# To lid or not to lid?



## AguaScape (Oct 28, 2018)

I would go with a lid. Shrimp are capable of climbing out of a tank.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

AguaScape said:


> I would go with a lid. Shrimp are capable of climbing out of a tank.


Yeah, and I couldn't imagine that dealing with evaporation on a small tank would be fun.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Now this poses a second issue...how to design and add a lid. It's rimless and nobody makes aftermarket lids for them. Plus there needs to be a gap on the sides in order for my chosen light to grip the tank.

Does anybody have suggestions?


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## PlantedRich (Jul 21, 2010)

Appearance is always a problem but when needing a lid to stop jumpers, and all my fish do jump at times, I have used the plastic mesh like sold for weaving. It is cheap and easy to cut and fit and then I bend small hooks of wire to suspend it over the tank. I like to let air pass to let the tank cool but if one wanted to stop evaporation and flow, you could lay on a thin sheet of plastic like a sheet protector. Saran Wrap, even?


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## wardgillette (Aug 9, 2007)

These can be used to create a fairly simple and inexpensive top.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07CKDC513/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s02?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## redneck joe (Mar 13, 2019)

Hardware store lowes etc. Plexiglass and some plastic cement to glue some strips to the underside, and inner portion of the tank. Let cure a few days. Drill some small feeding holes which will allow bad gasses to escape.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

I"m assuming it's a rimless tank. The whole idea is to make the tank and equipment as invisible as possible so to me putting a lid on kinda defeats that purpose. I've kept shrimp in various open-top tanks from ADA, Mr Aqua etc for years and I've never once found a shrimp on the floor. In fact I bred shrimp for years in open-top tanks when there were hundreds in the tank. You just need to leave around a 1" space from the surface of the water to the top of the tank.


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## AcidGambit (Aug 30, 2018)

I've had a nerite snail sneak out twice, but otherwise, haven't had issues with leaving my rimless tank without a lid. I keep the water line about an inch below the top. Be careful if you're going to be injecting CO2. The same lid that might prevent evaporation could also prevent proper oxygenation and CO2 outgassing.


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## evil8 (Aug 7, 2018)

I do have a top on my 10 gallon betta tank. I do not have a tops on my 29 gallon or 45 gallon tanks. All of these tanks are cheaper standard framed aquariums. I have to top off my uncovered tanks with approximately 2 gallons of water each, each week, from evaporation. I have 4 amano shrimp in the 29 gallon and have never experienced them trying to climb out.


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## JJBTEXAS (Jul 8, 2013)

I run lids on my sub 10 gallon tanks and would in your case. I use Lexan from the hardware store. Lexan doesn't absorb moisture and bend like cheaper plexiglass does.


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## redneck joe (Mar 13, 2019)

Plexi does not absorb water and lexan will bend almost the same thickness is the determining factor. This size tank with no weight to support the differences are not measurable. 

Lexan however is easier to work with imo. Less prone to cracking when cutting.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Wow, thanks for all the great feedback everyone!

To those who are running topless, are you adding water daily? A big concern with evaporation is keeping the parameters consistent enough for the shrimp and to avoid algae issues.

If I added a lid, it would likely need to be not as wide as the tank to give a small space to feed power cables, hoses, probes, etc.

Here’s a photo of the tank itself. As you can see, it has a built in section for filtration where most of the in-tank equipment can be hidden, but there’s also a small lip that’s slightly shorter than the panels of the tank. Any input on how to fit a lid that can still look pleasing?


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## redneck joe (Mar 13, 2019)

Budget dependent any good glass shop could do either glass or the plastic lid. Make a template out of cardboard, with feed holes and any notches etc for equipment.


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## JJBTEXAS (Jul 8, 2013)

I've seen a bunch of those at my LFS recently, they seem like really nice tanks. I would probably just make a rectangular cover that went side to side, front to the black divider wall, then either glue a small, second strip on the back to level it out, or use the clear rubber cabinet bumpers. Just keep in mind that the divider wall is slightly lower so it overflows into the tank if you're outflow gets backed up, so don't block it off too much. You can use a hole saw or forstner bit to drill feed holes. 



******* joe said:


> Plexi does not absorb water and lexan will bend almost the same thickness is the determining factor. This size tank with no weight to support the differences are not measurable.
> 
> Lexan however is easier to work with imo. Less prone to cracking when cutting.


https://www.plexiglas.com/export/si...roduct-Info-Plexiglas-Moisture-Absorbtion.pdf

If it's supported on all 4 sides, it's not going to bend enough to matter on a tank that short. Anecdotally, I originally used plexiglass and had to replace the lids with Lexan (same thickness). Fortunately I had only made 2 at the time.


