# my first planted ADA 120P tank journal



## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

hi everyone, i just joined the forum, first of all - i am a newbie by all measure, so please excuse my ignorance :icon_cool 

one of the main reasons to join was to share my first try with an ada tank, it is a 120p that i set up this last weekend, there is much more to do, but it is now up and running (can't wait for it to finish cycling)

here it goes

arrival of the ADA cube garden, i had to wait 2 weeks due to work and schedule and buy all other items before i could actually set this up, you cannot imagine the impatience on my part










here's after i opened the top, very nice glass and cilicone work










i got a rena xp3 filter, hydor in-line heater, and ada aquasoil










here's the stand, not an ADA stand (way too expensive), but something that has clean lines and simplicity










finally, the tank is sitting on the stand  










trying to figure out rockwork before substrate goes in










another view










i wanted to do two-tone substrate, so here goes in the separator boards










aquasoil is poured, the boards are holding nicely with help from the rocks










here goes the sand (large grain - almost small gravel size)










another view of the separators










the border from the side










walla, the cardboard comes off and the substrates are holding great :bounce: 










playing with hardscape - malaysian driftwood, and lava rocks










closer look, don't like the serpent face (left section valley border)










ok some rearranging of rocks/wood, plants (amazon sword - regular and compact, and anubias nana) and water goes in (now i have a dragon face, need to get rid of that too)










here's better view of the valley










different view










filter goes in, hate the ugly intake and outflow tubes (eyesore), i just ordered some lilly's to be here in about a week










top view from left










top view from right










lights are in hagel glo 2*54w










here's another view










and my favorite driftwood piece the "fallen tree"










what do you guys think? please provide feedback, remember i am very new, so please don't rip me into shreds :icon_neut


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## James From Cali (Dec 15, 2006)

I like it. I love the black specs in the sand....IDK why, I just do lol. What are your plants and fish that you plan to stock.


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## CobraGuppy (Sep 23, 2007)

Amazing Tank, what other plants are you thinking of adding?

I just noticed this too, why do they call it a Cube Garden when its a rectangle.


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## Tex Gal (Mar 28, 2008)

Very nice! Looks like it's gonna be pretty low maintenance!


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## Green Leaf Aquariums (Feb 26, 2007)

Very nice ADA..Well done with the light fixture


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks for the kind comments, i actually like the black specs (aquasoil specs) in the sand too, it happened when i was pouring water, i was going to clean it up, but decided against it because i thought it looked more "natural" this way

as you can probably tell, this tank does not have any CO2, and only has about 1.9wpg at this point, so i can't have any high light/growth plants, so i have amazon sword both "regular" variety and the compact variety (does not grow too big) and anubias nana, these should do well with ~2wpg w/o CO2, but you never know, i am going to try to see what happens with these and maybe later once things settle, add some more plants, also if i decide to do CO2, i plant on getting the lighting upto 2.5wpg to give them a little more

as far as fish, for now i plan on transferring fish from my 30gallon tank once this is cycled, this includes 4 sub-adult koi angels, 4 checkerboard cichlids (2m, 2fm), 2 hillstream borneo loaches, ocats, i also have some assorted tetras that i might not transfer to this, i want one big group of schooling fish, maybe i will get ~20 rummynoses or ~20harlequin rasboras, but i have to wait at least 3 to 4 weeks (if not more) before i can add all of them


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## Anti-Pjerrot (Jan 20, 2006)

Nice setup. Background?

Im giving you it straight - since i can see youre not a bad beginner - on the opposite i see a lot of good signs. 

I suggest you move the "fallen tree"... It dont add anything good to the layout, even though you might have an idea with it. Think about how the idea will become more attractive and try to figure out what you want before you do it.

Second - you need way more slope on the substrate. I suggest you suck up a lot of the sand in the front, since there is no need for a thick layer there. And try to flatten it more. You can add some more to the back as well.

I dont think the hardscape will work in the long run, and suggest you try to rearrange it a bit. Use more smaller rocks in the substrate border and remove the big rocks. In this kind of setup - the rocks are usually used only as border pieces and not as primary decoration as the driftwood is. 

The driftwood should act as the primary decoration and be more wisely placed. Its good the have the driftwood break the border, but do it with care and dont place it in the border or outside. The driftwood should be placed as it would bend over the border and not on it. 
Dont place the driftwood so close to the sides - it gives a feeling of a smaller tank and a claustrofobic feel.
Try to rearrange the driftwood so it adds more to the open areas and dont try to hide it. Try to imagine how it will look when the plants are fully grown.

The 2 big rocks inside the borders does not add anything good, and takes up a lot of space. You could place driftwood or plants there instead, and move the driftwood out from the back. 


The overall concave style and plant choice is good, but you must have in mind how the swords grow - very big. This way you will have some very big plants, and they will be too domination if they're in the front. 

I would suggest you move them some back and plants some crypts instead. Also some fastgrowing plants would be a good idea for temporary plant mass.

So to sum it up - you have a very good setup with awesome potentiale. You just need some fine tuning on hardscape and plant positioning. 

I say that for a beginner - you show some very good signs.
And you need also to focus on CO2 (Important), full range fertilizers and good algea eaters (lots of otocinclus and amanoshrimps, and some SAE).

Doing the first couple of weeks - the Aqua Soil leaks ammonia and you need to do a lot of waterchanges every day, or else you will get serious algae problems.


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## scottstephen (Jun 13, 2008)

Awesome tank. Can't wait to see pictures of it grown in and with fish.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Welcome to TPT- we're glad to have you  

That's absolutely gorgeous! There's no *way* you're really a newbie, right!?? 

I do think you'll need CO2 with that light, though- T5HO lighting simply blows the socks off of the CF lighting most people are used to.

I agree the placement of the "fallen tree" isn't quite right... it's an incredible piece of wood, but it needs to be worked in better with the rest of the scape somehow.

