# 220g Jardini Island



## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Very nice, that is just like mine but longer, same stand and trim. I have also added something to the end of the tank to keep sunlight from beeming in and making that end full of algae. My stand wasn't tall enough to fit a 2262 underneath, are you going to use a different filter or sump?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Very nice, that is just like mine but longer, same stand and trim. I have also added something to the end of the tank to keep sunlight from beeming in and making that end full of algae. My stand wasn't tall enough to fit a 2262 underneath, are you going to use a different filter or sump?


My 2262s would fit but I'm having a custom sump built for under this bad boy.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Too cool, I would love to try a sump on another tank. It's hard to get a sense of just how large that tank is unless you are standing next to it, when I see mine at the store (empty) it seem large but I'm so used to looking at it I want more room.

Are you keeping your 150 too?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Too cool, I would love to try a sump on another tank. It's hard to get a sense of just how large that tank is unless you are standing next to it, when I see mine at the store (empty) it seem large but I'm so used to looking at it I want more room.
> 
> Are you keeping your 150 too?


Nope the 150 will be sold to help fund this tank. Wife is letting purchase everything first then once it is all ready to go I will transfer everything over to the 220 and sell off all of my gear from the 150. Only thing I will be keeping is my CarbonDosers, CO2 Setup, and my wave maker everything else will be new for this tank.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

That's a good way to do it, I want to swap out my 8 year old Flourite for AS, but with the ammonia spike and 80 plus fish it will be very hard to do, I also need to re-seal the corners with new silicon so I need a 3 to 8 weeks of empty tank.

It's still going to be a lot of work but I'm curious to see what you come up with for a aqua-scape. Can you use the pumps from the 2262's or is something different required, I know if I had a pair of 2262's they would be hard to sell, emotional attachment.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I'll be using a Mag 24 for my return pumps. As for my auqascape I will be doing a dutch scape again.  For substrate I will be using my existing AS plus some RootMedic Goodness and a bag of miracle grow potting mix to give the tank a super charged substrate. This tank will ahve fully auto dosing via a bubble magus doser. Tank will be fully powered by RootMedic fertilizers all around.

Craig


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

Very nice! You still going to do a moss wall?

-Caton


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Da Plant Man said:


> Very nice! You still going to do a moss wall?
> 
> -Caton


That I am all the way around except for the overflows won't have moss on them. 

Tank is full and sitting here took a bit of work but the bulkheads are now leak free. Will drain it tonite or tomorrow after making sure it is comepletely leak free then I will have to wait for my custom sump to be built about 4-5 weeks lead time on that plus get some other toys. 

Once this is setup I will ahve lots of equipment from my 150 up for grabs.

Craig


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## The Gipper (Sep 9, 2003)

Wow awesome tank, I assume its 24 inch front to back? I followed your 150 journal from beginning...I've ordered a 190gal (72x24x26) it will take 6-8 weeks. What are you going to do for lighting on this one?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

The Gipper said:


> Wow awesome tank, I assume its 24 inch front to back? I followed your 150 journal from beginning...I've ordered a 190gal (72x24x26) it will take 6-8 weeks. What are you going to do for lighting on this one?


Probably use my existing light fixture though there is a really nice 39 watt x 12 T5HO fixture a couple hours away that would look stunning over this tank.

Yes it is 24 front to back 72x24x30 tall

Craig


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Sickk!!!! U must be exhausted though!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Can't wait how great this will turn out... Don't disappoint us craig!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Craigthor said:


> For substrate I will be using my existing AS plus some RootMedic Goodness and a bag of miracle grow potting mix to give the tank a super charged substrate.


Craig, I know a lot of people use it but I would URGE you very wholeheartedly to NOT put the potting mix in there. 

I used the potting mix and it was doing fine. However, I went to shift my wood at one point, and I broke the sand top layer. A volcano of dirt and gases erupted into the water. I almost lost my fish, I lost pretty much all of my shrimp a few cories and an otto. 

When I started taking the dirt out it smelled awful. Apparently it broke down something awful and wasn't venting properly, even though I made sure to keep the sand to no more than 1" deep. 

Right now I'm running it with straight sand (and the plants are suffering) until I can move later this summer and put together an order for AS.

I know some people have luck with dirt, but considering the size of this tank any issues like I had would be a train wreck.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Craig, I know a lot of people use it but I would URGE you very wholeheartedly to NOT put the potting mix in there.
> 
> I used the potting mix and it was doing fine. However, I went to shift my wood at one point, and I broke the sand top layer. A volcano of dirt and gases erupted into the water. I almost lost my fish, I lost pretty much all of my shrimp a few cories and an otto.
> 
> ...


Just curious how thick your dirt layer was, they don't recommend much over 1" max on the dirt and it can compact. I will be usign probably 1/2" or less in my setup. Also with zero hardscape and a fully dutch setup the roots from teh plants should do it well.

Craig


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## sssnel (Nov 8, 2011)

I use the MGOPS and have no issues. I never make it to the full inch of MGOPS though. I use about 1/2 to 3/4 and plant very heavy at the onset. I will tell you I rarely move around my hardscape though


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Craigthor said:


> Just curious how thick your dirt layer was, they don't recommend much over 1" max on the dirt and it can compact. I will be usign probably 1/2" or less in my setup. Also with zero hardscape and a fully dutch setup the roots from teh plants should do it well.
> 
> Craig



That was probably my mistake then. I had it mounded up in some areas. I knew the top layer couldn't be any more than 1" but did not know the dirt needed to be no more than 1" as well. 

Would completely explain my problems....uhg..... I've not had very good luck with this thing lately.

SOOO I suppose potting mix would be just fine! Go for it  

Honestly I'm excited to see this take shape. Your projects have been my favorite ever since I started with my 75. If you decide to let the 2262's go I'd like the opportunity to get one from you when the time comes. 

By the way, what ever did you do with the manzy that was in your tank from the pre-dutch phases?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> That was probably my mistake then. I had it mounded up in some areas. I knew the top layer couldn't be any more than 1" but did not know the dirt needed to be no more than 1" as well.
> 
> Would completely explain my problems....uhg..... I've not had very good luck with this thing lately.
> 
> ...


Manzy is tucked away in the garage and I just listed a bunch of stuff in the SnS.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

You want to let some of that manzy go?  PUHPUHPUHLEASE!?! Comments about the filter going in your SnS thread.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> You want to let some of that manzy go?  PUHPUHPUHLEASE!?! Comments about the filter going in your SnS thread.


Only if you want to make the trip up this way.... Not really looking to ship it.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Ha the trip from TN would be 3x the cost of shipping it most likely.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Got a new fixture to work with. Just got done tearing it apart and repainting it. Gone from black to Rustoleum Hammered Metal Copper finish. Now to wait for it to cure out and see how well it comes out. New lighting is a Current Nova Extreme 12x 39 watt T5HO light. 

Craig


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## zergling (May 16, 2007)

Subscribed! 

Not sure if I missed it, what are the dimensions? 6' x 2' x ??


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

zergling said:


> Subscribed!
> 
> Not sure if I missed it, what are the dimensions? 6' x 2' x ??


72x24x30tall


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

24" deep.... I'd love that. Opens up what you can do with driftwood a little more. Of course you're going dutch again right? So that just means bigger plant groups


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## zergling (May 16, 2007)

Holy **** that's a tall tank.

Please tell me you'll have altum angels there :hihi:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Nope no Altums. Currently will house a large school of 27 Millenium Red Rainbows, large school of odessa barbs, some Orizias Wowrae, pitbull plecos but may swap tehm out for a school of glass catfish to stay with the asian group of fishes.

Quick phone pic:










Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Is that the new light???? It's so dark and we want too see, are you keeping all the goodies under wraps too?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

If you move the pitbull plecos out I'd like the first shot at them. I have one and love him to death. I'd enjoy having more.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Is that the new light???? It's so dark and we want too see, are you keeping all the goodies under wraps too?


That it is, tossed the old bulbs it came with back in and have it on trying to dry the paint faster. LOL Has a couple imperfections in my painting but hoping as it dries it will disappear.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> If you move the pitbull plecos out I'd like the first shot at them. I have one and love him to death. I'd enjoy having more.


I've got a dozen...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

This is with 4 T5HO bulbs on and nothing else in the room.


















I know they are blue the fixture came of a salt tank, I have some more bulbs on order that I will be playing with.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I added a bit of blue to my light and the plants look good while they are on but I have more light hood than I need so it's an extra slot. I had Cyanobacteria and it had lead me to read a article about light that suggested staying away from the lower end of the Kelvin scale which is yellow, they suggest light above 6k for a planted tank and 10K for deeper tanks.


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

Personally, I think you should keep one of them blue and keep it on at night like a moon light. Idk, just a though. 

So far, it looks awesome. I can't wait until you get it planted!


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Wtf... I'm drooling.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Wtf... I'm drooling.


For the low, low fee of $99.99 plus shipping and handling I will let you even come sleep in the tank.... LOL :flick:


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Subscribed. I love large tank builds.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> For the low, low fee of $99.99 plus shipping and handling I will let you even come sleep in the tank.... LOL :flick:


Lmao how about a 6 pack? Lmao


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Having some thoughts of wood and slow growing plants under the T5 setup....


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

:icon_eek::drool::drool:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just got the T5HO bulbs switched over, I really want a couple of the UVL Red Sun bulbs to play with now. 

As soon as the sump builder starts a build thread on a local salt water forum I will post a link so those that want to follow can. 

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just got confirmation Tom is sendong some wood my way. Going for big and bold in this 220g setup. As always I selected more then I need so I have some things to play with. 

Definitely think I will be leaning towards slower growth plants in the new layout. I'm trying to minimalize work on the tank as my life gets busier and keep things as automated as possible.

I did think about going with a controller but since most of my toys are already stand alone I can't justify the cost. I will be investing in a 60" high end power stip with 20 outlets and some higher end Intermatic digital timers to control the needs. Should make things nice and simple.

Craig


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Craigthor said:


> Just got the T5HO bulbs switched over, I really want a couple of the UVL Red Sun bulbs to play with now.
> 
> As soon as the sump builder starts a build thread on a local salt water forum I will post a link so those that want to follow can.
> 
> Craig


They are freaky red.

I'll put the wood together and then you can look at it taped off.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> They are freaky red.
> 
> I'll put the wood together and then you can look at it taped off.


Yeah I saw the pics Zergling posted I have been pm'ing him for ideas on my bulb selections. The local SW club is getting a Par meter that can be loaned out soon and since I'm a member hoping I can play around with some bulbs and get some good numbers over the 220.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

GAH! MORE WOOD?!?!

You already have some awesome stuff. Not fair.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Here is a link to Toms workings for me:

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/s...zanita-driftwood-batch-9-a-7.html#post1749007


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## Amazonfish (Oct 20, 2009)

:drool: That is all.


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

I have to say I'm glad your going to use that nice looking wood in this layout. I like dutch style aquariums but I prefer to see some hardscape materials in the layout. I think you will enjoy a tank that doesn't require the work that is needed to do a dutch scape. I have a new tek light coming soon and I also wondered what the uvl red sun would look like. I plan on using 1 Geismann Aqua flora, 1 Geismann midday, 1 ati blue special, and 1 ati purple plus. I would like to see other tanks that use that red sun bulb before buying it too but may just buy one to see what it looks like. I will be following this new build and look forward to seeing what you come up with.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So I am thinking I want to do a large portion of the tank with Epiphytes. Looking at a bunch of Anubias, a bit of Java Fern, a nice bushel of Bolbitis, and some mini pellia on the wood. Also what I am considering is incorporating a nice selection of rock into this scape as well for both texture and structure. Here is a edited pic of where I would like to have some rock at.










Not the greatest pic but thinking the wood on the right will be attached to a rock out cropping and something similar with the stump on the left.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lol it's gonna look sick. I'm gonna go cut down a a few trees in central park and copy it lmao!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Lol it's gonna look sick. I'm gonna go cut down a a few trees in central park and copy it lmao!


How can I copy you if you copy me... LOL Also wouldn't that be a felony? May as well start a Bail Jerome out fund on Facebook. :flick:


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

U best start that page soon cause as soon as I find a chainsaw I'm walking 2 blocks down and cutting down the biggest tree ever and then hide it in my tiny office. Lol 

Ur still gonna copy me. I'm gonna use brick and cement instead of your seiryu stone lol using what I can find...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Lmao...


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

All jokes aside this will be amazing bro


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig it sound great, you should look in the nano section for inspiration with the wood, but what you've said sound great and it kinda back to the basics but those are some of the best tanks, good luck.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Not a lot to update on except alot of money going out right now. Found some rocks to work with, a couple of Seiryuesc type rocks the biggest weighing in at 38#'s. Wood should be coming in from Tom soon. Lots of plants from various sellers adn seen some I would love to add.

If anyone wants to dontate some C. Keei I wouldn't complain. LOL

Sump hasn't been started yet just awaiting the builder to wrap up some projects he had going on which is fine as I should have everything designed prior to arrival then I should be able to put hte sump in and plumb away.

Going to start selling the plants out of hte 150 so I can make room for the incoming plants that I want to use. The new scape will have minimal amounts of aquasoil so I may have lots of extra to sell at some point.

Craig


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Bro I never saw a pic of the biggest... I wanna seeeee!!!


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## ridewake210 (Jan 12, 2007)

Awesome Awesome AWESOME!!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Damn it Craig. I guess if you have aquasoil available at some point (a good amount for a 75g with some serious slope) send me a PM. 

If you have enough of it and can cut a good price I might take you up on the offer and come up to pick through your wood out in the garage as well


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

When you do this scaping of the wood, make sure to really make it so the wood does NOT MOVE. This means screwing it together, zip tie, rocks to wedge things in place well, sinker rocks for the 1st month or so on top to keep the wood in place.

I spend most of my time doing that when scaping.
The other stuff is fast and easy.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Bro I never saw a pic of the biggest... I wanna seeeee!!!


Pics of the 3 biggest rocks I will be working with weights are listed on the cardboard.










































Craig


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Geeze Craig! Whatever you do, don't drop 'em into the tank! 38lbs is going to be tough to work with! Not to mention tying it to Tom's wood.

Lift with your legs!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> Geeze Craig! Whatever you do, don't drop 'em into the tank! 38lbs is going to be tough to work with! Not to mention tying it to Tom's wood.
> 
> Lift with your legs!


 
Won't be tying will be using SS lag bolts for that permanent touch.


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Well, that's one worry down.....will you be using some sort of hydraulic lifting mechanism to place the rock/wood/lag bolt mechanism into the tank then? Preferably this?:










Sorry for dorking out. Just be careful, man! That final weight is going to be pretty heavy, and not very easy to work with!


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

LOL, that is some serious rock there. Do be careful and lift carefully and with a helper.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> LOL, that is some serious rock there. Do be careful and lift carefully and with a helper.


Definitely will be 2-3 of us working on the placement and setting these in the tank.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Definitely will be 2-3 of us working on the placement and setting these in the tank.


I'd help but you'd have to pay my ticket. First class plz


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Jeromeit...the only way to get to Cedar Rapids would be to take a small regional jet to Des Moines or Ames, and go the rest of the via tractor. ;D


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

crazydaz said:


> Jeromeit...the only way to get to Cedar Rapids would be to take a small regional jet to Des Moines or Ames, and go the rest of the via tractor. ;D


Now that is funny and I live in Nebraska so I know this to be true.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jeromeit said:


> i'd help but you'd have to pay my ticket. First class plz





crazydaz said:


> jeromeit...the only way to get to cedar rapids would be to take a small regional jet to des moines or ames, and go the rest of the via tractor. ;d





ua hua said:


> now that is funny and i live in nebraska so i know this to be true.


lol...


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lmao


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

How's the sump coming along. I'm very curious how you set this up this go-around.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> How's the sump coming along. I'm very curious how you set this up this go-around.


Waiting for the builder to start his build thread so I can watch it be built. I know he went and picked up the acrylic last week but haven't heard where he is at. Getting super ancy for him to get it done.

Craig


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm sure. I think I'd have a hard time having a 220 in the house and not messing with it every day.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Sump build has started, http://greateriowareefsociety.org/Community/DiscussionForums/tabid/78/aft/26502/Default.aspx can't wait to see how fast it goes. Hopefully wood and rock should arrive this week.

Craig


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Sweet  That means my filter will be available before too long!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Sweet  That means my filter will be available before too long!


Yep then I can also break down the other one and sell it to help fund the rest of the build, or atleast help cover what I've _invested _in setting up the new tank. Honestly didn't think it would cost as much as it has but the long term worth should be awesome once it is all up and running.

Craig


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Same here, once the 2262 is here I'll be doing my switching around in the cabinet, putting the PVC and all together and getting my reactor situation worked out. 

Then I can sell my 2215's to put money into Aquasoil


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Also.... the sump he's building sounds ridiculous. Is it completely sealed past the filter socks?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Also.... the sump he's building sounds ridiculous. Is it completely sealed past the filter socks?


It will be euro braced all around and I will have glass tops with foam weather strip to create a full seal.  This thing will be a beast my wallet got really light after writing him the check.

Craig


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

One of the best things about your projects is you're like me. You don't like screwing around and skimping on your equipment. The major difference is you have the means to buy it all lol. 

I can't wait to see how it comes together. And this hardscape is going to be BALLER.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> One of the best things about your projects is you're like me. You don't like screwing around and skimping on your equipment. The major difference is you have the means to buy it all lol.
> 
> I can't wait to see how it comes together. And this hardscape is going to be BALLER.


That and I don't think I will ever go bigger then the 220g as this is plenty of tank. I'm really excited about the hardsscape and am thinking using lots of ferns, anubias, bolbitis will be stunning. Will round it off with some Mini Pellia and possibly a dozen Crypt Keei and some Marisala sp for that easy to care for feel.

Craig


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Are you going to go for the jungle-like "dark water or "shadowy" feel?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Are you going to go for the jungle-like "dark water or "shadowy" feel?


Somewhat...


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Somewhat...


Lol super mysterious... kinda like film noir meets the jungle featuring batman huh?


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Okay I just realized that I made no sense.. Long day


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Lol super mysterious... kinda like film noir meets the jungle featuring batman huh?





Jeromeit said:


> Okay I just realized that I made no sense.. Long day


 
LOL, time to hit the Hookah bar....:biggrin:


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

I would if I wasn't broke lmao


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Got the wood in from Tom. Here is what I am thinking after alot of moving wood around here is where it sits. Still hard to visualize as I will also be using rock between some of the wood but until my sump come that won't be going into the tank. Using a bit of am offset triangular pattern in this build. Some more tweeking and it will be where I think I want to have everything. 


































Craig


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

From the first pic it looks like a ton of branches put together but in the third pic you see three individual pieces! Can't wait till this is all setup and Runnin Craig'


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

i like it!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> From the first pic it looks like a ton of branches put together but in the third pic you see three individual pieces! Can't wait till this is all setup and Runnin Craig'


 
Yep I went big and bold with the pieces, figured with the size of the tank I could get away with it.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> i like it!


Thanks, I did move a couple of the pieces just slightly and got a couple of the smaller pieces attached to stone.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Spent a few more hours tweeking and adjusting, think I am going to stare at it for a few days and see how it feels. So far I'm really liking the layout and the wife is liking the lines it creates. Wish I could put my rock in as it would give a better impression of the layout but that won't happen till I get my sump under the stand incase I have to pull the tank to fit it under.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

i really like it!! the lines it creates are really nice, your wife knows whats up roud:


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Oh. my.

That wood is amazing. The only thing I might change is the angle of one of the pieces on the left. I'd want some variance in how both of the branches came up and right now they look almost parallel. 

