# Hoppy's 65 Gal Riparium



## Old Salt (Aug 11, 2009)

Looking good , Hoppy. Waiting for pictures of the tank.


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

things are going to grow like crazy under that fixture!


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## fastfreddie (Sep 10, 2008)

Glad I found this thread early! You are a DIY fanatic Hoppy! You may need counseling. 

The fixture and stand look good enough for a retail shelf. I know how much time you have invested in both. Especially that light... wow! 

Looking forward to watching you hone your riparium skills!


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Yes! You are gonna get the awesome tank!!


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## billb (May 29, 2009)

Wow - nice work on the stand. It will complement your new rimless tank beautifully (much better than gray formica...)

Look forward to seeing this develop

Bill


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## fastfreddie (Sep 10, 2008)

fastfreddie said:


> Glad I found this thread early! You are a DIY fanatic Hoppy! You may need counseling.


Edit that. You are 4 posts away from 5,000 posts. It's way too late for counseling. The effects are irreversible. :icon_bigg


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## paulrw (Apr 14, 2009)

lookin good hoppy! i scanned through the light thread ,couple questions how many watts does the entire fixture use and did you end up with the 50-100 micromols per sq m per sec of PAR at the substrate level you were looking for?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The LED fixture runs at 400 mA or 200 mA and uses about 40 watts of power at the higher current. It gives about 45 micromols of PAR at the high current, with the fixture hanging about 6 inches above the tank, at near the substrate, about what I hoped for. It has been running at 200 mA for the past few weeks, with no CO2, as I try to switch the plants to non-CO2, so I can use them for the underwater plants for this riparium. The plants, mostly crypts, with some needle leaf Java Fern, and some sunset hygro are doing very well growing with no CO2. I will probably use the fixture at the higher current setting for the riparium.


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## Minsc (Jul 9, 2006)

You got it, very nice!
This tank is destined for greatness


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I don't really have the tank in hand yet, it had to be ordered. I could have arranged to get it tomorrow, but I won't be ready then, so I will probably pick it up late next week. One bit of sad news: I contacted 2 of the 3 LFS who sell Oceanic tanks for a price on the tank. One said $279.99, and the other said "about $300", so I bought it from the first place. Then, 2 hours later the second place called back to say they could cut the price by 10%, which would have saved me $10. Of course $10 isn't like real money today, so I'm not upset. With that $10 I could have paid for the gas to go pick up the tank! (PT Cruiser's don't get great mileage!)


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## paulrw (Apr 14, 2009)

awsome hoppy! you have got me interested about rips i have a 29g i'm thinking of making into one you and hydrophyte have got it down. i can't wait to see were you go with this!


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## Primetime Rob (Jul 24, 2009)

Well done. The stand and fixture look amazing. I look forward to seeing more.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

paulrw said:


> awsome hoppy! you have got me interested about rips i have a 29g i'm thinking of making into one you and hydrophyte have got it down. i can't wait to see were you go with this!


I did a "prototype" riparium with a 15H tank, just to be sure I really enjoyed it as much as I thought I would. I find I do. Why not set up that 29gallon tank for that reason too? It isn't grossly expensive to do so, and you will learn a lot about ripariums that way, plus find out if this is something you want to get more serious about. At worst even a poorly done riparium looks very good, with the beauty of the terrestrial plants above the water. And, there is a seemingly endless variety of plants you can use.


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## paulrw (Apr 14, 2009)

hoppy i saw your 15g thats what made me think hmmm! I really got into the planted aquariums because of the plants so the natural progression is the riparium I'm happy that theres people like you and hydro to push the boundary's to keep the rest of us inspired kudos!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Today was the appointed day to tear down the existing 45 gallon, Jebo style aquarium, to make room for the riparium. Big job! So far I've spent about 5 hours on it, but it is mostly done now. I just need to get the aquarium moved to somebody else's home, sell off the filter and powerhead, plug the holes in the wall where my constant flow water change system comes in, paint the patches, move the new stand into place, pick up the new aquarium, and away we go! Here is what is coming out:


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Hoppy said:


> I just need to get the aquarium moved to somebody else's home, sell off the filter and powerhead, plug the holes in the wall where my constant flow water change system comes in, paint the patches, move the new stand into place, pick up the new aquarium, and away we go!


... a piece of cake for you, Hoppy. You can do anything.... 

Looking forward to your Riparium!


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## Coltonorr (Mar 12, 2008)

I envy your doityourselfedness!


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## Regloh (Jan 17, 2009)

I really have to check here more often... I missed this thread entirely until now. Can't wait to see it setup. *subscribe*


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I finally got the wall repaired where the water piping came in from the deck outside, and where there were numerous thread inserts for various light setups. And, my wife and I moved the stand up the stairs to here. Plus, I got the support for the light made and installed:









That light support is like the bent conduit designs others have used, but I used a 1" conduit with a 1" conduit elbow (short piece of conduit pre-bent to 90 degrees), and two couplings to hold the conduit pieces to the elbow, with 3 one screw conduit brackets to hold it to the wall, with everything spray painted with Rustoleum satin white:









I will paint the brackets tomorrow and start leveling the stand. I still haven't had a call from the LFS telling me my tank has arrived.


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## Philosophos (May 7, 2009)

Nice to see you've got the kinks out of your DIY LED. I can't wait to see what you do with the riparium concept this time around. What kind of improvements do you have planned?

-Philosophos


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Philosophos said:


> Nice to see you've got the kinks out of your DIY LED. I can't wait to see what you do with the riparium concept this time around. What kind of improvements do you have planned?
> 
> -Philosophos


Riparium improvements? That is far in the future. I'm still struggling with learning how to manage a riparium. I will be shifting from a high CO2, moderate light, planted tank, to a low light, non-CO2 planted tank, having lots of terrestrial plants sharing the water with the aquatic plants and fish. This upsets my planted tank instincts considerably. Just learning how to manage the growth of the terrestrial plants, the seasonal cycle for them, the pruning techniques needed, the fertilizing, the insect pests, etc. should keep this interesting for at least a year, before I even think about how to do it better. You know, learn to walk before trying to win a marathon?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The first big problem happened today. Those who have already used bent conduit light support brackets probably saw this coming, but I didn't: the bracket flexes too much, so it is bent down by the light fixture weight - 10 pounds - due to the elbow section bending too much. I had calculated the bending of the straight sections, and found them to be well within reason, but I didn't allow for the curved section to bend so much.

That means I will have to make another bracket and mount two brackets on the back wall to support the light. This will be more than strong enough because the arms at the top will not be nearly as long, in fact I will just use the elbow section as is. A few more $$$ down the drain.


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## daFrimpster (Mar 7, 2005)

maybe a single bracket with larger pipe would work better.


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## TheCryptKeeper (Mar 9, 2008)

I think that the idea of a support bracket from the back will work great. When is the tank coming in? any word from you lfs? 

I am interested to see how this turns out. I hope that the transition for you works out ok and you don't give up! I want to see the end results.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

daFrimpster said:


> maybe a single bracket with larger pipe would work better.


No doubt, there is a conduit size that will make the deflection be reasonable. But, my CEO is already griping about the humongous pipe sticking out from the wall. Going to a still bigger one wouldn't do anything positiive for the relationship. A 1" conduit is about 1 1/4 inch in diameter, and it looks even bigger up there. I even thought about packing the inside of the conduit with sand or something to try to make it stiffer, but that would cost more than just using two brackets. And, I'm not at all sure it would work.

I did "beautify" my new pair of brackets by plugging the open hole in the end of each - the end of the conduit elbow - with a short section of 1" wood dowel, split down the middle, with a short sheet metal screw in the crack to expand it to a tight fit inside the conduit, then covered that with a big blob of plumbers epoxy putty. I will sand those down a bit, so they are a finished end.



Torpedobarb said:


> I think that the idea of a support bracket from the back will work great. When is the tank coming in? any word from you lfs?
> 
> I am interested to see how this turns out. I hope that the transition for you works out ok and you don't give up! I want to see the end results.


I won't give up, and it will work, absolutely guaranteed! But, still no word from the LFS. I will phone them tomorrow.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The stand is now leveled - using glued together layers of scrap veneer, a great method - the light fixture is hanging and works fine, and all of the stand parts are installed except the doors. Progress that's visible!

The two bent conduit light supports work fine, and anyone can make them this way:
















No bending required, just a pre-made elbow, a coupling, and a length of straight conduit. I plugged the ends that point out, using 2 inch long pieces of 1" diameter wood dowel, split with a chisel, masking tape taped back together at one end, with a small screw in the crack at the other end, to act as an expander to lock the dowel inside the conduit. Then, I used "plumbers epoxy putty", one of those you cut off a piece that has a different color core, then knead it with your fingers to mix the two colors, and molded over the end of the dowel to form the rounded end plug. It sets in about 30 minutes, so then I used a rasp, file and sandpaper to smooth and form it. The chains tie to a couple of small screw eyes, which I opened up the eye into a nearly closed hook, screwed into the underside of the conduit elbow end, and into the top of the light fixture. To raise the fixture I will make an "S" shaped hook from wire to grab chain links near the top and near the fixture to shorten the chains.

All that is left is modifying my RFUG to use a powerhead, and getting the tank. So far no word on the tank. I contacted the store today by email, but the email account is closed, so I will have to try to phone them again tomorrow. (I just hope they didn't declare bankruptcy after getting my money.) (No joke, that has happened to me before.)


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

can't wait to see it all together! make sure and give us a review of the the Oceanic tank.


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## billb (May 29, 2009)

Wow, I love the wood veneer you have used in the hood and the stand. Maybe If I could get something looking that good my wife would let me move my tank in from the garage!

Looking forward to watching this develop.

Bill


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

oldpunk78 said:


> can't wait to see it all together! make sure and give us a review of the the Oceanic tank.


What we can say already is that this tank is very, very popular! My order went to the local warehouse 9 days ago, and they said it was in stock. Now, it still hasn't arrived at the LFS, so I presume the warehouse ran out of them. And, I'm finally all ready for the tank, as my removed plants from the removed tank sit in a bucket of water slowly rotting away. I won't get hysterical if they all die, but it would be nice to maintain the continuity.


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## fishyboy (Nov 16, 2003)

From what I read Oceanic decided not to release the tank for liability reasons. Would be interested if it is true.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

fishyboy said:


> From what I read Oceanic decided not to release the tank for liability reasons. Would be interested if it is true.


That tank has been sold for a few months now, even having been on sale a few months ago. And, the distributor told two different LFS here that they were available, at what price. So, if Oceanic decided not to sell them they sure kept the news to themselves.

However, they do have an 800 number, so I may decide to give them a call Monday to see what they say.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Those pieces all look real nice together Hoppy. 

I sure hope that they haven't discontinued that tank already. I want to get one, and it's a perfect shape overall for ripariums too. The one that I saw looked plenty sturdy enough.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Those pieces all look real nice together Hoppy.
> 
> I sure hope that they haven't discontinued that tank already. I want to get one, and it's a perfect shape overall for ripariums too. The one that I saw looked plenty sturdy enough.


Nothing good to report today. I started by checking Oceanic's website, to look for all of the local stores that sell their tanks. I phoned all of the local ones - no one has the tank. I branched out to nearby communities, and finally found a place 58 miles away, that had 3 of those tanks! And, the price had been reduced. So, I drove there, only to find that they hadn't received a phone call from me, had no tanks at all in the store. Next I checked the website for that store to find that Oceanic has their phone number wrong by one digit. Obviously the guy who answered is tired of getting their phone calls so he played a game with me. Ha ha.

Now I have a phone call in to Oceanic asking if they ever have or ever intend to make that tank. My guess is that they aren't going to make it. The distributor for northern California has none of the tanks and no idea when or if they will receive any. I canceled my order and got my money back.

So, depending on what Oceanic tells me, plan B is to get an Aqueon 65 gallon tank, with oak color frame, and then decide whether or not to remove the top frame - probably not. At least it does cost a lot less. And, those are still being made, and are available quickly from the distributor.

The Illuminata may have been better called the Illusory Tank.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That's a drag. You spent a lot of time looking for that tank, and I was really hoping that it would become commercially available. You know that might be right that they decided not to release it for liability reasons--too many lawyers*. I have heard that one reason that manufacturers worry about open-top tanks is because of electrocution hazard, which is dumb, because it's much easier for a loose strip light to end up in the water than a fixture sturdily hung as a pendant. 

Well that 65 should be easy enough to get, and cheaper like you say. I imagine the shape of the 56 might have been a little bit nicer for looks, but the 65 will have a few more gallons water and a little more room to situate heaters and other hardware. Can you get it with the black frame? It seems to me the oak frame will clash with your nice stand.

Hey did you see I had another fun flower event?--blooms on my _Spiranthes_ orchid.

*Sorry if anyone reading this is a lawyer, but there are too many lawyers.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> That's a drag. You spent a lot of time looking for that tank, and I was really hoping that it would become commercially available. You know that might be right that they decided not to release it for liability reasons--too many lawyers*. I have heard that one reason that manufacturers worry about open-top tanks is because of electrocution hazard, which is dumb, because it's much easier for a loose strip light to end up in the water than a fixture sturdily hung as a pendant.
> 
> Well that 65 should be easy enough to get, and cheaper like you say. I imagine the shape of the 56 might have been a little bit nicer for looks, but the 65 will have a few more gallons water and a little more room to situate heaters and other hardware. Can you get it with the black frame? It seems to me the oak frame will clash with your nice stand.
> 
> ...


Yes, I saw the pic of the orchid and immediately did a google search to learn what I could about it. It is a central USA native plant! An orchid? I had no idea there were any orchids growing in the area when I grew up there. It is certainly a beautiful flowering plant.

The reason I'm thinking about the oak colored framed aquarium is to get rid of the contrast with the stand. My current, soon to be departed tank has oak trim and on its oak stand the trim isn't at all obtrusive. I haven't seen an Aqueon oak trimmed tank yet, so that has to happen first. Right in front of me now, on my desk is a black rimmed tank, and I don't like the top black rim at all. But, I'm still thinking about this.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

We have quite a few native orchids here in the Great Lakes region. Unlike the great variety of tropical orchids, which are mostly epiphytic, all of ours are terrestrial plants. I have seen a number of different ones Up North in pine forests and in bogs. Here in Southern Wisconsin I have only found rattlesnake plantain (_Goodyera_) and fringed orchids (_Platanthera_). There are 20-some species here in the state.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

*Hoppy's 65 Gallon Riparium (Name Change)*

Oceanic phoned me back this morning - they still produce and sell that 57 gallon tank, deliver them weekly by truck to the distributors, and all of the distributors have them. (And, in the Sacramento area the distributor has one (1), uno, a single one!) I told her I didn't believe that part, but I was glad they were still being produced. Then I headed to a LFS and bought an Aqueon 65 gallon tank, with oak trim, for $195, with the tax, to be in the store tomorrow. At least I'm saving money.


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## Philosophos (May 7, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> Riparium improvements? That is far in the future. I'm still struggling with learning how to manage a riparium. I will be shifting from a high CO2, moderate light, planted tank, to a low light, non-CO2 planted tank, having lots of terrestrial plants sharing the water with the aquatic plants and fish. This upsets my planted tank instincts considerably. Just learning how to manage the growth of the terrestrial plants, the seasonal cycle for them, the pruning techniques needed, the fertilizing, the insect pests, etc. should keep this interesting for at least a year, before I even think about how to do it better. You know, learn to walk before trying to win a marathon?


So where do you get your terrestrial info from? Any books or forums you'd recommend? I've almost always got an empty tank around tempting me. I'm starting to run out of excuses for keeping my emersed growth tray looking so bland as well.

-Philosophos


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Philosophos said:


> So where do you get your terrestrial info from? Any books or forums you'd recommend? I've almost always got an empty tank around tempting me. I'm starting to run out of excuses for keeping my emersed growth tray looking so bland as well.
> 
> -Philosophos


Hydrophyte is by far the best source of information I have found. But, I also use Google to read up on some plants, as well as to see what the strangely Latin named plants he talks about look like when not in a riparium. I already know a little about terrestrial plants, since I have had gardens of various sizes for many years. But, learning what I feel I want to know doesn't yet seem as easy as learning about aquatic plants - possibly because there is no equivalent group of "Experts" dispensing wisdom on forums like this, with emphasis on riparium type set-ups.

