# Hyzer's 40G Breeder - CRS + Slow Growers



## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

_*Updated 3/7/15*_

*Equipment:*
-40g breeder
-36" Catalina 3x T5HO - I only use the middle bulb for a couple hours mid day
-Eheim 2217, two Koralia nanos - I would recommend a larger filter for this size tank
-10lb. CO2 cylinder, Concoa regulator, Burkert solenoid, Ideal metering valve, Cerges (whole house filter) reactor
-Hydor inline heater w/ Finnex controller

*Flora:*
-Staurogyne repens
-Alternanthera reineckii
-Hygrophila sp. Araguaia
-Pogostemon Erectus
-Rotala 'Green'
-Rotala 'Colorata'
-Limnophila aromatica
-Downoi (Pogostemon helferi)
-Ludwigia 'Rubin'
-Ludwigia inclinata var. verticillata 'Cuba' - my nemesis
-Blyxa japonica
-Persicaria 'Kawagoeanum
-Cryptocoryne pontederiifolia
-Rotala Mexicana 'Goias'

*Fauna:*
-Gold tetras
-Glowlight tetras
-Aeneus corydoras
-Otocinclus 
-Nerite snail
-Pond snails
-Malaysian trumpet snails

*Algae:*
A little bit of almost every kind

*Updated pic 3/6/15*









I'm getting settled in after our cross-country move, so I figured I would get this tank rolling again.

Just a couple small changes in equipment: new stand (smaller rivet rack) and flip top legs for my light fixture. The movers managed to lose the corner posts to my old stand, so I picked up another inexpensive but strong rivet rack. I really like how the 40 is a perfect fit on this new rack. I may add wooden siding somewhere down the line to be a bit more stylish.

The new light fixture legs were necessary because the drywall is very thin in my new place. I didn't feel comfortable hanging the light using my previous method, even with toggle bolts. I wanted at least some of the convenience of my ratcheting pulley system from before so I went with the flip top.

Most of the plants made it, but my crypts (except parva) and mosses are really hurting. At least some of them seem to be making a comeback. I planted everything to just grow for now, I will eventually try to make it look good. Here's a pic from tonight:










Old thread:
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals-photo-album/118012-hyzers-40-gallon-breeder.html

I learned A LOT about this hobby with this tank, so I hope to improve.

Thanks for checking it out. I'll try to keep this thread updated.

_Update October 2013_


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## i'm a ninja (Aug 2, 2009)

What happened to the driftwood? It looked fantastic in the old set-ups


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

i'm a ninja said:


> What happened to the driftwood? It looked fantastic in the old set-ups


I saved that piece and plan on using it again somewhere. Not sure If I want to try a dutch style with this one. If I go dutch, I will use that manzy in a 29g with low light intensity.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I decided to see what type of plants I can grow in this new (softer) water. I've noticed that the Rotala butterfly grows much more quickly and has larger leaves, which gives me hope that I can pick up some more exotic stems for this tank.

I've always drooled over the densely planted and colorful dutch tanks, so I thought I would give it a try. I know it looks bare at the moment. Lots of growing, trimming, and planting to do.:biggrin:


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

:bounce: I've been waiting for you setup tanks again! :bounce:

What is your water parameters here, you mentioned it's softer, do you know what it is? Tank is growing in nicely, and I can't wait to see it in a few weeks.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

sewingalot said:


> :bounce: I've been waiting for you setup tanks again! :bounce:
> 
> What is your water parameters here, you mentioned it's softer, do you know what it is? Tank is growing in nicely, and I can't wait to see it in a few weeks.


Hey Sara!

GH~5-6
KH~4
Ph~7


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

We have almost the same parameters, my kh is usually 3 - 4 and Gh varies 6 - 9 throughout the year. I suspect you'll be able to grow darn near everything. I had tonias, erios and other plants that are 'soft water plants' grow great. I think you'll be pleased, really.


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## urbguy (Sep 24, 2009)

Awesome start already! So jealous you decided on a style, I'm having difficulty. I have to say I've heard Dutch style is a pain but when you get it right, it's wonderful. But after seeing your last tank, I have no doubts you'll create a wonderful tank.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

sewingalot said:


> We have almost the same parameters, my kh is usually 3 - 4 and Gh varies 6 - 9 throughout the year. I suspect you'll be able to grow darn near everything. I had tonias, erios and other plants that are 'soft water plants' grow great. I think you'll be pleased, really.


Yeah, I'm excited to see what I can grow. Just got a new job, so I should be able to afford some cool ones.



urbguy said:


> Awesome start already! So jealous you decided on a style, I'm having difficulty. I have to say I've heard Dutch style is a pain but when you get it right, it's wonderful. But after seeing your last tank, I have no doubts you'll create a wonderful tank.


Thanks for the kind words. Since I first started googling "planted aquarium" I have been in love with dutch tanks. I am ready to keep up on the trimming and dosing, plus the softer water should help.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I don't have a picture of it, but the Microsword is starting to send out some runners. It grows much more slowly than I remember.

The Rotala Rotundifolia responded well to it's first trim.











I'm really excited that the Rotala Butterfly is staying healthy. Soon I should have enough stems for a thick red bunch. I'm hoping the Stellatus handles it's first trim well. Sunset Hygro is growing how it usually does for me: nice and...white.










The Ludwigia Glandulosa is showing a tiny bit of color and the leaves seem to be growing more healthily in this water.




























For this photo session, I used the "Aquarium" setting on my point-n-shoot. I think the pictures look quite a bit less faded. In photoshop, duplicating layers, multiplying, and adjusting opacity helped with the brightness. Thanks for checking out my pics.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Looking great man. Exciting to be able to grow all those nice stems. Many years ago I lived in an area with extremely soft water, so for me it went the other way. I even managed to kill your glandulosa :icon_mad:
Nice images too, we never got around to Photoshop together.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Looking great man. Exciting to be able to grow all those nice stems. Many years ago I lived in an area with extremely soft water, so for me it went the other way. I even managed to kill your glandulosa :icon_mad:
> Nice images too, we never got around to Photoshop together.


I'm definitely stoked to have med-soft water now.

What happened to the glandulosa? Last time I saw it in your tank it looked healthy. I can send you more whenever you want some. Any plant you'd like to try. 

I'm missing Cali a bit. Hopefully I can get back there for some brew and T's PhotoShop Course sometime in the near future. Maybe we can tweak the color in my pics to make my sunset look like yours, haha.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Trimmed the back row last week and things are starting to fill in again. I think I am going to let everything grow all the way out this time.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Micro bubbles created by the atomic diffuser have always bothered me, so I decided to test out the inexpensive Ista Mix Max (12"). It is about 2x as loud as my 2217 so I'm not sure if it is right for an open stand.

I may just go ahead and finally build myself a PVC inline or try running this Ista without the impellers if the noise continues to bother me.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Tank looks awesome. Is that the bronze wendtii? Looks awesome, very bullous or whatever that's called.



Hyzer said:


> What happened to the glandulosa? Last time I saw it in your tank it looked healthy. I can send you more whenever you want some. Any plant you'd like to try.


What happened... I touched it. :icon_roll Cut off the long stem and replanted, never recovered after that. But hey, the SS Hygro still looks great. Thanks for the offer, but I am slowly growing out of my collectoritis (by losing plants here and there).:smile:



Hyzer said:


> I'm missing Cali a bit. Hopefully I can get back there for some brew and T's PhotoShop Course sometime in the near future. Maybe we can tweak the color in my pics to make my sunset look like yours, haha.


Let me know when you are in the area, you need to visit your fish... Regarding brew, got an Irish Red that turned out really tasty, and just ordered stuff to make a Kolsch, a Cali Steam, and a Maibock, so no fear of running out anytime soon. :fish:


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Tank looks awesome. Is that the bronze wendtii? Looks awesome, very bullous or whatever that's called.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, I'm pretty sure it is bronze wendtii. Unfortunately I bought it from a big name petstore a while ago and they didn't have it labeled.