I'd probably try flipping that far left piece around about 120 degrees. 

Regardless, it looks baller. This tank is going to be incredible.


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## looking4roselines (Mar 28, 2008)

Holy cow! this is going to be one kick a$$ setup. 
Always aiming high. I like it.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

looking4roselines said:


> Holy cow! this is going to be one kick a$$ setup.
> Always aiming high. I like it.


How many Keei would I need to do a foreground out of them. Trying to figure out which limbs I need to sell to pay for them. LOL


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## duff (Feb 26, 2006)

Stunning!!!! Can't wait to see your tank come alive. An amazing start...


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## looking4roselines (Mar 28, 2008)

Craigthor said:


> How many Keei would I need to do a foreground out of them. Trying to figure out which limbs I need to sell to pay for them. LOL


 
For a tank that size, you will need a few. :icon_smil
PM me and let me know when you're ready for them. My deal still stands.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Stunning as the first one. Maybe you should take a FTS of each one and then we can come to a decision of which ones best.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

... lmao a Keei foreground. Spare no expense. I might be as excited to see this go up as you are Craig. I'm living vicariously....


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> ... lmao a Keei foreground. Spare no expense. I might be as excited to see this go up as you are Craig. I'm living vicariously....


 
Pretty sure a single Kidney will pay for it. I will probably do it once I tear down the 150g tank and get it sold. Should pay for it.


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## vincenz (Jan 29, 2012)

The two pieces of the left kind of look like a set of bones (not sure if you were going for that). I agree with somehow angling one away from the other so the line isn't so continuous.

Bold for sure :icon_excl


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

vincenz said:


> The two pieces of the left kind of look like a set of bones (not sure if you were going for that). I agree with somehow angling one away from the other so the line isn't so continuous.
> 
> Bold for sure :icon_excl


In person the lines look different but in pics it doesn't catch the dimension of hte wood as well. Also there is still rock work to go around the wood and of course the plants.


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## green_valley (Sep 14, 2011)

EPIC... Will be EPIC!!!!....nough said. I can't wait for the plants.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Craigthor said:


> Pretty sure a single Kidney will pay for it. I will probably do it once I tear down the 150g tank and get it sold. Should pay for it.


Damn, if only you weren't selling it until later this summer. I'd come up and get it from you seeing as it's drilled and all and I'm wanting to upgrade to a 6ft show tank once I get moved into a more permanent location.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Damn, if only you weren't selling it until later this summer. I'd come up and get it from you seeing as it's drilled and all and I'm wanting to upgrade to a 6ft show tank once I get moved into a more permanent location.


LOL the 150 is already spoken for to another local plant person. I may have to drag out and sell some of that extra driftwood I have.


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## manualfocus (Jun 15, 2011)

That looks awesome, Craig. There are very few Iowans I know of who are really into aqua scapes. I hope you get your sump in soon!


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Eh figures, I wouldn't be ready for it for quite a while anyways. 

And you have my attention on the driftwood although my plan has changed dramatically. You think some of those pieces can be put together to form a twisted evil looking tree? I'm wanting to try and put driftwood together to do that, then find a way to grow moss on it that makes it look like a scary/haunted looking willow. I remember it being real branchy which is good. 

Although that also depends on if you're willing to ship it.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

manualfocus said:


> That looks awesome, Craig. There are very few Iowans I know of who are really into aqua scapes. I hope you get your sump in soon!


Me too, the guy building it is in your neck of the woods. 



rockwood said:


> Eh figures, I wouldn't be ready for it for quite a while anyways.
> 
> And you have my attention on the driftwood although my plan has changed dramatically. You think some of those pieces can be put together to form a twisted evil looking tree? I'm wanting to try and put driftwood together to do that, then find a way to grow moss on it that makes it look like a scary/haunted looking willow. I remember it being real branchy which is good.
> 
> Although that also depends on if you're willing to ship it.


I've got a huge box now that I could use for shipping. I have the house to myself this weekend as the wife is out of town let me try to drag it out and take some pics of it. 

Craig


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I want to put something like this together only smaller:










I've eyeballed that piece for a long time and see a lot of potential. I thought about that with a thick field of hairgrass aorund it and stems in the background, then hang a mini tire swing from a branch (would be cool as hell.) I just don't have a tank big enough. 

My latest idea is to do the dark gnarly tree on the right side with crypts dark colored plants and then build up a rocky cliff on the left where I'd plant all the bright stems, red, orange, super bright greens. Kinda like "you climb up out of the valley of darkness and evil to find the gods/light/awesomeness at the top" type thing. 

So if you think I could bring together some of the pieces you have to form like a 2/3 to 1/2 size piece like that, it would be perfect. 

And yeah, I know I just straight hijacked your thread..... sorry.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> I want to put something like this together only smaller:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What are your tank dimmensions and does it have a cross brace on the top. I'm sure I can find something


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

standard 75g (48w x 24h x 18d). And yeah its braced in the center.


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

rockwood said:


> standard 75g (48w x 24h x 18d). And yeah its braced in the center.


20" High unless it's actually a 90 g.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

If its braced in the center you won't get it in.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Ok, lets not jack his thread completely. If everyone wants to go ahead and help me start planning I'll start a new thread for it lol. 



jkan0228 said:


> If its braced in the center you won't get it in.


That's the only reason Tom still has that piece. I hadn't bought it because I know it's not going into my aquarium as is, which is a shame. 

And thanks for the correction on the height. It's a standard All-Glass 75.


Craig, if you come up with something, and can hook me up some pictures just shoot me a PM so we don't derail this any further 

*Now back to our regular programming.... Craig's amazing and wonderous, we-all-wish-it-was-ours tank/wood/stone/future keei emporium. *


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Ok, lets not jack his thread completely. If everyone wants to go ahead and help me start planning I'll start a new thread for it lol.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


LOL it's all good, I will try to make time this weekend to get you soem pics of what I have around an possibly if I have time try to do a quick layout for ya.

Craig


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## WillPlanted (Jan 14, 2012)

It's looking really good I can't wait to see some plants in there.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

If anyone wants to see the sump design there is a picture here: http://www.greateriowareefsociety.o...nForums/tabid/78/aft/26502/Default.aspx#97466


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## Booger (May 17, 2004)

Yeah that'll do it. Nice touches:



Floyd R...Turbo's Aquatics said:


> It has bulkheads on the front near the bottom of the on either side for heaters, a bulkhead on the back for draining during a continuous water change, and a series of small bulkheads on the top euro for dosing plant nutrients and RO/DI (used for a continuous water change), as well as a return pump bulkhead.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Booger said:


> Yeah that'll do it. Nice touches:


Was all about hte planning on this.  Think it will do me well for a long time and could filter several large tanks as it has a 70g volume.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Craig, can you explain how this works? What are you using for bio? Is water coming in to both sides? I know he mentioned "drip trays" what exactly does that mean?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Craig, can you explain how this works? What are you using for bio? Is water coming in to both sides? I know he mentioned "drip trays" what exactly does that mean?


Water comes in both sides from each overflow, each side will have 3x 4" filter socks 100 micron, from there water will go up through 30 PPI Poret Foam and flow over into a bio media section that will be loaded with the SubstratPro from my 2262s. Return pump is in the middle and will come up and go out each side to the returns.

Drip trays to help ensure that the flow is fairly even over all the media.


----------



## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

I hope you're not being charged by the hole. :biggrin:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

prototyp3 said:


> I hope you're not being charged by the hole. :biggrin:


Nope just by the gallon. :biggrin:


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

By the gallon is not too bad... Send it my way when ur done oh and throw in that wood too... Hehe


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> By the gallon is not too bad... Send it my way when ur done oh and throw in that wood too... Hehe


Not considering all the custom work he is doing for me. I'll run and flat rate that to you....


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## Assassynation (Dec 23, 2011)

Looking forward to this.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig that's a super design on the sump and a first for me, but I love the dual sided sump and your water should be really oxygen rich, not to mention clean.

I may have missed this but how are you going to introduce CO2???


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

yes.. oxygen rich.. wanna sell me your carbondoser? hehe


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

150EH said:


> Craig that's a super design on the sump and a first for me, but I love the dual sided sump and your water should be really oxygen rich, not to mention clean.
> 
> I may have missed this but how are you going to introduce CO2???


+1
How are you going to keep from going through a 20# tank every other month? :biggrin:


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I've alway wanted to try a little Taam Rio pump with the needle wheel option for CO2 with a sump.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Duck tape up the sump and cover the tank and you're fine with CO2. 

You could always get a 35 or 50lb....


----------



## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

I know he said he was going to have glass lids that were weather stripped to seal it but other than that....


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Craig that's a super design on the sump and a first for me, but I love the dual sided sump and your water should be really oxygen rich, not to mention clean.
> 
> I may have missed this but how are you going to introduce CO2???





Jeromeit said:


> yes.. oxygen rich.. wanna sell me your carbondoser? hehe





audioaficionado said:


> +1
> How are you going to keep from going through a 20# tank every other month? :biggrin:





jkan0228 said:


> Duck tape up the sump and cover the tank and you're fine with CO2.
> 
> You could always get a 35 or 50lb....


 
*Yep this is how I will be sealing the top:*



rockwood said:


> I know he said he was going to have glass lids that were weather stripped to seal it but other than that....


With the top sealed super well it won't lose to much of the co2 due to off gassing. I will be running my carbondosers probably off of a loop coming off my return line.


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Where are you getting your oxygen/air entrainment into the water column for the aerobic bacteria in your sump?

I'm assuming your main tank will not be sealed and will be the O2 source for the entire system.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Well I will ahve to take it all out oonce the sump gets here but here is a general layout of what I have planned. The rock looks much different when wet so mostly have to wait. 










I will take some better pics this coming week as the wife is out of state and took the camera with her so I jsut took a quick snap with my cell and the pictures isn't that great.

Craig


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

This looks great Craig! Did you still want the MQ carpet? im getting ready to pull it this weekend so please LMK so I can put it up in the SnS if not. I cant wait to see you get the sump in and get this tankzilla rolling


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

chad320 said:


> This looks great Craig! Did you still want the MQ carpet? im getting ready to pull it this weekend so please LMK so I can put it up in the SnS if not. I cant wait to see you get the sump in and get this tankzilla rolling


I'm torn right now go ahead and put it up in the SnS. I've got another idea but I'm not quite sure. I may PM a few people to bounce an idea around.


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Cool. Ive got a DHG 'Belem' carpeted 29g coming down soon too, in a month or so. Man, any way you go in this tank, your armpits are going to be sore doing a carpet


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

The hardscape looks really good. I take it your not going with to many stem plants for this scape as it looks as if there is not too much area thats not covered by rocks and driftwood. I think this would look great with ferns, anubias, and moss. On top of that it will be a lot easier to maintain long term. Beautiful setup and can't wait to see this all planted. I don't know if you mentioned it or not but what return pump are you going to use in your sump?


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## kwheeler91 (May 26, 2009)

This will be epic


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

kwheeler91 said:


> This will be epic


+1


Luckyass...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> The hardscape looks really good. I take it your not going with to many stem plants for this scape as it looks as if there is not too much area thats not covered by rocks and driftwood. I think this would look great with ferns, anubias, and moss. On top of that it will be a lot easier to maintain long term. Beautiful setup and can't wait to see this all planted. I don't know if you mentioned it or not but what return pump are you going to use in your sump?


:icon_mrgr Mag 24 but I can use just about anyone as I see fit.



kwheeler91 said:


> This will be epic





Jeromeit said:


> +1
> 
> 
> Luckyass...


Thanks guys...


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Dang Craig, thats some serious hardscape. Any ideas on plants?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So with the thoughts of going substrateless/ atleast for the most part I'm having a couple of thoughts.

Do I keep the Aquasoil? Seems kind of like a waste of good substrate, being only 6 months old I would sell it off.

Do I use BlackBeauty Blasting Sand? I am mostly wanting a thin layer to keep light out from under the stand and to provide a bit of texture and support for some smaller stones.

Thoughts?


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Keep the soil! Just in case you want to plant some crypts or anything in the crevices down the road.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Keep the soil! Just in case you want to plant some crypts or anything in the crevices down the road.


 
That is pretty much what I was thinking.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Great minds think alike hehe


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## looking4roselines (Mar 28, 2008)

I would personally do mineralized top soil and cap it with your used aquasoil. Your slow growing crypts and anubias will will appreciate this substrate over inert substrates.




Craigthor said:


> So with the thoughts of going substrateless/ atleast for the most part I'm having a couple of thoughts.
> 
> Do I keep the Aquasoil? Seems kind of like a waste of good substrate, being only 6 months old I would sell it off.
> 
> ...


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So what have I been up to today? Well call me crazy as I will probably have to pull it out when I put my sump under, possibly not but we will see. Needed more space as the 150 was packed and plants were suffering from neglect. 


































































































Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

looking4roselines said:


> I would personally do mineralized top soil and cap it with your used aquasoil. Your slow growing crypts and anubias will will appreciate this substrate over inert substrates.


Yeah that is what I was thinking, actually getting a bag of miracle gro organic and layering it around then topping with the AS.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

You're done!!! Fill er up and throw some power heads in there lol

looking good bro


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> You're done!!! Fill er up and throw some power heads in there lol
> 
> looking good bro


I thought about it....


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

That is going to look great when it's all grown in. Good use of the height.


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## dewalltheway (Jan 19, 2005)

That is so awesome! You did a great job on that layout! Where did you get the stone? That Anubias Nana looks great and I just PM'd Manini about some and hope to get some from him for my 125. Can't wait to see it filled up. :thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

dewalltheway said:


> That is so awesome! You did a great job on that layout! Where did you get the stone? That Anubias Nana looks great and I just PM'd Manini about some and hope to get some from him for my 125. Can't wait to see it filled up. :thumbsup::thumbsup:


I got 144lbs from PC1 and another 90 lbs of stone from Screenname. 2 different types of stones but the textures are similar. That coupled with the wood from Tom Barr. Probably my best to date.

Craig


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## looking4roselines (Mar 28, 2008)

Craigthor said:


> Yeah that is what I was thinking, actually getting a bag of miracle gro organic and layering it around then topping with the AS.


 
I've noticed that soil with too much unprocessed organic material has the tendency to "burp". Do you have access to pure topsoil?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

looking4roselines said:


> I've noticed that soil with too much unprocessed organic material has the tendency to "burp". Do you have access to pure topsoil?


I do, would that be better suited?


----------



## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Probably. I still have small tiny wood chips and gunk that came out of that dirt up around the rim of my tank. I've cleaned a lot of it but I won't get it pristine until I break the tank down and hose it out for the move. 

If you can avoid potting soil, avoid it. If you really want a bottom layer, try MTS or something like that. Personally.... you have the AS, just use it.


----------



## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I use is rice paddy soil, clay, low organic matter content, you only want about 10% or less OM. Higher sand/clay content.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

You could go complete soilless also for something novel.


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Yeah that is what I was thinking, actually getting a bag of miracle gro organic and layering it around then topping with the AS.


Don't do it! AS is plenty good enough and better than dirt in your tank. If that dirt doesn't work out or gets real messy with gassing you'll have a huge hassle on your hands cleaning it up without severely disrupting your nice scape. MTS would be better than dirt, but you already have the AS and it is too good to use as just a dirt cap.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> You could go complete soilless also for something novel.


I'm experimenting with that right now, may have to use some just o make sure the bottom is hidden.


----------



## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Gosh darn that's a neat scape. What about regular sand in the front? The tan might look nice and I think that a dark substrate will look odd.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Gosh darn that's a neat scape. What about regular sand in the front? The tan might look nice and I think that a dark substrate will look odd.


Might be a consideration...


----------



## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Looks great Craig!! 

I would follow Xue's advice, if nutritional value for heavy root feeders is an issue; however, a tan cap would look really nice in this tank...I say, why not combine those two ideas?  Most of it is going to be covered up anyhow by plants....may not be worth over-thinking it.


----------



## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Xingu or Nile sand would look pretty fantastic in there to fill in the spots where you need to cover the glass. Do like a little 1.5-2" layer. Enough so that if you decide go put crypts or something in you could stuff some rootmedic down in there next to them.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> Looks great Craig!!
> 
> I would follow Xue's advice, if nutritional value for heavy root feeders is an issue; however, a tan cap would look really nice in this tank...I say, why not combine those two ideas?  Most of it is going to be covered up anyhow by plants....may not be worth over-thinking it.


I will have few root feeders a couple of groups of crypts but that will be all, most will be anubias, java ferns and bolbitis. Possible a couple other rhiziods if they come in.



rockwood said:


> Xingu or Nile sand would look pretty fantastic in there to fill in the spots where you need to cover the glass. Do like a little 1.5-2" layer. Enough so that if you decide go put crypts or something in you could stuff some rootmedic down in there next to them.


Xingu sand goes black in a hurry used it before and it isn't all that nice. I do have some secret RootMedic goods to put down on the bottom so I am thinking I will stick with the Amazonia as I already have tons of it and put the RM products underneath. A couple of the planting areas will be fairly deep substrate but with big root feeders it should go well.

Craig


----------



## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

I would stick with the AS only. If you do decide to do dirt, you being from IA, are surrounded by fields of good black dirt. Wash and rinse in a bucket and youre good. I LOVE the scape. This is going to be a super nice grow in! And soooo much easier than chafing your armpits trying to maintain a carpet properly. This is a stunning start Craig, GREAT job!!!


----------



## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

LOOOOVVVEEE IT !!!!!! great job [email protected] this is your best scape yet!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

I was looking at a 210 gal Aqueon w/two overflow columns to get a feel how large of a tank I'd be dealing with if I got one. Only $1500 with ugly cheap looking black stand & canopy or $1100 for just the tank. I think I'll hold out for a red oak or cherry stand.

So Craig how's the snorkeling going or are you going to use scuba gear when you do in tank maintenance :icon_mrgr


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> I was looking at a 210 gal Aqueon w/two overflow columns to get a feel how large of a tank I'd be dealing with if I got one. Only $1500 with ugly cheap looking black stand & canopy or $1100 for just the tank. I think I'll hold out for a red oak or cherry stand.
> 
> So Craig how's the snorkeling going or are you going to use scuba gear when you do in tank maintenance :icon_mrgr


nice thing is with the choice of plants very little in tank maintence should be needed. Actually with stading on a short step stool I can reach in pretty well. My 150 is the same height.

Craig


----------



## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Your hardscape and plants look really good, I could see hiding the bottom egg create with a little AS, but it looks awesome!


----------



## wabisabi (Jan 31, 2011)

Wow, beautiful scape! This is awesome!


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craig that egg crate bottom layer is essential to protect you glass bottom with that stone mountain sitting on it. Genius even if you got the idea elsewhere. If I put down any heavy or sharp rocks in my large tank, I'll use that egg crate too.

What brand of tank did you get?

Are you going with the existing overflow columns or taking them out and doing something else with the plumbing connections? I'm not sure how well those built in skimmer columns work compared to a true surface skimmer overflow box.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Craig that egg crate bottom layer is essential to protect you glass bottom with that stone mountain sitting on it. Genius even if you got the idea elsewhere. If I put down any heavy or sharp rocks in my large tank, I'll use that egg crate too.
> 
> What brand of tank did you get?
> 
> Are you going with the existing overflow columns or taking them out and doing something else with the plumbing connections? I'm not sure how well those built in skimmer columns work compared to a true surface skimmer overflow box.


Perfecto/ Marineland aquarium. Yes I will be using the stock overflows, why wouldn't they work? They are rated over 700 GPH each and will skim the surface as any overflow will do. Why do you think these aren't true surface skimming overflows?