(PS- I have the same stand under my 90gal- I also like the nice clean lines. :icon_mrgr )


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## mott (Nov 23, 2006)

I usually don't like swords but this tank looks sweet! Good job.


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## CmLaracy (Jan 7, 2007)

Everything is nice and low maintenance, looks good. Will look even nicer when those swords start coming out of the water . One critique would be more slope, and a LOT less sand in the front, up against the front panel. Also you may want to keep the sand in a straight horizontal line up against the front, as an un-tidied sand foreground can affect the entire look of the scape. Other than some necessary work on the sand, minimizing it and straightening it out, IT LOOKS WONDERFUL! Nice job, good plants, especially for a new-comer. Keeping it low light yet high-tech, I like it.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks for all the feedback guys, yes it is a work in progress and i am new to this so bear with me, i rescaped the tank a little bit, the "fallen tree" has changed position, there are more driftwood and at this point it seems like a larger space after rescaping, i still have to flatten the sand in the front, i did not make some changes suggested because some things are more of a personal taste and expression, i know that swords can get rather large, but all the swords in the midground are actually compact swords, that will only grow slightly bigger than what i have now, the one's in the background will grow much bigger, since some of the key inhabitants will be angels, i wanted the amazon look, plus i like the cleaner look of amazons and nanas compared to stem plants, but i reserve the right to change my mind later  so here are some pics










here's another shot










here's my try at a cheesy shot, but it honestly looks cool and better in person










another try


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## roybot73 (Dec 15, 2007)

Very nice! I think some well placed moss would add a _lot_ to this layout...:thumbsup:


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

no way ur a first timer


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

hey guys, i need some advice, as all of you are aware of i am (some more painfully than others), no one likes algae in their tank, and i definitely hate them to put it lightly, i want to make sure i minimize the chance of too much algae growth in this new tank, what precautions should i take? PLEASE HELP, any advice is welcome


for some of you that have not read the entire thread and also i did not include much details, here are some facts about the tanks:

*size:* ADA 120p 48"*18"*18*
*gallonage:* rated 65USgallons, i'm thinking with substrate, rocks, its probably between 55 and 60
*first water went in* June 14, 2008
*plants:* planted on June 15, 2008, includes 10 bunches of amazon sword, and 12 little anubias nanas (of course none of these plants are high growth like a cabomba or anything, so algae has an upper hand in that sense)
*lighting:* Hagen GLO T5HO 2*54watts - photoperiod: ~8hours
*filter:* Rena XP3
*heater:*hydor in-line heater
*substrate:* ~65% ADA aquasoil, remaining sand (should be neutral), as you know aquasoil leaches ammonia - so ammonia has been very high, i also noticed that aquasoil lowered ph to between 6.4 and 6.8 (houston tap water is ~8 and it holds stable based on my other tanks w/o aquasoil)
water changes: performed a ~65% water change on June 16, and a ~35% water change on june 17
*algae: *have not noticed anything yet, but i am worried to death that it will just creep up on me and then i will be in algae hell forever
*livestock:* i have 4whiteclouds and 3 zebra danios for cycling

once again - please HELP


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

one more thing, i did dose fourish excel on june 15, and during 65% water change on june 16, i plan on dosing again today (june 18)


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

update - i have done at least 35% water change everyday the first week and have done one every other day since, the ammonia is now almost gone and of course nitrite is really high, hopefully that changes over the next few days, but the inevitable thing that i have been dreading has happened, i have green hair algae and some sort of read/brown algae, mostly on leaves and now seeing on the glass too, here are some other things, the only plant growth over the last 12 days (since the tank got water) has been the baby swords on the lines, they have all long roots going down to substrate, one touched already, and have given several leaves, but two of my nana rhizomes pretty much melted with leaves coming off, the rhizomes have been completey out of the substrate from the beginning just like the rest of the nanas but i am not sure why these two particularly melted, i hope they regenrate

i am dosing flourish excel with every water change, what can i do to keep a check on this hair algae and brown algae? 

i still can't put otos or other algae eaters because the tank is not cycled, i don't want to put BN because they almost skin swords! i might get SAE's, ottos, and nerites (if available), but still have to wait until cycled, i am still planning on doing water changes every other day or every two days until tank is completely cycled, but after that only weekly, please advice,

here are baby swords with some roots, these roots grow more than an inch a day!!









heres algae growing on glass 









one of the swords not doing so well 









NASTY hair algae super growth in two days (look on stem between two swordlets)









NASTY brown algae - seems like nana's are their favorite 









brown algae taking hold in sowrds - see small dotting at this point









more brown algae on nana 









any advice would be appreciate, please help


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## SuRje1976 (Feb 2, 2006)

Pretty normal startup algae issues. It will pass. Just keep up on the water changes. Maybe throw in a dozen otos. I wouldn't put any moss in the tank until the startup algae passes.


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## joetaff (Jun 9, 2007)

I would advise you get co2 of somekind on that tak asap, excel is good, but on a tank that size it would be cheaper (in the long run) and more effective to use a co2 system.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

my tank is cycled Smile)) i could not resist sharing a little update with the new inhabitants

here's cycled tank
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/cycled.jpg


updated full tank shot - notice i have added val nana - awesome plant
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/PICT0506.jpg


another angel updated full tank shot
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/PICT0511.jpg


close up of the val nana - love the way it looks
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/newvalnana.jpg


nasty algae - have to share the bad with the good
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/PICT0495.jpg


another nasty algae - but good news - most of the nanas have a new leaf - look in this pic
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/PICT0471.jpg


ok here are the awesome puffs (wall-e & eva) - they are curious about the snail - does not seem like they know how to eat it
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/howdoesthiswork.jpg


how does this work?
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/yummysnail.jpg


where is wall-e?
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/whereisjoey.jpg


the cories - three stooges
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/outonthewalk.jpg


following the leader
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/climbingtree.jpg


another try at the tree
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/fallingoffthetree.jpg


the loaner - she/he is sometimes with the other three - otherwise by himself!
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/PICT0476.jpg


