got my plants yesterday, after sitting in my tank overnight, I did a bit of a rescape this morning. It is still a little cloudy from yanking out all the Blyxa, but here is the tank as of this morning:










Left side:









Middle:









Right Side:









And a few close ups:

Downoi jungle and Rotala bushes









Replanted Downoi









S. Repens









A. Reineckii 'mini'









Nesea pedicellata ‘golden’ 









I am getting some moss early next week. I plan on adding the moss, some anubias and the HM in the crevasses of the rocks.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Still lovin that hardscape. I think the space between the rocks creates a great effect. Looking forward to watching it fill in.


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## MamaJu (Jun 4, 2013)

Looks awesome. I love the rocks and looking forward to your tank growing in. Keep posting pics


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## 180g (May 20, 2014)

even better now! I think I like the algae on the rocks tho. that's just a personal preference tho.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

burr740 said:


> Still lovin that hardscape. I think the space between the rocks creates a great effect. Looking forward to watching it fill in.


Thanks, yeah I want to be able to keep the gap free of plants, I am still thinking about the Blyxa there. I may try to coerce the DHG to fill in the substrate in the gap as well. 



MamaJu said:


> Looks awesome. I love the rocks and looking forward to your tank growing in. Keep posting pics


Thanks! Will do.



180g said:


> even better now! I think I like the algae on the rocks tho. that's just a personal preference tho.


I kind of like the dust on the rocks as well. I had a bit of a staghorn breakout along with some green thread algae, I did the one two punch and it eradicated those algae pretty easily but the dust algae persists. I didn't like it at first but it is growing on me


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## 180g (May 20, 2014)

tharsis said:


> Thanks, yeah I want to be able to keep the gap free of plants, I am still thinking about the Blyxa there. I may try to coerce the DHG to fill in the substrate in the gap as well.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


yea it gives it a nice rustic look I think.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Trimmed back the Rotundifolia, trimmed the downoi and spread it out a bit more. This stuff is growing like mad in this tank.

The rock algae seems to be coming in alot harder now. The plants are all doing fine, but the algae is spreading across the rocks like mad. Why is that?

Anyways, while watching the plants grow, I have been playing with the background lighting. Trying to find what I like. I am getting tired of the dark blue and want something more whiteish. 

Here are a couple different arrangements using whiter light. I like both better than the straight up blue, let me know what you think! I think I prefer #3 though. 




























And here are some growth pics:





































Going to plant some moss and anubias on the rocks next!


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Normally Im not a fan of light backgrounds but it makes a great effect on your tank. Think I like #3 best as well.

Not sure about the algae. Im dealing with the same thing in a little 20 gal. Best guess is too much light relative to plant density.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Just a quick update:

Added some anubias, I was shaping the HM to start growing in the crevices. I am also aggressively trimming the rotalas to be super bushy and I want them to follow the crevices/contours of the rocks. The nessea was showing signs of distress on the leaves, but I think it is just transitioning to submerged growth. It is starting to show new growth as well. The S. Repens is growing well as well, I will probably try to propogate it next week. Still waiting for the AR and Ludwigia to make their appearance over the rocks.

The algae on the rocks is still kinda bad as well. It is getting to be nice and thick, I kind of like how it waves in the current. The plants are perfectly fine though. I am guessing it is probably too much nutrients in the water column. I have been dosing pretty heavily without much monitoring. I may do the one two punch and then get a little more regimented with the dosing.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

I like the more solid tone of the background in that last pic. I think the actual contents of the tank come into focus better and really stand out.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

thanks, yeah I agree. I think that this is the one I am going to stick with.

on a faunal note, I think I am going to get some tetras either today or tomorrow. It is time to get some animals into this tank!


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## snakeybird (May 19, 2014)

Any updates on your tank?


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Time for a long overdue update! 

I moved some rocks around again, mainly I moved the biggest spire over to the right and I laid a few dividing lines between my rotalas. 




























I have been trimming like a maniac, keeping everything mowed down to try to get things as bushy as possible. The two rotala bushes in the front are really coming along nicely, I basically trim them like you would a cedar hedge once a week. It makes a mess of the tank with all the trimmings but I really like the look. I have been trying to get the rotundifolia to look like its growing up the sides of the rocks like a vine, and I think it is coming along nicely. 




























The stems in the back are getting the same aggressive trimming treatment, I really want bushy plants. It is requiring quite a bit of patience because it doesn't seem like there is much progression but I think it will pay off huge in the long run. 










I added another package of DHG from petsmart to fill in the right hand side. removed the HM because it just wasn't growing well, I got it emersed grown and it never transitioned well in my tank. But I added some fissidens and flame moss to the crevices between the rocks in its place. I think the flame moss is going to look awesome on the rocks once it grows in. 










The Downoi are growing really nice and compact as is the S. Repens. 










I have had some struggles with algae and I had to raise my light up about 6", the CO2 is not quite as stable as I would like. I am finally realizing the instability issues associated with a single stage regulator. When you are riding a knife edge with the high light, any fluctuations in the CO2 will set off algae problems. I never noticed it before because I was more in the medium light range so there was more leeway. So I have raised the lights up a bit and I also turned one bank to 50% to drop the light down low. 

I added some fish as well, two bolivian rams, 3 albino corys, and 5 ottos.










So that is that, I am waiting for the DHG to fill in on the right, I am going to propogate the S. Repens soon to fill in more of the right side. I want to get some S. belem and T. fluviatus for the right hand side. The Tonina will go right behind the S. Repens and the belem will be in the back.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Just a few pics of the inhabitants, I feel like I am finally getting the hang of taking pics of this tank. Getting the lighting and contrast has been much harder with the LED's than with the T5's. 









































































Needs more fish! Time for a nice big school of fish. Probably harlequins...


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Latest pics:





































Things are going well, I am still being hyper aggressive with the trimming, I want plant groupings to be as bushy as possible. I have some of the rotala species' behind the big outcrop on the right, they are about to make their first appearance. I also took out the Nesea from the left and replaced it with Limnophila Aromatica. I am keeping the Limno trimmed low as well to get it very bushy. Some algae problems but overall things are going well. Also added S. Belem to the left outcrop, and flame moss and fissidens to the outcrops. The S. Repens is spreading nicely as is the DHG.

I also added a few guppies.


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

Although its technically not (yet), the scape has a very Dutch style feel, just need to get that back section filled in with something tall. Man those rocks need cleaned! I'm personally not a fan of guppies but very nice photos of them, good clean shots.


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## tharsis (Oct 9, 2009)

Yeah, this is definitely heading in a dutchy direction. The ludwigia should fill in the back right, the rotalas will fill in the middle and aromatica will take care of the left.

I agree about the rocks! But I have given up on keeping them clean haha, I just can't keep the algae off of them. I figure I will cover them in moss and bee done with it! 

Thanks about the pics, these are my first guppies, not my favorite either, they lack personality. I will probably move them to another tank soonish. I am still unsure how to stock this tank.


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## lethalbrains (Feb 23, 2015)

Wow. That is one of the best scapes I have seen. Amazing job.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

very cool hardscape!

Bump: very cool hardscape!


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