# Suggestions for fish to complement Ember Tetras?



## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

One way to narrow the list down is to chose a body type and / or preferred swimming level.

Check out Paracheirodon simulans (green neon), they tend to hang around the bottom. Yet another option is a larger shoal of micro cories, around 12+.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

OVT said:


> One way to narrow the list down is to chose a body type and / or preferred swimming level.
> 
> Check out Paracheirodon simulans (green neon), they tend to hang around the bottom. Yet another option is a larger shoal of micro cories, around 12+.


Good Point. The Embers tend to hang around the top/middle, and the Rams will hang around the middle/bottom I think? Those Green Neons are nice! I've also thought about black neons. I'm assuming they also like to hang around the bottom?

Maybe something a little bit different shaped than the Embers though, which is why I was looking at the Emperor/Kerri tetras earlier which seem to be a little wider and taller body shape. I've considered Cories but my concern is that I understand they like to dig, and because of the way my tank is set up I don't want anything that will push the substrate around if I can help it. Anymore than my Amanos do already that is.


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## Alyson Joy (Jun 13, 2018)

Dwarf neon rainbowfish. (Praecox)


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## theatermusic87 (Jun 22, 2014)

celestial pearl danios are another decent one, and can usually be found at your lfs so you can check them out in person


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## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

@DJGSnax: Emperor Tetras et al are x2-3 larger then Embers. You might find the combination visually out of scale, even in the 36g. Cories, especially hastatus, habrosus, and pigmaeus, do not move substrate.

I happen to have Embers + Green Neons + C. habrosus in a 17g. This thread has a bunch of pictures (more coming later today) if you want to get some visuals. In the end, personal taste is all that matters.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/12-tank-journals/1261106-60-p-re-do-led-co2.html

Bump: you can see all 3 in this one (look hard  )


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## discuspaul (Jul 27, 2010)

As was already suggested just above, Celestial Pearl Danios are a great choice, o
or alternatively, any of the micro Rasboras - the Boraras species - check them out.


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## tamsin (Jan 12, 2011)

I've Sundadanio axelrodi and embers


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## CT_Ram (Sep 10, 2017)

At least my black neons stay really at the top, they never go to the bottom at all. My green neons pick on each other a bit more than the cardinals. I do like their color more than the cardinals but i like that the cardinals are more quiet. If you have a lid maybe dwarf hatchfish? They are really different but jump.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

Alyson Joy said:


> Dwarf neon rainbowfish. (Praecox)


I looked at Dwarf Rainbowfish. Seems like the minimum group of 6 would end up considerably larger than my tank would properly handle. They grow pretty big still don't they? Like 3"+?

Bump:


OVT said:


> @DJGSnax: Emperor Tetras et al are x2-3 larger then Embers. You might find the combination visually out of scale, even in the 36g. Cories, especially hastatus, habrosus, and pigmaeus, do not move substrate.
> 
> I happen to have Embers + Green Neons + C. habrosus in a 17g. This thread has a bunch of pictures (more coming later today) if you want to get some visuals. In the end, personal taste is all that matters.
> 
> ...


Beautiful tank!

The green neons are a nice complement for sure. Curious about your comment on visual scale: I was thinking that my next addition might be slightly bigger fish for variety's sake, hence the thought about the Emperors (although I think the Blue Emperors/Kerri tetras are smaller?). Do you find that it's better to keep schools closer to the same size of fish?

On a tangent, I did think about a few dwarf gouramis like I see you've got in there but read some horror stories about them attacking tetras. Is that gourami in your tank solo, and if so have you had any conflict between it and the Embers?

Bump:


discuspaul said:


> As was already suggested just above, Celestial Pearl Danios are a great choice, o
> or alternatively, any of the micro Rasboras - the Boraras species - check them out.


Ironically my original plan for my next set was to have 10 x CPDs, however I got swayed off the idea by the fact that I've heard they are notoriously shy and my tank has a huge amount of places to hide where I'd never see them. That plus I was thinking it might be nice to have something slightly larger than the Embers.

That being said I'm finding myself still waffling on the idea now. Have you had any experience with the CPDs? Are they really timid enough to be mostly absent from view?


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

tamsin said:


> I've Sundadanio axelrodi and embers


Hadn't heard of these guys before. Good suggestion I'm going to check it out. Looks like a nice complement to the red fo the embers for sure. 

Do you find they tend to occupy the same space as the embers, or keep to themselves?

