# Low Tech 38G progress.



## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi!

I have read the forum for many time but I never written here.

In first, sorry for my english, I'm from Madrid, Spain, and I don't speak it so fine.

I have had any planted tanks in past, and they were "High Tech Tanks", but now I am starting my first low tech tank, and I read a lot of information in american webs because in my country it isn't a very popular tank configuration.

This is the LT proyect:

*Dimensions:* 80x40x45cm (31x16x18in), 144 l (38g)
*Light:* 2x 24w Phillips HO 865 1650 lm, 6 hours.
*Filtration:* Aquaclear 70 (micromec).
*Substratum:* ground (perlite+spargum peat+aqualit+help soil+NPK) capped whit black volcanic gravel.

*Plants:* 
Anubia barteri var barteri	
Anubia barteri var nana	
Bacopa caroliana	
Blyxa japonica	
Cryptocorine Becketii	
Cryptocorine wentii brown	
Cryptocoryne spiralis/albida
Cryptocoryne Crispatula v. "Balansae"	
Crytocorine coslata	
Cryptocoryne wentii red
Microsorum pteropus 
Microsorum pteropus "Mini"
Eleocharis parvula

*Wildlife:*
Colisa Chuna
Trichopsis Pumila
Stiphodon Atropurpureus
Clithon Corona (Sun Snail)
Planorbis corneus (Ramshorn Snail)

*2014 may 02 (day 2):*











And these are some of my HT past tanks:






































I hope to do a good tank with your advices.


Kind regards!


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## MondoBongo (Jul 21, 2013)

those are some gorgeous tanks there.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Thanks mondo... 

And this is the LT proyect:

*2014 may 02 (day 2):*


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Welcome to TPT!

You've put together some really gorgous tanks!

I look forward to seeing this tank mature. I'm sure it will be beautiful just like your others.

Why did you decide to try a low tech approach with this tank?


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi laura and thanks!

I enjoy creating HT tanks, but they require too much time and HT tanks will always need a reset from time to time... remove, replant, and starts again.

One day, looking for information about lighting and CO2, I read an D.Walstad article, and I discovered LT setting... I after read Tom Barr, and others and I found this forum and I asked to myself if I could to do it too and enjoy the planted tanks slowly.

And I'm here... hoping to learn and to continue delighting me with this amazing hobby.


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## THE V (Nov 17, 2011)

You'll find that low tech tanks are a bit more challenging with algae. I think your PAR from that light is a bit much without CO2. You might want to check it.

With decreasing the light levels you can Increase the photoperiod. One of the things I like about low tech tanks is I can get away with 12-14 hour photoperiods of lower light. I actually had a very low light tank once where I never turned off the light.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

THE V said:


> You'll find that low tech tanks are a bit more challenging with algae. I think your PAR from that light is a bit much without CO2. You might want to check it.
> 
> With decreasing the light levels you can Increase the photoperiod. One of the things I like about low tech tanks is I can get away with 12-14 hour photoperiods of lower light. I actually had a very low light tank once where I never turned off the light.


The lighting has been my more complex doubt. In 38 gallons, the 24w T5 865 PAR seems too low light, and 48w too much. 

I read about it, and some people believe that a longer photoperiod time stimulates algae growing.

I gave a lot of thought to this... I finally decided for two tubes, and decrease the photoperiod time for 6 hours.

If algaes appears (4 days and there aren't algaes in tank), perhaps I could change the lighting setting.

Thanks for your opinion.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Another option if your lighting ends up too much would be to raise the fixture up off the tank.

I missed that you are running 2xT5HO over this tank... and I agree it's probably going to be too much.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

lauraleellbp said:


> Another option if your lighting ends up too much would be to raise the fixture up off the tank.
> 
> I missed that you are running 2xT5HO over this tank... and I agree it's probably going to be too much.


I believe It is in the limit too. But the lamp hasn't effective reflector and It hasn't glass or metacrilate protector (it's plastic), and I think that It relieves light.


I'll be careful... thanks.


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## redant (May 6, 2014)

Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


CO2 outgassing is not an issue on a tank where CO2 is not being injected.


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## redant (May 6, 2014)

lauraleellbp said:


> CO2 outgassing is not an issue on a tank where CO2 is not being injected.


But given the fact that the dissolved Co2 (from fish and plants - during night) is already a scarcity, won't too much surface agitation quickly drive out whatever little CO2 is there?


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

No, since the atmospheric concentration of CO2 in the air is typically higher, CO2 will tend to move INTO the water rather than exit the water. There's quite a few threads on this.


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## redant (May 6, 2014)

lauraleellbp said:


> No, since the atmospheric concentration of CO2 in the air is typically higher, CO2 will tend to move INTO the water rather than exit the water. There's quite a few threads on this.


