# Feet Nibbling "Doctor Fish" / Fish Pedicures



## xenxes (Dec 22, 2011)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_fish

Garra rufa and Cyprinion macrostomum. They live and breed in the outdoor pools of some Turkish spas, where they feed on the skin of patients with psoriasis. The fish are like combfishes in that they only consume the affected and dead areas of the skin, leaving the healthy skin to grow, with the outdoor location of the treatment bringing beneficial effects. The spas are not meant as a curative treatment option, only as a temporary alleviation of symptoms, and patients usually revisit the spas every few months.


























I've seen these places in parts of Europe and Asia. But the practice is banned in several of the United States and Canadian provinces as cosmetology regulators believe the practice is unsanitary, with the Wall Street Journal claiming that "cosmetology regulations generally mandate that tools need to be discarded or sanitized after each use. But epidermis-eating fish are too expensive to throw away". The procedure is legal in Quebec, with a few clinics in Montreal.

Thoughts? Lols? Fish cruelty, call PETA? Anyone tempted to step into their otocinclus/dwarf cory tank?


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## Zefrik (Oct 23, 2011)

Poor fish having to suck on random peoples feet, and not having a decent tank.


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## xenxes (Dec 22, 2011)

Haha that was my first thought as well. 

Well, this article -- "Spas also defend that since the fish are kept in UV-lit filtered tanks, diseases don’t stand a chance!" /shrug.

They better have carbon filters for all that nail polish.


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## lipadj46 (Apr 6, 2011)

every time I see those pics I throw up a bit in my mouth, dead foot skin and fish crap...


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## illiath (Mar 30, 2012)

I would point out that the only way they can get the fish to do this is to not feed them properly.

So, you are basically paying someone to stick your feet in a tank with malnourished and badly treated fish.

No thanks.


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## aweeby (Oct 1, 2011)

They have these tanks all over the tourist quarters in Cambodia. In the night markets, there are tiled pools with small bars where patrons can sit, get their feet "cleaned" and have a drink. It's a relatively cheap way to make a quick buck off of an naive tourist. The water is often slightly discoloured, most have no filter... but yet, the fish look pretty healthy. And sticking your feet in is a sensation like nothing else. I mean, who can say that they've done that? Yeah, it's bad, but nobody's going to stop it any time soon. As long as these kinds of things remain controversial (and thus rare) in the US, people are going to flock to such bars when they go abroad.


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## unissuh (Jun 5, 2006)

I don't like this practice as I think it *is* quite unsanitary, UV or not - how many of these spas calculate flow rate of the UV sterilizer and capability etc anyway?



illiath said:


> I would point out that the only way they can get the fish to do this is to not feed them properly.


Not sure I agree with this though - a hungry fish is a healthy fish. Feeding fish until they stop eating is overfeeding.


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## @[email protected] (Oct 24, 2007)

its no more unsanitary than a shower at a gym lockerroom or college dorm, and those are quite legal. besides your skin is a very good barrier against any serious infections. additionally, the fish EAT damaged tissue, which breeds dangerous microbes, therefor you leave with less harmful microbes than you came in with. the fish poop poses very little danger unless ingested (and even then, the odds of parasites are very low). understand that fecal matter is basically ubiquitous, there are legal limits for fecal coliform (bacteria that are shed with feces) in drink water. meaning its legal for a certain amount of sh*t to be in your water, because its NOT DANGEROUS.

its the same thing with many marine gobys that clean the mouths of larger fish, picking away uneaten food and damaged tissue: its mutualism. historically, animals humans have use for tend not to go extinct.


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## xenxes (Dec 22, 2011)

It was also a big fad in London a year ago, not sure now. Though never done it myself, I'm way too ticklish.



@[email protected] said:


> historically, animals humans have use for tend not to go extinct.


+1 

Guess it only becomes controversial when we anthropomorphize fish. I guess these fish lead much better lives than livestock on the slaughter-belt. I can think of many humans who enjoy nibbling on feet.


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## thechibi (Jan 20, 2012)

Hmm. Do those doctors have their MDs from a reputable medical school?  

They look cute. As long as they're treated well...

And I'm told they can help with some skin troubles.


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## xenxes (Dec 22, 2011)

No, sadly they all went to schools in the Caribbeans  low board pass rate.

They alleviate, I'm sure a foot soak or exfoliant would do the same, but interesting to see how fads catch on 

I should come up with something... acupuncture with insects? massages with bears?


