# Build Journal - Moss Wall (Large) *Updated 2016-10-20*



## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

*Intro
*
Hello everyone.
Thought it was about time to start a new project since my vacation is soon here. This time I am going to explore the wonderful realm of moss-walls.
Nothing new here you think, just slap up some plastic mesh on the back and be done with it, but nooooo. Way to easy and under-complicated for my taste!



*Why?
*
Currently I have a Juwel 3D background installed. There is nothing wrong with it, looks rather good actually. But I have grown bored of the sand-brown color and I think it makes the tank look very narrow or rather the perception of depth is negatively affected.
It is also rather flat and feels lifeless. I have tried to remedy this by attaching moss to it but not liking how it looks and the moss does not really seem to like it. Sure the moss wall will look flat as well but I am hoping one can cut it into a more natural looking form and that it will feel more living and something fish and shrimp can interact more with. And since I have ordered 7 bags of Aqua-Soil and planing a re-scape this feel like the perfect time!



*Initial plans and vision
*
My first thought was just to attach some plastic mesh-net to the background and that was that. But the more I thought about it the more I wanted to remove my current background and do something more living and interesting.
So my plan as it stand now is to build a frame and cover this with netting all over.



*What I want*

1. Be able to attach moss and other plants easily to it.
2. Be black or dark so it will not attract attention from the viewer
3. House my filter intake,outblow,heater, surface skimmer and PH/Temp probe.
4. The gadget housing should be placed in the center of the tank and not look to "squareish"

My first thought was to use an aluminum frame and use plastic 90 degree thingies to attach it. Luckily I did some research and came to the conclusion that metals in the tank would best be avoided with the exception for titanium. But since I want to make this as cheap as I possible can titanium is out of the question.

Many hours looking for plastic frames later I gave up and just surfed around the net for random aquarium gadgets. Came across a Swedish reef store by mistake and saw their permanent plumbing section and my frame was secured.



*Startup phase*

The frame will be built from aquarium plumbing pipes and accessories. The dimension will be 20mm pipes since it is somewhat hard to find accessories to smaller dimensions and I also do not want it to be to flimsy.
The following part has been ordered/bought and I will have them in week 30.

*This will be the main part of the frame, Pipe 20mm (dark grey)*
http://www.mrfisse.com/akvarium/Mosswall/1.jpg

*Different assortment of accessories *to be able to connect it and also build the protruding gadget housing. Inner diameter 20mm, outer 26,5mm (dark grey)






























*Mosquito Net*, bought two types. One is flexible and have a mesh size from 1,5-2,5mm. Not sure if it is fabric or synthetic. If it is fabric it would be a poor choice and I am not sure about its elastic properties either.
The other one is a plastic mesh, it is firm and won't stretch. Mesh size is 1,4x1,6mm and should not be able to pass fry, shrimp and small fish. The firm one will probably be the easiest to work with.









That is about how far I have gotten so far.
I have some concerns and possible solutions to those concerns. And I will have to make some decisions on the fly later on as the build goes on. 
*


Here are some thoughts and concerns etc that I would like some input and thoughts on.*
1 .I am planing to only use one layer of mesh and partially push in parts of the moss into the mesh holes for them to attach and hope for them to attach better as they grow.

2. Have not yet decided on a moss type but will probably not only go with one but mix a couple of them in different "zones".

3.The corners from the pipe frame when covered with net will not have an air gap underneath and thus making it impossible to push in moss there. I have some different thoughts on this.
I either dress these in cut of small/long pieces of moorwood/red moorwood (the rest of the tank will be rescaped with this wood type as well) in a eye-pleasing way.
Or attach moss here as well but using superglue instead.
Or installing some kind of thin plastic bar underneath to create a water gap between the net and the pipe.

4.Thinking if I should try to create some kind of depth difference in the netting to make it less flat or if one just should keep it flat and instead cut the mosses into form later instead.

5.Maybe would be nice to install some smaller pieces into the netting as well to plant other species on like anubias etc to make it look more alive?










Will keep this thread updated as I progress in the project.
And lets hope it does not come to a screeching halt due to me not being able to remove the current background since I used more silicone than I needed 


Thanks for reading!


