# Buying Otocinclus Online-update 4/21/9 (Liveaquaria)



## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

The local fish store is closing down and now I'm trying to find some otocinclus. Has anyone ever had any experience buying them online? Any suggestions on where to look?

Thanks for your assistance.


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## jphan (Mar 2, 2008)

i have never bought fish online but i heard invertz factory on this site is good


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

I have heard mixed reviews. Some ppl loose all of the otos after a few weeks and some have never lost a one. 

A crap shoot for sure. 

I have heard good things about the inverts factory.


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

petsmart has them.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Thanks for the replies. I didn't realize invertz factory had oto's. Maybe he just has them from time to time.

I'm leery about petsmart, but I guess I will have to try my luck there.


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## A Hill (Jul 25, 2005)

Live aquaria is another option. Its owned by Drs. Foster and smith. 

I've never ordered live goods from them but for some reason if I was going to I wouldn't have any fears. 

Inverts factory is great as well. Milalic (Pedro) said he sold out of the ottos he had and since they're seasonal he is waiting to get another order..

-Andrew


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## deondrec (Sep 30, 2008)

i got two from petsmart. wanted to order them but shipping was like 30 dollars. however i put the recommended dosage of excel in my tank and it killed one and 6 of my 9 ghost shrimp and all 6 nerite snails.


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## Raul-7 (Oct 17, 2003)

I agree, it's hit and miss. I got 3 from a quality LFS, all of them died within 36 hours. Bought 2 from Petsmart and they're still alive for 3+ weeks. 

I read an article saying it has to do with the way their captured from the wild with cyanide and that they are starved (sunken-bellies).


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## cojo0667 (Feb 21, 2008)

Have you looked at buying on Aquabid? There are all sorts of fish for sale on that website from different sellers. its like the ebay for fish if you dont know what aquabid is.


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## cojo0667 (Feb 21, 2008)

also, i have bottom from invertz on aquabid and got 2 extra fish when i ordered my rainbows from him.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

I've ordered a dozen at the local Incredipet. I guess we will see how they turn out. I have ordered some fish from Pedro at Invertz Factory, but I guess he had no otos in stock currently. Once again, thanks for the replies.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Just wanted to update this post and say, my adventure with Incredipet has been quite bad. Out of the 15 otos I got at Incredipet on Tuesday, at least 6 are dead, and several more are looking quire poor or are MIA. I noticed on all that have died so far that their tail fins are damaged. They are the sole inhabitants of my 75g at the moment so I can only conclude they came that way. I did notice when I recieved them that they seemed pale, and have not ever really colored up. 

Ces't la vie.


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## coolnick (Oct 28, 2006)

I have a couple in my 65g that I got from Petsmart about 6 or 7 years ago and I just added 4 to my 10g from Petsmart over the weekend. So far so good.


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## smoq (Feb 19, 2008)

Invertzfactory have tiger Otocinclus, I like the way it looks, but it is a little on the expensive side. Have any of you keep them?


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## WinstonAMC (Oct 20, 2008)

I have a tiger and I love him, he is in with 3 regular otos and shrimp in a nano. Very nice fish, probably 50? larger than regular otos, much less skittish and more visible than regular otos. I know they are a bit pricy, but I am sure glad I went for it.


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## rasetsu (Oct 11, 2007)

Nothing wrong with Petsmart and Petco. IME, the ones that live the longest have come from those two stores. They are cheapest there and because of high rate of unsuccessful acclimation with otos, the return policies from these places are great for otos.

I've ordered them online once and had a 75% DOA rate. The ones that did make it didn't last a week.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Fortunately Incredipet has a good return policy also. I picked them up the day they came in, which perhaps was inadvisable, but it was a special order. I guess that reiterates the fact that you should only buy fish that have been in the LFS for a week or so.


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## adamprice271 (Jun 10, 2006)

Bowles42 said:


> Fortunately Incredipet has a good return policy also. I picked them up the day they came in, which perhaps was inadvisable, but it was a special order. I guess that reiterates the fact that you should only buy fish that have been in the LFS for a week or so.


If it was a special order, I'd take them the day they came in too. Its better than letting them get acclimated for a little bit, and then stressing them out by catching and bagging again only to re-acclimate them later. IME, getting them right away and into a QT tank at home so they can acclimate once, where they will stay is best. Sounds like the way they came in, if you didn't get them they would have just died at the LFS.

Adam


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Just wanted to post another small update that only two of twelve I picked up on Tuesday are alive at this point. I will be suprised if they make until morning. I have noticed blood around the gills on several of the deceased. Any clue if this indicates something?


