# Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - The Mini S Returns! New Layout



## Francis Xavier

_This Journal is dedicated to Khoa Pham. The first person I ever taught Nature Aquarium to - and the first real customer I ever had. May the teachings in this Journal bring the same joy to others as it did to him._

Cryptkeeper54 converted the first half of the thread into an eBook available for download here, the eBook contains the final photo of the Mini M layout which the first half of the thread covers - which has not yet been published anywhere else, so be sure to check out he gorgeous HD photograph!

*Follow Me On:*

Twitter: http://twitter.com/iaquascape
Facebook: http://facebook.com/fwazeter
Tumblr: http://wazeter.tumblr.com

Instagram: @fwazeter

Communicating with me outside Social Platforms:

Email: [email protected]
TEL: 832-459-5172

Table of Contents:

*Opening ACT 1 - New Layout Mayhem!*

1. Introduction - Page 1

2. Getting Started - Step 1 - Page 2, Post 19

3. Setting the Substrate - Step 2 - Page 2, Post 25

4. Penac Pearling - Page 5, Post 64

5. Laying out a hardscape - Stone Arrangement: Step 3 - Page 5, Post 73

6. Basic Maintenance - Page 5, Post 74

7. Philosophy - Enjoying the Process - Page 6, Post 83

8. Planting and Planning for a Mixed Carpet: Step 4 - Page 7, Post 91

9. First Month Filter Setup & Day 5 maintenance: Step 5 - Page 8, Post 111

10. Aquarium Data - Equipment Used - Page 10, Post 143

11. How Co2 is distributed by water with a diffuser - Page 11, Post 160

12. Trimming Carpet Plants - Page 13, Post 191

13. End of Week 1 - Page 13, Post 195

14. Modifying the Layout - Removing an unnecessary element - Page 16, Post 231

15. Trimming Riccia - Page 18, Post 269

16. Size: Large vs. Small Aquaria, thoughts - Page 19, Post 280

17. A word on the International Aquatic Plants Layout Contest - Page 19, Post 284

18. End of Week 2 - Page 20, Post 286

19. Introduction to A New Way of Thinking: Why what you may have learned could be wrong - Page 21, Post 312

20. A New Way of Thinking: There is No Such Thing as Multiple Methods - Page 22, Post 325

21. A New Way of Thinking: Invalidating the Theory of "High Tech" - Page 22, Post 328

22. The NO B.S. Introduction to "The Method" - Page 23, Post 334

23. NO B.S. Method - The Most Important Post I've Ever Written - Page 23, Post 345

24. Removing Diatom Algae and Week 3 Tank Update - Page 24, Post 359

25. End of Week 3 - Week 1, 2, 3 Comparison Overview - Page 25, Post 371

26. The Method - Principle One: Malthusian Organisms - Page 25, Post 374

27. THE CHALLENGE! - Page 26, Post 382

28. ADA's 20th Anniversary (Takashi Amano Story) & Making a Small Layout Adjustment - Page 29, Post 431

29. The Method - Principle Two: The Law of Minimums - Page 31, Post 456

30. The Method - Principle Three: The Cyclical Nature of the Aquarium - Page 32, Post 471

31. Week 4/5 Celebration Video Coverage! The Beauty of Riccia Fluitans! - Page 33, Post 486

32. The final published shot of the aquarium before contest entry  - Page 35, Post 514

*BEGIN INTERMISSION! Fun Stuff in Between Works!*

33. Trimming Riccia Video - Page 36, Post 538

34. Removing BBA manually - Page 39, Post 571

35. Aquatic Poetry?! And 720p video of the Layout - Page 39, Post 579

36. Frank Wazeter on Blog Talk Radio! Aquascaping Discussion. - Page 40, Post 588

*ACT TWO: Enter LED Lighting Technology and a brand new layout!*

37. The Arrival of Nature Aquarium's First Ever LED light: AQUASKY!Page 45, Post 664

38. AQUASKY's Premiere - Solar Mini M retired, AQUASKY on a fresh canvas - Page 45, Post 670

39. The Tear Down of "San Marcos River Summer," and the Creation of the New Layout - Page 46, Post 683

40. Maintenance Regime on the Mini M! - Page 47, Post 692

41. Grow out of the Mini M - Days 1-7 Comparisons between Old and New  - Page 47, Post 704

42. The 60-P Developing with it's semi-permanent Cameo Appearance! - Page 47, Post 705

43. What has beautiful inlay designs and optimal functionality? ADA Anniversary Premium Goods! - Page 48, Post 712

44. Getting rid of that bothersome algae on the glass - the easy way. - Page 48, Post 715

45. Pencilfish Hunting in Riccia & the 60-P props back up again! - Page 49, Post 726

46. Autumnal Hues with the Beautiful Rotala Colorata - Page 49, Post 733

47. Sad News - The passing of my first student. Rest in Peace my friend. - Page 50, Post 736

48. When stem plants become brilliant and add dynamism to the layout -60-P - Page 50, Post 746

49. Time Elapse and Algae Killing in three days in the 60-P - Page 51, Post 751

50. Taking down Khoa Pham's aquarium & Mini M update - Page 51, Post 753

51. It's all in the Details - adjustments on the Mini M with Unzan Stone - Page 52, Post 767

52. Coming up next - the beautiful Microrasbora Kubotai! - Page 52, Post 776

53. Microrasbora Kubotai, subtle coloration adds an incredible dynamic to the layout. - Page 53, Post 782

54. Nano Fish Acclimation Guide! How to get 100% survival rates with ease! - Page 53, Post 789

55. Bringing the Layout to life with Fish - going from "cool" to "lost in the aquarium." - Page 54, Post 797

56. Mystic Photograph of the Kubotai + eBook Remastering of Act 1 - Page 55, Post 819

57. Ranking #127 in the IAPLC (international aquatic plant layout contest) and personal critique by Mr. Amano - an epic end to a great layout. - Page 58, Post 865


_ACT I Finale Shot - #127 IAPLC 2012_


_ACT II Finale_



"How do I create a beautiful mixed carpet in my planted tank?" 

*If you've ever wondered how to create a mixed carpet for your planted aquarium or amazed at how Amano does it, through the course of this thread you will learn how to grow just that.*

Sometimes, the task can seem impossible or overwhelming. So before I really begin to share these secrets, allow me to bring you along my history and development with planted tanks. You will see how you can create a fantastic layout, even if you are starting from humble origins.

Sit back, relax and read every word carefully, because it all starts with a vision:

*My Background History:*

At this point, I've thoroughly mastered growing single carpets as can be illustrated here:











Of course, this would also include your foreground and background stuff (for example, HC and hair grass), as you can see a relatively old example here:










That one kind of brings me back. Dollface might hate that photograph. 

An older (yet more recent example) of an aquarium I never quite did take a finished photograph of:










That one taught me quite a few lessons about riccia: you see those bald stones? that was from a few pieces of riccia that were "spoiled" when they arrived, *Lesson:* always use the greenest and freshest riccia!

*Something Important to Know:* I will always recommend that you master growing one species of plant at a time, for example: an iwagumi that's all hair grass or hc, or microsword etc.

*Why?* because this will give you the greatest skill in manipulating, shaping the plants growth, while knowing at what speed it grows and what it's nutrient requirements are. Think of it like breaking down a math problem into easy, simple to digest and understand components in order to solve a very complex problem (in this case, the mixed carpet).

*Along the way* *there have also been some mishaps and failures:*

How about this blast from the past (2008? 2009? I think):










This was my first ever attempt at a mixed carpet. It went surprisingly well, but I never did try to that extent again. See a close up from Glosso and HC growing together:










Oh, and of course, there was the first iwagumi:










I didn't even remember that somehow I had managed to get Riccia to intertwine with HC in that layout (e.g. it was a Random A$$ Accident) :










Oh boy! Look at that algae! Honestly I think that accidental mixing has been my best attempt yet...3-4 years ago...

And finally, there was my very, very first planted tank:










Man, how embarrassing is that?

There have been some other successes and failures over the course, but honestly? The failures teach you the most. The successes just give you some extra confidence.

*Which brings me to some other examples:

*









I probably should have spent some time polishing that one up a bit. Now that I look back on it, the sparser growth actually creates a nice effect for what I was trying to achieve.










This was the very first layout I had worked on at Aquarium Design Group: and also the first time I had done -anything- with driftwood. I wish I had taken a full shot of this tank then.



With that said, what's the next objective? Mastering the Mixed Carpet. 

Before I delve more into How-To and the fun of keeping the journal going, let me preface:

There will be mistakes. There will be frustration. And my *intent* is to teach you how to master these principles so that you can *learn quicker than me.* This is why I've had a lot of fun going over some of my past layouts, success, failures, embarrassments and all. 

So, without further ado, here is the newest layout I've set up at home:



















I promise not to bore you with equipment details: I'll only share them when necessary and when it's *valuable and worth your time* to know. 

Before we go on further, I have a homework assignment for you:

*Important Exercise*:*Visualize* your ultimate layout you want for your aquarium. Now, picture yourself successfully planting each individual plant, and then watch the plants grow. Imagine problems coming up and solving the problem. Watch as the aquascape evolves from freshly planted to completed, and *imagine* how you feel when you've accomplished the task.

Now sit back, subscribe and continue to watch for updates to take the next step, and the next exercise. Make sure you catch me on my next major update where I'll teach you the fundamentals behind setting the substrate, and if you're lucky, the arrangement of the stones!

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!

*Member Highlights! Check out these people and their awesome work:*

Here are some of my students who are also members of TPT (message me if you aren't listed and should be, or if you are listed and feel you shouldn't or don't want to be!) :

These people all share a passion for planted aquariums and have had great success moving forward! Cheer them on as they work their way towards being masters of the planted tank universe.

*Khoa N. Pham* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=122232

*fplata* - 




















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=181063



*freph* - 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=181281

*mluk27* - 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=174106&highlight=mluk27

*Dave Allen* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=184547

*Dollface *- 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=170180

*pejerrey* -



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=169143

*ozydego *- 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=181009

*dantra* - http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=161640

*frrok* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=160093

*flyinghellfish* -










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=49336

*orchidman* -










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=188790

*Brian MC* - http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=51675

*2wheelsx2* -










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=6864

*Jeff5614* - 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=107781

*Lludu* - http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=52328

*Zeldar* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=186330


----------



## FisheriesOmen

Not sure what the purpose of the first 95% of the thread was(was pretty confusing) but they looked good and can't wait to see your tank planted. I would suggest getting rid of the first part of the post and just get straight to the point. Good luck on your mixed carpet.


----------



## Warlock

where do you get all the cool stone!!


----------



## salmon

FisheriesOmen said:


> Not sure what the purpose of the first 95% of the thread was(was pretty confusing) but they looked good and can't wait to see your tank planted. I would suggest getting rid of the first part of the post and just get straight to the point. Good luck on your mixed carpet.


I think the idea was to purposely illustrate the trails of prior carpet/mixed carpet success to give us all incite on what this journal will be about. Not trying to put words in the OP's mouth or anything, but I think it's a very good post.

*****

Frank, very interested in watching this. Not any easy thing to do by any means, I pulled out half my hair trying to trim my mixed carpet recently. I find the mixed styles to appear much more natural, like something that would actually be found in the wild opposed to a placed and "kept" feel.

Watching this for sure! Keep us posted :smile:


----------



## Dave Allen

Frank, very interesting to see how your aquascaping skills have developed.

It's a good reminder for those who try to emulate the beautiful tanks of Mr. Amano and others that everyone had to start somewhere and learn along the way. When I think about this hobby, more and more it strikes me that I'm less drawn to an final destination of a "finished" tank than to the journey of trying to get there.

Can't wait to follow along and learn some new things!


----------



## manikmunky

Very encouraging thread, thanks for posting it and the pictures of the early tanks, "failures" and works in progress. It's easy for those of us still starting out to get disheartened when we see some of the amazing looking aquascapes and lush planted tanks out there. Now I have to remember I'm aiming to get that good, eventually, but not overnight


----------



## jcgd

Ah yeah. I've been running my mind over this issue for the last year or so, trying to figure out how I would incorporate a variety of foreground plant into a layout. It's awesome that I can watch to see what happens with your experiences. Do you have a plan of attack in mind? Did you have a style that you are striving for, such as crisp barriers or plants overlaying each other, or are you just wingin' it?

I'm pumped for this.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FisheriesOmen said:


> Not sure what the purpose of the first 95% of the thread was(was pretty confusing) but they looked good and can't wait to see your tank planted. I would suggest getting rid of the first part of the post and just get straight to the point. Good luck on your mixed carpet.


Thanks for the valuable feedback. I've rewritten a bit of it to make it a little more clear. Make sure to read over the initial post again for gems. 



Warlock said:


> where do you get all the cool stone!!


Honestly, Warlock, most of the stones that I've used I've collected over the years through swap n shop or a few various ADA shipments (I've yet to utilize any of the Ryuo stone, as I like to select pieces for people which I would feel comfortable using myself and this is the most popular type). 

To be completely honest with you though: many of these stones are rather "dull" upon first glance (especially in the Mini M I will take us through on this journey), however the trick is knowing how to arrange them and use them. Which I will be covering.



salmon said:


> Frank, very interested in watching this. Not any easy thing to do by any means, I pulled out half my hair trying to trim my mixed carpet recently. I find the mixed styles to appear much more natural, like something that would actually be found in the wild opposed to a placed and "kept" feel.
> 
> Watching this for sure! Keep us posted


Salmon, you will definitely want to take a pen and paper out and take notes and do the "homework," assignments i'll leave at the end of each major update. These are valuable secrets to success with the planted tank, which you will not find posted or written anywhere else. 



aegis32 said:


> Frank, very interesting to see how your aquascaping skills have developed.
> 
> It's a good reminder for those who try to emulate the beautiful tanks of Mr. Amano and others that everyone had to start somewhere and learn along the way. When I think about this hobby, more and more it strikes me that I'm less drawn to an final destination of a "finished" tank than to the journey of trying to get there.
> 
> Can't wait to follow along and learn some new things!


Aegis, we all start humbly! I think you will learn, as others who I am sure are feeling the same sentiment as you posted, that we all face the same challenges and roadblocks. Even Mr. Amano did.



manikmunky said:


> Very encouraging thread, thanks for posting it and the pictures of the early tanks, "failures" and works in progress. It's easy for those of us still starting out to get disheartened when we see some of the amazing looking aquascapes and lush planted tanks out there. Now I have to remember I'm aiming to get that good, eventually, but not overnight


Make sure to do the homework assignment at the end of the first post! You will find your way to success here. 



jcgd said:


> Ah yeah. I've been running my mind over this issue for the last year or so, trying to figure out how I would incorporate a variety of foreground plant into a layout. It's awesome that I can watch to see what happens with your experiences. Do you have a plan of attack in mind? Did you have a style that you are striving for, such as crisp barriers or plants overlaying each other, or are you just wingin' it?
> 
> I'm pumped for this.


jcgd, you will definitely want to be following and taking notes, I'll give you a teaser on the plan in the next post. As we go through the learning process, make sure to ask questions and save yourself headache! Most people who ask questions when learning about the planted tank and are open to being taught, master these concepts very quickly.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Before going further with post updates, I want to give a little insight into how you can learn how to *unlock Amano Magic* in your own planted aquariums. 

Each new major post will have an easy to follow format designed to teach step by step (and if you already know the basic steps, it will be good review to master them!) so you can begin to fully master the techniques that will lead to you fulfilling your vision. 

At the end of every post, there will be a simple and fun homework assignment that you can do to really improve your planted tank skills quickly. Most people who participate in these simple exercises find ways to instantly improve their layouts, whether they are completely new to the hobby or have been in it for years. 

Continue to read every word carefully and you will know the secrets of the professionals without having to go through the hassle of learning the hard way.

Until next time, here is the *planting formula* for this aquarium: 

**i**th** c******h******
******s*i**a e*******d*s
r**c** ***it**s
m**r* **o*d
e****od***s t***l**s
e****h***s ***c***ri*
w****w ***s

To get your mind situated right, here is the *universal starting point* for all of us:










The only difference here on out is *skills* and knowledge, which you will learn here.

Best Regards,

Frank Wazeter

P.S. Have you done the first homework assignment? If not go back and do it now in the first post!

P.P.S. If you're just starting a new planted tank or thinking of redoing your layout, this is the perfect time to join in and follow along from start to finish!

P.P.P.S. Have you subscribed to and shared this thread yet? If you haven't, what are you waiting for!

P.P.P.P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Dollface

I like how your threads keep getting increasingly ridiculous over the span of your TPT career Frank.


----------



## rezco

Subscribed


----------



## Rockhoe14er

Great thread. What happens if you're visualization is more about just being able to grow difficult plants and trying to learn how to really watch them and see what they need? I keep trying to visualize and I find what gives me the best sense of accomplishment is being able to grow new species of plants. Maybe once that's mastered and I learn how to read my plants I'll be ready to design my dream aquascape.


----------



## Kai808

Subscribed!!


----------



## orchidman

this looks like it will be a great thread! subscribing for sure!


----------



## AhVy

Subbbbscribedd!! More more!!


----------



## CrazyCatPeekin

Groovy thread! Subscribed!


----------



## mahko

Going to watch this one for sure. Subscribed.


----------



## pejerrey

Oh geez I'm glad I got here on time(I hope). I started this on monday with some 8month old ada substrate and some new mr aqua. But I could tear it apart and start again if needed.

Subscribed!










Will I be able to grow the hc with pps.pro x 4 and lots of co2? 

There is to ramshorns and 4-5 juvenile RCS.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Have you done the visualization exercise yet? If you haven't, stop reading and immediately refer to post #1 and do it! If you have, then great! you're ready for me to move on to the next step, which starts with an important question:

"How do I start?"

How do you start out your planted aquarium optimally for success? 

Most people understand that it is easier to start right the first time, rather than dealing with the problems that occur when you get off to a rocky start. You need to get the aquarium to stability and growth as quickly as possible. Master this skill and you will enjoy beautiful layouts, look over it, or ignore it, and your planted tank will be an emotional battle from day one.

STEPS TO STABILITY:

STEP ONE: Bacteria

The most vulnerable time for your planted tank is when you first set up. We need to cycle the tank with beneficial bacteria, not only for the nitrogen cycle (ammonia), but also for synergistic bacteria which grow and thrive amongst plant roots.

These bacteria form a "micro-filter" in your aquarium that work for you to break down negative elements and create positive ones that help your plants grow with health and vigor and your fish to be healthier.

*Action Step: *the quicker you can provide this bacteria, the faster your aquarium is stable and the less chance for algae.

STEP TWO: Chemistry

Water balance (pH & kH) is *critical*. Neutral water has a pH of 7. Alkaline water is above 7, and acidic water is below 7. Too much acid and the plants will fry like an egg on a skillet, too much alkalinity and the plants will bleach out. The healthiest pH ranges for planted tanks is about 6.7-6.8 (slightly acidic). 

On a less extreme example, higher kH and pH values (alkaline) makes it harder for plants to grow. Why? Imagine the mineral values in typically really high kH and pH water literally blocking the cells of plants, making it difficult for them to absorb nutrients, anything above 7.6 pH is usually harmful. A pH that is too low leads to plants burning themselves (browning out, etc) on the water. These values are typically between 5.8-6.2 (excepting in certain rarer plant conditions, I'm only talking about averages).

*Action Step: *the closer you can maintain your standard pH & kH values to a pH of 6.8 and kH of 2, the more effective co2 distribution and nutrient absorption will be!

*Pro Secret: *ignore pH values taken while co2 is in the aquarium: the lowering of pH from co2 does not have a harmful effect on the "real," pH. Don't worry if your co2 levels push your pH readings down into the "low" acidity ranges. 

Health Reference: the human body's healthy pH is 7.35 to 7.45, even tiny variation outside of this requires the body to adjust the pH values (requiring more energy and making you less energetic). Even a minor change outside of this pH would result in death! It's a good thing our body works to regulate that pH just like our body temperature!

Health Tip: Most of the foods we eat are highly acidic. Stress also increases acid levels in the body. Eat more alkaline foods and you'll see a big boon in energy. Which foods are alkaline? Greens! Who knew there was a really good reason behind Mom complaining to make you eat more vegetables?

STEP THREE: Nutrients

It would be silly to think that plant's can't grow without nutrients. Just imagine how long you can live without food. The nutritional aspect for plants is largely covered by nutrient rich substrates such as Aqua Soil, which cover all of the essential macro nutrients required for plants to grow. 

Later on, I'll show you what nutrients specifically are being provided, but in the mean time just know that Aqua Soil takes care of this for you without the need for you to worry about it. Of course, if you want to create your own substrate that will require more research. 

*Action Step:* Investing in the best substrate system you can gives you the best advantages for success. Never short-change your substrate, because otherwise you will have long term issues. 

*Pro Secret: *Pro's Cheat. Yes they CHEAT! They never go into a situation with a planted tank without making sure they have rigged the odds in their favor and *neither should you*. 










_Substrate system completed in the aquarium.The magic is below the substrate._ 

Make sure you continue to read every word, and next time I'll go underneath the soil into the setup of the substrate system so you can learn to *cheat to win like the pros*.

*Fun Exercise: *Look at an aquarium, now picture yourself shrinking and going deeper and deeper into the aquarium. The fish become larger, the plants become monolithic. You're still getting smaller, so small that you can't be seen without a microscope and visualize what you see: billions and trillions of other organisms the same size as you, working, growing and synergistic-ally processing elements. Imagine them lighting up in concert like electricity and steadily expanding to the exact needs of your planted tank. Watch them as they go through their life cycles: living, multiplying, dying. Recognize that this is the very foundation of your aquarium.

Make sure you're subscribed so you don't miss out on a single word in this journal to master the steps for your own planted tank success.



P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

pejerrey said:


> Oh geez I'm glad I got here on time(I hope). I started this on monday with some 8month old ada substrate and some new mr aqua. But I could tear it apart and start again if needed.
> 
> Subscribed!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will I be able to grow the hc with pps.pro x 4 and lots of co2?
> 
> There is to ramshorns and 4-5 juvenile RCS.


Don't worry! You are in time! Of course, if you want to restart and follow the journal step by step, you are absolutely welcome to. 

For soil that age I recommend investing in Iron Bottom and Multi Bottom: inject these into your substrate and you'll super charge growth as if the soil was new.


----------



## Ptjameso

Very cool and informative! Subscribed!


----------



## pejerrey

Will do, thanks!

-PH 6.5
-6dKh (after this test I lowered the bps in half, lol!)
-7dGh


----------



## Red_Wall

Subscribed! Using this thread for tips on my tank!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Here's a little bonus for today:

For inspiration, I've attached an unexpected photograph. For Nature Aquarium, many people look to pictures like:










While this can of course work for inspiration, it's much better to equate Nature Aquarium to an extremely micro scale, I find my best inspiration in the weeds outside.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Getting Started with the Substrate

Earlier I mentioned that professional's "cheat," and the *first step* towards cheating to stack the odds in your favor is having a killer substrate system. 

If you refer to my previous major post, I went over a series of three steps towards starting out right with your planted aquarium. Step one: Bacteria & step two: Chemistry is the area where you will want to focus the most on when setting your substrate. 

Of course, Step three: nutrients is wildly covered by Aqua Soil Amazonia, and doesn't need much to talk about: it really just is the work horse of growing plants. 

*Side Story: *Awhile back I had a customer come in and ask about Amazonia, saying he wanted to give it a try. He had been using eco-complete and flourite for years and I told him a simple fact: "if you can grow plants in eco-complete and flourite well, you will be a god with aqua soil." Sure enough he showed me a few photographs of his plantings, and he could indeed grow plants quite well with eco-complete and flourite. 

Sure enough he got some aqua soil, and for a while I hadn't heard back from him, and to be honest, had completely forgotten about him. Well, the other day he comes back and shares his enthusiastic results with Amazonia saying that the plants grew so fast that he was able to achieve in 3 months what took him 2 years to grow using the other substrates. 

Alternatives to Aqua Soil: Hagen has recently released a new product, Fluval Substrate. Third party testimony says that it grows plants fairly well, however I have not had any first hand experience with this product and cannot honestly give a side by side comparison, though I'm sure others can.

*Back to Basics: Starting the Substrate*

Aqua Soil leaches a lot of acidity. If you refer to the previous post, you know the effects of excessive acidity: the plants are burned at the root. While aqua soil by itself does not provide enough acid to burn plants out, plants -do- wildly benefit by a way to neutralize the acidity at the root level. 

*Penac P & Penac W: Add three spoons of each*

These two additives come in first, and they do precisely two things: neutralize the over-acidification of soil and rapidly oxygenate the water at the substrate level.

This means two things for you: plant roots grow easier and are more healthy and it means that the initial rapid oxygenation helps spurn bacterial growth immensely. 

Adding Penac P (spoon comes included with all ADA additives):









Spread Penac P evenly against the bottom pane of glass:










On top of Penac P, add Penac W in the same way, and you'll have something that looks like this:










*Tourmaline BC: add ten spoons*

Referring back to Step 1, it's important we foster bacterial growth and longevity as quickly as possible to get the aquarium as stable as possible so we do not have to deal with *major algae* outbreaks.

The best way to think of Tourmaline BC is to think of it as a high purity carbon (which it's not, but it does a similar task) which purifies water and helps in the break down of toxicity, waste, etc. 

Adding Tourmaline BC:









Now your Aquarium should look like this after 10 spoons of Tourmaline:










The importance of tourmaline is that it helps to break down the waste that builds up over time in the substrate and makes it harder for plant roots to grow. 

*Next up: Adding Power Sand*

In Nano-aquaria, Power sand is not necessarily needed due to size, however in this case I want some heavy slope, so using power sand helps to stabilize the soil and slope for build up without break down.

However, normally what Power Sand does is serve as a "home" for the bacteria to thrive in: like biological filter media it provides a highly porous surface area which allows these bacteria to thrive. Meaning that when plant roots reach and attach to power sand their roots essentially become super charged!

Power Sand also contains peat, so it has extra nutritional additives to the aquarium, but again, Amazonia does the bulk of the work on this front.

Spread the Power Sand evenly across the bottom, and leave the front open to prevent power sand from being seen in the viewing panel:










*Adding Bacter 100: The Bacteria - 3 spoons minimum, I used 10*

Next up, Add Bacter 100. This is the dormant bacteria which will do all of the heavy lifting with promoting healthy roots through synergistic bacteria. It is not possible to over dose this additive.

Spread it evenly so that the Bacter will thrive in the Power Sand. 










Bacter 100 spread evenly over power sand (you can also put this underneath power sand on the glass, either or works):










Another use for Bacter 100 is to eliminate cyano-bacteria should it appear in the tank, apply directly on top of it and it will eat it away.

*Add Clear Super: 3 spoons, food for bacteria.

*Clear Super is simply a food source for the bacteria. Until the aquarium becomes established we have to add a food source for them to grow and thrive, otherwise the bacteria will die off. 

Add three spoons of Clear Super over Bacter 100:










The Completed Substrate system:










*Last Steps: Adding Aqua Soil*

For a nano aquarium we use powder type since it allows smaller plants to spread roots easier as well as to keep the perspective in the Nano aquarium properly in place. 










Afterwards, use a tool, such as Sand Flattener to smooth out the substrate and keep the substrate line straight in the front.

*Do the Additives really do anything?*

The key to long term healthy plants is root health. The additives precisely promote this type of growth and health. For comparison sake here are two examples of two aquariums with and without additives and their roots.

These aquariums have been up for the same amount of time, same dosing, same lighting, same core products (aqua soil), while not an exact one for one, it's a broad illustration that you can evaluate for yourself the differences (it's more about the overall picture here) :

With no additives (please forgive the reflection, lots of light in the room!) :

Take note of the root growth and cyano bacteria in substrate:

glosso:










Blyxa and Rotala Stems:










Now, with additives:

Hair Grass (note, hair grass has pretty insane root growth regardless, pay more attention to the overall substrate 'health') :



















*Exercise: *Read over this post a few times, take notes if you'd like, and share what you're working on or if you're starting an aquarium and would like to follow play-by-play link back here!


P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Chlorophile

Wow this almost comes off condescending.


Btw your "with additives" "without additives" pictures are a joke, you showed a part of a tank with what looked like hc and a part that may have had no plants and compared it to a tank that obviously has a hair grass carpet...
Those plants behave so differently you can't even compare them.


----------



## Dollface

Chlorophile said:


> Wow this almost comes off condescending.
> 
> 
> Btw your "with additives" "without additives" pictures are a joke, you showed a part of a tank with what looked like hc and a part that may have had no plants and compared it to a tank that obviously has a hair grass carpet...
> Those plants behave so differently you can't even compare them.


What is even the point of this post? It seems like we have this additive drama in almost every single thread that Frank talks about them and it's useless. Frank is detailing here how he sets up a tank with the full ADA substrate system, and how it works for him. If you don't want to Believe In The Heart Of the Penacs, Yugi! you don't have to, just use regular old AS that's been proven to grow plants well over and over. Frank says the full system works better for him, and you know what, I believe him. He's only set up almost a dozen tanks using ADA substrate and presumably has a pretty solid comparison point for with and without additives by this point.


----------



## ltdan84

Subscribed


----------



## gnod

i don't know what it is about this lay out, but this REALLY feels like i'm staring at a mountain. something about the slopes, and the flatness of the smaller rocks... perfect
i find it difficult to visualize with the rocks i have.. haha not an easy task
i think this is my 3rd time im going to try to rescape my tank now. looking forward to the rest of the post


----------



## 2wheelsx2

I really like the look of the powder and realize now that I should have gone with the powder in my cube, but don't want to rip it all out again. The powder does fit better with the smaller tanks/scapes.


----------



## zchauvin

Dollface said:


> What is even the point of this post? It seems like we have this additive drama in almost every single thread that Frank talks about them and it's useless. Frank is detailing here how he sets up a tank with the full ADA substrate system, and how it works for him. If you don't want to Believe In The Heart Of the Penacs, Yugi! you don't have to, just use regular old AS that's been proven to grow plants well over and over. Frank says the full system works better for him, and you know what, I believe him. He's only set up almost a dozen tanks using ADA substrate and presumably has a pretty solid comparison point for with and without additives by this point.


You really think those two pictures did any justice?!?! Hahaha what a joke. If he wants to praise the products that's not the best way to do it. Hell, I didn't use any additives and I could take two pictures of my ONE tank and the two sides look just as different. The first pic has freshly planted hc as you can see the plants "clumps" are still there as it hasn't grown in same as the second, while the "additive" picture has a fully grown in mature hairgrass carpet.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Ozydego

wow, I dont see the point of flaming here. take from this thread what you will. if you dont believe it, dont follow the thread. I find the information extremely helpful, am I going to go out and buy every ADA product from those pics, probably not, but the nit picking just has no place in a thread like this. The man is taking HIS time to share his experience, take your hate elsewhere


----------



## zchauvin

Oh wah wah the pc police... Nobody is flaming here, just posting opinions... I just had to read the last three post again and to me it seems like people are just discussing what they see. But hey, its a forum right?!? 

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Booger

But it harnesses the power of ions! I LOVE IONS! :icon_lol:

Same old argument. For the uninitiated, consider reading this and maybe this or this or this to start with. I think Tom may be tired of carrying the flag for science.


----------



## Couesfanatic

+1 booger. I'm a skeptic.

But if anyone wants to do it, then go for it. I will be spending my money elsewhere. 

BTW I own 2 ada tanks, both with ada aquasoil.

I do think these threads are very helpful to beginners. Everyone just needs to take everything with a grain of salt in this hobby. It can be tricky at times with what to believe.


----------



## zchauvin

Yeah, aquasoil is great but yeah.... Hmm, about those ions!!!! Lol 

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## plantbrain

Chlorophile said:


> Btw your "with additives" "without additives" pictures are a joke, you showed a part of a tank with what looked like hc and a part that may have had no plants and compared it to a tank that obviously has a hair grass carpet...
> Those plants behave so differently you can't even compare them.


Yes, they need to consider total biomass, not just root growth alone. Many species have very different root/shoot ratios.

The whole business about long term growth is always a dead ringer.........since few aquarist can not measure measure or determine long term growth differences. Heater cable people tried this same old argument. If there is no difference in the rate of growth, then..........you cannot say much, if it is a subtle thing etc, over long time spans, then by that very definition, it is not a significant factor. This is circle talk marketing. 

I consistently sell a lot of wimpy hard to grow plants out of several tanks, the roots look pretty healthy. I've seen AFA's tanks and they have BGA below the glass also on some tanks with all the ADA fixings. 

Maybe the CO2 is different, maybe the plant species are different.
This may suggest something to consider further, but that is about it.
If the CO2 is different then the plants from the CO2 low tank will add less O2 to the sediment. More growth= more O2 to the roots.

One reason the cable and the additive folks bother me is a simple fact they do not address the plant's own abilities: they add O2 and everything else they need, the bacteria will establish quite well on their own. That is taking a natural instead of a chemical approach. Maybe some like chemical approaches, I prefer to keep it much simpler.


----------



## Dollface

Wow, TBH I wouldn't even blame Frank if he just abandoned this thread now, and the entire forum at this point. No matter what you think of ~magic ADA additives~ or what, he's still bringing a lot of valuable info to the table and he gets attacked with petty grudges over camera phone pictures. You flaunt your ADA tanks and AS, yet still attack *an US ADA supplier* for what, using and promoting his product line?

If you really want to debate the merits of the additives, calling him condescending and then childishly invoking "the PC police" (Which doesn't even apply to this, jeez) isn't the way to go about it.


----------



## zchauvin

Dollface said:


> Wow, TBH I wouldn't even blame Frank if he just abandoned this thread now, and the entire forum at this point. No matter what you think of ~magic ADA additives~ or what, he's still bringing a lot of valuable info to the table and he gets attacked with petty grudges over camera phone pictures. You flaunt your ADA tanks and AS, yet still attack *an US ADA supplier* for what, using and promoting his product line?
> 
> If you really want to debate the merits of the additives, calling him condescending and then childishly invoking "the PC police" (Which doesn't even apply to this, jeez) isn't the way to go about it.


Whoa whoa whoa, no one ever said anything about the information he brings us. No need to put words in peoples mouths, no one attacked him for using his product or marketing it. Go read the words said, is someone not allowed to point out the simple facts that are in the pictures HE uploaded. They are different pictures of different plants used to promote one product and the fact that he made it seem differently is what started his customers to post their feelings. I mean, we are all his customers and therefore should be given straight forward facts. And lastly, me bringing up the pc police had nothing to do with frank, it was to the person who came in saying how we should appreciate what he's doing ect ect when our statements had nothing to do with him in any way.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Dollface

zchauvin said:


> Whoa whoa whoa, no one ever said anything about the information he brings us. No need to put words in peoples mouths, no one attacked him for using his product or marketing it. Go read the words said, is someone not allowed to point out the simple facts that are in the pictures HE uploaded. They are different pictures of different plants used to promote one product and the fact that he made it seem differently is what started his customers to post their feelings. I mean, we are all his customers and therefore should be given straight forward facts. And lastly, me bringing up the pc police had nothing to do with frank, it was to the person who came in saying how we should appreciate what he's doing ect ect when our statements had nothing to do with him in any way.
> 
> Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


If you have legitimate questions about his products as his customers, then, idk, maybe you could have contacted him directly with your possible concerns about them, not publicly whine about it on what's still _his personal journal_. It's pretty obvious from your vitriol though that you have no intention of buying any of this, so why complain? What's the point? Frank has done a lot of work to clarify the claims that ADA makes about these things, attempting to back it up with his own experiences and anecdotes, yet you're still mocking him with this "Ions" childishness. 

He also isn't obligated to post any of this, so yeah, I'd hope that people would appreciate that he's making the effort to be so active and present in the hobby. When was the last time you saw the guys from AFA do a journal for one of their show tanks, demonstrating their process and their techniques?

Really, this whole thing is just disrespectful beyond imagination. Would you go into Tom's tank thread and start ranting about how E.I. is a scam? That's basically what you're doing here.


----------



## zchauvin

I buys lots of their stuff, and I'm not whining... I contact frank personally first when I buy something... No one told frank he had to do this... Ei is actually proven to work.. need I say more?

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Dollface

zchauvin said:


> I buys lots of their stuff, and I'm not whining... I contact frank personally first when I buy something... No one told frank he had to do this... Ei is actually proven to work.. need I say more?
> 
> Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


No, your attitude makes it obvious that any further argument would be pointless.


----------



## zchauvin

I wonder what frank will be using I'm this tank... Glosso and dhg, riccia perhaps?

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## orchidman

Maybe all of them, because the tile says mixed carpet.


----------



## zchauvin

Lol yeah, I see them use the glosso and riccia then dhg a little further back as a shade plant so to speak. We shall see soon enough 

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## orchidman

I'm excited!!


----------



## hidefguy

Very informative. subscribed.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'm getting a little ahead of myself here, but the planting has been finished at home and I'll share the results with you! Of course, I'll back track a bit to go step by step.










P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## zchauvin

Looks great Frank, apologize about the little rant that took place between earlier. 


Anyways, did this replace the NA you had started a little while back?

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Chlorophile

Dollface said:


> What is even the point of this post? It seems like we have this additive drama in almost every single thread that Frank talks about them and it's useless. Frank is detailing here how he sets up a tank with the full ADA substrate system, and how it works for him. If you don't want to Believe In The Heart Of the Penacs, Yugi! you don't have to, just use regular old AS that's been proven to grow plants well over and over. Frank says the full system works better for him, and you know what, I believe him. He's only set up almost a dozen tanks using ADA substrate and presumably has a pretty solid comparison point for with and without additives by this point.


Not making any comment on the additives.

It's as plain as day that you can't compare those two tanks root shots, to pass those off as proof is insulting.

Maybe if it were the reverse, and the hc had root growth like the hair grass and the hair grass also had root growth like hair grass always does...

If I put rocks under aquasoil and plant hair grass and then just use aquasoil in another tank and plant hc, and claim the rocks are why there is a dense mat of runners an roots in the hair grass tank, would that be okay with you, would you close your eyes and applaud?


----------



## Chlorophile

Anyway, beautiful hardscape.

Really nice placement, the curve of your main stone gives a sense of movement even though the stone is pretty upright


----------



## orchidman

Riccia!!!! Yes! I'm so excited about this, I love Riccia used this way! It looks great can't wait to see how you did everything!


----------



## dantra

*Show Me The Data*

Not too long ago I had an issue with a vendor who happens to be a sponsor here at TPT. I showed documentation in the form of emails and photos about the product that was shipped to me. I was basically ignored, all they did was blame the manufacturer and passed the buck.

Someone posted on my thread about not bashing the company without having the slightest clue of what they were talking about. Needless to say the thread was outright removed.

Frank represents ADA, which just happens to be a sponsor at TPT as well. He should be afforded the same courtesy as the other sponsors. If anyone disagrees with anything he says, it can and should be discussed on another thread so he can continue to provide countless others with the information he’s taking the time out to provided.

Now that that’s out of the way, here is my question, where is the proof that it doesn’t work? I’m not being facetious, I would like to see the scientific results debunking the “ADA Substrate System”. Here is why I ask, I quote Frank here, “You can actually sprinkle Bacter 100 on top of the substrate if you get cyanobacteria or other problem algae’s and over night the cyano bacteria will be eaten away by the bacteria and will likely not show up again.”

That actually has been proven to work, so why is it that the total “ADA Substrate System” is said not to work by so many? We know many metals, chemicals, minerals and acids are stable and harmless until mixed with something else, like Ammonia and Clorox for instance. How do you know that a reaction doesn’t occur that benefits the substrate?

Is it because you grew plants without the additives? So what, that alone doesn’t debunk the “ADA Substrate System”. Many people have grown plants implementing the “ADA Substrate System”. Did anyone measure the substrate, take samples, record any data and analyze the amount and health of the bacteria in the substrate? 

Allow me to put this into perspective and at the very least bring light to what I have observed on many forums.

We have 10 people using the entire ADA Substrate System. All of which are excited to implement said system. They all range in age and experience. We go from complete novice to expert.

Novice
1.	Has no clue what he/she is doing and gets algae – claims the ADA Substrate System doesn’t work, a waste of money.

2.	Same as above.

3.	Adds a couple of plants, D.I.Y CO2, feeds fish too much gets algae. Hardly any water changes gets algae – water stinks - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.

4.	Brand new tank, very little plants, doesn’t change filters like he/she should, debris in tank, not enough ferts gets algae - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.

5.	Too much light, not enough ferts, not enough CO2 (swears they do have enough CO2 because the drop checker says so) doesn’t change from mechanical filtration to biological filtration, tank dirty, little to no filtration maintenance, gets algae - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.

6.	Same as number 5

7.	Same as number 5

8.	Same as number 5 however at this stage they may start making the connection… maybe. This may apply to number 7 as well. Less light, not enough CO2, gets algae - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.

9.	Think they know it all, constantly trying to get people to follow their methods or you are doing it wrong, egotistic, narcissistic, won’t admit to being incorrect, in fact they’re never wrong, may still be battling CO2 issues. Thinks they are too good for the “ADA Substrate System” or claims it doesn’t work, shows no proof (tangible data, evidence). Did I mention egotistic…

10.	Debunks methods with proof (tangible data, evidence), shows proper methods of correction, explains cause and effect, understands and admits that there exist many roads leading to same results. Open to new methods and ideas etc… at this stage they are less critical until tests are conducted until proven correct or incorrect, doesn’t let emotions dictate results. However there are exceptions to this, after all we are human.
Expert

I would also like to mention that people become lazy, neglect the tank then blame something else as oppose to looking in the mirror. 

From the examples listed above, mostly all have high light, ignore CO2 and CO2 distribution and lets not forget oxygen or lack there of but somehow claim that the "ADA Substrate System" doesn't work. Don't get me started about the obsession folks have claiming fert deficiencies when it's really CO2.

What I learned is that 99% of the times, it is user error. It’s not the method that doesn’t work it is the way it is being implemented and carried out. There are so many variables that can throw an entire system off that you cannot blame one thing.

The “ADA Substrate System” may very well create a reaction in the substrate that benefits it, may benefit it a lot, very little or not at all, I simply don’t know. I say show me the data proving either or. 

Now just because you don’t/can’t see what the billions/trillions of bacteria in the substrate are doing doesn’t mean that the system isn’t working. Again I say, show me where you measured the substrate, took samples, recorded data and analyzed the amount and health of the bacteria in the substrate with and without the “ADA Substrate System”.

I will admit I did purchase the "ADA Substrate System" for my son Connor. After he used it I started to research, looking for answers about the substrate system. I didn't find one piece of hard data/evidence that showed it doesn't work. I did find an endless source of critique, attacks, emotionally charged hatred toward "The System". Why does it invoke such a powerful emotional response from individuals? I'll never know.

I look forward to the data. roud:

Obligatory Disclosure:
I feel this needs to be said, this isn’t an attack on anyone nor is it intended to offend anyone’s delicate sensibilities.

Dan

p.s. I apologize for the lengthy post Frank, hope it doesn't detract from your thread.


----------



## Couesfanatic

Dantra good point. 

IMO, I think everyone is upset by the method used as proof. I mean the picture posting. But can you blame anyone for supporting their company and product line?, of course not. I don't think Frank was meaning to "fool" anyone by his pictures, as some implied. He was simply showing his tanks and how he feels it works.

Like you, I would love to see some data, although I doubt it has been studied.


----------



## Chlorophile

dantra said:


> Not too long ago I had an issue with a vendor who happens to be a sponsor here at TPT. I showed documentation in the form of emails and photos about the product that was shipped to me. I was basically ignored, all they did was blame the manufacturer and passed the buck.
> 
> Someone posted on my thread about not bashing the company without having the slightest clue of what they were talking about. Needless to say the thread was outright removed.
> 
> Frank represents ADA, which just happens to be a sponsor at TPT as well. He should be afforded the same courtesy as the other sponsors. If anyone disagrees with anything he says, it can and should be discussed on another thread so he can continue to provide countless others with the information he’s taking the time out to provided.
> 
> Now that that’s out of the way, here is my question, where is the proof that it doesn’t work? I’m not being facetious, I would like to see the scientific results debunking the “ADA Substrate System”. Here is why I ask, I quote Frank here, “You can actually sprinkle Bacter 100 on top of the substrate if you get cyanobacteria or other problem algae’s and over night the cyano bacteria will be eaten away by the bacteria and will likely not show up again.”
> 
> That actually has been proven to work, so why is it that the total “ADA Substrate System” is said not to work by so many? We know many metals, chemicals, minerals and acids are stable and harmless until mixed with something else, like Ammonia and Clorox for instance. How do you know that a reaction doesn’t occur that benefits the substrate?
> 
> Is it because you grew plants without the additives? So what, that alone doesn’t debunk the “ADA Substrate System”. Many people have grown plants implementing the “ADA Substrate System”. Did anyone measure the substrate, take samples, record any data and analyze the amount and health of the bacteria in the substrate?
> 
> Allow me to put this into perspective and at the very least bring light to what I have observed on many forums.
> 
> We have 10 people using the entire ADA Substrate System. All of which are excited to implement said system. They all range in age and experience. We go from complete novice to expert.
> 
> Novice
> 1.	Has no clue what he/she is doing and gets algae – claims the ADA Substrate System doesn’t work, a waste of money.
> 
> 2.	Same as above.
> 
> 3.	Adds a couple of plants, D.I.Y CO2, feeds fish too much gets algae. Hardly any water changes gets algae – water stinks - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.
> 
> 4.	Brand new tank, very little plants, doesn’t change filters like he/she should, debris in tank, not enough ferts gets algae - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.
> 
> 5.	Too much light, not enough ferts, not enough CO2 (swears they do have enough CO2 because the drop checker says so) doesn’t change from mechanical filtration to biological filtration, tank dirty, little to no filtration maintenance, gets algae - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.
> 
> 6.	Same as number 5
> 
> 7.	Same as number 5
> 
> 8.	Same as number 5 however at this stage they may start making the connection… maybe. This may apply to number 7 as well. Less light, not enough CO2, gets algae - blames ADA Substrate System and claims it doesn’t work.
> 
> 9.	Think they know it all, constantly trying to get people to follow their methods or you are doing it wrong, egotistic, narcissistic, won’t admit to being incorrect, in fact they’re never wrong, may still be battling CO2 issues. Thinks they are too good for the “ADA Substrate System” or claims it doesn’t work, shows no proof (tangible data, evidence). Did I mention egotistic…
> 
> 10.	Debunks methods with proof (tangible data, evidence), shows proper methods of correction, explains cause and effect, understands and admits that there exist many roads leading to same results. Open to new methods and ideas etc… at this stage they are less critical until tests are conducted until proven correct or incorrect, doesn’t let emotions dictate results. However there are exceptions to this, after all we are human.
> Expert
> 
> I would also like to mention that people become lazy, neglect the tank then blame something else as oppose to looking in the mirror.
> 
> Mostly all have high light, ignore CO2 and CO2 distribution and lets not forget oxygen or lack there of but somehow claim that the "ADA Substrate System" doesn't work. Don't get me started about the obsession folks have claiming fert deficiencies when it's really CO2.
> 
> What I learned is that 99% of the times, it is user error. It’s not the method that doesn’t work it is the way it is being implemented and carried out. There are so many variables that can throw an entire system off that you cannot blame one thing.
> 
> The “ADA Substrate System” may very well create a reaction in the substrate that benefits it, may benefit it a lot, very little or not at all, I simply don’t know. I say show me the data proving either or.
> 
> Now just because you don’t/can’t see what the billions/trillions of bacteria in the substrate are doing doesn’t mean that the system isn’t working. Again I say, show me where you measured the substrate, took samples, recorded data and analyzed the amount and health of the bacteria in the substrate with and without the “ADA Substrate System”.
> 
> I will admit I did purchase the "ADA Substrate System" for my son Connor. After he used it I started to research, looking for answers about the substrate system. I didn't find one piece of hard data/evidence that showed it doesn't work. I did find an endless source of critique, attacks, emotionally charged hatred toward "The System". Why does it invoke such a powerful emotional response from individuals? I'll never know.
> 
> I look forward to the data. roud:
> 
> Obligatory Disclosure:
> I feel this needs to be said, this isn’t an attack on anyone nor is it intended to offend anyone’s delicate sensibilities.
> 
> Dan
> 
> p.s. I apologize for the lengthy post Frank, hope it doesn't detract from your thread.


There are 10 kinds of people, but 5, 6, and 7 are the same?
Why not say there are 8 kinds of people?


No dis to the ADA system, I don't have the money to spend on most of it. 

If I offended anyone I'm sorry. Love the scape, just not a fan of claiming that the roots that were depicted in that picture are because of the additives, not a fan of the implication that the HC tank may have looked like the hairgrass tank if you had used additives.

Edit: Some people need proof something doesnt exist/work to not believe in it, I need proof that it DOES exist/work before I believe in it. God, Psychic powers, medicine, fertilizer, etc, etc, etc. 
If you want you could set up a hairgrass tank which is known to root very well, one with and one without additives, make sure you plant evenly so as not to skew the results, provide everything else identically, and then take a shot of the roots against the glass - but you'd have to take a shot of every part of the glass, not just pick the most rooted section and the least rooted section, or you could weigh the roots, I don't know what your methodology would be. 
I am sure there would be some benefits in the tank with additives, and if those benefits are worth your money, and they make you happy then that is awesome. 
It's all about being satisfied.
Again I have nothing bad to say about the additives but couldn't let those photo's be passed off as proof of anything other than the fact that hairgrass roots like crazy and sends out runners underground...


----------



## dantra

Couesfanatic said:


> Dantra good point.
> 
> IMO, I think everyone is upset by the method used as proof. I mean the picture posting. But can you blame anyone for supporting their company and product line?, of course not. I don't think Frank was meaning to "fool" anyone by his pictures, as some implied. He was simply showing his tanks and how he feels it works.
> 
> Like you, I would love to see some data, although I doubt it has been studied.



I wasn't upset nor offended. Instead of putting things into perspective, people nick pick at the most obvious things. They contribute nothing to the discussion instead berate and attack the messenger with their snide comments.

Do I think he was intentionally trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes, absolutely not. It was just an example. People get with the program. Sometimes we take for granted that people know what we mean or our intentions but somehow that doesn't transfer well and looses its translation in the forums.

Dan


----------



## dantra

Chlorophile, the reason I asked for proof that it doesn't work is because it is deemed as a proven system. The proof is Mr. Amano's Gallery that has been running for years. Perhaps I didn't make that clear. Again I took it for granted that people would put that together.

I understand what you mean and how you feel however looking forward despite the misunderstanding I'm still looking for the data that debunks the "ADA Substrate System".

Hopefully someone can provide us with said documents.



Chlorophile said:


> There are 10 kinds of people, but 5, 6, and 7 are the same?
> Why not say there are 8 kinds of people?


Allow me to clarify, when I said 5,6 and 7 are the same, I meant that they for the most part do things almost the same way. Not entirely identical but similar enough nonetheless. I guess I didn't make that clear either.

----------------------------------



Chlorophile said:


> Edit: Some people need proof something doesnt exist/work to not believe in it, I need proof that it DOES exist/work before I believe in it. God, Psychic powers, medicine, fertilizer, etc, etc, etc.


I guess you overlooked the sentence referring to proof being provided *whether it works or not*. Allow me to quote myself.



dantra said:


> The “ADA Substrate System” may very well create a reaction in the substrate that benefits it, may benefit it a lot, very little or not at all, I simply don’t know. I say show me the data proving either or.


Hope its clear now,
Dan


----------



## Eldachleich

Im excited..
I have alot of trouble creating a good slope, and a decent hardscape.
My other trouble is how to mix plants appropriately. And what to consider when choosing plants. 
This thread is very helpful in that regard.
Thank you..


----------



## pejerrey

Where is the "ignore" button for all the spam? Lol! Joking!

Keep it up Frank! I decided I will try the ADA method as described in your thread to have the experience of it. I have other tanks with other methods but I want to try yours.

Where do I find detailed info about the additives and substrate components? I'm curious to know what exactly is in them and how they work.


----------



## dantra

pejerrey said:


> Where is the "ignore" button for all the spam? Lol! Joking!
> 
> Keep it up Frank! I decided I will try the ADA method as described in your thread to have the experience of it. I have other tanks with other methods but I want to try yours.
> 
> Where do I find detailed info about the additives and substrate components? I'm curious to know what exactly is in them and how they work.


This may help you out. I think this is what you're looking for.

Dan


----------



## Dollface

dantra said:


> This may help you out. I think this is what you're looking for.
> 
> Dan


That entire thread is one of the gems of the forum.


----------



## Francis Xavier

pejerrey said:


> Where is the "ignore" button for all the spam? Lol! Joking!
> 
> Keep it up Frank! I decided I will try the ADA method as described in your thread to have the experience of it. I have other tanks with other methods but I want to try yours.
> 
> Where do I find detailed info about the additives and substrate components? I'm curious to know what exactly is in them and how they work.


While the purpose of this thread for me isn't to plug product, (rather, to I enjoy teaching technique and methodology, and if I knew of any alternative products I'd list them) I won't object to directing to http://adgshop.com as a direct source.

Onto other things:

I listed out a lot of these techniques i'll be using here in the thread Dantra linked.

For the record, it's totally okay for you to have objections or skepticism. I don't hold it against anybody for supporting what has worked for them. What I am showing is what has worked for me, time and time again and eliminated most of the problems I had before. A good example is I can't tell you how to grow plants in eco-complete, I have a good idea, but I haven't done it for myself so I cannot judge on those methodologies. 

We all reach a point in our aquascaping skill set where we have to challenge what we thought we knew, re-evaluate and establish a skill set that will allow you to create the aquascape you -really- want to create. 

If your aquascape isn't all that great, do not be afraid of that fact (look at my first post again! there were more blunders than successes on my path to really learn and master technique). Admit it to yourself! Say "hey, my aquascape kind of sucks, I _want_ to be better," and sure enough you will open your mind to the very things that will enable your further advancement. If you're totally okay with how your aquascapes turn out already, that's great - and I envy you for it, since I am constantly of the mind set to improve it. 

*When you can fully embrace your current skill set and the desire to learn more, you will be unstoppable.* I guarantee you that Amano himself continues to learn. All Masters in *any field* never stop learning, so don't ever stop! You should be a master. You *deserve to have* a planted tank in your home that looks like the ones in the pictures.

Most people who can make that basic admission to themselves (the only thing that really matters), will advance their skill by leaps and bounds.

*What is the Point?*

This isn't a sales thread, or even an ADA thread really (hard to believe that one, eh?), this is an informative thread from the aquarium in my home, not in a gallery. It will include techniques I use, both ADA and non, to achieve cool scapes. This thread only contains information which I use that works 100% of the time. I've got nothing to personally sell you or otherwise. All of the equipment used here I personally purchased before taking over ADA-USA at ADG (albeit, the Wood Cabinet Stand was a gift from Jeff Senske). 

*Why am I doing it in a how-to fashion for a journal of my personal aquarium at home?* 

Because I love you guys here at TPT and want to see a bunch of other badass scapes being produced! It's more inspirational to look at other's work in many regards than your own. So get cracking on those layouts and sling up those journals. Post them here even for feedback!

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## zchauvin

Exactly, as I said from the beginning Frank its just opinions. In the long run were here because we want to see you put together a scape and learn from it.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Francis Xavier

Take this post as an interpretation of what-you-will, but these are effects that I've never experienced without the use of Penac P & Penac W in the substrate, and i'm always amazed when I see it at the start of a fresh tank.

This was 5 minutes after the tank was filled:










Now my timer is set for 7pm CST to 5am CST so I can see the tank, so when I woke up this morning at 9 AM, this is what the tank looked like:










Rapid Oxygenation (ignore the riccia stone on the rock, I had an extra I tied I don't know what to do with yet) :










Kind of beautiful, don't you think?

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

You can also see some of the beautiful hues in Manten in those pictures, which only appear when wet.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

zchauvin said:


> Looks great Frank, apologize about the little rant that took place between earlier.
> 
> 
> Anyways, did this replace the NA you had started a little while back?
> 
> Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


Thanks Zach! 

This is at my home, so it did not replace that Mini M at the gallery. However, that Mini M was torn down since Mike wanted to do something with it.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## zchauvin

Francis Xavier said:


> Thanks Zach!
> 
> This is at my home, so it did not replace that Mini M at the gallery. However, that Mini M was torn down since Mike wanted to do something with it.


Oh alright, you didn't happen to get my pm?

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## ClintonParsons

I use the whole substrate system, power sand, additives, etc. I supplied like half a bottle of each and six spoons of the Penac powders. 


I have never had fish in this particular three monthh old tank, only healthy plants.

Still, there is a white nematode infestation. Every time I dose excel, Nematodes come out and swim around. They are living in the substrate. 

Other than this, everything is fine. I don't know what is wrong withy substrate system to allow the Nematodes to exist there. Someone is off. I don't know what they are eating either since I have never added any fish or shrimp or food to the tank. 

Maybe you have some ideas, Frank? What's up with my substrate system?


----------



## Couesfanatic

I have the same issue, although I consider it free fish food. And as I stated earlier in the thread, I don't use the additives, just the substrate.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Clint and coues,

Nematodes are completely random, sometimes they hitch hike on plants or the like and get in the water. They are totally harmless, and best way to remove is to add fish. When you do, do a full filter cleaning to remove any excess and periodically use airline tubing to remove dead matter from the substrate and plants during a water change.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Couesfanatic

Thanks for the advice. I'm not complaining, actually I prefer them being there. Its free fish food. Also works well on vacation or when I'm busy and forget to feed. 

In retrospect, we all know that ADA Aquasoil is by far the best option for our planted tanks. In fact, I wish I could find some New Aquasoil powder to buy right now.


----------



## ClintonParsons

Awesome, I figured it indicated that my substrate wasnt healthy. Since excel pisses them off, is that indicative that I shouldn't be using excel at all?


Also, what is the secret to making hair grass grow! I am trying to mix it with glossy and it's been like two months! It is painfully slow and was planted at the same time as your 60-P. 

Are there any do's and dont's you an suggest when trying to make a mixed carpet? Guidelines for what species look good (or bad) when mixing? Trimming tips for plants that grow at different rates that you want to mix together, maybe?

I tried mixing riccia with glossy but riccia was such a PITA for me.... Messy trimming, the bottom died and contributed to algae, etc. which is unfortunate since it looks so good when mixed with glosso.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Secrets to Successful Stone Arrangement

Most people see the beautiful works of renown aquascapers and wonder: "how do I do that?" Before they know it, they attempt it and in frustration can't figure out how to make their layout look like the pictures.

I'm going to give you the number one secret to stone arrangement, and it's not about having the fanciest looking stone (although that certainly helps), for perspective, the stones I used in this layout contain nothing but "left-over" material that no customers wanted (after 6 months of sitting on the shelf!), and so it found it's way into my personal collection.

You've probably spent hours fiddling around with stones in your aquarium, in what started out as exuberant enthusiasm ended in frustration and headache. You then probably posted pictures of your hardscape to other people on the internet in hopes of feedback and tweaks, and in the end you have three or four copies of a layout that's based on what someone else thinks and no matter what you do it just doesn't feel "right." It seems "forced," when it grows in and you then said something like "eh, Iwagumi just isn't for me," or "man, if I _just_ had better stones like the pro's, I could do this too."

*Don't worry*, I was *just like you* and did exactly the same pattern I see repeatedly done over and over again on TPT and other forums. Just laugh and go "yeah, yeah we do do that a lot don't we?"

I'm not saying that getting other's feedback is a bad thing: it can be incredibly valuable. Priceless even. But don't let that make your entire scape or change your gut feelings.

Jesus! What is this secret already then?

Frank's Iwagumi method:

The first secret is simple, remember my first exercise? VISUALIZE! Don't visualize mountains or landscapes or any of that. But, visualize your aquarium layout, how you want it, regardless of what you have now, and you will succeed invariably with it. Focus on how the plants will grow in.

In other words BEGIN your layout with the END in mind. The number one reason why most layouts fail is because they begin at the beginning, and not at the end. If that doesn't make sense, imagine yourself shooting free throws in basketball. If there was no basket to shoot at - you wouldn't have a goal to aim for and score. You would be just throwing a basketball aimlessly in a random direction: how can you hope to succeed like that?

State of mind is extremely important to scaping in general: it should take you no longer than 15-20 minutes to lay down an aquarium, and in a nano tank i'd even say about 5 minutes. You need to be relaxed: not stressed or frustrated or your layout will show it. 

Scaping much longer than 30 minutes in an aquarium leads to the scape feeling 'forced,' and you lose the ability to 'see,' whats right and wrong naturally. So if you're experiencing scapers block after 30 minutes, leave it and move on and come back the next day: or at least in a few hours. 

*The second secret* is a little unintuitive: the most important factor to an iwagumi is selecting a main stone of appropriate size, not character, for the aquarium it's placed in. Your first focus is size: it needs to fit to scale, the second focus is character and detail.

In most mini's this means that the objective is to select a rock you think is over sized. You want to place this stone first. Always place the main stone first, the rest should follow.Here's some picture references: 

Placing the main stone *tip, keep the slope fairly high, this gives you greater manipulation of seemingly flat pieces and smaller pieces to look larger*:










In a nano it's okay to be a little centered due to the small canvas size. Place the stone at a pleasing angle. A brief description of angles: straight = stable, flat = stable, 45 degree angle = drama, angles closer to straight = stable, slightly dramatic, angles closer to 45 degrees = dramatic, closer to stable.

With ALL of your supporting stones it's very important to make sure texture and color matches, not just stone type, so select stones that 'feel,' like they are part of the same group.

Place the secondary stone (your second largest) :










In this example you can see that this stone (which is flat by the way by itself), forms an opposite angle to the main stone, which is situation straight up (stable), this adds a "dramatic" feel to the layout, by redistributing the "energy," or "flow," of the aquascape. (Dollface, maybe you can draw some angles on these pictures with diagrams, hint hint)

An important note: in an iwagumi, usually the SECOND stone is the most important in the whole layout, as it dictates how the scape will flow and how you plant accordingly to that. 

Think of the main stone as the star actor in the movie, and the supporting stone as the director, the star actor has the spotlight on him/her, but the director 'directs,' the whole picture.

Next up, we place some supporting small stones:










This stone mostly acts off of the power of the supporting stone, matching it's angle and softening the overall angle of that side of the tank, it will be largely invisible when plants grow in. It's a "hidden" trick, but very important. Even stones that will eventually be covered up by growth are essential for the layout.

Finishing the scape, fourth and fifth stone:










These stones largely dictate one thing: they go in motion with the main stone and distribute the "flow" of the aquarium cleanly down into the corner where it pleasantly ends. This completes the layout so that the eye has no place to wander unnaturally, and when placed together like this, form a single "cluster" or grouping of stones that look as if they might appear together.

*Important note* some of the placement here might look odd at first even, and the reason is, is that the END picture of the scape is for the majority of the secondary and tertiary stones to be completely covered by plants. Here's a great lesson for the necessity of stones, even if you plan on them being covered later on and the necessity for visualizing.

*Fun exercise*: Go back to the first page, read the end of the first post, and perform the visualization exercise once more (or for the first time).

P.S. Use a sand flattener (or other straight edged tool) to flatten out the substrate line in front. This is extremely important:










P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Let's fast forward to the present day so I can cover day one maintenance of the tank, i'll keep this short and brief with mostly pictures (for the first week, there will be a water change EVERY DAY, this is huge for preventing algae) :

Frank's water change & maintenance methods:

Drain water into a bucket with eheim tubing (obviously, you should consider turning off the filter first) :










Drain to about half full (make sure to leave enough water to fill back up with ease without disturbing substrate):










Trim any yellow or brown leaves (these suck out the plant's energy / nutrients so get rid of them asap for best growth) (using Trimming scissors curve type) :










Use a small cup to fill over, gently pouring water on the big main stone (this distributes water flow over the tank and doesn't disturb substrate:










Turn filter on when the water level is about halfway level with the outflow, this helps to super oxygenate the water at fill up:










At this stage in the game, I am only dosing Green Bacter, will start adding Brighty K + Green Bacter on the third day, add about 3-5 drops:










Use a net to remove any old or dead leaves at the top (doing this for a few minutes each day keeps the tank clean and makes it so you don't have to spend major time doing it later) :










Maintenance Complete (approximately 10 minutes)










One last tip: of course, if you're using tap water add dechlorinater first. I use pure RO/DI water as the water in Texas is very hard. I recommend it for anyone who has the means.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Dollface

Francis Xavier said:


> (Dollface, maybe you can draw some angles on these pictures with diagrams, hint hint)


:icon_roll

Hey man, don't be hatin' on my angles.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Dollface said:


> :icon_roll
> 
> Hey man, don't be hatin' on my angles.


I actually want you to draw angles since I am lazy right now.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Dollface

Francis Xavier said:


> I actually want you to draw angles since I am lazy right now.












Is that enough angles?


----------



## Francis Xavier

It's great! Maybe you can do one with the plants in too!

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Dollface

Francis Xavier said:


> It's great! Maybe you can do one with the plants in too!


You could at least do a long winded analysis, I wasted a whole 2 minutes on that thing.


----------



## frrok

this is fantastic! even though I read every immature and childish post, I really wish we can just focus on what Frank is trying to do here. drop knowledge. No one is forcing ADA products down your throat. By the way, Aqua soil is pretty much DIRT in little granules that look perfect! i will be using it in my next layout.
subscribed!


----------



## orchidman

i have a question for you! how do you easily prime your filter if you empty the water below the intake?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Orchidman,

With quick disconnects if you just close them before draining water you'll be okay. In filters without them, don't drain below the input. Although, with the eheim 2211, usually you can drain a bit like I did, turn it back on and it works fine. Shake out the filter a bit to get rid of the air bubbles within.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

So I was enjoying just looking at my aquarium tonight and decided to snap a photo. Here's a photo of the aquarium looking pretty much exactly like it did yesterday:










This inspires me to have a talk with you about something important, often overlooked:

*The Planted Tank, More than Any Other form of Aquaria, is about Enjoying the Process*

Do me a favor for just one moment: completely forget about the science, the products, the plants of the planted aquarium. Because this isn't what it's all about. 

This is the most important post you will ever read about the planted aquarium, so read every word thoroughly. 

Everything you do with the planted aquarium is about one thing, and one thing only: coming to enjoy every process of it. No, scratch that, I want you to LOVE every step of it. 

What do I mean by that? I mean that you need to develop a passion so deep, that you enjoy every aspect of it. 


1. Nurture a love for doing water changes, understand that water is what gives life itself to the aquarium, and to renew it's source on a constant basis means you give it life itself: from the microscopic bacteria to the plants, to the fish & shrimp.

2. Develop a love for the process of setting up the hardscape: do it with decisiveness and confidence. Study the patterns of great aquascapes and approach your own with enthusiasm. 

3. Carefully plant every species, showing the plants care, pay attention to them and trim off dead and dying leaves: they drain the plant's resources to grow.

4. Modify your filter media to best suite your aquarium's growth patterns, the planted tank constantly evolves and it's needs change over time to require different things. 

5. Make it a habit to clean your glassware and net out old trimmings from the top, this keeps the flow of water and distribution of vital co2 in good condition. Be proud of your setups.

To illustrate the points, I have an inspirational story to share:

Not too long ago, a member from this forum came into ADG with his son, Connor. That forum member's name is Dantra. As they came into the shop, they had an exuberant enthusiasm for the two displays we had up. As I had began talking with Dantra, it had begun as a fairly standard question and answer session. I thanked him for his compliments on our set ups, and answered the questions he had.

But then, there was a surprise:

His young son, Connor, was actually incredibly enthusiastic and incredibly knowledgeable on planted aquariums. I didn't know it at the time, but he had been studying the works of Amano, following this forum, and had wanted to come to ADG for a long time to see for himself. 

So taken aback by Connor, I took out the last remaining copy of The Book of ADA we had available, to Dantra and Connor's great surprise. When Dantra asked me about the book I said "you can have that one." To which, he replied "I can't believe that, how much do I owe you." I told him then, "no, don't worry about it, I want Connor to have it. It's a rare thing to see in anyone - much less someone his age." To which, the two were completely stunned at. 

Just this past week, Dantra gave me a call and asked a few questions, and when asked how Connor was doing, he told me a story. 

Connor had become so dedicated to the planted aquarium that he poured over research after research. He - unknown to me, had gone over every old post by planted aquarium experts, had poured over The Book of ADA like it held all the secrets of the universe in it. 

More amazingly, he then began applying everything! Dantra told me how Connor was so insistent about doing water changes on schedule, about trimming off dead leaves of plants, about making sure every technique he used was by the book, and more amazingly: *how he was in love with every step of the process*. 

Dantra then said something, which we should all take into exact account and learn from:

"you know, he was so insistent on doing water changes, and so insistent on trimming, and adding exactly what was prescribed by Amano, and I told him "Connor, that's just not necessary, you don't have to go overboard like that." and Connor replies (which I might add, is a completely indefensible statement) 

_"Dad, I remember all your old tanks and your battles with algae, and I'm just saying that if Amano does it, Frank and Jeff (Senske) do it, then we could at least try it. Otherwise you develop bad habits."_

So, being unable to defend against such a well argued point (that phrasing is something out of a lawyers playbook!), Dantra let him do it. And sure enough, the problems they had classically had disappeared. 

This level of research, the adamancy to technique, the love of maintenance and care for the aquarium and the bonding experience those two had is something that is completely rare and to be treasured.

Immediately go to this thread and look at Connor's work. Then take a look at yourself and say "you know, I can learn something from this." 

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals/161640-dans-ada-45-c-fitted-bulkheads.html

_I know I learned something from it._

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## ClintonParsons

That reminds me of when I was cleaning the filter on a Friday afternoon one day (did I tell you how much I LOVE my super jet?!?!?). My house mate asked me why and his reasoning was that it was Fiday. I said"it's the first of the month..." or something like that.


For me cleaning the filter is as stress and enjoyable as him playing video games. Actually probably more since he screams at the TV and gets pissed off ; )



Getting to play with my super jet and admire the craftsmanship probably helps, I won't lie. I do seem to enjoy maintaining it more than my green plastic Eheim!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Exactly the right mindset Clint!

In Iwagumi land for today, I didn't snap any pictures, but I did a 75% water change. At night I drained the water level down to be halfway level with the Nano Lily Pipe (for aeration, not necessary but helps during set up with this type of lily pipe during first few weeks).

Then before the lights came on I drained about 40% more of the water (75% total), filled back up, added 5 drops of Green Bacter.

Total time spent: 10 minutes.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Hey Frank, is there an Iwagumi thread here? I find it hard to beleive if they'res not. You know, a thread to share the best of our Iwagumi setups?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Kiran,

There is currently not an iwagumi thread for people to share, although you may feel free to share your best works here if you like.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Surprising. I'll share some tomorrow when my pipes come in!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Before going to sleep last night, I took a few more photo's on the aquarium. 

Day 3:










Today (Day 4) when I do a water change, I'll be adding in Brighty K (potassium) to the mix, in addition to already dosing Green Bacter (encourages bacterial growth). 

A quick recap:

Day 1-3: no fertilizers, only Green Bacter.
Day 4-7: Brighty K + Green Bacter

I took a little bit of extra time when I got home to remove any yellow leaves and melting debris (mostly from the microsword). My guess is that by the end of the week the riccia will start going vertical. 

A Nifty angle:










P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'll be updating with the planting section of how to do all this fun stuff. But while going through some photo archives, I found a cool shot of the 60-P:










P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Okay, let's get into some more nuts and bolts. You're here to learn, aren't you? Or are you here for my stunningly handsome persona? What's that? you say it's just to learn something? Well, fine, then:

How to Plant & Plan for a Mixed Carpet

So you've got your layout and you've decided on what plants you want to use, and you know basically what you want to achieve (because you've done some visualization right? if you still haven't, refer back to the end of the first post). 

For this Mini M, I had a laundry list prepared, but only ended up using the following plants:

Riccia Fluitans
Hemianthus Callicthroides
Willow Moss
Eleocharis Acicularis
Mini Microsword
Echinodorus Tennellus 

Before you begin to plant, you're going to have to decide on where and how to plant things. In other words you need a basic plan as to how you want the aquarium to look and grow out.

In order for you to successfully pull this off you need to have a knowledge of what pattern the plants grow in, how fast they grow and where to place them.

If you don't have much experience with growing the individual species you use, I highly recommend you practice on growing individual carpets of plants.

Because it is difficult to truly pull off a mixed carpet (due to the trimming methods and growth patterns) I highly recommend you focus on just growing a single carpet plant at a time before you dive into a full-fledged mixed carpet that involves multiple plants you've never worked with before, then start combining carpet plants you've worked with in the past to create a synthesis of the types. 

Anyway, so first let's subdivide our plants to work with into categories, for this layout I divided them as such:

Background Primary: E. Acicularis, Mini Microsword (touch)
Foreground & right side: HC, Riccia
Midground, focal point left: Willow Moss (primary), E. Tenellus (touch)

Preparing the Plants

The easiest part of setting up the layout is the actual planting, the hardest part is the preparation. Once the plants are prepped, it takes the little time to actually finish the planting (comparatively).

I start with the most PITA plants first: in this case, tying Riccia to stones (because it floats otherwise), and Willow Moss to porous stones (for attachment).

Plant #1: Pre-prep and Riccia










Healthy Riccia, if your riccia looks any different (unless in emmersed form), don't use it. Riccia spoils easy, so only use green riccia, and remove all brown or decaying riccia, otherwise your plants will suffer later (follow through with this for every plant). 

Tools: Riccia Line, Trimming Scissors, Riccia Stones (flat stones)










Before you start, use a spray bottle to wet the stones, this makes it easier for Riccia to "stick" to the stones, consequently making it easier for you to tie the Riccia to the stone. 










Riccia never attaches to stone, so it's important to use wire / line that will never disattach. When you are tying the line to the stone, make horizontal patterns across, then corresponding vertical patterns (creating a checkerboard of string tying it to the stone), and knot at the bottom of the stone. Use a thin layer of Riccia on the stone for best growth and do your best to get riccia to cover all four corners.

I couldn't get any pictures of tying the stones, as it takes both hands to do the tying and couldn't use the phone camera. But here's what the finished product should look like:










Next up: Willow Moss. Moss will eventually attach itself to surfaces, so for tying moss, use a type of cotton (Moss Cotton), which will dissolve over time.

Tools: Porous Stones, Trimming Scissors, Moss Cotton

Healthy Willow Moss (again,don't use any browned out plant matter) :










You'll just quickly tie together as much moss as you can. Moss grows slowly, so for a carpet of any means, to out compete riccia and hc, etc. Start out with much more than you think you need. 

Wrap firmly around the stone, and tie your knot underneath the stone like the riccia stone. 










Next: Hemianthus Callicthroides

Divide the pots HC come into like so:










Make sure you use pincettes to remove any excess cotton wool from the plant roots. 

Make sure to wash the plants in water (even moss and riccia) before planting and tying, this removes dirt, debris and dead leaves from the plants, look at the cup of water and see the built up dirt!










Divide HC evenly into clumps:










Repeat this pattern for Hair Grass (Eleocharis Acicularis), Microsword and E. Tenellus.










Now, Planting the Tank:

Tools: Fine-tipped Pincettes

Before you begin planting, mist down the soil with a spray bottle for ease, and raise the water level to even with the lower substrate line (this makes it much easier for you to plant.










First things first, lay down Riccia stones. Position them around main stones and in areas where you want the most growth. Here I'm emphasizing the back right and front and right corners most, so that's where the Riccia goes.










Next, lay down the Moss Stones, these are situated for me at the left for the primary focal point, behind the secondary stones. 










You should lay these plants down first because they will act as a guideline for the rest of the plants for proper mixing.

After the moss and the Riccia, I went ahead and planted the hair grass evenly spaced in the back. For hair grass like this, you only need to plant a little bit, because of how fast it grows.










The Final planting step is to plant HC between all the riccia stones, and across the main panel as it's the primary carpet plant to grow between riccia.

Adding a touch of Tennellus between the moss stones will ensure they grow together with a pleasant contrast, and planting the microsword behind the main stone and as a touch around the right focal point and the left adds an extra layer of texture to the layout.

Finished Planting:












P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## salmon

great in-depth look of the planting frank!

curious on the "mini" microsword used here, what sp. of lilaeopsis is that?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Salmon,

It's Brasiliensis. Honestly, this plant, depending on how it grows, may or may not have to be removed down the road. It's the only plant that's kind of a catch 22. It could go either way in the end.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## salmon

Francis Xavier said:


> Salmon,
> 
> It's Brasiliensis. Honestly, this plant, depending on how it grows, may or may not have to be removed down the road. It's the only plant that's kind of a catch 22. It could go either way in the end.


Thanks for that Frank. From my experience (which isn't much) it does looks great when interspersed in a mixed carpet, but when trimming time comes, trying to properly trim the HC/DHG around it is where I had to draw the line and hack it all. that and it likes to run way too much. I'll try and dig up a photo of my mixed layout.

Subscribed btw....keep these great posts coming!


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Although I appreciate the tank for what it is, I have to say I think it appears to be a proof-of-concept rather than a planned aquascape. Well that's not fair to say actually, it was very, very well thought out. But thought out to prove that this could be done. But that's not to say it's a bad thing. I like it though. Just throwing that out there.


----------



## Dollface

No, It's definitely a planned aquascape.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Back to the daily maintenance on this tank: 

Day 4 water change was about 75-80%. For the record, this photograph illustrates to you why I do water changes every day during the first week:










You can't detect that green tintish-water while it's in the aquarium, it just looks completely clear. It's comprised of decaying plant / melting plant matter and algae spores. So, an ounce of preventative maintenance is your number one secret to success.

Again, 10 minutes total time spent in changing water. No pruning today, but I've begun to add Brighty K now that the plants have settled a bit.










Upside down due to camera fun. Aerial shot of fertilizers are fun. Only one squirt of Brighty K.

Don't forget, also adding 5 drops of Green Bacter at this point.

On another note: here's the aquarium for today at a different angle than before.










P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Love that diffuser, Frank.


----------



## Francis Xavier

It's a great design for a nano, unfortunately they do not come standard with the co2 advanced system.

Which reminds me, I promised you a few photos of the Maintenance Stand I in another thread:



















While normally I would agree with you that the boxes should incur a "wtf," response in correlation to what's sitting on them, but in this particular case they are filled with Aqua Journals and what not, so it's rather appropriate. Or something.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Dollface

Man, no matter what you think of ADA, they really do have a superbly cohesive looking product line.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> P.P.S. If you're just starting a new planted tank or thinking of redoing your layout, this is the perfect time to join in and follow along from start to finish!
> 
> P.P.P.S. Have you subscribed to and shared this thread yet? If you haven't, what are you waiting for!



Sub! , good timing as I'm trying to grow a carpet of HC Cuba and would love to follow your progress.


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Francis Xavier said:


> It's a great design for a nano, unfortunately they do not come standard with the co2 advanced system.
> 
> Which reminds me, I promised you a few photos of the Maintenance Stand I in another thread.
> 
> While normally I would agree with you that the boxes should incur a "wtf," response in correlation to what's sitting on them, but in this particular case they are filled with Aqua Journals and what not, so it's rather appropriate. Or something.


Nice! Thanks man, that looks awesome.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Keeping in line with the spirit of having things updated on the fly:










Riccia growth on Day 4: It's beginning to perk up and go vertical (a good thing). 

Speaking of Riccia, it's an interesting plant: here's a species which is basically really moody. I've seen Riccia change color hues, growth appearance, etc. All based on where it is in the light cycle for the day and whether or not you gave it compliments when the lights turned on or not.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## houseofcards

Riccia is definitely one of my favs and I could see why it was used so much by Amano to get this NA thing going. Also probably one of the most prolific pearlers out there. 

BTW very nice scape!


----------



## Francis Xavier

houseofcards said:


> Riccia is definitely one of my favs and I could see why it was used so much by Amano to get this NA thing going. Also probably one of the most prolific pearlers out there.
> 
> BTW very nice scape!


I am in complete agreement here, and thank you for the compliment.

I'll give you a hint of my scapes to follow for a while: they will involve riccia.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## FlyingHellFish

I see you place your HC Cuba in clumps as well, I did the same but am getting side shoots that don't cover the ground evenly.

Do an in-depth on the HC Cuba carpet if you can good sir.


----------



## @[email protected]

riccia looks great, and IMO is the best thing to judge CO2 (better even then a drop checker). 
but its such a HASSLE to keep in large amounts. trimming it often, and then when the bottom is rotten, retying the healthy top part. and all the floating riccia bits...
good luck.


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Keeping in line with the spirit of having things updated on the fly:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Riccia growth on Day 4: It's beginning to perk up and go vertical (a good thing).
> 
> Speaking of Riccia, it's an interesting plant: here's a species which is basically really moody. I've seen Riccia change color hues, growth appearance, etc. All based on where it is in the light cycle for the day and whether or not you gave it compliments when the lights turned on or not.


Any reason for the one riccia stone on the rock there? EDIT. looks more like moss. I can't Id it. Lol


----------



## Francis Xavier

frrok said:


> Any reason for the one riccia stone on the rock there? EDIT. looks more like moss. I can't Id it. Lol


No reason: I had an extra riccia stone I don't know what to do with yet, and since I went through the trouble of tying it, I didn't want it to just rot. I'll probably untie it and leave it on a cup on a window sill or something. It's only temporary.



@[email protected] said:


> riccia looks great, and IMO is the best thing to judge CO2 (better even then a drop checker).
> but its such a HASSLE to keep in large amounts. trimming it often, and then when the bottom is rotten, retying the healthy top part. and all the floating riccia bits...
> good luck.


I hear you marko on the long-term maintenance challenges of riccia (good thing it grows quickly for replanting), but there's nothing quite like riccia for an absolutely gorgeous carpet mix: hence why I will use it and continue to master it in every layout I do for a while.



FlyingHellFish said:


> I see you place your HC Cuba in clumps as well, I did the same but am getting side shoots that don't cover the ground evenly.
> 
> Do an in-depth on the HC Cuba carpet if you can good sir.


Hey Flying, really the trick to carpet plants in the initial planting is to do two things:

1. Plant as Deeply as possible initially for glosso, etc.

2. To plant it well enough that it stays down, and dense enough that you have a high bio mass to start with.

Follow-up strategies are what leads to tight, clean carpets. For HC, practicing an aggressive trimming strategy will lead to a tight, clean carpet.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## gnod

any advice on mini riccia? I just got some in, and saw it pearling well yesterday (yay). 
they don't grow as fast as normal riccia right?


----------



## Francis Xavier

So, I got to Day 5 yesterday of the water change cycle, and upon getting home I noticed the water was a little brown. Not super-brown, kind-of-sort-of tannin-ish-but-not-really color. I should further clarify to you about the brown color: more of a slight tint than an actual brown. In otherwords, not perfectly clear water.

What this signaled to me, is that I should be preparing for a diatom outbreak sooner or later (perfectly fine) and that any plants in the emmersed form are currently breaking down and melting (which you can see visibly behind the main rock), a totally normal process.

