# |Jeff's ADA Mini Fissidens Mini S| Stock suggestions?



## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Jeez Jeff, _finally_! :hihi:

Great start but the stones are on the small side, and the scape is too symmetrical; don't rush it man, come up with something you'll really enjoy.


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## Centromochlus (May 19, 2008)

+1 to what Kiran said. They are too small and are all the same size. Great stones, but you definitely need some larger ones (as well as some medium-sized ones) to finish it off. Good start.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Upon second thought they may lend themselves well to a rock pile type scape.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Jeez Jeff, _finally_! :hihi:
> 
> Great start but the stones are on the small side, and the scape is too symmetrical; don't rush it man, come up with something you'll really enjoy.


Lol yup, I was the one who pulled that "Mini M" off CL, turns out its a mini S, gotta change the title! 

I kinda wanted them to be on the small side as I'll only be covering them in moss but I see your points



AzFishKid said:


> +1 to what Kiran said. They are too small and are all the same size. Great stones, but you definitely need some larger ones (as well as some medium-sized ones) to finish it off. Good start.


How do you think of the idea with a larger rock as a focal point with smaller rocks accenting in and same with the right side but the focal point being smaller?



Geniusdudekiran said:


> Upon second thought they may lend themselves well to a rock pile type scape.


I was primarily aiming for two slopes that had small rocks sticking out on both sides to have tiny patches of moss but I see where your both coming from, we shall see what I come up with tomorrow after track practice


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## Centromochlus (May 19, 2008)

jkan0228 said:


> How do you think of the idea with a larger rock as a focal point with smaller rocks accenting in and same with the right side but the focal point being smaller?


I suppose you mean something like this, but with each side reversed (focal on left side) and perhaps the stones pointing towards each other instead of away?

I think that would be a really cool scape, assuming that you can get ahold of some nice focal-point stones.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

AzFishKid said:


> I suppose you mean something like this, but with each side reversed (focal on left side) and perhaps the stones pointing towards each other instead of away?
> 
> I think that would be a really cool scape, assuming that you can get ahold of some nice focal-point stones.


I like that idea, couldn't see the pic since I'm on my schools wifi but will take a look at it once I get home. 

I have around 20 pound total so I should have a few nice pieces. Ill see what I can find when I get home


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Here's another scape I put together after dinner:










Still not where I want it to be though. I think I should space out the rocks a bit more? Suggestions?


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## radioman (Oct 29, 2007)

I like it better with the bigger rocks but something still seems to be off. I'm never good at scaping so don't take what I say to seriously.


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

If you want some manzanita I have some you can come get. I bought some small stuff from Tom.


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## orchidman (Dec 15, 2010)

Yeah Jeff! Finally! Lol who am I to talk? I don't have a nice tank. Lol. I think the larger stones you have would lend themselves nicely to a mountainy slopey scape. Like a nice big slope that is build around the rocks with tips poking out of the substrate and moss around the rocks. I did something similar in my 4g evolve.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

I think the two groups you're trying to get at with this scape will work but not if you do it that symmetrically -- off center man, off center!

Keep trying until you get something amazing, the best you can; even if it takes two weeks. Besides, we typically don't get to see a dry tank for more than a few days --- enjoy it while it lasts!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Put a few more scapes together just now




























The last two look pretty bad now that I see them on my comp but thought I'd post them anyway... 

I like the right side of the first one but feel the left side if missing something, suggestions?


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

bigger rocks.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

If you asks me, stop trying to scape with such high vertical elements. In a small tank like this, it's much easier to scape in a horizontal, slopey manner.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Any scapes that you recommend I can try and get a feel of?


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

How do you feel about a centralized rock pile type scape? I'll try to find an example.

Update: something like this? http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=172772


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## Curt_914 (Oct 6, 2007)

So thats where my powder Amazonia went... lol. Looks good. I am going to try my hand at a 20 long personally.

Curt


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Took a more horizontal approach with this. Only used two larger stones accompanied by three smaller ones



















Something's just wrong with the front left...


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

There we go! 

Still, too symmetrical in my opinion. Your two outer rocks, they're like this: / /. In order fix the front left, I'd take the far left rock and replace it with the one on the far right, and then take the one from the left and turn it inward, like this: / \. I'd slope the substrate some too. I think all of this would look more natural.

Can't wait to see how this turns out.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Something like this?


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Yeah, getting better! Of you could change out that far right rock completely, actually, it might look better.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

That's what I was thinking when I was looking at it yesterday but wanted to hear some opinions first!


