# Milwaukee Co2 MA957 Regulator?



## gmb225 (Mar 11, 2015)

I'm planning on buying a co2 setup in the near future. looking at aquariumplants.com's systems. is this milwaukee ma957 reg a good one or should i buy a tunze?


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## fishophile (Feb 6, 2012)

I've got the milwaukee. No problems so far and everything's working as it should.


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## AlanLe (Jan 10, 2013)

Invest in a custom dual stage co2 system and you will never have to worry about anything. 


-Alan


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## gmb225 (Mar 11, 2015)

AlanLe said:


> Invest in a custom dual stage co2 system and you will never have to worry about anything.
> 
> 
> -Alan



like what would you recommend?


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## PierreG (Nov 29, 2014)

I read to many bad story about the milwaukee ma957 

Custom dual stage co2 system.......are expensive.......minimum 175$ for the regulator + 100$ for the others parts + some profit .....300$ minimum ....after you need to add tubing, diffuser or reactor....etc...ouffff...it all depend on your budget!

I order last night a CO2art reg....2 stages.....will see!

http://www.co2art.co.uk/collections...l-stage-regulator-and-solenoid-magnetic-valve


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## reefcorgi (Mar 2, 2014)

if you on a budget, it is a okay regulator to use.
Dual stage is very reliable and have a good resell value.


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

PierreG said:


> I read to many bad story about the milwaukee ma957
> 
> Custom dual stage co2 system.......are expensive.......minimum 175$ for the regulator + 100$ for the others parts + some profit .....300$ minimum ....after you need to add tubing, diffuser or reactor....etc...ouffff...it all depend on your budget!
> 
> ...


The customs don't have to be expensive. I just sold one for $150. Most if not all of what's expensive is that way because the pretty ones sell better. Unfortunately, pretty costs more to make.


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## dcutl002 (Apr 8, 2014)

gmb225 said:


> like what would you recommend?


Search the for sale/trade on this forum and get a custom built 2 stage regulator. Milwaukee, Aquatec, and the like have a lot of sad stories on this forum. Maybe even ask AlanLe to build one for you. 

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=107312&highlight=


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## PierreG (Nov 29, 2014)

oldpunk78 said:


> The customs don't have to be expensive. I just sold one for $150. Most if not all of what's expensive is that way because the pretty ones sell better. Unfortunately, pretty costs more to make.


What are the components at 150$ ? 

Dual stage at 150$ ? 

Ideal Needle ? Clippard Mojuse Solenoid?

Yes custom can be less expensive....if you put cheap components. But, most custom builders want to put the best and the best is expensive. It's ok....but let's be honest....


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## FlyingHellFish (Nov 5, 2011)

PierreG said:


> I read to many bad story about the milwaukee ma957
> 
> Custom dual stage co2 system.......are expensive.......minimum 175$ for the regulator + 100$ for the others parts + some profit .....300$ minimum ....after you need to add tubing, diffuser or reactor....etc...ouffff...it all depend on your budget!


You can get near brand new Dual Stage, shiny regulator for 40 Canadian dollars. 

Well, maybe not anymore, but a week ago you could have.


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## PierreG (Nov 29, 2014)

FlyingHellFish said:


> You can get near brand new Dual Stage, shiny regulator for 40 Canadian dollars.
> 
> Well, maybe not anymore, but a week ago you could have.


Not anymore...lollll.....Where? Show it to me? 

Who will trust a 40$ dual stage anyway ! 

The cheaper I found is 149$


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## FlyingHellFish (Nov 5, 2011)

PierreG said:


> Not anymore...lollll.....Where? Show it to me?
> 
> Who will trust a 40$ dual stage anyway !
> 
> ...


It can happen. I got won this two weeks ago. 










I got AirGas's current model, it's the *SiR *dual stage regulator. It has a purity chamber which filters the inlet gas and let you know if your down stream is contaminated, which I have absolutely no use for. It looks kind of cool though. There is a _knurled metal ring and cap,_ when you unscrew them you get access to the interstage port. 








|








=======
I also got these Swagelok double pattern valves, two needles in one. Overkill, I know.


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## AlanLe (Jan 10, 2013)

FlyingHellFish said:


> It can happen. I got won this two weeks ago.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Dang free shipping from San Diego to Canada! Thats a good deal. You need to build an all stainless system. 


-Alan


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

PierreG said:


> What are the components at 150$ ?
> 
> Dual stage at 150$ ?
> 
> ...


