# tatersalad's 5 foot 120 build



## nyskiffie (Mar 23, 2016)

I'm in process of setting up the same size tank, I'm a big fan of this size 120. 

What are you planning on putting in it?


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Is that a standard 20g sump or 29g? I wish you had pictures of the actual tank! I'm sure the black silicone looks sharp. Also, on the topic of the overflow, what are the dimensions of the interior box? What's your proposed flow rate as well? I'm always interested in similarly sized tanks and their setup.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

nyskiffie said:


> I'm in process of setting up the same size tank, I'm a big fan of this size 120.
> 
> What are you planning on putting in it?


Well, at this point all I know for sure is that I've always wanted to keep clown loaches. And I want them to get big. I guess really I just want to have sorda a community tank. I would love to have a discus or two in there, but I feel like I won't be able to provide the proper care for them. Maybe a community tank with some nice bosemans rainbows?


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> Is that a standard 20g sump or 29g? I wish you had pictures of the actual tank! I'm sure the black silicone looks sharp. Also, on the topic of the overflow, what are the dimensions of the interior box? What's your proposed flow rate as well? I'm always interested in similarly sized tanks and their setup.


The sump is a standard 20 gallon High. I tried to fit a 29 gallon inside that space and it was an inch and a half too long. I did not want to remove the 2 main supports on the stand to fit it so I went with the 20 high and beefed up the 2 main supports instead. I will be posting pics of the main tank soon as I plan on drilling it this coming weekend. The overflow dimensions are approx. 12" x 6" on the front panel and 12" x 6" on the bottom panel. The two side panels are approx. 6" x 5.75". The reason I had to make my own box is because I could not find a pre-made one that I could fit a 1.5" bulkhead with a Elbow attached into it. Most everything was only 3" deep and I needed over 4 inches to get that 90 degree fitting and the bulkhead in there. I am setting it up with a Herbie type overflow. I am going to have a 1" main drain that I can throttle with a valve and the 1.5" is the emergency drain. I will be running a Jaebo DCT-8000 which is a DC drive variable speed pump that can max out at around 2100GPH. If I calculated right, I should be able to flow at least 1800GPH through this box. But honestly with the variable speed pump and being able to control the flow coming in the sump with a valve, I should be able to dial it all in. I filled the 20 high with a 1 gallon jug one gallon at a time and made marks on the tank so that I will know where to position my sump dividers so that I can have enough sump left to get in the amount of water that will drain off the main tank when the power goes down. You can bet I will for sure be testing all of this outside my house before setting this up in my living room!


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Nah! Test her on the carpet in the living room. haha. Glad to hear it! That's a ton of flow. Not saying it is too much, it's just a lot. I am going with the same brand of DC pump myself.


----------



## Nordic (Nov 11, 2003)

Lol, even just 2 gallons on a carpet looks like disaster zone.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm planning a spray bar for the return, so I'm sure I'll lose some flow there. I'm just trying to take my time with this project and not screw it up. This is the biggest "new" tank I've ever owned. My display tank in the house now is an old Oceanic 67 gallon "show" tank. It's 24" deep and looks good, but I've had it for like 15 years and it was used when I got it. I'm kind of looking forward to having a brand new tank with no scratches.


----------



## [email protected] (Dec 31, 2016)

This is fantastic!!!! I love it. Tell the Mrs to go find a hairdryer and a dressing table that will keep her happy. 

How did you find a tank that size so cheap? In the UK can't find anything line that. I have a 240 litre tank with stand bout paid over £700 for it. 

Have you got pictures of your tank 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Just a FYI, you can calculate the height change into volume and back into height change fairly easily since water has know values. I ended up buying the same pump. I'm very interested in seeing your return! I have no clue what I'm going to do with mine yet, so seeing some more examples and ideas is super useful. I do have to say that was quite the pickup for a NEW tank. Very good deal! I bet that sucker is heavy though.


----------



## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

tatersalad said:


> Well, at this point all I know for sure is that I've always wanted to keep clown loaches. And I want them to get big. I guess really I just want to have sorda a community tank. I would love to have a discus or two in there, but I feel like I won't be able to provide the proper care for them. Maybe a community tank with some nice bosemans rainbows?


Looks like a great build. Like how you are modifying the stock stand. Looks like it's going to work out well for you.

And I also have a 5ft 120G. Great size for Rainbows and loaches too. The Rainbows and loaches create a nice layering, as Rainbows stay near the middle/top, and loaches near the bottom. Another one you see often with Rainbows are Roseline Sharks. Also stay near the middle/bottom of the tank.

Good luck and looking forward to seeing how things progress. Lots of possibilities there.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> Just a FYI, you can calculate the height change into volume and back into height change fairly easily since water has know values. I ended up buying the same pump. I'm very interested in seeing your return! I have no clue what I'm going to do with mine yet, so seeing some more examples and ideas is super useful. I do have to say that was quite the pickup for a NEW tank. Very good deal! I bet that sucker is heavy though.


Thanks, the tank is very heavy. I actually don't normally do the Black Friday thing, but this year I came across a leaked ad for Petsmart showing the 120 and 125's being on sale for $300 before noon on Black Friday. I scouted out my local Petsmart 3 or 4 days before Thanksgiving and the manager told me they only had one of the 5 foot 120 gallon setups. He even went in the back and took a pic of it with his phone to show me. I got to the store 2 hours before they opened that Friday. I was first in line and when the manager opened the door he handed me a ticket and said that they never even unpacked the 120 setup because he knew I was coming. I just paid for it right then and drove around back and they loaded it up in my truck with a fork lift! I was in the store like 5 minutes. Best shopping experience I've ever had, LOL:grin2:


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Holy smokes! I really don't do the Black Friday thing either, but there are some good deals to be had from time to time. That really is a steal. I'm VERY stoked to see this come to fruition.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> Holy smokes! I really don't do the Black Friday thing either, but there are some good deals to be had from time to time. That really is a steal. I'm VERY stoked to see this come to fruition.


