# Need some advice with scape



## alym (Mar 31, 2008)

in this type of scape, i'd say you want to leave the space on the right open, i.e. filled with smaller plants rather than the tall ones you already have. just a thought!


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

That's what I was thinking as well but I had some extra plants left over so I went ahead and put them along the back and side. I am looking for some dwarf hair grass that would fill in the right side, so once I get that I will be moving the taller plants to the left or getting rid of them completely.


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## Strick (Apr 6, 2009)

It does seem unbalanced. Too much stuff and too much red on the right. Maybe move some of the taller red plants to the left side of the tank?


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## nismo tetra (Oct 11, 2009)

I would move some of those bright greens into the red section to further accent those reds. Would make them seem more "dramatic". Like that tall green plant move to the background of the red plant area. Almost as if the red plants are growing out of a patch of green plants.


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## anastasisariel (Oct 4, 2009)

I'm gonna have to be the odd ball and say that I like it and would like to see how it will look when it is much fuller after a couple weeks, and I kinda want to say I'd like to see a reddish green colored plant put in the midst of the greeness on the right.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

I think I will be getting rid of some of the green plants and reducing the amount of different plants I have...It looks a bit hectic IMO. I will move some of the taller green plants to the left behind and around the red ones to make it more "dramatic" and do some trimming once it grows in a bit more. 

I've read a few threads that tell you how to trim but I am still a bit unsure of where to trim the plant for it to come in nice and bushy so any advice on that would be greatly appreciated.

I also need to pull that small rock out, I had it in there to hold down a great big anubia but that plant is long gone now and for some reason left the rock there.

Thanks for all of your comments and opinions!


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Just got my dwarf hairgrass in and I also got some (and by some I mean a whole 10 gallon tank full) of java fern and about 10 anubias nana petite. I placed the dwarf hairgrass but not sure what to do with the java fern or anubias. Any recommendations? I moved some of the green into the 'red' zone on the left per recommendation of nismo tetra. The rotala indica is growing like crazy now...woohoo.

This is what the tank looks like now



























And just finished making a semi-covered canopy for it. Used window screen to block most of the reflecting light, we will see tonight how it did. Got the idea from Niko, and thanks for helping me out with that.










Criticism is always welcome and appreciated


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Oh also my aponogeton longiplumulosus shot up a flower and its about to bloom. I'll take a picture whenever its in full bloom, its supposed to be really nice and purple. I'll try to cross pollinate so that I can have offspring.


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## FSM (Jan 13, 2009)

I think the driftwood might look better on the right side, so that the branches are pointed towards the middle.

Right now, the left half of the tank looks great, but the whole thing doesn't seem very cohesive.


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

Keep us updated on the hairgrass. From my experience, hairgrass and loaches don't mix very well. Every morning I would see a bit of floating hairgrass.


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## nismo tetra (Oct 11, 2009)

I think it looks pretty good to be honest. Very clear. Just give it a bit of time to fill in. Then you can trim the plants up to where they better flow with one another. I like the hair grass. I'm sure in due time it will fill in nicely. If you get really bored one day and want to mess with the tank, you could further separate those clumps of hair grass to blend them all in a bit better. Long and tedious task lol.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

The hairgrass came in the mail from someone else who had them and it looked like there weren't too many roots so I figured I would try to separate them a bit more but not to the extend of every little strand. I am more worried about my 2 plecos to kick up the grass because I've seen them take some plants out by moving a lot. 

I think the driftwood could most a bit more to the right but I'll let everything grow in for a while then mess with it again. I have the anubias to tie to something so I was thinking about putting them on the driftwood near the top where it kind of looks like a sideways V, there is a little divot for them. Now tying them to that will be a task I believe. 

Should I throw in some java fern somewhere perhaps (seeing that I have a 10 gallon tank full of them)?


