# 5-Gallon tank too small for breeding RCS?



## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

I'm hoping to get away with breeding red cherry shrimp with my little 5 gallon fluval chi, be it "De-Chi'd." I had to buy a proper filter and a light that isn't constantly in the water growing algae. Dang thing cost too much, but I do like the shape of the tank.

Anyways, this tank is in my room upstairs, and I live in the midwest where temperatures often fluctuate. This is fine by me, but not so cool for shrimp I hear. I know a 10 gallon would probably be stable enough to definitely breed shrimp, and my impression is that 5 gallons is pushing it. They have moss, drift wood, and a couple other live plants in there with them. I'm doing the best I can with them, but that said I am not monitoring the TDS and the PH/KH. Seems like a pain and yet another expense to be monitoring those, while people say they just like stable parameters. Well, it's easier to just keep the parameters stable than to try and monitor and modify the params. Also I guess I want to prove that, at least with RCS, you can just have stable parameters and your shrimp will be fine. No need for your fancy TDS meter and PH test kits. Keep in mind I am somewhat of an experimenter. I'm not interested in babying my shrimp all the time. Besides, I want them to be tough. I don't even acclimate them. I went 12 for 12 last time I just threw 12 in there all at once! (They all survived!)

I was wondering if you guys think it would be interesting to insulate the tank. I really don't want to uproot all my plants and the gravel and everything to transplant this whole thing into a 10 gallon. But I want to keep the temperature more stable. Is there any way to do that? Or is it possible to be breeding RCS in a 5-gallon tank with some slight-moderate temperature changes?


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## SKYE.__.HIGH (Mar 18, 2017)

TBH I guess they might not like it but to bad to sad, they will survive. Their is a shrimp for sale thread that all the sudden gained popularity and the only breeding tank he has is a Fluval spec v which is 5.5 gallons. He said that he has had up to one thousand in that tank all at once which I think is unbelievable. But he is shipping the shrimp out my packs of 25 and he posted a picture of walls of boxes that he is sending out. So It goes to show you that you can actually breed shrimp in a 5 gallon. He is actually making money off of it.


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## ichthyogeek (Jul 9, 2014)

Would RCS in this case be Red Crystal Shrimp (Caridina), or Red Cherry Shrimp (Neocaridina)? Because I never check the pH on my cherry shrimp tank lol.

Aren't there small heaters meant for 5 gallon tanks? Why not just buy one of those?


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## natemcnutty (May 26, 2016)

Insulation does work to a degree, but your primary issue is the water surface that you also rely on for gas exchange.

Add a clip fan to keep temps down if needed, but no need for a heater unless you are keeping cardinals. I keep CRS in my spec v at work which ranges temps from 64 up to 76. Had a good 50 or so RCS in there previously before switching to CRS


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## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

natemcnutty said:


> Insulation does work to a degree, but your primary issue is the water surface that you also rely on for gas exchange.
> 
> Add a clip fan to keep temps down if needed, but no need for a heater unless you are keeping cardinals. I keep CRS in my spec v at work which ranges temps from 64 up to 76. Had a good 50 or so RCS in there previously before switching to CRS


Is there any way to insulate the sides of the tank? May seem silly because then I wouldn't be able to look into the tank...uh...as well. But I'd like to know if that possibility exists.

Also, considering this coming winter, I figured I might have to buy a heater. My question is can I get a little heater that can actually regulate the temperature? As in not constantly heat...


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## sfsamm (Apr 3, 2017)

OK I have a very healthy prolifically breeding group of RCS (Red Cherry Shrimp or neocardinia, CRS is Crystal Red Shrimp or cardina) is well outside recommend parameters that went through a blistering summer while my cooling unit was not functioning properly and in the midst of it all got dumped into a different 10 gallon when their tank sprung a leak and then jostled back to theirs once I had it replaced. I don't use special water, I use the tap and only treat the water with dechlorinator, pH 8-8.2, kH 10-12, gH 15 solid. Temps I have a heater set at 74 but this summer they went through night and day temp swings right along with me where their daytime temps were up as high as 84 at one point but generally were between 80-82 and this wasn't a couple weeks this was just over 2 months of this.

My five when I got it replaced and running again I culled my population down and added my 11 best shrimp that was 4-5 weeks ago and I have those 11 plus uncountable shrimplets (I'd venture at least 60 already and that's very conservative) and the ladies (I added 1 male, 10 females) are hatching eggs at a rate of one lady every 3-5 days. Also to note I really don't hardly feed, I have a long photo period on the tank and most anything I drop to feed will rot so it's removed within a few hours, I try once or twice a week. The shrimplets absolutely love krill day and devour their frozen krill that adults would rather eat naturally growing stuff in the tank.