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## sugarbyte (Apr 3, 2011)

I am from Montreal and I've had a fish pedicure once. It was a really interesting experience (especially since I'm pretty ticklish lol). I don't know enough about these types of fish to know if this is cruel or not. I guess one of my main concerns would be the people setting up and maintaining these tanks, and their overall knowledge and care for the fish. A lot of people who don't know (or care) enough tend to cut corners.


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## m8e (Oct 16, 2009)

illiath said:


> I would point out that the only way they can get the fish to do this is to not feed them properly.
> 
> So, you are basically paying someone to stick your feet in a tank with malnourished and badly treated fish.
> 
> No thanks.


For 99% of the fish that is still better than nature...


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## ItsDubC (Feb 5, 2008)

I saw this in the Amsterdam airport. The tanks were pristine and I thought it was cool, but I was more interested in finding out what kind of fish it was than getting a pedicure lol


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## wendyjo (Feb 20, 2009)

I could have done without seeing that first pic of those gross hairy feet! 

No way I would do this. I'm not sticking my feet in anything that hasn't been sanitized first - ESPECIALLY if the person before me had feet like in the above mentioned pic!


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## ShadowBeast (Jul 27, 2011)

It's funny I just read a comicstrip with one of the characters getting the fish treatment and now the doctor is suing her because one of the Koi died from biting her on her feet.


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## raven_wilde (Jul 12, 2006)

I did this during my first visit to Korea, and have since done a fair amount of research about this... 

In the setup I witnessed, the fish were in a big indoor pond that had seats all around the perimeter for multiple people. The water was clear and the fish all looked healthy. The bottom of the pond was covered in big rocks that provided a pretty naturalistic environment for the fish. I even noticed some schooling and perhaps mating behavior (dominant larger fish seemed to have staked out certain rocks as 'theirs' and were disinterested in feet nibbling). The fish all seemed completely at home like the pond was a perfect little world for them. After doing research online and seeing the single person tubs they employ in the West, I definitely think that the pond I saw was a much better setup for the fish and I didn't feel at all bad about their situation. This was of course, just one extremely well run setup at a pretty high-end jjimjibang, I'm sure there are countless less wonderful Doctor Fish setups throughout Korea and elsewhere. However, it did give me a pretty good sense that this practice can be carried out in a way that is pretty alright and even awesome for the fish.

As for person to person sanitation, well there was none, you basically walked up and stuck your feet in. But this was part of a jjimjibang, a big public bathhouse replete with communal bathing (gender divided), sauna, and showers... so by the time a customer gets to the room with the Doctor Fish and sticks their feet in the pool they've already walked barefoot (pretty much nobody wears flipflops in the bathing areas - I certainly didn't) over a number of surfaces that everyone else has as well. Would that gross out a lot of people in this country? Yeah, I'm sure it would, but its different in Korea and that kind of attitude is pretty rare.

As for species... I'm pretty sure that only Gara Rufa comes from Turkey, its also the species that allegedly secretes some kind of enzyme in its mouth that allegedly helps with skin conditions. The other species, commonly known as Chin Chin, comes from China and apparently only the younger fish will eat dead skin. Based on the behavior I observed at the jjimjibang in Korea I think that I encountered Chin Chin - the bigger fish didn't seem to care about our feet and preferred to stay in the territories they had staked out throughout the pond. While this seemed to not be such a big deal in the pond that I used - presumably the adults were breeding and making more younguns that would be happy to nibble on customers feet - I can see how it would be a problem to keep Chin Chin in a more 'Western' setup. Once the nibble happy juvies grow up, what does a spa do with the adults? If they are keeping them in those super sanitary glass boxes I have a hard time believing that the adults would be in the breeding mood. This could potentially lead to a lot of adult fish getting sent down the proverbial toilet. Not too fair for the fish in my opinion.

In any case, that is what I have experienced and that is what I know... would I be happy to see this become mainstream in the US? I think I would only if the welfare of the fish was taken into as much consideration as the perceived need for hyper sanitation.... I'm not saying that enforcing sanitation is wrong; I just think that people in this country are a little deluded if they think that there is a way to make something like this 100% sanitary. Its like they forget that they are letting another living creature eat their flesh. However you slice it, its a 'dirty' process and if someone can't recognize that then they shouldn't do it, because expecting it to somehow be made 100% safe by technology or regulations is just ridiculous.

Anyway, these are just my thoughts. I'm not a lawmaker or even necessarily a Doctor Fish proponent... I actually have very little confidence that this 'treatment' actually does anything.

But did I like it? Yeah it was cool... I liked watching the behavior of the fish... but personally I could not keep my feet in the pond for very long. My feet are SUPER TICKLISH and it felt like a million little cat tongues licking my feet!


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