Because I didn't think ahead and only started to do a water change, rather than getting a picture of the tank with the slight coloration difference (which you probably wouldn't be able to see in a photo anyway), I got you an ever-famous-frank-bucket shot.










If you're feeling particularly motivated you can compare this photo side by side with the other bucket shot, showing the differences in water. 

I drained the tank down a bit to:










*Pro Tip: *Exposure to air helps to kill some algae types. In general it's a pretty good preventative maintenance strategy to drain as much as you can on at least a monthly basis.

To spurn some extra aeration on fill-up: I turned the filter on at this water level:










Doing this as a regular practice helps to rapidly oxygenate the water during a water change, which is healthy for the overall environment (due-to-a somewhat long scientific explanation that involves oxygen levels at the microscopic levels, which you don't need to know to know that it helps and is free to do).

*Total maintenance time: *11 minutes

*Let's go back in time for a minute:

*Setting up the filter

Okay, so i'm assuming that you know how to set up a canister filter, and if you don't, just go to eheim.com or the like: it's fairly simple. 

Really the point here is to expose *my secret* for the setting up a canister filter for a planted tank. 

It involves an easy first step, which we're all familiar with:










If you bought an eheim, it should come with Bio Rings (mechanical filtration), if you'd like to use the ADA version, it's Bio Cubes (which we'll have sooner or later), but for now just have a layer of mechanical. This helps to break down / catch larger debris in the filtration process.

The second step is pretty easy too:

Carbon. (Rinse before use always, large explanation as to why, but just know that you need to do it. Also, don't do it in any area where it can stain the surface, carbon stains stuff. Like, say, in the bath tub. I did that once and it took me like a month to clean the carbon off. Bad idea. Use a stainless steel kitchen sink or the like).










That's it. We're going to *only use carbon and mechanical, at a ratio of 20% mechanical, 80% carbon* for the *first 30-45 days.*

The reason you're going to do it this way is because during the set up, we need the extra purification power of Carbon. This helps to polish the water and remove any negative elements, which there will be the most of during this period.

After the first month or so, we'll no longer need to use carbon (it will have burnt out by this point) and we can switch over to biological to maximize our biological filtration (most important step in filtration for us). 

*Tips for Carbon*
*has surface area for beneficial bacteria to grow on (which is why I use carbon instead of purigen in the planted tank, for a while, I / ADG used purigen in planted tanks, but long-term testing proved carbon to be better for this reason, though you can use carbon + purigen as well if you like, however if the choice is either carbon or purigen, go with carbon).

*choose the highest quality carbon you can get, this leads to the best results and the highest capacity for cleaning the water. NA Carbon is an excellent carbon source, and even better than NA Carbon is sources of Bamboo Charcoal (the best aquaria-related carbon, taken from bamboo). 

*avoid carbons that are just powdered or "caked onto filter pads," these tend to come by default with filters, the eheim 2211 i'm using came with one, and they're largely useless. They help some to make the water clear, but that's all they do. You always want a carbon that comes in stick form or that is bamboo charcoal (these types are kind of jagged edges).

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

gnod said:


> any advice on mini riccia? I just got some in, and saw it pearling well yesterday (yay).
> they don't grow as fast as normal riccia right?


Hey gnod, I don't have too much experience with "mini" riccia. Riccia has many different forms it comes in, but they all largely have the same nutrient & planting (i.e. floats) requirements and habits.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Geniusdudekiran said:


> Although I appreciate the tank for what it is, I have to say I think it appears to be a proof-of-concept rather than a planned aquascape. Well that's not fair to say actually, it was very, very well thought out. But thought out to prove that this could be done. But that's not to say it's a bad thing. I like it though. Just throwing that out there.


Hey Kiran,

I just have to ask for some elaboration on your viewpoint, because after reading and re-reading your post, I still have no idea what you're talking about, more curious than anything else.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> No reason: I had an extra riccia stone I don't know what to do with yet, and since I went through the trouble of tying it, I didn't want it to just rot. I'll probably untie it and leave it on a cup on a window sill or something. It's only temporary.
> 
> 
> 
> I hear you marko on the long-term maintenance challenges of riccia (good thing it grows quickly for replanting), but there's nothing quite like riccia for an absolutely gorgeous carpet mix: hence why I will use it and continue to master it in every layout I do for a while.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Flying, really the trick to carpet plants in the initial planting is to do two things:
> 
> 1. Plant as Deeply as possible initially for glosso, etc.
> 
> 2. To plant it well enough that it stays down, and dense enough that you have a high bio mass to start with.
> 
> Follow-up strategies are what leads to tight, clean carpets. For HC, practicing an aggressive trimming strategy will lead to a tight, clean carpet.


When you say plant as deep as possible initially for glosso, what does that mean? Can you elaborate on that? For glosso I always planted it so just the roots that are under the substrate. Is that too shallow?

I have an Eheim 2215 on my 10 gallon. I've been running it on this tank for almost a year. And to be honest, I can't remember what medias are in it. Terrible I know, can you tell me what a good ratio would be?

Last question, I promise, what is the proper height relative to the waters surface for lily pipes?


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> When you say plant as deep as possible initially for glosso, what does that mean? Can you elaborate on that? For glosso I always planted it so just the roots that are under the substrate. Is that too shallow?
> 
> I have an Eheim 2215 on my 10 gallon. I've been running it on this tank for almost a year. And to be honest, I can't remember what medias are in it. Terrible I know, can you tell me what a good ratio would be?
> 
> Last question, I promise, what is the proper height relative to the waters surface for lily pipes?


Excellent questions, Orchidman.

1. Glosso: plant it so that the leaves are barely breaching the surface of the soil. In a Nano tank especially, this will encourage runners being underneath the surface and the carpet will grow tight. Remember Glosso is a stem plant, and will respond well to trimming and excellent root nutrition.

2. An eheim 2215 might be a bit overpowered for a 10 gallon (reason being is that you'll have to half-cock the intake or output to not overpower the aquarium, and a 2213 will give you about perfect flow): while this isn't a bad thing, I might suggest a 2213 for a 10 gallon. The benefit to your 2215 is that you have more room for media, which is excellent.

3. As for media: I have some homework for you Orchidman, I want you to develop the habit of cleaning your filter every month. It's simple and easy when you get in the habit of doing so (often taking as little as 10 minutes during a water change). 

When you clean the filter, I want you to have a 5 gallon bucket filled with aquarium water during the water change, and to "rinse" the biological media in this bucket to remove debris. You will see your flow rate increase exponentially after doing this. 

At 1 year in, you should be running 100% bio rio + a packet of Tourmaline F for purification. Because your media has been running a while without a change, you cannot go 100% bio rio yet, or your system will crash. So, what i want you to do is remove the carbon you have in there, rinse the bio you have in aquarium water, and replace the carbon with more biological so you should have 20% mechanical, 80% biological. In one month, clean the filter again and remove the 20% mechanical for 20% more biological. Supplement Green Bacter to accelerate bacterial growth during transitions.

By staggering how you change filtration media, you will avoid a bacterial crash and avoid algae problems as a result of that crash. (having power sand as a bed for beneficial bacteria in the substrate is another redundancy method for having a beneficial bacteria base that is immune to these problems).

You should also take a spring washer (or equivalent tube cleaner) and clean out the gunk that is in the intake and outflow parts of the filter itself. Clean the tubing of algae with the same spring washer, etc and you will see another increase in flow of about 15-20%.

*When you develop these habits, you will see less algae, cleaner water and higher flow rates.*

P.S. I just took a look at your journal. You need to supply more co2 to prevent your glosso from growing upwards. Also, get in the habit of trimming it whenever it tries to go vertical and you will have a carpet sooner than you think.

P.P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Excellent questions, Orchidman.
> 
> 1. Glosso: plant it so that the leaves are barely breaching the surface of the soil. In a Nano tank especially, this will encourage runners being underneath the surface and the carpet will grow tight. Remember Glosso is a stem plant, and will respond well to trimming and excellent root nutrition.
> 
> 2. An eheim 2215 might be a bit overpowered for a 10 gallon (reason being is that you'll have to half-cock the intake or output to not overpower the aquarium, and a 2213 will give you about perfect flow): while this isn't a bad thing, I might suggest a 2213 for a 10 gallon. The benefit to your 2215 is that you have more room for media, which is excellent.
> 
> 3. As for media: I have some homework for you Orchidman, I want you to develop the habit of cleaning your filter every month. It's simple and easy when you get in the habit of doing so (often taking as little as 10 minutes during a water change).
> 
> When you clean the filter, I want you to have a 5 gallon bucket filled with aquarium water during the water change, and to "rinse" the biological media in this bucket to remove debris. You will see your flow rate increase exponentially after doing this.
> 
> At 1 year in, you should be running 100% bio rio + a packet of Tourmaline F for purification. Because your media has been running a while without a change, you cannot go 100% bio rio yet, or your system will crash. So, what i want you to do is remove the carbon you have in there, rinse the bio you have in aquarium water, and replace the carbon with more biological so you should have 20% mechanical, 80% biological. In one month, clean the filter again and remove the 20% mechanical for 20% more biological. Supplement Green Bacter to accelerate bacterial growth during transitions.
> 
> By staggering how you change filtration media, you will avoid a bacterial crash and avoid algae problems as a result of that crash. (having power sand as a bed for beneficial bacteria in the substrate is another redundancy method for having a beneficial bacteria base that is immune to these problems).
> 
> You should also take a spring washer (or equivalent tube cleaner) and clean out the gunk that is in the intake and outflow parts of the filter itself. Clean the tubing of algae with the same spring washer, etc and you will see another increase in flow of about 15-20%.
> 
> *When you develop these habits, you will see less algae, cleaner water and higher flow rates.*
> 
> P.S. I just took a look at your journal. You need to supply more co2 to prevent your glosso from growing upwards. Also, get in the habit of trimming it whenever it tries to go vertical and you will have a carpet sooner than you think.


1. so thats what it is! i have always planted mine so just the roots are in the substrate!!!

2. yeah at one point i had a 2213 running on it, but it broke, and instead of buying anew filter, i just used the 2215 i had. and yes, the quick connect on the output line is half closed to reduce the flow.

3. before coming across this thread, i hadnt realized how important cleaning the filter could be. i will try to establish a habit of changing it once a month! 

is there a substitute i can use for the bio rio, maybe something cheaper and easier to get without having to worry about shipping? 

what does tourmaline F do? green bacter helps your bacteria correct? i dont use any ADA additives. maybe there is something i can use instead? or would i be alright just not using either one?

thanks for looking at my journal!!!!! :icon_smil thats awesome that you would take the time to do that! since the alst picture, i took all the glosso out. i have growing emersed that i may add in soon though, with the new planting technique you told me about. i added new shrimp about a week ago so ive been running co2 less than normal, but i need to do research to find out how much co2 would be safe with RCS. im actually going now to update the thread, with a FTS and other info, so if you have a chance, check it out!

thanks soooo much for all the help! it would have taken me a week to find that much good advice elsewhere!


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> 1. so thats what it is! i have always planted mine so just the roots are in the substrate!!!
> 
> 2. yeah at one point i had a 2213 running on it, but it broke, and instead of buying anew filter, i just used the 2215 i had. and yes, the quick connect on the output line is half closed to reduce the flow.
> 
> 3. before coming across this thread, i hadnt realized how important cleaning the filter could be. i will try to establish a habit of changing it once a month!
> 
> is there a substitute i can use for the bio rio, maybe something cheaper and easier to get without having to worry about shipping?
> 
> what does tourmaline F do? green bacter helps your bacteria correct? i dont use any ADA additives. maybe there is something i can use instead? or would i be alright just not using either one?
> 
> thanks for looking at my journal!!!!! :icon_smil thats awesome that you would take the time to do that! since the alst picture, i took all the glosso out. i have growing emersed that i may add in soon though, with the new planting technique you told me about. i added new shrimp about a week ago so ive been running co2 less than normal, but i need to do research to find out how much co2 would be safe with RCS. im actually going now to update the thread, with a FTS and other info, so if you have a chance, check it out!
> 
> thanks soooo much for all the help! it would have taken me a week to find that much good advice elsewhere!


Orchidman, before I answer your follow up questions, please allow me to ask you a couple questions.

1. What is your mind set for your planted aquarium? What do *you* want from it?

2. May I ask How much money you have spent on your aquarium and what is your budget? (if you like, you can PM me a response to this one, or if you are comfortable you can post here).

3. Do you know what the difference is between these tanks in money spent and results?




























P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Hey, just wanted to say I really appreciate this type of effort on your part for the hobby. I think a lot of us newbies will benefit from seeing a "start - to finish" process instead of a random tank build.

About the HC Cuba: Many times I have seen lush carpets with little details about the growth. One picture would be the clumps of HC and the next would be a carpet with the last picture being a lush carpet. 

Can you take more pictures of the HC spreading, I did the same thing as you and many others yet I'm having these bare spots.


----------



## freph

Undeniable urge to do a Mini M setup but everything out of stock.  Can't wait til stock comes in. Lots of good info here even outside of the carpets...very good read and looking forward to more updates.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Very soon freph, keep up in contact with me and we can get you taken care of on the order side of things.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## freph

Sounds good to me. I'll shoot you an email when I get home. Also, I notice the CO2 diffuser is rather close to the surface. Are there any issues associated with this?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Alright, it's time for Day 6 water change. By now you must be sick of getting these pictures! "They all look the same!" I promise you they are new ones every time.

Perhaps when this process is finished, if you're feeling intrepid you can go print out these photos and make a growth flip book. 

This time I remembered to take a photo *before* the water change:










See that? it's brown! very slightly!

I drained the water level almost all the way down to the substrate here, and trimmed off a few pieces of riccia that had some algae on it from what-ever tank it came off of ( you want to eliminate those pieces as quickly as possible, don't be afraid to make surgical cuts) :










Annnd, the now famous bucket shot for you to illustrate:










Now, for the fill up process, again, I'm turning the filter on at about the halfway mark (once the water level is safely above the intake of the intake pipe) for some extra oxygenation fizz:










And then finally, after a *grueling 15 minutes (trimming!)* we're back and filled with water again (seriously, it takes longer to upload these images and write this post than it does to water change...if you have time to make a post, you have time to do a water change on a nano) :










Proof that these are new photos each time: you'll notice that extra Riccia stone missing. I decided it was totally messing with my feng shui, and immediately after removing it confirmed this fact. Saving the extra riccia wasn't worth it. Though it is sitting in a cup of water outside in sunlight now.

*Dosing:* 5 drops of Green Bacter. 1 Squirt Brighty K. Day 6 water change percentage: somewhere around 80-90%.










A photo from a different angle to show a different perspective. Kind of cool, don't you think? 

You have probably understood by now that this process has been pretty painless, easy and can be done by anyone: and I hope that the bucket shots have illustrated you in a very real way all the preventative maintenance you're doing for 10 minutes of time a day. You might never look at your tank the same way again.

P.S. Are you going to start your journal yet and start using these techniques? If not, what's the hold up! You don't need ADA product to exploit the techniques being used here for water changing and setup! 

P.P.S. If you have a 10 gallon tank, this usually takes about 15-20 minutes, and if you have a 20 gallon tank, about 25-35 minutes. Still pretty easy, no?

P.P.P.S. I want to see your aquascape! Light up this forum with your journals of success! You've got all the information now to have a really awesome start! Don't worry about later, by the time we get there, I'll have covered the topics and you'll have learned what to do if you don't already know.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Sounds good to me. I'll shoot you an email when I get home. Also, I notice the CO2 diffuser is rather close to the surface. Are there any issues associated with this?


Freph, I wouldn't use it on my personal tank at home, nor have paid for it (I bought all of the equipment shown before taking over ADA at ADG, excepting the Wood Cabinet stand, which was a gift from Jeff Senske) if it had any issues what so ever. Just keep the water level at about where I keep it in the photo and you'll be golden.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## freph

Awesome. I've always liked the glass sets for the Mini aquariums but it just made me wonder since it looks like most of the bubbles are going to the surface (unless the outflow is shooting them out and down but I can't see it). Easier to contact you via email or PMs on here? :icon_wink


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Orchidman, before I answer your follow up questions, please allow me to ask you a couple questions.
> 
> 1. What is your mind set for your planted aquarium? What do *you* want from it?
> 
> 2. May I ask How much money you have spent on your aquarium and what is your budget? (if you like, you can PM me a response to this one, or if you are comfortable you can post here).
> 
> 3. Do you know what the difference is between these tanks in money spent and results?


1. I want something beautiful and i want to create it. i enjoy dong maintenance and setting things up and such, and if it becomes a large burden, its not achieving the goals at hand. with school and volleyball after school everyday, sometimes im stretched for time, but i enjoy it and try to stay on schedule. and also i want my fish or shrimp to be happy and healthy. 

2.hmm, not sure exactly how much ive spent, because most things where gradually added. what i paid for things currently being used in this tank, and what ive paid for things up until this point is different. what i paid for things being used right this second is probably only about $130 thats filter, co2, plants, and substrate. everything else being used ATM was given to me at one time or another. 

as for budget, im a teenager, so im alwasy on a tight budget. right now i dont have any money to spend on it, except to keep things alive. im willing to spend a little bit on new filter media, but not much else other than things that NEED to be done now. once i save up some money, i will hopefully upgrade some stuff and replace plants that died before a major upgrade though. 

3. could it be the skill and expertise of the creator?

ps. would it be better for me to pm you? so i dont junk up your thread? either way is fine for me, im just glad to get advice.


----------



## Dollface

orchidman said:


> ps. would it be better for me to pm you? so i dont junk up your thread? either way is fine for me, im just glad to get advice.


Following previous threads of Franks, some of the most valuable content is from people asking questions like this. It's not clutter at all IMO.


----------



## orchidman

Dollface said:


> Following previous threads of Franks, some of the most valuable content is from people asking questions like this. It's not clutter at all IMO.


:icon_mrgr


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> P.P.P.S. I want to see your aquascape! Light up this forum with your journals of success! You've got all the information now to have a really awesome start! Don't worry about later, by the time we get there, I'll have covered the topics and you'll have learned what to do if you don't already know.


I guess you missed my post.... anyways...

Dosing EI, Nitrate is 10 - 20 , high light, Co2 pressurized at 30 ppm. Flourite Black, the usual stuff..... 

Advise. 

2 weeks ago









To:










It was lush and green for the first week and then BANG..... growth is still high, I trimmed some yellow off and kept it low to the gravel.


----------



## Dollface

P.S: I think the answer to #3 is that the cost difference was minimal for the results achieved. 

P.P.S: I keep expecting there to be a multiple choice exam that we get graded on at the end of the week.

P.P.P.S: _Oh god it's rubbing off on me._


----------



## orchidman

thats alot of P.S.'s!!


----------



## @[email protected]

i have green bacter (came free with some ADA stuff i bought), but never used it cuz i have no idea what it actually is. ive heard "bacteria cultures" and "bacteria food", but which bacteria and what form of food?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hello Flying,

My apologies for missing your question. Your solution is to increase the dosage of potassium in the system.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!



FlyingHellFish said:


> I guess you missed my post.... anyways...
> 
> Dosing EI, Nitrate is 10 - 20 , high light, Co2 pressurized at 30 ppm. Flourite Black, the usual stuff.....
> 
> Advise.
> 
> 2 weeks ago
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It was lush and green for the first week and then BANG..... growth is still high, I trimmed some yellow off and kept it low to the gravel.


----------



## Seattle_Aquarist

Hey Frank! How you doing down there in TX?


----------



## FlyingHellFish

I'll try that, thanks for the suggestion.


----------



## Drink_soy_sauce

Frank, what are the advantages of that style (MINI P-2 i think?) of outflow? Tanks looking great, by the way!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Drink_soy_sauce said:


> Frank, what are the advantages of that style (MINI P-2 i think?) of outflow? Tanks looking great, by the way!


The model used here is the Mini P-1 (10mm, Mini P-2 is 13mm), the smaller size is suitable for an ADA Mini-M or Mini S. The Mini P-2 suitable for a mini L, 45-F or 60-F. The primary advantage of the Mini P series is that it consolidates water flow into a strong stream. You can't see it in photos, but the push of the filter + the lily pipe is enough to bounce the water off the opposite corner of the tank, then to the opposite corner, then back to the intake without losing much momentum.

So flow goes origin (front left) - front right - back right - back left. This is important to know for co2 distribution, and is why I have the diffuser situated under the output. Another trick, to change co2 densities in the aquarium is to switch sides the co2 is on, which will affect plant growth rates and allow manipulation of how things grow.

A spray bar is terrible for flow because it distributes your flow over an even surface, so by the time the water is distributed among the spray bar it barely has enough energy to hit the other pane of glass.



FlyingHellFish said:


> I'll try that, thanks for the suggestion.


You should about double-triple your dosage of potassium. On day one double it, day two same as day one, day three same as day one, then on day four triple the dosage from the original, do that on day five, etc until you start seeing the plants recover. Just keep incrementally increasing your potassium until the problem is corrected. If you start getting some algae, dial it back down a little bit.

Being able to detect plant coloration is one of the tricks to knowing how much to dose.



Seattle_Aquarist said:


> Hey Frank! How you doing down there in TX?


Great Roy! How's GSAS & yourself doing? Texas will become very hot soon and I miss Seattle's soft water.



@[email protected] said:


> i have green bacter (came free with some ADA stuff i bought), but never used it cuz i have no idea what it actually is. ive heard "bacteria cultures" and "bacteria food", but which bacteria and what form of food?


Green Bacter is a combination of dormant bacteria cultures and a type of mulm which is a food source for the beneficial bacteria. I don't know what names of the bacteria that are in there, but the primary ones are the bacteria directly responsible for the nitrogen cycle (ammonia - nitrite - nitrate etc.), the others are those which are synergistic with plant roots, etc.

It's used 1) to help cycle the aquarium quicker, 2) to help bacteria recover after water changes and filter cleanings (long periods of time, of up to 30 minutes with a filter turned off is disastrous to the beneficial bacteria)

Basically everything ADA sells is "caked," with beneficial bacteria: Bio Rio has it, Power Sand S has it, Bacter 100 is it, Green Bacter, etc. 



Dollface said:


> P.S: I think the answer to #3 is that the cost difference was minimal for the results achieved.
> 
> P.P.S: I keep expecting there to be a multiple choice exam that we get graded on at the end of the week.
> 
> P.P.P.S: _Oh god it's rubbing off on me._


This would be correct. 



orchidman said:


> 1. I want something beautiful and i want to create it. i enjoy dong maintenance and setting things up and such, and if it becomes a large burden, its not achieving the goals at hand. with school and volleyball after school everyday, sometimes im stretched for time, but i enjoy it and try to stay on schedule. and also i want my fish or shrimp to be happy and healthy.
> 
> 2.hmm, not sure exactly how much ive spent, because most things where gradually added. what i paid for things currently being used in this tank, and what ive paid for things up until this point is different. what i paid for things being used right this second is probably only about $130 thats filter, co2, plants, and substrate. everything else being used ATM was given to me at one time or another.
> 
> as for budget, im a teenager, so im alwasy on a tight budget. right now i dont have any money to spend on it, except to keep things alive. im willing to spend a little bit on new filter media, but not much else other than things that NEED to be done now. once i save up some money, i will hopefully upgrade some stuff and replace plants that died before a major upgrade though.
> 
> 3. could it be the skill and expertise of the creator?
> 
> ps. would it be better for me to pm you? so i dont junk up your thread? either way is fine for me, im just glad to get advice.


I'll tell you a secret: the biggest waste of money I made in the hobby was not doing it right the first time. It cost me about $1200 to make the mistake of the first tank you saw there, and everything was basically junk and didn't work anyway!

It's not too bad when you can budget out, I would give you priority right now to getting: Bio Rio (something you can take care of and keep for long periods of time) for sure, and for other suggestions I'm going to have to look at your journal again.

But the core lesson comes to this: if you want to master the planted tank and achieve what you want in creating something beautiful, with little maintenance time, then the most important thing you can do is listen, learn, ask questions and save money as much as you can to build up to buy things to do it right the first time. Rather than spending X on Y because it's cheap, then Y breaks then having to buy Z anyway.



Dollface said:


> Following previous threads of Franks, some of the most valuable content is from people asking questions like this. It's not clutter at all IMO.


Gold star!

P.S. I need coffee.

P.P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## freph

Coffee sounds great right about now...too bad my brewer is terrible.  You have an email in your inbox chief.  Also, how does the P1 outflow do for surface film or do you have to raise it like the regular lily pipes to see any removal of it? Also, how does the CO2 density thing work by changing the location of the diffuser? I thought it would be the same throughout as long as the current is dispersing it around the tank.


----------



## orchidman

Thanks! I'll do that!!

is there a substitute i can use for the bio rio, maybe something cheaper and easier to get without having to worry about shipping? or would this we've an instance of "doing it right the first time" where nothing competes with bio rio?

what does tourmaline F do?i dont use any ADA additives. maybe there is something i can use instead? or would i be alright just not using either one when I clean my filter.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Coffee sounds great right about now...too bad my brewer is terrible.  You have an email in your inbox chief.  Also, how does the P1 outflow do for surface film or do you have to raise it like the regular lily pipes to see any removal of it? Also, how does the CO2 density thing work by changing the location of the diffuser? I thought it would be the same throughout as long as the current is dispersing it around the tank.


I need to find a time to escape to recruit coffee beans.

Generally, with an eheim 2211, surface film isn't too much of an issue, however it does occur. There are two methods to solving this: one do a small daily water change even when you are past the 1 major water change a day week (basically at night you would lower the water level to the lily pipe's output surface). Two: you can raise the lily pipe at night by using essentially a chop stick to raise and suspend it (this is kind of the jury rig version and just something I do every now and again, not a real ADA solution). 

The other solutions for aeration at night is to manually add an air pump / stone. 

Honestly, I'm more a fan of the drain a little bit of water at night and fill in the morning. However, it usually isn't as big an issue in these small tanks due to size and volume. 

Where the diffuser sits in the aquarium makes a massive difference to distribution effectiveness. For example in the 60-P at ADG, every 2 weeks we switch the side the diffuser and filtration are on, because the side OPPOSITE of the diffuser will grow thick and tall, while the side WITH the diffuser will stay shorter and not grow as quickly, due to how flow maneuvers co2 through the water before it's fully diffused. 

So sometimes if you're experiencing problems with one side of the aquarium not fully growing like the other, simply switch where the diffuser and flow are.



orchidman said:


> Thanks! I'll do that!!
> 
> is there a substitute i can use for the bio rio, maybe something cheaper and easier to get without having to worry about shipping? or would this we've an instance of "doing it right the first time" where nothing competes with bio rio?
> 
> what does tourmaline F do?i dont use any ADA additives. maybe there is something i can use instead? or would i be alright just not using either one when I clean my filter.


There are certainly alternatives to Bio Rio on the market: every major aquarium company produces a biological filtration media. However, I have found Bio Rio to be hands down the best in my experience, even over ehfi substrate (eheim's version, which is more expensive). 

The reason is, from the get go Bio Rio has beneficial bacteria in a dormant state caked on it (e.g. quick start when you make the transition without sabotaging your biological much), has the highest microscopic surface area on it for biological, and basically has a little nutrients with it (it's a bit earthy). 

If you take care of Bio Rio, you'll be able to use it for years to come. Just rinse it in aquarium water on a regular basis and it will last and last and last. Not a bad buy for $10 for 1l and $20 for 2l. So if you're in it for the long haul, invest in Bio Rio and a netting material to hold it together (i'll find a link somewhere). 

Tourmaline F is a high quality water polisher and is a bit more perishable than Bio Rio, so if the choice was Tourmaline OR Bio Rio, go with Bio Rio, although shipping dollars is about the same when you get the two together. Tourmaline F allows you to not have to use carbon to remove any impurities and is much longer lasting than carbon as it is raw Tourmaline Stones. 

I would begin a track of investing in ADA additives for their effects and uses, but take it in steps, learn what they're useful for and apply them for effectiveness.

In a 10 gallon tank:

Green Bacter: $18, beneficial bacteria stabilizes aquarium during cycling and helps during water changes to maintain bacteria. In a 10 gallon it will last you 1 - 1 1/2 years with the proper dosing.

Cost: $0.033 a day

Bacter 100: $16, Substrate additive + cyanobacteria killer & additive for algae problems. For Nano tanks, typically lasts 4 layouts.

Cost: $4 / layout

ECA: $18, fertilizes iron and organic acids to encourage bacterial growth, dosed once a week 3-4 drops. In Nano tanks, will last 1 - 1 1/2 years.

Cost: $0.033 / day

Green Gain: $18, contains trace elements, minerals, amino acid, as well as plant hormones to help plants recover quicker after trimming. In Nano tanks, lasts 1 - 1 1/2 years.

Cost: $0.033 / day

Phyton Git: $18, contains Phytoncide and no chemicals. This is a natural solution to algae, when it breaks out dosing to water column helps kill algae by strengthening plants natural auto-immune systems to fight algae. You can apply this with a brush directly to anubias leaves to kill BBA. Lasts 1 - 1 1/2 years in Nanos.

Cost: $0.033 / day

Then of course, the fertilizers themselves when you switch over to them, each 500 ml bottle will last about a year in a nano tank (I had one bottle of Brighty K, Step 1 and Step 2 last about 2 years across three different tanks. But we'll just say each $20 bottle will last 1 year to be conservative.

Cost: $0.05 / day between 4 total fertilizers (i'd just do Brighty K, Step 1 then buy Step 2 later, then Step 3 down the road.

So your daily cost to run the TOTAL ADA system would be: $0.18 / day and $4 per layout (well, $20 per layout if you did all the substrate additives).

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

I took a few other photo's just for fun last night after the lights had been on a while:



















P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## orchidman

thanks for writing that out!! its given me some good things to think about!

es, please post that link or PM it to me when you get a chance.

so tourmaline F isnt a liquid? its something like purigen? 

i dont have money to buy much if anything more than the bio rio right now. 

this summer im hoping to save up to get an ADA or do!aqua tank and the whole shebang. i might not get everything from ADA but most of it hopefully. maybe a 45-p or the do!aqua equivelant. regardless of which tank i end up getting, i might just wait on the additives and such and just get dry ferts and dose EI or PPS pro, then buy the ADA additives when i have saved up to get it all at once.

or maybe it would be better to get the additives all when i have saved enough to get them all, then save some more to order the tank. i dont know, ive got time to figure that out though.


----------



## Alyssa

Thank you for letting us see your past tanks, love seeing the progress folks make from the beginning!

Also appreciate all the journaling you did here, helps a lot I think!


----------



## Francis Xavier

A few of you now have asked me questions about the equipment list that I am running on this aquarium, and while I think that putting it up as the very first thing to do to get people to read a thread is in poor taste, it has become quite evident that you guys find the information valuable, whether that is to mimic the results or to find comparable products on the market.

So without further talk, here's the list:

It's all ADA proprietary:

*Core:*
Aquarium: Cube Garden Mini M
Lighting: Solar Mini M, Bulb: 27w Compact Flourescent, 8,000k.
Stand: Wood Cabinet Gun Metal Silver

*Co2 & Distribution:*
Co2 Advanced System (System 74-YA/ver. 2, Clear Parts Set, Bubble Counter (set includes more, but I had a few replacements)
Diffuser: Pollen Glass Mini
Metal Cap Stand
El-Valve (solenoid for automatic Co2 on/off)

*Filtration:*
Eheim 2211 (13mm inflow, 10mm outflow)
Clear Hose 10mm & 13mm
Lily Pipe Mini P-1 10mm (outflow)
Lily Pipe Mini V-1 13mm (inflow)

Filtration Media, Month 1:
Eheim Bio Rings
NA Carbon 750ml

Filtration Media, Month 2:
Eheim Bio Rings
Bio Rio 1L

Filtration Media, Month 4:
Bio Rio 2L (will end up being 1.5L in eheim 2211)
Tourmaline F

*Substrate
*Penac P
Penac W
Bacter 100
Clear Super
Tourmaline BC
Power Sand S 2L
Amazonia Powder Type 3L (for this slope, ended up being about 4.5L)

*Maintenance Tools:*
Maintenance Stand I
Pincettes S
Pincettes M
Sand Flattener
Pro Pincettes Spring (Curve Type)
Wave Scissors
Pro Scissors Short (Curve Type)
Pro Scissors Short (Straight Type)
AP Glass Feeder
AP-1 Fish Food

*Fertilizers and Additives:
*Week 1: Brighty K, Green Bacter
Week 2 to end of Month 3: Brighty K, Green Brighty Step 1, Green Brighty Special Lights (alternate Day 1 = Step 1, Day 2 = Lights, etc Brighty K everyday)


Month 3 onward: Brighty K, Green Brighty Step 2, Special Lights (see above for dosing)

Month 1 onward: ECA (iron, bacterial growth) once a week, 3 drops.

Fertilizer dosings are one squirt per day, by the end of the 2nd month this will likely be two squirts.

Green Bacter: after every water change, always.

Phyton Git: use when algae pops up
Green Gain: after trimming

*Other Setup Tools:
*Riccia Stones
Riccia Line
Moss Cotton
Lava Rock for moss attachment

*Hardscape:
*5 Manten Stones

*Water Change Schedule:*
First week = daily water change (50%-80%)
Second week = water change every other day (50%-80%)
Third week = water change every third day (twice) (50%-80%)
Fourth week onwards = once a week water changes, water change as needed due to algae.

Total time for water changes on a Mini M: 10 minutes
Likely Regime: draining about 10% of the water daily for extra aeration (~1-2 min)

*Water Quality:*
Pure RODI water, no additives.

*Likely additional additives:

*Seachem Excel, half capful daily after 2-3 week for a secondary source of carbon.

*Co2 Distribution:
*1 BPS first week
2 BPS second week
3-4 BPS onward, raise as needed.

*Average Co2 cartridge lifespan:*
4 weeks

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## dantra

This is a great reference and how to thread/guide for beginners to learn and develop good habits and for older seasoned hobbyist to improve on their technics. I'm actually on a trip, not really a vacation with the family so can't stay long.

I hear them calling me so I have to go. One of the things I agreed to was minimal computer time :frown: on this trip so I'll be gone for about a week and a half, we left Sunday the 18th.

I can't wait to show Connor the thread when we get back roud: :biggrin:

Dan


----------



## Chlorophile

Seems strange to start off with 1 bps at first and increase it later? 
Any logic behind that?

I assume it may be to keep the water from getting too acidic for nitrifying bacteria?


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> thanks for writing that out!! its given me some good things to think about!
> 
> es, please post that link or PM it to me when you get a chance.
> 
> so tourmaline F isnt a liquid? its something like purigen?
> 
> i dont have money to buy much if anything more than the bio rio right now.
> 
> this summer im hoping to save up to get an ADA or do!aqua tank and the whole shebang. i might not get everything from ADA but most of it hopefully. maybe a 45-p or the do!aqua equivelant. regardless of which tank i end up getting, i might just wait on the additives and such and just get dry ferts and dose EI or PPS pro, then buy the ADA additives when i have saved up to get it all at once.
> 
> or maybe it would be better to get the additives all when i have saved enough to get them all, then save some more to order the tank. i dont know, ive got time to figure that out though.


Take it in steps. My very first tank had no ADA (largest disaster), and then I gradually added more and more ADA as I could afford it until you see what I just listed above. Most of that equipment has lasted me for years now, and it's the best investment I've ever made (I don't keep a TV at home, I tried watching TV lately, and that stuff makes you stupid. If you want to increase your IQ by 20 points read a book, take care of a planted tank, whatever instead of watching drivel on TV). 

Anyway, back to taking it in steps. If you'll let me, I'll teach you a very valuable life financial strategy (hey, I normally get paid money to give this information as a consultant, so take it seriously).

Extreme cliff notes here (you'll have to enroll in a class with me to learn details & why, my going rate is $200 for all the information you need to start earning wealth & become debt free):

Budget out what you want, set plans, and set TIMELINES. Visualization is important, *useful trick: *the human brain can't tell the difference between a real and imagined experience in memory. Mimicry actually works.

So, take what you want, focus on that, and set your timelines to raise X dollars. Don't accept mental excuses you'll tell yourself like "i can't get the money, I'm XYZ, I can't do that," (believe me, we ALL do it, and it's all a mental block that prevents us from getting what we want. If you can conquer that, you've got a huge leg up on everyone else) sure enough, if you say you can't do something, you, well can't do it and won't do it!

I'd go in order of biggest bang-for-your-buck first. I can help you budget and put it all out there for you to work. But go with Bio Rio first.

Tourmaline F is pure stones - much better than Purigen. Purigen is a chemical based powder that purifies water. 



Alyssa said:


> Thank you for letting us see your past tanks, love seeing the progress folks make from the beginning!
> 
> Also appreciate all the journaling you did here, helps a lot I think!


Not a problem Alyssa! Many people are embarassed by their original layouts, but I say, hey, y'know I think that's the *most valuable* part of anything. 

Look at my original layout: there was even a non-aquatic plant in there! and when you see that, and laugh and go "okay, well I can definitely at least do BETTER than that," you can then see the progression and know that while you're having frustration now (if you're having it, and in this hobby that's pretty common no matter what level you're at), there *is another level* you can and will cross into with dedication, persistence and the *willingness to learn and adapt successful habits.*

The only way you lose in the Planted Tank game is to give up.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## orchidman

That last post is awesome! Thanks for posting all the equipment and specs!!!

I have a question about lily pipes.. For either type, what is the correct height relative to the surface to have them?


----------



## gnod

orchidman said:


> That last post is awesome! Thanks for posting all the equipment and specs!!!
> 
> I have a question about lily pipes.. For either type, what is the correct height relative to the surface to have them?


what he said! 

also, how do you grow fissidens well? 
i have a fissiden tree in my tank with lush green glosso and the fissiden looks so... bleak. i've been it super lush and green before on other threads..


----------



## Francis Xavier

dantra said:


> This is a great reference and how to thread/guide for beginners to learn and develop good habits and for older seasoned hobbyist to improve on their technics. I'm actually on a trip, not really a vacation with the family so can't stay long.
> 
> I hear them calling me so I have to go. One of the things I agreed to was minimal computer time :frown: on this trip so I'll be gone for about a week and a half, we left Sunday the 18th.
> 
> I can't wait to show Connor the thread when we get back roud: :biggrin:
> 
> Dan


Dan, maybe you can steal some computer time to show Connor the story I shared about him and yourself!

I hope you have a great trip. Bring pictures.



Chlorophile said:


> Seems strange to start off with 1 bps at first and increase it later?
> Any logic behind that?
> 
> I assume it may be to keep the water from getting too acidic for nitrifying bacteria?


Absolutely. Initially when plants are making the transition into a new aquarium, and are either A) making the transition from emmersed, or B ) were submerged but now have gone through the trauma of uprooting, trimming and planting, the most important factors are support of the beneficial bacteria (more oxygen at night), water change, and supporting root health & growth (additives).

Since the plants are all in a transition phase, for the first week their ability to take in nutrients, co2, etc is compromised, so we slowly, slowly start adding fertilizers and staging up co2 progression *as needed*.

This leads to a successful growth pattern of: planted, getting adjusted / established, spreading roots, growing a little, growing a little then BAM explosive growth. 

The key is to minimize algae during the transition phases. I can already see some traces of algae coming in (imports from the last tank the riccia was in) which requires some trimming and will require the addition of Amano's soon to make sure it doesn't become a problem.

As plants melt, they are removed with small airline tubing and trimming scissors to get rid of the debris in the tank, this encourages growth of NEW plants.

The trick to know is: no matter where we are in the growing cycle, we're always encouraging new growth. It's the healthiest, most vitale and algae free. Which means that we're constantly trimming back old leaves and algae-ridden leaves to prevent an infection of algae from old to new.
P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> That last post is awesome! Thanks for posting all the equipment and specs!!!
> 
> I have a question about lily pipes.. For either type, what is the correct height relative to the surface to have them?


Thanks. The correct height for the lily pipes in the nano models is to just have them sit naturally on the tank (no suction cups so they sit at the same height no matter what). 

The correct height in larger tanks, is to let the intake rest naturally on the glass surface and have the output adjusted so the pipe is just under the water surface to create a whirlpool, and then at night lift it up halfway out of the water for aeration.



gnod said:


> what he said!
> 
> also, how do you grow fissidens well?
> i have a fissiden tree in my tank with lush green glosso and the fissiden looks so... bleak. i've been it super lush and green before on other threads..


I don't have much experience with fissidens, but generally if you're lacking green color in fissidens, or having color problems in general there are two nutrients you can bump up to increase color: potassium (typically shown by yellow or browning leaves as needing more, but moss is different), and iron (enhances a lot of colors, especially in reds).

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## orchidman

Thanks! I always wondered about that! And what is the benefit of the pipes your using On this tank versus typical lily pipes with the bell? Added flow?


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> Thanks! I always wondered about that! And what is the benefit of the pipes your using On this tank versus typical lily pipes with the bell? Added flow?


Well, the mini lily pipes being like that are able to mimic the flow pattern in a super jet in larger aquaria (more consolidated, more powerful) In addition to that, the bell shape tends to take up too much real estate in a nano

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> The model used here is the Mini P-1 (10mm, Mini P-2 is 13mm), the smaller size is suitable for an ADA Mini-M or Mini S. The Mini P-2 suitable for a mini L, 45-F or 60-F. The primary advantage of the Mini P series is that it consolidates water flow into a strong stream. You can't see it in photos, but the push of the filter + the lily pipe is enough to bounce the water off the opposite corner of the tank, then to the opposite corner, then back to the intake without losing much momentum.
> 
> So flow goes origin (front left) - front right - back right - back left. This is important to know for co2 distribution, and is why I have the diffuser situated under the output. Another trick, to change co2 densities in the aquarium is to switch sides the co2 is on, which will affect plant growth rates and allow manipulation of how things grow.





Francis Xavier said:


> Where the diffuser sits in the aquarium makes a massive difference to distribution effectiveness. For example in the 60-P at ADG, every 2 weeks we switch the side the diffuser and filtration are on, because the side OPPOSITE of the diffuser will grow thick and tall, while the side WITH the diffuser will stay shorter and not grow as quickly, due to how flow maneuvers co2 through the water before it's fully diffused.
> 
> So sometimes if you're experiencing problems with one side of the aquarium not fully growing like the other, simply switch where the diffuser and flow are.


Hm. I'm still somewhat confused on this... Since the CO2 is being dispersed all over the system (by the flow doing a loop around the aquarium) how does the density in different parts of the aquarium change? Wouldn't the diffused CO2 eventually distribute itself evenly throughout the system, or is it just that gaseous CO2 is more easily used by plants and results in better growth vs diffused CO2? Could you avoid this issue by just skipping the diffuser and going with something like a reactor?


----------



## houseofcards

Francis Xavier said:


> ...Absolutely. Initially when plants are making the transition into a new aquarium, and are either A) making the transition from emmersed, or B ) were submerged but now have gone through the trauma of uprooting, trimming and planting, the most important factors are support of the beneficial bacteria (more oxygen at night), water change, and supporting root health & growth (additives).
> 
> Since the plants are all in a transition phase, for the first week their ability to take in nutrients, co2, etc is compromised, so we slowly, slowly start adding fertilizers and staging up co2 progression *as needed*.
> .


This is so key IMO. You could flood your tank with co2, but the plants especially in an Iwagumi are only going to do so much, so you need to support the bacteria and keep the tank extremely clean organically. Carbon, purigen, etc are really good when the bio-filter is just too immature as well some of the ADA product or using other methods. Unfortunately I think too many think of co2 as an algaecide. It's really limited to plant growth and mass, so in an Iwagumi as well as at startup it's not enough.


----------



## Brian Mc

Thank you for the journal Frank, I am really enjoying it and have learned a lot already. Thanks for the tips on the glosso. Just wanted you to know that I am performing the visualizations as you have described, I believe in their power and just wanted you to know somebody was doing it lol.

Like Dollface I would like to see an analysis of her angle diagram or were you guys just pulling my leg here? :icon_mrgr


----------



## Chrome

Wow, I just compared the the pics from day 1 to today. Thats some amazing growth in 8 short days. Another 8 and the carpet should be completely filled in.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Well, the mini lily pipes being like that are able to mimic the flow pattern in a super jet in larger aquaria (more consolidated, more powerful) In addition to that, the bell shape tends to take up too much real estate in a nano


I see! Thankyou! I always wondered. I personally think the smaller ones look cooler.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

I followed along on this thread to see the scape development, but learned all kinds of stuff about spraybars flow inefficiencies vs lily pipes, planting carpeting plants like glosso and HC, the reason why I got an algae outbreak in the beginning with my ADA and how to trim my plants and do maintenance to the best advantage. Thanks for all of that.


----------



## Dollface

Chrome said:


> Wow, I just compared the the pics from day 1 to today. Thats some amazing growth in 8 short days. Another 8 and the carpet should be completely filled in.


For the lazy/short attention spans (like me):


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Hm. I'm still somewhat confused on this... Since the CO2 is being dispersed all over the system (by the flow doing a loop around the aquarium) how does the density in different parts of the aquarium change? Wouldn't the diffused CO2 eventually distribute itself evenly throughout the system, or is it just that gaseous CO2 is more easily used by plants and results in better growth vs diffused CO2? Could you avoid this issue by just skipping the diffuser and going with something like a reactor?


I may need to draw a visual aid, don't worry, it's a bit of an advanced concept, and in a nano tank it isn't as critical due to size and scale, you see it much more readily in larger aquariums where the co2 has to travel farther (you begin to really see the effects first hand in 10-20 gallon aquariums).

Here's the 411:

I ended up drawing a picture (edit, it's on the bottom).

Example: Filtration is on the left (intake and output) and the diffuser is on the left (as pictured in my nano). What this means is that the greatest density of water saturated with Co2 is "pushed" by the flow to the *right* side of the aquarium. 

Think of Co2 as a consumable, limited resource (i.e. we only have X amount in the aquarium, and won't have more than X unless we add more).

As X (water saturated with the appropriate amount of Co2) is moved by the flow from left to right, the resource is being consumed. So we have X - consumption. 

Visualize the flow of a nano lily pipe modeled like the Mini P-1 and the regular P-2. It creates a jet stream that hits the opposite pane of glass. 

You can follow the flow circulation by looking at how a lily pipe moves water, but if you don't have one, you can look at the picture below and picture this: out of the lily pipe water follows this path: it goes straight across (left to right), and when it hits the right pane, the water flow goes in two directions: down towards the substrate (so the water flow goes down along the right side) and then diagonally dispersed evenly across the whole right panel.

Now, as water is traveling, Co2 is being consumed by the plants, this means that the *areas of greatest flow receive the most Co2*. So, Remember, X is a consumable resource and if we say that all plants across the front (concentrated flow, 1 flow stream) is being -1 Co2, and the right panel, (being -5 Co2 spread across 5 flow streams), by the time the Co2 has gone across the right panel we have:

X-6 = Co2 left available in the water column

Which means that, if our total value of X is 10 (these numbers are random for visuals), then X-6 = 4, and we have 4 Co2 left. That means that 4 Co2 is being swept away for the entire remainder of the aquarium, the back panel and the left panel. 

Now, over time we have Co2 that escapes the pattern and builds up to saturate the *total water volume* with Co2. Which means that over time we have a build up of say, *.5* Co2 after displacement (loss of Co2) of 1 (again, these numbers don't mean anything except as a visual aid). 

The important thing to know that, then due to where the flow is going the highest volume of Co2 in the water is against the opposite panel of the Co2 diffuser. 

This means that plants on the *opposite side* of the Co2 Diffuser grow faster, greener and healthier because they receive the greatest volume of water saturated with Co2.


There are two methods of getting adequate Co2 into an aquarium:

1. Flood the aquarium with Co2.

This is not advised since too much Co2 leads to oxygen shortage which harms fish, inverts etc and harms the beneficial bacteria. Good for a short term solution, but long time you compromise yourself by cutting yourself off at the ankles. (Fish actually contribute greatly to the health of a planted tank via waste, etc they are a huge part of the cycle).

2. Manipulate the positioning of the diffuser.

The best method: physical manipulation in response to how plants are growing by being able to switch the positioning of the diffuser and "target" areas for growth. In larger tanks, this usually translates to having two diffusers, one on each side of the aquarium (typical of 4ft - 6 ft aquariums)

Reactor vs. Diffuser

I will always argue against a reactor since you need to compensate with extra Co2 and you're limited to only option #1. You're more or less fixed on where you're going to put your co2 to plants, the same phenomena occurs as with a diffuser with flow. 

"But, I could just move the filter couldn't I?"

Yes, you could, but you wouldn't be able to manipulate flow AND diffuser positioning for the BEST results dependent on your plants.

A third solution is to put the highest demanding plants on the opposite side of the diffuser (in my case, the most riccia and HC is on the right), and the ones that have the least demands (mosses, etc) on the left, (maybe now my layout will inspire an "ah-ha" moment, for being both aesthetic and practical). This is best used in Nano aquaria where their small size lends themselves well to this design.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

houseofcards said:


> This is so key IMO. You could flood your tank with co2, but the plants especially in an Iwagumi are only going to do so much, so you need to support the bacteria and keep the tank extremely clean organically. Carbon, purigen, etc are really good when the bio-filter is just too immature as well some of the ADA product or using other methods. Unfortunately I think too many think of co2 as an algaecide. It's really limited to plant growth and mass, so in an Iwagumi as well as at startup it's not enough.


You've got exactly the right mind set my man! See post above.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Brian Mc said:


> Thank you for the journal Frank, I am really enjoying it and have learned a lot already. Thanks for the tips on the glosso. Just wanted you to know that I am performing the visualizations as you have described, I believe in their power and just wanted you to know somebody was doing it lol.
> 
> Like Dollface I would like to see an analysis of her angle diagram or were you guys just pulling my leg here? :icon_mrgr


Hah! I will make an analysis of the diagram sooner or later. Rather I don't so much need to do one for myself: as I design with these angles in mind naturally (you'll get there too with practice, you just get an "eye," for what "feels," right with practice on principles of placement.

I'm glad someone is doing the visualizations! Maybe you'll inspire someone else to share if they've done them!



Chrome said:


> Wow, I just compared the the pics from day 1 to today. Thats some amazing growth in 8 short days. Another 8 and the carpet should be completely filled in.


Thank you Chrome, anyone who follows the philosophy and skills described here is capable of the same. For the record: the layout has only been up since last friday (6 days). You can see in Dollface's post of progression how growth has gone "slow, slow slow, explode" the explosion phase is beginning.



orchidman said:


> I see! Thankyou! I always wondered. I personally think the smaller ones look cooler.


Not a problem! It's important to remember that these products aren't designed with just aesthetic in mind: they are functional and made for a reason first and foremost, then the aesthetic applied after.



2wheelsx2 said:


> I followed along on this thread to see the scape development, but learned all kinds of stuff about spraybars flow inefficiencies vs lily pipes, planting carpeting plants like glosso and HC, the reason why I got an algae outbreak in the beginning with my ADA and how to trim my plants and do maintenance to the best advantage. Thanks for all of that.


I'm happy it's been of value to you! The previous post with the flow diagram I posted should be of extra value to you.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Chlorophile

Francis Xavier said:


> Absolutely. Initially when plants are making the transition into a new aquarium, and are either A) making the transition from emmersed, or B ) were submerged but now have gone through the trauma of uprooting, trimming and planting, the most important factors are support of the beneficial bacteria (more oxygen at night), water change, and supporting root health & growth (additives).
> 
> Since the plants are all in a transition phase, for the first week their ability to take in nutrients, co2, etc is compromised, so we slowly, slowly start adding fertilizers and staging up co2 progression *as needed*.
> 
> This leads to a successful growth pattern of: planted, getting adjusted / established, spreading roots, growing a little, growing a little then BAM explosive growth.
> 
> The key is to minimize algae during the transition phases. I can already see some traces of algae coming in (imports from the last tank the riccia was in) which requires some trimming and will require the addition of Amano's soon to make sure it doesn't become a problem.
> 
> As plants melt, they are removed with small airline tubing and trimming scissors to get rid of the debris in the tank, this encourages growth of NEW plants.
> 
> The trick to know is: no matter where we are in the growing cycle, we're always encouraging new growth. It's the healthiest, most vitale and algae free. Which means that we're constantly trimming back old leaves and algae-ridden leaves to prevent an infection of algae from old to new.



Makes sense, the pattern you describe is true for any horticulture situation as well. 
I just recently had to trim the roots on our hydroponic tomatoes because they were getting too long and the leaves showed wilting the very next day after trimming the roots.
They have recovered now and look healthy and are even more vigorous than they were before, but of course there was a recovery period.


----------



## orchidman

thank you sooo much! you have no idea how much help this thread has been tome and everyone else, and how much help it will be to everyone who reads it in the future! thank you!

i totally understand about the diffuser! makes so much sense! 

ps. i do the visualizations too


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> thank you sooo much! you have no idea how much help this thread has been tome and everyone else, and how much help it will be to everyone who reads it in the future! thank you!
> 
> i totally understand about the diffuser! makes so much sense!
> 
> ps. i do the visualizations too


I'm glad you have found great value here. This is the compilation work of years of experience, mostly doing things the hard way to figure out the easy way, and you get to benefit from it!

*The next visualization:*

Start in your mind with an empty aquarium, aquascape laid out, misted and ready for planting. Then play like a movie in your head the action of taking a pair of pincettes and planting every plant densely, following similar planting patterns found in this thread. What plants are you using? how will they grow together?

If you use riccia, visualize tying it to stones with riccia line, not mesh. Visualize tying moss to driftwood or small stones. Rinse and repeat once a day. Watch the aquarium grow in to your final picture over time like a movie.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Jeff5614

Francis Xavier said:


> Green Bacter is a combination of dormant bacteria cultures and a type of mulm which is a food source for the beneficial bacteria. I don't know what names of the bacteria that are in there, but the primary ones are the bacteria directly responsible for the nitrogen cycle (ammonia - nitrite - nitrate etc.), the others are those which are synergistic with plant roots, etc.
> 
> It's used 1) to help cycle the aquarium quicker, 2) to help bacteria recover after water changes and filter cleanings (long periods of time, of up to 30 minutes with a filter turned off is disastrous to the beneficial bacteria)
> .


And it smells good too! Something like a good hickory fire.


----------



## Chlorophile

Francis Xavier said:


> Green Bacter is a combination of dormant bacteria cultures and a type of mulm which is a food source for the beneficial bacteria. I don't know what names of the bacteria that are in there, but the primary ones are the bacteria directly responsible for the nitrogen cycle (ammonia - nitrite - nitrate etc.), the others are those which are synergistic with plant roots, etc.


So how does it differ from bacter 100?

I'd bet a good bit of money bacter 100 is just heterotrophic nitrifying bacteria to help shorten the huge ammonia spike from aquasoil. 

Thus you have to also provide Clear Super (heterotrophic bacteria, unlike autotrophic bacteria that normally do nitrification, need carbon for their life cycle or they die.) which looks just like ground graphite. 

Which also explains why you have to add Penac P and Penac W, one of which is probably just a peroxide, without it the oxygen levels in the substrate would be low and the bacteria would just die off. 

Now what I wan't to know is how you keep them alive for more than 72 hours once oxygen levels in the substrate drop. 

My assumption is that you don't keep them alive, and that is why you add Green Bacter later on to keep with the denitrification process.
Green Bacter is a liquid, do you know if it needs to be refrigerated or has an expiration date?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Chlorophile said:


> So how does it differ from bacter 100?
> 
> I'd bet a good bit of money bacter 100 is just heterotrophic nitrifying bacteria to help shorten the huge ammonia spike from aquasoil.
> 
> Thus you have to also provide Clear Super (heterotrophic bacteria, unlike autotrophic bacteria that normally do nitrification, need carbon for their life cycle or they die.) which looks just like ground graphite.
> 
> Which also explains why you have to add Penac P and Penac W, one of which is probably just a peroxide, without it the oxygen levels in the substrate would be low and the bacteria would just die off.
> 
> Now what I wan't to know is how you keep them alive for more than 72 hours once oxygen levels in the substrate drop.
> 
> My assumption is that you don't keep them alive, and that is why you add Green Bacter later on to keep with the denitrification process.
> Green Bacter is a liquid, do you know if it needs to be refrigerated or has an expiration date?


Clear Super contains no bacteria - it is an activated carbon and organic acid food base for the bacteria. Two fold purpose: stabilizing chemistry and promoting growth of bacteria.

Bacter 100 does contain both heterotrophic and autotrophic bacteria to help the cycling process, but it also contains many other different types. The white papers state that it actually contains over 100 different types of Bacter 100. Now, I've never measured and identified each type of bacteria myself, however I can absolutely state that it contains more than nitrifying bacteria because it's primary use after being put under the substrate is as a natural agent that kills cyano bacteria (if you sprinkle it on top of cyano bacteria (blue-green algae)) over night you will literally see it eat away the cyano bacteria.

In this capacity it aids in the prevention of cyanobacteria within the substrate, which can be common in aqua soil without bacter 100.

Penac isn't really a peroxide (which are toxic in any significant quantities in the aquarium). They aid in both stabilizing the water parameters by neutralizing the acidifying effect in the soil a bit, and in Penac W's case actually has two purposes outside of the soil: 1 to use with RODI water once a month (or really soft water), 2 if you over-carbonate your water (e.g. overdose CO2), you can use it to rapidly oxygenate the water and save the inhabitants during an oxygen shortage.

For more detailed general Penac information you can read about it here.

Green Bacter does not have to be refrigerated. It's an organic acid compound that promotes bacterial growth. It's essentially another food source for the Bacteria itself, It's considered a bacteria 'activator,' which is probably the best way to think of it. Phyton Git works on the same principle, as well as ECA.

So what you're seeing here is a very, very recurring pattern.

ECA, Phyton Git, Green Bacter all serve as bacterial activators using organic acids (highest concentration in Green Bacter), they also contain amino acid supplements necessary for plant growths (highest in ECA).

So these liquids in part or in whole promote bacterial growth. 

Then on the other end you have Bacter 100 - pure dormant Bacteria which jump starts cycling and eats away / prevents cyano bacteria first and fore most.

Furthermore you have Bio Rio, Power Sand - highly porous pumice based material which supports organic bacterial growth "the home" for bacteria, and have bacteria caked into the pumice itself to help start and sustain. 

Then on the other token you have:
Clear Super,
Tourmaline BC 
Tourmaline F
NA Carbon / Bamboo Charcoal

Which all formulate for water purity / toxin removals.

and the Penac's which serve to promote oxygenation.

The recurring factor here is an extreme focus on promoting bacterial growth, not only at the initial stage but *throughout the life span of the aquarium.* Promoting and maintaining this healthy bacterial system is exactly what you see when you witness an aquarium which has reached stability and is basically completely clean of algae with little maintenance.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## freph

The diffuser post made a lot of sense. I appreciate the time you took to explain it and I'm sure many others do as well. Thanks! Did you happen to see my email or did it get lost in the mountain? 

Edit: Saw your email and responded appropriately. I'll have you know that Outlook crashed about 10 times while formatting that message perfectly before switching over to a Word document for ease of saving.


----------



## Chlorophile

Francis Xavier said:


> Clear Super contains no bacteria - it is an activated carbon and organic acid food base for the bacteria. Two fold purpose: stabilizing chemistry and promoting growth of bacteria.
> 
> 
> Bacter 100 does contain both heterotrophic and autotrophic bacteria to help the cycling process, but it also contains many other different types. The white papers state that it actually contains over 100 different types of Bacter 100. Now, I've never measured and identified each type of bacteria myself, however I can absolutely state that it contains more than nitrifying bacteria because it's primary use after being put under the substrate is as a natural agent that kills cyano bacteria (if you sprinkle it on top of cyano bacteria (blue-green algae)) over night you will literally see it eat away the cyano bacteria.
> 
> In this capacity it aids in the prevention of cyanobacteria within the substrate, which can be common in aqua soil without bacter 100.
> 
> Penac isn't really a peroxide (which are toxic in any significant quantities in the aquarium). They aid in both stabilizing the water parameters by neutralizing the acidifying effect in the soil a bit, and in Penac W's case actually has two purposes outside of the soil: 1 to use with RODI water once a month (or really soft water), 2 if you over-carbonate your water (e.g. overdose CO2), you can use it to rapidly oxygenate the water and save the inhabitants during an oxygen shortage.
> 
> For more detailed general Penac information you can read about it here.
> 
> Green Bacter does not have to be refrigerated. It's an organic acid compound that promotes bacterial growth. It's essentially another food source for the Bacteria itself, It's considered a bacteria 'activator,' which is probably the best way to think of it. Phyton Git works on the same principle, as well as ECA.
> 
> So what you're seeing here is a very, very recurring pattern.
> 
> ECA, Phyton Git, Green Bacter all serve as bacterial activators using organic acids (highest concentration in Green Bacter), they also contain amino acid supplements necessary for plant growths (highest in ECA).
> 
> So these liquids in part or in whole promote bacterial growth.
> 
> Then on the other end you have Bacter 100 - pure dormant Bacteria which jump starts cycling and eats away / prevents cyano bacteria first and fore most.
> 
> Furthermore you have Bio Rio, Power Sand - highly porous pumice based material which supports organic bacterial growth "the home" for bacteria, and have bacteria caked into the pumice itself to help start and sustain.
> 
> Then on the other token you have:
> Clear Super,
> Tourmaline BC
> Tourmaline F
> NA Carbon / Bamboo Charcoal
> 
> Which all formulate for water purity / toxin removals.
> 
> and the Penac's which serve to promote oxygenation.
> 
> The recurring factor here is an extreme focus on promoting bacterial growth, not only at the initial stage but *throughout the life span of the aquarium.* Promoting and maintaining this healthy bacterial system is exactly what you see when you witness an aquarium which has reached stability and is basically completely clean of algae with little maintenance.
> 
> P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!




So what is the shelf life on these things?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Chlorophile said:


> So what is the shelf life on these things?


They basically last for years as long as you keep the cap's on em and they aren't in extreme heat or cold. I've yet to run into any expirations.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Chlorophile

Francis Xavier said:


> They basically last for years as long as you keep the cap's on em and they aren't in extreme heat or cold. I've yet to run into any expirations.


How exactly would you be able to tell if they were expired?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Alrighty, Day 6 of water changing here, and today's is a little more intensive. Still got the brown water from before, so it's signaled that it's time to go ahead and take the extra time to remove dead plant matter:










Before any work.

I drained a little of the tank water to make it easier to work with, then turned off the filter and began cutting every plant that was yellowish or decaying. They're doomed anyway so just cut em off and get rid of them.

Not sure if you can see it, but here's the trimmings at the top:










Mostly a few bits of HC (was emmersed), Microsword and some tenellus (also emmersed), The Hair Grass will get it's own unique trim probably in a few days, as it's making the transition as well, and I will wait for more green shoots to pop up.










Use airline tubing to remove decayed plant matter without disturbing planting.

The got-to-be-by-now-infamous bucket shot:










The Riccia Stone outside:










Proceded to drain to this level:










There's an extra step I took today: I filled the aquarium back up to about where you've seen it all this time, at this level:










Now, at this time I noticed by chance an odd filmy white substance on all of the corners of the aquarium in the silicon, so I quickly took a razor blade to remove it after turning off the filter again.

From there I drained the tank back down to the original level and filled her back up and finished:










Total time today was about 30 minutes of work all said and done.

Dosing: Brighty K 1 squirt, Green Bacter 7 drops.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Chlorophile said:


> How exactly would you be able to tell if they were expired?


The powders won't unless they get wet (like you dumped water into the canister)

The liquids, I honestly couldn't tell you, as I've never experienced spoiled additives and ferts. However I imagine they'd smell pretty terrible.

That being said, I've had the same Green Bacter and Brighty K / Step 1 for 2 1/2 years without witnessing any difference in performance. Finally ran out and I had to replace, but that's as long as I've made it with one set.

P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Chlorophile

Francis Xavier said:


> The powders won't unless they get wet (like you dumped water into the canister)
> 
> The liquids, I honestly couldn't tell you, as I've never experienced spoiled additives and ferts. However I imagine they'd smell pretty terrible.
> 
> That being said, I've had the same Green Bacter and Brighty K / Step 1 for 2 1/2 years without witnessing any difference in performance. Finally ran out and I had to replace, but that's as long as I've made it with one set.
> 
> P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


The powders will never expire? The bacteria in green bacter live forever? 

Iron is Iron, so it shouldn't expire.
Carbon doesn't expire.
Ferts are just nutrients, those shouldn't expire, and feeling good about your aquarium doesn't expire either.
Feeling so good that you invest loads of time and effort in doing a regimented and highly rewarding and effective maintenance schedule doesn't expire...


Could it be that you would never experience a difference in performance because there was no performance to begin with beyond your own diligence? 

The same reason you wouldn't experience a difference in performance between not using the majority of these products at all? 


I apologize to you, Frank, and to everyone who reads this post and thinks I am being rude.

You are all free to believe whatever you want and express your views no matter how opposed they are to mine, I also have that right and so I posted this.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Chlorophile said:


> The powders will never expire? The bacteria in green bacter live forever?
> 
> Iron is Iron, so it shouldn't expire.
> Carbon doesn't expire.
> Ferts are just nutrients, those shouldn't expire, and feeling good about your aquarium doesn't expire either.
> Feeling so good that you invest loads of time and effort in doing a regimented and highly rewarding and effective maintenance schedule doesn't expire...
> 
> 
> Could it be that you would never experience a difference in performance because there was no performance to begin with beyond your own diligence?
> 
> The same reason you wouldn't experience a difference in performance between not using the majority of these products at all?
> 
> 
> I apologize to you, Frank, and to everyone who reads this post and thinks I am being rude.
> 
> You are all free to believe whatever you want and express your views no matter how opposed they are to mine, I also have that right and so I posted this.


I totally support you doing and making your conclusion it's great!

To be quite honest, I foresaw this post from you about four posts back. How's that? You will learn one day that there are certain strings of questions people ask when they are looking for a hole to be argumentative.

So I am not insulted, I think you have the right to make up your own mind, and I might be like your dad telling you to do something when you have an idea of another way. 

If you want a full dissertation on all of my experience using various techniques and then another complete dissertation on the methods of the Chinese in Seattle and another on the complete experience of ADG - starting with good habits and basically mineralized top soils, then I can give it to you.

But the fact remains: as of today this methodology is the most repeatedly proven for success, and the best aqua scapes in the world are crafted using this same background techniques.

Many ways to skin the cat: at the end of the day this is the method that I found to be the easiest for the best results. 

I've bumbled and done things exactly how you're doing them now: and I know their pitfalls and benefits and the work required already, and I don't teach them because of those pitfalls.

As for Bacter 100: it's dormant powdered bacteria. Dormant bacteria can remain alive incredibly long periods of time in extreme conditions even. 

Green Bacter is a food source. Sure these can eventually go bad but you won't reach that time in the time you use it.


----------



## Dollface

Chlorophile said:


> I also have that right and so I posted this.


You've already proved your skepticism about the additives. At this point you're just attempting to ensnare Frank with hypothetical and suppositions. If you're so desperate to prove that it's snake oil, buy the product line and test it yourself.


----------



## houseofcards

Well whether you support ADA products or not, I have to give Frank a lot of credit for throwing himself into the Lion's Den, LOL. 

Personally if any company in this space has earned the right to discuss the value of their products it's ADA. How many have joined this hobby based on their books, gallery, etc. and seeing what is possible.


----------



## Francis Xavier

In all fairness, I'd give a mention to competitive products for the additives if there were any I knew of. But most companies only focus on half of the equation.


----------



## Chlorophile

Because most companies would be throwing their money away packaging those sorts of things.


And yes I crafted my statements with a purpose, but not to be argumentative.




As for people asking me to buy the products and test them myself, I have the facilities to perform thorough bioassays on the ADA products.
It's just a guess, but I think that's the last thing ADA wants or they would have data on their products.
That's why an American company couldn't sell these kinds of things, the majority of our companies don't have the kind of apple-esque appeal and following to turn a profit without proof, data, ingredient lists, msds, etc. (does ADA have msds sheets? Seems like they would have to have something like it)

But no I'm not going to buy them and test them, send me something and I'll ask some of my professors for greenhouse space.


----------



## Dollface

Chlorophile said:


> Because most companies would be throwing their money away packaging those sorts of things.
> 
> 
> And yes I crafted my statements with a purpose, but not to be argumentative.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for people asking me to buy the products and test them myself, I have the facilities to perform thorough bioassays on the ADA products.
> It's just a guess, but I think that's the last thing ADA wants or they would have data on their products.
> That's why an American company couldn't sell these kinds of things, the majority of our companies don't have the kind of apple-esque appeal and following to turn a profit without proof, data, ingredient lists, msds, etc. (does ADA have msds sheets? Seems like they would have to have something like it)
> 
> But no I'm not going to buy them and test them, send me something and I'll ask some of my professors for greenhouse space.


Your continued grudge crusade is adding nothing to the discussion.


----------



## Chlorophile

Dollface said:


> Your continued grudge crusade is adding nothing to the discussion.


Okay, then I'll stop.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Chlorophile said:


> Because most companies would be throwing their money away packaging those sorts of things.
> 
> 
> And yes I crafted my statements with a purpose, but not to be argumentative.
> 
> As for people asking me to buy the products and test them myself, I have the facilities to perform thorough bioassays on the ADA products.
> It's just a guess, but I think that's the last thing ADA wants or they would have data on their products.
> That's why an American company couldn't sell these kinds of things, the majority of our companies don't have the kind of apple-esque appeal and following to turn a profit without proof, data, ingredient lists, msds, etc. (does ADA have msds sheets? Seems like they would have to have something like it)
> 
> But no I'm not going to buy them and test them, send me something and I'll ask some of my professors for greenhouse space.


Hey - if you don't want to use them, great! Good on ya. Take the lessons I've laid out here and use them to the capacity that you can. Don't waste your money on makin' the same old mistakes to any capacity. More importantly I would encourage you to not waste time on difficult methods.

Afterall, the reason for the thread isn't so much about product as it is about technique and methodology - product is a byproduct of that for making the job easier and being an effective tool that works.

I'll be honest with everyone in two respects: one, you would be very, very surprised at the stuff that American aquarium companies get away with selling - much worse than the evil additives. Two: the primary market for ADA is Japan, so the majority of the information is based on that market's demands. Take that for what you will.

The only honest assessment here is: the products don't need to be proven, they've already been proven time and time again. This isn't a new line fresh on the market.

I totally encourage you to go start a fundraiser, buy the products, do the testing and publish the results. I'll happily welcome whatever data comes about.


----------



## pejerrey

Baking is an exact science.

You can bake a cake two ways:

1- Buy all of the ingredients separate and follow a recipe reform scratch. Usually requires skills earned by practice, depending in the complexity of the cake.

2- buy a cake mix, add water and be done.

- most people won't be able to tell if they taste your "from scratch" and compare with the "ready mix", they will probably like more the ready mix despite your effort to make "the real deal".... Depending on the source or brand of your ingredients the cake would taste different, different oven...

Ada products are designed to work if you follow their method. This is like the ready mix.

You can buy your own ferts and create a dosing regime... Get your own substrate from your worm compost, make your own light... and figure it yourself. This is the "real deal" but that is not Frank's point here. He is just showing you how to do it, the way he knows. 

Chloro... I would love to see your "how to master iwagumi" thread with your own method, I would love to follow and learn. Most of us realize that companies need to sell you stuff.
The rest of us will enjoy to invest in a "ready mix" to experience a successful iwagumi scape.

Sorry to spam.


----------



## Chlorophile

pejerrey said:


> Baking is an exact science.
> 
> You can bake a cake two ways:
> 
> 1- Buy all of the ingredients separate and follow a recipe reform scratch. Usually requires skills earned by practice, depending in the complexity of the cake.
> 
> 2- buy a cake mix, add water and be done.
> 
> - most people won't be able to tell if they taste your "from scratch" and compare with the "ready mix", they will probably like more the ready mix despite your effort to make "the real deal".... Depending on the source or brand of your ingredients the cake would taste different, different oven...
> 
> Ada products are designed to work if you follow their method. This is like the ready mix.
> 
> You can buy your own ferts and create a dosing regime... Get your own substrate from your worm compost, make your own light... and figure it yourself. This is the "real deal" but that is not Frank's point here. He is just showing you how to do it, the way he knows.
> 
> Chloro... I would love to see your "how to master iwagumi" thread with your own method, I would love to follow and learn. Most of us realize that companies need to sell you stuff.
> The rest of us will enjoy to invest in a "ready mix" to experience a successful iwagumi scape.
> 
> Sorry to spam.


Hah I'm not a master at iwagumi so I wouldn't be posting anything like that, if I did the only rule would be no riccia! I hate riccia! 
If you want to follow directions and feel safe then just do the ADA method. It will make you feel good, like the Easter bunny used to, but it isn't fool proof either. I see just as many hiccups with or without all the ADA stuff, most are generally from beginners with no experience or routine.

All the philosophy and habit forming stuff frank is talking about is most important in my opinion.

If someone gives you a roadmap it's hard to get lost, it doesn't mean the path you took was special or even the quickest or easiest. It just means you got there.
Others like to try to use their sense of direction.

My opinion is just that plant physiology is very well documented, we know what plants need to be healthy and vigorous and in nearly all cases vigorous plants are all you need to keep an aquarium from being sullied by algae, and isn't that all anyone is ever after in the end once you we are past the scaping stage?

:]


----------



## houseofcards

Chlorophile said:


> ...
> My opinion is just that plant physiology is very well documented, we know what plants need to be healthy and vigorous and in nearly all cases vigorous plants are all you need to keep an aquarium from being sullied by algae..


That is really not true IMO. It might be in general aquatic plant husbandry, but I don't think it's applicable to all aquariums. If you have a sparsely planted tank in terms of mass, even if the plants are healthy it's probably not going to be enough to keep the tank from attracting algae. How would it? To rely only on healthy plants to keep a tank algae free would be very limiting in aquascape design.


----------



## Chlorophile

No you are completely right I should have said "lots of healthy plants."


----------



## Dollface

There's been too many unfounded assumptions and not enough pictures in this thread. Frank, I want a day 7 update.


----------



## houseofcards

Chlorophile said:


> No you are completely right I should have said "lots of healthy plants."


Makes a big difference. Just wanted to put it out there. Now about Riccia. You know they say if one can master Riccia Scape, he can accomplish anything.


----------



## Francis Xavier

To Mix things up for today, I've included a few quick iPhone videos I took last night, viewable:

Overall Video

Panning Video (apparently youtube is -so- upset by the shakiness of my hand, that it's taking measures to correct the shake factor. Sorry!)


----------



## Francis Xavier

A Sneak Peak at The Next Tutorial Session

The aquarium is growing in great, and now we're about to bridge an important process of the aquarium: trimming. While it's still a week or two away, with the heretofore lack of algae and other things to cover extensively, it's a good opportunity to give you a brief overview of some techniques which may help you in your existing planted tank.

Trimming the ole' carpet

Once you've gotten a carpet up and running and to that picture perfect moment, it's gone in a flash. Why? Because your plants are growing! So in the long term, proper trimming techniques are the most important. 

Each Plant has Different Trimming Requirements and Growth Rates

An important step in mastering mixed carpets is knowing how each individual plant responds to trimming, how quickly it grows and in what pattern it grows in. 

So what you want to do is master at least one plant at a time and it's trimming technique, and as a result here is an older video I took trimming eleocharis acicularis to keep it: short, dense, and growing viral. 

Trimming Eleocharis Acicularis

The proper tools: for trimming a carpet you want a pair of curved scissors to enable you to cut evenly across a wide surface. For this purpose, my favorite all around tool is the Wave Scissors type - as it allows to bend around rocks and hard to reach places due to it's shape. Aside from that, the good turn around is the Curved Type scissor which allows the same function across more open fields. This is the type I've used so far in the Mini M for the trimming of dead plants.

Technique: trim evenly as close to the root as possible with eleocharis acicularis. This will prompt fresh green growth that will appear as if it were 'sparkling,' (old leaves tend to be dark green, you always want to shoot for that "sparkling" green). If you have it, dose Green Gain to aid in the regrowth phase and help prevent algae. 

I'll cover more in depth trimming techniques once this tank has gotten a little more mature, but for now, I hope this tidbit of information has been valuable for you for your current aquariums. 

P.S. Feel free to continue asking questions! As Dollface answered earlier in this thread "some of the most valuable insights and techniques come from the questions of hobbyists."


----------



## freph

Elocharis acicularis looks like a lovely plant but how does its size scale in relation to the size of a Mini M tank? Is it more suited as a background plant when compared to naturally shorter/smaller species like _Elocharis belem_?


----------



## @[email protected]

freph said:


> Elocharis acicularis looks like a lovely plant but how does its size scale in relation to the size of a Mini M tank? Is it more suited as a background plant when compared to naturally shorter/smaller species like _Elocharis belem_?


imo, e. belem is a superior carpet in almost every tank. the point of a carpet is to be nice and low. plus e. belems leaves curve out after a bit helping to cover up more substrate per leaf then e. acicularis which has relatively straight, vertical leaves. 
but they are very similar, and are both true grasses, so you can trim the leaves themselves without killing the leaves.


----------



## freph

@[email protected] said:


> imo, e. belem is a superior carpet in almost every tank. the point of a carpet is to be nice and low. plus e. belems leaves curve out after a bit helping to cover up more substrate per leaf then e. acicularis which has relatively straight, vertical leaves.
> but they are very similar, and are both true grasses, so you can trim the leaves themselves without killing the leaves.


Makes sense. Sounds like a better choice. There is significant lack of Frank today...wonder where he is and if he caught my email.  I'd love his opinion on plant choice.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Alrighty, let's move straight on to Day 7!

I went ahead and changed the water volume to the same degree that the past few days had been, so you can imagine the change in water volume.

However, this morning I did do one thing different: I decided I wanted some extra oxygenation at night, so I lowered the water during lights off to this level:










Allowing the aquarium to run at this level at night (or raising the lily pipe) helps to maintain oxygen levels in the aquarium and prevent surface film from developing.

The ever-popular bucket shot (i'll continue to post these until you have a thorough understanding of the importance of water change for prevention!) :










After the water change today, I added another fertilizer to the Step program:










Green Brighty Step 1. So beginning today the dosing regime is Brighty K + Green Brighty Step 1, one squirt each. I also dosed Green Bacter, 7 drops. From here on, Green Bacter will be dosed only after water changes (so every 2nd day for the 2nd week).

And here's the full tank shot after the complete water change:










Something that might be hard to notice, is this particular shot:










If you notice the bronze leaf of the E. Tennellus, this is an extremely good sign: this means that there is potent light penetration, adequate Co2 and proper nutrient supplies. The normal coloration is Green, only under a synthesis of great conditions do the leaves turn bronze. This will add a nice touch of color to the tank later.

I will note one thing:

I am not happy with the way the Riccia is growing - well no, I'm happy with the way it is growing, but this SP. of Riccia Fluitans is too broad leaved. What this means is that I will likely be swapping out for Riccia from another source for a more micro leaf structure. I'll give it a few more days to see what it does, but at current the leaves are too large for me to achieve what I want.

This process is totally okay to go through in setting up the tank. 

Earlier I spoke about tools and gave a brief overview, now I'll show you a little more about the proper tool set

At minimum, you should have three tools to properly maintain your Nano. This is utterly important to long term maintenance of the aquarium:










From top to bottom you have: Curved Scissors short, Pincettes M, and Straight Scissors. 

These tools perform very vital roles and it's important to have a diversity on hand to do the job you need them to do:

Curved Scissors: for getting around corners, and more importantly trimming evenly across a carpet of plants. This is very hard to do without the curve, since they provide the extra leverage you need to make an even cut at an angle, as opposed to trying to level out the scissors themselves.

Straight Scissors: These are "surgical strike" scissors, which are ideal for trimming stems, or in this application, for cutting single yellowing or dead leaves from the plant with precision. This makes that job much easier than the curved type scissors. 

Fine-tipped pincettes: a must for planting. I can't imagine being able to plant without pincettes. That would be a nightmare! Having a set of ones which are fine tipped allows for you to plant smaller plants (like HC) with greater ease, additionally letting you plant deeper without taking a lot of soil or plant matter up with you.

A note on choosing quality:

Quality is extremely important, for scissors you must absolutely have scissors which have very sharp blades and are perfectly jointed to leave no space between blades, as pictured:










If the blades of your scissors are not sharp, they are worthless. You will waste time cutting and cutting and recutting the same plants and be unable to get a proper cut evenly across surfaces (the most important aspect in sculpting your aquascape). 

If they joints are not properly aligned and there's any spacing what so ever between blades, then you will suffer from similar problems as if you had a dull blade. 

For Pincettes, they should have proper bends that almost feel like they have a spring in them for the best ability to plant firmly doing as little damage to the plant as possible. Pincettes that end up laying flat together when you press them together with no resistance lessens your gripping power on the plant while also making it more difficult to put the plant in place.

Don't add extra hurdles to your maintenance!

For Long-term maintenance, you want to invest in the best grade of stainless steel you possibly can to prevent rusting, while keeping their performance consistent over their lifetime. Always make sure to wipe them down with a towel afterwards. This will ensure they last as long as possible. The first tool set I ever bought was about a $20 one from China, and believe me, it made my life miserable when it came to trimming. You don't need to go with ADA, but get the best quality ones you can afford - with proper maintenance they'll last you for years and years.

P.S. As the layout grows, and we begin moving into the transition between growth and stability, I'll be giving more detailed information as to application and when what tool is used where.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Makes sense. Sounds like a better choice. There is significant lack of Frank today...wonder where he is and if he caught my email.  I'd love his opinion on plant choice.


Hey Freph, 

I did get to your email yesterday! Check your inbox.



@[email protected] said:


> imo, e. belem is a superior carpet in almost every tank. the point of a carpet is to be nice and low. plus e. belems leaves curve out after a bit helping to cover up more substrate per leaf then e. acicularis which has relatively straight, vertical leaves.
> but they are very similar, and are both true grasses, so you can trim the leaves themselves without killing the leaves.


In the end belem vs. acicularis comes to personal preference. For me, one isn't superior to the other: it's all about application and look relative to the aquascape. E. Acicularis tends to be cleaner, Belem can be interpreted as "wilder," if used as a foreground.



freph said:


> Elocharis acicularis looks like a lovely plant but how does its size scale in relation to the size of a Mini M tank? Is it more suited as a background plant when compared to naturally shorter/smaller species like _Elocharis belem_?


E. Acicularis is a great mid-background in a Mini M. It can also be a great foreground, as it responds well to regular trimming and can be trained to stay shorter. The total height is usually no more than 5-6 inches.


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Freph,
> 
> I did get to your email yesterday! Check your inbox.
> 
> 
> 
> In the end belem vs. acicularis comes to personal preference. For me, one isn't superior to the other: it's all about application and look relative to the aquascape. E. Acicularis tends to be cleaner, Belem can be interpreted as "wilder," if used as a foreground.
> 
> 
> 
> E. Acicularis is a great mid-background in a Mini M. It can also be a great foreground, as it responds well to regular trimming and can be trained to stay shorter. The total height is usually no more than 5-6 inches.


