# Substrate help



## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

i am setting up a 30 gallon tank, and i want it to be planted, (no duh i am on a planted tank forum) but whatever, i want to do like one inch of sand (what type of sand should i use?) then an inch of potting mix (what type should i use? please be super specific!) then like 1.5 inches of that special plant gravel mixed with some normal gravel (what type of special plant gravel should i use?). that is it, please respond and be super specific:help:.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

can anyone help me?


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

can anyone give a specific brand and type of potting mix i can use in a 30 gallon planted tank? maybe you can post a link for a website that i could do some research or even buy it. thank you!


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## brianS (Apr 22, 2010)

Sand would be fine. You'd want to use pool filter sand, but be careful of potting soil and the type you use. You don't want to use anything with fertilizers in it. Potting soil can be quite messy too. On top of this section is a thread on MTS. You may want to read that. I've never used "just" potting soil, but I do use MTS. The problem with most potting soil is that they contain fertilizers, that if leached into the your tank can wreak havoc. Many also contain a lot of wood chips that can make a mess of your tank as well. Also becareful of the so-called "organic" potting soils. They aren't always what they appear to be. One more note... I don't believe you want to use "potting mix", as this will surely contain things that you don't want in your tank.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh thanks, then i will use some of this "MTS" and thanks for the warning on potting mix, THANKS!


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> i want to do like one inch of sand then an inch of potting mix.
> then like 1.5 inches of that special plant gravel mixed with some normal gravel


Pool filter sand or river sand is the best. One rinse of pool filter sand from Lowe's worked fine for me. If you are going to put rock over it, I would just put a fingers width of sand over the dirt.

For potting soil some use miracle grow organic, which is a product recommended by Diane Walsted. Some have ammonia spikes with this in the beginning. I just used Scott's top soil mixed with cactus soil. Had to sift mulch out. Read one got top soil from True Value hardware store that didn't have much mulch in it.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

I'll vouch for the Miracle Gro Organic Choice potting mix. I've got that in 2 of my tanks right now and it's working well. Capped it with my Flourite mix, filled the tank, added the fish immediately- no issues.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

cool, i already have sand, but what do you mean by "capping?"


> Capped it with my Flourite mix, filled the tank, added the fish immediately- no issues.


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Put it on top, to hold it down.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh so it means you put something on top of the fluorite mix so it doesn't float?


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

No, I put the Flourite on top of the Miracle Gro, to hold the Miracle Gro down. The Miracle Gro is very lightweight and probably would not hold plants well, otherwise.


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## heydude819 (Mar 17, 2009)

She means to put a different layer of substrate on top of the dirt so the dirt wouldn't get into the water column. In Laura's case it was her fluorite mix...for you it would be the sand that you're thinking about getting.

I guess I was a bit too slow haha


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

OK thanks! and do you guys recommended the plant gravel with nutrients in the gravel? or do you think its a waist of money?


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

anyone?


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

should i get seachem fluorite plant substrate?


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

If you want. You have lots of options, including the sand you started off thinking about.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

ok, and about additives, what things would i want to have (e.g. iron, potassium, ect.) please help!


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Flourite is a good choice, as it will readily absorb nutrients for later use but won't release anything into the water column causing a pH shift or an ammonia spike. You can use it on its own or as a cap for a shallow layer or MTS or that particular Miracle Gro (don't buy a different type). Using root tabs is always a good idea. Any other dosing should be done via the water column once you have plants in there. In a 30g you'll probably want 2 bags of Flourite ($40-ish plus shipping for new), which comes in a few colors and a couple granule sizes. Use http://www.mizuworld.com/pages/calculator to doublecheck the amount. You'll want 3-4 inches total substrate.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

*Update!!*

i just went to AA (aquarium adventure) and got myself 2 dwarf lilys
those aren't my tanks, i am too lazy to take pics of my real tank but those pics will give you a general idea
i am planning on taking my cichlids out because they might kill my plants. 
also i am asking if i need any additives for these plants. just so they will grow better


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

ok thank u!! and kevmo911, what is your profile pic? jw


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## lauraleellbp (Feb 3, 2008)

Your lilies would probably appreciate some root tab ferts.


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## Betta Maniac (Dec 3, 2010)

Flourite is good stuff. So is Aquasoil. But if you're looking for cheap and basic when starting out, you really can't beat a basic Walstad set-up.


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

Anything that roots itself in the substrate will appreciate root tabs, and I've never heard of anybody "overdosing" with root tabs. One every 3 inches or so, in a grid through the tank, will do just fine. Making your own with Osmocote Plus and either freezing some into tiny ice cubes and inserting them, or ordering some empty capsules online (<$5 shipped) to stick in there, is the cheapest bet, though I've had good success with RootMedic tabs.

And my icon is Hamish, from Braveheart. He was clearly the hero of the movie, with the crazy Irish guy running a close second.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh so Osmocote plus is a liquid?
and thanks for clearing that up, every time i saw u i thought it was like a hobo  oh well.
THANKS


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh and thanks Betta maniac, 1-1.5 inches of soil stuff and then 1-1.5 inches of gravel. i will probably replace that gravel with sand but oh well. THANKS


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## kevmo911 (Sep 24, 2010)

No, Osmocote is powder in little 2mm pellets. Which you want *in* your substrate, not sitting on top. So you need some way to deposit a bunch of them together. Osmocicles or capsules will help do that.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh OK.. so why would i want to freeze them?
and yes, do i just shove it down under my sand or gravel?


