# just started a 10g... need opinions



## philoserenus (Jan 9, 2007)

the 'mystery' plant in the middle should be a sword plant (echinodorus sp.).


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## Cheeseybacon (Feb 13, 2005)

First of all, that nasty multi-colored gravel needs to go ASAP. Appearance opinions aside, it isn't exactly an ideal substrate for plants. Consider either Eco-complete or Flourite instead.

Secondly, planted tanks do NOT need cycled, if you have sufficient number of plants (which you don't). Plants do an amazing job of sucking up all of the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates, which are the primary components involved in a typical aquarium cycle. In many ways your plants become the "bio filter".

Third, I strongly recommend you hold off on plants and keep this tank as a fish-only tank until you can get ALL of the necessary equipment to properly support live plants. I look at your tank and I see a mirror image of myself with my 1st 10-gallon planted tank. Look like you're heading down the exact same path I was initially heading with my 10-gallon, and let me tell you, it wasn't a good path. Read up first, then save, then buy everything necessary to support your plants all at once. It's been my experience that trying to buy everything bit by bit as you get money only makes the tank suffer in the meantime.

Finally, I suggest you thoroughly read every little bit of info from RexGrigg.com twice, before going any further. Lots of good info on there. It should be required reading followed by a quiz afterward for membership on this forum. :tongue:


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## bravofleet4 (Feb 25, 2007)

i think that swordplant is going to outgrow your 10 gallon. 

you can spruce up your tank with some driftwood which you can collect from a beach, creak, or pond and some rocks to tie down more plants

after you're done cycling, with only 3 danio's you have yet to reach your carrying capacity. Other fish that you could consider are cory's (same species and in groups of 3 or more), other small schoaling fish, a blue gourami, bettas, and guppies to name a few. 

before you buy from any store I would check craigslist and ebay first. If you can't find anything better and have to do store check their on-line prices and see if they'll match it in-store. I think there's like a REALLY CHEAP $10.00 hood at petsmart site called economy hood that uses regular bulbs. I don't know I just thought that was too cheap for me lol so I just got a regular strip light which cost me $21.00 but that also meant getting a glass canopy, so that's an additional $8.00

But I can't offer much since I haven't even planted my tank yet but am in the process of ordering and planning....lol


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

Cheeseybacon said:


> First of all, that nasty multi-colored gravel needs to go ASAP. Appearance opinions aside, it isn't exactly an ideal substrate for plants. Consider either Eco-complete or Flourite instead.
> 
> Secondly, planted tanks do NOT need cycled, if you have sufficient number of plants (which you don't). Plants do an amazing job of sucking up all of the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates, which are the primary components involved in a typical aquarium cycle. In many ways your plants become the "bio filter".
> 
> ...


THANKS for the reply.

after reading rexgrigg.com i think i've realized i don't know much about planted tanks... however, i know a lot more now, so thanks for the resourse!

I'm gonna try to find some Eco-complete or Flourite today during lunch. preferrably eco-complete since you don't have to rinse it before use... And even if it doesn't become a planted tank right away, at least the eco-complete will be there when i want to make it a planted tank. I thought the blue mixed with black would look nice, but I am colorblind so I could be WAY off... probably gonna go all black on the bottom. Is there a problem with taking everything out of the tank (fish and plants) and just mixing the eco complete in with the gravel i have? rexgrigg.com says you can mix onyx or flourite with gravel 50/50 but nothing about mixing eco-complete with gravel...

also, what's the purpose of the peat moss under the substrate?

still wanna paint the back of the tank black, anyone see a problem with that?

as for light fixture... i still don't know what to get...


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

bravofleet4 said:


> i think that swordplant is going to outgrow your 10 gallon.
> 
> you can spruce up your tank with some driftwood which you can collect from a beach, creak, or pond and some rocks to tie down more plants
> 
> ...


i figured it would outgrow my tank, but when that happens i'll put it in the 40 gallon tank my roommate has. 

also, i found some sword grass at a lfs... would that be a better match for my tank?

I'm going camping this weekend and will be on the lookout for driftwood... anything to stay away from? and do i just soak it til it sinks then throw it in?

I'm also gonna get some river stones this weekend. What do I stay away from in that regard? and do i need to do anything to them to make them ready to put in the tank?


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

I would just use the eco in your 10 gallon. You should be ok doing the switch.
Need more light,more plants,more plants,more plants and a source of carbon. Then some line of fertz. Good luck and read read read.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

Orlando said:


> I would just use the eco in your 10 gallon. You should be ok doing the switch.
> Need more light,more plants,more plants,more plants and a source of carbon. Then some line of fertz. Good luck and read read read.



how much light? 2wpg? 3wpg? don't wanna go too high cause i'm not ready to add CO2 yet.

and what kind of plants would you recommend?


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

ok, just bought some eco-complete... is peat moss on the bottom necessary?