Sorry about your glandulosa, but like you said it might be for the better.

I will definitely let you know when I come to Cali. Look forward to sampling some brews.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I decided to see what would happen if I brought the middle bulb on my fixture back for five hours. Too soon to tell.

I'm used to the Ista reactor noise. It is actually kinda soothing if I don't have to pee.

The background is starting to fill in, but the middle needs some work. I'm a bit worried about the butterfly rotala. It's just.... delicate.


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

Hahaha on the pee comment. If my tank water drops even slightly, I have that issue. Good reminder.  I like the tank a lot better without the glandulosa. Good move, even if it wasn't on purpose.


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## madness (Jul 31, 2011)

Where/how did you get those cool flip back legs or whatever for the light fixture and would they work on other fixtures?

They look sort of like the ones on the Zoomedic T5HO fixtures.

edit: it also appears that they would prevent the use of the standard Aqueon glass tops, is that correct?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

I admire your discipline - not a single fish that I can spot. That way you can bomb the tank with CO2 and other ferts, not bad. How is your Cherry situation these days?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> I admire your discipline - not a single fish that I can spot. That way you can bomb the tank with CO2 and other ferts, not bad. How is your Cherry situation these days?


It's funny you should say that... I visited a pet/pond shop in the middle of nowhere today. The owner builds display tanks all over the country and has a couple really cool ones in his shop. I've never had Bloodfin tetras before so I decided to give them a try. So much for disciprine...










The only shrimp I have are three Amanos in my other tank. I do want to keep Cherries again but I didn't feel like a high light/CO2 tank that I am constantly needing to trim would suit them best. I think I will end up adding them to the lower light 29g.



madness said:


> Where/how did you get those cool flip back legs or whatever for the light fixture and would they work on other fixtures?
> 
> They look sort of like the ones on the Zoomedic T5HO fixtures.
> 
> edit: it also appears that they would prevent the use of the standard Aqueon glass tops, is that correct?


I got the flip top legs from the company who built the fixture, Catalina Aquariums. Unfortunately I can't tell you whether they are compatible with other fixtures. I can take pictures of whatever you might be curious about though, so feel free to ask.

You are correct, these legs would not work with a standard glass top without some customization.


sewingalot said:


> Hahaha on the pee comment. If my tank water drops even slightly, I have that issue. Good reminder.  I like the tank a lot better without the glandulosa. Good move, even if it wasn't on purpose.


Are you talking about the Glandulosa on the right hand side? That is still there. Or maybe the removal of the majority of crypts in the middle?


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

The crypts in the center. I was reading about your glandulosa melting and didn't finish my thoughts and meshed them both together it appears. I am thinking I need to start reading my comments again before hitting "post quick reply." LOL


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

sewingalot said:


> The crypts in the center. I was reading about your glandulosa melting and didn't finish my thoughts and meshed them both together it appears. I am thinking I need to start reading my comments again before hitting "post quick reply." LOL


The glandulosa has actually been doing much better with these water parameters. Only the leaves on the very bottom are dying off, as opposed to all of them from the mid point of the stem and down.


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## Doc7 (Apr 7, 2011)

Looking forward to updated pics on this thread.

How's your flow in this tank? I'm 6 months in, with 2 Eheim 2217s on my 40B, and still messing around with how to set up the spray bars for good flow distribution without having either dead spots OR spots where the plants are blown sideways, which is very distracting to the viewer as well as not very attractive.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Doc7 said:


> Looking forward to updated pics on this thread.
> 
> How's your flow in this tank? I'm 6 months in, with 2 Eheim 2217s on my 40B, and still messing around with how to set up the spray bars for good flow distribution without having either dead spots OR spots where the plants are blown sideways, which is very distracting to the viewer as well as not very attractive.


Sadly I've kinda put this tank on the backburner. I made a few poor decisions:

-I switched the way I dissolve CO2 and don't think I got the level where it needs to be again.
-I went with a foreground that doesn't quite fit. Microsword is awesome, but I don't think it's right for this tank.
-I removed the powerhead in the back right corner and probably left it lacking circulation. Right now I'm watching oxygen bubbles float directly upwards (just did water change).
-I did not take my time in researching and choosing fish. I made a rushed decision and it was the wrong one. Never again....

I still dose, trim, and do water changes, but I'm just not in to it. The plants are kinda straggly looking. I'd much rather watch my low light with CPDs, Fire Reds, and Amanos.

The good news is that I can change everything but the fish, unless I get another tank for them.


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## Doc7 (Apr 7, 2011)

you can also post them on swap-n-shop or even Craigslist, and other boards swap -n-shops like A-Central


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I added a piece of wood, moved plants around, boosted my CO2, added some willisi and parva, and put a powerhead in the corner. Also got some Giesemann bulbs a couple weeks back to help get me motivated. I really want to be satisfied with this tank some time in the near future.

Still having trouble with my butterfly and wallichii. More CO2 helps, but it is still just straggly looking.

I am also learning a bit more about shooting in manual mode with my point n shoot. Didn't have to adjust the brightness in photoshop this time.


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## BS87 (Apr 9, 2012)

Gratuitous bump, but I have a question about your rivet stand. I've might have missed it in the previous thread, but where did you pick this up from? It's almost exactly what i'm looking for.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

BS87 said:


> Gratuitous bump, but I have a question about your rivet stand. I've might have missed it in the previous thread, but where did you pick this up from? It's almost exactly what i'm looking for.


Either Lowe's or Home Heapo. I just took my tape measure and was lucky enough to find one that fit perfectly. Make sure you put in the rear and side beams for extra stability in the middle.


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## BS87 (Apr 9, 2012)

Hyzer said:


> Either Lowe's or Home Heapo. I just took my tape measure and was lucky enough to find one that fit perfectly. Make sure you put in the rear and side beams for extra stability in the middle.


Thank you! I will hunt there in the future. The stand looks perfect for the 40B


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I have been busy buying up plants in preparation for a colorful dutch tank. Thank you to all the awesome sellers here on TPT. Now I'll see which of these stems like my tank.

Few changes:

-Ditched the driftwood. I decided to stick with my original plan.
-I got rid of the cheapo reactor and went back to misting. Also dealt with a check valve and bubble counter issue.
-Removed the microsword foreground and replaced with glosso. It is a bit leggy so far but I think a couple trims will solve this.

Tonight I'm going to work on placement. Until now I just kinda threw em in there until I had received all the packages. Here's a quick pick before I go to work. Sorry it's too dark, I didn't notice until I loaded it on my comp.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Looks just perfect on my monitor! Stems are lovely *unless your tank is too large*.

Is the compact Hygro growing slowly for you as well? I thought Hygros are supposed to be fast growers, this one is definitely not (in my tank).

Looking forward to the dutch scaping. Hope you are doing well!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Looks just perfect on my monitor! Stems are lovely *unless your tank is too large*.
> 
> Is the compact Hygro growing slowly for you as well? I thought Hygros are supposed to be fast growers, this one is definitely not (in my tank).
> 
> Looking forward to the dutch scaping. Hope you are doing well!


 I didn't think about my monitors color settings. Now that I look at it on my phone it doesn't look too dark.

The compact does grow very slowly and bushy in this tank. It is more likely to throw out side stems than grow vertically. In my lower light EBI it is growing upwards with perfectly smooth teardrop leaves. It must prefer less light.

I too am looking forward to figuring out this whole dutch thing. I need to propogate more stems from my new plants to really figure out placement.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Even thought I have just a few stems of some of these, I put together an updated plant list. Really enjoying the new ones. Hopefully they will stay healthy... the CO2 is blasting.

