# Extreme high lighting needed at a specific size



## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

4.5 x 12" panel...
$20...........

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000058192348.html


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## Streetwise (May 24, 2019)

It could probably fit the 15" Fluval Plant 3.0.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> 4.5 x 12" panel...
> $20...........
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000058192348.html


Golly for 20 dollars its worth the gamble... haven't considered trying proper search on aliexpress.. apparently definitely worth it. 



Streetwise said:


> It could probably fit the 15" Fluval Plant 3.0.


Fluval would give me a lot of customization but not nearly as much light as the other options. For an aquarium that's not so bad since you worry about algae, but for a vivarium... I am not so constrained. I can blast 300+ ppfd at substrate and its just beneficial to plants. Assuming I could find such a critter at least.

Edit: One issue with aliexpress light is that the darn thing is not expected to arrive till the middle of july... that is a bit too long to wait sadly.


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

you can always do a DIY LED fixture using pieces from RapidLED. definitely recommend it and it allows you to customize it so you can add different colors, add a controller, add different strength lights.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

monkeyruler90 said:


> you can always do a DIY LED fixture using pieces from RapidLED. definitely recommend it and it allows you to customize it so you can add different colors, add a controller, add different strength lights.


Under normal circumstances I would reject diy options for aesthetic reasons. However that is not a consideration here, the light will be hidden behind a hood. My only issue is can I really make a better light then what I can buy? Some of these lights are pretty well made and thoughtfully constructed with ppfd maximization in mind. Just randomly sticking leds together might get me something.. but will it be any good?


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> Under normal circumstances I would reject diy options for aesthetic reasons. However that is not a consideration here, the light will be hidden behind a hood. My only issue is can I really make a better light then what I can buy? Some of these lights are pretty well made and thoughtfully constructed with ppfd maximization in mind. Just randomly sticking leds together might get me something.. but will it be any good?


The $20 light as an example.. cost isn't really any major driver of DIY
more like creating a "vision" of something one can't get or sometimes too expensive but nuanced ..
Like Radion xr15's freshwater at $375 for JUST the light and "only" 95 Watts..

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/radion-xr15w-g4-pro-freshwater-led-light-fixture-ecotech-marine.html

Still hard to find lights that do "natural" daylight sunrise to noon or have better "complete" spectums or high CRI..

Considering your tank IF you wanted to do DIY I'd recommend using these:
https://www.stevesleds.com/Luxeon-Sunplus-and-C-Series_c_118.html
One advantage is the broad spread >120 degree lensing w/ a light that's put right on top of an enclosure. 

Sadly Steves doesn't carry the "purple" which in your case would be necessary, sort of..
One could substitute cheap "full spectrum" stars off eek bay though. Pretty similar (blue plus red phosphors)
https://www.lumileds.com/uploads/702/WP34-pdf

https://www.lumileds.com/horticulture/technology/


30 "sunplus" white "3W" class diodes..




> * MIXING LIST
> ----------------------------------------
> myData luxeon-sunplus-20-coolwhite.csv [150°] x30
> ----------------------------------------
> ...


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## Nubster (Aug 9, 2011)

Not sure if it changes anything for you, but the black box lights that are 8" wide, the actual lighting area is only 6" so it could actually work. Only issue will be the light spread, if you have plants high on the back of the enclosure they wouldn't get maximum light.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> The $20 light as an example.. cost isn't really any major driver of DIY
> more like creating a "vision" of something one can't get or sometimes too expensive but nuanced ..
> Like Radion xr15's freshwater at $375 for JUST the light and "only" 95 Watts..
> 
> ...


My issue is more just that I don't really have a vision so much as a desire for strong light that has good colors. I just don't think I can make that without a lot of testing and fiddling. I am hoping to have a working light in a couple of weeks at the most. For that reason I really don't think I can go diy.



Nubster said:


> Not sure if it changes anything for you, but the black box lights that are 8" wide, the actual lighting area is only 6" so it could actually work. Only issue will be the light spread, if you have plants high on the back of the enclosure they wouldn't get maximum light.


This... This is very interesting. Does this apply to the sb reef light as well?? If it does that might be a very good option especially since I could tilt the light slightly to aim it at the back wall and get better coverage there..


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## Nubster (Aug 9, 2011)

I have the SB Reef freshwater and that's what I measured. The housing is 8.5" wide but the outside to outside measurement of the actual LEDs is 6".


