# Red Cherry Shrimp Tank



## theshadybird (Sep 25, 2012)

1. Bamboo shrimp are filter feeders and need a pretty swift current to properly feed, and they won't interbreed, 'cause they're different species :]

2. Is your tank filtered? Is it planted only with Hair Grass?

3. How high is the light? Pics!!!


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

theshadybird said:


> 1. Bamboo shrimp are filter feeders and need a pretty swift current to properly feed, and they won't interbreed, 'cause they're different species :]
> 
> 2. Is your tank filtered? Is it planted only with Hair Grass?
> 
> 3. How high is the light? Pics!!!


2. reply: Yes, currently with a sponge filter as can be seen in the photo in the first entery. Its only Dwarf Hairgrass in the substrate and Java Moss on a log at the corner as seen in the corner.

3. Am using Aquatrader 24" Green Element 16x 3W 6500K Led light fixture.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Added A few pics in the first entry.


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## theshadybird (Sep 25, 2012)

I personally won't worry about the bubbles, I don't think you have enough cherries to worry about it. 
And I would add the ferts with how high your lights are, but hopefully someone else will chime in soon!

That tank is going to look really nice when it grows in though!


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

theshadybird said:


> I personally won't worry about the bubbles, I don't think you have enough cherries to worry about it.
> And I would add the ferts with how high your lights are, but hopefully someone else will chime in soon!
> 
> That tank is going to look really nice when it grows in though!


But would it be enough with just Seachem Excel as a Co2 source? Am not using a pressurized system since it said to be the number one killer of shrimp.

Thank You, I really hope it looks nice too.


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## theshadybird (Sep 25, 2012)

Light, CO2, and Ferts are the holy trinity of plant growth. More of one, means more of the others is necessary for good growth. You have high light and CO2, but without ferts or the fish that would otherwise provide the rudimentary fertilization, you're not going to get the growth you want, and with the light, will probably get a whole bunch of algae instead, especially with how few nutrient suckers you have in there.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

yeah!!! Algae Bad.
I already have a clado problem in my other planted tank, don't need another.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

added some more info.


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## Duck5003 (Oct 1, 2012)

For cherry reds you don't need to get too specific as far as hitting exact numbers, it's more about keeping consistent numbers as with most freshwater tanks. They will thrive and breed in a number of conditions, it's fluctuation that will cause problems. Your temp will be good from the 78-82 range, but again keep it consistent. Also that ph range you showed on the first post, if its going back and forth that's a problem. Again go for stability, but for RCS I would try to keep it up closer to 7.0 -7.2 (this works for me), but your a little low at 6.4. Another big factor as far as breeding and just overall health of the shrimp is your Tds and gh/kh, which I haven't seen mention of. That will play a large role in molting, and ultimately breeding. There's a lot of good info on this forum to dive deeper into that. As far as light and algae, I think you will wanna lower the time on with that kind of lighting if you take your ph up, as you'll likely start algae production with higher ph, if you havent already. As far as carbon, excel I've used with shrimp tanks and not had any major noticible problems however I dose much lower than recommended dosage. Actual CO2 systems I don't know much about. As I said before, this forum has a lot of info, I may also recommend planetinverts.com. Good info that is pretty well organized. Hope this at least helps point you in A direction lol


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

one question and 4 updates


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## theshadybird (Sep 25, 2012)

This one looks male to me. Dunno about the guys swimming against the flow.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

That's good to know I might go and buy two more male RCS


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## theericafish (Apr 27, 2012)

Females will have a saddle. It looks like an orange saddle right behind their head on their upper back. 

Be careful with fluctuating ph, it can kill the shrimp.

GH and KH are pretty important also, I learned the hard way.

I ended up putting coral bones in my filter to solve that issue, it raises the ph, kh, and gh.

