# One bag enough?



## demosthenes (Aug 23, 2008)

yes. the rule is usually 2 lbs per gallon in a normally proportioned tank. I've got oen bag of Eco in my 10g and its been great! definitely enough for any plants that could be in a 10g.


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## Church (Sep 14, 2004)

I personally found that 1 bag was just not enough to get the kind of dynamic sloping I wanted.. I ended up using about a bag and a half. To answer your question, I do think 1 bag _could_ be enough, but it's pushing it. Just my opinion.


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## amp (Dec 2, 2008)

Thats exactly what I was worried about, I dont want to get 2 bags of eco and have it be too much, but I also dont want the substrate to be shallow. I plan to use this tank as a grow out tank for mainly stem cuttings from my main tank. Maybe Ill do a bag of Eco & a bag of fluorite, then I can just store the extra fluorite since it isnt wet like the eco.


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## Church (Sep 14, 2004)

I've stored eco-complete for over a year with no problems whatsoever. All you have to do is put it in a container that closes air-tight. I used a plastic garbage can with a tight lid.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I have one bag of Flourite black sand in a 10 gallon tank, but with about 1/2 inch of mineralized topsoil under it. I don't think I would be happy with just that much Flourite.


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## chuukus (Jun 17, 2008)

Your right hoppy I have a bag of eco unopened sitting in a nornal sized 10 gallon. As far as I can tell you might get an inch and a halph without any sloping. I guess it could work if thats all you have but it just isnt enough to look right. You really want a deeper substrate for roots to take hold. I have some small plants like Hc that have 3" to 4" roots.


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

I just setup a 10g with 1bag of flourite black. I'd say it's not quite enough, about 1.5" depth on average.

Note that for some reason a 7kg bag of flourite black is smaller than a 7kg bag of flourite red or regular. Even the bag labels confirms this. I believe black is 325 cu. Red and regular are 425 cu, which would give you 2" in a 10g.

Chris


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Here is a Seachem substrate calculator for all their gravels. Click on the planted gravels and then the particular product.
http://www.seachem.com/Products/Gravel.html

Here is a substrate calculator for E-C, regular Flourite, silica sand and gravel.
http://www.plantedtank.net/substratecalculator.html


I once used 350 cubic inches per bag of E-C and 400 cubic inches per bag of regular Flourite.

10g: 20" x 10" x 3" = 600 cubic inches.


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

Left C said:


> Here is a Seachem substrate calculator for all their gravels. Click on the planted gravels and then the particular product.
> http://www.seachem.com/Products/Gravel.html
> 
> Here is a substrate calculator for E-C, regular Flourite, silica sand and gravel.
> ...


Actually that should be 18" x 10". I found the above calculator not to be accurate. I have 1 bag of flourite black in a 10g, and it is 1.5". The calculator says 1 bag is enough for 2" even for 31" x 10" tank. It finally says 2 bags when you go to 32" x 10".


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Be sure to read the fine print on the Seachem calculators: _"Note: The calculator will always round up. For example, you can't purchase 1.3 bags, so it will return 2 bags."_


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

Left C said:


> Be sure to read the fine print on the Seachem calculators: _"Note: The calculator will always round up. For example, you can't purchase 1.3 bags, so it will return 2 bags."_


First a minor correction to my previous post. I used the calculator for regular flourite, which it claimed 1 bag would be enough for 2" depth in up to 10 x 31 inch tank. For black, it claimed 1 bag would be enough for 2" depth for up to 10 x 24.