Bump:


CT_Ram said:


> At least my black neons stay really at the top, they never go to the bottom at all. My green neons pick on each other a bit more than the cardinals. I do like their color more than the cardinals but i like that the cardinals are more quiet. If you have a lid maybe dwarf hatchfish? They are really different but jump.


Just checked the pygmy hatchetfish out. Those are super cool fish. However I've got no lid so I think there would be casualties. Gives me ideas for another tank though....which I should try to quell until I at least finish this one!


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## jayo (Sep 21, 2016)

Consider Norman's lampeye killifish. They're a shoaling, subtle-colored silvery fish with unsubtle bright blue lamp eyes. They stay towards the top of the aquarium and are peaceful.


Another greener fish is Microdevario kubotai (Kubotai rasbora), which might be the same as the "neon green rasbora" you mention above, though that could also be Sundadanio axelrodi "blue".


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## tamsin (Jan 12, 2011)

DJGSnax said:


> Do you find they tend to occupy the same space as the embers, or keep to themselves?



They have a bit of an overlap, but seem to stay a bit lower than the embers - roughly 5-8" above substrate, where as my embers move up and down more and are often nearer the surface. They are quite bold - much more out and visible than I found the CPD.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

jayo said:


> Consider Norman's lampeye killifish. They're a shoaling, subtle-colored silvery fish with unsubtle bright blue lamp eyes. They stay towards the top of the aquarium and are peaceful.
> 
> 
> Another greener fish is Microdevario kubotai (Kubotai rasbora), which might be the same as the "neon green rasbora" you mention above, though that could also be Sundadanio axelrodi "blue".


I've actually been relatively interested in killifish, and I know there is one store within driving distance where the owner apparently specializes in them. However they've got super short lifespans don't they? usually only lasting about a year? That's thrown me off the path.

Edit: Looks like Fundulopanchax gardneri (Blue Lyretail Killi) can live up to 3 years and are suitable for my tank parameters (and is gorgeous). Only exception is I have no lid and they are apparently serious jumpers.....definitely something to consider though.


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## jayo (Sep 21, 2016)

There are "annual killifish" (typically live in temporary bodies of water that dry up part of the year) and "non-annual killifish" (that come from permanent bodies of water and live for multiple years). 

And yes, killies can jump.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

Anyone know anything about Peacock Gudgeons?

In looking up more info about Killifish I seem to have stumbled on them as well. Also looks interesting.


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## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

IME, all killi in uncovered tank will end up on the floor sooner then later. Same applies to hatchets.

Dwarf gurami have distinct personalities. The one in that tank is solo, very docile, and does not bother others at all. I tried 2 in another, 25g long, tank. One got pushed around by the other and ended up dead in 3 days. The remaining one is the tank boss and still chaises mollies and guppies around.

Size wise, we tend to notice bigger and brighter things before smaller and duller. If I have more then one school of fish in the same tank then I personally try to keep them roughly the same body size. Again, our tastes might vary.

When we take 2 of our dogs out, the 200 lb gets 90% of attention. The cute, cuddly, sweet, bright orange16 lb right next to him has to work to get noticed.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

OVT said:


> IME, all killi in uncovered tank will end up on the floor sooner then later. Same applies to hatchets.
> 
> Dwarf gurami have distinct personalities. The one in that tank is solo, very docile, and does not bother others at all. I tried 2 in another, 25g long, tank. One got pushed around by the other and ended up dead in 3 days. The remaining one is the tank boss and still chaises mollies and guppies around.
> 
> ...


Ya I see your point. That being said (I think?) it's pretty hard not to notice 20 Embers schooling in this tank.

I'm wondering now if instead of another school of fish it might be more fun to get a small group of non schoolers like killifish or the peacock gudgeon. Getting a cover for the tank doesn't look like it would be an issue. Plus I wouldn't have to top it up constantly from evaporation.

I'm finding the axelrodi pretty tempting too though to mix in with the Embers.

Appreciate all the advice!

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## discuspaul (Jul 27, 2010)

DJGSnax said:


> I looked at Dwarf Rainbowfish. Seems like the minimum group of 6 would end up considerably larger than my tank would properly handle. They grow pretty big still don't they? Like 3"+?
> 
> Bump:
> 
> ...



I've kept CPD's with Ember Tetras for a fairly lengthy period, and not only did they get along well, but the cpd's were certainly not shy, once they got settled in and comfortable with the tank and tank-mates. They were certainly not 'absent from view' at any time.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

discuspaul said:


> I've kept CPD's with Ember Tetras for a fairly lengthy period, and not only did they get along well, but the cpd's were certainly not shy, once they got settled in and comfortable with the tank and tank-mates. They were certainly not 'absent from view' at any time.