Anyway, heres how I learned=
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1971652#post1971652

Oh yeah, most algae wafers are pretty high in protein and if your gh/kh is low(low amounts of minerals in the water) you can actually kill your shrimp by overfeeding because they wont have enough minerals to generate a new shell before they bust out of their old one. In your pictures you can see the shrimp having a line in the center of their body, that seemed to be what was happening before mine had started dying. With moss in the tank they wont starve, I usually feed mine algae wafers twice a week and they get some flakes that the fish miss.

Not trying to be scary or anything, rcs are pretty easy to keep, shrimp in general are still less hardy than fish in my experience though.


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## accordztech (Dec 6, 2004)

For your temps, I noticed that my cherry shrimps bred much more at lower temps below 77 degrees. I have them at 74 currently.

I like that data logger, is that all real time?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

theericafish said:


> Females will have a saddle. It looks like an orange saddle right behind their head on their upper back.
> 
> Be careful with fluctuating ph, it can kill the shrimp.
> 
> ...


The PH reached 7.4 then lowered to 7.12 and stabilized at that value. The mineral powder states if you dlose correctly, the parameters will be the following: GH 4, KH 1-2, pH 7.4, conductance 75 µS.

I drop one Shirakura Ebi Dama Special pellet and I won't drop another until its finished.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

accordztech said:


> For your temps, I noticed that my cherry shrimps bred much more at lower temps below 77 degrees. I have them at 74 currently.
> 
> I like that data logger, is that all real time?


I have the Fluval heater set at 26C but the heater is showing 25C and the seneye is showing 24.3C.

The seneye device has readings taken at 30 minute intervals.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

accordztech said:


> For your temps, I noticed that my cherry shrimps bred much more at lower temps below 77 degrees. I have them at 74 currently.


Some say RCS breed better at warmer temperatures 25-27C, like this article in wikihow and Aquariuminfo. The majority of sites state this fact.

And shrimp farm states to keep at the temp and the PH anywhere but the extremes, which to me makes sense that RCS would breed better at an average of the range.

There was a site which I can't seem to find, which stated that the optimium temp is 74-75F.

At the end I've decided to go with the large number of srticles that state 25-27C is the best breeding temp. My only problem is that my fluval 100W heater wont get to that temp. It reaches 24.5C and stays at that value.


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## accordztech (Dec 6, 2004)

sub-80 said:


> Some say RCS breed better at warmer temperatures 25-27C, like this article in wikihow and Aquariuminfo. The majority of sites state this fact.
> 
> And shrimp farm states to keep at the temp and the PH anywhere but the extremes, which to me makes sense that RCS would breed better at an average of the range.
> 
> ...


Yea people have their opinions. FOr some reason at any low temp mine breed like hell. Try anything after a few months to see if things change. Its all about finding the sweet spot.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

added a question about breeding time


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Installing Pressurized CO2 into the tank until the DHG matures. Do I need to add an air stone and how many CO2 bubbles per second should I set it?


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## Unikorn (Jun 14, 2012)

I recently killed all of my RCS using pressurized CO2.  I was not dosing high amounts or anything either.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Unikorn said:


> I recently killed all of my RCS using pressurized CO2.  I was not dosing high amounts or anything either.


How large is your tank?

How many bubbles per sec were you dosing?

Was an air stone present?

Could it have been PH fluctuation that killed them?


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## Unikorn (Jun 14, 2012)

sub-80 said:


> How large is your tank?
> 
> How many bubbles per sec were you dosing?
> 
> ...


Standard 20 gallon tank
I have a sponge filter in the tank along with the canister filter
I was dosing 1-2 bubbles per second, from the information I've gathered from other TPT member's help, yes the PH swings will kill the shrimp.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Did you have an airstone in the tank?


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## Unikorn (Jun 14, 2012)

Isn't that is what runs the sponge filter? Do I need an additional air line?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

I switched from the sponge filter to an HOB and the sponge filter without the inline connected to the sponge filter and the oxygen was at 8.3 with inline 8.4 and when I have the HOB 8.0-8.2 depending on the height of water.


