# UNS 120P - Spectacle



## ElleDee (May 16, 2020)

I'm excited to see what you do with this! I'm also working on a build in these dimensions, but you're probably a couple months ahead of me, so I'll be following along with great interest.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

I am using an Oase Biomaster Thermo 650 on my Waterbox 4820/120p and it seems to be plenty. I have a spare 250 that I was going to use also but do not feel the need for it. I think that you will be happy with the 850. You will get much more noise from the Griggs than the Oase. I had a Griggs briefly and went back to an inline atomizer/diffusor.


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## brooklyntankster (May 23, 2020)

I am excited to see how this turns out. I plan to do a build with this size too but it will be much later in the year. I know there is a shortage on tanks so I hope I will be able to get one when I am ready.


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## abobo80 (Nov 7, 2013)

I have a similar build going on and likely endpoint with discus, and waterbox came through for me greatly. Said 6-8 weeks when I ordered but ended up being less than two weeks.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

ElleDee said:


> I'm excited to see what you do with this! I'm also working on a build in these dimensions, but you're probably a couple months ahead of me, so I'll be following along with great interest.


Thank you! I've been waiting years for this tank to come to fuitition, I'm really excited about it, and since this is going right in the middle of my living room, really hoping the tank comes together in a way that looks good.



mourip said:


> I am using an Oase Biomaster Thermo 650 on my Waterbox 4820/120p and it seems to be plenty. I have a spare 250 that I was going to use also but do not feel the need for it. I think that you will be happy with the 850. You will get much more noise from the Griggs than the Oase. I had a Griggs briefly and went back to an inline atomizer/diffusor.


You tempt me! I'm sooo hesitent to bite the bullet on the 850 because I don't want to a) need to buy another filter in addition to the 850, and b) am worried about the on paper calculations. I will be following your journal with great interest, if your tank were 6+ months further along and still working well I'd probably just go for it.

I've had griggs that were noisy and ones that were quiet. The difference being the amount of gas I was trying to pump into it. I think if they are too loud you just need to slow down the gas, the darn things are too efficient so if all the gas hasn't dissolved it will make noise. Or at least that is how I am explaining why my newt tank is dead quiet with the griggs at 1 bubble every 4 seconds while my quarantine was very loud with 4 bubbles per second.



brooklyntankster said:


> I am excited to see how this turns out. I plan to do a build with this size too but it will be much later in the year. I know there is a shortage on tanks so I hope I will be able to get one when I am ready.


Yeah the tank shortage is very real. Waterbox has been doing a bang up business as their source of tanks seems to be less affected. But UNS, ADA, those guys are taking months between restocking and the demand is easily exceeding the supply.



abobo80 said:


> I have a similar build going on and likely endpoint with discus, and waterbox came through for me greatly. Said 6-8 weeks when I ordered but ended up being less than two weeks.


Question for you and also @mourip, How did you guys move your tanks onto your stands? This is something I am dreading. My tank will (I assume) come in a crate. I have a handtruck and my plan was to move it into my house (on or off the crate depending on whether it would fit through my door) and then...... My wife is not much help at this point and during the pandemic my choice is either figure out how to do it by myself or hire some guys to come pick it up and put it on the stand.

Thanks for any advice.


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## abobo80 (Nov 7, 2013)

4-2/3 in. Dual Suction Cup Lifter - 125 lb. 4 of these, two on each end with placement depending on preference. Have never had a tank move go so smoothly.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

abobo80 said:


> 4-2/3 in. Dual Suction Cup Lifter - 125 lb. 4 of these, two on each end with placement depending on preference. Have never had a tank move go so smoothly.


Did you do it yourself or with another person? I assume another person?


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## abobo80 (Nov 7, 2013)

Two of us, neither in great shape with a Minnesota salty heavy slanted drive way, into the basement. If your stand had a wood top I'd detail how I got a 180 onto a stand by myself but without a plastic rim and the concrete i'd say there is no way it's a one man job.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

abobo80 said:


> but without a plastic rim and the concrete i'd say there is no way it's a one man job.


Le sigh... I worried this was the case. I am definitely going to have to hire someone when this thing shows up heh.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

abobo80 said:


> ...and waterbox came through for me greatly. Said 6-8 weeks when I ordered but ended up being less than two weeks.


That is great. I thought that it would be a couple of weeks and it took two months. 48" rimless thanks are in short supply these days.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

minorhero said:


> How did you guys move your tanks onto your stands? This is something I am dreading. My tank will (I assume) come in a crate.


Piece of cake. Use Task Rabbit!  

My Waterbox came on a palette in a huge Styrofoam lined box. I unpacked the tank in the garage and my wife and I were able to move the stand into place in our basement ourselves. 

The tank is 140 pounds of glass with no bracing. Two strong, young, cheery careful guys moved the tank from the garage down a flight of stairs to the basement for $70 plus I gave them a good tip. Be sure to have them point the correct side out if your tank has engraved badging and you do not want it to show.

It was money well spent and a drop in the bucket after I added up how much I have spent to get the 120P up and stocked.


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

abobo80 said:


> ... with a Minnesota salty heavy slanted drive way, into the basement.


Howdy neighbor! I'm near Duluth.


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

Can't wait to see the end results. I like the light setup you have going. I may steal that idea for the basement fishroom.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!

The tank is..... still backordered... le sigh. This was to be expected though, if the original timeline remains then sometime in the next 2 weeks it will actually ship to me.

Meanwhile I have not been idle. Probably the biggest change is to the stand. I had a poured concrete top on it that I did myself and frankly liked quite a bit. BUT, I had previously been planning a plywood vivarium on it, not a rimless aquarium. That top was not dead flat, and worse, it bulged upward slightly in the middle. How much exactly? Around .5 to 1 mm in the center compared to the edges. Would this have been a tank shattering experience? I don't know. These tanks comes with a 'leveling' mat for a reason but I decided my peace of mind couldn't handle the situation so I needed to replace the top. Rather then try to pour another concrete top I opted for a more professional route. 

I called around to several granite supply companies and got quotes. Those quotes ranged from 250 to 500 dollars for a granite top 22 inches x 51 inches. I went with the cheapest option at 250. The folks I bought it form loaded it into my car and I used a hand truck to get it out of my car and onto the stand itself. Actually tilting it onto the stand was a bit of a hairy moment but it found its way there safely enough. Here is how it looks now:










I still like the look of the concrete top but I feel much happier with the stand as an aquarium stand with the granite top.

Next up was work on the engine room. This tank needed a reactor, a heater, a temperature probe, and I decided, a dosing pump, and all of it needed to be done inline.......... Because .. aesthetics. 

Granted this is all just my aesthetics but I have decided the only equipment in the tank will be a stainless steel lily pipe inflow with built in skimmer and a stainless steel lily pipe return. Nothing else. 

The easiest I did first, the reactor. I have built at this point 5 different reactors, this one is my 6th. When I first built reactors I tried to be ...clever... and made weird reactors. I'm kind of over that phase of my life ;P I realize now that reactors should be kept simple not because my weird reactors didn't work, but because dissolving co2 into water is simple and my reactors were needlessly complicated, costly (by comparison) and overly large. 

