# My first planted Nano Tank



## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

Get a ton more plants if you want to have an easy time of it.








Here is my 7 gallon I cut back the plants every week. [emoji3] Then they grow all back.


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## pauld738 (Jan 4, 2019)

Agreed. Way more plants. And don't be afraid to plant in your gravel. Just throw a plant tab in there before planting. 

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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

EdWiser said:


> Get a ton more plants if you want to have an easy time of it.


Yeah I just did not want to over do it just yet. I have been recently told that facilities here at work may make me remove the tank. Something about not wanting water and electronics next to each other. I know the odds are in my favor as I have not seen a tank blow out or anything, but we are a medical company and they don't like playing any odds.




pauld738 said:


> Agreed. Way more plants. And don't be afraid to plant in your gravel. Just throw a plant tab in there before planting.


I plan on getting more plants. But I will be getting them from local guys and not PetSmart. The PetSmart here by work apparently has some fish people working there because the tanks look fairly good. But they only had a limited selection of plants. Since I am new at the planting I did not want to just grab plants that I knew nothing about. 

I hope to meet a few planted tank guys that I can get some clippings from.

I also saw that people were planting in gravel with the tabs. I stopped at PetSmart on my way home from work and they don't carry any, even though their site says they do. I will probably have to stop at the LFS to see if they have any. 


Tim


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Here is a photo of the tank with just the "Night Lights" on. I hope that these lights will not cause the plants any issues being on over night. 










I think it looks great. The RGB lights (x2 each) really bring out the red of the drift wood.


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## EdWiser (Jul 14, 2015)

I never leave lights on any of my tanks over night as I like the fish to get into day/night cycle. 
I always use a good planted tank soil Tropica or ADA. I found out a long time ago that trying to do things cheap cost me money and time trying to fight algae. 
My goal is to give the plants everything they need to be successful. An therefor I am successful and then my wife doesn’t yell at me for having algae all over the plants in the tank and the plants are not dieing on me. [emoji3]


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

EdWiser said:


> I never leave lights on any of my tanks over night as I like the fish to get into day/night cycle.
> I always use a good planted tank soil Tropica or ADA. I found out a long time ago that trying to do things cheap cost me money and time trying to fight algae.
> My goal is to give the plants everything they need to be successful. An therefor I am successful and then my wife doesn’t yell at me for having algae all over the plants in the tank and the plants are not dieing on me. [emoji3]




I currently don't have any fish or livestock in the tank right now. Only the two plants.

I am also not trying to do things cheaply. If I was just trying to be cheap I would not be getting into this hobby again.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Question for everyone...

Since both of the plants are on the drift wood I am assuming that tabs in the gravel will do nothing for them. So do I need to add some kind of liquid ferts in the water for them? If so, what is suggested.



Tim


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## pauld738 (Jan 4, 2019)

TDSapp said:


> Question for everyone...
> 
> Since both of the plants are on the drift wood I am assuming that tabs in the gravel will do nothing for them. So do I need to add some kind of liquid ferts in the water for them? If so, what is suggested.
> 
> Tim


 If you are not adding any kind of carbon the need for fertilizers reduces by quite a bit, x2 with basically no plants in the tank. This includes Excel. That said, a good quality all-in-one fertilizer might help if only in small doses. I use Nilocg Thrive in my nano tanks. But I use Excel as a carbon source so my growth is more than yours would be. 

Do test your tap water for nitrates, kh/gh so you know where you are starting from. Assuming you are using tap for water changes. Your tap may already have nitrates in it which might cause problems when adding an all-in-one fertilizer.

And I will recommend more plants again. Even something as simple as hornwort which you can have floating or stuck behind your driftwood (that's how I have mine and it consumes the tank after a week).

Here's my 5gal with hornwort floating at the top.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

I have some tabs coming and will be delivered tomorrow. I will be using them in my big tank first as I have plants planted in the sand. I will be adding them to this Nano once I get more plants for the gravel.

I looked at the Nilocg Thrive and saw there are two kinds. One for a tank with shrimp and one without. I do plan on having shrimp in this tank and the big one. Are they that different that I need to only get the shrimp one? 

What do you mean by adding carbon? All I knew was carbon was normally put into a filter to clear the water of chemicals and other things. I have a bag to put into the filter of this Nano if it is ever needed. Is there another use for it in planted tanks?

I am looking into ordering more plants soon. Just wanted to make sure I get the right things for this tank.