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## LRJ (Jul 31, 2014)

Interesting project. I like the idea of using the wall for equipment housing. Looking forward to seeing this take shape!


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

I've see it done nicely with thin poret foam covering the back window. Small amounts of moss is stitched on in rows about 3/4 inch apart.
Then it is all left to grow in. Looks a lot better than seeing pieces of mesh stick out.


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## burr740 (Feb 19, 2014)

Interesting project, look forward to seeing it progress



Fissure said:


>


Probably a dumb question, but is this a side view or top view or what exactly?


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

Nordic said:


> I've see it done nicely with thin poret foam covering the back window. Small amounts of moss is stitched on in rows about 3/4 inch apart.
> Then it is all left to grow in. Looks a lot better than seeing pieces of mesh stick out.


Have not seen one like that myself but actually sounds like a pretty good idea!



burr740 said:


> Interesting project, look forward to seeing it progress
> 
> 
> Probably a dumb question, but is this a side view or top view or what exactly?


Not dumb at all, probably should have mentioned that. It is a view from the side. Just showing how I was thinking about eventually making it at an angle instead.


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

So made a change to the plumping that will be used for the frame. Canceled the orders on the 20mm pipes and fittings. Found 10mm ones in a german aquarium shop and will be using that instead. Was a bit cheaper as well 

Been thinking about what moss types to use. Currently I plan to mix in different zones
Taxiphyllum barbieri
Taxiphyllum 'Spiky'
Vesicularia ferriei 'Weeping'

Also been looking at 
Taxiphyllum 'Flame'
Vesicularia dubyana 'Christmas'

But not sure the two latter would look good on a vertical surface?
Anyone else got any ideas about nice looking moss types to use?
Also not really to fond of the Java moss since I find it rather plain looking and a pain to keep trimmed.


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

So I was hoping to be able to start building today but my stuff is on a truck and could not be delivered. Mainly because they don't know how to use the telephone at the appartment entrance...
Anyways will hopefully be able to pick it up myself tomorrow and start building the frame.

Spent yesterday tearing down the Juwel background. Nearly cut my finger off :'(
Luckily my gf could patch me up and I could painfully continue.
It was hell getting it down. First tried to press a small carpet knife (thin variant) behind and saw through the silicone. 10 broken blades later I gave up that idea had only partially cut maybe 30 cm of the top.

So I grabbed a flat screwdriver and hacked it down the middle (depth) of the background pealing breaking of the front "shell/coating" of the background aprox where the silicone was applied. When only the softer foam part of the back ground was left I could jam the screwdriver down behind the silicone and it would break apart. Many hours later it was gone 

Did a full cleaning of the tank and scraped every inch of all the glass with a window scraper (razor). There was some serious white buildup of something on the glass that became apparent when I started to scrape.

Right now I placed some plastic one time food containers with aquasoil and a few shots of some of the plants I will keep for the next scape.

Kept some Tiger Lotus bulbs with some new shots. 
Some staurogyne repens shots.
Some Micranthemum 'Monte Carlo'. The stuff floating will be tossed though.
Also kept my Myriophyllum sp. "Roraima" which I got recently and just has started to take of.
And finally I kept the Eriocaulon breviscapum, not looking to healty though.

The darker roots at the bottom will not be used later on, will be user a lighter wood type for the rescape. Soaking three of them currently, they are some serious floaters.

Finally some pics from yesterday and today


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

Damn it, still no package. Promised me tomorrow, let's see how that works out.
Atleast got my final bags of Aquasoil Amazonia. 

Drained the tank again today and dragged it out from the wall so I could glue on the black background. Some small bubbles but managed to get most of them. Won't bother with it more since it will not be visible later on anyways.
Next update I hopefully will have made some progress on the actual moss-wall


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## patfat (Oct 23, 2015)

Fissure said:


> Damn it, still no package. Promised me tomorrow, let's see how that works out.
> Atleast got my final bags of Aquasoil Amazonia.
> 
> Drained the tank again today and dragged it out from the wall so I could glue on the black background. Some small bubbles but managed to get most of them. Won't bother with it more since it will not be visible later on anyways.
> Next update I hopefully will have made some progress on the actual moss-wall



Any more updates on the project??


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## BettaBettas (Aug 21, 2016)

update?