So this is what I built for my 6th reactor:










Next up was the regulator. I actually had purchased a 2 stage regulator about 2 years ago but lost it at one point only to rediscover it in time for this build. I bought a post body kit from @Bettatail and one evening put it all together. As an aside, Bettatail did an awesome job packing this post body kit up. Here is how the post body kit looked when I opened the box with everything individually wrapped:










My parts all laid out:










Everything back together:










I was told by folks on this forum (years ago) that my regulator is for relatively low pressure (I think 15? psi from memory) but that's fine for my purposes. For a reactor setup I doubt I will need more than that.

This is the first time I will be using a regulator with a bubble counter attached and check valve built in. My current regulator has a bubble counter inline and seperate check valve. Do folks install another check valve closer to the reactor? I'd hate to need to wait for the co2 to fill the whole line past the bubble counter, plus check valves fail etc.


Meanwhile I went to work on my various inline pieces. The heater I ordered from amazon is 300watt Ista inline heater. My research showed only 3 different brands for inline heaters. There is Hydor who is kind of the name brand but uses a spiny wheel dial for controls. There is Ista, and there is a random chinese brand that sells under different names the most popular of which is Datoo. Anyway I got the Ista because it had the least number of horrible reviews. Unfortunately the heater I got was either deliberately mislabeled or Ista changed their design because my 5/8" 16/22mm heater has an outside barbed diameter of 5/8" and an inside diameter that at most could be 1/2". This.. will probably be a problem. I'm going to just suck it up and go with it for now since I already own it, but I will likely replace it when/if it fails to produce the desired results.

For the temperature probe I drilled a hole in a pvc plug just large enough for the probe to squeeze through, then backfilled it with silicone. The plug then got screwed into a pvc Tee. 

Of everything though my weakest link will be the fertilizer dosing. I searched through old posts on this forum for people dosing ferts inlinine and found a handful of threads on the subject. It seems that folks have made this work before... but there weren't many people claiming to have done it long term. It seems the biggest weakness are the check valves. They can clog so ferts can't make it through. My plan for dealing with this is to 1) over dilute my ferts to hopefully cut down clogs, 2) mix in a little excel with my micros and macros to stop clogs and mold, and 3) use better check valves. Specifically I will be using Harsh Chemical rated check valves I bought from www.mcmaster.com. I tested them with my dosing pump and it is powerful enough to push open the valve so I 'should' be ok there. Time will tell whether it works or not 

Anyway I am as of now planning to go with pps-pro method of ferts. It failed for me once before but I'm hoping a much better attention to detail will get me in a better place this time.

On the cool techie side of things, at least one of my light bulbs is a smart bulb, my power strip is a smart power strip, and my temperature controller is wifi enabled as well (so it will create push notifications to my phone if it detects temperature irregularities). Not bad for off the shelf stuff and someone who doesn't code with a darn ;P

Anyway I spent a few days trying to figure out how I could fit all this stuff NEATLY in the stand. I started with the idea of using a free standing bit of 3/4" melamine and then attaching everything to that. I moved things around on this for a few days until I ended up with this:










It still needs the line leaving the fertilizer manifold and going into the tank but otherwise it's not..uh..horrible. It is not nearly as tidy as I envisioned it either but space became an issue and I didn't want to hard plumb everything together with lots of 90 degree pvc elbows. 

As for filtration, well I already own a Polar Aurau (rebadged Sunsun 704b) which is rated for 525gph. On paper its likely not enough power but I already own it, so I'm going to at least hook it up and see how it goes. If its not giving me enough flow (or ends up being too noisy) I will switch it out for either an FX4 or a Sunsun HW-3000. Speaking of which, anyone have any experience with either of those two filters? Specifically interested in how noisey they might be?

And that brings me to current. HOPEFULLY, my next update includes how I used two sets of these gripper things to move a UNS 120P onto that stand.


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

Great progress! Things are looking great underneath there too. Can't wait to see the tank all decked out.


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## Scully (Nov 20, 2020)

I'm 100% stealing that heater probe idea. Looking like this will be just as awesome as your newt tank.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Scully said:


> I'm 100% stealing that heater probe idea. Looking like this will be just as awesome as your newt tank.


Thank you! I can't claim the probe holder as an original idea. I saw someone (can't remember who) do this before. Hopefully it works for both of us!


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## aeneas (Feb 15, 2021)

I love the style of the stand @minorhero!  ...Too bad it won't hold your original dream tank of 120gal.
How come you chose to go with a canister filter now? I saw in your original posts you were still considering sump and K1 media? 
Your "engine" set-up looks great!! I may need to poke you with some questions about fertilizers / reactor etc. when I get to that stage of planning! BTW, thanks for helping me think through my own 300g tank planning and sump design!


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

aeneas said:


> I love the style of the stand @minorhero!  ...Too bad it won't hold your original dream tank of 120gal.
> How come you chose to go with a canister filter now? I saw in your original posts you were still considering sump and K1 media?
> Your "engine" set-up looks great!! I may need to poke you with some questions about fertilizers / reactor etc. when I get to that stage of planning! BTW, thanks for helping me think through my own 300g tank planning and sump design!


I sadly had to abandon the idea of using a sump for the 75 gallon for the simple reason of photography. I want to be able to enter this tank into the big aquascaping competitions which meant I needed clean sides without an overflow (similar to your desires with your 300g tank - but for a 75 gallon a canister filter is a much easier to implement option). I wasn't really concerned about this when doing the planning on the 120.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

Question. Would it be better to have the temp probe piped into the cannister inlet tubing? In my mind that would the best reading of the actual tank water. Or being after the cannister and still before the inline heater is it effectively the same?

I have a similar Inkbird probe hidden behind a large sword along with my doser inlet but I would have no hardware in the tank if I could do it. Being a bit paranoid I also try to minimize any out of tank water connections!

Just curious...


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

mourip said:


> Question. Would it be better to have the temp probe piped into the cannister inlet tubing? In my mind that would the best reading of the actual tank water. Or being after the cannister and still before the inline heater is it effectively the same?
> 
> I have a similar Inkbird probe hidden behind a large sword along with my doser inlet but I would have no hardware in the tank if I could do it. Being a bit paranoid I also try to minimize any out of tank water connections!
> 
> Just curious...


I honestly don't think it makes any difference whether its before the canister filter or after. Technically the canister filter is imparting some small amount of heat to the water from the pump, but this is pretty minimal. Considering that any filter I use will pump hundreds of gallons an hour, the water will be moving too quickly through the tubing, the tank, and back into the tubing again to really vary much in temperature whether its before or after the filter. 

On the other hand, its a lot easier on me to stick all the various connections in the same place. So it got installed after the filter along with everything else being done inline.

I'm paranoid about certain things when it comes to dozens of gallons of water but not about barbed connections or pvc pipe. The latter is designed to handle water inside the walls of households for decades without maintenance, the former is proven secure in hundreds of thousands of aquariums. If it doesn't leak when you first set it up it will keep not leaking unless you start pulling on it. At which time you will know it because you will be sitting there doing the pulling ;P

For the wacky inline things I'm doing? Well I feel mostly pretty good about it ;D


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!!

I got an email this morning telling me that sometime in the next week to 3 weeks I should be getting a shipping notice for my tank.... Golly! I ordered this tank in the middle of February, after I was told it should be coming in sometime in March. In March I was told to expect it in June. In June I was told they had no idea when it was coming in. Looks like it will ship in September. So somewhere around 7 to 8 month turn around.... Honestly if I knew that when I ordered it I might have done things a little differently ;P

Oh well, the good news is that this critter is finally happening! 

