# 46 gallon lighting



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok guys, I need Some help here. I have a 46 gallon bowfront tank that I want to make live plant. It is 36 in. Across and aprox 21 in deep ( prob around 18 in deep with substrate). It has a plastic hood that covers whole top except for small strip for light. Light fixture says on back 38w and is single bulb (t8) . Idk if that means max of 38w or what. So, I really like the natural green look that most pictures of tanks on this site look like. Do I need a whole glass top for my tank? Do they even make those for bowfront? So, what kind of light should I get to run a low-tech tank? I want to try to stay under $75 for lighting ( including hood if needed ) 

Right now I have a T8 single bulb, 25 watts. Will plants even grow? Thats not even close to the 2 watts per gallon, more like half a watt per gallon...

Thanks!!!


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

bowfronts are hard to light b/c of the shape and the depth. I would definitely ditch the standard hood. Plants photosynthesize best in the blue spectrum (6500K). You can mix spectrum types to achieve the color you want. I'm not sure what and how much light to recommend though.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

I just found a deal on eBay for a 2 bulb t5ho light fixture for $50, 2 39w bulbs, would that be too much light?


----------



## 5BodyBlade (Feb 8, 2011)

Kamikazi is right the bowfront can be a pain to light. Just some ideas. I have the same tank. I retrofit it myself with a Home Depot 2 light t5 and a new ballast for t5HO and that is more than enough light (2 39W bulbs). That light for $50 would be a good idea. I put in extra substrate (dirt) to make up for the tank depth. Also I just got rid of the top glass and have an open top with the lights on brackets.


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

stupidface said:


> I just found a deal on eBay for a 2 bulb t5ho light fixture for $50, 2 39w bulbs, would that be too much light?


Way too much. You can tone them down by adding a layer of standard window screen between the lamps and tank cover.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, my plan is to have 1 big piece of driftwood near the center of the tank and cover it in live moss, also some taller live plants to go on the
Ends of the tank. That being said, the light I found on eBay comes with 2 39w 6500k t5ho bulbs ( total of 78w ). Would that be too Powerful for the simple setup that I want? ( I don't want to deal with co2 until I become more familiar with the hobby ). Also, I guess it will be necesary to get rid of curent top. What are my options there? I don't think glass top is an option due to shape of the tank. Could I take some wood and a jigsaw and construct a whole new top? And just leave the tank top open?


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

A glass shop could cut some glass for your tank and it shouldn't cost too much.

You could get some clear acrylic hinge material to join the pieces.

Try McMaster-Carr for the hinge plastic.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, but is that too much light for low-tech tank?


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

Yes, whey to much for moss. A Coralife dual T5NO will work for low light plants. For moss, ferns and anubias 2 T8s should do. You can beef up the light with a parabolic reflector around it. Tis what I did for it. Pet Blvd has the replacement bulbs.When buying a light system make certain bulb replacements available. Found at home depot replacement bulbs for their T5NO were off by .5in.

Oh, forgot about Hyzer cheap T5HO light system. Check it out.

Oh found this one similar to yours


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Well right now I have a fixture that runs single t8. Max watts on fixture is 38w. I can buy a 6500k 25w T8 bulb. Would that grow moss and ferns??


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> Well right now I have a fixture that runs single t8. Max watts on fixture is 38w. I can buy a 6500k 25w T8 bulb. Would that grow moss and ferns??


Yes for I used 3 T8 18 watts over 29 gallon tank. Just with 1 bulb not certain light will spread to the front. My favorite T8 bulb is the Life-glo.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, Life-Glo does not make 36" =(
what do you think about this light though?
http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=11248157
or
http://www.petco.com/product/111972/Zoo-Med-T-8-Flora-Sun-Max-Plant-Growth-Fluorescent-Bulb.aspx
or
http://www.petco.com/product/111971/Zoo-Med-T-8-Ultra-Sun-Super-Daylight-Fluorescent-Bulb.aspx

they only make 25w for 36"



http://www.petco.com/product/10386/Zoo-Med-Reef-Sun-5050-Bulbs.aspx
This is in my tank right now^^^, I bought it thinking I was going to do salt water, I am going to return it and get a light more ideal for freshwater


