# Waterbox 3620 rimless build



## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

This project's been a long time in the making and will likely be a while longer before there's any water in it. I'll be DIY'ing the light fixture, stand and autodoser. Main equipment as follows:

Waterbox Clear 3620
3 x 24w T5HO
Eheim 2217
Eheim 2215
Matheson 2-stage reg + 2 Fabco NV-55s + Clippard mouse/manifold
2 x Griggs reactors

I've been working on the lights and stand on and off for the past couple months. Both are based off of a similar design to what I built for a 60p about a year ago: https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/...stand-different-take-design-construction.html

Being my second attempt on both of these, I'm pretty happy w/ how smoothly things have gone so far. Sorry for not being more consistent on taking pics during the build process, but here's everything so far:










































































And the stand so far:


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

Nice work on the alu fixture! Curious to see where this one goes!


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

The light is now pretty much finished. My plan is to have the cords run behind the tank so I mounted them towards the back of the fixture. Unfortunately their weight now tips the fixture up in the front quite a bit. Hopefully a few lbs of lead shot in the front of the housing will do the trick. Pics:


































As you can see I also added one of those cheap LED strips that you can find on eBay for just a few bucks. I'm hoping it'll make a decent moonlight. If it ends up too bright, I'll black out a few of the LEDs. 

I also finished puttying up the stand and finished the back panels. The left side is hinged so I can get behind the stand--the plan is to put this against a corner wall.


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## andrewss (Oct 17, 2012)

housing is lookin like its really coming together


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

A little more progress. Tank is in the house and frosted back done. I'm extremely happy w/ WaterBox's build quality:


























Here's the tank / location it'll be replacing:










Stand's almost finished and now in the house as well. Just need to install the front doors and move the old tank out of the way.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

And a bit more progress:


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## 808style (Sep 28, 2012)

Sick fabrication skills! Very impressive!


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Thanks!!! As it took years to convince the wife to allow another tank in the house, I'd been planning things out in the meantime, including how best to build as much as possible and thus keep the build costs minimal while also as attractive as I could. The one thing I didn't work out too well in my head before I actually got the go ahead: this thing just looks WAAAAAY too big for that little corner of our living room!


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

My auto dosing system is pretty much done. I'll be running 2 needle valves off my regulator, feeding in below the 2 solenoids. Solenoids will open on a timer after dark for a few minutes and fill the bubble counters. Co2 will then turn on in the a.m. and push the ferts into 2 RG reactors and into the tank:


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

what an interesting way to do autodosing! I would have never thought of feeding them straight into the reactor! doing it this way would prevent any back pressure from reaching the ferts. do the solenoid stand up to the co2 pressure? 

Yes, beautiful tank build! and very nice stand, I like the color


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

monkeyruler90 said:


> what an interesting way to do autodosing! I would have never thought of feeding them straight into the reactor! doing it this way would prevent any back pressure from reaching the ferts. do the solenoid stand up to the co2 pressure?
> 
> Yes, beautiful tank build! and very nice stand, I like the color


Hey, thanks! The solenoids are NC and can handle 125 psi so more than enough! Path of least resistance should ensure gas only goes into the reactors anyway. My only worry, as I haven't yet tried this out in real life, is will the bubble counters fill easily and consistently enough, and will the level of the fert solution in the bottles have any effect on that? I know the gas in the lines will easily compress and make room for the liquid, I'm just not sure exactly how much they'll fill and/or overfill into the lines after the counters. There will still be check valves between the reactors and the counters, so hopefully their resistance will be enough to stop the flow at the right point too. I'm just going to use a cheap 15 min timer to start but if I have to I'll get a fancier digital that I can dial in by the min or second. 

My goal w/ this was 1) cheap 2) minimal moving parts that won't break down or get clogged, and most importantly 3) no lines coming up and over the rim of the tank. I really hope this will work, but if not, I'm only out about $40 in parts.


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

How do you like the build quality and clarity of your WB tank? My 4820 should be here in a few weeks. Really looking forward to more space for the fish to school...


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

mourip said:


> How do you like the build quality and clarity of your WB tank? My 4820 should be here in a few weeks. Really looking forward to more space for the fish to school...