Consequently for anyone else, if you are interested in a larger UNS tank now is a really good time to pre-order or start obsessively checking stocking status.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

Any luck yet?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

mourip said:


> Any luck yet?


It's officially supposed to arrive today. But so far I haven't seen it. Fingers crossed ;P


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Spoiler


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

EmotionalFescue said:


>


Lol, not quite apparently. What I have is an email from a freight tracking service which gives me an estimate of arrival time to be noon on the 22nd. That time came and passed. The 'original' estimate before they ever picked it up is the 24th. This oh so helpful email informs me that someone should be home to receive the freight and that I should be looking for it on the 24th - or even after this date, its quite vague (this is a static email without the subsequent tracking data). Sooooooooo I guess who knows at this point ;P

Presumably somewhere in the continental United States there is a pallet with my name on it, that's all I'm willing to commit to right now.


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)




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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

BAM!



















I will say the packing job was almost disastrous. 6 nails were bent over but still sticking up in the pallet directly under the tank. It was enough to go through the cardboard, the Styrofoam and the leveling mat. 5 of those nails destroyed the leveling mat in fact. These weren't just bent over and pounded into the wood but were actively sticking into the air. They did scratch the bottom of the tank quite a bit but fortunately its all cosmetic. None of the scratches are even deep enough to feel with my fingers. I ditched their leveling mat in favor of a yoga mat I had purchased for my DOOA kitchen tank. The scratches are on the bottom of the bottom pane of glass so it's invisible when filled. Thus I won't be taking any action. I did send a heads up letter to the seller though because somewhere in their shipping process they have someone working who is either extraordinarily incompetent or purposely trying to destroy tanks.










All that said, I am SUPER excited for this tank. It's been 8 months to the day since I ordered it.


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## xrayguy (May 11, 2019)

its xmas in september!!!!!


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## brooklyntankster (May 23, 2020)

yay, now the fun begins


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!

I have not been idle these last few days. Step one was figuring out the hardscape of course.

I started with 2 very large pieces of malaysian driftwood. I originally wanted both in the tank. After fooling with them for a day I just wasn't happy with how they had to fit together (because they were too big to go into the tank in many orientations without piecing the water's surface). Here is how they looked:










Once I decided I needed to lose one of them, it became a bit easier. I picked the one which was obviously better (to me at the time) and tried to get it into the tank. Again due to it's size there were only so many ways it could go in. I ultimately wasn't happy with essentially the only one that worked. Here is how it looked before I pulled it:










Once I put the other piece in the tank I immediately realized this was the right decision. It fit much better. With minimal fooling around with it I also realized I might be able to make an undercut bank kind of tank with the wood. Here is what my original inspirational position looked like:










This placed the wood up a bit too high on the left hand side. So fiddled with it some more:










and some more:










This was much better. I added some bags of lava rock as filler and some more rocks to see how it would go together:










I kept adding big rocks and got to this point:



















I was happy with the big rocks on either end up top but the rocks up top in the middle needed some work:










I was feeling really good about how it was going so I started filling in the extra space with bits of lava rock. (I have I mentioned that I have WAY too much lava rock? - I ordered some crazy number like 10 bags of the stuff thinking I would need it for this build. I ended up using like half of one bag.)










Time to add some sand!










And some detail stones:










And that brings me to current.

There's still a lot more work to do. I need more detail stones, and more small stones mixed into the sand. BUT, this is by far my best scape ever and I haven't gotten to the plants yet. I am super excited to see how far I can take it.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

Flow seems really good. Not sure you need anything else but.....????
"Less is more"...


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

This looks great!

What kind of sand do you have in there? I like the look of it.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

EmotionalFescue said:


> This looks great!
> 
> What kind of sand do you have in there? I like the look of it.


HTH Pool Filter Sand. I am also going to mix in some Safe-T-Sorb as 'pebbles'.



jeffkrol said:


> Flow seems really good. Not sure you need anything else but.....????
> "Less is more"...


Thank you! Probably not much more but I need some more small stones, maybe some pieces of bark/wood.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Small update:

I added safe-t-sorb to the tank to give it something to break up all the sand. From experience the safe-t-sorb will stay pretty much on the surface since its significantly less dense then the sand. Right now it looks kinda stupid, but that's because it's wet from me washing it so its all clumped up. Once I fill the tank it should spread out all over. It won't cover the sand but it will cover about 30-50% if I did it right. 

I also added some more wood to the tank, though much smaller pieces. There's one small piece in the front middle and another cool root bending around some stones on the top right hand side. The wood in the top middle I ended up removing after this picture was taken because it just didn't 'fit'. 










I also pretty much completed the plumbing of the tank (big huzzah). I was mostly done with it already but I have never hooked it up before and put in place important things like check valves etc. Now it is actually all hooked up to a point where I could fill the tank. With that in mind I put some temporary stones in to stop all the wood from floating. Here is what it looks like now:










Next up will be filling the tank, which will probably happen tomorrow. After the tank is full, leak checked, and everything is running as it should I will start getting in plants. 

As far as plants go it's going to be pretty sparse. A few medium to small swords, some moss covered stones, and maybe something high maintenance like Brazilian pennywort. And.... maybe another plant species? haven't decided, but there won't be a carpet or even really dense plantings. Stay Tuned!


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

Looks great so far! Love your hardscape placement.


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## Mr. Fish (Apr 24, 2012)

Can't wait to see how this thing turns out!


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Small update:

Fill test!










Yeah the fill test really should have happened BEFORE I scaped it... ohs well.

This was supposed to be more then a fill test. I started up the filter with every intention of this being a done deal only to discover that I have at least 3 leaks in my plumbing....... I really should have tested it before it was on the tank.... le sigh.

Anyway I shut it down and pulled the engineering wall out (not before forgetting about the siphon effect.... whoops). Four towels latter I had cleaned up the mess and could address my leaks. I had at least 1 leak in the reactor, another 2 in my fertilizer manifold. I slathered on a lot of pvc cement so hopefully that resolves the issue. If not I will need to rebuild the reactor. Lesson learned, I will be testing the plumbing off of the tank before going to re-attach anything. In the meantime the tank is just hanging out.. all filled up /shrug.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

I really like the hardscape. 

Question. Do you think that with your pipes in their current positions you will get good flow across the back of the tank? It looks like you will get great flow across the front but might short cycle the back. With my 75g I experimented with a lot of positions and ended up with both pipes at one end with the outflow across the front and the return more toward the back. This gives you a "U" shaped pattern that get some return flow in the back.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

mourip said:


> I really like the hardscape.
> 
> Question. Do you think that with your pipes in their current positions you will get good flow across the back of the tank? It looks like you will get great flow across the front but might short cycle the back. With my 75g I experimented with a lot of positions and ended up with both pipes at one end with the outflow across the front and the return more toward the back. This gives you a "U" shaped pattern that get some return flow in the back.


Thank you!

I have no idea how the flow will work out long term. I will definitely be experimenting with various positions overtime to see what works best. The back of my tank is really shallow, only about 8 inches deep. So I am sure that will greatly affect how flow works back there.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!

I finally got it up and running with no leaks!

It took way longer then I thought it should. I tried just glopping on more pvc cement on the reactor to stop the leaks there but that frankly did not work even after 3 or 4 tries. I couldn't figure out what was wrong until I realized that when I attached the reactor to my engineering wall, the screwed on clamps were likely warping the whole reactor and that is what was making it leak. There was no good way to deal with it so I eventually abandoned the entire reactor and made a new one.