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Perfecto/ Marineland aquarium. Yes I will be using the stock overflows, why wouldn't they work? They are rated over 700 GPH each and will skim the surface as any overflow will do. Why do you think these aren't true surface skimming overflows?


They also have slots mid column and towards the bottom that will eat a lot of that 700 gal skimmer potential. However if it works for a marine/reef tank, it's gotta work for a FW planted tank.

I'll probably get a similar tank except maybe only 24" tall. I'll be watching how well your skimmer works.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> They also have slots mid column and towards the bottom that will eat a lot of that 700 gal skimmer potential. However if it works for a marine/reef tank, it's gotta work for a FW planted tank.
> 
> I'll probably get a similar tank except maybe only 24" tall. I'll be watching how well your skimmer works.


The slots in the middle actually feed to the top. The surface water flowing over is what causes the middle grates to draw water via suction as the water goes over the top.


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> The slots in the middle actually feed to the top. The surface water flowing over is what causes the middle grates to draw water via suction as the water goes over the top.


OK now I get it. :icon_idea
That whole plastic column is double walled and everything feeds up and over the inner wall. roud:


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> OK now I get it. :icon_idea
> That whole plastic column is double walled and everything feeds up and over the inner wall. roud:


Yep. :icon_wink


----------



## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

That's too cool for school, Craig! Very cool!!


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Sump build pics, getting closer!










































































Just need the Euro brace, bottom and custom sock holders and drip plates....


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just got off the phone with my Acrylics guy. Sounds like I should be able to take delivery of this right around the first week in April. So 2 weeks and counting for the sump. Just need a couple of days off to plumb the tank and get it all up and running. I am getting super stoked now.


----------



## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Guess I need to start planning my new plumbing for that beast of an Eheim....


----------



## Chlorophile (Aug 2, 2011)

Great.. now I need a new keyboard...
Well I lied because I am clearly typing on it right now but holy co2. 
That makes me drool!


----------



## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Mind telling us how much that baby costs? :hihi:


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Guess I need to start planning my new plumbing for that beast of an Eheim....


If all comes in as planned I'm hoping to ship it out to you teh week of the 9th...



Chlorophile said:


> Great.. now I need a new keyboard...
> Well I lied because I am clearly typing on it right now but holy co2.
> That makes me drool!





jkan0228 said:


> Mind telling us how much that baby costs? :hihi:


Roughly $600 for the sump but it is completely custom. Mostly 3/8" panels all around, lots of custom work and ideas. Can't wait to see how it pans out.


----------



## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

That's really reasonable for a custom built sump of that size considering most sumps start around the $250 and are nowhere as big or nice as that. What light are you going to use over this as I see you have your other for sale?


----------



## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Craigthor said:


> I'm experimenting with that right now, may have to use some just o make sure the bottom is hidden.


Plants on small slate pieces can do that easily.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> That's really reasonable for a custom built sump of that size considering most sumps start around the $250 and are nowhere as big or nice as that. What light are you going to use over this as I see you have your other for sale?


Got a Current 12x 39 watt T5HO setup 6 bulbs over each half the tank. 



plantbrain said:


> Plants on small slate pieces can do that easily.


Yep I'm playing with Mini Pellia on slate right now, if I can get enough of it that should fill in well.

Craig


----------



## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Pellia will grow in a shallow tray of water with a few fronds above the water just fine, replace 2x a week with rich nutrient tank water.

This way you have plenty to work with, an eventually, you'll have more than you know what to do with.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> Pellia will grow in a shallow tray of water with a few fronds above the water just fine, replace 2x a week with rich nutrient tank water.
> 
> This way you have plenty to work with, an eventually, you'll have more than you know what to do with.


That is what I am working with hopefully I can find some more Mini Pellia, Anubias Petite and some Nana.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Pics of the lighing setup:


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)




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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

That sump looks huge Craig. What are the outside dimensions?


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> That sump looks huge Craig. What are the outside dimensions?


18*18*47.5" if filled would be 70g


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Bro is that tank filled right now? Did I miss something?!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Bro is that tank filled right now? Did I miss something?!


Nope just dry started it as I needed room in my 150. The 150 was stuffed and plants were suffering so I emmersed all the anubias and ferns... LOL

Craig


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Hehe dry start ey? Good move lol 


In other news... my hc is dieing bro wtf!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Hehe dry start ey? Good move lol
> 
> 
> In other news... my hc is dieing bro wtf!


Trim it back and give it some ferts...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just a few teaser shots:










































































Lots of Anubias', Mini Pellia, single odd ball Java Fern sp to go in yet. Needs a few more rocks on the back right corner. Leveled out the stand, atleast almost perfect, and filled the tank 3/4 of the way full so I could have some room to work. Also misting several times daily was a PITA. I can already see tannins coming out of the wood.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Now that how to get the most out of a tall deep tank. Looks amazing and should be low maintenance with those slower growing plants. It would be a nightmare trimming that tank weekly. That's what lawns and yards are for.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

.... wow.


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## AquaNorth (Jan 27, 2010)

Amazing love it!!!!


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

You're gonna have to pay for my jaw surgery. Lol great work bro looks fantastic.


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## cableguy69846 (Dec 13, 2010)

Stunning. Absolutely stunning. Are you planning on a substrate at all? You could probably get away with not having any in there at all.


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

WOW Craig! That's a spicy meatball!  Love it!!

Any decision on the substrate yet?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Thanks guys, currently thinking I will run substrateless for the time being. Mini Pellia and Anubias Petite will create the foreground.

This is going to be a species only tank for my group of Millenium Red Rainbows. 

Tank is loaded with tannins already I really should do some daily water changes to start to clear it up.

Craig


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

I've still got a barclaya for you if you want it, Craig.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

zachary908 said:


> I've still got a barclaya for you if you want it, Craig.


I might think it would grow if I tucked the bulb into a rock crevice without substrate?


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Thanks guys, currently thinking I will run substrateless for the time being. Mini Pellia and Anubias Petite will create the foreground.
> 
> This is going to be a species only tank for my group of Millenium Red Rainbows.
> 
> ...


You could let it turn into a blackwater biotope LOL.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Moved some of the Millenium Red Rainbows over to the 220, no filter will just do daily water changes as I will be doing them to clear out the tannins anyways. I think I will be movign this tank over to tap water. The Rainbows will do fine as well as the plants are suited to hard water as well. This will make thing super simple for maintence. I still have the ability to top off with RO if needed. I will also be selling ym mag 24 pump to pay for a Mag 12 with fractioning impeller, this will also let me sell off my CarbonDoser EXT5000s.

Craig


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Pix or it didn't happen! Lol what's the ph of the tank with all that rock?


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> I might think it would grow if I tucked the bulb into a rock crevice without substrate?


Yeah, I've grown it on driftwood before. It will appreciate water column dosing if you do that, but it isn't a necessity. My boss has grown it in jars before.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

zachary908 said:


> Yeah, I've grown it on driftwood before. It will appreciate water column dosing if you do that, but it isn't a necessity. My boss has grown it in jars before.


Think I have the perfect stump to attach it too.  you want to pm me payment info?

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Pix or it didn't happen! Lol what's the ph of the tank with all that rock?


Not sure local tap runs 7.8-8 so probably about the same once it balances out.


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Think I have the perfect stump to attach it too.  you want to pm me payment info?
> 
> Craig


Pm sent.


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## Floyd R Turbo (Apr 24, 2009)

Subscribing!

I am starting to feel bad for taking so long to build the sump, I kept a planted tank for a couple years but this build is killer! Glad to be a part of it!


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

kind of makes me want to ditch my filters and get a sump lmao


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Floyd R Turbo said:


> Subscribing!
> 
> I am starting to feel bad for taking so long to build the sump, I kept a planted tank for a couple years but this build is killer! Glad to be a part of it!


Glad to see you over here!



Jeromeit said:


> kind of makes me want to ditch my filters and get a sump lmao


LMAO I can tell you who to go to, shipping might be a bit expensive... :icon_eek:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Ordered some Mini Fissidens today from Nick. I think I want to use this on teh big trunk probably only on the left edges of the tree. Some will be fairly shaded some will get more light but it should look like old growth moss on the north side of a tree. Have lots of plants due in this week which should pretty much allow me to almost finish the planting. Ordered some more rocks hope they come in this week as well as I need more structure on the back right corner of the tank for the ferns and anubias to attach too. 

And on that note I will leave you with a few pictures...


































Craig


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Looks amazing. You should take a video some time.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> Looks amazing. You should take a video some time.


Video after all said and done...


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craig it looks like your tank could use some surface skimming :icon_mrgr

It's looking good though roud:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Craig it looks like your tank could use some surface skimming :icon_mrgr
> 
> It's looking good though roud:


It could, no filtration probably 2 weeks till the sump is up and running, just daily 95% waterchanges and my wavemaker. Figured this should rid the tank of most of the tannins by the time the sump is up and running.

Craig


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## sanj (Jan 11, 2004)

Very nice, I really like the scape... and for Rainbows too. All good.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So I am thinking I want to add CPOs to this tank. I would love to do shrimp but they jsut get decimated by the rainbows. I'm thinking CPOs should look nice/ have great color and big enough not to get eaten.

Thoughts?


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

What's a CPO? lol


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> What's a CPO? lol


http://cpo-crayfish.blogspot.com/


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

interesting....


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## nonconductive (Jan 29, 2010)

wow! very nice.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

the tank looks very nice


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

You will not see much of the cpo's with all that rockwork for them to hide in. They like to hide in cave like areas and with the rainbows in there I would think they wouldn't come out much. I would also be concerned that the rainbows would try to eat them even though they are bigger than shrimp they still would be a nice snack for the rainbows. They might not be able to eat them whole but they would most definitely pick at them until they died and then pick them apart.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> You will not see much of the cpo's with all that rockwork for them to hide in. They like to hide in cave like areas and with the rainbows in there I would think they wouldn't come out much. I would also be concerned that the rainbows would try to eat them even though they are bigger than shrimp they still would be a nice snack for the rainbows. They might not be able to eat them whole but they would most definitely pick at them until they died and then pick them apart.


 
That is what I was afraid of...


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

If you decide to go with some smaller schooling fish in the future I think the cpo's would have a better chance of survival but they would still hide in all that awesome rockwork you have. It might be something to consider if you ever get rid of the rainbows. It would look really cool seeing a bunch of cpo's coming in and out of the rocks.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> If you decide to go with some smaller schooling fish in the future I think the cpo's would have a better chance of survival but they would still hide in all that awesome rockwork you have. It might be something to consider if you ever get rid of the rainbows. It would look really cool seeing a bunch of cpo's coming in and out of the rocks.


Yeah I am tempted to try a breeding pair as they should be larger and see how they do. Still need to wait till the tank is all up and running as with doing daily 90% water changes not sure how they would like that.

Craig


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

I have to say that I would try a couple and see how they do but I love those red irian rainbows and they look absolutely beautiful when they reach maturity so I would for sure leave those in there for awhile.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

They are actually Millenium Reds, I do have a Trio of Irian Reds but will be selling the irians as I am trying to get back down to one single tank.


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Craig, have you gotten your barclaya yet? Tracking says it has arrived at your PO


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

zachary908 said:


> Craig, have you gotten your barclaya yet? Tracking says it has arrived at your PO


Nope I'm guessing it will be there tomorrow.


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Nope I'm guessing it will be there tomorrow.


Let me know how it looks when it arrives. I don't have a ton of experience shipping plants in warmer weather. I'm sure it will be fine though. In the event it comes in bad shape let me know, and I will get you a replacement.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Will do.


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

Craigthor said:


> They are actually Millenium Reds, I do have a Trio of Irian Reds but will be selling the irians as I am trying to get back down to one single tank.


What's the difference between irian reds and millenium reds?


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> What's the difference between irian reds and millenium reds?


Different Lakes. 

Irian Red - Glossolepis incisus
Millenium Red - Glossolepis pseudoincisus

Milleniums are susposed to get a nicer red coloration as well.


----------



## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

I see now. I must have had a millenium before because it was always alot redder than the others and just thought it was because it was more mature. They were sold to me as irians but had way more red as the others had a little red with the gold. Very pretty fish.


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## knuggs (Mar 5, 2007)

Wow!!! :drool: Been awhile since I checked this thread out. Looks like you have been busy! You have taking that to a whole notha level! Those Rainbows are huge! Your whole hardscape with the driftwood and rock is well....dam theres no word to really describe it but hats off sir!!! That is prolly the nicest hardscape I have seen!! It looks really natural!! roud:


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## thefisherman (Oct 15, 2011)

i have 200g + envy... is that soo wrong 

your tank is astonishing, i love it!


- thefisherman


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

thefisherman said:


> i have 200g + envy... is that soo wrong
> 
> your tank is astonishing, i love it!
> 
> ...


Nope nothing wrong with that.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


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## GMYukonon24s (May 3, 2009)

Ya that is a beautiful tank. Great size.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It's really looking good Craig but I would love to see under the hood, the sump photos were great but left me wanting more, if you get a chance I would love to see the final configuration.


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## manini (Oct 18, 2007)

Tank is looking awesome!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Lots of planting and glueing today. maybe some pics tonite when I can take some better pics.

Craig


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## manualfocus (Jun 15, 2011)

I saw this tank in person yesterday and it's a beast. Well done, Craig!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Looking great. You are going to be happy with slow growers in a tank that large.

How do you glue in a filled tank?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Hyzer said:


> Looking great. You are going to be happy with slow growers in a tank that large.
> 
> How do you glue in a filled tank?


Super glue gel can be used under water.


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## BoxxerBoyDrew (Oct 16, 2005)

FREAKIN' AWESOME!!!!!!

I LOVE EVERYTHING about this setup! I can't wait to see everything up and running! 

This is one of the BEST SETUPS I have ever seen BAR NONE!!!!!

AWESOME JOB!!!
Drew


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just quick update. Some decent pics, some not so nice...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Getting some pretty good melting on teh anubias, rhizomes look good jsu the leaves melting off. Figure this is due to new tank, new water parameters as I move this over to tap water and the not as blasting light that I had over teh 150 with the metal halides.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Did you get this tank new or get a deal on CL?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Did you get this tank new or get a deal on CL?


Paid $700 for it on a local forum, drove 8 hrs round trip to go get it. LOL It is 2 years old but only filled once and then put into storage, Inside of stand was completely tiled but I removed some of them an it even has a nice 4' light in it.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Got a local CL listing for a 200gal marine setup kinda like yours for $750, but no money in hand to make the deal.


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

Is that second picture Hymenopyllum sp.? If that is what it is I'm curious to see if that type of fern will survive long term submersed.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So I found a great deal on CPOs wondering if I should jump on them. 15 for $110 shipped...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> Is that second picture Hymenopyllum sp.? If that is what it is I'm curious to see if that type of fern will survive long term submersed.


Here is what it was bought as: *Hymenophyllaceae sp. Wayanad *the seller has been growing it for a bit but he is not sure that the name is correct. Such a cool looking plant I had to give it a run...


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## toksyn (Aug 15, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Here is what it was bought as: *Hymenophyllaceae sp. Wayanad *the seller has been growing it for a bit but he is not sure that the name is correct. Such a cool looking plant I had to give it a run...


Gaaaah that's on my must have list.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> So I found a great deal on CPOs wondering if I should jump on them. 15 for $110 shipped...


You should get them so you can see them running around without having your nose up against the glass.


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## DogFish (Jul 16, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> [censored]


Very nice start!!! You are my new 'scape hero! :hihi:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Tuesday is SUMP Day, woot the builder will be delviering it too me Tuesday morning. :icon_twis Hope to get it plumbed up either Tuesday afternoon or Wednesday morning. Probably end up needing bith days to get it up and running.

Rearranged a couple of rocks to give a bit more height on the left side and have to wait for more rock to come in to do the right side up. 

Got the carpet done with a ton of Mini Pellia now to do the forever wait as it grows out so slowly. 

More pics once I get the sump up and running.

Craig


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Love the design, this should look very natural the plants grow in. Really dig plants in the spaces between rocks.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

uhm people should go check this out....

http://www.greateriowareefsociety.o...Forums/tabid/78/aft/26502/afpg/2/Default.aspx

yeah I'm speachless right now...


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> uhm people should go check this out....
> 
> http://www.greateriowareefsociety.o...Forums/tabid/78/aft/26502/afpg/2/Default.aspx
> 
> yeah I'm speachless right now...


WOW, beyond serious skills with that guy. I am speechless and jealous.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> Love the design, this should look very natural the plants grow in. Really dig plants in the spaces between rocks.


Thanks now to get the Anubias to stay put and attach themselves to the rock.



2in10 said:


> WOW, beyond serious skills with that guy. I am speechless and jealous.


Seriously worth every penny I spent on this, he has gone above and beyond and this thing is amazing...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

moved a couple things around really need to wait for the rest of my rock to really settle the scape. The bolbitis will probably venture to the back right corner as that is where I had envisioned it to begin with. Moved a bit of A. Coffeefolia to its spot and moved the bolbitis over a bit and will watch and see.

I will be putting in some Java Fern 'Windelovii' and 'Philippine' as well not exactly sure as to which will go to which side but have some thoughts, again need more rock to finalize my decision.

Craig


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Wow. That sump is amazing. How much did it cost? Hopefully not as much as the tank? :hihi:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> Wow. That sump is amazing. How much did it cost? Hopefully not as much as the tank? :hihi:


A bit over $600 with tax. Not bad considering all the custom work. He posted the finished drip trays and is almost done with it. Will eb delivered tomorrow morning. Then I will figure out what I need for plumbing and get busy with it.


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## dewalltheway (Jan 19, 2005)

Craig.....do you have an insurance policy just for this tank??? Holy Cow!! The sump is sweet and love the look of the tank. Great job man!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

dewalltheway said:


> Craig.....do you have an insurance policy just for this tank??? Holy Cow!! The sump is sweet and love the look of the tank. Great job man!


 
Nope.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)




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## al4n (Nov 18, 2008)

I like the design of that sump! Sexy as


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## aXio (May 29, 2011)

I really like the rock work on your new scape. Very well done. Once the plants settle in it will look even better. And that is one nice shiny sump you have there! *grin*


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Damn thats sexy! It's gonna look so dirty with all the mulm and what not :hihi: 

Hook her up Craig!


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Hey Craig, can you break down te sump for us? I'm curious as to all the little connectors sticking out here and there. I assume they are probe holders, spots for dosing tubes and such?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Hey Craig, can you break down te sump for us? I'm curious as to all the little connectors sticking out here and there. I assume they are probe holders, spots for dosing tubes and such?


7 go to my dosing pump setup, 1 for my RO line/ ATO and one is for the CO2 connection for my fractioning pump. 

1.5" intake on each side that runs through a drip tray to 3- 4" filter socks. Heater bulkhead on each side with 200 watt heater in direct and constant flow. Heaters will be attached to a Ranco Heater controller. Water goes up through 30 PPI Poret foam then over another drip tray that will hold my Eheim SubstratPro from the 2 Eheim 2262s that were on teh old 150. Return is going to be run by a Mag Drive 18 with venturi and fractioning impeller. Drain in side of tank is designed for auto drain if I want to setup a continuous water chagne system. System is designed for easy access and and adjustments.


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

So is she going to fit in the cabinet without having to disturb the display tank? 

What was the reasoning for designing drip plates over the socks? Depending on the flow rate, I can see that introducing bypass of the sock traps.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

prototyp3 said:


> So is she going to fit in the cabinet without having to disturb the display tank?
> 
> What was the reasoning for designing drip plates over the socks? Depending on the flow rate, I can see that introducing bypass of the sock traps.


