# Eheim 2217, Purigen, How Much ?



## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

So i finally bought a canister filter Eheim 2217 and now i'm looking for Purigen.

How much of it i will need ? Will 250ml be enough ? 
Also which bag should i get for it ? Is the Seachem "The Bag" worth it ?

Which original media i should replace ? I want to get rid of that Carbon pad for sure.


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## freph (Apr 4, 2011)

I personally like buying 2-3 of the 100mL pre-bagged boxes since I'm too lazy to recharge them. Granted, it's still cheaper to buy a 250mL bottle and the bag and keep reusing the bag over time since it doesn't break down. Recharge or just buy new stuff....whatever floats your boat. Also, 250mL is fine. Maybe more.


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## isu712 (Jan 11, 2008)

You must use "The Bag." Other media holders will not have a fine enough mesh and you will lose your purigen.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Is Purigen what you want to use? It's removed nitrates what what I've read and if your tank is planted it will need the nitrates, but if you are going to use it a little more might be wise, so you have enough to use in the filter and an equal amount to bleach to regenerate, plus you'll need to rise and let it evaporate dry to get rid of the bleach. I would think you would want at least a liter for a 2217 and I would use the Seachem bag because it most likely has the correct size mesh to contain the Perigen but yield maximum flow.

BTW there is nothing wrong with the carbon pad, you can use it and just leave it in the canister until the first cleaning of your filter, it will remove impurities for 6 to 10 days, it is added fine filter media, and it will grow nitrifying bacteria colonies.

Is the 2217 for your 36 Bowfront?


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

I read somewhere on a reef forum you shouldn't use recharged purigen. Can anyone explain this? [/thread-jack]


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## xenxes (Dec 22, 2011)

"The Bag" is as much as the 100ml which includes a bag. Get the 100ml imo. I tried the 250 + aquaclear bags and they still leaked a little, the particles are tiny.

It's a chemical filter that can be used to replace carbon. Nothing wrong with leaving carbon in too.

I don't see why you can't reuse it in a reef, bleach removes all organic particles attached to the media, then you rinse thoroughly, probably dip in an acidic pH buffer (because bleach has a pH of 12), rinse again and soak in a prime dip to remove chlorine.

According to seachem you're not supposed to allow purigen to dry again, not sure why.

I don't use mine anymore in heavily planted tanks because I want some natural nitrates and don't want to dose (going for 0/low-maintenance), when I added it in, nitrates depleted from 20ppm to 0 and never went back up (it removes organic matter before it gets converted to ammonia->nitrite->nitrate, not nitrate directly; but fast growing plants were eating existing nitrates up too fast). But if you're using it for fish only / no or low plants or dosing yourself / or breeding sensitive fauna that requires a constant 0 nitrate level, I'd highly recommend it. It works, almost too well  Also, I would not use it while cycling, it slows down the cycling chain.


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## isu712 (Jan 11, 2008)

oldpunk78 said:


> I read somewhere on a reef forum you shouldn't use recharged purigen. Can anyone explain this? [/thread-jack]


I think some people recommend not using it in saltwater tanks because it has been treated with bleach, but if the directions are followed, and a suitable dechlorinator is used that shouldn't be a problem. At least it hasn't been an issue on either my reef or planted tanks.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

150EH said:


> Is Purigen what you want to use? It's removed nitrates what what I've read and if your tank is planted it will need the nitrates, but if you are going to use it a little more might be wise, so you have enough to use in the filter and an equal amount to bleach to regenerate, plus you'll need to rise and let it evaporate dry to get rid of the bleach. I would think you would want at least a liter for a 2217 and I would use the Seachem bag because it most likely has the correct size mesh to contain the Perigen but yield maximum flow.
> 
> BTW there is nothing wrong with the carbon pad, you can use it and just leave it in the canister until the first cleaning of your filter, it will remove impurities for 6 to 10 days, it is added fine filter media, and it will grow nitrifying bacteria colonies.
> 
> Is the 2217 for your 36 Bowfront?


Yeah i have just read about the nitrates .. Maybe i will hold on with this plan for now lol
And yeah it's going on Bowfront untill i have enough money for 40B 

Thanks everyone for the input


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## Naekuh (Oct 19, 2011)

Lee's nylon bag will hold purigen... 

However they probably cost as much as seachem's the bag.