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## doy_ill (Jan 16, 2019)

red sea makes a diy net cover that you can customize shape/size/ openings


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## Wobblebonk (Feb 13, 2018)

The little aqueon rimless cubes come with a piece of glass and something like these https://www.amazon.com/Pack-Rimless-Clips-3MM-5MM/dp/B072C3NJ46 as a lid... would be pretty easy to cut an appropriate thickness piece of lexan or whatnot to size (need to leave enough room for the clips to fit)


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## Fallon (Oct 17, 2018)

Evaporation was an issue for me to I made my own lid and bought some fittings which sit inside the rim so to speak which although not perfect doesn't damage the minimal look too much. It stays clean is easy too move, really happy with it.









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## Fallon (Oct 17, 2018)

Fallon said:


> Evaporation was an issue for me to I made my own lid and bought some fittings which sit inside the rim so to speak which although not perfect doesn't damage the minimal look too much. It stays clean is easy too move, really happy with it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


From the front.









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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Thanks for the ideas everyone! @Fallon, I really love the look of that. What clips did you use? How far over the tank do the rests for the lid go in?


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## Fallon (Oct 17, 2018)

varanidguy said:


> Thanks for the ideas everyone! @Fallon, I really love the look of that. What clips did you use? How far over the tank do the rests for the lid go in?


Look at this on eBay 
[Ebay Link Removed]

They sit probably about 3cm into the tank. Took a while to come from China but I'm happy with the product. The lid is again acrilic I think about 5mm. I preferred the look without the lid but with it it more practical for me.

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## Fallon (Oct 17, 2018)

Fallon said:


> Look at this on eBay
> [Ebay Link Removed]
> 
> They sit probably about 3cm into the tank. Took a while to come from China but I'm happy with the product. The lid is again acrilic I think about 5mm. I preferred the look without the lid but with it it more practical for me.
> ...


Didn't realise the link would be remove. As you gathered they are off eBay, a choice of different sizes.

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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

doy_ill said:


> red sea makes a diy net cover that you can customize shape/size/ openings


Do you know if they'll make lids that are solid in the middle instead of screen? I couldn't find much info on them aside from their advertising/directional page for those lids.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Putting aside cost, ADA does make glass covers. Not sure if they would have your size. You could check out aquaforest or another distributor.


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## Wobblebonk (Feb 13, 2018)

The difference between the red sea kit and a screen window kit is theres ready made "cutouts" / rectangular sections in the red sea kit but it's totally cheaper to get a screen frame kit and extra corners to make your own cutout sections from a hardware store or amazon and some clear mesh... but no those screens do NOT come in solid forms but you could potentially use a clear roll of something except good luck getting it to look super flat they're literally the same thing you would put on a window with a different mesh. Or you can buy red sea zigzag corner pieces and probably use them with the kits from the hardware store but most hardware store kits are aluminum or white finish because not too many people have black window frames.

the aqueon nonsense looks like this...


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## theDCpump (Jul 22, 2016)

We dove pretty deep into rimless and rimmed tanks over the last 5yrs. We lost a few nice fish and settled for a 1/2 way compromise on lids.

Our big observation: standard tank rim/ no glass top =deflector.  

We tried an open top tank that still looked pretty, but added some level of safety for jumpers (the ledge).
*rimless look awesome, but we lost too many fish from night activities or getting spooked. Morning carpet surprises did not bring good fish news.

Rimless look like a gorgeous chalice of flickering light and water, but they just have limits with jumpers and favorite fish.
Fish do what fish do.


The little edge that supports glass tops gives a large percent of wall-skimming fish a 2nd chance to deflect off the lip while they skim walls or whatever they do to wind up on our floors.
A glass lid is the next step.

Good luck on your journey.

Below is our 80 gallon compromise between seeing the light flicker on an open top tank, but saving the jumpers.
A hidden nano skimmer keeps the water free of surface oils.


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## Thelongsnail (Dec 2, 2015)

Regarding evaporation, I have a ~25g open top tank (80cm long x 40cm wide x 30cm tall) and despite the larger footprint and being in a window, only lose around 2g of water a week through evaporation.

