# Frustrated with pool filter sand!



## PickieBee

I did so much reading before setting up my first planted tank a few months ago and thought pool filter sand would be the best choice for me, but I'm starting to regret that decision!

I read that it should be about 1 inch deep, but in practice that is not deep enough to keep my plants rooted. I am replanting stuff pretty much every time I do my weekly water changes, which can't be good for the roots.

Also I read that I'm supposed to be stirring the sand to prevent toxic gas bubbles, but once you get plants, driftwood, and rocks in there it's impossible to stir most of the sand without essentially rescaping every time.

And finally, that light-colored sand shows every little bit of detritus or poo, so that the tank never really looks pristinely clean.

Of course, on the other hand my catfish, shrimp, and plants all seem to love it and be quite happy.

I'm considering switching to some kind of commercial soil product (eco-complete, aquasoil, etc.). The reason I didn't go with one of those in the first place was because I didn't want to have to replace my entire substrate yearly when the soil gets "used up." I don't want to have to deal with clouding or toxic gas problems like I have read about from those who use potting soil or similar substrates.

I don't know yet the best solution to these issues...any thoughts?


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## aquanauts

Switch to the "good stuff" Eco complete, soil, etc. For a couple reasons 1, plain pool filter sand has very little to no nutrients (unless it is some kind of iron rich flourite sand or something), but u can still use it to cap dirt . 2, plants have a really hard time rooting in such a fine substrate like sand(low depth, fine substrate=floating plants). 3, The nutrient rich substrates like dirt and Eco complete do not have to be switched yearly. more like 6-10 years (10 is pushing it a tad). So, bottom line, GET THE GOOD STUFF M8. (Just a side note, Eco-complete is my all time favorite affordable substrate).
GOOD LUCK!


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## discuspaul

PickieBee said:


> I did so much reading before setting up my first planted tank a few months ago and thought pool filter sand would be the best choice for me, but I'm starting to regret that decision!
> 
> I read that it should be about 1 inch deep, but in practice that is not deep enough to keep my plants rooted. I am replanting stuff pretty much every time I do my weekly water changes, which can't be good for the roots.
> 
> Also I read that I'm supposed to be stirring the sand to prevent toxic gas bubbles, but once you get plants, driftwood, and rocks in there it's impossible to stir most of the sand without essentially rescaping every time.
> 
> And finally, that light-colored sand shows every little bit of detritus or poo, so that the tank never really looks pristinely clean.
> 
> Of course, on the other hand my catfish, shrimp, and plants all seem to love it and be quite happy.
> 
> I'm considering switching to some kind of commercial soil product (eco-complete, aquasoil, etc.). The reason I didn't go with one of those in the first place was because I didn't want to have to replace my entire substrate yearly when the soil gets "used up." I don't want to have to deal with clouding or toxic gas problems like I have read about from those who use potting soil or similar substrates.
> 
> I don't know yet the best solution to these issues...any thoughts?


 
Before you completely give up on PFS, consider the following:

- Firstly, you're right - 1" of PFS is not enough depth of sand to allow rooted plants to stay in place and develop properly. Try having only about 1" in the frontal open spaces, but add sand to graduate upwards to about 2.5" -2.75" or so at the rear where your main body of rooted plants is located.

- I've kept several tanks with nothing but PFS for over 5 years, and the only 'stirring' I ever did was the very occasional light stir in odd spots with a bamboo skewer or chopstick, if I thought I might want to check for potential gas pockets, just for peace of mind, if nothing else.
I've never experienced even a hint of a possible gas pocket formation over those 5 years.
- The only experiences I've ever heard or read about toxic pockets developing were where hard-packed very fine sand (like play sand for example) had been laid to a thickness deeper than 3", where anaerobic pockets were more likely to develop. In sand layers of less than 3", the risk of that occurring is negligible.
- And yes, you're right - PFS does tend to show all of the detritus and wastes that accumulate in a tank. I look upon that as a large benefit, particularly in my discus tanks. Every bit of undesirable material does not go & hide below the substrate surface (where it can produce toxicity in the form of harmful bacteria from decomposition), so it's easy to clean up, and allows you to maintain a squeaky clean tank, along with good water quality & conditions. I look upon that as an added bonus.
- If you have good quality #20 or #30 grade PFS, it will not get siphoned up while vacuuming, will not raise up into the water column when disturbed (so will not get into & clog filtration), and if properly rinsed, will never cloud your water.

Have a peek at what PFS substrate should look like. Mine is like this 100% of the time, in all my tanks. I swear by PFS:
http://s1105.photobucket.com/albums/h357/discuspaul/Anubias
http://s1105.photobucket.com/albums/h357/discuspaul/Sept2011


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## theatermusic87

Sounds like you just need more sand in your tank for your plants to root better. Im very happy with mine, been over a year, while im not too keen on the color, its gotten a bit duller with age and I like it better now. If your concerned about nutrients, you can always slide a couple root tabs in.


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## Diana

Ditto DiscusPaul! 

I also have kept tanks with PFS, along the exact lines he suggests. 

Except:
It won't hold a slope, and sifts through rock. I 'mortar' the rocks together with expanding foam filler to make a retaining wall. Then the sand or other substrate will stay where I put it.


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## Billium

I have PFS in my 55 and I don't regret it one bit. I have alot of current throughout the tank along with a school of cory's that are constantly sifting through the sand and its always squeaky clean. I about 2.5" of sand and never had any plant uprooting problems. Some plants just root better than others. Just get more PFS rinse it super good and add some more.


