# 50G with 30G sump - month 10 update



## jbreyy (Jul 8, 2012)

CO2 isn't really a complication. A DIY system takes about ten minutes to build, and only 2 minutes once ever 2 weeks to refill. It's really really worth the "effort". And it's probably the cheapest tank investment you will make.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Hm, I thought that CO2 encouraged growth, and thus increases maintenance (trimming, etc)?


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## jbreyy (Jul 8, 2012)

CO2 does encourage growth, and without it some plants just won't grow at all!! They will die and melt away. You'd have to pick all really easy plants, and expect them to grow really slow without CO2


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Yeap, that's pretty much what I was planning.  This is a first tank, after all, so no point in getting 'hard to keep' plants & animals.

If this tank goes well, I will be looking into turning the 30G into a sump for a 100+ gallon tank, and then I would use a CO2 system (with proper overflow to eliminate off-gassing, of course).

Thanks for the input, though, appreciated!


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Well, quick update. I've picked up all the bits and pieces my friend was giving me, and wow...this will take all weekend just to inventory. Pretty much everything you could want to run salt and fresh water tanks.

On the soil front, I've started the rinse process (some pics to follow). Questions to post in the substrate forum.

The blasting grit is a no-go - two different shops, one promising Black Diamond, one promising Black Beauty, both supply something made locally out of nickel slag - pretty sure that is toxic to any living thing out there, nevermind fish. So to avoid wasting more time hunting this stuff down, we're just biting the bullet and ordering some Fluorite Black or something. Anyways, I have a $12 toxic (and 88lb) lesson sitting in my garage: Ask questions, even if you feel you're inconveniencing people!


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

After a lengthy thread in the Equipment forum, back to posting here.

The budget has taken a beating, but we're still pretty much on-track. Just ordered the diamond hole-saws, bulkheads, loc-line for the returns, and black Flourite gravel.

Also, I picked up a 50G the other day off Kijiji, so now we're doing that as the display, and the 30G is the sump. More info tomorrow.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Sump design has been finalized - initial drainage onto coarse filter media (this will be periodically removed for cleaning), and then flowing onto 2-3 trays (egg-crating) of pot scrubbies. Water then flows under/over a set of baffles and into the pump/heater area for return to the display tank. Hopefully 20 gallons contained in the sump.

Tank overflow design is still coast-to-coast, although I may leave 3" on either end to avoid having the returns punching through. Have to see what glass costs before I make that call.

We ran our driftwood through the dishwasher yesterday, looks nice and clean. My wife will be putting it together into a nice display piece, moss and anubias will be tied to it.

After meeting the some local aquarium enthusiasts (http://www.dras.ca) the other day, they suggested that I speak to the owner of 'Menagerie', an LFS with a good reputation for plants. Will be calling him this week.

I had really hoped to get some Black Diamond blasting grit, but everyone around here uses a local company's stuff that is made from nickel slag. Since nickel slag dust is poisonous to humans, I can only assume it'll kill fish/plants, too. I will post a quick question in the substrate forum to confirm.

Finally, today will be the first full day of sun on the MTS (I unfolded the tarp and spread it out before work), so hopefully its dry and ready for a re-soaking.

Pictures will go up later.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Here's the link to the Equipment thread, for future reference: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=185703

Plumbing documentation/thought process here: http://wiki.practicaltech.ca/index.php/Aquarium_plumbing

Other aquarium notes here: http://wiki.practicaltech.ca/index.php/Aquarium


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Pics!

The new display tank, 50G, 36x18x18.









The sump, 30G, 36x18x12:









MTS process...

































Plexiglas egg-crate ledging & baffles cut.

















Driftwood cleansing.


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## Jmlampert23 (Jul 25, 2012)

Did putting the driftwood in the dish washer work? i just got a piece in the mail that i bought on ebay and want to give it a through cleaning and i was thinking the dishwasher. I was also thinking that it might help leach out the tannins. how did it work?


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

I ran them through without soap, of course, on the 'pot scrubber' setting AND the dry cycle. They turned out fine, I think. No clue how they'll do in water yet - no tank to put them in. I may dump them in the tank for the duration of leak testing - that should bring out any tannins that are left. Prior to the wash they sat in a tank of water for ~1.5 weeks.

Got the idea here: http://gwapa.org/wordpress/2009/01/january-2009-meeting/#more-366

Summarized: 
* Find some in a fast-moving stream
* If not from stream, soak in outdoor pond for a few months to remove tannins and waterlog the wood
* Always use dead wood
* Hardwoods only, nothing you can dent with a fingernail
* No pine/red cedar - toxic


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## Jmlampert23 (Jul 25, 2012)

i think my piece of wood is going to take a bath in the dish washer tonight


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

MTS dried out, so re-soaked it and spread it around. Probably keep this up all week and it should be ready for the weekend.

Picked up the egg-crate, silicon, and some of the pipe fittings tonight. I managed to find the unions, but no 'sanitary-tees' in 1" - guessing that's not a standard so not available. This was after three different hardware stores - Lowe's, Home Depot, and Home Hardware (Lowe's had the best selection by far).

I think I'm going to have to up the size to 1.5" as I saw a lot of options for that. There is a Rona near my train station, so will drop by tomorrow after work in a last-ditch attempt. If nothing else, at least I now have a better drainage system (even if it's bottle-necked by the 1" bulkheads).

If I can find 1" 'wye-tee' fittings, then no need to get 1.5". If not...

Pipe shopping list:

 3x 90-degree elbow (1" end fits into bulkhead, 1.25" intake)
 3x 1.5"->1" slip bushing (adapter to go from bulkhead 1" to drain 1.5")
 3x 1.5" sanitary tee (wye-tee eliminates waterfall effect)
 1x 12-18" of 1" PVC (bulkhead inside spacer)
 1x 10' of 1.5" PVC (drains)
 3x 1.5" adapter - slip to male threaded
 3x 1.5" threaded cap
 1x 1.5" true-union ball valve (dual union)
 2x 3/4" 'ball-style' check-valve (returns, non-spring)
 1x 10' of 3/4" PVC (returns)
 2x 3/4" threaded to slip adapter (pump connections)
 4x 3/4" 45-degree elbow (return out of sump)
 2x 3/4" 90-degree elbow (return enters tank)
 1/4" tube x 3/8" NPT fitting
 PVC glue/cleaner

Great plumbing intro from FishGuyTV: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=309UQpgXo8Q&feature=g-vrec

And another good plumbing/sump video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOkK2Zzvagk&feature=related


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

The MTS is coming along nicely...I think...the amount of dirt seems to be shrinking, seems kinda odd.

Ordered my plumbing bits from http://www.flexpvc.com, shipping was a bit much, but its saved me the time/hassle/driving of going to random stores looking/begging for parts.

On top of the stuff mentioned before (thanks to great prices), I got unions for the drains, two ball valves for the drains, ball valves for the returns, and ball check valves for the returns as well. The 'ball style' check valves were definitely not available locally. Also managed to snag some nice red 1/4" tubing and the 'street' 90-degree pieces that were also not available locally.

I do understand that BeanAnimal's page uses 1" bulkheads because that's all he had available, but I'd already ordered the 1" bulkheads when I discovered that 1" PVC has no local supply. Anyway, handy that I can just make a direct shopping list from his page now.

That site also has 'freebies' for different order values. I spent more than $50, so got 520' of 1" teflon tape for free. Cool.

Back to Lowe's tonight to return the pipe fittings and pick up the PVC glue/cleaner.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Returns made to Lowe's, and the stuff from Pets and Ponds got here already!

Bulkheads, gravel, and loc-line pieces. The loc-line, handily enough, fit my two pumps' outlets, so they are now pushing water around in the 50G so I can get a feel for how much power I'm dealing with. Thus far, quite turbulent in there...the losses from pushing up the return piping should give me just what I need.

Apologies for the poor pictures - BlackBerry was all I had.

*Kill-a-watt measuring 91-92 watts with both pumps in operation.*









*Side-by-side comparison of the 50G and 30G tanks.*









*The pump with attached loc-line.*









*Blurry picture of the surface movement.*


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Cleaned the 30G and 20G today with vinegar and water. Taped the tank for baffle attachment. Learned a few things.

1. Just because the bottle says 'Silicone I' doesn't mean it's clear. Protip: When it's labelled 'white', it is indeed white.
2. Mask off the baffle, too.
3. Wear a breather - fumes are nasty.
4. Dry-fit everything first. Obvious, but easy to overlook.
5. Use a little bit of silicon to start, then add extra once things are in place.



