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

update... even though i don't think anyone is gonna read.

moved the HUGE sword plant to the 55g tank. 
no more blue rocks, just black eco-complete. 
moved in some micro sword grass and it's doing pretty well after NEARLY dying in a lightless tank. 
also have three aponongeton bulbs that are flourishing.
the moneywort that was in the back corner has now been split apart, the DEAD parts removed (with some crazy looking white fuzz on it) and there are only three stems left but seem to be doing well. 
also bought a cheap fake root thing for some of the fish to hide in.

current fish: 2 albino cory's, 1 algae eater (not sure what kind), 1 pleco (also not sure what kind), 1 black molly, 1 danio, and 3 shrimp.

will post pics when i get a chance.

also gonna buy the ahsupply lighting setup when i can (stupid speeding ticket)


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## LeapingGnome (Apr 15, 2007)

Nice, sounds like they're doing much better in the eco complete! The darker color probably makes a nice looking tank too.


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## Mr.CC (Apr 24, 2007)

buy some java moss, it look scool, plus u can never have enough of it,,,when i started my ten gallon tank i had 7 serpa tetras, 1 anglefish and 1 pleco, so far its been great none of the fish are fighting, so i'm not complaining, but really java moss, can help make ur tank look great


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## yoko (Mar 16, 2007)

http://www.trafficschoolonline.com

It's a breeze :angel:


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## James From Cali (Dec 15, 2006)

Mr.CC said:


> buy some java moss, it look scool, plus u can never have enough of it,,,when i started my ten gallon tank i had 7 serpa tetras, 1 anglefish and 1 pleco, so far its been great none of the fish are fighting, so i'm not complaining, but really java moss, can help make ur tank look great


But I wouldnt try adding an angelfish and a pleco to a 10g . Java Moss attached to driftwood is great looking though!


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

HEy oven mitt.
Great to see another san antonian here.
For lighting, check out alamo aquatics on bandera road, they have good prices on equiptment. I suggest a sattelite 40W fixture, you can always do a yeast/fermentation/DIY co2 bottle later for a couple bucks.

Fintique on west avenue has great fish and some plants(i'm geussing that's where you got the micro swords from)

Stones and Driftwood:
Stones- If they are lime stone (white, sometimes smooth) then they will raise the PH and hardness dramaticlly.
IF you're not sure, pour vinegar on one and if it bubbles and foams it is not good for the tank.

The river rocks are ussually limestone too. Check out some local landscaping and gravel supply places, we have a bunch of them(at least on the north side) and ask them about rocks, they should be able to tell you if the rocks are lime or no.
Driftwood- I collect Driftwood all over, school, Gaudelupe river, canyon lake, etc. Cedar makes a good wood if you boil it, oak is not very good.

The peat under the substrate lowers P.H and hardness, and adds extra nutrients to the water, and also stains the water.


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## Cydric (Dec 6, 2006)

I want updated pictures!  Tie any kind of aquatic moss to a piece of driftwood using fishing line or sewing thread. Be sure to space it out thoroughly. :thumbsup:


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

ooooh replies!!! 

Dufus... i've checked out alamo aquatics... pretty nice place plus, that eel they have is INCREDIBLE. i may go check out fintique for some plants (probably java moss since everyone has said to). I'm not sure i have enough room for anything else though. 10g aren't big... AT ALL! also, i actually got the micro swords at wal-mart...  also, if you have the hookup with some driftwood or stones... i might just want to buy some from you! and i think i should have thrown some peat under the substrate since out water is hard as hell and the pH is pretty high. i'll probably do that in the 25ish hex tank i'm getting for free... but i've heard growing things in a hex is kinda hard due to the lighting...

pics soon.


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

WM!!! Can't beleive they had Micro swords!
I have some driftwood, but i am gonna use it in my 29 gallon. No stones, but like i said, a rockyard is a good place to check out.

Our water is very hard and high ph, but IME, it supports aquatic life! i had discus in our water.


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## AmoAquafish (Jun 5, 2004)

About painting the background, why don't you use black construction paper on the back? That way it is removable. That's what I do.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

construction paper is a good idea. or butcher paper. i may try it and see how it looks.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

Cydric said:


> I want updated pictures!  Tie any kind of aquatic moss to a piece of driftwood using fishing line or sewing thread. Be sure to space it out thoroughly. :thumbsup:


new pictures coming in soooon...


