# Every cherry shrimp is dead



## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

All 50 or so in my 20 long died at some point in the last couple of hours.

They were in a large pile in the center of the tank when I got home, was gone for ~5 hours, and they were all fine and active before. Some of them are still twitching right now, but most look like they're already gone.

Parameters are perfect, too. pH is 7.4, no ammonia or nitrite, nitrate is 40ppm (time for a water change). The seven otos and two farlowellas in the tank are all swimming around like nothing happened.

All water used is RO, original fill, topups, and changes. Just changed 5g immediately after taking a sample for testing, it's all I had left of it, though I doubt it will do any good now. :/

Only thing that changed recently was adding a piece of driftwood last night and attaching some peacock moss to it with superglue (cyanoacrylate, totally aquarium safe). Last water change was last weekend, 6g I think.

Ugh, I feel so bad for them. I'm helpless for the ones that are still alive, other than doing water changes.

I didn't get a picture of the pile of them (too frantically grabbing a sample and changing as much water as I could), but here is the current situation as of 12AM.











The driftwood in question.










The otos are all fine. :/











I'm so disappointed. This has been my favorite tank so far, the shrimp were so active and so fun to watch, and now they're all dead or slowly dying, and I can't do a damn thing about it. :icon_cry:


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## HolyAngel (Oct 18, 2010)

AWW  super sad night  

Anything change recently? Anyone change anything in the house? Spray something? Anything new in the tank? Did you clean/boil the driftwood? Where was it from? Anything?


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

HolyAngel said:


> AWW  super sad night
> 
> Anything change recently? Anyone change anything in the house? Spray something? Anything new in the tank? Did you clean/boil the driftwood? Where was it from? Anything?


The driftwood is 6 months old or so from an established & healthy tank, so no issues there. The house temp has stayed the same.

My wife sprayed a spider in the room earlier today (I still didn't want her to do it), but all three tanks in the room were covered previous to it (one of which is a reef that is closer to the spray spot, and it is showing 0 signs of anything), the ceiling fan turned off, only sprayed just in the one tiny spot, etc. This is why I highly doubt it is related.


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## stephenpence (Mar 5, 2010)

that's crazy... I've never seen a die-off that quick that wasn't from a malfunctioning heater. I've been noticing a steady decline in my office tank, but I've attributed it to a lack of calcium in the water, and so they're dying during molting, peril of using 100% RO water, but to happen that quick.. maybe a bacterial infection?? You got me man... I feel for you. If you can check the hardness, post what those values were as well..

Sent from my ERIS-ADR6200 using Tapatalk


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

stephenpence said:


> that's crazy... I've never seen a die-off that quick that wasn't from a malfunctioning heater. I've been noticing a steady decline in my office tank, but I've attributed it to a lack of calcium in the water, and so they're dying during molting, peril of using 100% RO water, but to happen that quick.. maybe a bacterial infection?? You got me man... I feel for you. If you can check the hardness, post what those values were as well..
> 
> Sent from my ERIS-ADR6200 using Tapatalk


Crap, just dumped my sample, but the water isn't hard after sitting in the tank. There are a few pieces of shale in the water (essentially a form of limestone) to bring the hardness of the water up and add calcium for the little shrimpies, but last I measured it wasn't considered "hard".

There is no heater in the tank, none of my tanks have one.

I'm just shocked as to how quickly it happened. I was specifically showing my cousin how awesome they were, how they are always eating at something, swimming around, etc, and they looked perfect, couldn't have asked for better shrimp.


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## gowfan05 (Feb 16, 2010)

Correct me if I'm wrong but isnt 40ppm nitrate bad? I'm not experienced with cherry's but I know that for CRS and OEBTs this is a major reason they die. But dont give up bro! I hope someone with more experience can help you out.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

From what I've read, you basically have to _try_ to kill cherries. The nitrate reading is usually 20ppm or less, this is the first tank I've really kept up with the water changes (it's also my smallest tank so far), but 40ppm wouldn't kill anything in a few hours. It would take much, much higher levels for it to be toxic.


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## VeeSe (Apr 16, 2011)

It could have been the spider spray... that's something that could affect shrimp but be harmless to fish... just throwing it out there, as shrimp are much closer biologically to bugs than fish are.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

VeeSe said:


> It could have been the spider spray... that's something that could affect shrimp but be harmless to fish... just throwing it out there, as shrimp are much closer biologically to bugs than fish are.


