# Can you make a tank Rimless!?!!



## Rickie (May 13, 2016)

A lot of people who have planted tanks and are stunning all have rimless tanks. My LFS does not sell rimless tanks and I barely see them around. So I was wondering if people remove them from rimmed tanks or even if it's possible. I love the look with no rim


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## Sharon_hazan (May 5, 2016)

go to glass workshop and buy glass by the dimension you want and silicone it together 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFUWVOaMlB4


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## No.92 (May 1, 2016)

It baffles me how the silicon can hold all that outward pressure in a rimless tank.


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## maxhrbal (Mar 19, 2016)

Small tanks, such as nano tanks often are rimless. Not much pressure. But the typical tanks.... I too wonder this  (my 29 gallon rim is actually bending outwards at the top and it worries me )


-->Max


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## roostertech (Oct 27, 2015)

Eh don't de-rim your tank, they are there for a reason.

If you are doing planted tank, it would suck for you tank to fail after countless hour getting a good scape going. You can always order tank online.


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## Filet-O-Fish (Mar 26, 2015)

Rickie said:


> A lot of people who have planted tanks and are stunning all have rimless tanks. My LFS does not sell rimless tanks and I barely see them around. So I was wondering if people remove them from rimmed tanks or even if it's possible. I love the look with no rim


Hi,
As far as I know, rimless tanks tend to have thicker glass so that it can withstand the force exerted from the water on the lengths of the tank. As thicker glass is used for rimless tanks, naturally the cost of the tank goes up.

Removing the rims from a normal tank is a asking for trouble. You may never know when the joints will give way and flood your place and killing your fish at the same time.

Recently I was looking a 5 feet rimless tank ( 5ft X 2ft x2ft using 15mm glass) and the cost difference was quite wide. If you don't mind a less than perfect look than a ADA style tank, you can have the braces at the bottom of the tank and they will be covered up by the substrate when you're scaping the tank. To bring the cost south, the bottom glass for the tank need not be as thick as the sides.

I was even advised by the tank maker that even the sides ( provided that they're not too long) can be thinner(12mm thick) than the longest sides(15mm thick).

Below is photo my 4 feet tank (48" x 22" x 22") with braces at the bottom. The glass is 12mm thick on all side. As for the silicon you can choose between black and clear.

Hope this was useful.
Cheers.


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

No.92 said:


> It baffles me how the silicon can hold all that outward pressure in a rimless tank.


it isn't even the silicone that is exposed on the inside of the tank that does this, that is just the seal..... the real bonding is done in those little areas glass meets glass, held together by an almost capillary thin layer of the stuff. I distrust the black stuff though as you can't see failures.

I have two 60 gal rimless made from 5mm float glass.... tough as nails.


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## nel (Jan 23, 2016)

For me those tanks with rims are actually funny thing. In Poland there're only rimless tanks (not counting old tanks with metal rims on every side), done with DIN 32622 standards and that's all you need to be safe. It's calculated, so really no need to worry. Done with float you even can have 1 l for 1 zł (around 1 gal for 1 $). With opti you can expect 1 l for 3-10 zł (depends on seller, really, there's a place where you can order new, done exactly as you want 200x50x50 cm opti for 1500 zł, it's actually around 1 gal for 3 $! I'm just waiting to get enough free money... )


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

Same, only rimmed tanks are imports.


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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

A lot of tanks can be de-rimmed, others can't. It depends on the length and thickness of the glass. I de-rimmed a 29 gallon but it's going to be a paladarium so it will only have water in the bottom third or so. I also left the rim on the bottom so I wouldn't have to do anything with a mat. It may still go later. If you do a search on here there are tons of threads about people derimming their tanks. That flexible strip of plastic on top doesn't offer a whole lot of strength. A lot of people feel if it doesn't have a center brace, or a one piece molded plastic frame on top (instead of 4 pieces joined at the corners) that it's safe to de-rim. YMMV.

If you want to de-rim and are concerned about the glass strength you can add a Eurobrace. A glass strip siliconed to the top, in the center, from the front to the back. There are other ways to brace the top with glass also.