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

You clicked on the wrong code to link all your pics- you clicked on the html instead of img


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

*sorry - here are the pix*

here's cycled tank 









updated full tank shot - notice i have added val nana - awesome plant










another angel updated full tank shot










close up of the val nana - love the way it looks










nasty algae - have to share the bad with the good










another nasty algae - but good news - most of the nanas have a new leaf - look in this pic










ok here are my new awesome puffs (wall-e & eva) - they are curious about the snail - but i don't think they know how to eat it!!










how does this work?










my new cories - three stooges










following the leader!










another try at this tree!!










here's the loner cory, he does not always hang out with the 3 stooges, but sometimes they are all together, don't know why he is a loner!










lucky snail (so far)


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

my calaqua stuff arrived today 

can't wait to put them in the tank this weekend

here's pix, looks nice but was not impressed with packaging


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Looks awesome!  

(Thanks for relinking all the pics for lazy ppl like me :icon_redf )

What about some Otos for all that brown algae?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks laura, i am planning on getting some ottos and amanos as soon as i can get to an lfs, ottos are not always the hardiest, i've seen them starve very easily before, how many is ideal for this 65gallon (keeping in mind i am thinking of getting nerites when available and amanos)?

it almost seems like the algae growth has significantly slowed since the tank has cycled, most of the stuff there is stuff that grew during the nitrite hike (hoping that is a pattern and not just a waiting period for another type of algae)

another thing i need to decide, what type of fish do i get for the one school of fish i want for this, of course there is the cardinal (i have kept them before and have 4 of them in my 30gallon tank, but everyone has them in planted tanks so it bores me a little, although they do look nice but don't school that tightly), the other was rummynoses - another favorite, but from what i have heard they are pretty sensitive and i didn't want a fish that is ultrasensitive - plus this is another typical one, and then i was thinking about harlequin rasboras - never kept them, they seem nice and small and supposedly school tightly, and a little less common compared to cardinals and rummys, what do you guys think?


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## AaronT (Apr 11, 2004)

10 Amazon sword plants are going to quickly outgrow that tank. If you want to keep the look you have now you might consider replacing them with smaller swords such as Echinodorus parviflorus 'Tropica' or another smaller species. 

I think you have a little too much water in the tank as well. I've found that it will slosh over the sides if you try to mess with anythign in the tank when the water level is that high. Try keeping it about 3/4"-1" from the top of the tank at the most.

All that being said, you've done a really great job, first timer or not.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks aaron for compliments, you are right, those swords can grow pretty big, i actually have 4 regular swords and 5 small swords (can't remember the name now), these 5 (in the middle section of each side) are not suppose to grow much taller than what they are now, but their offsprings on the other hand (through the shoots) have been growing fast, i have cut and planted a few and the remaining are aggressively sending roots to the ground with a few already have 3 or 4 roots in the ground from 4 inches above the ground, so i have to plant all of them or let them float - creates a different look, if the regular swords get too big, i will just simply remove them with the smaller species since i have the babies, maybe i should just do that now!!!

yes, the water level is quite high, i love the look of water level being almost at the tank level, but when i do any maintenance i usually do a water change and the levels are low, but sometimes during adhoc maintenance i have spilled from waving

one thing i forgot to mention in my last post, i do plan on moving my 4 sub-adult angels and 4 checkerboard cichlids from my 30gallon to this tank, just a consideration in choosing a school of fish, another alternative is black neon tetras, do they school tightly?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

i moved my angels from my 30gallon to here, i am so proud of them and i think they are one of the best looking angles i have seen around (minus nice altums), here's a few pix

dazed and confused - just dropped in the tank



















but priorities are priorities, so chasing begins to establish pecking order again



















followed up with fighting










soon 3 are fighting










the 4th one joins in the show




























still fighting



















done fighting, lets all line up










here's a close up shot of one - just brilliant - these pix do not do them justice, plus because of the move the colors are a little faded here


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

as i have mentioned before, i am planning on having one shoal (20+) of some schooling fish in this 65 gallon, after many thoughts and research i have narrowed it down to a few choices, i wish there was a way to poll, but wanted to see what you guys think is the best choice from these and then i will make a decision, they are in order of my current preference 

1) Harlequin Rasbora 
2) Rummy Nose 
3) Cardinal Tetra 
4) Black Neon Tetra


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## A Hill (Jul 25, 2005)

The tank looks very nice.

The brown algae is mostly diatoms some ottos will clear it up quickly.

Aquascaping wise yes there is a large aspect of personality to it but some things are beyond personality in making the scape look better and should at least be tried out.

Sand, since it is only asthetically used I also think you should take some out, just siphon it out and if you don't like the lower level just pour it back in. 

The tank is a bit symmetrical, in aquascaping you usually want to go more asymmetrical. See how each corner has a boarder and a big rock? It may look better if you take one rock out (right side probably) and either move it to the left side to make one large pile of rock, or just take it out, and replace it with moving the swords back and adding something like a chain sword or hair grass to create a bit of a foreground in one part of the tank. 

I think you may also like thread fin rainbows for your tank opposed to the more traditional schooling fish. But out of those my favorite is rummynose, black lace skirted tetras also may look nice in your tank but seem to get a little raggedy looking over time (their name varies a bit area to area) 

By the way, Welcome to the forum, just don't limit yourself by saying "I'm a newb" use that to try more things because you don't have to settle on anything right away.

