# How important is a bubble counter in a CO2 system?



## keithy (Jun 8, 2010)

I would say yes, unless you have other means of telling qualitatively how much gas you're letting out


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## hbosman (Oct 5, 2006)

When I used a powerhead as a diffuser, I didn't need one because I could hear the bubbles hitting the impeller. I could hear the bubble rate increase and decrease as I adjusted the needle valve. The noise was very irritating. Anyway, you could make one when you initially set your system up. When you have everything adjusted the way you want it, you might not need it further. You can buy inline bubble counters for very cheap on Ebay as well.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

A cheap bubble counter will cost you $10 or less. It will be a reference point as you increase or decrease the injection rate. The bc will be the cheapest component of the pressurized system ...unless you use a very cheap plastic or glass diffuser, in which case the bc will be one of the two cheapest components.

You could get away with not using a bubble counter, sure. But if you've never used CO2 before, you stand a pretty good chance of gassing out your fauna before you figure out exactly what you're doing.


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## zonamav (Feb 27, 2004)

Without the counter it's like driving without a speedometer. Doable but not ideal. Always good to know the speed.

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## ThatGuyWithTheFish (Apr 29, 2012)

Bleh, IDK if I want to spend money on two whole systems. I just can't seem to get my DIY yeast CO2 to make anything. They're supposed to be bubbles coming out of the diffuser, right? They're also a faint noise coming from the bottle.


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## AaronMB (May 9, 2012)

What kind of diffuser are you attempting to use? Many diffusers won't work with DIY CO2; I tried a cheap one off eBay and it didn't work because the DIY doesn't create enough pressure...the chopstick trick works well for me - pretty tiny bubbles.

If you hear a hissing from the bottle(s) you may have a leak somewhere. This makes sense. The pressure isn't great enough to force CO2 out the diffuser...and if you have a leak, the pressure will "find" it and be released there first. If your diffuser is supposed to work with DIY CO2 find the leak and the pressure may build enough for it to work.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Regulator, solenoid, bubble counter, tubing, diffuser, cylinder. Assume $175-ish for all of that, which is everything you'd need for a basic system, pretty much all of which will come from a prefab unit. Add another $50-75 and go through one of the members here, as well as buy a couple pieces on your own, and you can go a *huge* step up the quality ladder. If you're willing to shell out that kind of money, look into making your purchase a quality one.

If you do a lot of research, and patiently wade through Evilbay searches over a couple weeks, you can cut that second price down to about the first one, and possibly even cheaper if you're lucky. I think it's worth it. But make the decision about whether or not to go pressurized based on a total purchase price of at least $200 (to be safe). Does that help?

***Those prices include a 5lb cylinder, rather than paintball. You'll save $20-40 on the total by going with a 20oz paintball cylinder rather than a 5lb, but I've never felt that going paintball was worth it due to the refill frequency and its associated costs (in money, time, and general obnoxiousness). Others disagree.


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## ThatGuyWithTheFish (Apr 29, 2012)

^^I'm using a Boyu one, with the spiraling inside. I'll try to check for leaks. I did use krazyglue for the hole and 

^Oh no, you're way overestimating how much I'm willing to spend on this.  I'm only going to buy a Fluval package or something similar of canister, regulator, diffusor. Plus they're small tanks (10 and 20G) without high light (CFLs and coralife T5NO). I'm only really into CO2 for HC, glosso, Ludwigia, and nasea red.


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## In.a.Box (Dec 8, 2011)

bubble counter run u $5 shipped on e-bay
Item number: 310295245710


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## CatB (Jan 29, 2012)

how long have you had your DIY set up? mine took around three days to start producing CO2. 
what mixture/procedure to make said mixture did you use? if your yeast didn't activate or something, then that would explain a lack of bubbles.

also yeah, it's possible you have a leak. 

as for bubble counters...
extremely necessary in a pressurized CO2 system, or there's no way to tell your CO2 level and avoid gassing your fish.
less necessary, but still useful (the DIY glass jar kind) in a DIY system, it can prevent the yeast mixture and/or gunk/froth from getting into your tank.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

One 88g cartridge holds as much CO2 as 1/26 of a 5lb cylinder. A 3-pack of 88g Fluval cylinders (they have a proprietary thread, so you can't refill or substitute) costs $35 shipped.

In addition, the cartridge units don't come with solenoids, so you'll have to multiply by three (8h of use, vs. 24h). So, a dirt-cheap regulator kit (of rock-bottom quality, but functional), and a cylinder with one fill, will cost you in the $200 range (probably less). In the amount of time that the 5lb cylinder takes to run out, you'll have spent in the $900 range for a $65 Fluval unit (no solenoid) with 25 88g refills.

For the love of all things Holy, either go pressurized, or stick to low-tech (not a pejorative statement - I have 3 low-tech tanks). Don't go with cartridge units. The cost, in a year or less, will blow your mind. And your bank account.


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## proaudio55 (Oct 20, 2011)

"bubble counter" specifically: nope, it's not necessary. HOWEVER, flying by the proverbial seat of your pants is asking for a total fish kill by CO2 poisoning...
You really just need a method of verifying that your flow is consistent. I opt for a rotameter. It's not "accurate" in terms of numerical volume, but it gives me a fantastic visual reference to know what rate I'm bubbling in at and if the flow is faster or slower than normal.









http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/pHosting/f/8901_bubbles_a_secondc.jpg









http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/pHosting/f/8900_CO2_ratesc.jpg


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

They are a great visual aid to help you know how much gas is flowing, mine is a 10 ounce Canada Dry bottle, peel of the label, drill 2 tiny holes in the top, cut your tubing at a hard angle so you can pull them through the top with needle nosed pliers, make one tube short and the other almost touches the bottom with the shell of a Bic stick pen to keep the tubing straight, then fill it 3/4's full and screw on the cap. No sealers are needed so if you spray it with Windex and it foams from a leak you drilled the holes too big, when you drill and say to yourself "there is no way tubing will go through that hole" you've got the right size.


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