----------



## tkbellwood (May 16, 2011)

If you decide to go with T5 HO instead of NO, there is another good source here for under $50:

http://www.aquatraders.com/36-inch-2x39W-T5-Aquarium-Light-Fixture-p/52122p.htm


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> http://www.petco.com/product/111971/Zoo-Med-T-8-Ultra-Sun-Super-Daylight-Fluorescent-Bulb.aspx


Two of this would be perfect.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

tkbellwood said:


> If you decide to go with T5 HO instead of NO, there is another good source here for under $50:
> 
> http://www.aquatraders.com/36-inch-2x39W-T5-Aquarium-Light-Fixture-p/52122p.htm


thanks, that is an amazing deal, but i want a low tech tank and that would be too much light




Hilde said:


> Two of this would be perfect.


2? I thought I said, my light fixture only holds 1 bulb. Would anything grow under 1 bulb?


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> thanks, that is an amazing deal, but i want a low tech tank and that would be too much light
> 
> 2? I thought I said, my light fixture only holds 1 bulb. Would anything grow under 1 bulb?


Yeh, I know you have 1 but thinking for under $50 you could get another fixture. Try 1 and put it near a sunny window. 1 is enough for ferns, moss and anubias but will it look good to you, will it cover the whole tank is questionable. I have had those plants grow in a 10G that were in front of a south window with no light, thus certain they don't need much light to grow.

What Hyzer did is the best in the long run. I started with the T8s over 29 gallon tank and hated them. Wasted money on the lights. Fortunately at local aquarium association got a coralife for $18. Perhaps there is a local aquarium association in your area.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, thing is, to buy another fixture, I would have to get rid of the current top cover for my tank. I really do not want an open top tank, and I think a full glass top would get kind of pricey


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> Ok, thing is, to buy another fixture.
> 
> I really do not want an open top tank, and I think a full glass top would get kind of pricey


Yeh, in the long run it is cheaper to get another fixture for they come with the bulbs. Until you can get what you want you could just put it near a sunny window. 

I don't like open tanks either. For my 29gallon tank I cut the lid off the hood that came with the tank and put glass behind it. The glass I got cut at ACE hardware store for a few $. Got a piece of straight metal at Home Depot to hold the glass near the hood. The glass is a little shorter than the tank to allow tubes from canister filter. I cut some plastic to cover the open area and duct taped it. Perhaps you can do something like that. Here is glass top $29 for bowfront.

For filters hangonback (HOB)filters and canister filters are the best. Sometimes you can get deals on EBay for canister filters. Some I have read at APC don't have filters. Don't know how they manage that for I get BBA without a filter.

See you are checking out substrate now. For the ferns, moss, and anubias you don't need anything special. If you want something else later good to have dirt top with 3ml gravel or sand.

My basic substrate is-
1st layer reptile coconut bark ($3) for adds Co2 to substrate
2nd layer Scott's top soil mixed with Cactus soil ($6)
3rd layer river sand ($3) from landscaper.
Instead of cactus soil can mix in sand. This helps keep it from compacting.


----------



## audioaficionado (Apr 19, 2011)

stupidface said:


> I just found a deal on eBay for a 2 bulb t5ho light fixture for $50, 2 39w bulbs, would that be too much light?





audioaficionado said:


> *Way too much*. You can tone them down by adding a layer of standard window screen between the lamps and tank cover.





stupidface said:


> Ok, but is that too much light for low-tech tank?





audioaficionado said:


> A glass shop could cut some glass for your tank and it *shouldn't cost too much*.
> 
> You could get some clear acrylic hinge material to join the pieces.
> 
> Try McMaster-Carr for the hinge plastic.





stupidface said:


> Ok, thing is, to buy another fixture, I would have to get rid of the current top cover for my tank. I really do not want an open top tank, and I think a full glass top would get kind of pricey


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Hilde said:


> Yeh, in the long run it is cheaper to get another fixture for they come with the bulbs. Until you can get what you want you could just put it near a sunny window.
> 
> I don't like open tanks either. For my 29gallon tank I cut the lid off the hood that came with the tank and put glass behind it. The glass I got cut at ACE hardware store for a few $. Got a piece of straight metal at Home Depot to hold the glass near the hood. The glass is a little shorter than the tank to allow tubes from canister filter. I cut some plastic to cover the open area and duct taped it. Perhaps you can do something like that. Here is glass top $29 for bowfront.
> 
> ...