Just get an adjustable heater and set it at 72-74 and let them do their thing. Then you don't have to worry about the cold and summer temps well crack the lid and allow for evap or add a fan blowing across of its outrageously warm and they (at least mine) are fine. I would NEVER recommend the same treatment to work for nay cardinas or any of the long lined specialty colors of neos either. They ARE much more particular on a plastic aspects of their tank parameters and that's why I don't keep them.


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## AquaAurora (Jul 10, 2013)

I had an odd experience with my shrimp (mix from fire red to cherry), tried keeping/breeding in 3g tanks but they just kept dieing off. Tossed remaining 5-7 into a 12g long to be food for a dwarf puffer.. dwarf puffer would not eat them (only snails and live black worms) and the shrimp population exploded to a few hundred! Puffer has since passed away but shrimp going strong in 12g even with several tank tear down and rescapes.
I think the larger water volume gave added stability/less flux from water changes/air temp changes.
ph 7.5, gh kh 30, 70, temps 74-76


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## clownplanted (Mar 3, 2017)

ichthyogeek said:


> Would RCS in this case be Red Crystal Shrimp (Caridina), or Red Cherry Shrimp (Neocaridina)? Because I never check the pH on my cherry shrimp tank lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Aren't there small heaters meant for 5 gallon tanks? Why not just buy one of those?




RCS are red cherry shrimp. Neocaridina. CRS are crystal red shrimp. Caridina. Both require different water parameters. 

Red Cherry Shrimp are much hardier than CRS. 


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## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

sfsamm said:


> OK I have a very healthy prolifically breeding group of RCS (Red Cherry Shrimp or neocardinia, CRS is Crystal Red Shrimp or cardina) is well outside recommend parameters that went through a blistering summer while my cooling unit was not functioning properly and in the midst of it all got dumped into a different 10 gallon when their tank sprung a leak and then jostled back to theirs once I had it replaced. I don't use special water, I use the tap and only treat the water with dechlorinator, pH 8-8.2, kH 10-12, gH 15 solid. Temps I have a heater set at 74 but this summer they went through night and day temp swings right along with me where their daytime temps were up as high as 84 at one point but generally were between 80-82 and this wasn't a couple weeks this was just over 2 months of this.
> 
> My five when I got it replaced and running again I culled my population down and added my 11 best shrimp that was 4-5 weeks ago and I have those 11 plus uncountable shrimplets (I'd venture at least 60 already and that's very conservative) and the ladies (I added 1 male, 10 females) are hatching eggs at a rate of one lady every 3-5 days. Also to note I really don't hardly feed, I have a long photo period on the tank and most anything I drop to feed will rot so it's removed within a few hours, I try once or twice a week. The shrimplets absolutely love krill day and devour their frozen krill that adults would rather eat naturally growing stuff in the tank.
> 
> Just get an adjustable heater and set it at 72-74 and let them do their thing. Then you don't have to worry about the cold and summer temps well crack the lid and allow for evap or add a fan blowing across of its outrageously warm and they (at least mine) are fine. I would NEVER recommend the same treatment to work for nay cardinas or any of the long lined specialty colors of neos either. They ARE much more particular on a plastic aspects of their tank parameters and that's why I don't keep them.


Ok so it seems like I should get an adjustable heater. In the winter, I think it's a given that the temp will drop. And instead of that happening, I could be at a nice 72 degrees. So with a cold room and the heater on...it might be more stable. At least that's what I'm hoping.

Do you guys have any specific recommendations for a model of heater for a 5 gallon such as mine? Something small and cheap would be nice.


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## sfsamm (Apr 3, 2017)

Anything adjustable, which means you'll probably end up in a 100w but if you can find a brand you've heard of in 50w adjustable it should be good also. Hydor makes a good one in 50w I believe, but don't ever leave it on during a water change, all my hydors I've had over the years cracked the instant the water was half down and they were on... I occasionally forget to hit the switch in my sponge filter tanks. I really like them otherwise they are very accurate.  

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## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

sfsamm said:


> Anything adjustable, which means you'll probably end up in a 100w but if you can find a brand you've heard of in 50w adjustable it should be good also. Hydor makes a good one in 50w I believe, but don't ever leave it on during a water change, all my hydors I've had over the years cracked the instant the water was half down and they were on... I occasionally forget to hit the switch in my sponge filter tanks. I really like them otherwise they are very accurate.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


100 or 50 watts sounds like too much. For a 5 gallon tank? That brand also makes a 25 watt adjustable heater...


