# Eleocharis acicularis 'Mini' Dwarf Hairgrass Par question???



## Dman911 (Nov 24, 2016)

Is 30 par at the substrate enough to efficiently propagate Eleocharis acicularis 'Mini' aka dwarf hairgrass? In Aquasoil Amazonia, and dosing EI ferts with pressurized Co2 at approx. 30ppm. The limiting factor should be light at those levels if my countless hours of research are correct. This will be my first real attempt at a planted tank although I have bread and kept several species of fish for over 15yrs. In doing so I have experience with low light plants and easy growers such as Anubis, hornwort, duckweed etc. I'm dead set on carpeting Eleocharis acicularis for my aquascape so if I need to increase my lighting or change other equipment then so be it. Cost is not a big issue but as with anything in life bang for the buck is important to me. 

Dan


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## Deutschlandiesel (Nov 27, 2016)

I'm subscribing to this as I too have dhg questions. Not sure what kind of light you're running or how exactly to calculate par at the substrate level but. I've got a 37 gallon and intend on buying this plant to hopefully carpet a bit without co2 and with proper ferts. I have a 4x 24watt 6500k T5HO fixture. Hopefully someone can answer both of our questions 


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## Opare (Sep 9, 2015)

Dman911 said:


> Is 30 par at the substrate enough to efficiently propagate Eleocharis acicularis 'Mini' aka dwarf hairgrass? In Aquasoil Amazonia, and dosing EI ferts with pressurized Co2 at approx. 30ppm. The limiting factor should be light at those levels if my countless hours of research are correct.


Your research is definitely correct and sounds like you are doing everything right, so great job on that.  I'm actually also right now running my tank with E. acicularis 'Mini' at 30-ish PAR, but my light is dimmable, and I prefer to start low to begin with to prevent algae etc. I think it should carpet but it probably will be a bit slow, at least to begin with, as 30 PAR is just about the edge of 'low-light'.
What light fixture are you using? I recommend getting one you can manipulate the intesity of (by adjusting its height or dimming it), so you can start at a low PAR and then start cranking things up once the tank gets going.
If your only goal is to get it to carpet and you are not really fussed about anything else, then you could probably stay with the 30 PAR fixture and wait it out.
BTW, if your tank is mainly a carpet you probably don't need to dose full EI, and can go for a leaner dosing routine (like 1/2 EI or even less), but no harm in dosing EI really. Just EI is more suited to tanks with a lot of stems, and demanding fast plants. Especially if you are only using low-light.
Also do share a picture of your tank I'm interested to see it!


Deutschlandiesel said:


> I'm subscribing to this as I too have dhg questions. Not sure what kind of light you're running or how exactly to calculate par at the substrate level but. I've got a 37 gallon and intend on buying this plant to hopefully carpet a bit without co2 and with proper ferts. I have a 4x 24watt 6500k T5HO fixture. Hopefully someone can answer both of our questions


You should be fine as well. E. acicularis 'Mini' doesn't tend to be super demanding most people find. It probably will carpet in your tank just slowly, since you aren't running CO2. It may actually start to get a bit faster once it gets going, but you may have to be patient initially.




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## Dman911 (Nov 24, 2016)

Opare said:


> Your research is definitely correct and sounds like you are doing everything right, so great job on that.  I'm actually also right now running my tank with E. acicularis 'Mini' at 30-ish PAR, but my light is dimmable, and I prefer to start low to begin with to prevent algae etc. I think it should carpet but it probably will be a bit slow, at least to begin with, as 30 PAR is just about the edge of 'low-light'.
> What light fixture are you using? I recommend getting one you can manipulate the intesity of (by adjusting its height or dimming it), so you can start at a low PAR and then start cranking things up once the tank gets going.
> If your only goal is to get it to carpet and you are not really fussed about anything else, then you could probably stay with the 30 PAR fixture and wait it out.
> BTW, if your tank is mainly a carpet you probably don't need to dose full EI, and can go for a leaner dosing routine (like 1/2 EI or even less), but no harm in dosing EI really. Just EI is more suited to tanks with a lot of stems, and demanding fast plants. Especially if you are only using low-light.
> ...



