# Low Tech Lots of Questions



## Kosmonaut (Sep 21, 2014)

Just realized that maybe the Low Tech area was a better place to post, sorry.

Forgot to ask, where can I find some info on wether a specific plant type is a root or leaf feeder?

Thanks again.


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## BHolmes (Aug 23, 2012)

> But I got a low tech tank and I am not supposed to use chemical or biological filtration because they are detrimental to plants, right?


Filtration is never detrimental to plants. It will help keep your water quality stable and any inhabitants happy. Some people don't use it as a "no tech" approach. Other than that, everyone else uses filtration.



> Found this Oliver Knott's substrate, seems like a good alternative to the most used ADA soil, they say its long lasting and seems to be very clean, even right after filling the tank with water. Problem is that it will with time run out of nutrients, so would it be better to start with a inert substrate right off the bat and simply use tabs? Could I probably use the very cheap basalt gravel that was used to top the small vase and use root tabs only? Would ammonia spikes be then avoided?


In my opinion, I would use the Oliver Knott Substrate. That type of soil usually lasts for a year or two before it starts to break down. It would be much easier to maintain and plant than the cheap basalt gravel with root tabs. No matter what type of tank you setup it will always go through the initial ammonia cycle. That's easily fixed with heavy planting, seasoned water, and seasoned biological filter media. Frequent water changes help too.



> Is this a good combination? Will they need more ferts than just tabs?


Over time you'll see what plants will grow good in your tank. Once you find out which ones you'll have a good combination.



> Are my rcs going to turn green and muscular?


Your plants should!



> Forgot to ask, where can I find some info on wether a specific plant type is a root or leaf feeder?


Basically all of them are both. All plants will benefit from soil and fertilizers being dosed into the water column.

Good luck!


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## Kosmonaut (Sep 21, 2014)

Hi,

Got the Oliver Knott's substrate this week. I chose the fine size in black, looks nice.

Plants are supposed to be here on Saturday, I ordered the list that mentioned previously plus glossostigma. 

About filtering, Diana Walstad in his book says that bilogical filtering can be counterproductive and that chemical can be too... Would it be advisable to turn on the filter by night and off by day?


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## DumpyDuck (Jun 2, 2014)

I don't know why biological filtering would be detrimental or counterproductive, but if you only have shrimp in a 40L with plants, you probably wouldn't need it. If you had a filter and turned it off in the day and on at night, the bacteria necessary to provide biological filtering wouldn't really culture, so you would end up with only mechanical filtering and something that breaks up the scum on the top of the tank (which is a reason I think you would definitely want something to move the water). 

While it is true all aquatic plants will absorb nutrients from their leaves and roots, there are some plants, like your crypt, that are primarily root feeders, while other plants, like your ludwigia, that will feed from its leaves. A simple google search will help you identify which is which. For example: http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/plantfinder/details.php?id=26
This site lists that the ludwigia has a stem structure, and all stems take most of their nutrients from the water column, not their roots. 

A lot of questions similar to yours have been asked, but each case is unique, so it doesn't hurt to ask. I'd suggest perusing the low tech forum some to see if you can get any other opinions as well. 

Make sure you look a little into your lighting setup to make sure it is sufficient/not too powerful. If you have problems initially, the light can be a common cause. For a small low tech tank you don't need much, but you want to find the right range for success!

In any case, you will probably find, especially with low tech, that some plants will flourish and some will struggle. You can help that by figuring which plants are suitable for a low tech setup (there are a lot listed at the top of the low tech section)


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## navarro1950 (Jul 25, 2014)

It will help you out greatly if you first read the book called Ecology of the Planted Aquarium by Diana Walstad. In her book she explains the principals of the type of the you are talking about. Check it out on Amazon.com.


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## Kosmonaut (Sep 21, 2014)

Well, I got the book it's what got me interested in planted tanks... Maybe I need to reread it though.


