# 10 gallon low tech moss and shrimp tank - Setup stage (56k)



## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

While I wait for my 2 new tanks to mature, ideas keep floating as I browse through the forums and find wonderful scapes and plants. My latest addiction is moss. I have an old truvu 10g tank, a hang on filter, a 50W heater and a 24" T5HO so I wondered whether I should put them back in use. Cannot afford to buy any more expensive aquarium gadget. Nor in mood of any more DIY, so this one has to be low tech and low maintenance. Moss fits excellent with this profile (no CO2). With a basic filter and a moss only tank, shrimps seems to be ideal for fauna.

But one thing for sure, no java moss or christmas moss in this tank. Already have those in my other tanks. I am thinking

Fissidens Zippelianus
Fissidens Fontanus
Fissidens splachnobryoides
Weeping moss
Flame moss 
Peacock moss

Any ideas?

Also does anybody close or local to Bay Area, CA (or not) has any of these for sale?

I have absolutely not thought of the scape, substrate etc. or studied about the moss, so any and all suggestions (co2, fert, substrate, photo period, PH, GH....) are welcome.

I will post my pictures later on (nothing much to post at this stage other than an empty tank:icon_bigg)


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

mosses can survive in basically all conditions you throw at them. they prefer cooler water tho, but so do shrimp so dont set the heater above 70-72. good luck with the shrimp!


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

chris127 said:


> mosses can survive in basically all conditions you throw at them. they prefer cooler water tho, but so do shrimp so dont set the heater above 70-72. good luck with the shrimp!


Thank you chris127. 

I am thinking of keeping 2 varieties of shrimp. Any suggestions on combo?

Also does any other shrimp has tendency to climn out like amanos do sometimes?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Here are some combinations I am thinking of about the shrimp

1. CRS & Amano
2. Bumble bee & Amano
3. Tiger & Amano (replaced CRS & ghost)

please poll :icon_bigg or suggest a different combination of color + utility.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Either 1 or 2. 1 if you are using a black substrate that will be visible, but bumble bees are less common than crs. I love willow and flame moss, nice contrast.


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

ghost? no ghosts, theyre evil!!! i like super tigers and miniamis, but thats me  second would be super high grade CRS. i wish i could keep shrimp alive


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

clwatkins10 said:


> Either 1 or 2. 1 if you are using a black substrate that will be visible, but bumble bees are less common than crs. I love willow and flame moss, nice contrast.


Thank you for your suggestion clwatkins. 

I think I will cover the entire substrate with moss carpet, so the base will green. Since moss really does not need substrate (or am I wrong), I am inclined to regular pea gravel from petco/petsmart (no fancy aquasoil).

I love bumble bees but yes they are not common. AFA sells bumble bees and they breed them too. Since I am close to SF I have easy access but they are soooo expensive ($10-$20 each )


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

chris127 said:


> ghost? no ghosts, theyre evil!!! i like super tigers and miniamis, but thats me  second would be super high grade CRS. i wish i could keep shrimp alive


So increasing #3 does not seem to be high on anybody's list. So probably that will be out. Hoping to get some more opinions.

Thanks for the suggestion chris127. And I have a couple of questions
1. Why do you say "evil"? Just for my knowledge
2. I checked out the tiger shrimp profile...wonderful...that comes in consideration immediately. What are miniamis...did not find anything...do you have a link/photo?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

$1000 shrimp!!!!!!!!!!! check out this link

http://www.tetra-fish.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7348


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

minamis are wild type neocaridinas. theyre subtle and natural looking imo  i'll be getting some for the mini m

ghosts will eat your sick/small ornamental shrimp and out compete them for food you feed them. and they just look down right creepy! :flick:


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

http://www.theshrimptank.com/ShrimpSpecies/WildTypeNeocaridina.shtml


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## connordude27 (Jun 14, 2008)

wow i go to that site and yet i've never seen that thread but WOW!!!!


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

I like the minamis too. Where do you buy them from chris127? Local or online?