Ok...so will adding anything that increases surface agitation..say like an airstone help in increasing dissolved co2 in non co2 tanks?


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

Not to any useful levels.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk


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## redant (May 6, 2014)

jrill said:


> Not to any useful levels.


It won't be harmful either, right?


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Nope, not harmful either.

In some situations surface agitation may raise CO2 levels in tank water and in others it may lower them (depending quite a bit on what's actually in the tank in terms of livestock vs plants)- but in MOST cases, surface agitation on a non-injected tank shouldn't affect the CO2 levels at any stasticially significant level when it comes to plants.


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## starfire12 (Aug 13, 2009)

Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


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## redant (May 6, 2014)

lauraleellbp said:


> Nope, not harmful either.
> 
> In some situations surface agitation may raise CO2 levels in tank water and in others it may lower them (depending quite a bit on what's actually in the tank in terms of livestock vs plants)- but in MOST cases, surface agitation on a non-injected tank shouldn't affect the CO2 levels at any stasticially significant level when it comes to plants.


As of now i'm running a canister filter in my tank. I am using excel as my Carbon source. My tank is stocked in excess of 100% with SIX pearl gouramis. I also had two angel fish which i removed and kept in a separate tank. With the angel fish and p. gouramis together, the nitrate level was around 30ppm. I also had a yellow apple snail which I removed because it started feeding on my bacopa. I am planning to add a small sponge filter in my tank for more filtration due to the high bio load. Since I am already using excel, I hope the surface agitation due to the addition of a sponge filter won't affect CO2 levels. What do you say?


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol

But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


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## OVT (Nov 29, 2011)

Beautiful tanks!

For low tech tanks, even more then for HT, you might consider adding a lot more fast growing plants like water sprite, ambulia, pennywort, blyxa japonica, dwarf sagitaria. Floating plants will also help to adjust the amount of light penetrating the tank.

Once the tank gets mature, less frequent, smaller water changes (twice or once a month, or even longer, at 20-30%) would also help to avoid drastic changes in water conditions.

v3


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## Aurie (Jun 3, 2013)

Ades_XX said:


> Thanks mondo...
> 
> And this is the LT proyect:
> 
> ...



I love sunset gouramis. They are by far my favorite fish. I used to have 3 (1m 2f) but the male went nuts and attacked everyone so I returned him and the females went into my 46 and they would follow each other around and it was obvious what side belonged to whom. They unfortunately both died within a week of eachother and I have no idea why  I fully plan on getting more when I get my 55 set up

I'm really glad you're keeping them in this tank. I hope you enjoy them as much as I did with my "girls" (Laverne and Shirley)


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi again;

Sorry for the silence, but I've had a few holydays days.

20 days and the tank have a perfect evolution (I'm the most surprised). No algae, and all the plants have a good growing (It is very slow, but all the plants have new stems).

I have introduced two Stiphodon Atropurpureus pair (I love this algae-eater fish), and a few Cryptocoryne C. Balansae behind.

*Stiphodon Atropurureus "Male"*









*Stiphodon Atropurpureus "Female"*









Next week, in first month birth, I will take a update photo.




redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


Completely agree with Laura. I have a drop checker, and It becomes greener during darkness and becomes bluer during the photoperiod (accumulation-consumption). 





starfire12 said:


> Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


Thank you. I will. roud:




lauraleellbp said:


> I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol
> 
> But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


This is very interesting. I'm delighted that you "jack" the thread. :icon_wink




OVT said:


> Beautiful tanks!
> 
> For low tech tanks, even more then for HT, you might consider adding a lot more fast growing plants like water sprite, ambulia, pennywort, blyxa japonica, dwarf sagitaria. Floating plants will also help to adjust the amount of light penetrating the tank.
> 
> ...


Currently, plants consume more than the tank builds and I have to fertilize P, K and Fe weekly.

I don't do water changer... I just fill it evaporated and add micros and macros.




Aurie said:


> I love sunset gouramis. They are by far my favorite fish. I used to have 3 (1m 2f) but the male went nuts and attacked everyone so I returned him and the females went into my 46 and they would follow each other around and it was obvious what side belonged to whom. They unfortunately both died within a week of eachother and I have no idea why  I fully plan on getting more when I get my 55 set up
> 
> I'm really glad you're keeping them in this tank. I hope you enjoy them as much as I did with my "girls" (Laverne and Shirley)


I love this fish too... The male becomes territorial when guards his nest and it attack the females... It is natural. I hope that you would enjoy the sunset gouramis again in the future.


Thank you for all the comments and suggestions and best regards.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi again;

Sorry for the silence, I've had difficult working days.

The tank have a perfect evolution. No algae... good growing... all the plants have new stems.