Blyxa alternifolia
Eriocaulon parkeri 
Glossostigma elatinoides 
Hygrophila Araguaia 
Hygrophila Corymbosa var Compact 
Limnophila 'Wavy' 
Ludwigia glandulosa 
Ludwigia inclinata 'Pantanal'
Ludwigia repens 
Ludwigia 'Rubin'
Ludwigia senegalensis 
Persicaria 'Kawagoeanum'
Persicaria praetermissa
Pogostemon erectus 
Pogostemon stellatus 'Narrow'
Rotala macrandra 'Japan Red'
Rotala rotundifolia 
Syngonanthus 'Belem'


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

The new growth seems to be doing well, minus the Pantanal, which is just kind of surviving. I'm really excited to see the mac 'Japan Red' growing well because I've never had any luck with macrandas. I still don't have placement down, but I think I am getting closer to my ultimate goal. We'll see what I can do when I have a dozen or so of each of the new stems.

Nitrate levels were high when I tested this weekend (30-40ppm), which might have to do with a recent big trim and disturbing the small amount of Osmocote I have in the substrate. I'm going to lean out on dosing KNO3 for a bit to try to keep it in the 5-10 ppm range. Some say this will help color pop, others say it will just stress the plants unnecessarily. I'll see what works for me.

Full tank shot. The Glosso in the middle just got a hefty trim so it is very thin looking. I'm hoping the trim will encourage more horizontal growth.









I really like the thick bushy look the Rotala rotundifolia gets after a few trims. Just ignore the photobombers...









The Persicaria 'Kawagoeanum' (had to paste that name in there:icon_eek is becoming one of my favorites.









Some L. glandulosa, Pogo eructus, and red repens.









Some Rotala macranda 'Japan Red' looking not all that red, but healthy.


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Nice job! I love the Dutch look and have liked just about everything youve done to this 40B. That Japan red is an oddly named plant if you asked me. Its green and red. The red is just a deeper hue of red than the regular mac red. I have both and yours looks pretty typical of Japan red.


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## ghotifish (Feb 16, 2009)

Nice tank, looks like its just about to really blast off! Your plants all look very healthy and the scape is looking really nice. 

Carl


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

chad320 said:


> Nice job! I love the Dutch look and have liked just about everything youve done to this 40B. That Japan red is an oddly named plant if you asked me. Its green and red. The red is just a deeper hue of red than the regular mac red. I have both and yours looks pretty typical of Japan red.


Appreciate it Chad. Nice to hear that the growth is pretty typical. Any advice on the L. Pantanal? I know you have grown just about everything.



ghotifish said:


> Nice tank, looks like its just about to really blast off! Your plants all look very healthy and the scape is looking really nice.
> 
> Carl


Thanks Carl. I feel like it is about to come together as well. Just need to wait for more growth and shuffle things around a bit.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I was reading up on L. Pantanal and from what I gather it is very particular about CO2. When I first started using my mister again I almost gassed the fish after leaving home for a few hours. Thought I only dialed it back slightly but I guess not. It is difficult to tell the difference between 4, 5, and 6+ bps. After work I will go ahead and bump it up a bit.


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Fish can acclimate over time with it too. If you had it set for a few weeks you can usually nudge it up a bubble w/o the fish knowing  I wish I had some advice to give on the Pantanal, unfortunately, I dont. Mine only did well when it was close to the light, it got pretty smothered otherwise, and lost its lower leaves.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

A few things have seemed to improve growth on some of my picky plants (Pantanal, L. senegalensis, S. 'Belem').

I finally came to my senses about trying to keep Nitrate levels down to improve color. I want healthy plants, not colorful starved plants. Wasserpest, Plantbrain, and other experts have been schooling us on this subject all along.

A few weeks ago I stopped tossing dry ferts directly in the tank. Now I mix with tank water in a cup, let it dissolve, then pour it in. This takes more time, but it is easy to mix in the evening then dose before bed. I will probably get some larger bottles going to make it even easier.

More recently, I added a Koralia 240. With the 2217 and Aquclear 20 I think I finally have enough flow. Now I can see CO2 mist evenly distributed throughout the tank.

I am still lost when it comes to planting dutch attractively, and the Pantanal still has stunted, albeit improved, growth. This is a great way to learn though, and I'm having fun.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

I see you got rid of that Sunset Hygro... Looks very nice, can't really complain about color now. You know, for a tank like this, Flourite Black would look fantastic. :tongue: Always something to improve upon.

I am finally having some success with your Hygro compacta. None of the others in your tank would grow in this water here...


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## 2in10 (Feb 8, 2011)

Very nice tank, I have found that the Pantanal does not like nitrate in the water and soil. It does just like yours does. Also I found it does not like nitrate above 30ppm or it stunts. I found it dies off at about 50ppm.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> You know, for a tank like this, Flourite Black would look fantastic. :tongue: Always something to improve upon.


Gah, you just had to go there haha. My other two tanks have black substrate for a reason. 

My goal is to not see much of the substrate at all. Just need to keep multiplying those stems.



Wasserpest said:


> I am finally having some success with your Hygro compacta.


Nice! Which tank do you have it in? That compacta came from the owner of a small reef shop in Marina who was starting to stock some live plants before I left. He wanted to put reef intensity lighting on his planted tanks and I gave him a bit of advice. In fact, he may still be selling relatives of your Cherries.:icon_smil

Mine has nice teardrop leaves in my little shrimp tank (pictured below), but in this 40 it is a mess. I'm constantly losing lower leaves in both tanks too.














2in10 said:


> Very nice tank, I have found that the Pantanal does not like nitrate in the water and soil. It does just like yours does. Also I found it does not like nitrate above 30ppm or it stunts. I found it dies off at about 50ppm.


Thanks 2in10. It's weird that my Pantanal has started doing better with more N dosing. I was going a bit lean though.


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## BoxxerBoyDrew (Oct 16, 2005)

VERY NICE SETUP!!!

Really looking forward to seeing it grow in! Your plants look very healthy to me! Good selection of color too! 

Keep up the great work!
Drew


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## halffrozen (Nov 4, 2011)

Love, love, love your tank!

I have a 40GB as well, and I wish mine looked half of what yours looked like!!!


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Hyzer said:


> Nice! Which tank do you have it in? That compacta came from the owner of a small reef shop in Marina who was starting to stock some live plants before I left. He wanted to put reef intensity lighting on his planted tanks and I gave him a bit of advice. In fact, he may still be selling relatives of your Cherries.:icon_smil
> 
> Mine has nice teardrop leaves in my little shrimp tank (pictured below), but in this 40 it is a mess. I'm constantly losing lower leaves in both tanks too.


That's interesting. In my 36gal it just withered away. In the big tank, it took months but now it grows nicely dense green leaves. I was going to blame the lighting (lower in the small tank) but since you mention issues in your high light tank I am not sure.

I think you are talking about Picture Perfect? I was in there once. :fish1: Back then they had nothing planted yet. Maybe I should drop by there again and check it out.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

BoxxerBoyDrew said:


> VERY NICE SETUP!!!
> 
> Really looking forward to seeing it grow in! Your plants look very healthy to me! Good selection of color too!
> 
> ...


Thanks Drew. I'm looking forward to growing enough stems to make it dense.



halffrozen said:


> Love, love, love your tank!
> 
> I have a 40GB as well, and I wish mine looked half of what yours looked like!!!


Appreciate it. Have always loved the depth of this tank, glad you are reaping the benefits of of a 40 breeder as well.



Wasserpest said:


> That's interesting. In my 36gal it just withered away. In the big tank, it took months but now it grows nicely dense green leaves. I was going to blame the lighting (lower in the small tank) but since you mention issues in your high light tank I am not sure.
> 
> I think you are talking about Picture Perfect? I was in there once. :fish1: Back then they had nothing planted yet. Maybe I should drop by there again and check it out.


Sweet, I'm happy it's doing well in your big tank. How is the beast doing anyways?

Yup, Picture Perfect. I wonder if he kept going with freshwater critters and aquatic plants.

On a side note, I added some topsoil root tabs tonight from hydrophyte. I have regular Osmocote (NPK) in there but want to try something other than the little balls for micronutrients.


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## crazydaz (Mar 18, 2007)

Nice tank, Kevin! Love the new arrangement in there! Now, just leave it alone for a while and let it fill in and add to those "rows" and make them more robust!!

