# Wow - DIY in tank Co2 diffuser for $10



## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Thanks for posting this, I have been looking for a concise explanation on how to set a diffuser for a DIY co2 set up.

FYI, Petco is selling those for $7.50 each online until 10.5, so I grabbed 2, one for my 10gallon starter, and one for the eventually larger one I plan on setting up later. Also, the coupon code GEEKS10 got me 10% off (covered tax ), with no minimum order.


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## Moe (Jan 22, 2004)

They do work well on small tanks


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

can anyone point me to a good post on setting up the co2 bottle? I got my Elite minis in the mail today from petco and am ready to get things set up. I thought I had seen a thread, but can't find it now and my searches are futile.


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## Wicket_lfe (Aug 21, 2008)

Do you mean the 2 liter soda bottle filled with water, 1 cup sugar, and a teaspoon of yeast?

I'm sure if you just google DIY CO2 you must find something.


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Wicket_lfe said:


> Do you mean the 2 liter soda bottle filled with water, 1 cup sugar, and a teaspoon of yeast?
> 
> I'm sure if you just google DIY CO2 you must find something.


Yes, I'm looking for tips on getting a good seal on the soda bottle and whether I should have a smaller, secondary bottle to help with containing the "sludge" I've been reading about. I was just hoping there was a "tried and true" post rather than wading through a ton of search results.


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## SvenBoogie (Jul 3, 2009)

I want to note, I have these in 3 tanks, and they are great, with one major exception. Do NOT expect them to start properly on their own if you try to use a timer. All three of mine have to be jostled around a bit when started to get them going again.


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## SvenBoogie (Jul 3, 2009)

miklb said:


> Yes, I'm looking for tips on getting a good seal on the soda bottle and whether I should have a smaller, secondary bottle to help with containing the "sludge" I've been reading about. I was just hoping there was a "tried and true" post rather than wading through a ton of search results.


This is what I do, its a DIY bubble counter, which also serves as a filter for the co2. Any yeasty muck is filtered out when bubbling through the water. I made it with a bulk spice jar from a local market which cost all of $1.


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## Wicket_lfe (Aug 21, 2008)

miklb said:


> Yes, I'm looking for tips on getting a good seal on the soda bottle and whether I should have a smaller, secondary bottle to help with containing the "sludge" I've been reading about. I was just hoping there was a "tried and true" post rather than wading through a ton of search results.


There are so many posts because everyone does what they want. I found the easiest to be, drill a small hole in the bottle cap, and thread the tubing through it. For my bubble counter i have a check valve glued into a syringe. Otherwise, just use the 2 bottle method.

The great thing about DIY, there is no tried and true because people try to make it better.


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## SJInverts (Apr 6, 2009)

miklb said:


> can anyone point me to a good post on setting up the co2 bottle? I got my Elite minis in the mail today from petco and am ready to get things set up. I thought I had seen a thread, but can't find it now and my searches are futile.


This how I do my DIY co2 on all my tanks. For my 30g tank I have 2 bottles.

http://fish.cecolts.com/pics/co2.html


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## ZooTycoonMaster (Jan 2, 2008)

SvenBoogie said:


> I want to note, I have these in 3 tanks, and they are great, with one major exception. Do NOT expect them to start properly on their own if you try to use a timer. All three of mine have to be jostled around a bit when started to get them going again.


So if you hook them up to a timer and the timer turns on, it'll take a while for the filter to get started diffusing the CO2?

And to the OP - is there a noise when the CO2 bubble hits the impeller?


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## niko (Mar 8, 2006)

This 75 gal. tank uses 1 (one) of these DIY reactors:

http://picasaweb.google.com/ddasega/DaveS#

The tank made about 3 gallons of clippings every other week.

--Nikolay


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## SvenBoogie (Jul 3, 2009)

Curious if anyone else has seen the issue with these not starting up when turned on/off with a timer...


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## niko (Mar 8, 2006)

SvenBoogie said:


> Curious if anyone else has seen the issue with these not starting up when turned on/off with a timer...