So instead of a 1.5" lower opening, I now have a 3/4" lower opening because I assumed I had dry-fit it already. I probably had, but then that was before the measurements were finalized. 

I also got silicon all over the baffle panel itself. All that aside, it should turn out functional - and that's all that matters for this first try. In an hour or two I'll do the secondary baffle panel.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Added in the second baffle, learned another lesson: Don't mask somewhere that won't be accessible after gluing. _Protip_.

*Second baffle tank masking:*









*Second baffle masked:*









*View of the baffle from the outside:*









*Second baffle in place:*










Had a family outing to the local shops, came home with... 

*22 packs of scrubbies (132 total):*









*Cut the trays:*









*And glued the tray rests/ledges:*



















Tomorrow I'll remove all the masking, place the scrubbies and trays, and start work on the sump stand. Will also drain the 50G and give it a good cleaning/rinsing, and start work on the drill press stand so I'm not drilling these holes by hand.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Yay!










What I learned:
1. I might need more pot scrubbies.
2. I definitely need to add center supports and then cut the eggcrate trays into halves - impossible to fit inside the tank.
Edit: 3. Change order so that pattern is symmetrical.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Had some more thoughts on the train in this morning.

* The warnings about silicone/glass/acrylic bonding don't seem to apply - the stuff I'm using seems very sturdy. Maybe due to using 3/8 plexi?
* Call glass shops for quotes on covers - 36x12 and 36x18
* Rain is preventing MTS drying and no room in the garage! Clean/re-organize the garage.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Cool, glass shop right near me gave a pretty good quote - $11 per piece @ 36x4" (1/4" thick). I won't do lids for now - almost $75 after taxes to get the overflow box and lids cut. They also have a week waiting period, so better get those measurements hammered out tonight.

So, timelines...


Aug 10-11 - Finish sump framework/details, clean 50G, start sump stand, work on MTS
Aug 12-18 - Get overflow glass cut, install overflow box?, drill tank?, finish MTS, finish sump stand
Aug 19-25 - Sump/overflow plumbing install, plumbing live testing
Aug 26-Sept 1 - Move setup into final spot, place MTS&gravel, buy/plant plants
Sept 2-20 - Tank cycling
Sept 21-22 - Add Red Cherry shrimp
Mid-Oct - Add school of Neon Tetras


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Sump is pretty much done - just the coarse filter tray to silicone together. I managed to get all the tape out, thanks to a pair of 'remote fingers'. The trays are cut in half and midsection supports siliconed in.

Also washed and scrubbed the 50G, so that's out of the way. 

It's still raining, so the MTS will have to wait. I did get some more of the garage cleaned up, but not enough to move the tarp inside.

*Things I learned tonight:*

Use a low bench to work on tanks - saves your back and shoulders.
When cutting plexi sheets, keep your table saw blade low to avoid chip-out.
You can cut eggcrate on a table saw (low blade height).
The pumps I'm using move a LOT of water.

*Trays cut in half:*









*New middle supports (twice the width of end supports):*









*Some things I'd do differently next time:*

Use a router table to dress the edges of the plexi tray rests (or sander).
Use some solid guides to keep the silicone edging neat - very hard to trim once inside the tank.
Leave a little more room for the pumps.

I think both pumps could completely empty the 50-gallon tank in less than 3 minutes, so the return chamber that houses the pumps could empty in 30-45 seconds if a blockage occurs.

So, another addition to this project will be a float switch to turn the pumps off should a major blockage occur. Following that line of thought, maybe it won't be an issue due to the sheer volume the overflow can deal with. Testing in the garage will be my gauge.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Let's start with a word from our sponsors...Dollar store pot scrubbies..._now with more floatation power!!_

Seriously. Did not see this coming.









After my initial disappointment, I got a good laugh out of it...looks so ridiculous...like a child's bathtub or something. _Scrubbies will be freeeeee!_

Pretty sure I'll end up with some sort of drip-tray arrangement, but more on that later.

Sump stand reinforcement build
Always use the clamps...measure twice, cut once, blah blah. Makita's impact driver is pretty awesome...after years of not having one, will never go back. I wasn't super picky about the hole placement on the sides (within 0.5"), but it won't ever be visible, so not a big deal to me. I did, however, countersink nice and clean...gotta have some standards!  Just used the table saw and mitre guide to cut the wood. Two 2x6 for the center (attached through the center chipboard divider) and one 2x4 on each corner. It's only for the 30-gallon tank, so probably quite overbuilt. All of the wood was leftover from other projects.

If I can make one critical recommendation to newbie woodworkers - buy clamps, even cheap junk like the ones pictured (Jobmate) will work great. As a matter of fact, even though I have higher quality/strength clamps, these get used 95% of the time because they are light, 'quick clamping', and I don't care what happens to them. For the not-so-newbie woodworkers, if you don't already troll Craigslist and Kijiji for garage sales with clamps/tools...well, the more for me, I suppose.


























Trays finished
I fixed the one tray where a few edge pieces got yanked off by super-gluing some plexiglas. Then I siliconed the vertical divider in place, roughly 6x12" area for coarse filters and the drain lines.










Sump finishing details
Installed the pumps and tied the cables together, used some suction cup cable clamps to keep it tidy. I am sure that zip-tying the pumps together will come back to bite me, but too many hours spent cabling car audio systems and computer cases have taken their toll on me. _IASCA_ standards, indeed.


















MTS is still on hold
Rain, rain, go away, come again some other day...well, actually, the farmers are probably pretty happy, so I can wait.










Back to the comedy
Pictures, then my thoughts on how to fix it.


























You can (sort of) see the flow rate in that first picture...I don't have any way of doing video, so you'll have to use your imagination. It's quite good - that 0.75" spacing on the first baffle is tons. The second picture is again, funny. Trust me. Third picture has highlighting (thank you Windows 7 snip tool) around the water level pre- and post-baffle. About 0.125" difference thanks to the input of the two pumps, but after 10-15 minutes it had not changed at all. Definitely no need to add in a water level cut-off, I think.

The fix
The DIY wet-dry filter has input at the top, then a mechanical filtration tray with lots of holes - enough to flow the water, but not so much as to immediately drain the tray. Those holes function as a shower-head, raining water down onto the biological filter media - you end up with excellent aeration of the water and thus happy, healthy bacteria. 


I believe I'll have to add a removable plexi tray with the appropriate amount of holes drilled in it that will sit exactly at the top level of the top layer of pot scrubbies (preventing _the float_). It is unfortunate that I have to buy MORE of those things, as they are almost out of stock at the local Dollarama. 
Also too bad that I have to buy some plexiglas...that stuff is expensive. Maybe there is a tray or something similarly flat I can salvage. I don't think this top tray has to be super strong, and I can add plexi ribs to prevent bowing.
Finally, the topmost tray will have more substantial 'tray rests' - these will be threaded for some sort of wing-nut or thumb-screw.

*Material to source:*

Pot scrubbies (4 more packs)
Plexi/plastic tray/lid thingie
Appropriately-sized coarse filter pad - ??


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Quick update. Spent pretty much all day (outside of church) cleaning the garage and building my wife a shelf/stand thingy for her flower pots. Looks pretty good, considering how 'recycled' the wood was. I also rinsed the gravel as best I could before my back said 'no more'. Can't believe how much dust is in that stuff (Flourite Black gravel).

I will try and get out to pick up that plexiglas today...definitely going to have to reach into my welder savings now. Dag. Hm, maybe I'll take one more stab at an easy fix.

Here's a clearer view of the pump flow rate. It's also fun to watch the little waterfall.


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## iano7000 (Apr 21, 2012)

This might be a stupid idea, but do the scrunchies have enough buoyancy to float the trays? That way you could put the tray under the glass ledge, and the scrunches below them. The scrunches would then push the trays up into the glass stops. Just a thought.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

That's not a stupid idea, but my only concern would be them losing buoyancy over time due to whatever reason. The drip tray idea will actually be beneficial to this project, so might as well go that route.

Some pictures of how I'm cutting the plexiglas, if anyone had wondered.

*40-tooth blade on the table saw, pushing through with the mitre gauge.*









*Sacrificial DIY-clamp for pieces that get my fingers a little too close to the blade.*









*Nice clean cuts all around by keeping the blade low (height = 2x thickness of material).*









I also ordered the glass yesterday, ready on Wednesday! Ended up going with the full-length 'coast-to-coast' overflow box - I can drill through if necessary for the returns.