This is true, but the tank was completely covered before, and not uncovered for a long time after. The other tanks in the room are much closer to the spray point and no ill effects were seen in them (again, one of them being a reef, corals looked better than ever when I got home).


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## mistergreen (Dec 9, 2006)

+1 insecticide. Why would you need to spray? A magazine would do.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

mistergreen said:


> +1 insecticide. Why would you need to spray? A magazine would do.


Because my wife just doesn't think sometimes. :/ She thought about covering the tanks before spraying, but just smacking the thing "may not have worked". And now I have dead shrimp. Whether it's related or not, I'm still really upset.


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## wicca27 (May 3, 2009)

if you have an air pump in the shrimp tank when she sprayed it sucked some of it into the tank. that is what my cherrys did when a plumber sprayed wd40 in same room as my tank next morning i woke up to pile o shirmp and fish were fine even fry


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## Jaggedfury (Sep 11, 2010)

I agreed, has to be the toxic mist/fumes left in the room after the slight spraying even if the tanks were covered.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

wicca27 said:


> if you have an air pump in the shrimp tank when she sprayed it sucked some of it into the tank. that is what my cherrys did when a plumber sprayed wd40 in same room as my tank next morning i woke up to pile o shirmp and fish were fine even fry


No air pump, either. :/




Jaggedfury said:


> I agreed, has to be the toxic mist/fumes left in the room after the slight spraying even if the tanks were covered.


It's the only thing that's making sense now, but still sucks hardcore.


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## Jaggedfury (Sep 11, 2010)

For such an instant amount of die off, it only leaves the spraying as the culprit.


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## ucantimagine (Jan 8, 2012)

That is such an awful site.  Sorry about your shrimpies. Hopefully it was the bug spray. Atleast then it's something that's easily remedied. I agree it's very easy for the fine mist to float around long after you think it's gone and a covered tank is not an airtight tank.


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## TexasCichlid (Jul 12, 2011)

jedimasterben said:


> Crap, just dumped my sample, but the water isn't hard after sitting in the tank. There are a few pieces of shale in the water (essentially a form of limestone) to bring the hardness of the water up and add calcium for the little shrimpies, but last I measured it wasn't considered "hard".
> 
> There is no heater in the tank, none of my tanks have one.
> 
> I'm just shocked as to how quickly it happened. I was specifically showing my cousin how awesome they were, how they are always eating at something, swimming around, etc, and they looked perfect, couldn't have asked for better shrimp.


Just want to add shale is not a form of limestone. Also, you probably have slate, not shale. Slate is metamorphosed shale and is much harder, generally used for aquarium decorations among other decorative purposes. Many shales will literally turn to mud after extended periods in water.


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## slugzed (Sep 13, 2010)

had the same thing happen to me a few months ago. loss 1000+ cherry, all crs/oebt/yellows due to my brother spraying ants in the house with Raid. shrimps were all living healthy/happily prior to the spray. it sucks and i should know how you feel.


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## ucantimagine (Jan 8, 2012)

omg....I would have a fall out on the floor tantrum mental meltdown psychotic break if that happened to me. Yes...THAT dramatic. Bet I'd get some new shrimp out of it. lol


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## trixella (Jan 24, 2011)

I would also suggest testing the gh, cherries need a little more hardness than others for molting. Straight RO is probably too soft for them to form new shells properly.


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## chiefroastbeef (Feb 14, 2011)

That stinks Ben, sorry to hear... Though I am glad to hear your other tanks were okay, if they too were affected... man, you'll definitely be in tears.


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## sayurasem (Jun 17, 2011)

I don't know if you mention this, but did you wash your hand before putting your hand into the water?

I have the same problem and I think "not washing my hand" is the cause.
I remember after I smoke cigarette, put my hand in the tank then shrimp dying one by one.

people forget when we dip our hands into the tank without washing hands.
lotion, cigarette smell (heavy metals), our food, oil, our sweat, etc.


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## hedge_fund (Jan 1, 2006)

Look at the bright side....now you can get some fire reds to replace your cherries.


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## jasonpatterson (Apr 15, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your shrimpocalypse. Were there any survivors?