I wanted a clear rim around the edge as I have wood and plants coming out the top, but due to various reasons, have not been able to make/buy one yet. In the 8 months that the tank has been set up, I've lost one amano shrimp and had to throw a nerite snail back in (it was fine, thankfully)

A rim/lid will give you peace of mind & open up stocking choices and as seen above, you can buy or DIY some fantastic options. From personal experience though, I've never lost a pygmy cory through jumping and the shrimp loss was very shortly after acclimation, so as long as the water line is an inch or more below the top, I wouldn't lose too much sleep so long as you stocked the current choices.


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Jan 7, 2019)

JJBTEXAS said:


> I run lids on my sub 10 gallon tanks and would in your case. I use Lexan from the hardware store. Lexan doesn't absorb moisture and bend like cheaper plexiglass does.


When exposed to high humidity, Lexan will leach out chemicals known to be endocrine disruptors

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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

I believe I found the perfect option! The UNS lid for their tanks. Measures 43x23 CM, it'll perfectly cover the main portion of the tank, but leave the back exposed. And there will be a gap on either side to run the co2 hose for the in-tank diffuser! With the light stand clamped onto the sides of the tank, it's just wider (at the most narrow point) than 43 CM, so their lid should be perfect!

Edit: It would be the lid for the 45U/45S. Same dimensions.

Edit number two: HAHA Nevermind! Shipping is more than the lid! $26!

T-T-T-Triple edit!: Buce's official eBay store will ship it for $14...going to order there. By the time I get clips from a third party and some glass/plastic cut, it'll be about the same cost, maybe a few $$$ less. It's worth it to buy premade knowing it'll be the proper dimensions and from a good vendor. Because of the rules, I can't link Buce's eBay store here, but it's called "buceplantofficial"

https://buceplant.com/products/uns-rimless-tank-glass-lids-clips?variant=46102586957


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

The UNS lid arrived today (super fast shipping)! I actually wound up ordering from Glass Aqua because the BucePlant eBay store wouldn’t process my payment...and I didn’t want to pay the overinflated shipping on their web site. Glass Aqua offered it with $14 shipping, same as Buce’s eBay.

The thing fits like it was made for the tank! I was worried something would be wonky since they’re different brands, but nope! 


















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## TheUnseenHand (May 14, 2017)

varanidguy said:


> Wow, thanks for all the great feedback everyone!
> 
> To those who are running topless, are you adding water daily?* A big concern with evaporation is keeping the parameters consistent enough for the shrimp and to avoid algae issues.*
> 
> ...


Do yourself a favor and get an Auto topoff. It's life-changing. There are a ton of options out there. I will always suggest getting an Apex to use as an ATO because of all the other functionality. But there are plenty of other options:

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/auto-top-off/auto-top-off-systems.html


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

TheUnseenHand said:


> Do yourself a favor and get an Auto topoff. It's life-changing. There are a ton of options out there. I will always suggest getting an Apex to use as an ATO because of all the other functionality. But there are plenty of other options:
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/auto-top-off/auto-top-off-systems.html




Hmmm, well for now my budget is getting maxed out, still gotta get it planted, BUT that’s not so expensive it’s out of the question for the future!

So does the pump just sit in a bucket of distilled or RO water and top off as needed with a sensor or is it a mechanical float?


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## TheUnseenHand (May 14, 2017)

varanidguy said:


> Hmmm, well for now my budget is getting maxed out, still gotta get it planted, BUT that’s not so expensive it’s out of the question for the future!
> 
> So does the pump just sit in a bucket of distilled or RO water and top off as needed with a sensor or is it a mechanical float?
> 
> ...


All ATOs basically have 3 parts:

Float Switch/Sensor - These can be mechanical float switches or light sensors. They tell the Brain where the water level is.

A Pump - This pump is used to move RO/DI water from a container to the tank or sump.

A Brain - The brain is where the switches/sensors and pump are plugged into. It takes the input signal from the switches/sensors and tells the pump to turn on or off depending on the status of the switches/sensors.

To answer your question about the pump, yes, it can just sit in the container. That said, there are also pumps that are made to stay dry like aqualifters and peristaltic pumps. If you check my build, you can see there are creative ways to hide the container of RO water. I use that peristaltic pump in the link on my freshwater tank, but have also used aqualifters for years on my saltwater tanks. I like having the pump outside the container as it makes servicing or replacing easier.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

TheUnseenHand said:


> All ATOs basically have 3 parts:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




That’s awesome. Might have to set something like that up for the 40 breeder. And maybe this tank as well.