150EH said:


> Is Purigen what you want to use? It's removed nitrates what what I've read and if your tank is planted it will need the nitrates, but if you are going to use it a little more might be wise, so you have enough to use in the filter and an equal amount to bleach to regenerate, plus you'll need to rise and let it evaporate dry to get rid of the bleach. I would think you would want at least a liter for a 2217 and I would use the Seachem bag because it most likely has the correct size mesh to contain the Perigen but yield maximum flow.


your contradicting what a lot of people on this forum have been saying.
I read it removes nitrogenous waste... and has no impact on the ferts or other things which plants need to use. 

Now im lost... but can you care to explain if its good or bad? have you used the product and noticed a poor growth rate inside planted tanks?


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Naekuh said:


> Lee's nylon bag will hold purigen...
> 
> However they probably cost as much as seachem's the bag.
> 
> ...


 "Purigen® controls ammonia, nitrites and nitrates by removing nitrogenous organic waste that would otherwise release these harmful compounds." It's from Seachems website.


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## Naekuh (Oct 19, 2011)

Eviltwist said:


> "Purigen® controls ammonia, nitrites and nitrates by removing nitrogenous organic waste that would otherwise release these harmful compounds." It's from Seachems website.


i know but everyone who uses it and swears by it has really awesome tanks.

This is why im lost in both sides of purigen... :eek5:


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## isu712 (Jan 11, 2008)

Naekuh said:


> i know but everyone who uses it and swears by it has really awesome tanks.
> 
> This is why im lost in both sides of purigen... :eek5:


It does a great job of removing stuff, but if you use it you may need to add more nitrates than if you weren't using, but it's not going to remove all of the nitrates, so it still works well. I use it, swear by it, and after using both carbon and purigen, I will never go back to just carbon.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Naekuh said:


> i know but everyone who uses it and swears by it has really awesome tanks.
> 
> This is why im lost in both sides of purigen... :eek5:


It sounds like it only controls the waste part and should not affect dosed Nitrates.

"Purigen works very well in a planted tank. Purigen will remove nitrogenous organic waste; it will not directly remove nitrates (therefore, it will not be removing what the plants need)" response from Tech Support on Seachem forum.

This could be easily tested tho.
Maybe i will test it if i finally decide to get it.


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

I think you can use it but, even Seachem suggests it for tanks that need really clean water like a Discus tank, but it the planted tank it is not suggested by Seachem. It's just like carbon as it doesn't really hurt to use it buy why add anything that is not truly needed, it cost money, takes time, and the Ehiem media does a fine job. It does say at Seachems site that it doesn't harm micro nutrients but it's right next to removes ammonia, nitrites, & nitrates and that's all part of the cycle we try to re-create. I would say if it makes you feel better than go a head and use it and or carbon, I do every blue moon or when I buy a new filter it comes with a carbon pad.

A lot of folks claim Matrix is better too but stock Eheim media has always worked well.


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## Naekuh (Oct 19, 2011)

*pulls head*

watches my dog chase its tail... lolol...

i like the crystal clear water where fish looks like its floating...  

however its not worth it if its gonna stunt the growth on all my plants unless i dont want them to grow to reduce maintenance on gardening...

Meh... i have a 1L container of purigen, which i was gonna install next week, but now im lost on what i should do with it.


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## xenxes (Dec 22, 2011)

What I wrote above I bolded/edited some below (was not very articulate before):



xenxes said:


> I don't use mine anymore in heavily planted tanks because I want some natural nitrates in a no-maintenance tank (no fert dosing). When I added it in, nitrates depleted from 20ppm to 0 and never went back up (*it removes organic matter before it gets converted to ammonia->nitrite->nitrate, not any of the compounds directly*; but fast growing plants were eating existing nitrates up too fast).
> 
> I recommend using Purigen in the following situations:
> (1) Fauna only tank with no or low plants
> ...


 I don't use any kind of chemical filtration anymore in my planted (non-QT) tanks. For the planted tank forums you guys are really underestimating the power of plants :tongue:

If you don't want to use it anymore, you can still hold on to it to filter out medication, or to quickly mitigate overfeeding, nitrite spikes. Or in place of a water change you could just hook up the Purigen and wait for Nitrates to level off (w/c is still faster and recommended if it's too high).


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Naekuh said:


> *pulls head*
> 
> watches my dog chase its tail... lolol...
> 
> ...