Well, I must ask for grace and patience because it will probably take me awhile to complete 0
I have 3 kids and my wife works sometimes when I'm not working on the weekends so sometimes I get a chance to work on this project and sometimes other things take over. But I promise to take pics and document it in this journal when I do finally get it going.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Drilled*

Ok, everything worked out and I was able to drill my tank and install the bulkheads and the overflow I made. I am going to try to insert these photos as I go, hopefully. 
I got my wife to help me set the tank up on my sawhorses that I covered in some old bath towels as to not scratch the glass.

Bump: Then I laid everything out. Brought the overflow box up into position and traced out the inside diameter of it. Then I positioned my bulkheads and traced out their inside dimensions as well.

Bump: Then the fun began! Just so you guys and gals know: this is not my first tank to drill. I had 2 old tanks laying around outside that had either been cracked at some point or were just discarded for whatever reason. I practiced on those in the weeks leading up to this. I will say this though, none of them had as thick of glass as this 120 had. To me, the thicker the glass the easier it was to drill.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

And here is the finished product: I have a 1.5" emergency drain and a 1" main drain. I have a threaded low profile strainer on the 1" drain and of course the emergency will have a 90 with a short stand pipe to help my set the water level in the main tank. Thanks for looking.


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Not bad! It's more of an overflow than an emergency standpipe though. It's turning out pretty well thus far. I've never drilled glass, but it sounds nerve racking to me! I love the plumbing portion of a tank and I'm excited to see where you go with it all. It's super neat to see how others do their tanks to me.


----------



## Eric Mraz (May 17, 2016)

Looking good.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Putting the Sump Together*

Finally got a chance to swing by the glass shop and get some glass cut for the sump. I was only able to get the first section and the last section put in last night. Tonight I will put the other 2 pieces in and then hopefully I will do a test run on the tank this weekend. I'm starting to get anxious to finish this setup, but I know I still need to find a large piece or pieces of driftwood for the tank. Driftwood is one of those things that I would like to see in person before I buy. Thanks for looking.


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

Looking good so far!


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

tatersalad;9887442 Tonight I will put the other 2 pieces in and then hopefully I will do a test run on the tank this weekend. I'm starting to get anxious to finish this setup...[/QUOTE said:


> This is me in a nutshell at the moment. We are at similar points in our build. I wish you luck with the test run! I, unfortunately (sarcasm), have to take a family vacation for a week! I hope to see progress when I get back. :grin2:


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Finished Sump, Mocked Up Piping - Test Run*

Ok everybody, finally got a chance to make some headway on this project this week. I finished the sump and moved the display tank and stand onto my large back porch. I mocked up all the piping and ran the tank on the porch. I am going to try to post these pics in order so that you guys can see what's going on. First set will be the finished sump and the location where the sump is going in the stand. I decided to Plasti-Dip the bottom section of my stand where the sump will be sitting. I figure this will aid in keeping the sump from sliding around and I will also caulk all edges around the bottom to hopefully create a water proof cavity at the bottom of this stand. I do not foresee an issue with flooding but it doesn't hurt to be prepared. Sump setup will be: 1st spot poly batting. 2nd spot pot scrubbers. Bubble trap/slow down weir. 3rd spot reserved for CO2 loop and heating and UV. 4th spot is pump.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Piping setup*

Ok, first pic is of the tank running with a full siphon. This is just with the pipe all mocked up, no glue. Second pic is of the sump when the power is off and all the water that is going to drain into it already drained into it. Third and Fourth pics are of the mock up of the return piping with the dual spray bars on either side of the overflow box. And the last pic shows the super short standpipe at the top of my emergency drain. That pic was taken with the tank running. All in all I felt really good with the test run. When I had it running I just had the return pipe elbowed over into the tank. I have not tried it with the spray bar yet, but I know it will be okay. I really really really like the Jabeo pump. Having the DC drive variable speed pump is very nice and it was super easy to get my level and everything lined out with that pump. I was just messing with it and I can have my main drain almost completely open with this pump setup. When I stopped playing with it I had the pump at about 60% flow and my main drain valve pretty close to fully open. I'm sorry I didn't get a good pic of the piping from the back, but if you zoom in I think you can see what I had going on. 
Thanks for looking.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Got two coats of paint on the back of the tank last night. Using Valspar latex enamel. I have a feeling I'm going to need at least 2 more coats to get it good enough. Paint just doesn't want to stick to glass very well.


----------



## KayakJimW (Aug 12, 2016)

Looking great man, I like that plumbing job. Yeah, the first coat or two seems like the paint just doesn't want to go on. Each coat sticks a little better than the one before. I'll share an experience I had: Make sure each coat is completely dry before starting the next. I made the mistake of rushing it once and the result was crackling and pulling of the undercoat. Looked like cracked mud that had baked in the sun. I had to peel it off and start over. Doesn't always happen, but it sucks when it does. Great thread by the way!


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

You have one stand pipe taking all the flow and a backup? I thought a herbie had a full siphon and a trickle drain. Glad to see it coming along though. I like the spray bar.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> You have one stand pipe taking all the flow and a backup? I thought a herbie had a full siphon and a trickle drain. Glad to see it coming along though. I like the spray bar.


The full siphon is the 1" pipe. It's hard to see in the pic. The 1 1/2" elbow with the little pipe just above the water level is the emergency drain that water is supposed to trickle through when you have everything set right. My full siphon pipe doesn't have an elbow on it in the box. It has a flush strainer threaded onto the bulkhead. It works pretty well so far, I filled everything up just kinda eyeballed it. When I have the drain valve on the full siphon pipe adjusted right the water level will be right up to the 1 1/2" pipe and trickle just a little. But honestly with the way the overflow box is positioned and the thickness of the trim on this tank, it looks like the water level is full most all the time. Even when I shut the power off to the return pump and all the water siphons out you really can't tell when looking at the main tank because the trim is so thick.
All the herbie setups I could find online were done with the overflow boxes that go from top to bottom and the tanks are drilled at the bottom. The bottom pane of glass on my tank was tempered so that ruled that out. I guess you could call this a compact herbie, LOL. I don't know.