Don't look for excuses not to set up a riparium tank! Just close your eyes and jump right in.


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Loving your stand and light. The hangers from the back look better, I think. I hope your CEO likes them.  Am looking forward to seeing your riparium up and running. Glad you got the tank issues straightened out.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Have you decided about removing the top rim yet? I think you really will enjoy the result if you can do that--I like mine a lot. The best way to do that is with a block plane, shaving away the plastic all the way around along the top outside edge of the rim. If you can then just carefully saw through the two rim halves here and there in cross-section you should be able to pull them off easily. Silicone doesn't truly adhere to that plastic--the rim is just held in place with friction.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Have you decided about removing the top rim yet? I think you really will enjoy the result if you can do that--I like mine a lot. The best way to do that is with a block plane, shaving away the plastic all the way around along the top outside edge of the rim. If you can then just carefully saw through the two rim halves here and there in cross-section you should be able to pull them off easily. Silicone doesn't truly adhere to that plastic--the rim is just held in place with friction.


I will decide on removing the rim after I get the tank. But, I'm inclined not to do it. I really like the appearance of a rimless tank, for a riparium, but for a regular planted tank I'm not that sold on it yet. One thing that holds me back is that once the rim is off, the tank shouldn't ever be filled completely with water (my opinion), especially since this tank also has a cross brace across the top. However, an hour from now my mind may change yet again.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Yeah I wouldn't remove the rim if you think that you might ever want to fill the tank with water. It might be OK for something like a breeder or other shorter tank, but this one is too tall.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Good news! I'm now the proud owner of an Aqueon 65 gallon tank. Bad news! An Aqueon 65 gallon tank weighs more than my wife and I can move around, especially considering it has to go up one flight of stairs. But, it looks real nice in my PT Cruiser. Now, I just have to recruit a couple of strong guys to move it for me.

EDIT: Success! A couple of my SAPS members came thru for me this afternoon, so the tank is now on the stand, awaiting a black background, then being shoved back against the wall again. When that is done I will post a picture. But, I can say now, it looks great. By using the same proportions as Hydrophyte used for his stand/tank I managed to get a very pleasing set of proportions for this one.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The tank, stand, light, and the black background, all in place. For a background I used http://www.tapplastics.com/shop/product.php?pid=272& which went on very easily, using a rubber window squeegee, water with a tiny bit of dish soap in it, and some paper towels.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That looks great Hoppy. From here the oak aquarium rim really does look good. That's a nice big tank. Now you have some more room for your plants as they grow up.

Have you decided on what kind of substrate you will use for the bottom if the tank?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> That looks great Hoppy. From here the oak aquarium rim really does look good. That's a nice big tank. Now you have some more room for your plants as they grow up.
> 
> Have you decided on what kind of substrate you will use for the bottom if the tank?


The "oak" rim does work very well with the oak stand. It doesn't look exactly like oak, but is close enough that your eyes just skip over the rims. I think that was a good decision, and now I don't think I will even consider removing the top rim.

My substrate will be pool filter sand, with a RFUG under it, and a small sponge filter powerhead, by Catalina driving the water to the RFUG. That should be enough water circulation, and plenty of filtration, with nothing going over the back rim except the power cord for the little pump.

I'm now thinking about a semi-automated water fill system, based on a DIY thread I commented on. It would be an overflow, set to the desired water height, draining out through the wall, which I just finished repairing. And, a 1/4" diameter drip irrigation tube supplying replacement water through a shutoff valve, located under the tank, getting water through that same wall. That way I can maintain the water level, replace a portion of the tank water, and all without going out of doors, dragging a python hose around, using buckets, etc. That type of system suits my innate laziness. But, it will delay the final setup for another day or two.

Half of the removed fish from my old tank have died now, from the long time spend in a ten gallon tank packed to the gills with hanging planters. And, I suspect all of my removed plants are dead now, from the two week wait in a bucket. So, that means I get to pick new plants for the submersed part, and pick whatever fish I want.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

This is the water plumbing I plan to add. The overflow will go through the wall to a 5 gallon bucket, as I used to do with my continuous water dripping change system. The inlet line will go through a shut off valve through the wall to a run of 1/4" drip irrigation tubing, across the deck, to a tap water source. I plan to use CPVC piping and fittings, since they are smaller than PVC fittings and pipiing are. I shouldn't need a really large drain line.

To use it I will just open the shutoff valve, to let water come in, add Prime, wait until the 5 gallon bucket is full or two buckets are full - not decided yet - then shutoff the valve, wait for the water level to settle back to normal. Then use the drained water on deck planters. To maintain the water level in the tank, I will open the shutoff valve until the water starts to flow into the overflow, then shut it off. This, I expect to be about every other day. As lazy as I am, this shouldn't tax my patience at all.

This way I can concentrate on the plants more, and the water less.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Can you please come install one of those overflow systems on each of my tanks? :hihi: This afternoon I spent a couple of hours changing water in just a couple of tanks. I suppose I was also goofing around trimming dead leaves and moving stuff around and whatnot. 

Straight pool filter sand sound like a good idea. Hey I think that I have found a real good low-tech plant for the underwater foreground of ripariums. The _Echinodorus quadricostatus_ that I have in my 65 is growing well in pool filter sand with just Excel and the ferts that I add to the water column. It spreads with only moderate speed and has a neater appearance than _Sagittaria subulata_. I tried _E. tenellus_ in the same tank, but it hardly grew and got covered with algae in time. The _quadricostatus_ is very bright green--it looks like it's plugged in--which is good for brightening that area.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey Hoppy how are your _Acorus_ doing? I noticed just the other day that Asiatica Nursery posted catolog listings for three new rare sweetflags. They are right at the top of this page:

http://www.asiaticanursery.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/plants.viewCategory/catID/73/index.htm 

Pretty cool. Asiatica has rather high prices, but I might have to think about acquiring one or more of these because I already have something of a collection going and because _Acorus_ are such great riparium plants.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Hey Hoppy how are your _Acorus_ doing? I noticed just the other day that Asiatica Nursery posted catolog listings for three new rare sweetflags. They are right at the top of this page:
> 
> http://www.asiaticanursery.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/plants.viewCategory/catID/73/index.htm
> 
> Pretty cool. Asiatica has rather high prices, but I might have to think about acquiring one or more of these because I already have something of a collection going and because _Acorus_ are such great riparium plants.


My Acorus seems to be doing very well, sending out new leaves, and generally looking great. It seems better in my 10 gallon nursery tank than in the 15H riparium, but that may just be a difference between the two plants.

That webstore is very interesting, and a couple of the Acorus there look very nice to me. The prices look high until you look at other plants there - up to $65 each!!. This is one that really looks nice http://www.asiaticanursery.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/plants.plantDetail/plant_id/679/index.htm but it may seem gaudy in a riparium. It is very similar to the one you showed a couple of pics of in one of your tanks. Looking through that catalog is like being a kid in a candy store!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Asiatica has a lot of amazing stuff. They have a wild variety and for many of their offerings they are the only US source. They get a lot of brand new and rare varieties. Their prices are rather high, but they send beautiful specimens that are expertly packed. Still, it is easy to run up a high order total with just a few of their plants.

I think I have seen everything in their catalog and they do not have so many that are suitable for growing as marginals. I don't know if that _Alocasia_ would make it(?). I did get an order a while back with _Spathiphyllum_ 'Golden Glow' and _Acorus_ 'Omogo', which are both doing well so far.

Hey Hoppy what kinds of patio plants do you have?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

My deck, which sits on top of the garage, level with the second floor, which is the "living" floor of my condo, has 3 wine barrel halves, with a fig tree, a crepe myrtle, and a "false cypress", with lots of flowers around it. It also has 2 smaller planters with a dogwood tree in each, started from seed about 3 years ago. And, two pots of aloe plants. Plus, a 2' x 8' "square foot garden" planter, with eggplants and sweet peppers still producing in it. Soon it will get lettuce varieties for a winter garden. So far the deck shows no signs of collapsing from the weight of all of that!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The RFUG and substrate are in now. Both are from the tank I removed. The substrate I washed thoroughly as I removed it, then piled it on a black garbage bag in the sun, for two weeks, turning it a couple of times. There were still a lot of small roots in it, but I think I removed 90% as I installed it today. Any organics left in it should be mineralized by now. The RFUG pipes were so clean all I had to do was wipe them off. The black pump mounted on it is a Catalina powerhead based sponge filter, which seems to be a great match for the RFUG.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Awesome. I can't wait to see more updates!
Everything looks really nice so far.


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

This looks so nice. I just love your stand. Love the recessed panel doors! Can't wait to see how this comes out. This tank is quite tall! Looks like you're gonna need a ladder to plant it. Good thing it's a riparium. 

Thanks for that plastics link. I've heard people talk about it but never knew where to get it. Ordered some today.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I made the overflow half that fits in the tank, and the water inlet fitting, using CPVC, 1/2" pipe and fittings, with a couple of extra powerhead suction grid fittings mated to them. Now, I need to let the glue dry and spray paint them with black Fusion paint. And, of course finish the plumbing to the water supply and the drain bucket.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I like that RFUG--it is so nice and simple like you said with just a single cord leaving the tank. The sand was a good choice too you can see that it reflects light really well.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

RFUG's are very old fashioned, out of style, and discredited, but they do work very well for keeping the water very clean. Most of us, as far as I can see, don't keep a tank setup without starting over for more than a year or two, and the substrate can easily accomodate that much filtrate without causing problems. Eventually, I suspect that a RFUG would have to be removed and the substrate cleaned very well. But, for a riparium, it just seems to me to be a natural. 

The overflow, and semi-automatic water replacement system are also a natural for a riparium, because of the low water level in the tank. Even if the overflow "acts up" you would really have to be seriously distracted to run into trouble before noticing it. But, in a normal tank, with the near the top water level, that could lead to wet floors.


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## fastfreddie (Sep 10, 2008)

Finally some glass on that pretty stand! Here we go! :thumbsup:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I can't wait to see it with plants, and fish! :bounce:


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

No plants or fish, or even water yet, but here is my overflow with the out-of-tank parts done:
















As you can see I copied the ideas from Zapin's and Hydrophyte's DIY threads on a water change system, and using vinyl hose as a connector for hard pipe parts. I get lots of ideas by reading all of the DIY posts regularly.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That looks great. I think that for the next canister I plumb for a riparium I will just put the intake and return together with 1/2 PVC, rather than modifying the flimsy stuff that comes with those filters. I plan to use an Eheim Classic for that 56 column. Of course I would like to include a primer somehow for the return, because that's a nice feature of those Filstar fittings.

Hooray for Krylon Fusion!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The plumbing is all installed, and the tank has water in it now. But, I can't get the overflow siphon started. Does anyone know how to do that? Obviously you have to get the tube that goes over the top of the tank filled with water, no air, or the siphon breaks easily. I find I can't suck hard enough to do more than get a mouth full of water, but the flow doesn't start, even though the siphon inlet is completely under water in the tank. I can still use the water supply plumbing to add water, and that's how I filled the tank, but getting the "high" water out is a problem now. Help!!

The only idea I can come up with is to temporarily install a reservoir above the outlet outside the house, and use a vacuum cleaner to suck hard enough to pull a lot of water into that reservoir. That would fill the tube I think.

Or, how about using the jetpump from my DIY python system to suck on the outlet?


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Where does the overflow go? If it connects to flexible vinyl hose you should be able to just lift the loose end up higher than the elbow in the PVC, then use a funnel to fill the whole assembly with water(?). You would have to drill another hole, but it might be necessary to include some kind air escape at the top of the elbow for this to work if you want to fill it while it is still in place.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Where does the overflow go? If it connects to flexible vinyl hose you should be able to just lift the loose end up higher than the elbow in the PVC, then use a funnel to fill the whole assembly with water(?). You would have to drill another hole, but it might be necessary to include some kind air escape at the top of the elbow for this to work if you want to fill it while it is still in place.


The overflow is hard plumbed through the wall, where it flows into a 5 gallon bucket. I can attach a piece of garden hose to the end, hold it up and with my 3rd and fourth hands, pour water into it.:icon_mrgr I do have an air hole at the top of the loop going directly outside, like a vent for household plumbing. I have been keeping it plugged as I try to suck the water through the plumbing, but I can easily open it up. This might work, as long as I make sure that vent is the highest point in the line, otherwise the water overflows there all over the floor. I will try it tormorrow morning.

Tonight I tried the jet pump - it didn't work, even though it easily sucks water out of the tank when part of the python setup, and I had a real jet of water going through it too.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


>


Are you sure that this will work like an overflow? It seems to me that as soon as the water level falls to even with the pipe opening that the whole loop will just fill with air again(?).

If this configuration does not work what about using one of those "trickle-siphon" overflows? That kind of thing might be easier to fill with water.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Theoretically, this has to work:









From this you can see that water should remain in the siphon loop over the top of the tank, unless there is an air leak in that portion. And, there can't be one, since I can suck water out of the tank by sucking on the outlet, with the vent plugged. After a night's sleep, I'm going to hook up my water hose to the outlet, and use that to reverse flow fill it. That should let me blow all of the air bubbles back into the tank, leaving the line full of water. Fingers crossed!

EDIT: It worked! I feel pretty dumb not to have thought of this yesterday. But, at least it now works, so on to the next step!


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Yeah. The hose method works, or you could've filled the tank up all the way to get the pipe full of water, then drained it back down after the siphon started.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I am really dumb with physics, so it amazes me that this configuration works like an overflow. It's a miracle! You ought to build these and sell them to reef aquarists for a hundred bucks a pop. Isn't this a problem that the reefers have milled over for years?

I wonder what kind of flow it will give you as an overflow(?).


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The overflow doesn't have to have a big flow capability for my use. It just has to come close to keeping up with the incoming water from the refill line, and it does that very well.

But, enough about hardware: *Look! It's a Riparium!*









The submersed plants are the only survivors from my old aquarium, after a major disinfection campaign involving very high dosages of Excel, including spraying with 100% Excel, and trimming off all of the BBA infested leaves I could find. I hope to add some E. quadricostatus to fill in the bare areas more. And, the fish will wait until tomorrow, while the plants suck up any ammonia that is there from the nursery water - like a swamp!

I'm so satisfied with this, I'm amazed. All I had to do, in addition to what I planned, was add a tiny Boyu Koralia-like powerhead to circulate the water better, after I noticed that the heater was keeping one half of the tank warmer than the other. It does the job very well, and is cheaper than a Koralia. I have a couple more photos, but my AT&T internet connection doesn't allow me to do anything much unless the rest of Sacramento is asleep, so they will wait for tomorrow too.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Nice and the overflow is neat. What is the flow rate and heater capacity? Since you have about 1/3rd filled even a modest flow rate should be able to dissipate the heat fairly fast enough, shouldn't it?

Another idea that I implemented is to put a transparent plexiglass cover. I glued some transparent trims so that it does not buckle. It helps a lot in checking the evaporation and maintaining the heat in the tank.


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## SamH (Jul 17, 2009)

That is one awesome tank you got there Hoppy!

I'm getting a 2ft cube soon and wondering what to stock it with and what type of tank i should make it into. Seeing this thread has made me want a Riparium!

Could I please have some details on the overflow pipe you made and how the plants are attached to the back?

Thanks

-Sam


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey that looks sweet. Nice work again on the stand and everything else. That Java fern was a good choice. It could be neat to develop a similar spray of foliage in the emersed area to mimic that plant. 

With the water change system and with most of the plants getting most of their ferts from the MTS in the planter cups this should be a low maintenance and low algae display


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## dantra (May 25, 2007)

Hoppy, I have to admit I had no idea how this was going to turn out but I'm amazed! It look great and when things grow out its going to look beautiful. You make it look too easy.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

dantra said:


> Hoppy, I have to admit I had no idea how this was going to turn out but I'm amazed! It look great and when things grow out its going to look beautiful. You make it look too easy.


It actually is pretty easy, at least compared to doing an aquascape. Here are a couple more pictures:



















Today I need to do some cleaning up, add some fish, maybe look for aquatic plants for the submersed scene.


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

The tank is looking real good.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

cah925 said:


> The tank is looking real good.