I'll be takign pics but the plan is set. The filter sock plates are removeable so I need teh drip trays to even out hte flow. Will only be running around 1000gph total through the sump which is split into 2 sides.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Great looking sump Craig. It looks like it can handle a huge bio load and should be very easy to maintain (easy like in hardly ever) :icon_mrgr


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## manualfocus (Jun 15, 2011)

I have no idea what's going on in that sump, even after that explanation. LOL.. I'm sure it's nice. Maybe one day I'll have one. One day..


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## 2wheelsx2 (Jan 27, 2006)

The sump looks great. My one concern is the drilled and bulkhead locations for the heaters. If one goes bad, you'd have to drain the sump and stop everything to replace it? I know it wouldn't be as clean, but you're not going to see it anyway, so why not just put them in conventionally with suction cups?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2wheelsx2 said:


> The sump looks great. My one concern is the drilled and bulkhead locations for the heaters. If one goes bad, you'd have to drain the sump and stop everything to replace it? I know it wouldn't be as clean, but you're not going to see it anyway, so why not just put them in conventionally with suction cups?


Sump is easy to drain and removing the bulkhead takes less the 5 minutes so not really all that much work. Lift the drip tray and fitler sock assembly out and pull the heater out. :icon_cool


----------



## 2wheelsx2 (Jan 27, 2006)

Craigthor said:


> Sump is easy to drain and removing the bulkhead takes less the 5 minutes so not really all that much work. Lift the drip tray and fitler sock assembly out and pull the heater out. :icon_cool


I see. Well thought out process already. Well, on to the completed setup then!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Tada!


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## EntoCraig (Jun 7, 2010)

Stunning tank!


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

What kind of fitting are used for the inputs on top?


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

How the heck is that stand supporting over a ton of tank across a 5' span on the front?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> How the heck is that stand supporting over a ton of tank across a 5' span on the front?


Tank only has a few inches of water and teh weight of a tank is supported at the corners.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Looks amazing. I am usually not a big fan of rock and wood (or dense wood scapes for that matter) but the amount of "detail" and "interest" is amazing. 

I know nothing about sumps but that looks crazy. I have only seen DIY sumps that look like they would be very hard to deal with over time. I am interested in a sump on my next tank so I will take notes.


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## dewalltheway (Jan 19, 2005)

Spend that much money and have that great of a looking sump and then hide it under the cabinet.....something not right with this pic :hihi:

Seriously....that sump looks awesome. I am not familiar with sumps and how they all work so if you get some time, please post some pics and info on its design. Also...what made you go with a sump design instead of canisters? Is it mainly so you can have all your equipment in the sump instead of the main tank? Also...what do you do in case of power failure....will sump overflow? I would like to understand the concept more and your sump is an awesome one to study. Thx for the info ahead of time!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Tank only has a few inches of water and teh weight of a tank is supported at the corners.


Oh yeah, duh... now I see the water line. I knew you were smart enough to take that pecaution. There would be load transference to the corners if the sides weren't supported too. However I still wouldn't want to try and support a full 220 gal tank only by its corners.


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## The Gipper (Sep 9, 2003)

Amazing as usual!
Before you went custom sump, did you look at the commercials sumps out there and have one you liked over others?


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

You should build a new stand. Like my 75 gallon stand. All open so you can see that artwork!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

The Gipper said:


> Amazing as usual!
> Before you went custom sump, did you look at the commercials sumps out there and have one you liked over others?


The Aqueon Pro sumps were what I was looking at if I went commercial, would have been cheaper but ddin't meet all my needs. I found something I liked about alot of sumps but not a one size fits all.



OverStocked said:


> You should build a new stand. Like my 75 gallon stand. All open so you can see that artwork!


I may soon, I tried to talk the wife into it but so far whe isn't biting. Also with all the plumbing under the stand it is nice that I can close the doors and hide the mess.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Spent about 6 hours working on the plumbing. Tight corners and not alot of room to work so it took a bit. Used some SPA flex and that stuff is nice though a bit of a pain to get to conform to some of the bends. Only had to redo 2 fittings one union and one 1.5 to 1" bushing so not bad. Did take 4 trips to Menards to get everything I needed to have. 

Got my Wave maker and Dosing Pump brackets mounted and they are in place. In a few hours I will run a leak test on the sump and plumbing to see where it sits and how it does.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Decided to test out the drains and filled the overflow box. Started to leak and upon closer inspection the the bulkhead that was included with the factory overflow had a crack in it. Drained the overflow box out and removed the standpipe. Tomorrow I will look locally in the am to see if I can find one locally, if not I will order a few to have around form bulkreefsupply as their ground shipping is overnight to me.

Craig


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

If you do plumbing rigid and clean lines it looks sexy! 

Show her hydrophytes stands, you could even do the option with removable doors or something to easily show it all off!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craig I sure hope you own your house as it would NOT be fun if you had to move all this.

Your sump build has given me a lot of great ideas when the time comes for me to build one.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Craig I sure hope you own your house as it would NOT be fun if you had to move all this.
> 
> Your sump build has given me a lot of great ideas when the time comes for me to build one.


Oh no I rent, 2nd story apartmetn with a great view.


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## manualfocus (Jun 15, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Oh no I rent, 2nd story apartmetn with a great view.


And a conveniently massive hallway.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Oh no I rent, 2nd story apartmetn with a great view.


You have an amazing land lord to let you put up such a large amount of water in your place :hihi:


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig your tank and sump looks great and I would hate to be installing all that stuff because I know how much work went into my plumbing and yours is way more complicated and really looks like it's tight under there, not to mention all the weight over your head while doing it.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Definitely a tight fit under there luckily I can jsut barely squeeze my head and 2 hands under to fanagle stuff around.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I was just reading back to my last post and gathering all the info about the sump and that is a sweet setup, then add the layout of wood, rocks, and plants to make this a super build as far as I'm concerned, wow what a nice job.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Thanks the last 109lbs of rock to finish the scape is headed my way from Screename today, hopefully it arrives by Saturday so I can finish the scape out and finalize a few places.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

How do you like planting and moving things around at 30 inches deep??? I guess with the build in height do to all the rocks and wood you have added makes it somewhat easier but just maneuvering all that stuff to the bottom had to be too much fun?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Not too bad, I have a couple of nice step stools that I use and a couple sets of long tongs which help, also going with slow growing setup will make a huge difference.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Craigthor said:


> Not too bad, I have a couple of nice step stools that I use and a couple sets of long tongs which help, also going with slow growing setup will make a huge difference.


It'll end up being a big trim once every 2-3 months or so.

It'll take time to develop and grow in nicely, but it'll be worth the end product.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> It'll end up being a big trim once every 2-3 months or so.
> 
> It'll take time to develop and grow in nicely, but it'll be worth the end product.


Thanks Tom, yeah that will be better then having to do weekly trimmings. Also all plants are in fairly high demand most of the time so selling off a few trimmings should be easy.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Power strip in - check
CO2 controller in - check
Ranco Temp controller in - check
Hydor wavemaker setup - check
BubbleMagus Dosing setup in - check
Light timers setup - check
Cords organized - not even close
Doser programed - nope
CO2 controller setup - nope


































































Craig


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Definitely digging this scape much more than the dutch! I can't wait to see the barclaya grow to it's full potential in here!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Thanks, thinking about putting a bit of Java Fern Philippine around the base of the big stump between the anubias nana and the Barclaya.


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## thefisherman (Oct 15, 2011)

craig man that tank is a beast! 


- thefisherman


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craig, how's the noise level with the sump running, compared to your two canisters?


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## dhg is my plant (Dec 19, 2010)

whoa amazing setup you got!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Craig, how's the noise level with the sump running, compared to your two canisters?


Sump isn't running yet found a cracked bulkhead when I was doing my overflow test. Of course not a single place within driving had one in. My replacements will be here tomorrow thanks to www.bulkreefsupply.com as ground shipping from them is overnight to my house. :icon_lol: I will replumb that bulkhead tomorrow and get it glued back up then will have to wait till Friday after work to test it out as I want to ensure everything that I glue tomorrow is setup all nice and dry.



thefisherman said:


> craig man that tank is a beast!
> 
> 
> - thefisherman





dhg is my plant said:


> whoa amazing setup you got!


Thanks, this has been an adventure that is draining the pocketbook fast. Atleast it is almost all done then i can kick it into auto pilot and sit back and relax.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> ...this has been an adventure that is draining the pocketbook fast. Atleast it is almost all done then i can kick it into auto pilot and sit back and relax.Craig


Yeah, right :wink:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Yeah, right :wink:


LOL I jsut need someone to come put the last shipment of rock into the tank for me. It's only about 110lbs worth... :biggrin:

Total Hardscape weight:

363 lbs of rock
80 lbs or wood
10 lbs of slate tile


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

What are you all going to dose that you need 7 dosing outlets?


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> LOL I jsut need someone to come put the last shipment of rock into the tank for me. It's only about 110lbs worth... :biggrin:
> 
> Total Hardscape weight:
> 
> ...


'Bout the same as the dry weight of your tank. Don't think you're gonna just drain out the water to ever move that beast to another home. :icon_eek: :help:

If this tank isn't a dream come true, I don't know what is.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> What are you all going to dose that you need 7 dosing outlets?


Probably not all will be used but that is that my dosign pump setup has so that is what I went for.


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## Floyd R Turbo (Apr 24, 2009)

Lookin good! Too bad about the bulkhead.

How did you re-attach the center brace to the bottom frame with the sump in there? Did you set the sump up on something so you could get a hammer in there or what?

I can't wait to see this up and running...


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Floyd R Turbo said:


> Lookin good! Too bad about the bulkhead.
> 
> How did you re-attach the center brace to the bottom frame with the sump in there? Did you set the sump up on something so you could get a hammer in there or what?
> 
> I can't wait to see this up and running...


clamped, gorilla glue and a couple staples to hold it till the glue set, stronger then when I took it apart.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Craigthor said:


> Probably not all will be used but that is that my dosign pump setup has so that is what I went for.


I'd only use 2, this is all anyone really might need.

The only two things folks do not mix are PO4 and Fe chelate.

So you can use the macros and add Excel.
Then traces with a little Excel to kill any fungus.

You do not need to dose much or anything else.

You will spend most of the time cleaning the sponge(2-3 months) and the bag filters(1-4 weeks), and .....also the prefilter over flow sponges(weekly).


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> I'd only use 2, this is all anyone really might need.
> 
> The only two things folks do not mix are PO4 and Fe chelate.
> 
> ...


Yep I will be using a few of the dosers, but left myself room to grow:

Rootmedic Macro
Rootmedic Micro
Rootmedic Glut
Tropica TPN+

I will be dosing PPS Pro on this tank as I think I can get away with it. 

I am hoping to borrow the local salt clubs new PAR Meter soon so I can see where the tank sets as far as light intensity

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I do have the sump up and running for a test run. The fractioning pump is runnging a tone of bubbles into te tank but with the sponges clearing all the air out and the CO2 running full blast I expect this for the next couple of days. 

This weekend I will tear down the 2262s and get the bio media rinsed and into the sump and get all the millions of cords organized.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Spent a couple of hours running some line for the doing pumps, setting them up and got most of the cords all organized. Still a few things to tidy up but overall I'm pleased with the new setup.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)




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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

Craigthor said:


> Craig


Dang! That's gonna be epic if you can let it grow in. lol


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

oldpunk78 said:


> Dang! That's gonna be epic if you can let it grow in. lol


That is the plan, some of the coffeefolina on the left will go to the right as soon as I get the last of my hardscape rock in. I was hoping it would arrive today but alas it didn't so no I hope it comes on Monday.


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Looking good, craig! I think some bolbitis would look nice behind the large piece of wood on the right.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

zachary908 said:


> Looking good, craig! I think some bolbitis would look nice behind the large piece of wood on the right.


I've got something planned for there just need to get the funds to buy a sampling of the plant....


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> I've got something planned for there just need to get the funds to buy a sampling of the plant....


Can't wait to see what it is!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Ah new tank syndrome gotta love it. Diatoms, GSA, GDA, wood fungus, got it all going on right now. The plants are slowly starting to adjust to the new setup an starting to die less and get more green to them. 

One of three boxes of rock arrived today hopefully the other 2 come tomorrow so I can finish my scape, I may be grabbing a bag of black lava rock for the large open space to help support the rest fo the rock coming in and to give another spot for good bacteria to grow on.

Working out the details of my Auto Top Off system and hope to finalize that over the next month or so.

Stock list will be:

14 Millenium Red Rainbows (6 males/ 8 females)
15-20 CPOs to start
100 Blue Ramshorns 
12-20 Green Horned Nerites

Would like to eventually get a shrimp species going in the tank if possible but that will be after I get things settled in.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

> 12-20 Green Horned Nerites


How are these when it comes to spamming up the wood and rocks with those white eggs?
My zebra and redspot nerites really spammed up my tank. 3 months since they've died and still have some eggs left on the manzanita


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## BlueJack (Apr 15, 2011)

Awesome!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> How are these when it comes to spamming up the wood and rocks with those white eggs?
> My zebra and redspot nerites really spammed up my tank. 3 months since they've died and still have some eggs left on the manzanita


I'm hoping the Rainbows and CPOs like eggs... :hihi:



BlueJack said:


> Awesome!


Thanks this has been an adventure! roud:


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> I'm hoping the Rainbows and CPOs like eggs... :hihi:


If they don't, those eggs will last several months. Even with my 3 wood scrubin' plecos, I've still got some eggs left. The dead snail shells are dissolving faster than those eggs.


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## VadimShevchuk (Sep 19, 2009)

Just read your whole thread and that sump is one sexy beast! Glad you went with the fern, wood/rock combo then a dutch tank.


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## Bananariot (Feb 28, 2012)

I'm sure you get this alot but is your town THE cedar rapids the movie was about?


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

I love it!!!


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## cordero01 (Mar 23, 2012)

just read the entire thread today, really nice and hard work! have you had a the PAR measure, what heaters are those JAGER? whats the next step for the tank?


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## WhiskeyD (May 10, 2009)

How did you do your overflows? I'm having a hard time growing anything in my 180 gallon and I'm sure it has to do with my overflows and sump. Thanks


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

orchidman said:


> I love it!!!


:icon_mrgr



cordero01 said:


> just read the entire thread today, really nice and hard work! have you had a the PAR measure, what heaters are those JAGER? whats the next step for the tank?


Jager heaters and as soon as I can borrow the PAR meter from the local salt club I'll post some numbers.



WhiskeyD said:


> How did you do your overflows? I'm having a hard time growing anything in my 180 gallon and I'm sure it has to do with my overflows and sump. Thanks


Just standard Durso Standpipes 1.5" plumbing covered sump and return back via needle wheel pump.

Craig


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## WhiskeyD (May 10, 2009)

ok thanks! Does you water fall any as it enters the overflow? Mine falls about 1/2" and I think its off gasing my co2.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So I was a good and kept the wallet shut at the local club meeting last night. LOL We had Ted Judy of Ted's Fishroom in t ospeak and he brought in some awesome Rainbows from his sponsor to auction off. Had a bag of really nice Kamaka Rainbows and I so wanted them. Even stressed they were completely beautiful but I refrained from adding any more fish top the tank...


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Since you have new tank syndrome, are you going to get the clean up crew in place soon after you finish the scape?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Since you have new tank syndrome, are you going to get the clean up crew in place soon after you finish the scape?


Ramshorns in today, Nerites probably next week should be in, was given about 50 juvie cherries at the club meeting last night and put in (not ssure they will alst but they were really low grade culls for testing purposes) and I will have some CPOs probably next week as well.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Only problem with those low grade RCS is getting rid of them once they infest the tank like roaches. Anything you put in to eat them would eat higher grade shrimp too. Your wallet must be so light by now that you could use it as an anti-gravity device LOL.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Only problem with those low grade RCS is getting rid of them once they infest the tank like roaches. Anything you put in to eat them would eat higher grade shrimp too. Your wallet must be so light by now that you could use it as an anti-gravity device LOL.


 
See I'm not concerned with what the shrimp look like as long as they do there job. I'm more about the natural selectioon side of things... :biggrin:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Wallet what wallet I'm pretty sure it is all dried up now that I ordered the last of my plants this week. lol


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

Don't expect those shrimp to last long. My rainbows dominated the shrimp I threw in there... twice. I tried larger ones the second time and they still ripped them up. The second group lasted a lot longer but they were hiding more than cleaning. 

Bad news is my Irian Red male was the worst of the 9 rainbows I have at hunting them down any time he saw them moving. I know you have millenniums but they aren't that different. 

I've considered buying like 300 low grade all at once and then throwing them all in. I figure the rainbows will have their fill and then hopefully the population will be big enough and breed enough that they'd sustain their numbers.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

rockwood said:


> Don't expect those shrimp to last long. My rainbows dominated the shrimp I threw in there... twice. I tried larger ones the second time and they still ripped them up. The second group lasted a lot longer but they were hiding more than cleaning.
> 
> Bad news is my Irian Red male was the worst of the 9 rainbows I have at hunting them down any time he saw them moving. I know you have millenniums but they aren't that different.
> 
> I've considered buying like 300 low grade all at once and then throwing them all in. I figure the rainbows will have their fill and then hopefully the population will be big enough and breed enough that they'd sustain their numbers.


If they last halfway decently I've considered wholesaleing about 500 of them and dumping them all in at once. LOL


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

My thoughts exactly. 

My next scape is probably going to require shrimp to help pick through everything. The girlfriend is freaking out saying I can't get rid of the rainbows... so I'm kind of stuck. I might have to buy my roommates 65g early and throw them in there


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

You've got it all now and it looks great and executed very neatly, when you go on vacation I can control your tank via my desktop!!! I feel inadequate as I just had a hose out my office window to do a water change.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> You've got it all now and it looks great and executed very neatly, when you go on vacation I can control your tank via my desktop!!! I feel inadequate as I just had a hose out my office window to do a water change.


LOL nope no internet access to my tank, as much as that is a cool feature don't see it as a necessity. I prefer not to put all my eggs in one basket as far as controllers go.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

A quick phone video:

http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/...sformation/?action=view&current=VIDEO0007.mp4

Enjoy


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

It looks like you got your rocks in the back right. It looks amazing! Kudos to you!


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## Assassynation (Dec 23, 2011)

That is one sweet tank you have there... subscribed!


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## FISTER_ (Apr 8, 2012)

That is SEXY. It got my wife jealous.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

More pics...


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

You know... you're supposed to fill the tank with water... not rocks. 

This is a very neat scape. Is there any soil in there at all or just rock?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> You know... you're supposed to fill the tank with water... not rocks.
> 
> This is a very neat scape. Is there any soil in there at all or just rock?


 
Nope completely substrate free with just rock and wood. Mini Pellia foreground glued to a bunch of slate pieces.

More water then one would think... :biggrin:


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Haha, how refreshing it must be to know you'll never have to scoop sand outta there. Hope your back is up to it though! How many pounds of rock in there? I'm guessing 300# or so?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Haha, how refreshing it must be to know you'll never have to scoop sand outta there. Hope your back is up to it though! How many pounds of rock in there? I'm guessing 300# or so?


About 365lbs of rock and 80ish lbs of Manzanita :icon_mrgr


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

My lord. That rock would cost me $1460 shipped at $2.50 per pound. I think I'm gonna lose my lunch.

I cant wait to see it in 6 months when everything has grown out a bit.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

I hope your bottom pane has more than edge support.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> My lord. That rock would cost me $1460 shipped at $2.50 per pound. I think I'm gonna lose my lunch.
> 
> I cant wait to see it in 6 months when everything has grown out a bit.