If this calculator is rounding up, then it is way off:


Flourite black is 325 cubic inches per 7kg bag. 10 x 24 x 2 is 480 cubic inches, which should require 1.5 bags, not one bag. 10 x 18 x 1.5, which is what I have after filling my 10g with a bag of black, is 270 cubic inches, so I don't think I even got the 325 cubic inches claimed on the label. Maybe all that dust that washed away was 55 cubic inches.
Regular flourite is 435 cubic inches. 10 x 31 x 2 is 620 cubic inches, which should again require 1.5 bags, not one as claimed.
I think two things are going on here. First, the calculator appears to be rounding to the nearest bag, which would explain why it only started claiming two bags are needed after the actual amount went over 1.5. The 2nd is that I don't think the volume on the bag matches reality, so you probably need to actually add about another 20% to the total.

The 2nd calculator appears to at least be close, although only gives results for flourite, not flourite balck. This is what it said for Flourite:To achieve a depth of *2* inches in a tank *10* inches long and *18* wide, you will need to purchase *12* lbs of *Flourite* .​A 7kg bag of flourite, which is 15.4 lbs, is 435 cubic inches. 10 x 18 x 2 is 360 cubic inches.


360 / 435 = .827 bags according to actual bag size
12 lbs / 15.4 lbs = .778 bags according to calculator
 So at least this calculator is close, but does underestimate a bit.


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## agutt (Oct 28, 2008)

get two. I have always found that I use more than I think...


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Left C said:


> 10g: 20" x 10" x 3" = 600 cubic inches.





cjp999 said:


> Actually that should be 18" x 10".


All-Glass 10 gallon aquariums and 15 gallon tall aquariums are 20 inches long and not 18 inches long. I have four of them.

What 10g aquarium is 18 inches long?


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

Left C said:


> All-Glass 10 gallon aquariums and 15 gallon tall aquariums are 20 inches long and not 18 inches long. I have four of them.
> 
> What 10g aquarium is 18 inches long?


The one I measured yesterday, which somehow has grown to 20" today. 

Seriously, I did measure. Must have been the cold medicines I was taking.

In any case, that doesn't change what I said about the calculators. The seachem one is rounding to the *nearest* whole number, not up. However, the 1.5" in my tank is closer to 300 cubic inches, not 270 like I said, so probably the sizes given on the bags are not that overstated.


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

That's funny. I've done the same thing before.

When I said that I used 350 cubic inches per bag of E-C and 400 cubic inches per bag of regular Flourite, they were very close to being right. I haven't measured Flourite Black, Black Sand and Dark.

Seachem's old site said that one bag of (regular) Flourite was enough for a 2" depth in a 20" x 10" aquarium. This is where my 400 cubic inches per page came from. The TPT substrate calculator says: "To achieve a depth of 3 inches in a tank 20 inches long and 10 wide, you will need to purchase 20 lbs of (regular) Flourite." 600 cubic inches ÷ 20 pounds X 15.4 pounds per bag = 462 cubic inches per 20 pounds. This is close to 400 cubic inches per bag. See here: http://www.plantedtank.net/substratecalculatorcalculate.php?width=10&length=20&depth=3&substrate=96

My 350 cubic inches per bag of E-C came from my own measurements. TPT's calculator gives 363.6 cubic inches per bag when you do the math. "To achieve a depth of 3 inches in a tank 20 inches long and 10 wide, you will need to purchase 33 lbs of Eco-Complete." So, 600 cubic inches ÷ 33 pounds X 20 pounds per bag = 363.6 cubic inches per 20 pound bag. My 350 cubic inches per bag is very close to this. See here: http://www.plantedtank.net/substratecalculatorcalculate.php?width=10&length=20&depth=3&substrate=60


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## cjp999 (Nov 18, 2008)

Left C said:


> Seachem's old site said that one bag of (regular) Flourite was enough for a 2" depth in a 20" x 10" aquarium.


1 bag of regular is enough. I'm not disagreeing with that. However, it also says 1 bag is enough for 2" in a 31" x 10", which clearly it is not. It also says 1 bag of black is enough for 2" in a 20" x 10", which it is not. The bag of black is smaller, and only gives you 1.5" in a 10g. The calculator seems to know the bag is smaller, because it will say you need 2 bags of black starting at 25 x 10 x 2, and 2 bags of regular starting at 32 x 10 x 2. 