The other spot that was leaking was at the barbed fittings on the fertilizer manifold. Basically the barbs there were terrible. I bought new barbs and while I was at it, drilled and added another spot for fertilizer (or more likely, excel). 

Once done I was finally able to get it up and running. I originally added what I thought was seeded media to my filter in the hopes I would have an instantly cycled tank. Sadly either my plans for seeding simply didn't work, or I have an ammonia source somewhere in my tank (likely from the rocks and wood collected from the wild and not super thoroughly cleaned). Anyway, I'm currently rocking 2ppm ammonia so no fish any time soon.

I did however manage to find some plants. In the back are Compacta Amazon Swords. In the front are Marbled Queen Swords. Right in the middle I have a plant that needs to be moved out so you can ignore it ;P


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Small Update:

A few days with cycled media and dosing bottled bacteria and ammonia is now under control. I added 11 pygmy cories and will probably add a few more in a few days most likely. I also added some elodea and a few strands of brazilian pennywort that had grown out of my breeding tank and were drooping over the sides. 

Oh and I finally moved the pictures that were behind the tank (left over from before the tank was in place) so it no longer looks silly. Here is how things look now:



















I have done a little work on the engine room as well. I hooked up the co2 and I'm in the process of getting the ferts up and running. Soon this will be a fully armed and operational battle station.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update:

Its been almost 2 weeks and the tank has progressed. I have added what will likely be the full stocking to this tank. In addition to the pygmy corys, I also added 5 amano shrimp, a pair of german blue rams, a pair of apistogramma panduro, Two L106 Orange Seam Pleco (hopefully a pair but I can't sex these guys), 15 ember tetras, 6 otos, and 4 dwarf crayfish.

The crayfish and amano shrimp are not from the amazon but I really like having the former and the latter are kind of necessary cleanup critters. I went on a search looking for a feature fish I could add that would be happy with the current stocking and also not mess with neocardina shrimp which I might add latter. This ended up being a bit of a failure, but my kids ended up fastening onto the crayfish anyway which are a rare enough sight and interesting enough in their behavior to keep their attention when they appear, so it's all good.


For my part I consider the German Blue Rams to be the stars of the tank.

As for the plants, they are all doing well. The swords are growing submersed leaves, enough that soon I will be able to cut off all the emersed growth. The elodea is growing lots of nodes and roots which will make it much fuller in the coming weeks. I also added some littorella uniflora from tissue culture to the front. This is also not from the amazon but /shrug its the right combination of a grass like plant that won't take over the tank and carpet on me, so I'm happy with it. I also added a plant I pulled from a lake over the summer which looks like elodea but is slightly thinner of stem and leaf. This was added to the back of the tank to hopefully help with depth. Not sure about the id but its been growing great for me in my breeder tank so I decided to move it in here as well.

My two smaller pieces of wood still have not waterlogged on me and I'm starting to wonder how long it will take. Both of these pieces were 'liberated' from the wild near me. The smaller piece has some soft spots as well and I wonder if wood which has already started to decay can sink? The larger piece up top is mostly intact but... still wants to float away when I remove the rock.

The other issue I am having is with my female apistogramma panduro. Specifically I am wondering if its a female or just a really subdominate male. The rams have settled in together quite nicely but the male apisto still chases away the female and the rams also chase away with the female so she is just getting chased a lot.. or maybe he is getting chased? I've never had an apisto so I don't know what is normal behavior.

And finally here is how the tank is looking currently:























































And the full tank shot:


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Looking great!


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## Ordinary Joe (Feb 19, 2020)

I have a big piece of wood (thick branches and about 1.0x0.6m) that I collected and it took forever to sink. I think I had rocks over it for 6 months or so, so the water logging process can take a long time, but it will happen eventually. Anyway, your setup is really nice and I loved your lighting choice.


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## xrayguy (May 11, 2019)

your set up is gorgeous. well worth the wait. love your choice in fish/inverts as well.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

velivid said:


> My Waterbox came on a palette in a huge Styrofoam lined box. I unpacked the tank in the garage and my wife and I were able to move the stand into place in our basement ourselves.


We got an Archaea stand to go with our WB 4820. We chose it because it was a bit shorter than the WB stand. We moved the stand from the outside garage down to the basement by ourselves but there was no way we could do the tank. It is way heavy and of course fragile. We used Task Rabbit to get two young men with intact spinal health to do that!


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

mourip said:


> We got an Archaea stand to go with our WB 4820. We chose it because it was a bit shorter than the WB stand. We moved the stand from the outside garage down to the basement by ourselves but there was no way we could do the tank. It is way heavy and of course fragile. We used Task Rabbit to get two young men with intact spinal health to do that!


I think you were the one to tell me about task rabbit. I used them to move my tank in as well. Or at least I got 1 guy to come out. I also bought suction cup handles and between the guy I hired and myself we moved it inside.


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

I thought I was going to have to hire movers to get my 5' Waterbox into the house, but a buddy and I were able to do it with moving straps. I was shocked. My wife and I were even able to move the tank off and back onto the stand several times with them while I figured out the leveling feet. Best $20 I've spent in a while. Highly recommended.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Two months since I updated??

Heh this tank has been mostly drama free so I guess I didn't feel the need until I noticed how long its been.

Update!

The biggest news with this tank are the inhabitants. I simply could not keep a live female apistogramma panduro. My first one died and I got a second one and that one died as well. I gave up on them after that. I have no idea why they didn't do well. My male is doing fine. Sooo maybe aggression?

Also dead is my male german blue ram. Again no idea what happened. The female ram is doing great. Maybe aggression from the male apisto got the ram? But I honestly didn't see them fighting and the male ram was pretty intact when I found him. Temperature in the tank is kept at 82 which my understanding is should be good for the rams and possibly a little high for the apsito but not terribly high.

Anyway after those losses I put a hold on any new fish. I wanted to see what was going to happen so the tank sat as is for a couple of months. Flash forward to a couple of days ago and I decided it was time to add some fish again. I originally invisioned this tank with angel fish but decided against them due to concerns over aggression. BUT, when in the fishstore they had some nice looking golden angel fish and... well I couldn't resist. I got 2 and I'm hoping I chose correctly. So far no aggression between the angels so we shall see...

And now for the pictures:





































living his best snailly life:










And the obligatory full tank shot:










The eagle eye observer will note that the elodea like plant on the top shelf is gone. This is due to it frankly growing in a way that was not aesthetically pleasing (basically just crazy all over). I am also going to eliminate the actual elodea on the lower level as well soon. Its simply not growing in a nice way. I am going to replace it with more pennywort. I have also added hydrocotyle tripartita to the top shelf as well. This was very recently so it hasn't done anything yet but look a little sad. Heres to the next update looking even better!


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Sorry about the losses. Tank is looking good though.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

EmotionalFescue said:


> Sorry about the losses. Tank is looking good though.


Yeah it sucks when I lose a fish, I try not to get attached to them until they have been around for a while. In this case both deaths occurred pretty shortly after my last post 2 months ago. Nothing else has died (though I only see my poor dwarf crayfish when I do a water change). So I don't think its a water parameter issue but honestly I always feel like fish deaths are mysterious.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Quick Update:

When, what to my wandering eyes should appear? But eggs!