I have introduced two pairs of Stiphodon Atropurureus (I love this algae-eater fish):

*Stiphodon Atropurpureus Male*









*Stiphodon Atropurpureus Female*










I will soon take a update photo.




redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


I'm completely agree with laura. I have a drop checker and It turns greener in no lights period, and It turns bluer in photoperiod. (Accumulation - Consumption). 




starfire12 said:


> Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


Thank you. I will do. roud:




lauraleellbp said:


> I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol
> 
> But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


It's very interesting topic, you can "jack" the thread. :wink:




OVT said:


> Beautiful tanks!
> 
> For low tech tanks, even more then for HT, you might consider adding a lot more fast growing plants like water sprite, ambulia, pennywort, blyxa japonica, dwarf sagitaria. Floating plants will also help to adjust the amount of light penetrating the tank.
> 
> ...


The tank have fine consumption at the moment. 

I don't do water changes, I only refill evaporated water and I fertilize micros and macros weekly If it is necesary (I add K, Fe, P and K to complete suitable levels), and the water have a perfect condition and absolutely clear. 




Aurie said:


> I love sunset gouramis. They are by far my favorite fish. I used to have 3 (1m 2f) but the male went nuts and attacked everyone so I returned him and the females went into my 46 and they would follow each other around and it was obvious what side belonged to whom. They unfortunately both died within a week of eachother and I have no idea why  I fully plan on getting more when I get my 55 set up
> 
> I'm really glad you're keeping them in this tank. I hope you enjoy them as much as I did with my "girls" (Laverne and Shirley)


It is a beautiful fish... 

*Female*









This is the normal conduct in Gouramis when the male is doing the nest or It is caring the eggs or offsprings. I hope you will can to enjoy Sunset Gouramis again early.


Thank you for all the comments and suggestions. Best regards.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi again;

Sorry for the silence, I've had difficult working days.

The tank have a perfect evolution. No algae... good growing... all the plants have new stems.

I have introduced two pairs of Stiphodon Atropurureus (I love this algae-eater fish).

I will soon take a update photo.




redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


I'm completely agree with laura. I have a drop checker and It turns greener in no lights period, and It turns bluer at final of the photoperiod. (Accumulation - Consumption). 




starfire12 said:


> Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


Thank you. I will do. roud:




lauraleellbp said:


> I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol
> 
> But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


It's very interesting topic, you can "jack" the thread. :wink:




OVT said:


> Beautiful tanks!
> 
> For low tech tanks, even more then for HT, you might consider adding a lot more fast growing plants like water sprite, ambulia, pennywort, blyxa japonica, dwarf sagitaria. Floating plants will also help to adjust the amount of light penetrating the tank.
> 
> ...


The tank have appropriate consumption for the moment. 

I don't do water changes, I only refill evaporated water and I fertilize micros and macros weekly If it is necesary (I add K, Fe, P and K to complete suitable levels), and the water have a perfect condition and it's absolutely clear. 




Aurie said:


> I love sunset gouramis. They are by far my favorite fish. I used to have 3 (1m 2f) but the male went nuts and attacked everyone so I returned him and the females went into my 46 and they would follow each other around and it was obvious what side belonged to whom. They unfortunately both died within a week of eachother and I have no idea why  I fully plan on getting more when I get my 55 set up
> 
> I'm really glad you're keeping them in this tank. I hope you enjoy them as much as I did with my "girls" (Laverne and Shirley)


It's a beautiful... This is the normal conduct in Gouramis when the male is doing the nest or It is caring the eggs or offsprings. I hope you will can to enjoy Sunset Gouramis again early.


Thank you for all the comments and suggestions. Best regards.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi again;

Sorry for the silence, I've had difficult working days.

The tank have a perfect evolution. No algae... good growing... all the plants have new stems.

I have introduced two pairs of Stiphodon Atropurureus (I love this algae eater fish).

I will soon take a update photo.




redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


I'm completely agree with laura. I have a continuous ph checker and It turns greener in "no lights" period, and It turns bluer at final of the photoperiod. (Accumulation - Consumption). 




starfire12 said:


> Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


Thank you. I will do. roud:




lauraleellbp said:


> I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol
> 
> But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


It's very interesting topic, you can "jack" the thread. :wink:


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi again;

Sorry for the silence, I've had difficult working days.

The tank have a perfect evolution. No algae... good growing... all the plants have new stems.

I have introduced two pairs of Stiphodon Atropurureus (I love this algae eater fish).

I will soon take a update photo.




redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


I'm completely agree with laura. I have a continuous ph checker and It turns greener in "no lights" period, and It turns bluer at final of the photoperiod. (Accumulation - Consumption). 




starfire12 said:


> Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


Thank you. I will do. roud:




lauraleellbp said:


> I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol
> 
> But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


It's very interesting topic, you can "jack" the thread. :wink:




OVT said:


> Beautiful tanks!
> 
> For low tech tanks, even more then for HT, you might consider adding a lot more fast growing plants like water sprite, ambulia, pennywort, blyxa japonica, dwarf sagitaria. Floating plants will also help to adjust the amount of light penetrating the tank.
> 
> ...