Already responded to the first one. You have a nice chunky message awaiting you. :hihi: Define "wilder", though. Chlorophile mentioned the the leaves of belem curl outward as opposed to growing vertical. Does this mean that the belem grows more intertwined as opposed to the side-by-side density and uniformity that I see with acicularis?


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Already responded to the first one. You have a nice chunky message awaiting you. :hihi: Define "wilder", though. Chlorophile mentioned the the leaves of belem curl outward as opposed to growing vertical. Does this mean that the belem grows more intertwined as opposed to the side-by-side density and uniformity that I see with acicularis?


You got it. The messy-factor of Belem has gorgeous application when used in patches breaking up the monotony of HC. Tremendously well.

As a full carpet it can work really well as well - dependent on the stone it's used with. However as a single species carpet, E. Acicularis has more flexibility as it is able to be manipulated by slope and growing patterns.

Since it maxes out at about 5-6 inches, with high slope in the back, low in the front you can stage your trimming in gradients. Trim the front most often, middle half as much, and the back 1/4 as much.

In aquascaping it's not the most unique looking plant that's the most useful.

*It's the plant that can be manipulated in the most flexible ways.*


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> You got it. The messy-factor of Belem has gorgeous application when used in patches breaking up the monotony of HC. Tremendously well.
> 
> As a full carpet it can work really well as well - dependent on the stone it's used with. However as a single species carpet, E. Acicularis has more flexibility as it is able to be manipulated by slope and growing patterns.
> 
> Since it maxes out at about 5-6 inches, with high slope in the back, low in the front you can stage your trimming in gradients. Trim the front most often, middle half as much, and the back 1/4 as much.
> 
> In aquascaping it's not the most unique looking plant that's the most useful.
> 
> *It's the plant that can be manipulated in the most flexible ways.*


Very interesting. I've still got a few belem plants laying around that I could use for that very purpose. Do you happen to have any examples of such a practice? Sounds like I'm going with acicularis for the next tank though if it's that simple.


----------



## Calebh21

Is it normal that half the stuff in the adgshop's substrate system section is out of stock? A little ridiculous if it is.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Calebh21 said:


> Is it normal that half the stuff in the adgshop's substrate system section is out of stock? A little ridiculous if it is.


All the additives are in stock, we had a few web page hiccups this week. Bigger items like soil are resupplies April first week or so. Import time tables and what not.


----------



## Couesfanatic

Calebh21 said:


> Is it normal that half the stuff in the adgshop's substrate system section is out of stock? A little ridiculous if it is.


After the earthquake in Japan everyone has been low on most all of ADA products.

Rumor is that things are going to be amped up in production soon.


----------



## pejerrey

Is it possible to do a non co2, no ferts kind of carpet.


----------



## Dollface

Your only real option at that point is a moss carpet tbh.


----------



## Francis Xavier

pejerrey said:


> Is it possible to do a non co2, no ferts kind of carpet.


I would never recommend a non Co2 setup. They're prepping you for heart ache. 

The ONLY circumstance I'd do it in is with riccia some easy small stems (rotala green), in a container that is less than one gallon with daily water change.

Pressurized gets you the best results most consistently. At the very least you need a DIY setup, and I'd run at least two on a mini.


----------



## Lludu

I can't get miss to actually carpet haha


----------



## Francis Xavier

So I busted out ye ole test kit today just to see where things are:

Ammonia 4.0ppm (could be 8.0ppm, honestly the color gradient is a pain to distinguish on the API kits.

Nitrite: .25 ppm

Nitrate: 0

pH: 6.4

kH: 1

gH: 1


Now that water changes are scaled back somewhat, I'll start adding Penac W into the water column to balance variables somewhat in terms of hardness.

Today there was no water change: I drained the water at night to the outflow level then topped off to full before lights on.

Dosed brighty k and green brighty special lights.


----------



## mahko

I don't have Green bacter easily available to me, and I'm aware that adding 'mulm' or some filter media from an established tank would kick-start the bacteria growth. My question would be, is there another alternative? Such as Tetra Safe Start or is the mulm an easier option?


----------



## Francis Xavier

I cannot recommend the effectiveness of other products such as tetra safe start, as I've never used them personally. 

However, you can very much so seed your filter media with bio media used in another aquarium to help jump start the bacterial growth.

Green Bacter is a food source for the various bacteria in the substrate, bio media, etc and helps spurn their growth. Think of it as supplying nutrients to plants: Green Bacter is giving nutrients to bacteria so they grow. The same laws of minimums apply (e.g. a plant can only grow to the capacity which the lowest nutrient is supplied)


----------



## mahko

There's a lot of biased opinions on the 'cycle' products, and I was curious on your take. Thanks. So you let the bacteria establish on its own and just supply it with Green Bacter as food? Makes sense to me.


----------



## Francis Xavier

mahko said:


> There's a lot of biased opinions on the 'cycle' products, and I was curious on your take. Thanks. So you let the bacteria establish on its own and just supply it with Green Bacter as food? Makes sense to me.


This is correct. That being said - many of those products (Bio Spira I have first hand experience with) do work for non-planted tanks. The problem is the concentration of ammonia in Aqua Soil, so there's no "quick fix."

The best method involves Bacter 100 (dormant bacteria) + Filter media from established tank + Green Bacter for food. Quickest bang for buck.

For reference, in this aquarium I'm using no pre-established filter media.


----------



## ClintonParsons

Someone asked how to tell if the liquid additives are expired...

I got a bottle of something (I think Phyton-Git) that was given to me some years ago and it had sat it a garage. It had fluffy precipitate in it. Expired.


Frank, can Phyton-Git be painted on Bucephalandra leaves? I am having an algae problem now. My CO2 is at 1 bubble every four to five seconds from the mini polen diffuser (I don't have a bubble counter because I have a mist tank and it's not really practical) and this started after I added special lights.

Can you alternate special lights and shade?


Is Phyton-git useful for GDA? Also,my tourmaline In the filter is several years old. When do I add more? Or are its electrical properties I intrinsic so it is never exhausted? 

I as also wondering, if you have pret soft water, why can't you add a tiny bit of Penac-P at water changes?


----------



## Francis Xavier

ClintonParsons said:


> Someone asked how to tell if the liquid additives are expired...
> 
> I got a bottle of something (I think Phyton-Git) that was given to me some years ago and it had sat it a garage. It had fluffy precipitate in it. Expired.
> 
> 
> Frank, can Phyton-Git be painted on Bucephalandra leaves? I am having an algae problem now. My CO2 is at 1 bubble every four to five seconds from the mini polen diffuser (I don't have a bubble counter because I have a mist tank and it's not really practical) and this started after I added special lights.
> 
> Can you alternate special lights and shade?
> 
> 
> Is Phyton-git useful for GDA? Also,my tourmaline In the filter is several years old. When do I add more? Or are its electrical properties I intrinsic so it is never exhausted?
> 
> I as also wondering, if you have pret soft water, why can't you add a tiny bit of Penac-P at water changes?


Penac P is only recommended for being under the substrate - using Penac W is the way to go for adjusting water hardness a bit (as I used it today for this purpose, I want kH up a notch over 1 (between 2-3 is good). 

Phyton Git when dosed will help some with GDA, but primarily to get rid of GDA have oto cats (2 for Mini M), and do a weekly algae pad to the tank.

I would recommend swapping out the Tourmaline F given the amount of time you've used it for. I am not sure of it's effectiveness past 1 year, but it is quite significantly more long-lived than carbon.

Phyton Git can be painted on leaves of Anubias because of the hard cuticle. You can test this on Bucephelandra (a plant i've only grown once) to see how it reacts, start with only one leaf. 

Bump your co2 up a notch or so. You'll be slowly adjusting as the tank gets adjusted.

FYI your super jet pump is on it's way from Japan right now. ETA 1.5 weeks.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Hey, I notice a bit of improvement since taking your advice on adding more K to my HC Cuba carpet, thanks. 

Do you trim off the yellow parts? How aggressive do you trim to promote a thicker carpet? 

Also, with your tank being 5.5 gallon (I think) what kind of livestock are you going to add?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Not much for the Day 8 update, just a top off (in this tank the no water change days are basically 20% water changes)( day 9 water change is full 70%)

You can see the residue of some Penac W which will go away over time:










Yesterday you may remember me testing kH and having a value of 1, with the addition of Penac I rose this value to 2: right where I want it.

The only other thing I did was continue to remove dead, yellow or old leaves.










Here I'm using spring curve type scissors, which are easier to maneuver with in tanks of this size since you grip them with your palm and can access areas that are harder to otherwise.

I'm pruning off the old e. tenellus and micro sword leaves as well as bits of yellow HC.

Of all the plants I have in here, surprisingly the tenellus and the moss are doing the best, followed by the hair grass, which is doing the invasive growth hair grass thing.

Very pleased with the bronze tenellus growth: ridiculously happy in fact. This will provide the contrast im looking for. The riccia I have more being shipped in to see if it's a different sp.

For riccia I want an sp that isn't so broad, so hopefully the stuff I'm getting from a hobbyist is the right type. At least from his pics it appears that way.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> Hey, I notice a bit of improvement since taking your advice on adding more K to my HC Cuba carpet, thanks.
> 
> Do you trim off the yellow parts? How aggressive do you trim to promote a thicker carpet?
> 
> Also, with your tank being 5.5 gallon (I think) what kind of livestock are you going to add?


I go very aggressive with removing yellow and old leaves: especially once roots are established. 

I'm very glad you're seeing an improvement. You may also consider adding more iron.

I will add a small tetra or borates sp. have about 5-7 Amano shrimp and 1-2 o cats.


----------



## freph

FlyingHellFish said:


> Hey, I notice a bit of improvement since taking your advice on adding more K to my HC Cuba carpet, thanks.
> 
> Do you trim off the yellow parts? How aggressive do you trim to promote a thicker carpet?
> 
> Also, with your tank being 5.5 gallon (I think) what kind of livestock are you going to add?


Aggressive trimming would be trimming down to the bottom most layer of leaves/stem structures. You don't want to trim completely away, but you want to think of it as trimming away the top layer and exposing the underlying infrastructure. Here's a picture from a thread Tom did a while back about trimming.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Alright, Day 9:










I'm at a stage in the planted tank growth period where there isn't a whole lot you can do except sit tight and keep doing what you're doing.

As you develop good habits, an odd thing happens: you are so happy with the process involved with your tank that you always want to be doing something with it.

However, when appropriate, the best thing you can do is sit tight and wait things out. 

For example here I've got two algae's starting to appear: one which is a hitchhiker from the riccia I got from a local pet store ( which I am eagerly awaiting to replace with some from a different source ), while removal and replanting is typically not something you can do, with riccia it grows quick enough to not have a major impact this early in the game: plus it doesn't root, so there is minimal disturbance.

Aside from that: 

Hair grass is doing its viral thing already as this picture illustrates:










By this time next week I'll be trimming away all of the old emerged growth which is largely useless even now to the plant since it has rooted healthily.

I'm still very happy with the way e tennellus and the moss are coming in: much quicker and healthier than I thought they would, which is great.

Micro sword might find itself removed though, the more I look at it right now the more it isn't fitting the feel I want.

That being said: Day 9 had a full water change, Green Bacter x6 drops, brighty k x1 squirt and green brighty step 1 1x squirt.

Ammonia and nitrites are of course still to high to add shrimp (which will quickly eliminate the small green algae growing, which is great to see since its a very easy algae to eliminate).


----------



## freph

Looking spiffy. I'm really liking how the Riccia pops out...such a fast grower too. Also, reading back I notice that you use 100% powder types in terms of soil...how do you feel about this vs say 3L normal and 1.5L of powder? Any issue associated with it? I read on the website that too much powder type can cause issues with dustiness when moving plants and decreased water circulation...however I really love the fine look of the powder type and the size ratio is has with the Mini M. Also, happen to catch my second email?


----------



## FlyingHellFish

How do you stop the DHG from spreading too much? Do you put dividers in the substrate?


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Looking spiffy. I'm really liking how the Riccia pops out...such a fast grower too. Also, reading back I notice that you use 100% powder types in terms of soil...how do you feel about this vs say 3L normal and 1.5L of powder? Any issue associated with it? I read on the website that too much powder type can cause issues with dustiness when moving plants and decreased water circulation...however I really love the fine look of the powder type and the size ratio is has with the Mini M. Also, happen to catch my second email?


In a Mini S and Mini M 100% Powder is just fine (Amano will even just use the additives + powder in a Mini S/M). Once you start breaching Mini L size (8 gallons or so) and up you should use normal + powder. 

Generally speaking you don't want to have to move plants around much after you've planted them, but you'll still be all right with 100% powder.




FlyingHellFish said:


> How do you stop the DHG from spreading too much? Do you put dividers in the substrate?


When Hairgrass is trimmed it kind of triggers it to send out more runners. In this case, I'm holding off trimming off all the old emmersed growth (which could have been done on Day 8), to let it keep going vertical for a bit before trimming it away probably next week.

There are no dividers, it's just about trimming it back at the runner if it spreads where you absolutely don't want it, and otherwise just planting much, much, much less DHG than you do everything else.


----------



## Dollface

Francis Xavier said:


> There are no dividers, it's just about trimming it back at the runner if it spreads where you absolutely don't want it, and otherwise just planting much, much, much less DHG than you do everything else.


I've kept hair grass but never actively restrained it, could you elaborate on how to "train" it like this? are you just cutting the runners down to the substrate level?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Dollface said:


> I've kept hair grass but never actively restrained it, could you elaborate on how to "train" it like this? are you just cutting the runners down to the substrate level?


You can create "barriers" of other plants by planting around the hair grass. While it's viral, it has a great deal of difficulty overcoming other plants in the way of it. 

I discovered this in my first iwagumi by mistake. Where I had already mostly grown an HC carpet, and when I wanted to add hair grass, it never seemed to grow. The reason was because the HC essentially had blocked out it's growth in all but a small area. When faced with this challenge Hair grass does one of a few predictable things:

1. Stops growing
2. Grows underneath the substrate
3. Shoots runners over the plant hedges (easy to cut)

I reinforced this mistake by doing it in my Mini S and Mini L in Seattle - where hair grass absolutely would not grow past the hedge of HC, if you look at the double tank shot on page one, notice the Mini S (Front left tank), where there is absolutely hair grass in the tank, but it's almost imperceptable because the HC blocked out the growth of the hair grass. 

You can manipulate the growing points of other plants this way as well. In this particular layout I have a few artificial barriers:

1. Wall of moss stones. Hair grass will grow underneath the stones and prop itself up in spots not covered by moss if allowed.

2. E. Tenellus. This will through out underground runners and does not grow as thick and dense as Hair grass initially, so it will cover more ground and is a larger plant, so the roots will block growth inevitably.

3. HC and stones on the right. This will create the hedge on the right side that blocks hair grass from penetrating to the other side of the layout.

Techniques to stymie growth in the beginning:

1. Not trimming it as early as usual. I'm letting the emmersed growth stay for at least another week. This will drain the plant of 'energy,' while it focuses on growing out and trying to keep the old plant matter alive. This also will ensure that the fresh new green growth will grow vertical.

Trimming hair grass will encourage it to send out runners in a massive dash for survival. So by not trimming, we signal the plant that it's in a good spot and can just grow up, not out. 

So by stacking the odds in favor of the other plants, and with practice I can manipulate exactly how much hair grass will be in the layout. 

Essentially a ratio of 5:1 other plants to hair grass will help keep the odds balanced.

*This is why learning the growth patterns of each plant is essential to a mixed carpet.*


----------



## houseofcards

Hey Frank, don't know if this has been discussed in the thread, but it might be interesting to know how long you plan on keeping this setup and why?


----------



## Francis Xavier

houseofcards said:


> Hey Frank, don't know if this has been discussed in the thread, but it might be interesting to know how long you plan on keeping this setup and why?



I have a precisely in-precise answer to that question:

I plan on keeping this setup for as long as it entertains me. I figure at least 6 mo's to a year. It all really depends and here's why: There are some layouts you do, which once you achieve the final result you absolutely love them and keep them going as long as you want. Others, you get the final result and decide you want to do something new, or are inspired to challenge yourself in a new way. 

I would recommend with any layout to at least keep it going for enough time to enjoy fish in the aquarium and relax.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

That's a great tip about HG. I was wondering why my E. tenellus eventually took over the whole tank when I had it together with HG.


----------



## houseofcards

Francis Xavier said:


> I have a precisely in-precise answer to that question:
> 
> I plan on keeping this setup for as long as it entertains me. I figure at least 6 mo's to a year. It all really depends and here's why: There are some layouts you do, which once you achieve the final result you absolutely love them and keep them going as long as you want. Others, you get the final result and decide you want to do something new, or are inspired to challenge yourself in a new way.
> 
> I would recommend with any layout to at least keep it going for enough time to enjoy fish in the aquarium and relax.


That makes sense from an enjoyment/satisfaction end of things. I'm curious and I could be wrong, I think I once read in a ADA publication that eventually a tank will find it's end. I'm pretty sure it was based on an accumulation of organic build up over time. Even with WC and good growth/maintenance eventually keeping it pristine become harder and harder and the tank needs to be started over. Do you have any insight on this?


----------



## Francis Xavier

houseofcards said:


> That makes sense from an enjoyment/satisfaction end of things. I'm curious and I could be wrong, I think I once read in a ADA publication that eventually a tank will find it's end. I'm pretty sure it was based on an accumulation of organic build up over time. Even with WC and good growth/maintenance eventually keeping it pristine become harder and harder and the tank needs to be started over. Do you have any insight on this?


This is absolutely true. Every layout eventually reaches its end. You. An revitalize soil with multi and iron bottom, but eventually all things must end for the planted tank. Inevitably the plants become old and tired, no longer able to pull from the exhausted resources of the ecosystem. 

While this process often takes years in larger tanks when you at least resupply with multi and iron bottom, it is utterly inevitable that the system tires out and crashes. Not quickly, but slowly things just start to not Regrow as they used to. Eventually aqua soil starts to calcify, and loosen as roots keep pushing through it.

This is why you should enjoy the layout while it lasts and take measures to healthily prolong the system as much as possible. 

Bit of a life lesson, no?


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Francis Xavier said:


> ...eventually all things must end for the planted tank. Inevitably the plants become old and tired, no longer able to pull from the exhausted resources of the ecosystem.


Makes perfect sense, and exactly what happened to my 20 gallon after about 4 years. At that time, should one just pull everything out of the tank and restart or is it possible to just replace the substrate?


----------



## Francis Xavier

2wheelsx2 said:


> Makes perfect sense, and exactly what happened to my 20 gallon after about 4 years. At that time, should one just pull everything out of the tank and restart or is it possible to just replace the substrate?


Pretty much, you can redo the same scape, but will need to eventually just get new substrate, then the fun starts again.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Day 10 (I almost said Day 11, losing track). 

There's no water change today, and algae growth has stymied a bit.










There are two things different here. See if you can notice. Don't read any further until you can guess.



















Did you guess it? Yes, I changed out the Riccia stones, three of them, as well as one other change, but first let's talk Riccia.

I've discussed my displeasure with the way the Riccia was growing broad leafed before. In response to this, I obtained more Riccia. Really more Riccia than I know what to do with, so the majority of it is sitting in a bucket pending another layout.

Midway through looking at the Riccia, I discovered that likely it's the same SP of what I've got. So it's 99% likely that my quest continues. However, the Riccia's growth on the right side isn't irritating me as much today, so I'm leaving it there.

Now the other three stones had some growth suffering: the basic stock had some brown spots and was growing in unevenly. So I went ahead and used the new stuff to retie new riccia. This will balance out probably within a week or so. Thankfully, Riccia is very forgiving with it's growth.

The other change:

I removed the Microsword. There was something in this layout causing me tension and I couldn't quite put my finger on it. After looking at it for a bit, I had a hunch that the microsword was messing with the flow of my layout, and after enough frustration of seeing it, I completely removed it from the layout.

And Viola, there's all of a sudden a lot of tension gone from the layout: it flows much better and the planting scheme jives a lot better.

The broad leafed look of the Microsword was just not working with the slender leaf Tennellus and Hair Grass. It's color wasn't meshing with the Moss, and it's positioning on the left of the main stone just wasn't working.

So, compare the this picture with the previous day picture. All of a sudden the right side looks infinitely more expansive.

Now for a picture of my favorite section of the aquarium:


----------



## Francis Xavier

There's something I want to point out on the difference a single plant makes.

Day 9:










Day 10:










Looks like the whole scape opened up and became expansive didn't it?

The first picture looks like the main stone is centered.

The second the main stone looks more to the left.

The reason? No microsword to the right of the main stone to focus your attention at a second focal point, therefore centering the scale. All it was was 4 sprigs removed from that one spot.


----------



## Chlorophile

I liked it more with the Microsword, softens the look of the main stone which IMO is just barely too large, maybe 15% too large. 
I think it helped to bring some unity to the tank as well, feels less balanced without it.


----------



## Dollface

There's no such thing as "too large" a main stone in nano iwagumis, really. If it fits in the tank, it's good. A lot of the bulk is going to end up being hidden in either the substrate, or the plant growth. Keep in mind, this is only 10 days worth of growth. Over the course of the next few weeks and months, the carpet is easily going to eat that extra 15%. 

If you've ever seen some of the old iwagumi nanos from the ADA gallery, (This video at 1:18, and here) most of the main stones are all oversized. Size can also be deceptive, take for example This stone, pictured in my Mini-S. That stone is gigantic, it's almost 2x the size of the main stone I'm using in my current scape, it barely fits in the tank, but it still manages to look undersized. It's much better to err on the side of "too large" and letting the plant growth eat up any extra, than starting out too small and losing your entire scape.


----------



## Chlorophile

Yea I know, I like big rocks.
I think this would be perfect if it were identical but about 10% smaller.
It's all art anyway that's just the only thing I envision differently with the hardscape.
Love the main stone but just feels a hair too large.

You're right more growth will definitely take away from how large it looks.

I think the stone in your mini s is perfect dollface, it could be about 20% bigger and probably look even better but that rock also has a different look to Franks.
The mini s stone looks more like a cluster than a single stone.

Rock size aside the difference with and without the Microsword was barely noticeable, I liked it but it's fine either way, the overexposure on the second shot makes a bigger difference to the feel of the scape than the plant imo.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Chlorophile said:


> Rock size aside the difference with and without the Microsword was barely noticeable, I liked it but it's fine either way, the overexposure on the second shot makes a bigger difference to the feel of the scape than the plant imo.


I found the same. I don't really notice the loss of the microsword, but noticed the missing Riccia in the front a lot more. But then that could be my personal bias against Riccia.


----------



## frrok

After looking it 10 times I have to go with frank on this one. It really does open it up a lot more. The scape looks like it flows up from the left. Really nice. It's really amazing what taking out a couple plants will do.


----------



## Francis Xavier

All this is the fun part: predicting where the scape will go. Honestly, it's where the most errors are made, and this is where experience with individual plants comes into play. How large will they get, how fast will they grow, etc. 

For example, by the time it grows in, the Tennellus will be quite large for a nano and have a much more dominating presence. Much of the reason to eliminate microsword also had to do with giving the Tennellus more space to grow in.

I was in the mood for taking pictures last night and decided to show a few different angles:



















The pattern so far is working really well. Although I will have to consider moving the diffuser over to the other side to deliver more Co2 to the front left and such, which likely will result in switching where the inflow and outflow are.


----------



## freph

That's insane how removing a few sprigs of a plant makes that much of a difference in a scape like this. Nanos....you never cease to amaze me. The riccia is really taking off as well. Looks great!


----------



## Francis Xavier

For whoever was keeping track:

Day 1:










Day 10:


----------



## lauraleellbp

MODERATOR WARNING:

If you want to debate products, please start that in a different thread in the equipment forum rather than hijacking a journal.

Thanks everyone, and now back to Frank's lovely journal.


----------



## Dollface

Since frank sort of asked (well, more like he didn't say I couldn't) here's the original vs. "10% smaller" main stone, mocked up how I figure this'll grow in:








vs









The smaller stone just looks so sad.  I think franks vision is that even more of the stones will be obscured, so there's that too. 

I have to say, mocking it up really made me appreciate the moss/e. tennellus even more. I was kind of dubious, but It really draws the eye to the focal point of the main stone, while removing the microsword opens up up the entire right hand side into a sort of meadow. It's a really fantastic use of negative space, which is defintely under utilized in a lot of scapes (... like mine.) 

That's what I get for doubting Frank, jeez.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Holy (insert your favorite word)!

That's an awesome rendering. I'm going to "repurpose" that immensely.


----------



## Ptjameso

Love the rendering Dollface! Still following this journal and really enjoying it. I don't have any ADA products...yet but I'm very happy to be reading a journal like this. It has put me in a different mindset. I thoroughly enjoyed doing maintenance on my 20L today with about 60% water change and some trimming/ removing unwanted or excessive plants. It surely helped a lot. Thanks again Frank for creating this journal for everyone!


----------



## Chlorophile

Dollface said:


> Since frank sort of asked (well, more like he didn't say I couldn't) here's the original vs. "10% smaller" main stone, mocked up how I figure this'll grow in:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The smaller stone just looks so sad.  I think franks vision is that even more of the stones will be obscured, so there's that too.
> 
> I have to say, mocking it up really made me appreciate the moss/e. tennellus even more. I was kind of dubious, but It really draws the eye to the focal point of the main stone, while removing the microsword opens up up the entire right hand side into a sort of meadow. It's a really fantastic use of negative space, which is defintely under utilized in a lot of scapes (... like mine.)
> 
> That's what I get for doubting Frank, jeez.


Really nice drawings/renderings! :thumbsup:
I see what you mean, the rock seems very small though in both those drawings.

edit: I don't know what kind of camera Frank is using but it seems to me it is just his Focal Length playing tricks on my eyes. 
In some photos the rock looks too large but it was probably just shot with a longer Focal length, in other shots the rock seems a lot smaller. 
I've found that to be a big challenge in photographing Iwagumi, you can really play to your tank's photogenic strengths by choosing the right focal length.


----------



## mluk27

Wow its truly incredible how fast riccia grows.. I had no idea lol


----------



## Dollface

Chlorophile said:


> Really nice drawings/renderings! :thumbsup:
> I see what you mean, the rock seems very small though in both those drawings.
> 
> edit: I don't know what kind of camera Frank is using but it seems to me it is just his Focal Length playing tricks on my eyes.
> In some photos the rock looks too large but it was probably just shot with a longer Focal length, in other shots the rock seems a lot smaller.
> I've found that to be a big challenge in photographing Iwagumi, you can really play to your tank's photogenic strengths by choosing the right focal length.


He's using a camera phone.


----------



## freph

Dollface said:


> He's using a camera phone.


iPhone 4S if I recall.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Yes iPhone 4S


----------



## SeattleFishGuy

Frank - Could we have a pic of your equipment/setup under the tank. I read through your post but didn't see any and it help me understand what you are doing better. 

I started my new tank about the same time you did and wish I could have started about a week later because I could have used some of your advice. That being said I'm hanging in there. My growth isn't as good as it could be but then again I don't have a pressurized CO2 system yet...I'm just using the Haggen Nutrafin Natural CO2 with mixed results.:frown:

BTW I love the look of your "First" setup at ADG...wow, that glass cabinet looked amazing! Talk about having nowhere to hide the mess! :drool:


----------



## Francis Xavier

Day 11:

I went ahead and used airline tubing to remove any left over dead matter from the microsword. 

Took the water level way down today:










Allowing the scape to breath in open air for a few minutes (5 or so) every now and again will help prevent algae, since the exposure will help kill any residual algae spores, usually useful for non-serious algae types and purely for preventative measures.










You will notice I switched the diffuser sides.

If you read the flow Charts I posted earlier you will understand the reasoning behind this (if you haven't read it, refer back to page 13 or so, it's somewhere around there).

Basically by manipulating where I put the diffuser in relation to flow I can optimize which plants grow quicker.

You will see me manipulating this variable often and it is why I always recommend against reactors. I want you to start looking at these variables and adopting this habit in your aquarium. Just follow along and watch how I do it and you'll pick it up.

So homework for you tonight is if you've had your diffuser in one spot for a long time, move it to the other side and watch what happens.

And a cool shot to end out the day:










Dosing: Green Brighty Step 1 & Brighty K 1 squirt. 
Green Bacter: 6 drops.


----------



## Francis Xavier

SeattleFishGuy said:


> Frank - Could we have a pic of your equipment/setup under the tank. I read through your post but didn't see any and it help me understand what you are doing better.
> 
> I started my new tank about the same time you did and wish I could have started about a week later because I could have used some of your advice. That being said I'm hanging in there. My growth isn't as good as it could be but then again I don't have a pressurized CO2 system yet...I'm just using the Haggen Nutrafin Natural CO2 with mixed results.:frown:
> 
> BTW I love the look of your "First" setup at ADG...wow, that glass cabinet looked amazing! Talk about having nowhere to hide the mess! :drool:


Here's an equipment shot for you under the cabinet, not a whole lot to see. The filter goes to the wall socket and the light and co2 solenoid (el-valve) are hooked into a timer behind the cabinet.


----------



## mahko

Frank, you've mentioned the 'chopstick method' when talking about lily pipes for aeration, would you mind explaining this for me? Perhaps I mis-read this while reading though the thread. 

Also, just wanted to say that I've been following your journal and have adopted a lot of your practices as my own and seeing great improvements in my tanks. Thanks!


----------



## Francis Xavier

mluk27 said:


> Wow its truly incredible how fast riccia grows.. I had no idea lol


This is Riccia's greatest strength and greatest weakness all at the same time!



Ptjameso said:


> Love the rendering Dollface! Still following this journal and really enjoying it. I don't have any ADA products...yet but I'm very happy to be reading a journal like this. It has put me in a different mindset. I thoroughly enjoyed doing maintenance on my 20L today with about 60% water change and some trimming/ removing unwanted or excessive plants. It surely helped a lot. Thanks again Frank for creating this journal for everyone!


It's great to see you take away great habits from this journal and applying them. The more you can enjoy the maintenance and the trimming ( sculpting) part of the process, the more you successful you will be.



mahko said:


> Frank, you've mentioned the 'chopstick method' when talking about lily pipes for aeration, would you mind explaining this for me? Perhaps I mis-read this while reading though the thread.
> 
> Also, just wanted to say that I've been following your journal and have adopted a lot of your practices as my own and seeing great improvements in my tanks. Thanks!


In the past I would lift the lily pipe up on a nano tank at night by using a chopstick placed / held at an angle to hold the lily pipe up. However, of late, I haven't done this since it hasn't been entirely necessary. 

You'll have to share some of the improvements you've seen by adapting the methodologies! It's great to see.


----------



## Francis Xavier

More Day 11:

Moving the diffuser (and likely, this combined with the fact that I rose the water level up a tad higher) resulted in some heavy pearling yesterday.










Full shot across, since it might be more difficult to see the full details, below are close ups of right and left side.










A beautiful Riccia bed!










The coloration of that Tennellus is going to tie this whole layout together rather dynamically.

It might just be my imagination, but the colors seemed to pop even more vividly yesterday. For me, this layout consistently surprises me as it gets brighter and brighter in color as the plants have made their transitions and are absorbing more nutrients.


----------



## freph

So by moving the diffuser to the other side you're shifting CO2 concentration to the right and back as opposed to the front and right? That first picture really pops. Can't wait to see that HC and hairgrass fill in well. Any stocking numbers/ideas for this tank?


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> So by moving the diffuser to the other side you're shifting CO2 concentration to the right and back as opposed to the front and right? That first picture really pops. Can't wait to see that HC and hairgrass fill in well. Any stocking numbers/ideas for this tank?


The "target" for Co2 with this positioning is to hit the left hand side, mostly left front. However, because of the small scale of the aquarium, and the way the eheim's flow distributes water against the panes of glass on the right, the right back gets pretty well hit as well.

The hairgrass will be fully grown very quickly.

It's hard to see it in pictures - but in person this aquarium almost "glows," green with a "sparkling" effect from the fresh growth + rampant pearling as light refracts through the pearls of oxygen.

I'm thinking about a dozen or so microrasbora of some kind. Undecided yet.


----------



## freph

Ahhh gotcha. I bet the pearling looks amazing! I can see bits of it here and there but you'd need a much better camera than the iPhone 4S to do it justice I'd imagine. What about algae crew? I'm trying to figure up numbers myself without crowding. :hihi:


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Ahhh gotcha. I bet the pearling looks amazing! I can see bits of it here and there but you'd need a much better camera than the iPhone 4S to do it justice I'd imagine. What about algae crew? I'm trying to figure up numbers myself without crowding. :hihi:


My formula is 5 Amano shrimp, 1-2 oto cats for Mini M.

60-P is 10 Amano shrimp, 4 oto cats.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

freph said:


> you'd need a much better camera than the iPhone 4S to do it justice I'd imagine.


The 4S actually is a pretty good camera. What lets it down the the inability of that tiny lens to gather enough light so to shoot properly you need huge amounts of light augmentation. Or you can get one of the add on gadget lenses, although I have not seen any shots with them yet. There are are actually several photo shoots on the internet showing how good the 4S is compared to a full on DSLR.


----------



## Francis Xavier

2wheelsx2 said:


> The 4S actually is a pretty good camera. What lets it down the the inability of that tiny lens to gather enough light so to shoot properly you need huge amounts of light augmentation. Or you can get one of the add on gadget lenses, although I have not seen any shots with them yet. There are are actually several photo shoots on the internet showing how good the 4S is compared to a full on DSLR.


Bonus points if you feed my laziness and provide me with links.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Francis Xavier said:


> Bonus points if you feed my laziness and provide me with links.


Sure thing. Here's one: http://vimeo.com/13081827

I forgot that it was with the 3GS, so the 4S should be even better.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just wanted to share with you an interesting article I just finished reading.

If you read it, make sure to read the whole thing. Learned a bit more about nitrifying bacteria. Always fun to expand knowledge in the subject.

http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/nitrogen-cycle


----------



## FlyingHellFish

2wheelsx2 said:


> Sure thing. Here's one: http://vimeo.com/13081827
> 
> I forgot that it was with the 3GS, so the 4S should be even better.


You can make any camera look good with the amount of equipment that guy has, the subject (models) are what makes the picture.... 

Speaking of models, anyone else get the impression that the rock in the middle is a supermodel turning around?


----------



## FlyingGiraffes

Fun journal to follow. Love the regular updates.



Francis Xavier said:


> Allowing the scape to breath in open air for a few minutes (5 or so) every now and again will help prevent algae, since the exposure will help kill any residual algae spores, usually useful for non-serious algae types and purely for preventative measures.


I'm not an expert, but I thought certain species of freshwater algae can spread by wind, thus air exposure can't kill them.


----------



## Chlorophile

FlyingGiraffes said:


> Fun journal to follow. Love the regular updates.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not an expert, but I thought certain species of freshwater algae can spread by wind, thus air exposure can't kill them.


You're right.

Open air does nothing to most algae. Not sure where frank got that idea.
In times of stress and drought + and - cells of algae undergo syngamy and form a zygospore, protecting it from drying out for at least a couple weeks, but I think in some cases years.
When the zygospore is moist again gamete form inside it and it breaks up, releasing more algae spores.

5 or so minutes isn't likely to even be long enough to force the cells to form a zygospore, except maybe on the glass.


----------



## GMYukonon24s

Nice tank.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> You can make any camera look good with the amount of equipment that guy has, the subject (models) are what makes the picture....
> 
> Speaking of models, anyone else get the impression that the rock in the middle is a supermodel turning around?


Well I do now!



FlyingGiraffes said:


> Fun journal to follow. Love the regular updates.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not an expert, but I thought certain species of freshwater algae can spread by wind, thus air exposure can't kill them.


It's not so much that letting the stones, etc get exposed to air kills all algae or is a precise algae remedy - because it's not. Perhaps I phrased it poorly.

It's more that little things like consistently draining the tank to a certain level and exposing objects to air helps to stymie the algae. There are two techniques that I noticed while maintaining the 60-P that affected the growth of algae. 

One of the stones had a completely flat top, directly underneath the metal halide bulb. This flat top to the stone was almost always algae free - as well as other parts of other stones that were at the same water level.

Meanwhile other parts of the stones would take on green algae and become 'aged,' in appearance. All the while this spot in the area of most intense light remained spotless.

What it was, was that that spot was just a little higher than where I would drain the water level too. So it would get anywhere between 5 to 15 minutes of air exposure every week. 

This was also the spot where new water was poured into the tank. 

So, consequently, as I continued maintenance of the aquarium (this being during a time where there were no Amano shrimp in the tank), and progressively lowered the water line and kept consistently lowering the water line to that level every week, the algae line would start receding to that point. 

Now, particularly volatile algae's, like BBA, of course this method has no effect. 

The other technique I found that helps to rid algae is the process of "fluffing," plants while the tank is being drained and while they are exposed to air. This helps to remove excess build up around the plants.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Day 12:

_Dosing: Green Brighty Step 1, Brighty K x1 squirt, Green Bacter x6 drops_

I wasn't going to do anything on Day 12, however I ended up getting a wild desire to go ahead and trim the Riccia back on the right.










For trimming Riccia, I used Pro Scissors Spring type to maintain an even cut across the Riccia. Like my hair grass video, the technique was to trim short and trim evenly. 

The only difference here is that rather than trim to the base like with hair grass, I'm trimming only about halfway down the total growth.

Many hobbyists like to take out the Riccia stones and trim them in another container to prevent the mess of the Riccia trim from getting everywhere.

However, I don't like the act of disturbing a layout by removing the Riccia stones, as my HC has already grown "into" the Riccia quite a bit. 

And frankly, I'm counting on Riccia to spread everywhere in this layout, I want it entertwined immensely with the HC, even the moss. So a few strands escaping my netting strategy is no problems for me. 










You can't notice it in the photo, but I tied more Riccia from the trim to a tiny stone and placed it in between the two support stones on the right. 

This is where the real fun of a planted aquarium begins: sculpting the layout via trimming.


----------



## zchauvin

Looking good Frank, I'm suprised riccia grows that fast. Hopefully in 2 weeks mine will be close the same.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Francis Xavier

Tore down the 60-P today:



















(last pictures of this tank up!)

So I have a lot of eleocharis acicularis for sale, completely clean and gorgeous growth:



















Must go asap for quality control. 

2"x2" squares = $12 shipped

Half of the whole mass = $55 shipped
The whole thing = $100 shipped


----------



## freph

If I had anywhere to put it, I'd definitely take you up on it since it's planned in my next tank along with some currently undecided foreground. Hopefully we can make some nice plans in the next email. Out of curiosity, why'd the 60P have to come down? Also, I saw the video where you added over 100 amanos to the 60p to combat some green algae. What's the normal name for this algae?


----------



## zchauvin

What!!! Why tear it down?!?!

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## SomeCanuck

Great looking tank and the journal's given me all sorts of ideas with how to handle my little tank if ever I need to start it over from scratch (i.e. if I can't fix my current mistakes).

Out of curiosity, how long would you expect the CO2 canister on the Advanced system to last? I'm trying to figure out whether I could get by with a smaller paintball setup or if a 5lb CO2 tank would be the better bet. I've got an 8 gallon tank with 7 hours of light per day from a 13 W compact fluorescent. (It's a Fluval Ebi and will eventually play home to shrimps once the plants grow in healthy enough to provide adequate cover. First tank since I was 10.:biggrin It's a little more underplanted than usual right now because I had to heavily trim down the dwarf hygrophila in the back because it had started to rot and lose all its leaves at the base of the stems.

Keep up the great work! Looking forward to see how your nano keeps evolving! And thanks for all the info so far!


----------



## zchauvin

Get a tower twenty and Ada speed regulator!!! Can't go wrong 

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## Francis Xavier

Really quickly:

Here's the water change on Day 13 (or is it 12? Someone count for me).










Pretty beat after we worked to tear down and re do the 60 P in the gallery.

Responses to your great commentary as energy level returns.


----------



## Francis Xavier

GMYukonon24s said:


> Nice tank.


Thank you for your kind words.



zchauvin said:


> Looking good Frank, I'm suprised riccia grows that fast. Hopefully in 2 weeks mine will be close the same.
> 
> Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


Riccia grows pretty quick. It takes about a week to 'stand up,' then from there it just goes and goes and goes.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> If I had anywhere to put it, I'd definitely take you up on it since it's planned in my next tank along with some currently undecided foreground. Hopefully we can make some nice plans in the next email. Out of curiosity, why'd the 60P have to come down? Also, I saw the video where you added over 100 amanos to the 60p to combat some green algae. What's the normal name for this algae?


The algae that came up from that event was the typical algae that Amano's eat, so an aquarium with them in it will rarely ever see it. The reason it even popped up to begin with is I had removed all the Amano's and O-cats from the aquarium and should have increased the Co2 levels in the aquarium since it was fully grown in.

The "Amano bomb," is my impatience with the process of them eating it away, so for about 2 days left them in there and then transferred them out to only keep about 10 Amano's in the tank. 



zchauvin said:


> What!!! Why tear it down?!?!
> 
> Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


New Project! Last night Jeff Senske and I redid the layout inside the 60-P. We took final video cuts of the layout, some final pics, then tore her down.

She had been going strong for about a year, and even survived the Houston drought (which caused severe issues with water quality and lead to the use of nothing but RODI water for Planted Tanks...I'll leave nothing to those conditions of tap again).

We'll show the setup process again, but in this case, you'll have to wait for the play-by-play.



SomeCanuck said:


> Great looking tank and the journal's given me all sorts of ideas with how to handle my little tank if ever I need to start it over from scratch (i.e. if I can't fix my current mistakes).
> 
> Out of curiosity, how long would you expect the CO2 canister on the Advanced system to last? I'm trying to figure out whether I could get by with a smaller paintball setup or if a 5lb CO2 tank would be the better bet. I've got an 8 gallon tank with 7 hours of light per day from a 13 W compact fluorescent. (It's a Fluval Ebi and will eventually play home to shrimps once the plants grow in healthy enough to provide adequate cover. First tank since I was 10.:biggrin It's a little more underplanted than usual right now because I had to heavily trim down the dwarf hygrophila in the back because it had started to rot and lose all its leaves at the base of the stems.
> 
> Keep up the great work! Looking forward to see how your nano keeps evolving! And thanks for all the info so far!


I'm glad you're finding the information valuable!

The Co2 system cartridges on the System 74/YA-2 will last about a 4-5 weeks on an 8 gallon aquarium at 2-3 bps.


----------



## houseofcards

Frank, little off topic, but I think relevant since this thread is in the nano section. There was a discussion in another thread about Nanos vs Large tanks. Unfortunately it was closed, when it got too personal, but it got me thinking. I agree that a nano can be more impressive than a larger tank if done right and I'm sure this tank will fit that description, but I starting thanking about the IAPLC contest. There are very few nanos that rank very high. Almost all of the highest ranking tanks year after year are 3-5 footers. You pretty much never see a Mini S/M rank way up there? What are you thoughts on this? Is there a difference between a tank being impressive and possible limitations to depth, scale, etc come with a small tank? Is probably shouldn't matter since the execution and artistic impression should be king. If you don't want to discuss it here, I can move the post.


----------



## Francis Xavier

houseofcards said:


> Frank, little off topic, but I think relevant since this thread is in the nano section. There was a discussion in another thread about Nanos vs Large tanks. Unfortunately it was closed, when it got too personal, but it got me thinking. I agree that a nano can be more impressive than a larger tank if done right and I'm sure this tank will fit that description, but I starting thanking about the IAPLC contest. There are very few nanos that rank very high. Almost all of the highest ranking tanks year after year are 3-5 footers. You pretty much never see a Mini S/M rank way up there? What are you thoughts on this? Is there a difference between a tank being impressive and possible limitations to depth, scale, etc come with a small tank? Is probably shouldn't matter since the execution and artistic impression should be king. If you don't want to discuss it here, I can move the post.



Here's the thing: Regardless, at the end of the day size is a function of personal preference. If you like bigger tanks, make a bigger one. If you like a mix, get two, if you like nano's, do nano's. 

Size is also a function of practical limitation: if you live in a small apartment like I do, a 6 foot tank just isn't practical. It's also a function of what you can afford: can you afford the $700-800 for a full ADA nano set, or the $14,000 for a full ADA 180-P setup? 

The biggest *misunderstanding* about size is this: bigger is better.

An aquarium is just a glass box.

If you have an 8 foot aquarium, it is *not* *automatically* better than a 1 foot aquarium. Having 8 feet of glass does not by itself make your tank cooler. 

*Individual skill, layout ability, quality tools (the right tool for the right job) and follow-through is the only thing that makes one aquarium better than the other.

*If you have a bare 6 foot tank with an asian arowana in it, I am never going to compliment you on how cool your tank is. Because it's not cool. Frankly the tank sucks. The Arowana? Now the Arowana might be awesomely great, and I would, in fact, compliment you on your Arowana.

*Before I get into the IAPLC question, I'm going to explain something that might be a bit controversial. 

*If you take this as a negative, you're completely missing the point:

Let me state again, you need to read this very carefully. Every word. Beginning to end. If you are insulted I'm not going to respond to or support you, so don't bother, because you'll never learn and you'll never get out of your box without a mindset change.

Let's be honest with ourselves. Many of the layouts here are on a novice level. Even if you've been doing the hobby for 10 years, it doesn't mean that you aren't a novice. 

When I was an avid video gamer, we had a saying "Noobishness is not a function of time. If you have to ask "so when will I not be a noob," or "why am I a noob," you are going to be a noob for quite a while yet."

We tend to take on a negative connotation of the word "novice." The word feels "icky," doesn't jive with our self perceptions in many cases, and we come up with a litany of excuses to defend ourselves of not being a novice, sometimes we even come up with the most random obscure defenses to attack being called a "novice." Sadly, that's the exact behavior of a novice, and only a novice. Someone who has truly gone on to expert levels and beyond to master, isn't afraid of admitting to not completely knowing everything - they aren't afraid to learn.

So, just because you're a novice, doesn't mean that your layout or plant growing abilities are just completely trash and suck completely. And even if they do horribly "suck," it just means that you're learning. You can, again, reference my first post in this thread to see what I'm talking about.

I would rather associate with someone who has a single sprig of HC, a plug of Lucky Bamboo and a plastic plant in their tank *and has the enthusiasm to learn, admit to themselves fault and shows steady improvement* (in fact, such a person I would spend as much time as I could with and be happy doing it), over the person who has a half-grown carpet of something, some stems in the back that they farm, and thinks they are just awesome at planted tanks.

The only difference is mindset: one is closed minded, the other is not. 

I will bend over backwards for the person who is open to learning. I will not waste a second with the person who bickers more than they learn.

*I want to look at TPT and be utterly inspired by other people's works. I get immense enjoyment when someone else produces something awesome.*

Unfortunately, being completely honest here, that is really rare. That makes me sad. 

Do we encourage each other? Of course, positive reinforcement is great.

This doesn't mean that we attack someone who isn't a master on day one. Or even day 1000. I wasn't a master on day 1. I'm not a master today. I'm a student of _the only Planted Aquarium master._ 

*We get in the way of ourselves*

Inevitably as we learn the planted tank, at some point we have to believe that it is inherently difficult, and just growing the plant out itself is mastering it. 

We grow our first carpet of HC out, hair grass, whatever. And while these are certainly milestones to be proud of, the frank nature of it all is:

It's not nearly as hard we think it is. We're the only ones that complicate things.

Growing plants is easy. Growing plants is only about getting the right basic equipment and waiting. You don't even really need a good fertilizer regime or good habits to simply _grow a plant._

To sculpt the plants with the hardscape, and get them to pop vividly and pretty much algae free? Now that's a different beast.

And that's only mastery of three things:

1. Water Change & basic water chemistry
2. Immediate and Ruthless response to anything that threatens the tank's balance (e.g. algae)
3. Techniques (trimming, dosing, planting, etc)

Guess what? The water change part is really, really easy to master. Drain the tank, fill it back up. If you can't do one water change a week, consider another hobby. 

The chemistry bit is a little more complex: but just start with RODI and basically add seachem equilibrium or penac w to raise hardness to about 2-3 kH and you're golden. Don't rely on tap water and the water municipalities for your art.

2. Immediate and ruthless response is also easy. It means when you see an issue, you immediately address it. You don't wait til tomorrow, you don't wait til next week. You do it now.

The only learning part is the proper responses to the different type of algaes.

So issues #1 and #2 are 80% about laziness or the lack there of.

#3 - techniques. This is the part that just takes time, experience and duplication of what other successful people do.


So, in the end, to really start learning to master the tank you first:

*admit to yourself that your layout is probably between "not so great" and "okay."

Admit to yourself that this is "okay," and has nothing to do with me as a person.

Embrace that to get better, you need to open yourself up to learning the proven techniques, and that it's not hard for you to step up and start mastering the planted tank and have a layout that you -really- love and isn't just "well, okay, the best I can do so it's fine!"

Reinforce: I'm learning. I can do this. There's no significant difference between me and the experts other than time, technique and habit.

Start mastering. Take it in baby-steps. One plant at a time if you have to. 

You will get there. You will create an awesomely-insanely-badass-aquascape, and when you do you won't have to delude yourself into excuses.


*So start crankin those scapes and flood the forums with awesome journals so I can be inspired.


----------



## Francis Xavier

In other news, yesterday's daily FTS:


----------



## houseofcards

Great post Frank. Anyone that aspires to take their planted tanks to another level should read it, probably twice. 

Have you given any further thought to IAPLC and nanos?


----------



## frrok

I will read every word of this thread religiously.


----------



## Francis Xavier

houseofcards said:


> Great post Frank. Anyone that aspires to take their planted tanks to another level should read it, probably twice.
> 
> Have you given any further thought to IAPLC and nanos?


Here's the thing about IAPLC. 

For competition, there is an aspect of scale that's important. Typically either exactly 3 feet or exactly 4 feet is ideal. This in no way prevents tanks of other sizes from competing and placing well, but these are the tank sizes of the winners.

Typically either:

36"x18"x18" (90-P) or 48"x18"x24" (120-H) will have an advantage due to the proportions of the tank being easy to manipulate focal points. The only other larger tank that ideally represents this ratio commercially available would be 6'x2'x2' (180-P)

The other "ideal" proportion tank is 24"x12"x14" (60-P) as it falls in the same category. The Mini M (which is like 12"x8"x10" or there abouts) also falls into this proportion window representing the nano's.

In a competition like the IAPLC, you are competing with other *world class* aquascapers. This means that the more detail oriented you are, the more precise you are and the more formulaic you are the better you will do. Consequently the more you use the proper tank, the greater your chance by nature of design of the canvas you're using. 

Nano's teach you how to be -extremely- detail oriented and are the best tool to be as precise as possible since in order to be successful you need to really be on top of things. Translate this into a larger tank size and you have a winning formula.

The topic of competition aquascaping is a bit of an advanced topic, and has primarily to do with execution of:

1. Technique & Habits
2. Proper plant placement and growth (experience)
3. Proper Tools (tank proportions, not sheer size, etc)
4. Trends

You can't really guess what the big trend will be, so it's best to try to be innovative _within the constrains_ of good design, classic aquascaping basic rules, etc. 

Too creative and you'll lose.
Too standard and you'll lose.
Too overgrown you'll lose.
Too undergrown you'll lose.
Too....you see the pattern?

For example, Oliver Knotts' "Avatar" scape, while certainly playful and 'creative,' would never rank highly in the IAPLC. 

You want to be "in the box" while simultaneously out of the box.

Following rules does not equate to being in the box. Practicing good technique does not equate to being in the box.

Truly thinking differently is much more subtle. Different isn't inherently better. Different is only better when the default is terribly bad anyway. 

Then at the end of the day you have the whims of the judges to contend with. Could be that day they look at your scape they had rotten eggs and were in a bad mood. Could be that day they looked at your scape they had an adrenaline rush of some kind and yours stuck with them. Could also be that they just like your style and don't like other styles. 

Also, the top 100 are the only ones actually judged by the judges. The entries are presorted by non-judges, who select the top 100, then the judges review the top 100 for placement. Everything after 100 is more or less placed at random according to some basic rules.


----------



## Jeff5614

Frank, excellent thread you've got going. Most of the things discussed are applicable not only to nano's but larger tanks as well. You had mentioned in another thread a while back not needing mechanical media and just going with bio in the filter and then it came up again in this thread so I decided to give it a shot. It works great. The water is still clear and I even have more flow from the canister now that the floss is gone.


----------



## Francis Xavier

We're now officially at day 14. Two weeks since initial planting.

Algae is popping up - but relatively easy to eradicate ones. Some diatoms, a little green algae types: all stuff that gets devoured by shrimp.

Dosing is x1 squirt Brighty K and Green brighty step 1

No water change today: but one will be tomorrow.

A few photos from different angles:










My typical perspective










Angle shots make things look cool.



Classic full shot.


----------



## freph

Is that surface film I spy or just lighting doing weird tricks on the water surface? Also, what are those white blotches in the front in the soil? I like how you can see the HC growing outwards along the substrate...always a good thing to see. Looking forward to a Mini M of my own hopefully in the near future.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Is that surface film I spy or just lighting doing weird tricks on the water surface? Also, what are those white blotches in the front in the soil? I like how you can see the HC growing outwards along the substrate...always a good thing to see. Looking forward to a Mini M of my own hopefully in the near future.


Yes, that is surface film you see. It'll start to level out and appear less and less as the growing matures. Once water changes are at the three day stage ( starting after tomorrow's water change ), I'll end up stirring it up a bit more in between changes.

The white spots is where I was stupid in dosing Penac W - over time it will dissolve completely, but sometimes when you don't dose it appropriately it will catch itself lower in the substrate. Not a problem for anything, just a technique in dosing it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Freph,

You made me not be lazy and remove the surface film.

Putting a paper towel over it and then removing it from te aquarium quickly almost instantly removes the film. Takes about 5 seconds.

Alternatively, drain the water at night to the lily pipe out put level and fill before lights come on.

Good call on a habit.


----------



## freph

Bahaha. I hate surface film myself so I can't let a nice tank like this have that take away from it.  Paper towels are little magic tricks for that stuff.


----------



## bluestems

subscribed, thanks for the post.


----------



## Francis Xavier

bluestems said:


> subscribed, thanks for the post.


Great blue.

I'll see what I can do for you for stones and other ADA you were looking for after looking at your thread and your desire for an excellent layout.


----------



## mahko

Maybe I missed it, but have you added shrimp yet? Or are you planning on adding some? 

I cycled my tank with some seeded filter media and my ammonia/nitrite levels are zero as of yesterday. I added some amano shrimp and oto's and they are doing fine. Tested the water again and levels are the same. Was that too soon, or should I pull them and wait another week?


----------



## zchauvin

No he didn't and your fine... If ammonia and nitrite zero then why worry. 

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


----------



## mahko

I wasn't too worried, seeing how the water conditions were good. Looking back at the ADG/ADA how to videos on youtube, shrimp and otos were added after the first week. Seems to be going a slightly different direction than that. Just curious.


----------



## icepotato89

the nice ADA maintenance stand on a cardboard box made me lol. we need ADA stuff in australia...


----------



## Francis Xavier

mahko said:


> Maybe I missed it, but have you added shrimp yet? Or are you planning on adding some?
> 
> I cycled my tank with some seeded filter media and my ammonia/nitrite levels are zero as of yesterday. I added some amano shrimp and oto's and they are doing fine. Tested the water again and levels are the same. Was that too soon, or should I pull them and wait another week?


I will add shrimp sooner or later. Probably by the end of the third week. The reason being is this tank hasn't gotten fully cycled. In many tanks, using a substrate like Aqua Soil, it's best to seed with some old media from another tank of similar parameters. However I wanted to start "fresh," on this one. Partly to show the process, partly to improve my own skills in handling issues as they occur.



mahko said:


> I wasn't too worried, seeing how the water conditions were good. Looking back at the ADG/ADA how to videos on youtube, shrimp and otos were added after the first week. Seems to be going a slightly different direction than that. Just curious.


That aquarium also had tap water used in it: which in Houston is quite high (8.1 or there abouts). Nitrifying bacteria tend to grow quicker in harder water vs. softer water, where their metabolism slows (I just learned that a few days ago, and linked to the article a few pages back). I'm using pure RODI here as I refuse to use tap for a planted tank again.




icepotato89 said:


> the nice ADA maintenance stand on a cardboard box made me lol. we need ADA stuff in australia...


I could slap an ADA sticker on it for ya'


----------



## Francis Xavier

Quiz for today:

Can you spot everything that was done, why it was done and what my dosing is?


----------



## freph

Looks to be some kind of bacterial bloom. I assume you did a water change...possibly accidentally disturbed substrate? Not sure. Hairgrass trimmed to open up the left side a bit and keep it in line with the swords. Dosing....I'll have to read some more about the liquid additive I assume.


----------



## Francis Xavier

You're on a decent track - but no bacteria bloom, I did that to the water intenionally.


----------



## freph

Hm....not sure what I can think of that causes cloudiness outside of bacterial bloom/substrate disturbance aside from GH booster...any hints? Also, is that some type of algae on that piece of riccia in the front or is it just a weird blending of lighting?

Also, you moved the intake/outflow and the diffuser.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Hey, your tank is looking mighty good! Wish my HC was like that. 

My first attempt at a carpet, things started off good. Then by the third/fourth week. 

This is when I planted, March 10 - 12th










This is it now. March 31st 










Problem: Small leaf growth, Brown, Burned Edges, Yellow, Lack of colour, Poor growth structure.

Advice taken: I added more K, trimmed most of the yellow / brown, up Co2 just a bit. 

Stats: 30 ppm Light green PH drop checker, EI dosing, 23 watt 6500 K on a 6 gallon, with 42 LED light bar (Coverage is mainly the middle)

Any help will be appreciated.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Bump up the amount of iron you add into the aquarium. Incrementally increase K, but do it a step at a time: at this juncture add more iron.

Is it old growth primarily yellow and brown?


----------



## FlyingHellFish

^ Hard to tell, I believe new and old are affected.

The leaf size are really small, I believe I might have too much light raining down on them.

Tank is a 6 gallon with a desktop lamp position 2 - 3 inches above the surface. Nitrate is about 5 - 10 ppm, I try not to let it go pass 15 ppm because I have some shrimp. 

How much K and iron daily do I dose? I been doing 1/32 tsp of K daily, Seachem iron at 1 ml daily. 

Maybe it's too much ferts and lights?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Small leaves isn't a bad thing - many people strive for that.

The symptoms you describe are always a sign of nutrient deficiency, rather than too much.

The trick is you want to incrementally increase dosing so that you give the plants what they need and don't dose too much to get an algae outbreak.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

EDIT: I been seriously under dosing, I'll try out your suggestion.


----------



## shrimpster

Francis Xavier said:


> Quiz for today:
> 
> Can you spot everything that was done, why it was done and what my dosing is?


hmmm, let's see.

Intake is now at front left, outflow back left and diffuser is at back right. I'm gonna say h20 cloudiness is due to dosing some gh booster.


----------



## KH2PO4

Francis Xavier said:


> Quiz for today:
> 
> Can you spot everything that was done, why it was done and what my dosing is?


Bacter 100 into water?


----------



## talontsiawd

Frank,
I absolutely love your threads. I will not go very far into this but I am a bit skeptical on all the additives as well. I don't want to say there is no benefit, I am not sure, but I know you don't need to use anything but a good substrate to get good results.

Now the _only_ reason I bring this up is I feel you are seriously downplaying your commitment to maintenance and your routine. I mean this in a good way. Obviously, you are showing this in the thread, but it kind of gets diluted by all the other great info and explanations of your (and other people's) philosophies.

I bring this up because my first tanks, though lacking in many area's from a cost/technology perspective, look better than my tanks now. I attribute 100% of this due to my maintenance habits. I was in college when I started and always had more than enough time to do what was needed that day. Now I am a musician with serious lack of time, I often don't see my tank for up to a week at a time, or I am home all the time, one or the other. I can either go overboard on things or not touch things, not a good combo. 

Not to say I have not been successful with some low tech tanks, when you set something up correctly to your needs, it's a lot easier. But it's going to be almost impossible if not entirely impossible to have an impeccable tank without being able to rectify problems as they come about, no matter what you do. I have even seen my tank turn around in a week when I am home and spend 5-10 min per day (max) when I am home for each of those days. 



Again, I only bring this up because I know how much daily maintenance helps, compared to any other factor. I will go as far to say that diligence trumps knowledge (assuming you are trying to learn from mistakes). It has for me. Great thread and I only mean for these words to be taken complimentary


----------



## Dollface

Actually, I think daily diligence is the main point that Frank is trying to reinforce with this thread. He doesn't really rely so much on the additives as a magic fix-it-all, they're just another tool in his maintenance and dosing regimen. Most of his advice, e.g. consistent water changes, dosing, and filter clearning, dealing with algae sooner rather than later, taking note of the tanks needs and responding to that, isn't about magic ADA hickory smoke bacteria food, it's about just paying attention to your tank _and enjoying it_.


----------



## talontsiawd

Dollface said:


> Actually, I think daily diligence is the main point that Frank is trying to reinforce with this thread. He doesn't really rely so much on the additives as a magic fix-it-all, they're just another tool in his maintenance and dosing regimen. Most of his advice, e.g. consistent water changes, dosing, and filter clearning, dealing with algae sooner rather than later, taking note of the tanks needs and responding to that, isn't about magic ADA hickory smoke bacteria food, it's about just paying attention to your tank _and enjoying it_.


Oh, I agree and that's why I made a point of saying how much he shows it. It just can get a bit diluted, as I said, with all the other info. I was not trying to imply that I felt Frank thought his additives were more important than other aspects of the tank (and I have read enough from Frank to know he sees no shortcuts). I also want to restate that I only meant what I was saying in the most complimentary of ways. I am seriously jealous of his ability to put in so much time into his tanks. 

If I had time to get my hands wet even 2x as often, I know for a fact that my only high tech tank would be 4x better (or more). I realize that and now do more low tech tanks but I still haven't made my high tech stable enough for my lifestyle.


----------



## Francis Xavier

In Regards to Lessons of the Planted Aquaria
*
Really, what it comes down to is that the majority have learned how to do things incorrectly from the start.

*Most people focus on equipment. Equipment is intricately tied into the success of the planted tank. At the end of the day we need proper filtration, an aquarium, substrates and fertilizers. So, it's no wonder that people focus on that first. 

The most common questions are: what filtration, what lighting, what co2 and so on.

If you are new, you've asked these questions recently. If you aren't, you've long since established your bias' one way or another. But the thing of it all is:

_Everyone is focused on the 'what,' instead of the 'how.' People also haven't evaluated the 'who,' is using what techniques and which tools. _

When our hobby is so _incredibly linked_ to the 'what,' it is easy to see how a person focuses almost exclusively on 'what.' Frankly, you aren't drawing on a piece of paper where skill is immediately evident as the primary need. You can have the best pen in the world that does exactly as it says it does in the advertising, but if you can't draw, well, you can't draw, and it isn't the pen's fault.

The other issue with this focus on the 'what,' is that without really knowing any better, you aren't able to judge the difference between the 'what's.'

If your trimming techniques are improper and poorly managed or only done every few months, then there's no way for you to know what to look for in a pair of scissors, or when to use what type of scissor or how. 

For example, I'm not a good golfer. I don't know golf techniques and I don't know the mechanics of each club. I know I need to get a ball into a hole on the other side of a really long grassy-knoll thing. I know that I use a driver to get it most of the way, and a putter to get it the rest of the way.

But I have no idea what each iron does, why it's used when to use it or anything. I'm just aimlessly hitting golf balls towards a target and 'hoping,' that I pick the right club. 

Would you say that I'm in a position to give advice on what club to use and when? _If you answer yes, please consider a psych evaluation.
_
I don't even know -how- to tell the difference between one or another. 

_*Unfortunately, this focus on 'what,' leads to an inexperienced user base, providing feedback on equipment they haven't used, while using techniques that are easily among the worst ways to do something. Skepticism based or spread based on these parameters is nothing more than an uninformed opinion of the worst kind.

*_You wouldn't want to take advice from that person any more than you'd want to take my advice on what club to pick when you go golfing. 

We like to say that there's many ways to skin the cat, that each special snow-flake is unique. And that somehow, when I'm new, and take the advice of someone who has kind-of-sort-of made something work mildly okay that I'm going to magically get a different result. _They have a word for that: it's called insanity.

_Let me use another example here on the predictability of technique _and_ tools. *Dollface *started her aquarium following the same water change technique, the same quality of water (RODI), the same fertilization method, the same tools and the same substrate system.

What's the result? She's gotten exactly the same _kinds_ of minor algae, the same _growth rates relative to the amount she planted_, and the same water clarity. *Really, the only mistake she's made* is not planting -enough- from the start. She could have started with double the plant mass and had much quicker growth. But we do know that the HC will start kickin' this week and start spreading.

What can be learned from that? All she has to do at this point is follow step-by-step with my journal and will know more or less what's going to come her way and how to deal with it.

_That's powerful._
Similarly, if you do the same techniques as someone else, you are going to get their same result. So why on earth would you want to do the same methodology of relatively bland layouts and plant growth? Your result won't be any different!

*There really aren't multiple ways to skin a cat here. *

Every technique and method system is all based on the same overall way to grow and curate plants. They just do the job to varying levels of efficiency and effectiveness.

If you use eco-complete, you are essentially doing the same function as aqua soil, but the path you take is going to be infinitely more troublesome to get the same result. You could start with literal dirt in your tank: it will do the same function, but not as well and you'll introduce all sorts of weird stuff from the yard.

I'll continue this line of thought later, for now that should be enough food for thought. I would just say to reserve judgement until I post up the whole line of thought.


----------



## Ach1Ll3sH33L

Francis Xavier said:


> If you use eco-complete, you are essentially doing the same function as aqua soil, but the path you take is going to be infinitely more troublesome to get the same result.




Could you elaborate a bit more on this, i assume this is due to the fact that eco-complete is basically inert gravel? Reason i ask this, is i have a high tech tank set up with eco-complete, and the growth seems to be a bit sporadic to say the least. dosing e.i with weekly water changes for quite sometime and havnt been very satisfied with the results.

Also, and maybe i missed it, i would be interested on your techniques for setting a lighting schedule, and things you take into consideration when doing this. I have noticed in my own setups, that when i first plant a high light/c02 tank, i seem to get better results, meaning less algae, and more stability, with a shortened lighting period until the plants get rooted and begin to fill in, before increasing the lighting time, i assume this goes hand in hand with what you were previously saying, that plants don't take in as many nutrients until they are more established in the tank.

great thread btw!


----------



## @[email protected]

Ach1Ll3sH33L said:


> Could you elaborate a bit more on this, i assume this is due to the fact that eco-complete is basically inert gravel? Reason i ask this, is i have a high tech tank set up with eco-complete, and the growth seems to be a bit sporadic to say the least. dosing e.i with weekly water changes for quite sometime and havnt been very satisfied with the results.
> 
> Also, and maybe i missed it, i would be interested on your techniques for setting a lighting schedule, and things you take into consideration when doing this. I have noticed in my own setups, that when i first plant a high light/c02 tank, i seem to get better results, meaning less algae, and more stability, with a shortened lighting period until the plants get rooted and begin to fill in, before increasing the lighting time, i assume this goes hand in hand with what you were previously saying, that plants don't take in as many nutrients until they are more established in the tank.
> 
> great thread btw!


my 2 cents:
try root tabs. if your are doing EI water column dosing, then you have no nutrient problems in the water column. but you may see better growth (particularly from well rooted plants) if you use root tabs. i like root medic, but there are others (i have used flourish root tabs as well, and they arent bad). 
i assume you have pressurized CO2?


----------



## FlyingHellFish

@[email protected] said:


> my 2 cents:
> try root tabs. if your are doing EI water column dosing, then you have no nutrient problems in the water column. but you may see better growth (particularly from well rooted plants) if you use root tabs. i like root medic, but there are others (i have used flourish root tabs as well, and they arent bad).
> i assume you have pressurized CO2?


Dumb question but, if you got a high CEC like flourite black, can't you just inject the diluted fertilizer into the substrate?


----------



## @[email protected]

FlyingHellFish said:


> Dumb question but, if you got a high CEC like flourite black, can't you just inject the diluted fertilizer into the substrate?


sure. and then a little more 2" over, and then a little more 2" over...
and do that every day, one day macro, one day micro. just like with water column dosing.
or just use slow-releasing root tabs. :icon_mrgr


----------



## FlyingHellFish

@[email protected] said:


> sure. and then a little more 2" over, and then a little more 2" over...
> and do that every day, one day macro, one day micro. just like with water column dosing.
> or just use slow-releasing root tabs. :icon_mrgr


 You have poked my feelings with a knife good sir.


----------



## JeffyFunk

I'm going to go on a limb here, but I think the point that Frank is trying to make is that the best way to set up a planted aquarium is by promoting the entire ecological system that emphasizes the establishment and use of microorganisms. 

All of the ADA products that he uses are mainly for trying to get the microorganisms established in order to help (1) filter the water, (2) establish plant growth and (3) fight algae. 

In his previous post, Frank commented that people are too caught up with the "what" to buy and not "why" you should buy it. In a nutshell, he's saying that you should buy or use items (and techniques) that will help to establish the microorganisms in the aquarium. Is it possible to set up an aquarium without the use of the specific (ADA) items he suggests / uses? Yes... but if you do so, then the chances of having the wrong microorganisms or algae establish themselves is greater, leading to more problems than you want. 

As an example, he mentions eco-complete; you can certainly grow plants in it (nobody is disputing that fact), but eco-complete is not as ideal a substrate for the promotion and development of microorganisms (in comparison to Aqua soil... or Aqua soil + Power sand... or esp. Aqua soil + Power Sand + other additives). 

To me the root of the problem in this "discussion" is that most people haven't used or evaluated the entire ADA line. Why would that be important? Because this entire thread is supposed to be an avenue as to the *BEST* way to grow aquatic plants, not whatever method works. As Frank has said before - there are lots of ways to set up a planted aquarium and be successful with it. However, has everyone who has commented here set up an aquarium using the ADA method and products versus using another method and products? I highly doubt it. There's a big difference between saying "this method works" and "this (other) method is the best", esp. when you haven't even used the (other) method. 

Here's an analogy of how *I* think of the ADA method versus the other methods (let's use EI dosing as an example). The ADA Method is the equivalent of Organic Lawn Care and EI dosing is the equivalent of Conventional Lawn Care. Both methods will give you a nice green lawn, but the Organic Lawn Care system is a better method. (If you don't understand this analogy, I would highly suggest reading the book "Teaming with Microbes" by Jeff Lowenfels and Wayne Lewis - It will change the way you view organic techniques and conventional fertilizers and methods...)


----------



## houseofcards

JeffyFunk said:


> ...
> Here's an analogy of how *I* think of the ADA method versus the other methods (let's use EI dosing as an example). The ADA Method is the equivalent of Organic Lawn Care and EI dosing is the equivalent of Conventional Lawn Care. Both methods will give you a nice green lawn, but the Organic Lawn Care system is a better method. (If you don't understand this analogy, I would highly suggest reading the book "Teaming with Microbes" by Jeff Lowenfels and Wayne Lewis - It will change the way you view organic techniques and conventional fertilizers and methods...)


Personally I think this is a poor analogy. ADA is a complete method and EI is pretty much dosing. There is more to lawn care then just feeding the lawn.


----------



## @[email protected]

FlyingHellFish said:


> You have poked my feelings with a knife good sir.


i hope it was only a slight prick, rather than a brutal stab and twist. 
i was simply illustrating why root tabs are the better option...and having a little bit of fun.



JeffyFunk said:


> I'm going to go on a limb here, but I think the point that Frank is trying to make is that the best way to set up a planted aquarium is by promoting the entire ecological system that emphasizes the establishment and use of microorganisms.
> 
> All of the ADA products that he uses are mainly for trying to get the microorganisms established in order to help (1) filter the water, (2) establish plant growth and (3) fight algae.


i absolutely agree that ADA tries to promote bacterial growth, and that that is the way to go. and let me also say i love ADA quality, and am particularly fond of their tanks, AS, and glassware.
however, i am skeptical that all of the additives are really necessary. if you have a good substrate, such as AS or topsoil (mineralized or otherwise), and plants in that substrate, you have a complete niche for mutualistic microbes. the plants also provide an innoculation, and boom, you get healthy bacterial colonies. ADA products may speed up the process, which is great, but they are pricey, and once you have colonized the tank, it makes little difference.



JeffyFunk said:


> To me the root of the problem in this "discussion" is that most people haven't used or evaluated the entire ADA line. Why would that be important? Because this entire thread is supposed to be an avenue as to the *BEST* way to grow aquatic plants, not whatever method works. As Frank has said before - there are lots of ways to set up a planted aquarium and be successful with it. However, has everyone who has commented here set up an aquarium using the ADA method and products versus using another method and products? I highly doubt it. There's a big difference between saying "this method works" and "this (other) method is the best", esp. when you haven't even used the (other) method.


that is why i am carefully reading the thread and evaluating franks results to see how big of a difference the additives make, and then be able to pit that against their cost to determine if they are worth it *to me *(other people will likely have varying conclusions on the cost-benefit).



JeffyFunk said:


> Here's an analogy of how *I* think of the ADA method versus the other methods (let's use EI dosing as an example). The ADA Method is the equivalent of Organic Lawn Care and EI dosing is the equivalent of Conventional Lawn Care. Both methods will give you a nice green lawn, but the Organic Lawn Care system is a better method. (If you don't understand this analogy, I would highly suggest reading the book "Teaming with Microbes" by Jeff Lowenfels and Wayne Lewis - It will change the way you view organic techniques and conventional fertilizers and methods...)


you have fallen into the pit you mentioned earlier. EI is a system of dosing, and just dosing. something ADA necessitates as well. if you are referring to all the things Tom Barr does, and lumping them all as EI, then your analogy is very wrong. Barr often tells people how the bacterial colonies are the most important thing in the tank, and how they need to maintain their filter and substrate. in many posts he appears frustrated by how people focus entirely on the fertz dosing, and a bit on light:CO2, and not at all on the bacteria.


----------



## KH2PO4

I have not seen Tom put much interest on bacteria.

Well, I would like to read more from Frank than debating about this.


----------



## freph

KH2PO4 said:


> I have not seen Tom put much interest on bacteria.
> 
> Well, I would like to read more from Frank than debating about this.


He also focuses on good oxygenation and maintenance habits as well as watching your tank and adjusting different levels as needed. The most successful planted tank keepers (and tank keepers in general) are simply the ones that adapt to what is occurring in their tanks and do the required maintenance work. I think that's what Tom/Frank are getting at on a basic level but I could be wrong.


----------



## KH2PO4

No, the more O2 is just because to be able to inject more CO2.
Tom has never been focusing on bacteria. He focuses more on plants.
He has kept saying plants look nicer than bacteria for years. 

Nicer than bacteria
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1422063
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/g...iscussion/19945-why-add-no3-po4-when-you.html
http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/month.200401/msg00622.html
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1422063

Better than bacteria
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-22815.html
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f24/iron-test-kit-84157-4.html

Hey, I'm not saying if his (Tom) opinion is right or wrong. But he's never paid 
MUCH attention to bacteria, just a little.


----------



## Dollface

JeffyFunk said:


> *I'm going to go on a limb here, but I think the point that Frank is trying to make is that the best way to set up a planted aquarium is by promoting the entire ecological system that emphasizes the establishment and use of microorganisms. *
> 
> All of the ADA products that he uses are mainly for trying to get the microorganisms established in order to help (1) filter the water, (2) establish plant growth and (3) fight algae.


Quoting because I think you hit the nail right on the head, and it needs to be reinforced.


----------



## Francis Xavier

To Continue on the Planted Aquaria discussion from my last post...

*Last time, I discussed how everyone is focused on equipment versus the "why," and forming technique. This is a continuation of that line of thought.

*We left off with talking about different *pathways* to results more or less being the *same way of doing things, but to different results.*

Specifically the eco-complete example: ultimately, you buy eco-complete to perform the same duties of Aqua Soil. However, to get eco-complete to perform to the same level of effectiveness as aqua soil, you would need to use probably about four fistfuls of root tab fertilizers. Even then, there are other issues: such as softness of soil particles to allow roots to spread quicker and better.

Let's go with another example: the so-called "Natural Planted Tank" method. Here there's absolutely no special reason to try here. You're literally just better off going with even the lowest-quality of planted substrates and rigging something together to make it work than shooting for the 'purist,' method of Natural Planted Tank. All I really need to cite here is, have you ever seen a beautiful NPT layout (don't confuse 'low tech,' with the 'pure' NPT)? If you have, then I would submit that you are either blind, geeking out on the process and not the result (which is fine to geek on the process), or you've found the tank that's touched by the god(s) and should do everything in your power to steal said tank setup for it's magical, ambrosia of the gods elixir and monetize that thing as an immortality potion.

*Moral:* do not waste your time with the NPT. It's a nifty high-school experiment, but that's about it.

*In regards to the low-tech*

Okay, here's the thing on low-tech. The current interpretation of a low-tech aquarium is kind of BS. 

More or less someone's idea of a low-tech tank right now is "well, I'm not going to do co2 (because I can't afford it), so I'm going to go low-light and hope for the best."

Then we get a list of plants together that grow in lower light levels, and you have a moss anubias tank. Which kind of stays idle. For a long time.

There are two points to stick two on this topic:

1.) If you really want a low-light tank, stick to something cool growing emmersed in a bowl similar to wabi-kusa fashion. You'll save yourself a lot of head ache and still get something that looks great.

2.) The fundamental premise of low-tech is off. It takes a ridiculously low amount of light to really grow almost anything. What people are doing right now is just using the _wrong lights._ 

I totally respect operating on a budget. I understand the idea that what you want is something great - you have a passion for it, but you just simply don't have the money. Not having the money doesn't make the feeling of wanting to do it go away. 

If all you were to do is stick to core principles, and _*stop* defining tanks as *low-tech or high-tech*_, _you would open yourself up to a whole world of possibilities._

There is no such thing as a high tech tank. There is no such thing as a low tech tank.

There is only one methodology and one planted tank that works. One that follows rules and secrets to success.

Takashi Amano successfully grew layouts that make the highest tech tanks today look like absolute jokes back in the late 80's early 90's, before the ADA product line was really developed, more or less using a sand gravel bed.

What were the few things that really carried over from those days? Bacter 100, Clear Super, Tourmaline BC, 8000K (flourescent at the time) lighting, Co2. 
*
So if you have the low-tech mind set, stop it. *

Your budget constraints shouldn't in any way, shape or form, limit your ability.

Really when we talk 'low-tech,' we're talking Co2 and lighting. Get yourself any cheap fixture that will hold an ADA 27w 4 square pin bulb (on a nano) or 36w 4 square pin bulb (need 2 for a 20 gallon, 4 for a 40 gallon).

*Always, always, always use Co2

*Even if you cannot afford a pressurized unit, rig up a DIY yeast system and just make it work until you can afford a pressurized unit. Don't even bother trying to do a layout without Co2. It's *not worth the hassle.*

If you can't afford Aqua Soil, get yourself some basic gravel-like substrate, get some root tabs, Bacter 100 & Clear Super and you've at least got something that will work efficiently (efficiency being a measure of doing the job, effectiveness being a measure of doing the job well). 

*So now I've put together a basic lighting system, a co2 system, and substrate system on the super-cheap*.

Congrats. You're now "high tech." Are you starting to see how silly it is to pre-determine yourself as "low tech" or "high tech." 

I'll continue on later, but I hope by now you are beginning to understand where I'm going with this, and why you should start focusing on "why," and "how" techniques.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just a quick word on bacteria (not product, bacteria) :

If by now you have read this thread and you do not understand at a basic level their importance (that they are important) to the overall system then either A.) I am not explaining it well or B.) you are an idiot. 

I do not mean just nitrifying bacteria for cycling.

This isn't directed at anyone or in response to any particular comment. It's a stressing of the point!


----------



## talontsiawd

Francis Xavier said:


> *In regards to the low-tech*
> 
> Okay, here's the thing on low-tech. The current interpretation of a low-tech aquarium is kind of BS.
> 
> More or less someone's idea of a low-tech tank right now is "well, I'm not going to do co2 (because I can't afford it), so I'm going to go low-light and hope for the best."
> 
> Then we get a list of plants together that grow in lower light levels, and you have a moss anubias tank. Which kind of stays idle. For a long time.
> 
> There are two points to stick two on this topic:
> 
> 1.) If you really want a low-light tank, stick to something cool growing emmersed in a bowl similar to wabi-kusa fashion. You'll save yourself a lot of head ache and still get something that looks great.
> 
> 2.) The fundamental premise of low-tech is off. It takes a ridiculously low amount of light to really grow almost anything. What people are doing right now is just using the _wrong lights._
> 
> I totally respect operating on a budget. I understand the idea that what you want is something great - you have a passion for it, but you just simply don't have the money. Not having the money doesn't make the feeling of wanting to do it go away.
> 
> If all you were to do is stick to core principles, and _*stop* defining tanks as *low-tech or high-tech*_, _you would open yourself up to a whole world of possibilities._
> 
> There is no such thing as a high tech tank. There is no such thing as a low tech tank.
> 
> There is only one methodology and one planted tank that works. One that follows rules and secrets to success.
> 
> Takashi Amano successfully grew layouts that make the highest tech tanks today look like absolute jokes back in the late 80's early 90's, before the ADA product line was really developed, more or less using a sand gravel bed.
> 
> What were the few things that really carried over from those days? Bacter 100, Clear Super, Tourmaline BC, 8000K (flourescent at the time) lighting, Co2.
> *
> So if you have the low-tech mind set, stop it. *
> 
> Your budget constraints shouldn't in any way, shape or form, limit your ability.
> 
> Really when we talk 'low-tech,' we're talking Co2 and lighting. Get yourself any cheap fixture that will hold an ADA 27w 4 square pin bulb (on a nano) or 36w 4 square pin bulb (need 2 for a 20 gallon, 4 for a 40 gallon).
> 
> *Always, always, always use Co2
> 
> *Even if you cannot afford a pressurized unit, rig up a DIY yeast system and just make it work until you can afford a pressurized unit. Don't even bother trying to do a layout without Co2. It's *not worth the hassle.*


This is where I disagree with you. If you thoroughly plan a "low tech" or non-co2 tank, you can have fantastic results. You can do it with budget being a limiting factor as well. I am not talking about Java Moss and Anubus either. As long as you have some fast growers in there, and you light is right, you can really branch out into other plants that supposedly need high light and massive amounts of CO2. I have grown some seriously colorful plants with no co2, no ferts, not even root tabs.

Here are two examples of my own:
I don't particularly like the rock scape but this had the traditional low tech approach

















This one never matured and had more color than the pictures show


















I have done more than this (and better) but I don't have pictures of all my tanks. Neither tank had growth problems, neither seemed to limit the plants I used, and neither had any algae issues through the entire life of the tank, not even on the glass. I am talking about as close to zero maintenance as it gets. 