That's one of the reasons I chose that model. It starts with no problems.

But there is no real benefit from turning the CO2 on/off. I would like to see a tank that is doing considerably better because of aerating at night and no CO2 injection.

--Nikolay


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## Lnb (Apr 15, 2008)

I don't have it on a timer. I do have the Co2 on a solenoid that is timed with my lights, so actually the pump is never turned off.

One of the points from the original design is the bubble counting pish, pish from the bubbles hitting the impeller. I already have a bubble counter so it served no purpose to me. Instead of just threading the Co2 tubing into the pump I wedged in a small airstone which in turn produced smaller bubbles that were broken down to even smaller bubbles by the impeller. I've got news for you, these bubbles are as small as the bubbles produced from my Cal Aqua glass inline diffusers in the 55g.

In the APC thread some complain about the noise and others don't hear a thing so I can't tell you because I use an airstone and to me it's totally silent.

The thing is great, I converted the 20long and will be converting 2 15g tanks this weekend. Ceramic diffusers always produced adequate results without much of a monetary investment but nothing beats this. :bounce:

Oh, by the way Niko is the author of the APC thread.


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Thank you everyone for the input, I'll be setting this up tomorrow and will check back if I have any issues.


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## SvenBoogie (Jul 3, 2009)

Yeah, I haven't had any issues with noise with any of the 3 I'm using, just with it not starting properly when turned on with a timer. As far as I can tell, the issue is that the co2 gas builds up overnight in the lower chamber of the mini-filter where the sponge would normally be. When it turns on, the filter isn't strong enough to expel the built up gas out, so I have to pull on the power cord to jostle the mini-filter around to get the gas to release, at which point, it starts up fine.


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## hbosman (Oct 5, 2006)

SvenBoogie said:


> Yeah, I haven't had any issues with noise with any of the 3 I'm using, just with it not starting properly when turned on with a timer. As far as I can tell, the issue is that the co2 gas builds up overnight in the lower chamber of the mini-filter where the sponge would normally be. When it turns on, the filter isn't strong enough to expel the built up gas out, so I have to pull on the power cord to jostle the mini-filter around to get the gas to release, at which point, it starts up fine.



Just leave the mini filter running at night as well. I use pressurized 24/7, 2 bps into 46 gallons and have never had issues. If you aren't going crazy with the bubble count and have some surface turbulence, you won't hurt anything.


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## Lnb (Apr 15, 2008)

hbosman said:


> Just leave the mini filter running at night as well. I use pressurized 24/7, 2 bps into 46 gallons and have never had issues. If you aren't going crazy with the bubble count and have some surface turbulence, you won't hurt anything.


I agree, just leave it on.


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Well, I got it set up last night, might not have done something right, as it seems to be dispersing from the sides as well as the sponge, and makes a little noise, nothing too disturbing, but certainly isn't silent. Tried making a little video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEzN3pDGZ1c. Anyone see anything I might have done wrong?


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## Postal Penguin (Mar 30, 2009)

I am thinking of getting this for my 20g long. However, my question is how does this compare to a normal powerhead? On my 20 I just feed the CO2 directly into the powerhead impeller which smashes it to a fine mist. Does this produce even better results than that?


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## Lnb (Apr 15, 2008)

miklb said:


> Well, I got it set up last night, might not have done something right, as it seems to be dispersing from the sides as well as the sponge, and makes a little noise, nothing too disturbing, but certainly isn't silent. Tried making a little video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEzN3pDGZ1c. Anyone see anything I might have done wrong?


Did you take out that green tab plastic piece that covers the impeller? Take it off if you didn't. That might be the reason it's coming out the sides, though is this really a bad thing?

The pish, pish is probably the sound some folks complain about in the original thread. They say you can use the sound as your bubble counter. I used an airstone to eliminate this and don't hear a thing.