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Nevermind! It is a herbie setup from what you have described, I've just never seen someone call the overflow stand pipe an emergency drain. I get what you mean though, it is an emergency drain if your main siphon fails, but it also has constant flow unlike the emergency drain of a bean animal overflow. That's mostly what I wanted to clarify. I had a feeling I wasn't understanding your setup due to a discrepancy.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> Nevermind! It is a herbie setup from what you have described, I've just never seen someone call the overflow stand pipe an emergency drain. I get what you mean though, it is an emergency drain if your main siphon fails, but it also has constant flow unlike the emergency drain of a bean animal overflow. That's mostly what I wanted to clarify. I had a feeling I wasn't understanding your setup due to a discrepancy.


This webpage: Herbie Overflow Plumbing Guide for Quiet Reef Aquariums - gmacreef
Helped me out big time in setting this up.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Update:*

Well, I kinda fell behind on updating this journal. It just seems like when you get going on one of these projects you forget to take pictures as you go. I don't think there are very many folks following this journal anyway.
So I did my water test outside and everything went well, brought the tank inside and proceeded to paint the background. I now understand why everyone wants to paint their backgrounds. It is by far the least expensive method that looks good. And from my experience it comes right off very easily. I had to touch up a few places after I installed my plumbing, lol.
I ended up having to order some Krylon Fusion spraypaint online because apparently no one in my area carries it anymore. Lowe's doesn't even carry Krylon brand around here anymore. The only store I could find that carried Krylon was Walmart and they had every paint that they make EXCEPT the Fusion. I fabbed up my return pipe spray bar and painted everything with the Fusion. I ended up drilling a hole every inch on the spray bars. It was determined that this is too many holes. I fully intend to make myself another set of bars with a hole every 2 inches instead. 
Also during this time I was able to fab up my CO2 reactor for the sump. I have been running a Griggs style reactor for years on my canister filter and loved it. So I decided to build one using a small 400GPH pump. I can throttle the output of it with a 1/2" valve at the end. I also plan to extend this line to an external UV sterilizer. That way I can have a closed loop inside the sump for CO2 and UV. So far it is working well.
So, got my old tank broken down and removed from the house to make way for this behemoth. I put my potting soil in like always and then started putting in my rinsed black diamond, totally forgetting my layer of Osmocote. So I ended up making up some pills later and putting under every plant. The black diamond I used this time seemed to have more little bits that weren't black in it than normal. I don't know why it was like that, this is the first time I've had this experience. But it doesn't look bad, something different you know?

It was very hard to find a piece of driftwood that I liked. I looked around locally and basically nothing caught my eye. I found the piece I have now online and it looks good, I just wish is was maybe a couple of inches taller. I did locate some rocks that I think will work out.
For lights I have two Finnex Fugeray Planted + fixtures. I also have two 60 watt LED floods that I ordered specifically for a DIY project to have them setup to run approx. 3-4 hours mid-day. I have the aluminium angle and all the hardware for them to be installed, just haven't had the time. I will update with that project at a later date.

So far everything is going very well with the sump on this tank. I know it is a lot to have in a 20 gallon, but it gets the job done and maximizes my available space. I am running two 150 watt heaters on this tank and I am seriously considering ordering the Inkbird heater controller for this setup. I think I will get more efficient use from the dual heaters with one controller rather than the two of them trying to individually keep the temp up. Invariably you will have one heater that stays on more than the other. And the reason I went with two smaller heaters instead of one larger one is size. The sump would not accommodate a large 300 watt heater.

So, that's that and here are some photos to show some progress.
Thanks for looking.


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Hey! I still come back to follow your updates. I ran into the fusion problem myself. Royal pain in the butt it is. I didn't want to risk using rustoleum because all my experience points to Krylon. The spray bar hole pattern depends on the size of the hole. I think mine are like 3/8" or something and I spaced them about every 2". I would definitely get the inkbird controller. I have one and it is great. I set it to 77* and the heaters at 80*. The heater's never operate their internal components and the controller works flawlessly. I run two 300w heaters on my 125 but I have a 75g sump. Whatever works and keeps the temps up in the winter. Good luck with that lighting project!


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> Hey! I still come back to follow your updates. I ran into the fusion problem myself. Royal pain in the butt it is. I didn't want to risk using rustoleum because all my experience points to Krylon. The spray bar hole pattern depends on the size of the hole. I think mine are like 3/8" or something and I spaced them about every 2". I would definitely get the inkbird controller. I have one and it is great. I set it to 77* and the heaters at 80*. The heater's never operate their internal components and the controller works flawlessly. I run two 300w heaters on my 125 but I have a 75g sump. Whatever works and keeps the temps up in the winter. Good luck with that lighting project!


Well thanks for checking up on the build, what size pipe are you using on your spray bar? I went with 1/2" pvc and I drilled 1/4" holes every inch. I have great flow out of the end half of the spray bars but not much from the front half. Which Inkbird controller are you using? I noticed they have at least 2 different models. I'm thinking it would be a waste to buy the one that has a heating and cooling feature.


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

I've also been keeping up with the updates...keep em' coming!


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

tatersalad said:


> Well thanks for checking up on the build, what size pipe are you using on your spray bar? I went with 1/2" pvc and I drilled 1/4" holes every inch. I have great flow out of the end half of the spray bars but not much from the front half. Which Inkbird controller are you using? I noticed they have at least 2 different models. I'm thinking it would be a waste to buy the one that has a heating and cooling feature.