Nice job buddy! I will be looking for these updates from now on!


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## sewingalot (Oct 12, 2008)

Beautiful tank, Hyzer. I think it'll look great as it grows in some more. I do agree with not limiting the nitrates. Been there, done that. Had same results you did. :smile:

I've subscribed and love looking at all the updates. How are you finding the water quality in comparison to your previous home cross country?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Hey sewing! How you doing?

The water here is definitely softer, but I haven't tested it much recently. Things may have changed a bit as we are getting in to summer. 105 degrees today.:icon_redf


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Over here, it heated up to 75, but thank goodness now it's down to 67. :flick:


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Over here, it heated up to 75, but thank goodness now it's down to 67. :flick:


Man, that coastal weather sounds great right now. 10:30 PM and it's 96...


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I noticed some mangled growth this week and wondered what was going on. Turns out I had a CO2 leak in a new plastic bubble counter.:thumbsdow I made a temporary replacement with a plastic bottle and things look misty in there again.

Today I trimmed and replanted some of the faster growers and split the Erios.


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## austin.b (Feb 9, 2012)

I've been looking on the Catalina website, and can't find the light fixture. Do you think you can post a link? The tank is coming along great by the way!!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

austin.b said:


> I've been looking on the Catalina website, and can't find the light fixture. Do you think you can post a link? The tank is coming along great by the way!!


I called Catalina to place the order. They were very easy to deal with and gladly made it to my specifications. At the time I considered them fairly inexpensive too.

If you want to hang it, make sure you ask for hanging brackets to be installed. I don't use the moonlights much, but it's fun to turn off all the lights in my place and watch every once in a while.

This reminds me... not sure if I mentioned that I am trying a "noon burst" again for two hours in the middle of my lighting period. Other than that, it is just the outer bulbs. The burst may be excessive, but leggy glosso made me think I don't have as much light as I thought over this thing.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Got my first DSLR for my birthday and I've been messing around with it for a couple weeks. Thought I would add some recent tank and vacation pics to my journals.




























These are from the Tennessee Aquarium:




























Some of a family dog:


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## Williak (Jun 26, 2012)

Major bump, but what happened to this tank?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Williak said:


> Major bump, but what happened to this tank?


Starting a career, proposing, buying a house, fixing up a house, setting up a honeymoon overseas, and focusing on a promotion all shifted my attention elsewhere. Now that all of these things are falling in to place, I have more time to focus on one of my favorite hobbies.

All of my tanks stayed up with little more than fish food, evaporation top-offs, and CO2 (40g only). This tank has severely ragged overgrowth at them moment and is quite nutrient starved. Not all plants survived.

I'm going to get my 29g fixed up in the next couple weeks then start trimming and feeding the 40g properly.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Congrats, man sounds like you are seriously growing up. :flick:

Soon you'll get bored of all that house and honey stuff and be back focusing on important things like planted tanks. :fish:


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Soon you'll get bored of all that house and honey stuff and be back focusing on important things like planted tanks. :fish:


Exactly 

The biggest problem with this tank is that it is out of sight and mind most of the time. I only occupy the den a couple times a month. I need to move it to a centralized location or find more reasons to chill there. Perhaps I need some new toys in there...


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## Steezy B (Apr 19, 2013)

Hyzer said:


>


How much clearance is there between the tank and the lights?

I have a catalina fixture and the standard coralife legs don't give me enough height

thanks


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Hadn't used my D40 since Scotland so I figured I would take some pics of my tank. My attention has been drawn elsewhere lately, but the stems keep growing. I trim when needed and dose weekly.


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## tithra (Dec 1, 2012)

beautiful tank! great colors


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

tithra said:


> beautiful tank! great colors


Thanks! I think my camera gets most of the credit. I have a long ways to go before I'm happy with this tank.


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## Young (Jul 26, 2013)

Fantastic looking tank! Could you post a list of your current plants?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Young said:


> Fantastic looking tank! Could you post a list of your current plants?


Blyxa japonica
Cryptocoryne wendtii 
Cryptocoryne wendtii brown
Cryptocoryne parva
Cryptocoryne willisii
Heteranthera zosterifolia
Hygrophila Corymbosa var Compact
Ludwigia glandulosa
Ludwigia 'Rubin'
Persicaria 'Kawagoeanum'
Persicaria praetermissa
Proserpinaca palustris
Rotala rotundifolia

The plants left in here are survivors. I lost some rare plants when I stopped taking care this tank a few months ago. I left out are some random small pieces of moss and subwassertang.


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## svkr2k (Aug 24, 2010)

Hi,
Wonderful tank !
I like the simple stand you have got. Is it strong enough to hold 40g + substrate and all other contents? Surprised.
I'm also planning for a similar stand. Is itvery sturdy?
Does it shake if we try to? Or is absolutely rigid?


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## etk300ex (May 1, 2013)

Tank looks great!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

svkr2k said:


> Hi,
> Wonderful tank !
> I like the simple stand you have got. Is it strong enough to hold 40g + substrate and all other contents? Surprised.
> I'm also planning for a similar stand. Is itvery sturdy?
> Does it shake if we try to? Or is absolutely rigid?


 Absolutely rigid? No. However, I've been using this setup for three years in three different homes with varying foot traffic and floor sturdiness.

It works for me because it is almost the exact footprint of a 40 breeder and the weight is spread evenly on the frame. If I remember correctly, each shelf is rated for 700 lbs+ and I think the tank is around 450. It is certainly strong enough to handle the weight but I haven't tried shaking it hard on purpose. I have have bumped in to it a few times but it recovers well and has never given me a reason to worry.

That being said... I would not recommend this stand if you have kids because it may invite climbing and I don't know how it would stand up. Also, remember that it gets its sturdiness from the cross beams so try to spread them out as evenly as possible.

I've been wanting to cover the sides and add doors to the front for a while. Seems simple enough to do on a frame with holes all over it. Maybe I'll make that a winter project.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I've been contemplating a new light cycle that would increase viewing time and loosely simulate a natural light cycle. It seems people are doing this all the time with dimmable LED fixtures. T5HO's are getting to be old school now, but it's what I have.

I purchased a three bulb T5HO fixture mostly for the spread of the two outer bulbs over a wide tank. These outer bulbs are wired separately from the middle bulb. I experimented with the three bulb noon burst for a while, but I don't remember if it helped much.

>Current light cylce is:
7 hrs - 2 outer bulbs

>New light cycle would be:
2 hrs - 1 bulb - middle
2 hrs - 2 bulbs - outer
1 hr - 3 bulbs - middle+outer
2 hrs - 2 bulbs - outer
2 hrs - 1 bulb - middle 
--> 9 hours total

There are a few threads on this subject, but I still have some questions for those that have switched to this type of cycle. Also curious to hear from those that stay away from it for a reason other than hardware limitations.

-Do you notice healthier growth or is it strictly for a longer viewing period?
-Am I opening myself up to increased algae growth because of the extended photoperiod?
-Should my hourly plan above be adjusted?

Bulb choice for the middle bulb is important because it will fill four hours of viewing time. I know this is often personal preference, but...

-If you could only have one T5HO bulb over a colorful tank, which would you choose?


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## The Trigger (May 9, 2012)

Beautiful colors. Love the lighting


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Tank looks fantastic, congrats! Now I want to move to a soft water region...

T5 bulbs/fixtures are still good. Of course one day you will switch to LED, but until then, they will give you the most even lighting possible, plus you get a nice selection of bulbs and color temps and spectra.

Like you said, it comes down to personal preference, but if there was only one bulb, perhaps something fairly neutral like a Giesemann Midday would be a good choice. I've always had multi-bulb fixtures for that very reason, to get a mix of daylight (6500K), neutral (5000K) and plant grow (pink) bulbs with all their specific pro's and con's. Keep in mind plants don't really care as long as there is some minimum threshold that's satisfied. 

And I don't think the increased or reduced or broken up light period has much to do with algae or plant growth... other things like intensity and nutrient availability play a bigger role. One of my tanks is on a 12 hour light period (10-10) and it is pretty much algae free compared to another tank (the big one) with a shorter, staggered light period. 