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

Sorry, wall is finished. Will update the thread as soon as I have some time over !!


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

So finally an update on the Moss-Wall ! Sorry for the long delay, it has been finished and in use for some time now but just haven't had the time to sit down and write this post.

Went ahead with some 10mm pipe for aquarium plumbing use and decided to use the firm mosquito netting, the stretchy one was not firm enough, slacked and when I tried to attach it the mesh holes stretched and became to big for my taste.
Had a couple of hickups on the way and will point them out further down. So will take you through the build using the pics I took during it, more fun than reading a wall of text!


So this is how I started out, built a simple rectangle just to test the sturdiness of the piping. No noticeable sagging when stood up and felt more sturdy then I expected.










Some of the parts I ordered, the gray pipes was a much brighter grey then expected but I though that after I put the mesh over and infront of them it would maybe not be so notable.











Measured out the rectangle to the aquarium size also added a tech area in the middle where pipes, heaters, surface skimmer etc could be hidden from sight.











Added some vertical pipes to the left and right for further stability and easier attachment of the net.











Started measuring out the netting and ways to attach it. Superglue on the backside of the frame was the easiest solution. Also added a small "handlebar" on one of the vertical bars. Thought with this was to have an attaching point for driftwood. Looked ugly and was removed later on as I worked on the wall.











Sideview of the netting. Was really easy to work with when attaching using small dabs of superglue. Was a little bit of hassle to get it straight though. Had a tendency to "wander" and be missaligned in the ends. 











First mayor setback was when I was gonna place the above frame down for testing and I realized I had forgot all about my two tank braces.............. So there was no way in hell it was going down into the tank. Raged a bit and back to the drawing board. Decided to make two cuts on each side on the wall and insert a piece of a pen shell (!) into the pipe. This made it so I could fold the two cut off sides and then just push it together when in the tank, doing this vertically across the depth of the tank I could still keep the snug and exact fit to length of the tank. Had to tear off all the netting once again and cut a new piece to fit this design. No glues points near the fold points to give the two sides more "moveability". When I got it into the tank It worked but I realized that the grey color of the pipes would not be hidden enough so I took the hard decision to once again
tear of the netting and glue some layers of the netting on the parts of the frame that were to be submerged.
At this point I also decided to grab my dremel and cut the old filterbox for the Juwel tank, wanted the meshed part for the skimmer at the top and the netting would not hide the equipment enough for my liking. Ended up really well, some loctite there as well to keep it in place (not sure what one would to without loctite?) 











Frame submersible parts "dressed" with netting, did not cover the top of the frame since it will be above the surface at all times.











Netted again and took out a hole after some precise measuring for the filter outlets.











After some serious gluing I finally got it down into the tank. Fit really well and stands really firm without attaching it to something.











Plants for attaching on the wall, took some various mosses to try out and plant in different areas on the net.
Decided against Java moss due to its invasive growing, it is forever banned from my tanks ! 
Moss interesting was the fontinalis and the coral moss. Some other rhizome plants in the bags as well for roots I plan to add to the wall. Can add all the plants I used if anyone is interested.











When I was to remove the wall for planting I realized I had to do something about the intakes and outflows from the filter so I cut out some square holes in the tank frame for them to slide in to. A big plus so I can actually close the back lid! 











Wall removed and started to attach the moss to the wall, here I unfortunately got into "the zone" and forgot to take pics for extended periods. Here I already cut and fixed the driftwood and attached it to the wall using steel wire for outdoor use covered with green plastic.
Started attaching the fontinalis, my initial plan was to "thread" the moss through the net but I had been at it for 9 hours and my patience was exhausted. So I glued it with small amounts of superglue instead. Went much faster but I spent another 5(!) hours planting mosses on the net.











Attaching some moss to the wood.











Left side area for spiky moss (same on the right side) to its right fontinalis. Above and below that some weeping moss.











Unfortunately the planting was so time consuming I forgot to take any more pics of the progress. Did not realize this until I was finished and the wall was in the tank. Took a final pic of the wall installed. Here you can see the moss zones and various plants attached to the driftwood.