The regulator was a victor vts 250 (2-stage) I used a smc vdw series solenoid and a fabco needle valve. All good stuff.


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## PierreG (Nov 29, 2014)

Ok....with a use regulator it's possible to find at 40$. But, it's all question of risk at that stage...if it's defective!

GMB225....send him a check for one ! Don't wait


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

PierreG said:


> Ok....with a use regulator it's possible to find at 40$. But, it's all question of risk at that stage...if it's defective!


The trick is not to buy withouta return policy. Even some of the one's that look like they are in great condition are duds. New ones are nice if you can find or afford them. The whole idea behind these things was never that you had to find a new 2-stage regulator to not have issues with your co2. The idea was was to have something far superior that of the milwaukee for the same price or just a little more. We kinda took things farther than we had too as far a nice regulators are concerned.


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## FlyingHellFish (Nov 5, 2011)

PierreG said:


> Ok....with a use regulator it's possible to find at 40$. But, it's all question of risk at that stage...if it's defective!


A risk I'm willing to take.


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## loach guy (Jun 2, 2014)

As long as your reactor is a decent design, and you are using a PH controller, there is NO NEED for a dual stage regulator. We are putting bubbles into water. It's not that technical. I use a Milwaukee and have had ZERO issues. I also bought a used Milwaukee PH controller. The seller couldn't find the power supply, so I contacted customer service. Even though they didn't even make my model anymore, they sent me one free of charge. The product does exactly what it's supposed to do at a good price, and good customer service. What more do you want?


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## FatherLandDescendant (Jul 24, 2014)

loach guy said:


> As long as your reactor is a decent design, and you are using a PH controller, there is NO NEED for a dual stage regulator. We are putting bubbles into water. It's not that technical. I use a Milwaukee and have had ZERO issues. I also bought a used Milwaukee PH controller. The seller couldn't find the power supply, so I contacted customer service. Even though they didn't even make my model anymore, they sent me one free of charge. The product does exactly what it's supposed to do at a good price, and good customer service. What more do you want?


Agreed. I bought my Milwaukee and controller new as a package deal, works just fine, though I do disagree with their setup instructions.

With a PH controller and using the needle valve to determine the output EOTD shouldn't ever be a problem.


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## gmb225 (Mar 11, 2015)

what do u guys think of this CarbonDoser Electronic Co2 Regulator (the BEST in the World) http://www.aquariumplants.com/CarbonDoser_Electronic_Co2_Regulator_p/co2.htm

they claim it ends the problem of dumps due to pressure changes? with it i really wouldn't need a ph controller.


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## loach guy (Jun 2, 2014)

gmb225 said:


> what do u guys think of this CarbonDoser Electronic Co2 Regulator (the BEST in the World) http://www.aquariumplants.com/CarbonDoser_Electronic_Co2_Regulator_p/co2.htm
> 
> they claim it ends the problem of dumps due to pressure changes? with it i really wouldn't need a ph controller.


I'll be writing a new post tonight on how CO2 systems work. There are plenty of people that grow plants without a PH controller, but here's the thing. They have no idea how much CO2 is actually in their water. Plants grow daily and consume more CO2 when they are at the top of your tank, than when you just trimed them. For me, I would rather have a piece of equipment that can adjust to that instead of trying to find that invisible line manually.


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## Perryboat (Jul 11, 2012)

loach guy said:


> I'll be writing a new post tonight on how CO2 systems work. There are plenty of people that grow plants without a PH controller, but here's the thing. They have no idea how much CO2 is actually in their water. Plants grow daily and consume more CO2 when they are at the top of your tank, than when you just trimed them. For me, I would rather have a piece of equipment that can adjust to that instead of trying to find that invisible line manually.


Great. Will look forward to reading that post. I am interested in getting a controller. I havn't used a ph controller before, just curious how this can prevent an EOTD. It will still turn on the solenoid regardless of the pressure in the co2 tank right?


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

I've read a few posts over the years about how people still gassed their fish using ph controllers. 

Anybody want to guess how it happens?


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## charlie 1 (Oct 22, 2006)

oldpunk78 said:


> I've read a few posts over the years about how people still gassed their fish using ph controllers.
> 
> Anybody want to guess how it happens?


PH probe drifts?


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

charlie 1 said:


> PH probe drifts?


Naw...