In any case, you seem to keep track of parameters well, so if your changes don't work out as expected, you can further adjust them or go back to how you had it set up originally. If you don't like a 6000K bulb as it's only choice, switch it with a pink grow bulb and see what that does. Easy to do with T5 bulbs!


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## VadimShevchuk (Sep 19, 2009)

Beautiful tank! Blyxa looks awesome , like it has a golden hue to it.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Tank looks fantastic, congrats! Now I want to move to a soft water region...


Ya know, there are always some great deals on property out here... not sure your wife would be on board.:icon_smil But really, it's nice having seasons. Today there is a couple inches of snow on the ground. Weather fluctuations are good for my business but not so much yours.



Wasserpest said:


> Like you said, it comes down to personal preference, but if there was only one bulb, perhaps something fairly neutral like a Giesemann Midday would be a good choice. I've always had multi-bulb fixtures for that very reason, to get a mix of daylight (6500K), neutral (5000K) and plant grow (pink) bulbs with all their specific pro's and con's. Keep in mind plants don't really care as long as there is some minimum threshold that's satisfied.
> 
> And I don't think the increased or reduced or broken up light period has much to do with algae or plant growth... other things like intensity and nutrient availability play a bigger role. One of my tanks is on a 12 hour light period (10-10) and it is pretty much algae free compared to another tank (the big one) with a shorter, staggered light period.
> 
> In any case, you seem to keep track of parameters well, so if your changes don't work out as expected, you can further adjust them or go back to how you had it set up originally. If you don't like a 6000K bulb as it's only choice, switch it with a pink grow bulb and see what that does. Easy to do with T5 bulbs!


You are right on about the Giesemann Midday. I just messed around with a few combinations and I found the Midday bulb to be the best middle slot option. I didn't know how pleasing it would be to view the tank with lower light intensity.

I just adjusted the timers and decided on Giesemann Aquaflora (red, back) and Catalina 10k (bluish white, front) for the two outer bulbs. The Giesemann Midday (more neutral) is perfect for the middle bulb slot. We'll see how it goes.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

*The good:* I'm getting healthy growth because I'm blasting this tank with tons of CO2 and dosing strict EI now. I also have a new inhabitant: the mystery fish from my 29g. I also like my new light cycle. I actually switched to using the Aquaflora bulb in the middle slot because it compliments this tank the best.
*The bad: *There is a bit of hair algae. Could be worse.
*The ugly:* I still have a lot to learn about Dutch style scapes. I think I will try the round bush style next and plant them a couple inches away from each other. The color contrast in this current setup is also a problem. It's nice looking at healthy plants, but all put together it just doesn't quite do it for me.










Mystery fish:


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## The Trigger (May 9, 2012)

Beautiful tank hyzer!


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## GMYukonon24s (May 3, 2009)

That's a great looking tank you have there! That's a nice mystery fish!


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## BruceF (Aug 5, 2011)

I think it looks great. One of the key components of pruning is defining groups. You might want to just start there.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Thanks for the encouragement Trigger and GM.


BruceF said:


> I think it looks great. One of the key components of pruning is defining groups. You might want to just start there.


Agreed. With the exception of a few new plants, its current state is the result of my first trim after planting fresh tops. I pretty much just trimmed everything at the same height and angle. After most of these stems reach the surface, I'm going to trim once more at different heights to see what that does. Because these groups are so close together, my concern is that the taller rear bunches will shade those around it. This doesn't take in to account the growth rate of the weedy Star Grass. I guess it could use some shade.

Since I've been posting about bulb selection with my new light cycle, I thought I would share the difference between the morning + evening single bulb and mid day double bulbs. Both have their perks. Sorry if the pics are a bit dark.

Giesemann Aquaflora x1 - exposure 1/80 sec. , f/5.3









Giesemann Mid Day x1 + Zoo Med Flora Sun x1 - exposure 1/80 sec. , f/5.3


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## Cyanider (Mar 1, 2013)

Very informative journal.. and beautiful plants! How are you liking the bulb setup in your 3xT5HO fixture? I have the same fixture from Catalina minus the arms and the moonlights over a 46bf. I'm due for new bulbs and am wondering if you like the 10,000k + neutral + pinkish bulb combo. I'm currently doing 6500k on the outers and a pink bulb on the inner slot, but I'm due for new bulbs and am considering trying a different bulb combination.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Cyanider said:


> Very informative journal.. and beautiful plants! How are you liking the bulb setup in your 3xT5HO fixture? I have the same fixture from Catalina minus the arms and the moonlights over a 46bf. I'm due for new bulbs and am wondering if you like the 10,000k + neutral + pinkish bulb combo. I'm currently doing 6500k on the outers and a pink bulb on the inner slot, but I'm due for new bulbs and am considering trying a different bulb combination.


For a tank with emphasis on color, my opinion is that it doesn't get any better than Giesemann Aquaflora + Giesemann Midday. I ditched the 10k because even when combined with the Zoo Med pink bulb things just looked bleached out.

I ended up with this lighting after trying all combinations:
2 hrs Aqualfora
2 hrs Midday + Zoo Med pink
1 hr Aquaflora + Midday + Zoo Med pink
2 hrs Midday + Zoo Med pink
2 hrs Aqualfora

At first I thought the Aquaflora bulb was just a pink bulb but there really is a difference between it and the Zoo Med.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

It's a challenge to not mess around with this tank but I would like to grow everything in the back row to the surface before meddling again. I think its last trim was mid February.

I temporarily planted some new species wherever there was room. I'm going to see how they grow then find a better spot if they like my tank. This only contributes to the cluttered look.

Eventually I will live up to the "dutch" in my title. I'll post a pic before my next trim/arrangement.


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## boxboy (Jun 1, 2013)

Awesome tank! Caint wait to see some new photos.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

boxboy said:


> Awesome tank! Caint wait to see some new photos.


Thanks! I trimmed the tops off and rearranged last week. I'll hopefully have some time this weekend to take and post some pics.

I'm really liking the added support and cover on the stand. I only have one coat of black stain on there because I didn't want to stink up the place with family visiting. One thing I'd like to improve is the way I mount the front panel on. There must be a way to make locking it in to place on all four corners easier while still keeping it sturdy. Right now it is a bit tedious aligning each bolt.


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## boxboy (Jun 1, 2013)

Hyzer said:


> Thanks! I trimmed the tops off and rearranged last week. I'll hopefully have some time this weekend to take and post some pics.
> 
> I'm really liking the added support and cover on the stand. I only have one coat of black stain on there because I didn't want to stink up the place with family visiting. One thing I'd like to improve is the way I mount the front panel on. There must be a way to make locking it in to place on all four corners easier while still keeping it sturdy. Right now it is a bit tedious aligning each bolt.


Something like this maybe http://m.wikihow.com/Strengthen-Self-Adhesive-Hooks
if you want lockable this will work, but you would need 2 atleast, one in each corner and it would take a while to unlock it.. http://www.highlyusa.com/pics/c1091a.jpg


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## boxboy (Jun 1, 2013)

How many lbs is your Co2 tank?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

boxboy said:


> Something like this maybe http://m.wikihow.com/Strengthen-Self-Adhesive-Hooks
> if you want lockable this will work, but you would need 2 atleast, one in each corner and it would take a while to unlock it.. http://www.highlyusa.com/pics/c1091a.jpg


That second link got me wondering. It would be a bit clunky looking though. Maybe a smaller version that doesn't lock.



boxboy said:


> How many lbs is your Co2 tank?


10lbs. Just enough height for that and a big regulator.


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## tetra10 (Aug 5, 2012)

hows the hair algae situation going?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

tetra10 said:


> hows the hair algae situation going?


There's just a strand here and there. I found the best way to remove it is twisting it on a toothbrush. It's not growing on my HC anymore so it doesn't really bother me.