I have a 1" spray bar on the end of my DCT-8000 return pump (~2000gph). I have seen what you are describing on my stock sunsun spray bars. They pressure went to the end and worked it's way back with less pressure. All I can really say is experiment. Try your idea of less holes. Try bigger holes. Bigger holes move more water at a slower velocity. Kind of like a powerhead vs a return pump. More gentle flow, but the same amount. Could be worth a shot. I also have the inkbird controller with the heating and cooling features, I live in florida. The cooling is hooked to hood fans to exhaust excess temps out of the top in the summer. I won it in a RAOK give away. I believe mine is rated at 1000-1200w and I use 2-3 of aquatop's 300w heaters. Works like a champ though.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> I have a 1" spray bar on the end of my DCT-8000 return pump (~2000gph). I have seen what you are describing on my stock sunsun spray bars. They pressure went to the end and worked it's way back with less pressure. All I can really say is experiment. Try your idea of less holes. Try bigger holes. Bigger holes move more water at a slower velocity. Kind of like a powerhead vs a return pump. More gentle flow, but the same amount. Could be worth a shot. I also have the inkbird controller with the heating and cooling features, I live in florida. The cooling is hooked to hood fans to exhaust excess temps out of the top in the summer. I won it in a RAOK give away. I believe mine is rated at 1000-1200w and I use 2-3 of aquatop's 300w heaters. Works like a champ though.


That controller sounds really cool, I think I am going to have to get one of those for sure. How are you liking the DCT-8000? That's what I have also and I've been really pleased with it. My kids like the "feed" function, they think it's neat when it ramps back up.

Bump:


ScubaSteve said:


> I've also been keeping up with the updates...keep em' coming!


Thanks ScubaSteve, I just have to say that you win the forum for best screen name! I wonder how many people have tried to use ScubaSteve as their name on here. I should have an update tomorrow with the flood light setup. I started on it last night but ran into a stumbling block.


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

tatersalad said:


> That controller sounds really cool, I think I am going to have to get one of those for sure. How are you liking the DCT-8000? That's what I have also and I've been really pleased with it. My kids like the "feed" function, they think it's neat when it ramps back up.
> 
> Bump:
> 
> Thanks ScubaSteve, I just have to say that you win the forum for best screen name! I wonder how many people have tried to use ScubaSteve as their name on here. I should have an update tomorrow with the flood light setup. I started on it last night but ran into a stumbling block.




I love my inkbird controller and would easily pay the $30-40 for another one if the day comes when it stops functioning. It is cheap and effective. Easy to read and program. I have a review you can find in equipment with a video showing the setup in real time as well. Nothing fancy on my end.


I love my DCT-8000. I am running it on full blast as well. Zero complaints my friend. 2000gph makes some excellent flow! The ability to dial it in is nice as well, if needed. I have no other flow in the tank so I'm pushing it. The feed function is pretty nice as well. Hit it, drop food, walk away. Hearing it ramp back up actually gets me excited. I love messing with the equipment.


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

Bump: 

Thanks ScubaSteve, I just have to say that you win the forum for best screen name! I wonder how many people have tried to use ScubaSteve as their name on here. I should have an update tomorrow with the flood light setup. I started on it last night but ran into a stumbling block.[/QUOTE]

Haha! Thanks! Although, tatersalad is a pretty good one as well...lol.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Update with Pics of DIY dual LED floods*

Ok, got a chance to finish up the aluminum brackets for the LED floods last night. These are 60watt LED floods that I got on Amazon. They had some decent reviews and I noticed that "king of DIY" from Youtube used these lights on a couple of his builds so I thought I would give them a try. He compared the 60 watt version to one of the Kessel lights he had and it was very close. At approx. $30 each it's worth it. Anyway, here are the pics of the setup on the tank. The only thing I have to do is paint the bracket black because I noticed with it in place it is so close to the Finnex lights that they glare off the shiny aluminum. I plan on doing these floods for a 3-4 hour burst mid-day. I will not have these on all the time. As with everything on planted tanks, I will just be experimenting with timing and placement till I find a combo that works for me. My water is still pretty cloudy at this point, tank has only been up a week and a half.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*UPDATE: Been Awhile!*

Ok folks, been awhile since I've taken the time to update my journal. I thought I would try to take care of some of this today as I've been messing around with the tank for the last couple of hours. Just got 10 small discus today! Went to a very nice woman about an hour and a half away from me that breeds her own. She also has been breeding them in water that is very similar to my water, and she's been doing it with 78-79 degree water as well. I have had this tank running that temp since I first set it up in hopes that I would be able to get some discus one day. 
So besides all of that, I finally got everything tucked away under the stand well enough for a photo. The sump is being utilized to the max. I have a chamber for mechanical filtration and one for biological along with a larger center section that houses the dual 150 watt heaters and my CO2/UV sterilizer closed loop system. I am running my Rex Griggs style reactor with a 400GPH pump which then passes on through an externally mounted Odyesea 18 watt UV.
I also managed to get myself setup with an Auto Top Off system that works for me. I found a 7.5 gallon trashcan at Wal-Mart that fits into my last cabinent of the stand perfectly. I fill it up once a week and I have one of the TOM aqua lift pumps on a digital timer that runs the pump for 20 minutes a day which equates to approx. 1 gallon of water topped off a day.
So far the tank is doing well, I do change water once a week still and yes my spider wood is still giving off tannin which is fine with me. Right now the tank has 4 cory cats, 6 clown loaches, 6 cardinals, 1 really cool twig catfish, 3 Otos, and 10 half dollar size discus. I have kept fish for many years but with this tank I have tried to keep a couple of varieties that I have never kept before, those being the discus and the clown loaches and the twig cat.
Thanks for looking.


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

Looking good tatersalad! I love your setup and I'm anxious to see how well your discus do. I don't know much about them, but I think it's pretty cool there were bred in cooler water temps. What are your other parameters? PH, etc?


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

I tested the breeder's water and mine and the pH was close to 7.4. My water parameters were pretty close to hers. I think since these fish and their parents were tank raised I will have a better chance for survival. Plus they only ever traveled once in a 5 gallon bucket with a lid for about an hour and a half. I was also lucky that she was feeding them a blackworm flake that is easy to get online.