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> My issue is more just that I don't really have a vision so much as a desire for strong light that has good colors. I just don't think I can make that without a lot of testing and fiddling. I am hoping to have a working light in a couple of weeks at the most. For that reason I really don't think I can go diy.
> 
> 
> 
> This... This is very interesting. Does this apply to the sb reef light as well?? If it does that might be a very good option especially since I could tilt the light slightly to aim it at the back wall and get better coverage there..


SB reef are a mix of 90 and 120 degree lensed diodes..
BB's AFAICT are all 90 degree 

Neither as is are really good for direct to top setups..
Main problem is color mixing..
At 2 inches the light cones at 120 are 7 in diameter w/ a hot spot of much smaller diameter..

AS to diy, not complicated in this regard.. No "futzing" is really necessary..
Even monotone COB's will work well................
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Lumileds/L2C5-FS001208E1500?qs=COJyYuYQspt8XmRoCEgS2g==

But a more "hort" approach...
* MIXING LIST
----------------------------------------


> myData luxeon-sunplus-20-coolwhite.csv [150°] x15
> myData luxpurple25.txt [160°] x1
> ----------------------------------------
> 
> ...













3-4 drivers, ps, hunk of aluminum, wire and thermal adhesive..
Once one gets the parts about a day for assembly.. 

Outputs are rough estimates..
Add a WW "sunrise" channel if one wants and a controller.

Oh and I did the 25% blue which isn't available in a COB so it will be shifted to warmer..

Violet COB's are $20 each though.
https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/lumileds/L2C5-SPP11208E1500/1416-2047-ND/9450474

Simple design is 30 cool white from steves.
$44 luxeon sunplus cool white..

Rest can be bought from LEDSupply:
https://www.ledsupply.com/power-supplies/mean-well-lrs-enclosed
48V 150W oversized power supply $20
2 or 3 (recommend 3) Ldd-HW drivers 700mA (wires so no board is needed.)
and a heat sink..
Actually this can be the most costly part..
A makers easy to use slim heatsing 24" runs so they will cut it shorter for you.
https://www.ledsupply.com/led-heatsinks/makersheatsink-slim

Wider than 5" but you won't populate out that far.

wire and thermal compound.. Sounds cofusing but it's all pretty tinker toy-ish..


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> SB reef are a mix of 90 and 120 degree lensed diodes..
> BB's AFAICT are all 90 degree
> 
> Neither as is are really good for direct to top setups..
> ...


Heh it definitely sounds confusing to me. I've looked this over for 30 minutes and I am not even sure how many lights you are talking about... Is this 1 violet cob, 1 white sunplus cob and 30 cool white stars? Or some other combination of lights? My understanding of circuits is soooo limited that I can basically follow very simple directions like 'solder red wire here' with lots of pictures but that is about it. You tempt me quite a bit with diy, but I hesitate because I have no idea what I am doing 

On the other hand the popbloom uses all 120 degree lenses according to their wacky ebay pictures. The chihiros has a diffuser so basically should be wider still is my understanding? The popbloom essentially has no reviews or comparisons soooo you know.. could be awesome could be lot of regret. The chihiros wrgb 2 specifically has no reviews. The wrgb 1 does and generally favorable. But not much in the way of real numbers. A facebook post for the chihiros leads me to believe it will be adequate but darker then I would like in the corners and edges, especially since its not as long as it could be. The WRGB 2 doesn't need the wonky controller earlier models used, instead it communicates directly with an app which makes it likely the most customizable of any option.

BUT.... You know... could I get higher light using something else.. diy? sb reef? A 90 degree lens sucks for what I am trying to accomplish, 120 aint bad. I will be planting the back wall but up high it will be low light vines and air plants. Lower down will be ferns that will require the serious ppfd. I am soooo tempted by the diy but unless someone can point me at a step by step tutorial and a complete parts list its just beyond me not to mess it up.