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## Fallon (Oct 17, 2018)

What did you go for in the end?

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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Fallon said:


> What did you go for in the end?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk




I purchased the UNS lid for the 45U (45S lid is the same exact size) and it fits like a charm! Almost as if the lid was made for the tank. 


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## ced281 (Jul 6, 2012)

Seems like the OP's question/situation is answered, but I thought my responses might help others who have similar questions and are reading through this thread.



evil8 said:


> I do have a top on my 10 gallon betta tank. I do not have a tops on my 29 gallon or 45 gallon tanks. All of these tanks are cheaper standard framed aquariums. I have to top off my uncovered tanks with approximately 2 gallons of water each, each week, from evaporation. I have 4 amano shrimp in the 29 gallon and have never experienced them trying to climb out.


I've had amano shrimp climb out with a 1.5" gap of water level. They can easily grip onto the corners of tanks or climb up lily pipes if they are desperate. (This has primarily happened when they feel predated by large fish or the tank parameters are off e.g. elevated CO2, large pH fluctuations, etc.)



******* joe said:


> Plexi does not absorb water and lexan will bend almost the same thickness is the determining factor. This size tank with no weight to support the differences are not measurable.
> 
> Lexan however is easier to work with imo. Less prone to cracking when cutting.


I would strongly recommend against Lexan (and also acrylic). There are much better options out there IMO that just require a little bit more work. You can get glass cut at your Lowes/Home Depot equivalent and sand down the edges with sand paper (or even better, a Dremel). You can buy a lot of aftermarket aquarium lid clips for rimless tanks on Amazon, Ebay, etc. I personally like the ADA hooks, even though they are much more pricey than the acrylic/plastic ones you can get elsewhere, because they are much lower profile.



Fallon said:


> Evaporation was an issue for me to I made my own lid and bought some fittings which sit inside the rim so to speak which although not perfect doesn't damage the minimal look too much. It stays clean is easy too move, really happy with it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Tiger15 (Jan 7, 2018)

If the lid can reduce evaporation, it can also reduce off gassing of CO2 and provide better CO2 distribution. The airspace below the lid, though not 100% air tight, captures some escaped CO2 and redistributes it evenly over the water surface for re-absorption. I have no data to prove it, as I always have tank top, but you can make CO2 measurement comparison pre and post topping to verify. My deduction came from observing no more calcium deposit on the rims and glass lid once CO2 injection was introduced.


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## FischAutoTechGarten (Jul 11, 2003)

Tiger15 said:


> My deduction came from observing no more calcium deposit on the rims and glass lid once CO2 injection was introduced.


That's a nice benefit in of itself.


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## Ddrizzle (Jan 30, 2019)

I've had no lids forever and fill almost to the top. The only things that get out are an amano every couple of months, and some guppies when my first tank was in terrible shape.

As long as your tank isn't overstocked and ferts are correct, you won't get jumpers very often. In fact, I've had no shrimps jump for a few months as I've dialed in my ferts to near perfect.

Lids have no real effect on the co2. I can make a much higher co2 difference by putting the outflow half in and out of the water. This can make a ph difference of about 0.2 due to the co2 escaping from the rough water.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Discusluv said:


> Shrimp, snails? I wouldn't know anything about them- never kept them.
> 
> But, fish? ~If they have a swim bladder- ( which 99% of freshwater fish we put in our aquariums do)- all are capable of ending up on your floor. Fish jump for many reasons: natural breeding behaviors, aggression between con-specifics, startled by shadows across and above tank, declining water quality, Co2 issues, parasites- to name a few.
> 
> ...




My main display tank has a lid, with about a 2” gap in the back for plumbing and whatnot....my SAE still wound up on the floor [emoji24]


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

There's a couple of open-top lakes near me. I don't usually see fish flopping around on the shore. >


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## Fallon (Oct 17, 2018)

varanidguy said:


> My main display tank has a lid, with about a 2” gap in the back for plumbing and whatnot....my SAE still wound up on the floor [emoji24]
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I had probably less and my SAE some how ended up about 4ft away from the tank under the sofa. Found it a month after it went AWOL lol

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## Discusluv (Dec 24, 2017)

There are plastic strips that you can add to back glass and cut around plumbing so that there are no gaps- that is what I have. My Oto's stay in my aquarium. 

https://www.petswarehouse.com/perfe...-O20KQCa8hqkmkrgqnwVodH4Y3YrZATxoCw2YQAvD_BwE


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## Leeatl (Aug 8, 2015)

I have Platys who do jump so I use DIY sliding glass lids . For the back gaps I use plastic canvas cut to fit . Have never had a fish jump out . I use canopies so I don't care about the rim being seen cause it isn't anyway...lol


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 4, 2008)

I've cleaned up this thread *once*. I only intend to do this one time before closing the thread.