I see. So many choices!

I'm starting to understand why people have 5 different tanks in their homes.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

So, any comments on this stocking plan:

12 x Amanos

20 x embers

2 x Bolivian Ram

6 x CPD

3 x peacock gudgeons

Optional:. 6 x sundadanio axelrodi

(Planning on getting a lid for the tank now)

Seems like a lot to me but aqadvisor shows me having plenty of filtration for it....


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## discuspaul (Jul 27, 2010)

My experience with CPDs indicates they seem to feel safer and are less shy in larger numbers than just 6.
If I may suggest, consider reducing the number of embers, and increasing the number of CPDs so that they're more equal in numbers.
Also, the larger the size of their tank-mates, the shyer I feel they will be - I believe the size of mature Bolivian Rams would tend to intimidate the CPDs - that's my view.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

discuspaul said:


> My experience with CPDs indicates they seem to feel safer and are less shy in larger numbers than just 6.
> If I may suggest, consider reducing the number of embers, and increasing the number of CPDs so that they're more equal in numbers.
> Also, the larger the size of their tank-mates, the shyer I feel they will be - I believe the size of mature Bolivian Rams would tend to intimidate the CPDs - that's my view.


Unfortunately the embers are already established in the tank. I'm pretty set on the rams as well, so I'm thinking I might have to save the CPD for another tank.

Perhaps I can just replace the CPD with more of the sundanio axelrodi to look something like this:

12 x Amanos

20 x embers

2 x Bolivian Ram

10 x sundanio axelrodi

3 x peacock gudgeons


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## CT_Ram (Sep 10, 2017)

I had peocock gudgeons. They are ok. I breed them a few times but ended up trading them all for store credit cause they would not accept dry foods. They do eat frozen but I always go to my country for 3 weeks every year so I cannot have fish that cannot stay with an autofeeder. My males were basically always on their cave with eggs. The fry was easy to raise. The only annoying part really the feeding. I only had one male in total (in like 100) that accepted dry food. I kept him and put him in a regular tetra and stuff 55g community tank and he was still not active enough to compete for food. Everyone else would get it and then I would have to almost go hand feed him. That was my experience.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

CT_Ram said:


> I had peocock gudgeons. They are ok. I breed them a few times but ended up trading them all for store credit cause they would not accept dry foods. They do eat frozen but I always go to my country for 3 weeks every year so I cannot have fish that cannot stay with an autofeeder. My males were basically always on their cave with eggs. The fry was easy to raise. The only annoying part really the feeding. I only had one male in total (in like 100) that accepted dry food. I kept him and put him in a regular tetra and stuff 55g community tank and he was still not active enough to compete for food. Everyone else would get it and then I would have to almost go hand feed him. That was my experience.


Good to know. Thanks for the input.

I typically do feed some frozen food so that might not be so bad, but my thoughts are still wavering between the gudgeons or blue lyretail killifish...


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## AdamRT (Jan 23, 2018)

I think you’d be better off with neon green rasboras (microdavario kubotai) over cpd’s. 

I kept a group of embers and neon greens in a 65 gallon and found their colors, size, and swim zones to be very complimentary. Healthy neon green rasboras show such a unique range of colors from sapphire blue to bright yellow and every shade of green in between and there’s no other small soft water fish that fills that niche. They’re the perfect compliment to embers imho. 

Cpd’s are great little fish, but they come from cooler, fast-moving mountain streams with slightly harder water than embers or neon greens. I’m sure they can adapt to the softer water in most planted tanks without issue, but given the choice I’d pick a fish that is found in those conditions naturally any day of the week. I’ve always found cpd’s tended to hang in the lower zone darting around plants, where my neon green rasboras would straight up school with embers and the resulting flash of oranges, blues, greens, and yellows really popped against a dark substrate or background. It’s nice that the two species cohabitate the way they do and was fun to see them interact peacefully. 

I’ll see if I can dig up some pictures of that 65 gallon, but yeah... neon green rasboras and embers is probably my favorite pairing of soft water fish- if you go this route you will not be disappointed.


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## AdamRT (Jan 23, 2018)

It’s not the best picture, but if you look in the upper left hand corner around the filter intake tube you’ll see some neon green rasboras and embers. Also some blue eyed rice fish in this tank that are visible- they are another option if you want to go with Killis


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## SueD (Nov 20, 2010)

DJGSnax said:


> So, any comments on this stocking plan:
> 
> 12 x Amanos
> 
> ...