Ok, so, just to make sure I'm following you correctly. Get rid of entire plastic top on tank, buy another t8 light fixture, buy the glass top for the bow front tank, set both light fixtures on top of glass. Correct?
Also, I have a HOB filter, it's a marineland penguin bio-wheel 350.
For substrate I have been reading around and am thinking about white pool filter sand (like $10 for 50 pounds) . I really like the look of it. Other thing is, If I do get another single bulb light fixture in addition to the one that I have now, Should I use two different bulbs?

And also, will I have to cut that glass for where my filter sits down?


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> Get rid of entire plastic top on tank?


Not certain about that. Possible for under $29 can retrofit the area behind the lid.


stupidface said:


> Buy another t8 light fixture? If I do get another single bulb light fixture in addition to the one that I have now, Should I use two different bulbs


I think it would be cheaper in the long run to get 1 T5HO and hang it like Hyzer did. If you get another T8 fixture get 1 good bulb (zoomed super daylight) and 1 cheap bulb. Scratch that, for light fixture will probably have a bulb! Just get superdaylight bulb for present fixture.


stupidface said:


> For substrate I have been reading around and am thinking about white pool filter sand (like $10 for 50 pounds) .


I tried it and found it difficult to keep white. Others told me they vacuum it and top it with more sand. May be cheaper at Home Depot.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Hilde said:


> Not certain about that. Possible for under $29 can retrofit the area behind the lid.
> 
> I think it would be cheaper in the long run to get 1 T5HO and hang it like Hyzer did. If you get another T8 fixture get 1 good bulb (zoomed super daylight) and 1 cheap bulb. Scratch that, for light fixture will probably have a bulb! Just get superdaylight bulb for present fixture.
> 
> ...


Ok, Im alright with vacuuming and topping off the white sand since it is so cheap. So, I think I am going to keep my current set-up and buy a new bulb

So this is what I will have,
Penguin bio-wheel 350 filter

One of this bulb in my light http://www.petco.com/product/111971/Zoo-Med-T-8-Ultra-Sun-Super-Daylight-Fluorescent-Bulb.aspx

2 50 pund bags of white PFS (one to fill with, other to use for cleaning)

Is that all I need to start my live plant tank?

Also, I have heard that I shouldn't use air stones in a live plant tank, is that true?

Also, Do I need to worry about PH balance?


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

stupidface said:


> Also, I have heard that I shouldn't use air stones in a live plant tank, is that true?
> 
> Also, Do I need to worry about PH balance?


I dont run an air stone on my 29 gallon, I have one in my 40 gallon but that has more to do with moving surface water at one end of the tank. I eventually plan on a power head.

I don't worry much about pH. I make sure I get fish that fit my pH. My problem is I have very soft water and over time the pH drops from neutral out of the tap down into the low 6's if I don't do water changes every couple weeks to keep it stable.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

So, Im still foggy, what about the 2 watts per gallon thing? I'm at like half a watt per gallon.


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> So, Im still foggy, what about the 2 watts per gallon thing? I'm at like half a watt per gallon.


Watts per gallon is out dated. It was designed to work with T12 bulbs.

Besides moss I have grown in a sunny window. Then there anubias and ferns you can get. Java fern v windelov is my favorite. They are more expensive than stem plants. Since than can exist with minimum light they are cheaper in the long run especially if you buy them from an individual (member of forum).


stupidface said:


> Ok, my plan is to have 1 big piece of driftwood near the center of the tank and cover it in live moss, also some taller live plants to go on the ends.


Crypt v balance would look nice I think. Thus I suggest some dirt under the sand for them.