I am not saying that you shouldn't put co2 on any tank but I personally feel that if you plan right, you can be very successful without it. The second tank had Petco gravel so it only got nutrients from fish.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Previously:

*I had covered why using the terminology of why the concept of an NPT and low-tech is more or less cockamamie. 

*The core idea might be a little unsettling. This is because it is derived purely by a monetary standing. The _classic _idea is that if I have no money, then I make a low tech tank. 

Really, money has nothing to do with it. That is purely a human factor in what we can do and how we think we can do it. _Because everything is so product oriented, _we get clouded by either being a *have or have not*. Allowing this to be at the forefront inherently prevents your success.

I've already covered that _Takashi Amano, _has already done absolutely amazing layouts in what we would call today "_low-tech."_ 

I've emphasized that all you really need to focus on that end is: proper spectrum lighting (8,000K), proper technique, and a form of deliverable Co2, whether that has to be DIY or more preferably (due to consistency), pressurized. 

*The idea of high-tech is, also, BS.

*High-tech really only means that I have more gadgets than you and come over and take a look at my _hardware._

Over focus on the _what I have_, versus the _aquascape that I've created, _is entirely not the point. If all you want to do is show off hardware, then go buy yourself a fancy car and do whatever it is you've gotta do to justify the purchase. 

Aesthetics do matter - but function and aesthetic is more important than function. Aesthetics are a function of what's pleasing to our eye. Function is the _effectiveness with which it does it's job._

Of course an ADA Co2 Advanced System is always going to be better than a DIY system. Not because it looks better, but because it's better on a _functional level._

*Only buying stuff because it's stuff, does not enhance your aquascaping skills.*

Buying an ADA Cube Garden doesn't by default make you a better aquascaper. Just like buying a Ferrari doesn't make you a better driver by default. 

*What is high-tech then?

*High tech is at best, only stuff that does the job more effectively. 

_Equipment helps lessen the learning curve and make the job easier. The gap between a badass layout done in 'high tech,' and 'low tech,' is technique and knowledge.

_If you can grow plants in 'high tech,' setups, you can grow them in 'low tech,' setups and vice versa. 

So the whole idea of "I can't do this, _because_ I have a low-tech setup," is only an excuse.

*So, what then?

*There _are not _multiple ways to skin the cat.

There _are not _high tech and low tech setups.

There is only _*one way *_to have a successful aquascaped layout. *Everything else is based on this all-encompassing one way. *_This one magic formula_. 

*But Frank, my tank is different!*

No, it's not. 

*A small preview of what's next:*

The foundation of all things planted tank:

1. Gases, Molecules, etc.
2. Food Sources (nutrients, fish food, etc etc.)
3. Bacteria & Micro-organisms
4. Plants
5. Fauna (fish, etc)

*The Big Secret:

*The debate between E.I. and ADA, or ADA and whatever dosing, is utterly idiotic. They are "grades," or measures of effectiveness and efficiency of *the same universal method.* E.g. one is the kindergarten version, junior high, etc etc to think about it.


----------



## Wasserpest

There are lots of opinions in this thread. That is good. However, this tends to cause some unrest and aggressiveness. If you feel you are right and the others are wrong and you just have to prove it you need to step away from this.

Frank - consider taking your language down a notch. If you keep calling anything that isn't in agreement with your approach "BS" and "idiotic" you (and this thread) will not succeed.


----------



## pejerrey

I think the whole drama thing makes it a bit more interesting. By the end of the day it could be helpful to delete all useless posting to make it easier to read later.
Forums are like that, right? 
Although you Frank keep it together , don't let your anger stain your efforts, I'm very grateful of your thread, thank you for keep posting despite the negative inputs.


----------



## roybot73

Wasserpest said:


> Frank - consider taking your language down a notch. If you keep calling anything that isn't in agreement with your approach "BS" and "idiotic" you (and this thread) will not succeed.


Cheers. It's obvious that Frank knows his stuff and is a very talented aquascaper, but this is all coming off as a bit "high & mighty".
I'm very interested to read what you've got to say, but not if it's written in a condescending manner.


----------



## plantbrain

JeffyFunk said:


> In his previous post, Frank commented that people are too caught up with the "what" to buy and not "why" you should buy it.


Yep.



> To me the root of the problem in this "discussion" is that most people haven't used or evaluated the entire ADA line.


Well, I may be one of the very few, but, even those that sell ADA have not done this either, they sell it, it's not a thing that they question. That is understandable. Still, for myself, I like to understand know more about things, so I'll mess with it and test things.

Sometimes my conclusions are good towards a brand, sometimes not. 
It's a two way street.

But a nice journal using the products(the buyer can use or not use them, they have free will), is a good thing overall........and part of the TPT community.

Frank and ADG, as well as Amano himself have been fair about some of the products not being "needed". 



> Why would that be important? Because this entire thread is supposed to be an avenue as to the *BEST* way to grow aquatic plants, not whatever method works.


This is the problem, there is *no best way to grow plants*, this is not even the the right question, the question is what method is best suited for a person's goal/s for/with aquatic plants?

If ADA aesthetic is the goal, then this is what they are saying for you to do.
Whether is really helps, well, on some of the stuff, faith seems about all the argument is about, but..the main aspects of the ADA product line, light, tanks, filters, glassware, CO2.......ADA aqua soil, these are the Lion's share of the method.

Folk's seem to get side tracked on these minor additives and think there's some huge trick to them. I'd say the hobbyist and their general habits and routines play a much larger role,: good craftsmanship. ADA espouses this trait again and again. This is the main message, not Penac.



> There's a big difference between saying "this method works" and "this (other) method is the best", esp. when you haven't even used the (other) method.


True, the voice of ignorance knows no bounds
This also is a two edge sword. Vendors can be guilty of this also.



> Here's an analogy of how *I* think of the ADA method versus the other methods (let's use EI dosing as an example). The ADA Method is the equivalent of Organic Lawn Care and EI dosing is the equivalent of Conventional Lawn Care. Both methods will give you a nice green lawn, but the Organic Lawn Care system is a better method. (If you don't understand this analogy, I would highly suggest reading the book "Teaming with Microbes" by Jeff Lowenfels and Wayne Lewis - It will change the way you view organic techniques and conventional fertilizers and methods...)


Huh?? ADA liquid ferts and CO2? No different than EI.
The general method you are suggesting there is the same in fact.. along with good sized water changes. A good/better analogy would be EI vs say a non CO2 approach that is far more sustainable. No water changes, rely on fish waste and soil only. Slower growth/production, but far more sustainable, much more organic, allowing the entire system to interact/natural ecosystem functioning.

If you go this route within a debate/argument/philosophy, then best to go whole hog and not try and have it both ways. You end up contradicting yourself otherwise. It cannot be both "organic" and "inorganic" and you get to call it "organic"

Or natural and unnatural etc.........


----------



## plantbrain

Dollface said:


> Actually, I think daily diligence is the main point that Frank is trying to reinforce with this thread. He doesn't really rely so much on the additives as a magic fix-it-all, they're just another tool in his maintenance and dosing regimen. Most of his advice, e.g. consistent water changes, dosing, and filter clearning, dealing with algae sooner rather than later, taking note of the tanks needs and responding to that, isn't about magic ADA hickory smoke bacteria food, it's about just paying attention to your tank _and enjoying it_.


+1

It taste good on ribs though, hummm hummmhuh!


----------



## Francis Xavier

In which people are left wondering about the different tone in the thread. 

*That has a real application towards the planted aquarium. 

*Some of you may have wondered how this thread has gone the way it has. There's been a very clear difference in tone - namely from myself. 

This has been interpreted in a few different ways, which are all incorrect. 

_The reason for this line of thought: *be warned* if you've kept reading up until this point you may have the "ah-ha!" moment. _

*The NO B.S., Absolutely essential, immensely critical, secret and bag of tricks to growing any plant, at any time, with any setup. 

*Here's the deal.

Every planted tank, the 'eco-system,' and everything alive and thriving in our tanks follows only one rule. One law.

It is quintessentially Malthusian. 

Another, less fun way of explaining it, is that everything follows the law of minimums.

The law of minimums is simple:

1. The organism population will only grow to the available supply of the _least available_ nutrient necessary for survival.

What this means is that if our basic supplement required for growing plants is NPK (there is much more, but please, for the sake of example bear with me): 

if *N* is 3, *P* is 3 and *K* is 1 (and if plants require 1 of each), then your plants *will only grow to 1*, not 3. 

*This is a fundamental premise of E.I. dosing.

This is also a fundamental premise of ADA dosing.

*_Because it's the fundamental *premise of everything* in the planted tank. It's how plants, the bacteria, everything, grows. 

_There is a difference between the two; and there are reasons for the difference, but it's not so major as to call them separate methods entirely. 

One is refined and systemized, the other not so much. 

With this snippet of information, you should now begin to understand that there are *no multiple ways to skin the cat*. They all strive to do the *exact same* thing. 

An Unconventional Example: 
Let's take for example this thread. It was first fed on good information. The information is what brought you here. Not a product or a product system.

A good aquascape kept you interested, combined with the information you came back.

But...when did activity explode the most on this thread and the forum?

When there was something controversial. Something that could bring a spark into the conversation. Information combined with Visuals and a flair of drama. If you haven't had the opportunity to see it - by now a page of commentary has been deleted (to highlight how response increased), nothing of value in the deleted posts, but it's a "population" example if you will.

Now, slowly over the course of a few days I let a few things brim. I came out with a bold statement - and flat out said I wouldn't respond to negativity.

Then, followed that up with something slightly bolder. Consequently responses went up. Then finally today we had an explosion of conversation! Emotion going back and forth and the thread had a great deal of energy about it. 

This is exactly how the planted tank goes. This is exactly the concert that plays out between the micro-organisms, the plants and the fish / shrimp. 

Now if we missed one of those elements, things would die back down, normalize and the thread might even fall a few pages back completely. 

If you can understand that example - and how things naturally played their course, then you can _*do anything in your planted tank.*_


----------



## Francis Xavier

As a reward for bearing with me this long - and for diligently waiting while I prepare further postings on the elements I listed two posts back. I have attached some eye candy for you to view - a sneak peak at the 60-P I'm working on at the gallery.

In regards to the daily updates on the MIni M at home:










I've added in some Amano's to clean up the place a bit. The small amount of diatoms and green algae will be cleaned up in short order. Dosing has remained at 1 Brighty K & 1 Green Brighty Step 1.

Now performing once every 3 day water changes.

I haven't posted a bucket shot in some time - which I will at the next update, but the water is significantly clear at each water change now, which helps to illustrate the difference in algae growth / decaying plant rate between the first week, second week and third weeks. This is an important illustration of why water changes up front are important to long term success.

I will also have the answers to the "quiz," posted up later!

And now, for the teaser.


----------



## plantbrain

That teaser is looking good, and well placed in the indoor environment.


----------



## Doc7

Interesting thread so far. I like the ADA NA style though can't say I've attempted it. Someday I hope to also get a nano rimless.

Is there much remaining to do with this tank besides let it spread, and continue trimming?

How long from "completion" of the scape would you estimate it is? Also - is there a longevity of a scape like this where runners etc keep it from being manageable, or would you say once the carpet finishes filling in you could trim this and keep it looking like its current state for an indefinite period of time?

Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk


----------



## dhg is my plant

I like it! so nice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Bannik

Wasserpest said:


> There are lots of opinions in this thread. That is good. However, this tends to cause some unrest and aggressiveness. If you feel you are right and the others are wrong and you just have to prove it you need to step away from this.
> 
> Frank - consider taking your language down a notch. If you keep calling anything that isn't in agreement with your approach "BS" and "idiotic" you (and this thread) will not succeed.


 
I agree with this, in one post he puts down anybody who disagrees with him by saying they can't disagree with him unless they've tried the full line-up of ADA products. Then in the very same post he shows that he hasn't used another product or methodology due to his total ignorance. 

Is it not bad form and cause for moderation for giving negative product reviews as he has done multiple times to both competing products and proven methodologies?

In the past three years I've spent thousands of dollars (several hundred on the ADA line-up alone) ADA makes fantastic products and there is no disputing that, but it really is arrogant to say that doing things the "ADA Way" and anybody not using your products and methodology should tear down their tank or not even bother starting the hobby.

If this is how a brand spokesman is going to act towards a hobby that I *LOVE *I'm going to seriously consider no longer supporting that brand.


----------



## Jeff5614

Bannik said:


> I agree with this, in one post he puts down anybody who disagrees with him by saying they can't disagree with him unless they've tried the full line-up of ADA products. Then in the very same post he shows that he hasn't used another product or methodology due to his total ignorance.
> 
> Is it not bad form and cause for moderation for giving negative product reviews as he has done multiple times to both competing products and proven methodologies?
> 
> In the past three years I've spent thousands of dollars (several hundred on the ADA line-up alone) ADA makes fantastic products and there is no disputing that, but it really is arrogant to say that doing things the "ADA Way" and anybody not using your products and methodology should tear down their tank or not even bother starting the hobby.
> 
> If this is how a brand spokesman is going to act towards a hobby that I *LOVE *I'm going to seriously consider no longer supporting that brand.


Just when it seemed the thread was back on track.


----------



## pejerrey

I wish I didn't have to sell the tank I was going to use to learn ADA... 

I really like this thread Frank, thanks again!

I've been learning megatons from Tom Barr and my 30 gal with inert soil .









When I just started was in a horrible state. But now at the end of its scape it is lush colorful and vibrant. 
The most important things were to be diligent, master light and gas/dose more than enough to work with The law of the minimum. 50-25% water changes weekly. Tap water.

At the same time, I set up a shrimp tank with no co2, no dosing, very light feeding and akadama drl (inert?). To my surprise some plants looked happier and more colorful (also zero algae). Almost no water changes. DI water.

I'm still trying to understand and learn from this CRS tank:









I did consider the bigger dosed tank "high tech" and the nano "low tech", I guess from now on I will call it "high maintenance or low maintenance".

Just wanted to share.


----------



## plantbrain

One of Frank and my own, amano's, anyone worth a snots path to scaping........is the evolution.

Pejerrey is lamenting over the loss of an older tank, but think of what you will learn from the next incarnation? Nothing permanent. We might Keep Rift cichlids for 5-10 years, then perhaps breed Plecos, then maybe a reef for 7 years, then Killis for 6 years.

The same is true with Scaping with plants. the longer you stick with it and the effort you put into it, the better you get.

If you see a style you like, admire....then that should be enough motivation.
If you are weak in one area, then address that and work on that area. Do not just work on your strengths.

Many do not understand how to work with the Nature style.
There is little except within the ADA aquajournal(I STRONGLY urge anyone SERIOUS about the NA style to subscribe) and on line, but this is very limited.

I work with Japanese landscaping and living environment and the terrestrial gardening will give many a very good background into the general philosophy and a much wide range discussion of the style and also the craftsmanship that goes into it.

What Frank is suggesting is not much different from the ADA aqua journals and what ADA is suggesting is not much different from Japanese gardening philosophy.

The ADA approach can be extended to Non CO2 tanks, I'm not sure why ADA has not promoted that as much, if at all. This takes longer and more patience is required, but little effort after the set up is needed.


----------



## Bannik

Jeff5614 said:


> Just when it seemed the thread was back on track.


 I'm passionate about this hobby and I think it is important that we call out and police those that go out of their way to discourage people from starting a planted tank. 

Especially on a thread with so many views. There is no "One Way" to have a successful planted tank because each and every person has their own motivation, budget and end vision. I believe it is important that this hobby remains open to creativity and accessable at every pricepoint.

He isn't selling the positive benefits of his product line, instead he decided to go full negative on other proven products and methods. 
Who is he to look down on a child whose first foray into having a planted aquarium is growing an anubias in their Betta tank? To me, this is a major win for the hobby.

He needs to understand that ADA is a very niche market for those of us who want to pay a premium for a premium product. Sell us on that aspect, don't pretend that it is the only way to be successful in the hobby.

If that is the direction ADA marketing is taking, not only will I discontinue buying their product, I will discontinue advocating it to my friends.


----------



## Dollface

Bannik said:


> He isn't selling the positive benefits of his product line, instead he decided to go full negative on other proven products and methods.
> Who is he to look down on a child whose first foray into having a planted aquarium is growing an anubias in their Betta tank?


But he's not.


----------



## Francis Xavier

_If you've learned nothing else, at least take advantage of me in this gem to show me what's what. This may be the most important post in the hobby I've ever made, so read it carefully:_

Unfortunately, there has been a vital breakdown in communication. The frame of posting I chose was very specific. It had everything to do with attacking conventional thought. 

_The assumption, for better or worse, is that by saying the other methods are invalid, that the ADA method is the only method to choose.

_*This is not the case.

*Every common word we use to describe a method - is complete B.S. That would include calling it the "ADA" method. 

I use only one method. The one that most successfully grows plants. I also have a great deal of useless expertise in "methods," that do not work.

The _framing_ was an attack on every supposed method. We are all looking for the plant magic bullet. This _one method_ underlies everything as the very foundation.

*This may seem like Renegade thinking, but it's the real deal. 

*_Let's summarize (let me again make this clear, there has not, and will not, be any attacks against individuals):

_*The so-called "ADA" method is B.S.*: there's no special, magic ADA juice. There's no automatic-success mechanism with ADA. The only thing that matters is application, which is entirely up to the individual.

*The "high-tech" method is B.S.*: that's just focusing on the equipment - not the method. Focus on equipment does not equate to growing plants. 
*
The "low-tech" method is B.S.*: By no means does equipment limit your ability to greatly create an awesome layout. Equipment is a tool to "level the learning curve."

*The "NPT" method is B.S.: *while it focuses more on the theory of methodology, if you are doing it out of necessity - then follow the "true method," if you are doing it out of interest in experimentation - it would be more accurate to call it a style.

_*Okay, so now you might be really angry at me for saying that your preferred "method," is B.S. 

*_I say these methods are all B.S. for one reason, which has come via a lot of pain and suffering, observation and ultimately experience. 

It has come from spending a lot of time banging my head against a wall in the quest to take things to the next level. To master the planted tank.

_*It is an inherently emotional endeavor, and requires two things: stirred passions and dedication.

*_That conclusion is easy to say now, hard to see before you arrive at it;

_There is only one method. The Method. And it has nothing to do with equipment, brands or limitation. It has everything to do with understanding.

_*The Principles of The Method:

1.* All organisms are Malthusian in nature. They will grow and invade to the very limits their environment will permit them.

*2.* Organisms can only grow and duplicate to the extent that the least common denominator is available. E.G. The resource that there is the least of, is the extent to which a plant, bacterium, etc will grow.

*3.* Everything is cyclical. Everything is utilized in concert to grow and ultimately be recycled. Molecules, minerals and nutrients are taken in and used by organisms, organisms feed other organisms, and the waste product of those organisms feed yet other organisms. 
*4. *The purity of the environment is directly proportionate to how it will grow. The more "x-factors," and toxins you have, the less successful you will be.

*5. *It is the *balance *of all these factors that leads to ultimate success. The smallest of details matters.

*The Techniques of The Method:

1. *Purity of water. Because our aquariums have a finite amount of water immediately available, we must 'refresh,' the water source as frequently as is possible. 

*2. *Supply in relative abundance all of the factors that lead to proper growth of bacteria, plants and fish. Supply only the proper levels relative to the aquarium's rate of growth. 
*
3. *Trim vigorously - trimming enables new growth to take the place of the old. 

*4. *Daily attention - if you have the time to make a post, you have the time to give a quick check for anything running amok in your tank too.

*The Mindset of The Method:

1. *Cultivation and care for the planted aquarium (even the smallest microorganisms) is an enjoyable task, something that's look forward too. There is something irreplaceable in the appearance of a balanced aquarium.

*2. *Vicious, quick and precise attack on anything that threatens the balance of the aquarium.

*3. *Constantly seeking new ways to learn and improve. Visualizes success with the aquarium.


_Following this methodology, this mindset, _means that all others are irrelevant. Because they don't matter - they are parameters set by equipment and predefined 'successes,' rather than the aquascape and the health of the system at large.

This means that, following the principles:

*A "low-tech," tank can easily trump any "high-tech," tank.

The "high-tech" tank is irrelevant because it only describes equipment. 

The NPT is just a partial application of the whole picture.

The "ADA" method is just a series of techniques and quality brand tools to 'enhance,' The Method.

E.I. Method is only a fertilizer method. It's based on and a part of The Method, just like ADA. They are more similar than different.


*I know the path to this point has been a bit controversial. But I hope by now that you've found the value in taking this path, and why this path was taken to arrive at this destination. _Emotional energy, _getting attention, loud and clear, is an important part in true understanding.

Unfortunately, Pain is a greater motivator than pleasure.


----------



## Dollface

That was the most divisive way to unite the hobby that I've ever seen.


----------



## frrok

And now on to our regularly scheduled program. Thank you!


----------



## freph

frrok said:


> And now on to our regularly scheduled program. Thank you!


Yes, please!

@topic: That was probably the most accurate thing I've seen posted in a while. Bravo.


----------



## plantbrain

Dollface said:


> But he's not.


I agree, I do not see it and I'd bite an ear off... if so.
They are so chewy:redface:


----------



## Bannik

Francis Xavier said:


> _If you've learned nothing else, or simply wish me to die a horrible fate, at least take advantage of me in this gem to show me what's what. This may be the most important post in the hobby I've ever made, so read it carefully:_
> 
> Unfortunately, there has been a vital breakdown in communication. The frame of posting I chose was very specific. It had everything to do with attacking conventional thought.
> 
> _The assumption, for better or worse, is that by saying the other methods are invalid, that the ADA method is the only method to choose.
> 
> _*This is not the case.
> 
> *Every common word we use to describe a method - is complete B.S. That would include calling it the "ADA" method.
> 
> I use only one method. The one that most successfully grows plants. I also have a great deal of useless expertise in "methods," that do not work.
> 
> The _framing_ was an attack on every supposed method. We are all looking for the plant magic bullet. This _one method_ underlies everything as the very foundation.
> 
> *This may seem like Renegade thinking, but it's the real deal.
> 
> *_Let's summarize (let me again make this clear, there has not, and will not, be any attacks against individuals):
> 
> _*The so-called "ADA" method is B.S.*: there's no special, magic ADA juice. There's no automatic-success mechanism with ADA. The only thing that matters is application, which is entirely up to the individual.
> 
> *The "high-tech" method is B.S.*: that's just focusing on the equipment - not the method. Focus on equipment does not equate to growing plants.
> *
> The "low-tech" method is B.S.*: By no means does equipment limit your ability to greatly create an awesome layout. Equipment is a tool to "level the learning curve."
> 
> *The "NPT" method is B.S.: *while it focuses more on the theory of methodology, if you are doing it out of necessity - then follow the "true method," if you are doing it out of interest in experimentation - it would be more accurate to call it a style.
> 
> _*Okay, so now you might be really angry at me for saying that your preferred "method," is B.S.
> 
> *_I say these methods are all B.S. for one reason, which has come via a lot of pain and suffering, observation and ultimately experience.
> 
> It has come from spending a lot of time banging my head against a wall in the quest to take things to the next level. To master the planted tank.
> 
> _*It is an inherently emotional endeavor, and requires two things: stirred passions and dedication.
> 
> *_That conclusion is easy to say now, hard to see before you arrive at it;
> 
> _There is only one method. The Method. And it has nothing to do with equipment, brands or limitation. It has everything to do with understanding.
> 
> _*The Principles of The Method:
> 
> 1.* All organisms are Malthusian in nature. They will grow and invade to the very limits their environment will permit them.
> 
> *2.* Organisms can only grow and duplicate to the extent that the least common denominator is available. E.G. The resource that there is the least of, is the extent to which a plant, bacterium, etc will grow.
> 
> *3.* Everything is cyclical. Everything is utilized in concert to grow and ultimately be recycled. Molecules, minerals and nutrients are taken in and used by organisms, organisms feed other organisms, and the waste product of those organisms feed yet other organisms.
> *4. *The purity of the environment is directly proportionate to how it will grow. The more "x-factors," and toxins you have, the less successful you will be.
> 
> *5. *It is the *balance *of all these factors that leads to ultimate success. The smallest of details matters.
> 
> *The Techniques of The Method:
> 
> 1. *Purity of water. Because our aquariums have a finite amount of water immediately available, we must 'refresh,' the water source as frequently as is possible.
> 
> *2. *Supply in relative abundance all of the factors that lead to proper growth of bacteria, plants and fish. Supply only the proper levels relative to the aquarium's rate of growth.
> *
> 3. *Trim vigorously - trimming enables new growth to take the place of the old.
> 
> *4. *Daily attention - if you have the time to make a post, you have the time to give a quick check for anything running amok in your tank too.
> 
> *The Mindset of The Method:
> 
> 1. *Cultivation and care for the planted aquarium (even the smallest microorganisms) is an enjoyable task, something that's look forward too. There is something irreplaceable in the appearance of a balanced aquarium.
> 
> *2. *Vicious, quick and precise attack on anything that threatens the balance of the aquarium.
> 
> *3. *Constantly seeking new ways to learn and improve. Visualizes success with the aquarium.
> 
> 
> _Following this methodology, this mindset, _means that all others are irrelevant. Because they don't matter - they are parameters set by equipment and predefined 'successes,' rather than the aquascape and the health of the system at large.
> 
> This means that, following the principles:
> 
> *A "low-tech," tank can easily trump any "high-tech," tank.
> 
> The "high-tech" tank is irrelevant because it only describes equipment.
> 
> The NPT is just a partial application of the whole picture.
> 
> The "ADA" method is just a series of techniques and quality brand tools to 'enhance,' The Method.
> 
> E.I. Method is only a fertilizer method. It's based on and a part of The Method, just like ADA. They are more similar than different.
> 
> 
> *I know the path to this point has been a bit controversial. But I hope by now that you've found the value in taking this path, and why this path was taken to arrive at this destination. _Emotional energy, _getting attention, loud and clear, is an important part in true understanding.
> 
> Unfortunately, Pain is a greater motivator than pleasure.



Now this, this is a post I can enjoy reading, your idea is interesting. If I am understanding this, your hypothesis is that we should focus on cultivating a state of mind where maintenance is the most enjoyable part of keeping your tank? Once we have that, the rest takes care of itself? Cultivate your mind, and your plants will follow.

Please tell us more of this idea. I don't want to derail your thread and I was not attacking you personally. However please phrase things differently. When people use generalizations and absolute statements especially in a negative or dismissive manner they come across as condescending.

I am going to delete my post where I called out specific examples as that was out of line on my part. However, I stand by my point in my original post. I think it would be a service to the board if you re-framed some of the more dismissive and negative statements from your previous posts in a more positive way. That way you're not bad mouthing other vendors and alienating those with only a casual interest in the hobby.


----------



## Dollface

Bannik said:


> That way you're not bad mouthing other vendors and alienating those with only a casual interest in the hobby.


... But he never did that.


----------



## alfalfa

Bannik said:


> However please phrase things differently. When people use generalizations and absolute statements especially in a negative or dismissive manner they come across as condescending.
> ...
> I think it would be a service to the board if you re-framed some of the more dismissive and negative statements from your previous posts in a more positive way.


I respect your opinion and interpretation of what was said, but I read everything very differently. I have seen nothing but helpful advice from someone who has a genuine passion for this and helping other people advance, too. I almost reread this entire thread because I must have missed something big even though I was up to speed. Even after reposting all those quotes I still don't understand what the issue is. There was nothing problematic about anything that was said. It wasn't "my way or the highway or else you suck" but rather "hey I've made my share of mistakes, so save yourself the trouble and try this because it works, at least for me."

Nobody can be victimized by this thread unless they chose to be, and even then it will be their own doing.


----------



## pejerrey

This is the tank I had to sell:









My housemate's ignorance assumed that it will be too much water and too much energy to have a third tank, even if I buy the water at the store and have a kw meter to pay for what I use with the tanks separate. I'm keeping the old 30gal and the nano CRS tank. 

Sorry to hijack this thread again.


----------



## pejerrey

Francis Xavier said:


> Unfortunately, Pain is a greater motivator than pleasure.


 The right amount of pain under control it's a very unique and addicting additive to magnify pleasure .... (the learning curve, when you are aware and enjoying the process)


----------



## plantbrain

Bannik said:


> Cultivate your mind, and your plants will follow.
> 
> Please tell us more of this idea. I don't want to derail your thread and I was not attacking you personally. However please phrase things differently. When people use generalizations and absolute statements especially in a negative or dismissive manner they come across as condescending.
> 
> I am going to delete my post where I called out specific examples as that was out of line on my part. However, I stand by my point in my original post. I think it would be a service to the board if you re-framed some of the more dismissive and negative statements from your previous posts in a more positive way. That way you're not bad mouthing other vendors and alienating those with only a casual interest in the hobby.


Our own assumptions can come across VERY differently on line as they might in person. Give them the same latitude and grain of salt that you yourself would be afforded, perhaps even more.

Some read one thing, another might take it personally.

If in doubt, simply ask Frank directly.:thumbsup:


----------



## plantbrain

pejerrey said:


> This is the tank I had to sell:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My housemate's ignorance assumed that it will be too much water and too much energy to have a third tank, even if I buy the water at the store and have a kw meter to pay for what I use with the tanks separate. I'm keeping the old 30gal and the nano CRS tank.
> 
> Sorry to hijack this thread again.


The energy required is roughly 8-10$ a month at most, offer to pay that difference for the tank. I did this, but most liked the tanks so much and considered a part of the home/art, they would have none of that.

A ratty looking tank? Well, less likely. A nice ADA aesthetic? Much much more likely to get the non hobbyists approval. Maybe even a few converts. 

Same with Bonsai, or music.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Never knew there was so much politic in fish keeping. Why can't people just speak their mind, share their experiences and challenge the status quo. 

We need more updates on that teaser tank you got, it looks promising.


----------



## zoragen

Great thread Frank.

Now let's see more pics:icon_smil


----------



## Francis Xavier

We've gone over quite a bit of methodology and philosophy being the techniques lately, so it's time to get this show back on the rodeo with some-good-ole-fashioned technical details.

The Aquarium on April 4th (first water change of the week, week 3 = 2 water changes, 3 days apart)



Now, for the infamous bucket shot:



I post these bucket shots to illustrate examples, and to show first hand *why* water changes are done so frequently up front. 

In case you don't want to search the thread for some of the older bucket shots, here's a picture from week 1 (daily water changes) :



So, compare the two side-by-side: first bucket shot is on the third week, for the first water change that week (first of two, 3 days apart).

The second bucket shot is the water change after day 3 on the first week with *daily* water changes. 

*The aquarium is most vulnerable to algae in the first month, the first week especially. This is why we focus so much on getting started right the first time. Most people fail with their planted tank within the first month because of this curve.*

And the finished shot:



To Bring out a teaser of the 60-P in the ADG Gallery I'm working on:

Diatom Algae has appeared in the first week.



_Don't Panic! This is an easy algae, and is no problem what so ever. Amano's devour this stuff. But we're not ready to add them yet, so airline tubing removal will hold us over in the mean time.



_*Mini-M, April 5th:

*



Apparently, I'm terrible at taking straight and non-blurry photos at 1:30 am.

Dosing: Green Brighty Step 1: 1 Squirt, Brighty K 1 squirt.

*P.S.* an insight that I've overlooked for a while: Nano tanks truly aren't for beginners. They are much more difficult to balance than larger water volumes. Take for example the 60-P vs. the Mini M. The 17 gallon aquarium is much easier to balance and has much less problems to deal with than the 5.5 gallon aquarium. Just a little food for thought.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Bannik said:


> Now this, this is a post I can enjoy reading, your idea is interesting. If I am understanding this, your hypothesis is that we should focus on cultivating a state of mind where maintenance is the most enjoyable part of keeping your tank? Once we have that, the rest takes care of itself? Cultivate your mind, and your plants will follow.
> 
> Please tell us more of this idea. I don't want to derail your thread and I was not attacking you personally.


The absolute focus needs to be cultivating that state of mind! We often get overwhelmed by the task of multiple water changes and diligent maintenance because we have the urge to set up more aquariums or larger aquariums than we can handle (a thing in which I've fallen victim as well).

But rather, if we can focus on one tank first, see it through to stability and fruition, then the passion to replicate that result naturally occurs. Otherwise we end up with multiple tanks, which all invariably go down the toilet and never kind of get to where we originally envisioned them to go. From there we get the idea that this is really hard, and a lot of effort and we create negative associations with maintenance routines (e.g. planted tanks are just this way...it can't be helped), rather than positive ones. 

_*The ideal way to look at it is like this: the planted aquarium hobby is self-development with measurable, visual results through actions.*_



pejerrey said:


> The right amount of pain under control it's a very unique and addicting additive to magnify pleasure .... (the learning curve, when you are aware and enjoying the process)


Exactly. 



FlyingHellFish said:


> Never knew there was so much politic in fish keeping. Why can't people just speak their mind, share their experiences and challenge the status quo.
> 
> We need more updates on that teaser tank you got, it looks promising.


It's not so much politic, as it is a group of passionate people - when passions flair, it can be a bit heated at times!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Doc7 said:


> Interesting thread so far. I like the ADA NA style though can't say I've attempted it. Someday I hope to also get a nano rimless.
> 
> Is there much remaining to do with this tank besides let it spread, and continue trimming?
> 
> How long from "completion" of the scape would you estimate it is? Also - is there a longevity of a scape like this where runners etc keep it from being manageable, or would you say once the carpet finishes filling in you could trim this and keep it looking like its current state for an indefinite period of time?
> 
> Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk


At this point the name of the game with the aquarium, especially once it hits next week (when weekly water change begins and just top offs in between), is to 'sculpt,' the layout and maintain parameters. 

There is absolutely nothing indefinite about any planted tank - so I do not believe you could keep this going ad infinitum. However, the length of time it'll last is a precise measurement between: When the final picture is reached and when I tire of looking at the layout / want to do something else. 

Realistically, you could keep the aqua soil itself going for a few years if you did proper maintenance on it, provided you aren't constantly uprooting, and supplementing root tabs like Multi & Iron Bottom.



dhg is my plant said:


> I like it! so nice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Thank you!


----------



## Michiba54

Hi Frank, I've seen you talk about doing w/c once a day for the first month a few times an I was wondering if this was necessary for tanks that have already been established (cycled, but never planted) or is it just for newly set up tanks? 

Thanks~


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Great growth Frank, your HC Cuba is already spreading faster than mine.

So I took your advice and added K and Iron, I still have the brown/burnt leaf while some of the colour on the other stems are a lush green.

Any ideas about HC Cuba's brown/burnt tip? Growth is better, yet the colour is not.


----------



## plantbrain

Francis Xavier said:


> *The aquarium is most vulnerable to algae in the first month, the first week especially. This is why we focus so much on getting started right the first time. Most people fail with their planted tank within the first month because of this curve.*
> 
> Diatom Algae has appeared in the first week.


This diatom is called Melosira, pretty common filamentous diatom, also a fav food of shrimp and many other inverts, etc.

Does not last long.

One thing the SFBAAPS agreed upon about 15 years ago was you cannot over do water changes. You may not need them, but they do not hurt.
You might not need to sweep the house daily, but the place will be clean if you do.


----------



## roybot73

One thing I've noticed over the years is how often people seem to want to "rescape". It seems to me that a proper Nature Aquarium should be set up with longevity in mind and design. The more recent pictures of the display tanks at the Nature Aquarium Gallery in Niigata seem to reflect this ethos -- the same ones are still there that were there several years ago, and are looking _better_ as time goes on.

Can you speak to this point?


----------



## sewingalot

Moderator note:

Remember this _is_ person's journal regardless if you feel about it. Please show the respect you'd like to see in your own journal. Whether or not we agree with Frank's ideas or delivery method should be discussed off his thread as it is becoming distracting for the readers that do want to follow along. The rude commentary by _all _parties need to stop here and now. Further posts will be removed and action will be taken. Feel free to start a new thread to debate the merits to the products, but let's not continue it here.


----------



## Francis Xavier

roybot73 said:


> One thing I've noticed over the years is how often people seem to want to "rescape". It seems to me that a proper Nature Aquarium should be set up with longevity in mind and design. The more recent pictures of the display tanks at the Nature Aquarium Gallery in Niigata seem to reflect this ethos -- the same ones are still there that were there several years ago, and are looking _better_ as time goes on.
> 
> Can you speak to this point?


Great question Roy, 

The reality is that you should keep a layout going as long as you enjoy it. There are techniques to make sure the growing goes as long as possible. Ultimately there comes a time when the aquarium just needs to be reset, but that time can be years and years. 

Here's my theory (and it's based on my experience, ADG experience and the combined threads here, seeing people's layouts over the years). 

People rescape because of inexperience that leads to the layout just getting 'away,' from them: e.g. they "fail," due to inadequate growth or too much algae and frankly, it gets really discouraging. 

Very rarely do I see people restart a tank out of being (more especially nano's) "tired," with their layout idea, more so just that it didn't work out for them (and this happened a lot at ADG too for the first year of the new space until I spent a *whole year figuring out new techniques and water parameters to solve the issue*.

So the result is that it is just easier and more cathartic to restart and try again. This is an admirable trait to learn from mistakes and keep on goin, but the same mistakes get repeated again and again and again. 

This is why I focus so so much on getting people started _right_.

It's irrelevant what product is used as long as it does the job it needs to do. Are there differences? of course. But if you follow the principles and the methodology I've laid out before, then your success rate is guaranteed to go up at least 100-200% over your last layout. 

_What was the result of all my hard work in figuring out The Method at ADG?_

The success rate of layouts went from 25% of every layout set up being successful to the exact vision we saw it to 100% of every layout reaching what we saw in our minds.

This is The Method I'm trying to share with everyone here - so that everyone can benefit from my hard-earned experience to catapult their ability to create awesome layouts.

_So that you can have the layout you always dreamed of_


----------



## Francis Xavier

Michiba54 said:


> Hi Frank, I've seen you talk about doing w/c once a day for the first month a few times an I was wondering if this was necessary for tanks that have already been established (cycled, but never planted) or is it just for newly set up tanks?
> 
> Thanks~


Hello Michiba, 

I would not recommend adding plants to a tank that never had them before - it would be much easier for you to start from scratch with a tank dedicated to plants and set up correct from there. 

But if it was a planted tank that was already established you wouldn't have to do the 1 a day 1st week, every other day 2nd week, twice a week 3rd week, one a week afterwards. Though if you have significant algae issues I'd do at least 3 a week til the tank levels out.



FlyingHellFish said:


> Great growth Frank, your HC Cuba is already spreading faster than mine.
> 
> So I took your advice and added K and Iron, I still have the brown/burnt leaf while some of the colour on the other stems are a lush green.
> 
> Any ideas about HC Cuba's brown/burnt tip? Growth is better, yet the colour is not.


I would trim off any of the burnt growth and brown growth - use fine tipped scissors to do this function. New, green growth will replace it.

As long as new growth is vibrantly green, and the roots are white and healthy, you're good.


----------



## KH2PO4

How about the last quiz?


----------



## Francis Xavier

KH2PO4 said:


> How about the last quiz?


Ah yes! here are the answers to the "quiz" 

#1 Penac W added to boost the water hardness a bit to kH 2. (RODI)

#2 Moved lily pipe outflow to the back of the tank to manipulate circulation of Co2 in the tank to emphasize on the front more - the growth in front left Riccia was suffering a bit.

#3 Trimmed dwarf hair grass to the stub to eliminate emmersed growth. 

#4 trimmed any remaining dead growth.


----------



## Francis Xavier

End of Week 3 update:

So, yesterday (April 6) was the end of the third week. 

I did the full water change:



As well as removed via trimming any remaining dead growth. As you can see in the tank there's virtually 100% good, green, healthy growth going on everywhere.



Upon filling I added my ratio of Seachem Equilibrium + Penac W for water hardness on the RODI water. Now that I'm switching to once a week water changes + top offs, I can stabilize the system easily with these buffers in place. 



Clear water 20 minutes later:



*Did I mention how much I love E. Tennellus? I'm incredibly happy to see this runner because now I can continue to propagate the plant.* The runner will be cut as soon as it starts to "bloom," since I can't really have another tennellus plant that far front.



Let's do some comparison:

Day 1 (planted) :










End of Week 1:










The bucket shot during week 1:










End of Week 2:



The bucket shot during week 2:










End of Week 3:



Week three bucket shot:




The routine now is 2 squirts Brighty K, 1 Squirt Green Brighty Step 1, 1 squirt Green Brighty Special Lights, 6 drops Green Bacter after water change. 

Once a week water changes now.


----------



## frrok

That's pretty amazing how much healthy growth in only three weeks time.


----------



## Francis Xavier

frrok said:


> That's pretty amazing how much healthy growth in only three weeks time.


Thank you for your kind words, Frrok. 

It's taken me years now to arrive at the success formula to get that to grow like that, 100% of the time without exception. 

This is the formula I now try to spread to everyone I can. 

Beforehand, maybe 1 in 4 layouts would grow to maturity the way they were originally envisioned. Now that success ratio is 4 for 4. 

_Some Mistakes I may have made_:

1. I believe I may have trimmed the Riccia too early - it appears to be doing some pretty weird things in terms of growth. Lots of splitting and rather than being straight up, it has bend and curves to it. 

_Either way, I'm on a quest to obtain Riccia from Japan, this type grows profoundly differently than the type we have in America_

2. Adding the Microsword originally was a mistake. One of the reasons for that is it meant I had 6 plant varieties, instead of 5. Always stick to odd numbers. 

3. I dosed Penac W directly, rather than pre-mixing it in a small cup, so I got some Penac white powder stuck in the substrate on the front glass. A noob mistake that I had already learned once and promptly ignored.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Since I've got some time in my schedule right now, I figure this is a good time to go in depth a little into the Principles of The Method.

Let's start at Principle One. _All organisms are Malthusian in nature._ They will grow and invade to the very limits their environment will permit them.

Unlocking the understanding to this method is key for your success. 

What is Malthusian? Malthusian means that a population will expand to the very limits that it's environment will allow it. 

Let's dial back the clock to a high school biology experiment (you probably came across this during the section on genetics due to their fast rate of duplication) for illustration:

Fruit Fly eggs are placed in a vial with about half the container filled with food. 

The initial eggs will hatch in the land of plenty and immediately begin to reproduce in their new environment. 

Each female will choose a mate, lay eggs and the second generation is born. Then the second generation will repeat the pattern and produce the third generation, (likely with mixing of generations, but let's keep it simple) and so on and so forth.

Now, as generations are produced, the food supply begins to go from bountiful to steadily declining as the higher and higher rate of population begins to inhabit the same space and same declining food source. 

There are a few distinct points here in population relative to resources (food), space is nearly irrelevant:

1. Too Much Food, Too Few Flies

2. Food Source Availability = Fruit Fly Population (balanced, sustainable as long as the rate of death = rate of birth _and_ the supply of food is maintained at this same level). 

3. Too Little Food, Too Many Flies = the population begins massive die off, food source begins a rapid decline.

4. No Food, Too many flies = the food resource has been rapidly depleted, leaving an over abundance of flies, which now feast on their dead brethren to attempt to live.

5. The ecosystem has collapsed and all of the fruit flies are dead. Apocalypse. 

What this means is, organisms will continue their bid for survival as long as possible, using up as much resource as possible, and can only sustain their growth to the extent to which available resources (food, nutrients, etc) equals sustainable population.

Let's apply this to the planted aquarium:

*Micro-organisms:* Micro organisms will grow, such as those bacteria necessary for the Nitrogen Cycle, to the extent to which Ammonia is available, then Nitrite, and so on. 

This also applies to other beneficial bacteria which feed on other by-processes of plant and animal waste products, so on and so forth. 

Bacteria act as the purifying agent for the aquarium, it is their primary role to take toxic substances and turn them into live-able waste (of bacteria) products, which are then fed on by other bacteria or plants, etc. 

When Bacteria rapidly expand to the maximum limits of the environment, they take up all of the excess available, and will grow to approximately that level. 

So an aquarium with aqua soil leaching ammonia, will have an inherently higher level of nitrogen cycle bacteria than another aquarium without aqua soil. 

*Algae*: Algae tend to grow most prolifically in the presence of Ammonium in the water (which is a reason to want to cycle your aquarium as quickly as humanly possible), they also occur when imbalances occur.

For example, BBA will appear when there is a lack of Co2 and an abundance of other nutrients, which the plants cannot grow to support without the proper level of Co2. (Principle #2 is the Law of Minimums, so if there is a lack of Co2 and an abundance of fertilizers, it paves the way for nuisances like BBA, because all available Co2 is used, and there is an excess of other nutrients which are not being used by plants or micro-organisms).

_Why Principle #1 is important to algae growth_

Algae is like the fruit fly. They are relatively simple organisms and occupy a space on the evolutionary tree somewhere between super-simple micro-organisms and complex plants. 

*Algae also replicates quickly, invasively, and aggressively.*

A small amount of algae on day one, if left alone, could be a massive outbreak by day 3. 

Immediate action is required to eliminate these pests before they become huge problems.

This is huge, because *The number one reason why people give up, is because of too much algae*.

*Plants as the example*:

The best plants for aquascaping tend to be aquatic weeds. These guys can be pretty invasive and they will strive to cover as much ground, as quickly as possible over all the other competition.

A plant will grow and grow and grow and grow until it cannot grow anymore, even past the point of "healthy" growth, it'll continue to live on with half-dead growth going forward. 

_Let's evaluate Hair Grass:_

spreads via runners and heavy root systems which expand out in straight lines across the substrate. The runners pop up as many hair grass nodes as possible and just keep going before filling in totally. 

Hair grasses' strategy for choking out other plants is to have a root system so thick that nothing else can really compete on a root-level for nutrient uptake.

_Let's evaluate Glossostigma_

Glosso takes a similar approach, it will go up, of course, but it also tries to cover as much ground as possible via runners that go straight out from it's nodes. 

Glosso's invasive strategy is to just cover real estate as quickly as possible, and will do so even if it's growing in relatively thinly across the substrate. It'll then double back and start filling in from other runners going in opposite directions. Glosso mainly tries to uptake Co2 and "block" other plants via lots of thin growth in real estate.

_Hemianthus Callicthroides_:

HC on the other hand, grows in "zig-zags," it too, tries to cover as much real estate as possible, as quickly as possible, but rather than go wide and thin as quickly as possible, it "mounds" in one spot as quickly as possible while sending out runners that expand the territory inch by inch, which then mound and repeat the pattern.

HC will completely block the growth of other plants by simply making an impenetrable mound fortress. As an experiment, try placing a few sprigs of hair grass in the middle of a mound of HC, and another sprig away from the mound. 

The hairgrass away from the mound will spread quickly, while the hairgrass in the mound will slowly die or just stay steady with it's few nodes. 

_Marsilea Minuta_

Marsilea is probably the most vulnerable carpet out of the ones listed here. 

It will grow out in really really really straight lines across the substrate, unlike glosso it doesn't have a huge tendency to eventually double back. So it just keeps going straight out in one direction. This is a plant that when you start with this and another type you need to just plant a ratio of like 10 to 1 marsilea to other.

_Riccia_

Riccia doesn't spread by roots - so it's strategy for take over is to completely and utterly grow as quickly as humanly possible and 'detach,' and populate as many other areas in the aquarium as possible. 

It's strategy for winning the nutrient war is pure volume intake of nutrients and, when floating, to block out the light resources of the other plants. 

Consequently, because it has no roots, other plants, which grow in with Riccia have a much better chance of survival and rapid growth than others. 

*These are just a few examples of the Malthusian nature of all of the organisms in the planted aquarium.*


----------



## plantbrain

Francis Xavier said:


> Trimmed dwarf hair grass to the stub to eliminate emmersed growth.[/URL]
> 
> #4 trimmed any remaining dead growth.


*IME, hair grass emergent growth always gets algae and is sacrificed by the plant anyway, this should be standard fair for conversion to submersed growth.


----------



## @[email protected]

that growth is absolutely amazing. it usually takes me 2x that long to get a carpet going. i mean, riccia always grows very fast, but i could never coax that kind of growth out of HC. 
i think ill invest in some of that bacterial additive you put in the substrate, see if maybe thats the difference...


----------



## FlyingHellFish

My HC new growth is green and looking a lot better, thanks.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Happy Easter to everyone who celebrates it!


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> that growth is absolutely amazing. it usually takes me 2x that long to get a carpet going. i mean, riccia always grows very fast, but i could never coax that kind of growth out of HC.
> i think ill invest in some of that bacterial additive you put in the substrate, see if maybe thats the difference...


Thank you marko! Remember that the difference is likely the sum total of the whole technique / usage as well. 



FlyingHellFish said:


> My HC new growth is green and looking a lot better, thanks.


Great! I'm glad your carpet is turning around!


----------



## DTDPlanted

Francis Xavier said:


> Happy Easter to everyone who celebrates it!


Happy Easter Frank! I have a question for you. I have a 38gal deep tank (24"Dx31"L) which has been gathering dust for many years, I'm considering possibly planting it. However, since i have all that vertical space I'm wondering if you have seen anything using some sort of levels or natural shelves where more can be planted? I'm thinking some kind of fabricated natural stone looking shelf, or a great flat piece of stone cut to fit a corner, and placed about middle of the water column, or staggered. and then laying down substrate on it and planting it. Any experience with this? I would really like to see some pictures or DIY info if you know of any. 
Here is a crude attempt to explain my idea, LOL
|===_===|
| _|
|_ |
|_______ |


----------



## Ozydego

DTDP... what about a riparium? Less vertical space and two world to work in...


----------



## Francis Xavier

I was meditating earlier today. How do I further explain the benefits of "The Method," so you can see first hand what to do? The Method may seem complex, but is ultimately, very easy to understand. 

Many of you are already doing it to some extent, but not the full potential. 

I then thought to myself, "well, the most valuable learning tools have always been step-by-step journals." You can follow along through the troubles and tribulations, and see how things are responded to. 

*With this, I had an idea: What if I made a challenge?*

And with the idea of a challenge in mind, I've got the perfect learning tool. One which even I can't predict the outcome yet and here's why:

*I'm going to let you CHALLENGE me on a "low-tech," tank to prove the merits of The Method*

Here's the skinny:

I'm going to let TPT determine my next Nano Layout. The 'budget,' will be restricted and using The Method, the objective is to make a *stunning layout.*

So here's the parameters:

*You* decide what the plants will be.
*You* decide what the limitations on equipment will be.
*You* decide how much I can spend within reasoning.

The only thing I'll start with is a nano Rimless aquarium (since this has nothing to do with how the 'scape' turns out and the plants grow) and $50 maximum budget allowed to use at my discretion. 

With a popular consensus, I'll tackle the challenge, use the principles and techniques of The Method and we'll see firsthand together the results. 

*The direct objective is to create a "low-tech," tank which is set by current standards and show the effectiveness of The Method*.


----------



## mluk27

Very cool idea Frank, I think this will be a great contribution to the community.


----------



## Dollface

I want to see you do a manzanita driftwood lay out with petit, bolbitis or java fern, moss, a bunch of "beginner" stems that are readily available in the S&S at any given time, and a three plant mixed foreground with hair grass, glosso, and riccia.

You can only use AS + bacter 100 and clear super for the substrate
Brighty K + step 1 through 3 for ferts plus one liquid additive. 
DIY co2 only. 
Lighting is up to you, as long as there's an equivalent alternative fixture available for under 100$. Hard mode: you use a desk lamp. 
For kicks, I'm going to say you should use an aquaclear HOB filter, but you could cheat and just say that for the price of that + your 50$ you saved up for a 2211 instead :icon_roll
you only get to use one pair of scissors, and one pair of tweezers

Your total budget has to come out under 200-300$ if you were to buy everything new, hardscape and plants included, tank not included, with an itemized list of your costs.


----------



## freph

Dollface said:


> I want to see you do a manzanita driftwood lay out with petit, bolbitis or java fern, moss, a bunch of "beginner" stems that are readily available in the S&S at any given time, and a three plant mixed foreground with hair grass, glosso, and riccia.
> 
> You can only use AS + bacter 100 and clear super for the substrate
> Brighty K + step 1 through 3 for ferts plus one liquid additive.
> DIY co2 only.
> Lighting is up to you, as long as there's an equivalent alternative fixture available for under 100$. Hard mode: you use a desk lamp.
> For kicks, I'm going to say you should use an aquaclear HOB filter, but you could cheat and just say that for the price of that + your 50$ you saved up for a 2211 instead :icon_roll
> you only get to use one pair of scissors, and one pair of tweezers
> 
> Your total budget has to come out under 200-300$ if you were to buy everything new, hardscape and plants included, tank not included, with an itemized list of your costs.


If this is going to be a low tech budget tank then I think you could trim it down a bit more and be more stereotypical (that's the goal here, right?). For example, one of the popular low budget methods is to use organic potting soil and a sand cap. The desk lamp is perfect. HOB filter is even better.


----------



## Dollface

freph said:


> If this is going to be a low tech budget tank then I think you could trim it down a bit more and be more stereotypical (that's the goal here, right?). For example, one of the popular low budget methods is to use organic potting soil and a sand cap. The desk lamp is perfect. HOB filter is even better.


It's pretty obvious that his 50$ discretion was going to be used on AS + bacter 100 and clear super anyway, and I don't blame him. He's said as much right in the thread, that if you were to get the bare minimum, get those. 

TBH, there's not really any reason to use potting soil in nanos when AS is so readily available.


----------



## freph

Dollface said:


> It's pretty obvious that his 50$ discretion was going to be used on AS + bacter 100 and clear super anyway, and I don't blame him. He's said as much right in the thread, that if you were to get the bare minimum, get those.
> 
> TBH, there's not really any reason to use potting soil in nanos when AS is so readily available.


Doesn't matter if the AS is readily available or not, does it? Low tech is still low tech. I think there should be some more specifics about what this $50 discretion can and can't include. Rather, I think the entirety what we can suggest for him to use would be more adequate...


----------



## Dollface

freph said:


> Doesn't matter if the AS is readily available or not, does it? Low tech is still low tech. I think there should be some more specifics about what this $50 discretion can and can't include. Rather, I think the entirety what we can suggest for him to use would be more adequate...


Why can't AS be low tech? 

It's a hobby fallacy that "low tech" has to = Walstad NPT with dirt and ugly plants. If he really wanted to go low tech, he could just use inert. That's even cheaper and comes without a lot of the hassles of potting soil. Have you ever tried to look for potting soil for aquaria? I have, it's even MORE of a hassle to find than just ordering some AS and being done with it. That's not even getting into the ridiculous process of mineralized soil. Really, you only start seeing benefits with potting soil when you start getting into triple digits gallon wise. 

Part of the point of "the method" is to get it right the first time. How many successful and attractive nano tanks have you seen long term with potting soil? I've seen about none. How many tanks of varying "tech" level have you seen using AS? A whole lot.

What comes down to it, is it's his challenge, so if he wants 50$ to cover his bases against, well, having to use potting soil, those are his terms. I have no doubt that if TPT really had their way, it would end with forcing him to de-rim a 2.5 in a cave with a box of scraps.


----------



## frrok

Dollface said:


> Why can't AS be low tech?
> 
> It's a hobby fallacy that "low tech" has to = Walstad NPT with dirt and ugly plants. If he really wanted to go low tech, he could just use inert. That's even cheaper and comes without a lot of the hassles of potting soil. Have you ever tried to look for potting soil for aquaria? I have, it's even MORE of a hassle to find than just ordering some AS and being done with it. That's not even getting into the ridiculous process of mineralized soil. Really, you only start seeing benefits with potting soil when you start getting into triple digits gallon wise.
> 
> Part of the point of "the method" is to get it right the first time. How many successful and attractive nano tanks have you seen long term with potting soil? I've seen about none. How many tanks of varying "tech" level have you seen using AS? A whole lot.
> 
> What comes down to it, is it's his challenge, so if he wants 50$ to cover his bases against, well, having to use potting soil, those are his terms. I have no doubt that if TPT really had their way, it would end with forcing him to de-rim a 2.5 in a cave with a box of scraps.


I have one with dirt for almost a year and it looks decent, imo. But I agree that it is def a hassle if you don't do it right. I made mistakes for sure. but if your patient it can look really nice. And I can find the right kind of dirt very easily in home depot but i would have to order aquasoil online and pay for shipping. I live in nyc, cant get aquasoil in any LFS. 
But anyway, this sounds like a pretty good experiment. cant wait to see the result.


----------



## Dollface

frrok said:


> I have one with dirt for almost a year and it looks decent, imo. But I agree that it is def a hassle if you don't do it right. I made mistakes for sure. but if your patient it can look really nice. And I can find the right kind of dirt very easily in home depot but i would have to order aquasoil online and pay for shipping. I live in nyc, cant get aquasoil in any LFS.
> But anyway, this sounds like a pretty good experiment. cant wait to see the result.


Basically everyone who isn't in Houston, CA, or Hawaii has to order online as well, but a lot of people still use it for a reason. What you're 'saving' by buying potting soil, you're just paying for later with your time and energy by actually having to deal with potting soil.


----------



## frrok

Dollface said:


> Basically everyone who isn't in Houston, CA, or Hawaii has to order online as well, but a lot of people still use it for a reason. What you're 'saving' by buying potting soil, you're just paying for later with your time and energy by actually having to deal with potting soil.


I agree with you, thats why for my next tank I am going to use aquasoil. 

but anyway, i think what frank is doing is really interesting. curious on what he will use for this set up.


----------



## plantbrain

Dollface said:


> Why can't AS be low tech?
> 
> It's a hobby fallacy that "low tech" has to = Walstad NPT with dirt and ugly plants. If he really wanted to go low tech, he could just use inert. That's even cheaper and comes without a lot of the hassles of potting soil.


Very true, not sure why more folks have not done the low tech non CO2, but the method itself attracts cheap scapes, while ADA attracts fan boys/girls that have little issue spending 300-500$ for a 5 gal tank.

Few...... there are exceptions...........cheap scapes tend to do well with scaping. They simply do not have as much invested in it. Set and let it done its thing, it it survives and looks decent, great. I've seen maybe 1 out 100. 1% is rare. There is a certain type of person that GENERALLY is attracted to various products and styles. There is also a whole group that tries to copy everything ADA with knock off brands or DIY ADA. My stands and tanks all fall into this group. The ADA soil does not.

ADA AS and soil/potting soil, clay loams etc, are NOT the same thing aesthetically and how they are used, they might contain similar nutrients/grow plants the same even, but a sand cap is not something I've liked much. In some set ups where aesthetic sand is used, desired, then sure.


----------



## NyteBlade

I just wanted to chime and say so far this has been a really awesome read. Regardless of whether you agree with every word or not, these types of journals with wisdom (and eyecandy) I feel really add to our community.

I'm cheap. Back in high school, I mixed neon blue gravel with eco-complete. It was a disaster and I sincerely hope the pictures have been burnt. After 6+ years in the hobby, I haven't had a tank without an algae meltdown of some sort. The difference is when I first started, I just figured that "algae happens", and now I know exactly the reason why and I can assign blame to myself. :icon_wink

As I've gained aquarium experience, I've started to do things more on feel than based on rigorous calculation and research. I've had far less algae when I switched to aquasoil from flourite, so I'm more apt to try the complete ADA substrate system in the future. I don't want to start a debate, but it's important to remember our hobby is very much an intersection of science and art. It's okay to want scientific evidence for something or debate on a scientific level, but it's also okay to do something that works for you even if there isn't quantifiable scientific evidence to back up your claim. 

I've become a bit more "zen" as time has gone on too (sorry if I completely misused "zen"...). I'm less inclined to start a plant farm tank, and more inclined to create a well-executed aquascape. I'm a bit of an iwagumi fan, and while only getting to try a few different plants takes some adjustment, there's a certain peacefulness in keeping things simple. Granted all of my aquascapes are rather lackluster, I still enjoy it. If/when I graduate and get a "real" job, I could very well go on a drunken aquarium spending bender...


----------



## Francis Xavier

Dollface said:


> I want to see you do a manzanita driftwood lay out with petit, bolbitis or java fern, moss, a bunch of "beginner" stems that are readily available in the S&S at any given time, and a three plant mixed foreground with hair grass, glosso, and riccia.
> 
> You can only use AS + bacter 100 and clear super for the substrate
> Brighty K + step 1 through 3 for ferts plus one liquid additive.
> DIY co2 only.
> Lighting is up to you, as long as there's an equivalent alternative fixture available for under 100$. Hard mode: you use a desk lamp.
> For kicks, I'm going to say you should use an aquaclear HOB filter, but you could cheat and just say that for the price of that + your 50$ you saved up for a 2211 instead :icon_roll
> you only get to use one pair of scissors, and one pair of tweezers
> 
> Your total budget has to come out under 200-300$ if you were to buy everything new, hardscape and plants included, tank not included, with an itemized list of your costs.





freph said:


> If this is going to be a low tech budget tank then I think you could trim it down a bit more and be more stereotypical (that's the goal here, right?). For example, one of the popular low budget methods is to use organic potting soil and a sand cap. The desk lamp is perfect. HOB filter is even better.


Let's start hammering out these details that can be agreed upon.

1.) No canister filter
2.) Let's just go ahead and say no Aqua Soil for kicks and grins. I'm up for a challenge. 
3.) obviously, no pressurized co2

Under this plan, what I would then suggest is I'm not going to use potting soil. Defaulting to this strategy is infinitely more hassle to deal with than not, and isn't something I'd recommend in any event. With a no Aqua Soil plan, I would immediately go to saying "okay, so the substrate can be inert."

For plants right now we've got on the list:

Glosso
Riccia
Anubias Nana Petite
Bolbitus or Java Fern
Moss
Stems readily available on the market

Let's hear some more input!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Back to the Mini-M for a bit:

Day 23:







_Right Side

_



_More Right Side

_There isn't a whole much more to talk about this tank. 3 weeks and I'm more or less done with the hard work part. 

I may switch out the "true," willow moss on the right with a different variety - originally was looking for what Amano calls "willow moss," which tends to actually be what we call Christmas or Peacock Moss. Now that I have some, The switch will be made.

There's a bit of a brown and green algae out break and the diffuser needs a cleaning tonight (overdue a bit). 

I'm not worried about the Brown and Green Algae, the Amano's and the ocat i'll add will take care of it - these are the types of algae's you -hope- for.

The layout isn't done yet, but we'll switch the segment more and more over to trimming and cultivation as it grows in. 

Fish will be soon. Maybe even today depending on a few inbound fish shipments.


----------



## plantbrain

Francis Xavier said:


> Let's start hammering out these details that can be agreed upon.
> 
> 1.) No canister filter
> 2.) Let's just go ahead and say no Aqua Soil for kicks and grins. I'm up for a challenge.
> 3.) obviously, no pressurized co2
> 
> Under this plan, what I would then suggest is I'm not going to use potting soil. Defaulting to this strategy is infinitely more hassle to deal with than not, and isn't something I'd recommend in any event. With a no Aqua Soil plan, I would immediately go to saying "okay, so the substrate can be inert."
> 
> For plants right now we've got on the list:
> 
> Glosso
> Riccia
> Anubias Nana Petite
> Bolbitus or Java Fern
> Moss
> Stems readily available on the market
> 
> Let's hear some more input!


How about some free rice paddy clay soil? Has the same nutrient profile as ADA AS less the NH4.


----------



## @[email protected]

im curious, has anyone ever use aquasoil to cap MTS? 
i was thinking about my next tank (still a year away, but IMO planning it is half the fun), and remember reading somewhere that MTS provides nutrients longer than AS, which means the substrate would last longer on root tabs (after it begins to decline in nutrient value) before finally biting the dust. 
also, the MTS, if used right after finishing the mineralization, would provide an additional inoculation of bacteria, as it should be teaming with them.
any thoughts frank?

btw i keep staring at that HC in awe.


----------



## freph

Inert substrate sounds good to me. I agree soil is a hassle. Also, I swear this tank reminds me of the Mayan maps on Age of Empires II the way the stone and slightly overgrown look is. That piece of E. tenellus is perfect btw.


----------



## zoragen

Is the CO2 critical?

In an earlier post Frank said it was. 

I'm never going to use CO2 as I just don't want to get into the chemistry/mechanics of DIY or the expense (& mechanics) of a "real" system.

For many people it's a simple "thing" & no big deal to set up. It would be for me.

Other than than the CO2, I second Dollface's suggestions.

Very cool idea Frank:biggrin:


----------



## carpalstunna

zoragen said:


> Is the CO2 critical?
> 
> In an earlier post Frank said it was.


Yes if you read this thread you will see frank talks about everything in the tank working together using his methods. CO2 is a piece of that. I will say as someone that has done tanks both ways, you will never have a consistently good tank without it. 

CO2 is not difficult or expensive. DIY is not hard, no real need to be a chemist, and pressurized isnt that expensive. The amount of additional plant growth you will have will 1. save you money by not continuously killing and buying plants. 2. Probably make you enough money to pay for the time or money you invest in it, by selling your excess growth in the SnS. 
It is not difficult to setup a pressurized system for less than 100 dollars. If your tank is smaller start with DIY and save your money for pressurized.


----------



## Francis Xavier

So, here's a good exercise for this challenge:

How do we define "Low-Tech" 

Is it a reference to light?
To budget?
To equipment?
To plants?

What can we agree on as a something that is "low-tech," and what options are there?

Does Low-Tech mean no co2? does it mean co2, but cheap co2? does it mean dirt, does it mean inert soil? 

As you follow this line of questions, it will become apparent the point moving forward. 

_Here's another gem of an idea! Why not participate *with *me in the challenge so you can learn more, have a great tank and see first hand your own results!_


----------



## Storm

Francis Xavier said:


> *Moral:* do not waste your time with the NPT. It's a nifty high-school experiment, but that's about it.


This is why reading this thread is painful. There is no need to ridicule a method that is different than yours, yet equally effective.

The tank below requires zero maintenance. No water changes, fertilization, or any chemicals, only top off due to evaporation. Some might say it looks better than your tank, but it's just a matter of personal preference.



Why not just tell us about your method, rather than ridiculing other methods?


----------



## carpalstunna

Storm said:


> This is why reading this thread is painful. There is no need to ridicule a method that is different than yours, yet equally effective.
> 
> The tank below requires zero maintenance. No water changes, fertilization, or any chemicals, only top off due to evaporation. Some might say it looks better than your tank, but it's just a matter of personal preference.
> 
> 
> 
> Why not just tell us about your method, rather than ridiculing other methods?


Well, I think he has some right, as I doubt that level of growth was achieved in 23 days as franks was. So his method is in fact more effective. Also since you are doing NO water changes and NO fertilizers there is a question of sustainability. What will happen once the AS becomes depleted? Where will the plants get the nutrients necessary to grow?


----------



## Storm

carpalstunna said:


> Well, I think he has some right, as I doubt that level of growth was achieved in 23 days as franks was. So his method is in fact more effective. Also since you are doing NO water changes and NO fertilizers there is a question of sustainability. What will happen once the AS becomes depleted? Where will the plants get the nutrients necessary to grow?


The tank above is a dirt tank, so I would imagine it will last like that indefinitely; much longer than a typical high tech tank. The tank above is not mine.

Personally, I am a high tech person. I have an ADA 60P and I'm quite pleased overall with ADA products. However, I don't claim that ADA has a monopoly on all planted tank knowledge, and people using ADA methods could learn a lot from NPT, and vice versa.

I just don't see the point in ridiculing another method as a "high school experiment," when clearly, the results speak for themselves, and are equally beautiful to look at.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Storm said:


> This is why reading this thread is painful. There is no need to ridicule a method that is different than yours, yet equally effective.
> 
> The tank below requires zero maintenance. No water changes, fertilization, or any chemicals, only top off due to evaporation. Some might say it looks better than your tank, but it's just a matter of personal preference.
> 
> Why not just tell us about your method, rather than ridiculing other methods?


My friend,

We share the same thought process. I would encourage you to continue reading past that statement, in which you would find the final point behind that line of thinking (which I referenced in the first post starting that series to bear with me until the end). 

Yes, I will bash the 'low-tech,' method, the 'high-tech,' method, the 'NPT method,' the 'ADA method,' and 'EI dosing method.'

Why? Because there are no separate methods! They are all the _same method!_ An argument between the different 'methods,' is a silly, silly argument and has no place in a discussion.

*The reason:* these 'methods,' only describe *equipment*, rather than process. 

The function of the planted aquarium - how plants grow and thrive is the same regardless. *That's the point!

*So, by following the principles of The Method, you can more or less achieve a beautiful aquarium regardless of what equipment you are using. 

Refer here, to the final statement of that line of logic. 

Aside from that, that tank isn't an NPT!

NPT's use no filtration and no artificial lighting. The problem is, there is no such thing as an infinitely self-sustaining planted aquarium.


----------



## Ach1Ll3sH33L

My vote is to use aquasoil in the low-tech(w/o the powders), or if your going for the readily available products approach, azoo plant grower or fluval stratum, any kind of nutrient rich pellet substrate. I think the idea of the journal should be, not to do what we've seen done here and fail several times over like Tom has said, with a very small percentage of success. But if you want to go non c02, low light and h.o.b, what are the key components that will make this setup WORK! Having a good substrate is IME the most vital component in a 'low-tech' and i think your journal should express that.


----------



## Dollface

Storm said:


> The tank above is a dirt tank, so I would imagine it will last like that indefinitely; much longer than a typical high tech tank. The tank above is not mine.


Even dirt is eventually going to be depleted of nutrients. Nothing lasts "indefinitely". There's always going to be a set amount of energy present in a system, and once that energy is used up, it's not going to spontaneously generate more without outside interference. A tank like that with moss/anubia/java ferns will indeed last a lot longer than a "high tech" tank, if only for the sake of it grows at 1/10th the rate. 

If it's not your tank, do you have a source for it, with permission to post the photos?


----------



## talontsiawd

carpalstunna said:


> Well, I think he has some right, as I doubt that level of growth was achieved in 23 days as franks was. So his method is in fact more effective. Also since you are doing NO water changes and NO fertilizers there is a question of sustainability. What will happen once the AS becomes depleted? Where will the plants get the nutrients necessary to grow?


I agree with growth 100%. I feel like I get "tolerable" growth in many of my tanks. 

However, sustainability is a different thing. I have had many non-co2, minimal water change tanks. Some are totally inert. If you have a plan, it can be totally sustainable for...I don't know, I get bored or have to tear it down well before I see the slightest bit of issues.


----------



## Chlorophile

So is the challenge to do something hard or something easy? 
Low-Tech is the easiest thing for me, but it is because I use safe plant choices.

Either way I'd say just use Aquasoil, no powders, additives, etc.

Dirt tanks aren't very fun in the long run, so I vote against that. 

Easy Proposal:

Substrate: Just aquasoil
Light: Whatever you want
Co2: none
Plants: HM as a carpet + whatever plants someone else might think would be good. Or ferns + anubias - because that is as easy as it gets. 
Hardscape: Whatever you want


Difficult Proposal: (This one is hard to even come up with because low-tech with aquasoil is always easy and its benefits are even more profound in the long run in low-tech tanks with bi-weekly or monthly water changes) 


If you wan't something hard you could do Eco Complete or Flourite but I think demonstrating how easy it is to do a great tank with nothing more than Aquasoil is a great thing to demonstrate. 


I'd vote against any ferns bolbitis blah blah. 
It is easy and overdone. 
I see many tanks with very dim light and loads of ferns and they are stable and quite boring, IMO.


----------



## talontsiawd

Francis Xavier said:


> Let's start hammering out these details that can be agreed upon.
> 
> 1.) No canister filter
> 2.) Let's just go ahead and say no Aqua Soil for kicks and grins. I'm up for a challenge.
> 3.) obviously, no pressurized co2


I agree with the filter. I would say an Aquaclear of the appropriate size would be good.

Substrate could be anything. I think Flourite at best (or similar), Petco gravel at worst.

Co2, I would say try not using it. It actually can be fun. The only thing that I personally find to be more challenging is carpet plants. 



I am almost thinking a standard 10 gallon with an incandescent hood. Then throw 2 13 watt CFL's or similar. Add substrate of your choice. 


I may be willing to go along for the ride and try the same. I have to see if my old 10 gallon is still holding water. I have the light, I would just used Petco gravel. I just need a filter.


----------



## Bannik

Francis Xavier said:


> So, here's a good exercise for this challenge:
> 
> How do we define "Low-Tech"
> 
> Is it a reference to light?
> To budget?
> To equipment?
> To plants?
> 
> What can we agree on as a something that is "low-tech," and what options are there?
> 
> Does Low-Tech mean no co2? does it mean co2, but cheap co2? does it mean dirt, does it mean inert soil?
> 
> As you follow this line of questions, it will become apparent the point moving forward.
> 
> _Here's another gem of an idea! Why not participate *with *me in the challenge so you can learn more, have a great tank and see first hand your own results!_


"The home aquarium is an ecosystem always on the verge of collapse."

This fits in with your description of all living aspects of the planted tank being Malthusian.

That is what I have in mind when I'm building my tanks/nanos/bowls.

The difference between a low tech tank and a high tech tank has nothing to do with budget. It is what you use as the limiting factor for those Malthusian components in your tank.

With "High Tech" tanks the goal is to provide more than enough light and nutrients to grow your scape. The limiting factor is CO2. You are spot on with your many points that cost should not be your limiting factor if you wish to go for a tank like this.

With "Low Tech" tanks the goal is to use lighting as the limiting factor. You can absolutely use Aquasoil for a tank like this, you can also use top of the line equipment and have CO2 and still be a "low tech" tank.

I think Tom made a key observation about the type of people attracted to each method.

Back to my earlier quote. A high tech tank consumes quickly, grows quickly, and can go wrong and be fixed quickly. A Low tech tank, consumes slowly, grows slowly, and goes wrong slowly and gets fixed slowly.

The biggest problem people following the "high tech" method run into is not paying due diligence to balance and maintenance. Your insight into this has been amazing.

The biggest problem people run into with "Low Tech" is too much light and cutting corners with fertilizers, water changes and refusing to use CO2 when necessary to rescue a tank they've let be neglected too long. (cheapskates)


----------



## Francis Xavier

*I've got a dirty secret.* I've got to admit it now. 

In fact, you could call it:

An Ulterior Motive

You see, year after year I chronically see less and less and less Americans placing highly in the IAPLC. Yet, I continue to see relative growth in the hobby here. 

Yes, the hobby expands far in Japan, China, SE Asia, Europe, etc. Regular conventions with large planted aquaria expo's. 

See, I have a hidden intention to this thread. 

*My motive is to help encourage as many people as humanly possible to be badass aquascapers.*

I want you to learn from my mistakes. From your mistakes, from other's mistakes. 

_*I want an American to win the IAPLC.*_

It's my gut feeling that the person who will one day win this competition is right here, reading this thread. 

That's why I say there's only The Method. The one method that works, in which all others are derivative. 

So, take from this everything you can, follow along with your own aquarium and cast off the unnecessary clutter in your mind, and let's get off to the races. 

_Don't be disheartened by failure, every one of us will always have more failures than successes. They define our success._


----------



## Francis Xavier

talontsiawd said:


> I agree with the filter. I would say an Aquaclear of the appropriate size would be good.
> 
> Substrate could be anything. I think Flourite at best (or similar), Petco gravel at worst.
> 
> Co2, I would say try not using it. It actually can be fun. The only thing that I personally find to be more challenging is carpet plants.
> 
> 
> 
> I am almost thinking a standard 10 gallon with an incandescent hood. Then throw 2 13 watt CFL's or similar. Add substrate of your choice.
> 
> 
> I may be willing to go along for the ride and try the same. I have to see if my old 10 gallon is still holding water. I have the light, I would just used Petco gravel. I just need a filter.


Hey Matt,

I was hoping you'd chime in on the CHALLENGE, and I would welcome you to join in with me with open arms!



Chlorophile said:


> So is the challenge to do something hard or something easy?
> Low-Tech is the easiest thing for me, but it is because I use safe plant choices.
> 
> Either way I'd say just use Aquasoil, no powders, additives, etc.
> 
> Dirt tanks aren't very fun in the long run, so I vote against that.
> 
> Easy Proposal:
> 
> Substrate: Just aquasoil
> Light: Whatever you want
> Co2: none
> Plants: HM as a carpet + whatever plants someone else might think would be good. Or ferns + anubias - because that is as easy as it gets.
> Hardscape: Whatever you want
> 
> 
> Difficult Proposal: (This one is hard to even come up with because low-tech with aquasoil is always easy and its benefits are even more profound in the long run in low-tech tanks with bi-weekly or monthly water changes)
> 
> 
> If you wan't something hard you could do Eco Complete or Flourite but I think demonstrating how easy it is to do a great tank with nothing more than Aquasoil is a great thing to demonstrate.
> 
> 
> I'd vote against any ferns bolbitis blah blah.
> It is easy and overdone.
> I see many tanks with very dim light and loads of ferns and they are stable and quite boring, IMO.


It's not so much going for easy or hard, rather something that is a cool and desirable scape.

To be honest with you: if driftwood is to play a role, then of course a Java Fern Trident and some Anubias would be a great addition for the role they play in the scape.

However, the overriding goal is to have a carpet going here. And not a moss carpet. Moss will be used with driftwood - but to the extent to which it's tied to the driftwood. 

The balance of plants with a composition is just as important to the CHALLENGE as it is to grow the plants into the full form of the scape. 

I'm envisioning the use of stem plants, of course.



Ach1Ll3sH33L said:


> My vote is to use aquasoil in the low-tech(w/o the powders), or if your going for the readily available products approach, azoo plant grower or fluval stratum, any kind of nutrient rich pellet substrate. I think the idea of the journal should be, not to do what we've seen done here and fail several times over like Tom has said, with a very small percentage of success. But if you want to go non c02, low light and h.o.b, what are the key components that will make this setup WORK! Having a good substrate is IME the most vital component in a 'low-tech' and i think your journal should express that.


Good feedback! Of course the ultimate objective here is to have something duplicatable by just about anyone.



Bannik said:


> "The home aquarium is an ecosystem always on the verge of collapse."
> 
> This fits in with your description of all living aspects of the planted tank being Malthusian.
> 
> That is what I have in mind when I'm building my tanks/nanos/bowls.
> 
> The difference between a low tech tank and a high tech tank has nothing to do with budget. It is what you use as the limiting factor for those Malthusian components in your tank.
> 
> With "High Tech" tanks the goal is to provide more than enough light and nutrients to grow your scape. The limiting factor is CO2. You are spot on with your many points that cost should not be your limiting factor if you wish to go for a tank like this.
> 
> With "Low Tech" tanks the goal is to use lighting as the limiting factor. You can absolutely use Aquasoil for a tank like this, you can also use top of the line equipment and have CO2 and still be a "low tech" tank.
> 
> I think Tom made a key observation about the type of people attracted to each method.
> 
> Back to my earlier quote. A high tech tank consumes quickly, grows quickly, and can go wrong and be fixed quickly. A Low tech tank, consumes slowly, grows slowly, and goes wrong slowly and gets fixed slowly.
> 
> The biggest problem people following the "high tech" method run into is not paying due diligence to balance and maintenance. Your insight into this has been amazing.
> 
> The biggest problem people run into with "Low Tech" is too much light and cutting corners with fertilizers, water changes and refusing to use CO2 when necessary to rescue a tank they've let be neglected too long. (cheapskates)


Your mind is absolutely in the right place here. You are seeing how there's really no difference between "tech's" one just exchanges factors, but the basic formula and method is the same.

Execution and strategy has variation to it that equipment plays a role in, but otherwise the same methodology applies. 

There are a few limitations between strategies and equipment, but the message here is that by and large one does not guarantee success and the other does not guarantee failure. They are only tools for us to use.


----------



## dantra

Hello Frank, I finally found some time to post. As far as I'm concerned your "How To" should be a sticky. The information found here is invaluable to beginners, intermediate and advanced individuals alike. I'm sure there will be many who will never admit to incorporating something from your write up into their scape but we know different.

I have to admit that's one heck of challenge, you must be glutton for punishment :biggrin: by the way, I posted updated photos of Connors tank just so you can see what he is up to. He is having the time of his life with the aquarium. No algae and lush growth, just like you talked about.

Dan


----------



## mcqueenesq

I'm game.


----------



## talontsiawd

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Matt,
> 
> I was hoping you'd chime in on the CHALLENGE, and I would welcome you to join in with me with open arms!


I pulled out my old 10 gallon. Going as "low tech", "cheap ass", etc, etc. 

I am by no means trying to prove you wrong, not that I know it will work, I just thought it would be fun. If it works, cool. It's still not as fun as a high tech tank, and I don't recommend what I am doing, but if it works out, it is just an example. I plan to buy a lot of ADA stuff after my record comes out or I have a hot streak with selling instrumentals (I am a musician for a living right now, kind of rough for me lol).

Here is the thread... http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/planted-nano-tanks/172247-low-tech-i-can-go-10-a.html#post1812060

We will see how that works over time.


----------



## Francis Xavier

You may not know what this is, but those of you who do know how awesome this is:



_Picking this full setup up tomorrow_

Kicking it old school baby.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

^ What is that? Never seen an ADA product like that, is it lights and just the tank?

A few suggestions, there a whole lot of post and it gets time consuming trying to get up to speed, can you just leave the current status or a post marker so people can refer back to.


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Matt,
> 
> I was hoping you'd chime in on the CHALLENGE, and I would welcome you to join in with me with open arms!
> 
> 
> 
> It's not so much going for easy or hard, rather something that is a cool and desirable scape.
> 
> To be honest with you: if driftwood is to play a role, then of course a Java Fern Trident and some Anubias would be a great addition for the role they play in the scape.
> 
> However, the overriding goal is to have a carpet going here. And not a moss carpet. Moss will be used with driftwood - but to the extent to which it's tied to the driftwood.
> 
> The balance of plants with a composition is just as important to the CHALLENGE as it is to grow the plants into the full form of the scape.
> 
> I'm envisioning the use of stem plants, of course.
> 
> 
> 
> Good feedback! Of course the ultimate objective here is to have something duplicatable by just about anyone.
> 
> 
> 
> Your mind is absolutely in the right place here. You are seeing how there's really no difference between "tech's" one just exchanges factors, but the basic formula and method is the same.
> 
> Execution and strategy has variation to it that equipment plays a role in, but otherwise the same methodology applies.
> 
> There are a few limitations between strategies and equipment, but the message here is that by and large one does not guarantee success and the other does not guarantee failure. They are only tools for us to use.


ill join in too, if youll have me.
i always see bettas kept in barebottom jars, or in unscaped tanks with just some anubias and hornwort thrown in. im sick of it.
i will build not just a betta tank, but a low-light divided betta barracks, from a 5.5 gal. and by god, im going to scape the little 4x8 plots, and make them look good (or eat my words :biggrin.


----------



## Seattle_Aquarist

Francis Xavier said:


> You may not know what this is, but those of you who do know how awesome this is:
> 
> 
> 
> _Picking this full setup up tomorrow_
> 
> Kicking it old school baby.


Hi Frank,

Nice looking setup! 