Thank you! Now we need to get your riparium back in good shape. That tank was one of my inspirations.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Hoppy said:


> Theoretically, this has to work:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Same principle, works well. One thing to keep in mind - there is a possibility that air bubbles collect in the highest point, where the contraption goes over the rim. In a CO2 enriched tank with O2 saturation that's a question of "when" the siphon is broken.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> Thank you! Now we need to get your riparium back in good shape. That tank was one of my inspirations.


cah95 is getting his 75-gallon ready for a big slimy eel, just in time for Halloween. He put together an innovative cave duplex feature as a cozy abode for that animal...

http://aquaticplantenthusiasts.com/showthread.php?t=1565

Hoppy I really like your sand. I have looked around some but we don't seem to get a pool filter sand like that here. The stuff that I have found is finer and nearly white. It doesn't look so natural like your material.


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## demonbreedr16 (Jan 10, 2008)

It looks really nice Hoppy!


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## Philosophos (May 7, 2009)

Looks even better than your last one, Vaughn. Any plans for a little hardscape down below? Maybe a few rocks to give a river bank/bottom feel?

-Philosophos


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Wasserpest said:


> Same principle, works well. One thing to keep in mind - there is a possibility that air bubbles collect in the highest point, where the contraption goes over the rim. In a CO2 enriched tank with O2 saturation that's a question of "when" the siphon is broken.


I like the 5 gallon bucket with the trash bag water separator! I didn't think of that one at all. But, since I won't be using CO2, and the plant growth rates will be slow, I shouldn't generate much gas in the water. Eventually, of course the topmost point will gather an air bubble to break the siphon, but it is very easy to restart since I can hook up a garden hose to do it quickly.



Philosophos said:


> Looks even better than your last one, Vaughn. Any plans for a little hardscape down below? Maybe a few rocks to give a river bank/bottom feel?
> 
> -Philosophos


I don't plan on having anything in the water except the sand and plants. For me rocks and wood have always become algae gardens, causing more maintenance that I care to do. I do have some more plants on order on swap n shop to fill out the bottom better. And, I put my White Cloud minnows and catfish in the tank today. They seem happy, but I'm not good at interpreting fishese.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Do you have any room for any more orchids in there? I think I see that _ Trichosalpinx chamaelepanthes_. 

I can send some more midground plants too. I have struggled to find plants plants in addition to that _Hemigraphis_ which grow well on the Nano Trellis Raft. I recently tried some "pan-American friendship plant" (an strange name) (_Pilea involucrata_) and it looks good. It is a sturdy, attractive little plants and grows fine with its roots right in the water. It must have limited nutrient demands. This link goes to a page about that plant...

http://www.desert-tropicals.com/Plants/Urticaceae/Pilea_involucrata.html

Anyway, I can send some cuttings of that one too if you would like to try it.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Do you have any room for any more orchids in there? I think I see that _ Trichosalpinx chamaelepanthes_.
> 
> I can send some more midground plants too. I have struggled to find plants plants in addition to that _Hemigraphis_ which grow well on the Nano Trellis Raft. I recently tried some "pan-American friendship plant" (an strange name) (_Pilea involucrata_) and it looks good. It is a sturdy, attractive little plants and grows fine with its roots right in the water. It must have limited nutrient demands. This link goes to a page about that plant...
> 
> ...


Since you know what that orchid looked like you can probably find it - look for the bark. If I didn't know what it was I probably would never see it, at least as it looks now. But, I can hang other bark pieces several places in there. Planters would require that I remove one of the existing ones. The photo on that website of the Pilea involucrata looks very promising. So, yes I would very much like to try that one. Today I ordered some E. quadricostatus for the submersed area, and will get a little Bacopa Australis too, to see if I can grow it submersed, then lift up the over-long stems onto a raft for a midground plant. But, that Pilea really looks great.

The cutting of a hibiscus that you sent didn't survive. It looked great in the package, but immediately wilted when the stem was in the water, and never did recover. I suspect it has to be started in a planter. It was my most dramatic failure!


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

Hoppy said:


> For me rocks and wood have always become algae gardens, causing more maintenance that I care to do.


It's called patina  I rather like it. It gives the hardscape texture an depth.

I just bought some white cloud for the first time ever. They should arrive next week. It'll be fun.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Well it's like a patina if there's just a little bit of it. I took the rocks out of my 65 and replaced with a few pieces of manzanita because they were growing too much algae and also taking up too much floor space to the exclusion of the plants. 

What are your white cloud minnows going into?


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> Since you know what that orchid looked like you can probably find it - look for the bark. If I didn't know what it was I probably would never see it, at least as it looks now. But, I can hang other bark pieces several places in there. Planters would require that I remove one of the existing ones. The photo on that website of the Pilea involucrata looks very promising. So, yes I would very much like to try that one. Today I ordered some E. quadricostatus for the submersed area, and will get a little Bacopa Australis too, to see if I can grow it submersed, then lift up the over-long stems onto a raft for a midground plant. But, that Pilea really looks great.
> 
> The cutting of a hibiscus that you sent didn't survive. It looked great in the package, but immediately wilted when the stem was in the water, and never did recover. I suspect it has to be started in a planter. It was my most dramatic failure!


That _E. quadicostatus_ is a good idea. I really like mine and I'm surprised I don't see it around more. I would have anticipated as much from that hibiscus cutting, since it was unrooted. I should try to get you some of my _Hibiscus ascetosella_. I have some of that in the 120 and it easy-care and great for making a little splash of red. If there are any other particular emersed aquatics that you would like I can try to round up some of those too. Do you just have the one _Spathiphyllum_? That could be handy to have a few more of those, since they are such easy plants and good for developing the background.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> That _E. quadicostatus_ is a good idea. I really like mine and I'm surprised I don't see it around more. I would have anticipated as much from that hibiscus cutting, since it was unrooted. I should try to get you some of my _Hibiscus ascetosella_. I have some of that in the 120 and it easy-care and great for making a little splash of red. If there are any other particular emersed aquatics that you would like I can try to round up some of those too. Do you just have the one _Spathiphyllum_? That could be handy to have a few more of those, since they are such easy plants and good for developing the background.


I have three Spathiphyllum going, plus my wife has a couple of big ones in pots in the living room. I would like to try another hibiscus, to get that red color in the tank.

I still have some of the Bacopa Carolliniana, but it is erratic. Short stems seem to root well in a raft, but then they droop over into the water, and about 2/3 of those soon rot, while the others thrive. I'm still playing around with it. The Bacopa you sent me all gave up the fight some time ago. The Optismenus I have is doing poorly too, with only one stem still surviving. I have it in a raft with the stem end in the water.

Clearly there is a lot to learn here:icon_bigg


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Yeah my _Bacopa caroliniana_ are also only just barely growing. It's funny because it looks like such a hardy plant and those other two similar species, _monieri_ and the ?? one that looks like _monnieri_ but with bigger leaves, grow so well in riparium conditions. Do you have those stems rooted in a hanging planter? I wonder if there are some plants that just don't like artificial lighting(?). I'll prioritize that hibiscus.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Yeah my _Bacopa caroliniana_ are also only just barely growing. It's funny because it looks like such a hardy plant and those other two similar species, _monieri_ and the ?? one that looks like _monnieri_ but with bigger leaves, grow so well in riparium conditions. Do you have those stems rooted in a hanging planter? I wonder if there are some plants that just don't like artificial lighting(?). I'll prioritize that hibiscus.


The rooted B. caroliniana "passed away" the quickest. The Bacopa (sp), as I recall, I planted, rooted, in a hanging planter, but I may have lost it in a raft waiting for roots to form.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Those _Bacopa_ really can carpet pretty well. Here is a shot of the Mexico river 120 setup: that one _Bacopa_ (still don't know which one it is) has nice growth there in the right side of the tank...


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

For a change, I kept pretty good records of my costs for setting this up. Here they are:
DIY Stand - $120
Aqueon Tank - $195
Light Supports - $20
Powerhead - $30
Plumbing - $30
Sponge Filter - $15
Planter materials - $85

Total - $495


But, I sold off much of my old tank and supplies for $250 total, so my net cost is "only" $245


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Great looking tank, Hoppy. You are really owning this riparium thing. :thumbsup:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> For a change, I kept pretty good records of my costs for setting this up. Here they are:
> DIY Stand - $120
> Aqueon Tank - $195
> Light Supports - $20
> ...


You pulled that off a lot more economically than I probably would have.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Unfortunately, a lot of cost savings ends up being cost wasting. An example is the Boyu powerhead I bought, which is a copy of the Koralia type powerhead, but with less oomph behind the output. Just what I wanted, but part of its low cost is that they price the magnetic mount separately. The store clerk assured me it might work well without that mount. And, it did, for two days. So, tomorrow I need to spend another $11 to get the mount, bringing the cost to more than the Koralia cost.

The reason for the magnetic mount for others as slow witted as me, is that this type of powerhead produces a very strong thrust, which suction cup mounts cannot possibly resist very long. You really need that powerful magnetic grip to hold it in place, or it comes loose, then proceeds to dig a big trench in the substrate, until it sucks up enough grit to jam the rotor. That process takes about 20 seconds - I watched it.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

That sounds more like an investment compared to the money I wasted tonight, simply by deciding I wanted to rest my Tek Light on top of the tank after buying the $60 legs for it. And before I even got to buying legs, I bought sticks of 1/2" pipe, a bender, and hardware, and spent a few hours making light bars that I hated later on. :icon_roll

I'm glad I haven't tracked the cost of my last tank, it took close to 2 yrs to get running, one whole income tax check and then some, you'd think 'free tank' means cheap setup... hardly.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I think most of us see the cost of new tanks, and immediately look for used ones, bargains at less than half price. And, then reality sets in! Nothing from that point on comes cheaply without great effort - mineralized top soil is cheap, but lots of work, DIY can be cheap, but lots of work, etc. The lesson that takes a long time to learn is that the tank cost is only a minor part of the total cost, so why not get a tank that you really, really like, even if it costs more than you think it should. And, I'll bet that almost all of us "saved money" on our first pressurized CO2 system - Milwaukee makes good money for that reason. Then we quickly learn that there some things, like regulators and needle valves, where more money means much, much better results. I promise that some day I will learn these lessons.:biggrin:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey Hoppy now we have dueling 65-gallon ripariums. You are ahead of me now I just yanked all the the planters out of my tank and I'm starting over.


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## malaybiswas (Nov 2, 2008)

Nice setup Hoppy. Love the narrow leaf fern clusters. Do you plan to add any small stones or rocks?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

malaybiswas said:


> Nice setup Hoppy. Love the narrow leaf fern clusters. Do you plan to add any small stones or rocks?


My mental image of this tank doesn't include stones or wood. I see the substrate much more planted, with broad leaf chain swords, E. quadricostatus. Then, since this is for my pleasure (my wife is permitted to look at it too:icon_lol I also see it containing flowers at various times over the next few months. Once I get a better feel for ripariums I may settle down and try to get a river bank appearance, and then stones and wood may enter my mental images.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


>


I'm sure you have told us before, but what is that beautiful flower? The appearance of a flower in my tank is really an upper for both my wife and me. It makes this type of aquarium a lot more enjoyable for us.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That one is a Mexican rain lily, _Zephyranthes macrosiphon_.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Zephyranthes macrosiphon: That is a fascinating plant for a riparium. I checked on google and notice that the bulbs are sold out just about everywhere, most likely because it is near the end of their natural season. Next spring I will try to remember to look again at these.

When a bulb like this has a dormant season, how do you handle that with a riparium?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Fertilizing a Riparium: What are the options and the pros and cons of the various methods?

I can see using perhaps 1/2 of the EI recommended dosage for the submersed plants, although that pretty well forces you to do weekly water changes, which introduces fluctuating CO2 levels and possibly triggers algae growth. But, would that be enough for the emersed plants? If you tuck a substrate tab under each emersed plant, would enough fertilizer leach into the tank water to over do it for the submersed plants?

This is like learning to walk again - you all do remember that experience don't you?:wink:


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## trackhazard (Aug 24, 2006)

I user fert tabs in my planters. A pinch of dry fertz for the tank water. I also have root tabs under the crypts. Everything seems to be ok. Dunno, I guess we're all exploring at this point.

-Charlie


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

trackhazard said:


> I user fert tabs in my planters. A pinch of dry fertz for the tank water. I also have root tabs under the crypts. Everything seems to be ok. Dunno, I guess we're all exploring at this point.
> 
> -Charlie


What fert tabs do you use for the planters? I assume one would want to avoid regular terrestrial fertilizers to avoid the urea they have in them. So, that seems to mean you would use aquarium fertilizer tabs. I think I will go that way with mine.


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## trackhazard (Aug 24, 2006)

I was using the medicineman ones from Orlando at GLA but my bottle is all used up and they aren't available anymore so I need to find something else.

- Charlie


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Considering shipping costs I think I will be paying a visit to a LFS very soon. What's a good brand for LFS substrate tabs? Anyone?


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

the seachem root tabs work well and are pretty easy to find.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

Stay away from the Jungle tabs. I bought some and they fell apart very easily before getting into the sub. They sent me a bunch of replacements and they all did the same thing.

I hear the Seachem ones are good.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

API tabs work well for me, but they are pricey. I generally snap them in half to stretch them out more. They hold together pretty well, which might be beneficial. I found a few after more than a month in the sand on the bottom of the tank and they were still in one piece, with many plant roots holding on.

I wonder if MTS might not be a real good fertilizer for the planter cup. I have been experimenting with just a tablespoon or two of MTS with a thick layer of gravel underneath and on top so that it won't wash into tank. The plants in those planters are definitely growing better than similar ones with straight gravel.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I'm wondering if Osmocote is a good fertilizer for riparium planters. Osmocote is fertilizers in little balls, coated with a material that makes the fertilizers a time-release material. According to what Tom Barr has posted and said personally, that slow release pretty well eliminates worries about getting ammonia and urea into the water of an aquarium, if Osmocote is used under a substrate. So, it should be even better for fertilizing riparium planters. The last time I looked for some I couldn't find it at my HD or hardware store, but I'm thinking of trying again.

EDIT: See http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/f...eters/94455-riparium-planter-fertilizing.html 

I'm trying Osmocote in a few planters in my 15H riparium.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy what do you think about MTS in the planter cups? They are only casual observations at this point, but for the few planter cups where I recently tried out a thin lens of MTS I think that I am seeing much better growth and better-looking plants. I thought that you potted up a number of plants with MTS(?). 

It sure would be nice to have a reliable long-term fertilizing method for the planters. Until recently I had only though of dripping liquid ferts onto the gravel in the planter cup. This produces great results, but I think that a lot of the nutrients diffuse out into the aquarium water and also get utilized by the plant quick.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

My use of MTS was disappointing. For one thing, small particles migrate downward through large particles, and my MTS was very small particles. So, much of it ended up in the tank, escaping out of the planter cups. And, I haven't had very good growth with it either. 

I started fertilizing by using a syringe to squirt a few ml of my EI fertilizer pre-mixes on each planter. But, that ended up making me use far more fertilizers than I would expect to be desirable. That and looking at trackhazard's riparium, http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/t...4329-75g-riparium-thanks-riparium-supply.html, encouraged me to think more about root tabs, which led me to Osmocote. I'm also buying some of the red clay, from yesclassic, http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-shop/94426-mts-supplys-clay-potash-dolomite.html with the thought of trying to make little clay balls with ferts inside them (M&M's for plants?) I'm still thinking about that one. (I'm stumped by the task of printing the M&M on each one:icon_mrgr)


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

You know an idea I had a while back was to put a mix of dry ferts and clay in gel caps, which are dirt cheap. I thought I was pretty smart, but then I saw that Ferka beat me to it.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

We need to think through what we are trying to do when we fertilize planter cups. The obvious is that we are trying to provide NPK to the plant in the cup, and less obvious is that the NPK will be in the form of ions: NO3-, NH4+, K+, PO4---, for examples. Those ions move around very easily in water, so keeping them in the planters isn't that easy. Then, there is clay, with its high CEC, which can trap and hold the positive ions in the planters, or the use of Flourite or similar baked clay substrate in the planters to do the same. And, that, to me, suggests that clay balls with fertilizers in the middle could be a good method. Osmocote would work, if it does, because the ions are released slowly enough that they can't quickly escape to the tank water. Putting liquid fertilizer mix on the planters would seem to work only if the planter soil has a high CEC, otherwise the nutrients just pass on through to the tank water. Plant tabs probably work well because of their slow release of the ions.

