# Caribsea Eco-Complete



## Esteban Colberto (Mar 7, 2017)

I bought a 20 lb bag of Eco-Complete for my 30 gallon planted tank. I also plan on using a liquid fertilizer. Is that sufficient for good plant growth or do I need to add more "food" in the substrate?

Thank you from a rookie!


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## FLOutlander (Mar 7, 2017)

I'd add some root tabs into the substrate. Also, 1 bag is not enough for your tank. 

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## Esteban Colberto (Mar 7, 2017)

FLOutlander said:


> I'd add some root tabs into the substrate. Also, 1 bag is not enough for your tank.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


FLOutlander the layer should be how deep? Thank you sir.


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## FLOutlander (Mar 7, 2017)

Substrate should be 2.5 to 3 inches deep. Some folks slope it front to back, so maybe 2 inches in front and 3 to 4 in the back.

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## Esteban Colberto (Mar 7, 2017)

FLOutlander said:


> Substrate should be 2.5 to 3 inches deep. Some folks slope it front to back, so maybe 2 inches in front and 3 to 4 in the back.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


Thank you sir very much appreciated.

Bump:


FLOutlander said:


> Substrate should be 2.5 to 3 inches deep. Some folks slope it front to back, so maybe 2 inches in front and 3 to 4 in the back.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


I just did a little looking and it seems the formula is 1 pound per gallon for a 1" layer. So if I wanted 3" layer that's 90 lbs of Eco-Complete. That seems like a lot but maybe it's just right. Just wanted to ask before I headed off to the aquarium store. Thank you again.


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## natemcnutty (May 26, 2016)

Esteban Colberto said:


> Thank you sir very much appreciated.
> 
> Bump:
> 
> I just did a little looking and it seems the formula is 1 pound per gallon for a 1" layer. So if I wanted 3" layer that's 90 lbs of Eco-Complete. That seems like a lot but maybe it's just right. Just wanted to ask before I headed off to the aquarium store. Thank you again.


Just a warning on that formula - it's more of a guesstimate I've heard thrown around.

If you think about a 20 gallon high vs 20 gallon long, you need quite a bit more on the 20 long even though they are the same gallons. To make things even more interesting, a 29 gallon or 37 gallon would use the same amount as a 20 gallon long.

A better measurement would be how many pounds to cubic inches, but I don't know any vendors that give those details.

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## EmeraldAlkaline (Feb 24, 2017)

Hmmm, I am actually quite interested in this thread. Im about to be setting up a 20 Gallon high to replace my 10 gallon (don't worry Im gonna let the 10 gallon run while the 20 is cycling so the fish are safe) and was facing the conundrum with what substrate to get and how much. Seeing that Fluval Stratum worked pretty well in my 10, I was gonna to that but, I can only find the 4.4 pound bags online and i'd need at LEAST 5 bags of that I'm assuming for $16 a pop. 

Then I saw the Carib-sea 20 pound bag for the same price as a single bag of the fluval. Is the carib-sea stuff any good? and would I need to use additional ferts like root tabs to keep things growing? I plan on dosing the tank with excel and flourish, Im just talking about the substrate aspect. And now that the discussion has arisen with OP's tank, would a 20 pound bag be enough for a 20 gallon high?


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## Luke13 (Jan 23, 2017)

I tried 2 bags of Carib-sea in my 29 and it just gave enough with a very flat terrain. 3 bags would be much better to give it some slope toward the back. It's surprising (to us newbies) how much substrate can be swallowed up in a tank of modest size. I wish in retrospect that I had gone with blasting sand. Much cheaper, and if one is dosing the water column anyway, the benefits of the micronutrients in Carib-sea are, dare I say, negligible?

Please note the different "footprint" between the 29 and the 30!


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## RobnSonji (Oct 6, 2013)

I used eco complete in my 125 and I probably used the same formula. I forget what it is....it has been too long.

I do have enough to easily plant the plants....but I wish I had a little more. I'd say I have maybe 1.25" in the front and 2.25" or slightly more in the back.

Being mine is a bigger tank its easier spreading out a couple more bags....which I may do soon I dunno.

I guess my point is if it were me Id buy a little more than the formula says to. 

Although I don't think you need to be as deep as some people suggest. I see some tanks that look like they have 4 inchs in the front. 
Often when you see scapes where the substrate is very high in the back they have used something cheap to build it up before adding the good substrate. Ive seen large rocks used or even media bags full of normal aquarium gravel laid down to create hills with the good substrate on top.