BTW, you are way too young to be "Kicking it old school" lol


----------



## pejerrey

francis xavier said:


> that's why i say there's only the method. The one method that works, in which all others are derivative.


 the fx method?


----------



## pejerrey

pejerrey said:


> the fx method?


I guess I'm out of the challenge with my non ferts, non co2, akadama soil 6 gal because I use a canister.... Boooo


----------



## FlyingGiraffes

Vintage ADA, must be a hipster.


----------



## roybot73

Sweet setup. Wish the "Green Glow" fixtures were still in production. I'll bet that that fixture was used on most, if not all of the 60-P setups throughout the entire "Nature Aquarium World" series. Good stuff.
You score that from Jeff?


----------



## zoragen

Can't wait to see your tank marko. 

I started my foray into planted tanks w/ a 6 gal eclipse for a betta. 

Fluorite base & a few plants (crypts, sword, dwarf sag) & minimal ferts.

It's now my quarantine tank - soon to be just a place for a few plants. Which means it will probably become a betta tank again:icon_smil


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just a small update for right now, as I'm enjoying the Mini M. Without sounding too cliche, it has a 'zen' relaxation for me at the end of a long day.





I added some Amano's which I ordered about 400 of that came straight from Japan. They're the ideal small size and are vigorously eating algae. I have about 300 extra after dispersing them into various tanks. If you need some Amano's I can let em go for $2.25 / ea or 10 for $20 + shipping. Send me a PM, since this isn't a sales thread. 




roybot73 said:


> Sweet setup. Wish the "Green Glow" fixtures were still in production. I'll bet that that fixture was used on most, if not all of the 60-P setups throughout the entire "Nature Aquarium World" series. Good stuff.
> You score that from Jeff?


The whole system was a gift from my great friend, Luis Navarro. He was downsizing his aquariums at home.

The old Green Glow / NA style 60-P is something I've wanted for a long time for it's sentimental value. While technology has moved on, this particular setup was the quintessential ADA system until the Solar I replaced the Green Glow, and was the foundation for what we have today.


----------



## Lludu

Francis Xavier said:


> So here's the parameters:
> *You* decide what the plants will be.
> *You* decide what the limitations on equipment will be.
> *You* decide how much I can spend within reasoning.
> 
> The only thing I'll start with is a nano Rimless aquarium (since this has nothing to do with how the 'scape' turns out and the plants grow) and $50 maximum budget allowed to use at my discretion.
> *The direct objective is to create a "low-tech," tank which is set by current standards and show the effectiveness of The Method*.



*Plants:* Java Ferns, Mosses, Anubias, Crypts

*Equipment:* HoB Filters (or one of the following Canisters: 2211/13, Zoomed, Toms Rapid), Lighting Fixture under $80, No Pressurized Co2 - Only Flourish/Excel (Liquid Co2), No other additives (unless it is part of your discretionary funds). Eco-Complete, Akadama, AquaSoil, or Fluval Stratums

*Pricing:* Maximum of $300


I think that will make a very nice low tech tank... thats how I run my tanks and I love them... lets see what you can do with that...


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Just a small update for right now, as I'm enjoying the Mini M. Without sounding too cliche, it has a 'zen' relaxation for me at the end of a long day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I added some Amano's which I ordered about 400 of that came straight from Japan. They're the ideal small size and are vigorously eating algae. I have about 300 extra after dispersing them into various tanks. If you need some Amano's I can let em go for $2.25 / ea or 10 for $20 + shipping. Send me a PM, since this isn't a sales thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The whole system was a gift from my great friend, Luis Navarro. He was downsizing his aquariums at home.
> 
> The old Green Glow / NA style 60-P is something I've wanted for a long time for it's sentimental value. While technology has moved on, this particular setup was the quintessential ADA system until the Solar I replaced the Green Glow, and was the foundation for what we have today.


Do the Amanos from Japan stay smaller than the one that you can typically get from a lfs? 

Just a comment on the relaxing effect of aquariums. I absolutely love this aspect. There is nothing better than coming home to a beautful aquascape. Especially one in the nature aquarium style. Even in my "low tech" Or non-co2 tanks I try to achieve as much of a balance as possible and try to envoke a natural environment. This is very important to me. It's especially important to undertstand some of the philosophy.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'll be honest. I was a bit frustrated with how the true "willow" moss is growing in. It just doesn't have the growing patterns that I'm looking for. In a word, I need something that will accrue mass rather than spread like it's Marsilea Minuta for the effect I want. 

So, I took to the task of tying new moss (peacock moss from Dollface) to stones and replacing the willow moss.



_A little surprised at the growth rate there._



_New full tank shot_



You can really see how much brighter the layout got with the new moss replacement.

Admittedly, I did keep some of the other willow moss in the back to keep a barrier for the hair grass.



frrok said:


> Do the Amanos from Japan stay smaller than the one that you can typically get from a lfs?
> 
> Just a comment on the relaxing effect of aquariums. I absolutely love this aspect. There is nothing better than coming home to a beautful aquascape. Especially one in the nature aquarium style. Even in my "low tech" Or non-co2 tanks I try to achieve as much of a balance as possible and try to envoke a natural environment. This is very important to me. It's especially important to undertstand some of the philosophy.


They will eventually get larger. But getting them while they're smaller size is primo since they'll eat more algae than the larger / older guys. Of course the females are always huge and the males stay smaller.


----------



## Francis Xavier

A side note: all that hc and riccia was looser plant growth from dead or dying particles still in the substrate. Amano's act as a sort of trimming force for weaker plants too. I was far too lazy to remove those from the filter last night.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'd like to share a special event with you all today:

It is the 20th anniversary of Aqua Design Amano's corporate history.

On this day, April 12, 1992, Aqua Design Amano was officially incorporated in Japan. Of course, Aqua Design Amano was originally founded in 1980 by Takashi Amano when he was only 26 years old! Until 1992 it was a privately held small firm, when, upon release of Nature Aquarium World, the company went incorporated and began it's global expansion. 

Since that time, it's been a hell of a ride for the hobby - it's seen many things come and go. The advent of the internet has spread it farther than any other singular means before, and with it, the message of the planted aquarium. 

I'd like to share with you the following story:

*A story of Takashi Amano's childhood:*

In the post-war days in Japan there were no refrigerators, so people who lived in the interior couldn't eat fresh seafood. As children, we often caught carp for our families, especially in my home town where we had large expanses of wetlands. 

Our fishing method was a primitive one: we would scoop the water along the banks with a net that was tied to a bamboo pole! Of course, there was always the more dangerous approach, where we would dam up the ends of a big submerged pipe, empty out the water with buckets and then climb in to get fish, hishi, lotus and other plants. What we brought home to our families from these trips was an important source of protein back in those days. 

The catch was always evenly divided, using a fair method of rock-paper-scissors. However, if we had the fortune of coming across a colorful tanago (bitterling) or goby, one of us would always enthusiastically give up our entire share of the catch for the privilege of bringing home this living beauty.

The lucky boy would lovingly carry the fish home in one of the rubber shoes we all wore in those days. The shoe would be filled with water for the fish, for the two kilometer (1.25 miles) walk home. The road was so stony that it would leave bloody blisters on the boy's feet. 

The feet would make it, bloody as they were, but the fish, due to heat and lack of oxygen never made it home alive. I was scolded many times for coming home empty-handed this way.

There were many plants in the wetlands that resembled the two-temple and Hygrophila that I use today in my aqua scapes. The abundant plants (sasabanohiromo, mizuoobako (ottelia) Matsumo, and mizuwarabi) were a beautiful sight in the water. 

When I finally broke some of these plants off and stuffed them into my shoes, the fish, amazingly, survived the trip home!

_Many of my layouts come from childhood memories like this one._

*In honor of the 20th anniversary*, and due to people asking me, I have a limited quantity of open substrate additives (Bacter 100, Clear Super, Tourmaline BC, Penac P and W), which I can portion together in mixed bags for uses on 5-20 gallon tanks for $25 ($32 shipped) while my supply lasts. You can pm me for details if you'd like to try them.


----------



## @[email protected]

is that from one of his books? i remember reading that somewhere.

pmed about the substrate additives.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I just added a table of contents of some of the most noteworthy articles here. 

There are 28 unique, fully fledged articles on mastery of the planted aquarium.

I only selected the most useful posts to feature here in the table of contents - points of interest and particular areas of valuable information for future reference.

Can you believe it! *28 articles* from one aquarium. That's more than most informational booklets, blogs and forum threads get over a life time and it's only _been three weeks_.

Truly, you can improve your aquascaping and planting skills immensely just by using this thread as an informational source.




@[email protected] said:


> is that from one of his books? i remember reading that somewhere.
> 
> pmed about the substrate additives.


Yes, the story was from the original Nature Aquarium World book - which I edited and rewrote to modernize the language.


----------



## pejerrey

Lludu said:


> *Plants:* Java Ferns, Mosses, Anubias, Crypts
> 
> *Equipment:* HoB Filters (or one of the following Canisters: 2211/13, Zoomed, Toms Rapid), Lighting Fixture under $80, No Pressurized Co2 - Only Flourish/Excel (Liquid Co2), No other additives (unless it is part of your discretionary funds). Eco-Complete, Akadama, AquaSoil, or Fluval Stratums
> 
> *Pricing:* Maximum of $300
> 
> 
> I think that will make a very nice low tech tank... thats how I run my tanks and I love them... lets see what you can do with that...


Sorry, I need to ask:

is the tank i posted before a "low tech" then? -Confused-

*What's in it:*
- 15x9x10. ~6 gallon.
- Eheim 2213 Rated 50 gal. max. Running a diy UGF 
-planted Cascade 200 HOB filter with activated carbon and fluval media and fluval sponge pre filter.. Rated 50 gal. max.
- Internal heater.
- Some fissidens, lots of limnophila, and a nice sized farm of the coveted mini-Xmas moss, lobelia cardinalis, red cabomba, dwarf anubias, etc. 
- Archaea 27x2 10,000k light fixture 
- yamaya Rocks
-akadama double red line substrate
- Only DI water.
- No ferts, no CO2/excel.
- 1CPO, 12+SS CRS and many Fire Reds


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> ill join in too, if youll have me.
> i always see bettas kept in barebottom jars, or in unscaped tanks with just some anubias and hornwort thrown in. im sick of it.
> i will build not just a betta tank, but a low-light divided betta barracks, from a 5.5 gal. and by god, im going to scape the little 4x8 plots, and make them look good (or eat my words :biggrin.


Great Marko! The important lesson isn't so much to focus on being low-tech, as it is an exercise in methodology. Whether it is "high-tech," or "low-tech," (as we discussed, this only applies to describing equipment, not plants or method) the exact same patterns, scaping and growing methods are the same.

The only difference is a few small details (relative to the larger picture).

Start out with as many plants as possible!



Seattle_Aquarist said:


> Hi Frank,
> 
> Nice looking setup!
> 
> BTW, you are way too young to be "Kicking it old school" lol


Great to hear from you Roy!

Haha, I would agree with the age, but I still have a special place in my heart for the original equipment used!

You had a few great planted aquariums going last I saw you - how are things going with them and the GSAS?


----------



## Francis Xavier

pejerrey said:


> the fx method?


Maybe one day the "fx method," tag line will catch on, hah!



pejerrey said:


> I guess I'm out of the challenge with my non ferts, non co2, akadama soil 6 gal because I use a canister.... Boooo


See my post above! You can still participate, the goals being:

1. Healthy Plant Growth
2. Great Scape
3. Viable use of 'low-budget,' in getting started and following through right.



zoragen said:


> Can't wait to see your tank marko.
> 
> I started my foray into planted tanks w/ a 6 gal eclipse for a betta.
> 
> Fluorite base & a few plants (crypts, sword, dwarf sag) & minimal ferts.
> 
> It's now my quarantine tank - soon to be just a place for a few plants. Which means it will probably become a betta tank again:icon_smil


Focus on plant density, placement and growth and you'll do great!



Lludu said:


> *Plants:* Java Ferns, Mosses, Anubias, Crypts
> 
> *Equipment:* HoB Filters (or one of the following Canisters: 2211/13, Zoomed, Toms Rapid), Lighting Fixture under $80, No Pressurized Co2 - Only Flourish/Excel (Liquid Co2), No other additives (unless it is part of your discretionary funds). Eco-Complete, Akadama, AquaSoil, or Fluval Stratums
> 
> *Pricing:* Maximum of $300
> 
> 
> I think that will make a very nice low tech tank... thats how I run my tanks and I love them... lets see what you can do with that...


I'll post some ideas for the challenge I'm thinking about here shortly.


----------



## jcgd

Everyone keeps mentioning no co2 for this new setup, however, from why I can gather, the method Frank has been discussing always has co2. As in having no co2 injection wouldn't follow the method. The low tech challenge is to prove that you can go low tech and still be as successful as high tech.

I propose a budget setup like this:
Aqua clear or similar hob filter
Schultz aquatic plant soil or other cheap "planted tank" substrate
DIY or preferably a paintball co2 setup. Very basic. 
A small t5 fixture or similar. 
This could even go heater less and keep shrimp and white clouds or something. 
Additives that are essential to "the method" such as the Bacter, fertilizer tabs, iron bottom or whatever. 

This setup would be very cheap and basic. No fancy extras (co2 is not an extra, it is deemed as necessary at the tank itself). If one cannot afford such a setup while possibly DIYing a few things, like a fixture, than you cannot practice the fx method in the way it is being outlined. 

This is my understanding from reading the entire thread. Frank, please correct me if I am mistaken.


----------



## @[email protected]

jcgd said:


> Everyone keeps mentioning no co2 for this new setup, however, from why I can gather, the method Frank has been discussing always has co2. As in having no co2 injection wouldn't follow the method. The low tech challenge is to prove that you can go low tech and still be as successful as high tech.
> 
> I propose a budget setup like this:
> Aqua clear or similar hob filter
> Schultz aquatic plant soil or other cheap "planted tank" substrate
> DIY or preferably a paintball co2 setup. Very basic.
> A small t5 fixture or similar.
> This could even go heater less and keep shrimp and white clouds or something.
> Additives that are essential to "the method" such as the Bacter, fertilizer tabs, iron bottom or whatever.
> 
> This setup would be very cheap and basic. No fancy extras (co2 is not an extra, it is deemed as necessary at the tank itself). If one cannot afford such a setup while possibly DIYing a few things, like a fixture, than you cannot practice the fx method in the way it is being outlined.
> 
> This is my understanding from reading the entire thread. Frank, please correct me if I am mistaken.


the conditions were no PRESSURIZED CO2. yeast CO2 and glutaraldehyde are ok.
IMO, paintball CO2 is the same as "regular" pressurized CO2, the only difference is the size of the bottle. the main cost of CO2 is the regulator, solenoid, and pH controller (if you chose to use one instead of a timer), not the bottle anyway.


----------



## jcgd

Francis Xavier said:


> There is only one methodology and one planted tank that works. One that follows rules and secrets to success.
> 
> Takashi Amano successfully grew layouts that make the highest tech tanks today look like absolute jokes back in the late 80's early 90's, before the ADA product line was really developed, more or less using a sand gravel bed.
> 
> What were the few things that really carried over from those days? Bacter 100, Clear Super, Tourmaline BC, 8000K (flourescent at the time) lighting, Co2.
> *
> So if you have the low-tech mind set, stop it. *
> 
> Your budget constraints shouldn't in any way, shape or form, limit your ability.
> 
> Really when we talk 'low-tech,' we're talking Co2 and lighting. Get yourself any cheap fixture that will hold an ADA 27w 4 square pin bulb (on a nano) or 36w 4 square pin bulb (need 2 for a 20 gallon, 4 for a 40 gallon).
> 
> *Always, always, always use Co2
> 
> *Even if you cannot afford a pressurized unit, rig up a DIY yeast system and just make it work until you can afford a pressurized unit. Don't even bother trying to do a layout without Co2. It's *not worth the hassle.*
> 
> If you can't afford Aqua Soil, get yourself some basic gravel-like substrate, get some root tabs, Bacter 100 & Clear Super and you've at least got something that will work efficiently (efficiency being a measure of doing the job, effectiveness being a measure of doing the job well).
> 
> *So now I've put together a basic lighting system, a co2 system, and substrate system on the super-cheap*.
> 
> Congrats. You're now "high tech." Are you starting to see how silly it is to pre-determine yourself as "low tech" or "high tech."
> 
> I'll continue on later, but I hope by now you are beginning to understand where I'm going with this, and why you should start focusing on "why," and "how" techniques.
> [/SIZE]


Okay fine, no pressurized. But there must be DIY co2 as it is deemed a requirement of the fx method. 

As per the quote above, we shouldn't be referring to this new build as low tech, but instead a budget build. How can we break the mold of low/ high tech if you go right back to it? 

My overall point is that people are asking for no co2 when the requirements are that co2 MUST be used. Excel isn't co2. It's another compound that plants can use for carbon but it's not nearly as effective.


----------



## @[email protected]

jcgd said:


> Okay fine, no pressurized. But there must be DIY co2 as it is deemed a requirement of the fx method.
> 
> As per the quote above, we shouldn't be referring to this new build as low tech, but instead a budget build. How can we break the mold of low/ high tech if you go right back to it?
> 
> My overall point is that people are asking for no co2 when the requirements are that co2 MUST be used. Excel isn't co2. It's another compound that plants can use for carbon but it's not nearly as effective.


agreedroud:


----------



## Francis Xavier

Here's where we do run into a dilemma, and I'm thankful that you had the insight to bring it up, jcgd.

_The purpose of this challenge isn't that it's low-tech. Low-tech is only a mechanism of budget. It's to prove that, even if you can't afford the latest and greatest, the methodology is the same for both "low-tech," and "high-tech," which we've already established as being purely equipment based.


_So, the challenge now almost forces a hand of not using Co2. 

Not because not using Co2 has value first and foremost to learn - I will always be a proponent of having pressurized Co2 to play the game. But rather because the lesson might be disqualified by others if Co2 is used. 

So it's a bit of a catch 22. 

At the end of the day, the emphasis here is that there isn't a whole lot of difference (if any at all) between the application of 'high-tech,' and 'low-tech.'


----------



## Storm

Francis Xavier said:


> So, the challenge now almost forces a hand of not using Co2.
> 
> Not because not using Co2 has value first and foremost to learn - I will always be a proponent of having pressurized Co2 to play the game. But rather because the lesson might be disqualified by others if Co2 is used.
> 
> So it's a bit of a catch 22.
> 
> At the end of the day, the emphasis here is that there isn't a whole lot of difference (if any at all) between the application of 'high-tech,' and 'low-tech.'


I'm glad you pointed this out, Frank. Every successful method acknowledges the need for all life on this earth to have a carbon source. We are all carbon based life forms, after all. They just do it through different methods. High tech uses pressurized Co2. NPT uses dissolved organic carbon (DOC) that accumulates in the substrate.

If you want to be successful, I would recommend using something like Miracle Gro Organic Potting Mix, and capping it with inert gravel. Just using an inert gravel alone is probably asking for failure.

In my opinion, dirt tanks work well, however it's nowhere nearly as nice to scape with as Aquasoil as you have to be careful about disturbing the soil or digging up plants with large root structures.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Is there any reason why the carbon source cannot be Leonardite?


----------



## talontsiawd

Francis Xavier said:


> _The purpose of this challenge isn't that it's low-tech. Low-tech is only a mechanism of budget. It's to prove that, even if you can't afford the latest and greatest, the methodology is the same for both "low-tech," and "high-tech," which we've already established as being purely equipment based.
> _


_

Frank, I think there are 2 definitions of "Low Tech". I think it's because technology has come a long way so it's not hard to find cheap lighting, it's not hard to get good filtration without spending a fortune, better substrates have come about that may not even cost as much as epoxy coated gravel, etc. Even CO2 is becoming cheaper.

I think 1 mentality is all about budget. I have $xxx to spend and I will make a tank out of that.

I think the other is that I want a tank to suit my needs and therefore I don't need to spend my money on all this expensive stuff with planning. I think the second is more "accurate" to the idea, using lesser technology to get a result, which is only cheaper by nature (and that has it's appeal as well).

I, for example, consider low tech to be lower light, very little fert routine, no CO2. I make my tanks around this idea, not to be cheap, but because they are easy to setup, easy to maintain, and with good planning, you may never get enough algae to ever worry about even cleaning the thing. I own two that I have to clean my outside glass much more often than the inside glass (which is infrequent).



My point is this, low tech has really become a dated word at this point. This is because everyone has a different opinion. Again, someone like me would consider an ADA tank with a canister, lily pipes, AS, and any other high end gear you can throw at it "low tech", assuming the lighting was low enough to not require CO2. I don't see crazy technology here, it's just expensive. 

On the flip side, others may see low tech as an AGA tank, gravel, root tabs (which cost more in the long run than a better substrate), T8 lighting, and an internal filter. That is about cost.


Maybe someone who has been in this longer than me has a better explanation but the whole "low tech" and "high tech" has always been about advancement in lighting (which in turn would require CO2 on the high tech side). Even when I started, many people were still using T8's, T5's were just becoming common, and T5HO's were not really used. High light was MH for the most part. Reading my books with an older publishing date really show me how different the hobby has become in even the last 5-6 years.

I am just saying "low tech" seems like it has a different definition to each person. It's going to be hard to really come to a conclusion in this thread as to what would be appropriate. I would just stick with what you consider to be "low tech" and go from there._


----------



## Francis Xavier

I've decided on a filter:


----------



## Storm

talontsiawd said:


> I, for example, consider low tech to be lower light, very little fert routine, no CO2. I make my tanks around this idea, not to be cheap, but because they are easy to setup, easy to maintain, and with good planning, you may never get enough algae to ever worry about even cleaning the thing. I own two that I have to clean my outside glass much more often than the inside glass (which is infrequent).


This is a really great point, and I wish more "high-tech" people would consider this. A lot of "low-tech" people aren't necessarily cheap. Maybe they just don't want to spend time every day maintaining their tanks. Maybe they don't want to have to trim growth weekly. Even if it only takes a few minutes every day, those minutes add up and you do end up spending a few hours a week maintaining a high tech tank. The beauty of a low tech tank is that you can go on vacation and leave it for a few weeks and it will probably look almost as good when you return. With a high tech tank, it will probably turn into an algae farm without regular maintenance.

My point is that we all have different goals when it comes to the hobby. Some people just want a nice tank to relax and look at, without all of the maintenance. Others want a tank that can win a contest and are willing to work on it daily. Your goals and commitment should choose the method.


----------



## talontsiawd

Storm said:


> This is a really great point, and I wish more "high-tech" people would consider this. A lot of "low-tech" people aren't necessarily cheap. Maybe they just don't want to spend time every day maintaining their tanks. Maybe they don't want to have to trim growth weekly. Even if it only takes a few minutes every day, those minutes add up and you do end up spending a few hours a week maintaining a high tech tank. The beauty of a low tech tank is that you can go on vacation and leave it for a few weeks and it will probably look almost as good when you return. With a high tech tank, it will probably turn into an algae farm without regular maintenance.
> 
> My point is that we all have different goals when it comes to the hobby. Some people just want a nice tank to relax and look at, without all of the maintenance. Others want a tank that can win a contest and are willing to work on it daily. Your goals and commitment should choose the method.


Exactly. Don't get me wrong, I like to push boundaries of what people to believe is possible (hence my new 10 gallon, ultra low budget experiment) but at the end of the day, my best tanks are the ones that fit into my lifestyle.

Ironically, one of my best tanks is at my girlfriends. I often don't see it for more than 2-3 day out of the week and that doesn't mean I have time to maintain it. I couldn't find a 20 long rimless but I would have paid for one. It has an Eheim 2234 on it. I skipped on the substrate as it wasn't necessary to get something great but that was more due to color choice as my GF wanted a light colored substrate. I consider it "low tech" even though I have a relatively expensive light fixture, canister, etc. I spared no expense for my goal, which didn't happen to include CO2. Same with her 5 gallon, canister, custom light to my specs, no co2, doesn't fit my lifestyle.


----------



## jcgd

See, I kind of disagree with the typical idea of high/ low tech. I consider the differences in simply the amount of tech. Like Frank, I feel that there is more in common with successful aqua scapers than differences. Not to stomp on anyone's feeling, but I've seen about two natural, or dirt or walstad tanks that were spectacular. I'm not going to get into a debate about what is attractive or not, but my standard is along the lines or amano's scapes. Most people who place among the best use a similar method. 

Low tech to me is turning on/ off the co2 in the morning and at night. Pulling the return out of the water at night for oxygenation. Dosing ferts by hand, etc., etc. high tech is auto dosers, solenoids, ph controllers, etc. 

In other words, I determine if tank is high or low tech depending if it has high or low tech. In my own opinion, and you may disagree, there is methods for planted tanks that are more right and more wrong. 

An analogy: Joe walks into Pete's Pets and says he wants to buy a five gallon aquarium and four fancy goldfish. The employee recommends that Joe puchase a much larger aquarium, cycle it and return for the good fish later. Joe is aghast and says that his friend John has had great success with bowl and two goldfish that have been alive for a few years and that he doesn't need the larger aquarium or cycle. 

Another: two neighbors have lawns. One is "natural". It was sod laid on old dry alkaline soil that has never been weeded, trimmed or fertilized. Sure it's a lawn, but it isn't exactly one of the better lawns you seen. The other lawn was properly prepped soil, well manicured, weeded, aerated, fertalized, etc. Now this is a lawn. This is done properly and it shows. 

Just because plants sometimes grow in a bucket doesn't mean it's ideal. I believe that a proper water garden has certain equipment that is standard issue. I don't know about the fancy bacter and super clear (because I can't know what's in it I won't use it) but I agree with almost everything Frank has said. High tech and low tech should be defined by the advanced tech that is actually used to lessen the workload. Not the equipment I deem necessary but other people wish to forgo because it's expensive.

I would not buy a dog I couldn't afford to neuter and feed. I would not set up a planted tank for which I could not afford substrate, co2, lights, ferts, etc. 

* I am not trying to be disrespectful at all, just voicing my opinion here if any of this comes across wrong.


----------



## talontsiawd

jcgd said:


> See, I kind of disagree with the typical idea of high/ low tech. I consider the differences in simply the amount of tech. Like Frank, I feel that there is more in common with successful aqua scapers than differences. Not to stomp on anyone's feeling, but I've seen about two natural, or dirt or walstad tanks that were spectacular. I'm not going to get into a debate about what is attractive or not, but my standard is along the lines or amano's scapes. Most people who place among the best use a similar method.


I feel their is a difference between growing plants well and being a good aquascaper. Not to jump in to disagree but I have seen a ton of "low tech" or whatever you want to call it tanks with amazing looking plants. That doesn't mean the scape was good. I have also seen amazing scapes with OK looking plants but the scape makes up for it. I will even admit I like the second. I do agree that maybe a small amount of "low tech" or "dirt tanks" are scaped really well. But, that is a different goal all together. 

Sorry, I don't want to hi jack Franks thread at all and anything I say is not trying to be argumentative by any means.


----------



## Ptjameso

Quote:
Originally Posted by pejerrey 
the fx method?

Maybe one day the "fx method," tag line will catch on, hah!

I actually think "The Frank Method" is more suiting due to the upfront nature of these discussions and "The Method"


----------



## jcgd

Haha, nice play Ptjameso


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just a quick picture update today. The aquarium is much closer to balance now and I'm at two squirts green brighty step one and special lights, 3 brighty k.

Not much work to do anymore, will prune some Friday on the first water change of the week.









Enjoy!


----------



## mluk27

Wow it's incredible how fast your HC is filling in! Mine still doesn't look this thick and it's months older! The tank keeps looking better and better.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Storm said:


> I'm glad you pointed this out, Frank. Every successful method acknowledges the need for all life on this earth to have a carbon source. We are all carbon based life forms, after all. They just do it through different methods. High tech uses pressurized Co2. NPT uses dissolved organic carbon (DOC) that accumulates in the substrate.
> 
> If you want to be successful, I would recommend using something like Miracle Gro Organic Potting Mix, and capping it with inert gravel. Just using an inert gravel alone is probably asking for failure.
> 
> In my opinion, dirt tanks work well, however it's nowhere nearly as nice to scape with as Aquasoil as you have to be careful about disturbing the soil or digging up plants with large root structures.


Carbon is absolutely essential - we need to cover certain bases and make sure those things are supplied well for the plants, bacteria, etc in order for them to grow. 

It's akin to rounding out a diet. Sure you can live for a bit without eating vegetables, but not very healthy and you will suffer for it. It won't be long before problems crop up that require even more intensive correction than had you bothered to eat some greens in the first place!

I won't use miracle gro or any other soils. Going this route will mostly be inert sand with the proper bump up in fertilizers to compensate. I might be getting ahead of myself, but I'm pretty sure I can pull off Power Sand + bacter 100, clear super, tourmaline bc and get the relative same amount of growth rates as aqua soil.




talontsiawd said:


> Frank, I think there are 2 definitions of "Low Tech". I think it's because technology has come a long way so it's not hard to find cheap lighting, it's not hard to get good filtration without spending a fortune, better substrates have come about that may not even cost as much as epoxy coated gravel, etc. Even CO2 is becoming cheaper.
> 
> I think 1 mentality is all about budget. I have $xxx to spend and I will make a tank out of that.
> 
> I think the other is that I want a tank to suit my needs and therefore I don't need to spend my money on all this expensive stuff with planning. I think the second is more "accurate" to the idea, using lesser technology to get a result, which is only cheaper by nature (and that has it's appeal as well).
> 
> I, for example, consider low tech to be lower light, very little fert routine, no CO2. I make my tanks around this idea, not to be cheap, but because they are easy to setup, easy to maintain, and with good planning, you may never get enough algae to ever worry about even cleaning the thing. I own two that I have to clean my outside glass much more often than the inside glass (which is infrequent).
> 
> 
> 
> My point is this, low tech has really become a dated word at this point. This is because everyone has a different opinion. Again, someone like me would consider an ADA tank with a canister, lily pipes, AS, and any other high end gear you can throw at it "low tech", assuming the lighting was low enough to not require CO2. I don't see crazy technology here, it's just expensive.
> 
> On the flip side, others may see low tech as an AGA tank, gravel, root tabs (which cost more in the long run than a better substrate), T8 lighting, and an internal filter. That is about cost.
> 
> 
> Maybe someone who has been in this longer than me has a better explanation but the whole "low tech" and "high tech" has always been about advancement in lighting (which in turn would require CO2 on the high tech side). Even when I started, many people were still using T8's, T5's were just becoming common, and T5HO's were not really used. High light was MH for the most part. Reading my books with an older publishing date really show me how different the hobby has become in even the last 5-6 years.
> 
> I am just saying "low tech" seems like it has a different definition to each person. It's going to be hard to really come to a conclusion in this thread as to what would be appropriate. I would just stick with what you consider to be "low tech" and go from there.


Well here's the thing. Soon I'll be setting up the 60-P I received as a gift from Luis Navarro.

This setup uses 4x 8w Flourescent lights at 8,000k on a plastic hood. It's the original fixture from ADA for a 60-P from the early 90's. (This fixture is actually pretty awesome, it has a built-in 'chiller,' and you can manipulate which lights are on at what time, all 4, bulbs 1 & 3 or bulbs 2 & 4 to manipulate spread and bursts etc. 

Now, let's fast forward 20 years. We have compact flourescent, metal halide, t5ho and up and coming LED's. 

There hasn't been much that changed other than what the fixture looks like and energy efficiency. The lights pretty much grow plants within relatively to the same effectiveness. Mostly the difference in lighting is in shiny factor (i.e. shimmer from LEDs and Metal Halides), light intensity (soft light, hard light, bright light) and subtle color renderings.

As long as you have 8,000K lighting, you're pretty much good. You can do 6500 and 10000, but 8000K is about ideal.

So, technically the 60-P I'm setting up is "Low-tech." 

Back then there was pressurized co2 too, the fertilizers were the same, the additives & power sand were the same (they actually predate Aqua Soil and were used with inert substrates) and the _only significant difference between 1992 and 2012 is that Aqua Soil was invented and the style of the aqua scape_.

A "high-tech tank," properly set up, following the Method I've outlined here, is relatively pretty low maintenance.

You go through one month of "hell," and after that you're more or less good. Things are stable and going steady. 

The only significance is the difference in plants chosen. Slower growing plants versus faster growing plants. The _type_ of layout determines maintenance requirements, but the techniques, methods and what not are the same regardless.

So you're _still_ going to do water changes once a day for the first week

You're _still_ going to stage fertilizer additions for a slow ramp up

You're _still_ going to do a water change every other day on the second week.

You'll _still_ do two water changes the third week.

And you'll _still_ have gone through "hell month," to achieve stability and long-term balance.



Storm said:


> This is a really great point, and I wish more "high-tech" people would consider this. A lot of "low-tech" people aren't necessarily cheap. Maybe they just don't want to spend time every day maintaining their tanks. Maybe they don't want to have to trim growth weekly. Even if it only takes a few minutes every day, those minutes add up and you do end up spending a few hours a week maintaining a high tech tank. The beauty of a low tech tank is that you can go on vacation and leave it for a few weeks and it will probably look almost as good when you return. With a high tech tank, it will probably turn into an algae farm without regular maintenance.
> 
> My point is that we all have different goals when it comes to the hobby. Some people just want a nice tank to relax and look at, without all of the maintenance. Others want a tank that can win a contest and are willing to work on it daily. Your goals and commitment should choose the method.


The only thing I'll point up here is that _irregardless_, The Method is the same.

*Maintenance requirements in trimming and upkeep is determined by plant choice and layout vision. Not by equipment or any other 'supposed method choice.'*

The only thing that matters is getting your aquarium to a balance point. In this stability phase, regardless of lighting, equipment, vision, etc, all aquariums turn into low-maintenance aquariums.

Balance = stability = low maintenance.

The more plants you start with, the faster you get to low maintenance.

The more diligent you are in the first month, the more time you buy for yourself later.

The faster they grow initially, the longer the layout can be maintained algae free.

The quicker you remove initial problem algae, the less chance for algae problems occur later.




Ptjameso said:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by pejerrey
> the fx method?
> 
> Maybe one day the "fx method," tag line will catch on, hah!
> 
> I actually think "The Frank Method" is more suiting due to the upfront nature of these discussions and "The Method"


Hah! nice play on words / names.


----------



## Francis Xavier

mluk27 said:


> Wow it's incredible how fast your HC is filling in! Mine still doesn't look this thick and it's months older! The tank keeps looking better and better.


Hey Mluk,

I just took a gander at your journal, and for your first planted tank you're doing well. 

Here's a golden rule for plants, not only HC:

_They are social organisms which don't like to be lonely. The more buddies they have of the same species, the more they grow quicker and quicker.

The fewer of their friends that they have, the more depressed they get and the slower they grow._

I appreciate your kind words and admiration for my nano.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Principle Two of "The Method," or "The Frank Method," as pejerrey named it.

_All Organisms in the aquarium operate by the laws of minimums_

In other words:

Bacteria will only grow to the available 1.) space 2.) food source 3.) molecules (oxygen, etc) necessary for survival.

Plants will only grow to the available 1.) space 2.) nutrients (N,P,K, micro nutrients) 3.) Carbon 4.) Light

Shrimp & Fish will only populate and survive to the available 1.) space 2.) food source 3.) molecules (oxygen, etc) necessary for survival 

*In order for all organisms to grow healthy and steadily, all of the proper elements must be in place for them to thrive.*

So, let's take for example, bacteria:

If you have 1 unit of space, 0 food and 1 oxygen, then 0 bacteria are going to grow. 

For plants, if you have 1 Nitrogen, 1 Phosphorus 1 Potassium, 1 of each Micro Nutrient, but 0 carbon, you're going to have 0 growth.

So on and so forth.

Now, these formulations aren't even like this. The reality is you might need 4 Potassium, 4 Carbon, 2 Micro, 3 Phosphorus and 2 Nitrogen and that = one unit of growth. 

But for simplification, let's assume the 1 ratio. 

*Where does Algae Come into Play?*

Algae comes into play when there is an excess of one unit, and a lack of another, or in other words, when there is inconsistency. 

The most notable time table for the appearance of algae is an excess of NH4 (ammonium). This coincides with the initial setup of the aquarium when:

The Bacteria filter is not yet established.

The plants are adjusting to their new environment and are not uptaking as much ammonium/ammonia as they will otherwise (a nitrogen source). 

_Understanding those few sentences, means you understand why initially we do so many water changes for success, and why later you don't have to do nearly as much._

More application, Bacteria:

Bacteria will grow to the extent to which *oxygen* (for most beneficial bacteria types, we're speaking in broad strokes here), and *food source* (nitrogen, acids, ammonia, nitrite, etcs, some beneficial bacteria even eat carbon sources) are available.

The most overlooked portion of that, is two fold: space and food for non-nitrogen fixing bacteria. 

First, space:

You want to invest as much as humanly possible in highly porous material for microscopic surface area for bacteria to infest. This is why eventually in the filter we switch to 100% Bio Rio and why we use power sand. This means we have one biological filter in the filter where water flows through and one at the root system of the plants (helping the plants synergistically).

This also acts as a back-up system in case one biological filter fails for one reason or another.

*Redundancy = Stability = Less / No Algae*

Two: Food

Most people focus exclusively on nitrifying bacteria. This is for good enough reason, as these bacteria are the most readily "seen," as for their effects. Not having them = fish death.

However, there are hundreds of different bacterium which perform hundreds of different tasks. These bacteria inhabit bio media, roots, plant leaves, live within plants, within fish, they're literally *everywhere!* The health of these bacterium, is directly proportionate to the health of your ecosystem!

This is why the successful aquascaper will focus on making sure they have as bountiful a food supply as the plants themselves.

*In General, Bacteria are:* water purifiers, filters, and organisms which convert toxic or negative elements into positive, useful elements for plants and fish. 

_I'll repeat, when there is an excess of one resource and a lack of another, this creates imbalance as the organisms only grow to the extent of the lowest common denominator. This means your aquarium is out of balance._

Excess = Out of Balance = Algae, which are *Malthusian* organisms, *opportunistic bastards* and will take advantage of this gap and spread quickly and virally when given an opportunity.

_Balance = Health = Growth = Stability = Low Maintenance_

The most vulnerable time for our aquarium is on set up. This is when things are getting adjusted, established and gearing up. Doing water changes more frequently up front, saves you from disaster.

The difference between disaster and success at the end of the first month is understanding Principles 1 & 2 and acting accordingly.

If you're unsuccessful after the first month, you'll spend the next six months playing catch up.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

2wheelsx2 said:


> Is there any reason why the carbon source cannot be Leonardite?


I'm not sure that you saw this Frank and I think it's an important question for a budget tank. Thoughts?


----------



## Francis Xavier

2wheelsx2 said:


> I'm not sure that you saw this Frank and I think it's an important question for a budget tank. Thoughts?


Hmm, I haven't used Leonardite before, however, it seems like it is primarily for restoring deadened environments, and aiding in the capacity to absorb carbon through the soil.

The important thing to understand here is that our aquariums rarely contain the carbon levels naturally that exist in the wild.

However clear super is a source of carbon so with using clear super then you would have a carbon source immediately. Which does turn a light bulb on in my head as another side effect of clear super: a carbon jump start to the roots.


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> Principle Two of "The Method," or "The Frank Method," as pejerrey named it.
> 
> _All Organisms in the aquarium operate by the laws of minimums_
> 
> In other words:
> 
> Bacteria will only grow to the available 1.) space 2.) food source 3.) molecules (oxygen, etc) necessary for survival.
> 
> Plants will only grow to the available 1.) space 2.) nutrients (N,P,K, micro nutrients) 3.) Carbon 4.) Light
> 
> Shrimp & Fish will only populate and survive to the available 1.) space 2.) food source 3.) molecules (oxygen, etc) necessary for survival
> 
> *In order for all organisms to grow healthy and steadily, all of the proper elements must be in place for them to thrive.*
> 
> So, let's take for example, bacteria:
> 
> If you have 1 unit of space, 0 food and 1 oxygen, then 0 bacteria are going to grow.
> 
> For plants, if you have 1 Nitrogen, 1 Phosphorus 1 Potassium, 1 of each Micro Nutrient, but 0 carbon, you're going to have 0 growth.
> 
> So on and so forth.
> 
> Now, these formulations aren't even like this. The reality is you might need 4 Potassium, 4 Carbon, 2 Micro, 3 Phosphorus and 2 Nitrogen and that = one unit of growth.
> 
> But for simplification, let's assume the 1 ratio.
> 
> *Where does Algae Come into Play?*
> 
> Algae comes into play when there is an excess of one unit, and a lack of another, or in other words, when there is inconsistency.
> 
> The most notable time table for the appearance of algae is an excess of NH4 (ammonium). This coincides with the initial setup of the aquarium when:
> 
> The Bacteria filter is not yet established.
> 
> The plants are adjusting to their new environment and are not uptaking as much ammonium/ammonia as they will otherwise (a nitrogen source).
> 
> _Understanding those few sentences, means you understand why initially we do so many water changes for success, and why later you don't have to do nearly as much._
> 
> More application, Bacteria:
> 
> Bacteria will grow to the extent to which *oxygen* (for most beneficial bacteria types, we're speaking in broad strokes here), and *food source* (nitrogen, acids, ammonia, nitrite, etcs, some beneficial bacteria even eat carbon sources) are available.
> 
> The most overlooked portion of that, is two fold: space and food for non-nitrogen fixing bacteria.
> 
> First, space:
> 
> You want to invest as much as humanly possible in highly porous material for microscopic surface area for bacteria to infest. This is why eventually in the filter we switch to 100% Bio Rio and why we use power sand. This means we have one biological filter in the filter where water flows through and one at the root system of the plants (helping the plants synergistically).
> 
> This also acts as a back-up system in case one biological filter fails for one reason or another.
> 
> *Redundancy = Stability = Less / No Algae*
> 
> Two: Food
> 
> Most people focus exclusively on nitrifying bacteria. This is for good enough reason, as these bacteria are the most readily "seen," as for their effects. Not having them = fish death.
> 
> However, there are hundreds of different bacterium which perform hundreds of different tasks. These bacteria inhabit bio media, roots, plant leaves, live within plants, within fish, they're literally *everywhere!* The health of these bacterium, is directly proportionate to the health of your ecosystem!
> 
> This is why the successful aquascaper will focus on making sure they have as bountiful a food supply as the plants themselves.
> 
> *In General, Bacteria are:* water purifiers, filters, and organisms which convert toxic or negative elements into positive, useful elements for plants and fish.
> 
> _I'll repeat, when there is an excess of one resource and a lack of another, this creates imbalance as the organisms only grow to the extent of the lowest common denominator. This means your aquarium is out of balance._
> 
> Excess = Out of Balance = Algae, which are *Malthusian* organisms, *opportunistic bastards* and will take advantage of this gap and spread quickly and virally when given an opportunity.
> 
> _Balance = Health = Growth = Stability = Low Maintenance_
> 
> The most vulnerable time for our aquarium is on set up. This is when things are getting adjusted, established and gearing up. Doing water changes more frequently up front, saves you from disaster.
> 
> The difference between disaster and success at the end of the first month is understanding Principles 1 & 2 and acting accordingly.
> 
> If you're unsuccessful after the first month, you'll spend the next six months playing catch up.


IMO, this is one of your most important points yet. super quality, keep it up. roud:

though perhaps a better way to look at algae is not as a disease which afflicts out of balance tanks, but rather as a function of the ecosystem attempting to correct that imbalance. after all, we have all seen that when the underlying cause of an algal bloom is fixed the bloom subsides (some faster than others). 
the only issue is that the algae competes with our desired flora, and makes it harder for us to maintain that desired livestock at peak health.


----------



## Francis Xavier

That's a very good outlook on algae, Marko.

I share a similar mindset when algae appears in my aquariums where it's not a deal breaker or something to get frustrated at or hopeless.

However, many peoples first real issue is an abundance of algae and to teach methods of easy elimination, then the mind shift occurs when they can be successful a fighting it back


----------



## pejerrey

I named it "The FX Method"


(Francis Xavier method)


----------



## FlyingHellFish

What are you going to do about the middle Rock? It looks covered in some sort of rust, are you going to leave it like that?

How would you clean such a thing? 

Also, how many Otos do you have in that tank? Do they ever swim up to the surface for air?


----------



## Ozydego

As far as algae on rocks, I have seen the most used tool is a toothbrush to brush it off if it changes the scape to where you don't like it


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> What are you going to do about the middle Rock? It looks covered in some sort of rust, are you going to leave it like that?
> 
> How would you clean such a thing?
> 
> Also, how many Otos do you have in that tank? Do they ever swim up to the surface for air?


There are two oto's, minimum I use is two since they are social fish and get depressed alone. They chill and do the oto thing: hang out in one spot, move a little, hang out, move. Every now and again swim to the other side. They never go to the surface. Their favorite spot is near the intake or behind the main stone. I think they like the flow and cover.

The color is a combination of green and brown algae. Easy to eliminate. When the aquarium balances, those types do weird things. There will come a time when it looks like the algae "repulses" themelves off the rock and into the water, which when removed eliminates them.

Short of waiting for that, a quick fix is to drain the tank down and take a tooth brush with some h2o2 (peroxide) in it and scrub it off gently without getting the h2o2 on the plants.





Ozydego said:


> As far as algae on rocks, I have seen the most used tool is a toothbrush to brush it off if it changes the scape to where you don't like it


Yep! Eventually Amano's will eat it too, but the hard green algae is typically a bit harder to deal with and just requires a little scrub.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just a few photos for you guys at the end of week 4.

I didn't do a water change this weekend since I forgot to bring home RODI water and refuse to contaminate with tap.

In short this is an excuse, don't do this.

But the tank will be just fine until Monday, the tank id more or less in stability now and there's only easy algae present. If I get lucky, fish will be added this week.



I did, however trim the riccia down to keep it in check with the rest of the scape as well as a few non-perfect blades of tennellus and it's runners.

Also, added two more tiny stones of riccia to round out a few spots that need more texture.



Week 4 is over! Just need the miss to catch up and the vision is getting closer to the final picture.


----------



## mluk27

I love this tank.. How come you dont see a lot of pearling on the riccia?


----------



## Francis Xavier

There's tons of pearling on the riccia - in person, there's a bubble on every riccia leaf. In the pictures though, it tends to not show up at all. At least not with my camera / phone.

It might be a little more prevalent in this pre trim shot:


----------



## freph

I see dirty glassware Frank. Tsk tsk! Tank is really filling in well. My favorite part of it is how the e. tennellus seemingly creeps from the back, over the rock and into the foreground. Looks really nifty.


----------



## mluk27

Ahhh now Im seeing it!!I really want to try that plant the next tank I setup! I noticed Takashi Amano likes using Riccia heavily in a lot of his tanks when I looked through nature aquarium world.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> I see dirty glassware Frank. Tsk tsk! Tank is really filling in well. My favorite part of it is how the e. tennellus seemingly creeps from the back, over the rock and into the foreground. Looks really nifty.


You caught my dirty glassware! Bit of an eyesore eh? I'll be cleaning it up a bit tonight. Was it you that compared the layout to AOE2? That was a great game!




mluk27 said:


> Ahhh now Im seeing it!!I really want to try that plant the next tank I setup! I noticed Takashi Amano likes using Riccia heavily in a lot of his tanks when I looked through nature aquarium world.


Riccia is the most elegant carpet plant you can deploy. It definitely requires the most comprehensive combination of technique, skill and placement to use long term with a layout seamlessly without having goofball riccia pillows!

I believe houseofcards said it earlier: he who masters riccia, masters all.

Amano has said something similar about iwagumi: he who masters iwagumi masters all.

Also I have decided on a fish:

Rasbora Maculatus. 

They should be here in a few days.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*Principle Three: Everything is Cyclical. *


Everything is cyclical. In the planted aquarium, little goes to waste. As molecules, nutrients and even 'toxins,' enter the environment, these elements are converted by the various bacteria, plants and animals into usable material.

Two Easy Examples: 

1.) Toxic (to animals) ammonia is taken in by bacteria, which then convert the toxic ammonia into slightly less toxic Nitrite. Then another type of bacteria converts this Nitrite into Nitrate, which is safe for animals. Another avenue is the plants themselves uptake this ammonia and use it for growth - as a nitrogen source. The plants 'filter' out this toxic environment and make it live-able to animals.

This very process makes life possible in the aquarium. Without the nitrifying bacteria, animal life cannot live long term. The animals will literally kill themselves as when they intake food they produce ammonia.

2.) Plant cells absorb Co2 and through photosynthesis produce oxygen. This oxygen is then usable by bacteria and animals to breath. Through Cellular Respiration at night, plants take in oxygen and produce Co2. Additional oxygen at night, which can enter the system either through surface disruption (lifted lily pipe) or air stone, is greatly beneficial to the growth and wellness of plants.

Source(s) of:

Ammonia: decomposing organic matter (soil, fish waste, rotting leaves, etc)

Oxygen & Co2: absorbed into water via contact/mixing with air, cellular respiration (co2 producing, oxygen intake) of plants, fish, etc. Oxygen through Photosynthesis (co2 intake) and surface disruption.

Oxygen used by: bacteria, fish, plants, shrimp, etc. 
Co2 used by: plants primarily

Light energy, nutrients, gasses (co2, oxygen), trace minerals, molecules (ammonia, etc) are all taken in by plants. It's best to imagine plants as a factory which takes in these raw materials, and then out puts a product: in this case, more plant matter, which is an embodiment of energy in the aquarium. It's stored energy that's used to 1.) Grow more plants, 2.) filter more water and remove toxins, making the environment more suitable for life. 

Bacteria, in basic terms, convert an even more -raw- source of energy: normally unusable elements like Ammonia, or Nitrites, etc to perform still even more layers of filtering power to the ecosystem. Other types of bacteria even break down waste components (soil sediments, solid wastes, etc) and "purify" these elements out of the system. In modern day sewage treatment plants - one stage of turning raw sewage into useable, clean water, is a bacterial filter which literally moves the sewage up and down until it breaks down.

Fish take in food, remove pests (such as various water insects / pests that eat plants), and by processing these elements into waste, the plants and bacteria then feed off them as a source of phosphorus, this is a vital component of aquarium balance!

Shrimp such as Amano's, and fish such as otocinclus cats also eliminate "pest" algae which infest plants and "choke out" their growth through invasion of the system. They act as a barometer of control over algae to keep it in check, which keeps the system healthy by way of keeping the plants healthy. Amano shrimp especially, also act as "filters," by removing and eating dead animals, which as they decompose after death release ammonia into the system. Then these algae eating, animal decomposing critters digest and produce waste, they provide a source of food for the plants. 

*Algae* *is the result of imbalance.* Algae is nature's control factor for uptaking left over elements that go unused by other organisms.

Refer to Principle #2 Law of Minimums and Principle #1, Malthusian Organisms. 

See, because plants, bacteria, fish etc only intake the exact amount of nutrients, light, co2, etc components which they need to grow to the least common denominator (example 2 light, 1 co2 2 Micro nutrient, 2 macro nutrient, = growth only to one). 

In the last example, we would have 1 left over light, 1 left over micro nutrient, 1 left over macro nutrient. This leads to excess in the system.

This excess has to be *taken in* by something. Algae is what results. They use all the left-overs and infest the system based on 'whats left over.'

They're kind of like pigeons or rats in NYC, which thrive on the left-over food and trash of human occupation on Manhatten. 

This is why, in the popular E.I. Method, the simplest technique is to over dose everything as much as possible, and use *Co2 as the barometer for growth*. In that dosing method, the underlying philosophy is that it's simpler to control only one element: Co2, than it is to precisely balance all the other elements. 

A more advanced approach is to incrementally bump up each individual factor based on feel and observation; which requires a bit of experience with knowing how things grow and knowing when to up things at what time as it's not approximate. 

*This is also why when you overfeed the fish, algae appears.*

You must feed enough to have happy and healthy fish, but not so much that there's excess and left over, which will contribute to algae.

*Conclusion:

*You should be seeing patterns here now: behavior of organisms and growth with Principles #1 and #2, and the nature of the ecosystem (Principle 3, cyclical) and how this puzzle fits together.

In theory it would be possible to make something self sustaining, but not to the scale in which even the largest aquariums are, primarily because of Principle 4, as well as to grow plants to the extent to which we want them to be grown (and not just scraggly things growing randomly), we have to supplement with nutrients (which are not naturally available in the environment, except with what aqua soil and root tabs provides) and Co2 (which would require much more ground water and surface exposure to air to get suitable levels in the aquarium to grow like we do as quickly as we do).

Self-sustainability 100% is not possible. We must renew water, nutrients, etc. over time. Now, we can, however, get very close to self-sustainability by applying these principles and giving a little extra work up front to *achieve balance. *

Once balance is achieved, you are at about 80% self-sustainability.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> Riccia is the most elegant carpet plant you can deploy. It definitely requires the most comprehensive combination of technique, skill and placement to use long term


What about UG? I heard that is a pretty hard plant to get a nice green carpet. 

Anyways, not sure if you answered this before but do you use a drop checker? I don't see one in your tank, do you just kind of gauge the Co2 by the plants?

What bps are you running currently?


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> What about UG? I heard that is a pretty hard plant to get a nice green carpet.
> 
> Anyways, not sure if you answered this before but do you use a drop checker? I don't see one in your tank, do you just kind of gauge the Co2 by the plants?
> 
> What bps are you running currently?


UG is a great plant. However it does not have the same versatility as Riccia, and no other carpet plant does. Riccia can texture and accent any other carpet, or act as the main stay. Moss is the closest maybe.

As for a drop checker, I don't use one. Never have, I just judge the plants and their reaction and growth.

A drop checker is a temporary tool to help your learn this process with minimal learning pain and suffering: it's like training wheels. Necessary for most up front, but long term they go away.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Oh ya, bps is currently at about 4


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> Oh ya, bps is currently at about 4


Damn, I'm guessing you will lower that once the fish have arrived. 

About the drop checker, how does one gauge the Co2 level, any signs to look out for beside the obvious fish gasping. 

Q's - I run an air stone set for when the Co2 is off, I would like to stop doing this as the air stone is quite loud, does it do any good?

Also, can you have high level o2 in the tank and still have 40 ppm or higher? Could this be done with an air stone in the filter? Or is there a certain amount that the water can hold. 
*I want high o2 levels plus high Co2 levels.*


----------



## Francis Xavier

Did the water change (only two days late)

You can judge the remarkable difference by comparing to the last photo set what a little maintenance will do:





The bucket shot:


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> Damn, I'm guessing you will lower that once the fish have arrived.
> 
> About the drop checker, how does one gauge the Co2 level, any signs to look out for beside the obvious fish gasping.
> 
> Q's - I run an air stone set for when the Co2 is off, I would like to stop doing this as the air stone is quite loud, does it do any good?
> 
> Also, can you have high level o2 in the tank and still have 40 ppm or higher? Could this be done with an air stone in the filter? Or is there a certain amount that the water can hold.
> *I want high o2 levels plus high Co2 levels.*


When I acclimate I keep co2 off for that day or at least half that day. Then I'll keep the co2 levels consistently as high as they are now, depending on plant mass.

As long as the plant mass is there to support the co2 injection I'm using, then it's okay as the plants convert that co2 into o2.

See Principle #3 and read it carefully.

As for judging co2 levels - I feel it out. I judge based on plant pearling (relative to their normal pearling tendencies), for example if riccia isn't pearling I have a distribution problem. Air bubbles should periodically come out of the soil. 

The other thing I watch is algae growth and how quickly it spreads day to day relative to the color of the plants. If plants aren't vibrant colors, I know there's something I need to fix.

As for an air stone they work fine but if you don't want to use them you can inject pressurized o2 like co2 or raise lily pipe at night.

You can't really simultaneously have very high co2 and o2 levels due to principle 3.

If you have a significant plant mass and proper co2 distributions, at day you should have more o2 in the system and at night more co2. Excess isn't used and causes the excessive co2 levels, thus fish gasping etc.

Also, stocking levels in a planted aquarium play by entirely different rules than normal. You can way "overstock," a planted aquarium and it be perfectly healthy due to:

Plant filtration
Enhanced bio filtration
Better flow (exercise for fish).

So for example, this 5.5g in the end will probably have 15 micro rasbora, 2 oto cats and 5-7 Amano shrimp and be perfectly balanced.


----------



## jcgd

From what I can gather, having a high ppm of co2 isn't key. It's having consistent levels and maintaining those levels as the co2 is used by the plants. This includes distribution and if the flow isn't good, the co2 levels throughout the tank will vary.


----------



## @[email protected]

jcgd said:


> From what I can gather, having a high ppm of co2 isn't key. It's having consistent levels and maintaining those levels as the co2 is used by the plants. This includes distribution and if the flow isn't good, the co2 levels throughout the tank will vary.


thats how i understand it as well.
but i am under the impression that consistently high CO2 is better than consistently low CO2 (relative to the lighting of course).


----------



## jcgd

I think it depends one what you want to limit. I can't say what's better, but you could limit with light, keeping co2 high, or limit with co2. I can't say what is better but most people limit with co2 for sure. However they always keep bumping light trying to get faster growth. But, as long as the co2 is non limiting who cares if that level is only 10 or 15 ppm. 

From my understand, light should always be the limiter. The non-limiting level of co2 is what I'm not sure about. What would be the effect of keeping co2 levels at 5 ppm if it was always replenished as fast as it was used? Technically the baseline amount of co2 in unsupplimented water should be enough as long as it is replenished. Think nature with the co2 being artificially replenished.


----------



## @[email protected]

jcgd said:


> The non-limiting level of co2 is what I'm not sure about. What would be the effect of keeping co2 levels at 5 ppm if it was always replenished as fast as it was used?


ppm means parts per million, and is a way to express concentration. another way, more often used in chemistry is moles per liter, or molarity. a reactions speed depends in part, on its concentration. the higher the rate the faster the reaction occurs, photosynthesis included. so if you dont change the photoperiod, the higher the [CO2], the more photosynthesis occurs in a given day.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just some more photos of the tank, I wish there was something more exciting to report. Some kind of algae to fight back or some element out of whack.

Really, all I do now is wait for the moss to grow in. Guess its time to plot the CHALLENGE tank and the 60p.



Birds eye views:





Classic angle:


Fun close up:




Oh, the rasbora maculatus should be here Friday, maybe Saturday.

Can't wait for those!


----------



## @[email protected]

love the HC strand creeping over the rock.

boraras are fun. youll like them. 
the only thing i noticed is that even though they are properly sized for a nano, they seem much less comfortable than in a med sized tank. could be that they just dont like MY nano, however.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Well hopefully the HC continues to obscure the rocks!

We'll see how the rasbora respond to the aquarium.

Good rule of thumb is: healthy plants, healthy fish


----------



## bitFUUL

Awesome thread, and thanks for all the help on the phone today Frank! Helped me a ton, and now I've got a working "wishlist".


----------



## Francis Xavier

I have a treat for you guys today. To celebrate Week 4, I took some video from the phone for you to enjoy the layout a little more real than just photographic. 

There's even a better step you can take to really enjoy the progress this tank has made along with me; if I could, I'd love to invite you into my home to enjoy it for yourself. Unless you're in the Houston area, the best I can do is share video and photographs with you.

Week One - Initial Set Up

Week One - Fancy Close Ups

Week Four - The Full Tank Video

Because the pictures are hard to see the true beauty of Riccia Fluitans, I wanted to make a close up video of a piece of what is seen in person, 

This Video Shows the Beauty of Riccia Fluitans

I'd like to encourage everyone to give that plant a try!

And for some photos:



Full Tank Shot



What I'd like you to notice here is that there is no surface film since the last water change. This is a sign of the aquarium leveling out and progressing into balance.

You'll remember that the progress of this tank has had surface film form the very next day after water changes during this establishment period. To the point where a paper towel was deployed to remove the film! 

Now a point has been reached where this film is not occuring, and is a sign that everything is going well - no decomposing, excellent oxygen / co2 exchange and healthy organisms.


----------



## SeattleFishGuy

Frank any reason why you chose the Maculates over the smaller and more red Brigittae? I'm just curious because I thought about going with the Brigettae but decided not to at the last minute. It's the smallest (I think) of the Rasbora and is so small that it looks great in a nano.


----------



## Francis Xavier

SeattleFishGuy said:


> Frank any reason why you chose the Maculates over the smaller and more red Brigittae? I'm just curious because I thought about going with the Brigettae but decided not to at the last minute. It's the smallest (I think) of the Rasbora and is so small that it looks great in a nano.


Great question!

The reason I went with Maculatus over Brigittae has nothing to do with the species (they're both great, I love the nano fish), but rather how they look.

The red's of the Brigittae was too dominate - I wanted more hues of red, and the coloration patterns of the Maculatus better aided in achieving what I was looking for: a fish that could contrast the bright greens while bringing out the accent colors of the tennellus.

Also, the Maculatus are here, so I'll be adding them to the tank tonight.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Teaser shot of the Maculatus:



Since it will be the end of the day when they go to my aquarium, and since they have been in a box for a while I went ahead and put them in a bucket with a live plant. 

Rather than acclimate them to a tank here, then re-acclimate them again with three different scenary changes in a day, I simply drip acclimated in some planted tank water from the 60-P at ADG, which is of similar quality to that of the water in my home.

They've been happily swimming about in circles and have colored up a bit.

Not a single casualty so far.


----------



## radioman

I saw this posted on ADG's facebook this morning. I will be in Houston in a second. Should I just walk in or knock? 

Some people don't like riccia because of the mess but they are one of my favorite plants.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Radioman,

This tank is in my personal home, not at ADG hq.

ADG will be open tomorrow between 9-5.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Fun update, Fish!



Drip acclimation: 30 minutes.



Tighten the airline tubing with a knot to get it to drip in. This increases survival immensely.



Keeping the water level down for them for a while for oxygenation.



Happy and eating within 10 minutes in their new home. They should begin to color up over the next few days.


----------



## roybot73

Cool. Looking good!
I've got a brand new Mini M setup from ADG that I've had stashed for quite a few months now. 
You're making it difficult for me to keep it stashed. :thumbsup:


----------



## Francis Xavier

I lied about them taking a few days to color up.

They've eaten four times now ( small portions ) in 30 minutes with ADA AP-1 Gold and have regained their original color, especially the black spots. Once they fatten up a bit and develop their color will be amazing hues.

I can't describe the dynamism they add to the tank, anyone without fish in their setup is missing out! Adds a whole new zen flair!







Currently 2 bps on co2. Will be monitoring plants and animals for tr appropriate co2 balance.


----------



## SeattleFishGuy

Francis Xavier said:


> Great question!
> 
> The reason I went with Maculatus over Brigittae has nothing to do with the species (they're both great, I love the nano fish), but rather how they look.
> 
> The red's of the Brigittae was too dominate - I wanted more hues of red, and the coloration patterns of the Maculatus better aided in achieving what I was looking for: a fish that could contrast the bright greens while bringing out the accent colors of the tennellus.
> 
> Also, the Maculatus are here, so I'll be adding them to the tank tonight.


ahhh I see...funny that's the same reason I wanted the Brigittae, just goes to show that everyone has a different view.

How many did you go with? I thought I could count close to 20 in one of your shots.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I currently have 25 in the mini m, which is about a perfect number so far.

The aquarium ecosystem will naturally balance out the population. Better to start with slightly more *within reason and in the healthiest circumstance possible* than to have way too few.

Having too little is unhealthy for most of the shoaling fish - they like to hang an play together, they're social critters.

The filter power provides exercise and artificially enhances space - kind of like a lap pool that's only 7 feet or so and has tide movement going.

The population will over time naturally balance with the environment. The weak will die off (there's always a few no matter what) and the rest will thrive.

Remember principle #2! Minimums!

the population will likely level off at 20 or so if there are any weak ones. So far they are all very strong.

Additionally such a heavy plant presence lends comfort and extra powerful filtration for the inhabitants.

What you're seeing now is a super-pumped filtration system of bacteria and plants. You see it in the clarity of the water and the immediate playful and instinctual behavior of the fish - immediately with appetite and action. 

Some have already began spawning dances with one another after three days in shipping and a full day in a bucket with an air stone.


----------



## Ozydego

Question, before you added the fish, we're you feeding the Amanos and Otos at all or were they self sustainable on the algae? I think I have made my Amanos lazy, they wait for feeding time and each take a micro pellet to chew on... I have to feed my betta though. Any thoughts?


----------



## radioman

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Radioman,
> 
> This tank is in my personal home, not at ADG hq.
> 
> ADG will be open tomorrow between 9-5.


Haha I know I was just being funny since you said to come to your house. I would like to go to ADG sometime though. Is it just like a supplier warehouse or an actual store?

I keep editing this. Do you trim your riccia or pull the rocks up and tie the riccia back on when it gets to big?


----------



## 2wheelsx2

You're not worried about jumpers? I had 6 CPD's in my cube until they all committed suicide one by one over a week...now I have 1 left. I want to get it some buddies, but don't want to pick up dried up fish every morning.


----------



## mcqueenesq

The fish are beautiful and really complement the tank. Great choice!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Ozydego said:


> Question, before you added the fish, we're you feeding the Amanos and Otos at all or were they self sustainable on the algae? I think I have made my Amanos lazy, they wait for feeding time and each take a micro pellet to chew on... I have to feed my betta though. Any thoughts?


I never feed the Amano's or Otos (unless they're in a non-planted holding tank). The reason is they become spoiled on these foods and lose the instinct to perpetually look for algae to eat for survival.

Think of it like a Dog. You give your Dog normal Dog food, but when you have meat available, they will always defer to the meat and if you continually give them meat, they will leave the dog food in the container to rot, regardless of health priorities or anything else.

I would say to feed your betta less - maybe a small amount once a day or every other day, only enough for the betta to eat in one sitting. You can always add more food, so start with less and slowly build up.

Consequently, Amano's and ocats will only thrive to the extent to which available algae is present. So if there is a dramatic decline in algae growth, they will begin to starve and some may die. *Again, it's about balance.*

I recommend starting with more initially to beat back algae, then slowly remove a few. Some will naturally die off as they go, and that's okay, though it's best to try to avoid it. Having a back up tank with plants in it is always good for "spill-over" Amanos.

*The aquarium will always attempt to balance itself out, whether that's through extreme algae growth, algae eater die off, or etc. This happens on both a macro (fish, plant, algae) and micro (bacteria) scale.* 



radioman said:


> Haha I know I was just being funny since you said to come to your house. I would like to go to ADG sometime though. Is it just like a supplier warehouse or an actual store?
> 
> I keep editing this. Do you trim your riccia or pull the rocks up and tie the riccia back on when it gets to big?


Hey if you'd like to come by my apartment to see the aquarium in person that's totally alright. But you'll have to schedule with me ahead of time! Roommates and such.

I trim my Riccia. Adding rocks of riccia on top of them tends to be a bit inelegant and creates sloppy riccia. Alternatively having to pull up the stone with the Riccia to retie massively disrupts the aquascape and should only be deployed when absolutely necessary. A favorite technique of mine is to use some of the trimmings to add smaller accent stones of Riccia when applicable.



2wheelsx2 said:


> You're not worried about jumpers? I had 6 CPD's in my cube until they all committed suicide one by one over a week...now I have 1 left. I want to get it some buddies, but don't want to pick up dried up fish every morning.


I'm not worried about jumpers at all, for two reasons:

1.) A fish will only jump if there is something wrong with the tank. If the aquarium is balanced, they have no reason to attempt to leave the water. 

This means balance of co2, oxygen, water parameters / quality, plant growth etc.

2.) The only other time a fish will jump is when startled and when they are timid. Choosing a species only tank where they are comfortable (large school) makes them less skittish, more at home and less likely to get startled. Also place your aquarium in a quiet place and train the fish to be excited at your presence (aided by feeding small amounts when you do certain gestures, all fish will learn to recognize you or your motions).

An easy way to avoid accidental fish jumping due to being startled is to not fill your tank completely to the brim, this way if they accidentally get caught up in flow or are scared of something and bolt, they don't have the extra momentum of the water being filled to the top (making it very very easy to jump), when the aquarium level is even 1/4 inch or 1/2 inch below the rim it significantly blocks jumping.



mcqueenesq said:


> The fish are beautiful and really complement the tank. Great choice!


Thank you! I think a lot of people vastly underestimate the value of fish to finish the scape's look. It's the last element to be added, and in many cases, the most important. 

Zen is the best way to describe it, without sounding corny.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Hey Frank, my HC Cuba is looking a lot better since taking your advice. How long do I have to dose K and Iron? I been doing it daily and the colour is coming back, the new leafs are still a bit yellow.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> Hey Frank, my HC Cuba is looking a lot better since taking your advice. How long do I have to dose K and Iron? I been doing it daily and the colour is coming back, the new leafs are still a bit yellow.


I dose K and Iron every day. If you're on a once a week dosing schedule then it would be to continually up the amount in small increments until all new leaves are appearing green. In any event, if new growth is still yellow, continue to slowly up the amount of K / Iron you dose.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Francis Xavier said:


> I'm not worried about jumpers at all, for two reasons:
> 
> 1.) A fish will only jump if there is something wrong with the tank. If the aquarium is balanced, they have no reason to attempt to leave the water.
> 
> This means balance of co2, oxygen, water parameters / quality, plant growth etc.
> 
> 2.) The only other time a fish will jump is when startled and when they are timid. Choosing a species only tank where they are comfortable (large school) makes them less skittish, more at home and less likely to get startled. Also place your aquarium in a quiet place and train the fish to be excited at your presence (aided by feeding small amounts when you do certain gestures, all fish will learn to recognize you or your motions).
> 
> An easy way to avoid accidental fish jumping due to being startled is to not fill your tank completely to the brim, this way if they accidentally get caught up in flow or are scared of something and bolt, they don't have the extra momentum of the water being filled to the top (making it very very easy to jump), when the aquarium level is even 1/4 inch or 1/2 inch below the rim it significantly blocks jumping.


You forgot the third reason and the reason mine did it initially I think. Breeding frenzy. And now that I think about it, aggression will do it too. I've had fish jump and hit the top of my 125 gallon and almost knock the glass lid off. 

The schooling idea works (I have 100 lemon tetras in my 125, but in an 8 gallon cube, the entire tank is their "school").

I do agree with you however, on lower the water level. However, it seems a shame to have a rimless tank and then not use the top part. Since my jumpers were all at night when I was asleep (so no excess O2 or light flashing on and off or people walking by in my office), I am going to actually put a lid on it at night. Just wanting for the clips now. I do appreciate your input, but can't agree with your reason one. Maybe I should have gone with rasboras and not CPD's. Since the CPD's are surface feeders, they makes them more prone to problems maybe. I have 10 tiger shrimp, 12 C. habrosus, and 3 otos in there and none of those have attempted to leave the tank, even when it was at the rim.


----------



## plantbrain

Jumpers, that's what cats are for.


----------



## PaulPage

Great tank Frank. I'm looking to set up one similar to yours but using a 45-P. Would the ADA solar mini lamp strech enough to cover a 45cm long ?


----------



## 2wheelsx2

plantbrain said:


> Jumpers, that's what cats are for.


Got one of those too. Had 3 of them, that's why I never went topless before this tank.  Gets expensive replacing fish every week though.


----------



## Francis Xavier

PaulPage said:


> Great tank Frank. I'm looking to set up one similar to yours but using a 45-P. Would the ADA solar mini lamp strech enough to cover a 45cm long ?


The Solar Mini you can maneuver to -mostly- cover the 45-P but since it has a base plate you would need to incorporate some ingenuity when it comes to using a garden mat to compensate and make the tank level.

Much easier recommendation is to go with the Solar II. This will provide more adequate lighting for this size and fit much better.



2wheelsx2 said:


> You forgot the third reason and the reason mine did it initially I think. Breeding frenzy. And now that I think about it, aggression will do it too. I've had fish jump and hit the top of my 125 gallon and almost knock the glass lid off.
> 
> The schooling idea works (I have 100 lemon tetras in my 125, but in an 8 gallon cube, the entire tank is their "school").
> 
> I do agree with you however, on lower the water level. However, it seems a shame to have a rimless tank and then not use the top part. Since my jumpers were all at night when I was asleep (so no excess O2 or light flashing on and off or people walking by in my office), I am going to actually put a lid on it at night. Just wanting for the clips now. I do appreciate your input, but can't agree with your reason one. Maybe I should have gone with rasboras and not CPD's. Since the CPD's are surface feeders, they makes them more prone to problems maybe. I have 10 tiger shrimp, 12 C. habrosus, and 3 otos in there and none of those have attempted to leave the tank, even when it was at the rim.


Some species are definitely more prone to jumping than others: for example, hatchets will sail right out of the room. 

By and large if we're speaking in broad strokes about fish, they will not jump if given no reason to. Excess aggression (breeding frenzy as an example!), poor water quality, too much co2, etc. 

Jumping tends to be a mechanism of survival instinct or feeding. 

If you keep your nano tank at about the water level I have mine at, you can keep it safe and prevent most jumpage. 

General rule is healthy bacteria = healthy plants = healthy fish.

Of course, some specific species just like to jump for a fly or something.


----------



## PaulPage

Francis Xavier said:


> The Solar Mini you can maneuver to -mostly- cover the 45-P but since it has a base plate you would need to incorporate some ingenuity when it comes to using a garden mat to compensate and make the tank level.
> 
> Much easier recommendation is to go with the Solar II. This will provide more adequate lighting for this size and fit mucCh better.


Trouble with the solar 2 is it needs to be suspended I'm after one that either sits on the tank or next to it via a stand


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Francis Xavier said:


> If you keep your nano tank at about the water level I have mine at, you can keep it safe and prevent most jumpage.



Thanks. I'm doing that now. Lesson learned too late. But I'll be putting a lid on it at night and replacing the CPD's once I get that lid. Saddens me to cover up such a beautiful tank though...


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> Some have already began spawning dances with one another after three days in shipping and a full day in a bucket with an air stone.


the boraras look nice, but theyll look nicer after a few weeks the males should turn a darker red-orange color (not as red is the brigitae however). theyll color up better if you feed live food that was enriched with astaxanthin (i used "red" microworms). its the same pigment that gives shellfish their red color when cooked, and flamingos their pink hues.




Ozydego said:


> Question, before you added the fish, we're you feeding the Amanos and Otos at all or were they self sustainable on the algae? I think I have made my Amanos lazy, they wait for feeding time and each take a micro pellet to chew on... I have to feed my betta though. Any thoughts?


feeding a betta and feeding shrimp are 2 separate things. bettas eat off the surface, shrimp off the floor. 
feed your betta staple of good pellets (atisons betta pro is the best, omega one and hikari are also good) with some frozen/live food to keep him happy.
let the shrimp forage for its food. betta food is bad for them anyway, WAY too much protein.


----------



## Ozydego

My betta is very weird, I started feeding sinking pellets a while ago when i had espei rasboras and then later ember tetras, they ate the sinking pellets. now he eats them as they fall or off the floor... Unless the Amanos streak by and steal it, they get feisty... Guess I need to change back to floating pellets and retrain the betta now that I moved the other fish out... Then leave the Amanos to the BBA


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Instead of the 50% a week water change, would you be able to split that, maybe 25 , 25 in one week? 

My painted red don't like a massive amount of water change. 

Also, since the new growth is not entirely a lust green, isn't that a sign of a trace problem? Micro-nutrients ? I been told N might be lacking since I keep it at 5 - 10 ppm.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Will answer questions later, just wanted to make a quick post:



this layout is at a point of absolute enjoyment: the kind where you sit back and relax and know everything is going right. The maculatus are super reddening up off of AP-1 Gold, and have already recognized me as the feeder.

Death Record: 0
BPS: 1.5 
Fertilizers: Step 1 x2 & Lights x1 + brighty k x4

Having a layout put together like this one where all the elements are healthy like this makes all the learning pain and suffering worth it.

On that end, this may be my last photo of the tank as I believe i may throw my hat into the International Aquatic Plant Layout Contest. 40 days left for this layout to mature for competition. 

I'd encourage all of you to enter.


----------



## freph

That is some seriously healthy looking HC and riccia. Bravo.  HC looks to be about 3/4"-1" thick...any real threshold for a necessary trimming?


----------



## mcqueenesq

Good luck, Frank!


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Will answer questions later, just wanted to make a quick post:
> 
> 
> 
> this layout is at a point of absolute enjoyment: the kind where you sit back and relax and know everything is going right. The maculatus are super reddening up off of AP-1 Gold, and have already recognized me as the feeder.
> 
> Death Record: 0
> BPS: 1.5
> Fertilizers: Step 1 x2 & Lights x1 + brighty k x4
> 
> Having a layout put together like this one where all the elements are healthy like this makes all the learning pain and suffering worth it.
> 
> On that end, this may be my last photo of the tank as I believe i may throw my hat into the International Aquatic Plant Layout Contest. 40 days left for this layout to mature for competition.
> 
> I'd encourage all of you to enter.


thats awesome! good luck!


----------



## roybot73

Good luck with your IAPLC entry. 
BTW -- what's the word on your "old school" 60-P rig? Decided in a substrate yet?
May I suggest keeping it in line with the "old shool ADA" theme/methodology and using Oiso sand or Akadama as your substrate? Get that beast up & running, man!!


----------



## Francis Xavier

roybot73 said:


> Good luck with your IAPLC entry.
> BTW -- what's the word on your "old school" 60-P rig? Decided in a substrate yet?
> May I suggest keeping it in line with the "old shool ADA" theme/methodology and using Oiso sand or Akadama as your substrate? Get that beast up & running, man!!


Setting up the 60p Monday or Tuesday, so this journal will still get updates!

Oiso sand is a great idea, if I could source some, it was discontinued long ago. 

I know the type of layout ill do, but a few things are still hanging out there.


----------



## roybot73

http://www.dallasbonsai.com/store/river_sands.html


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> the boraras look nice, but theyll look nicer after a few weeks the males should turn a darker red-orange color (not as red is the brigitae however). theyll color up better if you feed live food that was enriched with astaxanthin (i used "red" microworms). its the same pigment that gives shellfish their red color when cooked, and flamingos their pink hues.
> 
> 
> 
> feeding a betta and feeding shrimp are 2 separate things. bettas eat off the surface, shrimp off the floor.
> feed your betta staple of good pellets (atisons betta pro is the best, omega one and hikari are also good) with some frozen/live food to keep him happy.
> let the shrimp forage for its food. betta food is bad for them anyway, WAY too much protein.


The Maculatus have gotten pretty nicely red with the AP-1 Gold as their staple diet. I think they may actually be getting fat already, so I'll scale back their feedings (not because they don't eat it all, but rather, so they don't become gluttons!).

I plan on mixing foods in with a staple of AP-1 Gold (small size, easy digestion is win), with a few microworms like you mentioned. I might actually use some spirulina. 

I'm a major proponent of keeping fish healthy with a varied diet.



FlyingHellFish said:


> Instead of the 50% a week water change, would you be able to split that, maybe 25 , 25 in one week?
> 
> My painted red don't like a massive amount of water change.
> 
> Also, since the new growth is not entirely a lust green, isn't that a sign of a trace problem? Micro-nutrients ? I been told N might be lacking since I keep it at 5 - 10 ppm.


You can do 25% twice weekly, sure. The idea is to do as many as is necessary to keep things balanced. You need to consider the health concerns of your animals as well, so if 25% twice a week is less stress than 50% once a week, go for it.

Go ahead and up your dosing of micro's to compensate with the increased potassium and iron. The idea here is you're slowly increasing amounts to eliminate deficiencies, so if one has a problem, you increase it, then the other might need to come up a bit. 

If you're lacking N, can I ask what soil you're using? If it's aqua soil, you very rarely lack in N or Phosphorus.



freph said:


> That is some seriously healthy looking HC and riccia. Bravo.  HC looks to be about 3/4"-1" thick...any real threshold for a necessary trimming?


Thanks freph! The oxygen bubbles from Riccia in that quantity do a lot for the health of the system's organisms. 

Normally I'd trim HC at about here, and will probably do so soon, but basically you want to sculpt HC to your desire. If you want it tight with the substrate you trim very early when it tries to mound this makes a tight, clean carpet.

Me? I want some mounding to balance the Riccia (which grows taller), so I want the level of Riccia to almost match the level of HC.



mcqueenesq said:


> Good luck, Frank!


Thanks! You should enter as well.

Honestly I'm just throwing my hat in the ring if it comes to fruition by that time just to throw my hat in the ring. A nano tank -might- break top 100, but just due to scale alone isn't going to win (since you have many, many people who can win based just on scale and applying the same detail work of the layout). 

Ironically Nano tanks are more "macro" scenes, and larger tanks are more "micro" scenes.



frrok said:


> thats awesome! good luck!


Throw your hat in!


----------



## Francis Xavier

roybot73 said:


> http://www.dallasbonsai.com/store/river_sands.html


I'm going to save this page. 

I probably won't do it for this layout since plants are already on a ticking time bomb. But This is definitely...

Wait, they're in Dallas.

Hmm....one day delivery in Texas...

So, as it turns out the 60-P Might turn into the "Low-Tech!"


----------



## roybot73

Nice 
I've been revisiting a lot of the older Amano layouts lately. They're very different from the current evolution -- in a way that I'm starting to like more and more...


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Throw your hat in!


That's definitely a goal of mine. But I have so much to learn and a long way to go before I feel confident enough to compete. But thanks for the motivation!


----------



## Francis Xavier

frrok said:


> That's definitely a goal of mine. But I have so much to learn and a long way to go before I feel confident enough to compete. But thanks for the motivation!


Take my advice and just enter the best tank you've got this year in 38 days. 

Right now it's not about winning (even for me!), it's about participating in the world-wide aquascaping community! So what if you place like 780 or 649 or 984 or whatever. After the top 100 they're all pretty random placements anyway.


----------



## Francis Xavier

The 60-P Journal has begun.


----------



## @[email protected]

good luck on in the contest.
i might put in my 30C, just to see what spot i get....IF i get the time to replant my UG this week, otherwise itll be to unruly by the time the contest rolls around.
how do you deal with UG frank? trim or replant? 
i try trimming, but UG just flips me the bird and floats up anway.

the latest FTS, is absolutely stunning frank. roud:
looks like something right out of dream. the r. fluitans especially.


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> good luck on in the contest.
> i might put in my 30C, just to see what spot i get....IF i get the time to replant my UG this week, otherwise itll be to unruly by the time the contest rolls around.
> how do you deal with UG frank? trim or replant?
> i try trimming, but UG just flips me the bird and floats up anway.
> 
> the latest FTS, is absolutely stunning frank. roud:
> looks like something* right out of dream.* the r. fluitans especially.


I think that's one of the coolest compliments I've ever gotten. Thanks!

As for UG, I stick to trimming plants as much as possible vs. replant. Though Dollface would be best to ask on UG, as my experience with UG is limited.


----------



## Francis Xavier

So I've been thinking about the challenge for "low tech," and have devised a potentially better way to start, inspired a bit by Amano. 

First, I'm thinking a small container using riccia, dwarf Belem and a stem of a rotala or so.