Tim


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## pauld738 (Jan 4, 2019)

TDSapp said:


> I have some tabs coming and will be delivered tomorrow. I will be using them in my big tank first as I have plants planted in the sand. I will be adding them to this Nano once I get more plants for the gravel.
> 
> I looked at the Nilocg Thrive and saw there are two kinds. One for a tank with shrimp and one without. I do plan on having shrimp in this tank and the big one. Are they that different that I need to only get the shrimp one?
> 
> ...


I use ThriveS but that's due to my 5gal tank. I didn't want to chance it with my shrimp in that small of a water column. The difference is that ThriveS doesn't have any copper, which shrimp are especially sensitive to, but plants like to have in small quantities. In a larger tank, with well and fast growing plants, it probably won't be an issue and I see people on here using the regular Thrive with shrimp without adverse affects. Smaller tank I wouldn't chance it. There is already a lot of tank parameters that can, and do, fluctuate rapidly in such a small tank. No need to add cooper to the mix. The one plus that the ThriveS has is that its lower in nitrates, which if you happen to have nitrates in your tap it's nicer to use since it doesn't artificially raise your nitrate level to high. Plus it has some calcium, which the regular doesn't, that helps shrimp with molting and general exoskeleton health. Provided you don't already have a lot of calcium in your tap water.

By adding carbon I meant either using co2 injection (Edwiser is using co2 in his tank) or using Seachem Excel, a bio-available carbon supplement(like a fertilizer). Plants need a carbon source for growth and it's usually the limiting factor in growth in non co2 injected tanks. The more carbon (co2 or excel) you have in the tank the more the plants need fertilizers to keep up the growth. The carbon in a bag you refer to is not the same thing. As a side note I've never used carbon(in a bag for removing impurities) in any of my planted tanks. Not that you can't. Many do. If the plants are growing well and strong, I just don't see the need.

Hope that helps and keep us posted as to what you get.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Thanks for the info Paul. I tried to buy some Thrive this weekend but the LFS did not have it. Since I wanted something I bought some Seachem Flourish Advance. I figure that I can use it while waiting on the Thrive to be shipped. I also picked up a few more plants. One for my big tank and two for this Nano tank. 

For the Nano I picked up some Java moss (I think that's what it is... right hand side of the tank in the picture below.) I also picked up a moss ball. Not sure how much good it is but every picture I see of shrimp they seem to always have one perched on a moss ball.


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## pauld738 (Jan 4, 2019)

TDSapp said:


> For the Nano I picked up some Java moss (I think that's what it is... right hand side of the tank in the picture below.) I also picked up a moss ball. Not sure how much good it is but every picture I see of shrimp they seem to always have one perched on a moss ball.


Nice! The shrimp will love the Java moss. I don't have experience with moss balls but I assume they collect lots of stuff that the shrimp pick at. Kind of like the Java moss. I have a bunch of Java moss in another tank that breeds cherry shrimp pretty well. I'm thinking the java moss helps allow the young shrimp to grow up big enough to not be eaten by fish.

Fyi, don't worry about the white fuzz growing on your wood. If you get shrimp before it does go away they will love it!

I did notice tonight that you are from Texas. It might be a good idea to check the kh/gh of your tank/tap water if you are wanting shrimp. If it's above 10 dKh you might want to look into bringing that down a bit.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

pauld738 said:


> Nice! The shrimp will love the Java moss. I don't have experience with moss balls but I assume they collect lots of stuff that the shrimp pick at. Kind of like the Java moss. I have a bunch of Java moss in another tank that breeds cherry shrimp pretty well. I'm thinking the java moss helps allow the young shrimp to grow up big enough to not be eaten by fish.
> 
> Fyi, don't worry about the white fuzz growing on your wood. If you get shrimp before it does go away they will love it!
> 
> I did notice tonight that you are from Texas. It might be a good idea to check the kh/gh of your tank/tap water if you are wanting shrimp. If it's above 10 dKh you might want to look into bringing that down a bit.


I did not think I had to worry about the white fuzz. I recall seeing it in many of my earlier tanks.


I have bought both the kh and gh testers but just keep forgetting to bring it to work. I am very curious as I believe that the water source I am getting my top off\change water from is filtered. I really hope that it has pulled some of the garbage out.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

WE HAVE LIFE! 

Ok, maybe not good life but life none the less. I was looking at my tank today when I saw my first living thing in the tank, besides plants that is. A worm... sigh... Last thing I added to the tank was the Java moss and the Moss ball. I guess there was at least one worm as a hitchhiker. 

I am not worried about it though. Still no other life in the tank and not really anything for him to eat. Unless he eats the liquid plant food.