Is there any good online vendor who specializes in shrimp?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

connordude27 said:


> wow i go to that site and yet i've never seen that thread but WOW!!!!


probably bcos it hibernated over a year ago :icon_bigg


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

While the shrimp poll continues, I have to search for mosses first. Anybody who has and want's to sell
Fissidens Zippelianus
Fissidens Fontanus
Fissidens splachnobryoides
Weeping moss
Flame moss 
Peacock moss
or any other moss except java and christmas, please PM me with pics and cost.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

malaybiswas said:


> I like the minamis too. Where do you buy them from chris127? Local or online?
> 
> Is there any good online vendor who specializes in shrimp?


Never mind, I saw the "store" link on the link you posted.

Here is one more link. The variety is awesome and I am puzzled (I want them all )

http://www.aquatic-store.com/en-us/dept_307.html.

Does anybody has any experience with this store? reviews?


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## chase127 (Jun 8, 2008)

i always post WTB ads for shrimp in the SNS or other forum classifieds, best service and prices imo.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

chris127 said:


> i always post WTB ads for shrimp in the SNS or other forum classifieds, best service and prices imo.


Yeah I agree. I have already located fissidens splachnobryoides, fissidens fontanus, peacock moss and taiwan moss from this forum. Still looking for the others.

Lookout for shrimp will probably start in a few weeks.


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## Kayen (Oct 14, 2007)

You guys are so lucky you can find mosses easily.
I love moss scapes.
Looking forward to this .


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Is there any special requirement for cycling shrimp only tanks. I have practiced fishless cycling for 3 tanks now. However even after complete cycling, when fish is added, there has been occasional spike in ammonia and nitrite (0.25-0.5 range). Never had any problems even with discus or cardinals for those small spikes for a few days till the bacteria adjusted to the load.

However I don't any idea of tolerence limit of shrimps for such spikes.

Anybody has any experience or suggestions how to cycle the tank (fishless or other) and what stage and how many shrimps should I add at a time?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Viettxboii said:


> You guys are so lucky you can find mosses easily.
> I love moss scapes.
> Looking forward to this .


In case you are looking and have not seen yet, aquaticmagic on ebay has a good collection of exotic mosses. They ship from asia but they do regular business in north america and europe. 

I have a few members from USA who have sellable quantities of some of the uncommon mosses but I am not sure about customs implications for sending live plant from US to Canada. However if you are interested, I can get you in touch with them.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Hey any suggestions on cycling?

Ordered my first set of mosses. Expecting to get them next Tuesday. I have to start setting up the tank over the weekend.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Hey...anybody with star moss experience? I ordered some out of curiosity. 

I know...they are not aquatic. But some have had success. Got a tip that they prefer alkaline water, so may be I'll give it a shot!!

All the moss has been ordered. Expecting to get them within the next week or 2.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

This is how the future moss tank is currently utilized . The stuff in it will have to find a new place, but the moss tank will still remain in the same location (my wife won't allow me additional desk space for tanks :icon_cry


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Also found the old hang on filter and heater to be used










Scavanging in the garage was quite exciting. Hopefully I would find more more long lost stuff that I can put to use. In my faint recollection, I might have some bg and rocks unless I totally trashed them.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

And a piece of rock and 3 pieces of mopani wood that I bought last March but never used. This is cool. I only need to buy wire mesh, gravels and moss ties now.


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## soundtweakers (Oct 12, 2005)

good luck with this tank, it should be a pretty cool moss tank. Let us know when you get your moss and don't forget to post pics.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

soundtweakers said:


> good luck with this tank, it should be a pretty cool moss tank. Let us know when you get your moss and don't forget to post pics.


Thanks soundtweakers. I am expecting some fissidens and peacock moss the end of this week. More pics are coming up before that for the setup process


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Cheap backdrop. A roll of old self adhesive cabinet liner will do the job for covering the back to hide the filter and CO2 equipment sharing the stand cabinet space with this tank.










Thats as much of garage scavanging I can do in a day


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

Woah where'd you get that cool looking 10 gallon?:icon_eek:


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Awesome! I can't wait!


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

ZooTycoonMaster said:


> Woah where'd you get that cool looking 10 gallon?:icon_eek:


Pet club in Hayward. They always have lots of truvu in stock and real cheap. There should be some around santa clara as well...google pet club. Bad thing...they take cash/debit card only.