Please stay on topic everyone, and be nice to each other.


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## DaveKS (Apr 2, 2019)

varanidguy said:


> My main display tank has a lid, with about a 2” gap in the back for plumbing and whatnot....my SAE still wound up on the floor [emoji24]
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cheap gutter guard plastic from hardware store. Pretty easy to cut out and still leave need ventilation. 

https://www.lowes.com/pd/amerimax-s...MI0cazybew4gIVAb7ACh03RQI7EAQYAiABEgI7w_D_BwE


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## tinkerpuppet (Feb 13, 2010)

Leeatl said:


> I have Platys who do jump so I use DIY sliding glass lids . For the back gaps I use plastic canvas cut to fit


Any chance you have a picture of the plastic canvas you use for the back gaps? I'm going to visit the glass place tomorrow to have some glass cut to make a DIY sliding lid, and was thinking of getting the back piece with a cut out for my equipment. But I don't love how permanent that is, if I ever want to switch up the filter or add an airstone in the opposite corner or whatever. But I want as much of the back covered as possible. I have some plastic canvas, interested to hear how you attach it! Thanks!


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

There are two main areas of interest in planted aquaria. One is farming (growing healthy plants usually a wide variety) and the other is aquascaping (making things aesthetically pleasing as possible.). Most people fall somewhere in-between these two. In 1985 I think, Takashi Amano released the first of his Nature Aquarium World Books showing incredible breathtaking beauty that has probably never been seen by before in freshwater aquaria. 

These books brought many people into the hobby in their quest to have such an aquarium and ADA took off. The backbone of their minimal equipment look was a rimless tank with no top. The idea was not have anything take away from the living art that was created inside the glass box. With the success of the ADA products many copycats came into the market also selling minimalist tanks, lily pipes, etc. Lights were usually hung over the tanks with hardscape many times protruding above the surface. 

It stands to reason if flying fish were a problem it would become known very quickly in the age of the Internet and open-top tank sales would stall. You would also see thread after thread here with people upset over losing their fish. That simply has not happened as more and more manufacturers produce tanks, lights and other accessories for open-top aquariums.


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## Discusluv (Dec 24, 2017)

Would you see "thread after thread"of people admitting they were losing fish over time because they have an open top? 
Why would they? If they have made the choice to have the "Amano aesthetic"- any loss from this decision is irrelevant. 

The most accurate way to determine what others lose is to do an anonymous poll. 

I anticipate that more fish are lost than people talk about either because they have made the decision and the loss is "par for the course" or they think their decision is nobody's business.


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## Quint (Mar 24, 2019)

Depends on what fish ya have and mix that with a bit of "luck of the draw". When I worked at my parents LFS we had lids on all our freshwater tanks (some better then others). Out of the probably 40+ tanks there were always certain fish that would find a hole just barely big enough to fit out of. There were other types that may get out once a year or several months. 

The worst were the eels, the swamp eel think it was (black ugly slow guys). The fire and peacock types were also bad about it sometimes. The swamp eels could make it a ways and as long as you got to them before they dried out they would usually make it.

Archers, reedfish, various catfish, freshwater puffers, some cichlids..... medium offenders. 

Pretty much all schooling fish, platies, mollies, things of that nature only occasionally. 

It wasnt like we were walking on fish every morning. It was occasional but did happen. Also not like most of us would have a total of 70+ tanks salt/fresh/brackish so the numbers for a person with 1 or 2 tanks is going to be far lower. I would assume it would be more so with a rimless no top tank but never had one. Maybe one of these days. 

I would really like to have a nice rimless tank setup however with dogs (hair), other people cleaning with god knows what in the house, two youngsters 1 of which would take full advantage of a open tank, the light being directly over the tank, and lastly where my tanks are setup there are wood cabinets over the top of them.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

Discusluv said:


> Would you see "thread after thread"of people admitting they were losing fish over time because they have an open top?
> Why would they? If they have made the choice to have the "Amano aesthetic"- any loss from this decision is irrelevant.
> 
> The most accurate way to determine what others lose is to do an anonymous poll.
> ...