Every one of them I've read about has been a Milwaukee and the solenoid got stuck open. That means the ph controller no bad how much it wants to cut the gas, it can't. 

Since the needle valve is adjusted to rapidly increase the co2 saturation, it doesn't take long to gas your livestock. 

Wanna know why the solenoid got stuck? Because your water or Glycerin or whatever other fluid you have in your bubble counter has a chance to back up to the solenoid whenever it's closed. It does this because the bubble counter is mounted right onto the needle valve and there's no check valve between the two. A really poor design as far as I'm concerned. But it works anyway. 

There aren't many of these type of failures and considering how many Milwaukee regs are out there, it's probably not going to happen to you. It does happen though. And every once in a while, we hear about it here on the forums. 

I guess my point is that you don't want to depend on a magical piece of equipment to save you from a piece of equipment that's prone to failure. With the money spent on both, you could have just got one good piece of equipment that doesn't require maintenance and won't crap out after a couple of years. A ph controller should be used as tool to set your co2 levels. Not thought of as a way to save your livestock incase of a failure somewhere else.


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## Perryboat (Jul 11, 2012)

oldpunk78 said:


> Naw...
> 
> Every one of them I've read about has been a Milwaukee and the solenoid got stuck open. That means the ph controller no bad how much it wants to cut the gas, it can't.
> 
> ...


Amen.  

I think its good to have a ph controller but having a reliable regulator always comes first.


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## FlyingHellFish (Nov 5, 2011)

@oldpunk

Are you talking about the controller with the peanut foam in it?

-----------------------

The AirGas works, both stages are leak free. Now I gotta hunt down some swagelok tube-adapters, which ironically is harder than finding a regulator.


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

FlyingHellFish said:


> @oldpunk
> 
> Are you talking about the controller with the peanut foam in it?


No. I was referring to a ph controller. 

The packing peanut in the aquarium plants dot com super regulator is funny though. It's a neat idea but I wish they would have developed it a bit more.


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## AlanLe (Jan 10, 2013)

FlyingHellFish said:


> @oldpunk
> 
> Are you talking about the controller with the peanut foam in it?
> 
> ...



What's that hemorrhoid looking piece on the bottom of the reg? Lol! Anyways I sent you a pm about the swagelok fittings. 


-Alan


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## FlyingHellFish (Nov 5, 2011)

^ It's an AirGas's purity chamber, they sell a flow gauge (looks like a bubble counter) and it tells you if you got a leak or if the gas is no longer pure. It's removable but I kind of like how it looks.


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## FatherLandDescendant (Jul 24, 2014)

oldpunk78 said:


> Naw...
> 
> Every one of them I've read about has been a Milwaukee and the solenoid got stuck open. That means the ph controller no bad how much it wants to cut the gas, it can't.
> 
> ...


Agreed that it's a poor design, however liquid backing up into the solenoid isn't the only reason for it sticking open. I just had Milwaukee send me a replacement solenoid for my rig because of magnetic lock causing the plunger to stick open. Usually when this happens the solenoid has a weak action if you will, the click it makes should be strong, mine wasn't, took it apart several times to verify it was dry inside the plunger well. New solenoid and I've not had a problem since. 

Then there is the way their instructions say to start the regulator. Your suppose to open the needle valve all the way, open the tank, open the regulator until you get the bubble count you want, wait a couple of minutes and adjust the regulator to increase the bubble count. I spent 5 hours trying to regulate the bubble count following those instructions, AND got mineral oil in the solenoid. With the needle valve pretty much wide open yea you can gas fish pretty easily. Personally I close the needle valve, open the tank, bring the regulator up to working pressure, then open the needle valve and adjust the flow to my reactor just until I get a slight mist from the filter return.



oldpunk78 said:


> There aren't many of these type of failures and considering how many Milwaukee regs are out there, it's probably not going to happen to you. It does happen though. And every once in a while, we hear about it here on the forums.


You can have that even with the high end regs out there, no product has a 100% no fail rate, not 1.



oldpunk78 said:


> I guess my point is that you don't want to depend on a magical piece of equipment to save you from a piece of equipment that's prone to failure. With the money spent on both, you could have just got one good piece of equipment that doesn't require maintenance and won't crap out after a couple of years. A ph controller should be used as tool to set your co2 levels. Not thought of as a way to save your livestock incase of a failure somewhere else.


Agreed, one should always monitor the equipment they work with regardless of the quality, or how much or how little one puts into the equipment they have.