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## livebearerlove (Aug 20, 2013)

@TDSapp

Looks like your wood has a nice white fuzz too it- keep an eye on that as it can mean your water table could soon be thrown off depending on how the wood was treated. If it gets worse- make sure to check your water parameters.

I lived in countries that caused on wood, and soon enough I spent all day adjusting the hardness, etc. Learned a lesson about the source of wood and stone and what It can leach into the already unstable tap water.


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## AguaScape (Oct 28, 2018)

TDSapp said:


> Question for everyone...
> 
> Since both of the plants are on the drift wood I am assuming that tabs in the gravel will do nothing for them. So do I need to add some kind of liquid ferts in the water for them? If so, what is suggested.
> 
> Tim


Root tabs will release nutrients into the water column. The rate of release Is hard to predict though. Liquid or dry fertilizer is much more controllable.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

AguaScape said:


> Root tabs will release nutrients into the water column. The rate of release Is hard to predict though. Liquid or dry fertilizer is much more controllable.


I do not have any tabs in the gravel yet. I have to get a plant that needs to be buried before I use any tabs or anything.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

OK, I have a couple questions now. I did a water test today and came up with the following results.

Ph 6.8
Ammonia (NH3/NH4) 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrates 0
dGH 142.4 ppm (8 drops)
dKH 53.4 ppm (3 drops)


So I have no fish, shrimp or any other animals in the tank. I use the Seachem Advance as a fert every morning when I get in to work. 

Would the fert cause any jumps in the Ammonia or Nitrites? I know that the plants consume Nitrates and with nothing but plants in the tank I could see where I would be reading 0 ppm. 

Should I assume that either the Cycle has completed, or that the cycle has not started at all? The only thing I have added to the tank has been prime when I add water, and the Seachem Advance ferts. So no ammonia or fish food... 


I have had two of the plants in the tank for a bit over one week, and the other two plants have been about five days. I am seeing some growth on the Anubias plants and nothing in the tank has melted or is turning colors. I am going on the assumption that everything is going great with the plants and should not be in a panic for anything. The water parameters look good to me. 


I would like to drop a few shrimp into the tank soon but don't want to rush into it.


Tim


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

I added some Temple Compacta to my today. Figured that I would add it to this thread so I would not forget what all I have.


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## pauld738 (Jan 4, 2019)

TDSapp said:


> OK, I have a couple questions now. I did a water test today and came up with the following results.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Flourish Advance is really just for starting new root growth. Not much of a plant fertilizer. Hence your 0 Nitrates and shouldn't affect Ammonia/Nitrates. 

BTW, plants also consume ammonia. Debatable as to whether plants prefer it over nitrates. My opionion is they do. 

By now I'm sure your tank has cycled. Have you added any shrimp to the mix? Go slow and as long as plants are growing you should be fine.

Also your dKh/ dGh look good.

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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

pauld738 said:


> By now I'm sure your tank has cycled. Have you added any shrimp to the mix? Go slow and as long as plants are growing you should be fine.
> 
> Also your dKh/ dGh look good.



I have added shrimp, a snail and one other plant since I posted last. I added five ghost shrimp but have only see two of them in the last few days. I also added five Red Cherry Shrimp and yesterday I saw three of them. The lady at PetCo told me that they have a 30 day warranty on their livestock and that if they die I only have to bring in the bodies and they will replace them. Problem is having so much stuff in the tank I can't find any of the missing shrimp. 

Any how... Plants are growing and the shrimp seem happy. 

Now if I could only get rid of the stupid micro bubbles!


Tim


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Well I found one of my shrimp today. A RCS decided to desk dive on me and I found him all dried out and crispy today. I will at least get to replace him. 

So I can see right now 3 RCS and two glass shrimp in the tank along with the snail. I dropped in a little bit of the banana I was eating today and the glass shrimp went crazy for it. They were actually fighting over it until they got it into two parts. Here they are, wanting more.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Tank Update...

I wanted to post a before and after photo so I can remember the changes.

Here is the tank on 3-22-19











Here is the tank today 4-1-19











The water is deeper and the Temple Compacta at the back of the tank is now out of the water. I am about to cut it and replant it. The single branch of Temple Compacta at the front left of the tank has also picked up and grown quite well. It hard to tell but the Anubis at the left side of the tank has also shot out a couple new leaves and is taller, and the moss on the right hand of the tank has probably doubled in size and thickness.


Tim


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## livebearerlove (Aug 20, 2013)

You can definitely see the difference!


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## pauld738 (Jan 4, 2019)

Nice!

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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Another update... I know, it's only been 3 days since the last update. 