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

Biological Filtration is said to be counter productive because the filter enters in direct competition with the plants as far as nutrients utilization goes. It's explained in the Walstad book. In my tanks I don't do bio filtration. Mechanical only. And under the norm flow rate. A rate good enough to circulate the water and distribute heat. Many plant prefer ammonium to nitrates according to Walstad. So don't let the bio filter convert ammonium into nitrates. Let the plants do the job.


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

Yes the book must be read a few time... Unfortunately it does not have the best layout and the table of content and index are really bad.


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## sushant (Mar 3, 2007)

Guck said:


> Biological Filtration is said to be counter productive because the filter enters in direct competition with the plants as far as nutrients utilization goes. It's explained in the Walstad book. In my tanks I don't do bio filtration. Mechanical only. And under the norm flow rate. A rate good enough to circulate the water and distribute heat. Many plant prefer ammonium to nitrates according to Walstad. So don't let the bio filter convert ammonium into nitrates. Let the plants do the job.


My understanding is that Even if no filter is attached biological filteration still exists as you cannot restrict microbes to grow. Would love to know that how did you manage to achieve this.


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

Bacterias will grow provided they have a support. Bacterias are scarce in openwater. That's why human made biofilters use all kind of devices such as wheels etc. Anything that offers lots of surface of contact. Bacterias use biofilms to attach and survive. They attach also to soil particulates and more than likely plants too. An equilibrium in biomass must be reached.


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## Kosmonaut (Sep 21, 2014)

So, what filtration are you using? Because after reading THE book I was planning to ditch the carbon and the ceramics (chemical and biological) and use only sponge and/or foam only to polish the water.

.


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## sushant (Mar 3, 2007)

Guck said:


> They attach also to soil particulates and more than likely plants too. An equilibrium in biomass must be reached.


thats why i said that a system without biofilteration in non-existent. if you use a mechanical filters then too the bacteria will find there way in its media.

coming to the Topic: since you are using a high grade planting substrate and planning to grow a foreground plant too i guess you should not totally stick to Diana Walsted method because though it is considered the bible of planted tanks still the main emphasis there is on low mentainence low light plants. high fertile substrate along with low light and no Co2 may result algae infested tank.


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

sushant said:


> thats why i said that a system without biofilteration in non-existent. if you use a mechanical filters then too the bacteria will find there way in its media.
> 
> coming to the Topic: since you are using a high grade planting substrate and planning to grow a foreground plant too i guess you should not totally stick to Diana Walsted method because though it is considered the bible of planted tanks still the main emphasis there is on low mentainence low light plants. high fertile substrate along with low light and no Co2 may result algae infested tank.


Sorry if I mislead you. Obviously part of the substance performing mech filtration will also do bio filtration to some extent but not as much as when using a specifically designed biofilter media. In my Eheim filters I only use one coarse foam (while is possible to stick in like 4 of those) and one thin floss if I find water too filthy. I don't use their biomedia. And no charcoal of course. Filter is cleaned when flow gets really low.


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## Mariostg (Sep 6, 2014)

Kosmonaut said:


> So, what filtration are you using? Because after reading THE book I was planning to ditch the carbon and the ceramics (chemical and biological) and use only sponge and/or foam only to polish the water.
> 
> .


I would use charcoal if I wanted to remove medication. You can search on this.


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## Kosmonaut (Sep 21, 2014)

I agree that I wont be using the Walstad method 100%, but I am not dogmatic, my concern when switching form dirt to something else was how to feed my plants, so I used an "activated" substrate with slow release root tabs. I just finished planting my tank, I am happy about it and seems like the substrate is actually very clean. Will be posting pics later if anyone is interested. Now my concern is wether I need to dose the water column itself... seems like you never have all the answers 

Back to my filter, I will be using the two grades of sponge that came with the filter, hopefully that will do to keep water from looking like black tea. In any case in the end I didn't use wood, only stones and a cup of leonardite below my commercial substrate.

Thanks a lot for your comments, they are really appreciated


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