 
Yeah about there for all the hardscape materials.... roud:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> I hope your bottom pane has more than edge support.


Nothing to worry about.


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgEwEiTyYcs

I bet the glass will hold just fine, although Craig's may not be tempered.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgEwEiTyYcs
> 
> I bet the glass will hold just fine, although Craig's may not be tempered.


Tempered probably not, just under 3/4" thick though. :red_mouth


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> I hope your bottom pane has more than edge support.


The bottom glass can't tell the difference between a thousand pounds of sand, a thousand pounds of rock, or a thousand pounds of water. It will be just fine.


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## manini (Oct 18, 2007)

Tank looks great! Cant wait to see the tank fills. It will be awesome!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

manini said:


> Tank looks great! Cant wait to see the tank fills. It will be awesome!


All thanks to you. roud:


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

OverStocked said:


> The bottom glass can't tell the difference between a thousand pounds of sand, a thousand pounds of rock, or a thousand pounds of water. It will be just fine.


Rock is heavier than the water it displaces, so there will be more weight overall than a few inches of substrate. Maybe it isn't going to be a problem in this case as reefers also put in a lot of rock mass, but it's something to consider when doing a massive rock hardscape. That egg crate will go a long way towards preventing any focused pressure points on the bottom pane.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Craigthor said:


> If they last halfway decently I've considered wholesaleing about 500 of them and dumping them all in at once. LOL


I have perhaps 500 Fires in my 120 Gal and had 35 NG Rainbows.......never saw them eat one.


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## rockwood (Jun 19, 2010)

plantbrain said:


> I have perhaps 500 Fires in my 120 Gal and had 35 NG Rainbows.......never saw them eat one.


Aren't NG Rainbows more of a "dwarf" rainbow? I know my rainbows (bosemani, irian, turquoise and another kind) all dominated the cherry culls and both sets of amanos I put in.


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## knuggs (Mar 5, 2007)

Ridiculous! This tank overwhelms me, especially the more I see and hear about it! I could only imagine what it looks like in person. Hope to see a vid sometime, that would be the bees knees!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Craigthor said:


> A quick phone video:
> 
> http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/...sformation/?action=view&current=VIDEO0007.mp4
> 
> Enjoy


Ask and you shall receive... :help:


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## knuggs (Mar 5, 2007)

:drool: Amazing!! Thank you sir!

How many fish do you have in there? I think if you dumped 500 shrimp in that tank they wouldnt have any problem keeping a colony as much rocks, plants, cracks, and hiding spots there are. Would be a great snack for them as well. Once shrimp learn there enviorment they will adapt and learn safe spots and find places for nurseries for lil shrimplets. I rarely see my Ornates eat them though.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

knuggs said:


> :drool:
> 
> How many fish do you have in there? I think if you dumped 500 shrimp in that tank they wouldnt have any problem keeping a colony as much rocks, plants, cracks, and hiding spots there are. Would be a great snack for them as well. Once shrimp learn there enviorment they will adapt and learn safe spots and find places for nurseries for lil shrimplets.


13 Millenium Reds (5 males/ 8 females) 

I have contemplated getting an import of shrimp that size if I can find a decent price on them. I will also be putting in 15-20 CPOs as they should be more resilient and slightly lager bodied so the rainbows will hopefully leave them alone more.

Craig


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## Kathyy (Feb 22, 2010)

I suspect shrimp would just hide out below the rocks and keep it squeaky clean down there. I killed them all but while they lived cherry shrimp cleaned up all the mulm in the part of the sump they were in.

The rock and wood work with the plants growing in the crevices is amazing. Love the Millennium Rainbows in there.


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## wabisabi (Jan 31, 2011)

Amazing! The hardscape now looks 'complete' with the added stone in the right corner. This tank is epic!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craig the massive scale with the detailed layout of your tank is the most amazing one I've ever seen. It looks good across the room and yet you can spend hours scouring all the nooks and crannies and discover new things every day as this grows in. I don't know if I'd ever attempt one like it, but it definitely inspires me to try some day.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

wabisabi said:


> Amazing! The hardscape now looks 'complete' with the added stone in the right corner. This tank is epic!


Thanks that is what I was going for. roud:



audioaficionado said:


> Craig the massive scale with the detailed layout of your tank is the most amazing one I've ever seen. It looks good across the room and yet you can spend hours scouring all the nooks and crannies and discover new things every day as this grows in. I don't know if I'd ever attempt one like it, but it definitely inspires me to try some day.


That it is, I wish pictures could capture the depth and detail that is going on. Should be a real sight once the Anubias' all green back out. Seeing lots of new growth now it is just a wait and see time.

Craig


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## ChadRamsey (Nov 3, 2011)

Craig, i brewed a pot of coffee and drank the entire thing reading this thread. What amazing attention to detail. This tank is beyond spectacular!

You get a standing ovation on this one my friend!roud:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Think I may have found a fish more suited to this tank. Melantoneia Bosemani 'Aytinjo' found some on Aquabid that come from Gary Langs stock and have some stunning coloration. Also these stay slightly smaller then the normal run of the mill Bosemanis' with a max length around 3ish inches.

Craig


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## zachary908 (Feb 12, 2011)

I shipped your package out this morning, Craig! You should have tracking in email, if not PM me.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Think I may have found a fish more suited to this tank. *Melantoneia Bosemani 'Aytinjo'* found some on Aquabid that come from Gary Langs stock and have some stunning coloration. Also these stay slightly smaller then the normal run of the mill Bosemanis' with a max length around 3ish inches.
> Craig


Tried that term on Google images. Didn't give me anything.

How do your 'Avtinjo' variety colors differ from the Melantoneia Boesemani I did find? Some had stripes and some didn't. Nice looking fish either way.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Tried that term on Google images. Didn't give me anything.
> 
> How do your 'Avtinjo' variety colors differ from the Melantoneia Boesemani I did find? Some had stripes and some didn't. Nice looking fish either way.


http://rainbow-fish.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2166

There are a few collection points with slightly different coloring. There is some nice video in the thread above that I found.

Craig


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

I've noticed that avtinjos look completely different in colour, as if they were painted in a different style. To me, the run of the mill boesmani looks like typical shiney fish colours, with the sparkle to it. The avtinjo variety looks like the colour is actually pastels. It's much softer looking, very neat. Both varieties will look stunning.

It's amazing how many breeds there are, and on top of that all the various geographically variations.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Hey Craig - Ever thought about putting Whisker Shrimp in there? They are a bit larger than normal shrimp and I have them in my tank with my Boesemani's and have no problems with them. I have 5 of them in my tank and they keep breeding but haven't seen any mature. I also don't have as much cover as you do though so they should be able to continuously breed. Tank is amazing! Can't wait to see it grow in!


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

amazing set up, just read from the beginning. 
wow, i feel poor just watching how much money you've invested in this!!!

keep updating it!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

JEden8 said:


> Hey Craig - Ever thought about putting Whisker Shrimp in there? They are a bit larger than normal shrimp and I have them in my tank with my Boesemani's and have no problems with them. I have 5 of them in my tank and they keep breeding but haven't seen any mature. I also don't have as much cover as you do though so they should be able to continuously breed. Tank is amazing! Can't wait to see it grow in!


I really like the neos but I have that worked out now I believe.



monkeyruler90 said:


> amazing set up, just read from the beginning.
> wow, i feel poor just watching how much money you've invested in this!!!
> 
> keep updating it!


Thanks, also don't feel poor. If you look at what our family spends money on you would see we don't have a tv so don't pay cable, rent movies, go out drinking, don't smoke, spend on misc material things that is how we afford this setup.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

I don't smoke, drink (except an occasional beer at home), or subscribe to cable/satellite and I'm still too poor for your setup, but I'm really enjoying this build. Gives me ideas on how to do something similar on a smaller scale. We can hardly wait until it grows in and you get it populated.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig I've been meaning to ask who makes those heaters you are using in your sump and do they come with the bulk head fittings or are those a separate purchase? I am setting up my RO/DI unit (finally) and I would like to use that heater in my holding tank (55 gallon white plastic drum) instead of just dropping one in from the top.

Also I've been installing the drain and fill plumbing so I'll be able to do water changes with just a turn of a valve to empty the tank and about the same to fill it, well yesterday I got the drain portion finished and I got to try it today. I emptied 65 gallons of water onto my front lawn in 9 minutes and I had to use the Python hose to do the refill but it was still less than 30 minutes for the the whole water change, I used 3/4 inch cpvc at the smallest point and I was just amazed at how fast it drained, I actually went out front and looked for fish swimming in the deep edge on my flower beds but they were smart enough to stay clear of the inlet strainer.

I also save for my purchases and buy items I'll need to build something and hold them for some time before I get to do the install, this RO/DI unit is a prime example. I bought the 6 stage unit from BRS last summer and then had to wait to purchase pipe and fittings, pumps, etc. and now I'm getting close to having everything so I can start the install with only the heater and some misc. items left before it will be complete.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Craig I've been meaning to ask who makes those heaters you are using in your sump and do they come with the bulk head fittings or are those a separate purchase? I am setting up my RO/DI unit (finally) and I would like to use that heater in my holding tank (55 gallon white plastic drum) instead of just dropping one in from the top.
> 
> Also I've been installing the drain and fill plumbing so I'll be able to do water changes with just a turn of a valve to empty the tank and about the same to fill it, well yesterday I got the drain portion finished and I got to try it today. I emptied 65 gallons of water onto my front lawn in 9 minutes and I had to use the Python hose to do the refill but it was still less than 30 minutes for the the whole water change, I used 3/4 inch cpvc at the smallest point and I was just amazed at how fast it drained, I actually went out front and looked for fish swimming in the deep edge on my flower beds but they were smart enough to stay clear of the inlet strainer.


Heaters are EBo Jagers, the bulkheads aren't included but can be purchased through Jehmco.com not the cheapest things but I really like them and find them well worth the money

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

My holding tank is in my garage and will be exposed to colder temps in the winter so I oversized the heater to 200 watts instead of a 150 watt model, I also just called Jehmco and a very nice lady said the 1" bulkhead adapter fit the Ebo-Jager heaters but I wanted to check with you to see if that sound right as she was a little unsure in manner. Thanks for the help.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

yep 1" is it, if you order the heater from them as well they test fit it out for you as well.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Thanks for the help, I ordered a 300 watt heater and the bulk head adapter and with shipping only $55 or so, not too bad IMO and he gave me some free info and advised I raise my holding tank off of the concrete floor with some thick styrofoam and plywood so the concrete doesn't suck the heat out of the water in the winter, thanks again.

BTW I thought they had really fair prices, the heaters only increased $1 per 50 watts, so a 300 watt was only $3.50 more than the 150 watt, not bad.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

You can get that white or pink Styrofoam board from Lowe's, Home Depot, etc. Some rimless large tank builders spec that for their glass tanks so it should easily work for your purposes and it's inexpensive. What are you going to insulate the sides and top with?


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig I took a good look around their site and it's a good find, they have tons of great deals on bulk filter media, breeding supplies, and a lot more. Their call and order is a bit unusual but it works.

Steve I'm not going to work about any insulation and if I do it will just be a thin 1/4" to make the thermal break from the floor but I'm hoping the heater is large enough to keep the water at 75 degrees and with double the wattage I think it will work and may even bring up the room temperature a half degree, if I'm lucky.


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## knuggs (Mar 5, 2007)

Craigthor said:


> http://rainbow-fish.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2166
> 
> There are a few collection points with slightly different coloring. There is some nice video in the thread above that I found.
> 
> Craig


Great link!!! Didnt know this existed. :red_mouth and now they have a new member


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## Jim_PA (Aug 26, 2011)

Craig,
Today the first time I had to look at your new tank journal. It very very nice. I do have a question though, what type of bio media are you using?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jim_PA said:


> Craig,
> Today the first time I had to look at your new tank journal. It very very nice. I do have a question though, what type of bio media are you using?


Eheim SubstratPro and Eheim EhfiMech.


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## starfire12 (Aug 13, 2009)

Craigthor I would have to say that is one awesome tank you can come and rescape my 46 bowfront for me. HaHa. What kind of plants do you have in there, and would you be willing to sell any of them.?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

starfire12 said:


> Craigthor I would have to say that is one awesome tank you can come and rescape my 46 bowfront for me. HaHa. What kind of plants do you have in there, and would you be willing to sell any of them.?


Nothing currently for sale but someday once they really grow out. Species are:

Anubias Nana
Anubias Nana 'Petite'
Anubias Coffeefolia
Anubias Gasser

Bolbitus Heudolotti
Boblitus Mini
Bolbitus Gua Agin

Java Fern 'Trident'
Java Fern Philippine
Java Fern 'Red'
Java Fern Windelov
Java Fern Narrow/ Needle Leaf
Java Fern Super Trident

Mini Pellia
Mini Fissidens

If you cover round trip travel, food, lodging plus supply the scaping materials I'm game to come scape your tank.

Craig


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

How is that Hymenopyllum sp. doing? I think that looks like a neat plant but still want to see how it does submersed long term.


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## starfire12 (Aug 13, 2009)

Thanks but right now I do not have the funds it would be nice though. Let me know when you have some plants for sale. Again that is one nice tank.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> How is that Hymenopyllum sp. doing? I think that looks like a neat plant but still want to see how it does submersed long term.


Some is still holding on but as I have harder water it isn't holdign out as well. I believe this plant needs softer water, tons of light and co2 to push it to grow properly.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Water change, check
Remove Rhizo outbreak, mostly check
Up ferts and carbo plus dosing, check


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

One of the salty guys stopped by with the par meter today and here is what we came up with. Numbers were really consistant from left to right and up and down on both side. Readings were taken with an Apogee Meter lights suspended about 4.5" over the top of the tank.

2 bulbs on - 1 Giesemann AquaFlora : 1 Giesemann Midday

right under water surface: 110
half way down tank: 60
right on bottom glass: 25

4 bulbs on - 1 Giesemann AquaFlora : 1 Giesemann Midday : 1 ATI Blue Special : 1 GE Starcoat 6500k

right under water surface: 175
half way down tank: 80
right on bottom glass: 50

6 bulbs on - 2 Giesemann AquaFlora : 2 Giesemann Midday : 1 ATI Blue Special : 1 GE Starcoat 6500k

right under water surface: 280
half way down tank: 100
right on bottom glass: 70

This was based on a Current Nova Extreme 12x 39 watt T5HO with 6 bulbs over each half the tank. The tank is 30" tall with the light about 4.5" over the tank top.

So with my 2 bulbs on each side turned on I have plently of par to keep low light at the very bottom with more further up if I wanted to keep something slightly more demanding.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

You could also do a nice midday burst without incurring an algae bloom.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> You could also do a nice midday burst without incurring an algae bloom.


Once everything is settled in I may consider it for a couple of hours midday.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Got a little picture happy trying out the new camera. Don't mind the algae, recovering Anubias', etc... They show up so much more with the new camera.






























































































































































































































































Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Boy does photobucket kill teh pic quality...


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## Lil' Swimz$ (Jul 24, 2010)

Wow. This thing will be beast once the anubias bounces back and everything grows in, although it's pretty beast now!!! The CPO is so cute in the rocks.


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

This tank is sick. I would challenge ANY marine enthusiast that this tank would be as picturesque as any of the best coral reef tanks out there, hands down.

Nice job Craig!!  Even with the dead anubias!


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lol man I wanna sleep in there haha


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Got a little picture happy trying out the new camera.
> Craig


So what lens did you end up getting with your Canon T3i?


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

You probably mentioned this but I'm too lazy to look but why did the anubias melt so much? It was like a genocide of anubias leaves


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## Kathyy (Feb 22, 2010)

Wow. So nice to be able to see your vision this time. Love the photos, especially the ones with the mini Bolbitis and wood creeping between the rocks. Just amazing.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Thanks guys will reply tonite when I return home from work.

Craig


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Awesome setup man. Really nice job!
If I may make a simple suggestion regarding your photos?
If you were to add a single space between the img codes when you're uploading them, they wouldn't "blend" together on the page and would be much easier to decipher what's going on in each individual picture...
Keep up the good work man!!!

:thumbsup:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Lil' Swimz$ said:


> Wow. This thing will be beast once the anubias bounces back and everything grows in, although it's pretty beast now!!! The CPO is so cute in the rocks.


Thanks



crazydaz said:


> This tank is sick. I would challenge ANY marine enthusiast that this tank would be as picturesque as any of the best coral reef tanks out there, hands down.
> 
> Nice job Craig!! Even with the dead anubias!


:thumbsup:



Jeromeit said:


> Lol man I wanna sleep in there haha


For the low low price of one million dollars... lol



audioaficionado said:


> So what lens did you end up getting with your Canon T3i?


Came with the 18-55 and the 55-250 telephoto



jkan0228 said:


> You probably mentioned this but I'm too lazy to look but why did the anubias melt so much? It was like a genocide of anubias leaves


Happened after moving from super high light, co2, ferts and super soft water to hard water, low light, lower CO2 and lower fert dosing



Kathyy said:


> Wow. So nice to be able to see your vision this time. Love the photos, especially the ones with the mini Bolbitis and wood creeping between the rocks. Just amazing.






roybot73 said:


> Awesome setup man. Really nice job!
> If I may make a simple suggestion regarding your photos?
> If you were to add a single space between the img codes when you're uploading them, they wouldn't "blend" together on the page and would be much easier to decipher what's going on in each individual picture...
> Keep up the good work man!!!
> ...


Done!


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## TexasCichlid (Jul 12, 2011)

Absolutely terrific job. I love the massive scale and the low light plants.


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## thefisherman (Oct 15, 2011)

craig your tank is outstanding! are you using holey rock? are you running a hardwater for this setup?


- thefisherman


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Your new tank is looking very nice Craig and filling in nicely too.

I got my order from Jehmco today and the shipping was dirt cheap at $6.05, I also got a 10 x 18 piece of filter fabric that made 2 x 2217 fine filter pads with tons left over for nano HOB filter pads for $4.50 and I was just impressed with the prices and quality from these folks.


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

<----Jealous....


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## zergling (May 16, 2007)

Very nice par readings Craig! IMO, high enough for any plant you want to try, but still manageable.

For a while I was derping around with 110 at the lowest part of the substrate. Crazy good plant growth, but stupid high light requires stupid high CO2. I'm aiming for half of that now, LOL!


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig I sent you a pm asking for help with RO water mixing and introducing it to the fish for the first time. I finally got the RO system filled and was lucky to have no leaks anywhere but I can't see if the heater is working, I guess the bulkhead must hide the on indicator, or can you see yours?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Few updated pics, the kiddo got in on the photo shoot as well. lol.






















































































































Craig


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## manualfocus (Jun 15, 2011)

Looks awesome, Craig.


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Your kid is never going to forget that tank. I've spent my whole life trying to recreate a tank I saw when I was a kid.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

manualfocus said:


> Looks awesome, Craig.


Thanks



jcgd said:


> Your kid is never going to forget that tank. I've spent my whole life trying to recreate a tank I saw when I was a kid.


His favorite are the CPOs in the tank as the ycome out to play randomly.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

That is amazing Craig


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

10/10


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## Lil' Swimz$ (Jul 24, 2010)

Yay for growth!~


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

talontsiawd said:


> That is amazing Craig


Thanks



!shadow! said:


> 10/10






Lil' Swimz$ said:


> Yay for growth!~


Just a bit.

Well I did my waterchange last night. Did a 75% this week as the tannins really seemed to be soaking out this last week. Ran out of CO2 on Saturday and had no CO2 for 3 days. No algae showed up so I am going to experiment with running even less CO2 on my system. Since our local tap has a fairly high PH, 8.1-8.2, when it off gasses but is fairly soft with a gh of 5-7 and a kh of 3-5 depending on the time of the year I want to play with more PPS style dosing and fewer water changes. Plants seemed to show no stress from teh lack of CO2 in the system and this may be a good thing.