But today I did my first lawn maintenance. I took the temple compacta and cut it down and moved it around.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Well, I may have to take the tank down and take it home. 

This weekend was hard on the tank. I left work around 2 p.m. on Friday and got to the office at 5 a.m. on Monday. (Uggg... I know right... I hate mornings) I turn on the night light for a while and then go to the white lights about 30 minutes later. There are two or three shrimp out on the rocks and wood sleeping. 

Turns out one of them was not sleeping... It was dead, and there was also another dead one on the gravel, and one head first into the foam on the overflow. All three were dead. The white algae\fungus is back onto the drift wood and my snail is missing. 

Yesterday during the day I saw one or two of the RCS and only two of the glass shrimp. Today I have only seen one of each. This may change as it is early. As I have said before my RCS are teenagers and don't normally get out of bed til after lunch.

So here is what I think the problem is. I work at the head quarters for a company and we are not a 24 hour operation here. So at 6 p.m. they turn the air conditioning up to save money, then around 6 a.m. they turn it back down. Today I am going to try and find out what the temperature is set to on nights and weekends. I do know that during the day the tank is normally around 75 degrees as that is what the heater is set to. But this morning when I came in the tank was at 79. That is after sitting over night with no AC. The weekend I think it gets even hotter, and it has longer to creep up. I know that the shrimp will do "OK" up to 80 to 82 degrees but I am worrying about the temperature swing from 75 to 82 or higher over the weekend. The summer will be even worse. I have came in here to work on the weekend before and it felt like it was sweltering. Nothing like coming into work and sweating while wearing shorts and a T-shirt.

Over night it does not seem to be a major problem because I don't think it has the time to really swing much. Maybe this weekend I will aim my fan to over the top of the tank. Only have to worry about evaporation then. I already have to add around 64 ounces of water to top off the evaporation after the weekend.

Oh well... at least the plants are growing. :smile2: Even the crypt has already put out a new leaf. I read that it would probably melt away and then start new leaves once it acclimated. But the existing leaves are looking great and a new one is popped up already.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Ok, so I got to talk to facilities. The AC is only ran from 5 a.m. to 4 p.m. M-F. On Saturday it is ran from 7 a.m. to 3 p.m. and Sundays it is just off. So I guess I noticed it this weekend because this was the hottest weekend since I set this tank up. Makes me worry because it only got to 80 this weekend. What is it going to do when it's 110 outside?


Tim


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## livebearerlove (Aug 20, 2013)

TDSapp said:


> Ok, so I got to talk to facilities. The AC is only ran from 5 a.m. to 4 p.m. M-F. On Saturday it is ran from 7 a.m. to 3 p.m. and Sundays it is just off. So I guess I noticed it this weekend because this was the hottest weekend since I set this tank up. Makes me worry because it only got to 80 this weekend. What is it going to do when it's 110 outside?
> 
> 
> Tim


 In the wild, temp varies.... night/day/seasonal.


I had the same potential issue- tank was in a guest bedroom, we didnt run aircon during the day, and at night we ran it. 

I ended up finding out water parameters were a miss... kh/gh and pH swings that stressed them... but it wasnt the temp for sure. Same tank, 2 months later was pristine.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

livebearerlove said:


> In the wild, temp varies.... night/day/seasonal.
> 
> 
> I had the same potential issue- tank was in a guest bedroom, we didnt run aircon during the day, and at night we ran it.
> ...



But in the wild if it is too hot they can swim deeper where it is cooler, and if it is too cold they can go closer to the surface. Trapped in a 12" tank they are kind of limited.

I will take some water home tonight and see how it measures out. 


Tim


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## livebearerlove (Aug 20, 2013)

TDSapp said:


> But in the wild if it is too hot they can swim deeper where it is cooler, and if it is too cold they can go closer to the surface. Trapped in a 12" tank they are kind of limited.
> I will take some water home tonight and see how it measures out.


 In theory... they also move away from predators too... often leaving them in the warm shallows. I cant image temp is the issue... I have the fluval (2.5 gallon) and it fluctuates from room temp of 70-85 all day long depending on the day. I successfully breed shrimp and raise fry in it. (commercial buildings wont risk the building going above that or that means there would be mold on the carpet- so the air con is decreased, but its not completely off. I used to own commercial buildings- just turning the HVAC 'off' is not an option).


I would approach your water parameters again 
My birthing/shrimp tank 2.5 gallon:


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

So taking temperature out of the mix I do have some water issues. It seems like I always have problems after the weekend. 