*Plants list and status*
Anubias 'Petite' - Growing with some algae issues
Azolla filiculoides - "Deadish"
Bolbitis heudelotii - Dead
Bucephalandra 'Wavy Green' - Growing with some algae issues
Fontinalis antipyretica - Dead apart for some stragglers
Hydrocotyle tripartita - Growing and healthy 
Riccardia chamedryfolia - Covered with algae 
Taxiphyllum 'Spiky' - Growing and looking healthy 
Vesicularia ferriei 'Weeping' - Almost all dead or overtake by algae


Today I did some cleaning of the wall and replanting planned on taking some pics but started measuring light levels instead. And the water was a bit hazy anyway after the maintenance so visibilty would not be the best. Will take some pics tomorrow after lights on before I go to work to give you and updated view.

There has been some issues with the wall. Most of the Weeping moss has died off, not sure why maybe it could not handle the glow. Same goes for the fontinalis, just some stragglers that took rest fell of or died. The riccardia is trying but covered in algae, most likely since I planted it on roots to close to the surface and light. The spiky moss has filled out really nice and covers the areas planned. Not sure what to do with the bare areas, if I should try the same species again and hope for the best or try something else. But all in all I am pleased and it is starting to look really nice.
I am starting to realize it will be a high maintenance thing though. Keeping the mosses trimmed, and trimming mosses is a pain since you end up with moss pieces everywhere.

I am planning a new scape in the tank so there is currently no substrate and just some plastic lunch boxes with some plants I am going to keep in them (my Pelvicachromis pulcher pair really likes placing their eggs and fry in the boxes  ) 
Not sure if this is contributing with the growth issues on some of species. Maybe the tank balance is totally off from it, not sure... Irritating when plants die off so fast, some of them are kinda expensive.

Well that's it for now, will update with more pics as soon as I can and as usual thanks for reading and feel free to ask questions !


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## Bananableps (Nov 6, 2013)

This is a very cool project.


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## talontsiawd (Oct 19, 2008)

Awesome project with the wood. I thought it was going to be a regular, flat one (which I still really want to try) but that looks really great. Please post pictures of how you let it grow out and maintain it.


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## klibs (May 1, 2014)

Will be awesome...


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

talontsiawd said:


> Awesome project with the wood. I thought it was going to be a regular, flat one (which I still really want to try) but that looks really great. Please post pictures of how you let it grow out and maintain it.


I will, have taken some pics today will edit them and post the update on the wall. Has been growing quite a bit since it was started (some of the mosses atleast)


klibs said:


> Will be awesome...


Lol yeah it will take some time before this one is all grown in for sure


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## IntotheWRX (May 13, 2016)

Fissure said:


> So finally an update on the Moss-Wall ! Sorry for the long delay, it has been finished and in use for some time now but just haven't had the time to sit down and write this post.
> 
> Went ahead with some 10mm pipe for aquarium plumbing use and decided to use the firm mosquito netting, the stretchy one was not firm enough, slacked and when I tried to attach it the mesh holes stretched and became to big for my taste.
> Had a couple of hickups on the way and will point them out further down. So will take you through the build using the pics I took during it, more fun than reading a wall of text!
> ...


sick idea. def pushing the edge of aquascaping art. love to see this grow in.


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

So going to post some pics here of the initial layout of plants and mosses and then how it looks today and then going to write some about current issues and how the maintanence has been so far. 

Here is the picture I took after I finished the moss wall (has been posted here before). Has crudely hand drawn the areas in different colors where the bigger plant groups are. There are some smaller details that I planted after hearth as I finished it to give a more "wild" look. Has left those areas out since there would be to many zones/numbers to be able to see make anything out of the picture.










1.(RED) - Taxiphyllum sp. "Spiky Moss"
2.(BLUE) - Vesicularia ferriei 'Weeping Moss'
Yellow"]3.(YELLOW) - [/COLOR]Fontinalis antipyretica
4.(ORANGE) - Anubias nana "Pinto" / Anubias "Petite"
5.(MAGENTA) - Bucephalandra "Wavy Green" / Riccardia Chamedryfolia / Crepidomanes cf. Malabaricum
6.(CYAN) - Bolbitis heteroclita "difformis" (Mini bolbitis)



Here is a pic I took when I rescaped my tank a week ago now with several problem areas marked.