Extremely happy. Glass is beautiful, silicone work's very clean. Only gripe: the mat's pretty thin and dense. Probably great for a professionally manufactured stand, but for my DIY one w/ all its irregularities, I'd prefer something a little thicker and spongier. I may end up just swapping it out.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Let there be light!


















I also added a little pull out shelf for holding things during maintenance:


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## mourip (Mar 15, 2020)

brohawk said:


> Let there be light!
> 
> I also added a little pull out shelf for holding things during maintenance:


Nice. I really like the magnetic tool holder. Headed toward the legendary online retailer now!

My 4820 will hopefully ship in a week or so.


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## ED3 (Sep 14, 2019)

I am extremely jealous of that storage system, smart planning.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Thanks guys! From experience, which I'm sure we all have about this, there is never enough floor space in a stand. My current one is a jumbled mess! I'm hoping to find a couple of these to mount to the other door to house ferts, food, etc.: https://images.app.goo.gl/tdtRynXsMpMYJ26X8


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Picked these up today too, $115 later. That's a bit over 70lbs--floor tiles are a foot wide for reference. I have another ~40lbs in my 29g that I think will make it more than enough for this scape.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Yay or nay? I still have to add some manzanita, more soil and some rubble.


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

I like the depth and the focus point being in the middle , it'll look great once the plants grow in the back as well 

Yeah, a few smaller pieces in front of the big ones will gradually soften the edges. I think it looks awesome. 

Is this stone going to impact ph?


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## Econde (Oct 13, 2015)

Man that's looking good. Just the maintenance part, like vacuuming substrate around the rocks makes me nervous. That's why I appreciate other peoples scapes, I can see the progress without having to worry about maintenance part.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Thanks guys. I wasn't sure about it last night but it's grown on me as of this a.m. I think with more soil in certain places my internal nit picking will quiet down.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

monkeyruler90 said:


> Is this stone going to impact ph?


 It shouldn't. It's all lava and I've used smaller pieces from the same source in my previous tank without issues. I love me some seiryu stone, but I wanted a big hardscape in this tank and I knew it'd wreak havoc on my water--we've got great soft water in Seattle.


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## jellopuddinpop (Dec 12, 2016)

Just a quick suggestion, but it may be worth it to make sure you can fit a hand between the hardscape and glass, all the way down to the substrate. You're going to need to be able to clean in there, and if there isn't room for your hand, it turns into a P.I.T.A.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

jellopuddinpop said:


> Just a quick suggestion, but it may be worth it to make sure you can fit a hand between the hardscape and glass, all the way down to the substrate. You're going to need to be able to clean in there, and if there isn't room for your hand, it turns into a P.I.T.A.


 I totally get what you mean but idea is to slope the substrate quite a bit, maybe just 4 inches or so below the top of the rocks (in the back/sides). Whether I can keep that slope long term, we'll see!


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## gjcarew (Dec 26, 2018)

Dang dude where did you find rocks like that in Seattle??


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

gjcarew said:


> Dang dude where did you find rocks like that in Seattle??


Bonsai NW! Unfortunately they're closing this week (but reopening under new owners at some point in a different location, but who knows when). AND I pretty much cleaned them out, though they still have a few stones laying around.


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## gjcarew (Dec 26, 2018)

I need to find a source. Not willing to pay $7/lb at Aquarium Zen


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

gjcarew said:


> I need to find a source. Not willing to pay $7/lb at Aquarium Zen


Will send you a pm...


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## YTP (Aug 26, 2019)

This is awesome! Can't wait to see the finished product. I'm actually waiting on a 3620 to get shipped any day now. They currently say 3-4 weeks and next week will be week 4 so fingers crossed!

Bump: This is awesome! Can't wait to see the finished product. I'm actually waiting on a 3620 to get shipped any day now. They currently say 3-4 weeks and next week will be week 4 so fingers crossed!


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## Tbakes (Mar 16, 2011)

I love the rocks - my only thought it that you might shift the "V" focal point to the right or left to meet the golden ratio. 

Is that Lava rock? It does look like some really cool mountains which should contrast nicely with your frosted background.