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## Down_Shift (Sep 20, 2008)

Oto's are very risky. It's a gamble to get good ones etc. I think I purchased a total of 18 before I finally got 10 that are doing ok for the past 3 months.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Did you drip-acclimate them?

Red gills can be a sign of acclimation issues.

Or parasites.


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## SnyperP (Dec 31, 2004)

I will never buy otos online or on a fresh order from a LFS. The survival rate is simply too low. I always buy 3-4 at a time locally at a petsmart or petco. They have a very lenient return policy. If one dies, i'll freeze it until another dies and then exchange the two for a fresh two until the policy ends. Usually by the end of the return policy duration, i'll have 3 otos that survived out of 6-7. 

Also, has anyone noticed that the survival rate of otos is better if you have otos already in the tank?


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## Down_Shift (Sep 20, 2008)

SnyperP said:


> I will never buy otos online or on a fresh order from a LFS. The survival rate is simply too low. I always buy 3-4 at a time locally at a petsmart or petco. They have a very lenient return policy. If one dies, i'll freeze it until another dies and then exchange the two for a fresh two until the policy ends. Usually by the end of the return policy duration, i'll have 3 otos that survived out of 6-7.
> 
> *Also, has anyone noticed that the survival rate of otos is better if you have otos already in the tank?*


YES. I thought it was because they are better in a school. Didn't think anyone else noticed.


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## born2lovefish (Dec 29, 2006)

They are all wild caught and usually come in to stores after being imported. Usually stressed and then bought and stressed some more. Personally, I always wait a while to see how the shipment is doing before I buy otos.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

@lauralee Yes, they were drip acclimated.


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## Down_Shift (Sep 20, 2008)

Just curious, how big were the oto? I have bought some really really small mini's and they NEVER survive without having some oto living in the tank already.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

@Down_Shift The otos were about an inch and a half long.


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## zzyzx85 (Feb 13, 2008)

That's about the size I got mine at.

I had a 50% success rate with otos from Petsmart, but I found a LFS that carried them and they were 100% success rate. All were drip acclimated.

Otos are tough to get acclimated to tanks but once they've made it past the critical period, they have a reputation of being pretty hardy.


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## FobbyBobby (Mar 7, 2004)

I've purchased 6 otos (in batches of 3) from Petsmart in two different states and over that span 4 have died relatively quickly after they were purchased (latest one died was 3 months after purchase). Interestingly, each batch of 3 has had 1 oto live a minimum of 4 years.

In fact, one of my otos is going on its 6th year (I feel like I literally have a child). The other one I bought while at college and it is going on its 3rd year. 

All the otos in their respective trios were exposed to the same conditions and all acclimated the same way via drip-acclimation. It is interesting to see how some from seemingly similar environments have such variations in their survival. The fact that it took 3 months to "weed" out the "weak" otos that died from the "super" otos indicates that waiting for that initial die-off that most LFS get when they first receive a shipment of otos probably isn't enough yet. 

This leads me to believe that LFS that are more of the mom and pop variety and typically have stock on hand for longer probably would give you better survival rates. Petsmart and Petco and the like are probably higher traffic areas since they appeal to a more general population, so people probably go and buy their otos much more quickly than a mom and pop style store.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Just wanted to post an update on this topic. Thought I would give Incredipet another try since I have few options and it is convenient. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

My wife picked up an order of 30 otocinclus to stock two 120's last night. I put them in a 29g quarintine that is both planted and cycled. The aquarium housed 10 black neon tetras and 10 cory's until yesterday afternoon when I pulled them and put them in one of the 120's.

By 10:00 this morning, 4 dead, by noon 8 dead. Same symptoms as the last batch. Red underbellies, and caudal fin damage. Tank parameters are all normal, did a 70 percent water change this morning. If I can't find a good online source I'm either going to have to drive a couple hours to get to a decent fish store, or forego otos all together.

Ryan


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## Superedwin (Jan 19, 2009)

Just make sure you accumulate them slowly and make sure there are lots of plant and add bleach zucchini, cucumber, or etc. Since usually they are shipped with no food and when they get to the lfs not much food either. so just make sure you do that.