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## James From Cali (Dec 15, 2006)

I cant wait for pics.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

here it is now...

don't hate on the blue tape in the background. or that the back glass is still clear. but do feel free to give comments
full tank:









full tank:









aponongetons growing pretty well. i think i'm going to move two of them to another tank to make more room in this one. thoughts?









some sort of grass (micro sword?) that almost died but seems to be coming back (the line of new grass behind the algae eater)









the aponongeton bulb on the left doesn't look like the others. it has a few short leaves but nothing like the two next to it. and it also has these sprout things that grew like mad and are circling the top of the tank... what is this?









and what kind of algae eater is this? (and in third picture)


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## dufus (Nov 13, 2006)

It's a chinese algae eater.
Gets pretty big and aggressive, for a 10. The grass looks good, i think it's micro sword.
The apons i think are pretty big for a ten, and if you keep them, i sugeest moving them backward, or trimming often.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

ok... 8 months later, here it is... this is the same tank, believe it or not... MUCH better

full tank shot:










left:










middle:










right:


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## Wisteria_Weaver (Dec 29, 2007)

WOW!!! its ten thousand times better than the first pics. someply marvelous. keep it going and never stop lovng it!


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## Kolkri (Dec 9, 2006)

I miss the gravel from the first picture but this one is much nicer planted. To bad you couldn't just add stuff to make the other gravel work.
Nice work.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

Wisteria_Weaver said:


> WOW!!! its ten thousand times better than the first pics. someply marvelous. keep it going and never stop lovng it!


thanks!!! i'm gonna clean it up this weekend hopefully and take some real pictures and post what all is in the tank...


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## NeonShrimp (Mar 9, 2006)

Nice job, and the neon tetras are a good addition. Please keep us updated


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

NeonShrimp said:


> Nice job, and the neon tetras are a good addition. Please keep us updated


thanks...

right now there are:
7 neon tetra's
3 oto's
1 ramshorn snail
a boatload of RCS.

the plants are:
microsword (still trying to get it to cover the foreground)
2 anubias nana petite
some weeping moss in two locations
some unknown species of moss (i'll try to get pictures)
moneywort in the corners
anacharis in the back
crypts wendtii also in the back


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

lookin good. is that rotala in the rear center? if it is snap it in half or thirds and plant it so it will fill in the back!

what is that in your avatar? kinda scary.


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## pdc2104 (Jan 1, 2008)

It's looking great!!



> right now there are:
> 7 neon tetra's
> 3 oto's
> 1 ramshorn snail
> a boatload of RCS


:thumbsup:


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

bsmith782 said:


> lookin good. is that rotala in the rear center? if it is snap it in half or thirds and plant it so it will fill in the back!
> 
> what is that in your avatar? kinda scary.


nope. it WAS anacharis, now it's in a different tank!

and my avatar is from the cover of a My Chemical Romance album. just like the picture.

update to this one coming soon.


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## Cloudy View (Oct 23, 2007)

what did you use for a light in that tank?

I just bought a 10g and I'm planning on doing some scaping like that.

you used ecocomplete?


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## outcast (Jul 4, 2007)

for a 10 gallon, i'd stick with 6500 daylight twister cfls in an incandescent hood. two 13 watts whould be plenty and cheap. I made the error of underpowering and i had green water, and major bba. mind you i also had only 3 plants from petcetera. and ised the recommended incandescent bulbs. once i switched to a stronger light with the cfls, i ended up with my first two tanks in my "View user Tanks" definatly sufficient. the times i got algae blooms were because i did nothing for a long long time.

i didn't use eco complete, i used another type of flora base that my lfs's planted tank hired specialist swore by.


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

Cloudy View said:


> what did you use for a light in that tank?
> 
> I just bought a 10g and I'm planning on doing some scaping like that.
> 
> you used ecocomplete?


i have an AHSupply enclosure with their now-not-offered-anymore 2x13w kit. 1x 10,000K bulb and 1x 6,700K bulb. I highly recommend that setup. if you wanna go a little higher tech (higher lighting, higher co2) get their 1x36w kit. order 1x 10,000K bulb and 1x 6700K and see which one you like better.

and yes, it's eco complete and i'm pretty happy with it.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

any updates?


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## ovenmit331 (Mar 27, 2007)

WELL... the tank is COMPLETELY overgrown. it's like a ridiculous jungle in there. the filter stopped working about 2 or 3 months ago with no noticeable ill effects. Tom's Rapids Mini Canister filters suck. end of story. no WC's in the same amount of time, also with no ill effects. just fill it up every once in a while. barely ever feed the fish... maybe 2 or 3 times a week... they're all doing fine. no CO2 at all but the jungle is so thick that barely any light gets through to cause algae.

i want to completely pull out the two types of stem plants i have in there, but i'm afraid it'll wreak havoc on everything. and i'm 99% sure the RCS have TONS of babies all in the jungle...

just gotta find time to figure this tank out.


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## fishsandwitch (Apr 20, 2008)

Pics! Please!


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## pope_luke (Nov 14, 2007)

I'd actually love to see the aftermath of the tank breakdown. I'm sure that compared to the very first pictures you posted long ago, they'd still be favorable. Also, I find it interesting to see how things get overgrown. You had a really nice tank look in your last update, so the contrast might be really fun to see.
Also, once you clean the whole thing up and bring it back to life, you'll have the mess to compare it to, and it'll look all the more fantastic for it.


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