On the plus side I have tons of berried cherries, the CPO's are suepr active and adventuresome and intereact well. The Blue Ramshorns have been reproducing like mad and may have to introduce a handful of Assassin snails eventually. 

Moved a few plants around to change the structure look and have some Lagenandra coming in today hopefully to add a touch more color to the tank. Also playing around with some Hygroza Ariostata for a nice floating plant in there. Mini Pellia is starting to rebound finally but will be a long time to color and fill in I'm sure.

Maybe I will break the camera out later today and snap some more pics.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)




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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Fantastic tank, great scape work


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## Tyger (Dec 9, 2010)

*Awesome!*

Craig,

I cannot wait to see the Lagenandra. One of my all time favorite plants (along with C. nurii). I am looking forward to seeing the Hygroza Ariostata grow out. It will be interesting to see whether or not your Assassin population takes off and out stripes Rams. Keep up the good work!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Tyger said:


> Craig,
> 
> I cannot wait to see the Lagenandra. One of my all time favorite plants (along with C. nurii). I am looking forward to seeing the Hygroza Ariostata grow out. It will be interesting to see whether or not your Assassin population takes off and out stripes Rams. Keep up the good work!
> 
> ...


 
I'll take a few pics today, the one speciemen is super huge but hte leaves didn't fare well in shipping then another much smaller specimen that is tucked in the middle of the ampitheater and should create a stunning layout once it grows out.

Not 100% certain I'll keep the Barclaya Reds as they atre growing but not vertically and kind of disappear in the back, may end up changing them out for more lagenandra in the end but I will give them more time to see if they will do there thing


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## Tyger (Dec 9, 2010)

Lagenandra can be super resilient. After transplant I find leaves will sometimes melt though the rhizomes will sprout new leaves. It is critical, as I am sure you know, for Lagenandra rhizome to be exposed to light or they will die out.


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## Lichard (Jan 24, 2012)

Just got through this thread and I gotta say, your scape is awesome.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Lichard said:


> Just got through this thread and I gotta say, your scape is awesome.


Thanks


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## Em85 (Apr 16, 2009)

Lichard said:


> Just got through this thread and I gotta say, your scape is awesome.


Agreed!

How do you reach the bottom of that tank though??


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Em85 said:


> Agreed!
> 
> How do you reach the bottom of that tank though??


I've got a little step stool I stand on and can pretty much reach the bottom if I have to


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

This tank remains "pimp-tastic," Craig. I wish I could see it in person! 

Is the anubias die-off tapering yet?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> This tank remains "pimp-tastic," Craig. I wish I could see it in person!
> 
> Is the anubias die-off tapering yet?


It has they are slowly re establishing themselves but I try not to take pictures as it isn't all pretty like.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just curious on how much purigen I would need for my tank? Still have some tannins but trying to get away from teh huge water changes in this lightly stocked tank but need something to clear the wataer up. 

Total water volume is about 250g of water give or take a bit.

Craig


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

That's pretty amazing, to me at least, that you can fit 250 gallons of water into a 220 gallon tank! You'll have to teach that to me sometime!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> That's pretty amazing, to me at least, that you can fit 250 gallons of water into a 220 gallon tank! You'll have to teach that to me sometime!


Got a 70g sump under the stand LOL :flick:


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Heard it was 1ml per gallon? I think? So one 500ml bottle should do. I use about that much myself lol


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

LOL I'm thinking about putting one of these together Purigen Reactor and running it off of my 3rd output under my stand. I have the valve port and a spot to return on the side of the sump so using a gate valve I could fine tune the flow through one of these pretty easily.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Oh yeah I was gonna do that too... But got lazy. As usual btw 1 pump ordered 1 more to go!


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

:icon_redf LOL! I humbly stand corrected!!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

LOL The power plant behind this setup:


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## ikuzo (Jul 11, 2006)

wow looks awesome
really professional
pics of it in action please


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## Tyger (Dec 9, 2010)

*Seriously*



Craigthor said:


> I've got a little step stool I stand on and can pretty much reach the bottom if I have to


In truth, the kiddo pictures were just before he put the wet suit on his son and sent him down


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Tyger said:


> In truth, the kiddo pictures were just before he put the wet suit on his son and sent him down


Mine would like that. LOL


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Added and did a bit of rearranging on my day off tuesday.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

How are those CPO's doing?


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

well, this tank is basically perfect now. Nice call on the hygroryza, and I don't means that to be funny or seek props. The roots add a great touch. One of the top tanks on this site bro...I could look at this tank for hours. Beautiful.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> How are those CPO's doing?


Doing great, haven't seen any breeding yet but they are super active.



crazydaz said:


> well, this tank is basically perfect now. Nice call on the hygroryza, and I don't means that to be funny or seek props. The roots add a great touch. One of the top tanks on this site bro...I could look at this tank for hours. Beautiful.


I do like the roots hopefully can get tehm to spawn in them.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

What are your parameters?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> What are your parameters?


Straight tap gh 6 kh 3-5 ph without co2 8.1-8.2 with co2 7.6-7.8


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Maybe the problem could be the ph?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> Maybe the problem could be the ph?


They have only been in the tank for a short time so I'm not too worried about it. Also out of the 15 I put in I only see 4-5 at a time so there could easily be berried females hiding in the rock work.


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## Zefrik (Oct 23, 2011)

How do you clean that tank?! It seems like junk would get in between the rocks and be lost for eternity! It is one of the best, most natural looking tanks I have ever seen though.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Zefrik said:


> How do you clean that tank?! It seems like junk would get in between the rocks and be lost for eternity! It is one of the best, most natural looking tanks I have ever seen though.


Siphon as best I can but I keep a fairly large amount of snails, shrimp, cpos to help with the clean up. Anything else should break down over time and provide mulm and nutrients to feed the plants.

Craig


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

WOW! It's coming along great!

May be a dumb question but I couldn't find it anywhere in the journal, what plants are on the outside corners? They look like vals but didn't know.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

JEden8 said:


> WOW! It's coming along great!
> 
> May be a dumb question but I couldn't find it anywhere in the journal, what plants are on the outside corners? They look like vals but didn't know.


Right side is Java Fern Needle Leaf/ Narrow Leaf the left side is Java Fern Phillipine with a splash of Java Fern Super Trident between some anubias.

Craig


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

That is a great scape for low growing plants, awesome job on the design.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

I want some moss on those rocks. 

This tank will look and mature nicely over the next 1-2 years.
Just keep up on the CO2 and water changes.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> That is a great scape for low growing plants, awesome job on the design.


roud:



plantbrain said:


> I want some moss on those rocks.
> 
> This tank will look and mature nicely over the next 1-2 years.
> Just keep up on the CO2 and water changes.


Oh it is growing already, the Mini Pellia is starting to spread to the rocks and wood where I never put it at. Now it is just a sit back and relax period.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Weekly water change today and some clean pics afterwords.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Is that Barclaya Longifolia? 

And boy do those CPO's look nice.


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## kribkeeper888 (Oct 8, 2011)

Wow Ive been following this journal for a while, DANG what a cool tank lol I like your use of anubias, I think its underrated


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jkan0228 said:


> Is that Barclaya Longifolia?
> 
> And boy do those CPO's look nice.


Thanks and yes that is Barclaya Longifolia 'Red'



kribkeeper888 said:


> Wow Ive been following this journal for a while, DANG what a cool tank lol I like your use of anubias, I think its underrated


Thanks, still lots of maturing to do but it is getting there. :icon_mrgr


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Looking great


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

So....much.....to......look.....at....... 

Looks super, Craig! Thinking about adding any buce's?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

What a monster. Looking great man.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Looks absolutely amazing. I love the way you did the rocks, really makes the tank.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It's looking really nice Craig and it's filling in so quickly, your hardscape is so massive and in scale with the tank size it makes it difficult to tell that the tank is that large, nice job.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Wait till I epoxy my apartment bro just wait lol


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## kwheeler91 (May 26, 2009)

I demand a video! I feel like pics just arent doing this beast justice and I want see it n action.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

The Trajectory will end up looking nicer over time, I've done a few good sized tanks with these same plants.

It will look quite nice over time.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> Looking great


roud:



crazydaz said:


> So....much.....to......look.....at.......
> 
> Looks super, Craig! Thinking about adding any buce's?


I may in the future but want to stick with some easy stuff for now.



Hyzer said:


> What a monster. Looking great man.





talontsiawd said:


> Looks absolutely amazing. I love the way you did the rocks, really makes the tank.





150EH said:


> It's looking really nice Craig and it's filling in so quickly, your hardscape is so massive and in scale with the tank size it makes it difficult to tell that the tank is that large, nice job.


Thanks. :icon_mrgr



Jeromeit said:


> Wait till I epoxy my apartment bro just wait lol


Best go start a journal man... LOL


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

kwheeler91 said:


> I demand a video! I feel like pics just arent doing this beast justice and I want see it n action.


May have to find and borrow a camera or see what I can shoot with my dslrs built in camera. You aren't that far away if you ever road trip this way let me know.



plantbrain said:


> The Trajectory will end up looking nicer over time, I've done a few good sized tanks with these same plants.
> 
> It will look quite nice over time.


 
Thanks Tom. roud:


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## ikuzo (Jul 11, 2006)

moar fish and pics


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Also still contemplating setting up a purigen reactor to help remove the tannins as after a water change is looks so clear. With the light fish load I really shouldn't need to do water changes each week atleast not as large as I ahve been doing but am doing them to keep the tannins down.


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Purigen or carbon will definitely help with the tannins. Purigen is probably the most cost effective,


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> Purigen or carbon will definitely help with the tannins. Purigen is probably the most cost effective,


That is what I was thinking plus I can recharge it. I just need to decide how big of a cannister I want to build out of either a 10 or 20" cannister, the 10 is probably easier to service and I could even put 2 of them side by side and rotate them. They would be outside the stand as I won't be able to service them easily inside the stand.


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## kwheeler91 (May 26, 2009)

Always wanted to head out west, probably have to wait til my little one grows up some now. I head out to wisconsin every once in a while, maybe the next time I go I can take a side journey.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

kwheeler91 said:


> Always wanted to head out west, probably have to wait til my little one grows up some now. I head out to wisconsin every once in a while, maybe the next time I go I can take a side journey.


Do it only 4ish hours from milwaukee


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just added a single moon light to my system, used a 20w Xenon bulb in an under cabinet puck a bit if rewiring and we are set to go. Just a single bulb over the middle of the tank to give a nice soft moon light. Total cost about $15 for parts.

Craig


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> That is what I was thinking plus I can recharge it. I just need to decide how big of a cannister I want to build out of either a 10 or 20" cannister, the 10 is probably easier to service and I could even put 2 of them side by side and rotate them. They would be outside the stand as I won't be able to service them easily inside the stand.


You would only need a canister large enough to hold 250ml of Purigen. So I would think a 10" canister would do.


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## 75 gallon (Dec 19, 2011)

Wow that looks great man, way to go! this gives me lots of ideas for my tank.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I really like moonlights even if it doesn't help me much I think it helps the fish and shrimp feel more like they have a natural cycle, mine come on around 8 pm and stay on until 3 am, it's good lighting in case you get up for a glass of water.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> You would only need a canister large enough to hold 250ml of Purigen. So I would think a 10" canister would do.


Yeah, I will have to play around with it.



75 gallon said:


> Wow that looks great man, way to go! this gives me lots of ideas for my tank.


Thanks!



150EH said:


> I really like moonlights even if it doesn't help me much I think it helps the fish and shrimp feel more like they have a natural cycle, mine come on around 8 pm and stay on until 3 am, it's good lighting in case you get up for a glass of water.


Yeah, this one is pretty bright I will have to take some pics, wouldn't have thought so but it has a nice color to it. Makes me wonder if I couldd hook a dimmer up to it and tone it down a bit.

Craig


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## Mr. Fish (Apr 24, 2012)

Wow is all I can say...

Who needs a $20,000 dollar Reef tank when you can have something like this!~


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## ~~~ (Apr 2, 2012)

Just skimmed over the thread, I love it!
It boggles my mind how you do maintanance... my 166 is hard enough already! though it is in the wall

If I am seeing bosemanis, those are Awesome lookin man?

If I dare ask, what are CPOs?


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Catalina has a dimmer for $20 IIRC but it was for LED's.


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## The Gipper (Sep 9, 2003)

Looks great craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Will post some updates this coming week everything is starting to settle in again. Tried taking some pics with just the moon lighting on but yeah it didn't come out as planned will have to play around a bit more.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just a few quick pics...


























































































Craig


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Beautiful, filling in well, which plant is blooming?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

2in10 said:


> Beautiful, filling in well, which plant is blooming?


Apongeton Madagarensis


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Awesome congrats, mine hasn't in the 4 years I have had it, but it has never been real close to the surface. The bulb on mine is about 3 times the size it was when I bought it.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Don't need no stinkin' big screen TV with this beauty to gaze at for hours roud:


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## FishFarmer (Feb 8, 2007)

Hats off to you.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> Don't need no stinkin' big screen TV with this beauty to gaze at for hours roud:


Yeah I don't own a TV.



FishFarmer said:


> Hats off to you.


Thanks


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Craig, the pic of the tank in the room really gives the perspective of how massive the scape looks. I have seen tanks bigger than yours (usually saltwater displays in buildings) that look tiny from a viewing standpoint. I would love to sit in that room for an hour.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

talontsiawd said:


> Craig, the pic of the tank in the room really gives the perspective of how massive the scape looks. I have seen tanks bigger than yours (usually saltwater displays in buildings) that look tiny from a viewing standpoint. I would love to sit in that room for an hour.


If you ever make it this way let me know and your more then welcome to come visit...


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## kwheeler91 (May 26, 2009)

Looking really good sir. Any problems with algae?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

kwheeler91 said:


> Looking really good sir. Any problems with algae?


Nope I do see a bit of stag and/ or BBA from time to time but I am still playing with the CO2 so that is to be expected.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Craigthor said:


> If you ever make it this way let me know and your more then welcome to come visit...


I don't think I have ever been out that way but I will take you up on that if I am, would love to see it.


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## ikuzo (Jul 11, 2006)

the room shot is a stunning one
shows how big the tank is
amazing!


it even have a firetruck support nearby


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Thinking about removing the hygroiza ariostata from the tank as it creates alot of shade over parts of the tank, also I have seem to have found duckweed starting to grow in here now hanging on to the ariostata which is a bit unsightly.

Craig


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Just take some hygroriza out from time to time...just like any other plant or floater, it needs to be thinned out from time to time. You've only had for what....two or three weeks??


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> Just take some hygroriza out from time to time...just like any other plant or floater, it needs to be thinned out from time to time. You've only had for what....two or three weeks??


 
Yeah in 3 weeks it went from a dinner plate covering to almost 1/2 of my 220. Took a bunch out that will be going to the local club members. Also need to riunse it and get rid of the duckweed that seemed to appear.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Also got a dimmer for my moonlight so I could crank it back a bit, was a bit over powering with it at full power. The moonlight is a single 20 watt halogen puck light with an inline dimmer to control the brightness. Allows fora bit of low light veiwing before I crash at night then greets me in the morning during the wee hours when everyone else is still dreaming.

Craig


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

> Yeah in 3 weeks it went from a dinner plate covering to almost 1/2 of my 220. Took a bunch out that will be going to the local club members. Also need to rinse it and get rid of the duckweed that seemed to appear.


So, what you're saying is that your tank has an ample amount of nitrates leading to an explosion of Hygroryza growth, right? 

I know nothing of duckweed. I'm not sure that I like what you are implying....it's not in MY tank, for shizzle.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> So, what you're saying is that your tank has an ample amount of nitrates leading to an explosion of Hygroryza growth, right?
> 
> I know nothing of duckweed. I'm not sure that I like what you are implying....it's not in MY tank, for shizzle.


Yeah it didn't come from your tank I got a couple other plant orders and a piece must have snuck in.


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Man, your tank is filling in really nice! I can't believe the speed of the growth, it looks like it's a year old. What's this reddish plant in the pic here?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Man, your tank is filling in really nice! I can't believe the speed of the growth, it looks like it's a year old. What's this reddish plant in the pic here?


I ust moved it to the back and moved the Bolbitus to the front but it is Lagenandra Meboldii 'Pink' I have several portions but this is the largest one. Like a crypt and anubias blended into one.

I'll have to take some fresh pics in the morning.


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## wetbizquit (Jul 9, 2006)

just stunning man, impressive layout, its like a very intense computer, sleek on the outside, but inside very organized yet complicated.... nice work, what did you use for substrate? i never noticed any going in??


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

wetbizquit said:


> just stunning man, impressive layout, its like a very intense computer, sleek on the outside, but inside very organized yet complicated.... nice work, what did you use for substrate? i never noticed any going in??


completely substrate free.


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Very nice growth Craig!!!

Ya I have to thin out my hygroiza ariostata from time to time.
RAOK a bunch off right now actually haha!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Just bumped my group of Boesmanis up to 40. Watching the social interaction is pretty cool on a large group of rainbows. Looks to be almost even pairs of fish as well with the male to female ratio.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

First quick video not the best but still trying to figure out the camera.



http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/...nsformation/?action=view&current=MVI_0393.mp4

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I have a better one as well but the file is huge so I need to make the file smaller to upload Ill work on it in a bit.


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## mot (Sep 17, 2011)

Your tank looks even more epic in the video. You really have done a great job on this tank.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

mot said:


> Your tank looks even more epic in the video. You really have done a great job on this tank.


Uploading a second video to you tube right now. Will take a bit as it is a huge file.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

New video will be up shortly here: http://youtu.be/V7d9oSruyHI


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## NWA-Planted (Aug 27, 2011)

Watched the video, that tank is simply beautiful! I am very jealous! makes my 125 look like child play!

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

NWA-Planted said:


> Watched the video, that tank is simply beautiful! I am very jealous! makes my 125 look like child play!
> 
> Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


Thanks this tank comes after many years of trying different things and spending alot of time over the years trying to prepare for a huge tank,


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## NWA-Planted (Aug 27, 2011)

It has well paid off, not going past 125 until I get a bigger house, going to be building a new stand one of these days and upgrading my Sump anywhere from 30-55 gallons.

But alas you have doomed me, I have been wanting to redo my scape... I have no choice now!

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

NWA-Planted said:


> It has well paid off, not going past 125 until I get a bigger house, going to be building a new stand one of these days and upgrading my Sump anywhere from 30-55 gallons.
> 
> But alas you have doomed me, I have been wanting to redo my scape... I have no choice now!
> 
> Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


You should jsut go bigger now, if it makes you feel better I have mine in my second floor apartment... I'm a big believer in bigger the better on the sump.


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## NWA-Planted (Aug 27, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> You should jsut go bigger now, if it makes you feel better I have mine in my second floor apartment... I'm a big believer in bigger the better on the sump.


lol I want to but the wife is the dictator on Max size right now ;-) small house 3 kids, just not enough room, she said in the new house I can have a fish room (freaking love her)

Bigger Sump is a definite but need a new stand as the current one has very little access to the underneath. new one will be steel with 3' door openings!

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

NWA-Planted said:


> lol I want to but the wife is the dictator on Max size right now ;-) small house 3 kids, just not enough room, she said in the new house I can have a fish room (freaking love her)
> 
> Bigger Sump is a definite but need a new stand as the current one has very little access to the underneath. new one will be steel with 3' door openings!
> 
> Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


Nice, have a journal for your tank? Oh yeah piece number 11 is super nice looking in your SnS thread you should use it in your 125 with a bit of trimming.