-Andrew


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

so here's an update:

1) I got the calaqua intake/outflow installed - looks awesome (actually don't see it unless you look for it)

2) Got Harlequin Rasboras - a school of 25 - they are just amazing schoolers and the sight of them schooling together is so awesome

here's pix:

full shot of the tank - notice the calaqua pipes on the left










another shot - any intake/outflow or pipes barely visible










panaroma from left 










panaroma from right










harlequins - these pictures do NOT do justice to how awesome they look when schooling, also, i could not take a good picture of all of them schooling, they seem to scatter more when i try to take pix!









































































here's a close up, the copper/pink/blues are amazing in these fish - my pix do not really capture it 










heres the BIG surprise, after a day of the harlequins being in their new home i did a water change after feeding and walla, a spawning frenzy, i have never seen this type of behavior in person or in video and i wish i had a good video to capture, but i tried my best to capture in pix, i loved watching this, it went on for at least an hour, the lone fat danio, and my checkerboard cichlids made a yummy roe dinner out of all the eggs, here's a series of pix w/o any order




































































































enough about the harlequin rage, my 5 new ottos have been awesome, they have cleaned up all the nasty hair algae and most other algae and so far algae growth has been in good check with flourish excel dosing

here's my ottos at work










here's a few plants that were nasty with algae - if you scroll back a few postings you will see the before pix




























here's my amazing checkerboard cichlids, i have 2males and 2females, the colors on the two males are amazing, this pic does no justice to say the least










my hillstream loaches have been moved from the 30g to here










here's a series of calaqua pix


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

everything looks nice. You cichlids are amazing! Congrats on the algae issue. I would suggest reducing the # of pics in the last post though, as it took forever to load all of them.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

u guys are not going to believe this, my checkerboard cichlids just spawned, i cannot believe my eyes, first the dominent male/female both lost the checkerboard pattern and had one solid line down the middle, the male showed amazing dark maroon colors along with irridescent, now they are done laying, he has fertilized, now the female does not allow the male to come close, she is one third his size, but is vigorously fighting with him, and not allowing him near the eggs, he wants ont be on the eggs too! i cannot believe this, i am sure all the eggs will be snack for all the harlequin and others, but this is freaking exciting, the male which is one 5th of the angels, is not allowing them in the vicinity and the female too!!!! i got a couple of pix, not as good:

mom laying eggs - dad in the top left corner










mom guarding eggs



















mom fanning










eggs - close up


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

congratulations, I bet that was exciting to watch


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

your fish love your tank! next it will be the angels!


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## Renegade545 (Oct 28, 2007)

Great looking tank


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## lescarpentier (Feb 2, 2008)

You have really turned this into a first class setup.:thumbsup:


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks guys, i've been enjoying this, the harlequin spawning was very interesting, i didn't know they did the under the leaf upside down egg laying (assumed egg scatterer), it almost seems like everyday a few females spawn with her heram of males behind her


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## SearunSimpson (Jun 5, 2007)

Your tank looks really good. I always keep seeing Checkerboards but pass them up cause I'm scared they'll be too agressive and what not. Do you have many issues with them, considering you have two pairs?
Also, is the ADA-120P 120gallons? If not, how big is your tank cause I've got a new 90gl and your tank is sorta inspiring me to get it going.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks searunS, checkerboards fall within the dwarf cichlid category and among the least aggressive of dwarf cichlids, i have kept german rams, kribs, apistos, and checkerboards appear to be the least aggressive of them all, the dominant male will chase the other male a little, but nothing too aggressive or serious, but if you had them in a small aquarium (footpring less than 36"L*18"W), i would recommend one male with one or few females

ADA 120P is approximately 65 USgallons, the 120 refers to 120cm or 48" which is the length of the tank, the footprint is 48"L*18"W which is typical footprint for a standard 75 or 90 gallon tank (gallonage differs based on height in this case)


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

i've been out of town for work the last few days, got back in this evening, and guess what? my angels just did it, they spawned for the first time, with so many mouths i am sure the eggs won't last that long, but its fun for the time it exists, here's pix




























from a little far










a little farther - now you can see all the patroling hungry mouths, the checkerboards are the biggest culprits along with the danio, the checkerboard females are very small and they sneak in a get the eggs before the much larger and awkward moving angels realize, but they are trying their best to keep the eggs


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## kevin007 (Aug 15, 2007)

Damn..too much fish porn, what in the world is in the water!? lol


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## MedRed (May 20, 2008)

MedRed said:


> your fish love your tank! next it will be the angels!


who called it?!


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

wow, everything is spawning. you need some mouthbrooding bettas, they wont let their eggs/fry be eaten.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

*ONE MONTH UPDATE - July 20, 08*

medred, u were right, i have to admit, but unfortunately as expected, all the eggs were eaten within two days (checkerboard cichlids main culprit), the two checkerboard females spawned again and those eggs are also gone

mark, i would love to get hold of a pair of mouth brooding bettas, but don't even know where to start, never see them at lfs's, do you know online retailers that can be trusted?

well, i thought i would do a one month update:

overall, i am very happy, had lots of spawnings by everyone, and so far i have been able to keep algae in check (keeping fingers crossed), the fish have been doing well, as of now i don't have any plans of adding anything unless i see/get something very interesting (like the mouthbrooding betta)

here's how it looked a month ago










here's how it looks like today


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## Chrisinator (Jun 5, 2008)

Sweet tank! Very jealous!


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

www.AnubiasDesign.com and www.AquaBid.com are 2 sources for mouthbrooding betta. Do your HW before buying from anyone on AB- that works just the same as Ebay.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

quick update - my first nana flower in this tank

from far










close up










a different view


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Very nice! :thumbsup:


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks laura

here's a quick update 

my angel pair spawned again  this time on amazon leaf

mom w/ eggs










dad w/ eggs










the pair "what should we name them"










here's all my ocats having a party on the nana, i love my ocats, this is the most lively badge of ocats i have ever had


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Update? Have any of the spawns survived to date?


