# ADA Substrate Additives Necessary?



## aquanut415 (Jan 21, 2006)

tropicalfish said:


> I am going to order ADA substrate for my 75 gallon in a day or two, and I want to know if the substrate additives are necessary. I want to keep it not too expensive, so I was wondering if the stuff like Bacter 100 and Tourmaline BC and Clear Super were necessary.
> 
> Do they have any added benefit? Is it "snake oil"? Is it full of nutrients?


the answer to your first question is no... they are not necessary.

the second and third questions are debatable. Look at some of jsenske's tanks if you want to see what those on the cutting edge of ADA setups are up to...

IMO if its not gonna break the wallet.. why not try it?


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

Well, added together with the AquaSoil and Power sand, it will cost upwards of at least 150 dollars, PLUS shipping!! Only for the stuff on the bottom of the tank!

Well maybe I am not soo spendy.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Tourmaline is really really very debatable at best and outright snake oil new age mumbo at the other end.
Bacter and the SC have perhaos a bit more utility. But adding Alum can clear up a tank for the next 200 years for 2$. Adding mulm from another estlished tank, adding plant roots etc adds bacteria etc, adding zeolite etc reduces the NH4, water changes etc.

I've had the same results with the full line as I have had with the ADA Aqua soil alone.

But you can still use them, they will not hurt, it's just when folks suggest they do something significant, I have to ask precisely what that benefit really is.

I sure never saw it.

Unless you bother to test things and try it WITHOUT to see, you really cannot say nor argue otherwise.

It could be due to the additives, it could be due solely to the Aqua soil.

I'd say the latter based on actually trying it.

Plenty of companies sell these items, clarifiers, bacteria boosters, Fe additions etc. I'd suspect these are not much different.

You can these to the sediments as well, who knows if they work or not?
That's a very hard standard to show unless it's fairly dramatic difference.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## tropicalfish (Mar 29, 2007)

So I could save some money, not get the stuff, and have the same affect with purely only the Power sand and AquaSoil?


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## fishscale (May 29, 2007)

plantbrain said:


> But adding Alum can clear up a tank for the next 200 years for 2$.


Can you elaborate on this? By Alum, do you mean the Alum you can buy at a supermarket as a pickling agent? How much do you add to a tank? What does it do to clarify the tank?


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## zergling (May 16, 2007)

personally, plant growth has already been amazing with aquasoil and EI dosing. While I have not compared this to Aqua Soil with PowerSand, I really don't see a whole lot of need to get faster growth.....

....unless I want to try to grow crypts faster.....hmmm.....


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

Well, my ntion is simple and based on sound basic plant biology for controlling growth rates. Want less growth?
Use less light.

Cost less, less heat, goes along with the basic premise "Less is better" and addresses the root cause, not he symtom as light drives CO2 demand which regulates NH4 and NO3 uptake and the rest of the nutrients.

It all starts with the light. Plants do not start growing because they are exposed to CO2 or nutrients, they need light first and less light = less algae growth rates in all cases.

Unlike CO2 or nutrients within the ranges we keep.

So of the 3 main factors in volved in plant growth, light, CO2 and nutrients, regulating light makes the most logical supportable sense.

EI is not suggested to be used blindly, you can taper off the dosing slightly if you so chose and with lower light, this is suggested.

Also, I have fully tested with a lab spect all the liquid fertilizers for ADA for NH4, NO3, Fe, PO4, K+, Ca, Mn and Mg.

I'm send the soil off to have it verified independently for various attributes.
As clear, bacteria and other like products are not direct plant growth components, I do not test them.

Alum is ==> aluminum sulfate.
Use as a clarifyer in Madel's products, water treatment plants, agriculture etc.

*If you assume that a product helps plants and improves their growth, this directly implies that you have a higher growth rate in one treatment vs a control.*

I mean *what would you measure to show preference between two treatments* if you wanted to grow something? 

I think many of us have not thought this through all the way sometimes.
You need to define a goal/s you have, then apply a method and a means to get there that work best together for you.

This includes cost(ADA ain't cheap, nor was Dupla, which spawned an entire dIY culture and PMDD in this hobby:bounce: ) and controlling growth rates, as well as aesthetic and routine habits etc, not just growth rate alone.

ADA does this with lower light also, but adds a spike in the midday, but many assume they need the high light which is not true.

See the Low Light ADA Tank I posted as a prime example of that hogash being falsified.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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