Angel fish eggs to be precise:










When getting angel fish the advice is always to get them really small, get a bunch, and then rehome everyone who is not a happy pair. I did not take this advice, I bought 2 angel fish, watched really closely at the fish store, and hoped I got it right. I frankly thought I got it wrong, there has definitely been aggression between the two and I was seriously thinking of rehoming one of them soon. Then this morning I see the eggs. I am assuming this first lay will be a failure so I'm just leaving it for now. But maybe in the future I will transfer them to another area. Thank goodness they laid on a leaf. Will make removal a lot easier when it happens.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Quick update:

Water change day. Full tank shot:


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!

It's been about 4.5 months since I planted the tank. At this point the original plants have reached their potential and the result is frankly not quite what I wanted. I really wanted the bigger swords to frankly be a bit smaller. I also wanted them to be a bit fuller. I am also not happy with how the pennywort is growing. I wanted it to grow in and around the hardscape. I can kind of drape it on the hardscape and pin it in place. But it just grows up to the surface after that. I simply do not have enough flow to keep it growing sideways instead of vertically. Soooo it was time for a change.

I recently made a thread asking about plant options for surface growth, and as a result of that thread bought some ludwigia sedioides from buceplant. While I was at it, I also bought some Needle Leaf Java Fern and some Philippine Mini Java Fern. 

The plan is to have a few of the ludwigia growing from the deeper part of the tank all the way to the surface (and maybe one in the back, we will see) and put the bigger needle leaf java fern closer to the front with the smaller philippine mini java fern farther back in the hardscape to hopefully help with the perception of depth.

I also wanted to get rid of the bigger swords, and then move the smaller swords to the front. The pennywort also needed to go. I also decided to add a bunch more blyxa japonica I had leftover from my shallow tank redo. To that end:










Now I already think its looking better. BUT I have always been a little unhappy with how the rockwork is handled on the right side:



















Basically I don't like how it ends so abruptly. I either should have continued the embankment all the way to the end of the tank, or come up with something else. I decided now was a good time to tackle this. It's always a bit harry to do major renovations inside a tank while its still planted and occupied... but I gave it a go.




























I still ended up with a major drop-off but it doesn't look as bad... maybe... ;P I honestly haven't decided yet if I'm done fiddling with it. The bushy sword plant is just kind of stuck there because I didn't have room for it anywhere else. I might get rid of it, but felt a lot of hesitation in doing so simply because its been such a healthy plant for me up to now. Soooo we shall see. I'll probably update again in a day or two once the new plants are in.


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Looking good. I never end up with many of the OG plants still in the tank after a few months.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update:

Plants arrived as expected. Also a little more generous then I expected. The java ferns all had multiple plants per pot. And the bundle of ludwigia sedioides included 9 plants. None of the ludwigia looks happy to see me, but they just spent 2 days in a box traveling across the country in winter. So not terribly surprising. If its like any other ludwigia I've grown, it should be perking up within a few days.

Pictures during the day for extra window glare action!




























I'm not super happy with my java fern placement right now and may move them about a bit. Also they need to bush out some more before I will be completely satisfied. But its a fun change of pace from the previous layout.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Small Update:

This is their 4th clutch. So far no eggs have survived past a couple of days. I am just leaving them. I am not desperate to raise a million angel fish but if they make it happen I will find a way ;P










and a full tank shot. Sadly the new ludwigia has completely failed to thrive.


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## ddiomede (Feb 21, 2011)

The tank looks amazing! The fact that you have angles laying eggs says a lot about the health of the system. 

I might have missed it, but what did you do for the background? I'd love to use vinyl, but then was thinking about how the wall behind my tank is a very pale blue which might actually look pretty good. I used white vinyl initially on my nano before it was set up, but I have equipment on the back which really stood out again white so I switched to black instead. I'd have preferred white.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

ddiomede said:


> The tank looks amazing! The fact that you have angles laying eggs says a lot about the health of the system.
> 
> I might have missed it, but what did you do for the background? I'd love to use vinyl, but then was thinking about how the wall behind my tank is a very pale blue which might actually look pretty good. I used white vinyl initially on my nano before it was set up, but I have equipment on the back which really stood out again white so I switched to black instead. I'd have preferred white.


Thank you! This tank has been super easy so far. It's fun to see breeding activity in it. I originally lost my male german blue ram when I started this tank and left the female alone for a while. Now that she is doing so well I decided to add a male back in. Not pictured there, the new male (which is much smaller then the female) seems to be doing well and the two rams have definitely paired up. So its possible I will see breeding from them as well.

There is no background on this tank, that is just the wall. When I do a background I go with window film which is usually translucent. I have a gray background on my new bookshelf newt tank which I think is pretty decent, but I might swap it out for something else (haven't decided yet).


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## ddiomede (Feb 21, 2011)

minorhero said:


> Thank you! This tank has been super easy so far. It's fun to see breeding activity in it. I originally lost my male german blue ram when I started this tank and left the female alone for a while. Now that she is doing so well I decided to add a male back in. Not pictured there, the new male (which is much smaller then the female) seems to be doing well and the two rams have definitely paired up. So its possible I will see breeding from them as well.
> 
> There is no background on this tank, that is just the wall. When I do a background I go with window film which is usually translucent. I have a gray background on my new bookshelf newt tank which I think is pretty decent, but I might swap it out for something else (haven't decided yet).


Wow that's crazy, I thought for sure you had a background on that tank lol. It really does look like there is one. 

One of my favorite fish are rams. I'd love to start breeding them but just don't have the time. That would be pretty cool though if they started laying eggs too. Outside of livebearers, which will breed in almost any conditions, if you can get egg layers to lay eggs it's a really good sign that things are in great shape.

ETA: thanks again for all your help with my future build. That's why I prefer forums to FB and the like. I've always gotten much better advice on forums, and there's always something I forget or didn't think of that's mentioned.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

ddiomede said:


> ETA: thanks again for all your help with my future build. That's why I prefer forums to FB and the like. I've always gotten much better advice on forums, and there's always something I forget or didn't think of that's mentioned.


Glad to help! I agree with you about facebook. I am a member of several aquarium groups on facebook as well, the advice here is orders of magnitude better then what is commonly handed out in those groups. Plus actually tracking a build is pretty much impossible. Facebook is great for seeing a picture or asking about something local. Forums are much better for anything involving a longitudinal question, study, or build.


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## Bootsy (Jul 4, 2021)

How is that ludwigia/mosaic plant doing? I hope it works for you - vicarious thrill for me because I don’t have anywhere to put one right now.

Also jealous of the angels, which I adore but also can’t accommodate.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Bootsy said:


> How is that ludwigia/mosaic plant doing? I hope it works for you - vicarious thrill for me because I don’t have anywhere to put one right now.
> 
> Also jealous of the angels, which I adore but also can’t accommodate.


Sadly its almost a complete loss at this point, and I am frankly anticipating total failure regarding the ludwigia. I think I got 8 or 9 stems originally. Several lost all their leaves within a few days. Those stems are now dead. Several others held onto their leaves for a week or 2. But now even those leaves are gone. Interestingly despite having almost (or in most cases, no) leaves some of the stems are still growing taller. One reached the surface and then after several days just rotted off at the base. 

Anyway I don't know why it hates my tank, but it clearly does. Likely though its going to be either nutrients, light, or kh as the deadly culprit. 