You have to be comfortable with your stocking level, but I believe you have plenty of room in this 36g tank for what you're currently planning and room for more. Both the embers and CPD's are very small fish. I haven't had embers but the CPD's I had were very shy, although they were in a much smaller tank. If you decide on these, I would certainly increase that number to at least 12. Even if not so shy, 6 tiny fish in 36g won't be easily seen. 

I think if you're going to go nano in a larger tank, larger numbers make a bigger impact. Alternatively, something a little large in somewhat smaller numbers can have a similar effect. I've had the Kerri tetras in a 20g long and they've been really hardy fish - a bit smaller than the emperor tetras. 

In 36g, you can also consider a school of about 8 full size cories or a larger number of the dwarf cory habrosus if you want to stick to "nano" size. My only hesitation here is that I'm not familiar with behavior of the rams. So some advice from others on ram/cory compatibility would be of assistance.

Aqadvisor is a great start but I think it's a bit on the conservative side. I will admit, however, that I tend to overstock just a little on occasion.


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

AdamRT said:


> I think you’d be better off with neon green rasboras (microdavario kubotai) over cpd’s.
> 
> I kept a group of embers and neon greens in a 65 gallon and found their colors, size, and swim zones to be very complimentary. Healthy neon green rasboras show such a unique range of colors from sapphire blue to bright yellow and every shade of green in between and there’s no other small soft water fish that fills that niche. They’re the perfect compliment to embers imho.
> 
> ...





AdamRT said:


> It’s not the best picture, but if you look in the upper left hand corner around the filter intake tube you’ll see some neon green rasboras and embers. Also some blue eyed rice fish in this tank that are visible- they are another option if you want to go with Killis



The kubotai raspboras were what I originally came across when I was doing research as I mentioned in my first post. And they look great in your tank for sure.

I guess my concern was that the tank is already mostly reds, oranges, and greens and they wouldn't show up that well in a planted tank, so I was looking more towards purples and blues. Look pretty nice in yours though!

For reference here is the tank with the 20 embers in place now:



Now in looking I'm thinking there might be enough dark background to set it off.

I think I'm set on skipping CPDs this time around. And now I'm kind of waffling between the microdevario kubotai and the sundadanio axelrodi blue. Or maybe just some of both? If the neon green raspbora will school nicely with the embers maybe I can just get away with 6 of them and 6 of the others?

On a tangent, are the blue and red fish in your tank the rice fish?


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## DJGSnax (Jun 12, 2018)

SueD said:


> You have to be comfortable with your stocking level, but I believe you have plenty of room in this 36g tank for what you're currently planning and room for more. Both the embers and CPD's are very small fish. I haven't had embers but the CPD's I had were very shy, although they were in a much smaller tank. If you decide on these, I would certainly increase that number to at least 12. Even if not so shy, 6 tiny fish in 36g won't be easily seen.
> 
> I think if you're going to go nano in a larger tank, larger numbers make a bigger impact. Alternatively, something a little large in somewhat smaller numbers can have a similar effect. I've had the Kerri tetras in a 20g long and they've been really hardy fish - a bit smaller than the emperor tetras.
> 
> ...


I did some research on the Kerri tetras and really liked them. They come off as either bright purple/blue or black though....mind if I ask what your experience with their coloration is, and their temperament in terms of aggression?

I've so far stayed mostly away from Corys because I had heard they might push the substrate around in the tank (apparently dwarf corys won't do this though), which until my carpeting is in place would cause a lot of havoc. Plus my Amano shrimp are doing a killer job of keeping everything sparkling. They are pretty cool fish though so I have considered it. Then there is the fact that the Rams are definitely going to be down there as well, although everything I've read says they should be fine with corys.

Right now in my shuffling brain for stocking it's looking more than this:

12 x Amanos (already in)

20 x embers (already in)

2 x red racer nerites (already in)

2 x Bolivian Ram

--------
6/10 x microdevario kubotai
+
6/10 x sunandanio axelrodi

or 

10 x Kerri tetra
---------

3 x peacock gudgeons or lyretail killifish


Probably going to do a grand tour of the wider ranging LFS soon to get some eyes on these guys if I can....I live a 40 minute ferry ride plus some driving away from most of them though so long transport times is a factor.

Loving all the advice here though. It's helped me both narrow down choices and find mew options!


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