My tank is 30L x 18W x 24H. I am running a 30" finnex ray 2. I had originally ordered both the finnex ray2 and monster ray but canceled the monster ray to hold off until the new planted plus 24/7 comes out. The distance from substrate to light is about 22" which should give me approx. 30 par when filled with water. I will also be adding some HC cuba on the waterfall and some AR mini and Christmas moss on the dragon wood for a tree look. Here is a pic of the scape and a link to the waterfall test I ran before. https://www.facebook.com/dan.rempel.54/videos/1248323501881586/ 
I forgot to add that I will be dosing 1/3 EI and light for about 6 hrs to start and working up from there algae permitting over the several weeks. I'm right on the edge of thinking I should order another temporary dimmable light to up my par to about 40-50 since I would like it to carpet fast then I can remove and change over to the new planted plus 24/7 comin out (it apparently has 1.5x the power of the old one and is dimmable etc) After the tank is carpeted I won't need as much light as its ok if it starts to grow taller at that point. Does this sound reasonable? 


Dan


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## Deutschlandiesel (Nov 27, 2016)

Dman911 said:


> My tank is 30L x 18W x 24H. I am running a 30" finnex ray 2. I had originally ordered both the finnex ray2 and monster ray but canceled the monster ray to hold off until the new planted plus 24/7 comes out. The distance from substrate to light is about 22" which should give me approx. 30 par when filled with water. I will also be adding some HC cuba on the waterfall and some AR mini and Christmas moss on the dragon wood for a tree look. Here is a pic of the scape and a link to the waterfall test I ran before. https://www.facebook.com/dan.rempel.54/videos/1248323501881586/
> I forgot to add that I will be dosing 1/3 EI and light for about 6 hrs to start and working up from there algae permitting over the several weeks. I'm right on the edge of thinking I should order another temporary dimmable light to up my par to about 40-50 since I would like it to carpet fast then I can remove and change over to the new planted plus 24/7 comin out (it apparently has 1.5x the power of the old one and is dimmable etc) After the tank is carpeted I won't need as much light as its ok if it starts to grow taller at that point. Does this sound reasonable?
> 
> 
> Dan




I still think it wouldn't be enough power for me. Perhaps from what I read so far keeping up with trimming it as low as reasonably possible helps grow outward yes?


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## Dman911 (Nov 24, 2016)

Deutschlandiesel said:


> I still think it wouldn't be enough power for me. Perhaps from what I read so far keeping up with trimming it as low as reasonably possible helps grow outward yes?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




From what I have read its best to let it root first like a week or a tad longer while trimming the dying portions and the cut short once the roots have established to help it to propagate. I was also thinking of lowing my light to get 50 par at the substrate and using DSM since the DHG I'm getting will be emersed grown anyways. Then when I flood the tank raise it back up and the 30 par should be sufficient to maintain its health. Does anyone have experiences with DSM and DHG that could give an opinion here? Also from my understanding Co2 is a must to carpet this plant successfully and good Co2 should reduce the amount of light needed to effectively propagate this plant... Is this true or have I stumbled on some bad info?


Dan

Couldn't resist I'm going to give dry start a go. Just finished planting

Dan


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## Opare (Sep 9, 2015)

Dry start should be fine and if your goal is mainly carpeting you will be alright.
Just make sure you don't make it you don't get it so wet that the water level is above the substrate.


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## Dman911 (Nov 24, 2016)

Opare said:


> Dry start should be fine and if your goal is mainly carpeting you will be alright.
> Just make sure you don't make it you don't get it so wet that the water level is above the substrate.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks for the tip Opare. Since I am using Aquasoil amazonia there is no need for ferts yet with DSM? or should I be misting with small amounts of ferts from the start?

Dan


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## Opare (Sep 9, 2015)

Dman911 said:


> Thanks for the tip Opare. Since I am using Aquasoil amazonia there is no need for ferts yet with DSM? or should I be misting with small amounts of ferts from the start?
> 
> 
> 
> Dan


With Aquasoil you should be okay without fertilisers.


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## Dman911 (Nov 24, 2016)

Opare said:


> With Aquasoil you should be okay without fertilisers.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks again


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