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## Hardstuff (Oct 13, 2012)

My Ph swings from 7.5 to 6.4 almost every day but I only have 3 cherries in a fish / planted tank with pressurized CO2 & my shrimp are doing really well. Although I am not sure if they are too old to breed. I have been told that 2 or 3 shrimp in a heavy planted tank are not going to breed. I also read that that the stripe down the middle actually means the shrimp are getting older NOT dying. My RCS shrimp have had a stripe down the middle now for 5 months & they are still doing well. If they died in the next few months I doubt it was because the stripe appeared but more because they died of old age. The stripe means they are old shrimp. Young cherry reds do not get the stripe until they are at least a year old or more. 
If my shrimp were more plentiful & younger they probably would have breed by now. I doubt the ph swings are really that bad because in nature the ph swings a lot. It is probably a myth the ph thing. If your shrimp are breeding with a steady ph than it is probably because all else is good.
1 last thing. I do not always consider breeding the only indication that a species is doing well. All it takes is 1 thing that can turn the corner for breeding but the species can still be doing well. My 2 cents


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

WTH? I thought a made a second post here?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

*Second Continuation*

*Updates:*

Replaced the Sponge filter with Eheim HOB (2042) with Fluval prefilter; The oxygen dissolved was reduced from 8.4 to 8.0.
 Bought some more shrimp; Currently have 10 RCS and 4 Amano/Yamato Shrimp.
Placed a Fluval Ceramics Shrimp Tube. To enhance the chances of breeding.
Installed a pressurized Co2 syste; 4Kg aluminum cylinder, Miluawkee Regulator set at 1 bubble every 4 seconds and Aquili 3cm corner Co2 diffuser.
Increased Temperature to 27C (80.6F) ; the corner where the Java Moss is gets an average of 25C (77F)
Installed a Dupla drop checker. Light green.


*Objective:* Red Cherry Breeding and Nicely planted tank.

*Question 9:* Have a huge number of snails, should I get rid of them or should I keep them, since I don't pick up remaining food? Will they affect the shrimp breeding?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Its been a month and 2 weeks since the tank has been setup and haven't seen one female with eggs. Majority of the red cherry shrimp have line on their bodies. Should I get more shrimp? I already have 10 red cherry shrimp.


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## Blueangel (Aug 19, 2012)

I would just wait they might still be getting use to there new home. You have to just sit back and give them sometime and keep everything stable. They could be still be young to do you see any saddles yet.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Any ideas to keep ph and kh stable?
My ph fluctuates from 7.3 to 6.9 between every 4 days until I use mineral powder. Will placing sea shells in filter increase kh or gh?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Did a Water test via Tetra Water test kit and Got these values:

KH:1-2dH
GH:3-4dH
PH:6.5
Nitrite: Less than 0.3mg/l

The mineral powder is doing its job, am getting the GH and KH values except PH since it starts at 7.4 but goes down along the days but the process increased due to CO2 injection. But I'd rather have a greater GH value so PH fluctuation would be less drastic.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

I placed 2 SAE and now I barely see any shrimp. Can't get them out they're to fast. 
Going to add another light fixture to get an even coverage of light, have some algae growing.


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## clau74 (Apr 21, 2012)

Hi,
Try to catch them with the lights off, the tank is nice.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Thanks. Tried that had only the room lights on and still too fast. Probably try only using a flash light


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## water hyacinth (Mar 3, 2013)

what is that in the third picture, it looks like duckweed in a canister??


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Am not sure what pic. your talking about, is it in the first post? 

I don't have duckweed in my tank.


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## water hyacinth (Mar 3, 2013)

sub-80 said:


> Am not sure what pic. your talking about, is it in the first post?
> 
> I don't have duckweed in my tank.


ye the first post, 3rd pic. It's like a canister filter but green in the middle.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Its not a canister. It is an "Atman" sponge filter, its consists of 2 yellow sponges. It has an optional airline to be used if you want air bubbles.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

sub-80 said:


> .... an optional airline to be used if you want air bubbles.