In this manner building up slowly towards creating a more formulaic system behind growing things out in a modern way.

I do really want to do a layout with Oiso sand for experimentation, however for many plants they don't grow well in pebbles, but crypts tend to grow really well there so it will be interesting to see what can be done.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> You can do 25% twice weekly, sure. The idea is to do as many as is necessary to keep things balanced. You need to consider the health concerns of your animals as well, so if 25% twice a week is less stress than 50% once a week, go for it.
> 
> Go ahead and up your dosing of micro's to compensate with the increased potassium and iron. The idea here is you're slowly increasing amounts to eliminate deficiencies, so if one has a problem, you increase it, then the other might need to come up a bit.
> 
> If you're lacking N, can I ask what soil you're using? If it's aqua soil, you very rarely lack in N or Phosphorus.


I'm just using Flourite Black, the tank started out as a testing for my Co2 system which turned out stable. 

The HC Cuba kept growing so I'm sticking with it now. I'm seeing a colour change and I'm glad I took your advice. 

What is different is the growth rate, I started mine a week or two before your tank, yet you have a nice stable growth. Mine is dense instead of tall, maybe the light is to blame. Not sure how a 23 watt CFL on a 6 gallon compares to those Solar Mini.


----------



## supersbite

*All the best and Thankyou*

All the Best for the contest Frank and thanks for all the guidance :thumbsup: 
Cheers


----------



## plantbrain

Francis Xavier said:


> I think that's one of the coolest compliments I've ever gotten. Thanks!
> 
> As for UG, I stick to trimming plants as much as possible vs. replant. Though Dollface would be best to ask on UG, as my experience with UG is limited.












About 4 weeks ago the day I replanted:










I use to replant like this:









Notice the care(lack of care) in the replanting and denser packing above vs the below: 

Then I started really working it back in with denser replanting:









The UG is a L shape a couple of rows over, I changed it back but this denser packing really is the cat's meow. 

Looks much better than mowing it, which you recover nothing you can really sell for a decent $. This is just a simple technique that really works, recovery to this level takes about 4 weeks and it looks nice as it fills back in. 

A dense patch will provide ample plant material to make a real serious repacking/replanting that will fill in fast. Then whatever is left over from that rug, you sell. About every 4-8 weeks, I'll sell 50-100$ worth. 

I refer to this as repacking the rug vs simply replanting plugs spaced 1" apart.That's fine if you lack plants to start off with...........but if you want to have fast recovery and trim as it gets overgrown, then you have plenty of plant material.........so do not sell it all, leave yourself with the min amount etc:wink:

Replant as densely as you possibly can.












when I replant, I take 1" plugs off the mat and leave then nice and dense. Then I twist them into the soil gently and pack from one part to the other side of the area, just like painting into a corner. I use about a180degree or so twist to keep the plants lodged in good, and I'm only using 1" of ADA As or less!
These mats stay put. I do trim the runners that will pop up and make the mat look ratty unkept etc and I use a paint scraper to push the edges on the glass downward to give a well manicured look.


----------



## @[email protected]

thanks tom. 
sounds good. ill try that out this week.


----------



## markusdowny

This question seems kinda stupid and the answer is perhaps somewhere...but what are the plants at the back?



Francis Xavier said:


> Let's fast forward to the present day so I can cover day one maintenance of the tank, i'll keep this short and brief with mostly pictures (for the first week, there will be a water change EVERY DAY, this is huge for preventing algae) :
> 
> Frank's water change & maintenance methods:
> 
> Drain water into a bucket with eheim tubing (obviously, you should consider turning off the filter first) :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drain to about half full (make sure to leave enough water to fill back up with ease without disturbing substrate):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trim any yellow or brown leaves (these suck out the plant's energy / nutrients so get rid of them asap for best growth) (using Trimming scissors curve type) :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Use a small cup to fill over, gently pouring water on the big main stone (this distributes water flow over the tank and doesn't disturb substrate:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turn filter on when the water level is about halfway level with the outflow, this helps to super oxygenate the water at fill up:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At this stage in the game, I am only dosing Green Bacter, will start adding Brighty K + Green Bacter on the third day, add about 3-5 drops:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Use a net to remove any old or dead leaves at the top (doing this for a few minutes each day keeps the tank clean and makes it so you don't have to spend major time doing it later) :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maintenance Complete (approximately 10 minutes)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One last tip: of course, if you're using tap water add dechlorinater first. I use pure RO/DI water as the water in Texas is very hard. I recommend it for anyone who has the means.
> 
> P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


----------



## Francis Xavier

markusdowny said:


> This question seems kinda stupid and the answer is perhaps somewhere...but what are the plants at the back?


Plants in the very back: Eleocharis Acicularis (dwarf hair grass)
Back-midground: E. Tennellus Micro

There used to be a microsword in there, but I removed it.


----------



## markusdowny

There are some moss in front too, right?

So there are HC, a kind of moss, E. Tennellus Micro, DHG, riccia and micro sword (before)?

Is there any particular reason why you removed that?

Thank you so much for answering my questions...!:smile:



Francis Xavier said:


> Plants in the very back: Eleocharis Acicularis (dwarf hair grass)
> Back-midground: E. Tennellus Micro
> 
> There used to be a microsword in there, but I removed it.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Where the updates man?


----------



## Francis Xavier

I have two goodies for you guys today:

How To Trim Riccia

Part 1

Part 2


----------



## darkrainer

Again Tom how did you manage to keep the UG so healthy?


----------



## mluk27

Wow Frank, the Riccia looks so lush and I can DEFINITELY see all the pearling in that video. Thanks for the informative video!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Thanks mluk,

I have a funny story about netting out all the trimmings of the Riccia. 

The Maculatus are so comfortable in the Mini M, that they've gotten to full color point, and when I'm around they spend a lot of time following me around (hoping for food). 

When I hide from them, they spend most of their time milling about (still zero casaulties or jumpers) in the open areas of the tank and in the tennellus area. They actually sleep in the thicket of tennellus (which I think has more to do with flow than plant).

So, upon using a net to get riccia trimmings out, I had a great deal of trouble getting the Riccia out, because the Maculatus would swim into the net and chill out in the net, and make no attempt to jump out or anything.

Which meant I would have to try to carefully guide them out or dump the trimmings out in the tank for them again. Even a few Amano's did this.

If I just lay a net there, these guys will gun for it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

You can also see in the video how a few are just dancing around my hand.


----------



## mluk27

Do you enjoy using those scissors best for trimming Nano size tanks??

Thats pretty amusing, but frustrating guess those Maculatus are just trollin you  lol

If you had CPD's you wouldnt have this problem because the second you come up to the tank you wouldnt see them for a while lol.


----------



## Francis Xavier

The spring scissors are my favorite for Nano Tanks.

The reason is they don't require you to hold them at the handle and the whole tool is leverage for cutting, which lets you get into smaller spaces easier.

Outside of Nano tanks, they aren't as practical (takes too much time) except for precision trimming. Also, outside of Nano tanks my favorite scissors are the wave scissors, which are all around the best scissors ever, I would say.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

I've never had any problems trimming the Riccia neatly, but always had problems getting all the trimmings out, much to my annoyance. They always end up growing all over the tank in places I didn't want. But then it was probably because I didn't prune often enough so the tank was a bit overgrown at times.


----------



## @[email protected]

when i had a riccia carpet, i put a surface skimmer attachment for my ehiem. never had to pull out any leaves from any plant. 
its too big for a nano though.


----------



## freph

The tank looks absolutely beautiful Frank. Can't wait to get the Mini M ordered, setup and started! How about a video exploring the whole tank?  That tenellus section looked wonderful from what I could see in the riccia video.


----------



## Francis Xavier

2wheelsx2 said:


> I've never had any problems trimming the Riccia neatly, but always had problems getting all the trimmings out, much to my annoyance. They always end up growing all over the tank in places I didn't want. But then it was probably because I didn't prune often enough so the tank was a bit overgrown at times.


The right fish net with filters off makes removing trimmings easier. Also, use airline tubing to remove any left overs. The next day, the filter will intake any left-over remnants which you can remove.



freph said:


> The tank looks absolutely beautiful Frank. Can't wait to get the Mini M ordered, setup and started! How about a video exploring the whole tank?  That tenellus section looked wonderful from what I could see in the riccia video.


Thanks Freph! Can't wait to see your Mini M go. The Tenellus section is definitely one of the most interesting there. I already have ideas for more nano's using the plant.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*Nano Tank Guys!

*There's a new competition open only to the US & Canada, hosted by Aqua Botanic for Nano Aquariums.

The three categories cover:



Planted Nano
Freshwater Biotope Nano
Marine/SW Nano
I was invited to participate as a judge in this competition, and happily accepted to aid in promoting this segment of the hobby (so don't worry, you won't have to compete against me).


I would encourage, as with the IAPLC to make an entry even if you don't think you can win! Do it for the experience.


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> *Nano Tank Guys!
> 
> *There's a new competition open only to the US & Canada, hosted by Aqua Botanic for Nano Aquariums.
> 
> The three categories cover:
> 
> 
> 
> Planted Nano
> Freshwater Biotope Nano
> Marine/SW Nano
> I was invited to participate as a judge in this competition, and happily accepted to aid in promoting this segment of the hobby (so don't worry, you won't have to compete against me).
> 
> 
> I would encourage, as with the IAPLC to make an entry even if you don't think you can win! Do it for the experience.


congrats on being a judge.
where does one enter?


----------



## Francis Xavier

The entry form is here:

http://www.aquabotanic.com/


----------



## Francis Xavier

Over the course of the next few weeks I'll post some contest refinement tips and how to's so you can learn how to avoid losing misdeamenor points. Great techniques to general practice as well.

*Upcoming contests to prepare for:*

The big boy (everyone should enter for practice) : IAPLC

The AGA (international, hosted in USA. Enter to rep the USA! Has categories) : AGA

The Aqua Botanic Nano Challenge


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Are you going to enter your nano tank? See how well your ADA start method does with others?


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'll probably enter into IAPLC and AGA, yes.

With IAPLC I don't anticipate a high ranking, purely due to the nano size vs. larger tanks, as you can get infinitely more detail work in for larger tanks for a competition like that. Nanos are more of a macro scene, large tanks more of a micro panorama.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Yo Frank, what algae is this brown/black stuff? Is it BBA? Since I up the fertilizers, things been slowly creeping on my HC. 











Too much iron?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hard to tell from pictures, but it's not BBA, which grows in tufts.

Looks more like diatoms. Easy fix with some Amano shrimp.


----------



## Ozydego

Frank, do you have any advice for Getting rid of BBA once it has established itself?


----------



## freph

Remove dead plant matter, increase CO2, do water changes more frequently, spot treat with excel/peroxide/phyton git.


----------



## Francis Xavier

To remove BBA, it's best to manually remove as much as possible by scraping it off objects, with the filter off, and a piece of airline tubing to suck out the scrape off.

Then, increase your Co2 levels and monitor for more appearance. Remove as it appears.

The key is to keep Co2 levels stable.


----------



## Ozydego

I did finally get stable levels, at first, no Co2 and then DIY in a 1 liter bottle, so not stable, finally got an 88g cylinder and regulator with solenoid. It is now stable, its in the HC, so last night I spent a good 30 minutes removing affected sprouts... I am slowly raising the Co2 level and I have also noticed that the HC has now perked up and exploded... even in inert sand... I have not noticed any new spots forming and I am picking out the existing as I go... Its starting to look better, this pic is before the BBA removal


----------



## radioman

That looks like staghorn.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> Hard to tell from pictures, but it's not BBA, which grows in tufts.
> 
> Looks more like diatoms. Easy fix with some Amano shrimp.


Really hate to turn this thread into an algae identification thread but I got no replies for this mystery algae.


















It's this black tar, older leafs are affected more than younger ones. Some of it is on the gravel, some on the flat rock and HC. I notice that the areas of the flat rock that is covered, doesn't get the black algae. 

Any ideas? I think it's BBA.


----------



## @[email protected]

my 2 cents (not as valuable as franks):
99% of issues are CO2 related. 
with carpet plants, its particularly challenging to ensure good water movement, to bring fresh, CO2 rich water. 
i find that i have much better growth from UG when their leaves are very lightly waving, than when they dont have any current around them. 
try getting some better flow there, and/or increasing the overall CO2 in the tank. if that keeps the algae from spreading, than just spot does excel to get rid of whats already there.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Thanks marko, your 2 cents is worth than 2 cents.

I have growth with nice colour now. Problem is this it's this strange black algae that makes it way to all my new growth. My UG is shooting out roots under the substrate Flourite Black, and the side of my tank has this under level algae too.

*The only algae that resembles algae is this. It's not BGA.*









*This is the same algae, it's less over here. My UG had some nice young blades that I trim because it was covered by the unknown black tar algae.*









_So, what algae is this black stuff? I tried taping the sides as you can see in my first pic, no change._


----------



## !shadow!

staghorn or blue green algae?


----------



## Francis Xavier

The algae in the second set of pictures is cyanobacteria or blue-green algae. Sprinkling Bacter 100 over this algae during the end of a water change will make it disappear (in many cases over night). 

Aside from that manipulating your diffuser where it is in relation to the flow (as there is a diagram earlier in this thread), will aid in spot helping the algae spots. Marko provided good insights on co2 / flow relation. Finding that 'sweet spot,' is important and often entails manipulating where the diffuser is. 

I would trim out the old growth that's infected as a manual measure to prevent further spread.


----------



## Ozydego

thanks for all the advice everyone, this thread has inspired me to take more pride in my tank and be more diligent with it. Thanks Frank!


----------



## FlyingHellFish

One mystery down, I took off the tape and yeah it is bga. I can't scrub the side so what the best thing to do?


----------



## @[email protected]

FlyingHellFish said:


> One mystery down, I took off the tape and yeah it is bga. I can't scrub the side so what the best thing to do?


gram negative antibiotics come to mind.
minocycline, kanamycin, etc. take your pic.
id advise against sulfa drugs though. they are as precise as a nuclear blast. sulfa drugs will kill your gram-negative and gram-positive bacteria. save those for sick fish.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Not a big fan of those, I tried them once and it didn't do anything. The whole one week dosing was just money down the drain, I had the same result from just physically removing with a bit of a black out. 

I'm scraping it off and electric taping the side to block light. Dosed some excel on it too with a medicine dropper. 

Anyways, I think I figure out what the whole black mess of algae is, it's RODOPHYTA SP. 2.

On the bright side of things, I'm getting new growth that looks like everyone else's HC Cuba.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I did a few things today, which started with seeing some BBA and removing it:



Then, I noobishly broke my diffuser and took it out on my tank via intensive trimming:



I trimmed everything down to the base, including the Riccia again, this will enable the moss to grow in a bit more.

Still has a cool look to it though, no?

One of the cool things about appropriate planning, is you can even have a cool scape when you trim back the main features. Here you see an entirely different look to the scape than when the tennellus and hair grass is prominent and this temporal change adds a whole dimension to the enjoyment of the tank!


----------



## FlyingHellFish

How you break your diffuser?


----------



## @[email protected]

personally, i like the trimmed back look even better. lol
i noticed that bba is particularly reactive to excel spot dosing. you may want to try spot dosing the areas with bba after you remove as much as you can manually (there is always some left over). 
is your bba localized to one specific area of the tank or dispersed throughout?


----------



## Francis Xavier

The BBA is a fairly minor issue in a tank like this: just on some old growth that needed trimming away anyway. If need be I'll use some excel, but the problem should be more or less resolved. 

I've found that BBA tends to show up initially when fish are added and co2 levels are modified to adapt to that. Swift removal then tends to make sure it doesn't come back. 

Another correlation is BBA showing up at about the time the tank's growth is full and stabilized, again a sign of needing to modify dosing and co2 regime. 

But to answer the question it was hanging out a little on the big rock.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> How you break your diffuser?


I had back pressure in the diffuser when I removed it and went to take the tubing off. This caused it to snap at the weak joint. 

Always make sure the co2 is fully drained in the tank before removing a diffuser, this ensures no back pressure problems.


----------



## Francis Xavier

The effect -is- quite nice with the tennellus and hair grass cut back. It was getting a bit unruly.

Now I get to enjoy a new scape while it grows back in.

Some fun photos:


Classic, slight angle shot. Maculatus Dancing for food.


Top down angle shot to enjoy the texture subtleties and color contrast in the scape





Amazing how pronounced the back slope becomes in a shot like this with no extra height in the tank (plants)


----------



## mluk27

So much green! This tank keeps looking better with age! How many amanos do you have in there? Do any of them crawl out on you?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Thanks Mluk! It is great to be able to enjoy the natural changes of the scape.

I have 5 Amano's, 2 o-cats and 23 Maculatus.

No Amano jumpers or crawlers, no Maculatus deaths or jumps (just two that I regrettably sucked up with airline tubing and they didn't survive the suction...they're too damn friendly).


----------



## Francis Xavier

*Darting through the aquascape,* the tiny rasbora become like shimmering jewels, playing in the flow of water. Like the seasons, the scenary changes with trimming, maintenance and care. 



Displaying their full colors in vibrance, the rasbora nibble at the surface, seeking attention with excitability.




Across the way, the Otocinclus lazily hang in their favorite spot: right near the inflow of the filter. Moving ever so slightly every few minutes for another spot of micro-algae. Shrimp tend to the plants and rocks, diligently scouring the aquarium for algae, quietly acting in the background.



Meanwhile, in the backdrop Riccia and moss pearls releasing oxygen into the aquarium and creating a shimmer to the scene of vibrant green. Together, fish, shrimp and plants create a wonderful and relaxing scene. Existing in a state of tranquil evolution.

*Watch the Video in 720p*

In other news, I'll be speaking on Saturday on Robert's Aqua Botanic Radio Show about Aquascaping and Iwagumi. Listen in for some useful techniques and tips.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/aquabotanic


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Hey Frank, not sure if you listed this but what is your photo period like? Do you do the whole "burst noon" lighting?

Any tips for improving my layout?


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> In other news, I'll be speaking on Saturday on Robert's Aqua Botanic Radio Show about Aquascaping and Iwagumi. Listen in for some useful techniques and tips.
> 
> http://www.blogtalkradio.com/aquabotanic


Great i listen every Saturday! I would call in and ask a question but I work a weekend cash job and probably wont get a minute.


----------



## Francis Xavier

After being bush-whacked, the Tennellus is growing back in thicker and more vibrant than ever. Riccia after repeated trimmings has developed to be smaller and more compact. 




Growing back in, clean of algae and pristine, the color becomes a deep crimson red under the light:


----------



## Dollface

Those aren't snails, are they?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Those are indeed snails. I just kind of remove them as they appear with airline tubing.


----------



## frrok

i have a snail issue also, and do the same thing. as long as they dont breed like crazy i dont mid them too much except when they leave poop on the glass. gross!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey flying,

In nano tanks I do not use a noon day burst - only in larger tanks such as 90-P, which makes it effective. 

My photoperiod on all aquariums is 10 hours. If using noon burst then 2 low-6 high-2 low. You could even try 3-4-3. 

For your layout, on this aquarium I would focus on plant health and growing - learn how the plants grow and how they flourish. Then on your next layout go for an all-out aquascape using the knowledge you've gained.



FlyingHellFish said:


> Hey Frank, not sure if you listed this but what is your photo period like? Do you do the whole "burst noon" lighting?
> 
> Any tips for improving my layout?


----------



## Francis Xavier

In two hours, noon CST, I'll be talking on Aqua Botanic's Radio Show.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/aquabotanic


----------



## Francis Xavier

You can find a recording on my talk here if you missed it:

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/aquabo...dio-aquascaping-principals-with-frank-wazeter

As for the Mini-M, it continues to grow back and be enjoyable. 



_It'll be time to trim that Riccia again very soon. I might even trim it at the next water change._


----------



## mluk27

You know, although people were skeptical in the beginning about using ADA products and your methods but, your results sure speak for themselves. I dont see your tank overun by algae and everything has grown in nice and healthy. If only my tank was doing so well  lol


----------



## Francis Xavier

Mluk,

I must say that, this aquarium is really what a planted tank should be. Not for it's design - the design aesthetic is up to your personal choice. 

Rather, for it's relative ease of maintenance, hands-on involvement with the temporal changes of the aquarium (trimming) and enjoyment of the tank.

Up front, I invested time and effort to set it up and set it up right. 

Now I spend about 10-20 minutes a week to clean glass and do a water change and I can spend the rest of the week just feeding the fish and dosing the tank, both are hands-on enjoyable experiences. 

For many, this layout would be complete - but now it's in the fine trimming / pruning / sculpting phase.

This means I am trimming back elements and waiting for others (moss) to grow to meet a final vision. 

The thing of it is - if you mess up in your first month it takes 400 times more effort to accomplish the same result - more headache, more prone to start over, etc.

It's fascinating to watch as the Riccia responds to trimming - each time getting thinner and more compact. I know I've done it right when I can look at the bottom of the Riccia and not see any rotten / black Riccia. It's healthy from top to bottom. 

The tenellus coming in crimson red is a huge bonus, and the HC is impeccable.

*This is exactly what I want for everyone here - this experience.*


----------



## Francis Xavier

Okay, to revisit the Low-Tech Challenge.

Here's my plan so far. 

*I plan on using a 12-inch Cube aquarium.
*Powerhead / sponge filter attachment. (basically just a pump).
*No Co2 or excel. 

The Substrate System Plan:

Since I will need to rely even more so on the substrate for biological filtration, I'll use power sand with the addition of Bacter 100 and Clear Super. The actual substrate itself will likely be something like just sand or oiso gravel. 

I don't want to overload the substrate with nutrients - since it will be a precise balance game. I can supplement with liquid fertilizers to make up for the gap, or deploy root fertilizers in certain spots if need be. The substrate's most important role at this point will be biological filtration.

The Co2 Plan:

DIY Yeast: *eliminated as option*, the inconsistency of the yeast system is a problem I don't want to deal with - BBA, namely, would show up with such a system. Also, it wouldn't be able to turn off at night, preventing oxygenation.

Excel: *eliminated as a primary option*, may be a secondary option, but the fact that it dissolves after 24 hours is a bit concerning. I may come back to this one, but I still consider it a last resort. 

Excel is kind of an emergency go-to for me; if a tank is just way out of whack, then it's a good back up. Otherwise it's not really necessary. 

*The current plan is to basically do small water changes daily using carbonated water. * We'll see how that goes.


----------



## pejerrey

Frank, the next challenge you are planning on sounds interesting and fascinating enough to have its own thread with a related title so it would be easy to find into posterity. 

Thanks for doing this, it's very educative and hassle saving for fellow aquascapers.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Speaking of hassle,

I would say that going through the process for "low-tech," is infinitely more hassle than the cost of simply going pressurized!


----------



## pejerrey

Francis Xavier said:


> Speaking of hassle,
> 
> I would say that going through the process for "low-tech," is infinitely more hassle than the cost of simply going pressurized!


 What I consider my "low tech" its so boringly stable that I thought exactly the opposite :icon_mrgr. 

One thing to consider is that I may be out of the "low tech" description (if there is any) because of my overfiltration. Which I *believe* (dunno really) its the trick. I literally top off with DI + 30ppm of GH from mosura mineral plus. water change to come back to 100tds when I hit 120+tds (every 3-4 months?). That is it.

Maybe Akadama DRL is not really inert after all, although I cant measure any nutrients with my test yet in the water column.

Nothing fancy in my tank tho, its pretty simple scape with mostly stems.









Therefore Im really exited to see what you are going to do, it will improve my aquascaping possibilities greatly!!roud:

Looking forward for the next lesson Frank!

PS I saw that you added a index in the first post! very clever, that rules out my previous suggestion!:icon_wink


----------



## wkndracer

Does the timeline on this tank follow the posting dates?
(Born on date) Setting the substrate, filling etc. through the present postings.


----------



## becks17

What's going to be your source of carbonated water? Will it be store bought bottles/cans like Amano first used? Isn't that going to be comparatively more expensive?


----------



## Francis Xavier

wkndracer said:


> Does the timeline on this tank follow the posting dates?
> (Born on date) Setting the substrate, filling etc. through the present postings.


Yes, this journal follows the dates as they occurred. The only move around was the setup (which occurred all in one night but the how to was posted over a few days).


----------



## Francis Xavier

becks17 said:


> What's going to be your source of carbonated water? Will it be store bought bottles/cans like Amano first used? Isn't that going to be comparatively more expensive?


I havent decided yet - using a simple pressurized system you can produce carbonated water for about $.04 per 2 liters. That or wholesale canisters.

That being said, during this process te importance isn't cost, but to determine thresholds and other methods of Co2 delivery - a reverse engineering if you will.


----------



## becks17

Yeah, that makes sense and I'm excited to see the outcome. Though I think it'd also be interesting as a "low-tech" challenge to see the aquascape possibilities using equipment "on a budget" for those new to the hobby, whom might be hesitant to front the high initial costs of "high-tech" equipment and supplies. That'd might be another project for another time.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Really, I've got more aquascaping ideas than tanks to put them in, so there won't be any shortage!


----------



## pejerrey

Pardon my ignorance.
I think that if you will still provide co2, then it may be more than low tech? 
I don't know. Can't you try without any co2 input?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Well, the reality is there isn't much at all that distinguishes a low-tech from a high-tech. 

When it comes to the aquascape, it's an independent factor and has nothing to do with equipment.

As for the plants - they have the same needs to grow regardless of conditions, and the way in which they grow is determined by meeting these needs. 

Many aquarists who are first inspired by plants likely see them at a petco or a petsmart and consider them as a good addition to their aquaria. Having bought the aquatic plant, they bring it home, plant it in the best method they know how (with little or no direction) and watch as the plant slowly dies. 

What's not being met? Proper conditions, which we supplement with equipment - better lights and co2 namely. Fertilizers, additives and tools follow after. 

The challenge isn't so much to create the 'lowest tech,' possible layout, rather to drill down and create something that skirts the fear of investment in pressurized co2. 

Co2 is required - regardless of what approach for diffusion is used. There are some plants, of course, which can resist a lack of co2 for a while, but the goal isn't to use anubias and some moss exclusively to a layout that takes two years to develop to prove a point.

What the search is for - is to make the easiest possible, fastest possible, layout eliminating as much as possible from the equation.

In reality, I believe 'low-tech,' to be much harder than the 'high-tech,' equivalents, due to it's limiting nature. The thing of it is, it being unnecessarily harder.


----------



## pejerrey

Aha! Now I understand more what you mean with "harder", it's harder to achieve a goal, an envisioned aquascape with more limitation, right?
Say, light, dosing, gas... Therefore flora.

It's like the EI premise. 

Thanks for answering that, I was confused.


----------



## talontsiawd

Frank,
I think you will enjoy low tech. I have grown just about everything in a low tech tank. I had a pearling carpet of HC in a very under filtered 10 gallon with a CFL light fixture. I have another tank where I am successfully growing just about anything in Petco gravel. 

It's the same thing as high tech, you need to find the balance. The only difference is you can't increase your CO2. Use light as your limiting factor, as most do with high tech (assuming they have living things in the tank). 

The initial start up sucks because you just wait and wait. Once it comes together, it's really simple. You don't need consistent water changes, you don't need to trim, you don't even need to clean the glass. In my 5 gallon, I may clean the inside of the glass every few months. I clean the outside much more regularly than the inside. 

The only really hard part of low tech is finding a good light. Most fixtures are pretty poor for low light. That and patience.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I also need a name for this layout


----------



## pejerrey

Francis Xavier said:


> I also need a name for this layout


Low Rider, the FX method limited edition.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I did a trimming of the Riccia two days ago. If anyone wants a tennis-ball portion of Riccia, I'll let it go for $12 shipped.



_Full tank shot - keeping Riccia healthy and green from top to bottom via trimming keeps it growing in smaller and smaller to get that refined "thin" look.



Right side - a meadow of light & green.



Left side - contrast and texture. 
_


----------



## Dollface

It's kind of neat to look at that mock up I did a while back, and it's almost spot on. Do I get a gold star?

The actual tank though, its more stunning than I even guessed. You're right, the texture, the contrast, it's truly awesome.


----------



## mahko

What's your thoughts on trimming HC? All the way to the substrate? After trimming mine the other day, I noticed how thick it has gotten and the bottom leaves (near the aqua soil) were starting to die off.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Mahko,

Yes, I would trim HC to the substrate.


----------



## @[email protected]

when you trim your HC do you just give it a haircut, or do you dilligently trim stem by stem so as to not damage foliage and such?


----------



## Francis Xavier

I give it a straight hair cut, like Riccia, Hair Grass, Tennellus and glosso. 

You can use precision stem-by-stem trimming (and I do) but only to remove specific stems, like one that might have bba on it, or one that's rotting a bit or has algae on it that you don't like (more common of Tennellus). 

But for actually trimming it back you just want to mow it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Dollface said:


> It's kind of neat to look at that mock up I did a while back, and it's almost spot on. Do I get a gold star?


It is kind of cool that you were able to get the impression spot on! And yes, that's gold star worthy. 



Dollface said:


> The actual tank though, its more stunning than I even guessed. You're right, the texture, the contrast, it's truly awesome.


Thanks for the compliment! 

You know, this reminds me of a good point, and a story of mine. 

In 2008, when I was first inspired to create a planted aquascape, I would spend hours looking at Amano's work.

The iwagumi in particular, was amazing and soon I had my own layouts ready to go. But, whenever I put together a layout, for some reason the plant growths just never quite looked the same, and I couldn't figure out precisely why. 

I'd tried one carpet plant, multiples, it just wasn't looking like I wanted. 

In the end - I discovered that the real difference, wasn't the individual carpets or anything like that, it was the use of plants to create *texture* in the layout - using Riccia as a huge tool to create that extra bit of texture and contrast makes a HUGE impact on how the layout looks down the road. 

In fact, this is probably why I will be using Riccia a lot for the foreseeable future.


----------



## Francis Xavier

_Another day in paradise_

There is nothing quite as enjoyable to watch as a field of shimmering Riccia - a plant which once you master tying of it to stones, and proper placement is easily one of the most pleasurable plants out there.

Riccia gives the impression that the layout is smiling at you.


----------



## tigerali

Francis Xavier said:


> NPT's use no filtration and no artificial lighting. The problem is, there is no such thing as an infinitely self-sustaining planted aquarium.


Frank, thank you for your journal. I've been following this thread with quite some interest. I'm not sure any one has mentioned it yet, however, but I disagree with this statement. 

First, if you look to Walstad as the patron saint of contemporary NPT, she allows for artificial lighting, though that is low and even lower if the tank catches direct sunlight. I believe this is actually in her book.

Second, I think post-publication, Walstad has noted that filtration can be used (the book recommends against filtration outside of the initial set up, but she's softened her stance since it came out I think). Certainly the NPT community either uses filtration through the entire process or at least carbon to help clean up the newly set up tank. Again, her posts on the semi-official NPT forums on APC suggest this shift in methodology.

Third, if you read Walstad's book, she never makes the claim that her NPT method is self sustaining, and I daresay there are no tanks that can make that claim, as you very rightly note. Instead, she advocates that input in the form of food will help see the tank through as plants use up the (admittedly long term) initial nutrients from potting soil.

Finally, while this wasn't Frank's statement, someone commented that NPT tend to be dirty tanks with ugly plants. I've seen some beautiful NPT tanks and unless you're very much in the mindset that iwagumi is the only beautiful tank style, I'd argue that any tank with healthy plants and fish can be charming in its own way - even java moss can be gorgeous with some maintenance. As there isn't a lot of other plants iwagumi, can be aesthetically displeasing as well and for me - who still considers plants secondary to fish - many fish would be happier in an densely planted NPT than in a "barer" iwagumi (anabantoids come to mind immediately).

Anyway, returning to Frank, as a Japanese studies graduate, it appears your approach to methodology approximates the rival schools kind of understanding often present in Japanese arts - especially martial arts and calligraphy (the latter which I know much better).

In any case, I don't post this as an expert on anything; just to point out that your definition of NPT doesn't seem to match what's actually written in the cornerstone text on the matter, nor the forum, nor actual practice. Apologies if I've misunderstood or anything - I just know for the areas in which I consider myself a hobbyist with real knowledge (and aquaria is most certainly not one) I'd like to be called out, because getting better is much better than being right.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Tigerali,

Thank you for your well-thought out post on the subject. 

Please bare in mind as well that that particular stream of posts was as well to utilize examples in the extreme to expose one fundamental premise:

_Inherently, all methods of growing aquatic plants follow the same fundamentals.

_With NPT - I used the commonly, perhaps misunderstood, variables about it. The assumption a new person makes (admittedly, with many planted aquaria) is that the aquarium becomes self-sustaining and requires no maintenance outside of this closed loop ecosystem.

Often this is interpreted by many that the NPT, by way of wording, is a way to create a self-sustained system which does not rely on equipment to do the lifting. People are seeking ways to avoid investment in quality goods to recreate a Nature Aquarium. 

However, this is something that is very misleading - in order to fully realize a gorgeous layout (minus say, wabikusa bowls and the like), you have to invest in equipment at some point. Allow me to make a reference to one of my favorite video game franchises, Final Fantasy. 

The original Final Fantasy game is very straightforward: you level up to get stronger to beat the bosses and progress. Arguably it takes less skill (but more time) to level up as high as you can to simply over power the boss fight, and it is infinitely more challenging to beat the boss at a lower level.

In order to keep it interesting, many long-time fans will go back to Final Fantasy (the original) and run through the game with a 'challenge,' to not level up except with what experience is provided by bosses. This means you have an extreme low-level run through.

It's arduous and not for the faint of heart or easily frustrated. Likely the end is a much less elegant finish and a "just barely pulling it off," kind of situation with precise calculation and luck. 
*
In many ways, this is similar to the Planted Aquarium.*

The use of quality equipment is similar to 'leveling up,' to make the task easier for yourself - and more enjoyable for the majority of people (where as maybe the 1-5% will do the low-level challenge). 

Rather than spending time, it's spending money (which of the two, take my money and leave me with my time...there's plenty of money out there, but no matter what we only have 24 hours in a day no matter who we are).

NPT, Low-Tech, even Nano tanks, really these aren't for beginners. They're not even for the intermediate person. 

To encourage the spread of planted tanks, we need systems. Systems which are designed for success as quickly as possible - not ones in which you must balance a million different variables to have a prayers chance of succeeding. 

However, the fallacy is, hey, you can start one of these with little investment and you can get some kind of self-sustaining or easy to maintain system going. 

Why is that a fallacy?

1.) 'High-tech' does not = High maintenance. This is easily the most common misconception. I spend less than 20 minutes a week to keep my "high tech," Nature Aquariums in -perfect- condition. Really, once they're stable you could go quite a while if you are okay with algae on the glass. 

2.) Low investment = easy come, easy to quit. If I'm inspired by a beautiful Nature Aquarium - to expect to achieve that with low-tech easily, "on-the-cheap," and without any effort is _setting someone up for failure._ When it takes months and months and months to realize a layout - most people quit. When they mess up the slightest of variables and get an algae mess in a system that exists "On the razor's edge," then most people quit.

3.) A little investment in quality equipment - even if all you did was get pressurized co2 and an appropriate light, you would save yourself a huge time and emotional problem with dealing with rolling issues that chronically comes up - where as many of the algae issues that are posted even here on the boards, you can easily avoid or remedy with a few quick changes if you have _controlled environments._

That's the basic gist, and I'm not saying to go out and spend as much money as you can - I'm saying to make the wise investment in _yourself_ ahead of time and avoid headaches. 

*So, as for NPT and the like,

*Really, I would say this is more for hobbyist experts - something to challenge themselves with, a fun project or something like that. Not for the new person and not for the person who simply just wants a beautiful Nature Aquarium or planted aquarium. The reality is it's not even something that attracts the majority of new people. It might even scare them off!

I will make no claims to say that you can't have a gorgeous aquarium that's "low-tech," or NPT or the like, as someone, somewhere will prove me wrong - but I will say that there are not many, if any at all, which can rival the diversity, ease and beauty possible in Nature Aquarium. Beauty certainly is in the eye of the beholder - and if your interpretation of beauty is different than mine, then of course, you need to follow your path and I will not judge you for it. 

The one thing I would say though, is to be careful to say "oh, well this is more beautiful in my opinion because I can do it," do not limit yourself to one thing just because it's all you can do or accomplish at that time - constantly strive to improve yourself and learn technique. Each layout should be better than the last! (This goes for me as well). 

*A Mental Exercise

*Rather than thinking in terms of equipment. Think in terms of "this is my dream layout. And I want to achieve this layout."

From there, think of what you will need to accomplish that - then fill in the blanks. The equipment is only there to help you get there easier and more sustainable.

Fill in the blanks with techniques - learn them, practice them and continue to improve. 

That's really the only secret. It's not about constant 'scientific' measuring or precise worry about water parameters or any of this type of thing. It's just about building a basic set of fundamental techniques and then growing from there. 

Once you know the basics, you can build and build and build off those and get increasingly complex and pull off master layouts - but not until you understand the basics, and it's not about water parameters - in fact, it's a very rare case for many of the 'best aquascapers,' to ever test anything at all! They just know by looking at the plants! And that's simple! Just check for:

Color - Vibrance & Hue
Growth Rate
Algae Infestation vs. Clean
Holes in leaves or anything?
Browning? Yellowing?

Then the basic more or less comes down to increasing the dosage of a certain fertilizer or making a small change to Co2 rate. 

Nature Aquarium - planted tanks, are built on many many small changes over time. A little more of this, a little more of that, small adjustments make huge impacts and it's the sum total of this simple observation that leads to excellence.


----------



## tigerali

Frank, thank you for your extremely well thought out reply. Any analogy to Final Fantasy is one I'll understand - you're speaking my language (perhaps you picked up on that from my user icon).

I agree with you on both counts: first newbies, like myself, need a methodology that works. The less variables, the less room for error, or even judgment the better off newbies are; I'm a novice and I want a tank that looks beautiful and has healthy plants and fish. I don't care how I get there. That's why I'm so interested in your thread - have you thought about compiling the information into one or two posts without the side-commentary like mine?

Second, perhaps relatedly, is the tank that to some degree, the tank that works is one that is beautiful to me. If that means NPT, that's fine, if that's NA that's fine too.

I think my next tank is going to be a 10 gallon planted. I'm seriously considering emulating your steps to set up a similar tank to see if it works for me or not.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'll probably be condensing the information into a knowledge base for another project I'm working on - forum's tend to be difficult to access information one for one: the role of a forum is more about the active conversation and distilling of information via the convo rather than a fixed article-base. 

If I were to give you advice, and if you had a limited budget, I would say to invest your money into the soil, additives and supplements - these will save you an infinite amount of time and frustration with proper usage. The glass is just the box that holds it together - that can come later. 

For example, you may reference my killing of a complete Algae mess in less than 3 days with 20 minutes a day here: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals/173827-60-p-how-turn-algae-mess-4.html#post1874167

Really the planted aquarium is very, very easy. It becomes complicated when you try to cut corners and re-invent the wheel - like the Final Fantasy low level challenge. I spend about 10 minutes a week in maintenance less than a minute a day dosing. If you want absolute perfection it's like 20-30 minutes a week and 2-3 minutes a day (after the first month). 

There are many examples of other methods here, enough so that people can compare 1 for 1 results. Part of the reason so many other methods came about, like DSM, rather than finding the path of least resistance - such as I've laid out here - is that much of the information only came in bits and pieces and in poor translations. It took two years of compiling the information and hands-on trial and error to formulate and lay out the method for 100% success, 100% of the time when you follow it. 

As for Final Fantasy - I've always been a diehard fan. FFXIII is actually one of my favorites - and I've played them all.


----------



## talontsiawd

I agree to above post 100%.

I kind of accidentally adopted a 30in foot print over the years. I find that 90% of my personal issues are due to lighting. With 3 tanks with a 30 in light fixtures, I can go anywhere from barely enough light to grow anything to more light than would ever be reasonable by swapping fixtures. On top of that, I have embraced adjustable lighting to be able to fine tune even more, as well as using fixtures (or using multiple fixtures) to have at least 2 stages of light. I went from a high light tank to low light buy a flip of a switch on a tank and it worked perfectly. 

I do try my own things but I know that if I can't get things worked out in the first few weeks, it's not going to work. I really enjoy low tech nano's that are colorful and have carpets. It's not just about lighting there, it's about plant choice and some fail, but over time I can grow far more than I ever thought without co2. 

I do use time spent per day as my guideline as if something is worth keeping. If I get random algae booms after the first month, I either need to change something or start over. No more fighting too much light, gassing fish, or weekly clean outs of algae mass, unless I am trying something different.

Even the DSM method, that is a great example of a good idea that often doesn't work. I haven't ever had failure but the transition period on many plants is too long so it's almost like starting without any plant mass. I will use it on hard to plant species like HC or to keep slopes but I find it usually is a slower process, even when it works flawlessly. I think the only time it' really is worth it is when you have a rare or unknown plant that you can't get more of and need the plant mass.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hello my friends,

I have just started a new blog dedicated to aquascaping and the planted tank

On it, I will be showing all of the methodology I use - all of the success tips and mental strategies so you can be even more successful.

I'd like to extend my invitation for my first introductory posting, as the week goes on, I'll be adding in new content and highlighting certain key questions to answer. 

Look forward to speaking with you more,

-Frank Wazeter


----------



## CalmSeasQuest

I just wanted to say Thank You. As a life long "reefer" trying to get through the planted tank learning curve, I've found this thread to be very valuable.

Thank you for sharing your time and knowledge - Subscribed.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Welcome to the Planted Tank side of things! Please feel free to ask me any questions you may have.

I also made an update post to tumblr,


http://wazeter.tumblr.com/

In it, I'm starting out at ground zero - what is aquascaping. For a laugh, click on "read more" and scroll to the first photo you see.


----------



## mthoma32

Hey Frank,

I am new to this site and planted aquariums. I really enjoyed reading your How-To thread and plan on implementing a lot of the ideas into my own tank (which is not up yet). This thread was really useful and the detail you went into and answering others questions was really nice of you.

I just have two quick questions and I can not remember if you addressed these over the 40 odd pages. 

1). Do you use a heater for this tank? If not, how does it stay warm enough, through the light?

2). When you are dosing the Green Bacter, Brighty K, ECA, ect. how do you know how much to dose? Are there directions included with each of these? Is this based on tank size, co2, lighting, plant density, ect?


Again thank you for the very informative and interesting thread!

Mitch


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hello Mitch,

Thank you for your kind words and support. I am glad that I have been able to assist you so far.

For your questions: 

1.) I do not use a heater. I have lived in both Seattle (cold) and Houston (hot), and the use of a heater or chiller has never been necessary. 72-78 degrees is about optimal for the nature aquarium, and this is achieved naturally with room temperature, even when the room is as cold as 45-50 degrees or as hot as 85-90 degrees. 

2.) I know how much to dose based on experience. However, directions are written with each box and each fertilizer.

The basic premise is you start out with small amounts (except Green Bacter - start with 5 drops), and then slowly increase the amount as the plants need it. You can tell this factor by things such as yellowing, holes in leaves etc. If you see these things simply increase your dosages. If you get too much algae, stop dosing everything except Brighty K and remove algae, then in a week resume dosage levels.

You can find everything at my store:

Http://www.adgshop.com


----------



## @[email protected]

why do you recommend stopping everything but brighty k (potassium?) in the even to algae? 
im curious as to why not stop everything, or continue everything; what makes the brighty k different?


----------



## freph

@[email protected] said:


> why do you recommend stopping everything but brighty k (potassium?) in the even to algae?
> im curious as to why not stop everything, or continue everything; what makes the brighty k different?


I can only theorize that it's because normal levels of potassium don't contribute as much (if at all, I know I dose extra in my 20L) to algal growth when nitrogen and phosphorous are absent or in limited supply but still helps the plants use up the other excess nutrients.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Freph is on the right path.

Of all the nutrients - potassium does not contribute in any way to algae growth. It's also the one thing that Aqua Soil really lacks. So by striking a balance between Aqua Soil and K, you then help balance the nutritional supply in the tank - choking out the algae. 

When used in conjunction with Phyton Git (attacks algae / helps plants attack algae) for example, you deliver a powerful 1-2 punch to algae. Add in Green Gain after a trim, and you've got a 1-2-Knockout. 

It all comes back to :

Healthy Bacteria = Healthy Plants = Healthy Fish.


----------



## david10072

*Hi*

Hi, Frank
First of all, your tank is amazing. I admire your knowledge and skills. I have been following this thread for a while. I have similar set up. I have been building my tank and dosing similar. I have 6 Gallon. Archaea's 27w light. Pressurized CO2 with diffusor. Zoo med 501 with lily in & outlet. I have been keeping ph around 6.4~6.8. Kh 2 Gh 3~4. Temperature around 74. I have been doing water change on time. My light is on 8 hrs a day. I have aqua soil but did not add any substrate additive. I have similar plants.. HC/hairgrass/riccia. 
I am not good with dosing fert. I am using ADA step 1, brighty k as you suggested. Also green bacter every time I change water. I am pretty much following your guide. 
So I am on my fifth week...riccia is doing good and pearling. Hairgrass is sending runners. HC was doing ok. So, I was introduced to Special light. I started dosing and alternating between step1 and special light with one pump per day. Man. The result is amazing. The growth increase extremely. After a week of dosing one pump of special light and step1 two pump of brighty K, I decided to up the dose (just testing to see what would happen). I up the dose to one pump of step1 and special light and two pumps of brighty k. After two days... I started to have BGA on my HC. It is covering my new leaves. I did a 50% water change right away and manually removing the BGA. 
My question is... and I over dosing? I know you mentioned the law of min. Maybe I am short on a certain element.
I need your expert advice. I am here to learn. Thank you for any advice and your time,
David


----------



## david10072

Maybe it's the filter.. zoo med doesn't really create enough flow in the tank.. shopping for eheim 2211 today.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey David,

I'll answer your questions in detail when I get an opportunity (container has me pretty busy right now).

But we do have 2211's available at adgshop.com !


----------



## Ozydego

yeah, I thought it was about time for that shipment... that whole container is probably already sold


----------



## grogan

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey David,
> 
> I'll answer your questions in detail when I get an opportunity (container has me pretty busy right now).
> 
> But we do have 2211's available at adgshop.com !


you know checking the forum while driving a fork lift is dangerous...unless your a pro like myself. Dont break my pallet!


----------



## hidefguy

Hi Frank, I spoke to you this morning on the phone regarding my order, kind of bummed on the back order but oh well I'll just give them a good cleaning. Anyways want to drop in and say thanks and I've learned a lot from this thread, only if you started this in January I wouldn't have gone thru all the heartaches of starting my first planted tank.


----------



## david10072

Here is a list of my tank specs (I borrow your format). Maybe this will help track down problems and improve the tank. Again, your time is appreciated Frank. 










*Core*:
Aquarium: Topless Fluval Edge
Lighting: Archaea 27w Compact Flourescent, 10,000k.
DIY stand.

*Plants*:
Riccia
Dwarf Hairgrass
HC

*Co2 & Distribution*:
Presurized CO2 tank.
Archaea Diffuser
Archaea Single gauge regulator

*Filtration*:
Eheim 2211 

*Substrate*:
Aquasoil, no additive

*Fertilizers and Additives:*
Week 1: Brighty K, Green Bacter

Week 2 to end of Month 3: Brighty K, Green Brighty Step 1, Green Brighty Special Lights (alternate Day 1 = Step 1, Day 2 = Lights, etc Brighty K everyday)
Aquavitro Propel 1mm every other day
Excel 1/3 cap full every day
Kh adjustment, Aquavitro Carbonate
Gh adjustment, Seachem Equilibrium

*Hardscape:*
5 Kei Stones

*Water Change Schedule:*
First week = daily water change (50%-80%)
Second week = water change every other day (50%-80%)
Third week = water change every third day (twice) (50%-80%)
Fourth week onwards = once a week water changes, water change as needed due to algae.

*Water Quality:*
Tap water and dechlorized. 

*Co2 Distribution:*
Enough that Riccia is pearling. Light pearl on HC. 

*Average Co2 cartridge lifespan:*
3~4 weeks 

*Heating:*
none for summer time.

*Age of the tank:*
5th Week


----------



## orchidman

I Frank! i got really busy and dropped off the journal at like page 11. well i just read the whole thing! (i have no life, haha) great evilution of the tank! and your articles are great! 

I've decided to join in on this low budget (im not going to use the term low-tech anymore, thanks to you) challenge! 

luckily i was already planning on doing a tank like this on my own accord, so i already have stuff and im finishing piecing it together!! however, im going to use a canister filter. because i want to 

so here are the specs.... subject to changing though.


*Tank*- Mr Aqua 7.5g bowfront

*Lighting*- Odyssea 24w PC light

*Filtration*- Eheim 2213 with acrylic lily pipes

*Substrate*- Eco-Complete

*Hardscape*- Manzanita wood and stones (not sure what kind, because i havent bought any)

*Plants*- Not entirely sure. Most likely needle leaf java jern (maybe bolbitis or windelov fern instead), Anubias nana 'petitie', moss ( i dont know the ID, a pic is attached.) (im going to make a "moss milkshake" and spread it on the wood and grow it emersed, so i dont need string and it looks awesome), and maybe some singapore moss or riccia. other then that, im not sure. 

*Fish*- Not sure (any suggestions?) i was thinking maybe boraras birggate, or something similar

unknown moss

580248_297789363632273_1044796020_n by orchidman10, on Flickr

a sketch i did the other day, this is what i want from the layout. similar at least, i havent gotten the manzanita yet, so it will be different. (ignore the writing below, its not relevant)


546317_301791866565356_100002036359377_711733_1929271023_n by orchidman10, on Flickr

*Equipment sourced*- tank, substrate, heater, lily pipes, light (still need a bulb though)

thansk for letting me join in the fun!


----------



## Dollface

That looks like terrestrial star moss and won't grow submersed.


----------



## orchidman

It came in a submersed package a while ago...


----------



## Dollface

star moss is commonly sold as "aquatic" in the petco plant sense.


----------



## orchidman

THats depressing it came in the package as a hitchhiker. So that's my only shred of hope. I'll have to try some submersed to be sure then. :/

Do you know of a moss that's similar? I like how it's low and stays close to the ground or wood. Unlike java of christmass moss that will spread all over.


----------



## @[email protected]

orchidman said:


> Do you know of a moss that's similar? I like how it's low and stays close to the ground or wood. Unlike java of christmass moss that will spread all over.


all mosses grow more compact when emersed. moss is non-vascular, so if a piece of it grows to far away from the water source, it dehydrates and dies. underwater, that is no longer an issue, so the moss is free to grow vertically to a greater extent.
i had a java moss carpet in a terrarium, it was lush and green and thick, and didnt show a bit of the dirt underneath, all being only an eighth of an inch thick. and yet submerged, we all know java moss wont grow like that.


----------



## orchidman

Well this "star moss" emersed is lower then other mosses I have growing emersed. You can see the difference between it and Singapore moss. Just in the structure. Like Singapore moss has a "stem" thing with "branches" coming out. Even emersed. This doesn't when emersed. And idk about if it will even live submersed.


----------



## Ozydego

Yeah, I found some of that exact star moss growing in the forest, used it in a terrarium... Didn't do so hot in my aquarium...


----------



## orchidman

Anyone have ideas for a similar moss?


----------



## jcgd

orchidman said:


> Anyone have ideas for a similar moss?


Mini fissidens might be nice.


----------



## david10072

Frank, 
I swapped out the zoo med 501 with eheim 2211. The water circulation is sooo much better. Also, I need a 100% water change and trim down the plant. I started to change my dosage to brighty k, step1, 6 drop green becter and 10 drops phyton git everyday. I start to see the color coming back on HC. The BGA is reduced by 80% and continue to reduce. Is there anything else I need to do? 
David


----------



## talontsiawd

david10072 said:


> Frank,
> I swapped out the zoo med 501 with eheim 2211. The water circulation is sooo much better. Also, I need a 100% water change and trim down the plant. I started to change my dosage to brighty k, step1, 6 drop green becter and 10 drops phyton git everyday. I start to see the color coming back on HC. The BGA is reduced by 80% and continue to reduce. Is there anything else I need to do?
> David


Not to speak for Frank and I am not up on the ADA product line. I will say that increasing flow does wonders for algae and you will likely see things start to turn around. It also allows better distribution of CO2 and since you are getting pearling, you likely have enough going in but better distribution will help with most algae, especially BGA. Just saying you made the right choice. 

I had very good luck with underpowered filters on both high tech and low tech (I know Frank doesn't like these terms) so it took me a while to realize the benefit of using a lot of flow. Congrats on the purchase and seeing good results.


----------



## @[email protected]

flow helps with CO2 distribution, which is WHY it helps with algae. the only algae it really helps with directly, IME, is cyanobacteria. 
some algae do preffer less flow, but there are others which preffer high flow. so you just swap species if all that changes is the flow. but generally, flow carries around the CO2 from your diffuser, increasing the useful CO2 to your plants (since a plant has 0 benefit from a CO2 molecule 3 inches away from it).


----------



## Francis Xavier

Sorry guys for my disappearing-act lately - It's been a wild, wild week getting everything squared since the container hit. 



hidefguy said:


> Hi Frank, I spoke to you this morning on the phone regarding my order, kind of bummed on the back order but oh well I'll just give them a good cleaning. Anyways want to drop in and say thanks and I've learned a lot from this thread, only if you started this in January I wouldn't have gone thru all the heartaches of starting my first planted tank.


Sometimes heaartaches are good with the planted aquarium - if you learned valuable lessons from them! I look forward to seeing great scapes and plant growth from you as you adopt towards the method! 



orchidman said:


> I Frank! i got really busy and dropped off the journal at like page 11. well i just read the whole thing! (i have no life, haha) great evilution of the tank! and your articles are great!
> 
> I've decided to join in on this low budget (im not going to use the term low-tech anymore, thanks to you) challenge!
> 
> luckily i was already planning on doing a tank like this on my own accord, so i already have stuff and im finishing piecing it together!! however, im going to use a canister filter. because i want to
> 
> so here are the specs.... subject to changing though.
> 
> 
> *Tank*- Mr Aqua 7.5g bowfront
> 
> *Lighting*- Odyssea 24w PC light
> 
> *Filtration*- Eheim 2213 with acrylic lily pipes
> 
> *Substrate*- Eco-Complete
> 
> *Hardscape*- Manzanita wood and stones (not sure what kind, because i havent bought any)
> 
> *Plants*- Not entirely sure. Most likely needle leaf java jern (maybe bolbitis or windelov fern instead), Anubias nana 'petitie', moss ( i dont know the ID, a pic is attached.) (im going to make a "moss milkshake" and spread it on the wood and grow it emersed, so i dont need string and it looks awesome), and maybe some singapore moss or riccia. other then that, im not sure.
> 
> *Fish*- Not sure (any suggestions?) i was thinking maybe boraras birggate, or something similar
> 
> unknown moss
> 
> 580248_297789363632273_1044796020_n by orchidman10, on Flickr
> 
> a sketch i did the other day, this is what i want from the layout. similar at least, i havent gotten the manzanita yet, so it will be different. (ignore the writing below, its not relevant)
> 
> 
> 546317_301791866565356_100002036359377_711733_1929271023_n by orchidman10, on Flickr
> 
> *Equipment sourced*- tank, substrate, heater, lily pipes, light (still need a bulb though)
> 
> thansk for letting me join in the fun!


Hey Orchid,

It's great that you read through the whole thread! I believe if you follow the methodology and the step-by-steps laid out here, you can master any layout you wish, and save yourself an immense amount of time, money and frustration.

I look forward to seeing how you approach the low-budget setups. I've basically gotten the formula to a point of substrate/bacteria + water quality + light levels + carbon. 



david10072 said:


> Frank,
> I swapped out the zoo med 501 with eheim 2211. The water circulation is sooo much better. Also, I need a 100% water change and trim down the plant. I started to change my dosage to brighty k, step1, 6 drop green becter and 10 drops phyton git everyday. I start to see the color coming back on HC. The BGA is reduced by 80% and continue to reduce. Is there anything else I need to do?
> David


Hey David,

That's a big step up from the zoo med - and i'm glad you've seen the desired results. The eheim zoo med seems to be more for terrestrial / turtle tank type deals where it's not having to push as much water.

Where as the eheim 2211, for the nano tank it's intended for, does a lot ot stabilize flow as well as give you immensely more medium to work with to grow a bacteria base to help your filtration.

To curb back the remaining BGA, I would recommend Bacter 100 - as this will pretty much eliminate anything left within 24 hours or so. The tricky part with BGA is, if you've killed it quick enough, then you're good, but if it's 'seeded' itself in the substrate you will have to do repeat applications to remove it and have it never come back again.


----------



## talontsiawd

@[email protected] said:


> flow helps with CO2 distribution, which is WHY it helps with algae. the only algae it really helps with directly, IME, is cyanobacteria.
> some algae do preffer less flow, but there are others which preffer high flow. so you just swap species if all that changes is the flow. but generally, flow carries around the CO2 from your diffuser, increasing the useful CO2 to your plants (since a plant has 0 benefit from a CO2 molecule 3 inches away from it).


I have noticed benefits from increased flow with algae in no co2/carbon supplemented tanks. I can't say why it helps, I just know it does. Maybe it's increased CO2 from the atmosphere. I know some algae will thrive on high flow and some in more stagnant water but it seems to help with most types of algae. BBA is one exception I have run into where flow means nothing when we are talking about no CO2 injection. But BBA and Cyano (especially) are the type of algae are am very proactive about because they can be the hardest to get rid of with passive methods like increasing CO2, decreasing light, ferts, etc. They can linger in a balanced tank for a very long time.


----------



## Francis Xavier

talontsiawd said:


> I have noticed benefits from increased flow with algae in no co2/carbon supplemented tanks. I can't say why it helps, I just know it does. Maybe it's increased CO2 from the atmosphere. I know some algae will thrive on high flow and some in more stagnant water but it seems to help with most types of algae. BBA is one exception I have run into where flow means nothing when we are talking about no CO2 injection. But BBA and Cyano (especially) are the type of algae are am very proactive about because they can be the hardest to get rid of with passive methods like increasing CO2, decreasing light, ferts, etc. They can linger in a balanced tank for a very long time.


I can tell you exactly why aquariums with higher flow have a tendency for less algae.

I'll give a $10 gift certificate to the person who can answer the question - if you've read this whole thread, you should know what it is, or at least what's involved!


----------



## Dollface

My shot in the dark is that more flow leads to higher and more efficiently dispersed oxygen levels, which helps boost the beneficial bacteria?


----------



## Francis Xavier

And...Dollface nails it. So much for the stumper.

I didn't expect to actually have to give out a gift certificate!

This means the thread has at least been a good teaching tool!


----------



## Dollface

Whoa wait really?


----------



## david10072

Thank you all the help. I will try and keep you guys posted.


----------



## ADAtank

I won!


----------



## ADAtank

haha/jk :icon_mrgr


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Orchid,
> 
> It's great that you read through the whole thread! I believe if you follow the methodology and the step-by-steps laid out here, you can master any layout you wish, and save yourself an immense amount of time, money and frustration.
> 
> I look forward to seeing how you approach the low-budget setups. I've basically gotten the formula to a point of substrate/bacteria + water quality + light levels + carbon.


i plan to follow the great step-by-step instructions you've laid out. but i wont be able to follow them to the point, when you laid out most of them, you were talking about doing a higher-budget tank, specifically like the mixed carpet iwagumi that this thread was started for. but using the instructions as a guideline, it should accomplish much the same results...so i hope :flick:

since this is low-budget (right now, low is the only budget i have), what would you suggest i do since i wont have any of the liquid supplements from ADA? as for the substrate additives, i likely wont have need for them, since most.all of the plants i will use will be epiphytic or mosses tied to something, i will just use a decorative white sand. 

do you have any tips on how to keep initial startup algae at bay? other then daily waterchanges for the first week or two..

as for the formula, substrate/bacteria + water quality + light levels + carbon. 

substrate/bacteria-my substrate will be purely decorative, and thus VERY shallow. so ill have to rely on the large filter and whatever can live on the plants/rocks/wood for the bacteria hosting.

Water quality- i plan on frequent water changes, paired with good maintenance and a large filter, to maintain good water qaulity

Light levels- im using a 24w PC light, so it will not be very bright, so as to help combat algae. since im not planning on using fertilizers or pressurized co2, i want to keep the light low, so as to keep everything balanced.

carbon- none of the plants i will be using are overly demanding. im going to guess that in water there is already dissolved a small amount of carbon, otherwise why would myself and other people be able to grow plants without the assistance of added carbon? so im hoping to rely on the carbon that is present (hopefully) already, keeping in balance the low nutrient levels, and low light level.

this is my plan, there may be faults in it, if anyone finds one, pllease do let me know!


----------



## plantbrain

Dollface said:


> Whoa wait really?


Yep, I kept my mouth shut:redface:


----------



## orchidman

i have a question, in your earlier posts, you say that for the first month, your filtration media should be 20% mechanicsal, 80% carbon. what would time line be for changing it progressively so you get to the goal of 100% biological?


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> i have a question, in your earlier posts, you say that for the first month, your filtration media should be 20% mechanicsal, 80% carbon. what would time line be for changing it progressively so you get to the goal of 100% biological?


Yes - for the first month the combination is:

Bio Cube 20 (available Monday) - 20%
NA Carbon / Bamboo Charcoal - 80%

After about the first month - second month:

Bio Cube 20 - 20%
Bio Rio (biological) - 80%

After the fifth month:

Bio Rio - 100%


----------



## david10072

Hey Frank,
I started adding phyton git, increasing nitrogen, and water flow. Guess what, the cyano is 99.99% gone. Well now I have a bit of milky water tho. Any suggestion?


----------



## orchidman

Thanks! I've decided to make a tank journal. Like an old fashion one, like on real paper! I have my specs, plan, maintenance plan, and filter media timeline. Along with a new sketch of what my goal is... I can post the sketch if you want.....


----------



## @[email protected]

try cleaning your filter and pipes and then add some carbon and (seachem) purigen.
it did the trick any time my water got cloudy.


----------



## Francis Xavier

AQUASKY is here:



Unveiling:




What does this mean?

New layout in the mini m time.


----------



## frrok

SWEET! cant wait to see the results


----------



## cawolf86

Oooo nice.


----------



## freph

It's like a dirty magazine but for aquarium equipment. Yowza. That is one sleek fixture...looks even better than in the advertisement for it.


----------



## orchidman

moar pictures!!!


----------



## talontsiawd

I very curious what you think about the AQUASKY, especially long term. I understand the look but I am a bit disappointed as it doesn't fit my personal style as good as the Solar series. I am thinking about biting the bullet on an ADA tank for my 30th birthday and space constraints mean a nano, unfortunately. 36 CM is about perfect for me and the AQUASKY is an option.


----------



## Francis Xavier

This thing is absolutely beautiful - and I've seen a lot I LED lights. So far this is the only one that does it right for the planted.



When I plugged it in, my roommate and I both went "owe, bright!" at the same time, immediately afterwords she goes: "whoa that's cool, is that that new light?"





This thing really is...very bright!


----------



## Erirku

now its time to plant!!! so we can see if it works well !!!


----------



## BS87

I actually don't like the way that looks. The heatsink part is nice, but the legs/housing just look silly to me. Still interested in how it turns out though.


----------



## pwolfe

I'd like it more if it had a way to be hung. I agree, the thick acrylic legs are distracting.


----------



## Francis Xavier

You can actually unattach the light and heat sink from the casing and mount it to something else. I'll show a picture later.

Basically the light & heat sink is separate from the acrylic stand.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Francis Xavier said:


> You can actually unattach the light and heat sink from the casing and mount it to something else. I'll show a picture later.
> 
> Basically the light & heat sink is separate from the acrylic stand.


Nice. A gooseneck mount would look awesome.


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

I just _really_ wish it were lower...


----------



## [email protected]

*First Day in the Planted Tank Forums.*

I see everyone subscribing to your post. How do I do that so I can follow along in my adventures in starting a planted tank. I'm sure your posting this will be of great help to this noob.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

[email protected] said:


> I see everyone subscribing to your post. How do I do that so I can follow along in my adventures in starting a planted tank. I'm sure your posting this will be of great help to this noob.


By posting, you've subbed, if your profile is set for that (I think that's the default). If not, you can go to the top of page, click on "Thread Tools" and you'll see a subscribe button.


----------



## [email protected]

2wheelsx2 said:


> By posting, you've subbed, if your profile is set for that (I think that's the default). If not, you can go to the top of page, click on "Thread Tools" and you'll see a subscribe button.


 

Thanks 2wheelsx2. Going to Thread Tools and then selecting subscribe did the trick


----------



## trenton

I agree with other peoples comments, the legs are distracting from rimless tank. 

I also think it would look better if the legs were the same thickness as the tank glass and if the colour of the acrylic was matched to that of the glass to make it a more unified look. 
It is still pretty slick though!

By the way. I have been watching this thread for quite a while and have pulled quite a bit of invaluable information from it. Great job on your how-to entries. Very helpful!


----------



## orchidman

I'm not a fan of how it looks either. It looks too chunky. I like the solar series better!


----------



## @[email protected]

to be honest, im not that crazy about the fixture itself. i think it is larger than it needs to be. they could have made the acylic top smaller, to just be a small edge around the LED setup, and the legs could be a lot thinner. 
the light however, looks very nice and bright. can you control any of the LEDs separately (turn only some on, dim some, etc.)? thats what i find alluring about LEDs (yet to actually shell out the cash for one), that you can have a legit sunrise/set, and different colored LEDs in on at different times to simulate clouds vs full sun, and stuff like that. they give much more control than the crappy power compacts i have been using.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*The tear down*



I took down the old layout, and had about enough plant matter to fill a 60-P (24" x 14" footprint).

In taking out the old main stone, I had forgotten just how large the stone was - removing it revealed a gaping chasm of untouched aquasoil and a root density from the plants so thick that there was nothing but a wall of white surrounding it.

Before the tear down, I of course got a final shot for IAPLC - but you'll have to wait to see that photo for a while, unfortunately.

*Onwards, to the new layout*

With the amount of plant matter I had, I was lucky that's wanted to reuse much of the same plants. It's important to have a degree of repetition as you learn, so you can truly master how each plant grows for increasingly complex layouts.




_Divider for sand and aqua soil - sand in the front and Bacter 100, Clear Super, Tourmaline BC, Penac W and Penac P under where the Aqua Soil Amazonia will go_

For this layout I want to use sand and the new Unzan stone - sand + Riccia is a combo I've longed wanted to do. I briefly thought about driftwood and stems, but I have stems going in the 60-P and I really wanted to use Unzan stone, so that won the day.

You can see in the above photo my make shift divider for where aqua soil is - I used all of the substrate additives to create that base of bacteria and acidity neutralizing positive effects of Penac, etc (which, evidently is used in Germany to remove toxic sludge from environments and aid in root development of new plants).



_Final Fantasy divider and AQUASKY - a match made in heaven._

A fun filled fact - Square is the same age I am - and company launched in the same month no less!

Being too lazy to take photos of Riccia stone tying and hair grass planting, I'll move on:



Unzan stone has nifty pockets which can be filled with aqua soil (or have a wabi kusa planted in them) - since I haven't got a wabi kusa that size - I've opted to fill with aqua soil, but first I put one spoon of Bacter 100 and Clear Super in the pockets before filling with aqua soil - this way the tennellus I plan to put there has direct access to the same beneficial effects.

*Mini M layout: Shimmer Sands*



Plants: 

Dwarf Hair Grass (eleocharis acicularis)
Riccia Fluitans
E. tennellus

Stone:

Unzan stone 

Nile Sand + Aqua Soil & Additives - no power sand this time since the slope in the back isn't as dramatic and there is only limited areas of soil.

Dosing, first week:

Brighty K ( 1 squirt) + Green Bacter (5-6 drops)





Once the roots of the tennellus get established I'll trim them down to the base - right now they're a bit overbearing.


----------



## frrok

is adg going to be selling that Unzan stone?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Yes, as well as branch wood & horn wood.

Will be up probably Monday or Tuesday.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Nice vesicular basalt.


----------



## freph

Got any leftover tennellus/riccia/etc you're willing to sell? I'd be happy to take it off of your hands. :hihi:


----------



## icepotato89

cool light, if it were me i would try bury one of the stones deeper. at the moment they look a bit too symetrical to my eyes. awesome thread!


----------



## CmLaracy

icepotato89 said:


> cool light, if it were me i would try bury one of the stones deeper. at the moment they look a bit too symetrical to my eyes. awesome thread!


Gotta agree with this, the stones look like identical twins. Not only are they VERY simliar stones in almost every way, they are also arranged in almost the same exact way. One of them could definitely use some turning and lowering as icepotato mentions; I'd say the right one for sure, as opposed to the left. Also, it looks good right now, but between how intense the light is and how high up it is, that tenellus in the stone will quickly become way to thick IME. Looks promising though. I like the in-depth progression in this journal, very informative regardless of if you agree with it all or not :thumbsup:


----------



## orchidman

i agree. although im sure you have a good reason for what you did, to my untrained eye it looks like the stones are wayyy to similar...


and seeing the aquasky now, i wish the legs were shorter, just like kiran said!


----------



## fplata

This is the most useful thread I have seen. Thank you!! and yes i read every single post. keep it comming


----------



## Francis Xavier

I set out on my normal water regime for a new tank - if you've been keeping up so far then you know the method calls for one water change a day for the first week.

For your viewing pleasure, I have wonderfully unique photographs of the tank looking almost exactly as it did a two days ago.

Except one photo has half the water in it:



And the other is presumably after the water change, I could have just photoshopped it though:



(it really is after the water change).

This layout will go quick - I'm invisioning simulans tetra as the go to guys maybe even some microrasbora kubotai - since they won't get as drowned out in this layout.

And to round out the day, here is a cameo of the 60-P:


----------



## orchidman

60-p looks great!!

in the mini-m, any reason the substrate isnt straight?


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> 60-p looks great!!
> 
> in the mini-m, any reason the substrate isnt straight?


Yes: laziness and no sense of urgency (substrate line).

If I had a carpeting plant I'd have an extreme sense of urgency to get it and keep it straight.

But here I'll wait until water changes are twice a week to bother since nothing will grow with the sand


----------



## @[email protected]

the 60P looks excellent. the red in the back, is that r. colorata?


----------



## orchidman

sounds like a good reason, lol!

you do water changes everyday for the 1st week, every other day for the 2nd week, and two times a week for the 3rd week?


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> the 60P looks excellent. the red in the back, is that r. colorata?


Yeah, the R. Colorata kind of took over. It's a super thick bush now. Also, it was supposed to be more orangish, but everything in that tank, if it can turn red, is the deepest possible red it can be. 

R. Wallichi is in there, R. Bangladesh (which you can literally watch grow a few inches in an hour once it gets going) and D. Diandra. Also some H. Pinnatafolia, which I'll have to watch since it's behaved and stayed small - which means in about a week I am betting it explodes in size. 

In the end there may be too much red!



orchidman said:


> sounds like a good reason, lol!
> 
> you do water changes everyday for the 1st week, every other day for the 2nd week, and two times a week for the 3rd week?


Yes.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I also fear I might be turning into the "Riccia & Tennellus Guy"


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> I also fear I might be turning into the "Riccia & Tennellus Guy"


I see no problem in this. Healthy plants are available and you get cash in your pocket for spare plants. What's not to like about that?


----------



## orchidman

Thanks! I'm gonna follow that retiming too!


----------



## orchidman

frank- what do you think about this light? http://www.adana-usa.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=667 (do you sell this one?) my tank is 18" wide and 10" tall. it would be for the low-budget one.. which means no co2. thanks!


----------



## Chlorophile

Francis Xavier said:


> I also fear I might be turning into the "Riccia & Tennellus Guy"


You do well with Riccia, I loathe that plant but it looked good in the last layout!

edit: I love those rocks, damn! Is it okay to use only 2 stones ;] Hah, I kid, it looks great with just 2 given their size and complexity.


----------



## trenton

Just wanted to say that this thread has been a great resource for me in figuring out everything I needed/wanted to do with my own tank. I learnt a lot from reading through the pages. 
Keep up the great work!

Cheers,
-T


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'm sorry for the lack of updates of late guys & gals. 

Honestly, it's been a bit hectic keeping pace with demand lately! 

I did, however get to take pictures along the way.


Day 4:




The Amazing part here - is that after such a short period of time the Riccia is 'standing up,' and growing in very small and tight. Normally the time it took for it to begin growing like this under MH and CF bulbs was about 1.5-2 weeks, and the leaf pattern was broader and wider until trimming occurred.

Day 5:



Day 7:



By the end of the first week the Riccia was nearly fully grown in, standing tall and very very tiny. 

Also, at the end of Day 7, I began dosing Green Brighty Special Lights, so the dosing became x1 Special Lights + x1 Brighty K (squirts).

Day 9:



Day 10:



The Former Layout:

Day 3:










Day 4:










Day 6:










Day 7:










Day 8:










Day 11:










With the previous Solar Mini M - it took til the 11th day for Riccia to start really pearling, etc. 

The difference between growth patterns here, is that under the Solar Mini M it grew much taller and broader. Under the AQUASKY, it's been coming in a lot shorter and much, much thinner, more nano sized. 

The Tennellus and the Hair Grass though, are definitely going through some adjustments, they're transition from the light types and uprooting / re-planting. New growth is clean and slender in, which tells me that both plants should be trimmed here in the next few days. Root growth is pitch white - an excellent sign of health in plants.


----------



## Francis Xavier

For those looking to the 60-P, here are more recent photos after a trim.

After trim:





Today, two days later after trim right after lights came on:



The layout here is approaching its final shot for completion. Stems usually take about a 3 month process of trimming and pruning to get a full bodied look.

Daily Dosing: Brighty K x8 squirts, Green Brighty Step 1 x8 squirts 

ECA x10 drops, Phyton Git x8 drops, Green Gain x5 drops.

After water change: Green Bacter x15 drops


----------



## mluk27

Its incredible the difference between the AQUASKY and Solar mini, makes me want one even more. I really love the rock in there too. Does the LED have a ripple effect like a MH? 

The 60p is looking incredible, I love the red stem plant. It should look incredible when the stem plants grow in more in the back.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Unzan Stone is finally available for purchase!

We also made a 60-P video of the use of Unzan stone here.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> With the previous Solar Mini M - it took til the 11th day for Riccia to start really pearling, etc.
> 
> The difference between growth patterns here, is that under the Solar Mini M it grew much taller and broader. Under the AQUASKY, it's been coming in a lot shorter and much, much thinner, more nano sized.


Why do you think that is? What about people who want taller and broader? I'm having a tough time keeping my HC Cuba "big" and "wide", would the small size be an indicator of low Co2? 










I glanced over your thread on the lights, I guess ADA keeping it's trade secret because I'm not sure what makes these LEDs different from others. Regardless, I actually really want to get one, it's just ADA products are kind of non-existance up here in Canada. 

Did you happen to measure the PAR of the lights?


----------



## 2wheelsx2

FlyingHellFish said:


> Regardless, I actually really want to get one, it's just ADA products are kind of non-existance up here in Canada.


Not sure where you are, but many people out west here have ADA products. 
The official distributor is in Vancouver: http://www.miyabi-aqua.com/

He was even featured on Global News: http://www.globaltvbc.com/video/index.html?v=fEz3BQ1rTfcIuzolzJ1HStYTBApkHfsA#fullnewscast/video

Starts at 35:05


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Speaking of which, Frank actually suggested I go miyabi when I asked him about an ADA set up. Very nice of him looking out for the hobbyist instead of being all business. I'm east coast and they are west, I'll inquire about shipping.

Anyways, nice progress you got going, I like the new look. Wish my HC Cuba were all uniform in size like yours.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> Why do you think that is? What about people who want taller and broader? I'm having a tough time keeping my HC Cuba "big" and "wide", would the small size be an indicator of low Co2?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I glanced over your thread on the lights, I guess ADA keeping it's trade secret because I'm not sure what makes these LEDs different from others. Regardless, I actually really want to get one, it's just ADA products are kind of non-existance up here in Canada.
> 
> Did you happen to measure the PAR of the lights?


Hey Flying,

The ADA LED light is a mix of 7000k and 8000k bulbs for a pure white spectrum.

I haven't measured PAR yet. 

Generally more intense light = more compact, smaller growth. Less intense light = broader, bigger growth since things have to "reach" for lights.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Anniversary Premium Goods are here!!

_And they are *gorgeous*_. I couldn't resist putting together a set of my own from the initial order.

_Pro Razor Mini, Anniversary_


_I honestly didn't expect the patterning to be *this cool!*_


_Pro Scissors Short Type - Silver_


_A Fancy Shot - The other tool is Pro Scissors Short - Black & Silver Pattern_


_I didn't buy one of these yet (quantities are extremely limited) - but the laser engraving here is *beautiful* on the Co2 Advanced System_





I'll have some "action shots" later.


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Beautiful new equipment.


----------



## freph

You're welcome for partially funding that tool purchase.  They look quite nice.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*A Post of Some Value Rather than just shiny pictures*

So it's gotten to be about time to trim everything back. I have to admit, I didn't expect Tennellus to have such a rough transition time from the last layout (it had a lot of melting here), but all is well. 

Today, I'm going to do just some regular maintenance after the two week mark:

1. Clean Filter Hose and Lily Pipes
2. Clean Diffuser
3. Clean Algae off the glass of the tank
4. Trim



Pro Razor Mini is my new favorite tool ever. It's infinitely easier to scrape algae off the glass with this tool, due to the long handle (and consequently your hand not getting in the way). _I can't believe I didn't buy one of these earlier._



When scraping the algae off the glass, make clean straight "up and down" passes - from top of the tank, to the top of th esubstrate layer. Only one or two passes should get everything off the glass and you'll be good to go.







Before moving on to trimming, I'm going to go ahead and take the dirty diffuser and clean it up real quick. Putting 1-2 capfuls of Superge into a Clean Bottle filled to the neck line (the point where the container goes from a 90 degree angle to a 45 degree angle) is sufficient enough to totally clean and polish the glassware. 

I put my lily pipes here too for nano size.



Easy!



Now it's time for the trim. Here I'm going to go ahead and cut the Tennellus all the way down to the base, as well as the Hair Grass in the back, and surprisingly, the Riccia in the front. When you trim you might as well go trim everything to keep the timing of the layout in sync. 

Using Pro Scissors Short - Curve Type, Anniversary Black & Silver.



And we're all done! The diffuser and Lily Pipes are all nice and clean (I didn't get any photos of cleaning tubing with Spring Washer's, since I was distracted by a conversation, but that was the other step, just simply putting a spring washer brush through the lily pipes and tubes).

You can also see the results of the trimming here.

Dosing: Green Bacter after water change.

Alternating: Green Brighty Step 1 & Special Lights every other day x2 squirts, Brighty K x2 squirts.

Amano shrimp will need to be added sometime in the next week or so - there's some nice brown algae for them to munch on and devour.


----------



## BruceF

Why does Amano always seem to prefer the 7000- 8000K range?


----------



## Chlorophile

Dang... I really want one of those glass scrapers!


----------



## freph

Chlorophile said:


> Dang... I really want one of those glass scrapers!


Right? AFA sells the mini one for $65...Frank, care to hook us up?


----------



## talontsiawd

It's weird, I was looking at some ADA stuff not to long ago and thought that they were having some design crisis lol. Now it makes sense what I was looking at, the 20th Anniversary stuff.


Thank looks great Frank. What is your thoughts on that light now that you have had it for a bit?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Will have the pro razor mini up tomorrow to be available! As well as the other goods!


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> Will have the pro razor mini up tomorrow to be available! As well as the other goods!


Bazinga! I'll have to get up with you on that one.



talontsiawd said:


> Thank looks great Frank. What is your thoughts on that light now that you have had it for a bit?


I'm curious about this as well. The light looks great! You did mention it was working quite well in one of your previous posts, though. Much faster, healthier growth and such.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I love the new light. I'll continue to judge it's plant growth as Hair Grass and Tenellus grow back - tennellus already sent out many runners, which I hadn't noticed. For two weeks in, that's amazing (it took a full month for tenellus to send runners last time). 

Riccia is an excellent judge - since it's a very finnacky plant if it doesn't get everything it craves - major nutrient & light hog. 

My next scape with this setup will be a full blown stem-driftwood layout, so that'll add another dimension to 'testing.' Though it's hardly necessary - as my confidence level with it is that it just grows everything based on how it has grown Riccia so far. 

The only concern is that it might grow hairgrass in too short for the way I want it to display in this layout! I'd actually prefer it with more height. The new hairgrass growth has been tight and smaller in growth.


----------



## frrok

Hey Frank, did you guys get the new
Cube glass cabinet clear? Just saw ADA's newsletter that they came out with one for he mini-m and cube. Looks sweet. Any idea on pricing?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Frrok,

We have the old style Cube Glass Cabinet Clear for Mini M & Mini S(which has some extra overhang on the left for filtration pipes to go through instead of being 100% flush).

We'll get some of the new style though, the only difference between the two is 100% flush vs. not (from Solar Mini)


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Frrok,
> 
> We have the old style Cube Glass Cabinet Clear for Mini M & Mini S(which has some extra overhang on the left for filtration pipes to go through instead of being 100% flush).
> 
> We'll get some of the new style though, the only difference between the two is 100% flush vs. not (from Solar Mini)


Ok cool! Thx for the info.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I added Amano's yesterday to the Mini M. 6 to be exact. It was about time to have that nuisance algae's removed. 

However, I couldn't get a photo for you, so instead I'll distract with more cameo appearances from the 60-P:



_Still My Favorite New Toy. 



This was just a cool picture - I didn't take it, the resident woman of the apartment did, and then edited it with snapseed, a rather awesome app on the iPhone.
_


----------



## freph

Pro Razer looks like it'll be worth its weight in gold. Can't wait to see how it performs. Not sure what kind of pencilfish those are, but they look _amazing_ against the riccia and in that tank in general.


----------



## @[email protected]

love that shot of the fish in the r. fluitans.


----------



## IWANNAGOFAST

When can we buy the special anniversary tools?


----------



## fplata

Adgshop.com is where I will be getting mine from. Great customer service there as well


----------



## Francis Xavier

Anniversary Goods will be available Monday!


----------



## Francis Xavier

The top 200 IAPLC results have been announced! 

You can see them at http://en.iaplc.com - beware though, server times are being slow.

Click on "announce of top 200 layouts" to view them. If there are any aquascapes up there you recognize from the owners, be kind and keep the user anonymous. 

If you submitted a contest entry this year, you should have received an email which will allow you to vote on 3 of the entries.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Progress on the Cube Garden 60-P:



This tank has been pretty pleasant to deal with so far - no real issues, stems are going thickly (the trick here is to constantly retrim once they hit the surface, each time trimming a little higher and higher to form a thick bush).

Although Rotala Colorata has become dominant - and while there are things I would change about this layout now, at this time I'm just waiting to get a final shot then begin a new project. 