Soooo if it makes you feel better, even if you found some its possible it wouldn't do any better for you then for me ;P


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## ElleDee (May 16, 2020)

What is your kh btw?


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## Bootsy (Jul 4, 2021)

That’s a shame, but I think it’s got a rep as a bad shipper/acclimater.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

ElleDee said:


> What is your kh btw?


3 to 4 depending on the season.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Bootsy said:


> That’s a shame, but I think it’s got a rep as a bad shipper/acclimater.


Could be the issue as well but it did grow in my tank, just not well or for long before dying.


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## Virtus (11 mo ago)

Just finished reading through your journal and I love your setup! It reminds me a lot of this river scape build from Green Aqua I recently watched - 



.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Virtus said:


> Just finished reading through your journal and I love your setup! It reminds me a lot of this river scape build from Green Aqua I recently watched -
> 
> 
> 
> .


Thank you! Its a fun tank which has required surprisingly little maintenance. 

As time goes on I like the aquascaping videos green aqua puts out more and more. Seems like this fellow was similarly influenced by streams.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Brief Update:

My filter started making a loud scratching humming noise today. I figured it was something stuck in there, so I opened it up and took it apart and did a full cleaning while I was at it. This is the second time I've cleaned this filter since putting it into service about 6 months ago which is right around the schedule I 'want' to have but more frequent then my typical canister filter cleaning usually is.

Anyway I found the culprit pretty easily. SNAILS. Lots of snails. A dead one was likely the one making the noise with its shell having been mostly cut up and crushed. Here are the live ones I pulled out:










It's no secret how they are getting into the filter. I have a skimmer on the intake, and they must be crawling in from there when they are small enough to fit through the skimmer teeth. For that matter they might not be crawling in so much as floating in. Ramshorn snails have an ability to float just under the water's surface. In nature this is how they move around quickly, in my aquarium its how they get sucked into the blackhole of 'almost' no return.

Anyway I am very interested if anyone has found a good solution for stopping this kind of thing from happening. In the short term I put one of my daughters hair ties around the skimmer at the water's surface further restricting the hole size.










It won't stop a snail from crawling over the tines, but it will at least stop the small ones from getting sucked in when they are floating around.


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

Snails.... I pulled my Oase 250 to move to a different tank. It's been running for only a couple of months on that tank and the bottom tray was totally covered in snails and snail eggs.


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## Virtus (11 mo ago)

Wow! That's A LOT of snails!


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Small update. 

The wife is moving furniture around this room and put a chair near the tank. The new cat wasted no time in taking advantage.


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## Virtus (11 mo ago)

That would make me nervous! Does he ever try grabbing any of the tank inhabitants?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Virtus said:


> That would make me nervous! Does he ever try grabbing any of the tank inhabitants?


It does makes me nervous...

He has never gone after fish. What he wants to do is drink the water. He can reach the two newt tanks much easier and regularly drinks water out of them. This tank has no ledge or shelf next to it, so until the chair was put next to it, it was effectively off limits. Once he had a boost from the chair back he could reach the rim. I was surprised he could then balance ON the rim 

My nightmare scenario is that he falls in, and in his scramble to get out knocks over a rock which in turn busts the tank. ...........

Have I mentioned that this is The Wife's cat and I am not allowed to have it turned into slippers?


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## ddiomede (Feb 21, 2011)

minorhero said:


> It does makes me nervous...
> 
> He has never gone after fish. What he wants to do is drink the water. He can reach the two newt tanks much easier and regularly drinks water out of them. This tank has no ledge or shelf next to it, so until the chair was put next to it, it was effectively off limits. Once he had a boost from the chair back he could reach the rim. I was surprised he could then balance ON the rim
> 
> ...


Whatever you do, don't dissuade it using a spray bottle. 50/50 chance the cat falls into the tank after getting squirted lol. 

Ask me how I know...😐


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## Virtus (11 mo ago)

Tank update request  

Was just reading through your build again, I may have missed it but what kind of stones are these?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Virtus said:


> Tank update request
> 
> Was just reading through your build again, I may have missed it but what kind of stones are these?


Tank is doing well. I am thinking of changing it up a little bit, adding some more rock and branching wood to the top, possibly with moss on the wood. The rock is all wild collected from a friends property in a stream. 90% sure its granite.


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## Virtus (11 mo ago)

minorhero said:


> The rock is all wild collected from a friends property in a stream. 90% sure its granite.


So the best type ha!

Looking good my friend.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Morning fish vibes with the cat.










I'm thinking I will be adding to the scape of this tank. Likely a little more rock and a lot more wood. My wife cut some dead azalea branches and I got immediate aquascaping vibes from them.


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## ddiomede (Feb 21, 2011)

minorhero said:


> Morning fish vibes with the cat.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The cat is most definitely planning something.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

My 3 year old son's favorite fish in the tank is not the rams with their iridesent blue fleks, or the angel fish with their long fins and flattened bodies. It's this guy, the Orange Seam Pleco L106. Practically impossible to photograph, but I finally got him with my phone.


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

minorhero said:


> My 3 year old son's favorite fish in the tank is not the rams with their iridesent blue fleks, or the angel fish with their long fins and flattened bodies. It's this guy, the Orange Seam Pleco L106. Practically impossible to photograph, but I finally got him with my phone.


Gorgeous fish. And you got him in the light! My pleco is completely nocturnal and incredibly shy.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

EmotionalFescue said:


> Gorgeous fish. And you got him in the light! My pleco is completely nocturnal and incredibly shy.


These guys are not exactly nocturnal... but they definitely are not commonly in the light. More frequently they come out after the morning lights turn off (I have a split photo period) or after lights out in the evening. But I feed the tank in the morning and since switching to only feeding once a day, I've started to see them coming out around feeding time. They just usually jet away as quickly as possible when I have a camera or phone in my hands


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

What are your plecos eating? I can't get mine to eat anything but algae off the rocks.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

EmotionalFescue said:


> What are your plecos eating? I can't get mine to eat anything but algae off the rocks.


I used to feed them algae wafers but it was hit or miss. I'm pretty sure they eat leftover bits of food that make it to the substrate/rocks. That plus the algae.


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## AlexM (Jun 16, 2011)

looking great so far! Interested in your lighting, seems quite bright. Your using a smart bulb in the center to mimic dusk/dawn?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

AlexM said:


> looking great so far! Interested in your lighting, seems quite bright. Your using a smart bulb in the center to mimic dusk/dawn?


Thank you!

The one in the center is currently a near UV light I was originally using as an experiment to see if it affected algae growing on the rocks. It had no noticeable affect. But I ended up liking the colors it made in the tank so I left it. 

I get about 40 ppfd at substrate level so medium light. I run this tank with low nutrients and low levels of CO2. It's been working for me this far and has been my lowest maintenance tank by a good margin.


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## AlexM (Jun 16, 2011)

minorhero said:


> Thank you!
> 
> The one in the center is currently a near UV light I was originally using as an experiment to see if it affected algae growing on the rocks. It had no noticeable affect. But I ended up liking the colors it made in the tank so I left it.
> 
> I get about 40 ppfd at substrate level so medium light. I run this tank with low nutrients and low levels of CO2. It's been working for me this far and has been my lowest maintenance tank by a good margin.


can you refresh me what bulbs you've used? I may have to try this on my new build and decide to update to more intense lights later down the road.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

AlexM said:


> can you refresh me what bulbs you've used? I may have to try this on my new build and decide to update to more intense lights later down the road.