 Sell it to me cheap


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## tbarabash (May 18, 2011)

I use 500ml of purigen dumped into seachem's the bag in my 36g bowfront in my eheim 2217. All that purigen fits fine in the bag and i just throw it on the top of my filter before the big wad of filter floss. I end up recharging it every month or so cause I have a LOT of driftwood that uses up the purigen in about 2-3 weeks.. slowly becoming longer as all the tannins leech out. 

Seachem suggests to soak it in 50/50 bleach/water for 24 hours, I find that 24h isnt enough to get all of my stuff clean (I mean my bag is kinda packed pretty full) so I usually soak in like 60/40 bleach/water for 3 days and sometimes if it's really really grossly soaked in I'll change the bleach/water solution and soak it for another day. Then I soak it in the suggested dechlor solution (i forget 3tbsp/cup or something) for a full 48 hours (instead of the 8 that they suggest... Good way to see if it's done is put your nose close to the dechlor solution and if it still smells like chlorine then the bleach isn't all gone yet)and it's almost always coming out 100% clean and ready. 

Yes, I may go through a lot of bleach but 4$ for a gallon of bleach that lasts me 15 or so recharges seems like a pretty good deal to me. The difference between purigen in the filter and non purigen is night and day, it still blows my mind everytime I put it in how much clearer it makes the water, if my glass is clean you can't even tell that there's anything in the tank it looks like the fish and all the plants are floating in air.

I will use purigen until the day I retire from this hobby, for sure.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Anyone knows how much Purigen fits into one Seachem The Bag ?


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## tbarabash (May 18, 2011)

At least 500ml in my experience. I wouldn't do any more than that, I think I have about 450 in mine and it takes quite a while for it to recharge cause of how thick the balls are in there


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

I use purigen in all of my planted tanks. Seachems site pretty much reads to me that it removes ammonia from the water column, not nitrates. 

After trying many DIY methods because I felt 'the bag' was a stupid way for seachem to make more $, I now use 'the bag' in every filter with purigen! It should have only taken one episode where I lost $10 of purigen during rinsing because after the second/third recharge the pantyhose/sock I used as a holding device disintegrated in my hand and the purigen going down the drain. 

It's really the best Chem product on the market 
I have a bag I have recharged 10 times at least and even though after a charge it's not snow white, it still gets the job done. 

You should get at least two bags per tank so you can just swap one out at filter service intervals. You can just recharge the other bag over the next two/three days and when done keep it in a sealed ziploc in the stand awaiting use.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Yeah that's what i will do Bsmith, since it takes a while to recharge it it will be worth to have 2 bags.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I have bags going on 4 years old now that have gotten recharged every few months and still work great. I do typically bleach the older bags twice to get them nice and white, though.

I'm a huge fan. People do double-takes when they see fish swimming around in my tanks going, "Wow- there's water in there! It's so clear!"


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## celticmiss (Jan 26, 2012)

I have a question on the purigen as I am considering it for my tanks...sorry to but in but thought someone could answer. It mentions that if your dechlorinator has slime coat it will not reguvinate??? I do not use prime...it messes with my water tests and I cannot stomach the smell. So does anyone know of a dechlorinator that will work with it? I currently use aquasafe plus.


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## isu712 (Jan 11, 2008)

I've used Novaqua plus and it works fine.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

You have to make sure that a different brand of dechlor does not contain any products that are -amine based. Otherwise, when you put the purigen back into the tank, the -amines in the tank water from the dechlor product could combine with any residual bleach left in the purigen, and form chloramines.

I personally just stick with Prime to be on the safe side.


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## celticmiss (Jan 26, 2012)

I have read about the amine thing but do not really know how to tell what that is?


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## m00se (Jan 8, 2011)

API "Tap Water Conditioner" is sodium thiosulfate and water. Cheap and effective. Or, you could buy a lb of dry sodium thiosulfate for $15 and have enough to last a fish store 200 years.:smile:


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## 150EH (Dec 6, 2004)

Well I'm sorry Eviltwist but this discussion has lead me to purchase two 100 ml bags of Purigen and a bottle of AmQuel to dechlorinate to see how it effects my tank water. I put one 100 ml bag in my filter today and won't remove until the middle of next month, then I add a clean bag and regenerate the spent bag.

It's all lauraleellbp fault because when she posted I'm a huge fan. People do double-takes when they see fish swimming around in my tanks going, "Wow- there's water in there! It's so clear!" I knew I was going to try it.

I'll let you know if they have converted me.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Haha i ordered 500 ml of it, gonna have it this Saturday but unfortunately Seachem Bags won't make it here until Wednesday. 
I'll update once i receive all the items and will do a bit of testing.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I had my doubts about Purigen at first too- just bought a bag to see how it compared to carbon.