What I'm currently pondering is what is plastic but also threaded, and cheaply/easily available...? I had thought maybe something like those clear curtain rods, but they might not deal with torsional forces involved with threading. The other end of this would be stainless steel, but that's probably more cost than I'm prepared to pay.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Cool! Plastic thumbscrew issue resolved.

*Found some old ear plugs from my rockband days.*









*Threading the plastic pieces.*









*Test fitment - perfect!*










I started threading with oil, but quickly turned out that I did not need it - I tapped the clear plexi with no oil at all. I think I will try the next one with the drill press so as to make the threads perfectly vertical. The ear plug rod was cut with tin snips, not a super clean cut, but good enough for my purposes.

I will make the head portion of the thumbscrew out of two squares of plexiglas with rounded corners. If I had the stuff to do it, some plexi dowel, drilled and knurled, would be ideal.

Anyway, busy week coming up, will progress as time allows. Super happy with the threading results!


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Picking the glass up tonight - the two pieces came to $17.11, not bad!

Took a look around for knurling tools...very expensive/hard to find. I think I'll move more in a 'hex-head' thumbscrew for a few reasons. _First_, completely round would mean zero-grip if any kind of algae or film formed on the surface. _Second_, knurling or a slot pattern would fill with aforementioned algae/film and require occasional cleaning. _Third_, a hex shape gives enough grip without looking ridiculous, and is relatively easy to make.

I plan to leave a 'shoulder' on the threaded rod portion to fit snugly into the drip tray itself. The top end of the shoulder will then be cemented (E-6000 adhesive) into the 'top/nut' plexi piece.

Next tasks:

Finish MTS process. (let dry out; first round mesh sift; second mesh sift; store in tub)
Install overflow box. (prepare jig; measure/mark; initial silicone; glass placement; final silicone; tape)
Mark out drill points on 50G. (measure/mark)
Fabricate drip plate thumbscrews. (thread plastic pieces; cut top portions; assemble)
Fabricate drip plate. (trim/drill/tap drip plate rests; measure/mark/cut drip plate; measure/mark/drill press drip holes; test; enlarge if necessary)

*Drip plate*
For the drip tray hole sizing, I will start at 1/16" and test. Once the initial holes have been drilled on the drill press, I can re-size them using the hand driver quickly enough. I think the idea is to have as many holes as possible while keeping enough standing water to allow the drip tray to 'drip' from every hole. I am sure there is fancy maths that can be done to calculate the exact hole size off the bat, but I didn't do that well at math (probably for lack of trying) and this is DIY, not mass production. If it takes 1-2 re-sizings, that's fine. Probably less extra time involved than the calculations. 

*Overflow box*
I had thought about installing the overflow box right away (more time to cure, good visual prior to drilling), but decided against it - too much could go wrong. Also, I might discover that the 5" depth I've specified is too deep and need the glass re-cut to fit. Finally, if I have to drill for the returns, much easier to do that out of the tank.

Edit: This guy has a great overview of his BeanAnimal/coast-to-coast system: http://www.glassreef.com/basics_index.htm


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Again, apologies for the fuzzy pictures...it's the best RIM can do. Later on I'll take some time to do nice shots with the Canon and tripod.

Updates
*Glass*
The overflow glass is about 1/8" too short, but I think after a liberal dose of silicone things should hold up fine. 

*Drip tray*
The tray rests were cut, tapped, and siliconed in place last night. I am not super happy with the end result - the curves I cut on the band saw are not symmetrical, the holes are not symmetrically spaced - but since I have so little time, and this will be hidden, we'll go with it. Functionality won't be impaired, just aesthetics.

As you can see, all the threaded portions are done, just have to cut the hex heads and adhere them in place.


























*Driftwood/rock design v1:*
My wife started work on the driftwood and rocks last night while I worked on the drip tray. I am liking how the driftwood fits together, but the rocks will need smashing/chipping. Right now the rocks cover ~40% of the soil - I'd like that number to be closer to ~15% to allow for more stem plants. She'll also be trying to integrate some sort of cave/rock bridge thingy to provide shelter for fish should the plants have issues.











Coming up next...

Sump drip tray
Overflow box
Finish MTS

This weekend will be busy, hopefully the sump stuff can be finished up. Another item I forgot about was finding coarse filter media to line the drip tray with. Maybe I'll just forego that and use the filter socks for testing.

Just saw that the PVC parts are out for delivery today!! Sweet.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Awesome, my wife just sent me pics of version 2.



















I think it looks great...the rock footprint is reduced, wood spreads out in a somewhat natural position...yup.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Quick update. 

Cut the drip tray to size, then realized that due to the top trim piece being in the way, it would never fit, so had to cut it in half.

*Chop chop.*









Then I marked (poorly) the intersection points for the holes, chucked my smallest drill bit into the drill press, clamped the two pieces together and drilled away.

*I need more 'small and tiny' clamps...*









*Semi-final result:*










As you can see, I left the wrapping on prior to testing. Why? Because I knew they still needed work, of course! And ya, a lot. The holes need cleaning out for sure - no water got through them. Somewhat surprisingly, the gaps at the edges I assumed would need filling leaked very little water - possibly due to some wacky pressure/hydraulic issues.

I tested by dumping a pail of water on top of the drip tray. Some got in the sump baffle space, raising the sump baffle water past the level of water in the sump drain area.

This caused a lot of air to want to escape the drain area (scrubbie area), only it couldn't because of all the water sitting in the drip tray area!

A lot of very rude noises resulted, along with the drip trays being tossed about like a ship in stormy seas.


...Next up...I re-drill out the holes and test again. Will try and get a picture of the 'burping'.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

The glass measurements are fine, as per this thread: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1982027

Thanks for the input, planBtypeA and Diana.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Update...

Plumbing
It arrived! After the import/brokerage fees ($58), it'll be the last time I order anything via UPS from the US, and I mis-ordered the caps (I had initially looked at the NPT, but ended up adding slip to the cart  ), but that's not a big deal, and I will look harder for a Canadian source next time. It's nice to have it all in one shot, anyway.










MTS
After the screening process (which left me with much shallower fingerprints), I watered down the MTS and - no smell! At all...only the smell of the water. I am calling it done like dinner, and will add the clay when I have a moment. For reference, two bags of soil gave me 2/3 of that storage container.

The screen material is the 'pet-safe' type - I would guess that using metal screening would destroy your hands.

The method for screening was:

Clamp screening to tub
Shovelful of soil
Spread/shake around with hands, pressing into the screen slightly
Be sure to break up clumps by rubbing them between hands
When obvious that remainder is not going through, remove from screen
Repeat process

*The nylon screen material:*









*Post-screening:*









*This was left out of two bags of soil:*









*Kinda like wet concrete (ok, really wet concrete):*









*A little plantedtank love...* 









Sump
*The initial drip flow size:*









*Pumps seem to hold 3-4" of water above the tray.*









*The burping I mentioned lifting the panels:*









*Can you spot the design flaw?*









*Water level below drip tray:*









So, still some work. I am thinking I'll need to remove the drip tray rests and move them. Guessing you can see the issue. Drip tray is at the same height as the baffle overflow, meaning there is no room for 'dripping'. Pretty sure I'll be removing the tray rests, cleaning up the mess, and then re-installing them 1.5" above the baffle height. Won't give me a huge amount of space above for water, but I'll also enlarge the drip holes a bit to give more flow.


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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

jbreyy said:


> CO2 does encourage growth, and without it some plants just won't grow at all!! They will die and melt away. You'd have to pick all really easy plants, and expect them to grow really slow without CO2


 I have to disagree, I wouldn't discourage him from going low tech. I myself grow R macrandra without co2, and ludwigia cuba s repens and s porto vehlo along with other demanding plants. all under water. all without ferts, lots of reds. not too much algae to where it cannot be managed


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## shrimpNewbie (May 6, 2011)

i'd say the flaw is you have the drip plate on the same level as the high point of your baffle, if you can remove your baffel and use a shorter piece of glass to lower the level of water. I love sumps, personally i would have went with filter socks over a drip pan and toss a buck of lava rock in the sump and i mean all over even around the pump, you can put the rock in filter bags if you want but you should be fine just letting it hang loose


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Just pics for now, text in the morning. Long day...

Update: Ok, text added.

*Prep-work:*
Note how I have marked the holes (dry-erase marker) on the cutting face AND the inside. This was definitely handy.


