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

do you guys know a good place or site that has root tabs cheap? i just went to LFS and they were $12 for 10.. is that a good price?


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> do you guys know a good place or site that has root tabs cheap?


Here you can buy them on line with no charge for shipment. API brand is my favorite because the contain iron.

There are also diy recipes for them. Some sell them. Check the diy section.


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## zenche (Feb 9, 2011)

wth...since when did lnt sell fish stuffs?


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

all the time.. and thanks Hilde, i will probably get them there. because when i went to my LFS, they were $12! rip off


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

zenche said:


> wth...since when did lnt sell fish stuffs?


Don't know and don't care. Found this when I was googling for Brightwell aquatic products. For the LFS that caries the products is 20 miles from me and I didn't want to waste gas going up there.


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

There is no good reason to use three layers, and expecting them to stay in 3 seperate layers is just asking for a letdown. Sand will settle down.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

thanks! any other anything would be appreciated


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

over_stocked said:


> There is no good reason to use three layers, and expecting them to stay in 3 seperate layers is just asking for a letdown. Sand will settle down.


I have 4 layers-
1st layer Laterite
2nd layer Reptile coconut bark
3rd layer top soil with potassium sulfate and calcium sulfate
4th layer river sand
Laterite provides iron, reptile bark provides Co2. Tap water has no minerals so I added minerals.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

Ok thanks! Do you know a good white sand that has plant nutrients? Jw, that would go well with my white sand i have now.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> Ok thanks! Do you know a good white sand that has plant nutrients? Jw, that would go well with my white sand i have now.


All white sand is free of nutrients. I have seen pure white sand at Pet Smart. Cheapest good sand is pool filter sand from Lowe's. Could also try pool supply company's.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

but you can buy like fluorite in white sand, right?


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> but you can buy like fluorite in white sand, right?


No!! It comes in black. Don't believe it has a lot of nutrients though.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh. do you know a good way to start a 10 gallon planted. substrate wise?


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> oh. do you know a good way to start a 10 gallon planted. substrate wise?


Eco-compete 20lb will give 1.5 in substrate. Petco has sales on it occasionally. Cheapest is to get Scott's top soil and Miracle grow cactus soil. Mix 3 parts top soil to 1 part cactus soil. Then top with river sand or pool filter sand (PFS). I prefer the river sand for it never looks dirty contrary to the PFS. Tank I saw where it looked white was vacuummed 3xs a week. I only vacuum my tank 1x a month so it got nasty.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

ok, so just get some "Scotts top soil and miracle grow cactus soil and mix 3 parts top soil and 1 part cactus soil? OK i got that down. just were can i get this stuff? online? or can i get it at a lowes?


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## zenche (Feb 9, 2011)

^ lowes or home depot should have all that.

others have also mentioned organic miracle gro would serve well.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

thanks! i will pick some up on my next trip there! any other suggestions for a 10 gallon planted? doesn't have to do with substrate.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

I got Scott's top soil at Wal-mart. Cactus soil from Home Depot.


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

Ok thanks!!!


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

so you guys know the best substrate for breeding? is there one? thank you


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> so you guys know the best substrate for breeding? is there one? thank you


Most use moss or marbles for egg layers. What are hoping to breed?


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

some guppies, and does anubias do well in sand? jw, heard some rumors.


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## Mgiorgi1221 (Mar 23, 2011)

I have sachem fluorite black substrate in my planted tank and it's great when you fist dump the water in it's all cloudy and a mess but give it a couple off weeks and looks great. Carpeting plants such as dwarf hair grass love it


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

Kibblemania1414 said:


> some guppies, and does anubias do well in sand? jw, heard some rumors.


No rumors here. Anubias should not be planted in ANY substrate. It should be attached to driftwood, rocks, etc.


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## Mgiorgi1221 (Mar 23, 2011)

But They can be grown in larger stone gravel but prefer rocks driftwood like overstocked said


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

oh thank you, i think i will attach it to my rock... can i use cotton thread or fishing line?


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## Mgiorgi1221 (Mar 23, 2011)

I would us cotton because it will dissolve. And by time it dissolves the roots will be established


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

ty! very helpfull!


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

ok, i am now thinking of taking this route:
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...-mineralized-soil-substrate-aaron-talbot.html
with mineralized top soil
chad recommended it to me and now i am going to try it out, along with everyone elses recommendations. (scotts top soil under flourite)


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## Kibblemania1414 (Feb 1, 2011)

WOW has it been a while since i have been on here...
Oh well...
So i am thInking about cutting down from 3 tanks just to 2 tanks because i am giving my bass to my friend who will hopefully live a long life in a bigger tank. So i was just wondering what are some of tye best substrate that works for you...
I was just planning on turning my 20 gallon into a WAY more techy kinda tank, with better light providing more Watts. So i was also going to re-plant everything and put in different substrate. 
Right now i have just normal gravel, sand, a mix of them both, small pebbles, and also some bigger pebbles. So i was just wondering what would be tye best choice out of those, because i really dont feel like going out and getting new substrate. 

Any help is appreciated 
And excuse ke for any typos or grammatical mistakes i may have made, i am typing with my iPod
Thanks again...


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