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## deleted_user_16 (Jan 20, 2008)

update?


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## John_Auberry (Nov 2, 2008)

Looks great


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

This has been a long time coming, but lots have happened over the last 6 months and I could not get to it, so here is a very condensed version of what happened

the swords and val nana’s grew like crazy (w/o any CO2), took over most of the tank, here’s a few pictures, these are from nov. of 2008 (see a few posts above for comparison)



















Close up of val nana’s even taking over my little opening



Even more close up of val nana multiplying










At this point I was still doing weekly 30% plus water change (the only maintenance) and despite all this growth and no other maintenance, not one strand of algae

Around dec, I was even more busy and could not do regular water changes, the val nana’s clogged up everything and swords grew even more, I trimmed and cut one bucket of val nana every week, and it grew even more, shot all over the place and then all of a sudden the tank was taken over by algae, by mid jan, there was barely any place in the tank for fish to swim and I was getting tired of how it was looking

So I became bold this Sunday and decided enough is enough, so I just started uprooting the swords, there was soooooo much root, each plant took out a huge clump of aquasoil, the entire tank looked like thick mud by the time I was done uprooting the swords and nanas, then I had to wait 4 hours for the water to clear enough for me to do some rescaping, all this time all the fish were still there (I was paying there was no bad gas leaking from substrate)

I moved around the rocks, tried to contain the aquasoil that was now all over the tank, replanted the nanas and replanted some existing crypts and crypts from my 30gallon

My tank is still ridden with algae and nerite eggs (these nerite eggs are something new and I didn’t know about this egg problem, they will be out of there very soon), so please bare in mind this is a work in progress and it will take some time for this new setup to set in, so here you go – pix from yesterday



















Below are some current residents (pix taken today)

Here’s the king of the tank – the bigdaddy










With the mrs



the blue ram male








http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd73/ataphoto/germanrammale.jpg

the gold ram male










The honey gourami male blowing his nest, these guys are feisty and blow water above water line



My only pleco, still don’t know what type he is, he has never grown past 3 inches and is the best algae eater ever


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## dr.tran (Oct 8, 2007)

Make sure u lock ur doors at night cuz I'm gonna steal ur tank!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks dr. tran, i can't wait for the rescape to settle in

here's my other tank, its a 30 gallon tall (24"long*12wide*24high)










closer shot










current residents are not permanent, i can't decide what i want in there, i was thinking of moving my breeding koi angels from 120p to this one to see if they can rear any fry's if they are by themselves, but i am not sure if i will do that


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## ColeMan (Mar 9, 2008)

I just went through your journal - quite a progression in the last 6 months, especially for a new hobbyist. :thumbsup:

Where did you get the stand for the ADA 120? It looks quite nice... 

What are your plans for the tank now that the swords are gone? Crypts and anubias, and ferns, or are you going to try your hand with some stems?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks coleman

the stand is a aquatic fundamentals stand rated for 75/90 gallon, i love it, i've had a lot of ppl ask about the stand, it is very simple with clean lines, the quality is good, i have no complaints so far

i've always been a huge fan of nana's, as you can see in the rescape, i have lots of nanas, they will stay, i also have a big crypt (that was previously dwarfed by the swords) and some smaller crypts, i love crypts too, so will keep those, as far as stem, i am not sure i want to, i've never had co2 and don't plan on adding in the future, to get some of good stem plants in the shape i would like, i would need co2 and i don't want to go that direction, also, i love the looks of nanas and crypts, so i might keep adding different crypts and nanas!


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## dbmaven (Feb 11, 2009)

Awful nice work there, finfan.

A question if you don't mind - what media are you using in the XP3 filter?
I'm looking to set up something similar (boy am I glad I found your thread!!) and am curious about the filtration/biological balance you've managed to achieve.

Thanks !


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks dbmaven

i wish i could tell you i am using something sophisticated/clever, but as of now (and from the beginning) i've had foam - "ceramic" bio media - carbon - more fine mesh foam (in that order bottom to top), i plan on slowly moving out all carbon

i have to say in my experience xp3 is a superb filter, super effective and no sound whatsoever, i've had it on this tank since day one (8 months now)


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## SeaSerpant (Feb 20, 2008)

I wish my aquarium looked that good. I think it looks amazing, i loved every scape you've had so far, keep up the good work!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks SS, so as you guys know, i have nana and a few crypts in the 120p now, i want to try some other plants that will be ok with 2wpg and no CO2, i have javas in mind, but what else will go well?


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## dbmaven (Feb 11, 2009)

finfan said:


> thanks dbmaven
> 
> i wish i could tell you i am using something sophisticated/clever, but as of now (and from the beginning) i've had foam - "ceramic" bio media - carbon - more fine mesh foam (in that order bottom to top), i plan on slowly moving out all carbon
> 
> i have to say in my experience xp3 is a superb filter, super effective and no sound whatsoever, i've had it on this tank since day one (8 months now)



Thanks for the reply!

That's amazing. If I would have had to guess, I'd have said you weren't using any bio media at all to get that kind of growth without CO2 injection.
Wow.
And you're not dosing any kind of nutrients or anything??


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

i've only dosed flourish excel irregularly during some water changes, nothing else


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## kovuu (Dec 10, 2008)

awesome! i just dont understand, most everything i read people either inject, or diy co2. how do you grow your plants so well without any?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks kovuu, in my humble opinion, it all depends on the type of plants and the mixture of light and nutrients, in my case sword, val nana, crypt, and nana are all medium to low light requirement plants, i provided 2wpg lighting (tank height is also only 18 inches), and i had aquasoil (any other soil base would do the same), i sparingly used flourish excel for some carbon supplement, in this scenario i would not expect much need to co2 for lush growth, in other instances (different plants/substrate/chemistry) there might be and in my scenario co2 would have probably produced faster growth (which would have been undesireable in my case), i personally try to stay as low tech as possible, but some enjoy the challenge of a high tech environment, but things can also go very bad very fast when things go wrong in a high tech environment, an accidental overdose of high c02 can kill the fish


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

i have news! guess what i got from wify for valentines  i'll let the pix speak for themselves


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Beautiful fish!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks, they are gorgeous and these pix just simply don't do justice, my first ever discus, now i don't know why i didn't have them earlier!!!