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## Dryn (Jan 22, 2009)

Your 'scape is looking good. However, there are a couple of things I'd critique: first, you are using a triangular-shaped layout which makes the rotala out of place (move it left some). Second, you lack a focal point with which to draw the attention of the viewer (follow the golden rule). Third, you are using far too many red plants in the layout making it look to complicated. Green is much more unifying. Your layout has a great deal of potential and it looks pretty good so far. Stick with it...


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Thanks for the advice Dryn! I took out some of the red plants (Ammannia Gracillis and Ammannia Senegalensis) and trimmed the rotala back to behind the DW. Took out the wallichii because it wasn't doing great. I placed the nana petit in the divot although the anubias aren't looking great themselves.

I am have the rotala along the whole back it just seems like the ones in the middle are growing faster than the ones on the left.

Wouldn't the focal point be the DW? I tried to place it 1:1.618 but I guess I should move it a bit more to the right and get the rotala to go behind it some more.

I'll keep messing with it for a while until I am happy with it...then I will redo the whole thing haha.

Thanks again for the critique.


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## Dryn (Jan 22, 2009)

The driftwood itself is too big to be the focal point, but a piece of it could be if it was properly highlighted, say with nice chunk of neon green riccia on a dark field.

What you want in a focal point is something that immediately draws the attention, but doesn't overwhelm the viewer. You want a point that can be taken in one look without having to look back and forth to take it all in, that defeats the purpose. The focal point grabs the attention, then the driftwood acts as a piece of interest that draws the eye through the landscape. 

A nice little knot of anubias at the bottom of the driftwood would draw the eye to it and the hairgrass across the front allows the eye to continue flowing... so on and so on.

You've got a good grasp - the devil's in the details.


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

dude wanna build me a canopy like that for my 72?


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Hmmm...Well I believe I am getting some riccia here sooner or later so that could help. I can place an anubia or two in there or even put some java fern to make it 'flow' more. I get what you're saying its just going to take a bit to finally get that thought/image into the aquarium. I'll mess around with it again this weekend and post another few pictures to see how things are going, hopefully in the right direction haha.


I would gladly made you a canopy for your 72 but I think that sending it in the mail will cost quite a bit.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Well I took some updated pictures. Let me know what you think.


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## Aqua'd (Dec 20, 2009)

That flower is Sweet!! 
Where is that plant in the tank though?? Is it that green curvy stalk going up on the left of the tank? 
What does the plant itself look like? 
Thanks


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## Twimbo (Oct 10, 2009)

I think it looks great. I'd simply wait for it to grow out even more, then do some fine tuning with a scissors....


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

The flowering plant is the Aponogeton Longiplumulosus and it is the big plant in the left corner indeed. I am going to try to pollinate it and grow new ones...I guess its hard to do but I'll give it my best try. Does anyone have any advice on how to cross pollinate a plant?

I am waiting for things to fill in as well perhaps make a few more plant changes but I am fairly happy with it right now.


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

yo check out my new post in my aquascape 72 bow question... posted some new pics... I'll get some non-hazy ones when I go back down there for school on the first and start dosing fertz again... what kind power heads do you use in yours to get the current going around? I'm thinking of using my xp4 spray bar up top pointed down just slightly with two 30-60 gallon rated power heads blowing from each corner end of tank towards front of tank slightly down... what do you think?


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Got some time today and also got some new fish and moved plant around and trimmed some. I would take more pics and post more but wife put me in charge of getting the party stuff going for tonight. Happy New Years to all!

Aquarium

















Tiger Lotus - got two giant mother plants and about 6 smaller ones









Angelfish - Got these guys for free...I really like them.









Furcata - Got 6 of these, 4 males 2 females









Kilifish (fundulopanchax gardneri) - Got one male and one female, the female is just plain orange and she always bites me whenever I put my hand in the aquarium...so every time I have to change something I put her in a net in 'time-out'


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## dj2005 (Apr 23, 2009)

Stunning tank and fish.