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

It's looking better!!!

Try the far right rock like it is but pointed upward?


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

I tried what you suggested 150EH, here's the same stone:









And three others:
# 1 This one's the same stone but placed more vertically than the first one


















#2









#3


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Great potential here, the middle rock just looks unnatural and throws the whole thing off....


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

freph said:


> Great potential here, the middle rock just looks unnatural and throws the whole thing off....


Any suggestions? I'm thinking of picking a much smaller rock that doesn't have much significance and have it poking out of the substrate.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

jkan0228 said:


> Any suggestions? I'm thinking of picking a much smaller rock that doesn't have much significance and have it poking out of the substrate.


I'd take the center rock out altogether and move everything over to the left. Try that and see how you like it. You don't want a centered scape (maybe you do, idk ).


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

I've always tried to avoid an even number of rocks as I feel that it adds a symmetrical sense to the scape.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Anyways, Here's #2 with the flipped over central rock









Without center rock and shifted left


















Something different


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

What about that last one with the far right rock flipped around? I'll post a photo tomorrow, it's hard to explain.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Answered your FB chat Jeff. If you have a link for your LFS with the pygmy copies, please let me know!


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

Nice start, I think I prefer the first scape you made.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Answered your FB chat Jeff. If you have a link for your LFS with the pygmy copies, please let me know!


I tried your method and here's what I got: 









Used some other rocks and came up with this:


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

I like how you have kept that far left rock in the same place, that's a perfect positioning. I'm thinking you should really try some left-skewed or right-skewed scapes and see what you get.

I see of course what you mean about using an odd number of rocks to avoid a symmetrical scape; there is irony in the fact, however, that you've managed to make a very symmetrical scape using an odd number of rocks. Quantity's not related to symmetry -- arrangement is! roud:

Whatever you do, do whatever works best for you. I'm not sure if I'm bothering you, but I feel like I am :icon_lol:


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## ThatGuyWithTheFish (Apr 29, 2012)

Are those Sieryu stones? What are your plans for this tank?


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

So here's the final scape that I've decided to go with:









With flora wise, I might go with a complete carpet of fissidens fontanus, Mini Xmas moss or DHG Belem. What do you guys think?


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## bitFUUL (May 14, 2010)

I've been keeping up with your scaping options in both forums, and this is by far the best! 
Very nice J!


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

There you go Jeff!


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## Green_Flash (Apr 15, 2012)

That does look the best yet! A full carpet will look great!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> There you go Jeff!





Green_Flash said:


> That does look the best yet! A full carpet will look great!


Thanks guys! Now I'm just stuck on flora now. I'm thinking either full carpets of the following: Mini Xmas Moss, Fissidens Fontanus or DHG Belem or a combination of one of the mosses with Belem


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## ad3hybrid (Dec 11, 2011)

jkan0228 said:


> So here's the final scape that I've decided to go with:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think those plants will need more time to form into a dense carpet. I would go for HC, because they grow much faster. Just my 2 cents. I have no experience with those plants anyway.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I think any moss would look great with a sencond small plant peeking out here and there, like 'belem', 'parva', or Narrow Leaf Micro Sword.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

ad3hybrid said:


> I think those plants will need more time to form into a dense carpet. I would go for HC, because they grow much faster. Just my 2 cents. I have no experience with those plants anyway.


I've never had much luck with HC and I don't really plan on fertilizing at all. Maybe a little co2 here and there. I also don't really want my hands in this tank either which isn't really possible with the occasional trims that HC requires. Moss and Belem would be a lot less maintenance. 




150EH said:


> I think any moss would look great with a sencond small plant peeking out here and there, like 'belem', 'parva', or Narrow Leaf Micro Sword.


A carpet of fissidens? I just fear that it'll take forever to fill in. Especially una setup without any CO2 or Ferts. I find that it'll be worth it though. How about downoi instead of Belem? 

Any other suggestions with flora? Having trouble thinking of more.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

Nice rock formation! I like the idea of a fissidens carpet but I agree that it would take forever to carpet. Why not just follow the idea of a belem carpet with sections of fissidens mixed in? It'd all grow together pretty nicely.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

I'm still hesitant on the Belem as it requires CO2 and Ferts for it to actually spread decently... It'll be as slower than the fissidens. But that's just what I'm guessing. Anyone got any experience growing 'Belem' without CO2 or water column fertilizing? The only source of ferts they would receive would be from the aquasoil. 