Eco complete is good but not the best substrate money can buy.....but I was doing a 125 and didnt want to 2nd mortgage the house.
My plants grow but now that mine is coming up on 2 years old I have started added root tabs (osmocote) and it is helping.


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## Nlewis (Dec 1, 2015)

EmeraldAlkaline said:


> Hmmm, I am actually quite interested in this thread. Im about to be setting up a 20 Gallon high to replace my 10 gallon (don't worry Im gonna let the 10 gallon run while the 20 is cycling so the fish are safe) and was facing the conundrum with what substrate to get and how much. Seeing that Fluval Stratum worked pretty well in my 10, I was gonna to that but, I can only find the 4.4 pound bags online and i'd need at LEAST 5 bags of that I'm assuming for $16 a pop.
> 
> Then I saw the Carib-sea 20 pound bag for the same price as a single bag of the fluval. Is the carib-sea stuff any good? and would I need to use additional ferts like root tabs to keep things growing? I plan on dosing the tank with excel and flourish, Im just talking about the substrate aspect. And now that the discussion has arisen with OP's tank, would a 20 pound bag be enough for a 20 gallon high?


Eco-Complete is a giant waste of money. You could buy a $5 bag of lava rock, take a sledgehammer to it and come up with the same product for a fraction of the cost.


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## EmeraldAlkaline (Feb 24, 2017)

Nlewis said:


> Eco-Complete is a giant waste of money. You could buy a $5 bag of lava rock, take a sledgehammer to it and come up with the same product for a fraction of the cost.


Ah, good to know. Any recommendations?


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## Nlewis (Dec 1, 2015)

EmeraldAlkaline said:


> Ah, good to know. Any recommendations?


If dont want to go soil based the I'd suggest either pool filter sand or Black Diamond blasting grit. The PFS is a beige color and the blasting grit is black. Both are inert substances and are SUPER CHEAP, my favorite would be the blasting sand. I'd also recommend picking up a set of dry fertilizers, they will go a lot further than the liquids will and they as well are SUPER CHEAP. 

EI based NPK + CSM+B with GH booster - NilocG Aquatics


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## EmeraldAlkaline (Feb 24, 2017)

Nlewis said:


> If dont want to go soil based the I'd suggest either pool filter sand or Black Diamond blasting grit. The PFS is a beige color and the blasting grit is black. Both are inert substances and are SUPER CHEAP, my favorite would be the blasting sand. I'd also recommend picking up a set of dry fertilizers, they will go a lot further than the liquids will and they as well are SUPER CHEAP.
> 
> EI based NPK + CSM+B with GH booster - NilocG Aquatics


I do have some Seachem flourish root tabs. Would just PFS and those plus liquid fert be enough?


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## RobnSonji (Oct 6, 2013)

Nlewis said:


> Eco-Complete is a giant waste of money. You could buy a $5 bag of lava rock, take a sledgehammer to it and come up with the same product for a fraction of the cost.


you cant make a statement like that without further elaboration

I like mine well enough....whats wrong with it?

And please make it something more than because its not soil


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## Esteban Colberto (Mar 7, 2017)

RobnSonji said:


> you cant make a statement like that without further elaboration
> 
> I like mine well enough....whats wrong with it?
> 
> And please make it something more than because its not soil


Agreed and to be honest if someone said I could spend $5 and spend a few hours busting up lava rock with a sledge hammer or pay $20 for a bag of Eco-Complete I'm spending the twenty any old day of the week.

Bump:


natemcnutty said:


> Just a warning on that formula - it's more of a guesstimate I've heard thrown around.
> 
> If you think about a 20 gallon high vs 20 gallon long, you need quite a bit more on the 20 long even though they are the same gallons. To make things even more interesting, a 29 gallon or 37 gallon would use the same amount as a 20 gallon long.
> 
> ...


Point well taken natemcnutty. I bought four bags for my tank and I'll just keep the remaining amount to use as a top off. Many thanks!


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## Mattb126 (Nov 13, 2016)

RobnSonji said:


> you cant make a statement like that without further elaboration
> 
> I like mine well enough....whats wrong with it?
> 
> And please make it something more than because its not soil


Eco-complete is inert, and is just crushed lava rock. This being said it is way overpriced, for what it is. Also, it is very hard to keep plants with a small root system in, ie: stem plants. 