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## FISHSHROD (Jan 1, 2010)

Nice tank , once it grows in roud:


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Haha I am still waiting for it to fill in as well...I think I trimmed a bit too much of some stems but oh well...they will be back in about 2 weeks. The dwarf hairgrass is growing fairly quickly so that's good.


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## Frogmanx82 (Dec 8, 2009)

You need to move that one wire that runs right down the middle. You either need some sort of background on the back glass or tape the wire to the side of the tank.


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## leemacnyc (Dec 28, 2005)

Wow, nice transformation! It's really coming along....I concur on adding some background...keep up the good work


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## Dryn (Jan 22, 2009)

I have enjoyed seeing this tank evolve. Thank you very much. Your photography is also very excellent. 

The only thing left that unbalances your layout is the subtle lack of unity. The best solution would be to let the hairgrass grow completely across the front. 

And I must second the opinion that some sort of background is needed. A dark one would bring out the many, many red colors and a white one would limit thier impact (which I suggest).

Keep up the great work and I hope to see more pictures from you.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Trying to figure out what wires you are talking about that run down the middle? I have a reflection of our back door in the somewhat middle of the tank which might be what you think is a cable? I do want to hide all the cables though. I had a background but I didn't like it and took it off...I can change the light that is being reflected on the back wall by raising or lowering the light so I can have a much darker background next time. The black background looks unnatural to me unless I paint it perhaps.


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## trailsnale (Dec 2, 2009)

Nice tank and pics!


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Thanks for the compliments...still trying to figure out which cables I am missing that I need to move. I will be building a new canopy so that I will not have any light reflected on the back wall so that it will be darker but still avoiding a background. 

I am having a problem with some filamentous algae and it relaly likes to cling onto my rotalas...anyone have any advice on how to deal with this? Must have gotten it when I traded some plants...wonderful. Quick pictures.

























Any reason why one angel is always less colorfull than the other?








Bright red espei








Male and female kilis








And ofcourse the one fish I will never be able to catch to get him out of the tank...CAE. Anyone have any suggestions on how to catch him in a planted tank? Every time I come near the tank he hides, even when I leave a net in there for an hour he will still be hiding.


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

My tank's finally balanced... I guess when I got the current fixed, you really understand how important current is in the tank...

The current in my tank is 100% better at the very least... 

I mean obviously it brings oxygen to roots, plants, fertilizer to them, etc...

so let the 72 battle begin! 

To the best aquascaper!


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Haha I am not doing any ferts so you will get better growth and you have more lighting than I do. But sounds good.


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## Frogmanx82 (Dec 8, 2009)

I'm never really sure how to apply all these aquascaping rules. I'll just comment on how the tank hits me. While you are hoping that the driftwood is the focal point. The eye automatically goes to the open space and then there sits all your filter equipment.

I think a focal point isn't made just by adding one piece according to the golden rule. The rest of the tank has to help point to that and steer your vision to that focal point. The arrangement you have doesn't do that for my eye. I can't get my own tank right, but I know what looks good when I see it.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Oh I agree, my tank is not very soothing to the eye and my eyes wonder all over the tank and after moving things around for a while I get frustrated so I just leave it somewhat done. I would like to get rid of some plants and go for the more simplistic look and dwarf hairgrass all across the front to try and tie it all together. For these update pictures I am not taking the equipment out until I really am happy with the setup because taking it all out and putting it back in would be too much of a hassle on a weekly/daily basis (depending on when I feel like taking pictures). I also took the kilifish out because they were both attacking my hands whenever I would move something around...those little guys can bite hard! I tried to keep them in 'time-out' in a net...but ofcourse they jumped out of the net which would have been about a 4" jump in about 1.5" of water.

After moving a few things around and trimming...again, this is what I was left with. Still not what I want.


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## Frogmanx82 (Dec 8, 2009)

To me, the equipment is part of the tank, not to be removed for pictures. If it doesn't look good in a picture, then you need to do a better job blending it in with the aquascaping.