What did I learn here? Use the plumber's putty for just one hole at a time. Why? *Protip*: if your reservoir is around three hole points, and you turn one of them into an actual hole...it will drain. No kidding.

*Next time I would: *

Make dams around all three to begin with, would limit the mess (and there was a big mess of water/glass dust).
Put the tape on BEFORE I start drilling - for all the holes.
Tape some sort of cup/container underneath the hole to limit the splashing/mess.
Use blue tape to mark out the holes on the drilling surface - the dry-erase marker wiped off like a dry-erase marker.

*Levelling the work surface for an even cut:*
It wasn't perfect, but ended up being good enough.










*Drill press set for ~900RPM*
The belt ended up slipping off mid-way through the first cut - pulleys were too out of line - so I settled for the next pulley up on the drill side.

You can calculate this by taking the motor pulley diameter divided by the spindle pulley diameter, times the motor speed.

1725RPM * (2/4) = ~860RPM (early morning maths...)

I think the second option got me somewhere around 1100RPM, still within spec for drilling glass.


















*Drilling as easy as 1-2-3!*
Ok, this is a lie. Hole#1 took about 1 hour, mainly because I was terrified of breaking the glass. Hole#2 took about 45 minutes, because after 30 mins of little progress I got impatient. Hole#3 took about 45 minutes because that's about as fast as I would cut. The two smaller holes each took about 30-40 minutes.

Very little chip-out on the 1" holes, and moderate chip-out on the 1.25" holes (one had a 0.25" shallow chip), despite the tape. Pretty sure a quality bit would make a difference here. _The lesson is:_ $10 worth of drill bits will do the job, but will take FOREVER and not give you a perfect hole.

I learned how to properly read my drill press depth measurement during this process - it is marked with 1/64 graduations, not 1/16. 


























If they look out of line, it's just an optical illusion. You can trust me on that.










*Drill bit after a few holes:*









*Final product:*
Well, I'd have to say this was a success. The tank is in one piece, cuts are acceptable (covered by bulkheads), and even though the alignment wasn't perfect, things are in spec.

If anyone is attempting to do this with a hand drill...wow...have fun. Maybe smaller holes would not be so bad, or better bits would make a big difference.

Anyway, we can get back to the sump fixin' now. More to come. (oh, and I need to order another 1" bulkhead...oops)


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Whups, bump for text update.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Quick update...
I took a look at the Sumpery, annnd promptly moved on to the shiny.

Some test fitting of the PVC bits, also cut some of the connector pieces required for the drains.

*New items on my list:*

We'll need to drill the overflow box for sure to accommodate the returns - they won't fit as I originally intended. (7/8" bit ordered)
The caps are threaded, not slip, so I will be trying to make a 'gasket' of silicone - making lemonade out of lemons, as it were.
I am indeed out of PVC cement/solvent. 

*What I learned:*

There is just no way to get the piping fully into the fittings. No way, man.
This project is expensive, but we're close now.
I appear to be having an allergic reaction to PVC shavings. Indeed.

*Bulkheads installed:*
A good feeling, this is.


















*BeanAnimal:*
It starts to take shape!! Thankfully the holes I drilled are close enough that shifting the bulkheads around gives me pretty darn close alignment.










*So fresh and so clean...*
I spent 20 minutes cleaning my saw blades with vinegar and a brass brush prior to using. The chop saw blade was so caked in pine sap it could barely cut anything at all - now look at 'er!










*Bits and pieces:*
Like Lego for aquarists. Or something.










*"Threaded" cap:*
I say that with hesitation because I did not have an appropriately-sized tap. I drilled the cap out with a Forstner bit on the drill press (using my drill press vise for the first time whee), then gave it a light thread. Since it was close, I "encouraged" the fitting to move into its new home. Fits like a glove! (if you are curious, this is indeed a John Guest fitting, and same for the red line...the online store I ordered from just happened to have it, so why not...)


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Hole saws shipped today, I'm thinking 7/8" with silicone around it, so if the PVC expands for any reason, there is some play and should not crack the glass. Also need to pick up some female threaded 3/4" fittings for the Loc-Line adapter when I get the PVC cement.

Hm, I should have asked about coarse filters when at Big Al's yesterday.

_Shrimpnewbie_, thanks for the input. It'll be easier to raise the drip tray than replace the baffle, so that's what we'll do.

I will also be gluing a vertical support onto the bottom of the rests - they stick out too far for the silicone to hold them. Simple enough fix.

*This week's to-do list:*

Finish thumbscrews
Adjust drip tray rests & add vertical supports
Cut remainder of PVC for BeanAnimal
Figure out some method of supporting the drain/return pipes
Get jig ready for overflow box installation next week
Mask off overflow box silicone areas

I may just re-cut the drip tray rests while I'm at it - the middle piece needs extending anyways.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

I'm now uncertain about using silicone instead of an actual bulkhead...hm.

Below are some great build threads I'm using as inspiration.

*Example of the 'through' return plumbing I'll be doing:*
http://www.3reef.com/forums/i-made/diy-65-gallon-reef-tank-build-pics-110234.html

*Another BeanAnimal setup, painted piping:*
http://www.3reef.com/forums/show-off-your-fish-tanks/90-gallon-wave-front-build-lot-pictures-86196.html


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Quick update...had a few minutes after picking up the (hopefully) last batch of goodies from the Depot.

*PVC PIPING...ASSEMBLE!*

















Yup, got the heights within 1/16-1/8" or so, pretty happy about that.

*Fitted onto the bulkheads (dry test)*
I realized that there is no turning back once the pipes are glued onto the bulkheads - only way the bulkheads are coming out after that is with lots of cutting!

Not sure how I feel about that.

The valves can both be wide open at the same time...about 1/4" to spare...and having all the unions in line is symmetrically satisfying.

I'm thinking for the slip caps fitting on threaded adapters...a bead of silicone inside the top of the cap should allow it to snug down without ripping the silicone off. Can't hurt to try.

One last note - the weight of the plumbing isn't as stressing as I'd thought it might be - with a support piece below the unions it'll hold up just fine.



















Tomorrow, if time allows, I'll start on the return plumbing - the drill bit for the overflow box returns should arrive mid-next week, so next weekend will be the drilling and assembly of the overflow.

*This week/week-end:*

Finish sump!!!!
Mock up tank/sump for routing of drains
Return plumbing
Make overflow box jig
Mask/prep tank surface for overflow box install

Oh....and install new fuel filter in the Jetta.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

New tray rests, this time with symmetry. Used the belt and disc sanders with clamps to get this result - _much_ better.

*The four outside rests.*
Threaded them all together, then sanded.


















*The two inside rests.*
Made new ones, this time 3" wide.









*All of them glued and taped.*
I gave all the rests vertical supports. Used the blue tape prior to gluing to ensure they stayed where I wanted them post-glue. Glued with E6000.










*Slight fix for the scrubbies.*
Prevents them from floating on their own. I may still need to weigh them down a bit, but they are holding much better now. I used a *lot* of zip ties, but I've had that bag since high school...best $15 I ever spent!



















I have to wait 48 hours for the E6000 to fully cure, then silicone the rests into place. 24 hours, and then test the new drip trays.

*In the mean time I can:*

Source coarse filter foam
Get platform ready for plumbing routing/testing in the garage
Work on the return plumbing
Prep the 50G for the overflow box install
Build the jig for the overflow box install


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Decided to get the return plumbing started. Went with two 45s, as I believe that's better than one 90...not sure by how much. The ball valves probably won't be used, but not a huge penalty to keep them in anyways. The check valves function as unions, so I tried to line them up with the other unions.

Note that the plumbing hanging off the back will be painted matte black.

*Return plumbing dry fit:*

























*New drip tray rests in place:*









*Protip: 'Measure twice, cut once' is analogous to everything.*









I was definitely not thinking right in two ways. First, I should have measured centerpoints for all the drip tray rests from the get-go. Second, should not have measured things on the fly in a rush. At least I know that the silicone cleans up really nicely with a razor.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

We went to a bunch of garage sales today...and wasn't I surprised to see this:

























Yup, mini metal lathe! For $40, I couldn't resist. It'll do just fine for small projects, and for helping me learn lathe basics.

*Back to tank stuff...*
I think the sump is pretty much done except for:

Prep the top for drain pipes/returns
Source the coarse filter
Return hard line plumbing

These are the tops from this tank's life as a 'normal' fish tank.