If the terrestrials require only as much access to nutrient ions as aquatic plants, just an EI type tank water fertilizing method might be effective, but is that all that the terrestrials require?

None of the above may be relevant, but I think it is good to think in basic terms like that when addressing a "problem" like this.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

This is a quick note with a couple of observations.

I get the impression that the planter gravel does have an ability to hold a nutrient reserve. A number of times I have observed underwater plants in my setups exhibit deficiency symptoms when I have slacked off on fertilization, while the emersed plants were growing well. The gravel that I use is a medium-grain baked clay product, so it should have some CEC ability. However, I have wondered if this might be compromised or changed for fired clay. The success of baked clay products (Fluorite, Turface, Special Kitty) as planted aquarium substrates suggests that they must still present a good rooting environment and I would presume that this is because of CEC effect.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I now have a few more plants in the riparium, one is the spider lily Hydrophyte showed photos of when it was in his riparium, not blooming now, of course, and possibly just waiting to go dormant for the winter, but still looking very healthy. Then, there is another orchid on a piece of hanging bark, and some Pilea (sp) trying to start some roots from a nano raft.

And, I planted some E. Quadricostatus, broadleaf chain sword, in the substrate, along with a few stems of Bacopa Australis, both from Zeek21, to see if I can grow them up to the water surface, then drape them across a raft to grow emersed there.

Yes, I'm having fun with this!roud:


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## SearunSimpson (Jun 5, 2007)

Hoppy, that Riparium is look sick man! I'm currently in the process of planning a 90gl and I'm way intimidated as my 30gl attempt was a complete failure.
What is the filter you are using? I was thinking of using a Fluval3 internal one on its side, since I'm only going to be filling about 30gls of the tank anyways. Also, where is your heater hiding, or do you not use one (considering you're in Cali, and the fauna appears to be WC's.


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## paulrw (Apr 14, 2009)

flourish tabs work great and i think they would be easy to replicate, if you could take a measured amount of ferts say enough for 2 weeks and mix them with something that was slowly soluble by water maybe some kind of eatable gum and press the mix some how if you have a vise I'm sure you could buy a mold at the craft store. just trowin it out there. awsome progress on the tank!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

SearunSimpson said:


> Hoppy, that Riparium is look sick man! I'm currently in the process of planning a 90gl and I'm way intimidated as my 30gl attempt was a complete failure.
> What is the filter you are using? I was thinking of using a Fluval3 internal one on its side, since I'm only going to be filling about 30gls of the tank anyways. Also, where is your heater hiding, or do you not use one (considering you're in Cali, and the fauna appears to be WC's.


I'm using a reverse flow under gravel filter, with a small Catalina internal filter, having a sponge in the chamber, connected to pump water into the RFUG. It is black, is back in the right hand corner, and is essentially invisible. The heater is a 50 watt one - I only have about 25 gallons of water, and have found that a 50 watt heater will do a pretty good job on even 40 gallons for the conditions I have. The heater is vertical, and is next to the Catalina filter, also essentially invisible. In addition, to get some water circulation, I have a Boyu semi-Koralia type powerhead mounted at the back left corner blowing water a little up towards the water surface, and along the back of the tank. That powerhead causes a lot of surface disturbance, but that disturbance is damped out in a few inches by the planters and rafts.

I'm pretty sure this would just be a mess without all of the help I get from Hydrophyte, both the planters and rafts, and the plants he has been so generous with. I try to follow his directions as well as I can until I decide rightly or wrongly that I "have a better idea". So far it hasn't been a bit hard to keep the plants going - most of them. I kept a 10 gallon tank as a nursery, a role now filled by my 15H tank, to keep extra plants in, and to try to grow some bigger before trying them in the riparium. Compared to fighting BBA, this is child's play:biggrin:


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

paulrw said:


> flourish tabs work great and i think they would be easy to replicate, if you could take a measured amount of ferts say enough for 2 weeks and mix them with something that was slowly soluble by water maybe some kind of eatable gum and press the mix some how if you have a vise I'm sure you could buy a mold at the craft store. just trowin it out there. awsome progress on the tank!


I'm not at all sure we could make an equivalent to Flourish tabs, because the construction of the slow release portion would be a lot of work to try to figure out, get the materials and assemble it. But, I also don't think it is necessary to duplicate them. Instead, I'm thinking that clay is the magic ingredient to use. I have some red clay I bought on the swap n shop forum, so I plan to see how easy it is to make little clay balls, perhaps 1/4 inch or less in diameter, with fertilizers inside. And, I'm now trying Osmocote "prills"-little coated balls. Tentatively I think I will try to enclose 2-3 of those Osmocote prills in a clay ball, let it dry out good, then use them as plant tabs. The idea is that the escaping nutrient ions will at least partly be adsorbed by the clay, with its high CEC, and held for the plant roots. What little risk there is of the Osmocote "dumping" too much fertilizer at once should then be eliminated. And, this should be very easy to do. I thought about baking the balls, but not knowing enough about the Osmocote and what high temperatures would do to it, I don't expect to try that.

This is part of the fun too! Why, I can remember when I was a kid, maybe 5 years old, making just this sort of thing in the back yard, and debating whether the resulting pie would taste good.:icon_wink


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


>


That's looking great Hoppy. I'm sorry I missed what kinds of fish are those? 

I think that you will like those _Pilea_ plants. If you can keep clipping them as they grow and starting new cuttings on the Nano Trellis Raft they will make a nice midground hedge for your layout. Don't forget to mist those little orchids with RO whenever you can. They will also benefit with an occasional dunking in the tank water so that they can get some ferts.


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## SearunSimpson (Jun 5, 2007)

Does your tank have a cover on it? My 90gl has glass tops, but I'm not wanting to use them, mostly cause they'll inhibit the vertical height I could achieve with the plants.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I swore off of tank covers a couple of years ago when I found out how much better I like it with the tank completely open on top. Sure, I have lost a few, very few fish that way, but I still enjoy it too much to give it up. Of course the water level is so low in the riparium that losing fish isn't really possible, unless they can climb up the vegetation. My fish are White Cloud mountain minnows, inexpensive, active, school pretty well, and attractive, to me anyway. I also have my two remaining otos and one remaining cory catfish. Plus one flame tetra which managed to hitch a ride with the White Cloud fish when it was supposed to go with its buddies into another tank - the buddies all died, so this is one very smart fish.

I can easily dunk the orchids - both of them, Tolumnia and Trichosalpinx? Right now I'm just misting them with distilled water.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Oh yes now that you say those do look just like white cloud mountain minnows.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Since I have our plant club's PAR meter now, I took some measurements of the light on this riparium to compare to my 15H riparium. The 15H gets 135 micromols at the top of the tank and this one gets 120. The 15H gets about 85 in the middle of the emersed plants, about half way down to the water. This one gets about 60. I had been noticing that plants seem to be growing a bit faster in the 15H, so I suspect I need more light on this one. Luckily a hanging fixture is easily adjusted - I will lower it a couple of inches soon, and remeasure.

I wonder if our high light = 80-120, low light = 25-40 applies to the emersed plants too? I suspect it doesn't.

I just lowered the light by 3", so it now has a bit more light than the 15H riparium - about 20% more at 10 inches below the top of the tank.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Update: My Pilea cuttings, in a raft, are really doing well now, new leaves, healthy leaves, and a lot of roots. It is getting close to a good time to prune them and use those cuttings to get more plants.

The Hymenocallis, spider lily, isn't looking at all like it will ever be dormant. It seems to be continuing to grow. But, the Zephyranthes, rain lilies, which I was sure were going dormant are sending out lots of new growth, even when virtually dry, so I put them back in the water an inch or so, while I figure out what they are up to. Everything else looks great.

And, the planters I put a couple of prills of Osmocoat fertilizer in haven't done anything bad yet.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I was at Home Depot today looking for pansies for some winter color on the deck, when I walked by the house plant area and saw a really nice red leaf plant that I would love to incorporate in my riparium. So, I squandered $3 for a small pot of them, washed all the dirt off, separated them into about 6 little plants, soaked them in water for awhille, then planted about half of them in hanging planters and the other half in a nano raft.
















These are in my 15H riparium now in use as a nursery, hoping a few will grow well so I can transfer them to the big tank. Any ideas about what these are? HD doesn't label plants like this with names of any kind.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I think I found this with Google - Hypoestes phyllostachyo "carmine". http://www.hort.wisc.edu/mastergardener/features/foliageplants/hypoestes/hypoestes.htm If I'm right it may not do well in the riparium, maybe preferring drier conditions. But, it still looks good, so my wet conditions aren't killing it yet.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I bet that there are many plants, even some not usually associated with the water, that one could grow with the Nano Trellis Raft--just think of how many plants can be easily propagated by suspending cuttings in water. This is basically the same kind of situation. It will be interesting to see what this one does. I wouldn't be surprised if the pieces in the Hanging Planters do not make it because I think that that is a pretty oxygen-poor substrate environment in there, so true semi-aquatic emergents/emersed plants would be expected to do better there.

That little bit of red will look nice in there if they make it. That can complement the red on the mountain minnows.

Those Nano Trellis Rafts with plants really are handy for making some midground depth and for helping to cover up the Hanging Planters.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I rearranged the front plants a bit today, adding my new Hypoestes phyllostachya on a raft, to get some more color. And, adding another of the original plants Hydrophyte sent me, that I have lost the name for - a raft occupant, with 2" x .5" leaves, with ripples perpendicular to the length - nice light green color. That one I had great difficulty getting to grow, but in my 15H it finally began doing well.

Here is a closeup of most of the new area.









Note the new leaf on the Colocassia - not dormant yet.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

You got some nice variegated stuff there. If you keep chopping the tops off those plants on the Nano Trellis Rafts and re-rooting them you will have all you need. Your 15-gallon setup ought to be good for that since it can be more easily covered to raise humidity for new cuttings while they develop new roots.

It looks like those orchids are doing pretty good too.

I like the way that big mass of plant on the right visually relates to the Java fern.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

That looks amazing, Hoppy. The plant matter is getting so dense and awesome looking.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> You got some nice variegated stuff there. If you keep chopping the tops off those plants on the Nano Trellis Rafts and re-rooting them you will have all you need. Your 15-gallon setup ought to be good for that since it can be more easily covered to raise humidity for new cuttings while they develop new roots.
> 
> It looks like those orchids are doing pretty good too.
> 
> I like the way that big mass of plant on the right visually relates to the Java fern.


I pruned off a lot of the Hemigraphis Red Equator, and have the cuttings in the 15H to root them, but I'm not sure what I will do with them later. I need to get some more people in my area to start ripariums - I am working on it.

I put the Ruella plant above the Java Fern just to repeat the leaf shape above water - it does work well for that. And, the miniature orchids are looking good too. From what I read in our local paper today, orchids need to be largely ignored to do real well, maybe watered every couple of weeks. I dunk those about weekly, and mist them every few days.


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## Philosophos (May 7, 2009)

Wow, that riparium is really starting to look good. It's a shame they don't offer 1/2-1/3 height tanks for stuff like this; It would be nice if the plants weren't behind glass.

-Philosophos


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Philosophos said:


> Wow, that riparium is really starting to look good. It's a shame they don't offer 1/2-1/3 height tanks for stuff like this; It would be nice if the plants weren't behind glass.
> 
> -Philosophos


If you want the plants above the glass you can use any height tank to do that, just by raising the water level. If the tank were rimless it could look good. If I wanted to try that I think I would use a 30 or 40 breeder tank, just 12 inches high, with maybe 10 inches of water height. I suspect the proportions wouldn't be nearly as pleasing as the high tanks that apportion the water/air by the golden ratio.

I'll bet you could find a 30-40 breeder on Craigslist, then remove the rim, work your patootie off cleaning it, and have a cheap way to try this.


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## Coltonorr (Mar 12, 2008)

Looks awesome!


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## Coltonorr (Mar 12, 2008)

Philosophos said:


> Wow, that riparium is really starting to look good. It's a shame they don't offer 1/2-1/3 height tanks for stuff like this; It would be nice if the plants weren't behind glass.
> 
> -Philosophos


Oh but they do...lol
http://www.greenleafaquariums.com/glass-rimless-aquariums/rimless-aquarium-91-b.html


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

The tank is looking great. I can only hope that mine comes out looking half as nice as this.

Maybe its time to start a riparium support group.  The idea on the shallow tank might be interesting to try at some point. I have 2 30 breeders in my garage that I might consider trying down the road if I get good growth out of the experimental one. They would make fantastic grow out/farm tanks though. :icon_twis


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I have thought that a shallow riparium tank with most of the foliage sticking out the top could be a good way to keep goldfish. You could enjoy the goldfish with both the view from above and through the glass, and the tank would get the robust biological filtration provided by the emersed plants. Since they would be up out of the water the plants would be mostly up out of the way of the goldfishs' chomping, but I don't know if they would eat the roots or not(?). Some of the flowering pond marginals would go really well with goldfish.

I agree however that it is easier to put together a coherent layout if both the underwater and emersed parts are framed within the bounds of the aquarium.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Well......I do have a 10 gallon tank sitting out on the deck, empty. And, removing that rim isn't really difficult. And, I have to admit that I'm intrigued by the idea of the plants being almost entirely above the tank. And,.......I'm afraid I'm off on another adventure!

How about a caladium/impatiens riparium?


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Eek, another tank!

Caladiums and impatiens would look right together. The wild impatiens that we have around here prefer riparian kinds of habitats with muddy soil. I don't know what the cultivated ones might do in wet soil(?). You know one potential problem with caladiums is that you might expect them to be going dormant soon. Did you say you saw some recently at Home Depot?

Check out this tank...

http://www.exo-terra.com/en/products/turtle_terrarium.php

This could be a good choice for the growing-out-the-top idea. With a 18" X 24" footprint it has a real nice shape. It is nicely trimmed too. It's too bad that it has those sloping side panels--it would look better as just a simple box.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The bigger one, http://www.exo-terra.com/download/high_res/products/images/PT3750_Turtle_Terrarium_Use_1.jpg would look pretty good as a riparium, perhaps with a reverse golden ratio - more water, less air. I just finished removing the rim on my 10 gallon tank, easier than the 15H tank was, and it is now sitting with water up to 3 inches from the top, to see if it leaks, breaks. The front and back glass do bow out a bit. I plan to start another journal here for this one.

Yes, HD did have several caladiums about a week ago, but I didn't look closely at them, since they were all big leaf varieties. I will be making a return visit before long. I know caladiums need a winter break when planted outdoors - you dig up the corms and store them in a warm place. But, do they need it if only used as houseplants, always in warm surroundings? So much to learn!

Impatiens are an interesting possibility, and they keep on growing, blooming, as long as it stays cool and not too dry, as I recall. That would be a very cheap way to introduce color into a riparium.

Incidentally, has anyone tried attaching two planter cups together, with both supported by the suction cups of one? I doubt the suction cups being able to hold both up, but suppose a raft material necklace was around the second one? That could make using low growing plants in front of high growing ones a lot easier and more flexible. Something else to experiment with.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Oh do let us know how those impatiens perform. That could be a good one to grow as a low flowering hedge with a line of Nano Trellis Rafts.

Yeah that Exo Terra would be a good one to try. It still amazes me that the major tank manufacturers don't build any standard fish tanks with 18" X 24" footprint. It seems like such a nice shape, and it would be perfect for a riparium.

There is one company, Great Lakes Aquariums, that build a 23G, a 34G and a 45 High with 18" X 24" base size, but I get the impression that they have only limited distribution. Here is their page with different tank models:

http://www.greatlakesaquariums.com/rpl.php

I'd really like to get a hold of one of those 23-gallon or 34-gallon tanks.

Glasscages.com also builds rimless turtle tanks.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

The Hypoestes phyllostachya you recently purchased loves humidity, so this is a great choice for the riparium. I believe the one you have is called 'Carmina.' Here is a great link on them. I have a picture of 'Pink Dot' taken on Christmas day when it bloomed. Sorry it's a blurry picture, I was excited :redface:









You've just got me super excited about this plant in the riparium.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

sewingalot said:


> The Hypoestes phyllostachya you recently purchased loves humidity, so this is a great choice for the riparium. I believe the one you have is called 'Carmina.' Here is a great link on them. I have a picture of 'Pink Dot' taken on Christmas day when it bloomed. Sorry it's a blurry picture, I was excited :redface:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


When I saw the plant at HD I got pretty excited too, enough that I walked back into the store to get it after I had decided not to do so. It is still looking very good and healthy too. I'm not really sure I have it identified corrrectly - HD doesn't put plant names on their little potted ones. But, I haven't found any other photos that come close to looking like what I have.