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

tatersalad said:


> I tested the breeder's water and mine and the pH was close to 7.4. My water parameters were pretty close to hers. I think since these fish and their parents were tank raised I will have a better chance for survival. Plus they only ever traveled once in a 5 gallon bucket with a lid for about an hour and a half. I was also lucky that she was feeding them a blackworm flake that is easy to get online.


Nice...sometimes I wonder if it is really as hard to keep Discus, as some say it is:wink2:. Keep us posted on their progress and don't forget to show some pics!


----------



## BettaBettas (Aug 21, 2016)

I wanted discus so bad, but I refrained after tons of research. realized apparently only certain plants can be kept with them and im more of a plant guy


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

BettaBettas said:


> I wanted discus so bad, but I refrained after tons of research. realized apparently only certain plants can be kept with them and im more of a plant guy


That's why I liked the idea of these discus being bred at lower temps. More plant choices!!!:smile2:


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

Glad to see so much progress! I was so tempted to buy discus myself, but the water change schedule is impractical for me. I settled on rainbows. Good luck with it all. I'm excited to see the tank age along side mine and see how it all turns out. I tend to follow similar builds while I'm working on a project. I did notice you are using a timer and not float switches for the ATO, any reason there? Seems like it will take tuning during times of the year with higher evaporation.


----------



## BettaBettas (Aug 21, 2016)

Freemananana said:


> buy discus myself.


That would have been neat to see in your tank!


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> Glad to see so much progress! I was so tempted to buy discus myself, but the water change schedule is impractical for me. I settled on rainbows. Good luck with it all. I'm excited to see the tank age along side mine and see how it all turns out. I tend to follow similar builds while I'm working on a project. I did notice you are using a timer and not float switches for the ATO, any reason there? Seems like it will take tuning during times of the year with higher evaporation.


That's a very good point, I would imagine I may have to increase/decrease the time at some points during the year. I guess the deal with the float switches just seemed like a point to fail for me. I've had several mechanical and digital timers over the years and had great success with them in other situations. My job requires me to work on industrial float switches at times and the failure rate in my experience has been higher. I guess it was just my personal choice honestly, but I'm sure if you had a setup with two floats in case one failed it would be just fine. They may be what I end up doing before it is all said and done. This venture into this almost fully automated tank setup is kind of a learn as you go for me. That Inkbird controller has been awesome, I don't know why anyone would try to run 2 or more heaters without one.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

ScubaSteve said:


> Nice...sometimes I wonder if it is really as hard to keep Discus, as some say it is:wink2:. Keep us posted on their progress and don't forget to show some pics!


I talked with the breeder during my visit about the requirements for keeping discus. We discussed keeping them in a planted tank. She informed me that the only reason she did not have a display tank in the house with plants and discus is because she never had time to take care of the plants properly. She spends her time doing water changes for all those grow out tanks full of baby discus. She also explained to me that alot of the hype that went around the hobby in the 80s and 90s with discus were related to the fact that most of them on the market were wild discus. She said with the advent of the internet and the access we all have to information regarding just about anything we now can talk to someone who has kept Discus in environments other than 86 degrees and 90% water changes everyday. 
I just decided to make up my mind and go for it. I got these 10 fish for $150, so my investment is not quite as large as some folks regarding the stocking of their tanks. I looked at it like this: I've been keeping fish for at least 20 years and plants for probably 15 of those, I've always wanted them and I'm not getting any younger so I will try them out. LOL


----------



## Greggz (May 19, 2008)

tatersalad said:


> I looked at it like this: I've been keeping fish for at least 20 years and plants for probably 15 of those, I've always wanted them and I'm not getting any younger so I will try them out. LOL


Good luck and I will be watching your thread. I've thought about keeping Discus many times, but never got around to it. I hope everything works out well. Keep the updates coming.


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

tatersalad said:


> I talked with the breeder during my visit about the requirements for keeping discus. We discussed keeping them in a planted tank. She informed me that the only reason she did not have a display tank in the house with plants and discus is because she never had time to take care of the plants properly. She spends her time doing water changes for all those grow out tanks full of baby discus. She also explained to me that alot of the hype that went around the hobby in the 80s and 90s with discus were related to the fact that most of them on the market were wild discus. She said with the advent of the internet and the access we all have to information regarding just about anything we now can talk to someone who has kept Discus in environments other than 86 degrees and 90% water changes everyday.
> I just decided to make up my mind and go for it. I got these 10 fish for $150, so my investment is not quite as large as some folks regarding the stocking of their tanks. I looked at it like this: I've been keeping fish for at least 20 years and plants for probably 15 of those, I've always wanted them and I'm not getting any younger so I will try them out. LOL


Well, I for one am happy you decided to keep them. I think you can do it and will be following your progress!


----------



## slythy (Sep 1, 2015)

Hows that reactor working out for you? I had to add a second one for my tank.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

slythy said:


> Hows that reactor working out for you? I had to add a second one for my tank.


It's going good, I have the output of the reactor plumbed up through an external 18watt UV sterilizer and back into the same section of the sump. I have the control valve on the output of the reactor wide open. I was running a smaller Griggs style reactor on my 65 before I got this tank and I just left my needle valve on the CO2 in the same position to start this new tank. I ended up just barely turning it up some to get my drop checker the color I wanted. I also checked PH in this tank and when the CO2 has been on for a couple of hours I am getting approx. 1 point of PH drop from night time when the CO2 is gone.
One thing I have noticed with having a sump, my drop checker is actually going all the way back to blue during the night. This is something that I never achieved with a canister filter/griggs reactor setup. I think that this means that there is more O2 being put into the water with a sump than with a canister. I think this allows you more of a "grace period" with your CO2. Meaning, I think you are less likely to gas all your fish with a sump setup vs. canister.


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

I believe what you've stated was the presumed thought amongst most. There is a lot more agitation to bring the O2 levels back up to atmosphere with a sump than a closed loop canister. I think it is a win-win situation if the amount of CO2 you have to add to the tank isn't cost prohibitive, which it doesn't seem to be in your case.


