# Excel Dosing in the Low Tech Tank...



## bpm2000 (Feb 16, 2005)

Why would you dose Excel in a regular injected already CO2 enriched tank (other than algicidal reasons?)?


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## deleted_user_4 (Mar 8, 2006)

Excel is only a source of Carbon. You're injecting CO2 already, there's no reason to use it, unless you want to start spawning more algae from having too much CO2 in the water.


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## jhoetzl (Feb 7, 2005)

He is NOT injecting...low tech...

Dosing daily on a 55 might get spendy...what kind of water changes are you doing? I'd start out at every third day or so, if you are doing bi-weekly water changes...


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## gbhil (Oct 28, 2005)

I'd either dose it daily, or not at all. Force the plants to not use carbon (much) or give them as much as they need. Trying to split the difference just might cause problems with the higher plants nutrient intake when no carbon is present. 

I'm curious what Tom Barr thinks about this one.


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## TheOtherGeoff (Feb 11, 2003)

i add it to my tanks every now and then when i think they need it. maybe once or twice a week. alittle here and alittle there.


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## BluSponge (Apr 2, 2006)

I suspected there might be some different opinions on the matter. And Tom Barr's article on the non-CO2 method is mostly silent on the exact amount of excel dosing. All the more reasons to ask.

I don't want to sabotage the plants this early in the game, but at the same time I do want to encourage some initial growth. Thus, here in the early stages, I would like to use excel to get things off to a good start. Plus I'm still dealing with the remanents of the old algae culture, and want to put that to bed as fast as possible (not by overdosing, but by getting the plant's nutrient intake up).

The non-CO2 method seems half science, half voodoo, and a good dose of luck. And since I don't have the voodoo down, I'm hoping to distill as much as I can from the science part. 



gbhil said:


> I'm curious what Tom Barr thinks about this one.


I am too.


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## gbhil (Oct 28, 2005)

BluSponge said:


> ....
> I don't want to sabotage the plants this early in the game, but at the same time I do want to encourage some initial growth. Thus, here in the early stages, I would like to use excel to get things off to a good start. .....


Off topic, but I thought I'd throw this at you for your 'future reference' files.
ATM I have two low-tech tanks going here. What I did in the beginning to keep the algae from getting a foothold was toss some riccia in the tanks. Even in a low-tech low-nutrient situation, floating riccia grows like gangbusters. I suspect it can do this because it has access to CO2 in the air above it. Once I noticed some real growth in intermediate growers (like java fern in my case) I removed most of it. Other than dust on the glass every once in a while when I do add ferts, I have zero algae issues in both tanks. It could be luck on my part, or just coincidence, but I thought I'd pass it along.


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## BluSponge (Apr 2, 2006)

gbhil said:


> ATM I have two low-tech tanks going here. What I did in the beginning to keep the algae from getting a foothold was toss some riccia in the tanks.


Not a bad idea! But would the ricca do well with my lighting? I have 2x36 lamps over my 55G. I know ricca is a high light plant, but floating on the surface, would be sufficient?

Tom


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## bpm2000 (Feb 16, 2005)

I have a couple of low-tech running as well. 

I first started off with the barr non-c02 method, adjusted per adding Excel. In my lower light tank (18w) I developed killer GS algae, while my higher light (36w) tank did ok, but still not awesome (developed GW later). 
I've since ceased using any ferts or excel (well I lied - I still add a tiny bit of excel/flourish now and then) and the GS is definitely receding. Plants are still ok and growing (fish food+snail/endler waste seem to keep the nitrates around 5). A blackout took care of my GW but also with it about 12 cherry shrimp. 

Anyways, If I had to do it all over again I'd definitely not add ferts and try just adding a little bit of excel and seeing what happens, adjusting over time.


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## gbhil (Oct 28, 2005)

BluSponge said:


> Not a bad idea! But would the ricca do well with my lighting? I have 2x36 lamps over my 55G. I know ricca is a high light plant, but floating on the surface, would be sufficient?
> 
> Tom


It grew rather slowly, but still grew, in a 67 gallon (48"x 18" footprint) with a single 40 watt NO fluorescent tube, so I don't see why it wouldn't do at least as well in your situation. IMO it's not a demanding plant at all when grown floating.


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## BluSponge (Apr 2, 2006)

bpm2000 said:


> Anyways, If I had to do it all over again I'd definitely not add ferts and try just adding a little bit of excel and seeing what happens, adjusting over time.


Interesting theory. I may try that if the current plan blows up in my face. As it is, today my ferts finally arrived. I hope this'll make my plants happy, as they are starting to show signs of distress.

In all, I added:

Flourish Excel: 28 ml (recommended first time dose)
Flourish Nitrogen: 4 ml
Flourish Phosphorous: .85 ml

That seems to be pretty much the proscribed dosage for a 55G tank as per Tom Barr's article. So we'll see what happens next. I plan to dose with excel every two days for the rest of the week, then probably go to every three days depending on the results I see.

I am curious though. About an hour after introducing the Nitrogen, I did a Nitrates test, which still came out to zero. My understanding is that the Nitrogen boosts your nitrate levels. Am I wrong here?

Thanks,
Tom


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