If you do a search on here you'll find some instructions on de-rimming. I used a hand plane and kept planing the outside corner of the upper frame until I cut through, then carefully peeled off the pieces. Clean up the excess silicone with a razor blade and alcohol. Knock the sharp edges off the glass with a block and some fine sandpaper. BE CAREFUL IT'S EXTREMELY SHARP.

As someone else noted the rim is there for a reason, but I think the reason is so they can do an ugly sloppy silicone job and not bother to polish the edge of the glass. It's all about $$$.

I also wouldn't build a small rimless unless you have a real good source for glass. It's got so expensive to buy from a glass shop that many people buy tanks at the $ per gallon sales at Petco and Petsmart and harvest the glass from the tanks because it's cheaper than buying the glass outright.


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## Bushkill (Feb 15, 2012)

Just some things to consider:

If the tank has a center brace, it's there for a reason. A reason you don't want to defeat. The center brace allows for the use of thinner glass, which makes them cheaper to build and ship.

Smaller tanks without center braces are a different animal. The top trim certainly does "bind it together" at the corners, but pressure issues aren't as severe. As Maxhrbl noted, today's 29G's bow severely; 1/16" on each viewing pane at the top isn't out of the question (I can vouch for it!).

Without any real science behind it, I wouldn't de-rim anything larger than a 15G.

You also have to consider that the edges the plastic trim conceal, are razor sharp and can even be ragged and chipped. So you need to be prepared to deal with either or both.


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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

This is thread on derimming a 75 gallon with center brace. http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/20-diy/131169-my-75-gallon-derimming-project.html

This is a quote from that thread that originally came from Aquarium Answers website.

"The trim (which is generally plastic) offers LITTLE support other than providing a “cushion” between the bottom glass and stand and as well a “convenient” way to place the lid, lights, etc., on top. Of coarse the trim does certainly add to the attractiveness(mg: i like that part ), but as someone that has worked with high end aquarium manufacturers and built/repaired many myself, I can tell the reader here from an experience that the trim offers little in support and if it is necessary for support, you have a dangerously poorly built aquarium!
As well, I have removed trim from many tanks (including large ones) and filled them with water with no difference other than the unattractive aspect."


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## Bushkill (Feb 15, 2012)

Kubla said:


> This is thread on derimming a 75 gallon with center brace. http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/20-diy/131169-my-75-gallon-derimming-project.html
> 
> This is a quote from that thread that originally came from Aquarium Answers website.
> 
> ...


All I can add to this is that I have several used tanks. I know some were used as SW settups back when Metal Halides was the platform of choice. MH lights were and are brutal on plastic trim that wasn't designed for it. If you've ever seen a center brace crack and start to grow it would at least give you cause to stop and think. I'm not trying to be an alarmist here at all. Merely sharing thoughts and experiences. If I were to de-rim a standard tank as big as a 75G, Eurobracing would be part of my plan.


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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

Bushkill said:


> All I can add to this is that I have several used tanks. I know some were used as SW settups back when Metal Halides was the platform of choice. MH lights were and are brutal on plastic trim that wasn't designed for it. If you've ever seen a center brace crack and start to grow it would at least give you cause to stop and think. I'm not trying to be an alarmist here at all. Merely sharing thoughts and experiences. If I were to de-rim a standard tank as big as a 75G, Eurobracing would be part of my plan.


I don't think I'd ever do one without a brace either. I don't think anyone should derim any tank without some research and an extreme amount of caution. Just wanted to share that it was possible.


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

if I were to build a rimless from scratch I would have the glass cut at a place that can bevel, and grind edges straight.
its is kind of a cool process, there are some vids on youtube showing how it is done. But then again I'd also design it to have a bean animal overflow as part of the actual tank. (i.e. tank sides and rear would be modified).
As it stands I have enough tanks just needing the odd glass panel replaced. I think I have one 26gal long with a eurobrace.


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## Filet-O-Fish (Mar 26, 2015)

This is what happens when you don't pay attention to the thickness of the glass.


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## Goomie (Jul 21, 2015)

Oh my gosh! That's terrible.


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## dpod (Sep 16, 2014)

I'm gonna throw my experience in de-rimming a tank up here and say that it's probably not worth the hassle. I took the plastic off the top of a top fin 5.5g, and I think it took 2+ very tense hours. While the tank was structurally sound, I cracked the front panel during a water change in less than a year. It didn't leak very fast. Thankfully, I didn't have to clean all that water out of my carpet. I'll say that the plastic rim isn't pretty or terribly important for strength, but it does a good job of padding the edges from clumsy aquarists.