----------



## slythy (Sep 1, 2015)

I run my co2 24/7, it takes so long to drop back down 1 point that i just leave it on all the time. Im sure i go through a bit more but thats ok, thats why i bought a 35# bottle.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

slythy said:


> I run my co2 24/7, it takes so long to drop back down 1 point that i just leave it on all the time. Im sure i go through a bit more but thats ok, thats why i bought a 35# bottle.


I just recently adjusted my lighting/CO2 schedule because of algae on the glass. I'm doing 8 hours of the Finnex Fugeray Planted + and 4 hours in the middle with the two 60 watt LED floods. I may end up cutting the floods back even more, they penetrate all the way to the bottom of this deep tank, but honestly I don't have any plants that are that light demanding.
I have my CO2 come on 2 hours before the Finnex lights and cut off 2 hours before the Finnex lights cut off. 
Let me ask you this: how do you have your overflows setup in your tank? I couldn't tell from your journal. That could be the difference maker, if the water is coming through the teeth of the overflow and falling a couple of inches before being siphoned out then you could be losing alot there. With my pipe setup the level in the overflow is very close to the level in the main tank so the water does not fall at all. Also, inside your sump is the water having to fall very far from weir to weir? I am running an ATO that keeps the sump water level pretty stable to combat that falling of water. These are just my experiences so far with CO2 and a sump. My main concern when I was building all of this was not really to combat CO2 loss but to cut down on the waterfall noise. I wanted the sump to be as quite as possible.
I will try to take some up close pics tonight to better illustrate what I am trying to say.

Bump: Well, I tried to get some decent pics of my Discus. As you can see, I am still fighting algae on the glass. Kinda makes it hard to get a good pic. These fish are light little pets, every time you come up to the tank they think you are going to feed them. They come up and beg for food. We've been feeding them twice a day with a good blackworm flake that pretty much everything in my tank loves. And the orange Discus do not have deformed mouths, they both have a little black "mustache" on their face. Kinda goofy looking!


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*UPDATE: New Lighting/Tank Shots*

Well, I just never got to like the LED floodlights I have had installed on this tank. The light from them was just to yellow compared to the Finnex planted +. So I got 2 more of the Finnex Fugeray Planted+ lights. I like the look now, the fish seem to have a good color and I can see all the way to the back of the tank now.
I also tried to get some more pics of the fish and a full tank shot. 
As far as equipment goes, everything is working well. The ATO seems to be keeping up for the time being, but I have already purchased parts to build my own ATO with floats and relays and alarms and stuff. I will post an update with photos of that build as well. So far my plan is to have a float to control level in the sump main chamber and have an alarm float in the first filter chamber to warn when filters become clogged to the point that the water level in that chamber is about to overflow. I have barely caught this issue twice now. I have two layers of poly batting under one good layer of poret foam. I have been making it approx. a week and a half before being forced to change out the batting and rinse the foam. I attribute this to the small size of my sump. I believe that a larger sump with larger chambers would give me more time before having to change the poly batting out. One up to it though, I have crystal clear water because the filters get changed out weekly. Good thing poly batting is so cheap!
Hope y'all enjoy.


----------



## sharambil (Nov 15, 2016)

Discus will not grow well in that tank... 2.5 inch discus should be fed 5 times a day, a hearty protein mix in order to grow to proper size... those will not grow past 4 inches in that tank. Organics will get stuck within the plants and rockwork, increasing TDS, slowing discus growth. If you had purchased 5 medium- full grown discus, you would be fine. By the time you feed discus at that size and grow them out to 5 inches, the costs of buying small are more expensive than buying the full grown adults.

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

sharambil said:


> Discus will not grow well in that tank... 2.5 inch discus should be fed 5 times a day, a hearty protein mix in order to grow to proper size... those will not grow past 4 inches in that tank. Organics will get stuck within the plants and rockwork, increasing TDS, slowing discus growth. If you had purchased 5 medium- full grown discus, you would be fine. By the time you feed discus at that size and grow them out to 5 inches, the costs of buying small are more expensive than buying the full grown adults.
> 
> Just my 2 cents.


I was waiting for the first person to bash me for having small discus in a planted tank! Congratulations! You are the winner!
I'm good with 4 inch discus and I'm not trying to make these fish grow to 6 inches inside of a year so that I can sell them off. I'm just a hobbyist enjoying my hobby, which is not breeding/selling fish.


----------



## cooledwhip (Apr 3, 2016)

tatersalad said:


> I was waiting for the first person to bash me for having small discus in a planted tank! Congratulations! You are the winner!
> I'm good with 4 inch discus and I'm not trying to make these fish grow to 6 inches inside of a year so that I can sell them off. I'm just a hobbyist enjoying my hobby, which is not breeding/selling fish.


I believe the point he is trying to make is stunting their growth is harmful to their health... like how they make veal?
or cage chickens?


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

cooledwhip said:


> I believe the point he is trying to make is stunting their growth is harmful to their health... like how they make veal?
> or cage chickens?


Well if that was the case then wouldn't we all need like 400 gallon tanks to house 2 neons because they would be limited because of the size of their glass cage?
I mean we are all raising fish inside of a glass box on this forum. I don't understand why one breed of fish seems to get more attention than others. The breeder I got my fish from had a breeding pair in a 20 gallon tall and they were breeding every time she took the fry out of the tank. And they were over 6". And she had been doing this for over 25 years.
Yes, I think housing 2 goldfish in a less than one gallon fish bowl is cruel. But 10 small Discus in a 120 gallon seems on par with what most common sense minded people are doing.


----------



## sharambil (Nov 15, 2016)

tatersalad said:


> Well if that was the case then wouldn't we all need like 400 gallon tanks to house 2 neons because they would be limited because of the size of their glass cage?
> I mean we are all raising fish inside of a glass box on this forum. I don't understand why one breed of fish seems to get more attention than others. The breeder I got my fish from had a breeding pair in a 20 gallon tall and they were breeding every time she took the fry out of the tank. And they were over 6". And she had been doing this for over 25 years.
> Yes, I think housing 2 goldfish in a less than one gallon fish bowl is cruel. But 10 small Discus in a 120 gallon seems on par with what most common sense minded people are doing.