Postal Penguin said:


> I am thinking of getting this for my 20g long. However, my question is how does this compare to a normal powerhead? On my 20 I just feed the CO2 directly into the powerhead impeller which smashes it to a fine mist. Does this produce even better results than that?


I use this in my 20 long. Personally, I've never used a powerhead as a diffuser. 

I think the fact that the Co2 bubbles collect on the sponge allows for the Co2 more time to be absorbed into the water column as opposed to just having the bubble being chopped up and dispersed by the powerhead.


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## niko (Mar 8, 2006)

To avoid the CO2 accumulating in the filter when the pump is off turn the pump sideways. So the gas can escape through the strainer bars.

Once again - noone can show a tank that looks much better just because it was aerated at night and the CO2 was being turned off. Also if you do some measurements you will find out that when turning the CO2 off at night the concentration of CO2 drops very fast (30 min or so). But it takes 2-4 hours to build up in the morning.

My point is - don't turn the CO2 off at night. It makes no real difference - for the plants and for your wallet.

--Nikolay


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## Lnb (Apr 15, 2008)

niko said:


> To avoid the CO2 accumulating in the filter when the pump is off turn the pump sideways. So the gas can escape through the strainer bars.
> 
> Once again - noone can show a tank that looks much better just because it was aerated at night and the CO2 was being turned off. Also if you do some measurements you will find out that when turning the CO2 off at night the concentration of CO2 drops very fast (30 min or so). But it takes 2-4 hours to build up in the morning.
> 
> ...


I'm sure this is very true and clearly demonstrated by the beauty of your tank. If I did not already have a solenoid connected to my Co2 reg I would definitely go the route. Fortunately or unfortunately all my Co2's are set up with solenoids. 

Now if I had known before hand ........ it may have been a different story. 

Yes, it's very true that I will not get the reading I want on my drop checker until hours after the Co2 is turned on. This would be clearly avoided if the Co2 was never off in the first place.


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Lnb said:


> Did you take out that green tab plastic piece that covers the impeller? Take it off if you didn't. That might be the reason it's coming out the sides, though is this really a bad thing?
> 
> The pish, pish is probably the sound some folks complain about in the original thread. They say you can use the sound as your bubble counter. I used an airstone to eliminate this and don't hear a thing.



Yes, I took the green tab out, and I wasn't sure if coming out the sides was a bad thing, thus my question 

I might experiment with an airstone just to see the difference, though the "pish, pish" doesn't bother me, I'm finding it a bit soothing, especially since I have to keep the tank topped off and don't hear any dribbling from the filter.

Thanks again for all of the responses and the link to the original thread. I can't wait to see the difference.


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## oldpunk78 (Nov 1, 2008)

i haven't heard of too many of you guys trying this, but it works really well(at least for me anyway...).

all i did here was cut down a lime wood air stone so it would fit into the hole i drilled into the side. the result was a very fine mist getting blown all over the tank. you do need to clean off the wooden stone every week though. this is why i eventually ditched the lime wood diffuser for a high quality ceramic one(air stone). oh, and did i mention that this mod makes the whole bubble smashing sound disappear? 










someone should give this a try and report back with your findings...


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## SvenBoogie (Jul 3, 2009)

My concern about leaving the co2 on constantly was the potential pH crash, as we have extremely soft water here. I tried it over the weekend however, and no shrimp losses yet (although they seem to be a bit more pale in color than they were), so looks like I'll just be leaving it on.


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Anyone have an issue where the propeller keeps falling out? I just did my first switch of DIY CO2 bottles, and decided to add a check valve and airstone to see compare. Now the little green propeller won't stay in. I've tried gently sliding it back into the tank on it's side thinking that once it got going, it would stay in, but alas, no luck.

Any tips?