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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

dpod said:


> I'll say that the plastic rim isn't pretty or terribly important for strength, but it does a good job of padding the edges from clumsy aquarists.


That's very true. But, that's a comment on rimless tanks in general, not on derimming a tank.

Bump:


Filet-O-Fish said:


> This is what happens when you don't pay attention to the thickness of the glass.


I've never seen a tank that burst under pressure but that's not what I would expect. That looks more like it got hit with something.


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## nel (Jan 23, 2016)

nel said:


> Kubla said:
> 
> 
> > That's very true. But, that's a comment on rimless tanks in general, not on derimming a tank.
> ...


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## Bushkill (Feb 15, 2012)

Kubla said:


> That's very true. But, that's a comment on rimless tanks in general, not on derimming a tank.
> 
> Bump:
> 
> I've never seen a tank that burst under pressure but that's not what I would expect. That looks more like it got hit with something.


You noticed the reflection of the back of that SUV in the glass too!


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

Gees, some of my rimless 26 gal longs must be over 20 years old and made out of 4mm glass.
I did have to redo one I left standing empty out in the sun for years, as the silicone on that was pretty much perished.

A tall tank is always going to require sturdier construction. Just take a normal 3 foot rimless tank, fill all but the last 3 inches, measure the bulge, then fill it and see how much extra that pane bulges out. You'll be carefull for life.

Anyways the sump in that pic seems to be made of thicker glass than the tank....


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## toybox22 (Sep 29, 2014)

I'll jump in the fire. I de-rimmed my 20 long. That's the biggest I would go for a tank to de-rim. I only did the top brace on it however. Took my time. Didn't touch the silicone. Took a couple hrs. I leaked tested for 5 days outside. Didn't see a leak, so I brought it back in and planted it. It held strong to the day I upgraded to a proper rimless tank. I probably had the tank de-rimmed for a year. It never looked the same as a rimless. If you can, just buy rimless. Marine depot and bulk reef supply both should have rimless tanks. Shipping is usually free as well. 

Here are a couple of pics of it set up.


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## evil nick (Oct 20, 2014)

Could you derim your tank and re rim with a diy clear plexi rim?


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## toadpher (May 25, 2015)

A few months ago I was filling my old 55g paludarium, to make an aquarium out of it. I didn't notice the center brace was cracked and about the 54th gallon of water the brace blew out with a bang (literally). I immediately dropped the bucket of water on the floor and squeezed the two pieces of glass BACK together. If I had to guess, I think the glass bowed a good 1" between the two panes (I could shove two fingers side-by-side between the crack!). 

Sure, glass can flex a little, but once it's had enough, it will give and there is nothing you can do to stop it. It might not break right away, or even for a while, but adding that much stress to glass can be asking for disaster (not to mention the new torsional forces introduced to the silicone, where it would normally just be tensile force with the frame and bracing. How good are those seals anyways??). Some tanks are over-engineered and can support themselves, I don't know how to tell, other than measuring the thickness and talking to you guys, but some tanks aren't over engineered and need that center brace. 

Food for thought.


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## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

I like the glass floor brace they have in that broken tank...


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## Kubla (Jan 5, 2014)

Nordic said:


> I like the glass floor brace they have in that broken tank...


I was trying to make some sense out of that. At first I thought it was a reflection.

Bump:


toybox22 said:


> I'll jump in the fire. I de-rimmed my 20 long. That's the biggest I would go for a tank to de-rim. I only did the top brace on it however. Took my time. Didn't touch the silicone. Took a couple hrs. I leaked tested for 5 days outside. Didn't see a leak, so I brought it back in and planted it. It held strong to the day I upgraded to a proper rimless tank. I probably had the tank de-rimmed for a year. It never looked the same as a rimless. If you can, just buy rimless. Marine depot and bulk reef supply both should have rimless tanks. Shipping is usually free as well.
> 
> Here are a couple of pics of it set up.


That's a beautiful tank. I think I would have been scared doing a 20L. Not much height, but a decent span. What brand is the tank?


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