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## lamiskool (Jul 1, 2011)

Love the colors of this tank! The substrate also helps the plants pop I think, great job!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Put a second coat of stain on the stand yesterday. Thought I'd share what it looks like open and covered.



















Doing a big trim today, the back looks especially messy. Thinking about ditching the Ludwigia repens altogether. May give it one more trim to see if I can get it to bush up.


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## Chris Noto (Aug 19, 2005)

Nice work on the stand. I'm thinking about a similar project for a 20 Long I've got.


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## boxboy (Jun 1, 2013)

looks great  what type of metal is that cross bar at the back?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Chris Noto said:


> Nice work on the stand. I'm thinking about a similar project for a 20 Long I've got.


Thanks Chris. It started as wanting to protect my gear from kids but I ended up really liking the end result.



boxboy said:


> looks great  what type of metal is that cross bar at the back?


I think it's galvanized steel. Found it on a random isle at Lowes.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Despite working on this tank for two and a half years, I'm still missing the mark with CO2. These plants are not growing to their full potential and I think I'm finally figuring out why. It's funny how someone who knows better will still try to blame lights and ferts, and tweak them in dozens of different ways to no avail.

My first mistake, and probably greatest, was letting the tank evaporate for a week until my next water change. At the beginning of the week I had good CO2 with insufficient O2. Since the spray bar was partially out of the tank by the end of the week, I had lots of O2 with insufficient CO2. Tanks thrive with stable and high levels of both gasses. I think the inconsistency of my water level took a toll not just on my plants but bacteria and fish as well. Moving the spray bar lower in the tank would have been unsightly and not easy with my magnetic holders. It's really not that hard to top off with a 2.5g bucket in the middle of the week. 

I also had the spray bar pointed towards the surface for aeration and to reduce surface scum. I feed a ton of CO2 (5ish [email protected] 30lb working pressure) in to a Cerges reactor connected to the 2217 output. I notice small bubbles being shot straight to the surface. I know most of of the CO2 dissolving happens in the reactor, but I think I was gassing off a lot right when it enters the tank. The powerhead provides plenty of surface agitation on its own. So, I leveled out the spray bar.

Even with a powerhead and the spray bar pointed up, I still had a bunch of surface scum until the spray bar was out of the water towards the end of the week. After watching an ADA video describing how they move lily pipes out of the water at night, I read a few threads about how important gas exchange and aeration are to planted tanks. So I picked up an Eheim 350 skimmer and plan on setting it to run while the CO2 is off. It just arrived today and I don't know how I ever lived without it. Crystal clear.:icon_smil

Couple questions:

Do you think the surface skimmer will provide enough aeration if just run at night? Any other suggestions besides an air stone?

Will the increased O2 level in the tank allow my fish to handle higher levels of CO2?


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## Capsaicin_MFK (Nov 15, 2009)

What you described is almost exactly what I was experiencing. I too ditched the L. repens after a while. I constantly had surface scum issues and I had the general feeling that my O2 was low all the time.

I think the Eheim Surface Skimmer will work out nicely for your tank though.

Overall it is a very nice looking tank.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Capsaicin_MFK said:


> What you described is almost exactly what I was experiencing. I too ditched the L. repens after a while. I constantly had surface scum issues and I had the general feeling that my O2 was low all the time.
> 
> I think the Eheim Surface Skimmer will work out nicely for your tank though.
> 
> Overall it is a very nice looking tank.


I'm liking the surface skimmer so far. At a medium flow setting it sprays a ton of micro bubbles. Then there's the crystal clear surface... so nice.

Your 75 dutch tank is inspiring. I wish I had that much room. Going to toss up some recent pics?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Limnophila aromatica is quickly becoming my favorite stem plant. I may ditch other species just to make more room for it. Haven't quite figured out how to get the bright red color out of it yet, but I'm hoping recent changes I've made to this tank will help.


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## tclancy (Jan 29, 2014)

Hyzer said:


> Limnophila aromatica is quickly becoming my favorite stem plant. I may ditch other species just to make more room for it. Haven't quite figured out how to get the bright red color out of it yet, but I'm hoping recent changes I've made to this tank will help.


I'm also trying to figure out how to get better color out of Limnophila Aromatica. It's such a cool plant. Your tank is awesome!


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## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

More light = more red on Aromatica.

v3


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

OVT said:


> More light = more red on Aromatica.
> 
> v3


Seems risky. Maybe I can try three bulbs on longer. I'll find out quickly if my CO2 is up to the challenge.


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## umarnasir335 (Mar 2, 2014)

Any updates on this amazing tank?


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Hyzer said:


> Put a second coat of stain on the stand yesterday. Thought I'd share what it looks like open and covered.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


L ovalis pink would be better.

Close, but should bunch nicer.


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## Sparklescale (Nov 22, 2013)

your tank looks gorgeous! Love the bright yellow aromatic! 

BTW, your mystery fish looks like a Pseudomugil Furcata or a female P. Gertrude, perhaps... from what I can see of it. Does it have two dorsal fins?


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

That last picture is gorgeous! You're getting the hang of it, photo-wise. With regards to plants, well, I think you are going for perfection. Looks great to me! 

So is my mailed mystery fish still alive?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

umarnasir335 said:


> Any updates on this amazing tank?


I'm going for a different look by having some negative space on the right with an HC lawn. L. Aromatica is now kinda the centerpiece. I'm still working on separating the different species with tiers. This is a bit rough in such a shallow tank. I think I would like a 75g... hmm.

I also ditched my old metering valve because it was very difficult to get a precise bubble count. I'm still a big fan of Swagelok. That thing is bulletproof and served me well for a few years. I just purchased the wrong kind in my hasty pursuit of a budget post body on the bay. Orifice size was too large, and I got fed up with the micro adjustments. Ideal shipped me a 52-1-12 and the difference is night and day.

I got two new T5HO bulbs, Aquaflora and a Midday. I wanted to see if a longer, steady photoperiod had an effect on growth so I ditched the bulb ramp up and down. I now have the two outer bulbs on for about 9 hours. I've definitely noticed more color out of the aromatica and R. colorata since the switch and very healthy growth on other species. The hitch is that I have a bit of BBA on the filter intake and open gravel.

Sorry it's not the picture update people prefer, I'll get to that later.



plantbrain said:


> L ovalis pink would be better.
> 
> Close, but should bunch nicer.


My first thought was that I have enough red in the tank. However after looking at pics of L. ovalis, the pink might contrast enough to work. 

I'm still trying to narrow it down to a few species and you aren't helping, heh. Still haven't made it out of that collectoritis stage.



Sparklescale said:


> your tank looks gorgeous! Love the bright yellow aromatic!


Thanks sparkle. 


Sparklescale said:


> BTW, your mystery fish looks like a Pseudomugil Furcata or a female P. Gertrude, perhaps... from what I can see of it. Does it have two dorsal fins?





Wasserpest said:


> So is my mailed mystery fish still alive?


Sadly the mystery fish jumped to its death a couple months back. It was really starting to thrive and rule this tank too. Open top tanks come with a risk, and this loss was the toughest yet.


Wasserpest said:


> That last picture is gorgeous! You're getting the hang of it, photo-wise. With regards to plants, well, I think you are going for perfection. Looks great to me!


Appreciate it man. I am trying to get the most out of these plants and still learning. Once I can figure out how to grow them well I'll get to a proper scape.


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## umarnasir335 (Mar 2, 2014)

Hmmmm, I guess I should really learn from what you said here - getting a quality needle valve actually matters more than I would've thought. I was initially going to get a generic Home Depot brand one, but I think I might wait a few weeks and save up for a Swagelok one for my soon-to-be paintball setup. Thanks!


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## Chris Noto (Aug 19, 2005)

Hyzer said:


> ("More light = more red.")
> Seems risky. Maybe I can try three bulbs on longer. I'll find out quickly if my CO2 is up to the challenge.


Risk = Algae?



Hyzer said:


> Maybe I can try three bulbs on longer. I'll find out quickly if my CO2 is up to the challenge.