*Secret weapon - rocks!*
No float for you!


























*Drip trays on the new rests*
I drilled the drip holes out one larger size today, the new rests are working out great. It's now running in a loop, will let it go for a few days, see how the drip holes work out.


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## Big O (Jun 28, 2011)

WOW, F#*k'n amazing! Kudos. Mad skills.
Love it,
big o


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Thanks, but you should give kudos to this forum and the people in it...I'm really just taking bits and pieces of design from others and applying the concepts to my situation. Glad you're enjoying it though! (admit it...it's all the pretty pictures, isn't it?) 

Quick update on the sump testing...went out this morning to take a look. 










Yup, the drip tray area water level is right up to the trim now - twice the level it started at! This is why we test things, folks. 

I turned off the pumps, let it settle, and turned them back on. Within a minute or two the level was right back up to the trim...odd. The drip holes did not look clogged, and were still flowing the same as before. 

Decided to move the pump hoses into a position more resembling what the drains will be doing (vertical flow in the center area of the drip tray), and left things running. Will be out there later on today, so we'll see how it goes.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Protip: Getting clean lines with silicone involves removing the tape while the silicone is WET!!

Things I would do differently next time...

Mask off the overflow glass
Make a fancier jig so that I could pull all the tape at once
Use more silicone so I don't end up with gaps


























































Also, I totally forgot to tape the overflow glass...whups. Guess I'll be razoring the grossness off. I was using the level to ensure that the tank itself was level, and then I could verify that the overflow glass was square.

I moved the glass out of the way, applied a good bead of silicone, and then placed the glass. After I lined it up, made sure it was square, I then used my handy latex gloves to smear the bead so it was smooth and consistent across the whole length.

Would have been a lot nicer if I'd used more silicone and masked off the overflow glass! As it is, I think it'll work fine. Finally, the centrepoint for the return holes in the other piece of overflow glass will be almost exactly in the middle, so that was nice to discover.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

*Protip:* _Definitely_ mask things first, trimming with the blade is not an easy task.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Ok, real quick update. Been busy with life, hopefully more progress this weekend.


Drill bits arrived, so overflow is being finished this week/weekend
Ended up (trial and error) with 1/8" drip holes
Sump is so close...
Plant pickup schedule forthcoming...

I have some pictures, but won't bother posting them, not really informative. I marked out the water lines for the sump after drilling the drip holes out last night (ended up at 1/8"), and checked the levels this morning: All good! Holding about 1.5" of water above the trays, that should work out well. Just that pesky filter to source...

The set of bits arrived for the overflow return through holes, so will drill them tomorrow maybe. I'm hoping to have the overflow assembled before the weekend so I have plenty of time to mock up plumbing.

Finally, we are getting really close to actually having a fish tank, and not just some expensive exercise in fabrication. I will be calling Menagerie back as soon as the plumbing checks out.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Update time...been busy.


*This, ladies and gentlemen, is why you do NOT enter the shop when under the weather:*

















Thankfully the tank itself was undamaged (we'll see how it holds up to a week of live testing), and I think the chips themselves are marginal problems for an internal overflow.

*Drilling the return holes:*
Once again, I made a newbie mistake. The drill bits I ordered were fine...if 3/4" was the OD. Ya. Whups. 

Anyway, all it will cost me (besides the not-useful-at-the-moment drill bits) is another $10 for one more 3/4" bulkhead. Could be worse.

Glass drilled out much faster - not sure if it's due to newer _and_ thinner glass, or what. Took all of 10 minutes to drill, and thanks to drilling into the firmly taped bottom and sacrificial piece of wood, the chipout was minimal, much better than last time.


























*Taped up the overflow glass this time, as well as the interior:*









*The overflow jig:*
I really didn't want to get too fancy, so simple it was! Yes, that is a square clamped to the brace. And yes, it was level. Aside from preventing me taking the tape out, worked great!


























The result:
Apologies...pics are awful.


























*A look at the return 'through' system:*
There will be a bulkhead at each piece of glass.










Now, for another issue that puzzles me...the sump levels are...wacky.


























You can see how the water level where the 'dripping' takes place is now a good 0.5-1.0" higher, and the return area with the pumps is down about 1.0". The drip hole size must be okay though, because that level has not changed a bit since initially settling down.

Weird. I will not draw any conclusions until I get the full system plumbed up and tested for a full week.

I am happy about how well the dry-erase marker works for this task. 

Also...putting more rocks into the sump on the trays when I move everything around.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

It's alive!!!

Okay, but first the painful steps to get there...

*Assembling piping and sump:*

























*Mistake #1*
The tank was not level! This, of course, meant that the weir was only functional along 2/3 of the overflow.











*Returns plumbed...creatively:*
Due to the physical constraints of my test area, I didn't have enough height to properly install the plumbing, so had to be a little creative in how it all fit together.










*Really creative...*
Big Al's doesn't stock 3/4" bulkheads...good ole duct tape to the rescue. Handy indeed.










*Filling the tank:*









*Problem:*
The drains were not working correctly, I guessed, because the level got almost to the point of overflowing the emergency drain.


























Note the 2/3 weir.











So I (thanks to my wife's suggestion) limited the flow from one of the pumps.










A step in the right direction, for the wrong reasons.


















*Solutions:*
First, I 'submerged' the drains, just by adding a coupling that extended the piping to just below the water level. You will note I also have my coarse filter in place. Such a cost...ouch.










Second, I made the 'adjusted' drain completely air-tight (supposed to be in the design anyway). Yes, that is a latex glove zip-tied to the top of the drain.










*New water level:*









*Full weir:*
Forgot to mention...I levelled the tank during all this (well, the stand), so now a nice full weir is present!











*Summary of what I learned:*

The full-siphon drain pipe must be completely air-tight - 100%, not 99%
The tank must be level for the weir to function properly
Duct tape functions as a ghetto bulkhead
A functioning coast-to-coast w. BeanAnimal is totally worth the effort. 

A note on adjusting the full-siphon drain...not sure why people are suggesting gate valves over ball valves, works great as designed. Anyway, if I crack it open one more 'tick', the entire overflow drains in seconds - at this point it's stable and only a dribble is going down the secondary drain.

I tested by unplugging the pumps - overflow drained in seconds, then just the trickle from the duct tape bulkhead coming in. Plugged them back in, and things had stabilized (full siphon) within 30 seconds.

Super excited....we're almost there! More info on next steps to come.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

So, what's left?

*This coming week:*

Let plumbing test run for one week (at least until next weekend).
Find permanent solution to keeping all drains air-tight.
Order bulkhead.
Confirm with Menagerie about plant pick-up.
Contact shrimp people on GTAaquaria, co-ordinate for pick-up.
Double-check list for cycling.

One week at a time...


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## Only One Haze (Nov 10, 2011)

lookin good man! great progress


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Thanks!

I played around with the valve yesterday, my thoughts are that the secondary drain should be accepting enough water to semi-fill the pipe. Why? Anything less tends to crash down the length of the pipe, adding a very small amount of noise.

Also, definitely need to seal up the secondary inside the cap. I am thinking that I'll just use silicone. It should come out with some twisting if necessary, and since this is slip cap -> threaded adapter, no worries of it locking threads up.

I made a shelving unit for our pantry yesterday, so not a lot of progress. Hopefully some more updates by end of day today. Yay Labour day long weekend.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Ha, ok more things I need to pick up:

Ammonia to do fishless cycle
Small packet of fish food
Shrimp food

Not much of an update...just lists being checked off.

*Progress*

Plumbing test is underway.
Will silicone drains tonight.
Bulkhead is arriving tomorrow.
Calling Menagerie tonight.
Contacted Aaron on GTAaquaria, he has plenty of RCS, available when I'm ready.
Cycling requires more shtuff.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Quick update...the silicone on the caps works brilliantly. Still not sure about how I'm going to fix the secondary drain air line in place...one item off the list, one item on the list.

Also confirmed that even if the return bulkheads fail (the ones in the overflow box) and the tank drains below that level, the sump water levels are okay. This should 'in theory' mean that if the ball check-valves stick open, there should be _just_ enough space to accommodate whatever siphons out. I think I might 'arch' the flex line and drill a hole just in case.

One other note on check valves...they rattle...a lot. That is unfortunate. Even more so that I have already glued them in place.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Bulkhead is in, and appears to have a minor leak - I think because the plumbing is not glued-up. More testing prior to the weekend I guess! Hm...tomorrow is Thursday.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

*Bulkhead leak?*
Ok, here's the leak. Hm...I think I'll have to really check this out tomorrow.