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## waterdog1 (Jan 12, 2005)

Thats a lot of fish for that tank. yikes..


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## PJtree23 (Feb 4, 2009)

i just read your journal, nice! 

How are the Calaqua pipes doing? 

Tank does look a little crowded, how are they getting along?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks pjtree, the calaqua pipes are awesome, i have no complaints whatsoever, the tank is a 65gallon tank, i have five discus, the adult angel pair has been moved to their own 30 gallon, but even if they were not i would not be worried, the rest of the fish are basically tetras and a few dwarf cichlids, so i don't know why its so crowded to you guys? the discus have 12+ gallons per fish (which is more than recommended) and the tetras and dwarf cichlid has very little waste, so i would like to understand your and waterdog's logic. How many discus have you guys kept and for how long? How long have you kept fish to become experts on stocking levels?


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## waterdog1 (Jan 12, 2005)

finfan said:


> thanks pjtree, the calaqua pipes are awesome, i have no complaints whatsoever, the tank is a 65gallon tank, i have five discus, the adult angel pair has been moved to their own 30 gallon, but even if they were not i would not be worried, the rest of the fish are basically tetras and a few dwarf cichlids, so i don't know why its so crowded to you guys? the discus have 12+ gallons per fish (which is more than recommended) and the tetras and dwarf cichlid has very little waste, so i would like to understand your and waterdog's logic. How many discus have you guys kept and for how long? How long have you kept fish to become experts on stocking levels?


I typically see Discus @ 20 gallons/fish. More power to you, if you can keep the tank and discus successful with that load you have accomplished an aquatic success. Now that you removed the angels, its a little more reasonable. Its a sweet tank. Go with what works for you:thumbsup:


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## CAM6467 (Feb 11, 2009)

finfan, wonderful tank! I think that a given tank's bioload is variable, and if your water parameters are within normal ranges you don't need to worry about too many fish. I've been keeping cichlids for years and I've always had "too many" according to popular opinion, but I've never had any adverse reactions. 

I'm loving this thread, and I'm excited to see where this tank goes in the future. I'm new to the planted tank as well, and I'm going to need some advice. Check out my link. Who knows, maybe you can offer another "newbie" some advice. Keep up the amazing work.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. You have already pulled off the most amazing trick in aquarium history. You got your WIFE fish for valentine's day! I wish my wife was into my tanks like yours obviously is!! 

Keep up the good work.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

waterdog... please excuse my comments, i was not in a good frame of mind when i read your post and maybe reacted hastily... anyway, i don't think its the ideal discus setup by any means... but we will see.... i might even take them back

cam6467... thanks for the kind words, yes, i'm a lucky guy... she like this stuff and does not mind me fussing with fish... looked at your journal... looking good... keep it up


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

It’s been almost 3 months since my last post, so I think its about time I update this journal with what is going on with this tank. Well, I decided that this was not an ideal home for the discus, there was too much plant/bio material built up in the system and the choice was to completely gut it and re-do with perhaps just a few plants or keep it as a planted tank and I really love planted tanks and so the discuss were returned and that venture put on hold for the time being until I can really do a discuss tank from scratch. 

So its not fun unless you experiment with plants/tanks. I have never worked with stem plants, so I wanted to give them a try. I was discouraged since I don’t have any CO2 and do not intend to have any CO2. So I went to the LFS and bought a few stem plants (do not know their names, later I will ask for ID from you plant gurus). I planted them at random spots around the tank, at this point my goal is not to necessarily aquascape but to see if I can actually sustain stem plants in my system. Surprisingly they took off and all but one type of plant grew like crazy, in a very short time I had to start doing cuts. Initially I was throwing the cuts away not realizing I can just replant them. When I realized that I started replanting them throughout the tank and the cuts grew just as well!! So I will post pictures below to show this progression. At this point I still have not attempted aquascaping but I did what may be somewhat planned placement since I did not want to change the “bone” structure of the tank at this point. 

here are two pix when i first planted the stem plants




















here's what it looks like as of last weekend after i figured out that i can replant the cuts!!!! i can't believe i threw away so many at first w/o realizing




























close up of left side










close up of right side










right panaroma










left panaroma










top back from right










top back from left










following are some plant species i have, some i know and others i don't, please help me id them, also there are several other plants that i could not figure out the best way to picture them... those coming later

unknown plant from top










unknown same plant as above from front










another unknown plant










another unknown plant, i think it is called star something










unknown plant and peek-a-boo from my gold ram










unknown crypt plant










another unknown plant










cabomba carolina?










anubias nana 










below are some current resident (some have been with me for a while), with all efforts i just could not take some good close-ups of my AMAZING congo tetras, so i did not post any, i also could not do so for my bleeding hearts, i got some turquise rainbow pix, but not really as nice as they look in person

turqouise rainbow










honey gourami










harlequin rasbora










bolivian ram










german ram couple... these are two gems... always spawn but lose eggs










apisto macmasteri... killed his wife... now alone... this is a wild specimen










here are my very fav. wild caught black phantoms... notice very different from the colors you see in stores for black phantoms or red phantoms... this is almost an awesome mix of both black and red










rummy's... these guys would not pose... very hard to get a shot... theres more, but i could only capture 3 in pix, one of the best schoolers i would say










very regal koi angel, he is always in front center for pix, can't picture plants because he is always blocking view 










black neon and rainbow


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## Veloth (Jun 25, 2008)

Gorgeous tank roud: Sorry about the discus :icon_cry:


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks veloth, it was just not the right set up for discus

anyone want to help me with plants i'm calling "unknown"? just want to know their names


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## volatile (Feb 13, 2007)

I really like the lush look of your tank, and all the different varieties of plants you used.