The tank have appropriate consumption for the moment. 

I don't do water changes, I only refill evaporated water and I fertilize micros and macros weekly If it is necesary (I add K, Fe, P and K to complete suitable levels), and the water have a perfect condition and absolutely clear. 




Aurie said:


> I love sunset gouramis. They are by far my favorite fish. I used to have 3 (1m 2f) but the male went nuts and attacked everyone so I returned him and the females went into my 46 and they would follow each other around and it was obvious what side belonged to whom. They unfortunately both died within a week of eachother and I have no idea why  I fully plan on getting more when I get my 55 set up
> 
> I'm really glad you're keeping them in this tank. I hope you enjoy them as much as I did with my "girls" (Laverne and Shirley)


It's a beautiful fish. This is the normal conduct in Gouramis when the male is doing the nest or It is caring the eggs or offsprings. I hope you will can to enjoy Sunset Gouramis again early.


Thank you for all the comments and suggestions. Best regards.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Hi again;

Sorry for the silence, I've had difficult working days.

The tank have a perfect evolution. No algae... good growing... all the plants have new stems and looks fine.

I have introduced two pairs of Stiphodon Atropurureus (I love this algae eater fish), Clithon Corona and Planorbis Corneus.

*Male*









*Female*










I will soon take a update photo.



redant said:


> Are you using a HOB filter in your tank? As this will be a non CO2 low tech tank, a HOB will cause too much surface agitation thereby leading to loss of dissolved CO2. IMO a canister filter would be a better option.


I'm completely agree with laura. I have a continuous CO2 checker and It turns greener in "no lights" period, and It turns bluer at final of the photoperiod. (Accumulation - Consumption).




starfire12 said:


> Welcome to the forum. Those are some great tanks. I really enjoy the low tech tanks, I have three ten gallon low tech tanks and a 46 gallon bow front somewhat high tech tank. Keep us updated.


Thank you. I will do. roud:




lauraleellbp said:


> I think we're jacking Ades' thread lol
> 
> But to answer your question, I don't think your CO2 levels will be affected one way or the other.


It's very interesting topic, you can "jack" the thread. :wink:




OVT said:


> Beautiful tanks!
> 
> For low tech tanks, even more then for HT, you might consider adding a lot more fast growing plants like water sprite, ambulia, pennywort, blyxa japonica, dwarf sagitaria. Floating plants will also help to adjust the amount of light penetrating the tank.
> 
> ...


The tank have appropriate consumption for the moment. 

I don't do water changes, I only refill evaporated water and I fertilize micros and macros weekly If it is necesary (I add K, Fe, P and K to complete suitable levels), and the water have a perfect condition and absolutely clear.




Aurie said:


> I love sunset gouramis. They are by far my favorite fish. I used to have 3 (1m 2f) but the male went nuts and attacked everyone so I returned him and the females went into my 46 and they would follow each other around and it was obvious what side belonged to whom. They unfortunately both died within a week of eachother and I have no idea why  I fully plan on getting more when I get my 55 set up
> 
> I'm really glad you're keeping them in this tank. I hope you enjoy them as much as I did with my "girls" (Laverne and Shirley)


It's a beautiful fish. This is the normal conduct in Gouramis when the male is doing the nest or It is caring the eggs or offsprings. I hope that you will can to enjoy Sunset Gouramis again early.


Thank you for all the comments and suggestions. Best regards.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

A small video today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUjNKIbPgDQ

(You can watch it in HD)

Best regards.


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

Progress photo:

*02-06-2014 (1 month):*









*02-05-2014:*










Best regards!


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## Aurie (Jun 3, 2013)

Ades_XX said:


> It's a beautiful fish. This is the normal conduct in Gouramis when the male is doing the nest or It is caring the eggs or offsprings. I hope that you will can to enjoy Sunset Gouramis again early.
> 
> 
> Thank you for all the comments and suggestions. Best regards.


I will have them again in my 55. The male I had was super mean but I had my females for a year after he was returned. I'm glad you love the fish as much as I do. They're great and full of personality. 


The tank is looking really good. Keep up the good work. Slow and steady. 

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Ades_XX (May 13, 2013)

New photo:

*02-07-2014*









7.2-7.4 Ph
3.5 ºdKh
8 ºdGh
24.5 ºC
270-300 ppm TDS 
5-10 ppm NO3 ---- No added.
0.05-1 ppm PO4 ---- 1.2 a 1.5 ppm weekly added.
0.05 ppm Fe ---- 0.025 a 0.05 ppm weekly added.
K added 7x PO4
0 ppm Cu


Best regards!


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