Trallen has a single 48" 32 watt 10,000K bulb over is 55 gallon tank. This makes think that it is the spectrum of the bulb that is more important. He initially started with root tabs

Here is a 29G with stock hood lights (plant bulbs) and extra 13w daylight lamp.


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

kamikazi said:


> My problem is I have very soft water and over time the pH drops from neutral out of the tap down into the low 6's if I don't do water changes every couple weeks to keep it stable.


Nice to know. I will save the info for those whom have low PH. Wish I had low ph. It is perfect for Rams and Apistogramma.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Thanks halide, you are very helpful. So it wouldn't work for the substrate to be 100 % sand? Also, are there any tall plants that I can grow?


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

stupidface said:


> Thanks halide, you are very helpful. So it wouldn't work for the substrate to be 100 % sand? Also, are there any tall plants that I can grow?


some plants will grow in just sand, some won't. just depends on the plant and other conditions.

alot of people use sand as a cap over dirt. or if they aren't using dirt they will put root tabs or ocmocote capsules. Here is a link that might interest you that talks about the latter. http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/el-natural/45072-osmocote-substrate.html


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

OH, yes forgot about the root tabs. Some have grow plants sand substrate using them. Seachem brand the best. Are $9.53 here with no shipment cost.

Tall plants that are easy are the Cryptocoryne


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, what is just a simple plant that I can put in my tank that will grow with my lighting, with sand only, that i can buy at petsmart or petco. I just want to start with 1 plant


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> Ok, what is just a simple plant that I can put in my tank that will grow with my lighting, with sand only, that i can buy at petsmart or petco. I just want to start with 1 plant


Petco has more plants. Look for fern or anubias or crypt that is growing in water. Don't get the amazon swords for they are too big for your tank.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, I need to go to petco anyway so that works out


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

Amazon swords are too big for a 46 gallon tank?


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

So, my tank is already full with water, I am using pfs as substrate. Can I just pour the sand into the water? If I do need to drain it. Can I refill it with just regular hose water?

Going to petco and home depot today. Going to buy pfs frOm home depot
At petco I am buying the light you recommended (single t8). And a few plants.
Is there anything else that I need? Like PH test kits or something?


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

Are you using tap water or water treated with chlorine/chloramines? If so get a bottle of chlorine/chloramine remover. Add according to the directions on the bottle and treat your water with it when you do water changes or top offs (add the remover, before putting new water into tank)

If there isn't anything in the tank that could be buried you can add the sand with the water in it, just be sure the water level is down so that the sand won't displace the water and cause it to overflow everywhere. However, I really don't recommend this. I would drain the water in the tank an inch or two left wont be an issue.

Before adding the sand I'd recommend rinsing it in a clean bucket first or else you will have a huge cloudy mess, especially with adding the sand to a tank with water in it. 
Even after rinsing it you will probably still have a somewhat cloudy tank, it should settle and clear in a day or so. 

You should get a test kit to test at least pH, nitrates, nitrites, and ammonia API sells a all in one test kit for around 34-38 dollars. Im still using test strips b/c I'm too cheap to buy the API kit.

You need the tests to check your ammonia, nitrite and nitrates when cycling your tank. You want to cycle it before adding fish. Usually takes around 4-5 weeks.


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

Unless you plan to keep cold water fish you will want a heater rated for a 46 gallon tank.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, don't think this is an issue, but jus want to be sure. I can mix my tank with live and artificial plants right?


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

stupidface said:


> Ok, don't think this is an issue, but jus want to be sure. I can mix my tank with live and artificial plants right?



Yeh no problem doing that, it might look a little strange if the fakes don't look natural enough. But I have seen some artificial plants that look pretty real.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ya, I saw some fake corkscrew plants that look pretty real. On my way to petco now to see them up close


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Just left petco, bought 3 plants, no idea what they are, they were not marked. The light above the tank of all of the plants was a single T8 about 1 foot above tank... So I figured
They would be fine in my tank. Will take pics of them when I get home. They came in little Pots. Do I take them out of the pots and just Burry the roots in the sand?