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## Jayme (Nov 27, 2011)

How awful. :icon_cry: Sorry to hear about your little guys and gals.

I never thought about how serious a spray of any kind and fumes could be. Going to have to start cleaning guns outside (spray cleaner) and watch the air freshener!

I had a hard time with the death of my oldest prettiest lady the other day. I would have had an emotional breakdown had I lost everyone...


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## GDP (Mar 12, 2011)

I was suspecting your DW until you mentioned you had it in another tank for a while now. I still almost want to suspect it. Either that or the fumes from the spray. My condolances.


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## splur (Nov 26, 2011)

Was this your only shrimp tank in the room? If so, then ya I'd have to pin it on the bug spray.


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## harley1964 (Jan 22, 2012)

I'm sorry for your loss, its stories like this that help the rest of
us avoid something similar. I dont mean to derail this, but, do you guys think
we could avoid this by running activated carbon, or maybe purgen.
I also have shrimp that I worry about every time I see the cloud of pam being
sprayed on the pans.
Thanks Darrell.


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## GDP (Mar 12, 2011)

harley1964 said:


> I'm sorry for your loss, its stories like this that help the rest of
> us avoid something similar. I dont mean to derail this, but, do you guys think
> we could avoid this by running activated carbon, or maybe purgen.
> I also have shrimp that I worry about every time I see the cloud of pam being
> ...


I wouldnt think pam would be water soulable. Maybe it is though? Activated carbon could possibly help I would think, but dont really know if it would help in time.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

TexasCichlid said:


> Just want to add shale is not a form of limestone. Also, you probably have slate, not shale. Slate is metamorphosed shale and is much harder, generally used for aquarium decorations among other decorative purposes. Many shales will literally turn to mud after extended periods in water.


It is slate. I do have a lot of shale I used in a cichlid tank (if its not made of limestone, it sure still raised the pH and kH up), and just got the naming mixed up.


trixella said:


> I would also suggest testing the gh, cherries need a little more hardness than others for molting. Straight RO is probably too soft for them to form new shells properly.


The rocks I have in the water seem to keep the gH at acceptable levels, I will retest again before adding any more little guys. Gonna do several 75% water changes over the next eek.


chiefroastbeef said:


> That stinks Ben, sorry to hear... Though I am glad to hear your other tanks were okay, if they too were affected... man, you'll definitely be in tears.


I'd be devastated.


sayurasem said:


> I don't know if you mention this, but did you wash your hand before putting your hand into the water?
> 
> I have the same problem and I think "not washing my hand" is the cause.
> I remember after I smoke cigarette, put my hand in the tank then shrimp dying one by one.
> ...


I'm a very clean person, so I never worry about that sort of thing if I know I haven't eaten anything or touched anything oily, salty, etc.


hedge_fund said:


> Look at the bright side....now you can get some fire reds to replace your cherries.


That would be nice if I could afford them. My wife doesn't want me to replace them at all, but I will start rebuilding the colony in the next couple of months, we owe a lot in taxes this year so I can't really afford even cherries right now. 

If you know where I could get some inexpensively, please let me know so I can start scrounging money up where I can.


jasonpatterson said:


> Sorry to hear about your shrimpocalypse. Were there any survivors?


No. *cry*


splur said:


> Was this your only shrimp tank in the room? If so, then ya I'd have to pin it on the bug spray.


Only shrimp tank in the house. Haven't seen my coral banded shrimp in my reef tank, though, now that I think about it.


harley1964 said:


> I'm sorry for your loss, its stories like this that help the rest of
> us avoid something similar. I dont mean to derail this, but, do you guys think
> we could avoid this by running activated carbon, or maybe purgen.
> I also have shrimp that I worry about every time I see the cloud of pam being
> ...


The tank was running carbon already, but I don't think Pam is soluble, you shouldn't have to worry about it.