*Chip issue*
That chip is coming back to haunt me - letting water into the overflow after the weir has stopped flowing.










*Siphon*
The siphon line for the secondary drain is sort of in the overflow...not sure if that's a real issue - it still functions perfectly (tested and verified).










*Now with less ghetto!*


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Adjusted the return outputs. Higher-output pump is now pushing along the back, and lighter along the front.




















More to come this weekend...


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Ok, list time...

*Tonight*

Drain water from tank and sump
Remove pumps/heater
Clean tank and sump glass (exterior)
Caulk chipped area of overflow (trim Saturday)
Disassemble plumbing (check out that leaky bulkhead) & clean
Fabricate/paint hood

*Saturday*

Trim caulking patch on overflow
Move sump into place
Move tank into place
Check level of tank (ensure weir will be even)
Plumbing dry install, measure, cut
Plumbing glue-up
Fabricate/install brackets to support plumbing
Run power & set up UPSes
Substrate layout (hardscape->MTS->gravel)

*Sunday*

Do water tests
Establish baseline in notebook
Pick up ammonia & dechlorinator/fish food

Jeepers! Lots to do. I need to figure out a solution for a cover/hood - at this point will try and make one (wood & paint) rather than do the glass route - too expensive at this stage. Lots of DIY stuff out there on light hoods that I've seen, so not too difficult.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Wheee! Lots of progress tonight...

*Front view:*
The drains are 99% done (need to glue the bulkhead->drain piece, that's it). The returns are 'dry fit' (one needs a few more parts), and pretty much ready to glue up. Not super happy with how many joints there are, but to be expected with the weird angles and whatnot.










*'Office' view:*
I admittedly see a lot of piping rather than tank...but who says that's bad?  This has come together much better than I had initially imagined, very pleased. My wife is just as pleased, so this is good.











Finished draining/moving the tank/sump
Will clean after all gluing is done
Caulked the chip, will trim tomorrow
Pretty sure we'll go with a piece of glass instead of a hood
Checked the level of the tank - good enough!
UPSes are in place, stuff just needs pluggin' in
Wife is doing hardscape tomorrow
Plumbing is remarkably strong...not certain if it needs a lot of bracing
Plumbing is 90% done
Picking up fish food, ammonia, dechlorinator, and extra piping tomorrow

Will also do the substrate tomorrow night, get some water in there!! Progress!


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

*Teaser pic:*
(The Blackberry camera is truly a pathetic thing, honestly.)











I will post pics tomorrow, but here's a preview list:

Tank plumbing - 100%
Hardscape - 100%
MTS - 100%
Gravel - 100%

I very much overestimated how much MTS I needed to make (used about 15%), overestimated how much gravel I needed (probably 2.5" across the entire tank, with some left over!), and definitely spilled the PVC primer on my desk. (half the tin...thankfully most went on the sheets I had laid down)

On the other hand, all we have left to do now:

Sort out covering the tanks
Water testing to establish baseline
Fill with water and begin cycling
Plants (next weekend)
Shrimp (two weeks after that)
Fish (one week after that)


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Okay, pictures. Getting really close to breaking down, getting an actual camera.

Hardscape install
This is what we ended up going with. Didn't realize at the time that most of it would be covered up!










*Sloppy Joes!*









*Potash*









*Dolomite*









*MTS in*









*The work area*









*Gravel in*










More to come tonight when the water is in, and tests/cycling started.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Yup, tank is online!!


Water in and Seachem Prime added (1.2 cap-fulls = ~70G water)
Gravel has settled and I filled in the sinkholes (due to placing hardscape before placing substrate)
Water is coming up to temp nicely (@73.4, started @72.2, target is ~76)
No leaks in any of the piping
Had one issue with the drip tray - resolved with an air tube to prevent overflow in the drip tray area
Water level was initially low in the pump area, water falling was causing micro-bubbles to be spit out by the pumps - resolved by raising the water level almost to baffle height
Cleaned the inside using magnetic scrubber
Added filter socks in an effort to cut down on the cloudiness

I waffled on starting the cycle with the Seachem Stability...I should just go get the ammonia and do it as listed.

We are definitely on track for plants this weekend, and shrimp probably the week after, and fish the week after that!

My last 'mental hump' is the water testing...never done it before is all.


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## Only One Haze (Nov 10, 2011)

Looking good man! Such great progress.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Thanks.

This week I'll work on building the light/lid hood assembly. The hood for the sump is something I'll leave for another day, I think...or maybe do some sort of rubber grommet system to fit around the piping.

The water was just under 75 this morning, so I must need to adjust the heater (the twist dial was a bit imprecise), and clarity seemed the same as last night, so guess that's as clear as it'll get. 

Mental note...buy ammonia on the way home tonight...


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Temperature has stabilized just under 78, so started the fishless cycle (I've read it should be more like 82, but might as well keep things consistent).

Here are my initial test results using the Tetra Laborett kit I inherited.

GH - 36dH (Hagen test kit says 140 (7 drops * 20))
KH - 5.5-6.0dH
pH - ~7.75
ammonia (initial) - 0.25mg/l
ammonia added (+7cc) - 1.5-2.0mg/l
ammonia added (+10cc) - 3.5-4.0mg/l
ammonia added (+4.5cc) - should end up around 5mg/l

The GH thing seems wrong...I will post about that elsewhere.

Tomorrow will test ammonia and nitrites again...just a waiting game now. Guess water testing isn't that bad after all!

Edit: Update, Hagen's calculator indicates that 140ppm on the GH test is actually equal to a GH of 7.8. So perhaps the Tetra test went bad.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Ok, update time.


Water @ 78.6F & still clear
Ammonia levels at ~3.0mg/l
Added 8.4cc of ammonia, brought levels up to 4.0-4.25mg/l
Water level in pump area of sump is down another inch since yesterday - averaging 1" per day

So, cycling seems to be progressing - ammonia levels went down as they should have. The water evaporation rate is alarming, though. Already the return pumps are spitting out tiny air bubbles due to the 'waterfall effect' the baffle creates. I now have two major tasks left:


Fabricate tank covers
Set up slow-drip refill system

And get the plants this weekend, get them planted. :S


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

*Automated top-off system*
Thanks to the cache of parts I inherited, the bits were all here, just needed plugging/trimming.

The relay.









The 'aqua lifter' pump.









Upturned output so I can hear when it's on.









Secret jug o' redi-water.









The float switch.










*Drip tray siphon*
I mentioned this, but don't think I showed it. Slightly concerned about the big fat drips I keep seeing appear at the bottom, and the 1.5mm increase in water in the drip tray area...will monitor the situation.




















And the money shot. UPSes look like baddies hiding in the cupboard. I thought I should mention, so far it's noisy, but not obnoxiously so. Sitting behind it at my desk, the rattling of the check valves is the most annoying, then the pumps. The overflow box noises are fine...more splashing than I'd like by the return through-piping, but I can live with it. Yeah, if the pumps were silent and the check valves did not rattle...would be pretty much silent.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

*Quick updates:*

Tank is evaporating around 2L every 24 hours.
Testing for ammonia is troublesome - uncertain which test kit to believe (and now one has run out).
Going to pick up Ammonia Watch by Seachem this weekend.
Picking up plants on Saturday, planting later that day.
Thus far the auto top-off system is working perfectly.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Well, for whatever reason, the siphon on the tank went nuts last night, started sucking the overflow dry. I played around with the valve a few minutes before I left, but still not sure why. I 'think' that the siphon tube on the secondary drain came unstuck from the suction mount, drooped into the water, and magically became air tight (it was previously requiring some glue to seal it back up).

Something to consider this weekend.

Ammonia levels were back down to 0.7ish (I guess), so tossed in another 10cc and called it a day. Oh, and nitrite levels were up...a bit...0.1 the day before, I'd guess 0.125 or 0.15 now, slight increase. Should go up further once the plants are in.

Also, the auto top-off system stopped working, not sure why, have to investigate. 

Still evaporating ~2 liters/day, so definitely have to take those measurements this weekend and get glass cut for the main tank. Princess Auto has a 0.25" glass bit ($4), so I can still have the siphon tube going into the tank off the secondary drain. Will need a grommet of some sort to allow for removal of the glass. Hm...actually...

