# BAKING mineralized soil?



## DiscusIt'sWhats4DinneR (Apr 25, 2008)

I am setting up a new tank and want to try mineralized soil.
Life would be great if i could use the HOT summer fresno sun to dry out my soil but it isnt really an option at this time as i have been having all kinds of rain lately. so currently my weather is not conducive to drying out mineralized soil outside and i really want to have this all together in less than a couple weeks.


Can i bake it in the oven at 140F? or does this interfere with the mineralizing process?


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## metageologist (Jan 10, 2008)

i used to bake soil samples in the lab at 140 to remove all water to determind dry weight and oganic content so i would say that 140 wont alter the mineral composition


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

If you are married, I think you would want to offer the wife/husband a nice restaurant meal for a couple of consecutive nights after doing the baking. I don't believe this would be an odorless operation.


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## DiscusIt'sWhats4DinneR (Apr 25, 2008)

Hoppy said:


> If you are married, I think you would want to offer the wife/husband a nice restaurant meal for a couple of consecutive nights after doing the baking. I don't believe this would be an odorless operation.


 It will be alright.

I think that i am going to start this in the next couple of days. I can use foil baking pans, i have the big ones that are about 24x12 and 4" deep so that means less of a mess to clean up, they are disposable. One thing that puts me off a bit is that i need enough soil for a 125 so i am glad that i have 2 ovens that i can run simultaniously.


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## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

I seem to recall reading about this in that big mineralized soil thread, I don't think it helps the process. The drying of the soil allows the time for the bacteria to break down the soil into its "goodness". Just drying it does not do that from what I understand.

I could be wrong though


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## EdwardN (Nov 7, 2008)

One can bake soil to sterilize it. As an indicator how long to bake it, put a medium size potato in it, and when potato is done, then this is sufficient time to achieve the purpose. You have to aerate it afterwards for a couple of days, otherwise it will be toxic....

To dry soil, spread it onto something flat and use fan to blow along that surface. Work it up every so often and you can be surprised how fast it dries without killing everything in it. Expose to wind would do the job also.

Good luck.


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## DiscusIt'sWhats4DinneR (Apr 25, 2008)

gmccreedy said:


> I seem to recall reading about this in that big mineralized soil thread, I don't think it helps the process. The drying of the soil allows the time for the bacteria to break down the soil into its "goodness". Just drying it does not do that from what I understand.
> 
> I could be wrong though


See i Thought that i had read something about that before but then couldnt think logically how it would be different drying it in an oven vs. outside or naturally. Now i can believe that the amount of time that the soil is allowed to dry is probably a signifigant factor. anyhow i think that since i need to create about 100 pounds of this stuff it may be much easier to do it outside. otherwise i would be literally baking mud pies for days. :hihi:


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The mineralizing process includes soaking for a few days, followed by drying, then repeat that cycle a couple or three more times. So, even if you can accelerate the drying you still have to spend the time soaking it. I'm not sure if baking at a high temperature converts organic compounds to inorganic ones - does anyone know?


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## EdwardN (Nov 7, 2008)

Hippy, I pretty much covered the subject in my post above. You will wind up with a lot of ammonia and other toxic compounds (depending on soil content), not to mention about killing all the beneficial microflora and microfauna.

Air movement, whether artifical, or natural is all one need in this respect.

And works faster then you would expect!


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## milesm (Apr 4, 2006)

i thought that baking actually liberates the ammonia, not generate more.


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## hubbahubbahehe (Sep 13, 2003)

this sounds like so much trouble..why not just buy aquasoil or flourite?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

OMG Hubba is back excavating old threads. :wink:


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

EdwardN said:


> Hippy, I pretty much covered the subject in my post above. You will wind up with a lot of ammonia and other toxic compounds (depending on soil content), not to mention about killing all the beneficial microflora and microfauna.
> 
> Air movement, whether artifical, or natural is all one need in this respect.
> 
> And works faster then you would expect!


You mean less NH4, not more.

Heat/burning oxidizes, this does not reduce.
NH4 is reduced, NO3 is oxidized N.

Excess reduced Carbon can drain O2 and reduce too much, so cooking it, boiling or baking can rapidly oxidize soil.

I'd do it about 400F for an hour, but boiling for 10-15 minutes would be best I think and less stank.

Same method is used for Worm castings to remove excess NH4, this is old old news over a decade of usage, bacteria will simply recolonize quickly thereafter, plant roots etc are loaded with bacteria.

You can do it via bacterial oxidation or thermal oxidation. End result is the same.

*If you really want to promote the bacterial goodness, then a Dry start method that links oxidizing bacteria + real roots of plants would be far superior.* Because once you pull the MTS and disturb the layers of bacteria, this disrupts the bacterial zonation. This must re establish once you add it back to the tank after the mineralization process. DSM does not require this and also links the bacteria to the roots specifically from day one of the tank being flooded with water. If you plant later, you still have some disturbance, whereas there is none with DSM. 

DSM also takes 4-8 weeks before flooding, so no time is really lost waiting, since you wait for the MTS a few weeks anyway. Plant roots also add much more O2 to the soil than MTS alone might. This means the bacterial zonation and colonies are more stable and higher densities.

So if you are in a rush, boiling it, or you wanna do the "natural" methods, the DSM is much better if you want to use soil for planted tanks for mineralization.


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## ernest (Sep 19, 2012)

Hoppy said:


> The mineralizing process includes soaking for a few days, followed by drying, then repeat that cycle a couple or three more times. So, even if you can accelerate the drying you still have to spend the time soaking it. I'm not sure if baking at a high temperature converts organic compounds to inorganic ones - does anyone know?


yes It does and quicker than bacteria. However sometimes the products are not the same ( because the method to oxidize are different the result can be different) but for ammonia and organic matter they all finish in nitrate and CO2 mainly .
A way in science or food technology to find the amount of minerals an edible item has is to bake it at high temp ( 500 Celcium 900 F)
everything burns(oxidize, evaporate etc) and only you keep the ashes 
The difference in the weight before and after is the amount of minerals a food has.
With soil I dont think you need to go all the way to minerals only but baking for some time at 200 F it eliminates a lot of stuff you dont want.

Bump:


hubbahubbahehe said:


> this sounds like so much trouble..why not just buy aquasoil or flourite?


because is freaking expensive:grin2:


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