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## wicca27 (May 3, 2009)

weather your a clean person or not you never know what is in a chemical you clean the house with or soap or lotion that you have touched and can transfer to the tank. i always rinse my hands and up to my arms with as hot a water as i can stand before going in the tanks. i dont use any soap at that time and dont touch anything between the sink and tank. the hot water will remove any oils from the skin or other bad things you dont want in the tank and not soap residue in the tank


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## chiefroastbeef (Feb 14, 2011)

I'd send you a bunch of my cherries for free if I didn't live in Hong Kong.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

wicca27 said:


> weather your a clean person or not you never know what is in a chemical you clean the house with or soap or lotion that you have touched and can transfer to the tank. i always rinse my hands and up to my arms with as hot a water as i can stand before going in the tanks. i dont use any soap at that time and dont touch anything between the sink and tank. the hot water will remove any oils from the skin or other bad things you dont want in the tank and not soap residue in the tank


It's never been a problem, and if I know I have something on my hands or I haven't washed them in a while, I'll wash them just because, whether I'm putting my hands in a tank or not.



chiefroastbeef said:


> I'd send you a bunch of my cherries for free if I didn't live in Hong Kong.


You're very kind, thanks anyway!


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

My wife still doesn't get why I was upset about it, and still doesn't think I should replace them. So what do I do? Make a Swap n shop thread. Found a few bucks that'll soon be a few shrimp.


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## ucantimagine (Jan 8, 2012)

Someone on SnS is selling 100 cherries for 50 bucks. They don't have any close up pics though, last time I looked at the thread.


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## chiefroastbeef (Feb 14, 2011)

Honestly, if I was you, I'd wait a little longer to save up some cash and start again with a colony of Fire Reds. I wish I would of done that in the beginning with my 60-p. Now it is too late since I can't catch them all unless I take all my plants out, and I have a jungletron.

Oh, and not to be a jerk, but you may want to think about changing your signature, the part about buttloads of RCS...

too soon? sorry.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

ucantimagine said:


> Someone on SnS is selling 100 cherries for 50 bucks. They don't have any close up pics though, last time I looked at the thread.


I will look into that, thanks!


chiefroastbeef said:


> Honestly, if I was you, I'd wait a little longer to save up some cash and start again with a colony of Fire Reds. I wish I would of done that in the beginning with my 60-p. Now it is too late since I can't catch them all unless I take all my plants out, and I have a jungletron.
> 
> Oh, and not to be a jerk, but you may want to think about changing your signature, the part about buttloads of RCS...
> 
> too soon? sorry.


You're a weenie. 

The color actually doesn't matter a whole lot to me, I just love having tons of shrimp scurrying around everywhere! Pretty colors are nice to have, but not needed.


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## h4n (Jan 4, 2006)

poor shrimpys! so sorry for your loss!!


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## GDP (Mar 12, 2011)

jedimasterben said:


> My wife still doesn't get why I was upset about it, and still doesn't think I should replace them. So what do I do? Make a Swap n shop thread. Found a few bucks that'll soon be a few shrimp.


Take all her makup and trash it, then tell her you dont understand why she is so upset about it. Or whatever it is she loves. Not really but you know.

Sorry man for the loss. Hope you can get some new good ones.


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## skindy (Jan 30, 2012)

D'aww ... sorry about your shrimpies  

I'm sure, if it _was_ the bug spray, that wifey didn't mean it. Though, she could be a teeny bit more understanding as to why you're upset. It's alright, we shrimp people are different from "them. " :red_mouth


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## GDP (Mar 12, 2011)

skindy said:


> D'aww ... sorry about your shrimpies
> 
> I'm sure, if it _was_ the bug spray, that wifey didn't mean it. Though, she could be a teeny bit more understanding as to why you're upset. It's alright, we shrimp people are different from "them. " :red_mouth


lol if only you knew how much stuff I get @ work from everyone when they found out I breed shrimp.


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## Jeromeit (Sep 30, 2011)

Any ferts in ur tank?


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## hedge_fund (Jan 1, 2006)

GDP said:


> Take all her makup and trash it, then tell her you dont understand why she is so upset about it. Or whatever it is she loves. Not really but you know.


roud:roud:roud:roud:


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

More bad news - my big coral banded shrimp in my reef kicked the bucket too.


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## splur (Nov 26, 2011)

Throw away that bug spray. And any other insecticides you have in the house before your wife decides to use it again.

It's scary because I totally went wild one day spraying the hell out of my makeshift terrarium with bug spray because of the bugs in it... luckily not in the same room as the shrimp tanks but pretty damn close.