That was a stupid explanation.


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## Unikorn (Jun 14, 2012)

I love reading this thread, when you set up your tank it inspired me to make my own shrimp only tank  So thanks!
Aren't there supposed to be 0 nitrite and ammonia and then just nitrate readings? plus kh/gh/ph

Hope everything is doing well.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

The nitrite ammonia are close to zero. 
I plan to use MgSo4 to increase GH value to reduce the pH fluctuations.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

I want my shrimps yo breed so much that I dreamt of offspring shrimp jumping out of the java moss then their mother last.


Will SAE eat baby shrimp?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Placed two teaspoons of crushed coral in my hob filter to increase GH, KH and PH last night it has been 16 hours. Currently am away from tank but seneye reports 7.38 it was 7.01 before I placed the coral.

I also decreased the light duration to 3 hours due to the presence of hair algae.

When I get back home I will check the GH and KH.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

ph: 7.30 (seneye)
gh: 6dH (Tetra test)
kh: 4dH (Tetra test)

The gh and kh almost doubled.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Did the same test as above

GH: 6dH
KH: 2dH
ph: 7.42

removed the crushed coral will not be able to observe next day.
The CO2 has been turned off the past 2 days.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Returned the crushed coral on the begining of 17th.

average ph:7.32
gh:6dH
kh:2dH

added one more table spoon.


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## theericafish (Apr 27, 2012)

From my experience the GH And kh will peak at some point and won't go much higher. As you do water changes it will remove some of the waters hardness and it sort of balances out. 

The only downside to crushed coral is it raises the pH of the water. The kh has direct correlation to the pH and is also a representation of the GH value.

I found that its an easy way to keep neocardinas because they will acclimate to higher pH values and do well with the added GH. You only run into issues if you are keeping fish that thrive at a lower pH, like tetra species or other tropical fish. Although they will live in higher pH you will have reduced breeding/ coloration & also opens them up to disease and shortens their lifespan a bit. 

If you have hair algae most people will tell you its due to high phosphates and excess nutrients or lighting. Best way I've found to combat it is manual removal and dosing liquid co2. Excel and similar products have been invert safe in my experience but I recommend half the dosage just to be safe. Also use with caution, I see you mostly just have moss in your tank so it may not be fully absorbed and may lead to more algae issues.

Another note: most fish will eat anything that fits in their mouth. Some are more aggressive than others.

I've also found that moss grows and resists algae much better with some water flow on it.

Also with 10 or less shrimp feeding should be very sparse. With moss and algae in the tank they will always have something to graze on. Overfeeding will lead to molting issues. Molting issues leads to dead shrimp :x 

My advice would be limit factors that could cause them to die. Feed less, get a stable pH and definitely more plants if you want your tank to benefit from co2 injection. Shrimp are sensitive and even the stress of water changes can cause them to die. Striping means they are ready to breed and they should have yellowish saddles in their upper back behind their head. Once that happens the eggs will move down to their legs and are ready to be fertilized. Once fertilized you will be able to see black spots on the eggs which are their eyes. Wait about 3 weeks and you will have shrimplets. Once you can see shrimplets in the tank make sure to be vary careful with water changes so you don't suck them up, they are pretty tiny for the first few weeks.

From my experience the shrimplets tend to be a little more hardy because they are more used to the water conditions you have provided. And their exoskeletons will grow in a more linear pace compared to the adults or sub adults that you received which could have came from random water conditions.

Once you get past all that you can think about adding more cherry shrimp to diversify your gene pool and then you will be on to your next project, maybe even the harder to keep cardina species.

As far as snails go, some find them an eyesore but I find them beneficial and interesting. If you ever feel they are out of hand you could pick up some assassin snails, but beware they will decimate the population of your snails. And you should always have a cleanup crew in there, otos are awesome but can be very sensitive. In my shrimp tank I decided to go with nerite snails because they are peaceful and don't breed if you just have one. 

Please excuse the wall of text  This site is great and you can find plenty of information on here.