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

Once past the introduction to different water conditions their just about bullet proof.
I'm having to guess I've been unbelievably lucky not to have losses. 
(I'm NEVER lucky,,, my first RAOK here cost me $20.00 out of pocket to complete) Only to lose two out of over twenty purchased for my three tanks. 
I weight / float a pitcher in the corner of my quarantine tank and every 5 minutes add 1/2 a cup of tank water until the bag in the pitcher is full. Empty more than 1/2 and do it again. I pour the water from high (6") over the pitcher so it splashes going in. Then when filled dump 90% of that down the sink and release the fish in the 10g.
All of the ottos I've received at the LFS have been within 48hrs. of delivery and have had stubs for tails. Art told me the fish eat each others tails in transit, true or not they've all had stub tails.

Everything posted here makes more sense than my methods but the possible difference being the pour of the tank water adding more O2, and the fact their all swimming and eating.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

I always drip acclimate them. I'm kinda at a loss.


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

Bowles42 said:


> I always drip acclimate them. I'm kinda at a loss.


Everything posted here makes more sense than my methods but the possible difference being the pour of the tank water adding more O2.

Me Too :confused1:


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## marrow (Feb 4, 2007)

I bought a bunch of them at once from invertzfactory when they had the regular ones and every one survived. I purchased I think 20 of them. They are in a large heavily planted tank and if one disappeared I would never notice but they all seem healthy and happy to me a year later now.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

9:45 update: 19 Dead. Expect more deaths by morning.


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## florafan (Jan 21, 2006)

I too had incredibly bad luck with otos. I bought 2 batches of 3 from the lfs and from each batch I only have one fish surviving beyound a few days. The one from the first purchase survived for about 6 months and the remaining one has been around for over a year now and is still going strong. The lfs got them from the same whole seller at the same time, and I don't know why one makes it and the other 85% didn't!


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Only three left alive this morning when I got up.


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## wkndracer (Mar 14, 2009)

Bowles42 said:


> Only three left alive this morning when I got up.


If you like I can ask Art which supplier his ottos ship through. Maybe that would provide an alternate source. I know LFS here receive from Blue Springs Hatchery Inc. in Alabama as well as others in south Florida. Scratch the 'if you like' comment I'll just ask him first of the week and PM his responce.

Sorry your having such an issue. I know how frustrating it can be to lose livestock.


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## eyebeatbadgers (Aug 6, 2007)

Bowles42 said:


> If I can't find a good online source I'm either going to have to drive a couple hours to get to a decent fish store, or forego otos all together.
> 
> Ryan


Have you tried Petsmart?

There are two in Lexington, much closer to you than a couple hours I believe. I've bought several from them in the past, and have over half live. Not a percentage I like much, but it's better than what you've experienced.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

No, I haven't given petsmart a try yet. I'm thinking of placing an order through Live Aquaria just to try something different. There's a good place in Louisville too (East End Aquatics) which is a about an hour away, but they said their price per oto was $5.99.

Two left alive this morning, and they both look relatively healthy.


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## requiem (Oct 25, 2008)

I find ottos pretty hit and miss too. One thing to keep in mind - why are you getting them? They are pretty delicate initially, and only eat green algae. Unless your tank has steady green algae you'll have to feed them pellets. 

I just find many people buy these poor guys thinking they'll keep their tanks clean. They are used to strong currents in shallow water with plenty of fluffy green algae.

Here's a good site for info on these.

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/Otofaqs.htm


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

There is a lot of information there, thank you for the link. 

I feel like I have all the right conditions for otos, and besides the two batches I bought at incredipet, haven't had any serious problems with keeping them alive.

That article said several times that they don't eat diatoms, but I've heard conflicting information about this and could have sworn to have seen mine grazing on brown diatoms.

Thanks again,
Ryan


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## o snap its eric (Jan 12, 2004)

isnt the shipping cost way more expensive than the actual cost of the otos? You will need to order a lot otos to justify the cost.


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## tlef316 (May 10, 2008)

i've actually had realativly good luck with otos. i bought a batch of 6 that were very small. 3 were dead within 3 days. i bought 6 larger ones the next week, and they all survived. as far as i can see, all 9 are thriving in my 75 gallon. fat bellies and tons of energy. The funny thing is that one is a loner. he hangs out all by himself on the right side of my tank (on the valis) while the other 8 spend 99% of hteir time on the left side on the tiger lotus. Very strange. Guess he's a loser or something.


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

It sounds like you are doing everything right in terms of acclimating them so i'm afraid I don't have much to add, the only thing I can think of would be is there enough algae in the QT tank for the otos to eat? if not i'd maybe add a piece of blanched zuchini and some algae wafers to give them some options, they're sure to be starving when they first get in the tank.