Well if that's the case. Let's not do co2, use poor maintenance or put certain chemicals in the water. I can assure you that those things kill more fish then an open-top tank by far. I've had probably seven open top tanks in the last 10 years and can recall losing one fish. Most people here don't keep Discus, the fish are usually smaller in size, but people don't care about them? You really make it seem like they don't.

When a bad co2 regulator kills fish, or a certain chemical or dosing, etc. people share it here, they would be sharing it too if their fish were jumping out. You can't do a poll here. There wouldn't be enough response for the results to mean anything and it would be skewed by the % of people having open top vs those that don't. You'd have to weight it 50/50 which they're definitely wouldn't be enough sample to do. 

So we are left with anecdotal more qualitative information of hobbyists. Results will vary based on how low they kept the water line below the rim. 1" is usually enough.


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## KayakJimW (Aug 12, 2016)

So many variables... Fish seem far less likely to jump in a house with a few calm adults vs say a house with rambunctious dogs or kids running around to spook them. I've had to teach my kids to approach the tank slowly because you could see fish (cardinals, rasboras, even shrimp) dart off in every direction when they don't. Plus I think with most "Amano style" tanks there's usually just a school or two of a dozen+ small fish and the occasional missing one goes unnoticed until the tiny fish mummy turns up. If I have 18 rasboras and one day there's 17 I usually think to myself, I guess one died and got eaten by the tank mates and move on. The missing fish could have jumped and been found by the vacuum or a pet before the aquarist. If the goal is to have a rimless minimalist tank then it's an assumed risk and likelihood of jumping would depend on the species of fish, the environment around the tank, and other variables. To each their own, YMMV, and all that stuff. I think of lids like guard rails on a highway, they may not always stop every car from flipping over it, but are likely to keep more cars out of the ditch. 

To the OP, I think you found a nice looking lid! Super clean, looks great


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

This entire conversation started off to address the OPs question whether he should go with a lid or not. He choose to use a lid. His tank in his own word was a nano build 10 G. Somehow we got to Discus


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## Leeatl (Aug 8, 2015)

tinkerpuppet said:


> Any chance you have a picture of the plastic canvas you use for the back gaps? I'm going to visit the glass place tomorrow to have some glass cut to make a DIY sliding lid, and was thinking of getting the back piece with a cut out for my equipment. But I don't love how permanent that is, if I ever want to switch up the filter or add an airstone in the opposite corner or whatever. But I want as much of the back covered as possible. I have some plastic canvas, interested to hear how you attach it! Thanks!


I don't attach it . It just lays on the glass top and the edge of the tank . Here is a pic......


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Asteroid said:


> This entire conversation started off to address the OPs question whether he should go with a lid or not. He choose to use a lid. His tank in his own word was a nano build 10 G. Somehow we got to Discus




By all means don’t stop on my account! Anything that can be learned is valuable. I mean, we are all in this hobby together. [emoji2]


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## Discusluv (Dec 24, 2017)

Asteroid said:


> Well if that's the case. Let's not do co2, use poor maintenance or put certain chemicals in the water. I can assure you that those things kill more fish then an open-top tank by far. I've had probably seven open top tanks in the last 10 years and can recall losing one fish. Most people here don't keep Discus, the fish are usually smaller in size, but people don't care about them? You really make it seem like they don't.
> 
> When a bad co2 regulator kills fish, or a certain chemical or dosing, etc. people share it here, they would be sharing it too if their fish were jumping out. You can't do a poll here. There wouldn't be enough response for the results to mean anything and it would be skewed by the % of people having open top vs those that don't. You'd have to weight it 50/50 which they're definitely wouldn't be enough sample to do.
> 
> So we are left with anecdotal more qualitative information of hobbyists. Results will vary based on how low they kept the water line below the rim. 1" is usually enough.


I just realized something. I can push "ignore" :surprise:and never have to read your posts again. Too-da-loo:wink2:. You will not be missed. :grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2:


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## Ddrizzle (Jan 30, 2019)

I love no lids.


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## somewhatshocked (Aug 8, 2011)

Pro-tip: Y'all need to stop instigating and then reporting threads to try to get users responding to you into trouble. 

If you can't handle behaving like adults, please hop on out the door, kids. Not cleaning this thread up again.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Suffice it to say there are many pros and cons to lids, and there’s a healthy debate about whether or not they’re even necessary.