The smart bulbs are Feit Electric bulbs. The one in the center is just a near uv bulb. I've run a few different bulbs in the center at this point. That's the greatest strength of this kind of lighting. When you just have e26 bulb sockets you can unscrew your light and replace it for fairly cheap with something else allowing you to trial and error your way to the best looking light spectrum.


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## AlexM (Jun 16, 2011)

minorhero said:


> The smart bulbs are Feit Electric bulbs. The one in the center is just a near uv bulb. I've run a few different bulbs in the center at this point. That's the greatest strength of this kind of lighting. When you just have e26 bulb sockets you can unscrew your light and replace it for fairly cheap with something else allowing you to trial and error your way to the best looking light spectrum.


Yeah the e26 base has nice flexibility. I wonder if even the grow shops sell those I might have to take a look. I’ve had decent luck with some e26 base bulbs even from Home Depot on nano tanks


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

AlexM said:


> Yeah the e26 base has nice flexibility. I wonder if even the grow shops sell those I might have to take a look. I’ve had decent luck with some e26 base bulbs even from Home Depot on nano tanks


I have 3 tanks (2 of them being display tanks) running with e26 bulbs. If you don't want 60+ ppfd at substrate then in my view there is nothing better. Especially since they keep making better bulbs so in the long term you are likely to get a better and better light out of the deal. BUT if you want to lay down 100+ ppfd with a high light tank. Well, you would need so many of the things as to make it near impossible to make it look good aesthetically.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Change is coming!










I have had this scaped and running for 14 months. Originally I had hoped to photo it for entry into aquascaping contests but realized partway through this last year that it would never place well. For one thing, while the hardscape goes up past the halfway mark on the tank, it does not reach the waterline. Looking at recently winning tanks, a hardscape that goes all the way to the surface is essential. I've known for a while now that I needed / wanted to redo this tank, but how has been a question.

Well today The Wife has indicated that this tank needs to move across the room about 10 feet so we can change up the furniture in that room. This is a non-trivial undertaking as unfortunately the stand itself has at least one screw that digs into the floor when the tank is pushed. So I need to lift the stand up when I move it and that frankly means, that I need the tank off the stand entirely (plus probably the granite top as well). 

The process of rescaping this tank (I will literally need everything including hardscape out of the tank to move it) is a time consuming enough process that I would need to store the livestock and plants in a full blown second cycled and heated aquarium in order to do a proper job of it.

OR

I can take this as an opportunity to rehome the fish and change up the livestock in this tank.......and yeah, I'm going this route.

I am far from certain yet on what fish will go into this tank.... but I am strongly leaning towards peaceful and small natives in a scape that will hopefully be a contender for a contest.


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## rzn7z7 (Aug 17, 2013)

Looking forward to where this goes....and your cat seems to be at home lapping up the tank's water


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

rzn7z7 said:


> Looking forward to where this goes....and your cat seems to be at home lapping up the tank's water


It's going to be fun! So far thinking bluefin killifish, pygmy killifish, and pygmy sunfish. Debating darters, sculpin, and blue spotted sunfish 

It's weird but that's his favorite place to drink despite there being several tanks that are easier to get to plus of course his actual water bowl.


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## Count Krunk (2 mo ago)

You going to take the new hard scape up to the water line then?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Count Krunk said:


> You going to take the new hard scape up to the water line then?


Yes, definitely that's the plan. I've never done that before (unless you count wood piercing the water, which is not what I mean) so it's going to be an adventure.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update:

The move!

I rehomed all of my fish 2 days ago on Monday. Today I pulled all the plants and emptied the tank.

I didn't count, but I'm guessing I have something crazy like 200 blyxa japonica in this tank once they were all separated out. Because I rehomed the amazon compacta along with the fish, the only plants left in the tank were the java fern and the blyxa. Mostly blyxa. Combined they filled up more then half of a 5 gallon bucket:










Here is what the tank looked like once the plants were all removed:










After that I drained out the water, and started removing rocks while this was happening. I actually got a bit ahead of myself. It was useful having some water in the tank because I could use it to wash off the sand before I removed a rock. But I drained it down too far and decided I needed to refill it partly to get my sand washing game back on 

After all the rocks and wood were removed I combed through the sand to pull out my chopstick snails (they dig in the substrate during the day) and removed any small rocks and lava rock that I missed.

I then used my favorite tool for removing sand, a plastic dust pan, a few more partial refills and empties and here I am:










After that it was time to move it. I was a bit concerned that the rubber feet on this stand are actually scratching my floors (they are secured with screws which are sadly not as inset as they need to be) so I lifted up the whole thing just enough for The Wife to slip some folded paper under each of the 4 corners which would hopefully lift the stand up just enough that no scraping would occur. This ALMOST worked..... but it honestly wasn't too bad.

Here is where it started off:










And here is where it ended up:










Later after The Wife conferenced in her sister, it got moved over an additional foot to the left. But otherwise, it's now in it's happy new home.

And that brings me up to current.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!

My tank in the previous location was not level..... and it ALWAYS annoyed me. It wasn't off by much, by the time we got to the top of the tank the front was 1/4 inch lower then the back of the tank. Visually only I ever noticed this, but... I DID notice. It was also the type of thing that could not be fixed short of draining the tank.

Well.. the tank is empty. So, time to fix it! Because the new spot had the same level of non-levelness as the last, it needed the same amount of fixing. 

Well the tank weighs something like 150 lbs. I have no idea what my stand weighs... but I would guess something like 200 lbs at least. I'm not a big guy.... I don't bench 350.. so lifting up the stand so I could shim it was not going to be easy. Or so I thought.

A few searches turned up some 'cabinet jacks'. Wow what a cool device. One on each front corner activated at the same time and 30 seconds later this tank is level.



















45 dollars shipped for the pair. Highly recommend!


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## somewhatshocked (Aug 8, 2011)

minorhero said:


> A few searches turned up some 'cabinet jacks'. Wow what a cool device. One on each front corner activated at the same time and 30 seconds later this tank is level.


Welp, this website is gonna make me go broke today.

These and that double-size utility sink in @EmotionalFescue's journal are no-brainers for people suffering from Multiple Tank Syndrome.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

somewhatshocked said:


> Welp, this website is gonna make me go broke today.
> 
> These and that double-size utility sink in @EmotionalFescue's journal are no-brainers for people suffering from Multiple Tank Syndrome.


LOL, yeah they are pretty awesome, and I have to admit... I've already started thinking about replacing my washdown sink, my current one being functional but SUPER shady in it's implementation (the drain at one point goes UP hill). 

Anyway...

UPDATE!

As mentioned, this is a really good time to fix things that have bothered me with the tank.

One thing that definitely has been bothering me is the fairly ridiculous engine room for this tank. I mean... after the water comes from the filter, it literally goes into a spiral before it leaves my equipment to go back into the tank.

I have always thought I could do better.

For reference, here is was what the engine room looked like before now (removed from the stand and without the filter):










The filter pushes the water through the reactor, then to the temperature probe, then to the heater, then to the fertilizer manifold and then back to the tank.

Well the tank going forward is not going to need a heater as I am switching to all native fish. So not only do I not need a heater, I also don't need a temperature probe. Time to simplify things!