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## danepatrick (Jul 17, 2006)

the riparium is looking great hoppy. i'm loving the new plant.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

You've definitely identified it correctly. I suspect yours may be the compact version they have been creating for a while now. My grandma has grown this for years and it is truly a wonderful plant. It is a good thing you have it in the riparium because of its humidity demands. It flags at the even remote sign of drought. I am going to Lowes to see if I can find some more of these now!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I just had to show off this view! The light green, rippled leaf plant in the middle is Oplismenus hirtellus, and it took me a long time to get that one looking good and growing well. I think it is one of the nicest looking plants for a riparium.

Today I tried to clean my filter sponge, but that isn't going to be possible without removing some of the planters so I can get to it easier. Fortunately the sponge is a coarse one so I doubt that it will plug up anytime soon. 

And, I got another compliment from the CEO this morning, as she was gazing at it while eating breakfast. I can't believe anyone would regret starting one of these. This has been set up for one month now.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

That's looking awesome Hoppy. Can't wait to retire and set up a couple of those. 

Impatiens could work well. I remember them growing along water falls in Kauai. Definitely humid/wet, and near tropical climate.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That _Oplismenus_ is looking good. Is that the same stuff that I sent to you? It's funny that yours is yellow, while mine is dark green with white variegation.

_Oplismenus_ works great on those Nano Trellis Rafts, but I found that the stems are so skinny and loose in the notches of the insert that they don't keep the insert and the rest of the raft together. I used a short section of fat rubber band squeezed in between the two pieces to keep them together.


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## PinkRasbora (Jan 22, 2005)

Wow that tank looks awsome. Are those potted plants on the sides suctioned cupped to the side? the photo looking down made me see some plastic. great idea though, suction cup pots, hehe.:fish:


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Wasserpest said:


> That's looking awesome Hoppy. Can't wait to retire and set up a couple of those.
> 
> Impatiens could work well. I remember them growing along water falls in Kauai. Definitely humid/wet, and near tropical climate.


One website I read, about ponds and little brooks, as I recall, mentioned that impatiens will grow in very wet conditions, as well as caladiums, which was what I was looking up. So, I went looking for impatiens, but none found yet, not even the seeds. Apparently it isn't easy to start from seeds, so I will keep looking for starter packs of 6 impatiens plants. And, I haven't seen a single caladium either - they are seasonal.



hydrophyte said:


> That _Oplismenus_ is looking good. Is that the same stuff that I sent to you? It's funny that yours is yellow, while mine is dark green with white variegation.
> 
> _Oplismenus_ works great on those Nano Trellis Rafts, but I found that the stems are so skinny and loose in the notches of the insert that they don't keep the insert and the rest of the raft together. I used a short section of fat rubber band squeezed in between the two pieces to keep them together.


That Oplismenus is the last remaining bit from what you sent me, and it has always been that color. The other cuttings all died. I had all of them in nano trellis rafts, discarding the rotted remains as they rotted, until this one little piece was left, with two living leaves. I just ignored it totally in my nursery tank, and finally noticed it a few days ago, and saw how nice it now looks.



PinkRasbora said:


> Wow that tank looks awsome. Are those potted plants on the sides suctioned cupped to the side? the photo looking down made me see some plastic. great idea though, suction cup pots, hehe.:fish:


Here is where the pots and other plastic parts come from: http://ripariumsupply.com/store.html And, you can read through that website and find out about all there is to know about setting up a riparium. It really isn't very hard, compared to "high tech" planted tanks.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Don't Caladiums get too large? The ones I have seen have beautiful about foot long leaves. Might be overpowering, like a Sword plant in a 10gal tank. Perhaps there are some dwarf varieties available.

_Cyperus_ should be another nice one for this type of setup. There are many different ones available. Epiphytic ferns should do well outside of the water.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

duplicate


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Wasserpest said:


> Don't Caladiums get too large? The ones I have seen have beautiful about foot long leaves. Might be overpowering, like a Sword plant in a 10gal tank. Perhaps there are some dwarf varieties available.
> 
> _Cyperus_ should be another nice one for this type of setup. There are many different ones available. Epiphytic ferns should do well outside of the water.


Most caladiums are called "elephant ears" for a good reason! But, there are some small leaf varieties available, from here, for example: http://www.asiaticanursery.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/plants.viewCategory/catID/72/index.htm and this is the website that makes me want to find one of the green and white leaf, small leaf varieties.

I have some Cyperus alternifolias "Gracilis" in this tank. Hydrophyte has it available.


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## jaidexl (Sep 18, 2006)

That Oplismenus looks great, I love the color and texture of the leaves. Nice contrast.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

My wife is now suggesting that I should set up ripariums for people around town for profit! She thinks they would have a big market, once people see one. I'm inclined to agree, but at my age working for money is way, way down on my priority list. I'm thinking about suggesting that some one much younger in our local plant group might want to use this as a side business idea. (But, today while grocery shopping I found I was designing the Riparium store in my head!)


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

A feature that makes ripariums a compelling choice for aquarium rental or maintenance operations is that they are crash-proof in comparison with some other kinds of setups, especially high-tech planted and reef tanks.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> A feature that makes ripariums a compelling choice for aquarium rental or maintenance operations is that they are crash-proof in comparison with some other kinds of setups, especially high-tech planted and reef tanks.


Of course the major selling point is their absolute beauty, and I think people can relate to them better than to planted aquariums because most people are familar with houseplants. The bonus is the fish in the water below the plants. This makes me wish I were younger!

Here is a plant that should be available in 4 inch pots at Target, and which should be a perfect addition to a riparium, one I will be looking for:








From http://waterroots.com/aphelandrasquarrosa.htm
I have been looking around for a plant like this, green leaf with bold white veins on it. There are some caladiums that look similar, but this might work even better.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That plant would look real good as a centerpiece in among finer-leaved foliage.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That site has a real good page on pest control in houseplants.

http://waterroots.com/peskycritters.htm

They make a good point about the advantages of hydroculture in excluding soil-borne pests.

Have you still not had any pest problems Hoppy in your setup? I recently had some spider mites flair up in one tank, but I knocked them down again.

That site is overall extensive and fairly well-written. It's funny that they don't seem to be selling anything from it, because it has a lot of information and looks commercial.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey that Exotic Angel site lists that _Pilea_ that looks really good and grows well on the Nano Trellis Raft. They call it 'Silver Tree'...

http://www.exoticangel.com/Varieties/ShowProductDetails.aspx?productid=221


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I'm not sure I would recognize an insect pest problem before it was severe, so I can't say I don't have problems. But, I haven't seen anything to make me think I have a problem. One thing I have noticed over several years: I used to live in Missouri and visited there regularly for many years. There were always 10X the insects there compared to Sacramento, and this is a farming area too. I suspect the very dry conditions in the summer here act to discourage many insect pests. At least for now I'm going to assume I will face fewer insects than you do.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Hey that Exotic Angel site lists that _Pilea_ that looks really good and grows well on the Nano Trellis Raft. They call it 'Silver Tree'...
> 
> http://www.exoticangel.com/Varieties/ShowProductDetails.aspx?productid=221


They also list it as Pilea spruceana, so those of us who can't live without a little Latin in our lives can be happy:icon_mrgr


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I added a few more plants today, but I think I am near the capacity for this tank. Once they all get started growing vigorously, I will have a job deciding where to cut, what to remove, how to rearrange. For now I am just ecstatic about how this is turning out.

And, a close up of the left side:


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Wow. I like it too. A lot. It reminds me of the landscaping at the jungle themed hotel in Disney World (no, not the mickey mouse shaped shrubs, lol)
Really cool, Hoppy. You're making me really want to set one of these bad boys up!


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## will5 (Sep 30, 2005)

Hoppy said:


> I now have a few more plants in the riparium, one is the spider lily Hydrophyte showed photos of when it was in his riparium, not blooming now, of course, and possibly just waiting to go dormant for the winter, but still looking very healthy. Then, there is another orchid on a piece of hanging bark, and some Pilea (sp) trying to start some roots from a nano raft.
> 
> And, I planted some E. Quadricostatus, broadleaf chain sword, in the substrate, along with a few stems of Bacopa Australis, both from Zeek21, to see if I can grow them up to the water surface, then drape them across a raft to grow emersed there.
> 
> Yes, I'm having fun with this!roud:



Ok maybe I missed this but what did you use the hang the plants on the left and right side of the tank? They look like baskets?


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

will5 said:


> Ok maybe I missed this but what did you use the hang the plants on the left and right side of the tank? They look like baskets?


They are planters bought from riparium supply. They use suction cups to attatch to the wall.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

Hoppy, also look up Fittonia for that red plant. They are very similar in growth to the Hypoestes with more substantial leaf texture and flowers similar to polygonums.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

sewingalot said:


> Hoppy, also look up Fittonia for that red plant. They are very similar in growth to the Hypoestes with more substantial leaf texture and flowers similar to polygonums.


I don't think mine are Fittonia, because my leaves have somewhat more sharp points, less obvious veins running between the major veins, and no ruffling of the leaf edges at all. I think to be sure, one has to see a flower on the plant, and that hasn't happened.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

The flowering will definitely tell the plant.  It is looking good. One suggestion? The back left hand corner plant can't be seen very well. Maybe move it in front of the other plant on the left side? JMO.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

sewingalot said:


> The flowering will definitely tell the plant.  It is looking good. One suggestion? The back left hand corner plant can't be seen very well. Maybe move it in front of the other plant on the left side? JMO.


That is a good suggestion. I put that lily plant there because I expected it to go dormant very soon and I would be removing it then, but it has fooled me by continuing to grow new leaves. Maybe tomorrow I will try moving it back where it can tower over the front plants more artistically. The whole dormancy thing has me badly confused now. I even wonder how plants indoors in a riparium can tell it is approaching winter. The lighting duration sure doesn't change as it does in nature, and I thought that was a major cue for dormancy.


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

Hoppy said:


> The whole dormancy thing has me badly confused now. I even wonder how plants indoors in a riparium can tell it is approaching winter. The lighting duration sure doesn't change as it does in nature, and I thought that was a major cue for dormancy.


My thoughts exactly. How do these plants know it's time to go dormant if the lighting/temp/nutrients stay the same thru out the year:icon_ques


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

londonloco said:


> My thoughts exactly. How do these plants know it's time to go dormant if the lighting/temp/nutrients stay the same thru out the year:icon_ques


Ditto. I am wondering this as well. Alos since the plants roots are kept in heated water, I am wondering if it even will go dormant.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

sewingalot said:


> Ditto. I am wondering this as well. Alos since the plants roots are kept in heated water, I am wondering if it even will go dormant.


I have two rain lily plants (bulbs) in my nursery tank, and they definitely did begin to go dormant, with older leaves yellowing, and any new leaves being very thin and short. But, even with only the roots coming out of the planter in the water, they are still not obviously dormant. I wonder what causes the winter dormancy.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

My Colocasia (Taro) is growing very well now, with another new leaf completely open, and a baby plant going good, with one leaf already. So, how do you know when to separate the baby from the mother? And, should it be planted in a regular planter cup like the mother plant?









The same plant may also be ready to bloom again. At least it seems to be starting a spathe - which could turn out to be another leaf too.









Is it just another leaf?


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

SO long as it has some real roots on it you should be abel to snip off that little _C. fallax_ plantlet and repot it. You could use a hanging planter, or put it in just a regular flower pot with a coarse potting mix. When I divide plants I like to replant into different kinds of situations and put them in different locations as insurance against loss. 

I don't know when those dwarf taro will go dormant. I remember from last winter that the plants just kept producing more and more spathes and fewer and fewer leaves, and the remaining leaves began to yellow and die. I can't remember exactly when that happened. I had a few of them and I think some went dormant in November while others were still going until January.

I think that I can see the little fattened tuber at the base of the plantlet. That is the part that will will remain as an energy reserve while the plant is in dormancy.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> I have two rain lily plants (bulbs) in my nursery tank, and they definitely did begin to go dormant, with older leaves yellowing, and any new leaves being very thin and short. But, even with only the roots coming out of the planter in the water, they are still not obviously dormant. I wonder what causes the winter dormancy.





sewingalot said:


> Ditto. I am wondering this as well. Alos since the plants roots are kept in heated water, I am wondering if it even will go dormant.





londonloco said:


> My thoughts exactly. How do these plants know it's time to go dormant if the lighting/temp/nutrients stay the same thru out the year:icon_ques


I really don't know what specific cue might trigger dormancy for these plants. I have watched that _Colocasia_ taro and _Hymenocallis_, _Crinum_ and _Zephyranthes_ lilies start dormancy even though they were in riparium setups with constant daylengths and temperatures and with no apparent cues that the seasons might be changing. I wondered if they might just have some sort of internal clock that regulates changes in growth and activity after certain lengths of time.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Thank you Hydrophyte! So, it isn't urgent to separate the baby plant, and I can wait until the roots are better developed. This is really an ideal riparium plant, because of its slow growth and the long life of the mature leaves, not to speak of the beauty of the leaves.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Yeah that one is just about my favorite too. It would be nice if it didn't have that dormancy period, but that's not so difficult to accommodate and while it is dormant you can enjoy some other plant in its place. The spider mites do go after that one if they find it, but since the leaves are so big it is pretty easy to wash them off with a gentle spray of RO.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Here is another obviously ideal plant for a riparium, Syngonium podophyllum, or arrowhead vine. I saw one of these, although not as nice as the one in the photo, at my local Ace Hardware store today, but I couldn't believe it would be a good riparium plant until I researched it a bit. I may keep my eyes open for a nice looking variant of this.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Those are real tough plants, but I don't _think_ they grow as marginals in the wild. I seem to remember them described as forest vines that grow in shady spots close to the ground. It might do alright in a riparium though if potted in real coarse media.


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

Hoppy, your Riparium looks incredible. I have read this thread from the beginning, and I think I remember you saying you’re using root tabs in the planters. But are you dosing the water column?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

londonloco said:


> Hoppy, your Riparium looks incredible. I have read this thread from the beginning, and I think I remember you saying you’re using root tabs in the planters. But are you dosing the water column?


Thank you! I started the riparium with no fertilizers in the planters, and just dosed the water using approximately EI dosages. Later I added a few little balls of Osmocote to some of the planters, and my 10 gallon experimental tank has all of the planters dosed with a few balls of Osmocote. I see no problems, like green water, from the Osmocote, so I assume that is working well. The plants in planters send roots out the bottom, so I'm not sure how much the tank water is feeding them and how much the Osmocote is doing it. Some day one of us should do some comparative experimenting on fertilizing, but I'm too enthralled with the riparium as a whole to do that now.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Those are real tough plants, but I don't _think_ they grow as marginals in the wild. I seem to remember them described as forest vines that grow in shady spots close to the ground. It might do alright in a riparium though if potted in real coarse media.


One of the websites I did some reading in said they like to have their soil continuously moist, as opposed to drying out between waterings, except if they are going dormant, to allow them to dry out a bit. And, they are described as very hardy, so the combination screams *RIPARIUM!!* to me. I will be looking around for nice variants like that photo shows, and I'll try them then.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

One thing I have decided with ripariums: we are actually growing our plants as hydroponic plants, even those in planters. An exception would be the planters with some MTS in them, but average planters with only inert substrate in them are just hydroponic containers. That led me to look at websites that discuss suitability for hydroponic growing of various plants. I was surprised to see that most plants can be grown that way, or at leas a lot of plants. Possibly some plants would eventually give up if grown hydroponically for a whole year - I'm not sure about that. And, I doubt that plants noted for needing very little water would grow at all well. But, otherwise I suspect we have a huge variety of possible riparium plants.


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

Hoppy said:


> Some day one of us should do some comparative experimenting on fertilizing, but I'm too enthralled with the riparium as a whole to do that now.