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## hbosman (Oct 5, 2006)

niko said:


> Once again - noone can show a tank that looks much better just because it was aerated at night and the CO2 was being turned off. Also if you do some measurements you will find out that when turning the CO2 off at night the concentration of CO2 drops very fast (30 min or so). But it takes 2-4 hours to build up in the morning.
> 
> My point is - don't turn the CO2 off at night. It makes no real difference - for the plants and for your wallet.
> 
> --Nikolay


Niko,

I haven't turned off co2 at night, yet. I thought that it was intuitive that, if you turn off co2 at night, you will probably crank up the bubble rate to maybe double so that the co2 saturation would be sufficient when the lights came on. Even with a several hour lead time. There could be two issues here, one - you hardly would save any co2 and two - If the solenoid sticks open (which happens occasionally) you will have a lot of dead fish.

For experimental purposes, I am going to incorporate a solenoid, to see if the assumption described above is incorrect. I just hope that point number two doesn't happen.

Niko, have you ever made a comparison to truely see if the co2 savings was indeed minimal?


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## Fatality (Oct 21, 2009)

This quesiton might sound retarded but I am new to all of this, but with this DIY reactor, are you doing the soda bottle with yeast as well?


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## snafu (Oct 9, 2004)

niko said:


> Once again - noone can show a tank that looks much better just because it was aerated at night and the CO2 was being turned off. Also if you do some measurements you will find out that when turning the CO2 off at night the concentration of CO2 drops very fast (30 min or so). But it takes 2-4 hours to build up in the morning.


i can point to one case where my tank and its inhabitants are doing much better since i stopped CO2 and have begun aerating at night. on several occasions very recently, i've found my fish gasping at the water surface in the morning so i started nighttime aeration. whether or not the flora is better off is another matter, but the fauna appreciate the nighttime aeration. i suspect the root cause has been a combination of an overpopulation of tank inhabitants (emperor tetra and pencilfish) and unusually hot weather. my lesson-learned is not to put a bunch of prolific species in the same tank.


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## miklb (Oct 2, 2009)

Fatality said:


> This quesiton might sound retarded but I am new to all of this, but with this DIY reactor, are you doing the soda bottle with yeast as well?


Heh, I was there just few short weeks ago. In my case, yes, I'm using a 2L bottle and yeast/sugar mixture.


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## jart (Jan 17, 2003)

I plan on setting one of these up tomorrow evening. Tonight's task was unhooking the existing inline reactor and reconnecting the XP3 without the reactor. Hopefully Niko's idea will serve as a simpler method of CO2 dispersal. 

Although, it will be difficult to tell if this method will produce superior results in my tank. The increased outflow from the XP3, now that the inline reactor is removed, is quite significant. So if my plants do grow better with the Hagen Mini Elite, arguably it might just be a matter of better water circulation.

Niko, what do you use for circulation on your 75? I am thinking about using this idea on my 72 in the future. Currently I have a Koralia 2 in there, but it is a little strong for my liking.

Regards.


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## daverockssocks (Dec 1, 2008)

I use a QuietOne pump for a similar method, using a small ceramic difuser in front of the intake for the pump, which then runs through my ladder style UV sterilizer. Bam, 300gph Co2 diffuser. Almost absolute diffusion.


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## S&KGray (Nov 12, 2008)

daverockssocks said:


> I use a QuietOne pump for a similar method, using a small ceramic difuser in front of the intake for the pump, which then runs through my ladder style UV sterilizer. Bam, 300gph Co2 diffuser. Almost absolute diffusion.


Any pics?


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## Whiskeyfox (Oct 16, 2009)

Check out my 20g journal, I have a pic of the Hagen Elite with zip ties, bottom fed, no airstone, and a picture of my Co2 Bottle setup.


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## Burks (May 21, 2006)

I went to a Petco in Toledo today and they didn't have any of these. But for about $13 shipped, I will be ordering one anyways. Not that big of a cost for something that works!


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## Whiskeyfox (Oct 16, 2009)

I do now use a ceramic airstone in the Hagen Elite.


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## jart (Jan 17, 2003)

Whiskeyfox said:


> I do now use a ceramic airstone in the Hagen Elite.


Thanks for the info. I ordered a couple of airstones this week (I am running two Elites on my 72).


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