# Suggestions for Aggressive slopes



## Gatekeeper (Feb 20, 2007)

Do tell... perhaps we can direct you better with more detail.

FYI, almost all substrates will settle over time. If you really want a large slope, you need to anchor the slope with "something" to keep it in shape, such as rocks (exposed or not exposed).


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## jasa73 (Jun 3, 2007)

Hey - I'd be interested as well. I'm upgrading to a tank with the same dimensions...90 gallons right? I'm chewing on ideas for slopes as well. Let's hear your idea!


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## FrostyNYC (Nov 5, 2007)

I believe that some substrates are better at holding slopes than others. I read in a thread that ADA aquasoil holds slopes very well, but I have no experience with that substrate myself. 

Like gmccreedy said, best bet is to support the slope with rockwork. Any plexiglass or other barriers will lead to a "tiered" effect, unless you reslope it when needed. I would also be wary of anaerobic pockets in very deep slopes.


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## rbarn (Mar 21, 2009)

Slopes will never hold if too steep.
Will always settle into an equilibrium.

Think of building terraces with rocks and wood instead and then
blending each level into a slope using plants, wood and rocks.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Check out Terraces by Peter Champus here. 

Also I have been told that to prevent gas build up under high slope to have plants with deep roots. 

To build the terraces you could use metal flashing and cover with gravel.


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## JimmyYahoo (Aug 14, 2005)

Anerobic pockets, huge piles of filler material, and empty open spaces are all things im trying to avoid. Aquasoil does hold a slope very well. Ive been able to create some decent slopes by pouring into the tank slowly while misting with a water bottle. Over time however the water does win and everything settles. Ive have thought to attempt to grow the plants emmersed on the slopes then fill with water once a nice root structure is in place to hold the dirt. This method floated around for awhile using HC but i rarely read any positive outcomes.

Ive also though to create a sort of molded shell using stainless steel screen like that you see flame moss growing on. The idea is basically to have two layers about 1.5 inches apart to sandwich in some substrate. Thing is is that stuff is expensive and hard to shape without a mold.

Last idea is a hybrid of both. Create the hills while dry then lay on some semi rigid net like material (i know of no such product) over the slopes. Ive seen this method used to prevent erosion on a large scale but dont know how well its would work small scale in the tank. Something custom may be in order like netting dipped in an epoxy so it hardens up.

Well, all in all just brainstorming at the moment. If anyone sees any pitfalls or ways to make what ive come up with better let me know. In the end ill try something, im going to have to see it not work to believe it.

Thanks.


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## saint27 (Apr 27, 2006)

I have designed a few reinforced soil slopes for bridge abutments and always thought it would be cool to do one in an aquarium. Here is one idea I drew up awhile ago. You could do something similar without the tier. I was thinking of planting with HC or micro swords.


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## Aquamadman (Aug 10, 2007)

Im gonna suggest something rather radical but while looking at some ancient city wall constructions ( I study archaeology ) I thought it might be an idea to use pebbles of 2cm radius at the bottom then layering those with smaller pebbles as you go higher and finally covering them with moss or aquasoil. 

Now you dont want the soil to slide off so you could try making a grid of some sort or by terracing. 

Hope this helps


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## jargonchipmunk (Dec 8, 2008)

why do you want to AVOID "large piles of filler material"? It will cut your costs by a lot, not to mention it works.
terrace the ground and hide the "terraces" with plants. I never see my substrate with all the plants in there anyway.

If you're looking to plant a carpet over the whole slope it would obviously present a whole new challenge, but in that case, if you're going to be using water column ferts... don't use soil on the slope. Make a form for the hills out of a mesh material (like the moss screens you were talking about) and make a sandwich that goes something like this:

Top mesh layer
plants
rockwool (or other absorptive material that will hold nutrients)
Bottom mesh later

The plants can grow fine into the rockwool and the water column ferts will provide all they need. The rockwool will even absorb some of the nutrients the plants don't use and become a bit of a fertilizer in and of itself if something proves lacking at any point.

Granted, I've never tried this myself, and haven't seen it tried, but hey... I'm an idea man lol I never claimed to actually KNOW what I was talking about.