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## NWA-Planted (Aug 27, 2011)

Thats kinda what I have been thinking the pieces aren't selling at all so may use for myself!

I really don't have a journal need to do one....

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2


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## tetranewbie (Oct 6, 2010)

Do you take vistors to come admire this tank? <3 it!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

tetranewbie said:


> Do you take vistors to come admire this tank? <3 it!


I do atleast when I'm home not sure if the wife would approve of people chilling watching the tank when I was at work, well unless they were will to do some house work. LOL


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## tetranewbie (Oct 6, 2010)

I can vacuum and dust the room where the tank is... 
Or can help with tank maintanence... does that count? Lol.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

tetranewbie said:


> I can vacuum and dust the room where the tank is...
> Or can help with tank maintanence... does that count? Lol.


Hey if you can vacuum you may be in, just be forewarned I do have a 3 yr old so trying to keep up is tricky. :hihi:

Craig


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## The Trigger (May 9, 2012)

That tank is amazing dude.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I will have to post some pics later tonite or tomorrow, did a bit of rearranging and moved some rocks that were hidden in the back right over to the left side and arranged the plants a bit better now that they were starting to settle in well. I've been contemplating this adjustment for a bit and since I needed to clean the plantlets off the Java Fern leaves it was jsut as easy to pull them out to do it. Hoping this creates more of the ampitheater look that I have been working on in the setup. Also allowed me to move a few things around and get a nicer mix of leaf shapes.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Pics in a few days! Want to let everything settle in and I may need to tweak a plant or 2 and give everything a chance to revive after being transfered around. The look is great plus getting to see some of this awesome stone that was tucked away is great also.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Some fresh pics and will have some video up in a couple of hours. Sorry forgot to shutoff the CO2 so you can see the micro bubbles in the pictures.










































































































































































Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

http://youtu.be/shJ4fY2-9Oc


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## Noahma (Oct 18, 2009)

Amazing, there are two Rainbow tanks I find to be the best I have ever seen, this one and Sanj's Great work!!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Noahma said:


> Amazing, there are two Rainbow tanks I find to be the best I have ever seen, this one and Sanj's Great work!!


 
Definitely should be stunning in the next year or so as everything really starts to take hold and get established. This last fine tuning of hte hard scape is what really give it the finished look with just enough rock and wood showing through to really enjoy the contrasts and textures.


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Bravissimo, Craig! Looks stellar! Love the hardscape, plants, the bosemani's! It's hard to constructively critique anything about it! Tremendous effort bro!

Now comes the hard part: keeping it that way!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> Bravissimo, Craig! Looks stellar! Love the hardscape, plants, the bosemani's! It's hard to constructively critique anything about it! Tremendous effort bro!
> 
> Now comes the hard part: keeping it that way!


Lots of upcoming 6 day work weeks should do wonders for keeping me out of the tank. LOL I've been trying to figure out how much more rock I was going to need when in the end it jsut took a bit of moving around to get enough where I needed it. No it is time for auto pilot again. :help:


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

The video makes the tank look much better than the pictures do. I think in a few months when the plants start to bush out it should look great.

Remind me what those little orange crustaceans are again? CPOs, scratch that


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

CL said:


> The video makes the tank look much better than the pictures do. I think in a few months when the plants start to bush out it should look great.
> 
> Remind me what those little orange crustaceans are again? CPOs, scratch that


 
Yeah it is really hard to capture the depth of this tank with my camera skillz. LOL


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Been tinkering with the powerhead and lock line outputs today trying to improve CO2 flow throughout the tank. The best part about CO2 misting is I can see where and where not the CO2 it flowing. Trying to get a nice even mist throughout the whole tank which is a big challenge with the large driftwood on the right side of the tank. Looks like I am getting closer but I want to let it run for a couple of days before I tinker any more.


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Wow the tank is really looking fantastic.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

SS regulator sold and boxed ready to ship...

New Brass regulator parts ordered and Btimmer is awaiting arrival of my Ideal NV with Vernier Handle to assemble and ship to me...

So what does this mean? About 2 weeks of no CO2 so the plan of action is:

Raise lights 3"
Turn off additional banks and just run 4 bulbs
Bump up Metricide dosing slightly
Sit back and wait it out impaitently

LOL

Wish me luck.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Craig it really is looking good and I can fully understand the type of effort you have made with this tank and it shows in the video, the way you have banked the hardscape and plants has a nice effect and it looks better every time I see it, nice work.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Well after doing some day dreaming I would someday love to get a pair of ATI Dimmable Powermodule 8x39 watt fixtures for over this tank. The mix of bulbs would be stunning and the fact I could virtually simulate sunrise to sunset. What would my mix of bulbs be?

1- ATI Blue Special
1- Giesemann Midday
1- Giesemann Aquaflora
1- GE Starcoat 6500
1- GE Starcoat 3000
1- Aquasun 10000
1- Red Sun
1- Indigo Sun

Would be a stunning mix I think of reds and blues with a bit of 10k whites for balance.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Craig it really is looking good and I can fully understand the type of effort you have made with this tank and it shows in the video, the way you have banked the hardscape and plants has a nice effect and it looks better every time I see it, nice work.


 
Thanks, I did a bunch of Anubias Coffeefolia from Tom so it will be nice to see how it balances out.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Will work on some pics later today, did a small plant rearrangement and some layering of plants. Did remove a few species that just weren't responding well to a substrateless tank. Pulls a bit of overflow plants out as well. Would love to find a couple large chunks of petite to use in a foreground spot so will have to keep my eyes open.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

My first shot at shooting manual mode with the Cannon. Not the best but I'll get there, this will also hold you all over till I finish uploading my video I shot earlier.
























































































































Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Sitting on the couch:

http://youtu.be/XzcJ0tJHBIs


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## dannylill1981 (Apr 11, 2012)

wow, just wow epicness in abundance, sick tank man. wow.....


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## Shimagoma (May 15, 2012)

so cool! its a great view! Id love to have some fish tv like that!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Sitting on the couch:
> 
> http://youtu.be/XzcJ0tJHBIs


You still need to double the fish count for even more action :fish:
Yeah I think I could give up a lot of TV viewing if I had a tank like yours.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> You still need to double the fish count for even more action :fish:
> Yeah I think I could give up a lot of TV viewing if I had a tank like yours.


There is 40 of them in there once they all get full grown should be jsut about right


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So did a huge water change which is currently on a 10 day schedule, did roughly 95% figure it should reset the system. Did some work to the right side of the tank, since redoing the left side the right was a bit out of place. Tank now has balance and seems 100% bigger when viewing. Thinking about adding another fish to teh tank. Another species but a single pet per say. I got the chance to spend some time watching a Jardini in a local LFS and think I want to add a small one to grow out. Can't wait to get my CO2 system back up and running. 
































































Craig


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

very nice tank, and i love the rainbows.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

That thing is massive... The sense of depth really shows now that the plants have grown in. Job well done Craig!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

@[email protected] said:


> very nice tank, and i love the rainbows.


Thanks



jkan0228 said:


> That thing is massive... The sense of depth really shows now that the plants have grown in. Job well done Craig!


Yeah after this last adjsutment it is really starting to come into its own.

Craig


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## ophiophagus (Mar 5, 2012)

Great job on this tank I really like it. This may be the nicest i've seen planted with "low light" plants. Subscribed


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## F22 (Sep 21, 2008)

that tank is awesome!


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Tank is looking great for not having CO2. You are doing real well on manual mode taking photos. The ATI fixtures with the mix of bulbs should give a very interesting effect.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

F22 said:


> that tank is awesome!


Thanks!



2in10 said:


> Tank is looking great for not having CO2. You are doing real well on manual mode taking photos. The ATI fixtures with the mix of bulbs should give a very interesting effect.


ATI will probably be a ways out but we can all day dream right. LOL As for the not having CO2 up and running it is holding out really well and I am impressed, I have removed soem thread algae but doesn't seem to be anything too major.

Craig


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

I'm liking it more and more as time goes on!


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## Alastair-T (Jun 5, 2011)

This tank is stunning. You must be really proud of it I would be 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

CL said:


> I'm liking it more and more as time goes on!


It is turning out well, will have to take some new pics in a a few days...



Alastair-T said:


> This tank is stunning. You must be really proud of it I would be
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I am one of my best renditions, so peaceful but yet so much to see.


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## if_fishes_were_wishes (Jul 29, 2007)

holy gorgeous! I love it!!!


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It does look nice and the photos of the fist were very nice too, IIRC there is no substrate at all in the tank is that right? Also I was wondering now that you've had the sump for a while how does it compare to the big Eheim canisters and are there any things would would change if you did it again?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> It does look nice and the photos of the fist were very nice too, IIRC there is no substrate at all in the tank is that right? Also I was wondering now that you've had the sump for a while how does it compare to the big Eheim canisters and are there any things would would change if you did it again?


 
Yep no substrate at all.  As for the sump there isn't anything at all that I would change. Almost zero maintence except for filter socks every 6 weeks or so. As for a comparison to the big 2262's there isn't one IMO.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I'm dying to try one and after I finish this 10 gallon project I want to try the Wasserpest plywood tank with a sump and I have found a local company for acrylic that has good prices and doesn't mind walk in customers. I'm going to try and build the sump myself and outfit it from the Jehmco catalog because I loved the heater bulkhead, now I just have to break it to my wife about the new wall O tank. 

I would like to use you sump as the model as I really liked the layout.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So what a day the new fish didn't survive the trip and the package of plants I ordered is out for delivery in a town 3 hours away. grrrr. Not my day by the looks of it hoping the plants get redirected and come back and next week we are going to try again with incoming fish. Wish me luck. 

On the plus side my new CO2 regulator and RootMedic ferts will hopefully arrive by weeks end.

Wondering if I want to go back to the needlewheel pump or build a big reactor as having no co2 mist in the tank has been greta for viewing....

Craig

Craig


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Oh Craig!!

It didnt survive a day trip?

-Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Nope box looked like it had been tossed around and leaked water.


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Craig, were you running the needle wheel? I'm feeding to my return pump, and while I don't mind the mist, I burned through a 10 pounder in three weeks. I'm losing a lot of gas to the surface, but I'm not using a needle wheel. I'm wondering if a needle wheel will produce finer bubbles that won't rise to the surface as much. I'm getting lots of co2 in the water, but wasting too much as well. 

As of today I'm running it through a power head and two feet of tubing, then through the return pump. I'm hoping I works a little better. The miss it less noticeable. I'll see how it is working when I'm home. Hopefully I dont gas the tank, but I set the power head to turn off if the ph gets too low. 

Thoughts?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Craig, were you running the needle wheel? I'm feeding to my return pump, and while I don't mind the mist, I burned through a 10 pounder in three weeks. I'm losing a lot of gas to the surface, but I'm not using a needle wheel. I'm wondering if a needle wheel will produce finer bubbles that won't rise to the surface as much. I'm getting lots of co2 in the water, but wasting too much as well.
> 
> As of today I'm running it through a power head and two feet of tubing, then through the return pump. I'm hoping I works a little better. The miss it less noticeable. I'll see how it is working when I'm home. Hopefully I dont gas the tank, but I set the power head to turn off if the ph gets too low.
> 
> Thoughts?


 
Yep I;ve got a mag 18 setup with the needlewheel. after a couple of weeks of not having the mist I like the nice clean view. If I do anything I will probably go with another cerges style reactor but with a 20" cannister and control it via a gate valve. I may also watch for another carbondoser also.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

That's why I'd never go with a needle wheel for CO2. I hate the mist effect. Still a great pump to help get more O2 into the water. I might have to get one of those 20"ers too for my next big tank.


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

I've never used a reactor before. Do those carbon doser 5000s work well? I've read reviews that they burp a lot. 

I may have to make something.


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Craigthor said:


> Nope box looked like it had been tossed around and leaked water.


Bummer!! 

-Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> I've never used a reactor before. Do those carbon doser 5000s work well? I've read reviews that they burp a lot.
> 
> I may have to make something.


With lower flow rates they are great they burp if you get too much flow through them.



h4n said:


> Bummer!!
> 
> -Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


Exactly


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Man that really sucks about your fish delivery.

So even if the needle wheel is dumping into the sump you get a mist in the tank?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

150EH said:


> Man that really sucks about your fish delivery.
> 
> So even if the needle wheel is dumping into the sump you get a mist in the tank?


Needlewheel is my return pump so it doesn't dump intot the sump but flows for my returns.


----------



## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I guess there's not much more you could do other than have your needle wheel pump pick up and dump into the center section of the wet/dry then get picked up by the return pump and there would even be a risk it wouldn't do the trick plus any space restrictions.

How fast were you burning CO2?


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

And if anyone is after a nice Sony Digital Camcorder let me know I have a nice one I want to sell for cheap and pass it on since I got the DSLR. Model Sony DCR-DVD650


----------



## Lurch98 (Oct 7, 2011)

Any reason not to put the CO2 into the needle wheel and run it through a reactor? Is the pump too high of flow for that to work?

I'm changing my canisters out for a Sump shortly, and I plan to run mine this way as a closed loop in the back of my sump. Hopefully 300 gph won't be too much for the CO2 to dissolve with a 20" canister.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Lurch98 said:


> Any reason not to put the CO2 into the needle wheel and run it through a reactor? Is the pump too high of flow for that to work?
> 
> I'm changing my canisters out for a Sump shortly, and I plan to run mine this way as a closed loop in the back of my sump. Hopefully 300 gph won't be too much for the CO2 to dissolve with a 20" canister.


My pump at my head puts out 1300 gph way too much for a reactor. Also the way it is plumbed I would need 2 reactors, one for each side. 

I have a 3rd arm with a valve that I may just install a gate valve on and run it through a 20" reactor so I can control the flow rate through it and hopefuflly get the CO2 where I want it.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

300 gph is fine for a 10 inch reactor housing.

Craig as I was looking back at the pages when the wet/dry was installed the aquascaped looked so different, you should do a before and after post to show how far it has come.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I will also be tweaking the foreground as well with this setup. PC1 is nice enough to send me a box of scrap pieces and I will be pulling most of the slate and doing a textured rock foreground out of smaller seriyu pieces. Will be attaching Mini Pellia again to several of the rocks and also attaching Anubias Petite around as well. This will take place over the next few weeks as I will be swamped at work.


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

Lurch98 said:


> Any reason not to put the CO2 into the needle wheel and run it through a reactor? Is the pump too high of flow for that to work?
> 
> I'm changing my canisters out for a Sump shortly, and I plan to run mine this way as a closed loop in the back of my sump. Hopefully 300 gph won't be too much for the CO2 to dissolve with a 20" canister.


I would like to know if this is posssible also. I know you have a pump that is too high of a flow for running through a reactor but will this work if your needle wheel pump is not running at so many GPH. I have been thinking about putting my wet/dry sump back on my tank and looking at the needle wheel pumps but I don't want all the micro bubbles in my tank so was thinking of running it through my aqua medic 1000 reactor after the needle wheel pump but don't know if this is something I want to do yet and was hoping for some more input on the issue.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

You can also get the non needle wheel impeller. It might be a little more efficient too.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

http://youtu.be/W7gUMYVqXIQ


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Absolutely stunning tank, man. Is that an Arowana in there?&#55357;&#56883; Those Bosemanis look very, very tiny, haha. That scale is amazing.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Absolutely stunning tank, man. Is that an Arowana in there?&#55357;&#56883; Those Bosemanis look very, very tiny, haha. That scale is amazing.


 
Jardini but yeah...


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Very cool. Will he stay in there indefinitely or be removed once he is gigantic?


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

looks amazing craig! i love the arrowana!!!!!!!!! oh, and i like your commentary on broiling!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jcgd said:


> Very cool. Will he stay in there indefinitely or be removed once he is gigantic?


Nope he will stay unless I move to another bigger tank. The nice thing is Jars don't typically exceed 24" but it takes along time to get them that big.

Craig


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Very nice Craig, Glad the second one arrived alive!
Will he go after your other fishes?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

h4n said:


> Very nice Craig, Glad the second one arrived alive!
> Will he go after your other fishes?


He doesn't seem interested in the other fishes but loves him some crickets and krill, have a large order of floating pellets coming for him but they won't arrive till tomorrow.

Really want to get him to be able to hand feed eventually.

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Redid the foreground, removed all the slate and put in a bunch of Seiryu gravel that I got from PC1. Looks soo much better!
























































































































Also got the new brass CO2 regulator all setup an running. I did get a bit of algae during the 2 weeks of CO2 lessness but that should hopefully work itself out over the next few weeks. 

Craig


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

Do you have glass tops on your tank? If not it will be a matter of time before the jardini goes for a jump onto your carpet. I like the foreground a lot better without the slate. It ties the rest of the rockwork together alot better.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> Do you have glass tops on your tank? If not it will be a matter of time before the jardini goes for a jump onto your carpet. I like the foreground a lot better without the slate. It ties the rest of the rockwork together alot better.


I've got egg crate tops on it, I don't use glass tops as with my old 150 I went through 3 sets as they would jsut randomly crack.

Craig


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Great looking redo, beautiful Arowana


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## ThatGuyWithTheFish (Apr 29, 2012)

Wow, you've created a really beautiful scape of mostly just java fern and anubias. Gotta love bosemanis too!


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

<----Jealous...Love how it's filling in! And of course your new addition.


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

2in10 said:


> Great looking redo, beautiful Arowana


Oh oh... He looks hungry and the other fish look worried :icon_twis


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

soon will have missing rainbow


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Unfortunately the Jar died this morning. Tuesday night he was fine and was out swimming yesterday when I left for work. Came home and he was sitting on the bottom and looked like he had been run through a shredder. Tried my best but he passed on this morning.

Craig


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Craigthor said:


> Unfortunately the Jar died this morning. Tuesday night he was fine and was out swimming yesterday when I left for work. Came home and he was sitting on the bottom and looked like he had been run through a shredder. Tried my best but he passed on this morning.
> 
> Craig


Awwww man!
Sorry to hear.

Any idea how or why?

-Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

h4n said:


> Awwww man!
> Sorry to hear.
> 
> Any idea how or why?
> ...


 
Only thing close would be a case of Dropsy which they can be susceptible to via a change in water parameters, temprature or other change. The fact it killed him in less then 24 hours amazed me not even really a chance to heal him up.

Not sure if I will attempt another one or not I really loved the look of him in the tank though.

Craig


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

really dont suggest put aro in the planted tank  go get some altums  they looks great in that tank


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Altums are way to finicky IME, maybe some Altum mixes. Also with my trying to get away from using RO water the Aussie Aro fits into what I have available.

Craig


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Psst....


Get another arowanna...

Thanks..

Sincerely,
Your inner voice


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Psst....
> 
> 
> Get another arowanna...
> ...


 
:icon_mrgr You just want the tank when the wife kills me. LOL


----------



## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Now why would your inner voice want u dead?


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Just to set things straight your inner voice must be Asian.


----------



## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Now why would your inner voice want u dead?





Jeromeit said:


> Just to set things straight your inner voice must be Asian.


 
All I got to say is Aquapartment. roud:


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lol one day brotherman one day.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Lol one day brotherman one day.