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Did not buy test kits :/. Hopefully all goes well


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

stupidface said:


> Just left petco, bought 3 plants, no idea what they are, they were not marked. The light above the tank of all of the plants was a single T8 about 1 foot above tank... So I figured
> They would be fine in my tank. Will take pics of them when I get home. They came in little Pots. Do I take them out of the pots and just Burry the roots in the sand?


I'm interested to see what plants you ended up with. Depends on the plant on how you plant it. If it has a rhizome like java fern and anubais you dont want to bury the rhizome. They grow well tied or glued to rocks and driftwood. 

With potted plants I carefully remove the pot and the rock wool that is used. I try to get as much of the rock wool off without damaging too many roots (i found this to be difficult with crypts as the roots tend to be fragile) once you have the roots exposed trim the roots with scissors, I have read varying suggestions on how much to trim. Trimming the roots encourage new growth and helps the plant get established. 

Sometimes potted plants will have more than one plant in the pot. You can carefully separate the plants and then plant them in the tank.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ya, some of them have more than 1 plant In a pot. I will post pics when I get home in aprox. An hour and a half (gotta stop at some places)


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Man, drained my tank, put PFS in, only have enough water from purified water store to fill a little less than half the tank. Water is murky and
I can't run filter because it is HOB and there would be a waterfall. Will my plants last in a plastic bag overnight???


----------



## Hoppy (Dec 24, 2005)

stupidface said:


> Ok, don't think this is an issue, but jus want to be sure. I can mix my tank with live and artificial plants right?


NO! The plastic and natural plants will cross-breed, possibly resulting in a noxious weed that can take over the whole house!:icon_roll


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Hoppy said:


> NO! The plastic and natural plants will cross-breed, possibly resulting in a noxious weed that can take over the whole house!:icon_roll


... The first time that I read this I believed it... Just because you were the person that wrote it


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

you are using purified water? is there a reason you aren't using tap water? you have to treat it with chlorine remover of course but at least you won't have to pay for purified water. 

Where are the pictures of the plants??

and I lol'd at hoppy's post


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, its only $10 to fill with purified water. I am posting pics now


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Heres all three









One in middle is anubia


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

I'm not sure about the one of the left but the one on the right is a type of crypt, appears there are alot of plants in that pot too, looks good!

I'm not sure what you plan on as far as a water change schedule but some people do them weekly. $10.00 a pop could really start to add up.


----------



## kamikazi (Sep 3, 2010)

post a pic of the plant on the left in the plant section and see if someone can ID it for you.


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, I got the tank full and filter is now running. I'm goin to chill at the beach for a while and will put plants in when I get home... Water was too cloudy when I left


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Put plants in and it looks great!!!!!!!








On left side of tank it is a fake plant, also on the wood thing in the middle the green things are fake, rest is live





Heres a close up of them










Awsome!!


Any suggestions?


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Should I be using fertilizers?


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

I'm gonna start a new thread in low-tech secti


----------



## Hilde (May 19, 2008)

stupidface said:


> Should I be using fertilizers?


Seachem root tabs would be good. Can get them cheap with no shipment cost at LNT.com.


stupidface said:


> Ok, its only $10 to fill with purified water. I am posting pics now


I agree with kamikazi that is going to get costly using purified water. Don't understand why you are using it when you don't have any special fish. 

For my celestrial danios I use a gallon of distilled water with tap water for 10 gallon tank.

Light looks good for the plants you have. Amazed how bright it is with 1 bulb. What bulb did you get?


----------



## stupidface (Jun 20, 2011)

Hilde said:


> Seachem root tabs would be good. Can get them cheap with no shipment cost at LNT.com.
> 
> I agree with kamikazi that is going to get costly using purified water. Don't understand why you are using it when you don't have any special fish.
> 
> ...


Thanks to you I got the best bulb,
http://www.petco.com/product/111971/Zoo-Med-T-8-Ultra-Sun-Super-Daylight-Fluorescent-Bulb.aspx


I set up a new thread in the low-tech section, I could really use your help halide, you and kamakazi are amazing =)
here is my new thread,
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/low-tech-forum/141205-my-planted-tank.html


----------