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

The one you called "star something" is called star grass. The tank looks much better roud:


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks guys for the kind words and the star grass plant id

anyone want to help me out with the iding the other plants?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

this is something i got over a pm, but i thought it is worth sharing with everyone, what have your experience with open top ADA tanks as far as jumpers go?

on this tank the Danio's have been worse for me, i've never been able to keep them from jumping, the congo tetra and turqouise rainbows though very fast and active have not jumped (keeping fingers crossed), a surprise jumper was one of my beloved paired koi angel which was a big loss for me and two of my hillstream loaches chased each other off the tank also!


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## alter ego trip (Jun 1, 2009)

Just finished reading through the whole thread. I know that aquascaping is based a lot on personal preference. The first go around just didn't click for me, I like this new scaping a ton better. Great job!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks AGT

on another note, i bought 5 amano shrimps for the first time this saturday, even with so many hiding places somehow they kept jumping off my tank or getting to the top and moving like bugs getting all the tetras and angels excited to attack them

many of you have ada or ada style open top tanks with similar inhabitants line mine, did or do you have the same experience

i'm very disappointed at losing all of them... what can i do differently... i thought i had the perfect home for amanos!!!!


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## ExReefer (Jan 27, 2009)

I have not experienced any jumping shrimp and I have six Amano shrimp in my open top 75 gal plant tank. My shrimp are very calm and don’t hide. They pick at the plants 24/7 and my fish ignore them. I’ll bet your angelfish are chasing the shrimp. The angelfish could probably eat them or kill them while trying to eat them. I would not recommend large angelfish with shrimp or slow moving small fish. Angels are very good hunters. Throw some feed guppies in there sometime and watch them sneak up on them.


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

reefer... i think you might be right, i just didn't think that one angel would go around and do that in less than 24 hours with so much plant cover, but i can see that, my koi angel female in my 30 gallon planted tank ate the two precious red badis badis i added there about a month ago, the bigger one of the two badis got stuck in the females mouth and i had to pull it out... that was an interesting exercise, i think i have a hazy pic, i need to post that


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

here's an update, the plants took over and i should have taken a picture before trimming, but i forgot, today i had a huge trim and pretty much got two buckets full of cuts, wish i had a place to plant them! the lotus has really gotten big and i love the plant but can't decide yet if i leave it there or not or do what with it!

full tank shot










close up of lotus










i was finally able to get some shots of my congos which are not easy to picture, these pictures are ok but really don't do them justice



















notice the teeth!!!










note the teeth again!




























here's my beautiful harlequins and fat gold cloud










here's a bad pic of panduro










here's another dwarf cichlid (forgot the name) he can get very dark or light, in this pic he is more on the light side










so i tried and tried to get some pix of my odessa barbs with no luck... here are some partial pix



















female with male










last but not least, my loan clown loach, he does the side by side dance with my congos quite a bit... not sure what that means, he is about 4+ inches... same size as my congos


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

*having issues - need help*

over the last 4 to 6 weeks on a daily basis i am finding severed plants or leaves floating, at first i thought it was just dead/dying leaves/plants but i have noticed it is also healthy plants/leaves

i have spent hours looking/observing and can't figure out which fish/group of fish is doing it, today i found one of my favorite red stem plant cut off like someone knawed it off 

can anyone help from their experience, please help :help: this is driving me nuts :icon_mad::angryfire

below is my fishlist

Koi Angel (male) 1 Kribensis/ Pelvicachromis pulcher (female) 1 Bolivian Ram (male) 1 Gold Ram (female) 1 Blue Ram Pair 2 Cory 4 Harlequin Rasbora (large) 5 Black Neon Tetra 5 Black Phantom Tetra (wild) 5 Cardinal Tetra 2 Congo Tetra 5 Turquoise Rainbow 5 Bleeding Heart Tetra 5 Gold White Cloud 4 Firetip Tetra (3m/2fm) 5 Apisto Pandura 1 Unknown dwarf cichlid 1 Apisto Macmasteri 1 Unknown small pleco 1 Checkered barb 5 Odessa barb 5 Rummy nose tetra 2 Honey Gourame pair 2 Cloun loach 1


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## Centromochlus (May 19, 2008)

BEAUTIFUL koi angel.. and nice tank too. 

I've always wanted a koi. So pretty..


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## CL (Mar 13, 2008)

Wow that's a lot of fish. It might be the pleco. The tank looks great!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks guys, yes it is a quite a lot of fish, but i've had them for a long time and as you can see a lot of them i only have 1 or 2 pieces, the pleco has been in this tank for at least 7 months, do they change their behavior pattern? it was sold to me as a BN pleco, but it has no bristles and it is about 4.5inches and stopped growing once it got to that length about a year ago, i don't think its a BN, but also not a common pleco


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

wew! you need a dsl warning for that last page, lol. 

nice progress.


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## giraffe (Jun 26, 2009)

I like those wild caught black phantoms


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## sean117Ply (Jun 28, 2009)

Its been interesting seeing your tank evolve, I plan to turn my 55g into a planted tank. At the moment it looks more mbuna worthy rather then Discus! I have set up my old 29g African cichlids tank to hold my discus while I completely revamp the 55g...

I'm amazed you've been able to make a flourishing planted tank without a co2 system!


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## Fishery (May 26, 2008)

Hi, I new here and I learning how to setup a planted tank for my shrimp and I wondering what sand you are using .Care to tell me what brand and type of sand is that please.I went to a few shop I dont see anything like yours.Anyway is its natural sand?