She is housing a pair in a 20 tall, keep in mind that both fish are at a large size. If you want pretty discus, with an actual shape resembling a disc and not a triangle, I would suggest reconsidering. 

If you can't properly care for the fish, seem like you don't really care, and you knew this stuff before hand, I feel ashamed...


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

sharambil said:


> She is housing a pair in a 20 tall, keep in mind that both fish are at a large size. If you want pretty discus, with an actual shape resembling a disc and not a triangle, I would suggest reconsidering.
> 
> If you can't properly care for the fish, seem like you don't really care, and you knew this stuff before hand, I feel ashamed...


Now I remember why I didn't do a journal on my last big tank. It's amazing how I post all these pics of me putting this tank together, building the overflow, modifying the stand, building a co2 reactor, all the plumbing and stuff and basically 2 people looked at those and commented.
Post one group of pics of the fish I am keeping and all of the sudden I start getting bashed for keeping Discus. No wonder everyone is scared to keep these fish, the internet discus police will come take them away from you if they aren't shaped perfectly and growing at an acceptable rate.


----------



## sharambil (Nov 15, 2016)

You do you. I'll do me. I think that the rest of your build is fantastic, but your choice of stock in terms of decoration and fish was poor. That is all I wanted to say. You realize the issue, which means I got my point across.


----------



## Freemananana (Jan 2, 2015)

tatersalad said:


> Now I remember why I didn't do a journal on my last big tank. It's amazing how I post all these pics of me putting this tank together, building the overflow, modifying the stand, building a co2 reactor, all the plumbing and stuff and basically 2 people looked at those and commented.
> Post one group of pics of the fish I am keeping and all of the sudden I start getting bashed for keeping Discus. No wonder everyone is scared to keep these fish, the internet discus police will come take them away from you if they aren't shaped perfectly and growing at an acceptable rate.


As one of those people that checked in, the hardware and plumbing is my favorite part and I'll take this as an honorable mention. :grin2:


Don't let anyone dictate your hobby. It seems like you're letting some minor criticism get the best of you. I tend to not post a lot of my other hobbies on forums because what I do isn't in line with the popular opinion. But a lot of popular opinion stuff is a fad or just safe advice for new hobbyists. I had a late 80's Honda with a body kit and legitimately had people on the internet tell me I should either rip the body kit off or kill myself. I, at the time, enjoyed the body kit though and ignore their input and ended up leaving that site behind. I did everything else "right" according to the forum though. I had quality turbo parts, high end suspension, etc but the body kit ruined the entire car because it wasn't in line with the popular opinion. Chalk this up to something similar. 


The bottom line is you're keeping fish. They aren't exactly main stream pets. There are many more, much more cruel, keepers out there. You're firmly in the gray zone. I bought 20 rainbowfish and 20 corys and many of those didn't make it. Easy enough to blame shipping or the shipper, but it could have easily been my fault. Very little criticism aimed at me though. You're making a fair effort. Time will tell if it is an inappropriate environment.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Freemananana said:


> As one of those people that checked in, the hardware and plumbing is my favorite part and I'll take this as an honorable mention. :grin2:
> 
> 
> Don't let anyone dictate your hobby. It seems like you're letting some minor criticism get the best of you. I tend to not post a lot of my other hobbies on forums because what I do isn't in line with the popular opinion. But a lot of popular opinion stuff is a fad or just safe advice for new hobbyists. I had a late 80's Honda with a body kit and legitimately had people on the internet tell me I should either rip the body kit off or kill myself. I, at the time, enjoyed the body kit though and ignore their input and ended up leaving that site behind. I did everything else "right" according to the forum though. I had quality turbo parts, high end suspension, etc but the body kit ruined the entire car because it wasn't in line with the popular opinion. Chalk this up to something similar.
> ...


Thanks Freemananana, I totally understand your situation with the Honda. As far as these fish go, I've had them a month now and I've been doing all my water changes and providing good food for them. I haven't seen any bad things with these fish yet. You are right, time will tell though. I tend to be the way you are, I have always believed that there is more than one way to do something right.
You are correct, I shouldn't let people's criticism get to me. I was expecting it really and should have done a better job handling it.


----------



## reddhawkk (Dec 28, 2011)

I just came across this thread and read all of it. Great tank and info! The reason I read it is because I am going to be putting together a new tank with a sump, and I have never done a sump. As far as others bashing your choice of livestock or decoration, well, everyone has an opinion but that doesn't mean it needs to be shared. Great tank.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

reddhawkk said:


> I just came across this thread and read all of it. Great tank and info! The reason I read it is because I am going to be putting together a new tank with a sump, and I have never done a sump. As far as others bashing your choice of livestock or decoration, well, everyone has an opinion but that doesn't mean it needs to be shared. Great tank.


Good luck on your sump design! After having this sump setup for a few months now my only regret is not springing for the PVC gate valve for my main drain line. I put a regular ball valve from Lowe's on it and I regret that every time I have to adjust it. You can really dial in your flow with a gate valve. The ball valve just pops over and moves too far. You'll like having a sump, it gives you immediate access to all your filter media and you won't have a bunch of heaters and pipes hanging over in your tank.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

Update


----------



## geektom (Dec 17, 2012)

Gorgeous! I love all that big, healthy jungle val!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

Looks great!


----------



## The Dude1 (Jun 17, 2016)

Tank looks killer... and quite frankly if I ever work up the nerve to try Discus I would do exactly as you have done. Sometimes you can't do EVERYTHING perfectly and you are left to do your best. Your best in this case is pretty freaking awesome! 
Any new shots of the Discus?


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

The Dude1 said:


> Tank looks killer... and quite frankly if I ever work up the nerve to try Discus I would do exactly as you have done. Sometimes you can't do EVERYTHING perfectly and you are left to do your best. Your best in this case is pretty freaking awesome!
> Any new shots of the Discus?