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## splattered (Jun 7, 2017)

Put it in sunlight until mid july when the new light arrives. Do a dry-start so you can move it around


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

splattered said:


> Put it in sunlight until mid july when the new light arrives. Do a dry-start so you can move it around


Definitely not an option. This vivarium will be going in the basement. My house actually has no windows with direct sun anyway, all indirect light and since the backwall is going to be opaque due to a background even if I wanted to just use indirect light I would need to turn the vivarium so that front opening doors would be facing the window... yea not doable.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Picture showing the par data for the wrgb 2 at 55cm which is essentially the depth I would be operating at:










Hard to make out but 120 is the center and 60 is the outer corners.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> My understanding of circuits is soooo limited that I can basically follow very simple directions like 'solder red wire here' with lots of pictures but that is about it. You tempt me quite a bit with diy, but I hesitate because I have no idea what I am doing



Use thermal glue (heatsink plaster ect from eek bay) and a hunk of aluminum...and done..
The only electrical basics are 

W = V x A
and voltages add in series
amps divided in parallel


LDD drivers out put power supply voltage - 3 volts (48 in = 45 out)


Add V(f) of diodes to determine max series string lengths..


@ 700mA luxeon cool whites, on average are at 3V
So MAX of 15 diodes in series per LDD driver


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## splattered (Jun 7, 2017)

Idunno, you get what you pay for. Unless you plan on only running this system for a year or two I wouldn't go cheap. All my cheapo from the internet products have failed one way or another and I won't buy them anymore. Made in china stuff from ebay or amazon eventually falls apart. I like leds but I think it's worth paying for the real deal. Ecotech, elos, kessil, there's some nice german stuff... but pick one brand and maximize the investment cuz they all can chain together. It's more expensive but then you save on power with the leds. Remember how expensive it was to run metal halides? So it's still worth it if you don't have to replace them in 18months. The other option is looking into leds for hydroponics. Now that the cannabis industry is more prevalent we have more options to choose from. I'm growing mangroves under grow lights from the home improvement store right now. They were only $40-$60 a piece, replacing those wont sting as much and I won't have to deal with mishandling during the online delivery process or getting something that's already been opened/used/who knows. Lighting is the one thing I'll spend money on. Tanks come free. Fish/plants can be traded for. Compost can be made. Substrate can be recycled. Pumps are cheap now if you know where to look. Natural sunlight is great but not always available, then I feel justified spending the dough on lighting to get exactly what I need by saving on everything else. There's even led t5 and t8 bulbs now if you already have shop lights for half the price of the new aquarium led strips. Personal preference really, I'm just spit-ballin here... but it is something I've given a lot of thought as well. Cheers.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> Use thermal glue (heatsink plaster ect from eek bay) and a hunk of aluminum...and done..
> The only electrical basics are
> 
> W = V x A
> ...


OK THIS is helpful. See that diagram? That's the level I am at. Red wire goes here ;P It probably seemed extremely elementary to you but I did not know how to wire that up.

How many of each light should I be adding Jeffkol? 30 cool white stars, and how many violet cobs? Other cobs? Other color stars like green? red?



splattered said:


> Idunno, you get what you pay for. Unless you plan on only running this system for a year or two I wouldn't go cheap. All my cheapo from the internet products have failed one way or another and I won't buy them anymore. Made in china stuff from ebay or amazon eventually falls apart. I like leds but I think it's worth paying for the real deal. Ecotech, elos, kessil, there's some nice german stuff... but pick one brand and maximize the investment cuz they all can chain together. It's more expensive but then you save on power with the leds. Remember how expensive it was to run metal halides? So it's still worth it if you don't have to replace them in 18months. The other option is looking into leds for hydroponics. Now that the cannabis industry is more prevalent we have more options to choose from. I'm growing mangroves under grow lights from the home improvement store right now. They were only $40-$60 a piece, replacing those wont sting as much and I won't have to deal with mishandling during the online delivery process or getting something that's already been opened/used/who knows. Lighting is the one thing I'll spend money on. Tanks come free. Fish/plants can be traded for. Compost can be made. Substrate can be recycled. Pumps are cheap now if you know where to look. Natural sunlight is great but not always available, then I feel justified spending the dough on lighting to get exactly what I need by saving on everything else. There's even led t5 and t8 bulbs now if you already have shop lights for half the price of the new aquarium led strips. Personal preference really, I'm just spit-ballin here... but it is something I've given a lot of thought as well. Cheers.