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## SueD

As an alternative to the color of pool filter sand, you could try Caribsea Instant Aquarium - Tahitian Moon. This is black sand that is packed in a liquid, much like Eco Complete, although it does not have the plant nutrients of Eco. But no rinsing required! It's supposed to have things to speed up cycling.

I just decided to try this for a new tank over the Eco I have in other tanks and I really like it so far. I have over 2" in there and it's been easy to plant in. I haven't added fish yet so I can't say how it will act when I have to do tank maintenance.


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## talontsiawd

I can tell you one thing for certain, if you don't like the color of your substrate, you probably never will. That alone is reason enough to replace it for me, which I have done myself.

As for other issues, you can try more sand and add carpeting plants so you never have to worry about what the top of the substrate looks like if you don't mind it being covered up. 

I haven't used PFS specifically but I have tried some things similar. You will see that some people love PFS, others feel it works for the money, others just hate it all together. That's typically what you find with cheaper alternatives, but many also complain about other substrates as well.


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## klibs

A lot of it is personal preference.
If you don't like certain aspects of it then you may consider replacing it.

Eco Complete for instance is loved by many people but also hated by another good many people. After using it for a year or so I have come to hate the stuff and this has prompted me to plan to tear down my tank and replace it. Also - don't think that eco complete holds nutrients like dirt or aquasoil does. It's basically just a very light, inconsistent sand/gravel mix. It is completely inert.

That said you definitely don't have a deep enough layer of PFS. You also shouldn't have to stir your substrate ever. If you use some root tabs buried in there you should be fine. IF you don't like the density of PFS then you might want to try something else. There is also a very good chance that your plant's rooting issues could lie elsewhere (substrate may not be to blame)


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## PickieBee

Thanks for all the input! I think I will try making the sand deeper before I give up on it altogether.


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## tricken

i have a tank with sand at 7 years no issues at all 2-3 inch and works great in a 55


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## MissileBear

I am also a big fan of PFS, as was my mentor. I would also suggest increasing your depth. If you are concerned about anerobic pockets, take a peek at the underside of the tank. If you have anerobic pockets you will probably see the black patches through the glass. Rooted plants and snails seem to help with this if it is a problem. 

My 180 gallon occasionally gets anerobic pockets under large rocks and driftwood. I use tweezers to repeatedly poke into the sand into & around the affected area. This releases any gas buildup and helps aerate things without pulling up plants and such. I've never had this become an issue with anything alive.

DiscusPaul made many good points. After having tried most of the other substrates, PFS continues to be my main choice. I use many others on specific tanks - AS Amazonia, ControlSoil, Flourite, Carribsea, and MTS, but these each have a specific use. I always have a spare bag of PFS handy.


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## Stone454

I never liked PFS or the playground sand, it is just messy and the color was awful, it shows every little bit of dirt. It was too easily disturbed and clouded the water, especially if you have a fish that likes to dig. I like black diamond if I am going to use sand, and to stir you sand to keep from getting the "deadly gas pockets" ( which I have never encountered and have seen fish get blasted right in the face by bubble with no ill effects) get some malaysian trumpet snails and they will stir it for you.


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## blt

Agree with all above about deeper and no need to stir. Also wanted to add that PFS can be found in colors besides white, I've found this more natural looking color:








It's been in this tank about 3 years with no discoloration and all the various tank detritus blends in better than with "show off your poop white".


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## discuspaul

Yes, PFS can be found in white, off-white, a couple of shades of beige/tan, pinkish, and greyish. Good selection to choose from - your preference. Some colors may be difficult to find, depending on your area of the country, and where it's obtained & mined.


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## anastasisariel

Pretty sure if i started a tank with only 1 inch of PFS id be frustrated too.


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## MySquishy

blt said:


> Agree with all above about deeper and no need to stir. Also wanted to add that PFS can be found in colors besides white, I've found this more natural looking color:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's been in this tank about 3 years with no discoloration and all the various tank detritus blends in better than with "show off your poop white".


What brand pfs is this?
This is exactly what I’m looking for for the tank I’m setting up.


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## mourip

nicepoeci said:


> One of those "DIY" save 10$ tricks that goes viral on the internet but really is just people cheaping out on their fish. It clearly says on the bag that the dust causes cancer but online hobbyists say "ItS InErT". I fell for it myself, tried it and instantly regretted it once the entire line was destroyed - all swimming around without color looking like skeletons until moved after 6 months- yea I rinsed that sand for 2 hours in my bathroom. If your going to use sand, best to buy it straight from the pet store some nice real river sand. If you want nice healthy plants and a soil that breathes- you need ada aqua soil or fluval stratum. Everything else is a pathetic representation of people cheaping out on their fish IMO. Hate me all you want.


Spending even a few minutes online researching the safety sand for aquariums will come up with a variety of "informed" opinions. This issue is in no way clear cut and in your case possibly not even the source of your tank husbandry issues. All sand has silica in it and therefore some amount of dust. If it exceeds 95% silica it gets the warning label. A more probable culprit for poor fish health when using sand is buying some that has been treated with chemicals for algae or mold.

Clearly hundreds of aquarists on TPT alone use pool sand and have healthy fish. One might better be able to effectively argue it's safety for humans before it has been washed to minimize the dust.

BTW. I doubt that anyone here will take even a second of their time to "hate you".


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## somewhatshocked

Several comments have been removed. There's no reason to insult others, get into weird political discussions, troll or spread disinformation.

Won't clean this thread up again, so it's now locked.


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