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## sfsamm (Apr 3, 2017)

I always use 10w per gallon minimum... But until a couple years ago lived basically on the Canadian border and we had very very cold winters, never had luck with less keeping tanks at temp. 

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## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

sfsamm said:


> I always use 10w per gallon minimum... But until a couple years ago lived basically on the Canadian border and we had very very cold winters, never had luck with less keeping tanks at temp.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Ok I got the 50 watt Hydor heater. It was only 2 more bucks than the 25 watt, so...yeah. It's worth 2 bucks to have less anxiety about keeping them warm.


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## natemcnutty (May 26, 2016)

Well, let's just hope your heater doesn't get stuck on and cook your shrimp. I still stand by you don't need a heater in a neo or caridina tank. It's the heat you want to be careful of 

As for insulation, but some cheap foam board insulation from a home improvement store. 1/2" or larger should be fine.

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## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

natemcnutty said:


> Well, let's just hope your heater doesn't get stuck on and cook your shrimp. I still stand by you don't need a heater in a neo or caridina tank. It's the heat you want to be careful of
> 
> As for insulation, but some cheap foam board insulation from a home improvement store. 1/2" or larger should be fine.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


At least I'll have some shrimp to eat and some very expensive omelets! Ha.

Well, I think I read that they aren't supposed to go down any lower than 57 degrees. Also, like I said, I'm hoping the heater can actually provide added stability since we have nature cooling it and the heater heating it. Right now it is just whatever. No cooler, no heater. If I turn the AC on, they might drop a couple of degrees. I can't shake the feeling that they don't like that.

And it gets better: We use a wood-burning oven sometimes to heat the house. The ooooold fashioned way! This throws off the thermostat and it can make my room very cold. So yeah during the day it has heaters, though I'm not sure how 'warm' the agreed temperature is going to be this year.

Anyways, we'll see. Maybe it'll be kind of a waste, but for 18 bucks...there's some kind of floor to the temperature. Somehow I think they'll appreciate 72 degree water in the winter. And if the temp of the room never gets higher than that, we're in stable water city!


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## KleineVampir (Aug 29, 2017)

Guys now that it's getting a little cooler, finally under 70 even, I've had the chance to try out that 50 watt Hydor heater. I have it turned way down to what's probably about 67 degrees, but it's keeping my tank at 75. It says you're supposed to wait a day, and I haven't yet, but it's been on since this morning and it's been 75 this whole time. 75 isn't too bad but it really bothers me that it's apparently completely inaccurate. I thought it was supposed to sense the temperature of the water and only turn on if needed to heat it. It's almost cranked all the way down and I still have a temperature that's more in the middle of the dial. Honestly that's pretty annoying and disappointing. It has one job, and it can't even do it. Pathetic. Did I get too big of a heater? I mean, sure I won't have to worry about them freezing now, but now I have a more general worry about them actually getting too hot. And 75 is ok but I'd prefer a bit cooler than that.

Also it's annoying that they just changed the dial numbers from celcius to fahrenheit. So the marked numbers are all strange, like 71 to 75 to 79.


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## natemcnutty (May 26, 2016)

KleineVampir said:


> Guys now that it's getting a little cooler, finally under 70 even, I've had the chance to try out that 50 watt Hydor heater. I have it turned way down to what's probably about 67 degrees, but it's keeping my tank at 75. It says you're supposed to wait a day, and I haven't yet, but it's been on since this morning and it's been 75 this whole time. 75 isn't too bad but it really bothers me that it's apparently completely inaccurate. I thought it was supposed to sense the temperature of the water and only turn on if needed to heat it. It's almost cranked all the way down and I still have a temperature that's more in the middle of the dial. Honestly that's pretty annoying and disappointing. It has one job, and it can't even do it. Pathetic. Did I get too big of a heater? I mean, sure I won't have to worry about them freezing now, but now I have a more general worry about them actually getting too hot. And 75 is ok but I'd prefer a bit cooler than that.
> 
> Also it's annoying that they just changed the dial numbers from celcius to fahrenheit. So the marked numbers are all strange, like 71 to 75 to 79.


Water flow makes a huge difference for those built in thermostats. Outside of sulawesi shrimp, I still question the need for a heater, but if you must, I'd invest the $15 in an Inkbird controller. External temp probes are better, and it gives you a failsafe in case the heater gets stuck on.

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