The chihiros, popbloom, and sb reef are not exactly cheap... They would each run around 150 dollars. There is something to be said for buying quality products and expecting them to last a long time. On the other hand a lot of those quality products are made in the same places as the off brand products and just have a lot of marketing driving up the price. The reality is that I don't have an issue spending 150 dollars on a light for this project, my concern is whether it can do the best job possible. What I want is a LOT of light, spread out, with good looking colors. I have a cheapo hardware store light on one of my tanks as well but by itself.. the color is terrible.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> OK THIS is helpful. See that diagram? That's the level I am at. Red wire goes here ;P It probably seemed extremely elementary to you but I did not know how to wire that up.



Well it wasn't elementary at the time I started..




minorhero said:


> How many of each light should I be adding Jeffkol? 30 cool white stars, and how many violet cobs? Other cobs? Other color stars like green? red?


 Well it can be as complicated or easy as you like. The plants won't care..
Let's ignore COB's for now. Best bang for the buck but it adds a complexity to it that is err. 

LED 102...........




minorhero said:


> What I want is a LOT of light, spread out, with good looking colors. I have a cheapo hardware store light on one of my tanks as well but by itself.. the color is terrible.


Current "looks" can go from "natural" ie high CRI clean white light to "vivid" i.e RGB white light w/ color enhancements at the expense of a more complete spectrum.


still think that as for DIY and your exact situation/needs the "natural" w/ possibly some enhancements (RGBW-ish) is the best.


3 rows of 10 diodes each as I stated earlier
2 outside rows are 10 Sunplus cool whites.
middle row is where the fun is...


Normally I'd suggest creative use of RG(cyan)B but really think spotting will be an issue...so


A compromise.
W-W-R-W-R-W-R-W-W
NOTE cente string is only 9 diodes long. Symmetry thing.

Suggest all sunplus in the above case.. matching beam angles..sunplus cool white/deep red.



Red can be anything from red, deep red, low K white (3000-ish)


You can complicate things by splitting that one channel into 2 and using warm whites.. cool white/warm white allowing for sunrise/set effects..
Cool white and red is more pink.. Doesn't give the orangy warmth as does a good warm white diode.


Drivers are only $6 so certainly not a deal breaker.


Using the LDD-hw's will allow for adding control later, as will designing the light as above (cool white/warm white) even if not used right away..


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> Well it wasn't elementary at the time I started..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ok this is coming together now. So in order to make this all work my parts list looks like 26 cool whites and 3 deep reds plus 3 drivers and the power supply, plus wire, heatsink, thermal paste, some more wire for a plug. If I want to do sunrise and sunset modes I need some kind of dimmer solution and to wire things differently.... while that would be cool its not strictly necessary, and unless there is an off the shelf option for it would likely just skip. I want plants that turn red to be nice and red so that to me means deep reds? I definitely wouldn't mind colors being a bit more vibrant then real so long as it wasn't cartoony if that makes sense. I'm surprised I don't need other colors or frankly more lights heh. A lot of the led black boxes have like 75+ leds on them, I figured a diy option would look similar to that.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

Dimmer solution (will explain more as needed)

https://www.tc420.net/connecting-high-power-LEDs-to-the-TC420.php
https://www.tc420.net/images/TC420/TC420-High-Power-LED-Circuit.png
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/...-led-controller-timer-$12-anyone-try-one.html


Sunplus specs are in PPFD so it's hard to translate to something err normal like lumens but most Luxeon cool whites are like 120-140 l/watt.
So like 7000-ish Lumens for 26 diodes (3V x .7A X 130 Lumens x 27) .. It may take *2x* the diodes to meet that criteria in other lights 

There are tons of "color theories" and none are probably 100% correct. Just shoot for best case balancing look/function/power/ 

Most of the colors added are because othr diodes are lacking but that's not 100% always the case..
The sunlight ones have boost in the cyan range lacking in 90% of other whites soo no need for cyan/green supplementation unless shooting for a "vivid" green look. 

The combination of luxeon "fresh fish" (cool white/high CRI cyan supplementation) and luxeon "crisp white" (low k ie. lots of red, added violet for pop(flourescence stimulation)) are as close to a complete spectrum as any dozen colors on a separate array..

As to power one can go crazy...33,246 estimated lumens from the 9 fresh fish COB's


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> Dimmer solution (will explain more as needed)
> 
> https://www.tc420.net/connecting-high-power-LEDs-to-the-TC420.php
> https://www.tc420.net/images/TC420/TC420-High-Power-LED-Circuit.png
> ...