Stems are an excellent plant and among my favorite now - because they are truly a plant to cultivate, train and prune. You shape them into the type of layout you want and over time get to see the changes. 



It'll be time for a trim again very soon.

Dosing: 

Brighty K x10 squirts
Green Brighty Special Lights x10 (alternate with Step 2 x10 every other day)
ECA x10 drops
Phyton Git x5 drops
Green Gain x10 daily after trimming, x5 after water change.

_P.S. Follow my blog on tumblr - http://wazeter.tumblr.com/ for extra bonuses to this content. Each major update here in the Journal will have a corresponding entry there with added content!_


----------



## Bunbuku

Frank is that your tank #128 on IAPLC? If so congratulations:biggrin:!!


----------



## @[email protected]

looking good.
im still in love with your r. colorata.
though if i may offer a suggestion, you might want to replace the hygro. it looks a bit out of place in its current position.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*In Memoriam.*

Cube Garden 60-F Iwagumi

﻿I received a phone call today. The kind of phone call you never wish for, but will inevitably receive. While at the office, there was a phone message from a client and friend of mine's sister - pondering this occurrence, I picked up the phone. 

Immediately his sister mentioned having visited once and asked me if I had remembered a customer named Khoa Pham. I said "of course I remember Khoa, I hear he got into medical school, how's he doing?"

She corrected me with the specific field of study and mentioned how hard he had worked, and with some hesitation told me "well, I don't know if you've heard, but...Khoa past. He always spoke very highly of you, and I...just wanted you to know."

This was incredibly shocking news to receive. I remember Khoa very well. The real answer to her question is Khoa was my first real customer shortly after joining ADG and taking over ADA USA in August 2010.

Of course there were plenty of people before him who had bought things from me - but he was the first person I taught aquascaping to and the first person who fully engaged in the complete philosophy of Nature Aquarium. _The first ﻿real customer﻿ I ever had_. The kind of person who was passionate about his hobby and always eager to learn more. I sensed that he probably really enjoyed life as well. He was an upbeat and positive guy, enthusiastic all around.

*The video I've linked is his.* Somehow the scape and the music is extremely fitting. 

In what little way I had an impact on his life, I'm grateful for it. I'm grateful that he was able to find incredible enjoyment from Nature Aquarium, and I'm grateful that he made this video that I can share with you today while in remembrance.

I've decided to dedicate my IAPLC 2012 layout entry to him. You can find it listed here, though I'm not able to reveal which one it is directly.

*Thank's Khoa. Thanks for being so great. *


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

That is very unfortunate news to hear... I remember seeing his 60-F journal, it was one of the reasons I decided to make the jump to an ADA tank. Very sad to hear, considering how young he must have been. Rest in peace.


----------



## Hayden

This was my favorite tank, so sad to know he's passed.


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> *In Memoriam.*
> 
> Cube Garden 60-F Iwagumi
> 
> ﻿I received a phone call today. The kind of phone call you never wish for, but will inevitably receive. While at the office, there was a phone message from a client and friend of mine's sister - pondering this occurrence, I picked up the phone.
> 
> Immediately his sister mentioned having visited once and asked me if I had remembered a customer named Khoa Pham. I said "of course I remember Khoa, I hear he got into medical school, how's he doing?"
> 
> She corrected me with the specific field of study and mentioned how hard he had worked, and with some hesitation told me "well, I don't know if you've heard, but...Khoa past. He always spoke very highly of you, and I...just wanted you to know."
> 
> This was incredibly shocking news to receive. I remember Khoa very well. The real answer to her question is Khoa was my first real customer shortly after joining ADG and taking over ADA USA in August 2010.
> 
> Of course there were plenty of people before him who had bought things from me - but he was the first person I taught aquascaping to and the first person who fully engaged in the complete philosophy of Nature Aquarium. _The first ﻿real customer﻿ I ever had_. The kind of person who was passionate about his hobby and always eager to learn more. I sensed that he probably really enjoyed life as well. He was an upbeat and positive guy, enthusiastic all around.
> 
> *The video I've linked is his.* Somehow the scape and the music is extremely fitting.
> 
> In what little way I had an impact on his life, I'm grateful for it. I'm grateful that he was able to find incredible enjoyment from Nature Aquarium, and I'm grateful that he made this video that I can share with you today while in remembrance.
> 
> I've decided to dedicate my IAPLC 2012 layout entry to him. You can find it listed here, though I'm not able to reveal which one it is directly.
> 
> *Thank's Khoa. Thanks for being so great. *


So sorry about your friend. RIP.


----------



## @[email protected]

i remember that tank.
thats pretty sad.
you have my condolences.


----------



## freph

That tank was actually one of the ones that got me into the whole planted tank scene. RIP to a truly inspirational aquascaper and person.


----------



## theblondskeleton

A great tribute, Frank. And his tank reflected a talent and passion for what you introduced to him. Sorry for your loss.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I shall pass on all your well wishes to the family in the letter I am writing them tonight. 

*I've decided that I'll put my mind to writing a book on Nature Aquarium.*


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> *I've decided that I'll put my mind to writing a book on Nature Aquarium.*


not a bad idea, id certainly buy a copy.


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

@[email protected] said:


> not a bad idea, id certainly buy a copy.


Likewise.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just a quick photo update of the 60-P, it's currently won my favorite child award between it and the Mini M for now. 

Honestly, it has everything to do with this amazing Rotala Colorata thicket:



Close up:



and, since the green glow on top blocks a top down view, this was the first time I really got a look from the top:



The key has been repeat trimmings in a gradient, green gain, ECA and alternating between special lights and step 1.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

I agree, the Rotala thicket makes the scape.


----------



## @[email protected]

+1
LOVE the rotala


----------



## Ozydego

Frank, can you explain trimming in a gradient? Do you mean trimming the outsides shorter than the middle to create the rounded effect? Do you trim the entire area at the same time or do alternating stems so that the bush does not show the trim as much?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Ozydego said:


> Frank, can you explain trimming in a gradient? Do you mean trimming the outsides shorter than the middle to create the rounded effect? Do you trim the entire area at the same time or do alternating stems so that the bush does not show the trim as much?


Sure, I can explain it.

Number one is that when you trim, it's best to just trim everything you can - so when I go to trim the thicket, I also trim the Riccia, etc. Though in cases like Riccia and Rotala Colorata in this instance at the very least, they outgrow everything in the tank, so I won't always trim the Tennellus, etc. with them. 

This is why it's important to stick to a few core plant types and slowly get more complicated as your scaping and pruning skills evolve rather than always using new plants. Learn their growth rates, etc. For trimming. The Didiplis Diandra for example can't really be trimmed at all since it's so slow growing. 

As for the trim technique itself you can see it expressed better here: 



Essentially you are doing your trimming in a diagonal line - trim shorter in the front, taller in the back. Over time you get a gradient of stems going backwards. 

As you continue to trim and prune a stem plant mass, they get thicker as they grow back with two nodes replacing the original, and this is how you get the thick and lush look.


----------



## Francis Xavier

From:










Next:



















Then From Algae Mess to Clean in 3 days:










Second Day:










Day 3:










The Tank on June 15:










The Tank June 30th:



July 9th:



Yesterday:


----------



## alkatraz

Wow just spent ~4 hours over 2 days reading this epic thread from start to finish. Fantastic info and great to see some healthy, constructive debate/discussion in here as well. Thank you for sharing Frank!! :thumbsup: Subscribed


----------



## Francis Xavier

It's been a while. I apologize about that. 

I've been all over the place lately and the aquariums are more or less on auto-pilot. 










This tank might look familiar - and it would if you've watched this video by Khoa Pham.

Upon Khoa's passing, I inherited the setup that he put together some 2 years ago, a 60-F system that under the cabinet looked like a car you might see in Fast and the Furious. 

He had clearly been in the middle of something new at the time of the tear down. The process of disassembly took most of the afternoon - not because it was particularly complicated, but rather because I could tell his sister had been effected by the whole process of managing the belongings he left behind. Very carefully I took it apart, piece by piece, cleaning each item back to it's originally condition and placing them back in the original boxes that left my hands some 2 years ago, now returning in an odd twist of fate.

There's a deeper philosophical meaning behind all of this - about the temporeal aspect of Nature Aquarium. Perhaps a reflection of our lives and the temporary imprints we put on the earth. 

In the end, Nature Aquarium is what we make it. It can be a precise measurement of science or it can take on deep philosophical meanings and become reflections of our personalities and outlook on life. 









_A long overdue update photo of the Mini M_

Layouts take on a life and whimsy of their own - in part a reflection of us, in part a reflection on what we want to be and where we want to go. They contain our dreams and aspirations; past and present. Their temporary imprints on the world bring joy, frustration, excitement, creation and ultimately destruction. Each new layout is a clean slate and a new opportunity for learning, free of the restrictions of it's predecessor. 

There's much we can learn from that. 

_Ultimately, it is whatever you make it to be and nothing more. _


----------



## freph

A very philosophical and heartfelt post. Always something worth reading from you, Frank. Hopefully Khoa's family is doing well...The tanks look amazing. Any plans to setup the 60-F in memory of your friend, or what's happening with all that lovely equipment? From reading his thread, he put a lot of work into the tank...


----------



## @[email protected]

love the way the mini m is looking.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Thanks Marko!

In other news, ADG's resident dog, heretofore referred to as Demon Dog (a doberman), *ate my Riccia*.

Now this particular Doberman has an affinity for aquariums - not the aquariums themselves, but for messing with anything aquaria related. While spending any time doing maintenance on an aquarium she will steal anything from nets to algae pads to buckets and as fast as possible run across the way.

Indeed, on my desk there were quite a few items, including:

Lunch
Paperwork
Riccia in Ziplock bags.

Out of all the options, she immediately went for the Riccia, foregoing Lunch and Paperwork, opened the ziplock bags and devoured the contents inside. Consequently, she spent the next 20 minutes running around ADG with a ziplock bag covering her mouth (she didn't eat any of the bag itself, rather tore it open and ate the Riccia) knowing precisely what she was guilty of.

*Suddenly, I have an idea for a new, all natural dog treat.*


----------



## freph

Now I'm starting to wonder where you got the Riccia for my shipment yesterday... :confused1: :hihi:


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Now I'm starting to wonder where you got the Riccia for my shipment yesterday... :confused1: :hihi:


I did mention it was freshly fertilized, no?


----------



## SaltyNC

Francis Xavier said:


> In other news, ADG's resident dog, heretofore referred to as Demon Dog (a doberman), *ate my Riccia*.
> 
> *Suddenly, I have an idea for a new, all natural dog treat.*


Maybe that's the secret ingredient in crack-for-dogs (aka Greenies). :icon_bigg


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> I did mention it was freshly fertilized, no?


Remind me to stay away from special ADG exclusive all-natural wabi-kusa. :hihi:


----------



## Stussi613

Frank,

I, like someone else mentioned, just spent a few hours each evening for the last few days reading this journal in its entirety. I came cross it in the nano forum after posting some shots of my Fluval Edge looking for critique/advice - i noticed it mainly because of the title. 

I've learned quite a bit and gotten some great ideas for what I'm going to do with the tank from reading your journal. 

Your tanks look amazing and I appreciate all the effort you've gone through to lay out your methods and show the results. Thanks for that. 

I also want to say that in reading about your friend that passed away and your deep and resounding sorrow for his passing that I can't help but respect you and commend you for dedicating this journal to him. Thanks for that too.


----------



## theblondskeleton

The mini-M looks fantastic  I admit to being a bit skeptical at first, but that riccia looks delicious... er, I mean... great!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Stussi613 said:


> Frank,
> 
> I, like someone else mentioned, just spent a few hours each evening for the last few days reading this journal in its entirety. I came cross it in the nano forum after posting some shots of my Fluval Edge looking for critique/advice - i noticed it mainly because of the title.
> 
> I've learned quite a bit and gotten some great ideas for what I'm going to do with the tank from reading your journal.
> 
> Your tanks look amazing and I appreciate all the effort you've gone through to lay out your methods and show the results. Thanks for that.
> 
> I also want to say that in reading about your friend that passed away and your deep and resounding sorrow for his passing that I can't help but respect you and commend you for dedicating this journal to him. Thanks for that too.


Thanks a lot for the feedback Stussi! I'm glad that you've gained value out of the journal process. 

It's an odd thing - this hobby, especially at the professional level. I believe connections are more readily formed due to the niche culture of the hobby itself and the intense teacher / student, mentor / mentee relationships that form to pass on knowledge. As such, most people move beyond "just a customer," and into new realms.



theblondskeleton said:


> The mini-M looks fantastic  I admit to being a bit skeptical at first, but that riccia looks delicious... er, I mean... great!


Thanks!


----------



## Ajax_xajA

Turned this into a well-spent 2-3 hours of reading at work 

I can't remember if you've addressed this in previous posts, but how do you maintain the riccia carpet looking at a long-term tank? I'm thinking of starting a mini riccia carpet held down with SS mesh, but from what I've heard, it's a high maintenance plant that requires a lot of trimming and retying. Any way around all of this?

Regardless, thanks for all the info, it was a wonderful read and I'm glad that you took out the time to do this for all of us. Beautiful pictures!


----------



## javajaws

Francis Xavier said:


> Thanks Marko!
> 
> In other news, ADG's resident dog, heretofore referred to as Demon Dog (a doberman), *ate my Riccia*.


LOL I knew that dog was trouble! I think she's trying to tell you she needs a little doberman playmate named Riccy.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Ajax_xajA said:


> Turned this into a well-spent 2-3 hours of reading at work
> 
> I can't remember if you've addressed this in previous posts, but how do you maintain the riccia carpet looking at a long-term tank? I'm thinking of starting a mini riccia carpet held down with SS mesh, but from what I've heard, it's a high maintenance plant that requires a lot of trimming and retying. Any way around all of this?
> 
> Regardless, thanks for all the info, it was a wonderful read and I'm glad that you took out the time to do this for all of us. Beautiful pictures!


Hopefully there was nothing pressing to do at work! If there was, I'm glad to do my part in internet non-productivity rates. I would submit the argument that it's much more valuable than random YouTube surfing. 

1. Mini Riccia - after a long time looking into it, I'm not sure this plant exists as Riccia Fluitans. There is a Riccardia, Mini Pellia, which is sometimes called Mini Riccia, but is a totally different plant (dark green, doesn't pearl like Riccia). 

After messing with the plant for a long time, The "miniature" stature of Riccia can be gained by repeated trimming and light intensity. Riccia splits just like stem plants. 

2. Riccia Maintenance: Riccia is a fairly high-maintenance plant. The reason is, due to it's high growth rate it will inevitably grow so well that the bottom is blocked from light and dies off, causing the portion that's tied to stone to float to the top. 

Once Riccia Gets going it's a trim thing every 10-14 days. That being said, this is also the reason why this plant is perhaps the best aquatic plant for truly sculpting a layout. 

Frank's Techniques for keeping Riccia long-term:

1.) In a multiple carpet scenario, plant HC, glosso etc around Riccia. Inevitably, the HC and Glosso will spread runners through the Riccia and form a second layer to "tie it down" and hold it together. The roots of the other carpet plants serve as a binding source and seldom get seen. 

2.) in a single, Riccia carpet only scenario use either Eleocharis Belem or Eleocharis Parvula, both very very small hair grass varieties which will grow and spread roots into Riccia without ever being noticed. Eleocharis Belem's curved growth creates a scenario where it blends completely in with Riccia. 

3.) Trim every 10-14 days to keep it going well and healthy. After repeated trimmings Riccia gets smaller and smaller and smaller. Due to the easy nature of trimming Riccia, it's a great plant to learn trimming on other plants with. 

4.) Over longer periods of time you can of course take the stones out and re-tie them. Alternatively, take more stones tied with Riccia and plop them on top of the Riccia. 

I'm not such a huge fan of placing more stones on top of the Riccia, but it does work. 

5.) Riccia takes the shape of whatever object you tie it to - so make sure to select a flat stone for tying. 

6.) Always use a product like Riccia line to tie the Riccia done on objects - you need this fine line to thoroughly tie the original batch down it requires some technique to get use to but gets much easier over time. 

Using hair net / bath sponge things is not really a great way to do it. While initially it may be easier, long-term it just doesn't hold the Riccia done as well as a product like Riccia Line.


----------



## Francis Xavier

So I did some detail work today on the Mini M. 

Mostly, this involved trimming everything nice and down, and switching around the intake/out put to get some better mileage on Co2 distribution.










I made a few additions and modifications - namely I added Eleocharis Parvula (which I'll have a large bulk supply of soon, this stuff is amazing, it grows only about 1/2" tall and is perfect here) around the Tenellus (which I'll also have a bulk supply of at the same time) to cover up some of the root growth for the final shot. 

As well I added the Parvula in the front right corner to cover up the space between the Riccia and the glass, and to the right of the left side of the scape to create a border that blocks the riccia stone from view. 

This little touch will add a nice transition point between the elements of the aquarium.

Aside from that, the Tenellus, hair grass, Riccia all got a pretty hefty trimming to keep it going and get into more final stages.

I've way put off fish for this aquarium - and I'd like to get some Microrasbora Kubotai for this layout.










P.S. if anyone is looking for riccia, I have a bunch I just trimmed out of here.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I got a PM asking about the plant list of the 60-P and here it is:

_Riccia Fluitans
Eleocharis Belem
E. Tennellus 
H. Pinnatifolia 
Didiplis Diandra
Rotala Colorata

_


----------



## ichise

Hi Frank ~

Thanks for sharing this thread , read thru every page from the start ,
very informative .

question : How do you find the flowrate of Eheim 2211 ?
Is it enough for your tank size 

Thanks


----------



## freph

The flow rate for an Eheim 2211 is 60gph. Filled with media, I can't say how much.

Frank,
The tank looks AMAZING. I hope I can get my own Mini M to a level like that in the coming months....this tank is driving me up the wall. I think we may need to sit down and have a chat.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> The flow rate for an Eheim 2211 is 60gph. Filled with media, I can't say how much.
> 
> Frank,
> The tank looks AMAZING. I hope I can get my own Mini M to a level like that in the coming months....this tank is driving me up the wall. I think we may need to sit down and have a chat.


Fight through it my friend, you'll get to the other side and be able to put things together easy soon. You have all the tools for success, you just need to work on technique.


----------



## Francis Xavier

A quick post-trim Photo update.

60-P:










Mini M:










You can really tell the difference between light sources in these pictures. The yellow of the Fluorescents (which looks more white in person) and the ultra-clean white of the AQUASKY.

*In other news*

Expect both of these layouts to be redone in about a month - once I move I'll go forth and redo the layouts. For now I'm just trying to get them to a "final shot" point.


----------



## iter

Frank-
Since eleocharis belem has a curled leaf appearance, it would mix in well with riccia right?


----------



## Francis Xavier

iter said:


> Frank-
> Since eleocharis belem has a curled leaf appearance, it would mix in well with riccia right?


I have belem mixed with my Riccia carpet in the 60-P - you can barely notice it at all. It's only purpose in the 60-P is to help keep the Riccia tied down. 

If you want to mix a hair grass that will be noticed with Riccia - then use Eleocharis Acicularis. 

Hair Grass + Riccia is a gorgeous combination, and are often found together in the wild.


----------



## freph

I must say Frank, I'm absolutely in love with that mixed riccia/grass in the 60P....it looks *amazing*. I'm glad I spent the time tying all 13 stones worth of riccia you sent me. The 8 that are sitting in the 20 (random growout until Thursday) are already standing up. The ones in the Mini, however....not so hot.Thinking I'll just swap stones over from the 20 into the Mini come Thursday. In the meantime, cloudy water ahoy! *does water change*


----------



## Francis Xavier

Finally fish are here! Microrasbora Kubotai coming up! These will go into the Mini M. 












freph said:


> I must say Frank, I'm absolutely in love with that mixed riccia/grass in the 60P....it looks *amazing*. I'm glad I spent the time tying all 13 stones worth of riccia you sent me. The 8 that are sitting in the 20 (random growout until Thursday) are already standing up. The ones in the Mini, however....not so hot.Thinking I'll just swap stones over from the 20 into the Mini come Thursday. In the meantime, cloudy water ahoy! *does water change*


Great Freph! Are the ones in the Mini not doing so well from the original batch? Or newly tied on? I wonder what's causing that. It might point to some issues in the Mini going on right now with all the transitions. 

Glosso + Riccia is also another great combination for the carpet that's predominately Riccia. Either way having either eleocharis belem or glosso acts as an additional layer of 'tying down,' the Riccia.


----------



## freph

The newly tied ones. There's some kind of imbalance going on for sure, but I'm not sure what it is.


----------



## CryptKeeper54

Francis Xavier said:


> Finally fish are here! Microrasbora Kubotai coming up! These will go into the Mini M.


Those are some sweet looking fish. It will be interesting to see if they can stand out in planted tanks with lush, green plants.


----------



## toastedtoast

CryptKeeper54 said:


> Those are some sweet looking fish. It will be interesting to see if they can stand out in planted tanks with lush, green plants.


I have a school of them in my 20L--they're very active and generally a lot of fun to watch (more so then chili rasboras for example) but it seems like their colour is much more reflective then passive. Under my lights (spiral CFLs) they look quite boring when backlit but stunning when on towards the back of the tank and the light is reflecting off the silver-green scales. I was really disappointed at first, but adjusting my water flow so that they hang out towards the back of the tank has completely sold me on them. They like high-flow areas and it was fairly easy to move them around by aiming a powerhead where I wanted them to go.


----------



## SaltyNC

Beautiful fish, Frank. 

Toastedtoast: Chili rasboras less fun to watch? Say it ain't so.


----------



## frrok

Awesome little fish! Got me thinkin...


----------



## Francis Xavier

Here's a teaser picture for now, 15 minutes after acclimation. 










I'll post up a mini-guide on nano-fish acclimation here in the next 24 hours or so - these guys started eating a good 5 minutes after initial acclimation.

Feeding of course done via Anniversary Edition AP Glass / AP-1 Premium Fish Food.


----------



## @[email protected]

they look really neat. and well camouflaged.


----------



## Francis Xavier

They're extremely playful fish - I had forgotten how active they are. Even more so than Maculatus. 

In person their green color stands out much better with the layout, but at the same time subtly blends. I'll have to get a DSLR to capture that in a photo.


----------



## windfish

Francis Xavier said:


> Here's a teaser picture for now, 15 minutes after acclimation.
> 
> I'll post up a mini-guide on nano-fish acclimation here in the next 24 hours or so - these guys started eating a good 5 minutes after initial acclimation.
> 
> Feeding of course done via Anniversary Edition AP Glass / AP-1 Premium Fish Food.


Oh man, I'm very jealous of the fish. Looking forward to your acclimation guide.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just another quick update shot that I thought was kind of cool:










In this photo you can see a bit more how the Kubotai stand out & blend within the aquascape a bit more.


----------



## 8foot6inchRod

Those little guys look awesome in there for a subtle look. Can you imagine the contrast if you put them in a specialty planted tank with all red plants? I think that would look pretty cool too.


----------



## Ozydego

Frank, I would like to see a post on possible fish to use in small nature aquariums. Twice now, the fish introduced look amazing and I had never heard of them before this thread. I would like to know what other options are out there as well for nano fish. The established guide here just does not help as much as it should.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*How to Acclimate Fish into your aquarium for a 100% success rate!*

Fish, especially ones for Nano aquaria, tend to be delicate. When healthy, they are robust and entertaining to watch. It is your objective to as safely as possible acclimate your fish into your aquarium so you can avoid suffering through significant fish loss - and nothing's worse than getting excited about that great new, maybe rare, fish only to have a mass die-off within 24-48 hours.

In this case, I had my fish shipped to me - it's often difficult to get great nano fish at Local Fish Stores, usually due to demand and their extra handling requirements.

The first thing you should bear in mind, is that whether you're taking them home from the LFS or if you've got them shipped in, those little guys are going through an insane transition period right now and are likely stressed out. 

Imagine if you were plucked from where you're sitting now, got wrapped up in a giant translucent box and immediately started to get transported, only able to get the faintest glimpses of your surroundings. Rocking back and forth, starting and stopping as the transportation process begins. 

_You'd probably be freaking out or stressed -just- a little bit, no?_

It's okay though - the fish you're bringing home are going to a great new home in a Nature Aquarium that is as close to perfect conditions for them as possible (side note: always make sure your Ammonia levels read 0 before adding fish). 

*Preparing Your Aquarium Checklist*

1. Turn off your Co2 - these fish aren't adapted to Co2 conditions yet at worst, at best they come from tanks that have Co2 but are too stressed to handle it. 

2. Lift your lily pipe or outflow pipe for additional aeration into the water to get more oxygen going. 

3. Get a 5 gallon bucket ready for the fish

4. Have a long piece of airline or co2 tubing available - such as the tubing that comes with an ADA Clear Parts or Gray Parts Set. 

5. Have your fish net handy - a soft net, such as one used to get trimmings out of an aquarium is the best to use. These soft nets are best for dealing with the extremely small size of the fish and their scales without damaging them. Any net that's even a little bristly to the touch you should avoid. Stick to one that is 100% soft and smooth. 

*To start*, you should have a 5 gallon bucket on hand (you should always have one for your aquarium maintenance duties - life savers!), gently pour the water from the bag into the bucket - the fish should slide gently with the flow of the water into the bucket. 











Next you're going to want to begin to _drip acclimate_ the fish so that they can adapt to the new temperatures and water conditions of your aquarium. 

Drip acclimation is easy - take your piece of airline tubing, place one end in the aquarium such as depicted here:










Now, before you begin the siphon, tie a loose knot into the end of the airline tubing that is going into the bucket - just a very basic loop is all that's necessary. 

Begin the siphon and, once water flow begins, tighten the knot vigorously and this will slow the water flow down to a drip.









_Example of a tightened knot_

Once the dripping has commenced, sit back and relax and wait for the water in the aquarium to be drained to a level where the outflow is breaching the water's surface like so:










As soon as the water level reaches this point, stop the siphon by removing the airline tubing from the aquarium and drain the remainder of the water in the tubing into the bucket. 

Your water volume should now be roughly 60% water from your aquarium and 40% water from the original bag containing the fish. 

If it isn't, you may need to add some more water from the aquarium. 

*The next step for you to take* is to sit back and relax! place an airstone into with an airstone attached to an air pump into the bucket 










This keeps the water nice and oxygenated for the fish. 

Meanwhile, go take a nap, watch some TV, surf the internet, whatever for about 45 minutes and let the fish get accustomed to the new water. 

*After the 45 minutes is up,* take your fine fish net and catch the fish from the bucket and place them into the aquarium. NEVER add the water from the bucket into the aquarium! This will release built up ammonia or contaminates from other aquariums into yours. 

Once all your fish are into the aquarium, they should at this point have faded coloration and some may even appear white. This is normal - they're still getting acclimated. 

***Make sure to keep your Co2 Off*** Do not turn on your Co2 until the next day and maintain the water level where it is. 









_Keep the Co2 Turned off until the next day and maintain the water level at this point_

*5-10 minutes later* the fish should be colored up and happily eating!










Small Nano fish particularly enjoy really small granule fish foods - such as ADA's AP-1 Fish food. They tend to devour this stuff fairly quickly.

In the end, 15-20 minutes after initial placement into the aquarium, the fish should be happily dancing around, colored up and enjoying the new setup you've got going:










Feed the fish 1-2 times a day, in small doses, only to the extent which they will eat within 30 seconds. Every 30 seconds for 1-2 minutes you may add a little bit extra, so long as they continue to eat. Don't overfeed - as this will lead to an algae outbreak. 

Hope you've enjoyed the Nano Fish Acclimation Guide!

-Frank Wazeter

P.S. Feedback is always appreciated if the post brings you value! Make sure to ask me with specific questions.


----------



## Complexity

I have a specific question. When fish have been in a bag for 2-3 days due to shipping, it's my understanding that the ammonia in the water has built up. But because the bag is sealed, it's less harmful to the fish somehow. However, the instant you open the bag, there is a chemical reaction (CO2 and pH maybe?) that causes the ammonia to become much more toxic.

As a result, I generally add a tiny bit of Prime into my 5g bucket just before opening the bag and releasing the new fish into the bucket. I've always done this to help protect the fish from the ammonia in the shipping water.

What do you think of the issues of ammonia in the water from shipping and how to handle it? Is the way I handle it a good idea or is there a better way?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Complexity said:


> I have a specific question. When fish have been in a bag for 2-3 days due to shipping, it's my understanding that the ammonia in the water has built up. But because the bag is sealed, it's less harmful to the fish somehow. However, the instant you open the bag, there is a chemical reaction (CO2 and pH maybe?) that causes the ammonia to become much more toxic.
> 
> As a result, I generally add a tiny bit of Prime into my 5g bucket just before opening the bag and releasing the new fish into the bucket. I've always done this to help protect the fish from the ammonia in the shipping water.
> 
> What do you think of the issues of ammonia in the water from shipping and how to handle it? Is the way I handle it a good idea or is there a better way?


You're absolutely correct - if a fish has been in a bag for 2-3 days (as opposed to Next Day Air), then it's a great course of action to add Prime to the 5g bucket to lesson the impact of ammonia burn on the gills of the fish.


----------



## Complexity

Thank you! :smile: I have a couple more questions, if you don't mind.

In your directions above, you said to take a 45 minute break after the water has finished dripping into the bucket, but the only measurement you gave of how long it takes to drip the water in the bucket was in reference to the amount of water being dripped. There's no time given. The time can vary greatly, depending on how fast or slow you make the drip. So about how long would you say it takes for you to drip the water into the bucket before your 45 minute break?

Also, I have large tanks running CO2 (75g and 90g). I've always been concerned about adding fish in these tanks because of the CO2. Both tanks have a high CO2 saturation (drop checkers are yellow). What I've been doing is performing a 50% water change to cut the CO2 saturation in the tank before adding new fish. However, I have not been turning the CO2 off after that. Is doing the 50% water change first the best idea or do you have a better suggestion? Also, if I did keep the CO2 off for the remainder of the day, will the fish be okay when the CO2 jumps back to its normal high saturation level the next day? Just how much will the CO2 affect new fish? (It might be helpful to note that I also have a high oxygen level in the tanks based on the amount of pearling seen in the tanks.)

Thank you so much for offering to help answer these questions! I've actually been wondering about some of these things, especially since I just added 50 new amanos and a couple new plecos to my tanks.


----------



## ajmckay

Hey Frank, I've read this whole thread over the past few days and I feel like I've learned a lot. I'm a reef keeper about to attempt my first planted aquaria. Recently I've decided that I am going to wait a little while before starting my tank though so that I can more thoroughly study "the method"  and really have a good plan laid out of what I need to do. I also have a lot of materials to obtain. I have the tank and an HOB filter and that's about it. 

Maybe I missed something, but is the current M supposed to be the "challenge" tank that was discussed earlier in the thread?

Finally, nice write up on drip acclimation. I used a similar method for acclimating marine fish as well. I would maybe mention that if the tank water is heated that a temperature acclimation procedure would also be required which could be putting the fish into a tupperware or a bag and floating it in the tank for the last portion of the procedure.


----------



## SaltyNC

Great write-up Frank. That's how I added my Boraras brigittae the other day, and they are doing great. The one thing I would add is that it does seem to make the fish more comfortable if you place something in the bucket. In your photos, the dark airline tubing can be that "something". I placed a stone in my bucket, and they instantly grouped around that. Fish like structure. Even though the bucket is a very temporary part of their stressful journey, and it's relatively trivial, I think everything we can do to reduce stress is a plus. For the dip net, the Fluval shrimp net works very well for nano fish. It doesn't collapse around them but remains open, so less contact with their delicate fins. I could coax them into the net without aggressively chasing them, and then simply placed the net in the tank and allowed them to swim out when ready --a very gentle process. 

I've really enjoyed my Petco bookshelf experiment, but I'm about ready to get on with my ADA tank. You post too much eye-candy! Cannot...resist....can...not...resist.  I'll be contacting you soon.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Ozydego said:


> Frank, I would like to see a post on possible fish to use in small nature aquariums. Twice now, the fish introduced look amazing and I had never heard of them before this thread. I would like to know what other options are out there as well for nano fish. The established guide here just does not help as much as it should.


Sure thing!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Complexity said:


> Thank you! :smile: I have a couple more questions, if you don't mind.
> 
> In your directions above, you said to take a 45 minute break after the water has finished dripping into the bucket, but the only measurement you gave of how long it takes to drip the water in the bucket was in reference to the amount of water being dripped. There's no time given. The time can vary greatly, depending on how fast or slow you make the drip. So about how long would you say it takes for you to drip the water into the bucket before your 45 minute break?
> 
> Also, I have large tanks running CO2 (75g and 90g). I've always been concerned about adding fish in these tanks because of the CO2. Both tanks have a high CO2 saturation (drop checkers are yellow). What I've been doing is performing a 50% water change to cut the CO2 saturation in the tank before adding new fish. However, I have not been turning the CO2 off after that. Is doing the 50% water change first the best idea or do you have a better suggestion? Also, if I did keep the CO2 off for the remainder of the day, will the fish be okay when the CO2 jumps back to its normal high saturation level the next day? Just how much will the CO2 affect new fish? (It might be helpful to note that I also have a high oxygen level in the tanks based on the amount of pearling seen in the tanks.)
> 
> Thank you so much for offering to help answer these questions! I've actually been wondering about some of these things, especially since I just added 50 new amanos and a couple new plecos to my tanks.


Hey Complexity,

You can do a 50% water change before hand to increase oxygen levels and decrease co2 concentrations for sure - however, is typically unnecessary. Just as long as you turn off Co2 and raise your filtration output so that the water is becoming oxygenated. 

Over time fish can become adapted to higher Co2 concentrations, however initially I tend to lower my Co2 output into the aquarium, as in most cases, we are using more Co2 than is necessary when there are no fish in the aquarium. Then slowly over time I increase the Co2 level going into the aquarium. Especially with a plant such as Riccia, you can get to quite a high level of Co2 over time. 

In a 75 gal, stick to about 5-6 BPS depending on where the diffuser is located in the aquarium. Though in such a large aquarium you typically can get away with 9-10 BPS. 

In Nano's, 2-3 is good. In a 20 gallon 3-5 is good. The best method is to make slow changes over time. 

Keeping the Co2 off for the remainder of the day they're acclimated gives them time to settle and rest from the stresses of transportation - by the next day, when Co2 normally comes on and begins to saturate the water, it's a much less jarring experience. If you choose to do it same day, wait about 4 hours.

As for the volume of water into the bucket - you want to roughly double the amount of water that the fish originally came in. In a Nano it's super simple since you merely drain the tank water about 1.5" down (or in an ADA tank w/lily pipes, to where the outflow begins). 

This should be done over about a 20-30 minute interval at least - so make those knots tight!



ajmckay said:


> Hey Frank, I've read this whole thread over the past few days and I feel like I've learned a lot. I'm a reef keeper about to attempt my first planted aquaria. Recently I've decided that I am going to wait a little while before starting my tank though so that I can more thoroughly study "the method"  and really have a good plan laid out of what I need to do. I also have a lot of materials to obtain. I have the tank and an HOB filter and that's about it.
> 
> Maybe I missed something, but is the current M supposed to be the "challenge" tank that was discussed earlier in the thread?
> 
> Finally, nice write up on drip acclimation. I used a similar method for acclimating marine fish as well. I would maybe mention that if the tank water is heated that a temperature acclimation procedure would also be required which could be putting the fish into a tupperware or a bag and floating it in the tank for the last portion of the procedure.


On the temperature bit - that's a great piece of additive advice. Fortunately, most planted aquariums are kept at room temperature, and if you allow the fish in the bag's water to sit for about 10-15 minutes it'll get to room temperature as well. 

Temperature is one of the biggest shocks to fish acclimating - so either float the bag for 10-15 or let em sit alone for 10-15 minutes if your planted aquarium is kept at room temperature (really, the only need for a heater ever for a planted aquarium is if you live in an extreme cold temperature state - and don't keep a kind of heater on during the winter. Room temps of roughly 60 degrees often net a water temperature of about 70-74 in my experience, and water will stay at about 76-78 even if room temperature is around 85). 

This layout isn't the challenge aquarium - I've gotten caught up in a lot of tasks in the day, but it'll come sooner or later. Probably after my next move in September. 



SaltyNC said:


> Great write-up Frank. That's how I added my Boraras brigittae the other day, and they are doing great. The one thing I would add is that it does seem to make the fish more comfortable if you place something in the bucket. In your photos, the dark airline tubing can be that "something". I placed a stone in my bucket, and they instantly grouped around that. Fish like structure. Even though the bucket is a very temporary part of their stressful journey, and it's relatively trivial, I think everything we can do to reduce stress is a plus. For the dip net, the Fluval shrimp net works very well for nano fish. It doesn't collapse around them but remains open, so less contact with their delicate fins. I could coax them into the net without aggressively chasing them, and then simply placed the net in the tank and allowed them to swim out when ready --a very gentle process.
> 
> I've really enjoyed my Petco bookshelf experiment, but I'm about ready to get on with my ADA tank. You post too much eye-candy! Cannot...resist....can...not...resist.  I'll be contacting you soon.


Absolutely! An object helps the fish - if I have trimmings available or if the fish have to sit in a bucket for long periods of time for whatever reason, I'll typically throw some trimmings from stem plants or the like into the bucket for them. This does a lot to provide shade and some natural filtration (albeit small scale) in the bucket temporarily.


----------



## Francis Xavier

And here's today's photo update, with the tank levels restored and me turning on Co2 for the first time since last night:










I've once again taken on the enjoyment of feeding the fish - which is something quite fun to sit back and watch with the schooling microrasbora variety's.

As such, I'll just take a second to say again that we often forget about fish in the course of the planted aquarium with so much focus on the plants - but really, it's the right fish that bring the whole picture together and make the final picture so great.

Fish have a way of bringing the whole layout into life and brings an aquascape from "cool" territory into "stare at for hours and get lost into it" status. 

It's easy to get tunnel vision - so don't forget about the fish that you should add to your layout to complete the scene!


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> And here's today's photo update, with the tank levels restored and me turning on Co2 for the first time since last night:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've once again taken on the enjoyment of feeding the fish - which is something quite fun to sit back and watch with the schooling microrasbora variety's.
> 
> As such, I'll just take a second to say again that we often forget about fish in the course of the planted aquarium with so much focus on the plants - but really, it's the right fish that bring the whole picture together and make the final picture so great.
> 
> Fish have a way of bringing the whole layout into life and brings an aquascape from "cool" territory into "stare at for hours and get lost into it" status.
> 
> It's easy to get tunnel vision - so don't forget about the fish that you should add to your layout to complete the scene!


Huh? Oh, sorry. I was too busy staring at the tank to read. Looks amazing as always Frank. I'll get there one day.


----------



## Complexity

Thank you, Frank, to take the time to answer my questions. My setup is a little different so I can't do everything exactly as you suggested, but I get the basic concepts and can apply them equally as well. It sounds like most of what I'm doing is pretty much on target except I'm going to start leaving the CO2 off for the day when adding new fish. I actually like that idea, and it resolves a concern I've had for awhile.

The tank is looking great, as always! Love the fish! Their color couldn't be more perfectly matched for that tank. :smile:


----------



## SpecGrrl

*I wish I had seen this on Sunday*



Complexity said:


> I have a specific question. When fish have been in a bag for 2-3 days due to shipping, it's my understanding that the ammonia in the water has built up. But because the bag is sealed, it's less harmful to the fish somehow. However, the instant you open the bag, there is a chemical reaction (CO2 and pH maybe?) that causes the ammonia to become much more toxic.
> 
> As a result, I generally add a tiny bit of Prime into my 5g bucket just before opening the bag and releasing the new fish into the bucket. I've always done this to help protect the fish from the ammonia in the shipping water.
> 
> What do you think of the issues of ammonia in the water from shipping and how to handle it? Is the way I handle it a good idea or is there a better way?



Bc I lost an HMPK even though I acclimated him for over an hour.

Is it possible that he had been so ammonia stressed during the flight that he was too far gone when I received him?

I feel like I let him and his previous owner down.


----------



## Francis Xavier

SpecGrrl said:


> Bc I lost an HMPK even though I acclimated him for over an hour.
> 
> Is it possible that he had been so ammonia stressed during the flight that he was too far gone when I received him?
> 
> I feel like I let him and his previous owner down.


What is the long form name of HMPK? Rather, what does the abbreviation stand for.


----------



## PinoyBoy

HMPK = Half Moon Plakat
http://www.bettafishtalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=472&d=1342138497


----------



## Francis Xavier

SpecGrrl said:


> Bc I lost an HMPK even though I acclimated him for over an hour.
> 
> Is it possible that he had been so ammonia stressed during the flight that he was too far gone when I received him?
> 
> I feel like I let him and his previous owner down.


I didn't know bettas to be so sensitive - but it's possible that those more upscale breeds are (not my area of expertise admittedly), similar to how higher grade CRS become more delicate. 

Did you get it next day air, 2nd day or priority mail / normal shipping?


----------



## SomeCanuck

I have a small clump of java moss that I just leave float freely in my water change bucket (it gets dechlorinated and left to sit during the week for minor topping off and aging for the Saturday water change). Whenever I get new shrimp or fish (as infrequent as it may be), I just move it over to the acclimatisation bucket. Gives them a place to hide, a piece of greenery to hang out around, some biofilm to munch on and, like you mentioned, some minor bio filtration. And since java moss is unkillable, all it takes is the ambient lighting in the room to keep it going.



Francis Xavier said:


> Absolutely! An object helps the fish - if I have trimmings available or if the fish have to sit in a bucket for long periods of time for whatever reason, I'll typically throw some trimmings from stem plants or the like into the bucket for them. This does a lot to provide shade and some natural filtration (albeit small scale) in the bucket temporarily.


----------



## SpecGrrl

It was an adoption so she shipped him priority on Saturday and he arrived Monday at 3 pm.

He was delivered to the door.

But he was so very pale with brown stress stripes and he was supposed to be red.

She warned me that he lost color when he got stressed and that he was the smallest of his spawn mates and the only male she'd known that ever got stress stripes.

Gah!

Sorry am babbling bc of lingering guilt issues.

Today am drip acclimating my female betta to her new big 5 gallon tank which has driftwood in it so it's pH is different.

Thank you so much for this thread!


----------



## SpecGrrl

SomeCanuck said:


> I have a small clump of java moss that I just leave float freely in my water change bucket (it gets dechlorinated and left to sit during the week for minor topping off and aging for the Saturday water change). Whenever I get new shrimp or fish (as infrequent as it may be), I just move it over to the acclimatisation bucket. Gives them a place to hide, a piece of greenery to hang out around, some biofilm to munch on and, like you mentioned, some minor bio filtration. And since java moss is unkillable, all it takes is the ambient lighting in the room to keep it going.


This is a genius Idea!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Absolutely some plant matter will help ease some stress off the fish - it sounds like the Betta you received before was probably a bit too delicate. It happens, and I don't think it was your fault that he died. 

It's common for fish to arrive with faded and pale coloration - so don't panic if you see that. However, so long as you are taking all the necessary steps, you're doing all that you can do. Sometimes, a fish just won't make it no matter what you do.


----------



## @[email protected]

SpecGrrl said:


> Bc I lost an HMPK even though I acclimated him for over an hour.
> 
> Is it possible that he had been so ammonia stressed during the flight that he was too far gone when I received him?
> 
> I feel like I let him and his previous owner down.


unless he was traveling for over 2 days, i dont think it was NH3 poisoning. honestly, bettas are particularly resilient to NH3 and NO2, likely in part due to having really sh*tty gills (which is where these toxins enter the fish). 
and they tend to be hardy with acclimation too.
if he died a week later, i would bet parasites. fish can live with parasites for years without any symptoms, but after a major stressor (like shipping) they cant handle the parasite load anymore and die. 
what i do when i ship bettas, is put a drop of Prime in the bag. it binds out NH3 for 24-48 hours, so usually there is 0 NH3 when the fish arrives. i will also add a drop upon first opening a bag of a fish shipped to me, to neutralize any NH3 that may have accumulated so the poisoning stops instantly, and not 40 min later when i finish acclimating.


----------



## Francis Xavier

For any of you instagrammers out there, I've started up on that app. 

You can find me at @fwazeter


----------



## Complexity

I've never heard of the ap. What's it for?


----------



## Francis Xavier

It's basically a picture with captions / basic manipulation sharing app. Kind of a twitter with pictures instead of snippets.


----------



## Complexity

Okay, thanks for explaining. I looked at the app, but wasn't sure.


----------



## SpecGrrl

@[email protected] said:


> unless he was traveling for over 2 days, i dont think it was NH3 poisoning. honestly, bettas are particularly resilient to NH3 and NO2, likely in part due to having really sh*tty gills (which is where these toxins enter the fish).
> and they tend to be hardy with acclimation too.
> if he died a week later, i would bet parasites. fish can live with parasites for years without any symptoms, but after a major stressor (like shipping) they cant handle the parasite load anymore and die.
> what i do when i ship bettas, is put a drop of Prime in the bag. it binds out NH3 for 24-48 hours, so usually there is 0 NH3 when the fish arrives. i will also add a drop upon first opening a bag of a fish shipped to me, to neutralize any NH3 that may have accumulated so the poisoning stops instantly, and not 40 min later when i finish acclimating.



Oh? Maybe that is why he was so small compared to his spawn sisters?!? Parasites.


----------



## SpecGrrl

@[email protected] said:


> unless he was traveling for over 2 days, i dont think it was NH3 poisoning. honestly, bettas are particularly resilient to NH3 and NO2, likely in part due to having really sh*tty gills (which is where these toxins enter the fish).
> and they tend to be hardy with acclimation too.
> if he died a week later, i would bet parasites. fish can live with parasites for years without any symptoms, but after a major stressor (like shipping) they cant handle the parasite load anymore and die.
> what i do when i ship bettas, is put a drop of Prime in the bag. it binds out NH3 for 24-48 hours, so usually there is 0 NH3 when the fish arrives. i will also add a drop upon first opening a bag of a fish shipped to me, to neutralize any NH3 that may have accumulated so the poisoning stops instantly, and not 40 min later when i finish acclimating.



He had all the classic signs -- gasping, red streaks, darting about, paleness etc -- I did put Prime in, but after I cut the bag open,so maybe it was too late?

The red streaks weren't until much much later.

My pH is 7.5 -8.0 and I stupidly didn't check his water parameters when I opened his bag, I was just concerned w getting him some Prime and cleaner water.


----------



## SpecGrrl

Happily my drip acclimation of my female betta seems to be very successful!

She is astounded by the enormous size of her 5.5 gallon tank (more like 3 bc it doesn't have a lid yet and she can jump pretty well).


----------



## Ozydego

Since we are talking about drip acclimation, I saw this just 2 days ago, and I may have to have one of these accudrip youtube vid


----------



## skoram

great thread! subscribing.


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Frank, the tank is looking great! I love the little recess from the plants in the center front, it gives us a nice look at the white sand.

I love those M.D. Kubotai, I think they'd be very neat in my Mini S -- could you PM me your source?

The only small thing about this journal/guide that I do not particularly love is the photography. I think that some really high quality photos would make the journal/guide _that_ much better!


----------



## Francis Xavier

*ACT 1 of the thread now digitally remastered in eBook format!

*Cryptkeeper54 converted the first segment of the thread into digital eBook format, which you can view here.

There's a nice surprise at the end - the final HD photograph of the first layout, which hasn't been published in the thread. 

Other minor updates - the table of contents works again and the new table of contents has been updated. 










Full Post Available to Read on my Tumblr.


----------



## @[email protected]

holy crap!
the tank looks STUNNING in that picture.
great work frank.


----------



## orchidman

so I finally setup a low-budget tank for that challenge from forever ago. here it is 




DSC_0031.jpg by orchidman10, on Flickr


heres a link to the journal incase you want to check it out, frank.

http://plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=188790


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> *ACT 1 of the thread now digitally remastered in eBook format!
> 
> *Cryptkeeper54 converted the first segment of the thread into digital eBook format, which you can view here.
> 
> There's a nice surprise at the end - the final HD photograph of the first layout, which hasn't been published in the thread.
> 
> Other minor updates - the table of contents works again and the new table of contents has been updated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Full Post Available to Read on my Tumblr.


This is a great resource! Good job guys!


----------



## Francis Xavier

*Member Highlights! Check out these people and their awesome work:*

Some of my students who are members of TPT (message me if you aren't listed and should be, or if you are listed and feel you shouldn't or don't want to be!) :

*Khoa N. Pham* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=122232

*fplata* - 




















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=181063



*freph* - 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=181281

*mluk27* - 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=174106&highlight=mluk27

*Dave Allen* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=184547

*Dollface *- 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=170180

*pejerrey* -



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=169143

*ozydego *- 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=181009

*dantra* - http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=161640

*frrok* - 










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=160093

*flyinghellfish* -










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=49336

*orchidman* -










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=188790

*Brian MC* - http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=51675

*2wheelsx2* -










http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=6864

*Jeff5614* - 



















http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=107781

*Lludu* - http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/member.php?u=52328


----------



## CryptKeeper54

Holy Batman, you have been up to some serious work. Its great that you revamped the table of contents. You should treat yourself to a vacation to Hawaii...... and while you are here you might as well do a seminar on planted tanks


----------



## freph

Aaaaand download. This will definitely be going in the Books app on my iPad.


----------



## frrok

freph said:


> Aaaaand download. This will definitely be going in the Books app on my iPad.


Ditto! .. And done.(but for iPhone)


----------



## Francis Xavier

First post updated!


----------



## frrok

I feel honored to be a part of that list! thank you Frank...

I must say those are some amazing scapes...


----------



## orchidman

woah! i made the list! im honored!


----------



## Geniusdudekiran

Great compilation. Also, absolutely love that last photo on the link. Those fish are so awesome!


----------



## Francis Xavier

I couldn't find the person to quote about the fish in a line and training them, but there's the answer:

A couple of hours with a camera in front of the tank, and scaring the bejesus out of them every 3 seconds so they start schooling, while spamming the take photo button = eventually a shot where they are in alignment!


----------



## SaltyNC

Francis Xavier said:


> I couldn't find the person to quote about the fish in a line and training them, but there's the answer:
> 
> A couple of hours with a camera in front of the tank, and scaring the bejesus out of them every 3 seconds so they start schooling, while spamming the take photo button = eventually a shot where they are in alignment!


LOL. That was me, Frank. I deleted the message, because I think I misunderstood the post when you were discussing your students and I was asking about a class in addition to the fish. I had a Homer moment, and I'm not talking about the blind poet. :icon_conf


----------



## orchidman

Frank, I've learned alot of things from this thread (its awesome) especially some aquascaping principles. I thought you'd enjoy seeing the hardscape i put together the other night. thank you so much for this awesome thread and sharing your knowledge!


DSC_0001.jpg by orchidman10, on Flickr


DSC_0003.jpg by orchidman10, on Flickr


DSC_0002.jpg by orchidman10, on Flickr

any critique is welcome!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Orchid,

Good overall composition, the only thing I would recommend is you need more height on your slope, otherwise the composition is lost when you get plants.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey Orchid,
> 
> Good overall composition, the only thing I would recommend is you need more height on your slope, otherwise the composition is lost when you get plants.


i can do that! thanks frank! im planning on switching the substrate out for aquasoil before i do anything, so i will add more height then. just the back will have aquasoil, the front will have sand. it will only have plants around the rocks, like this http://i54.tinypic.com/2pyoqr5.jpg


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Guys!

I've got some good news for anyone looking for some of this info in printed form to read on the go!

After talking with Tropical Fish Hobbyist before the labor day weekend, we've come to bring ACT 1 following the Mini M: San Marcos River Summer into print form in T.F.H.










*Act 1 will run from January to April in Tropical Fish Hobbyist*

The photo selections will be in a bit higher quality for this run - remastered and edited for print of course. 

But what this all means for _you_ is a more focused and concised overview of the entire methodology from day one - unique to T.F.H. e.g., it's not just going to be a copy and paste of the information here or in the eBook located here. 

*Act II will follow Act 1 in either the June or July issue, covering the by then completed progress of the layout.










Act II will have much more HD photographs available, including image sets that I haven't published on the T.P.T. yet. 
*

Keep in touch with me for more updates so you can stay in the loop on the aquascaping-info-circle:

*Follow Me On:*

Twitter: http://twitter.com/iaquascape
Facebook: http://facebook.com/fwazeter
Tumblr: http://wazeter.tumblr.com


----------



## orchidman

cool!!!!!! so it will definitely be in issue jan-april? thats awesome!


----------



## Francis Xavier

There's finally bona-fide HD camera pics of the updates. 

The first of which you can find here along with some good tricks on trimming riccia!


----------



## freph

Tank looks great. Good to know I was trimming my riccia correctly at least. :hihi: You're 100% correct, though.....netting the riccia trimmings is by far the worst part. :redface:


----------



## chrislewistx

Frank,

Congratulations on being published in TFH. I think its great that they have decided to do a series of articles on setup, and maintenance of the nature aquarium.

I had been avoiding subscribing to TFH, since I have too many magazines that arrive each month. However, I think I am going to subscribe. Maybe I will check out a digital subscription if one is available.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Mini M in HD:


----------



## orchidman

looks great! keep the HD pics coming!


----------



## freph

Screw glosso, I'm just gonna do a hairgrass and riccia tank lol. Much less room for error as long as you keep it trimmed.


----------



## Francis Xavier

In the Dark, Nature Aquarium becomes particularly striking.


----------



## windfish

Francis Xavier said:


> In the Dark, Nature Aquarium becomes particularly striking.


Gorgeous shot.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Been a while since I read this thread. That Mini M is gorgeous! 

Got a question regarding Green Dust algae, how in the world do you get rid of it? 










It's really hard to scrape off and my otos cats can't keep up with it.


----------



## 5BodyBlade

I'm only on page 17 so sorry if this has been answered, but how is the diffuser better than the reactor if the reactor gets close to 100% diffusion?


Francis Xavier said:


> Day 11:
> 
> I went ahead and used airline tubing to remove any left over dead matter from the microsword.
> 
> Took the water level way down today:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Allowing the scape to breath in open air for a few minutes (5 or so) every now and again will help prevent algae, since the exposure will help kill any residual algae spores, usually useful for non-serious algae types and purely for preventative measures.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You will notice I switched the diffuser sides.
> 
> If you read the flow Charts I posted earlier you will understand the reasoning behind this (if you haven't read it, refer back to page 13 or so, it's somewhere around there).
> 
> Basically by manipulating where I put the diffuser in relation to flow I can optimize which plants grow quicker.
> 
> You will see me manipulating this variable often and it is why I always recommend against reactors. I want you to start looking at these variables and adopting this habit in your aquarium. Just follow along and watch how I do it and you'll pick it up.
> 
> So homework for you tonight is if you've had your diffuser in one spot for a long time, move it to the other side and watch what happens.
> 
> And a cool shot to end out the day:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dosing: Green Brighty Step 1 & Brighty K 1 squirt.
> Green Bacter: 6 drops.


----------



## Francis Xavier

GDA is usually a sign of imbalance in the aquarium - the quicker you get it, the less powerful your biological filtration. It's an excellent metric to see how well your biological is doing. 

The easiest short term fix is to get a razor and scrape it off the glass - in the long term, I would try switching your filter media to more about 80% biological, 20% mechanical if you haven't yet. If you have Green Bacter or Bacter 100, dosing either one into the aquarium will help give the Bacteria a jump start if you don't have any power sand under the substrate.



FlyingHellFish said:


> Been a while since I read this thread. That Mini M is gorgeous!
> 
> Got a question regarding Green Dust algae, how in the world do you get rid of it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's really hard to scrape off and my otos cats can't keep up with it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

5BodyBlade said:


> I'm only on page 17 so sorry if this has been answered, but how is the diffuser better than the reactor if the reactor gets close to 100% diffusion?


Great question!

The primary advantage of the diffuser is your ability to manipulate the positioning of the Co2 in relation to where the flow is. 

To bring it to essentials, plants grow differently based on where the highest concentration of Co2 is, which follows the pattern of the flow in your aquarium. Generally plants closest to the diffuser grow slower / shorter and plants further away grow quicker and taller. So the ability to change sides to manipulate growth and keep things balanced is absolutely critical.

Reactors are good for larger aquariums, such as those that are over 300-400 gallons in size, but typically just don't provide enough saturation in the water column to help plants as well as a diffuser. As well, it ends up forcing you to stick the co2 in only one spot - going with the flow of water into the aquarium. Should you ever have a dead spot of flow, those plants are basically done for. Additionally, if you have the reactor on the inflow side of things, the highest concentration of Co2 hits the biological filtration - oxygen absorbing bacteria - first, which will stunt their growth and keep it permanently lower, which leads to more algae issues. 

Alternatively, if you have the Co2 on the outflow side of the filter, which is the better scenario, You're still stuck with being tied to where ever the flow is going in the aquarium. In both cases, you will typically need to use more co2 to get the same efficiency as using a diffuser, again excepting in the cases of very, very large aquariums where the reactor is more suitable.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

I'm sure this question been answered but I like the way you explain things Frank.

Explain to me how to increase Co2 in relation to O2, as more O2 provides the water column the ability to retain more Co2.

So how do I increase O2 without out gassing the Co2? I don't have the luxury of increasing the surface tension due to my unique tank.


----------



## frrok

Any update on the MINI-M Frank?


----------



## fahim6801

i would like to ask a silly question i had in mind for a long time, whats the different between Phyton Git and Do! Aqua be-Clear, and the different between Green Brighty and Do! Aqua Be-Green, we dont have ADA in our country but i would like to bring some with my friends help who is in uk now, so was thinking which one to select


----------



## andrewss

looking real good


----------



## Francis Xavier

As you guys know, I've been a bit under the weather this month, but I've got some exciting news:

new layouts will be coming in the fall season;

And I will be gone from Oct. 24th until Nov. 7th for the Nature Aquarium Party in Tokyo, Japan.

Expect a lot of pictures!


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> As you guys know, I've been a bit under the weather this month, but I've got some exciting news:
> 
> new layouts will be coming in the fall season;
> 
> And I will be gone from Oct. 24th until Nov. 7th for the Nature Aquarium Party in Tokyo, Japan.
> 
> Expect a lot of pictures!


Hope everything is ok Frank. Your health is most important. Thanks for the update. Looking forward to pictures from the party!


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> As you guys know, I've been a bit under the weather this month, but I've got some exciting news:
> 
> new layouts will be coming in the fall season;
> 
> And I will be gone from Oct. 24th until Nov. 7th for the Nature Aquarium Party in Tokyo, Japan.
> 
> Expect a lot of pictures!


hope you get better soon. 
excited for the new layouts.


----------



## CryptKeeper54

That is awesome. Putting that on my "bucket list." I would love to see what you are about to in person. Goodluck and have fun.


----------



## plantbrain

KH2PO4 said:


> I have not seen Tom put much interest on bacteria.
> 
> Well, I would like to read more from Frank than debating about this.


On my web site I have a sub forum for aquatic microbiology.
Most of the articles I wrote for my forum also address bacterial cycling, entire wetland cycling diagrams with references. Just because I do not go into detail here, implies nothing. I am FAR MORE specific about bacteria than ADA is, and I also qualify the and quantify those same specifics. So does Diana Walstad. Simply telling someone that there's a biological imbalance is not informative, anyone can say that. You go down one by one and fairly evaluate and compare. ADA does not do this, I've never seen an article from ADA or AJ that does. 

The advice on the labor, trimming, general care, design aspects are very good however, but they are extremely weak in other areas. Compare ADA vs Walstad (see chapter IV). Likewise, Diana is hardly the best scaper out there, we are all weak in many areas:redface:

The point is to try and improve holistically. Then you are better able to achieve your goals, and then more importantly, help others achieve theirs. 
ADA fulfills a very good aspect, so do many others, we each have a specific skill set that contributes to the entire hobby. 

I've had GDA about 6-7 times and it's never lasted for long. I will say I do not know specifically what causes it and why some have long standing bouts with it. I've seen it at several places who have ADA full line ups. Eventually they got rid of it. But so does everyone at some point. I had it in a new set up on a client's 350 Gallon tank. 2 weeks later: gone.

Algae is not exclusive to any particular to any Brand, method/dosing, light type etc. CO2 concentration perhaps.........we see algae in ADA tanks plenty, as well as with EI dosing. 

So is it the hobbyists looking to blame things? Or is it ADA's fault? EI's fault for the woes? *It's us, not the methods.... they both work for the same reasons and they both add the same things. *

Ponder that.


----------



## houseofcards

plantbrain said:


> ...Algae is not exclusive to any particular to any Brand, method/dosing, light type etc. CO2 concentration perhaps.........we see algae in ADA tanks plenty, as well as with EI dosing.
> 
> So is it the hobbyists looking to blame things? Or is it ADA's fault? EI's fault for the woes? *It's us, not the methods.... they both work for the same reasons and they both add the same things. *
> 
> Ponder that.


This is so true. I mean there are incredible tanks in terms of growth, upkeep and scape the world over and they use different systems. How many have come on here and used full ADA setups and ended up with something out of Tim Burton movie. I like many ADA components and use them, but the main ingredients in any setup is knowledge and dedication. None of these systems run themselves, they all need the attention of the hobbyist.


----------



## bluestems

Francis Xavier said:


> _Don't Panic! This is an easy algae, and is no problem what so ever. Amano's devour this stuff. But we're not ready to add them yet, so airline tubing removal will hold us over in the mean time.
> 
> 
> 
> _


Hi Frank, I'm finally getting a chance to read through your journal and appreciate all the tips. Wish I had read this prior to setting up my tank a couple of months ago! 

Also, I just added some rasbora maculatas, pygmy corys, and danio erythromicrons to my 7g aquarium on Sunday, and my hc and dhg has suddenly taken a wrong turn... 










I have aquasoil as the substrate, Aquasky LED, dosing daily Green Brightly Step 1 x1 and Brightly K x1. CO2 is normally at 1-2 bps, except has been off since Monday night due to an airline issue. Is this sudden turn of events all because CO2 has been off a couple of days?


----------



## catfishbi

Frank what do you use to clean the lily pipe?


----------



## freph

catfishbi said:


> Frank what do you use to clean the lily pipe?


Spring brush and Superge. My personal favorite is just soaking them in bleach. Burns all the crud off.


----------



## catfishbi

do you use small size brush?


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Francis Xavier said:


> And I will be gone from Oct. 24th until Nov. 7th for the Nature Aquarium Party in Tokyo, Japan.
> 
> Expect a lot of pictures!


I can't wait that long, post some pics! Some teaser pics or anything,


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey guys!

Full report when the jet lag is done and over with!



I had the honor of placing #125 out of 2021 entries into this year's IAPLC. It ranked as the 2nd highest American entry and the highest nano aquarium ranking. 

It's been a fun journey with this layout - from the people it has helped teach all the way to the end in the IAPLC. For me personally, there has yet to be a layout so valuable in meaning to what it means and represents to me.

When I finally had the honor of meeting with Mr. Amano, he asked me a simple question: "how long have you been doing Nature Aquarium before ADG?" When I gave him the answer, he requested his assistant to print out the layout I entered, and upon receiving it from her took an evaluative look at it and said:



Takashi Amano said:


> This layout is quite good. Very simple and for such a small size it expresses a feeling of wabi sabi well. For a first entry into the contest, you have done very well. Congratulations. I have no suggestions for improvement on this layout.


----------



## somewhatshocked

Nice, Frank!

Can't wait for you to share about a million photos and stories.


----------



## iter

I truly understand what Mr. Amano meant. Well done Frank!!


----------



## freph

I seriously just wish I had the ability to make a tank go right from day one like you do. Seems like there's always something I can't do right. Riccia won't grow, gets overrun by algae. HC and dirt gets blown away until it carpets over so I can't turn my filter outflow up = bad CO2, turnover, bad O2. That tank is amazing.


----------



## Green_Flash

Congrats Frank, it looks great.


----------



## bluestems

Congratulations! The tank looks amazing! I have those same rasboras. They are so much fun in the aquarium. I chose them for their touch of red, and the spots to compliment the okho stone, but they've become one of my favorites for their playful personality.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

"If Mr.Takashi Amano says it's a good looking tank, then it's an AMAZING looking tank." 


Congrats on the 127 placing. Were you surprise when you found out?


----------



## fplata

Awesome my friend!


----------



## SaltyNC

Congrats


----------



## andrewss

congrats, and ya that is a great tank - loving those rasboras too


----------



## acitydweller

Congratulations frank. Brilliant work and effort.


----------



## theblondskeleton

Congratulations, Frank! That is very high praise and quite an honor (as you well know).


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Hey guys!
> 
> Full report when the jet lag is done and over with!
> 
> 
> 
> I had the honor of placing #127 out of 2021 entries into this year's IAPLC. It ranked as the 2nd highest American entry and the highest nano aquarium ranking.
> 
> It's been a fun journey with this layout - from the people it has helped teach all the way to the end in the IAPLC. For me personally, there has yet to be a layout so valuable in meaning to what it means and represents to me.
> 
> When I finally had the honor of meeting with Mr. Amano, he asked me a simple question: "how long have you been doing Nature Aquarium before ADG?" When I gave him the answer, he requested his assistant to print out the layout I entered, and upon receiving it from her took an evaluative look at it and said:


Congratulations frank! What a moral booster to be credited from the master himself! 

I hope someday I can get back to aquascaping and enter into the IAPLC. After Sandy, Im not sure when my life will be "normal" again.


----------



## Francis Xavier

A teaser to the opening of ACT III:



*ACT III to start soon!

*Layouts to come: 

*Wabi Kusa 
*Mini M version III
*60-P version II
*on the docket is reloading the Mini S!

Sessions to come:

*understanding wabi sabi
*technique perfection

*ACT II & III Intermission:

*Nature Aquarium Party Report! Sumida Aquarium blow-your-brains out awesome _plus_ Nature Aquarium Gallery & Autumn in the mountains of Urabandai.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Thank you to all my friends for the congratulatory posts! I am humbled and appreciative. 

Some people who stand out:

Freph - you'll get there, look again at some of my earlier work and on the first page and you'll see it didn't all come in a day. Keep at it and you'll be there sooner than you think.

Frrok - I've lived through my fair share of bad hurricanes. It might not seem like it now but life will get back to business-as-usual sooner than you think. I'm glad for your safety in the event of Sandy.

TBS - thank you very much my friend! When will you enter?

acitydweller - Thank you for your kind words, are you doing okay with Sandy?

andrewss - the rasbora are an excellent fish! 

SaltyNC - thank you for your congrats!

fplata - thanks man! when will we see your 120H hitting the contest rounds?

FlyingHellFish - I was surprised twice. Once when a nano aquarium ranked in the top 200, and second when it placed at 127, beating out much larger scale layouts. It just goes to show that much is possible - when you think of it in terms of the 2021 that entered, that places a tiny 5.5 gallon aquarium in the top 6% or there abouts.

bluestems - they certainly do have an excellent personality, don't they? Kubotai are similar in this regard!

Green_Flash - Thank you my friend!

iter - it's interesting, the feel of wabi sabi. I think it might be the most difficult thing to pull off in the hobby. It's something that I see lacking a lot in european layouts - which isn't a bad thing, they aren't necessarily going for the Japanese aesthetic. 

somewhatshocked - soon the photos will be made available!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Apparently I had my own ranking wrong, #125, not #127.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

^ ROFL , a better rank indeed. Top 125 has a better ring to it than 127. 

Anywhoo, how was the whole trip? Any new additions to the hobby? New aquascaping techniques? 

I hate to sound like a broken record but your HC Cuba is mighty good looking, how do you keep the bottom leaves from yellowing or dying out? Mine looks great on top but is yellow on the bottom. And, yeah I tried the whole trimming as close to the substrate as possible. :icon_roll


----------



## @[email protected]

that really is a teaser.
thats some nice emergent growth. im actually planning on setting up my own wabikusa soon, im hoping on using you and kiran as a resource to help me work out any kinks if anything starts going wrong. 

looking forward to all the new scapes


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> ^ ROFL , a better rank indeed. Top 125 has a better ring to it than 127.
> 
> Anywhoo, how was the whole trip? Any new additions to the hobby? New aquascaping techniques?
> 
> I hate to sound like a broken record but your HC Cuba is mighty good looking, how do you keep the bottom leaves from yellowing or dying out? Mine looks great on top but is yellow on the bottom. And, yeah I tried the whole trimming as close to the substrate as possible. :icon_roll


#125 does sound a lot better, doesn't it? I remember why I thought #127, because #126 was a really cool layout in a much larger aquarium by a Japanese shop owner, and I was surprised to score higher. 

The whole trip was pretty amazing - I learned how the Sumida guys take care of the world's largest planted aquarium, amazing what you can learn speaking some Japanese! Those guys are the real heros behind that aquarium - and you'll never hear about them outside of that video. 

For yellow - up your potassium and iron, remember that the planted aquarium isn't a static beast. Meaning that just because, say, one pump of Brighty K on day 1 is enough, it doesn't mean it's enough on day 30. So you're slowly adjusting over time to compensate. 

Of course, maintaining good trimming technique to keep it trimmed shorter helps quite a lot, as the lower portion will die from lack of light if it grows over itself too much.


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> that really is a teaser.
> thats some nice emergent growth. im actually planning on setting up my own wabikusa soon, im hoping on using you and kiran as a resource to help me work out any kinks if anything starts going wrong.
> 
> looking forward to all the new scapes


It's a set of bona fide wabi kusa fresh from Japan. It'll be fun!


----------



## Green_Flash

looking forward to your next projects Frank, hopefully we can buy wabi kusa soon in the USA.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> #125 does sound a lot better, doesn't it? I remember why I thought #127, because #126 was a really cool layout in a much larger aquarium by a Japanese shop owner, and I was surprised to score higher.
> 
> The whole trip was pretty amazing - I learned how the Sumida guys take care of the world's largest planted aquarium, amazing what you can learn speaking some Japanese! Those guys are the real heros behind that aquarium - and you'll never hear about them outside of that video.
> 
> For yellow - up your potassium and iron, remember that the planted aquarium isn't a static beast. Meaning that just because, say, one pump of Brighty K on day 1 is enough, it doesn't mean it's enough on day 30. So you're slowly adjusting over time to compensate.
> 
> Of course, maintaining good trimming technique to keep it trimmed shorter helps quite a lot, as the lower portion will die from lack of light if it grows over itself too much.


that is amazing!


----------



## CryptKeeper54

Ditto. That video was intense. So much work and dedicatin for those tanks.

Congrats Frank on your masterpiece nano tank.


----------



## theblondskeleton

Francis Xavier said:


> TBS - thank you very much my friend! When will you enter?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, as soon as I can catch up  nah, I'll likely enter this coming year as soon as I get the 120P in presentable shape again. We'll see how she fares. I hope you can get more folks stateside to enter! Let's represent, people!
> 
> And again, really remarkable work, Frank. That final shot is quite beautiful. It's one of those works you can go back to over and over and just immerse yourself in for a while. I have yet to hit that with my aquariums, but all things in their own time. It appears I have a lot to learn about wabi sabi, myself
Click to expand...


----------



## Francis Xavier

CryptKeeper54 said:


> Ditto. That video was intense. So much work and dedicatin for those tanks.
> 
> Congrats Frank on your masterpiece nano tank.


Thank you for the cool props!



theblondskeleton said:


> Francis Xavier said:
> 
> 
> 
> TBS - thank you very much my friend! When will you enter?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, as soon as I can catch up  nah, I'll likely enter this coming year as soon as I get the 120P in presentable shape again. We'll see how she fares. I hope you can get more folks stateside to enter! Let's represent, people!
> 
> And again, really remarkable work, Frank. That final shot is quite beautiful. _It's one of those works you can go back to over and over and just immerse yourself in for a while._ I have yet to hit that with my aquariums, but all things in their own time. It appears I have a lot to learn about wabi sabi, myself
> 
> 
> 
> That's probably one of the coolest compliments I've ever received - that means a lot, thanks!
> 
> As one of the contest judges described wabi sabi:
> 
> "I have a feeling of wabi sabi, *deep breath* when I am sitting on a summer day sipping tea while looking over the scenery of the land while a cool breeze crosses my face."
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## Francis Xavier

*What is Wabi Sabi?*

Wabi Sabi, a mysterious Japanese sense of aesthetics, which has most often been described as admiration for the imperfect - an admiration for something as simple as a patch of weeds growing alongside a rock, is easily misunderstood. 

It is not quite so simple as merely saying that in your design you have achieved wabi sabi by letting things "grow wild," as there is a controlled chaos to it, a measured imperfection and an emotion.

To describe it, and for you to understand it, you must put yourself in an emotional state that inspires a deep, inner feeling. 

Wabi Sabi is...like re-igniting that feeling of love you felt for someone for the first time, heart racing and blood rushing to your head. That feeling of anticipation, waiting for the next time you meet or talk to that person. At the same time, it's that feeling of heart-break that spurns from that same love. While also being the desire to do it all over again. 

To feel Wabi Sabi is to feel that entanglement of emotion and to express it and inspire it in other people - in this case, with aquatic plants.


----------



## orchidman

well put! it sheds more light on it then other things ive read trying to describe wabi sabi. of photos ive seen, i know what they make me feel. the way you phrased it describes what that to a T!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Some eye candy - my latest layout in the Mini M at the ADG gallery.


----------



## freph

Very nice. I love how the simple sand, rocks and a central plant mass layouts look. Has a very nice feeling of wasabi...err...wabi-sabi. 

I see you've got some of the grout stuff in the silicone corners as well...any clues as to how to get at it or get it off? It seems like it's bonded with the silicone somehow and just refuses to come off. I've had diatoms grow on it but they come right off and that stuff remains.


----------



## @[email protected]

Is that a wabi kusa submerged?


----------



## orchidman

love the simplicity of it!


----------



## andrewss

museum quality 

I love the clear everything, light stand, tubes, so clean


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Where all the updates? Don't get lazy on us Frank,  

So I been trying to get the whole Wabi Sabi going and there a few different guides on creating the soil ball. 

How do you make the ball stay in shape and not dissolve in the water? I been trying potting mix wrap with taiwan moss and normal ground moss, not going too well.


----------



## orchidman

FlyingHellFish said:


> Where all the updates? Don't get lazy on us Frank,
> 
> So I been trying to get the whole Wabi Sabi going and there a few different guides on creating the soil ball.
> 
> How do you make the ball stay in shape and not dissolve in the water? I been trying potting mix wrap with taiwan moss and normal ground moss, not going too well.


ive been using AAA New Zealand sphagnum moss wrapped around a rock. works well, i dont fertilize but you cuold fertilize the water you mist with or the water in the tank if its submersed. i guess you could add a root tab to the ball as well...


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Doesn't the plants have to be rooted within the soil? Do you just cover the rock with the soil and wrap it up with moss?


----------



## orchidman

FlyingHellFish said:


> Doesn't the plants have to be rooted within the soil? Do you just cover the rock with the soil and wrap it up with moss?


I don't use any soil as all. I just wrap the sphagnum moss tightly around the rock. Secure with fishing line. And then I place the plants on the ball and secure with more fishing line. The roots I have found will go into the sphagnum moss once they get going. And I jut lag the plants on top and secure with fishing line. After they start growing the stems will give shoot from the nodes along the stem and those shoots will grow upwards.


----------



## loucas6290

what kind of sand are you using?


----------



## marioman72

read every page from the very beginning over the past few hours, showed me a lot of bad habits that i have learned, and what i can do to better my self. definitely great techniques and how toos. hopefully will learn much much more thanks for a great read!!


----------



## FlyingHellFish

orchidman said:


> I don't use any soil as all. I just wrap the sphagnum moss tightly around the rock. Secure with fishing line. And then I place the plants on the ball and secure with more fishing line. The roots I have found will go into the sphagnum moss once they get going. And I jut lag the plants on top and secure with fishing line. After they start growing the stems will give shoot from the nodes along the stem and those shoots will grow upwards.


I tired your method and it still isn't working. Everything just rots away without soil. I think the moss was even dying, maybe the moisture not high enough.


----------



## orchidman

FlyingHellFish said:


> I tried your method and it still isn't working. Everything just rots away without soil. I think the moss was even dying, maybe the moisture not high enough.


What moss did you use? If you used quality sphagnum moss you shouldn't have that problem. Sphagnum moss is dead from the start.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Well, I had the bright idea of using my clippings of taiwan moss. The part under water did fine, but the top part, along with the Cuba and various other plants, die really quickly. 

How do they get the soil ball to stay in place? As soon as that bad boy touches water, it just breaks apart. 

I was thinking of taking a foam ball, covering it up with soil and rocks, while having only the bottom part touching the water. So when you water the bowl, the foam sucks it up. 

But.......

At last.....

I'm too lazy....


----------



## orchidman

FlyingHellFish said:


> Well, I had the bright idea of using my clippings of taiwan moss. The part under water did fine, but the top part, along with the Cuba and various other plants, die really quickly.
> 
> How do they get the soil ball to stay in place? As soon as that bad boy touches water, it just breaks apart.
> 
> I was thinking of taking a foam ball, covering it up with soil and rocks, while having only the bottom part touching the water. So when you water the bowl, the foam sucks it up.
> 
> But.......
> 
> At last.....
> 
> I'm too lazy....



i wrapped a rock with sphagnum moss http://www.newworldorchids.com/images/goods/moss5.jpg and then tied around it with fishing line. the moss wicks the water up. it doesnt brake apart if you tie it well..


----------



## Francis Xavier

The first article in a four part series, Adventures in Aquascaping column in TFH was published just recently - in the January 2013 issue the first segment covers the preplanning stage and thought process behind the original Mini M layout here!

Pick one up!


----------



## bluestems

How's the Wabi Sabi doing? Any chance of ADG stocking ADA wabi sabi's in the near future?


----------



## amphirion

FlyingHellFish said:


> I tired your method and it still isn't working. Everything just rots away without soil. I think the moss was even dying, maybe the moisture not high enough.


sphagnum moss tends to break down quicker if exposed to hard water or strong nitrogen rich environments when mosses and bryophytes take over.


----------



## FlyingHellFish

^ My tap water is super hard


----------



## Francis Xavier

Through a random stroke of luck:






The Cube Garden Superior 60-P


----------



## @[email protected]

that looks fantastic.
what kind of setup are you gonna make it?


----------



## d2creative

Frank, it was awesome to meet you today and I loved the little tour of ADG!
Just found this thread and can't wait to go through it all. 

Thanks again!

-dennis


----------



## Francis Xavier

Hey Dennis!

You'll have to share what you do with some of that great rock in your aquarium here!


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> that looks fantastic.
> what kind of setup are you gonna make it?


I'm going back and forth between stone and stone+driftwood. Going through the inspiration stage!


----------



## Francis Xavier

A found cache of photographs from San Marcos River Summer, featured in TFH magazine January through April 2013 issues. 


Top angle shot of San Marcos River Summer, Francis Wazeter by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr


Francis Wazeter's San Marcos River Summer by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr


----------



## FlyingHellFish

Yo Frank, look what happen when you went away....


A meteor hit my tank....


----------



## bluestems

Francis Xavier said:


> Francis Wazeter's San Marcos River Summer by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr


I really love the evolution of this tank! I have the same pygmy rasboras and absolutely adore them. Can you tell me what bps you pump your co2 in with these guys? With all the pearling that you have, is that from high co2 dosing? Just wondering as I would like to bump up my co2 but am not sure how high is safe for the maculatas.


----------



## Green_Flash

Hey Frank, nice cube garden superior! first I've seen used I think. Awaiting updates!


----------



## Francis Xavier

FlyingHellFish said:


> Yo Frank, look what happen when you went away....
> 
> 
> A meteor hit my tank....


Did the HC float up? The result is probably from not trimming soon enough - when you do not trim plants like HC or Riccia, eventually the bottom portion rots (due to no access to light), causing the top portion to float up. No worries though, you can get it to come back quick and it's all just a part of the learning process. You've shown significant improvement over the last 6 months! Keep it up my friend!



bluestems said:


> I really love the evolution of this tank! I have the same pygmy rasboras and absolutely adore them. Can you tell me what bps you pump your co2 in with these guys? With all the pearling that you have, is that from high co2 dosing? Just wondering as I would like to bump up my co2 but am not sure how high is safe for the maculatas.


Thank you for the compliment Blue! There is another complete series feature in Tropical Fish Hobbyist on this aquarium spanning 4 issues - January 2013 to April 2013. Worth a read if you get a chance, I wrote out an entirely different spin on the whole learning process there. 

For BPS, by the time the tank was at this stage in the game, I was running around 4-5 BPS. Absolutely no issues what so ever with any of the living organisms.

With Co2, as with ferts, just slowly raise your input over time as the aquarium evolves. Though, most of the pearling from this aquarium is from Riccia, which is a notorious pearler. Well, the moss pearls a lot too. 



Green_Flash said:


> Hey Frank, nice cube garden superior! first I've seen used I think. Awaiting updates!


Here's a sneak look: 


Wazeter Cube Garden Superior by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

As far as I know, it's the only one of it's kind in North America - the tank is a bit ridiculous...one of those that you wish you had never seen, since it makes all other aquariums (including the ADA high clarity line) look cheap. That being said, you'd have to be a serious enthusiast to put the $3,400 (for that you could have a 180-P) into the aquarium. I found myself in possession of it after a long string of events that involved the original purchaser canceling at the last minute, so it ended up with me kind of by default.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Cube Garden Superior 60P by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Angle shot showing the clarity of the glass / seamless edge.


----------



## orchidman

That is incredible!


----------



## iter

Look at the quality of that glass!!!


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*

Awesome tank frank, what kind of wood are you using?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## bluestems

The 45p is on my wish list! :smile:... hopefully it will continued to be stocked when I can purchase one. I love how the aquasky frame fits, and was pleasantly surprised by the quality of the frame. 



Thanks, Frank for the explanation on the co2. I've bumped mine up to 1-2bps and will gradually increase it over the next couple of weeks. The hc and other plants seem to be doing well, but I'm hoping to get rid of some string algae and bba. With my next setup, I'll be better at the doing the required initial water changes after reading through this guide. Thanks again!


----------



## Green_Flash

TheGuy said:


> Awesome tank frank, what kind of wood are you using?
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


I think it is branch wood. 

Nice scape Frank! 
Although I would take a 180-P anyday over this.  ::biggrin:


----------



## d2creative

I want to see what somebody does with that little 10x10x10 superior.


----------



## bluestems

Green_Flash said:


> Nice scape Frank!
> Although I would take a 180-P anyday over this.  ::biggrin:


+1 :icon_smil


----------



## Francis Xavier

Oh believe me, I'm with you on taking the 180-P over this one. In this case, the opportunity here was far too good to pass up. This is kind of like, opting to take the 100% titanium or white gold built Mercedes over a Ferrari...a point where if you're going to buy it retail, the price for you is just truly far beyond being relevant. We had just such a client, who decided to abandon his deposit and cancel the order two days before arrival.


----------



## shrimpnmoss

Wow! That's some serious tank porn.