Personally I live on a VERY tight budget ATM, a couple of years while I get through school and can move into a better paying job sounds just like what I need. Not all of us can pop $250 or $300 for a high end reg with swaglock fittings and clippard solenoids. Say what you will there's no way you could put a dual stage reg with the bells and whistles you tout AND throw in a pH controller for what I have in my rig. 

For those of us just getting into the CO2 injection side of the hobby knowing what SPECIFICALLY to buy, where, and for how much is a bit overwhelming. There are a lot of little details one has to grasp to successfully assemble a working setup, and for those who have never done so trying to grasp those details (such as the different pipe fittings for one) while grasping the fundamental basics of what they are about to undertake just injecting CO2 into their tank is a huge chunk of knowledge for many people to swallow at once. 

Mass market setups like the Milwaukee are good entry level rigs to help people get started, once they figure out the application then they can, if they are so inclined, move on to the mechanical aspect. That is if they want to continue on with the high maintenance that a high tech tank is. 

I use my pH controller as that tool you mentioned, to set a CO2 level and keep it there, not as a fail safe for EOTD. For just under $200 I got my controller and regulator and for an entry level setup that is pretty much plug and play you can't beat that with a stick. Nobody on here can give me that kind of deal with a custom regulator, and at the end of that couple of years if I do go to a custom regulator I still have a controller.

As for the comment charlie 1 made regarding probe drift, I've been watching mine closely and a .2 variance on the probes calibration every few weeks isn't something I'm going to get my nickers in a twist about, no probe out there is going to maintain perfect accuracy.


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## loach guy (Jun 2, 2014)

I completely agree with some of the things that FLD said. Some things ehhh...Not as much. 

"Personally I close the needle valve, open the tank, bring the regulator up to working pressure, then open the needle valve and adjust the flow to my reactor just until I get a slight mist from the filter return." This is the proper way to adjust your CO2 system. You will be dialed in a minute or two.

I guess my question for those of you that have these dual stage regulators is this. Are you running CO2 24/7, or do you use solenoids on a timer?


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## charlie 1 (Oct 22, 2006)

FatherLandDescendant said:


> Agreed that it's a poor design, however As for the comment charlie 1 made regarding probe drift, I've been watching mine closely and a .2 variance on the probes calibration every few weeks isn't something I'm going to get my nickers in a twist about, no probe out there is going to maintain perfect accuracy.



Please note my comment was more of a uncertain question type answer to old punks question. it was never intended to be a comment of fact.
Regards


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## FatherLandDescendant (Jul 24, 2014)

charlie 1 said:


> Please note my comment was more of a uncertain question type answer to old punks question. it was never intended to be a comment of fact.
> Regards


Gotcha:wink:


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## gmb225 (Mar 11, 2015)

gmb225 said:


> what do u guys think of this CarbonDoser Electronic Co2 Regulator (the BEST in the World) http://www.aquariumplants.com/CarbonDoser_Electronic_Co2_Regulator_p/co2.htm
> 
> they claim it ends the problem of dumps due to pressure changes? with it i really wouldn't need a ph controller.



can anybody tellme what they think of this regulator?


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 4, 2008)

gmb225 said:


> can anybody tellme what they think of this regulator?


There were some threads from many years ago where someone took apart the black box attached to this regulator.

In it was a simple solenoid that controlled the gas flow. I think it is a bit expensive for what it actually is.


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

gmb225 said:


> can anybody tellme what they think of this regulator?


It's a great idea. It does have its limitations though. And like the guy above posted, you're paying a lot for a basically a beer regulator with a pot and a proportional solenoid.


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## AlanLe (Jan 10, 2013)

You mean this regulator? I see a clippard solenoid attached to a board and 2 styrofoam balls (probably acts as a check valve). It's a clever design but there are limitations. The regulator is a single stage, 15psi output, and the solenoid can get stuck open. 










-Alan


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## flight50 (Apr 17, 2012)

reefcorgi said:


> if you on a budget, it is a okay regulator to use.
> Dual stage is very reliable and have a good resell value.