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## Crystalview (Aug 10, 2007)

Would the dutch stype slopes work? I am trying to create a flow of UG. I am still looking for ways to do a slope with a tunnel for the Discus and other fish to swim through.

http://www.aquabotanic.com/dutchsecrets.htm


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## kwc1974 (Mar 17, 2009)

Mike @ADG is doing something wild using platic pieces to stabilize the slope. wish I could show a pic but he is entering it in the contest. needless to say, the tank is a 75 gallon and the Amazonia is 5" from the top back corner.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

JimmyYahoo said:


> Last idea is a hybrid of both. Create the hills while dry then lay on some semi rigid net like material.


I have seen some do that in an aquarium using egg crates, which is actually the screen material that goes under flouresant lights.

I was wonder if laying the netting over the dirt will cause the soil to be compacted and cause anerobic conditions. Has anybody done this?


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## JimmyYahoo (Aug 14, 2005)

saint27 said:


> I have designed a few reinforced soil slopes for bridge abutments and always thought it would be cool to do one in an aquarium. Here is one idea I drew up awhile ago. You could do something similar without the tier. I was thinking of planting with HC or micro swords.


Interesting. I foresee the gravel settling and eventually having a terraced effect that looks similar to a tiered rice patty. That would not look bad but its not what i am am going for. A smoother slope is the plan.


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## JimmyYahoo (Aug 14, 2005)

jargonchipmunk said:


> why do you want to AVOID "large piles of filler material"? It will cut your costs by a lot, not to mention it works.
> terrace the ground and hide the "terraces" with plants. I never see my substrate with all the plants in there anyway.
> 
> If you're looking to plant a carpet over the whole slope it would obviously present a whole new challenge, but in that case, if you're going to be using water column ferts... don't use soil on the slope. Make a form for the hills out of a mesh material (like the moss screens you were talking about) and make a sandwich that goes something like this:
> ...


You may have something here. Rockwool might indeed work and no chance of that loosing its slope since it could be one fibrous piece, or several stitched together then tied to a mesh structure. Simlar to how they make floats - form the shape with chicken wire (not suggesting to use this) then put the rockwool over it. 

However, ive never seen plans that spread by runners grown in rockwool - its always stem plants. Anyone have any input on this?


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## jargonchipmunk (Dec 8, 2008)

the runners would most likely spread above the rockwool in whatever mesh you use to hold the original bits down. I've done glosso emersed like this and it worked fine.


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## o snap its eric (Jan 12, 2004)

i just did it the old fashion way, lbs and lbs of substrate to create the slope.


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## JimmyYahoo (Aug 14, 2005)

Hilde said:


> Is this what you are invisioning?




Spectacular tank... but no. More rounded sloping hills with bedrock poking through.


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## bigshrimpin (Apr 2, 2009)

would natural clay work? Easy to mold and have the bedrock peek through like you want. Then cover the clay with 1"-2" of substrate.


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## blair (Feb 8, 2009)

Any solutions on this yet? I'm am very interested in the same concept.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

BTW, ADA As is clay, you can pack it in some it does not move.
Here's the 180 cm tank at AF which has this nice slope for about 1-2 years.

The rise is about 12" over 24"










Wood and rock can be used, plastic or glass slats, I think just doing a DSM and then let things root well, then top, do not uproot will allow the scape remain in good shape over time.

I have 6" rise vs 18" run using HC.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## dindin (Mar 4, 2009)

Hilde said:


> Is this what you are invisioning?


That one is fantastic! How was it done?

@Tom Barr, that is good to know. Most substrates tend to settle back down into a flatter 'scape eventually~~ esp with the help of cories.


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## plantbrain (Dec 15, 2003)

dindin said:


> That one is fantastic! How was it done?
> 
> @Tom Barr, that is good to know. Most substrates tend to settle back down into a flatter 'scape eventually~~ esp with the help of cories.


Avoid cories, Kuli loaches, anything that messes the sediment up.
Otherwise plan on redoing it every few months.

"Octopus" is awesome at the nano, one of the best scapers at the micro scale I've seen. 