For your tank, I would spread it out, use what you have to mask the filter return, move some grass along the front and open up some holes on that left side and maybe move the driftwood to the right of center.


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## Francis Xavier (Oct 8, 2008)

One angelfish is darker than the other because the dominate one will show greater coloration as a by product of being dominate, and the other will be paler as a show of submission. This is a trait shared by cichlids in general.


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

dude why are your red plants so red... I'm dosing iron now in mine and their not even that red yet... it's been like 4 days dosing iron...


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

They are red because...not sure, perhaps the iron or the light. 

But anyways, I am going to be re-scaping in spring so I am holding off on any changes but I will be selling off all of my plants except for the DHG come spring time. Now that I am back to work full-time again I don't want to do a lot of maintenance and would like a new piece of DW and not rush it this time. I will keep my fish out of my tank for about a month and doing a little bit at a time but until then looking to buy some mosses and manzanita.

Preliminary design for just hard scape with DHG. The rectangular thing in the back left will by my filtration...getting rid of canister filters and having a GIANT 4" deep piece of foam and a pump behind it to create a current.


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## actioncia (Jun 9, 2005)

That tank looks awesome.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Haha thanks. Now all I have in it is the driftwood and tiger lotuses. Sold allll of the other plants...getting ready to drain it and put in new filtration system hopefully this weekend. The most annoying part is that I have to wait for the silicone to cure completely aka 48 hours.


I will be ordering manzanita and DHG (again) and hopefully this is what it will look like eventually. Might not have the rocks till spring but thats ok. 









Let me know what you guys think.


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## Dr. Acula (Oct 14, 2009)

I think that looks like a great plan. I'd go for thicker manzanita though, both because I think it would give a stronger, kind of older, more peaceful look (if that makes sense), and because the wood will then last longer in the tank. Manzanita is pretty rot resistant, but it will slowly disintegrate in the tank over time.

Also, what are your plans for the back right corner? More java fern to tie it all together? And do you plan on growing anything on the wood? Maybe a bit of moss or some anubias nana "petite"? I think the petite would look nice, but that's just me.


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

hey does your ecco fit the co2 reactor just right? My XP4 is fitting kinda loose and I don't want to risk it so I think I"m gonna go buy the ecco 2234 tonight and hook it up to the reactor... do I need more line or anything while I'm buying the ecco 2234? do you think any of the smaller ecco filters would be enough for the reactor? Please let me asap... trying to get this diffuser hooked up right away.


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

bought it... now I have the 2234 or whatever and an XP4... so much filtration for a 72 bow hahaha... probably eventually get like an 80 or 90 tho so it should work out...

gonna hook the reactor up tomorrow... how many BPS do you run into your reactor 1000? I'm gonna have the exact same setup same reactor, same filter... same pressurized CO2... minus the pH probe...

I also have 265W CF so I'll probably run a little more CO2...

and dose EI heavyyyyy....


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## Delslo (Feb 5, 2010)

I love the way you set it up, but it needs some more colour IMO


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## The Gipper (Sep 9, 2003)

What type of filter are you using on this one?


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

snoop do your plants pearl all the way down below... I can't get mine to and my Baby Tears are growing but still the old leaves look kinda poopy...

I dose heavy EI, Flourish for trace, and Flourish Iron

I have the same reactor as you through the same filter 2234 and I have it going about 1 bps right now...

I have 265W CF I even put a 95 W CF light on the top too add to it for a few days and still no pearling on the bottom...

I also have an XP4 on it and a couple power heads on each side...

I have a lighter fish load right now... Stuff pearls up top really well stuff towards very bottom doesn't really pearl..

I use half flourite/half medium gravel (could my carbonate hardness be too high from this)

Water from the tap is very soft where I lift (corvallis, OR)

10-11 photo period... 

weekly 35-50% water changes...

very little algae at this point.