1. - This area was planted with Spiky moss but I think I did not plant it dense enough there to counter the slower growth/die off caused by lower light levels. Pretty easy problem to fix as I only have to take some off the excess growth from other areas and replant areas that need more at WC day etc.

2. - This area was planted with Fontinalis both on the background and creeping around the wood pieces. Unfortunately almost all of it has died, there is a few stragglers that look healthy and growing but we are talking like two or three pieces. Not sure what to do with this areas yet, maybe try it again or try a different moss. I have no prior experience growing Fontinalis so I have no personal reference on how and on what it likes to grow. I suspect it might have something to do with the cyano glue, some moss species seem to take a rather hard hit from it as other do not.

3. - Here was weeping moss planted and same as with the Fontinalis here pretty much. Died almost right away and turned all white, probably from the glue. Maybe would have worked better with the gel variant of cyano glue instead. Used a liquid variant of loc-tites glue when I first made the wall. Not until the end of the build did I get to use some of the gel type (when the loc-tite ran out) and noticed how much simpler it was to use. Might react the same way from gel type though since it should be the same stuff...

4. - These areas I did not plant enough or not at all, thought the substrate would reach that level but it did not. Nothing that bothers you now when the hardscape are in place and it is planted though. Just some small gaps that I will fill out with excess moss cuttings later on.

5. - The wood in this area was planted with some mini Bolbitis plants, these turned black after a week or two and died off. There is one though that survived and is growing nicely currently, hopefully this will be enough to take cuttings from and fill out that area as time goes. Might fill out other areas with this as well as I love the green coloration and leaf structure of this plant.

6. - The wood around these numbers (and some other locations) was planted with coral moss and Malabar Filmy Fern. Most if this also turned black within a week or two and has died. There is some areas where it is still alive and growing slowly but not having much hope for those plants. Real shame since I think these plants would add a really cool and living look to the wood. Might order home some more and try it again though. No reason to give up on the first try right? 


Other than that there has been some issues with the anubias and buces during the first month, leaf necrosis and algae issues. I am guessing this (and possibly some of the issues mentioned above) has been due to either glue issues or that the tank was ran empty after the moss wall was finished. Took a while to make up my mind regarding the new scape, finding plants and ofc time. Saved some plants I planned to use that I planted in aquasoil in plastic boxes. Neved had issues with the plants before and grew perfectly, but after this change the cutting just got tons of algae and lots of leaf health issues. Had to throw it all away after a month due to it's bad state of health.
It has only been a week since I rescaped the tank and algae issues on the moss-wall plants has pretty much all of it disappeared, actually noticed it after just three days. Back to regular dosing regimes and more even flow and co2 distribution seemed to have helped quite a bit. Maybe if I timed the moss wall better with the rescape more of the mosses and plants would have survived?



Feel free to ask any questions and/or come with suggestions for plants or whatever on how I could continue to evolve the project.


Will end with a pic from today, unfortunately the water is not clear yet.










Changes from the last update is that some of the Weeping moss areas that were barren to the right and center has been planted with Pilotrichaceae sp. - "Pilo moss". So far it is alive but not looking like it is taking very well, hopefully it will make it and start to grow, pretty neat looking moss.
Also added some "Hydrocotyle cf. tripartita" strands to the center and top right, growing crazy as usual and I just love how it creeps around everywhere and pops out it's light green clover like leaves everywhere. Love some of those "how the hell did it get here" plants 

Thanks for reading !


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## LRJ (Jul 31, 2014)

Looking great. Can't wait to see how this progresses over time.


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## KayakJimW (Aug 12, 2016)

Wow! That's awesome. Man, way to have a vision and see it through! This is one of those tanks where I just zone out looking around and 10 minutes goes by...


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## fietsenrex (Oct 8, 2014)

KayakJimW said:


> Wow! That's awesome. Man, way to have a vision and see it through! This is one of those tanks where I just zone out looking around and 10 minutes goes by...


LOL just noticed an hour has passed xD


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## monkeyruler90 (Apr 13, 2008)

hey, how's the wall doing?


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## BettaBettas (Aug 21, 2016)

wow..


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## Hagis30 (Jan 20, 2017)

Do you have any updates on the wall?