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## MARIMOBALL (Mar 18, 2007)

Here is my ADA 120P iwagumi scape. I used 7 *9L bags of ADA Amazonia I. The foreground is 3 inches. The back of the slope is 9 inches. all Amazonia. the glosso, marselia minutia, and E tenellus micro have deep roots. The 150 lbs of seriyu stone hold the substrate. Oh and no corries, loaches and most important is no *MTS*.
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals-photo-album/65904-marimoballs-ada-120p-12.html


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## heydude819 (Mar 17, 2009)

check out post 16 of this thread over at apc

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquascaping/32847-hillside-2.html

It seems pretty simple to make. All you need is a lot of filler material on the bottom. maybe use regular gravel to fill up a good portion of the bottom and then top it off with your planting substrate


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## Chris-Indy (Feb 16, 2008)

I used a lot of Soilmaster substrate for my slope. I have a 30 gal cube with the slope running to the back left corner. At the base I used 3 or 4 lace rocks I would stay I have about 15 - 20 lbs of Soilmaster in the slope. I have Sagittaria subulata on the slope. Its about time for me to trim the stuff, but I have about 10+ mollie fry in there and I really don't want to lose any due to screwin with the setup.


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## Crystalview (Aug 10, 2007)

Were can I see more of "Octopus's" work?


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## JimmyYahoo (Aug 14, 2005)

heydude819 said:


> check out post 16 of this thread over at apc
> 
> http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquascaping/32847-hillside-2.html
> 
> It seems pretty simple to make. All you need is a lot of filler material on the bottom. maybe use regular gravel to fill up a good portion of the bottom and then top it off with your planting substrate


That is a nice tank and a great concept. Result is pretty similar to what i had in mind. I think ill do the same but use SS mesh for smoother and more shapely hills.


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## lumpyfunk (Dec 22, 2004)

Please double check this before trying. I think that great stuff expanding foam is a safe project, I read it somewhere, but I would double check before I tried it in one of my tanks. Use the great stuff to build the base shape. When it freshly applied force substrate or larger rock pieces into it. It will harden and the first layer of substrate will be attached. You could use a drywall saw to cut in pots or to shape it.


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## JimmyYahoo (Aug 14, 2005)

Lumpy, I think i see where you are going but what would keep the substrate from sliding down the foam base? This has been the issue all along.










This is close to what ive had in mind slope wise but covered in a nice thick grass like plant. I dont believe foam will get me there.


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## lumpyfunk (Dec 22, 2004)

When the foam is still fresh, it is soft. You could push in the substrate to give a sand paper like effect or use a mesh or egg crate type material. This would be held by the foam once it hardens.


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## ezcry4t3d (Apr 24, 2009)

I have considered using some terracotta pottery to add some additional support for a steeper slope in my 85gal. Both square and rectangular pots are readily available. I expect it will end up with more of a terraced look than you are wanting though. I am 100% sure that it's fish safe, since I have tons of it in with my goldfish.


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## ricoishere (Jan 26, 2009)

I was doing some reading, and using some styrofoam shaped in the shape of the slope you desire would be suitable. you could then attach the plants using COTTON thread.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Aquamadman said:


> While looking at some ancient city wall constructions ( I study archaeology ) I thought it might be an idea to use pebbles of 2cm radius at the bottom then layering those with smaller pebbles as you go higher and finally covering them with moss or aquasoil.
> 
> To prevent the soil from sliding off you could try making a grid of some sort or by terracing.


I am going try this idea using screen with .25 in mesh. Thinking of making inner of high hill with wire mesh in-compassing rocks. Will use spray foam to cover cracks.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Crystalview said:


> Were can I see more of "Octopus's" work?


Go to aquasape forum and google members, that is after you join.


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## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

lumpyfunk said:


> great stuff expanding foam is a safe project, I read it somewhere, but I would double check before I tried it in one of my tanks. Use the great stuff to build the base shape. When it freshly applied force substrate or larger rock pieces into it. It will harden and the first layer of substrate will be attached. You could use a drywall saw to cut in pots or to shape it.


Phil Edwards used great stuff to build a moss wall here.


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

JimmyYahoo said:


> Lumpy, I think i see where you are going but what would keep the substrate from sliding down the foam base? This has been the issue all along.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 the grass' & trees' roots hold the hill together. Without them, erosion would occur.

Something to think about in your scaping.


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