Whoaa, need a few more years on just planted tanks to give that a try. Give me any fish, I'll figure out all needed to keep them alive for years, but learning about dosing regimes is kicking my butt!:icon_roll I'm trying here...lol....


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy, Look at this...

http://showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2008.cgi?&op=showcase&category=3&vol=-1&id=58

That setup has a _Syngonium_ with it's crown under several inches of water. 

I wonder what is the smallest leaf/plant size that you cold hope to find among _Syngonium_.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

http://showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/Img2008/400/354.jpg
From http://showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2008.cgi?&op=showcase&category=3&vol=-1&id=58
This has to be one of least well scaled ripariums I have seen!

Based on what I read about those plants, the variations are just color variations, not leaf size variations. So, I doubt that there are any readily available with smaller leaves. The one I saw at Ace Hardware had leaves maybe 3 inches long.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That setup isn't really a riparium, and it isn't really a paludarium either. It's more like a regular planted tank with one big emergent growing out the top. I just thought it interesting that that _Syngonium_ was growing so well with such wet feet.


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## ghostsword (Oct 9, 2009)

Hoppy, why don't you raise a hanging planter above the water to plant the Syngonium, allowing the rest of the plant when it trails to be supported on a trelli raft?

By the way, this post should be sticky, as it a great example of how to build a Riparium.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

ghostsword said:


> Hoppy, why don't you raise a hanging planter above the water to plant the Syngonium, allowing the rest of the plant when it trails to be supported on a trelli raft?
> 
> By the way, this post should be sticky, as it a great example of how to build a Riparium.


I haven't found a Syngonium I want to use yet, so I haven't had to face the terrible question - what to get rid of to find space for it? The leaf size on that plant makes me think it wouldn't look appropriate if allowed to sprawl over a raft - just too much big leaves. I would want to keep it pruned down, replanted often, if necessary, so it was just a foot or so high and not yet sprawling.

I don't agree about this thread being a sticky. A good sticky would be more focused, and less rambling than this has been. One day Hydrophyte will start the thread that will be the Riparium Sticky.


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## ghostsword (Oct 9, 2009)

There were two points on this thread that I really liked, one was the way you built your cabinet, that was really useful, and the other the transformation of your riparium, from putting up the lights to seing the plants giving shape to the whole project.

I would use the Syngonium trailing the side of the tank, but that is a question of taste.

I am using old pond books, to find marginal plants and asking friends of mine spread thru out the world for pictures of plants that they may have seen arround rivers.

When I find a plant that I think will do good on a Riparium I buy it, use a hanging planter and place it on a small tank, as they are cheap in the UK. Some survive, others die, and the information is collected on a notepad. This is time consuming and expensive, but it is hard to find information arround.

What Hydrophyte should do, is to collate his knowledge of Ripariums and produce a book, or a DVD, showing the type of plants to use, what substrat, lighting, etc. I am sure that it would sell, I would buy a copy, as there is nothing out there about it, at least I haven't seen it.

As I got friends in west africa and Sri Lanka, the information so far is positive but slow.

Your Riparium is looking great, and hopefully some of those plants will flower.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

My E. quadricostatus (now renamed into another species, but I forget what it is) has begun to do very well. It isn't spreading a lot yet, but the plants are growing, look healthy, and are a great addition. Here is how they looked 30 minutes ago:









The houseplants I have been experimenting with have produced another winner! It is the Gynura aurantiaca (Purple Passion) vine. From the day I added it it has looked good, but it also grows slowly, so it doesn't try to take over the tank. And, the purple adds another color without looking garish. Again, from 30 minutes ago:









One more plant that I got with my original order from Riparium Supply is Oplismenus hirtellus, or basket grass. This one refused to grow for me for weeks, with most of the cuttings just slowly dying, but the survivors finally began to do well, and now they are outstanding. Their light green color, and different leaf shape, plus the low growth pattern, make them a very nice addition to the "garden". Notice the rippled texture of the leafs - from 30 minutes ago:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That lime green _Oplismenus_ makes a really nice contrast against the purple passion vine. How did you plant the purple passion vine?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> That lime green _Oplismenus_ makes a really nice contrast against the purple passion vine. How did you plant the purple passion vine?


It is planted on a nano trellis raft, three cuttings per raft - except they aren't cuttings. I just washed the rooted plantlets well, getting all of the dirt off the roots, then planted them in the raft to grow hydroponic. My two other houseplants are largely planted the same way.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Have you found that the Nano Trellis Raft has been able to hold them up OK? They look like largish plants.

Your chameleon plant is still looking good too. I like _E. quadricostatus_ a lot too. As far as I can tell it is just as easy to grow as a regular amazon swrod. I haven't tried it yet though in dimmer light. It has such a snice bright green color.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Have you found that the Nano Trellis Raft has been able to hold them up OK? They look like largish plants.
> 
> Your chameleon plant is still looking good too. I like _E. quadricostatus_ a lot too. As far as I can tell it is just as easy to grow as a regular amazon swrod. I haven't tried it yet though in dimmer light. It has such a nice bright green color.


I have the extra "floats" on the nano trellis to keep it from toppling. And, they are fastened to a planter cup at one end. Eventually that will be a problem, but I hope to be able to just top the plants and restart the cuttings. Then I will find out how well it does as cuttings, and how well it adapts to pruning.


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## MoonFish (Feb 12, 2006)

*Dude*

If I did one of those, I would have a big bush of Limnophila aromatica. Just to smell it. The irony of growing a plant named for the smell but growing it on a form where there is none. 

It does look cool but the underwater section is sort of bare!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

MoonFish said:


> If I did one of those, I would have a big bush of Limnophila aromatica. Just to smell it. The irony of growing a plant named for the smell but growing it on a form where there is none.
> 
> It does look cool but the underwater section is sort of bare!


What does Limnophila aromatica look like in the emersed form? Adding some aroma to a riparium would be interesting.

I keep the underwater section sort of bare on purpose. For one thing, there isn't a lot of light down there, so the number plants that can grow well there is limited. And, I have had all the battles with algae that I want, so I have been reluctant to add algae prone plants. Anubias would be a good thing to try, especially Anubias nana petite. When I get bored a bit with the above water plants I may try to add a lot of that anubias. Another consideration for me is that I have a lot of roots growing in the water under some of the plants, which restrict the swimming space a bit, so I have been reluctant to restrict it more.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Look! In the riparium! It's a bird, it's a plane, no - it's my colocasia (taro) sending up a bloom! 

I thought this was going to be another leaf for the past week or so, but now it looks very much like a flower is about to open. This is like when one of those massive, stinking plants from Indonesia does its once in 20 year blooming. I'm thinking of sending out a press release:biggrin:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That plant will probably keep producing more and more new blooms. The spathe of _C. fallax_ is actually rather drab and it doesn't open any more than that, but the foliage is nice. There are a number of other emergent aquatic aroids that would be intersting to explore for blooming, crypts are already popular for this, and lasiod aroids (_Lasia_, _Cyrtosperma_ and several other genera) have wild, tropical-looking spathes. This link goes to a shot of the spathe of _Cyrtosperma johnstonii_.

http://keys.lucidcentral.org/keys/aquariumplants2/Aquarium_&_Pond_Plants_of_the_World/key/Aquarium_&_Pond_Plants/Media/Images/cyrtosperma_spathe.jpg

...and _C. johnstonii_ has these amazing leaves.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Aw.... So how does the pollen transfer take place if the spathe remains completely closed up? Even if it does nothing else, it is still an interesting thing to watch develop. And, that is part of the attraction I feel for ripariums. With a good selection of plants there will always be something interesting going on.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Well, a few days later the spathe on my C. fallax has done nothing beyond what the photo above shows, except that it is shriveling up and the bottom portion getting green. I did a tiny bit of googling to find that this type of plant doesn't propagate like "normal" plants so no pollen is intended to get inside the spathe. The spathe is just there to intrigue folks like meroud:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

So does that mean that it is self-fertilizing? I have always just clipped those spathes off, but it would be interesting to leave one on the plant to see what it would do. That _C. fallax_ is just about my favorite plant. I love the leaves. It does get awful big though and the spider mites like it too.

Hey this figure shows pretty well a good way to handle the sandwich magnet pair while mounting the magnetic planter in the tank.










The real important point is that the magnet on the outside of the tank is _slid_ into place along the glass panel. If you approach it directly with the magnet in your fingertips it is likely to jump free and slam into the glass. It is also important to be aware of neighboring planters with magnets, as it will be attracted to them too. The best way to position it is to approach from directly above. Lastly, you should also test the magnet polarity beforehand to be sure that the correct side of the free magnet is contacting the glass, lest it give you a surprise as it flips around to correct itself.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Today I was doing some minor maintenance on the riparium, including separating 4 plantlets from the Colocassia, and I noticed the above! My spider lily is blooming! And, I have been waiting to see it settle down for a winter rest. Now I feel like an expectant fatherroud:


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

Hoppy, this rip has been set up about 4 months now...how bout a FTS? It's been awhile and I'm dying to see it in it's total glory! Thanks!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

londonloco said:


> Hoppy, this rip has been set up about 4 months now...how bout a FTS? It's been awhile and I'm dying to see it in it's total glory! Thanks!


FTS awaits an evening when it is dark enough with the house lights off to avoid reflections, and when I remember that I intend to do that. Also, I did a lot of disassembling of the plantings today, so it will be a few days before the tank recovers. Excuses, excuses!


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

Grrr, now how am I suppose to know what my rip should look like in 2 months time? LOL...can't wait to see the pics!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


>


You're gonna love that spider lily bloom. I don't know why that plant hasn't started to go dormant yet. Mine did. 

That plant would be a real good one to propagate. How many bulbs do you have? You could probably get a whole pot of new bulblets by growing it out on the patio next summer.

What is that grassy stuff? Is it _Cyperus_?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

It's dark enough for a FTS, so here it is. Some of the moved plants need to readjust to the new surroundings, so it should look a little better in a couple of weeks. The smaller Colocasia leaf to the left is a new plant offshoot I just put in a planter cup. I now have three less mature ones in my 10 gallon grow out tank - just set up again for this purpose. (You can see that I split the photo in half and adjusted the exposure so both halves are not too dark or light.)

Hydrophyte, I have only one bulb, the one I got from you last summer. Is it going to do better out in the very hot sun here for the summer, or in the riparium with a much cooler temperature? Will it grow bulblets in the riparium?

The yellowish grassy plant is Acorus gramineus, which I bought from a pond plant supply place, on line.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Looks great, Hoppy!


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## isais (Nov 28, 2009)

gorgeous Hoppy, I love the purple in the middle


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## pandapr (Nov 10, 2008)

I really hate myself....I have to stop looking at ripariums...but they look so great....

good job !


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

So pretty. Wish I could see it in person! Some plants are washed out by the light. I bet the contrasts are beautiful.

The only thing I wish is that you could hide the pots. I guess with time the bottom plants will grow up to hide them.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I like the way that the Java fern and the _Ruellia brittoniana_ mirror each other. They have the same shape and texture and movement. The fern is just somewhat larger that the _Ruellia_.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Tex Gal said:


> So pretty. Wish I could see it in person! Some plants are washed out by the light. I bet the contrast are beautiful.
> 
> The only thing I wish is that you could hide the pots. I guess with time the bottom plants will grow up to hide them.


I like having as many planters as I can get, so I have a couple at each end of the tank. Those are the only ones where you can see the planters (pots). If you enjoy "houseplants" as well as aquariums, this is like nirvana! I don't see how anyone with those twin interests could ever be disappointed if they start a riparium.


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

As usual, your rip/tank is outstanding. I'll have to post some pics of mine this week, sigh...they both pale in comparison.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

...your _E. quadricostatus_ looks nice in there too and it is perfect for the underwater area. I had mine going well for a while, but then it fizzled when I moved everything. I need to grow it up again. I wonder how that plant would do emersed(?). I think that I have seen pictures of it emersed with little flower stalk on it.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

It took a long time before the E. quadricostatus began to grow well, but now two of the plants have nearly covered the front of the substrate. Those I planted farther back are shaded more and never did start growing. Apparently I am right on the borderline for adequate light for that plant, so any shade is too much shade. Still, it is encouraging because at most I have perhaps 30 micromols of PAR, probably more like 20. This is a plant that will obviously do well in any low light tank. No CO2 either and no substrate fertilizing.


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

I can see how seeing the root systems would be interesting. I guess I'm just more in love with all the foliage. It's amazing to see all those beautiful leaves.

I really like all the water plant growth as well!


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## Strick (Apr 6, 2009)

Beautiful rip, Hoppy. Great job!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Thank you to all of you who complimented my effort! I have to say though, the most appreciated compliment is from my wife, who after all these years of enduring my aquarium efforts, now is always hinting that another one would be really nice. She even objected when I took down my 15H and 10 gallon ones in my "office". I ended up setting the 10 gallon one back up to house extra plants again, and she wants it to have more plants! For me, ripariums are the right "button" to push!


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## dewalltheway (Jan 19, 2005)

Hoppy said:


> the most appreciated compliment is from my wife, who after all these years of enduring my aquarium efforts, now is always hinting that another one would be really nice.


So those of us that are hearing right now....."Why do you need so many?...or Why do you need to set that up?..." that there could be light at the end of the tunnel?

Also....very nice layout Hoppy! How your plants have grown in makes me impatient for mine to do the same. I do have to say as far as ripariums go, that you need to have more patients with the plant growth then you do with emersed plants.


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## idontknow (May 9, 2008)

Seeing yours really makes me want to set one of these up.



Hoppy said:


> .......I have to say though, the most appreciated compliment is from my wife, who after all these years of enduring my aquarium efforts, now is always hinting that another one would be really nice......


I wish my wife would say something like that  though I am greatful that she doesnt complain either. Again very nice work.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The Spider Lily bloom is about to open! The News Media have been alerted! Watch NBC Nightly News for coverage.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

You will be very happy with that bloom. It might only last a day or two, so keep your camera at hand.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

African Violets do very well in a riparium. Here are the leaf cuttings I stuck in a planter about a week ago, with new plants already sticking their tiny new leaves out through the Flourite planting medium. These are the ones I started in a cup of water, then transplanted to the riparium planter once they had some roots, but only buds for the new plants. Clearly, they are growing well this way.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Just plain Flourite?

Are you dosing this tank at all, Hoppy? (sorry if you already answered this somewhere back in the thread...)


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

lauraleellbp said:


> Just plain Flourite?
> 
> Are you dosing this tank at all, Hoppy? (sorry if you already answered this somewhere back in the thread...)


As I recall I added a little Osmocoat to the planter, well below where the current roots are, and I fertilize the tank water approximately per the EI method. The water has enough nutrients that the drained water feeds an algae colony on the downspout from my deck.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I really need to try out some African violet.

Yesterday I saw one in someone's window that had longer leaf petioles (~10"). Something like that might grow into a nice shape in a riparium and be a more viable part of a layout. 

Hey Hoppy whenever you get a chance it would be great to see a shot quartering down into the tank for a good view of the foliage. I would be really interested to see more detail.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> I really need to try out some African violet.
> 
> Yesterday I saw one in someone's window that had longer leaf petioles (~10"). Something like that might grow into a nice shape in a riparium and be a more viable part of a layout.
> 
> Hey Hoppy whenever you get a chance it would be great to see a shot quartering down into the tank for a good view of the foliage. I would be really interested to see more detail.


See http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/t...-45-gallon-rimless-riparium-7.html#post982239


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Wow! Look at what greeted me this morning. This spider lily is one of the major reasons I wanted a riparium - absolutely beautiful bloom. And, the plant has a great sense of drama, taking lots of time developing the bloom so you are fully engaged in the drama before it finally appears.


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## paulrw (Apr 14, 2009)

wow! looking good hoppy. that spider lilly is gorgeous.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Nice one, reminds me of the Crinum calamistratum flowering in my 36gal.

You could find some black/dark sheet/towel/something to use as a nicer background.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That's awesome Hoppy.

That thing might set seed. If you have the space you oughta to try and sprout them.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Full tank shot, with the lily at the upper left. I took the photo above this morning quickly, just in case I was dreaming:biggrin: But, it's still there, so I took Wasserpest's advice, grabbed a green place mat from the dining table beside the tank, and took another photo, to accompany my press release to the NY Times:confused1:









Hydrophyte: How big are the seeds going to be? I can handle trying to grow a lily from a seed I can see, but those tiny, tiny seeds that many plants produce aren't within my capabilities.