I'm sure others will chime in with their experiences which may differ from mine, its all a learning process and can be very rewarding!

Good luck!


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

Not at all I appreciate people taking time to share their knowledge.











The part that I hate about manual removal is that it is firmly stuck on the hair grass and when I lift it, the hair grass is lifted with it and its runners. I did try yesterday excel spot treatment. Am facing hair algae and green spot algae and am just hoping that it is hair algae and not cladophora as I have faced cladophora and the price of success is not expensive but tiring.
Actually half of the tank is planted. The strange part about the algae is that it is only appearing in the middle section of tank.

Most say SAE don't eat shrimp, but I believe that fish tend to bite anything that fits their mouths. What bothers me most is rough movements they move fast and sometimes almost bump into shrimps.

Noticed a spur of growth when I reduced the light duration to 3 hours.


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## theericafish (Apr 27, 2012)

At least the tank is looking good minus the hair algae . I have a bit I've been battling also and as soon as it entwines in your plants its such a pain. Probably going to pick up a sae or american flag fish today. Although I hear flag fish can be aggressive toward shrimp. So far with excel dosing I have seen a lot of the algae turning a whitish color. There is hope 

I have seen first hand how a flagfish can control hair algae but it also ate some shrimp I'm that tank :x


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

American flag fish are omnivores, I guess you know that. In the ADA, Tropica and Oliver videos they showed SAe as an hard working elegant fish but they don't show their rough movements and other behaviors that I find annoying (can't think of them right now). Trying to get one of them out of the tank but they are too fast. I remember someone warning me that I put sae it will be permanent but I didn't think it would be this hard.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

It turns out the cladophora that had infested in my 135l tank has also infested my shrimp tank. I was able to eradicate the cladophora in the 125l tank. I a shortcut of I did to the 125l tank and hopefully it will be fine.

I noticed it when I got some on my hand the awful smell got to my nose.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

I have some bad news.  

After a while of only seeing only one or two shrimps only I decided to trim the java moss where it seems all the shrimp were hiding. When I moved the java moss a lot of dirt came out making the water cloudy. So I decided to fill a bucket half of aquarium water and place the Java moss on it and clean the java moss. I was able to find only 3 red cherries. I tore the Java moss to piece but found none. I found half of Yamato (Amano) shrimp next to the driftwood. I did a 60% water change and added 6 red cherry shrimps and one oto. 
Unlike before otos used to die in a few days but due to the crushed coral the PH only fluctuates from 7.72 to 7.52. The GH is 6 and KH is 2. Its been a week and the shrimp seem to be fine. 

If anyone who has bred neocaridina with fluval shrimp stratum what are the water parameters and temperature did your shrimp breed at? 

I had cladophora in the tank and it has been eliminated but I still have glass algae which seems to be making the oto busy and happy for now.

This is the second attempt I guess. Any advice?


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

I woke up today to see that one of my shrimp was torn to bits with a SAE and a red cherry shrimp munching on it. 

I decided that I will completely empty the tank to be able to catch the SAE and place them in my other tank. The shrimp and onto will be placed in a bucket until I clean and fix the aquascape of the tank. Hopefully better results.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

I did 95% water change removed water until it was barely visible. Placed the red cherry shrimp and Otis in a bucket with aquarium water and placed the sae in another tank. Fixed the landscape, scraped the algae then filled the tank. Waited a few hours for the water temp. and parameters to stabilize before placing the shrimp and Otis back in. Used seachem prime and ocean free pure liquid before placing shrimp. 

I also installed a second eheim filter to help keep the water cleaner.

I am thinking of cleaning the gravel, I placed a filter media bag on my siphon tube to stop it from sucking in gravel. Should help remove any dirt under the gravel.


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## sub-80 (Oct 29, 2012)

*Re: Red Cherry Shrimp Tank II*

Did not do the gravel clean up. Posting some pics.

How do I remove this glass algae? Shown in the last pic.


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