I've already moistened the soil, just to give the bacteria a head start or start emersed as an option.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Finally got around to fill this nano up  

I'm starting to be more and more hesitant about using a full _Fissidens fontanus_ carpet. Livestock will probably consist of _Boraras brigittae_ and _Corydoras Habrosus_. Thoughts?










Edit - Water should clear up within a few days.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Wow, finally, lol. I agree, toss the full fissidens idea and just use it around the rock, using either riccia or glosso as a carpet (if you ask me :hihi


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Wow, finally, lol. I agree, toss the full fissidens idea and just use it around the rock, using either riccia or glosso as a carpet (if you ask me :hihi


I've actually decided to go with Mini Fissidens (so it'll look proportional) and C. Parva.  

Riccia would go crazy and I don't think glosso would go well without any CO2. Which ill probably use eventually in the future.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Spent a little under 3 hours yesterday tying some Mini Fissidens onto some SS Mesh. Here's the result: 

Might have to bend a few pieces for them to hug the substrate more. 


















Didn't get the very back because it isn't really visible and I ran out of moss. I might reserve that last spot in the back for some C. Parva.


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## shrimpnmoss (Apr 8, 2011)

lol that's a lot of mesh bro....you won't see the c parva behind that rock anyways it doesn't get that tall...


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

shrimpnmoss said:


> lol that's a lot of mesh bro....you won't see the c parva behind that rock anyways it doesn't get that tall...


It was definitely a PITA but hopefully it'll be well worth it once everything grows out.

Any suggestions as to plant in the back?


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## DeeJayA1 (Sep 23, 2011)

how much mini fissidens did you use for that?? holy ___ that's a lot!


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## bitFUUL (May 14, 2010)

That's some patience!


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Nice Jeff!

now i see all that mesh to use LOL!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

DeeJayA1 said:


> how much mini fissidens did you use for that?? holy ___ that's a lot!


I used two golfballs, thanks Chad!

Had to ration out a bit of each of the 2x2" pieces to get the last few small ones in there.



bitFUUL said:


> That's some patience!


Its not that bad when it's winter break and you have nothing else to do and you've already tied tons of pieces before 


h4n said:


> Nice Jeff!
> 
> now i see all that mesh to use LOL!


Yes sir! :hihi:


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## DeeJayA1 (Sep 23, 2011)

2 golfballs? looks like a whole lot more...hope that grows out quick for you (so I can buy some).


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Lol, nice man. Must have been a PITA to cut that mesh! This tank should look pretty amazing filled in. Good luck!


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## bostoneric (Sep 7, 2011)

nice work! i wouldnt have the patience to tie all that fissidens to the mesh. 
when i do it i usually just take a nice clump and tie it down.


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## Betta Maniac (Dec 3, 2010)

Very cool! I'm totally inspired to do something similar in my BKK tank.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

DeeJayA1 said:


> 2 golfballs? looks like a whole lot more...hope that grows out quick for you (so I can buy some).


The seller sent a good amount  just slightly more than two golfballs, just enough for this tank  it was however infested with some Spirogyra so ill have to pop an Amano or two in here later on when the tanks done cycling if it spreads. 


Geniusdudekiran said:


> Lol, nice man. Must have been a PITA to cut that mesh! This tank should look pretty amazing filled in. Good luck!


Not really. A pair of kitchen scissors from kitchen aid did the job  easy to eye how much I needed to cut out too. It'll be a good amount of time before everything fills in since there's no ferts or CO2 I'm estimating about 3 months? That's assuming that all goes well. 


bostoneric said:


> nice work! i wouldnt have the patience to tie all that fissidens to the mesh.
> when i do it i usually just take a nice clump and tie it down.


I've tied plenty of fissidens so I don't mind. It gets quicker and quicker the more experience you have. A pair of tweezers is all I needed to spread the moss evenly. Plopping down a clump may give you denser growth but it wastes a lot of moss as well IMO and I needed to cover as much surface as I could so I used the least I could without using not enough that it would make holes in the substrate as some of moss will simply die off and not send out new fronds. Only time will tell. 


Betta Maniac said:


> Very cool! I'm totally inspired to do something similar in my BKK tank.


You won't want to use Seiryu stones through as they raise your GH and pH. This could probably be solved if you had ADA Africana that buffers the pH extremely low along with a few calculations as to how fast the stones raise your GH which would dictate how often you would have to change out water with RO to bring down the hardness of water.


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Lol, nice man. Must have been a PITA to cut that mesh! This tank should look pretty amazing filled in. Good luck!


