# Are Neon Tetra's Hardy



## Louey (Jan 17, 2005)

I bought 8 neons last weekend and now I have only 2 left. They died one by one. The two remaining ones seem to be okay. All other fish in the tank appear healthy.

Is there a trick to getting neons acclimated?

My other fishes are (2) lyretail mollies, (5) SEA's, and (4) pair of rosey barbs. I did not notice any aggression towards the neon's from their tank mates.

Any tips? I was really looking forward to having a school of neons.

My tank is 38G's.

The PH is around 7.5 - 8.0 and my KH is 8 degrees. Temperature is 81 - 82 degrees due to VHO lighting.

Louey


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## Kris (Feb 27, 2004)

in my experience, neons can be tricky. i have had a simialar experience and my answer has been to quarantine the last bunch. this way, i know that they are feeding, i am able to treat them and when i transfer them after a month, they should be fairly hardy.
of course, this might not keep them from jumping out of the tank!


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## Spar (Aug 7, 2003)

lower and stable pH is the key. 6.8-7.0 pH is a good pH to aim for.

are they hardy? nope. I have gone through about 60 of them now and only have 6 adults to show for it. however, i did not have stable pH at the time.

they also like lots of plants.. and since you are on this forum, I assume that isnt a problem for you.


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## Louey (Jan 17, 2005)

Yep, got plenty of plants.

I am going to get a full pressurized CO2 system, which should enable me to lower the PH. Right now I have a crappy Carbo Plus system running full blast and it's not lowering my PH one bit.

louey


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## EricSilver (Feb 23, 2004)

I think the commercially produced fish are so over bred, and perhaps inbred, that they are no longer genetically viable. They seem programmed to die. 

Wild-caught fish, on the other hand (like Rummy Nose Tetras, Gold Tetras, etc.) are extremely hardy.


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## WolverineFan (Dec 15, 2004)

The *only* reason I kept Neons is because Cardinals used to be so darn hard to find and not that much easier to keep. Now that Cardinals are readily available and seem to be much hardier than in the past, I kissed Neons goodbye and never looked back. IMO Neons can't hold a candle to Cardinals as far as looks go.


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## danmhippo (Feb 3, 2005)

Louey, I find cardinals a bit hardier than the neons. Neons need slow acclimation IME just like the starfish. It's a good idea to check with LFS if they have been medicating the batch of neons before you buy them, as I know many LFS subject neons to medication the first they arrive at their store. 

FYI, the 10G nano that I have, I originally got 30 cardinals, returned 10 back to the LFS per recommendations of this board, and the remaining 20 is still with me. I had a pH swing 2 weeks back (stupid mistake, I added too much baking soda as buffer). The pH swing wiped out all shrimps and snails, but the 20 cardinals are still there. That's pretty hardy IMHO.

Cardinals are more pricy, but compared to your reef tank, it's relatively cheap. But since you have problems with acclimation, I would also suggest you quarantine your tetras just to make sure they could adapt to captivity.


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## Urkevitz (Jan 12, 2004)

I have had good luck with neons, but as wolverine said they are obsolete now because of how cheap cardinals are. I am still having trouble finding healthy rummynose, I haven't bought any in months because the shipments are of such poor quality.


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## AmoAquafish (Jun 5, 2004)

When I first got neons I had hard time keeping them alive (got them at Wal-Mart) but now I think it is because of where I bought them from. Later I got more at a realible lfs and none died. I also have a cardinal with them that came in with the neons, and though he is nicer looking, there is something I like about how small neons are. I can't get cardinals around here. Once you have had the neons very long they seem pretty hardy. Good luck with your neons, I personally like them!


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## Louey (Jan 17, 2005)

Dang. I got home tonight and the remaining 2 Neons have disappreared and one pair of rosey barbs are dead on the subtrate.

The fish seem to be beathing heavily so I added an airstone.