What is the problem... why will my stuff not pearl at the bottom...

very small surface agitation 

ugh... bout to give up on my 72 pearling wise... pretty pissed off after I bought a 2234 not seeing any improvement on 1st day

bought that damn reactor

was a hasle to hook it up after I realized the xp4 line was too big and then just bought the ecco eheim 2234...

really dissapointed...

is a 72 bow JUST TOO DEEP!?


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Three...You don't want your tank to change instantly to what you want because if it can do that...it can easily turn into something you don't want. My DHG pearled when I had it with my 108 watts of light and I increased the surface agitation. I did a 25% water change maybe every 2 weeks and my photo period was 10 hours. I did have my Co2 running at around 3 bps. Try putting the solenoid on a timer that comes on about 30-60 minutes before the lights do and then turn off about an hour before your lights do. That way the aquarium will be saturated with Co2 so that the plants can use it right from the start as the lights turn on. I didn't do any ferts just substrate from aquariumplants.com and that seemed to work just fine. An aquarium can be frustrating but just don't pay attention to it for a bit and see what the results are then.

I did sell all of my plants so now I have a new filtration system along with my old until the bacteria gets build up nicely in the new filtration. Using a block of poret foam with a pump behind it and thats about it...a lot less maintenance from what I have read/heard so we will see how that goes. Now I have some pretty beat up java fern, anubias and tiger lotus in there. Waiting for my manzanita to arrive today (woohoo) then I can continue the scape. Ordered DHG from someone on this forum, paid them but no response regarding shipping or anything...hopefully I didn't get screwed.

I will post some pictures soon.


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## zenfish (Jan 29, 2006)

The HG has defiently softened the EDGE between the 2 sides..


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## problemman (Aug 19, 2005)

aw im said you got rid of the plants and didnt tell me...........


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Got the DHG in yesterday and its in pretty bad shape...I think it was grown under super low lighting so it grew tall instead of sideways. Perhaps I can get it to grow correctly. Also got the manzanita in...awesome pieces. They are soaking for a week or so, or until they are waterlogged. After that I'll post a picture.

Next time I'll let you know regarding getting rid of plants if you want.


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## snoop-a-loop (Oct 31, 2009)

Quick update on the tank. Its going to take some work to get it to look right. The java fern is pretty beat up, any tips on how to get it to not look brown and holey...?


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## three105 (Nov 15, 2007)

snoop,

can you tell me how you have your 2234 hooked up to the inline reactor 1000? I had my reactor in the stand but i think the lines turn too much and break a lot of the flow... do you have all the media chambers in the 2234 with stuff in them? I just cleaned mine and its flowing a lot better, left one chamber empty so thinking about putting my inline 1000 back on...

also I know you have about 110 W T5 right?

whats your co2 bps?

weekly water change %? 

and fert dosing plan? brand of dosing? what about the substrate... do you lightly sweep it with a gravel vac w/o sucking up anything.

and flow... how do you have your outputs angeled and other powerheads? 

I just ordered a koarlia powerhead or whatever the brand name is 

put out around 750 gallons per hour...

gonna try to put it on side of 72 and have it blow towards bottom to other front side... then xp4 output in back left pointed down/backwards sorta... and eheim 2234 on other side pointing downwards on the right back side...

what do you think?

what about feeding? how many times a day? a pinch of flake? 

trying to get my stuff under control...

i have 265 CF 10k/6,500.

co2 constant stream of bubbles through large glass diffusor w/ weak powerhead blowing the bubbles towards left front of tank...

filters running...

ordered timer for air, co2, and lights... so I can put on co2 hour before lights and air pump hour before lights go off...

i do weekly water changes but its hard to get a constant flow of current when you have a 3:1 aspect ratio tank with big pieces of drift wood... especially on the bottom of the tank...

right now im dosing potassium, flourish, and flourish Iron.

and excel to kill black beard...

and just did a one time dose of full erithromycin to kill BGA... the bga is attacking my hairgrass...

trying to get current on the bottom... need my powerhead thats supposed to get here today!

keep you updated

Three


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