Got to buy the right mesh 
So it easier to cut 

-Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


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## MABJ (Mar 30, 2012)

Very neat! I'll be watching to see if it grows in!!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

h4n said:


> Got to buy the right mesh
> So it easier to cut
> 
> -Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


I wonder where I got the mesh from... :hihi:



MABJ said:


> Very neat! I'll be watching to see if it grows in!!


I'll be watching it daily.. gonna be a killer for sure.

Although I'm already seeing tiny fronds pop up here and there.


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

Hahaha 

-Sent from my Samsung Note, a "Phablet"


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

getting any growth?


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

*|Jeff's ADA Mini S| Mini Fissidens Carpet 12/31/12*



Couesfanatic said:


> getting any growth?


Does algae growth count? :hihi: 

Actually though there is a good amount do growth considering there isn't any fertilizer or CO2. I did have a short algae breakout which I solved with 3 amanos and it's slowly under control now. 

Some patches have suffered a bit with algae and died off a bit but generally most spots are A-Okay with growth. Slowly but surely


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

it will look good when it grows in, it will get there.


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Theres some minor algae in there right now, spirogyra, BBA and hair algae to be specific but the amanos will take care of that sooner or later. Moss is growing in quite nice, will do an update once the moss is cleaned up and everything is nice and clean.

*Now:*Does anyone have suggestions for livestock?! I'm thinking pygmy or habrosus cories or some micro fish. Suggestions?


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## bluestems (Feb 7, 2012)

jkan0228 said:


> Theres some minor algae in there right now, spirogyra, BBA and hair algae to be specific but the amanos will take care of that sooner or later. Moss is growing in quite nice, will do an update once the moss is cleaned up and everything is nice and clean.
> 
> *Now:*Does anyone have suggestions for livestock?! I'm thinking pygmy or habrosus cories or some micro fish. Suggestions?


Pygmy cories and rasbora maculatas get along really well, and are playful with good personalities for micro fish. :smile: 

Cories though can be too active for shrimp, so if you plan on keeping the amanos, you might reconsider the cories. 

Also, I don't think Amanos eat that type of algae... at least they don't in my tank. 

Look forward to seeing an updated picture!


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Yea I think I might go with Boraras Maculatus with a few pygmies. The Amanos will actually be bigger than the Cories so I don't see them as a threat or a disturbance. 

I'm thinking either 15 Boraras Maculatus or 10 Boraras Maculatus with a few pygmies. 

Any experiences on the schooling behavior of Boraras Maculatus? 

Half the clean up crew


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## gnod (Mar 24, 2011)

1. love the tank and fissidens idea! hope it carpets well for you.
2. i like the choice of fish but...isn't 10-15 a little high for a mini S?


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

gnod said:


> 1. love the tank and fissidens idea! hope it carpets well for you.
> 2. i like the choice of fish but...isn't 10-15 a little high for a mini S?


1. The carpet is getting there, slowly but surely. I wanna try and find a way to get them to grow thicker, maybe just a short period use of CO2

2. I always thought I could go on the higher side with a 2211 since the filter itself also increases the total water volume.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

Nice Amano army you got there Jeff roud:


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Nice Amano army you got there Jeff roud:


Thanks Kiran!

There are currently 9 in there working hard on whatever algae is left. The oto is slacking on those diatoms on the glass, might need to give him a hand


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## assasin6547 (Feb 6, 2013)

Really nice fissidens carpet. It's starting to fill in awesomely.


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## Geniusdudekiran (Dec 6, 2010)

jkan0228 said:


> Thanks Kiran!
> 
> There are currently 9 in there working hard on whatever algae is left. The oto is slacking on those diatoms on the glass, might need to give him a hand


Geez man, I'd never pay that much for that many of those guys largely because I can never keep them in the tank :icon_redf :icon_roll :frown:


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## jkan0228 (Feb 6, 2011)

assasin6547 said:


> Really nice fissidens carpet. It's starting to fill in awesomely.


Thanks! Looking at it now, it'll take a few trims before it fills in completely over the mesh to where I want it to be




Geniusdudekiran said:


> Geez man, I'd never pay that much for that many of those guys largely because I can never keep them in the tank :icon_redf :icon_roll :frown:


Lol that's why you cut a piece of plexiglass to fit the top 

I got 20 for like $44 shipped? Still way cheaper than my LFS :tongue:


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## Couesfanatic (Sep 28, 2009)

Hows this going? This has tons of potential.


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