That was I think almost 5 years ago, and I don't see myself ever going back. :hihi:



m00se said:


> API "Tap Water Conditioner" is sodium thiosulfate and water. Cheap and effective. Or, you could buy a lb of dry sodium thiosulfate for $15 and have enough to last a fish store 200 years.:smile:


You gotta be careful with sodium thiosulfate because it does NOT detox chloramines, which many water treatment facilities use at least occasionally (to "purge" their systems) if not all the time. They favor chloramines because they don't evaporate out like chlorine does- which makes them that much more deadly for fish, too.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Got my Purigen today but still no bag.
Anyways i got a question, did you guys rinse it before use ?


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## bsmith (Jan 8, 2007)

Eviltwist said:


> Got my Purigen today but still no bag.
> Anyways i got a question, did you guys rinse it before use ?


No need, just bag it up in something and throw it in.


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## GeToChKn (Apr 15, 2011)

Eviltwist said:


> Got my Purigen today but still no bag.
> Anyways i got a question, did you guys rinse it before use ?


Use a very fine mesh bag or double layer pantyhose for it and just toss it in.


It does work good and helps against any kind of spikes in a tank. Some may say it's not needed but if you have a bunch of $30 a piece shrimp, a $10 bag to prevent an ammonia spike and kill off a $1000 in shrimp seems worth it. It also helps keep a tank crystal clear.


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

Yeah i have ordered "The Bag" for it.


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## etbarry (Feb 22, 2009)

how often do you folks recharge or replace?


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## Eviltwist (Jun 15, 2011)

So after using it for about a week i can say the water is a bit cleaner (it was really clean to begin with).

There is no noticeable effect on Nitrates. There was noticeable smell in the water of Purigen (i did not rinse it and i guess i should have done that).
I have used all 500ml of it separated into 2 bags at the last layer (top of filter).
"The Bag" would be a bit better if it had some kind of zipper at the top instead of zip tie.


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## discuspaul (Jul 27, 2010)

I've been using Purigen without a break for 3 years in my planted discus tanks and, like lauralee and tbarabash, I swear by it, and can't imagine not ever using it. I keep 2 bags in use, one in each of my AC 110's, and 2 or 3 in reserve for replacing those that need re-charging.
Here's my take on the results, based on long use and careful observation;

- Purigen is an excellent product, removing a number of impurities from water as stated by Seachem, including the waste that releases ammonia, nitrites & nitrates, but not the nitrate presence itself.
- It has little or no efffect of removing beneficial elements such as plant fertilizer compounds.
- Regular use produces and maintains crystal water clarity.
- It should be placed in bags (I use fine mesh bags from a variety of inexpensive sources, and keep the Purigen particulate from escaping by double-bagging - organza fabric works particularly well) at a thickness of no more approx. 1/2" to 3/4" for best effectiveness - thicker layers tend to preclude a free-flow of water through the particulate and reduces the beneficial effect.
- Purigen should be re-charged on a regular, relatively frequent basis, I suggest no less frequently than monthly, to maintain it's peak efficiency.
- Purigen can be re-generated up to a dozen times or more (a year's usage) and still maintain effectiveness.
- For best, whitest cleansing, I suggest full strength bleach, but no more than for approx. 24 hours, then rinsing well several times over the next few days to ensure no residual bleach - keep it in water in a pail until next usage - don't let it dry out.
- If you bleach, whether full or partial, for say 72 hours straight or more, you may find the Purigen particles may begin to disintegrate. I've left Purigen in bleach for about a week, and there was absolutely nothing left in the bag after that time. 
- IMO it is a product that is significantly better and more reliable than carbon (or Chemi-Pure) for a number of different usages.
Give it a try and you will likely not be without it again.
Here's my LOW-TECH planted discus tank, posted only to show you it has no adverse effect on good plant growth:
http://s1105.photobucket.com/albums/h357/discuspaul/Sept2011

Hope this helps some folks out.


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## BS87 (Apr 9, 2012)

Hate to bump an "old" thread, but just to those that buy the 100mL pre-bagged purigen: Make sure you inspect the seams of the bag before you use it. I bought 2, and on one the seam had a small area that was not sealed. Fast forward to 2 hours after I put that bag into my AquaClear and my fish are chasing all the little purigen balls around the tank. Lost about 1/4 of the bag :|


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