There is another view.


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## soundtweakers (Oct 12, 2005)

I always love the cleaning bare tank part, you always get that "wow" feeling after a nice clean up and become clear and shine obsessed!!:thumbsup:


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

soundtweakers said:


> I always love the cleaning bare tank part, you always get that "wow" feeling after a nice clean up and become clear and shine obsessed!!:thumbsup:


Actually it is not as clean as it seems in the picture. I had some "postit"s on it which have left some mark. Not visible on camera (yet) but still there. I have to clean those too, but need to be careful not to scratch the arylic.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Thank you clwatkins10.

Meanwhile I bought the rest of the hardware required.

1. Regular pea gravel from petco









2. Some 1/8" wire mesh from Ace Hardware for moss carpets









3. Plant ties for securing the wire mesh.


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## soundtweakers (Oct 12, 2005)

aha, looks like you are set for those arriving moss. :thumbsup:

best of luck and can't wait to see the magic happen!!


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Not much work today. Just finished the backdrop


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## Phoenix-cry (Dec 25, 2008)

Cool


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Can anybody help me with stocking suggestions. I am considering a combination of banana yellow (or cherry red), cardina japonica and bumble bee.

Approximately how many total should I keep at most for a healthy shrimp only habitat in 8-10 gallons?


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

malaybiswas said:


> Can anybody help me with stocking suggestions. I am considering a combination of banana yellow (or cherry red), cardina japonica and bumble bee.
> 
> Approximately how many total should I keep at most for a healthy shrimp only habitat in 8-10 gallons?


Shrimp have very low bio-loads. I have had a couple hundred cherries in a ten gallon one time


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

clwatkins10 said:


> Shrimp have very low bio-loads. I have had a couple hundred cherries in a ten gallon one time


Wow! that's a lot of shrimp but that opens so many possibilities. The more I am studying about shrimps the more I am falling in love with all the wonderful varieties out there. If I keep 8-10 each of different species, I can still keep 5-6 species that I have my eyes on. Thanks a lot clwatkins


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Yesterday I prepared the basic layout of the tank.

A layer of gravel about 1/2" thick









Trial positioning of the hardscape and BW...









...and instruments









Next I cut the wire mesh to fill the open ground. First I cut a rough rectangle for the left side and overlayed it to check the proportions.









Next it was cut to smaller pieces to match the open surface around the rock.









Similarly for right rear between the BW









and the rear center









and the front left and center









Complete layout plan









Finally placed the tank in it's "tomb". BWs are just kept in there for now to leach tannin. They will be properly repositioned when I am ready to plant









Filled with water and cycling started. The filter and heater will run on timer for the time being to save energy (PG&E rate hikes are killing me)









I also added a dose of Fritz starter bacteria to jump start the cycling. I used it to cycle my previous 3 tanks and it never failed me. Love it.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

This is my initial planting layout scheme.

Each shape of the wire mesh were cut out twice so that the moss can be sandwiched between them and tied with the plant ties.









and planting scheme









I am expecting to receive my first order of moss to arrive today. If they do, I will probably have my initial planted tank photos tomorrow.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Nice layout. The wood looks good. Are your energy rates that high?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

clwatkins10 said:


> Nice layout. The wood looks good. Are your energy rates that high?


went up this month...approx 30%


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Just received my first batch of moss. Planting day today


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

wow. thats awesome. post a pic of the moss in the wire once you're finished. who did you get the moss from? overseas or was it a member on the forum?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

monkeyruler90 said:


> wow. thats awesome. post a pic of the moss in the wire once you're finished. who did you get the moss from? overseas or was it a member on the forum?


This batch is from a member. There are some more I have ordered from other members and overseas as well.


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## jeepn4x4 (Jan 27, 2008)

How are things coming along? That wire mess you got is it similiar to window screen material?


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

jeepn4x4 said:


> How are things coming along? That wire mess you got is it similiar to window screen material?


tank is running fine but low tech lights are not good enough for photography so I have not posted anything so far. Working on a diy led light panel.


I don't know what that mesh is called exactly but same stuff you see in lfs for making carpetted plants. It is not window screen material. Should find in any hardware store. I got mine from ACE hardware


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