Reusing the same reactor (but integrating it directly) I decided the only thing I really needed to do was make a better fertilizer manifold. Here are the parts I selected:










The last time I made one of these, I drilled a 3/16th inch hole into some pvc, and glued an airline connector into the slot and called it a day. This time I wanted to use cable glands which I frankly didn't know existed until @EmotionalFescue posted about using them in his build. I already had the cable glands on hand and while I probably could just use some airline tubing, I wanted something stiffer to provide some 'grip' for the cable glands. I chose to use short lengths of co2 tubing.

I also did not want the darn thing to ever get accidentally pulled free. So the first thing I did was use a heat gun to soften the co2 tubing tip, then used a random screwdriver bit to widen the end in a cone shape while it was still hot and malleable:










After this when the co2 tubing was inserted into the cable gland, the wide end would be impossible to pull free. I then used an airline connector on the other end so I could easily 'plug' into it. This is what that looked like:










After that I drilled and tapped a pvc end cap. I had to fudge things a bit here as I did not have the correct thread size for the tap. I made up for the difference with some pvc cement. I am very 'hopeful' that it won't leak 










I did this a total of 3 times and put it together. The extra spot at the end is for potential expansion in the future.










After that I removed the barbed ends from the reactor and integrated it directly into the manifold. I re-attached a barbed end to the top of the reactor, but this time I installed a 1 inch barb instead of a 5/8. The reason is that this new system is all 1" except for the tubing from the lily pipe and the tubing back to the return pipe. If they made stainless steel 1" lily pipes, I would just use that of course, but this is the best I can do without that. Will it make any difference?? No idea, but I hope my water no longer going into a spiral and through all those different barbs will help somewhat.

After that I needed to attach this whole contraption to a board so I could easily install it under my stand.










As fine woodworking..... it leaves a lot to be desired. But for a slapdash implementation its entirely adequate.

Before I actually put this whole thing to work I plan to leak test it... just in case. Otherwise I am getting incredibly close to filling this tank back up!


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## EmotionalFescue (Jun 24, 2020)

Looking good!

For future reference, you can thread the glands right into threaded bushings which slip fit right into tees, elbows, etc... They're what you ended up with, but you don't have to tap them yourself.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

EmotionalFescue said:


> Looking good!
> 
> For future reference, you can thread the glands right into threaded bushings which slip fit right into tees, elbows, etc... They're what you ended up with, but you don't have to tap them yourself.


This was sadly very much a make work with what ya got kinda thing. I had previously bought a kit containing several sizes of cable gland. But only one of them fit my CO2 tubing. It was not a normal size unfortunately. Something bigger than 1/2 inch but smaller than 9/16 inch. So I just kind of went with it. If it fails the leak test (or I find myself doing it again down the road) I will definitely buy the right stuff. Making do is much less satisfying than just using the correctly sized parts from the beginning


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## Le duke (Jun 29, 2021)

Oh man. I like this. 

Here's a question for you:

Is there any reason you couldn't make a dosing manifold that was ALSO a housing for an in-line heater? Would the locally elevated temperatures denature or somehow otherwise harm the dosed ferts?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Le duke said:


> Oh man. I like this.
> 
> Here's a question for you:
> 
> Is there any reason you couldn't make a dosing manifold that was ALSO a housing for an in-line heater? Would the locally elevated temperatures denature or somehow otherwise harm the dosed ferts?


Since water is going to be constantly moving through that chamber, there really would not be an elevated temperature locally so long as the filter or pump is turned on. I mean... technically it will be elevated... but we are talking like .1 degree or some nonsense. Water will be moving through an inline chamber at hundreds of gallons an hour for a 75 gallon tank. It won't stay around long enough to do anything.

Honestly, I have no idea if fertilizers stay good if heated up to say 100 degrees. BUT, I don't think it will ever happen so to finally get around to answering your question, sure it would work fine. If I were building such a critter I would just make sure to use properly removable parts so I could gain access to the area down the line if/when the heater eventually failed. Similarly you could include a temperature probe in the same manifold system as well. In fact, that is basically what the 4th unused spot is for. If I ever need a temperature probe in the future, I can drill and tap that location to make it happen. The biggest 'issue' for me was making sure that the T junction I am using was facing 'down' so there wouldn't be an air bubble trapped when in use (if that makes sense).


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Update!

Soooo those reading along will remember that I previously said I was going to try to put hardscape right to the very top of the tank. I definitely made a good effort with that, but ultimately decided I did not like the look. I mean.. structurally it is very possible. It takes about 3 large stones stacked on top of each other, but at that point you are the water's surface or piercing it.

BUT, I was fundamentally unhappy with how things looked. I probably went through 20 different aquascapes. This one came close to making it, but I decided it was not what I wanted.










I was somewhat discouraged and a bit obsessed with it, so I walked away from the whole thing for a day. As tends to happen, I found myself inspired after I walked away and came back to put together this scape:










The idea here would be a carpet in the middle that would go to the back and then up over each side in the back as well. The wood would hold up the rocks allowing for a subterranean kind of look 'under the carpet' as it were. This would not truly be a landscape style tank but much more of a nature style. Or such was my idea. I was pretty happy with this scape and after a bit of tinkering decided to keep it.

I did have to partially take it apart to boil my wood for instance:










This got rid of a LOT of tannins plus made it so my wood would waterlog quicker. I did not bother to boil the large bit of wood on the left which was previously in my saltwater tank, but everything else went into the pot.

Now again, those following along will notice this scape does not actually go to the water's surface. But I just wasn't inspired by the scapes I created that did go up that high.

I added one 50lb bag of pool filter sand just to get an initial layer, and then added water to the tank. My FX4 has been sitting in my basement since I drained this tank. The filter has been full with the input and output pieces removed so some air could get into the filter. My hope is beneficial bacteria is still alive in the filter.... but who knows, if that is the case. Either way when I turned the filter on for the first time in this new setup, it blew junk all over the tank. I pretty much expected this to happen so I wasn't surprised or concerned.

I was however MUCH more concerned when the middle port in my fertilizer manifold developed a slow leak shortly after starting the filter. I can't say I'm super surprised about this either. I tried to plug it by just slapping on some more pvc cement, but predictably that didn't do it. I therefore drained the tank:










Once there was no more water in the manifold, I unscrewed the cable gland, got a new one, slapped on a LOT more all purpose pvc cement, and then screwed it back on.

This worked and the new cable gland held water once refilled.

I also added another 50lb bag of sand to bring the back up to close to where I want it. This is how it looks now:










Things left to do....

Well I am still not done with substrate. I want to create a way to add substrate to the different layers of rocks in this tank so I can have little pockets of plants in the nooks and crevices. I previously tried this by stuffing holes between rocks full of foam. This .... sucks.. So I will be trying something different in this tank. I will hopefully tomorrow find out if it works.

I also want to drain and refill the tank at least one more time.. Why? Well half the wood in this tank, plus a significant number of the rocks were previously in a saltwater tank. I have no doubt they are currently raising the salinity quite high for a freshwater tank. I want that stuff gone before I plant.

Speaking of plants, they came in today! Which is good because tomorrow the weather is expected to be in the single digits where I live.

Hopefully I will be planting tomorrow, and when I do, I will post more detail about the plants at that time.


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## Jekk (Jan 11, 2022)

Beautiful, and always a pleasure to follow along.


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