# effect of high PH on plants



## happi (Dec 18, 2009)

i seen many people asking this question about how there plants die due to high PH. could anyone explain how this effect the plants.

thanks


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

Hardness can effect plants, pH is irrelevant(to any extent I can research). That being said, most aquatic plants can adapt to some extent. Certain plants are more sensitive to very hard or very soft water. 

pH is often misunderstood in the aquarium, and KH and GH are significantly more valuable tools for assessing water quality. Even then, most fish, outside of very sensitive species, can live and thrive within a wide range of water parameters, given that they are STABLE.

One point of note is that high pH can cause free ammonia to be more toxic, but to fish, not plants. Plants can thrive in these conditions while animals might not. 

There is little evidence to suggest that pH in and of itself has much effect on most aquatic life. The conditions that lead to that have some, but again, stability is the most important thing in our tanks. 

If you intend to keep very demanding and sensitive species, using RO water and rebuilding it with a very set formula is likely the method you would need to use. You would then start with a particular goal and get there. 

For most of us, dechlorinated tap water is sufficient. The things often missed are the balance of co2, light and fertilizers. Often we have too much light, too little co2, and too little macro and micro nutrients. 

Just my 2cents. I tried to find research that indicated pH played some significance to aquatic plants, but I could not. Some finer leaved plants struggle in really hard (kh and gh) which usually means a higher pH too, but tons of plants do fine otherwise.


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## happi (Dec 18, 2009)

thanks for explaining it.

what do you think about this though:
alkalinity - 180 mg/L
hardness - 200-300 mg/L
PH - 7.2

how well the plants would do under this water?



over_stocked said:


> Hardness can effect plants, pH is irrelevant(to any extent I can research). That being said, most aquatic plants can adapt to some extent. Certain plants are more sensitive to very hard or very soft water.
> 
> pH is often misunderstood in the aquarium, and KH and GH are significantly more valuable tools for assessing water quality. Even then, most fish, outside of very sensitive species, can live and thrive within a wide range of water parameters, given that they are STABLE.
> 
> ...


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

There is no reason your plants should have a problem, unless you don't provide the essential elements already discussed. 

That being said, I am interested to see if anyone has anything that directly ties pH to plant health or anything that shows the limits to hardness.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

happi said:


> thanks for explaining it.
> 
> what do you think about this though:
> alkalinity - 180 mg/L
> ...


My tap exceeds those:



















KH is 200mg/l, Gh is 450 mg/l

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## sparkysko (Jun 11, 2004)

I was on well water in the desert, my pH was 8.2 and the levels of everything was ridiculously high. Was great for keeping African Cichlids... I grew plants, they did alright. I moved my planted tank to Oregon which has virtually nothing in the water here, and the rate of growth of most things increased significantly. Java moss which hadn't done anything in the desert finally started to grow, now it's a nuisance....

Aside from the moss, I can't think of anything else that didn't grow at a decent enough rate.. I never had any other plants that I couldn't grow.


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## sajata (Aug 21, 2009)

here is a article i found on this subject. What i want to know is how accurate is it. As we all know it must be true because i read it on the internet. The Article makes we want to use RO/DI and rebuild the composition form the ground up.
http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/AquariumKH.html


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

sajata said:


> here is a article i found on this subject. What i want to know is how accurate is it. As we all know it must be true because i read it on the internet. The Article makes we want to use RO/DI and rebuild the composition form the ground up.
> http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/AquariumKH.html


I found this in researching this. Number one, the are selling something. Number two, outside of being outrageously long, it basically ties pH to GH and KH. Which we know. There is nothing in there to provide evidence that a lower pH or KH really will be better for your plants. 

One point is that SOME kh and gh is important if you use co2, as it stops you fro bottoming out. 

CO2 also helps in the consuption of KH.


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## happi (Dec 18, 2009)

very nice man. the plants looks very healthy. i hope this helps those who thought plants cant grow in high PH. thank you for the pictures, i hope my plans grow well someday, still having some issue with the co2. 



plantbrain said:


> My tap exceeds those:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Daniel*Swords (May 8, 2006)

As I've understood it, pH affects the availability of some fertilizers for plants. This in its turn is affected by the composition of the fertilizer (different chelators for different pHs). Tom?


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

Daniel*Swords said:


> As I've understood it, pH affects the availability of some fertilizers for plants. This in its turn is affected by the composition of the fertilizer (different chelators for different pHs). Tom?


I do know that Ferrous gluconate works better at lower pH while DTPA and EDTA chelated iron work better at higher pH, if not mistaken. They are more bioavailable in those conditions.


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## sajata (Aug 21, 2009)

so on the PPS site i found this artical on PH and CO2
PPS, the GH, KH CO2 relationship


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## OverStocked (May 26, 2007)

sajata said:


> so on the PPS site i found this artical on PH and CO2
> PPS, the GH, KH CO2 relationship


This is just showing the much talked about co2/ph/kh relationship. Nothing about high pH and its effect on plants.


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## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

There are a few plants that have problems with very hard water. Generally the plants most of us have used will adapt to almost any tap water - remember you are safe in drinking tap water, so why should the plants be more particular than you are? Who do they think they are, huh??:icon_cool


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## scollinguk (Nov 22, 2010)

Sorry to reopen an old thread, I am having problems with hard water and was hoping that those of you in the know here could cast an eye over it for me, my tap water comes out at 13dKH and the tank raises it higher then that and I am trying to put together a long term strategy on how to handle it.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/plants/121287-water-hard-liquid-granite-ferts-plants.html

Cheers!


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## justin182 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hoppy said:


> There are a few plants that have problems with very hard water. Generally the plants most of us have used will adapt to almost any tap water - remember you are safe in drinking tap water, so why should the plants be more particular than you are? Who do they think they are, huh??:icon_cool



The other day I heard my plants yelling, 'give me some of that voss water.' ＿φ(￣ー￣ )


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