So this weekend I put my little desktop fan blowing at the top of the tank to help with any kind of temperature change. But that apparently kicked up the evaporation. I had to add top off water to the tank as soon as I got in this morning. My water pump was running dry. I probably had to add around 80 ounces of water to the tank to get it back where the level should be. 


On Friday one of my glass shrimp came out of hiding. He swam around the tank for a while and foraged off some of the plants. But this morning when I came in he was dead in the corner of the tank. I may have also lost the mystery snail I put in last week. I found him on a rock this AM but he was not moving around. So I picked him up to see if he was dead but his trap door is shut. I dropped him into the tank where I can see him. If he has not moved by this afternoon I will pull him from the tank too.

So having a tank with so many hiding places is good and bad. Bad part is I think all the shrimp and the snail I have lost were all hidden when they died. Since I can't get them out of the tank I figure they have fouled the water. I had to replant one of my Temple Compactas this morning as it was floating. That disturbed the gravel and I ended up with a bunch of detritus worms floating around. I know they normally show up when there is food for them. Since I rarely feed this tank I think they are eating all the fallen shrimp and fish.


I am going to do multiple water changes this week to see if I can change the condition of the water. 


Tim


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

Sigh, when it rains it pours. So the only thing in my tank now is plants. Now there are no snails to try and keep the algae at bay so I am seeing more of it in the tank. 

I have not fed this tank in a while and today was the first time I even used any ferts in quite a while. I came into work today from a long weekend to find detritus worms in the water. Not just some worms but probably well over 1,000+ of them. I did a quick water change in the morning and when I added the water back from the water change it mixed up the water and I had even more worms in the water. I waited a couple hours and did another water change. So I have probably changed around 80% of the water today. Still have more than 100 worms in the water at this point. No telling how many are in the gravel and in the java moss. 

My issue is I know they show up when there is too much food in the water. Things like dead bodies, dead plants... I have been keeping the plants in this tank trimmed well and take out dead leaves when I see them. I just don't know what they are eating now. 

I did add some frogbit to the tank last week and it has been growing. I hope it at least helps with the algae problem.


Tim


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## cynyck (Jan 6, 2019)

After reading through this thread I'd like to offer two observations: one is that you have a nice looking tank there. The second is that I think you really need to take livebearerlove's advice and check your water parameters.

If I am reading correctly, you asked after 15 days if anyone thought your tank could be cycled after you got zero-zero-zero readings, and someone said it definitely could be. But according to what I've read, you didn't use any media from an established tank, you didn't add any store-bought bacteria, and no store-bought ammonia. There's nothing wrong with not using any of that, but if what I've read is correct, I seriously doubt you established a cycle in 15 days.

I think you should check your water parameters. At this point, 40 days into it and after adding livestock, you could *now* have an established cycle. But, I think you lost your livestock because it was not cycled.

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. If not, then at this point you need to feed the bacteria by adding more livestock or by adding something like Dr. Tim's Ammonium Chloride until you do add livestock.

Again, nice looking tank, it'd be terrible to give up on it now.


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## TDSapp (Feb 28, 2019)

cynyck said:


> After reading through this thread I'd like to offer two observations: one is that you have a nice looking tank there. The second is that I think you really need to take livebearerlove's advice and check your water parameters.
> 
> If I am reading correctly, you asked after 15 days if anyone thought your tank could be cycled after you got zero-zero-zero readings, and someone said it definitely could be. But according to what I've read, you didn't use any media from an established tank, you didn't add any store-bought bacteria, and no store-bought ammonia. There's nothing wrong with not using any of that, but if what I've read is correct, I seriously doubt you established a cycle in 15 days.
> 
> ...



Thank you, I thought it was a great looking tank as well. But having it at work was too much trouble. They would lower the AC here over night so I was having to add water every morning. Not too much of an issue but they did the same thing over the entire weekend. So the pump would keep the display area nice and full but the filter area was losing it's water. I was finding that on Monday it was close to running dry so my filter media was drying out every weekend. 

I asked if it could have been cycled as I am new at planted tanks. Knowing that the plants would consume the junk in the water, I was not sure if it was safe to add animals before a cycle was done.

Anyhow, Tuesday of last week was the last day that there were any plants or anything in the tank. On Wednesday I hopped on an air plane and went to Mexico for five days. Knowing that I was not going to be around for five days and finding hair algae on everything after the weekend I pulled all the plants from the nano.

I took them home, did a bleach dip and put them into my 150 tall at home. 

This week I am going to empty the tank and take it home. I will set it up again but somewhere I can keep an eye on it every day. SWMBO may not be happy as that will make three tanks at home. But I would rather have it at home and healthy than here at work and always being a problem.


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