But I did want to add that my Otos definitely cleared my tanks of diatomacious algae and I know a lot of people recommend them for that, i had lots of brown dust looking stuff (diatom algae) in my 5g and when i put Otos in they went to town on it, so i'd say yes, they eat that :tongue: 

I am sorry to hear you are having such bad luck with the otos though, I know others have said it but I was really happy with my fish order from Pedro (InvertzFactory) and I've heard good things about LiveAquaria and AquaBid. If you're looking for 30 otos I imagine that will make the cost of shipping worth it. 

Good luck!


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Yeah the tank was full of diatoms and even so I don't think it's my fault if they starve to death in the first 24-48 hours or so.

I'm going to put in an order to live aquaria, I'll post my experiences here.


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## grillmasterp (Jan 4, 2009)

Bowles42 said:


> No, I haven't given petsmart a try yet.


Otos are the only fish I've purchased from Petsmart. 
$1.99 each AND a 2 week guarantee. Just freeze the dead ones in a ziploc bag to bring as proof for the replacement.


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## dr.tran (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey I can send u some ottos. I have a very nice LFS around here that has the best ottos I ever had. I bought 10 from them and only 2 died because I messed around with my co2 too much and posined them. Otherwise they are amazing and healthy. 

Its a nice little LFS that seems to really take good care of the fish they have.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Just wanted to post an update to this thread. Last Thursday I placed an order through Liveaquaria for the 30 otocinclus, as well as 5 German Blue Rams, 30 Black Neon Tetras, and 12 Glass Catfish. 

Liveaquaria sent me one extra each of everything but the rams. One ram was DOA, and one Glass catfish was practically DOA.

As of today (Tuesday) I have remaining 3 German Blue Rams, 26 Otocinclus, 30 plus or minus Tetras, and 8-9 Glass Catfish. Overall I am pleased with my experience, the fish seem generally healthy and they were reasonably priced.

They have a 14 day guarantee, and I have an e-mail into their customer service department on the dead fish. I will update when that issue is resolved. 

Ryan


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## MarkMc (Apr 27, 2007)

I bought 4 at Walmart close to a year ago. They are doing very well.


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## Bowles42 (Mar 5, 2008)

Just wanted to update and say that Liveaquaria has already credited my account for the dead fish.

Ryan


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## Karackle (Dec 11, 2007)

Sounds like they are a good place to buy from! Mostly healthy fish, good customer service! 

Glad to hear you seem to have a healthier crop of Otos finally! I hope the numbers stay up for you!


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## pealow (May 11, 2008)

dr.tran said:


> Hey I can send u some ottos. I have a very nice LFS around here that has the best ottos I ever had. I bought 10 from them and only 2 died because I messed around with my co2 too much and posined them. Otherwise they are amazing and healthy.
> 
> Its a nice little LFS that seems to really take good care of the fish they have.


What LFS are you talking about, I live in Queens and am looking for a good shop. Can you tell me where it is???

Paula


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## wendyjo (Feb 20, 2009)

I find they are hit or miss as well. One of the problems is that they need algae, and they just don't get that in the pet stores. Those tanks are clean as a whistle (for our benefit - consumers don't want to see algae in the tanks) and many of those poor otos are starved when you buy them. Unless you have a serious algae outbreak for them to feed on it may just be too late for them. Trying to feed veges and wafers helps, but sometimes it takes them a while to recognize these things as food (remember they are wild caught and not familiar with these things) and they still starve. It's kinda sad - they go thru so much just to end up in our tanks. Wild caught, and many times with the use of chemicals, starved, etc. I love them but sort of wish they weren't available for sale and could just live their lives in peace. I hate to think of how they must suffer just to entertain me in my tank.

Having said that - I am thinking of getting some. I suck.


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## MarkMc (Apr 27, 2007)

wendyjo said:


> I find they are hit or miss as well. One of the problems is that they need algae, and they just don't get that in the pet stores. Those tanks are clean as a whistle (for our benefit - consumers don't want to see algae in the tanks) and many of those poor otos are starved when you buy them. Unless you have a serious algae outbreak for them to feed on it may just be too late for them. Trying to feed veges and wafers helps, but sometimes it takes them a while to recognize these things as food (remember they are wild caught and not familiar with these things) and they still starve. It's kinda sad - they go thru so much just to end up in our tanks. Wild caught, and many times with the use of chemicals, starved, etc. I love them but sort of wish they weren't available for sale and could just live their lives in peace. I hate to think of how they must suffer just to entertain me in my tank.
> 
> Having said that - I am thinking of getting some. I suck.


LOL But just think...you might be the only hope those ottos have of living out their lives. Save the Ottos!


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