Left C said:


> This is where my 400 cubic inches per page came from. The TPT substrate calculator says: "To achieve a depth of 3 inches in a tank 20 inches long and 10 wide, you will need to purchase 20 lbs of (regular) Flourite." 600 cubic inches ÷ 20 pounds X 15.4 pounds per bag = 462 cubic inches per 20 pounds. This is close to 400 cubic inches per bag. See here: http://www.plantedtank.net/substratecalculatorcalculate.php?width=10&length=20&depth=3&substrate=96
> 
> My 350 cubic inches per bag of E-C came from my own measurements. TPT's calculator gives 363.6 cubic inches per bag when you do the math. "To achieve a depth of 3 inches in a tank 20 inches long and 10 wide, you will need to purchase 33 lbs of Eco-Complete." So, 600 cubic inches ÷ 33 pounds X 20 pounds per bag = 363.6 cubic inches per 20 pound bag. My 350 cubic inches per bag is very close to this. See here: http://www.plantedtank.net/substratecalculatorcalculate.php?width=10&length=20&depth=3&substrate=60


The TPT calculator is fairly accurate. I'm also not disagreeing with that. I also like it better because it lets you decide on your own how many bags you need. For example, if it says you need 7.5 kg of flourite, then there's probably no point in going out and buying two bags. You just buy one 7 kg bag and not worry about the difference.

In summary, I would say 1 bag of EC or 1 bag of regular flourite is enough for a 10g (gives you 2"), but 1 bag of a black may leave you wanting for more (only gives you 1.5").


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Regular black flourite has smaller particles than the older colors, and that makes the bag weigh more per unit volume - less air space in the bag or tank. Of course black sand is even smaller particles.


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## amp (Dec 2, 2008)

I got two bags of Eco today and just added one to m,y 10g. It gave it a little over 2" of depth.


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Gosh! CaribSea is getting a bit skimpy with their E-C. 

You used to get 1¾" of substrate depth using 1 bag in a 10g.


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## amp (Dec 2, 2008)

Maybe I worded that wrong, with one bag of eco I got a little over 2". For now the second bag will remain unopened.


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## Left C (Nov 15, 2003)

Hi



cjp999 said:


> In any case, that doesn't change what I said about the calculators. The seachem one is rounding to the *nearest* whole number, not up.


 I don't like the fact the Seachem's calculator is rounding it up either. It should give the pounds needed to achieve a certain substrate depth with an aquarium having a certain footprint.



I did a little bit of playing around with Seachem's Gravel Calculator and this is what I got using an aquarium with a 20"x10" footprint:
- 3.1" of a substrate depth using Regular Flourite requires 1 bag. This is 620 cubic inches.
- 2.25" of a substrate depth using F. Black, F. Black Sand and F. Dark requires 1 bag. This is 450 cubic inches. 



I have 3 bags of unused Flourite Black. Printed on their bags it says that one bag contains 5500 cubic centimeters or 325 cubic inches per bag and to use this amount to calculate how much is needed. 

450 cubic inches per bag vs. 325 cubic inches per bag. This sure is odd! What is going on?





cjp999 said:


> However, it also says 1 bag is enough for 2" in a 31" x 10", which clearly it is not.


I don't have a bag of Regular Flourite for reading that statement. However, using Seachem's Gravel Calculator, I got 1 bag of Regular Flourite will add 2" of substrate depth with an aquarium having a 31"x10" footprint. This is 620 cubic inches. This agrees with the above calculation.



Things are a bit odd, aren't they?

I'm going to post a question about 450 cubic inches per bag vs. 325 cubic inches per bag on Seachem's forum at PlantGeek.com.



Thanks for bring this up, cjp999
Left C


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## Mutant Fish (Dec 28, 2008)

yea that should probably be good but if your worried about it you can try and find a substrate calculator.


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