Sounds like you need a water bed to start out with to get used to the sleeping on water feel.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lol good idea!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Unfortunately the Jar died this morning. Tuesday night he was fine and was out swimming yesterday when I left for work. Came home and he was sitting on the bottom and looked like he had been run through a shredder. Tried my best but he passed on this morning.
> 
> Craig


Do you think he freaked out and tore himself up on the rocks?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I doubt it as teh wife was home and was watching him a bit before I got home and he was just hanging out not really doing anything. There was an old thread on MFK about Aros eating shelled shrimp, etc and causing internal injury that turned to dropsy. Well I *HAD* CPOs in the tank prior to him arriving and haven't seen any in days so wondering if he ate one that casued an internal issue. That is only a guess but it is all I could come up with other then I did a big water change a few days prior so wondering if something was in the water or there was a fluctuation that caused the dropsy.

Craig


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## KenRC51 (Oct 13, 2011)

The arowana might mess up your scape when it get larger.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

KenRC51 said:


> The arowana might mess up your scape when it get larger.


Always a possibility but I have some bigger plans for a year or 2 down the road.


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## lbacha (Apr 13, 2011)

Is that a Lagenandra meeboldii "pink" in the center of the tank?

Len


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

every time I look that this beautiful tank the first thing caught my eye is the red one. maybe move to yellow? just me


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I like to look at other peoples big fish but they tend to eat all my little fish so I have vowed nother over 2" from here out.

That really sticks that you lost him already was this also the same species you lost due to poor packaging by the shipper???? I don't know much about them and only remember they jump and eat insects from low hanging tree branches, animal plannet is great. I wonder if he was trying to jump and was hitting the egg create, man that really sucks.

They can be extremely beautiful fish, I stole this shot from Wiki


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## catfishbi (Jun 10, 2008)

that's a red tile golden, illegal to buy or own in us. also they are not good for planted tank


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## KenRC51 (Oct 13, 2011)

catfishbi said:


> that's a red tile golden, illegal to buy or own in us. also they are not good for planted tank


illegal but I'm sure you can still find some. I remember about 15 years back you can get a RTG (red tail golden) for about $800.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

lbacha said:


> Is that a Lagenandra meeboldii "pink" in the center of the tank?
> 
> Len


Yep it is L. 'pink'



catfishbi said:


> every time I look that this beautiful tank the first thing caught my eye is the red one. maybe move to yellow? just me


Funny thing about the yellow circle is there is a couple of smal L. Meeboldii 'Pink' growing out in that spot. LOL

Craig


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## lbacha (Apr 13, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Yep it is L. 'pink'
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I won't stay small for long, lol..

They are neat plants

Len


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

How big are your male Boesemani's? They just seem so small but have their full color. Could be your ginormous tank haha!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

jeden8 said:


> how big are your male boesemani's? They just seem so small but have their full color. Could be your ginormous tank haha!


2.5"


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> 2.5"


Damn....makes my 90 gallon seem so much smaller now haha. Where did you get your full grown? I'm looking to get rid of some fish and add another 4 or 5 Boesemani's.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

These will max out about 3" compared to some of the larger varieties. Pretty sure this is a regional varient of this species causing an almost dwarf version.

Craig


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Well my full grown are about 3" right now. I'm just trying to find the males that have their full coloration but only find full grown females or males that haven't grown in their colorations yet and take up to a year to get the full color.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Lots of changes coming over the next couple of day. I have had a few fish health issues and have currently torn the tank down and it is running bare bottom as of last night. 

Literally all teh plants filled a 13g trash bag alot will go back in but I will be putting a bunch of them up for sale so if anyone is interested in anything particular let me know.

Scrubbing all the wood down and will do the same with the rocks as well. Removed the egg crate from under the rocks as it was a major debris/ mulm/ fish poop collector and wasn't easily cleaned.

Stay tuned....


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## jcgd (Feb 18, 2004)

Wowzers, didn't see that coming. What was going on in there? How's your back?


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Since you don't have any substrate, perhaps a good under gravel type filter will help with the mulm build ups.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I've got another plan but will go into more detail tonite when I get home.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Tank is back up and running. As for the unseen problems I have been fighting fin rot in the tank for a few weeks, this is probably what lead to the demise of the other Jardini as well. Lots of unclean water, or atleast I thought it was clean with the massive water changes I have always done. 

After ripping all the rock and wood out I had about an inch of mulm, detritus, decaying food, fish poo under all the rocks. It smelled horrible and took about 4 large water changes to get cleaned out. So bad that at times as I was removing things from the tank that I couldn't see in there. The egg crate had trapped tons of stuff so yeah a tear down was inevitable. 

I am movign this tank to be very lightly planted the only plant I am using is Java Fern Needle Leaf. A few large rocks and a few select pieces of wood. For the bottom I covered the bottom glass with 2- 24x36" sheet of ABS Plastic at .100 thickness should make cleanign the bottom super easy.

I will get some pics over the next few days tonite I need to work on pics of all teh plants to sell nearly a 13g trash bags worth that I pulled out.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

A bottom filter through a canister was another option to leave all those rocks in. Looking forward to seeing the redo.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

audioaficionado said:


> A bottom filter through a canister was another option to leave all those rocks in. Looking forward to seeing the redo.


With the shear amount of rocks in there not sure it would have worked I would have need a way to get complete flow under the whole bottom. Much more sparse as I need to watch for a few nive bunches of Needle Leaf as the wife wants a bit mroe green in the tank. 

To be honest having this really lightly planted and scaped tank really has a lot of depth perception to it.

Craig


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Wow...Sorry to hear that! Hope everything goes better with the new setup.


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## akdylpickles (Feb 21, 2011)

that really blows. are you going to make a new journal for the new setup? can't wait to see it!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

I'll continue this one with some new pics as it is the same tank. I have to say I'm really liking the minimalist look of this rendition not sure why but I do. Completely out of style for me I guess.


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

I'm really sorry you had to tear down the tank, but I'm sure whatever you do with it will be great. Sometimes change can be refreshing and offer a new pleasure in just seeing something different develop. I hope your fish make it through okay.

Looking forward to pics of your new scape when you have it started!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> With the shear amount of rocks in there not sure it would have worked I would have need a way to get complete flow under the whole bottom. Much more sparse as I need to watch for a few nive bunches of Needle Leaf as the wife wants a bit mroe green in the tank.
> 
> To be honest having this really lightly planted and scaped tank really has a lot of depth perception to it.
> 
> Craig


You'd need to have the egg crate off the bottom with the slotted piping under it. That way there would be water moving down though the rock piles like an under gravel filter keeps the mulm from building up in the gravel. OTOH any shrimp fry might get caught. However your fish will be catching more most likely LOL. The flow would keep stinky anaerobic activity to a minimum.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

A few pics to satisfy everyones taste buds for a bit, also got some video uploading but that will be a couple hours yet as I have some stuff to do and will post once I return.























































Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

And some video:


http://youtu.be/fjNL45PqZ80


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## togified (Apr 24, 2012)

for a arrowana planted tank to be successful. your going to need to train him to eat pellets. I feed mine hikari brand for about 8 years already. The fish is nice strong and healthy. never gotten sick once from this food. 

MY fish gotten so used to the floating pellets. I have 15 neon tetra, angel fish and 3 corys in there with him. None have gotten eaten yet. Thev'e been in there for about 2 months. Think my fish is to lazy to chase after them to eat lol. They jsut swim around my drift wood and plants.

I had about 100 red cherry shrimp in there befor i added the neon tetra and corys. But i think they ate them all. I only see 1-2 rcs once in a while.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

togified said:


> for a arrowana planted tank to be successful. your going to need to train him to eat pellets. I feed mine hikari brand for about 8 years already. The fish is nice strong and healthy. never gotten sick once from this food.
> 
> MY fish gotten so used to the floating pellets. I have 15 neon tetra, angel fish and 3 corys in there with him. None have gotten eaten yet. Thev'e been in there for about 2 months. Think my fish is to lazy to chase after them to eat lol. They jsut swim around my drift wood and plants.
> 
> I had about 100 red cherry shrimp in there befor i added the neon tetra and corys. But i think they ate them all. I only see 1-2 rcs once in a while.


 
Already pellet trained.


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## green_valley (Sep 14, 2011)

WOW, you torn your tank down??????????? I am curious what happened exactly that you have to actually clean them all up. You said that some fish health issue. ick?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

green_valley said:


> WOW, you torn your tank down??????????? I am curious what happened exactly that you have to actually clean them all up. You said that some fish health issue. ick?


 
Was getting a nasty case of fin rot in the tank.


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## green_valley (Sep 14, 2011)

Craigthor said:


> Was getting a nasty case of fin rot in the tank.


That's gotta be really nasty fin rot if you have to actually tear down 220g. Im sorry to hear that. But you'll be back roud:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Figure it is only fair to update my thread name after this last batch of changes. Some new pics here in a few minutes, a bit more tweaking is needed but it is really close now

Craig


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)




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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

And a new adventure has begun! :hihi: Looks good! Much cleaner than before with lots of room for growth. Love the fish. They really stand out.

I'm curious as to why you don't want to use a substrate. I can appreciate not wanting stems in such a large tank, but why no substrate at all?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Complexity said:


> And a new adventure has begun! :hihi: Looks good! Much cleaner than before with lots of room for growth. Love the fish. They really stand out.
> 
> I'm curious as to why you don't want to use a substrate. I can appreciate not wanting stems in such a large tank, but why no substrate at all?


 
Mostly a new challenge.  Now I really need to find some more leedle leaf anyone have some? 

Craig


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## akdylpickles (Feb 21, 2011)

What about planting some vals in pots in the back?


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## O2surplus (Jan 31, 2010)

Nice Jardini! In my humble opinion- there's nothing I enjoy seeing more than an Arowana cruising through the growth in a well planted tank. I've kept nearly every species at one time or another under similar conditions. I had an experience very similar to yours while trying to employ additional under gravel filtration, and I eventually had to remove the system just like you did. I hope that you're already aware that a lot of care needs to be taken if you employ additional Nitrogen supplementation for the plants. Arowanas seem to suffer a few different maladies, like gill curling, due to elevated Nitrate levels. I learned that lesson the hard way, and had to resort to surgery on the affected fish to correct the deformity. I've found that the Nitrogen total had to be maintained at less than 40ppm to keep the aro's healthy.
Good Luck with your tank


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

O2surplus said:


> Nice Jardini! In my humble opinion- there's nothing I enjoy seeing more than an Arowana cruising through the growth in a well planted tank. I've kept nearly every species at one time or another under similar conditions. I had an experience very similar to yours while trying to employ additional under gravel filtration, and I eventually had to remove the system just like you did. I hope that you're already aware that a lot of care needs to be taken if you employ additional Nitrogen supplementation for the plants. Arowanas seem to suffer a few different maladies, like gill curling, due to elevated Nitrate levels. I learned that lesson the hard way, and had to resort to surgery on the affected fish to correct the deformity. I've found that the Nitrogen total had to be maintained at less than 40ppm to keep the aro's healthy.
> Good Luck with your tank


Barely dosing anything at this point with daily waterchagnes and melafix plus with the light planting this should help.


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## Termato (Apr 12, 2012)

So Craig i just spent an hour or so...maybe more...going through this thread thinking Wow! That took you so long. And then on the last two pages you tare it down! :O! Couldn't believe it! That must have taken so long for you to make that decision after the amount of work you put into it. I'm expecting something 300x better because from the start of the old one was I was thinking...what is he doing...but the more you went along the more it came together.

I really liked what you did with the removal of the foreground not too long ago. That really made things come together.

What I enjoyed most though about this thread was watching your tank grow from like a flat view to a mountain side haha. You literally constructed the side of a mountain underwater inside that tank. It was beautiful.

I can't wait to see what you to with it now that you have all that space to work with. Good luck! Very inspirational, can't wait until I can have my own of these.

Have you considered tall stem plants for the background? I haven't seen you use any of those so I was just wondering.

Also, I'm jealous of your rainbows. I have never seen them so orange like that.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Termato said:


> So Craig i just spent an hour or so...maybe more...going through this thread thinking Wow! That took you so long. And then on the last two pages you tare it down! :O! Couldn't believe it! That must have taken so long for you to make that decision after the amount of work you put into it. I'm expecting something 300x better because from the start of the old one was I was thinking...what is he doing...but the more you went along the more it came together.
> 
> I really liked what you did with the removal of the foreground not too long ago. That really made things come together.
> 
> ...


Thanks, the scape is almost finalized now just need to score a bit more Needle leaf to finish it off.


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

I like the new look Craig!!

If you want to sell some of that stone to me, send me a pm!!


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

crazydaz said:


> I like the new look Craig!!
> 
> If you want to sell some of that stone to me, send me a pm!!


I'm holding most of the seiryu stone until I decide what I want to do with it but I have alot of stone that has brownish tones that I will have forsale. 

Here is what my deck looks like right now:










Also will have some new video uploaded later today just started uplaoding so it will take a bit.

Craig


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Well since you already have a nice pile of good rock, why not just keep it in storage for later when you do future rescapes and new builds.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

http://youtu.be/QuGOjUL1tXw


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## jennesque (May 10, 2012)

Wow! I've only looked at like the last 6-7 pages.. saw the old tank, which did look amazing, but I love the new set up. Very nice looking!


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

Lovely! 

Quick question; how do you heat a tank that large? I have been doing research for this 210g I recently got. I'm thinking like two 500w heaters, I just don't know if I should do one in the sump and on outside, or both in the sump, or both outside, one on either end of the tank. 

Now... How long will the tank stay like this? You seem to change once the tank gets perfect, lol. You've given me lots of inspiration, thats for sure.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Da Plant Man said:


> Lovely!
> 
> Quick question; how do you heat a tank that large? I have been doing research for this 210g I recently got. I'm thinking like two 500w heaters, I just don't know if I should do one in the sump and on outside, or both in the sump, or both outside, one on either end of the tank.
> 
> Now... How long will the tank stay like this? You seem to change once the tank gets perfect, lol. You've given me lots of inspiration, thats for sure.


2- 250 watt heaters keep this tank rock solid at 82


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## JoraaÑ (Jun 29, 2009)

Craig, your tank looked so Nice and Sudden change...you should put some Substrate and plant some easy sp. I found 2 videos in youtube. Watch it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NXniyO_XDQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpInDXlNTx0


I read and seen the video of Arowana in planted tank in another link...there was this guy from HK..Can't find it right now.

This is another link 
http://www.n1wanred.com/isi/forum/showthread.php?t=26782


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Joraan said:


> Craig, your tank looked so Nice and Sudden change...you should put some Substrate and plant some easy sp. I found 2 videos in youtube. Watch it...
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NXniyO_XDQ
> 
> ...


 
Great videos!


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

wow you took down the whole tank, and here I'm dreading on tearing down my 48g and starting from scratch. So time consuming at times. Anyways keep up the great work man


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## sanj (Jan 11, 2004)

The new scape looks good, but I thought the first was somthing quite different and special.

Still I quess for the sake of the newest inhabitant the scape probably needed to change to afford more living space and I take it we havent seen everything yet... interesting to see this one develop.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

So for those that wanted some video of the sump up and running here is a short video:


http://youtu.be/3ENN06RXoDc

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It's very quite.


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

Gives me a good idea of what I am doing with my 210g. Hope you don't mind me copying your tank when it had stems!


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## Complexity (Jan 30, 2008)

150EH said:


> It's very quite.


We're mourning the loss of the old scape. It's not that we don't like the new scape. We do! It's just that no scape can ever replace another scape. And the untimely death of the old scape was so sudden, so unexpected. It's going to take some time...

:tongue:


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Couple of new videos:

http://youtu.be/Lv5fF44tDZc

and

http://youtu.be/ZhUIzgoTfkM


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

That is one beautiful fish thats for sure. Are you still injecting CO2 into this tank? It would seem like you would be burning through a ton of CO2 with a sump and those air stones running trying to keep the CO2 at a good level. 

I also have to mention that those rainbows look terrified as they know it's only a matter of time before they are lunch.


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

ua hua said:


> That is one beautiful fish thats for sure. Are you still injecting CO2 into this tank? It would seem like you would be burning through a ton of CO2 with a sump and those air stones running trying to keep the CO2 at a good level.
> 
> I also have to mention that those rainbows look terrified as they know it's only a matter of time before they are lunch.


Nope no CO2 at this moment, I had been running it and even with the air pump on my ph was staying steady where it was before the airpump. I am thinking of putting a reactor on with super slow flow and a UV sterilizer on a seperate loop in my setup as I have most of it plumbed jsut need the cash to make it all happen.

I want a high end UV to handle good flow and be built like a tank then run a CO2 reactor after it. Will set it up with a gate valve to fine tune flow throught the seperate loop.

Craig


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Complexity said:


> We're mourning the loss of the old scape. It's not that we don't like the new scape. We do! It's just that no scape can ever replace another scape. And the untimely death of the old scape was so sudden, so unexpected. It's going to take some time...
> 
> :tongue:


I meant to say the video of the sump was very quiet.


Craig I saw a 7 foot Arowana on the television the other night so you may need a bigger tank.


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

150EH said:


> Craig I saw a 7 foot Arowana on the television the other night so you may need a bigger tank.


Do you mean arapaima? Arowana's rarely get up to 3'


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

This tank will be going to storage for a bit, selling off the plants and moving the remainder to storage. Got into an accident at work last Thursday and am on no lift restrictions till after I see the doctor tomorrow. We move on Saturday so the best thing is to move everything to storage so I don't have the stress of moving the tank right now. In the long term if I decide to part with equipment that will happen after the move and we get settled in to the new place.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Bro what's happening to Toto???????


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Bro what's happening to Toto???????


If all goes well rehomed to a bigger tank, more like a pond.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Aww bro sorry to hear that... You ok?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Aww bro sorry to hear that... You ok?


Sore and poppin pills so it makes me even better, lol


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

And I'll give you first dibs if I want to part anything out. lol


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lmao Burning a hole in my pockets bro


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Lmao Burning a hole in my pockets bro


Better start a jar now for your pennies as you know you want the rocks... lol


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Ur an evil evil man... Lol You really know how to motivate my spending habits -.-


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Jeromeit said:


> Ur an evil evil man... Lol You really know how to motivate my spending habits -.-


I try....


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Lol hope you feel better though bro get well soon


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Me too, off to catch some sleep got a bit of a drive to get to the doctors first thing in the am.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Craigthor said:


> Nope no CO2 at this moment, I had been running it and even with the air pump on my ph was staying steady where it was before the airpump. I am thinking of putting a reactor on with super slow flow and a UV sterilizer on a seperate loop in my setup as I have most of it plumbed jsut need the cash to make it all happen.
> 
> I want a high end UV to handle good flow and be built like a tank then run a CO2 reactor after it. Will set it up with a gate valve to fine tune flow throught the seperate loop.
> 
> Craig


Try dosing pump with Excel(see bulkreefsupply). I assume there are no inverts correct? Water changes how often? CO2 can kill, so can Excel, but a metering dosing pump and a decent timer should prevent any issues.

110mls per day added 15 min after the lights come on. You can add the trace mix to this also(straight Excel).

It's not likely CO2 is worth it with this plant biomass even if you added 2x this amount.


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

Sometimes, Craig, I think you like tearing down tanks only to set them back up in a few weeks/months 

Thats really sad though. My Mother and Sister got in a car wreck a few weeks ago, its not pleasant. Hope you heal well!


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## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

Craig, hang on to everything for now. Once you heal up and the winter cabin fever sets in, you'll be back with a vengeance on your 220 set up. You have lots of time to plan the next over the top scape and wow us once again.


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## driftwoodhunter (Jul 1, 2011)

Just chiming in to say I hate to hear you've been injured, I hope all goes well at the Dr's and you get better fast...


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## JEden8 (Jan 5, 2011)

Hope everything goes well Craig.


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## knuggs (Mar 5, 2007)

Hows it been going?


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## newbieplanter (Jan 13, 2013)

Darn I wish I could see it!


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