-Tony


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Tbakes said:


> I love the rocks - my only thought it that you might shift the "V" focal point to the right or left to meet the golden ratio.
> 
> Is that Lava rock? It does look like some really cool mountains which should contrast nicely with your frosted background.
> 
> -Tony


Agreed. Unfortunately they're so large there ain't much moving allowed. The left side is just 2 rocks: a very large vertical one against the glass, and a smaller 8" to 9" rock that fits perfectly next to/behind that. I have a lot more soil to add to the backside of the tank, and hopefully that'll skew (and widen) the V a little. Depending on how it looks at that point, I may be able to move the 2nd to middle right rock up and further left w/ more soil too. Anyway, point is, I'm aware and it's still my main qualm w/ the layout. But it won't happen until I start breaking down my 29g and recoup that soil. Hopefully next week.

Edit: yes, all lava rock.


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## underH20garden (Dec 19, 2017)

any updates on this build? 

I am playing around with adding a FW planted WB to my collections of reefs  

lots of nice DIY here!


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Old tank is mostly cleaned up and I moved the old aqua soil into this one. With the extra soil I was able to make some tweaks to the hardscape too. Still planning to add a bit of wood but that'll be minimal I think. Will then do a final top off with fluval stratum--the aqua soil is noticeably a lighter shade. Everything under the stand is now wired up too so won't be much longer before this thing sees water.


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## coseal (May 26, 2008)

love the DIY attitude towards this build! everything looks great! how long did you think about the light construction before you began? or did you just walk out into your workshop and start building? i will sometimes build something in my head 3 or 4 different ways and either commit or scrap the idea's all together. but i find it super decompressing to grab a coffee and head downstairs and just start building!

oh! how did the doser test out? and i noticed in some of your stand pics there is a light colored square top right?


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

coseal said:


> love the DIY attitude towards this build! everything looks great! how long did you think about the light construction before you began? or did you just walk out into your workshop and start building? i will sometimes build something in my head 3 or 4 different ways and either commit or scrap the idea's all together. but i find it super decompressing to grab a coffee and head downstairs and just start building!
> 
> oh! how did the doser test out? and i noticed in some of your stand pics there is a light colored square top right?


Thanks!! It was a bit of both preplanning and just messing around. I'd tooled around w/ a couple ideas over the years, eventually scrapped them b/c they weren't looking right. But I did learn a bit about how to work w/ aluminum in the process. Then after a lot more thinking I attempted a similar light for a 60p tank: https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/...stand-different-take-design-construction.html (I don't know why, but the pics are all stretched vertically so the light looks a little odd in that thread.) But it came out almost exactly as I wanted it so I then knew I could pull off a larger light for this tank. There was a lot less trial and error the 2nd time around too so this one got whipped up in just a few weekends.

The autodoser MAY work out but I'm still not sure. The solenoids work as I'd hoped and drain right into the bubble counters. But they don't fill at all if I pinch closed the end of the tubing somewhere after the bubble counters to simulate back pressure that would normally be coming from the reactors when everything's running. Also, the bubble counters don't fill up all the way as I figured they would. They just fill to the base of the outlet and flow out from there. That may not matter, but I may need much bigger bubble counters if that's the case as I can see that not being enough ferts at a time. I won't know for sure though until I have the tank full of water and both canister filters running. If it doesn't go well, I may have to come up w/ another idea. Will likely make a separate thread on that and get others advice if that's the case but time will tell.

Can't wait to get this thing filled up!


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Oh, and the little square is just an aluminum plaque w/ the Waterbox logo, same as what's etched in the glass. Came w/ the tank--they didn't include one w/ the 60p I had previously. Don't know if I'll keep it but it's on there for now.


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## Tbakes (Mar 16, 2011)

Love the revised rock layout - looks great Brohawk!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Got impatient. Will source some background plants and continue to plant over the coming days. Wood is a bit out of whack in the photo as some are trying to float up.


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## coseal (May 26, 2008)

man that wood sets it off! hell it looked great without the wood!


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

coseal said:


> man that wood sets it off! hell it looked great without the wood!