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks sean and fishery

sean, in my experience a lot of plants actually do quite well w/o CO2, they don't grow as fast, but they will mostly do well in a 2wpg to 3wpg, there are some exceptions, for instance it will be difficult to do a low carpet w/o CO2, but there are many scapes that can be done w/o carpets

fishery, unfortunately i don't remember the exact brand/type of sand, i've been looking for it myself because i really liked it, but the lfs i bought it from does not carry it now, if i find out i will let you know, it is a medium grain size white/offwhite color


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

giraffe said:


> I like those wild caught black phantoms


thanks giraffe they are one of my fav. fish there too, i've had them almost 2 years now... they were with me before i had this tank


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

here's a quick update on this tank, the lotus was clogging up the middle 50% of the tank, so as part of my weekly pruning, along with all the stem plants i cut off half of the lotus leaves and here's what it looks like now, i'm currently not happy with how this tank is looking and anticipating a rescape in the next 3 to 4 months



















after the water change yesterday my honey gouramis decided to spawn again and provide everyone else in the tank with tasty morsels of eggs, i could not get good pix, but you will get the idea from the following three timelapse pix

embrace 1










embrace position 2










embrace position 3 (notice the angel waiting for the eggs to fall, he knows the process now!!)










also, finally i was able to capture a few pix of one of my odessa barb male, he looks so much better in person, but you will have an idea... that blue spot on his gills is really bright



















here's another top view after the trim


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## mountaindew (Dec 10, 2008)

Nice update, I like the lotus! Was thinking I might need to pick one up for a new display. 
Great job
Md


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## Veloth (Jun 25, 2008)

Gorgeous tank. My Angels usually don't miss any eggs from anything.


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## MARIMOBALL (Mar 18, 2007)

Tank is looking great. Im anticipating your next rescape.


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## NaturalWater (Jul 7, 2009)

Fishery said:


> Hi, I new here and I learning how to setup a planted tank for my shrimp and I wondering what sand you are using .Care to tell me what brand and type of sand is that please.I went to a few shop I dont see anything like yours.Anyway is its natural sand?


Hey Fishery I'm new here as well.


Way back on the first page and last post finfan posted this:

*substrate:* ~65% ADA aquasoil, remaining sand (should be neutral), as you know aquasoil leaches ammonia - so ammonia has been very high, i also noticed that aquasoil lowered ph to between 6.4 and 6.8 (houston tap water is ~8 and it holds stable based on my other tanks w/o aquasoil)
water changes: performed a ~65% water change on June 16, and a ~35% water change on june 17

(hope that helps you some).


-Home website for substrate-

http://www.adgshop.com/Aqua_Soil_s/21.htm


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

thanks all, i am still undecided which direction i want to take this now, maybe you guys can help, i really like the look of the lotus, but it gets very big very fast, so i am not sure if i want to keep it or not, but i really want to keep it, i don't know why, but i miss my swords, so i am very tempted to bring back one sword plant, so below are some of the possible scenarios. Please give me your thoughts:

(1) move the big lotus to the left, keep rocks w/ anubias nana at the base of that, also leave the crypts i have as in on the left side, on the right side, take out most of the stems and show the large crypt that is more in the back and not visible currently, add different types of crypts in in front of it extending almost to the middle of the tank with decreasing crypt height, combine different colors, in the very back have a line all the way through of the plant that i currently have in the very back left (sorry, forgot the name)

(2) move the lotus to the left side, add a large arrangement of manzanita woods extending from a base in the right center towards all directions with some branches going over the waterline, take out most of the anubias from the rocks and plant them towards the base of the wood, on the top sides of the wood add java moss, leave the large crypt on the right back where it is, in the very back have a line all the way through of the plant that i currently have in the very back left (sorry, forgot the name)

(3) move the lotus to the left side, add one sword plant on the right center side, leave most of the rockwork as is with slight rearrangement, have a sloping v line of stem plants in the back

(4) have one large lotus plant on either the left or right, and have a random mix match of small crypts and nanas throughout the tank with a mix match of rockwork, in this case the lotus will really be the focal point of everything with the other plants as accent

(5) your suggestions

notice that all the scapes would allow me to keep this tank low-tech as it is currently, no CO2, no dosing (occasional excel)

another thing i want to do is put a 2 to 3 inch layer of just white sand over my current substrate to make it all one color but also leave the aquasoil underneath so that plants can get nutrients from the substrate


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## giraffe (Jun 26, 2009)

I think number two sounds best, but i'm sure whatever you choose will look great.


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## Digsy (Mar 4, 2006)

Any updates on this tank? I stumbled across it while searching for tanks with Congo tetras and would like to see what you ended up doing with your scape.


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## speedie408 (Jan 15, 2009)

From your most recent pics, it seems like your battling some algae issues. Any updates? Other than that, your tank looks excellent!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

So... after almost a 9yrs break, I am ready to revive this tank again... I still have this tank... currently bare bottom with a few random fish... should I start a new thread or continue here??


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## Bleuwater (Aug 5, 2017)

I say new one, I can't see your old tank pics


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## Angella (Aug 11, 2017)

finfan said:


> So... after almost a 9yrs break, I am ready to revive this tank again... I still have this tank... currently bare bottom with a few random fish... should I start a new thread or continue here??



New one! I never saw the old pics and photobucket has fudged them now.
But I read back some and it sounds gorgeous. Can't wait to see what you do!


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## finfan (Jun 16, 2008)

Bleuwater said:


> I say new one, I can't see your old tank pics




yes, disappointing that the old pics are gone

Bump:


Angella said:


> New one! I never saw the old pics and photobucket has fudged them now.
> But I read back some and it sounds gorgeous. Can't wait to see what you do!




thanks, makes sense to start a new one


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