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## jedimasterben (Aug 21, 2011)

splur said:


> Throw away that bug spray. And any other insecticides you have in the house before your wife decides to use it again.
> 
> It's scary because I totally went wild one day spraying the hell out of my makeshift terrarium with bug spray because of the bugs in it... luckily not in the same room as the shrimp tanks but pretty damn close.


This. We neared the house sprayed professionally soon though, cucarachas are getting into the house somewhere.


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## trixella (Jan 24, 2011)

jedimasterben said:


> This. We neared the house sprayed professionally soon though, cucarachas are getting into the house somewhere.


Sprinkle diatomaceous earth around your baseboards inside and around the outside parameter of your house. It's all natural, non toxic, and totally works. If you don't want to sprinkle it around your baseboards, you can make a mix of DE, boric acid, and sugar and put it in dishes and place them around the house where pets can't get to it (under fridge, under dishwasher, stove, furniture, in attics, etc).


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## blackwidow (Mar 22, 2010)

its the spray. i read while back ago on other forums that bug spray killed their shrimps. even they did not spray in the shrimp room but other room in the house could also kill shrimps!

Sent from my HTC Glacier


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## Alaizabelle (Apr 7, 2011)

I just went through my house top to bottom, making sure there wasn't a can of bug spray hiding somewhere that a caretaker might find and spray O_O


That would be so awful!!


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## Fishies_in_Philly (Dec 8, 2011)

so sorry for your loss :-( if it's any comfort, your loss has brought upon the rest of the forum some invaluable knowledge. never in a million years would i have thought a small spray of bug juice would have wiped out all the shrimp in the immediate vicinity. very handy info for me since i have nothing but shrimp tanks.


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## splur (Nov 26, 2011)

jedimasterben said:


> This. We neared the house sprayed professionally soon though, cucarachas are getting into the house somewhere.


Take advantage of the fact you don't have shrimp right now? Lol...

Cover your tanks though, air tight or do a full water change after.


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## chad320 (Mar 7, 2010)

Its the spray. My friend killed his cocatiels spraying his baseboards and letting them out later that night. I have also had the bug man spray when I wasnt home in an apartment and killed all of my shrimp. lucky for me, the landlady lets me do it myself now. I will be culling TPFRs tonight and you can have the culls for the price of shipping. A cube styro box usually goes for $8 and some change. Hit me with $10 and they are yours.


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## Luna1222 (Jan 12, 2022)

Dude, I am literally crying, same thing happened to me, about 100 of my shrimps ALL died on me overnight after I used a pest killer spray in the room last night to kill some mozzies. For 1.5 yrs of fish keeping, this never happened to me, not like this level. Other fish and snails are fine even the ones have eaten the dead shrimps, but anyone who has shrimps, please never ever use a spray in the room that the aquarium is placed! Even if you didn't sprayed over the tank, I think the chemical molecules sink into the water and literally wipes out ALL your shrimps. I hope this never happens to anybody. I am devastated and traumatised..


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## somewhatshocked (Aug 8, 2011)

Luna1222 said:


> Dude, I am literally crying, same thing happened to me, about 100 of my shrimps ALL died on me overnight after I used a pest killer spray in the room last night to kill some mozzies. For 1.5 yrs of fish keeping, this never happened to me, not like this level. Other fish and snails are fine even the ones have eaten the dead shrimps, but anyone who has shrimps, please never ever use a spray in the room that the aquarium is placed! Even if you didn't sprayed over the tank, I think the chemical molecules sink into the water and literally wipes out ALL your shrimps. I hope this never happens to anybody. I am devastated and traumatised..


You're responding to a post from _ten years ago_. In the future, you should probably consider starting your own thread.

What happened to you, though, just plain sucks. Sorry you're having to experience this.

Important for us all to remember that shrimp (1 S, plural) are bugs that live in water. They're super-susceptible to bug spray and pretty much anything used to deter or kill insects in your house.

If you start a new tank in the future, there are some steps you can take to prevent problems. One thing a lot of people do if it's absolutely necessary to use bug spray (it's rarely necessary) inside a home with shrimp or other invertebrates is completely cover the tank with plastic wrap/shrink wrap. I mean fully cover it - maybe with a few layers to be safe - and use lots of tape to seal up any air gaps. I'd leave it on for 10-12 hours but it's probably fine after a few.


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