I chose to use a lid primarily due to evaporation being that I live in a desert. Helping to prevent jumpers is a huge plus as well.


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

I've never used lids in decades of fish keeping, but I have always had a canopy, which helps keep them in. At times I have added some egg crate to the back side, as if you have known jumpers they will find a way.

With Rainbows, it really varies from type to type, but for instance M. Splendida's are very well known prolific jumpers. I added three Splendidas one time and all three jumped in a few days. I would never, ever keep Rainbows in an open top tank. 

Roseline sharks like most barbs are also known jumpers. I lost a small one not too long ago. Found him on the floor all dried up. So trust me, it happens.

The problem with lids and planted tanks is that they get dirty and block the light, and that's the main reason I never used them. Just seem like a pain to manage when feeding and trying to keep them clean.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Greggz said:


> I've never used lids in decades of fish keeping, but I have always had a canopy, which helps keep them in. At times I have added some egg crate to the back side, as if you have known jumpers they will find a way.
> 
> With Rainbows, it really varies from type to type, but for instance M. Splendida's are very well known prolific jumpers. I added three Splendidas one time and all three jumped in a few days. I would never, ever keep Rainbows in an open top tank.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the feedback! I know you’re the rainbow fanatic, they really are beautiful. I have been kind of tempted lately to get some dwarf rainbows. I saw a video of a species that has gorgeous finnage with spots and those were absolutely gorgeous.


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## Quint (Mar 24, 2019)

Greggz said:


> I've never used lids in decades of fish keeping, but I have always had a canopy, which helps keep them in. At times I have added some egg crate to the back side, as if you have known jumpers they will find a way.
> 
> With Rainbows, it really varies from type to type, but for instance M. Splendida's are very well known prolific jumpers. I added three Splendidas one time and all three jumped in a few days. I would never, ever keep Rainbows in an open top tank.
> 
> ...



Without a lid does your light get the same build up or is it high enough (how high is enough) to prevent getting the build up on it? Just curious. Cleaning the lid is annoying wish I could get by without it unfortunately cant due to other reasons I mentioned previously.


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## aydemir (Sep 20, 2012)

Not sure if it was mentioned but in a shallow tank (less than say 12" height, ballpark...) pretty much every fish becomes a jumper since you will have 'low level fish' still not too far from the top of the tank simply because of how shallow it is. I've lost 7 fish and at least 20 shrimps in the last 6 months, and I have a lid...I have an ADA tank with the ADA lid so there is quite a bit of a gap however. Obviously a tighter lid would lead to fewer losses. So for the future all my shallow tanks will have tight lids, even though I really love that shallow rimless look...


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## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

Quint said:


> Without a lid does your light get the same build up or is it high enough (how high is enough) to prevent getting the build up on it? Just curious. Cleaning the lid is annoying wish I could get by without it unfortunately cant due to other reasons I mentioned previously.


The lights are about 12" from the water surface. 

No problems with build up, just wipe down the reflectors every so often.


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## Asteroid (Jul 26, 2018)

On reflection. I think the reason this thread got so "passionate" is because the participants are coming at it from a different perspective. If you want the aesthetics of a rimless/lidless tank your probably doing an aquascape where the overall layout is the most important thing and the fish are a secondary attraction. If you doing a "fish tank with plants in it" then your fish are the main attraction. More likely you have larger fish or more of them that would increase the likelihood of an incident. 

I think the biggest fish I've keep in a rimless tank would be a full grown Congo tetra, Bolivian ram and never had a problem with them as long as the 1"+ rule was applied. I also wasn't heavily stocked.


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## varanidguy (Sep 8, 2017)

Asteroid said:


> On reflection. I think the reason this thread got so "passionate" is because the participants are coming at it from a different perspective. If you want the aesthetics of a rimless/lidless tank your probably doing an aquascape where the overall layout is the most important thing and the fish are a secondary attraction. If you doing a "fish tank with plants in it" then your fish are the main attraction. More likely you have larger fish or more of them that would increase the likelihood of an incident.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the biggest fish I've keep in a rimless tank would be a full grown Congo tetra, Bolivian ram and never had a problem with them as long as the 1"+ rule was applied. I also wasn't heavily stocked.




Absolutely. I put more care overall into my plants than my fish, but I do enjoy having a high stocking of fish and lots of activity. It’s nice because I don’t need to dose as much KNO3 


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