If you want a good substrate, that's cheap, and is easy to plant in, get black diamond blasting sand. 

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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

The deceptive marketing is enough to keep me away from Eco-Complete. I try to not support companies that lie to the consumer.

"Why does Eco-Complete planted aquarium substrate outperform other products? For the same reason that Hawaii, Bali and Costa Rica are famous for lush, exuberant plant growth. The secret lies in rich basaltic volcanic soil which contains iron, calcium, magnesium, potassium, sulfur plus over 25 other elements to nourish your aquatic plants. Eco-Complete Planted Aquarium Substrate is mineralogically and biologically complete, giving you luxuriant aquatic plant growth without nuisance algae."

Your dinner plate contains a lot of these minerals too, but if you don't put some food on it, you'r not going to do too well!

EC is hard to compare to other substrates because you don't know how much you're getting. The bag weight includes the water.


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## Mattb126 (Nov 13, 2016)

Kubla said:


> Your dinner plate contains a lot of these minerals too, but if you don't put some food on it, you'r not going to do too well!


This.


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## Nlewis (Dec 1, 2015)

RobnSonji said:


> you cant make a statement like that without further elaboration
> 
> I like mine well enough....whats wrong with it?
> 
> And please make it something more than because its not soil


All Eco is, is crushed up lava rock. The only value it has is its ability to soak an store nutrients for later use. It's cons are its a pain in the ass to plant in and it cost a lot more than what i listed earlier.


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## sohankpatel (Jul 10, 2015)

I think my tank looks pretty good with eco complete....
(Signature)


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## Nlewis (Dec 1, 2015)

sohankpatel said:


> I think my tank looks pretty good with eco complete....
> (Signature)


So did mine with blasting grit. I spent about 18 bucks on my substrate, how much did you spend?


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## sohankpatel (Jul 10, 2015)

Nlewis said:


> So did mine with blasting grit. I spent about 18 bucks on my substrate, how much did you spend?


*Mumble
"You're just jealous... :laugh2:
I really should have gone with BDBS, but I was a newb at the time.


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## MtAnimals (May 17, 2015)

I've done several tanks with ECO....The last one is a 20 gallon.After outbreaks of 3 different kinds of algae,the plants are struggling,barely growing.It only seems to work well after it's been aged and matured.I used Ocote+ root caps too.

the last 2 tanks I used miracle gro and bdbs.one bag of miracle grow did both small tanks,it was 5.49 for a 9 litre bag.I topped with BDBS,9 bucks for 50 pounds.Plants are growing like crazy,no algae.

all three tank have had the same ferts added,the results are day and night.I would never recommend ECO to anyone,but I would recommend MGOCPM and BDBS,and that's all I will ever use in the future.

You really should give the miracle gro and bdbs a try.It's way way less money too.


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## RobnSonji (Oct 6, 2013)

Eco may be pricey

if you compare it to blasting sand or even pool filter sand

not so pricey when compared to some others (at least when I bought mine)

I dont know about difficult to plant in.... I have no problems with it....and Im a newb.

There are also plenty of pics of tanks as beautiful as yours Nlewis that are using eco complete. Based on that the only difference is price.
My eco complete was growing plants without the use of any root ferts.....Ive never tried it will blasting sand do that?


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## Mattb126 (Nov 13, 2016)

MtAnimals said:


> It only seems to work well after it's been aged and matured.


This further validates that eco-complete is inert, and the only benefit is that it has a high CEC which allows it to hold nutrients for the plants. 

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## mbkemp (Dec 15, 2016)

MtAnimals said:


> I've done several tanks with ECO....The last one is a 20 gallon.After outbreaks of 3 different kinds of algae,the plants are struggling,barely growing.It only seems to work well after it's been aged and matured.I used Ocote+ root caps too.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I have one with eco, bought into the hype as a newb and one with bdbs and organic miracle grow. No comparison, bdbs for me unless it's all the way to aquasoil 


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## MadRiverPat (May 3, 2013)

Don't know if you've got a tractor supply nearby but they've got safe-t-sorb which has very similar cec properties to eco complete and is significantly cheaper in price. People build entire fish rooms using this stuff exclusively. 

SafeTSorb - For Life Out Here


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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

The one positive I keep seeing for Ecocomplete is a high CEC. I don't believe that either. I'm think it's just flourite with added bacteria and water. Flourite has lousy CEC. It works better over time because mulm builds up.