When I started with pressurized CO2, I didn't know what I know now and I was on a budget. I went from diy to pressurized because I got tried of how much of a chore diy was. The Milwaukee isn't the best by any means but it will get you by. Here is how I see it. To get out of diy or for a starter system to feel your way around with pressurized go Milwaukee if your on a budget. If you can save up or build a better one, do that and by pass the Milwaukee if money or time is not a factor. The only thing I had to watch for on my Milwaukee when I was running it was the high pressure gauge. Once it drops to about 400-500 psi, yank the tank. Yes you swap the tank before its empty but it's not like it will happen in the course of a few weeks. It will dump sooner or later if your not keeping an eye on it. I gassed half my live stock due to my failure to watch it once. I switched over to the AP carbon doser after that. I still have the Milwaukee regulator though and I plan to put it back in service within the next month on my plant only grow out tank. No dumps to worry about in the worst case scenario. I might swap out the needle valve and the bubble counter that came with it though.



oldpunk78 said:


> The trick is not to buy withouta return policy. Even some of the one's that look like they are in great condition are duds. New ones are nice if you can find or afford them. The whole idea behind these things was never that you had to find a new 2-stage regulator to not have issues with your co2. The idea was was to have something far superior that of the milwaukee for the same price or just a little more. We kinda took things farther than we had too as far a nice regulators are concerned.


You can say that again. There are several steals on eBay from time to time if you know what your looking for. Use the list that is in the building a regulator thread in the stickies. I purchased a Victor vts253A, vts253B and an Air Products E12-N145D last fall and all where under $70-80 bucks with the shipping. I only looked for people that sold with returns. I actually did get one E12-145D that was bad once I got it and tested it out. The regulator was sold as "in working order" but it wasn't. He did try to correct it with other regulators he was selling but they weren't the same model so he just returned by funds without hassle. I ended up finding a brand new E12-N145D about a month later. Don't depend on the description from the seller to be accurate. A lot of the people don't know the difference between a two stage regulator and a two gauge regulator. They are not the same so know what your looking for and the gas that it ran previously can make a difference.



gmb225 said:


> what do u guys think of this CarbonDoser Electronic Co2 Regulator (the BEST in the World) http://www.aquariumplants.com/CarbonDoser_Electronic_Co2_Regulator_p/co2.htm
> 
> they claim it ends the problem of dumps due to pressure changes? with it i really wouldn't need a ph controller.


This statement is true. You will never experience an end of tank dump. Never. This is what I upgraded to back in 2008 when my Milwaukee dumped on me. At the time I did not regret my decision one bit. It is pricey for what it is though. As stated above, knowing what I know now, I can build my own for the same price or cheaper. I actually just got the last few items I needed to put together my 5 output setup similar to the GAPro5 but at 1/4 of their cost. I will post it in the link in my signature as part of my whole setup eventually.



oldpunk78 said:


> No. I was referring to a ph controller.
> 
> The packing peanut in the aquarium plants dot com super regulator is funny though. It's a neat idea but I wish they would have developed it a bit more.


I don't know how true that pic was. When I opened mine, there was no peanuts in mine. Perhaps that was the way they use to do it prior to me receiving mines or that could be how they do it now after I received mine. At any rate, mine does not have that and I have had 0 issues with in 7 years of usage.



oldpunk78 said:


> It's a great idea. It does have its limitations though. And like the guy above posted, you're paying a lot for a basically a beer regulator with a pot and a proportional solenoid.


For a single tank, I don't find any limitations to it. Although it is pricey for some, it is not a bad regulator at all. I loved mine when I bought it, and I still love it now. It have been flawless for me. Never missed a beat, never failed, never dumped even when the psi reads 0. Other than the price, there is nothing wrong with it.


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

flight50 said:


> For a single tank, I don't find any limitations to it. Although it is pricey for some, it is not a bad regulator at all. I loved mine when I bought it, and I still love it now. It have been flawless for me. Never missed a beat, never failed, never dumped even when the psi reads 0. Other than the price, there is nothing wrong with it.


Can you use an atomizer?


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## AlanLe (Jan 10, 2013)

oldpunk78 said:


> Can you use an atomizer?



Lol! 


-Alan


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## flight50 (Apr 17, 2012)

oldpunk78 said:


> Can you use an atomizer?


It probably could actually. The regulator they give you can be swapped out and they do sell the box solo. The regulator is what supplies the pressure, not the box. Plus not too many use atomizer anyways due to the pressure needed. I am sure most of us have regulators that supply under 30-40 psi to our needle valve(s) . Those that aren't like you and Alan who build them, know the ins and outs to building a quality setup. Many on here can't do that. There are other products out there in lieu of an atomizer that others including myself have turned to. Besides, I don't like the misting 7up look that it creates just as others don't desire.


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