Instead of two large squares (what the tank is designed to hold due to center brace), I can do four rectangles. Means I only need to lift one panel to do trimming/etc, and also means the piece with the siphon tube won't need to be moved all the time. This might also be a little cheaper.

To lift the glass, I'll just silicone on some acrylic handles.  The lights are already on little legs, so will leave that be for now.

For the sump...I'm thinking of using the existing glass for the forward section (part that will be removed to access the filter, etc), and a framework with custom-cut rubber sheet to fit around the piping.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Haha, well, Big Al's didn't have the Ammonia Watch, so I got a new API ammonia test kit.


Ammonia @ 5.0 (or 6.0?? scale gets squirrelly at the high end)
Nitrites @ 0.25 or 0.3

So, did not add any more ammonia, we'll re-measure tomorrow. Nitrite levels are definitely increased from yesterday, so that's encouraging.

The siphon issues have disappeared, so maybe it was just the secondary siphon tube acting up. It was a safe kind of failure (too much siphon  ), but I will definitely be working on securing that.

Some fun updates tomorrow with the plants!!


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Big update time! Plants are in!!










Crazy weekend, but so nice to see plants swaying in the current.










*Things I have learned:*

Plants that come in those plastic 'pots' are a huge pain to remove safely
Whoever decided that using thread to tie plants down was a good idea has dexterity level 60
Having a 12x turnover in the tank means crystal clear water within minutes 
The tank temperature appears to have dropped 0.5-1.0 degrees F after planting
I have no idea how my light timer works

*Water update:*

Ammonia still registering high according to the API test, guessing 5.0 or 6.0.
Nitrite I have decided to start measuring with the Tetra test kit since I'm pretty sure the Hagen one is expired - levels at 0.8
Water increased back up to mid 79F over the course of the day, but was low earlier.

*List of plants*

Aponogeton ulvaceus
Anubias nana
Anubias afzelli (thought it was barteri...but this is on the receipt)
Cryptocoryne lucens
Vallisneria americana (var natans)
Vallisneria spiralis (Italian val)
Hygrophila difformis (Wisteria)

Yeah, not 100% on that list after some google images, but close enough. The tank is probably not 'heavily' planted, but I'm not sure I could have fit any more in there comfortably. Also, guy at Menagerie assured me the Vals will grow rather fast.

I am thinking if I had it to do over again, I would have gotten a lot more Wisteria, just fills things in much more than the Vals. 

On a brighter note - I am already seeing plant growth on all species. It's only been 24 hours, so maybe things will change, but that is encouraging. The crypts (I think the red ones in the middle) are melting, but I expected that. They gave me a 'nut'-shaped thing I'll assume is a tuber or root base that had one little shoot coming out of it, and a few semi-full plants. The nut/tuber has new growth, the others not so much.

I used a rubber band to affix the Anubias Nana onto the driftwood, and just 'sat' one in place. Using the thread underwater is a joke.

On to more pictures...

*Full view with regular lights.*









*Planting the anubias, rhizome above the substrate.*

















*Peeling the weird 'fiber' foam stuff out of the potted plants.*









*Right-hand side of the tank:*









*Left-hand side of the tank:*









*View from my desk:*


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Quick update...


Water still clear, @79.5F
Ammonia has decreased to ~4mg/l - definitely lighter blue-green than yesterday
Nitrite has for sure increased, guessing to ~1.6, much stronger red than yesterday
Plants appear to still be healthy - I can see little roots poking out here and there, some new growth
The Val melt is not that bad - I expected everything to die off, but for the most part things are a healthy green colour
The Anubias are getting a brownish haze on them - assuming this is due to the acclimatization process - it is most obvious on the Nana

I also tied down the roots of the upper Nana with an elastic, they should have a much better chance to tie down on the driftwood now.

Finally, I observed the water in the drip tray to be 1" higher than normal, so I checked the filter socks - they were chock-full!! Emptied them out, water came down a bit, but not that much. Something to keep an eye on.

Oh, and I ordered the glass for the display top - four pieces that I just might hinge. Just the sump cover to deal with now.


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## zzrguy (Jul 11, 2012)

Bushing looking it going to make some fish very happy.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

I certainly hope so. The changing levels of ammonia/nitrites leads me to believe the tank might be ready by this weekend for fish. Pretty sure I stalled the cycle by adding too much ammonia due to bad test kits - it's now coming back online. If I am correct, ammonia will have decreased again tonight, and nitrite increased.

Pretty sure we'll be doing fish first, now. Big Al's tent sale has Jumbo Neon Tetras on sale 3 for $2 or something - can't pass that up, assuming the tank is cycled.


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## shrimpedout (Sep 14, 2012)

Awesome set up.

---
Get shrimped out!


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Thanks, eh. I'm thinking of calling it 'the Internet Special'.

*Quick update from yesterday:*

Water temp dropped down to 77.8 (right now) from 78.6 (last night) - I think we left a window open somewhere, and outside temp went down to 6C last night. Also, no heating on at the moment.
Ammonia is definitely around 4 now, no guessing - has gone down again
Nitrite has definitely increased, probably around 2.0-3.0 at this point

I also went to the first DRAS meeting of the year (local fish club), and it was a very interesting experience - the speaker was great! - although I did not get to stay for the whole thing.

Hm...is that kind of water temp drop something to be worried about? _To the search engine!!_


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Ok, good news! Nitrites and nitrates are off the scale, ammonia is down to 2.0!!! According to the fishless cycle guide, this means it's time for a 50% PWC. We brought in every bucket we have, filled with tap water to warm up for tonight.

I'm noting that the water is still crystal clear, but has a very slight green-yellow tint to it (such as looking through the tank at the wall behind). Guessing this is normal, to a point.

Plants are dying off ever so slightly, guessing this is due to very high nitrite/nitrate levels, and normal acclimation.

Also - the glass was cut for the tops...but it was cut incorrectly!! ...again... They cut four squares instead of four pieces that fit into two squares (obviously I gave them the exact piece measurements, not weird descriptions like that). Guess something was lost in translation. At any rate, two of the four squares they gave me fit the top openings perfectly, so I just need to drill/grommet for the overflow siphon tube and silicone on some handles. I noted that within seconds of placement the glass had misted over with condensation...so this should help. Also appears to be helping keep the temperature in...tank is back up to 78.7.

Tonight, water change (which will be a rather difficult exercise...), dose ammonia back up to 4, check pH, and continue the waiting game. In theory we are very close to the point where ammo/nitrite disappear overnight and the cycle is complete.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Awright, quick update before church.

As Diana suggested, we did a 95% water change in an effort to reduce the nitrite in the system. I put 2.5 capfuls of Prime into the measuring cup to ensure good distribution of the dechlor throughout the water change refill process.

*Water change overview:*

Turn off the UPSes powering pumps/heater.
Use the hose+pump combo to drain the display.
Drain the sump return area.
Fiddle with/figure out how to siphon out of the sump biological filter area without removing everything.
Clean out dead plant matter.
Place Seachem Prime into measuring cup, settle into place on the bottom.
Fill up slowly by screwing the hose onto the sink's faucet.
Let overflow re-fill sump.
Once water levels normal, turn it on, see how it goes.

*Floaty Wisteria.*









*Micro-bubbles on the plants. Neat.*









*Coiled the hose to make for the best gravity path.*









*Used a pump w. duct tape to start/continue the siphon.*









*Cleaning dead junk out (not that much...but still, might as well).*









*Floppy plants.*









*Super floppy.*









*Low flow meant the input water just flowed smoothly over this measuring cup.*









*Wisteria issues...dead stem bottoms...* 









*The Anubias Nana's diatom algae emitting a neat string of bubbles.*










*Water parameter update:*

*Pre-WC:* [email protected]
*Pre-WC:* [email protected]+ (off the scale)
*Post-WC:* [email protected]
*Post-WC:* [email protected]
*Post-WC+4cc ammon:* [email protected]~1.0
*Post-WC+4cc ammon:* [email protected]~1.6


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Sorry, been busy, update time!

*As of today:*

[email protected] or less (probably 0)
[email protected]
Only other item of note is the froth/foam in the sump return area (see pic below). This could be due to the filter socks needing a clean.
The Wisteria seem to be not-dying whilst floating, so will leave them to develop more roots.
I will be adding 12cc of ammonia and will check parameters tomorrow this time. If [email protected] and [email protected], and nitrates increased, then we're good. 
I am also guessing nitrates are low due to the amount of plants. Have to look that up.
Tank temp has jumped back to 79...kinda weird.