Flourite, EcoComplete, Blasting sand, can all have great growth, you just have to add the right nutrients. They don't cause algae You just have to decide if you want something to hold your plants or hold them and feed them.


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## sdwindansea (Oct 28, 2016)

Nlewis said:


> All Eco is, is crushed up lava rock. The only value it has is its ability to soak an store nutrients for later use. It's cons are its a pain in the ass to plant in and it cost a lot more than what i listed earlier.


I completely agree although there is one other advantage that I can think of (for the lazy). You do not need to pre-rinse it before starting up a new tank.


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## MtAnimals (May 17, 2015)

I could rant on ECO all day long....I recently set up a tank with ECO,plants struggle,very little growth,3 different algae outbreaks.it's been about 6-8 weeks.OTH,another tank with plain colored aquarium gravel and mulm,the same plants grow great.both have the same light,same root caps,same ferts.I need to top and replant pretty badly in the one with plain gravel.

sorry for the crappy camera pics,but I just now took them.


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## Esteban Colberto (Mar 7, 2017)

MtAnimals if Eco-complete is inert how can it be to blame for your poor plant condition on it since... according to others... it does basically nothing? Just asking.


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## MtAnimals (May 17, 2015)

​


Esteban Colberto said:


> MtAnimals if Eco-complete is inert how can it be to blame for your poor plant condition on it since... according to others... it does basically nothing? Just asking.


Exactly my point! It does nothing. It is inert.It's promoted as being "a complete planted tank substrate".I was just demonstrating the difference between ECO and old inert colored gravel.I do have one tank in which ECO is growing great plants,but it took about a year and a half of ferts,root tabs,and fish waste to get that way.

As far as the poor condition of the plants in that tank,I take full responsibility for that.I just haven't found a way for them to take off in that tank yet.But Again,the point is there is no use is spending the extra money for something that's touted to be everything you need in a plant substrate.In my view,it will cause people new to planted tanks to have trouble and be turned away from the hobby,which is bad for all of us.

If I had a place to put that large angelfish in that 20,I would just reboot that tank with MGO and be done with it.

Regardless of post count,I still consider my self fairly new to planted tanks,and I am still learning.


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## sohankpatel (Jul 10, 2015)

Esteban Colberto said:


> MtAnimals if Eco-complete is inert how can it be to blame for your poor plant condition on it since... according to others... it does basically nothing? Just asking.


Eco complete really needs to be aged before it works well. It absorbs nutrients from the water and makes them available to plant roots. I like it, but it is kind of a pain to plant in, compared to sand.


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## audimurf (Mar 23, 2017)

are we talking sand blasting grit here?! 
As in 50 lbs from harbor freight and using a 20% off coupon?!
50 lb. Black Aluminum Oxide 70 Grit Abrasive Media


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## MtAnimals (May 17, 2015)

audimurf said:


> are we talking sand blasting grit here?!
> As in 50 lbs from harbor freight and using a 20% off coupon?!
> 50 lb. Black Aluminum Oxide 70 Grit Abrasive Media


not sure if that's the same thing..What we're talking is "Black diamond blasting sand",it's actually coal slag from what I understand.

http://www.ruralking.com/media/cata...slag_blasting_abrasives_50_lb._bag_-_1240.jpg


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## audimurf (Mar 23, 2017)

well darn. I just paid $70 for 2.25 gallons of prodibio aquasoil. It is my first tank. If I can find this black diamond blasting grit near chicago, I'm returning that stuff!!!! The internet rules!

Considering how much stuff i need to fill in the slopes where i have paint cans. If i go this route, OP gets a beer on me!


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## aja31 (May 25, 2013)

audimurf said:


> well darn. I just paid $70 for 2.25 gallons of prodibio aquasoil. It is my first tank. If I can find this black diamond blasting grit near chicago, I'm returning that stuff!!!! The internet rules!
> 
> Considering how much stuff i need to fill in the slopes where i have paint cans. If i go this route, OP gets a beer on me!


Aquasoil is completely different. It is a complete substrate that does have all the needed nutrients. Eco-complete and things like flourite are inert with high CEC allowing them to store nutrients over time as you fertilize but start with nothing. Sand has no nutrients and no storage capacity. If you stop fertilizing for even a few days your plants will suffer. Just depends on how good you are in keeping to a schedule really.


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