Heh I definitely don't need 33k lumens ;P Or at least... I don't think I do heh and I know I don't have the room for that many COBS. Anyway I actually kind of do want that 'vivid' green look. So should I make my board look like:

W W W W W W W W W W
W W R G R G R W W
W W W W W W W W W W​
Where the greens are limes an the reds are deep red.

I am pretty open to best suggestion here, I want the plants to turn all kinds of fun colors and the frogs (this is for dart frogs) to really pop.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> Heh I definitely don't need 33k lumens ;P Or at least... I don't think I do heh and I know I don't have the room for that many COBS. Anyway I actually kind of do want that 'vivid' green look. So should I make my board look like:
> 
> W W W W W W W W W W
> W W R G R G R W W
> ...



1208 COB is 20 x 24 mm..3/4x 1 roughly inch.. 




> * MIXING LIST
> ----------------------------------------
> myData luxeon-sunplus-20-coolwhite.csv [150°] x24
> PhilipsLumileds Luxeon-Rebel Cyan (490-510nm) [120°] x3
> ...



cyan pushes green better than lime


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> 1208 COB is 20 x 24 mm..3/4x 1 roughly inch..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


But where to get it? Steves doesn't carry them, just limes, mints, and royal blue.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> But where to get it? Steves doesn't carry them, just limes, mints, and royal blue.





https://www.stevesleds.com/Luxeon-ES-True-Cyan-3-Watt-_p_400.html


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> https://www.stevesleds.com/Luxeon-ES-True-Cyan-3-Watt-_p_400.html


Ahhhh so not the sunplus got it.

Ok so I definitely went ahead and pulled the trigger on this. I am kind of excited as I've never made a proper light before.

Here is what I purchased, please let me know if you think I am missing anything.


*From Steve:* 

3 - Luxeon ES True Cyan 3 Watt

2 - Luxeon ES Deep Red 

24 - Luxeon SunPlus Cool White 

22 Gauge wire

Solder 

18/4 Gauge Driver Power Cable (I figured too big is better then too small)

Wire Sleeve Sheath 1/8" 3.5mm 

*From LED Supply:*

Makers HEATSINK SLIM (I asked for 20 inches no fan)

3 - LDD-H Series Mean Well Step-Down Mode CC DC-DC LED Drivers
Output Current : 700mA

Mean Well LRS Series Enclosed Style Switching Power Supply
Voltage : 48V
Wattage : 150W 

Power Cord - 72inch


I also picked up some thermal adhesive from amazon.

All of the parts were certainly not cheaper then buying a popbloom heh the total with shipping comes to just over 200 dollars. But if it blasts the heck out of these plants it is totally worth it.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> Ahhhh so not the sunplus got it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well, looks good EXCEPT did you get the meanwell H's or HW's..


H's need a circuit board..
https://www.rapidled.com/ldd-h-4s-driver-board/


HW's are hard wired...



minorhero said:


> All of the parts were certainly not cheaper then buying a popbloom heh the total with shipping comes to just over 200 dollars. But if it blasts the heck out of these plants it is totally worth it.


popbloom is 12 x 29 cm $160, 5000 lumens @100W.... 50L/watt


ADDENDUM:
Middle Bar:
W:C:R:W:C:W:R:C:W

Just noticed you got the "normal" deep red not the sunplus deep red?


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> Well, looks good EXCEPT did you get the meanwell H's or HW's..
> 
> 
> H's need a circuit board..
> ...


I purchased these: https://www.ledsupply.com/led-drivers/mean-well-ldd-h-series-cc-step-down-mode

When selecting options for wires and 700mA it changes to say it is the HW version. But it doesn't show up as such in the cart so my guess is that I got it right. 

I did go with the normal deep red not the sunplus. Your post #23 used the regular ones so I went that route. Should I buy the sunplus reds?


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## Tiger15 (Jan 7, 2018)

I have a glass top hood on my fish tank like yours and run out of space to fit over top light. So I went to eBay and bought submersible aquarium led tubes and tied them with fish line on the front, side and back rims. Just drill tiny holes on the plastic rim to fit the line. Do a search in eBay and you can find submersible led tubes that come in all lengths that will fit tank of all size. Here is a glimpse on how the the submersible led tubes look like on the side view of my 75g.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Tiger15 said:


> I have a glass top hood on my fish tank like yours and run out of space to fit over top light. So I went to eBay and bought submersible aquarium led tubes and tied them with fish line on the front, side and back rims. Just drill tiny holes on the plastic rim to fit the line. Do a search in eBay and you can find submersible led tubes that come in all lengths that will fit tank of all size. Here is a glimpse on how the the submersible led tubes look like on the side view of my 75g.