I'm pretty sure that, in this case, "more light" is mostly measured in intensity, with duration of secondary significance.



Hyzer said:


> I'll find out quickly if my CO2 is up to the challenge.


Yeah, true that. Balance is the thing, and as we are dealing with living systems, it is a constantly changing, dynamic balance.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

umarnasir335 said:


> Hmmmm, I guess I should really learn from what you said here - getting a quality needle valve actually matters more than I would've thought. I was initially going to get a generic Home Depot brand one, but I think I might wait a few weeks and save up for a Swagelok one for my soon-to-be paintball setup. Thanks!


There are tons of quality metering valves, I'd recommend Swagelok or Ideal because I've used them. If you buy new they can be pricey and it can be tricky to find the correct models on e bay. Well worth it though.



Chris Noto said:


> Risk = Algae?


Yes, that and more importantly health of the new growth.



Chris Noto said:


> I'm pretty sure that, in this case, "more light" is mostly measured in intensity, with duration of secondary significance.


I was ramping up intensity by switching the middle and outer bulbs on and off independently. More light, in my situation, meant keeping all three bulbs on for longer in the middle of the photoperiod. Higher intensity for a longer duration.

After I changed it up, I didn't notice better color with a longer mid day burst. I switched back to just having the outer two bulbs on for a longer period and using the middle bulb for sporadic viewing. With 9 hours of moderate/high light, I've noticed much better color and growth. The only downside is that every area not covered with plants wanted to grow a bit of BBA. So I took it down to 8.5 hrs. and bumped up the CO2 just a bit. Being able to fine tune the bubble count now is so nice.


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## Chris Noto (Aug 19, 2005)

Hyzer said:


> [Snip!]...bumped up the CO2 just a bit. Being able to fine tune the bubble count now is so nice.












pH controller: the Final Frontier in CO2 metering!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Getting CO2 level closer to where it needs to be and trying our a different look. The thread algae and BBA is being overtaken by new growth.


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## Sparklescale (Nov 22, 2013)

Lookin' very pretty!


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## Ashok (Dec 11, 2006)

That's a gorgeous tank!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I haven't had much time for tanks recently but this one is still growing. I ditched the all the HC for a much more forgiving stauro (soon to be) carpet. I had some issues with CO2 but it's getting back on track.

Here is a pic before trimming this evening.









After trim


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## umarnasir335 (Mar 2, 2014)

Wow! Even all this time later, this is some of the best dutch-ish scapes around, and that's saying something! 
Very inspirational stuff here for me when it comes to letting a tank do its own thing and yet still have it look this good.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

umarnasir335 said:


> Wow! Even all this time later, this is some of the best dutch-ish scapes around, and that's saying something!
> Very inspirational stuff here for me when it comes to letting a tank do its own thing and yet still have it look this good.


Appreciate it. Hard to believe I've had this tank for almost 5 years.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Fantastic tank my friend! Appears that you can grow anything you wish, and it looks great altogether. Hope everything is well with little L and such. roud:


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Fantastic tank my friend! Appears that you can grow anything you wish, and it looks great altogether. Hope everything is well with little L and such. roud:


Thanks man. Little L is doing very well. Going to move my little EBI in to the nursery. Might as well start her early.


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## Chris Noto (Aug 19, 2005)

Hyzer said:


> I haven't had much time for tanks recently but this one is still growing.


Going strong, sir! I love the way you have allowed this tank to evolve. 
Thanks for sharing it with us!


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Hyzer said:


> -I did not take my time in researching and choosing fish. I made a rushed decision and it was the wrong one. Never again....


Why do you say that? I am thinking of getting bloodfins for they are good schoolers.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Chris Noto said:


> Going strong, sir! I love the way you have allowed this tank to evolve.
> Thanks for sharing it with us!


Appreciate it Chris. I enjoy tracking my progress.



Hilde said:


> Why do you say that? I am thinking of getting bloodfins for they are good schoolers.


I was never happy with their temperament in my tank. A couple got big and aggressive and stressed out the others. It may to do with the environment or water parameters I provided for them, so take it as you will.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Hyzer said:


> I was never happy with their temperament in my tank. A couple got big and aggressive and stressed out the others.


Aggressive towards other fish or their partners?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Hilde said:


> Aggressive towards other fish or their partners?


Mostly towards other bloodfins. They may have just been cramped.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I added some Corydoras and replanted everything except the Stauro last week. I think doing more than a few trims on the same stems worked against me. There was a ton of broken down plant matter everywhere and BBA was starting to make a comeback on subsrate and plumbing. Swirling up the top of the substrate during my weekly water change just wasn't enough. New growth was starting to look weak and the bottom some of the stems were pretty raggedy. I will stick to 3 trims max now.

Anyone have any advice on getting ludwigia Cuba to grow that nice orange color? You can see mine yellow at best. I blast it with just about as much CO2 as the fish can handle, have 3 T5HOs running for 5 hours midday, and dose EI with extra iron regularly.

I look forward to letting the Stauro get a bit taller and replanting. I'd like it to mix further back and in between the taller mid ground plants. The tank needs more green and I think it's perfect for filling gaps.


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## Wasserpest (Jun 12, 2003)

Happy New Year K! Looks fantastic. Have you ever considered doing a nice rimless starphire tank? Hmmmm... All the best for you and your family!


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Hyzer said:


> Anyone have any advice on getting ludwigia Cuba to grow that nice orange color? You can see mine yellow at best.


How about increasing KNO3? Have you tested KNO3?

Oh you know my bloodfin Tetra, which I have had for about a month, hide in my plants most of the time. Other fish are White Skirt Tetra. The few that come out at times are not afraid the the other fish. Thus getting tired of them.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Wasserpest said:


> Happy New Year K! Looks fantastic. Have you ever considered doing a nice rimless starphire tank? Hmmmm... All the best for you and your family!


You too man. This tank is getting old isn't it. Rimless tanks undoubtedly look the best, but my next one will probably be a regular 75g. I'd like a bit more length and height to mess with and rimless tanks that big cost a fortune. I tend to care more about how things are growing inside the tank than how things look on the outside anyways.



Hilde said:


> How about increasing KNO3? Have you tested KNO3?
> 
> Oh you know my bloodfin Tetra, which I have had for about a month, hide in my plants most of the time. Other fish are White Skirt Tetra. The few that come out at times are not afraid the the other fish. Thus getting tired of them.


Yeah bloodfins didn't work well for me either for some reason. 

Last I checked nitrate was 15-20 ppm. Not sure that's the issue here.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Hyzer said:


> Last I checked nitrate was 15-20 ppm. Not sure that's the issue here.


That is perfect of nitrates. How about iron sulfate?


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## plantman25 (Aug 17, 2014)

This tank looks awesome man. I have a 40b as my main planted tank that I only wish would look like this. Your tank is definitely inspiration for me. Keep up the good work.


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## Overfloater (Jan 12, 2004)

Wow, great layout! The plants look super heathy and the colors are excellent. Keep up the good work.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Hilde said:


> That is perfect of nitrates. How about iron sulfate?


Part of the issue is probably iron. These stems take in most of their iron from roots and I haven't added new root tabs in way too long. I have some of Hydrophyte's clay tabs left over so I'll add them tomorrow.

Now the biggest issue...

I tossed all the Rotala Rotundifolia from this 40g in to my 8g recently. New growth in the little tank puts this tank to shame. It is sending out side shoots near the substrate and turning a nice pink color. I could never get it past yellow in the 40g.










Comparing the two tanks may help me figure this out. I'm using a Cerges' reactor in the 40g and misting in the 8g. The 40g has a 3xT5HO fixture (at peak, just a few hours) and the 8g has two 12" Finnex Planted+ fixtures (full photoperiod). Seems the 8g has more light intensity and better CO2.

Now to figure out how to increase my CO2 concentration without killing any fish. Maybe I just need to go back to misting...



plantman25 said:


> This tank looks awesome man. I have a 40b as my main planted tank that I only wish would look like this. Your tank is definitely inspiration for me. Keep up the good work.