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## seds (Jan 30, 2009)

Hoppy, that's cool flowers! And look at that submersed growth!

Most riparium pictures make it hard to see the aquatic plants. Have you ever tried a callitriche species in a riparium? I think that'd be cool, with it's surface rosettes.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Is that a spider lilly? Is this the same as the rocky shoals spider lilly? 

We have a canal local to us where these bloom en mass every may. Its quite an awesome sight. Apparently they are fairly rare and protected. 

Either way awesome job and congrats!


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

The lily and your tank both are just stunning!!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> Hydrophyte: How big are the seeds going to be? I can handle trying to grow a lily from a seed I can see, but those tiny, tiny seeds that many plants produce aren't within my capabilities.


The ones that I saw on a similar species were largish, about the size of a BB, and shiny black. I don't know if this plant can self-fertilize and I don't know if you could expect the seed sot be viable. It could be worth a shot.

Nice work blooming that plant. It must be happy. I do see one other photo tip for the next time you have the camera out. That chalkline is pretty conspicuous, so you might hit it with some white vinegar or RO to wipe it away before shooting.



MrJG said:


> Is that a spider lilly? Is this the same as the rocky shoals spider lilly?
> 
> We have a canal local to us where these bloom en mass every may. Its quite an awesome sight. Apparently they are fairly rare and protected.


There are a bunch of different _Hymenocallis_ species, including several that are common horticultural selections. Wikipedia (to be taken with a grain of salt) describes _Hynmenocallis_ as comprising 63 species.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

seds said:


> Hoppy, that's cool flowers! And look at that submersed growth!
> 
> Most riparium pictures make it hard to see the aquatic plants. Have you ever tried a callitriche species in a riparium? I think that'd be cool, with it's surface rosettes.


No, I haven't tried a callitriche species, even though they grow wild in the wetlands near me. From what I see on the photos of it, I don't see a value to it in a riparium. (At least not for what I want.)


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The second bud opened tonight! Spectacular, huh?


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## Regloh (Jan 17, 2009)

Wow... 
I can imagine that this kind of bloom would inspire you to start a riparium project... I am iching to do this ever since hydrophyte posted his first bloom here. Absolutely gorgeous...


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## cah925 (May 18, 2007)

The tank looks great. It's really coming together very nicely. Congrats on the blooms! The flower is very striking.


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## londonloco (Aug 25, 2005)

Awesome!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I really wish I had more of that plant. I have four different _Hymenocallis_. The really common horticultural one is _H. liriosme_, but that one gets too big to use in a tank very well. The other two that I have are dwarf secis/varieties, but they are not such good growers and have never bloomed for me.

I acquired this one as a gift from some people who were emptying a pond for the winter. I remember that the pot with this spider lily was stuffed full of bulbs and they were throwing out all but a few to store for the winter. I only grabbed a couple of them. Whoops.

This coming summer I am going to plant my few bulbs out-of-doors in a little container pond and use a rich topsoil substrate in the pot. I hope that they will grow more vigorously and give me more divisions.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey Hoppy I got that box sent off I think the day before yesterday so you should see it soon.

To plant that _Bacopa_ just be sure to include a good number of stems (6 or 7) in each planter cup. This will make a bushier clump more quickly. The rooted end should be buried about 1" down in the planter gravel. Then snap a Trellis Raft in place and spread the stems out across it. 

This plant benefits from root fertilization, so be sure to include a root tab or Osmocote or whatever in the planter.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I now have the Bacopa planted - about 6-8 stems in planter cups, with the ends more than an inch deep, osmocote added, and a raft attached, with the stems spread out on it. Right now they are very droopy from the stress, but possibly tomorrow they will be up for a picture.

But, this is in my other riparium, where I also planted my Episcia Chocolate Cream.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

This photo shows the seed pods of the Spider Lily as they develop. I was surprised to find how far from the blooms they were. Now, how do I proceed to get viable seed from these? I presume they will mature as the flower stalks begin to turn yellow and die. But, when do I "harvest" them? And, then what?


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I would just let it be until maybe the stalk begins to brown. I think that I observed one of the seed pods having split open on its own to reveal the shiny black seeds inside. I think that they would be mature if you saw that. I have no idea whether this plant is able to self-pollinate and if you would expect the seeds to really be viable. It sure would be great to propagate some more of that plant.

If you get seeds that look good you might try just putting a few on the surface of the substrate in a riparium planter. It could be useful to also try a less soggy situation, such as in moist, loose potting media in a flower pot on a warm windowsill.

The perianth tube on that plant is very long and the ovaries are way down at that bottom. Big showy white flowers like that are often pollinated by nocturnal hawk moths (Sphingidae), which use their very long probosces to reach down through the tube to the nectar reward.


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

was the flower pollinated?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

mistergreen said:


> was the flower pollinated?


No, my tongue wouldn't reach:tongue:


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Well, all you really had to do to pollinate it was rub your nose on the anthers and stigma.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Well, all you really had to do to pollinate it was rub your nose on the anthers and stigma.


All I did was gently blow on them periodically to see if that would transfer pollen. I thought about using a tiny brush, but I didn't have one. It never occurred to me to get really intimate with the flower:redface:


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

This riparium finally got ratty enough I decided to do a major overhaul of the planting. My Colocasia fallax was producing huge leaves rapidly, and was shading about half or more of the tank. The Spathiphylum was way overgrown, extending well above the light fixture. And, some of the raft plants had died completely. Plus I have other plants I want to try out. So, yesterday I removed all of the plants and started over.

The first problem I ran into was the suction cups on the planter cups. Many were deteriorated too much to work again. They turn white and get stiffer with time. After I had two planters drop to the bottom, I visited Tap Plastics to see if my memory of seeing them there was correct. It was! I got a dozen of them at 35 cents apiece. They come with an "S" hook looped around the "stem" of the cup, but that slips off easily. 

Then I had lots of trouble planting the Impatiens I want badly to try. That plant seems to just crawl out of the planter as soon as you turn your back. I think I finally have it planted firmly enough to stay in place.

I have a RFUG on this tank, with a small Catalina in-tank filter driving the water into the RFUG. I cleaned the sponge for the first time yesterday. It wasn't terribly dirty, and the pump was working just fine, but I had it apart by then, so I cleaned the sponge completely.

Now all of the plants I want there are in place for now, but I expect to shuffle them a bit to get a better scape, so no photos yet. And, I still need to wipe down the glass well before taking a photo.

I found my Colocassia (taro plant) had lots of new plantlets, in addition to the 3 I had already removed a few months ago. I have about 6 or so to do something with. Plus the "mother" plant is just floating in my nursery tank for now. Who wants some of these? The "mother" plant is really too big for anything but a very large riparium, but maybe it would be a nice houseplant?


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## Craigthor (Sep 9, 2007)

Hoppy said:


> This riparium finally got ratty enough I decided to do a major overhaul of the planting. My Colocasia fallax was producing huge leaves rapidly, and was shading about half or more of the tank. The Spathiphylum was way overgrown, extending well above the light fixture. And, some of the raft plants had died completely. Plus I have other plants I want to try out. So, yesterday I removed all of the plants and started over.
> 
> The first problem I ran into was the suction cups on the planter cups. Many were deteriorated too much to work again. They turn white and get stiffer with time. After I had two planters drop to the bottom, I visited Tap Plastics to see if my memory of seeing them there was correct. It was! I got a dozen of them at 35 cents apiece. They come with an "S" hook looped around the "stem" of the cup, but that slips off easily.
> 
> ...


 
I've got a home for the Mother Taro. :biggrin: Is a 150g 72x18x30 big enough?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Craigthor said:


> I've got a home for the Mother Taro. :biggrin: Is a 150g 72x18x30 big enough?


I think that beautiful plant just found a home!:icon_wink


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Yesterday I did some rearranging, discarding unsuccessful plants, adding a few different plants, etc. I'm still viewing this as a work in progress, but it looks good enough to pose for a photo again. I now have Photoshop "Elements" so I'm trying to learn how to use it. I used it on this photo to combine two exposures to get good lighting both above and below the water. It certainly works.


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## MrJG (Feb 21, 2007)

Looking very nice! Whats the short purple leaved plant on the left? I assume you have it on a nano-trellis?


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## prototyp3 (Dec 5, 2007)

So much sexy in that tank, it's looking great.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Wow your maidenhair fern fared much better than mine did. You have a lot of interesting plants in there it would be great to see some more cloes-ups looking down inside. The underwater area is looking great too. I can't remember are you dosing Excel? THat fern and chain sword sure look happy.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

It's lovely, Hoppy.

I think E. quadricostatus was a good choice for the foreground, I like how you can see the whole chain going there.


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

Hey hoppy how would covering up the sides with contact paper/vinyl, just to see how it would look with the bright colored sand? do you think your tank would stand out more or is there a reason you specifically left it out?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

!shadow! said:


> Hey hoppy how would covering up the sides with contact paper/vinyl, just to see how it would look with the bright colored sand? do you think your tank would stand out more or is there a reason you specifically left it out?


I could have covered the end of the tank that is against the wall, but didn't think to do it. Now it is just too hard to reach that area to do it. The other end is a viewing area, so I would never cover it. If I did this over I think I would stop the black backing right at the water line, and I would cover that end next to the wall.


MrJG said:


> Looking very nice! Whats the short purple leaved plant on the left? I assume you have it on a nano-trellis?


That is Gynura aurantiaca (purple passion vine). I got it at Target last Fall. It is on a nano raft, but really doesn't do well there. It just grows too fast and reaches out to the maximum light to vigorously. That causes it to droop into the water, and even turn the raft over at times. I have to prune off the tips, and replant them every few weeks. I like how it looks, but it is a royal pain to keep up with.


hydrophyte said:


> Wow your maidenhair fern fared much better than mine did. You have a lot of interesting plants in there it would be great to see some more cloes-ups looking down inside. The underwater area is looking great too. I can't remember are you dosing Excel? THat fern and chain sword sure look happy.


I don't use Excel any longer, even though I still have a jug of it. My light intensity just isn't high enough to need a carbon supplement. When I get the layout cleaned up a bit better I will do some more close-ups. Right now the Purple passion vine is about ready to tip the raft over again, and it looks pretty ratty up close. I may replace it with a raft of Pilea that I have about ready for the "big time". That maidenhair fern is now sitting on the tank substrate, but it still looks healthy. I may decide to leave it that way.


lauraleellbp said:


> It's lovely, Hoppy.
> 
> I think E. quadricostatus was a good choice for the foreground, I like how you can see the whole chain going there.


I selected that plant after hydrophyte was so enthusiastic about it. It was a great choice. It picks its own route around the tank, seeking to stay in the best lighted areas. It took several weeks to really start growing, but when it did it was very impressive.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That purple passion vine may be a pain, but it sure is nice how it adds that purple, which shows up really well in photos. I wonder if it might be possible to grow that one in a planter filled mostly with hydroton. It might be easier to manage that way(?).

I bet that that fern won't be able to make it long-term with its crown underwater like that. 

It looks like you could divide that _Cyperus _and get some more new ones going. That plant is a great one for filling much of the background in a layout. It is easy to yank it out of the pot, wash it off and then just pull divisions apart. 

You can also plant the _Cyperus_ leaf tops right in the substrate and little adventitious plants will start right from the bases of those leaf whorls. However, that is a slower method and would take probably three months of good growth to get a full plant.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

This may seem stupid, but it never once occurred to me to divide the Cyperus:icon_cry: I was even wondering if I could find some locally, in pond supply places. I now have 3 planters of it, all of which are ready to be divided. Some days I just feel like I'm barely scratching the surface with learning about riparium planting.

I do need to lift that fern out of the water, but getting it to stay up may be difficult, given its weight. Maybe I can fins something to prop it up from below.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I keep meaning to try out some silicone grease. I have heard that it can really increase the holding power of suction cups.

So long as you have the vertical space for it that Cyperus is an awesome riparium plant. I like the way that it adds such nice volume, but doesn't throw a lot of shade.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The latest iteration for this riparium. I took the Echinodorus that was growing way too big for my high water 45 gallon tank and placed it in this one, in the place of honor. I have this one back to where I really enjoy looking at it again. 

Today I planted another Caladium bulb in a planter cup, which I hope to add to this tank, once it gets started growing well.

And, now I see I once again forgot to clean the front glass before snapping the camera.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That's looking great Hoppy. Your _Adiantum_ fern is especially nice. Has it been developing many new leaves and roots while in there, or did it come with most of that? _Adiantum_ in combination with a few other things would be perfect for a Japanese garden style riparium.


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

l didn't even know there existed a japanese garden style riparium. l gotta agree with hydro on that fern. lf l had this tank i'd make an entire carpet out of it only bad thing about it is that it's pretty big from the look of this tank but i guess there nothing a little trimming can't fix


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The sad news about the fern is that it doesn't seem to have grown a bit since I put it in the tank. Most of the fronds are obviously dieing. I'm ready to give up on this one, as soon as I get a replacement for it. The funny thing is, as long as the planter cup sat on the bottom, with much of the plant submersed, it looked like it might make it. But, now that I have the planter propped up on a glass it is fading fast. Clearly not every plant will make it with hydroculture, at least not without a major effort.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Yeah I don't know if that environment inside of the planter cup is really appropriate for rooting those _Adiantum_ fern. Mine are growing again slowly, but it's still a bit soon to guess whether they are making a recovery, or breathing a final gasp.

I have run into enough different interesting plants that share that water-trickling-over-wet-rocks habitat that I wonder about setting up a paludarium just for growing them. . 

Here's an orchid I was reading about recently that grows on that sort of substrate.

_*Disa tripetaloides*_





*


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

l hope that plant makes it out in the end. l would hate to see such a lovely plant just wither away.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

!shadow! said:


> l hope that plant makes it out in the end. l would hate to see such a lovely plant just wither away.


The plant in my tank is half of what was in the pot that I bought. The other half I replanted in another plastic pot as a houseplant. It died too. But, this was after I had washed off the soil and soaked the plant under water for a couple of hours or so. My guess is that the problem is that this plant has very tiny roots, too delicate to withstand the treatment it got, and all of the roots were removed, making it hard for the plant to survive. 

Now that Spring is here I see lots of these in the stores. If I wanted to try again it would be easy to do so. But, I can't see any obvious way to do something that would lead to success the next time.


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## !shadow! (Jan 25, 2010)

Do you think it might also be due to the fern not traditionally tied down on a piece of driftwood or is this type of fern able to bypass that rule? l would just tie it down on a seperate tank and just compare growth just to see, it wouldn't hurt. l just noticed l wasn't "planted tank obsessed anymore lol  off to a celebration:bounce:


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

This riparium is getting far too overgrown now. The background plants, most of which are big leaf plants, are all growing up past the light fixture, and shading the rest of the tank excessively. Plus the Colocassia plant is sending out ugly runners everywhere now, each starting a floating plant. So, it is time to re-set it, with some new, smaller plants. 

Today I visited my local big nursery and browsed the "indoor plants" area, where I picked up 3 new plants ($12 total). One is a very small Maidenhair fern, just to try that one again. One is a Begonia "Purity", a smaller leaf begonia. And the last is a nice looking Radermachera sinica "China Doll Plant", which I now know isn't likely to do well. But, here they are:









I need to wash off the soil, soak them to kill off any insect pests, and plant them tomorrow. In preparation I cleaned out my nursery tank, the one in the background above, to get rid of plants I will never use again, and allow room to do more of what I intended the tank for - experimenting.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey Hoppy I got a flower from another different _Hymenocallis_ and it's pretty awesome. This one is _H. traubii_. I haven't bloomed this one yet before, but I have had it for a couple of years. Here is a picture that I got two nights ago. This first bloom has already started to shrivel up, but the second opened last night and is still crisp and white and perfect.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

As beautiful as those lilies are, and they are one of the most beautiful flowers I can recall seeing, lilies are not ideal for ripariums in the long haul. The folliage is just average, except mine tended to get too long and droop at times, and you go a long time before and after you get a bloom, with nothing happening. If you have room to keep the non-blooming ones in a nursery setting, and only add them to the riparium for their short blooming time, they are perfect. But, I lack that kind of room or dedication.