Bottom line, if time allows - fish this weekend! 

*Foamy*









*Wisteria rooting*









*Whatever these are, they are generally doing terribly*


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## KFryman (Sep 4, 2012)

Nice tank build!

Were those sponge type things presoaped? It sounds stupid, but sponges sometimes come with soap on them from the factory, weird, but something to take into account.

Looks like red tiger lotus.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Thanks, it's been a lot of fun. Good question - pretty sure no, as bacteria has grown just fine, but really have no clue.

Thanks for the tip on the plant...will look it up. The LFS guys (and my wife) were really enthused about it, but so far hasn't done well. Maybe it'll just take longer...


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Ok, quick update on the cycle. I think we're closer. I will be adding a little less ammonia this time, see how it does.


[email protected], slightly green/yellow tint to it
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected] (should be fine for fish)
Turned off one of the light sets (so only 2 bulbs instead of 4 T5HO) in an attempt to curb diatoms
The plants appear to be growing, so that's something

Nitrates have decreased, so it seems the plants are eating them up. 

Added 7cc ammonia.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Well, the cycle is complete, good enough for me.

I did a 50-60% water change, double-checked parameters (nitrates ended up 5-10, zero for ammon/nitrite), and was off to Big Al's.

I'm still in a bit of sticker shock, but bit the bullet. Cardinals, 12 (6 for $18) of them.

I have discovered something: My fancy overflow and super-high turnover is NOT fish friendly. I think we kinda knew that going into this, but had no idea how crazy it would be.

One little guy...who I am pretty sure won't make it...got sucked into the filter sock almost immediately. I quickly turned off both pumps, got him out, but he's alternating between swimming upside down and bumping into things whilst swimming upside down.

The other 11 seem to have done better - I think it's because the aforementioned doomed fish took several minutes longer to net out of the bag, so the others had schooled, and he just got confused. They have found a 'quiet' spot in the tank, and I am running only the smaller of the two pumps at the moment. 9 of them consistently school in a back corner.

I put in some food, but no takers yet. Guessing it'll take them a day or so to get acclimated.

I moved the floating Water Wisteria to form a 'barrier' along the overflow edge - it seems to help, a little. If nothing else the Wisteria will enjoy the extra oxygen.

Unfortunately we have no camera at this time, so no pictures.



Jeepers. Feel bad for that little guy.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Well, guess this will be the last update for a while (until I finish that sump lid, anyway).


Still have 11 Cardinals...never did find that guy who disappeared...very confusing. Guess they ate him? Maybe his body is buried in some ancient Tetra rite?
Plants are indeed growing...the vals took off, anubias have a few new shoots, even the red tiger lily has new leaves. 
The swords are the only item that did not do well. One has all leaves gone (I plucked when they turned yellow), other only has a few left. I trimmed the old stems back today, maybe that will help.
Cleaned the mechanical filters for the first time today, nice collection of diatoms/old fish food.
I am still confused about how much/how/when to feed these guys. Been doing every other day, a good pinch, place near the bottom/back and let them go to town. They look really fat afterwards. 

On the feeding front, I've had suggestions to pre-soak food like bloodworms, and for both types (flaks/worms) to put into a turkey baster to inject into the calmer areas of the tank.

Water parameters stabilized about a week before I placed the fish in. Waiting on some consensus as to what currents shrimp can withstand before I get a batch of RCS.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Not the greatest video, but you get the idea.

http://youtu.be/t9mYiRDmvGw

As a side note - the ball check valve is rattling because of the high flow rate. If I crank the flow down using the ball valve, rattling goes away.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Thought I would post an update.

Tank is doing really well, down to 9 Cardinals - no trace of the missing fish to this day. We added 30-40 shrimp on Saturday...I think there are 10 left. Cardinals are looking super fat, and several shrimp carcasses have turned up, besides all the shrimp gone missing.

Shrimp regularly get sucked down into the sump...seem okay with it, for the most part, but annoying to have to keep moving them back to the display area. They won't last long at this rate, anyway, kinda sad that the Cardinals are such angry fishies. Not like they don't get fed...they were growing very nicely with my feeding schedule. 

The good news about the tank is that it has been a month since the introduction of fish, and I have yet to do a water change, or even consider one (just refilling the sump ~0.5G every other day or so. The ammonia levels are 0, nitrate levels are 0 (strange for a planted tank...they were ~5-10 when I introduced fish I think), and water is crystal clear. Will probably do one once all the shrimp get eaten. Maybe.

Bottom line we enjoy the tank, but very sad the shrimpies won't work out. They were a lot of fun to watch for the first day.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Wow, didn't realize how long it's been since I built this. Guess I'll submit an update.

Still have yet to change the water, aside from top-ups. Now that I have added a proper top to both the sump and tank, I'll have to do a monthly test, maybe. Fish are still super-healthy/happy. 

We are now up to...30 fish? ~8 Cardinals, 1 Angel (other two got sucked into the sump), ~12 silver tetras, ~10 Sunburst Platies. All of the shrimp were eaten, unfortunately. I did a water test the other day just for kicks, levels are zero.

The water wisteria died off after I reduced the light window (to combat algae), but the rest of the plants are doing great. The red thing mysteriously came back to life, but still not doing that great.

Anyways...pretty happy with things, and no water changes is pretty awesome. Only maintenance I do is scrub the glass once a month, feed the fish every 2-3 days, and clean the sump mechanical filter maybe once a month. So... 1-2 hours maintenance per month, plus feeding. 

Oh...after I added the sump/tank tops, refill period has shrunk dramatically...I'm guessing that will be down to 2 gallons a month, maybe less.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Oh, I wanted to post a list of do's/don'ts:

Don't do an internal overflow - makes cleaning very difficult.
Don't do 'through-tank' returns, go overtop (have had the ball valves stick open once).
Don't do coast-to-coast style without some sort of screen/mesh - angelfish do not like the sump trip, and rescuing everything else is a pain.
Do have lids for the display tank and sump to prevent the majority of evaporation - saves a lot of refill maintenance.
Do stick with one breed of fish rather than a bunch of different ones, looks nicer IMO.
Do spend more time on the aquascape plan.
Don't forget that the gravel/mts takes up 1-2", so plan rock display accordingly.
Don't go small on the sump...30G I'm thinking is the smallest you'd want a sump from a purely practical point of view (maintenance, access, etc)
Do get a lot of plants to start, key for getting cycled and keeping the water levels in the green.
Do make your sump cover easy to remove.

If there's ever a catastrophe or we move or some such, I think we'll be moving to a 180G at minimum...most likely a plywood tank. 55G is so small!


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## midlife_hobbyist (Jul 4, 2012)

Just read your 6 page thread.....Great work! I could learn the art of patience from you - never one of my strong suits....tank looks great.


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## tattooedfool83 (Mar 15, 2013)

Awesome build. And dude youre hilarious.. how you worded your descriptions as wel kept me reading this thread for 30mins or so


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Haha, thanks. Less about patience, more about addiction to internet research. I'll be starting a new thread for the 20G shrimparium - just got the plants yesterday!

I want to highlight that 50G is really not that large from a viewing perspective...only 3' long, and when you are primarily viewing from the back (sitting at my desk) and the 3-stack of 2" plumbing is in the way...ya, definitely doing minimum 180G next time. Even from the front, just not that much space to fit everything.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Hum, after reading some on trimming, I think it's clear why my plant growth has been kinda lame. I don't think I've ever trimmed them...just when they reached the surface.

Some interesting reading/viewing material:

 http://aqualandpetsplus.com/Plant,%20Anubias.htm
 http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquascaping/57960-pruning-timeline.html
 




 http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=21794


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Random update. Pond snails have appeared seemingly from nowhere...but that's cool - cleaning crew and whatnot.

ALSO...!...discovered baby platies in the sump! One is ~1cm long, the other is half that size. Assuming they are still alive because fish no longer 'take the ride' to join them. Will have to read up on how big they need to be prior to a rescue operation.

ALSO......!...shrampies! Still alive! _ In the sump! _ Boggles the mind...haven't seen one in many months - it's one of the Amanos I got...can't even remember when. It was cold out. So long time now. Yep, still alive and just shramping along.

I will post some pics.


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## crazymittens (Jun 4, 2012)

Pics...
EDIT: Ugh...I really need to spend more time taking pictures. So underexposed.






























The tank after some pruning and new plants. Interestingly after I did the big prune of jungle val, it never really went back to crazy growth like before.


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