I'll check the water parameters later, but the PH is usually consistantly in the 7.5 - 8 range, KH is always around 7 degrees, and the nitates are undetectable.

Water temp is 83.

WTF?

Louey


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## Thanks (Oct 9, 2004)

got CO2? overdose maybe?


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## m3th0d (Jun 27, 2004)

Fish are weird. Sometimes you can't look at the statistics...

When I first came into the hobby I was told that keeping Neon's was extremely tough but I've experienced the exact opposite. I bought a small school of 6 Neons about two years ago and they are my most hardiest fish! They're actually from the batch of first fish I've ever purchased. And I have really hard water, 7.8+!


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## AmoAquafish (Jun 5, 2004)

I think it all depends on where you get them. Sorry about your fish, Louey :icon_frow, I know the feeling. Did you quarentine?


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## Louey (Jan 17, 2005)

Thanks wrote:



> got CO2? overdose maybe?


I got a crappy Carbo Plus unit that sucks. According to my PH and KH readings, my CO2 is low according to the CO2 calculator. If I use 7.5 for PH. my co2 is only 8ppm. If I use 8 for PH, then the co2 is even lower at 2PPM.

AmoAquafish, no I did not quarentine. Shame on me. I thought about that too.

Louey


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Depends on where you get them, I guess. The tiny ones(3 for $1!) I get from local grocery store(Albertson's) are extremely hardy, you can't kill them with a bullet. And yes, I do see some signs of excessive inbreeding on these guys, like short gill plates.


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## andyg (Oct 9, 2004)

Like Shalu & AmoAquafish said, it does depend where you get them. I still have the original six I purchased at the same time as Glowlight and Zebra Daniosfrom a different lfs. All the Zebras are gone and I lost three Glowlight. 
I know the lfs they came from keep all new fish quarantined for at least 2 weeks before the hit the sale tank.


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## WolverineFan (Dec 15, 2004)

83 seems a little on the high side to me. I keep all my tanks at 76-78.


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## Aphyosemion (Oct 15, 2004)

Okay, something is very wrong with your tank. If I have one fish die, I remove it and check some of my tank parameters just to be safe. If I have more than one die or two die within a short time period, I KNOW something bad is going on and run the whole barrage of tests I have available. There is always a reason, you just have to find it. 
As for neons, they are a south american fish and don't like a high PH. Also, your tank is too warm for just about any fish, except maybe discus. I would try to bring the temp and PH down. When I first started keeping fish, I couldn't figure out why some fish just would die no mattter what. My PH was a good solid 7.8 to 8.0 and that seemed fine to me at the time, cuz I didn't know better. Bring the temp to around 75 to 78 and the PH down to about 6.8 to 7.2 and you might have better luck. Almost any freshwater fish can live with a PH of 7.0, but not that many will survive in a PH of 8.0. At least not very long.
-Aphyosemion


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## Louey (Jan 17, 2005)

Aphyosemion wrote:



> I would try to bring the temp and PH down.


I agree with you on both issues. I should add a fan in the canopy to blow out some of the heat generated by the VHO's. When I add a full pressurized CO2 system, I should be able to easily get the PH down to the 7 range.

On a positive note, no more fish deaths in the last two days. Hopefully, whatever caused these deaths is over. I'll be more careful about adding new fish in the future.

Louey


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## Louey (Jan 17, 2005)

Damn. Just like that, one of my rosey barbs is now dead on the substrate. They all looked fine, and they all still look fine, except the one that is now suddenly dead.

I have not seen any aggression amongst these fish. Should I suspect that I have a killer fish?

I don't get it. All fish fed aggresively just 3 hours ago. Why would an actively feeding fish end up dead 3 hours later?

Louey


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## shalu (Jan 16, 2003)

Don't think either temp or ph caused the death, although the high temperature might not be the best for them. I have neons in that kind of ph, they could not be happier, the temp in summer can get to 90s. Probably you bought some sick fish/carrier of pathogens recently.


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