I'm just moving along trying new plants just to see how they work out, enjoying that process, and really enjoying the periods when the riparium just looks "perfect". Like any living thing ripariums go through cycles - sort of like my hair?


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## RipariumGuy (Aug 6, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> I'm just moving along trying new plants just to see how they work out, enjoying that process, and really enjoying the periods when the riparium just looks "perfect". Like any living thing ripariums go through cycles - sort of like my hair?


I agree. My tank seems to go through cycles also. Has anybody tried irisis? Or strawberrys? :icon_mrgr I have seen strawberrys in aeoroponics setups, but I don't know if that is really diffrent compared to ripariums.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I removed all of my massively overgrown plants today, all of which have been entertaining me ever since I started this riparium. But, now I like it much better with the new plants, with more light getting into the below water area. This photo has no adjustments to equalize the lighting - it really is pretty well equalized now.

More pics:


















I think the maidenhair fern is going to make it this time. There were a couple of new fronds starting when I first planted it, and they are 3 inches long and opening up now. Nothing is wilting on it either. The "secret" is to not wash off 100% of the dirt on the roots, just so the roots are an obvious mass of roots, but lots of dirt particles left mixed in. I suspect this damages the roots a lot less. But, the real secret may be that this plant was in much better condition when I bought it, than the first one I got.

The begonia and the China Doll plant, which filled two planters, are both in very good shape too, after their brief stay in my nursery tank. No wilting on any of them.


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## jmhart (Mar 14, 2008)

This continues to look great!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

That's looking great Hoppy. Is that prayer plant growing in there?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Yes, the Prayer Plant is on the left side at the front. That's because I learned about one problem with a magnetic supported planter. It is very difficult to install one on the back of a fully filled tank, which has a light hanging above it, and is only about 3 inches from the wall, plus is pretty tall. I couldn't figure out how to hold the planter, while still sliding the magnet down the back into position. One day when I'm feeling very ambidextrous I will give it another try.

The Prayer Plant seems poised to grow very well, too. I think it will be a success as a riparium plant.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

My new plant additions are doing very well. The begonia is slowly growing, looking very healthy. The China Doll, Radermachera sinica, looks especially good, lots of new shoots. And, even the Maidenhair fern, Adiantum?, is looking very good.

Early this spring, once it got reasonably warm, I planted my Spider Lily outdoors in my square foot garden box. It now looks very healthy and growing, so I'm thinking of returning it to the riparium. I see no signs yet of new bulbs developing, but they could be hidden underground. It will soon start hitting 100F temperature outdoors, and in the sun, even hotter, so I'm reluctant to leave this outdoors.


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## idontknow (May 9, 2008)

Love the new plants......got any new full tank shots? Looking for some ideas for mine I'm setting up.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Here is a full tank shot, but my full tank shots always disappoint me. I think that's because I look at individual plants and groupings when I look at it, not at the whole tank.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

This setup has matured wonderfully. I love this view right here.



Hoppy said:


>


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> This setup has matured wonderfully. I love this view right here.


That view is the first thing I look at every time I look closely at the tank. Only later do I notice the fish. Eventually I will want to separate the fern more from the China Doll plant, so the fern shows up better. But, for now I'm happy with it this way.


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## Minsc (Jul 9, 2006)

Hoppy said:


> Here is a full tank shot, but my full tank shots always disappoint me. I think that's because I look at individual plants and groupings when I look at it, not at the whole tank.[/QUOTE]
> 
> That is the way it works, looking at a picture of your tank is the best way to find all its shortcomings and become disappointed in what you had been proud of minutes ago...
> 
> ...


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## Minsc (Jul 9, 2006)

What is the plant with the small round leaves on the right side? It is on a raft in front of the grassy looking plant.

I think I have some of that on my windowsill, and it has always been one of my favorites.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Minsc said:


> What is the plant with the small round leaves on the right side? It is on a raft in front of the grassy looking plant.
> 
> I think I have some of that on my windowsill, and it has always been one of my favorites.


I'm not sure what it is. I bought it at a nursery, in the "indoor plants" area. It looks like a Pilea, but I haven't figured out which one, if it is.

When I look at my tanks I almost never see the planter cups at all. I have to specifically look at them to even realize they are there. This is a disadvantage in that anything going wrong in one doesn't get seen by me until it has developed into a problem, but it makes the "scene" in the tank look great.

The rafts are harder for me to avoid seeing. I have one covered with moss, and nothing else, so the rubber isn't visible at all, but it still shows as a raft, not a natural planting. The best I have been able to do is use moss and small stem plants on the raft. The stem plants then distract attention from the raft, and the moss effectively hides what would be visible of the raft. But, in general moss has disappointed me as a raft plant - it grows very well, but doesn't look much different from a bad algae splotch, because the individual plantlets of moss don't stick up, they just lie there looking like slime. Maybe I'm just having an anti-moss moment though:icon_mrgr


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Minsc said:


> What is the plant with the small round leaves on the right side? It is on a raft in front of the grassy looking plant.
> 
> I think I have some of that on my windowsill, and it has always been one of my favorites.


I'm not sure what it is. I bought it at a nursery, in the "indoor plants" area. It looks like a Pilea, but I haven't figured out which one, if it is.

When I look at my tanks I almost never see the planter cups at all. I have to specifically look at them to even realize they are there. This is a disadvantage in that anything going wrong in one doesn't get seen by me until it has developed into a problem, but it makes the "scene" in the tank look great.

The rafts are harder for me to avoid seeing. I have one covered with moss, and nothing else, so the rubber isn't visible at all, but it still shows as a raft, not a natural planting. The best I have been able to do is use moss and small stem plants on the raft. The stem plants then distract attention from the raft, and the moss effectively hides what would be visible of the raft. But, in general moss has disappointed me as a raft plant - it grows very well, but doesn't look much different from a bad algae splotch, because the individual plantlets of moss don't stick up, they just lie there looking like slime. Maybe I'm just having an anti-moss moment though:icon_mrgr


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## idontknow (May 9, 2008)

Thanks for posting up that full shot  looks good!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Just finished some cleaning and replanting. I'm really happy with the big adiantum fern now. Of course it is only a matter of a few months before it will be too big, but maybe I can prune it back then.


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

holy java fern....


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## RipariumGuy (Aug 6, 2009)

over_stocked said:


> holy java fern....


Amen! :icon_surp That thing is beast! Is that a Taro I see? I really like the look of them.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Yes, my needleleaf Java Fern is gradually growing to fill the entire tank. I suppose some day I will need to do some heavy pruning of it, and who knows what strange critters now live in there??? 

The Taro plant, Colocasia fallax "Silver Dollar", is about a 3rd or 4th generation shoot of the original one I got from Hydrophyte, and I have a shoot of it growing in my nursery tank too, just floating for now. Once those get started good they can send runners clear across the tank, looking for good lighting to send up more leaves. Then, the plant finally gets too big to keep. But, by then you realize that it should be called a Rabbit Plant.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Hoppy said:


>


That's all looking great Hoppy. That _Adiantum_ fern sure has grown well for you. That one would be awesome for filling up much of the background of a layout and then with a few other midground plants as accents. What is that thing with the patterned leaves right to the left of the fern?

So it sounds like you _C. fallax_ taro has just kept growing and growing all along(?). Mine always go dormant in the wintertime. Maybe it is because our house gets to be cold enough that it triggers dormancy(?).


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The two spotted plants are Maranta leuconeura, prayer plant, and Fittonia verschaffeltii, silver nerve plant, down at the bottom of it on a raft. The Fittonia is a very good plant, because it is slow growing, does very well on a raft, and cuttings start quickly on another raft. 

I found another of those Adiantum fern plants in a 2" pot, and now have it in my nursery tank to be sure it will grow like this one before I put it in one of my two big tanks. For some reason I seem to find those as an isolated single plant on a shelf of other plants.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I like Fittonia a lot too. They are real easy and stay nice and compact. Some of the other things that I have tried on rafts start to grow leggy after a while. I think you might have been the one who discovered Fittonia(?).

So has the Maranta been growing well and with good root development?


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## JoraaÑ (Jun 29, 2009)

Nice tank Hoppy!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> I like Fittonia a lot too. They are real easy and stay nice and compact. Some of the other things that I have tried on rafts start to grow leggy after a while. I think you might have been the one who discovered Fittonia(?).
> 
> So has the Maranta been growing well and with good root development?


I think I was the first to use Fittonia, back when I spotted it at a nursery and it looked like a "budding star":icon_cool

My Maranta looks good, is growing nice and slowly, but it is still too soon to say whether it is growing good roots. None, or very few are visible yet. I have noticed that some plants will look great for a few months, apparently doing very well, then suddenly give up and quit completely. Those usually have very poor root development when I study them after I remove them from the planter. So, its easy to jump to a premature conclusion about how well some of the plants are doing.


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## Casie (Jun 8, 2010)

This tank is beautiful Hoppy!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Thank you Joraan and Casie! 

I just looked more carefully at my Maranta. It is doing better than I thought. There are lots of new roots growing in the planter, visible through the back, and about 3 long roots extending out of the bottom. I just didn't see them before. The new growth is of smaller leaves than the original ones, possibly due to the low light level I use. But, it clearly is going to adapt to riparium living.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Does anyone use these, Lysimachia nummularia 'Aurea' (Golden creeping Jenny), http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-shop/115654-fs-2-bunches-portions-new-species.html in their riparium? I'm tempted, since they are emersed grown, so would start life with a plus. I'm pretty sure I have seen these in someone's riparium here.


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## idontknow (May 9, 2008)

Hoppy said:


> Does anyone use these, Lysimachia nummularia 'Aurea' (Golden creeping Jenny), http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/swap-n-shop/115654-fs-2-bunches-portions-new-species.html in their riparium? I'm tempted, since they are emersed grown, so would start life with a plus. I'm pretty sure I have seen these in someone's riparium here.


I thought I remember someone in the rip forums on APE saying they had a golden colored creeping jenny. Love that beast of a java fern tank looks fantastic!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Luke had a creeping jenny going in his setup and it covered the whole water surface.


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## macclellan (Dec 22, 2006)

Lookin' good!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

hydrophyte said:


> Luke had a creeping jenny going in his setup and it covered the whole water surface.


Yes, now I remember. Well, I'm ready to try another "noxious weed" in mine, so I ordered some. :icon_smil The fact that it is grown emersed is what sold me - when I tried a little bit that was from someone's tank, grown submersed, I had no luck with it.


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## familyman03 (Jun 16, 2010)

Wow!!! You have inspired my wife and I to give this a try thank you for the info and pictures. What site do you get your planters at?


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## luke20037 (Jan 24, 2010)

yeah defianitly the creeping jenny hopppy! Since I moved the tank I have had to cut it right back but it has doubled size in two weeks its such a fast grower!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Thank you Luke, I went ahead and order a couple of bunches of it on Swap n Shop. If I have to trim it every 2 weeks I may not be happy, but I have wanted to try it for some time now. The cuttings of it that I got, which were submersed grown, refused to grow at all in my ripariums.

Did you plant it in a planter cup or just use a nano trellis raft?


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## luke20037 (Jan 24, 2010)

I planted in a planter cup and let it grow on a raft, mine was emmersed grown and brought from a lfs that stocks marginal plants for ponds.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I will try it in both a planter cup or two and on a nano trellis raft. Most stem plants can grow quite awhile without a substrate. You know if we didn't have problems with some riparium plants we could never try new ones? The tank would just fill up and we would have to choose between dumping some for new ones, or keeping the same look forever!


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

I imagine that creeping jenny will do best rooted in a planter and with a pretty rich gravel substrate. It has a lot of roots.


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## luke20037 (Jan 24, 2010)

Hoppy said:


> I will try it in both a planter cup or two and on a nano trellis raft. Most stem plants can grow quite awhile without a substrate. You know if we didn't have problems with some riparium plants we could never try new ones? The tank would just fill up and we would have to choose between dumping some for new ones, or keeping the same look forever!


tell me about it! I have tried so many plants, but then again thats all part of the fun and excitement!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Just a progress report. I tore down my 45 gallon riiparium, combined the best plants from it with the best from this one, plus a couple from my nursery tank, and this is the result. I had to do something because the maidenhair fern I had in here had grown so big it filled almost the entire tank! I couldn't even see some of its companion plants any more. Now, it looks great again. 

What appears to be Riccia began growing on one of my rafts several months ago. I just left it alone to see what it would do. It now covers that raft and is creeping across the water. It is the light green raft you can see in the middle of the tank.

The two syngoniums are doing very well now. But, when I removed my African violet from the 45 gallon tank I found that, as healthy as the plant looked and as much as it had grown, it had virtually no roots at all. Just a stub of a "trunk" poked into the gravel in the planter cup. When I moved it, it fell out. I euthanized it! That experiment failed.

The creeping jenny is doing very well too. And, it isn't growing fast enough to become a nuisance.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

That's too bad about the African violet. One of my favorites. They're picky about watering, though, so it doesn't surprise me.

The tank is really lovely, Hoppy.


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## Da Plant Man (Apr 7, 2010)

This tank is amazing!


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## RipariumGuy (Aug 6, 2009)

Tank looks great Hoppy! The same thing happened with my Syngonium as with your violet: It looked great until the day I moved it and found that all the roots where rotting! I guess that it is a hit or miss when converting house plants.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

I think in riparium with fertilized water, the plant doesn't need roots too badly. Just short ones will suffice. So, that might explain why some grow well, but never really grow roots. Of course, other plants grow enormous root systems in a riparium, and at least one of my syngoniums seems to be doing that. The prayer plant did it too, but the top died back on that one. It's compost now.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

Wow this is looking fantastic Hoppy.

What is that emersed mossy bright green stuff right in the middle?

It looks like that left-most plant and the pink one are both syngoniums. They have grown really well in there. What kind of root development do those two plants have? Do they have lots of roots?

Hey Hoppy do you still have those palms going in riparium planters? I have been researching palms suitable for growing in ripariums. There are some water-associated species that could be especially good selections.


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## NeuRon (Feb 6, 2011)

This is great! I do like that fern in the middle (Maidenhair, you say?) And, of course, the ricia raft is awesome.

And, Hydro, you say the one on the left is likely a syngonium? I like that alot too. 

What's the plant in the right corner?


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The light green mossy stuff appears to be riccia, which started as a tiny piece on a moss raft. Yes, I have two different color syngoniums, and both are doing very well, with good roots growing out into the water, but not the enormous root systems I have seen on some other plants. 

The fern I now have is one of these http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/plants/113718-riparium-plants-home-depot.html and I still don't know its name. It sends our a horizontal rhizome and the individual leaf is bigger than my hand, perhaps 10 inches across, with multiple "fingers". The leaves get bigger as the plant gets older. 

The plant in the right corner is a cyperus, one of the original ones I got from Hydrophyte, or at lease an offshoot of one of them.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

i love the tank hoppy, i love how it is half water half not, whatever that word is.

love it!!!!!!!!!!


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

The riparium is gorgeous, Hoppy!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

Thank you, Sewingalot. Ripariums are pretty easy to make look great, once you have the planters, and make a few trips to a local store selling house plants. I have found this to be perhaps the most rewarding way to use an aquarium.


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## luke20037 (Jan 24, 2010)

any updates on this tank?!


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## BradH (May 15, 2008)

I don't know how I missed this thread, but glad it got bumped up today. Amazing Hoppy!!


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

The update is that I have torn down the tank. At the moment there is a high probability that I will be moving in the next 2-3 months, so I'm shutting down my tanks to make it doable. One left to go.


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## luke20037 (Jan 24, 2010)

good luck with the move!


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Hoppy this tank is very pleasing to the eye and well planned, good work. I do have a couple of questions, how does the black "Fusion" paint hold up and is this the first time you've used it on submerged pvc? How are you able to clean the intakes and exhausts made from pvc.

I noticed some very shaded areas in the bottom of the tank where a Aponogeton, Madagascar Lace might do well, just a thought.


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## hydrophyte (Mar 1, 2009)

This setup had some great plants in it.



Hoppy said:


>


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## TankZen (Jan 31, 2011)

Love this tank!! Any updates?


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## luke20037 (Jan 24, 2010)

Hoppy said:


> The update is that I have torn down the tank. At the moment there is a high probability that I will be moving in the next 2-3 months, so I'm shutting down my tanks to make it doable. One left to go.


theres your update!


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