Appreciate it. I've had a lot of fun learning from this tank and I hope yours does the same for you.



Overfloater said:


> Wow, great layout! The plants look super heathy and the colors are excellent. Keep up the good work.


Thanks for checking it out. Healthy but not healthy enough. :icon_mrgr


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Hyzer said:


> I have some of Hydrophyte's clay tabs left over so I'll add them tomorrow.


What are Hydrophyte's clay tabs? Google them and could not find them. I would like to get a pic of them.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Just read this entire thread, very inspiring. Im currently at the stage you were at a couple years ago, still learning how to grow various species, and how prune/group bunches of plants, all the while trying to move towards a presentable "scape." Lots of good food for thought, and it's great seeing a tank evolve like this over the course of a few years. Every phase to me has looked fantastic. 

Thanks for sharing, looking forward to future updates!


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## TheAnswerIs42 (Jul 10, 2014)

Great post! Just read the whole thing. Your tank is very inspiring and I only hope that I can achieve half in my tanks.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Picture update. It's just about time to get a bigger tank.


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

Looking great Hyzer! You're just up the road from me now. I'd love to see this tank in person if you take visitors.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Phil Edwards said:


> Looking great Hyzer! You're just up the road from me now. I'd love to see this tank in person if you take visitors.


Definitely. We should set up a time for you to come up.


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## Roshan8768 (Mar 18, 2009)

Looks fantastic! I'm not a huge fan of the plant in the back right corner, or the one in the midground right below it. Colors are on point, but something about the growth/leaf structure is off. JMO 



Definitely one of the best Dutch tanks I have ever seen


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Roshan8768 said:


> Looks fantastic! I'm not a huge fan of the plant in the back right corner, or the one in the midground right below it. Colors are on point, but something about the growth/leaf structure is off. JMO
> 
> 
> 
> Definitely one of the best Dutch tanks I have ever seen


Thank you, that is quite a compliment. I also agree with you about the right side of the tank. It's hard to see them but I'm waiting on some Cardinal stems to grow in. I have trouble parting with the P. Kawa and I know it's not a great mid ground plant. That pink color when it grows in a bit is nice.


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## ua hua (Oct 30, 2009)

Hyzer said:


> Picture update. It's just about time to get a bigger tank.


Very beautiful Hyzer. 

I have to agree though, it's time to get a bigger tank and test your Dutch skills on a tank that allows you the proper space. I have been following your tank since the beginning and would love to see what you could do with a tank with a larger footprint.


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## BettaBettas (Aug 21, 2016)

@Hyzer This tank im sure has obviously been as much as an inspiration to me as it has been to others on this forum. What is that plant in the back right corner? I like its leaf shape and growth style! Rotala of some sort I imagine? hope you can update this thread sometime as it would be lovely and amazing to see what this tank looks like as of now. I especially hope you know I love this tank because of all the impressive leaf shapes! it looks naturally weedy and grown out if you get what I mean, in a good way. The s repens ( I imagine that's what it is ) covers the lower parts of the other plants, a lower to ground carpeting plant just wouldn't look right in there. 
very good job, a spellbinding image!
Nate


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Oh my:surprise: Looks a picture! You sure have come a long way since your low tech thread here. What would you say is the main thing that made your tank look like a picture?

Bump:


Hyzer said:


> I'm used to the Ista reactor noise. It is actually kinda soothing if I don't have to pee.


:hihi: I feel you.


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## shhh (Jan 1, 2016)

Gorgeous tank!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

*On to skrampos*

After having fun with my 10g CRS tank, I've turned this in to a Caridina shrimp tank. I'm thinking Blue Bolts, CBS, CRS, and Golden Bees. I've got an RO filter and slow growers (Buce, Anubias, moss). I replaced the actual 40 breeder tank and added one of those 24/7 type led lights. If anyone is interested in a 3xt5ho fixture or adopting some 5 year old Glowlights or Gold Tetras let me know.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

BettaBettas said:


> @Hyzer This tank im sure has obviously been as much as an inspiration to me as it has been to others on this forum. What is that plant in the back right corner? I like its leaf shape and growth style! Rotala of some sort I imagine? hope you can update this thread sometime as it would be lovely and amazing to see what this tank looks like as of now. I especially hope you know I love this tank because of all the impressive leaf shapes! it looks naturally weedy and grown out if you get what I mean, in a good way. The s repens ( I imagine that's what it is ) covers the lower parts of the other plants, a lower to ground carpeting plant just wouldn't look right in there.
> very good job, a spellbinding image!
> Nate


Sorry I didn't answer this a couple years back but I just read this. Looks like I had Rotala colorata in that spot. Since then, I realized that trimming stems every other week was not realistic for my lifestyle. I'd hate to share the state of this tank with you good people before I decided to go shrimpin' and no CO2 recently. Let's just say the dominant species is JAVA MOSS!!!!


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

I get excited about algae on the glass these days. To me it's a sign of a maturing tank.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)




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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

Dude...you've got bugs in your tank and they've eaten all your plants! Want the number for a good exterminator?


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## Quint (Mar 24, 2019)

Good looking stuff. Wish I could get my 40B to look like your previous tank. 

What is that yellow floating plant? Looks like a shrimps favorite.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Phil Edwards said:


> Dude...you've got bugs in your tank and they've eaten all your plants! Want the number for a good exterminator?


 Ha, tell me about it. They may overrun the tank at some point. When I showed my buddy a couple videos of tanks full of Caridinas (after the "TO EAT?" part) he said it stressed him out. For me, shrimp are more relaxing to watch than fish.

I do plan on supplying a couple LFS once I feel good about the colonies. That is a form of extermination. =(



Quint said:


> Good looking stuff. Wish I could get my 40B to look like your previous tank.
> 
> What is that yellow floating plant? Looks like a shrimps favorite.


I know the tank in its current state isn't much of a looker. I have some really cool slow growers though IMO. Low maintenance is key at this point.

The main floater is Dwarf water lettuce and I use it primarily to suck up Nitrates. Shrimp do enjoy climbing and munching on it too.


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

No joke, one of the towns near me back in Japan was famous for Cherry Shrimp...to eat. Every year when the season started they'd have a festival with all sorts of different preparations and let me tell you, they don't taste like much. They're great for cleaning between the teeth though! LOL


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## Quint (Mar 24, 2019)

Hyzer said:


> I know the tank in its current state isn't much of a looker. I have some really cool slow growers though IMO. Low maintenance is key at this point.
> 
> The main floater is Dwarf water lettuce and I use it primarily to suck up Nitrates. Shrimp do enjoy climbing and munching on it too.



Thanks a bunch. Hey low maintenance is nice. Allows for the relaxing and enjoying part. Ive been thinking of getting some floaters just not sure how to do it yet, my well water has about 10ppm nitrates out of the tap if I remember correctly and I am in no mood to be doing RO or DI water.


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Shrimp Lollie!


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## Streetwise (May 24, 2019)

Beautiful scape and shrimp!

What is that snack stick?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Streetwise said:


> Beautiful scape and shrimp!
> 
> What is that snack stick?


I wish I could crank up the CO2 a bit more and dose nutrients to bring out the best in these plants. Thanks for your compliment. It's called a Shrimp Lollie.


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## Discusluv (Dec 24, 2017)

Those shrimp are so nice. 
I know nothing about shrimp, but thinking of converting one of my 30 gallons to a shrimp tank. 
What type do you have? What type of water parameters do these need?


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## Hyzer (Mar 9, 2010)

Discusluv said:


> Those shrimp are so nice.
> I know nothing about shrimp, but thinking of converting one of my 30 gallons to a shrimp tank.
> What type do you have? What type of water parameters do these need?


Go for it! I started out trying for 5-6 GH 0-1 KH 6 PH, around 70 degrees, light feeding a couple times per week. I usually do a water change when my TDS gets to around 130 or so. Honestly though, I started losing fewer shrimp when I stopped trying to get the perfect parameters all the time. Consistency is key.


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