Its not a bad solution but I am trying to keep equipment in the tank as limited as possible. Currently the only thing in the tank will be a misting nozzle. Plus with the leds I just bought I don't think I will need any other supplementary light.


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## Immortal1 (Feb 18, 2015)

minorhero said:


> Hello folks,
> 
> Slightly off topic (or not??) post because I am not trying to light an aquarium but rather a vivarium. As such I am not held to the typical concerns about algae. Instead the plants can take whatever I can possibly dish out to them in terms of par/ppfd.
> 
> ...


Have been meaning to post this pic but it took awhile to find it. LOL, you could always use motorized mirrors that track the sun. The pic below is from my Seneye PAR meter, sitting on my back porch in full noon sunlight in the summer, somewhere in Iowa.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

Immortal1 said:


> Have been meaning to post this pic but it took awhile to find it. LOL, you could always use motorized mirrors that track the sun. The pic below is from my Seneye PAR meter, sitting on my back porch in full noon sunlight in the summer, somewhere in Iowa.


Timely! I just this morning saw a post on the dart frog forum I am frequenting about this critter:










No idea what it is or where its from but the person who posted it said some folks have used something like it to light their reefs.

The vivarium I am setting up is in the basement. It is underground. I would need to channel light more then 20 feet down to make it work. And then I wouldn't be able to move the tank ever... I could see this being good for someone committed to their aquarium location and needing a LOT of light but for my purposes it won't do.

Edit: Did some more searching and its called a suntube or sun tunnel. A lot of different people make and install them. One website said 500-1000 dollars professionally installed, seems quiet reasonable compared to something like ADA Solar ;P


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## Immortal1 (Feb 18, 2015)

I think I have seen that light tube at Menards. Agreed, cool idea for the right location. Anyway, when I read your post about "blasting it with as much light as possible" I thought to myself.... Really? are you sure?? LOL
Anyway, good luck on the DIY build.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> I purchased these: https://www.ledsupply.com/led-drivers/mean-well-ldd-h-series-cc-step-down-mode
> 
> When selecting options for wires and 700mA it changes to say it is the HW version. But it doesn't show up as such in the cart so my guess is that I got it right.
> 
> I did go with the normal deep red not the sunplus. Your post #23 used the regular ones so I went that route. Should I buy the sunplus reds?



Ok.


If you can change it fine, if not doesn't make a lot of difference. Pretty sure it's the same diode, just different lens angle.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> Ok.
> 
> 
> If you can change it fine, if not doesn't make a lot of difference. Pretty sure it's the same diode, just different lens angle.


Gotcha, ordered the sunplus ones this morning.


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## jeffkrol (Jun 5, 2013)

minorhero said:


> Gotcha, ordered the sunplus ones this morning.


cool..
Anyways since you will be assembling your bars soon I want you to think about a topic that most ignore.. mainly since most can't do a thing about it.. 
A light bar is as it is..










Even light spread w/ your pointy light sources.
Since leds are basically a bunch of individual light cones blended together a drawback is w/ all evenly spaced an overlap of more diodes (center area) creates a sort of hot spot.


W/ saltwater tanks people are finally starting to come to grips w/ this. Mostly due to the LARGE cones created by "puck style" lights..


See any PAR map to get an idea of what I mean..


Anyways an example:
HOW TO get an even (or less severe) PAR spread












Depending on your goals/ design you may want to consider your spacing of diodes.. wider apart in the center ..or not.


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## minorhero (Mar 28, 2019)

jeffkrol said:


> Depending on your goals/ design you may want to consider your spacing of diodes.. wider apart in the center ..or not.


I think this is really good advice. If I knew for certain where plants were going and that they would stay there I could plan the light around that. But I don't know and won't until much later and even then I will almost certainly change things as the years go by. 

But I certainly don't need to make a center hotspot. 

I think evenly placing reds and cyan but leaving a gap in the middle with the cool whites should help a lot.


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