Lol, thanks!! Honestly the whole time I was adding the wood, my mind was saying, dude, you're ruining it. It was perfect already. But, after I'd added enough of it I started feeling like, no I THINK this was the right move. Glad to hear someone else's approval too. Honestly.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

A lot of the HC melted over the first couple weeks. What was left has adjusted though and is slowly spreading. Growth should be quicker but I've been struggling to get my CO2 up to 30ppm which just seems wrong. I've got 2 grigg reactors going on 2 eheims and the reactors are quite noisy and gurgling for the last 3 - 4 hours of the photo period. Bubble counts are at least 5 - 7 bps, in BOTH counters and I'm going through a 10lb every 2 weeks or so. Drop checker gets dark/medium green but I can't get it to lime, nor can I get the fish up to the surface.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Slowly filling in. I'm not sure about the dwarf sag for a background though. Just too overpowering imo. I was hoping the leaves would appear a bit finer and lay longer across the surface than they actually do. Maybe giant hair grass instead? I'm afraid it might be too much of the same shade of green than I want too, just like the dwarf sag. And runners. The sag is already annoying me enough. Hair grass would be even worse. Which brings me to stems. I swore off stems a while ago thinking they're too much work to maintain. But at least stems don't infiltrate your ground cover either...

Thoughts anyone? Rotala rotundafolia sunset? R. indica? I don't think I want anything deep red, but some variation from green to pink might look nice?


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## gjcarew (Dec 26, 2018)

brohawk said:


> Slowly filling in. I'm not sure about the dwarf sag for a background though. Just too overpowering imo. I was hoping the leaves would appear a bit finer and lay longer across the surface than they actually do. Maybe giant hair grass instead? I'm afraid it might be too much of the same shade of green than I want too, just like the dwarf sag. And runners. The sag is already annoying me enough. Hair grass would be even worse. Which brings me to stems. I swore off stems a while ago thinking they're too much work to maintain. But at least stems don't infiltrate your ground cover either...
> 
> Thoughts anyone? Rotala rotundafolia sunset? R. indica? I don't think I want anything deep red, but some variation from green to pink might look nice?


Lately I've really been liking Hygrophila siamensis '53B'. It's pretty bulletproof and grows slowly for a stem plant. Rotalas tend to be pretty weedy, especially the rotundifolia variants. Rotala macrandra green is a little slower growing and is greenish pink, I know you're in the Seattle area so I could give you some cuttings if you're interested. It's more manageable than some other varieties I've kept.

I don't really like the taller hairgrasses. They can send runners from the tips of their leaves, which I don't find attractive.

If you want a more delicate grassy look without having to deal with runners, what about cryptocoryne spiralis? For even thinner leaves you could go with Eriocaulon sp. 'Feather Duster'. Those rosette plants are very easy to manage. I think I've seen both of those at Aquarium Zen.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

gjcarew said:


> Lately I've really been liking Hygrophila siamensis '53B'. It's pretty bulletproof and grows slowly for a stem plant. Rotalas tend to be pretty weedy, especially the rotundifolia variants. Rotala macrandra green is a little slower growing and is greenish pink, I know you're in the Seattle area so I could give you some cuttings if you're interested. It's more manageable than some other varieties I've kept.
> 
> I don't really like the taller hairgrasses. They can send runners from the tips of their leaves, which I don't find attractive.
> 
> If you want a more delicate grassy look without having to deal with runners, what about cryptocoryne spiralis? For even thinner leaves you could go with Eriocaulon sp. 'Feather Duster'. Those rosette plants are very easy to manage. I think I've seen both of those at Aquarium Zen.


Thanks so much for the tips! Boy, now I'm torn. Your macranda offer is very nice, and I think it may be exactly what I was picturing for a stem option. But that Erio Feather Duster is pretty darn close to what I originally was thinking. Or maybe Erio Needle Leaf. But if you've got stems to spare, I think I'd like to try that first. I'm in upper Queen Anne, but happy to drive to where ever you are.


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## brohawk (May 19, 2008)

Continuing to fill in. I swapped the dwarf sag background for some rotala H'ra and so far I'm liking the change. I'm not chasing bright red coloring anyway, so I'm continuing to dose EI and the H'ra is staying various shades of yellow/orange/pink accordingly. I'd been struggling to get my CO2 to the correct levels ever since I set this up, but finally figured out a couple weeks ago I had a rather big leak in my setup. CO2 is now dialed in and the BBA is retreating. Next goal is to get my autodoser setup finally integrated. I had held off on this b/c it uses the same CO2 lines to function and I didn't want to add further potential leaks to the equation. Fingers crossed it'll actually work!


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## Phil Edwards (Jul 18, 2003)

That's stunning!


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