ScubaSteve said:


> Looks great!





geektom said:


> Gorgeous! I love all that big, healthy jungle val!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Thanks everyone, next time I will get some pics of the Discus as well. Thanks!


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

*Fish Pics*

Tried to get some decent pics, I'm fighting algae right now. Ended up getting 4 more larger Discus online and they have done well, I removed all of the smaller Discus from this tank and did some trading with a friend. This tank has a black background and black gravel.
Thanks for looking


----------



## The Dude1 (Jun 17, 2016)

I'm no discus expert, but those look awesome! How many do you have total?


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

The Dude1 said:


> I'm no discus expert, but those look awesome! How many do you have total?


I have 5 that are all this size. There is a cobalt blue that wouldn't come out for pictures. He lost interest when he figured out I wasn't feeding him


----------



## ScubaSteve (Jun 30, 2012)

Nice...beautiful fish...are they eating well?


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

ScubaSteve said:


> Nice...beautiful fish...are they eating well?


Yea, a couple of them can bullies at times during feeding but for the most part everyone gets their fill. They enjoy the blackworm flake and I also feed frozen bloodworms and beefheart. They really like the bloodworms.


----------



## DigityDog70 (Jan 20, 2017)

Your tank and those fish look amazing it looks like you've embraced the responsibility of raising the Discus and things are progressing. How do you like the Val now? I use to like Val, in small patches it looks nice, but I don't like how it takes over a tank. I ended up removing "all of the Val" in all of my tanks. 

I have been reading your journal and Freemanana's as well without posting or commenting many times, so know that it's appreciated. 

If you ever do get a chance to zoom in on your chamber where the CO2 reactor is and the plumbing, I still have 2-3 months left before my tank arrives and I'd love to look closer at your sump and see how you have it plumbed. I can see most all of it, but I can't quite figure out the flow with the co2 reactor Perhaps in my hunt for it, I just haven't identified it and I'm looking right at it?), not that I want to replicate it exactly, but it's definitely an achievement worth a closer look. The delivery of Co2 is an accomplishment that I aim to master at some point. Albeit I had one of those MixMax Co2 reactor/injectors powered by a 210gph mini pump, it didn't matter where I put my drop checker, it could be juxtaposed to the injector or clear across my 55gal tank in a corner completely away from the path of the current and it would turn green. Without hi-jacking your thread, I'd love to install a spray bar as well but I also think a tank with Co2 bubbles rising to the surface throughout a tank look stellar 

I have a 180Gal tank (per Custom Cages) at 72"L x 30"H x 18D and I've yet to design my stand or sump. I also like that you used glass baffles in the "glass" tank, something simple I think a lot of people overlook(they try to use acrylic to save a few bucks, which isn't a best practice, as I am confident you well know (acrylic absorbs water and will bloat potentially cracking). Glass should be used with glass in my opinion. I also really like your idea of the auto fill/top off system. I want to see what I can come up with. I am pretty sure my tank will be sitting atop a stand at the 36" mark? In my opinion, a lot of tanks just sit too low at the 27"-30" mark.


----------



## tatersalad (Dec 7, 2011)

DigityDog70 said:


> Your tank and those fish look amazing it looks like you've embraced the responsibility of raising the Discus and things are progressing. How do you like the Val now? I use to like Val, in small patches it looks nice, but I don't like how it takes over a tank. I ended up removing "all of the Val" in all of my tanks.
> 
> I have been reading your journal and Freemanana's as well without posting or commenting many times, so know that it's appreciated.
> 
> ...


I am so sorry that it took so long for me to reply to this post. I just never made it back over here to update things. I tried my best to get some pics for you of the sump workings this morning and I just decided to do a video instead. My CO2 reactor loop is using a small 400gph pump that pumps sump water through the reactor and out through a ball valve and up to my external UV sterilizer then back into the sump with the output from all of this pointing at the suction of my main return pump. I ended up going with an ATO that I purchased from autotopoff.com. They are here in Texas and make a pretty robust and simple setup. I use their float switch and relay setup paired with a small TOM Aqualifter pump. It works well and keeps a constant level in the sump. I believe this is important for achieving good CO2 saturation. With this setup I have the CO2 level I prefer and a 10lb tank lasts approximately 4 months. I ended up using all the pieces that I had purchased for a homemade ATO to make a homemade sump level alarm. In the first chamber where the water enters from the display tank, I have my mechanical filtration. As this media becomes more and more dirty, it takes longer for the water to pass through it, thus increasing the level in that chamber. I have this alarm float setup in this chamber to notify me when it is time to change out/clean the filter media. This float is hooked up to a beeper with an audible alarm that will wake you up from a sleep. 
As far as the main tank goes, I really regret planting the jungle vals. I have since removed almost all of them and I plan to have them all out during the next water change probably this weekend. They over ran the entire tank and it looked horrible. My fish stayed hidden all the time and it just wasn't as enjoyable to look at as I had envisioned it in my mind. One hurdle in this big tanks that I think goes unmentioned is the fact that you need a decent flow throughout the tank for proper plant growth and to combat algae. I ended up biulding two new spray bars for mine that had less holes for more increased pressure and flow. This allowed me to have more flow in the main tank while at the same time dialing back my return pump. This DC powered return pump is very quite throughout most of it's range, but it is the most quite when it is not running full blast. By decreasing the number of holes in my spray bars I was able to dial back the pump to around 80% power and now you cannot hear it running at all. I did end up adding two small fans inside the tank to help with circulation in hard to get to places. 
Well, I hope this info helps you and I hope the video will allow you to see something you may not have been able to see in the previous pics.
Thanks

sump setup vid by tatersalad1999, on Flickr


----------



## BeeBop (Nov 4, 2017)

Looking great. I have enjoyed your journal. Getting ready for my first planted tank.


----------



## DigityDog70 (Jan 20, 2017)

Thanks, I plan to read this at least a few more times, but wanted to express my gratitude for your efforts! 


Cheers,
DD


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------