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

Sorry for the lack of updates, have not had time or energy to maintain the mosswall due to work. It is for the most part still looking really nice and grown in. But the weeping moss was a bad choice, it grows like a pine tree and instead of attaching it gets lifted up by air collecting under the moss from other plants pearling and blocks all light downwords on the moss wall. Have been replacing it with other mosses partially but will continue to do so when it calms down at work. Should do so after this week or the next. Will try to take some pictures atleast.
It seems to be shrimp heaven though, the ten jade green shrimps I added to the tank have multiplied and mini shrimps can be seen everywhere foraging on the mosswall.


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## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Holy smokes! This is neato! Finally a thread I can direct all the moss carpet folks to. Wish I had seen this earlier.


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## Brian Rodgers (Oct 15, 2016)

Dang nice build. Fantastic idea too. I would have never thought of that. Thank you and everyone on this forum for letting us newbies have projects we can aspire to.


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## LadyHawk (Jan 25, 2017)

This is fantastic! I attempted a moss wall a few years ago and it was a hot mess! Thank you for sharing this - I may try making one again with your template. I've always hated the options for backgrounds, but I LOVE this idea!


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

Hi everyone, has been quite a while since my last update.
Have been quite busy and the tank has just gotten the needed maintenance, but everything back to normal now again so time to spend some more time tanking? 

The mosswall has been doing so-so to be honest, there was some nice growth with the mosses but the usual happened (usual for me) and the moss started to die of in the back of the carpets and eventually came loose. Did not attach to the net as much as I hoped. So had to drag it all down and instead tried pushing it down behind the wall for it to grow out through the mesh towards the light. First started with the left side and it turned out really well so I did it on the right side just under two weeks ago. Will make it easier to prune the moss without detaching it. 
Right side is starting to push through the mesh now but it is quite empty there currently as far as mosses go. 

Also has been battling some serious BBA outbreaks (that [censored][censored][censored][censored][censored][censored][censored] crap). So one week ago I decided to make a real tear down. Pulled almost all plants out and cut all effected leaves, tidied up the tank and fitted the intakes with two eheim filter boxes I had lying around and moved it into the tech area behind the moss wall. This actually seem to have improved the circulation through the moss wall as I can visually see small particles sucked through the mesh/moss behind the wall. 1 day after the teardown the intake connections started sucking air and I wondered what the hell was going on. Turned out the filterboxes both got totally clogged up over night, so their new placement seem to have worked out nicely. Tank looks cleaner overall.

The past week the BBA has been starting to disappear a bit on wood, rock and some of the anubias I did not clean. There still is some amount of it left on the dwarf hairgrass in the front. The grass could use a good trimming but afraid to have another BBA outbreak on the cut straws again. And there are to many shrimplets in there to not cause a massacre with a scissor. 

Think I mentioned earlier that I added ten beautiful green jade shrimp on a whim a while back to get a colony going. They have now totally exploded. There are green jade shrimp in the sizes from 1mm to 2 cm friggin everywhere. Did a fast count and stopped at 100. So that is kinda fun 

Will end it with a pic from today. 

Thanks for reading !


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## BettaBettas (Aug 21, 2016)

Looks very very awesome, great job


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## huhu89151734 (Jun 29, 2010)

To solve your Moss wall issue. You really do need to keep trimming the moss to keep them thin. Otherwise as time goes by, the bottom layer of moss won't get any light will start dying. And then the whole thing float.


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## Clancy (Oct 6, 2017)

Totally cool! Of all the mosses you have tried, which one seems to adhere to the mesh the best over time?


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## Fissure (Jun 29, 2014)

Clancy said:


> Totally cool! Of all the mosses you have tried, which one seems to adhere to the mesh the best over time?


I would probably say HC Cuba 

But when it comes to real mosses Weeping moss is the one that stays on the longest. But doing a "single sheet" moss wall clearly is not the best option. 
If I am doing it over I would chose a small mesh back sheet and a little larger mesh front sheet and keeping it pruned very frequently. Downside with this as always with mosses is that you get moss everywhere else in the tank and you really never get rid of it


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## JAMarlow (Jan 16, 2018)

Wow, this is just beautiful. Thanks for uploading the pictures so the rest of us could admire it!


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## ranjib (Jan 19, 2018)

Gorgeous :0)


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