----------



## danielt

Dear sir, I read the e-book text made from this thread and I just wanted to thank you for the philosophical bits you put in there. I'm really amazed how a couple of well written lines can change a mindset. Thank you again!

One question that bugs me and I doubt you can answer it fully. Is there a way to replicate the function of the bacterial substances you employ to construct that wonderful substrate?

In my country these products are not readily available and my understanding is that I must order over seas for these products as the last shop that used to sell them told me there is a huge shortage of your product mostly in Europe and they will not attempt to bring them again because of a lack of request.

I'm planning to make do with other alternatives for the key ingredient: bacteria

I was hoping you can give some pointers of what type of product might provide something close to its function.


----------



## Green_Flash

Well actually, I don't like the superiors at all, just don't like the rounded corners.



> Oh believe me, I'm with you on taking the 180-P over this one. In this case, the opportunity here was far too good to pass up. This is kind of like, opting to take the 100% titanium or white gold built Mercedes over a Ferrari...a point where if you're going to buy it retail, the price for you is just truly far beyond being relevant. We had just such a client, who decided to abandon his deposit and cancel the order two days before arrival.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*



Green_Flash said:


> Well actually, I don't like the superiors at all, just don't like the rounded corners.


Same here, a white gold Mercedes sounds too gaudy and just odd... give me the Ferrari!!! I like all ADA tanks because of the craftsmanship... but I absolutely hate getting algae off a curved tank. So frustrating. 

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ADAtank

crazy nice


----------



## Francis Xavier

With the arrival of a few new plant's on Friday, the first layout of 2013 has begun.

Returning to the classics - a Mini M layout once again. In the visioning process of this aquascape, I wanted to perfect an image in my mind that had never been fully realized in the previous layout, shown here:


Green in the Fog by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

That particular layout had some potential, but in the end I had imported some algaes from another aquarium which kind of always plagued the setup. I liked it, but it didn't satisfy my vision. 

When it came time for me to move residences, I opted to not continue the layout as it was and to start a new once things got settled, and now is the perfect time as aquascaping season is officially here as we prepare for the IAPLC 2013 competition!

To get back to the original inspiration, here is a photograph I took while visiting Japan, which emphasizes one of the key points of the layout type I want to achieve. 


Stream Side Inspiration by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

There is an ancient feeling to this segment of a stream, ferns growing in tandem with moss on the stones near a stream side. This is the type of feel I am reaching for, and have finally gotten together the materials to do just so:


Mini M "Stream Side" by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

"Stream Side," Layout, composition is Bolbitus Heteroclita "Mini" and Peacock Moss on Unzan stone with sand foreground. Aquarium size: 20L, (5.5 gallon) in Mini M aquarium.

Layout Benefits:

-Slow growing plants, much less maintenance intensive on the trimming side

Layout Challenges:

-Very little aquasoil - liquid dosings, especially in Nitrogen and Phosphorus will have to be upped. 
-Method of moss attachment will take time, and Amano's will pick it off the stones, so algae may become somewhat of an issue up front - requiring extra diligence in the first month.

As for the technical details, I'll get to those in a follow up post, covering the step-by-step setup as well as the sanitizing process of the filter and equipment used before to prevent any residual spores from coming in and setting up shop.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*

Very sweet

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Green_Flash

Frank, this is great, I like the stream inspiration picture.


----------



## assasin6547

One question if you don't mind, is there anything other than rocks I can tie Riccia to? Or could I just leave it on the mat and let it the dwarf hair grass grow into the mat? https://www.azgardens.com/p-2190-riccia-on-mat.aspx Thanks. I am starting my first low tech planted tank!


----------



## Francis Xavier

That you had a mindset shift based on my written words is a deep compliment to me, thank you for your words!

I am not familiar with other products that achieve the same effect, but I do believe in the past year to two years or so there have been some alternatives developed out of other companies, though I believe their availability is primarily in SE Asia. 

If you know other hobbyists in the area with established tanks, you may 'seed' your substrate with a sample of theirs, however, this does carry the risk of contamination of whatever type of algae's they may have in their aquaria (which is inevitable to get anyway if you are trading plants / and or in commercially available plants, etc etc). With this strategy you would do the same as the additives - place the sample underneath the substrate. 

Over time, these bacteria will occur naturally and will be seeded into the aquarium via the roots of the plants you place in the tank - as these bacteria are symbiotic with the roots of the plants (if they did not exist, it would be more difficult for the plants to absorb raw nutrients through roots, the bacteria actually break down the raw nutrients into a usable form by the plants).

There is a case where this is most prevalent - in the case of species of Anubias, which have a great deal of trouble growing via Tissue Culture because they are so reliant on symbiotic bacteria to grow. In this case, during the tissue culturing process, the plant is made sterile, removing contaminants, fungi, etc for a healthier plant specimen free of pests. However, with Anubias, this also has the unintended side effect of killing off all the beneficial bacteria in the rhizome, rendering the growth of the certain Anubias species largely ineffective. Other, less dependent species, are much easier to propagate via tissue culture for these reasons - or perhaps because they are regenerating from cells at a very basic level. My measured scientific knowledge on the subject, while expanding, is still limited, but this is as best I know how to describe it.

What the additive Bacter 100 does is it speeds the process along at the start when the aquarium / new ecosystem is at its most vulnerable. From the get go by having a super punch of bacteria from day 1, you effectively aid the development of the ecosystem getting established. This then speeds the development of plants along in the aquarium by way of increasing nutrient absorption capabilities through the roots. 

So in your case, trying to seed it with some samples of someone elses soil would help you out quite a bit. Alternatively, if you raised enough ruckus in with your closest European distributor of ADA, they might get you some Bacter 100 to shut you up!



danielt said:


> Dear sir, I read the e-book text made from this thread and I just wanted to thank you for the philosophical bits you put in there. I'm really amazed how a couple of well written lines can change a mindset. Thank you again!
> 
> One question that bugs me and I doubt you can answer it fully. Is there a way to replicate the function of the bacterial substances you employ to construct that wonderful substrate?
> 
> In my country these products are not readily available and my understanding is that I must order over seas for these products as the last shop that used to sell them told me there is a huge shortage of your product mostly in Europe and they will not attempt to bring them again because of a lack of request.
> 
> I'm planning to make do with other alternatives for the key ingredient: bacteria
> 
> I was hoping you can give some pointers of what type of product might provide something close to its function.


----------



## Francis Xavier

assasin6547 said:


> One question if you don't mind, is there anything other than rocks I can tie Riccia to? Or could I just leave it on the mat and let it the dwarf hair grass grow into the mat? https://www.azgardens.com/p-2190-riccia-on-mat.aspx Thanks. I am starting my first low tech planted tank!


You can tie Riccia to anything with a surface! Bear in mind that Riccia ends up adopting the shape of the object it's tied too - so if tied to say, moon stones it will have a roundish mound appearance vs. an even hedge from Riccia stones / flat stones. 

I would not leave the plants on the mats they sell them on - typically they're made of some kind of fibrous material that seems to cause more issues than it solves. If it is on a steel mesh, it would be okay, but I would still encourage you to retie it yourself to another surface, such as flat, thin stones. This will give you the most flexibility and manipulation in your layout over Riccia.


----------



## Tank Man

Reading through this forum I see you do daily water changes for the first week and then slowly do less and less. Would you suggest doing the same with a larger tank (55g)? Would the larger volume reduce the need at all or would the bacteria's needs rise proportionally and therefore still benefit from the daily changes?

P.S. Thank you for the inspiration and this thread in general. The philosophy of keeping and maintaining a beautiful tank draw me into the hobby more than any singular plant, fish, or tank ever could.


----------



## Xalyx

I have two quick words.

Thank you.

Frank, I appreciate your hard work. This is the most helpful thread I've ever read so anyone disagreeing with your teachings is automatically wrong because they're not trying to do what you've done in this thread.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Tank Man said:


> Reading through this forum I see you do daily water changes for the first week and then slowly do less and less. Would you suggest doing the same with a larger tank (55g)? Would the larger volume reduce the need at all or would the bacteria's needs rise proportionally and therefore still benefit from the daily changes?
> 
> P.S. Thank you for the inspiration and this thread in general. The philosophy of keeping and maintaining a beautiful tank draw me into the hobby more than any singular plant, fish, or tank ever could.


Yes - no matter the tank size, you're going to want to refresh the water supply daily for the first week, every other day for the second week, twice a week for the third and once a week there after. 

That being said, the water changes you do during the first week should be the easiest care sessions you ever do for the aquarium - water in, water out, fertilize. Algae should not yet have grown anywhere and there's no need to trim yet. This will also cultivate the habit for water change after the first "hell month."

Everything goes in proportion like you theorized - also too, the bacteria will only grow to the maximum support of the environment. 

Great to hear that the thread has been an inspiration for you! Hopefully it will continue to do so.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Xalyx said:


> I have two quick words.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Frank, I appreciate your hard work. This is the most helpful thread I've ever read so anyone disagreeing with your teachings is automatically wrong because they're not trying to do what you've done in this thread.


Thank you for your kind compliments! I'm glad it's been helpful for you and hopefully it will continue to be so!


----------



## Green_Flash

Hi Frank, when is the new intl ADA site going to be up?

Also why don't they make AJ in English anymore?


----------



## Francis Xavier

They discontinued the English AJ due to 'lack of interest,' or something to that effect. 

I have no idea when they anticipate a release of the intl site.


----------



## Xalyx

Where did you get all this dwarf riccia? Isn't it hard to buy? Where can I get some?


----------



## Green_Flash

Is dwarf ricca different from ricca?


----------



## MABJ

*Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*



Green_Flash said:


> Is dwarf ricca different from ricca?


Yup. It also floats unless tied down, but it is more compact and far denser.


----------



## Xalyx

MABJ said:


> Yup. It also floats unless tied down, but it is more compact and far denser.


That's all fine and dandy but meaningless if it can't be obtained.


----------



## MABJ

*Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*



Xalyx said:


> That's all fine and dandy but meaningless if it can't be obtained.


Hey now :/ my answer wasn't meaningless. 

In fact I know of a seller, so be nice. 

F2plata, I believe is his name, has a picture of an older car in his profile. He has some and grows it.

I was about to buy some simply for its rarity, but I didn't because I have nowhere to put it.


----------



## Xalyx

MABJ said:


> Hey now :/ my answer wasn't meaningless.
> 
> In fact I know of a seller, so be nice.
> 
> F2plata, I believe is his name, has a picture of an older car in his profile. He has some and grows it.
> 
> I was about to buy some simply for its rarity, but I didn't because I have nowhere to put it.


Incorrect name I think


----------



## Francis Xavier

Xalyx said:


> Incorrect name I think


I only use normal Riccia Fluitans - the moss in the new layout is peacock moss.

I achieve small size in Riccia with frequent trimming and higher co2 concentrations and nutrient density. When I get these aquariums to fully grown in, I am typically running 3-4 times the initial recommended dosage for fertilizers.

This same technique can be used for E. Tennellus - which will grow quite large when left alone, trimming to the base Helps maintain a smaller size. 

Often, the size of a plant isn't a new sp. of that plant, but small growing size is achieved with good trimming and dosing technique.

For example - E. Acicularis and E. Parvula will grow to about 8 inches left alone, but frequent trimming can train this plant to stay about 3-4 inches instead.

The same with stems - trimming them will keep lea sizes smaller and create denser foliage.


So the lesson here is that mastery and cultivation comes through proper care (trimming) technique, rather than specific species or sub species. The same practice comes into play with plant color.

In two tanks with the same dosing regime, one with frequent trimming (tank A) and the other with almost none( tank b), E. Tennelus is growing.

In tank A, Tenellus grows shorter and keeps a blood-red bronze coloration mixed with greens. 

In tank B, tennellus over grows and becomes taller (about 12"), and the bronze coloration fades out to a light shade of green.

The trimming induces tennellus to regrow where it maintains it's beautiful bronze color before it "grows out of it."

In Rotala Colorata, as the thicket is repeatedly trimmed back, the stem size stays tinier as it is covering ground (e.g. It hasn't grown to full size yet). The tips maintain a gradien coloration between deep red at the top and yellow at the bottom. However as the leaf ages it turns more yellowish and eventually is green, so left alone only the top portion would be the brilliant autumnal color.

Think of the aquatic plants growth as a flower blooming - once it has bloomed it "peaks" and the plant grows beyond that stage. What we want to do is repeatedly maintain the plant in the most pleasant temporary state, which is achieved through trimming at the appropriate times. Overgrown plants are rarely a good thing aesthetically, unless you are specifically looking for the plant to be in it's "overgrown form."

So if we think of plants in terms of emmersed forms and submersed forms as the most obvious, then there are "sub forms" of the submersed forms (this is not technically, scientifically correct, but for understanding is easiest to visualize and think of).

Of those "sub forms" there are three stages - initial growth / re growth, where the plant part is spreading out a runner or a new plantlet or regrowing a stem. This form is usuall the smallest and has a slightly pale coloration.

The second and usually most "ideal" form is the maturing phase, where the plant has it's deepest / most brilliant coloration and the plant is of medium size (relative to max growth of that plant). This would be where tenellus is about 3-4 inches and has primarily bronze colors.

The third is overgrown or aged phase - where the plant has gone beyond full maturation and is now at or beyond maximum size - colors usually change again and are a little more faded or deeper in color depending on species. sometimes this coloration could be much different (like red to yellow to green in R. Colorata) or more subtle shades (like popping vibrant green to darker / subdued green in HC).

Another way to think of it is in terms of a human baby growing up and going through adolescence to teenage to adulthood to old age. 

So in trimming we effectively restart the process again at initial growth and want to constantly be in the maturation phase.

This is also why it is important for you to learn a couple key species and to reuse them in your layouts so you can master their growth and phase patterns to make increasingly more complex layouts.


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Great points made there, Frank, and once again, making this one of the coolest threads ever.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Thanks!

I have a few photos to update this with, I had an incident happen in the aquarium that's useful to teach off of, but I've been too busy to get the photos off the camera and tend to forget (then when I remember I don't have the SD card on me!!).

Essentially what happened is, I used pure RODI water and caused the Moss to brown out since there was no pH buffer at all - due to a lack of aqua soil and no stones that raise / alter pH. The moss is recovering now that I'm not being lazy and adding back in equilibrium, but it's a great example of a problem that can happen quickly and is completely preventable with a step. 

But, the road to recovery should prove useful as an instructional tool - at least no algae has shown up yet.


----------



## Xalyx

Ok I know where to buy regular riccia, although still rare.

As for my next question, how did all these people become your students, where can I attend such a university?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Nothing too special! Just ask questions, learn from the principles I've set out and have an attitude that's willing to be challenged. It's a laissez-faire one on one type deal. Just message or call me with specific questions and follow the system and take pictures of your results!


----------



## Xalyx

Francis Xavier said:


> Nothing too special! Just ask questions, learn from the principles I've set out and have an attitude that's willing to be challenged. It's a laissez-faire one on one type deal. Just message or call me with specific questions and follow the system and take pictures of your results!


Definitely going to take you up on that offer but it's going to be late 2013/Early 2014 before I have all the money for a full ADA Mini S set. So my wait is long... but I'm going all out and cutting no corners so in the end it'll be worth it. I look at it as the cup is half full... this means that I have a year to envision my layout!! I have the flora list down to 98% completion (can't decide between HC and Riccia). 

Visualize my scape... Can't wait.


----------



## Francis Xavier

In the mean time you may want to pick up copies of TFH (Tropical Fish Hobbyist) magazine for January to April 2013 - I have an article series running in there for that length that goes over the whole process from a different perspective. 

I think they can be found at barnes and nobles or somewhere like that.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*

Frank did you find the small unzan was very buoyant

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Francis Xavier

TheGuy said:


> Frank did you find the small unzan was very buoyant
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


Hmm, I never had an issue with it floating or anything. They are very light stones, and very porous.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*

I think it just wanted to give me a hard time. Would you be kind enough to tell me what page you went over dosing schedules ect. on for the mini m? I'm not sure how much of what is needed.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## dr3ww3rd

Francis Xavier said:


> A few of you now have asked me questions about the equipment list that I am running on this aquarium, and while I think that putting it up as the very first thing to do to get people to read a thread is in poor taste, it has become quite evident that you guys find the information valuable, whether that is to mimic the results or to find comparable products on the market.
> 
> So without further talk, here's the list:
> 
> It's all ADA proprietary:
> 
> *Core:*
> Aquarium: Cube Garden Mini M
> Lighting: Solar Mini M, Bulb: 27w Compact Flourescent, 8,000k.
> Stand: Wood Cabinet Gun Metal Silver
> 
> *Co2 & Distribution:*
> Co2 Advanced System (System 74-YA/ver. 2, Clear Parts Set, Bubble Counter (set includes more, but I had a few replacements)
> Diffuser: Pollen Glass Mini
> Metal Cap Stand
> El-Valve (solenoid for automatic Co2 on/off)
> 
> *Filtration:*
> Eheim 2211 (13mm inflow, 10mm outflow)
> Clear Hose 10mm & 13mm
> Lily Pipe Mini P-1 10mm (outflow)
> Lily Pipe Mini V-1 13mm (inflow)
> 
> Filtration Media, Month 1:
> Eheim Bio Rings
> NA Carbon 750ml
> 
> Filtration Media, Month 2:
> Eheim Bio Rings
> Bio Rio 1L
> 
> Filtration Media, Month 4:
> Bio Rio 2L (will end up being 1.5L in eheim 2211)
> Tourmaline F
> 
> *Substrate
> *Penac P
> Penac W
> Bacter 100
> Clear Super
> Tourmaline BC
> Power Sand S 2L
> Amazonia Powder Type 3L (for this slope, ended up being about 4.5L)
> 
> *Maintenance Tools:*
> Maintenance Stand I
> Pincettes S
> Pincettes M
> Sand Flattener
> Pro Pincettes Spring (Curve Type)
> Wave Scissors
> Pro Scissors Short (Curve Type)
> Pro Scissors Short (Straight Type)
> AP Glass Feeder
> AP-1 Fish Food
> 
> *Fertilizers and Additives:
> *Week 1: Brighty K, Green Bacter
> Week 2 to end of Month 3: Brighty K, Green Brighty Step 1, Green Brighty Special Lights (alternate Day 1 = Step 1, Day 2 = Lights, etc Brighty K everyday)
> 
> 
> Month 3 onward: Brighty K, Green Brighty Step 2, Special Lights (see above for dosing)
> 
> Month 1 onward: ECA (iron, bacterial growth) once a week, 3 drops.
> 
> Fertilizer dosings are one squirt per day, by the end of the 2nd month this will likely be two squirts.
> 
> Green Bacter: after every water change, always.
> 
> Phyton Git: use when algae pops up
> Green Gain: after trimming
> 
> *Other Setup Tools:
> *Riccia Stones
> Riccia Line
> Moss Cotton
> Lava Rock for moss attachment
> 
> *Hardscape:
> *5 Manten Stones
> 
> *Water Change Schedule:*
> First week = daily water change (50%-80%)
> Second week = water change every other day (50%-80%)
> Third week = water change every third day (twice) (50%-80%)
> Fourth week onwards = once a week water changes, water change as needed due to algae.
> 
> Total time for water changes on a Mini M: 10 minutes
> Likely Regime: draining about 10% of the water daily for extra aeration (~1-2 min)
> 
> *Water Quality:*
> Pure RODI water, no additives.
> 
> *Likely additional additives:
> 
> *Seachem Excel, half capful daily after 2-3 week for a secondary source of carbon.
> 
> *Co2 Distribution:
> *1 BPS first week
> 2 BPS second week
> 3-4 BPS onward, raise as needed.
> 
> *Average Co2 cartridge lifespan:*
> 4 weeks
> 
> P.S. if you've found these techniques valuable, help share the information with new comers by linking back here in your own journals when you use my techniques!


I think this is the post your looking for. It has most the info your looking for at the bottom of his post.


----------



## Francis Xavier

I'm not sure what page it was now - but to start 1 squirt of brighty k, 4-5 drops of green Bacter for the first week.

Second week onward step one 1 squirt and brighty k 1 squirt. 

Increase dosage slightly as plants grow by your judgement.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - What is Wabi Sabi?*



dr3ww3rd said:


> I think this is the post your looking for. It has most the info your looking for at the bottom of his post.










Francis Xavier said:


> I'm not sure what page it was now - but to start 1 squirt of brighty k, 4-5 drops of green Bacter for the first week.
> 
> Second week onward step one 1 squirt and brighty k 1 squirt.
> 
> Increase dosage slightly as plants grow by your judgement.


Thanks guys. 

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Francis Xavier

It's nasty....it's disgusting...it's often the result of neglect....it is algae!

It also just happens and there's just no getting around it. As one of the most common causes of frustration, it can easily drive you to a point of madness in it's eradication. However, when algae does happen, for any reason (maybe you had to go on vacation, maybe you just kept coming home tired and said "tomorrow I'll do a water change for sure," and life gets away from you), you have a choice: start over with a clean slate, give up on the aquarium thing all together, or, more preferably: solve the problem.

At the bottom of this post you'll see a pretty nasty picture. A shameful picture...one that should never happen in the picturesque world of the perfect planted aquarium seen in the pictures. 

But, more often than not, the reality for most of us is it's something we've got to deal with at one point or another, and this is what this next series of posts is for. I'm going to show you how a terrible disaster will *go to clean within 30 minutes and back to being on the path of beauty within 24 hours.

*First, before getting into techniques of solving the problem, let me tell you how this tank got to this point so you can _learn how to avoid the problem!

_1.) I set the tank up, and three weeks in to it, I've only ever done one water change. Yep, just one. 

2.) I dosed some potassium and special lights only a few times in the first week, then neglected the tank completely. 

3.) I used pure RODI with no buffer at all and had no stones that add minerals to the water column, and barely any aqua soil, so there was nothing in the aquarium: the result? 2 days after tank setup the pH had no stability and the swings caused the moss to die off immediately and brown out. 

4.) I didn't dose any Green Bacter or anything to help the beneficial bacteria get going, then probably killed a bunch of it trying to get established in the first week when I used tap water with no dechlorinator at the one water change I did do. 

Without further ado, here's an extremely messy aquarium, one I will show you how to fix completely *within 30 minutes and back to beautiful within 24 hours!
*

P.S. That's not mid water change - that's evaporated water levels!


----------



## orchidman

Now let's see how you fix it! My tank is going though the same thing! I literaly told myself yesterday "ugh I should probably just start over" but I really don't want to have to start over. I love the scape and want to get it back on track.


----------



## bluestems

I like that you allowed the tank to get like this as a teaching tool.


----------



## Francis Xavier

So the aquarium is out of hand and the task is to get it back to recovery. At the moment, it looks quite disheartening and you're unsure if it is even worth trying to recover it.

Fortunately, in this case here, the problem is much easier to deal with than it looks. The algae that has formed in this initial period and has been allowed to get out of control is a soft, green filamentous algae and diatoms (brown). Congealed together it looks nice and nasty and boggy though! 

That being said, this kind of algae, left unresolved, often helps lead to more complicated algae types later. We've also got this nice little issue at the top of the aquarium where what looks like some kind of fungus is growing from the evaporated water levels, and there's hard water stains everywhere. 

*We're going to fix 90% of the problem within 30 minutes. 

Step 1

*Turn the filter and co2 off and Remove all that glassware from the tank!


algaediffuser by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

The diffuser taken off!


lilypipeadd by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

The inflow pipe


outflowpipe by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

The outflow pipe. 

Now, add one capful of Superge to a Clean Bottle (bleach can also be used, though Superge has a polishing agent for glass added to it, so it's up to your preference) :


onecapsuperge by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Then follow up by adding all three pieces of glassware into the Clean Bottle, shutting the lid and put it off to the side for a little while (20 minutes)


placeglassinsuperge by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

It's very important here that we sanitize the glassware from algae at this stage. Algae on the diffusion disc will make co2 delivery less effective, while algae in the inflow and outflow pipes will reduce flow. Additionally, if we were to clean the rest of the aquarium and leave these out, then we'd still have the unsightly algae on the glass in the aquarium. Besides the algae being unsightly, it will also provide a good place for the algae to recuperate and grow from - leading to another outbreak quicker.

*Follow up to Step 1:

*Remove the clear hose & filter tubing from the canister filter and place it to the side - we'll come back to that later. At this stage, drain water from the canister filter completely into a bucket.

*Step 2:

*It's time to tackle the algae! Use a Pro Razor Mini or other Razor blade and scrape the algae off the glass. 


algaescrape by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Use vertical strokes going up and down to thoroughly remove algae from the glass - follow this up with another round going horizontal to remove any troublesome algae that stays behind. 

By looking at the glass in the aquarium from an angle, you can see exactly where the algae is. 

*For hard water stains*, use the pro razor to scrape away the hard water, and using some of the aquarium water, rub it against the glass, this will help dissolve and remove the hard water stains from glass quickly. 

*Step 3:

*Drain the aquarium completely - today we'll use a normal 10mm diameter hose to remove the water and remove heavy algae from the area. Stir up the sand with the pro razor to get any algae in the sand loose for removal with the hose. 

Let the aquarium sit there for a moment while you tackle the next task.

*Step 4:*

Remove the glassware from the Clean Bottle while near a sink and run a spring washer through the glass pipes to remove any remaining algae. Rinse thoroughly in water and set them to the side. Use the spring washer to clean out the clear hose from the filter and thoroughly remove any built up algae in the tubing.

For the diffuser, simply rinse thoroughly under the sink until you can no longer smell a chemical odor coming from the glass. Bring these back to the aquarium with you!

*Step 5:

*Fill the aquarium back up with water, for nano size, typically a small pale (such as one you'd use to water plants) is sufficient - pour water over your hand or a plate slowly to prevent disrupting the substrate. 

Once the aquarium is full with water, remove any remaining hard water stains (in this case with the aquasky light as well - running a microfiber cloth over the acrylic casing (separated from the light) removed water stains after an initial dipping into water).

The best technique at this point is to use your hand to rub the hard water stains around the rim, and follow up quickly with a towel or microfiber cloth to dry. 

*Step 6:

*Place the filter & co2 back up, turn both on. 

-Dose Brighty K
-Dose Green Bacter
-Dose Green Brighty Step 1

It's important at this stage to not hold back with your fertilization - as this primarily will only inhibit plant growth more than prevent algae growth. It is useful after this point to dose phyton git, which helps kill algae as a phystoncide. I've noticed that use of this product regularly as a preventative measure helps lesson the impact of algae outbreaks in general.

Aside from that, Day 1, 30 minutes later is complete and there will be one follow up water change tomorrow!


day1finished by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr


----------



## orchidman

Thatnks for the informative post!!! Is there anything I can do about BGA? It keeps coming back no matter what I do.


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> Thatnks for the informative post!!! Is there anything I can do about BGA? It keeps coming back no matter what I do.


Spreading Bacter 100 over the top, or dosing Arethra Myacin (spelling butchered there) will kill BGA.

Use an airline hose before hand to manually remove as much as possible before dosing. Then follow up with the Bacter 100 or Myacin. 

Once you kill it once, it won't come back - but if you let it get infected to the root level, it is considerably more difficult to kill and will require repeat dosings and treatments.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Spreading Bacter 100 over the top, or dosing Arethra Myacin (spelling butchered there) will kill BGA.
> 
> Use an airline hose before hand to manually remove as much as possible before dosing. Then follow up with the Bacter 100 or Myacin.
> 
> Once you kill it once, it won't come back - but if you let it get infected to the root level, it is considerably more difficult to kill and will require repeat dosings and treatments.


Looks like Bacter 100 is out of stock on the ADG website..

Arethra Myacin- Would that be the same thing as Erythromycin? I actually think I have heard of people using it (in the form of pet-store-available Maracyn) for BGA before.

For the tank in question, I have DHG 'Belem' in low tech, so if it's growing, it's growing super slow. The only other plant really is Anubias barteri 'Micro' which also isn't a fast grower. Could that be my problem? That in my setup neither one is vigorous.

And it's also a constant battle with diatoms..


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> Looks like Bacter 100 is out of stock on the ADG website..
> 
> Arethra Myacin- Would that be the same thing as *Erythromycin?* I actually think I have heard of people using it (in the form of pet-store-available *Maracyn*) for BGA before.
> 
> For the tank in question, I have DHG 'Belem' in low tech, so if it's growing, it's growing super slow. The only other plant really is Anubias barteri 'Micro' which also isn't a fast grower. Could that be my problem? That in my setup neither one is vigorous.
> 
> And it's also a constant battle with diatoms..


Bolded words are the correct spellings, yes.

I would say that most of your issues are from the 'low-tech,' setup. It's not that it doesn't work, it's just that it's more difficult because of the variables at play. Things take much, much longer to balance out and problems can't be avoided from fast plant fill ins, so unless you have a huge bulk of plants to begin with, it's kind of like shooting yourself in the foot a little bit. 

Not saying that over time you can't be successful, but that you would find many of these issues go away with the addition of a higher powered proper spectrum light and some kind of co2 injection. While I do not like yeast co2 solutions due to inconsistency, some kind of gaseous co2 addition is better than nothing.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Bolded words are the correct spellings, yes.
> 
> I would say that most of your issues are from the 'low-tech,' setup. It's not that it doesn't work, it's just that it's more difficult because of the variables at play. Things take much, much longer to balance out and problems can't be avoided from fast plant fill ins, so unless you have a huge bulk of plants to begin with, it's kind of like shooting yourself in the foot a little bit.
> 
> Not saying that over time you can't be successful, but that you would find many of these issues go away with the addition of a higher powered proper spectrum light and some kind of co2 injection. While I do not like yeast co2 solutions due to inconsistency, some kind of gaseous co2 addition is better than nothing.


Haha thanks!

I see.. I really am not a fan of yeast CO2 it's way too inconsistent. Do you think adding a floating plant or another type of plant that would grow quickly and basically be an excess nutrient "sponge" would help? Given my constraints of no CO2 and this low lighting that I have, what would you do? I would love to do Co2 and high light, but I simply cannot.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Adding floating plants would only further shade the layout and inhibit the growth of the plants underneath - if you were to add, I would add more plants that survive in the substrate. 

The best thing to do is to keep up with the tank, use it as a learning exercise and start budgeting for a very basic Co2 system and light - it'll definitely earn you a lot of return on your dollar over time.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> Adding floating plants would only further shade the layout and inhibit the growth of the plants underneath - if you were to add, I would add more plants that survive in the substrate.
> 
> The best thing to do is to keep up with the tank, use it as a learning exercise and start budgeting for a very basic Co2 system and light - it'll definitely earn you a lot of return on your dollar over time.


The whole thing is planted or has stones, so really there isn't anywhere else to plant things...


----------



## Francis Xavier

orchidman said:


> The whole thing is planted or has stones, so really there isn't anywhere else to plant things...


If the aquarium is totally grown in or mostly full - then this hints at a filtration capacity problem (or again, the co2 consistency issue), speaking in terms of biological filtration capacity.


----------



## orchidman

Francis Xavier said:


> If the aquarium is totally grown in or mostly full - then this hints at a filtration capacity problem (or again, the co2 consistency issue), speaking in terms of biological filtration capacity.


It is mostly full I would say, but only because I planted it to the amount I wanted it, knowing the plants wouldn't grow fast. So it is full because I planted it not because the plants filled in. If that makes sense...could be filtration. How does filtration directly affect algae? Would you suggest changing from 50/50 mechanical to bio media to 100% bio media?


----------



## talontsiawd

orchidman said:


> It is mostly full I would say, but only because I planted it to the amount I wanted it, knowing the plants wouldn't grow fast. So it is full because I planted it not because the plants filled in. If that makes sense...could be filtration. How does filtration directly affect algae? Would you suggest changing from 50/50 mechanical to bio media to 100% bio media?


I will speak on this, even though you are asking Frank, I have done many low tech tanks without hard to grow plants (HC for example) with no CO2. 

The first key thing is having the right amount of light. It may or may not be low light. I like CFL bulbs on nano tanks because you can go from low light to high light by swapping bulbs. I get two sets of bulbs, starting with the lower and if I don't see good color I up the light (more important than growth to me because good color will get good growth). Good color is relative here because you won't get crazy rich colors with the amount of light that is reasonable. You saw the plants I sent you, that wasn't great color, even for low tech but they all had color.


Filtration, IMO, isn't as significant but you want good filtration. More good bacteria, more good happens in the tank. However, I have had plenty of low tech tanks that didn't have great filtration that worked great. 

Watch what happens after water changes. If you get algae afterwards, do smaller, or less often, or smaller less often. That changes the CO2 level. Even though you are not injecting CO2, their is CO2 in the water. Large water changes lead to inconstant CO2 levels.


----------



## Green_Flash

Frank, that is a great post. It shows that even a little amount of effort can go along way toward solving algae problems. 

I look forward to seeing the further progress!


----------



## OKnights112

Thanks for the great information.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - ALGAE MESS! and how to fix it fast!*

Maybe you can answer this one Frank. My stems will not grow vertical.. all to the side under the aquasky. Right now my co2 is around 1-1.5 bps and dosing one pump each daily. Everything was good until now, I'm starting to get some algae on glass. Not diatoms but green stringy one. What would you say is different here compared to ada view mini m setup. In 8 days the stems were to surface (2" growth). Mine are making new leaves and shoots but refuse to go up. Perhaps the reason of growth rate and algae is a sign up needing more nutrients? If my light is so high couldn't I bump the co2 to 2bps, and raise ferts to two pumps or is there something I am missing?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Francis Xavier

TheGuy said:


> Maybe you can answer this one Frank. My stems will not grow vertical.. all to the side under the aquasky. Right now my co2 is around 1-1.5 bps and dosing one pump each daily. Everything was good until now, I'm starting to get some algae on glass. Not diatoms but green stringy one. What would you say is different here compared to ada view mini m setup. In 8 days the stems were to surface (2" growth). Mine are making new leaves and shoots but refuse to go up. Perhaps the reason of growth rate and algae is a sign up needing more nutrients? If my light is so high couldn't I bump the co2 to 2bps, and raise ferts to two pumps or is there something I am missing?
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


I sure can explain it. 

Aside from the fact that the Niigata gallery sits on a special magnetic spot on the planet which polarizes nature for optimal growth, it's a pretty easy explanation.

ADA exclusively uses wabi kusa now - which are basically plants "pre-growing" while being farmed. This means that when they use a wabi kusa, the plant in question has already been well established, has everything it needs to grow and is optimally healthy in most cases. 

A similar kind of advantage can be had with Tissue Culture plants because they arrive healthier at your door and make an easier transition to a planted tank.

Where as when we get other plants, even from living-but-sub-optimal tanks, they have to 1.) Get cut, 2.) planted, 3.) make transitions and adjust to a new environment where all the variables are still up in the air.

If you look at earlier Amano work and time lapses - you'll see growth similar to yours, and it's not typically until the end of the first month that the stems are at the top. 

If you're starting from zero by using a normal plant (non wabi kusa, non tissue culture propagated), then basically starting with tissue culture is like +1, and bona fide wabi kusa is +3. 

Basically the stems you have now are doing a very common plant strategy for dominance in their environment - they're growing out to cover ground so they can grow up to shade out other plants. You can steadily increase you dosages without much issue and just keep things going. 

The wabi kusa with Rotala green in it just has like 10 trillion individual stems in it, so they're already "spread out" and they have no choice but to go up except on the periphery. Like my 60-P at home now, which had a rough start, I had like 100-200 stems of Rotala Green going and it's formed a hugely thick bush that is now pushing up since there are other stem plants essentially blocking the path. 

The only difference (aside from wabi kusa) between your aquarium and Mr. Amano's, is Mr. Amano's first hand experience. He just knows how much to plant, where to plant and in what quantities from over 20 years of doing it. That's really the only magic going on.

In a lot of cases, the reason for mishaps or improper growth is simply experience and technique. For example - today I did a 100% water change on the 180-P in the gallery on the third week, instead of the normal 40%. Not only in that tank am I stretching the schedule (daily water changes for 2 weeks, every other day in week 3 & 4). I can't even tell you approximately why I did it - except that to my eyes the water looked weird / off from what it should look like. So, that's not a schedule or a thing that can be taught, it's purely just practice and experience. 

As it turns out, it was a good thing to do that water change, as there was a power outtage over the weekend, and the water wasn't flowing for 5-6 hours.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Admittedly, I've fallen a bit behind lately.

Mostly due to the SXSW festival, if I were to be totally honest. 

But I have some goody teasers for you in the Mini M:


Revamped Unzan Stone Layout by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr


----------



## IWANNAGOFAST

It looks truly amazing Frank!

I know you're a huge fan of the aquasky, but I've found that it is just way too much light, and I can't increase the co2 anymore without gassing the fish. Do you know if ADA will ever make dimmable ones?


----------



## Green_Flash

Hey Frank, what is the other plant next to the moss?


----------



## Francis Xavier

It's staurogyne Porto Velho - I replaced the bolbitus heteroclita mini after my suspicions of it not being truly aquatic. It seems to stay alive in water but not a single new bud concerned me. Fortunately this layout style is easy to modify on the go - once I get a complete shot of it like this ill add a few varieties to change the layout over time and enjoy different interpretations of the same core skeleton.


----------



## marioman72

SXSW is most def an awesome experience! i go almost every year. but on to the real question what kind of fish are those? i saw some in my LFS and almost got them but wasnt sure on their requirements or what they were!


----------



## acitydweller

Pseudomugil furcatus (threadfin rainbows)?


----------



## SomeCanuck

acitydweller said:


> Pseudomugil furcatus (threadfin rainbows)?


Right scientific name, but the common name is "furcata rainbows" or "fork-tail blue eye" depending who you talk to. The green ones are microdevario kubotai (emerald rasboras).


----------



## gnod

nice rainbows! i love those guys! super playful and when they defend/court, they are beautiful. one of my favorite fish. 

but i was curious, seems like a lot of fish in there. how many is in there exactly? haha


----------



## Francis Xavier

gnod said:


> nice rainbows! i love those guys! super playful and when they defend/court, they are beautiful. one of my favorite fish.
> 
> but i was curious, seems like a lot of fish in there. how many is in there exactly? haha


Honestly, I have no idea, there are like 14 furcata's and 6 kubotai with two oto's. 

I tend to heavily stock fish in planted aquariums - mostly because you can way bend the rules for stock levels and make excellent fish displays with optimal health.

Within minutes of being added to the aquarium, two pairs of the furcata's started courting in a pretty awesome display. I think I got a small video of it. All the fish are displaying great coloration and mating behavior. In the case of the Furcata's though, I'll probably remove any that get too large for the scale of the aquarium.

I have something like 250 Boraras maculata in one of my 60-p's as well, but that's also an extremely densely planted 'farm' tank with lush stems covering it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*What's Frank been up to?

*It's been quite the season and I'm happy to say that it seems the planted aquarium continues to grow excellently in the USA. More and more I'm seeing excellent layouts from other Americans and hobbyists on this forums and nothing pleases me more than to browse the forums and go "that's a cool looking tank." 

Mini M's have been especially popular among you all. Gotta love some of these awesome tanks:

Drew's first go at the Mini M is growing in nicely with a classic simple design.

Definitely interested in seeing how John's Mini M progresses over the next few months. Great execution of a non-literal translation of inspiration from a landscape!

I'm a fan of Philip's Mini M, particularly the stone placement and choice of plants. Help me pester him for an update or two.

ad3hybrid, well, what can I say. This layout makes me want to elevate my nano game execution again. Big props here!

Jonathan's Mini is _still rockin'_ but I admire his dedication for perfecting his aquascapes in the Mini M.

As you know, these are only a couple of the dozens out there, if ya haven't checked these guys out, go on over and give them some props. 

On other notes, the original layout from here:


San Marcos River Summer by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Has finished up it's segment on TFH. Part 3 and 4 are particularly good - about wabi sabi and finalizing layout tips, they're in the March and April issues respectively. 

Finale and Part 4 (April)

Part 3, the Wabi Sabi segment (March)

Each of the 4 segments covered material that I did not cover here, so it's worth a read if you want some more in depth material based on that layout.

If you're a subscriber to ADA's Aqua Journal, then you'll see another, different wabi sabi segment written in the latest issue - unfortunately it's all in Japanese. But, pretty pictures none-the-less. 

*More Recent Events

*Believe it or not, I do have two layouts running at the moment, one of which you're already familiar with, the Mini M version 3 layout...But I actually took an updated photograph last night for you:


Wazeter Mini Iwagumi Version 3 by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

You may have noticed the Rainbow Furcata's are gone - they were doing fine, but their size with the way I was feeding them was throwing off the scale of the aquarium.

So I replaced them with 26 of these excellently awesome little guys:









Wazeter Mini Class N Lime Green Endlers by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

The good news is they breed consistently. The bad news is there is only 5 males to 21 females (sounds like the males are having a good time, no?). 

That said, I've immensely enjoyed this tank, as I can completely neglect it (even at one point, I left this one without co2 for 5-6 days), and it doesn't really affect the layout. 

Once I get this version to a "complete" point, I'll add more plants and show the flexibility of a theme and the change of a layout over time. So, this is definitely a "long haul" relationship this go around. 

*Something You Haven't Seen Yet

*Day One, 60-P


Wazeter Cube Garden Superior by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Day Two, 60-P


Wazeter Cube Garden Superior by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Week Two, 60-P


Wazeter Cube Garden Superior by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

You'll notice where the Furcata ended up.

I'll talk to you more later, but for now I'm all worded out.

Have a good one'

-Frank

P.S. Oh, and by the way, there's a new video from the original Mini M layout, which you can watch over here:

http://www.tfhmagazine.com/blogs/category/adventures-in-aquascaping/

P.P.S. My next project is to get another Mini S and Mini M going, as well as some of the cool 25cm cubes we have laying around, some of which are still available. The brain is swirling with new ideas!

P.P.P.S. I forgot to add - IAPLC is coming up, make sure you get your entries ready!

P.P.P.P.S. One more thing, I promise - one of our gun-for-hire IT guys got a Sphero at Austin's SXSW festival, and well, sphero + 180P Planted aquarium = Frank goofing off for a minute. Sometimes, I have a quirky sense of humor - I laughed for hours. Check the video out below:


----------



## freph

Reminds me, I need to update my Mini M journal sometime by the end of this year. Oops. :redface: Can't wait to see more from that 60P!


----------



## talontsiawd

That 60-P looks great. Also, thank you for sharing some other people's journals on the board, I would have missed some great looking tanks.


----------



## CPDzeke

That Cube Garden Superior is making me very very jealous!
Why you no mention my Mini-M? :hihi:


----------



## dr3ww3rd

Yay I made it onto Franks page!! This journal has been so much help to me and to others as well. Now if I could just get rid of these diatoms :angryfire


----------



## Francis Xavier

CPDzeke said:


> That Cube Garden Superior is making me very very jealous!
> Why you no mention my Mini-M? :hihi:


It's the kind of tank you never want to see since you'll never look at "normal" high quality tanks the same again.

As for the mini m, patience young padawan! Keep curating it!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Just a small update for today;

Took a short video of my holding tank yesterday for my private fish collection, and thought you'd enjoy seeing it (best in 720 HD) :


----------



## CPDzeke

Thank you Master Obi-Wan.


----------



## pejerrey

*Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - It's the Season for Updates!*

I get the post 1000?
Dang! It was 1001...


----------



## Green_Flash

Very cool Frank! I want to see all the new tanks you are going to set up.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Happy Friday / Good Friday / Paycheck Day / Party Night / Movie Night / Entertain the Spouse Evening / Event Night / Night at the Opera 

Did I miss any? Oh, yeah, maybe planted tank maintenance day?!


As I enhance my video skills with the iPhone, I've got an unprecedented 3rd video in three days for you!






You can actually view this one in 1080p HD too!

But, what I wanted to show in this tank is the subtle beauties - as for an aquascape, technically speaking it's just moss and some staurogyne porto velho.

However, it's the small things that make this layout great, which only video can really show if you're not seeing it in person. Ultimately, that's because it is the interaction of the fish within the scene. 

Watch the video and you can see what I mean!

The way the Class N Lime Green Endlers in particular interact with the moss gives an excellent sense of relaxation while watching it in person. Particularly, the 'drab,' females provide the most entertainment, as you witness them nesting in the moss, in fact, the shoal of 20 or so females have claimed various spots on the moss-covered stone to inhabit as a nest. 

This interactivity with the layout itself is one of the most spectacular displays of fish harmony within the layout. Contrarily, on the surface level, the Kubotai in the aquarium add an extra sense of color and activity to the scene as a whole, versus the endlers being more of a tiny detail in the scope of the layout. 

What this creates is an eye-catching first look, and then a suck-you-into-the-layout second look as you notice the tiny endlers nesting. 

You can kind of see what I mean with this snippet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=fLtyVvaZH34&list=HL1364570265#t=29s


----------



## Francis Xavier

Now that you've read the previous post, watch this video again:






and you will notice a lot of excellent little details of fish interaction with their aquarium. See how the Honey Gourami kind of saunters through as the Maculata are obsessed with inspecting little details of the plants and the Amano's in the background are just kind of crawling all over the place, up and down over leaves.


----------



## @[email protected]

the shot seems a bit backlit.
but i love the gourami. im a sucker for anabantoids.


----------



## Francis Xavier

How do you mean backlit? Curious as I'm still learning lighting tricks and what not.


----------



## MABJ

*Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - It's the Season for Updates!*



Francis Xavier said:


> How do you mean backlit? Curious as I'm still learning lighting tricks and what not.


Well when shooting photos or videos it is best for you to have your back to a light source. 

Backlit means the light is where you don't want it to be, in front of you. 

It drowns out what your subject is somewhat. 

Your goal in photography is to have surrounding light everywhere but behind.


----------



## catfishbi

love that 60P


----------



## @[email protected]

backlighting
its sometimes cool as an artistic effect, but should be avoided if you are taking pictures/videos primarily as a form of documentation. which is the way i feel most aquarium pictures/videos are taken - as a means of showing the tank as it appears to a viewer in front of it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Thanks guys! The photography aspect actually gets to be a lot of fun, particularly I think because planted aquariums are so temporal that it encourages you to want to get the best camera / photo quality possible to preserve your work. 

I can't say how many times I've loathed a layout while it was developing - you know that stage, when all you can see is the flaws in the layout - only to come back to a photo of it months or years later and go "you know, that was actually pretty awesome."

Video just adds a whole different layer to the experience and captures details, such as fish activity, that is missing without it.

Now, all that said, it may just be an excuse I'm conjuring up for me having just splurged on a Canon EOS 5D Mark II body to go with the lenses I got from Jeff. Why that choice? to be honest, I'm just following Jeff's lead on cameras (and totally comfortable with that), and I already used it once to shoot the Mini M for last year's contest, so I am already familiar with what it's capable of. 

In the end, I think you all will be the real winners of that particular purchase.


----------



## dr3ww3rd

Frank you made a good decision. I recently majored in techincal photography and that's the body I shoot with. The 5D Mark ii is a beast


----------



## @[email protected]

i have a different canon EOS and i love mine. they are good cameras. the shots are much better than they were with my old nikon, but im sure they would be even better if i actually knew what i was doing, lol.


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> i have a different canon EOS and i love mine. they are good cameras. the shots are much better than they were with my old nikon, but im sure they would be *even better if i actually knew what i was doing, lol.*


This is how I feel about my current Canon Rebel xSi that I got from Jeff. While a significant upgrade over an iPhone camera, and while also significantly powered up by an over-powered lense, I still don't get the results I want.

I attribute this to a couple things:

1.) first and foremost my technical skill with the camera
2.) lighting (although, close up on nano's and 60-P's rarely matter in this category, the lighting over the tank is usually sufficient)
3.) my technical skill with the camera.

Although, I was able to take quite a few awesome nature photographs in Japan - which already had natural colors that looked like photoshop with saturation way up and bright, clean light during the day.


----------



## Francis Xavier

FYI - Amazon financing is an evil, evil trick to get me to do what they want (open a credit card account with them) by dangling what I want in front of my face with a finance offer (the camera). 

Equal parts awe of brilliant marketing automation and "I should know better," and "aww, screw it." here.


----------



## freph

Francis Xavier said:


> FYI - Amazon financing is an evil, evil trick to get me to do what they want (open a credit card account with them) by dangling what I want in front of my face with a finance offer (the camera).
> 
> Equal parts awe of brilliant marketing automation and "I should know better," and "aww, screw it." here.


I feel the same way every time you let me know about equipment or fish you're selling. :hihi: If I had the cube you would be shipping me fish too.


----------



## @[email protected]

Francis Xavier said:


> FYI - Amazon financing is an evil, evil trick to get me to do what they want (open a credit card account with them) by dangling what I want in front of my face with a finance offer (the camera).
> 
> Equal parts awe of brilliant marketing automation and "I should know better," and "aww, screw it." here.


kinda like offering an ada 30c for $50?:icon_wink


----------



## freph

@[email protected] said:


> kinda like offering an ada 30c for $50?:icon_wink


My thoughts exactly. :hihi:


----------



## Jeff5614

Francis Xavier said:


> FYI - Amazon financing is an evil, evil trick to get me to do what they want (open a credit card account with them) by dangling what I want in front of my face with a finance offer (the camera).
> 
> Equal parts awe of brilliant marketing automation and "I should know better," and "aww, screw it." here.


If ADG had such schemes I would probably finally own an ES 2400 .


----------



## Francis Xavier

Jeff5614 said:


> If ADG had such schemes I would probably finally own an ES 2400 .


Well...as a matter of fact...we do accept Paypal Bill Me Later...


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> I feel the same way every time you let me know about equipment or fish you're selling. :hihi: If I had the cube you would be shipping me fish too.





@[email protected] said:


> kinda like offering an ada 30c for $50?:icon_wink


I had a good laugh at this!


----------



## Francis Xavier

*Just a Little History

*The Mini S was my first ADA aquarium and I remember buying it because the Mini M, which is what I originally wanted, was out of stock at the time. I did not know it at the time, but it was a pretty fortunate mistake, as there's something quirky about the Mini S. 

See, the Mini S, dimension wise ends up being kind of like a high aquarium - it's a bit taller than it is wider, compared to the Mini M, which fleshes out depth. But the further irony is that when you get more and more into complex layouts, height ends up aiding more in the perception of depth than...depth

Last night, I took out the old Mini S and started tinkering, and soon I'll have a layout going with it in there, since I've resparked my love for the Mini S all over again.

-Frank

P.S. And oh yeah - I made tied a bunch of stuff to a piece of driftwood last night, which came out absolutely awesome for the Mini S. Did not take a picture, but I'll get one soon. I've got it sitting in another tank temporarily until I get a few things together for the Mini S.


----------



## Hayden

Can't wait to see it! Interesting concept with the height and depth.


----------



## gnod

hey frank! 
do you get algae on the mosses that you tied to the driftwood, say in your 60P? 
i ask because the branches are at different heights and some are closer to the light. 

i'm facing a little hair algae issue in my tank and was wondering if you've experienced it before. i'm just plucking out what i can for now but long term am wondering what i can do. 

thanks!


----------



## Francis Xavier

Every now and again there's a little fuzz - but a healthy amount of Amano's keeps that in line more or less. Manually removing as much as you can helps a lot in the process.

What I find is that most people under-use Amano's when it comes to some of those algae's. For example, in a 60-P, I'll see a lot of people using 5 or so Amano shrimp and believing that that will solve the issue. 5 is typically a suitable number for say a Mini M, but in a 20 gallon, you're going to want in the area of 15 or so Amano's to keep things consistently in line.


----------



## Francis Xavier

On the 5D, I may have spoken too soon. But I -have- been staring at cameras all day long as time permits!


----------



## MABJ

*Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - It's the Season for Updates!*

Can't wait to see your Mini S. 

I can't wait to start mine! Wink wink. Lol


----------



## pmcarbrey

Just wanted to say thanks for all the great info you've presented us with frank, I read through this thread for the second time today and wish I had found it when I first started with planted tanks!

EDIT: Frank, any chance you could enlighten me as to what the benefits of doing small rocks covered in moss is versus coating a single piece of wood or a large rock?


----------



## Francis Xavier

If the attachment on an iPhone worked - here's a photo as promised of what I'm working on for the mini s.


----------



## SeattleFishGuy

Very inspiring Frank! I hope we can get you to come out and speak this year in Seattle/GSAS!


----------



## Francis Xavier

pmcarbrey said:


> Just wanted to say thanks for all the great info you've presented us with frank, I read through this thread for the second time today and wish I had found it when I first started with planted tanks!
> 
> EDIT: Frank, any chance you could enlighten me as to what the benefits of doing small rocks covered in moss is versus coating a single piece of wood or a large rock?


Thank you for your kind words of support pmcarbrey!

As for your question, it's not about a specific advantage of small rocks versus driftwood - the only exception id say is with a large rock.

Small stones allow flexibility in where and how you place the moss around other plants and arrangements (such as on or between stones). This adds a layer of detail work to your layout. 

Attaching moss to driftwood is another application of moss all together, but if you wanted to carpet moss, it's a different deal.

As for big stones, unless you have a big aquarium, this diminishes your flexibility of planting around it and I definitely recommend against it. Additionally, except for propagation, I do not even prefer tiles of moss (unless the entire carpet is moss).

For example, had I used a single flat big stone to tie moss to in the Mini M version 1, then I would not have been able to mix tenellus or hair grass with the moss to create the effect that I did.

Additionally, plants like moss and Riccia have a tendency to take on the shape of the object they are tied to - so the effect of moss tied to small stones makes natural contours in the layout and add an extra layer of depth to the overall picture. Contrarily, if tied to a tile the whole appearance takes on a flat appearance. Certainly desirable in some cases but not in others and not in most cases where I use moss.


----------



## Francis Xavier

SeattleFishGuy said:


> Very inspiring Frank! I hope we can get you to come out and speak this year in Seattle/GSAS!


I'd love to do a live demonstration an talk in Seattle! Petitions should be started to make this happen.


----------



## gnod

Francis Xavier said:


> Every now and again there's a little fuzz - but a healthy amount of Amano's keeps that in line more or less. Manually removing as much as you can helps a lot in the process.
> 
> What I find is that most people under-use Amano's when it comes to some of those algae's. For example, in a 60-P, I'll see a lot of people using 5 or so Amano shrimp and believing that that will solve the issue. 5 is typically a suitable number for say a Mini M, but in a 20 gallon, you're going to want in the area of 15 or so Amano's to keep things consistently in line.


noted! will pick some up this weekend.


----------



## gnod

Francis Xavier said:


> If the attachment on an iPhone worked - here's a photo as promised of what I'm working on for the mini s.


have you been attaching all these using glue? i dont' see any lines!


----------



## Francis Xavier

gnod said:


> have you been attaching all these using glue? i dont' see any lines!


Nope, all with wood tight and moss cotton. It's still a terrible photo since I have it just floating in the Mini M for the time being.


----------



## iter

I see BUCES!!! :bounce:


I love tanks with lots of variety of epiphytes and tanks that use them a lot; it adds a whole new dimension to the layout.

Could you give us a full frontal shot of the tank? It is hard to grasp what is happening on the other side of the rock.


----------



## Francis Xavier

The tank isn't set up yet - that's just me putting the piece into my Mini M so it can grow while I get more stuff for the Mini S. 

There are:

Bucephelandra (sp purple something-or-other, ask AzFishKid, he sent it to me)

Anubias Nana Petite
Bolbitus Heudelotii 
Peacock Moss (top)
fissidens fontanus (bottom)
Bolbitus Heteroclita Mini (which finally, it seems, after 2-3 months of sitting in a tank, started forming new leaves, so i'm still on the fence about this plant)

I'm looking for some more bucephelandra as well, for another tank possibly. 

I have to say, (not having too much experience with buce yet), I've had some great luck with the Bucephelandra on this piece of driftwood - in 4 days I've seen 4-5 new leaves form.

In terms of layout making, I'm definitely entering a heavy stem plant and epiphytic phase.


----------



## freph

Sounds like a pretty awesome plan. I'm getting into a heavy stem and epiphyte stage myself. Mosses, too. I spent about 100 bucks sourcing plants for the 12" cube so there will be no issues of not enough plants this time around. :icon_cool

How do you feel about Bolbitis heteroclita vs heudelotii? I personally didn't like it all that much...

Get your buce pimp on. I want to see some density like this guy.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Normal Heteroclita gets huge - so, it's not that I don't like it, but I just don't have much use for it.

Mini Heteroclita...it takes a LONG time to grow, so in times of aquascaping - it's kind of useless unless you have a huge volume of submerged stuff to use already. That being said, I'm on the fence, I've been told a lot of things about true aquatic, not true aquatic, so on and so forth, both from trustworthy sources. So I'm just sitting on it at the moment to see how it does. 

Heudelotii is just a great classic - in a nano, often trimming to keep it in line.


----------



## Green_Flash

Careful with those Buces Frank, they can get addicting. :biggrin:


----------



## SeattleFishGuy

Francis Xavier said:


> I'd love to do a live demonstration an talk in Seattle! Petitions should be started to make this happen.


Working on it! :hihi:


----------



## Francis Xavier

Previously, I mentioned my want for a Canon 5D. However, I came across a better local deal for a 7D, and decided to go that route, as it serves the needs I am looking for, while being able to put aside for some higher quality lenses down the road. 

The results are some fun:


Preparing the next project by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_A better photograph, which shows in more detail the centerpiece for my next layout in the Mini S_


Wazeter Mini Iwagumi Version 3 by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_The full tank shot - for quality difference between the Canon Rebel and the 7D, see my last Canon Rebel shot below_


Wazeter Mini Iwagumi Version 3 by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_Canon Rebel shot_


Pockets of Staurogyne grow out of the rock face by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_I like these kinds of shots, they show a different dimension to the aquarium overall._

I tinkered with some video, which brings to light a desperate need for a tripod now. Overall, the upgrade in camera will allow a better story to be told through these aquariums, by allowing for a more accurate depiction of the scene, and for that, I am excited.

P.S. I will be trimming soon. I will have a few golfball portions of peacock moss and quite a lot of staurogyne porto velho from this layout. Shoot me a PM if you'd like to reserve it.


----------



## orchidman

Nice photography!


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Nice purchase, but based on the photo it looks like there was hand movement in the Rebel shot and not in the 7D shot. Unless the 7D allows you higher ISO in lower light. Are they shot with the same lens? The light gathering capability of the lens makes a big difference too.


----------



## Francis Xavier

2wheelsx2 said:


> Nice purchase, but based on the photo it looks like there was hand movement in the Rebel shot and not in the 7D shot. Unless the 7D allows you higher ISO in lower light. Are they shot with the same lens? The light gathering capability of the lens makes a big difference too.


Shot with the same lens, yes! While I did manage to learn a lot of new tricks from all the photographers at the IAPLC meeting / Urabandai tour, I make no claims as to being able to hold my hands completely steady for a shot yet! Getting better though! 

The fuzziness I attribute to a little hand movement. The thing I noticed more was fish & plant detail and color (primarily fish here).


----------



## freph

Nice rock. I swear, next thing you know you're going to be selling pre-grown centerpieces out of the Mini M. No, that was not a business idea. Be nice.


----------



## Francis Xavier

freph said:


> Nice rock. I swear, next thing you know you're going to be selling pre-grown centerpieces out of the Mini M. No, that was not a business idea. Be nice.


Hah! Well, I have to pay for the camera somehow!

And I have no idea what it is, but that Bucephelandra is growing like crazy for a week under lights compared to what I've been told to expect. It's got like 4-5 new leaves since the last time I looked at it.


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - It's the Season for Updates!*

Go to conns for camera frank, they finance easily and have cameras. 

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Francis Xavier

Easy financing is something to dread usually! Cause usually that means "ohh I can totally get MORE now!"


----------



## TheGuy

*Re: Frank's Planted Tank How-To Mini Novel - It's the Season for Updates!*



Francis Xavier said:


> Easy financing is something to dread usually! Cause usually that means "ohh I can totally get MORE now!"


Very true

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Francis Xavier

Keep in touch, as there's a bigger update coming later today with a step-by-step. 

Having rekindled my original love and gone back to the Mini S, there was just too much inspiration to not do a driftwood layout focusing on epiphytic plants and stems. Having developed an obsession for driftwood-centric styles, my gut feeling is that this particular layout is a notch above the one I'm currently working on in the 60-P.

Well, before I tell you too much about it, just check out the below image:


Mini S v1 nano aquascape stage one by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_For step one, the hardscape is in place. In this case, I am doing things a little backwards and will add soil and sand after the initial placement of hardscape, due to my plans and the relative small size of the Mini S. I'd advise only taking this route once you have good experience and know how._

Come back by the afternoon time and there should be another update, going step-by-step. 

-Frank

P.S. If you haven't subscribed yet, you should seriously consider doing so (in the top right hand corner of the top of the thread content, click on "thread tools," and then click "subscribe to this thread").


----------



## orchidman

I like it!


----------



## caliherp

Finely just finished reading the whole thread. I wanted to sincerely thank you for putting this thread together and keeping it updated. Out o all my years reading on forums I don't think I have ever learned so much off of of one thread. You have taught me many lessons that are no doubt going to help me prevent many major disasters from ever occurring. For that I thank you. Keep up the great work. 

P.S I really like the new mini s layout. I have always liked scapes that use wood. I am also a epiphyte freak so I can't wait to see it all finished.


Regards, Patrick


----------



## JAYGEE

Hey Frank, I figured I would post in here! Thnks for helping me out at the shop today! Can't wait to set it up, already trying out some scapes. I should have bought more rock.

Keep the updates coming and ill try to keep my money in my pocket


----------



## Francis Xavier

As always, the first step in a successful planted aquarium is the strength of the soil system behind it. As such, the first step here is to add additives and power sand:


Mini S Driftwood Layout - Step 2, Power Sand & additives by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Because I will have the most root-heavy plants in the back, I've focused on putting the power sand there, as opposed to the front, which will have a more minimal amount of substrate.


Mini S Driftwood Layout - Amazonia Aqua Soil by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

I've kept the Amazonia soil mostly confined to the back and almost allll the way up to the front panel - normally you want to use a divider of some kind to make for ease of separation between sand and soil, but in this case, I will add sand by hand - very slowly. 


Completed Substrate System by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

With sand in place, the soil system is complete - and you can see what I mean by a very minimal amount of soil in the front. This will make planting a challenge, but will ultimately reap long term rewards in scale of the layout. I wouldn't recommend trying this at home until you've gotten a lot of planting experience (or patience) under your belt.

Annnd, the first plant to go in:


Tissue Culture Cryptocoryne Parva Wazeter by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Cryptocoryne Parva - sealed in a nice tissue culture vessel and with plenty in the canister, only one will suffice. 

For now, that's all folks - keep a look out for the next update that delves into planting and what not, it might be easier for you to subscribe to the thread to get a notification of updates, if you haven't already.

Best,

-Frank

*Feedback!*



caliherp said:


> Finely just finished reading the whole thread. I wanted to sincerely thank you for putting this thread together and keeping it updated. Out o all my years reading on forums I don't think I have ever learned so much off of of one thread. You have taught me many lessons that are no doubt going to help me prevent many major disasters from ever occurring. For that I thank you. Keep up the great work.
> 
> P.S I really like the new mini s layout. I have always liked scapes that use wood. I am also a epiphyte freak so I can't wait to see it all finished.
> 
> 
> Regards, Patrick


Thank you for your kind words! I'm glad that this thread (maybe it needs to be renamed to "The Book" at this point) is making an impact in your scaping and planting care! Glad to have another reader for the next layout, it's going to be an epic package in a small scale!


----------



## Rbp917

Any special handling/care requirements for tissue culture plants?

Any advantages (beside no hitchhikers)?


----------



## TheGuy

Rbp917 said:


> Any special handling/care requirements for tissue culture plants?
> 
> Any advantages (beside no hitchhikers)?


Better health and faster growth due to no melting etc..

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Francis Xavier

TheGuy said:


> Better health and faster growth due to no melting etc..
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


Fyi - i haven't forgotten your PM, will message you tonight.


----------



## TheGuy

Francis Xavier said:


> Fyi - i haven't forgotten your PM, will message you tonight.


Np mna

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## @[email protected]

this is looking really nice frank. im gonna be paying close attention to this layout in particular. i was planning on doing a similar thing (slow growing plants, wood, sand foreground) in the cube i just got from you. hoping to get some ideas or inspiration from you. 

question on the tissue culture plants: how long can the plant last in culture? i assume there is a food-source in there, i know thats one of the big hits of in vitro plant growth is that you can give them glucose to get some pretty intense growth. how long can they last in there like that sealed up on just the food and nutrients in the culture?


----------



## Francis Xavier

@[email protected] said:


> this is looking really nice frank. im gonna be paying close attention to this layout in particular. i was planning on doing a similar thing (slow growing plants, wood, sand foreground) in the cube i just got from you. hoping to get some ideas or inspiration from you.
> 
> question on the tissue culture plants: how long can the plant last in culture? i assume there is a food-source in there, i know thats one of the big hits of in vitro plant growth is that you can give them glucose to get some pretty intense growth. how long can they last in there like that sealed up on just the food and nutrients in the culture?


I'm not so sure on opening them and adding glucose, unless you have a sterile environment - and even then difficult since infection is the number one cause of plant death in these vials. Normally, they will last about 2-4 weeks if kept in cooler conditions. However what we are finding is they do not handle shipping well cause of the nature of shipping - what I mean is any agar based ones will get all tumbled and the plant is healthy but it gets all jumbly. Ones with liquid based agars and not gels, ship much better in terms of aesthetics. 

On he inspiration front - thank you, and I mean it. Being told your layout is a base of inspiration for another to do their own interpretation, I consider the highest compliment. 

As far this tank - I feel as if it may be my best work to date, or it will when it grows, so I'm excited (and will have to think of a way to trump it on the next layout!).


----------



## Francis Xavier

_With mosses, bucephelandra, anubias and bolbitus tied to the driftwood, and the driftwood soundly in place, the first plant to go in the substrate is crypt. parva_


Tissue Culture Cryptocoryne Parva Wazeter by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_The placement of this plant was elected to go first, as it will be an accent plant that determines how the rest of the carpet will be placed._


Mini S planted tank - driftwood layout Wazeter v1 by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Cryptocoryne Parva is planted in such a way as to break up the lines of the aquascape, while providing a transition from foreground to background. By planting in a pattern of 3's (left, off center and right) the foreground areas become defined and the overall feel becomes more 'natural,' in the aesthetic sense of being pleasing to the eye - as if it belongs there. 

This is an important first step in the determination of the flow of the layout.

-Frank Wazeter

P.S. You should keep up and subscribe to this thread in order to not miss the next crucial phases!

P.P.S. Remember to keep the layout moist by spraying water with a spray bottle set on 'mist,' this prevents the plants from drying out!


----------



## orchidman

I have a question, any reason why you didn't decide to put a few stones around the base of the wood?


----------



## Francis Xavier

I have the driftwood pre soaked to sink, and opted to not use stones aesthetically. This requires a delicate hand in such a small tank, however, to prevent shifting of the arrangement or not knocking over since there are no stones to support it.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Elatine Hydropiper by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_The primary carpet plant will be Elatine Hydropiper. Using fine tipped pincettes to grip the base of this tiny plant, it becomes easier to form a full carpet in the substrate._


Wazeter Mini S Driftwood Layout v1 by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Together, *E. hydropiper and C. parva create a dynamic melding of texture via having similar leaf shape*, the two pair together well, as does glosso and C. parva, to create a sense of both contrast and similarity that takes the attention off of the carpet and onto the greater scene. 

-Frank Wazeter

P.S. For those of you who tumblr, you can find me here, and you can also get updates fed directly through twitter.


----------



## Hayden

This is looking excellent Frank! I really love how the Mini S is coming along. I was actually planning to do a mixed carpet with C. Parva and HC/E. Hydropiper in my next scape! Can't wait to see it filled.


----------



## freph

Hello driftwood inspiration. Oh 30cm cube, you will be so much fun to setup....

How did you attach the anubias and buces? I see plenty of cotton thread on the moss but I couldn't distinguish any for the buces and anubias except for the brown bit of wood tight on the bolbitis(?) on the branch.


----------



## Francis Xavier

Yesterday, we left off here in the Mini S:


Wazeter Mini S Driftwood Layout v1 by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

Elatine hydropiper in the layout - accompanied by Crypt parva. 

_But today, I'm going to diverge over to the 60-P and the happenings over there_

It has been about 40-45 days since the initial setup of the 60-P, and after last night's trimming session, the tank looks like this:


60P Driftwood Layout after Trimming by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_For stems, the first trimming is the most important, as it will determine at what stem length the stems will branch, so for the first time, you will want to trim low, behind a "trimming line."_

As this layout developed, Rotala wallichi was actually the first stem to breach the water's surface, ahead of both Ludwigia sp. "atlantis" and Rotala rotundifolia "green." So in this case, I put up with a few days of Rotala wallichi looking goofy compared to the rest of the layout, in order to time the trimming of all the plants together at the same time. 

You can see the results, and the stem density, more clearly here:


View of trimmed stems by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

*A note on Hottonia palustris* - did you notice the plant that's off to the right back corner and is creeping to the left? That one right next to Rotala rotundifolia? That's Hottonia. So far, this plant has formed an excellent texture for that "foresty" feel - and I like it. While initially a little brown, with extra nutrition it has stayed fairly healthy. This plant wasn't trimmed yet, as it has displayed a tendency so far to spread horizontally first, rather than vertically, which, fortunately for the way I placed it, works out just fine. 

*Managing the mixed carpet* -


carpet close up 60P by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

There are *a lot of carpet plants* and _plants used as a carpet_ hanging out in this layout. 

There is:

Riccia fluitans
Hemianthus callicthroides
Glossostigma elatinoides
Fissidens fontanus
Echinodorus tennellus
Eleocharis parvula

..._and some stems of Rotala rotundifolia that really want to pretend to act like a carpet plant._

Really, when I evaluate this carpet, it is a much more complicated carpet layout than my last iwagumi here:


Top angle shot of San Marcos River Summer, Francis Wazeter by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

The reason is, in the Mini M, the only plants that needed controlling was Riccia (a straight trim), Tennellus (cutting runners) and Hair grass (cutting runners / pulling up runners to keep it contained), which didn't take much time.

However, this layout has all those elements - plus glossostigma, which has a tendency to race to cover ground as quickly as possible, and a mix of the glosso and HC just isn't the aesthetic I want across the front, it appears messy. 

So, about 30 minutes during this session was spent cutting glosso runners and slowly using pincettes to uproot glosso from the HC areas and making sure the rest of the plants were in line. One of these days, I will make a video that shows this technique of removing a rooted plant without disturbing the substrate. 

*One more note* - I'm very pleased with the Riccia in this layout, finally, after searching for a long time, I found the super-tiny Riccia fluitans sp / mutation that stays small and very fine leaved, versus getting broader leaves over time. 

*Question and Answer!*



Hayden said:


> This is looking excellent Frank! I really love how the Mini S is coming along. I was actually planning to do a mixed carpet with C. Parva and HC/E. Hydropiper in my next scape! Can't wait to see it filled.


Great plan! I would, definitely though, recommend sticking to a single carpet of E. hydropiper and C. parva, unless you're already familiar with how E. hydropiper grows - since mixed carpets are tricky, due to reasons mentioned above, and I encourage you to try!



freph said:


> Hello driftwood inspiration. Oh 30cm cube, you will be so much fun to setup....
> 
> How did you attach the anubias and buces? I see plenty of cotton thread on the moss but I couldn't distinguish any for the buces and anubias except for the brown bit of wood tight on the bolbitis(?) on the branch.


I attached both the anubias and buce's with wood tight. Moss cotton was only used for mosses - I was able to conceal much of the wood tight by using a minimal amount and bunching together the anubias and buce's around the wood tight, while covering up other areas of the wood tight aesthetically with moss. 

*Final notes!*

I have a lot of Rotala rotundifolia, Rotala wallichi, some Ludwigia sp. atlantis and a golfball of peacock moss and a golfball of the super tiny riccia. Send me a PM if you'd like any of it while it's fresh. 

All the best,

-Frank


----------



## iter

Frank - Since you are growing glossostigma in the 60p, let me ask:

How would you deal with glosso growing vertically? Also, if the glosso is already growing vertically, how would you let run horizontally? Is it more light? Or trimming techniques? I am currently having problems with this and I want some advice.

Other than that, it is a great tank! The scape makes the tank look a lot bigger than it really is; am I right in saying that it is partly because of the empty space on the right?


----------



## Francis Xavier

iter said:


> Frank - Since you are growing glossostigma in the 60p, let me ask:
> 
> How would you deal with glosso growing vertically? Also, if the glosso is already growing vertically, how would you let run horizontally? Is it more light? Or trimming techniques? I am currently having problems with this and I want some advice.
> 
> Other than that, it is a great tank! The scape makes the tank look a lot bigger than it really is; am I right in saying that it is partly because of the empty space on the right?


Good question!

Glosso carpeting, does require good lighting and co2 - but also, good trimming technique. When it starts to pop up, trim it down, and when you plant, plant it deeply so it has to "pop up" into the substrate layer. 

As for the scale - it is two things, the empty space, as well as the scaling of the plants, relative to the size of the driftwood - that's a pretty big piece for the size of the tank.


----------



## sunyang730

Hi Frank! 

Very nice setup!!! LOVE IT, I have a question regarding the DHG. How you pull out the runner? Doesn't it disturb the substrate and pull out other plants too? 

I am having so much trouble with BBA/BGA, and I try to increase the CO2 and lower the light on time but doesn't seems like helping. Does changing the water once every other day help? 

Thanks for your help!

Also, where did you get your Cryptocoryne Parva, and do you have any experience planting UG?


----------



## Green_Flash

Great work Frank, the 60P looks beautiful.


----------



## Francis Xavier

*Returning to the Mini S setup,*


Mini S planting progression foreground complete by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

The planting of the foregound being complete, this angle top-view shot shows the detail of placement between Elatine hydropiper and Cryptocoryne parva. 

Next up, we'll move on to the midground, behind Cryptocoryne parva:


Tissue Culture Littorella Uniflora Wazeter by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

...With Littorella uniflora. For this segment, I wanted something a little more sparse to help create the transition behind crypt. parva to the background, and the thinner nature, yet similar appearance to crypt parva, makes this plant suitable for the job, here, you can witness the slow transition of leaf type and shape to the background, which aids in a feeling of depth.


Mini S with Littorella uniflora added to the midground by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

_Littorella uniflora completed in the layout_

Until next time, enjoy the eye candy!

*Some Q's, some A's and feedback!*



sunyang730 said:


> Hi Frank!
> 
> Very nice setup!!! LOVE IT, I have a question regarding the DHG. How you pull out the runner? Doesn't it disturb the substrate and pull out other plants too?
> 
> I am having so much trouble with BBA/BGA, and I try to increase the CO2 and lower the light on time but doesn't seems like helping. Does changing the water once every other day help?
> 
> Thanks for your help!
> 
> Also, where did you get your Cryptocoryne Parva, and do you have any experience planting UG?


Easier to reference this question with the picture from yesterday:


carpet close up 60P by Francis Wazeter, on Flickr

When pulling out DHG runners (or glosso runners, or tennellus runners, etc etc), use straight scissors to cut the runner roots itself. Meaning the little white shoots the plants send out to form new plants. 

Once this has been cut, take a pair of fine tipped pincettes and grab the base of the plant. Making a gentle swirling motion (by rotating your hand clockwise or counter-clockwise) while slowly pulling upwards, you will dislodge the roots from the soil substrate, without pulling up soil or other plants (though in the case where a plant is entrenched with other plants, you will get some pull out of the other plant).

As for BBA - the best way to remove is manual removal with filter off, scraping it off of every surface it's on, either with a tool, like a pro picker or your fingernail. When it's growing on leaves, cut the leaves. Remove all the BBA with an airline tubing used as a siphon hose. Place any glassware with BBA on it in a clean bottle with superge or bleach to remove the bba and kill it there.

Supplement the tank with Phyton Git, and it will help supress the BBA. 

It's a long and arduous process with BBA, and it will never fully go away once the tank is infected, but you can control the amount present so that it's just a tuft or two every now and again that you remove with a water change. Doing water changes daily or every other day for a little while helps with overall algae issues, yes.

For planting UG, plant it like you would HC or glosso - it's a really finnacky plant and has the highest chances of dying when initially planted. 



Green_Flash said:


> Great work Frank, the 60P looks beautiful.


Thanks! It's finally starting to take good shape!


----------



## @[email protected]

hey frank, id like to hear your take on an issue im having with my tank. recently growth has slowed almost to a standstill. the hair algae i almost got rid of is getting worse. and now many plants are showing signs of Ca deficiency (pale and twisted new growth). however, my gh is 8. it used to be 4, and i think my taps gh went up (its at 6). i can only assume the Ca deficiency is induced by a Mg overdose, and that most of that gh is Mg. im bringing a Mg and Ca test kit my dad uses for his reef to check, and getting some CaSO4 from a friend. however, i dont want to have a gh this high. its slaughtering my poor erios. and adding more Ca to combat the deficiency will raise my gh higher. what would you do in this situation?


----------



## Patson

Such a beautiful tank! I am speechless!!! :icon_eek:


----------



## sayurasem

This littorella uniflora is amazing. Is it import only?


----------



## @[email protected]

sayurasem said:


> This littorella uniflora is amazing. Is it import only?


i have seen it on sale in the swap and shop before. and now you can get it in and in vitro cup from frank looks like.


----------



## marle

Francis Xavier said:


> "


Greetings from Singapore! You have got an awesome thread going on here. Thank you for the effort.

May i know how did you attach the plants to the rock in the above picture?


----------



## OKnights112

Frank,

What would you suggest if you see no pearling from your plants?


----------



## freph

OKnights112 said:


> Frank,
> 
> What would you suggest if you see no pearling from your plants?


You shouldn't worry if your plants aren't pearling. It's not necessarily an indication of healthy plant growth. It could be from the accumulation of CO2 bubbles floating around or from a water change....or from oxygen saturation.


----------



## @[email protected]

OKnights112 said:


> Frank,
> 
> What would you suggest if you see no pearling from your plants?


if you want pearling, you need more than healthy plants. to get O2 to accumulate on the leaves, you need a high photosynthesis rate (meaning good light and more important good CO2), and you need to have the water column saturated with O2 (or it just dissolves away). so good aeration, and good flow.


----------



## tizzite

Hi Frank, thanks for all the great insight. I am planning a planted tank setup with a sump, and since you recommend raising the lily pipes to the surface for more oxygenation, do you think that running an airstone in the sump would produce the same beneficial effect?


----------



## pkny

Hey Frank, I've been reading your ebook religiously and I finally caved and bought the whole ADA get up. I myself have the mini m and I'm doing a drystart w/ HC for my iwagumi setup...

While on my "drystart quest" - I've started to load up on ADA equipment 

However, I have some questions regarding ADA equipment: the CO2 Speed regulator. Your ADG store carries the CO2 Speed Regulator along with a special N. American co2 adapter (http://www.adgshop.com/CO2_Speed_Regulator_p/101-303.htm)

I currently live in Canada (and we use CGA 320 standard CO2 tanks) - is this CO2 adapter compatible? And how much does ADG sell it as standalone??

Thanks


----------



## Francis Xavier

pkny said:


> Hey Frank, I've been reading your ebook religiously and I finally caved and bought the whole ADA get up. I myself have the mini m and I'm doing a drystart w/ HC for my iwagumi setup...
> 
> While on my "drystart quest" - I've started to load up on ADA equipment
> 
> However, I have some questions regarding ADA equipment: the CO2 Speed regulator. Your ADG store carries the CO2 Speed Regulator along with a special N. American co2 adapter (http://www.adgshop.com/CO2_Speed_Regulator_p/101-303.htm)
> 
> I currently live in Canada (and we use CGA 320 standard CO2 tanks) - is this CO2 adapter compatible? And how much does ADG sell it as standalone??
> 
> Thanks


Yes this adapter is compatible. We will be sending some (as apparently they're a custom item made by the Eheim distributor in Houston) to our Canadian partner, Miyabi Aqua Design shortly. PM me for more info.


----------



## Hayden

Hi Frank, I've been trying to contact you about my upcoming order. Just curious if you got my PM, I'd like to get going on it soon. Thanks!


----------



## jiejian

ive had something ''similar'' going on for my 1ft tank not so long ago too 
however my tank is non-co2 injected


----------



## Jahn

Hi! New to the forums and back to the hobby after many many years - in fact, back because my son would like to start. I just read this thread and wanted to thank you for journaling your tank - very inspirational! Although my son's tank is probably going to be more inspired by Spongebob Squarepants than Amano, I'll try my best to keep it somewhat in balance and in health (and beauty) over here!


----------



## fplata

A little known fact, sponge bob is inspired by Amano 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Francis Xavier

Well guys, It's been a whirlwind two weeks - had a trip overseas (with some awesome untouched nature shots to share) and just returned here on the 5th.

However, my business with ADA has concluded. I'll still be around to answer questions and help the community, as I always have. If you wish to talk to me via email, you can reach me at [email protected] - or via phone at 281.617.2539, and of course, via private message here!


----------



## pwolfe

Best of luck in all your endeavors. Just looked over your linkedin again, you'll bounce back I'm sure of it better than before I'm sure of it. 

I'll get to making that thing we talked about sometime this weekend.


----------



## frrok

Francis Xavier said:


> Well guys, It's been a whirlwind two weeks - had a trip overseas (with some awesome untouched nature shots to share) and just returned here on the 5th.
> 
> However, my business with ADA has concluded. I'll still be around to answer questions and help the community, as I always have. If you wish to talk to me via email, you can reach me at [email protected] - or via phone at 281.617.2539, and of course, via private message here!


Wow. Sad day! Sorry to hear, good luck on your new path. Well I hope we'll still get to see some amazing aquascapes from you.


----------



## Bserve

So, Frank, what's up?


----------



## Francis Xavier

Next


----------



## Bserve

The return of the great


----------



## Florian

I understand that the great need some time for preparation to return properly but after reading the entire thread with every post, I can't wait to learn more skills and I really look forward for some some nice pics. :smile:


----------



## skarpy

Hi!
I read your topic on the forum and it is simply amazing. Thank you for a lot of useful information!

I wanted to ask your advice with my nano aquarium.

Nano aquarium 16L, with flexi mini light.
Tropica power aquasoil.
Eheim 2213 filter.
Tropica premium and specialised fertilizer alternately every day (1,2ml).
Under aquasoil bacter 100 and Clear Super.
Light period 6h and co2 7h 1bbs.
The water temperature is 24.

My water changes:

First 2 days: 75% every day
Next 5 days: 50% every day
Next 14 days: 50% every other day. 

I planted:
Rotala Green
Rotala rotundifolia
Hydrocotyle tripartita japan
Fissidenus fontanus moha
Hemiantus callitrichoides Cuba

Plants grow well, but in the third week began to appear a lot of brown deposits on plants, rocks and walls of the tank.
And a little white hairs on some plants. What am I doing wrong? It may need to increase the lighting?

I really hope for a hint!

photograph: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0Bzg-leIf4h-zWHFYTnl3Z1hZX3M


----------

